# Golf course closing? [Grande Pines at Cypress Harbour]



## Serina (Mar 10, 2015)

Recently, I heard that the golf course across the street from GV (I think it's called Grand Cypress golf course?) has been sold and there are plans to build single family homes. Does anyone know if that is indeed true?


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## n777lt (Mar 11, 2015)

I don't know about the single family homes plan, but I was told in December by GV staff that the golf course would be closing because the owner of the property was going to do something else with it.


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## #1 Cowboys Fan (Mar 11, 2015)

Do you mean Grand Pines?

(That's in Orlando, near Grande Vista and Cypress Harbour).

It's a nice, but pretty tough course.

It THAT the one you mean?

Pat


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## dioxide45 (Mar 11, 2015)

It is true. Here is an article about its sale. It was also mentioned on TUG a while back.


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## EducatedConsumer (Mar 11, 2015)

That's a shame. Grande Pines was a nice course to play, and a pretty back-drop to Cypress Harbour. Convenient to Cypress Habour, too.


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## Bucky (Mar 12, 2015)

The course will officially close the end of this month. It's also a shame because it's right across the street from MGV.


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## wordine (May 14, 2015)

*Cypress Harbour Resort-Grande Pines Golf Course Issue*

If there is a thread already open on this issue, I apologize but I have not seen it.
Today, I received the Cypress Harbour Newsletter Spring 2015 that detailed some of what has occurred, is occurring and may occur relative to the loss of the Grande Pines golf course that has been a fixture in the overall Cypress Harbor experience.
The newsletter reported that the golf course is closed and there are plans for a housing development.  The golf course was sold by a Marriott company to a developer in 2014, according to news reports.
While the newsletter did not give very many specifics on the scope of the development or name the developer, news reports in the local media peg the size at more than 1,100 units consisting of apartments, townhouses and single family residences. Retail development is also in the proposal. Clearly, there are many questions outstanding.
The site map illustration that is linked in the newsletter shows the development will largely encircle  Cypress Harbour. Owners should take a careful look.
I was unaware until very recently of the substantial changes that are coming to a resort that was a jewel on the timeshare landscape.
This thread is an opportunity for owners and concerned parties to contribute thoughts and information.


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## Deej82 (May 14, 2015)

Can you/someone possibly provide a copy of or link to the newsletter?  I'd be interested in any details... We love Cypress and are trying to keep tabs on the developments.. Thanks!


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## TRAVELING FOOL (May 14, 2015)

We were informed of this by the bartender when we were there in February. It was such a beautiful view sitting by the main clubhouse pool. I can't imagine what it will be like to look out at housing developments!


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## samara64 (May 14, 2015)

What about Grande Vista Golf Club. Are they selling this as well.


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## wordine (May 15, 2015)

More information in recent article in Orlando Business Journal.


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## Bucky (May 15, 2015)

samara64 said:


> What about Grande Vista Golf Club. Are they selling this as well.



In a word, no.


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## amanda14 (May 15, 2015)

I received that correspondence a while back but it has been known for sometime that it was closing.  Unfortunate as that is a challenging course to play.  Strange drive in though to the clubhouse and seeing the Corniche (Was that the name) buildings.  I wonder if Marriott tried to purchase the whole thing.


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## n777lt (May 15, 2015)

We were told last December that the golf course across I Drive from Grande Vista IS being sold - is that the Cypress Harbour one?


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## SueDonJ (May 15, 2015)

amanda14 said:


> I received that correspondence a while back but it has been known for sometime that it was closing.  Unfortunate as that is a challenging course to play.  Strange drive in though to the clubhouse and seeing the Corniche (Was that the name) buildings.  I wonder if Marriott tried to purchase the whole thing.



  According to the link in Post #4 Marriott did own it, sold it in 2014 but continued to operate it for a year.  Now the new owners have released their development plans.


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## SueDonJ (May 15, 2015)

n777lt said:


> We were told last December that the golf course across I Drive from Grande Vista IS being sold - is that the Cypress Harbour one?



I think so.  There's a map at the linked page in Post #11 - is that Grande Vista all the way to the right?  It looks like the 9-hole course and Marriott Golf Academy at GV has nothing to do with what's happening at Cypress Harbour.

{eta}  Wow, Cypress Harbour is completely surrounded by the new development.  Are any of the other Orlando MVW resorts also on that map?


