# Last Timeshare Presentation at Pinon Pointe Will Be Our LAST



## NWTRVLRS (May 6, 2022)

We are currently at Pinon Pointe for 2 weeks... prior to arrival we were contacted about doing our 'Owner Update' and they advised that there is new information we will want to know about _(ya-da, ya-da, ya-da)_... we confirmed and showed up at our appointed time.

To say that our salesperson, who we have met with before, was rude is an understatement... I won't get into all the back and forth sales tactics _(that we all know)_, but here are the salient points:

Marriott will no longer *allow* them to sell the _*cheap*_ 660 point contracts and they are now only allowed to sell a minimum of 1100 points
We won't be able to book anything but our week in the near future, as 90% of Legacy owners are in the HPP
He no longer had to write upside down on a piece of paper, as there was a giant whiteboard across one wall with one small column showing what we own/how we can use it and the rest of the giant board was showing all of the privileges/benefits of the HPP.

Part of the conversation:

Hubby: We are very happy with our unit/week

Salesperson: You told me that 3 times already

Hubby: Then you obviously are not listening to me

Salesperson: Then why are you here?

Hubby: We were called and invited to an owner's update, where we were told there was new information

Salesperson: You have been to these things before... you knew what this was. There is no need for you to attend another presentation in the future if you are not going to buy. And I have flagged your account so that you won't be offered the 'option' of ever rolling your week into the HPP

And done.

Sitting around the fire pit this evening, we spoke with a lovely couple who were rattled by their presentation today with the same salesperson... we were able to share our knowledge learned on the TUGG boards and invited them to join so they never have to feel that way again.

We are so incredibly grateful for the knowledge that has been shared on TUGG over the years as we have learned about HRC and how to navigate timesharing... thank you.


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## BJRSanDiego (May 6, 2022)

We typically avoid the presentations unless it seems like they have some REALLY new information.  But at most timeshares we seem to be on the "do not waste your time" list. 

We'll be there in about a month.  We'll see IF or what they offer.


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## AJCts411 (May 6, 2022)

"We won't be able to book anything but our week in the near future, as 90% of Legacy owners are in the HPP"  Great it true! Then we owners can change brand affiliation...AKA kick Hyatt out.


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## Tucsonadventurer (May 6, 2022)

We skipped the Pinon Pointe update as we read these kind of comments in TUG and in the Facebook group. We have never felt this pressure in the Hyatt presentation in the Ka'anapali resort. Obviously they aren't selling Portfolio well if they are so rude.


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## The Colorado Kid (May 6, 2022)

NWTRVLRS said:


> We are currently at Pinon Pointe for 2 weeks... prior to arrival we were contacted about doing our 'Owner Update' and they advised that there is new information we will want to know about _(ya-da, ya-da, ya-da)_... we confirmed and showed up at our appointed time.
> 
> To say that our salesperson, who we have met with before, was rude is an understatement... I won't get into all the back and forth sales tactics _(that we all know)_, but here are the salient points:
> 
> ...


Yikes - was there at least some sort of reward for attending?


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## Ty1on (May 6, 2022)

BJRSanDiego said:


> We typically avoid the presentations unless it seems like they have some REALLY new information.  But at most timeshares we seem to be on the "do not waste your time" list.
> 
> We'll be there in about a month.  We'll see IF or what they offer.



You will invariably find new information here first or at least at the same time, and it won't be forced through the Sales filter.


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## dioxide45 (May 6, 2022)

NWTRVLRS said:


> Salesperson: You have been to these things before... you knew what this was. There is no need for you to attend another presentation in the future if you are not going to buy. And I have flagged your account so that you won't be offered the 'option' of ever rolling your week into the HPP


I guess there is no need to ever attend again if you can't even buy the product. We get this line now and then at sales presentations (not Hyatt), we attend for the free gifts. The response should be that they need to go back to their marketing department and tell them to stop misrepresenting what an owner update is.


