# WKORV Misc. Stuff



## DavidnRobin (Nov 26, 2006)

Part 1 - (from David - still in vaca-mode)
We are still working on the review, but here are some random things.

Overall - we loved the resort and the OF Deluxe unit - the south-side corner was great, and had a specular view.  The light and views from the Lanai and windows on the sides overlooking the park beach are great.  The construction side would have sucked because of the pounding that goes on during the day.  That won't last, but WKORV-N will block views from that side for a lot of the units on the north side.  We would also not like the pool sides because of the noise, but wouldn't be so bad in the front by the ocean. (we don't have kids - so that is a consideration).  WKORV is a great place for families.  Note to (some) parents: letting your kids go into the Koi pond is bad form.  :annoyed: 

I was surprised that WKORV would allow young kids to be in the outside Jacuzzi - especially unsupervised - surprising in this age of litigation.

They should also have a separate towel exchange booth (like St John) - it is annoying to try and exchange towels when people in front are buying and renting stuff.  Also, $18 for renting a snorkle for a day!!! That is almost the price to buy a set at K/Wal-Mart.

Sorry - never went into the pool - so can't give info about the pool temp - nobody seemed to complain.  People go out early to reserve lounge chairs (with towels) - we saw lots of chairs with towels and no people.  They say that chairs cannot stay unoccupied for more than 1 hour, but no one is enforcing that rule.

The food and drinks at the pool-side restaurant/bar were good - pricey, but what else is new.  The Biz center had card key entry which was nice - other *wood places have been open - and kids occupied the computers playing games or doing whatever in myspace.com. At WKORV - most computer use was by adults - on and off quickly.

The weather was great all week (85F-68F) - rained one day - never humid.  The wind was never an issue.

Our wedding ceremony on during Sunday's sunset at Kapalua Beach was perfect.  The people on the beach were considerate - our weather and sunset were great - best all week. And, of course, my bride was beautiful.  We had a flower circle and a duet that played music (Maui Wedding Song, Brown-Eyed Girl, Your Song, Have I Told You Lately..., Fields of Gold, etc.) - and they coordinated and performed the ceremony. Very simple, casual, romantic and personal - with our family around us - everything we wanted.  Went to the unit for champaigne, and then to Roy's in Kahana afterward - food was great - lacked ambience, but all was good.

The WKORV beach area was good - good snorkling (relatively) once you get beyond the small break (that can catch one off guard if not careful - ouch) - and there is a sea turtle that resides between the south and north complexes. Lots of fish life.  The entry from the park is easist, then north towards WKORV, and then back (with slight current) back to the park.

Hmmm... let's see...
The entry foyer to the units is ~50sqft (7x7) and not 72sqft as someone claimed (at least for our foyer).  The entry hallway takes up a lot of space, but ended up being useful for our sandy/wet stuff.

The garbage is suppose to be taken to the bin the elevator, but don't think people read about that.  The mid-week tidy was fine - they didn't clean the sand in the foyer, but not sure is they were suppose to.  We washed our towels as needed.

The space in both sides of the Deluxe Villa was good - also the light. The ceilings were high also - nice.  The windows were doubled paned - the overall construction is good.  The OF lanai was larger than I thought it would be - I would estimate 7.5 x 25.

We managed a full T-Day diinner with 10 people.  We ordered a cooked turkey from FoodLand - Safeway was sold out.

Everything worked well.  We didn't really deal with WKORV staff while we were there - the way I prefer it.

Loved the Heavenly Bed, Heavenly Shower, and the Heavenly Tub - we actually took 3 tubs during our stay - especially great with being able to look outside during sunset.

They should switch out the TVs to flat-screens.

The studio balconies at WKORV-N seemed small, but probabky better than the 'Juliet' balconies at WKORV.  WKORV-N is set further back and closer to the road.  There are going to be some poor views at WKORV-N, but less than WKORV.  I can see why some people are upset with their views at WKORV.

More later...


