# Purchased Retail HGVMax; I want to rescind, my Wife doesn't...what to do!



## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

Hi All-
First off, thanks for taking time to read this post. I appreciate any advice I can get. Newbie here, as you can tell from rest of my ignorance below ;P
On Monday, July 11th (4 days ago, so still in the 7-day rescinscion period), we purchased a retail HGVMax membership out of an Orlando Grand Vacations club. 
Here are the terms: 
$25K cost. 
8,800 clubpoints (will get us a 2-bd every other year, which is what we need for our family)
Every other year terms, starting in 2023
$910 maintenance (paid every other year)
$281 club dues (paid every year) 
25,000 bonus club points good for 2 years 

I'm seriously considering rescinding it given resale prices are so much lower (and unfortunately not something I researched ahead of time). However, my Wife does not as she feels the 3 weeks added at sign-on offsets the cost enough and that we'd use the HGVMax benefits, which, from my understanding aren't available with resale? I think this includes access to more clubs and open-season/cash-based rates to other properties, cruises? That isn't super clear to me.  
If I look at the 25K bonus club points, and put a 2-bd suite at $400 a night? (I suppose that comes to about $3K a week, so $9K worth of value?). That would bring it down to 16K since we were planning to take those 3 weeks of vacations anyway to Hawaii and Australia. So is the $16K product worth more to us for how we are using it versus say a $5K resale? 

*I don't know what question I'm really asking here except if my rationale and thinking is valid to reasonably support a retail purchase or am I over-rationalizing it to feel good about my wife's stance and should just essentially push back and get this thing rescinded? *

Thanks for any input


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## CalGalTraveler (Jul 14, 2022)

Welcome to TUG. Rescind now. Tell your wife that you need to do more research e.g. resale or other properties retail before you can spend this much money.  You wouldn't buy a car for this price without research, right?

That deal will be there if you research and want it later. You only have once chance to rescind or you will be stuck with something you haven't researched. Rescind to buy yourself time. There is no rush.


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## RX8 (Jul 14, 2022)

^^^^ best advice


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## HuskerATL (Jul 14, 2022)

Which resort in Orlando?  Actually, you can get the same timeshare for almost free or an annual one for a couple grand..if that.  So purchase price wise, this is a big waste of money.  

If you buy resale, you will not be in Max but there is nothing in Max yet anyway.  You also won't get bonus points...but some resale do come with current year points that are already paid for...so, sort of, bonus points.  

Orlando has higher maintenance fees than some others.  I would look at Vegas, if you are just looking for cheap price and MFs.  Orlando always has openings so I would not worry about owning there to stay there.  Points are points so you can use them anywhere.

I would rescind, by following the directions in the contract and then do some research. If you decide later to buy retail, HGV will always gladly sell you one.


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## vacationtime1 (Jul 14, 2022)

Show your wife this page (listing HGVC resales):





						Elara by Hilton Grand Vacations Timeshares For Sale | RedWeek
					

Buy a timeshare directly from Elara by Hilton Grand Vacations owners, starting at just $35. Resales are almost always 30 - 50% cheaper than buying the same unit from the resort!




					www.redweek.com


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## TheTimeTraveler (Jul 14, 2022)

.

RESCIND NOW while you still can legally rescind.   Note:  You can always go back to purchase again, but you can only rescind for a few short days.

Study up on TUG, do your homework, keep your hands in your pocket (save money) and buy resale.

Do think about becoming a TUG member.  It will be the best $15 you spend.......  Welcome to TUG.




.


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## dboeger1 (Jul 14, 2022)

For what it's worth, I'm not one of these religious NEVER-BUY-RETAIL types, because I think it depends if you have the money and if they're offering what you want... but that being said, we just recently bought HGV Max retail, rescinded a few days later, and our sales guy immediately called and offered us the same package for $7,200 less than we paid, even though our deal was supposedly them bending over backwards to honor an outdated Diamond Resorts sampler contract. They're pretty desperate to get people to buy in, and the prices are such that they have a lot of wiggle room, so you can almost certainly get a better deal later by rescinding, even if you do decide to buy retail.

HGV Max is a bit confusing and fuzzy, but my understanding is these are the main selling points:


Access to HGV and DRI properties.
Ability to use HGV points to book Hilton hotels.
Open season / cash deals.

The sales rep had a lot of trouble showing us actual points availability, in part because he wasn't willing to log into his personal account to show actual examples, which past reps have done for us. However, he did show us several open season cash deals well below market rate, which was nice to see. I think it looks like a decent program, but I doubt you're getting some screaming detail from the developer.


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## HuskerATL (Jul 14, 2022)

vacationtime1 said:


> Show your wife this page (listing HGVC resales):
> 
> 
> 
> ...


or this page: https://tug2.com/timeshare-classifieds/search/results.aspx?hilton&ResortName=hilton&ForSale=True

example:


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## HuskerATL (Jul 14, 2022)

dboeger1 said:


> For what it's worth, I'm not one of these religious NEVER-BUY-RETAIL types, because I think it depends if you have the money and if they're offering what you want... but that being said, we just recently bought HGV Max retail, rescinded a few days later, and our sales guy immediately called and offered us the same package for $7,200 less than we paid, even though our deal was supposedly them bending over backwards to honor an outdated Diamond Resorts sampler contract. They're pretty desperate to get people to buy in, and the prices are such that they have a lot of wiggle room, so you can almost certainly get a better deal later by rescinding, even if you do decide to buy retail.
> 
> HGV Max is a bit confusing and fuzzy, but my understanding is these are the main selling points:
> 
> ...


