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Waikoloa Sales Pitch

Charlie Jones

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I vacationed at the Waikoloa Vacation Club recently. I love the renovations and the hotel. However, I made the very stupid mistake to accept the MVC sales pitch. They offered 25K reward points or $150 in discounts to some local shops. I chose the $150.

I’ve been to maybe 8 or 9 sales presentations over the years and I’ve spent some coin to join MVC. All my past presentations were very professional. I work in a sales/customer type role and discuss business with sales people quite often. In all my previous presentations, I have been upfront and very genuine with the sales person that I am or am not interested in spending money at the sales meeting. I don’t beat around the bush. I set the expectation if I am interested or if I am definitely not interested.

I told them upfront, in the 1st 5 minutes that I was not going to buy anything. I was just want updates to properties and changes to the system to book. The sales guy acknowledge that and started the presentation. He was very good socially, discussing his family, how he met his wife, etc. Like this is going to soften me up. (NOT). He progressively transitioned into a pure sales pitch. When I told him again, I'm not spending money, he was still in that sales pitch mode known as "I know I can switch him to buy".

Then he told me he was bringing in his sales manager. While we waited a few minutes, we heard the customers next to us say they didn't want more points because it's getting costly to maintain the points.

Then the this sales manager showed up and started off not polite but not either pleasant. Just business. So he goes into a sales pitch, tells me what a great off he has and I'll never seen another this good again. I told him I'm not interested to buy at this time. Then he started getting upset. Telling me it's a great deal. I countered that I can buy a Marriott timeshare online for a lot less money. That statement really got him mad. He said "Do you really think Marriott would let you enter that into the system? You will be stuck with it with no flexibility or service". So I gave him a look of disinterest. Then he went to his backup plan and offered me a "repurchase". That is a timeshare lease Marriott repurchased from a customer. This offer was less than half the 2nd offer they made. It was a pretty good offer and came with all the Marriott services. But... I had already said, from the very beginning that I was not going to buy anything this year. He went ballistic by then. I should note, Waikoloa's sales office is a closed environment. You can hear the offers that other sale people are offering. This sales guy started yelling at me and went into a temper tantrum. He was screaming. I won't mention his name but I will say that he was way less than "presidential". So here I am, getting yelled at, screamed at and I'm wondering why he thinks this is going to convince me to buy. I have to say, that last offer was very tempting. But instead of being respectful and talking more about it, he rushed into his scream-fest. And then he shuffled his papers and walked out on us, like a frustrated cry babying child. He was not "presidential" at all.
 

Quadmaniac

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This is not much different from my experience at Ko Olina last week. I posted it in another thread. They seem to be getting more aggressive and desperate.
 

VacationForever

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Then he went to his backup plan and offered me a "repurchase". That is a timeshare lease Marriott repurchased from a customer. This offer was less than half the 2nd offer they made. It was a pretty good offer and came with all the Marriott services.

Would you please explain? I have never heard of this.
 

jhac007

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I vacationed at the Waikoloa Vacation Club recently. I love the renovations and the hotel. However, I made the very stupid mistake to accept the MVC sales pitch. They offered 25K reward points or $150 in discounts to some local shops. I chose the $150.

I’ve been to maybe 8 or 9 sales presentations over the years and I’ve spent some coin to join MVC. All my past presentations were very professional. I work in a sales/customer type role and discuss business with sales people quite often. In all my previous presentations, I have been upfront and very genuine with the sales person that I am or am not interested in spending money at the sales meeting. I don’t beat around the bush. I set the expectation if I am interested or if I am definitely not interested.

I told them upfront, in the 1st 5 minutes that I was not going to buy anything. I was just want updates to properties and changes to the system to book. The sales guy acknowledge that and started the presentation. He was very good socially, discussing his family, how he met his wife, etc. Like this is going to soften me up. (NOT). He progressively transitioned into a pure sales pitch. When I told him again, I'm not spending money, he was still in that sales pitch mode known as "I know I can switch him to buy".

Then he told me he was bringing in his sales manager. While we waited a few minutes, we heard the customers next to us say they didn't want more points because it's getting costly to maintain the points.

