# Future Building in Hanalei [merged]



## Fisch (Jul 27, 2012)

A developer is looking to build a luxury development that puts 25 resort mansions over the river directly across from Black Pot Park and overlooking the Hanalei River and Hanalei Bay.

There is a petition to try and stop the development. http://signon.org/sign/stop-the-development.fb21?source=s.fb&r_by=

Not sure if the petition is against TUG policy or not.  But I thought a few people on this board might be interested.


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## Kona Lovers (Jul 28, 2012)

I just signed.

Marty


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## Greg G (Jul 28, 2012)

Here is a link to the pdf of the development plan map Fisch embedded in his post.  That is one big development 

http://lauhala.com/hinano/20120608-072440-hanalei-plantation-resort-draft-proposal.pdf

Greg


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## Kona Lovers (Jul 28, 2012)

Makes one wonder why when someone is already a billionaire, why they want to go a permanently destroy the true beauty of creation.    

Why doesn't he take some of that money and refurbish the Coco Palms Resort?

Marty


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## Kauai Kid (Jul 28, 2012)

I signed the petition and hope it does some good.  Also sent it to folks I know in Hanalei.

Sterling


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## Kildahl (Jul 28, 2012)

I am willing to sign the petition but it is the thought of being placed on MoveOn.orgs mailing lists that holds me back.


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## california-bighorn (Jul 28, 2012)

Without knowing more details on this development I find it difficult to be against a project like this.  From looking at the map of the development and looking at Google Earth it doesn't appear to infringe on anyone else or damage the environment and I'm sure all questions of this nature would need to be addressed.  I don't understand what is so different with something like this and all the houses, condos and timeshares in the Princeville and Poipu areas.  
Sure we would all like Hawaii to remain the way it was 100 years ago, but, that bird has flown.  With the added tax revenue, maybe the County won't need to come after timeshare owners


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## Tamaradarann (Jul 28, 2012)

*New Developments and Urban Population Density*



california-bighorn said:


> Without knowing more details on this development I find it difficult to be against a project like this.  From looking at the map of the development and looking at Google Earth it doesn't appear to infringe on anyone else or damage the environment and I'm sure all questions of this nature would need to be addressed.  I don't understand what is so different with something like this and all the houses, condos and timeshares in the Princeville and Poipu areas.
> Sure we would all like Hawaii to remain the way it was 100 years ago, but, that bird has flown.  With the added tax revenue, maybe the County won't need to come after timeshare owners



Years ago I felt the way you do about development.  I bought land in Southern Arizona in 1971 when I was 21 years old.  There was nothing there but the utililities and a hotel, it was in the middle of no where but I was taken by the beautiful mountain views and the wide open spaces.  I was 21 and driving 50 miles to Tuscan for a doctor or hospital was nothing.  At 21 nothing is a problem.  

I am older than 21 now and I have a different perspective on this. While I do agree that ruining beautiful landscapes and the environment with new developments is not a good thing, I have another reason that new developments on virgin land should not be initiated.  This reason has many aspects which include the enviroment, cost, safety, traffic and lifestyle.

As I have gotten older and have vacationed in Honolulu without a car for entire winters I realize how great it is to be able to live comfortably without a car.  Being able to walk to a great many things or take good public transportation is very freeing.  You don't need to buy, lease, or rent a car.  No gas costs.  No parking problems.  Traffic headaches are not your problem.  You can drink as much as you want and not worry about having to drive home.  Furthermore, when you get older and should give up driving sacrificing your freedom and lifestyle is not an issue.

However, the only way to have a walkable location with good public transportation is to have a reasonable urban density.  Therefore, for future development my thoughts are to increase the population density of towns and small cities to make walking and good public transportation lifestyle feasible.  Higher rise housing on vacate lots and replacing low rise housing would be the development that I would encourage.  Lets get out from the chains that cars tie you up with.


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## Kona Lovers (Jul 29, 2012)

california-bighorn said:


> With the added tax revenue, maybe the County won't need to come after timeshare owners



That would be one plus for ts owners.  Hope the other counties in Hawaii don't follow Maui's lead on this.

Marty


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## Kauai Kid (Jul 29, 2012)

*Princeville Years Ago*

The area encircled by Pepalani Loop was an open grassy field.

At the corner with the main drag a Nene' built her nest and was sitting on her egg when we arrived.  About two weeks later she was strutting around like a proud mother and we could hear her chick peeping.

Like a typical mainland Haole I got out of the car to get a closer photo.  Mama saw me coming, ran like Jesse Owens, and pecked me a couple of times before I could get back in the car.

Now that whole nesting area is taken up by some crappy condos.

