# Unpleasant sales pitch for W57 at NY Hilton Club



## Conan (Feb 7, 2013)

We signed up for a two-night stay at NY Hilton Club, paying $343 (with sales tax).  The deal obligates you to take a timeshare presentation, and gives you $100 back when you go.  If you do not attend the presentation, the difference between the special package price and the currently published nightly rate, plus premium costs and taxes, is chargeable to your credit card.

We knew we wouldn't be buying, but we made the mistake of being cordial to the salesman.  For the first hour he was friendly and chatty, and told us more than we wanted to know about his former occupations, his girlfriend, and the recent death of his grandparents (in the context of what a great last family gathering he enjoyed with them at his timeshare).  

From there and into the second hour it was like being on a tour in Mexico.  A confusing stew of numbers - - especially confusing because he kept alternating between how you spend Hilton Honors Points (the "bribe" you get if you buy) and how you spend the timeshare points themselves.  

We should have walked out at 90 minutes, but by then I was curious to find out what these points were going to cost.  It took another 20 minutes to get to the close, but by then he knew I wasn't going to buy and boy, did his mood change!  I think the offer might have been $100,000 for 11,000 points at West 57th and a million Hilton Honors Points, or $42,000 for 5,500 points at West 57th and maybe the same number of Hilton Honors Points.  But when I tried to say back to him what I understood the offer to consist of and add back the cost of maintenance, he refused to answer my questions, rudely cut me off, and stalked off without another word!

At least then I thought we were done, but (like in Mexico) we still had to deal with the so-called owner's representative who had an offer of NY Hilton Club points for us (contrary to the first guy's pitch that NY Hilton was completely sold out), and after that, a third person who wanted to sell us a number of Hilton Club nights at $339 each creditable against the sales price if we decided to buy after all.

Our total time was a little over two hours and would have been longer if we hadn't been abrupt with salespeople #2 and #3 (as to #3, we were standing and backing away while she was talking).

You know you've been through a timeshare tour when you spend the rest of your day stewing over the lies and insults.  Never again!


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## vacationhopeful (Feb 7, 2013)

I did the Hilton Club tour and had a decent experience. Had a woman who was very versed in The Hilton Club and had told her NOT any interested in the 57th street property. I was there on an RCI Exchange - not the promo stay bribe.

I think the offer was under $15000 and I want to say about 3500 pts. Don't remember any of the bonus points.

Was there about 2 hours ---


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## Ron98GT (Feb 7, 2013)

Guys/gals #2 and #3 where the closers.  The job of the 1st guy was to be friendly to you, warm you up, and then turn you over to closers, unless you were easy prey then he could write you up for the closers to finish.  Sounds like guy #1 blew-it.  If he handles every mark, err I mean Hilton Vacation Club Guest, that way, he should be fired.

Unlike post #2, sounds like you didn't even get a tour.

To let off steam, you should write a complaint about the guy and sent it to HGVC.


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## Sandy VDH (Feb 7, 2013)

My view is that if you don't like sales experiences, than don't go on them and avoid situations where you are forced to go, ie buying a promo that requires you to go.

I know there are people who like to go and get their freebies.  However it is a complete waste of both my time and the sales staff time.    I have better things to do with my time.

General saying around here is how do you know a salesman is lying.  Their lips are moving.


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## csxjohn (Feb 7, 2013)

Sandy VDH said:


> ...General saying around here is how do you know a salesman is lying.  Their lips are moving.



I woke up this morning with this thought on my mind.

The men in black wake up thinking "I'm going to save the world today."

Timeshare sales people must wake up thinking "I need to to pay for _____ and I'm going to get the money today no matter what.:annoyed:

I will never go to one of these presentations no matter how much they offer.  My time and peace of mind is way more valuable than what ever they offer.

I don't know why people put themselves through it.


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## bogey21 (Feb 7, 2013)

Sandy VDH said:


> My view is that if you don't like sales experiences, than don't go on them and avoid situations where you are forced to go, ie buying a promo that requires you to go.



