# Do you have sewer backup rider on your homeowners policy?



## Mosca (Apr 17, 2011)

If not, you might want to look at the cost and get it. I saved about $50/year over the last 20 years. Last night the sewer main backed up, and raw sewage gushed from the basement toilet for about 3 hours, from 10:30 until about 2:45, while the township worked to clear it. Today the Servpro guys are here, and the bill, after a call to State Farm confirming that we don't have the coverage, is $9887.46. That is WITHOUT replacing any of the damaged furniture, or electronics, or the carpeting, or any of the contents. That's just to fix and disinfect the house and garage.

Now, you might say that there is far, far less than a 10% chance that your sewer would ever back up, or even a 5% chance, allowing for $10000 worth of content, and I would agree with you; the odds are pretty slim. BUT, I would counter by saying that you'll never miss the $4-$5 a month, and if you ever have a claim you'll be glad you spent it.


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## vacationhopeful (Apr 17, 2011)

Check valve?


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## riverdees05 (Apr 17, 2011)

That is terrible. thanks for posting, I am going to check into it when I get back home.


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## Mosca (Apr 17, 2011)

Nope. This was caused by a blocked main. water flowing out of the house is generally not under pressure, and doesn't get valved. 

I can't blame the township, there's no negligence. I had the opportunity to take the coverage 20 years ago and apparently declined. I'm taking responsibility for my choice with my checkbook, but I regret the choice I made.


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## KCI (Apr 17, 2011)

We've have had it since we moved to Florida in 91 because it's highly recommended. Most of Florida uses pumping stations to keep the stuff moving. If for some reason (like a hurricane) power goes out, the pumps stop, everyone keeps flushing and it has to go somewhere, so it backsup. Fortunately it's never happened to us, but better safe than sorry. Can't tell you what the extra cost is because it just says "included" on the policy, but in the past the cost was about $25 a year. 
KCI's Wingman


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## Passepartout (Apr 17, 2011)

We have the insurance rider. The city's sewer backed up and put 2" of raw sewage in our basement the night before we went to China for a month. To replace all flooring, clean/dry/disinfect/paint etc. was over $10k. The city paid it. We had yet another flood a few years later (water heater leaked). This time it was our own homeowner's insurance that paid the bill.

Our insurance agent told me that his company pays out more than twice as much in flood damages than fire. Read on:

Whether or not one buys the insurance rider is up to them, but I can't recommend highly enough, *WATER ALARMS*. Here's an example: http://www.google.com/products/cata...n&client=firefox-a&cid=18209929765725436351#p There are several types that all work pretty much the same. Ours came from Home Depot. We have them behind the refrigerator, washer, water heater, under the sink/dishwasher. For about $10 each and a new battery once a year, they can save you (and have saved me) thousands of dollars. Every house needs a few of these.

Jim Ricks


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## MelBay (Apr 17, 2011)

We have it.  We do NOT have flood insurance, but my cousin is a disaster manager for State Farm and asked me if I had "sewer & pipe coverage" (or something like that), when I asked if I should get earthquake insurance.   He highly recommended both riders, and neither costs me much more per year.  Hope I never need to use either, but if I do, they're there.


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## pjrose (Apr 17, 2011)

Ugh.  It must have been a horrible experience.  I just can't imagine having sewage all over the place.  I don't know if we are covered for this, but I will check.

I have to call our insurance company tomorrow anyway because last night we had extremely heavy rain and our finished basement flooded with groundwater coming up through the floor.  We squished around on the carpet with rainboots moving as much stuff as we could.  (We live way up on a hill, and have never had a bit of problem in 25 years!)

Besides the living area down there, the storeroom was in about 3" of water; fortunately most of the stuff in the store room was in plastic bins, but whatever was in cardboard boxes is wrecked.

I don't know if we're going to have to replace carpeting, wallboard, and insulation....it may look ok once it dries out, but I don't want mold or who-knows-what else growing.  How do we even tell what might be growing behind the walls?  

Tomorrow I'll call the insurance company and also go buy a dehumidifier and probably get a carpet cleaning company to come suck up the remaining water from all the carpeting.  

At least it was (relatively) clean water and not sewage, and at least it's just a finished basement with stuff that can be tossed and/or replaced, not our whole house destroyed like in New Orleans or Japan.


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## equitax (Apr 17, 2011)

*Sewer Backup / Earthquake Coverage*

I don't like giving money away but I have both riders on my home insurance (and my house is in Ottawa, not exactly on a fault line.)


I have seen firsthand the damage caused by backing up sewer (as OP states).  If you have any type of damage from a back up that will cost minimum 5K if you have a carpeted basement -50$ a year - I ride the odds.

