# Amex and Costco



## Julian926 (Feb 13, 2015)

With Costco removing Amex as its credit card, are Amex users feeling neglecting about the reduction of choices and benefits?

Would love to hear from Amex users.


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## gmarine (Feb 13, 2015)

Its only one store, thats not a reduction of much at all.  Costco will end up taking MC and/or Visa. No big deal.


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## presley (Feb 13, 2015)

It doesn't matter to me, other than I am used to using my card there when I don't have enough cash.  I don't carry the traditional bank credit cards because I don't like big banks.  I can bring a check.

I think it is a bad choice for Costco to remove the card.  My local Costco pushes their American Express card all the time.  I never got one, but I can imagine what it would be like to believe all the promises they make about the benefits of having the card and then they decide that they won't accept it.

-1 Costco


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## Quiet Pine (Feb 13, 2015)

gmarine said:


> Its only one store...No big deal.



According to this, it's all stores--starting next year.
"(Reuters) - American Express Co said it will stop issuing credit cards co-branded with Costco Wholesale Corp in the United States from March 31, 2016.

Costco has already replaced American Express with Capital One Financial Corp as its credit-card issuer in Canada starting this year."


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## gmarine (Feb 13, 2015)

Quiet Pine said:


> According to this, it's all stores--starting next year.
> "(Reuters) - American Express Co said it will stop issuing credit cards co-branded with Costco Wholesale Corp in the United States from March 31, 2016.
> 
> Costco has already replaced American Express with Capital One Financial Corp as its credit-card issuer in Canada starting this year."



Yes, of course its all Costco stores.


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## sjsharkie (Feb 13, 2015)

gmarine said:


> Its only one store, thats not a reduction of much at all.  Costco will end up taking MC and/or Visa. No big deal.



No big deal for you, but this is huge for AMEX. Costco has over $100B in sales per year, of which a healthy amount goes to the one and only credit card issuer that they have had for the last 12 years (in the US -- Canada has already changed to MC).  AMEX was down over 8% yesterday on the news.

I have a Costco cobranded card which will be replaced as well once the relationship ends.  I've had that card for over 15 years -- so this will likely divert a good chunk of my business over to MC.

I like AMEX and their customer service.  But this will cause a huge impact on my personal usage (as I tend to drive all purchases towards one card).

-ryan


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## LAX Mom (Feb 13, 2015)

I'll miss the AMEX Costco rebate check. Just cashed one yesterday for $250! 

I use my Costco AMEX for all Costco purchases & gas. Almost everything else goes on my Marriott VISA for Marriott reward points. Without the Costco rebate, I'll likely just use the VISA for everything.


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## DaveNV (Feb 13, 2015)

My spouse is a career Refund Cashier at Costco. Here's the rest of the story:

I'm told the reason they will stop accepting Amex at Costco is because Amex was demanding even more from Costco if the contract with them is renewed.  You've no doubt noticed how hard your local Costco has been pushing signups for Amex over the last several years. That's because Amex REQUIRED it in the contract. But no matter how many signups for the card Costco got, it was never enough for Amex. They wanted more and more, and Costco felt they had already done enough for them. Even though nobody at Costco works on commission, Costco employees were REQUIRED to push Amex signups to members, or risk being fired.  This kind of pressure goes against the Costco business model, and when Amex pushed for even more, Costco pushed back.  Costco is in negotiations with other card merchants, to see if an equitable agreement can be reached. I'm told Capital One is currently ahead of the rest.

Stay tuned to Costco as things move forward.  I'm sure they'll arrange something. If you've been a member there long enough, you'll remember there was a time when Costco didn't accept any credit cards at all.

Dave


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## Luanne (Feb 13, 2015)

Dave, we still pay by check at Costco.  I always forget they take credit cards.


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## DaveNV (Feb 13, 2015)

Luanne said:


> Dave, we still pay by check at Costco.  I always forget they take credit cards.



I use my debit card, which is the same idea, and easier for me since I rarely carry my checkbook. But to be honest, I don't shop there a lot. Being married to someone who is there every workday, I can usually put in my request for the items I want, and they magically appear on the kitchen counter that evening. It's amazing how that works! 

Dave


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## jsfletch (Feb 13, 2015)

I use my Costco Amex card for almost all my purchases. My rebate checks are in the $500-600+ range for years. Costco is our almost exclusive place for groceries and gas. I only use other cards because someone won't take AMEX. I don't need air miles etc. I want cash back and Costco prices!


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## klpca (Feb 13, 2015)

My rebate check is about $800 annually, which more than covers our membership costs. We will just switch to what ever card they decide to use. We pay our credit card bills in full every month, but use them every chance we can to generate miles/cash rebates. We will definitely close our AMEX account after this.

I heard that they changed from AMEX to Capital One Mastercard in Canada.


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## LAX Mom (Feb 13, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> I use my debit card, which is the same idea, and easier for me since I rarely carry my checkbook. But to be honest, I don't shop there a lot. Being married to someone who is there every workday, I can usually put in my request for the items I want, and they magically appear on the kitchen counter that evening. It's amazing how that works!
> 
> Dave



Haha......my DH does the same thing. Makes a request and it magically appears. However, I don't work there. I just shop there a lot! 

Dave, thanks for the insight into the background behind the AMEX-Costco situation. They really do push the AMEX card sign-ups. I'll just switch to Capital One or whoever issues the new Costco card.


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## Ken555 (Feb 13, 2015)

I have a Discover card (which I no longer use) because at one time that was the only credit card Costco accepted. It doesn't surprise me that AMEX is demanding and that Costco will push back, if nothing else that makes for a good story. 

Ironically, I just applied a few days ago for a MasterCard (Barclaycard) since AMEX still charges 3% foreign transaction fee (I called to complain) and I wanted a real chip and pin credit card. I did this mostly out of principal re the 3% fee as I'm done paying more than I need to while traveling (and paying for foreign services, which I've done more of lately). 

I have no doubt we will hear more about any changes at Costco with sufficient advance notice to make other arrangements. AMEX is typically very good for the consumer but not as good for the merchant (and as a merchant, I can attest to that). 

Costco will still have $5 chicken, so it's all good in perspective. 


Sent from my iPad


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## sjsharkie (Feb 13, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> My spouse is a career Refund Cashier at Costco. Here's the rest of the story:
> 
> I'm told the reason they will stop accepting Amex at Costco is because Amex was demanding even more from Costco if the contract with them is renewed.  You've no doubt noticed how hard your local Costco has been pushing signups for Amex over the last several years. That's because Amex REQUIRED it in the contract. But no matter how many signups for the card Costco got, it was never enough for Amex. They wanted more and more, and Costco felt they had already done enough for them. Even though nobody at Costco works on commission, Costco employees were REQUIRED to push Amex signups to members, or risk being fired.  This kind of pressure goes against the Costco business model, and when Amex pushed for even more, Costco pushed back.  Costco is in negotiations with other card merchants, to see if an equitable agreement can be reached. I'm told Capital One is currently ahead of the rest.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the info.  I'd take this with a grain of salt as there are two sides to every story.

I'm certain merchant fees were a big part of the decision.  Costco knows what they got from Capital One and MC from the Canada move -- likely AMEX couldn't match and/or Costco thought they could do better than what was proposed.

-ryan


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## DaveNV (Feb 13, 2015)

Ken555 said:


> I have a Discover card (which I no longer use) because at one time that was the only credit card Costco accepted. It doesn't surprise me that AMEX is demanding and that Costco will push back, if nothing else that makes for a good story.



I agree.  But when you stop to think about it, if Costco was happy with the Amex arrangement, there wouldn't be any reason to make a change.  So something isn't right with the deal.  Somebody is paying for the privilege to use a credit card, and in this case, I think Amex just got too greedy.

Dave


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## Ken555 (Feb 13, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> I agree.  But when you stop to think about it, if Costco was happy with the Amex arrangement, there wouldn't be any reason to make a change.  So something isn't right with the deal.  Somebody is paying for the privilege to use a credit card, and in this case, I think Amex just got too greedy.
> 
> 
> 
> Dave




You may be completely correct. But, there's always two sides (or more) to a story. Perhaps Costco had negotiated a great deal with AMEX and it was understood years ago that the discounted rate may not be available in future. I'm sure Costco is paying AMEX much less of a fee than I am when my clients uses their AMEX cards. I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that AMEX is getting greedy, in fact it could very well be the other way around. Using the info you provided, it could very well be that the majority of profit AMEX derived from the association with Costco was due to new cardholders and their other purchases away from Costco using their new card that they wouldn't have if not for Costco. 

In the end, I doubt any of us have the whole story.


Sent from my iPad


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## SmithOp (Feb 13, 2015)

Thats my one pet peeve about Costco, the barrage of marketing in store and at the register.  I've complained about the phone and direct tv marketeers that wander the aisles instead of staying at their booth.  Thanks for the insight Dave, didn't realize it was forced by the contracts.


Sent from my iPad using the strange new version of Tapatalk


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## persia (Feb 13, 2015)

Costco in Australia accepts cash, EFTPOS, Visa, MasterCard or Amex (American Express).


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## Passepartout (Feb 13, 2015)

No skin off my nose either way. Amex forced itself out of my wallet years ago, though DW uses the co-branded Costco one. When it is no longer honored, we'll drop- or not renew- it and if the replacement is Cap One, all the better.

Jim


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## sjsharkie (Feb 13, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> I agree.  But when you stop to think about it, if Costco was happy with the Amex arrangement, there wouldn't be any reason to make a change.  So something isn't right with the deal.  Somebody is paying for the privilege to use a credit card, and in this case, I think Amex just got too greedy.
> 
> Dave



I agree that Costco wasn't happy -- but I think it boils down to merchant fees.  

Executives don't care (to a certain extent) about employees having to push cards to consumers at the store -- that will likely happen anyway with the new arrangement.

At the end of the day, I think AMEX had a floor in terms of what they could sustain with respect to merchant fees in the relationship.  Costco thinks they can get below that floor given their current revenue stream.

Of course, everything I say here is conjecture.

-ryan


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## DaveNV (Feb 13, 2015)

Next time you're in Costco, drop by the Membership desk and ask about it. You'll hear the same kind of thing I described. And while I agree there are two sides to every story, I maintain the pressure placed on Costco by Amex was brutal. Those marketing people wandering the aisles pushing Amex would much rather have been out soliciting new businesses to sign up their employees. It would have been better for all concerned, but the unhappy harassed members already know that. 

Dave


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## sjsharkie (Feb 13, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> Next time you're in Costco, drop by the Membership desk and ask about it. You'll hear the same kind of thing I described. And while I agree there are two sides to every story, I maintain the pressure placed on Costco by Amex was brutal. Those marketing people wandering the aisles pushing Amex would much rather have been out soliciting new businesses to sign up their employees. It would have been better for all concerned, but the unhappy harassed members already know that.
> 
> Dave



Dave -- I absolutely believe you that the behavior exists.  I just don't think executives place as much weight on that type of stuff.  It probably was a contributing factor, but I still think if Costco could get the merchant fees where they wanted it to be, this would be an issue that could be worked out.

I'm sure Capital One was pushing those cards in Canada too.  More important for Capital One since any member bank can issue a MC card versus American Express which has a much smaller footprint by comparison of 3rd party banks issuing their cards.

Again, just my opinion.  None of the above is based on facts specific to the Costco/AMEX situation.

-ryan


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## Ken555 (Feb 13, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> Next time you're in Costco, drop by the Membership desk and ask about it. You'll hear the same kind of thing I described. And while I agree there are two sides to every story, I maintain the pressure placed on Costco by Amex was brutal. Those marketing people wandering the aisles pushing Amex would much rather have been out soliciting new businesses to sign up their employees. It would have been better for all concerned, but the unhappy harassed members already know that.
> 
> 
> 
> Dave




Do you honestly think the store employees know the true backstory on the business relationship with AMEX? I find that extremely unlikely.


Sent from my iPad


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## Julian926 (Feb 13, 2015)

Like Ryan mentioned, it's all about the costs..

http://www.wsj.com/articles/costco-says-split-with-amex-related-to-cost-1423849047


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## JudyH (Feb 13, 2015)

Personally, I am glad.  I like their products, but only want to use my air miles VISA card....so I never went there.


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## klpca (Feb 13, 2015)

*Amex also "divorcing" Jet Blue*

busy, busy....

http://seekingalpha.com/news/2299436-bloomberg-amex-also-divorcing-jetblue


"_Fresh off news that its agreement with Costco (NASDAQ:COST) is coming to an end, American Express (NYSE:AXP) is also splitting with JetBlue _"

I couldn't find anything else on this in the 30 seconds that I looked and there's not too much more to the story in the press release but usually Bloomberg is accurate.


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## frank808 (Feb 13, 2015)

Ken555 said:


> Do you honestly think the store employees know the true backstory on the business relationship with AMEX? I find that extremely unlikely.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad


I will confirm that what bmw said about the marketing for amex signups was true.     You would be quiet surprised that costco does share information that matters to the front line workers.  I am not saying it happens all the time at costco.  The employees have regional meetings to get trained for this.  
In the end I believe the main issue was that amex did not want to lower the discount rate for transactions.  So amex said that they would not renew.


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## DaveNV (Feb 13, 2015)

Ken555 said:


> Do you honestly think the store employees know the true backstory on the business relationship with AMEX? I find that extremely unlikely.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad




Not the average store employee.  I'm talking about the Membership/Marketing Department.  I believe the people working that department have a fairly clear understanding of the underlying aspects of the case. They're the ones on the front lines, who are the people processing those Amex applications, and they're the first to face the wrath of ticked off members.  And there have been a LOT of ticked off members.

It may well also be about the fees, too, as you all are saying. It wouldn't surprise me. I know Amex agreed to some things early on, to get their foot in the door. They've altered things a time or two over the years, and may want to change the agreement now to a point that Costco wont agree to it.

As a personal aside, I won't be sorry to see Amex go.  It's time for someone else to have a chance, and I hope it's a Visa/MC company. Especially if rewards are in order. Amex has never been my go-to card for regular use.

