# Considering Wyndham



## GadgetRick (Apr 14, 2009)

I posted this in the points systems discussion and I figured I should also post it here.

Ok, I recently had to sell my DVC due to financial reasons. Luckily, I actually made money on it. Whew! Anywho, looking to buy a TS just not sure which way to go. I like points-based systems as they allow the flexibility we like in our travel. Here's a bit about us, how we travel and what we like to do. Just looking for some advice of which way to go...

-We, typically, go away for a minimum of 2 weeks per year with long weekends thrown in.
-We have a school-aged child and a 3 year old. So we're (somewhat) at the mercy of school but we're not opposed to taking him out for a week.
-We still go to Disney (at least) once a year.
-I love skiing and would like to continue my once a year out West trip (or more).
-We tend to travel last minute but can make plans in advance sometimes as well.
-I'm not opposed to watching the Bay for deals. We're not in a rush to buy anything. Looking for the best possible deal.
-I'm not opposed to having to exchange but have a lot to learn about it for any system we buy into.

So far I've been leaning towards Wyndham because it seems like that would give me the most flexibility to go different places. Although we do Disney all of the time, we also like to go different places for other vacations. So, if I'm reading everything correctly, it seems as if they would be the most flexible for us.

We're not sticklers for the fancy resort. I just need a reasonable room which are clean and near where I want to be. Don't need incredibly awesome resorts with lots of amenities. We'll call that a nice-to-have not a need-to-have.

We also don't have a fortune to spend and it seems as if Wyndham points can be bought (relatively) inexpensively online.

Are there other systems I should be considering? Any help will be greatly appreciated. Someone else mentioned HGV.


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## timeos2 (Apr 14, 2009)

*Wyndham is a truae timeshare bargain but only at resale price*



GadgetRick said:


> -We, typically, go away for a minimum of 2 weeks per year with long weekends thrown in.
> -We have a school-aged child and a 3 year old. So we're (somewhat) at the mercy of school but we're not opposed to taking him out for a week.
> -We still go to Disney (at least) once a year.
> -I love skiing and would like to continue my once a year out West trip (or more).
> ...



Wyndham points are dirt cheap to buy, offer extreme versatility and choice of internal as well as external resorts, gets you a free membership to RCI and much more. You are already familiar with points so your learning curve to maximize value would be shorter than most. 

IMO Wyndham resale points offer one of the truly great bargains in all of timeshare right now.  Look for 220,000 - 300,000 total points ad you'll be able to do almost anything, anytime using your points.  Inexpensive to purchase and fees are reasonable for the value of the resorts/trades obtained. We have really enjoyed our Wyndham ownership for over a decade and it seems to just get better as they add more great resorts and locations. Except for the customer service (which you only deal with at sales time) and the need to avoid the sales weasels at some of the resorts it is a painless ownership when purchased resale.  NEVER buy Wyndham retail.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 14, 2009)

Thanks. This is exactly my impression. I'm keeping an eye on a few eBay auctions for various point levels. I watched one for 203k points go for $102.50 plus closing costs. I can afford that now. 

I did place a low bid on another for 210k points at Pagosa Springs, CO. If I get lucky, great, if not, there seems to be plenty available.

I also figure, if I get it for dirt cheap, the worst thing which will happen is, we'll use it once and decide to dump it. If I get it cheap enough, I could give it away and not feel like I lost anything. 

Here's the $64,000 question though. It seems like it won't matter (much) where the resort is for the points I buy as it seems (relatively) easy to use them for other resorts (I know, depends on the resort and the time of year I want to use it). Just seems like there are so many potential choices I'll find somewhere I want to go which has space for us. I just want to confirm it doesn't really matter where the resort is where I buy the points. We tend to like to go different places anyway.

Thanks a bunch.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 14, 2009)

Also, anyone know about Shares3000 on eBay? They offer 0% financing over a few months. Not a bad deal if needed--shouldn't need it at the prices I'm looking at but it's good to know. Just wondering if they're reputable.

Thanks again for everything!


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## kalua (Apr 14, 2009)

*re; considering wyndham*



GadgetRick said:


> I posted this in the points systems discussion and I figured I should also post it here.
> 
> Ok, I recently had to sell my DVC due to financial reasons. Luckily, I actually made money on it. Whew! Anywho, looking to buy a TS just not sure which way to go. I like points-based systems as they allow the flexibility we like in our travel. Here's a bit about us, how we travel and what we like to do. Just looking for some advice of which way to go...
> 
> ...



wyndham is good, but just not for me! IMO something else to consider is and if I were doing it again this is what I would do ,I would buy about 84,000 points where I could get the cheapest maint. fee's(pts. are pts. doesn't matter what resort) and then exchange a couple of week's w/ rci or use them for short stay's ,and use last call at rci,your maint. fee's are not hanging over your head for say $120.00 mthly.for 300,000 pts.for the rest of your life or until you can sell,IMO I would do this aleast until I was sure I wanted to stay w/wyndham JMO !


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## EAM (Apr 14, 2009)

GadgetRick said:


> -We, typically, go away for a minimum of 2 weeks per year with long weekends thrown in.
> -We have a school-aged child and a 3 year old. So we're (somewhat) at the mercy of school but we're not opposed to taking him out for a week.
> -We still go to Disney (at least) once a year.
> -I love skiing and would like to continue my once a year out West trip (or more).
> ...



