# Platinum vs. Presidential Reserve



## boobosa (Feb 17, 2017)

Can someone please tell me the difference between platinum vs. PR?  Pros and cons?  Maintenance fees, perks in advancing to PR, is it worth it, etc?  Thank you.


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## lcml11 (Feb 17, 2017)

boobosa said:


> Can someone please tell me the difference between platinum vs. PR?  Pros and cons?  Maintenance fees, perks in advancing to PR, is it worth it, etc?  Thank you.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



http://www.nxtbook.com/nxtbooks/wyndham/memberdirectory_test/index.php?startid=377

http://www.nxtbook.com/nxtbooks/wyndham/plus_membersdirectory1415/#/362

If it is worth it is fundamentally a decision of the buyer.


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## wjappraise (Feb 17, 2017)

boobosa said:


> Can someone please tell me the difference between platinum vs. PR?  Pros and cons?  Maintenance fees, perks in advancing to PR, is it worth it, etc?



Both Platinum and PR require at least 1 million developer points purchase.  And both grant owner Platinum VIP status for discounts, etc. 

PR does cost more for MF with a surcharge added to the costs, about $.25 per 1,000 points.  PR allows owner to have 14 month ARP at the home resort, and 12 month ARP at other PR resorts inventory (must be PR inventory, cannot book non-PR inventory at 12 months).  Also, while you can achieve Platinum status with PIC units, you cannot achieve PR status with PIC.

Hope that helps.


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## Jan M. (Feb 17, 2017)

Presidential Reserve Exclusive benefits include:

*Guaranteed access*

Presidential Reserve Members receive guaranteed access to available Presidential Reserve Suites at CLUB WYNDHAM Presidential Reserve Resorts when you book during your Advance Reservation Priority (ARP) window, 14 to 12 months in advance of your check-in date at your “home” resort.
*Exclusive access*

Presidential Reserve Members receive exclusive access to available Presidential Reserve Suites from 12 to 10 months in advance of your check-in date at all Presidential Reserve Resorts.
*Privileged Reserve Period*

10 months to 30 days prior to your check-in date is the Privileged Reserve Period for Presidential Reserve Suites. Up to 75% of unreserved Presidential Reserve Suites will be held for CLUB WYNDHAM Presidential Reserve Members to access during this benefit period.
*On-site resort benefits*
While staying at a Presidential Reserve Resort, members enjoy:




*Presidential Arrival* – your presidential treatment continues upon your arrival at the resort. From dimmed lighting and soothing music to premium snacks and upgraded bath amenities, you will enjoy the privilege of relaxing in a plush Presidential Reserve Suite, complete with presidential upgrades.
*Special on-site amenities* – fee-based services exclusively available to CLUB WYNDHAM Presidential Reserve Members


*Housekeeping On-Demand* - we are pleased to offer Presidential Reserve Members two (2) options for daily housekeeping of their suite.
Option 1, the Spruce and Tidy, will provide a fresh set of towels, remove the refuse from the suite, and remake the beds with fresh bed linens. Service fees vary by resort and will be billed to your suite. Contact the resort directly for pricing.
Option 2 provides all of the services of the Spruce and Tidy above as well as the placing in or removing dishes from the dishwasher, cleaning the kitchen, and vacuuming the traffic areas. Service fees vary by resort and will be billed to your suite. Contact the resort directly for pricing.
Of course, Presidential Reserve Members will still receive their one Midweek “Clean and Tidy” cleaning during their full week stays. This mini cleaning includes a fresh set of towels and the removal of refuse from the suite.



*In-room personal chef* - If you would like to have a private chef prepare a meal in your suite for any occasion, Resort Management staff will be happy to coordinate. We ask that you please request this service at least 48 hours prior to when you would like the meal prepared. Resort Management will work with you and the chef to finalize all of your meal options and arrangements. The cost for this service, along with a service fee, will be billed to your suite. Once the staff obtains a chef, you will work directly with the chef to finalize all your meal details and other arrangements. Prices vary according to the nature of your request.