Imagine the wildlife disrupted by the newest humogous billionare's development. 


Sterling


Sterling


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## daventrina (Jul 29, 2012)

Kona Lovers said:


> That would be one plus for ts owners.  Hope the other counties in Hawaii don't follow Maui's lead on this.
> 
> Marty


Don't think for a second that just because they can nail a bunch of rich folks that they would leave us timeshare owners.


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## Kona Lovers (Jul 29, 2012)

daventrina said:


> Don't think for a second that just because they can nail a bunch of rich folks that they would leave us timeshare owners.



That's be the reality for sure.  Upon further thought, as mentioned above that the bird has flown on Hawaii not being like it was 100 years ago, just because that is the case, doesn't mean there has to be mass destruction of the natural environment.  I realize in these situations usually greed wins out, but that just doesn't make it right.

Marty


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## ricoba (Jul 29, 2012)

Kildahl said:


> I am willing to sign the petition but it is the thought of being placed on MoveOn.orgs mailing lists that holds me back.





california-bighorn said:


> Without knowing more details on this development I find it difficult to be against a project like this.  From looking at the map of the development and looking at Google Earth it doesn't appear to infringe on anyone else or damage the environment and I'm sure all questions of this nature would need to be addressed.  I don't understand what is so different with something like this and all the houses, condos and timeshares in the Princeville and Poipu areas.
> Sure we would all like Hawaii to remain the way it was 100 years ago, but, that bird has flown.  With the added tax revenue, maybe the County won't need to come after timeshare owners



I too would have reservations about signing a petition such as this.  

First, I believe this is a local issue that the local citizens can and should decide for themselves.  This would be my primary reason for not participating in this, since I am not a resident or citizen of the state of Hawaii.

Second, since the sponsoring organization for the petition is a openly political organization, I would choose not to affiliate with them or most of their causes.

Third, I find the allusion to class warfare here a bit disconcerting.  At one time in our country, those with wealth were esteemed for their ability to use that wealth to benefit the good of others through manufacturing, building things  and job creating.  Sadly, we have turned away from this view to a view that everyone who has a certain income is suspect and ought not to be trusted or believed.  After all, they are just some rich "gazillionaire" who is only concerned about themselves and their own wealth, right?  This is not to say that the all the super wealthy are pure, we know they are not.  But to lump them all into the same category is myopic and more than likely prejudicially biased in my view.

But, having said that, this is a free country, where folks can add their names to whatever petition or cause they choose.


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## ouaifer (Jul 29, 2012)

Kauai Kid said:


> The area encircled by Pepalani Loop was an open grassy field.
> 
> At the corner with the main drag a Nene' built her nest and was sitting on her egg when we arrived.  About two weeks later she was strutting around like a proud mother and we could hear her chick peeping.
> 
> ...



_All so true.  

Did you know that Pepelani Loop used to be ONE WAY?
Did you know that the land inside the loop was designated "Protected Lands" that would NEVER be built upon because it was considered a nesting area for the "Goonie" birds...albatross?
Did you know that MONEY bought the development board and they voted to develop the land...and now we have Nihilani and the Plantation....both of which are now troubled and under water trying to sell for $100,000s less than originally sold for?
Did you know that there is ENOUGH development on Kaua'i?  AND we don't need any more and DON'T want any more?
I have a great bumper sticker that a friend sent to me that says....

"*If you LOVE Kaua'i, send your friends to Maui*!"

The best statement I can find._


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## Fisch (Jul 29, 2012)

ricoba said:


> First, I believe this is a local issue that the local citizens can and should decide for themselves.  This would be my primary reason for not participating in this, since I am not a resident or citizen of the state of Hawaii.



The link I posted was sent to me from a friend in Hanalei.

Since I own a timeshare in Kauai and pay taxes on it, I consider myself a part time citizen.


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## Kona Lovers (Jul 29, 2012)

Fisch said:


> Since I own a timeshare in Kauai and pay taxes on it, I consider myself a part time citizen.



Exactly.

Marty


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## Kauai Kid (Jul 29, 2012)

*Kaui vs Maui Gov'ts*

At least time-share owners in Kauai seem to have more respect from Gov't officials than those on Maui.


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## Tamaradarann (Jul 29, 2012)

*No more development in Kauai, I can go for that!*



ouaifer said:


> _All so true.
> 
> Did you know that Pepelani Loop used to be ONE WAY?
> Did you know that the land inside the loop was designated "Protected Lands" that would NEVER be built upon because it was considered a nesting area for the "Goonie" birds...albatross?
> ...



