# Very Disappointed



## malago (Mar 2, 2011)

Well.....March is here and none of my trades have come thru.... HHI or Myrtle Beach for Aug. 2011.   Been waiting since September...... now, i don't even know where to trade into....not long before August is here...... (kids vacation).   Any suggestions where i can trade into (An Aruba 2BR Gold) and maybe get some luck and get into.....would like something that has a beach....It's been a brutal winter here New York.......


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## DebBrown (Mar 2, 2011)

You still may get one of those.  Because its a driveable destination, people don't always make final plans too far ahead.

We own at Swallowtail in Sea Pines at HHI and if I deposit, it is usually right before the 60 day mark.  We always debate whether or not to use every year.  We often deposit or rent and then stay somewhere pet friendly.

Deb


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## CMF (Mar 2, 2011)

I suggest adding Manor Club to the mix.  Beautiful resort, lots of history, great amusement parks.

Charles


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## luvgoldns (Mar 2, 2011)

malago said:


> Well.....March is here and none of my trades have come thru.... HHI or Myrtle Beach for Aug. 2011. Been waiting since September...... now, i don't even know where to trade into....not long before August is here...... (kids vacation). Any suggestions where i can trade into (An Aruba 2BR Gold) and maybe get some luck and get into.....would like something that has a beach....It's been a brutal winter here New York.......


 
Do you have enough MR points to hold a hotel week?  That's what I do so I know I'm going (wherever) it's just a matter of where I'm going to stay.

ileneg


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## TJCNewYork (Mar 2, 2011)

*Consider II's ShortStay Exchange in Orlando for August*

As illustrated below, II's ShortStay Exchange shows availability for up to 6 night stays in Orlando.  You could deposit one of your weeks and book up to 12 nights.  For example, if your schedule permits back-to-back stays, you could book the first week at a 2 Bedroom in Royal Palms starting Aug 6th and book the second stay at a 2 Bedroom in Sabal Palms starting Aug 12th.  

If you are set on booking Marriott, there is availability at Royal, Sabal, Grande Vista, Cypress Harbour and Harbour Lake which check-in through Aug 23.  With the exception of GV there are 2 bedroom villas.  Do note that II Gold is required to book ShortStays but you can see if what is available meets your family's needs before upgrading if you haven't already.

Hope this helps you with a backup plan and best wishes with your II requests coming through.


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## yumdrey (Mar 2, 2011)

Sorry to hear about your unsuccesful II trade.
I have summer HHI week which I didn't deposit (yet), I am keep thinking if I should or not.
I tried to rent the week, but if I cannot find a renter by early April, I will deposit my week. So please be patient, I believe most owners (in HHI & myrtle beach) go the same path like me


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## bobcat (Mar 3, 2011)

malago said:


> Well.....March is here and none of my trades have come thru.... HHI or Myrtle Beach for Aug. 2011.   Been waiting since September...... now, i don't even know where to trade into....not long before August is here...... (kids vacation).   Any suggestions where i can trade into (An Aruba 2BR Gold) and maybe get some luck and get into.....would like something that has a beach....It's been a brutal winter here New York.......



The timeshares you are trying to trade into are not easy. Everybody wants the beach in Summer. With airfares high and money tight, many owners are using their weeks in the Summer. We live at the SE N C coastal beach. We own at the Barony. We go every year the first week of Sept. That week is even booked up. I would try for some different trades. We are right by a 12 mile beach. The town has 7500 people. In the Summer it goes to 30,000. Traffic and alot of tourists.  Good luck.


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## enma (Mar 3, 2011)

I would not give all the hope up yet. My trade just came thru for June that II kept telling me it is a tough trade. Lots of owners probably have not deposited their weeks yet.


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## Stefa (Mar 3, 2011)

If you would consider Florida, you could add Ocean Pointe and Oceana Palms to the request.


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## malago (Mar 3, 2011)

Thank you for all your kind suggestions.  I am going to add a few more properties to my ongoing request and hopefully something will come thru.   I think i was spoil because in the last 2 years when i traded the same Aruba week for HHI and Myrtle beach (Aug. 2009 and 2010) trades come thru in one month time..... would put trade in sept. and by oct. it would happen.......guess not this time


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## djs113 (Mar 3, 2011)

don't know which week in august you are looking for - but if its the last week in august going into labor day weekend - i may be able to help

check your IM

- david


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## jdunn1 (Mar 3, 2011)

Something is going on with all the Marriott summer beach weeks this year.  I'm sorry to say this, but it's more than just Myrtle Beach and Hilton Head. Even the Florida properties (with the exception of Doral and a bulk banking of Pannama City) are or have been unavailable to exchangers this year.  I've posted several times about this but it seems as though the DC has taken all the good beach weeks this year and also, many owners have not yet deposited their summer beach weeks.

I've had an exchange request in for any Marriott summer beach week, (i.e. Myrtle Beach, Hilton Head and all of Florida) since October/November.  I am using a platinum Marriott week as an exchange.  Back in October/November, there were several studios and a handful of one bedroom Florida beach weeks but that has been it.

I hope what some owners have posted is true, that the have simply not depostied their week, yet -- but I think it is more than that.

I do want to also add that since I began my search, I included all gold crown Myrtle Beach properties and I haven't received a match on any of those properties, either -- so I do think a lot of owners are using their week this year, or they have not deposited yet, or they are trying to rent.

I'm tired of waiting for a match, though.  Good luck with your search.  Lots of people in the same boat, though.

I wonder if the high gas prices this summer will keep many people from renting weeks at top dollar and sooner than later those renters will give up and deposit those weeks.