I agree with most of what the others have already said, and I agree that starting with a small points package is a good approach.  However, I suspect that in a few years, when you have two school age children, you will probably be wanting 2 BRs in prime season, as well as your weekend getaways, and a small points package may not be enough to get what you want within the Wyndham system.  You may or may not be able to get what you want using 70K points deposits in RCI.

Prime 2 BR week @ Steamboat Springs (e.g. over Christmas Break) 231K
Summer week at Cypress Palms (Kissimmee) 175K or prime week at Bonnet Creek 224K (more amenities, closer to Disney)
Weekend getaway - Could be as much as 91K at Atlantic City, lower most other places.  Sometimes you will be able to get discounts for last minute travel during the off season, even if you do not have the VIP privileges that go with a developer purchase.

If being able to choose your destination is important to you, plan your travel in advance (max is 10 months with Wyndham except at the resort you own where it is 13 months).  If you can be flexible about your destination, planning at the last minute usually works with Wyndham.  

As far as I know, Wyndham has the most locations and some of the lowest resale prices of the mini-systems that use points.  Try to buy at a resort with low (but not the lowest, which may be an indication of inadequate reserves) maintenance fees, unless you want to be sure of going to the same place each year and can plan 10-13 months in advance.

One caveat: Wyndham is less attractive than it used to be because of a number of recent changes.    Some fees (e.g. guest certificates, etc.) have been increased and some privileges, such as the right to transfer points between owners, have been taken away.  There is currently no owner representation on the board which administers the Vacation Owners Association trust, and decisions are being made that are in the best interest of Wyndham but not necessarily the best interests of owners.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 14, 2009)

Great info from all! Thanks a bunch! I'm taking it all in and trying to learn at the feet of the masters...  

I think I'll wind up buying a Wyndham interest for now as they are so cheap. Probably wind up with HGVC at some point in the future as my budget allows.

Seems like Wyndham offers the flexibility/number of resorts I need. We're usually quite flexible in where we stay when we go away. I figure I should be able to find something in the general area we want to go. Seems like Wyndham has most of the areas we like covered quite well.

One question I do have, however is, if I book at an Affiliate resort, is it like booking at a Wyndham resort or are there extra fees/points requirements like if I deposited points in RCI? I can't quite figure that out. With the number of resorts plus affiliates available, I'll probably be quite happy with just those.

Thanks again!


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## EAM (Apr 14, 2009)

*Affiliate resorts*

You book at affiliate resorts just like you would at Wyndham.  There are no additional fees, just a reservation transaction.  You get one reservation transaction per year for each 77K points you own.  After that, as I recall there's a $30 fee if you book online and $59 fee if you book by phone.  

Availability at affiliate and associate resorts is often very limited, so you would need to book in advance.  Some affiliate or associate resorts have a minimum stay, such as 1 week.  The point values at affiliates and associates may change.  Also, associate resorts are not necessarily permanently part of the Wyndham system.  The Worldmark resorts are associates.


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## Lisa P (Apr 14, 2009)

GadgetRick said:


> ...minimum of 2 weeks per year with long weekends thrown in... a school-aged child and a 3 year old... Disney (at least) once a year... once a year out West trip... travel last minute but can make plans in advance sometimes... need a reasonable room which are clean and near where I want to be... (relatively) inexpensively online.



If you want those 2 weeks per year to be a Disney (possibly DVC) week in FL and a ski week out west, both during school breaks, then you may want to consider WorldMark credits instead.  We do love our Wyndham points!!!  But you'll have more variety of western resorts during school breaks with WM.  And WM seems to have trade power to get into DVC, regardless of whether they're currently trading through II or RCI.

Now if you're just looking for offsite near Disney in FL and a non-prime-ski (summer?) week out west, then Wyn pts would work extremely well for you at a lower cost than WM.  And the Wyn locations for long weekend trips from northern NJ are certainly better too - Atlantic City NJ, Poconos PA, Bentley Brook MA, Newport RI, even Williamsburg or Alexandria VA. 



EAM said:


> I suspect that in a few years, when you have two school age children, you will probably be wanting 2 BRs in prime season, as well as your weekend getaways, and a small points package may not be enough to get what you want within the Wyndham system.  You may or may not be able to get what you want using 70K points deposits in RCI.
> 
> Prime 2 BR week @ Steamboat Springs (e.g. over Christmas Break) 231K
> Summer week at Cypress Palms (Kissimmee) 175K or prime week at Bonnet Creek 224K (more amenities, closer to Disney)
> Weekend getaway - Could be as much as 91K at Atlantic City, lower most other places.  Sometimes you will be able to get discounts for last minute travel during the off season, even if you do not have the VIP privileges that go with a developer purchase.



I agree with this overall, especially if the OP starts smaller and then, later, they may want to add another points contract with the same use year, as they may combine points for their Standard 10-month reservations.

189K = 1 week at Steamboat, 1BR Deluxe in Prime season
70K = RCI school break trade into Cypress Palms, HGVC, Vistana, Orange Lake, possibly Bonnet Creek (not DVC)
64K = weekend getaway at Atlantic City, smallest 1BR Suite in prime season
------------
323K = excellent starting level for your needs.

