# Wyndhan Owner Meeting Live Webcast



## Silverdollar (Jul 28, 2017)

If you want to watch the Wyndham Annual Owners Meeting Live Webcast information can be found in two places, on the Dashboard and in the What’s Happening section of the new website. It states, "You can be a part of the AOM experience, no matter where you are! The live webcast of your 2017 Annual Owners Meeting is set for Aug. 2 at 10:30 a.m. ET."


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## spackler (Jul 28, 2017)

Would there be a point to watching?  Spending a few hours listening to false promises by tone-deaf executives seems like a waste of time.

It's not like they'll allow any sort of Q&A or feedback.


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## Richelle (Jul 28, 2017)

spackler said:


> Would there be a point to watching?  Spending a few hours listening to false promises by tone-deaf executives seems like a waste of time.
> 
> It's not like they'll allow any sort of Q&A or feedback.



I'm hoping there will be some ticked off Owners who will make things interesting.


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## Silverdollar (Jul 28, 2017)

spackler said:


> Would there be a point to watching?  Spending a few hours listening to false promises by tone-deaf executives seems like a waste of time.
> 
> It's not like they'll allow any sort of Q&A or feedback.


I'm curious on two fronts. First, I want to see what management has to say about the website debacle. And, second, how owners handle themselves at the meeting, even though there is not supposed to be Q&A or feedback. Will there be open defiance by owners due to the many frustrations related to the new website?


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## Nomad34 (Jul 28, 2017)

Will this include the trust owners?


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## ronparise (Jul 28, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> Will this include the trust owners?


It is specifically a meeting of the fairshare owners association. And to be a member of that hoa you must have assigned your use rights to the fairshare trust

So owners of club Wyndham plus; club Wyndham Select  (UDI or converted weeks), Club Wyndham Access, Presidential Reserve, and Margaritaville are invited


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## Nomad34 (Jul 28, 2017)

Yes, mine are all in the trust.


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## Silverdollar (Jul 28, 2017)

ronparise said:


> It is specifically a meeting of the fairshare owners association. And to be a member of that hoa you must have assigned your use rights to the fairshare trust
> 
> So owners of club Wyndham plus; club Wyndham Select  (UDI or converted weeks), Club Wyndham Access, Presidential Reserve, and Margaritaville are invited


Thanks Ron. I see the owners meeting as kinda a big deal. It will be the first time owners will have hear from management since the website launch and the first time for owners to express themselves in an open forum.

I am VIP Platinum and have been with Wyndham (formerly Fairfield) for 34 years. I have seen the good, the bad and the ugly. The revamped website and other recent changes have been the ugliest I have seen IMO. In recent weeks, I have read hundreds, if not thousands, of posts here and on other sites dealing with these issues. This has affected a lot people and I don't see it settling down anytime soon. 

I can't make it to the meeting, but plan to watch the webcast. I'm curious to know who may be going, or planning to watch the webcast.


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## erniecrews (Jul 28, 2017)

I plan on going.  I remember when we used to get together the evening before on Wyndham or Fairfield, usually at Bonnet Creek or Grand Desert and have a few cocktails and generally have a good time.  I also remember when we used to have a VIP Platinum breakfast before the  meeting - no longer - but I still go to all the annual meetings and usually have a good time, but I long for the old days.

I agree the website is awful and can't imagine any VIP or inspiring to become VIP would purchase any additional points thru Wyndham.


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## Nomad34 (Jul 28, 2017)

Silverdollar said:


> Thanks Ron. I see the owners meeting as kinda a big deal. It will be the first time owners will have hear from management since the website launch and the first time for owners to express themselves in an open forum.
> 
> I am VIP Platinum and have been with Wyndham (formerly Fairfield) for 34 years. I have seen the good, the bad and the ugly. The revamped website and other recent changes have been the ugliest I have seen IMO. In recent weeks, I have read hundreds, if not thousands, of posts here and on other sites dealing with these issues. This has affected a lot people and I don't see it settling down anytime soon.
> 
> I can't make it to the meeting, but plan to watch the webcast. I'm curious to know who may be going, or planning to watch the webcast.


Aren't you a member of the trust or did you get mixed up with a trick or two by a salesman?


erniecrews said:


> I plan on going.  I remember when we used to get together the evening before on Wyndham or Fairfield, usually at Bonnet Creek or Grand Desert and have a few cocktails and generally have a good time.  I also remember when we used to have a VIP Platinum breakfast before the  meeting - no longer - but I still go to all the annual meetings and usually have a good time, but I long for the old days.
> 
> I agree the website is awful and can't imagine any VIP or inspiring to become VIP would purchase any additional points thru Wyndham.


Especially since Wyndham no longer has anything about VIP in the directories now.


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## paxsarah (Jul 28, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> Especially since Wyndham no longer has anything about VIP in the directories now.



What do you mean by that? There's plenty on VIP in the last full directory (14-15) and several VIP benefits are also addressed in the new supplement (17-18), but only as it relates to changes from the 14-15 policies. Additionally, VIP information is all over the knowledge base of the new website.


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## Nomad34 (Jul 28, 2017)

paxsarah said:


> What do you mean by that? There's plenty on VIP in the last full directory (14-15) and several VIP benefits are also addressed in the new supplement (17-18), but only as it relates to changes from the 14-15 policies. Additionally, VIP information is all over the knowledge base of the new website.


Nothing in the glossary about VIP in the latest directory that I got this year after the trust withdrew.


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## Jan M. (Jul 28, 2017)

erniecrews said:


> I plan on going.  I remember when we used to get together the evening before on Wyndham or Fairfield, usually at Bonnet Creek or Grand Desert and have a few cocktails and generally have a good time.  I also remember when we used to have a VIP Platinum breakfast before the  meeting - no longer - but I still go to all the annual meetings and usually have a good time, but I long for the old days.
> 
> I agree the website is awful and can't imagine any VIP or inspiring to become VIP would purchase any additional points thru Wyndham.



Did you get the email yesterday from Wyndham about the meeting? No more nice lunch; just light hors d' oeuvres served at various locations this year. No mention was made of wine so I'm guessing that won't be offered this year either. I noticed that they worded this as we can snack as we browse. Does that likely mean there won't be tables for us to sit at and visit with other owners?

We have to go to different floors for some things. Was this intentional to discourage people from attending the different talks and discussion groups? With the large number of people attending getting to the different floors on the elevators will likely be time consuming and generally a pain. There may be a few more tables/vendors this year but is anyone expecting there to be a lot more than in previous years?

I'm staying at Cypress Palms this year as that is where a friend is staying. Today's email has a link to sign up for the shuttle from the resort. It leaves the resort at 8am, leaves the meeting at 3:30pm and then you still have to ride the shuttle back to Cypress Palms. That makes for a long day. I'm really missing staying at Bonnet Creek with a 5-10 minute walk from my unit over to the meeting.

The one very nice thing is that I can register/sign in for the meeting on Tuesday afternoon at Cypress Palms. But again I'm wondering if they are doing that to keep us from talking to each other while we wait in line to sign in the morning of the meeting.

Thanks Wyndham! If we weren't already unhappy about the numerous issues we've been experiencing since the advent of the new website now you've done everything you can to ruin an annual event many of us looked forward to and really enjoyed.


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## erniecrews (Jul 28, 2017)

Yes I received the email - see below -however the event is not at the Hilton, it is downtown at the Dr. Phillips Performing Arts Center,so we will all be driving or enjoying the bus ride, I am going to opt for the Bus ride this year.  We can talk on the elevators...

"We're so glad you're joining us for this year’s FairShare Vacation Owners Association Annual Meeting, and we want your experience to be the best possible! This event offers you the exciting opportunity to get to know your club — live and in person. You'll have a chance to mingle with your ownership community, chat with experienced and knowledgeable CLUB WYNDHAM® representatives and participate in club education. 

This year’s venue, the Dr. Phillips Performing Arts Center, is a chic and unique downtown Orlando location — it’s five floors bustling with CLUB WYNDHAM activity, surely creating an event to remember! Complimentary shuttle service to and from the event will be offered at select Orlando area resorts – stay tuned for more information. Please keep in mind that attendees opting to drive to the venue may experience typical downtown congestion and paid parking options will be limited. We're so glad you're joining us for this year’s FairShare Vacation Owners Association Annual Meeting, and we want your experience to be the best possible! This event offers you the exciting opportunity to get to know your club — live and in person. You'll have a chance to mingle with your ownership community, chat with experienced and knowledgeable CLUB WYNDHAM® representatives and participate in club education. 

This year’s venue, the Dr. Phillips Performing Arts Center, is a chic and unique downtown Orlando location — it’s five floors bustling with CLUB WYNDHAM activity, surely creating an event to remember! Complimentary shuttle service to and from the event will be offered at select Orlando area resorts – stay tuned for more information. Please keep in mind that attendees opting to drive to the venue may experience typical downtown congestion and paid parking options will be limited."


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## Sandi Bo (Jul 28, 2017)

Anyone know how late it goes?

Edit.. oh, nevermind.  I see Jan has 3:30 in her post.  

Are there any plans for people to get together outside the meeting?  I'm happy to help organize something.  This will be my first owners meeting (is this kind of like jury duty)?


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## rickandcindy23 (Jul 28, 2017)

> Are there any plans for people to get together outside the meeting? I'm happy to help organize something. This will be my first owners meeting (is this kind of like jury duty)?


You want to know if you can talk to other owners?   I sure hope no one gets arrested for talking about Wyndham outside of the meeting.

We won't be there.  I don't care what excuses they give.  I would love to see what some owners are going to say about being shut down.


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## ronparise (Jul 28, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> Nothing in the glossary about VIP in the latest directory that I got this year after the trust withdrew.



What do you mean when you say: "...after the trust withdrew"?

To my knowledge nothing has changed regarding the structure of the club. The trust is the same trust as it always was


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## Nomad34 (Jul 28, 2017)

Still trying to get answers about the 25 years of service that appeared on my MF papers this past year. My last purchase to my trust was the Great Smokies Lodge in 2012 which voted to exit from CWA program in November 2016. 1966-1991 equals 25 years of Fairfield (fairshare vacation owners association trust)


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## Jan M. (Jul 28, 2017)

Sandi Bo said:


> Anyone know how late it goes?
> 
> Edit.. oh, nevermind.  I see Jan has 3:30 in her post.
> 
> Are there any plans for people to get together outside the meeting?  I'm happy to help organize something.  This will be my first owners meeting (is this kind of like jury duty)?



SCHEDULE OF EVENTS
*10:30 a.m. – 12:00 p.m.
(doors open at 10:15 a.m.)* *General Session & Giveaways
(Must be present to win)
Location: Disney Theater (Tier 1 & 2)*
12:00 - 1:30 p.m. Appetizers/Refreshments
Location: Tiers 1, 2, 3 & 4
12:00 - 3:30 p.m. CLUB WYNDHAM Open House Participants
Location: Tiers 1, 2, 3, 4 & 5
12:00 - 3:30 p.m. Owner Help Center
Location: De Vos Family Room (Tier 3)
12:30 - 1:00 p.m.
1:15 - 1:45 p.m.
2:00 - 2:30 p.m.
2:45 - 3:15 p.m. Education Sessions 
The World at Your Fingertips (RCI)
Hidden Gems of Your Membership (Wyndham Rewards)
Location: Disney Theater (Tier 1)
1:30 - 2:00 p.m.
2:30 - 3:00 p.m. Education Sessions
Finding Your Way: Understanding Your Membership 
Location: De Vos Family Room (Tier 3)
12:45 - 1:15 p.m.
1:25 - 1:55 p.m.
2:10 - 2:40 p.m.
2:50 - 3:20 p.m. Executive Roundtables
Location: Donor Room (Tier 2)
2:15 p.m.
2:30 p.m. 
2:45 p.m.
3:00 p.m. 
3:30 p.m. Bus Departure - Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort
3:30 p.m. Bus Departure - Star Island & Wyndham Cypress Palms


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## erniecrews (Jul 28, 2017)

It is not Jury Duty at all, you will like it.  It really is a lot of fun, even in the abbreviated format.  

