# British Airways Frequent Flier Award Seats



## Judy (Dec 7, 2012)

I need a PIN and chip card and have located a likely candidate in the Chase British Airways affiliated card.  Can anyone tell me how good British Airways is about making award seats available on its OneWorld partners and on British Airways itself?  I joined the British Airways Executive Club and ran a few "Book with Avios" searches, but I still don't have a good understanding of how well their program works for non-elite members. For one thing, when I find any availability at all, I'm only seeing avios and cash options.  Can someone who has experience with the British Airways frequent flier program please give me their opinion?


----------



## DeniseM (Dec 7, 2012)

My experience has been that it is fairly difficult to get seats, and if you fly to the UK, you still have to pay the taxes, which can run $500-$600 per ticket.


----------



## Pat H (Dec 8, 2012)

I often see a lot of BA flights available when looking for award seats on AA. Like Denise said, the taxes are exorbitant e.g. $700 vs $32. Doesn't make it worth it.


----------



## sjuhawk_jd (Dec 8, 2012)

Pat H said:


> I often see a lot of BA flights available when looking for award seats on AA. Like Denise said, the taxes are exorbitant e.g. $700 vs $32. Doesn't make it worth it.



And the reverse is not true. So, when you are looking on BA.com (or via phone) for AA flights for routes where BA does not fly, usually there is no availability. BA miles are worthless, they are just like Wyndham vacation club points.


----------



## Judy (Dec 8, 2012)

Thank you all for the information.  I've crossed the Chase BA affiliated credit card off my list.


----------



## x3 skier (Dec 8, 2012)

The BA card is a Chip and Signature anyway, not Chip and PIN. 

Last time I looked a couple of months ago, there were a lot of AA flights available for Avios. As long as you stay with short flights (DAY ORD is one example), it's a good deal. Trans Atlantic the fees are ridiculous. 

Cheers


----------



## Ken555 (Dec 9, 2012)

x3 skier said:


> The BA card is a Chip and Signature anyway, not Chip and PIN.



Mine is chip and pin.


----------



## Timeshare Von (Dec 9, 2012)

WOW - maybe things have changed but I found the BA Chase Visa the only way I could really afford my flights to/from Kenya last summer.  I opened two accounts (one personal & one for my family owned LLC) and received 100k miles.

With those miles, plus some earned and another 20k I had to buy, I was able to fly World Traveler Plus (like an upgraded coach) to Nairobi from Dulles Int'l . . . and first class (not "just" business class) home to Chicago/O'Hare for a total of $1,900 which included the added taxes for flying in/out of Heathrow, plus the purchase of the needed miles to get the first class ticket home.  I used the "miles + cash" purchase option, so I did not use just miles.

There were some logistics that I had to work through like buying my departing ticket immediately on the day that it became available (and I was in Alaska that day) . . . and I had to fly out of Dulles, so I had to buy a one-way ticket from Milwaukee to get to Dulles.  I then bought my return ticket 15 days later to coincide with the availability date.  Booking two one-way trips can be a bit unnerving, as you play the "what if I don't get my return ticket on the same airline?" . . . but it worked for me flawlessly.

Flying home first class was heavenly since it was a red-eye out of Nairobi after a fully day on safari.  Once in London, I had full access (by advance appointment) to their lounge and day spa.  I booked a private room there for a few hours to shower and nap; had a full breakfast and a short 20 minute facial.  Awwww it was so luxurious!

As a point of reference, a R/T coach ticket on Delta/KLM from Milwaukee (or Chicago) to Nairobi was pricing out at around $1,600.  So thanks to the BA Chase relationship, it cost me about $300 more to fly the WT+ and F/C.  For me, it was an exceptional value and deal.

All of that said, I recall reading on Flyer Talk that a lot of people who live in the UK and routinely fly BA were very upset with the "freeloaders" like myself who were not necessarily loyal BA fliers.  (I may never fly them again.)  "We" take up a lot of the seats allocated for frequent flier travel, making their miles more difficult to use because BA does seemingly have a rather limited inventory system for their FF mileage program use.