I agree with no more development in Kauia, Molokai or any of the the Hawaiian islands or other places in the world.  If I may clarify my previous post: where development is desired, needed or required further develop the areas that are already developed into higher density without hurting the virgin land.  Doing this will enable us to not only keep our virgin landscapes pristine but enable society to live without sacrificing our enjoyment while contributing less to the polution of the entire earth through the use of so many automobiles.


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## Kona Lovers (Jul 29, 2012)

Tamaradarann said:


> I agree with no more development in Kauia, Molokai or any of the the Hawaiian islands or other places in the world.  If I may clarify my previous post: where development is desired, needed or required further develop the areas that are already developed into higher density without hurting the virgin land.  Doing this will enable us to not only keep our virgin landscapes pristine but enable society to live without sacrificing our enjoyment while contributing less to the polution of the entire earth through the use of so many automobiles.



Wish they had a "Like" button on TUG!


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## DeniseM (Jul 30, 2012)

I cannot imagine starting a development like this right now, in this economy.  The huge http://kukuiula.com/properties/ development by the Lawai Beach Resort has been a major flop - why would this be any different?


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## tfalk (Jul 30, 2012)

Let me start by saying yes, I do in fact have one of the 'If you love Kauai, send your friends to Maui' t-shirts...



ouaifer said:


> _All so true.
> 
> Did you know that the land inside the loop was designated "Protected Lands" that would NEVER be built upon because it was considered a nesting area for the "Goonie" birds...albatross?
> Did you know that MONEY bought the development board and they voted to develop the land...and now we have Nihilani and the Plantation....both of which are now troubled and under water trying to sell for $100,000s less than originally sold for?_



I assume you have some proof you'd care to share regarding your first 2 statements about the land being designated as 'protected lands' and even more interesting, PROOF behind the development board being 'bought'?

As for the 'troubled and underwater', anyone who bought in Hawaii (and pretty much anywhere in the country...) around the time these units were marketed are underwater - Why are you singling out these 2 particular developments?  I bought a Mauna Kai unit in 1994 and we were underwater for most of the time we owned it, finally waited it out and sold in 2004 and actually made money.  As with any purchase, there is always risk/reward...    And yes, we looked at several Ni'Hilani units and in fact almost bought one but couldn't justify the price at the time.  If I had the money right now, I'd consider one since they are a nice sized unit for the price.

Yes, there does need to be a balance.  That balance should be determined by those who live there and their local planning board, not some global petition of people who occasionally visit.


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## singlemalt_18 (Jul 30, 2012)

tfalk said:


> Yes, there does need to be a balance.  That balance should be determined by those who live there and their local planning board, not some global petition of people who occasionally visit.



Absolutely right on.

The idea that development should be up (high rise) instead of sprawling out is a non-starter; there are many ordinances prohibiting structures beyond only a few stories in height.  Maui for one, has a strict ban on any new high rise ever being built.  The locals seem to know what is important and exactly what they want.

As far as the wildlife and protected areas, Kauai in particular is what - 90% - uninhabitable!  Forget about it being the wettest spot on the planet, most of that island can only be seen from an airplane.  No man or his development will ever impact the vast thick mountainous rain forest that makes up most of that island, or the wildlife that thrives there.

If they want to build, let them build.


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## Tamaradarann (Jul 31, 2012)

*Think Globally, Act Locally*



singlemalt_18 said:


> Absolutely right on.
> 
> The idea that development should be up (high rise) instead of sprawling out is a non-starter; there are many ordinances prohibiting structures beyond only a few stories in height.  Maui for one, has a strict ban on any new high rise ever being built.  The locals seem to know what is important and exactly what they want.
> 
> ...



There is an expression "Think Globally, Act Locally".  When I first heard it I didn't agree with it.  I now believe the entire world needs to start thinking that way particularly our leaders whether they be federal, state, county, town, or village from all countries.  In a world with infinite resources and ability to absorb wastes what people want and believe is important for themselves and their immediate neighborhood is fine.  However, we are approaching 9 billion people on the earth and many of the countries that were underdeveloped and not using natural resources and discharging waste products are now developing.  Having rules about building high risers while allowing the ruining virgin land may be what the locals want, but may not be what the world needs.  Driving rather than being able to walk or take public transportation may be quicker, but it may not be the most envionmentally friendly.  Using corn for bio-fuel may be cheaper and save our importation of oil, but it may not be the best use of corn when people are starving.

I don't have a nickel in this argument so as far as I'm concerned they can do whatever the want.  However, should they do whatever they want?


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## tfalk (Jul 31, 2012)

Tamaradarann said:


> However, should they do whatever they want?



Let's play devils advocate for a minute...