You may even start lower, trying to trade up more through RCI (28K wks), get some less prime season weeks (fewer pts) and/or get involved with two different programs, perhaps a western fixed week when you know you'd like to use it or WM credits for the western trip, only using Wyn pts for your FL and/or short stays.  Adding later is easy.  With all of these options, naturally you'll be looking for resales!!!


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## GadgetRick (Apr 14, 2009)

Thanks for more great info. There is no perfect answer right now. My biggest limitation is my budget (very small at the moment). That's why I've been drawn to Wyndham as the resales are ridiculously low.

Not concerned with staying on Disney property nor going during peak season. We, typically, go during the first week in December before peak Christmas season so that shouldn't be a problem.

From what I'm seeing at the ski resorts, the whole ski season isn't peak season so I can work around that as well as the whole family doesn't always go skiing. Might just be me and some buddies, in which case, school doesn't matter either. 

I've decided to bid on a 210k interest in Pagosa Springs, CO. I figure that's not a bad start and I can add on if I need to. Honestly, I'll probably wind up buying HGVC at some point in the near future if my finances permit me. I like what they offer as well.


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## EAM (Apr 14, 2009)

*FYI*

Pagosa is more of a golf resort than a ski resort, although skiing is available. Wolf Creek Ski area is about 30 miles away, on mountain roads.  Wyndham offers a round trip shuttle for about $27 per person.


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## Robnsunny (Apr 14, 2009)

Consider the extra charges that non VIPs run up, especially with short stays or small RCI deposits. You'll need to buy extra housekeeping points and extra transactions. It adds up quick.

Ski weeks out west will be difficult but Disney is easy (don't know about DVC). With the cheap buy in and the large number of nice resorts, it's probably what you need. Just be aware of the extra expenses and limitations.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 14, 2009)

Robnsunny said:


> Consider the extra charges that non VIPs run up, especially with short stays or small RCI deposits. You'll need to buy extra housekeeping points and extra transactions. It adds up quick.
> 
> Ski weeks out west will be difficult but Disney is easy (don't know about DVC). With the cheap buy in and the large number of nice resorts, it's probably what you need. Just be aware of the extra expenses and limitations.


Thanks for bringing this up. I've been trying to get my arms around these expenses to understand them but can't seem to find a comprehensive description of them all.

I'm thinking the ski weeks may not be as tough for me as I'm usually VERY flexible on when/where I want to go skiing. If I can't go to CO, I can go elsewhere. At least, I'm hoping this is true.


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## EAM (Apr 14, 2009)

*Forum for owners at Wyndham timeshares*

This forum may have the information you are seeking:

http://forums.atozed.com/


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## timeos2 (Apr 14, 2009)

*VIP for Wyndham is not worth the $$*



Robnsunny said:


> Consider the extra charges that non VIPs run up, especially with short stays or small RCI deposits. You'll need to buy extra housekeeping points and extra transactions. It adds up quick.
> .



This non-VIP can't remember ever paying a fee that I would have saved as a VIP. That in 15 years of ownership. When do I get the hit with the cost of VIP "benefits"? When do they add up? I have never run out of housekeeping credits (and they are CHEAP if I did). Makes me mighty glad I saved tens of thousands on resale rather than falling for the VIP nonsense.  Or do I have to count the newspaper - NOT USA Today - I usually like to buy when traveling? If so I've only got about $25,457 to go before VIP would have paid off!


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## GadgetRick (Apr 15, 2009)

Ok, another question. What resorts should I be looking at for lower MFs? Seems like the fees vary widely.

Thanks again.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 15, 2009)

Sorry, yet another question. 

Been looking at Pagosa Springs in CO. Figure, worst case, I can go there for some skiing. However, I'm seeing a lot of points for there for sale. Is there something I should be aware of with this resort? Something bad happening there?

Thanks again!


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## mshatty (Apr 15, 2009)

I own at Pagosa Springs (Mountain Meadows POA).  There are 8 POA's as part of this TS resort.  They are all owner controlled POAs.

Pagosa Springs is an established resort with stable management and costs.  As all things, the cost of running any business has increased.  All of the POAs seem to have good reserves for future updates.

Here's a link to the Pagosa Springs owners website:  
http://www.wyndhampagosa.net/properties.htm


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## EAM (Apr 15, 2009)

Wyndham Pagosa is one of the older, more established resorts.  Originally Fairfield would buy huge tracts of inexpensive land and then develop the sites for recreational, timeshare and retirement use.  There are both timeshares and year-round homes in such areas.  However, these sites were not close to any major tourist destination, and this makes them less attractive to many people.  Pagosa, Bay, Glade, Harbour etc. are now called the Legacy resorts.  They are great places to get away from it all for golf, swimming, fishing, tennis, etc but not good if your idea of a vacation is a crowded beach or theme park. 
You should realize that many weeks at the older resorts were originally sold as fixed weeks and later converted to points.  Such points have ARP (13 month) only for the original fixed week.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 15, 2009)

Ah, good info. So it sounds like it's a good property and I shouldn't worry about MFs going through the roof unless something crazy happens. Good to know that. I realize MFs will increase due to cost of living and other things. I expect to pay more next year than this year. 

Other than not having a ton of ARP (is that how it's used?) available, are there other downsides to buying into PS? I'll probably use the points at other various Wyndham resorts as we tend to go all over the place.


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## vacationhopeful (Apr 15, 2009)

Don't discard the importance of ARP when you have kids and live in the Northeast.  Want that summer beach vacation - ARP (esp Myrtle Beach)  Need that Thanksgiving long weekend - ARP.  Want to go to DC - ARP.

