# The Point at Poipu - Times are a changin'



## Poobah (Mar 8, 2009)

If you are an owner at The Point and have booked a week be prepared for some changes when you check in:

1. They now put a $200 hold on your credit card
2. The free breakfast on your day of arrival is history
3. The cocktail receptions are history
4. The activities have been contracted out to Expedia and you can no longer charge activities to your room
5. Half the concierge staff is gone (see #4 above).
6. Of the people I have talked to, the "Owner Review" meetings dissolve into a confrontation. The accounts are there is a lot of name calling. 
7. Most of the management as us old timers knew them are gone.

You can see the stress in the faces of the staff.  

It struck me that in all our years of coming here, this was a happy place; it is no longer. There was never any siginificant complaining; sure there was stuff, but it wasn't the overriding topic of conversation. In the adult spa, there is nothing but complaining. It is quite a change.

The ohana that was EVR and Poipu Point has been torn asunder. 

More later, the sun s finally out and I don't want to miss it.

Aloha,

Paul


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## csalter2 (Mar 8, 2009)

*Why are You So Surprised?*



Poobah said:


> If you are an owner at The Point and have booked a week be prepared for some changes when you check in:
> 
> 1. They now put a $200 hold on your credit card
> 2. The free breakfast on your day of arrival is history
> ...



I can't believe that you are surprised by cutbacks and concern. Our country is not in a very happy place. When I speak with people in various industries, there is such uncertainty in their workplaces. People are really feeling the pressure or knowing if they are going to have a job or not. We are in the most turbulent time in our country's history. People are scared and they become confrontational because the are under a stress they may never have been through before. I have seen two separate families in which one of the parents committed suicide leaving the rest of the family including the children in further despair.

So don't be too surprised by all that is going on.


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## lv_maui (Mar 8, 2009)

Poobah said:


> If you are an owner at The Point and have booked a week be prepared for some changes when you check in:
> 
> 1. They now put a $200 hold on your credit card
> 2. The free breakfast on your day of arrival is history
> ...



I guess I wonder what the commotion is about for the above.

1.  A hold is not a big thing nor is really that unexpected.
2.  The free breakfast was a Sales issue, but the resort did much to try and educate owners that this was not a right, but was a developer favor.
3.  Same as 2 although I thought it helped Sales.
4.  I am against them contracting out to Expedia but the developer controls the front desk.
5.  I am sad to see some of the staff go but I would think Expedia would like to hire them.
6.  I wonder who is on the Board now.  Maybe they need to start to educate the owners and create more newsletter communication.
7.  Same as 5 as I liked them also,

Poipu is impacted greatly by the various maintenance fee increases that seem to be out of control.  The truth is that the fee was way too low in the beginning, but once they figured out the true numbers, they increased to try and catch up, but now it is a bad economy.


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## kapish (Mar 8, 2009)

> 4.  I am against them contracting out to Expedia but the developer controls the front desk.


Don't the owners have any right ask for this be changed? 

More interesting, when an owner brings up his/her concern about this, how could a fellow owner brush it aside as just "the developer controls the front desk" rather than working to help fix this?


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## Kauai Kid (Mar 8, 2009)

Poobah said:


> If you are an owner at The Point and have booked a week be prepared for some changes when you check in:
> 
> 1. They now put a $200 hold on your credit card
> 2. The free breakfast on your day of arrival is history
> ...




I concur.  I was shocked on our last visit.

We are not experiencing the sour faces at the Schooner but certainly everyone staff and guests are understanding the economy stinks everywhere.

Sorry it hasn't improved and I blame most of it on Diamond.

Sterling


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## timeos2 (Mar 8, 2009)

*All too common*



kapish said:


> Don't the owners have any right ask for this be changed?
> 
> More interesting, when an owner brings up his/her concern about this, how could a fellow owner brush it aside as just "the developer controls the front desk" rather than working to help fix this?



Most resorts have the rights of the sales  group / developer in their documents. Hopefully with an end date (although far too often there is none).  Those rights can be quite inclusive and usually covers the guest services / front desk (not the check in area) as that is a prime contact point to schedule sales meetings. The Association/Board often has little or no control over the operation of those areas. Remember the Developer WROTE the resort documents. They are certain to have made them as favorable as possible to themselves. As for owners failing to care about other owners that too is all too common it seems. Look out for number 1 has seemingly become the battlecry.


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## AKE (Mar 10, 2009)

Identical changes were made at the Embassy Kaanapali on Maui which now is run by Diamond Resorts under the new name Kaanapali Beach Club.  I think that it has less to do with the economy and more to do with the Diamond Resort style (i.e. it appears that all owner benefits have been eliminated that costs $$$ and were not part of the timeshare agreement).  What I am surprised is that there seems to have been no owner input into these decisions (so is there no HOA?)


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## Poobah (Mar 10, 2009)

*Times are changing*

The BOD at the Point has five members, three of which have one thing in common: they are employed by DRI. I might be wrong here, but none of them are owners.   So I don't anticipate that those BOD members will do anything that upsets their employer (and impacts their pay checks).

There was a request to the BOD to reinstate some form of the Cocktail Reception. There are options like BYO and the resort supplies munchies. They could charge a nominal amount for the drinks, at least to cover cost. 

My former employer had a management style like DRI. They tend not be very creative. It is easier to just cut it out. I think this says something about whether a company has "managers" or "leaders." 

Most of what I wrote in the first post I really don't care about, it was meant to inform.  What I care about is the attitude of DRI to not communicate it to anyone. This was suggested by the staff:  get out a newsletter to the owners with the changes so that there are no surprises when they arrive. I am sure they wanted this because they take the brunt of "the surprise." You can see how far the newsletter got.

The real question is does DRI consider its owners to be "customers" or "suppliers." I suspect it is the latter.