Dave


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## IngridN (Feb 13, 2015)

Hmmmm....was at Costco this morning and they're still pushing AmEx. I was going to stop by the table on my way out to ask about the change and what happens to current card holders, but the attendant must have gone to lunch!

Ingrid


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## DaveNV (Feb 13, 2015)

IngridN said:


> Hmmmm....was at Costco this morning and they're still pushing AmEx. I was going to stop by the table on my way out to ask about the change and what happens to current card holders, but the attendant must have gone to lunch!
> 
> Ingrid



I wouldn't expect there to be a change in how things at Costco are done until there is a clear break in the connection with Amex. The Amex card will still be valid for use elsewhere, just not at Costco.

Dave


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## rapmarks (Feb 13, 2015)

just yesterday they had a special display offering a free tote if you signed up for the Amex card.  we got one when my wallet was stolen on the drive to Florida, we had no credit card, debit card, or cash to use and needed gas. I will just go back to our old debit card when they switch, really didn't need this credit card.


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## IngridN (Feb 13, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> I wouldn't expect there to be a change in how things at Costco are done until there is a clear break in the connection with Amex. The Amex card will still be valid for use elsewhere, just not at Costco.
> 
> Dave



It won't unless AmEx issues you another card. Once the relationship is severed that particular card is useless. WSJ is reporting that AmEx will issue replacement cards to those affected. 

Ingrid


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## Luanne (Feb 13, 2015)

JudyH said:


> Personally, I am glad.  I like their products, but only want to use my air miles VISA card....so I never went there.



We shop Costco as we like the products and usually love the prices.  While I do use a credit card that give me miles when I charge, Costco not taking credit cards certainly didn't deter us from shopping there.


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## Ken555 (Feb 13, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> It may well also be about the fees, too, as you all are saying. It wouldn't surprise me. I know Amex agreed to some things early on, to get their foot in the door. They've altered things a time or two over the years, and may want to change the agreement now to a point that Costco wont agree to it.




I suspect this decision is solely made due to cost concerns. The store employees may hear differently in order to deflect the true issue. I would be shocked if internal Costco negotiation details with AMEX were distributed to store employees, and if they are then they will be presented in a way that makes AMEX the guilty party. This is business 1.0. 

Anyway, I've always been surprised that Costco affiliated with any network. I would not be surprised if they launch their own charge card, similar to the store cards available in the 70s and 80s, etc. Of course, it's likely Costco is able to negotiate a fee with a bank to handle this instead for less than doing it themselves. 

For myself, AMEX cards are my primary go to card for both business and personal expenses. I've been quite loyal for a long time, especially since I bought a Starwood timeshare in 2005 and decided I should earn hotel points instead of airline miles with purchases (and I still think that's the best use of a cc program since hotels typically cost more than a flight). 


Sent from my iPad


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## Elan (Feb 13, 2015)

I have the Costco branded Amex card and it's my go to card, but it won't bother me if Costco switches as I've grown tired of Costco.  Their prices on many things just aren't competitive, and it's too difficult to get in and out to buy the items that are priced competitively.  We'll likely keep our membership, but we go less and less.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


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## Luanne (Feb 13, 2015)

Elan said:


> I have the Costco branded Amex card and it's my go to card, but it won't bother me if Costco switches as I've grown tired of Costco.  Their prices on many things just aren't competitive, and it's too difficult to get in and out to buy the items that are priced competitively.  We'll likely keep our membership, but we go less and less.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk



I would keep Costco just for their prices on car rentals.


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## jsfletch (Feb 13, 2015)

I just stopped by my local Costco (Kapolei) and as I was leaving there was a women behind the desk offering Costco Amex cards. I asked her if they were dropping Amex why was she selling cards? She replied that the Amex cards would be good thru 4/16. So what? Why get a card for just a year? Does it save that much?


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## Elan (Feb 13, 2015)

Luanne said:


> I would keep Costco just for their prices on car rentals.


Costco is good for some things.  Bit I've found that if I'm really interested in price shopping, they can almost always be beaten.  What irks me most, however, is that they've strayed from being a decent place to buy family sized portions at reasonable prices to more of a Trader Joe's type selection of prepared meals and specialty foods.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


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## Luanne (Feb 13, 2015)

Elan said:


> Costco is good for some things.  Bit I've found that if I'm really interested in price shopping, they can almost always be beaten.  What irks me most, however, is that they've strayed from being a decent place to buy family sized portions at reasonable prices to more of a Trader Joe's type selection of prepared meals and specialty foods.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk



Really?  We still find ours to have the very large portion sizes...at reasonable prices.  We are now about an hour away from the closest Costco (we used to be about 10 minutes) so we go far less often, but buy more since we need to stock up. We love it for cleaning supplies, paper goods, meats, produce, etc., etc., etc.


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## dioxide45 (Feb 13, 2015)

The problem is that people will need to apply for the new car. Those AmEx card members won't simply be transferred to whatever new credit card Costco start offering. Those card members belong to AmEx. AmEx will simply change the card program offerings of the card.


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## DaveNV (Feb 13, 2015)

This link sheds some light on both sides of this discussion:  http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/story/...nger-take-american-express-starting-next-year

If you read between the lines, it does sound like it comes down to "swipe fees."

Spouse just shared with me an interesting point:  Virtually all Amex cards have some sort of annual fee paid directly to Amex.  Amex has made millions off those fees.  The Costco Amex card does not have an annual fee. The fee paid to Costco was the annual Costco membership fee.  Amex didn't get a piece of that fee.  So some of this breakup could be related to that.  Food for thought.

Dave


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## tante (Feb 14, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> This link sheds some light on both sides of this discussion:  http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/story/...nger-take-american-express-starting-next-year
> 
> If you read between the lines, it does sound like it comes down to "swipe fees."
> 
> ...



I don't understand what you mean. Amex has quite a few cards with no annual fee, even a hilton branded card that gives you status (gold I think).

But you are right, they couldn't come to an agreement on the fees and it was a terrible move for amex. I think I read elsewhere that 8% of their revenue comes from costco. They had access to upper middle class families via costco. And I heard that millionaires are leaving amex to go to chase.


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## IngridN (Feb 14, 2015)

My thought are that if AmEx re-issues the Costco branded cards to regular, no fee, nice rewards, AmEx, they will not lose a lot of $. When I used this card as my go to card for the majority of purchases (have switched to another card that provides slightly better rewards), the purchases made at Costco were a small amount of my monthly charges. I would venture to guess that that might be the case with many others. AmEx is betting that once the dust settles, they'll be OK.

Ingrid


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## Ken555 (Feb 14, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> This link sheds some light on both sides of this discussion:  http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/story/...nger-take-american-express-starting-next-year
> 
> If you read between the lines, it does sound like it comes down to "swipe fees."
> 
> ...




While the annual fee charged for the card does obviously add up, I doubt that's the main profit center for AMEX for their cardholders. I suspect AMEX makes most of their profit on the swipe fee from merchants other than Costco (where I'm certain they pay well below an average fee) and interest charges to cardholders (AMEX is notoriously higher even for the most qualified and now and then I bet they get some fees from them). 

I always thought other AMEX cards offered better benefits than the Costco card, but there's a reason AMEX (and all other banks) offer a variety of card affiliation options.

Also, AMEX has traditionally made very smart business decisions. If they couldn't offer a deal Costco would accept, my inclination is that Costco was demanding too much of a discount, not that AMEX was being "too greedy". Costco is well known to push vendors for better prices as a means of marketing exposure to a larger, more affluent, market. That rationale applies to credit cards as well. 


Sent from my iPad


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## sjsharkie (Feb 14, 2015)

Ken555 said:


> Also, AMEX has traditionally made very smart business decisions. If they couldn't offer a deal Costco would accept, my inclination is that Costco was demanding too much of a discount, not that AMEX was being "too greedy". Costco is well known to push vendors for better prices as a means of marketing exposure to a larger, more affluent, market. That rationale applies to credit cards as well.



There is no question in my mind that AMEX did all the number crunching in the back room, and figured out that they couldn't make the numbers work.  AMEX knew this would be a blow to their share price -- the only way they make this decision is if the numbers don't work for them.

From this article, Costco likely had a bidding war going with AMEX and another company (Capital One and MC is the likely duo given the Canada relationship IMHO):

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-costco-amex-20150214-story.html#page=1

-ryan


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## DaveNV (Feb 14, 2015)

IngridN said:


> It won't unless AmEx issues you another card. Once the relationship is severed that particular card is useless. WSJ is reporting that AmEx will issue replacement cards to those affected.
> 
> Ingrid



That's what I'm hearing too. New cards would be issued.

Dave


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## LynnW (Feb 14, 2015)

We had no trouble getting our Costco American Express changed over when they switched here in Canada. I am happy that I can now use my air miles card at Costco. We still wanted the American Express card to buy gas at Costco in the US but it looks like we won't need it anymore.

Lynn


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## gregb (Feb 14, 2015)

A few years ago, at least in the SF Bay area, Costco got into a price dispute with Coca-Cola.  At one point in the "negotiation" Coke products were not available in the stores, and the fountain drink dispensers in the food courts were converted to Pepsi products.  The end result is that Pepsi remains as the fountain drink (at least around here), but Coke products are again available in the store.   

When Costco pushes their suppliers to reduce costs, it is the customers that ultimately reap the benefit by way of lower prices.  It's not just Costco.  Walmart is well known for playing hardball with their suppliers on prices.  I support Costco in trying to get the best prices on products, as long as it doesn't drive the suppliers out of business.  Some say Walmart pushes too hard.

Given that AmEx charges higher swipe fees than other cards, I always wondered why Costco accepts it.  I expect Costco negotiated a good deal with AmEx on swipe fees, but for some reason, one of the parties feels that deal is no longer viable.  

We use our Starwood AmEx at Costco to accumulate points.  But if Costco no longer accepts that card, we will continue to shop there, either with their new card, or our debit card.  

Greg


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## LannyPC (Feb 14, 2015)

klpca said:


> My rebate check is about $800 annually, which more than covers our membership costs. We will just switch to what ever card they decide to use. We pay our credit card bills in full every month, but use them every chance we can to generate miles/cash rebates. We will definitely close our AMEX account after this.
> 
> I heard that they changed from AMEX to Capital One Mastercard in Canada.



We signed up for the Costco AMEX card because of the cash-back thing to get rewards for spending.  If we were going to be spending all that money, getting a little something in return sounded appealing.  Our rebates, however, were nowhere near $800 because we bought most of our groceries at a large grocery store chain and our gasoline at a major oil company.

Now that the Costco relationship with AMEX has ended, we signed up for a particular Master Card.  Costco in Canada accepts all MCs.

We, like you, also pay our credit card bills in full each month and thus avoid paying interest.  I like using credit cards for deferral.  So if today we were to purchase something from Costco on our MC, we would not have to pay MC back until mid-March.:whoopie:


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## JudyS (Feb 15, 2015)

For those who enjoyed having an Amex card with no fee, Fidelity Investments offers a no-fee Amex card. I believe it offers 2% back on purchases. I assume you need to have a Fidelity account, but Fidelity IRas can be opened with a very small initial deposit. (Not sure what fees, if any, apply to a Fidelity IRA.)

There are Amex cards that give more cash back on certain purchase categories, but those cards have an annual fee.


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## LAX Mom (Feb 15, 2015)

JudyS said:


> For those who enjoyed having an Amex card with no fee, Fidelity Investments offers a no-fee Amex card. I believe it offers 2% back on purchases. I assume you need to have a Fidelity account, but Fidelity IRas can be opened with a very small initial deposit. (Not sure what fees, if any, apply to a Fidelity IRA.)
> 
> There are Amex cards that give more cash back on certain purchase categories, but those cards have an annual fee.



My son loves his Fidelity Amex card with 2% cash back. He puts everything on it (and pays it off every month!!). I've considered switching to that card, but we use our Costco Amex for gas with 4% back (business card). It's been convenient to have a card for use at Costco & gas stations. 

Depending on what card Costco offers next year, I might start using the Fidelity Amex card.


----------



## Elli (Feb 16, 2015)

LynnW said:


> We had no trouble getting our Costco American Express changed over when they switched here in Canada. I am happy that I can now use my air miles card at Costco. We still wanted the American Express card to buy gas at Costco in the US but it looks like we won't need it anymore.
> 
> Lynn


Lynn, I didn't know Costco accepts the Air Miles card.  I'll go back with my bills to Jan. 1 or 15 when the switched over and will see if they credit my Air Miles card.  Or are you talking about getting Air Miles with the BMO Master Card?


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## dioxide45 (Feb 16, 2015)

Elli said:


> Lynn, I didn't know Costco accepts the Air Miles card.  I'll go back with my bills to Jan. 1 or 15 when the switched over and will see if they credit my Air Miles card.  Or are you talking about getting Air Miles with the BMO Master Card?



I think there is a difference between Air Miles and air miles. The capitalized one being the Air Miles branded system where air miles can mean earning air miles by using a airline branded credit card.


----------



## Julian926 (Feb 17, 2015)

When I posted this thread, I was wondering how Amex users felt about this.  But I noticed most people are Amex users due to the store's requirements.  Seems like they're ok with this divorce.

I stumbled upon Costco due to an Amex promotion.  I practically use Amex for all of my cc transactions. But as I became more dependent on Costco, I felt this event as a huge disappointment. 

Any true Amex users feel like they are losing benefits and choices from Amex due to the divorce?


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## easyrider (Feb 17, 2015)

What I really like about the AMEX Costco card we have is the rental car coverage that offers way more protection than a regular visa card. I use this card in Mexico and Canada for rental cars. We also use it at Costco and seem to get about $400 cash back a year. I would rather have airmiles.