Yes, I use my ARP for my winter FL vacations - otherwise the warmest I would be is Atlantic City Skyline Tower :ignore: ...


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## GadgetRick (Apr 15, 2009)

I don't discount it at all. However, we're so flexible when we want to travel I'm thinking (hoping?) we can find something SOMEWHERE. We go to Disney in the first week of December--not a prime season--and, when I want to go skiing, I can go anywhere they have a room. I don't pin my hopes on one certain place. I usually say, "I feel like a ski trip, let's see where I can get the best deal." I'd just change and say, "Let's see where I can find a room."

Am I naive in thinking this type of use would work?


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## EAM (Apr 15, 2009)

Although it is is not impossible, you should NOT expect to be able to get a winter ski week or a summer beach week at the last minute.    You will be able to get a winter week at the beach or a summer week in the mountains at the last minute (IMHO, I like walking along a beach any time of the year and it is better when it isn't so hot and crowded, and I like hiking in the mountains so this works for me.)  If you must travel during holiday season, you must book far in advance.  Even at this point, most of the best ski destinations within Wyndham are totally booked for Christmas.  There's availability in January, but not every week at every resort.

Even if you plan in advance, you need to be flexible about where you ski.   Getting an average resort in New England, the Midwest, or the Appalachians (NC, VA) a few months in advance should not be a problem.  I don't know about the Poconos. New York is hard to get.  Getting someplace out west (other than Colorado or near Salt Lake City, UT) several months in advance would probably work too.  Getting Colorado or Park City in ski season isn't easy because most owners use their weeks and they are not deposited.

You lose ARP rights at 10 months anyway, so ARP is important only if you plan about a year in advance.

Some parts of Pagosa (Teal Landing and also Peregrine?) were sold as UDI (undivided interest) points.  With UDI points you can ARP anything available at 13-10 months before checkin, as long as you own enough points at that particular resort.  (I.e. if you owned at both Pagosa and Glade, you can only use your Pagosa points to make and ARP reservation there.)

If your philosophy is, I think I will take a vacation, let's see what's available, you will have some delightful vacations at places you might never have gone otherwise.  We went to a beautiful resort in Eden, UT that way, one summer when we were making last minute plans and could not find anyplace in Colorado.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 15, 2009)

EAM said:


> If your philosophy is, I think I will take a vacation, let's see what's available, you will have some delightful vacations at places you might never have gone otherwise.  We went to a beautiful resort in Eden, UT that way, one summer when we were making last minute plans and could not find anyplace in Colorado.



And this is pretty much how we vacation. Sure, we do the Disney in December trip every year. But the week I go shouldn't be a problem. Besides, if it is a problem, there are so many inexpensive places to stay it won't be an issue.

Other than that, we either plan way in advance if it's somewhere we HAVE to go, but usually just pick a timeframe (maybe a month) when we can take a week and figure out where to go based on where the deals are. We'll just change this philosophy to where the availabilty is. 

Also, can't I always use RCI by depositing points there? Seems like they have even more choices and, being flexible as I am, should make it even easier to find a place. I know I'll have the exchange fee but it would still be an inexpensive week. I don't plan to nor do I want to do extensive travel this way--I'd rather just deal with Wyndham and Affiliate resorts if I can--but I'm not opposed to trading in RCI if I _have _to.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 15, 2009)

EAM said:


> Pagosa is more of a golf resort than a ski resort, although skiing is available. Wolf Creek Ski area is about 30 miles away, on mountain roads.  Wyndham offers a round trip shuttle for about $27 per person.



Sorry I didn't reply to this sooner. I noticed this as well. For me it seems to bode well for winter trips. Wolf Creek seems to be a locals-type mountain--I live for locals mountains. And other mountains are within striking distance. So, if all else fails (Tahoe or Utah or where ever), maybe this would have availability during the winter?


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## GadgetRick (Apr 15, 2009)

Also meant to mention I lost my auction last night by 2.50. I think I got sniped. Sold for $107.50. One the other day for 205k points sold for $71.50. I'm going to try and snipe one I'm looking at now. They seem to sell for around $100 or less plus closing costs. As I've mentioned, if it doesn't work out and I only use it once or twice, I could literally give it away without feeling terribly guilty. I'd be out the MFs but that's a cheaper way to learn it does (or doesn't) work for me than investing thousands up front plus MFs. 

I'll let you know how it goes. There are plenty of packages like this available on the bay from one of the reputable sellers (everyone around here has said nothing but good things about them) on eBay. So I'll win one eventually.

I also joined as a paid TUG member. I was a paid member about 2 years ago when I was looking at TS. Joined again. Well worth it for the amount of money you all will have saved me by the time this is over. Thanks so much.


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## donnaval (Apr 15, 2009)

I just did a quick RCI search with my worst trader (a Pagosa lock-off deposited only 14 days before check-in), and I was able to see 28 resorts in the Kissimmee/Orlando area for check-in on 12/05/09, with many of them 2-brs.  

I would think that a Wyndham 28k generic would pull at least as well, if not somewhat better, than this extremely late deposit!

For traveling off-season, and if you're not particular about where you go, Wyndham is great through RCI.  Unfortunately the trading power has fallen so low that you will never see the truly prime stuff, no matter how many points you deposit into RCI--for example, you will never see Manhattan Club, DVC, summer GC beach resorts.  