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## NWTRVLRS (May 6, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> I guess there is no need to ever attend again if you can't even buy the product. We get this line now and then at sales presentations (not Hyatt), we attend for the free gifts. The response should be that they need to go back to their marketing department and tell them to stop misrepresenting what an owner update is.


That is exactly what hubby told him!


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## NWTRVLRS (May 6, 2022)

The Colorado Kid said:


> Yikes - was there at least some sort of reward for attending?


$100 or 10,000 points… we opted for the$100


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## NWTRVLRS (May 6, 2022)

AJCts411 said:


> "We won't be able to book anything but our week in the near future, as 90% of Legacy owners are in the HPP"  Great it true! Then we owners can change brand affiliation...AKA kick Hyatt out.


Funny thing was that we met 4 other couples that night and NONE of them were in HPP… so where are these 90% they speak of??? LOL!


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## Ty1on (May 6, 2022)

NWTRVLRS said:


> Salesperson: You have been to these things before... you knew what this was. There is no need for you to attend another presentation in the future if you are not going to buy. And I have flagged your account so that you won't be offered the 'option' of ever rolling your week into the HPP



Me: "So looks like this whole experience began and ends with bald-faced lies."

I'm not shy to call liars liars.  I don't care how much it affronts them.


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## ScoopKona (May 6, 2022)

Ty1on said:


> Me: "So looks like this whole experience began and ends with bald-faced lies."
> 
> I'm not shy to call liars liars.  I don't care how much it affronts them.



When I worked in Key West, liars were fired. There were also specific instructions not to pitch as an investment, or any of the other cockamamie things salespeople say. We didn't do any price drops, either. Our broker sat in the room and listened in on every conversation at once. And if he heard something he didn't like, he'd walk over and drop the hammer on the offending salesperson.

Sad that Hyatt has fallen into the realm of "just another crimeshare company."


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## dsmrp (May 6, 2022)

When we did a presentation last year May, we had a reasonable salesperson, who had also been a real estate agent.  However the sales mtg at the table next to us was pretty vocal and more contentious.  My husband said he couldn't help hearing and was surprised at the tone of that salesperson.  The manager was definitely around, but as they were to our backs, couldn't tell if she or another person intervened.  

I have no doubt they were selling some 660 pt contracts, but not anywhere near 90% as they say.  At nearly $20/pt, an 1100 pt contract is around $22K.  If we're not biting at $13K why would we want to pay more?  There were few Pinon Pt weeks in the trust last year; a lot more from Windward Pt & Wild Oak.
And MF was about $1/pt, so $1100 for 1100 pts ??

You have to convert your whole unit to Portfolio in order to effectively use the 660/1100 pts. And then you lose your home-fixed unit priority, unless you pay 70 pts to specify your unit.  I was pretty picky on what unit-building we purchased, so didn't feel good about that 'feature'.

I am good with using my resale home week, when Marriott tries to integrate HPP after Vistana.


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## Kal (May 6, 2022)

NWTRVLRS said:


> We are currently at Pinon Pointe for 2 weeks... prior to arrival we were contacted about doing our 'Owner Update' and they advised that there is new information we will want to know about _(ya-da, ya-da, ya-da)_... we confirmed and showed up at our appointed time.
> 
> To say that our salesperson, who we have met with before, was rude is an understatement... I won't get into all the back and forth sales tactics _(that we all know)_, but here are the salient points:
> 
> ...


We recently attended the Maui presentation.  The huckster said they were sooooo happy that they didn't have to sell Portfolio as they hated it.  It was entirely selling weeks at HKB.  The only item that sparks my interest is that they are hawking only 1100 points rather than 660.  I wonder if there's any truth to it???


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## RunCat (May 6, 2022)

What surprises me more than anything is that, from my limited understanding, one is not gaining anything from the HPP program; there isn’t any new exclusive inventory et al.  Instead one is just trading a valued week ownership for something else  and paying forth the privilege.