*Pre-stocked groceries* - upon request, we will be delighted to pre-stock your suite with groceries that you select from a pre-set list of items. We ask that you please place all orders at least 72 hours prior to your arrival. Changes to your order can be made up to 24 hours prior to your arrival. A service fee of $25 will be added to the cost of groceries and billed to your suite.
*Area services* - specific to each Presidential Reserve Resort location, enjoy special services that take advantage of opportunities in the local area to make every stay presidential class.

*Exclusive toll-free service number*

1-866-RESERVE (737-3783) is dedicated to CLUB WYNDHAM Presidential Reserve members.
As an eligible Presidential Reserve Member, you also have Platinum VIP status in CLUB WYNDHAM Plus.


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## ronparise (Feb 17, 2017)

also note that presidential reserve is a deeded ownership. Certain units are presidential reserve units and these are the units that would be noted on the deeds

it is possible to buy a presidential reserve contract on the secondary market and therefore possible to own presidential reserve but not be a VIP


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## asreiter (Feb 17, 2017)

it is possible to buy a presidential reserve contract on the secondary market and therefore possible to own presidential reserve but not be a VIP[/QUOTE]

I need to find one of these contracts!!


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## Jan M. (Feb 17, 2017)

Presidential Reserve units are a lot more points to book. If you are developer Gold or Platinum already it is typically another big chunk of money to go PR. Yes a percentage of PR inventory is held for PR owners but it isn't quite the rosy picture they paint in the sales presentations. It works great if you are booking further out but what they don't tell you is that often the bulk of what is available within the last couple of months is off season reservations at resorts that are very definitely seasonal. Want to go to the ski resorts out West in the summer or Myrtle Beach in the winter? You would be one of the few people who do. Without the VIP discount and free upgrade PR units are a lot more points to book and become very expensive when you calculate the maintenance fees on the points used. If you are able to go pretty last minute I find that many PR owners are renters and I can sometimes pick up their cancellations when it gets down to the 15 day cancellation window.

I'm trying to stay impartial on what I say about it because this is a choice that involves a lot of money and only you can decide what is right for you. You need to think about how much you will have to spend to go PR, look over the benefits in my previous post and think about what your usage will be of those PR units.

If anyone is considering buying PR on the secondary market and they don't already have the VIP status to be able to book non PR units to use to get the upgrade to the PR unit then be prepared to own and pay maintenance fees on a huge number of points. It would truly be much, much cheaper to rent stays in the PR units from owners. For example a 4 bedroom presidential at Bonnet Creek in Orlando is 424,000 points in one of the prime season weeks. The maintenance fees on that reservation would run you about $2100 and maybe more. You can easily rent for less than that.


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## lcml11 (Feb 17, 2017)

"I need to find one of these contracts!!"

Be careful on re-sale purchase.  If I read the following correctly, the benefits associated with the Presidential Reserves membership may not be available on a re-sale buy.  See page 380 of the Member's Directory.


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## ronparise (Feb 17, 2017)

The maintenance fees on presidential reserve units are not that much more than the regular points at the same resort. 

While certainly someone that wants presidential reserve is likely to be cost conscious , my guess is that they are more lily to be value shoppers. And some folks find value With a presidential reserve ownership. 

As Jan says perhaps over $2000 a week. In fact a 4 bedroom presidential at Bonnet Creek is 424000 points ($2500) that sounds high until you consider it sleeps 12. Or $200 a week per person.  Not too bad

My point is that what's too much to spend is different for each of us


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## uscav8r (Feb 17, 2017)

asreiter said:


> it is possible to buy a presidential reserve contract on the secondary market and therefore possible to own presidential reserve but not be a VIP
> 
> I need to find one of these contracts!!



There is one on eBay right now. 


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## lcml11 (Feb 17, 2017)

uscav8r said:


> There is one on eBay right now.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Before you buy, research, on line, Smuggler's Notch or any other resort you would buy at to make sure it is everything you would want it to be.