Suppose you owned a piece of property in Long Island (which shows as your location) and you wanted to build houses on it.  Suppose further that the people of Kauai somehow heard about it and their opinion is that there should be no more building in the United States...  Would you expect me to believe you would be perfectly happy with not being allowed to build on your property and the subsequent loss of value simply because others thought you shouldn't be allowed to build?

We had a big eminent domain case locally a few years ago, the town took a large farm because they wanted it for parks, ball fields, etc... Needless to say, the owners did not want to sell but lost anyway.  I wanted to go to the hearings and give them a list of 8 other properties they should take instead of the farm... coincidently, it was the 8 properties that were owned by the 8 council members who voted to take the farm.  Somehow, I don't think they would have listened...


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## Tamaradarann (Jul 31, 2012)

tfalk said:


> Let's play devils advocate for a minute...
> 
> Suppose you owned a piece of property in Long Island (which shows as your location) and you wanted to build houses on it.  Suppose further that the people of Kauai somehow heard about it and their opinion is that there should be no more building in the United States...  Would you expect me to believe you would be perfectly happy with not being allowed to build on your property and the subsequent loss of value simply because others thought you shouldn't be allowed to build?
> 
> We had a big eminent domain case locally a few years ago, the town took a large farm because they wanted it for parks, ball fields, etc... Needless to say, the owners did not want to sell but lost anyway.  I wanted to go to the hearings and give them a list of 8 other properties they should take instead of the farm... coincidently, it was the 8 properties that were owned by the 8 council members who voted to take the farm.  Somehow, I don't think they would have listened...



Environmental assessments and protection of wetlands have delayed, increased the cost considerably, and/or prevented building on Long Island.  There are many laws/codes that I agree with and some that I don't agree with.  I have to live with those that I don't agree with.  There are planned communities already built.  There are planned communities in the process of being built right now.  In this case I am suggesting that the planning of development should have some longer reaching goals than just building whatever someone wants.  Higher density with the ability to live comfortably without a car should be one of those goals.


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## singlemalt_18 (Jul 31, 2012)

Tamaradarann said:


> Having rules about building high risers while allowing the ruining virgin land may be what the locals want, but may not be what the world needs.  *Driving rather than being able to walk or take public transportation may be quicker, but it may not be the most envionmentally friendly.*  Using corn for bio-fuel may be cheaper and save our importation of oil, but it may not be the best use of corn when people are starving.
> 
> I don't have a nickel in this argument so as far as I'm concerned they can do whatever the want.  *However, should they do whatever they want?*



I don't know that people who live on islands care much about using a car instead of walking... that is more a concern for urbanites or utopians.  I also don't think that many of the 600,000,000 people currently without power in India choose to use a bike instead of a car because they are concerned about the planet.  A great many people on this crowded planet are just trying to live and survive the best they can.

People living in Hilo who work in Kona have their OWN priorities, as do people in Hanalei that may work in Poipu.  And when it comes to fighting rock fever, the airports and jet planes are their best friends!

_Should they do what they want???_

*Who should have the power to stop them?*  Hawaiians seem very capable of protecting the land that is their heritage... if they didn't, I don't think _soooooo many people _would spend so much of their lives just planning their next visits.

FTR - I agree about corn for ethanol; I do not believe there is another instance in all of human history where food has been used as a fuel source... even primitive man was smarter than that!


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## Tamaradarann (Aug 1, 2012)

singlemalt_18 said:


> I don't know that people who live on islands care much about using a car instead of walking... that is more a concern for urbanites or utopians.  I also don't think that many of the 600,000,000 people currently without power in India choose to use a bike instead of a car because they are concerned about the planet.  A great many people on this crowded planet are just trying to live and survive the best they can.
> 
> People living in Hilo who work in Kona have their OWN priorities, as do people in Hanalei that may work in Poipu.  And when it comes to fighting rock fever, the airports and jet planes are their best friends!
> 
> ...



The native Hawaiians that I know don't believe that they are capable of protecting the land or the culture that is their heritage.  The music the create, the stories they tell, and their history reveals that other countries, including primary the United States, took their land and their country from them.  (By the way that was before there were automobiles) Many of the Hawaiians want it back.  

The trips you indicate do need a car.  The concept that I am professing is living and working closer where you can walk to shop or work or have the density to have good public transportation.  In much of Honolulu that is possible.  We do live in Honolulu for the entire winter without a car.  

I agree with you about the comment that the "A Great many people on this crowded planet are just trying to live and survive the best they can"  That is my biggest fear.  As the people in this crowded planet become more developed they want computers, washers, dryers, automobiles and other energy using products to survive better.  The problem in India is that electrical system is not up to the growing electrical demand of their developing people.  The roads are not up to the demand for cars.  They will eventually become as developed as we are and our planet can't support 10 million people that are energy hogs like the people in the United States.


