# Pros/Cons of WorldMark ownership



## Jarmont (Aug 22, 2022)

Hello all.
Im new to TS’s and I’ve been researching the Worldmark timeshare listings (as suggested by other TUG users) and I must say they don’t look too bad. Quite a few are relatively driveable from my area in Canada (Alberta), and they look to be decent accommodations. When I research more through other sites I see a lot of concern and frustration regarding their online system and their customer service hotline. 

I figured I better go to the forum where the actual experts hang out.

What are the pros and cons of WM ownership? Are the accommodations and benefits for ownership good, any issues with their customer care phone line and online booking system that I keep seeing?
By the looks of available points charts, it looks like 12,000-14,000 points would be sufficient for an annual 1BR or 2BR accommodation at most site (correct or mis-read)?

thank you all

Jarmont


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## Ty1on (Aug 22, 2022)

You should be aware that Worldmark Maintenance Fees are bracketed, and everyone within I believe a 2500 point bracket pays the same Fee amount.  In your example, 14,000 points would cost you the same annual fees as 15,000 points.  I think most savvy owners try to get to a multiple of 5K to minimize their annual cost per point and to help avoid trying to find odd contracts that could get them to a number like 12,500.


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## rickandcindy23 (Aug 22, 2022)

The website for WorldMark used to be great, easy to navigate, and I loved it.  Then Wyndham did what they do, and they made a new website, and it's very tough to navigate, but ironically, it's exactly the same as the Club Wyndham website.  So I can navigate because I am used to Wyndham.  

The program is great.  We own 46,000 points, and we usually don't have to pay for housekeeping.  Every 10,000 points you get one HK fee.  If you own 12,000 points and want to book 5 nights here and another 4 nights there, you may have to pay housekeeping on that second stay.  Just so you know...

Also, guest certificates are $99.  So if you have an adult child you want to add to the membership, I would certainly consider doing that.  You don't want to pay to have your kids use the membership.


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## DaveNV (Aug 22, 2022)

WorldMark as an owned timeshare system works well, if you're clear in what you want, and you can maneuver around the website to do your booking.  Calling in to get help can be a hassle, since the phone people don't usually have much knowledge about how things work.  I suspect a fair amount of the call center is outsourced, so there is an additional challenge of having to explain over and over about the same issue each time you may have to call in.  But as to the WorldMark locations and accommodations - they're very good.  They are not five star places, but then, neither are the maintenance fee prices.  They're well run, clean, and conveniently located.  As in so many things timeshare-related, location is everything.

This link shows the 2022 WorldMark locations.  If those work for you, then it sounds like WM may be a good fit.









						2022 WorldMark Locations - Google My Maps
					

Updated 2/2022




					www.google.com
				




Do not buy from the Developer - definitely buy resale.  You can get an ownership very reasonably, without overspending.  Do your research before you buy.

Dave


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## easyrider (Aug 22, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> WorldMark as an owned timeshare system works well, if you're clear in what you want, and you can maneuver around the website to do your booking.  Calling in to get help can be a hassle, since the phone people don't usually have much knowledge about how things work.  I suspect a fair amount of the call center is outsourced, so there is an additional challenge of having to explain over and over about the same issue each time you may have to call in.  But as to the WorldMark locations and accommodations - they're very good.  They are not five star places, but then, neither are the maintenance fee prices.  They're well run, clean, and conveniently located.  As in so many things timeshare-related, location is everything.
> 
> This link shows the 2022 WorldMark locations.  If those work for you, then it sounds like WM may be a good fit.
> 
> ...



Where did you find the map ? I use that to figure bonus time out routes and it disappeared when they launched the new site.

Bill


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## Jarmont (Aug 22, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> WorldMark as an owned timeshare system works well, if you're clear in what you want, and you can maneuver around the website to do your booking.  Calling in to get help can be a hassle, since the phone people don't usually have much knowledge about how things work.  I suspect a fair amount of the call center is outsourced, so there is an additional challenge of having to explain over and over about the same issue each time you may have to call in.  But as to the WorldMark locations and accommodations - they're very good.  They are not five star places, but then, neither are the maintenance fee prices.  They're well run, clean, and conveniently located.  As in so many things timeshare-related, location is everything.
> 
> This link shows the 2022 WorldMark locations.  If those work for you, then it sounds like WM may be a good fit.
> 
> ...


Hi.
I was under the impression there were European sites or Mediterranean sites with WM. I don’t see any in the map link.
Thanks. J.


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## Ty1on (Aug 22, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> Hi.
> I was under the impression there were European sites or Mediterranean sites with WM. I don’t see any in the map link.
> Thanks. J.



Did you get that in a Sales presentation?  There are a few RCI sites in Europe, mostly far from civilization.  Sales weasels are notorious for taking something you say, such as "We like to visit Europe/The Med" and spin existence of an exchange sites into (dishonest) verbal assurances that Worldmark can get you where you want to go in Europe..  Worldmark doesn't have anything in Europe at all.


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## Passepartout (Aug 22, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> Hi.
> I was under the impression there were European sites or Mediterranean sites with WM. I don’t see any in the map link.
> Thanks. J.


WM or RCI or II, the timeshare offerings in Europe are NOTHING like TSs in the resort areas of N. America and Mexico. There are a few, mostly out in the countryside, NOT in the European cities where Americans want to visit. Europeans LIVE in cities. They want to vacation out in the countryside. There are a few TSs in Spain/Portugal & some golf resorts in Scotland, but generally the facilities are smaller and with less amenities than the US counterparts.


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## bnoble (Aug 22, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> I was under the impression there were European sites or Mediterranean sites with WM.


The directory lists the WM resorts. As a resale owner, you would not have access to Club Pass or Travelshare.