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## uscav8r (Feb 17, 2017)

lcml11 said:


> "I need to find one of these contracts!!"
> 
> Be careful on re-sale purchase.  If I read the following correctly, the benefits associated with the Presidential Reserves membership may not be available on a re-sale buy.  See page 380 of the Member's Directory.


Incorrect, or at least misleading. A resale PR buyer (not from an immediate relative) has ALL benefits of PR, with the exception of:
1) exchange privileges in the Registry Collection program (this is an external exchange program)
2) access to Registry Collection Concierge (a special vacation planner)
3) VIP benefits.

A resale PR owner still has the exclusive access rights and booking windows not afforded to non-PR owners.


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## BellaWyn (Feb 18, 2017)

uscav8r said:


> Incorrect, or at least misleading. A resale PR buyer (not from an immediate relative) has ALL benefits of PR, with the exception of:
> 1) exchange privileges in the Registry Collection program (this is an external exchange program)
> 2) access to Registry Collection Concierge (a special vacation planner)
> 3) VIP benefits.
> ...


Chris, in the current system, if you add an aftermarket PR contract to an existing VIP account, wouldn't those PR points function as VIP at the 10 month mark?

We don't know how that will change if they restrict how VIP functions if they ever roll out a new system however.


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## ronparise (Feb 18, 2017)

BellaWyn said:


> Chris, in the current system, if you add an aftermarket PR contract to an existing VIP account, wouldn't those PR points function as VIP at the 10 month mark?
> 
> We don't know how that will change if they restrict how VIP functions if they ever roll out a new system however.




Not Chris, but Ill jump in with a Yes, thats right. if you add resale  contract to an existing VIP account the VIP benefits will extend the new contract

and as you suggest that might change in the future.


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## raygo123 (Feb 18, 2017)

ronparise said:


> Not Chris, but Ill jump in with a Yes, thats right. if you add resale  contract to an existing VIP account the VIP benefits will extend the new contract
> 
> and as you suggest that might change in the future.


Are you talking about the ability to credit pool after the start of use year, 6 months or 9 months, or are their additional benefits to take advantage of during the use year?

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## ronparise (Feb 18, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> Are you talking about the ability to credit pool after the start of use year, 6 months or 9 months, or are their additional benefits to take advantage of during the use year?
> 
> Sent from my RCT6873W42 using Tapatalk


 discounts and upgrades,unlimited housekeeping and transactions, and you get to use included guest confirms for reservations made with the resale points


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## raygo123 (Feb 18, 2017)

ronparise said:


> discounts and upgrades,unlimited housekeeping and transactions, and you gey to use included guest confirms for reservations made with the resale points


That makes absolutely no sense.  Is that due to Wyndham's lack of ability to distinguish between direct buys and resale in  a VIP account?  Page 379 first paragraph, heir's don't neven get those benefits, of course unless they buy more.

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## uscav8r (Feb 18, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> That makes absolutely no sense.  Is that due to Wyndham's lack of ability to distinguish between direct buys and resale in  a VIP account?  Page 379 first paragraph, heir's don't neven get those benefits, of course unless they buy more.
> 
> Sent from my RCT6873W42 using Tapatalk



Heirs do not have to buy more points to maintain existing VIP benefits of a predecessor. However, VIP maybe lost if the decedent's account is split up such that the surviving accounts do not meet the VIP thresholds. 

BTW, I read that paragraph (last sentence).  There is absolutely nothing that says heirs must purchase more points. It distinctly says immediate relatives inherit all benefits. 

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## raygo123 (Feb 18, 2017)

uscav8r said:


> Heirs do not have to buy more points to maintain existing VIP benefits of a predecessor. However, VIP maybe lost if the decedent's account is split up such that the surviving accounts do not meet the VIP thresholds.
> 
> BTW, I read that paragraph (last sentence).  There is absolutely nothing that says heirs must purchase more points. It distinctly says immediate relatives inherit all benefits.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yes but they do not maintain pres. Reserve benefits. Heirs go to platinum.

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## rubbub (Feb 18, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> Yes but they do not maintain pres. Reserve benefits. Heirs go to platinum.



