# Paying to get a the Wyndham 'first owner' perks



## kinchigirl (Jul 30, 2009)

I have 3 priorities when it comes to my Wyndham vacationing:

1. Get my 11 -13 window APR at certain resorts
2. work my way to Permanent Platinum Status ( I love the perks...got a 2 year taste of it)
3. work with 1 trusted Wyndham Advisor

Is this a far-fetched wish list?  

I recently met with a rep to devise some plan to have these priorities met.  I was told that he is wasn't a sales rep, but more of a marketer.  However, said person would be happy to answer my questions.  Said Marketer's status is with the President Club and, therefore, ONLY really works with VIP members.  Said Marketer emphasized that my points would go far with the use of Extra Holidays (which intrigued me quite a bit).  Said Marketer also offered a more exclusive & personal service should I buy from them. Said Marketer also said it was of no interest to 'sell' me something since there was no incentives in it for them, however, to be involved in Extra Vacations was something worth Said marketer's time.

I liked Said Marketer and would like to have the opportunity to work further with this person. I did not buy that day...nor will I buy without sufficient satisfactory information.  I can play hardball too.  My objective is to vacation for life whenever I like with Platinum perks.  At this juncture, I want to buy till I get permanent platinum status and then buy resales.

Thoughts?  Comments? Contests?


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## bnoble (Jul 30, 2009)

I've heard many promises along the lines of "I'll help you manage your account after you buy."  Usually, it's hogwash.  I vaguely recall reading of one salesperson with WVO who actually did, but I can't recall her name.

If you are serious, you should look into various ways to reduce the cost of getting to Platinum status.  In particular, consider buying a couple larger units that would be eligible for red-time PIC status together with a smaller developer purchase.

I would also advise that you spend a little time convincing yourself that the Platinum benefits are worth the cost differential between a developer purchase and a resale purchase---at the moment, it's more than an order of magnitude.  I think the general consensus is that the perks are not worth the price, but they might be to you.  Also know that Wyndham has a history of watering down VIP perks.

Finally, you'll want to be sure that ARP is really necessary for the usage you have in mind.  In many cases it is not needed.  Even when it is, you can get ARP at a resort by buying resale there too.


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## timeos2 (Jul 30, 2009)

*There is no question at any price. Retail is far too much for way too little*



kinchigirl said:


> I have 3 priorities when it comes to my Wyndham vacationing:
> 
> 1. Get my 11 -13 window APR at certain resorts
> 2. work my way to Permanent Platinum Status ( I love the perks...got a 2 year taste of it)
> ...



Strong thoughts. Is it worth not hundreds or even thousands but TENS of thousands of dollars for what you admit are a few perks? You would be paying an outrageous price. If you want it and can afford it then enjoy. But there is no possible way to get the cost down to anything near what you can buy non-VIP points for (as VIP can now only be obtained through the 90%+ premium cost of direct developer points purchase) so you had better REALLY love those perks and know what you paid to have them. I could never justify it but maybe you feel you can. 

I'd simply buy enough inexpensive points to do what I wanted in the system and IF (as it hardly ever seems to occur) I get hit with a small fee or two or using some extra points that I could have saved with VIP I chalk up the few dollars spent vs the incredible cost difference of purchasing retail & smile all the way to my unit. It just doesn't make any sense to pay those prices IMO.


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## ilenekm (Jul 30, 2009)

kinchigirl said:


> I have 3 priorities when it comes to my Wyndham vacationing:
> 
> 1. Get my 11 -13 window APR at certain resorts
> 2. work my way to Permanent Platinum Status ( I love the perks...got a 2 year taste of it)
> ...



I am a permanent Platinum VIP and yes, I probably did pay too much for it.  I do however enjoy the perks of being Platinum.  My husband and I really enjoy weekend getaways and take between 6-10 per year.  If I were a regular owner, I would not be able to do this.  With the 50% point discount at 60 days, I can get twice as many weekends for the same amount of points. I also never have to worry about reservation transactions or housekeeping credits.  

