# Just Purchased 3500 Points in MVCI - Have Questions



## NYFLTRAVELER (Aug 18, 2013)

First time time share purchaser, we just purchased 3500 points in the MVCI Destinations Program through MVCI after an Encore presentation (first presentation was 2012 and we visited again recently).  Not planning on using their financing.

We are in the 10 day period of right to rescind.  Putting the cost for the points aside for the moment ---- While on one hand I think this program will be a good thing for us, and with small children we have a resort type property as opposed to a one room run of the mill hotel room and the program allowing us to explore places we would not generally travel to, I am also having second thoughts as I am unsure what this does for me as opposed to just putting together an annual trip.  We do not want to buy a week at a certain resort and be attached to that property or have difficulties trading that. I do like the flexibility of going wherever we'd like.

I would be interested in feedback and comments from other owners who bought into this program as their first foray into time share ownership....... is this program for you or do you regret it?

I cannot get past the concept of paying so much money for the points PLUS paying annual maintenance fees on top of that when we can stay at a Marriott property for 5 or so days for +/- the cost of the maintenance fees..... That is what is troubling me most.  What is the benefit of being part of the "club"?

As a second question, how difficult is it to convert these points into the II program to obtain a stay at a high level non-Marriott resort such as one in the Hyatt system (I have no interest staying at a property which is not at least MVCI level).

I have many other questions as well if you all don't mind if we stick this out.

Thank you in advance and I look forward to corresponding with you.


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## MALC9990 (Aug 18, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> First time time share purchaser, we just purchased 3500 points in the MVCI Destinations Program through MVCI after an Encore presentation (first presentation was 2012 and we visited again recently).
> 
> We are in the 10 day period of right to rescind.  Putting the cost for the points aside for the moment ---- While on one hand I think this program will be a good thing for us, allowing us to explore places we would not generally travel to, I am also having second thoughts as I am unsure what this does for me as opposed to just putting together an annual trip.
> 
> ...


Having these questions is in itself enough to tell you that you should rescind this purchase immediately and then do your research here and then and only then decide what you should do about buying into a TS system.

So rescind now and do the research.


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## BocaBoy (Aug 18, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> First time time share purchaser, we just purchased 3500 points in the MVCI Destinations Program through MVCI after an Encore presentation (first presentation was 2012 and we visited again recently).
> 
> We are in the 10 day period of right to rescind.  Putting the cost for the points aside for the moment ---- While on one hand I think this program will be a good thing for us, allowing us to explore places we would not generally travel to, I am also having second thoughts as I am unsure what this does for me as opposed to just putting together an annual trip.
> 
> ...



You have identified the big problem with purchasing points--they are extremely expensive.  Most people here on TUG (myself included) will counsel you to rescind because we cannot justify the cost outlay.  Most of us own weeks which can be converted to points on an annual basis because they were purchased before the introduction of the Destinations program.  You might be better off looking for a resale week and buy that, even though a week purchased today would not be eligible to be converted to points.  You would be able to use such a week or trade it through interval International.  You could also purchase Getaways at favorable prices from interval.  This approach is economically very attractive.


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## jimf41 (Aug 18, 2013)

If you decide not to rescind you have to you have to understand that 3500 points will get you a decent week but not a great week. You'll have to buy 1500 more points to get a great week. It comes down to your age, your income, the number of people you travel with and the time of year you want to travel.

If you don't fully understand exactly what 3500 points will get you then I recommend that you rescind and do some homework before plunking down the cash required for 3500 trust points. 

Buying resale is cheaper but it comes with it's own problems. You can't convert the week to points so if you want o go somewhere else you have two options. Rent and use the proceeds to to rent somewhere else of trade with II and try to get a week where and when you want to travel. Both options are more complicated than just using your points to reserve a week. 

If you are brand new to timesharing you won't really understand the pro's and con's of any of this. 

Rescind, do your homework and come back and choose a method that is best for you.


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## burg1121 (Aug 18, 2013)

Rent Rent Rent Then buy somewhere you really liked on resale market or just keep renting.


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## iluvfla (Aug 18, 2013)

Give it back !!!! There is a lot to learn before buying a timeshare, I wish I knew about this website before I bought my first timeshare for 24000, then my second week cost me only 3000!!!!! Thanks to tug !!!!!


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## swaits (Aug 18, 2013)

Adding to the echo chamber.. Your concerns are well founded. Rescind at once!


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## jont (Aug 18, 2013)

Welcome to TUG, you have come to the right place, a little late but better late than never. I agree with the others, if you don't fully understand what you bought you should  rescind. Do your research and then make an informed decision. You may find that buying a resale unit at a place you really would like to go most years works best or you may find that renting is the way to go. Whatever, there is never a rush to buy.  Take your time and figure out what works best for you. We are here to help you. Good luck.


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## Saintsfanfl (Aug 18, 2013)

If you add up all the costs and do the math, it is cheaper to just book what you want on Marriott.com. It's cheaper AND you don't have to prepay AND you can cancel up to 3 days before check-in. The break-even point is literally decades down the road and after you figure interest and/or opportunity cost break-even will likely never happen. 

Buying points retail makes zero sense whatsoever.


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## gmarine (Aug 18, 2013)

Rescind ASAP.


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## dioxide45 (Aug 18, 2013)

You found out what the problem is with trust points, they are not a great value over just renting on your own. In the past, MVCI was able to sell the prepaid vacation". However, when the moved in to the DC points era that all changed.

The cheapest I beleive you can buy 3,500 trust points for is $9.80pp without incentives. I don't know if they offer that to non-owners, but I think they would to make the sale.

$9.80 x 3,500 = $35,300

Annual Maintenance Fees are $0.437pp. There is also a $175 annual DC fee.

($0.437 x 3,500) +$175 = $1,704.50 per year

For $1705 you can get a pretty good hotel room for seven nights a year. That without the upfront $35K. Now of course a Marriott timeshare is far different than a cramped hotel room. But for about $1000 (if that) more you can rent a great Marriott timeshare from an owner. That would mean it would take 35 years to break even.

As saintsfanfl indicated, if you are financing the timeshare then you will likely never break even. If you count in the interest you could have earned on the $35,000, then you won't break even. Heck, you could use the interest on the $35,000 plus the annual MFs to rent a great week at a great resort in prime season.

Now, if you have no concerns about money and want flexibility and ease of use, then points are a great tool to take great vacations.


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## NYFLTRAVELER (Aug 18, 2013)

Thank you. Certainly taking your comments into consideration.

I do like the concept of being able to travel to various Marriott (and similar level) resorts and have the use of the grounds and larger accommodations. 

