# Points Assigned vs Points to Reserve [Merged with a points-assigned thread]



## Armada (Jun 20, 2010)

Barony Gold Oceanfront
Points Assigned 3725
Points to Reserve 4000
Percentage Assigned Points vs Points to Reserve 93.1%


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## TheTimeTraveler (Jun 20, 2010)

Can someone with the correct knowledge please post the "Points Assigned" charge in this thread?

I can't seem to access it (I expect due to the busy activity with people getting into it).

Thanks.


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## abdibile (Jun 20, 2010)

Willow Ridge Lodge (Branson) Platinum:

* Points Assigned 1850

* Points to Reserve in Platinum season:
              * 16 weeks at 2400 points
              * 13 weeks at 1675 points 
              * 4 weeks at 900 points 
       * average: 1932.6

* Percentage Assigned Points vs average Points to Reserve 95.7%
* Percentage Assigned Points vs Points of peak week (I always reserved...) 77.1%


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## abdibile (Jun 20, 2010)

TheTimeTraveler said:


> Can someone with the correct knowledge please post the "Points Assigned" charge in this thread?



There is no chart yet, every owner can only see the points value of his ownership when he starts the enrollment process.


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## floyddl (Jun 20, 2010)

Platinum Plus Oceanfront July 4th week at Oceanwatch:

Points offered:  5025
Points to reserve:  5400
Percentage:  93.05


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## floyddl (Jun 20, 2010)

abdibile said:


> There is no chart yet, every owner can only see the points value of his ownership when he starts the enrollment process.



Looks like early returns reflect that Marriott is skimming 7% on the points values.


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## hipslo (Jun 20, 2010)

mountainside : 5350 points assigned, 6900 points to reserve (so I have read, I still cant seem to access the pdf with the point charts) - 77.5%!!!!


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## abdibile (Jun 20, 2010)

abdibile said:


> Willow Ridge Lodge (Branson) Platinum:
> 
> * Points Assigned 1850
> 
> ...



We should add another interesting data point:

Maintenance fee per Point assigned: $774/1850 = 42 cents/point


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## natstr (Jun 20, 2010)

Desert Springs Villa I

Platinum Season

Points Offered:  3,225

Points Required:  4,225  (for vast majority of platinum season)

Percentage:  76%

Ouch.


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## dioxide45 (Jun 20, 2010)

How is points to reserve determined? Is the the minimum number of points for the season you own, the maximum, or what?


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## caterina25 (Jun 20, 2010)

Aruba Surf Club
platinum oceanside 2BR LO
points assigned 4,075
points needed to use 4,650
87.6% a loss of 12.4 %


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## abdibile (Jun 20, 2010)

Please everyone calculate an average of the weeks in your season and provice the peek points for comparison.



dioxide45 said:


> How is points to reserve determined? Is the the minimum number of points for the season you own, the maximum, or what?


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## dioxide45 (Jun 20, 2010)

abdibile said:


> Please everyone calculate an average of the weeks in your season and provice the peek points for comparison.



I think it would be good to see the max amount, the min amount, and then the average. If someone is real intuitive, they could do this for all the resorts and then people only need to post their worth. I could be that intuitive if I had the time.


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## IngridN (Jun 20, 2010)

*Grand Chateau, 1 bedroom, New Year's Plat+ week:*

assigned:  2975
needed to reserve:  3175

*Shadow Ridge, 2 bedroom, gold season*

assigned:  2325
needed to reserve:  2450, 3175, 4000 (4000 is Thanksgiving week which is gold in Phase I (Villages) and Plat or Plat+ in Phase II (Enclaves)

*Aruba Surf Club, 2 bedroom, Oceanside, gold season*

assigned:  3075
needed to reserve:  2750 or 3500 (we are always there during the 3500 cost timeframe!)

Ingrid


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## dougp26364 (Jun 20, 2010)

TheTimeTraveler said:


> Can someone with the correct knowledge please post the "Points Assigned" charge in this thread?
> 
> I can't seem to access it (I expect due to the busy activity with people getting into it).
> 
> Thanks.



Try this link http://veljovich.com/tugpoints/points_charts.pdf


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## dougp26364 (Jun 20, 2010)

Ocean Pointe 3 bedroom silver season:
Points recieved 4,225
Points required 5,900

Marriott's skim 1,675 points 
Skim percentage 28% or 72% whichever way you want to look at it. I look at it as Marriott taking 28% of what should be MY points.


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## ArtsieAng (Jun 20, 2010)

paulaf52 said:


> Aruba Surf Club
> platinum 2BR LO
> points assigned 4,075
> points needed to use 4,650



I own the same unit. That's about 88%


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## dougp26364 (Jun 20, 2010)

Marriott's Grand Chateau 3 bedroom Platinum season:

Points assigned 4,625
Points to reserve 5,225

Marriott's Skim 600 points

Percentage 11%

Apparently, Marriott is a lot like the old bosses in Vegas. They just figure people are to stupid to do the math. It's nice little profit Marriott's taking off of my hands for the privledge of joining their worst-deal-in-timeshare points program.


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## lll1929 (Jun 20, 2010)

Marriott Aruba Ocean Club Gold 2 bdrm OV

points assigned - 3075
points to reserve - 2750 and 3500

Bad idea Marriott!!

No membership for me!!


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## IngridN (Jun 20, 2010)

lll1929 said:


> Marriott Aruba Ocean Club Gold 2 bdrm OV
> 
> points assigned - 3075
> points to reserve - 2750 and 3500
> ...



No fair...my Oceanside also gets 3075 points. I'm curious as to what Oceanfront and Gardenview get. Looking at the points chart, OV and OS 'cost' the same...I want the premium I paid for my OS back Marriott :hysterical: .