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## Kauai Kid (Sep 9, 2012)

*Resort Proposed on Hanalei Plantation Road*

Here is the web site:

www.hanaleiplantation.com


I wonder how long before it gets washed out to sea in a heavy rain.


Sterling


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## Kona Lovers (Sep 10, 2012)

Why do they have to ruin everything?

Marty


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## vacationtime1 (Sep 10, 2012)

Kona Lovers said:


> Why do _*they*_ have to ruin everything?



"We have met the enemy and he is us."

Pogo, 1971.


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## Kona Lovers (Sep 10, 2012)

vacationtime1 said:


> "We have met the enemy and he is us."
> 
> Pogo, 1971.



LOL.  So true!


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## slip (Sep 10, 2012)

I don't get it. It's not like everything is full all the time. I guess some one
Thinks they are missing out on making some money.


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## jacknsara (Sep 10, 2012)

*current satellite view*

https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=22.216698,-159.495564&spn=0.008244,0.013937&t=h&z=17


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## Kauai Kid (Sep 20, 2012)

*Resort Proposed on Hanalei Plantation Road*

September 19, 2012 1:00 am  •  Léo Azambuja - The Garden Island
(10) Comments

HANALEI — One of the most significant developments proposed in Hanalei Bay since the building of the Princeville Hotel (now the St. Regis Resort), is meeting staunch opposition from a rapidly growing group of people, despite attempts from developers to assure that they are doing the right thing.

Hanalei Plantation Resort representatives are saying this is the most environmentally and culturally responsible visitor-oriented project ever to be proposed in the state, and will set the standards for future development.

“I think there are a lot of clarity that needs to be made with regards to who we are as a company and the proposed development,” said Michelle Swartmann, director of land and community development at ‘Ohana Hanalei LLC, the company in charge of the development.

“It’s important for people to understand what are the guiding principles of our company,” she said. “One, it has to make economic sense. Two, it has to be respectful of the culture and very sensitive to the environment.”

On the flipside, the Hanalei Bay Coalition has painted a somber picture of what could potentially become to one of Hawai‘i’s most beautiful viewplanes. According to the coalition, the ridge is at high risk of being covered with a string of high-end mansions perching over Hanalei River, similar to what has happened on the bluff overlooking Kalapaki Bay in Nawiliwili.

“People are shocked that an element like that could be encroaching in Hanalei,” coalition member Hayley Ham Young-Giorgio said. “Not to mention whatever the environmental aspects are.”

The coalition’s lobbying against the project has been so aggressive and successful that they have already gathered more than 3,400 signatures in a petition opposing the development. They ultimately want the man behind the project, billionaire and eBay founder Pierre Omidyar, to donate part of the project, the ridge overlooking Hanalei River, to conservation.

And it is conservation — and restoration — of a monumental-size historical and cultural feature that is in the developers’ plans. They say they will bring back to life a giant Hawaiian fishpond currently covered with dirt, mud and invasive species, and lined up with a 1,000-foot-long rock wall that is 600 years old.

“It is something we owe it to our kupuna, we owe it to our community and we owe it to our children to preserve and to celebrate and to share,” Swartmann said.

Project overview

The proposed Hanalei Plantation Resort land, bought in 2008 by Omidyar, extends from the bottom of the St. Regis Resort up to the north margins of Hanalei River, excluding a few riverbank parcels up the river. Omidyar bought the property in 2008. The land is mostly zoned for hotels and resorts, with some of it in conservation.

A ridge coming down from Princeville and extending to Hanalei River mouth is the crux of this battle. It is a proposed development there that the coalition is primarily concerned with. The project includes subdividing the ridge into 34 residential lots, roughly 15,000 to 20,000 square-feet each, with 25 of those lots facing the river and nine lots on the opposite side of the ridge. The current plans are to sell those lots individually, according to Swartmann.

On the low lands between the ridge and St. Regis Resort lays the project’s second phase: An 86-room resort, bungalow style, separated from the ocean by a marsh full of all kinds of invasive species. In the past, the marsh had been used for taro farming and cattle ranching, Swartmann said.

Between the marsh and the sandy beach, a roughly 1,000-foot-long rock wall estimated to be there since A.D. 1400 has gotten archaeologists to believe the marsh was once a working fishpond, which later got filled with mud and dirt.

