# MVCI Travel package details



## Feverdog66 (Sep 12, 2011)

I remember when I first bought my Grand Chateau timeshare a couple of years ago there was a big push on MR points, and the salesperson kept telling us that with our bonus points given we would soon be able to take a nice vacation for two using those points, either to Hawaii, or Europe etc.  We were not able to take advantage at that time, and now I am taking a closer look at our points.  We have accumulated about 400k now via the MR credit card, and am wondering how we would use our "vacation package".  Maybe I am overlooking it, but I cannot find where it says in the charts that the points usage is for two airline tickets, although that is what we were told at the time.  I know that the nights were at a Marriott hotel of our choosing.  I had since went back to MGC for another presentation in March 2010, and was told the same thing.  So now I am wondering if the vacation (that included two tickets) was only snake oil or am I just not aware of how to use it.  Could someone please give an overview on how these packages work and if the points listed in the chart are for one airline ticket or two?  Thanks everyone....


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## tiel (Sep 12, 2011)

When you purchase a package, you are purchasing X number of nights in a particular hotel category, and Y number of miles to be deposited in your chosen airline FF account.  Before you purchase the miles, you need to how many miles you will need for 2 tickets to get you where you want to go, and then buy the corresponding amount.  Since different airlines require different numbers of miles depending on your origin/destination, you need to decide which airline you are going to use before you make your purchase.  Plus, the miles will be placed ONLY in the FF account of the owner of the MR account...if the MR account is in your name, the miles can only be deposited in your FF account.  One last point, you will be making all the reservations for your vacation;  Marriott does not perform this service, though, of course, Marriott will assist you with your hotel reservations if you call them.  

Hope this helps!


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## melroseman (Sep 12, 2011)

*Travel packages*

Here's a url for the 7-night travel packages that you are asking about.  For MCVI owners there are 5-night travel packages as well.

https://www.marriott.com/rewards/usepoints/morepack.mi#packages


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## NJMOM2 (Sep 12, 2011)

Funny I was just looking at using a Marriott Reward Vacation Package today.  I remember being told the thing about the 2 airline tickets from the sales rep when I bought my timeshare.  I did however use the FF points to get 2 tickets at one time.  The problem is the airlines have upped the number of points needed for airline tickets.

At the time of my TS purchase 25K airline miles would get you any round trip ticket in the continental US; 30K miles would get you a round trip to the Caribbean; 35K round trip to Hawaii (which I got 2 round trips for using the 70K miles vacation package from the rewards program).

I was just looking at the airline websites today and was ready to write a letter to Marriott because they need to update their vacation packages to meet the increase miles needed to still get 2 airline tickets. (They will probably will have to increase the number of Marriott Points needed in order to keep up with the airline's increases.)  The current package will get you 1 and quarter round trip tickets for what used to be 2 full round trips in the past.  This made me very mad as I too am getting ready to consider another vacation package.


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## Feverdog66 (Sep 12, 2011)

Thanks for the information.  As I suspected we should have taken that trip within a few months of purchasing because you never know what the future holds....


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## pwrshift (Sep 13, 2011)

The packages with 120,000 FF miles should easily get you two economy seats almost anywhere if you book them 330 days ahead.  The nice thing is you can use FF miles for business class seats too which cost as much as 5 times more than economy seats but only about 50% more in FF miles depending where you go.  So two pkgs should get you on biz class to spend 5 nites in London and 5 nites in Paris for example...IF you do it early.

Brian


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## BocaBoy (Sep 13, 2011)

The travel packages have been, and remain, one of the great travel bargains around.  This is primarily due to the high value in airline miles you get for your MR points.  If you are upset with the airline mileage you get in a travel package, you must not understand what you are getting.


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## NJMOM2 (Sep 13, 2011)

BocaBoy said:


> The travel packages have been, and remain, one of the great travel bargains around.  This is primarily due to the high value in airline miles you get for your MR points.  If you are upset with the airline mileage you get in a travel package, you must not understand what you are getting.



I do realize what I have lost since my 2007 trip to Hawaii.

In 2007 it cost over $800 for a round trip airline ticket on American Airlines or 35K FF miles.  I had about 36K miles in my FF account, got a Marriott vacation package with 100K FF miles and bought the last 4K FF miles giving a total of 140K FF miles that I used for four round trip tickets to Hawaii.

Today it costs around $900 on Continental Airlines for a round trip ticket to Hawaii or 80K FF miles.  Even if I took the Marriott vacation package with the 120K FF miles I would not be able to get *TWO* round trip airline tickets to Hawaii.

So, four years ago for 100K FF miles I got almost the total needed for three airline tickets now the 100K FF miles will only get one ticket with 20K miles left over.  Even the 120K FF miles will not get two airline tickets to Hawaii.  That's what makes me mad!

Just to compare apples to apples - American Airlines now require 45K FF miles for a round trip ticket to Hawaii.  Which would be better if American Airlines miles were available.  Delta requires 65K FF miles for same ticket - still 10K short for two tickets if using 120K vacation package.


