# Brand New - Tried to Recind, 1 day late. Any advice ?



## RadWagon (Aug 7, 2019)

Cant blame anyone else. Its my own fault.
Bought from a developer.
126,000 Points.

I don't hate the product, I just wish I found the resale market before it was too late.

Haven't paid anything more than the down payment so far.

I could walk and take the hit on foreclosure. ( almost seems like best option based on stories I have read here) Exit companies ALL sound worthless with some doing nothing more than me not paying.

One lawyer came up in my search that appears legit, might do a consult with her. (Susan M. Budowski) Seems like that's 4-6k based on searches.

I know I cant give it back unless I pay it off.
Any advice ?


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## CPNY (Aug 7, 2019)

@Grammarhero knows a lot.


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## capital city (Aug 7, 2019)

Did you mail the rescind anyway? I would, they may not block it if it's only a day late. Keep in mind it's the day you mail it not the day they receive it.


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## Braindead (Aug 7, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> Cant blame anyone else. Its my own fault.
> Bought from a developer.
> 126,000 Points.
> 
> ...


DO NOT PAY ANY LAWYER
If you have the $4-$6k to pay a lawyer, put that towards what you owe.
Or walk away taking a possible hit on your credit score.

If you like the Wyndham product & can afford it, the best advice is to keep it enjoying your vacations. Read & ask questions here on how to get the most out of your ownership!!
Lesson learned & buy resale if you want more points down the road.
Unless your going for VIP stay with resales in the future


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## jwalk03 (Aug 7, 2019)

Mail the recession anyway!!  It just might work, and the only thing you have to lose is the cost of a letter!


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## jwalk03 (Aug 7, 2019)

If the recession doesn't work- and you like the product, and can afford it.  Just chalk that cost up as a loss, and lesson learned, and pay off the loan ASAP to avoid the additional lost interest charges.  Learn to use the product- though 126K points is not a lot.  Whatever you do- DONT pay an exit company, & DONT pay a lawyer!  You will just be throwing more money away.


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## Passepartout (Aug 7, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> Cant blame anyone else. Its my own fault.
> Bought from a developer.
> 126,000 Points.
> 
> ...


My read here is that you like the product, but not the price. And that it won't cause you hardship to pay it off. So pay it off, join TUG, and LEARN TO USE IT!

Half of TUGgers bought our first timeshares at retail from the developer, so you're in good company. The reasons you saw to buy are still valid. And timesharing is probably not the only way you vacation. You'll find out that you can lower the total cost of your TSs by just buying more on the resale market. 

Don't hire a lawyer. They don't have any magic words or potions to make a purchase 'go way'. All they can do is offer it for sale, and nobody will buy it if there is a mortgage. Then they charge you more money to keep advertising it, and you still own and pay maintenance fees.

Welcome to TUG. Send a rescission letter- even though a day late. It might work, but if it doesn't, take solace in owning a good product and providing your family with great vacation memories.

Jim


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## Braindead (Aug 7, 2019)

If your 100% sure your going to walk away & you’re not paying another dime to Wyndham.
I’d send a notarized certified letter saying so in the next 30 days

I’m not a lawyer but that might stop a foreclosures as Wyndham will most likely not have the deed filed in the next 30 days.
They might report the non payment, that will hit your credit score but you might avoid any foreclosure filed against you


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## Grammarhero (Aug 7, 2019)

@CPNY 

Out of ten (10) documented MF or TS loan foreclosures on TUG, six (6) got reported to the credit agencies.

For Wyndham, out of three (3) foreclosures (one, 1 loan and two, 2 MF foreclosures), none got reported to the credit agencies.

For TS loan foreclosures, two (2) out of three (3) got reported to the credit agencies.  The one that didn’t was Wyndham.


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## dgalati (Aug 7, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> Cant blame anyone else. Its my own fault.
> Bought from a developer.
> 126,000 Points.
> 
> ...


A lawyer can only cost 6k more. Resulting in another costly bad decision.


