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Sometimes it's better to buy from the brand [says Timeshare Salesman]

DannyTS

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Can you give us the details of any contract your company sells? Resort, season, size, maintenance fees, number of points, bonus points, purchase price, interest rate if financed. We will then be able to compare with the resale market.
 

Iggyearl

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Let's conservatively assume you're given 3 weeks of free vacations on a 1-week purchase, for which the average deed price in 2017 was around $22k. Assuming a value of $250/night after taxes, that would be worth $5,250, which is 24% of the purchase price. A savvy negotiator could acquire 5+ weeks as a bonus, which would have a value of $8,750, which is 40% of the purchase price. This could potentially exceed the savings by purchasing resale, correct?

Additionally, we have to reduce the value of a resale if it comes with reduced logistical usage, correct?

So, a savvy investor would bargain for 5 weeks of bonus instead of 3. Have you ever considered that the average "prospect" is on vacation and has never been a student of timeshare....... The students of timeshare live on this site. And they can't believe the drivel that you are expounding. You think that people who buy timeshares are sophisticated purchasers?? Stop.... please Stop....
 

RX8

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Happy purchaser of a resale big brand timeshare. Saved 66% over retail.
 
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Panina

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Is there something wrong with my math when I make the assertion that the value of bonus points can overwhelm the savings of purchasing resale (which might suffer logistical penalties), particularly if looking for a specific property?
The fact your are missing are most timeshares are free or very low in price thus no cash outlay or minimal cash outlay. No need to pay lots of money to save money as your example shows. Are there exceptions that supports your theory, occasionally(rarely) but most often not.
 

breezez

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I own lower end stuff like Grandview that is in RCI Points. And I own multiple high end stuff at two different Hyatt locations. I also own middle of the road stuff like Wyndham and Worldmark. I have bought everyone of mine via resell, some via brokers and some direct with seller.

The way I see it is: What you guys in timeshare companies offer people in hard pressure sales presentation is always smoke and mirrors. All the perks, bonuses etc that don't transfer with the ownership are used to get people to buy were never part of the ownership in the first place. These are always perks that can be changed at any time, and trust me you guys change them from time to time. Reading your opening monologue you feel these are of tremendous value, but the reality is the fact they can not be transferred makes them of no value. An asset with zero liquidity has not value. In fact a timeshare is one of if not the only things in life the majority of the people pay lots of money for and then again are willing to pay lots of money to get rid of in the end, as it is a debt you can never pay off. When a person owns one they have given their HOA's a blank check to charge them what ever they may till they dispose of the unit.

Then you suggest that people that want low end stuff may buy resell. I can tell you each of my Grandview weeks I have have in RCI Points were original sold to original owner for over $18K each, my cost under 3% of this all in and I got 3 years worth of points. So you can get bonus points buying resell too! I have the same benefits as if I bought direct. My Wyndham contracts same type of story, but I paid even a lower %. My Wyndham contracts are not eligible to qualify for VIP status only real perk of value I lose by buying resell. I can't use club pass, but I own Worldmark so I wouldn't anyway. Oh and I can't use my points to pay my MF's.. But why would you do this anyway it a poor value.

My WorldMark Contracts I paid the greatest % of normal direct sell price. I paid around 12% of developer costs. I can't join travelshare, but its a scam anyway so no real loss. My credits can't be used for elite tier status anyway. The only large benefit to elite tier status is fee WIFI I think and no housekeeping if you are top tier. But My Worldmark is a NHK account so I got the no house keeping feature anyway. All my WorldMark accounts came as fully loaded accounts meaning 2 years of credits available and one even had 12000 expired credits in a reservation I was able to change and use. Again bonus credits buying resell

My two Hyatt weeks original owners paid almost a combined $70K I paid less than 8% of this all in and got 3 years worth of credits with one contact having 2 years in EEE and 1 year in LCUP points. So again you can get bonus point buying resell. The only thing I can't do is convert my points to World of Hyatt points which is of poor value anyway. As far as ROFR both of these passed ROFR. While ROFR helps keep prices slightly elevated you can still get great deals.

So why you sell smoke and mirrors to the unsuspecting people not understanding what you are offering them of value is not in their contract or deed. I will be happy with what I have bought. But as a tugger I have to say, I am happy people exist to sell timeshares for the developers. So when the people who bought them are ready to get out I can pick up a good resell contract for peanuts.

