# Newbie Kierland SVO Owner Questions



## saluki (Mar 30, 2006)

I just got back from a Kierland promo visit & came home with a contract for a 2BR Lock-off Gold Season unit. My wife & I had no intention at all of buying, but after seeing the resort & the display villas (plus the other network properties) we decided that it made sense. Vacationing with two children in a regular hotel room can be challenging. I have always enjoyed a condo-type unit with resort amenities & that is a very hard combo to find. Starwood seems to fit the bill.

I realize from reading these boards prior to our trip that this unit could be had for cheaper in the resale market. However, the Starpoints option was very important to us.

I have read Chris Nettleton's very informative post & many threads here. I am just trying to clarify a few items. Namely...:

- Is there any significance at all to the week listed on my contract? I have a float unit but a week is listed for "deeding purposes". I just want to confirm that I can reserve ANY unit at Kierland for my 81000 StarOptions points 12 months in advance (i.e. reserve a 1BR premium Platinum season worth 81000 as opposed to my 2BR during the gold season also worth 81000 points).

- Regarding splitting the 2BR unit...this is my understanding but please confirm. I can use the premium 1BR & convert the regular 1BR points to Starpoints. I can do this every year as long as I alternate which side of the unit I use. I can do this whether I visit Kierland or any other SVO property.

More newb questions to follow, I'm sure. Just trying to make sure I have the details correct before my 7 day grace period expires.


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## skim118 (Mar 30, 2006)

saluki said:
			
		

> I just want to confirm that I can reserve ANY unit at Kierland for my 81000 StarOptions points 12 months in advance (i.e. reserve a 1BR premium Platinum season worth 81000 as opposed to my 2BR during the gold season also worth 81000 points).



No -- You can use your 81,000 Staroptions to book only in the season(gold) you purchased 12 months out.  

If you want a 1-bed platinum you will be competing with all SVN owners at 8-month period.

We love the Kierland resort, but I would rescind the purchase immediately since you can buy a 2-bed Platinum  on the resale market and get 148100 staroptions for the same price you paid for 81,000 staroptions.

Sara


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## duke (Mar 30, 2006)

skim118 said:
			
		

> No -- You can use your 81,000 Staroptions to book only in the season(gold) you purchased 12 months out.
> 
> If you want a 1-bed platinum you will be competing with all SVN owners at 8-month period.
> 
> ...




Skim118 is correct for Kierland, however, you would not have Starpoints or possible Elite program eligible.


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## vic714 (Mar 30, 2006)

saluki said:
			
		

> I realize from reading these boards prior to our trip that this unit could be had for cheaper in the resale market. However, the Starpoints option was very important to us.



Resale is an option, but you are the only one who knows if the flexibility that Starwood offers is the best for you. All of our purchases have been through the delveloper. We have no regrets with these purchases and have used all of the starpoint incentives to help offset much of the travel we have made in the last three years.

If you do decide to keep your contract make sure to sign up for the Starwood American Express. It's a GREAT way to earn additional starpoints.



			
				saluki said:
			
		

> - Is there any significance at all to the week listed on my contract? I have a float unit but a week is listed for "deeding purposes". I just want to confirm that I can reserve ANY unit at Kierland for my 81000 StarOptions points 12 months in advance (i.e. reserve a 1BR premium Platinum season worth 81000 as opposed to my 2BR during the gold season also worth 81000 points).



The week listed on the deed doesn't mean anything. Only the season that you purchased is important.

Ask away on the questions. There are many people here that will be able to give you accurate information to make an informed decision on your purchase.

Victor


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## skim118 (Mar 30, 2006)

duke said:
			
		

> Skim118 is correct for Kierland, however, you would not have Starpoints or possible Elite program eligible.




IMHO Elite Program is not that useful(unless you are talking at 4-star/5-star level in which case money is not an issue at all).

If Starpoint conversion is absolutely essential, the OP will still be better off buying a 1-bed platinum season for 81,000 staroptions since that is the only time Kierland seems hard to trade into(requires the 12 month call ahead)  This way you end up paying just  1-bed rm  maintenance fee instead of a 2-bed rm.

