# Just Purchased Westin Lagunamar



## sherilah (Jul 31, 2008)

Hello, 

My husband and I are new to the ts world.  We recently returned from Maui, bought Kaui, then after reading many TUG posts, rescinded our offer.  We really loved SVO over the other TS companies out there.  I had already been speaking to a Starwood rep about other possibilities, but got caught up in the ts presentation in Maui. After a lot of thought, we purchased a 2 bedroom lockoff platinum season at Lagunamar.  In addition, we decided to pay the extra $$$ and purchase the EOY option during gold season.  

We are VERY excited about the Cancun property, since we see ourselved going to Cancun in the near future.  We are also excited about going to the other Starwood properties, as well as using points in the reward's system.  We were NOT excited about Kaui when we purchased it...we were going to use it to go to other Starwood properties...just so you know where we are coming from!

Just curious as to what you guys think of the Lagunamar.  I know it has yet to open.  Do you think it's a good deal??  Do you think it'll trade well???  

Like I said, we are new to the ts world, so any thoughts would be appreciated!!


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## DeniseM (Jul 31, 2008)

> Do you think it's a good deal??



Frankly, I can't understand why you bought from the developer again.   Even though it's not open, Lagunamar is already being sold on the resale market.

With your goals, you could have saved a lot of money by buying an EOY resale at Lagunamar - to use.

And an EOY resale at a mandatory resort - to exchange.



> Do you think it'll trade well???


As far as the trading value of Lagunamar, all Staroptions are equal in value, so Staroptions from the cheapest bottomfeeder Starwood resort are equal in value to Staroptions from the most popular resorts.


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## sherilah (Jul 31, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> Frankly, I can't understand why you bought from the developer again.   Even though it's not open, Lagunamar is already being sold on the resale market.
> 
> With your goals, you could have saved a lot of money by buying an EOY resale at Lagunamar - to use.
> 
> ...



We didn't want to buy resale because of the inability to convert our Star Options to points.  Some years, we will definitely convert part or all of our villa to points to use at other Starwood properties, such as W's, St Regis, etc.  We like the flexibility.  

I wasn't aware that we were buying from the developer.  I contacted Starwood Vacations directly....was I actually dealing with the developer???  Now I'm confused!


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## DeniseM (Jul 31, 2008)

sherilah said:


> We didn't want to buy resale because of the inability to convert our Star Options to points.  Some years, we will definitely convert part or all of our villa to points to use at other Starwood properties, such as W's, St Regis, etc.  We like the flexibility.



Unfortunately, the conversion rate to Starpoints is very poor, and you will not have enough Starpoints for a week in a standard room at a W, St. Regis, etc. I have a hard time giving up a week in a 2 bdm. villa for a few nights in a standard room.



> I wasn't aware that we were buying from the developer.  I contacted Starwood Vacations directly....was I actually dealing with the developer???  Now I'm confused!



Yes - Starwood Vacations IS the developer.


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## Twinkstarr (Jul 31, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> Frankly, I can't understand why you bought from the developer again.   Even though it's not open, Lagunamar is already being sold on the resale market.
> .



This comment peaked my curiosity, so I went over to Redweek. Yep 3 resales already. Including a EOY odd 2br float. 

I guess I would at least use it once(just to see what I bought) before selling it.


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## sherilah (Jul 31, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> Unfortunately, the conversion rate to Starpoints is very poor, and you will not have enough Starpoints for a week in a standard room at a W, St. Regis, etc. I have a hard time giving up a week in a 2 bdm. villa for a few nights in a standard room.



We want to at least have the option.  How much do resales at mandatory resorts go for if we wanted to get a 2 bedroom lockoff in Platinum season?  We wouldn't buy 2 different ones....my husband said 3 strikes and we're out of the ts system.  We already rescinded a DVC resale, Kaui....if I tell him about this, he probably won't speak to me!!!!



> Yes - Starwood Vacations IS the developer.



Gotcha!  Thanks for all of your very informative info!


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## DeniseM (Jul 31, 2008)

In the Owner Resources Sticky at the top of the board there is a link to the Starwood ebay sales database that has current resale prices.

There aren't any Lagunamar weeks listed yet, but the mandatory resales are:

* Harborside at Atlantis
* Vistana Villages (except Amelia & St. Augustine)
* Westin St. John (except Bay Vista)
* Westin Ka'anapali & Westin Ka'anapali-North
* Westin Kierland Villas 

Westin Kierland is often considered the best buy on the resale Mkt.


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## grgs (Jul 31, 2008)

sherilah said:


> How much do resales at mandatory resorts go for if we wanted to get a 2 bedroom lockoff in Platinum season?



The least expensive mandatory resale worth 148,100 options is a 2 bd platinum
unit at the Westin Kierland Villas in Scottsdale.  You can probably pick one up for around $22K, maybe less given the current economy.

Glorian


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## sherilah (Jul 31, 2008)

grgs said:


> The least expensive mandatory resale worth 148,100 options is a 2 bd platinum
> unit at the Westin Kierland Villas in Scottsdale.  You can probably pick one up for around $22K, maybe less given the current economy.
> 
> Glorian



I know my husband would rather spend the extra $$$ to have the reward options.  It was something we discussed in great length. Also, we want the Elite status.


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## DeniseM (Jul 31, 2008)

I am going to guess you paid around $40K?  And you can buy a 2 bdm. at Westin Kierland worth the same number of Staroptions for 22K - so that means that it's worth $18,000 to you to be able to convert to Starpoints?

Are you planning to buy more weeks to reach Elite Status?  If you are, then you  should definitely buy resale first so you can requalify it (bring a resale into the SVN) when you buy another week from the developer.

What are your goals for becoming an Elite member?

Here are the number of Staroptions you must own to reach Elite Status:

*3 Star Elite = Interval ownership equivalent to at least 159,000 StarOptions

4 Star Elite = Interval ownership equivalent to at least 359,000 StarOptions

5 Star Elite = Interval ownership equivalent to at least 559,000 StarOptions
*
And here is a link to the Elite perks for each level:  https://www.mystarcentral.com/elite/chart.html

As you can see, there is no real value until you reach the 5 Star level.

