# Ongoing problems with Starwood Villa Finder



## Sicnarf (Feb 3, 2016)

It looks like the online villa finder has been down for the last hour.


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## tlpnet (Feb 3, 2016)

It was down all day (at least from ~10:00 am PST) yesterday.  I finally emailed someone last night.

-tim


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## okwiater (Feb 3, 2016)

It's working fine for me right now.


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## DeniseM (Feb 3, 2016)

It worked fine for me both yesterday, and today.


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## Sicnarf (Feb 3, 2016)

It still not working for me.  And I tried it in my personal PC, work PC and even my Smartphone.  It could be localize to certain areas since an SVN rep confirmed it was down when I called earlier.


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## LobsterHunter (Feb 3, 2016)

Maybe just the east 1/2 of the US is down, been down for me all day too.


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## aeroflygirl (Feb 3, 2016)

Not working in Hawaii since yesterday.


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## lizap (Feb 4, 2016)

Working fine down South.


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## pacman777 (Feb 4, 2016)

lizap said:


> Working fine down South.



Not working in Mexico since yesterday


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## lizap (Feb 4, 2016)

Well it was working, now it's not, ---now working again..



lizap said:


> Working fine down South.


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## golf261 (Feb 4, 2016)

Hasn't worked in Indiana for the past 3 days.  I did contact SVN yesterday - was told their IT department is working on it, but did not know how long it would take to get it up and going.


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## DeniseM (Feb 4, 2016)

Starting about 9:30 last night, it has been up and down for me.  

Starwood is a management short-timer.  You have to wonder how much time and money they are willing to invest in the system, with only one month left in their tenure.


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## tschwa2 (Feb 4, 2016)

It's been down for me for the last 3 days.  I can't even pull up my confirmed reservations online.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 4, 2016)

I am in Switzerland, and was able to get onto villa finder with no issues... (and see my reservations). Everything looks normal.


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## Mauiwmn (Feb 4, 2016)

I was online at 11pm CST last night trying to book OF Maui South for 2/4/17.  System was up and down for first 15 min.  Then it showed me availability and allowed me to get through the  first steps of reserving a week.  When I tried to complete reservation it said technical difficulties and call for assistance.  I went through this same process 4 times.   I was finally able to confirm a reservation.  It was very frustrating.  My time stamp will not be very good for next year.

I called SVN today to advise them of the technical issues and I was told there is nothing wrong with the online system. They are not having any problems. :hysterical:   They would not even take an issue report from me.  I even advised the rep that I saved all the ID numbers from the failed reservations if that would be of any help.

I hope others don't have the same problem.


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## Kildahl (Feb 6, 2016)

golf261 said:


> Hasn't worked in Indiana for the past 3 days.  I did contact SVN yesterday - was told their IT department is working on it, but did not know how long it would take to get it up and going.



Similar experience. Reported it and received an "apology" letter today.


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## Helios (Feb 6, 2016)

Weird, it has been working for me.  I made and updated a couple of resies this week (over several days and times) and everything works OK.  Little slow but that's it.


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## tschwa2 (Feb 6, 2016)

It came back online for me last night several days of error messages.


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## Sicnarf (Feb 6, 2016)

It has been working for me since yesterday.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 6, 2016)

Back home - still working... 
I will be completing (hopefully) a Home Resort reservation at WKORV soon (Prez week) curious to see how it goes given the high demand.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 11, 2016)

So... that was fun.

I just went to reserve Feb11 2017 at WKORV (HomeResort - OFD studio) online EXACTLY at open (9PM PST) and got to submit reservation (after delays), and gave me an error and kicked me out.
Then off/on access to MSC - attempt to get back to online booking. Jammed.

Finally got back to search page, and continued to get multiple errors (technical difficulties try again, one said I had same villa on hold...). Got back to submit page (check terms and conditions) and submitted - error! 

went back to search page - and got a error message that said that I cannot make another reservation (and noticed my SOs dropped).

Looked in upcoming stays - and the reservation was there.  
Took 30 minutes (and a lot of swearing...)

The online booking system is having problems with overload. 

I understand from another that WKORV HomeResort reservations since Jan1 have been challenging.
Well... at least I got it.


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## maph (Feb 11, 2016)

Congratulations on getting something, David.  I've been trying for the last hour, from the second that Feb 11 showed up on the calendar, and never once saw any available inventory for my OFC week.  Looks like I'm screwed!


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## Mauiwmn (Feb 11, 2016)

maph said:


> Congratulations on getting something, David.  I've been trying for the last hour, from the second that Feb 11 showed up on the calendar, and never once saw any available inventory for my OFC week.  Looks like I'm screwed!