						Demo
					






					cbadb35588.site.internapcdn.net


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## DaveNV (Aug 22, 2022)

easyrider said:


> Where did you find the map ? I use that to figure bonus time out routes and it disappeared when they launched the new site.
> 
> Bill



It was posted on Tug months ago.  I clicked it, then saved a Bookmark to it.  I don't know who made the map, but it includes Moab, so seems pretty current. I don't think it is from WM.  I think a private citizen made it.

Dave


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## Passepartout (Aug 22, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> It was posted on Tug months ago.  I clicked it, then saved a Bookmark to it.  I don't know who made the map, but it includes Moab, so seems pretty current. I don't think it is from WM.  I think a private citizen made it.


That's why they pay you the BIG BUX!


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## DaveNV (Aug 22, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> Hi.
> I was under the impression there were European sites or Mediterranean sites with WM. I don’t see any in the map link.
> Thanks. J.



There are no WorldMark locations in Europe or the Med. If you were told they have locations there, they were either mistaken, or they lied to you. You might be able to arrange an Exchange through an outside company to get to a timeshare in Europe and the Med, but odds are tough, and pickings are very slim.

Think of WorldMark as a mostly western USA and Canada thing.  There are a few locations in Mexico, Florida, and a couple up the East Coast and in the Midwest, but most are in the West.

Dave


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## DaveNV (Aug 22, 2022)

Passepartout said:


> That's why they pay you the BIG BUX!



Oh yeah?  Still waiting for that check to clear...  

Dave


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## Jarmont (Aug 22, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> WorldMark as an owned timeshare system works well, if you're clear in what you want, and you can maneuver around the website to do your booking.  Calling in to get help can be a hassle, since the phone people don't usually have much knowledge about how things work.  I suspect a fair amount of the call center is outsourced, so there is an additional challenge of having to explain over and over about the same issue each time you may have to call in.  But as to the WorldMark locations and accommodations - they're very good.  They are not five star places, but then, neither are the maintenance fee prices.  They're well run, clean, and conveniently located.  As in so many things timeshare-related, location is everything.
> 
> This link shows the 2022 WorldMark locations.  If those work for you, then it sounds like WM may be a good fit.
> 
> ...


Thank you. Do you know if the WM timeshares hold with any value for RCI exchange points?  In case I want to expand to RCI in the future. Thx. J.


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## Hobokie (Aug 22, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> Thank you. Do you know if the WM timeshares hold with any value for RCI exchange points?  In case I want to expand to RCI in the future. Thx. J.


Are you looking to potentially trade into RCI or II? In general, I have found most folks on here prefer Interval International to RCI. 

I can’t speak to Worldmark trading in RCI as I don’t have my WM tied to RCI, but I can speak to how well it trades into II (strong trader) because I have my WM in II.  HOWEVER, I would not get a WM timeshare specifically to trade into II (there are much cheaper and easier ways to trade in II vs getting a points system like WM. 

PS - love my WM!


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## easyrider (Aug 22, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> It was posted on Tug months ago.  I clicked it, then saved a Bookmark to it.  I don't know who made the map, but it includes Moab, so seems pretty current. I don't think it is from WM.  I think a private citizen made it.
> 
> Dave



I think I better save this. Thanks for re-posting it.

Bill


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## DaveNV (Aug 22, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> Thank you. Do you know if the WM timeshares hold with any value for RCI exchange points?  In case I want to expand to RCI in the future. Thx. J.



As @Hobokie said above, WorldMark is a strong trader in Interval International.  But the WM website has a direct link to RCI from there, so that would presume it's worth having.  (Although RCI is owned  by Wyndham, who also own WorldMark, so it may be a "brothers in arms" thing.)  But I also agree, don't buy WM if you plan to just trade it.  The costs will be too high for that.  What makes WM a good value is the cost of the vacations, and the locations where the resorts are found.  A lot of WM locations are near National Parks and high-end tourist destinations.  That makes it worthwhile to many people. It's what drew me to it.  

Case in point:  I have a two-week vacation coming up to WorldMark resorts on two islands in Hawaii.  I booked these last year, so the vacation accommodations are already paid for.  Using 2022 credit costs, this 14-night vacation in 2 bedroom condos, with full kitchens, living rooms, laundry, and two bathrooms, will cost me just $168 per night - in Hawaii - right near the beach. I've stayed in a lot of lousy motel rooms for those kind of rates, and even higher.  So for me, it's win-win.

Dave


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## Jarmont (Aug 22, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> As @Hobokie said above, WorldMark is a strong trader in Interval International.  But the WM website has a direct link to RCI from there, so that would presume it's worth having.  (Although RCI is owned  by Wyndham, who also own WorldMark, so it may be a "brothers in arms" thing.)  But I also agree, don't buy WM if you plan to just trade it.  The costs will be too high for that.  What makes WM a good value is the cost of the vacations, and the locations where the resorts are found.  A lot of WM locations are near National Parks and high-end tourist destinations.  That makes it worthwhile to many people. It's what drew me to it.
> 
> Case in point:  I have a two-week vacation coming up to WorldMark resorts on two islands in Hawaii.  I booked these last year, so the vacation accommodations are already paid for.  Using 2022 credit costs, this 14-night vacation in 2 bedroom condos, with full kitchens, living rooms, laundry, and two bathrooms, will cost me just $168 per night - in Hawaii - right near the beach. I've stayed in a lot of lousy motel rooms for those kind of rates, and even higher.  So for me, it's win-win.
> 
> Dave


Thank you.
I don’t plan on trading the WM right when I purchase a resale. I am just looking at potential options to us down the road. If WM has the resorts that we come to like them trading may not be an option. Thx again. J.