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## HudsHut (Mar 4, 2011)

enma said:


> I would not give all the hope up yet. My trade just came thru for June that II kept telling me it is a tough trade. Lots of owners probably have not deposited their weeks yet.



Which resort/week did you trade for?


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## TJCNewYork (Mar 4, 2011)

jdunn1 said:


> I hope what some owners have posted is true, that the have simply not depostied their week, yet -- but I think it is more than that.



For additional insight that may or may not correlate with these observations, see Message #48 in an earlier thread, Recorded Trust Documents.  

In December, I received a Bonus Week Offer (AC) from Interval for both my July 4 and Labor Day weeks in Orlando (but not other weeks). We jumped for the AC and deposited the Labor Day week, hoping that we could string together 2 ShortStays with the AC for almost 3 weeks. 

Friends of ours who also own in Orlando, Williamsburg, Las Vegas and Seaview did not receive this offer.  They have not deposited their weeks - hoping for a Bonus Week offer.  They are probably in good company.  

Bottom line, there are several factors contributing to the lack of inventory for exchanges - and the wait is both disappointing and frustrating.


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## enma (Mar 5, 2011)

hudshut said:


> Which resort/week did you trade for?



I traded 1 bedroom Grande Vista Platinum week for Marriott Village d’Ile de France in June. I only had one weekend for check-in dates. II kept telling me it would be hard. I kind of wondered why because I have made the trade successfully in the past. It did take much longer this time but so glad I got it finally.


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## ml855 (Mar 6, 2011)

I also gave up on my trade request through II.  I had a request going since Fall, 2009 for Myrtle Beach and HHI for this upcoming summer and finally gave up.  I decided to take a Royal Sands week in Cancun for summer, 2012 instead, we also love this resort.  

This summer, 2011 we're renting from an owner, by renting we're getting the week and view we want.  We thought about buying resale into Myrtle Beach but decided to rent instead.

I also believe something is going on with all the summer beach weeks, this is the first year in the last 4, I haven't been able to pick up this exchange.


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## rudy (Mar 6, 2011)

*Be patient*

I suspect Marriott is not only holding all of their inventory ( both owned and via Marriott Reward traders) but also  grabbing every HHI summer beach vacation time for the   points owners or potential points users.  

Both Marriott and owners who rent are likely to turn in their villas to HHI at the last minute within the  30-60 days.

I just came back from Marriott's Ko-Olina Beach club  in Hawaii and about 40% of the people I talked to were non-owners and nearly all of them got their trade within the last 30-60 days.

Good luck!


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## saturn28 (Mar 6, 2011)

malago said:


> Well.....March is here and none of my trades have come thru.... HHI or Myrtle Beach for Aug. 2011.   Been waiting since September...... now, i don't even know where to trade into....not long before August is here...... (kids vacation).   Any suggestions where i can trade into (An Aruba 2BR Gold) and maybe get some luck and get into.....would like something that has a beach....It's been a brutal winter here New York.......



You should have joined the Marriott Destination Points program. I have found availability at SurfWatch, Barony, Ocean Watch, and Grande Ocean in June and July. Those were all in the last 3 weeks through Destination Points. I have found the Destination Points system works great. Even places like Aruba during March and April, has shown availability in the last month. This is just by calling in and asking what is available.


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## dioxide45 (Mar 6, 2011)

rudy said:


> I suspect Marriott is not only holding all of their inventory ( both owned and via Marriott Reward traders) but also  grabbing every HHI summer beach vacation time for the   points owners or potential points users.





			
				Exchange Procedures said:
			
		

> Exchange Company shall have the right to forecast anticipated reservations and use of the Accommodations and is authorized to demand balance, reserve, deposit, or rent the Accommodations for the purpose of facilitating the use or future use of the Accommodations or other benefits made available to Members through the program in it's sole discretion



This gives MVCI a lot of leeway is "hoarding" inventory. I think however that in future years you will see it loosen up some. Currently MVCI doesn't have any history to really go from, once they have a few years under their belt with DC, they will be better able to accurately forecast use. Currently they think their program is so grande that everyone is going to want to use points that they are wanting to get as much inventory as they can. They will end up depositing lots of that in II when it goes unused.


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## GrayFal (Mar 6, 2011)

saturn28 said:


> *You should have joined the Marriott Destination Points program. *I have found availability at SurfWatch, Barony, Ocean Watch, and Grande Ocean in June and July. Those were all in the last 3 weeks through Destination Points. I have found the Destination Points system works great. Even places like Aruba during March and April, has shown availability in the last month. This is just by calling in and asking what is available.


No - Marriott should not be screwing their Loyal Owners - I am a 10 year owner of 4, now 3 Platinum weeks (and responsible for the sale of 30+ more weeks to friends) and they are withholding and/or withdrawing weeks from II inventory to 'save' for people who paid their 'ransom' money to protect their investments.

I am glad u r happy but sad it has to be on my back and other owners who were happy with the old program. Just read all the threads here of people who have happily traded thru II for years.....very very sad indeed.


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## wof45 (Mar 6, 2011)

GrayFal said:


> No - Marriott should not be screwing their Loyal Owners - I am a 10 year owner of 4, now 3 Platinum weeks (and responsible for the sale of 30+ more weeks to friends) and they are withholding and/or withdrawing weeks from II inventory to 'save' for people who paid their 'ransom' money to protect their investments.(



I could make the opposite argument --

people who are buying DC points through the Trust are also Loyal Owners, so why should the weeks that they own part of be deposited into II until they have a chance to reserve these weeks?

Reservation lead time depends on points owned, so they need to reserve weeks to be reserved by people who are not premium members, and even for people who own trust points but are not DC members.

it would be easy to make the case that MVCI should not deposit extra weeks to II until flexchange time.


