# Comparison Chart of current major point system Timeshare developers



## TUGBrian

We have compiled a chart that provides a great high level overview comparison of the major Timeshare industry players currently (2017) that have point system memberships.
*
http://tug2.net/timeshare_advice/timeshare-system-comparison-chart.html*




Created with help from TUG members spurned by the discussion in this thread:

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/how-to-compare-point-systems.255425/

We hope you enjoy reading it and find it useful!  It was quite a learning experience for all involved in creating it!


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## qwerty

If I'm reading the chart correctly, you do not have a RCI points comparison. I see Wyndham which has same ownership but different point system.


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## rhonda

Concerning RCI Points -- it should be addressed but it isn't in the same "ballpark" as the products listed in the table.  RCI Points is more of a _service_ than a _product_.  One doesn't purchase pure points directly from RCI -- but, instead, one buys a separate timeshare that is 'converted to points' and 'affiliated' with the RCI Points exchange service. 

There are many (hundreds? thousands?) of different timeshare resorts affiliated with RCI Points.  Their cost and point structures will vary widely -- making it even more difficult to "average" than the handful of points products listed in the comparison table.


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## Passepartout

I have come to love the insight from another TUGger (whom I couldn't find the source of, but a 'tip of the hat' anyway)

THE ULTIMATE POINT SYSTEM: CASH.

JIM


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## CO skier

Passepartout said:


> I have come to love the insight from another TUGger (whom I couldn't find the source of, but a 'tip of the hat' anyway)
> 
> THE ULTIMATE POINT SYSTEM: CASH.
> 
> JIM


Many of my vacations would cost me at least twice as much in the CASH Rental System.  I use my cash to buy WorldMark points and get my vacations at a significant discount.


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## TUGBrian

have had a few people send emails/calls about the lack of "rci points" listed in the comparison chart.

im not quite sure how we would incorporate a useful comparison given its not an actual membership you can "buy" but instead is an exchange company.... but we can talk it over more if you like!


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## bobpark56

TUGBrian said:


> We have compiled a chart that provides a great high level overview comparison of the major Timeshare industry players currently (2017) that have point system memberships.
> *
> http://tug2.net/timeshare_advice/timeshare-system-comparison-chart.html*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Created with help from TUG members spurned by the discussion in this thread:
> 
> http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/how-to-compare-point-systems.255425/
> 
> We hope you enjoy reading it and find it useful!  It was quite a learning experience for all involved in creating it!


Why have you ignored Festiva?


TUGBrian said:


> We have compiled a chart that provides a great high level overview comparison of the major Timeshare industry players currently (2017) that have point system memberships.
> *
> http://tug2.net/timeshare_advice/timeshare-system-comparison-chart.html*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Created with help from TUG members spurned by the discussion in this thread:
> 
> http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/how-to-compare-point-systems.255425/
> 
> We hope you enjoy reading it and find it useful!  It was quite a learning experience for all involved in creating it!


You may want to add Festiva to your listing. They have 21 resorts plus sailing vacation and they have an exchange network. They also exchange through I.I.


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## DeniseM

> have had a few people send emails/calls about the lack of "rci points" listed in the comparison chart.
> im not quite sure how we would incorporate a useful comparison given its not an actual membership you can "buy" but instead is an exchange company.... but we can talk it over more if you like!



This would be more appropriate for a comparison of exchange companies - I wouldn't put it with the resort systems.


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## Sandy VDH

bobpark56 said:


> Why have you ignored Festiva?
> 
> You may want to add Festiva to your listing. They have 21 resorts plus sailing vacation and they have an exchange network. They also exchange through I.I.



Not enough discussion or participation by Festiva members.  I know nothing about it.  Obviously no one else that contributed knew anything either or we would have added it. 

Can't comment about what we don't know.  I personally have Hilton, Wyndham and Holiday Inn points.  I can comment about those just fine.


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## T_R_Oglodyte

There are lots of smaller systems out there.  As the systems get smaller, the return from effort involved to create the table and keep it updated diminishes.  At some point it's no longer worthwhile.

Perhaps it would be good to also list out smaller systems that are not included in the chart, and suggest that people post questions in the "All Other Timeshare Systems" forum.

BTW, other systems, in addition to Festiva, include Vacation Internationale and Raintree.


