# Four Seasons Aviara just added $30/day Resort Fee



## PamMo (Mar 2, 2022)

Just an FYI for anyone trading into the resort. I got this from Interval today for a reservation at the end of summer.


_*Dear Members and Guests:*_
* 
Four Seasons Residence Club Aviara has informed Interval International that a resort Fee of 30 USD per unit per day will be collected at check-in.

We apologize for any inconvenience.

Please contact the resort directly for more information.
*
_*Interval International*_


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## mrsmusic (Mar 16, 2022)

Has anyone gone since the announcement and questioned the charge as not being disclosed when booking months and months ago? Just curious.


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## 10spro (Mar 16, 2022)

We also received the notice. We arrive in April on a II trade that was made last year. They say to call for more information, but they don’t really have more information. There are no additional benefits or resort amenities included or made available for the extra fee. My husband grilled the guy for 15 minutes on the phone and he gave us no useful information. We got his manager on the phone and he was even less helpful. I think in person is better so will grill them again when we get there to see if they have a better answer by then.


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## buzglyd (Mar 16, 2022)

PamMo said:


> Just an FYI for anyone trading into the resort. I got this from Interval today for a reservation at the end of summer.
> 
> 
> _*Dear Members and Guests:*_
> ...



If you keep the reservation, let me know. I live about 2 miles from there.


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## PamMo (Mar 17, 2022)

I’m keeping the reservations for now, but I’m not so happy about the extra $420 fees for our 2-week stay.

**Added: After reading VacationForever's post below, I guess the fees are going to cost me an extra $460 for our 2-week stay!


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## VacationForever (Mar 17, 2022)

They add a tax on top of the $210, which is another $20+.  We just spent a week there at end Feb/early March.  They have reinstituted daily housekeeping.


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## mrsmusic (Mar 17, 2022)

10spro said:


> We also received the notice. We arrive in April on a II trade that was made last year. They say to call for more information, but they don’t really have more information. There are no additional benefits or resort amenities included or made available for the extra fee. My husband grilled the guy for 15 minutes on the phone and he gave us no useful information. We got his manager on the phone and he was even less helpful. I think in person is better so will grill them again when we get there to see if they have a better answer by then.



We are supposed to arrive in May, let me know what you find out. It would "seem" to me that they can't arbitrarily add fees after it's booked with no notification during the booking process. But what do I know. I would probably still have booked it, but it would have been much better to know ahead of time. Disney's is even only $190 with in-resort/parks transportation included.


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## bogey21 (Mar 28, 2022)

mrsmusic said:


> It would "seem" to me that they can't arbitrarily add fees after it's booked with no notification during the booking process.



I'm sure their attitude is that they can do whatever they damn well want to...

George


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## marmite (Mar 28, 2022)

I first noticed the resort fee in the fine print during checkout on December 20th 2021.  The only reason I know the date is because I mentioned it in one of my sightings I posted.  Back then they were advising that any reservations with a check in date after January 1st 2022 had the resort fee.

Not sure how much earlier than December they were advising people during the checkout process in Interval.  With that fee I'd definitely only take a 2BR exchange.


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## mrsmusic (Apr 26, 2022)

10spro said:


> We also received the notice. We arrive in April on a II trade that was made last year. They say to call for more information, but they don’t really have more information. There are no additional benefits or resort amenities included or made available for the extra fee. My husband grilled the guy for 15 minutes on the phone and he gave us no useful information. We got his manager on the phone and he was even less helpful. I think in person is better so will grill them again when we get there to see if they have a better answer by then.



Just following up, what did you find out in person? Thank you!


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## 10spro (Apr 26, 2022)

mrsmusic said:


> Just following up, what did you find out in person? Thank you!


Messed up on the dates. Checking in May 7. Will update after.


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## 10spro (May 16, 2022)

Just got back from a week at Four Seasons Aviara in Carlsbad, North San Diego. This is such a wonderful resort with the most amazing rooms I've ever come across in the timeshare world. So lucky to have traded in here through II for a second time. Did not need a 2BR, but that's what we got, 2BR, 3BA, 1,600+ SqFt. What's not to like. Well, yes, there is now a $30 per day resort fee, plus taxes for another $6.06, so my week cost me $235.62, but I still think it's well worth it for this property. And, yes, we did try to negotiate the $30, since it was only communicated after we made the reservation, but they were having none of that, not budging even a little on  reducing or removing the fee. I hope they use that revenue to budget for some upgrades, while this is a beautiful property, it could benefit from a refresh.
.