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## DavidnRobin (Nov 26, 2006)

Part 2 (sure wish this BBS had spell-check...) -

The TS Owners Update...
They were really selling WKORV-N - it was amazing how much space at WKORV they had for TS sales - the TS salesman told me that they had 130 TS salespeople.  I could believe it - lots of offices behind the SVO operations in the Lobby.

WKORV-N will be open in July 2007.

They gave us 4500 SPG points for attending the 60 minutes 'Owners Update'.  Actually wish I hadn't attended, but found out some stuff - some not good.  I tried to get through without telling them I had bought resale, but he was wondering why we weren't 'Gold' status in our documentation saying that we bought our WKORV OF villa in 2003 (for $65000!) and our WSJ villa in 2000.  And why we weren't given  higher floor (we ended up on the 2nd floor).  Of note: he claims that if OF Deluxe at WKORV are sold by SVO are valued at ~$85K, and showed us a chart showing the value per year.  This chart had the Oct/2001 price at ~$47K and OV at ~$42K.  I didn't catch the price increase for OV except it was around $50K now.  He was going to exchange out our unit at WKORV for WKORV-N OF, but never got that far once he found out we bought resale.

He was pleasant, and was telling us about the benefits of trying to get to 5* Elite before finding out about our resale purchases..  He wouldn't give me the documentation about the SPG member levels once he found out about resale.  He did suggest we buy Cancun cheaply and covert our resale WKORV OF so we could get to Gold (or 3* - don't recall).  He did say we did quite well with our resale purchases and was trying to do 'something' for us (don't know what...) with his manager - then came back and said he couldn't do anything.  Not sure what he was trying to do - I had told him we had 3 weeks already (we are in resale contract for Kierland).  He said Kierland is selling Cancun and suggested we discuss with them.  He also suggested cancelling our Kierland contract and buy developer Kierland to convert our WKORV.

As I said - he was all set to get us to 3* SPG - then found out we bought our units resale.  At this point we could have left, but he was nice about it.  He was in the process of explaining the different levels and benefits.  The one thing I found to be interesting (and not good for resale owners) that 3* and above SPG members/WKORV owners will get floor preference if they call the the 8-12 month window - even if we call 12 months out.  He stated that room assignments are given out 10 days before check-in for those who called in within the reservation window first based on their SPG status, and then in the order they called in to reserve the week.

I was surprised to find this out - he said with OF units being in low supply - that most OF owners are some type of SPG Elite members and therefore will always have floor prefernece since they are usually the big spenders and own lots of StarOptions and StarPoints.  He said that it may be difficult to get above the 2nd/3rd floor because of this.  He said 3* and above members can call up to 3 months out and request higher floors and they will get floor preference.  This may have been a TS sales ploy to get us to buy from SVO, but the 3* documents I saw did state something regarding floor preference.

I found it interesting that the contract doumentation had the info about our villas - and the original sales and purchase dates, but he didn't know they had been resold. Once he found out we bought resale - he put in in bold letters on top of our contract info.  I don't know if this was a TS ploy, but it made me feel as I should have never told him about the resale and just played dumb and see if he would havr figured it out. He did say he was all set to get us to 5* when he saw our contract info - and did say that the 1st 2000 5* members will become Platinum.  To be honest - I didn't pay attention to the benefits since (as I told him) we only have 3 weeks vacation per year.

Regarding Mandatory vs. Voluntary Resorts:  He did say that all resorts being built are going to be Mandatory because it help SVN control inventory.  This totally contradicted what a Tugger who went to the Owners Update a couple of days earlier where the TS salesman said that the new resorts are Voluntary.  I mentioned this to him and he said that info was incorrect, and that many TS salesman do not know the difference and were likely thinking about StarOption conversion to StarPoints.

He seemed knowledgable, but you never know - I won't bank on anything he said.  I hope the whole floor preference was misinformation.  It would suck to call first thing 12 months out and end up on the bottom floors.  I would be interested in others who have bought WKORV resale, if this were true.

