# Shell Vacations migrating to Club Wyndham Plus



## JohnPaul (Apr 9, 2019)

I noticed an item on the website about this and it lines up with what we were told at our last update.

The notice does say that Club Wyndham Plus is an exchange network.

According to sales, all of the inventory will move to Club Wyndham Plus and there will be nothing left for SVC members who don't upgrade to Club Wyndham Plus to book.

It's obviously their attempt to integrate Shell more completely into Wyndham.

First of all, if that were to happen I think it would take a long time.  Second of all, I don't think they can take inventory and put it in it's own bucket.

Anyone else heard more about this?


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## bizaro86 (Apr 9, 2019)

Where did you see that on the website? I couldn't find it on the public site or in the members only area...


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## JohnPaul (Apr 9, 2019)

SVC Member News - first item


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## ecwinch (Apr 9, 2019)

It certainly is possible that they have added SVC as a full member of Club Wyndham Plus program, just as other Clubs - i.e .Club Wyndham Access, Club Wyndham Select, Presidential Reserve, and Margaritaville Vacation Club.

But I dont see how they could remove inventory from Shell Vacation Club and place in the Club Wyndham Plus program since SVC is a points based program. If they are going to open up SVC inventory to the rest of Club Wyndham Plus members at 10 months (like they do with the other separate ownership programs), it would seem they would have to allow SVC members to book the combined Club Wyndham Plus inventory at the 10 month mark also.


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## bizaro86 (Apr 9, 2019)

Thanks for pointing this out! There's a link to the FAQ below for others might be as search-challenged as me. 

https://www.shellvacationsclub.com/pdf/ShellVacationsClub_FAQ.pdf

Looks like a free enrollment will be offered for those who go on a sales tour. That might be enough to get me to attend one and say no.


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## bizaro86 (Apr 9, 2019)

ecwinch said:


> It certainly is possible that they have added SVC as a full member of Club Wyndham Plus program, just as other Clubs - i.e .Club Wyndham Access, Club Wyndham Select, Presidential Reserve, and Margaritaville Vacation Club.
> 
> But I dont see how they could remove inventory from Shell Vacation Club and place in the Club Wyndham Plus program since SVC is a points based program. If they are going to open up SVC inventory to the rest of Club Wyndham Plus members at 10 months (like they do with the other separate ownership programs), it would seem they would have to allow SVC members to book Club Wyndham Plus inventory at the 10 month mark also.



As long as the inventory in equals inventory out, you don't have to give everyone access. No particular reason they'd have to give every SVC member access to Club Wyndham Plus as long as they have enough SVC inventory to balance things out. They can get SVC inventory by giving a bunch of free enrollments to folks to go to sales presentations, taking trade ins, and by putting SVC points they got from ovation into one of the Wyndham programs (maybe CWA?).

As an example, only developer buyers can get club pass. No particular reason they couldn't do the same thing with SVC and Club Wyndham Plus.


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## ecwinch (Apr 9, 2019)

Thanks for the link.

It sounds like a bleed-off strategy like they did with Pahio. Ability to "enroll" SVC points and deeds into Club Wyndham, taking the points/deeds that are assigned to Club Wyndham to carve out inventory that is then placed into Club Wyndham.

What will be interesting is how they handle Advanced Reservation Priority.


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## JohnPaul (Apr 10, 2019)

I think it's telling that it is described as an exchange network.  I don't think that SVC's point structure (which like Worldmark is not tied to a specific underlying property) will allow them to remove inventory from general availability to SVC members.


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## ausman (Apr 10, 2019)

Wyndham in the past has bought fixed weeks at various resorts, usually once they had the management contract and the right to control unsold inventory, into the Wyndham system by the process of Assignment and Assumption. Fixed weeks owners in the Wyndham system are familiar with this. The fixed week owners assign their usage rights to Wyndham in return for Wyndham points and entry into the Wyndham system. They retain the rights to reserve their units at the 13-11 month mark and give up that right completely at the 10 month mark when the units then become available to the general Wyndham populace. This is the basis of ARP which all Wyndham owners are familiar with.

This seems to be that, except, that they are basically doing this with parts of a complete system instead of individual resorts or much smaller groups. I really don't see that a points system would present much difficulty in implementing the concept and kind of wonder why they waited so long.


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## JohnPaul (Apr 10, 2019)

The reason a points system of the type of SVC is different is as follows.  A Wyndham week or an HGVC week is a deeded ownership with associated points that can be used for exchanging.  If the underlying property is put into a new trust or similar then its use would follow the rules of that new trust.  I believe this is how Wyndham CWA works.

Points systems like SVC and WM are structured differently.  All the property is in a trust (or similar instrument) that is owned by all of the members.  That trust has rules and regulations that cannot be just ignored.  Yes, SVC members can essentially assign their points to Wyndham but Wyndham would have to compete w non Club Wyndham Plus SVC members to book inventory.

The crux of my point is that they (Wyndham) would still have to book SVC inventory following the SVC rules.  Granted that with a lot of points and their management of the systems, they could likely book out good inventory very early.

The usage they get from fixed week owners would of course be different.

I see this as much more akin to the Club Pass program between Wyndham and WM which is also an exchange program.  If they structure like Club Pass with SVC owners having first grabs up until 9 months then I don't see a problem other than sales lies to scare people that don't want to pay more for "enrollment".


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## ausman (Apr 10, 2019)

JohnPaul,

Using an Assignment and Assumption process it is the *usage* is that assigned. Deeds are not transferred. This process *is* akin to the Club pass program in that owners have first dibs and then after a time period so do others.


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## bnoble (Apr 10, 2019)

JohnPaul said:


> I think it's telling that it is described as an exchange network


Me too. This sounds more like the Wyndham/WorldMark Club Pass relationship than an integration.


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## usasail (Apr 11, 2019)

Sorry saw this and hoping some could reply on my SVC thread as well, hope we don't screwed on points....ugh!


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## rickandcindy23 (Apr 11, 2019)

If it turned out to be a free enrollment, where you would get enough points to make the MF's make sense like $5/1,000 Wyndham points, I might be interested in doing it.  But it's going to cost like $25K to do it, and if you own multiple certificates, it's going to be even more.  I don't care if they say the enrollment is free.  They are going to expect us to buy something else to convert to Wyndham.  It's a sales ploy.  And then they will charge us $99 per guest as well.  

It's just not going to be free enrollment.  That is misleading, and it's really lying.


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## ronparise (Apr 11, 2019)

Here’s how I see it happening

She’ll owners assign their use rights to the fair share trust and are awarded a certain number of club wyndham points
Now the Club wyndham owners including the new club wyndham owners will be able to make reservations at all the club wyndham resorts and the shell resorts 

Let’s assume 50% of the shell shell points are  assigned to club wyndham.  That would mean 50% of shell inventory will be available to club wyndham owners (including the former shell owners)

The remaining 50% of shell inventory will be available to remaining shell owners who still hold 50% of the shell points


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## JohnPaul (Apr 12, 2019)

The big question is what does 50% of inventory mean?  Does that mean SVC members and Club Wyndham both have access to all SVC unreserved inventory up to their 50% ownership or does it mean CW can grab all the "good inventory" as long as it doesn't exceed 50% and leave the leftovers to SVC owners that didn't convert.  The second thing is the scare tactic that sales is already using if you don't convert to CW.


