Oklahoma National Guard

[Pompey Family]

Name them.

Oh please! As if I know the names of all the people across the world who believe that they are completely safe once vaccinated! I've read comments on travel forums from people who believe just that.

Not one responsible scientist or expert or govt leader or media talking head has made a definitive claim that the vaccines are 100% effective in any capacity.

No, not that I'm aware of but it doesn't stop people believing that they are.

Maybe the irresponsible people should stop pulling claims of 100% efficacy out of thin air and tell us instead what the experts are actually saying.

What's irresponsible about telling people that they're not 100% effective? Surely it's more irresponsible to shout down those that are advising people that they're not 100% effective! Some people have their priorities screwed up.

 

[Pompey Family]

Propagating that lie

It's not a lie. The vaccines don't prevent transmission, what they are effective at is reducing the chance of transmission. The way some people act they need to be given information in simple terms.

 

[SueDonJ]

What's irresponsible about telling people that they're not 100% effective? Surely it's more irresponsible to shout down those that are advising people that they're not 100% effective! Some people have their priorities screwed up.

You misunderstand. What's irresponsible is telling people that claims of 100% efficacy are being made by responsible experts, govt officials and media talking heads, when no such claims have been made. What's irresponsible is pulling that claim out of thin air for the sole purpose of furthering criticisms against the vaccines.

There's a big difference between claiming:

"Responsible people are hurting you by telling you that the vaccines are 100% effective, because that is just not true. But if they're lying to you about that, what else are they lying to you about?"

and:

"You should not believe anyone who tells you that the vaccines are 100% effective, because no responsible expert, govt official or media talking head has made that claim. The truth, and the reason why vaccines are being strongly suggested, is because they lessen illness severity and the likelihood of death, and with widespread acceptance will result in herd immunity because lesser degrees of illness and shorter duration of illness results in lesser transmission."

 

[bluehende]

There are many people who believe that the vaccines are 100% effective, meaning that they believe they can't contract the virus and that they can't transmit it. These people need to be made aware that both beliefs are incorrect. 93% isn't 100% is it? Meanwhile, you're writing lies and misinformation on threads to claim that I'm spreading falsehoods. It's people like you with your comments that lead those to believe that they're completely 'safe'!

I'm not claiming the vaccines don't work, I never have! Do you get it yet?

You are right. It is a shame you did not actually say that until called on your misinformation.

Please show anywhere where I said they are completely safe. I have posted dozens of different studies that give exact risk info according to the study. One was posted showing exact risk from myocarditis. You routinely call this a problem but refuse to believe actual data that shows that the incidence of a very treatable and rarely dangerous disease is about 200 to 1000 times more prevalent due to infection. You know data other than what I want to believe.

And again answer the question.

Show any data that shows the vaccine is not within orders of magnitude safer than the disease.....you know....what I actually said.

 

[Pompey Family]

What's irresponsible is telling people that claims of 100% efficacy are being made by responsible experts, govt officials and media talking heads, when no such claims have been made.

Can you point out where I've made such a statement?

 

[SueDonJ]

Can you point out where I've made such a statement?

You stated that people are being led to believe that claims of 100% vaccine efficacy are being made (although you've yet to name any of the people who've made those claims or any of the people who believe them.)

Why would you believe that claims of 100% efficacy are being made and believed, if you can't point to the origins of the claims? Why would you perpetuate the falsehood that vaccines are 100% effective by furthering the untruth that someone somewhere sometime made such a claim, if you can't prove it?

 

[PigsDad]

It's not a lie. The vaccines don't prevent transmission, what they are effective at is reducing the chance of transmission. The way some people act they need to be given information in simple terms.

I'll try to state this in simple terms for you. In the bolded statement above, you are admitting that the vaccines prevent transmission a percentage of the time. That is in direct conflict with your repeated statement that "vaccines don't prevent transmission". If you had said "vaccines don't prevent transmission all of the time", then we wouldn't be having this conversation, but you keep on repeating the clearly incorrect statement. Word choices have consequences -- you can't just make up your own rules of language. I suggest you have a conversation with an English teacher to set yourself straight on how to properly use the language. What you are saying is simply wrong. Period.

I'm exiting this conversation now, since trying to have this conversation with someone who doesn't even know how to properly use the language is pointless. Have a nice day.

Kurt

 

[dannybaker]

We have Lost friends and family from COVID-19. All of them were unvaccinated and believed the vaccine was a hoax. I’ve had over a dozen vaccinated friends and family members get COVID-19 and survive with little to no issues. Not one person has died who has been given the vaccine. One of my Commanders just died September 28 from covid, he was 54 years old retired col from the USAF. He was in great shape prior to getting covid and it destroyed him. He was on life support for over 87 days, his lungs collapsed four times during this time. He was not vaccinated. Another Chief Master E-9 who worked for me found out about our Commander and decided to get the shot, ten days later he caught covid at word and brought it home. His 22 year old son was put on life support seven days later, his last words were I don’t want to die dad, can we get the vaccine now please.

 

[Pompey Family]

You stated that people are being led to believe that claims of 100% vaccine efficacy are being made

No I didn't. If you're going to quote me then at least have the decency to do so accurately. I said people believe that the vaccine provides 100% immunity, not that they're being led to believe. How those people reach their conclusion is not known to me and I don't claim to know how they've reached that conclusion.

In discussions such as this one it's important to not put words into people's mouths.

 

[geekette]

We have Lost friends and family from COVID-19. All of them were unvaccinated and believed the vaccine was a hoax. I’ve had over a dozen vaccinated friends and family members get COVID-19 and survive with little to no issues. Not one person has died who has been given the vaccine. One of my Commanders just died September 28 from covid, he was 54 years old retired col from the USAF. He was in great shape prior to getting covid and it destroyed him. He was on life support for over 87 days, his lungs collapsed four times during this time. He was not vaccinated. Another Chief Master E-9 who worked for me found out about our Commander and decided to get the shot, ten days later he caught covid at word and brought it home. His 22 year old son was put on life support seven days later, his last words were I don’t want to die dad, can we get the vaccine now please.

What a difficult post this must have been. I am so sorry. Healthy young people, lost.

 

[geekette]

No I didn't. If you're going to quote me then at least have the decency to do so accurately. I said people believe that the vaccine provides 100% immunity, not that they're being led to believe. How those people reach their conclusion is not known to me and I don't claim to know how they've reached that conclusion.

In discussions such as this one it's important to not put words into people's mouths.

In my opinion, there are people that will believe damned-near anything.

Not wanting into the fray, my simple question is, how do you know there are people that think it is 100% effective? Are these people you have interacted with and they said it?

It seems to me that anyone that has had, say, flu shot, knows they can still get the flu, and some do. It would not take great imagination to expect some people getting a shot to think it is full protection, guaranteed. I tend to think that pandemic has brought a lot more attention to so many details, but, I cannot believe that everyone is devouring all info all the time. It's not unthinkable that some aren't doing any info consumption about it whatsoever.

So, I do think there are probably a great many people that think covid vax = guaranteed protection. I'm sorry they think that, as they then could be likely to let their guard down. Thing is, when I'm in a store and there are a lot of unmasked people, I don't know if they are vaxxed or not. Neither does the person going unmasked thinking they are totally safe being out and about.

 

[MdRef]

Moderator Note: [Duplicate post deleted and responses to it have been moved to this thread: U.S. Covid-19 Deaths in 2021 Surpass 2020's] <-- SueDonJ