# What should I expect to pay for 81000 StarOptions with Westin



## JC951 (Apr 2, 2007)

I want to buy a resale week at either Westin Kierland Villas or Sheraton Vistana Villages worth 81000 star options. Where would be best off looking and what could I expect to pay. Im hoping for the lowest MF which appear to be at SVV. Any info appreciated.


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## DeniseM (Apr 2, 2007)

There are Starwood units on ebay all the time - I'd start there.  However, I assume you are buying to exchange?  Exchanges into the top 3 Starwood resorts (Westin St. John, Harborside, and Maui) can be difficult.  WSJ is darn near impossible.  If you really want to go to one of those resorts, your best bet is to buy resale at one of them.  I wouldn't buy with the intention of exchanging for a "better" resort every year, because there is just too much competition for the most popular resorts.  Maui is the easiest of the 3, but exchanging in, puts you at the bottom of the pecking order for a good view, and in Hawaii, I wanna see the ocean!


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## JC951 (Apr 3, 2007)

Im hoping to use it to trade into the new Lagunamar in Cancun once its finished. Do you guys think it will be hard to get into being that its Cancun, once everyone gets over the novelty that its new?


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## DeniseM (Apr 3, 2007)

JC951 said:


> Im hoping to use it to trade into the new Lagunamar in Cancun once its finished. Do you guys think it will be hard to get into being that its Cancun, once everyone gets over the novelty that its new?



Since it's Starwoods only Mexican resort, I think it will become the 4th member of the Big Three Club.  

This is the way Starwood's exchanges work - from 12 to 8 mos. out, only owners can make reservations at their home resort.  At 8 mos. out, exchangers can try to make reservations.  At some resorts, like St. John, there is simply no availability at 8 mos. out.  

Until the resort actually opens, it's going to be hard to say what the demand is.  If I were you, I would buy at a resort that I wouldn't mind going to as a "back up" or be willing to exchange into other Starwood resorts.  

Since they have been in sales at Laguna Mar for awhile, there are probably resales available - have you looked into that?  If I wanted Laguna Mar, I'd start hunting for a resale and be very patient - they'll be there.


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## JC951 (Apr 3, 2007)

Thanks Denise. I actually wouldnt mind owning at SVV though, even if I couldnt use my staroptions at the other places. It also seems that on ebay its the best buy for the 81000 staroptions. Just saw one at WKV that went for 11k. Ive been reading on the boards that SVV goes for about 8k. Maybe I can buy a week at Cancun later and requal my SVV week from what I read here.


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## Denise L (Apr 3, 2007)

There are two recent ebay auctions for Westin Kierland that are at $11,000 & $11,350 right now. One ended recently at $10,999. All are advertised as 81,000 Staroptions.

Vistana Villages...there was a thread recently about the prices. There was one I was watching recently that ended at $7,000 which surprises me, as others have gone as high as $9,450, and I know that someone was asking if $8,000 was a good price, too.  A 67,100 unit ended at $5,000 recently.

These prices are the winning bids, but do not include closing costs and reimbursement of current year's fees (if 2007 occupancy). Add $1100 in fees to the $7,000 bid, for example.

But like DeniseM recommends, buy where you want to go.

Either that, or be flexible with when/where you go, and be happy in FL or AZ if you can't get Cancun.


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## djp (Apr 3, 2007)

*Since it's Starwoods only Mexican resort, I think it will become the 4th member of the Big Three Club.*

Here is my theory which may indeed prove to be false....I am predicting that with starwood apparently focussing on beach/tropical locations for immediate additions, I predict that the demand for exchanging into these "big 3-st jon,harborside maui" will balance out with the rest of the starwood system.
I am saying that with the addition of cancun, 2 in kuai, another 2 in maui for a total of 3 there, cabo and aruba, that I think tropical beach lovers will have more options and thus more availability. In fact I believe that sometimes the owners of these resorts will in fact want to go to orlando, or vail, or the desert...thus driving up demand at the resorts that are easier/cheaper to get to and at this point in less demand. 
It is all supply and demand and with a lot more supply of resorts that are in some ways similar to the "big 3", I am prediciting the end of the idea of the "big 3" 
time will tell, but I think with the constant addition of new resorts it is only going to get easier to exchange into these more desirable places as 

tropical beachy
cabo*
cancun*
aruba*
wkorv
wkorvn*
wkorvnn*
harborside
st jon
princeville*
sheraton kuai*
10 resorts, 7 new*, plus 2 expanding harborside/st jon.

non tropical beachy
myrtle beach
palm desert 2
phoenix 2
vail 3
orlando 2
other florida 2
12 resorts 2 brand new (avon and palm desert) 2 expanding myrtle beach and vv)

All this to say that the majority of current expansion is in tropical/beachy places thus driving up exchange demand for the current closer/driveable resorts, and freeing up space at tropical beachy places.