Lunch time.

Cheers,

Paul


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## GregGH (Mar 17, 2009)

Hi

see this NO RESERVE eBay auction for building 4 (assume it is a fixed location you are buying ??)  -- two weeks ...  anyone have a site map ??

http://cgi.ebay.com/THE-POINT-AT-PO...h=item190293244702&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262

shows as Unit 4 - 102 ... good or poor view -- just curious

Greg


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 17, 2009)

GregGH said:


> Hi
> 
> see this NO RESERVE eBay auction for building 4 (assume it is a fixed location you are buying ??)  -- two weeks ...  anyone have a site map ??
> 
> ...


Units are floating, not fixed.  The number on the deed is solely for inventory control purposes.  

Unit 4-102 is classed as parital ocean view, so the ownership will be either a POV unit, or if it was sold before view categories were established, a float-float unit.


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## GregGH (Mar 17, 2009)

Thanks

also saw previous post - review photo area has site map ...

Interesting

Greg


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## dougp26364 (Mar 17, 2009)

In the FWIW catagory, I believe Marriott also contracts out their conceirge staff. I could be wrong but it seems that was a topic for discussion a couple of years back. I know the Hilton's and the Marriott in Las Vegas contract out the Valet service. Many resorts also contract out the maid service. Is just a fact of life as it keeps cost consistant and you don't require a large human resource department when you don't actaully do the hiring. There's no issue with benefits either. It's all contracted out for one easy bill. 

While in Hawaii, I do not recall Hiton even offering any sort of owners update or get together. They did offer a $75 gift card that could be spent in the Rainbow bazaar shopping area if you attended an owners update (sales atttempt) but, that was it for what Hilton did for it's owners while we were at HHV. We did get a discount card good for a few shops around HHV but, that was it. It really wasn't any big deal as it was only good for a handful of shops/restaurants. 

Developers have been cutting back on the marketing freebie's for some time. Even Marriott had started to reduce the Marriott Rewards Points it offered for attending down to 10,000 from 15,000. I believe most resort's have changed it back to 15,000 points. 

In the past, most freebie's given for attending a presentation were in the $100 + range. Now it seems to be in the $75 range. I was surprised that, at our last Marriott stay, we were offered a Marriott gift card worth $150. Without actually seeing the full disclosure, it wouldn't surprise me if it was limited to a list of merchants rather than being good anywhere.

I heard several comments at the owners reception where Marriott educates owners about exchanging and how to use Marriott rewards points that they had really cut things back. Apparently, the cheese and wine did not flow as freely in years past. Those things aren't of interest to us so much as listening to see if there's a trick I've missed with requesting exchanges or using my Marriott Rewards points. 

The owners breakfast had also been scaled back some according to things I had overheard. Again, it's not something we typically attend as coffee and a donut isn't enough to get me out of bed on vacation. 

As mentioned, some of what has been cut out was paid for by the developer as part of the sales budget. If the owners want to keep it in place, then I guess it needs to remain profitable for the developer to put on those little shindigs. That means owners need to buy more developer inventory. If that's the case, I'll pass.

I'm not going to say I like everything that DRI does but, in this case, it appears to be good business and a way to keep those MF's from climbing even higher.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 17, 2009)

Wyndham also  contracts out concierge at many resorts; on the BI you deal with Expedia.

I have to say that I think it does make sense.  Were I the manager of a resort trying to navigate through difficult circumstances, one of the key questions I would ask is "What are the most important things that we must do well?"  Sort of a "core competencies" kind of question.

I don't think I would put concierge at the top of that list.  I would say we need to focus brutally on reservations, housekeeping, and facilities.  If I identified concierge as an area of strength, while we had deficiencies in the areas I had listed, I would think that we need to review our priorities.

If I could outsource concierge services to help me focus on more essential activities, I don't think I would hesitate to make that change.


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## Poobah (Mar 19, 2009)

*Changes*

I suspect that DRI will eventually subcontract out housekeeping. I believe the management of the resort is already contracted out albeit to a DRI subsidiary, but this is typical. They probably have a P&L responsibility.

It will be interesting to see how all these "cost cutting" measures impact the 2010 MFs. I don't think it is going to make a difference; the MFs are going to take a big jump. I say this for two reasons 

1) we hear nothing about what DRI is doing to control and reduce its corporate costs: e.g. the overhead that is passed down to each resort. My experience has been that most corporate staff functions could never survive a costs/benefits analysis! 
2) DRI wants to create a big disparity between what deeded owners pay in MFs and what owners in the trust pay in annual fees. This is not my supposition, it was spoken by a DRI salesperson at an owner's review. This is looked at as an  "incentive" to put your deed in the trust. 

Cheers,

Paul


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## lv_maui (Mar 20, 2009)

*Questions*



Poobah said:


> 1) we hear nothing about what DRI is doing to control and reduce its corporate costs: e.g. the overhead that is passed down to each resort. My experience has been that most corporate staff functions could never survive a costs/benefits analysis!
> 2) DRI wants to create a big disparity between what deeded owners pay in MFs and what owners in the trust pay in annual fees. This is not my supposition, it was spoken by a DRI salesperson at an owner's review. This is looked at as an  "incentive" to put your deed in the trust.
> 
> Cheers,
> ...




Paul,

First, outsourcing could be a good source of potential so do not automatically think it would be negative.

Second, what do you mean by DRI allocating its corporate overhead?  DRI is paid a management fee % for the offsite costs of overseeing the resort.

Third, I think you are correct in that they want to make the trust more attractive for fees.  In Hawaii, you take the high costs of operations and average it with Florida, Virginia, Arizona, and it naturally would be cheaper.  However, it is more math than intentional.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 20, 2009)

Poobah said:


> 2) DRI wants to create a big disparity between what deeded owners pay in MFs and what owners in the trust pay in annual fees. This is not my supposition, it was spoken by a DRI salesperson at an owner's review. This is looked at as an  "incentive" to put your deed in the trust.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Paul


Really, Paul.  You're taking what a timeshare salesperson says while trying to make a sale as authoritative???