I would not want to purchase a set week at a specific resort and be attached to that resort or be reliant on depositing it to the pool and relying on being able/not being able to trade it in for another week someplace else. The whole theory behind purchasing via the Destinations Club was the flexibility of going to various locations during different times of the year (we have young children) banking points for a longer trip in the future and/or renting out nights.

I am going to scour these boards to see what you all say pro and con about the program in general (have not seen many pro's yet) and then make a decision before the end of the week.

Thank you again.

SBD


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## puckmanfl (Aug 18, 2013)

good morning

NYFL traveler....

remember that points are just a currency for occupancy. Trust resorts, you do have direct access (depending on availability) however, 2/3 of the system (Legacy weeks) are already owned by owners like us, even with points, you would still be "exchanging".  I am willing to bet that the sales rep did not explain this to you.  I bet he/she said something like this...  Go where you want, when you want!!!  Everything in timesharing is dependent on availability!!!


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## NYFLTRAVELER (Aug 18, 2013)

puckmanfl said:


> good morning
> 
> NYFL traveler....
> 
> remember that points are just a currency for occupancy. Trust resorts, you do have direct access (depending on availability) however, 2/3 of the system (Legacy weeks) are already owned by owners like us, even with points, you would still be "exchanging".  I am willing to bet that the sales rep did not explain this to you.  I bet he/she said something like this...  Go where you want, when you want!!!  Everything in timesharing is dependent on availability!!!



Yes, they explained go where you want when you want but you would need to book early to have a chance to get in.

For example, if I were to buy a week at a specific resort instead via a resale, let's say the last week of August at Newport, what can I legitimately do with it as we certainly do not want to go out to the same place year after year but may, for example, wish to travel in a February to Colorado or the Caribbean.

I look at it this way, the average cost of a 1 week trip at a nice hotel/resort is probably $3,000-$4,500.  We have young children.  In 8 or so years individual trips would = the approx. $25k price. Then from that point forward the cost of a trip would be primarily the maintenance fees.  Am I right to use this mindset?


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## FlyerBobcat (Aug 18, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> I look at it this way, the average cost of a 1 week trip at a nice hotel/resort is probably $3,000-$4,500.  We have young children.  In 8 or so years individual trips would = the approx. $25k price. Then from that point forward the cost of a trip would be primarily the maintenance fees.  Am I right to use this mindset?



Will the 3,500 points get you something that realistically equates to a $3,000 - $4,500 per week stay on a regular basis?  (I kinda' doubt it, but there are MUCH better experts on the topic here....)

Also... what about MFs during those first 8 weeks you mention?


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## indyhorizons (Aug 18, 2013)

The only thing I would add to this discussion is it appears your assumption is you would be purchasing a fixed week.  Very few of the weeks sold are/were fixed weeks (in the overall scheme of things). Most weeks you will find on the resale market will be floating- which means you could reserve during any week of the season you purchase. Whatever resort you would choose, I would recommend that you purchase platinum if you decdide to purchase a resale week. I also believe that there are some resale weeks that will always have prime exchange capabilities, for example most platinum 3 bedrooms seem to command high exchange priority preference. I vote for rescinding and taking your time to do research.  This is a friendly bunch of folks who you can/will learn a great deal from.  You're asking some great questions.


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## dioxide45 (Aug 18, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> I look at it this way, the average cost of a 1 week trip at a nice hotel/resort is probably $3,000-$4,500.  We have young children.  In 8 or so years individual trips would = the approx. $25k price. Then from that point forward the cost of a trip would be primarily the maintenance fees.  Am I right to use this mindset?



I always had to laugh years ago when a sale rep would ask us how much we were spending on the vacation. Probably about $3000. He would say, wouldn't you be better to put that in to buying a week at a resort and prepay for the vacation? While true, perhaps only about $1000 of that $3000 was for the lodging. I don't think buying timeshare was going to pay for my food, rental car, airfare and entertainment too.

I would agree with FlyerBobcat. Take a look at the points chart to see what 3,500 points will get you. You will likely find that it will be tough to get 7 nights at a premier resort in peak season. Though if you can travel Sun-Thur nights (five nights), you will probably do okay. Though, then you have to consider you are only getting five nights a year instead of seven.


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## puckmanfl (Aug 18, 2013)

good morning....

NYFL traveler....  go on the points chart and see what 3500 points gets you???

go on redweek.com to check out rental rates....


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## jont (Aug 18, 2013)

I would suggest that if you do decide to buy points from Marriott that you buy the smallest package available  which I believe is 1000 points and then rent the rest of the points you need. Greg T has sent up a great website for renting points. The initial startup cost would be less but it would still allow you to play the points game. You could rent the additional points you need at 50 -65 cents per point  vs 45 cents per year Mf without the big initial capital outlay. Something to consider.


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## FractionalTraveler (Aug 18, 2013)

Here are some good benefits for your 3500 Points purchase:

1. Ability to rent more points from other owners at a reduced cost.  You can't do this unless your an owner enrolled in the DC.
2. Flexibility to book and confirm a reservation like a hotel room by the day at any MVCI resort in any season desired.  You can't do this as a resale owner who buys in today's marketplace.
3. Ability to use your points for other types of vacation experiences.
4. Automatic enrollment in the MVCI DC.
5. Rent from MVCI at 25% discount for being an owner.
6. Trade for MR points if so desired (not a good value)
7. Rent out your points for cash if desired

Many folks take an ALL or NOTHING approach to vacationing using timeshares as the only vehicle to achieve their goals thus they will always recommend to *"Rescind"* immediately.

If this is merely one way you plan on vacationing then it may be a good fit with your particular lifestyle choices.

The Marriott Program is not the only way to travel or vacation each year but IMHO it does offer quite a few good opportunities to do so.

As others have suggested, this site can help you understand the program better.

Good luck.

FT


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## dioxide45 (Aug 18, 2013)

FractionalTraveler said:


> Many folks take an ALL or NOTHING approach to vacationing using timeshares as the only vehicle to achieve their goals thus they will always recommend to *"Rescind"* immediately.



I think the *Rescind immediately* advice is never bad advice. It doesn't cost you anything. A week is not nearly enough time to to the research on what is a major financial transaction.

You can always go back to Marriott later and buy the same points, though prices may have gone up a few cents per point. However, rescinding removes the pressure to research NOW and make a quick decision that you may regret later. Rescind and take the time needed to learn about the program and know if it is right program to buy in to for one's family.


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## FractionalTraveler (Aug 18, 2013)

dioxide45 said:


> I think the *Rescind immediately* advice is never bad advice. It doesn't cost you anything. A week is not nearly enough time to to the research on what is a major financial transaction.
> 
> You can always go back to Marriott later and buy the same points, though prices may have gone up a few cents per point. However, rescinding removes the pressure to research NOW and make a quick decision that you may regret later. Rescind and take the time needed to learn about the program and know if it is right program to buy in to for one's family.