FWIW, I, likewise, have gotten the “why are you here?“ numerous times.


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## Kal (May 6, 2022)

I would love to engage the huckster at Pinon!  That would be worth the price they paid for me to attend.  A wonderful sporting event where one could tie the huckster up in his own web.  Maybe even have him write down his claims and sign it.  Then ask for the top manager to come to the room and review all the nonsense with him.  Then have him sign for what he claims.  Would they EVER sign something??? Not on your life for fear of what I might do with the document   Unfortunately, they would escort me to the door ASAP.

I never tell the huckster I'm not buying, but continue to bait him to try to sell.  At first I just come across as a naive sucker with lots of money who just doesn't understand things.  A Columbo type.


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## NWTRVLRS (May 6, 2022)

Kal said:


> We recently attended the Maui presentation.  The huckster said they were sooooo happy that they didn't have to sell Portfolio as they hated it.  It was entirely selling weeks at HKB.  The only item that sparks my interest is that they are hawking only 1100 points rather than 660.  I wonder if there's any truth to it???


We really don't even know for sure... we didn't even let him get to the point where he did the upside-down math in front of us, offering option 1 - option 2, etc... he just threw that out there as the only thing he could do... and we weren't buying what he said - nor buying the HPP


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## NWTRVLRS (May 6, 2022)

RunCat said:


> What surprises me more than anything is that, from my limited understanding, one is not gaining anything from the HPP program; there isn’t any new exclusive inventory et al.  Instead one is just trading a valued week ownership for something else  and paying forth the privilege.
> 
> FWIW, I, likewise, have gotten the “why are you here?“ numerous times.


First time for us! But I think Tuggers could come up with a collection of impressive/snarky responses - LOL!!!


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## ScoopKona (May 6, 2022)

NWTRVLRS said:


> First time for us! But I think Tuggers could come up with a collection of impressive/snarky responses - LOL!!!



Do what I do. "No, I do not want to attend an 'update.' Furthermore, there is nothing you can give me which is worth my time."


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## alexadeparis (May 8, 2022)

There is NO WAY that 90% of legacy owners bought into HPP.


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## youknowthenight (May 8, 2022)

LOL at the salesperson getting pissed that you're aware the owners meeting line is a scam and you're wasting their time. I use to engage with these guys on their BS but now I just play dumb and try to get out ASAP.


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## RunCat (May 8, 2022)

youknowthenight said:


> LOL at the salesperson getting pissed that you're aware the owners meeting line is a scam and you're wasting their time. I use to engage with these guys on their BS but now I just play dumb and try to get out ASAP.



for the salesperson it is not a waste of time but a $0 tour that goes against their $/tour average. In this business maintaining a high sales$/tour is essential (fwiw it is usually a rolling average.)


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## CalGalTraveler (May 8, 2022)

This is helpful. We are not Hyatt owners but have a discounted stay plus presentation coming up. Can they sell deeds? Can they sell Maui? If not, if we say that we only buy deeds and would only consider Maui would that release us from the presentation sooner?


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## NWTRVLRS (May 8, 2022)

alexadeparis said:


> There is NO WAY that 90% of legacy owners bought into HPP.


Agreed! As the week went on, we did not meet a single person who owned HPP!


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## Tucsonadventurer (May 8, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> This is helpful. We are not Hyatt owners but have a discounted stay plus presentation coming up. Can they sell deeds? Can they sell Maui? If not, if we say that we only buy deeds and would only consider Maui would that release us from the presentation sooner?


Only Maui sells deeds . Otherwise deeded weeks are resale


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## NWTRVLRS (May 8, 2022)

Forgot to add this when I started the thread... when we mentioned that since COVID they no longer have an owner meeting with the manager anymore (which we always loved)... he said... 

Wait for it..................

"There are no owners to attend... do you think a couple of people are just going to sit and have a meeting?"

In years past, we had ALWAYS had a robust crowd attend the manager's meeting! And we spoke to SO many owners while we were there! So obviously we are still around - LOL!