Except--sometimes in the 2-week window those things might pop up, but until/unless they give us the ability to book online ourselves, they're pretty hard to snag.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 15, 2009)

donnaval said:


> I just did a quick RCI search with my worst trader (a Pagosa lock-off deposited only 14 days before check-in), and I was able to see 28 resorts in the Kissimmee/Orlando area for check-in on 12/05/09, with many of them 2-brs.
> 
> I would think that a Wyndham 28k generic would pull at least as well, if not somewhat better, than this extremely late deposit!
> 
> ...



Ok, I'm not concerned with getting into the prime resorts. Just give me enough space and clean and we're happy.  Sounds like this is going to be the way to go for our travel needs/financial restrictions at the moment.

Thanks again for all of the great info. I'm sure I'll have more questions and will do my best to contribute as I learn more. Now I'm gonna go try and snipe the one I'm watching...


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## GadgetRick (Apr 15, 2009)

Thanks to EZ Snipe (no affiliation), just won 231k points in Pagosa Springs for...drumroll....$76 plus closing costs. WooHOO!

Thanks for everyone's advice, I'll be asking many more questions once the transaction is complete for sure.


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## timeos2 (Apr 16, 2009)

*Nice buy. Great price*



GadgetRick said:


> Thanks to EZ Snipe (no affiliation), just won 231k points in Pagosa Springs for...drumroll....$76 plus closing costs. WooHOO!
> 
> Thanks for everyone's advice, I'll be asking many more questions once the transaction is complete for sure.



Great job. Good amount of points. You got a real bargain. Now learn the ropes to maximize your use and enjoy.


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## bornreddy (Apr 17, 2009)

I am new to the Wyndham forum as I own HGVC.  However, I am considering Wyndham for many of the reasons stated above but have one question.  Since HGVC is affiliated with RCI is it worth considering one of the few Wyndham resorts that trade with Interval International?  It seems that it would afford me the most flexibility given my current HGVC timeshare and RCI affiliation.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 17, 2009)

timeos2 said:


> Great job. Good amount of points. You got a real bargain. Now learn the ropes to maximize your use and enjoy.



Thanks, I'm pleased with the deal. Can't do much better than that. 

Been reading everything I can on how to maximize my points. Seems like that amount (231k) should be more than sufficient if I use them wisely. 

Thanks for everyone's help!!!


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## GadgetRick (Apr 17, 2009)

One quick question, the seller told me expect this to take 12-16 weeks to go through. Not a huge problem. He explained Wyndham is very slow in switching over the contracts these days and this is what causes most of the delay. Is there anything I can do to help move this along? We'd love to see if we can use the points this summer on a last minute jaunt but this will be cutting it close. 

Again, not a huge problem as we're going away either way but I may as well try to enjoy the points as soon as I can.


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## refumpcpa (Apr 17, 2009)

*Really Depends on your needs*



bornreddy said:


> I am new to the Wyndham forum as I own HGVC.  However, I am considering Wyndham for many of the reasons stated above but have one question.  Since HGVC is affiliated with RCI is it worth considering one of the few Wyndham resorts that trade with Interval International?  It seems that it would afford me the most flexibility given my current HGVC timeshare and RCI affiliation.



Wyndham pays your membership fee to either RCI or II as part of your maintenance fee.  The exchange company that they will pay for depends upon which Wyndham resort you purchased first.  If HGVC does the same thing, it would make sense to get an II affiliated Wyndham so that you can see for yourself which company works better for you.  Fair warning, if you want an II membership through Wyndham you have to be persistent when you become an owner.  They try to default everyone into RCI.  But, if you make enough noise, they will give you the II membership.

There are people on both sides of the RCI/II fence on this board.  I happen to like the option that II gives in that you can search for what you want to trade for prior to depositing your week.  I never understood depositing my week first and hoping I get what I want.  You don't walk into a store, pay first and then hope the store has what you want to buy.  But that's just me.


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## timeos2 (Apr 17, 2009)

*II isn't good but 2 RCI memberships are worthless so go II*



refumpcpa said:


> There are people on both sides of the RCI/II fence on this board.  I happen to like the option that II gives in that you can search for what you want to trade for prior to depositing your week.  I never understood depositing my week first and hoping I get what I want.  You don't walk into a store, pay first and then hope the store has what you want to buy.  But that's just me.



One of the big advantages to having RCI through Wyndham is the ability to "request first" just like II has.  It can only be done with Wyndham deposits but its a good feature.  If the Hilton already is a full RCI membership, with or without request first, then I would reluctantly agree that it makes more sense to get Wyndham to pay for II as it comes out of your annual fee no matter which you choose. Do remember that only the few Wyndham resorts affiliated with II have that option - you cannot request II membership for an ownership at an RCI Wyndham resort (all but 4-6 of them are exclusively RCI).  Too bad Wyndham won't pay fr RCI Points membership as that would be a much better value than II.


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## linsj (Apr 17, 2009)

Hilton owners don't have direct access to RCI. We have to go through a Hilton CS rep; and, by default, they only look for gold crown resorts. I've heard you can get others, but it's a struggle to do so.


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## timeos2 (Apr 17, 2009)

*Things change. The Hilton is a limited type*



linsj said:


> Hilton owners don't have direct access to RCI. We have to go through a Hilton CS rep; and, by default, they only look for gold crown resorts. I've heard you can get others, but it's a struggle to do so.