Bill


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## gmarine (Feb 17, 2015)

easyrider said:


> What I really like about the AMEX Costco card we have is the rental car coverage that offers way more protection than a regular visa card. I use this card in Mexico and Canada for rental cars. We also use it at Costco and seem to get about $400 cash back a year. I would rather have airmiles.
> 
> Bill



Up until a few months ago I thought the Costco card had the best car rental coverage. However, a few months ago Citibank changed the terms of their car rental coverage and I think the Citi cards are now better. 

For example, out of the US, the Citicard provides primary coverage. Citi also covers vehicles up to $100,000 in value where I think the Amex limit is $50K. Citi now also covers all vehicles as long as they are passenger vehicles not driven off road. Amex doesnt cover some vehicles, full size SUVs among them.  

Check out the Citicard coverage and see what you think.


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## sjsharkie (Feb 17, 2015)

The best ones provide primary (as opposed to secondary) rental car coverage in the US (IMHO).

I know UA Mileage Plus Explorer Visa includes it.

There are several other options for those that don't want to pay an annual fee.

-ryan


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## rickandcindy23 (Feb 17, 2015)

There are much better cards for earning points than Costco's Amex, including the Starwood Amex.  We have the Costco Amex card and will be happy to switch, if we must, but get back a very small rebate.  Compared to our Chase Ink Bold and Ink Plus cards, the card isn't worth much to us.


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## easyrider (Feb 17, 2015)

We use the Alaska Airlines Visa for most purchases. Included with this card are a yearly companion ticket for , I can't remember but think its about $120. We rack up miles using these cards to pay for anything that accepts them. 

So how will this work with the Costco dealio ? Will they issue new cards with the membership info on it or will we need to actually apply for their new card ?

Bill


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## gmarine (Feb 17, 2015)

sjsharkie said:


> The best ones provide primary (as opposed to secondary) rental car coverage in the US (IMHO).
> 
> I know UA Mileage Plus Explorer Visa includes it.
> 
> ...



I didnt realize that card provided primary coverage in the US.  Thats a great feature. Thanks for posting that info.


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## JudyS (Feb 17, 2015)

Julian926 said:


> When I posted this thread, I was wondering how Amex users felt about this.  But I noticed most people are Amex users due to the store's requirements.  Seems like they're ok with this divorce.
> 
> I stumbled upon Costco due to an Amex promotion.  I practically use Amex for all of my cc transactions. But as I became more dependent on Costco, I felt this event as a huge disappointment.
> 
> Any true Amex users feel like they are losing benefits and choices from Amex due to the divorce?


I use my Amex cards a lot, and I'm not too happy with the news. As long as Costco will take one of my other existing cards, that would be OK. But I wouldn't to apply for something like a Costco store card -- it's not worth doing a hard pull on my credit report just to get a store card. If Costco won't take any of my other cards, I would pay by cash or check, and that would be a factor encouraging me to shop elsewhere. 

By the way, I don't have a Costco Amex. I have a different Amex that gives 5% back on certain purchase categories after meeting a minimum annual spend of $6500. I don't think my specific card is offered to new users, but there are other Amex cards that offer up to 6% on certain categories.


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## JudyS (Feb 17, 2015)

sjsharkie said:


> The best ones provide primary (as opposed to secondary) rental car coverage in the US (IMHO).
> 
> I know UA Mileage Plus Explorer Visa includes it.
> 
> ...


Wow! Are you saying UA Mileage Plus Explorer Visa offers *free *primary auto insurance coverage? I thought Diner's Club was the only card with free primary auto insurance coverage -- and Diner's Club isn't accepting new applications from US customers. 

American Express offers primary auto insurance coverage on car rentals (in addition to free secondary auto insurance), but the primary coverage has a fee of $19.99 or $24.99 per rental, depending on coverage level.

Believe it or not, the free auto coverage from Amex works better if you have no collision insurance on cars you personally own. If you have collision insurance, then Amex submits the claim to your own insurance first, and your auto insurer may raise your rates because you had a claim. If you have no collision insurance, Amex generally doesn't even bother submitting the claim to your insurer (at least, that's what Amex told us.) 

Currently, our only car is an old beater and we have no collision insurance. My husband had a minor accident with a rental car in Orlando recently. The Amex free secondary coverage paid all the damages and Amex said they wouldn't contact our personal auto insurance company.  But we will probably buy a new car soon and get collision insurance, at which point having primary auto insurance for rental cars will be more important.


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## gregb (Feb 17, 2015)

Here is what I expect will happen between now and the Costco/AmEx breakup in 2016.

AmEx will offer (or even automatically switch) all current Costco AmEx card holders to one of their other AmEx cards.  Which one?  Who knows, but probably to one that has similar benefits.  AmEx wants to retain the Costco card holders as customers, so they will do what they can to make it easy for the current Costco AmEx card holders.  Since the customer already has a account/contract with AmEx for credit, it should be quite painless.  It is possible they will automatically issue new cards to the Costco AmEx card holders.  (I had one CC move from MasterCard to Visa system and all they did was mail me a new card.)  Remember, AmEx wants to retain as many of its Costco customers as possible.  

The Costco side may be a little more complicated.  Costco will do a new deal with a different credit card company, most likely Master Card or maybe Visa.  Once the deal is done, Costco will offer all current Costco AmEx card holders the new card.  Again, it is in Costco's interest to make it as easy as possible for customers to switch over.  But since the credit part of the card is with the issuing bank, it will probably require a new application.  Maybe they will figure out a way to avoid that, but I wouldn't count on it.  At any rate, once a new card brand is in place, as with AmEx today, Costco will accept any version of the card, not just the one branded to Costco.

That is my prediction.

Greg


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## sjsharkie (Feb 17, 2015)

gmarine said:


> I didnt realize that card provided primary coverage in the US.  Thats a great feature. Thanks for posting that info.



As of August 2014, here are the others that provide primary coverage for US car rentals -- some do not accept new applications as the article notes.

http://millionmilesecrets.com/2014/08/18/credit-cards-with-primary-rental-car-insurance/
http://thepointsguy.com/2014/08/credit-cards-that-offer-primary-car-rental-coverage/

(I added both links because I'm not sure either list is fully inclusive.)

-ryan


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## PigsDad (Feb 17, 2015)

JudyS said:


> Wow! Are you saying UA Mileage Plus Explorer Visa offers *free *primary auto insurance coverage? I thought Diner's Club was the only card with free primary auto insurance coverage -- and Diner's Club isn't accepting new applications from US customers.
> 
> American Express offers primary auto insurance coverage on car rentals (in addition to free secondary auto insurance), but the primary coverage has a fee of $19.99 or $24.99 per rental, depending on coverage level.



Yep -- we have both cards and have switched from the Amex (which used to charge us $24.95/rental) to the United Explorer card for all our car rental charges now.  It is a great deal.

(and as sjsharkie shared above, there are a few other cards that offer primary coverage for free)

Kurt


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## LynnW (Feb 17, 2015)

Elli said:


> Lynn, I didn't know Costco accepts the Air Miles card.  I'll go back with my bills to Jan. 1 or 15 when the switched over and will see if they credit my Air Miles card.  Or are you talking about getting Air Miles with the BMO Master Card?



Sorry Elli  I didn't mean the Air Miles card We have a Royal Bank Avion

Lynn


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## dioxide45 (Feb 17, 2015)

JudyS said:


> Wow! Are you saying UA Mileage Plus Explorer Visa offers *free *primary auto insurance coverage? I thought Diner's Club was the only card with free primary auto insurance coverage -- and Diner's Club isn't accepting new applications from US customers.



It isn't free, there is a $95 annual fee on the UA Mileage Plus Explorer Credit Card. Though there is no additional fee when you rent like there is with Amex. Also, the first checked bag is free when you have the Explorer card and are flying United.


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## JudyS (Feb 18, 2015)

dioxide45 said:


> It isn't free, there is a $95 annual fee on the UA Mileage Plus Explorer Credit Card. Though there is no additional fee when you rent like there is with Amex....


Wow! I stand corrected on my earlier statement that Diner's Club is the only card that offers primary collision insurance for free when one rents a car and pays using that card. (I'm pretty sure that was true a few years ago.) 

As it turns out, I already have several credit cards that reportedly offer primary collision coverage for rental cars. I'll want to verify with the credit card companies to make sure the coverage hasn't changed, but overall, this is really good news. 

Also, everyone please disregard what I said earlier on this thread, about secondary coverage not covering anything towards the collision deductible specified on one's personal car insurance. I don't know if that's right. 

On the other hand, Amex _did _tell me, "Since you have no collision coverage, we'll just pay all the damages without contacting the company that provides your personal car insurance." 

I find the whole concept of insurance for rental cars quite confusing, so if anyone know much about this topic, I'd love to hear it. 

Also, for everyone reading this, remember that credit card companies may offer some sort of free coverage for collision on rental cars (damage to the rental car), but as far as I know they don't provide any _liability_ insurance (coverage for injuring someone or damaging other people's property).


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## radmoo (Feb 18, 2015)

dioxide45 said:


> It isn't free, there is a $95 annual fee on the UA Mileage Plus Explorer Credit Card. Though there is no additional fee when you rent like there is with Amex. Also, the first checked bag is free when you have the Explorer card and are flying United.



I was not aware of this either, usually use Amex or Marriott Visa but will use my United card going forward.  TUGGERS rule!!!


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## dioxide45 (Feb 18, 2015)

JudyS said:


> Wow! I stand corrected on my earlier statement that Diner's Club is the only card that offers primary collision insurance for free when one rents a car and pays using that card. (I'm pretty sure that was true a few years ago.)
> 
> As it turns out, I already have several credit cards that reportedly offer primary collision coverage for rental cars. I'll want to verify with the credit card companies to make sure the coverage hasn't changed, but overall, this is really good news.
> 
> ...



I believe you were correct. If you have collision coverage on your vehicle and use a credit card that offers secondary CDW coverage, first you must file a claim with your insurance company. Any amounts they don't cover can be claimed against the collision CDW. So that would be any deductible you have. If you are using some kind of CDW (primary or secondary) you should not be out of pocket any money if you have to file a claim.

They key is to make sure you use that credit card for every aspect of the rental. At one time Alamo had the ability to input your credit card number online, I made sure to use a card that had CDW coverage. I think that was before we had the UA Explorer. When you return the car and they ask if you want to keep it on the same form of payment, you must do so. Don't decide to pay cash or debit.

CDW through a credit card or even the rental agency does not cover liability. You will still need your own insurance for that. Though I think you may be able to buy this option through the car rental agency, though it isn't cheap. I suspect it is mainly for people who do not own a car, perhaps because they live in a large metropolitan area.


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## SMHarman (Feb 18, 2015)

^ though homeowners has liability also.


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## Elli (Feb 18, 2015)

LynnW said:


> Sorry Elli  I didn't mean the Air Miles card We have a Royal Bank Avion
> 
> Lynn


Thanks, Lynn, I use my Starwood Amex wherever it is accepted (used to have Royal Bank Avion), but with Costco I now use my BMO Master Card, which does earn Air Miles.


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## JudyS (Feb 19, 2015)

Dioxide45, thanks very much for the information!

I've looked into this topic some during the past day, and have found some additional information. 

According to a poster on another forum, credit card companies usually don't tell your regular auto insurance about the claim, even if the credit card coverage is secondary. Instead, the credit card company just asks to see the declarations page from your auto insurance to determine what coverage you have. If you have collision insurance, the credit card company pays just the deductible and it is then up to the renter to decide whether to file with their regular insurance to cover the rest of the damage, or pay for the rest of the damage out of pocket without filing a claim with their regular insurance.  If you have NO collision insurance, the credit card company pays for all the damage to the rental car, up to the amount of their coverage limit. (If you totaled a $80,000 sports car, say, that would likely exceed the maximum benefit on the free coverage.) 

The above policy (on notifying your regular auto insurance about the claim) may vary between different U.S. states. However, I'm not sure which state's policies are the determining factor -- the state where the car damage occurred, or the state where you have your auto insurance. 

Also, when a renter damages a car, they may owe charges in addition to the actual repair cost of the car. There is often a fee charged by the rental car company for administering the repair, plus a fee charged by the rental car company for "loss of use" of the car while it is in the shop. Personal auto insurance may not cover these fees. Coverage through a credit card may or may not cover them, depending on the particular card's policies.

When we had our recent claim with Amex for damage to an Alamo rental car, Alamo charged an administration fee, which Amex paid. Alamo also had a "loss of use" fee, but Amex negotiated with Alamo and Alamo removed that charge. We paid nothing at all for the damage. 


It's also occurred to me that using RCI Points for a car rental might not provide any automatic car rental damage coverage. (There is a $25 transaction fee when booking a car through RCI Points, but I don't know if that fee, when charged to a credit card, qualifies for free rental car damage insurance.) So, even if I have extra RCI Points, I won't use them for car rentals.


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## Ken555 (Feb 19, 2015)

JudyS said:


> It's also occurred to me that using RCI Points for a car rental might not provide any automatic car rental damage coverage. (There is a $25 transaction fee when booking a car through RCI Points, but I don't know if that fee, when charged to a credit card, qualifies for free rental car damage insurance.) So, even if I have extra RCI Points, I won't use them for car rentals.




I use my AMEX (and pay the $18 per rental fee for additional coverage) currently, though every year or two I revisit this topic. It seems that now is a good time to do so again.

To your point, whenever I rent via Priceline I call AMEX and tell them it's for a car rental (as opposed to flight or hotel) and they charge the $18 and I'm covered. They only automatically charge when it's from a known auto rental company. Depending on which card you're currently using, you may be able to do similar when renting via RCI, though I wouldn't be surprised to learn that the cc deny the coverage since the entire rental wasn't paid on the card (and the $25 may be considered an administration fee unrelated to the car rental itself).



Sent from my iPad


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## sjsharkie (Feb 19, 2015)

JudyS said:


> When we had our recent claim with Amex for damage to an Alamo rental car, Alamo charged an administration fee, which Amex paid. Alamo also had a "loss of use" fee, but Amex negotiated with Alamo and Alamo removed that charge. We paid nothing at all for the damage.
> 
> 
> It's also occurred to me that using RCI Points for a car rental might not provide any automatic car rental damage coverage. (There is a $25 transaction fee when booking a car through RCI Points, but I don't know if that fee, when charged to a credit card, qualifies for free rental car damage insurance.) So, even if I have extra RCI Points, I won't use them for car rentals.