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## RadWagon (Aug 7, 2019)

I did send the letter, I actually thought I was inside the 10 days when I mailed it. I was a day late. I already got an official reply " We can not honor your request as it was postmarked after the required 10 day period"
They go on to say " While we understand your desire, please contact us for other options we may be able to provide" something like that. Pretty darn sure WHATEVER they have to offer IS NOT going to be an exit.
Probably just encourage me to pay it off and give it back to Ovations.

I like the statistics Grammarhero. Seems like my chances are good it wouldn't hit my credit.
Yes, I can afford it - I cant pay it off today, but maybe over a year. 
No, I never intended to sell it. I didn't buy thinking 'this is an investment' We have friends with DVC, and they are very happy. I was happy with the idea.
It just didn't occur to me to look at resale before my 10 days were up. Now I see that I overpaid by about 15k. Its frustrating.


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## LisaH (Aug 7, 2019)

I"m sorry to hear. Please stick around and learn how to get the most out of your timeshare. We have a lot of collective wisdom here


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## Free2Roam (Aug 7, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> Now I see that I overpaid by about 15k. Its frustrating.



You're in good company... a lot of us paid developer prices first. Stick around and absorb all you can to get the most benefit from your purchase.


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## Aurelius (Aug 7, 2019)

I’d send a backdated recision letter by every channel I could find to every address I could find. Fax. Email. Different people will receive it and maybe 1 will let it slip by. Don’t admit to sending it late. You may get lucky.


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## Passepartout (Aug 7, 2019)

Aurelius said:


> I’d send a backdated recision letter by every channel I could find to every address I could find. Fax. Email. Different people will receive it and maybe 1 will let it slip by. Don’t admit to sending it late. You may get lucky.


The OP has already received a letter denying their rescission. So it's no longer just one day late. They tried. Nice thought, though.


RadWagon said:


> I did send the letter, I actually thought I was inside the 10 days when I mailed it. I was a day late. I already got an official reply " We can not honor your request as it was postmarked after the required 10 day period"
> They go on to say " While we understand your desire, please contact us for other options we may be able to provide" something like that. Pretty darn sure WHATEVER they have to offer IS NOT going to be an exit.
> Probably just encourage me to pay it off and give it back to Ovations.
> 
> ...


RadWagon, you may be closer to reducing the overall price of entry than you knew. That 126,000 points won't get you much vacation where you want to go. I'm not a Wyndham owner, but having been around TUG for a while, it occurs to me that it tales somewhere close to 180K for a 1 BR for a week in high season and obviously more for a bigger unit. So adding some of those resale points to add to your stash might be on your horizon.

Jim


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## cbyrne1174 (Aug 7, 2019)

If you are stuck with the contract, but like the resorts, you already spent more than half of what it costs to be a VIP Gold member by using PIC plus. VIP Gold pays for itself in 10-15 years if you can actually use 700,000 points in a year. It's mostly for people who like weekend getaways less than 45 days out, or single night stays less than 14 days out. The value is getting 35% off 60 days out with unit upgrades when available.

For example, if you live near Bonnet Creek and want to go to Disney frequently for the weekend, but don't feel like driving home, you could book a single night in a 1 bedroom deluxe and get easily upgraded to a 2 bedroom deluxe and only have to pay 65% of the price of the 1 bedroom deluxe. VIP Gold members get free reservation transactions and unlimited housekeeping. That is where the value is in buying retail. To put it in dollar amount, that would be about $65 for a Saturday night in the Value season if you book less than 14 days out. I'm using this as an example because that is my thought process for possibly making a retail purchase in the future.

The trick to getting a cheap VIP Gold account is buying 210,000 CWA points retail via telesales for about $27,000 after having two 3 bedroom RCI weeks deeds in your name and registering those deeds for an extra 508,000 points. If you want VIP Gold, you will have to pay more than the $27,000 because you probably paid $170-$210 per thousand points instead of the $130 per thousand that Telesales charges. 700,000 sounds like a lot of points, but it is easy to rent out your extra points if you have a VIP gold account because of the point discount and extra guest certificates.

If VIP Gold sounds like something you would want, you are only out of the amount you spent over $130 per thousand, which I'm guessing is $5,000-$10,000 instead of the full amount you paid. I personally paid only a few hundred dollar for my resale points. I have 497,000 annual points at low maintenance fee resorts ($4.87 per thousand before the program fee), but it took me 6 months of stalking EBay/Tugg to get my contracts that cheap. Your purchase is worthless unless you want VIP Gold benefits. 