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## rickandcindy23 (Apr 12, 2019)

JohnPaul said:


> The big question is what does 50% of inventory mean?  Does that mean SVC members and Club Wyndham both have access to all SVC unreserved inventory up to their 50% ownership or does it mean CW can grab all the "good inventory" as long as it doesn't exceed 50% and leave the leftovers to SVC owners that didn't convert.  The second thing is the scare tactic that sales is already using if you don't convert to CW.


How much are they asking to convert?  I would love another platinum account, but I am not willing to pay huge money for it.  

Shell owners are a pretty small lot compared to Wyndham, WorldMark, Hilton, etc.  When I say Shell points, people I meet say, "What is that?"   Yep.


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## HitchHiker71 (Apr 12, 2019)

rickandcindy23 said:


> How much are they asking to convert?  I would love another platinum account, but I am not willing to pay huge money for it.
> 
> Shell owners are a pretty small lot compared to Wyndham, WorldMark, Hilton, etc.  When I say Shell points, people I meet say, "What is that?"   Yep.



That's a really interesting question.  I'm temp VIPP permanent VIPG, and am trying to figure out the best way to obtain permanent VIPP.  Wondering if it may be possible to pick up either resale SVC or even retail SVC and then have the "converted" CWP points count toward VIP status on the Wyndham side?  Even if it's SVC retail, if it's cheaper to obtain the SVC retail points as opposed to direct CWP points retail, might be worth looking into?  Just thinking out loud here.


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## Michelle Marie Perez (Apr 13, 2019)

rickandcindy23 said:


> If it turned out to be a free enrollment, where you would get enough points to make the MF's make sense like $5/1,000 Wyndham points, I might be interested in doing it.  But it's going to cost like $25K to do it, and if you own multiple certificates, it's going to be even more.  I don't care if they say the enrollment is free.  They are going to expect us to buy something else to convert to Wyndham.  It's a sales ploy.  And then they will charge us $99 per guest as well.
> 
> It's just not going to be free enrollment.  That is misleading, and it's really lying.


We just converted our



HitchHiker71 said:


> That's a really interesting question.  I'm temp VIPP permanent VIPG, and am trying to figure out the best way to obtain permanent VIPP.  Wondering if it may be possible to pick up either resale SVC or even retail SVC and then have the "converted" CWP points count toward VIP status on the Wyndham side?  Even if it's SVC retail, if it's cheaper to obtain the SVC retail points as opposed to direct CWP points retail, might be worth looking into?  Just thinking out loud here.





rickandcindy23 said:


> If it turned out to be a free enrollment, where you would get enough points to make the MF's make sense like $5/1,000 Wyndham points, I might be interested in doing it.  But it's going to cost like $25K to do it, and if you own multiple certificates, it's going to be even more.  I don't care if they say the enrollment is free.  They are going to expect us to buy something else to convert to Wyndham.  It's a sales ploy.  And then they will charge us $99 per guest as well.
> 
> It's just not going to be free enrollment.  That is misleading, and it's really lying.


its not free enrollment but they are waving it for now as the change just happened. They are bonusing owners as well.  Also, they no longer sell shell points. You get a lot more when you convert than to keep shell. You get 220 resorts vs 24. We just converted in Napa.


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## ecwinch (Apr 13, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> We just converted our
> 
> 
> 
> its not free enrollment but they are waving it for now as the change just happened. They are bonusing owners as well.  Also, they no longer sell shell points. You get a lot more when you convert than to keep shell. You get 220 resorts vs 24. We just converted in Napa.



Marie - thanks for that insight. I know your fellow Shell owners would greatly appreciate any specifics you are willing to share.... i.e. how many Club Wyndham points did you receive for converting how many SVC points..... what bonus you received, etc. etc.


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## Sandy VDH (Apr 13, 2019)

Any idea how long "waiving it for now" will last?


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## Michelle Marie Perez (Apr 14, 2019)

ecwinch said:


> Marie - thanks for that insight. I know your fellow Shell owners would greatly appreciate any specifics you are willing to share.... i.e. how many Club Wyndham points did you receive for converting how many SVC points..... what bonus you received, etc. etc.


The conversion is 40 to 1. So if you own 7k points you would multiply by 40.  The enrollment is $2995. I think they might be done waving it. My sister is going in to convert hers so we’ll see. I purchased 120k bonus points and they bonused me 300k points. The change took place April 4th and they have a ton of discounts and bonuses they are giving with purchases while they kick off the new program. Other sites don’t offer the same incentives. I also own club Wyndham prior to shell so I know for a fact it’s a pretty hefty discount. Also, resale points from shell or Wyndham do NOT count towards VIP.


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## HitchHiker71 (Apr 14, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> The conversion is 40 to 1. So if you own 7k points you would multiply by 40.  The enrollment is $2995. I think they might be done waving it. My sister is going in to convert hers so we’ll see. I purchased 120k bonus points and they bonused me 300k points. The change took place April 4th and they have a ton of discounts and bonuses they are giving with purchases while they kick off the new program. Other sites don’t offer the same incentives. I also own club Wyndham prior to shell so I know for a fact it’s a pretty hefty discount. Also, resale points from shell or Wyndham do NOT count towards VIP.



Thanks for this data.  Really good info! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## HitchHiker71 (Apr 14, 2019)

Are all SVC sites/owners eligible for this conversion?  I had heard only a subset of sites will actually be eligible.  Wondering specifically about the site in NC state.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ecwinch (Apr 14, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> The conversion is 40 to 1. So if you own 7k points you would multiply by 40.  The enrollment is $2995. I think they might be done waving it. My sister is going in to convert hers so we’ll see. I purchased 120k bonus points and they bonused me 300k points. The change took place April 4th and they have a ton of discounts and bonuses they are giving with purchases while they kick off the new program. Other sites don’t offer the same incentives. I also own club Wyndham prior to shell so I know for a fact it’s a pretty hefty discount. Also, resale points from shell or Wyndham do NOT count towards VIP.



Thanks for posting that. 

Did they require a purchase of Club Wyndham points to convert your SVC points? Is that why you purchased additional Club Wyndham points?


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## bizaro86 (Apr 14, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> The conversion is 40 to 1. So if you own 7k points you would multiply by 40.  The enrollment is $2995. I think they might be done waving it. My sister is going in to convert hers so we’ll see. I purchased 120k bonus points and they bonused me 300k points. The change took place April 4th and they have a ton of discounts and bonuses they are giving with purchases while they kick off the new program. Other sites don’t offer the same incentives. I also own club Wyndham prior to shell so I know for a fact it’s a pretty hefty discount. Also, resale points from shell or Wyndham do NOT count towards VIP.



Thanks so much for sharing! Do you happen to know how the conversion works? Ie do you give up your Shell points and get 40x new points (club Wyndham access?) Or do you keep the shell points but now have the ability to book wyndham with them?


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## bizaro86 (Apr 14, 2019)

How do folks feel about the conversion ratio? Intuitively it seems not bad, but maybe not as good as could have been hoped for.

My most frequently used resort is Peacock Suites. Wyndham has a few rooms a block away at the Worldmark Anaheim, which is nicer.

A studio at Wyndham Anaheim is 172k. A 3 bedroom unit in peak season at Peacock suites is 3900 shell points, which would be equivalent to 156k wyndham points at 40x.

Now, I've stayed at both and the Wyndham Anaheim is definitely nicer. But I think the 3 bedroom vs studio more than outweighs that difference, and the shell one is still cheaper.