----------



## Ken555 (Dec 9, 2012)

Before I signed up for the cc, I searched for availability on some of the routes I use. In particular, BA's partnership with AA made the decision easier since seats were available for quite reasonable mile redemption amounts domestically (which I normally wouldn't use miles for) and so got the card. This included flights to Hawaii (note that they weren't available far off on the dates I tested, but were available about three or four months out) - I don't know if this is always the case, but I found it nice to see. Of course, if AA morphs into US/AA I'll have to wait and see how valuable these miles turn out to be. There are other partner airlines and I'm sure the miles won't go to waste (even if I do use them on BA one day and pay their absurd fees...).

More importantly the cc worked great while in Europe recently and I didn't pay any of those nonsense foreign transaction fees with cc purchases. I only used my AMEX (my regular cards) sparingly (primarily at Starwood hotels, and even then I hesitated to do so).


----------



## travelguy (Dec 9, 2012)

sjuhawk_jd said:


> And the reverse is not true. So, when you are looking on BA.com (or via phone) for AA flights for routes where BA does not fly, usually there is no availability. BA miles are worthless, they are just like Wyndham vacation club points.



Agreed that BA.com has crappy FF avails.  However, FT posters routinely say that you can call BA with availability info from the AA website and BA will book those seats.  I've never done this so YMMV.


----------



## x3 skier (Dec 9, 2012)

Ken555 said:


> Mine is chip and pin.



When did they change? I just got a new one last week as a replacement and it still requires a signature for charges. 

You can use a PIN for use at an ATM but AFAIK, not for charges. 

Cheers


----------



## Ken555 (Dec 10, 2012)

x3 skier said:


> When did they change? I just got a new one last week as a replacement and it still requires a signature for charges.
> 
> You can use a PIN for use at an ATM but AFAIK, not for charges.
> 
> Cheers



Well, good question. I just got the card recently (in fact, they had to send it to me when I was in London...and though they have a printing facility outside London, the card was printed in the States and shipped overnight to me, but then it wasn't, and took longer...). Anyway, I was specifically told it was a full chip and pin card, and yet when I received it I had to use it just as you mention - chip and signature. This was due, I was told, because it takes time to get the pin and it had to be mailed to my home address only. So, I haven't used it as a chip and pin card, but I was assured that's what it was. 

I suppose you're going to tell me that three reps at Chase told me wrong, and that it's really just a chip and signature card, right? This would be disappointing, since I got it in part to use as a full chip and pin card for future trips. FWIW, the paperwork that came with the card did use the words "chip and pin".


----------



## x3 skier (Dec 11, 2012)

Ken555 said:


> I suppose you're going to tell me that three reps at Chase told me wrong, and that it's really just a chip and signature card, right? This would be disappointing, since I got it in part to use as a full chip and pin card for future trips. FWIW, the paperwork that came with the card did use the words "chip and pin".



That is what I would tell you but who knows what is the truth. When I first got mine, I got the same story about it being a chip and pin. After about five calls, I finally got someone who knew what they were talking about and was told it is a chip and signature for charges and chip and pin for ATM use. I have had the account for almost a year and never been allowed to use a pin. The PIN I was mailed almost a year ago was for ATM's which I destroyed since I have no use for that function with Chase. 

May have changed but I doubt it since when I used it in Hungary and Austria two weeks ago it was chip and signature. The call reps really don't know what they are talking about and I suggest you ask to talk to a supervisor who *may* know the right story. 

Cheers


----------



## JudyH (Dec 11, 2012)

I agree it is chip and signature.  We just used it all over Europe and never used a PIN.


----------



## Ken555 (Dec 11, 2012)

JudyH said:


> I agree it is chip and signature.  We just used it all over Europe and never used a PIN.



But did you get a pin in the mail? If you didn't request one, it works as chip and signature for sure.


----------



## scotlass (Dec 12, 2012)

The BA card is a chip and pin and we used it as such in September in the UK.  It can also be a signature card which is what it would be in the US.  It is true that it does not charge for foreign transaction fees.

