# Looking to purchase Atlantis-Harborside



## bjs525 (Jul 6, 2012)

We recently came back from a stay at Atlantis. Went to a time share presenation for Harborside on 6/27/12. Was given a price which being new at this i thought was high.When we got back i called Harborside in Florida and prices given to me were around  35% higher. Not sure why. Looking to purchase a two bedroom with no week restrictions. Any help would appreciated.
Thank You,


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## DeniseM (Jul 6, 2012)

Hi and Welcome to TUG!

All timeshare at Harborside have week restrictions - so you need to buy the exact season or week when you want to travel, because it is very difficult to change your reservation to a different week.

You can save 50% or more, by buying on the resale market - there is little or no reason to spend more than twice as much by buying from the developer.

I recommend that you start your research with the Starwood FAQ and then let us know what questions you have:  http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63224

One more point - Please be aware that you cannot rely on the info. the sale people gave you - they will tell you whatever it takes to make a sale.


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## Karen G (Jul 6, 2012)

Check eBay.  Here aresome completed auctions that show what they sold for. If the number is in green it means it sold; if in red, it didn't.


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## Pmuppet (Jul 6, 2012)

Karen G said:


> Check eBay.  Here aresome completed auctions that show what they sold for. If the number is in green it means it sold; if in red, it didn't.



Not that i would recommend spending $28k on a timeshare, but i am willing to bet this is a much better deal than what you were offered during your presentation.  A three bedroom during prime weeks.

I imagine the market price is much lower (especially considering the annual MF). But you know the absolute most a 3 bedroom prime goes for is less than $28k as no body bought it.

If you are truly serious about buying a timeshare, sign up for terapeak which will give you historical prices on what these timeshares have sold for.  I believe the common ebay historicals only go back 90 days.  This app goes back much further and is worth its weight in gold when buying expensive items on ebay.

I used it to reasearch prices on the ebay TS i bought and i was glad i did.  I cancelled the membership after i made my purchase, but will restore my membership if i buy other expensive items via ebay.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/3BR-LOCKOFF...51084195515?pt=Timeshares&hash=item3a75c8c6bb


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## zcrider (Jul 6, 2012)

Just go to redweek.com there are tons of them for sale.  A guy named Russell Kanner " the timeshare king" sells Harborside almost exclusively and uses Daved H. From Tug for the closing, he has the best price.


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## RichardL (Jul 6, 2012)

*Why Pay $2,800 for Maintenance Fees??*

I own several Westin's and I trade into Harborside using Star Options at a much lower maintenance fee than $2,800.  Harborside is much easier to trade to for example than St. John.  I would rather pay $1500 at Kierland and do a trade.

I really don't like those high maintenance fees.


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## RichardL (Jul 6, 2012)

*Why Pay $2,800 for Maintenance Fees??*

I own several Westin's and I trade into Harborside using Star Options at a much lower maintenance fee than $2,800.  Harborside is much easier to trade to for example than St. John.  I would rather pay $1500 at Kierland and do a trade.

I really don't like those high maintenance fees.


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## yumdrey (Jul 7, 2012)

RichardL said:


> I own several Westin's and I trade into Harborside using Star Options at a much lower maintenance fee than $2,800.  Harborside is much easier to trade to for example than St. John.  I would rather pay $1500 at Kierland and do a trade.
> 
> I really don't like those high maintenance fees.



That's what I tried to do for several years with my platinum westin kierland week.
To be honest, getting week 25 through week 32 at Harborside was almost impossible at 8 months out, especially for larger than 1BR deluxe.
That's why I bought two Harborside weeks, one week to use during spring break and the other to use during summer break.

Always best deals are coming from ebay, but most ebay sellers use their in-house closing co. and they don't know how to close Bahamian deeds properly.
If you hire a good closing co., you can save time and money.
When I bought my weeks through ebay, I insisted to use an independent closing co (DaveH is a TUG member) and sellers agreed and closing was a breeze.