If you use points to book the car rental, it would not be covered by most credit card primary or secondary insurance.  The entire item has to be charged to the card.

Six years back, I had a damage claim (loss of use issue as reported above) for a rental car where the other party was at fault.  Primary insurance refused to cover loss of use.

AMEX cited that I had used a free day coupon and therefore, they would not cover the loss of use charge.  I argued that a coupon issued by the agency (in this case from National) is a reduction of the retail price, not a different form of payment and that the card was used to pay the entire transaction -- the coupon required that I rent for 3 days and the first day would be free.  This was different that a reward coupon where there was no obligation to purchase additional days.

I had to take this all the way up to corporate.  They paid the claim, but only up to the deductible amount of my insurance.  I had already negotiated a lower payment with National for loss of use so they accepted it as full satisfaction.

So, in your case, where you are using points for a rental, would likely be denied as a claim.


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## JudyS (Feb 19, 2015)

sjsharkie said:


> If you use points to book the car rental, it would not be covered by most credit card primary or secondary insurance.  The entire item has to be charged to the card.
> 
> Six years back, I had a damage claim (loss of use issue as reported above) for a rental car where the other party was at fault.  Primary insurance refused to cover loss of use.
> 
> ...


Another wow! I never thought that using a "free day" coupon issued by the car rental agency could invalidate the free car rental insurance from a credit card. I will have to watch out for that in the future. 

The Discover card has car rental gift certificates available under the Discover Cashback program -- a $40 gift card for $20 in cashback rewards. I don't think my Discover card (it's a Discover More) provides primary car rental insurance. I was thinking of using one of a Discover gift certificate while paying with a different credit card that does offer primary car rental insurance, but now I'll make sure not to. In fact,  after reading your post, it now seems risky to use the Discover car rental gift certificates even if I charge the rest of the rental to Discover.

And renting a car with RCI Points is right out. I wasn't sure I wanted to do it before, and now I'm sure I don't want to.


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## sjsharkie (Feb 19, 2015)

JudyS said:


> Another wow! I never thought that using a "free day" coupon issued by the car rental agency could invalidate the free car rental insurance from a credit card. I will have to watch out for that in the future.
> 
> The Discover card has car rental gift certificates available under the Discover Cashback program -- a $40 gift card for $20 in cashback rewards. I don't think my Discover card (it's a Discover More) provides primary car rental insurance. I was thinking of using one of a Discover gift certificate while paying with a different credit card that does offer primary car rental insurance, but now I'll make sure not to. In fact,  after reading your post, it now seems risky to use the Discover car rental gift certificates even if I charge the rest of the rental to Discover.
> 
> And renting a car with RCI Points is right out. I wasn't sure I wanted to do it before, and now I'm sure I don't want to.



I would only use coupons that are issued by the rental company -- I think this is the only way to argue that the coupons are a reduction of the retail price versus another form of payment.

Since Discover issues the coupons, they are likely remitting some form of payment ($40 or some fraction thereof) to the rental company on your rental.  It's tough to argue that this is not another form of payment IMHO.

I still use free day coupons on all of my rentals -- only those issued by the rental car company.  Not sure if I would run into this issue again or not.

-ryan


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## CCR (Feb 27, 2015)

I'm not sure what to do as I've loved my AMEX and do like to shop at Costco.  Our rebate was always a nice $900-$1000 in February.

I don't want to give up the benefits of an AMEX card so I'm currently trying to decide which AMEX to switch to.  My research has me leaning toward the Blue Cash Preferred Card.  It sounds like you get the most cash back with that one.  I feel very secure with AMEX as they are diligent in looking for fraud, great protection with car rentals, etc.

Also considering if I should try something new like the Alaskan Airlines card.  I'm having a hard time understanding how the points work for flights and if easy to book.   I've seen mentioned on Tug the BA card (I'm assuming this is British Airways).  Anyone have a recommendation on these two? I'm seeing comments that Hawaii flights may be less points with the BA card.

I'll probably just start using cash at Costco.


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## Saintsfanfl (Feb 27, 2015)

I got the Costco Amex Business card specifically for the 4% gas rebate. I hope the card that replaces it has 4% for gas. If not, I need to fine more category cards. I have two so I can usually get 5% with those for two quarters of the year.


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## sue1947 (Feb 27, 2015)

CCR said:


> I'm not sure what to do as I've loved my AMEX and do like to shop at Costco.  Our rebate was always a nice $900-$1000 in February.
> 
> I don't want to give up the benefits of an AMEX card so I'm currently trying to decide which AMEX to switch to.  My research has me leaning toward the Blue Cash Preferred Card.  It sounds like you get the most cash back with that one.  I feel very secure with AMEX as they are diligent in looking for fraud, great protection with car rentals, etc.
> 
> ...



The Alaska Airlines card is issued through Bank of America (is that the BA you are referencing?).  It's the classic miles card earning airline miles for each dollar spent on the card.   You can check Alaska's website for how many miles are needed for which type of flights.  The big advantage of the Alaska card is the extra companion ticket you get once a year.  You book a flight and can book a second one of the same type and flight (they need to be traveling together) for a small fee.  That option only comes with the highest level card which comes with an annual fee.  As a result, the flight you use it on needs to be one that costs over $200 to make this worthwhile; flights to Hawaii are a perfect example.  This is a good option if you fly Alaska and can use the companion ticket.  If not, you can get better cash back options elsewhere with no annual fee.  

Sue


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## Passepartout (Feb 27, 2015)

*March 31, 2016*

It's not like you have to make this big decision right away. Your Costco AMEX is still valid at Costco until *March 31, 2016*. Costco hasn't even announced which card they will switch over to.

Jim


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## easyrider (Feb 27, 2015)

sue1947 said:


> The Alaska Airlines card is issued through Bank of America (is that the BA you are referencing?).  It's the classic miles card earning airline miles for each dollar spent on the card.   You can check Alaska's website for how many miles are needed for which type of flights.  The big advantage of the Alaska card is the extra companion ticket you get once a year.  You book a flight and can book a second one of the same type and flight (they need to be traveling together) for a small fee.  That option only comes with the highest level card which comes with an annual fee.  As a result, the flight you use it on needs to be one that costs over $200 to make this worthwhile; flights to Hawaii are a perfect example.  This is a good option if you fly Alaska and can use the companion ticket.  If not, you can get better cash back options elsewhere with no annual fee.
> 
> Sue



+1 for Alaska Airlines Signature Card . We use two of these. 

Bill


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## CCR (Feb 27, 2015)

Passepartout said:


> It's not like you have to make this big decision right away. Your Costco AMEX is still valid at Costco until *March 31, 2016*. Costco hasn't even announced which card they will switch over to.
> 
> Jim



Yes I agree but I have been thinking for a while that I may get better bang for my buck with another card possibly.


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## Kal (Feb 27, 2015)

sue1947 said:


> ...flights to Hawaii are a perfect example. This is a good option if you fly Alaska and can use the companion ticket. If not, you can get better cash back options elsewhere with no annual fee.
> 
> Sue



For my flight in April 2014 to Maui, I compared the Alaska-BA "free companion" pricing to Hawaiian Airline's straight up pricing. I found that the Hawaiian price for 2 tickets was much lower than the Alaska price with the $100 companion fare.

I'm not very satisfied with the Alaska promotion but continue to pay the annual fee just to accumulate Alaska miles. I'm using a chunk of those miles this year on a Delta partner flight to Paris. Will see what the future brings with Delta's mileage gouging program as it relates to being an Alaska partner. 

 My goal now is to find the "perfect" chip and pin card with no foreign transaction fees!


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## PigsDad (Feb 27, 2015)

Passepartout said:


> It's not like you have to make this big decision right away. Your Costco AMEX is still valid at Costco until *March 31, 2016*. Costco hasn't even announced which card they will switch over to.


The card may be valid until then, but the rebate benefits could (and most likely will) change long before that, IMO.

Kurt


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## Ken555 (Feb 27, 2015)

Kal said:


> My goal now is to find the "perfect" chip and pin card with no foreign transaction fees!




I just got the Barclaycard for this purpose.


Sent from my iPad


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## CCR (Feb 27, 2015)

I think my Marriott Rewards Visa card has a chip and I think there are no foreign transaction fees, but I will need to try it out to be sure.  (I think the Hyatt card also has these benefits)

I used the Capitol One card (no chip) in Europe several times with no foreign transaction fees.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 27, 2015)

Ken555 said:


> I just got the Barclaycard for this purpose.



Watch out for 'Card Clash' with London Oyster Cards


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## tante (Feb 27, 2015)

Saintsfanfl said:


> I got the Costco Amex Business card specifically for the 4% gas rebate. I hope the card that replaces it has 4% for gas. If not, I need to fine more category cards. I have two so I can usually get 5% with those for two quarters of the year.



Amex simply cash has 5% back at gas stations.


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## Smudge (Feb 27, 2015)

Julian926 said:


> When I posted this thread, I was wondering how Amex users felt about this.  But I noticed most people are Amex users due to the store's requirements.  Seems like they're ok with this divorce.
> 
> I stumbled upon Costco due to an Amex promotion.  I practically use Amex for all of my cc transactions. But as I became more dependent on Costco, I felt this event as a huge disappointment.
> 
> Any true Amex users feel like they are losing benefits and choices from Amex due to the divorce?



We’re bummed that Costco and AmEx are separating.  We funnel all our purchases to AmEx, except for the occasional use of VISA card.

We have been very happy with the AmEx customer service and rewards, and will stay with them.  

As for the new Costco co-branded card, it looks like it’s going to be a CapOne MasterCard:
http://www.capitalone.com/media/doc...ement-for-Costco-Cards-in-Capital-One-N.A.pdf

On the up side, the Costco/CapOne MC will charge no foreign transaction fees.  But to apply for it, CapOne will require any credit freezes to be temporarily lifted at all three credit bureaus.


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## rickandcindy23 (Feb 27, 2015)

We love the Starwood Amex card.  We can transfer miles to Alaska and receive 25% bonus miles.  It's becoming our second favorite. We pay our Starwood MF's with the card.  

Our favorite is Chase Ink Bold or Chase Ink Plus.  5X points on office supply store purchases, 5X points for internet, phone, cell phone and satellite TV, and 2X points for almost all of our MF's because they are keyed as travel.  So 2X on travel.  We transfer those points to Southwest.  

We do manufactured spend for additional points, while it's still working, and we build miles quickly that way.  Hope they don't stop us somewhere along the way.  For now, it's great.  

So we rarely use the Costco Amex.  Only at Costco and for gas.  That's about it.


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## tante (Feb 27, 2015)

rickandcindy23 said:


> We love the Starwood Amex card.  We can transfer miles to Alaska and receive 25% bonus miles.  It's becoming our second favorite. We pay our Starwood MF's with the card.
> 
> Our favorite is Chase Ink Bold or Chase Ink Plus.  5X points on office supply store purchases, 5X points for internet, phone, cell phone and satellite TV, and 2X points for almost all of our MF's because they are keyed as travel.  So 2X on travel.  We transfer those points to Southwest.
> 
> ...



You should be very careful with ms on your spg card. Amex monitors it very closely.


----------



## Talent312 (Feb 27, 2015)

Our new CapOne chip-Visa does not have an account # on the front.
Instead it's listed in a column format on the back side.
Also, Am-Ex sent us an e-mail saying we'll be getting chip card soon.

But these are all chip-signature cards, not chip-PIN cards <sigh>.
.


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## hvsteve1 (Feb 28, 2015)

No, Costco employees don't make commission.  But, yes, the people in the store doing nothing but pushing Amex cards probably do as they are not Costco employees but working for marketing firms who are paid to sell Amex cards.  If you knew what those firms and their folks got for each new card, you would realize how much profit there is in each of those accounts.

I don't really care what card they use.  I get similar cash back on Discover and other cards and, if Costco insists you use a new co-branded card, it's fine with me.

 When they opened our Costco a couple of years ago, there were rewards for getting a Costco membership but the awards when you also got the Amex ended up making the membership free plus giving you a gift card.


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## PigsDad (Mar 2, 2015)

*Citi Visa*

Just announced:  Citi Visa will replace Amex as the Costco branded credit card starting April 1, *2016*.

http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/2...ns-with-Citi-Visa-for-new-credit-card-program

Kurt


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## amycurl (Mar 2, 2015)

Ah, someone beat me to it! Yes, interesting that it is Citi, my *least* favorite of the big banks. Too big to fail, my patootie. I would have loved to see them go. I'm very disappointed. 

Currently, I use my Costco Amex for practically everything, and get a nice $600ish reward back at the end of the year. With this new agreement, I will use other visa cards at Costco--my LLBean visa or perhaps it will get me to finally get a Marriott visa. I doubt I will use the new Amex at all, and I will certainly not use the Citi card anywhere else (if even at Costco.)


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## pedro47 (Mar 2, 2015)

amycurl said:


> Ah, someone beat me to it! Yes, interesting that it is Citi, my *least* favorite of the big banks. Too big to fail, my patootie. I would have loved to see them go. I'm very disappointed.
> 
> Currently, I use my Costco Amex for practically everything, and get a nice $600ish reward back at the end of the year. With this new agreement, I will use other visa cards at Costco--my LLBean visa or perhaps it will get me to finally get a Marriott visa. I doubt I will use the new Amex at all, and I will certainly not use the Citi card anywhere else (if even at Costco.)



What is Citi annual finance charge for their Visa card and do they have a reward back program at the end ot the year ?


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## Big Matt (Mar 2, 2015)

I'm not sure what you are talking about.

Citi wasn't ever in danger of going out of business.  They have a very balanced and diversified business model.

