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8/24/22 NEW THREAD: Discussion of new Abound/VSN Documents [please limit chitchat posts]

CalGalTraveler

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I don’t think so, I think if you’re in abound you’ll receive elite benefits. I have only resales left in my account and I now see an elite level associated with my account.

someone did report on the abound Facebook group that they were told that Marriott made a change and mandatory resales would not be included after all. Again, this is what a “supervisor” at owner services told this owner. Who really knows? I did check the FAQ’s and they have not changed. I’d assume if they were making a change like that, they would remove the verbiage in the FAQ’s quickly.

Thank you. Sounds like sales blather or poor training. They wouldn't bill you for the Abound fee if they didn't intend to have you enroll.

I just realized that the line item says,"2023 Select Dues $239.58" So perhaps this is recognition of the Elite level. I recall the email I received said that we would also map to the elite level, but my memory may not be accurate.

Curious if there is a mandatory resale owner that qualifies for "member" level with fewer than elite Abound points tier, if that line item says, "2023 Member Dues $239.50"
 

Ken555

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Waiting for WKV invoice to be available.


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DavidnRobin

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Based on the Membership Fee on our WKORV 2023 MF Bill ($307) - it is apparent that resale Vistana Mandatory VOIs (prior to Aug 2022) are included in Abound. Our WKORV Ownership was our first.

Based on our Ownership we should be a Presidential Level which matches the Membership Fee (plus HI tax).
 
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DavidnRobin

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Based on the Membership Fee on our WKORV 2023 MF Bill ($307) - it is apparent that resale Vistana Mandatory VOIs (prior to Aug 2022) are included in Abound. Our WKORV Ownership was our first.

Based on our Ownership we should be a Presidential Level which matches the Membership Fee (plus HI tax).


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Based on my Ownership with the 1st part of VSN fee taxed by HI.
It costs $67 more with the New Membership fee ($307) over VSN alone ($240).
If $600 to rejoin, guess I am forced to pay - arg! — since I may use Abound at some point.

And other than Covid - no need to Bank or use II or Housekeeping fees as we go where we own for most part.


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daviator

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Based on my Ownership with the 1st part of VSN fee taxed by HI.
It costs $67 more with the New Membership fee ($307) over VSN alone ($240).
If $600 to rejoin, guess I am forced to pay - arg! — since I may use Abound at some point.

And other than Covid - no need to Bank or use II or Housekeeping fees as we go where we own for most part.


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I also have my Club Dues billed on my WKORV ownership, so I get Hawaii GET added to the amount (I wonder if you can request to have your club dues assessed on a different VOI, to save the sales taxes? It probably isn't worth the effort.)

Like you, we go where we own, mostly. I've never paid housekeeping fees in almost 20 years of ownership, and only paid a banking fee a couple of times. So I will pay roughly $100/year more under the new scheme.

The people who will really save money are those who own in both the MVC and Vistana systems and were previously paying membership dues in two systems. So essentially it benefits MVC owners who also own in Vistana. I suspect most Vistana owners will pay more.

And it seems like those who own at Lagunamar or Harborside may have to continue paying VSN dues for those properties, while ALSO paying Abound dues for other VOIs. So they get hit twice! I am not in that situation.
 

DavidnRobin

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I also have my Club Dues billed on my WKORV ownership, so I get Hawaii GET added to the amount (I wonder if you can request to have your club dues assessed on a different VOI, to save the sales taxes? It probably isn't worth the effort.)

It can’t be changed - I inquired.


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I also have my Club Dues billed on my WKORV ownership, so I get Hawaii GET added to the amount (I wonder if you can request to have your club dues assessed on a different VOI, to save the sales taxes? It probably isn't worth the effort.)

Like you, we go where we own, mostly. I've never paid housekeeping fees in almost 20 years of ownership, and only paid a banking fee a couple of times. So I will pay roughly $100/year more under the new scheme.

The people who will really save money are those who own in both the MVC and Vistana systems and were previously paying membership dues in two systems. So essentially it benefits MVC owners who also own in Vistana. I suspect most Vistana owners will pay more.