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## TravelTime (May 16, 2022)

Is this fee only applied to non-owners? We own there so just wondering.


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## 10spro (May 16, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Is this fee only applied to non-owners? We own there so just wondering.


Did not ask owner vs. non-owner. The Group Code on our invoice is "2022 OWNER". I know the initial communication, for us anyway, regarding the fee came from Interval. The Four Seasons website also specifies the fee to book a room, so seems it applies to the general public outside of Interval. I would guess if an owner goes in through whatever portal you schedule your dates, I'm thinking there will also be a statement there about the fee.


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## TravelTime (May 16, 2022)

10spro said:


> Did not ask owner vs. non-owner. The Group Code on our invoice is "2022 OWNER". I know the initial communication, for us anyway, regarding the fee came from Interval. The Four Seasons website also specifies the fee to book a room, so seems it applies to the general public outside of Interval. I would guess if an owner goes in through whatever portal you schedule your dates, I'm thinking there will also be a statement there about the fee.
> View attachment 55052



I emailed Owner Services. At FSA, owners need to book by calling. They do not have an online system to book.


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## dannybaker (May 16, 2022)

This really sucks, it appears that the money grab continues more and more. I wish Marriot would charge exchangers $1000 each and reduce my maintenance fees. Timeshare cost continue to climb and I’m sure forcing people to abandon them in masses. 
$1500 maintenance fees
RCI/II annual fees $79
excange fees $229
taxes 
parking fees
resort fees


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## TravelTime (May 16, 2022)

Four Seasons said: As a Four Seasons Residence Club Aviara owner you will not incur additional resort fees should you travel in through Interval International.


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## VacationForever (May 16, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Four Seasons said: As a Four Seasons Residence Club Aviara owner you will not incur additional resort fees should you travel in through Interval International.


So is that additional revenue going back towards the timeshare property or is it a pure money grab that goes back to the hotel bottom line?


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## zentraveler (May 16, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> So is that additional revenue going back towards the timeshare property or is it a pure money grab that goes back to the hotel bottom line?



There is no "hotel" at this property. It is the Four Seasons Residence Club.


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## VacationForever (May 16, 2022)

zentraveler said:


> There is no "hotel" at this property. It is the Four Seasons Residence Club.


What I meant is that Four Seasons charges management fees and licensing fees.  So is this resort fees going back to the Four Seasons hotel brand or do they flow back as revenue for the HOA?


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## TravelTime (May 16, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> So is that additional revenue going back towards the timeshare property or is it a pure money grab that goes back to the hotel bottom line?



I would not know. Not sure I consider it a money grab if the hotel side takes it vs the timeshare side.


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## TravelTime (May 16, 2022)

dannybaker said:


> This really sucks, it appears that the money grab continues more and more. I wish Marriot would charge exchangers $1000 each and reduce my maintenance fees. Timeshare cost continue to climb and I’m sure forcing people to abandon them in masses.
> $1500 maintenance fees
> RCI/II annual fees $79
> excange fees $229
> ...



The only thing specific to owning a timeshare that you mentioned is the MF and you would pay for a hotel anyway.

With a timeshare, the taxes are a lot less than with a hotel. We do not pay parking fees or resort fees with a timeshare. 

Exchanges fees only apply if you exchange. I pay no exchange fees because I do not exchange. However, if I ever do exchange, I am happy to pay for the opportunity to go somewhere else assuming I own a week that does not participate in a points program.


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## VacationForever (May 16, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I would not know. Not sure I consider it a money grab if the hotel side takes it vs the timeshare side.


There is contractual term as to how much Four Seasons get from maintenance fees - in Marriott case I think it is 10%.  Collecting resort fees from exchangers add to the Four Seasons bottom line, which would be above the stated percentage, if they are not passed back to the HOA to pay for operating expenses.