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## dioxide45 (Mar 6, 2011)

wof45 said:


> I could make the opposite argument --
> 
> people who are buying DC points through the Trust are also Loyal Owners, so why should the weeks that they own part of be deposited into II until they have a chance to reserve these weeks?
> 
> ...



If Marriott is pulling these prime weeks from II, it begs the question, what is it offering back to II in exchange? It doesn't seem that they are giving II back equally prime weeks (one for one). If that were the case, it would balance itself out, which doesn't appear to be happening.

Are they instead giving II multiple lower demand/shoulder season weeks that in IIs eyes is equal to the week Marriott took back.

If that is the case, it is good for II in a way that they can get two or more exchange fees out of those multiple weeks instead of just one. That is if they can exchange out those two or more weeks and not lose any of them to breakage.


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## saturn28 (Mar 6, 2011)

GrayFal said:


> No - Marriott should not be screwing their Loyal Owners - I am a 10 year owner of 4, now 3 Platinum weeks (and responsible for the sale of 30+ more weeks to friends) and they are withholding and/or withdrawing weeks from II inventory to 'save' for people who paid their 'ransom' money to protect their investments.
> 
> I am glad u r happy but sad it has to be on my back and other owners who were happy with the old program. Just read all the threads here of people who have happily traded thru II for years.....very very sad indeed.



I am sorry for that. I was happy with the old system as well. But I took the leap and must say that I am happy with the availability of normally difficult to get weeks at high demand resorts. I just took the view that things always change in life and sometimes you have to roll with it. 

One thing I have noticed is sometimes the agents put me on hold when checking inventory. I beleive they must be checking another pool of inventory because they usually come back on and say there is availability.


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## GrayFal (Mar 6, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> *If Marriott is pulling these prime weeks from II, it begs the question, what is it offering back to II in exchange? It doesn't seem that they are giving II back equally prime weeks (one for one). If that were the case, it would balance itself out, which doesn't appear to be happening*.
> 
> Are they instead giving II multiple lower demand/shoulder season weeks that in IIs eyes is equal to the week Marriott took back.
> 
> If that is the case, it is good for II in a way that they can get two or more exchange fees out of those multiple weeks instead of just one. That is if they can exchange out those two or more weeks and not lose any of them to breakage.



Agree



saturn28 said:


> I am sorry for that. I was happy with the old system as well. But I took the leap and must say that I am happy with the availability of normally difficult to get weeks at high demand resorts.* I just took the view that things always change in life and sometimes you have to roll with it. *
> One thing I have noticed is sometimes the agents put me on hold when checking inventory. *I believe they must be checking another pool of inventory because they usually come back on and say there is availability*.



I would have leapt if there had been an equitable deal - I felt it was not. No need to rehash that and thank you for not 'jumping' on me for my negative response to your post.

It is always difficult to change and I looked forward to the Marriott one but had hoped it would have been modeled after the Starwood System which granted the top resorts mostly the same amount of points but still gave you home resort booking priority.....didn't happen and the numbers just didn't make sense to me.

In the past, the trades I have made have been for additional time at the Aruba Surf/Ocean Club in March - using other Marriott weeks or Westin Weeks with ongoing searches getting the match.....when u get the confirmation, it has the owners name on the exchange. These units NEVER said "developer" although I have had Developer on other exchanges I have made to other resorts. (correction - trades made when the Aruba Surf Club first opened in 2004 were developer weeks)
It is my impression that the Platinum Time at Aruba Ocean/Surf Club is pretty much sold out - certainly at the Ocean Club - so these exchanges I have made in the past were owner deposited weeks....my question is, where have these owner deposited weeks gone????

*Answer - see dioxide's post above*  *as well as your statement of "checking another source" for those weeks given to DC Club members*


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## saturn28 (Mar 6, 2011)

GrayFal said:


> Agree
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I can tell you that there is no shortage of weeks at Ocean Club and Surf Club for Destination Points owners. I call in all the time and ask about availability at those resorts, and I can tell you that there has been a lot of availability during the winter at Surf Club and Ocean Club. So, the answer to your question about where the platinum week have gone, they are been held in the Destination Points system. That is just my opinion. It may not be fact.


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## davemy (Mar 6, 2011)

I agree with Grayfal all the way!!! Very unhappy with summer trades so far.


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## GeNioS (Mar 6, 2011)

When I have gone to Coachella in the past, I have traded into Palm Desert without any problem.  There has always been an abundance of all types of units for months leading up to the music festival.  I've never seen Palm Springs as being a tough trade.  In fact, I've always considered Palm Springs "Orlando West" when it came to trading.  If I couldn't get any trades and needed a place to go, it seems I could always count on those two places.

This year I passed up on a 1 br week 6 months ago because I've never had a problem getting a 2 bedroom.  I may have to sell my tickets this year because nothing is available.  Not any size.  Nothing is available even in the non festival weeks before and after.  I've haven't seen anything like it.

The funny part is that Marriott is laughing at someone like me.  I can hear them saying exactly as I read on here,"You should have joined the club."  So yep they're laughing at me for not joining...laughing at the guy that paid retail for a timeshare that I could have bought for 90% off had I known better.  So I guess it's the second time they're laughing at me.  And according to some people, the answer would be to give them even more money and join up in the club?  I can't wait....in another five or six years, Marriott will come up with a way to fleece the destination club members and they'll be laughing again.

Fool me once, shame on you.  Fool me twice, shame on me.  Fool me three times, I must own a timeshare.