Moving beyond that, the trust is the entity that holds the deeds.  The resort HOA and AOA set the annual fees, and those fees flow to the deedholders, whether those be individual owners or the trust.  So increasing the fees at the resort doesn't inherently create disparities between deeded owners and others.

But ... and I think this is what the salesperson was alluding to .... when a deed is added to the trust from a resort that has high maintenance fees relative to the overall holdings in the trust, that owner will see a reduction in annual fees (on a per point basis) as compared with the corresponding deeded ownership.  That, however, will be offset by increases in annual fees that wind up being paid by owners who added deeds to the trust from less expensive properties.

That point was explained to us in sales presentation at Po'ipu; the sales person was quite upfront about how Po'ipu had:

1) the highest fees in the trust
2) fewer total units than other resorts in the trust.

Thus not only would Po'ipu owners have lower fees by coming into the trust, but that difference was likely to always remain.  Since Ka'anapali and Jockey are essentially hotel properties without the landscaping of Po'ipu, one would expect annual costs at those two resorts to always be less than at Po'ipu.

Of course, since owners can't control what resorts get added to the trusts, all DRI need to is open sales at another large resort that has even higher fees than Po'ipu, and then that cost advantage goes away.

But yeah, they do use that in their sales pitch at Po'ipu.  And I'm sure that they don't mention a word of that at the other locations.


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## lv_maui (Mar 20, 2009)

*You are absolutely correct.*



T_R_Oglodyte said:


> But yeah, they do use that in their sales pitch at Po'ipu.  And I'm sure that they don't mention a word of that at the other locations.



LOL, you are absolutely right.  Back 5 years ago, the fees in Sedona were pretty low and when Club came around, that was the biggest complaint from Sales.  A Sedona owner who joined Club would have higher fees.


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## Poobah (Mar 20, 2009)

*Overhead*

Part of the management fee covers some of the corporate overhead. This is pretty typical of any corporation.

Sunny in the north today, but a little windy. Rain up in the mountains, but what else is new! 

About to head off to Annini Beach for a picnic and some sun. It is tough here 

Cheers,

Paul


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## Kauai Kid (Mar 20, 2009)

I understand the forecast for Burnsville is 8-12" of blowing and drifting snow with 30-40 mph winds, preceeded by rain, an ice storm and temperatures decreasing  from about 32 to near 38 below zero within 14 hrs.  At least after the blizzard it will be clear.   :hysterical: 

Sterling


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 20, 2009)

Kauai Kid said:


> I understand the forecast for Burnsville is 8-12" of blowing and drifting snow with 30-40 mph winds, preceeded by rain, an ice storm and temperatures decreasing  from about 32 to near 38 below zero within 14 hrs.  At least after the blizzard it will be clear.   :hysterical:
> 
> Sterling



And when that snow and ice melts the water will fill all of the pools and puddles that are so critical for the mosquitoes.


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## Werner (Mar 20, 2009)

Poobah said:


> 1. They now put a $200 hold on your credit card
> 2. The free breakfast on your day of arrival is history
> 3. The cocktail receptions are history
> 4. The activities have been contracted out to Expedia and you can no longer charge activities to your room
> ...



We also just returned from the Point.  The good news that the resort seems to be functioning well.  The grounds were clean, and well maintained.  The unit was clean, furniture was in OK condition, a balky coffee maker was replaced in an hour, the grills were clean and worked fine.  There was some complaining from someone that an old, rusty, never used, broken charcoal grill was removed a day after they bought a bag a charcoal.  Sometimes you can't win for losing!   The whales were jumping, the sea turtles were all over the place, and monk seals were on almost every beach.   There was even a turtle on the beach at Poipu Park.  I thought only Big Island turtles came ashore.  

re:
1.  credit card hold, every hotel does it.
2.  the free breakfast was a way of capturing you for an update.
3.  the watered down Mai Tais won't be missed.
4.  Expedia; why is this bad? They are in the travel business.  They may even get better discounts.
5.  Some of the concierge staff is doing double-duty working check-ins.  Seems efficient to me.  Most the time they just sit there waiting for the phone to ring.
6.  The "owner update" was indeed a big disappointment.  We used to get useful information about the Point, II, Sunterra and later about DRI, for an hour or so and then end with a brief sales attempt and a polite "no thank you, see you next time".   This was more of a disinformaton session.  Deeded owners are perceived to be dinosaurs in the DRI world of "collections".  We we told we were in the "Sunterra" program.  We reminded the sales rep that Sunterra no longer existed and he responded with a smarmy comment that implied that the "real" DRI members are in the trusts/collections.  He either did not understand what deeded owners / club members were or he was testing us to see if we understood what we owned.  When we pushed back he called in the Sales Manager, a no-nonsense woman who knew her stuff and confirmed our understanding of deeded ownership and assignment of deeds to the Club for points.  The salesman got an education from his boss which he clearly didn't want. 

The primary pitch for Poipu owners to convert to the Hawaii collection is the lower maintainence fees.  Basically all those folks that convert at Polo and Sedona are subsidizing the Hawaii freeloaders.  Not said of course is that all those Polo and Sedona owners who convert to the trust will want to get their money's worth by competing with you when you try to reserve at the Point or KBC.  When we got down to numbers, the "big" savings from going into the trust was about $100/wk; big deal.  
7.  Having lived through corporate mergers and takeovers back in the bad old days (when I worked for living) I'm not surprised that the old regime is gone but we did a miss seeing one of our favorite Point personalities, the always enthusiastic Victoria.


