# Destination Club Forums -- Where Is It?



## DCTraveler

Does anyone know what happened to www.DestinationClubForums.com?

It has been down for a while saying it will be upgraded, but that's not how things usually work.  You don't pull the plug out until you are ready to flip the switch, right?


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## NeilGoBlue

right... something is wrong...

Anybody got any ideas?


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## RLG

The upgrade story is an obvious lie.

My guess would be that the destination club industry bought them out to shut up the people who posted the ugly truth about the industry.

Just imagine how much the ARDA would pay to get rid of TUG.


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## TarheelTraveler

There are good timeshare companies and bad timeshare companies.  Just like there are good destination clubs and bad destination clubs.

The beauty of these forums is while there is a lot of noise on them, a good amount of very helpful information is out there for folks that fortunately go beyond the slick brochures and websites.


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## DosMasCervesos

RLG said:


> My guess would be that the destination club industry bought them out to shut up the people who posted the ugly truth about the industry.


I sure hope that isn't the case, but I must say that is the most plausible explanation. For some reason, it seems someone (owner of DCF.com, someone buying DCF.com, etc.) wanted the content of the forum taken down.

I believe the owner (or previous owner) of DCF.com is a poster on TUG as well, so maybe he'll chime in here to offer an explanation?


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## Bourne

Word on the street is that the "upgrade" should be completed sometime this week. 

On a different note, there is light at the end of the tunnel on another pertinent issue. And the light is suprisingly bright. Keep chipping away at it.


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## RLG

Bourne said:


> Word on the street is that the "upgrade" should be completed sometime this week.




Should we take this as confirmation that the story that the site is down due to an "upgrade" was not entirely truthful per the "word on the street"?


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## pwrshift

I'm very surprised at how this 'upgrade' was announced ... after closing down the site, instead of announcing the changes when the bbs was active so members could know what was up.  I liked the administrator of the site and hope all is ok.

Brian


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## PerryM

*What's the big deal?*

Destination Clubs (DC's) are dead - finished - kaput.

The folks who had "pocket change" of $400k and could buy a membership have sadly learned a lesson - dreams are easy to sell; reality is another thing completely.

I predicted this debacle years ago here on TUG and the skeletal remains of the DC industry drag along like a zombie looking for a new meal.

Don't chuckle too loudly - the timeshare industry isn't that far behind.

Don't buy a DC or a timeshare in 2010 - under any circumstances.

The DC Forum may simply be revamping and might come out with something spectacular - who knows.  I sure wish them well and have admiration for the folks there who brought together hundreds of DC owners in a forum for debate.  Good luck guys.

As someone who runs 25+ websites, trust me when I say you guys need to monetize your efforts - freebie viewers are simply a pain in the butt...

If you want to discuss with me send me a PM - if not, I'm out of here...


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## Bourne

PerryM said:


> Destination Clubs (DC's) are dead - finished - kaput.
> ..
> ...
> Don't buy a DC or a timeshare in 2010 - under any circumstances.
> ...
> ....



You and I, my friend, are at different ends of the spectrum. Like I said before, it ain't over till the fat lady sings......but she gotta get over the indegistion first...


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## Bourne

RLG said:


> Should we take this as confirmation that the story that the site is down due to an "upgrade" was not entirely truthful per the "word on the street"?



The quotes were used for highlighting. No hidden meaning. Should have used bold. 

I have been acquainted with DC4MS for years and called him regarding the same a few days back. Was told that he is working on some upgrades but also has pressing issues on the day job front.


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## wdinner

*Too much time on your hands?*

Good to see the same folks with nothing else to do but try to find out what happened to the web site.   

But the site was very useful in the darkest hours of the PE/UE adventure.  If it doesn't resurrect itself soon it may be worthwhile starting it up here.

Bill


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## Torn and Frayed

wdinner said:


> Good to see the same folks with nothing else to do but try to find out what happened to the web site.
> 
> But the site was very useful in the darkest hours of the PE/UE adventure.  If it doesn't resurrect itself soon it may be worthwhile starting it up here.
> 
> Bill



Amen; I thought that by reading both the positves and the negatives posted at that site was most helpful and informative.


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## UnhappyInCT

RLG said:


> The upgrade story is an obvious lie.
> 
> My guess would be that the destination club industry bought them out to shut up the people who posted the ugly truth about the industry.
> 
> Just imagine how much the ARDA would pay to get rid of TUG.



