# Just Received Offer From Vistana To Deed Back Unit



## rtsdfw (Oct 11, 2017)

Hello all,

We've had this unit at the Mountain Vista Resort in Avon Colorado for about 15 years now. We own it free and clear with no mortgage. We abandoned it several years ago after the maintenance fees tripled. About 2 weeks ago we got a letter from Vistana indicating that we owed several thousand dollars in back dues etc. etc. etc. Then yesterday we received another letter from Vistana offering to take back our unit.

It's a nice unit: 2 bedroom lockoff floating week 8 every other year

Don't remember if it's even or odd.

But based on what I see here and on other sites they just don't seem to have any value. Particularly with the back dues we'd have to pay off to make a sale/transfer.

So I was wondering if other people have received similar offers or if we're special. We're inclined to take the deal just to be done with it but it seems strange that companies who don't like to take back their product are willing to do so now. Is there some kind of rebound happening in the timeshare market that I'm not seeing?


----------



## VacationForever (Oct 11, 2017)

Are they offering to take back the unit without your needing to pay all that is still owing to Vistana?


----------



## rtsdfw (Oct 11, 2017)

VacationForever said:


> Are they offering to take back the unit without your needing to pay all that is still owing to Vistana?



Yes. I believe so. part of the letter reads: "There is no cost to you..."

My guess is it's a good week during prime ski season and they would have no trouble reselling it.


----------



## VacationForever (Oct 11, 2017)

rtsdfw said:


> Yes. I believe so. part of the letter reads: "There is no cost to you..."
> 
> My guess is it's a good week during prime ski season and they would have no trouble reselling it.


I would say jump on it with both feet then!

Seriously, I am hoping all major timeshare systems do deedback for anyone who has fully paid up their ownership, before letting MF go into overdue.  It solves alot of issues for HOA and other owners that have to make up on the MF delinquencies.


----------



## duke (Oct 12, 2017)

You owe the back fees to the HOA not Vistana. 
Who is making you the offer to take back the deed?
HOA or Vistana?

ALSO - SMV Prime season weeks purchased from the Developer or Requalified have about 85,000 StarPoints per year.  Remember 90,000 StarPoints get you 270,000 Marriott Points which can be used for a Nights and Flights Travel package which gives you 7 nights in at Cat 1 - 5 hotel and 120,000 airline miles (132,000 if United).  Quite a good deal for $1,400 each year!  It also has 148,100 StarOptions which can get you 7 nights in a 2 BR L/O in Hawaii for the same $1,400 per year.  Again, quite a good deal!


----------



## Coloradorunner (Oct 12, 2017)

I would think that a ski week in the Vail/Beaver Creek area would have resale value.


----------



## cubigbird (Oct 12, 2017)

You should find a way to give this away on TUG (pay it current?).  That way a Tugger can get good usage out of it instead of Vistana selling for a huge inflated developer profit.  That’s why they want it.


----------



## Egret1986 (Oct 12, 2017)

cubigbird said:


> You should find a way to give this away on TUG (pay it current?).  That way a Tugger can get good usage out of it instead of Vistana selling for a huge inflated developer profit.  That’s why they want it.



I would imagine if they don't deed back to the resort and try to give it away or sell it, then they would be on the hook for all the back fees.

Take the offer from Vistana and don't look back.


----------



## RX8 (Oct 12, 2017)

Curious, did the past due maintenance fees ever hit your credit as a collection account?  No contact from the HOA until recently after you walked away from it several years ago?


----------



## TUGBrian (Oct 12, 2017)

very curious to learn the details on this...if its something official by vistana it could be music to the ears of many many owners on the forums!


----------



## Jchayes (Oct 14, 2017)

We recently had a discussion with customer care in Summerbay and gathered from that conversation that major players in the timeshare industry are hearing their owners with regard of how to have a strategy to leave once their lives have shifted.  We will have to wait and see but we were encouraged that there is a recognition that the owners are "aging out" and the industry wants to stay relevant to the new generation of consumers.


----------



## Larry M (Oct 14, 2017)

Jchayes said:


> We recently had a discussion with customer care in Summerbay and gathered from that conversation that major players in the timeshare industry are hearing their owners with regard of how to have a strategy to leave once their lives have shifted.  We will have to wait and see but we were encouraged that there is a recognition that the owners are "aging out" and the industry wants to stay relevant to the new generation of consumers.



I hadn't thought that much about exiting when I bought my timeshare. It's a prime summer week on Edisto Island and it only cost $1500, so I figured I would give it away on TUG. But a few years ago it was pointed out on another TUG forum that timeshare contracts have a dissolution date. Mine is 4:00 pm on the first Sunday in 2026. I can use it or let my son's family use it seven more times and it magically disappears.

Let's see...I got it in 2010 for $1500, it goes away after 2025, so my sunk costs are maintenance fees and $100 a year. Not too bad.