And it seems like those who own at Lagunamar or Harborside may have to continue paying VSN dues for those properties, while ALSO paying Abound dues for other VOIs. So they get hit twice! I am not in that situation.
Harborside is not part of Abound yet but Lagunamar is. Why would the Lagunamar owners have to pay VSN and Abound fees?
 

daviator

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Harborside is not part of Abound yet but Lagunamar is. Why would the Lagunamar owners have to pay VSN and Abound fees?
I thought I’d read in another post that a Lagunamar owner got charged VSN fee on their ownership there, but maybe I misremembered. So what I said probably applies to St. John and Harborside owners but (maybe) not to Lagunamar.
 

vistana101

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For those that have mandatory resales now enrolled in Abound, are you able to now convert those to Bonvoy points as well? Or did it just impact the timeshare side?
 

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For those that have mandatory resales now enrolled in Abound, are you able to now convert those to Bonvoy points as well? Or did it just impact the timeshare side?

I did see that option to convert our resales to BV points, but did not go further to see if it was actually doable.


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Red elephant

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I also have my Club Dues billed on my WKORV ownership, so I get Hawaii GET added to the amount (I wonder if you can request to have your club dues assessed on a different VOI, to save the sales taxes? It probably isn't worth the effort.)

Like you, we go where we own, mostly. I've never paid housekeeping fees in almost 20 years of ownership, and only paid a banking fee a couple of times. So I will pay roughly $100/year more under the new scheme.

The people who will really save money are those who own in both the MVC and Vistana systems and were previously paying membership dues in two systems. So essentially it benefits MVC owners who also own in Vistana. I suspect most Vistana owners will pay more.

And it seems like those who own at Lagunamar or Harborside may have to continue paying VSN dues for those properties, while ALSO paying Abound dues for other VOIs. So they get hit twice! I am not in that situation.
I wonder what is going to happen to me as I own both Marriott and Vistana but I also own Harborside which will not be in Abound. As a 5 star my VSN fee was reduced for that week. So do I loose that discount since only one week will be in VSN? Will they give me my money back if Harborside can be enrolled in Abound sometime in 2023?
Since it’s EOY even do I have to pay a fee for 2023? So many questions.
 

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I wonder what is going to happen to me as I own both Marriott and Vistana but I also own Harborside which will not be in Abound. As a 5 star my VSN fee was reduced for that week. So do I loose that discount since only one week will be in VSN? Will they give me my money back if Harborside can be enrolled in Abound sometime in 2023?
Since it’s EOY even do I have to pay a fee for 2023? So many questions.
So those who are part of VSN are automatically enrolled in Abound. The went as far as allowing mandatory resale to participate to Abound. Yet, the same rule does not apply to Harborside? What are the issues there and why the secrecy? How can someone who owns Marriott and Vistana see a reduction of fees while someone who owns Harborside and another Vistana resort would have to pay more? I hope this is just a misunderstanding. Not to mention the program did not even start yet but, if you do not like the new fees, you are supposed to make a decision if you want to "opt out". Opt out of what exactly?
 

Ken555

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Not to mention the program did not even start yet but, if you do not like the new fees, you are supposed to make a decision if you want to "opt out". Opt out of what exactly?

FWIW, I saw this on Facebook yesterday.

4e6d38aea094fb059f25477aec797dac.jpg



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TravelTime

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Is the Abound opt out something a TS owner wrote? It sort of looks like something a TS owner would create. It seems too specific to one person’s situation. There seems to be a lot missing as well.
 

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FWIW, I saw this on Facebook yesterday.

4e6d38aea094fb059f25477aec797dac.jpg



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Looks very similar to the language in the most recent maintenance fee statements on page 2.

Not sure about my understanding, but it seems to me there are 2 different aspects to the Abound decision.

One is about whether to take advantage of the consolidated fee structure which for many owners of multiple properties will result in lower fees. Opting out of this will also take away the opportunity to convert StarOptions to Abound Destination Club Points.

The "Other" is an annual decision to convert StarOptions to Abound points which opens up opportunities to book the Marriott properties and other Marriott Trust inventory at up to 13 months in advance and has some banking options.

We expect to take advantage of the new fee structure and make the conversion to Abound decision on an annual basis. Hope I understand. Looking forward to the launch so we can gain more clarity.
 