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## Michelle Marie Perez (Apr 14, 2019)

bizaro86 said:


> Thanks so much for sharing! Do you happen to know how the conversion works? Ie do you give up your Shell points and get 40x new points (club Wyndham access?) Or do you keep the shell points but now have the ability to book wyndham with them?


You give up shell for Wyndham points but your deed is still in west club properties. You can still book at the shell properties too


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## ecwinch (Apr 15, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> You give up shell for Wyndham points but your deed is still in west club properties. You can still book at the shell properties too



Marie - thanks for taking the time to answer all the questions. Would you mind doubling back and answering the question about a points purchase?

i.e. is a Club Wyndham points purchase required to convert?

I imagine that is a key question people are wondering about.  Thanks in advance.


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## rickandcindy23 (Apr 15, 2019)

My Shell was all resale, 100% resale.  They aren't going to let me convert to get Platinum.

So 280K points for 7K Shell = $1,820 in MF's?  That is the ~ MF amount for Shell.  Is that $6.50 per thousand?  I am not great at math.


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## HitchHiker71 (Apr 15, 2019)

rickandcindy23 said:


> My Shell was all resale, 100% resale.  They aren't going to let me convert to get Platinum.
> 
> So 280K points for 7K Shell = $1,820 in MF's?  That is the ~ MF amount for Shell.  Is that $6.50 per thousand?  I am not great at math.



Yes it’s $6.50/1000 points, pretty similar to CWA when you add in the program fees.  

So just to be clear, they will let you convert, but the conversion will not be VIP eligible yes?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Sandy VDH (Apr 15, 2019)

rickandcindy23 said:


> My Shell was all resale, 100% resale.  They aren't going to let me convert to get Platinum.
> 
> So 280K points for 7K Shell = $1,820 in MF's?  That is the ~ MF amount for Shell.  Is that $6.50 per thousand?  I am not great at math.



Would this be a separate membership or would they combine it with your existing Wyndham membership?


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## ecwinch (Apr 15, 2019)

HitchHiker71 said:


> Yes it’s $6.50/1000 points, pretty similar to CWA when you add in the program fees.



My math might be off, but it almost seems like a doubling of the program fee - one to SVC and one to CWA. I am guessing that is the end run on how they are doing this - putting the SVC points into CWA.

If so....wondering what that portends for WM.


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## 55plus (Apr 15, 2019)

rickandcindy23 said:


> My Shell was all resale, 100% resale.  They aren't going to let me convert to get Platinum.
> 
> So 280K points for 7K Shell = $1,820 in MF's?  That is the ~ MF amount for Shell.  Is that $6.50 per thousand?  I am not great at math.


How does Wyndham know you Shell points are resell? Tell them it all or nothing.


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## TheHolleys87 (Apr 16, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> You give up shell for Wyndham points but your deed is still in west club properties. You can still book at the shell properties too





ecwinch said:


> Marie - thanks for taking the time to answer all the questions. Would you mind doubling back and answering the question about a points purchase?
> 
> i.e. is a Club Wyndham points purchase required to convert?
> 
> I imagine that is a key question people are wondering about.  Thanks in advance.



Yes, I’d very much like to know whether Shell points can be converted without buying more points. We don’t have a lot of Shell points (basically enough for EOY in Hawaii) but with our other TS we don’t need more! I’d only be interested in converting if it gave us more options for reserving within the program.


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## chapjim (Apr 16, 2019)

I own a single floating week at The Suites at Fisherman's Wharf.  When I rent it out, I submit a Wyndham form.  Other than that, the Shell —> Wyndham migration doesn't seem to affect me.  I haven't received any offers to do anything.

Am I missing something?


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## JohnPaul (Apr 16, 2019)

chapjim said:


> I own a single floating week at The Suites at Fisherman's Wharf.  When I rent it out, I submit a Wyndham form.  Other than that, the Shell —> Wyndham migration doesn't seem affect me.  I haven't received any offers to do anything.
> 
> Am I missing something?



I believe you will be eligible for this program (see link posted early in thread).  I don't think anyone is being proactively approached yet.  Just people attending presentations.


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## Michelle Marie Perez (Apr 16, 2019)

Ot


HitchHiker71 said:


> Yes it’s $6.50/1000 points, pretty similar to CWA when you add in the program fees.
> 
> So just to be clear, they will let you convert, but the conversion will not be VIP eligible yes?
> 
> ...


 It is VIP eligible when you convert. Resale can be converted just not eligible for VIP.


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## Michelle Marie Perez (Apr 16, 2019)

Sandy VDH said:


> Would this be a separate membership or would they combine it with your existing Wyndham membership?


Combined.


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## pedro47 (Apr 16, 2019)

According to the FAQ you must sit thru a 90 minutes or more a sale presentation. That is wrong IMO.

Plus, you must buy and spend more money; to buy into another timeshare program.


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## JohnPaul (Apr 16, 2019)

pedro47 said:


> According to the FAQ you must sit thru a 90 minutes or more a sale presentation. That is wrong IMO.
> 
> Plus, you must buy and spend more money; to buy into another timeshare program.



You don't actually have to do anything.  Just keep paying your SVC MF and enjoy your vacations at the SVC resorts.


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## Braindead (Apr 16, 2019)

Converting Shell owners can book any Club Wyndham Plus Resorts. Then at some point the Shell Resorts have to become Club Wyndham Plus Resorts open to all Wyndham owners for booking, any word on how long that will be?


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## ecwinch (Apr 16, 2019)

Since the questions about buying more points keep going unanswered, and given that you have to attend a sales presentation to convert, I would conclude a purchase is required.


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## Braindead (Apr 16, 2019)

ecwinch said:


> Since the questions about buying more points keep going unanswered, and given that you have to attend a sales presentation to convert, I would conclude a purchase is required.


I think you’re right! We’ve heard about the phony conversation fee that no one can use. You always have to buy more points to save the $2,997 conversion fee, Wyndham wants the buyer to believe they made a good purchase saving $


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## 55plus (Apr 16, 2019)

Who says you have to pay anything to convert? They just want to get into your pockets.


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## Michelle Marie Perez (Apr 16, 2019)

55plus said:


> Who says you have to pay anything to convert? They just want to get into your pockets.




I don’t know if it’s required to purchase because I went in there with the intentions to purchase. If you buy from shell it’s 30% less than a Wyndham and in about a month it will go to regular price. My friends daughter works for shell in Anaheim. The 30% discount is only available to shell owners. It’s not available if you only own Wyndham. If you plan to upgrade at some point in your life. Do it now before the 30% goes away. We saw the same thing at shell in Hawaii.


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## rickandcindy23 (Apr 16, 2019)

If it walks like a duck...  

I won't be going to the update. The web news is misleading:

Important Update About Shell Vacations Club

We’re glad to see so many of you enjoying your new RCI® exchange benefits — expanding your vacation horizons to unique locations around the globe. You’ve asked for access to even more great locations, and we would like to share an important update.

Starting as early as April 2019, you’ll have the opportunity to join the Club Wyndham® family by visiting a Shell Vacations Club sales location. What does this mean for you? As a Club Wyndham owner, you’ll enjoy a host of terrific new benefits and vacation options, including 100+ incredible resorts in the Club Wyndham portfolio.

You will also have the opportunity to enroll your eligible Shell Vacations Club points into Club Wyndham Plus starting in early 2020.