What are your issues with Citi?  I'm not trying to pry, but I'm sure I will get one of these cards, and your post makes me wonder what I'm in for.



amycurl said:


> Ah, someone beat me to it! Yes, interesting that it is Citi, my *least* favorite of the big banks. Too big to fail, my patootie. I would have loved to see them go. I'm very disappointed.
> 
> Currently, I use my Costco Amex for practically everything, and get a nice $600ish reward back at the end of the year. With this new agreement, I will use other visa cards at Costco--my LLBean visa or perhaps it will get me to finally get a Marriott visa. I doubt I will use the new Amex at all, and I will certainly not use the Citi card anywhere else (if even at Costco.)


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## dioxide45 (Mar 2, 2015)

Like that they will be accepting Visa. Likely won't sign up for the Coscto branded Citi card, but will use other Visa cards there. We don't have the Costco Amex.


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## IngridN (Mar 2, 2015)

Glad to hear it's Visa. We have one with really good cash back rewards so I won't be applying for the Citi one, a company which I hate. Nothing to do with fin'l crisis but with issues while I was caring for my father under POA years and years ago.

Ingrid


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## amycurl (Mar 2, 2015)

Big Matt said:


> I'm not sure what you are talking about.
> 
> Citi wasn't ever in danger of going out of business.  They have a very balanced and diversified business model.
> 
> What are your issues with Citi?  I'm not trying to pry, but I'm sure I will get one of these cards, and your post makes me wonder what I'm in for.



I find their customer service and support terrible (and my spouse has had a Citi card for as long as I've known him, but it's not been used for purchases in over a decade,) and their corporate culture lacking in a variety of areas (and I've done some contract HR work for them in the past, so that's partly why I know this.)

But, no, Citi did not have a particularly sound business model, and was the biggest of the too-big-to-fail banks (not including AIG, which was an insurance company, primarily.)  They have been the beneficiaries of three different government bailouts, and represented the largest risk to US taxpayers under TARP. To quote CNBC (which, if anything, tends to lean more pro-business in its reporting,) 

"The bank that exposed the federal government to the greatest potential loss during the government bailout was Citigroup, which received a grand total of $476.2 billion in cash and guarantees, according to a new report of the Congressional Oversight Panel which oversees the TARP program."

If banks want to get uber-big and take uber-risks, that's fine with me (although I can choose not to bank with them.) But then they should bear all the risks, and not just the rewards--and not look to the US Treasury to bail them out when they get in trouble. (Granted, I blame the government for undoing Glass-Steagall, but that's a different topic...)


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## Kal (Mar 3, 2015)

Ken555 said:


> I just got the Barclaycard for this purpose.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad



Which Barclaycard do you have?  Is it a chip and PIN or chip and signature?


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## Ken555 (Mar 3, 2015)

Kal said:


> Which Barclaycard do you have?  Is it a chip and PIN or chip and signature?




Barclaycard Arrival+ chip and pin. I only received it a few days ago, but setup the PIN online already. 


Sent from my iPad


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## chalee94 (Mar 3, 2015)

amycurl said:


> But, no, Citi did not have a particularly sound business model, and was the biggest of the too-big-to-fail banks (not including AIG, which was an insurance company, primarily.)  They have been the beneficiaries of three different government bailouts, and represented the largest risk to US taxpayers under TARP. To quote CNBC (which, if anything, tends to lean more pro-business in its reporting,)
> 
> "The bank that exposed the federal government to the greatest potential loss during the government bailout was Citigroup, which received a grand total of $476.2 billion in cash and guarantees, according to a new report of the Congressional Oversight Panel which oversees the TARP program."
> 
> If banks want to get uber-big and take uber-risks, that's fine with me (although I can choose not to bank with them.) But then they should bear all the risks, and not just the rewards--and not look to the US Treasury to bail them out when they get in trouble. (Granted, I blame the government for undoing Glass-Steagall, but that's a different topic...)



yeah, that is exactly what John Allison, a former bank CEO, said about Citi:

http://www.ethicsandentrepreneurship.org/20110719/interview-with-john-allison/



> Corrupt businessmen will be punished in a free market. Unfortunately, the government fairly often saves poorly-run businesses in the name of the public good. Citigroup has failed three times in my career. Each time the government has saved them and they have become bigger and worse.


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## dioxide45 (Mar 3, 2015)

An article I read indicated that the Citi deal is contingent upon Citi purchasing the current Costco credit card company from Amex. I suppose that Costco and Amex may have had some type of clause in their contract requiring Amex to do so. I wonder how this will play out. Could Amex hold them over a barrel?


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## SMHarman (Mar 3, 2015)

dioxide45 said:


> An article I read indicated that the Citi deal is contingent upon Citi purchasing the current Costco credit card company from Amex. I suppose that Costco and Amex may have had some type of clause in their contract requiring Amex to do so. I wonder how this will play out. Could Amex hold them over a barrel?


Company or book of business. 
More likely the latter. Then the need is to value the receivable and move on. 

Citi issues Amex cards as well so should be well placed to integrate that receivables book.


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## Kal (Mar 31, 2015)

Ken555 said:


> Barclaycard Arrival+ chip and pin. I only received it a few days ago, but setup the PIN online already.


 
 I reviewed all my cards and found all kinds of stories:

 - Chip & sig cards will be coming out by end of year or early 2016
 - Most have no foreign transaction fees
 - Almost none have chip & pin
 - All over the map on benefits (miles, points, cash, companion fares & free hotel nights)

 I have the Barclaycard Arrival+ and am anxious to satisfy the promo $3,000 in 3 months.  Since it is chip & PIN, it definitely will be the "go to card" for my fall trip to Paris!


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## Ken555 (May 10, 2015)

Kal said:


> I have the Barclaycard Arrival+ and am anxious to satisfy the promo $3,000 in 3 months.  Since it is chip & PIN, it definitely will be the "go to card" for my fall trip to Paris!




Update on the Barclaycard: it sucks.

We all (or, at least, *I*) thought it would operate in a similar manner to European credit cards in that it would work as chip and pin whenever used in a chip and pin compatible terminal. Well, that's not the way it works. 

I've now used the card in Spain and the UK. Whenever it's used in a terminal that has chip and signature capability, it works as chip and signature. Period. 

After experiencing this unfortunate reality, I called Barclaycard and discovered two things: 1) Barclaycard reps really don't know the details of how the card works abroad (when I originally considered the card I called and discussed it with them and was assured it would work as a chip and pin, even though their website is somewhat ambiguous), and 2) it should work as a chip and pin in any unattended vending machine or similar (ie. a terminal that does not have chip and signature capability).

After this call I tried it in two different unattended vending machines. It did not work at all in one so I just used cash, and did work in another (the SIM card vending machine at Heathrow) though that particular machine also accepted credit card swipes, and did not even require my pin...so I don't think it processed as a chip and pin card at all.

In the end, it's operating no differently than my existing BA Chase credit card (which also offers no foreign transaction fees). I like the Barclaycard (and I've already benefited by some ~$750 in free travel, so is helping with this European trip!) but would have preferred it worked as represented.

On a related note, my Barclaycard was fraudulently used in the last few days. It seems I paid for a hotel in Australia and bought some electronics from a popular online retail store twice...all three transactions occurring within three minutes. So much for security. I had a fun call with Barclaycard security department explaining to them how their card actually works, and asking them to question whose bright idea it was to default it's use as a chip and signature card instead of chip and pin on all transactions (after all, wouldn't you assume, given the choice, it would default to the more secure method?). 

So, they canceled the card and are sending a replacement to my next hotel. Then left me a message today asking me to call them because they wanted to verify that I really did want them to send it to an international destination. When I called I was told that it had already been sent and that my call was unnecessary. It seems they thought there was a concern so placed a call to me, then reassessed and sent it but neglected to call me back and say a call wasn't needed...so I had to take time today to call and question...all I can say is that their customer service (at least in their security department) could do with some improvement.



Sent from my iPad


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## SmithOp (May 10, 2015)

I have the Hawaiian Air Barclay and the transaction alert emails are useless, arriving days after the charge. I've had it replaced once already due to fraudulent charges in PA at a convenience mart.


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## Kal (May 11, 2015)

Ken555 said:


> Update on the Barclaycard: it sucks.
> 
> We all (or, at least, *I*) thought it would operate in a similar manner to European credit cards in that it would work as chip and pin whenever used in a chip and pin compatible terminal. Well, that's not the way it works.
> 
> I've now used the card in Spain and the UK. Whenever it's used in a terminal that has chip and signature capability, it works as chip and signature. Period. ...


 
 This is not good news!  It was the ONLY chip & pin card I could find.  I've got other cards that are chip & signature but that doesn't meet my needs.

 However, the card has a great 2X per $ points accumulation plus the promo of 40,000 points at the get go.  I will definitely benefit by the points rebate program especially where it includes other trip costs beyond just airfare.  I can consume that full benefit before the annual renewal date so I've got some time.

 Does anyone know of any other chip & pin card????


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## presley (May 11, 2015)

Kal said:


> Does anyone know of any other chip & pin card????



I found this via google search. http://creditcardforum.com/blog/chip-and-pin-credit-cards-usa/

It looks like many popular cards will issue them, but you have to request it. Only some require a pin.


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## Ken555 (May 11, 2015)

presley said:


> I found this via google search. http://creditcardforum.com/blog/chip-and-pin-credit-cards-usa/
> 
> 
> 
> It looks like many popular cards will issue them, but you have to request it. Only some require a pin.




This is a great example of the misinformation that is out there. The cards on this page do NOT operate as a real chip and pin card. You may request a chip card from many (I have them on my AMEX, Citi, and others) but they do NOT work as a chip and pin, they are instead all chip and signature. As my earlier post explains, Barclaycard was one of the very few available to US residents that purported to work as a true chip and pin card, but it doesn't. Worse, when calling these banks the staff doesn't even know...as I experienced with both the Barclaycard this year and the Chase BA card two years ago. 

We need a real chip and pin card. They're coming, but it seems they aren't here yet. I'm sure there will be many articles online you can find that say they work...but as proved during my trip, what they say and what they actually do are sometimes two completely different things.


Sent from my iPad


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## Passepartout (May 11, 2015)

Kal said:


> Does anyone know of any other chip & pin card????



It looks like the liability issue has to be resolved- and that will take legislation. We know how likely THAT is to happen in the current environment. Banks want merchants to be responsible for fraudulent card transactions, and merchants want card issuers to continue to be responsible. Oh, and card issuers want merchants to buy their own terminals, too.

Fwiw, I asked for and got chip/signature cards from Citi and Amex. No chip/PIN yet at low/no cost.

Jim


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## Kal (May 11, 2015)

presley said:


> I found this via google search. http://creditcardforum.com/blog/chip-and-pin-credit-cards-usa/
> 
> It looks like many popular cards will issue them, but you have to request it. Only some require a pin.



 These credit card people don't use the term "PIN" as in "Chip & Pin".  When they refer to PIN it is for credit card cash advances.  And those advances come with outrageous interest rates and fees.


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## theo (May 11, 2015)

voluntarily deleted --- the post I was responding to was considerably older than I first realized.


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## Bill4728 (May 11, 2015)

"Chip" cards ( either chip & pin   or  Chip & sign) are being issued my most lenders because they so much harder to fake/forge.  Personally I don't see where there is a lot of difference between the two "chip" cards. Someone needs to steal the card for them to be used in person.  The thief just can not have your number.

The problem comes with online purchases. There the thief *can *make purchases with just your number.  So the "chip" cards do not help with those purchases.


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## Ken555 (May 11, 2015)

Bill4728 said:


> "Chip" cards ( either chip & pin   or  Chip & sign) are being issued my most lenders because they so much harder to fake/forge.  Personally I don't see where there is a lot of difference between the two "chip" cards. Someone needs to steal the card for them to be used in person.  The thief just can not have your number.
> 
> The problem comes with online purchases. There the thief *can *make purchases with just your number.  So the "chip" cards do not help with those purchases.




No. There is practically no difference in security between a chip card and a signature card when the chip card is allowed to be used as a chip and signature card. This is especially true when the card also has a swipe capability (as they do). However, a chip and pin is much harder to forge, since while anyone can sign for you if they don't know your pin the charge won't be authorized. I'm a bit tired, so perhaps I'm not explaining this sufficiently...if you're still confused what the difference is between chip and signature and chip and pin, please post and I'm sure someone will answer better (or I will tomorrow...) - there is a significant distinction.

There are other ways to protect yourself online, if you wish. For instance, single instance numbers (Citi and others offer this, but it's up to you to use it). 


Sent from my iPad


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## SMHarman (May 11, 2015)

Bill4728 said:


> "Chip" cards ( either chip & pin   or  Chip & sign) are being issued my most lenders because they so much harder to fake/forge.  Personally I don't see where there is a lot of difference between the two "chip" cards. Someone needs to steal the card for them to be used in person.  The thief just can not have your number.
> 
> The problem comes with online purchases. There the thief *can *make purchases with just your number.  So the "chip" cards do not help with those purchases.


Maybe in the Europe where a chip is the required interface but in the US where a swipe is the norm the chip and Sig is the same as strip and Sig. 

Strip and Sig or Chip and Sig is single factor authentication. 
Something you have. Get the numbers from it and someone else can create that something tiny have. 

Chip and Pin is two factor 
Something you have. The card with the chip. 
Something you know. The pin. 
Either without the other cannot make a transaction.


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## "Roger" (May 11, 2015)

Bill4728 said:


> ..."Chip" cards ( either chip & pin   or  Chip & sign) are being issued my most lenders ...  Personally I don't see where there is a lot of difference between the two "chip" cards. ....


It can make a big difference in Europe.  Admittedly, either will work in hotels, restaurants, etc., but gas stations, park and pay lots, train stations can have unattended machines. The only way you can pay is with a chip and pin card.  If you only have a chip and signature card, in all likelihood, you are SOL.


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## bnoble (May 11, 2015)

> If you only have a chip and signature card, in all likelihood, you are SOL.