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## TravelTime (May 17, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> There is contractual term as to how much Four Seasons get from maintenance fees - in Marriott case I think it is 10%.  Collecting resort fees from exchangers add to the Four Seasons bottom line, which would be above the stated percentage, if they are not passed back to the HOA to pay for operating expenses.



Yes but why is it bad for a hotel to get money from exchangers, assuming they are? Don’t Marriott and other timeshares get parking fees from exchangers? I think there are often discrepancies between what owners get vs what exchangers get. We may not like it but it seems fair to me.

I was looking at the P&L after you commented. The timeshare side runs everything at the resort. The P&L has a line item for resort fees. I have no idea if these new resort fees go to the timeshare side but it might be likely.


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## VacationForever (May 17, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Yes but why is it bad for a hotel to get money from exchangers, assuming they are? Don’t Marriott and other timeshares get parking fees from exchangers? I think there are often discrepancies between what owners get vs what exchangers get. We may not like it but it seems fair to me.
> 
> I was looking at the P&L after you commented. The timeshare side runs everything at the resort. The P&L has a line item for resort fees. I have no idea if these new resort fees go to the timeshare side but it might be likely.


To me, fair will be the established fee structure as everything should be above board.  I am not the one paying almost $3K on MF at the resort. If FS collects an additional $210 plus taxes per week, I would surely wish that the money goes back to HOA to lower my MF.


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## TravelTime (May 17, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> To me, fair will be the established fee structure as everything should be above board.  I am not the one paying almost $3K on MF at the resort. If FS collects an additional $210 plus taxes per week, I would surely wish that the money goes back to HOA to lower my MF.



We do not know the answer. I am not sure why you say it is not above board if it is disclosed to exchangers. The fact that I do not know the answer does not mean much. I do not follow the HOA stuff at timeshares. It is what it is to me.

I can ask next time they email me something from the HOA about who gets this revenue. I am paying almost $3000 and I am not overly concerned. I think it is great that exchangers pay extra. I am assuming it goes back to the residence club.


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## zentraveler (May 17, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> What I meant is that Four Seasons charges management fees and licensing fees.  So is this resort fees going back to the Four Seasons hotel brand or do they flow back as revenue for the HOA?


No idea. I do wonder if the $30 daily fee is to defray daily housekeeping which, as far as I know, is not offered at any other timeshare. Some these days one is lucky to get once week for longer stays.


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## zentraveler (May 17, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> We do not know the answer. I am not sure why you say it is not above board if it is disclosed to exchangers. The fact that I do not know the answer does not mean much. I do not follow the HOA stuff at timeshares. It is what it is to me.
> 
> I can ask next time they email me something from the HOA about who gets this revenue. I am paying almost $3000 and I am not overly concerned. I think it is great that exchangers pay extra. I am assuming it goes back to the residence club.


We are not paying $3000; must be the lowly gold week we have .


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## TravelTime (May 17, 2022)

zentraveler said:


> We are not paying $3000; must be the lowly gold week we have .



We would pay the same as you. I have gold weeks too. I know it is less than $3000 but the poster was saying almost $3000 so I went along. I can’t recall exactly how much it is. Is it $2600 now?

BTW, Gold weeks at FSA are better than Platinum weeks, IMO. You get more months and many holidays.


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## VacationForever (May 17, 2022)

Don't forget to add in property tax.


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## dannybaker (May 26, 2022)

All I’m saying is if your resort charges a fee or resort fee you should have to pay exactly the same fee or resort fees to trade into my Marriott resort. If the fee is for house keeping give the exchange person a option.


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## VacationForever (May 26, 2022)

dannybaker said:


> All I’m saying is if your resort charges a fee or resort fee you should have to pay exactly the same fee or resort fees to trade into my Marriott resort. If the fee is for house keeping give the exchange person a option.


Like it or not, it is a free market and you can always not exchange into a resort which charges resort fees.


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## dannybaker (May 27, 2022)

Okay so next year it’s $60. Then maybe $500 per night? This is total bs in my opinion its a money grab period. my Point is the maintenance fees for this resort are $3k already. Is this money helping reduce the maintenance fees? I seriously doubt it. Again this sets a precedent for additional cost to all of us who exchange. I understand for a lot of elite people who have tons of money no big deal right!!!