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## jrb916 (Aug 22, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> As @Hobokie said above, WorldMark is a strong trader in Interval International.  But the WM website has a direct link to RCI from there, so that would presume it's worth having.  (Although RCI is owned  by Wyndham, who also own WorldMark, so it may be a "brothers in arms" thing.)  But I also agree, don't buy WM if you plan to just trade it.  The costs will be too high for that.  What makes WM a good value is the cost of the vacations, and the locations where the resorts are found.  A lot of WM locations are near National Parks and high-end tourist destinations.  That makes it worthwhile to many people. It's what drew me to it.
> Dave



Wyndham does not own WM, they are the management company.  WM owners own the credits & locations.  Unfortunately, we pay them to manage & staff the resorts.  Resort staff tell everyone they own WM and that is inaccurate.   We have been very happy with them but only have experience w/ the new website which is the least functional website I have ever used.   We have had 3 great trips & another one planned.   We also visited the Orlando resorts as our contract was processing & were greatly impressed with them.   Rent & see if they are right for you before you buy.   Although, there are some great deals on eBay recently.   Good luck w/ your decision & keep asking questions.  I decided to buy WM based on the great advice here!


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## DaveNV (Aug 22, 2022)

jrb916 said:


> Wyndham does not own WM, they are the management company.  WM owners own the credits & locations.  Unfortunately, we pay them to manage & staff the resorts.  Resort staff tell everyone they own WM and that is inaccurate.



Ok.  But no matter how they are listed on paper, Wyndham as the management company becomes a defacto owner of WorldMark. Why else would the new Worldmark website be an exact replica of the Wyndham website?  When you call the WorldMark call center, half the time the person answering the phone stumbles over their words, and calls you a Wyndham owner.  Why does the website say "WorldMark by Wyndham?" Even the website URL is https://worldmark.wyndhamdestinations.com/  So there isn't much separation of the two.  

Dave


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## geist1223 (Aug 22, 2022)

Wyndham South Pacific (use to be Worldmark South Pacific) has several locations in Europe. Also Australia and New Zealand. But you have to buy Developer Credits to have Access. Those that have WM+A Credits (pre November 2006) also have access.

With Resell WM Credits you have full access to the 90+ Worldmark Resorts, which includes Fiji; Bonus Time; Inventory Specials; and, Monday Madness. Booking high demand Resorts can be a challenge. 

Also checkout the Web Site www.wmowners.com/forum. This is a site by Worldmark Owners for Worldmark Owners.


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## easyrider (Aug 22, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> By the looks of available points charts, it looks like 12,000-14,000 points would be sufficient for an annual 1BR or 2BR accommodation at most site (correct or mis-read)?



Yes, 12,000 and 14,000 is a decent account. Bonus time is a big perk for us. We use bonus time for overnight stays on our drive to Arizona and California. Occasionally we do  motorcycle trips or car trips and stay at WM on bonus time for less than a nice hotel. There really isn't anything too bad. Maybe the sales staff at some resorts are the biggest con. 

Bill


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## Jarmont (Aug 22, 2022)

easyrider said:


> Yes, 12,000 and 14,000 is a decent account. Bonus time is a big perk for us. We use bonus time for overnight stays on our drive to Arizona and California. Occasionally we do  motorcycle trips or car trips and stay at WM on bonus time for less than a nice hotel. There really isn't anything too bad. Maybe the sales staff at some resorts are the biggest con.
> 
> Bill


I’m assuming that you get “bonus time” from attending and purchasing from the presentations?  Can you acquire Bonus Time with resells? J.


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## easyrider (Aug 22, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> I’m assuming that you get “bonus time” from attending and purchasing from the presentations?  Can you acquire Bonus Time with resells? J.



No, bonus time is available to all members. Any inventory that is available at 14 days out can be rented for cash. There are some resort that have exotic bonus time that can be book at 30 days. Guest usage is allowed. For us, guest usage included bonus time stays at the Camlin in Seattle while they operated on my grand daughter. I have a few accounts so I was able to buy alot of bonus time. For me personally, it was Kihei bonus time that saved us when a condo we rented had too many roaches. I expect a few in Hawaii but not a few hundred.

Bill  


Bonus Time gives you access to last-minute WorldMark inventory. If spontaneous getaways are your style, Bonus Time is for you.


Booking window
Owners: 14 days from date of arrival
Guests: 5 days from date of arrival
Guest usage allowed
Yes
Allowed active reservations
One confirmed reservation per account at a time
Maximum length of stay
4 nights
*Exotic Bonus Time*

For a tropical getaway, look to Exotic Bonus Time. Enjoy a stay at the following resorts for a reduced fee-per-credit rate:

WorldMark Coral Baja
WorldMark Fiji
WorldMark Isla Mujeres
WorldMark Kapaa Shore
WorldMark Kihei
WorldMark Kona
WorldMark Elysian Beach Resort
WorldMark Valley Isle
WorldMark Zihuatanejo


Booking window
30 days from date of arrival
Guest usage allowed
Yes
Allowed active reservations
Cannot book more than 30% of the resort's suites
Maximum length of stay
30 nights


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## Jarmont (Aug 22, 2022)

Hmm. Something else to look at. Also something else that could be a bit confusing, lol.
Thanks for this.


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## VacationForever (Aug 22, 2022)

I used RCI from 1996 to 2007, switched to II in 2008 to present day and never looked back.  Quality of resorts is inferior in RCI.


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## Jarmont (Aug 22, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> I used RCI from 1996 to 2007, switched to II in 2008 to present day and never looked back.  Quality of resorts is inferior in RCI.


That’s interesting. Thank you


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## DaveNV (Aug 23, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> Hmm. Something else to look at. Also something else that could be a bit confusing, lol.
> Thanks for this.



WorldMark has a number of other perks, too.  No extra effort required, (such as attending a Presentation and such.)  These are perks all owners can take advantage of.  If you watch for these discounted offerings, you can easily stretch a smaller account into feeling like a larger one.  And since most of these special programs book for cash, it's a great way to save your credits for bigger trips, or to take advantage of specials after your credits have been used.