Exactly.  I was interested in the Barclay's card---not because of the increased security, but because I want to have a card I can use in unattended kiosks in the EU. If that card defaults to chip-and-signature in such situations, it is essentially useless to me.


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## Ken555 (May 12, 2015)

bnoble said:


> Exactly.  I was interested in the Barclay's card---not because of the increased security, but because I want to have a card I can use in unattended kiosks in the EU. If that card defaults to chip-and-signature in such situations, it is essentially useless to me.




Assuming I get my replacement card as scheduled tomorrow, I will definitely try to use it in another kiosk (perhaps for a transit ticket, etc) and post back to this thread.

I do think there is significant confusion at the bank itself about the PIN as described earlier in this thread. Is it a PIN for ATMs or chip and pin credit card usage at a merchant? The site is rather clear (at least to me), and they allow you to change the PIN online in your account details (actually, I was quite pleased how easy it is to set the PIN). 


Sent from my iPad


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## Ken555 (May 22, 2015)

Ken555 said:


> Assuming I get my replacement card as scheduled tomorrow, I will definitely try to use it in another kiosk (perhaps for a transit ticket, etc) and post back to this thread.
> 
> I do think there is significant confusion at the bank itself about the PIN as described earlier in this thread. Is it a PIN for ATMs or chip and pin credit card usage at a merchant? The site is rather clear (at least to me), and they allow you to change the PIN online in your account details (actually, I was quite pleased how easy it is to set the PIN).
> 
> ...




I was reminded today that I hadn't updated this thread. I received my card on time (which really was nice, and kudos to Barclay for actually shipping on time, unlike Chase when they sent me a new card while overseas a couple of years ago). I tried the card again and it didn't work as expected. 

In essence, this is a chip and signature card with the potential to supposedly work with a pin in certain unattended kiosks (but the one time it worked in a kiosk for me it didn't even ask for the pin!). It was absolutely no different than my BA Chase Visa in that it's a chip and signature card with no foreign transaction fees.

I'm not impressed. I've never been one to churn credit cards but unless I find that the 2.2% travel benefit really works for me I'll be canceling this card before renewal. The only exception would be if they change it to a true chip and pin card, which I suppose isn't beyond the realm of the possible given the upcoming changes in the US.


Sent from my iPad


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## bnoble (May 22, 2015)

Well, that's disappointing.


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## Kal (May 22, 2015)

That is soooo bad!

 Here is what Barclay says about the chip card on their website:

_"Your credit card is a chip and signature card with Personal Identification Number (PIN) capability. In most cases when you travel abroad, you'll be asked to sign for your transaction. However, at some unattended terminals, such as train ticket kiosks, you may be asked to enter your PIN instead of signing._

_At chip-card terminals:_
_Insert your card into the reader – chip side up and chip end in – and leave it there until your transaction is complete. In most cases, you’ll sign for your transactions. But at self-service terminals like ticket kiosks and vending machines, you could be prompted to enter your 4-digit PIN."_


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## Kal (Sep 10, 2015)

An update on the chip & pin drama.....

 I first tried my Barclay Chip & pin card here in Paris at an unattended purchase of Metro tickets.  It worked great!! Entered the PIN and the transaction worked fine.  That's nice as I see other US people getting their chip & sig cards rejected.

 I even enjoyed using my Schwab ATM card for euros and they pay each and every bank fee.  The exchange rate is right at the interbank rate with no games or jacked up rates.

 Drama is over for me so I can continue my challenge to taste every French wine!!


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## bobpark56 (Sep 10, 2015)

*Try Spain*



Kal said:


> An update on the chip & pin drama.....
> 
> <snip>
> Drama is over for me so I can continue my challenge to taste every French wine!!



Try Spain. The wines are cheaper, and there are more of them (Spain produces more wine than France). Just as good, in my opinion. Where else can you buy a decent bottle for $3-3.50 (Rioja or Ribera del Duero, for example)? And paying more gets you even better wines. FWIW, we were advised by a wine merchant to beware buying reservas at grocery stores, as those bottles tend to sit on the shelf for extended periods, in uncontrolled environments.


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## donnaval (Sep 11, 2015)

Sam's Club is now going to accept AMEX:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/sams-...120000351.html;_ylt=A0LEVu54JfNVm18A2zRjmolQ#


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## MichaelColey (Sep 12, 2015)

Wow, that's huge!  We strongly prefer American Express, so our Sam's Club workaround has been to buy Walmart Gift Cards using AmEx and use them at Sam's.  It'll be nice to be able to just use our AmEx.

Now I just need to find a workaround for Costco when they stop accepting AmEx next year.


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## Elli (Sep 12, 2015)

I bought some cash cards with Amex at Costco before they discontinued Amex in Canada.  I should have bought more.  Now it's Master Card.


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## DaveNV (Sep 12, 2015)

Elli said:


> I bought some cash cards with Amex at Costco before they discontinued Amex in Canada.  I should have bought more.  Now it's Master Card.



Next time you come down to Bellingham, you can buy some more. At least, until next Spring. 

Dave


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## Elli (Sep 13, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> Next time you come down to Bellingham, you can buy some more. At least, until next Spring.
> Dave


You mean I can buy the cash cards with Amex in the States and use them in Canada?


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## DaveNV (Sep 13, 2015)

Elli said:


> You mean I can buy the cash cards with Amex in the States and use them in Canada?



I just asked my spouse, who is a career Refund Cashier at Costco.  I'm told that yes, you should be able to do it. But be aware that as of March 31, 2016, Amex will no longer be accepted at Costco. So you'd have to buy them before then. The caveat is to ask at the Member Services counter to make sure, the next time you're in a U.S. warehouse.

Also, you'd buy at the U.S. exchange rate, but spend them at the Canadian exchange rate. With the exchange rate currently at ~25%, ($1CAN equals roughly $.75US), you'd have to really need to have that card, to absorb that kind of loss.

On another note:  I'm also being told the new credit card coming April 1, 2016 is a "kick-ass Capital One Visa card that gives more cash back than anything Costco has used up to this point."  I don't know how that translates across the border for Canadian members. But anyone in the U.S. who wants to use a Visa at Costco may want to compare perks before deciding whether to get one of the new cards. 

Dave


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## dioxide45 (Sep 14, 2015)

MichaelColey said:


> Wow, that's huge!  We strongly prefer American Express, so our Sam's Club workaround has been to buy Walmart Gift Cards using AmEx and use them at Sam's.  It'll be nice to be able to just use our AmEx.
> 
> Now I just need to find a workaround for Costco when they stop accepting AmEx next year.



I wonder if Costco will continue to accept Amex online? Our work around for Costco with Visa was to buy a Costco Cash Card online with Visa and use it in the warehouse. This was more of a pain though than your situation as you need to either always keep a good stock of them or anticipate about a week out that you will need them. They took anywhere from 3 to 10 days to have the physical cards delivered. I could never find a way to reload the cards online,.


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## Elli (Sep 14, 2015)

BMWguynw said:


> I just asked my spouse, who is a career Refund Cashier at Costco.  I'm told that yes, you should be able to do it. But be aware that as of March 31, 2016, Amex will no longer be accepted at Costco. So you'd have to buy them before then. The caveat is to ask at the Member Services counter to make sure, the next time you're in a U.S. warehouse.
> 
> Also, you'd buy at the U.S. exchange rate, but spend them at the Canadian exchange rate. With the exchange rate currently at ~25%, ($1CAN equals roughly $.75US), you'd have to really need to have that card, to absorb that kind of loss.
> 
> ...


Thanks for checking with your wife, Dave, I'd forgotten about paying in US dollars - for the time being, definitely not worth it.


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## DaveNV (Sep 14, 2015)

Elli said:


> Thanks for checking with your wife, Dave, I'd forgotten about paying in US dollars - for the time being, definitely not worth it.



That was kind of what we were thinking. 

Dave


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## happymum (Sep 15, 2015)

When Costco stopped taking Amex in Canada, we received a cash-back replacement card from Amex, without having to do anything. The bonus was that they offered a great promo fpor the first 6 months. I believe it was 5x the normal rate, or something similar - for grocery, gas and drug store purchases, I believe. I only ever used Amex at Costco and although I tried to use the new card a bit, I reverted to Visa. Was very pleasantly surprised to get a $200+ credit  on yesterday's Amex bill (which had a 0 balance to start with!)


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## dsmrp (Feb 6, 2016)

*Costco AMEX use extended to June or mid-summer*

I just read in local news about Costco extending use of AMEX until June or so, depending upon the transitioning negotiations and agreements between AMEX and Citigroup.  No firm date just a time range 

Also good news to me, the Costco CFO said after the transition to Citigroup, they would accept ALL Visa cards, not just Citi's in their US stores. No mention about Canadian stores.

Well I got a few more months at least to add more costco purchase points on my Starwood card


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## DaveNV (Feb 6, 2016)

I just asked my Costco spouse about this extension, and I was told some things that bear repeating:

The date extension is accurate.  The reason is because there are more than 12 million Costco Amex cards in use.  American Express is anxious to convert those cards to another kind of Amex card, to keep their revenue stream flowing.  Citigroup wants to bring in those 12 million cardholders to their Costco Visa card as seamlessly as possible.  That means without a credit check (if possible), so no credit rating hit to the member, and so Citi can decide whether to accept that member into their rolls.  This process is taking longer than originally scheduled, because there are so many people it affects.

The major reason Costco is ending their relationship with Amex is because Costco sold the membership on these cards as having no annual fee for the card.  Amex wanted to charge people $70 annually to have the card.  Neither side would budge, and Costco ended the association with Amex.  So if you Sam's Club members are going to get an Amex through them, watch out for that annual fee - something tells me Amex would make Sam's go with that fee.

Yes, after the changeover, Costco will be accepting any Visa, not just Citi.  So if you have a  great card from elsewhere, you can use it at Costco.

The answer to the question about using Amex at Costco.com is "probably not."  Costco is ending their association with Amex rather sternly, so it's unlikely they will accept Amex anywhere.  But time will tell on that.

Dave


----------



## sjsharkie (Feb 6, 2016)

BMWguynw said:


> The major reason Costco is ending their relationship with Amex is because Costco sold the membership on these cards as having no annual fee for the card.  Amex wanted to charge people $70 annually to have the card.  Neither side would budge, and Costco ended the association with Amex.  So if you Sam's Club members are going to get an Amex through them, watch out for that annual fee - something tells me Amex would make Sam's go with that fee.


The Sam's Club situation is apples to oranges though.  Sam's accepts Visa, Mastercard and Discover in their B&M stores as well as (most recently) Amex.  I suspect the swipe fees are slightly higher as a result, and there may be a lesser need for an annual fee on any Sam's Club branded card.

As opposed to the Costco situation where I hear the swipe fees are nearing zero for Citi.

Of course as you point out, time will tell. I doubt a $70 annual fee branded Sam's Club card will be very successful.

-ryan


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## BevL (Feb 6, 2016)

dsmrp said:


> I just read in local news about Costco extending use of AMEX until June or so, depending upon the transitioning negotiations and agreements between AMEX and Citigroup.  No firm date just a time range
> 
> Also good news to me, the Costco CFO said after the transition to Citigroup, they would accept ALL Visa cards, not just Citi's in their US stores. *No mention about Canadian stores*.
> 
> Well I got a few more months at least to add more costco purchase points on my Starwood card



Just a quick note that the Costco AMEX is being replaced with a Capital One MasterCard.  Currently your options at Costco are any MasterCard, debit card - and your US one may or may not work - or cash.

The reason I make the comment about debit cards working is because my debit card will work in the Costco just across the border in Bellingham.  However, it didn't work last time I tried using it in California.  YMMV on that one.


----------



## IngridN (Feb 6, 2016)

Just had Costco AmEx card decline the yearly WSJ subscription. Didn't bother to find out why, just assumed it's because the card will be dead soon. It was something on my to do list anyway in addition to applying for another AmEx card for the insurance coverage.

Ingrid


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## MuranoJo (Feb 7, 2016)

Good to hear Costco will be accepting any Visa card.


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## pedro47 (Feb 7, 2016)

BevL said:


> Just a quick note that the Costco AMEX is being replaced with a Capital One MasterCard.  Currently your options at Costco are any MasterCard, debit card - and your US one may or may not work - or cash.
> 
> The reason I make the comment about debit cards working is because my debit card will work in the Costco just across the border in Bellingham.  However, it didn't work last time I tried using it in California.  YMMV on that one.



Am I reading this correctly Costco will accept both VISA and  Capital One Master Card after July?


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## dioxide45 (Feb 7, 2016)

pedro47 said:


> Am I reading this correctly Costco will accept both VISA and  Capital One Master Card after July?



No. The Capital One Master Card is or will be accepted in Canadian Costco stores and the Citi Visa will be accepted in US stores.


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## pedro47 (Feb 7, 2016)

dioxide45 said:


> No. The Capital One Master Card is or will be accepted in Canadian Costco stores and the Citi Visa will be accepted in US stores.



Thanks for the clarification.


----------



## BevL (Feb 7, 2016)

pedro47 said:


> Am I reading this correctly Costco will accept both VISA and  Capital One Master Card after July?



Sorry, didn't mean to confuse, when I posted about the MasterCard, I had highlighted the portion of the previous post relating to Canadian stores.


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## dougef (Feb 7, 2016)

To further clarify - in the US - A Costco Citibank Visa will be issued to replace the Costco Amex card.  US Costcos will, after the transition date, accept ALL Visa cards and only Visa cards at their stores.


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## DaveNV (Feb 7, 2016)

And to even further clarify, my Costco spouse (senior Refund Cashier at the Membership Desk) tells me that the American Costco Citi Visa will not be honored in Canadian warehouses, and the Capital One Costco MasterCard from Canada will not be honored in US warehouses, _ONLY FOR PURCHASES._ 

These cards are also the membership card, so they will work to get you in the door of the warehouse in either place, but if you want to buy something, you'll need another form of payment.

However, you should be able to continue using either card at Costco.com.  The website currently accepts both Visa and MasterCard.

