# Should I inherit my aunt’s Wyndham points? Help! Million plus points



## Debidocsr (Jan 30, 2019)

Hi, let me start out by saying I own 3 deeded weeks and 7,650 shell points (I didn’t buy off developers). So I thought I knew a lot about timeshares as I work hard to check daily and use our benefits to the max, but I’m so confused about this decision.  My aunt recently passed and my cousin is offering us to take over her points; she bought all from developers. Just have to pay MFs 
My uncle doesn’t want them or need them anymore. He worked many years paying for them and for the most part enjoyed traveling on them. My question is: Is it worth keeping if she bought directly off developer and has VIP status? Does the status changed if transferred to me? What is the process and best way to facilitate this?  I know she had deeded weeks and two years ago converted to points (1,220.000 biennial) so I think that cost her a pretty penny but we can’t find any contracts.  I would hate for all her benefits and all the money to go back to Wyndham if the family could benefit from inheriting them. The resorts are in Hawaii Bali Hai and Royal Sea Cliff. Thank you in advance! I appreciate any input. #timeisoftheessence


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## DeniseM (Jan 30, 2019)

A few thoughts:

-These are not top tier resorts - Bali Hai is inland, and Royal Sea Cliff is on a lava rock bluff - no beach. 
-The properties don't have any resale value, but the Wyndham points may.
-To transfer the ownership, the deeds would each have to be legally transferred to the new owner.  Many owners use a timeshare title company for this - it's usually less than $200 per deed + $299 per deed to Wyndham.  
-A title company can also research and acquire the deeds for you, for a fee.
-What would you do with the timeshares/points if you take them?


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## schoolmarm (Jan 30, 2019)

I would disagree with Denise about the Bali Hai contract.  Bali Hai has very low maintenance fees (one of the lowest in Wyndham) and is a highly desirable Wyndham contract. It will also come with Outrigger (ability to book Australia, New Zealand and Hawaii). Bali Hai contracts do have some resale value. I would hang on to it!  (and if you don't want it, Richelle was looking for one and I wouldn't mind getting a second one...just sayin')

In order for VIP to transfer to you, you might have to also have your cousin on the deeds for a awhile. Someone here will clarify which direct relatives get VIP benefits upon transfer.  There is a Legacy department for transfer between family members. I don't know how to use it yet, but that is what you should do. It might not require full fees. 

I am planning on giving my nieces and nephew my timeshares when I pass. I am probably going to have to put my brothers on the contracts as well for this to happen. 

VIP gold has some benefits that would be useful.  I'd keep it if you can handle the monthy maintenance fees.


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## T-Dot-Traveller (Jan 30, 2019)

DLB said:


> ....... My aunt recently passed and my cousin is offering us to take over her points; she bought all from developers. Just have to pay MFs
> My uncle doesn’t want them or need them anymore. He worked many years paying for them and for the most part enjoyed traveling on ....Is it worth keeping if she bought directly off developer and has VIP status? Does the status changed if transferred to me? What is the process and best way to facilitate this?  I know she had deeded weeks and two years ago converted to points (1,220.000 biennial) so I think that cost her a pretty penny but we can’t find any contracts.  I would hate for all her benefits and all the money to go back to Wyndham if the family could benefit from inheriting them. .........



Please extend our TUG sympathies to your uncle & family .
and welcome .

1) How she bought(developer) does not matter since that is sunk money .
2) Keeping the VIP status is important . I am unsure as to what family connection  is required to
keep the VIP status .
3) The points would likely sell for something on the open ( ebay ) market .

I am sure Knowledgeable Wyndham owners with VIP status will help you .


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## DeniseM (Jan 30, 2019)

Let me clarify what I said: I don't care for Bali Hai, _because it's inland._  When I go to Hawaii, I want to be right on the ocean.  However, I also said that the Wyndham points may have value.  So if you want Wyndham points, and can use them, _the points_ may be a good value for you.

Regarding the transfer of of VIP benefits - I believe they only transfer to immediate family, but others here can elaborate on that.


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## 55plus (Jan 31, 2019)

Convert the ownership into a LLC to save the VIP level. This alone will give the points value and then sell it or use it for awhile.