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## GetawaysRus (Sep 13, 2011)

NJMOM2 said:


> Today it costs around $900 on Continental Airlines for a round trip ticket to Hawaii or 80K FF miles.  Even if I took the Marriott vacation package with the 120K FF miles I would not be able to get *TWO* round trip airline tickets to Hawaii.



It's necessary to be a little creative and do some advance planning to take advantage of a travel package.  Here's one way to do this, if Hawaii is your goal.  (I don't use Continental, but let's assume that you are right that you need 80K FF miles per ticket.)

Let's say you have enough Marriott points that you redeem for a vacation package with 120,000 FF miles.  You still need 40K more miles.

Do you have a Chase Sapphire Preferred credit card?  There is a sign-up bonus for the Sapphire Preferred that will net you 50,000 Chase Ultimate Rewards points if you spend $3000 within 3 months.  Chase U.R. points can be transferred to a number of programs.  It is possible to transfer your Chase U.R. points to Continental miles on a 1:1 basis, but be aware that this will end after December 2011.  You'll find info on the Sapphire Preferred credit card on FlyerTalk, in the MilesBuzz forum I think.

So, you could apply for this card, try to meet the 3000 spend fairly quickly, then get Chase U.R. points transferred over to Continental before year-end so that you have enough miles for your tickets.

That's just a first thought.  I'd also look into which other airlines partner with Marriott (i.e., which airlines you can get FF miles on using a Marriott travel package) and if they fly to Hawaii.  Marriott no longer partners with American (my airline of choice), but there may be other airlines that would work for you.


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## dima (Sep 13, 2011)

BTW, about Hawaii airfare, I recently bought tickets from LAX to LIH on Delta for $600. Price looks good to me.


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## tiel (Sep 13, 2011)

Something else to keep in mind:  you can use your travel package hotel certificates separately from your FF miles you purchase in that package.  So, if you want to use your certs for a hotel stay in HI, and pay for your flight because you can find a good deal, you can just deposit your miles and save them toward another trip (keeping in mind you have to keep your FF account active).  

We actually did the reverse.  We used the miles from our packages toward flights to Egypt (which fell through because of the political situation), and will be using our hotel certs from the packages for a trip to HI next February.  So, as GetawaysRus said, if you are creative, and can plan ahead, you might be able to get the trip you want, and/or, add onto a trip already planned.  True, MR points don't go as far as they used to, but "currency" does?

Hope you can figure someting out Feverdog!


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## Aviator621 (Sep 13, 2011)

Can you split the 7 day hotel certificate between two hotels and/or locations if all stays are within the same week?


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## tiel (Sep 13, 2011)

Aviator621 said:


> Can you split the 7 day hotel certificate between two hotels and/or locations if all stays are within the same week?



To the best of my knowledge, no.  You  must use all nights on one certificate at the same hotel.  If you want to stay at different hotels, you need to purchase  a separate certificate for each hotel.


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## NJMOM2 (Sep 13, 2011)

The point of my story was with my creative maneuvers (using credit card FF miles & small purchase of miles) where I got 7 nights in HI with FOUR airline tickets will not work anymore due to the airline ALL requiring more FF miles.  Now I might only get TWO airline tickets for the same trip - maybe THREE if using creative maneuvers and I would have to use more Marriott reward points.

Continental has a direct flight from Newark to HI (would be nice to take) – However Continental is usually one of the most expensive airlines when I am pricing them - If I were to do the trip again I probably would end up using Delta - not sure because I was only glancing and did not price all possible flights.  I am also flying from the East coast so I will NEVER find a flight for $600.

I was trying to explain to the OP how the reward packages used to work with 7 nights and two airline tickets but because the airline raised the required miles it will not work the way it used to unless Marriott changes the miles given in each package.  Where at the time of my purchase (2001) 25K would get round trip in continental US; 30K would get to round trip to Caribbean; 35K round trip to Hawaii; not sure what 120K would get probably overseas (?) never priced it.  Since 2001 the airline increased their required miles but the reward packages did not increase the FF miles given.  So the saleman can no longer claim vacation packages with 7 nights in hotel and TWO airline tickets (for the lowest package at least).


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## BocaBoy (Sep 13, 2011)

NJMOM2 said:


> I do realize what I have lost since my 2007 trip to Hawaii.
> 
> In 2007 it cost over $800 for a round trip airline ticket on American Airlines or 35K FF miles.  I had about 36K miles in my FF account, got a Marriott vacation package with 100K FF miles and bought the last 4K FF miles giving a total of 140K FF miles that I used for four round trip tickets to Hawaii.
> 
> ...


This illustrates what I said about not understanding the situation.  