There is also the part of me that believes that if some of us were not willing to pay retail, then there wouldnt be any new resorts developed for everyone to enjoy. 

My goal is to become Presidential Reserve at some time in the future but for now I really truly enjoy the perks that I have

Ilene


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## timeos2 (Jul 30, 2009)

*You paid upfront rather than on demand (and most likely paid far more)*



ilenekm said:


> I am a permanent Platinum VIP and yes, I probably did pay too much for it.  I do however enjoy the perks of being Platinum.  My husband and I really enjoy weekend getaways and take between 6-10 per year.  If I were a regular owner, I would not be able to do this.  With the 50% point discount at 60 days, I can get twice as many weekends for the same amount of points. I also never have to worry about reservation transactions or housekeeping credits.



What you choose to ignore is you DID pay far more than the cost of the few points and maybe a few fees to get those 6-10 weekends - you paid it in the 90%+ extra you could have saved with resale. It is by no means free. Had you paid resale price you likely would never spend close to the total you paid for purchase even without considering annual fees. It simply isn't "a good deal".


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## GadgetRick (Jul 30, 2009)

ilenekm said:


> There is also the part of me that believes that if some of us were not willing to pay retail, then there wouldnt be any new resorts developed for everyone to enjoy.


Well, thanks for taking one for the team then...


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## Goofyhobbie (Jul 30, 2009)

*Thank You!*



> *ilenekm* said: There is also the part of me that believes that if some of us were not willing to pay retail, then there wouldnt be any new resorts developed for everyone to enjoy.



I too want to thank you for taking the hit for the team. 

Obviously you are fortunate enough financially to pay the hefty price and not miss the money. 

If the UPFRONT costs means that little and you feel the PERKS currently available to you are worth the cost continue to spend the bucks to support the overworked Wyndham Marketing Folks and the stockholders of Wyndham. 

While, I am thanking you I should also be thanking the four families who together paid $60,146 for the 469,000 points that I recently purchased re-sale so that I could get ARP at Myrtle Beach, SC.

Had they not paid Wyndham 13 cents a point up front and thereby provided Wyndham with the incentive to build such nice resorts, I would not have been given the opportunity to buy their contracts re-sale.

Including my total closing costs and transfer costs I paid the whopping sum of $1,701.88 for the same property that they paid $60,146.00.

My SUNK COST turned out to be just a little over 1/3 of a cent per point while their cost was almost 13 cents per point. 

Going forward I am "investing the difference" at 5.01% in a local bank.

The interest that I get each month (Roughly $244) will more than cover the occasional time that I need to deposit a full complement of points versus 50% off to get two or three day extra vacations.  With that interest I can easily afford to pay for any extra perks that I might want that you get for free.

Again Thank You for Doing What I was Not willing to do.


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## timeos2 (Jul 31, 2009)

*How much wood would a wood chuck chuck if a wood chuck could chuck points?*



Goofyhobbie said:


> My SUNK COST turned out to be just a little over 1/3 of a cent per point while their cost was almost 13 cents per point.
> 
> Going forward I am "investing the difference" at 5.01% in a local bank.
> 
> ...



Good job clearly pointing out that the "savings" of the so called perks of VIP as well as the "discounts" are far from free. In three lifetimes of those so called perks there is no way to get back even on a retail purchase vs a resale even if the total difference was only half the $60,000 it represents. 

The gyrations that the mind goes through to justify the expense of retail vs resale is truly self-delusion to the max. No actual look at the figures could ever result in a "I'll pay retail to get a 50% point discount vs saving $30,000 hard dollars in purchase cost" decision. It is like the DVC owner who thinks that they "can always sell for what I paid" thus ignoring the fact that no one will pay the same for a RTU that has fewer years left and that carry some of the highest fee commitments in the industry. It somehow feels good to think your choices were right despite facts that say it ws a colossal mistake!   If you enjoy it great but don't kid yourself that the tens of thousands you could have really saved somehow got you even more savings. Won't happen.