Call me paranoid, but your suspicions may be true.  One potential culprit would be Jim Tousignant at Ultimate Escapes.  They were getting a lot of bad press from former members (like me) who got screwed in the assessment process last year.  Despite this influx of cash they are still bleeding red ink.  They are close to getting delisted from the NYSE and they are trying to raise $30 million of new capital to stave off extinction.  Shutting down a source of negative press that could spook potential investors would be something that, in my opinion, is plausible that JT would do.


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## Bourne

1ncentives said:


> Uncertain, what  Destination Club offered?  Was it a  Rental
> 
> Company..or ..Ownership?/Thankyou



Destination Club as a term that relates to an industry. Consider it a sub segment of the resorts/hospitality industry. Like others in the broad segment, it went through a big shakeup with some firms filing for bankruptcy.

The big kahunas in the order of membership are

www.exclusiveresorts.com
www.ultimateescapes.com
www.quintess.com
www.akresidenceclub.com
Destination M [link updated 4/25/17]


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## AKTHUE

*DestinationClubForums was probably threatened with a suit*



RLG said:


> The upgrade story is an obvious lie.
> 
> My guess would be that the destination club industry bought them out to shut up the people who posted the ugly truth about the industry.
> 
> Just imagine how much the ARDA would pay to get rid of TUG.



I found Destination Club Forums to be a very useful source of information and insight into several destination clubs. I agree with RLG that some of the companies probably did not like the information presented, nor having members be able to communicate with each other.

Rather than having been bought, I suspect that some club sent a ceast and desist letter, alleging slander or libel, and threatened to sue - and the operator, rather than pay for legal expenses, took it off the air.

It's really too bad as it would be a good place to discuss things like what is going on with UE's current offering.


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## PerryM

AKTHUE said:


> I found Destination Club Forums to be a very useful source of information and insight into several destination clubs. I agree with RLG that some of the companies probably did not like the information presented, nor having members be able to communicate with each other.
> 
> Rather than having been bought, I suspect that some club sent a ceast and desist letter, alleging slander or libel, and threatened to sue - and the operator, rather than pay for legal expenses, took it off the air.
> 
> It's really too bad as it would be a good place to discuss things like what is going on with UE's current offering.



This is the problem with forums open to the public where anyone can join - the owner of the website is responsible for every word said by every person there.  A lawsuit costs $25 to file and big bucks to deal with.

Hopefully the folks at DC Forums will make the new forum a paid subscription with a NDA with hefty fines.  Make the membership fee just $1 and you will be amazed how many crazies are kept out.  The folks who object to paying $1 are the same nuts who cause all the problems - good riddance to bad rubbish.

The NDA and a the state of the art web tools allow you to track every hit and IP address to the website - you can set up any conditions you want.

The DC world is infested with slick promoters who are unethical to begin with and have no problems finding lawyers to sue you.

Of course the posts aren't indexed by the search engines but recaps can be written that are viewable and thus attract the engines.

Most DCs were never designed to survive what the real estate market is doing now - imploding.  I just don't think DCs will survive and hang on for those folks with "$400k of Pocket Change" to sell memberships to - those folks were wiped out last year.

Just a suggestion to anyone listening.....

P.S.
S @ 9938 2/5/10-09:00 cst


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## msscarlet

*UE Delisting*

Yes, it would have been very helpful if the forum were still up and running to hear what others think about the UE delisting and aborted equity offering.  

The suggestion that the offering didn't work because of 'market conditions' was the usual spin by JT in my opinion.  I just feel sorry for the club members who bought the shares at $8 thinking that when they got the extra shares and halved their investment cost they would either make money or have a limited downside.  

Given all the new hires, increased costs of being public, and general mismanagement, I am anticipating another member assessment.....


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## wilkes591

msscarlet said:


> The suggestion that the offering didn't work because of 'market conditions' was the usual spin by JT in my opinion.  I just feel sorry for the club members who bought the shares at $8 thinking that when they got the extra shares and halved their investment cost they would either make money or have a limited downside.



