# Newbie wanting to buy resale!



## Smo1990 (Oct 10, 2018)

Hello all!

My husband and I attended the whole timeshare spiel in Myrtle Beach yesterday. We went in to it thinking we were just gonna get our free gifts and never look back. BUT as he was doing his whole pitch, we both realized that the point system might actually be ideal for our family. We do wanna vacation 2-3 weeks a year now that we don’t have babies, at least one of them here in Myrtle each year. If I would have been alone, I probably would have been suckered into it, so THANK GOD my husband is the voice of reason. 

Since we got back, I’ve been researching and see that resale is clearly the way to go. But since we were provided an obviously biased view of the program, I don’t how the system works and whether or not it’s a good deal. Can you guys tell me or direct me to a good resource for how the program works, what I can expect, etc. Last thing I want to do is buy points and pay my maintenance fees and then not be able to use them.


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## mjc775 (Oct 10, 2018)

About 5 years ago I was in your situation. Went to a Wyndham presentation, bought, rescinded, bought resale (eBay). A year later we bought from Diamond (not resale) because we liked the resort and the other resorts in the presentation, and we got a status upgrade because we were Wyndham owners. 

Would I buy again? No. Here’s why: We’re basically limited to staying at a select few resorts and destinations, which aren’t always available unless we book exactly 10-13 months out. Multiple times I’ve tried to book using points a few months out, yet there was no availability. I then went to Expedia and was able to book the exact same room type and dates as a rental, at a considerable discount from regular rates. 

My wife often asks why we can’t book at “THAT Ritz Carlton or JW Marriott”. Because we already “invested” $36K and yearly MFs of $2700 into our limited selection of resorts, destinations and availability. 


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## Smo1990 (Oct 10, 2018)

mjc775 said:


> About 5 years ago I was in your situation. Went to a Wyndham presentation, bought, rescinded, bought resale (eBay). A year later we bought from Diamond (not resale) because we liked the resort and the other resorts in the presentation, and we got a status upgrade because we were Wyndham owners.
> 
> Would I buy again? No. Here’s why: We’re basically limited to staying at a select few resorts and destinations, which aren’t always available unless we book exactly 10-13 months out. Multiple times I’ve tried to book using points a few months out, yet there was no availability. I then went to Expedia and was able to book the exact same room type and dates as a rental, at a considerable discount from regular rates.
> 
> ...


Do you mean that you wouldn’t buy again AT ALL or that you wouldn’t buy again from Diamond? There’s one I’m looking at that would be 186,000 with MF of about $1100 yearly. If I could get two weeks out of that, I’d be happy. And I should add, we prefer to travel out of season to miss the crowds


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## mjc775 (Oct 10, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> Do you mean that you wouldn’t buy again AT ALL or that you wouldn’t buy again from Diamond?...



I wouldn’t buy AT ALL. I’ve lost flexibility to book elsewhere, and availability isn’t guaranteed. We’ve just reached the point in our lives where we don’t have to book during school breaks, so that may help a bit. But what if one of us becomes sick and we can’t travel - we’ve wasted money on something we can’t use. All things I wish I would have thought through 4-5 years ago. We bought because of emotion, instead of logic. 

Try booking your dream resort through Expedia or direct. Do the math. See if the initial cost + MFs make sense. Maybe it does?



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## harveyhaddixfan (Oct 10, 2018)

Wyndham is not Diamond. Diamond doesn’t have the real portfolio of resorts like Wyndham. They manage a lot of resorts but don’t necessarily have good inventory in them. Most people don’t understand that Diamond doesn’t own ever week of every unit at a resort. 

With Wyndham, buying resale is the way to go. You can get points contracts with low maintenance fees for next to nothing. I just had my contract and account set up a few weeks ago so I haven’t been able to play with the availability calendar yet. Keep in mind that he average 1 BR in prime season is 154,000 points.


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## rboesl (Oct 10, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> Do you mean that you wouldn’t buy again AT ALL or that you wouldn’t buy again from Diamond? There’s one I’m looking at that would be 186,000 with MF of about $1100 yearly. If I could get two weeks out of that, I’d be happy. And I should add, *we prefer to travel out of season to miss the crowds*


Smo1990, that will be the key to you getting the enjoyment out of your purchase that you expected. There's a reason that general advice here is to "buy where & when you like to go." Peak season also means peak competition for space. Following that advice allows you to guarantee the space & time you like most. But, it also requires planning ahead. Not 2-3 months but 6-12 months or more.

mjc775, regarding "*See if the initial cost + MFs make sense. Maybe it does?*" One of your purchases was from the developer, which is ALWAYS more expensive. But, over the long haul it can still work. A couple of years ago Consumer Reports did a comparison study. They compared a developer timeshare purchase at a DVC resort vs. visiting the same resort via booking through Expedia (I think) same time every year. The study showed a break even point at 7 years. After that the timeshare purchase continued to come out further and further ahead. Using that math buying resale would put you waaayyy ahead much earlier. Plus, that study didn't take into account the ability to book other getaway and last minute weeks at significant savings to Expedia.

I've kept a spreadsheet using the math the Consumer Reports study used for my own use. To date, over an 8 year period traveling 3 times a year, we have saved over $46,000 compared to booking using Orbitz & Expedia. So, I know from experience. The math works. But, you gotta plan ahead.


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## Rich S (Oct 10, 2018)

Hi Smo1990, and welcome to TUG!  

First of all, I commend you on doing your research, it will benefit you in the end whatever you choose to do.  Three years ago, my wife and I attended a timeshare presentation and decided to buy from the developer.  Although I learned later that we could have saved money buying resale, it wasn't a large contract and I do not regret the decision.  I have never stayed at that resort but I use it strictly for trading through II.

I have since purchased two Wyndham contracts resale totaling 421,000 points.  I could not be more pleased.

My home resort is in Las Vegas, and we use it several times a year.  It is an 8 hour drive for us so we just load up and go hang out for a few days.  We also vacationed in Hawaii for a week at Waikiki Beach Walk without having any booking problems.  The point system is very flexible allowing you to book any day of the week for any number of days that your points will allow.  Obviously it may be difficult to book some resorts last minute during peak times, for example Las Vegas for New Years eve.  However, with a little planning you should be able to enjoy great vacations and getaways within the Wyndham system.

Some will have you believe that owning a timeshare is the best thing since sliced bread.  Some will have you believe that only fools purchase timeshares.  My two cents is this:  There is a responsibility that comes with timeshare ownership.  It is NOT an investment.  It is an opportunity to vacation in well maintained, safe, enjoyable venues at reasonable rates over the LONG RUN.  Pay attention to the maintenance fees because those are going to be the recurring costs, especially if you purchase resale at a reasonable price.  Manage your expectations of what you may be getting into.  If you want to take trips several times a year for the cost of maintenance fees, you will enjoy it.  If you feel you should be guaranteed the best suite in the resort every year during Christmas, Thanksgiving, 4th of July, or New Years Eve just because you are an owner, you may be disappointed.

I know I got long winded and I apologize for that.  To answer your question, I have two deeded contracts equalling 420,000 points.  My points replenish each July 1st.  I can book any resort in Club Wyndham that is available at the time I request as long as I have enough points.  You just decide where you want to go, check the availability for that time, and if you have enough points you book it.  The further out you book, the better the chances for availability.

You have come to the right place for resources.  I am sure others will have more to say, this is just my experience so far.


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## Richelle (Oct 10, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> Do you mean that you wouldn’t buy again AT ALL or that you wouldn’t buy again from Diamond? There’s one I’m looking at that would be 186,000 with MF of about $1100 yearly. If I could get two weeks out of that, I’d be happy. And I should add, we prefer to travel out of season to miss the crowds



Those maintenance fees are not horrible but if you are willing to pay some money upfront, instead of taking the free or dirt cheap ones, you can get lower maintenance fees.  I just got a 168,000 biannual contract at National Harbor contract on eBay for $510, no closing costs or transfer fees.  The maintenance fees are $33 a month.  If that were an annual contract, the dues would be $66 a month.  There is currently a 154,000 point National Harbor annual contract with a starting bid of $750.  It was a relist.  It previously sold for $750, but i am guessing the buyer backed out.  The maintenance fees on that one would run you about $64 a month or $768 a year with the minimum program fee of $131 a year.  That's $27 a month or $330 a year cheaper then the one you are looking at.  If you paid $750 for that one, you'd would have made up for that extra cost just over two years and you'd still be paying lower fees after that.  National Harbor doesn't come up as often as the higher priced ones, but they come up maybe a couple times a month on ebay.  They run about $5-$9 per 1,000 points depending on the size and contract type.  Larger contracts can sometimes get more.  By Larger, i mean about 300,000 annual points or more.   If you need more then 154,000, if you are patient, you will find another National Harbor or maybe even Bali hai contract.  Those two plus Canterbury, steamboat springs, and Panama city have some of the lowest fees in the system, but you will have to pay more upfront.  However, in the long term, the higher upfront costs will be the better option.  Third Party market places include:

eBay
Tug Market Place
TugBBS Bargain bin
Redweek
Timeshare nation (these are free, but tend to have much higher maintenance fees)
SumDay Vacations

There are others like sellmytimeshare.com and buyatimeshare.com, and some Facebook groups have advertisements, but I would start with the above first.  I think you can get some of the best deals there.


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## Richelle (Oct 10, 2018)

Here is my little copy and paste blurb. It says eBay but it can apply to any third party market place, and in some aspects it can even apply to buying retail. 