*The facts:*
1)  American still only requires 35,000 miles for a coach round trip to Hawaii at the lowest level  (apples to apples).
2)  Continental requires only 40,000 miles for a Hawaii round trip (not 80,000).  The same for United.  (80,000 is for an anytime award or a first class award.)
3) Delta only requires 40,000 (not 65,000) for a Hawaii round trip at their lowest level.
4) U.S. Airways also requires only 40,000 miles for a Hawaii round trip (35,000 if you have their credit card), and they offer a first class round trip for only 70,000 miles (65,000 if you have their credit card).

You must be looking at what you would have had to spend on a specific given day, and the lowest level was probably sold out that day.

Actually, the miles required for travel to Hawaii have been relatively stable for quite a few years.  We go an average of twice each year and with a little advance planning have always been able to get the lowest level award in either coach or first class.


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## NJMOM2 (Sep 13, 2011)

This illustrates what I said about not understanding the situation.  

*The facts:*
1)  American still only requires 35,000 miles for a coach round trip to Hawaii at the lowest level  (apples to apples).

I am comparing mid-range PEAK rates which is what I used 4 years ago.  YES I looked at the AA Awards chart and did my research before posting:

http://www.aa.com/i18n/disclaimers/free-ticket-award-chart.jsp

2)  Continental requires only 40,000 miles for a Hawaii round trip (not 80,000).  The same for United.  (80,000 is for an anytime award or a first class award.)

I actually picked travel dates for next July for the Continental test and the SaverPass reward  was NOT available only the EasyPass rewards for the dates I picked.  This would be compatable to the AA rewards ticket I used in 2007. *We didn't have a super saver ticket OR fly anytime ticket - we had the standard midrange reward ticket (apples to apples).*  I didn't go to the United web site but some of the Continental connections were United - I get the feeling they merged.

http://www.continental.com/web/en-US/content/news/continental_onepass_rewards_2011.pdf 

3) Delta only requires 40,000 (not 65,000) for a Hawaii round trip at their lowest level.

Same holds true for Delta Economy Class Medium Reward 32500K one way 65K round trip.

http://dmn.delta.com/skymiles/direct/charts/us49/


4) U.S. Airways also requires only 40,000 miles for a Hawaii round trip (35,000 if you have their credit card), and they offer a first class round trip for only 70,000 miles (65,000 if you have their credit card).

I didn't look at U.S. Airways. 

You must be looking at what you would have had to spend on a specific given day, and the lowest level was probably sold out that day.

Actually, the miles required for travel to Hawaii have been relatively stable for quite a few years.  We go an average of twice each year and with a little advance planning have always been able to get the lowest level award in either coach or first class.

My point is a 70K miles vacation package that I could have gotten me TWO MIDRANGE airline reward tickets to Hawaii in 2007 will NOT get the SAME MIDRANGE airline reward tickets today. I am not confuses and I do know what I am talking about.  They did offer a super saver award in 2007 for less than the 35K miles I used for each tickets - I don't remember what it was.  Whatever dates I picked then and now there are never any discounded reward tickets available so it  was not & is not really an option.


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## Aviator621 (Sep 13, 2011)

tiel said:


> To the best of my knowledge, no.  You  must use all nights on one certificate at the same hotel.  If you want to stay at different hotels, you need to purchase  a separate certificate for each hotel.



Thanks, appreciate the response!


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## Feverdog66 (Sep 13, 2011)

Thanks again to everyone for the information provided.  Very useful and much food for thought!


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## BocaBoy (Sep 14, 2011)

NJMOM2 said:


> This illustrates what I said about not understanding the situation.
> 
> *The facts:*
> 1)  American still only requires 35,000 miles for a coach round trip to Hawaii at the lowest level  (apples to apples).
> ...


That is an absolutely absurd analysis.  Mid range tickets did not even exist in 2007, and don't exist today on Continental, United and American (with a very limited exception), so I do not know how you could be comparing mid range tickets today with the nonexistent mid range tickets you said you got in 2007.  The mileage levels you quoted were for the lowest level in 2007, not a mid range level.  I don't find it any harder to get low mileage tickets today than in 2007.  When the lowest level awards are sold out, the mid range options are usually a cheaper alternative than you could have gotten in 2007 when you would have had to use an anytime award in similar circumstances.  I actually find it easier to get cheap mileage tickets to Hawaii today than I did four or five years ago.  You just have to be a little flexible, but that is not new either.


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## NJMOM2 (Sep 14, 2011)

BocaBoy said:


> That is an absolutely absurd analysis.  Mid range tickets did not even exist in 2007, and don't exist today on Continental, United and American (with a very limited exception), so I do not know how you could be comparing mid range tickets today with the nonexistent mid range tickets you said you got in 2007.  The mileage levels you quoted were for the lowest level in 2007, not a mid range level.  I don't find it any harder to get low mileage tickets today than in 2007.  When the lowest level awards are sold out, the mid range options are usually a cheaper alternative than you could have gotten in 2007 when you would have had to use an anytime award in similar circumstances.  I actually find it easier to get cheap mileage tickets to Hawaii today than I did four or five years ago.  You just have to be a little flexible, but that is not new either.