I had similar issue.  I got 3 result ID numbers over a 30 min period and all failed to complete the reservation.  Very frustrating.  We have only one week of our two week trip for 2017.

To make matters worse, after sending SVN an email outlining the issues I had last week, I received an email back saying they had fixed the issues.


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## maph (Feb 11, 2016)

Mauiwmn said:


> I had similar issue.  I got 3 result ID numbers over a 30 min period and all failed to complete the reservation.  Very frustrating.  We have only one week of our two week trip for 2017.
> 
> To make matters worse, after sending SVN an email outlining the issues I had last week, I received an email back saying they had fixed the issues.



Were you trying for OFC too?  I never got to the point of having it fail - just absolutely nothing showed up.  I did have exactly the same problems last week as David had tonight, but was able to get a week after a number of 'system error' messages.  

I too now have a hole in next year's Hawaii vacation!  Maybe Mexico...


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## Mauiwmn (Feb 11, 2016)

maph said:


> Were you trying for OFC too?  I never got to the point of having it fail - just absolutely nothing showed up.  I did have exactly the same problems last week as David had tonight, but was able to get a week after a number of 'system error' messages.
> 
> I too now have a hole in next year's Hawaii vacation!  Maybe Mexico...



Yes, I was trying to book OFC,  either side.  It showed availability and gave me result ID numbers which just adds to my frustration.  I understand no availability,  but it is unacceptable for the system to show me availability and then fail to reserve it for me after multiple attempts.

Good luck with your vacation hole.  I may need to rent David's villa for 2/11/17!:whoopie:


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## undrpar64 (Feb 11, 2016)

I own an OFC South, an OF Deluxe South, and OF North. I first tried to reserve an OFC and the same problems came up(technical diffuculties).  I then approached my next search with all sizes and both resorts.  this time it showed availability for the OFD but only as a studio being available.  I went thru the process and completed it to only be rejected by technical difficulties at the end.

Started over.  Logged out and went back to the reservation page and tried to book an OF North.  After several minutes of spinning it showed availability in the North.. I chose a 2 bdrm and started the wheel turning.  Again rejected, this time stating that I currently had a reservation on hold and could not proceed further.  I could not find a place to get back to the previous hold on the OFD.

After another 15-20 minutes of trying to get through I gave up and hoped the reservation on  hold would show up this morning.  It did not.  However I logged on again and quickly booked an OFD Studio within a 30 second period.  The studio was the only one showing availability.

For those of us who book consecutive weeks, I see a problem with the current use of this reservation system.  They need to allow multiple week owners a means to reserve these weeks.  By having to wait week by week we seem to be losing availability, especially after witnessing what I went through last night.  The only OFC and OFD unit available was the studio OFD(only one showing up).
I anticipate the same to occur next week.  If anyone has a solution or any other means of securing a reservation please let me know.


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## Henry M. (Feb 11, 2016)

Similar problems happened last night to me too, booking WKORV OV and WKORV-N IV. The reservation system was erratic. Initially only a 1BR showed for WKORV-N, WKORV showed everything, but the process would break at different points. 

Finally, close to 12:30 EST things seemed to calm down and I was able to make the reservations I wanted. All size units started to show up (Studio, 1BR and 2BR).

I guess the system was overloaded with everyone furiously going after various reservations.

This morning I still see all OV sizes (what I own) available at WKORV, but only 1BR IV at WKORV-N. I have a feeling this is probably similar to last week where it took a couple of days for WKORV-N availability to actually show up. I couldn't make the reservations on the 4th. 

If I look at the 4th today, I still see all sizes available at WKORV, but only 1BR at WKORV-N. January 28 check-in is the same, but only Studio shows for WKORV-N while everything open for WKORV.


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## pathways25 (Feb 11, 2016)

undrpar64 said:


> For those of us who book consecutive weeks, I see a problem with the current use of this reservation system.  They need to allow multiple week owners a means to reserve these weeks.  By having to wait week by week we seem to be losing availability, especially after witnessing what I went through last night.  The only OFC and OFD unit available was the studio OFD(only one showing up).
> I anticipate the same to occur next week.  If anyone has a solution or any other means of securing a reservation please let me know.



I completely agree with this statement.  If I own multiple floating weeks of a particular type, each week that I own should have a chance (whatever that chance is) of getting a reservation for a specific interval equal to all other weeks of that type.  As a practical matter, the way the reservation system works, if I have multiple weeks in the same account, I have to attempt reservations serially which means that for certain weeks like President's Day, Easter and July 4th, by the time I've finished the first reservation, the resort is already sold out and my other weeks have (or had) no chance at all of getting that interval.