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## DanZale2000

TUGBrian said:


> have had a few people send emails/calls about the lack of "rci points" listed in the comparison chart.
> 
> im not quite sure how we would incorporate a useful comparison given its not an actual membership you can "buy" but instead is an exchange company.... but we can talk it over more if you like!




Last summer I attended a sales presentation at The Grandview in Las Vegas -- a Vacation Village resort. They were selling RCI points and the pitch was indistinguishable from what I have received at pure points systems like Diamond Resorts and Bluegreen. I also attended the Bluegreen presentation at Club 36. I don't see how a newbie would have any idea there's a difference between RCI points and Bluegreen points.


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## pedro47

This comparison chart is so cool.


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## TUGBrian

we just need to find a shell owner/expert to fill in the last few blanks!


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## flyguy

On the chart, ownership in Diamond Resort maintenance fee includes II membership.


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## nuwermj

flyguy said:


> On the chart, ownership in Diamond Resort maintenance fee includes II membership.



Developer purchased points only. Developer points and resale points are held in separate accounts. An individual with both types will have two accounts. An II membership is included only with the developer account.


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## rickandcindy23

Shell fees include an II membership but doesn't show on the chart. 

Shell is crazy expensive, as I know so very well.  However, using the points for 5-night stays, starting Sun, is much less expensive per night, and that is how we use our Shell ownership.  Peacock Suites is cheap to stay, and it's really even cheaper than exchanging into the resort.  It's only 2,550 points for a one bedroom for a full week, which is 23.5 per point X 2,550.  That is a little less than $600 for a week.  The two bedrooms during prime summer are only 3,900 points.  It's less than that during some of the slower times of year.  So it's not as bad as it looks.


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## GregT

Brian,

This is a good addition to TUG, I'm glad that it has been created and it will help many people!

Best,

Greg


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## TUGBrian

thank you for the shell information, ive updated the chart and uploaded the new version to the site!


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## Binspira

Brian -

This chart is very helpful - I just sent an e-mail to NOT purchase my Raintree Timeshare because of this and realizing that I need to understand more before committing to a 30 year commitment. I felt it was a good value, yet now ont sure ---> http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index....posed-to-close-this-week.257702/#post-2015996

Binspira


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## TUGBrian

glad you found us in time!


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## Binspira

Brian - Maybe you can start a new post like the one in 2006 where TUG members were surveyed about how they rank different time share companies and why? There is so much information out there and it would be interesting to see how things have shifted. Just a thought. Thanks for posting.


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## rhonda

Binspira said:


> Brian - Maybe you can start a new post like the one in 2006 where TUG members were surveyed about how they rank different time share companies and why? There is so much information out there and it would be interesting to see how things have shifted. Just a thought. Thanks for posting.


Which post are you referring to, Binspira?  Do you have a link?  Thanks!


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## Binspira

rhonda said:


> Which post are you referring to, Binspira?  Do you have a link?  Thanks!



Here you go ---> http://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?...he-top-4-hotel-based-timeshare-systems.34031/
this is a Sticky Topic under Other Timeshare companies.. seems like a great topic to be updated.


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## VacationForever

Brian,
On Worldmark, majority of the timeshares require only 10,000 points for a 2BR.  The MF is under $800 for 10K points.


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## rhonda

Binspira said:


> Here you go ---> http://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?...he-top-4-hotel-based-timeshare-systems.34031/
> this is a Sticky Topic under Other Timeshare companies.. seems like a great topic to be updated.


Ah, but it was updated?  The new version is linked right at the top of the 1st thread:  http://tug2.net/timeshare_advice/timeshare-system-comparison-chart.html

In fact, you are commenting in the discussion topic related to that very update!    Perhaps what is called for is a short list of "strengths and weaknesses" for each column?


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## Sandy VDH

VacationForever said:


> Brian,
> On Worldmark, majority of the timeshares require only 10,000 points for a 2BR.  The MF is under $800 for 10K points.



I don't recall who provided the numbers for WM.  But the decision was made to make it the AVERAGE 2 BR in High season.  So I agree all the old resorts in WM were 10K NOT all of the new ones were, so it is NOT the lowest 2 BR but an average 2 BR.  I know the 3 texas properties that I have looked at are 12K, 12.5K and 13K for a Standard 2 BR NOT the fancier Presidential 2 BRs either.