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## timeos2 (Jul 31, 2009)

*Pay no attention to that rattle near my tail - it's just bling*



kinchigirl said:


> I have 3 priorities when it comes to my Wyndham vacationing:
> 
> 1. Get my 11 -13 window APR at certain resorts
> 2. work my way to Permanent Platinum Status ( I love the perks...got a 2 year taste of it)
> ...



By the way why did this one post wonder show up praising outrageously  overpriced retail Wyndham Points then disappear without even a second "says who?" reply?  Seems like a new sales shill looking to be a "Trusted (like a snake) Wyndham Adviser" to some poor slobs who buy into the hype.  Guess we shut it down.


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## WeLovetoTravel (Jul 31, 2009)

I Just had to throw my 2 cents in too! We are permanent Gold VIP. Do we love the few perks that we get? Yes! absolutely. We love being able to take last minute long weekend get-aways and do them at point discounts, get upgrades, and not worry about housekeeping credits. Was VIP it worth the money invested? NO WAY!!!
We wish we would have discovered this board 6 years ago!
-Deb


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## donnaval (Jul 31, 2009)

What I want to know is--where can I get 5% interest?????


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## Carol C (Jul 31, 2009)

donnaval said:


> What I want to know is--where can I get 5% interest?????



Yeah, tell us that Mr Know-It-:rofl: All!


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## sandkastle4966 (Jul 31, 2009)

and FYI- RARP is 10-11 Months, not 11-13 months.  Excludes holiday weeks and spring break/easter, and excludes summer at MB.


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## Goofyhobbie (Jul 31, 2009)

*You Asked For It*



> *Carol C said: * Yeah, tell us that Mr Know-It- All!



Carol,

Appreciate your joke; but, what I said is definitley no joke. 

I don't consider myself a know-it-All; but I have been around the block a few times and over the years I have tried to learn something new every day. 

If sharing what I know with folks here helps them so be it. If they choose to ignore anything that I impart that's O. K. also.  But, never let it be said that I don't do my research.  The opinions that I express are based on that Research and my personal experience.  If I personally state that I have done this or that, I assure you I can back it up.   

There are many banks more than willing to pay a savvy customer 5.01% on a checking account that has as little as $100.00 up to $25,000. If you have more than that to put in your checking account you can open additional accounts. 

The savings that I have encountered buying Re-Sale over the years has enabled me to open several such accounts.

Rather than publicly tell you exactly where I opened the accounts I will simply give you some simple direction and you can determine which Bank you would like to do business with.  By the way some of these banks will pay as much as 6.01 %; but I chose to do business with a Brick & Mortar FDIC Insured Bank in the city where I reside.  That same bank allows me access 24 hours a day 7 days a week throughout the United States at no additional cost to yours truly. 

http://www.highyieldcheckingdeals.com/

Hope you have learned something new today.


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## Goofyhobbie (Jul 31, 2009)

*Clarification*



> *sandkastle4966 said:* and FYI- RARP is 10-11 Months, not 11-13 months. Excludes holiday weeks and spring break/easter, and excludes summer at MB.



Advance Reservation Priority (ARP) privileges vary by different membership types, as specifically described in a member's membership documents.

Not sure what you mean by RARP, however participants in the Wyndham Vacation Owners Points Trust who have a Wyndham home Resort at Wyndham Ocean Boulevard can use *A*dvanced *R*eservation *P*riority (*ARP*) to make a reservation at any of the four Wyndham Resorts in the Myrtle Beach area without regard to whether or not the period of time reserved involves a holiday or the Summer.  

An ARP reservation can only be booked between 13 months and the start of the Standard 10 Month out reservation period provided the amount of points necessary is available for the use-year and contract.  Re-sale contracts are eligible for ARP.