Brian, I'd love to be able to say I found it through TUG--and I was looking--but I also asked the HOA which said that they didn't sell units but would act as a matchmaker. They called with this unit before something similar popped up on the TUG Marketplace.


----------



## YYJMSP (Oct 14, 2017)

Larry M said:


> I hadn't thought that much about exiting when I bought my timeshare. It's a prime summer week on Edisto Island and it only cost $1500, so I figured I would give it away on TUG. But a few years ago it was pointed out on another TUG forum that timeshare contracts have a dissolution date. Mine is 4:00 pm on the first Sunday in 2026. I can use it or let my son's family use it seven more times and it magically disappears.
> 
> Let's see...I got it in 2010 for $1500, it goes away after 2025, so my sunk costs are maintenance fees and $100 a year. Not too bad.
> 
> Brian, I'd love to be able to say I found it through TUG--and I was looking--but I also asked the HOA which said that they didn't sell units but would act as a matchmaker. They called with this unit before something similar popped up on the TUG Marketplace.



It sounds like you have a RTU (right to use) ownership vs the deeded ownership alternative.  Only Westin Lagunamar is effectively RTU (50yrs plus 50yrs renewal) in the Vistana system, all others are deeded.

With deeded ownership, there is no expiry, so you're on the hook forever or until you get yourself off the deed by transferring/selling it...


----------



## cubigbird (Oct 14, 2017)

My WSJ-SB week is an RTU - 40 Years, I believe with an option for owners to renew, similar to Lagunamar.  I believe there are other phases like CV also RTU.  In either case, it’s much easier to give back an RTU because there is no deed.


----------



## TUGBrian (Oct 14, 2017)

Larry M said:


> I hadn't thought that much about exiting when I bought my timeshare. It's a prime summer week on Edisto Island and it only cost $1500, so I figured I would give it away on TUG. But a few years ago it was pointed out on another TUG forum that timeshare contracts have a dissolution date. Mine is 4:00 pm on the first Sunday in 2026. I can use it or let my son's family use it seven more times and it magically disappears.
> 
> Let's see...I got it in 2010 for $1500, it goes away after 2025, so my sunk costs are maintenance fees and $100 a year. Not too bad.
> 
> Brian, I'd love to be able to say I found it through TUG--and I was looking--but I also asked the HOA which said that they didn't sell units but would act as a matchmaker. They called with this unit before something similar popped up on the TUG Marketplace.



what you refer to is called a "sunset clause"  its not your contract that has an end date...but the timeshare itself.

this has been discussed in the past, and in nearly all cases the timeshare eventually gets the members to vote to extend the sunset clause indefinitely (or to a much more distant date again).


----------



## remowidget (Oct 14, 2017)

Deed vs RTU seems like a pretty abstract conversation to me, at least with a long life like Lagunamar. What happens when you die can be managed with estate planning. To me, what happens if you can't use it anymore is a much bigger issue. Even so, I think it is better to explore how to most efficiently use your time than to worry about what will happen down the road.

Yesterday my wife and I were looking at a trip to Washington, DC. As I was researching, I started thinking we should stay in an area away from DC. I read quite a few articles and threads and found a common theme. While there are other reasons for staying in areas outside of DC proper, they all have a basis in saving money on hotels. Realizing that slant made all the difference for me because the difference in cost is much less for me because I am using points. Points I have and know how to use because of my timeshare ownership. 

Tug seems to me to be an us vs them place. I think the most important thing is maximizing the enjoyment you get from your ownership. Dollars are important, but once you make the purchase it isn't about the money you spent anymore. Its about using or wasting your purchase for as long as it works for you. We bought our timeshare for the experiences,  which we have had and continue to experience in spades.

Sent from my SM-T580 using Tapatalk


----------



## VacationForever (Oct 14, 2017)

remowidget said:


> Deed vs RTU seems like a pretty abstract conversation to me, at least with a long life like Lagunamar. What happens when you die can be managed with estate planning. To me, what happens if you can't use it anymore is a much bigger issue. Even so, I think it is better to explore how to most efficiently use your time than to worry about what will happen down the road.
> 
> Yesterday my wife and I were looking at a trip to Washington, DC. As I was researching, I started thinking we should stay in an area away from DC. I read quite a few articles and threads and found a common theme. While there are other reasons for staying in areas outside of DC proper, they all have a basis in saving money on hotels. Realizing that slant made all the difference for me because the difference in cost is much less for me because I am using points. Points I have and know how to use because of my timeshare ownership.
> 
> ...


Well said.


----------



## DavidnRobin (Oct 14, 2017)

Also - Edisto Island is not Vistana...