I do not feel sorry for the members who bought the shares at $8! You had to have your head in the sand not to see where the stock price was going. Come on the UE ripped me off might work last year, but now, with JT's track record. Anybody who joins gets what they deserve and anybody buying the stock gets what they deserve. Do your DUE DILLENGCE and realize the RISK OF LOSS! Just goes to prove, having money does not make you smart.


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## UEgly

*DC4MS sell out?*

Apologies if this has been revealed already, but based on the following it looks like DC4MS sold destinationclubforums.com to UE for 16,667 shares of UE stock:

1.  Destinationclubforums.com was founded by William Scherer:

“I originally started Destination Club Forums as a small area on the Internet where I could post messages and discuss exotic luxury travel locations with other destination club members,” said William Scherer, the founder.

(http://newsblaze.com/story/2010042010352000550.pr/topstory.html)



2.  In UE's S-1, a William Scherer was the proud owner, and hopeful seller, of 16,667 shares of UE stock:

Selling Stockholders:                                                                          
William Scherer        16,667           *           16,667     

(see page 69 of http://sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1402364/000114420410031992/v187261_s1.htm)

3.  UE bought certain assets from an individual for 16,667 shares of UE stock:

ITEM 2 — UNREGISTERED SALES OF EQUITY SECURITIES AND USE OF PROCEEDS
On January 5, 2010, we issued 16,667 shares to an individual from whom we acquired certain assets, as part of the purchase price of those assets.

(see http://www.faqs.org/sec-filings/100513/Secure-America-Acquisition-CORP_10-Q/)


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## travelguy

*DC4MS Sell Out*

So basically UE bought off the one constant source of truthful, er... negative information for $60K+ in stock (value as of Jan).  This would certainly explain why Bill and DC4MS disappeared suddenly into the night ....

IMHO, the lack of a thriving forum for the Destination Club industry hurts the industry far more than any negative posts.  DC4MS was a huge source of sales lead generation for most of the DCs.

Makes you think ... if the price for UE to silence DC4MS was $60k+ ... how much is it worth to Marriott to silence TUG ???  

Also ... wonder if Dr. Bill sold his UE stock windfall before the massive decline in value and liquidity.


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## AKTHUE

*Or was it part of a settlement?*



travelguy said:


> So basically UE bought off the one constant source of truthful, er... negative information for $60K+ in stock (value as of Jan).  This would certainly explain why Bill and DC4MS disappeared suddenly into the night ....
> 
> IMHO, the lack of a thriving forum for the Destination Club industry hurts the industry far more than any negative posts.  DC4MS was a huge source of sales lead generation for most of the DCs.
> 
> Makes you think ... if the price for UE to silence DC4MS was $60k+ ... how much is it worth to Marriott to silence TUG ???
> 
> Also ... wonder if Dr. Bill sold his UE stock windfall before the massive decline in value and liquidity.



Another scenario is that UE had sued Dr. Bill or sent him a threatening letter, and that they negotiated a settlement that UE dropped all claims and bought ownership of the website for some stock.


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## TarheelTraveler

What a shame.  Nice detective work UEgly.  I guess we now know that DC4MS is not coming back (or at least presumably not coming back in a way that we were hoping).  As pointed out on another thread, it was nice to have a place where people could truly learn something about DCs beyond the glossy brochures and marketing hype that made all DCs look great.  Hope we can get some more activity on here, so this section can actually be more informative.


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## travelguy

AKTHUE said:


> Another scenario is that UE had sued Dr. Bill or sent him a threatening letter, and that they negotiated a settlement that UE dropped all claims and bought ownership of the website for some stock.



Shortly after DC4MS went silent, Dr. Bill stated that the board was NOT down due to legal threats or actions.  He also specifically mentioned HCC which had threatened and/or taken legal action against him.

There were some other reported issues for Dr. Bill taking down the board, not involving legal actions from DCs, that other sources discussed but I have no direct knowledge of.

I think the selling of DC4MS, _ESPECIALLY _to UE, comes as a shock to most of us who were close to the forums as moderators.  My personal thought is that Dr. Bill would have updated us if there was a motive other than pure profit.  _>> Note that I'm not saying making a profit is a bad thing, just wish there was more disclosure_.


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## AKTHUE

*Dc4ms*

Now that I think about it, it doesn't make sense to me that any DC would have bought DC4MS, and not tried to remake it into a marketing vehicle for that DC or the DC industry. They could have started moderating (censoring) the discussions, just like they do on their own websites, and put up marketing information in the form of threads. Even if readership would have dwindled over time, it still would have had marketing benefit in the short run, and the member database would have given them some leads.