And did I mention that Pinon Point was more crowded than we had ever seen it during our deeded week timeframe?

And the day before checkout, we saw the notice had just been posted that manager's meetings were to begin this upcoming week at Pinon Pointe!


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## Kal (May 9, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> This is helpful. We are not Hyatt owners but have a discounted stay plus presentation coming up. Can they sell deeds? Can they sell Maui? If not, if we say that we only buy deeds and would only consider Maui would that release us from the presentation sooner?


There's a time criteria to get the gift so if you skip out early, no deal.  I would do time in the chair, then come up some feeble excuse why you can't do it now.  I use the one that I don't make a 5-digit financial decision in 20 minutes....PERIOD.  Then see if they will give you an "Access Package" maybe to Maui.  I went to the Maui presentation then a week later the offer for an "6-day Access Package to Maui" showed up.  

I would keep searching for a Maui resale.  There's lots of them out there.  Just do your homework so you know what to look for.


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## CalGalTraveler (May 9, 2022)

Kal said:


> There's a time criteria to get the gift so if you skip out early, no deal.  I would do time in the chair, then come up some feeble excuse why you can't do it now.  I use the one that I don't make a 5-digit financial decision in 20 minutes....PERIOD.  Then see if they will give you an "Access Package" maybe to Maui.  I went to the Maui presentation then a week later the offer for an "6-day Access Package to Maui" showed up.
> 
> I would keep searching for a Maui resale.  There's lots of them out there.  Just do your homework so you know what to look for.



Thank you for the informative response. Would love a Maui package because we own at the Westin Kaanapali and would love to extend our stay next year.  Do you know what size units they offer? Also are the packages good for up to one year?  I may time our Pinion stay around this.

When we went on our last Hyatt Maui package about 4 years ago they gave us a 2 bdrm...awesome! Love that resort.


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## Kal (May 9, 2022)

They are 2BR units.  The package is good for 2 years, but can be extended to 3 years.  As of now the price is $2999.  I asked if I could transfer it and they said no.  I'm thinking about passing on it.


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## Tucsonadventurer (May 9, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Thank you for the informative response. Would love a Maui package because we own at the Westin Kaanapali and would love to extend our stay next year.  Do you know what size units they offer? Also are the packages good for up to one year?  I may time our Pinion stay around this.
> 
> When we went on our last Hyatt Maui package about 4 years ago they gave us a 2 bdrm...awesome! Love that resort.


We bought a Hyatt Maui package for 2 bedroom 2499 and a Nanea 2 bedroom for 1995 . We added them to a 1 bedroom exchange at Hyatt Ka'anapali and a studio stay at north. We also got an Interval week in Maui. The packages are great when bringing family and friends


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## Mongoose (May 13, 2022)

NWTRVLRS said:


> Funny thing was that we met 4 other couples that night and NONE of them were in HPP… so where are these 90% they speak of??? LOL!


Its more like 20%


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## Mongoose (May 13, 2022)

Next time someone goes to one of these, ask to see the list of actual units HPP has at each resort.  Most resorts only have a few percent of total units.  I think at Pinion Point its 3% others have less.  So when they push the flexibility its based on very limited availability of units accept for San Antonio and maybe two others.  This is a few years old, but I'm not hearing many legacy owners taking the bait.  [HPC Contract Talk] Inventory - HRC and HPC Inventory as of June 2019 | Timeshare Users Group Discussion Forums (tugbbs.com)


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## Kal (May 13, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> Next time someone goes to one of these, ask to see the list of actual units HPP has at each resort.  Most resorts only have a few percent of total units.  I think at Pinion Point its 3% others have less.  So when they push the flexibility its based on very limited availability of units accept for San Antonio and maybe two others.  This is a few years old, but I'm not hearing many legacy owners taking the bait.  [HPC Contract Talk] Inventory - HRC and HPC Inventory as of June 2019 | Timeshare Users Group Discussion Forums (tugbbs.com)


Not only the number of HPP units but the quality of those weeks.  Remember, HPP originally received stale inventory that Hyatt could not sell.  Given the Trust and Hyatt no longer selling weeks, those weeks will hang around like moldy bread.