I love timesharing and I always try to avoid staying in hotels if I don't have too. Once you get used to the size and quality of timeshare life its hard to ever want to stay in a hotel. I accept what MF's are because I went into this fully understanding my obligations and risks, and I have an exit strategy should I decide in the future to par it down some or completely.

There are only two situations I would ever buy direct from a developer. I may one day when I get to retirement age consider buying enough Wyndham points via telesales to PIC two 3 bedroom units to get me to Wyndham VIP Gold. If my grand babies to be become Disney buffs I might buy a small amount of DVC points to get the perks but would buy most DVC points on resell market. But I doubt I would ever buy DVC, so the Wyndham telesales is likely the only one I would ever consider.
 
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dayooper

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Is there something wrong with my math when I make the assertion that the value of bonus points can overwhelm the savings of purchasing resale (which might suffer logistical penalties), particularly if looking for a specific property?

We don’t know if there is something wrong. We have no basis to know where the numbers came from, what systems were used and what seasons these are based off of. We don’t even know if the $22,000 is from the same set of data as the $8,750 for the 5 weeks or if the bonus points can be used in the same place/system that the $22,000 data point came from. Were the numbers hand picked? Without a source from reputable organization, they are meaningless. It’s an old salesman trick. Build up their trust in you, dazzle ‘em with meaningless numbers and don’t give them time to process it. There’s an old saying that numbers and facts don’t lie. Well they do if they are told from a particular perspective. I suggest you check out The Dihyrdogen Monoxide page or dmho.org to see how facts can be twisted to fit one’s narrative.

I love the part I quoted. Put the burden of proof that the numbers aren’t wrong back on the one questioning it. Is there something wrong with the numbers? If there is, show me is what that really means. I believe you have reasons other than civil discussion to be here, but that’s for a different conversation that I won’t get into with you. I could say more on your post, but I’ve said my peace on the biggest issue I have with your argument.
 
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DannyTS

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I assume that you are relatively new in the industry and you are just repeating what you were told during the training sessions. I cannot imagine a veteran timeshare sales person who knows the reality trying to debate this matter on TUG of all the places.

If this is the case and we are indeed bursting the bubble, sorry, this may negatively impact your future sales performance.
The silver lining, you may be learning something new and, who knows, maybe you will buy retail yourself one day.
 
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CalGalTraveler

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What if you want a timeshare in a specific, premium location, e.g. New York City?

I am not arguing that all resales are inferior to all direct sales. I'm saying that it SOMETIMES makes sense to purchase direct.

I appreciate the conversation because perhaps there is something I don't know. Here is what I know about our hotel-branded timeshares:
  • We bought NYC developer. Although we enjoy the property, the 70% loss in value which we will never recoup makes me sick.
    • We frequently attend owner updates to collect as many gift cards and discounted vacations to recoup ROI but have yet to find a developer deal that pencils in better than resale. (you can fool me once...)
  • We own Maui OF resale purchased for 12k, another premium location. The seller paid $70k to the developer so that's $5800 a year capital loss in addition to $2,700 Maintenance fee ($8,500/year spent/lost) over the 10 years they owned the week. That's significantly more expensive than renting. We will recoup the value of our resale purchase in 3 years and are happy.
  • Why would I spend $129,000 for a new developer purchase, knowing that it will devalue by 70% or more, when I can put the $129,000 in a CD earning 3% and use the 3% annual interest to rent the same unit and then get my $129,000 capital back at any time with no strings attached?
What say you? What are those premium location deals?
 
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tombanjo

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I bought in NYC for less then the money the previous purchaser owed on the loan after years of paying for it. I'm pretty sure a few bonus points did not really make that worthwhile. And yes, it obviously passed ROFR at a fraction of the initial sales price, less than 25% in fact. I bought low cost, open market, premium location, at price I wanted with a great re-seller who worked FOR me. You really can't pretend that this was awful and should be avoided by going with a developer to get what I wanted.
 
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RX8

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In the first post the OP falsely implies that it is the resale buyer who bears the burden of broker’s fees. These fees of course are paid by the seller.

Based on the OP’s user name, I think his judgement has been “clouded”.
 
