# [ 2015 ] Banff Gate Mt Resort Quickie Review



## Kauai Kid (Sep 11, 2015)

Main Lodge, check-in, grounds, personnel 9+

Chalets 5.0

Chalets and areas around them show years of neglect and poor maintenance.  Almost criminal what the BOD has allowed to happen.  This could be a gold star resort with a one time hefty special assessment to stain the outside, fix the rotten doors, put in some decent lighting, regrade the gravel roads and remove the potholes, clean the windows so you can see the beautiful Canadian scenery, replace all the door locks, put hand rails on all the units requiring steps to get into them.

We would not stay here again until they fix the place up and show some pride of ownership.

Sterling


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## elaine (Sep 11, 2015)

My Mom, Uncle and Aunt stayed there last month. We were at another resort and visited them. I had read the reviews and told my Mom to expect rustic (like her 60 year old lake house with original bathroom). When they first got there, they were shocked at the unmatched furniture and dated decor, various nonworking items, dirty deck furniture, etc. But, after a few days, they grew to really like the place. The view was outstanding. They found out that resort suffered greatly in a big flood 2 years ago and were still trying to get things back in order. My Mom felt like a handyman with a few weeks and a punch list could get a lot done. I noticed that the paint/stain needing to be redone. Not doing preventative things like that will cause water to penetrate the windows and then get wood rot around the frame and into the walls. It looked like this was already happening. Sad, because if truly is in a lovely area. However, I would stay there if I wanted to be near Banff and couldn't get into another timeshare. They had a great time and are still talking about it.


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## Kauai Kid (Sep 12, 2015)

Don't want my quickie review to be entirely negative.  Absolutely the quietest place we've ever been and great for star gazing when the nite sky is clear.

The Husky Gas Station has an associated trucker's restaurant that really puts out a plentiful plate of tasty food for a very reasonable price.

My own thought is that they should pick the chalet in the worst condition and fix it up to be a 9* unit and then they would have a baseline to get all the others in tip-top shape.  It is going to take a special assessment in my opinion.

Staff told me the floods happened when the lakes and cirques above the resort had frozen over and then torrential rains melted everything and down came the torrents of water. 

Sterling


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## silentg (Sep 12, 2015)

The questions to ask is how many of the owners are keeping up their Maintenence fees? Is the resort in danger of closing? Do they plan to fix up the place? Sell it or what?


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## Kauai Kid (Sep 14, 2015)

The lodge is in tip top shape and looks great.  All the wood is properly stained, beautiful hanging planters all around the facility.  Indoor pool and hot tub really nice.  Exercise room ok.  Dance floor looked appealing  and the outside area around the lodge very attractive and appealing.

I don't know the answers to the resorts finances.

There is a unit for sale on TUG but I'd never buy without seeing it in person.
.

Sterling


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## barto (Nov 1, 2015)

*Special assessments*

Actually, they have instituted special assessments of $400-ish for the past two years, and at least one more year to come.  Partly to deal with extra problems from the Big Flood, but also because it seems the previous management company wasn't able to keep up.  There's a new management company (Grand Pacific) that took over *just* before the flood.

There's a plan in place to deal with structural things first (sewer/water, some actual foundation issues on some chalets, etc.), after which they can get to making the units nice again.  I believe some of that work has started.

I am a former owner, and we absolutely loved the location, but as the chalets deteriorated over the years have taken a break.  I'm still on the mailing list so I get regular updates - definitely would love to get back in there once things have been sorted out.

Bart


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## pedro47 (Nov 1, 2015)

Did the new mgt company have flood insurance?


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## barto (Nov 18, 2015)

pedro47 said:


> Did the new mgt company have flood insurance?



There was definitely flood insurance (not just from the new management company), but of course it doesn't cover everything.  And while looking at flood damage they discovered some other issues that weren't quite flood related, as I understand it.


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## JoeBlow (Dec 12, 2015)

Barto ....Here's the rest of the story

Management was not the problem with Banff Gate Mountain Resort (BGMR), the problem was with the board and it's lawyer (who is a member also, but has never disclosed that little fact to the membership). 