I arrive Tuesday around 7:30 PM and depart Friday around 9AM.  I am open in getting together either Tuesday Night or Wednesday morning.  I am staying in Tower 6, 3 bdrm presidential reserve - I hope.


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## Larry M (Jul 29, 2017)

Silverdollar said:


> I am VIP Platinum and have been with Wyndham (formerly Fairfield) for 34 years. I have seen the good, the bad and the ugly. The revamped website and other recent changes have been the ugliest I have seen IMO. In recent weeks, I have read hundreds, if not thousands, of posts here and on other sites dealing with these issues. This has affected a lot people and I don't see it settling down anytime soon.



Well, I got out of Wyndham several years ago so I'm not familiar with website debacle beyond what I've read here. But my vote for the ugliest change was when they flat-out cancelled the internal exchange program claiming low usage after deliberately taking a series of steps (price hikes, fewer eligible properties, no catalogs) to make it less enticing.


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## nicemann (Aug 1, 2017)

Sad, I was hoping to watch it while I was at work but now they scheduled an all day meeting.  Wanted to see the show they put on.  I am sure people will be posting here what happened.


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## ronparise (Aug 2, 2017)

The annual meeting is underway and they have already referenced the problems with the new website


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

I'm livestreaming now!  We'll see how long I last!


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## iaminak (Aug 2, 2017)

Is anyone else watching?!? I hope the 2 old guys pop up and give him a hard time too!!!


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

They have an app for Wyndham Club Owners Annual Meeting app.  Maps, schedule, etc. Venders, etc. Prizes for 5 scavenger hunt winners.


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Website changes will be first up! With board president, Jeff somebody.


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

They have asked to hold question until after the general session and to ask "subject matter experts" posted throughout the area.  Jeff Richards is up now...website updates.


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## paxsarah (Aug 2, 2017)

I got my popcorn ready.


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## spackler (Aug 2, 2017)

Thanks in advance to those of you providing live updates/information.


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## iaminak (Aug 2, 2017)

"If you only hear one thing I say this morning... we are not done yet"... ummm, sure hope not!


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

"We are not done yet with website enhancements. We have met with many owners this week so we can continue to make improvements." 

"We are actively working on or have already addressed many issues"....these are:

Search and Book, Log in, registrations, auto upgrade, changing legacy reservations, eliminating/reducing extended hold times.


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## paxsarah (Aug 2, 2017)

Quick notes, poorly edited:

Board president
New system: benefits across multiple brands, future - mobile checkins etc

Changes to program guidelines:
Simplify and maximize experience
Allows for 24/7 --> flexibility
If you hear only one thing -- we are not done yet with system enhancements. Did focus group this week with owners. Taking feedback to teams.
Complications with specific features. Working on or have implemented some fixes: search and book, login and reg, modify and cancel legacy reservations.
All hands on deck to lower hold/handle times.
Still a ways to go.

Would prefer everything working already, but 100s of associates and resources resolving issues. Will not stop until accomplished.
Heard feedback, working hard to address concerns. Please continue to provide feedback on good and bad.
Thanks to event planners.
Thanks for opportunity to be board president, ty for patience.


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

"We will not stop until this is accomplished" "We hear your feedback and are working hard to respond to your feedback."

They want you to continue to give positive or negative feedback.
He thanks us for our patience through the last few months. 

And now prizes.  "Whoo hoo"<--my quote, not them.

10,000 World Mark credits (about 7 nights) "Fiji sounds awesome"
7 night vacation in any Shell resort (2 BR, up to 6 people)
2 tickets to LegoLand
105,000 Wyndham Rewards points


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## Silverdollar (Aug 2, 2017)

schoolmarm said:


> "We are not done yet with website enhancements. We have met with many owners this week so we can continue to make improvements."
> 
> "We are actively working on or have already addressed many issues"....these are:
> 
> Search and Book, Log in, registrations, auto upgrade, changing legacy reservations, eliminating/reducing extended hold times.


It would have saved everyone a lot grief and anguish if they had "met with many owners" PRIOR to launching the new website. Just saying.


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Wyndham Rewards loyalty lady up now.  There are more Rewards members than the population of Canada.

6000 members with  "Gold" rewards status on Rewards (preferred room, late checkout and free WIFI at hotels)

<Note, I have Platinum status on Wyndham rewards...too bad it doesn't come with the bennies of the Platinum statues for WVR).

And my feed is buffering...


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Wyndham destinations is a place in US (WVR resorts), China, Europe, luxury hotels...that you can book with 15,000 Rewards points/night. 

Linking with Caesars Entertainment Worldwide--Harrahs, Caesars, Ballys, etc.  You can earn and redeem points there soon. 

50million Wyndham Rewards members. 

She was nice and didn't have a Schtick (Unlike the MC and the Owner's president)...

Board treasurer is up next.


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Board treasurer:

Stats, 2016 financial results and audit discussion and 2017 financial budget. 

Blah blah blah..he needs to get to the point.

406,124 Active members as of 12/31/16 
105,363,456,000 points owned by members.
average points owned is 259,437 per member
Program fee is 61 cents per 1000.  In 2012 it was 52 cents/1000--modest increases.


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

"If you don't have increases, you can't have an impact."  ??? (I don't know what he is referring to here).  Zero-based budget=what does it cost to operate. take out income (HK, ressies) the HOAs do the same thing. They want a break-even budget.

The 2017 Program assessments remained the same as 2016 (61 cents/1000).


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## iaminak (Aug 2, 2017)

Might be the best quote of the day "An audit is a requirement and I say it that way because it is a requirement".


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

2016 budget results (he is blahing on about audit procedures/opinion):

The audit was clean according to CliftonLarsonAllen LLP. 
In THOUSANDS:
$86,996 in Program fee assessments
29,610 in reservations
16978 VIP Program (paid by developer to administrate)
8864 in Financial services (monthly statements--this has decreased)
3963 rental (owners who need more points) and housekeeping (additional for clean and tidy)
40 interest income

$146,451,000 revenues for 2016 (not in thousands)
$143,794,000 for 2015


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Expenses in thousands:
40,415 reservations
25,048 housekeeping (paid to home resort)
20,810 Exchange Company fees
18,811 VIP program
12,844 Financial Services
8,795 Credit card fees
6,015 Bad Debt (decreased from 2015)
4,120 Management fees
3,876 Owner services
1,685 Inventory management
990 Directory and Magazine Printing
1,510 Provision for Income Taxes and Other

$144,919,000 (not in thousands) Total Expenses for 2016
$140,125,000 for 2015


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Balance sheet:

Assets:
11,234 Cash
2,721 Accounts receivable
7,473 Trust Accounts receivable
3,060 Receivalbe from Developer
13,731 Escrow for members
9?05 Income taxes receivable
1839 prepaid expenses...

Didn't get the rest He said that the trust was strong.


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Results of operation IN THOUSANDS for 2017 BUDGET:
Fund deficit is $3,088
Total revenues 132,009 (in thousands)

Expenses:
42,859 Reservations
20,962exchange co fees
22 042 Housekeeping
49,234 other
135,097 total....pre taxes.

He thinks that this is tracking low but will end up ok. This will determine program fees. 

Peter.hernandez@ ....you know, Wyndham....


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Ad by "Party Weekends" sponsor.  They are pushing these entertainment weekend events/entertainment.

More prizes:  
Free party weekends certificate 
2 prizes of 4-day cruises to Cuba on Norwegian cruise line. 
7 night vacation in 2 BR (6 people) in Club Wynham Plus Resort
7 night RCI "VIP" certificate 
And there is FINALLY a winner in the balcony!


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## Richelle (Aug 2, 2017)

will there be a recording of this available later?  I had to step away for a bit to handle some work stuff away from my desk.


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Mark Johnson, Board VP:

He has responsibilities at Wyndham for the resorts, reservations, renovations, etc. etc.

He sincerely apologies for the difficulties for the May roll out. The number of phone calls and email were more than expected. Late spring/early summer usual 30K calls per week. After system rolled out those numbers doubles.

Emails usual 300-400 per week, after roll out 4,000 per week.

There was anxiety and angst from the owners and our associates. He SINCERELY apologizes.

The good news is that the system enhancements and adjustments are being made. The service levels are adjusting and call times are returning to norms.

More good news--with recent changes to Mike Brown as CEO who is NOT there.

Strategic priorities:
1. Deliver great vacations and countless memories for our owners
2. Activating Wyndham brand to it fullest potential
3.  Grow owners base.  Add new owners and retain current owners
4.  Take care of associates.

This will get us organic and sustainable growth.

GROWING TRAVEL OPTIONS!

Clearwater resort.
More units at Midtown 45
Hillside units at Marg. St. Thomas
More units at Desert Blue

Club Pass:  New resorts--WM Marble Falls (Hill Country TX), Stable Springs (Wine Country TX) Scottsdale.

Wyndham resort in planning in downtown Austin, TX.


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## Free2Roam (Aug 2, 2017)

I just joined in... it let me rewind to the beginning


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Renovations:

More that 160 (??) renos at resorts.  Video of rehabs.

Ocean Walk
Towers on the Grove, Myrtle Beach
Tamarack
WestwindsPalm Aire
King Cotton
Galena
Indio

New Resorts:
Clearwater Beach
World Mark Marble Falls
WorldMark Scottsdale
Wyndham St. Thomas Hillside
Wyndham Austin (showing pool!)


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Video highlight the donation of Wyndham Developer owned points for "Jack and Jill" charities for vacations for families who have a parent diagnosed with cancer.

Schticky MC is back.  Hors d'oerves on each tier.
He goes through the schedule for the rest of the day.

And thanks us!  Thank you for being passionate owners of Wynham.

And the meeting adjourns at 12:03pm.


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## Richelle (Aug 2, 2017)

schoolmarm said:


> Board treasurer:
> 
> Stats, 2016 financial results and audit discussion and 2017 financial budget.
> 
> ...



I thought it was .55 for non-plus partners and .57 for plus partners.  at least that's what my last assessment said.


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## schoolmarm (Aug 2, 2017)

Richelle said:


> I thought it was .55 for non-plus partners and .57 for plus partners.  at least that's what my last assessment said.




His slide said 61 cents per 1000 So maybe that will be an increase coming for next year.  OR it might be that low points owners are charged the full fee and that number is averaged with the rest of us? Those of us with more than their minimum are charged .57 for plus partners...and maybe it will go up.

Good question.


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## rickandcindy23 (Aug 2, 2017)

We cannot get into our account, so sincere apologies aren't cutting it for us.


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## Melder (Aug 2, 2017)

Richelle said:


> will there be a recording of this available later?  I had to step away for a bit to handle some work stuff away from my desk.



https://livestream.com/accounts/25530367/WYNAOM2017/videos/160687369


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## cayman01 (Aug 2, 2017)

And I cannot say there have been any significant improvements to the website. In two and a half months that is very poor.


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## geerlijd (Aug 2, 2017)

I copied the finance slides for those who are interested in the details.  The $0.61 program fee is a blended rate, so that  is the average fee  paid since small owners pay a flat amount which increases the average.

The $3M shortfall on this year's $132M budget tells me we can expect program fees to go up. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




























Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## cayman01 (Aug 2, 2017)

That 2017 budget slide looks like complete BS to me. What is their justification for other revenue dropping by 25%.


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## ronparise (Aug 2, 2017)

geerlijd said:


> I copied the finance slides for those who are interested in the details.  The $0.61 program fee is a blended rate, so that  is the average fee  paid since small owners pay a flat amount which increases the average.
> 
> The $3M shortfall on this year's $132M budget tells me we can expect program fees to go up.
> 
> ...




No. The shortfall is planned and will be made up by previous years surplus' (club equity)


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## iaminak (Aug 2, 2017)

I was watching but only till about 11:30. Did they ever take any questions from the floor?