Ah, so the plot thickens.  If the buyer has other resorts to get into RCI and/or wants access to RCI from Wyndham then going with the prepay for RCI does make sense. Since having Wyndham pay for II would limit your potential trades to the II pool vs the full RCI pool is you choose that my recommendation changes from II to RCI.  The very limited Hilton Corporate RCI link is virtually worthless (except for trading the Hilton time of course) so you are really NOT duplicating a full membership with RCI from Wyndham.  The choices from II are bad enough and adding the extremely limited (and reluctant) participation from Wyndham choosing II makes no sense.  Take the full RCI membership.


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## sevenvii (Apr 17, 2009)

Wolf creek is amazing ski/snowboard place.  I live in Colorado and Wolf Creek and other smaller resorts like it are the best way to enjoy our awesome sking.  Not to mention Wolf Creek usually boasts the best snow depth, and huge powder days compared to any of the fancy Vail resorts on the I 70 corridor.  I too am looking at making Pagosa my first Wyndham vacation, and one reason is to have an alternative ski spot to my local resorts here, Wolf Creek is that great of a place 

I had some free passes to Angel Fire, NM (also in wyndham system), but havent made it down there.  They wont get near the snow, but it might be another decent spot to make a quick get away for a boarding trip.


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## GadgetRick (Apr 17, 2009)

sevenvii said:


> Wolf creek is amazing ski/snowboard place.  I live in Colorado and Wolf Creek and other smaller resorts like it are the best way to enjoy our awesome sking.  Not to mention Wolf Creek usually boasts the best snow depth, and huge powder days compared to any of the fancy Vail resorts on the I 70 corridor.  I too am looking at making Pagosa my first Wyndham vacation, and one reason is to have an alternative ski spot to my local resorts here, Wolf Creek is that great of a place
> 
> I had some free passes to Angel Fire, NM (also in wyndham system), but havent made it down there.  They wont get near the snow, but it might be another decent spot to make a quick get away for a boarding trip.



Was researching Wolf Creek and I will certainly take advantage of it at least once. I LOVE locals places like that. So much less crowded.


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## janej (Apr 17, 2009)

sevenvii said:


> Wolf creek is amazing ski/snowboard place.  I live in Colorado and Wolf Creek and other smaller resorts like it are the best way to enjoy our awesome sking.  Not to mention Wolf Creek usually boasts the best snow depth, and huge powder days compared to any of the fancy Vail resorts on the I 70 corridor.  I too am looking at making Pagosa my first Wyndham vacation, and one reason is to have an alternative ski spot to my local resorts here, Wolf Creek is that great of a place



How far is Wolf Creek from Pagosa Springs?  We went to Vail for the first time this January and loved it.  I already booked Breckenridge for next January.  But I am always on the look out for different places.


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## sevenvii (Apr 17, 2009)

> How far is Wolf Creek from Pagosa Springs? We went to Vail for the first time this January and loved it. I already booked Breckenridge for next January. But I am always on the look out for different places.



Its about 30 minutes or so from Pagosa.  I admit, Vail and the other big ones do offer some fun, and they definitely offer a lot of nice amenities.  For me though, they are just too packed and a whole different kind of atmosphere, thats good in very small doses .


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## YeongWoo (Apr 17, 2009)

*Wyndham does seem to drag out deed transfers*

I think the 12-16 weeks is about right.  It took 3 months last fall from the time I sent payment till I was able to log onto my new Wyndham account.  Everything went as planned from what I could tell and the closing was done by a company that handles a lot of resales.  I don't think anything could have sped up the process.  I was able to book a last minute deal right away though so maybe you can catch a late summer deal.

Quote GadgetRick:

One quick question, the seller told me expect this to take 12-16 weeks to go through. Not a huge problem. He explained Wyndham is very slow in switching over the contracts these days and this is what causes most of the delay. Is there anything I can do to help move this along? We'd love to see if we can use the points this summer on a last minute jaunt but this will be cutting it close.


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## Lisa P (Apr 17, 2009)

bornreddy said:


> Since HGVC is affiliated with RCI is it worth considering one of the few Wyndham resorts that trade with Interval International?


A few benefits you'll get with your Wyndham-paid exchange company membership, which may affect your choice of an RCI vs. II -affiliated home resort for your first Wyndham contract:

1.  Trading power.

II seems to give better trade power to Wyndham deposits, probably because the few Wyn resorts which trade via II are all strong traders, even in lesser seasons.

RCI gets more of the quiet Wyndham resorts' deposits and deposits from offseason, affecting the generic trade power negatively.  So trading through RCI is better when you're trying to trade into average difficulty rather than tough trades.  This may be fine for you, since your HGVC already gets those tough trades.

2.  Trading up in unit size or season.

II members report some success but doing ongoing searches requires like-for-like, so you spend a lot of Wyndham points on those.

RCI makes it pretty easy to trade up, allowing a trade power boost when trading into the dozens of sister Wyn properties.  It's also easier to trade up in RCI because you may request "any size unit that sleeps 6" on the phone, even when using a studio deposit to make the search request.  This is GOOD and encourages me to use my Wyndham points in RCI as a point-stretcher, even in relative off-season.

