# Newbie HGVC Question re: how many points to buy



## korndoc (Jan 1, 2007)

I have been reading about HGVC in TUG and elsewhere.  It seems that while 7000 points is the most commonly recommended # of points to buy, and most readily available, some of the newer HGVC resorts have weeks that would cost 8400 and even 9600 points.  So I was thinking I should probably buy a resort with 8400 to not be eliminated from trading into some of the newer resorts Hilton may be developing.

But what do I do with extra points if I own 8400 and only use 4800 or 7000?

Thanks

Jeff


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## travel girl 2 (Jan 1, 2007)

*Suggestion...*

Someone once said they put one year of points into Hilton Honors and then use the other year...not the best use of points since you have to convert all the points. Or you could by 2 smaller contracts and convert one and use the other or bank points forward and go for longer.


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## Sir Newf (Jan 1, 2007)

Hi- Happy New Year!
You might want to speak with or email, a resell broker for HGVC- Seth Nock at www.sellingtimeshares.net was very helpful to me.  I found him to be low pressure, and has an incredible amount of knowledge of HGVC. Even if you don't buy anything, he can help you with the fine details of the program. Enjoy....


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## Steve (Jan 1, 2007)

Jeff,

You could buy two gold weeks at one of the Hilton Affiliate resorts in Southwest Florida for far less than it would cost you to purchase one 8400 point platinum week (or even one 7000 point platinum week) at a Hilton developed resort.  With the two gold weeks you would have a higher maintenance fee bill, but you would have 10,000 points every year and tremendous flexibility.

Steve


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## korndoc (Jan 2, 2007)

Steve,

But won't the Gold weeks have less trading power if I trade in SFX?  

I am confused, why would 2 5000 point properties give me more flexibility?

Finally, you are suggesting I purchase an affiliate resort rather than a Hilton developed resort.  On another thread, I had been advised (by Bill, if you are reading this) that perhaps there is more risk buying a Hilton affiliated resort because Hilton, like Marriott, could decide to disaffiliate it.  Granted this has never happened but Marriott has done it, so certainly Hilton could.  They would be less likely to drop one of the resorts they developed.

Tavel Girl,   What I meant by my question was: what do I do with any extra points should I only need 4800 points for a vacation but still have 2200 points left over from a 7000 point time share?  Can they be saved for the following year, or cashed in for HHonors points?  

Thanks and Happy New Year to both of you, 

Jeff


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## Bill4728 (Jan 2, 2007)

korndoc said:
			
		

> On another thread, I had been advised (by Bill, if you are reading this) that perhaps there is more risk {there is a risk but IMHO, it is very low}/Bill  buying a Hilton affiliated resort because Hilton, like Marriott, could decide to disaffiliate it. Granted this has never happened but Marriott has done it, so certainly Hilton could.


Jeff,

Yes I read this. LOL  

You must make this decision for yourself. 

If your buying a car: you can buy new from a dealer, used from a dealer, used from a private party. Each new option saves you more money but adds risk to the deal. The same is true buying into HGVC. 

You could buy from HGVC (but the cost/risk isn't worth it). Buy the lowest cost HGVC resort resale (maybe the best cost/risk) or buy an affiliate (even better cost/ still low risk). Personally, IMHO, I'd buy the Bay Club (you said Hawaii was an important location for you) which you could get for a little less than LV or Orlando and if HGVC disaffiliates, you'd still have a wonderful resort in Hawaii. 

But if you're one of the guys which would never buy a used car from a private party, maybe you'd be better off buying a low cost resale in LV or Orlando.


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## PigsDad (Jan 2, 2007)

korndoc said:


> Steve,
> 
> But won't the Gold weeks have less trading power if I trade in SFX?



No.  The concept of "gold" weeks is different in HGVC.  It only has to do with how many points you get.  For example, a gold week 2BR unit is 5000 points.  You could use those points to reserve a platinum 1BR week (4800 points), and deposit that with SFX.  Or you could borrow points from next year to reserve a 2BR platinum week for 7000 points and deposit that with SFX.



korndoc said:


> I am confused, why would 2 5000 point properties give me more flexibility?



