# Raintrees Whiski Jack , Whistler



## boatnut (Nov 1, 2008)

After two weeks of nothing but people sipestepping the question, lack of any real answers and general evasise behavior by anybody I tried to talk to at Raintree or RCI I gave up on the idea of buying a Timeshare. That was approx 4 weeks ago. Having calmed down and now armed with some "insider info"   lol... (one of those Raintree Vacation Club usage calenders/matrix) provided to me by somebody that owns a week at Whiski Jack, I feel up to trying again. 
  How can I verify if a unit is an "A", "B", or "C" rated unit?  PLEASE do not say call Raintree!!  Is there a list published, does the rating apply to the building or is it somehow unit/week related?  Raintree has zero interest in talking to anybody unless they are a member or want to talk to the sales dept.  HELP!!!


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## Bill4728 (Nov 2, 2008)

First, Welcome to TUG, Most people here love their TS and find that it is agreat way to vacation. And just like you most of us have discovered that buying resale can save us huge amounts of money. If you buy whiski jack resale you'll also find you'll save huge amounts of money compared to buying from raintree.   

Second,  There are only a few people on the site who have any significant working knowledge of Raintree/Whiski Jack  It may be awhile for you to get the info you need.

Personally, I ask for what ever info you can from the seller

Sorry


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Nov 2, 2008)

try calling 800-424-6532. Explain what info you are seeking from one the Raintree Vacation Guides.  They should be able to get the info from the points charts for the various resorts.


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## boatnut (Nov 2, 2008)

*obvious??*

Thanks. I have found a fixed week that shows as a platinum level week on Raintree Vacation Clubs Usage Calendar. Does this mean this week/unit that is for sale  is a platinum week for trading purposes within Raintree? Seems obvious, however, timeshare land seems to work differently lol....  Anybody know what (if any) the fees are to join Raintree Vacation Club? Does it come with the purchase of a week automatically? Clive.


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## geoand (Nov 2, 2008)

You may have to contact Whiski Jack in Whistler to get the info you seek.  Purchasing  a week resale may not get you a membership in Raintree.  Shucks, I am not sure if purchasing a week directly from Whiski Jack gets you a membership with Raintree.  We own at Tynnsdahl Hall and then paid a fee to join Raintree.  We joined in 2000 or 2001 and have thoroughly enjoyed our membership.


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## boatnut (Nov 2, 2008)

*Raintree Membership*

Thanks for the response. Can I ask how much the fee was to "join" thr Raintree Vacation Club?


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Nov 2, 2008)

boatnut said:


> Thanks. I have found a fixed week that shows as a platinum level week on Raintree Vacation Clubs Usage Calendar. Does this mean this week/unit that is for sale  is a platinum week for trading purposes within Raintree? Seems obvious, however, timeshare land seems to work differently lol....  Anybody know what (if any) the fees are to join Raintree Vacation Club? Does it come with the purchase of a week automatically? Clive.



If it's a platinum week *and* it's part of Raintree Vacation Club it will trade in Raintree as a platinum week.  

There is a direct and specific correlation between gem level in Raintree and the number of points a week receives.  (The gem level program preceded Raintree using points; when Points were introduced all of the gem levels became equated with specific numbers of points.) A platinum week is worth 72,000 points in Raintree (which aiso how many RCI Points it has if you trade it through RCI).  Because there is a direct correlation between gem level and points, you can work out which Whiski Jack properties are A, B, or C by comparing the point levels (or gem levels) associated with a given property.


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## boatnut (Nov 3, 2008)

*Thanks*

Really gratefull for all the advise. So if I understand correctly....  It IS possible to buy a deeded week in the Whiski Jack complex (in a building that is listed in Whiski Jack Resorts Annual news letter) WITHOUT it qualifying as a tradable week within the Raintree Vacation Clubs other resorts?  If this is this case, would a timeshare advertised as "Raintrees Whiski Jack" be false advertising if it did NOT qualify for trading ?


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Nov 3, 2008)

boatnut said:


> Really gratefull for all the advise. So if I understand correctly....  It IS possible to buy a deeded week in the Whiski Jack complex (in a building that is listed in Whiski Jack Resorts Annual news letter) WITHOUT it qualifying as a tradable week within the Raintree Vacation Clubs other resorts?  If this is this case, would a timeshare advertised as "Raintrees Whiski Jack" be false advertising if it did NOT qualify for trading ?



I believe so.  There are many units that Whiski Jack sold before Raintree appeared, and unless and until the owners have joined those units to Raintree, those units operate exactly as they did prior to Raintree appearing.