For example, each week they offer "Monday Madness," where selected resorts (the list changes weekly) are offered to book for cash - I think it's currently 9 cents per credit. There are Inventory Specials, where certain resorts are allowed to be booked for a credit discount during certain days of the week.  A resort that is always busy on the weekends may have availability Monday to Thursday. So Inventory Specials invite owners to book during those less-busy days.  If you need more credits than you have in your account, you can borrow your own credits from your next year's allotment.  You can also rent credits from other owners, up to twice the amount of what you own. So if you want to book a resort that has a higher credit requirement than what you have available, you have options to be able to book it.

All in, WorldMark is a really good system.

Dave


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## WManning (Aug 23, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> WorldMark has a number of other perks, too.  No extra effort required, like attending a Presentation and such.  These are perks all owners can take advantage of.  If you watch for these discounted offerings, you can easily stretch a smaller account into feeling like a larger one.  And since most of these special programs book for cash, it's a great way to save your credits for bigger trips, or to take advantage of specials after your credits have been used.
> 
> For example, each week they offer "Monday Madness," where selected resorts (the list changes weekly) are offered to book for cash - I think it's currently 9 cents per credit. There are Inventory Specials, where certain resorts are allowed to be booked for a credit discount during certain days of the week.  A resort that is always busy on the weekends may have availability Monday to Thursday. So Inventory Specials invite owners to book during those less-busy days.  If you need more credits than you have in your account, you can borrow your own credits from your next year's allotment.  You can also rent credits from other owners, up to twice the amount of what you own. So if you want to book a resort that has a higher credit requirement than what you have available, you have options to be able to book it.
> 
> ...


I would agree! BT, IS & MM great way to streatch a smaller account. All the cash options a great way to save on HK's and the cash cost is less then paying maintenance fees. You have to be able to book at last minute and flexible on travel destinations. I would disagree on attending a presentation!


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## DaveNV (Aug 23, 2022)

WManning said:


> I would disagree on attending a presentation!



I meant that attending a Presentation isn't necessary. 

Dave


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## Jarmont (Aug 23, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> I meant that attending a Presentation isn't necessary.
> 
> Dave


I wondered if that’s what you meant. Lol.
Thanks
J.


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## easyrider (Aug 23, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> Hmm. Something else to look at. Also something else that could be a bit confusing, lol.
> Thanks for this.



On the WM website you have the ability to see all available inventory. An example is WM Banff has a studio available. I have options on how to purchase this and I would choose bonus time. If I choose to use my vacation credits I would have to also use one of my housekeeping tokens so that's not happening. The only reason I would use fax time is if I was out of bonus time and there is no Monday Madness rate available. You see the payment options as you go into the booking stage of the reservation.

Bill

WorldMark Canmore - Banff
Canmore, AB




DATES
08/30/2022→09/01/2022
SUITE TYPE
Studio
TOTAL SUITE COST
1,750 credits


1. Payment options
How would you like to pay for your vacation?
PAY WITH CREDITS
*Vacation Credits* | 1,750 credits
PAY WITH RENTAL OPTION(S)
*Bonus Time* | $160.00
*FAX Time* | $227.50
*Monday Madness* | $160.00


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## Jarmont (Aug 23, 2022)

Thank you to everyone who contributed to this thread. Now to Look into the best WM TS for us and see if it’ll work for us to purchase.
Thanks again everyone.
J.


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## Jarmont (Aug 23, 2022)

easyrider said:


> On the WM website you have the ability to see all available inventory. An example is WM Banff has a studio available. I have options on how to purchase this and I would choose bonus time. If I choose to use my vacation credits I would have to also use one of my housekeeping tokens so that's not happening. The only reason I would use fax time is if I was out of bonus time and there is no Monday Madness rate available. You see the payment options as you go into the booking stage of the reservation.
> 
> Bill
> 
> ...


Can I look at the WM website if I am not an owner yet?


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## easyrider (Aug 23, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> Can I look at the WM website if I am not an owner yet?



Yes. A sales rep would be happy to show you. Maybe you know some one that has a WM account that is willing. I let my brother in law have access to one of my accounts so he could see what it was about.

Bill


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## VacationForever (Aug 23, 2022)

easyrider said:


> Yes. A sales rep would be happy to show you. Maybe you know some one that has a WM account that is willing. I let my brother in law have access to one of my accounts so he could see what it was about.
> 
> Bill


You know that the answer technically is no... You need someone else to show you what is available through their account.


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## easyrider (Aug 23, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> You know that the answer technically is no... You need someone else to show you what is available through their account.



Probably so. I learned by using the account. That is probably the way it goes for most people. With seeing the account and using the account there is a big difference, imo.

Bill


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## VacationForever (Aug 23, 2022)

easyrider said:


> Probably so. I learned by using the account. That is probably the way it goes for most people. With seeing the account and using the account there is a big difference, imo.
> 
> Bill


I have only used the old Worldmark website.  By the way, I am waiting for my account to be set up this week.  The broker put in a request to WM to transfer the account on 7/14, DocuSign was sent to us on 8/18, 5 full weeks later.  We learned that WM had missed my husband's name altogether and the broker went back to WM, got the DocuSign updated, and both of us signed on 8/19.  According to WM, they will take 5 days to complete the transfer, presumably by end of this week, making it 6 weeks.  6 weeks beats 4 months the last time we sold our WM contract in 2017.


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## Jarmont (Aug 23, 2022)

easyrider said:


> Probably so. I learned by using the account. That is probably the way it goes for most people. With seeing the account and using the account there is a big difference, imo.
> 
> Bill


It’s all good.
I don’t know anyone personally that has WM so I may need to contact a sales rep. Thanks. J.


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## geist1223 (Aug 23, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> Thank you to everyone who contributed to this thread. Now to Look into the best WM TS for us and see if it’ll work for us to purchase.
> Thanks again everyone.
> J.