The more I read, the more I'm convinced I'm getting the shaft.

Ingrid


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## mjkkb2 (Jun 20, 2010)

*oceana palms*

OV GOld to convert 2625 pts
- to reserve a week (in same season 2900 pts) except as below:
- four week window in September for 2000 pts.

I guess it would be good to convert if we wouldn't mind going in Sept.
Since this resort is mostly undersold, majority of owners will be points owners going forward, thus no availability issues.

hmmm


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## bw3 (Jun 20, 2010)

*Grande Ocean points*

Grande Ocean oceanside platinum  assigned 4200  reserve 4500.  Marriott skim = 6.7%.  Or Marriott gives 93.3% of actual value.

Grande Ocean oceanside gold  assigned 3,325 reserve 3,450-4,500.  Marriott skim 3.6% or 26.1%.  Marriott gives 96.4% or 73.9% of value.

Frenchman Cove platinum 3 br  assigned 5,025  reserve 5,675.  Marriott skim 11.5%.  Marriott gives 88.5% of value.

Why would anyone at these resorts sign up for this??????????????


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## timeos2 (Jun 20, 2010)

*It's not a skim*



floyddl said:


> Looks like early returns reflect that Marriott is skimming 7% on the points values.



There is no "skim". The value given to each owner each use period reflects the total number of points in the season they own - which has some weeks worth more in absolute terms than others but all are in that season - divided by the total number of weeks and the resulting average value is what you get as an owner. No skim. 

Lets do it very simply. 

There are 4 Golden weeks. There are 100 total owners. But one is a holiday week. So 3 of the weeks cost 500 points to reserve but the one holiday week costs 700. The total available points to all owners of that season is 220,000. But no one "owns" the super value week - all owners can try to get it - so the value each owner gets is 550. No skim. No one gets the value of the super week on total and no one gets only the lower value. They all get their fair share to use as they please. 

If there were deeded use weeks then each of the 3 should get 500 points and the owners of the 4, super week, would get 700. But they all have a right to it & all get the value.  Get it?


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## IngridN (Jun 20, 2010)

timeos2 said:


> There is no "skim". The value given to each owner each use period reflects the total number of points in the season they own - which has some weeks worth more in absolute terms than others but all are in that season - divided by the total number of weeks and the resulting average value is what you get as an owner. No skim.
> 
> Lets do it very simply.
> 
> ...



I get it...I'm not even getting like for like. The trade up ride in II was great while it lasted and I'm not screaming about entitlement. However, when I bought I bought with the understanding that my week would get me a week in the same season at any of the other Marriott resorts. I am being cheated out of theat 'promise.'

Ingrid


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## Werner Weiss (Jun 20, 2010)

*Newport Coast Villas*

Marriott’s Newport Coast Villas (NCV)
Newport Coast, Newport Beach, California
Platinum

Notes:

At NCV, all villas are 2BR/2BA
There are no view categories
Platinum season is early June through the end of the year, except for July 4 week and week 52, which are fixed weeks.

Marriott Vacation Club Destinations Exchange Program

Points Assigned: 3,475

Points to Reserve:


Early and late summer: 4,225
Percentage Assigned Points vs Points to Reserve: 82.2%

Prime summer (except 4th of July week): 4,725
Percentage Assigned Points vs Points to Reserve: 73.5%

Fall (beginning mid-September): 2,900
Percentage Assigned Points vs Points to Reserve: 119.8%

Week 51 (Christmas): 4,725
Percentage Assigned Points vs Points to Reserve: 73.5%


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## scrapngen (Jun 20, 2010)

timeos2 said:


> There is no "skim". The value given to each owner each use period reflects the total number of points in the season they own - which has some weeks worth more in absolute terms than others but all are in that season - divided by the total number of weeks and the resulting average value is what you get as an owner. No skim.
> 
> Lets do it very simply.
> 
> ...



I understand this, but it is very simple for fixed weeks. Now, I have to say this would make sense in re: my fixed week 51 as it was also sold as part of a float week on some of the first deeds until they changed to a Platinum Plus week later. Now (according to someone else's post) they have given me the same points for my fixed week as the floaters are getting, not a reflection of the higher price/value they had placed on it with the fixed designation. Good for the floaters, bad for me.

fixed Waiohai 51 assigned:  4225
fixed Waiohai 51 to reserve:  5075
 83%

fixed Waiohai 52 assigned:  5175
fixed Waiohai 52 to reserve:  5550
93%

MF/point ratios:   .35 and  .28 respectively (if I did it right) 
$1475MF/assigned point total


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## IngridN (Jun 20, 2010)

scrapngen said:


> I understand this, but it is very simple for fixed weeks. Now, I have to say this would make sense in re: my fixed week 51 as it was also sold as part of a float week on some of the first deeds until they changed to a Platinum Plus week later. Now (according to someone else's post) they have given me the same points for my fixed week as the floaters are getting, not a reflection of the higher price/value they had placed on it with the fixed designation. Good for the floaters, bad for me.
> 
> fixed Waiohai 51 assigned:  4225
> fixed Waiohai 51 to reserve:  5075
> ...



I also own fixed week plat+ New Year's week at Grand Chateau. Assigned points are 2975; points needed to reserve are 3175...that tells me I am not getting in points assignments, the value of the week. This is a new resort and there aren't the issues described above.

Ingrid


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## Darwin (Jun 20, 2010)

*Canyon Villas*

Canyon Villas, Phoenix, Arizona week 52, 2br/2ba, view excellent, point value = 3900.  Points to reserve = 4,175.  Difference of 275 points.  What is the cost of purchasing the additional points?  93% of value.