You make a good point, I agree its a good idea to take your time with such a lifestyle purchase.  

I would not agree if the justification is just because the purchase is retail.

FT


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## rovitm (Aug 18, 2013)

Good morning NYFLTRAVELER,

You will receive good advice on this site and welcome.  I was new to timeshares before I joined and I am glad I did.  Without joining I was about to buy directly from Marriott but instead I learned the system, bought resale and saved a lot of money.  

I was recently at a presentation and the big selling point for the sales team was the World Traveler Collection.  It looks good when you are thinking about going to great places until you find out the point retirements are for only two people and for a family of four you will have to pay out of pocket.  It is a lot of money.  I agree and think you should rescind and do some research.  





NYFLTRAVELER said:


> First time time share purchaser, we just purchased 3500 points in the MVCI Destinations Program through MVCI after an Encore presentation (first presentation was 2012 and we visited again recently).  Not planning on using their financing.
> 
> We are in the 10 day period of right to rescind.  Putting the cost for the points aside for the moment ---- While on one hand I think this program will be a good thing for us, and with small children we have a resort type property as opposed to a one room run of the mill hotel room and the program allowing us to explore places we would not generally travel to, I am also having second thoughts as I am unsure what this does for me as opposed to just putting together an annual trip.  We do not want to buy a week at a certain resort and be attached to that property or have difficulties trading that. I do like the flexibility of going wherever we'd like.
> 
> ...


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## jme (Aug 18, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> Yes, they explained go where you want when you want but you would need to book early to have a chance to get in.
> 
> For example, if I were to buy a week at a specific resort instead via a resale, let's say the last week of August at Newport, what can I legitimately do with it as we certainly do not want to go out to the same place year after year but may, for example, wish to travel in a February to Colorado or the Caribbean.
> 
> I look at it this way, the average cost of a 1 week trip at a nice hotel/resort is probably $3,000-$4,500.  We have young children.  In 8 or so years individual trips would = the approx. $25k price. Then from that point forward the cost of a trip would be primarily the maintenance fees.  Am I right to use this mindset?



yes, but...you didn't get what you thought you got!

Ditto, ditto, ditto on what everybody else has said!!!!!!!!!

Bottom line: 3500 points won't get you what you want....i.e., Colorado or Caribbean in Feb., or even a good beach location in summer... not once!!! 

It might get you there in Spring or Fall, & 2 weeks in summer. but 3500 points is a "mediocre" week somewhere. Get hold of a points chart and look at what you can get. i'll bet you've never seen a chart. To get what you want, you need 5000-6000+ points. They force you to buy MORE later. 

You've also paid a premium in money already, and you'll have exorbitant annual maintenance fees, and for what?  Rescind and research. There are wise people here...don't feel remorse for what you did, just back out and learn. We've all learned the hard way already, that's why we advise you to do research first. You'll shake your head in disbelief at what you almost did. 

BUT, if you have disposable income (hey, there are some who qualify), then proceed, but double or triple your purchase...only then will you live the life you thought you already bought.


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## BocaBoy (Aug 18, 2013)

jimf41 said:


> If you decide not to rescind you have to you have to understand that *3500 points will get you a decent week but not a great week*. You'll have to buy 1500 more points to get a great week.



I agree with the rescind advice and also with this bolded language IF there is agreement on what is a great week.  What is a great week for some is a bad week for others.  For example, I would never want to go to Hilton Head in the hot summer which is the high season that most consider a great week.  3500 points would get you multiple weeks there at the time of year I would consider prime for me personally.  The key thing is to know and like what you can get for 3500 points, so doing your homework is key.


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## pipet (Aug 18, 2013)

FractionalTraveler said:


> 1. Ability to rent more points from other owners at a reduced cost.  You can't do this unless your an owner enrolled in the DC.



I disagree with this statement - being in the DC points program allows you to have the points you rent transferred into your account (and your name), but you can still rent if not in the DC. You rent points from an owner and have them make the reservation for you; this is similar to renting a week from a weeks' owner; most Marriott owners leave the reservation in their name and add the renter's name to the reservation.  

As for rescinding, I also think the initial cost of points is very hard to justify. As someone also pointed out, very few 3500pt weeks would realistically cost you $3000-4000k for the week. Some prime Maui weeks will cost you that much to rent, but they would also cost you 2 years of points as well, so there isn't any savings.  There are *some* value weeks in the system where the point cost (based on MF & ignoring initial outlay) is cheaper than renting, but those are the exception rather than the rule.

If you have tons of money, the points program is nice because of the flexibility.  If you are not overflowing with cash, I'd seriously consider renting points for .60/pt instead of buying them and/or simply renting a traditional week from year to year.  Renting from year to year is the ultimate in flexibility, and renting from owners will almost always be cheaper than the rates you see at Marriott.com. 

Check out http://vacationpointexchange.com/ to see what the point rental market looks like.  Like others have mentioned, study the charts as others to see what 3500 gets you and compare rental prices for those same weeks.


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## jimf41 (Aug 18, 2013)

pipet said:


> I disagree with this statement - being in the DC points program allows you to have the points you rent transferred into your account (and your name), but you can still rent if not in the DC. You rent points from an owner and have them make the reservation for you; this is similar to renting a week from a weeks' owner; most Marriott owners leave the reservation in their name and add the renter's name to the reservation.



I suppose this is possible as in anything is possible but look at the logistics of this from a non-DC members prospective. You would have to know how the DC system operates and understand it. Then you would have to find someone who is a DC member  and has enough available points to check online availability for you or ask them to spend time on the phone with a rep.

Now you would have to know about the points rental website and find an owner renting points who was 

A. willing to make a reservation for you with his points for what he was asking just to rent the points. 

B. willing to go through this nut roll with no upfront payment from you and no guarantee that you'll pay him after he rents the week for you.

Isn't it just easier to rent a week?


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## dioxide45 (Aug 18, 2013)

jimf41 said:


> B. willing to go through this nut roll with no upfront payment from you and no guarantee that you'll pay him after he rents the week for you.



Though if the renter doesn't follow through and pay, the owner can always just cancel the points reservation and get all their points back.


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## SkyBlueWaters (Aug 18, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> First time time share purchaser, we just purchased 3500 points in the MVCI Destinations Program through MVCI after an Encore presentation (first presentation was 2012 and we visited again recently).  Not planning on using their financing.
> 
> We are in the 10 day period of right to rescind.  Putting the cost for the points aside for the moment ---- While on one hand I think this program will be a good thing for us, and with small children we have a resort type property as opposed to a one room run of the mill hotel room and the program allowing us to explore places we would not generally travel to, I am also having second thoughts as I am unsure what this does for me as opposed to just putting together an annual trip.  We do not want to buy a week at a certain resort and be attached to that property or have difficulties trading that. I do like the flexibility of going wherever we'd like.
> 
> ...