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## cbyrne1174 (Jan 31, 2019)

If she has VIP Gold or platinum hold onto it as long as you can. You could easily rent out half your points and pay for the other half using the profit.


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## Debidocsr (Feb 2, 2019)

I appreciate everyone’s responses. My cousin called under ovation program and they credited her for past dues and said after September they would give her $3200 for rest of points after she owned cliff property five years but my understanding she can’t use points now. Once she calls, anyone know if it’s final or my uncle has to sign stuff and time to change his mind?


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## happyhopian (Feb 3, 2019)

If she has platinum VIP I think it would be worth it if you can afford the MF. Here is what I would suggest.

Have her children transfer it to a trust or an LLC and once complete add you as an authorized user and then transfer the LLC to you. This will preserve the VIP status until they change the rules and prohibit this too.

The second option would require more steps but would also preserve VIP. Are your parents alive? I would have them transfer to your parents which will cost $299 per transfer to Wyndham through the legacy department. When you transact the deeds have them add both their name AND your name in a divisible way, with right of survivorship. After all of this is done and the transfer to your parents is complete - THEN call wyndham legacy again and make another transfer from your parents to you. You won't have to do the deeds again since you are already listed on the deeds. This will allow the 'immediate' family to trigger twice and you will keep the VIP status.

If you don't care about the VIP status then transfer to yourself and have a merry time!


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## Debidocsr (Feb 3, 2019)

Hi,
My parents aren’t alive and I don’t think they want the hassle. I thought my aunt probably paid a lot for Vip status and now that one has been relinquished I know the other probably doesn’t have enough points to retain status. I’m thinking I should set up a Trust for my Timeshare’s so my kids don’t have the hassle later.  She had 710,000 points biennial and gave up the 500,00 for credit towards MF. I don’t think she got a good deal. They just wanted her points back to sell. Any thoughts?


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## Jan M. (Feb 3, 2019)

DLB said:


> Hi,
> My parents aren’t alive and I don’t think they want the hassle. I thought my aunt probably paid a lot for Vip status and now that one has been relinquished I know the other probably doesn’t have enough points to retain status. I’m thinking I should set up a Trust for my Timeshare’s so my kids don’t have the hassle later.  She had 710,000 points biennial and gave up the 500,00 for credit towards MF. I don’t think she got a good deal. They just wanted her points back to sell. Any thoughts?



From what you said it sounds like your cousin already made the deal to give back 500,000 Bali Hai points for credit towards maintenance fees. If her name isn't on the deed for them or she doesn't have power of attorney for him I would think your uncle has to sign so hopefully there is still time. If not, I'm not going to sugar coat it, she was a fool to do what she did. Bali Hai has just about the lowest maintenance fees in the entire Wyndham system so of course Wyndham would love to have those points back! She could have found someone to pay probably a lot more than Wyndham credited her towards the maintenance fees if that was her major concern. And that gold or platinum ownership was worth a very great deal more than whatever they gave her or are proposing to give her.


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## Richelle (Feb 4, 2019)

Unfortunately aunt/uncle to niece/nephew is not considered a direct relative per the program directory. However, they “might” make an exception if the children or spouse of the owner does not want it. You may have to pay any past dues if there are any. If they won’t transfer to you and keep VIP, your next option would be a trust. If your uncle is willing to put it in a trust, it might be worth it. If you can, match Wyndham’s offer. Especially with Bali Hai in there. It would make it a lot easier to rent out because your maintenance fees are less, so you can charge less.  Renting out can help offset some of those maintenance fees. Friends and family would be the best people to ask if they want to rent points from you. I hate to see VIP status go to waste, especially since they are so expensive. 







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## Jan M. (Feb 4, 2019)

Just leave your uncle and even your aunt also on and add your names with right of survivorship. This gives you extra names on the account to hold reservations without having to use guest certificates. And there are no worries about the degree of relationship.


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## Debidocsr (Feb 7, 2019)

Does it cost money to add a name? May be a good option. They were thinking of pathway program or something and transferring into my name for $299. My uncle doesn’t want it in his name anymore. Does anyone know if that happens,  if privileges/vip benefits transfer ?