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## Sandi Bo (Aug 2, 2017)

They did not.

Executive round tables were lively/good. 

Anyone at Bonnet Creek, pm me if you'd like to meet later at the back bay bar or pizza joint. About 7?


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## breezez (Aug 2, 2017)

schoolmarm said:


> Expenses in thousands:
> 40,415 reservations
> 25,048 housekeeping (paid to home resort)
> 20,810 Exchange Company fees
> ...




I have never got a directory,  plus they are a few years behind


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## Cdn Gal (Aug 2, 2017)

If anyone would like to meet up tomorrow morning or afternoon at Bonnet Creek, let me know


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## Cdn Gal (Aug 2, 2017)

erniecrews said:


> It is not Jury Duty at all, you will like it.  It really is a lot of fun, even in the abbreviated format.
> 
> I arrive Tuesday around 7:30 PM and depart Friday around 9AM.  I am open in getting together either Tuesday Night or Wednesday morning.  I am staying in Tower 6, 3 bdrm presidential reserve - I hope.


Hey!  How are you for Thursday morning for coffee? Tower 4 by the pool/bar?


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## TUGBrian (Aug 2, 2017)

no questions from the floor yet?  or at all during the meeting?


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## scootr5 (Aug 2, 2017)

TUGBrian said:


> no questions from the floor yet?  or at all during the meeting?



I believe they typically do not take them at all.


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## TUGBrian (Aug 2, 2017)

ah, that makes more sense thanks!


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## Cdn Gal (Aug 2, 2017)

Sandi Bo said:


> They did not.
> 
> Executive round tables were lively/good.
> 
> Anyone at Bonnet Creek, pm me if you'd like to meet later at the back bay bar or pizza joint. About 7?


Yes I'm in!   Are you there now?


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## ronparise (Aug 2, 2017)

So can we get a report on what happened in the Q&A sessions

Were there folks upset at losing cancel and rebook for discounts?


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## nicemann (Aug 2, 2017)

I just watched the entire replay.  Love how Mike could not make it due to another board meeting.  You would think they would have planned that better or he could have been excused.  I like the idea of mobile checkin, wish they would also work on mobile parking lot pass.  Totally skip those sharks.  Peter's jokes were really corney.  I agree with what others said, plan on program fees going up.  I love how reservations revenue went up $1.6 million.  This is basically after you use all the transaction credits the fees we pay and of course all the also guest fees.  Wonder how much that will go up the remaining of this year with all the new policy changes.  Who knows maybe that will keep the program fee the same one again.

I wish they would have broadcasted some of the Q&As.


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## Sandy VDH (Aug 3, 2017)

schoolmarm said:


> His slide said 61 cents per 1000 So maybe that will be an increase coming for next year.  OR it might be that low points owners are charged the full fee and that number is averaged with the rest of us? Those of us with more than their minimum are charged .57 for plus partners...and maybe it will go up.
> 
> Good question.



PR rates are higher still, it did say blended average.  

Someone with PR knowledge on the top of their heads, what is the program fees for PR?


----------



## ecwinch (Aug 3, 2017)

So from a VIP standpoint:

? VIP Members out of ~406,000.
Receiving benefits that costs Wyndham ~17million per year.

Did they mention the VIP member count.


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## Braindead (Aug 3, 2017)

ecwinch said:


> So from a VIP standpoint:
> 
> ? VIP Members out of ~406,000.
> Receiving benefits that costs Wyndham ~17million per year.
> ...


$17 million sounds like a big number.
If there's 200,000 VIPs that's only $85.00 per VIP member a year.
About one free night per VIP member a year


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## Braindead (Aug 3, 2017)

ecwinch said:


> So from a VIP standpoint:
> 
> ? VIP Members out of ~406,000.
> Receiving benefits that costs Wyndham ~17million per year.
> ...


That 17 million was income to the club from I assume Wyndham Corporate. I think they said Wyndham sales were $2 billion. 
Wyndham 2 billion sales and pays the club 17 million for reimbursement of benefits VIPs received. 
If the average VIP only received less than $100.00 of benefits. Pretty sad Wyndham felt the need to make it even harder to get benefits or the club isn't getting proper reimbursement from Wyndham.
Might sound like a silly question but I'm going to ask.
Who made the decisions on the new rules ? The board members of the trust that spoke yesterday? Corporate Wyndham?


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## staceyeileen (Aug 3, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> My last purchase to my trust was the Great Smokies Lodge in 2012 which voted to exit from CWA program in November 2016.



Sorry for responding to this off topic post, but does anyone know what he is talking about here?  Wyndham still lists GSL as a CWA resort.  Wll that be channing?

Sent from my FRD-L04 using Tapatalk


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## cayman01 (Aug 3, 2017)

Braindead said:


> That 17 million was income to the club from I assume Wyndham Corporate. I think they said Wyndham sales were $2 billion.
> Wyndham 2 billion sales and pays the club 17 million for reimbursement of benefits VIPs received.
> If the average VIP only received less than $100.00 of benefits. Pretty sad Wyndham felt the need to make it even harder to get benefits or the club isn't getting proper reimbursement from Wyndham.
> Might sound like a silly question but I'm going to ask.
> Who made the decisions on the new rules ? The board members of the trust that spoke yesterday? Corporate Wyndham?




With the average owner owning 260k in.points there is no way there are 200,000 VIP. More likely in the 40-60k area or less.


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## ronparise (Aug 3, 2017)

staceyeileen said:


> Sorry for responding to this off topic post, but does anyone know what he is talking about here?  Wyndham still lists GSL as a CWA resort.  Wll that be channing?
> 
> Sent from my FRD-L04 using Tapatalk


I haven't understood nomad34's comments either

It seems he/she has a grevence but it's not clear to me what it is

And I think he/she is confusing ownership of Wyndham points which means his use rights are assigned to a trust and the ownership of his deed in a personal trust.  At least he has confused me


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## ronparise (Aug 3, 2017)

Braindead said:


> That 17 million was income to the club from I assume Wyndham Corporate. I think they said Wyndham sales were $2 billion.
> Wyndham 2 billion sales and pays the club 17 million for reimbursement of benefits VIPs received.
> If the average VIP only received less than $100.00 of benefits. Pretty sad Wyndham felt the need to make it even harder to get benefits or the club isn't getting proper reimbursement from Wyndham.
> Might sound like a silly question but I'm going to ask.
> Who made the decisions on the new rules ? The board members of the trust that spoke yesterday? Corporate Wyndham?


Understand that the expenses that Wyndham is paying the club for is compensation for the unlimited housekeeping and transaction credits and the free newspaper it is not compensation for the discounts that these owners receive 

As to who made the rules, the officers of the club or Wyndham executives? The answer is yes. Geoff Richards, Mark Johnson and Peter Hernandez, the officers of the club, are all three high level Wyndham executives


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## Braindead (Aug 3, 2017)

staceyeileen said:


> Sorry for responding to this off topic post, but does anyone know what he is talking about here?  Wyndham still lists GSL as a CWA resort.  Wll that be channing?
> 
> Sent from my FRD-L04 using Tapatalk





ronparise said:


> I haven't understood nomad34's comments either
> 
> It seems he/she has a grevence but it's not clear to me what it is
> 
> And I think he/she is confusing ownership of Wyndham points which means his use rights are assigned to a trust and the ownership of his deed in a personal trust.  At least he has confused me


It sounds like they setup a family trust and no longer have control of the trust. Either their family or an attorney is now in control. Their grievance is with whoever has control of their personal trust. Has nothing to do with Wyndham


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## Nomad34 (Aug 3, 2017)

ronparise said:


> I haven't understood nomad34's comments either
> 
> It seems he/she has a grevence but it's not clear to me what it is
> 
> And I think he/she is confusing ownership of Wyndham points which means his use rights are assigned to a trust and the ownership of his deed in a personal trust.  At least he has confused me


The last trust I bought at GSL was in a CWA program along with regular CWA but whoever was in the trust voted to be removed from CWA was my understanding. That was a light to the end of my tunnel of pennies on the dollar deeds I thought but only time will tell.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 3, 2017)

It is confusing go me too as two of my deeds are in a trust with Fairfield which I purchased in 1999 and 2000 and placed in a trust but the 2012 GSL was split with the CWA and the fairshare vacation owners trust in Little Rock,AR which is no longer there but is in Orlando as I learned in June. May 2016 I was warned to not release my deeds as a split was coming.


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## Jan M. (Aug 3, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> It is confusing go me too as two of my deeds are in a trust with Fairfield which I purchased in 1999 and 2000 and placed in a trust but the 2012 GSL was split with the CWA and the fairshare vacation owners trust in Little Rock,AR which is no longer there but is in Orlando as I learned in June. May 2016 I was warned to not release my deeds as a split was coming.



Sorry but when even Ron P. can't figure out what you are talking about that means none of the rest of us can either. I think part of the problem is you are repeating stuff you've been told at those presentations you keep going to that get you into more and more trouble. What you've been told is either completely false or inaccurate and even what was accurate and honest, you may not have fully understood. We all know there is a lot to learn and keep straight.

Don't use the term Fairfield Trust to describe what you own; instead think of it as the Fairfield Trust just manages the points for all of us. Is the account in your name and perhaps your daughter's name too or is the account in a family trust with multiple family members in that trust? You can have multiple family members on your account but that doesn't make it a family trust ownership.

You have three choices of what you own. For OP reading this, yes there are one or two other choices but from previous posts I don't think Nomad owns any of them so I'm not listing them.
1. Fixed deeded weeks at specific resorts that may or may not have been converted to points.
2. Club Wyndham Select points from deeds at specific resorts.
3. Club Wyndham Access points in contracts from of a blend of resorts participating in CWA.

It might help us if you were to list all your contracts and deeds by resort name and the number of points in each. Or if you own any Club Wyndham Access contracts how many points in those contracts too. Also if they were bought developer, meaning from Fairfield or Wyndham, we don't need to know which just whether or not they were developer purchases or resale purchases, meaning bought outside of Fairfield or Wyndham from another owner or timeshare resale company.


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## Braindead (Aug 3, 2017)

ronparise said:


> As to who made the rules, the officers of the club or Wyndham executives? The answer is yes. Geoff Richards, Mark Johnson and Peter Hernandez, the officers of the club, are all three high level Wyndham executives


Which hat were they supposed to be wearing when they made decisions on the new rules?


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## Lisa P (Aug 3, 2017)

From some other posts by Nomad, it looks like after sitting through an Owner Update with sales weasels, Wyndham tried to take back some deeds and upsell to CWA.  At least one of the deeds was in a family trust and some trustees were unavailable for signatures.  So there have been multiple contracts signed followed by rescinding.  In addition, when some grandchildren removed deeds from the trust, the total number of points in the account dropped and a VIP level was lost.  There may have been an additional developer purchase made, to preserve some VIP status.  In addition, upon realizing that Nomad's heirs did not want the timeshares in the family trust, Nomad paid an upfront fee to a timeshare broker or scammer.  An attorney has been contacted.

Nomad, is this correct?  Your posts suggest that you struggle to make sense of your ownership.

Just so you know, *there was no vote to split a trust at GSL*.  Most inventory at GSL was sold to regular owners like yourself.  Later, some inventory was sold to CWA trust purchasers.  The two groups of owners are given ARP to the separate allotments of points/rooms.  At 10 months out, all remaining room inventory is available to all Wyndham points owners of every kind.

By the way, when Fairfield was taken over by Wyndham, the program name and points trust changed from FairShare Plus to Wyndham Plus and the headquarters moved from Little Rock to Orlando.  But for the most part, the program stayed functionally the same.  No split, no losses.