Maybe the deal was simpler - we'll give you some stock in return for suspending the site - because UE felt the presence of the site was hurting their membersip sales, so they bought silence.


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## travelguy

AKTHUE said:


> Maybe the deal was simpler - we'll give you some stock in return for suspending the site - because UE felt the presence of the site was hurting their membersip sales, so they bought silence.



More importantly, UE was able to permanently banish the vast archive of negative posts that would have killed sales for years to come.

Of the active Clubs, UE was certainly the most skewered but the executives of Equity Estates seemed to be the most reactionary and paranoid to posts about the many unanswered questions regarding their business model.


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## AKTHUE

*Now the SEC filings can do the same thing *



travelguy said:


> More importantly, UE was able to permanently banish the vast archive of negative posts that would have killed sales for years to come.



Anyone who reads the UE SEC filings should steer clear of UE. It's difficult to believe that financially sophisticated people who can afford UE joining fees and dues would not take the time to read the statements. Just the debt level should scare them away.


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## MULTIZ321

UEgly said:


> Apologies if this has been revealed already, but based on the following it looks like DC4MS sold destinationclubforums.com to UE for 16,667 shares of UE stock:
> 
> 1.  Destinationclubforums.com was founded by William Scherer:
> 
> “I originally started Destination Club Forums as a small area on the Internet where I could post messages and discuss exotic luxury travel locations with other destination club members,” said William Scherer, the founder.
> 
> (http://newsblaze.com/story/2010042010352000550.pr/topstory.html)
> 
> 
> 
> 2.  In UE's S-1, a William Scherer was the proud owner, and hopeful seller, of 16,667 shares of UE stock:
> 
> Selling Stockholders:
> William Scherer        16,667           *           16,667
> 
> (see page 69 of http://sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1402364/000114420410031992/v187261_s1.htm)
> 
> 3.  UE bought certain assets from an individual for 16,667 shares of UE stock:
> 
> ITEM 2 — UNREGISTERED SALES OF EQUITY SECURITIES AND USE OF PROCEEDS
> On January 5, 2010, we issued 16,667 shares to an individual from whom we acquired certain assets, as part of the purchase price of those assets.
> 
> (see http://www.faqs.org/sec-filings/100513/Secure-America-Acquisition-CORP_10-Q/)



UEgly,

Thanks for the links. 

The Ultimate Escapes S1 was an eye opener.


Richard


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## Kagehitokiri2

travelguy said:


> Dr. Bill stated that the board was NOT down due to legal threats or actions. He also specifically mentioned HCC which had threatened and/or taken legal action against him.


he did not state that.

he may or may not have mentioned HCC/CK, but if he did, there would be missing context. ("specifically mentioned" and then nothing)

i dont recall hearing from bill that HCC/CK did anything. i certainly dont recall evidence of it on DC4MS. (like with another club that shall remain nameless.) 

quotes from bill re DC4MS being down >
jan 14 - "issues" "advised" "until"
mar 15 - "legal issues"

thats all im comfortable posting, and will not comment further, except for additional corrections...


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## travelguy

Kagehitokiri2 said:


> he did not state that.
> 
> he may or may not have mentioned HCC/CK, but if he did, there would be missing context. ("specifically mentioned" and then nothing)
> 
> i dont recall hearing from bill that HCC/CK did anything. i certainly dont recall evidence of it on DC4MS. (like with another club that shall remain nameless.)
> 
> quotes from bill >
> jan 14 - "issues" "advised" "until"
> mar 15 - "legal issues"
> 
> thats all im comfortable posting, and will not comment further, except for additional corrections...



Kage,

Not to get in a public argument with you on this, and it really doesn't matter anyway ... but to clarify ...

Dr. Bill did not post any of the reasons for the board shut-down that I can recall but did communicate off-forum.  That's what I'm referring to in my post.

HCC/Kirschner WAS taking legal action against Dr. Bill and presumably the forum.  I know this because I was involved as an intermediary between Kirschner and Dr. Bill to resolve a conflict before the board went silent and Kirschner contacted me later asking me to assist his lawyers and the FBI in actions against Dr. Bill.  I declined and have no idea what happened after that.  Dr. Bill seemed to be "aggressively" posting about Kirschner after he lost his HCC deposit.

