# Changes to Ovation program "limited Edition"...



## PeterS (Dec 25, 2018)

We exited Wyndham through Ovation and our ownership qualified for the "Limited Edition" program that gave us three years of the same amount of points with no maintenance fees.

We have found it is working well, as it has given us value for what we turned over and it allows us to phase out over three years.... 

We just got notice of a change in "Limited Edition" which summarized is they are eliminating guest certificates for use of points during those three years. Not a big change, but it shows the entire Ovation program is very fluid and can change at any time... 


_"CLUB WYNDHAM introduced the innovative Limited Edition program in 2014 to allow our valued owners, whose needs have changed over the years, the opportunity to transition out of their ownership in a safe and secure manner. As the program evolves in response to owners' needs, we've made some adjustments to the program guidelines so that members may access as many of the over 100 CLUB WYNDHAM resorts in their portfolio as possible during the term of their membership. 

Accordingly, as of Dec. 26, 2018, Guest Confirmations for Limited Edition reservations have been discontinued. If you have already made a reservation using a Guest Confirmation, it will be honored, and your guest(s) will be permitted to occupy the reserved unit. However, any Guest Confirmations for future reservations made on or after Dec. 26, 2018 will not be accepted. 

We at CLUB WYNDHAM continue to be committed to serving our Limited Edition members, and to assist you in taking full advantage of this unique program. If you have any questions or concerns regarding Guest Confirmations, future reservations or anything else, please contact us. 

Happy travels, 
CLUB WYNDHAM Limited Edition Reservations"_


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## uscav8r (Dec 25, 2018)

Actually, it’s not just an elimination of Guest Certificates. In effect, Wyndham is saying guest check-ins and occupancy will not be permitted. Therefore any usage must be by the owner(s).


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## wjappraise (Dec 25, 2018)

Don’t you love how they cannot speak truth?  “In response to our owners’ needs....”  What a blatant lie. 

It should say “In response to you using the program and allowing your friends and family to use it, we have decided to stop this right of ownership unilaterally.”


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## ronparise (Dec 25, 2018)

A little off topic but

The limited edition Ovation was and probable still limited to contracts bought directly from wyndham.

 And it is or was a way to “pay”  owners for their contracts. As I remember they “paid” 3 years worth of points. But instead of paying money they allowed the sellers to strip the points from the contract

Resale owners didnt  get paid


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## chapjim (Dec 25, 2018)

wjappraise said:


> Don’t you love how they cannot speak truth?  “In response to our owners’ needs....”  What a blatant lie.
> 
> It should say “In response to you using the program and allowing your friends and family to use it, we have decided to stop this right of ownership unilaterally.”



I think a more accurate interpretation would be, "In response to OTHER owners' needs (not yours) . . . ."  Wyndham is giving something and now they're taking some of it away.  Wyndham doesn't want LE Ovation people making money off the program so the are spinning this the same way they managed to spin the May 2017 changes as enhancements.

You gotta admit they're good at spinning!


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## PeterS (Dec 25, 2018)

I guess I didn't summarized it clearly....

Absolutely, the elimination of Guest Certificates was a cute way to say no more guests....

Also they made it clear when they said, "In response to our owners".... again a cute way of saying LE Ovation people are no longer considered owners...

Also, don't assume it is only people who bought directly from Wyndham... we didn't... but we qualified...still not sure why... Could be we converted weeks to points through Wyndham, could be they needed points at our resort that week????? Who knows but don't assume anything, as it changes daily....

We just hope the changes stay minimal until our three years are up.

I am not knocking Wyndham... they didn't have to offer the Ovation plan or the LE Ovation plan in the first place. I appreciate that they did. The offer of the three years helped us make the decision and it must have been worth it to them to give it to us in exchange for what we gave them... A deal that both sides are happy with.

My original posting was to just point out a change that anyone considering LE Ovation should be aware of, when making their decision. Actually we are using the points ourself so it doesn't affect us at all.

Actually this change makes a lot of sense, as it does protect owners...


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## TravelTime (Dec 25, 2018)

It sounds like they do not want people who have ended their timeshare ownership to rent out and profit. To me, this makes sense. They did owners a favor by having an exit plan. If you are exiting, perhaps you should not get 3 more years with no MFs. I can see why now that a prominent Tugger said there is a sense of entitlement among TS owners.