Sheri - I am not trying to pick on you, but I hate to see someone make an expensive mistake.  I hope it all works out for you.  Good luck my friend!


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## sherilah (Jul 31, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> I am going to guess you paid around $40K?  And you can buy a 2 bdm. at Westin Kierland worth the same number of Staroptions for 22K - so that means that it's worth $18,000 to you to be able to convert to Starpoints?
> 
> For some reason, I can't find the sticky that leads me to the resales....I don't know why!  Ugh!  Yes, I think it's around $42k...like I said, if I bring this up to my husband, I'll end up w/nothing, so at this point, yes, it's worth the extra $18,000!!!
> 
> ...




Thanks again, Denise....you know your stuff!


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## DeniseM (Jul 31, 2008)

I'm sorry to throw so much stuff at you at once, but if you are still within the rescission period, I want to give you the info. you need to make an informed decision.

You are lucky that you found TUG - if it makes you feel any better, we bought our first timeshare BEFORE we found TUG and paid the developer abut $45K. - That same week sells for less than $30K now!  

However, we still love timesharing, we learned from our mistakes, and we bought 5 more weeks since then - all resale and for less then $5,000 TOTAL!


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## sherilah (Jul 31, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> I'm sorry to throw so much stuff at you at once, but if you are still within the rescission period, I want to give you the info. you need to make an informed decision.
> 
> You are lucky that you found TUG - if it makes you feel any better, we bought our first timeshare BEFORE we found TUG and paid the developer abut $45K. - That same week sells for less than $30K now!
> 
> However, we still love timesharing, we learned from our mistakes, and we bought 5 more weeks since then - all resale and for less then $5,000 TOTAL!



That makes me feel better....I found the sticky you were talking about...thanks again.  

Question:  If we bought a resale SVO TS can you use it for II exchanges???  Is that an option or no???  Thanks!


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## DeniseM (Jul 31, 2008)

sherilah said:


> That makes me feel better....I found the sticky you were talking about...thanks again.
> 
> Question:  If we bought a resale SVO TS can you use it for II exchanges???  Is that an option or no???  Thanks!



Yes - all Starwood timeshares, (resale or developer) can be used for II exchanges, and because Starwood owners can see and reserve other Starwood timeshare 3 days before everyone else (on II's website) it's actually quite a good deal.

For a good overview of how Starwood works, check out the Starwood FAQ at the top of the page.


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## tomandrobin (Jul 31, 2008)

Can you buy cheaper...yes/maybe....eventually. 

Most of us have bought from the developer at least once. No shame in that. We bought a Lagunamar EOY week also, sight unseen. I we love Cancun and are looking forward to our future trips to the resort.


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## tomandrobin (Jul 31, 2008)

Also, I do agree with the others, that if you are going to buy from the developer, you might as well buy a resale unit and have it requalified.


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## DeniseM (Jul 31, 2008)

tomandrobin said:


> Can you buy cheaper...yes/maybe....eventually.



Tom - there are already Lagunamar resales for sale.


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## DavidnRobin (Jul 31, 2008)

sherilah said:


> I know my husband would rather spend the extra $$$ to have the reward options.  It was something we discussed in great length. Also, we want the Elite status.



DeniseM is a kind and gentle person... I will be more frank...

It sounds as if you are trying to justify to yourself to go forward with this purchase - it is not uncommon.  However, bottom-line is that the money you would save buying resale far outweighs the (so-called) benefits of buying from SVO - for example the SO-SP conversion.  Do the math - it doesn't work (in most cases) unless you really work the system - and even then it is questionable.  IMO

If you are truly interested in getting an Elite status that is worthwhile - then you will need to get to 5* Elite in order to get to PFL (Platinum-for-Life) since the other levels are not worth the cost.  This 5*Elite/PFL benefit can be had for a good price (I guess), but involves buying some SVO VOIs resale then requalifying them with (as cheap as possible) SVO purchases since 559K SOs are required to get to 5* - and PFL will still need to be available.

We are of the mind to buy where you want to go - so for us - PFL would be quite expensive.

If money is no object - than I say go for it. However, if $ is a consideration - then rescind and research before you proceed.

Don't get me wrong - we love the SVO system and our TSs - it works well for us. We actually did buy EOY WPORV from SVO after we purchased 2 resale VOIs - but that is with some caveats (excellent price, tons of SPs, and a requal were involved) - but at least I went in knowing that we would likely take up to a $10K loss in our WPORV purchase - so the incentives had to be worth it.

Anyway - not meant to be harsh - and to each his own - but most of the experience obtained from this forum on TUG would not to buy from SVO unless under very specific conditions (like the money tree is shedding and you can't rake it in fast enough) and buy resale if the SVO system fits your needs.  Even then you will get argument...

best of luck.


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## capjak (Jul 31, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Hello,
> 
> Just curious as to what you guys think of the Lagunamar.  I know it has yet to open.  Do you think it's a good deal??  Do you think it'll trade well???
> 
> Like I said, we are new to the ts world, so any thoughts would be appreciated!!



I am assuming you got the following:

2 bedroom EOY gold for about $19,000, this will convert to 81000 staroptions and 48,000 starpoints and an incentive around 75,000 starpoints. Close?

 unfortunately 48,000 starpoints every other year for a maintenace fee of $1350 will not get  you much, check the starwood site out.  

So the starpoint conversion will not meet your travel needs and the staroptions of 81,000 will get a 1 bedroom in Hawaii.

So I do not think this will meet your travel goals.

I would rescind and read/learn etc..You will be able to take a trip to Cancun for very little $$$ as they are trying to sell the resort, look for specials for timeshare presentations.


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## tomandrobin (Jul 31, 2008)

capjak said:


> So the starpoint conversion will not meet your travel needs and the staroptions of 81,000 will get a 1 bedroom in Hawaii.



