# Another new rule that will make Wyndham more money



## John_and_Val (Mar 1, 2018)

Just called reservations.........in the beginning of call a message states there is a new benefit for owners. It allows an owner to pay a additional 50 bucks to get a refundable cancellation (points) within the day of the reservation.


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## 55plus (Mar 1, 2018)

That's not if you have a 14 day reservation and iffy travel plans. Fifty dollars v. possibly losing a lot of points - count me in.


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## WyndhamBarter (Mar 1, 2018)

But wait.  There is a refundable cancellation for last-minute
reservations that are cancelled within 24 hours.  I've used it.
(And it didn't cost 50 bucks.)

The most recent member directory supplement:

http://www.nxtbook.com/nxtbooks/wyndham/plus_membersdirectory_supplement1718/

...says on page 5:

"Last-Minute Reservations

If you are making a reservation 15 days or less prior to check-in,
you have 24 hours to cancel your reservation without forfeiting
your points.

When booking a reservation for same-day check-in, the reservation
must be canceled prior to 12 a.m. ET to avoid forfeiting your points."

Is this claimed new benefit that you can reserve months in advance
and then cancel up to 24 hours prior to the check-in date?  Is it
available on the website yet?


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## 55plus (Mar 1, 2018)

I couldn't find it on the website so I assume it'll have to be done through a VC. I book ARP at 13 months so $50 isn't a bad investment to save 14 days of points. It's like insurance, it's good to have when you need it.


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## ecwinch (Mar 1, 2018)

Last minute emergencies do popup. So that does makes sense that they offer something like this.


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## Sandi Bo (Mar 1, 2018)

More money in WYN's pocket and less last minute availability for owners.


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## nkldavy (Mar 1, 2018)

I was told we cannot take the insurance inside of 3 months before check-in.
   Uncle Davey


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## schoolmarm (Mar 1, 2018)

They DO make you take the insurance months ahead, but I can't remember what the window is.

I called them from the ER or maybe it was my hospital room (just finished the stress test, maybe) the day before I was supposed to check in and they were REALLY nice and gave me my points back. She explained the new $49 "insurance." There is a specific window that you need to be in for it.  Frankly, I was having chest pains and I can't remember.  I know that my reservation for next week  was NOT in that window. It is 3-4 weeks after my call from the hospital.


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## Dave Landry (Mar 1, 2018)

WyndhamBarter said:


> But wait.  There is a refundable cancellation for last-minute
> reservations that are cancelled within 24 hours.  I've used it.
> (And it didn't cost 50 bucks.)
> 
> ...



We used the last minute cancelation too. Was wondering if it would credit the transaction as well but instead it charged us another reversion credit.


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## Baby Jane (Mar 2, 2018)

I am just wondering how many people have a problem within the 14 day window that they need to cancel? In the 22 years we have owned this has happened once. A friend I was sending was in a car accident. I just asked my inlaws if they would like to go instead. We are platitinum so if we paid $50 for every vacation Wyndham would be making a small fortune off of us for no reason. I think I would risk the points even if I had to give away the trip to friend or family member


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## Braindead (Mar 2, 2018)

Baby Jane said:


> I am just wondering how many people have a problem within the 14 day window that they need to cancel? In the 22 years we have owned this has happened once. A friend I was sending was in a car accident. I just asked my inlaws if they would like to go instead. We are platitinum so if we paid $50 for every vacation Wyndham would be making a small fortune off of us for no reason. I think I would risk the points even if I had to give away the trip to friend or family member


Same here. Wyndham will not get my $ on this insurance


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## JohnPaul (Mar 2, 2018)

It sounds a bit like Point Protection that I can get through Vacation Internationale.  Normally any cancellation within 30 days of arrival loses all points.  For $45, which must be paid at the time of initial reservation you can cancel for any reason up to the last business day before your arrival.  VI charges a $20 reservation fee in lieu of housekeeping and Point Protection also lets you adjust your reservation without paying the fee again.  

I have found it useful on occasion.

Obviously you don't need to buy it if you don't think it's useful.


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## Ron2 (Mar 7, 2018)

I spoke with a VC yesterday about the Points Protection Feature and was told that you could purchase the protection up to 15 days before check-in and cancel as late as noon on the check-in date. Obviously at 15 days out, if you know you can't use the reservation, it would be best to just cancel the reservation and recover the points. But if for some reason like an illness or injury that may keep you homebound, it may be useful if purchased last minute. I wouldn't buy it much before the 15 day deadline and only if there was an issue that may prevent me from getting to the resort.


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## pedro47 (Mar 7, 2018)

Let’s said that 20,000 owners used this new feature. Wyndham will make 1 million dollars using this feature.


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## happyhopian (Mar 7, 2018)

Here's a point no one is noticing - these aren't wyndham's points nor are the wyndham's rules.

The trust has certain rules and only the members of the trust can vote to change those rules. 

How does paying Wyndham $50 provide the ability to change the rules. i guess Wyndham could just randomly decide to allow booking 24 months in advance.


