# Buying HGVC to Access Club Intrawest



## range_life (Sep 8, 2007)

Hi all,

I've noticed, especially with the rising Canadian dollar, that HGVC weeks seem to be a better deal than Club Intrawest points.  If I plan to visit Mont Tremblant once a year, does it make sense to buy a week in, say Las Vegas or Florida, and exchange it for Tremblant on a regular basis? My math suggests that it does, but I am worried that I've missed something. 

Any thoughts?


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## nonutrix (Sep 9, 2007)

I'm not the moderator, but this question might reach more people if it were in the Hotel based TS section.  

I am also interested in what others might have to say on this same issue, as I am a HGVC owner and want to know how easy it is to trade into CI from HGVC.

Good luck!

nonutrix


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## PigsDad (Sep 9, 2007)

HGVC members only have access to 4(?) of the CI properties.  Plus, there is only limited availability for HGVC members -- i.e. a HGVC member is not going to get a high demand week in a CI property.  If you decide that CI properties are where you want to vacation, your best bet is to buy CI, not HGVC.

Kurt


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## range_life (Sep 10, 2007)

The thing is that using the RCI point chart, peak weeks in Florida are valued much higher than peak weeks in Quebec. I have a hard time believing that you couldn't somehow regularly work it to get a good week at Tremblant.  But I could be wrong.

Does anyone know which 4 CI resorts HGVC members have access to (BTW that is half of the CI resorts...they have only 8)?

Has anyone tried to trade or otherwise exchange their HGVC week for a week at Mont at Tremblant? 

We are determined to buy one or the other, and really appreciate the feedback.


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## Seth Nock (Sep 10, 2007)

It is a good deal, currently.  The only problem is if the relationship between Hilton and CI ever changes.  With Hilton, there is minimal differences between buying developer and resale.  I have been told that with CI, resales don't qualify for booking Hilton properties.- I guess this is misinformation.


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## tashamen (Sep 10, 2007)

Seth Nock said:


> I have been told that with CI, resales don't qualify for booking Hilton properties.



I don't believe this is correct.  My understanding is that anyone who participates in the Extraordinary Escapes program within CI can trade into HGVC properties, and that program is open to anyone willing to pay the ridiculous (IMO) fees.


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## Bill4728 (Sep 10, 2007)

Seth Nock said:


> I have been told that with CI, resales don't qualify for booking Hilton properties.



There are no difference between developer purchases and resale purchases in CI. Every club member is treated the same.

BUT, when you buy CI resale you must pay ~$650 to transfer the membership/points. AND for memberships/points to transfer, they must be at least 120 points or more.


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## Seth Nock (Sep 10, 2007)

I have to stop trusting developer sales people!  Sorry for the misinformation.


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## DG001 (Sep 12, 2007)

Not sure about "trading" into CI, but we have been able to get open season reservations at CI Tremblant for the weekends we wanted to go (its an nice drive up from Boston). We didn't really check "peak" summer though - but it was open during president's day weekend for skiing, and early October for fall colors.

I am not sure if Tremblant is representative of the whole though - doubt I could have got Whistler on short notice.

The four available to HGVC are:
- Tremblant
- Sandestin (Florida panhandle)
- Whistler
- Palm Desert (California desert - not sure if thats the exact name)

I asked the HGVC agent once, and she said that HGVC don't get better access to "exchange" into the other CI properties - so it won't help you get into Mexico, that will still go through RCI and availability. But if you want to use your points to get into either of the four above, you can call 9 months in advance and book, just like any other HGVC affiliate. Just don't expect to spend every Christmas at Whistler. 

I am really hoping that at some point they open up other CI properties to this partnership.... Blue and Mexico would be fantastic!

The other thing is that you can't book CI online, you have to call. But I think even CI people can't book online...


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## benjaminb13 (Sep 12, 2007)

i hope it all woks out- CI and HGVC make perfevct partners- CI has some really great properties- Just Visited CI palm Desert - The resorts - though smaller- were great- i can only describe the resort and units as  modern/artistic southwestern. lots of privacy and each set of units had a small pool 20 steps or so outside  the french doors


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## OnMedic (Sep 13, 2007)

Bill4728 said:


> There are no difference between developer purchases and resale purchases in CI. Every club member is treated the same.



This has changed, and resale purchasers no longer qualify for EE unles the resale purchase meets certain criteria. I have more info if anyone is interested.


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## OnMedic (Sep 13, 2007)

Also of note:

I tried to make a Palm Desert reservation about 7 months out and there was NO availability to me as a HGVC owner. However, in talking to a CI owner, they stated there was lots of available rooms showing for them. SO, it appears CI is available on an alottment basis, not all availability.


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## tashamen (Sep 13, 2007)

OnMedic said:


> This has changed, and resale purchasers no longer qualify for EE unles the resale purchase meets certain criteria. I have more info if anyone is interested.



Thanks, Steve - this made me go look on the CI owners site, and you are correct.  The new policy took effect Jan. 1, 2007.  Basically anyone who attends a CI sales pitch and then purchases CI points on the resale market within 2 years of that tour, is not eligible at all for EE.  Anyone who buys on the resale market (no tour involved) is eligible for EE only if they paid at least $125 US per CI point, AND they have to pay a "benefit enrollment fee" of $10 US per CI point purchased.  That is highway robbery!  For a 150-point CI purchase (which is still probably pretty average on the resale market) that would mean an additional $1,500 just to be able to participate in EE!  That's in addition to the $650 transfer fee.