But when core samples were taken from different parts of the marsh, coral was found. Now, archaeologists are thinking that area may have been a small bay, later turned into a fishpond by the early Hawaiians. If that is correct, the adjacent ridge would have been a point extending into the ocean, with the river on one side and a cove on the other.

“Based on (archaeologist Hallet Hammatt’s) findings, we believe the ocean extended to this bay, and this plateau was a point to the ocean,” said Swartmann, pointing to the ridge.

She said many had no idea the fishpond existed — in the heart of Hanalei Bay. The project includes restoring the area to a working fishpond, bringing it as much as possible to its original condition six centuries ago.

The fishpond would not be used for commercial purposes, but it could be available for educational opportunities. The fishpond would also filter sediments coming from Princeville’s surface water that flows into Waileia Stream, which currently flows into Hanalei Bay, according to Swartmann.

There is one beach access on the property, and the developers plan to add another access north of the property.

The ridge

The coalition has no problems with the fishpond and the 86-bungalow project on the other side of the ridge, as long as ‘Ohana Hanalei meets environmental and cultural criteria, coalition member Carl Imparato said. Even if the developers decide to increase their density there to 120 units, as long they meet environmental and cultural criteria, “we can live with that,” he said.

“This out here is the real problem,” said Imparato, pointing to the ridge by Hanalei Bay River.

“It’s right there in your face,” Ham Young-Giorgio said of the development on the ridge.

If the county or the state has implemented a rule to protect the viewplanes, the ridge is “obviously part of it,” she said.

“We need to come to some sort of agreement where we can clearly agree that this is part of the viewplane,” Ham Young-Giorgio said. “(The project) doesn’t deserve to be in this area. Taking that out and compromising with the rest of the project is obviously what we’ve been talking about.”

Imparato said Ham Young-Giorgio is correct; there are various ordinances protecting the viewplanes, and in the North Shore development plan there is consideration for viewplanes.

“But unfortunately it’s not saying that the viewplane must be protected at all costs,” he said. “It becomes a qualitative thing for the planning commissioners to make judgments on, trying to weigh against on what they perceive to be the developer’s political power.”

Coalition member Maka‘ala Ka‘aumoana said the entire ridge should be put into conservation status, with a “good, hefty tax credit” to Omidyar.

“I think he has the right capacity to do it, I think he has the right mind, I think he has the right heart, given the kinds of things that he’s done statewide,” she said of Omidyar.

Imparato said keeping the ridge in conservation is the only way the issue can be addressed, as far as he can see.

“There should be nothing that destroys this viewplane, it’s the most important viewplane on the island of Kaua‘i,” he said.

During the recent celebration of the 100 years of Hanalei Bridge, people were talking about how essential the bridge is to the Hanalei’s character, according to Imparato, who said another essential feature to Hanalei is the bay and the view of that ridge.

“When we talk about putting something on that ridge, we talk about transforming the very nature of Hanalei,” he said. “Jesus, if you build there, what did we save with 35 years worth of fighting for that bridge? What did we save if we let Hanalei go that route? What is Pierre Omidyar thinking?”

There are some residents, however, who may experience direct impacts from the project, but are not against it overall.

For about a year, Thames Goodwin has been participating in steering committee meetings organized every other month by the developers. He has been living for more than 10 years on a Princeville property adjacent to the proposed project.

“They have the ability to put a hotel up on that ridge, but they are not going to do that,” said Goodwin, adding that the developers could put 400 units in the entire property, but will rather leave a smaller footprint on the ridge.

“The ‘Ohana group has expressed a great interest in making sure they don’t destroy the beauty of Hanalei Bay,” he said.

Homes

Swartmann said what happened in Kalapaki can be avoided by following restrictions in the county Comprehensive Zoning Ordinance and in the North Shore development plan.

Mala Fu and her husband own a home on Plantation Road, about a quarter-of-a-mile before the project’s entrance in Princeville.

“From my understanding, these are single stories, these aren’t two, three, four story buildings,” Fu said. “I know the developers are very concerned about the birds, the lighting, the scenery, the way the buildings are going to be.”

Goodwin said the steering committee has focused on the impacts on the viewplane and how well those homes are going to be designed to blend in with the environment.

Current restrictions limit building heights on the North Shore to up to 25 feet. Imparato, however, said this restriction could be circumvented due to the topography of the lots, a mix of a narrow plateau and steep terrain downhill.

A 12-foot setback would not leave much flat land to build a 7,000-square-foot home, the average size of homes built on multi-million-dollar lots, he said.

“What that means is, you’re going to at least put two stories in,” said Imparato, explaining that multi stories would be allowed as long as it goes downhill, because the height restriction is measured from the property’s entryway.