Please see these frequently asked questions for additional details about this update. To learn more, visit a Shell Vacations Club resort or sales location. You can also call us at 844-743-3315 or email asksvc@wyn.com at any time.


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## Michelle Marie Perez (Apr 16, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> I don’t know if it’s required to purchase because I went in there with the intentions to purchase. If you buy from shell it’s 30% less than a Wyndham and in about a month it will go to regular price. My friends daughter works for shell in Anaheim. The 30% discount is only available to shell owners. It’s not available if you only own Wyndham. If you plan to upgrade at some point in your life. Do it now before the 30% goes away. We saw the same thing at shell in Hawaii.



That’s if you want developer points.


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## ecwinch (Apr 17, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> That’s if you want developer points.



30% sounds good, but it really depends on what the net price is after the discount.


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## Michelle Marie Perez (Apr 17, 2019)

Y


ecwinch said:


> 30% sounds good, but it really depends on what the net price is after the discount.




You could buy the smallest package they sell, 84k points, (which is only available to shell owners) convert your shell 40-1 and it counts towards VIP permanently. don’t quote me on this but I think I heard it was like 15k. At any normal Wyndham, as of right now they don’t offer a 84k package. I personally felt it was worth it because I would rather have access to 220 resorts versus 24. The Mexico and blue green properties are only affiliates. The Blue green relationship will dissolve late 2019 early 2020 and Mexico will fall off too. I feel like they are trying to faze shell out and eventually force everyone to go Wyndham. The shell properties will soon be part of club Wyndham access and shell owners will almost be forced to either convert or give up shell. That’s just my own conclusion based on the presentation and the way it’s going. I like Wyndham though. With shell I got 20% off for being signature, in Wyndham I get 50% off with an automatic upgrade to a larger unit if you opt in. Every reservation I’ve had with Wyndham, I’ve gotten an up grade. We can now turn our Wyndham points into Wyndham rewards or convert club Wyndham points straight to maintenance fee credits. It’s not the best conversion though. The plus partners actually work when you rent a car and airfare with points.


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## ecwinch (Apr 17, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> You could buy the smallest package they sell, 84k points, (which is only available to shell owners) convert your shell 40-1 and it counts towards VIP permanently. don’t quote me on this but I think I heard it was like 15k. At any normal Wyndham, as of right now they don’t offer a 84k package. I personally felt it was worth it because I would rather have access to 220 resorts versus 24. The Mexico and blue green properties are only affiliates. The Blue green relationship will dissolve late 2019 early 2020 and Mexico will fall off too. I feel like they are trying to faze shell out and eventually force everyone to go Wyndham. The shell properties will soon be part of club Wyndham access and shell owners will almost be forced to either convert or give up shell. That’s just my own conclusion based on the presentation and the way it’s going. I like Wyndham though. With shell I got 20% off for being signature, in Wyndham I get 50% off with an automatic upgrade to a larger unit if you opt in. Every reservation I’ve had with Wyndham, I’ve gotten an up grade. We can now turn our Wyndham points into Wyndham rewards or convert club Wyndham points straight to maintenance fee credits. It’s not the best conversion though. The plus partners actually work when you rent a car and airfare with points.



50% off with automatic upgrade to a larger unit sounds nice.

So you were able to upgrade to the Platinum VIP level by buying a 120k Wyndham points package using all those discounts. Converting like 20k Shell points?

Sweet.


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## Sandy VDH (Apr 17, 2019)

ecwinch said:


> 50% off with automatic upgrade to a larger unit sounds nice.
> 
> So you were able to upgrade to the Platinum VIP level by buying a 120k Wyndham points package using all those discounts. Converting like 20k Shell points?
> 
> Sweet.



NOTE it is an automatic request.  It is NOT an automatic upgrade.  They can't upgrade you IF No units are available.  The auto upgrade does function, but it has been observed with hiccups.  By that we see inventory available in a larger unit, and know Tuggers who have a smaller unit and have a request for a larger unit, it is sitting in inventory for at least a few days or more, then finally disappears.  So we don't know if the auto upgrade worked or didn't work.  

Instant upgrade is a lot easier to predict.  That is AT TIME OF BOOKING you are offered and take an upgrade from a smaller unit to a larger unit.  That is working fine, but it will not start working until about 1 hr after they calendar date has shifted ( should be Midnight ET, 2 months out, but sometime it won't offer any upgrades until 1 am 2 months out).   If you are less than exactly 2 months out it works just fine, any time.  At least that is my observation.


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## 55plus (Apr 17, 2019)

Eighty-four thousands points won't get you much. You'll need more than that to enjoy an owership. Save yourself tens of thousands of dollars and buy Wyndham resell points. You can find them here on TUG and on eBay. Use that tens of thousands of dollars you'll save and buy yourself a nice new Harley and some firearms. That what I'd do. I'm just sayin'.


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## HitchHiker71 (Apr 17, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> Y
> 
> 
> 
> You could buy the smallest package they sell, 84k points, (which is only available to shell owners) convert your shell 40-1 and it counts towards VIP permanently. don’t quote me on this but I think I heard it was like 15k. At any normal Wyndham, as of right now they don’t offer a 84k package. I personally felt it was worth it because I would rather have access to 220 resorts versus 24. The Mexico and blue green properties are only affiliates. The Blue green relationship will dissolve late 2019 early 2020 and Mexico will fall off too. I feel like they are trying to faze shell out and eventually force everyone to go Wyndham. The shell properties will soon be part of club Wyndham access and shell owners will almost be forced to either convert or give up shell. That’s just my own conclusion based on the presentation and the way it’s going. I like Wyndham though. With shell I got 20% off for being signature, in Wyndham I get 50% off with an automatic upgrade to a larger unit if you opt in. Every reservation I’ve had with Wyndham, I’ve gotten an up grade. We can now turn our Wyndham points into Wyndham rewards or convert club Wyndham points straight to maintenance fee credits. It’s not the best conversion though. The plus partners actually work when you rent a car and airfare with points.



The pricing and points contract availability is typical Wyndham sales weasel BS.  You can buy 84k points anywhere, they just make it sound like you can't and they make it sound like you're getting a good deal with the 30% discount off of MSRP, which is currently $254/1000 points.  A 30% discount would equate to $178/1000.  Depending on whether this is a CWS or CWA contract that price may or may not be a good price.  If it's CWA points contract, I paid net $134/1000 using telesales for a 105k/295k contract back in July 2018 ($145/1000 is my frozen price point until July 2019 - the $134/1000 net price was due to a contract rebate available at the time - and usually there are rebates available so be sure to ask for them if you are considering a developer points purchase!), so $178/1000 for any CWA contract is not a good price.  If it's a deeded CWS contract, the answer will depend on the deeded location.  Unfortunately I don't think telesales will be an option for a SVC conversion deal, since it appears you have to broker any deal at certain local resorts that are offering the contract conversions.


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## TheHolleys87 (Apr 17, 2019)

Marie Gonzalez said:


> I don’t know if it’s required to purchase because I went in there with the intentions to purchase. If you buy from shell it’s 30% less than a Wyndham and in about a month it will go to regular price. My friends daughter works for shell in Anaheim. The 30% discount is only available to shell owners. It’s not available if you only own Wyndham. If you plan to upgrade at some point in your life. Do it now before the 30% goes away. We saw the same thing at shell in Hawaii.