Final response:

Whatever....all I know is I cannot get two round trip tickets for 70K from Newark to Hawaii on the airlines that I looked at for a 14 day trip in the summer.  Where in 2007 I had a choice of days to pick from without using fly anytime miles.  Maybe today I can get a round trip 35K ticket at a time of year that is less traveled to Hawaii and I want to stay less then 14 days or more than 14 days because the discounted tickets are hard to find from Newark.  Do the tests yourself.  On American Airline (because that it was I flew in 2007) I was able to find the 35K tickets for HI on AA for Nov. and Jan. to Mar.  They are NOT even offered after April 1, 2012.  That would make the spring/summer tickets exactly equal to what was offered in 2007 and make my 35K ticket now cost 45K miles.  Conclusion the airlines may have changed thier programs now offering off peak tickets for what the lowest rewards tickets used to cost and those off peak rewards are hard to find if even offered in prime seasons (summer in HI).  Good luck trying to get two round trip tickets for the current Marriott reward packages offered.


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## thinze3 (Sep 14, 2011)

I have noticed the same thing with Continental. They have all but given up on the "saver pass" flights to Hawaii from Houston. I just looked for next summer on the non-stop flights that are completely wide open - but no "saver pass". They do, however, offer a few saver pass options with stop overs in LA for Business Class seats.


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## BocaBoy (Sep 14, 2011)

NJMOM2 said:


> Final response:
> 
> Whatever....all I know is I cannot get two round trip tickets for 70K from Newark to Hawaii on the airlines that I looked at for a 14 day trip in the summer.  Where in 2007 I had a choice of days to pick from without using fly anytime miles.  Maybe today I can get a round trip 35K ticket at a time of year that is less traveled to Hawaii and I want to stay less then 14 days or more than 14 days because the discounted tickets are hard to find from Newark.  Do the tests yourself.  On American Airline (because that it was I flew in 2007) I was able to find the 35K tickets for HI on AA for Nov. and Jan. to Mar.  They are NOT even offered after April 1, 2012.  That would make the spring/summer tickets exactly equal to what was offered in 2007 and make my 35K ticket now cost 45K miles.  Conclusion the airlines may have changed thier programs now offering off peak tickets for what the lowest rewards tickets used to cost and those off peak rewards are hard to find if even offered in prime seasons (summer in HI).  Good luck trying to get two round trip tickets for the current Marriott reward packages offered.


Right now you can get 40,000 mile tickets from Newark to Honolulu on many days every month through early June of next year, including the very heavy February season.  Continental will make more seats available later for the summer months.  Any other facts you want to make up?


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## NJMOM2 (Sep 14, 2011)

BocaBoy said:


> Right now you can get 40,000 mile tickets from Newark to Honolulu on many days every month through early June of next year, including the very heavy February season.  Continental will make more seats available later for the summer months.  Any other facts you want to make up?



The fact is:  The 70K MR package is still NOT going to get you two airline tickets even at the lowest rate on Continental like it did for me on American Airlines in 2007!  Now try July - which is when I traveled nothing under 60K (found one return flight for 20K if you want to take 17+ hours to return home).

I have been using FF miles for 20+ years - not often but often enough to understand the programs.  I do not appreciate you implying I am making thing up and do not understand they system.  I am not an expert on ALL airlines but for the few that I use I do see an increase in miles needed to fly at the times and seasons I have flown in the past. I do not fly on the night owl fiights in the off season.


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## rsackett (Sep 14, 2011)

BocaBoy said:


> ...Actually, the miles required for travel to Hawaii have been relatively stable for quite a few years.  We go an average of twice each year and with a little advance planning have always been able to get the lowest level award in either coach or first class.



I should have you make my FF reservations!  

We went from Detroit to HNL last Christmas  and the best I could do was 57,500 per ticket (four of us) on Delta at 330 days out.  One of the problems with Delta is you must book the whole round trip at one time so I needed to wait till the January 1st return was available to book the first leg of the trip.

I actually felt good being able to book the trip at that rate for Christmas travel to Hawaii!

Ray


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## LAX Mom (Sep 14, 2011)

Observation...

The Marriott travel packages don't promise 2 round-trip tickets but offer a certain number of miles plus nights in a Marriott hotel. Inflation happens. You can't get the same value for the package that you could a few years ago. 

If you need more miles than what the travel package offers you do have other options....

redeem for a different travel package with more miles

use a credit card to supplement your miles

redeem more than one travel package

Inflation happens.


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## NJMOM2 (Sep 14, 2011)

LAX Mom said:


> Observation...
> 
> The Marriott travel packages don't promise 2 round-trip tickets but offer a certain number of miles plus nights in a Marriott hotel. Inflation happens. You can't get the same value for the package that you could a few years ago.
> 
> ...