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## Braindead (Mar 7, 2018)

happyhopian said:


> Here's a point no one is noticing - these aren't wyndham's points nor are the wyndham's rules.
> 
> The trust has certain rules and only the members of the trust can vote to change those rules.
> 
> How does paying Wyndham $50 provide the ability to change the rules. i guess Wyndham could just randomly decide to allow booking 24 months in advance.


What members of the trust voted on the changes that came along with Voyager? When and where did that vote take place ?
Why bring this up now ? I think this is a minor change compared to last years directory supplement and Voyager disaster


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## happyhopian (Mar 8, 2018)

Braindead said:


> What members of the trust voted on the changes that came along with Voyager? When and where did that vote take place ?
> Why bring this up now ? I think this is a minor change compared to last years directory supplement and Voyager disaster


I'm not going to disagree with you but that is my point. The rules say it requires x amount of points and that the point expire at a certain time and that it requires a certain amount of points to do this or that. If Wyndham can just change the rules to make more money for them then they are no longer managing a trust for us owners, they are using our trust to increase their profits as they see fit. This is more inline with the previous argument that they implemented voyager to free up more inventory from the mega renters so they could send it to holidays. This just seems more blatant. Now if they money went to the trust to reduce cost to owners, then I could see the argument. Look, I'm not tilting at windmills. As Ron said last year - this is their game now and if anyone doesn't want to play you just need to go home. You can't win a lawsuit against them so it doesn't matter but that doesn't mean it any less true


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## Braindead (Mar 8, 2018)

happyhopian said:


> I'm not going to disagree with you but that is my point. The rules say it requires x amount of points and that the point expire at a certain time and that it requires a certain amount of points to do this or that. If Wyndham can just change the rules to make more money for them then they are no longer managing a trust for us owners, they are using our trust to increase their profits as they see fit. This is more inline with the previous argument that they implemented voyager to free up more inventory from the mega renters so they could send it to holidays. This just seems more blatant. Now if they money went to the trust to reduce cost to owners, then I could see the argument. Look, I'm not tilting at windmills. As Ron said last year - this is their game now and if anyone doesn't want to play you just need to go home. You can't win a lawsuit against them so it doesn't matter but that doesn't mean it any less true


This is not a mandatory matter. Any owner using this fee as insurance is doing so voluntarily. I actually see this as an owner benefit. I don’t plan on using the insurance but I have no problem with Wyndham when an owner can opt in or out. Anytime Wyndham will allow an owner to make their own decision I will applaud Wyndham for it


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## Ron2 (Mar 8, 2018)

I agree with Braindead. It's a good feature for owners planning family reunions where they reserve several units but need to deal with last minute cancellations. I doubt Wyndham is going to make a lot of money from this because most people with any common sense won't buy it until last minute and only if they see a potential need.


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## sandkastle4966 (Mar 8, 2018)

VC I talked to said it was outside of 90 days to purchase the protection - not up to 15.....


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## Nomad34 (Mar 9, 2018)

Braindead said:


> What members of the trust voted on the changes that came along with Voyager? When and where did that vote take place ?
> Why bring this up now ? I think this is a minor change compared to last years directory supplement and Voyager disaster


They voted to stay in the fairshare trust and put CWA in the Wyndham trust, hence to Voyager.


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## WyndhamBarter (May 11, 2018)

Just today I noticed that this $49 "Points Protection" feature has been added to the website.

The detail page doesn't say anything about a 90-day advance purchase requirement; in
fact (my reading says) it should be purchasable up to 15 days before.

"You may add Points Protection to new reservations at the time of booking, when booking 15 days or more prior to the check-in date.

Additionally, you may purchase Points Protection for any of your existing reservations that have been reserved 15 days or more prior to your check-in date."

https://www.myclubwyndham.com/mycw/happening/news/points-protection.page?



 

https://www.myclubwyndham.com/mycw/...g-my-vacation/points-protection-program.page?


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## Sandy VDH (Jul 4, 2018)

I read it the same way as Wyndham Barter. 

I would be interested in hearing from anyone who has used this since it was introduced.   Anyone tried it and cancelled yet?


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## littlestar (Jul 6, 2018)

Ron2 said:


> I agree with Braindead. It's a good feature for owners planning family reunions where they reserve several units but need to deal with last minute cancellations. I doubt Wyndham is going to make a lot of money from this because most people with any common sense won't buy it until last minute and only if they see a potential need.


I added the insurance for a family reunion in Hawaii. I am using all of our Wyndham points and with so many family members going, anything could happen last minute. I am also using DVC points and I insured the DVC points for the first time since owning (2002).


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## ddavid1073 (Jul 6, 2018)

To cancel within the 14 day window is rare but it does happen.

If someone wants to have an added level of "point" protection, this is an excellent feature.

Just last week I purchased two nights in DC through Hotwire.  My wife was starting to come down with something so for $10 I purchased trip insurance through Allianz.  She became sicker and we needed to cancel the trip.  They are reviewing the claim but it's valid and I believe they will pay on the claim.  