I do not believe this to be correct. Anyone buying or inheriting a PR contract is classified as a PR Member and will receive those benefits. However, unless they are an immediate relative of the previous owner they will not receive/inherit the following benefits: Exchange privileges in The Registry Collection program; Access to The Registry Collection Concierge; and VIP benefits.


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## rubbub (Feb 18, 2017)

uscav8r said:


> There is one on eBay right now.



I noticed the Smuggler's Notch contract I believe you are referring to is not 1m+ points. Is this because the PR threshold was lower when the contract was first purchased?

I assume a resale buyer (who is not already PR), would still receive PR benefits since the classification it is tied to the underlying deed/contract. I ask because the Members Directory does state 1m points must be owned. Would 'grandfathered' PR status transfer with the deed/contract to the buyer?


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## ronparise (Feb 18, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> That makes absolutely no sense.  Is that due to Wyndham's lack of ability to distinguish between direct buys and resale in  a VIP account?  Page 379 first paragraph, heir's don't neven get those benefits, of course unless they buy more.
> 
> Sent from my RCT6873W42 using Tapatalk


 
Perhaps not but it's how I made my money. 126000 points bought directly from Wyndham let me take advantage of  a loophole to make two platinum accounts.  Then I added 30 million resale points and every bit of it got the VIP discount, unlimited housekeeping, unlimited transactions and a total of 60 guest confirms


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## uscav8r (Feb 18, 2017)

rubbub said:


> I noticed the Smuggler's Notch contract I believe you are referring to is not 1m+ points. Is this because the PR threshold was lower when the contract was first purchased?
> 
> I assume a resale buyer (who is not already PR), would still receive PR benefits since the classification it is tied to the underlying deed/contract. I ask because the Members Directory does state 1m points must be owned. Would 'grandfathered' PR status transfer with the deed/contract to the buyer?



The contract itself is PR, there is no grandfathering. You get the exclusive PR access at home of 12-14 months, and exclusive system-wide PR access at 10-11 months. You also retain the access to 75% of PR units during SRP. 

All you miss out on is the Platinum VIP benefits (hence the 1M threshold, but this does not convey on resale anyway), such as the Reciprocal ARP in the 10-11 month window.


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## ronparise (Feb 18, 2017)

rubbub said:


> I noticed the Smuggler's Notch contract I believe you are referring to is not 1m+ points. Is this because the PR threshold was lower when the contract was first purchased?
> 
> I assume a resale buyer (who is not already PR), would still receive PR benefits since the classification it is tied to the underlying deed/contract. I ask because the Members Directory does state 1m points must be owned. Would 'grandfathered' PR status transfer with the deed/contract to the buyer?



1 million + has been the number for Platinum since Ive been involved

heres one explanation: for the odd mumber of points. This resort is a weeks resort that wyndham just recently becam involved with. and I believe the original developer sold the weeks two at a time, One in ski season and one not. This owner may have owned  multiple 2 week packages and been convinced by a slick wyndham salesman to convert them to points.  So this may be one deed out of several they owned. For all we know, they may still be platinum and presidential reserve by virtue of the deeds they arent selling


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## BellaWyn (Feb 19, 2017)

ronparise said:


> Not Chris, but Ill jump in.....


The question got answered regardess so thank you.


ronparise said:


> 1 million + has been the number for Platinum since Ive been involved
> 
> Heres one explanation: for the odd mumber of points. This resort is a weeks resort that wyndham just recently becam involved with. and I believe the original developer sold the weeks two at a time, One in ski season and one not. This owner may have owned  multiple 2 week packages and been convinced by a slick wyndham salesman to convert them to points.  So this may be one deed out of several they owned. For all we know, they may still be platinum and presidential reserve by virtue of the deeds they arent selling


Smuggs is PR location which means somehow Wyn was able to take existing Smuggs inventory and "designate" specific unitis as "PR Inventory" and then sell a contact that includes points associated specifically with that designated inventory.  In a PR contact it actually identifies the PR unit numbers, up to the point equivalency, of the number of points sold..