You do not purchase a particular WM Resort. There is no Home Resort. It is a pure Credit System.


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## Jarmont (Aug 23, 2022)

geist1223 said:


> You do not purchase a particular WM Resort. There is no Home Resort. It is a pure Credit System.


So why can I find resorts that have weeks on “sellmttimeshare.com”?  There is a deeded TS for Worldmark Palm Springs and there is no mention of points. If you follow SMTN the ad number is #2065274.


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## easyrider (Aug 23, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> So why can I find resorts that have weeks on “sellmttimeshare.com”?  There is a deeded TS for Worldmark Palm Springs and there is no mention of points. If you follow SMTN the ad number is #2065274.








						WorldMark Palm Springs Timeshare for Sale - $3,000
					

Great WorldMark Palm Springs timeshare resale. Asking price is $3,000. All reasonable offers considered. Make an offer or inquire for additional information today!




					www.sellmytimesharenow.com
				




In the add it does say deeded and under affiliation it says RCI, II and WM. I can't tell if this is a deeded Palms Spring unit or a Worldmark membership but to me it looks like a Palms Spring only membership. Many Worldmark resorts have inventory in resorts with other types of ownership. Eagle Crest, Seaside, Kapa'a, Surfside , Depot Bay are a few of these type. You would have to ask the seller.

If you want a Worldmark you are looking for a point membership. Ebay or the WM facebook group is probably the best place to look for a resale point membership. There are a few resales in the Tug marketplace under points.


Bill


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## Jarmont (Aug 23, 2022)

easyrider said:


> WorldMark Palm Springs Timeshare for Sale - $3,000
> 
> 
> Great WorldMark Palm Springs timeshare resale. Asking price is $3,000. All reasonable offers considered. Make an offer or inquire for additional information today!
> ...


Thank you


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## DaveNV (Aug 23, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> So why can I find resorts that have weeks on “sellmttimeshare.com”?  There is a deeded TS for Worldmark Palm Springs and there is no mention of points. If you follow SMTN the ad number is #2065274.



Your link should read "sellmytimesharenow.com"

I looked at this, and have no idea what it is.  WorldMark does not sell deeded timeshares.  It is a pure credit system, with no underlying deeds. When you buy, you are entered onto a single page of Owner Information for a flat fee of $299.  You don't buy any specific resort.  That SMTN website is known to rip off unsuspecting people for thousands of dollars, and they do nothing but make a listing to "sell"a timeshare, at highly inflated prices.  Since the victim has prepaid them for the listing, SMTN doesn't care if it ever sells.  They already have their money.

If you go look at https://worldmark.wyndhamdestinations.com you can explore the website some, and at least review the resorts.

If you want to see legit WorldMark contracts for resale, look at eBay, wmowners.com, or right here in the Tug Marketplace.  I bought my 12K Wm account on eBay for about $1500.  Heck of a deal.

Dave


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## Jarmont (Aug 23, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> Your link should read "sellmytimesharenow.com"
> 
> I looked at this, and have no idea what it is.  WorldMark does not sell deeded timeshares.  It is a pure credit system, with no underlying deeds. When you buy, you are entered onto a single page of Owner Information for a flat fee of $299.  You don't buy any specific resort.  That SMTN website is known to rip off unsuspecting people for thousands of dollars, and they do nothing but make a listing to "sell"a timeshare, at highly inflated prices.  Since the victim has prepaid them for the listing, SMTN doesn't care if it ever sells.  They already have their money.
> 
> ...


Thank you Dave. I will check the sites you provided. I sincerely apologize for typing the website link incorrectly. My mistake. You said, I believe, that there was a WorldMark Facebook page. Do you have to be a point owner to join?


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## DaveNV (Aug 23, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> Thank you Dave. I will check the sites you provided. I sincerely apologize for typing the website link incorrectly. My mistake. You said, I believe, that there was a WorldMark Facebook page. Do you have to be a point owner to join?



I don't remember saying anything about a Facebook group.  Did I?  I don't follow or subscribe to one, so not sure what I may have meant. But I just searched Facebook, and found a "WorldMark the Club" group page. I haven't seen it before, so have no idea what it's about.  That link is https://www.facebook.com/groups/38541793752 if you want to explore it.

Edited to add:  I just looked over the Facebook page.  It reads like a lot of whiners complaining because they don't know how to use what they own, or are expecting to be spoon-fed things.  Take the site with a large grain of salt, and do your own research. You'll find much better experience right here on Tug, or over at WMowners.com.

The SMTN website is well known among experienced timeshare owners.  They are a PITA because they mislead people who are desperate to get out of their timeshares, many of whom are elderly or otherwise financially compromised.  They are scam artists of the first degree.  Any high praise reviews of them are either fake, or calculated so they can get a good review.

At the end of the day, owning WorldMark is very straightforward.  You buy an account for an agreed purchase price, (resale, of course, and paid off, so there is no outstanding amount owed on the original purchase contract - mine cost me about $1500), and your name is put onto the Owner Information document at WM corporate.  (That's the $299 fee I mentioned above.) That's it.  You now have access to the credit amount in the account annually, to spend as you wish.  When maintenance fees are due, you pay the fixed amount for the amount of credits your account owns. I pay my MFs quarterly, but I think you can pay monthly or annually, too.  You set that up when you are put onto the Owner Information page.  The rest is up to your experience and effort to use the account.  No deed is ever recorded, and it's all a paperwork thing - you pay your maintenance fees, and you receive your credits every year.  You book the resorts you want, and you're charged a certain amount of credits based on unit size, number of days, and time of year.  There are no surprises.

Dave


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## Sandy VDH (Aug 23, 2022)

I purchased a new WM account earlier this year.  I purchased only 5K as I had intended to use it mainly for MM, IS and BT.  So far I have made 5 reservations 2 MM and 3 IS.  I have yet to use my points and cost to use these bonus programs are cheaper than using my points.  I will eventually use my points on some harder to get location that generally is not available for bonus.