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## wjappraise (Dec 25, 2018)

Not likely someone who uses Ovation all of sudden becomes a mega renter. Very likely it’s an older couple who uses Ovation and has points available for a year or two more, wants their family members to enjoy “one last trip” to Disney or the beach compliments of Grandma and Grandpa.  

Either way, lying is so ingrained in Wyndham culture they can’t honestly state the reason for the corporate policy change.  I used to think it was only the sales staff that had perfected the art of unashamed lying.  It’s part of the corporate DNA.


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## ronparise (Dec 25, 2018)

TravelTime said:


> It sounds like they do not want people who have ended their timeshare ownership to rent out and profit. To me, this makes sense. They did owners a favor by having an exit plan. If you are exiting, perhaps you should not get 3 more years with no MFs. I can see why now that a prominent Tugger said there is a sense of entitlement among TS owners.


"They did owners a favor"

perhaps.... but they did their shareholders the bigger favor,,, They get something for nothing, that they can resell for $150/1000 points


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## paxsarah (Dec 25, 2018)

wjappraise said:


> Not likely someone who uses Ovation all of sudden becomes a mega renter. Very likely it’s an older couple who uses Ovation and has points available for a year or two more, wants their family members to enjoy “one last trip” to Disney or the beach compliments of Grandma and Grandpa.
> 
> Either way, lying is so ingrained in Wyndham culture they can’t honestly state the reason for the corporate policy change.  I used to think it was only the sales staff that had perfected the art of unashamed lying.  It’s part of the corporate DNA.



This was my first thought - no more gifting a honeymoon to your niece or a big family vacation requiring more units than there are owners’ names on the account during the LE period. I guess it’s “nice” of Wyndham to offer that program, but this seems a little petty.


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## Sandi Bo (Dec 26, 2018)

Wonder if they've stopped selling hundreds of thousands of points to people over 80 years old to help them reduce their overall maintenance fees?  Selling an 80+ person with 1M points another 400K is shameful. Telling them they can rent the excess, ha.  Next tell them you'll take them back for no charge, and let them they can use them for 3 years (quoting my Dad, as sarcastically as I can say it 'Isn't that nice of them'). Now tell them they can give the contracts back for no charge, and only they can use them.  There was ONE person on my father's account (him) when they sold him his last 400K.  I think he was 82-84, somewhere in there.  Thanks Wyndham!


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## jediinprescott (Dec 27, 2018)

I guess I will never understand Wyndham's thinking ( first mistake)... seems to me anytime a guest is in a unit , there's a potential new owner( sucker). So why would they put a restriction on guest certs? I would think there's a better potential buyer than from the person manning the kiosk in Harrahs.
Mike


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## jediinprescott (Jan 2, 2019)

jediinprescott said:


> I guess I will never understand Wyndham's thinking ( first mistake)... seems to me anytime a guest is in a unit , there's a potential new owner( sucker). So why would they put a restriction on guest certs? I would think there's a better potential buyer than from the person manning the kiosk in Harrahs.
> Mike


Has any other "limited ovation" participant received the email in question?
mike


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## Jan M. (Jan 2, 2019)

I didn't think this was something new just recently. I may be mistaken but I thought someone reported a while back that they were told they could only use the "Ovated" points for reservations for themselves.


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## PeterS (Jan 2, 2019)

Jan M. said:


> I didn't think this was something new just recently. I may be mistaken but I thought someone reported a while back that they were told they could only use the "Ovated" points for reservations for themselves.



_"Accordingly, as of Dec. 26, 2018, Guest Confirmations for Limited Edition reservations have been discontinued. If you have already made a reservation using a Guest Confirmation, it will be honored, and your guest(s) will be permitted to occupy the reserved unit. However, any Guest Confirmations for future reservations made on or after Dec. 26, 2018 will not be accepted."

Recent change.... and noted they were accepted before.
Maybe someone knew it would be coming and tried to a give heads up...
Maybe the system allowed it but it shouldn't have and they "fixed it" and now have to give official notice._


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## Jan M. (Jan 2, 2019)

PeterS said:


> Maybe someone knew it would be coming and tried to a give heads up...