If I was going to travel to Hawii, I would lock-off the unit and deposit into II and trade into Hawaii. Staroptions are a mute point these days in Hawaii. In a couple more years, with the new resorts, it'll be as easy as trading into Vistana.


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## capjak (Jul 31, 2008)

Tomandrobin:  Good point, Harborside?


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## tomandrobin (Jul 31, 2008)

Harborside and St John are now the elite two! 

I was hoping that with Bay Vista addition that it would be easier to trade into WSJ, but it hasn't happened yet. 

Harborside is easy trade in Sept/Oct


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## sherilah (Jul 31, 2008)

DavidnRobin said:


> DeniseM is a kind and gentle person... I will be more frank...
> 
> It sounds as if you are trying to justify to yourself to go forward with this purchase - it is not uncommon.  However, bottom-line is that the money you would save buying resale far outweighs the (so-called) benefits of buying from SVO - for example the SO-SP conversion.  Do the math - it doesn't work (in most cases) unless you really work the system - and even then it is questionable.  IMO
> 
> ...



Thank you!!!  I'm really looking forward to my new TUG membership for feedback, etc!!

Sheri


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## sherilah (Jul 31, 2008)

capjak said:


> I am assuming you got the following:
> 
> 2 bedroom EOY gold for about $19,000, this will convert to 81000 staroptions and 48,000 starpoints and an incentive around 75,000 starpoints. Close?
> 
> ...



We actually bought a 2 bdrm lockoff, platinum season $42k, 148,000 SO + an additional EOY studio for an extra $7k that's worth I think 22,000 SO.  

Hey, is it worth it to buy the 85,000 points for $1800?  I know they offered that to us when we were in Maui (before we rescinded)....I assume we have the same option do purchase that. 

Our travel goals are to be able to be as flexible as possible.  We like Cancun, we like the price, we like the ability to use the star points.


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## sherilah (Jul 31, 2008)

How hard is it to get into St John or Harborside in the summer months?  Is it easier if you do it exactly at 8 months or is it better to wait till the 3 month mark?  Many times, we go away less than a week....

Also, is everyone pretty much happy w/Starwood as far as timeshares go???


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## sherilah (Jul 31, 2008)

tomandrobin said:


> Also, I do agree with the others, that if you are going to buy from the developer, you might as well buy a resale unit and have it requalified.



What does "requalified" mean?  Sorry, I'm a newbeeeee!


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## Beaglemom3 (Jul 31, 2008)

I'd just like to say that I am in the process of closing on a resale, 2 bed, Westin St John, annual week 32, with 81,000 StarOptions. I will not get StarPoints, but at $12,000, I can live with the price difference.

Please don't misunderstand, I'm not gloating or anything like that. I am grateful that I followed this thread for a year and bought resale, thereby saving a lot of money. 

StarPoints would be nice, but saving ~$20k from what the developer is asking is better for my travel and financial needs.  

You can have the best of both worlds by requaling.

The requalifying thread here is invaluable information.


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## capjak (Jul 31, 2008)

sherilah said:


> We actually bought a 2 bdrm lockoff, platinum season $42k, 148,000 SO + an additional EOY studio for an extra $7k that's worth I think 22,000 SO.
> 
> .



Whats a requal?   

That is the ability to take a resale and requalify it into starwood so that you get all the benefits as if you purchased directly like you did your cancun timeshares.

For example:

You could purchase Westin Mission Hills 148,000 staroptions and 72,000 starpoints resale for $11,000 annual use and than go to starwood and purchase your same Cancun 2bd room for 42,000 under the condition that they "requalify" your WMH so that you earn staroptions and starpoints annually.

Go to the FAQ at the top of this forum for more in depth examples etc...

If you rescind you could do this and end up with 296,000 staroptonis a year or convert to 144,000 starpoints per year.  Now that will get some nice vacations.


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## gmarine (Jul 31, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Hello,
> 
> My husband and I are new to the ts world.  We recently returned from Maui, bought Kaui, then after reading many TUG posts, rescinded our offer.  We really loved SVO over the other TS companies out there.  I had already been speaking to a Starwood rep about other possibilities, but got caught up in the ts presentation in Maui. After a lot of thought, we purchased a 2 bedroom lockoff platinum season at Lagunamar.  In addition, we decided to pay the extra $$$ and purchase the EOY option during gold season.
> 
> ...



 $20K plus is way too much just for the ability to trade for points. And hopefully you paid cash and didnt consider financing a timeshare purchase this large.

Your admittedly new to timesharing. Rescind then take your time to learn before you jump in and spend $49K.


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## sherilah (Aug 1, 2008)

capjak said:


> Whats a requal?
> 
> That is the ability to take a resale and requalify it into starwood so that you get all the benefits as if you purchased directly like you did your cancun timeshares.
> 
> ...



Now I'm REALLY confused...I thought you wouldn't get starpoints if you purchase resale....?????  So you're saying you can buy something resale and tell Starwood you'll buy another piece as long as they'll "requalify" your resale?????  Do they normally do this????  

Like I said previously, I've been talking my husband's ear off about timeshares.  He meant it when he said 3 strikes we're out...if we rescind this offer, he/we will be done.  I should've bought my TUG membership before all of this!!


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## Beaglemom3 (Aug 1, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Now I'm REALLY confused...I thought you wouldn't get starpoints if you purchase resale....?????  So you're saying you can buy something resale and tell Starwood you'll buy another piece as long as they'll "requalify" your resale?????  Do they normally do this????
> 
> Like I said previously, I've been talking my husband's ear off about timeshares.  He meant it when he said 3 strikes we're out...if we rescind this offer, he/we will be done.  I should've bought my TUG membership before all of this!!




I think that by reading everything on the many threads here, you would stand to gain, or keep in your pocket, a lot.