Buying Wyndham resale

When buying on eBay, feedback is important to review before placing a bid. Keep in mind, that most people do not leave feedback until the process is completed. Me included. The problem though, is Wyndham takes weeks and sometimes months to complete the transaction, and that's not the seller's fault. I believe a buyer only has 45 days to leave feedback. That's not enough time to wait for the transaction to complete.  So not everyone is going to have a ton of feedback. Just look for patterns.  If you see negative marks, do they have something in common?  Communication is a common complaint. If the seller doesn't communicate, it understandably frustrates the buyer. This causes them to leave bad feedback. If you are unsure, ask some of us about a particular seller. Some may have already worked with them. Also, end of the year is usually the best time to buy because people are getting their yearly assessments and decide they want to sell their timeshare to get out of the maintenance fee cost. I got one of my resale contracts in November for $1. That same contract sold for $510 in May, and the buyer paid closing costs. Timing is everything. At the end of the year, it’s a buyers market. During vacation season, it’s a seller’s market. With that said, here are just some of the things you need to look for in the listing, besides price:

1.  What are the monthly maintenance fees?  Can you afford that on top of what you already have or your current budget? Some only list yearly, so you will have to do the math if you pay monthly. If you already own, whatever payment plan you currently have, should transfer over but you can always ask to change it.  Some sales guy may tell you that the fees are different for resale contracts. This is NOT true. They are the same for every owner who owns at the resort it’s deeded to. The same with CWA contracts.

2. Who is paying the closing costs?  If the buyer pays, how much are they?  I would not accept closing costs that are more then $500 on top of the transfer fee.  Especially since so many sellers are offering to pay those costs. 

3. Who is paying the transfer fee?  It's a $299 fee that is required by Wyndham. Sometimes the seller will pay for this and not closing, or both. 

4.  Is it annual or bi-annual?  Bi-annual is usually listed as odd or even years, or may use the acronym EOY which stands for every other year. They are all the same thing. Bi-annual contracts are cheaper only because the yearly fee is split over 24 months instead of 12 for annual. The rate per 1,000 points is the same whether you have annual or bi-annual. You can only use the points on that contact on the years designated. In between you have nothing. These are a good ideal if you only take vacations every other year. 

5. How many points is it?  This will usually be listed in the title but it should be noted here, as something to consider. Do you need that many points?  Do you need more then that many points?  Be sure to have an idea on how many points you want before you start to shop. Using the directory will help you determine where you want to stay. From there you can determine about what time you will travel there. The points chart will tell you how many points you will need for a certain room, at that resort, at that time time. 

6.Does the seller have a recent estoppel letter?  You can PM them, and ask them to provide one. Wyndham charges a fee to the owner for this. Do not pay this yourself. It will provide some valuable information such as how many points the contract is for, how many points are left for that year, how much the maintenance fees are, and if there is money owed such as back MF or a loan balance. This letter should save you from nasty surprises like it having zero available points, maintenance fees higher then advertised, or months worth of back dues Maintenance fees. 

7. What is the home resort?  Will you be traveling there?  It's ok if the answer is no, but if you know it's a resort you will go to a lot during prime season, you may want to consider buying a contract for that resort so you can have ARP. 

8. What is the fine print?  Some companies will add some special fee or have some special payment requirement. Always read the fine print. 

Finally, if something seems “off” with a seller or the transaction, trust your gut. There are TONS of contracts for sale. If the one you want is not available at that time, it will be later. Just be patient.  You can also ask us for advice if you have questions. 


 Hope this helps.


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## Smo1990 (Oct 10, 2018)

Rich S said:


> Hi Smo1990, and welcome to TUG!
> 
> First of all, I commend you on doing your research, it will benefit you in the end whatever you choose to do.  Three years ago, my wife and I attended a timeshare presentation and decided to buy from the developer.  Although I learned later that we could have saved money buying resale, it wasn't a large contract and I do not regret the decision.  I have never stayed at that resort but I use it strictly for trading through II.
> 
> ...


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## Smo1990 (Oct 10, 2018)

Great info! Let me ask you this.... something that I’m not sure of... what exactly are the benefits of your home resort vs others? I see that some maintenance fees are much less at some resorts than others


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## Richelle (Oct 10, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> Great info! Let me ask you this.... something that I’m not sure of... what exactly are the benefits of your home resort vs others? I see that some maintenance fees are much less at some resorts than others



My home resort has the third lowest fees in the system behind Bali Hai and Canterbury.  It's also closer to me and one of the newer resorts.  Other then location, those are subject to change.  They could have a drastic increase in costs or taxes over the new few years making it the sixth lowest in the system instead of third.  Still,  it's likely always going to be higher then CWA unless there is a very drastic change.  Next years maintenance fees are only going up 10 cents per 1,000 which is a 2.5% increase.  That's a typical increase.  CWA had a 5% increase last year i believe, but that is not typical.  If I recall correctly, I've typically  seen 2%-3% increases with CWA.    Some of the resorts that are newer, and not in natural disaster prone areas are the better investment in my opinion because they have less of a chance for a special assessment or a drastic increase.  

I say, if you are looking to keep this for more then a few years, go with lower MF option.  If you find out later that you need to switch to something else, one of those lower MF contracts will be easy to give away or sell.  You may or may not get the same amount you paid for it, but you will more likely get a taker then if you choose F airfield Harbor or some other not so popular resort.  If you are looking to get ARP at a specific resort, you will have to buy points at that resort, or if it participates in CWA, you can get CWA points.


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## cbyrne1174 (Oct 10, 2018)

I made a guide a month ago.
https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php...-low-maintenance-fees-guide-for-noobs.278773/

This is the best current ebay auction
https://www.ebay.com/itm/154-000-Wy...=item4b512be00e:g:5CMAAOSwbYZXWG0y:rk:11:pf:0

You want a resort that is well kept and has low maintenance fees. Las Vegas is least likely to have special assessments too because it's in a desert away from bad weather. Myrtle beach has high maintenance fees except at Towers on the Grove.


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## paxsarah (Oct 10, 2018)

cbyrne1174 said:


> Myrtle beach has high maintenance fees except at Towers on the Grove.



One of the Ocean Boulevard HOAs has MFs of $4.89. But you have to know which one you’re getting.


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## cbyrne1174 (Oct 10, 2018)

All the myrtle beach properties still have open summer availability for 1-2 bedrooms. Seawatch is a little spotty in July, but you can just be on top of booking at exactly 10 months out. The best strategy for the original poster would be to buy a resale contract with the lowest maintenance fees. If "not having babies" means they have children now, they're probably going to book a lot of Smoky Mountain Lodge and Bonnet Creek anyways. If they live in the Southeast, a Bonnet creek contract might be ideal since it has average maintenance and is a pain to book during Christmas.


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## Smo1990 (Oct 10, 2018)

cbyrne1174 said:


> All the myrtle beach properties still have open summer availability for 1-2 bedrooms. Seawatch is a little spotty in July, but you can just be on top of booking at exactly 10 months out. The best strategy for the original poster would be to buy a resale contract with the lowest maintenance fees. If "not having babies" means they have children now, they're probably going to book a lot of Smoky Mountain Lodge and Bonnet Creek anyways. If they live in the Southeast, a Bonnet creek contract might be ideal since it has average maintenance and is a pain to book during Christmas.


I have a 4 year old and a two year old. It was nearly impossible to travel the last 5 years due to either being pregnant and feeling yucky or having an infant. We live in Chattanooga so actually Smokey Mountains wouldn’t be a bad idea. 

So if I understand correctly, the only perk to your home resort is booking 3 months earlier than the rest? That’s probably not that big of a deal if the Myrtle Beach resorts still have decent availability at 10 months.


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## Jan M. (Oct 10, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> Do you mean that you wouldn’t buy again AT ALL or that you wouldn’t buy again from Diamond? There’s one I’m looking at that would be 186,000 with MF of about $1100 yearly. If I could get two weeks out of that, I’d be happy. And I should add, we prefer to travel out of season to miss the crowds



Sorry if I'm answering stuff other people have already answered because I haven't read al! of the replies. You can do a whole lot better than that on the maintenance fees. Also you will want more points than that. If you have at least 231,000 points you will only pay a program fee of .58 per thousand points instead of the minimum program fee of $131.

Depending on where and when you want to go sometimes you may need to book as far out as possible. You can book your home resort at 13 months and everything else at 10 months. Wyndham periodically adds more inventory so just because you look a couple of times and don't see anything doesn't mean there won't ever be something. Keep looking, a little effort often pays off.

If you are traveling outside the peak times you should have no problem. When our son went to college and it was just my husband and I we went to Myrtle Beach sometimes twice a year. In the last two weeks of May and sometimes again in September or October. We never had a problem. We avoided that last full week of October as the weather often seems to get cool and rainy that week.

Also you will get a free RCI weeks account as a Wyndham owner. That will give you access to many, many more resorts not just in our Country but in many other countries too.


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## cbyrne1174 (Oct 11, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> I have a 4 year old and a two year old. It was nearly impossible to travel the last 5 years due to either being pregnant and feeling yucky or having an infant. We live in Chattanooga so actually Smokey Mountains wouldn’t be a bad idea.
> 
> So if I understand correctly, the only perk to your home resort is booking 3 months earlier than the rest? That’s probably not that big of a deal if the Myrtle Beach resorts still have decent availability at 10 months.




You should just buy a smoky mountains or smoky mountains lodge contract. Both are RCI Gold resorts, have below average maintenance and have a really low chance to experience a natural disaster (forest fire tops). The lodge is harder to find, but your kids will want to stay there every summer as they age because it has 3 water parks. Regular Smoky mountains has below average fees. The older buildings' maintenance fees are 7% below average and Smoky Mountains II is 14% below average. You're going to want 154,000 or 168,000 points a year to start with. You might want another small contract when they're teenagers and your income is higher if you want to book 2 bedrooms, but for right now 1 bedrooms are optimal for a young family of 4. Put 1 kid on the couch and another on an inflatable twin. All the 1 bedrooms are spacious enough for the most part to accommodate 4 that way. I plan on having 3 kids and still only care to book 1 bedrooms as they age. Personally, I'm a super cheap person which is why I got into Club Wyndham resale in the first place.


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## Smo1990 (Oct 11, 2018)

Ha! I am super cheap as well! I’m always looking for the cheapest way to go on vacation. This is right up my alley! Smoky Mountains are what I’m keeping my eye out for right now because of the MF. We are fairly flexible and plan to do our main vacation in the fall, so I doubt will have trouble finding places other than the Smokies.