I think that was likely the case. Some people wait until after the first of the year so they have the full points when they give their deed or contract back but they inquire a few months prior to the first of the year to get the ball rolling. I thought some people reported they were given a month?, 6 weeks?, two months? to accept the offer from Ovations and I would think that would be disclosed in the paperwork if the date was after December 26th.


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## bestpal38 (Jan 6, 2019)

TravelTime said:


> It sounds like they do not want people who have ended their timeshare ownership to rent out and profit. To me, this makes sense. They did owners a favor by having an exit plan. If you are exiting, perhaps you should not get 3 more years with no MFs. I can see why now that a prominent Tugger said there is a sense of entitlement among TS owners.


People exit for a variety of reasons. The Ovation program is a nice program, but just hold on there, when you say people are pfofiting. Lets take my own Timeshare numbers, and see who is profiting here. Let's say for example, Wyndham gives me 3 years "free" use. My annual MF's are around $2500. So over 3 years, I get the equivelant of $7500. Total cost of the timeshare....$115,000. Please show me the profit. Just to clarify, I did not purchase my timeshare, I inherited it, but the bottom line is, it cost $115,000, so getting 3 years of usage out of it, before it goes back to Wyndham, is not profit, even if you sell every point.


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## tschwa2 (Jan 6, 2019)

I think it is more that they don't want ovation participants to compete with Wyndham's own rental program.  While they can't prohibit owners from renting, since they can write and change rules of ovations at anytime, they can prohibit the competition so they have chosen to do so.


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## Jan M. (Jan 6, 2019)

I wondered if they restrict the stays with the "ovated" points to owners only counting on the owners not being able to use them a good percentage of the time. Wyn wins. When you think about how the Ovations program was advertised they were definitely targeting the older owners who are no longer able to travel like they had in the past. So give them three years of points, which they may or may not be able to use, to make them feel like they are getting something out all the money they spent buying developer. Then restrict them to only using the points for themselves instead of allowing even close family to use them. I know not everyone who gives back to Ovation is in poor health or physical condition, no longer inclined to travel or their spouse has passed but I would bet that a good percentage of them are. Does Wyndham get to play the accounting/tax game of declaring the value of the points they give but then those points never get used? Genius.


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## CO skier (Jan 7, 2019)

ronparise said:


> As I remember they “paid” 3 years worth of points. But instead of paying money they allowed the sellers to strip the points from the contract
> 
> Resale owners didnt  get paid


"For those who qualify, Limited Edition enables participants to enjoy three years of continued access to CLUB WYNDHAM resorts with no obligation to purchase, pay maintenance fees or incur additional costs. In exchange for relinquishing their ownership, participants are also cleared of future obligations, as Wyndham fully assumes those responsibilities."

"three years of continued access" sounds to me like three years of points used over three years and does not sound like "immediate three years of points usage" which is what points stripping would be.  Maybe someone who has taken advantage of LE Ovations can comment on how they can use their three years worth of points.


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## PeterS (Jan 7, 2019)

CO skier said:


> ""three years of continued access" sounds to me like three years of points used over three years and does not sound like "immediate three years of points usage" which is what points stripping would be.  Maybe someone who has taken advantage of LE Ovations can comment on how they can use their three years worth of points.



Exactly...

Still have an online Wyndham account and the same number of points show up for each use year. No lump of points. The only real limitations were they could only be used for Wyndham properties (ie: No Worldmark or other affiliates) and no trading/depositing into RCI. And now no guest certs.

Even taking all that into consideration, we are extremely happy with the Ovation LE program. We could have given away our time for free but we have three years of free use. Yes it is limited usage but it is better than nothing and with everything we learned here, we can maximize our usage by carefully selecting unit size and seasons.


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## flindberg (Jan 7, 2019)

was ONE person on my father's account (him) when they sold him his last 400K.  I think he was 82-84, somewhere in there.  Thanks Wyndham![/QUOTE]

Can't think of a better definition for "Despicable". Wyndham Corp culture is Predation - of which deception is part & parcel.


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## chapjim (Jan 8, 2019)

If someone has multiple contracts acquired from Wyndham, could that person divest one contract every three years?  That would allow personal use of the "ovated" contract and continued unlimited use of the remaining contract(s).  Three years later, turn in another contract (understanding that three years later, there might not be an Ovation program).

Or, is Ovation an "all or nothing" deal?