It's a very unfair system that seems to favor the single week owners, especially since having multiple weeks in an account makes the system performance slower and decreases the chance of success during the midnight rush.


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## maph (Feb 11, 2016)

Just found out that 4* & 5* elite owners no longer have the ability to waitlist while holding a home resort reservation - first I've heard of it.  Does anyone know where a current list of elite benefits can be found?  I can't seem to find it anywhere in the 'dashboard'.


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## okwiater (Feb 11, 2016)

maph said:


> Just found out that 4* & 5* elite owners no longer have the ability to waitlist while holding a home resort reservation



Who told you that?

The new SVN Elite chart is located here: https://www.starwoodvacationnetwork.com/ownership101#svn_elite

Keep in mind that 4* & 5* can't waitlist for *home resort reservations *-- only SVN reservations.


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## YYJMSP (Feb 11, 2016)

maph said:


> Just found out that 4* & 5* elite owners no longer have the ability to waitlist while holding a home resort reservation - first I've heard of it.



Who said that???  If that's the case, I am livid , as that's the most useful feature of 5*...



maph said:


> Does anyone know where a current list of elite benefits can be found?  I can't seem to find it anywhere in the 'dashboard'.



Hmmm, can't find it any more...


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## maph (Feb 11, 2016)

okwiater said:


> Who told you that?
> 
> The new SVN Elite chart is located here: https://www.starwoodvacationnetwork.com/ownership101#svn_elite
> 
> Keep in mind that 4* & 5* can't waitlist for *home resort reservations *-- only SVN reservations.



The elite owner services rep told me.  You could in the past waitlist a home resort reservation, not only ones made with staroptions.  Apparently that was changed at the same time that the number of star options was increased for OF units, & starts with 2017 reservations.


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## LisaRex (Feb 11, 2016)

You have to go to Ownership 101 page.  They sure hide it well:  https://www.starwoodvacationnetwork.com/ownership101#svn_elite  Hint: You'd think that they'd put it on the "Own More" tab.

If you do not have an SVN account, here is the pertinent information.  Note that you have to buy from the developer in order to qualify for elite status:

SVN Elite

Elevate your Owner experience to new heights of privilege and status as a Starwood Vacation Network (SVN) Elite member. SVN Elite is a special program designed for a very select group of our vacation owners. It¹s our way of showing appreciation to our multiple Vacation Ownership Interest (VOI) Owners and thanking them for their continued loyalty.

SVN Elite Owners who have two VOIs or more and:

    A combined value of 159,000 StarOptions
    A combined value of 359,000 StarOptions
    A combined value of 649,000 StarOptions

SVN Elite Privileges

Benefit    3*/4*/5*

Extended Period for SO Banking: Oct 1/Oct 1/Dec 31
Reduced Fee for SO Banking: Yes/Yes/Yes (no charge)
Convert to SPs every use year:  Yes/Yes/Yes
Extended Period to convert to SPs: Jul 1/Oct 1/Oct 1
SVN Elite Travel Services :  Yes/Yes/Yes
Add'd rewards with Friendship Rewards Program: 30,000/35,000/40,000
More SPs through Signature Escapes Program: 3,000/4,000/5,000
SP Conversion Waived:  No/Yes/Yes
10% premium on SP Conversion:  No/Yes/Yes
Priority Early Villa Check-in (2pm, subject to avail): No/Yes/Yes
SVN Float Period Waitlist while Holding Prior Reservation: No/Yes/Yes
Auto Platinum membership in SPG: No/No/Yes
Platinum Concierge Service: No/No/Yes
Priority Late Villa Check-Out (Noon, subject to availability): No/No/yes


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 11, 2016)

Interesting.

So...to be clear - previously a 4*/5* HomeResort Owner could reserve their VOI and then waitlist for another TS week(s). Of course, that would only be for TS weeks at <12 months - you cannot have waitlisted for a TS week at >12 month anyway.

Added after LisaRex post...
*"SVN Float Period Waitlist while Holding Prior Reservation"*
I do not think a SVN Float Period is considered a HomeResort period... (could be wrong)
so it looks as if there may be misinformation out there (not surprised)


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## YYJMSP (Feb 11, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> Interesting.
> 
> So...to be clear - previously a 4*/5* HomeResort Owner could reserve their VOI and then waitlist for another TS week(s). Of course, that would only be for TS weeks at <12 months - you cannot have waitlisted for a TS week at >12 month anyway.
> 
> ...