Interesting that “in about a month it will go to regular price“ since the conversion/purchase can be done at only a limited number of Shell resorts (in Hawaii, for instance, only on Kauai). If the offer is good only for this month, they’ll lose a lot of potential sales from owners who won’t be there yet. We just booked an August stay at Peacock Suites, and DH and I agreed that they’ll have to offer us a very nice incentive ($200 gift card, say) to get us into the “update.”


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## 55plus (Apr 17, 2019)

TheHolleys87 said:


> Interesting that “in about a month it will go to regular price“ since the conversion/purchase can be done at only a limited number of Shell resorts (in Hawaii, for instance, only on Kauai). If the offer is good only for this month, they’ll lose a lot of potential sales from owners who won’t be there yet. We just booked an August stay at Peacock Suites, and DH and I agreed that they’ll have to offer us a very nice incentive ($200 gift card, say) to get us into the “update.”


Use the money you get in the gift card and buy Wyndham resell points. And tell them that as you walk out the door.


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## HitchHiker71 (Apr 17, 2019)

TheHolleys87 said:


> Interesting that “in about a month it will go to regular price“ since the conversion/purchase can be done at only a limited number of Shell resorts (in Hawaii, for instance, only on Kauai). If the offer is good only for this month, they’ll lose a lot of potential sales from owners who won’t be there yet. We just booked an August stay at Peacock Suites, and DH and I agreed that they’ll have to offer us a very nice incentive ($200 gift card, say) to get us into the “update.”



My sense is this is more sales weasel BS with regard to the "in about a month it will go up..." mantra.  They ALWAYS say if you don't buy now you will pay more later.  This is sales 101 best practice.  Don't fall for it.  It's simply a way to create a sense of urgency for you to buy now as opposed to walking away and making an educated purchase decision.


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## TheHolleys87 (Apr 17, 2019)

55plus said:


> Use the money you get in the gift card and buy Wyndham resell points. And tell them that as you walk out the door.





HitchHiker71 said:


> My sense is this is more sales weasel BS with regard to the "in about a month it will go up..." mantra.  They ALWAYS say if you don't buy now you will pay more later.  This is sales 101 best practice.  Don't fall for it.  It's simply a way to create a sense of urgency for you to buy now as opposed to walking away and making an educated purchase decision.



 We don’t need and don’t even want any more TS than we have now! We’ll go to the “update” (sales weasle talk) only if we get a gift card large enough to finance a very nice dinner!


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## rickandcindy23 (Apr 17, 2019)

Wyndham is the worst at lying, misrepresenting, and I don't think anything Maria was told is fact.  She didn't say how much she paid, even though she was asked.  

I think this sales' presentation our next visit will be a real conversation about how we can get rid of what we have, not pay more for Wyndham ownership without any ViP benefits.  We own 25,300 points in Shell.  

However, have you seen the rate for exchanging into DVC Saratoga Springs via ongoing search through the Shell portal?  2,000 points for a one bedroom during September, so probably the same in January.  That is a deal.  I am hoping to get January, and SSR is just fine with me.  I like it, it's easy to catch the buses from Paddock, where exchanges tend to get most.  I need 3 units/ 2 consecutive weeks, for kids and grandkids and us.  I would love to get that.  It would be amazing to get it cheaply.  Of course, I have tons of TPU's in my regular account.  I rarely get a match for anything in that account.


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## TheHolleys87 (Apr 18, 2019)

rickandcindy23 said:


> Wyndham is the worst at lying, misrepresenting, and I don't think anything Maria was told is fact.  She didn't say how much she paid, even though she was asked.
> 
> I think this sales' presentation our next visit will be a real conversation about how we can get rid of what we have, not pay more for Wyndham ownership without any ViP benefits.  We own 25,300 points in Shell.
> 
> However, have you seen the rate for exchanging into DVC Saratoga Springs via ongoing search through the Shell portal?  2,000 points for a one bedroom during September, so probably the same in January.  That is a deal.  I am hoping to get January, and SSR is just fine with me.  I like it, it's easy to catch the buses from Paddock, where exchanges tend to get most.  I need 3 units/ 2 consecutive weeks, for kids and grandkids and us.  I would love to get that.  It would be amazing to get it cheaply.  Of course, I have tons of TPU's in my regular account.  I rarely get a match for anything in that account.



Wow, 2000 points for a 1 BR at SSR? I’ve never looked at DVC through Shell but will think about it next time.

And re Maria, she says her niece works for Wyndham; I wonder if she does too, given the sense of urgency in her posts. At any rate, we’re not going to do anything except enjoy our vacation.


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## Michelle Marie Perez (Apr 18, 2019)

TheHolleys87 said:


> Wow, 2000 points for a 1 BR at SSR? I’ve never looked at DVC through Shell but will think about it next time.
> 
> And re Maria, she says her niece works for Wyndham; I wonder if she does too, given the sense of urgency in her posts. At any rate, we’re not going to do anything except enjoy our vacation.



First of all, I said my friends daughter worked for shell in Anaheim. Not my niece. 2nd, I don’t work for Wyndham. I just happened to go in the other day and thought my information was useful to you guys. I could careless what you do. The way it seemed to me is eventually you would have to convert in because the shell properties are going to be in CWA and CW.


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## northwoodsgal (Apr 19, 2019)

Marie, I appreciate the information you provided to the group. It seems like you've found a way to enjoying timesharing vacations even more.


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## rickandcindy23 (Apr 19, 2019)

They need to convert me for free, if they want all of Shell in Wyndham.  If they start denying us the ability to book the way we always have, that is going to be a lawsuit against Wyndham.  Blackmailing me into converting to Wyndham isn't going to work for me. It would be very expensive to convert these many contracts I have into a system that might require an $84K purchase for each.  No thanks.  And why should people pay, anyway?  Someone already paid a great deal of money for what I own, and developer owners shouldn't have to pay again for yet ANOTHER program, when the one they have is satisfactory enough.  

Deny me use, and you had better take this bunch of points off of my hands.


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## TheHolleys87 (Apr 19, 2019)

Michelle Marie Perez said:


> First of all, I said my friends daughter worked for shell in Anaheim. Not my niece. 2nd, I don’t work for Wyndham. I just happened to go in the other day and thought my information was useful to you guys. I could careless what you do. The way it seemed to me is eventually you would have to convert in because the shell properties are going to be in CWA and CW.



Sorry for the inaccuracies in my post.  

If you still want to be useful to us, you could tell us 

1) whether an additional purchase is required in order to convert, or could we simply convert our current Shell points and that would be all the Wyndham points we'd have and 

2) what the price per point is for additional points, if we want to buy any.  

We don't want or need to know the details of your personal deal, just what Wyndham is currently offering to Shell owners who are interested in converting.  

And I agree with @rickandcindy23  - I don't believe that Wyndham can take away my rights to book in the Shell system, and if they want my Shell properties in their Wyndham system, they'll need to allow me to convert at no cost to me, neither conversion cost nor required additional points purchase.  Maybe all the Shell properties will end up in CWA, but I think that will take quite a few years and changes of ownership of Shell properties.

Thanks!


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## rickandcindy23 (Apr 19, 2019)

So through the portal, Shell to RCI, I can book through both points and weeks.  I am all about that.


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## woj027 (Apr 19, 2019)

Will Wyndham members be able to reserve Shell rooms in the future?  If so, anyone have ideas as to how soon?