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## SteveinHNL (May 29, 2022)

I’m told by an owner that this does not apply to owners or people who come in directly through an owner, as opposed to people who trade in through II


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## rickandcindy23 (May 29, 2022)

dannybaker said:


> All I’m saying is if your resort charges a fee or resort fee you should have to pay exactly the same fee or resort fees to trade into my Marriott resort. If the fee is for house keeping give the exchange person a option.


Don't give Marriott any ideas.  

This is why I don't trade into Hiltons.  Well, my credit card covers 1 week of fees + an additional 3 days ($25 X 10 =$250 credit card refund).


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## TravelTime (May 29, 2022)

dannybaker said:


> Okay so next year it’s $60. Then maybe $500 per night? This is total bs in my opinion its a money grab period. my Point is the maintenance fees for this resort are $3k already. Is this money helping reduce the maintenance fees? I seriously doubt it. Again this sets a precedent for additional cost to all of us who exchange. I understand for a lot of elite people who have tons of money no big deal right!!!



If it is any consolation prize to hear this, Four Seasons Aviara is a terrible trader in Interval International. I am surprised II gets any deposits for FSA given what a lousy trader it is. I made my one and only deposit in II several years ago and never again. So maybe eventually there will not be any FSA in II to trade into and the $30 resort fee will be a non-issue.


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## VacationForever (May 29, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> If it is any consolation prize to hear this, Four Seasons Aviara is a terrible trader in Interval International. I am surprised II gets any deposits for FSA given what a lousy trader it is. I made my one and only deposit in II several years ago and never again. So maybe eventually there will not be any FSA in II to trade into and the $30 resort fee will be a non-issue.


Actually there are more deposits now than before.  I managed to retrade 2 BR several times until I got the dates which we preferred.


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## TravelTime (May 29, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> Actually there are more deposits now than before.  I managed to retrade 2 BR several times until I got the dates which we preferred.



I believe it but I do not understand it. It is such a terrible trader. I wonder if those could be HOA deposits. If owners are depositing, there are much better places to deposit like ThirdHome, which actually gives good value to FSA.


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## VacationForever (May 29, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I believe it but I do not understand it. It is such a terrible trader. I wonder if those could be HOA deposits. If owners are depositing, there are much better places to deposit like ThirdHome, which actually gives good value to FSA.


I think you said you deposited a studio.  In general, studios don't have good trade power no matter the brand.


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## TravelTime (May 29, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> I think you said you deposited a studio.  In general, studios don't have good trade power no matter the brand.



FSA is a bad trader regardless of unit size. I have looked with the 2BR unit intact also. Someone said it‘s because all the other brands give preference to their owners first. So I guess there’s not much left over after that. So not sure why people are whining about a resort fee to stay at FSA when an FSA owner can barely get into their resorts.


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## VacationForever (May 29, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> FSA is a bad trader regardless of unit size. I have looked with the 2BR unit intact also. Someone said it‘s because all the other brands give preference to their owners first. So I guess there’s not much left over after that. So not sure why people are whining about a resort fee to stay at FSA when an FSA owner can barely get into their resorts.


Back when TUGgers were comparing trade power, deposited weeks were showing higher trade power than undeposited weeks.  Did you deposit a full 2BR?  Yes, the priority blocks for Marriott and Vistana do factor into the inability of other brand names to see these weeks while being blocked out during those first 3 weeks.


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## rickandcindy23 (May 29, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> I think you said you deposited a studio.  In general, studios don't have good trade power no matter the brand.


My Marriott studios are great traders, so I don't think that's true.  I am sure there is truth in what TravelTime says.  No reason to doubt an owner who has had the experience.


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## VacationForever (May 29, 2022)

rickandcindy23 said:


> My Marriott studios are great traders, so I don't think that's true.  I am sure there is truth in what TravelTime says.  No reason to doubt an owner who has had the experience.


A FSA studio should trump a Marriott studio trader, except for the brand name blocks.


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## rickandcindy23 (May 29, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> A FSA studio should trump a Marriott studio trader, except for the brand name blocks.


Except I do get the Marriott brand for my trades, and what brand is FSA going to trade into with priority, except maybe a bigger FSA or Scottsdale.  I am not arguing with you at all, I am just saying that TravelTime speaks from experience, so of course I believe what she is saying.  The fees are so high, higher than most oceanfront Maui weeks.