DanCali

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If I don’t plan to use Abound - am I still required to pay?

Owners who do not plan to elect Abound points for their VOIs should still, IMO, consider paying the consolidated fee versus opting out. Opting out would likely require a subsequent purchase to re-enroll which would be very costly.

Things like banking fees would go away when one pays the consolidated fee, so dollar-wise it could even out. Moreover, even if you do not elect points for your own VOI, the ability to rent points from others (typically at what is the cost of Trust points MFs) can be very useful. This would allow, for example, to combine one week at WPORV with a few extra days on Poipu at Marriott's Waiohai, a few days on St. John with a few days on St. Thomas and some other nice combinations. We also live pretty close to a Marriott property in Florida and take advantage of the "worst (i.e., cheapest) season when you can get a studio at 70 points/night (~$45) at 60-days out for Sun-Fri stays and we just use it to access the facilities during the day. And those stays often get me to the Bonvoy 75-night level so I get an extra 5 suite nights or a 40K certificate.

We had a couple of pre-2010 Marriott weeks and held out on enrolling (fee for pre-2010 resale weeks was around $2000) until around 2015 because I also didn't believe we'd ever elect points. Our catalyst to enroll was to get grandfathered to Executive level before the threshold went from 6500 points (which we had) to 7000 points (which we did not). We rarely elected points for our weeks, but we often rented points from others and used them in the manner I described above.
 

CalGalTraveler

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If you sign up for Abound, can you still elect Staroptions for a given year?
 

dioxide45

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If you sign up for Abound, can you still elect Staroptions for a given year?
You don't really "elect" StarOptions. Whenever you go to make a VSN reservation at 8 months, you are using StarOptions. That doesn't go away with Abound. You also don't sign up for Abound. Now if you elect Abound Club Points in a given year, you lose the ability to use the StarOptions from that VOI for VSN StarOption reservations.
 

CalGalTraveler

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Thanks for clarifying. We've always used our unit and never traded staroptions. It seems like there is little to lose (x club fee increase) and benefits to gain - especially if life happens and we cannot use the unit. Makes me feel better about MVC/Vistana integration. Who knows? I may buy more.

As a resale mandatory, it sounds like if you don't sign up now, you will lose the new Elite designation, and may not be able to sign up later as a resale.
 
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dioxide45

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As a resale mandatory, it sounds like if you don't sign up now, you will lose the new Elite designation, and may not be able to sign up later as a resale.
This would only apply if you opt-out. Again, there is no signing up for Abound. It is automatic. We don't know, if when you opt out, what kind of requirement will be there to become part of Abound again..
 

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I was going by the opt-out note shared earlier in this thread,"...purchaser will not be eligible to receive any benefits as a Grandfathered VSN Elite Member."

I am planning to opt-in but wanting to be certain we are not losing any rights. Sounds like a great benefits. I am regretting not buying another deed prior to the cut-off date.
 

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I was going by the opt-out note shared earlier in this thread,"...purchaser will not be eligible to receive any benefits as a Grandfathered VSN Elite Member."

I am planning to opt-in but wanting to be certain we are not losing any rights. Sounds like a great benefits. I am regretting not buying another deed prior to the cut-off date.
Just to be clear, there is no "opting in." There's only opting out. If you don't opt out, you will be enrolled in Abound.

There is an annual election if you want to play in the Abound program for the following calendar year instead of at your home resort or in VSN. Abound isn't a very good deal as an exchange platform for many Vistana owners, but it does open up additional properties and so may make sense for some.

My question is whether Abound members can rent Club Points even if they never elect to exchange their Vistana ownership(s) for Club Points. I don't think we know yet.
 

dioxide45

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My question is whether Abound members can rent Club Points even if they never elect to exchange their Vistana ownership(s) for Club Points. I don't think we know yet.
Marriott owners are able to do it.
 

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Marriott owners are able to do it.
Yes, but they have MVC online accounts. It isn't clear to me whether we will have an MVC account, particularly if we never elect to give our ownership(s) to Abound. I guess we will wait and see. Hopefully we will have the same ability as Marriott owners to rent points.
 
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