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## ausman (Apr 19, 2019)

No idea, but let's make some assumptions and guesses.

In one of the posts Wyndham was quoted as saying they were working on extending the Shell reservation period to 13 - 9 months.

We know that Shell conversions to Wyndham began early April 2019.

Assuming Wyndham had already completed the change to the 13 - 9 month period before they announced they were working on it, then Shell owners could have reservation rights for another 4 months beginning April.

It would seem those rights would expire April plus 4 mths. So, August, for beginning Wyndham access to Shell inventory would be my guess with addition inventory subsequently.


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## T-Dot-Traveller (Apr 20, 2019)

HitchHiker71 said:


> My sense is this is more sales weasel BS with regard to the "in about a month it will go up..." mantra.
> 
> They ALWAYS say if you don't buy now you will pay more later.  .... Don't fall for it.  It's simply a way to create a sense of urgency .....



I agree -
The scenario you describe duplicates what I have read on TUG - re. Diamonds Sales Pitches to Gold Key
owners after they bought the Virginia Beach based system a few years ago .

The same urgency was used on Silverleaf owners after HICV acquired
that system - per posts on TUG.

******

I could be wrong - but IMO / based on reading the TUG Wyndham Forum - CWA points can only ARP book up to the percentage of each resort property that is in CWA .

So : a hypothetical resort X in the Wyndham System has 10 units x 52 weeks = 520 math units and hypothetically  they were all sold originally as fixed weeks to 520 individual owners .
1) 120 are still fixed weeks / never converted to points
2) 300 were converted to UDI points / with priority ARP for resort X .
3) 100 were turned in to Ovation and Wyndham put them into CWA (trust)and sold those points to new owners .**
4) Those new owners have CWA ARP at resort X .**

let’s assume all the CWA owners of resort X choose to use their points at resorts Y & Z**

IMO - CWA ARP reservations can only book 100 math unit / weeks because CWA only has that percentage ownership of resort X.

Shell owners would still be able to book the 300 math unit / weeks that remain in Shell Points .

5) If the remaining Shell inventory is gradually converted to CWA / the number of Shell owners trying to book Shell inventory is reduced by an equivalent amount .

< **My explanation is is a simplified version of how CWA is structured >
I think I gave the “big picture “ explanation correctly .


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## Vee Ts (May 2, 2019)

ecwinch said:


> Since the questions about buying more points keep going unanswered, and given that you have to attend a sales presentation to convert, I would conclude a purchase is required.



It's is totally frustrating when someone post something and then completely avoids valid questions. What are you hiding? Did you get a bad deal? Well, I attended the presentation myself and YES I do believe it's a bad deal. I went to the presentation at Inn at the Park in San Diego. Yes you do have to buy CW points to convert the rest of your Shell Points to CW. The Shell conversation is 1 to 40. The new CW points was a crazy amount. 84k points cost 17k and 126k post cost 25k. VIP starts at 400k CW points which gives you discounts points when booking. Then I called a friend who has CW. Without VIP, if you want to Bank points you need do it in the first three months of your Use Year plus a $39 fee (I think). I forgot to ask about Borrowing points. Anyone know if this is possible in CW and is there a fee? Also, the myclubwyndham.com site was SLOW. I wanted to see the point chart so I can try to compare what I can get with my point. It's not as easy as our Shell Owners site. You need to search for a Resort, make sure it's available on the dates you want, then click on Details, scroll down and find the link call "Point Chart". You need to do this for every resort to see the point chart. In Shell, we have a page for this with easy drop down to pick a resort.


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## ecwinch (May 2, 2019)

Thanks for reporting back with the specifics. 

If it is a good or bad deal, I think depends on how many Shell points that are eligible to convert to Cub Wyndham. Being able to buy into the VIP Gold or Platinum Club Wyndham level for $17k might make sense for some. 

Club Wyndham has a limited ability to borrow points - you can borrow points from your next use year for reservations made within 90 days of check-in with no fee.


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## Vee Ts (May 2, 2019)

ecwinch said:


> Thanks for reporting back with the specifics.
> 
> If it is a good or bad deal, I think depends on how many Shell points that are eligible to convert to Cub Wyndham. Being able to buy into the VIP Gold or Platinum Club Wyndham level for $17k might make sense for some.
> 
> Club Wyndham has a limited ability to borrow points - you can borrow points from your next use year for reservations made within 90 days of check-in with no fee.



All Shell points can be converted to CWP (1 to 40). But I can get 100k CWP for less than $1,000 resell. Why would I want to spend $17,000 to get access to CW Resorts? If was able to convert without buying new points then I would probably do it.

As far as borrowing, it doesn't sound as good if I can only do it within 90 days of check-in. Is there also a fee to Borrow? For example, I was able to pull together over two years of point for a long vacation. I Banked unused points from my 2018 UY (Use Year), use all of my 2019 points, and borrow some of 2020 points. This is the beauty of maximizing points and not forfeit them. Also, you will never use every last point perfectly in one year. So basically, they are forcing you to pay the $39 Banking/Deposit fee or else you lose you points. Shell doesn't have this fee and you can bank up to the last 3 months of your UY, and borrow immediately from the next UY. I have never lost any points in owning Shell for 15 years.


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## ecwinch (May 3, 2019)

Vee Ts said:


> All Shell points can be converted to CWP (1 to 40). But I can get 100k CWP for less than $1,000 resell. Why would I want to spend $17,000 to get access to CW Resorts? If was able to convert without buying new points then I would probably do it.
> 
> As far as borrowing, it doesn't sound as good if I can only do it within 90 days of check-in. Is there also a fee to Borrow? For example, I was able to pull together over two years of point for a long vacation. I Banked unused points from my 2018 UY (Use Year), use all of my 2019 points, and borrow some of 2020 points. This is the beauty of maximizing points and not forfeit them. Also, you will never use every last point perfectly in one year. So basically, they are forcing you to pay the $39 Banking/Deposit fee or else you lose you points. Shell doesn't have this fee and you can bank up to the last 3 months of your UY, and borrow immediately from the next UY. I have never lost any points in owning Shell for 15 years.



There is no fee to borrow points in Club Wyndham.

VIP members get a 25-50% points discount on reservations made within 30-60 days. I make extensive use of this and unit upgrades. It cost me about that amount to buy in, and I have a good ROI.


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## Vee Ts (May 3, 2019)

ecwinch said:


> There is no fee to borrow points in Club Wyndham.
> 
> VIP members get a 25-50% points discount on reservations made within 30-60 days. I make extensive use of this and unit upgrades. It cost me about that amount to buy in, and I have a good ROI.


Half the time I make a reservation in 60 days of check-in. But the other half it's like 9 months out, usually for longer vacations. I can't risk (and I'm sure others are the same way) booking flights, car, asking for time off, etc only not have availability for accommodation.


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## ecwinch (May 3, 2019)

Vee Ts said:


> Half the time I make a reservation in 60 days of check-in. But the other half it's like 9 months out, usually for longer vacations. I can't risk (and I'm sure others are the same way) booking flights, car, asking for time off, etc only not have availability for accommodation.



You be surprised how having that as an option changes how you travel. For the better. 

For reservations I need to make 9-13 months out, I rely on exchanges. Primarily via Interval.