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## tiel (May 15, 2015)

SueDonJ said:


> {eta}  Wow, Cypress Harbour is completely surrounded by the new development.



We were so disappointed when we heard the course had been sold and was going to be developed.  It was a beautiful "part" of CH.  We loved sitting in the main pool area and enjoying the view of the course across the lake.  It was so serene.  Now it's going to be residences.  We think that will have a negative effect on the general atmosphere of the pool and the resort somewhat.  

Not sure what the boundary between the resort and course looks like now, but it will surely have to made more substantive so residents can't access the resort, by land or water, at will.  Has anyone heard what the plans might be?  I've seen the proposed development plan, but couldn't discern wha the boundaries might look like.


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## dioxide45 (May 15, 2015)

SueDonJ said:


> Are any of the other Orlando MVW resorts also on that map?



Yes, the cluster of buildings you see toward the upper left across from the entrance to Cypress Harbour is Harbour Lake. What you see on the far right is Grande Vista. It seems that MVCI owned a large swath of land all the way from I4 over to the housing developments that backs the east side of Grande Vista. Not much further east and you have Grande Lakes where the Marriott, Ritz and Lakeshore Reserve are located.


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## wordine (May 17, 2015)

I am shocked that there is so little response from Cypress Harbour owners.  The housing development will surround and intrude into the resort.  With 1,136 housing units, including 700 apartments, this would mean conservatively about 3,000 permanent residents and about 2,000 additional cars right in the resort's lap.  Consider ongoing construction, the impact of traffic, loss of wildlife, diminishing resale value, adverse affect on trade value, potential impact on Destination Club points.  The issues go on and on beyond simply losing a pretty view.


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## sparty (May 17, 2015)

From BOD:

As of March 31, 2015, the golf course ceased operations. The developer does have plans in place to maintain the course by mowing the grounds until such time their development begins. As far as we have been told, the first construction will be apartments on the other side of Westwood Boulevard to our southwest corner – and they hope to start those by the end of the year.

We can all agree this situation is quite regrettable. You might feel we can do something to “stop” the development – we may or may not, but if we tried, it would be at a great cost with no guaranteed result. Instead, the Board and Resort management will take the approach of protecting the Association and our Resort as best we can given the circumstances. Right now, we have a good dialogue with the developer who appears willing to consider our requests, and we are feeling positive we will get what we need in order to protect our property and our Owners and guests.

As part of the sale process, Marriott Vacations Worldwide (MVW) and the developer agreed on two major items: fencing between the development and Cypress Harbour on the north and east sides of the property and protection of our rights to use the lake. Since then, the developer has indicated their desire to obtain easement rights to property the Association controls on the northwest corner as well as easement rights for drainage enhancements. In exchange, the Board intends to request additional fencing, allowances for security and landscaping, additional language regarding our lake rights and additional setback allowances.

The developer had their first meeting with the Orange County Zoning Commission in April and it was delayed until May. Cypress Harbour Representatives appointed by the Board attend all these meetings to ensure what the developer tells us is what occurs. Two Owners have been helpful in this regard, and we would like to thank Tom Sanders and Dave Harpley.

What does this mean for our lovely golf course view across the lake from the Clubhouse? If we agree to relinquish our control over the two parcels of land mentioned above, the developer will build single family homes with their back yards abutting the lake. If we do not relinquish the control of the two parcels of land, the developer will build townhouses across the lake to meet density requirements. 

The Board has chosen to negotiate the control of the two parcels so that homes vs. townhomes will be built for two reasons: ease of landscaping and less density. At the recent Board meeting, proposals were heard from Resort staff to increase security (for example, increased perimeter lighting, more visible security and the right type of fencing) as well as landscaping. Options of landscape choices which will provide lovely views from the Resort side of the fence as well as providing prickly plants on the borders to discourage trespassers.


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## wordine (May 17, 2015)

From the Cypress Harbour Newsletter provided by Sparty.  Thank you to our friend from Michigan  ...

_What does this mean for our lovely golf course view across the lake from the Clubhouse? If we agree to relinquish our control over the two parcels of land mentioned above (i.e. easement rights that the developer needs, my add), the developer will build single family homes with their back yards abutting the lake. If we do not relinquish the control of the two parcels of land, the developer will build townhouses across the lake to meet density requirements. _

Should we call that a negotiation or an ultimatum?

By the way, since the Newsletter seems to go out of its  way not to mention the developers by name, I'm wondering if we are we not allowed to say it out loud?