It took me a year of research before buying my first resale. Break even was less than a year because for one of my units, we got a ski season MVCI. After four years, I added a MVCI property mainly because have firmed up our vacationing preferences. Point is, you have all your life to buy but only a couple of days to rescind. Follow your gut feel and spend some time here and exchanging a resale. You'd be surprised at what you can get on the secondary market from third parties.


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## jimf41 (Aug 18, 2013)

dioxide45 said:


> Though if the renter doesn't follow through and pay, the owner can always just cancel the points reservation and get all their points back.



If you were renting points how many cancellations would you go through before you just said "rent the points or go away i'm not in the reservation business".


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## dioxide45 (Aug 18, 2013)

jimf41 said:


> If you were renting points how many cancellations would you go through before you just said "rent the points or go away i'm not in the reservation business".



While possible, I think the issue is very small. In most cases you would be checking for availability and probably only making the reservation when you had a confirmation from the renter that they wanted to rent the confirmation. Probably 95%, if not more, would follow through. I think you are making it sound like a bigger issue than it would end up being.

It is easier to flat out rent and transfer points? Yes, but renting a confirmed reservation made with points isn't that much harder.


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## jont (Aug 18, 2013)

Speaking as someone who rents out points, I would ask the prospective renter for a small deposit prior to me making the reservation.


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## Bill4728 (Aug 18, 2013)

Please note that many current TS owners will rent out their weeks to the general public at a cost significantly less than Marriott will rent the same room. 

We were thinking about buying a Westin TS in Hawaii and the MFs would have been about $2300/yr .  For about the same amount of money I was able to find several current owners who would rent me the same TS unit. This means that I can stay in the same resort with the same large TS apartment as an owner without having to buy anything. If next year we want to go to Disney I can rent a room there for 1/2 of the MFs of the Hawaii TS.

Good Luck


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## NYFLTRAVELER (Aug 18, 2013)

Thank you all for your feedback.  I have some more studying and research to do over the next few days.  I am sure I will be back with more questions.


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## Beverley (Aug 18, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> Thank you. Certainly taking your comments into consideration.
> 
> I do like the concept of being able to travel to various Marriott (and similar level) resorts and have the use of the grounds and larger accommodations.
> 
> ...



I will stand out there and say that we are very happy owners of a number of Marriott deeded week resorts and we purchased 2500 trust points two years ago. Yes, we could rent hotel rooms for less ... but the accommodations are not nearly as spacious.  We can easily have family and friends join us and choose to have dinners out or family dinners in ... Using destinations we are able to reserve the view category we want, we are able to stretch our points by reserving almost a week (Sun to Thursday take half the DC points as a Sat or Sun) and when we are not having family and friends we can reserve a one bedroom for longer or for less points. 

One thing that could make your purchase better (hold on to your hat) is to circle back to your sales person and ask if he/ she can get a resale (through Marriott) of an off season week that can be converted to 1500 or more points that costs under 5K.  They will place this week in the program and waive any sign on fee as long as the purchase is done at the time of buying a min of 1500 trust points.  We just sold through Marriott our Spring Barony week that brought 1625 DC points every year for a price to the buyer if 3300. If they coupled this with a purchase of 1500 trust points they would have access to 3125 per year.  If you did this and added it to your 3500 point purchase, you would have 5125 every year to work with.

Just this week, friends of ours did similar only they purchased an every other year Vegas property with 1500 dc points and have an average of just under 3000 dc points each year for a total price of just under 23K.  (they paid 11.88 per credit)  According to our presentation two weeks ago, ( we didn't buy since we own another 5 and 2500 dc pts) if you purchased 3500 points, the price was rolled back to 9.50 per credit and you also got another incentive or two.  If a purchase like yours were made in conjunction with a resale week purchased through your Marriott rep for a small amount more ( in comparison) you would greatly increase your benefits.

There is a lot that can be done with 3500 dc points but there is much more that can be done with 5000+.

We've owned since 1999 and have not been sorry a day since.  Now that our daughters are older and do not always travel with us, we have friends that join us, enjoy some trips on our own, and can give our kids access to places they would like to go on their own.  We could have saved money buying resale along the way but never did.  With their new system, I am glad that we purchased through Marriott. We used to trade frequently through II but now we use DC points when we want to go to another Marriott property.  I expect that Marriott DC points would trade relatively easily to other systems but as with all timeshares, where you want to go would have to be available.

Good luck with your decision.  I would not rescind.  I imagine you were able to apply your encore costs to your purchase price and that you got a reasonable roll back price.  Congratulations on your purchase.

Beverley


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## Whirl (Aug 18, 2013)

FractionalTraveler said:


> Here are some good benefits for your 3500 Points purchase:
> 
> 1. Ability to rent more points from other owners at a reduced cost.  You can't do this unless your an owner enrolled in the DC.
> 2. Flexibility to book and confirm a reservation like a hotel room by the day at any MVCI resort in any season desired.  You can't do this as a resale owner who buys in today's marketplace.
> ...




For STarters, I agree with the advice to research thoroughly before buying and if you are not 100% certain, then perhaps wait until you are. 

With that disclaimer out of the way, I would echo most of the above comments, adding some balance to the discussion. 

Adding a couple more considerations. No need to add to the other side of argument as it is well represented: 

1. renting from an individual requires a degree of work and diligence you may not feel like doing

2. Some properties and or size accommodations are harder to get into and MAY  not be as readily available, so it may require more flexibililty than you are aware

3. Context - again not saying any of the prevailing advice is incorrect or inappropriate,  but there is a resale bias to this community... 

One key thing to take note....a CON....take key note of the advice to see what you really get for 3500 points. That would rarely be enough to get me what I want as I need prime time and large accommodations...


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## FractionalTraveler (Aug 18, 2013)

Another benefit to purchasing Trust points is using your points to enhance a legacy deeded week reservation by adding on a few days to the reservation without burning through another week.

FT


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## jimf41 (Aug 18, 2013)

dioxide45 said:


> While possible, I think the issue is very small. In most cases you would be checking for availability and probably only making the reservation when you had a confirmation from the renter that they wanted to rent the confirmation. Probably 95%, if not more, would follow through. I think you are making it sound like a bigger issue than it would end up being.
> 
> It is easier to flat out rent and transfer points? Yes, but renting a confirmed reservation made with points isn't that much harder.