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## m61376 (Jun 20, 2010)

IngridN said:


> No fair...my Oceanside also gets 3075 points. I'm curious as to what Oceanfront and Gardenview get. Looking at the points chart, OV and OS 'cost' the same...I want the premium I paid for my OS back Marriott :hysterical: .
> 
> The more I read, the more I'm convinced I'm getting the shaft.
> 
> Ingrid



I was wondering about that too. Should make reserving those OS rooms a real dream


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## dougp26364 (Jun 20, 2010)

timeos2 said:


> There is no "skim". The value given to each owner each use period reflects the total number of points in the season they own - which has some weeks worth more in absolute terms than others but all are in that season - divided by the total number of weeks and the resulting average value is what you get as an owner. No skim.
> 
> Lets do it very simply.
> 
> ...



Sure there is a skim. Marriott gives an owner 4,000 points for a week but another owner must pay 5,000 points for that same week. That might not be skim in the technical term of the word but, there's a 1,000 point profit for Marriott on the deal. Give 4,000 for the week and sell/rent it to another for 5,000 points. Call it a 1,000 point profit rather than a skim. It's still a variance of 1,000 points in Marriott's favor. 

Thanks but no thanks. If they're going to get 5,900 points for my week, I want 5,900 points for that week as well and not the 4,225 points they're offering. I'm smart enough not to take 75 cents for my $1. I'm smart enough not to do that once let alone sign up for the option to do it every year PLUS pay for the priveldge to get short changed every time I agree to give them my week. What a great business model Marriott has developed!


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## Darlene (Jun 20, 2010)

Points I would get giving them my Marriott Monarch May 28, 2011 week - 1900points.
To reserve the same week with GV = 2675 points. 
Percentage=  71%


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## Dave M (Jun 20, 2010)

*Moderator note:*

Because the number of posts regarding the new system is so huge, it is important to keep threads (other than the main thread) on topic. Thus, I will be deleting a number of posts that are not on the topic of this thread.

Dave M
BBS Moderator


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## GregT (Jun 20, 2010)

MOC 3BR Fixed Week 24/25:

My points:  10,225
Points to book: 11,800

Percentage:  86.66%


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## SpikeMauler (Jun 20, 2010)

Marriott Frenchman's Cove
2 bedroom Platinum season

Points offered - 3650

Points required - 3725
Jan 7th to Feb 3rd
Apr 8th to Apr 28th

Points required - 4125
Feb 4th to Feb 17th
Feb 25th to Apr 7th


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## l2trade (Jun 20, 2010)

[_Message deleted. Please stay on topic in this thread. (See my above post.)_ Dave M, BBS Moderator]


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## dougp26364 (Jun 21, 2010)

Dave M said:


> *Moderator note:*
> 
> Because the number of posts regarding the new system is so huge, it is important to keep threads (other than the main thread) on topic. Thus, I will be deleting a number of posts that are not on the topic of this thread.
> 
> ...




No problem. The topics around Marriott's new problem.....uh, system are a little overwhelming./


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## taffy19 (Jun 21, 2010)

MM1 Maui Lahaina tower 2 BR Fixed week.

Points assigned for week 12 = 7475

Points to reserve for weeks
Jan 18 to Feb 17 = 8650
Feb 25 to Mar 31 same
Jun 03 to Aug 31 same

Percentage 86%

To reserve other weeks during 2011 anywhere from 7450 to 10,425 points.


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## GaryDouglas (Jun 21, 2010)

Maui Ocean Club -

MMO OF 2bdrm Suites: 6450
Charts for the suites range from 6425 to 7800, week 1-51

MM1 OF 2bdrm Floating Villas: 7475
Charts for the villas range from 7450 to 9050, week 1-51


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## SMB1 (Jun 21, 2010)

Lakeshore Reserve 2 BR Deluxe Premiere Platinum, get 3800; need 4675, 4175, 3725; 19%, 9%, +.02%

OceanWatch 2 BR Platinum Ocean View, get 3425; need 3725; 9%

Grande Vista Gold 2 BR, get 2175, need 1900, 2500; +1.5%, 13%


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## saturn28 (Jun 21, 2010)

I am not concerned about the points I get versus the points Marriott requires to stay at a similar resort because as weeks owners we don't have to use the points system to exchange a full week. We can continue to use the weeks system through Interval World and trade into all the Marriott Resorts the same way we did before the points system was introduced. In addition, if you join there are some other options that you get that look attractive to me.

Am I wrong to think like this? It is only the people that buy into Marriott now that have to use the new points charts and be concerned about the way the points are being priced now.


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## kedler (Jun 21, 2010)

saturn28 said:


> I am not concerned about the points I get versus the points Marriott requires to stay at a similar resort because as weeks owners we don't have to use the points system to exchange a full week. We can continue to use the weeks system through Interval World and trade into all the Marriott Resorts the same way we did before the points system was introduced. In addition, if you join there are some other options that you get that look attractive to me.
> 
> Am I wrong to think like this? It is only the people that buy into Marriott now that have to use the new points charts and be concerned about the way the points are being priced now.


If what I read on one post is true, and I haven't seen it in writing you are correct we don't need to worry about points if we are using a full week either in our home resort or in exchange we just handle it the same way we always have done. I think the issue is competition for those weeks.

The conversion figures for two of my weeks are posted and I haven't figured the bronze weeks out yet but am I the only one who thinks that Marriott has been doing this all along? 

If you traded your week for MR or rented it through Marriott, then Marriott received the payment for the week and could have obtained the full rack rate for our week even though MR or the rental payment did not equal what Marriott received for our week on the reservation system.