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## Fisch (Mar 20, 2009)

Werner said:


> We also just returned from the Point.  The good news that the resort seems to be functioning well.  The grounds were clean, and well maintained.



Did you notice if Michael is still working the Bar/Restuarant?

Al


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 20, 2009)

Werner said:


> The primary pitch for Poipu owners to convert to the Hawaii collection is the lower maintainence fees.  Basically all those folks that convert at Polo and Sedona are subsidizing the Hawaii freeloaders.  Not said of course is that all those Polo and Sedona owners who convert to the trust will want to get their money's worth by competing with you when you try to reserve at the Point or KBC.


Yep - and the pitch for them to join is that they can now reserve in Hawai'i at 13 onths instead of 10 months.



Werner said:


> Having lived through corporate mergers and takeovers back in the bad old days (when I worked for living) I'm not surprised that the old regime is gone but we did a miss seeing one of our favorite Point personalities, the always enthusiastic Victoria.


For at least the last four or five years there has been a tall (about 6'-4") bald guy in the sales office.  Probably early- to mid-40s.  Did you see him??

One of the things I've noted over the years at Po'ipu is that we often do see some of the same sales staff from year to year.  Personally, I think that's a good thing.  I suspect that the shops that are the most mercenary probably also have the highest turnover.  At the mercenary shops those who can't deal with the pressure are shoved out the door quickly; while those who are good don't hesitate to jump when anyone dangles a better offer in front of them.


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## Poobah (Mar 21, 2009)

*Michael*

Yep, Mike is still holding court at the poolside grill. He left yesterday evening (Thursday) for Colorado with the family. Headed to Vail for a little skiing and then to the old homestead in Trindad, CO. Back in 10 days.

One of our favorite people at the Point, too.

Based on the Owner Reviews we should all change our handles to "Dinosaurs." A lot of people got that line. Some were accused of being "emotionally attached to their deed." I resemble that remark.

Sterling: thank you for the Burnsville weather forcast! Since I am here I can say "Frankly Scarlett, I don't give a d*mn!" I am sending home the obligatory "eat your heart out" pictures. I love this!!!!

Steve: I think we are in violent agreement on what is going on with DRI.

We are lucking out big time on the weather on the north. I think we brought the Poipu sunshine with us. Tomorrow we are meeting some friends from MN who are here for four months and doing the Farmers Market, walking Hanalei Bay, and then heading for lunch at the new Westin. I can't take the stress All these obligations; will it never end?

Aloha,

Paul


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## dougp26364 (Mar 21, 2009)

Poobah said:


> Yep, Mike is still holding court at the poolside grill. He left yesterday evening (Thursday) for Colorado with the family. Headed to Vail for a little skiing and then to the old homestead in Trindad, CO. Back in 10 days.
> 
> One of our favorite people at the Point, too.
> 
> ...




I'm not emotionally attached to my deed. I'll sell it back to DRI anytime they want to make me a reasonable offer........and actually follow through with it.


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## Werner (Mar 21, 2009)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> For at least the last four or five years there has been a tall (about 6'-4") bald guy in the sales office.  Probably early- to mid-40s.  Did you see him?



Steve, sorry but I don't really know anyone else in that office.  We usually had private meetings with Victoria at these updates.  Now they are scheduled mass meetings, almost like a job fair, where each table is filled with salesman and their targets.  It was a bit of a zoo.  We heard that the sales staff is now almost all DRI.  

also, in the midst of the confusing disinformation campaign by the salesman he suggested that DRI might not manage the resort next year.  I don't know if that is a good thing or a bad thing.  I suspect its a don't care.  

BTW, Patty in reservations said that they are no longer assigning units to specific check-in days.  

We thoroughly enjoy our visits to the Point.  As long as the maintenance is done and the grounds kept up the natural setting of the Point is its primary attraction.  We use nearly all of our club points there.  The few that we trade through DRI and II are usually disappointing (except to KBC) so DRI's importance to our TS experience is diminishing.  The most important things we use DRI for is the ability to rollover points and the elite upgrades. 

One of the salesman's disinformation arguments for converting was that us deeded-owner-dinosaurs were becoming extinct and we would soon be unable to reserve any unit other than the unit listed on our deed because we would be the last owner left standing.  We asked him to show us numbers of unit/weeks in each ownership category, he pretended to look for them in the office and came back with nothing.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 21, 2009)

Werner said:


> BTW, Patty in reservations said that they are no longer assigning units to specific check-in days.


If that's true, that's a huge change logistically with lots of opportunities to get reservations all fouled up.



> One of the salesman's disinformation arguments for converting was that us deeded-owner-dinosaurs were becoming extinct and we would soon be unable to reserve any unit other than the unit listed on our deed because we would be the last owner left standing. We asked him to show us numbers of unit/weeks in each ownership category, he pretended to look for them in the office and came back with nothing.



As of last September the resort was about 50% the Club and 50% deeded owners (info from Jamie Shigeta).


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## Werner (Mar 21, 2009)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> As of last September the resort was about 50% the Club and 50% deeded owners (info from Jamie Shigeta).



There are 3 categories of interest:
1.  deeded owners not affiliated with DRI at all
2.  deeded owners who are members of the club (deeds assigned to DRI)
3.  Trust/Collections

Are there any more groups?  Do you have this breakdown?  I think the salesman was suggesting that group 2 is the dinosaur.  He may be right but if we start having trouble making reservations we might revert back to group 1 rather than buy into the collections.  Being forced to spend two weeks on Kauai every year is not a serious punishment.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 21, 2009)

Werner said:


> There are 3 categories of interest:
> 1.  deeded owners not affiliated with DRI at all
> 2.  deeded owners who are members of the club (deeds assigned to DRI)
> 3.  Trust/Collections
> ...