All HGVClub Legacy retail and resale owners already get 2) and 3) so it is really just 1) that Max gives you..for Legacy owners they get access to DRI at 6 months but none of it is available yet.  For 2), you don't book Hilton, you convert HGV points to HH and then you can use those HH points to book Hilton hotels.


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## Iggyearl (Jul 14, 2022)

It sounds like you want to please your wife - doesn't everybody?  But ask yourself - did you purchase a timeshare from HGVC?  Or were you sold a timeshare?  Did you say, "We want to think it over?"  And they found all the reason not to do it today.  Final question - Did you pay cash, and could you afford to do so without hurting?  The price of your purchase just shot up if you financed it.  Unless you have money lying around, and need to get rid of it, rescind and start studying.


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## BingoBangoBongo (Jul 14, 2022)

After a quick scan of the point charts for many resorts it appears that you bought a 2BR Grand Plus Gold deed at Elara.  It's not a bad deed, but you can do much better on a resale purchase, and honestly no one has any experience with Max yet.  If it were my wife (who loves to shop), I would tell her that unlike a clothing store, this same product or a better one will be available if you decide to go the retail route after some more research.  The telling part of your original post is you stating your uncertainty on the questions you're asking.  I bought an Every Year ELara 1BR Grand Platinum at the end of 2020 for about $5000, and that now has 11,200 points.  I feel that deed would bring close to that if I decided to sell it today.  Your's at best would be worth less than $2500.  

In your post you mention using the bonus points for Hawaii and Australia, but don't mention if these are typical trips for you or when and where you might want to go.  This could impact on what type of deed you buy.


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## Passepartout (Jul 14, 2022)

Here's the thing to be sure your wife understands: Timeshares acquired at resale are EXACTLY the same as those bought from the developer. Just without the sales department's markup. ALL timeshares are used. When you check in, someone slept in the bed, ate off the dishes, sat on the couch whether they bought retail or resale. The only difference is that the owners who bought resale have more money to spend elsewhere.

Jim


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## dayooper (Jul 14, 2022)

@MrHodgieman What Max perks does your wife think you will use? Salesman stretch the truth all the time on the use of perks, many of which are really only useful with high points. The game is they get their foot in the door by selling families a small contract that they think they can easily use, but, in reality are little more difficult. So you go to another update where they tell you what you bought is useless and sell you a larger contract. This keeps on going until you get wise and stop going to sales presentations. 

Here’s the thing, you only get one chance to rescind, but the deal you got (or a better one) will always be available. Once the recession period is up, you are stuck with what you bought, but you can always buy from HGVC.


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## geist1223 (Jul 14, 2022)

As others have said Rescind. Or perhaps get a new wife and in the divorce give her this time share.


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

HuskerATL said:


> Which resort in Orlando?  Actually, you can get the same timeshare for almost free or an annual one for a couple grand..if that.  So purchase price wise, this is a big waste of money.
> 
> If you buy resale, you will not be in Max but there is nothing in Max yet anyway.  You also won't get bonus points...but some resale do come with current year points that are already paid for...so, sort of, bonus points.
> 
> ...


It's the Parc Soleil but we bought a week at the las Vegas Elara as our salesperson said the maintenance is lower. I do think our sales guy was being transparent (relatively), he even highlighted the ROFR from Hilton and how they buy back at a much lower %. 
Thank you!


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Welcome to TUG. Rescind now. Tell your wife that you need to do more research e.g. resale or other properties retail before you can spend this much money.  You wouldn't buy a car for this price without research, right?
> 
> That deal will be there if you research and want it later. You only have once chance to rescind or you will be stuck with something you haven't researched. Rescind to buy yourself time. There is no rush.


Thank you


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

TheTimeTraveler said:


> .
> 
> RESCIND NOW while you still can legally rescind.   Note:  You can always go back to purchase again, but you can only rescind for a few short days.
> 
> ...


Thanks. I did join and pay the membership. Definitely worth it! And happy to support this community!


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

dboeger1 said:


> For what it's worth, I'm not one of these religious NEVER-BUY-RETAIL types, because I think it depends if you have the money and if they're offering what you want... but that being said, we just recently bought HGV Max retail, rescinded a few days later, and our sales guy immediately called and offered us the same package for $7,200 less than we paid, even though our deal was supposedly them bending over backwards to honor an outdated Diamond Resorts sampler contract. They're pretty desperate to get people to buy in, and the prices are such that they have a lot of wiggle room, so you can almost certainly get a better deal later by rescinding, even if you do decide to buy retail.
> 
> HGV Max is a bit confusing and fuzzy, but my understanding is these are the main selling points:
> 
> ...


Thanks. Yeah my wife liked the additional resorts we have access to and the cash deals. But I pointed out those generally require a 30-45 day window before traveling which is not always conducive to planning vacations from work, etc. Maybe she's looking to jet without me. Lol


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

Iggyearl said:


> It sounds like you want to please your wife - doesn't everybody?  But ask yourself - did you purchase a timeshare from HGVC?  Or were you sold a timeshare?  Did you say, "We want to think it over?"  And they found all the reason not to do it today.  Final question - Did you pay cash, and could you afford to do so without hurting?  The price of your purchase just shot up if you financed it.  Unless you have money lying around, and need to get rid of it, rescind and start studying.