Dave


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## Passepartout (Feb 7, 2016)

They did a great job of sidestepping me- or maybe it was the other way around. My Citi card is a Master Card, and my CapOne is a Visa. Just the opposite of what's the preference at Costco after the switch.

DW and I ran the numbers last night and decided that the Executive membership is costlier than a standard Costco membership at our spending level.  Back when her office supplies all went through it, the rebate paid for our membership, but now, not so much.

Jim


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## pedro47 (Feb 7, 2016)

Passepartout said:


> They did a great job of sidestepping me- or maybe it was the other way around. My Citi card is a Master Card, and my CapOne is a Visa. Just the opposite of what's the preference at Costco after the switch.
> 
> DW and I ran the numbers last night and decided that the Executive membership is costlier than a standard Costco membership at our spending level.  Back when her office supplies all went through it, the rebate paid for our membership, but now, not so much.
> 
> Jim



There wass a very good suggestion to look at the both Executive & Standard membership for our spending level now that we both retired.


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## DaveNV (Feb 7, 2016)

Passepartout said:


> They did a great job of sidestepping me- or maybe it was the other way around. My Citi card is a Master Card, and my CapOne is a Visa. Just the opposite of what's the preference at Costco after the switch.



But you'll be able to use that Cap One Visa in the warehouse after the switch. So there's that.



Passepartout said:


> DW and I ran the numbers last night and decided that the Executive membership is costlier than a standard Costco membership at our spending level.  Back when her office supplies all went through it, the rebate paid for our membership, but now, not so much.
> 
> Jim



The thing about whether it's worthwhile to upgrade to Executive is not only how much you spend annually, but whether you can use the other perks an Executive receives that Gold Star members don't receive.

If you spend at least $2750 a year at Costco, your 2% rebate check pays for the upgrade. Anything spent over that is cash in your pocket. That $2750 works out to $229 per month.  I know I spend more than that there every month.  

But even if you spend less than that, and your 2% check doesn't cover the $110 cost of the Executive membership, it may still offset the $55 cost of the Gold Star membership.  If the rebate check is more than $55, your membership cost is reduced by the amount over $55.

The next time you're in a warehouse, look for and pick up a booklet titled "My Costco Services." It describes a lot of non-merchandise services that make the Executive membership worthwhile.  

  -  For example, if you get Ameriprise auto insurance through Costco, an Executive member receives free Roadside Assistance.  Gold Star members don't receive that perk.  That's worth something like $80 a year.

  -  If you book a cruise through Costco Travel, Executive Members receive things that Gold Star members don't get.  For example, I booked a cruise to Alaska next year through Costco Travel.  We're getting a $285 Onboard Credit just because we're Executive members.

You never know when that big-screen TV in your living room will fail, or you need new glasses, or when your car will need new tires.  If you buy rain gutters or kitchen countertops or a home air conditioning system or whatever sold by outside vendors through Costco, not only do you get the cash cards frequently offered by those vendors, but the entire purchase is run through your warehouse membership - so if you're Executive, you'll get 2% of the purchase price back as cash in your pocket.

Check that booklet.  There are a lot of things in it.  If you can use any of those non-merchandise services and discounts, an Executive upgrade may easily pay for itself in more than 24-pack bricks of toilet paper.  

Dave


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## Passepartout (Feb 7, 2016)

BMWguynw said:


> If you spend at least *$2750 a year *at Costco, your 2% rebate check pays for the upgrade. Anything spent over that is cash in your pocket. That $2750 works out to* $229 per month*.  I know I spend more than that there every month.
> 
> Executive upgrade may easily pay for itself in more than 24-pack bricks of toilet paper.



That was pretty close to the number we came up with, and we rarely spend that monthly amount there, so next renewal, we'll prolly drop back to Gold Star. We just don't- or at least haven't found value in the other, non-warehouse services.

Interesting to scrutinize, as one ages and spending habits change, what memberships are important. Like our timeshares, lack of use, hassle to exchange, heirs that don't want them, ever increasing MFs. Life hands us changes.


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## johnrsrq (Feb 7, 2016)

I had the benefit of joining costco last year, used the  my business to choose the executive level , get one the last Amex costco cards with promo $250 (or so) credit after I spent the first $250 or so.

Then, Amex offered replacement non Costco's business card with another $300 promo after some spend level. I said , ok, free $300. great.
Amex sent me two cards.. did receive $600 total credit and use them as sam's. 

tried Costco , it's local location kinda tough, going to cancel but i have to take my earning check to the Costco front desk to redeem or so they told me.

free money free money


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## Ken555 (Feb 7, 2016)

BMWguynw said:


> If you book a cruise through Costco Travel, Executive Members receive things that Gold Star members don't get.  For example, I booked a cruise to Alaska next year through Costco Travel.  We're getting a $285 Onboard Credit just because we're Executive members.




I've booked several cruises thru Costco Travel. They're very helpful and I recommend them to others. However, I've never received any direct benefits being a Costco member, much less an Executive Member (which I've been for 15+ years, if not longer...). I've even asked them before about this and they said there's no benefit to being Exec for the cruises. 

Perhaps you're referring to a special Costco membership cruise, which does occur now and then, and which probably includes OBC for Exec members. If so, then your post should have been clearer. As it is, your post would lead us to conclude that every cruise from Costco Travel includes additional OBC for Exec members, and that's simply not accurate.


Sent from my iPad


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## Ken555 (Feb 7, 2016)

IngridN said:


> Just had Costco AmEx card decline the yearly WSJ subscription. Didn't bother to find out why, just assumed it's because the card will be dead soon. It was something on my to do list anyway in addition to applying for another AmEx card for the insurance coverage.
> 
> 
> 
> Ingrid




This had nothing to do with the change at Costco. I suggest you call AMEX and investigate why it was declined.


Sent from my iPad


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## DaveNV (Feb 7, 2016)

Ken555 said:


> I've booked several cruises thru Costco Travel. They're very helpful and I recommend them to others. However, I've never received any direct benefits being a Costco member, much less an Executive Member (which I've been for 15+ years, if not longer...). I've even asked them before about this and they said there's no benefit to being Exec for the cruises.
> 
> Perhaps you're referring to a special Costco membership cruise, which does occur now and then, and which probably includes OBC for Exec members. If so, then your post should have been clearer. As it is, your post would lead us to conclude that every cruise from Costco Travel includes additional OBC for Exec members, and that's simply not accurate.
> 
> ...



Ken, I was told the Onboard Credit included with the cruise I just booked is something Executive Members get, but that is not given to Gold Star members. It may be due to the timeframe, (my cruise is 18 months away), and may not be given to cruises booked closer to departure dates.  I don't know.  Being married to a 20+ year Costco career staffer, I've learned to listen, not ask questions.  

But now I plan to call Costco Travel and ask them about it.

Dave


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## Ken555 (Feb 7, 2016)

BMWguynw said:


> Ken, I was told the Onboard Credit included with the cruise I just booked is something Executive Members get, but that is not given to Gold Star members. It may be due to the timeframe, (my cruise is 18 months away), and may not be given to cruises booked closer to departure dates.  I don't know.  Being married to a 20+ year Costco career staffer, I've learned to listen, not ask questions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Yes, please do. I'd be curious what they tell you. They've been clear to me in that the OBC is based on the cost of the cruise, and they have a specific chart for OBC for each cruise (so it's not quite as simple as a % of cost for any cruise). This is why some cruises offer more OBC than others. 

I know other Costco members who are not Exec and received the same benefits as I. In fact, I was surprised when I learned that Exec members don't receive more than Gold, but then the profit margin on cruises, while still high compared to the rest of the travel industry, is not all that much.


Sent from my iPad


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## DaveNV (Feb 7, 2016)

Ken555 said:


> Yes, please do. I'd be curious what they tell you. They've been clear to me in that the OBC is based on the cost of the cruise, and they have a specific chart for OBC for each cruise (so it's not quite as simple as a % of cost for any cruise). This is why some cruises offer more OBC than others.
> 
> I know other Costco members who are not Exec and received the same benefits as I. In fact, I was surprised when I learned that Exec members don't receive more than Gold, but then the profit margin on cruises, while still high compared to the rest of the travel industry, is not all that much.
> 
> ...




If that's the case, then I get to share some "news" with my spouse. 

Dave


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## klpca (Mar 25, 2016)

*New Costco Visa info*

From The Points Guy

Looks good. 

4% cash back on eligible gas worldwide, including gas at Costco (up to $7,000 per year, then 1% back)
3% cash back on restaurant and eligible travel purchases worldwide
2% cash back on all other purchases from Costco and Costco.com
1% cash back on all other purchases


Read more: http://thepointsguy.com/2016/03/details-of-new-visa-card-at-costco/#ixzz43vZYL9D4


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## presley (Mar 25, 2016)

klpca said:


> From The Points Guy
> 
> Looks good.
> 
> ...



That does look good. Not sure if I want to go through unfreezing my credit report and then freezing it again, though. Maybe my husband can apply for the card and just add me as an authorized user.


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## IngridN (Mar 25, 2016)

presley said:


> That does look good. Not sure if I want to go through unfreezing my credit report and then freezing it again, though. Maybe my husband can apply for the card and just add me as an authorized user.



You won't have to unfreeze. No credit check. You will automatically receive a card in May at same limit.
https://www.citi.com/credit-cards/cr...ard-conversion

edit:  added link to Costco Visa

Ingrid


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## csxjohn (Mar 26, 2016)

I joined Costco last year mainly for the car rental rates.  I was talked into the higher membership level with the promise that if my refund amount did not cover the extra cost I could bring it in and they would make up the difference, so no cast to upgrade.  We shall see if that works out or not.

So, I have a question.

With the AMEX card I was able to sign up for primary CDW insurance with $0 deductible for a small fee of $20 or $25 per rental period depending on the coverage I wanted.  I like not having to worry about anything happening to the rental car, just walk away.  This only gets charged if and when I rent a car.

Does anyone know if the new Costco card company has anything similar to this or will I need to obtain a different AMEX card to keep the benefit?


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## dioxide45 (Mar 26, 2016)

csxjohn said:


> I joined Costco last year mainly for the car rental rates.  I was talked into the higher membership level with the promise that if my refund amount did not cover the extra cost I could bring it in and they would make up the difference, so no cast to upgrade.  We shall see if that works out or not.
> 
> So, I have a question.
> 
> ...



Guess we will need to see all the card T&C and benefits for more details. The coverage you are referring to is specific to Amex. There are other cards out there with primary CDW coverage. The Chase United MileagePlus card is one. No extra fee, just the regular annual fee.

They are now handing out slips of paper at our local Costco to people using an Amex that they will stop accepting them as of 6/20/2016. Also big signs at the Costco gas pumps.


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## csxjohn (Mar 30, 2016)

dioxide45 said:


> Guess we will need to see all the card T&C and benefits for more details. The coverage you are referring to is specific to Amex. There are other cards out there with primary CDW coverage. The Chase United MileagePlus card is one. No extra fee, just the regular annual fee.
> 
> They are now handing out slips of paper at our local Costco to people using an Amex that they will stop accepting them as of 6/20/2016. Also big signs at the Costco gas pumps.



In the mail yesterday we got some stuff explaining benefits.  "Travel with peace of mind.  Your new card provides Worldwide Car Rental Insurance, Worldwide Travel Accident Insurance and Trip Cancellation & Interruption Protection."

No details are provided and by going on line to the dedicated page for the new Costco card there are no details either.  By using the site map there appears to be more specific info but you need to be a current customer to see it.

https://www.citi.com/credit-cards/c...on&cmp=PAC~01~160323~CRDOTHER~Vanity~CostcoWC

I'm just hoping I don't need to get a new AMEX card to keep the coverage, I like what I have through them.  


I'll look into the chase card you mentioned if I need to find a replacement, thanks.


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## taterhed (Mar 30, 2016)

csxjohn said:


> In the mail yesterday we got some stuff explaining benefits. "Travel with peace of mind. Your new card provides Worldwide Car Rental Insurance, Worldwide Travel Accident Insurance and Trip Cancellation & Interruption Protection."
> 
> No details are provided and by going on line to the dedicated page for the new Costco card there are no details either. By using the site map there appears to be more specific info but you need to be a current customer to see it.
> 
> ...



The Costco Amex is not an efficient card (without Costco). Blue Cash Everyday or it's points equivalent are better (for lower usage $$$). The United Explorer is very good for rental insurance.

Here is a link for CC's that offer PRIMARY rental coverage:
http://thepointsguy.com/2015/07/credit-cards-that-offer-primary-car-rental-coverage/+

 As the new Costco card is so new, I think we'll have to 'wait and see' what comes to fruition. Seems like it changes quite a bit--so far for the better.


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## theo (Mar 30, 2016)

Fwiw, printed material being distributed at our local Costco, while obviously not legally binding, proclaims in writing that June 19, 2016 is very specifically the last date on which Amex will be accepted at any U.S. Costco. 

Flyer further states that new Costco Citibank VISA cards will have been issued by that date, and that *any* VISA card will be accepted at Costco thereafter as well.


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## rickandcindy23 (Mar 30, 2016)

When are we supposed to get these new Citibank Visa cards in the mail?  I thought it was going to happen by the end of this month, which is tomorrow.  Has anyone gotten the card?


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## Kozman (Mar 30, 2016)

gmarine said:


> Its only one store, thats not a reduction of much at all.  Costco will end up taking MC and/or Visa. No big deal.



I just bought gas at Costco. They had a sign that they will be taking VISA. I did not see Mastercard on the list.


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## uop1497 (Mar 30, 2016)

If I do not want to have another 2 cc (Citibank) from Costco, is there a way to prevented.    If you do know the answer please share. I am thinking to close my Costco account now and reapply after . Will that work


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## Ken555 (Mar 30, 2016)

Kozman said:


> I just bought gas at Costco. They had a sign that they will be taking VISA. I did not see Mastercard on the list.



They will not be accepting MC.