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RX8

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Let's conservatively assume you're given 3 weeks of free vacations on a 1-week purchase, for which the average deed price in 2017 was around $22k. Assuming a value of $250/night after taxes, that would be worth $5,250, which is 24% of the purchase price. A savvy negotiator could acquire 5+ weeks as a bonus, which would have a value of $8,750, which is 40% of the purchase price. This could potentially exceed the savings by purchasing resale, correct?

Additionally, we have to reduce the value of a resale if it comes with reduced logistical usage, correct?

That $22K developer week likely has no resale value (probably in an over developed area like Orlando). In addition, your estimated $8700 value for 5 weeks is going to be way over valued. Those weeks could probably be rented at no more than the owner’s MF but likely even less than MF. So, being generous maybe $5000 max value. That still leaves the owner paying a net $17000 for a timeshare that could be had on the resale market for a dollar.

As for your last question, the resale value is determined by many factors including if it has “reduced usage”. Westgate for one seriously devalues the resale. As a result, those have a negative value on the resale market (the seller has to include all fees paid, free usage and in some cases CASH to the resale buyer). While it is great that the direct buyer may have some direct perks worth maybe a couple hundred dollars, when their life changes and need to sell they are stuck unless they are willing to pay out of pocket AGAIN to get out from the timeshare. So, that $17000 net now becomes $19000 + cost to the direct buyer.
 
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DannyTS

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I am still waiting for the OP to post the details of what he considers a great deal: resort, season, size, maintenance fees, number of points, bonus points, purchase price, interest rate if financed.

If these contracts were so great we would see them in the papers, the same way the car prices are advertised. But we all know nobody would jump on these "deals" from the comfort of their home; these "deals" only make "sense" during the high pressure and confusing marathon sales presentations.
 

bbodb1

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I am still waiting for the OP to post the details of what he considers a great deal: resort, season, size, maintenance fees, number of points, bonus points, purchase price, interest rate if financed....

 

PamMo

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Perhaps the OP is taking part in some weird hazing ritual for a new timeshare sales position? "Go on TUG and post how great a developer purchase can be!" If they survive the thread without getting too angry or discouraged, and they STILL want to sell timeshares, they get put on the floor.

If the OP has a great deal that is as good or better than a typical resale (not an inflated imaginary price) in the resort system they work for, I think they should post an ad in the TUG Marketplace. If it was spelled out in detail and we had time to research all the benefits, maybe they would find some buyers. In a 90-minute high pressure presentation, where a decision has to be made RIGHT NOW!!!, I always have such a hard time figuring out all the numbers scribbled upside down on scratch paper for weeks, seasons, points, discounts, trade-in value, extra points, bonus weeks, etc. It's always hard to see why I should buy retail when I'm already enjoying my free/highly discounted timeshares at the resort. But, I'll be the first to admit that I don't know everything there is to know about timeshares (that's what I'm here on TUG - to keep learning!) so maybe I'm missing something? I'm from Missouri, so as we say here, "Show Me!"
 

bizaro86

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Hello,
I suspect from your comments that you work for Hilton. But just in case I'll go through the reasons when to and when not to buy from the developer for all major brands.

Hilton: no developer perks of value (*story about elite bands at the end of this post). Huge discount buying resale outweighs initial purchase points, even in NYC as noted above. I think HGVC is a great product (to purchase resale) because of the flexibility.

Marriott: There is no cheap access to the points system. Some tuggers advocate purchasing a combined week/points package from sales. I think (if you MUST have MVC points) the optimal decision is to buy the smallest possible points package resale and then rent in points for slightly more than the points MF. You would never recover the purchase price of developer points compared to this method unless you absolutely always work the perks (13 month is unreliable, would need to make it up on discounts). For many/most, legacy resale weeks will be the optimal choice. It has less access to their newest "resorts" but those are basically all hotels. If you want a hotel book priceline or similar.

Hyatt: pure points is a tire fire. The legacy points system is complicated but works well, and transfers with resale weeks. Resale weeks are WAY cheaper than developer weeks, even in their top tier locations like Maui. Incentives don't make up the difference.