We paid on a Hilton Amex card with a year to pay off interest free. We are in position to pay off during that time so as to avoid any finance charges. But by no means $$ lying around. Two kids, two car payments, mortgage, blah blah blah.


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## HuskerATL (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> Thanks. Yeah my wife liked the additional resorts we have access to and the cash deals. But I pointed out those generally require a 30-45 day window before traveling which is not always conducive to planning vacations from work, etc. Maybe she's looking to jet without me. Lol


You get open season with resale so you can still use cash or convert to HH.


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## dayooper (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> It's the Parc Soleil but we bought a week at the las Vegas Elara as our salesperson said the maintenance is lower. I do think our sales guy was being transparent (relatively), he even highlighted the ROFR from Hilton and how they buy back at a much lower %.
> Thank you!



I bought my Boulevard 2 bedroom platinum (11200 points) for $2500 and it wasn’t bought back. Take a look at what people have purchased recently at this site:






						Home Page - ROFR Experiences
					

ROFR Right of First Refusal Results Marriott Hilton Experiences




					rofr.net
				




It all might be moot if you can only reserve 45 days in advance. Your availability will be very poor and you will not get your money’s worth, even at resale costs.


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## HuskerATL (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> We paid on a Hilton Amex card with a year to pay off interest free. We are in position to pay off during that time so as to avoid any finance charges. But by no means $$ lying around. Two kids, two car payments, mortgage, blah blah blah.


I bought our resale Scotland ( actually 6 of them) with our Aspire but paid about $2k each for them so I got 14x HH points and the $250 resort credit. About 46k points for about $12k.


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## HuskerATL (Jul 14, 2022)

dayooper said:


> I bought my Boulevard 2 bedroom platinum (11200 points) for $2500 and it wasn’t bought back. Take a look at what people have purchased recently at this site:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just to add, when the DRI herd does get into Max, there will be even less available for open season.


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

dayooper said:


> @MrHodgieman What Max perks does your wife think you will use? Salesman stretch the truth all the time on the use of perks, many of which are really only useful with high points. The game is they get their foot in the door by selling families a small contract that they think they can easily use, but, in reality are little more difficult. So you go to another update where they tell you what you bought is useless and sell you a larger contract. This keeps on going until you get wise and stop going to sales presentations.
> 
> Here’s the thing, you only get one chance to rescind, but the deal you got (or a better one) will always be available. Once the recession period is up, you are stuck with what you bought, but you can always buy from HGVC.


Thanks. As far as perks was the access to more 2 bedroom units, which is a must with two teenagers. Seemed with retail vs resale you gain access to more HGV properties and anything new added in future? Plus the RCI and discounts on cruises and last minute travel.


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## DRIless (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> Hi All-
> First off, thanks for taking time to read this post. I appreciate any advice I can get. Newbie here, as you can tell from rest of my ignorance below ;P
> On Monday, July 11th (4 days ago, so still in the 7-day rescinscion period), we purchased a retail HGVMax membership out of an Orlando Grand Vacations club.
> Here are the terms:
> ...


DIVORCE


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## HuskerATL (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> Thanks. As far as perks was the access to more 2 bedroom units, which is a must with two teenagers. Seemed with retail vs resale you gain access to more HGV properties and anything new added in future? Plus the RCI and discounts on cruises and last minute travel.


Rooms are based on points and season so the more points that you have the more options.  It looks like  yours is a 2 bedroom gold season so you couldn't get a 2 bedroom during platinum season at that resort.  You have access to RCI with resale and other stuff but you don't get the Max cash percent for cruises/flights but that is probably a poor use of points anyway.


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## dayooper (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> Thanks. As far as perks was the access to more 2 bedroom units, which is a must with two teenagers. Seemed with retail vs resale you gain access to more HGV properties and anything new added in future? Plus the RCI discounts on and cruises and last minute travel.



I am full resale and have stayed in 2 bedrooms in Hilton Head and Myrtle beach and had a 3 bedroom in Myrtle Beach booked but had to cancel in 2020 due to Covid. I have complete access to RCI discounts and last call reservations. As far as new resorts, that remains to be seen, but everything that has come from non-sales hasn’t said anything about resale or legacy members (anybody who is not a Max member) not being able to book any new resorts. 

Only you and your wife know if buying resale, retail or even purchasing is right for you. I have no problem with what anybody does with their funds. For some purchasing retail is right for them. I just hope that anybody who purchases retail does so after they do their research.


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

DRIless said:


> DIVORCE


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

HuskerATL said:


> Rooms are based on points and season so the more points that you have the more options.  It looks like  yours is a 2 bedroom gold season so you couldn't get a 2 bedroom during platinum season at that resort.  You have access to RCI with resale and other stuff but you don't get the Max cash percent for cruises/flights but that is probably a poor use of points anyway.


We're Gold 1 bedroom in Vegas but we have no plans to use the points for Vegas. It seemed the 8800 points every two years would be enough for one week at a 2 bedroom anywhere we'd like to go given the point system is flat (eg, same points. Needed for unit size no matter where you go). The places we plan to use the program are Hawaii, japan, Fiji, Australia, Greece, so big trips and probably expensive flights. Don't know if the savings in flights by being a retail owner is big enough to warrant cost of ownership.


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## jabberwocky (Jul 14, 2022)

geist1223 said:


> As others have said Rescind. Or perhaps get a new wife and in the divorce give her this time share.


I think it would be cheaper to keep the developer purchase vs divorce.