Hope that explains my post.  I don't believe I've left out any relevant context although there are other details that don't need to be posted to understand my statements.

Regardless, same result - DC4MS is gone, UE critics are somewhat silenced, Dr. Bill profited, HCC is still bankrupt, and we're back to TUG.


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## Kagehitokiri2

i was not implying there was no HCC/CK legal action, just that i had not heard of it from bill. (that i recall. and i may be forgetting.)


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## travelguy

Kagehitokiri2 said:


> (that i recall. and i may be forgetting.)



One thing that I can count on is that you, my friend, _never _forget!


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## UEgly

*No more pretending...*

Looks like destinationclubforums.com is no longer pretending to come back someday with exciting new features later in 2010 -- it is just a blank page now.  

I'm shocked to learn that UE, as the owner of the asset, wasn't completely honest about its intentions with the site! :annoyed:


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## UnhappyInCT

UEgly said:


> Looks like destinationclubforums.com is no longer pretending to come back someday with exciting new features later in 2010 -- it is just a blank page now.
> 
> I'm shocked to learn that UE, as the owner of the asset, wasn't completely honest about its intentions with the site! :annoyed:



Are you being sarcastic?  

Many of us who have had experience with Jim Tousignant and UE were not shocked at this.  In fact, check out my post from Feb 4 where I predicted that this was a likely reason for the shutdown of the website.


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## Kagehitokiri2

travelguy said:


> One thing that I can count on is that you, my friend, _never _forget!


if only 

i try to make sure to state when im not 100% sure.


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## UEgly

UnhappyInCT said:


> Are you being sarcastic?



Yes.  Honesty is not their long suit from my experience...


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## AKTHUE

UEgly said:


> Yes.  Honesty is not their long suit from my experience...



UE is a master at communications that are technically accurate but actively misleading - by omitting important information or saying things in a way that invite you to infer what they hope you will.


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## UEgly

AKTHUE said:


> UE is a master at communications that are technically accurate but actively misleading - by omitting important information or saying things in a way that invite you to infer what they hope you will.



I think "technically accurate" is being generous.  "Actively misleading" nails it.  Of course, intent is very hard to prove/disprove, but let's take a look anyway:

"Since 2007, Destination Club Forums has been the #1 resource for independent information about the Destination Club industry and Destination Clubs such as:

Abercrombie & Kent Residence Club 
Distinctive Holiday Homes 
Equity Estates 
Exclusive Resorts 
Hideaways Club 
M Private Residences 
The Markers Destination Club 
Oyster Circle 
Quintess, LRW 
The Ritz-Carlton Destination Club 
Ultimate Escapes 

Now *we're working *to bring you *an exciting upgrade *that will provide even *more news, information, and insights *into Destination Clubs — a fantastic way to experience the very best in luxury vacationing.

We greatly appreciate your patience while *we prepare for these changes *as we take *our site *to a *whole new level in 2010*!

Please check back in the near future while *we work out all of the exciting details*."

[emphasis added]


If only it ended with:

Sincerely,

Jim Tousignant
Ultimate Escapes, Inc.


Now that would have been entertaining.


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## 3DH

All I can say is, WOW!  

As a moderator there, I had absolutely NO IDEA (as with the others who are now active here...) that UE was in the plans for ownership. Oh well... guess we have all found a new "home"...


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## pwrshift

For what it’s worth, I think DrB loved the DC concept and truly felt it was a fantastic vacation alternative, especially vs timeshares. I can only imagine the amount of his money it took, and personal time, to run it each day. Maybe he one day hoped to see ad support to meet those costs or even turn a small profit, but most DC’s viewed the site as a pain in the ass and had no interest supporting it. 

I think we all found it a valuable source of information, but when the economy tanked we discovered some DC’s had bad management, very little financial transparency, and next to no membership deposit security. A lot of members lost money and they became very vocal on DC4MS. 

No doubt, running the site was no longer fun as everyone was bitching so much. If several DC’s threatened lawsuits over the content I can’t blame DrB for pulling the plug as it was probably in the best interest of the moderators and some posters too as the DCs were trying to go after members that posted negative things. Almost like he fell on the sword rather than disclose private info about members during lawsuit depositions.