3.  Resort locations.

Choosing between the two may be more affected by where YOU want to travel most frequently and what resort options you'd have there.  We got our II fixed-week traders, specifically to access DVC and Marriott properties.  Since DVC switched, they're mostly just for the Marriotts in sub-prime red time - fall and spring travel.  Wyndham would work well for this too, in II.  Wyndham does not trade into DVC in RCI though your HGVC does.  We still do more trading through RCI overall, especially into the Wyndhams and HGVCs... and independent resorts.

4.  Exchange fees and policies.

II has lower fees.  II has a much better ongoing "search first" option.  While RCI does have a search first capability for Wyndham owners, it's very odd and time-consuming, not currently doable online, and turns into a deposit if you don't cancel within a limited time period - so it's only useful for getting your points back IF you just want to have a "look" to see how few points you can get away with trading for a particular, available exchange.  It's not for use with an ongoing search, really.

RCI allows more flexibility in placing a one-day "hold" on a week, then confirming but being allowed to cancel within _another_ 24 hours - a bit more time to settle on a trade and find airfares.  Also, while many people here have posted the opposite, we've had better customer service at RCI than at II.  This may be due to the quality of customer service at the Wyndham phone line for RCI.  But both II and RCI can be inconsistent.

5.  Website.

II allows Wyndham owners to search online now.  Its search feature is glitchy, sometimes returning no results when you KNOW there are resorts and you have to start all over to see them.  I've been shown resorts many times but then sometimes, when I've tried to see "more dates," it shows no availability and I have to start over.  When it shows results of a search, it doesn't show the full range of dates for each resort at first glance either, so you much check "more dates" with every resort individually.   II is also harder to search broadly within limits you select, like all in "Florida" or all "Marriott" resorts - it requires you to select a specific city or resort name or go through a lengthy "select from map" process.  For my kind of searching, it's poor.

RCI has a much, much better website, a lot more fun once you get used to it and it has a better keyword search feature, even if it sometimes includes too much.  I like that it allows you to repeatedly narrow a broad search by a variety of limitations, like "min unit size 1BR" or "full kitchen only" or "awarded properties."

But we're still waiting for online searching with generic Wyndham points deposits at RCI.  So this great capability isn't there yet for Wyndham points trading.  Month ago, Wyndham announced online searching capability to begin during this past March but it's been delayed... again.  For someone who's thinking of purchasing, and who'll have to wait a few months to get into the system anyway and who plans to use it for years to come (so looking at the long term), I don't think this issue should be a detriment to choosing RCI because I do believe they're going to start sooner or later, and possibly sooner since it's actually in the works.  HTH.


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## Redrosesix (Apr 17, 2009)

timeos2 said:


> Wyndham points are dirt cheap to buy, offer extreme versatility and choice of internal as well as external resorts, gets you a free membership to RCI and much more. You are already familiar with points so your learning curve to maximize value would be shorter than most.
> 
> IMO Wyndham resale points offer one of the truly great bargains in all of timeshare right now.  Look for 220,000 - 300,000 total points ad you'll be able to do almost anything, anytime using your points.  Inexpensive to purchase and fees are reasonable for the value of the resorts/trades obtained. We have really enjoyed our Wyndham ownership for over a decade and it seems to just get better as they add more great resorts and locations. Except for the customer service (which you only deal with at sales time) and the need to avoid the sales weasels at some of the resorts it is a painless ownership when purchased resale.  NEVER buy Wyndham retail.



Not sure how I got to this point in my research, but we're actually considering Cypress Pointe now.

Like I want to figure out how a whole other points system works.


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## Lisa P (Apr 17, 2009)

GadgetRick said:


> One quick question, the seller told me expect this to take 12-16 weeks to go through. ...... Is there anything I can do to help move this along? We'd love to see if we can use the points this summer on a last minute jaunt but this will be cutting it close.


You can keep in touch with the seller in a week or so to make sure that the deed was sent to the county where the resort is located.  Then call the county to see if it's been recorded.  Once it has, follow-up with the seller to make sure that your home resort or Wyndham has been sent a copy (ask for the date on which it was mailed).  After that, call Wyndham Owner Services every week or so and ask for the status of the transfer and your new owner number so you can set up your online access at Wyndham and give them your RCI number, if you already have one, so they'll pay the annual membership on your RCI account.  If you don't already have an RCI membership through another timeshare, it may take a few extra weeks for Wyndham to set one up for you.  But once you have your Wyndham owner number, you're set to use your points.

Now, just FYI, using your points last minute for a summer jaunt will be VERY difficult.  The resorts are pretty much all booked up for summertime and you'll be hunting for that elusive cancellation.  Wish you well!!!


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## GadgetRick (Apr 17, 2009)

YeongWoo said:


> I think the 12-16 weeks is about right.  It took 3 months last fall from the time I sent payment till I was able to log onto my new Wyndham account.  Everything went as planned from what I could tell and the closing was done by a company that handles a lot of resales.  I don't think anything could have sped up the process.  I was able to book a last minute deal right away though so maybe you can catch a late summer deal.



Good to know that's a realistic number either way. I think we may have a better chance of getting luck at the last minute from everything I've read online.


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## Lisa P (Apr 17, 2009)

Redrosesix, if you'll use your time at a Cypress Point home resort, consider getting a specific week you'd like there.  They're pretty readily available for cheap!  If you want to learn more about their points program, start your research in another Points forum - there are several knowledgeable points owners from Sunterra / DRI around here but relatively fewer will see you here the Wyndham system forum than on the other forums.