Agree 100%.  Back in the days when I was interested in Marriott, Hilton, Starwood and the like I would just walk into the sales office and tell them I wasn't interested in gifts, etc. but would just like to talk to a Sales Representative.  I was never turned down and always received an informative  personal tour.

George

PS  and no, I never bought


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## WalnutBaron (Feb 7, 2013)

My wife and I just returned last week from a five day, four night promo trip to the Westin Desert Willows in Palm Desert, California. The promo cost of the stay was $189, plus $7/night for parking. The sales weenie gauntlet (i.e. timeshare sales presentation) was billed as being one hour but--like the OP--it actually took about two hours. 

Like the OP, we too had a total of three representatives to wade through--the "hospitality representative", the "supervisor", and the "quality control manager".

Unlike the OP, all three were pleasant, although they did sell us hard on our various options.

We walked out of the presentation feeling like we'd endured it without a scratch. My view of the experience was that two hours out of what was essentially a free five-day vacation was an acceptable trade-off.


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## Sandy VDH (Feb 7, 2013)

WalnutBaron said:


> We walked out of the presentation feeling like we'd endured it without a scratch. My view of the experience was that two hours out of what was essentially a free five-day vacation was an acceptable trade-off.



Then in your case, it was worth it for what you got.  For others it is not worth it.  Everyone has to decide for themselves.


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## PigsDad (Feb 7, 2013)

Sandy VDH said:


> Then in your case, it was worth it for what you got.  For others it is not worth it.  Everyone has to decide for themselves.



I agree.  And then if you do decide to put yourself through that torture, it seems kind of silly to me to come back here and complain that the sales presentation wasn't all wine and roses.  You got some free stuff, so move on.

Kurt


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## feed the otter (Feb 7, 2013)

The best advice I've ever gotten on dealing with a tough sales presentation like this, is look at your watch when you walk in, and be ready to walk out as soon as you've fulfilled your end of the contract (be it an hour, 2 hours, or however long).  Take the opportunity to square that with the sales rep at the beginning of the meeting if you like, so they cannot squabble later over when the presentation actually began and thus when you're allowed to leave.

If as you declare an end to the presentation they give you a hard time, which they may well do, explain you're leaving and would like to see the manager to ensure there's no discrepancy over whether or not you've held up your end of the deal to get your gift, discount, or whatever.

In the wake of such advice, we've dealt with soft and hard sales pitches, but every one of them now ends exactly as soon as allowed by the agreement that got us in there.  The last one we did gave us $150 to throw around HHV a couple years ago, and was reasonably worth an hour of our time.  All good.

Just my $0.02.


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## ricoba (Feb 7, 2013)

Sandy VDH said:


> My view is that if you don't like sales experiences, than don't go on them and avoid situations where you are forced to go, ie buying a promo that requires you to go.



I agree completely.

Back when we owned our TS, we'd do the HGVC "Owners Update" from time-to-time, but eventually the sales force became way too pushy and unpleasant.  

Our initial experience with HGVC sales was always pleasant, but this changed over the years and we stopped going to the sales presentations because of how distasteful the presentation became. This was especially true in Vegas.


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## czar (Feb 7, 2013)

Maybe this has been covered somewhere else, but several years ago (i.e., pre-2008), when we were much poorer, unmarried, and had no children, we received solicitations, phone calls, mailers, etc., for promo packages all the time. I just assumed that the financial crisis put a damper on those things. Today, we own a home, have more income, and young kids, and we get nada!  We'd definitely be willing to spend 2-3 hours of aggravation on a presentation for a free or low cost stay at a resort!



WalnutBaron said:


> My wife and I just returned last week from a five day, four night promo trip to the Westin Desert Willows in Palm Desert, California. The promo cost of the stay was $189, plus $7/night for parking. The sales weenie gauntlet (i.e. timeshare sales presentation) was billed as being one hour but--like the OP--it actually took about two hours.
> 
> Like the OP, we too had a total of three representatives to wade through--the "hospitality representative", the "supervisor", and the "quality control manager".
> 
> ...


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## Sandy VDH (Feb 7, 2013)

I still get calls from HGVC and Wyndham on a regular basis, even with asking to put me on the Do not call list. 