Again - overall - things were great all week - we loved the resort, the unit, and the island.

per DeniseM recommendation - we did the sunset Trilogy trip to Lanaii the day after our cermony - it was great.  We also did the bike trip down the Volcano (not sunrise) - the weather was so good - I wore shorts the whole trip down.  We could see the Big Island from the top.

Enough for now. We will write our review (10).
Time to start planning for St John...


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## mesamirage (Nov 26, 2006)

Thank you for the fantastic post!! and CONGRATS on the wedding!!


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## tomandrobin (Nov 27, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> As I said - he was all set to get us to 3* SPG - then found out we bought our units resale.  At this point we could have left, but he was nice about it.  He was in the process of explaining the different levels and benefits.  The one thing I found to be interesting (and not good for resale owners) that 3* and above SPG members/WKORV owners will get floor preference if they call the the 8-12 month window - even if we call 12 months out.  He stated that room assignments are given out 10 days before check-in for those who called in within the reservation window first based on their SPG status, and then in the order they called in to reserve the week.


 
I find this interesting also. So if you call and are lucky enough to score a unit at 7 months out, and you are an elite member, you will get a better floor/view? I thought "home" resort members had preference.


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## tomandrobin (Nov 27, 2006)

*Congrarts*

Congrats on your wedding!!!!


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## ciscogizmo1 (Nov 27, 2006)

Congrats on your wedding... Sounds like you had a great week.


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## DavidnRobin (Nov 27, 2006)

tomandrobin said:
			
		

> I find this interesting also. So if you call and are lucky enough to score a unit at 7 months out, and you are an elite member, you will get a better floor/view? I thought "home" resort members had preference.


Thanks for all of your well-wishes.

This is what I was lead to believe - although I am not positive since this came from a TS salesman interested in getting me to buy and convert our resale to get into the Elite program.

'Home' resort owners should have preference.  He did say that most OF WKORV owners were in the Elite program and would have floor preference over me.  And he did insinuate that 5* Elite and Platinum SPG members would get unit/floor upgrades no matter what.

He also said that villa assignments are made 10 days prior to check-in - and something about 3* and above being able to call 60-90 days out to make villa requests.

I have no problem calling in 12 months in advance at 8AM PST to reserve and make a floor request, but to do this and then end up on the 1st floor because Elites ended taking the upper floors would piss me off.  This is not stated in the CCRs or Owners Manual (that I recall seeing), but they are selling this as a benefit of the Elite program.

I would be interested in finding out if this is true.  Also, what have been resale owners experience in their getting villa/floor requests.  If you are an exchanger that is not in the SPG program - you would really be at the bottom of the list.  There are quite a few lousy locations at WKORV.


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## nodge (Nov 27, 2006)

tomandrobin said:
			
		

> I find this interesting also. So if you call and are lucky enough to score a unit at 7 months out, and you are an elite member, you will get a better floor/view? I thought "home" resort members had preference.



My recent StarOption reservation at WKORV less than 8 months out included the following notice from Starwood in my confirmation e-mail.

Quote from Starwood:



			
				Starwood said:
			
		

> Important Information Regarding Your Reservation
> -Every effort will be made to meet your special requests, including your villa assignment requests.
> -Villa assignment requests on reservations made during the Starwood Vacation Network(SM) Reservations Period (eight months or less prior to the arrival date) are fulfilled on a first-come, first-served basis.
> -Owners of The Westin Ka`anapali Ocean Resort Villas are not guaranteed their deeded view on reservations made during the Starwood Vacation Network reservations period (8 months or less prior to arrival date). .
> ...



Another thread here on TUG . . .

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18937&page=2&highlight=elite+wkorv

. . . discusses the meaning of "once all the other requests have been processed" language relating to elite member requests.  

In general, and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, Starwood elites have NOT been very successful in upgrading their floor/view at WKORV when the place is full,  but they have been able to upgrade their floor/view on rare occasions when a better floor/view unit would otherwise go unused.  In the latter case, in choosing which owners to upgrade to the unused floor/view units, Starwood appears to first offer them to elite members (based on pecking order among those 3 and 4 star elites who timely requested it within the timeframe specified by Starwood and the 5 star elites who's request is automatically requested) before offering them to non-elites.