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## tomandrobin (Jul 7, 2012)

RichardL said:


> I own several Westin's and I trade into Harborside using Star Options at a much lower maintenance fee than $2,800.  Harborside is much easier to trade to for example than St. John.  I would rather pay $1500 at Kierland and do a trade.
> 
> I really don't like those high maintenance fees.



Two reasons.....Trading into HRA is not as easy as you make it sound. We trade into HRA often too, but there are weeks where there is no availability. Also, we are planners and travel with a larger group. The further out we can book our airfare, the cheaper it is. So when traveling with 8 people, $100 per ticket is $800 total.....negates the MF savings.


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## mariawolf (Jul 7, 2012)

At some point I got prices from timeshare king--I think that was it--he had a lot listed and most around the same as e bay prices as I recall.
On a side note just got a check from Family fun at Harborside at Atlantis--formerly known as Atlantisfamily fun--and netted  $3k for my small one bedroom week 52--will pay the fees for my two bedroom (hopefully unless fees goes up again) with a little change left over.
Have used them successfully many times.


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## sail27bill (Jul 7, 2012)

mariawolf said:


> At some point I got prices from timeshare king--I think that was it--he had a lot listed and most around the same as e bay prices as I recall.
> On a side note just got a check from Family fun at Harborside at Atlantis--formerly known as Atlantisfamily fun--and netted  $3k for my small one bedroom week 52--will pay the fees for my two bedroom (hopefully unless fees goes up again) with a little change left over.
> Have used them successfully many times.



Maria--We are considering using them to rent out our unit for next year.  Is it possible to let me know how the process works?  Feel free to PM me if you don't want to post the details.

Thanks in advance.
Anita


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## Docklander (Jul 7, 2012)

+1 for the Timeshare King. I used Russell for my Harborside purchases before he set up his own business and I was very happy with the service I received. 

As someone pointed out up thread, it's important to use a closing company that knows what it's doing re. Bahamian timeshares as the process is different to the one here in the US. The process is also considerably more expensive than for a closing in the US (more so if the closing company doesn't know what it's doing).


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## mariawolf (Jul 7, 2012)

just looked he had two bedroom two bath floats for under $7K for sale
thetimeshareking.com
haven't used him but his prices are way better than at the resort.
Just make sure if you want a summer month to buy then==my brother bought a week 48 and was told he could trade easily for summer since it is the same season as week 48--not true!


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## csudell (Jul 7, 2012)

sail27bill - family fun at Harborside is great to deal with.  Maria has easy weeks to rent though.  I have dealt with them in the past and there is nothing bad to say about them at all.  they have their prices that they set - you can check the website.  you get 75% of the rental price.  they will drop the rental price as time gets closer to the rental date to try to rent it.  the economy has affected them as much as anyone else.  Their prices are higher for rentals that a tugger would pay - but that's because tuggers are more knowledgeable and know where to look.  they have a lot of success renting.

Russell Kanner is a great agent for buying and selling.  He, along with Dave Heine make the process a breeze.  I finally got my deed from my 12/2010 purchase in January 2012.  the Bahams registered the deed on 10/26/11.  If it werent for Russell and Dave, I would have been a nervous worry wart.


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## mariawolf (Jul 8, 2012)

My week 52 is always easy to rent--but they have also rented my week 1, 2 bedroom lockoff which is not the easiest time to rent right after the holidays== --the key is to rent it as early as possible because they rent them in the order they are listed.


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## alf26 (Jul 10, 2012)

*2 bedroom for sale*

[Buying/selling/renting are strictly prohibited in the TUG discussion forums. - DeniseM Moderator]


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## jarta (Jul 10, 2012)

Becoming a public sale thread?   Salty


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## alf26 (Jul 10, 2012)

*closing agent*



yumdrey said:


> That's what I tried to do for several years with my platinum westin kierland week.
> To be honest, getting week 25 through week 32 at Harborside was almost impossible at 8 months out, especially for larger than 1BR deluxe.
> That's why I bought two Harborside weeks, one week to use during spring break and the other to use during summer break.
> 
> ...