Based on earlier posts, I'm getting more points for my GV gold then needed on the chart but I believe its less for Aruba. It seems the same in many ways as opting to exchange for MR or rent.

Please tell me if and why I'm wrong?


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## thinze3 (Jun 21, 2010)

Can someone post a link to the pdf chart showing how many points are required to make a reservation?


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## dmorea (Jun 21, 2010)

*Manor Club*

Points allotted 2375

Points to reserve:
Mar-May-- Oct to Nov  2500  95%

June - Aug 2900     82%


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## dmorea (Jun 21, 2010)

*points charts link*



thinze3 said:


> Can someone post a link to the pdf chart showing how many points are required to make a reservation?




Think this is what you are looking for
https://www.my-vacationclub.com/en-us/owners/2_pointsCharts.jsp


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## thinze3 (Jun 21, 2010)

dmorea said:


> Think this is what you are looking for
> https://www.my-vacationclub.com/en-us/owners/2_pointsCharts.jsp



That's it. Thanks.


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## thinze3 (Jun 21, 2010)

Waiohai Beach Club IV

assigned 4225
required 4225-5075 for floating weeks
typical summer week required is 4850 pts (87%)


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## dougp26364 (Jun 21, 2010)

There is one thing that disturbs me about the theory Marriott is balancing points and not skimming. With Grand Chateau, the entire season is Platinum except for week 52, which is Platinum Plus. If they're balancing the points out, then why is it that every single 3 bedroom Platinum week receives the same short end of the stick?

Points assigned are 4,625. I can see no arguement that ANY owners of a 3 bedroom Plat. week would be assigned anything more or anything less. That is unless there is a Marriott fickle finger of fate which smiles upon some owners but gives the finger to others. 

So, they assign 4,625 points to every three bedroom Plat. owner but, the smallest point fee to reserve is 4,675 points. That means that there are no owners who will recieve what Marriott takes. Points totals for 3 bdrm Plat weeks are 4,675 points, 5,225 points and 5,400 points. I'm sorry but is it just me that see's that Marriott gives less than they take? EVERY SINGLE OWNER GET'S LESS THAN THE VALUE MARRIOTT ASIGNS TO THE WEEKS FOR EXCHANGE! How can anyone argue that they're not taking more in points for reservations than they're giving owners to use for reservations? At this one resort it is very easy to calculate the NEGATIVE flow of points for owners and the POSITVE flow of points for Marriott. 

Yes I know one does not elect to use points to reserve at their home resort but, other owners DO use points to reserve these same units. So how is this a like for like exchange and not skimming? If I give you $1 for your product, then charge $1.25 for that exact same product, I've just made a profit at YOUR expense and without breaking a sweat to work for that profit. The points are unbalanced in Marriott's favor. It's their game, they set the rules and YOU pay a premium in addition to the sign on fee and yearly membership fee.

As to why I won't join I have a trust issue with any company that will do this up front. As I understand it, and maybe I'm wrong, Marriott has written this new program so that they have full control to change virtually any aspect of the program as they see fit. Anyone here familiar with Marriott Rewards points? We all know how aggresively Marriott pushed that option as a reason to but direct rather than resale. But every year MF's go up and over time the value of MR points has gone down. I wonder what the future holds for those who pay to have the option to use Marriott Exchange Company Points? Before signing any agreement, I'd be sure and read the fine print. Anyone know if there is a right to rescind since this isn't a timeshare sale but a membership fee?


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## Suzy (Jun 21, 2010)

With all my weeks at Marriott, I can at least get a week at my home resort except for one silver week I own at Legends Edge.

My silver week is worth 1,150 pts, but it takes 1,225 to reserve the lowest week there.  I can't even trade into my resort at all!!!  I can't believe that.


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## bogey21 (Jun 21, 2010)

IngridN said:


> I get it...when I bought I bought with the understanding that my week would get me a week in the same season at any of the other Marriott resorts. I am being cheated out of theat 'promise.'



*Well said!!

George*


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## luvgoldns (Jun 21, 2010)

*Maui Ocean Club*

I'm not sure if this is what people are looking at/for but here's what I:

pasted from the Points Chart for Maui Ocean Club
1 BR Ocean View
Fri - Sat 475
Sun - Thur 500
Full Week 4,700

pasted from from my MVCI account
Maui Ocean Club
Floor Plan: 1BR + 2BA
View Type: Ocean View
Point Value 3,900

_only 83% value_ (if I understand this)

HTH,
ileneg


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## luvgoldns (Jun 21, 2010)

*Grande Vista*

Points Chart for Grande Vista
2-Bedroom
Fri - Sat 450
Sun - Thur 325
Full Week 1,900

From my MVCI account
Grande Vista
Floor Plan: 2BR + 2BA
View Type: Excellent View
I own "Gold"
Point Value 2,175 

ileneg

Edit: So it looks like this is one of the few instances where this might work out for the better? Not sure. GV always confuses me cause I originally bought a 2BR at 65% (EOY???) and went back and bought the 2nd "half" w/in a few months. So I have 2 deeds and my MVCI account shows GV twice.


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## iamnotshopgirl (Jun 21, 2010)

IngridN said:


> No fair...my Oceanside also gets 3075 points. I'm curious as to what Oceanfront and Gardenview get. Looking at the points chart, OV and OS 'cost' the same...I want the premium I paid for my OS back Marriott :hysterical: .
> 
> The more I read, the more I'm convinced I'm getting the shaft.
> 
> Ingrid



My thinking exactly Ingrid!