Club is Club.  Club consists of Trust + deeded weeks affiliated with Club.  She did not break Club into Trrust vs affiliated deed.

In addition to the 3 groups you list there is a fourth:  Trust not affiliated with Club.  This ownership type will be created when a trust membership loses Club affiliation (e.g., with a sale of the trust interest).  I also imagine that a trust owner could terminate their affiliation with the Club in exactlly the same manner that a deeded owner can terminate their affiliation with the Club.


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## Poobah (Mar 22, 2009)

*Inventories*

I think this whole deeded,trust, club , etc. is getting too complicated to ever really work well.  The whole idea was to get money out of the owners beyond their maintenance fees. 

What bothers me is that there will be more points in the system than inventory to support it. Kind of like printing money, but that is another story! I am not a points person, we bought at The Point because that is where we want to go every year. We didn't by it to trade it or get into a pool where every Tom, Dick, and Harry with enough points can compete for a week. 

I met a couple at the tub that did just that; the only reason they got into the Club and the Trust was so they could leverage their KBC with EOY at Poipu and add some points and get Poipu every year. They like Poipu much better than KBC. We ran into another Trust/Club member that was paying essentially $2300 a year in points to get into Poipu.

Off to Lumahai.

Cheers,

Paul


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## Kauaigrl00 (Mar 26, 2009)

I have really found this subject very interesting since we are owners at the Point at Poipu for over 10 years.  We purchased through the Encore Program and own 1 week a year, float float, oceanfront.

I am a bit confused about everything people are talking about the deeded.  We are deeded, they did try a few years ago to get us to go with points and we declined.

I just booked my trip for 2 weeks for Feb. 2010, I had no problems booking but the one thing that upset me was that I was told that Patty Ornellas is not with the Point anymore.  For years I strictly dealt with her.  Sure sounds like we are in for a surprise.  We were there in Feb. 2008 and had no problems whatsoever for 2 weeks.  I am disappointed that there is no newsletter anymore.

Boy I am glad I found this board.  Very informative!  Thanks  I am sure I will have a ton of questions


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## Poobah (Mar 27, 2009)

*Patty Ornelles*

Patty position was "eliminated." From what I understand she still is unemployed. 

IMHO, there are always jobs for the good people. She will not be unemployed long. 

Cheers,

Paul


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 27, 2009)

Poobah said:


> Patty position was "eliminated." From what I understand she still is unemployed.
> 
> IMHO, there are always jobs for the good people. She will not be unemployed long.
> 
> ...


With Patti and Jamie gone they have lost two of their most "Ohana" people.  This is not good.


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## Carolinian (Mar 27, 2009)

Developer or management control of an HOA BOD is a huge negative.  With all of the member dissatisfaction, someone needs to organize a Concerned Owners group and run slate of indepedent owner representatives to oust these functionaries with conflicts of interest.





Poobah said:


> The BOD at the Point has five members, three of which have one thing in common: they are employed by DRI. I might be wrong here, but none of them are owners.   So I don't anticipate that those BOD members will do anything that upsets their employer (and impacts their pay checks).
> 
> There was a request to the BOD to reinstate some form of the Cocktail Reception. There are options like BYO and the resort supplies munchies. They could charge a nominal amount for the drinks, at least to cover cost.
> 
> ...


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 27, 2009)

Kauaigrl00 said:


> I have really found this subject very interesting since we are owners at the Point at Poipu for over 10 years.  We purchased through the Encore Program and own 1 week a year, float float, oceanfront.



If you're float float, you are not oceanfront.  Those two are mutually exclusive forms of ownership.  Float float is what corresponds in the ownership documents to a Type II ownership.  Ocean Front is Type II-A.  You cannot be both types.

So far, if float float owners who know how to use their ownership have generally been able to consistently book ocean front with their units.  But that is not guaranteed, and I suspect that we are going to be increasingly squeezed.


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## Kauaigrl00 (Mar 27, 2009)

*Float*



T_R_Oglodyte said:


> If you're float float, you are not oceanfront.  Those two are mutually exclusive forms of ownership.  Float float is what corresponds in the ownership documents to a Type II ownership.  Ocean Front is Type II-A.  You cannot be both types.
> 
> So far, if float float owners who know how to use their ownership have generally been able to consistently book ocean front with their units.  But that is not guaranteed, and I suspect that we are going to be increasingly squeezed.




Well we do own Oceanfront.  Possibly I am mistaken about the float float, I do know you can not get this anymore.  We can go whenever we want and we do always get an oceanfront.  We are through RCI and I have really never had a problem.  NOW, on the other hand what we do is go every other year, for 2 weeks.  One week for sure is oceanfront because it is our owners week and the second week we "could" end up in a gardenview, though that has never happened yet. We have actually been lucky and stayed in the same unit for 2 weeks.  We also tend to go at a busy time which is Feb. around President's week.


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## Kauaigrl00 (Mar 27, 2009)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> With Patti and Jamie gone they have lost two of their most "Ohana" people.  This is not good.



Boy this is true!  There are two other "past" employees that were tops and I have been lucky enough to keep their friendship.  One is Merlie who now lives on Oahu and Rose who was the activity director and still lives on Kauai.

Is John from Milwaukee still there in the concierge or whatever position he may have now?  All those people were truly "Ohana".  I will really miss Patti.  Summer was also great to work with for this upcoming trip for Feb. 2010


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## Poobah (Mar 27, 2009)

*John*

John is still at the concierge desk as is Kelly. Natalie left and works for Capt. Andy's. The young lady, whose name I just forgot (I do that a lot lately)left and is nowworking for Gaylords and pitches the Luau at the Island Orientation. She also performs in the show.

Summer has always been nice to work with.  