Raintree is probably the most confusing multi-resort system around.  Before you assume it's false advertising, you should consider that perhaps some owners don't know exactly what they own.  When all of the correspondence you see says "Raintree", your resort website it at the Raintree web site, your annual statements say "Raintree", and you've sat through owner updates that tell you all about how "Raintree" has acquired "Whiski Jack", it's not surprising that many Whiski Jack (and Club Regina owners as well) think they own a Raintree timeshare.

+++++++

A couple of other Raintree comments.  

First, as regards their points system:

When Raintree was formed Raintree set up the gem levels to identify trade power and value of weeks within the system.  Then they decided to offer a points system and to accomplish that they hooked up their system with RCI Points, tying RCI Points to the gem levels. At that point you could use gem levels to do week for week exchanges within Raintree, and if you wanted to trade through RCI you were in the weeks system.  Or you could upgrade to "Raintree Vacation Club powered by RCI Points" which turned your gem level into points. You could use those points in RCI Points, and you could also book less than week long stays within Raintree by using points.

At some point, without telling owners, Raintree simply converted the entire Club to RCI Points at no cost to owners who hadn't paid for the upgrade to RCI Points.  

Second, as regards Raintree operations:

Raintree is without doubt one of the worst operations at communicating with owners.  A good example is the situation cited above in which they simply migrated the whole system to RCI Points, with nary a word to owners about what was going.  I was totally confused when I talked to a phone rep and he he started talking about points in my account and doing four and five night availabilities.  I had no idea what he was talking about.  Eventually I was able to piece together what happened, when I realized that I had access to everything about RCI Points that had been pitched to us during an "Owner Upgrade".

Third, don't let this scare you off from Raintree.

Where confusion reigns, those who have correct information have a distinct advantage. If you are willing to invest time in understanding the system you have a distinct advantage in the Raintree resale market.  You can easily identify properties that are underpriced because the owners don't really know what they own.  Similarly, you will easily know properties to stay away from because the owners don't own what they think they do. You will know what questions to ask of owners.

Needless to say with all of this, you should never consider buying any Club Regina/Whiski Jack/Raintree property unless you have the opportunity to confirm ownership details (using the phone number I gave above).


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## boatnut (Nov 3, 2008)

Thanks again. I think I'm gettin it now!   Clive.


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## geoand (Nov 3, 2008)

Steve is absolutely correct with his comments about Raintree.  We were Whiski Jack owners who were given the option to join RVC thru the WJ "let us tell you about a great opportunity update pitch."

One item that Steve did not mention is that RVC owners can use both RCI Points and RCI Weeks.

The join RVC costs back in 2000 has to be considerably cheaper than what it is today.  If memory serves correctly, we paid in the vicinity of $1000 to $1100 to join.


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## nyparadigm (Nov 3, 2008)

boatnut said:


> How can I verify if a unit is an "A", "B", or "C" rated unit?  PLEASE do not say call Raintree!!  Is there a list published, does the rating apply to the building or is it somehow unit/week related?



Back to one of your original questions...the most recent version of the usage matrix for Whiski Jack identifies which resorts fall into A, B or C.  

I don't know Whiski Jack, but it seems to me that if you have a basic description of the unit type and you know the resort it is in, along with the week #, then you have all the information you need to determine the Gem level for the unit...assuming that it actually has been converted to a Gem level...

Confused yet...?

Chris


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## boatnut (Nov 3, 2008)

*Confused, kinda?*

Wow, this is one painfull convoluted learning curve. That said, fairly confident I have found what I was looking for.....  Platinum RVC membership included (with a $525 transfer fee), 2 bedroom/loft, sleeps 8, red week (week 20 in Whiski Jack Northstar), deeded, $682 MF, original owner paid 23k!!, I'm getting for $2,000 plus transfers etc. Phew, anything else I need? Remember my goal is to trade for Club Regina, P Vallarta WITHIN Raintree. I intend to call RVC tomorrow with owners approval and membership info to confirm trade value/membership. If that checks out, am I OK to commit?


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## aliikai2 (Nov 4, 2008)

*Are you sure that this week is part of Raintree ??*

These resorts sold lots of weeks before they became part of Raintree, and a fixed week 20( slow season) doesn't sound like a Raintree ownership. I just don't want to to get this and the find out that you own a poor trader, that can only be used there or through RCI. Greg



boatnut said:


> Wow, this is one painfull convoluted learning curve. That said, fairly confident I have found what I was looking for.....  Platinum RVC membership included (with a $525 transfer fee), 2 bedroom/loft, sleeps 8, red week (week 20 in Whiski Jack Northstar), deeded, $682 MF, original owner paid 23k!!, I'm getting for $2,000 plus transfers etc. Phew, anything else I need? Remember my goal is to trade for Club Regina, P Vallarta WITHIN Raintree. I intend to call RVC tomorrow with owners approval and membership info to confirm trade value/membership. If that checks out, am I OK to commit?