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## sandkastle4966 (Jul 31, 2009)

RARP is not ARP.  It is a VIP benefit (Gold level I think) - Reciprical ARP - essentially ARP rights at all resorts at 11 months ( with the fine print of course)


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## Goofyhobbie (Aug 1, 2009)

*Good Information*

*sandkastle4966,*
Thanks for the information. That is the first thing I learned on Aug 1, 2009. 
Looks like another good learning day has occurred.:hysterical: 

*timeos2,* Although I did not call the OP out with my initial first post in this thread, you probably could tell from my attitude that I too recognized the one post wonder as a probable sales schill if not an outright TROLL. 

Must be frustrating to those individuals to know that there are a lot of folks who check in here to get the facts either shortly after sitting through a presentation or before sitting through a presentation.  No doubt they periodically post under different USER NAMES to make a subtle pitch or get us all riled up here on the Board. The clue for me was the last three words that the one post wonder used - THOUGHTS? COMMENTS? CONTEST?

I just could not resist pointing out the fallacy in the poster's argument.


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## donnaval (Aug 1, 2009)

Thanks for that link about the checking accounts, goofyhobbie.  Drat, the two paying 5% in my state are 1)A bank with only a ** (below peer) rating on Bankrate, and 2)A credit union where I don't qualify to be a member.


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## Jya-Ning (Aug 1, 2009)

The op has made 2 or 3 posts in Wyndham site.  I guess maybe she does not want to tell the detail after the 1st post here.

But you made money so you can spend to your fit, otherwise, there will be no reason someone paying several hundred thousands just to have lunch with Warren Buffet.

But there is no way pure based on money calculation to make it works.

Jya-Ning


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## kinchigirl (Aug 1, 2009)

timeos2 said:


> By the way why did this one post wonder show up praising outrageously  overpriced retail Wyndham Points then disappear without even a second "says who?" reply?  Seems like a new sales shill looking to be a "Trusted (like a snake) Wyndham Adviser" to some poor slobs who buy into the hype.  Guess we shut it down.



Wow.  there is no reason to have a nasty tone.  I'm not a sales person...just an owner who happened to find this blog and was really happy to finally have found others I can brainstorm with to make better decisions. 

Thanks to all for the information.  Rather than posting another thing (to apparently validate me) I was busy reading every kind of post imaginable regarding timeshare resales and am getting more convinced that resale is smarter.

I bought retail 3 years ago in Hawaii.  They kept us there the whole day...and mostly because we had a trillion questions that we wanted satisfactory answers to.  I already knew of resales back then and brought it up at the T/S presentation.  I asked, why shouldn't I buy resale?  I was told that the points would not be honored like retail points.  My bad that I believed them....

We were sold---victims of a bait & switch type technique.  They were pushing for us to spend near $85K for 495K points.  Upon my resale question, we were 'miraculously' offered a week selling @ $40K for 500K pts + throwing in another 500K for two years so we could experience VIP Platinum.

That's our story.  We've been happy with Wyndham (not including all the owner updates we've had to endure each time afterward).  We would like to enjoy the use of more points.  As I read through all the posts here, I am seeing the 'light'.

Except for the demeaning remarks, I say thank you to everyone for the thoughts and comments on this.   It really isn't necessary to make someone feel stupid for buying retail in the first place.  It's better to teach the possibilities outside of the box than reprimanding those who were mislead into it.


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## kinchigirl (Aug 1, 2009)

WeLovetoTravel said:


> I Just had to throw my 2 cents in too! We are permanent Gold VIP. Do we love the few perks that we get? Yes! absolutely. We love being able to take last minute long weekend get-aways and do them at point discounts, get upgrades, and not worry about housekeeping credits. Was VIP it worth the money invested? NO WAY!!!
> We wish we would have discovered this board 6 years ago!
> -Deb



Amen.  I'm with you all the way on this.


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## kinchigirl (Aug 1, 2009)

> *timeos2,* Although I did not call the OP out with my initial first post in this thread, you probably could tell from my attitude that I too recognized the one post wonder as a probable sales schill if not an outright TROLL.
> 
> Must be frustrating to those individuals to know that there are a lot of folks who check in here to get the facts either shortly after sitting through a presentation or before sitting through a presentation.  No doubt they periodically post under different USER NAMES to make a subtle pitch or get us all riled up here on the Board. The clue for me was the last three words that the one post wonder used - THOUGHTS? COMMENTS? CONTEST?
> 
> I just could not resist pointing out the fallacy in the poster's argument.