I have to remind them every once and a while.  

I just reminded Hilton and the calls seem to have stopped.


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## sjuhawk_jd (Feb 7, 2013)

I did this same tour about 2 years ago. It lasted about 25 minutes, when I told him how many HGVC points I own (all through Grand pacific Palisades and Marbrisa upgrades and resales etc. in Southern California) and my costs for those points. He jokingly offered me a job there since I knew so much, and then we were done. I had a big smile on my face for the rest of the day


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## SmithOp (Feb 7, 2013)

czar said:


> Maybe this has been covered so where else, but several years ago (i.e., pre-2008), when we were much poorer, unmarked, and had no children, we received solicitations, phone calls, mailers, etc., for promo packages all the time. I just assumed that the financial crisis put a damper on those things. Today, we own a home, have more income, and young kids, and we get nada!  We'd definitely be willing to spend 2-3 hours of aggrebation on a presentation for a free or low cost stay at a resort!



Give them a call or email, I'm sure they can offer you a promo package. 

1-800-230-7068
http://www.hiltongrandvacations.com/MoreInfo.aspx

We haven't been on an owners update since 2005, bought in Hawaii where the sales team were very casual.  I can imagine how high pressure those NY types are now...

Sandy - I think they can call us despite the DNC list since we have a business relationship being HGVC members.  I just added their numbers to my contact list, if I see HGVC in the caller ID I send it straight to VM.


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## Talent312 (Feb 7, 2013)

"Star Wars" (1977) -- Han Solo: _No reward is worth this!_
I've reached an age where I simply value my vacation time more.

If going to one of these things, be prepared to have your ears boxed.
Pick out a watering hole nearby so you have a place to decompress later.
.


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## dougp26364 (Feb 8, 2013)

We had a similar experience at the HGVC LV Strip, our home resort, several years ago. The funny thing was that we didn't go for the gifts, we really just wanted to be updated. In fact, they didn't have any gifts we wanted so we refused (they weren't offering cash or debit cards at the time). We were so put off by the high pressure and lies we haven't been back nor are we likely to ever go back or recommend any of our friends/family.


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## tombo (Feb 8, 2013)

We said never again but we were in NY for 10 days and we decided to sit through 90 minutes of misery while waiting to check-in at Manhatten Club for $100 restaurant gift card and a couple of other perks. We arrived at 1 PM and couldn't check in until 4. The lady setting up the appt (on the phone prior to our trip) said I couldn't do a tour on the day I arrived.  I told her it was 2 PM arrival day or never. She did it. 

I got to the presentation, told him he had 90 minutes and I was leaving. After a little small talk I was shown a model unit. After the tour he  asked how long I had been in town and I said I arrived today. The guy  said you can't take the tour today. I said you scheduled us for this time today, she knew it was my check-in day, and she agreed. They got a manager. He quizzed me. I told him I owned many timeshares (all resale), was staying there on an exchange, and that I would listen for 90 minutes but would not buy. He said you will never stay here on exchange again. I said I can in 4 years. He said that is changing. I said then I will stay somewhere else next time. He said you have to re-schedule a tour. I said I will not. I am here for the time and day your resort scheduled, and the clock is running. He came back with another mgr. I was told no several times and finally was given the "gifts" being informed that I got the scheduler in trouble. I was out in 45 minutes and still had to wait about an hour to check-in. It was my best tour ever. Rather than waiting around to check in I got a tour of the resort, some "gifts", and was not delayed one minute from sightseeing or checking in. Dead time turned into $100 of meals (well in NY one nice meal lol).

We stayed our last 3 days in HGVC 57th and refused their offers. One tour a trip is more than enough. I have been to enough of them in my life to know that it is misery no matter how long it lasts.

I really hate the tours and hope to never go on another one again. If I am ever enticed with the "gifts" in the future I will write down the time on my watch on a piece of paper, tell them upfront I will not buy under any circumstances, and that they need to get mgr number one and number 2 in with us before the 90 minutes is over or I will not talk to them. I will not be held hostage for 2 or 3 hours ever again no matter how good the "gifts" are and no matter how hard sell they become!