The owner selling the currently listed 654K eBay contract may have only needed the less-than-1MM-points to hit the PR point requirement, which would have needed to exceed the Plat VIP 1MM minimum to qualify for PR at the time of purchase.

Note that the use of "only" does not in any way minimize that a 654K point developer purchase at the PR per/K price is still a freakin' big-A amount of $$ to drop.  The $16K eBay resale price is a huge drop from what it originally sold for by WYN to that owner.


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## uscav8r (Feb 19, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> Yes but they do not maintain pres. Reserve benefits. Heirs go to platinum.
> 
> Sent from my RCT6873W42 using Tapatalk



You've got it completely wrong. ALL PR and VIP benefits convey to an immediate relative. 

You are also confusing VIP Platinum and PR. You can have one without the other. PR is strictly tied to a deeded ownership and has its own booking rules. VIP is a developer perk. If there is a sale to a non-relative, the former conveys (less a couple of aforementioned exceptions), but the latter does not. 


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## ronparise (Feb 19, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> Yes but they do not maintain pres. Reserve benefits. Heirs go to platinum.
> 
> Sent from my RCT6873W42 using Tapatalk



that's  wrong


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## happyhopian (Feb 20, 2017)

Jan M. said:


> Presidential Reserve units are a lot more points to book. If you are developer Gold or Platinum already it is typically another big chunk of money to go PR. Yes a percentage of PR inventory is held for PR owners but it isn't quite the rosy picture they paint in the sales presentations. It works great if you are booking further out but what they don't tell you is that often the bulk of what is available within the last couple of months is off season reservations at resorts that are very definitely seasonal. Want to go to the ski resorts out West in the summer or Myrtle Beach in the winter? You would be one of the few people who do. Without the VIP discount and free upgrade PR units are a lot more points to book and become very expensive when you calculate the maintenance fees on the points used. If you are able to go pretty last minute I find that many PR owners are renters and I can sometimes pick up their cancellations when it gets down to the 15 day cancellation window.
> 
> I'm trying to stay impartial on what I say about it because this is a choice that involves a lot of money and only you can decide what is right for you. You need to think about how much you will have to spend to go PR, look over the benefits in my previous post and think about what your usage will be of those PR units.
> 
> If anyone is considering buying PR on the secondary market and they don't already have the VIP status to be able to book non PR units to use to get the upgrade to the PR unit then be prepared to own and pay maintenance fees on a huge number of points. It would truly be much, much cheaper to rent stays in the PR units from owners. For example a 4 bedroom presidential at Bonnet Creek in Orlando is 424,000 points in one of the prime season weeks. The maintenance fees on that reservation would run you about $2100 and maybe more. You can easily rent for less than that.



Two points here from someone very experienced in this.

Yes resale points are provided VIP benefits and yes there use to be a loophole that would transfer resale points with VIP benefits though I have not heard of this happening in a long time. 

As to rental vs Presidential. I have been booking both at Bonnet Creek for about 5 years for ourself and family. I have never seen a Prime unit as referenced by Jan above for rent for much less than what it would cost to book directly. Now it is usually the same price, maybe $100 more or less and I've seen some $500 more. I share this to say that even at $500 more, you don't have to maintain the points and you use as you want. It is hard to recommend purchasing PR on the secondary market unless you are already VIP IMHO. 

And again as Ron states, the use of resale points under VIP status may change in the future just as everything else in life has no guarantees


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## happyhopian (Feb 20, 2017)

rubbub said:


> I do not believe this to be correct. Anyone buying or inheriting a PR contract is classified as a PR Member and will receive those benefits. However, unless they are an immediate relative of the previous owner they will not receive/inherit the following benefits: Exchange privileges in The Registry Collection program; Access to The Registry Collection Concierge; and VIP benefits.