I would personally do 1 of 2 things:

1. Default on the loan if VIP Gold isn't for me

2. Buy another 105,000 points via telesales for about $13,000 AFTER I found two REALLY low maintenance 3 bedroom PIC weeks that I can enroll to get the VIP Gold benefits. The deeds must already be in your name before the purchase. If you really take the time to find cheap PIC weeks ($800 per year), that would be 739,000 annual points a year for about $3,000 a year in maintenance fees.


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## easyrider (Aug 7, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> I did send the letter, I actually thought I was inside the 10 days when I mailed it. I was a day late. I already got an official reply " We can not honor your request as it was postmarked after the required 10 day period"
> They go on to say " While we understand your desire, please contact us for other options we may be able to provide" something like that. Pretty darn sure WHATEVER they have to offer IS NOT going to be an exit.
> Probably just encourage me to pay it off and give it back to Ovations.
> 
> ...



If it is this close I would dispute their timing and file complaints to the BBB, Attorney General Office and the resort. 

Bill


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## Grammarhero (Aug 8, 2019)

@RadWagon 

If you do decide to let the Wyndham loan go into foreclosure, please kindly let us know the outcome and, if any, affect on your credit score.  Your response is helpful for other Ts owners running into unfortunate circumstances. 

The three (3) Wyndham owners sharing their own foreclosures and lack of affect on their own credit score might have been helpful to you.


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## CPNY (Aug 8, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> I did send the letter, I actually thought I was inside the 10 days when I mailed it. I was a day late. I already got an official reply " We can not honor your request as it was postmarked after the required 10 day period"
> They go on to say " While we understand your desire, please contact us for other options we may be able to provide" something like that. Pretty darn sure WHATEVER they have to offer IS NOT going to be an exit.
> Probably just encourage me to pay it off and give it back to Ovations.
> 
> ...


Don’t fret, you’re not the only one. I bought developer price at the Atlantis all those years ago. I have a better one for you. I paid 850 bucks to a broker to handle the sale when I found the buyer. Not only are maint fees so high, the closing is insane. I had to offer to pay half. In the process I picked up other ownerships resale and actually make it work for me. It’s all ok, just pick up more Wyndham points in Orlando for free to offset the purchase


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## bogey21 (Aug 8, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> They go on to say " While we understand your desire, please contact us for other options we may be able to provide" something like that. Pretty darn sure WHATEVER they have to offer IS NOT going to be an exit.



I'd make the phone call.  Who knows what they will say.  If they try to talk you into spending more money just tell them "thanks but no thanks"...

George


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## RadWagon (Aug 8, 2019)

I'm going to call... I'll write a couple letters. We actually signed and dated the document on the 10th day. Just didn't mail it till the following day.
I could argue the intent was clearly defined within the period of recession, but the letter of the law ( and the contract ) clearly states 'by the post mark'
I mailed the letter to two different addresses, but I doubt I'll see a second response from them.

We are a young family, and my credit is great right now. I don't anticipate any particular need for credit usage in the immediate future, but within 5 years we will probably sell and buy a different home, and maybe a car. It seems like Russian roulette with my Credit. Even if Wyndham chooses not to report, My research says the credit bureau COULD find it in public record. A non-judicial foreclosure maybe not, but this is not my area of expertise.
Bottom line - its a gamble, I don't need that looming over my head in 5 years. Considering I'd still be willing to go buy it again <RESLAE> I'm basically left with the question ' Is being taken for 15k worth MAYBE screwing my Credit up for 7 years. I THINK the answer is no. But still on the fence.
IF I had a lawyer dig into it and argue over the dated letter and the 1 day late post mark.... I'd be thrilled if 4-6k of legal fees got it to go away. But again, No guarantee.


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## cbyrne1174 (Aug 8, 2019)

126K points for $15,000 isn't bad. If you are interested in the product, seriously consider VIP Gold via PIC plus. I'm 30 years old and if I could afford a 27k purchase, I would do it because it's cheaper in the long run with VIP benefits the way that I personally want to vacation with a lot of short stays less than 60 days out. I haven't heard of a single VIP Gold member that got their status for under 30k be unhappy with their purchase.