I think this may be hepful. There are others, too
http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24046&highlight=requal+resale
and http://www.tug2.net/advice/Starwood_Vacation_Network.htm


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## VacationPro (Aug 1, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Now I'm REALLY confused...I thought you wouldn't get starpoints if you purchase resale....?????  So you're saying you can buy something resale and tell Starwood you'll buy another piece as long as they'll "requalify" your resale?????  Do they normally do this????
> 
> Like I said previously, I've been talking my husband's ear off about timeshares.  He meant it when he said 3 strikes we're out...if we rescind this offer, he/we will be done.  I should've bought my TUG membership before all of this!!



I'm sure if you explain this as a decision to delay the purchase and explain that you can get much more by going the route suggested here, he will understand.  You can essentially get 296,200 SOs for around $50K or 148,100 for $42K.

There are many SVN pros here, listen to them and you will save a great deal of money and will learn how to maximize the value you receive.  I come here regularly and I am still learning the finer points.


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## sherilah (Aug 1, 2008)

VacationPro said:


> I'm sure if you explain this as a decision to delay the purchase and explain that you can get much more by going the route suggested here, he will understand.  You can essentially get 296,200 SOs for around $50K or 148,100 for $42K.
> 
> There are many SVN pros here, listen to them and you will save a great deal of money and will learn how to maximize the value you receive.  I come here regularly and I am still learning the finer points.



Honestly, it sounds like a pain in the butt to start searching for a resale, rescinding (which we already did a week ago w/Kaui), all the paperwork again, making a deal, waiting, etc.  We don't go away THAT much to have all of those staroptions.  In fact, I don't know what we'd do w/them!!!  

When my husband says 3 strikes, I'm seriously out!  He'll take the loss just so he doesn't have to it from me!  It's all we've been talking about for the last month!  We almost bought a destination club membership, which is a whole other ball game.  

I do appreciate everyone's effort and advice.


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## DeniseM (Aug 1, 2008)

sherilah said:


> How hard is it to get into St John or Harborside in the summer months?  Is it easier if you do it exactly at 8 months or is it better to wait till the 3 month mark?  Many times, we go away less than a week....



These are the 2 hardest exchanges in the Starwood system, especially St. John and it is really difficult to get a Resv. for less than a week, because you can't do it until 90 days out, and by then everything is usually gone at the more popular resorts.  The Starwood system works best for weekly reservations and in general, timesharing requires advanced planning - like 12 mos. out, to get the reservations you want.



> Also, is everyone pretty much happy w/Starwood as far as timeshares go???



At the top of the board you will see a poll entitled, "If I could go back and do Starwood all over again," that addresses this question.  You will see that about 31% of the people polled would buy Starwood all over again, with no changes, and about 2/3, would do something differently.  You will also see that about 31% would buy resale if they had it to do all over again and only about 3% would go back and buy from the developer!

For a good background on how Starwood works, and in introduction to many of the finer points, like requalifying, be sure to check out the Starwood FAQ at the top of the board.  It will answer many of your questions about Starwood.


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## SDKath (Aug 1, 2008)

Tell your husband to look at the numbers.  Anyone with a bit of patience will see that you just saved your family $20,000 to $30,000 by taking the advice above.

Katherine


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## Ken555 (Aug 1, 2008)

Some people just like to burn through money. If that's you, then keep the developer week and you'll be very happy with it. If you want to save, then rescind and buy resale. 'nuf said.


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## DavidnRobin (Aug 1, 2008)

Rescinding is easy - relax and take your time. You have just potentially saved a lot of money.

If you plan to move forward in the future and you have decided on SVO (as we did) - decide where you want to go and how many weeks of vacation you can handle.

Since you live in the LA area - I would consider buying at Westin Kierland (if Scottsdale fits you) in the Spring season - the MFs are cheap compared to other resorts - it is a great resort and you can use it to do a SVN exchange (at 8 months) and it is a Mandatory (must be in SVN and transfer if sold).  You will be able to exchange into most resorts (except WSJ and HRA will be difficult, but not impossible).  Plus - you can drive there.

If you want Cancun - buy resale - if you want 5*/PFL (need 5 weeks essentially) and you want to travel around on SOs/SPs because you have even more weeks - then read and learn - many have done here relatively cheap.

If you figure you want more SOs - and are going to requal - there are other SVO VOIs to buy to requal (some close to you) - because a big advantage of requaling is that for a Voluntary resort bought resale now can be like you bought it from SVO (w/ the SO-SP conversion). If you do not want 5*/PFL -I wouldn't worry about Elite status.  Remembering that the re-resale value is less.

Bottom-line - lots of ways to meet you vacation needs and the more time you spend researching - the more value you will find.

We did not go the cheap route - but we have some sweet vacation spots and units.  We could have saved some $, but you can't take it with you - and certainly it is a investment in vacation - and not a financial investment.  We can go - exchange - rent etc, (and do).  Enjoy.


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## LisaRex (Aug 1, 2008)

I've never been to Lagunamar but I've personally visited two Westin properties.  They are all really, really nice and I think that you and anyone you bring to Cancun (including your husband) will be very impressed.  So if you're okay with overspending, then I think you'll be very happy with the quality of what you bought. 

I was never interested in requalifying, either, because that involved buying two timeshares.  I don't want two timeshares. So if Lagunamar is where I wanted to be most years, then I'd buy there. And since you also want to trade within SVN, which is nothing to sneeze at, then you're one of the few people who has no recourse but to buy from the developer.  

The only matter I might bring up to my husband at this point is the view category.  Let's say you bought an ocean view villa from the developer for $30,000.  You could undoubtedly buy an ocean FRONT view on the resale market for the same or less.  To ME, the view trumps SVN membership.  Your mileage may vary. 

(If you did buy OF, you should realize that your view category does not travel to other resorts.  You won't get OV/OF anywhere but Lagunamar.)


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## sherilah (Aug 1, 2008)

Thanks to everyone's replies....we are not going to rescind this offer...it's done, so I won't be asking any more questions about that. Thanks for looking out for us, though!!

What have you guys heard about Lagunamar?  I know it hasn't opened yet....just curious as to what anybody knows about it!  

Thanks!!