WM is already the cheapest on the list, so I wouldn't worry about it. When we did this a few weeks ago, it was agreed it was OK. 

I did the Wyndham column, and I looked at every 2 BR unit across the board and took an average.


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## VacationForever

Sandy VDH said:


> I don't recall who provided the numbers for WM.  But the decision was made to make it the AVERAGE 2 BR in High season.  So I agree all the old resorts in WM were 10K NOT all of the new ones were, so it is NOT the lowest 2 BR but an average 2 BR.  I know the 3 texas properties that I have looked at are 12K, 12.5K and 13K for a Standard 2 BR NOT the fancier Presidential 2 BRs either.
> 
> WM is already the cheapest on the list, so I wouldn't worry about it. When we did this a few weeks ago, it was agreed it was OK.
> 
> I did the Wyndham column, and I looked at every 2 BR unit across the board and took an average.


I would majority of Worldmark resorts are 10K for 2BR in the high/red season.  But I am not the one with the pen here.


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## JohnPaul

TUGBrian said:


> we just need to find a shell owner/expert to fill in the last few blanks!



Shell has "Home Clubs" such as West or Hawaii.  You can reserve at 12 months in your home club (full week) or 9 months in any club.  At 307 days, minimum stay goes to 2 days.

I'm not sure if 3900 is a good estimate of points for a 2 bedroom.  Here are some examples, all using high season. FWIW - Many of our favorite resorts don't have 2 bedrooms.  

9050                Vino Bello (Napa)
5600/6250        Whispering Woods (Welches, OR)
6450                Suites at Fisherman's Wharf (San Francisco)
6900                Sunset Plaza (Puerto Vallarta)
6350                Kona Coast Resort (Kailua - Kona)
3300 - 6200     Lawai Beach Resort (Kaloa)
3900                Peacock Suites (Anaheim)
5200                Crotched Mountain Resort (Francestown, NH)
6950                Desert Rose (Las Vegas)
4000                Foxhunt at Sapphire Valley (Sapphire, NC)
5350                Carriage Hill Resort (Barrie, Ontario)


So.....maybe 5900 or 6000 would be a closer estimate.

With regard to MF, I own West Club (I think Hawaii MF are higher).  I believe there are 5 clubs each with their own MF.   I own 15,500 points and my MF (including the club fee which is mandatory) were $3700.75 for 2017 which comes to $238.70 per thousand.

So.  If the average points is 6000 then MF would be $1432.

Developer vs resale

Resale

No Lifestyles - this includes some nice foreign hotels, some Outrigger hotels, Canadian Ramadas (I'm assuming nicer than US) and some Wyndham Resorts.  Also some bad deals for points to Spa or other credits (i.e.  1800 points for $200 gift card).

No Select Connections - An exchange into BlueGreen resorts.

No Credit toward Elite Status (now called Signature)


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## TUGBrian

would you consider the perks you lose buying resale to be significant or remotely worth the cost difference from retail?


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## JohnPaul

TUGBrian said:


> would you consider the perks you lose buying resale to be significant or remotely worth the cost difference from retail?



Absolutely not worth the cost difference.  However, I'm not sure it that's the same as saying they are minor/of no value.  I see you say the WM differences are minor even though a number of them, such as Asia Pacific booking and Club Pass are pretty handy.  By the same token, we are staying with BlueGreen in Chicago on a really good deal with the Shell Select Connections (some of our points are developer).  But if WM differences are minor, then so are Shell.

If our points credited toward elite, we might not pay transaction fees but I can pay a lot of fees for what I saved.


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## TUGBrian

its definitely a hard item to discuss, i guess i use the litmus test of "would the average person looking to buy into this system consider paying full retail to obtain the extra benefits" as the difference between major and minor.

sure those items are likely very valuable to some, and those folks would pay the extra cost...but to most?


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## JohnPaul

Any plans to update the Shell portion with the new information?


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## TUGBrian

yes sorry!

if its not in my email inbox or todo list...sadly it usually gets missed


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## TUGBrian

updated


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## Theiggy

I’m not an expert, rather a newbie, but I didn’t think the average maintenance fees for Marriott is $2500? Are there a few very high fees raising up that average?


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## TUGBrian

the average is for a standard 2br unit...not the average overall maint fees.