Vistana: the staroption system is open to resale owners. Also, both westin and Sheraton flex can be purchased resale. Huge discounts available for exactly the same thing. IF someone happens to travel a lot in Marriott hotels (but not so much they have status) AND has the time to travel to Vistana timeshares, it might make sense to buy large Vistana deeds resale. Then trade some in on small upgrade purchases to requalify he remainder. I think this is poor value, but the perk isn't otherwise available.

Holiday Inn: points are available resale at certain resorts. Perks are significant, but so is the purchase price. Many of the "signature" resorts can be substituted by trades to nearby resorts, or into weeks owned by legacy ownerships at the same resort. The value of the perks/incentives doesn't justify buying developer.

Worldmark: the perk for buying developer is called travelshare. The stuff that comes with it can be acquired cheaper by buying it. It also comes with club pass (aka access to leftover wyndham units) if that is a big value buy a wyndham deed, otherwise trade with a wyndham owner who wants worldmark access (I've done this, it works). Super-duper elite level (73k developer) comes with free housekeeping, but that perk can be acquired over 100k cheaper by buying a grandfathered no housekeeping resale. Resales come with everything else at huge discounts. Worldmark has higher resale than almost any other system and the incentives aren't even close.

Wyndham: the perks for buying developer are VIP. The discounts have some value for last minute booking. They recently neutered VIP by cancelling a sales-promoted tactic called cancel-rebook, which is a good reminder that the non-deeded "perks" that come with developer purchases can be changed or cancelled at any time. The deeded stuff that is guaranteed comes with a resale. For the vast, vast majority of people resale is better here. It's way cheaper (95%+) and you have to work the discounts to justify VIP big time. I think it probaby only makes sense if your buy tons of resale points and rent out. Some tuggers got VIP with resale in the past (as far as I know that isn't possible now - if it is I'd love a PM) but you can PIC resale weeks through telesales to get it at lower cost. It still never makes sense to buy at a resort.

Shell - points are free with free usage resale. Developer perks are not meaningful.

Diamond - The Club is only available developer. I think the value here is poor, and the benefits of The Club don't outweigh the massively increased cost of buying retail (or upgrading via retail).

Welk - points are available resale. The cheapness of resale points outweighs incentives/perks.

Bluegreen - resale owners need to be careful which trust/type they buy, but given resales are free/cheap this restriction is minimal, imo.

Breckenridge Grand - resales are way cheaper. Biggest developer perk is day use for skiing. My understanding is that everyone gets it at their original resort so buy resale there if that is important (check this before buying, I don't own here).

Disney - Significant disney related perks for buying direct. Most notably access to the Gold annual pass. Not applicable for FL residents who can get it anyway. If you would otherwise buy annual passes at regular price AND a DVC resale, a small developer purchase may make sense. You should do a spreadsheet of total cost of both options for the life of the contract. If you assume a reasonable rate of return on the extra initial capital it isn't a slam dunk. Anything more than the minimum should be purchased resale.

Grandview - great rci points units available resale at 90% off. Buy that not developer. Not even close.

Anyway, in the spirit of analytical dialogue I've tried to be comprehensive. Since you have so far declined to state who you work for (your prerogative) I've summarized the case for buying resale/developer for every brand I could think of.

If I missed some or you'd like to discuss one of them in further detail let me know. I'd be happy to spreadsheet out the details on any of my assertions. I'm on my phone right now or I would have done a more complete analysis.

**almost forgot - I stayed at HGVC Kings Land last week. Two bedroom unit in phase 1, which I believe is 9600 HGVC points. I traded in through RCI with a timeshare I got for free.

I couldn't help thinking when I saw folks wearing the "elite" wristbands that they looked handy for not carrying a key card. I estimated the value to me at $20 though, not $50,000....
 
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bbodb1

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I'd like that post twice if I could, Bizaro86!
 

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Hello,
I suspect from your comments that you work for Hilton. But just in case I'll go through the reasons when to and when not to buy from the developer for all major brands.

Hilton: no developer perks of value (*story about elite bands at the end of this post). Huge discount buying resale outweighs initial purchase points, even in NYC as noted above. I think HGVC is a great product (to purchase resale) because of the flexibility.