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## paxsarah (Jan 8, 2019)

chapjim said:


> If someone has multiple contracts acquired from Wyndham, could that person divest one contract every three years?  That would allow personal use of the "ovated" contract and continued unlimited use of the remaining contract(s).  Three years later, turn in another contract (understanding that three years later, there might not be an Ovation program).
> 
> Or, is Ovation an "all or nothing" deal?



We've had multiple reports of people using Ovation (simply the give-back) on some contracts but not others. As far as Limited Edition (the three years of points) goes, I found this thread from two years ago where it says that all contracts must be returned. However, I can't find that exact language published anywhere although it looks like it came from Wyndham - maybe that poster received it in an email.


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## chapjim (Jan 8, 2019)

I remembered something like that.  So, in my case, I own 4.7 million points, about 40% bought from Wyndham and some of which are converted fixed weeks, the rest from Ebay.  I would have to turn in the entire 4.7 million, not just the ~1.8 million retail points.

Sounds like a heckuva a deal!


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## tschwa2 (Jan 8, 2019)

chapjim said:


> I remembered something like that.  So, in my case, I own 4.7 million points, about 40% bought from Wyndham and some of which are converted fixed weeks, the rest from Ebay.  I would have to turn in the entire 4.7 million, not just the ~1.8 million retail points.
> 
> Sounds like a heckuva a deal!


Or you can sell off your resale points first before you apply for limited editions.


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## dgalati (Feb 1, 2021)

tschwa2 said:


> Or you can sell off your resale points first before you apply for limited editions.


Sell LOL!! I think sell would consist of giving them away for free and pay transfer and closing costs along will the maintenance fees for the 16 weeks of transfer time on a resale transfer compared to 4-5 weeks of transfer time using Ovations.


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## tschwa2 (Feb 1, 2021)

dgalati said:


> Sell LOL!! I think sell would consist of giving them away for free and pay transfer and closing costs along will the maintenance fees for the 16 weeks of transfer time on a resale transfer compared to 4-5 weeks of transfer time using Ovations.


2.6 million resale points depending on how many contracts and which contracts might have some resale value.  Even going through certified exit will take some time so the owner would be on hook for some of the time regardless and might be able to get the new owner to cover some of it depending on how many current year points are transferring.


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## Eric B (Feb 2, 2021)

The dredging continues; gap in posts on this one was ~13 months.


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## wjappraise (Feb 2, 2021)

Actually 25 months.


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## Eric B (Feb 2, 2021)

wjappraise said:


> Actually 25 months.



My bad - you're right, it's even dustier than I thought initially.  This whole pandemic thing must be getting to someone....


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## dgalati (Feb 2, 2021)

Eric B said:


> My bad - you're right, it's even dustier than I thought initially.  This whole pandemic thing must be getting to someone....


@paxsarah Maybe 2020 really didn't happen after all?


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## Braindead (Feb 2, 2021)

dgalati said:


> Sell LOL!! I think sell would consist of giving them away for free and pay transfer and closing costs along will the maintenance fees for the 16 weeks of transfer time on a resale transfer compared to 4-5 weeks of transfer time using Ovations.





Eric B said:


> The dredging continues; gap in posts on this one was ~13 months.





wjappraise said:


> Actually 25 months.


The worst part is dgalati is posting false information again. He doesn’t even know what the OP has for contracts yet has deemed ALL Wyndham contracts are WORTHLESS! That’s FALSE.

On eBay a Bali Hai 500,000 point contract sold for $5,300 in December, I’d say that contract had value & was worth selling.
Larger low MF & PR contracts sell for several thousands of dollars all the time.

dgalati post false information looking for attention, dgalati should be banned from discussing some topics such as all Wyndham contracts are worthless & resell points in a VIP account.


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## Eric B (Feb 2, 2021)

Braindead said:


> The worst part is dgalati is posting false information again. He doesn’t even know what the OP has for contracts yet has deemed ALL Wyndham contracts are WORTHLESS! That’s FALSE.
> 
> On eBay a Bali Hai 500,000 point contract sold for $5,300 in December, I’d say that contract had value & was worth selling.
> Larger low MF & PR contracts sell for several thousands of dollars all the time.



A lack of understanding of market fundamentals is what drives the timeshare industry retail sales.  I'm just happy that there are folks on TUG that are willing to share reliable and verifiable information rather than gripes and pet peeves.