As to your other post - the allocation of units for HGVC, that was my impression from the beginning of the agreement, similar to what it has been all along for DVC, for example.  It would be nice to get some real statistics on such availability and exchanges, but I won't hold my breath!


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## OnMedic (Sep 13, 2007)

I also love the repurchase guarentee at 100% of what you paid. They tried to race through that in the presentation... 100% of Purchase price, or 60% of current value. Meaning it would need to be selling for $300+ per point to see your original value back.

Finally, we were seriously considering throught the developer for the equity exchange program because we are genuinely interested in one of the Intrawest fractional or whole ownership programs. However, it cannot be applied to a fractional purchase, only whole ownership.


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## OnMedic (Sep 13, 2007)

I do however have a workaround for it if anyone is interested.


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## Bill4728 (Sep 17, 2007)

tashamen said:


> Thanks, Steve - this made me go look on the CI owners site, and you are correct.  The new policy took effect Jan. 1, 2007.  Basically anyone who attends a CI sales pitch and then purchases CI points on the resale market within 2 years of that tour, is not eligible at all for EE.  Anyone who buys on the resale market (no tour involved) is eligible for EE only if they paid at least $125 US per CI point, AND they have to pay a "benefit enrollment fee" of $10 US per CI point purchased.  That is highway robbery!  For a 150-point CI purchase (which is still probably pretty average on the resale market) that would mean an additional $1,500 just to be able to participate in EE!  That's in addition to the $650 transfer fee.



How in the world can this be true??? 

First, CI says that you can't use II unless you purchased before 2001 now thay say you can't join EE unless you purchase your points from the developer?? So anyone buying CI resale just isn't allowed to trade their TS at all?? 

*Maybe this could really backfire on CI.* All new resale buyer could start using the independant TS excange companies like SFX and that would really cut into CI profits. 


This is likely the reason that CI points have taken a nose dive in their resale prices.


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## OnMedic (Sep 17, 2007)

Yup... Sad to say! As a resale buyer you can also finance through CI... if you purchase your points at that rediculous price as well.... 

You can trade through RCI independantly if you like, anyone with a CI membership can join RCI or II. As a workaround, you can purchase the smallest possible pt. pkg. via CI and then buy everything else resale if you so desire access to the developer PERKS.

I have a bunch of information from one of the most knowledgable CI resellers (Donnie Carmichael of Whistler Real Estate) if anyone is interested.


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## tashamen (Sep 17, 2007)

Bill4728 said:


> First, CI says that you can't use II unless you purchased before 2001 now thay say you can't join EE unless you purchase your points from the developer?? So anyone buying CI resale just isn't allowed to trade their TS at all??



Sorry I wasn't clear on this, Bill - I didn't copy the whole thing.  Anyone who bought CI points - developer OR resale - before January 1, 2007 can use EE.  The distinction only comes for those buying after January 1, 2007.

Also - Steven - I never heard that I can independently join RCI with CI points - only II.  I thought that only the CI corporate membership is available with RCI (through EE).


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## Bill4728 (Sep 17, 2007)

tashamen said:


> Sorry I wasn't clear on this, Bill - I didn't copy the whole thing.  Anyone who bought CI points - developer OR resale - before January 1, 2007 can use EE.  The distinction only comes for those buying after January 1, 2007.
> 
> Also - Steven - I never heard that I can independently join RCI with CI points - only II.  I thought that only the CI corporate membership is available with RCI (through EE).


 No, you were clear!  I was just pointing out that there was a poster about 2 months ago which was told that they couldn't join II, because CI is now enforcing a policy which said you must be a CI member since 2001 to be allowed to join II.

Now CI is telling members that they can't join EE. 

As far as I'm concerned *all CI members MUST be treated the same*. No member can get special rights because they became a member earlier than another member. The biggest difference between members should be, you bought earlier so you've been able to use the benifits of membership longer.


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## range_life (Sep 20, 2007)

Went to a CI presentation on the weekend. I now understand why people make the mistake of buying from developers. After they work on you for a while you start to lose your perspective. My wife, who is usually resistant to the "impulse buy" thought that maybe we should put down a down payment just to "hold the deal". I convinced her that the deal was not worth it and we got out of there with our savings intact. As we were leaving they offered us the "free" week stay at any CI resort, which really isn't free. It costs about $2500. Later, if you buy points, they apply the money to your purchase. Not exactly free.

We were told some things that I suspect aren't true and others that I know aren't true:

-that resales "aren't possible" 
-that only 3% of owners sell, and only to other owners
-that they could guarantee that we would not buy resale (which sounded suspiciously like a threat)

We're now looking for other options, so I guess they were right about the last one. The resort itself was okay, but we don't want to buy something that is potentially so difficult to sell!


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## OnMedic (Sep 20, 2007)

ranger, where did you visit?

LOL, ya 3% per year maybe might sell. The other thing they kept saying was "if you can even find a resale"... and it just so happens I know the #1 CI reseller, so no problem!

I do agree that it will be harder to sell with all the limitation if you don;t buy it from them... or at least sell it for any more th 40% what you paid. I have seen resales usually go around $80 or so, with the odd one at $66 and as low recently as $62.


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## tashamen (Sep 21, 2007)

range_life said:


> The resort itself was okay, but we don't want to buy something that is potentially so difficult to sell!



I don't think there is any problem in selling CI points these days.  You wouldn't get back what you paid to the developer if you bought from them, but if you buy resale you might do okay.  Personally I would never buy any ts with thoughts of wanting to sell it someday - but I do understand that others do.

Although we own CI points and love the system, I have to admit that the changes that have occurred in just the 6 1/2 years that we have been owners do not leave me with a very good taste in the mouth.


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