----------



## silentg (Oct 14, 2017)

Two of our timeshares are RTU,  when the time comes we will end our relationship with those two resorts. Our other timeshares are deed based and we will use them as long as possible.
I’m retired and DH will be in 2019. We will travel as much as possible till then and when he retires we will go more often. Love timeshares!
Silentg


----------



## SMHarman (Oct 17, 2017)

Jchayes said:


> We recently had a discussion with customer care in Summerbay and gathered from that conversation that major players in the timeshare industry are hearing their owners with regard of how to have a strategy to leave once their lives have shifted.  We will have to wait and see but we were encouraged that there is a recognition that the owners are "aging out" and the industry wants to stay relevant to the new generation of consumers.


It is a huge problem for their sales teams. 

Why would Gen X and Millenials buy timeshare when they see they headaches it is currently causing their parents. 

On the OP this week had value prior to the MF backing up.  Probably still has some to a buyer willing to clear that as the cost of acquisition. 

Week 8 is often a school holiday week.


----------



## DavidnRobin (Oct 17, 2017)

SMV tripled in MFs? I’d like to see fact-check on this claim.  Since we have been tracking MFs on TUG over the last 12 years, I do not recall any total increase that have been greater than two times over this time period.  And I have a couple (WSJ, WKORV) that had the highest percent increases...


----------



## cubigbird (Oct 17, 2017)

I’d be curious on VSE taking back specifically Westin deeds.  The reason why I ask that is, is there really a new deed back program or is VSE bucking at the door to get back SHERATON deeds to add to Flex?  They can’t sell more Flex points without more deeds added to the trust, so I’m sure they want Sheraton deeds to come in to add to Flex.  This has been going on for quite some time now and I fear we might be confusing that with an actual deed back program (that may not exist).


----------



## DeniseM (Oct 17, 2017)

The OP defaulted on his TS "several years ago" and it appears that Vistana has decided to take it back in lieu of foreclosure - which costs them more money.  I wouldn't call that a deed back "program."  I'd call that cleaning up a deed that is in limbo, the cheapest way.

However, I'm sure that Vistana is trying to get more inventory for all of their Flex programs, so it wouldn't surprise me at all if they are a lot more receptive to taking back good weeks.  I'm sure they cherry pick - just like they do with ROFR.


----------



## GrayFal (Oct 17, 2017)

DeniseM said:


> The OP defaulted on his TS "several years ago" and it appears that Vistana has decided to take it back in lieu of foreclosure - which costs them more money.  I wouldn't call that a deed back "program."  I'd call that cleaning up a deed that is in limbo, the cheapest way.
> 
> However, I'm sure that Vistana is trying to get more inventory for all of their Flex programs, so it wouldn't surprise me at all if they are a lot more receptive to taking back good weeks.  I'm sure they cherry pick - just like they do with ROFR.


Bingo.


----------



## DavidnRobin (Oct 17, 2017)

Nice Win-Win-Win-Lose

So... Owner doesn’t pay MFs.
HOA takes up slack for lack of MF.
SVO/VSE controls the villa, and rents out this prime week over the years.
Questionable that the HOA is ever reimbursed for this rental by VSE (age old question that has never been adequately answered...)
Then, SMV/VSE takes back... Owner gets rid of TS headache, but VSE ends up with TS that had resale/rental value in first place.

The original premise was the 3x MF claim.   Did SMV really have this increase? [No.]  When did SMV become part of SVN?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## DeniseM (Oct 17, 2017)

[Correction - SMV isn't in Flex, Steamboat Springs is.]


Sheraton Vistana Resort (FL-Orlando)

Sheraton Vistana Villages (FL-Orlando)

Vistana's Beach Club (FL-Jensen Beach)

Sheraton Desert Oasis (AZ-Scottsdale)

Sheraton Broadway Plantation (SC-Myrtle Beach)

Sheraton Steamboat Springs (CO-Steamboat Springs)


----------



## DavidnRobin (Oct 17, 2017)

DavidnRobin said:


> SMV tripled in MFs? I’d like to see fact-check on this claim.  Since we have been tracking MFs on TUG over the last 12 years, I do not recall any total increase that have been greater than two times over this time period.  And I have a couple (WSJ, WKORV) that had the highest percent increases...



According to TUG MF database 
SMV 2Bd LO (Plat+ = 148.1K SO)
2004: $717
2016: $1373

1.9x over 12 years
$1373 is relatively cheap for 148.1K SO($/SO), and an easy mark to attain by renting a 2Bd LO in prime ski week.
ouch... I hope the SMV HOA gets adequate compensation


----------



## SMHarman (Oct 17, 2017)

DavidnRobin said:


> According to TUG MF database
> SMV 2Bd LO (Plat+ = 148.1K SO)
> 2004: $717
> 2016: $1373
> ...


Exactly. Say that unit is 3 years past due on  MF.   I'd buy it for the back MF of $4 k. In fact I think there would be a fight for it at that price. 

Would likely break even on a week 8 rental next year.


----------