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## tomandrobin (Aug 1, 2008)

Its in the heart of Cancun, directly on the Gulf. Looks to have a pool bar. Will be built in three phases. In phase 2 and phase 3, there will be a couple direct water front units that will be available for purchase (for a premium). It will have an infinity pool.


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## DavidnRobin (Aug 1, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Thanks to everyone's replies....we are not going to rescind this offer...it's done, so I won't be asking any more questions about that. Thanks for looking out for us, though!!
> 
> What have you guys heard about Lagunamar?  I know it hasn't opened yet....just curious as to what anybody knows about it!
> 
> Thanks!!



At least you inquired and made an informed decision.  There is a lot of info here on TUG - so make sure you lurk ever so often.

One thing you didn't mention was what view/unit-type you bought (and how much?) and what were you SP incentives for buying?  {or maybe I missed it...} One thing - if you want to negotiate - is to try and squeeze more incentive SPs out of them.

It is good to bank as many SPs as possible - and get an AMEX SPG card to build your points. We are up to 350K SPs and are going to use some this weekend to go up to the wine country (Sonoma) for Robin's BDay.  Two nights at 8500 SPs/nite (upgrade) for a room that has a $300 rake rate - probably $220 at discount - not too bad for SP usage.

Best of luck - come on back and say hello - and share you vacation experiences.


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## SDKath (Aug 1, 2008)

David

Sounds great!  Which hotel are you staying at?  I loooove the SPs for these 1-2 day overnight stays that would otherwise be too pricy for us to splurge on...

Katherine


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## sherilah (Aug 1, 2008)

DavidnRobin said:


> At least you inquired and made an informed decision.  There is a lot of info here on TUG - so make sure you lurk ever so often.
> 
> One thing you didn't mention was what view/unit-type you bought (and how much?) and what were you SP incentives for buying?  {or maybe I missed it...} One thing - if you want to negotiate - is to try and squeeze more incentive SPs out of them.
> 
> ...



Thanks, David.  We paid $42k and are getting Platinum 148,000 SO's and 80,000 SP's.  In addition, we are getting an EOY gold for 7k, 22,000 SO's, 15,0000 SP's.  Should we try to milk them for more since we are w/in the rescind period|?  

We actually opened up two AMEX cards, one for each at 12,000 SP's a pop. We are actually charging our purchase, so we're going to get lots of points that way.  

Have FUN in Sonoma.  Have you been?  I was up there last year for a wedding, and was in Napa a few months ago.  It's beautiful.  LOTS of amazing wine!!


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## sherilah (Aug 1, 2008)

It's a 2 bedroom lockoff...


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## grgs (Aug 1, 2008)

DavidnRobin said:


> One thing you didn't mention was what view/unit-type you bought (and how much?) and what were you SP incentives for buying?  {or maybe I missed it...}



I believe they're all sold as Ocean View.  See Denise M's Lagunamar page:

http://www.freewebs.com/denisetravels/starwoodnews.htm

(note: Since the above information was posted by Denise, Starwood has adjusted the Plat season Staroptions to 148,100 for the 2 bd LO; 81,000 for the 1 bd prem; 67,100 for the studio)

When we were in Cancun this past June, I walked by the resort on the beach side.  It does look like most of the units should have a decent OV.  Of course, it's hard to be sure until one see the actual view from inside the unit.

I am looking forward to exchanging in there, but it probably won't be for a few years yet.

Glorian


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## DavidnRobin (Aug 1, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Thanks, David.  We paid $42k and are getting Platinum 148,000 SO's and 80,000 SP's.  In addition, we are getting an EOY gold for 7k, 22,000 SO's, 15,0000 SP's.  Should we try to milk them for more since we are w/in the rescind period|?
> 
> We actually opened up two AMEX cards, one for each at 12,000 SP's a pop. We are actually charging our purchase, so we're going to get lots of points that way.
> 
> Have FUN in Sonoma.  Have you been?  I was up there last year for a wedding, and was in Napa a few months ago.  It's beautiful.  LOTS of amazing wine!!



Correct me if I am wrong - you bought both an EY platinum (148.1K SO, 80K SP) for $42K and an EOY Gold (22K SO, 15K SP) for $7K.  What are the MFs?

hmmm... To be honest {yes, I know you said you are set) - I would rescind the EOY Gold - since you should have no issue doing a SVN exchange at that time of year - and buy WKV resale and get more bang for your buck - and just exchange into Lagunamar - or other SVN resorts (buy at least 81K SO).

In fact - you could have bought WKV resale first - and then bought the Platinum Lagunamar and had the WKV requaled easily.  WKV can close very quickly - especially if you can find a good price at SmartChoice.

Is it just the 2 of you?  If so, you can buy a 1Bd Premium/Platinum EY at WKV (81K SO) for $10-12K (MF~$630), or for more (e.g. kids) - then buy a EOY 2Bd LO WKV (148.1K SO) for around the same price (MF ~$1100) - or a EY 2Bd LO Gold (81K SOs) for ~$8-9K.  Either way - you can buy and close fast - and then buy the Lagunamar and have the WKV requaled.

Sorry - I know you don't want the hassle - and the husband issue - but not sure what you are trying to get out of the EOY.  Funny - most here have one partner that deals with the TSs - and the other that doesn't want to be involved.  If it were me - I would look at all routes of ownership.

If you do not want to hassle You could threaten to cancel the EOY unless they compensate you with more SPs.  At least you could get a bit more SPs.

Sounds as if you are set with the Lagunamar Plat EY - but take a look at the recent EY WKORVN IV that just sold on eBay for 1/3 of what SVO sold them for.  And WKORVN (like WKV) is a Mandatory resort (holds value better historically).  That is a monster savings in buying resale.

yes - SVO salespeople hate TUG...
Enough said.