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## Lisa P (Aug 3, 2017)

Nomad, please stop attending sales meetings.  $100 for "groceries" is NOT WORTH this kind of aggravation for you.  Use what you own and enjoy it as best you can.  If your adult daughter wants to attend, she could go independently.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 3, 2017)

Jan M. said:


> Sorry but when even Ron P. can't figure out what you are talking about that means none of the rest of us can either. I think part of the problem is you are repeating stuff you've been told at those presentations you keep going to that get you into more and more trouble. What you've been told is either completely false or inaccurate and even what was accurate and honest, you may not have fully understood. We all know there is a lot to learn and keep straight.
> 
> Don't use the term Fairfield Trust to describe what you own; instead think of it as the Fairfield Trust just manages the points for all of us. Is the account in your name and perhaps your daughter's name too or is the account in a family trust with multiple family members in that trust? You can have multiple family members on your account but that doesn't make it a family trust ownership.
> 
> ...


Thank you for your post. I first bought in 1999 at Branson at the Falls for 105k andd joined with my sister and daughter in law by joining their fixed weeks into a trust that gave us 308k (Silver) . In 2000 my sister and I purchased ocean walk Daytona for 192k to gain Gold at 500k. My granddaughter bought my sister's fixed week as a resale (pointed out by sales) which was later removed from the trust leaving me with silver again but also with the trust only in my name which was set up by a trust lawyer outside of timeshares but including my deeds. The branson deed reads Fairfield as does the Daytona as pointed out by Title and Deed but the GSL only reads Fair share Vacation Owners Trust for 105k purchased in March 2012 when the new trust for CWA was introduced including the fair share vacation owners trust (which listed Little Rock,AR address whuch no longer exists)which opened a real can of worms as I see it. Therefore as I see it now the trust has been relieved of CWA and as I said earlier 25 years of service on my MF statement looks like an even split with 50 years Wyndham claims. Am I wrong? As I continually ask. I have no complaints against Wyndham other than to see value removed from my deeds which I need to resolve before I die to keep any retribution being made on my family who are in fear of consequences that might occur since they are listed as beneficiaries and deeds are perpetual.
Anitger interesting fact, title and Deed informed me the deed for GSLwill go to probate but the other two are exempt. I had to list a person to my trust when it was changed at Daytona releasing all other trustees. I listed my grandson who has told me "no way after I've seen those salesmen attack you" and while staying in his home I  received calls about my deeds being made to him to put them up for sale. He said he just ignored them but I wanted to attack them about even calling as they were not his to sell.


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## breezez (Aug 3, 2017)

Braindead said:


> That 17 million was income to the club from I assume Wyndham Corporate. I think they said Wyndham sales were $2 billion.
> Wyndham 2 billion sales and pays the club 17 million for reimbursement of benefits VIPs received.
> If the average VIP only received less than $100.00 of benefits. Pretty sad Wyndham felt the need to make it even harder to get benefits or the club isn't getting proper reimbursement from Wyndham.
> Might sound like a silly question but I'm going to ask.
> Who made the decisions on the new rules ? The board members of the trust that spoke yesterday? Corporate Wyndham?




This is a good point -  I think its more Wyndham not reimbursing the club properly.    Looking at just the VIP's posting on here I bet you all are getting way more than $100 in benefits from it a year.


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## ssreward (Aug 3, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> As I continually ask. I have no complaints against Wyndham other than to see value removed from my deeds which I need to resolve before I die to keep any retribution being made on my family who are in fear of consequences that might occur since they are listed as beneficiaries and deeds are perpetual.



And you've continually been answered. But once again, in hopes of it sinking in - there's nothing to be resolved before you die, your family/beneficiaries are at no risk because there's no requirement to accept any inheritance. Perpetual means YOU are bound by your contract indefinitely, not your heirs.


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## Braindead (Aug 3, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> Thank you for your post. I first bought in 1999 at Branson at the Falls for 105k andd joined with my sister and daughter in law by joining their fixed weeks into a trust that gave us 308k (Silver) . In 2000 my sister and I purchased ocean walk Daytona for 192k to gain Gold at 500k. My granddaughter bought my sister's fixed week as a resale (pointed out by sales) which was later removed from the trust leaving me with silver again but also with the trust only in my name which was set up by a trust lawyer outside of timeshares but including my deeds. The branson deed reads Fairfield as does the Daytona as pointed out by Title and Deed but the GSL only reads Fair share Vacation Owners Trust for 105k purchased in March 2012 when the new trust for CWA was introduced including the fair share vacation owners trust (which listed Little Rock,AR address whuch no longer exists)which opened a real can of worms as I see it. Therefore as I see it now the trust has been relieved of CWA and as I said earlier 25 years of service on my MF statement looks like an even split with 50 years Wyndham claims. Am I wrong? As I continually ask. I have no complaints against Wyndham other than to see value removed from my deeds which I need to resolve before I die to keep any retribution being made on my family who are in fear of consequences that might occur since they are listed as beneficiaries and deeds are perpetual.





ssreward said:


> And you've continually been answered. But once again, in hopes of it sinking in - there's nothing to be resolved before you die, your family/beneficiaries are at no risk because there's no requirement to accept any inheritance. Perpetual means YOU are bound by your contract indefinitely, not your heirs.


If I read the post right Nomad you have some timeshare ownerships in your personal trust.
You say you have a trust lawyer. Have your trust lawyer transfer your timeshare ownerships back to you personally.
Then will those timeshare ownerships to Wyndham in care of Geoff Richards. That way he can be an owner with the rest of us


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## Nomad34 (Aug 3, 2017)

Thank you, I am relieved to the extent of your knowledge of the law. At any extent, I will sell if any value returns such as Fairfield was able to do before selling out to Cendant and Wyndham. I respect the Fairfield salesmen more than I do the way I have been treated by the Wyndham, but I must say that the tunes are changing so I will continue to attend sales when I want for enjoyment realizing most being told me doesn't apply to me. More than likely I will be put on DNT list. Thinking back now when the salesman who sold me GSL sold me Pathways the next year, (whic I rescinded) and I asked him about the trust program in my packet, he said "he put it there thinking I might have wanted to see what I turned down." It wasn't until I finally read it that I saw the trust was a separate entity in the program


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## Nomad34 (Aug 3, 2017)

I don't have any timeshares with Wyndham as title and Deed says they are Fairfield not Wyndham. Interesting thought though since my Daytona property and branson both had a membership with my sister's SS number before contracts changed who knows who owns them. Title and Deed required producing my sister's death certificate before it could be changed in Las Vegas.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 3, 2017)

I mentioned in an earlier post of having a Fairfield former executive had a meeting at Fairfield Plantation in 2013 telling us about the fight against Wyndham which was gaining momentum and seems to have made it now by a lot of sweat and blood of former salesmen and also of some health issues to others.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 3, 2017)

Also I question why I am still using my old ID to access the website. Is there going to be a new website for those in a trust as seemed to exempt me from gaining access?  All of your information has boggled my mind. Also I am not able to make reservations for next year on the site.


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## Jan M. (Aug 4, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> Thank you for your post. I first bought in 1999 at Branson at the Falls for 105k andd joined with my sister and daughter in law by joining their fixed weeks into a trust that gave us 308k (Silver) . In 2000 my sister and I purchased ocean walk Daytona for 192k to gain Gold at 500k. My granddaughter bought my sister's fixed week as a resale (pointed out by sales) which was later removed from the trust leaving me with silver again but also with the trust only in my name which was set up by a trust lawyer outside of timeshares but including my deeds. The branson deed reads Fairfield as does the Daytona as pointed out by Title and Deed but the GSL only reads Fair share Vacation Owners Trust for 105k purchased in March 2012 when the new trust for CWA was introduced including the fair share vacation owners trust which opened a real can of worms as I see it. Therefore as I see it now the trust has been relieved of CWA and as I said earlier 25 years of service on my MF statement looks like an even split with 50 years Wyndham claims. Am I wrong? As I continually ask. I have no complaints against Wyndham other than to see value removed from my deeds which I need to resolve before I die to keep any retribution being made on my family who are in fear of consequences that might occur since they are listed as beneficiaries and deeds are perpetual.



So in the trust are the following:

Branson at the Falls, deeded, 105,000 points. In your name only?
Location(s) unknown, fixed weeks, 203,000 points. Owned by your sister and daughter-in-law.
Silver VIP
Ocean Walk, deeded, 192,000 points. Owned you and your sister.
Gold VIP  *Until your granddaughter bought the fixed week from your sister and set up her own account. What happened to the other fixed week owned by your daugher-in-law or was it your sister's DIL?
Silver VIP once again.
Club Wyndham Access, right to use, 105,000 points, 2012. In your name only?

This last purchase is where the confusions sets in but on your part only. You purchased Club Wyndham Access points while at staying at Great Smokies Lodge but did not buy deeded Club Wyndham Select points at GSL I think you don't really understand what you bought/have with CWA. No value was removed from anything, you have exactly what you bought, CWA points.

Why in the world would any retribution be made to your family and why would they be in fear of consequences? No one whose name is not on the timeshare deeds or contract can be held responsible for anything. And if any of them are on any of the deeds or contract along with you, all you and they need to do is contact Wyndham and complete any paperwork to have any of their names removed from the deeds or contract if that is what they want. It doesn't matter that your timeshare ownerships are listed in the trust, as long as your family members names aren't on the actual timeshare deeds or contract, when the time comes for your estate to be settled your heirs need only decline to accept the timeshares and they will go back to Wyndham. That has no impact on the rest of your estate.

Are your finances in such a dire state that your family has cause to worry that you will be dependent on them for your basic necessities for the remainder of your life? If that isn't the case then ask yourself if you are obsessing and causing yourself and your family a lot of stress. If all your grandchildren have heard is how you were taken advantage of and ripped off repeatedly it is no wonder they have such a horrible impression of timeshares and want no part of them. All of us can think back to when we were younger and our older relatives would get on their high horse about certain things, their pet peeves, how they were wronged, etc. We would mentally or often actually roll our eyes, think here we go again, maybe even say something to end the conversation because we were tired of hearing about it for the umpteeth time! It doesn't hurt to take stock once in awhile and ask ourselves if we are becoming that older family member.

If you feel that you won't be able to use your timeshares anymore, the maintenance fees are an unnecessary expense, and no close or even extended family members want them you have several options. Give a responsible family member a limited power of attorney for timeshares and only the timeshares. This is what you can do to help them. Have them get on a speaker phone with you to Wyndham so they can get your ownership page opened and take a screen shot of what you own, the resort, type of points, annual, biannual points and the use year. Ask the rep tell them exactly how many points are left in the use year for each one and request estoppel letters. Next you and that family member contact Ovations to see what they will take back and list the rest in the "free to a good home" section as I call it here on TUG. If you are suffering from the delusion that the timeshares you paid thousands of dollars for are worth anything then you need to get over that asap. You might see something, not much but something, for the Ocean Walk deed but the others are too small and typically the ones people give away often even paying the closing costs. Ovations might take some or all of it back and give you a couple of years use of the points. You didn't supply any information on the remaining fixed week. Depending on where it is there are still people who want them so you might see something for that one too but it won't likely be anything near what you think.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

The "system" was introduced to me in 2013 when I bought a Discover package and my check was destroyed as the office declared it invalid. I never purchased timeshares to rent for profit so I never used it. Also when told alll profit over 14 days was taxable I knew I didn't want to use it.


Jan M. said:


> So in the trust are the following:
> 
> Branson at the Falls, deeded, 105,000 points. In your name only?
> Location(s) unknown, fixed weeks, 203,000 points. Owned by your sister and daughter-in-law.
> ...