Sara


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## ArtsieAng (Mar 30, 2006)

Why did I think that Kierland was a mandatory Starpoint timeshare? I thought I read that somewhere.....


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## vic714 (Mar 30, 2006)

skim118 said:
			
		

> If Starpoint conversion is absolutely essential, the OP will still be better off buying a 1-bed platinum season for 81,000 staroptions since that is the only time Kierland seems hard to trade into(requires the 12 month call ahead)  This way you end up paying just  1-bed rm  maintenance fee instead of a 2-bed rm.
> 
> Sara



I love my kids ( 14 & 17 ) but if we had to cram 4 people in a 1 BR unit I'm not sure we would travel as much as we do. ( Usually 3 weeks per year ) I'm also not sure if we all would make it back home if we had to spend so much time toghether OP indicated that they will be traveling with 2 kids as well but didn't indicate the ages. I'm going to assume that if a hotel room is too small they are in the same situation.

We have had success with the elite program in not only getting nicer rooms in our hotel stays, but with our resort stays as well. We booked a 1 BR del. unit this week and were upgraded to a 1 BR prem. for the same staroptions.

Victor


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## vic714 (Mar 30, 2006)

ArtsieAng said:
			
		

> Why did I think that Kierland was a mandatory Starpoint timeshare? I thought I read that somewhere.....



Staroptions carry across a resale purchase not the ability to convert to starpoints.


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## saluki (Mar 30, 2006)

Our initial interest was in the 1BR Premium for Platinum Season but they are sold out @ Kierland. The salesman indicated that the 2BR Gold Season was the same price & same point value (81,000). I do like the fact that we can split up the 2 bedrooms & use part while banking Starwood points or taking another vacation. 

What concerns me is that as a gold season owner, I would only be able to reserve for Platinum season 8 months in advance (at Kierland). And, equally annoying is the fact that the salesman never mentioned this in spite of my grilling him on the 1BR Platinum vs. 2BR Premium Gold differences. But, knowing that will likely use our points at a variety of SVO properties, maybe it's not that big of a deal.

BTW, I do have a Starwood AMEX card. I also don't mind paying a bit of a developer premium knowing that we will take advantage of the Starpoint options & lifetime SPG Gold status.

For price comparison, I can not find a current resale listing for a Kierland 2BR Gold. I did find a 2BR Platinum for $25,500 which is more than I paid.


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## duke (Mar 30, 2006)

Saluki:
I was advised by salesperson that Kierland will have a price increase on April 1.


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## DavidnRobin (Mar 30, 2006)

I would add that you should calculate the difference in cost buying from the Developer and buying resale.

[Kierland units are available for resale on different sites, and have been recently sold on eBay - make sure you completely research - this is a low period for TS sales due to the time of year  - MFs paid, 2006 units reserved]

Then ask yourself if those StarPoints that you got for buying from the Developer are worth the difference in cost.  If yes, then not a problem.  If no, then you should rescind.  

In asking this same question for our OF WKORV-N/WKORV purchase (search TUG for more details) - we decided that the extra $20,000 saved was not worth an extra 150K StarPoints that we would have gained. (no way considering that 80K StarPoints is a one week stay at a comparable resort - no matter how you cut it...)


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## vic714 (Mar 30, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> In asking this same question for our OF WKORV-N/WKORV purchase (search TUG for more details) - we decided that the extra $20,000 saved was not worth an extra 150K StarPoints that we would have gained. (no way considering that 80K StarPoints is a one week stay at a comparable resort - no matter how you cut it...)



Robin,
Big difference between Maui and Kierland. Doesn't make sense $ wise to convert to starpoints based on the cost of the MF you/we are paying for owning there ( Maui ). Converting at a resort that isn't so expensive is a nice way to see different places. If you decide not to go to Maui you should be able to rent out your unit to cover your MF and then some. They same goes for your St John unit.
Victor


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## DavidnRobin (Mar 30, 2006)

Hi Victor -
Perhaps I am missing something.  I wasn't talking about converting the unit to StarPoints.  I was talking about what the Developer is offering as incentive StarPoints - compared to the difference in cost between buying resale vs. Developer.