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

BingoBangoBongo said:


> After a quick scan of the point charts for many resorts it appears that you bought a 2BR Grand Plus Gold deed at Elara.  It's not a bad deed, but you can do much better on a resale purchase, and honestly no one has any experience with Max yet.  If it were my wife (who loves to shop), I would tell her that unlike a clothing store, this same product or a better one will be available if you decide to go the retail route after some more research.  The telling part of your original post is you stating your uncertainty on the questions you're asking.  I bought an Every Year ELara 1BR Grand Platinum at the end of 2020 for about $5000, and that now has 11,200 points.  I feel that deed would bring close to that if I decided to sell it today.  Your's at best would be worth less than $2500.
> 
> In your post you mention using the bonus points for Hawaii and Australia, but don't mention if these are typical trips for you or when and where you might want to go.  This could impact on what type of deed you buy.


Thanks. My wife and I have gone to Hawaii multiple times but haven't since the kids. Kids are now teens, 13 and 14, so thinking these big trips make sense for us to enjoy as a family before they leave the nest. We did like the bonus points because it allows us to take multiple weeks out of the gate next year given a week won't cut it esp for long distances. Our deed is actually 1 week gold in Elara. But we got some extra bonus points as I resisted signing and they added more to try to sweeten it.


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## HuskerATL (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> We're Gold 1 bedroom in Vegas but we have no plans to use the points for Vegas. It seemed the 8800 points every two years would be enough for one week at a 2 bedroom anywhere we'd like to go given the point system is flat (eg, same points. Needed for unit size no matter where you go). The places we plan to use the program are Hawaii, japan, Fiji, Australia, Greece, so big trips and probably expensive flights. Don't know if the savings in flights by being a retail owner is big enough to warrant cost of ownership.


So there aren't any HGVC resorts in Fiji, Australia, or Greece.  There are plenty in Hawaii and Japan. There are RCI around the world and you could convert your points to HH then use Hilton hotels but that isn't the best use of the points.  8800 points aren't enough for two bedrooms everywhere.  It just depends on the resort and the season. See below for examples:

Here is the point chart from The Beach Resort Sesoko in Japan




Here is the points chart for Kingsland in Hawaii:




Here is the points chart for Elara in Vegas:


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## dayooper (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> We're Gold 1 bedroom in Vegas but we have no plans to use the points for Vegas. It seemed the 8800 points every two years would be enough for one week at a 2 bedroom anywhere we'd like to go given the point system is flat (eg, same points. Needed for unit size no matter where you go). The places we plan to use the program are Hawaii, japan, Fiji, Australia, Greece, so big trips and probably expensive flights. Don't know if the savings in flights by being a retail owner is big enough to warrant cost of ownership.



If you can travel in the off season, you should be ok. If you have to travel in the busy season, you do not have enough for a standard 2 bedroom. A standard 2 bedroom in the platinum season is 11200 points. If you want the more extravagant rooms and places, even in the gold season, they will cost more.

While there are HGVC properties in Hawaii and Japan, there are no properties in system in Australia, Fiji or Greece. To go to those places, you would have to put your points in the Hilton Honors system. You will not have enough for a week in a 2 bedroom. You might have enough for 1 hotel room in those locations.


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## alwysonvac (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> We're Gold 1 bedroom in Vegas but we have no plans to use the points for Vegas. It seemed the 8800 points every two years would be enough for one week at a 2 bedroom anywhere we'd like to go given the point system is flat (eg, same points. Needed for unit size no matter where you go). The places we plan to use the program are Hawaii, japan, Fiji, Australia, Greece, so big trips and probably expensive flights. Don't know if the savings in flights by being a retail owner is big enough to warrant cost of ownership.



*You’ll only have one chance to rescind but you’ll have endless opportunities to buy from the developers.*
Take the time to research to determine fact vs fiction. Don’t get caught up in the dream they created.

If you change your mind next week, next month, next year… you’ll be lucky to get 10% of your money back. Here are the asking prices for 8,000 ClubPoints at Elara via the resale market.


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

alwysonvac said:


> *You’ll only have one chance to rescind but you’ll have endless opportunities to buy from the developers.*
> Take the time to research to determine fact vs fiction. Don’t get caught up in the dream they created.
> 
> If you change your mind next week, next month, next year… you’ll be lucky to get 10% of your money back.
> ...


Appreciate this info, thank you. I guess part of it isn't just the points and the cost of the points but what you have access to during resale vs retail. We aren't the type to go to same resort more than once, so we want to try different destinations. Is seemed like HGVMax had a much larger offering via retail but that could be the sales schmooze


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## escanoe (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> Is seemed like HGVMax had a much larger offering via retail but that could be the sales schmooze



No one really knows if the additional options through HGV Max will amount to much availability or not. Those of us most familiar with the system think it may add some, but question if it is enough to justify a developer purchase.

I would rescind the bird in the bush you bought. When it becomes a bird in the hand (something that exists outside of theory and that is real) you can better make an honest assessment if it is worth a developer purchase or not.


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## brp (Jul 14, 2022)

escanoe said:


> I would rescind the bird in the bush you bought. When it becomes a bird in the hand (something that exists outside of theory and that is real) you can better make an honest assessment if it is worth a developer purchase or not.



Yup. if you really do decide that Developer purchase and Max are for you, you can always get this deal (maybe better) again. Once chance to rescind, many chances to buy from them again. Despite the "we can on;y make this offer today" spiel,  you will be able to get it again if you want.

Cheers.