In other words, based on Starwood’s PUBLISHED rules at least, Starwood appears to be giving WKORV owners that call within their home resort priority period (12-8 months out) floor priority (if they specifically ask for it when making their reservation) within their ownership view category (OF, OV, IV) on a first come / first served basis independent of their elite status. Elite status only comes into play when Starwood divvies up the remaining units that are reserved less than 8 months out.  In those cases, it would still appear to be first come / first served, with elites being given priority only after "all the other requests have been processed."

Congrats on your wedding!

-nodge


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## tomandrobin (Nov 27, 2006)

This is something that we are going to have to consider. If view and floor level can be affected by "Elite" status, maybe I need to reconsider my next purchase and go for a small developer unit to push us into the "Elite" status. 

I know on one of our last trips, we had a terrible view overlooking a parking lot. This was not a Starwood trip, but I would hate to have spent all the money we have so far with Westin and have our next trip looking at a bunch of rental cars. Thats not why we bought into Starwood.


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## MON2REY (Nov 27, 2006)

I know this has been addressed before in generalities so please bear with me.  We have not yet booked our first stay at WKORVN.  It sounds like the time stamp is very important to insure that we get the best location available.  For this reason we would want to have all the information required readily available so that the reservation process is a quick as possible.  My question is: what info do we need to have available so that all the questions (and our preferences) can be answered as quickly as possible when we do call in at 8:00 EST?  Thanks for any help.


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## DavidnRobin (Nov 27, 2006)

MON2REY said:
			
		

> I know this has been addressed before in generalities so please bear with me.  We have not yet booked our first stay at WKORVN.  It sounds like the time stamp is very important to insure that we get the best location available.  For this reason we would want to have all the information required readily available so that the reservation process is a quick as possible.  My question is: what info do we need to have available so that all the questions (and our preferences) can be answered as quickly as possible when we do call in at 8:00 EST?  Thanks for any help.



It depends on your unit type (of course), but if you want highest floor - like most requests seem to be - first you supply your home phone number, then resort location, then week/date you are requesting with check-in day, then unit(s) [for Lock-offs], and then high floor and/or building request.  I think that is pretty much it.

Do you have to reserve by the end of the year in 2007?  You should call into SVN and ask what you will be be asked for.

Good luck.


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## vic714 (Nov 27, 2006)

nodge said:
			
		

> In general, and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, Starwood elites have NOT been very successful in upgrading their floor/view at WKORV when the place is full
> -nodge



Nodge is correct. 
We called in at 8:00 AM EST at 1yr out, made our request for the highest floor and still only got 1st floor OF even though we were the 8th reservation of the day . I had thought that since there are 11 OF units we would have been higher but I guess I was wrong. I had even called in at the 60 day window to confirm my request for a high floor and that didn't seem to work.
My 4* elite status did help get my mother upgraded from a studio to a 1 br unit and she had a great visit to Maui (her first time).
On Thanksgiving day the weather was perfect, and since the balconcy is so large we were able to move the table outside and enjoy our meal overlooking the ocean. My kids thought we were nuts for getting up at 7:00 to start cooking but it was worth it. I'm glad we were in building 2 since the trees are so high on the other side. We are already counting down the days until next July when we go back.

Victor


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## vic714 (Nov 27, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> Regarding Mandatory vs. Voluntary Resorts:  He did say that all resorts being built are going to be Mandatory because it help SVN control inventory.



We were told just the opposite. 

Our salsperson told us that Starwood is going to start making more of the resorts voluntary so that it opens up availabilty to people in SVN. The way she explained it, it did make sense to a point. If someone buys resale for a fraction of the price why should it hurt the people who paid the developer price from getting into the hard to get resorts. When I made the point that it really cuts down on the resale value for the voluntary resorts she replied that anyone who buys a timeshare and tries to sell it in less than 10 years is an idiot. You'll never be able to turn around and get your money back. This was the first time I had ever heard a salesperson admit that a timeshare really isn't an investment.