Good for you in getting the AMEX and using the card to purchase - we did the same and got tons of points when we bought EOY WPORV (~220K in total)

We live on the SF Peninsula - so yes... but it has been a while (sadly) - I just wanted to burn off some SPs and have a short get-away for the weekend (w/o traffic it is only about 60 mins away).  We are actually staying in Petaluma (closest SPG hotel) - it is a quaint town and not to far from many wineries, plus the Sonoma County Fair is going on in Santa Rosa (close-by).

Best.


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## LisaRex (Aug 1, 2008)

DavidnRobin said:


> Correct me if I am wrong - you bought both an EY platinum (148.1K SO, 80K SPSounds as if you are set with the Lagunamar Plat EY - but take a look at the recent EY WKORVN IV that just sold on eBay for 1/3 of what SVO sold them for.  And WKORVN (like WKV) is a Mandatory resort (holds value better historically).  That is a monster savings in buying resale.



I don't know, David, it depends on the MFs. Taking the hit on the purchase price and having much lower MFs year after year may in Cancun may make more sense than being saddled with a TS in a location they don't want with really high MFs, then having to trade in, thus losing any owner's priority (e.g. high floor) they they have.


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## sherilah (Aug 1, 2008)

I just asked my husband what the MF's are...he said 1200 something + 2 hundred something...then asked why I asked.  I just said I was curious...I'm telling you, we're not budging!  We pretty much wanted the additional piece to buy ourselves more time (July 1 vs March 31) in deciding what we're going to do for that year.  He thought 7k was nothing

....it's not just the two of us.  We have a 3 year old son (1 and DONE!)  We like to do trips w/o kids w/other couples as well as family trips.  We do many 2 nighters throughout the year.  As our son gets older, we assume he'll bring a friend on family trips.  Ts's will be perfect for that vs spending lots of $$$ on a suite at a hotel!!  Plus, we like the idea of not having to go out for breakfast and/or lunch everyday.  We were spending $50 a pop on breakfast while we were in HI for the TWO of us!  I love the idea of waking up, having a bowl of cereal and a cup of coffee on my balcony (even if it's a pool view), then heading down to the pool or excursion.  

Do any of you ts-ers ever venture out of ts properties and do Club Med vacations, etc?  I've been to Club Med Cancun....am kind of bummed to give that up...then again, I went there back when I was single!!  Now, supposedly, it's a family village....just curious!


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## gmarine (Aug 1, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Honestly, it sounds like a pain in the butt to start searching for a resale, rescinding (which we already did a week ago w/Kaui), all the paperwork again, making a deal, waiting, etc.  We don't go away THAT much to have all of those staroptions.  In fact, I don't know what we'd do w/them!!!
> 
> When my husband says 3 strikes, I'm seriously out!  He'll take the loss just so he doesn't have to it from me!  It's all we've been talking about for the last month!  We almost bought a destination club membership, which is a whole other ball game.
> 
> I do appreciate everyone's effort and advice.



How about you rescind, then I will do all the work for you in finding a resale and even pay for the closing for just half of the 20K you will save?


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## DeniseM (Aug 1, 2008)

sherilah said:


> I just asked my husband what the MF's are...he said 1200 something + 2 hundred something..



I think that's way low - look at this chart from Starwood.

I believe your annual week MF will be $1,347 a year 

And your every other year MF will be $763 a year

Total - $2,110 per year

That may or may not include your II fees.

Do you plan on leaving the purchase price on your AMEX and making payments?


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## DeniseM (Aug 1, 2008)

grgs said:


> I believe they're all sold as Ocean View.  See Denise M's Lagunamar page:
> 
> http://www.freewebs.com/denisetravels/starwoodnews.htm
> 
> (note: Since the above information was posted by Denise, Starwood has adjusted the Plat season Staroptions to 148,100 for the 2 bd LO; 81,000 for the 1 bd prem; 67,100 for the studio)



Good point - but since that was "historical" data - I think I should leave it that way, so we have the original info. for comparison.


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## sherilah (Aug 1, 2008)

Noooo...we're going to pay it right off.  Once it's charged, we'll write a fat check to AMEX.  I'm pretty positive we're not paying that much for the EOY portion.  The EY figure I gave you is probably before the membership fee.  I will try and find out...


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## DavidnRobin (Aug 1, 2008)

Sounds like a done deal. But if not,  I only charge $5K... lol

Unfortunately - I don't think they are taking into account the loss of value from the Developer price to the price upon resale (what will the future value of the units be? - easily 50-75% less) - of course that only matter if you sell - which is not a selling point the TS salesperson ever discusses.

Added - Looks like the EOY is a 1Bd - and is being purchased to get to 3* Elite (assumed) - sorry... bad idea - 3* is not worth it (we are 3*) - rescind the EOY at least

LR - I was talking the lower MFs at WKV (even EY) by rescinding their EOY Gold at WLR - and then exchanging (Gold Season) into Lagunamar EOY and then exchange wherever (e.g. HI) the other EOY - definitely more bang for the buck.


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## DeniseM (Aug 1, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Noooo...we're going to pay it right off.  Once it's charged, we'll write a fat check to AMEX.  I'm pretty positive we're not paying that much for the EOY portion.  The EY figure I gave you is probably before the membership fee.  I will try and find out...



The every other year Maintenance fee is about half the every year MF, unless your EOY week is only a 1 bdm. or a studio.


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## grgs (Aug 1, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> Good point - but since that was "historical" data - I think I should leave it that way, so we have the original info. for comparison.



I didn't mean to suggest you should change it--I'm all for maintaining the historical record.   I just wanted to note the change in StarOptions so no one would be confused.  I think it's great that you have your webpage which shows the original pricing, etc.

Glorian


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## DeniseM (Aug 1, 2008)

grgs said:


> I didn't mean to suggest you should change it--I'm all for maintaining the historical record.   I just wanted to note the change in StarOptions so no one would be confused.  I think it's great that you have your webpage which shows the original pricing, etc.
> 
> Glorian



Hi Glorian  -  I didn't think you meant that - I just thought some people might wonder why I have out of date info. listed!


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## tomandrobin (Aug 1, 2008)

grgs said:


> I believe they're all sold as Ocean View.