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## GT75 (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> The places we plan to use the program are Hawaii, japan, Fiji, Australia, Greece, so big trips and probably expensive flights.


Of those places which you have listed, I would only count on using HGVC TS at HI.   The others aren’t practical IMO.    Secondly, you aren’t  purchasing enough pts initially (I agree with @dayooper has stated, next owners update the salesperson is going to sell you more pts).   Thirdly, resale will be much cheaper (but I certainly understand pleasing your wife)


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## alwysonvac (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> Appreciate this info, thank you. I guess part of it isn't just the points and the cost of the points but what you have access to during resale vs retail. We aren't the type to go to same resort more than once, so we want to try different destinations. Is seemed like HGVMax had a much larger offering via retail but that could be the sales schmooze



Yes, sales schmooze. The timeshare sales folks basically tell folks what they want to hear.

They are not giving folks the full picture. Yes, HGV Max will bring together DRI and HGVC but each system will have priority access within their family of resorts. As a result, most of the high demand locations and/or high demand travel dates will be long gone before the booking window for DRI resorts opens up to HGVC owners. Folks will basically have access to any leftovers.

For example, here’s what HGVC states for HGVC owners regarding HGV MAX reservations (see below). NOTE: The Club Reservations and Open Season description below applies to all HGVC Owners.




Here’s the latest HGVC point charts and open season rates for each HGVC resort.
ClubPoints requirements “_usually” _don‘t change but Open Season rates have increased over the years.

*2022 Point Chart with Open Season rates for each HGVC resort *(link)
*2022 Club Reference guide with Club Fee information page 24 * (link)
Timeshares are best used for timeshare stays. All of the other travel options that the developer offers only allow you to apply some of your cost towards a different type of vacation (they’re not offering the best savings). In most cases, you’ll basically end up paying more out of pocket vs just paying for it separately using cash.

If you like the ideal of multiple weeks out the gate, take a look at timeshare rentals.
Here’s the link to Hawaii bargain rentals on Redweek (link)


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

brp said:


> Yup. if you really do decide that Developer purchase and Max are for you, you can always get this deal (maybe better) again. Once chance to rescind, many chances to buy from them again. Despite the "we can on;y make this offer today" spiel,  you will be able to get it again if you want.
> 
> Cheers.


Thank you. Makes complete sense and is prudent thing to do. Will draft up my letter and get it in certified mail!


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 14, 2022)

alwysonvac said:


> Yes, sales schmooze. The timeshare sales folks basically tell folks what they want to hear.
> 
> They are not giving folks the full picture. Yes, HGV Max will bring together DRI and HGVC but each system will have priority access within their family of resorts. As a result, most of the high demand locations and/or high demand travel dates will be long gone before the booking window for DRI resorts opens up to HGVC owners. Folks will basically have access to any leftovers.
> 
> ...


This is so helpful. Thanks. Ok, will be rescinding and then really planning out how we make this work best for us.


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## alwysonvac (Jul 14, 2022)

alwysonvac said:


> *ClubPoints requirements don’t change *but Open Season rates have increased over the years.


Correction…forgot the recent point adjustment in Cabo 








						2020 points increase in Cabo!
					

I just noticed this alert on the club web site, I wonder if it will spread to other resorts that HGVC feels is undervalued.  Owners should see a point increase to lower their fee per point ratio.  After a recent evaluation, Hilton Grand Vacations has adjusted the ClubPoints value for 2020...




					tugbbs.com
				




And I think the only other point requirement change was 20+ year ago when they eliminated bronze weeks in Las Vegas. That’s what I recall since joining TUG back in 2002. 

Posted 12-13-2004 09:27 by TUG member GeorgeJ in the older TUG site -http://www.tug1.net/tugbbs1/Forum6/HTML/001340.html​
_"...Later in the 90's, HGVC decided to have both floating and fixed Platinum weeks to more closely correspond to the seasons and pricing in Orlando. Gold weeks became floating Platinum; silver owners were upped to Gold and bronze week owners now had Silver designation and there were no more bronze weeks in Las Vegas..I think that all happened in either 1997 or 1998.."_​


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## jabberwocky (Jul 14, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> You wouldn't buy a car for this price without research, right?


I should introduce you to my wife. Her research on our last car purchase was “does it have massaging seats?”


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## Nowaker (Jul 14, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> However, my Wife does not as she feels the 3 weeks added at sign-on offsets the cost enough


25,000 bonus points are worth around $2,400. That's what I'd pay for this amount of points in maintenance fees.


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## CalGalTraveler (Jul 15, 2022)

jabberwocky said:


> I should introduce you to my wife. Her research on our last car purchase was “does it have massaging seats?”


Ha! I like the way she shops! I would want the heated seats too...


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## letsgobobby (Jul 15, 2022)

alwysonvac said:


> *You’ll only have one chance to rescind but you’ll have endless opportunities to buy from the developers.*
> Take the time to research to determine fact vs fiction. Don’t get caught up in the dream they created.
> 
> If you change your mind next week, next month, next year… you’ll be lucky to get 10% of your money back. Here are the asking prices for 8,000 ClubPoints at Elara via the resale market.
> ...


Where is that screenshot from


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## rickandcindy23 (Jul 15, 2022)

Common sense will set in eventually, and then it will be too late.  Rescind while you can and don't hesitate.  There are bargains to be had with Hilton.  Save your money and buy your wife a nice piece of jewelry with a little of the savings.