Bob


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## thinze3 (Jun 21, 2010)

Suzy said:


> With all my weeks at Marriott, I can at least get a week at my home resort except for one silver week I own at Legends Edge.
> 
> My silver week is worth 1,150 pts, but it takes 1,225 to reserve the lowest week there.  I can't even trade into my resort at all!!!  I can't believe that.



You are paying a little bit of premium for the flexibility that you did not have before, trade for MR pts, anytime check-in and check out, etc..

The membership fees are actually cheaper when you add current II and Marriott fees. So you are essentially gaining the flexibility at about 7-13% premium.


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## DanCali (Jun 21, 2010)

*NCV Plat*

Here is the calculation for NCV, where Platinum weeks (23-51 ecxcluding July 4 week) are *awarded 3475 points*.

Week		Points
3-Jun		4225
10-Jun		4225
17-Jun		4225
24-Jun		4725
1-Jul		NA-PP
8-Jul		4725
15-Jul		4725
22-Jul		4725
29-Jul		4725
5-Aug		4725
12-Aug		4225
19-Aug		4225
26-Aug		4225
2-Sep		4225
9-Sep		4225
16-Sep		2900
23-Sep		2900
30-Sep		2900
7-Oct		2900
14-Oct		2900
21-Oct		2900
28-Oct		2900
4-Nov		2900
11-Nov		2900
18-Nov		2900
25-Nov		2900
2-Dec		2900
9-Dec		2900
16-Dec		2900
23-Dec		4725
30-Dec		NA-PP


*Average for Plat weeks:	3706*

Not as terrible as the MGC 3BR situation. At least we can go when the kids are in school...

The loss relative to average (which some call the "fair" measure) is about 6.3%.


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## iamnotshopgirl (Jun 21, 2010)

m61376 said:


> I was wondering about that too. Should make reserving those OS rooms a real dream



Agreed. But when you bought OS you were garunteed Building 1 (Lighthouse Tower). Does that now change with the points system?  I mean if OS and OV are the same pt wise ????????????

bob


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## camachinist (Jun 21, 2010)

NCV (Newport Coast, CA) Gold (Jan 7 - June 2, 2011/Jan 6 - May 31, 2012)

Points to reserve -
Fri-Sat - 700
Sun-Thurs - 300
Full week - 2900

Points Assigned - 2700


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## potchak (Jun 21, 2010)

So I did some calculating myself on the 3 properties we own. 

Manor club- platinum 2bd
The average pts needed for the platinum season is 2573
Points we receive for our 2 bedroom - 2375
Percent of needed pts: 92.3%

Waiohai Platinum 2bd 1-50
The average pts needed for the platinum season is 4526
Points we receive for our 2 bedroom - 4225
Percent of needed pts: 93.3%

Timberlodge Platinum 2bd summer
The average pts needed for the platinum season is 3600
Points we receive for our 2 bedroom - 4150
Percent of needed pts: 115.3%- WOW! I found a good one!

Any clues as to why Timberlodge seems to be better than the average?


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## jimf41 (Jun 21, 2010)

I really don't understand the point of this thread. If you bought a week at a resort why would you give that week to II for the purpose of trading back in to your home resort? Once you give it to II there is no guarantee of getting back in or getting anywhere you might want to visit. This is what this thread is asking.

In the past there would be no reason to do this except to game the system. In the future I could see doing it as you now have the ability to pick any week of the year you want. There are no more seasons. If you are a new purchaser this is more expensive than what we all bought but at least you can buy what you want. For all of us weeks based owners this is a home run IMO. You can still reserve any week in your original "season" at no extra cost other than the initial fee and you can pick any "season" that you have accumulated enough points to reserve.

That said here are my numbers for a 3bdrm silver at Ocean Pointe 4225 points assigned

silver season 20 weeks

8 weeks @ 5900 = 47,200
8 weeks @ 4000 = 32,000
4 weeks @ 2000 =  8,000

TOTAL SEASON POINTS 87,200

20 weeks @ 4225 = 84,500 

Is Marriott skimming? Well they are getting 2700 more points than what they charge for a season. In exchange they opened up the entire "Gold" season to Silver owners for no charge. I don't have worry about not getting a 3bdrm on a trade anymore. Something that was very hard to do with II.

And the best thing. If I don't like this deal I'll just reserve one of those 5,900 hundred weeks like I have been in the past.


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## Slakk (Jun 21, 2010)

St Kitts Gold Oceanside 2 BR- 4550

Jan 7- Feb 3, April 8-28   4125 points
Feb4-17, Feb 25-April 7 4525 points
April 29-Sept 1, Nov 4-Dec  3325 points (traditional Gold)
Sept 2-Nov 3 2575 points
Pres Week 5675 points
Christmas 5450 points
New Years 6825 points


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## rsackett (Jun 21, 2010)

*Here's what I came up with for Manor Club*

Just went through the points offered for Manor Club Platinum.

to use points at manor Club for a two bedroom in what is now the Platinum Season there are:

18 weeks that cost 2500 pts.
12 weeks that cost 2950 pts
2 weeks that cost 2175 pts
4 weeks that cost 1400 pts

this results in 90,350 pts / 36 wks = 2510 points per average platinum week.  Marriott is offering 2375 points for a Platinum two bedroom a difference of 135 points, or 5.4%.  

Out of 36 weeks in the season there are 30 that cost more points than Marriott gives and 6 that cost less.

Ray


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## 5infam (Jun 21, 2010)

There have been several for Maui, but I don't think anyone posted for what I have yet - Maui Ocean Club, 1 bedroom, mountain/garden view - weeks 1 to 50. Points I get from Marriott if I trade in are 3,100. According to the chart, the platinum weeks are now one of the 3 following categories for the identical room type and view:

3,100 points
3,550 points
3,725 points

If I average the 3 out, it is 3,458 points - or 89.6%. However, I have only used mine in the summer and have traded back in during the summer, so that would be 3,550 points vs. the 3,100 I would get as a trade or 87.3%. 