Originally I said let's look at this from the non-DC members perspective. I own a 2b OS plat unit at Ocean Pointe. If I were to convert to DC points and rent them on the VPE website at .60 a point I'd be asking for $2595 based on the 4325 points. Why would someone ask me to get a week for them at a cost of $2595 when there are 55 listings on Redweek for a 2b OS/OF during plat season at Ocean Pointe ranging in price from $1750 to $2500. 

It just doesn't make any sense to try to do this. It has no real benefit to the seller and it's more expensive to the renter. Yes it's possible but IMO highly unlikely.


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## denydog (Aug 18, 2013)

*DC Points OK for us.*

My wife and I were in similar situation as OP 18 months ago. In our case, we purchased into Marriott 3,500 DC point timeshare while on a stay at Marriott Ko Olina. I started my first research into timeshares via Google as I sat by the pool an hour after signing the contract.

The TUG forum stood out, and as I continued reading, I quickly came to the realization that we had just signed up for the most expensive way to get into Marriott timeshare ownership. But as of today, I still do not regret our decision. For us it pretty much comes down to convenience. If it were just me it would be different, but my wife hates complications and any type of ambiguity. Convenience and simplicity trumps other factors, though I realize the high cost. My wife would never go for any trading of weeks, or buying renting or selling outside of Marriott.

So for us the DC points seem to be working out well. I made a reservation ten months out for a 10-day stay at Waiohai, two bedroom ocean view, using nearly two years points (6,900). We like better views and more than a week at a time, though our travel times are flexible. I also am considering using the single night(s) option for a short stay when I'm passing through Newport  next summer.

If I want more points in the future, I will buy them as needed outside of Marriott.

I do agree with others here that the OP should probably back out if they have questions at this point, unless they know for sure what they want, and are getting.


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## LUVourMarriotts (Aug 18, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> Yes, they explained go where you want when you want but you would need to book early to have a chance to get in.
> 
> For example, if I were to buy a week at a specific resort instead via a resale, let's say the last week of August at Newport, what can I legitimately do with it as we certainly do not want to go out to the same place year after year but may, for example, wish to travel in a February to Colorado or the Caribbean.



Example, I own at Marriott Fairway Villas in Absecon, NJ, a Platinum week. I've exchange that unit twice to Barony Beach, HHI, twice to Aruba Surf Club, to Orlando, Williamsburg, VA, Park City. Many of these were before the Destination Club, but not all. Most were for Platinum weeks and all were 2BR units. My most recent II exchange with that week was for a 2BR unit at Surf Club this past July for a specific week, for a friend. 

I can't guarantee, that you would always be able to do this, but Marriott won't either. Here's the kicker, if you bought the same resale week at Fairway, you'd probably be paying $5000 up front and MF's are cheaper than 3500 points, last I checked.


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## stoler527 (Aug 19, 2013)

*Goals of timeshare ownership*

Sometimes we get so involved with the cheapest way to do things that we forget that others have other goals.

Yes, being retired, my family has limited cash and so we search for a cost effective way to vacation. 

It would probably be cheaper for us to rent rather than own. We own because it reduces stress and forces us to actually go on vacations.

The OP sounds like he or she is willing to spend money to buy flexibility and to lessen the hassles of vacation planning. The points program will do that.

I agree that 3500 points will not meet the goals of the OP. More points are needed. If money is not a constraining factor, the OP should just buy more than 3500 points. Otherwise, the resale week from Marriott combined with the points would be a good way to go.

We did not buy into the points program. For us, it was just too expensive. For the OP, it may be the perfect purchase.

However, the OP needs to look at the points charts and to decide what is best for the family. The salesman probably painted a rosy picture. If time is running short, I would advise the OP to rescind and take the purchase more slowly. If time has run out, I would advise the OP to enjoy the points and develop a strategy (purchasing, renting, resale weeks, etc) to get more points.


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## NYFLTRAVELER (Aug 19, 2013)

Crafty527 said:


> I agree that 3500 points will not meet the goals of the OP. More points are needed. If money is not a constraining factor, the OP should just buy more than 3500 points. Otherwise, the resale week from Marriott combined with the points would be a good way to go.



I am not certain that the 3500 will meet our needs either looking at when we would need to travel, where to travel etc....

What do you mean by "Otherwise the resale week from Marriott combined with the points would be a good way to go?"

Thanks.


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## vacationhopeful (Aug 19, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> I am not certain that the 3500 will meet our needs either looking at when we would need to travel, where to travel etc....
> 
> What do you mean by "Otherwise the resale week from Marriott combined with the points would be a good way to go?"
> 
> Thanks.



Post #35 above in this thread - Beverley info.

If you even remotely_ believe_ you NEED MORE INFO, rescind NOW! 

Despite what every timeshare person will tell you, all developer sales' DEAL OF THE CENTURY are not the ONLY, BEST, GREATEST or LAST deal. Those terms will not be in your written contract that you will be struck with - but the salesman's commission check will be in his pocket (for about 5 minutes til he hits the check cashing store).


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## KathyPet (Aug 19, 2013)

I do agree that the OP Has most probably not purchased enough points to get them what they may want.  They need to check the points requirement chart to look at the requirements for points at a couple of resorts and times that they would be MOST interested in vacationing at to see what the ycurrent points requirements are for those resorts and times.
However I absolutely agree that not every purchaser's focus is on the bottom line.  Many MVCI owners simply do not want the hassle and frustrations of dealing with renting addl points or taking the hours of time required to play with the availability calendar on the MVCI website.  
I recently made two reservations using DC points that I had banked.  The first one at OW inn August of 2014 went pretty easily but the second reservation trying to use the remaining points at Oceana Palms or Ocean Points took hours of fooling around with unit size, view, # of  nights, check in days etc.  I ended up getting something but had to rent a small # of points to complete the transaction.  That also took time.
I now have zero DC points banked and while I will never say never I seriously doubt I will ever trade for DC points again. It is simply too much hassle.  I just want simplicity.   If you have the time and interest in spending hours on line fooling around with how to use your DC points then have at it.
As for me I will stick to using my deeded weeks at my home resort which is why I purchased at those resorts to start with or trying to trade with II with my weeks.


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## Fasttr (Aug 19, 2013)

Another option for the OP to consider, if they decide not to rescind, but feel they need more points in the short term, and feel they want to vacation in full week increments, is to use their newly purchased points to book Sun-Thur and then use MOD rate with Marriott credit card to get 35% off Fri-Sat nights on Marriott.com and pay cash for those. That might also allow OP to stretch points without needing to purchase more today. It's just another option in addition to buying more or renting from others.

That said, OP could only book the 5 nights with points at 10 months out so availability could be more limited.  Just tossing there idea out there so OP can consider all options.