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## IngridN (Mar 30, 2016)

uop1497 said:


> If I do not want to have another 2 cc (Citibank) from Costco, is there a way to prevented.    If you do know the answer please share. I am thinking to close my Costco account now and reapply after . Will that work



I have heard that if you cancel your AmEx now, you will not automatically receive the Visa. You will receive a replacement Visa if your Costco branded AmEx is active.

Ingrid


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## ThreeLittleBirds (Mar 30, 2016)

We have the Costco Amex. We were told by Amex that 3/31 was the last day it would work at Costco, and sometime this summer, they card will completely go away (unfortunately, any balance on the card does not go away with it...lol). You can continue to make payments on the card, but won't be able to use it to make purchases. Amex did not have an exact date that this would happen.

I didn't realize our card would automatically be replaced. I'll have to keep an eye on this thread to make sure ours doesn't get lost in the junk mail shuffle.


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## theo (Mar 30, 2016)

rickandcindy23 said:


> *When are we supposed to get these new Citibank Visa cards in the mail?*  I thought it was going to happen by the end of this month, which is tomorrow.  Has anyone gotten the card?



"Beginning June 20, the only accepted forms of payment at Costco warehouses in the U.S. will be Visa cards, cash, checks, debit/ATM cards, EBT and Costco Cash cards. American Express will no longer be accepted at Costco in the U.S. after June 19.

Members with Costco cards from American Express will automatically receive new Visa cards from Citibank to replace their cards.

Cardholders will receive important account *information* *from Citibank beginning April, 2016*.

Cardholders will be mailed their *new credit cards* *in May or early June, 2016*.

Cardholders may start using their new Visa credit cards beginning June 20, 2016."
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The above is quoted *verbatim*, in pertinent part, directly from the printed sheet I picked up yesterday while at our local Costco.


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## DaveNV (Mar 30, 2016)

theo said:


> "Beginning June 20, the only accepted forms of payment at Costco warehouses in the U.S. will be Visa cards, cash, checks, debit/ATM cards, EBT and Costco Cash cards. American Express will no longer be accepted at Costco in the U.S. after June 19.
> 
> Members with Costco cards from American Express will automatically receive new Visa cards from Citibank to replace their cards.
> 
> ...





The whole process was delayed a couple of months because Citi is processing through the entire portfolio of cardholders they bought from Amex.  There are several million cardholders.  Because they're doing everything without doing current credit checks, it's taking longer than they had planned.

Dave


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## csxjohn (Mar 31, 2016)

IngridN said:


> I have heard that if you cancel your AmEx now, you will not automatically receive the Visa. You will receive a replacement Visa if your Costco branded AmEx is active.
> 
> Ingrid



My mailing says "To receive your new card, your American Express account must remain open, current, and in good standing."


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## csxjohn (Mar 31, 2016)

taterhed said:


> The Costco Amex is not an efficient card (without Costco). Blue Cash Everyday or it's points equivalent are better (for lower usage $$$). The United Explorer is very good for rental insurance.
> 
> Here is a link for CC's that offer PRIMARY rental coverage:
> http://thepointsguy.com/2015/07/credit-cards-that-offer-primary-car-rental-coverage/+
> ...



Thank you for this info.  The current card will die at the deadline so keeping it is not an option.  I will look into the link you provided.


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## theo (Mar 31, 2016)

csxjohn said:


> <snip> The current card will die at the deadline so keeping it is not an option. <snip>



John:
Fwiw, despite the looming June 19, 2016 "sunset" date on Costco Amex cards, it's relatively easy to obtain a new, completely different replacement Amex card --- with little more than a phone conversation (1-888-246-1076) with American Express. I have already started the process to do so myself and will have a new (non-Costco) AmEx card / account *long* before the Costco AmEx "sunset" date in June.  

AmEx obviously already has all of your personal info on file, so will merely ask a few questions on current income and assets before just submitting a new application *for* you. Their "Blue Cash" AmEx card, for specific example, reportedly has *no* annual fee and yet provides cardholder access and option to purchase primary insurance for car rentals, at least as I understand it.

That being said, if you've had a Costco-issued AmEx for only a year, as I seem to have read somewhere "upstream" in this thread, you *may* have some additional hoops to jump through or additional questions to answer to obtain a new, different (non-Costco) AmEx card / account. Surely it's worth a toll free phone call to find out, no?  

P.S. I am not in any way associated with (or on commission for) AmEx. Truth to tell, aside from Costco and the car rental primary insurance purchase option, there are other cards I use and prefer (and will continue to) for other, unrelated reasons.


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## csxjohn (Mar 31, 2016)

theo said:


> John:
> Fwiw, despite the looming June 19, 2016 "sunset" date on Costco Amex cards, it's relatively easy to obtain a new, completely different replacement Amex card --- with little more than a phone conversation (1-888-246-1076) with American Express. I have already started the process to do so myself and will have a new (non-Costco) AmEx card / account *long* before the Costco AmEx "sunset" date in June.
> 
> AmEx obviously already has all of your personal info on file, so will merely ask a few questions on current income and assets before just submitting a new application *for* you. Their "Blue Cash" AmEx card, for specific example, reportedly has *no* annual fee and yet provides cardholder access and option to purchase primary insurance for car rentals, at least as I understand it.
> ...



Thanks, that is one of my options, I've briefly looked at the various AMEX cards and when I signed on for the rental car protection it did say any additional cards would also be included in the coverage.

I have to now wait to see details on the new card and what kind of rental and accident coverage it will have before I apply again with AMEX.

I currently pay $20 or $25 for the primary rental coverage, I think I opted for the $25 for higher coverage and I like that it gets charged automatically when I rent.

I don't rent a lot right now but with age, driving is getting more tiring and we are planning to start flying more.

Hopefully Citi will have details soon.


----------



## theo (Apr 1, 2016)

csxjohn said:


> Thanks, that is one of my options, I've briefly looked at the various AMEX cards and when I signed on for the rental car protection it did say any additional cards would also be included in the coverage.
> 
> I have to now wait to see details on the new card and what kind of rental and accident coverage it will have before I apply again with AMEX.
> 
> ...



Your call and your decision, of course, but keep in mind that it *won't* be as simple and easy as a phone call to obtain a different AmEx card *after* the June 19 "drop dead" date for current Costco AmEx cards.    

You could opt to get a different (no annual fee) AmEx card now, while it's still very easy to do so --- and if the Citibank Visa proves to be every bit as good (...unlikely, IMnsHO) just cancel the new AmEx card later. 

Not peddling or promoting AmEx, just offering food for thought.


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## "Roger" (Apr 1, 2016)

I want to thank John for alerting me to the fact that with AmEx you can sign up to have their card become primary coverage for car rentals at $20 to $25 per shot. Like most people, my personal auto insurance will cover rentals, but, having looked more into this, I found that if you do damage a rental car, obtaining and submitting the necessary paper work to your own insurance can be quite a hassle. You will then be rewarded for your efforts by having your premiums go up.  (I strongly suspect that if you are ticketed, your rates will go up anyway, but not if you are not.) Hopefully, AmEx will extend this possibility to the Blue Cash Back card they are promoting.  

I did decide to apply for the AmEx card. Two other factors that went into my decision:

The 3% cash back on supermarkets is worth far more to me than the 4% that Costco will offer on gas.

I called AmEx several weeks ago for completely unrelated reasons and got the big spiel to sign up for the Blue Cash Back card. The one argument that hit home was the claim that AmEx is the most proactive at supporting the card holder as opposed to the merchant in disputes.  (You might look at the thread about a Chase card holder's problems in this regard.)

One minor factor that also went  into my decision. With AmEx you never have to call about travel plans. On a recent trip I made the mistake of assuming that with most cards (since I knew this was true with AmEx), they know that you plan to travel (from monitoring reservations, etc.). On a recent trip to Arizona, I got caught with my Citibank card being denied because of suspected fraud. That problem was resolved when I was in a position to call, but not at the store. At the store, I was able to use my Costco AmEx card to pay for my charge, but, if I only had another Citibank card (for example, the new Costco card), I am not sure that it would have passed muster either. Not sure that I want my only cards to both be with the same underlying bank. 

Like Theo, I have no connections to AmEx outside of currently having a Costco card.


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## csxjohn (Apr 1, 2016)

theo said:


> Your call and your decision, of course, but keep in mind that it *won't* be as simple and easy as a phone call to obtain a different AmEx card *after* the June 19 "drop dead" date for current Costco AmEx cards.
> 
> You could opt to get a different (no annual fee) AmEx card now, while it's still very easy to do so --- and if the Citibank Visa proves to be every bit as good (...unlikely, IMnsHO) just cancel the new AmEx card later.
> 
> Not peddling or promoting AmEx, just offering food for thought.



Thank you again, I'm hoping I'll see the info from the new card before we too close to the deadline.  My plan is to get a no fee card from AMEX if much more time goes by without the info.


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## csxjohn (Apr 1, 2016)

"Roger" said:


> I want to thank John for alerting me to the fact that with AmEx you can sign up to have their card become primary coverage for car rentals at $20 to $25 per shot. ....



I have to give the credit to TUG member "Blues" who told me about this in a thread I started on car rentals from Costco.

What I really like about it is there is no deductible unlike my insurance.


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## easyrider (Apr 3, 2016)

We were not sure of what Costco is doing regarding AMEX so we called AMEX and got their Hilton's Rewards Card. They gave us a bonus of 75000 Hilton points to add to our Hilton account. 

Im not sure if I should cancel the Costco AMEX card and I do not need a Citi Bank card. 

So what is everyone doing. Does the Costco Amex turn into a Citi Bank card and if so does Citi Bank offer a reward for our business ?

Bill


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## Ken555 (Apr 3, 2016)

easyrider said:


> We were not sure of what Costco is doing regarding AMEX so we called AMEX and got their Hilton's Rewards Card. They gave us a bonus of 75000 Hilton points to add to our Hilton account.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Asked and answered. Read the thread.


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## amycurl (Apr 3, 2016)

Did everyone else get the "welcome"/ teaser packet from Citi this past week? (I think my came on Thursday or Friday.) Not heaps of detail. 

Genuinely torn. I've been very disappointed by Citi (we have one of their cards, but don't use it for purchases,) and tend not to like to support the big, risky banks (and Citi is one of the biggest, and riskiest,) because I don't think their business plans are good for the country. I have other Visa cards I could use at Costco, but I've gotten used to the cash back.

I have a Delta Amex we could go back to using more regularly. But I'm also considering the Marriott Visa as well. 

I don't want to forfeit the Amex rewards we have already earned on this card since getting our reward check, so we will probably keep the Citi card for maybe the first year and then take it from there.


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## csxjohn (Apr 3, 2016)

amycurl said:


> Did everyone else get the "welcome"/ teaser packet from Citi this past week? (I think my came on Thursday or Friday.) Not heaps of detail.
> 
> Genuinely torn. I've been very disappointed by Citi (we have one of their cards, but don't use it for purchases,) and tend not to like to support the big, risky banks (and Citi is one of the biggest, and riskiest,) because I don't think their business plans are good for the country. I have other Visa cards I could use at Costco, but I've gotten used to the cash back.
> 
> ...



Without going back and reading the mailer I think it said all earned rewards will be transferred to the new citi card when it takes over.

What will I do?  Not sure yet, waiting for more details on the new citi card.  Rebates seem good at first glance but I'll wait and see what the other bennies are in detail.


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## Kozman (Apr 3, 2016)

Ken555 said:


> They will not be accepting MC.



Probably because Sam's Club has their Mastercard with 5% gas cash back.


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## pedro47 (Apr 4, 2016)

How much will the finance charge be on the Citi Costco VISA Card ? I cannot find any information on this question.


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## amycurl (Apr 4, 2016)

csxjohn said:


> Without going back and reading the mailer I think it said all earned rewards will be transferred to the new citi card when it takes over.



Yes, so if you cancel the Citi card before you get the year-end reward check, you lose about four months rewards earned on the Amex card. I'd rather they just cash us out when they cancel the Amex card, so then you wouldn't lose them if you decided not to switch to the Citi card. I mean, it makes sense for them, just not for us.


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## pedro47 (Apr 4, 2016)

amycurl said:


> Did everyone else get the "welcome"/ teaser packet from Citi this past week? (I think my came on Thursday or Friday.) Not heaps of detail.
> 
> Genuinely torn. I've been very disappointed by Citi (we have one of their cards, but don't use it for purchases,) and tend not to like to support the big, risky banks (and Citi is one of the biggest, and riskiest,) because I don't think their business plans are good for the country. I have other Visa cards I could use at Costco, but I've gotten used to the cash back.
> 
> ...



We also rec'd the welcome package; but it did not mention how much their finance charges are going to be. Does anyone have any ideas?


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## csxjohn (Apr 4, 2016)

pedro47 said:


> We also rec'd the welcome package; but it did not mention how much their finance charges are going to be. Does anyone have any ideas?



I'm only guessing but I imagine it will be the same as their other cards and when you look at those it show a range.  I'm pretty sure it will be as high as is allowed by the state you live in.

Their other cards range from 12.24 to 23.24 depending on your credit worthiness.


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## easyrider (Apr 15, 2016)

pedro47 said:


> We also rec'd the welcome package; but it did not mention how much their finance charges are going to be. Does anyone have any ideas?



My Citi package arrived today.

The apr on the balance shows as 15.49%. This purchase apr will vary with the market based on prime rate.

APR for cash advance is 25.49% and varys.

Penalty APR is 29.49% and lasts at least 12 billing cycles.

There is a minimum interest charge of $0.50. 

I haven't been able to actually see the full Citi Costco auto rental benifit. Since I have the Hiltons Honors AMEX that does have the auto rental benifit I like, I think Im going to say no to the Citi Visa.

Bill


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## Kal (Apr 15, 2016)

The 3% foreign transaction fee is fitting :annoyed:


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## gregb (Apr 18, 2016)

Especially since AmEx dropped the foreign transaction fee, at least it did on my Starwood card.

Greg



Kal said:


> The 3% foreign transaction fee is fitting :annoyed:


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