Maintenance fees...I paid $1,475.07 for my 2010 week. So if you base that on the points Marriott gives me (3,100), then it is $0.4758 per point. If you base it on what I use it for, which is a summer week - then I would need 3,550 points, or $0.4155 per point, which is closer to the $0.40 that apparently will go along with the points. 

Sounds like I could do better with the points on MF's, but someone correct me if I screwed up the math.


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## dougp26364 (Jun 21, 2010)

jimf41 said:


> I really don't understand the point of this thread. If you bought a week at a resort why would you give that week to II for the purpose of trading back in to your home resort? Once you give it to II there is no guarantee of getting back in or getting anywhere you might want to visit. This is what this thread is asking.
> 
> In the past there would be no reason to do this except to game the system. In the future I could see doing it as you now have the ability to pick any week of the year you want. There are no more seasons. If you are a new purchaser this is more expensive than what we all bought but at least you can buy what you want. For all of us weeks based owners this is a home run IMO. You can still reserve any week in your original "season" at no extra cost other than the initial fee and you can pick any "season" that you have accumulated enough points to reserve.
> 
> ...



You don't use points to trade back in. The variance is the overage Marriott charges other owners to trade into your resort. When you give Marriott your week for points, then trade into another resort, you're the one making up for the shortage.

Look at it this way, you sell your week to Marriott for 93 cents on the dollar. Marriott then charges you full price for the week you want to reserve. If they did this to everyone, there's a 7 % variance in favor of Marriott. They charge 7% more points than they give. 

Now, if you have 1,000,000 points outstanding in your system and, you overcharge you owner/exchangers by 7%, you suddently find yourself (Marriott) with a surplus of points to the tune of 70,000 points. Marriott can then use that surplus to take weeks from the system to rent. If the average points to exchange is 4,000 points, that gives Marriott 17.5 full weeks to rent that they didn't have to pay for. 

There is no other system that I'm aware off that offers owners this exciting enhancement of "we'll give you less for you week than we charge everyone else who exchanges in" or, as I like to think of it, the Marriott double standard. All other systems seem to manage just fine without skimming a portion of the points. Why can't Marriott? Even when Hilton started labling all their new units as "premium" and charging more for them, those that bought those units received the "premium" number of points for them. Marriott choose a different path.


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## mtnpilot (Jun 21, 2010)

*There IS one positive...*

For Summit Watch, the average points required in the platinum season is 4750, and with my assigned points of 4425, the "skimming" is about 7%.

However, those of us with high demand weeks get one real advantage over new "points-only" owners.  My maintenance fees this year are around $1200, but under the new system, my maintenance fees would be $1770, a difference of $570 or 48%!  So, there are places where we are getting some advantage.  I have a feeling that this is the primary reason why it seems that Marriott is skimming from existing owners.

The bottom line is that Marriott is moving to a new system that simplifies marketing, sales, and management, and there are some plusses for existing owners, and some minuses.  As for me, I will probably join the program...

MS


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## taffy19 (Jun 21, 2010)

GaryDouglas said:


> Maui Ocean Club -
> 
> MMO OF 2bdrm Suites: 6450
> Charts for the suites range from 6425 to 7800, week 1-51
> ...


Week 52 (10,425 points) was lumped in with the rest of the year so did that change the percentages?  I only figured the slippage on our own week.


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## jjking42 (Jun 21, 2010)

legends edge platinum

points given 2250
points needed for summer 2950

only 76% give me a break


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## Dave M (Jun 21, 2010)

*Moderator note #2*:

As I stated above, I will be deleting (not transferring) some posts that are not on the titled topic of this thread. Please post elsewhere if you have comments on fairness, whether you like the new program, whether it's a good idea to convert, etc.


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## NJDave (Jun 21, 2010)

Cypress Harbour Special week.  

Allocated 2,650 points 

It takes at least 2,675 to reserve any week. The average value is 2,828.   

Week Points

1     2,675
2     2,675
3     2,675
4     2,675
5     3,225
6     2,900
7     2,900
8     2,900
9     2,900
10   2,900
11   2,900
12   2,900
13   2,675
14   2,675
15   2,675
16   2,675
17   2,675
51   2,900
52   3,225

Average Value 2,828


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## DanaTom (Jun 21, 2010)

Shadow Ridge Gold:

Allocated: 2325
Need for most weeks:  2450

94.9%

However, there are some June months at 1950, and then early November months that require 3175 and Thanksgiving week at 4000!  Basically they turned November into Platinum.


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## dioxide45 (Jun 22, 2010)

Anyone know what a plat Fairway Villas is getting?


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## vistana101 (Jun 23, 2010)

[_Message deleted. Please see my above post._ Dave M, BBS Moderator]


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## Superchief (Jun 23, 2010)

*Ocean Pointe Silver gets more points than Oceana Palms Gold*

I do not understand how my Ocean Pointe Silver OV receives more points than Oceana Palms Gold OS.
Ocean Pointe Silver OS   3050
Oceana Palms Gold OV    2625

The Oceana Palms is dramatically undervalued.


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## TheTimeTraveler (Jun 23, 2010)

Superchief said:


> I do not understand how my Ocean Pointe Silver OV receives more points than Oceana Palms Gold OS.
> Ocean Pointe Silver OS   3050
> Oceana Palms Gold OV    2625
> 
> The Oceana Palms is dramitically undervalued.





Oceana Palms set up an expanded Platinum Season compared to Ocean Pointe, and no silver season exists at all at Oceana Palms.  Matter of fact, many of Ocean Pointe silver weeks fall during Oceana Palms Platinum Season.