FYI on VIP status and continuance: If anyone owns VIP on a significant number of points then you should look into converting your ownership to a trust, an llc or other 'entity' besides single ownership. I have confirmed and encourage you to call title services to inquire but these types never lose their VIP status as ownership never changes. I can list the ownership as an LLC and never transfer the ownership but rather place up to six people as authorized users. Those users can come and go but they never change the ownership. Same is true for a trust, where by the 'trust' owns the underlying deeds and contracts and the members or beneficiaries of the trust change over time, the ownership does not. I can also sell the LLC - but that is a change in members and owners in the LLC - the deeds never change. These forms of ownership are totally allowable under Wyndham and unless they have stopped doing it in the last year I can attest it has and can (could) be done.


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## rubbub (Feb 20, 2017)

happyhopian said:


> FYI on VIP status and continuance: If anyone owns VIP on a significant number of points then you should look into converting your ownership to a trust, an llc or other 'entity' besides single ownership. I have confirmed and encourage you to call title services to inquire but these types never lose their VIP status as ownership never changes. I can list the ownership as an LLC and never transfer the ownership but rather place up to six people as authorized users. Those users can come and go but they never change the ownership. Same is true for a trust, where by the 'trust' owns the underlying deeds and contracts and the members or beneficiaries of the trust change over time, the ownership does not. I can also sell the LLC - but that is a change in members and owners in the LLC - the deeds never change. These forms of ownership are totally allowable under Wyndham and unless they have stopped doing it in the last year I can attest it has and can (could) be done.



Deviating off-topic, but while I can see advantages of an entity being an owner vs. an individual or named group of individuals, what are the pros & cons of choosing an LLC vs. a trust?


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## 55plus (Feb 20, 2017)

I truly believe Presidential Reserve was mainly developed as another way for Wyndham to get into your pockets. Wyndham needed a way to take advantage of Platinum owners. I'm just saying. . .


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## hdins (Feb 25, 2017)

Now we are being told that PR and VIP do not have as good access as the new Access points.


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## uscav8r (Feb 25, 2017)

hdins said:


> Now we are being told that PR and VIP do not have as good access as the new Access points.



Whatever you have, the salesperson will claim it is flawed and you need the opposite. 


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## BellaWyn (Feb 25, 2017)

uscav8r said:


> Whatever you have, the salesperson will claim it is flawed and you need the opposite.
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Exactly.  And be aware that TUGGERS, in general, are extremely skeptical of vague postings from pretty much anyone (can be a long-time member or newbie).

It's a known fact that sales people lie to get the sale and information is invented. 


hdins said:


> Now we are being told that PR and VIP do not have as good access as the new Access points.


Plan on getting asked "who is we" and "who is doing the telling" -- it colors how the information is received in this forum.


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## markb53 (Feb 26, 2017)

I was told at an update at Bali Hai that my CWA was worthless and that I would never be able to book anywhere good with CWA. I said then how do you explain that I am staying in a 3br presidential during Christmas week with my worthless CWA. Or maybe you're saying Bali Hai is worthless. Which is it.


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## hdins (Feb 27, 2017)

Sorry for the lack of information. I (the we) have now attended 2 updates,  in NYC and Nashville. Wyndham sales representatives (the who) are saying that Access will be able to book all access locations 13 months out vs the shorter time given for other owners. Except for PR or the  owners resort. Their solution was to give up 1 million PR points in exchange for 1 million Access points. Of course Wyndham will do to for a fee of 24,000.00 . They say Access owners will be able to request future upgrades on a first come basis when something is canceled.


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## Jan M. (Feb 27, 2017)

hdins said:


> Sorry for the lack of information. I (the we) have now attended 2 updates,  in NYC and Nashville. Wyndham sales representatives (the who) are saying that Access will be able to book all access locations 13 months out vs the shorter time given for other owners. Except for PR or the  owners resort. Their solution was to give up 1 million PR points in exchange for 1 million Access points. Of course Wyndham will do to for a fee of 24,000.00 . They say Access owners will be able to request future upgrades on a first come basis when something is canceled.



No one in their right mind would ever give up presidential reserve for access let alone pay to do it! We've heard variations of the same lies and that is what finally "cured" us of attending updates. There is nothing they won't say to get you to give them more of your money.


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