I am not up on the details of Kierland, but the same applies - are the StarPoints being offered as an incentive to buy from the Developer offset by the cost difference.

For example - there was a Kierland on Ebay (1Bd - low season) that went for ~$4000 - if the Developer cost was $20,000 for the same unit - would the incentive StarPoints of 80K be worth $16,000?

As to converting from StarOptions to StarPoints straight-up - it would be a stretch for me to think that this conversion would be ever worthwhile.

I am missing something?

Anyway - hope all is well - my WSJ deed finally got recorded in the USVI - I will post details after it get recorded with SVO/SVN and I am put on as the owner (final steps...)


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## DavidnRobin (Mar 30, 2006)

duke said:
			
		

> Saluki:
> I was advised by salesperson that Kierland will have a price increase on April 1.




This is a standard comment by a SVN saleperson - they said the same about WKORV-N - wasn't true.


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## saluki (Mar 30, 2006)

saluki said:
			
		

> Regarding splitting the 2BR unit...this is my understanding but please confirm. I can use the premium 1BR & convert the regular 1BR points to Starpoints. I can do this every year as long as I alternate which side of the unit I use. I can do this whether I visit Kierland or any other SVO property.



What about the policy on the question above? Is my understanding correct?


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## grgs (Mar 30, 2006)

I found a 2 bedroom gold resale listed at:

www.transactionrealty.com

I would do as blujahz suggests and see if the price difference you paid is worth the Starpoint conversion privilege and SPG gold status.  There isn't a right or wrong here--it's what works best for you.

Also, you might want to wait for a Platinum 1 bedroom premium resale to come up.  That way you'd be able to reserve in high season with a lower m.f. 

Good luck!

Glorian

P.S. Would you mind posting the current pricing for Kierland?


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## skim118 (Mar 30, 2006)

saluki said:
			
		

> What about the policy on the question above? Is my understanding correct?



The policy quoted above is accurate.

I used to be a big Starpoints believer & we did buy from the developer early 2002.  Now given the Starpoints devaluation  there is no way I would overpay for Westin Kierland.  I have seen Westin Kierland 2 bed Plat routinely sell around $20K.

We were so close to buying Westin Kierland last year(even purchased the Explorer package from them), before we decided against it since Kierland seems to be a fairly easy trade for us((during our preferred travel time).

I will give my unsolicited advice one more time: Please rescind your purchase and do further research if you have too and then buy from the developer.


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## DeniseM (Mar 30, 2006)

Yes, you can convert one side to Starpoints and the other side to Staroptions, and use the Staroptions to exchange into another SVN resort.  However, there are no guarantees when you are trying to exchange and there is a lot of competition for the more popular resorts (Maui, Harborside, and St. John) especially anytime the kids are out of school.

Just make sure you have enough Staroptions for the resort/season/unit you want to exchange into because it's different at every resort. For example, the larger side of your lock-off is worth 44K Staroptions, but to exchange into a 1 bdm. on Maui, you need 81K Staroptions. So to exchange for a Maui 1 bdm. you would have to convert the whole unit, to have 81K Staroptions.

There is a Staroption chart in Chris' advice page article - http://www.tug2.net/advice/Starwood_Vacation_Network.htm


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## ArtsieAng (Mar 30, 2006)

vic714 said:
			
		

> Staroptions carry across a resale purchase not the ability to convert to starpoints.




Thank you for clearing that up for me....


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## djp (Mar 30, 2006)

holiday group currently has a 2br platinum listed for 22k, if it lasts more han 3 days it will be able to be had for less.


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## vic714 (Mar 30, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> For example - there was a Kierland on Ebay (1Bd - low season) that went for ~$4000 - if the Developer cost was $20,000 for the same unit - would the incentive StarPoints of 80K be worth $16,000?


