Truth about reservation priority

[Anne&Jim]

I’ve read here on Tug several times that unit preferences are honored in order of date/time stamp of reservation. Recently, however, when discussing a possible upgrade (ocean front in Maui) the salesman, Harvey Heard, said that our 4-star status would be used to give us priority. If this is true, that would mean that un-requalified resales could end up getting lower reservation priority if owners have no “status”. How can we find out the truth, and how do we know there is any rigor at all in the reservation priority? Frankly, I’m nervous to purchase OF units on the secondary market if I will always get the least desirable OF views (such as those with trees or other view blockers) unless I pay more to retain my status. On a related note, for WKORV and WKORN, are there a list of OF units with impacted views? If there aren’t very many, maybe it doesn’t matter as much as I think?


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[dss]

No one knows for absolute certainty (at least no one here), but I do believe that there is overwhelming evidence that they use timestamp at the first and primary forcing field for prioritization. I think that Elite status, when using home resort privileges, would only come into play in a tiebreaker. We are resale owners (3 star elite), and always book at 12mos out to the second, and almost always wind up with our preferred high floor in WVKORV OFD. There are some lower units that can have some tree obstruction but that has never really been a huge concern (and they have done a good job of shaving those trees back from what I recall).

It sounds like you really care about having a premium view, and if that is the case, I would strongly consider removing WKORVN from your thought process as the OF category there is much larger, and include some fantastic units, but also some less desirable angled (and set back) views that were very generously classified as OF. I would have zero concern about buying WKORV OFD or OFP (Center) resale if you plan to make your reservations at the earliest window opening.

One final note, sometimes you will be trumped by people who have fixed units/weeks, especially high demand weeks like Pres Day, etc... You also may get subjective decision making here they might consider a pool view on a lower floor better than "black rock" view on a higher floor. But in general, I think WKORV does an excellent job of being as accurate and fair as possible in respecting the proper assignment order.

 

[vacationtime1]

We own ocean front center at WKORV. No status with Vistana (all four of our Vistana units were purchased resale). We always make our reservations as soon as possible at the twelve month mark.

In the twelve times we have checked into our OF unit, we have never been placed on floors one or two. Which makes me believe that they do adhere to the stated timestamp rule.

 

[DavidnRobin]

We have never been below 5th floor when making a reservation at 12 months (in 11 years)
How can you tell a TS salesperson is lying? {hint: lips moving...}

Also, look at wording on reservation confirmation - it states timestamp as key factor in location.

It would be way too complicated for the person that Reserves rooms to take all nuances combined with timestamp.

Besides... have you seen the Developer ‘paper’ cost for WKORV OF? Last I saw was $125K for OFD. Are you willing to spend 3x resale cost?

What are they charging for WKORVN OF?

 

[Anne&Jim]

We have never been below 5th floor when making a reservation at 12 months (in 11 years)
How can you tell a TS salesperson is lying? {hint: lips moving...}

Also, look at wording on reservation confirmation - it states timestamp as key factor in location.

It would be way too complicated for the person that Reserves rooms to take all nuances combined with timestamp.

Besides... have you seen the Developer ‘paper’ cost for WKORV OF? Last I saw was $125K for OFD. Are you willing to spend 3x resale cost?

What are they charging for WKORVN OF?

WKORN OF are being offered for $82,900 (but you need a $70,000 margin on trade ups). We are only considering buying from the developer because we have IV units and a WMH Christmas week we’d like to trade in. The WKORV margin is $75,000 and the cost for OF (deluxe or center) is $124,500. So my choice is to trade up into a developer week (two developer weeks in WKORN due to the margin) and hopefully retro a resale week at the same time. Or, just sell our current holdings and rent from others the weeks we want without all the hassle of being owners. Honestly, I don’t trust the developers’ need to continually devalue our investments over time for their own gain. What happens when rents can’t keep up with MFs?


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[vacationtime1]

WKORN OF are being offered for $82,900 (but you need a $70,000 margin on trade ups). We are only considering buying from the developer because we have IV units and a WMH Christmas week we’d like to trade in. The WKORV margin is $75,000 and the cost for OF (deluxe or center) is $124,500. So my choice is to trade up into a developer week (two developer weeks in WKORN due to the margin) and hopefully retro a resale week at the same time. Or, just sell our current holdings and rent from others the weeks we want without all the hassle of being owners. Honestly, I don’t trust the developers’ need to continually devalue our investments over time for their own gain. What happens when rents can’t keep up with MFs?

What is your goal? If it is to stay at WKORVN-OF, buy WKORVN resale; it will cost about a third as much money as buying it from the developer (~$26K vs. $82.9K). That is over $100K of extra cost to purchase two OF units (less trade-in value). Are you really prepared to pay an extra $50-100K because a salesperson said you would get a better room assignment?

Treat the disposal of your WMH and WKORVN-IV units as completely unrelated to any purchase you may make. It is only by tying the buy and the sell together (and adding lies about room assignments) that the salesperson created enough confusion that the developer pricing looked appealing.

 

[DavidnRobin]

I agree with this. I think LisaRex sold her WKORVN for ~$22K - that difference in price can never make up the difference. Do not throw good money after bad.