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## bnoble (Apr 17, 2009)

You'll want to ask the Sunterra/DRI people, but my impression is that a lot of Cypress Pointe owners never converted.  The other weeks are all floats just at CP, either "emerald time" or "diamond time"---emerald only floats in offseason weeks, you definitely want to own diamond, even if you can travel offseason now.

If the prime season owners didn't convert in appreciable numbers, you may have an issue in booking time from DRI.


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## Redrosesix (Apr 17, 2009)

Lisa P said:


> Redrosesix, if you'll use your time at a Cypress Point home resort, consider getting a specific week you'd like there.  They're pretty readily available for cheap!  If you want to learn more about their points program, start your research in another Points forum - there are several knowledgeable points owners from Sunterra / DRI around here but relatively fewer will see you here the Wyndham system forum than on the other forums.





bnoble said:


> You'll want to ask the Sunterra/DRI people, but my impression is that a lot of Cypress Pointe owners never converted.  The other weeks are all floats just at CP, either "emerald time" or "diamond time"---emerald only floats in offseason weeks, you definitely want to own diamond, even if you can travel offseason now.
> 
> If the prime season owners didn't convert in appreciable numbers, you may have an issue in booking time from DRI.



See, I've learned something already -- I thought Cypress Pointe was Wyndham.


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## Mike&Nancy (Apr 17, 2009)

GadgetRick
I live 80 miles East of Pagosa Springs & own there as well. The most popular week at Wyndham Pagosa I'm told is the week between Christmas & New Years. I've never had trouble getting a room at Pagosa & I use it like a weekend retreat, staying several long weekends a year. Wolf Creek Ski area currentle has approx 450 inches this year to date, Probably got 18 to 24 inches today. They had a base of 120" packed powder this morning. Lift ticket $31. WWW.wolfcreekski.com watch the webcam

Mike


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## GadgetRick (Apr 17, 2009)

Mike&Nancy said:


> GadgetRick
> I live 80 miles East of Pagosa Springs & own there as well. The most popular week at Wyndham Pagosa I'm told is the week between Christmas & New Years. I've never had trouble getting a room at Pagosa & I use it like a weekend retreat, staying several long weekends a year. Wolf Creek Ski area currentle has approx 450 inches this year to date, Probably got 18 to 24 inches today. They had a base of 120" packed powder this morning. Lift ticket $31. WWW.wolfcreekski.com watch the webcam
> 
> Mike



Awesome. Sounds like I'll be extremely happy.  Might hit you up for some more questions regarding PS.

Thanks.


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## bnoble (Apr 17, 2009)

> I thought Cypress Pointe was Wyndham.


Cypress *Palms* is a Wyndham resort.

Cypress Pointe (and CP Grand Villas) are Diamond resorts.

And, then there is Windsor Palms, formerly known as Wyndham Palms, which is a whole-ownership townhome/pool home development.


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## bornreddy (Apr 18, 2009)

Lisa P said:


> A few benefits you'll get with your Wyndham-paid exchange company membership, which may affect your choice of an RCI vs. II -affiliated home resort for your first Wyndham contract:
> 
> 1.  Trading power.
> 
> ...




Thanks for all this great information.  It sounds like there are pluses and minuses to both RCI and II.  Botome line is that I should be able to get some great vacations through Wyndham and/or either exchange company.
:whoopie:


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## GadgetRick (Apr 18, 2009)

Lisa P said:


> You can keep in touch with the seller in a week or so to make sure that the deed was sent to the county where the resort is located.  Then call the county to see if it's been recorded.  Once it has, follow-up with the seller to make sure that your home resort or Wyndham has been sent a copy (ask for the date on which it was mailed).  After that, call Wyndham Owner Services every week or so and ask for the status of the transfer and your new owner number so you can set up your online access at Wyndham and give them your RCI number, if you already have one, so they'll pay the annual membership on your RCI account.  If you don't already have an RCI membership through another timeshare, it may take a few extra weeks for Wyndham to set one up for you.  But once you have your Wyndham owner number, you're set to use your points.
> 
> Now, just FYI, using your points last minute for a summer jaunt will be VERY difficult.  The resorts are pretty much all booked up for summertime and you'll be hunting for that elusive cancellation.  Wish you well!!!


I'll try and stay on top of them. I don't (currently) have an RCI number so that'll add to the time. No biggie.

I also know trips during the summer will be harder. We're flexible in our plans and it'll be last minute. If we get lucky, great, if not, no big deal. We'll still do something, maybe rent or something.


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## Culli (Apr 22, 2009)

GadgetRick said:


> I'll try and stay on top of them. I don't (currently) have an RCI number so that'll add to the time. No biggie.
> 
> I also know trips during the summer will be harder. We're flexible in our plans and it'll be last minute. If we get lucky, great, if not, no big deal. We'll still do something, maybe rent or something.



You might have to call them when your Wyndham account is set up and make sure you have an RCI account.  They don't necessarily set the RCI account up right away or even if you asked.  I wanted an RCI account and called Wyndham they said yup here is your number.  I dind't need to use it for awhile so a few months later I called RCI and the RCI account was actually the previous owner.  I got the number on this forum from an experience person Jya-Ning and got it straight here is the thread, hope it saves you some time:

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=83044


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