The previous management before Grand Pacific Resort Management (GPRM) was only allowed to spend *$5,000 per year *, that's it. To spend more Management needed board approval.   Previous management had tried requesting money to fix problems, but those request never made it to board meetings, they were blocked by a couple of board members.

GPRM is no longer managing BGMR as of Jan 01, 2016. BGMR has, again,  had to hire another Management Company.  

Management does not provide/buy flood insurance, the Association does.

The Big Flood, as the Association Board likes to call it, only caused damage to the water pond ($112k claimed) (they don't pump water from the pond anyway, they buggered up the intake from the pond so now they get it up stream and pump it down to the intake shack and from there up to the water treatment plant), insulation in the crawl spaces of the Chalets ($40k claimed), Chalet 18 flooring/furnace ($8k claimed), the road leading into the Resort ($15k claimed), Loss mitigation ($20k claimed) and business interruption ($180k claimed).   They Claimed just over $350k and have received $326k to date and are waiting for $24k to be paid.  

The horrendous condition of Resort up to and after the flood was due to a lack of maintenance, which is the sole responsibility of the Association Board.  It was not management's fault and it certainly was not caused by the flood.  The flood did minimal damage to the resort, but listening to board they make it sound like it was the only reason for all the needed repairs which were supposedly discovered after the flood. In reality the board (again just a couple of board members) knew all about the needed repairs before the flood but did nothing.  So again the much needed repair where known about for years, but the board used the flood as an excuse to hid their past failure to act.    

If 4 directors hadn't brought forward the past failures of the board and true condition of the resort to the the membership in 2012/2013, the resort would most likely be shut down today.    By getting this information out the board was finally forced to act, thus the extra $411 a year in maintenance fees for the past 2 years and most likely the next 5+ years.  But according to the board they only found out about these issues after the flood.   What a pile of do do.  

This resort may never recover and if it does, it's going to cost a pile of money.    As of today I'm still a member but as for the future I will not be renewing my membership for 2016 and beyond.   I've had enough.


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## djyamyam (Dec 12, 2015)

Very interesting.  I'm hoping that the previous board members have not been re-elected based on this information?

Who is going to be the new management company and why the change?  Was GPRM fired or they backed away because of the board?


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## JoeBlow (Dec 12, 2015)

LaTour Resort Management is the New Management.

As far as the board goes, they've had the same core bunch for the last 10 years or so, which is 3 board members plus now a friend of the bunch elected 2 years ago, running the show.   They had 2 board members resign last year and then one of them, a past president, ran again 4 months later.   If your going to resign, resign and state to the membership why you resigned and maybe wait a couple of years to run again.   I really think the core group asked this person to come back because they didn't want any new blood interfering with their control of the Association.

They have one board member (8 years on board) who is hardly ever present at board meetings and when he is he only stays for the first 20 minutes or so. 

The board elected after the flood along with their incompetent lawyer brought in a special resolution stating that the Association Articles would prevail over any laws of the country.   When a group of members argued at an AGM that it was illegal, the incompetent Association lawyer got up and stated that "This motion addresses, if there is something in our articles that conflicts with what the companies act says, what regulations under the companies act, our *articles would prevail. Period.*".   The majority of the membership at the AGM followed the idiots lawyer advice and voted in favor of it.   2 years later Corporate registry made them rescind this illegal resolution which required another special resolution.  They never admitted they made a mistake or even questioned the competency of the Association Lawyer, they went ahead a put special resolution to rescind it in with a bunch of non related special resolutions and made the membership vote on all as one.  

This is the type of Board that this resort has had for the last 10 years.  They won't provide any information when requested.  They decide what the membership should know, which is not much.   Their motto is "Keep the membership ignorant and we can do what we want, because nobody cares anyway".    They know that most don't care or understand what's going on,  so they take advantage of this short coming of the membership.  