I even used IS for 4th of July weekend, as it was available.  Beauty with WM and living in the state of TX, we have 4 WMs within driving distance, and most are available with some MM or IS on a regular basis.


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## kozykritter (Aug 23, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> I have only used the old Worldmark website.  By the way, I am waiting for my account to be set up this week.  The broker put in a request to WM to transfer the account on 7/14, DocuSign was sent to us on 8/18, 5 full weeks later.  We learned that WM had missed my husband's name altogether and the broker went back to WM, got the DocuSign updated, and both of us signed on 8/19.  According to WM, they will take 5 days to complete the transfer, presumably by end of this week, making it 6 weeks.  6 weeks beats 4 months the last time we sold our WM contract in 2017.


That's great and surprising. I signed my DocuSign on 8/16 after a week delay because they got my email address wrong originally and sent it off to oblivion. The reseller WMcredits.net told me it takes WM up to 30 days to do the title change after signing and usually 3 to 4 weeks in their experience. Who shared the 5 day timeline with you? Should I be calling WM and bugging them, I wonder?


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## DaveNV (Aug 23, 2022)

kozykritter said:


> That's great and surprising. I signed my DocuSign on 8/16 after a week delay because they got my email address wrong originally and sent it off to oblivion. The reseller WMcredits.net told me it takes WM up to 30 days to do the title change after signing and usually 3 to 4 weeks in their experience. Who shared the 5 day timeline with you? Should I be calling WM and bugging them, I wonder?



I'd hold off another week or so and see what happens.  When I bought my WM account it took every bit of 90 days to do the transfer.  30 days would be nice.  I also read here where somebody got theirs done in something like 5 days.  That's amazing.  But considering it's just replacing the old owner info with the new owners' info, it should be easy to do.

Dave


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## kozykritter (Aug 23, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> I'd hold off another week or so and see what happens.  When I bought my WM account it took every bit of 90 days to do the transfer.  30 days would be nice.  I also read here where somebody got theirs done in something like 5 days.  That's amazing.  But considering it's just replacing the old owner info with the new owners' info, it should be easy to do.
> 
> Dave


Right? It took 6 weeks to get the DocuSign and when I saw how little information it needed I was shocked it would take so long just for that little bit. How could it possibly take 30 days to change the name after that? I guess you can't push the river unless you want to drown


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## DaveNV (Aug 23, 2022)

kozykritter said:


> Right? It took 6 weeks to get the DocuSign and when I saw how little information it needed I was shocked it would take so long just for that little bit. How could it possibly take 30 days to change the name after that? I guess you can't push the river unless you want to drown



Yes.  And my guess is the people at WM doing the resale transfers are also doing Developer WM sales setups, and Wyndham contracts, both of which probably have higher priority.  So there is no rush to do anything in a hurry.  That was why that five days thing sounded so amazing.  Be patient, and maybe you'll be surprised.

Dave


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## VacationForever (Aug 23, 2022)

kozykritter said:


> That's great and surprising. I signed my DocuSign on 8/16 after a week delay because they got my email address wrong originally and sent it off to oblivion. The reseller WMcredits.net told me it takes WM up to 30 days to do the title change after signing and usually 3 to 4 weeks in their experience. Who shared the 5 day timeline with you? Should I be calling WM and bugging them, I wonder?


Basically my contract needs to be sped up as 2020 credits will go down the drain once anniversary month rolls over, hence their agreement to expedite the transfer.


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## kozykritter (Aug 23, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> Basically my contract needs to be sped up as 2020 credits will go down the drain once anniversary month rolls over, hence their agreement to expedite the transfer.


I hope it works out. Fingers crossed! My contract is barren except for the new credits issued in June so no problem being in line behind you.


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## VacationForever (Aug 24, 2022)

kozykritter said:


> I hope it works out. Fingers crossed! My contract is barren except for the new credits issued in June so no problem being in line behind you.


Essentially I will get 3 years of credits, now we have to figure out where we can book for summer when there is still availability by the time the contract transfers.  We bought a 35K contract, what size contract did you buy?


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## kozykritter (Aug 24, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> Essentially I will get 3 years of credits, now we have to figure out where we can book for summer when there is still availability by the time the contract transfers.  We bought a 35K contract, what size contract did you buy?


10K. I will probably wait list for a week for next summer but if I don't get it that's fine cuz I'm okay letting credits build up for a couple years and then borrow or rent credits and take a big trip.


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## VacationForever (Aug 24, 2022)

kozykritter said:


> 10K. I will probably wait list for a week for next summer but if I don't get it that's fine cuz I'm okay letting credits build up for a couple years and then borrow or rent credits and take a big trip.


The first time we bought WM was for a 10K contract which was fully loaded and we went everywhere.  By the time we sold the contract 3 years later, we sold it full loaded.  I still don't believe how much the 10K contract stretched.  Now with a 35K contract, which has 105K available without borrowing, I need to quickly use 35K of that to book something before they expire at end of month.  Good problem to have for sure.


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## DaveNV (Aug 24, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> Essentially I will get 3 years of credits, now we have to figure out where we can book for summer when there is still availability by the time the contract transfers.



Book anything you can as far out as possible to hold those expiring credits. Then when you find something you really want, call in and have them book the one you want, and cancel the one you don't want. If you do it yourself, you'll lose the expired credits. If they do it they can save them for you.

Dave


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## geist1223 (Aug 24, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> So why can I find resorts that have weeks on “sellmttimeshare.com”?  There is a deeded TS for Worldmark Palm Springs and there is no mention of points. If you follow SMTN the ad number is #2065274.