Also, resale buyers can't stay in the Worldmark properties. A retail purchase doubles the amount of resorts you can stay at.


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## LisaH (Aug 8, 2019)

In the grand scheme of things, $15K is not too bad. Most of us spent at least that much (or more) with our first purchase from developer, then we learned to use the system and added more resales to our portfolio. Most of us are happy with our purchase(s). 
Perhaps you can negotiate with Wyndham to give you certain period of time to include your future resale purchase for elite status qualification? Might as well give it a try...


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## Braindead (Aug 8, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> Considering I'd still be willing to go buy it again <RESLAE> I'm basically left with the question ' Is being taken for 15k worth MAYBE screwing my Credit up for 7 years. I THINK the answer is no. But still on the fence.


If you walk away there’s a very good chance you’ll be banned from even buying resale for life.

From everything thing you’ve said I highly recommend paying off your loan as soon as you can.

Ounce your loan is paid, then you can decide whether you want to go with resale or take cyberns advice for additional points

So pay it off & start enjoying your ownership!!


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## Richelle (Aug 8, 2019)

If you can pay it off do it. I do not regret any of my purchase, both resale and retail. Consider it as an expensive lesson learned, and do a lot of studying so you can get the most bang for your buck. There is nothing wrong with retail. You do get Club Pass reservations, RCI nightly stays (allows you to book at select RCI resorts for less then a week for a smaller fee), and Plus Partners. You would get those if you only owned resales. 

If you can afford to do it before the changes take effect in late 2020, buy another 49,000 (around $12k), and enroll a three bedroom fixed/float week into PIC Plus. That will get you an additional 303,000 points (for $12k total) on top of your 126,000. If you do it before the changes, that will get you VIP silver and grandfathered into the new program with your current benefits plus new ones. If you want Gold, you can enroll two PICs and buy 98,000. I know 105,000 goes for about $16k. Silver is good, but Gold gives you unlimited reservation transaction credits, 9 months to move points forward, RARP (book outside your home resort 11 months from check in), and better discounts and upgrade priority. Might be worth the extra $4k if you can afford the maintenance fees on two Fixed/float timeshare weeks.   

Of course, if you won’t use the VIP benefits, it’s not worth spending the extra money. It’s all in how you use it and how much value you place on having those benefits.  


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## rickandcindy23 (Aug 8, 2019)

If it hits your credit, write a letter to the credit bureau, telling them you were swindled, cheated, lied to, etc., and maybe it would save your credit.  

I know for a fact that timeshare payments are not looked upon as a debt that is "important" to the credit agencies.  I know because I once wrote a letter for someone else, who couldn't put a two sentences together that make sense.  It was successful, and the couple never paid another dime and still bought their dream house.


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## RadWagon (Nov 25, 2019)

Update : ( Cant believe it took this long )
I contacted 'Customer Care' who opened a case. 
They were very slow to respond, but eventually someone in 'Owner Care' did reach out. 

They were very specific about knowing exactly why I wanted to cancel. They asked about certain statements being made or not made by the sales person. 
It seemed like a " Did we follow all the rules, might he hire an attorney". 

I was just plain honest. I didnt make up anything or tell them anything outrageous - But I was firm. I said " When I raised concern over the rate of financing, the sales person said " I would get a personal loan and immediately pay this off to avoid the outrageous interest rate. "  I told them the sales person claimed I could sell the Time Share- and I considered both of those statements lies of omission because No bank will lend to payoff a time share, and I CANT sell it until paid off.  I also noted that while attempting to cancel I received countless phone calls asking me to buy MORE, and the cancellation 'team' was taking weeks to respond to my contact.  And concluded by stating I was ripped off for thousands of dollars because the resale value was no where near retail. < by that point, I know my voice was raised and shaking cuz I was pretty pissed> 

I recall the rep was silent for a moment, then she said " well, please know that we are going to do everything we can for you..." I cut her off. <still angry> and said " Dont bullshit me, your job is to keep people paying, we both know that. So your going to review my statements, and maybe the signing that you video taped, and determine if there is anything I can legally dispute."