Earthquake (comes with 3% deductible)- Simply put, I would rather bite the bullet for 78$ a year, and be limited to 22500 loss if the place falls as a result of quake.

Cars though, another story.  All my vehicles are insured for liability ONLY.  reason? Collision insurance in Canada only kicks in if you have an at-fault accident, other wise paid from other parties liability.  Comprehensive? My cars aren't on the top 10 robbed list.  I save about 4300 annually in premiums, and can therefore afford the occasional write off (thaankfully has not happened yet mind you!)


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## vacationhopeful (Apr 17, 2011)

As I heard my subpump running longer than usual, I decided to walk down the steps to see if I had inches of water in basement.

Usual little dampness. But now I am parniod as bet. Thanks, guys.


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## Mosca (Apr 17, 2011)

Ooooh, PJ. We've had clean water once, and that is pretty bad, too. I live in a town called "Mountain Top", I never, ever thought I would have water damage. Interestingly enough, I added the water damage waiver at that time (2005), but most likely I waived the sewer coverage a second time then. 

As long as the water is clean you won't have a problem with bacteria, but mold I don't know about. IIRC, We tore out the carpet, dried out the room, and replaced the carpet, pretty much just like that. The fix for the sewage is that they cut the bottom 8" off the walls and replace it. 

I think that's most of the cost. Even though the money is important, it's the interruption of our lives that really, really bugs us. But yeah, it's not as bad as what others have gone through. As Mrs Mosca said when I was stressing out, "It's just water in the basement. And money. It will pass, and we'll have a story to tell." Y'know, that's why I love her. 




pjrose said:


> Ugh.  It must have been a horrible experience.  I just can't imagine having sewage all over the place.  I don't know if we are covered for this, but I will check.
> 
> I have to call our insurance company tomorrow anyway because last night we had extremely heavy rain and our finished basement flooded with groundwater coming up through the floor.  We squished around on the carpet with rainboots moving as much stuff as we could.  (We live way up on a hill, and have never had a bit of problem in 25 years!)
> 
> ...


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## pjrose (Apr 18, 2011)

Mosca said:


> As Mrs Mosca said when I was stressing out, "It's just water in the basement. And money. It will pass, and we'll have a story to tell." Y'know, that's why I love her.



I'm with Mrs. M, though I wouldn't call sewage "just water".  

While DD and I were grabbing stuff from the floor and moving it to the tops of furniture someone else in the house (he who shall go unnamed LOL) was stressing out - maybe like you?


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## pwrshift (Apr 18, 2011)

My mother used to have a backflow preventer valve in her basement sewer that would rise and stop water from coming up a sewer.  She didn't have a toilet or sink in the basement.  One year there was a neighborhood backup and hers was the only house on the street without backup.  Might be the cheapest insurance you can get.  Here's something I found on the subject that might be of use...

http://www.ag.ndsu.edu/pubs/ageng/structu/ae1476.pdf


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## NWL (Apr 18, 2011)

pjrose said:


> Ugh.  It must have been a horrible experience.  I just can't imagine having sewage all over the place.  I don't know if we are covered for this, but I will check.
> 
> I have to call our insurance company tomorrow anyway because last night we had extremely heavy rain and our finished basement flooded with groundwater coming up through the floor.  We squished around on the carpet with rainboots moving as much stuff as we could.  (We live way up on a hill, and have never had a bit of problem in 25 years!)
> 
> ...



I've been in a similar situation.  Basic homeowners insurance does not cover this situation.  I suggest, if you are going to do it yourself, you go to your local rental center and rent a commercial dehumidifier and a shop vac.  Suck as much water up as you can with the shop vac and run the dehumidifier for at least a week.  I live in a semi-arid location and that was enough to clear the moisture out, although the carpet that was soaked was elevated and had good air flow around it.

There are also disaster restoration companies that do this, too.  Your insurance rep will have references.  

Cheers!


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## bobcat (Apr 18, 2011)

Mosca said:


> If not, you might want to look at the cost and get it. I saved about $50/year over the last 20 years. Last night the sewer main backed up, and raw sewage gushed from the basement toilet for about 3 hours, from 10:30 until about 2:45, while the township worked to clear it. Today the Servpro guys are here, and the bill, after a call to State Farm confirming that we don't have the coverage, is $9887.46. That is WITHOUT replacing any of the damaged furniture, or electronics, or the carpeting, or any of the contents. That's just to fix and disinfect the house and garage.
> 
> Now, you might say that there is far, far less than a 10% chance that your sewer would ever back up, or even a 5% chance, allowing for $10000 worth of content, and I would agree with you; the odds are pretty slim. BUT, I would counter by saying that you'll never miss the $4-$5 a month, and if you ever have a claim you'll be glad you spent it.