Florham Park, N.J.-based Ridgewood Real Estate Partners and New York-based Angelo, Gordon & Co. LP. 

Look, I am hopeful that this is just the beginning of a process that will have an outcome that's quite different from the developers' proposed opening bid of 1,136 housing units plus retail/restaurants -- but any Cypress Harbour owner has to be real nervous right now.


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## wisbadgerm (May 17, 2015)

The golf course does come fairly close to some of the CH buildings and is in view across the lake from both large pools.  This seems to be a very large development and I would hope the board would look into obtaining a buffer area between the resort and any planned development.  Possibly the development would be interested in having some green space/park that could be used for that purpose.  Probably not realistic, but maybe CH could buy some of the land and create a buffer.  It would be nice to have access and be able to walk around the lake. 

One negative for the developer and a negotiating point is that the pools are brightly lit 24/7 and can be noisy during the day and when entertainment is provided.  Plus I know I would not want loads of people using the pools to be able to view into my back yard.  Most owners prefer privacy. That would be a negative for any buildings built there.


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## wordine (May 17, 2015)

For Cypress Harbour timeshare owners who may be just learning some of the details of the potential enormous changes coming to their resort, here is a brief history of the Cypress Harbour/Grande Pines Golf Course sale and possible development culled from news reports.

*  During or before October 2013. It appears that Marriott Vacations Worldwide -- the 2011 publicly-traded spinoff (NYSE: VAC) from Marriott International, Inc. -- began exploring liquidating some real estate assets near the Cypress Harbour timeshare resort at least as early as October 2013 when it advertised a 20-acre parcel to the east of Cypress Harbour along International Drive.  That land is adjacent to Grande Pines GC and was touted as being useful for a variety of purposes, including housing and commercial.

* In October 2013, the Orlando Business Journal reported that Orange County (Fla.) was being asked to entertain a radically different development plan for a far larger piece of property that would include Grande Pines GC itself.  The developer wanted to put 2,384 apartments, 100 timeshare units, 150 hotel rooms and commercial space on the land.  It was not clear from the news report whether the developer had control of the land owned by Marriott Vacations Worldwide.  The report was not explicit in that regard.  The report did mention that there was at least one community meeting about the plan.  While it is not clear what further officials steps were taken regarding that plan, clearly it did not come to fruition.

* In November 2013, the Orlando Business Journal ran a news report reiterating Marriott Vacation Worldwide’s interest in liquidating the Grande Pines Golf Course.  There were no further details on what such a re-purposing might look like.

* In February 2014, the Orlando Sentinel reported that Marriott Vacations Worldwide had sold the 170-acre Grande Pines GC -- which the precedent Marriott company had owned since 1997 -- to a potential developer.  The report identified the buyer as AG-RW Grande Pines LLC and that it was represented by Angelo, Gordon & Co.  The report said the sale was for $24 million.  Marriott Vacations Worldwide said the sale was done to benefit shareholders. An MVW executive said that “when (Cypress Harbour) was being marketed, the golf course was not part of the resort” and the golf course “was never included as an amenity in the purchase,” according to the news report.

* In March 2015, The Orlando Business Journal reported that developers Angelo, Gordon & Co. (of N.Y.) , and Ridgewood Real Estate Partners (of N.J.) had presented a Master Plan to Orange County (Fla.), including a master plan map, that described a development of 700 apartments, 176 townhouses and 260 single-family homes on three parcels that encircled Cypress Harbour.  There were also provisions for retail/restaurants to the far east side of the golf course property.

* In May 2015, Cypress Harbour sent an email newsletter detailing some of the above and describing negotiations it was having with developers to mitigate effects of the proposed development on the Cypress Harbor time share resort.


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## aka Julie (Aug 22, 2015)

*Any update?*

We're going to be staying at Cypress Harbour in late October.

Has anyone stayed there recently to advise on if any work has started on developing the golf course.

I'm starting to think about where we should request our villa assignment and any construction would impact our request.

Thanks.


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## rapmarks (Aug 23, 2015)

whoops, somehow I posted in wrong thread


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## aka Julie (Aug 23, 2015)

rapmarks said:


> my son took my grandson into Boston and took him to many sites, but this was his favorite.   Since he was an infant, he has loved construction and construction vehicles



Huh! What does this have to do with Cypress Harbour?


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## Bogeygirl (Aug 23, 2015)

I'm guessing that the OP is suggesting that kids love watching construction equipment and maybe having the construction close by will be entertainment for them.  I, on the other hand, would not be entertained.