I dont know if it was the statements I made, or the tone, or the fact I only had 2k paid in, or that my recession was 24 hours late, or that my use year would not even start for another 2 months BUT : 
Two weeks later, I got a call back stating I would be granted a full refund, and TODAY that refund hit my bank account.


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## silentg (Nov 25, 2019)

Glad it worked out for you!


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## Grammarhero (Nov 25, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> Update : ( Cant believe it took this long )
> I contacted 'Customer Care' who opened a case.
> They were very slow to respond, but eventually someone in 'Owner Care' did reach out.
> 
> ...


Congrats.  What was the purchase price of your TS?  Glad it worked out for you.


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## Grammarhero (Nov 25, 2019)

@TUGBrian @DeniseM check out this feel-good story about an owner who got a refund and rescission despite being one day late.


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## TUGBrian (Nov 25, 2019)

very happy to read about another successful rescission!  it never hurts to TRY!


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## Grammarhero (Nov 26, 2019)

TUGBrian said:


> very happy to read about another successful rescission!  it never hurts to TRY!


And to think Wesley and other TS companies were charging OP $4k to $6k for something the OP did himself.


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## klpca (Nov 26, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> Update : ( Cant believe it took this long )
> I contacted 'Customer Care' who opened a case.
> They were very slow to respond, but eventually someone in 'Owner Care' did reach out.
> 
> ...



Good for you for being persistent. Glad that they sent you a refund. You are proof that it can happen!


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## rickandcindy23 (Nov 26, 2019)

I am so happy for you @RadWagon


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## bobinmich (Nov 26, 2019)

RadWagon said:


> Update : ( Cant believe it took this long )
> I contacted 'Customer Care' who opened a case.
> They were very slow to respond, but eventually someone in 'Owner Care' did reach out.
> 
> ...


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## HitchHiker71 (Nov 26, 2019)

...deleted...


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## dgalati (Nov 26, 2019)

HitchHiker71 said:


> If you had genuine intent to rescind and missed the deadline by one day, I would clearly state your case to the CEO michael.brown@wyn.com and send a scanned copy of the official reply along with it.  Worst case is his office will align with the official response, best case is he will grant an exception given your intent.  It's worth a try IMHO.


WYNDHAM ALREADY SENT ALL HIS MONEY BACK AND CANCELLED THE SALE.


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## bobinmich (Nov 27, 2019)

You got VERY lucky...


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## bogey21 (Nov 27, 2019)

bobinmich said:


> You got VERY lucky...


A little bit of luck and a lot of persistence...

I accomplished 3 Deed Backs in my lifetime.  None were accomplished without many, many phone calls...

George


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## Grammarhero (Nov 27, 2019)

bobinmich said:


> You got VERY lucky...


His luck began with posting on TUG.  By himself, he did was Wesley charged $4k to do.


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## dgalati (Nov 27, 2019)

Grammarhero said:


> His luck began with posting on TUG.  By himself, he did was Wesley charged $4k to do.


Who is Wesley?


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## paxsarah (Nov 27, 2019)

dgalati said:


> Who is Wesley?


https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/wesley-financial.280209/


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## dgalati (Nov 27, 2019)

paxsarah said:


> https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/wesley-financial.280209/


Thanks Paxsarah!


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## Grammarhero (Nov 27, 2019)

dgalati said:


> Who is Wesley?


A TS exit outfit purporting to be consumer activists, but banned me when I told their potential customers about Diamond Transitions and Wyndham Ovations.


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## dgalati (Nov 27, 2019)

Grammarhero said:


> A TS exit outfit purporting to be consumer activists, but banned me when I told their potential customers about Diamond Transitions and Wyndham Ovations.


You didnt? Lol


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## Grammarhero (Nov 27, 2019)

dgalati said:


> You didnt? Lol


Sure did.  Check out the screenshots.


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## dgalati (Nov 27, 2019)

Grammarhero said:


> Sure did.  Check out the screenshots.


Nice I love the way you helped them save 4k


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## AnnaS (Dec 1, 2019)

Excellent!!! Great news to hear.  Congrats!


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