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## wa.mama (Jun 23, 2010)

Suzy said:


> With all my weeks at Marriott, I can at least get a week at my home resort except for one silver week I own at Legends Edge.
> 
> My silver week is worth 1,150 pts, but it takes 1,225 to reserve the lowest week there.  I can't even trade into my resort at all!!!  I can't believe that.



The Minimum number of points you can own to join the club is 1500.  That's why Marriott is offering the "free" 800 points - to allow you to join and trade for _one year_.  Next year you'll be on your own if you want to exchange outside of II.


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## dougp26364 (Jun 23, 2010)

mtnpilot said:


> For Summit Watch, the average points required in the platinum season is 4750, and with my assigned points of 4425, the "skimming" is about 7%.
> 
> However, those of us with high demand weeks get one real advantage over new "points-only" owners.  My maintenance fees this year are around $1200, but under the new system, my maintenance fees would be $1770, a difference of $570 or 48%!  So, there are places where we are getting some advantage.  I have a feeling that this is the primary reason why it seems that Marriott is skimming from existing owners.
> 
> ...



What I'd like to know is why the trust MF's are so much higher than the resorts MF's. In theory, the trust MF's should be an average of all the resorts in the trust. Yet it seems to me that the trust MF's are considerably higher than just about every Marriott resort, which are notorious for having the highest MF's in the industry. 

Could it be that Marriott is not only skimming points but gouging on the MF's as well? It sort of looks that way to me. Maybe Perry was correct that Marriott was on the verge of insolvency and they needed a new bankroll to keep going.


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## dioxide45 (Jun 23, 2010)

dougp26364 said:


> What I'd like to know is why the trust MF's are so much higher than the resorts MF's. In theory, the trust MF's should be an average of all the resorts in the trust. Yet it seems to me that the trust MF's are considerably higher than just about every Marriott resort, which are notorious for having the highest MF's in the industry.
> 
> Could it be that Marriott is not only skimming points but gouging on the MF's as well? It sort of looks that way to me. Maybe Perry was correct that Marriott was on the verge of insolvency and they needed a new bankroll to keep going.



Actually if I own enough points for a silver week somewhere the MF are much lower than what an owner currently pays. This was discussed a lot in the speculation thread. In a weeks based system the MF are spread evenly among all owners, it is just how it works. In a points based system it doesn't work that way. People with enough points for platinum weeks will pay much more MF than those with enough weeks for a cheap silver or bronze week.


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## Dave M (Jun 23, 2010)

Please focus on the title of this thread and keep on track. Even though discussion might be somewhat related, it makes it more difficult for people to find info they want and runs the risk of deletions by my ruthless hand.


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## kdorward (Jun 29, 2010)

*Marriott point Value recieved for resorts*

Maybe this is posted someplace already but I didn't find it.   I would like to see the point value for different resort and season resorts recieived.
I would received:
Frenchmans Cove Gold   2BR  OS  2775 
Newport Coast     Plat   2BR        3475


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## UK Fan (Jun 29, 2010)

Oceanwatch/Plat/2 Bedroom/Gardenview--3225 pts.


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## lll1929 (Jun 29, 2010)

Aruba Ocean Club 2bdrm OV Gold - 3075 pts


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## SpikeMauler (Jun 29, 2010)

Frenchman's Cove 2 BR Plat - 3650


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## dhole (Jun 29, 2010)

Waiohai Plat OV 5075
Grand Chateau Plat 3 bdr  4675
Willow Ridge 2 br Silver  850


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## littlestar (Jun 29, 2010)

Willow Ridge 2 Br Gold - 1,575


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## LAR (Jun 29, 2010)

Maui Ocean Club 1 BR GV - 3100


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## donb (Jun 29, 2010)

Aruba Surf Club, 2 br, GV 2575. MRP 75,000 EOY


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## hipslo (Jun 29, 2010)

mountainside platinum - 5350
fairway villas gold -       1350


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## m61376 (Jun 29, 2010)

Aruba Surf Club:
2BR Plat. OS: 4075 (surprisingly, OV was awarded the same # points)
3BR Gold OV: 3975


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## LAX Mom (Jun 29, 2010)

Summit Watch, silver 1,400
Summit Watch, bronze  0

edited to add both weeks are 2 bedrooms, no views are assigned at Summit Watch


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## mnf999 (Jun 29, 2010)

*My weeks*

OceanWatch Villas at Grande Dunes
2BR + 2BA
Oceanside/Gardenview
PLATINUM
3900

Kaua'i Beach Club
1BR + 2BA
Ocean View
PLATINUM
2775


:rofl:


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## lasiked (Jun 29, 2010)

OceanWatch Villas Plat 2BR OF - 4350


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## m61376 (Jun 29, 2010)

Please post the size, view and season


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## kdorward (Jun 29, 2010)

LAX Mom said:


> Summit Watch, silver 1,400
> Summit Watch, bronze  0



So for Summit Watch, bronze you dont get any points.   Was that a special purchase that you couldn't receive any points.


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## jgalt19808 (Jun 29, 2010)

*Marriott Points Awarded*

Surfwatch 
Silver
Oceanside
1925 points


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## potchak (Jun 29, 2010)

Waiohai IV 2bd platinum- 4225
Timberlodge Plat summer 2bd l/o - 3350
Manor Club 2bd plat MMC/MSE - 2375


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## Werner Weiss (Jun 29, 2010)

Ko Olina Beach Club
Platinum Floating
Floor Plan: 2BR + 2BA
View Type: Ocean View (NOT penthouse ocean view)
4,950 Points    

Newport Coast Villas
Platinum Floating
Floor Plan: 2BR + 2BA
View Type: "Excellent View" (no view categories at NCV)
3,475 Points


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## LAX Mom (Jun 29, 2010)

kdorward said:


> So for Summit Watch, bronze you dont get any points.   Was that a special purchase that you couldn't receive any points.