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## GrayFal (Mar 6, 2011)

saturn28 said:


> *I can tell you that there is no shortage of weeks at Ocean Club and Surf Club for Destination Points owners. I call in all the time and ask about availability at those resorts, and I can tell you that there has been a lot of availability during the winter at Surf Club and Ocean Club*. So, the answer to your question about where the platinum week have gone, they are been held in the Destination Points system. That is just my opinion. It may not be fact.



I assumed they had been taken back from II by Marriott - I have had a request in since October using a 1BR Platinum Marriott week to exchange in to week 1 studio/1BR unit in Aruba .....

Probably not going to happen for me - and next year II will not get my Marriott deposits - so then where will Marriott get its' Platinum high demand inventory to give to the DC Members?

Oh the web we weave!


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## saturn28 (Mar 6, 2011)

GrayFal said:


> I assumed they had been taken back from II by Marriott - I have had a request in since October using a 1BR Platinum Marriott week to exchange in to week 1 studio/1BR unit in Aruba .....
> 
> Probably not going to happen for me - and next year II will not get my Marriott deposits - so then where will Marriott get its' Platinum high demand inventory to give to the DC Members?
> 
> Oh the web we weave!


What date are you looking for. I will check tomorrow and see if it is available.


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## GrayFal (Mar 6, 2011)

saturn28 said:


> I can tell you that there is no shortage of weeks at Ocean Club and Surf Club for Destination Points owners. I call in all the time and ask about availability at those resorts, and I can tell you that there has been a lot of availability during the winter at Surf Club and Ocean Club. So, the answer to your question about where the platinum week have gone, they are been held in the Destination Points system. That is just my opinion. It may not be fact.





saturn28 said:


> What date are you looking for. I will check tomorrow and see if it is available.


12/31/11 or 1/1/12 Surf or Ocean Club - studio or 1BR.


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## Serina (Mar 6, 2011)

davemy said:


> I agree with Grayfal all the way!!! Very unhappy with summer trades so far.



Count me in on being unhappy with summer trades so far! 

I will have to think long and hard (and see some changes in the II/Marriott system) before I would consider depositing my weeks with II next year too.


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## dioxide45 (Mar 6, 2011)

Serina said:


> Count me in on being unhappy with summer trades so far!
> 
> I will have to think long and hard (and see some changes in the II/Marriott system) before I would consider depositing my weeks with II next year too.



It seems to turn in to a catch 22. You don't get what you want so you don't deposit, it reduces inventory in II. Others feel the same, so they then don't deposit. So it becomes a vicious cycle. More reason to pay Marriott to enroll in DC


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## vacationcrazy (Mar 6, 2011)

Saturn 28

Are the Aruba weeks you are seeing for 2012 or 2011 with the points and are the points legacy points or DC points? We went to a presentation at Grand Chateau last week.  The salesman basically told us we were crazy for not enrolling in the points program. He said we will not have any availabily to trade in the future.  I questioned him on the difference between legacy points and DC points and he confirmed they are from different pools, so basically if you have legacy points you still do not have the option to trade for units in the 
DC trust.  I still do not see the advantage to join when I only own one week resale. Does anyone have a different view on this? He also said the minimum DC points you can purchase now is 1500 and they are now $9.80 per point.  He said Marriott is excercising Rofr on all units that sell for less than half of the price the units were originally sold for.  I told him some of the units on e-bay especially Grand Chateau are selling very cheap.  He said no way will the sale go through and Marriott will be buying all of those back.  Has anyone experienced this?


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## GrayFal (Mar 6, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> It seems to turn in to a catch 22. You don't get what you want so you don't deposit, it reduces inventory in II. Others feel the same, so they then don't deposit. So it becomes a vicious cycle.* More reason to pay Marriott to enroll in DC*



Not really - if the owners of the prime Platinum weeks don't deposit them into II, Marriott will not be able to raid the II deposits to get the prime time to give to the destination club members.....so the legacy destination club owners will just start using their weeks and either rent when they don't use or deposit with different exchange companies.

The New "non-week" DC Club members can fight over the low season/unsaleable inventory that Marriott is using to back the club point ownerships with, no??? 

I will happily use or rent two of my three Platinum weeks and the third I will give the 1BR to SFX and probably still deposit the studio in II for flex-change exchanges.....so before II would get 3-6 Marriott deposits from me, now they will get maybe one....
My friends who own the 30+ weeks I mentioned earlier in this thread are pretty much doing the same thing....no more Prime deposits to II as they can not be trusted to give us equitable trades any longer - II can't be in bed with Marriott and satisfy me, too.


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## thinze3 (Mar 6, 2011)

FYI.  I had a trade come through last week for a late June 2BR unit at Barony Beach.  I used a 3BR Grand Vista week 53 that I purchased from Marriott's "gift of time".


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## GrayFal (Mar 6, 2011)

thinze3 said:


> FYI.  I had a trade come through last week for a late June 2BR unit at Barony Beach.  I used a 3BR Grand Vista week 53 that I purchased from Marriott's "gift of time".


Good for you!


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## ilene13 (Mar 7, 2011)

GrayFal said:


> 12/31/11 or 1/1/12 Surf or Ocean Club - studio or 1BR.



I know that the majority of owners at the Ocean and Surf Clubs who have the dates you are looking for do NOT exchange them if they are not using them---they rent them.  I have a 1 bedroom from 12-30 to 1-6 that I am not using--I am in the final negotiations to rent it.  I am using my other 2 weeks!  Look at both the TUG and Redweek listings.