Cheers,

Paul


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## Kauaigrl00 (Mar 27, 2009)

Poobah said:


> John is still at the concierge desk as is Kelly. Natalie left and works for Capt. Andy's. The young lady, whose name I just forgot (I do that a lot lately)left and is nowworking for Gaylords and pitches the Luau at the Island Orientation. She also performs in the show.
> 
> Summer has always been nice to work with.
> 
> ...



I wonder how many people followed George Costa to the Hilton?  He was a great guy too.  I have not met the new Manager yet but I can tell you he was very nice.  My girlfriend died on the plane on the way to Kauai (half way accross the ocean) and the next day we had a huge arrangements of flowers in our condo.  It was like no one could do enough for us, they were truly "Ohana" !


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## lv_maui (Mar 27, 2009)

Kauaigrl00 said:


> I wonder how many people followed George Costa to the Hilton?  He was a great guy too.



Where did George go and what position?

I was told that Jamie was still with DRI doing inventory or something like that.


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## Kauaigrl00 (Mar 27, 2009)

lv_maui said:


> Where did George go and what position?
> 
> I was told that Jamie was still with DRI doing inventory or something like that.



I was told he is at the Hilton Kauai Beach Resort and is the General Manager.


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## Poobah (Mar 28, 2009)

*George Costas*

I believe George Costas is the Economic Developoment Director for the County of Kauai. George was a great guy.:whoopie: 

Rainy on the North Side today. Not Chamber of Commerce weather. Visited Kauai Orchids; bad mistake! I have a carry on!!!! 

Aloha,

Paul


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## Kauaigrl00 (Mar 28, 2009)

Poobah said:


> I believe George Costas is the Economic Developoment Director for the County of Kauai. George was a great guy.:whoopie:
> 
> Rainy on the North Side today. Not Chamber of Commerce weather. Visited Kauai Orchids; bad mistake! I have a carry on!!!!
> 
> ...




Yes it does look like he has moved on from the Kauai Hilton Resort - good for him!

http://www.kauai.gov/Government/Dep...fandContactInformation/tabid/225/Default.aspx


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## lv_maui (Mar 29, 2009)

I was wrong.  I saw his picture and George is now in Government.


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## natarajanv (Apr 1, 2009)

*Attending TS presentation at points at poipu*

I will be attending the TS presentation with them on April 5th. If anyone wanted me to get some answers for their questions, I will be glad to do so. I am not a owner, but going there with their discounted promotional rate.


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## Kauai Kid (Apr 1, 2009)

natarajanv said:


> I will be attending the TS presentation with them on April 5th. If anyone wanted me to get some answers for their questions, I will be glad to do so. I am not a owner, but going there with their discounted promotional rate.



Whatever you do don't buy from them.

I'd love for someone to post a U Tube Video of their presentations, mis- representations, fibs, and out and out lies. :hysterical: 

What they say doesn't count, only what is on the contract.

After the third time of saying NO the fourth time was about 195 db and I said "WHAT PART OF NO DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND?"  The "super closer left with a streak"

Buy me an umbrella drink with the funds you save. 


Sterling

owner--2 weeks Oceanfront


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## natarajanv (Apr 12, 2009)

well, I did attend the TS presentation but DID NOT buy from them. The asking price was $31K for 9500 points. The added incentive was 4 R/T air fare within US and an extra 1 week vacation with II. But since I told the TS person that I just bought an HGVC (resale) and awaiting the deed competion process, he did not put any kind of pressure on me to buy it.

I did like the program though, with internal reservation with all their 100 plus resorts and 59 day reservation with half the points, etc, etc.

He told me that all those neat features are not availabe via resale... Is that right.?


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## dougp26364 (Apr 13, 2009)

natarajanv said:


> well, I did attend the TS presentation but DID NOT buy from them. The asking price was $31K for 9500 points. The added incentive was 4 R/T air fare within US and an extra 1 week vacation with II. But since I told the TS person that I just bought an HGVC (resale) and awaiting the deed competion process, he did not put any kind of pressure on me to buy it.
> 
> I did like the program though, with internal reservation with all their 100 plus resorts and 59 day reservation with half the points, etc, etc.
> 
> He told me that all those neat features are not availabe via resale... Is that right.?




Yes and no. It just seems to depend on which way the wind is blowing. 

From what I've read, they'll tell you that, if you buy at developer prices, they'll waive the $2,995 joiner fee for THE Club. If they claim to be waiving a joiner fee, then a joiner fee must exist and be offered or they could have a problem. 

On the other hand, you have not mentioned that they would waive the "joiner" fee so, perhaps they have changed the wording in the presentation.

At different times people have reported that resales have been handled a variety of ways. Some have requested that when they buy a developer week that it be written into the contract that they can add resale weeks to THE Club without additional expense. Other have written that when they inquired about getting resale weeks into THE Club, they were told they had to buy additional inventory from the developer. Others have reported being able to negotiate that $2,995 joiner fee.

IMO, DRI is foolish for not allowing resale owners to join THE Club for the $2,995 fee. IMO, that's essentially free money. No gifts to give out, no inventory to build and sell. No overhead what-so-ever. If someone has bought resale, they're not likely to buy developer. They already know the secrete. On the other hand, those that buy from the developer aren't likely to find out about resale values until they want to sell their units. 

I also feel that, by keeping resale units out of THE Club, it has the effect of decreasing inventory for the existing members. Inventory that would be nice to have when making reservations. 

So the long and short of it is, the target seems to keep changing. DRI really hasn't seemed to settle on how they're going to handle resale unit owners seeking membership in THE Club. Hopefully at some point there will be a set of rules for joining and this won't be much of a topic for discussion. Until then, it's anyones guess. If you're going to buy a DRI week resale, it's best to buy something you can either use or be happy trading using I.I. or RCI's weeks based exchange systems.