I agree.  The vacations packages don't promise it but I was told by the salesman that the vacation packages will get you 7 nights in hotel with two airline tickets and it did at the time of my purchase - even the lowest 50K FF package.   My starting point was that is no longer possible because of inflation.  The OP was asking where to find the two airline tickets his salesperson was referring to, as did mine.  Now you need a little creative math to get it - due to FF miles inflation.  Today you have to upgrade the MR package to get the miles needed and perhaps end up with a surplus of miles to use for your next trip.  Even, using BocaBoy's example, at the lowest rate to HI on Continental 80K FF miles are needed (if available) for two tickets you will have 20K miles left over on a rewards package with a 100K miles. Whereas, at time of purchase the salesman referred to the rewards package with 70K miles that would have gotten you two tickets to HI with no left over miles (on most airline to the best of my knowledge).


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## BocaBoy (Sep 14, 2011)

NJMOM2 said:


> I do not appreciate you implying I am making thing up and do not understand they system.


If the shoe fits, wear it.  I am not trying to be nasty, but I cannot let such gross inaccuracies go unchallenged.  Others might believe you.


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## NJMOM2 (Sep 14, 2011)

BocaBoy said:


> If the shoe fits, wear it.



Game over you can be the winner.....


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## Feverdog66 (Sep 14, 2011)

Thanks again for helping me to understand all of this.  I hope that soon Marriott will make some adjustments to account for inflation with the package program, but in this economy somehow I don't see that happening.  I do see now how important it is to research and keep up with all the different frequent flyer programs and how to determine how many points are needed for which trips, etc.  Sometimes I think that keeping up with all of this is a full time job, and being someone who works 50+ hours a week I hope that I can become adept at it one day...

Does anyone have an opinion on what the best airline / credit card deal is now, as far as most bang for your buck, or does just depend on where you live and which hub is closest to you?


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## SueDonJ (Sep 14, 2011)

melroseman said:


> Here's a url for the 7-night travel packages that you are asking about.  For MCVI owners there are 5-night travel packages as well.
> 
> https://www.marriott.com/rewards/usepoints/morepack.mi#packages





pwrshift said:


> The packages with 120,000 FF miles should easily get you two economy seats almost anywhere if you book them 330 days ahead.  The nice thing is you can use FF miles for business class seats too which cost as much as 5 times more than economy seats but only about 50% more in FF miles depending where you go.  So two pkgs should get you on biz class to spend 5 nites in London and 5 nites in Paris for example...IF you do it early.
> 
> Brian



As mentioned, Marriott owners are eligible for 5-night packages as well as the 7-night ones, and if you put together two 5-night ones the way that Brian has then you'll be able to do a longer trip and collect twice the miles.  To find the 5-night package details, sign in to your my-vacationclub.com account, click on the "Program Enhancements" link under "Marriott Rewards" in the column on the right, and then scroll down.


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## Mamianka (Sep 14, 2011)

LAX Mom said:


> Observation...
> 
> The Marriott travel packages don't promise 2 round-trip tickets but offer a certain number of miles plus nights in a Marriott hotel. Inflation happens. You can't get the same value for the package that you could a few years ago.
> 
> ...



One more idea - we use the Delta "Pay With Miles" option a lot.  Using some of our FF miles and adding cash (well, credit card - that makes MORE miles or points!) is often the solution, especially for flights that are not that far away, as opposed to cross-country.  If you try to use ALL FF miles on the first screen, we find that fewer flights come up on the screen.  If we use the Pay With Miles - we get a far bigger choice.  At the checkout, sometimes we even answer "How much of this ticket would you like to pay with MILES?" with "All of it!" - and we STILL get the long list of good flights.  Don't anybody tell them this!  Our secret!

Yes, having fun takes research and some work.  Oh well.  Planning is supposed to be at least half the fun.  When it is not fun anymore - you can always STAY HOME and find something else to grouse about.  "All you kids - GET OFF MY LAWN!!!"  Meanwhile, some figuring and conniving - and sometimes it gets a little loud here,too - is part of the excitement.  

Mamianka


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## dioxide45 (Sep 14, 2011)

BocaBoy said:


> If the shoe fits, wear it.  I am not trying to be nasty, but I cannot let such gross inaccuracies go unchallenged.  Others might believe you.



IMO and I am sure that many others probably agree, that while you may not be TRYING to be nasty, you in fact are being so. I find your comments and rhetoric in this thread to be over the line, uncalled for, and rather rude. This isn't the only thread where I have made this observation. Half of what you respond to and consider "gross inaccuracies" are merely your opinion or experience vs. that of someone else. It doesn't make your point of view any more correct. It seems however that you may feel better now and can go off thumping your chest in victory.

Just because it appears that we don't have an active moderator on this board doesn't mean you can choose to ignore the "be courteous" rule.

I don't know where you learned math. But in my school four times two is still 8. Meaning that 40,000 times two tickets means 80,000 miles are needed for two tickets. That would mean that the 70,000 mile MRP travel package isn't enough. 80 is still greater than 70 in all math textbooks.