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## hcarman (May 16, 2022)

NWTRVLRS said:


> $100 or 10,000 points… we opted for the$100


Smart that you opted for $100.  We opted for 10,000 points at our last “update” and it took 5 months and about 12 calls to get them.  What a hassle.  It was like they were hoping you would forget.


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## mjm1 (May 17, 2022)

We attended a sales presentation at Pinon Pointe this week and the sales rep said she didn’t have information regarding the number of units or seasons at resorts that are in the HPP.

We were offered a universal package or a Sedona package, both for 4 nights.

The universal package was for a 1BR at Sedona, San Antonio, Carmel or Bonita Springs. The cost was $995 plus $99 processing fee. It also included a room at the Hyatt Regency on Maui for an extra $800. There was no mention of the residence club on Maui. You also receive either a $125 certificate or 25k World of Hyatt points. Good for 18 months.

The Sedona package is a 1BR for 4 nights for the same base price. March, April, October and November cost an extra $300. You also receive 25k WoH points (although they marked it up to 48k) or $250 certificates. If you purchase during the presentation you are required to attend you receive 1,500 PP bonus on top of any other incentive for buying. Good for 18 months.

By the way, the rep we had was much better than the one described by the OP.

Best regards.

Mike


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## Mongoose (May 17, 2022)

mjm1 said:


> We attended a sales presentation at Pinon Pointe this week and the sales rep said she didn’t have information regarding the number of units or seasons at resorts that are in the HPP.
> 
> We were offered a universal package or a Sedona package, both for 4 nights.
> 
> ...


LOL, They are selling only HPP and they don't have any data on the units!? I hope you asked, why you should buy something they can't fully explain?

I assume the 1,500 PP bonus is for buying a contract rather than the promotional package.

Did they say anything about Welk/HVC?


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## mjm1 (May 17, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> LOL, They are selling only HPP and they don't have any data on the units!? I hope you asked, why you should buy something they can't fully explain?
> 
> I assume the 1,500 PP bonus is for buying a contract rather than the promotional package.
> 
> Did they say anything about Welk/HVC?



No, we didn’t say that directly, but certainly implied it. Yes, the 1,500 PP bonus is for buying a contract.

They did mention Welk as part of the part of the growth plan. I imagine there won’t be any organic growth in the near future, since they spent so much on acquiring Welk and will focus on rebranding those resorts and bringing them up to standard. The rep is familiar with the Welk property in Palm Springs (really in Cathedral City) and noted that it is the farthest away from Hyatt standards. As a former Welk owner, we absolutely agree with that assessment.

Best regards.

Mike


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## boraxo (May 17, 2022)

I don’t think $100 or 10k points would be enough to sit thru it though I value hotel points at .02. Too much aggravation.
I love the lie about never having a chance to convert again. Really? HRC will forgo $$$$ profit just because you hurt his feelings? Riiiight. Reminds me of the Marriott guy who said I would never receive another preview offer. They still come like clockwork every few month.


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## Tucsonadventurer (May 17, 2022)

boraxo said:


> I don’t think $100 or 10k points would be enough to sit thru it though I value hotel points at .02. Too much aggravation.
> I love the lie about never having a chance to convert again. Really? HRC will forgo $$$$ profit just because you hurt his feelings? Riiiight. Reminds me of the Marriott guy who said I would never receive another preview offer. They still come like clockwork every few month.


You can negotiate . They went to 150 for us, we still declined but don't forget to ask for what your time is worth


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## Mongoose (May 17, 2022)

Tucsonadventurer said:


> You can negotiate . They went to 150 for us, we still declined but don't forget to ask for what your time is worth


$150 is my minimum and then I have to feel they will have something interesting to say.


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