This is my opinion and my hope.


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## DeniseM (Apr 3, 2007)

djp said:


> *Since it's Starwoods only Mexican resort, I think it will become the 4th member of the Big Three Club.*
> 
> Here is my theory which may indeed prove to be false....I am predicting that with starwood apparently focussing on beach/tropical locations for immediate additions, I predict that the demand for exchanging into these "big 3-st jon,harborside maui" will balance out with the rest of the starwood system.



Maybe...but there will also be a huge influx of new owners competing for the most desirable locations.  I just don't see the people who put out the big bucks to buy at the resorts that are more expensive, and have higher MF's, exchanging into the bottom feeders - I see them competing for the most popular resorts...but...only time will tell!

(BTW I own a bottom feeder too, so I can talk like that!  )


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## DavidnRobin (Apr 3, 2007)

Denise L said:


> There are two recent ebay auctions for Westin Kierland that are at $11,000 & $11,350 right now. One ended recently at $10,999. All are advertised as 81,000 Staroptions.
> 
> Vistana Villages...there was a thread recently about the prices. There was one I was watching recently that ended at $7,000 which surprises me, as others have gone as high as $9,450, and I know that someone was asking if $8,000 was a good price, too.  A 67,100 unit ended at $5,000 recently.
> 
> These prices are the winning bids, but do not include closing costs and reimbursement of current year's fees (if 2007 occupancy). Add $1100 in fees to the $7,000 bid, for example.


or...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190097415201&ssPageName=ADME:B:WNA:US:12


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## smsavage (Apr 3, 2007)

djp said:


> *Since it's Starwoods only Mexican resort, I think it will become the 4th member of the Big Three Club.*
> 
> Here is my theory which may indeed prove to be false....I am predicting that with starwood apparently focussing on beach/tropical locations for immediate additions, I predict that the demand for exchanging into these "big 3-st jon,harborside maui" will balance out with the rest of the starwood system.
> I am saying that with the addition of cancun, 2 in kuai, another 2 in maui for a total of 3 there, cabo and aruba, that I think tropical beach lovers will have more options and thus more availability. In fact I believe that sometimes the owners of these resorts will in fact want to go to orlando, or vail, or the desert...thus driving up demand at the resorts that are easier/cheaper to get to and at this point in less demand.
> ...





I don't think that you're far off on this one. We're trading one of our Hawaii weeks this year for Vail in June. Just because we can go to the beach every year doesn't mean that we want to. We bought because of the flexibility of the system and because of the diversity of the locations. I'm sure we're not the only ones in this boat.

Funny thing is that even though we're off to WKORV this week, the kids can't wait to enter the Beaver Creek Rodeo.


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## JC951 (Apr 3, 2007)

Is it possible to use SVV options for less than a week at Westin Maui? If so, is that also hard to do? Sometime we like to take only 3 or 4 night mini trips


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## smsavage (Apr 3, 2007)

JC951 said:


> Is it possible to use SVV options for less than a week at Westin Maui? If so, is that also hard to do? Sometime we like to take only 3 or 4 night mini trips



That might be tough to do, as you can only book trips of less than a week at 90 days out. There may be some low demand times (as evidenced by the current Starwood 50% off promotion covering mid-April through the start of June), but you never know until you call.


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## Transit (Apr 3, 2007)

DeniseM said:


> Maybe...but there will also be a huge influx of new owners competing for the most desirable locations.  I just don't see the people who put out the big bucks to buy at the resorts that are more expensive, and have higher MF's, exchanging into the bottom feeders - I see them competing for the most popular resorts...but...only time will tell!
> 
> (BTW I own a bottom feeder too, so I can talk like that!  )



Denise It's all relevant ,instead of using 148100 S/O to go to a TOP resort always, people will look at using less S/O' s to stay different seasons/elsewere. St John is unique in that to many units in phase 1 were fixed and they undervalued s/o's for popular seasons also once the Been there done that factor is over the competition should spead out more evenly.Aruba and Hawaii are expensive airfares and long flights ,some may go every few years instead of ey.I for one will try to visit every SVN resort.Also there is availability at off peak time at the big 3 for those who are flexible.


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## JC951 (Apr 3, 2007)

Hey Transit, being that you own at SVV (from the info on the post), do you find it hard to use star options to reserve at Maui. Im planning on possibly buying 81000 options at SVV also. Thanks


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## pointsjunkie (Apr 3, 2007)

my friends own svv,81,000so and they got mauii last year for february break. i have also met many owners from svv and they were at harborside gold season. i also know people who own at svv and have been to st. john's 2x. so i guess it is the timing and luck.