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## klpca (Sep 15, 2011)

FWIW, I have been trying (unsuccessfully) to use 25k continental miles for a one way San Diego to OGG for next June and I only see 40k tickets. I spoke to someone from Continental and she told me that the cheaper fares "weren't loaded" in the system yet. A recent thread on flyertalk confirms this. The speculation is that the airlines are holding the discounted seats to see if they can sell them for real $$ first, then they will release the saver fares closer to the flying dates if if they remain unsold. This could explain why it is taking more ff miles to book flights that required fewer miles in the past.


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## NJMOM2 (Sep 15, 2011)

One reason why someone might be under the impression they can get two airline tickets with a rewards vacation package is from the Marriott documention itself.  The online Marriott presentation document for the using Marriott Reward points has an example of Delta's mileage chart from Jan. 2010 on page 45 that shows the required miles for a round trip ticket as 25K (Continental US states), 30K (Caribbean) and 35K (Hawaii) and up.  There is a disclaimer that it can change.  This online document was updated on 5/20/2011.  I would guess that the salespeople are using similar documents as they tell clients how they can get "two airline ticket" with a vacation package.

http://vacationclub.richfx.com.edgesuite.net/presentation/media/Marriott_Rewards_Points/

The NEW Delta rewards chart is much different:

http://dmn.delta.com/skymiles/direct/charts/us49/

You can still get intercontinental US flights during low times/season for 25K but the Caribbean and Hawaii rewards have gone up.


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## OldPantry (Sep 15, 2011)

All I can say about this whole thread is that I have found it NEARLY impossible to locate tickets on ANY airline at the lowest rewards levels.  After spending umpteen hours on various scenarios, I have given up in utter frustration.  My own take is that you are best off to take whatever Marriott points you have accumulated in the past and use them for lodging as best you can.  Then, switch to a really good rebate card.  There are two I know: through Fidelity Brokerage, where you can get 2% cash back, and Bank of America (a special offer I have been using like mad, which presently amounts to 2.5% back when redeemed at $300 or more at a time).  These tangible rewards beat the crap out of anything now available through Marriott, in my opinion.  I also got an American Express offer which (bizarrely) offered me $750 in gift cards for spending about $2000 on issuance).  That was a windfall I don't expect to see repeated, but if I do, I'll jump.

By the way, the truly best Marriott deal I have seen recently is the buy two get one night free offer.  This works only for level 1-4 hotels, but is a truly good deal.  The category 1-5 free night upon renewal of the Marriott black Visa is also cost-effective.  Otherwise, I am pretty much sour on Marriott points.


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## BocaBoy (Sep 15, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> IMO and I am sure that many others probably agree, that while you may not be TRYING to be nasty, you in fact are being so. I find your comments and rhetoric in this thread to be over the line, uncalled for, and rather rude. This isn't the only thread where I have made this observation. Half of what you respond to and consider "gross inaccuracies" are merely your opinion or experience vs. that of someone else. It doesn't make your point of view any more correct. It seems however that you may feel better now and can go off thumping your chest in victory.
> 
> Just because it appears that we don't have an active moderator on this board doesn't mean you can choose to ignore the "be courteous" rule.
> 
> I don't know where you learned math. But in my school four times two is still 8. Meaning that 40,000 times two tickets means 80,000 miles are needed for two tickets. That would mean that the 70,000 mile MRP travel package isn't enough. 80 is still greater than 70 in all math textbooks.


I have also observed that many people are consistently very rude to me and others much of the time.  TUG has a lot of experts on things where they have absolutely no knowledge or experience.  "Don't confuse me with the facts" could be the TUG mantra.  I vividly remember being the target of a large number of personal attacks, including charges that I worked as a salesman for Marriott.  I even decided to stop posting as a result but a couple of TUGGERs convinced me to stay, saying that my posts were among the best on the Board.  

In this thread the facts were being grossly ignored and I considered the responses to my corrections to be rude.  I was correcting FACTS, not opinions.  I come to TUG for information.  Too many others come with an agenda.  It is all too common on TUG.  My agenda is accurate information.

You stated:"I don't know where you learned math."  That should be considered  rude in your context.  But you feel free to say that when complaining about me being rude.  And where do you even get the idea that I "feel better now and can go off thumping [my] chest in victory."  I never said anything like that and I do not feel I "won" anything.

In short, your post is at least as nasty as anything I have posted.  Go figure.


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## BocaBoy (Sep 20, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> IMO and I am sure that many others probably agree, that while you may not be TRYING to be nasty, you in fact are being so. I find your comments and rhetoric in this thread to be over the line, uncalled for, and rather rude. This isn't the only thread where I have made this observation.


Well, based on the PM's I have received from TUGGERs following your attack, it seems they think you are the nasty one here.  It is always dangerous to speak for others.  It often prompts them to speak up and contradict you.