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## Debidocsr (Feb 7, 2019)

Does anyone know once you trade points in towards maintenance fees, is that final or only happens when you relinquish property or do they do that to regular accounts like a hardship credit?


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## Debidocsr (Feb 7, 2019)

I’m looking at contracts. What does AFLO mean on Bali Hai?  Or U-OD for Royal Sea Cliff? Thank you in advance for your time in answering my questions. I appreciate it.


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## tschwa2 (Feb 7, 2019)

DLB said:


> Does it cost money to add a name? May be a good option. They were thinking of pathway program or something and transferring into my name for $299. My uncle doesn’t want it in his name anymore. Does anyone know if that happens,  if privileges/vip benefits transfer ?


Do they already have Pathways built into their contract?  That was a brief discontinued program. If they have it they should call the number on their contract and get a tentative payout amount it could be in the $20,000-$30,000 range or more.  If they have that they might want to just take it.

If you mean ovations not Pathways (which required an additional purchase during the 18 months when it was offered and is part of at least one of their contracts) then Limited Edition (part of the Ovations program) could offer 3 years of use for no fees.  

If your uncle wants his name off the contract completely and no qualified direct family members are willing to go on the timeshare with you then it will transfer without VIP status if you go that route.


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## ausman (Feb 7, 2019)

DLB said:


> I’m looking at contracts. What does AFLO mean on Bali Hai?  Or U-OD for Royal Sea Cliff? Thank you in advance for your time in answering my questions. I appreciate it.



DLB,

Bali Hai Wyndham points are either UDI points or converted weeks points. The AFLO would mean they were originally sold as weeks and then at some later time were converted to Wyndham points. Exactly what size unit and on what floor etc you could call Bali Hai to get the details. U-OD usually means UDI points in an ODD year.

I have two questions for you:

1) What VIP status did your Aunt have.
2) Converting 500,000 points to MF, was this a one time deal (as described on pg 259 of the current directory) and the contacts were still owned and future years points would be available.

Responders seem all over the place on the interpretation of these two items.


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## Debidocsr (Feb 7, 2019)

Thanks for the response. I’m trying to figure her VIP out. I know she has a 3 bedroom at Bali Hai and gets 500,000 points a year, a million biennial. (Does that make sense)  dues are 989 a year and originally bought after market and converted to points and cliffs bought off Wyndham and converted to points I believe. 210,000 biennia (689 yr MF)l. So if she bought Bali Hai after market and converted through them to points, do they count that towards VIP? I thought they take half of biennial points towards VIP which is 710,000 which is what showed in her account. What VIP is that, if any. I know she had some upgrade status because when I checked in after she passed away on a Timeshare’s he had booked,  they upgraded us to a penthouse suite. (Which was awesome)


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## ausman (Feb 7, 2019)

The royal sea cliff figures make sense, probably 210,000 biennial and counting 110,000 towards vip.
The Bali hai  figures look a little suspect. A 3br had annual fees of approx. $1,800 p.a. in 2017? not including the program fee. That would suggest 500,000 points biennial, counting 250,000 towards vip. 

If both contracts were biennial odd they would show as 710,000 available in odd years.

Something else for you to check.


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## HitchHiker71 (Feb 7, 2019)

Do you have the login credentials for the account?  Easiest way to get most of these questions answered is to simply login and check under Ownership and see what the account VIP status is along with the listed contracts.


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## Debidocsr (Feb 7, 2019)

basham said:


> The royal sea cliff figures make sense, probably 210,000 biennial and counting 110,000 towards vip.
> The Bali hai  figures look a little suspect. A 3br had annual fees of approx. $1,800 p.a. in 2017? not including the program fee. That would suggest 500,000 points biennial, counting 250,000 towards vip.
> 
> If both contracts were biennial odd they would show as 710,000 available in odd years.
> ...


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## Debidocsr (Feb 7, 2019)

so Looking at info again it shows 710,000 points traded one time towards MF 2019. Shows 1,2010. 2021 year usage still. Shows Club Wyndham Plus membership but Bali Hai club presidential Reserve resort so doesn’t that give her any VIP status or it would be clearly listed in ownership details. ?  Or she just has CWP?  She was billed each year for 500,000 I’m so confused ‍ I just remember her saying “I have a million plus points “but her contract reads 500,000 biennial . Why would it show 1,210,000 if each contract is 500,000 and 105,000. Biennial? Her maintenance fees with program were 1818.60 this year.