Would appreciate if you could advise name and number of closing agent, and cost including Bahamian firm.  How longer ago did you close. Thanks alf26


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## bjs525 (Jul 10, 2012)

We usually are available to travel last week of June and thanksgiven week. How would it work if we purchased second week in august.


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## bjs525 (Jul 10, 2012)

*Thank you for your responses*

I made some calls to a few real estate agents and request on line.  I can understand sale prices vary based on what they paid for them Why is there such a difference on maintenence fees.  tks


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## jarta (Jul 10, 2012)

bjs525 said:


> I made some calls to a few real estate agents and request on line.  I can understand sale prices vary based on what they paid for them Why is there such a difference on maintenence fees.  tks



Assessments change over time.  If the listing is old, the MF may be understated.  The current assessments for Harborside are posted in the TUG Starwood sticky about 2012 maintenance fees located (red lead-in) at the top of the Starwood Forum home page.

Also, on eBay anything goes.  Be careful!  Ask for a copy of an official Starwood "estoppel letter" (or whatever it is called) about ownership per the resort records, size of unit, use period, amount and status of fees and fixed or float week.  Get it and read it before sending any money to the seller's agent.

Closings at Harborside cost more than most places because the papers are supposed to be drafted (or reviewed) and filed by an attorney.  Closings have been reported to take up to a year.  Title insurance is a must, IMO.  And, the levels of administration can make the process expensive (up to $2K depending on who you end up using) and frustrating.

During the closing period, make sure the seller makes a 12 month out home resort reservation you are happy with for the 1st year of use.  By the time you become an official owner, there may be nothing available when you want to go.

And, do not buy a timeshare you cannot use and/or afford to use.   Salty


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## alf26 (Jul 10, 2012)

*August timeshare*



bjs525 said:


> We usually are available to travel last week of June and thanksgiven week. How would it work if we purchased second week in august.



You can request different time periods about 8 months in advance.  I only did that once and it was fine.  I'm sure if you are requesting change to a busy period , it can b diffficult to make change.  alf26


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## DeniseM (Jul 10, 2012)

bjs525 said:


> We usually are available to travel last week of June and thanksgiven week. How would it work if we purchased second week in august.



It wouldn't work - it is very difficult to reserve a different week than the one you own.  If you change to a different season - then you lose your owner's priority and there is no reason to even buy at the resort.

You need to buy the week/season when you want to travel - June and Thanksgiving are different seasons.



> You can request different time periods about 8 months in advance.



If you try to reserve a different week at the 8 month mark - you are making a Staroption exchange - which you can attempt to do with any Starwood timeshare, so there is no advantage to paying the high prices to buy at Harborside.


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## bdogma (Jul 10, 2012)

*Harborside question*

This is a little off-topic but does anyone know why the closing/transfer costs at HRA are so much higher than other Bahamian resorts that are also located  on Paradise Island? Thanks in advance.


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## jarta (Jul 10, 2012)

bdogma said:


> This is a little off-topic but does anyone know why the closing/transfer costs at HRA are so much higher than other Bahamian resorts that are also located  on Paradise Island? Thanks in advance.



Didn't know they were.  Which resort and what closing fee amount are you talking about?

Something like Club Land'Or is not a fee ownership.  It is RTU for a set number of years.  Many timeshares outside the US are RTU for a number of years - and then they expire.  

Harborside is fee simple ownership.  If the fee is transferred, a title search has to be done.  Not so with a RTU for years.   Salty


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## Dave H (Jul 10, 2012)

bdogma said:


> This is a little off-topic but does anyone know why the closing/transfer costs at HRA are so much higher than other Bahamian resorts that are also located  on Paradise Island? Thanks in advance.



Because HRA is one of the only "Deeded" resorts in the Bahamas.  Teh others are right to use or membership based.  As a deeded resort, it has to follow all the laws and customs of a real property and that forces the use of an attorney who is very well paid in the Bahamas.  