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## Richelle (Oct 12, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> Ha! I am super cheap as well! I’m always looking for the cheapest way to go on vacation. This is right up my alley! Smoky Mountains are what I’m keeping my eye out for right now because of the MF. We are fairly flexible and plan to do our main vacation in the fall, so I doubt will have trouble finding places other than the Smokies.



I like an hour from National Harbor and have been a Marylander all my life.  I can count the number of hurricanes and earthquakes we've had combined on one hand.  We have tropical storms every five years or so, but they are usually low end by the time they get to us.  Most of the newer buildings are built to handle those.  National Harbor is newer then smokies and has lower fees.  Also, it's not far from DC and the airport.  There is a ton to do for the family.  The downside though, is some of the rooms can be high in points.  a One bedroom in prime season can be 189,000 points.  You can use those at any resort, but can only book 13 months out at National Harbor.

I am not sure what this year's smokie mountain fees are, but in 2017 they were 4.62 per 1,000 and National Harbor was $4.05 per 1,000 (not including minimum program fee of $131 for resale).  On 154,000, the price difference would have been $87.78 a year or $7.31 cents a month.  Not a huge difference, and it's entirely possible that the gap between the two is smaller, but it could also be larger.  Also, the more points you have, the bigger the savings. Right now, National harbor is $4.14 per 1,000 points (without program fee).

I will say though, fourth of July week is booked at smokies but National harbor has availability.  So if fourth of July is important, having a smokies contract would give you ARP there and you'd have more availability in the ARP period, theoretically.


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## cbyrne1174 (Oct 12, 2018)

Avenue collection usually has low maintenance since they are located in cities and don't have to have a lot of grounds upkeep. They also cost a lot of points, making the per point maintenance low. Just use the sticky post and pick the contract with the lowest maintenance. Only pick a UDI contract for your first purchase like smoky mountains. If you buy a converted fixed week, your maintenance per point depends on what season the converted week is in because every person with the same unit size has the same maintenance but are converted to different point values. It's confusing if you don't know the ins and outs of the system. It took me 2 months of learning to make sure I didn't pick a bad contract. 

The seller is just as important as the deeded location itself. Use a licensed broker if you can. seans0302 and Sumday vacations are cheap and reliable. Legacy adventures is reliable but way overpriced.


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## cbyrne1174 (Oct 12, 2018)

Since you're the same age as me (born 1989 myself) and have the same age of kids, I'm assuming you think similar to me. I condensed the 2017 maintenance fees list to resorts that are UDI and have low to average maintenance. These are the ones I personally would consider. If you buy from this list, you'll avoid the converted fixed week craziness.


Alexandria

    UDI All All 5.46

Beaver Creek

    UDI All All 4.13

Bonnet Creek

    UDI Standard All 5.63

Bonnet Creek - Presidential Club

    UDI All 5.86


Capital Cove at National Harbor

    Standard All 4.05
    Presidential All 4.23


Captains' Court

    Presidential All All 4.38


Desert Blue

    Standard All 3.83
    Presidential All 4.14

Grand Desert

    All All 4.52

Grand Desert Tower 3

    All All 4.58

Great Smokies Lodge

    Standard All 4.62
    Presidential All 5.06


King Cotton Villas

    All - Presidential All 3.94


Myrtle Beach

    Seawatch North POA All All 5.78
    Seawatch North T/S All All 5.62
    Seawatch Plantation All All 5.66
    Seawatch South Towers All All 5.62

Towers on the Grove

    All All 4.6


New Orleans - La Belle Maison

    All All 5.12


New York City - Midtown 45

    Standard All 4.37
    Presidential Presidential All 4.45

Oceanside Pier

    All All 4.65


Panama City Beach

    Standard All 4.1
    Presidential Club Presidential All 4.4

Park City - Miners Club

    Presidential Presidential All 4.26

Reunion

    All All 5.35

Royal Garden at Waikiki

    All All 4.79

San Antonio - La Cascada

    All All 5.02

San Diego - Harbour Lights

    All All 5.33

San Francisco

    Presidential All 3.76

San Francisco-Canterbury

    Standard All 3.43

Santee Ballard's Pointe

    All All 5.34

Sedona

    Red Rock All All 4.96

Smokey Mountains - Governor's Crossing

    I All All 5.05
    II All All 4.81

South Shore at Lake Tahoe

    All All 3.83

Steamboat Springs

    All All 4.02

Sundara Cottages

    -Presidential All All 5.14

Waikiki Beach Walk

    All All 4.57


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## Richelle (Oct 12, 2018)

cbyrne1174 said:


> Since you're the same age as me (born 1989 myself) and have the same age of kids, I'm assuming you think similar to me. I condensed the 2017 maintenance fees list to resorts that are UDI and have low to average maintenance. These are the ones I personally would consider. If you buy from this list, you'll avoid the converted fixed week craziness.



There is a sortable excel spreadsheet attached to that post.  It can be sorted by state, maintenance fee rate, city, etc.  There is also a 2018 maintenance fee thread, but it's not as comprehensive as the 2018 one.  If they see something they like here, they should check the 2018 thread to see if someone posted more up to date fees.


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## silentg (Oct 12, 2018)

Have you checked the TUG Marketplace for Bargain Deals ? Most of the timeshares we own we bought or took over from other TUG members. LT Transfers handles the closings. You should take a look.
(No I have nothing for sale) Just offering suggestions.
Silentg


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## Richelle (Oct 12, 2018)

silentg said:


> Have you checked the TUG Marketplace for Bargain Deals ? Most of the timeshares we own we bought or took over from other TUG members. LT Transfers handles the closings. You should take a look.
> (No I have nothing for sale) Just offering suggestions.
> Silentg



Good point but keep an eye on those maintenance fees.  Some can be high which is why they are giving them away, but I've seen a smokies go through there with decent fees.


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## Smo1990 (Oct 13, 2018)

cbyrne1174 said:


> Since you're the same age as me (born 1989 myself) and have the same age of kids, I'm assuming you think similar to me. I condensed the 2017 maintenance fees list to resorts that are UDI and have low to average maintenance. These are the ones I personally would consider. If you buy from this list, you'll avoid the converted fixed week craziness.
> 
> 
> Alexandria
> ...


This is good stuff! I am most definitely buying UDI. I want the simplest program possible. Ha! I’m really leaning towards the Smokies if I can find the right contract. My parents are in Knoxville and it would be the one if most likely use my ARP for if I wanted to do Christmas there or something.


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## Smo1990 (Oct 13, 2018)

Richelle said:


> Good point but keep an eye on those maintenance fees.  Some can be high which is why they are giving them away, but I've seen a smokies go through there with decent fees.


I’ve definitely noticed that if you’re willing to pay a little more upfront, you are more likely to save more in a couple years on maintenance charges. I’m waiting for a really good contract to come through and I’ll jump on it!


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## antjmar (Oct 13, 2018)

You have been given great advice. However personally I'd rather pay a few hundred more in maintenance fees and guarantee the resorts I want than try to snag it at 10 months. Seawatch is sold out for next July if you want a 2 bedroom. Plenty of 1 bedrooms.
As your children get older (unless you home school) you won't be traveling in the fall as much. You'll also probably want the 2 bedroom units. 
Ironically the low maintenance fee  resorts typically don't require ARP to book. 
Financially the low MF resorts are smarter. But you might have to compromise on your travel dates/ unit size if traveling peak times.


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## Smo1990 (Oct 13, 2018)

Let me ask you this. Say I buy a 200,000 pts contract now at the Smokies and in 6 months I decide I wanna be able to stay at Bonnet Creek for Christmas and buy 100,000 there so I know have ARP. Are my 100,000 the only points good there for 13 months out or can I dip into my other 200,000 if my reservation takes 175,000? I know points are points at 10 months but I wasn’t sure how it worked in ARP?


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## antjmar (Oct 13, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> Let me ask you this. Say I buy a 200,000 pts contract now at the Smokies and in 6 months I decide I wanna be able to stay at Bonnet Creek for Christmas and buy 100,000 there so I know have ARP. Are my 100,000 the only points good there for 13 months out or can I dip into my other 200,000 if my reservation takes 175,000? I know points are points at 10 months but I wasn’t sure how it worked in ARP?


You will need 175K deeded at BC. That's a week that you'd probably need ARP


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## capital city (Oct 13, 2018)

You can only stack arp if it's deeded at the same place. If you buy 200,000 smokies then 100,000 smokies then you will have 300,000 available for arp. 200,000 smokies then 100,000 bonnett creek then you only have arp up to the point amount owned at each. 

Good luck if your looking for a contract with the water park at the smokies. I've seen very few of them.


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## Smo1990 (Oct 13, 2018)

capital city said:


> You can only stack arp if it's deeded at the same place. If you buy 200,000 smokies then 100,000 smokies then you will have 300,000 available for arp. 200,000 smokies then 100,000 bonnett creek then you only have arp up to the point amount owned at each.
> 
> Good luck if your looking for a contract with the water park at the smokies. I've seen very few of them.


Thanks for clearing that up for me. I don’t know if you could even get time in Bonnett Creek for 100,000 but I was just using that as an example.


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## OutSkiing (Oct 13, 2018)

I'm not sure what the fuss about converted fixed week is .. I think it means just make sure the maintenance on your contract is low enough as opposed to thinking it will be the same as someone else's contract.  I have two contracts that are 'Converted Floating Week' biennials at Bali Hai .. one of the lower maintenance fees in the system.  One of these is worth 325k points and the other only 308k points! I am thinking maybe one was for an upper floor unit and the other for a lower floor when first written. The points all spend the same at any resort within 10 months. 

But both have the same exact dollar amount of maintenance fee, reserve and taxes! So the one averages out to $2.22 and the other $2.32 per thousand but both are very low.  Double those numbers to be comparable since they are biennial contracts .. still reasonable.

Bob


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## Avislo (Oct 13, 2018)

On your website, what point type shows up?  Select or one of the other system Wyndham Club Plus has a relationship with over the year?