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## natarajanv (Apr 13, 2009)

Thanks Doug for the reply. Yes, they indeed mention that they are waiving the $2995 joiner fee. There was one other 2995 fee also waived , but I am not sure what that one was for.

Also, they told that I can buy a 4500 point from them at developer prices and then buy a resale 4500 points and then I would not have problem joining that account to the club without a fee...


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## dougp26364 (Apr 13, 2009)

natarajanv said:


> Thanks Doug for the reply. Yes, they indeed mention that they are waiving the $2995 joiner fee. There was one other 2995 fee also waived , but I am not sure what that one was for.
> 
> Also, they told that I can buy a 4500 point from them at developer prices and then buy a resale 4500 points and then I would not have problem joining that account to the club without a fee...




I suspect there is very little profit for a salesman to push the joiner fee if you buy resale. It sort of defeats their purpose.


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## kauai vacations Kenny (Aug 12, 2009)

We have been owners since the days of the Embassy.  We had our Diamond timeshare presentation a few days ago when the "Dinasour" term was used on my wife and I.  I objected (loudly) and got the attention of all the others in the room.  I think I made my point as it was not mentioned again and may have disrupted other presentations (we were all owners).  Anyway, I do believe the building maintenance is better now than when Sunterra had control.  Dinasour Kenny


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Aug 12, 2009)

The DRI Club program is essentially Club Sunterra carried forward under a new name.  I expect that Diamond will have little hesitancy making changes in Club operations that they believe are worthwhile and prudent (and to them "prudent" certainly encompasses "more profitable".



dougp26364 said:


> Yes and no. It just seems to depend on which way the wind is blowing.
> 
> From what I've read, they'll tell you that, if you buy at developer prices, they'll waive the $2,995 joiner fee for THE Club. If they claim to be waiving a joiner fee, then a joiner fee must exist and be offered or they could have a problem.
> 
> ...


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## Kauai Kid (Aug 12, 2009)

kauai vacations Kenny said:


> We have been owners since the days of the Embassy.  We had our Diamond timeshare presentation a few days ago when the "Dinasour" term was used on my wife and I.  I objected (loudly) and got the attention of all the others in the room.  I think I made my point as it was not mentioned again and may have disrupted other presentations (we were all owners).  Anyway, I do believe the building maintenance is better now than when Sunterra had control.  Dinasour Kenny



Kenny:  During the presentation last year they were playing good guy/bad guy sales tactics with us to convert the deed to points for an outrageous sum of money.  A polite no three times was ignored.  With me usually it is 3 strikes and you are out.

The fourth time I said "*What Part of No Don't You Understand*" loud enough to be heard in Hanalei.  We were out of there in 4 minutes.:hysterical: 

I'll never attend an "owners meeting" again or buy any DRI timeshare.


Sterling


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## rmb (Aug 13, 2009)

> If you are an owner at The Point and have booked a week be prepared for some changes when you check in  -  Kauai Kid


We used to own an annual 2 BR Float/Float at 'Embassy Poipu'... back in 'the good 'ol days'.  The things that attracted me to this property:

- ability to make reservations 365 days out and SECURE a particular unit if it was availabl - You could request 3 units and get confirmation within a couple of days via email.
* I still remember the 3-4 of us standing in line around midnight making sure we secure our week(s) for the next year!  That's how much we loved the place and how much effort we would put forth to take advantage of the resort's policies and offerings.

CAN YOU STILL DO THIS?  NO

- the evening reception
* there was something very warm, pleasant and almost magical when many of the owners would congregate in the lobby between 4-6 PM, enjoy a cold beer or mai tai on the house, snack on some chips and salsa, and sometimes enjoy some local musicians.... really a nice piece to the vacation (although it often disrupted your appetite since it was so close to dinner time!).

CAN YOU STILL DO THIS?  NO

- the friendliness, warmth, and hospitality shown by the local workers at the resort... those memories will always last and it doesn't surprise me that you are noticing 'stress' on the employees' faces.  It is all a 'connection', and if the resort is not connecting with the owners, the trickle down effect will be very evident and genuine.

No, I must admit - I am very, very pleased to have gotten out from under this resort's transition started several years ago.  I now own Pono Kai (paid less than $2000 for an EOY 2 BR Float-Float), once again enjoy the policy of requesting a particular unit during a particular week and getting IMMEDIATE confirmation that it is available or not... and while the Pono Kai may not be as flashy as the Embassy, the resort still shines for us and the 'Ohana' feel that we used to experience at Embassy is alive and well.

It's a sad case to hear all the negativity about the former Embassy Poipu... I remember the day when every word spoken about the resort was positive and refreshing.


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## aliikai2 (Aug 13, 2009)

*We also used to own at the Embassy,*



rmb said:


> >
> No, I must admit - I am very, very pleased to have gotten out from under this resort's transition started several years ago.  I now own Pono Kai (paid less than $2000 for an EOY 2 BR Float-Float), once again enjoy the policy of requesting a particular unit during a particular week and getting IMMEDIATE confirmation that it is available or not... and while the Pono Kai may not be as flashy as the Embassy, the resort still shines for us and the 'Ohana' feel that we used to experience at Embassy is alive and well.



We also used to own at the Embassy and sold in 2002 for most of what we had paid retail, bought 3 weeks at the Pono Kai, 2 bedroom float, and have been very pleased and happy with our change.

 My wife and I enjoy the PK so much more than the EVR, it is just home to us.

 I know Steve and some other feel the same way about the Point, but it was just not for us.