Robin,
Not sure what Starwood is asking for a 1 BR silver. I really doubt it's 20K. In the deal you presented the incentive points would hardly justify the extra cost. Every transaction is different. For my Maui unit the incentive points worked out well for me and they offset the cost so that it was comparable to a resale week.
Would I convert my Maui week to starpoints? Highly doubt it. I'd much rather give it as a comp. to someone at work to help boost morale, but it's nice to know that if I needed the points for an upgrade on an upcoming flight it would be possible.

BTW

Congrats on your WSJ going through. Hope you enjoy your time there this summer. I'm still considering my week there myself. If I could only figure a way to put it on my expense account  

Victor


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## vic714 (Mar 30, 2006)

skim118 said:
			
		

> I will give my unsolicited advice one more time: Please rescind your purchase and do further research if you have too and then buy from the developer.



Sound advice.

The gold week deal will be there for awhile. If you indicate that you are thinking about backing out there is a chance that they may even throw more points at you to keep the deal going.

If you do back out you can always call them back and make the deal at a later date. It's easy enough for them to Fed Ex out the paperwork to you.

Good luck in whatever you decide. 

Starwood has a bunch of new resorts in the works and IMHO have a great product.

Victor


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## saluki (Mar 30, 2006)

Another question I have concerns using II. It seems apparent that sticking with the SVO family is the best value, but I forsee many times when we will want to visit areas without an SVO property. I am just a little unclear on using the II option.

Would my 2BR Kierland Gold give me the ability to get ANY 2BR unit in prime season (or 2 1BR weeks)? And, can I reserve at 1 year in advance? What is the general consensus of using II as a Starwood owner in terms of success of booking & satisfaction of their "5 Star"' properties?


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## DeniseM (Mar 30, 2006)

When you exchange through II, Starwood chooses the week that's deposited.  It won't be a high-season week, and it may not be from your home resort. However, you don't have to use II.  You may want to look at some of the independents where YOU choose the week that's deposited.


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## grgs (Mar 30, 2006)

I don't have any experience trading my Kierland in Interval, but my gut tells me that while it would have good trade power, there's probably not much in Interval that would be comprable.  I would think that Marriotts would be, but the good Marriott trades are probably mostly taken within the Marriott priority period by other Marriott owners.  Hopefully, someone who has traded in Interval will have more information.

I have been looking into trading with San Francisco Exchange Company (http://www.sfx-resorts.com/), and will probably try deposting my smaller one bedroom with them.  If I deposit early enough, it is my understanding that I can get one or two bonus weeks ($399 each) in addition to the actual exchange week.  However, SFX only takes Kierland platinum weeks.  That might be another reason to consider a 1 bedroom premium platinum over a 2 bedroom  gold.   

Glorian


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## saluki (Mar 30, 2006)

DeniseM said:
			
		

> When you exchange through II, Starwood chooses the week that's deposited.  It won't be a high-season week, and it may not be from your home resort. However, you don't have to use II.  You may want to look at some of the independents where YOU choose the week that's deposited.



Denise-

I understand that Starwood chooses the week to deposit. What I don't understand is what that means in terms of me reserving a property through II. Does the week I am depositing somehow have to be claimed by someone before I get my reservation? Am I not able to get an II property a year in advance just by relinquishing my Kierland week?

Thanks for the help...


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## grgs (Mar 30, 2006)

What you can get out of Interval is largely determined by what you put in (i.e. trade power).  What Denise is saying is that with Interval, you don't get to pick the strongest week (which with a Gold Kierland I would think might be Thanksgiving week).  Instead you call Starwood and they deposit a week on your behalf into Interval.  That week can be from a different resort and season than what you own.  Imagine what your trade power would be like if the week deposited on your behalf was an August Mission Hills week.  Not too likely to have good trade power with a summer desert week!