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## Saintsfanfl (Aug 19, 2013)

KathyPet said:


> I do agree that the OP Has most probably not purchased enough points to get them what they may want.  They need to check the points requirement chart to look at the requirements for points at a couple of resorts and times that they would be MOST interested in vacationing at to see what the ycurrent points requirements are for those resorts and times.
> However I absolutely agree that not every purchaser's focus is on the bottom line.  Many MVCI owners simply do not want the hassle and frustrations of dealing with renting addl points or taking the hours of time required to play with the availability calendar on the MVCI website.
> I recently made two reservations using DC points that I had banked.  The first one at OW inn August of 2014 went pretty easily but the second reservation trying to use the remaining points at Oceana Palms or Ocean Points took hours of fooling around with unit size, view, # of  nights, check in days etc.  I ended up getting something but had to rent a small # of points to complete the transaction.  That also took time.
> I now have zero DC points banked and while I will never say never I seriously doubt I will ever trade for DC points again. It is simply too much hassle.  I just want simplicity.   If you have the time and interest in spending hours on line fooling around with how to use your DC points then have at it.
> As for me I will stick to using my deeded weeks at my home resort which is why I purchased at those resorts to start with or trying to trade with II with my weeks.



Yes but what about just booking on Marriott.com?? Hassle free, no frustration, no prepayments, 100% flexible, and fully cancelable. 

You can use anything as an example but lets look at booking a summer week at Grande Ocean on HHI. This is a conservative example because Grande Ocean is relatively cheap on DC point cost compared to demand.

OF - Points Required for 1 week - 5,400

Upfront Cost - $52,920
Current Annual Cost $2,359.80

marriott.com for July 4 2014 (full rate, no discount) - $4,545.45

Let's be as conservative as possible and assume we paid cash for the points. Let's use a rate of 1% for a CD comparison. That will generate $532 per year to help with the annual cost deficit. Let's assume no price increases on anything and no increase in interest rates.

How long to break even? *32 years!*

If you don't pay cash then you will never ever hit a break-even point. When interest rates start rising you also will likely never hit break even.

This is a very conservative example. My OF week at Ocean Pointe for Thanksgiving has a break even point of 99 years using the same logic.

I can't figure out why anyone would buy DC points retail unless they were guaranteed something unique in return. So far there doesn't seem to be anything unique about any of the properties in the DC. You can get anything you want without the points.


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## GregT (Aug 19, 2013)

I think the "best" option right now when purchasing direct right now is 2,000 Trust Points (approx. $22,000) bundled with a 3BR Grande Vista EOY (approx. $6,300).  There are about $800 in closing costs, so it's $29K all-in.

Still a lot of money, but the Grande Vista is worth 3,725 points EOY, and can be used either as a rocking trading property (that is enrolled), or as a points generator.  If used as a trader, the full 3BR would be strong enough to compete for prime summer weeks, and the locked-off 2BR still would be a great deposit in its own right, with the Studio as another week for Instant Exchange.

If used as a points generator, it has a respectable point/MF value that supplements well the base package of 2,000 points.  As others have noted, I still don't think this is enough points for someone who is dedicated to using their points for their vacation needs, but there is a lot that could be done with this package:

1) Use the full 3BR when trading for tough Marriott trades
2) Use the 2BR when trading within Marriott for normal trades
3) Use the Studio when trading outside the Marriott network, or for Instant Exchange
4) Use the 2,000 points to extend the reservation of #1 or #2 
5) Use the 2,000 points for Sun-Thurs then cash reservations for Fri/Sat
6) Make the GV into a points generator and have 5,725 points EOY and 2K EOY
7) Rent points to combine with any of the above (excluding external #3)

For a purchaser who really wants to play in Marriott points, and doesn't feel like taking the resale purchase risk, this seems like a viable option.

Thoughts?

Best,

Greg


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## jont (Aug 19, 2013)

A very good option Greg, especially considering the the OP has stated he wants to trade for other TS systems thru II. With 2000 points he can always bank or borrow them for a good vacation eoy while using his GV unit to trade into other locations. Plus you got him about 350 extra points per year while saving him about 5k in initial upfront cost.


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## Fasttr (Aug 19, 2013)

jont said:


> A very good option Greg, especially considering the the OP has stated he wants to trade for other TS systems thru II. With 2000 points he can always bank or borrow them for a good vacation eoy while using his GV unit to trade into other locations. Plus you got him about 350 extra points per year while saving him about 5k in initial upfront cost.



I think the savings is less than $5k as I assume they applied his encore room costs against the purchase price. I assume that was nearly 2 grand at NCV in the summer.  Also with the 3500 point purchase they roll back the price per point a decent amount. 

Obviously from all the ideas above, there are many ways to skin a cat.


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## Saintsfanfl (Aug 19, 2013)

GregT said:


> For a purchaser who really wants to play in Marriott points, and doesn't feel like taking the resale purchase risk, this seems like a viable option.



I think that sums it up. If you really want to get into DC points then this bundle is as good an option as any.


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## cp73 (Aug 19, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> I cannot get past the concept of paying so much money for the points PLUS paying annual maintenance fees on top of that when we can stay at a Marriott property for 5 or so days for +/- the cost of the maintenance fees.....



NYFL you hit the nail on the head. It is tough to get past this point. It will never make financial sense to do this. Don't even consider taking out a loan to do it. Rescind and think it through. You can always jump back in. There is no shortage of points or timeshares to buy. No hurry at all.


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## GregT (Aug 19, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> I cannot get past the concept of paying so much money for the points PLUS paying annual maintenance fees on top of that when we can stay at a Marriott property for 5 or so days for +/- the cost of the maintenance fees..... That is what is troubling me most.  What is the benefit of being part of the "club"?



A big reason to favor a timeshare over staying at a Marriott property for 5 or so days (assuming you're referring to a hotel?) is that there is a much higher cost for food/laundry with the hotel (and less space -- which is tough to value).

If you are referring to renting a timeshare week from an owner, than I agree, the cash cost simply become the easiest comparison of rental cost versus the MFs.  Many timeshares (including Marriotts) can be rented for the same as MFs, or nominally more than MFs -- so why own them? (that is worthy of a different thread, and there are good answers for ownership, IMO).

But these arguments support your concern that being in the Club doesn't appear to have any intrinsic value in its own right.  What intrinsic value there is comes in the form of convenience (primarily personal control over the reservation) versus any traditional financial value.

Resale purchases are where financial value (if there is any, in the timeshare world) starts to become relevant.  But even resale purchases of Trust Points are expensive.   Fundamentally, the Marriott point system is an expensive way to vacation -- a wonderful way, to be sure but so is simply paying cash for everything.   Expensive, but wonderful.