Swartmann said staggered multi-story buildings is not what ‘Ohana Hanalei envisions for the property, but to prevent this from happening it’s something they still have to explore. They are still in the process of trying to understand what can be built, and have recently hired a geotech to try to understand the soil.

Fu said she walks at Hanalei Beach every day, and lately she has been paying close attention to the bluff overlooking the river. She said the buildings will stand out, and it’s not going to be a “nice sight,” but the developers’ plans are a lot better than what it could be.

And there is also the issue of the natural vegetation providing a buffered view from Blackpot Beach Park. The developers are saying the vegetation will be left in place, but the coalition is saying there are no guarantees for that.

“In the end, we have to assume that not one tree will be left standing, because any tree that (the homeowners) leave standing will block their view, their $4 million view,” Imparato said.

Swartmann said it’s just as important to the homeowners to have their privacy. When asked what would happen if the homeowners’ association got together and decided to cut the trees, she said, “Depends on how you write your documents, right?”

Precedence

Swartmann said that about 50 or 60 years ago there was a 210-room hotel on top of the ridge. Then Club Med came in, and the density was still at 210 units.

After Club Med shut down, developer Bruce Stark got approval for 204 hotel units. He started construction but never finished it. Today, an empty swimming pool, concrete slabs and basic infrastructure tell the story of a halted development.

“There is precedence there, there was a hotel there,” Swartmann said. “It was a thriving hotel that was enjoyed by all, and it was a piece of paradise and it was under the guidance of Grace and Gus Guslander.”

Goodwin said it has taken a long time for someone to replace the former development on the ridge.

“The viewplane, it is what it is today, but it used to be something very different, and what it used to be was very ugly,” Goodwin said.

The Hanalei Plantation Resort may have a reduced density of 86 hotel rooms and 34 homes, but Imparato said this is relative. The hotel rooms will measure 400 to 500 square feet, but the homes on the ridge will be much larger.

“When Stark got approved, that was 125,000 square feet,” Imparato said. “The 34 mansions alone heads up to about 250,000. That’s already twice as much as anything that has been up there, or even approved.”

Ham Young-Giorgio acknowledged there was a previous development on the ridge, and that people have a right to use their property.

“But when you put it into perspective … look at what Hanalei was before, there was nothing around,” she said. “Hanalei was still a natural environment.”

Today, the concentration of development just keeps getting “thicker and thicker and thicker,” she said.

“There’s got to be balance in Hanalei, that’s what we are trying to do,” Ham Young-Giorgio said. “For me, growing up in Hanalei, this town is really madness right now.”

Swartmann also used the word “balance.” She said there has to be a balance between preserving historical sites, creating a viable business and having an economy that is beneficial to the island, and there has to be “sensitive and sensible growth,” where the people can participate with concerns and feedback.

Clarity

“It’s about the community finally finding out what’s going on with that, and people are getting upset,” said Ham Young-Giorgio, adding that community in Hanalei didn’t even know what was happening there. “People deserve to know.”

Swartmann, however, said ‘Ohana Hanalei has had five steering-committee meetings so far, and they have had “insightful discussion” with many key community members. Some who attended included the presidents of the Hanalei to Ha‘ena and the ‘Anini community associations, members and the executive director of the Princeville Community Association, a representative from Hanalei Watershed Hui and others.

“It has always been our intent to go out to our larger community, but we wanted to first get some insights and comments and hear what those main concerns may be,” said Swartmann, adding that they are in the early stages of community outreach.

Goodwin said the developers have brought experts from all over the state, and have consulted a great deal with them as to what needs to happen to make the project a reality. These same experts have come to the steering committee meetings to share their findings and their plans.

He said ‘Ohana Hanalei invited to the meetings those they knew would bring participation rather than straight opposition, but there was still an opportunity for anyone to participate in any of the meetings simply by requesting.

Fu said she really appreciates that the developers are reaching out to the community.

“They want to make it pono,” said Fu, adding that they have asked as many kupuna as they could to provide their mana‘o, sometimes through one-on-one conversations.

“You don’t get that from a developer,” she said.

Fu’s own father was one of those kupuna.

“He pretty much knew every nook and crevasse here in Hanalei,” Fu said of her father, who recently passed away.


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## tfalk (Sep 20, 2012)

I think it has a lot of potential and I like that the developers are getting the community involved.  I'd love to buy one of the lots but I doubt I would be able to afford it or a house on one of the lots.

Sorry, but I totally disagree with the whole 'no building anywhere' mentality that seems to be driving the resistance to the project.