They did do the hard sell on me to get me to 5*, but I told them it would be cheaper for me to buy a 3 br in Orlando ( about $12,000 cheaper upfront and $900/yr in MF's ). At that point she did get mad and said that I would never be able to get into HI with my FL Staroptions. When I told her that we did last year we were told we got lucky and we basically got the boot. I guess we'll see if we get our 4500 starpoints.

Victor


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## DavidnRobin (Nov 28, 2006)

As I said - I told the TS guy that I heard the opposite (SVN buiding V resorts) and he said that was not correct.  Too bad that they can't just be upfront.

So far - WKORV-N is mandatory. and it sounds as if WPORV is Voluntary.  Maybe they are both wrong.

My guy seemed knowledable about M vs. V resorts - at least knew what it meant to buy resale at either.  He commented something about SVN able to fill a resort with exchangers being a benefit to SVO properties when they were in the SVN system.


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## Denise L (Nov 28, 2006)

vic714 said:
			
		

> At that point she did get mad and said that I would never be able to get into HI with my FL Staroptions.



What is ironic here is that the sales executives are supposed to be telling potential owners that their Staroptions will allow them to book at any of the SVO resorts, including WSJ, Harborside, etc., regardless of where they purchase. That is one of the key benefits of the system.  Imagine if you had tape recorded that statement and played it back in a sales office at Vistana Villages...what would potential buyers there think?

Impossible scenarios aside, I would hope someday that Starwood would attempt to accept the resale owners and woo them to buy developer the next time.  Burning bridges and getting defensive/angry benefits no one, but fostering good relationships could pay off big time in the future.  You would give a good review of your presentation, enticing would-be owners to take a tour and be wowed by the kindness and honesty of the sales staff.  If they had the money, they'd buy because of 1) the product and 2) the pleasantness of it all.

I know a couple who were just beginning their WKORV tour just after they had purchased a Hyatt week from the developer.  They mentioned this & the Starwood sales executive criticized them on their purchase, insisting that they overpaid and that Starwood was a better product. Guess what? The couple walked out, furious, without even taking the tour, even though they were ready to buy (with cash!) because they loved the resort from their brief visit.  Had the sales executive complimented them on their purchase (and maybe even been knowledgable about the Hyatt system), and then suggested that they add another fantastic location to their portfolio, he would have had his commission.


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## vic714 (Nov 28, 2006)

deniselew said:
			
		

> Imagine if you had tape recorded that statement and played it back in a sales office at Vistana Villages



Denise,
Great idea. I wonder why I didn't think of that.

BTW
IV Deluxe are still available at WKORV ( 3 weeks as of 11/22 )2007 usage
$48,900 and 120,000 points
OV were available too, but I couldn't get pricing on those.
I tried to get them to upgrade my Gold EOY WMH to annual at WRORV but they wouldn't cross sell properties.

I was also told that Starwood exercises ROFR on all OF units at WRORV so that they can resell them for $89,900. I just kind of laughed and thought about Robin and David enjoying their honeymoon in the OF deluxe resale unit.

It gets more interesting each time we go to these updates.

Victor


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## DavidnRobin (Nov 28, 2006)

vic714 said:
			
		

> Denise,
> Great idea. I wonder why I didn't think of that.
> 
> BTW
> ...


I think that the OV price was in the low to mid-50s.  It was the morning after T-Day and I wasn't paying close attention (should have taken notes) - I was going to blow-off the update, but decided at the last minute to go. 

I know of 3 OF WKORV units that sold resale within the last year (including ours).  I didn't comment about this to the TS guy - that if WKORV is selling them for $89K why they didn't excercise their ROFR in the low 50s, and turn around and resell them.  I actually think they could get around 70-75K considering that OF WKORV-N are selling for 69K.