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## rapmarks (Aug 23, 2015)

no, I was posting in the Boston thread, removed it, can't figure out how it got in this one!!!!


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## catharsis (Jun 20, 2017)

_[Threads merged.]_

I presume this is not news - but though I would identify it in case it was....

A notice relating to cypress harbour bookings included the following



> Please direct any questions to the MVW Grande Pine Development inbox at mvwgpd@vacationclub.com or by phone at 407-238-6190.



Is a new MVW property called Grande Pines really under construction in Orlando?


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## SueDonJ (Jun 20, 2017)

It's not news that Marriott sold off the golf course adjacent to Cypress Harbour and that the land is being developed by the buyer as townhouses/single dwellings.  Here's one of the TUG threads related to that: Golf course closing? [Grande Pines at Cypress Harbour]

I think it is news if MVW (Marriott Vacations Worldwide) is working with the new owner to develop new timeshare properties on the golf course property, and it's curious that the notice you shared mentions something called, "MVW Grande Pine Development."  Can you share where/how you came upon the notice and any more of its text?

(If new MVW development on that site is in the works, this thread will remain as a new topic.  If not, this will be merged into the linked thread as a related topic.)

*******
DOH!  Never mind, I found it on the Cypress Harbour home page on owners.marriottvacationclub.com: 





> Please note there is ongoing development and construction on the land adjacent to the resort until further notice. Construction related activities/noise may be experienced during working hours. Please direct any questions to the MVW Grande Pine Development inbox at mvwgpd@vacationclub.com or by phone at 407-238-6190. We thank you for your understanding and sincerely apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.



I would say this has nothing to do with Marriott developing new timeshares in the area.


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## catharsis (Jun 20, 2017)

@SueDonJ surely "*MVW *Grande Pines" and an email address ending in vacationclub.com indicate that this is a Marriott Vacation Club development?


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## SueDonJ (Jun 20, 2017)

catharsis said:


> @SueDonJ surely "*MVW *Grande Pines" and an email address ending in vacationclub.com indicate that this is a Marriott Vacation Club development?



To me it seems like a special email address that Marriott wants us to use if we have any questions about the construction that's going on adjacent to Cypress Harbour, on what was the golf course.  If you look through all the information linked in this thread you'll see that it's a significant project practically surrounding CH. The employees at Cypress Harbour have probably been inundated with questions that they can't answer because it's not a Marriott project, so it stands to reason that MVW wants to direct all those questions to a single voice in MVW who can explain Marriott's (non) position as well as forward any that should be forwarded to the new owner.

I could be wrong but in all the related non-Marriott press releases and in all the official Marriott statements (including company conference calls) issued since the golf course sale was announced, there hasn't been any suggestion that MVW is working with the buyer to develop new Marriott timeshares.  If anybody knows differently, please set me straight.


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## catharsis (Jun 20, 2017)

I think you must be correct.

I must say in my own defense that while the email address is probably a sensible response, referring to "MVW Grande Pines" is just unhelpful and misleading ... at least to the easily misled


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## dioxide45 (Jun 20, 2017)

SueDonJ said:


> To me it seems like a special email address that Marriott wants us to use if we have any questions about the construction that's going on adjacent to Cypress Harbour, on what was the golf course.  If you look through all the information linked in this thread you'll see that it's a significant project practically surrounding CH. The employees at Cypress Harbour have probably been inundated with questions that they can't answer because it's not a Marriott project, so it stands to reason that MVW wants to direct all those questions to a single voice in MVW who can explain Marriott's (non) position as well as forward any that should be forwarded to the new owner.
> 
> I could be wrong but in all the related non-Marriott press releases and in all the official Marriott statements (including company conference calls) issued since the golf course sale was announced, there hasn't been any suggestion that MVW is working with the buyer to develop new Marriott timeshares.  If anybody knows differently, please set me straight.


This would be my take on the situation.


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## NboroGirl (Jun 21, 2017)

I agree with Sue.  I can't wait for that construction to be over with, though. As Grande Vista owners, it's been a pain. International Drive has been under reconstruction in front of the old Grand Pines golf course for the past 2 years: widening, new traffic lights, etc.  I hope by the next time I'm there, the traffic light in front of Grande Vista will be up and operational. It's getting harder and harder to exit MGV onto International Dr., *especially *if you're trying to turn left.


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