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## brp (Jul 15, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Ha! I like the way she shops! I would want the heated seats too...



Dude, looks like you live in California. heated seats, indeed. Oh yeah, we live in CA as well and my wife has hem in her car (and I do like them sometimes )

Cheers.


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## arga (Jul 15, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> We're Gold 1 bedroom in Vegas but we have no plans to use the points for Vegas. It seemed the 8800 points every two years would be enough for one week at a 2 bedroom anywhere we'd like to go given the point system is flat (eg, same points. Needed for unit size no matter where you go). The places we plan to use the program are Hawaii, japan, Fiji, Australia, Greece, so big trips and probably expensive flights. Don't know if the savings in flights by being a retail owner is big enough to warrant cost of ownership.



Hi, I lives in Japan and just rescinded my purchase few days ago.
Currently stays in their Sesoko Beach resort, the hotel which is different building in the same area with their vacation club. I can tell you, you are probably have a difficulties to book this one at holiday season without owning one, because owner of this vacation club will have 12 month ahead to book instead of your 9 month ahead (because you own vegas not sesoko). Forget the odawara, they only has 10 rooms, and completely booked for your 9 month ahead timeframe.

If you want a complete flexibility and never go the to same resort twice, I suggest you to stick to the traditional hotel. It'll be more expensive of course, ultimately for family with teens but that's your price for flexibility. You can enter their HHonors programs, maybe use their branded amex card daily to offset your hotel purchase once a year.


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## alwysonvac (Jul 15, 2022)

letsgobobby said:


> Where is that screenshot from


From Judi Kozlowski’s website. 




__





						Home | Timeshare Professionals Resale United States
					

Timeshare Professionals, Inc. has been helping clients purchase timeshare resales for almost 30 years.  Licensed real estate professionals helping you with the resale of your timeshare, buying timeshare or renting timeshare.  Specializing in Hilton Grand Vacation Club - HGVC.




					www.timeshareprofessionals.com
				




It’s an alternate search tool. Not as user friendly but the search function works (link).


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## rdw95 (Jul 15, 2022)

I used the Kizlowski group for our resale purchase of 2 weeks in Italy last year and they were excellent.


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 16, 2022)

alwysonvac said:


> Yes, sales schmooze. The timeshare sales folks basically tell folks what they want to hear.
> 
> They are not giving folks the full picture. Yes, HGV Max will bring together DRI and HGVC but each system will have priority access within their family of resorts. As a result, most of the high demand locations and/or high demand travel dates will be long gone before the booking window for DRI resorts opens up to HGVC owners. Folks will basically have access to any leftovers.
> 
> ...


Thank you for all this information! Sorry I've been late to respond...on vacation in Orlando at the HGVC here. Need to get my rescission letter in mail before I leave today


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## alwysonvac (Jul 16, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> Thanks. I did join and pay the membership. Definitely worth it! And happy to support this community!


Thanks for supporting TUG 

When you get back home, you’ll need to update the BBS Member Codeword in your TUGBBS profile to indicate your TUG Member status. Follow the instructions in this post.








						TUG MEMBERS: Entering the BBS Member Codeword in your TUGBBS profile
					

This post applies to the following situations:  You have paid to become a TUG member, but are being shown on the BBS as "Guest". You have paid to become TUG member, but you cannot see or access the Sightings/Distressed forum when logged into TUGBBS. You have paid to become a TUG member, and you...




					tugbbs.com
				



Enjoy the rest of your vacation


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## tnlewis (Jul 16, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> Hi All-
> First off, thanks for taking time to read this post. I appreciate any advice I can get. Newbie here, as you can tell from rest of my ignorance below ;P
> On Monday, July 11th (4 days ago, so still in the 7-day rescinscion period), we purchased a retail HGVMax membership out of an Orlando Grand Vacations club.
> Here are the terms:
> ...


Definitely rescind.  I have two timeshares bought direct and one resale and I use my resale much more than the others. My resale was for closing cost only purchase and I’ve had it about seven years and it was definitely the best decision.


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## tnlewis (Jul 16, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> Thank you for all this information! Sorry I've been late to respond...on vacation in Orlando at the HGVC here. Need to get my rescission letter in mail before I leave today


Great decision


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## dago (Jul 16, 2022)

geist1223 said:


> As others have said Rescind. Or perhaps get a new wife and in the divorce give her this time share.


That was cruel,  but LMAO


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## Cyberc (Jul 17, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> We're Gold 1 bedroom in Vegas but we have no plans to use the points for Vegas. It seemed the 8800 points every two years would be enough for one week at a 2 bedroom anywhere we'd like to go given the point system is flat (eg, same points. Needed for unit size no matter where you go). The places we plan to use the program are Hawaii, japan, Fiji, Australia, Greece, so big trips and probably expensive flights. Don't know if the savings in flights by being a retail owner is big enough to warrant cost of ownership.


Welcome to Tug.


8.800 points every two years might get you a 2br for one week, but it certainly depends on when you plan to travel and also where you plan to travel.

If you travel during platinum season to Orlando which is the most expensive season point wise, then you will need to pay at least 11.200 points for a 2br for a week. If you travel during gold season like January or late April or May then you can get a 2br for 8.000 points. If you travel to Oahu during Platinum season then your 8.800 points won't be enough for a 2br for a week. If you travel in gold season ie. during May you could get a 2br at Lagoon for 8.000 points.

HGVC is a great system, it has it flaws but once you learn them how to avoid them then its great. 