Marriott: There is no cheap access to the points system. Some tuggers advocate purchasing a combined week/points package from sales. I think (if you MUST have MVC points) the optimal decision is to buy the smallest possible points package resale and then rent in points for slightly more than the points MF. You would never recover the purchase price of developer points compared to this method unless you absolutely always work the perks (13 month is unreliable, would need to make it up on discounts). For many/most, legacy resale weeks will be the optimal choice. It has less access to their newest "resorts" but those are basically all hotels. If you want a hotel book priceline or similar.

Hyatt: pure points is a tire fire. The legacy points system is complicated but works well, and transfers with resale weeks. Resale weeks are WAY cheaper than developer weeks, even in their top tier locations like Maui. Incentives don't make up the difference.

Vistana: the staroption system is open to resale owners. Also, both westin and Sheraton flex can be purchased resale. Huge discounts available for exactly the same thing. IF someone happens to travel a lot in Marriott hotels (but not so much they have status) AND has the time to travel to Vistana timeshares, it might make sense to buy large Vistana deeds resale. Then trade some in on small upgrade purchases to requalify he remainder. I think this is poor value, but the perk isn't otherwise available.

Holiday Inn: points are available resale at certain resorts. Perks are significant, but so is the purchase price. Many of the "signature" resorts can be substituted by trades to nearby resorts, or into weeks owned by legacy ownerships at the same resort. The value of the perks/incentives doesn't justify buying developer.

Worldmark: the perk for buying developer is called travelshare. The stuff that comes with it can be acquired cheaper by buying it. It also comes with club pass (aka access to leftover wyndham units) if that is a big value buy a wyndham deed, otherwise trade with a wyndham owner who wants worldmark access (I've done this, it works). Super-duper elite level (73k developer) comes with free housekeeping, but that perk can be acquired over 100k cheaper by buying a grandfathered no housekeeping resale. Resales come with everything else at huge discounts. Worldmark has higher resale than almost any other system and the incentives aren't even close.

Wyndham: the perks for buying developer are VIP. The discounts have some value for last minute booking. They recently neutered VIP by cancelling a sales-promoted tactic called cancel-rebook, which is a good reminder that the non-deeded "perks" that come with developer purchases can be changed or cancelled at any time. The deeded stuff that is guaranteed comes with a resale. For the vast, vast majority of people resale is better here. It's way cheaper (95%+) and you have to work the discounts to justify VIP big time. I think it probaby only makes sense if your buy tons of resale points and rent out. Some tuggers got VIP with resale in the past (as far as I know that isn't possible now - if it is I'd love a PM) but you can PIC resale weeks through telesales to get it at lower cost. It still never makes sense to buy at a resort.

Shell - points are free with free usage resale. Developer perks are not meaningful.

Diamond - The Club is only available developer. I think the value here is poor, and the benefits of The Club don't outweigh the massively increased cost of buying retail (or upgrading via retail).

Welk - points are available resale. The cheapness of resale points outweighs incentives/perks.

Bluegreen - resale owners need to be careful which trust/type they buy, but given resales are free/cheap this restriction is minimal, imo.

Breckenridge Grand - resales are way cheaper. Biggest developer perk is day use for skiing. My understanding is that everyone gets it at their original resort so buy resale there if that is important (check this before buying, I don't own here).

Disney - Significant disney related perks for buying direct. Most notably access to the Gold annual pass. Not applicable for FL residents who can get it anyway. If you would otherwise buy annual passes at regular price AND a DVC resale, a small developer purchase may make sense. You should do a spreadsheet of total cost of both options for the life of the contract. If you assume a reasonable rate of return on the extra initial capital it isn't a slam dunk. Anything more than the minimum should be purchased resale.

Grandview - great rci points units available resale at 90% off. Buy that not developer. Not even close.

Anyway, in the spirit of analytical dialogue I've tried to be comprehensive. Since you have so far declined to state who you work for (your prerogative) I've summarized the case for buying resale/developer for every brand I could think of.

If I missed some or you'd like to discuss one of them in further detail let me know. I'd be happy to spreadsheet out the details on any of my assertions. I'm on my phone right now or I would have done a more complete analysis.

**almost forgot - I stayed at HGVC Kings Land last week. Two bedroom unit in phase 1, which I believe is 9600 HGVC points. I traded in through RCI with a timeshare I got for free. The MF is ~600, well under the MG of a Kings Land unit. But it gets better - I got the timeshare free with 1 years free use. This was the free (seller paid incentive) use. So my only cost was the RCI exchange fee, that I got 25% off of for making a deposit (RCI Pro), plus the resort fees/taxes ($286/week).