In phase 2 and phase 3, they will be selling direct ocean front. The inventory for the direct OF limited to a few units. All of phase 1 will be considered OV, but some of them will be very limited OV.


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## sherilah (Aug 1, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> The every other year Maintenance fee is about half the every year MF, unless your EOY week is only a 1 bdm. or a studio.



It's a studio.


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## sherilah (Aug 1, 2008)

DavidnRobin said:


> Sounds like a done deal. But if not,  I only charge $5K... lol



I like the 5k deal!  It'd probably be worth our money...hahahaha!!!!  



> Unfortunately - I don't think they are taking into account the loss of value from the Developer price to the price upon resale (what will the future value of the units be? - easily 50-75% less) - of course that only matter if you sell - which is not a selling point the TS salesperson ever discusses.



Hopefully, we won't sell it in our lifetime, and it'll get passed on.  If we hate Starwood, which I doubt, then it'll be a loss.  I'm REALLY looking forward to our first trip, whatever that will be!!!



> Added - Looks like the EOY is a 1Bd - and is being purchased to get to 3* Elite (assumed) - sorry... bad idea - 3* is not worth it (we are 3*) - rescind the EOY at least



It's a studio....



> LR - I was talking the lower MFs at WKV (even EY) by rescinding their EOY Gold at WLR - and then exchanging (Gold Season) into Lagunamar EOY and then exchange wherever (e.g. HI) the other EOY - definitely more bang for the buck.



What are the MF's at WKV?  Just curious....

Hey...as a ts owner, will Starwood be "hitting us up" for more stuff???  I think I remember them saying that once in a while they have owner tours w/specials, etc.  What are they talking about???

Also, is the 85,000 SP's for $1800 worth it?

Thanks, David & Robin! (Is it David or Robin that's been posting?  I assume David!)


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## Ken555 (Aug 1, 2008)

sherilah said:


> What are the MF's at WKV?  Just curious....



2Bd EY ~= $1200



> Hey...as a ts owner, will Starwood be "hitting us up" for more stuff???  I think I remember them saying that once in a while they have owner tours w/specials, etc.  What are they talking about???



Yes, they will try to sell you an additional t/s EVERY time you visit.


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## capjak (Aug 1, 2008)

sherilah said:


> What are the MF's at WKV?  Just curious....
> 
> Hey...as a ts owner, will Starwood be "hitting us up" for more stuff???  I think I remember them saying that once in a while they have owner tours w/specials, etc.  What are they talking about???



I am doing an "owners special" in Orlando staying 2 bedroom at SVV villiages for 5 nights at $199 total plus free 2 adult tickets to theme  park, we choose seaworld plus Aquatica.

Oh and have to do an owner's update.


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## Transit (Aug 1, 2008)

capjak said:


> sherilah said:
> 
> 
> > What are the MF's at WKV?  Just curious....
> ...


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## DeniseM (Aug 2, 2008)

sherilah said:


> It's a studio.



Ok - then you have an EY 2 bdm. at $1,347 a year
and an EOY studio at $371.00 a year
Total - $1,718 a year.

What are your plans for the studio?


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## LisaRex (Aug 2, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Also, is the 85,000 SP's for $1800 worth it?



It depends on what you'll use those StarPoints for.  The best bang for your buck is usually hotel rewards, with the lower tiered hotels and/or the Cash & Points option usually giving you your best value.  But you need to research it on your own because only you know your likely travel destinations. 
https://www.starwoodhotels.com/preferredguest/account/starpoints/redeem/point_comparison.html 

If you want to convert to airline miles, 85,000 SPs will get you 105,000 miles on most airlines (see link below for the chart).  Go to your favorite airlines' website and see what the miles will get you, knowing that Delta, Alaska, and Hawaiian Airlines have all just revamped their award structures, and the other airlines will undoubtedly follow suit soon. 

https://www.starwoodhotels.com/preferredguest/account/starpoints/transfer/airline_partner_list.html

I'm using Delta as my sample airline because it's my usual airline.  Armed with that 105k miles, I look at Delta's award chart on their website to see what 105k miles could get me.  Getting to Cancun on Delta will now cost 35 -70k miles/seat for coach and 60k - 140k miles/seat for firstclass. Or I could take $1000 off my ticket using "Pay for Miles."  Now I need to compare the cost if I simply booked the tickets outright.  Using sample travel dates 1/30-2/6/09, I could get a fare of $725 for coach and $1300 for first class from Cincinnati to Cancun.  So in my scenario, paying $1800 for the 105k miles is not worth it as the best case scenario is breaking even. 

Your mileage may vary.  And that is why it's important for you to do some leg work and number crunching to determine what's best for you.


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## sherilah (Aug 2, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> Ok - then you have an EY 2 bdm. at $1,347 a year
> and an EOY studio at $371.00 a year
> Total - $1,718 a year.
> 
> What are your plans for the studio?



We want it for:

A) The option to wait for July 1st to dump it.  This is huge for my husband.
B) To use it as an extra piece....some years we will go away w/another couple and use the entire 2 bdrm lockoff.  If we have the piece we can deposit it into II and have an extra week somewhere...
C) To use w/in SVO - if my husband want to go away for a few nights here and there, we will still have our 2 bedroom lockoff...


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## DeniseM (Aug 2, 2008)

sherilah said:


> We want it for:
> 
> A) The option to wait for July 1st to dump it.  This is huge for my husband.



Frankly, this is not the best option, because the 13,000 Starpoints will only get you 1 or 2 nights in most nicer hotels.  Since your MF is $371 - I don't think that's a great value.  But I am not a fan of converting to points.  



> B) To use it as an extra piece....some years we will go away w/another couple and use the entire 2 bdrm lockoff.  If we have the piece we can deposit it into II and have an extra week somewhere...



This could be a very good deal for you, especially if you are flexible - I know we've bombarded you with info.  but when you deposit a Starwood property with II, you have a 3 day priority for other Starwood properties on the II website and often can even upgrade to a larger unit.