That was taken back by ovations in 2013 when the others pulled out because it was costing $80/month for 77,000 points which left me 402,000 points which I have enjoyed. You are right the eyes roll whenever the subject is brought up. But, I am still hoping for some value to help pay for my contract with Buy a Timeshare. I know you are tired of hearing that too as they are. I still have faith that all will be sold when the right person wants it as much as I did.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> The "system" was introduced to me in 2013 when I bought a Discover package and my check was destroyed as the office declared it invalid. I never purchased timeshares to rent for profit so I never used it. Also when told alll profit over 14 days was taxable I knew I didn't want to use it.
> 
> That was taken back by ovations in 2013 when the others pulled out because it was costing $80/month for 77,000 points which left me 402,000 points which I have enjoyed. You are right the eyes roll whenever the subject is brought up. But, I am still hoping for some value to help pay for my contract with Buy a Timeshare. I know you are tired of hearing that too as they are. I still have faith that all will be sold when the right person wants it as much as I did.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> The "system" was introduced to me in 2013 when I bought a Discover package and my check was destroyed as the office declared it invalid. I never purchased timeshares to rent for profit so I never used it. Also when told alll profit over 14 days was taxable I knew I didn't want to use it.
> 
> That was taken back by ovations in 2013 when the others pulled out because it was costing $80/month for 77,000 points which left me 402,000 points which I have enjoyed. You are right the eyes roll whenever the subject is brought up. But, I am still hoping for some value to help pay for my contract with Buy a Timeshare. I know you are tired of hearing that too as they are. I still have faith that all will be sold when the right person wants it as much as I did.


In trust. Daytona 192k branson 105k and GSL 105k. 402k silver.


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## Jan M. (Aug 4, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> But, I am still hoping for some value to help pay for my contract with Buy a Timeshare. I know you are tired of hearing that too as they are. I still have faith that all will be sold when the right person wants it as much as I did.



I just looked at their website. I can't even begin to tell you how horrified I am! Kiss that money goodbye and please, please, please quit kidding yourself. Their prices are so grossly over inflated that I would be truly astounded if they ever sell anything! Anyone could buy developer points directly from Wyndham for less than they are asking and at least have the potential to build a VIP account. NO ONE pays that much resale deeds, especially the smaller point deeds.

I think you are a good person. Why would you "have faith" hoping for someone to be naive or foolish enough not to know that is company this a scam and buy from them? Is that what you want for someone else; do you really want to benefit at the expense of another one of this company's victims?


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

Jan M. said:


> I just looked at their website. I can't even begin to tell you how horrified I am! Kiss that money goodbye and please, please, please quit kidding yourself. Their prices are so grossly over inflated that I would be truly astounded if they ever sell anything! Anyone could buy developer points directly from Wyndham for less than they are asking and at least have the potential to build a VIP account. NO ONE pays that much resale deeds, especially the smaller point deeds.
> 
> I think you are a good person. Why would you "have faith" hoping for someone to be naive or foolish enough not to know that is company this a scam and buy from them? Is that what you want for someone else; do you really want to benefit at the expense of another one of this company's victims?


No I wouldn't want them with Wyndham as it is but my faith is in the timeshare I bought in the trust which gave me some light at the end of my tunnel about some value in it. Maybe they will have an ovation that will give me something for my deeds rather than charge me to use what I owned. I will continue using my deeds until I am either dead or given a fair value.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

The letter I sent to Little Rock last April was not returned as the ones later were.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

The letter I sent to Little Rock last April was not returned as the ones later were.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

The letter I sent to little Rock last April was not returned


Nomad34 said:


> No I wouldn't want them with Wyndham as it is but my faith is in the timeshare I bought in the trust which gave me some light at the end of my tunnel about some value in it. Maybe they will have an ovation that will give me something for my deeds rather than charge me to use what I owned. I will continue using my deeds until I am either dead or given a fair value.


Whose website were you looking at?


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## chapjim (Aug 4, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> I don't have any timeshares with Wyndham as title and Deed says they are Fairfield not Wyndham. Interesting thought though since my Daytona property and branson both had a membership with my sister's SS number before contracts changed who knows who owns them. Title and Deed required producing my sister's death certificate before it could be changed in Las Vegas.



This is insane!  Please!!  Contact your attorney.  Does your attorney know you seek advice on a message board? 

Among other things, you attorney can explain the legal consequences of Fairfield becoming Cendant, then Cendant becoming Wyndham.  In my opinion, there are none. This is a non-issue.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

chapjim said:


> This is insane!  Please!!  Contact your attorney.  Does your attorney know you seek advice on a message board?
> 
> Among other things, you attorney can explain the legal consequences of Fairfield becoming Cendant, then Cendant becoming Wyndham.  In my opinion, there are none. This is a non-issue.


Thank you  yes he knows and is not interested in my donating my deeds to my charity which may help me in my insanity.


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## Jan M. (Aug 4, 2017)

Whose website were you looking at?[/QUOTE]

Seriously? Whose website? That would be Buy A Timeshare, the company *you* said named in a previous post in this thread! You do remember them, the company that scammed you out of God only knows how much money?



chapjim said:


> This is insane! Please!! Contact your attorney. Does your attorney know you seek advice on a message board?





Nomad34 said:


> Thank you  yes he knows and is not interested in my donating my deeds to my charity which may help me in my insanity.



Of course your attorney isn't interested. You have been told before here on TUG that it is highly unlikely that a charity would want your timeshare deeds. It appears that you do follow and read the various threads so how have you missed being repeatedly told that once you buy a timeshare the only thing that has any value is the enjoyment you get out of going to the resort(s). They cannot be considered to have any cash value, none, zip, zero, nada.

No matter how many times any of us have tried explaining various things to you it seems that you aren't really able to understand any of what you've been told.  And you are paying an attorney but don't listen to him either. I'm truly hoping that your posts are your idea of a joke and you get some enjoyment out of playing all of us here on TUG. Otherwise we have to conclude from your posts that you should be turning all control of your affairs over to your family and attorney.


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## CYRUS2400 (Aug 4, 2017)

Jan M. said:


> once you buy a timeshare the only thing that has any value is the enjoyment you get out of going to the resort(s). They cannot be considered to have any cash value, none, zip, zero, nada.


Well said.


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## ronparise (Aug 4, 2017)

Ok, who thinks Nomad34 is the latest reincarnation of Robert Longwell?


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

The attorney has been paid so I don't owe anymore.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

Not familiar with him so maybe I am. Just thankful for the monies I had to buy them.


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## Braindead (Aug 4, 2017)

chapjim said:


> This is insane!  Please!!  Contact your attorney.  Does your attorney know you seek advice on a message board?
> 
> Among other things, you attorney can explain the legal consequences of Fairfield becoming Cendant, then Cendant becoming Wyndham.  In my opinion, there are none. This is a non-issue.


I bet their attorney has tried to explain it all also to no avail. I bet his eyes role also.
I was negotiating a lease with an elderly gentleman. We both dealt with the same attorney and the elderly gentleman was doing estate planning at the same time. No matter what the attorney did even if it was exactly what the elderly gentleman said and wanted he would come back and change it. Several times from legal wording to laymen terms. Finally the attorney told him in an elegant way. You are lonely and doing all this for conversation and attention. I'm not going to charge you for anymore services. You can either sign the documents [lease and estate planning] or you can find a new attorney that needs your business and money because I'm not taking anymore of your money.

Sad to say but I think that's what we are dealing with here. Alone elderly looking for interaction not help with any problems


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## Braindead (Aug 4, 2017)

ronparise said:


> Ok, who thinks Nomad34 is the latest reincarnation of Robert Longwell?


With a concussion


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## Jan M. (Aug 4, 2017)

ronparise said:


> Ok, who thinks Nomad34 is the latest reincarnation of Robert Longwell?



If you are correct, and after reflecting on previous posts from this individual I think you may be, it is time for him to be permanently banned from TUG.


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## spackler (Aug 4, 2017)

This thread has gone off the rails...

Any other comments about the webcast/meeting?


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## chapjim (Aug 4, 2017)

ronparise said:


> Ok, who thinks Nomad34 is the latest reincarnation of Robert Longwell?



The thought has crossed my mind.


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## CYRUS2400 (Aug 4, 2017)

Hate to ask this question, but was there any mention on how awesome the Points Deposit Feature was going to be (versus the credit pool)?


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## Nomad34 (Aug 4, 2017)

chapjim said:


> The thought has crossed my mind.


It has been a great trip and now I can just relax and enjoy without anymore tomfoolery.


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## Jan M. (Aug 4, 2017)

For those of you who watched the webcast, only the center sections of the main floor and the balcony had people seated in those sections because that is where the camera was pointed. I didn't think it was as well attended as the previous meetings I've been to at the Bonnet Creek location.

The lunch time munchies were very good and much more plentiful than I expected them to be. Maybe because they had planned for more people and had a number of no shows for the the event? I did really miss sitting at the large tables and getting to talk to the other owners at my table. The small 4 person, higher cafe type tables aren't optimal for the age group that attends the meetings.

The speakers didn't try to bluff it out over the issues with the new website. What was really noticeable was the frequent silence and minimal applause. I think they were expecting at least a little warmer response than they got but the meeting wasn't interrupted by any incidents.

It didn't go over well that the new CEO was too busy with another meeting to be able to attend his first annual owners meeting. We now know that the meeting he was at in New Jersey was about splitting the timeshare and hotel divisions but at the time it felt like a slap in the face.

I was hoping to find a party weekend that interested me as they give a $100 off if you sign up for one at the meeting. In the past the party weekends included two things, this year they only included one thing. When we did a party weekend in Branson that I booked at the meeting three years ago we had the dinner show on the Showboat Belle, dinner at the Chateau, a lovely place btw, and a breakfast/lunch get together before the sales presentation that was actually enjoyable. This year the Branson party weekend only included the Showboat Belle. I wondered if the cut backs were because with the new website issues they aren't very likely to make sales at the two hour presentation you are required to attend.

I attended one of the executive sessions. We were told and I asked to make sure I understood that VIP owners get the discount for the full stay they are booking as long as the first day of the stay is within the appropriate window. It isn't working that way for me, nor for some other people either.

Hey Dagger, I looked out for you and your wife! When the topic of handicapped units came up I suggested they send out emails to everyone booked into one asking them to notify the resort if they don't need a handicapped unit. That seemed to me to be something that would be very easy to program the system to do. I learned at this meeting how sub par the handicapped units are at some of the resorts. Handicapped units with bathtubs but no walk in shower. Handicapped units on the second floor and no elevator.

Someone asked if there were any plans for allowing pets at the resorts in the future. NO

In walking around overhearing conversations all day I can tell you if there were two or more people talking they were discussing the changes and the new website issues. I came away from the meeting with the impression that the Wyndham executives present hadn't truly understood how widespread the problems with the system are or how many different problems there are. Here on TUG we are just a small percentage of Wyndham owners, not necessarily representative of the overall ownership. It would appear that if there are any owners who have absolutely no problems with the new system and the changes, then they are in a very small minority.


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## Braindead (Aug 4, 2017)

cayman01 said:


> With the average owner owning 260k in.points there is no way there are 200,000 VIP. More likely in the 40-60k area or less.


They talk number of members. Is each owner under a membership a separate member ?
If the average member number has 4 owner members. The average member number would have over a million points.
I didn't say it but I thought someone posted atleast half of members had VIP benefits.


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## cayman01 (Aug 4, 2017)

Braindead said:


> They talk number of members. Is each owner under a membership a separate member ?
> If the average member number has 4 owner members. The average member number would have over a million points.
> I didn't say it but I thought someone posted atleast half of members had VIP benefits.



 I was always under the assumption that they counted accounts not individual members. What I would be interested in is how many resale owners there are vs. direct purchase.


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## ronparise (Aug 4, 2017)

cayman01 said:


> I was always under the assumption that they counted accounts not individual members. What I would be interested in is how many resale owners there are vs. direct purchase.



Not sure how you would use the data but:

1) A lot of folks have both developer purchased points and secondary market points in their accounts

2) every point in circulation was originally sold by the developer

3) Recently Wyndham changed their sales goals to put more emphasis on creating more owners over upgrade sales

4) Wyndham has recently entered the secondary market with ovation. I don't have the numbers but I think new development is less now than in the past. So they need to get points back to feed their sales operation. If ovation can't deliver enough, I wouldn't be surprise to find that Wyndham starts buying points and ultimately gets control of the secondary market


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## dagger1 (Aug 5, 2017)

Nomad34 said:


> Not familiar with him so maybe I am. Just thankful for the monies I had to buy them.