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## KathyPet (Sep 20, 2011)

And while we are on the subject of inflation in the number of airline miles required to get to a destination let us also remember that Marriott has also had at least two major point modifications since I first purchased at MMC.  It now takes a lot more points to stay in one of the upper end Marriott's then it used to.  No corresponding increase in the MR points that Marriott gives me for trading my weeks for MR points of course.


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## dioxide45 (Sep 20, 2011)

BocaBoy said:


> Well, based on the PM's I have received from TUGGERs following your attack, it seems they think you are the nasty one here.  It is always dangerous to speak for others.  It often prompts them to speak up and contradict you.



Had they posted publicly I might believe you, otherwise your statement is hearsay and pretty much meaningless. BTW, I was only defending your attack on another Tugger which was completely unnecessary. "If the shoe fits", I don't know anyone that would be willing to support that kind of statement about another Tugger. 

This makes me chuckle and think about this cartoon again.




http://xkcd.com/386/


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## BarbS (Sep 20, 2011)

There are bargains to be had when using frequent flyer miles.   We were able to get first class one way tickets on Lufthansa from Charlotte to Malaga, Spain, for 67,500 miles each using Continental miles.  These tickets would have cost over $10,000 each if we had purchased them.  We're spending 5 days in Marriott Marbella and then getting on a transatlantic cruise back into Fort Lauderdale, so we didn't need a round trip ticket.  We will try to find a cheap ticket back to Charlotte separately.  

Also, when the airlines are offering specials where you get double the purchased miles, or when they offer a bonus to transfer Marriott rewards points, I think it pays to go ahead and do this even though you don't currently have travel plans.    That way you will already have enough miles when you need them.


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## elaine (Sep 20, 2011)

for Ff tickets to hawaii, you have to be an early bird. I just had multiple choices on AA for late July/Aug (for 5 tickets) and decent choices on United/Continental for the return in is 2 weeks Aug. However, there are many like me out there---and many of the routes have sold out of the saver tickets--some sold out by 8am the day they were released (I know, I got those tickets at 6am). Some routes did not offer savers at all (AA KOA-WAS was 45K each way all days). You also have to be flexible--we are flying WAS-HNL and either using more miles (10K RT HNL-KOA) or are going to pay cash--which will be $800 for 5 persons.
As an aside, AA appears very light on Euporean ticket for next summer vs. United which had plenty of flights that I could get 5 seats on. I also miss the 35K RT Hawaii on AA. AA also does not allow a free stopover in Europe. I think United still does if you get a RT ticket.
There is no best plan--we picked AA 10 years ago b/c we flew to Carib. and HAwaii---now we go to Euopre more and have to connect via JFK for DC area--last month our flight going to JFK was cancelled and almost every time there is a long delay. There are a lot of CC offers with free miles, so pick the airline you want and then wait for a good CC offfer. Last year, I got 75K AA miles for getting a citibank CC. Elaine
ps--thanks PP for that tip! I have 70K Delta (dud) miles-----If we use the Pay With Miles - we get a far bigger choice. At the checkout, sometimes we even answer "How much of this ticket would you like to pay with MILES?" with "All of it!" - and we STILL get the long list of good flights. Don't anybody tell them this! Our secret!----


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## KathyPet (Sep 20, 2011)

Just another bone to pick with the airlines, at least United.  When we were trying to book FF seats to Europe this past spring for a cruise that we just completed we attempted to find flights on line for miles that allowed us to fly into Barcelona and return from Paris using United or one of the Star Alliance carriers only to find out that you can't do that on line using miles.  I tried multiple times only to keep getting a message saying "system could not process your request".  I finally called and was told you could only book those flights using a live agent and thus you had to pay the booking fee.  I was highly annoyed with that response.
If I choose to use a live agent (I guess no dead ones would be answering the phones anyway) then I would expect to pay the fee.  However, to be forced to use the call centers and pay the fee because their system cannot handle my request on line really burned my butt.


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## flyboy0681 (Sep 20, 2011)

Feverdog66 said:


> Maybe I am overlooking it, but I cannot find where it says in the charts that the points usage is for two airline tickets, although that is what we were told at the time.  I know that the nights were at a Marriott hotel of our choosing.



What you are referring to was an all inclusive package that was discontinued when Marriott devalued the Rewards program back in 2009. Up until then you were able to hand over a certain amount of points and in return were issued certificates good for hotel and airfare. Miles were not placed into your account but rather the certificates issued were redeemable for actual flights.


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## Mr. Vker (Sep 20, 2011)

We had to travel Cat 7 (7 night) travel packages that we used at the Grand Flora Rome before it became at Cat 8. It was a Cat 8 when we arrived, but we were grandfathered in.

The real story was the airline tix. Four round trip econ class tix BWI-FCO (1 stop in JFK) for 40k miles each (AA). A real bargain IMHO.