From 2008 up until 2014 the board (6 of 10 members) was the most dysfunctional, incompetent, corrupt board I've come across.  Worse than the timeshare company we bought the Resort from.   From 2014 on, the board has more or less been forced to behave, so they are trying to fix issues that various Government agencies are forcing them to fix.  It going to take years and buckets of cash to get this resort up to spec.   That's how bad the resort has deteriorated from inaction over the years.

As you can tell I not a fan of this Association Board or it's incompetent Lawyer.  The information I possess on this Association would make a great story.   But the membership seems to have no interest in the truth, so I keep it to my self until needed.


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## JoeBlow (Dec 13, 2015)

To answer the question on why GPRM quit, I really don't know and I doubt the membership will ever really know.   The Board is well known for not answering questions.  The only time the Board will respond to a question is just before an AGM and if they do answer, it will be either very vague; incomplete or just plain incorrect.    If you ask a question any other time during the year they simply ignore you.  Too make matters even more frustrating they wait months after the AGM to post answers to questions asked prior to the AGM.

Every other management company before GPRM quit due to the micro managing of the board or not being able to work with the board.  It's pretty funny that for 12+ years in what there are of board minutes they talk about moving from a micro managing board to a proper governing board, but that never happens.  

The Board at BGMR from 2008-2009 reverted to running the Resort under strictly crisis management, only acting when absolutely required to do so.   Their action plan was to put any required issues on an action list and never act on them unless absolutely necessary.  After 2010 they stopped even putting things on an action list.  They also never took Executive or Committee meeting minutes when they actually had one of those meetings, which wasn't very often and with some committees never.  So there is not a record of what went on at those meetings.  These people don't understand a key legal protection of being on a board, which is keeping proper records, but I guess it's pretty hard to keep records of doing nothing!!!!

The core group which is mostly the Executive seems to think that a few on Executive committee run the Association and not the Board.  Even the incompetent Association Lawyer has stated that's the way it should be.  

The Board has only disclosed the up front management fees paid to GPRM.  They have never disclosed the costs of all of GPRM's affiliates, like billing, debt recovery, etc.  At the AGM when asked for these numbers they just say they will look into it and get back, but that never happens they just ignore you because they know the next opportunity to bring something up will not be until next AGM and by then hopefully you've giving up.   If you actually do ask the same question again at the next AGM, you'll get the same answer and circle of nothingness continues.

So back to GRPM and their affiliate costs.  It's pretty funny that with all the other resorts that GRPM manages they give the membership a full reporting of all their fees, including affiliates.....  with BGMR it's a big secret.... Go figure.

I guess one possible reason for GPRM quitting is they've milked the Association for as much as they could when the getting was good and have moved on. Or  maybe it's because the Canadian dollar has depreciated so much it's not worthwhile anymore.  Who knows.  I do know that GRPM has also quit their partial management gig at a Panorama timeshare and stopped managing Resorts in Canada.


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## barto (Mar 5, 2016)

*Wow*

JoeBlow, thanks for sharing your thoughts and experiences!  I had no idea about the dysfunction going on there.  That would explain a lot, for sure.

All I have to go by is in the newsletters and e-mails that get sent out, as I'm still on the mailing list even though we haven't owned there for a couple of years.

Certainly hope that they follow through on their stated plans for various repairs and renovations, as we really thought the location was spectacular.

Our experience there goes back to the days of Brandon (I think) as the manager, shortly after the members bought back the resort, so we've seen changes there over the years... but the chalets themselves have generally not changed much.

Certainly would love to hear more about your experiences and stories.

Bart


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## Kauai Kid (Mar 7, 2016)

Grand Pacific did such a poor management job at Alii Kai resort, where we own, that the BOD fired them, and a new company is managing the Alii Kai Resort on Kauai.

Hope Grand Pacific does better by you folks.

$400 is peanuts--It should be upwards of $4000/wk owned.

Sterling


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## JoeBlow (Mar 22, 2016)

*GP out, La Tour in.*

GP is out of Canada completely.  Moved on.  Probably couldn't make enough money here to over come the exchange rate loss.


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