There are many Online Sale sites that require a Resort be listed. We have been Worldmark Members for 20 years. There is no Home Resort. There are no Deeds. I would not trust a site that claims to selling a Deed to a Worldmark Timeshare


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## Ramona (Sep 26, 2022)

Sandy VDH said:


> I purchased a new WM account earlier this year.  I purchased only 5K as I had intended to use it mainly for MM, IS and BT.  So far I have made 5 reservations 2 MM and 3 IS.  I have yet to use my points and cost to use these bonus programs are cheaper than using my points.  I will eventually use my points on some harder to get location that generally is not available for bonus.
> 
> I even used IS for 4th of July weekend, as it was available.  Beauty with WM and living in the state of TX, we have 4 WMs within driving distance, and most are available with some MM or IS on a regular basis.



What is MM and IS? BT must be Bonus Time?


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## DaveNV (Sep 26, 2022)

Ramona said:


> What is MM and IS? BT must be Bonus Time?



Monday Madness and Inventory Specials. Two other programs WM offers members.  BT is Bonus Time.

Dave


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## Ramona (Sep 26, 2022)

Thanks Dave!


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## DaveNV (Sep 26, 2022)

Ramona said:


> Thanks Dave!



As you've probably figured out, WorldMark has a number of ways you can stretch your ownership into something larger.  These other programs (MM, IS, BT) offer discounted rates, or you can pay in cash instead of credits to book something.  You can also borrow your own credits from next year. You also can rent credits from another owner (up to twice the amount you own, per year.)  So you don't have to buy a larger account unless you expect you'll use it all, and the other options won't serve your needs.

The biggest thing to know about WorldMark is where resorts are located.  They are mainly in the western USA.  Few on the East Coast, and only a few available overseas to resale buyers.  If it fits your needs, WorldMark is a great system to own.  It's not five stars, but three to four stars in most cases.  I just returned from a two week trip to Hawaii, staying a week at a time in two different WM resort locations (Big Island and Maui.)  It was great, and I'd do it again anytime.

Dave


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## ronparise (Sep 26, 2022)

jrb916 said:


> Wyndham does not own WM, they are the management company.  WM owners own the credits & locations.  Unfortunately, we pay them to manage & staff the resorts.  Resort staff tell everyone they own WM and that is inaccurate.   We have been very happy with them but only have experience w/ the new website which is the least functional website I have ever used.   We have had 3 great trips & another one planned.   We also visited the Orlando resorts as our contract was processing & were greatly impressed with them.   Rent & see if they are right for you before you buy.   Although, there are some great deals on eBay recently.   Good luck w/ your decision & keep asking questions.  I decided to buy WM based on the great advice here!




Wyndham as you say does not own  Worldmark the Club,   Whats your point?
 Wyndham is a real estate  developer and property manager.  When it comes to Worldmark they bought (and own) two things, 1) the exclusive right to develop new worldmark properties, which they give to the club, in exchange for credits that they can sell and 2) they own the management contract  

The way I see it is that Wyndham may not own Worldmark, but they do own what matters... and there is no club without them.


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## NateB (Oct 3, 2022)

Hobokie said:


> Are you looking to potentially trade into RCI or II? In general, I have found most folks on here prefer Interval International to RCI.
> 
> I can’t speak to Worldmark trading in RCI as I don’t have my WM tied to RCI, but I can speak to how well it trades into II (strong trader) because I have my WM in II.  HOWEVER, I would not get a WM timeshare specifically to trade into II (there are much cheaper and easier ways to trade in II vs getting a points system like WM.
> 
> PS - love my WM!


Can you offer advice on "much cheaper and easier ways to trade in II vs. getting a pts system like WM". I have an RCI weeks and points account but have never used II. I would like access to the higher level properties offered in II. I am a digital nomad and travel extensively. I like to book within 30 days to get the discounted points/weeks value that RCI offers in those cases.  Not sure if II works similarly.  Thanks.


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## rickandcindy23 (Oct 3, 2022)

The website is so glitchy.  Wyndham ruined our easy-to-use WorldMark website.  I am so disappointed.


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## jules54 (Oct 8, 2022)

[As a long-time member, you know you can't solicit rentals in the discussion forums.]


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## 2BlackKitties (Oct 9, 2022)

Jarmont said:


> I’m assuming that you get “bonus time” from attending and purchasing from the presentations?  Can you acquire Bonus Time with resells? J.


Greetings.  I believe you may be referring to Wyndham Rewards points for attending sales presentations.  Those points are used for staying at Wyndham hotels (e.g., La Quinta).  I love those points because we use them on our road trips when we just want to stay someplace for one night while we are on our way to a WorldMark or Club Wyndham resort.  We'll be doing that next week!


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## lotus5 (Nov 28, 2022)

bnoble said:


> The directory lists the WM resorts. As a resale owner, you would not have access to Club Pass or Travelshare.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Is it worth buying a small chunk of developer points to get Club Pass and Traveshare?


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## DaveNV (Nov 28, 2022)

lotus5 said:


> Is it worth buying a small chunk of developer points to get Club Pass and Traveshare?



I'd say No.  The timeframes to book resorts are shorter, and the fees are higher.  The best resorts tend to book out quickly, so there may not be any availability when those shorter windows open up.

WorldMark has good value in the industry.  If it were me just starting out, I'd buy the smallest contract possible, (I think that's 5000 credits), on the resale market (check eBay for typically good pricing, also Redweek, WMOwners.com, and Tug's marketplace.)  Try it and see if it works for you.  Learn the system, both ups and downs of it, and then decide if you want more.  If you do, it's easy to buy additional contracts to give you more credits (since credits can be transferred at will between contracts, you can move things to suit your booking needs), until you tweak things to suit your travel needs.  If you decide it isn't for you, it's easy to resell a WM account.  All in, an easy way to go.

Since you're in Blaine, you're right at the edge of the WM resort world.  And if you're just across the border from Blaine, same thing - lots of availability right near you. Nice thing is, WM speaks both sides of the Border.  (I used to live in Birch Bay.)