Glorian


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## duke (Mar 31, 2006)

vic714 said:
			
		

> Robin,
> Not sure what Starwood is asking for a 1 BR silver. I really doubt it's 20K.
> Victor



Current price:
Silver:  2BR - $14,900


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## zinger1457 (Mar 31, 2006)

I went though the Kierland sales presentation about 4 month ago.  They were really pushing the Gold season hard.  At that time the only Plat was for 07 and they weren't offering much incentives at all for Plat.  I would highly recommend you take the adive others have given and take your time and really think if the benefits of buying from the developer is worth it.  Don't trust anything the salesman tells you either, the one I had was either very ignorant about SVO or downright lying.  I ended up purchasing a Kierland 2-BD Plat resale with 148K StarOptions for $20K, the developer wanted ~$34K.


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## vic714 (Apr 2, 2006)

zinger1457 said:
			
		

> Don't trust anything the salesman tells you either, the one I had was either very ignorant about SVO or downright lying.



FWIW

I think it's mainly training. I think Starwood has soo many things going on the salespeople either have a hard time keeping up or that corp just doesn't keep the sales force up-to-date.
We went to the owners update while we were staying at Vistana Villages last week. I mentioned, to the salespereson, that we can now trade our Staroptions for cruises ( so far only 1 sailing date confirmed, but I have heard that there will also be one on Oct. ) The salesperson didn't know anything about it so I told them to log onto MyStarCentral. He then comes back and shows me a printout and claimed that all of the cruise lines were available for this. Lying or misinformed I don't know.    I would like to think misinformed since I believe that MOST people are truely honest deep down.

Victor


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## skim118 (Apr 2, 2006)

vic714 said:
			
		

> FWIW
> Lying or misinformed I don't know.    I would like to think misinformed since I believe that MOST people are truely honest deep down.
> 
> Victor



Based on our experiences in Maui & Kierland, I would be comfortable in calling the salesmen we met liars   

We are dreading to "meet" these SVN salesmen later this year in Kierland to get our 50,000 Starpoints due to the Explorer package we purchased last year.  

We have made it a policy not to go to any of those special "owners updates" (sic) from now onwards & not get sucked into any more Starpoints "deals" ever again.  In any case we get better info from TUG anyway.


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## baz48 (Apr 4, 2006)

saluki said:
			
		

> Denise-
> 
> I understand that Starwood chooses the week to deposit. What I don't understand is what that means in terms of me reserving a property through II. Does the week I am depositing somehow have to be claimed by someone before I get my reservation? Am I not able to get an II property a year in advance just by relinquishing my Kierland week?
> 
> Thanks for the help...




When you call Starwood to deposit with II, as has been mentioned, they pick the week to deposit.  Last November we used the smaller Platinum1BR unit at Kierland to trade and asked the agent to see if she could find a Kierland Platinum week to deposit.  She found a January week to deposit for us.  I was afraid that was a pretty short notice deposit, but it might have been a bulk-banked week that they just assigned to me for trading.  With that 1 BR week deposited we were immediately able to book a 2 BR at Sunterra Ridge in Sedona for October (11 months out).   We didn't have to wait for someone to book the January Kierland week.

A few weeks ago we decided not to use our Maui week this year, but to deposit it with II.  We asked Starwood to deposit it as two 1 BR units and they deposited two units from Mission Hills over Memorial Day week 2006.  I wasn't thrilled with the Mission Hills deposit, but I understand that they would like to keep Maui for SVN trades and the agent kept assuring me that all the Starwood properties have prime trading power.  Don't know if that's true or not.   Within a week or so we traded the smaller 1 BR for a 2 BR at Club Internacional in Cancun (a Royal property) for our daughter's September honeymoon.  (No jokes about 2 BR on a honeymoon, please.      They wanted a property on the beach with a kitchen for fixed dates, and this was a good choice.)  We'll use the larger 1 BR for ourselves next year, maybe to Williamsburg.  Right now I can see Marriotts available a year out.

So in a nutshell, as soon as Starwood deposits, you can make the exchange, even a year in advance.


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