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## Braindead (Feb 7, 2019)

DLB said:


> so Looking at info again it shows 710,000 points traded one time towards MF 2019. Shows 1,2010. 2021 year usage still. Shows Club Wyndham Plus membership but Bali Hai club presidential Reserve resort so doesn’t that give her any VIP status or it would be clearly listed in ownership details. ?  Or she just has CWP?  She was billed each year for 500,000 I’m so confused ‍ I just remember her saying “I have a million plus points “but her contract reads 500,000 biennial . Why would it show 1,210,000 if each contract is 500,000 and 105,000. Biennial? Her maintenance fees with program were 1818.60 this year.


VIPs can convert current use year points to pay MFs at a rate of $2.10 per 1k points.
If you have really low MFs at $4.20 you only get half of your money back paying MFs with points, but if they had no other use for the points it’s better than letting them expire.  It’s not a hardship case, it’s a regular program Wyndham offers. It’s no different than using the points for reservations. If you use points towards paying MFs it has no long term effect on your contracts or membership.

Where are seeing “shows Club Wyndham Plus membership but Bali Hai club Presidential Reserve “ is it in the directory??
If your online in their account go to my ownership & click on each contract, then tell us what each contract says.
That’s the only way we can tell what they own.
Where do you see the 1,210,000 points??


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## Debidocsr (Feb 7, 2019)

When I click on to make a reservation  at owned resort on contract page under Bali it shows outrigger and club presidential reserve resort. 1,210,000. Shows up in future use. This year they only put 710,000 towards MF though. Irregardless they can’t transfer to me without losing something I’m assuming. Wouldn’t it be the same if I bought aftermarket since she only bought 210,000 off Wyndham directly . Not sure it’s worth $598 to transfer to me especially when I own 6 other timeshares but not Wyndham points


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## Braindead (Feb 7, 2019)

DLB said:


> When I click on to make a reservation  at owned resort on contract page under Bali it shows outrigger and club presidential reserve resort. 1,210,000. Shows up in future use. This year they only put 710,000 towards MF though. Irregardless they can’t transfer to me without losing something I’m assuming. Wouldn’t it be the same if I bought aftermarket since she only bought 210,000 off Wyndham directly . Not sure it’s worth $598 to transfer to me especially when I own 6 other timeshares but not Wyndham points


Sorry but I’m still confused where you are at on the website.
At the top of the the home page click on  “My Ownership “ then go down to contracts and click on the contract.
If that’s where you are and it shows “points owned 1,210,000”  Bali Hai Presidential Reserve, they spent a very large sum of $$ and it would be a shame to let that go to waste.
When you say “I click on make a reservation at owned resort on contract page” doesn’t make sense to me & I can’t tell where you are on the website


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## Debidocsr (Feb 7, 2019)

Braindead said:


> Sorry but I’m still confused where you are at on the website.
> At the top of the the home page click on  “My Ownership “ then go down to contracts and click on the contract.
> If that’s where you are and it shows “points owned 1,210,000”  Bali Hai Presidential Reserve, they spent a very large sum of $$ and it would be a shame to let that go to waste.
> When you say “I click on make a reservation at owned resort on contract page” doesn’t make sense to me & I can’t tell where you are on the website


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## Debidocsr (Feb 7, 2019)

It clearly says 500,000 biennial odd and 105,000 biennial odd, reciprocal ARP, UDI On Cliff. I just don’t understand why  it shows future use as so much. I think I misunderstood as the resort Bali Hai is a presidential resort. I just know somehow I got upgraded when I used her resort in Carlsbad last year.   Thanks for your time and energy helping me figure this out. I really appreciate any input or ideas


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## capital city (Feb 8, 2019)

Its showing exactly twice the amount. Either your just looking at the total for future use and not year by year or she deposited one year into a future year effectively doubling the amount available


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## paxsarah (Feb 8, 2019)

If you go into the online account, My Ownership, Financial Info, and then scroll down to the PDF assessments. Look at the latest one, and there will be a column with “Total points determining HOA billing” which for me is the average points across two years (since my odds and evens are different). There is also a column with “total contract points” and for me as an owner of both biennial and annual points, it’s the number of points I get on my bigger year (in my case, odd years). If you look at those two figures, you’ll have a better idea of what the account actually comprises.