I couldn't help thinking when I saw folks wearing the "elite" wristbands that they looked handy for not carrying a key card. I estimated the value to me at $20 though, not $50,000....
two thumbs up
 

T-Dot-Traveller

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Perhaps the OP is taking part in some weird hazing ritual for a new timeshare sales position? "Go on TUG ....

In a 90-minute high pressure presentation, where a decision has to be made RIGHT NOW!!!, I always have such a hard time figuring out all the numbers scribbled upside down on scratch paper for weeks, seasons, points, discounts, trade-in value, extra points, bonus weeks, etc.....

But, I'll be the first to admit that I don't know everything there is to know about timeshares (that's what I'm here on TUG - to keep learning!) so ...... I'm from Missouri, so as we say here, "Show Me!"

Hi PamMo,
I like the "weird hazing ritual" concept .

Re : 90 minute high pressure presentation .....numbers scribbled upside down ...
I guess you have done a couple of Vidanta presentations -
LoL

Maybe the OP should go on vacation to Mexico & learn from the experts !
 

PamMo

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What's the deal with the upside down writing anyway? It's not just Mexico! It seems like all timeshare salespeople do it, and I always stifle a giggle when I see it. The notes seem intentionally confusing.

BTW, T-Dot-Traveller, I've never done a Vidanta presentation. I'm terrified of those guys!
 

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Is there something wrong with my math when I make the assertion that the value of bonus points can overwhelm the savings of purchasing resale (which might suffer logistical penalties), particularly if looking for a specific property?
I have never, not once, seen a sales incentive that made up for the cost difference of buying resale vs. the developer. And, that makes sense, because the value of those things is often mythical ("a value of $250/night" but no one ever pays that much). When it's real, the sales office has to pay for them out of its marketing budget. You didn't even come up with a good example. For many systems, your 40% of the purchase price makes up for only half of what the purchase loses the day the legal right to rescind expires, and it's a hypothetical so you may as well just be making things up.

We've had a lot of people try hard to justify a developer purchase on dollars-and-cents terms. The best I've ever seen required everything to break exactly right, a tremendous amount of luck finding discounted reservations of value, and even then only broke even. Maybe. Some of those people buy from the developer anyway, but it's for emotional reasons not financial. Those can be worth it to some; depends on how you value the non-monetary aspects of being a "full owner" or whatever. But, the money argument just doesn't work.

In short: welcome to my ignore list. Now go away.
 

bluehende

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Is there something wrong with my math when I make the assertion that the value of bonus points can overwhelm the savings of purchasing resale (which might suffer logistical penalties), particularly if looking for a specific property?

A lot. Your values are way high. Where does a retail purchase come with 3 to 5 weeks of free usage for a timeshare week valued at 1750? That is pretty high end. Also again you have undervalued the savings on resale. PS one of the timeshares I bought came with 1 yr of usage and I paid 1 dollar all in. My guess is that is much more than 50% off. In fact it is incalculable.

Also again I will ask. Why would you buy a timeshare retail that is impossible to sell resale because of developer limitations? I would rather rent from all those disgruntled owners who cannot get out.
 

bluehende

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Hello,
I suspect from your comments that you work for Hilton. But just in case I'll go through the reasons when to and when not to buy from the developer for all major brands.

Hilton: no developer perks of value (*story about elite bands at the end of this post). Huge discount buying resale outweighs initial purchase points, even in NYC as noted above. I think HGVC is a great product (to purchase resale) because of the flexibility.

Marriott: There is no cheap access to the points system. Some tuggers advocate purchasing a combined week/points package from sales. I think (if you MUST have MVC points) the optimal decision is to buy the smallest possible points package resale and then rent in points for slightly more than the points MF. You would never recover the purchase price of developer points compared to this method unless you absolutely always work the perks (13 month is unreliable, would need to make it up on discounts). For many/most, legacy resale weeks will be the optimal choice. It has less access to their newest "resorts" but those are basically all hotels. If you want a hotel book priceline or similar.

Hyatt: pure points is a tire fire. The legacy points system is complicated but works well, and transfers with resale weeks. Resale weeks are WAY cheaper than developer weeks, even in their top tier locations like Maui. Incentives don't make up the difference.