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## cbyrne1174 (Oct 13, 2018)

I did get a Smoky Mountains 130,000 odd in the bargain bin for free. Only issue is that you don't get the smoothest closing that way.


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## Richelle (Oct 14, 2018)

antjmar said:


> You will need 175K deeded at BC. That's a week that you'd probably need ARP



I was able to book a two bedroom just a few days after the 10 month mark, which should work for them in the short term.  However, I don't think you can get much bigger then that without ARP, but they might get lucky.


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## Richelle (Oct 14, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> Thanks for clearing that up for me. I don’t know if you could even get time in Bonnett Creek for 100,000 but I was just using that as an example.



You can get a full week in a one bedroom during value season, or a one bedroom, Sunday to Thursday, during Prime season.  If you are like me and don't like crowds, value season is the way to go.  I know you have kids though.  I am not sure about your school system, but occasionally, they will have "Professional days" a couple days in a row which makes for a good long weekend trip.


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## Richelle (Oct 14, 2018)

Since you were talking about the smokies, here is the points chart for that one too.


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## Smo1990 (Oct 14, 2018)

Richelle said:


> Since you were talking about the smokies, here is the points chart for that one too.
> 
> View attachment 8602


I wish our school system would switch to year round school just so we can have some extra time in off seasons We have spring break and fall break, both of which are in “high” season so that’s not TERRIBLE, but I’m not even gonna lie... if an excellent deal comes our way, I’ll pull them out for a few days.


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## Richelle (Oct 14, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> I wish our school system would switch to year round school just so we can have some extra time in off seasons We have spring break and fall break, both of which are in “high” season so that’s not TERRIBLE, but I’m not even gonna lie... if an excellent deal comes our way, I’ll pull them out for a few days.



The reminds me.  They do periodically have points discount specials for both VIP and non-vip.  These are the current discounts open to everyone.


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## Smo1990 (Oct 14, 2018)

Richelle said:


> The reminds me.  They do periodically have points discount specials for both VIP and non-vip.  These are the current discounts open to everyone.
> 
> View attachment 8607


Ohhh nice! I cannot wait to get a contract and be able to search around on the website!


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## Smo1990 (Oct 14, 2018)

Richelle said:


> The reminds me.  They do periodically have points discount specials for both VIP and non-vip.  These are the current discounts open to everyone.
> 
> View attachment 8607


So one question that I’ve thought of... I was looking through the directory and it says something about “Club Wyndham Plus” and it has housekeeping credits, 1/1000 pts. Would I have those benefits with my resale?


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## Richelle (Oct 14, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> Ohhh nice! I cannot wait to get a contract and be able to search around on the website!



Just do your due diligence so you are not stuck with some thing that has high fees, or you don't get as many points as you need.  Patience is key.  I personally think the 154,000 annual at National Harbor is a good deal.  The fees are lower.  To give you an idea, the going selling price for CWA is about $4-$5 per 1,000 points.  Let's assume $4 per 1,000.  A 154,000 point CWA contract would cost you $616 at that rate. The maintenance fees would be $251 a year or $21 a month MORE then National Harbor.  If you paid a little extra up front, it will take you 1 year to make up for the additional $134 you spent on the 154,000 point national harbor contract.  After that, you still continue to pay fees cheaper then CWA.  Bonnet creek has maintenance fees that are very close to CWA, but the contracts are cheaper then CWA.  The last bonnet creek contract went for $3.03 per 1,000.  You'd still be saving more at National Harbor in the long term.

With that said, you only get ARP at National harbor.  If ARP at Bonnet during Christmas is important to you, and you want something bigger then a one bedroom, you should probably get CWA and/or Bonnet creek points to give you ARP at that resort.  Just know that if you get both CWA and Bonnet creek points, you cannot combine them at 13 months for a Bonnet creek reservation.  You can only use one or the other for each reservation.  So if you want a big room, get the amount of points you need on one or more of the same contract type.  So if you need 308,000 points for the reservation, buy 308,000 Bonnet creek points on one or more bonnet creek contracts.  Or buy 308,000 on one or more CWA contracts.


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## Richelle (Oct 14, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> So one question that I’ve thought of... I was looking through the directory and it says something about “Club Wyndham Plus” and it has housekeeping credits, 1/1000 pts. Would I have those benefits with my resale?



All points get Housekeeping credits except presidential reserve.  PR member have to buy a minimum of one million points which puts them at platinum level.  All VIPS get unlimited house keeping credits.

Also, ALL points are Club Wyndham Plus points.  Club Wyndham Plus is the name of the whole program.  Club Wyndham Access points fall under that umbrella.  Club Wyndham Select (aka deeded) also fall under the Club Wyndham Plus umbrella.  They all get 1 housekeeping credit per 1,000 points.


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## OutSkiing (Oct 14, 2018)

Avislo said:


> On your website, what point type shows up?  Select or one of the other system Wyndham Club Plus has a relationship with over the year?


Not sure if this was directed to me but was right below my post about Bali Hai converted floating week contracts.

Those two contracts both say ‘Outrigger Resort Club by Wyndham’. I have other contracts that say ‘Club Wyndham Access’ and ‘Club Wyndham Select’.

Bob


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## Avislo (Oct 14, 2018)

Thanks for the info.


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## Richelle (Oct 15, 2018)

OutSkiing said:


> Not sure if this was directed to me but was right below my post about Bali Hai converted floating week contracts.
> 
> Those two contracts both say ‘Outrigger Resort Club by Wyndham’. I have other contracts that say ‘Club Wyndham Access’ and ‘Club Wyndham Select’.
> 
> Bob



I'm not 100% sure what you meant by the comment, so if i'm off base, I apologize in advance.  


Outrigger is for people who own deeded points at certain Hawaiian properties.  It's not another points system like Margaritaville or presidential reserve.  I have one too.  It just means we have exclusive access to Outrigger inventory, and can book other Outrigger resorts 12 months out.  I think it is more like another Club Pass, only it's limited to other outrigger owners, there is no exchange fee, and you can book online.  Only thing is, unless you have a minimum of 574,000 Outrigger eligible points, you're not going to get a full week at any Outrigger inventory.


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## OutSkiing (Oct 16, 2018)

Richelle said:


> I'm not 100% sure what you meant by the comment, so if i'm off base, I apologize in advance.
> 
> 
> Outrigger is for people who own deeded points at certain Hawaiian properties.  It's not another points system like Margaritaville or presidential reserve.  I have one too.  It just means we have exclusive access to Outrigger inventory, and can book other Outrigger resorts 12 months out.  I think it is more like another Club Pass, only it's limited to other outrigger owners, there is no exchange fee, and you can book online.  Only thing is, unless you have a minimum of 574,000 Outrigger eligible points, you're not going to get a full week at any Outrigger inventory.


Thanks for the update .. mine are converted resale so I don't think I get all the outrigger inventory .. don't get ARP on these units or others in outrigger club I know that much.  Is there a resort I should check to verify if I get outrigger inventory?

Bob


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## Richelle (Oct 16, 2018)

OutSkiing said:


> Thanks for the update .. mine are converted resale so I don't think I get all the outrigger inventory .. don't get ARP on these units or others in outrigger club I know that much.  Is there a resort I should check to verify if I get outrigger inventory?
> 
> Bob



My Bali Hai is a converted fixed week I bought on eBay. I have access to Outrigger. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## BibbityBoppity (Oct 17, 2018)

OutSkiing said:


> Thanks for the update .. mine are converted resale so I don't think I get all the outrigger inventory .. don't get ARP on these units or others in outrigger club I know that much.  Is there a resort I should check to verify if I get outrigger inventory?
> 
> Bob



With resale Outrigger benefits transfers with the Ownership! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Jan M. (Oct 17, 2018)

BibbityBoppity said:


> With resale Outrigger benefits transfers with the Ownership!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



It transferred with ours and we bought it resale.


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## BibbityBoppity (Oct 17, 2018)

That’s what I’m saying lol it transfers to the new owner


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Annette Gendron (Oct 17, 2018)

Hi. Did purchasing the added deeds/points put you in VIP status with Wyndham?


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## Avislo (Oct 17, 2018)

Rephrasing the above question, after transfer to the account, did it show up as developer creditable points for VIP purposes?


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## Richelle (Oct 18, 2018)

Annette Gendron said:


> Hi. Did purchasing the added deeds/points put you in VIP status with Wyndham?



Resale does not count towards VIP. Has to be retail bought points or PIC points.


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## Avislo (Oct 18, 2018)

One frequent poster, formally a mega-renter, if I remember right, had indicated in a number of posts awhile ago that there was a HI resort that sometimes could be bought re-sale and have the points count toward VIP status.  It was my understanding from this poster's subsequent posts that that had changed.


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## ecwinch (Oct 19, 2018)

It was Kauai Beach Villas, one the Pahio resorts that Wyndham acquired about 10+ years ago. For some reason - I think it was a loophole the local sales office figured out - they were letting resale contracts convert their week to points as part of a retail purchase. They were still doing it in 2015, don’t know about any changes since then.

I believe there are other acquired resorts where existing owners are offered similar opportunities - Smugglers Notch and Plantation SC come to mind. Perhaps one of those sales offices figure out something similar.

Obviously there is a little bit of risk involved, as you have to be on the deed to close the deal.


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## ronparise (Oct 19, 2018)

Richelle said:


> All points get Housekeeping credits except presidential reserve.  PR member have to buy a minimum of one million points which puts them at platinum level.  All VIPS get unlimited house keeping credits.
> 
> Also, ALL points are Club Wyndham Plus points.  Club Wyndham Plus is the name of the whole program.  Club Wyndham Access points fall under that umbrella.  Club Wyndham Select (aka deeded) also fall under the Club Wyndham Plus umbrella.  They all get 1 housekeeping credit per 1,000 points.




and UDI and converted weeks fall under Club Wyndham Select


I think you and I are the only two on this tread that understand the organization of the club


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## Richelle (Oct 19, 2018)

ronparise said:


> and UDI and converted weeks fall under Club Wyndham Select
> 
> 
> I think you and I are the only two on this tread that understand the organization of the club



I think you might be right.  I think most of the confusion is from resellers who don't know the difference and call deeded points Club Wyndham access, and sales people who like to confuse people.  Then you have the people repeating that inaccurate information that was given to them.