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## VacationForever (May 29, 2022)

rickandcindy23 said:


> Except I do get the Marriott brand for my trades, and what brand is FSA going to trade into with priority, except maybe a bigger FSA or Scottsdale.  I am not arguing with you at all, I am just saying that TravelTime speaks from experience, so of course I believe what she is saying.  The fees are so high, higher than most oceanfront Maui weeks.


Hypothetically, FSA would trump MVC trade into  Hyatt Carmel deposit.  I put in my MVC and Vistana trade request to Carmel and have never been matched, even when I put in a wide window.  Yes, priority blocks are an issue for any non affiliated brand.  But based on pure trade power, FSA should be higher when trading into other timeshare.


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## rickandcindy23 (May 29, 2022)

I have gotten Hyatt Carmel with a combined trading power 9-43 SBP one bedroom.  I have gotten matches more than we have been able to go.  But honestly, I don't question the validity of an owners's complaint about trading power.  If you have the same type of week, then perhaps you can ease her mind?


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## VacationForever (May 29, 2022)

rickandcindy23 said:


> I have gotten Hyatt Carmel with a combined trading power 9-43 SBP one bedroom.  I have gotten matches more than we have been able to go.  But honestly, I don't question the validity of an owners's complaint about trading power.  If you have the same type of week, then perhaps you can ease her mind?


It is not even a relevant discussion.  FSA gets leftovers Vistana and MVC deposits and that has nothing to do with trade power.  It is the priority block rule.


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## TravelTime (May 29, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> Back when TUGgers were comparing trade power, deposited weeks were showing higher trade power than undeposited weeks.  Did you deposit a full 2BR?  Yes, the priority blocks for Marriott and Vistana do factor into the inability of other brand names to see these weeks while being blocked out during those first 3 weeks.



No I did not deposit a 2BR. I just use the II website to put in a dummy reservation to get an idea of what it would trade for. The difference between what I saw with the studio I deposited vs what I see with the dummy 2BR reservation is about the same. The ability to trade back into FSA was not even that great. I would have had priority for that but the options were just okay. You probably know I am not an II fan to begin with. So possibly this is not an FSA problem and just an II problem. No matter what I have ever deposited, I have never like the II trading system. However, based on my experience, Marriotts are much better traders than FSA within II.


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## zentraveler (May 30, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> No I did not deposit a 2BR. I just use the II website to put in a dummy reservation to get an idea of what it would trade for. The difference between what I saw with the studio I deposited vs what I see with the dummy 2BR reservation is about the same. The ability to trade back into FSA was not even that great. I would have had priority for that but the options were just okay. You probably know I am not an II fan to begin with. So possibly this is not an FSA problem and just an II problem. No matter what I have ever deposited, I have never like the II trading system. However, based on my experience, Marriotts are much better traders than FSA within II.


FWIW, we have owned FSA for 20+ years and have traded it through II almost exclusively. We have consistently gotten great trades, mostly in Hawaii. We have gotten several over the years for larger units than we deposited (including one at MFC where we got a 2 bdrm for a 1 bdrm deposit). We have also used a lot of the AC's we have been given for nice trades as well. The Four Seasons desk at II has been very helpful over the years.

No complaints from us, although as always one's mileage may vary as it certainly seems to.


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## rickandcindy23 (May 30, 2022)

zentraveler said:


> FWIW, we have owned FSA for 20+ years and have traded it through II almost exclusively. We have consistently gotten great trades, mostly in Hawaii. We have gotten several over the years for larger units than we deposited (including one at MFC). We have also used a lot of the AC's we have been given for nice trades as well. The Four Seasons desk at II has been very helpful over the years.
> 
> No complaints from us, although as always one's mileage may vary as it certainly seems to.


Great information.  

For what it's worth, I would pay the $30 housekeeping fee at FSA for the wonderful benefits of staying at FSA.  I love everything about that resort, including the toiletries, the daily housekeeping, the coffee, the comfortable beds (OH MY) and furniture.  The location is unique.  It's worth every penny of the $30 per day fee.  Our daughter-in-law is really wanting to stay at FSA.