The contact paperwork that I saw said that our unit (title) sold in 2003 for ~65K from SVO with 150K SPs.


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## duke (Nov 28, 2006)

vic714 said:
			
		

> They did do the hard sell on me to get me to 5*, but I told them it would be cheaper for me to buy a 3 br in Orlando ( about $12,000 cheaper upfront and $900/yr in MF's ). At that point she did get mad and said that I would never be able to get into HI with my FL Staroptions. When I told her that we did last year we were told we got lucky and we basically got the boot. I guess we'll see if we get our 4500 starpoints.
> 
> Victor



Vic:

Did they hard sell you on the "limited availability" of SPG Platinum cards?  When I was at WKORV 2 months ago they told me that there were less than 200 SPG Platinums left if I became 5*.  They tried to hard sell me on the WKORV IV's.

You can get the extra staroptions you need to get to 5* if you buy an EOY Resale and requalify it with a VV EOY developer.  See post by Nodge.

Duke


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## vic714 (Nov 28, 2006)

duke said:
			
		

> Vic:
> 
> Did they hard sell you on the "limited availability" of SPG Platinum cards?  When I was at WKORV 2 months ago they told me that there were less than 200 SPG Platinums left if I became 5*.  They tried to hard sell me on the WKORV IV's.
> 
> ...



Duke,

The limited availabilty of the SPG Plat card was the point that they were stressing the most. 

I already have a EOY Plat resale that I'm going to get requalified so the purchase at WKORV would have been put me well over the 559,000 staroptions needed. Right now I need approx. 90K more options to get to 5 star so I really do not have alot of choices in what to purchase. I'm hoping that when Aurba goes into sales they have a 97,500 unit. We'll see.

Victor


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## duke (Nov 29, 2006)

vic714 said:
			
		

> Duke,
> 
> The limited availabilty of the SPG Plat card was the point that they were stressing the most.
> 
> ...



Vic:

Did they tell you how many SPG Plat cards are left?  I wish we could verify the number.

I am waiting for Desert Willow to go on sale to complete mine.  Otherwise I would buy a Vistana Villages.  VV seems to be the least expensive.  Any ideas?

Duke


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## wilma (Dec 11, 2006)

We stayed at WKORV Nov 25-Dec 2, and while we enjoyed our week in Maui I'm not sure I would ever trade there again. It's a very different situation for traders & you really run the risk of getting a lousy view unit as a trader. We dodged a bullet and were given a 1 bedroom unit in bldg 4 with a dull view of the backside of bldg 3. When we asked to be moved to a unit with a nicer view, the front desk person just laughed and said that she had many more miserable people with views of the construction & highway. One morning a fellow was pleading to be moved saying his wife & kids were mad at him for their horrible unit with a view of the crane and construction. Even when the construction is done, many units will face the highway. Yes, the units are great, the bed is wonderful & the showers heavenly. But I find it weird to be in Hawaii and have a view of a blank wall on a bldg, at least they could have planted something on the wall. There are just too many bad view units at WKORV and I don't want to be stuck in one of them.
The Westin does seem rather cheap about many things like their mid-week cleaning and replenishing supplies especially given the high maintenance fees. We asked the housekeeping person for more dishwashing soap after using the 2 that were supplied at check-in, and he said absolutely not, his manager instructed him not to give out anymore or he would get in trouble! That's just cheap. At the mid-week cleaning they did give us new towels but just remade the bed and did not change the sheets and there was still sand in the bed. And they also don't have any welcome party just the nightly entertainment, that was nice, and the chance to buy $6 drinks. They also need more bbqs especially for those in the back of the complex. There are also no bbq spatulas or tongs in the unit and you must check them out in the store, but they were out when we asked. Just cheap...
We had to call down twice after they power washed the lanai above us and dumped water & sand all over our lanai. We asked them to clean it up and they responded that we would have to pay extra for additional cleaning. I then had to talk with a manager who agreed to do it for free! Then a few days later a window washer dropped his squeezee mop head on me while I was sitting & reading on the lanai. It made a big mess and hurt! He then yelled down to me, he was a couple of floors higher, and told me to bring it up to him! I called down to the front desk and made them come and get it. They did clean it up and gave us a bottle of wine.
The beach was great and we enjoyed snorkeling and also went scuba diving right out in front. We rented chairs from Snorkel Bobs because the Westin prices were too high, seems to me that they don't need to charge for beach chairs. Had great dinners at Pacific O in Lahaina and Mamas, yes they are too expensive but great. We loved Maui but would probably opt for the Maui Marriott next time.