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## paxsarah (May 3, 2019)

Vee Ts said:


> I wanted to see the point chart so I can try to compare what I can get with my point. It's not as easy as our Shell Owners site. You need to search for a Resort, make sure it's available on the dates you want, then click on Details, scroll down and find the link call "Point Chart". You need to do this for every resort to see the point chart.



The Wyndham website is not great, but there is an easier way. You don’t need to search your dates first - you can simply go to the resort page and scroll down to the points chart. But the easiest way to look at multiple resorts is to look at either a print or PDF/online version of the full directory. Simply open the electronic document, do a quick ctrl-F on the resort name, and see its points chart.


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## TheHolleys87 (May 4, 2019)

Vee Ts said:


> It's is totally frustrating when someone post something and then completely avoids valid questions. What are you hiding? Did you get a bad deal? Well, I attended the presentation myself and YES I do believe it's a bad deal. I went to the presentation at Inn at the Park in San Diego. Yes you do have to buy CW points to convert the rest of your Shell Points to CW. The Shell conversation is 1 to 40. The new CW points was a crazy amount. 84k points cost 17k and 126k post cost 25k. VIP starts at 400k CW points which gives you discounts points when booking. Then I called a friend who has CW. Without VIP, if you want to Bank points you need do it in the first three months of your Use Year plus a $39 fee (I think). I forgot to ask about Borrowing points. Anyone know if this is possible in CW and is there a fee? Also, the myclubwyndham.com site was SLOW. I wanted to see the point chart so I can try to compare what I can get with my point. It's not as easy as our Shell Owners site. You need to search for a Resort, make sure it's available on the dates you want, then click on Details, scroll down and find the link call "Point Chart". You need to do this for every resort to see the point chart. In Shell, we have a page for this with easy drop down to pick a resort.



Many thanks for these details! Now I know that converting makes no sense whatever for us and we don’t even need to consider attending the “owner update.”


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## Sandy VDH (May 4, 2019)

Here is the book that you can see all points....

http://www.nxtbook.com/nxtbooks/wyndham/plus_membersdirectory1819/index.php#/266


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## JohnPaul (May 4, 2019)

I am highly unlikely to convert but curious about VIP.  I have 17,000 Shell points (7000 developer).  If I converted at 40:1 that's 680,000.  Add 84,000 points and that's 764,000.  Does 750,000 points get you anything?  Would my resale points be excluded in that calculation?


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## JohnPaul (May 4, 2019)

I'm sure people have noticed that anything not contractually required by the Shell legal documents is going away to make Shell Ownership (Vs their conversion) less valuable (unless all you want are the SVC resorts - which I can live with but the extra perks were nice).

For example, no International Options any more in either SVC Lifestyles or SVC Collections.  Select Connections (partnership with Bluegreen is going away next year).  I'm guessing the option to use Shell points to stay in Wyndham/WM resorts (about half a dozen currently) will also disappear.

However, I'm 64 and my husband is 71.  We own a ton of timeshares.  He doesn't like traveling to the South or much of the Midwest.

So...I don't see any big benefit to converting for us.  We will just continue to use San Francisco, Napa and San Diego.

Of course, they told me our availability will go to nothing as everyone converts to Club Wyndham Plus.  I think that's just a scare tactic.


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## ecwinch (May 4, 2019)

JohnPaul said:


> Of course, they told me our availability will go to nothing as everyone converts to Club Wyndham Plus.  I think that's just a scare tactic.



Yes, it is just the fear-uncertainty-doubt (FUD) strategy they always play when changes are made. I have been hearing that same thing in regard to using my Marriott week with Interval for years now - that II inventory will disappear once everyone converts to MVCI points. Many years later and it still have not come to pass. And if it does, I will switch then.


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## ecwinch (May 4, 2019)

JohnPaul said:


> I am highly unlikely to convert but curious about VIP.  I have 17,000 Shell points (7000 developer).  If I converted at 40:1 that's 680,000.  Add 84,000 points and that's 764,000.  Does 750,000 points get you anything?  Would my resale points be excluded in that calculation?



The initial report on the conversion process was that resale points can be converted, but wont count toward VIP levels. Your 7000 developer points would come in at 280k and if you bought 128k more you would get Silver VIP. That would get you a 25% pts discount 60 days out, unit upgrades 30 days out, and free housekeeping.


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## bizaro86 (May 4, 2019)

Interesting about everything else going away. I bought to use the Shell resorts, so that doesn't really affect me. Resale owners can't get most of that anyway. Although interestingly, I added points to my account this year and they seem to have mistakenly coded them as a developer purchase.


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## rickandcindy23 (May 5, 2019)

I think the majority don't want to pay to convert to Wyndham.  And why should a person who paid through Shell long ago have to pay again to convert, simply because Shell gave up the management of Shell resorts and chose Wyndham?  What makes Wyndham better?  Nothing worth $28K or whatever they want to charge. 

This has been my frustration about timeshare all along.  We have owned PAHIO Bali Hai and Shearwater for a long time.  First you buy a week that floats, are happy with it, use it, then you get a presentation all about RCI Points and how much better RCI points is for your week you paid a lot for years ago.  RCI Points adds options you don't have now, including travel (airfare, cruise, cars, Disney tickets, etc.) I was in disbelief at that one, and I was right.  RCI Points doesn't have those travel options like they once had.  

Then Wyndham takes over PAHIO a year later, and now there is something new to sell, which is Wyndham points. For a small purchase, you can convert your weeks to Wyndham points.  I did that twice.  I have been there, done it, and I was ecstatic, until two years ago with the new computer "upgrades."  Sneaky Wyndham.  Now WorldMark has guest fees.  I am just not happy with Wyndham right now, and Shell stands alone as a decent system, so perhaps people ought to avoid paying more for something that is not going to pay you back in benefits, even if you figure the benefits over 100 years.  :0


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## rickandcindy23 (May 5, 2019)

So right now, through the Shell > RCI Portal, I see a week at Wyndham Bonnet Creek for 3,000 Shell points, 12/8-12/15, 2 bedroom.  So for 3,000 points (about $780 total MF cost) + $189 transaction fee, you too can use Shell for Wyndham.  That is a great deal.  I am looking forward to booking RCI exchanges with Shell points.


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## T-Dot-Traveller (May 5, 2019)

JohnPaul said:


> I'm sure people have noticed that anything not contractually required by the Shell legal documents is going away......
> ..., I'm 64 and my husband is 71...So..We will just continue to use San Francisco, Napa and San Diego.
> Of course, they told me our availability will go to nothing as everyone converts to Club Wyndham Plus.  I think that's just a scare tactic.



A agree - a scare tactic .
I am reposting my own post from earlier in the thread / it is based on reading TUG  and information gained from folks , including Ron Parise - who studied Wyndham points & their structure extensively .



T-Dot-Traveller said:


> The scenario ..duplicates what I have read on TUG - re. Diamonds Sales Pitches to Gold Key owners after they bought the Virginia Beach based system .....The same urgency was used on Silverleaf owners after HICV acquired ...
> ******
> I could be wrong - but IMO / based on reading the TUG Wyndham Forum - CWA points can only ARP book up to the percentage of each resort property that is in CWA .
> 
> ...



Based on your ages &  Shell use focus on primarily 3 properties - I doubt that 
buying developer points to get to VIP would make fiscal sense .

It could if a Shell owner was 45 / and wanted a wider resort selection AND Wyndham let all the Shell points qualify . Doing the math would be interesting .