I assure you.  I'm an owner and cute too (my husband is behind that last part 100% LOL).   But it does bother me that there actually might be sales people here TROLL-ing this site and infiltrating a place where we one can be REAL.


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## kinchigirl (Aug 1, 2009)

Jya-Ning said:


> The op has made 2 or 3 posts in Wyndham site.  I guess maybe she does not want to tell the detail after the 1st post here.
> 
> Jya-Ning



Thanks for validating me Jya.  I have actually been on the Wyndham site over the last 2 days because I forgot how to get back to this site!  Lots of great info there too!


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## timeos2 (Aug 1, 2009)

*Thanks for the update*



kinchigirl said:


> Wow.  there is no reason to have a nasty tone.  I'm not a sales person...just an owner who happened to find this blog and was really happy to finally have found others I can brainstorm with to make better decisions.
> 
> I bought retail 3 years ago in Hawaii.  They kept us there the whole day...and mostly because we had a trillion questions that we wanted satisfactory answers to.  I already knew of resales back then and brought it up at the T/S presentation.  I asked, why shouldn't I buy resale?  I was told that the points would not be honored like retail points.  My bad that I believed them....
> 
> ...



Sorry - sounds like you aren't a shill (they HAVE dropped by before so we're always on guard for such posts). 

Please think through any purchase you make and be SURE it makes sense to go retail rather than resale. Remember the points are the same but the cost is day and night different. It seems unlikely there is any combination that makes the extra upfront expense worth it vs the incredible value and cost savings of additional resale points. Keep recalling how convincing thye sounded until you found out the truth for yourself.  If you decide that retail makes sense then so be it but at least be fully informed prior to such a choice.


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## kinchigirl (Aug 1, 2009)

*Dear John...*

S'okay.  I just wanted to make sure that I didn't get stuck with a stigma.

We're cool.  I'm here to learn and make the most of my Wyndham Deed!


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## Goofyhobbie (Aug 1, 2009)

*Apology*

Kinchigirl,

I too apologize to you if in fact you are just another individual who just happened to get caught in the web thrown out by Wyndham's Marketing department.

It is just that we get so many Schill's and/or Trolls here that we have become accustomed to them. If we stepped on your toes it was because of the fact that you posted once with a specific challenge to the group and then did not return until now.

We are now giving you the benefit of the doubt and we are welcoming you to the community. Comeback often and you will learn a great deal.

By the way due to Jya-Ning's post above I found where you had posted at the other site and provided an addition to that thread. Hope the information is enlightening.


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## BocaBum99 (Aug 1, 2009)

donnaval said:


> What I want to know is--where can I get 5% interest?????



Getting 5% interest as a consumer is the wrong question.  Goofy expressed the problem incorrectly.

What he should have done is characterized the 5% as a cost of capital.  In other words, where could you get a 5% loan.  By doing that, you can make an apples to apples comparison of two alternatives.

First alternative is renting for cash with no upfront fees.

Second is the alternative of borrowing the money at 5% so that both options required no upfront fees.  

Then, you discount the future anticipated costs to compare the alternatives.

When you do that analysis, the VIP benefits are indeed not worth it because it is cheaper just to buy cheap points, pay twice the maintenance fees instead of getting the 50% discount in the 60-day window and saving the upfrontn capital.


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## Goofyhobbie (Aug 1, 2009)

*No Problem*

BocaBum,

I really am not that serious.  I did not pose a question and did not attempt to solve a problem.

My comments referred to my personal experience and my analysis after the fact.  As far as I am concerned I did what was best for yours truly. :whoopie: 

I take it you are an MBA or an Accountant who methodically analyzes the business question before proceeding. Good for you!