The real value in FF miles is elite cabin international travel. Twice we have leveraged MR points to travel to Thailand. In 2008 (2) first class tickets (AA and JAL) and in June 2011 (3) Business class tickets (ANA though US Airways via Star Alliance). Great routing and great service. Requires flexibility and patience, but the payoff can be huge.


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## pacheco18 (Sep 20, 2011)

Love those packages - here is what I am doing next August
I had nearly 800k miles

5 nights at Prague Marriott
7 nights at Marriott Champs Elysee
5 nights at JW Marriott Grovesnor House London
240k miles (2 free business class tickets)
I am Platinum Marriott so I will get upgraded room and free breakfast, concierge level privileges.

Essentially a free trip -- aren't MRPs grand!!!


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## Mr. Vker (Sep 20, 2011)

pacheco18 said:


> Love those packages - here is what I am doing next August
> I had nearly 800k miles
> 
> 5 nights at Prague Marriott
> ...



Free internet now too.


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## thinze3 (Sep 20, 2011)

KathyPet said:


> Just another bone to pick with the airlines, at least United.  When we were trying to book FF seats to Europe this past spring for a cruise that we just completed we attempted to find flights on line for miles that allowed us to fly into Barcelona and return from Paris using United or one of the Star Alliance carriers only to find out that you can't do that on line using miles.  I tried multiple times only to keep getting a message saying "system could not process your request".  I finally called and was told you could only book those flights using a live agent and thus you had to pay the booking fee.  I was highly annoyed with that response.
> If I choose to use a live agent (I guess no dead ones would be answering the phones anyway) then I would expect to pay the fee.  However, to be forced to use the call centers and pay the fee because their system cannot handle my request on line really burned my butt.



We had to do the same when we wanted a 5 night layover in Paris. Small price to pay for what is virtually a free segment.


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## aandmrun (Sep 20, 2011)

*I use them for hotel stays only*

Having been in the Marriott Rewards program since 1995, I have found that it is best (for us anyway) to use the points for hotel stays and just look for discount airline tickets on-line.  I hate to spend too much money or points on transportation because I feel that the REAL VACATION begins when we arrive at our destination.  I love the Marriott Rewards program and over the years we have booked many enjoyable hotel stays.


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## BocaBoy (Sep 20, 2011)

flyboy0681 said:


> What you are referring to was an all inclusive package that was discontinued when Marriott devalued the Rewards program back in 2009. Up until then you were able to hand over a certain amount of points and in return were issued certificates good for hotel and airfare. Miles were not placed into your account but rather the certificates issued were redeemable for actual flights.


Actually, the change from 2 coach tickets to FF miles came several years before the 2009 devaluation.  The original program gave the two tickets but we have been getting miles now for at least 10 years or so.  It is the reason we have not flown coach over the ocean for many years.


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## BocaBoy (Sep 20, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> Had they posted publicly I might believe you, otherwise your statement is hearsay and pretty much meaningless.



Of course you would say that.


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## MALC9990 (Sep 20, 2011)

*Don't blame Marriott or the Airlines for inflation.*

I have reviewed all of this thread twice now and it seems to me that the original subject was a complaint that Marriott had reneged on promises made about what a travel package would deliver for a set amount of MR points.

In the intervening years the airlines had changed the earn/burn rates for FF miles - that is essentially outside of Marriott's control. As a FF member of a number of airlines (all non-US) I have experienced this with a vengence in the last 15 years. However they have done this as a business measure inorder to survive as a viable entity. The LCCs have dramatically changed the business model for airlines in the last 15 years. In Europe no LCC gives FF miles - just low fares (though that is coming to an end now that some have become dominant). Airlines such as BA and LH in europe responded to stay in business. BA for example responded by severely limiting the availability of reward tickets. If they can sell a seat why give it away for FF miles! In some instances it can be more profitable to leave seats in coach empty and carry more profitable freight.

Marriott have to buy those FF miles that get put in your FF account when you take a travel package. Just like the CC companies buy the FF miles to offer as an inducement to take the new CC. Also as inflation has increased hotel prices over the last 15 years so the earn rate for a stay at a Marriott for MR points has increased - same points per $ but now you spend more $s.

That's infation for you - who to blame - our leaders in government for printing and spending our money before we earned it!!

The advice that it takes planning to use the packages effectively is definitely sound. I recently took a 5 day package as a MVCI owner. 250K MR points got me 5 nights at the cat 6 hotel I wanted to stay at and 120,000 BAEC miles in my account. I will not use the miles for this trip since BA do not have convenient flights but the miles will go towards a much bigger trip in F class to somewhere a long way from home for 2 of us using our companion voucher courtesy of my BA AMEX card spend this year, The accommodation will be using our MVCI weeks via home resort ressies and some II exchanges.

So don't blame the Airlines for inflation - would you rather they went bust and you lost all your FF miles, don't blame Marriott for inflation - again would you rather Marriott folded and your MR points dissappeared.


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