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## dagger1 (Aug 5, 2017)

Jan M. said:


> For those of you who watched the webcast, only the center sections of the main floor and the balcony had people seated in those sections because that is where the camera was pointed. I didn't think it was as well attended as the previous meetings I've been to at the Bonnet Creek location.
> 
> The lunch time munchies were very good and much more plentiful than I expected them to be. Maybe because they had planned for more people and had a number of no shows for the the event? I did really miss sitting at the large tables and getting to talk to the other owners at my table. The small 4 person, higher cafe type tables aren't optimal for the age group that attends the meetings.
> 
> ...


Jan M, we were at Riverside Suites in 105 degree weather in San Antonio.  Had a great long weekend, wore my TUG "I paid more for this t-shirt than my Timeshare....." t-shirt all weekend.  Hope to see you next January in Orlando!!


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## time4share (Aug 6, 2017)

spackler said:


> Would there be a point to watching?  Spending a few hours listening to false promises by tone-deaf executives seems like a waste of time.
> 
> It's not like they'll allow any sort of Q&A or feedback.



It is a waste of time. It's only a feel good for owners. The only HOA that really exists at one of the resorts is the people who still own a deeded property. Not points and not access. Don't be fooled. The reason Wyndham is collected the deeded properties is to be in control of it all. 
What would interest me is a GoToMeeting or a webinar or even a good old fashion traditional meeting to get a game plan together and possibly bring a real live class action against the Deep State Wyndham executives. It will make stocks tumble so you will want to dump it before then at its low buy it up so we the owners can tell them how WE like it. My two cents. Thanks for listing. Another passed off 3 million point idiot


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## time4share (Aug 6, 2017)

time4share said:


> It is a waste of time. It's only a feel good for owners. The only HOA that really exists at one of the resorts is the people who still own a deeded property. Not points and not access. Don't be fooled. The reason Wyndham is collected the deeded properties is to be in control of it all.
> What would interest me is a GoToMeeting or a webinar or even a good old fashion traditional meeting to get a game plan together and possibly bring a real live class action against the Deep State Wyndham executives. It will make stocks tumble so you will want to dump it before then at its low buy it up so we the owners can tell them how WE like it. My two cents. Thanks for listing. Another passed off 3 million point idiot
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



How much more of this crap am I going to need to swallow? Wyndham is screwing us all and no one person but me will fight back   


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Nomad34 (Aug 6, 2017)

Why do you think you are alone in this?  I feel that a fight has been waged and won by the Fair share trust. The small print in the 2014 -15 stated VIP would be only for owners, ones inheriting (children or grandchildren) no resales.


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## regatta333 (Aug 7, 2017)

Jan M. said:


> I attended one of the executive sessions. We were told and I asked to make sure I understood that VIP owners get the discount for the full stay they are booking as long as the first day of the stay is within the appropriate window. It isn't working that way for me, nor for some other people either.



That is because of the stupid way they have designed the new system, where every single day on the calendar has the required points associated with the booking.  The individual day on the calendar will not show the discount until it is within the window, even if your start date is within the window.  This is also why you can now only view availability by individual room type, and not everything that is available for your dates.  This is completely unnecessary feature.  I was fine with waiting until I had selected my dates and room type and only then seeing the number of points that would be required.


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## Braindead (Aug 7, 2017)

regatta333 said:


> That is because of the stupid way they have designed the new system, where every single day on the calendar has the required points associated with the booking.  The individual day on the calendar will not show the discount until it is within the window, even if your start date is within the window.  This is also why you can now only view availability by individual room type, and not everything that is available for your dates.  This is completely unnecessary feature.  I was fine with waiting until I had selected my dates and room type and only then seeing the number of points that would be required.


How is it possible that all days of your reservation aren't in the discount window if your start date is in the discount window ?
In the old system didn't  your start date date have to be in the discount window ?
I thought the new system would be better. Because if the reservation you want is available one might be willing to give up the discount on 1 or 2 nights at the start to get the reservation


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## Baby Jane (Aug 7, 2017)

Braindead said:


> How is it possible that all days of your reservation aren't in the discount window if your start date is in the discount window ?
> In the old system didn't  your start date date have to be in the discount window ?
> I thought the new system would be better. Because if the reservation you want is available one might be willing to give up the discount on 1 or 2 nights at the start to get the reservation


On the old system it varied whether your whole stay was in discount window. I think that was based on resorts check in day If it was Friday and you were booking Sunday through Sunday the Friday and Saturday nights were not in discount window. I occasionally came across that then and it was frustrating. New way is even more so  I am finding by the time all your days are in the discount window the room you want is not available for the first part of your stay


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## regatta333 (Aug 7, 2017)

Braindead said:


> How is it possible that all days of your reservation aren't in the discount window if your start date is in the discount window ?
> In the old system didn't  your start date date have to be in the discount window ?
> I thought the new system would be better. Because if the reservation you want is available one might be willing to give up the discount on 1 or 2 nights at the start to get the reservation



Because I believe they have the new systems designed such that it totals the points indicated on all of the individual calendar day boxes.  The boxes apparently do not get updated based on whether the check-in date is in the discount window, but based on whether each individual day is in the discount window.


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## vacationhopeful (Aug 7, 2017)

OLD system was if the reservation was a SPLIT reservation ... 2 different units.. you did NOT get the discount on the 2nd reservation unless THAT 2nd unit was also inside the discount window.

And yes, the NEW way does benefit Wyndham as they do NOT have to pay for all those extra nights beyond the discount window for ANY day NOT in the VIP discount window.

No surprise to me ... definitely a GREAT benefit to Corporate Wyndham's ledger sheet.


Just wait til Wyndham's computer staff figures out HOW to NOT GIVE unit upgrades or points discount to any reservation unless ALL days are in the discount/upgrade booking window.


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## Jan M. (Aug 7, 2017)

Just wait til Wyndham's computer staff figures out HOW to NOT GIVE unit upgrades or points discount to any reservation unless ALL days are in the discount/upgrade booking window.[/QUOTE said:
			
		

> They already have! Contrary to what they assured my group in the executive session I attended at the owners meeting.
> 
> Can any other platinum owners as of today book October 7-14 for 7 nights at any resort and get their discount on the entire stay? I know I can't.


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## Braindead (Aug 7, 2017)

Never mind I'm thinking seasonal points


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## north (Aug 7, 2017)

I'm only gold, but I get my 35% discount if I try to book October 7-14.  I have to search the specific resort to get the discount for all the days.  If I search on the region, I only get a discount on the first night.


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## Braindead (Aug 7, 2017)

time4share said:


> It is a waste of time. It's only a feel good for owners. The only HOA that really exists at one of the resorts is the people who still own a deeded property. Not points and not access. Don't be fooled. The reason Wyndham is collected the deeded properties is to be in control of it all.
> What would interest me is a GoToMeeting or a webinar or even a good old fashion traditional meeting to get a game plan together and possibly bring a real live class action against the Deep State Wyndham executives. It will make stocks tumble so you will want to dump it before then at its low buy it up so we the owners can tell them how WE like it. My two cents. Thanks for listing. Another passed off 3 million point idiot
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk





time4share said:


> How much more of this crap am I going to need to swallow? Wyndham is screwing us all and no one person but me will fight back
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


There's plenty of owners willing to fight Wyndham. Some already have and won but most have lost. Win or lose most of us can't discuss the outcome.
Not against Wyndham but I for one have been the original organizer putting a group together for a possible class action suit. The group settled without filing a suit. I ended up filing suit on my own because I had a unique situation different from the group.

Tell us the issues that justify a class action lawsuit. If they have to do with the rule changes most here have come to the conclusion that Wyndham has the right to change the rules. None of us like the changes but understand that Wyndham has the authority to do so.

There's no shortage of class action attorneys in this country. I'm sure some have looked at this case with Wyndham and have yet to come up with anything worth their time and investment to proceed forward. This would be the perfect format for an attorney to get something started.

Wyndham has the authority to do away with all VIP benefits. Some after the changes thought there should be a lawsuit over losing cancel rebook.
Can you imagine being a witness on the stand and Wyndhams attorney ask you if you can cancel a reservation ? Answer yes. Can you book an available reservation? Answer yes. Case over

Before you call us cowards or wimps for not willing to fight Wyndham. Give us just cause to fight.


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## time4share (Aug 7, 2017)

Braindead said:


> There's plenty of owners willing to fight Wyndham. Some already have and won but most have lost. Win or lose most of us can't discuss the outcome.
> Not against Wyndham but I for one have been the original organizer putting a group together for a possible class action suit. The group settled without filing a suit. I ended up filing suit on my own because I had a unique situation different from the group.
> 
> Tell us the issues that justify a class action lawsuit. If they have to do with the rule changes most here have come to the conclusion that Wyndham has the right to change the rules. None of us like the changes but understand that Wyndham has the authority to do so.
> ...



I never called anyone cowards or wimps. Let's get that on the forefront. I'm a pissed of elite owner. I spend thousands a month on maintenance fees and I can not use the new website. I have a situation I can not discuss on this forum. You are right Wyndham reserves the right to change whatever the hell they want to. I'm pissed because we all fall victim of there lies. All in the name of more sales. Well not if I can help it and neither should any of you. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Looks like it has helped by looking at their stocks. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Braindead (Aug 7, 2017)

time4share said:


> I'm a pissed of elite owner. I spend thousands a month on maintenance fees and I can not use the new website. I have a situation I can not discuss on this forum. You are right Wyndham reserves the right to change whatever the hell they want to. I'm pissed because we all fall victim of there lies. All in the name of more sales. Well not if I can help it and neither should any of you.


There have been been names of Wyndham employees posted here that might of been able to help you get resolution.
There are government agencies posted here that have helped some get access back within 24 hrs.
Hope your attorney helps in moving your issues along to a quick resolution for you.
Sometimes when people get lawyers involve the issues become harder to resolve. Hope that's not the case for you.

You didn't use names but did state that no one here but you will fight back. That's just false and implies no one here has a backbone


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## Avislo (Aug 7, 2017)

Attended the Fairfield Trust meeting on Orlando.  It was very interesting.  Especially, when two executives met with me one on one and one executive met with a member of my family while we were on a family reunion.  The summery of the meetings with the Executives looked good to me.

I also attended a "Count on Me" meeting at Bonnet Creek that featured a presenter and a video pertaining to the new site.  The comment of note from the presenter in my session was they were doing the presentations because they do not want people calling Wyndham anymore on matters relating to the new website or words to that effect.  After the presentation, a sales person was supposed to meet with people in attendance.  My sales rep was more interested in being at the font desk where the people were that checked in attendees and the sales manager was there.

We were given some forms to fill out and submitted that were profile related forms.  After what seemed like forever, I went up to the front desk and the Sales Manager sent me to gifting.  Turned the forms in.  Learned something new for me from the gifting group.  The person that helped me indicated, that at least at Bonnet Creek, the gifting staff was now Expedia and that it had been that way for about three years.


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## Braindead (Aug 7, 2017)

Avislo said:


> Attended the Fairfield Trust meeting on Orlando.  It was very interesting.  Especially, when two executives met with me one on one and one executive met with a member of my family while we were on a family reunion.  The summery of the meetings with the Executives looked good to me.
> 
> I also attended a "Count on Me" meeting at Bonnet Creek that featured a presenter and a video pertaining to the new site.  The comment of note from the presenter in my session was they were doing the presentations because they do not want people calling Wyndham anymore on matters relating to the new website or words to that effect.  After the presentation, a sales person was supposed to meet with people in attendance.  My sales rep was more interested in being at the font desk where the people were that checked in attendees and the sales manager was there.
> 
> We were given some forms to fill out and submitted that were profile related forms.  After what seemed like forever, I went up to the front desk and the Sales Manager sent me to gifting.  Turned the forms in.  Learned something new for me from the gifting group.  The person that helped me indicated, that at least at Bonnet Creek, the gifting staff was now Expedia and that it had been that way for about three years.