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## JerseyDeb (May 5, 2019)

We have a trip scheduled this fall with a Shell Discovery Package we purchased last Spring. Curious to see what they try and sell us now. We purchased Wyndham a few years back and they gave us temporary VIP which allowed us to somehow book Vino Bello.  Did an "owners update" only to find out it was not a Wyndham owner update but a Shell sales pitch. They tried to tell us that many Wyndham owners add Shell to their portfolios just to get into the west coast resorts. They indicated that although Shell was under Wyndham, they kept their own inventory. We bought developer once before finding TUG so we were not making that mistake again. But we did love Napa and wanted to come back. We kept saying no and they kept trying.  They finally sold us a Shell Discovery Package which we purchased because we figured we could come back once or twice depending on how we used it for around what it would cost to book on Extra Holidays. (Plus I knew I could get hubby to go on another trip west if we had to use it or lose it!!) 

Supposedly if we buy Shell off the Discovery Package we can apply the costs and roll the points into the purchase. The more I looked into Shell after our purchase the more I realized that the higher maintenance fees did not justify even a resale purchase for us. But I am curious how the sales pitch I am required to attend this fall will go now. I suppose they will only try and sell me more Wyndham points.


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## Vee Ts (Jul 9, 2019)

A followup on my Owners Update from April. I did another Owner Update to compare what I heard the first time. 84k is the min you can buy for 17k (15k after saying "No" a couple time). In the end, I said I was hoping I can just convert my existing SVC to CWP and the manager said yes but the enrollment/conversion fee will be $2950. If you buy the min 84k CWP then there's no enrollment/conversion fee.


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## rickandcindy23 (Jul 10, 2019)

Is that $2,950 per contract you own, or if you own like 10 contracts (all bought resale), would they charge several X $2,950?  

I may go on a Shell presentation, but I am already platinum with Wyndham, having converted our PAHIO weeks years ago to get that status.  I don't think it will work for me.


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## Vee Ts (Aug 2, 2019)

rickandcindy23 said:


> Is that $2,950 per contract you own, or if you own like 10 contracts (all bought resale), would they charge several X $2,950?
> 
> I may go on a Shell presentation, but I am already platinum with Wyndham, having converted our PAHIO weeks years ago to get that status.  I don't think it will work for me.



I only have 1 contract so I didn't inquire. But the way it sounds for example if you are new to Wyndham there is an enrollment fee to join the Club (whether its waived, discounted, etc. is another discussion). If you buy extra Wyndham contracts and don't have to pay another enrollment fees then I would say it's only $2,950 to convert all your contracts. But if you have to pay an enrollment fee each time you purchase from the developer, then I would say it's $2,950 per contracts.


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## HitchHiker71 (Aug 3, 2019)

Vee Ts said:


> I only have 1 contract so I didn't inquire. But the way it sounds for example if you are new to Wyndham there is an enrollment fee to join the Club (whether its waived, discounted, etc. is another discussion). If you buy extra Wyndham contracts and don't have to pay another enrollment fees then I would say it's only $2,950 to convert all your contracts. But if you have to pay an enrollment fee each time you purchase from the developer, then I would say it's $2,950 per contracts.



Be sure to dive into the details on the fee based conversions.  I just had a buddy of mine attempt to do this just this week for his legacy points at Wyndham Plantation in Myrtle Beach area (he has owned there for 17 years with Plantation resorts), via the fee based model.  We dove into the Wyndham contract details and found that when using the fee based model it is termed a “Limited Membership”.  Turns out though he had 532k annual conversion points, only 329k were VIP eligible which was buried in the contract verbiage.  Took us some digging to uncover all of this crap.  Fortunately we were on day five and still had time to rescind his contract.  Very odd contract verbiage in this deal.  He rescinded and then is going back to the drawing board to see what can be done the second time around.  

Same goes for the PIC Plus fee based option turns out.  The director at the resort kept telling my buddy that he could add PIC Plus contracts later for $2395 for the first PIC and $1995 for the second PIC.  I’ve always understood that adding PIC contracts requires a minimum developer purchase.  The PIC Plus fee based conversion is also termed “Limited Membership” and even with PIC Plus it expires after five years.  Only a PIC Plus combined with a developer purchase is not term limited.


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## kpeiper (Dec 17, 2019)

Not a pleasant update.  From the sales person:  Of course, the conversion offer could end by end of 2019.  After that Ovations will be my only option as so many people are converting that MF will rise 20% or more per year and eventually the website will not even be maintained.  With so many people converting, there will be no remaining inventory for the handful of SVC owners left.  

Lowest conversion offered is $19k.  MF costs didn't seem advantageous and I have grandfathered elite for the benefits that Wyndham hasn't raided.  

I was irritated at the lies and attitude.  He had a few incorrect math equations that I corrected which did not sit well.  I said no.  

Will the west HOA stay strong for SVC?  Should I drop the cash and convert?


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## T-Dot-Traveller (Dec 17, 2019)

Hi kpieper,
I have listed  what is likely a more accurate scenario than the version sales is spewing .

Ron posted this in April 2019  / earlier in the thread .




ronparise said:


> Here’s how I see it happening. : She’ll owners assign their use rights to the fair share trust and are awarded a certain number of club wyndham points
> Now the Club wyndham owners including the new club wyndham owners will be able to make reservations at all the club wyndham resorts and the shell resorts
> Let’s assume 50% of the shell shell points are  assigned to club wyndham.  That would mean 50% of shell inventory will be available to club wyndham owners (including the former shell owners)
> 
> The remaining 50% of shell inventory will be available to remaining shell owners who still hold 50% of the shell points


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## TheHolleys87 (Dec 17, 2019)

kpeiper said:


> Not a pleasant update.  From the sales person:  Of course, the conversion offer could end by end of 2019.  After that Ovations will be my only option as so many people are converting that MF will rise 20% or more per year and eventually the website will not even be maintained.  With so many people converting, there will be no remaining inventory for the handful of SVC owners left.
> 
> Lowest conversion offered is $19k.  MF costs didn't seem advantageous and I have grandfathered elite for the benefits that Wyndham hasn't raided.
> 
> ...


We own a tiny number of Shell Hawaii points, just enough for a 2-bedroom EOY if we bank or borrow, and we mostly use them in RCI. We attended an update at Peacock Suites in August. We made it clear we weren’t buying or converting and didn’t get any details from them - the sales lady said she reads TUG and the information here is accurate! Anyway, the minimum cost then would have been around $17K for us, but we refused.

We received our MF statement recently, and the increase was minimal, nowhere near 20%. 

I don’t think TUG has any data yet on percentage of Shell owners who have converted, refused conversion, or not yet had opportunity to convert or refuse, but I suspect (hope) that conversion is moving slowly and that we have many years before the amount of Shell inventory that’s inaccessible to us makes a difference.


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## california dreaming (Oct 28, 2020)

We received a similar sales pitch last year that we wouldn't be able to book SVC points because they would all be taken by Wyndham owners.  Only to find out when we checked the Wyndham site using the Wyndham points that we had, we were unable to book Napa.  As we looked through the whole thing, we did not like what we saw and didn't think we would use the points like we have in the past.  We therefore gave all 17, 000 points back to Wyndham, saving us $5,000 this year, especially since we would not have used them.  We are now in the process of returning our Wyndham points.  The sales pitches we set in on with SVC before Wyndham seemed to be fairly truthful.  The sales pitches after Wyndham purchase were oversold.


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