You have to be very carefull as to what claims you want to report to your insurance co. Where we live, on the 3rd claim they can and will drop you.


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## Kagehitokiri2 (Apr 18, 2011)

at some point im going to investigate how much a premium "luxury" insurance charges.. umbrella coverage, put you up in amazing accommodations during repairs, etc.

edit - article >
http://www.departures.com/articles/material-comforts-smart-advice-for-smart-people
(john smith / 371909)


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## Mosca (Apr 18, 2011)

I just spoke with State Farm. It's not _that_ great a deal, but it's still worth getting. $70/year. $10k max benefit, $1k deductible. Covers structural damage only, not contents. No option to raise the limit. 

Now, just as an aside, I find this curious and I'm going to ask further. The guy who did our estimate said that State Farm was really good to deal with, and that they usually put in claims of $15-20k including replacing contents. Our contact at the agency might have been underinformed.

My thought is that once there's a partial blockage, the chance of there being another one some time in the future is high, so I added the coverage. The cost to repair our structure is $9887. And I did notice the sewer authority out on the street today pulling manholes and running the cleaner through. So maybe there's some negligence to pursue.


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## timeos2 (Apr 18, 2011)

pwrshift said:


> My mother used to have a backflow preventer valve in her basement sewer that would rise and stop water from coming up a sewer.  She didn't have a toilet or sink in the basement.  One year there was a neighborhood backup and hers was the only house on the street without backup.  Might be the cheapest insurance you can get.  Here's something I found on the subject that might be of use...
> 
> http://www.ag.ndsu.edu/pubs/ageng/structu/ae1476.pdf



Most newer sewer connections require a back flow preventor.  They protect from this exact type of problem and are relatively low cost. Having worked for the local sewer agencies over 30 years I know the value of those vs the potential nightmare the unpredictable sudden sewer backup can cause any home.  If you don't have one get one even before you think of any backup insurance as preventing the damage is far better than cleaning it up.


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## Passepartout (Apr 18, 2011)

Kagehitokiri2 said:


> at some point im going to investigate how much a premium "luxury" insurance charges.. umbrella coverage, put you up in amazing accommodations during repairs, etc.



With all due respect, best to get basic insurance at reasonable cost to make you whole in case of disaster than to put it off to 'at some point' in order to get gold-plated coverage that almost makes you look forward to a loss.

If you are subjected to a sewage flood, the time that you are kept away from home is measured in weeks and months rather than days. The voice of experience here. Even if it is a 'clean water' flood, floor coverings and much wall board has to be replaced. The resultant mold can come as much from spores already in your home as 'imported' via polluted wastewater. 

See my post #6 above- I've experienced both.

Jim


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## Sea Six (Apr 18, 2011)

Interesting thread here!  The city just installed a sewer system on our street, and we are not hooked up yet.  My house is near the end of the line, before the first lift (pump) station, and my house is above the sewer line, with no basement.  Strictly a gravity feed here, with no pressure since we are not beyond any pumps.  I don't think there is physically a way for a back-up to happen here, but I want to ask if they install back-flow preventers when they hook me up and destroy the old septic system.


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## stugy (Apr 18, 2011)

Every insurance salesperson should offer this to clients.  2 years ago we had a torrential downpour in our area.  Our neighbor had been blowing his leaves down the storm drain.  I thought everyone knew that the drain was for water, but he's not very ambitious nor bright, I guess.  Well, the storm drain backed up from the leaves and our downstairs (basement and garage) got flooded.  The damage was significant, carpet, furniture, etc.  We had a restoration service and had to buy new carpet and furniture for our gameroom.  When we called our insurance man, we were told we had no coverage for it. We were never offered this coverage.   We requested it and for $5.00 a month, we are now covered.  My recommendation is to make sure you always have it and don't let your lazy neighbors blow leaves down the storm drain.  :annoyed: 
Pat


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## Mosca (Apr 18, 2011)

Sea Six said:


> My house is near the end of the line, before the first lift (pump) station, and my house is above the sewer line, with no basement.  Strictly a gravity feed here, with no pressure since we are not beyond any pumps.  I don't think there is physically a way for a back-up to happen here,




That is exactly what I thought. But if the sewer blocks, the water will look for the first available outlet, and it will be driven up by pressure from the rest of the water. We were above the sewer line, but it didn't matter; we were the last house before the blockage.

We're going to look into that valve, too.


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## vacationhopeful (Apr 18, 2011)

Called a "Check Valve". Another name is "backflow preventer".