Ron's right again!
Nomad=Avislo on his meds 
He said he was going to the annual meeting and did


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## Nomad34 (Aug 8, 2017)

Avislo said:


> Attended the Fairfield Trust meeting on Orlando.  It was very interesting.  Especially, when two executives met with me one on one and one executive met with a member of my family while we were on a family reunion.  The summery of the meetings with the Executives looked good to me.
> 
> I also attended a "Count on Me" meeting at Bonnet Creek that featured a presenter and a video pertaining to the new site.  The comment of note from the presenter in my session was they were doing the presentations because they do not want people calling Wyndham anymore on matters relating to the new website or words to that effect.  After the presentation, a sales person was supposed to meet with people in attendance.  My sales rep was more interested in being at the font desk where the people were that checked in attendees and the sales manager was there.
> 
> We were given some forms to fill out and submitted that were profile related forms.  After what seemed like forever, I went up to the front desk and the Sales Manager sent me to gifting.  Turned the forms in.  Learned something new for me from the gifting group.  The person that helped me indicated, that at least at Bonnet Creek, the gifting staff was now Expedia and that it had been that way for about three years.


Thank you for your report. I feel the light at the end of the tunnel just turned on again. I am looking forward to talking with board members from the trust next week.


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## Avislo (Aug 8, 2017)

Your welcome.


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## ronparise (Aug 8, 2017)

And now he seems to be talking to himself


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## Silverdollar (Aug 9, 2017)

Ok, I've got this dilemma. We leave for Bonnet Creek this Saturday and I've got to make a decision. Do I boycott the sales presentation/update in order to make a statement about the new website, or do I go and openly tell everyone what I think? On the one hand, I want to refuse to attend another update until the website is fixed. On the other hand, I want to see what kind of spin they try to put on the whole website debacle. What would you do?


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## Braindead (Aug 9, 2017)

Silverdollar said:


> Ok, I've got this dilemma. We leave for Bonnet Creek this Saturday and I've got to make a decision. Do I boycott the sales presentation/update in order to make a statement about the new website, or do I go and openly tell everyone what I think? On the one hand, I want to refuse to attend another update until the website is fixed. On the other hand, I want to see what kind of spin they try to put on the whole website debacle. What would you do?


If you do decide to go. Make it clear you would buy more points if the website actually worked. Also you will never buy until owners stop being denied access to their account.

The quicker and louder sales report to corporate  the website is hurting sales the better


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## SmileLynn (Aug 9, 2017)

We attended the sales update. When we passed on the contract offered to us, we were asked to write decline on it and initial. That's when I also wrote: "No purchase until the website is fixed. My vip ownership has been devalued the way it works now." The same message was repeated on the exit survey. The presenter didn't object as he said he's heard it plenty of times!


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## Silverdollar (Aug 10, 2017)

SmileLynn said:


> We attended the sales update. When we passed on the contract offered to us, we were asked to write decline on it and initial. That's when I also wrote: "No purchase until the website is fixed. My vip ownership has been devalued the way it works now." The same message was repeated on the exit survey. The presenter didn't object as he said he's heard it plenty of times!


Over the next year, most of us here will be asked to attend an update or multiple updates. We are all wondering what we can say or do to bring about positive change with the new website. What you have done is a great example for all of us. Thank you for sharing.

Maybe others have ideas or suggestions they can share for bringing about positive change. Who has attended an update since the launch of the new website? Who is planning to attend an update? What is your "action plan"?


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## bestpal38 (Aug 10, 2017)

Silverdollar said:


> Ok, I've got this dilemma. We leave for Bonnet Creek this Saturday and I've got to make a decision. Do I boycott the sales presentation/update in order to make a statement about the new website, or do I go and openly tell everyone what I think? On the one hand, I want to refuse to attend another update until the website is fixed. On the other hand, I want to see what kind of spin they try to put on the whole website debacle. What would you do?


I went to a sales update yesterday, and I complained about the website. The only response I got was, It's new, it will get better. He then told me I was free to go get my gift. Total time......15 minutes.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 10, 2017)

Good to hear. I have 3 more possible sales but probably on DNT list. Hope not as they can be interesting.


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## SmileLynn (Aug 10, 2017)

During the annual meeting one of the presenters referenced sessions between the web team and owners in previous days before the meeting. This was also referenced to in session 1 & 3 of the executive round tables which I attended.  I was one that got to meet with 2 from the web team. We met in a conference room in the Wyndham Grand. My understanding is there were 2 groups. One group was owners meeting with web designers on things wrong with the new website. I was in the other group. I was to give feedback on new functions/features that were "possibly" coming to the website.
I was asked questions like:
How long I've been with Wyndham, my favorite resort, computer literacy, what operating systems I use, what apps I use & other websites I visit.  I let them know I used Chrome, Safari, Explorer and Edge. There was also times when one operating system wouldn't let me log in so I would try another. I seem to have the best luck with my Chromebook as it doesn't keep history or cookies. He seemed to genuinely interested on how I navigated around and on what devices. 
They were from Rokkan in New York. I was told they were web designers. They had an apple laptop to have me walk through a demonstration. I would be recorded so they could see how I did things. More questions. They wanted me to be comfortable talking about things while being recorded. How familiar was I with the website. They were interested that I've made more than 50 transactions since the rollout & how I book. I sometimes plan in advance, change travel plans & book elsewhere. Sometimes it's last minute. I also like my vip discounts,
The recording began. I was shown a screen similar to what it looks like now after logging in. Was told to make a reservation at Bonnet Creek for a specific day. I immediately clicked on the orange button which didn't work. I was told I was to use the reservation box listed on the screen. I was asked why I chose that path so I explained how when in the discount window when I used the orange BOOK button and entered an exact resort I got my correct discounted points & when I go the path he was directing me I only got part of my reservation discounted. He was unaware and would look into it. ( I was questioned more about it, but the point was made.) 
So i was to enter bon into the location, Bonnet Creek dropped down, I clicked on it. Was told not to pick a date yet. Pressed enter. The BC page appeared but a few differences. There was an arrow in the date box. It dropped down & I could select a month. October. The month appeared. I could choose the number of bedrooms on the left, 1, 2, 3, 4, or all. Selected all & immediately showed the calendar with available, limited availability, or not available. Next I choose a check in and check out date. Another box on the lower right popped up showing what room types was available for those days. When I picked the room type, it told me the points. I could change the room type. I could change dates simply by clicking on the dates. So simple.
Also located at the bottom of the screen was 4 small boxes, 1 box for each of the two months prior & after the month I was searching for. In each box there was a number like August 4, September 6, November 9 and December 14. I was told the number represented the number of consecutive nights available in those months.
After viewing this I was asked if it was an improvement. Yes it was, but I felt it still had a ways to go. I would be nice to be able to search more than 1 resort at a glance. 4 or 5 would be nice.
I asked when this might roll out. He didn't know or even that it would be as I seen it. It wasn't his decision. They were getting feedback from owners and thank me for my time.
I was in there just shy of 45 minutes. Got $100 AMX card for my time. 
I googled Rokkan and looked around but found this link probably the most interesting  www.rokkan/work/wyndham-vacation-ownership/
I still don't know what to make of it, but wondered if anybody else had anything to add.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 10, 2017)

SmileLynn said:


> During the annual meeting one of the presenters referenced sessions between the web team and owners in previous days before the meeting. This was also referenced to in session 1 & 3 of the executive round tables which I attended.  I was one that got to meet with 2 from the web team. We met in a conference room in the Wyndham Grand. My understanding is there were 2 groups. One group was owners meeting with web designers on things wrong with the new website. I was in the other group. I was to give feedback on new functions/features that were "possibly" coming to the website.
> I was asked questions like:
> How long I've been with Wyndham, my favorite resort, computer literacy, what operating systems I use, what apps I use & other websites I visit.  I let them know I used Chrome, Safari, Explorer and Edge. There was also times when one operating system wouldn't let me log in so I would try another. I seem to have the best luck with my Chromebook as it doesn't keep history or cookies. He seemed to genuinely interested on how I navigated around and on what devices.
> They were from Rokkan in New York. I was told they were web designers. They had an apple laptop to have me walk through a demonstration. I would be recorded so they could see how I did things. More questions. They wanted me to be comfortable talking about things while being recorded. How familiar was I with the website. They were interested that I've made more than 50 transactions since the rollout & how I book. I sometimes plan in advance, change travel plans & book elsewhere. Sometimes it's last minute. I also like my vip discounts,
> ...


Great review. Thanks. I am enjoying now searching for other dates even though I have booked all of this year's points. I did cancel one and booked one in discount time and upgraded to 2 BR. Will find out Sunday if auto upgrade comes up for September. It took me some time to recognize the box apply after entering the dates but was happy to see search other places in area if mine wasn't available. A person at church asked me to find Thanksgiving (Wed,- Sun) in Orlando. I figured all was booked and it was. If I see him I know I can get Sunday to Wednesday in the area but I am only silver so I know he would want something cheaper. I am well pleased now now and still use my old ID and password. I use chrome.


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## OutSkiing (Aug 10, 2017)

Thanks for sharing!  Its encouraging that they are experimenting with unique ideas. Rokkkan seems to be a pretty classy digital agency .. way too good for Wyndham.  But from the link it looks like it was a 'quick study' .. no telling whether Wyndham will take any advice.  Also, Rokkan looks to be into the gigantic pictures we all hate .. more of the brand image kind of thing rather than good function.

Bob


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## Sandi Bo (Aug 11, 2017)

SmileLynn said:


> During the annual meeting one of the presenters referenced sessions between the web team and owners in previous days before the meeting. This was also referenced to in session 1 & 3 of the executive round tables which I attended.  I was one that got to meet with 2 from the web team. We met in a conference room in the Wyndham Grand. My understanding is there were 2 groups. One group was owners meeting with web designers on things wrong with the new website. I was in the other group. I was to give feedback on new functions/features that were "possibly" coming to the website.
> I was asked questions like:
> How long I've been with Wyndham, my favorite resort, computer literacy, what operating systems I use, what apps I use & other websites I visit.  I let them know I used Chrome, Safari, Explorer and Edge. There was also times when one operating system wouldn't let me log in so I would try another. I seem to have the best luck with my Chromebook as it doesn't keep history or cookies. He seemed to genuinely interested on how I navigated around and on what devices.
> They were from Rokkan in New York. I was told they were web designers. They had an apple laptop to have me walk through a demonstration. I would be recorded so they could see how I did things. More questions. They wanted me to be comfortable talking about things while being recorded. How familiar was I with the website. They were interested that I've made more than 50 transactions since the rollout & how I book. I sometimes plan in advance, change travel plans & book elsewhere. Sometimes it's last minute. I also like my vip discounts,
> ...



Thanks for great info. 

But, seriously, they picked an advertising agency to rewrite their timeshare inventory system?  Says alot right there. 



OutSkiing said:


> Thanks for sharing!  Its encouraging that they are experimenting with unique ideas. Rokkkan seems to be a pretty classy digital agency .. way too good for Wyndham.  But from the link it looks like it was a 'quick study' .. no telling whether Wyndham will take any advice.  Also, Rokkan looks to be into the gigantic pictures we all hate .. more of the brand image kind of thing rather than good function.
> 
> Bob



These images are killing my data plan - rokkan sites loads even slower than Wyndham's!


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## Silverdollar (Aug 11, 2017)

SmileLynn said:


> During the annual meeting one of the presenters referenced sessions between the web team and owners in previous days before the meeting. This was also referenced to in session 1 & 3 of the executive round tables which I attended.  I was one that got to meet with 2 from the web team. We met in a conference room in the Wyndham Grand. My understanding is there were 2 groups. One group was owners meeting with web designers on things wrong with the new website. I was in the other group. I was to give feedback on new functions/features that were "possibly" coming to the website.
> I was asked questions like:
> How long I've been with Wyndham, my favorite resort, computer literacy, what operating systems I use, what apps I use & other websites I visit.  I let them know I used Chrome, Safari, Explorer and Edge. There was also times when one operating system wouldn't let me log in so I would try another. I seem to have the best luck with my Chromebook as it doesn't keep history or cookies. He seemed to genuinely interested on how I navigated around and on what devices.
> They were from Rokkan in New York. I was told they were web designers. They had an apple laptop to have me walk through a demonstration. I would be recorded so they could see how I did things. More questions. They wanted me to be comfortable talking about things while being recorded. How familiar was I with the website. They were interested that I've made more than 50 transactions since the rollout & how I book. I sometimes plan in advance, change travel plans & book elsewhere. Sometimes it's last minute. I also like my vip discounts,
> ...