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## GrayFal (Mar 7, 2011)

ilene13 said:


> I know that the majority of owners at the Ocean and Surf Clubs who have the dates you are looking for do NOT exchange them if they are not using them---they rent them.  I have a 1 bedroom from 12-30 to 1-6 that I am not using--I am in the final negotiations to rent it.  I am using my other 2 weeks!  Look at both the TUG and Redweek listings.



I am a Surf Club owner - have traded in that date (12/28-30 for a studio unit) before by depositing a strong trader 1BR, requesting 14 months out and accepting a studio. Date Sunday 1/1 and Monday 1/2 are actually week 1 and can be reserved at the Surf Club by regular Plat owners and of course 1/1 by all Ocean Club Plats - I have a resie already for 1/1-1/8/12.

I knew someone would post the "owners always rent" mantra so I just wanted to counter that I have traded for this and other high demand weeks at the Ocean and Surf Club - I have also rented my owned week(s) in the past as well. 

This is what this thread is about - loss of ability to trade thru II as in the past.


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## puckmanfl (Mar 7, 2011)

good morning....

ilene...
How do you know that 51% of owners of Platinum Aruba use or rent???  Last Spring break, I snagged a Plat Plus mid march spring break week at Surf Club thru II. Just for giggles, at the check in line, I asked loudly, "How many people here are exchangers???  80% of the line flashed II certificates..I believe the number of traders would shock you...

A factoid from MVCD...  Over 25% of owners (even at the sold out joints) convert to MR points..

MVCD has a huge inventory of these units in addition to the ones they snag from delinquencies and foreclosures.  This inventory used to go for bulk II deposits and rentals.  Now they go to DC program. This shift of inventory explains the diminished II weeks exchanges  and the great oppportunities in DC.  I believe there is some MVCD /II manipulation of inventory, but MVCD must replace any unit snageed from II with an equal unit as well...


I have snagged 4 ski week units in Park City, Kauai Lagoons in Summer, Surf Watch in July all with Legacy points. (no trust points).  The salesperson scam of buying more points to make your Legacy points work better is horse hockey.

Without rehashing 25 old threads, MVCD has changed the game with the new opportunities in the DC (this is where the action is). Legacy owners can snag these points by enrolling at a fraction of the $$$$ that new owners are paying.  My 14,000 points came in at $6/point and 0.35$ pt/MF (developer original purchaser).  If you were smart enuf to buy resale before 6/20, evenwith the $1995 enrollment, you are still way ahead..

My advice to Legacy owners...
#1 enroll
#2 use points (don't wait list) call your Voa and if you like an exchange convert the unit to points n the spot.
#3 DO NOT purchase Trust points thinking the magic wand is waved making your Legacy points better.  

#4 ENJOY....

PerryM said it best...

"when the rules change, just exploit them differently"....


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## Cmore (Mar 7, 2011)

puckmanfl said:


> ....Without rehashing 25 old threads, MVCD has changed the game with the new opportunities in the DC (this is where the action is). Legacy owners can snag these points by enrolling at a fraction of the $$$$ that new owners are paying....
> 
> My advice to Legacy owners...
> #1 enroll
> ...



You are correct, Sir!


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## saturn28 (Mar 7, 2011)

GrayFal said:


> 12/31/11 or 1/1/12 Surf or Ocean Club - studio or 1BR.



I called in and they have either your December 31st or January 1st check-in dates available at the Marriott Aruba Surf Club in a studio with either an oceanside or oceanview. There is nothing available at the Ocean Club. In addition, there are no one bedrooms available at this time. Any thing that is not available, one would have to go on the wait list to get.


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## Born2Travel (Mar 7, 2011)

GrayFal said:


> No - Marriott should not be screwing their Loyal Owners - I am a 10 year owner of 4, now 3 Platinum weeks (and responsible for the sale of 30+ more weeks to friends) and they are withholding and/or withdrawing weeks from II inventory to 'save' for people who paid their 'ransom' money to protect their investments.
> 
> I am glad u r happy but sad it has to be on my back and other owners who were happy with the old program. Just read all the threads here of people who have happily traded thru II for years.....very very sad indeed.


 

Agree with you Pat - I see this happening with other ts now also - Worldmark is one of them - I was happy with what I bought but now they're wanting ransom money for me to be at the "top" tier they've created when previoiusly there was ONE tier and owners were equal.  I still have what I bought into, but now they've devalued my ownership.


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## ilene13 (Mar 7, 2011)

puckmanfl said:


> good morning....
> 
> ilene...
> How do you know that 51% of owners of Platinum Aruba use or rent???  Last Spring break, I snagged a Plat Plus mid march spring break week at Surf Club thru II. Just for giggles, at the check in line, I asked loudly, "How many people here are exchangers???  80% of the line flashed II certificates..I believe the number of traders would shock you...
> ...



I said the majority which at Christmas and New Years, (which is what the OP is talking about), could actually be more.  I have never met an exchanger weeks 51 and 52, there could be some, there are many, many renters.  We have owned at the OC since 2001 and we have gone there annually since then(wks 51 and 52).  We are legacy owners and we will NEVER join DC points.  The 13,500 DC points I would receive for my 4 platinum weeks would never give me 4 vacation weeks at at similar resorts during high season.
 Thus far I have not had trouble making reservations using my weeks and I plan to continue doing so.


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## puckmanfl (Mar 7, 2011)

good evening...

ilene

oops my bad... I did not realize you meant fixed plat plus weeks (Xmas/new years).  I agree that most of these owners occupy or rent.  Sorry, I didn't read your post more carefully...

once again, my apologies....