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## ronparise (Oct 19, 2018)

Avislo said:


> One frequent poster, formally a mega-renter, if I remember right, had indicated in a number of posts awhile ago that there was a HI resort that sometimes could be bought re-sale and have the points count toward VIP status.  It was my understanding from this poster's subsequent posts that that had changed.



That poster to whom you refer, did indeed say that

Actually it wasnt just that resort, it was as near as I could tell all the converted weeks from all the Pahio resorts.  as well as all the points from the affiliate resorts, that counted toward VIP>> 

There was a day that you could take Pahio weeks and convert them to VIP points with a small developer purchase, There were several posting on tug that did an unlimited number of weeks with one small developer purchase. By the time that that megarenter to whom you refer did it, he was limited to three conversed weeks with one 63000 purchase, but he did it twice

Another owner and that poster to whom you refer, figured out  there were certain converted week contracts that would transfer (resale) with VIP eligible points. They were able to build VIP accounts at will, with ebay purchases

As you say, Wyndham found them out when reviewing accounts after the Great Suspension of 2016 and closed the loophole

It is my belief however that they closed the loophole by doing some manual check in the transfer dept as part of each transfer. My bet is that given the turnover rate at Wyndham, that the time will come that no one remembers to do this check, and that once again you will be able to make VIP accounts with resale purchases


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## Avislo (Oct 19, 2018)

ronparise said:


> That poster to whom you refer, did indeed say that
> 
> Actually it wasnt just that resort, it was as near as I could tell all the converted weeks from all the Pahio resorts.  as well as all the points from the affiliate resorts, that counted toward VIP>>
> 
> ...



Thanks for clarifying the issue well.  For people who have Pahio resorts in their accounts, What Wyndham Destinations point type is showing under their ownership type section of their on-line account?


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## Avislo (Oct 19, 2018)

Richelle said:


> I think you might be right.  I think most of the confusion is from resellers who don't know the difference and call deeded points Club Wyndham access, and sales people who like to confuse people.  Then you have the people repeating that inaccurate information that was given to them.



Nothing wrong with people reporting in this forum what the salespeople are saying at what resort.  If the


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## Richelle (Oct 19, 2018)

Avislo said:


> Nothing wrong with people reporting in this forum what the salespeople are saying at what resort.  If the



There is if it’s inaccurate information that is being portrayed as fact. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Avislo (Oct 20, 2018)

If the information reported attributed to a salesperson is wrong or misleading, I am sure other posters will correct it.  This, I would think, would be a good thing for others going to presentations to know.


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## flindberg (Oct 23, 2018)

harveyhaddixfan said:


> Wyndham is not Diamond.
> With Wyndham, buying resale is the way to go. You can get points contracts with low maintenance fees for next to nothing.


I'm curious as to where you found "points contracts with low maintenance fees for next to nothing." MF's on my 3 Wyndham contract's are sky high...


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## ronparise (Oct 24, 2018)

flindberg said:


> I'm curious as to where you found "points contracts with low maintenance fees for next to nothing." MF's on my 3 Wyndham contract's are sky high...


Although I haven’t purchased anything in a while, eBay was the place to find low priced contracts.  Not ever auction to be sure, but if you participate in enough you can score some pretty good deals there


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## Jan M. (Oct 24, 2018)

flindberg said:


> I'm curious as to where you found "points contracts with low maintenance fees for next to nothing." MF's on my 3 Wyndham contract's are sky high...



Which resorts do you own at and how many points at each of them? Our combined maintenance fees at the 3 resorts own at are $5.02 per thousand points which includes the program fee. And we pay a higher program fee because we are presidential reserve. With program fees of .56 instead of the .64 per thousand for the first million points and .58 per thousand points for everything over that first million we pay, that would bring the combined maintenance fees down to $4.97 per thousand points.

As Ron P. said eBay is a good place to look. Also keep an eye on the Bargain Deals under the Buying, Selling, Renting forum here on TUG. Some of the resellers on eBay have their own websites and you can sometimes get better deals on their websites. Sumday is one of them and you can check out their website and contact them directly.


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## bendadin (Oct 24, 2018)

I got Outrigger as well but then someone mentioned a discount rate. Outrigger was on that list for a fraction of the price that the MF would be since the points needed is ridiculous.


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## Richelle (Oct 24, 2018)

some (not all ) the free or low cost ones have maintenance fees that are high, so just keep an eye on those.  occasionally you will get lucky and find something with decent maintenance fees.  Timeshare nation also does giveaways, but the fees tend to be high on those.  Don't rule them out entirely because you could get lucky.  I find eBay has the best deals too.  Look at the completed listings for ones that have not sold, and make an offer.  That's how I got my 308,000 anual Branson contract for $1.  Six months later someone paid $510 for the same 308,000 point contract.  You can even make offers on ones that are still active.  That show I got my EOY 308,000 Bali Hai for $1795 out the door when they were charging $3,000, plus closing costs, transfer fee, and six months of maintenance fees.  It ended up being about $5,000 total costs.  If you are going to make an offer lower then the asking price, make sure you have a reason for offering something lower.  In my case, the cost per 1,000 points was higher then what other Bali Hai biennials were going for.  Much higher. When i made the offer, in the comments I explained the bases for why I thought what i was offering, was a fair asking price.  I used other auctions as examples of why i was making that offer.  In the end, they agreed.  So i saved about $3,200 by making a different offer and providing a reason for why i was offering a lower price.  A little effort pays off.


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## schoolmarm (Oct 24, 2018)

Avislo said:


> Thanks for clarifying the issue well.  For people who have Pahio resorts in their accounts, What Wyndham Destinations point type is showing under their ownership type section of their on-line account?



My Bali-Hai deed shows as Club Wyndham Select and Outrigger.


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## Avislo (Oct 24, 2018)

Thanks.


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## flindberg (Oct 26, 2018)

Jan M. said:


> Thanks, Jan. I appreciate your taking time to respond! I have 511,000 annual points = all on Kauai. I'm not looking to acquire more. I was just curious what people had that they considered 'low or next to nothing' mfs. Your and Ron P's responses help give me a little perspective. Do you consider your annual expense worth it? My mfs + Program fee comes out to around $5.30 per 1000points. To me it just seems like an awful lot to spend - especially when it gets increased every year! I have not had any luck with renting to help offset the costs...
> Thanks again for the response!


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## flindberg (Oct 26, 2018)

ronparise said:


> Although I haven’t purchased anything in a while, eBay was the place to find low priced contracts.  Not ever auction to be sure, but if you participate in enough you can score some pretty good deals there


Thanks Ron, I appreciate your response!


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## Jan M. (Oct 26, 2018)

Flindberg I think $5.30 per thousand is good. So you paid $2708.30 this year for your 511k points. If you owned at Bonnet Creek, a resort a lot of people like to own at, you would have paid $3285.73 for those 511k points, $5.87 plus a program fee of .56 per thousand if all your deeds are resale or $3295.95 with .58 per thousand if you bought developer. With Club Wyndham Access you would have paid either $3229.52 or $3239.74, $5.76 + .56 or .58. That means the people who own at Bonnet Creek or CWA paid anywhere from $578.20-$521.22 more than you did on the same number of points as you own. And there are resorts with even higher maintenance fees that Bonnet Creek or Club Wyndham Access.

From the numbers posted for 2018 here are a few resorts you could have paid even more if you owned at.
Ocean Boulevard I - $6.03 + either .56 or .58 for 511k points would have been $3367.49-$3377.71
Pagosa Teal Landing - $6.08 + either .56 or .58 for 511k points would have been $3393.04-$3403.26
Royal Vista - $6.15 + either .56 or .58 for 511k points would have been $3428.81-$3439.03
The Cottages - $6.53 + either .56 or .58 for 511k points would have been $3622.99-$3633.21
Nashville - $6.87 + either .56 or .58 for 511k points would have been $3796.73-$3806.95  The people who own at Nashville paid $1088.43-$1098.65 more than you did for the same number of points!

I didn't see figures for 2018 but in 2017 some other high maintenance fee resorts are: Skyline Tower,  Branson Falls, Meadows and Mountain Vista, Cypress Palms, Ocean Walk, Bay Club, Majestic Sun, Fairfield Glade, Glacier Canyon, Westwinds, Palm-Aire, Governor's Green, Tamarack. There are likely some others with higher fees also but these are the ones I saw when I quickly scanned the sticky for 2017 maintenance fees. And some were even higher than Nashville.

This should give you perspective about what you pay and hopefully make you feel a whole lot better about what you own!


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## Richelle (Oct 26, 2018)

Jan M. said:


> Flindberg I think $5.30 per thousand is good. So you paid $2708.30 this year for your 511k points. If you owned at Bonnet Creek, a resort a lot of people like to own at, you would have paid $3285.73 for those 511k points, $5.87 plus a program fee of .56 per thousand if all your deeds are resale or $3295.95 with .58 per thousand if you bought developer. With Club Wyndham Access you would have paid either $3229.52 or $3239.74, $5.76 + .56 or .58. That means the people who own at Bonnet Creek or CWA paid anywhere from $578.20-$521.22 more than you did on the same number of points as you own. And there are resorts with even higher maintenance fees that Bonnet Creek or Club Wyndham Access.
> 
> From the numbers posted for 2018 here are a few resorts you could have paid even more if you owned at.
> Ocean Boulevard I - $6.03 + either .56 or .58 for 511k points would have been $3367.49-$3377.71
> ...



My Branson at the meadows is $6.13 not including the 56 or 58 cent per 1,000 program fee.   511k points would run them $3,132.43 without the program fee.