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## DeniseM (Apr 3, 2007)

Transit said:


> I for one will try to visit every SVN resort.Also there is availability at off peak time at the big 3 for those who are flexible.



But...if you were the owner of one of the expensive resorts and paid big bucks up front, and high maintenance fees, would you be willing to exchange that for one of the bottom feeders?  I sure wouldn't!  Especially when you can get them easily on an outside exchange using an inexpensive week.  IMNSHO - It makes no sense to knowingly trade down.  I still think all the competition is going to be for the exotic beach resorts.


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## Transit (Apr 3, 2007)

JC951 said:


> Hey Transit, being that you own at SVV (from the info on the post), do you find it hard to use star options to reserve at Maui. Im planning on possibly buying 81000 options at SVV also. Thanks



Last June it was available to me but I decieded on Harborside.Maybe next year.At The Peak seasons It's hard to book but Poeple do lockoff so there is some availability you have to work at it.


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## Transit (Apr 3, 2007)

DeniseM said:


> But...if you were the owner of one of the expensive resorts and paid big bucks up front, and high maintenance fees, would you be willing to exchange that for one of the bottom feeders?  I sure wouldn't!  Especially when you can get them easily on an outside exchange using an inexpensive week.  IMNSHO - It makes no sense to knowingly trade down.  I still think all the competition is going to be for the exotic beach resorts.


  If i'm in SVN and I have a super unit with alot of S/Os the lesser valued resorts/seasons cost alot less S/Os to use isn't that the main benefit of any mini system/or points system.I would use the other resorts that I like to travel to.Some want to return to the same location every year and thats fine but then why bother with SVN at alll when there are so may quality T/Ss out there.Looking at the S/O charts The trades are equal  .Example :exchanging a Maui studio for a 2 bedroom in Myrtle beach or Orlando with no exchange fee seems doable to me.Reverse it -A 2 bedroom in Orlando or Myrtle beach only gets you a studio or a one bedroom in Hawaii.I think Tuggers strive to get evey dollars worth for their T/S but the average owner is just going to exchange to wherever they want to go.


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## DavidnRobin (Apr 3, 2007)

JC951 said:


> I want to buy a resale week at either Westin Kierland Villas or Sheraton Vistana Villages worth 81000 star options. Where would be best off looking and what could I expect to pay. Im hoping for the lowest MF which appear to be at SVV. Any info appreciated.



To go back to the original question - IMO - a 1Bd Premium (large) in Platinum season (81K SOs) at WKV is one of the best values - Low MFs, Mandatory, location, quality resort, and reasonable cost (if you can find one) - especially considering that you are from SoCal.

We bought this unit for these above reasons.

As I mentioned above - two 2Bd LOs (Gold - 81K SOs) just sold on eBay for a pretty big difference in price, and another one is coming with a bid aleady higher than the highest one just sold.  I assume that the lower price one was because it was a poor ad (didn't even mention SOs).  If you were looking fior a 2Bd LO at WKV worth 81K SOs - this would have been a good buy, but I still would rather have the 1Bd Premium (Plat, 81K SOs).


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## Transit (Apr 3, 2007)

I agree with DavidnRobin Keiland is the better value because of MF/Staroptons and if your out west its easier to get to your home resort.Vistana Villages has alot more units and will always be easier to get into.


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## JC951 (Apr 3, 2007)

Saw a SVV recently sell on ebay for 7K, as opposed to 8750 and most recently 11k for WKV, and all with the same 81000 SO. Do you guys thinks it would be better to pay a bit more to get better trading out of WKV?


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## Transit (Apr 3, 2007)

JC951 said:


> Saw a SVV recently sell on ebay for 7K, as opposed to 8750 and most recently 11k for WKV, and all with the same 81000 SO. Do you guys thinks it would be better to pay a bit more to get better trading out of WKV?



I think the M/f was less at Keirland.Trading thru SVN doesn't matter all SVN resorts trade the same at the 8 months out exchange period. Maui will trade as good as Keirland in SVN. I have not ventured to exchange thru II but have seen good trades on request first.


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## DeniseM (Apr 3, 2007)

JC951 said:


> Do you guys thinks it would be better to pay a bit more to get better trading out of WKV?



Once you convert to Staroptions, it doesn't matter which resort they came from.  81K Staroptions have the same value in exchanging, no matter what the original resort was - they don't even look at that.  All that matters is that you own enough Staroptions for the exchange you want.


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## djp (Apr 4, 2007)

[*QUOTE=DeniseM;311337]Maybe...but there will also be a huge influx of new owners competing for the most desirable locations.  I just don't see the people who put out the big bucks to buy at the resorts that are more expensive, and have higher MF's, exchanging into the bottom feeders - I see them competing for the most popular resorts...but...only time will tell!