I'd recommend that you read a lot more here and then eventually buy resale.


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 17, 2022)

Thank you. It took some convincing, and the posts here helped a lot, but was able to align with my wife to rescind. I put the certified letter in mail at post office yesterday, day 5 of the 7 day window. Whew! 
We take a lot of "modest" vacations to shore near us here in Jersey, or camping. But we do want to pursue a resale 2 bedroom so that we can take a big trip somewhere new every other year for two weeks with our teen kids before they leave the nest. These would be for the Hawaii, Asia, Europe, etc trips. And we don't want to have to worry about seasons and not having enough points. Definitely will read up! Thank you!


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## heitmullerj02 (Jul 17, 2022)

Had to add my opinion just to save this gent’s money, bought a beautiful HGVC, 2 bed,2 bath, gold time inCarlsbad,on eBay, $100, MF annual $1400, love it. Hilton treats me just like a regular buyer, never had a problem trading. Going to Lagoon tower in HI this fall, 8000. Points annual.


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## heitmullerj02 (Jul 17, 2022)

Another point, a lot of the Diamond resorts are older and need some maintenance to bring them up to HVC standards. Tried to sell me Max at last owner update, but I told sales rep, have stayed at all the resorts in Sedona, and they are OLD! Would never trade my new HGVC in Marbrisa for them. Just use my Vistana and it trades inRCI.


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## alwysonvac (Jul 17, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> ….We take a lot of "modest" vacations to shore near us here in Jersey, or camping. But we do want to pursue a resale 2 bedroom so that we can take a big trip somewhere new every other year for two weeks with our teen kids before they leave the nest. *These would be for the Hawaii, Asia, Europe, etc trips.* And we don't want to have to worry about seasons and not having enough points. Definitely will read up! Thank you!



Just keep in mind that timesharing may not satisfy all of your travel needs.

*Whatever you decide, don't put all of your future vacation dollars into timesharing.*
_This will give you the flexibility to choose the best way to visit your desired destinations. You may want to visit a destination in an completely different way via a cruise, hotel/resort stay, special discounted travel package, tour company, beach house rental, etc.

Also, there might not be a timeshare near the location you want to visit or if there is a timeshare it may be very difficult to get a trade (or unrealistic due to supply vs demand). I try to be as flexible as possible with my travel dates when using my timeshares for both internal and external trades _
_
*I also believe in diversification.*
I don’t want to be limited by my timeshares (currently HGVC, Vistana and WorldMark). Timesharing in general doesn't satisfy all of my vacation needs so I don’t spend all of my vacation money in timesharing. It’s only part of my vacation budget. 

_


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 20, 2022)

As we wind down our vacation and I was able to get the rescission in in time, I just wanted to thank you ALL for your posts and support. Apologies if I didn't respond to everyone but I'm grateful for all of your help. And happy to be a member of this group as I look to learn more about timeshares and maybe help others as I learn more.


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## Arimaas (Jul 21, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> As we wind down our vacation and I was able to get the rescission in in time, I just wanted to thank you ALL for your posts and support. Apologies if I didn't respond to everyone but I'm grateful for all of your help. And happy to be a member of this group as I look to learn more about timeshares and maybe help others as I learn more.



I know I'm late to this post, and I'm happy to see you rescinded in time. I see you are in central Jersey (well South Jersey by my standards since I'm sure you eat pork roll and not Taylor ham). I'm in Rockland County, NY and I own both HGVC and Wyndham. 

You may also want to look into Wyndham. HGVC seems to bill themselves as five star with Wyndham a step or so below, but to be honest, I have never known any differences (but then again, I've never travelled outside of Orlando or Myrtle with HGVC). I like the fact that Wyndham is much more accessible to us in the Northeast which makes it easier to use some left over points for an off season three day weekend (Atlantic City, Newport RI, Poconos, Virginia, etc.) and to be honest, Wyndham Orlando Bonnet Creek blows any HGVC in Orlando out of the water. My sister has used my Wyndham in Hawaii and had no issues with their facilities. 

I find their fees cheaper and the MFs less (of course depending where you buy). You get the same RCI access (actually Wyndham owns RCI) and their resale price is free or really cheap, as opposed to HGVC with all their fees. 

Just my 2¢, but since you rescinded and are still researching, you may also want to take a look at that system. I like Wyndham much better than HGVC.


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## escanoe (Jul 21, 2022)

Arimaas said:


> You get the same RCI access (actually Wyndham owns RCI) and their resale price is free or really cheap, as opposed to HGVC with all their fees.



Wyndham may be best the OP, but statement above is untrue when it comes to resale. 

Wyndham resale can only access “RCI Weeks” inventory. HGVC resale comes with access to “RCI Points” which largely gives you access to everything in points and weeks.

So even though Wyndham owns RCI, in the resale market Wyndham gives you second class access to RCI.

I am less of an expert on fees, but on house cleaning and guest certificates Wyndham seems fee happy in comparison to HGVV.


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## WaterMan (Jul 22, 2022)

MrHodgieman said:


> We're Gold 1 bedroom in Vegas but we have no plans to use the points for Vegas. It seemed the 8800 points every two years would be enough for one week at a 2 bedroom anywhere we'd like to go given the point system is flat (eg, same points. Needed for unit size no matter where you go). The places we plan to use the program are Hawaii, japan, Fiji, Australia, Greece, so big trips and probably expensive flights. Don't know if the savings in flights by being a retail owner is big enough to warrant cost of ownership.