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## SueDonJ (Mar 7, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> If Marriott is pulling these prime weeks from II, it begs the question, what is it offering back to II in exchange? It doesn't seem that they are giving II back equally prime weeks (one for one). If that were the case, it would balance itself out, which doesn't appear to be happening.
> 
> Are they instead giving II multiple lower demand/shoulder season weeks that in IIs eyes is equal to the week Marriott took back.
> 
> If that is the case, it is good for II in a way that they can get two or more exchange fees out of those multiple weeks instead of just one. That is if they can exchange out those two or more weeks and not lose any of them to breakage.



I'm beginning to wonder if Marriott has to deposit a like-for-like exchange when they take from II to satisfy a DC request.  Many folks have been able to get uptrades from II for all these years and they didn't have to compensate II in any way; why do we now expect that Marriott must?  I know that's what TUGgers decided must have to happen, but have we ever seen an actual rule stating that?

I haven't made an II request this year so don't have anything to add to that equation, but I was able to use DC Points back in July for a late-June, 2011 (Plat season) exchange into Grande Ocean, and then cancel that when a same-six-days Barony DC exchange became available a couple months later.


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## ilene13 (Mar 7, 2011)

puckmanfl said:


> good evening...
> 
> ilene
> 
> ...



My weeks aren't fixed but I've been lucky enough to book week 51, 52 and a second week 52--which my children use.  When they don't I rent it.


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## puckmanfl (Mar 7, 2011)

good evening...

 ilene ...

you should still try DC.  I took my plat GV week for 3725 pts and used it for TWO 5 day stays at Summit Watch next Jan (ski time) for a TOTAL of 4000 pts (2000 for each unit).  My 7 days in Florida became 9.5 days of ski time!! Even with the skim I love it.

I took 2 IV waiohais and converted to a 3 bedroom OF at Kauai Lagoons.  Took the 1500 pts left over and snagged another 1 bedroom studio for 5 days at Summitt Watch this Feb...

The beauty of it for Legacy owners is that enrolling doesn't exclude using weeks as well.  WE have OPTIONS and points is just one of them...

Unfortunately, it is a fixed sum game.  The II trading opportunites lost are made up in DC...  Just ask SueDon, she snagged some summer HHI as well.  Anther poster added to an Aruba stay...


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## dioxide45 (Mar 7, 2011)

SueDonJ said:


> I'm beginning to wonder if Marriott has to deposit a like-for-like exchange when they take from II to satisfy a DC request.  Many folks have been able to get uptrades from II for all these years and they didn't have to compensate II in any way; why do we now expect that Marriott must?  I know that's what TUGgers decided must have to happen, but have we ever seen an actual rule stating that?



The "uptrades" that many people get here are only uptrades to them. To II they are an equal exchange, otherwise they wouldn't happen. Is our Grande Vista studio Memorial week equal to a 2BR April week at Barony, according to II yes. Some here see it as an uptrade, in DC points it would be an uptrade. As far as II is concerned it is even steven or could even be a downtrade.

I agree that we really don't know what is happening between II and Marriott. Is Marriott placing request with trust inventory just like you or I would do with out weeks? Or is there another agreement there?

However the weeks that Marriott seems to be hoarding are prime inventory, summer HHI, winter Aruba. There is very little chance my lowly studio would grab 2BR units during that time. I doubt II is taking the same to give them to Marriott.


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## dioxide45 (Mar 7, 2011)

puckmanfl said:


> good evening...
> 
> ilene ...
> 
> you should still try DC.  I took my plat GV week for 3725 pts and used it for TWO 5 day stays at Summit Watch next Jan (ski time) for a TOTAL of 4000 pts (2000 for each unit).  My 7 days in Florida became 9.5 days of ski time!! Even with the skim I love it.



How did a 3725 point MGV deposit get you 4000 worth of time through DC? It doesn't seem to add up...


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## GrayFal (Mar 7, 2011)

ilene13 said:


> I know that the majority of owners at the Ocean and Surf Clubs who have the dates you are looking for do NOT exchange them if they are not using them---they rent them.  I have a 1 bedroom from 12-30 to 1-6 that I am not using--I am in the final negotiations to rent it.  I am using my other 2 weeks!  Look at both the TUG and Redweek listings.





saturn28 said:


> I called in and they have either your December 31st or January 1st check-in dates available at the Marriott Aruba Surf Club in a studio with either an oceanside or oceanview. There is nothing available at the Ocean Club. In addition, there are no one bedrooms available at this time. Any thing that is not available, one would have to go on the wait list to get.


Thank you, Since this is being held for destination club members, I can not access this inventory - in the past, I would have gotten this exchange thru II.



dioxide45 said:


> How did a 3725 point MGV deposit get you 4000 worth of time through DC? It doesn't seem to add up...


And the poster gave up 7 2BR nights to get 9.5 1BR nights - rather then 7 1BR and 7 studio = 14 nights - also does not add up in my book.


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## dioxide45 (Mar 7, 2011)

GrayFal said:


> And the poster gave up 7 2BR nights to get 9.5 1BR nights - rather then 7 1BR and 7 studio = 14 nights - also does not add up in my book.



I think puck did get two 5 night stays in a 2BR at SW. They appear to be Sun-Fri stays. Those for January are 2000 points on the chart. I am thinking some PlusPoints were used in there?


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## dioxide45 (Mar 7, 2011)

I read a lot on here where people say that those that don't use their prime weeks end up renting them. In reality I think this is a stretch. For the most part people either don't know, don't care to, or don't want to bother renting their weeks. If 70% of the people stay on their home resort reservation, I would bet there are not any more than 10% actually renting them out. That leaves a lot of inventory that still finds it's way in to II or DC. Not everyone out there is savvy like the Tuggers here.