Then the this sales manager showed up and started off not polite but not either pleasant. Just business. So he goes into a sales pitch, tells me what a great off he has and I'll never seen another this good again. I told him I'm not interested to buy at this time. Then he started getting upset. Telling me it's a great deal. I countered that I can buy a Marriott timeshare online for a lot less money. That statement really got him mad. He said "Do you really think Marriott would let you enter that into the system? You will be stuck with it with no flexibility or service". So I gave him a look of disinterest. Then he went to his backup plan and offered me a "repurchase". That is a timeshare lease Marriott repurchased from a customer. This offer was less than half the 2nd offer they made. It was a pretty good offer and came with all the Marriott services. But... I had already said, from the very beginning that I was not going to buy anything this year. He went ballistic by then. I should note, Waikoloa's sales office is a closed environment. You can hear the offers that other sale people are offering. This sales guy started yelling at me and went into a temper tantrum. He was screaming. I won't mention his name but I will say that he was way less than "presidential". So here I am, getting yelled at, screamed at and I'm wondering why he thinks this is going to convince me to buy. I have to say, that last offer was very tempting. But instead of being respectful and talking more about it, he rushed into his scream-fest. And then he shuffled his papers and walked out on us, like a frustrated cry babying child. He was not "presidential" at all.


Maybe he and his family were not having regular meals!
 

Quadmaniac

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Would you please explain? I have never heard of this.

I would assume he is referring to a hybrid package where they sell you a week and the corresponding number of points so the total points with the points from the week works out to be about $7.60ish per point.

Essentially the sell X week worth say 2500 points and sell you another 2500 points for a total of 5000 points for around 37K.
 

davidvel

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So sad that Marriott has gone this way. For the past 7 years since inception of their great club, this story is repeated over and over. With points its just too easy to do simple math by looking at the number of points needed for a week where you want to go, then comparing how expensive it is to buy and maintain. With rare exception, its almost always more than booking directly with Marriott.

Stupid club is hard to sell, and new crop of salesperson believe its your duty to buy. I think its fair to give names. My salesperson was Lonnie in Tahoe. Same type, who told me he had a mortgage to pay and showed me his toddler and wife he needed to feed, that he would struggle with if I didn't buy. Desperate and pathetic.
 
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VacationForever

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I would assume he is referring to a hybrid package where they sell you a week and the corresponding number of points so the total points with the points from the week works out to be about $7.60ish per point.

Essentially the sell X week worth say 2500 points and sell you another 2500 points for a total of 5000 points for around 37K.
It makes sense now. Thanks.
 

buzglyd

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That's called commission breath.
 

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Please send a note to Marriott. Just let them know as a owner you found it very unprofessional and that you expect more from Marriott since as an owner, bad behavior on their sales staff reduce the value of your properties.
 

Charlie Jones

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I would assume he is referring to a hybrid package where they sell you a week and the corresponding number of points so the total points with the points from the week works out to be about $7.60ish per point.

Essentially the sell X week worth say 2500 points and sell you another 2500 points for a total of 5000 points for around 37K.

I didn't get into the details because the manager was already acting poorly. But your description is similar to what I think I heard.
 

Charlie Jones

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Please send a note to Marriott. Just let them know as a owner you found it very unprofessional and that you expect more from Marriott since as an owner, bad behavior on their sales staff reduce the value of your properties.

I assume the MVC monitors this bulletin board. I left enough clues in my note that anyone familiar with MVC Waikoloa's sales office know exactly who I am talking about.
 

Quadmaniac

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I sent a message to Marriott from their contact info area and sent them links to the numerous threads about the presentations and failures of late including my experience. I got a call back from a customer service manager who says they are really sorry about the experience and will look into it. She seems sincere in the phone but who knows what will really be done.

I received the feedback survey from my stay at Ko Olina and mentioned it there as well. Hopefully they will get the message that their behaviour is unacceptable.
 

Denise G

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We had a very similar terrible experience with MVC Sales in Maui a few years ago. We walked out when the Sales Manager got so condescending that we weren’t buying more points that he said we obviously weren’t wealthy enough to afford MVC. And we’ve not gone to another sales presentation since!
 

Renzo

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I vacationed at the Waikoloa Vacation Club recently. I love the renovations and the hotel. However, I made the very stupid mistake to accept the MVC sales pitch. They offered 25K reward points or $150 in discounts to some local shops. I chose the $150.

I’ve been to maybe 8 or 9 sales presentations over the years and I’ve spent some coin to join MVC. All my past presentations were very professional. I work in a sales/customer type role and discuss business with sales people quite often. In all my previous presentations, I have been upfront and very genuine with the sales person that I am or am not interested in spending money at the sales meeting. I don’t beat around the bush. I set the expectation if I am interested or if I am definitely not interested.

I told them upfront, in the 1st 5 minutes that I was not going to buy anything. I was just want updates to properties and changes to the system to book. The sales guy acknowledge that and started the presentation. He was very good socially, discussing his family, how he met his wife, etc. Like this is going to soften me up. (NOT). He progressively transitioned into a pure sales pitch. When I told him again, I'm not spending money, he was still in that sales pitch mode known as "I know I can switch him to buy".