I attended a sales presentation twice and was very lucky to be able to stop the urge to buy and found this group while on vacation. Bought resale from this site, 5000 points Gold Elara every year (now 8000 points) in 2019 for $1k which includes points for that year. After transfer and activation fee, my cost was close to $2.5k in total. Thankful for this site. Buy resale, you won't regret it.


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## Arimaas (Jul 22, 2022)

escanoe said:


> Wyndham may be best the OP, but statement above is untrue when it comes to resale.
> 
> Wyndham resale can only access “RCI Weeks” inventory. HGVC resale comes with access to “RCI Points” which largely gives you access to everything in points and weeks.
> 
> ...



Ah you’re right with the weeks versus points. Didn’t even think of that specifically. 

Wyndham gives you free transactions before they start hitting you for the fees so it really depends on what you’re specifically looking to do each year. I think you get something like one free housekeeping credit per 70k points you own. I’m not sure the others off the top of my head.


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## alwysonvac (Jul 22, 2022)

Just a heads up.. 
The OP wasn’t looking for stays in the Northeast. Here’s what he wrote in this thread.


> ….The places we plan to use the program are Hawaii, japan, Fiji, Australia, Greece, so big trips and probably expensive flights.….



NOTE: I also live in NJ (Hunterdon County) and use my HGVC ownership primarily for stays in Hawaii.


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## Arimaas (Jul 22, 2022)

alwysonvac said:


> Just a heads up..
> The OP wasn’t looking for stays in the Northeast. Here’s what he wrote in this thread.
> 
> 
> NOTE: I also live in NJ (Hunterdon County) and use my HGVC ownership primarily for stays in Hawaii.



Yes, I saw that as well, but since half the places he named you couldn’t use HGVC for, I figured why not throw in the kitchen sink and offer some unsolicited advice about what else to look for since he’s shopping around 

It all sounds great in a sales presentation, until you realize flights for a family of four from New Jersey to Hawaii are $10k. For me, nice to have some local drivable options in case I can’t swing that every year.


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## alwysonvac (Jul 22, 2022)

Arimaas said:


> It all sounds great in a sales presentation, until you realize flights for a family of four from New Jersey to Hawaii are $10k. For me, nice to have some local drivable options in case I can’t swing that every year.



That’s the flexibility you get with HGVC. You don’t have to travel to Hawaii every year. With banking and borrowing, you can go every two or three years and use your ClubPoints to stay for a longer length of time and/or large accommodations.  

Yes, airfare will definitely be higher during peak season (anytime the kids are out of school) where ever you go. The OP seems to be aware that flights will be expensive. But it’s not $10k for a family of four to Hawaii unless you’re trying to book first class. Whenever I travel to Hawaii with my school aged nieces and nephews, I try to go when airfare is the lowest. From NJ that’s typically the last weeks in August before they head back to school. There’s also various ways to lower the airfare expense via credit cards points, frequent flyer miles, companion certificates, etc.


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## Arimaas (Jul 22, 2022)

alwysonvac said:


> That’s the flexibility you get with HGVC. You don’t have to travel to Hawaii every year. With banking and borrowing, you can go every two or three years and use your ClubPoints to stay for a longer length of time and/or large accommodations.
> 
> Yes, airfare will definitely be higher during peak season (anytime the kids are out of school) where ever you go. The OP seems to be aware that flights will be expensive. But it’s not $10k for a family of four to Hawaii unless you’re trying to book first class. Whenever I travel to Hawaii with my school aged nieces and nephews, I try to go when airfare is the lowest. From NJ that’s typically the last weeks in August before they head back to school. There’s also various ways to lower the airfare expense via credit cards points, frequent flyer miles, companion certificates, etc.



To each their own! Just giving the OP some options when they do some research and shopping!


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## alwysonvac (Jul 22, 2022)

For example, this year I booked a two week extended family trip for a party of six (One week in Oahu via HGVC followed by 6 nights in Maui via Vistana). As part of our advance planning, both hubby and I got credit card bonus miles. I normally would book the direct flight from Newark to Honolulu but this year wasn’t as easy due to the increased travel demand.

Earlier this year, I was able to grab six frequently flyer tickets for 29.5k miles each from Newark to Honolulu via a connection in LAX  which included an intersland flight from Honolulu to Maui a week later.

For the return leg, they had lots of reasonable cash options. I was sending my sister and brother-in-law airfares that I found for the return trip home such as this one.


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## MrHodgieman (Jul 24, 2022)

Arimaas said:


> I know I'm late to this post, and I'm happy to see you rescinded in time. I see you are in central Jersey (well South Jersey by my standards since I'm sure you eat pork roll and not Taylor ham). I'm in Rockland County, NY and I own both HGVC and Wyndham.
> 
> You may also want to look into Wyndham. HGVC seems to bill themselves as five star with Wyndham a step or so below, but to be honest, I have never known any differences (but then again, I've never travelled outside of Orlando or Myrtle with HGVC). I like the fact that Wyndham is much more accessible to us in the Northeast which makes it easier to use some left over points for an off season three day weekend (Atlantic City, Newport RI, Poconos, Virginia, etc.) and to be honest, Wyndham Orlando Bonnet Creek blows any HGVC in Orlando out of the water. My sister has used my Wyndham in Hawaii and had no issues with their facilities.
> 
> ...


Always pork roll!  Thanks. Will definitely look into Wyndham as well. It's nice to have options and doing the research to feel good about the purchase when we pull trigger.


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