The flat 11 acres of the PK, versus the up and down of the Point, for Joyce makes all the difference. 

fwiw,

Greg


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## lv_maui (Aug 14, 2009)

rmb said:


> >
> - the evening reception
> * there was something very warm, pleasant and almost magical when many of the owners would congregate in the lobby between 4-6 PM, enjoy a cold beer or mai tai on the house, snack on some chips and salsa, and sometimes enjoy some local musicians.... really a nice piece to the vacation (although it often disrupted your appetite since it was so close to dinner time!).
> 
> CAN YOU STILL DO THIS?  NO



Again, this was funded by the developer and once the developer goes away, then the freebies go away.  You get what you pay for.  Do you want the maintenance fees to go up and provide this service?  The majority of the owners would vote no.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Aug 15, 2009)

They have cut back extensively on the incentives for attending the "owners update".  No longer can you get the incentives credited against next year's maintenance fee.

Also, in a totally idiotic move, they don't do separate sales presentations when there are multiple family groups travelling together. Instead, they put everyone in one tour, and each added party gets a $50 added incentive.

Totally ridiculous, because as anyone who has been involved in sales knows, each decision maker has their own approach to making decisions.  So when you  have two or three separate decision makers sitting together in a presentation, you can't put make an optimized presentation.

My son sat through the presentation, and thought it stupid, largely because the sales person was pitching to DW and I, whereas my son's issues are totally different.


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## lv_maui (Aug 16, 2009)

That is totally stupid and hokey for such a high level resort such as Poipu.  Wow, they are really doing this?????  Next, they will be doing podium sales pitches!!


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## Lee B (Aug 16, 2009)

*Speaking of Changin'*

I remember years ago when the Embassy management believed that their resort was so special that they told RCI to allow no exchange when the deposit was a non-Embassy Hawaii interval.  All those other resorts responded by telling RCI not to allow an exchange for an Embassy deposit, nyah.  

Is this still going on?


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## rickandcindy23 (Aug 16, 2009)

Lee B said:


> I remember years ago when the Embassy management believed that their resort was so special that they told RCI to allow no exchange when the deposit was a non-Embassy Hawaii interval.  All those other resorts responded by telling RCI not to allow an exchange for an Embassy deposit, nyah.
> 
> Is this still going on?



I don't think this is the case anymore.  I think that was an Embassy thing.  I know what you are talking about because we went to a sales pitch on our first Hawaii visit 9 years ago.  We exchanged into the Point and had the sales person treat our Colorado summer week like we only received this exchange out of charity.  Then he talked about the exclusive exchange privileges, which would keep any other Hawaii resort from trading into the Point.  We had no intention of buying a Hawaii week back then, so I thought it odd for a salesperson to make such a big deal about it.  He showed us the list of resort not allowed into his resort.  It was such a joke.  :rofl: 

Does Point at Poipu have a bridge to make the twin beds into a king?  I didn't want to get one of these weeks for my sister, but I may add it to my list of possibilites.


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## Kauai Kid (Aug 16, 2009)

Don't know about the "bridge" for the bed but you may need a "bridge loan" for the next maintenance fee and special assessment.  :hysterical: 


Sterling


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## rickandcindy23 (Aug 16, 2009)

Kauai Kid said:


> Don't know about the "bridge" for the bed but you may need a "bridge loan" for the next maintenance fee and special assessment.  :hysterical:
> 
> 
> Sterling



Well, I would just be getting an exchange.  The last exchange I got was in a garden level in the building by the parking lot.  I wasn't sure I wanted my sister and her best friend to celebrate their 50th birthdays in a unit at Poipu, since they assign exchangers those units, but hey, it's Kauai, the resort is clean, and I think they would love it there.  They will just need to go somewhere to watch the whales.


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## pedro47 (Aug 16, 2009)

What is happening in DRI from the CEO and his staff about making Diamond International a great company for timeshare owners & Club members ?


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## Kauai Kid (Aug 17, 2009)

aliikai2 said:


> We also used to own at the Embassy and sold in 2002 for most of what we had paid retail, bought 3 weeks at the Pono Kai, 2 bedroom float, and have been very pleased and happy with our change.
> 
> My wife and I enjoy the PK so much more than the EVR, it is just home to us.
> 
> ...



I'd sell our two ocean front weeks at the Point if I could get some of what we paid in return.  Not a handicapped friendly resort.  PK sounds ideal for us older folks.

Sterling


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## rmb (Aug 17, 2009)

lv_maui said:


> Again, this was funded by the developer and once the developer goes away, then the freebies go away.  You get what you pay for.  Do you want the maintenance fees to go up and provide this service?  The majority of the owners would vote no.



Sounds to me like they are doing both... cutting the services AND raising maintenance fees!


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## pedro47 (Aug 17, 2009)

The Top Brass is monitoring this web site and Timeshare Forum web site.


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## lv_maui (Aug 17, 2009)

pedro47 said:


> The Top Brass is monitoring this web site and Timeshare Forum web site.




Pedro, what would be the reason that you psoted this?  That you were contacted by them for a previous post?  Wss it a libel warning?


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Aug 17, 2009)

pedro47 said:


> The Top Brass is monitoring this web site and Timeshare Forum web site.



Tell us something new. They have been actively monitoring TUG for at least six years.  

When we stayed at Ka'anapali in 2003 I posted an unflattering message about the resort.  The next day the Ka'anapali resort manager left a message on my voice mail, requesting a meeting with me.  When we met he indicated that he had been told of my post by a Sunterra VP and was directed to followup with me.


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## mwengler (Oct 12, 2009)

*Does DRI buy float-float units?*



dougp26364 said:


> I'm not emotionally attached to my deed. I'll sell it back to DRI anytime they want to make me a reasonable offer........and actually follow through with it.



We are a float-float owner from the Embassy days (1996).  Does diamond make straight cash offers for units to go in to the trust?

I have done only one sales presentation where they tried to make the points systems sound as good as they had made RCI sound back in the day.  It was my first exposure to points so I spent my whole time trying to figure out what all the catches were.  

Cheers,
Mike


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## lv_maui (Oct 12, 2009)

I have never heard of straght cash offers for units to go into the trust.


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