The way my timeshares make financial sense for me (again, if that concept is possible) is that I've figured out to maximize each system -- I've bought systems that can be acquired on the resale market inexpensively, and I've studied the systems to usually be able to get the prime reservation I want.  

Marriott doesn't let the resale purchaser do this -- points are simply expensive to use (because you need a lot of them for a prime 2BR), and the fees make them expensive to purchase.  

It is not dissimilar to the premiums associated with a fixed week -- I paid a big premium to have a fixed week at MOC, because of the convenience of not having to be on the phone line at 6am and hoping my week would be there (and I also wanted a 3BR).   

Points are similar -- there is a premium associated with the convenience.  If you are looking for a cost effective alternative to hotels, then I think you should focus on that, and realize the answer may not be Marriott DC points.   I hope this helps?

Best,

Greg


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## Venter (Aug 19, 2013)

*Another system?*

As mentioned by GREGT another system might make more sense if convenience and cost effectiveness matters.  I love Marriott resorts and feel bad for recommending any other system but of late I have looked at HGVC.  They are building a couple of new resorts, have affiliates and you can either book your week or use points.  Mostly people seemed satisfied to get what they want even using points for other resorts at 10 months out. They do however trade through RCI to other systems but best of all they are still available almost like for like resale.

Have a look over on the HGVC board.


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## SkyBlueWaters (Aug 19, 2013)

Venter said:


> As mentioned by GREGT another system might make more sense if convenience and cost effectiveness matters.  I love Marriott resorts and feel bad for recommending any other system but of late I have looked at HGVC.  They are building a couple of new resorts, have affiliates and you can either book your week or use points.  Mostly people seemed satisfied to get what they want even using points for other resorts at 10 months out. They do however trade through RCI to other systems but best of all they are still available almost like for like resale.
> 
> Have a look over on the HGVC board.



Are you saying there are no restrictions on HGVC resales? I'm interested in acquiring in a system that has properties in NYC.

Sorry for hijacking this thread but perhaps NYFL will benefit from the information you share.


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## GregT (Aug 19, 2013)

SkyBlueWaters said:


> Are you saying there are no restrictions on HGVC resales? I'm interested in acquiring in a system that has properties in NYC.
> 
> Sorry for hijacking this thread but perhaps NYFL will benefit from the information you share.



No the NYC properties in HGVC have lots of restrictions. I don't even think of them as being part of HGVC. 

The rest of HGVC rocks!

Best,

Greg


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## pwrshift (Aug 19, 2013)

I'll add myself to the rescind list.

Brian


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## NYFLTRAVELER (Aug 19, 2013)

Thank you all for your advice. We are going to rescind at this time and continue to research and explore and perhaps pickup a MVCI Destinations Club points package via resale.

I know that there are fees associated with that ($200 per 250 points, $300 education fee) but if we went that route through a legit reseller can save $.

New question is what is a fair resale market purchase price for 3500 trust points in your opinion?

Thanks again to all.

SBD


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## davidvel (Aug 19, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> Thank you all for your advice. We are going to rescind at this time and continue to research and explore and perhaps pickup a MVCI Destinations Club points package via resale.
> 
> I know that there are fees associated with that ($200 per 250 points, $300 education fee) but if we went that route through a legit reseller can save $.
> 
> ...


Congratulations! As many have said, you have nothing to lose by rescinding, but lots to (potentially) lose by not doing so. Haven't read through all the posts but you can search for rescind and find lots of info: rescind in writing pursuant to the contract. Don't call and don't take calls from your sales person. 

Think about the $30,000+ you just saved, the $1,000 per year in ROI you could easily earn on that money, the $1,700+ in MF per year you saved, and what you could get directly from Marriott.com at any resort for all that $$ over 30 years (at your choice) vs. what you could have reserved with 3500 pts.


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## Beefnot (Aug 20, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> New question is what is a fair resale market purchase price for 3500 trust points in your opinion?



I think I read in a recent thread that Marriott is ROFRing under $5 a point or something like that. So anything north of this would be a good entry point. Might be difficult to get a good gauge on fair resale price given the newness of the DC program.


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## Venter (Aug 20, 2013)

*Nearly none*



SkyBlueWaters said:


> Are you saying there are no restrictions on HGVC resales? I'm interested in acquiring in a system that has properties in NYC.
> 
> Sorry for hijacking this thread but perhaps NYFL will benefit from the information you share.



Not no restrictions but use wise there are none.  The only things that are not like for like are things like Elite status etc. that really only should make a difference when staying in their hotels. 

NYC properties unfortunately as GregT have mentioned are different but that is it really.


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## m61376 (Aug 20, 2013)

I'll just add one suggestion to the ones already posted here- which may or may not be worth considering. I know you've nixed the concept of trading, etc., so aren't looking at buying a resale week. But, depending n your needs (unit size, destinations and time of travel) trading in II might be a relatively easy and much cheaper way to enter the market, at any extent. Esp. if you don't need 2BR and/or prime time all the time. And even if you do, don't underestimate the trade power of some relatively inexpensive weeks- like some of the 3BR's esp.; size of unit is a biggie in II. 

Anyway, as you do your research, you may want to at least look into this before simply dismissing it. The DC has its pluses, but it is still subject to availability.


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## jont (Aug 20, 2013)

Congrats on a wise move and good luck moving forward.


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## cp73 (Aug 20, 2013)

m61376 said:


> I'll just add one suggestion to the ones already posted here- which may or may not be worth considering. I know you've nixed the concept of trading, etc., so aren't looking at buying a resale week. But, depending n your needs (unit size, destinations and time of travel) trading in II might be a relatively easy and much cheaper way to enter the market, at any extent. Esp. if you don't need 2BR and/or prime time all the time. And even if you do, don't underestimate the trade power of some relatively inexpensive weeks- like some of the 3BR's esp.; size of unit is a biggie in II.
> 
> Anyway, as you do your research, you may want to at least look into this before simply dismissing it. The DC has its pluses, but it is still subject to availability.



I couldn't agree more that what m61376 suggested. I dont think anyone on this board has determined that trading with points is any easier than trading a week in II. In both cases its all about availability. You definately will save some money on the purchase price and by purchasing one with a lockout you can get two weeks out of one. Also if you have the ability to travel with less than 90 days advance notice you can trade your lock off unit or one bedroom unit for a two bedroom unit. The weeks system to me seems to give you the most bang for your buck.


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## live4life (Aug 20, 2013)

To rescind or not rescind? ... that is the _TimeshareanI newbie question. _ I was in your shoes NYFLTRAVELLER. A friend of mine was already a weeks owner in 2008 and was telling me of the benefits. Then, the GREAT Recession hit! I saw all of the TS owners dumping their weeks on the various sites- and frankly, I got spooked and did nothing. I went down to Florida from up North and stayed at the Grande Vista for a night and Oceana Palms for another night in Feb. 2010 while en route to Marco Island- just to get a feel for TS and IT WAS FABULOUS.