(BTW I own a bottom feeder too, so I can talk like that!  )[/QUOTE]*

Denise, i think we tuggers think about how to get the most bang for our buck, I think %80 of starwood owners just open their starwood binder and figure out where they want to go, each year, not considering how much the other resort cost in purchase price and in maint fees etc...I know for this guy with 5 in the family the idea of a $500-$1000 flight each, every year for the whole family is not all that appealing, so sometimes the idea of  the eoy closer family vacation is appealing. I think 1/3-1/2 of the people who buy starwood in the tropical locations plan to sometimes go to orlando, or vail, or palm springs, and thus the eventual evening out of supply and demand in the starwood system, at least until the day comes that starwood adds more resorts in the continental 48 at the rate it is adding others.


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## capjak (Apr 6, 2007)

I have friends that own 2br Westin Kanapali, bought it when it was preconstruction and have never been there.  They can't seem to plan far enough in advance.  They have use staroptions for princeville and sheraton and exchanged 1 year for both a week in colorado and 1 week  Avalon isla murales as well as a few nights in Cancun.

But they enjoy the TS and do whatever they want with it?


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## DavidnRobin (Apr 7, 2007)

capjak said:


> I have friends that own 2br Westin Kanapali, bought it when it was preconstruction and have never been there.  They can't seem to plan far enough in advance.  They have use staroptions for princeville and sheraton and exchanged 1 year for both a week in colorado and 1 week  Avalon isla murales as well as a few nights in Cancun.
> 
> But they enjoy the TS and do whatever they want with it?



Glad to hear they enjoy TSing - they unlikely want to hear about the money they would have saved buying in the states since they are using their expensive SOs to exchange anyway - and saving even more $ buying resale... and more value buying Mandatory.

This is where researching TS systems can save a lot - by choosing one that best fits your needs - and being patient to find the best value - this would have saved $25-30K (in this case - for example - buying the same SOs resale at a Mandatory resort like WKV (west) or SVV (east)).

Fortunately - for SVO - they get folks when they are most vunerable (and sell beautiful vacation dreams).
Fortunately - for SVO buyers - there is TUG for those few who get this far.
(I say 'few' because I would guessimate that <1% ever get here)

I continually tell folks I meet that own TSs about TUG - and I don't think many have ever ventured here.  Why is this?  One reason I would imagine is related in some part to a type of 'buyers remorse'.


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## pointsjunkie (Apr 7, 2007)

i have bought 3 times from starwood,with no buyers remorse, i got 1 for a fabulous price hs and the other two originally bought eoy and then later upgraded to ey. got lots of starpoints,great trips but now that i know about TUG i will probably buy 1 resale and requal it with aruba when it opens. the info i got from TUG has been eye opening. but i would still have bought from the developer all the other times. but now my goal is to get to 5* and want to use all the weeks to semi-retire at great places.


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## DavidnRobin (Apr 7, 2007)

pointsjunkie said:


> i have bought 3 times from starwood,with no buyers remorse, i got 1 for a fabulous price hs and the other two originally bought eoy and then later upgraded to ey. got lots of starpoints,great trips but now that i know about TUG i will probably buy 1 resale and requal it with aruba when it opens. the info i got from TUG has been eye opening. but i would still have bought from the developer all the other times. but now my goal is to get to 5* and want to use all the weeks to semi-retire at great places.


ahem... you found TUG...
would you have done the same if you had found TUG before... based on your posts - in hindsight - you probably would have bought resale - and then requaled.  But I wasn't referring to you... I said 'related' - meaning - those who buy and then put it in the back of their mind.  I know of 2 who bought (and even financed thru SVO - yikes!) and have barely considered anything about using the SVO/SVN system they were sold in the first place - this certainly is not you...


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## pointsjunkie (Apr 7, 2007)

buying resale and requalifying still has me scared, i do not want to be the one when they decide , ok the person before you was the last requal we are going to do, and with my luck that will happen. or they will requal and not let them be used for 5* and then i have all this "wonderful"  (sarcastically) timeshare that i won't be able to use. but love starwood and can't wait for aruba. that is the east coast's version of hawaii. always nice breeze and great weather all year. fellow tuggers have a great holiday.


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## DavidnRobin (Apr 7, 2007)

pointsjunkie said:


> buying resale and requalifying still has me scared, i do not want to be the one when they decide , ok the person before you was the last requal we are going to do, and with my luck that will happen. or they will requal and not let them be used for 5* and then i have all this "wonderful"  (sarcastically) timeshare that i won't be able to use. but love starwood and can't wait for aruba. that is the east coast's version of hawaii. always nice breeze and great weather all year. fellow tuggers have a great holiday.



If you get the requal paperwork in order (as per thread) - they can't go back.  All the paperwork - including the Elite level - is signed by SVO and you.  They would have no motivation to do so. You have a good one also.


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