Then he told me he was bringing in his sales manager. While we waited a few minutes, we heard the customers next to us say they didn't want more points because it's getting costly to maintain the points.

Then the this sales manager showed up and started off not polite but not either pleasant. Just business. So he goes into a sales pitch, tells me what a great off he has and I'll never seen another this good again. I told him I'm not interested to buy at this time. Then he started getting upset. Telling me it's a great deal. I countered that I can buy a Marriott timeshare online for a lot less money. That statement really got him mad. He said "Do you really think Marriott would let you enter that into the system? You will be stuck with it with no flexibility or service". So I gave him a look of disinterest. Then he went to his backup plan and offered me a "repurchase". That is a timeshare lease Marriott repurchased from a customer. This offer was less than half the 2nd offer they made. It was a pretty good offer and came with all the Marriott services. But... I had already said, from the very beginning that I was not going to buy anything this year. He went ballistic by then. I should note, Waikoloa's sales office is a closed environment. You can hear the offers that other sale people are offering. This sales guy started yelling at me and went into a temper tantrum. He was screaming. I won't mention his name but I will say that he was way less than "presidential". So here I am, getting yelled at, screamed at and I'm wondering why he thinks this is going to convince me to buy. I have to say, that last offer was very tempting. But instead of being respectful and talking more about it, he rushed into his scream-fest. And then he shuffled his papers and walked out on us, like a frustrated cry babying child. He was not "presidential" at all.
If all you wanted was updates then maybe you shouldn’t have wasted people’s time. All you had to do was call Marriott. What were they supposed to do after you told them you were not interested? Leave you alone? They were just doing their job. I understand not everyone buys, I get that, but going to 8 or 9 presentations? And all that for $150? [Name calling deleted.]

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dougp26364

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If all you wanted was updates then maybe you shouldn’t have wasted people’s time. All you had to do was call Marriott. What were they supposed to do after you told them you were not interested? Leave you alone? They were just doing their job. I understand not everyone buys, I get that, but going to 8 or 9 presentations? And all that for $150? [name calling deleted]

My bet is MVC made the offer to attend the presentation. I know they’re ALWAYS after us to attend. They push even when I tell them we’re not buying, own more than we need, hate presentation et....

If they want to stop “mooches”, it’d be simple enough to black list those who attend multiple presentations without buying. I’ve had salesmen drop the threat that we’d NEVER be invited to another presentation since we weren’t buying. To bad that’s not true because, next time we vacation we get that call from the “concierge” offering another “owner update.”

We attend very few presentation but, every now and again we travel with friends and, $100 or $150 per couple allows us to go out for a nice dinner. We’re upfront and decline the invitation once. If they push, I feel no remorse about taking their money
 
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DeniseM

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Please note that this thread is from Oct. 2017, and someone has brought it out of mothballs with posts #14 & 15.
 

Jayco29D

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I would assume he is referring to a hybrid package where they sell you a week and the corresponding number of points so the total points with the points from the week works out to be about $7.60ish per point.

Essentially the sell X week worth say 2500 points and sell you another 2500 points for a total of 5000 points for around 37K.

Does that include all costs including closing costs and activation fees? If so, it’s a great deal for buying direct from Marriott, given that resale DC points are selling for a minimum of $6.50 all in.
 

dougp26364

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Keep in mind DeniseM pointed out this was an old thread pulled out of mothballs, so the price point is probably different by now. The last tour we did was 2 1/2 years ago. They didn’t offer us the hybrid program at that time but, they had offered it to us maybe 4 years ago, so it might have been in their notes we had declined it, so they didn’t try that option again on us
 

JIMinNC

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Does that include all costs including closing costs and activation fees? If so, it’s a great deal for buying direct from Marriott, given that resale DC points are selling for a minimum of $6.50 all in.

Keep in mind DeniseM pointed out this was an old thread pulled out of mothballs, so the price point is probably different by now. The last tour we did was 2 1/2 years ago. They didn’t offer us the hybrid program at that time but, they had offered it to us maybe 4 years ago, so it might have been in their notes we had declined it, so they didn’t try that option again on us

We haven't done a Marriott sales presentation since 2014 either, but my recollection is most of the hybrid package offers I've seen posted here recently still wind up in that same $7 to $8 per point range. Not sure whether folks include the closing costs or not when they post those offers, but remember, when you are buying a Points/Week package from Marriott there is no equivalent to the huge $2/point activation fee charged on external resale points purchases. The only added costs over the base purchase price of the week and points are the closing costs of about $500-$600 for the week and about the same for the points. That's only about $1000 or so over the actual cost of the week and the bundled points, so depending on how many points are being acquired, the impact of those fees may not have as significant a relative impact on the deal pricing as the $2/point activation fee has on a $3 to $5 per point resale points purchase.
 