Naturally *BEFORE* making a major purchase it makes sense to consider Finance Cost or the cost of Capital used to make the purchase.  Also, one should consider the time value of money, anticipated cost of renting over time and the cost of maintenance and fees over time with Inflation considered in the equation. 

When I made my post I was presenting the situation after the fact. 

Being a little Goofy, I made my decision in a simple straight-forward way. I decided to BUY but did so as inexpensively as possible.

For the most part that was the end of my analysis.   My SUNK COST ($1,701.88) came out of current funds and I did not have to borrow anything. 

The cost of money analysis meant nothing to me because my funds did not have to be borrowed and once spent represented SUNK COST.

My point to the average Consumer is one can pay $60,146 or $1,702 and invest the savings.  That savings ($58,444) if invested at 5.01% throws off enough interest to more than pay for any VIP benefits that are not included in a RE-SALE purchase. 

Here is what I said:



> Including my total closing costs and transfer costs I paid the whopping sum of $1,701.88 for the same property that they paid $60,146.00.
> 
> My SUNK COST turned out to be just a little over 1/3 of a cent per point while their cost was almost 13 cents per point.
> 
> ...



When donnaval posted the question quoted below I interpreted the question as simply another Consumer asking where he could make a good Consumer decision and get a 5% return on money saved.  



> *Originally Posted by donnaval  *
> What I want to know is--where can I get 5% interest?????


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## bnoble (Aug 1, 2009)

> We've been happy with Wyndham (not including all the owner updates we've had to endure each time afterward).


You know, you don't _have_ to go to "owner updates."  I never do.  When I go do the _parking pass tango_ with "owner services" (a.k.a sales) I politely but firmly decline their request to schedule an update.  If they push, I simply respond with, "I would be wasting your time."

Usually, that's that.


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## kinchigirl (Aug 1, 2009)

bnoble said:


> You know, you don't _have_ to go to "owner updates."  I never do.  When I go do the _parking pass tango_ with "owner services" (a.k.a sales) I politely but firmly decline their request to schedule an update.  If they push, I simply respond with, "I would be wasting your time."
> 
> Usually, that's that.



I will definitely keep that in mind!  Each and everytime I've prepared myself for the update and actually sometimes looked forward to it because I wanted answers.  But now that I'm with like minded owners in this forum I can avoid the parking pass tango and go straight to enjoying my vacation.


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## kinchigirl (Aug 1, 2009)

*BTW..this is me*

Hi!  I'm Kiani!

[IMGL]http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v674/215/82/1058762516/n1058762516_30234320_5246.jpg[/IMGL]


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## donnaval (Aug 1, 2009)

>When donnaval posted the question quoted below I interpreted the question as simply another Consumer asking where he could make a good Consumer decision and get a 5% return on money saved.<

You interpreted my question correctly, Goofy.  The pittance I've spent on acquiring my timeshares is already spent and value received.  At today's interest rates I couldn't even buy a decent cup of coffee with the interest I would earn if I still had that cash.  Well, maybe if I go to McDonald's on Mocha Monday...

The "hanging around" money is where I'd like to get that 5%.  The interest would pay some of the MFs!


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## AwayWeGo (Aug 7, 2009)

*Just Because That's How It Was Doesn't Mean That's How It Always Will Be.*




ilenekm said:


> There is also the part of me that believes that if some of us were not willing to pay retail, then there wouldnt be any new resorts developed for everyone to enjoy.


Click here for a different philosophical perspective on that.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## Unionite (Aug 21, 2009)

Not every decision is financially driven.  It's obvious that resale is a much better choice financially.  But so is buying a used car.  And not buying a TS at all.  But after spending everything earned raising a family and investing in the kids education, there comes a time when investing in yourself, via perks, is enjoyable.  I don't view retail purchases as a subsidy to resale purchasers, rather a choice I've made to enjoy myself (and for my children to enjoy when I pass).  And if your assigned personal advisor isn't satifying your expectations, who's problem is it?  Get one that does.


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