It's not something I usually do but in this case it was prudent.  For older or sicker people, I think it's great that they've added this option.

Will it make them money?  Of course!  That's why they are in business.  But in my opinion, there is value returned for the cost, even if it's just peace of mind.


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## am1 (Jul 6, 2018)

Who eats the points if the reservation goes unused as it was cancelled within the 15 day window.  This will result in more points chasing the same amount of rooms.  I would have used it on some reservations when I was renting.  Especially if reservations up to 14 nights were allowed.  I had hundreds of reservations go unused and a lot that were discounted close to check in to unload them.  If I took out insurance on a few high point reservations when I had 5-10 of the same reservation I would not have had to think about canceling at 15 days.


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## wjappraise (Jul 6, 2018)

To me it is like buying the extended warranty on a used car. . . there are loads of disclaimers to prevent the purchaser from ever cashing in.  Decades ago I worked for a car dealer, they sold them on almost every used car deal.  The insurance company that issued the policy paid the dealership 50% up front as a sales commission, and still made a profit.  

Insurance should be reserved for those things we cannot afford to "self insure."  I own a small company and we all have iPhones.  We do NOT buy the insurance program that costs $12 per month per phone and has a deductible.  We can afford to cover the costs of the few broken screens or waterlogged phones that happen over the course of several years.  Cost vs. value.


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## skotrla (Jul 6, 2018)

wjappraise said:


> To me it is like buying the extended warranty on a used car. . . there are loads of disclaimers to prevent the purchaser from ever cashing in.  Decades ago I worked for a car dealer, they sold them on almost every used car deal.  The insurance company that issued the policy paid the dealership 50% up front as a sales commission, and still made a profit.
> 
> Insurance should be reserved for those things we cannot afford to "self insure."  I own a small company and we all have iPhones.  We do NOT buy the insurance program that costs $12 per month per phone and has a deductible.  We can afford to cover the costs of the few broken screens or waterlogged phones that happen over the course of several years.  Cost vs. value.



Agree completely insurance - it makes sense if you have an above average chance of needing it.  Buy travel insurance if you have en expectation of needing to cancel.  Buy phone insurance if you go through multiple phone per year.  You want to buy insurance in cases where they wouldn't sell it to you if they were reviewing your policy on a case-by-case basis.

-Scott


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## Sandy VDH (Jul 6, 2018)

If you have a large amount of points at risk, then my all mean purchase the insurance.  I think I might use it on occasion but not every time.


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## uscav8r (Jul 10, 2018)

Sandi Bo said:


> More money in WYN's pocket and less last minute availability for owners.



Why would there be less last minute availability for owners? The way I see it, this could open up more availability at the last minute. 

The point at which the availability appears may be different (i.e., inside of 15 days), but this opens up the possibility of cancelling with minimal pain to a broader population of bookings. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Sandi Bo (Jul 10, 2018)

uscav8r said:


> Why would there be less last minute availability for owners? The way I see it, this could open up more availability at the last minute.
> 
> The point at which the availability appears may be different (i.e., inside of 15 days), but this opens up the possibility of cancelling with minimal pain to a broader population of bookings.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Chris -

I agree, you are correct. 

And, as owners, if we don't mind that WYN reaps $50 to allow people to cancel up until checkin, that's just great.  It allows less predictability overall, and I do believe that's the overall goal here.  And, it really don't matter if we mind or not. 

I'm pretty certain WYN management considers Voyager a success. For an IT person, and an owner, the system not acceptable to me.  I would be embarrassed to deliver such a mess. And yet it is what we have.  All good for WYN, the behaviors and the bugs. The uncertainties of upgrades, the illogicalness of them. The random behavior. All good for WYN. And I do believe it's here to stay. Why wouldn't WYN be considering this hot mess a huge success?

Sandi


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## tschwa2 (Jul 10, 2018)

The insurance is also an excuse for Wyndham to deny the hardship cases that it previously allowed when cancelled within 15 days.  Now instead of refunding points when there is a death or serious sickness, they can say that is why the points protection insurance is offered for cases just like these.


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## am1 (Jul 10, 2018)

tschwa2 said:


> The insurance is also an excuse for Wyndham to deny the hardship cases that it previously allowed when cancelled within 15 days.  Now instead of refunding points when there is a death or serious sickness, they can say that is why the points protection insurance is offered for cases just like these.



That would vary a lot.  Because I was dealing in hundreds of reservations a month Wyndham did not alway care about hardship cases.  One exception per account is not the same as one exception per so many points owned or reservations made.


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## wjappraise (Jul 10, 2018)

am1 said:


> That would vary a lot.  Because I was dealing in hundreds of reservations a month Wyndham did not alway care about hardship cases.  One exception per account is not the same as one exception per so many points owned or reservations made.



Not sure I follow your logic, Adam.  I believe the poster stating exceptions will now be denied has a valid point, and if so, this will be applied across all accounts, whether one reservation made a year, or "hundreds of reservations a month."


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