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## Darcyd35

I have a question. We just attended a timeshare presentation for IHG. They had this cool thing where you could book a place 45 days in advance and only pay $3-500 for a weeks stay. They also had a points system.
I'm wondering if anyone else has done this?


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## Bmatrose

Darcyd35 said:


> I have a question. We just attended a timeshare presentation for IHG. They had this cool thing where you could book a place 45 days in advance and only pay $3-500 for a weeks stay. They also had a points system.
> I'm wondering if anyone else has done this?


Thats an RCI thing not exclusive to IHG(Holiday inn Club Vacations)


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## skotrla

Sandy VDH said:


> I don't recall who provided the numbers for WM.  But the decision was made to make it the AVERAGE 2 BR in High season.  So I agree all the old resorts in WM were 10K NOT all of the new ones were, so it is NOT the lowest 2 BR but an average 2 BR.  I know the 3 texas properties that I have looked at are 12K, 12.5K and 13K for a Standard 2 BR NOT the fancier Presidential 2 BRs either.
> 
> WM is already the cheapest on the list, so I wouldn't worry about it. When we did this a few weeks ago, it was agreed it was OK.
> 
> I did the Wyndham column, and I looked at every 2 BR unit across the board and took an average.



Do you have a spreadsheet that you used to calculate Wyndham 2BR average?

I'm looking for something with detail comparable to what I created for HICV and hoping someone has a starting point!  Using Peak is tough because different resorts have different quantities of peak weeks.  Some resorts might have peak for half a year, while others might have a super-peak that only lasts a few weeks.  In my opinion the only way to get a true comparison number is to use annual points divided by 52.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1HB00pcN4u116afQyKAG1iumSddSaSTmC8rf5OoeN9Yc/edit?usp=sharing

-Scott
Owner, HICV Google+ Group


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## Sandy VDH

skotrla said:


> Do you have a spreadsheet that you used to calculate Wyndham 2BR average?
> 
> I'm looking for something with detail comparable to what I created for HICV and hoping someone has a starting point!  Using Peak is tough because different resorts have different quantities of peak weeks.  Some resorts might have peak for half a year, while others might have a super-peak that only lasts a few weeks.  In my opinion the only way to get a true comparison number is to use annual points divided by 52.
> 
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1HB00pcN4u116afQyKAG1iumSddSaSTmC8rf5OoeN9Yc/edit?usp=sharing
> 
> -Scott
> Owner, HICV Google+ Group



I don't recall if I was that methodical.  It was an exercise nearly a year ago.  But since I don't recall calculating it all out in a spreadsheet, I suspect not.  But let me go look at my files, maybe I have something.


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## skotrla

Sandy VDH said:


> I don't recall if I was that methodical.  It was an exercise nearly a year ago.  But since I don't recall calculating it all out in a spreadsheet, I suspect not.  But let me go look at my files, maybe I have something.



I compiled the resort guide into a single table of points values to allow for easy analysis:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Qg7jd4yPldw-HPWaPkVk1E68KsETwoIuyBFnJPulkgw/edit?usp=sharing

I took the annual points for the cheapest 2BR at each resort to come up with a median 2BR cost of 8.2M points (158K/week).

-Scott


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## SenorBlanco

rhonda said:


> Ah, but it was updated?  The new version is linked right at the top of the 1st thread:  http://tug2.net/timeshare_advice/timeshare-system-comparison-chart.html
> 
> In fact, you are commenting in the discussion topic related to that very update!    Perhaps what is called for is a short list of "strengths and weaknesses" for each column?



Would love an update on this like I mentioned in my topic about HGVC vs MVC. Being new, there appears to have been pretty significant changes/consolidations since this topic first posted. Understanding it’s subjective, but I love hearing (reading) those kinds of pros and cons as a newbie.


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## Gioconda79

CO skier said:


> Many of my vacations would cost me at least twice as much in the CASH Rental System.  I use my cash to buy WorldMark points and get my vacations at a significant discount.


Are you saying that owning points is better than regular vacations ? I just got 500,000 points that will renew every year from Capital vacations.  I was advised to rescind while I can. Please help me understand what you mean


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## Marathoner

I would submit that for Hyatt Residence Club, the difference between developer and resales ownership is Minor for weeks ownership.  Currently it is set as Major.  The only difference is the ability to covert to Hyatt hotel reward points.  I agree that for HRC points, the difference is major.  Perhaps an asterisk is warranted for this difference similar to the other programs?