Summit Watch bronze weeks were originally held back by Marriott to be used as bonus time for owners. A few years ago the HOA decided to sell them using Marriott to broker the sales. Marriott charged $1,500 (including all closing costs, etc) for each week and labeled them as bronze. 

These same weeks are silver at Mountainside (also in Park City and very comparable to Summit Watch). I find it interesting that Summit Watch is a resort that Marriott developed, sold weeks to the public (including these same weeks as silver to Mountainside owners) and Marriott now basically takes the position that these weeks are worth nothing. I've received AC's from II for the deposit on a Summit Watch bronze 1 bedroom (at least twice, maybe 3 times).


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## Weimaraner (Jun 29, 2010)

Aruba Surf Club

Platinum 2 bedroom Oceanfront  5225  
Platinum Plus 2 bedroom Oceanside 5825
Platinum 3 bedroom Oceanview 5225 (same as 2 bedroom OF but maintenance fees a lot higher)


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## jtd (Jun 29, 2010)

MOW plat OV  3475
MCV  gold      1825
MGC  plat       3275

all 2 BR


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## rsackett (Jun 29, 2010)

Harbour Point week 32 (Platinum) 2 bedroom - 1150 pts.

Ray


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## BarbS (Jun 29, 2010)

Barony Beach OF Gold - 3725
Aruba Surf Club OF Gold - 3975


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## Dave M (Jun 29, 2010)

I am going to combine this thread with an earlier one that lists points received and also includes the points required to reserve using points.


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## Whirl (Jun 29, 2010)

Barony Beach Platinum Ocean Side - 4200

Barony Beach Platinum Ocean Front -5025

Monarch Platinum GardenView -2500


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## Kokonut (Jul 21, 2010)

Ko Olina Beach Club
Platinum Floating (Weeks 1-50)
Floor Plan: 3BR + 3BA
View Type: Ocean View
6,550 Points 

Ko Olina Beach Club
Platinum Floating (Weeks 1-50)
Floor Plan: 2BR + 2BA
View Type: Mountain View
4,025 Points 

Newport Coast Villas
Platinum Holiday (Week 52)
Floor Plan: 2BR + 2BA
View Type: "Excellent View" (no view categories at NCV)
4,625 Points


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## DanCali (Jul 21, 2010)

Kokonut said:


> Ko Olina Beach Club
> Platinum Floating (Weeks 1-50)
> Floor Plan: 3BR + 3BA
> View Type: Ocean View
> ...



Pretty consistent skim across the board here...

Total skim: 478+280+325 = 1083 points

At $0.50 rental value that about $540 a year in extra cost each time you use points!


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## Katsdad (Aug 2, 2010)

*Ocean Point Points Value*

Does anyone know what the point value is for Ocean Point Silver, Garden View is?


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## dioxide45 (Aug 2, 2010)

Katsdad said:


> Does anyone know what the point value is for Ocean Point Silver, Garden View is?



Ocean Pointe doesn't have a garden view. There is Ocean Side and Ocean Front. I don't know how many points were offered for Ocean Side. I do know that a lot of gold owners are upset at Ocean Pointe because silver season was actually allocated more Destination Points than their gold seasons.


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## jimf41 (Aug 2, 2010)

Katsdad said:


> Does anyone know what the point value is for Ocean Point Silver, Garden View is?



Silver 2bdrm OS gets 3050 points.


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## scpoidog (Sep 12, 2010)

*Ko Olina OV PH*

Ko Olina Beach Club
Platinum Floating (Weeks 1-50)
Floor Plan: 2BR + 2BA lock-off Penthouse
View Type: Ocean View
5,925 Points


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## nygiants11991 (Nov 13, 2010)

Maui Ocean Club
2 bdrm older section
Mountain/Garden view
4725 received
Points to use 4700
Jan 7–Jan 27; Apr 1–Apr 21; Apr 29–Jun 2; Aug 22–Nov 24; Dec 2–Dec 22Points to use 5450
Jan 28 – Feb 17 Feb 25 – Mar 31 Jun 3 – Aug 25
Points to use 5675
Feb 18 – Feb 24 Apr 22 – Apr 28 Nov 25 – Dec 1 Dec 23 – Dec 29
Points to use 6475
Dec 30 – Jan 5
This works out well for us, because we usally go in January.   And when it is just my DH &  I we will opt for a smaller unit with a better view.  So far I am pleased with my options of the new program.  Yeah it cost me $600 to join, but I recieved enough points for almost two nights in an ocean front studio in the new towers during my next trip.
To each is own, the plan will benefit some and not others.


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## OldPantry (Jan 7, 2011)

*Ko Olina points analysis*

Marriott would offer 4050 points for a 2BR mountainview unit in their newly defined low season.  So, 100% equivalency if you settle for one of those 27 weeks.
However, Ko Olina weeks were marketed as 50-week platinum. So, 23 weeks have now been removed from availability for those 4050 points.  Now they cost from 4575 points (12.9% premium) to 4800 (18.5% premium).  Other exposures are a good deal worse (17.7% to 23.9% for a top of the line 3BR oceanfront unit).  This, of course, ignores the lockoff equivalencies, discussed elsewhere.  They are even worse.   Even low season starts at a 12.3% haircut.
I would say Marriott is exacting a very stiff price for the convenience they tout in a points exchange.


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