I think they were just trying to say that 10,000 points will give you more flexibility / opportunity than 7000 or 8400 points, for the same or less purchase price.



korndoc said:


> What I meant by my question was: what do I do with any extra points should I only need 4800 points for a vacation but still have 2200 points left over from a 7000 point time share?  Can they be saved for the following year, or cashed in for HHonors points?
> 
> Jeff



I believe (I am a new HGVC owner, so I am still learning) that you can roll leftover points into RCI points, which can then be used within 2(?) years.  Also, before Jan. 1 of each year, you can "bank" your upcoming year's points to the following year, and then you can borrow points from the future year to make reservations.

For example, if you owned 7000 points, before Dec 31 2006 you could bank your 2007 points into 2008 for $69, I think.  You can always borrow (without a fee) from next year's points to make a reservation.  That means you would have 14,000 points available for you to make reservations in 2007.  If you didn't use any of those points, you would loose nothing at the end of 2007, since those points were already banked into 2008.  However, you would have to do something with those 2007 points by the end of 2008.


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## Steve (Jan 2, 2007)

Hi Jeff,

I don't feel that there is much risk of the Southwest Florida resorts on Sanibel and Marco being dropped by Hilton.  They are in an extremely high demand area.  I think there is more risk that the Scottish properties would leave the system than the Southwest Florida locations.  But I think the risk for any of this is low.  Hilton has a different business plan than Marriott does.  Hilton is much more comfortable with managing resorts it has not built.

As for two gold weeks worth 10,000 points giving you more flexibility than one 8400 point platinum week, this is true for many reasons.  With my two weeks, I can exchange one with RCI and use the other for HGVC stays.  Or I can exchange one with II and one with RCI.  Or exchange one with SFX and one with II.  Or one with SFX and one with RCI.  Or I can rent one and use the other.  Or I can combine all of the points and have 10,000.  Owning two separate weeks gives you a lot more options than just owning one week with the same number of points...unless you are ONLY going to use your points for HGVC stays each year.  If you are ever going to rent one of your weeks, use your owned week, or exchange through II or SFX...then you have more options with more than one week.  

For example, if you buy an 8400 week from HGVC for $25,000 and you decide to use it in 2007, then you've spent $25,000 and you have a one week vacation.  That's it for this year.

In contrast, if you buy two 5000 point weeks resale for $6500 each, then you have spent $13,000 (a savings of $12,000).  If you decide to use one of your weeks in 2007, you have that one week vacation.  But...unlike above...you aren't done for the year...you still have one week left. You can rent it, exchange it through II, exchange it through RCI, exchange it through SFX, convert it to HHonors points, or use the 5000 points for stays at other HGVC resorts.  So you have a lot more flexibility...and at lower initial cost...than the guy who bought a single 8400 point week.

Steve


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## korndoc (Jan 3, 2007)

Oh My....do I ever have a lot to learn! 

I know Marriott and the other traditional timeshares like the back of my hand, having read so much on TUG for several years... 

But I am just getting my feet wet with a point system, such as Hilton.  

Thank you Steve and PigsDad.  I really need to sort all this out.

And Bill, thanks so much.  

Jeff


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## misternick (Jan 3, 2007)

*I am missing something*

Steve, I'm also relatively new with HGVC. I am clearly misunderstanding your examples. 

The way I am reading your examples leaves me with the impression that advantage for having two 5K's over one 8.4K (other than the obvious cost savings) is that you can do two different things with each of your 5k points.  But don't you have the same flexibility with the 8.4K points?  You can use some with RCI, some with HGVC, some with SFX....  Say for instance you banked your 2006 points to 2007 back in December 2005 (I think that's the correct timeline).  In 2006 I would have 16.8K points available to do with as I please within the limits of HGVC's exchange partners.  Yes, it's more expensive, but I'm not seeing the advantage of owning two small HGVC's verses 1 Big HGVC (again, other than cost).

Please let me know where I have lost what your point was.  

Thanks


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## Steve (Jan 3, 2007)

Misternick,

Let me see if I can help clarify my point.  If you have an 8400 point week...or 7000 point week...and you choose to occupy the week you own during your home season at your home resort...then you are done for the year.  You have used up all of your points.

If you own two 5000 point weeks...and you choose to occupy one of your owned weeks during your home season at your home resort...then you still have your second week left over.  This gives you the opportunity with this 2nd week to rent, exchange, occupy, convert to HHonors points, etc.  Therefore, you can use one of your owned weeks and still have the 2nd week (5000 points).  

If you never, ever plan to stay at your home resort during your home season in your home unit size...then ignore the example above because it won't make any difference.  But if you do plan to stay where you own during your home season, then having two weeks gives you a lot more flexibility than one.