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## DavidnRobin (Dec 11, 2006)

Sorry to hear about your experience.  Did you trade through II or was this a SVN exchange?  How far ahead?

We did not have these issues, but this is why we bought OF at WKORV (because of potential view issues) - of course we paid a hefty premium.

We didn't have mid-week cleaning issues - I would have been pissed if the sheets were not changed.

Being on the south corner was great.  I requested this corner again (2nd to a high floor request) for 2007.  Note: when you call in to reserve a specific building - they go by the building letter and not number (Building 3 is Building B)

Hopefully, we will get a higher floor next time.  It will be interesting to see what happens - when I called (exactly at 8AM EST - 12 months out) - the SVN agent said that we were the first callers and no one else had reserved ahead of us.  If we get pushed down to a low floor next year - I am going to the mat about this. While a TS salesperson claim the 'elite' get floor privileges (and unit assignments are made 10 days ahead of time) - the documentation about this claims that reservation orders are time-stamped.


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## wilma (Dec 11, 2006)

Traded through II (used Marriott Canyon villas) about nine months ago. It seems that the only way to get a great unit is to buy OF, it's just not a good place to trade into via II, IMHO.


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## DavidnRobin (Dec 11, 2006)

We talked with another exchanger while we were there who also got a bad unit.  I was surprised to see how many poor locations there were.  Now that WKORV-N is going to be there - the units on the north-side of WKORV and south-side of WKORV-N are going to face one another (not really an OV...)  

Many people do not care about their view as they are not in their units that much - but not us - we like the view and glad we bought OF.  OV reserved 12 months out with a high floor and close to the ocean wouldn't be bad.  I would say anything on the 3rd floor or higher and in the front half (ocean) of the 2 buildings aren't bad, but there are a good number of units that are just poor locations.

A lot of the units at WKORV-N facing the island are really close to the highway, and the set-back from the ocean seemed to be greater than WKORV.

Some of the things you mention about WKORV do seem 'penny-wise, but pound-foolish'.  This was not an issue with us because we knew ahead of time about things we would need to buy/bring with us.  I prefer to have as less interaction with staff as possible.  Our stay was pretty much perfect - the $18/day snorkle rental was comical (and some parents should keep limits with their kids - but that doesn't seem too be the norm nowadays).

During our ceremony on the beach at Kapalua - I was very happy that everyone was considerate and gave us our space.  I find that rare occurance in today's world - and I was proud of 'society' that day.


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## Denise L (Dec 11, 2006)

I didn't realize that the mid-week cleaning included clean sheets. I'll have to find where this is documented. I thought it was towels, make beds, replenish supplies.


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## wilma (Dec 11, 2006)

deniselew said:
			
		

> I didn't realize that the mid-week cleaning included clean sheets. I'll have to find where this is documented. I thought it was towels, make beds, replenish supplies.


Well the little card in the room said--"Mid-week tidy (3 days after arrival) includes making of the bed with fresh linens, placing clean towels & trash removal." 
They did make the bed but with the same sand infested sheets. They emptied the trash but didn't leave any additional bags so we had to go find some extras. The housekeeping staff appeared very stressed and probably understaffed. Again, I suspect Westin is just being cheap and could loosen up a bit considering the high maintenance fees.


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## Denise L (Dec 11, 2006)

Thanks. I logged onto mystarcentral and it says

_Q:   What housekeeping services do I receive as an Owner?  