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## Richelle (Oct 26, 2018)

If you want lower then $5.30, you would be looking at getting Canterbury, National Harbor, Bali Hai, South Shore, Steamboat Springs, Grand desert, Panama City, Waikiki, Mid-Town, Desert Blue.  Those are just the ones reported on the Maintenance fee threads.

Those are also the more expensive ones on ebay.


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## angela horning (Nov 19, 2018)

Richelle said:


> My Branson at the meadows is $6.13 not including the 56 or 58 cent per 1,000 program fee.   511k points would run them $3,132.43 without the program fee.


 Can you help me out and let me know which CWA have the lowest MF?  Thanks!!


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## Avislo (Nov 19, 2018)

I believe CWA is just one MF.


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## Some_Devil (Nov 19, 2018)

Hi everyone, could someone link me to a "good" deal on Ebay as an example? My mother in law was convinced to purchase at a presentation a couple days ago and I am trying to help her see the possible mistake she was convinced of doing. She still has a week to rescind .


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## harveyhaddixfan (Nov 19, 2018)

Some_Devil said:


> Hi everyone, could someone link me to a "good" deal on Ebay as an example? My mother in law was convinced to purchase at a presentation a couple days ago and I am trying to help her see the possible mistake she was convinced of doing. She still has a week to rescind .




Here’s an example for a Wyndham contract: https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/323546914521


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## paxsarah (Nov 19, 2018)

Some_Devil said:


> Hi everyone, could someone link me to a "good" deal on Ebay as an example? My mother in law was convinced to purchase at a presentation a couple days ago and I am trying to help her see the possible mistake she was convinced of doing. She still has a week to rescind .



Here’s a list of search results for recently sold Wyndham points on eBay: https://m.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from...share+points&_sacat=0&LH_Complete=1&LH_Sold=1


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## Some_Devil (Nov 19, 2018)

harveyhaddixfan said:


> Here’s an example for a Wyndham contract: https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/323546914521



Thank you! Would that example be considered a good value? And if a current annual member buys a biannual contract does that effect their current plan? Thanks for the help.


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## Smo1990 (Nov 19, 2018)

A silly question... but what keywords do you search for? I always look at “Wyndham timeshare points” but I feel like others have found much better listings than I do


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## harveyhaddixfan (Nov 19, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> A silly question... but what keywords do you search for? I always look at “Wyndham timeshare points” but I feel like others have found much better listings than I do



I search for “Wyndham” in the timeshare category. I’ve also searched for “RCI points”. 

If someone is looking for a deal, Sumday has a 500k contract at National Harbor. Asking price is $4500, but I’m sure they’d come down. MF is approx $208 a month. Works out to $4.99 per thousand points, including the program fee.


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## Richelle (Nov 19, 2018)

harveyhaddixfan said:


> I search for “Wyndham” in the timeshare category. I’ve also searched for “RCI points”.
> 
> If someone is looking for a deal, Sumday has a 500k contract at National Harbor. Asking price is $4500, but I’m sure they’d come down. MF is approx $208 a month. Works out to $4.99 per thousand points, including the program fee.



I am not sure where they are getting their numbers from.  I own 292,000 National Harbor and the MF are $4.72 when you account for the 58 cent per 1,000 points program fee.  I would definitely ask for an estoppel on that one.  National harbor is all UDI.  The only way it would be higher is if they were PR points.


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## Richelle (Nov 19, 2018)

Some_Devil said:


> Thank you! Would that example be considered a good value? And if a current annual member buys a biannual contract does that effect their current plan? Thanks for the help.



I paid $1 for 308,000 points.  I got fairly lucky on that one, because 6 months later, someone else sold the same contract for $510.  However, when they sold that $510 contract, it was in a seller's market.  I bought in a buyers market which we are in now.  Club Wyndham access goes for anywhere between $3-$5 per 1,000 points.  Usually, the cheaper ones are the ones where the seller is asking the buyer to pay closing costs, but that's not always the case.  I believe Ovations has reduced the number of contracts on the resale market, which has driven up the price for some, but if you are patient, you can get some decent deals.  The national harbor one is not a bad deal at all.


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## Smo1990 (Nov 19, 2018)

Richelle said:


> I paid $1 for 308,000 points.  I got fairly lucky on that one, because 6 months later, someone else sold the same contract for $510.  However, when they sold that $510 contract, it was in a seller's market.  I bought in a buyers market which we are in now.  Club Wyndham access goes for anywhere between $3-$5 per 1,000 points.  Usually, the cheaper ones are the ones where the seller is asking the buyer to pay closing costs, but that's not always the case.  I believe Ovations has reduced the number of contracts on the resale market, which has driven up the price for some, but if you are patient, you can get some decent deals.  The national harbor one is not a bad deal at all.


I’ve been waiting for several months for the right one to come along. I think I’m gonna just have to bite the bullet and bid really high on a good one on EBay. I’ve been watching them and they stay low until about the last 5 minutes and I’ll think I have a chance and then they jump up really high and I’m not prepared. Lol!


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## Richelle (Nov 19, 2018)

angela horning said:


> Can you help me out and let me know which CWA have the lowest MF?  Thanks!!



All CWA points have the same maintenance fees.  CWA stands for Club Wyndham access.  CWA is a trust and one of multiple programr under the Club Wyndham Plus umbrella.  The only way to get fees lower then CWA, is to buy Wyndham select points (aka deeded), at a lower maintenance fee resort such as National Harbor, Canterbury, Steamboat springs, Panama City, Grand Desert, etc.  There is a sticky thread in the list of threads in this forum, located towards the top.  It says 2018 maintenance fees.  They have fees for various resorts listed.  

The lower maintenance fee resorts are more expensive on the resale market, because a lot of people want lower fees.  So the demand is high and supply is low.  In the long run, you make out better, but in the short term, be prepared to pay some money upfront.  There was a 154,000 national harbor contract that sold for $760, but the buyer also had to pay $750 in closing costs and transfer fees.  So over $1500 for 154,000 points.  Just to compare, there was a 154,000 points for Wyndham Pagosa that went for $177.50 and no closing costs. You would save over $1,300 by buying the Wyndham Pagosa deed, however, the maintenance fees on Pagsoa are $328 more per year or about $27 a month more then National Harbor. If the maintenance fee difference remains about the same, in four years, you would have spent more then that $1,300 savings in Maintenance fee money. So you either get the cheap one now, or wait for one of the lower fee resorts to pop up and pay some money upfront, to save in the long run.


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## Richelle (Nov 19, 2018)

Smo1990 said:


> I’ve been waiting for several months for the right one to come along. I think I’m gonna just have to bite the bullet and bid really high on a good one on EBay. I’ve been watching them and they stay low until about the last 5 minutes and I’ll think I have a chance and then they jump up really high and I’m not prepared. Lol!



It will happen.  did you check the tug market place and redweek as well?


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## Smo1990 (Nov 19, 2018)

Richelle said:


> It will happen.  did you check the tug market place and redweek as well?


Tug yes but not redweek in a while. I’ll have to look!


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## Some_Devil (Nov 19, 2018)

Richelle said:


> I paid $1 for 308,000 points.  I got fairly lucky on that one, because 6 months later, someone else sold the same contract for $510.  However, when they sold that $510 contract, it was in a seller's market.  I bought in a buyers market which we are in now.  Club Wyndham access goes for anywhere between $3-$5 per 1,000 points.  Usually, the cheaper ones are the ones where the seller is asking the buyer to pay closing costs, but that's not always the case.  I believe Ovations has reduced the number of contracts on the resale market, which has driven up the price for some, but if you are patient, you can get some decent deals.  The national harbor one is not a bad deal at all.



Thank you, that's a great deal. Is there any truth to what I have been told about that they flag you and make it harder to book things when you need to because it's a resale.


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## paxsarah (Nov 19, 2018)

Some_Devil said:


> Thank you, that's a great deal. Is there any truth to what I have been told about that they flag you and make it harder to book things when you need to because it's a resale.



Nope.


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## Richelle (Nov 19, 2018)

Some_Devil said:


> Thank you, that's a great deal. Is there any truth to what I have been told about that they flag you and make it harder to book things when you need to because it's a resale.



No truth at all. Look at it this way. If they made it harder for resale people to book, they will get frustrated, and you never get them to buy retail. Also, if people start with resale, that is a free lead that they can try to convince to buy retail.  Finally, resale owners pay maintenance fees on those contracts. If people could not get rid of their contracts, they would just walk away and there would be no one to pay the dues.  The resale market helps Wyndham in some areas. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Avislo (Nov 20, 2018)

Most of the re-sale contracts are flagged as re-sale.  Do not know about harder to book, however, some Wyndham Club Plus/Access programs need developer creditable purchases.


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## Some_Devil (Nov 23, 2018)

Avislo said:


> Most of the re-sale contracts are flagged as re-sale.  Do not know about harder to book, however, some Wyndham Club Plus/Access programs need developer creditable purchases.



Does this mean that buying a resale Club Wyndham Access contract would keep you from using it like a developer contract?


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## Jan M. (Nov 23, 2018)

Some_Devil said:


> Does this mean that buying a resale Club Wyndham Access contract would keep you from using it like a developer contract?



The only thing buying CWA resale wouldn't do is count towards attaining VIP status. Other than that those points work just the same as all other CWA points, developer or resale.


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## Avislo (Nov 23, 2018)

Some_Devil said:


> Does this mean that buying a resale Club Wyndham Access contract would keep you from using it like a developer contract?



If I remember right, Club Wyndham Pass needs developer points maybe a few other things like less problems if you want to use the developer point contracts for what they have called trade credits towards a new purchase.  Maybe others can chirp in with other things that could be affected.  I believe that there have been numerous posts over time pertaining to uses of re-sale points.

Club Wyndham Access points bought from the developer are developer creditable points.


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## Braindead (Nov 23, 2018)

Avislo said:


> Club Wyndham Access points bought from the developer are developer creditable points.


Gee Thanks!! I always wondered about that. You’re just a wealth of knowledgeable and helpful on all aspects of Wyndham


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## Richelle (Nov 25, 2018)

Some_Devil said:


> Does this mean that buying a resale Club Wyndham Access contract would keep you from using it like a developer contract?