Good luck!

Dave


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## geist1223 (Nov 28, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> (I used to live in Birch Bay.)
> Dave



Having visited Birch Bay last September I can not understand anyone choosing to live there. We left after 6 days.


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## DaveNV (Nov 28, 2022)

geist1223 said:


> Having visited Birch Bay last September I can not understand anyone choosing to live there. We left after 6 days.



I lived down the road from the beach for awhile, but basically grew up in that county.  Nobody should ever think Birch Bay could ever be as nice as ANY beach in Oregon.  You folks have it great there. Birch Bay is the last stop northbound, more or less, before the Canadian Border. Population, shopping, nightlife, indoor entertainment, and general activities are very, very limited.  Weather is sketchy, at best (although the Oregon Coast is similar.) A lot of Canadians own property in Birch Bay, so they can get a foot in the door on the USA side of the Border.  As a result, there are way more houses than there are people most of the time.  Just coming out of Covid-forced quarantine and Border shutdowns, I'm not at all surprised you didn't enjoy yourself there.  You kind of have to bring your own fun, and dial back your expectations.

But if you want to walk on a deserted beach most of the time, enjoy a tremendous amount of peace and quiet, and experience incredible sunsets, it's a pretty special place.  Ssshh!  Don't tell anyone.

Dave


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## geist1223 (Nov 29, 2022)

Many of the people we met were either from Canada and had USA relatives they would meet at Birch Bay or were from the USA and would meet Canadian relatives there. Even the locals recommended driving to Bellingham to go out for meals. Could not find a decent Breakfast Restaurant in Birch Bay.


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## LizardKing (Dec 30, 2022)

Worldmark Housekeeping fees are a big negative. They have shot up in the last couple of years. You get charged a flat fee whether you stay for one night or seven nights. It is a big disincentive for staying for shorter periods. You get 1 housekeeping token for each 10,000 of points, after that it is an expensive fee each time you book. You should be able to purchase extra housekeeping with your Worldmark points, but you can't.

Proceed with Caution.


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## VacationForever (Dec 30, 2022)

LizardKing said:


> Worldmark Housekeeping fees are a big negative. They have shot up in the last couple of years. You get charged a flat fee whether you stay for one night or seven nights. It is a big disincentive for staying for shorter periods. You get 1 housekeeping token for each 10,000 of points, after that it is an expensive fee each time you book. You should be able to purchase extra housekeeping with your Worldmark points, but you can't.
> 
> Proceed with Caution.


It depends on how you use your ownership.  I own 35K points and have never used up my housekeeping tokens.  I had one leftover for Sept 2022 usage, and likely to have another one or two for Sept 2023.  We use WM for longer stays to get away from summer heat, and possibly in the winter to get away from the cold in the future as well. I also let all 4 guest certificates go to waste each year.


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## DaveNV (Dec 30, 2022)

LizardKing said:


> Worldmark Housekeeping fees are a big negative. They have shot up in the last couple of years. You get charged a flat fee whether you stay for one night or seven nights. It is a big disincentive for staying for shorter periods. You get 1 housekeeping token for each 10,000 of points, after that it is an expensive fee each time you book. You should be able to purchase extra housekeeping with your Worldmark points, but you can't.
> 
> Proceed with Caution.



To add to what @VacationForever said above, there are ways around the fee.  If you book through Bonus Time and such, for example, housekeeping credits are included in the booking - so you don't pay extra. You need to factor in the HK price if you pay extra, yes, but if you amortize the vacation costs to include that fee, it averages out.  If you do a lot of one-night stays, then it seems high, but you're paying the same fee for a week's stay - which makes the daily cost much lower.  Compare the prices you're paying WorldMark (even with the housekeeping fee) vs. the cost of a hotel room these days, and you're well ahead of the game.

Definitely requires advance planning.

Dave


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## markb53 (Dec 31, 2022)

DaveNV said:


> To add to what @VacationForever said above, there are ways around the fee.  If you book through Bonus Time and such, for example, housekeeping credits are included in the booking - so you don't pay extra. You need to factor in the HK price if you pay extra, yes, but if you amortize the vacation costs to include that fee, it averages out.  If you do a lot of one-night stays, then it seems high, but you're paying the same fee for a week's stay - which makes the daily cost much lower.  Compare the prices you're paying WorldMark (even with the housekeeping fee) vs. the cost of a hotel room these days, and you're well ahead of the game.
> 
> Definitely requires advance planning.
> 
> ...



I often use even FAX time for short stays  especially 1 night reservation if I have to book them ahead when I am not sure they will show up in MM or IS. Here is an example. This is for Angels Camp in January for 1 night in a 1BR the Credit cost is 700 credits
Using credits costs for 2022 not 2023 which starts tomorrow.
$68.60 Cost My cost for 700 credits
$106.00 2022 Cost for HK
$16.65 TOT Tax
$191.25 Total

Using FAX time the most expensive cash cost
$91.00 Fax time cost. If I used inventory special this cost would be $80.00
$10.92 Tax
$101.29. Total cost.

It is often less expensive to use IS or MM and sometimes FAX for short stays than to use your credits and pay for an HK. Notice in this example the HK is more than the total cost with Fax Time.


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## DaveNV (Jan 1, 2023)

markb53 said:


> I often use even FAX time for short stays  especially 1 night reservation if I have to book them ahead when I am not sure they will show up in MM or IS. Here is an example. This is for Angels Camp in January for 1 night in a 1BR the Credit cost is 700 credits
> Using credits costs for 2022 not 2023 which starts tomorrow.
> $68.60 Cost My cost for 700 credits
> $106.00 2022 Cost for HK
> ...



Thank you.  That's exactly what I was talking about.  There are ways around the fees, but you need to plan ahead.

Dave


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