Excellent! Thanks for sharing.

I leave for Bonnet Creek tomorrow. If I decide to go to the owner update, I would like to present them with an exhaustive list of concerns/complaints with the new website and/or changes to the program. I would appreciate any help Tug members/guests could give me with compiling this list. For example what are your top 5/10 complaints with the new website and/or program changes?


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## CYRUS2400 (Aug 11, 2017)

My biggest beef is with the change from a 3 year, flexible 'Credit Pool' to a very restrictive fixed 1 year Points Deposit process.  As someone who was locked out early on with the new system, and who fears being locked out again, they need to be extra responsive to members who are having account access issues.  Those are my 2 complaints.


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## Bigrob (Aug 11, 2017)

The encouraging thing about this is that whether or not it gets implemented in the way they tested with OP, they are at least recognizing the search function is broken. If they implement in the manner suggested it would be much more useful.


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## wjappraise (Aug 11, 2017)

Silverdollar said:


> Excellent! Thanks for sharing.
> 
> I leave for Bonnet Creek tomorrow. If I decide to go to the owner update, I would like to present them with an exhaustive list of concerns/complaints with the new website and/or changes to the program. I would appreciate any help Tug members/guests could give me with compiling this list. For example what are your top 5/10 complaints with the new website and/or program changes?



1. Lack of correct tracking of points. 
2. "Modify" option doesn't work when trying to book. 
3. Ability to upgrade units doesn't work. 
4. Can't see inventory that's available near the dates of search.  
5. ARP doesn't work. 
6. Extremely slow program. 
7. Numerous reservations don't show on upcoming list. 
8. Some reservations show duplicates. 
9. Owner names are wrong. 
10. Numerous outages report as "Aw, Snap"

That's just ten. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## spackler (Aug 11, 2017)

11. Default setting for reservations list is in *reverse* chronological order.  This makes zero sense.
12. Absurd use of spacing/pictures on many pages
13. Floor Plan not viewable for any resorts
14. No Print View for reservations
15. Converted Week ownerships don't list what week you can ARP


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## ronparise (Aug 11, 2017)

CYRUS2400 said:


> My biggest beef is with the change from a 3 year, flexible 'Credit Pool' to a very restrictive fixed 1 year Points Deposit process.  As someone who was locked out early on with the new system, and who fears being locked out again, they need to be extra responsive to members who are having account access issues.  Those are my 2 complaints.



One of the Wyndham execs I've talked to referred to me, in a derogatory way, as a "points puller" they didn't like what I was doing as it allowed me the use of two years of points without paying mf. So they ended the points pulling feature of the credit pool and replaced it with the 2 year points deposit feature

Don't expect the credit pool to return to what we had.  It ain't gonna happen

There are as I see it three "buckets" of complaints

1) stuff that just dosent work, like the upgrade feature
2) new rules we might not like. that aren't going to change. We are going to learn how to work with the new rules 
3) needed improvements 

I agree with big rob. There is reason to be encouraged


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## paxsarah (Aug 11, 2017)

Honestly, I don't think bringing a list of complaints to an "owner update" is a particularly efficient or effective way to send a message to Wyndham about particular issues regarding the website. Expecting a bulleted list of complaints to make it from the sales staff at an update to someone in the organization who understands, cares, and/or can actually influence/implement such changes is pretty darn optimistic. I would mention that the website continues to have significant problems nearly three months after implementation and leave it at that.


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## CYRUS2400 (Aug 11, 2017)

ronparise said:


> One of the Wyndham execs I've talked to referred to me, in a derogatory way, as a "points puller" they didn't like what I was doing as it allowed me the use of two years of points without paying mf.


Let me understand, you'd pool 2018 points in early 2016 and then begin using them in 2016 (2 years prior to paying any MF's)?  If you did that, I agree, you were a 'points puller' and that should not have been allowed.  Most of us smaller points owners just want to have flexibility in planning our vacations.  I pooled my 2016 points very late in 2015 after I'd looked at my personal vacation plans and was then allowed to use those points in 2016 (as I paid fees), in 2017 (after fees had been paid) and/or in most of 2018 (after fees had been paid).  Granted, it was legal for you to do what you did if I understand what you did and I don't begrudge you for working the system. But, if the intent for Wyndham was to stop you, as a 'points puller', they should have just done that.  Now, because of this change, us smaller points owners are forced to use a much less flexible process.  I can't plan a December 2017 vacation, today, because all my 2017 points were moved into 2018 in June 2017 (the latest date allowed for a Silver owner).  I'm very angry about them killing the flexibility afforded me with the Credit Pool.  And, I'm angry that we have to 'experience' how the Deposit feature will work because Wyndham refuses to spell it out the same way each time they are asked.  The system works for me, albeit, not as nicely as it did before, so I want the policy change revisited.  This is my complaint and I'm entitled to having my complaint.


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## Braindead (Aug 11, 2017)

CYRUS2400 said:


> Let me understand, you'd pool 2018 points in early 2016 and then begin using them in 2016 (2 years prior to paying any MF's)?  If you did that, I agree, you were a 'points puller' and that should not have been allowed.  Most of us smaller points owners just want to have flexibility in planning our vacations.  I pooled my 2016 points very late in 2015 after I'd looked at my personal vacation plans and was then allowed to use those points in 2016 (as I paid fees), in 2017 (after fees had been paid) and/or in most of 2018 (after fees had been paid).  Granted, it was legal for you to do what you did if I understand what you did and I don't begrudge you for working the system. But, if the intent for Wyndham was to stop you, as a 'points puller', they should have just done that.  Now, because of this change, us smaller points owners are forced to use a much less flexible process.  I can't plan a December 2017 vacation, today, because all my 2017 points have been were moved into 2018 in June 2017 (the latest date allowed for a Silver owner).  I'm very angry about them killing the flexibility afforded me with the Credit Pool.  And, I'm angry that we have to 'experience' how the Deposit feature will work because Wyndham refuses to spell it out the same way each time they are asked.  The system works for me, albeit, not as nicely as it did before, so I want the policy change revisited.  This is my complaint and I'm entitled to having my complaint.


Exactly my point on another thread.
VIP Platinum is a HUGE benefit for using the point deposit feature. You could make your Christmas plans or change them if something comes up and still deposit any points left on December 31st


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## CYRUS2400 (Aug 11, 2017)

Braindead said:


> Exactly my point on another thread.
> VIP Platinum is a HUGE benefit for using the point deposit feature. You could make your Christmas plans or change them if something comes up and still deposit any points left on December 31st


Unfortunately, I'll never be Platinum unless someone adopts me and/or wills me the status.


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## Nomad34 (Aug 11, 2017)

CYRUS2400 said:


> Unfortunately, I'll never be Platinum unless someone adopts me and/or wills me the status.


I understand and am happy to remain silver. I was just upset when a man told me he had become platinum for $5000. and could use it like my few points. Finally I see some justice for those who paid a lot for the privilege now having it back.


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## spackler (Aug 11, 2017)

An easy solution to the 'points pullers' would be to make them prepay the MFs for the years they were pulling from. That way there's less concern about them cut & running after credit pooling.


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## Silverdollar (Aug 11, 2017)

paxsarah said:


> Honestly, I don't think bringing a list of complaints to an "owner update" is a particularly efficient or effective way to send a message to Wyndham about particular issues regarding the website. Expecting a bulleted list of complaints to make it from the sales staff at an update to someone in the organization who understands, cares, and/or can actually influence/implement such changes is pretty darn optimistic. I would mention that the website continues to have significant problems nearly three months after implementation and leave it at that.


Thank you for your feedback. Maybe you are right. At least I will be prepared with the information, if needed. Also, I wanted to hear from Tug members/guests to get their input to share with "higher ups", when I have the opportunity. 

FYI, I have been in regular communication with a Wyn executive since February about a couple issues, and more recently with two executives since the launch of the new website. This has involved phone calls as well as multiple emails back and forth. Will it make a difference? Who knows? At least I "have their ear" and they continue to answer my emails.


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## CYRUS2400 (Aug 11, 2017)

spackler said:


> An easy solution to the 'points pullers' would be to make them prepay the MFs for the years they were pulling from. That way there's less concern about them cut & running after credit pooling.


Unfortunately, Wyndham chose a different form of punishment.  I suffered as a result.  And this is why I want the policy revisited.


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## ilya (Aug 11, 2017)

paxsarah said:


> Honestly, I don't think bringing a list of complaints to an "owner update" is a particularly efficient or effective way to send a message to Wyndham about particular issues regarding the website. Expecting a bulleted list of complaints to make it from the sales staff at an update to someone in the organization who understands, cares, and/or can actually influence/implement such changes is pretty darn optimistic. I would mention that the website continues to have significant problems nearly three months after implementation and leave it at that.




Sales people will probably throw the list in the trash.


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## ronparise (Aug 11, 2017)

CYRUS2400 said:


> Unfortunately, Wyndham chose a different form of punishment.  I suffered as a result.  And this is why I want the policy revisited.




there was no punishment


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## CYRUS2400 (Aug 11, 2017)

Punishments take on many forms.  I've lost something that I previously had.


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## Silverdollar (Aug 11, 2017)

ilya said:


> Sales people will probably throw the list in the trash.


Maybe so. Here is my thinking: Sales reps can't survive without sales (and neither can Wyndham) and disgruntled owners won't purchase more points with the current level of anger/frustration with the new website. As sales "dry up", I can see the sales force appealing to management to make improvements to the website ASAP. In that sense, I believe sales reps and owners have a common interest - that the website get fixed ASAP.


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## pedro47 (Aug 12, 2017)

Buyers of timeshare have been disgruntled owners for the past 30 years. Do you really thinks Wyndham cares about how we feel about them.


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## Silverdollar (Aug 25, 2017)

ilya said:


> Sales people will probably throw the list in the trash.


Last week, my wife and I went to Wyn. Bonnet Creek. As you know, I was trying to decide whether to attend the update/sales presentation. I asked Tuggers to provide a list of their website complaints to present to the sales rep./manager. I copied and pasted everyone's feedback (along with my own) and took with me. However, after further consideration, I decided to "boycott" the update. When I went to get my parking pass, I told the the lady that I would not be attending another update until the new website was fixed. She immediately pivoted with an offer for a $150 gift card. I told her "no" and that she could offer me $1,000 and I would not attend. I wish I had taken a pic of the ladies face, and those standing around who heard the conversation. Then, I said, "I don't want anyone calling my room". She said that she would put me on the "do not call list". I am happy to say she/they honored my request and I did not receive a call all week.


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## dagger1 (Aug 25, 2017)

spackler said:


> An easy solution to the 'points pullers' would be to make them prepay the MFs for the years they were pulling from. That way there's less concern about them cut & running after credit pooling.


That's exactly what Hyatt does.  If you want to use future "points", you prepay MF's.


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## dagger1 (Aug 25, 2017)

CYRUS2400 said:


> Unfortunately, Wyndham chose a different form of punishment.  I suffered as a result.  And this is why I want the policy revisited.


They did it on purpose.  They know what they are doing, are not as dumb as they want us to think they are.  It will always be about degradation of ownership benefits and more dollars into Wyndham's pockets.


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## dagger1 (Aug 25, 2017)

pedro47 said:


> Buyers of timeshare have been disgruntled owners for the past 30 years. Do you really thinks Wyndham cares about how we feel about them.


EXACTLY....


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