I debated to either buy fixed weeks or DC points. I elected DP points considering "everyone" was dumping their weeks for peanuts to what they originally paid for them. WHEN I BOUGHT THE DC points, I was at the rescind tunnel- I went back and forth in my mind (recall the song, "Should I stay or should I go now" - it came out in the 80s) well, I was nervous shelling all that money when the DC pgm came out. Would I rescind now? (*somedays yes* [the MF of my 3k points is more than what its worth], *somedays no* [due to the flexibility of having <7 days of usage]).

After I bought the 3k points, I bought two Marriott resale weeks on the market for a fraction of the cost to what people paid for them. So alothough those weeks are currently ineligible to be in the DP program, I either use them, lock them off (get two weeks out of them), or trade them. So basically, i'm in botth program.

If I were to "do it all over again," i would rescind. I would RENT a week somewhere I'd like to take the family from redweek OR rent Marriott DP points from Greg T's website and see what that experience is like. Do that for two vacations/two years. Get acquainted with TUG. NOTE: that as a potential member of the DP pgm, you ability to find premium spots with 3500 points is limited (due to the availibilitry of the resorts, availability to our status of having less than Premium or Premium Plus ownership, etc.).

Don't hesitate to ask more questions... Good luck and keep us posted.


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## NYFLTRAVELER (Aug 20, 2013)

Letters to Rescind went out this afternoon.

Will keep monitoring and if I can find a good resale situation I may look into that.


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## dioxide45 (Aug 20, 2013)

NYFLTRAVELER said:


> Thank you all for your advice. We are going to rescind at this time and continue to research and explore and perhaps pickup a MVCI Destinations Club points package via resale.
> 
> I know that there are fees associated with that ($200 per 250 points, $300 education fee) but if we went that route through a legit reseller can save $.
> 
> ...



There are some other fees, though not substantial by comparison.

ROFR Fee = $95
Transfer Fee $25 per 250 points (BI)


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## SueDonJ (Aug 21, 2013)

dioxide45 said:


> There are some other fees, though not substantial by comparison.
> 
> ROFR Fee = $95
> Transfer Fee $25 per 250 points (BI)



Has there ever been an explanation of why Marriott is charging the same $95 ROFR fee for Points that they charge for Weeks, when the DC governing docs allow for as much as $1.00/point for ROFR on Points resales?


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## dioxide45 (Aug 21, 2013)

SueDonJ said:


> Has there ever been an explanation of why Marriott is charging the same $95 ROFR fee for Points that they charge for Weeks, when the DC governing docs allow for as much as $1.00/point for ROFR on Points resales?



Not that I am aware of. It seems from prior reports that they are only charging the $95 per deed but as you indicate can charge way more than that. I also find it odd that they charge $25 per BI even though all BIs are on a single deed


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## jimf41 (Aug 21, 2013)

SueDonJ said:


> Has there ever been an explanation of why Marriott is charging the same $95 ROFR fee for Points that they charge for Weeks, when the DC governing docs allow for as much as $1.00/point for ROFR on Points resales?



They do charge $.80 per point. One BI of 250 points costs $200 to transfer with a $2000 minimum. 200/250=.80. They just call it by a different name.


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## jimf41 (Aug 21, 2013)

cp73 said:


> I dont think anyone on this board has determined that trading with points is any easier than trading a week in II.



I'll have to take exception to this. Trading with points is not only easier it's possible in cases where trading with weeks is impossible.

Every year I convert my 3 silver and 1 plat week at Ocean Pointe into DC points. I then use the points to line up with the 2 weeks at Frenchmans Cove for a four week stay every year with no overlapping checkin days. There are points left over and those I use to go back to Ocean Pointe EOY during Gold season for four weeks at once all with the same checkin day.

This is simply an impossible trade with II. I do it every year at the 13/12 month mark with no real problems. The trade back into Ocean Pointe is especially hard with weeks because I can't just take any week in Gold season. I have to coordinate the vacation schedules and school vacation dates of four different families. It gets narrowed down to the 2nd and 3rd week in July. No other dates will suffice.

For those who think it's possible to do this in II try this experiment. Call an II rep and tell them you want four weeks in July next year at Ocean Pointe. Only a Saturday or Sunday checkin is acceptable but it must be the same checkin day for all rooms. Then say that you want a 3bdrm, two 2bdrms and a 1 bdrm all ocean front rooms.

Be prepared to wait a few minutes for the laughter to die down. Then tell the rep that you want to use some silver weeks at Ocean Pointe to trade into Frenchmans Cove in February and the weeks have to line up with the weeks you already own there.

The rep won't laugh this time they'll probably just assume this was a crank call and hang up.


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## jont (Aug 21, 2013)

Very impressive Jim. Great use of points!


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## SueDonJ (Aug 21, 2013)

jimf41 said:


> They do charge $.80 per point. One BI of 250 points costs $200 to transfer with a $2000 minimum. 200/250=.80. They just call it by a different name.



But that's a separate fee from the ROFR fee.  The docs say that the Initiation Fee is $200/BI ($2,000 min) and the ROFR fee is $1.00/Point.  So they're charging the Initiation Fee and $25.00/BI Transfer Fee as they're stipulated, but are reducing the ROFR fee way down to the single-transaction amount that they're charging for Weeks.  I'm just wondering if they've ever explained why.


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## Bill4728 (Aug 21, 2013)

jimf41 said:


> > Originally Posted by cp73  View Post
> > I dont think anyone on this board has determined that trading with points is any easier than trading a week in II.
> 
> 
> ...


There is a big difference between using your DC points to make a reservation within the DC and making a trade with DC pts in II.

Making reservations with DC points to the resorts in the DC is clearly much easier than finding trades in II. 

BUT I agree that making an II trade is about the same in weeks & with DC points. 

The only real difference I see is that I can often find huge "trade ups" in II  weeks that would not be possible with points. I can trade a silver season -1bd at my whistler resort for a 2 bd at the westins or marriott resorts in Hawaii pretty easily. If I did the same trade using points (either DC pts or my Club intrawest pts), the number of points needed to make those trades would be 3 times what I used to reserve that 1 bd whistler week.


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## live4life (Aug 21, 2013)

Good for you NYFLTraveller!!! Sit back and enjoy your vacations while reading TUG. Once you've acquired all the angles to approach your family vacations (DP, re-sale weeks, II, combos, or whatever) then take the plunge. It appears from everyone's take from your initial inquest is that every individual situation is different. Choose what's best for you and your family.

good luck


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