It costs very little to launch a lawsuit, but a ton to defend even if there’s a good chance of winning. I’m guessing he reached an out of court settlement that involved paying his legal fees and shutting down the site. I don’t think there’d be any buyers for the 16,667 shares, and surprised some of you might see something negative here. He started DC4MS in 2007 to share info as a free resource and created the largest online social gathering of DC members and should be thanked for that. I also found his DC home reviews, photographs, and stories quite entertaining.

Here’s some interesting reading on how some companies can SLAPP the little guy’s face with a nuisance lawsuit…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategic_lawsuit_against_public_participation

No doubt he made a number of rookie mistakes with the site (perhaps registering it in his own name rather than a LLC) that might have made his family personally liable for information posted there. Either way, he is probably under strict Non-Disclosure (NDA) as that is pretty standard with lawsuits. Too bad, as it was a terrific site and one that we all miss.

I'm glad all you rich guys found TUG again, and welcome back ... how about springing $15 and changing from 'guest' to 'member'.


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## TarheelTraveler

Well said, pwrshift, and all are good points.  It is nice to have a more complete perspective of what may have happened.


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## Kagehitokiri2

i agree with *pwrshift* re DC4MS.


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## travelguy

I also agree with PWRSHift on his assessment of Dr. Bill and the DC4MS situation.

I'll add two additional thoughts:

1) What posters didn't see were some of the discussions on the private moderators only section of the board.  When the implosion of DCs started to happen and members became very vocal and aggressive, several mods (including me) urged Dr. Bill to clamp down on the personal attacks and unverified accusations that were being made against the DCs and the executives of the DCs.  Our feeling was that these would lead to legal problems even if some/most of the rants were justified.  (personal note - There is a difference between what is just from a moral & ethical perspective and what is legally unjust).  To his credit, Dr. Bill wanted the forum to continue to be somewhat uncensored and allowed the escalating aggressiveness to continue.

2) Dr. Bill was also a DC member who lost his DC investment.  He posted under a different board name to voice his personal opinions.  He was totally transparent about this and disclosed this to the mods from day one.  IMHO - In the end days of DC4MS, some of the postings of "DC4MS" (the administrator) became the angry personal opinions of Dr. Bill, the person who was ripped off by a DC.  I'm not saying the any of those posts were unjustified, only that they should not have been posted as the opinions of the admin.

To add context to this account - remember that the legal liabilities of public postings and the disclosures needed have changed dramatically from 2007 until today.


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## RLG

pwrshift said:


> Almost like he fell on the sword rather than disclose private info about members during lawsuit depositions.


 
One of the things I've noticed about people who are drinking the DC coolaid is that it makes them say "thank you" when they are getting screwed.  

If I understand what happened correctly, he SOLD our information to one of the DC's.  Your contact info, username, password, posts and any PM's are all now in the hands of JT.  So much for falling on his sword.



pwrshift said:


> I’m guessing he reached an out of court settlement that involved paying his legal fees and shutting down the site. I don’t think there’d be any buyers for the 16,667 shares, and surprised some of you might see something negative here.



I hope he rides the shares all the way down to zero.  Maybe he can exchange them for 30 pieces of silver which would be a more appropriate compensation.

No wonder he didn't tell anyone what he did.


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## Kagehitokiri2

let me rephrase - what i got from *pwrshift*'s post was the focus on lawsuits, and settlements, and NDAs.


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## pwrshift

There's a lot of bitterness out there over the broken DC dreams. I'm not happy that I lost on HCC, but that wasn't DrB's fault. Even though it was money I could afford to lose I didn't like doing so, but would never blame anyone else for my stupidity. Besides, I lost a lot more on the stock market that crashed right after that. If you lost money on a DC of the stock market, take a look in the mirror to see who is responsible.

Once burned....! You won't find me in line to buy into another DC as a result of what happened, and HCC, Lusso, etc. did great harm to the DC industry. DC4MS became the refuge of relief when everyone woke up from the dream. 

It is my understanding that a BBS like TUG and DC4MS cannot read PM's or get member email addresses not posted in public. I've never been spammed because of TUG or DC4MS. 

My reading on it is that if he 'sold' anything it was the closure of the site, as anything else was worthless.