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Nov 4, 2008)

aliikai2 said:


> These resorts sold lots of weeks before they became part of Raintree, and a fixed week 20( slow season) doesn't sound like a Raintree ownership.



The fact that it's a fixed week 20 doesn't really indicate much about whether it is or is not part of Raintree - it probably was sold as Whiski Jack but the issue is whether or not it was converted.

Just to make matters more confusing, even after Raintree acquired Whiski Jack they continued to sell Whiski Jack units as Whiski Jack properties not part of Raintree Vacation Club.  In a sales presentation we went to about eight years ago the presentation included options to either purchase a straight Whiski Jack unit, or to buy a unit that would be part of Raintree from the outset.

Of course, everything said Raintree so an owner buying a Whiski Jack ownership could easily think they were buying a Raintree ownership.


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## aliikai2 (Nov 4, 2008)

*Exactly my point*

Only you said it better Steve 

Greg 



T_R_Oglodyte said:


> The fact that it's a fixed week 20 doesn't really indicate much about whether it is or is not part of Raintree - it probably was sold as Whiski Jack but the issue is whether or not it was converted.
> 
> Just to make matters more confusing, even after Raintree acquired Whiski Jack they continued to sell Whiski Jack units as Whiski Jack properties not part of Raintree Vacation Club.  In a sales presentation we went to about eight years ago the presentation included options to either purchase a straight Whiski Jack unit, or to buy a unit that would be part of Raintree from the outset.
> 
> Of course, everything said Raintree so an owner buying a Whiski Jack ownership could easily think they were buying a Raintree ownership.


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## nyparadigm (Nov 4, 2008)

boatnut said:


> Wow, this is one painfull convoluted learning curve. That said, fairly confident I have found what I was looking for.....  Platinum RVC membership included (with a $525 transfer fee), 2 bedroom/loft, sleeps 8, red week (week 20 in Whiski Jack Northstar), deeded, $682 MF, original owner paid 23k!!, I'm getting for $2,000 plus transfers etc. Phew, anything else I need? Remember my goal is to trade for Club Regina, P Vallarta WITHIN Raintree. I intend to call RVC tomorrow with owners approval and membership info to confirm trade value/membership. If that checks out, am I OK to commit?



FYI per the RVC usage matrix, Northstar is an "A" resort, but the unit you describe, for week 20, equates with an RVC Sapphire (117K pts) Gem membership.  Also the MF seem on the low side for both the Platinum (72K pts) and, of course, the Sapphire levels.  

Unless Whiski Jack deeded is really different from the rest of RVC, something seems not quite right...best to confirm directly with RVC as you stated you would do above.

Chris


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## boatnut (Nov 6, 2008)

*Contact!!!*

Well it actually happened, I got a real person at RVC to talk to me. They were very very guarded with their answers, however, they confirmed that the unit/week I am buying *does* trade for what I want. I committed to buy subject to RVC membership transfering. Now what? 
My experience so far tells me that the games are not over yet lol..... what can go wrong now? What should I look out for? Thanks to all who have helped out with great advise. Double thank you to Donna for talking to me on the phone and patiently explaining things. Clive.


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## geoand (Nov 6, 2008)

I will repeat that I think you should call Whiskijack in Whistler to get the info you need about the values of the unit, mf, and whether or not you will have to pay extra to join RVC or to maintain RVC.  They do have a toll free number and it is different than the RVC number.  Rvc number connects you to call center in the midwest.


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## boatnut (Nov 8, 2008)

Thanks Geo, spoke with Whiski Jacks legal dept who are doing the transfer. Confirmed it is a RVC unit and am paying $525 to transfer. I believe that I am very happy with the outcome, hated the process. In hindsight I can understand why RVC is so loath to release any info to non owners. Privacy laws and potential involvement in disputes/ upset owners re private sales that take away from theirs?  Clive


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## DMGG (Nov 14, 2008)

Congratulations!
You got an excellent deal on your Whiski Jack/RVC ownership! And your MF is very low for a Platinum level. (FYI the RVC yearly fee may be on top of the MF...)
You should not have a problem getting in to PV, especially if you plan ahead...
Peace,
David


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