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## HitchHiker71 (Feb 8, 2019)

Here's a screenshot of what we are referring to if you login and click on My Ownership, you will see the current Tier status right on the splash page, which will clearly indicate the ownership type and if any VIP status exists:


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## ausman (Feb 8, 2019)

I would point out, as others have, that even without VIP status the Bali Hai ownership in itself is valuable. It has one of the lowest MF's in the system. It is a worthwhile ownership for that reason alone. The amount of points gives you great choices for Wyndham vacations. The smaller contract not so much but if you can use the points maybe.


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## ausman (Feb 8, 2019)

This is not mine but a copy of an account I came across some years ago. The account you have access to should show similar biennial contracts. You can see the Contract point value and that 1/2 of the fees are being billed each year.

This does not show points available in 2016, for that there there would have been another section.


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## Debidocsr (Feb 9, 2019)

Thanks. So I guess the million dollar question is should I keep 605,000 points for $151 month first biennial usage 2021 with no VIP status at these two resorts? I do have 7650 points in shell already, a deeded week at 1 bdrm London Bridge, a deeded 1 bdrm week at Peacock Suites and a deeded 2 bdrm Marriott but clear in titles. I was thinking maybe ovation would take my points back and Wyndham points may be better but trading power okay in RCI for Shell


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## Jan M. (Feb 9, 2019)

DLB said:


> Thanks. So I guess the million dollar question is should I keep 605,000 points for $151 month first biennial usage 2021 with no VIP status at these two resorts? I do have 7650 points in shell already, a deeded week at 1 bdrm London Bridge, a deeded 1 bdrm week at Peacock Suites and a deeded 2 bdrm Marriott but clear in titles. I was thinking maybe ovation would take my points back and Wyndham points may be better but trading power okay in RCI for Shell



It should be possible to do this in such a way that the VIP status is retained unless of course your cousin has already ruined the account.


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## Debidocsr (Feb 9, 2019)

But at biennial 605,000 points that doesn’t qualify does it?


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## Jan M. (Feb 9, 2019)

DLB said:


> But at biennial 605,000 points that doesn’t qualify does it?



If I understood your first post correctly they get 605,000 points annually or 1,210,000 biannually. If the account is grandfathered at gold that is worth a great deal to you.


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## Debidocsr (Feb 9, 2019)

I looked at contract and it says 500,000and 105,000 biennial. She must have had a 500,000 point credit or something in her account which is why I got so confused and why she shows 1210,000 in future use.  Doesn’t VIP start at 400,000?


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## CCdad (Feb 9, 2019)

DLB said:


> I looked at contract and it says 500,000and 105,000 biennial. She must have had a 500,000 point credit or something in her account which is why I got so confused and why she shows 1210,000 in future use.  Doesn’t VIP start at 400,000?



Like Hitchhiker71, PAXSARAH and Basham posted earlier, if you'd print out the details from the Ownership Details screen and the 2019 MF statement, that would definitely clear up what is owned and if the account status is VIP grandfathered or not.

If you can log into the account, go to My Ownership, Ownership Details screen.  Save this screen and the 2019 MF statement to PDF and post what these two things say (so there's no more guessing and speculation on the part of those trying to give useful advice).

Most veteran Wyndham owners think having a Bali Hai Villas (BHV for short) contract is worth owning because of their low MFs per 1k points. Especially if this account is grandfathered VIP Gold (500K developer annual points or 1,000K total biennial developer bought points).

Despite the fact that your aunt may have said that the BHV was resale, there was a time when those floating / fixed weeks (originally sold by Pahio) were given Wyndham developer point status when converted with a developer purchase.  Some of those fixed week contract numbers started with 80 when converted to points (as you see in Basham's example of a MF statement above).

Good luck.


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