I think one of the things that will cause some issues going forward are those resorts/season that were offered very high point allocations. This would be Hawaii, and HHI summer weeks. There is plenty of incentive for those people to deposit their weeks for points when they want to exchange. Why deposit in to II and get one exchange when you can deposit in to DC and have some extra time left over to use or carry over to the next year.

This will make some prime inventory tough to get through II if a high percentage of these people deposit to DC. Because of the high point allocations there was also great incentive for them to enroll. If the enrollment rates are at 15% overall, I think it is safe to assume that the percentage of enrollees that own prime resort/seasons is closer to 50% or more and closer to 2-5% for off season and less desirable properties.


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## puckmanfl (Mar 8, 2011)

good morning....

yes...

the points don't exactly add up.  I have 13,866 points(11,500 in even years and 16,000) in odd.  The point I was trying to make is that 7 nites can become 9 using flexibility of points.  Please also keep in mind that the 7 nites were Orlando which became 9.5 ski nites.  These were 2 bedroom units!!!

My Orlando unit is 3 bedrooms GV plat.  I don't do math in terms of bedrooms.  A two bedroom Plat skiweek at Mountainside is worth more (by any accounting method rental/points/sale price) than a Feb 3 bedroom (even Presweek) in Orlando (when I purchased developer I paid 20k.  Thus , not only did I make 7 nites into 9.5 I traded up in the process in terms of quality of room...Yes, I was able to take advantage of Sun-Thurs flexibility...

The Lagoons trade was 2 (2 bedroom) IV waiohiais in exchange for 7 nites in a 3 bedroom OF + 5 nites ski studio Feb in Park City at Summit Watch.  If I was willing to accept Garden View at KL this summer, I would have kept 2000 more points as change.  Since view doesn't mean much to me(I don't stay in the room until dark anyway) I still might change and save another 2000 points. I have until 3/27 to do this...

Please remember that weeks works great too.  I also snagged a 2 bedroom Mountainside this past Feb. using a studio  (orlando) on Flexchange...

Legacy owners have options!!!!

I suggest being flexible and trying them....


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## m61376 (Mar 8, 2011)

Dioxide- What you've posted above makes a lot of sense. While there is a lot of incentive for certain high demand property owners to enroll and use the DC for trades (HH, Hawaii, and a few others), point allocations for many other properties, combined with the skim factor, will likely result in far fewer deposits, even if legacy owners enroll. For example, while Caribbean weeks are a "good buy" with respect to point cost, they are a bad deal wrt point allocation. Thus, while many such owners may have enrolled (and I'm guessing that many of the enrollees enrolled without really understanding what the true exchange value of their week would be), when they "see" what their weeks buys elsewhere in points I suspect they will continue to trade in II or rent unused weeks.

Especially as the economy rebounds and rental rates likely creep up as travel demand increases, I would expect that owners of high demand properties will rent them if not exchanging in II. Esp. over the winter (although this applies to many Gold weeks as well), Aruba weeks have had characteristically high rental rates. Marriott itself rents many nights in excess of $850 per night, plus taxes. I assume other Caribbean properties command high rental rates as well, although perhaps not as high as Aruba's. I would be surprised if Caribbean week owners flock to exchange for points that won't be sufficient, in many cases, to reserve a week that Marriott itself charges three-quarters  to half the price for. So I would expect there to be a shortage of such "good point value" high demand weeks in the system for point reservations. Personally, I would rather rent my week and then use the funds to rent elsewhere, or arrange trades personally via the Tug marketplace.

Besides Caribbean weeks, there are several other high demand properties (NCV summer weeks, for ex.) where the point allocation pales in comparison to the exchange value in II or the rental value of the week, and I anticipate that there will be limited availability for point reservations from owner exchanges for points.

However- and I think this goes back to what several earlier posters talked about- the unknown here is whether Marriott is sequestering those II deposits into the DC program, and gets back to the question of what Marriott considers like for like exchanges. IF Marriott is nabbing those high demand weeks for its points program, what is it giving II in return? Like Grayfal, I am looking for an Aruba exchange for next winter. Even though I am looking for a specific Feb. arrival date, since I am looking for a studio I would have expected a match as the first deposits were made at the 12 month mark. I haven't seen a single week online in II for next winter. Of course, they may have been matched elsewhere and thus not showing up, but I do find it curious that I haven't seen one online despite frequent checks. 

It is too soon to tell, but initial appearances do make me question assurances I was given, as well as many others (as well as what was implied by the post on II's website several months back) that when Marriott exchanged for properties in II it would have to deposit an equivalent trade. It goes back to what is their definition of equivalent- prime week for prime week, or perhaps prime weeks for two off season weeks?


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## wof45 (Mar 8, 2011)

most of us don't want to go through the hassle of renting our places or the uncertainty.  a lot of us also are looking for something specific.

yesterday, we cancelled our waitlist for MFC, and took eight days at Beachplace next February including my wife's birthday - Saturday to Sunday since our limit is vacations days.

we also added a Saturday to our Oceanna Palms II trade this December, so it is now also eight days.

If airfares continue to rise, more people will think about adding days for the same trip.


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## wvacations (Mar 10, 2011)

I too cancelled my II request first for Ko Olina for the first week of November. I had the request in using DSV II Thanksgiving week 2BR trying to get 2BR for first week of November. Request has been in since mid-November. Checked everyday  3 or 4 times a day and never once saw anything other than flexchange for any Hawaii Marriott. Seeing as I only had 1 week I could go since work schedule has already been set, and that we are celebrating my Dad’s 75th birthday and my 50th I found the week to be too important to keep waiting. I was calling DC every other day and they always had units available any size and view. Finally decided I had to do  what I said I would never do, trade the Thanksgiving DSV II 2BR for points, then add the 800 points for enrolling, and still had to borrow 1100 points from my 2012 DSV I White week to book a 2BR GV Penthouse for Ko Olina on the week I wanted. Not the ideal situation, but at least the waiting is over and we can get on with getting FF tickets, rental cars and so forth as now we know the check in date! Not ideal but as they say you have to “roll with the changes!” Just glad I have enough weeks to salvage vacations under the new system. 5 lock off weeks no longer equates to 10 weeks but at least I am still able to go on vacation so I have to happy about that! 