RLG said:


> One of the things I've noticed about people who are drinking the DC coolaid is that it makes them say "thank you" when they are getting screwed.
> 
> If I understand what happened correctly, he SOLD our information to one of the DC's. Your contact info, username, password, posts and any PM's are all now in the hands of JT. So much for falling on his sword.
> 
> I hope he rides the shares all the way down to zero. Maybe he can exchange them for 30 pieces of silver which would be a more appropriate compensation.
> 
> No wonder he didn't tell anyone what he did.


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## Kagehitokiri2

pwrshift said:


> It is my understanding that a BBS like TUG and DC4MS cannot ... get member email addresses



not correct.

just a matter of who [admin] has access to them.

cant imagine anything happened beyond simply taking the site down.


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## travelguy

Kagehitokiri2 said:


> not correct.
> 
> just a matter of who [admin] has access to them.
> 
> cant imagine anything happened beyond simply taking the site down.



Agreed, e-mails were available to admin and mods.  Also note that HCC itself made all members e-mails available in the public domain by an IT screw-up.  

I agree with our friend from the great white north that I've never been spammed from anything to do with DC4MS.  I HAVE been spammed by the HCC wannabe DCs that routinely sent e-mails to all HCC members after the failure of HCC.  That spamming has died down since none of them ever got off the ground.


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## travelguy

pwrshift said:


> Even though it was money I could afford to lose I didn't like doing so, but would never blame anyone else for my stupidity. Besides, I lost a lot more on the stock market that crashed right after that.



I'll also add that I lost much more on the "value" of my timeshares than I did on the DC over that same time period (based upon current ts resale values).  At least I'm not paying annual dues on HCC, unlike some of my timeshares that have no value.  In fact, I might jump at the chance to trade-in my worthless timeshares for a worthless DC.  


At least I made back the money I lost on the stock market!  No chance of making back the TS or DC losses.


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## pwrshift

travelguy said:


> At least I made back the money I lost on the stock market! No chance of making back the TS or DC losses.


 
Ah...but no doubt you're a smarter investor now on everything.


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## willmyclubmakeit

pwrshift said:


> Ah...but no doubt you're a smarter investor now on everything.



I don't think the DC4MS had any collusion in mind and it was just time to move on.  I know I received what I now consider a tip re: my private messages.   Thank you DC4MS if you are still listening--I learned a great deal due to your forum.  Too bad it was an expensive lesson but the experiences with our family were worth it.  I hope or wish it just lasts longer.


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## Kagehitokiri2

note i was only saying *pwrshift* was wrong about email. (see quote in my post) admin has access, and we mods were given high enough access to see it.

i dont think admin could see private messages, and i think if there ARE forums that do that, its going to be much rarer than the norm. i dont believe ive ever seen references to it, but it must exist in some form.


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## Desties

Either way, it's been a long time since the forum went blank. If UE had any intentions of buying up the site to go after its more vocal critics it would have done so by now. It would have sent emails, lawyers, phone calls -- and folks would have piped up about it here. It's a dumb theory because a company can't play Whack-a-Mole. If you squelch negativity on one site, it'll just pop up somewhere else. Opinions can't be suppressed.

My two theories are that either UE wanted to silence the forum (which it did) or that it intended/intends to run it with a tighter moderated fist for the industry's sake, while also affording it the opprotunity to market UE to prospective destination club members. It's brilliant, really. 

I had the pleasure of once meeting DC4MS and he's a stand up guy. I don't think he sold any of us down the river. A tempting offer likely came -- and he took it.


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## 3DH

Desties said:


> I had the pleasure of once meeting DC4MS and he's a stand up guy. I don't think he sold any of us down the river. A tempting offer likely came -- and he took it.



Ditto on meeting him & his credibility... can't fault him for what happened, or the way it went down.


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## OneMoreTime

*DC4MS not an asset in UE's list*

I noticed on the list of domains that were for sale with the UE auction that DC4MS was not one of them- It would be great as we go through the next season(s)  of the UE transaction to have DC4MS filing hierarchy back.


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## Kagehitokiri2

OneMoreTime said:


> I noticed on the list of domains that were for sale with the UE auction that DC4MS was not one of them- It would be great as we go through the next season(s)  of the UE transaction to have DC4MS filing hierarchy back.


hrmm......


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