Resale does not get you Club Pass reservations (WorldMark resorts for a $99 fee), VIP status, Plus Partners (unless you already have a retail bought contract), or the ability to convert Club Wyndham points to Wyndham rewards points.  The last two are a waste of points, because the conversion rate is terrible. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Howdy_TX (Dec 31, 2018)

(1) does multiple deeded contract means multiple fixed program fee if say each contact is 100k points (below min)? But own 3 different contracts deeded at different resorts total 300k points?

(2) if no (program fee is based on total points hold and not per contract min), is it best to own different resort deeds?

(3) Hawaii mentioned seems to be low in MF, but wouldn’t Hawaii prone to more “special assessment”?

(4) if it’s EOY-Even (every other year), I can only use the points durinf Even years? Or they deposit 1/2 if the points yearly to be used? Say if EOY 150k, is it 75k yearly? Or 150k to use on even years?

(5) if it’s even Even years, then i thought you could have points carryover additional year within Wyndham ??? How does this work? Never can be carried over?


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## paxsarah (Dec 31, 2018)

(1) No. One account, and the program fee is determined by the total points in the account regardless of the number of contracts.

(2) Probably not. If you're going for low MFs and you happen upon several smaller deeds at low-MF locations, that's probably fine, but it's probably more economical to have it in one larger deed in terms of multiple transfer fees and closing costs. If you're going for ARP, small deeds aren't going to get you very far in terms of ARP if they're all at different resorts.

(3) I can't really say, but I haven't heard discussion of it being a problem. I've owned at Myrtle Beach (which one might think could be prone to special assessments) for 8 years and have never been hit with a special assessment.

(4) You can use the Points Deposit feature ($39) to move some or all of your biennial even-year points to the following odd year. The way they're initially issued, you'll get all your points in the even year, zero in the odd year. I no longer recommend buying biennial contracts unless you truly plan to vacation more in alternate years, or if you'll balance an even out by also buying an odd. The old credit pool made it easy to manage, but the Points Deposit feature is less flexible.

(5) You can use the Points Deposit feature on biennial points. As resale, you'd have the first three months of your use year to decide to do this. If you wait longer, you either have to use the points or deposit to RCI.


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## Howdy_TX (Dec 31, 2018)

Thank you - hope no more questions - also a newbie


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## Jan M. (Dec 31, 2018)

oo7bunny said:


> (1) does multiple deeded contract means multiple fixed program fee if say each contact is 100k points (below min)? But own 3 different contracts deeded at different resorts total 300k points?
> 
> (2) if no (program fee is based on total points hold and not per contract min), is it best to own different resort deeds?
> 
> (3) Hawaii mentioned seems to be low in MF, but wouldn’t Hawaii prone to more “special assessment”?



1. The program fee is based on the total number of points you own in your account, single or multiple deeds and/or contracts. For resale points the program fee for 2019  is $0.58 per thousand points or a minimum of $135. $135 divided by $0.58 = 233,000 points you have to own, total in your account, to get above the minimum program fee. Say you have two deeds in your account, 105k and 77k for a total 182k points, that means you would be paying the minimum program fee of $135 which makes your cost per point $0.74 for the program fee instead of $0.58 if you owned at least 233k points.

2.  Some people like to own deeds at multiple resorts to give themselves ARP at those resorts. But remember you would need to own enough point at each resort to be able to make the ARP reservation you want. Say you wanted to use your ARP to book Bonnet Creek the week of Christmas or New Year's and need a three bedroom unit. That means you would either need to own 308k points at either Bonnet Creek or CWA points to be able to do that. Btw Bonnet Creek maintenance fees, $6.16 per thousand points, are even higher than CWA, $5.99 per thousand, and both of those are without the program fee.

I'm going to add something else about a reservation like that example. Your maintenance and program fees for 308k points deeded at Bonnet Creek would be $2076 for 2019 and CWA would be $2024. That is pretty expensive for a week's vacation so now you need to think about what it would cost you to rent from another owner vs owning yourself.

A two bedroom lock off at Star Island would only be 233k points for those weeks. Say you owned 308k points deeded at Grand Desert. I'm going to use GD building 3 which is a little higher maintenance fees than buildings 1 and 2 because we own points at building 3 and I have those figures. For 2019 they are $4.82 per thousand and the program fee would be another $0.58 per thousand for you; so all in $5.40 per thousand points. That makes the cost of the 233k point reservation at Star Island for the two bedroom lock off unit $1258.20. You just saved yourself $817.80 over owning at Bonnet Creek and staying there or $765.80 if you owned CWA points and stayed at Bonnet Creek. And you would be able to book that two bedroom lock off unit at Star Island at the 10 month mark which means you wouldn't need the ARP from owning Bonnet Creek or CWA points to stay at Bonnet Creek. Plus you would have saved 75k points to use on another stay.

The lock off units at Star Island are different than those at other resorts in that the Suite side has two double beds instead of a king bed.  And if you look at the layout you can see that in the Suite unit side there are doors that close off the bedroom and the living room/kitchen where the sofa bed is. That makes the two bedroom lock off at Star Island function beautifully as a three bedroom unit. The lock off doors between the units open directly into the units there is no hallway, the image shows a space to indicate that they are two different units. If you have kids they really like having that second living room for their own TV room and that second refrigerator for their drinks and snacks. I sent someone to Star Island and they actually preferred the location over Bonnet Creek because Star Island has all kinds of restaurants, a Walmart and a Publix nearby which Bonnet Creek does not. The best part was when they got home their kids told everyone that they had their own apartment on vacation. The dad called me to tell me how awesome that made him feel to hear his kids telling their friends and other family that and also that their family had a great vacation and liked the resort.

The reason I'm telling you all of this is to demonstrate that these are the kinds of things you don't know until after you own and have a chance to start staying at the different resorts. When we've stayed in areas that have more than one resort we've gone to the other resort or resorts and asked to look around and see a unit. That gives us ideas for where we might like to stay the next time.






 +

3.  Wyndham has really learned a lot over the years various resorts got hit by hurricanes. At the owners meeting in Vegas last Fall they told us how many resorts have opted to get their insurance through Wyndham. It is better coverage and better rates than getting insurance as a stand alone policy. And I believe they are better at assessing future needs and building the reserve funds to cover them. Special assessments are pretty rare these days. We've owned for 16-17 years and never had one.


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## Howdy_TX (Dec 31, 2018)

Thank you Jen - I read over 10+ threads (10+ hours from sat nite until now) - and you’ve provided very detail explanation multiple times - much appreciated - and repeatedly mention Grand Desert - I’m actually starting to search Grand Desert and waiting for a good deal to fall on my laps - lol

Hawaii would be nice, but I’m not even sure if I’ll go there more than 3 times rest of my life just because airfare alone is costly —- I was debating on Hawaii due to low MF but afraid of “special assessment” - that’s why questioned - 

Still debating Hawaii or Vegas

And now sure how you guessed- I will be going to Disney, FL at least once or 2x - wanted to stay inside Disney but told only RCI have such... I’ll definitely look at Star - I was just iffy about getting on/off shuttles would it be too crowded (assume Star also have that to Disney?)


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## paxsarah (Dec 31, 2018)

Bonnet Creek is inside Disney’s gates but not on Disney property - it’s adjacent to Disney’s Caribbean Beach resort. We’ve stayed there, and we’ve also stayed at DVC properties multiple times via RCI exchange. DVC only makes 1BRs available to RCI in recent years, if that’s a concern.


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## Howdy_TX (Dec 31, 2018)

paxsarah said:


> Bonnet Creek is inside Disney’s gates but not on Disney property - it’s adjacent to Disney’s Caribbean Beach resort. We’ve stayed there, and we’ve also stayed at DVC properties multiple times via RCI exchange. DVC only makes 1BRs available to RCI in recent years, if that’s a concern.



Which would you suggest ? Bonnet Creek or DVC ? I’m just not sure of using shuttle when staying Bonner Creek...

I’m not familiar with RCI - you don’t have to use points right? You could just pay?


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## paxsarah (Dec 31, 2018)

These would be exchanges that require points. We typically stay during weeks that take 105k points for a DVC exchange, then there’s a $239 exchange fee, and Disney charges $190 basically because they can. It’s still less expensive than almost any other way of staying in those units on property, even with those added fees.


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## Jan M. (Dec 31, 2018)

oo7bunny said:


> Thank you Jen - I read over 10+ threads (10+ hours from sat nite until now) - and you’ve provided very detail explanation multiple times - much appreciated - and repeatedly mention Grand Desert - I’m actually starting to search Grand Desert and waiting for a good deal to fall on my laps - lol
> 
> Hawaii would be nice, but I’m not even sure if I’ll go there more than 3 times rest of my life just because airfare alone is costly —- I was debating on Hawaii due to low MF but afraid of “special assessment” - that’s why questioned -
> 
> ...



It doesn't matter where you own or whether or not you ever intend to stay there. What matters is having low maintenance fees and ARP if you know you will need it. We've only ever stayed at one of the three resorts we own at. Some people have never stayed where they own.

I frequently use Grand Desert as an example because the resort has pretty good maintenance fees and it is fairly easy to find resale points at reasonable prices. Many people like Bali Hai points as they have very low maintenance fees. National Harbor, Panama City Beach, Canterbury, Midtown, Desert Blue are a few others that also have lower maintenance fees.


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## bnoble (Dec 31, 2018)

oo7bunny said:


> I was just iffy about getting on/off shuttles


I would never stay at a non-DVC resort in Orlando without a rental car. To be fair, I rarely stay at a DVC resort without one either.


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## Howdy_TX (Dec 31, 2018)

bnoble said:


> I would never stay at a non-DVC resort in Orlando without a rental car. To be fair, I rarely stay at a DVC resort without one either.



Why is that ? I mean I most likely will rent a car because will stay Disney week then move closer to universal but just park at whatever resort and take shuttles... just not looking forward parking in Disney daily if stay offsite - but I heard Bonnet have free shuttles but wasn’t sure how crowded or painful to get on going/return from Disney.