Now I am in the process of renting enough points to get another 2BR for the rest of the family for the same week! Not even going to try and play the II game for the second unit. Maybe as II starts losing deposits because no one can get the weeks they need, maybe they will hold Marriott accountable if in fact Marriott DC is snaging all the II deposits.


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## m61376 (Mar 10, 2011)

I have not joined, nor do I see any value in joining wrt trading my weeks in for points. But I do fear whether II will remain a viable system if Marriott nabs many/most of the prime weeks for their DC. As Greg has pointed out, the real benefit to membership may lie in renting points from others for making reservations.

As wvacations has outlined, sometimes firming up plans is more important than waiting for the better deal to hopefully work out. Personally, I am looking for a studio to complement my 2BR for a specific week and arrival date in Feb.. In other years I would have expected it to match when the first reservations/deposits were made. Hopefully it still will. But @.50 per point, it would cost me $1125 for enough points to reserve the week in question, which is probably a little more than renting a room for 2 nights even with the MOD discount. So I can foresee this being a real benefit over time, and allow for variable needs from year to year. It is ironic, but that may ultimately be the deciding factor and I may join to keep that option open.


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## GrayFal (Jun 18, 2011)

On June 11th I got a confirmation from II for a studio at Marriott Aruba Ocean Club January 1,2012 using a Willow Ridge Branson 1br July 4th week. 

Happy it happened. 

Still on 
the fence about joining DC 



saturn28 said:


> I can tell you that there is no shortage of weeks at Ocean Club and Surf Club for Destination Points owners. I call in all the time and ask about availability at those resorts, and I can tell you that there has been a lot of availability during the winter at Surf Club and Ocean Club. So, the answer to your question about where the platinum week have gone, they are been held in the Destination Points system. That is just my opinion. It may not be fact.





GrayFal said:


> I assumed they had been taken back from II by Marriott - I have had a request in since October using a 1BR Platinum Marriott week to exchange in to week 1 studio/1BR unit in Aruba .....
> 
> Probably not going to happen for me - and next year II will not get my Marriott deposits - so then where will Marriott get its' Platinum high demand inventory to give to the DC Members?
> 
> Oh the web we weave!





GrayFal said:


> 12/31/11 or 1/1/12 Surf or Ocean Club - studio or 1BR.


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## ilene13 (Jun 18, 2011)

GrayFal said:


> On June 11th I got a confirmation from II for a studio at Marriott Aruba Ocean Club January 1,2012 using a Willow Ridge Branson 1br July 4th week.
> 
> Happy it happened.
> 
> ...



We haven't joined the DC program.  We will see you in Aruba in Jan.  We'll be there from DEc 19-Jan2
ilene


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## bogey21 (Jun 18, 2011)

What I am reading is "It used to be easy, but now it isn't".  What changed?  Marriott changed.  Get used to it!!

George


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## dioxide45 (Jun 18, 2011)

bogey21 said:


> What I am reading is "It used to be easy, but now it isn't".  What changed?  Marriott changed.  Get used to it!!
> 
> George



Do you even own a Marriott?


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## m61376 (Jun 18, 2011)

I too landed up getting the exchange I wanted a couple of months ago, for a Feb. SC week for the exact arrival date I needed. So despite the apparent relative shortage of Plat. Aruba weeks in II, it seems like at least some weeks are being matched for regular week trades.


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## bogey21 (Jun 18, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> Do you even own a Marriott?



Yes.  I owned pre-construction at Sabal Palms, Harbour Club, and Heritage Club.  I owned a Monarch Crown Suite purchased in the secondary market.  

I sold Sabal, Harbour and Heritage (breaking about even) back when Marriott started changing their rental and sales programs which I had found invaluable.  I held onto Monarch a while longer but sold the Week (at a $15K profit) about 7 years ago when I became totally disallusioned with Marriott.

I took about 5% of the money I received from selling my Marriotts and bought 8  Weeks at smaller resorts in places like Mesquite, NV; North Myrtle Beach, SC; Deerfield Beach, FL; Biloxi, MS; Galveston, TX; Dillon, CO; and Ruidoso, NM.

When health and Father Time started catching up with me I sold one of these smaller independent resorts on TUG; sold one thru the Resort's Sales Department; Deeded three back to their respective HOAs (just by making phone calls); and still own three.

George


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## Beverley (Jun 20, 2011)

wof45 said:


> I could make the opposite argument --
> 
> people who are buying DC points through the Trust are also Loyal Owners, so why should the weeks that they own part of be deposited into II until they have a chance to reserve these weeks?
> 
> ...



Because an owner is supposed to hold the choice of what to do with their week.  

If the owner places it with II then it should stay with II and be awarded to another who has a request to be filled through II.  Not "pulled" to make reservations available for non premier enrolled or trust owners.  This week is a week that was already reserved.. If Marriott tampers with the II system, it could jeopardize the entire workability of the core concept of timeshare ownership.  

Beverley


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## chrisalberts77 (Aug 2, 2011)

Yup, beach! Everyone love it in long cold winter. Hawaii and Bahamas are just two of the places where you should spend your vacation.


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