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## TUGBrian

we can certainly update the original page, its years old now and might need some changes/additions!


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## CO skier

Gioconda79 said:


> Are you saying that owning points is better than regular vacations ? I just got 500,000 points that will renew every year from Capital vacations.  I was advised to rescind while I can. Please help me understand what you mean


For me, owning resale timeshare points is more cost effective than renting something equivalent -- most especially for my holiday ski weeks.  It would cost at least $1500/week more to rent a comparable 3 BR accommodation during those weeks.

The advice to rescind must have been in response to a retail purchase from a developer for more than $10,000?  The buy-in cost makes the difference.  Over the years, I have received enough AMEX gift cards from attending owner updates, that my buy-in cost for resale WorldMark credits is less than zero.


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## CO skier

TUGBrian said:


> we can certainly update the original page, its years old now and might need some changes/additions!


Count me in for updating the WorldMark info on the comparison chart.  If the maintenance fee information is updated (probably the most important info to update), all of the programs will need to be updated to make the mf comparisons relevant and equivalent.


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## TUGBrian

if you want to tackle the worldmark fields that need updating please do! ill update things as they come in or get posted here.

can likely get input from other systems to at the very least update the maint fee averages across the board for a 2br.


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## CO skier

TUGBrian said:


> if you want to tackle the worldmark fields that need updating please do! ill update things as they come in or get posted here.
> 
> can likely get input from other systems to at the very least update the maint fee averages across the board for a 2br.


Only the maintenance fee fields need updating for Wyndham and WorldMark.  These are the 2021 maintenance fees.

$1130 for WorldMark 2 BR ($1130 is the total maintenance fee on a 12,000 credit account)

Club Wyndham Access is a good proxy for maintenance fees, since it represents a collection of deeds at resorts across the Club Wyndham system.  MF is $6.61 per thousand points.  So,

$1440 for Wyndham 2 BR  ($6.61 times 190 plus $185 program fee)


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## dioxide45

I also wonder if there shouldn't be a link to the official TUG Advice articles included in the grid where it exists?


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## CO skier

dioxide45 said:


> I also wonder if there shouldn't be a link to the official TUG Advice articles included in the grid where it exists?


The links are in the Owner FAQ/Link row.


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## dioxide45

CO skier said:


> The links are in the Owner FAQ/Link row.


It is for all except for Vistana and Marriott. Those actually go to the FAQ for each system on the BBS. It looks like the link for Diamond is broken.


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## TUGBrian

ill add this to the newsletter today and start updating this weekend!


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## A.Win

I suggest 2 new rows:
1. Ease of renting to others: High, Medium or Low (indicator of whether to buy conservatively or aggressively)
2. TUG Owner Satisfaction: High, Medium or Low


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## Sandy VDH

A.Win said:


> I suggest 2 new rows:
> 1. Ease of renting to others: High, Medium or Low (indicator of whether to buy conservatively or aggressively)
> 2. TUG Owner Satisfaction: High, Medium or Low



#2 can be a bit of a loaded Q.  Make it Resort Satisfaction and it might be ok.  For instance Wyndham Sales - Hate.  Wyndham Resorts - Love most but not all.


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## dioxide45

Sandy VDH said:


> #2 can be a bit of a loaded Q.  Make it Resort Satisfaction and it might be ok.  For instance Wyndham Sales - Hate.  Wyndham Resorts - Love most but not all.


The bigger question is how to rate it. So we need surveys on the forum? I think #1 is a pretty good one, though it will also sometimes depend specifically on what resort or where you own. Marriott is easy to rent unless it is off season or somewhere with oversupply (Orlando, Vegas). Wyndham even seems pretty easy to rent in Orlando given all the Bonnet Creek rentals, however perhaps it is only easy for VIP owners?


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## MICROZE

What about Westgate?


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## Sandy VDH

MICROZE said:


> What about Westgate?



No one volunteered to cover Westgate.  Can't provide a summary on a system we know nothing about.


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## dioxide45

MICROZE said:


> What about Westgate?


If someone wants to write up and consolidate the details, I am sure it could be added. However, Westgate doesn't get a lot of love around these parts and I don't see very many people admitting that they own Westgate.


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## TUGBrian

updated the info for wm and wyndham, as well as fixed some links!

keep the updates coming, ill keep updating the page!


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