On the other hand, I always said I would not pay the $25 per day for the exchanges at Hilton that I can get through RCI in Orlando.  I would pay on the islands, I would pay it for coastal resorts. But when I look at the number of points I have built up right now in RCI that I can no longer use for Disney exchanges, I am sure considering using up that trading power somehow.  

I may be forced to pay those nonsense fees.  Getting rid of RCI exchange power is my current goal.  Our kids love the Hiltons in Orlando.  I do too.  Ironically, the dates I need for October are not available.  People are paying those fees willingly.  

I have run out of my Marriott and Sheraton weeks to exchange through II and my trading power is all with RCI.


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## TravelTime (May 30, 2022)

zentraveler said:


> FWIW, we have owned FSA for 20+ years and have traded it through II almost exclusively. We have consistently gotten great trades, mostly in Hawaii. We have gotten several over the years for larger units than we deposited (including one at MFC). We have also used a lot of the AC's we have been given for nice trades as well. The Four Seasons desk at II has been very helpful over the years.
> 
> No complaints from us, although as always one's mileage may vary as it certainly seems to.



I am not much of a trader so I am sure my issue has less to do with FSA and more with II. I do not regret purchasing FSA because we won the lottery in 2019 and got the best exchange in the world IMHO…Four Seasons Costa Rica!


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## Quimby4 (May 30, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I am not much of a trader so I am sure my issue has less to do with FSA and more with II. I do not regret purchasing FSA because we won the lottery in 2019 and got the best exchange in the world IMHO…Four Seasons Costa Rica!


Traded thru the FS network or II?


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## TravelTime (May 30, 2022)

Quimby4 said:


> Traded thru the FS network or II?



The only way to exchange into FS Costa Rica with FSA is by winning the lottery, as I said in that post.


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## rickandcindy23 (May 30, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> The only way to exchange into FS Costa Rica with FSA is by winning the lottery, as I said in that post.


But was it II?


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## TravelTime (May 30, 2022)

rickandcindy23 said:


> But was it II?



II does not have a lottery or any deposits for FS Costa Rica. You need to own at FSA and enter the lottery. It is hard to win. We won in our first year of ownership in 2019. We have two EOY odd weeks. You can enter all your weeks in any year you are eligible but after winning, you must skip a year to re-enter that week.

FS Costa Rica does not allow owners to rent their units so the only way to stay there is to pay retail. Even in the lowest season, it is $35,000 a week for the cheapest season there for the same unit. It goes up to $130,000+ a week for the exact same unit during holiday weeks. We stayed there in July which is summer Platinum season so that week is probably $40,000 to $50,000. So the purchase of my two weeks more than covered this stay for many years to come.


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## zentraveler (May 30, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> II does not have a lottery or any deposits for FS Costa Rica. You need to own at FSA and enter the lottery. It is hard to win. We won in our first year of ownership in 2019. We have two EOY odd weeks. You can enter all your weeks in any year you are eligible but after winning, you must skip a year to re-enter that week.
> 
> FS Costa Rica does not allow owners to rent their units so the only way to stay there is to pay retail. Even in the lowest season, it is $35,000 a week for the cheapest season there for the same unit. It goes up to $130,000+ a week for the exact same unit during holiday weeks. We stayed there in July which is summer Platinum season so that week is probably $40,000 to $50,000. So the purchase of my two weeks more than covered this stay for many years to come.


We got to stay there for a full week when it first opened and FSA was still exchanging (for MF's) our week for some of their hotels and properties like FS Costa Rica. Fabulous resort. In the old days it could just be had without a lottery (as were many others that we took advantage of). And to your original point, not sure why II has worked out so well for us.


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## TravelTime (May 30, 2022)

zentraveler said:


> We got to stay there for a full week when it first opened and FSA was still exchanging (for MF's) our week for some of their hotels and properties like FS Costa Rica. Fabulous resort. In the old days it could just be had without a lottery (as were many others that we took advantage of). And to your original point, not sure why II has worked out so well for us.



That was incredible and must have been disappointing when the rules were changed. How long ago was that? Did you stay in the 3BR residence? Just wondering because I thought the 3BR residences were not super old, perhaps the late 2000s, like 2008 or so?


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