I found good availability for ff flights to the UK but, as another poster said, the taxes are ridiculous.  If you have United or AA miles, like we do, you can book the flight to the UK with BA and the return on United or AA.   It's the return flight on BA that is exorbitant although the flight over is also not as cheap as other airlines.  

There is another advantage to the BA card....you need fewer miles each way, 20,000 miles one way for a flight from Boston to LHR vs. 30,000 with AA and United.


----------



## sml2181 (Dec 12, 2012)

Just wanted to add that I have seen many ff seats from the US mainland to Hawaii. Takes 25K avios rt. I could imagine this to be quite an ok value to some. I've also seen flights to SJD and CUN; I haven't really searched other destinations from the US. 

Personally I have used the cash/miles option. For our family of 6 this can be a good option to get lower fares during summer vacation.


----------



## Ken555 (Dec 12, 2012)

sml2181 said:


> Just wanted to add that I have seen many ff seats from the US mainland to Hawaii.



That's how I hope to use these miles! Interestingly, during a test search a month or more ago, I discovered that seats far out were not available but seats within a few months were. Of course, I don't know if this is indicative of regular availability or not.

And, 25k for a roundtrip fight to Hawaii is a great deal, when you consider that it really just costs ~$16,670 to get that amount. Based on any other credit card program, I believe this may be the best deal around.

I was incorrect. Here is the actual redemption costs for Hawaii (still a good rate).



> This is a direct flight.
> Avios required	Money	Additional charges
> 37500
> $ 0.00
> $ 10.90 *taxes, fees and carrier charges



Ok, now I'm officially confused. The quote above is from the BA award calculator. Yet when I find actual flights available for the same route, the award total is only 25k, such as:



> Total	25000 Avios + $ 5.00



And fwiw, AA has a bunch of seats available on Sundays from LAX to OGG in Jan and Feb, at least at the moment.

Surprisingly, it seems it costs more to fly from LAX to FLL than to OGG (30k vs 25k).


----------



## sml2181 (Dec 12, 2012)

Last month, I saw many openings to both HNL and OGG from various US mainland cities on both AA and BA for next summer. I thought it was interesting to see that they did not offer the same flights, but different flights on different days. I ended up using United from Europe, but sometimes it is a great value to pay cash for the transatlantic part and then use AA or BA miles for the last part. 

I was actually looking for flights to CAN, but tickets to CAN were much more expensive paying cash than tickets to Hawaii, and I couldn't find more than a single seat using miles. So, we reconsidered and  now we "have" to go to Maui.


----------



## x3 skier (Dec 12, 2012)

scotlass said:


> The BA card is a chip and pin and we used it as such in September in the UK.  It can also be a signature card which is what it would be in the US.



Interesting since when I used my Chase BA Chip card in the UK in Oct and in Austria and Hungary two weeks ago for charges, I had to sign and was never asked for a PIN. It read the Chip and spit out a receipt for me to sign while friends I was with entered a PIN when their Euro based Bank cards were inserted in the same machine. 

You can get a true Chip and PIN from Chase Canada. 

Cheers


----------



## scotlass (Dec 13, 2012)

x3 skier said:


> Interesting since when I used my Chase BA Chip card in the UK in Oct and in Austria and Hungary two weeks ago for charges, I had to sign and was never asked for a PIN. It read the Chip and spit out a receipt for me to sign while friends I was with entered a PIN when their Euro based Bank cards were inserted in the same machine.
> 
> You can get a true Chip and PIN from Chase Canada.
> 
> Cheers



Actually, while we were in the UK we used it both ways.  I guess I should have said that when a chip and pin was required, which did happen, we were able to make the purchase without having the card rejected.


----------



## Pat H (Dec 13, 2012)

Do you think there is a difference between cards issued to US residents vs those who live in Europe?


----------



## x3 skier (Dec 18, 2012)

Pat H said:


> Do you think there is a difference between cards issued to US residents vs those who live in Europe?



AFAIK, all Euro credit/debit cards are true Chip and PIN while there are only a few in the USA. 

Cheers


----------