Vistana: the staroption system is open to resale owners. Also, both westin and Sheraton flex can be purchased resale. Huge discounts available for exactly the same thing. IF someone happens to travel a lot in Marriott hotels (but not so much they have status) AND has the time to travel to Vistana timeshares, it might make sense to buy large Vistana deeds resale. Then trade some in on small upgrade purchases to requalify he remainder. I think this is poor value, but the perk isn't otherwise available.

Holiday Inn: points are available resale at certain resorts. Perks are significant, but so is the purchase price. Many of the "signature" resorts can be substituted by trades to nearby resorts, or into weeks owned by legacy ownerships at the same resort. The value of the perks/incentives doesn't justify buying developer.

Worldmark: the perk for buying developer is called travelshare. The stuff that comes with it can be acquired cheaper by buying it. It also comes with club pass (aka access to leftover wyndham units) if that is a big value buy a wyndham deed, otherwise trade with a wyndham owner who wants worldmark access (I've done this, it works). Super-duper elite level (73k developer) comes with free housekeeping, but that perk can be acquired over 100k cheaper by buying a grandfathered no housekeeping resale. Resales come with everything else at huge discounts. Worldmark has higher resale than almost any other system and the incentives aren't even close.

Wyndham: the perks for buying developer are VIP. The discounts have some value for last minute booking. They recently neutered VIP by cancelling a sales-promoted tactic called cancel-rebook, which is a good reminder that the non-deeded "perks" that come with developer purchases can be changed or cancelled at any time. The deeded stuff that is guaranteed comes with a resale. For the vast, vast majority of people resale is better here. It's way cheaper (95%+) and you have to work the discounts to justify VIP big time. I think it probaby only makes sense if your buy tons of resale points and rent out. Some tuggers got VIP with resale in the past (as far as I know that isn't possible now - if it is I'd love a PM) but you can PIC resale weeks through telesales to get it at lower cost. It still never makes sense to buy at a resort.

Shell - points are free with free usage resale. Developer perks are not meaningful.

Diamond - The Club is only available developer. I think the value here is poor, and the benefits of The Club don't outweigh the massively increased cost of buying retail (or upgrading via retail).

Welk - points are available resale. The cheapness of resale points outweighs incentives/perks.

Bluegreen - resale owners need to be careful which trust/type they buy, but given resales are free/cheap this restriction is minimal, imo.

Breckenridge Grand - resales are way cheaper. Biggest developer perk is day use for skiing. My understanding is that everyone gets it at their original resort so buy resale there if that is important (check this before buying, I don't own here).

Disney - Significant disney related perks for buying direct. Most notably access to the Gold annual pass. Not applicable for FL residents who can get it anyway. If you would otherwise buy annual passes at regular price AND a DVC resale, a small developer purchase may make sense. You should do a spreadsheet of total cost of both options for the life of the contract. If you assume a reasonable rate of return on the extra initial capital it isn't a slam dunk. Anything more than the minimum should be purchased resale.

Grandview - great rci points units available resale at 90% off. Buy that not developer. Not even close.

Anyway, in the spirit of analytical dialogue I've tried to be comprehensive. Since you have so far declined to state who you work for (your prerogative) I've summarized the case for buying resale/developer for every brand I could think of.

If I missed some or you'd like to discuss one of them in further detail let me know. I'd be happy to spreadsheet out the details on any of my assertions. I'm on my phone right now or I would have done a more complete analysis.

**almost forgot - I stayed at HGVC Kings Land last week. Two bedroom unit in phase 1, which I believe is 9600 HGVC points. I traded in through RCI with a timeshare I got for free.

I couldn't help thinking when I saw folks wearing the "elite" wristbands that they looked handy for not carrying a key card. I estimated the value to me at $20 though, not $50,000....

Maybe the OP can print this out and have it at his desk as a sticky.
 

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CalGalTraveler

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Maybe the OP can print this out and have it at his desk as a sticky.

Actually he may frame it in the breakroom and say, "See how I trolled TUG and got 47 responses in less than 24 hours!" LoL
 

e.bram

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Name a developer brand which will "GUARANTEE" an NYC week any time you wanted? Not based on availability?
 
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