A:   The Resort's housekeeping staff will have your villas thoroughly cleaned prior to your check-in. They will also provide you with a midweek cleaning, which includes replenishment of towels and a bed make-up with linen change. 
The midweek service is scheduled as follows: 

If you checked in on Friday, you will receive your midweek service on Monday. 
If you checked in on Sunday, you will receive your midweek service on Wednesday. 
If you need to change your scheduled day for midweek service, there will be a small fee charged. _

Did you ask them to come and change your sheets after you found out that they did not? How awful, not the service we expect at all.




			
				wilma said:
			
		

> Well the little card in the room said--"Mid-week tidy (3 days after arrival) includes making of the bed with fresh linens, placing clean towels & trash removal."
> They did make the bed but with the same sand infested sheets. They emptied the trash but didn't leave any additional bags so we had to go find some extras. The housekeeping staff appeared very stressed and probably understaffed. Again, I suspect Westin is just being cheap and could loosen up a bit considering the high maintenance fees.


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## nell (Dec 11, 2006)

Denise,

I found this under FAQ on our resort on mystarcentral:

A:   The Resort's housekeeping staff will have your villas thoroughly cleaned prior to your check-in. They will also provide you with a midweek cleaning, which includes replenishment of towels and a bed make-up with linen change. 
The midweek service is scheduled as follows: 

If you checked in on Friday, you will receive your midweek service on Monday. 
If you checked in on Sunday, you will receive your midweek service on Wednesday. 
If you need to change your scheduled day for midweek service, there will be a small fee charged.  

I thought I read somewhere (I can't find it right now) that the supplies (like soap powder and dishwashing liquid) were not replenished.  

I am concerned that it seems more and more people are having a problem with service and not just the views. :annoyed:  With the amount we pay for MF, service should be exceptional (JMHO)!

Jonelle

Seems we were posting at the same time.


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## wilma (Dec 11, 2006)

I had already read Hoc's review and was prepared for no replenishment of dishwashing soap or shampoo. But it just seems so cheap & petty, why not hand out 2-3 more dishwashing soaps. I didn't call again about the sandy sheets as I had already called them several times about other problems and we just brushed the sand off ourselves. But WKORV does not have 5 star service and we left WKORV feeling like blujahz noted that it was penny-wise but pound-foolish. I also don't buy the argument that some people don't care about the view. That might be ok for a garden view or mountain view but I suspect most people are pretty unhappy about construction or highway views on their Hawaii vacation.


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## DavidnRobin (Dec 12, 2006)

no argument here... we bought OF for this reason - if you have an 'island' view - you pretty much have a highway view - especially at WKORV-N

II traders into WKORV are going to have a good chance of getting a bad room from what I can tell - unless you are at the right 'Elite' level.  You have to compete with owners, SVN exchangers and Elite starpoint stays.   Hmmm.... maybe this is why Tuggers suggest that you buy where you want to stay.


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## pharmgirl (Dec 12, 2006)

What really annoys me is as an owner of ov, if I don't make arrangements at least 8 mths prior i am put in same category as non-owner. last time I didn't realize this and we were initially put into highway view.  If we had known we would have made another time to visit.  We also own at marriott, if there aren't any of your "view" they let you know - I would prefer that - not gambling with getting what you bought.

Now I know that you need to make reservations 8 - 12 mths in advance - thats difficult.  Especially if you may at a later time decide you don't need entire 2 br/2 bath and lose your "place" in the lineup


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## DavidnRobin (Dec 12, 2006)

I know what you mean - this aspect of TS took me a while to understand, but it is what it is - and they sell it that way. (8 to 12 months ahead)

Our solution - is what we love about TS - it forces us to plan our vacations ahead of time - and with our Westin trifecta (for us) is that we go 3 times a year - to places we want to go - and should go once per year.  Plus - we like low season in general.

In the SVO/SVN program - it pays to be 'Elite' (the higher - the better) - and they also sell it that way.  The SPG folks that have the best flexibility are those at 5*/Platinum - funny how that works...


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