Another example:  if you want to exchange through II, then you have to buy at an affiliate resort that is dual affiliated with both RCI and II.  This is very important if you ever want to stay at Marriotts, Disney Resorts, Hyatts, or Four Seasons.  These chains exchange within II...you can't get them through HGVC or RCI.  And, for all practical purposes, you can't get them through SFX, either.  Just ask anyone who has tried!  

Since HGVC doesn't belong to II, you can't use points to exchange through II.  You have to use your whole week...regardless of how many points it is worth in HGVC...to exchange in II.  So, two 5000 point weeks give you much more flexibility than one higher point week.

For example, I have exchanged my Hurricane House week for a week in a 2 bedroom villa at Four Seasons Aviara in Carlsbad, CA in 2007.  Now I still have my Club Regency week left over.  It's worth 5000 points in HGVC.  I can convert it to HHonors points...or use the 5000 points for various HGVC stays...or take 4800 points and exchange for a red two bedroom week through RCI and have 200 points left over...or I can reserve my home week and exchange it through SFX...or I can reserve my home week and rent it...or I can reserve my home week and stay there at Club Regency.  

If I only owned one week, I couldn't have both my II exchange to the Four Seasons for my Hurricane House week AND all the options for my Club Regency week.  I could only have one or the other.  Plus...if I owned in an HGVC developed resort...I would never get into the Four Seasons because none of the HGVC developed resorts belong to II.  So my flexibility with two gold affiliate weeks is far greater than it would be with one HGVC built 8400 or 7000 point platinum week.

Steve


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## misternick (Jan 4, 2007)

*Your Advice*

Steve,  
   Thanks for that wonderful explanation.  Let me now seek your advice:  

Based on where I am currently positioned with two 7K (2BR Platinum) HGVC resorts, would it be better (best point for the buck and flexibility all around) in your opinion to add an HGVC affiliate that trades with II (and adds to my HGVC points), or acquire a strong trade that has a low cost per point ratio not affiliated with HGVC - or some other option?

My goal would be to provide the maximun resort availability options and exchange strength / bang for the buck - allowing me to exchange with II, Marriot, Disney.  It seems like an HGVC affiliate may be the answer due to existing point compatability with the 'extended exchange range' (and convenienience of managing my points via HGVC), but despite as much as I've learned on TUG over the past year, the more I realize this educational journey is just getting started.  

Someone should write a book specific to Hotel based timeshares with all the tips, traps, and techniques.

Thanks again.

Nick


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## Steve (Jan 4, 2007)

Hi Nick,

For maximum flexibility, an HGVC affiliate resort on Sanibel Island or Marco Island that is dual affiliated with both RCI and II is an excellent choice.  You'll have awesome trade power...however you choose to trade your week. 

Another option worth considering would be purchasing a Marriott week...if you plan to try to exchange into a lot of Marriott resorts during peak demand seasons.  Marriott owners have a 24 exchange priority into other Marriotts...so this can limit availability to all non-Marriott owners...even those with top trade power weeks.  

I really like Marriott resorts and enjoy owning a Marriott.  It is a rather rigid week-for-week system...but if that is okay with you...then Marriott offers a terrific product in awesome locations.  What you give up in flexibility is made up for in quality and variety of resorts.

Still another option is purchasing an inexpensive week with good trade power in II like Foxrun.  I used to own a couple of weeks there...and they traded very well considering the purchase price.  There is likely to be a special assessment in the near future, however, so it isn't as cheap to own as it used to be.  But I successfully traded a Foxrun week that I only paid $500 for into Marriott's Newport Coast Villas and Marriott's Manor Club.  So it was certainly a bargain.  I sold it, though, as I prefer owning resorts that are located where I like to vacation.

There are lots of choices.  It just depends on how and where you like to vacation...and if you are willing to learn more than one system.  