Dave


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## bjs525 (Jul 11, 2012)

When i spoke to Harborside directly they told me if i purchase phase 2 i can go any week. There would be no restrictions.That doesn't sound like what i have beed reading.  tks


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## jerseygirl (Jul 11, 2012)

If you purchase a phase two week, you can book any week in your season.  The last week of June is in the same season as Thanksgiving when Thanksgiving falls during week 47.  But, sometimes Thanksgiving falls during week 46 - and that's a different season.  If those are the only two weeks that work for you, you'd just need to check the dates carefully and plan accordingly.

The week on your deed is insignificant if phase two - but very important if phase one.  Usually, when someone mentions a specific week, the assumption is that they're talking about phase one.


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## bdogma (Jul 11, 2012)

Jarta,

The eBay ad I saw (below) is misleading to begin with because Cable Beach is not on Paradise Island as described. But the closing fee on this "deeded" property is $499.00 plus a resort transfer fee of $100.00. Maybe it's really not deeded although it "never expires" and clear title is guaranteed.

This is a 3 br at Blue Water Resorts at Guanahani Village. Maybe Paradise Island has different rules? Not interested in buying just very curious because the transfer fees for HRA are so high.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/360471243591?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649

Would love to hear your feedback. Thanks!


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## jarta (Jul 11, 2012)

bjs525 said:


> When i spoke to Harborside directly they told me if i purchase phase 2 i can go any week. There would be no restrictions.That doesn't sound like what i have beed reading.  tks



Phase II is almost all float weeks for 1 of 3 seasons.

With a Harborside float week, you can reserve any available week in your home resort season by calling 12-8 months from check-in.  Usually, no problem with availability in the Harborside SVN rental pool (except weeks 51 & 52 and 7 where fixed weeks were sold off for up to 50% of the units and many may have also been retained by Starwood and not be in the rental pool).  You compete with every other Harborsfide owner of your size unit in your season.

You can also call at 8 months from check-in and, SUBJECT TO AVAILABILITY and having sufficient unused StarOptions, can reserve any week at Harborside - or at any other SVO timeshare resort.  You compete with every other owner at an SVO resort that has StarOptions.   Salty


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## DeniseM (Jul 11, 2012)

bjs525 said:


> When i spoke to Harborside directly they told me if i purchase phase 2 i can go any week. There would be no restrictions.That doesn't sound like what i have beed reading.  tks



Here is the simple truth - sales will tell you whatever you want to hear to make the sale.  You really cannot rely on the info. you get from them.

There are 2 major restrictions:

1)  Depending on the phase, you will either have a deeded week, or deeded season in which you can make an owner's reservation - not just any week.

2)  There is far more demand, than supply at this resort.  If you try to make a Staroption exchange outside your season, you are competing with all other owners in the Starwood system, and you have no advantage as an owner at Harborside.


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## Dave H (Jul 11, 2012)

bdogma said:


> Jarta,
> 
> The eBay ad I saw (below) is misleading to begin with because Cable Beach is not on Paradise Island as described. But the closing fee on this "deeded" property is $499.00 plus a resort transfer fee of $100.00. Maybe it's really not deeded although it "never expires" and clear title is guaranteed.
> 
> ...



Bluewater which is now part of Bluegreen is a timeshare license that still has to be recorded.   Any recorded document in the Bahamas has to be signed off on by an attorney in the Bahamas.  If it is not done properly while it is recorded it does not effectively transfer the title.

The Bahamas is still old English way of doing things.  I would ask WHO the attorney in the Bahams is.   I can tell you, the attorneys are not that cheap.  

If they are not using one, then the deed is very defective.

Dave


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## yumdrey (Jul 15, 2012)

alf26 said:


> Would appreciate if you could advise name and number of closing agent, and cost including Bahamian firm.  How longer ago did you close. Thanks alf26



Dave H is a manager of that closing company and he already posted on this thread.
You can send him a PM or e-mail.
I am a very satisfied client.


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