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## paxsarah (Dec 31, 2018)

Bonnet Creek has paid shuttles, and their hours don't suit my touring style. Although I always have a car because we drive to Disney, if I were flying I'd still rent a car. If I didn't want to rent a car, I'd Uber/Lyft, but I wouldn't rely on a non-Disney resort's shuttle to get me where I want to go when I want to be there.


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## Jan M. (Dec 31, 2018)

Howdy_TX said:


> Why is that ? I mean I most likely will rent a car because will stay Disney week then move closer to universal but just park at whatever resort and take shuttles... just not looking forward parking in Disney daily if stay offsite - but I heard Bonnet have free shuttles but wasn’t sure how crowded or painful to get on going/return from Disney.



The Bonnet Creek shuttle isn't free and doesn't have many options for departure and pick up times. That could be very inconvenient if you are traveling with younger children. If there are 3 of you in your family you would pay more for the shuttle than you would pay to park. I thought the shuttle was now up to $8 a person.


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## Howdy_TX (Dec 31, 2018)

Jan M. said:


> The Bonnet Creek shuttle isn't free and doesn't have many options for departure and pick up times. If there are 3 of you in your family you would pay more for the shuttle than you would pay to park. I thought the shuttle was now up to $8 a person.



Huh? I thought all shuttle is free  that was one of the sales rep told me  it is it only for VIP status?


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## Jan M. (Dec 31, 2018)

Howdy_TX said:


> Huh? I thought all shuttle is free  that was one of the sales rep told me  it is it only for VIP status?



It isn't free not even for VIP.


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## Howdy_TX (Dec 31, 2018)

Jan M. said:


> It isn't free not even for VIP.



Really? Another mis-information at the sales rep last week !!!


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## bnoble (Dec 31, 2018)

Howdy_TX said:


> Why is that ? I mean I most likely will rent a car because will stay Disney week then move closer to universal but just park at whatever resort and take shuttles... just not looking forward parking in Disney daily if stay offsite - but I heard Bonnet have free shuttles but wasn’t sure how crowded or painful to get on going/return from Disney.


You can save time/annoyance, or you can save money. When I'm on vacation, my time (and mood) is at a premium. I'd rather spend some money to save some time and be in control of when I can come and go.

Now, as they say on DISboards, "There is no pixie dust in transportation," and so nothing is annoyance-free. But, driving is on average faster and more convenient. Driving to/from MK from a Disney resort is usually a push (excepting the MK-area resorts). Driving between any other two points on property is faster. I would sometimes take the bus if I were planning a second BEvERage at Epcot, but now that I'm sober, there's no reason to do even that anymore.


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## Jan M. (Jan 1, 2019)

I think I may not have given the most accurate information when I said you can't combine points from different deeds to use for ARP. That is true if the points are from deeds are at different resorts but if they are from multiple deeds at the same resort I believe the points can be combined for ARP. I remember this being discussed quite a while back and hopefully someone who knows for sure will confirm whether or not this is correct.


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## Braindead (Jan 1, 2019)

Jan M. said:


> I think I may not have given the most accurate information when I said you can't combine points from different deeds to use for ARP. That is true if the points are from deeds are at different resorts but if they are from multiple deeds at the same resort I believe the points can be combined for ARP. I remember this being discussed quite a while back and hopefully someone who knows for sure will confirm whether or not this is correct.


You’re correct that all deeds at the same resort are combined into one ARP allocation for that resort
All CWA contracts would be added together as one ARP allocation
All allocations can be seen by using the “points calculator “


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## talkamotta (Jan 22, 2019)

mjc775 said:


> I wouldn’t buy AT ALL. I’ve lost flexibility to book elsewhere, and availability isn’t guaranteed. We’ve just reached the point in our lives where we don’t have to book during school breaks, so that may help a bit. But what if one of us becomes sick and we can’t travel - we’ve wasted money on something we can’t use. All things I wish I would have thought through 4-5 years ago. We bought because of emotion, instead of logic.
> 
> Try booking your dream resort through Expedia or direct. Do the math. See if the initial cost + MFs make sense. Maybe it does?
> 
> ...


You are correct in adding up all your costs.   Many don't include the original cost of buying the resort or points. I know what the value of my points are based on mfs.  I add the cost of trading fee and I added the purchase price of my timeshares divided by 30 years.  I figure I pay $125 let day for a 2 bedroom resort.  I compare it to hotels.com, expedia etc.   I always come out much better. I bought all but my first on ebay......the first was 5k.   That's why if I ever go to a timeshare presentation they soon don't want to waste their time.  I'm also 65.  I've put a lot of time making sure I get good value a lot of timeshare owners aren't willing or able to put in that much effort.  My co-worker bought 7 Marriott s.....2 bedroom weeks for about 270k.  All from Marriott. In his case it's very true but he is happy.    For my 7.5 weeks I paid 16k.   3 of my weeks are Hawaii and 5 are gold crown.  I do good but I plan months in advance, Im retired now and flexible.  I don't do holidays and I try to stay away from the school calendar. I mostly do  gold crowns but sometimes a good resort is in a wonderful location.


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## jwalk03 (Jan 23, 2019)

It is easier (and most often cheaper) to just drive to Disney from Bonnet Creek if you have a car.


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## cbyrne1174 (Jan 23, 2019)

You could also park your car at Disney Springs and use the busesto get to the park if you're REALLY cheap. I did that when I was in college lol.


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## paxsarah (Jan 23, 2019)

cbyrne1174 said:


> You could also park your car at Disney Springs and use the busesto get to the park if you're REALLY cheap. I did that when I was in college lol.



With the caveat that the Disney Springs buses don’t go directly to the parks and one would need to first take a bus to a resort, then take that resort’s transportation (bus, monorail, boat, etc.) to a park. On the continuum of thrifty to convenient, this is all thrift, no convenience.


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## cbyrne1174 (Jan 23, 2019)

You can walk to magic kingdom in under 5 mins from bay lake tower and walk to Epcot/HS in 10 mins if you park at the boardwalk. It's cheap, not convenient.


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## dgalati (Jan 25, 2019)

mjc775 said:


> I wouldn’t buy AT ALL. I’ve lost flexibility to book elsewhere, and availability isn’t guaranteed. We’ve just reached the point in our lives where we don’t have to book during school breaks, so that may help a bit. But what if one of us becomes sick and we can’t travel - we’ve wasted money on something we can’t use. All things I wish I would have thought through 4-5 years ago. We bought because of emotion, instead of logic.
> 
> Try booking your dream resort through Expedia or direct. Do the math. See if the initial cost + MFs make sense. Maybe it does?
> 
> ...


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## talkamotta (Jan 25, 2019)

Smo1990 said:


> I wish our school system would switch to year round school just so we can have some extra time in off seasons We have spring break and fall break, both of which are in “high” season so that’s not TERRIBLE, but I’m not even gonna lie... if an excellent deal comes our way, I’ll pull them out for a few days.


My grandchildren learn more on their vacation weeks with me than they do in school.  So don't feel bad about that.


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## bnoble (Jan 26, 2019)

talkamotta said:


> My grandchildren learn more on their vacation weeks with me than they do in school.  So don't feel bad about that.


I can't say that has ever been true for my children. This is criminal if it is true (and I suspect it is not).


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## Richelle (Jan 26, 2019)

talkamotta said:


> My grandchildren learn more on their vacation weeks with me than they do in school.  So don't feel bad about that.



My step sisters are teachers, and both agree that year round school would be better because Children wouldn’t forget what they learned the previous year, and there would be less time reviewing material from last year.  They can spend that time, teaching the kids other things, or giving them more time to digest new information.  I agree the year round school would be a good idea, and would have the added benefit if giving people time in the off season to go on vacation cheaper then during prime.  I think more families would vacation, if they didn’t have to do it during the most expensive times of year.  I fully believe that family vacations help create a stronger bond with family members, and foster a healthier relationship, because they spend more one on one time together.  That’s just as valuable as a good education. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## bnoble (Jan 27, 2019)

It is of course possible to take inexpensive vacations even when in summer, on holidays, etc. You just have to go to places that aren't as in-demand. 

I know this can be done, because we did it as a family when we had two young kids, one income, a mortgage, and the bulk of the loans for my wife's MD.


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## needhelp (Mar 30, 2019)

Richelle said:


> My step sisters are teachers, and both agree that year round school would be better because Children wouldn’t forget what they learned the previous year, and there would be less time reviewing material from last year.  They can spend that time, teaching the kids other things, or giving them more time to digest new information.  I agree the year round school would be a good idea, and would have the added benefit if giving people time in the off season to go on vacation cheaper then during prime.  I think more families would vacation, if they didn’t have to do it during the most expensive times of year.  I fully believe that family vacations help create a stronger bond with family members, and foster a healthier relationship, because they spend more one on one time together.  That’s just as valuable as a good education.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I know this is an old post, but how would year round school help with off-peak vacation time. The peak time would just move to whenever kids are out. 
Although I dont like the "pressure" of finding summer programs, it does give kids the opportunity to learn outside the classroom.


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## 55plus (Mar 30, 2019)

Peak times are generally when traditional school is out for the summer and school year holidags, like Christmas, etc. Whenever traditional school is out. Year round school year is better for finding availability. The kids will from time-to-time be off school when availability will be plentiful.


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## Richelle (Mar 30, 2019)

needhelp said:


> I know this is an old post, but how would year round school help with off-peak vacation time. The peak time would just move to whenever kids are out.
> Although I dont like the "pressure" of finding summer programs, it does give kids the opportunity to learn outside the classroom.



Just to add to 55plus’s comment, not all schools would be off at the exact same time. It would vary on the schools needs. So summer may still be peak, but kids would only be out for a few weeks in between semesters. Which weeks they have off, will vary among school systems. So it’s possible you won’t have as many kids at the parks or beaches, because not all of them are off at the same time, like they are now, from late June to mid August. 


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