Steve


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## korndoc (Jan 9, 2007)

Steve said:


> if you buy two 5000 point weeks resale for $6500 each, then you have spent $13,000 (a savings of $12,000).  If you decide to use one of your weeks in 2007, you have that one week vacation.  But...unlike above...you aren't done for the year...you still have one week left. You can rent it, exchange it through II, exchange it through RCI, exchange it through SFX, convert it to HHonors points, or use the 5000 points for stays at other HGVC resorts.  So you have a lot more flexibility...and at lower initial cost...than the guy who bought a single 8400 point week.
> Steve



Steve,

I love your example of how to get the most out of the 10,000 points v.s. 8400 points at a single resort. Almost like having a Marriott lockout v.s. a single unit.   But it raises a few Newbie questions:  1. the MF on the 2 units will be higher than that for a single ts.  I guess the difference is made up by the savings on the initial purchase, right?   2.If I want to use one or both of the units for a trade into another HGVC resort, as you suggest, what can I get for just 5000 points if that is all I want to use at that time?  3. If this is a Gold rather than Platinum season, won't that affect trading power in SFX or II?  4. You traded your Hurricane House for Aviara.  Was this a difficult trade...were your surprised...or is this something you have come to expect with trading Hurricane House?  6. Which should I buy: a Sanibel Island Hilton Affiliate, or one on Marco Island?  And then, which ts? 

Thank you,

Jeff


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## Steve (Jan 11, 2007)

Hi Jeff,

You ask a lot of good questions.  First, the maintenance fees are going to be double if you have two weeks instead of one.  However, the huge difference in initial purchase price helps greatly to offset this.  It should be noted that there is a great variance in the maintenance fees of the various Hilton affiliate resorts in Southwest Florida.  For example, my Club Regency week is $750 while my Hurricane House week is $1100.  That's a big difference.

As for trade power with II, it's important to note that II does not use Hilton's platinum, gold, silver, bronze system.  II considers Sanibel Island in particular and, to a lesser extent, Marco Island, to be an extremely high demand location with very low supply.  Thus, you will have outstanding trade power for winter, spring, and summer weeks...somewhat less so for fall which is prime hurricane season.  The Hilton seasons are completely irrelevant to II.  What matters is a beachfront, high quality resort, with very high demand.

When it comes to SFX, you should have excellent trade power as well...regardless of the number of Hilton points your week is worth.  However, that is relative to what SFX has to offer.  In my personal opinion, SFX should NOT be used if your goal is to trade into branded resorts (Marriott, Hyatt, Westin, Sheraton, Four Seasons, Disney).  It's very hard to get an exchange into any of those chains through SFX.  If you're interested in independent resorts in Mexico or Hawaii...and/or if you aren't particular about which resort you stay at...but rather will accept anything they give you...then SFX would probably work very well for you.  It's important to have realistic expectations.  This doesn't work for me...as I like the chains and like to pick the resort I'm going to stay at...and that's why I don't use SFX.

As for trading Hurricane House into Four Seasons Aviara...that was an easy exchange.  I have been told by several longtime II employees that Hurricane House has absolutely top trade power...and I believe it.  This resort will trade into anything that is available.  

As for what where to buy...Sanibel or Marco...that's debatable.  Sanibel Island is my favorite of the two by far.  So for using my home week, I'm much more likely to stay on Sanibel Island than on Marco.  Sanibel also has better trade power as it is much harder to trade into than Marco.   

However, Marco still offers excellent trade power and is a better value.  More bang for the buck.  If you're buying just to trade, I think you are better off with Marco...or perhaps the less expensive Shell Island Beach Club on Sanibel. 

Hurricane House is the best of all possible worlds...but it's too expensive to purchase...and also has maintenance fees that are too expensive...if you're never going to go there.

A note of caution:  not all of the affiliates are dual affiliated.  For example, my Club Regency week is not affiliated with II and I can't exchange it through II.  The only Hilton resorts on Marco that are affiliated with II are Eagle's Nest and the Surf Club of Marco.  This was okay with me as both my Hurricane House week and my Marriott Manor Club week exchange within II...so I didn't care that Club Regency does not.  But if I were only going to buy one week, I'd make sure I bought at a resort that is dual affiliated.  (All of the Hilton affiliates on Sanibel are dual affiliated.)

Steve


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## korndoc (Jan 11, 2007)

Thank you Steve. Things are beginning to gel concerning HGVC and the affiliates.  
You didn't answer one of my questions.  If I want to use one or both of the units for a trade into another HGVC (or affiliated) resort, as you suggest, what can I get for just 5000 points if that is all I want to use at that time?

Jeff


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## Bill4728 (Jan 11, 2007)

At most HGVC locations, 5000 pts is a 2 bd during gold or a 1 bd during platinum season. NOTE, some locations don't have gold season and some don't have 1 bd units.


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## korndoc (Jan 12, 2007)

Bill,

Where can I see a list of which locations have which levels of gold v.s. platinum and which have 1 or 2 bedrooms?

Jeff


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