Steve Fatula

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We always go to the presentations, and always for MR points, which are now 30,000. We've piled up in 20 years more than 700,000 points which have paid for all over overseas flights and other things. It's free money the way we look at it. Generally, we tell them as the OP stated that we will not be buying anything. And they tell us it's of course to update us, great, then we have a deal. So, at .9 cents per point (I believe the current worth of MR points), they have paid us $6,300. i.e., most all of the money we paid for our original ownership (not resale). We will always continue to go, but, would not stand for being treated as the OP was. 30,000 points is $270, so, that's not bad for say 1.5 hours of "work".

I will edit this post with an addendum. The value of MR points is highly dependent on how you use them. On our Australia trip last year, the flights in cash price were $1,500 each. That's $3,000 for the wife and I. Instead, we signed up for a MileagePlus card for United, and, supplemented that with MR points and just our normal life purchases in order to reach the necessary 120,000 points for 2 free tickets. So, the extra points we needed required us to spend 112,000 MR points to get the necessary United points (though it was too many, that's ok, it will pay for Thailand next year as we will have piled up enough by then). So, the way I view it, that was 4 presentations for $3,000. We'll do that every day as long as we can. But we get that many view that still as a bad trade. Everyone is different. One cannot deny the monetary value though. We're just cheap. :)

I think these sorts of tricks may be useful to some, perhaps a different way of viewing things. I understand many if not most people see TS presentations as horrific or whatever. They don't bother the wife and I in the least, and the rewards are just too good to pass up. We've had a number of inquiries as far as how we can travel so cheap. This is one way.
 
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When we were at Pueblo Bonito Pacifica (hotel side) in December, they gave us $400 in resort credits to attend the TS presentation and they only charged us $100 per night (instead of $150 per night) to upgrade us from a hotel room (about 400 sf) with no view from the unit and only a partial ocean view from the balcony to a Club level oceanfront one bedroom (800 sf + 2 huge balconies) on the top floor with oceanviews from every room and sunset views too. It was one of the most amazing views we’ve had and the room was wonderfully maintained and recently remodeled. The upgrade also gave us access to their oceanfront Club restaurant. We used the $400 credit to pay for the room upgrade. Since there were only 6 days left on our week when we went to the TS presentation, we only paid $200 for the room upgrade. We went to PCP on a certificate promo so we did not pay much for the hotel room to begin with. The TS presentation was enjoyable and they took us on a tour of all different property options at Sunset Beach and Montecristo. We did not buy and the TS sales reps were super nice. It was 3 hours including breakfast and the tour. I did not mind because I wanted to see the interiors of the other properties since we were not staying there. It is strange, but I thought $400 was very little but I guess it was a great deal, especially since we also got the inexpensive room upgrade. It was Christmas week and they were sold out so we were so lucky to get to stay in one of their best suites in the entire hotel property. That may have been my favorite vacation in 2017. And now I get to say good things about Pueblo Bonito since they treated us so well! I like spreading good karma!

I am just mentioning this because folks are bragging about getting a couple hundred dollars of benefits for attending a TS presentation. I would never attend a TS presentation for so little unless I had a reason like wanting to see the rooms anyway. The few times I have attended a TS presentation that the developer has invited me to, I have gotten oceanview room upgrades and other benefits like a free rental car for 10 days. However, those benefits were in Mexico, not in the USA.

We went to a Marriott sales office last summer when we were in Hawaii. We asked simply to see the rooms but we did not sit through a presentation. For that, we got nothing and they did not do anything except show us the room - no pressure at all from MVC. Once again, I was happy that they did exactly what I asked and did not pressure us, so I did not expect anything financial in return for that.

P.S. I am not into eating so a free breakfast with a TS rep would never motivate me. LOL
 

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he said we obviously weren’t wealthy enough to afford MVC.

Yes, I've heard this one a couple of times and I never understood this strategy. Is that suppose to make me whip out my credit card and say "I am too rich enough and I'm going to prove it to you. Where do I sign."
 
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Jayco29D

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Yes, I've heard this one a couple of times and I never understood this strategy. Is that suppose to make me whip out my credit card and say "I am too rich enough and I'm going to prove it to you. Where do I sign."

This is so ridiculous and rude. I would tell them off.
 
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