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## dougp26364 (Feb 8, 2013)

Hard to believe a timeshare sales staff would put a date on when you can tour, then spend the majority of their only sales opportunity debating that point rather than attempting to sell you something. Just goes to show how narrow minded some of these staffs can be.


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## ccwu (Feb 8, 2013)

sjuhawk_jd said:


> I did this same tour about 2 years ago. It lasted about 25 minutes, when I told him how many HGVC points I own (all through Grand pacific Palisades and Marbrisa upgrades and resales etc. in Southern California) and my costs for those points. He jokingly offered me a job there since I knew so much, and then we were done. I had a big smile on my face for the rest of the day



It became shorter and shorter for us too. After they saw how many points we had, they just asked to see if we had any question and suggestions about the system. We sometime made recommendation and they lead us go to get our promotion less than 25 minutes recently. 

I have to say in the past, my husband was dreadful for our owner's update.  Every time I promised not buying any more and end up gave up to to salesperson recommendation to climb the level of elite. Of course, I never heard of TUG in those days either.  

I recently got a call from the headquarter trying to offer me 9600 points from their inventory at myrtle beach HGVC two bedroom penthouse at platinum season for $36k plus 36k of bonus point. (MF for around $960) They said they could offer at the low price due to there is no marketing overhead charges in it. I almost took the offer.  We did not like the location.  I went to the web browsed the property, there was no jacuzzi tub in unit.


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## pianodinosaur (Feb 8, 2013)

Sandy VDH said:


> My view is that if you don't like sales experiences, than don't go on them and avoid situations where you are forced to go, ie buying a promo that requires you to go.
> 
> I know there are people who like to go and get their freebies.  However it is a complete waste of both my time and the sales staff time.    I have better things to do with my time.
> 
> General saying around here is how do you know a salesman is lying.  Their lips are moving.



I agree with you.


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## tombo (Feb 8, 2013)

dougp26364 said:


> Hard to believe a timeshare sales staff would put a date on when you can tour, then spend the majority of their only sales opportunity debating that point rather than attempting to sell you something. Just goes to show how narrow minded some of these staffs can be.



They want you to have something invested in the tour. If you give up 1/2 a day or more of your time in NY (or at any other destination) to take the tour you have some skin in the game. Taking the tour like we did before we checked in meant that we didn't have to give up any of our valuable vacation time to attend. They were correct in their assumptions. A $100 gift card for meals would never have made me give up one of my mornings or afternoons in NY.


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## NJ-S&L (Feb 13, 2013)

Conan said:


> We signed up for a two-night stay at NY Hilton Club, paying $343 (with sales tax).  The deal obligates you to take a timeshare presentation, and gives you $100 back when you go.  If you do not attend the presentation, the difference between the special package price and the currently published nightly rate, plus premium costs and taxes, is chargeable to your credit card





Conan said:


> .
> 
> Sounds like we had the same guy for our salesman.
> Must have been something in the air because even though I was quite strongly against the idea, we wound up going for it @ $58k  for 5,250 City Points + lifetime Gold+ and 700,000 HH.  After some research this does not look like a good deal for us at this time.    Rescesion letter being mailed tomorrow.
> ...


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## Conan (Feb 13, 2013)

NJ-S&L said:


> Sounds like we had the same guy for our salesman.



If my post helped steer you towards rescinding you've made my day!


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## NJ-S&L (Feb 14, 2013)

It certainly helped me feel like I was doing the right thing canceling the transaction. 

Should have done the homework before the meeting.


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## NJ-S&L (Feb 21, 2013)

NJ-S&L said:


> It certainly helped me feel like I was doing the right thing canceling the transaction.
> 
> Should have done the homework before the meeting.



Rescission letter Accepted no questions or further pitch. 
.


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## vegasVIP (Feb 22, 2013)

I attend the so called "Owners Update" when they cvall and offer something good.  But I understand it will not be pleasant.  Its give and take, endure the presentation and get the gift, or decline and either pay the full price or dont travel there.  Bottom line, presentations are usually not fun or pleasant.  Know that upfront.


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