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[Westnick]

I own a WKORVN-OF 2bd lo unit(resale). I stayed there Jan 2018 and split my unit. First week I reserved the 1 bed at 9am 12 months out. My assigned unit was 8506.second unit I reserved at midnight 12 months out. 2 days before the switch I went down to the front desk and asked if she knew what my room number was going to be for the studio. The desk clerk said the room had been assigned but she could not tell me the room number. She did tell me that I had the number 1 time stamp and I would be happy with the room. My room assignment was 5604 which is the top floor closest to the ocean. I am 0 star elite as all my units are resale. Not sure what all this means other than time stamp is very important even in resale.

 

[duke]

Or, just sell our current holdings and rent from others the weeks we want without all the hassle of being owners.

You are talking real money here. Best action is to sell what you have and then Rent from other owners and get what you want. Taking annual fees into account you are far ahead renting.

 

[alexadeparis]

Honestly, the room assigner may take elite status into account as the deciding factor between otherwise equal in time reservations, but if they did, that person would not know whether or not you owned any resale units or were using that resale one for your reservation vs one of your “qualified” 3 star elite units. That’s all nonsense. The assigner could give a &$%*. I understand the concept that they want to reward the people that have spent the most money at the corporate level, but I really doubt that the worker bee doing the assignments every week cares how much money you spent, since none or very little of it trickles down to him/her. They just care about getting it done so they can move on to the rest of their work. Same thing with the people on the phone. They have thanked me for being a member since 199X when they are clearly just looking at the original purchase year on the contract, not looking for the time when I began owning it. They couldn’t care less. This is across the board at all the places we own in my opinion.

 

[DavidnRobin]

The confirmation # is the timestamp. There is no equal timestamp as every confirmation number is unique.

There is an order stated per CCRs (Owners Manual) - it has been discussed here before (e.g. Ultra Premier Ownership and consecutive stays, VSE Owned, etc. - been a while since I have read this section...)
Otherwise, Timestamp rules.

The Reservation Confirmation even states:
“Villa assignments are made based on the date/time of the reservation booking. “

This text was not in past confirmations (along with the text about renting SOs). This SVO (VSE) TUG forum was in part responsible for this text. I personally had email conversations with SVP of OS over these topics.

If a Salesperson states otherwise - ask them to put it in writing - it is a bogus claim.

The only time status matters is with Hotel side - and if they own a villa that they rent - as they do - then they can override timestamp for some mucky muck 5*/PFL. But, it has to be VSE owned.
I have met these folks over the years.




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[triangulum33]

Does anyone know if changing the reservation (moving checkin/checkout by a day, changing from LO to 1Bd, etc) would reset the timestamp?
We've had instances when we booked a year out, but needed to slightly adjust dates due to time off work, flight costs, etc. Also had friends bow out that were going to stay in half of LO, etc.

 

[canesfan]

Does anyone know if changing the reservation (moving checkin/checkout by a day, changing from LO to 1Bd, etc) would reset the timestamp?
We've had instances when we booked a year out, but needed to slightly adjust dates due to time off work, flight costs, etc. Also had friends bow out that were going to stay in half of LO, etc.

Yes it does. You can ask them to retain the time stamp if you split the LO but if you change the date it will change the reservation. It will give you a new number and new time stamp. I just went thru this the other day.


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[dss]

Yes, I believe that unfortunately does reset the timestamp. One exclusion is releasing just one side of a 2 bedroom which should not alter the other side at all (but does happen if you have a careless rep, happened to me once many years ago and I had to go through a lot effort to get my timestamp back).

 

[taterhed]

You are talking real money here. Best action is to sell what you have and then Rent from other owners and get what you want. Taking annual fees into account you are far ahead renting.

Disagree.

WKORV/N both show long term value (purchase cost, resale). Both show rentals at/above MF (OF, OV) and rental rates are NOT cheap during whales/summer.
Renting is neither easy nor sure unless you pay a premium. It's also not cheap.

I agree, I would not spend $100k plus just to gain elite and have an OF unit....but if we're talking resale, I think WKORV/N are both good values to own vs rent for peak season.
For off-season, maybe SO's from a cheaper resort would meet your needs, but SO reservations at 8 mos are never a sure thing from what I've read.

Again, "RENT don't BUY" makes sense for some, but not for all... Careful consideration is always a must.

IMHO

 

[okwiater]

I would imagine for Home Resort reservations, timestamp rules. As DnR stated above, it's written in the CCRs.

However, once you are talking StarOptions reservations, I'm pretty sure Elite status plays a role in assigning the remaining units. Can't figure out why else I would have received such great units during popular/holiday weeks, even for last-minute reservations.

 

[DeniseM]

+1 for "you can't believe sales people." They will say whatever it takes to get you to buy from them.

This is the thing you have to remember: there is huge competition for certain high season dates - like President's week.

I recently spoke to a very disappointed Ocean Front Deluxe WKORV (south) owner, who made their reservation the second the reservation window opened for President's week 2018, but found themselves in a less desirable ground floor unit with a partially blocked view. The front desk showed them the check-in list which was prioritized by confirmation number (timestamp) and they were indeed nearly at the bottom of the list - even though they completed their reservation within 60 sec. of 12:00 midnight. There were 28 reservations on the list (some were split) and they were #24 on the list.

During low demand weeks, it is common for Elite Owners to be upgraded to OF, because after all the OF owners are assigned, there are still unassigned units left over. Then, the Elite Owner priority kicks in - after all the home resort owners have been assigned.

 

[Anne&Jim]

Thank you all so much for your thoughtful replies — it is clear you really do try to help each other here! I have taken your advice to heart and cut the salesperson loose. Will need to decide if we want an after market unit or just to rent — as long as we can find rental availability (and we are flexible travelers) we will probably go that route.


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