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## dioxide45 (Feb 2, 2021)

Braindead said:


> dgalati post false information looking for attention, dgalati should be banned from discussing some topics such as all Wyndham contracts are worthless & resell points in a VIP account.


Not sure anyone should be banned for this, there are plenty here that will call them out and correct them. At some point they lose credibility. As they say "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"


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## Eric B (Feb 2, 2021)

dioxide45 said:


> Not sure anyone should be banned for this, there are plenty here that will call them out and correct them. At some point they lose credibility. As they say "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"



Completely agree with the sentiment, though I'm closer to "lost credibility" for some posters.  But that's what the ignore button is for.


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## Braindead (Feb 2, 2021)

dioxide45 said:


> Not sure anyone should be banned for this, there are plenty here that will call them out and correct them. At some point they lose credibility. As they say "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"


Your post gave me a good chuckle! Where are you when TUG routinely edit post, remove post, lock threads?
I might agree with you & my train of thought in my post might not of come across my mind if TUG didn’t already censor on a routine bases.
Why let one poster ruin a whole forum?


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## bnoble (Feb 2, 2021)

Eric B said:


> But that's what the ignore button is for.


Yep. Unfortunately, it has gotten to the point where some Wyndham threads are very hard to read because I see a few people responding to many others on my ignore list, and I have no idea what the thread is about. Every once in a while I click on "show ignored", but I almost always regret it.


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## dgalati (Feb 2, 2021)

Braindead said:


> Your post gave me a good chuckle! Where are you when TUG routinely edit post, remove post, lock threads?
> I might agree with you & my train of thought in my post might not of come across my mind if TUG didn’t already censor on a routine bases.
> Why let one poster ruin a whole forum?


Try to stay on topic and answer the op's question. Your response is of no help to op and makes no sense. When posting on a open forum you are welcoming a response from others. Try to be courteous and respectful to others opinions even if you disagree. Or be like bnoble and block everyone who has another opinion he may disagree with.


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## dioxide45 (Feb 2, 2021)

dgalati said:


> Try to stay on topic and answer the op's question. Your response is of no help to op and makes no sense. When posting on a open forum you are welcoming a response from others. Try to be courteous and respectful to others opinions even if you disagree. Or be like bnoble and block everyone who has another opinion he may disagree with.


The OP's question was asked WAY back in 2019. Does it even matter now?


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## Eric B (Feb 2, 2021)

OP actually didn’t ask any questions, but posted a tidbit about changes to the Wyndham Ovations Limited Edition program on Christmas in 2018.  Not really new anymore per se or anything worth dredging up an old thread for.  Given that the feedback program isn’t even called that anymore, you’re definitely on to something about it no longer mattering.


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## dgalati (Feb 2, 2021)

Braindead said:


> Your post gave me a good chuckle! Where are you when TUG routinely edit post, remove post, lock threads?
> I might agree with you & my train of thought in my post might not of come across my mind if TUG didn’t already censor on a routine bases.
> Why let one poster ruin a whole forum?





bnoble said:


> Yep. Unfortunately, it has gotten to the point where some Wyndham threads are very hard to read because I see a few people responding to many others on my ignore list, and I have no idea what the thread is about. Every once in a while I click on "show ignored", but I almost always regret it.





dioxide45 said:


> The OP's question was asked WAY back in 2019. Does it even matter now?





Eric B said:


> OP actually didn’t ask any questions, but posted a tidbit about changes to the Wyndham Ovations Limited Edition program on Christmas in 2018.  Not really new anymore per se or anything worth dredging up an old thread for.  Given that the feedback program isn’t even called that anymore, you’re definitely on to something about it no longer mattering.


A few here along with yourself felt the need to reply so it might have mattered. If you don't like a particular thread, stop reading it! Or just use the ignore button if you feel the need. Now try to get back on topic and stop the personal lectures.


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## dioxide45 (Feb 2, 2021)

dgalati said:


> A few here along with yourself felt the need to reply so it might have mattered. If you don't like a particular thread, stop reading it! Or just use the ignore button if you feel the need. Now try to get back on topic and stop the personal lectures.


I guess most are just wondering why you posted to dig up a two year old thread? I haven't seen any reason to do so and you haven't indicated why. Just curious?


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