Yes, and pressure from a gavity feed system will force sewage out any outlet - basement, first floor and higher.


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## Conan (Apr 18, 2011)

Slightly off topic, but we know somebody who had the washing machine water inlet hose fail while they were on a two-week vacation. Many thousands of dollars damage for a completely flooded living area and basement. (Of course you can turn off the water before going on vacation - - they didn't - - but it could also fail on a random day when nobody's home.)

We now have an electric gizmo in-line with the washing machine water inlet - - a sensor hangs down from it to the floor, and supposedly if there's water on the floor it will close the water valve. It cost about $80 plus installation.

Here it is on the Web;
http://www.watts.com/pages/learnAbout/intelliflow.asp
(looks like my description is a little off - - according to the webpage it closes the water valve whenever the machine is not running; the sensor on the floor is an override in case there's a spill while the machine is running)


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## Sea Six (Apr 18, 2011)

Isn't there a standard shut-off valve on the water supply line to the washer? There must be. Your owner's manual for any washer will tell you to shut off the valve when not in use for exactly this reason.


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## isisdave (Apr 18, 2011)

There are four other approaches to the washer hose problem:

1. Shut the valves off before you go.

2. Replace the hoses every 5 years, even if they look fine.  My last one "broke" right at the faucet ferrule. Basically, the hose comes off the faucet horizontally, and its own weight tugs it downward, so the split will be at the top of the hose, right where the brass coupling ends.

3. Buy the expensive armored hose set,  and trust they'll last the 20 or so years they're supposed to.

4. Install a whole-house shutoff valve where your water enters the house, and put it on your "leaving for vacation" checklist.  Get this kind, which operates instantly by turning 90 degrees --- not a gate valve you have to twirl for 30 seconds. If you're leaving for more than a week, also turn off your water heater as it will probably run dry with the house water shut off.

=========
My homeowner's insurance is through the Auto Club of S. Cal and it specifically does not cover this hazard, and there is no rider for it. So I'm shopping.

Regarding check valves: the idea is they permit flow only one way, but there are a couple of problems.  First, they do restrict the flow in the normal direction, so it is possible that you might get a blockage if something substantially smaller than the pipe goes down the drain.  Also, if you have trees along the sewer line, roots can get in and infiltrate the line, and if they go through the valve they will essentially prevent it from closing and doing its job.  So keep those things in mind, and install the valve somewhere you can get at it to clean it ... not under your new driveway.


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## pjrose (Apr 18, 2011)

I called the insurance company today about coverage for our water damage in the finished basement (post 8 above).  We don't have flood insurance, and it wasn't available because we don't live in a flood plain (we're up on a hill....well they call it a mountain here, but I used to live in Colorado, so to me it's a hill LOL).  

We're just going to have to go with the shop vac and dehumidifier route suggested above by NWL, and fortunately we have a really good handyman who will do it for us.  

I asked about the sewer rider for our policy and was told it isn't available for our current (25 year old) policy - it could be added to a new more expensive one.  The rider is about $150 for $10K coverage on top of however-much-more the new policy would be.  

I like the idea of the check valve / backflow protector.


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## Kagehitokiri2 (Apr 19, 2011)

Passepartout said:


> If you are subjected to a sewage flood, the time that you are kept away from home is measured in weeks and months rather than days.



i was only saying i personally am going to explore upgrading/replacing entire insurance portfolio. (each component, and adding umbrella etc.) i have no idea what the incremental cost is like.

from article i linked >


> The renovation had run to several millions of dollars...The family spent months at the Hotel Bel-Air and then in a nearby luxury apartment while their condemned home was rebuilt. Howard’s customized homeowner’s insurance policy, which covered the costs of repairing his home and his temporary living expenses


this is part of why i personally see it as semi-related to OP >


Mosca said:


> I just spoke with State Farm. It's not _that_ great a deal, but it's still worth getting. $70/year. $10k max benefit, $1k deductible. Covers structural damage only, not contents. No option to raise the limit.
> 
> Now, just as an aside, I find this curious and I'm going to ask further. The guy who did our estimate said that State Farm was really good to deal with, and that they usually put in claims of $15-20k including replacing contents. Our contact at the agency might have been underinformed.


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## Elan (Apr 19, 2011)

isisdave said:


> There are four other approaches to the washer hose problem:
> 
> 1. Shut the valves off before you go.
> 
> ...



  I have the braided steel washer hoses, but after reading how many folks had their ice maker connection spring a leak while on vacation, I've now opted to shut off the water at the main when I leave.   I had my main shut-off valve placed right at the 
opening of a crawl space access in out MBR closet.  Takes about 15 seconds to lift the cover, turn off the water, and replace the cover.


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