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## Kauai Kid (Sep 20, 2012)

tfalk said:


> I think it has a lot of potential and I like that the developers are getting the community involved.  I'd love to buy one of the lots but I doubt I would be able to afford it or a house on one of the lots.
> 
> Sorry, but I totally disagree with the whole 'no building anywhere' mentality that seems to be driving the resistance to the project.



Not everybody in Hanalei is opposed to the project.

Have you ever been to Hanalei???

There is a 2 br 2 bath condo on the market in Princeville for $580k.  I'd live there if I could afford it.

Not Hanalei though--it floods too often.

Aloha, Sterling


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## tfalk (Sep 20, 2012)

Kauai Kid said:


> Have you ever been to Hanalei???



Enough times to remember when the Club Med was under construction and my wifes license plate for the last 13 years is Hanalei   I used to own a unit at Mauna Kai and I'm currently a part owner at the Villas of Kamali'i so I understand where you are coming from.  I'd still be interested in this development if it comes to fruition and if I could possibly afford it.  If there is a view to die for on this planet, I can't think of much better...


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## Kauai Kid (Sep 21, 2012)

Wai'oli Hui'ia Church, the green one in Hanalei, had a remember Club med weekend this spring with lotsa memorabilia.

I got a t-shirt to help the cause (refurbishing the Hanalei pier)

That view of Hanalei Bay takes my breath away every single time I see it.  It is the largest bay of all the Hawaiian Islands.

Aloha, Sterling


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## Fisch (Nov 7, 2012)

*Saving Hanalei River Ridge Meeting on 11/13*

For anyone interested and on island next week:

If you want more info on the Hanalei Ridge Project there is a meeting set for 11/13 in Hanalei.

The email I received:

Aloha, 

  We'd like to say Mahalo for your help in signing our petition to help preserve the natural beauty of Hanalei River Ridge. With your help we have now collected nearly 5000 signatures. Yesterday was our first meeting with the Mayor of Kauai and we are pleased to learn that representatives of the Ohana Real Estate Investors LLC (http://ohanare.com/) have agreed to give a presentation to the Hanalei To Ha`ena Community Association at their Tuesday November 13, 2012 meeting regarding the company's plans to "develop a hotel and residential project on an approximately 63.6-acre site located adjacent to and north of the Hanalei River and northeast of Hanalei Bay in Hanalei, Island of Kauai."   

To introduce multi-million-dollar homes sitting on top of the ridge looking down on Hanalei Pier and Black Pot Beach Park, would break the hearts of the thousands of people who live here and also those who come to visit and enjoy the tranquility & beauty of the River and the Bay. Building on the ridge opens the door to letting it become more like Laguna Beach and less like Hanalei; this Garden of Eden that so well defines Kauai.   

Please share this information with your friends and family and plan to attend the presentation at 6 pm at the Hanalei School Cafeteria on Tuesday November 13, 2012. Come learn more about the proposed development, ask questions and share your mana`o. Everyone is welcome.    


Mahalo for your kokua!


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## Kauai Kid (Nov 7, 2012)

Will see if I can attend since I'm on Island.  Have mixed feelings about opposition since an Hawaiian friend says it would be ok, if and only if, the developers do right by the site.

Sterling


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## rifleman69 (Nov 8, 2012)

Just wondering what the development of the property north of the Hanalei River has to do with the actual bridge itself?


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## Kauai Kid (May 23, 2013)

*Hanalei River Ridge Proposed Development*

savehanaleiriverridge.com 

Big development proposed.  Please check it out.

Mahalo,

Sterling


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## K2Quick (May 23, 2013)

Is this development really any more offensive than the five weeks you apparently own at nearby developments?


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## rifleman69 (May 23, 2013)

Sorry to say Sterling, but this one is going to go through.   It may be modified in some ways but it will be going through.


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## Kauai Kid (May 23, 2013)

K2Quick said:


> Is this development really any more offensive than the five weeks you apparently own at nearby developments?



I made no comments regarding the development pro or con but believe people should be aware of it, I wasn't.


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## rifleman69 (May 23, 2013)

Kauai Kid said:


> I made no comments regarding the development pro or con but believe people should be aware of it, I wasn't.



You have a post from July 28th 2012 in this now combined thread?   How could you not know about it?


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## Kauai Kid (May 23, 2013)

Right you are.  

I've decided that the folks living in Hanalei and Kauai will make the right decision regarding the development and mainlanders should have zero input into the decision.

Sterling


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## Greg G (Aug 10, 2013)

Appeared in the WSJ today.  Not much new information from what has been posted here but it was interesting to see it showing up in the WSJ.  Per the article looks like the mayor and his administration are still in the information gathering stage of evaluating the proposal before making a determination.

Development Encounters Trouble in Paradise

Greg


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