> C) To use w/in SVO - if my husband want to go away for a few nights here and there, we will still have our 2 bedroom lockoff...



Remember that you can only reserve stays of less than a week at 90 days out, but this will work off-season at lower demand resorts.   

Exchanging it with II probably has the most value, since it's not worth a lot of Starpoints or Staroptions.


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## sherilah (Aug 2, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> Frankly, this is not the best option, because the 13,000 Starpoints will only get you 1 or 2 nights in most nicer hotels.  Since your MF is $371 - I don't think that's a great value.  But I am not a fan of converting to points.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Exactly!  If we want to go to Palm Springs in February for the weekend last minute, we'll probably be able to.  We live less than 90 minutes from there...also a short plane ride away from Phoenix! 

Is that the amount of Starpoints we are getting?  I thought it was 15,000 or even more...I'll check....also, we will have the option to turn our 2 bedroom lockoff into starpoints w/the Elite status...the July 1st date will work w/both the EY and EYO once you're Elite, right?  If not, then we definitely have an issue!


Thanks again for looking out for me.  I appreciate all of the comments!!!


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## DeniseM (Aug 2, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Is that the amount of Starpoints we are getting?  I thought it was 15,000 or even more...I'll check....



I am basing my post on this Starwood Chart - Westin Lagunamar

Which shows:  

2 bdm. lock-off Plat - 148,100 Staroptions, 72,000 Starpoints

Studio EOY Gold - 37,000 Staroptions, 13,000 Starpoints

Be careful converting to Starpoints.  If you stay at your home resort, you can stay in your timeshare for 3 weeks.  If you convert it all to Starpoints - it's only going to get you a week or 10 days in a standard hotel room.  I can see converting the studio for a weekend in a hotel, but converting the whole thing to Starpoints is not your best value, because the nicer Starwood hotels are 12,000 points a night and up.


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## sherilah (Aug 2, 2008)

I think we're only getting 22,000 Staroptions.  Are they screwing us?  Maybe I'm wrong...


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## DeniseM (Aug 2, 2008)

sherilah said:


> I think we're only getting 22,000 Staroptions.  Are they screwing us?  Maybe I'm wrong...



Staroptions and Starpoints are the same for every owner of a particular unit - the developer can't change those during the purchase.  The link I listed above is from Starwood - it should be accurate.  Plus, there is no unit at Lagunamar that has 22,000 Staroptions, according the the chart.


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## sherilah (Aug 2, 2008)

Just asked my husband.  For the EOY studio we are getting:

22,000 Starpoints
37,000 Staroptions


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## DeniseM (Aug 2, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Just asked my husband.  For the EOY studio we are getting:
> 
> 22,000 Starpoints
> 37,000 Staroptions



Is that on your contract, because according to the chart, Gold Studios have 13,000 Starpoints and Plat Studios have 22,000 Starpoints.  Did you look at the chart I posted?

Also - just to clarify - I'm talking about the yearly (or EOY in this case) Starpoint value of your studio, not any incentive points you may have received as part of the sale.


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## sherilah (Aug 2, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> Is that on your contract, because according to the chart, Gold Studios have 13,000 Starpoints and Plat Studios have 22,000 Starpoints.  Did you look at the chart I posted?
> 
> Also - just to clarify - I'm talking about the yearly (or EOY in this case) Starpoint value of your studio, not any incentive points you may have received as part of the sale.



Yes, it is in our contract.  

Also, yes, it's in the yearly, the SP value of the studio.  The incentive points we received are 15,000.  We got all of this in writing.


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## DeniseM (Aug 2, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Yes, it is in our contract.
> 
> Also, yes, it's in the yearly, the SP value of the studio.  The incentive points we received are 15,000.  We got all of this in writing.



That's interesting.... If your contract says you got 22K SP's a year - then the salesman may have made an error writing it up and given you the SP's for for a Plat week, instead of a gold week.  

It will be interesting to see how that pans out and if Starwood will honor it, or if they will catch it during closing.  It's an error in your favor, so you may just want to see what happens.


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## sherilah (Aug 2, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> That's interesting.... If your contract says you got 22K SP's a year - then the salesman may have made an error writing it up and given you the SP's for for a Plat week, instead of a gold week.
> 
> It will be interesting to see how that pans out and if Starwood will honor it, or if they will catch it during closing.  It's an error in your favor, so you may just want to see what happens.



Should we ask about it?  Or keep our quiet about it?  I think the salesperson was pretty new, since she had to keep putting us on hold to ask her manager.


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## DeniseM (Aug 2, 2008)

sherilah said:


> Should we ask about it?  Or keep our quiet about it?  I think the salesperson was pretty new, since she had to keep putting us on hold to ask her manager.



I don't know - if it's a mistake, they will probably find it during closing anyway, so you might want to call the salesperson directly and just ask her.  Be sure you have a copy of the Starwood chart at hand when you call so you can refer to it.  

If it's an error, catching it early might save some time later, and if it's not an error, it would be helpful for you to find out exactly why they gave you that many Starpoints.


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## sherilah (Aug 2, 2008)

I actually remember my husband asking her about the chart vs our points.  I think she said the chart wasn't correct....I will try to find out.


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## tomandrobin (Aug 2, 2008)

What week is the studio deeded in your paper work?  That will indicate what week and season you own.


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## sherilah (Aug 2, 2008)

tomandrobin said:


> What week is the studio deeded in your paper work?  That will indicate what week and season you own.



Not sure of the week, but it's Gold Season.


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## BradC (Aug 3, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> Did you look at the chart I posted?


There's at least one error on that chart.  The platinum-season Studio Staroptions are listed at 44,000 instead of 67,100.

It also seems odd that the Starpoints for the studio + 1-bedroom wouldn't add up to the Starpoints for the 2-bedroom lockout.  Is there any other SVO resort where they've done that?


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## tomandrobin (Aug 3, 2008)

Has your unit posted on My Star Central yet? If it has, you see the details of you ownership, including the week, season and staroptions assigned to the unit.


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