SVN Float Period is 8mos to 60days out, so anything booked in it would not be a Home Resort reservation, so we're talking StarOptions.

I'm pretty sure we've never been able to wait-list more than 8mos out, and the waitlist request has always expired at 60days out, so that definitely corresponds with the SVN Float Period definition.

At the time of the waitlist request, you have to designate which existing booking you want to use if it comes through.  I'm sure we've used a Home Resort booking to back the waitlist request.  If the waitlist comes through, and you accept it, they just cancel the Home Resort booking, which then gets turned in to StarOptions, and those get applied to the waitlist booking.


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## maph (Feb 11, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> Interesting.
> 
> So...to be clear - previously a 4*/5* HomeResort Owner could reserve their VOI and then waitlist for another TS week(s). Of course, that would only be for TS weeks at <12 months - you cannot have waitlisted for a TS week at >12 month anyway.
> 
> ...



What misinformation would that be?  You could before waitlist for reservations < 12 months, now it's < 8 months.  Why don't you call them and ask them to verify that if you don't believe it.


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## maph (Feb 11, 2016)

LisaRex said:


> You have to go to Ownership 101 page.  They sure hide it well:  https://www.starwoodvacationnetwork.com/ownership101#svn_elite  Hint: You'd think that they'd put it on the "Own More" tab.
> 
> If you do not have an SVN account, here is the pertinent information.  Note that you have to buy from the developer in order to qualify for elite status:
> 
> ...



Thanks Lisa.  If you compare this wording to the previous table found in Denise's sticky, they've now added the words 'Float Period'.

https://www.mystarcentral.com/elite/chart.html

Rereading these posts, I think I should clear up that I'm not saying that you cannot waitlist a HomeResort reservation; I'm saying that you cannot waitlist a HomeResort reservation until the 8 month mark.  For example, in the past if you waitlisted an OF week & it got filled before 8 months, you got an OF unit with the new check-in date.  Now if you waitlist an OF unit at 8 months, you'll get whatever view is available that matches your date.  If you have IV, then it doesn't matter because you can't do worse than what you already have.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 11, 2016)

maph said:


> What misinformation would that be?  You could before waitlist for reservations < 12 months, now it's < 8 months.  Why don't you call them and ask them to verify that if you don't believe it.



??? I agree with YYJMSP...
I meant misinformation between TUG and SVN/SVO (and even within TUG and SVO/SVN individually).
As posted - the definition of SVN Float week matters, and whether it was recently changed (or not)

I am only a lowly 3* and do not need to waitlist anyway (I travel offseason and do not exchange). Sorry, not going to call - I have no skin in game.  I am just going by what has been reported here, and my years of being on SVO TUG... it was my understanding that waitlisting was for SO reservations (1st in line at 8 months...). Sorry if you are perturbed - it is not my fault. {peace}


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## Helios (Feb 11, 2016)

YYJMSP said:


> I'm pretty sure we've never been able to wait-list more than 8mos out, and the waitlist request has always expired at 60days out, so that definitely corresponds with the SVN Float Period definition.
> 
> At the time of the waitlist request, you have to designate which existing booking you want to use if it comes through.  I'm sure we've used a Home Resort booking to back the waitlist request.  If the waitlist comes through, and you accept it, they just cancel the Home Resort booking, which then gets turned in to StarOptions, and those get applied to the waitlist booking.



This is exactly what my experience has been as both 4* and 5*.  I've never heard about 12 months.  If that was the case, SVN Elite reps and Sales people omitted telling me about this benefit.  I find this hard to believe from Sales people who lie and embellish things to entice a purchase.


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## LisaRex (Feb 11, 2016)

maph said:


> Rereading these posts, I think I should clear up that I'm not saying that you cannot waitlist a HomeResort reservation; I'm saying that you cannot waitlist a HomeResort reservation until the 8 month mark.



Technically speaking, at 8 months, it can't be a HomeResort reservation.  Once the Home Resort Priority period closes, you are doing a StarOption exchange, even if it's back into the resort you own. (That's why you lose your view at 8 months.)

Just sayin'.


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## maph (Feb 11, 2016)

moto x said:


> This is exactly what my experience has been as both 4* and 5*.  I've never heard about 12 months.  If that was the case, SVN Elite reps and Sales people omitted telling me about this benefit.  I find this hard to believe from Sales people who lie and embellish things to entice a purchase.



You're 5* - if you don't believe it's true, why then don't you call them & set us all straight?


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## lizap (Feb 12, 2016)

Working like a charm tonight.  Got a 2 BR WSJ ...


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## YYJMSP (Feb 12, 2016)

maph said:


> You're 5* - if you don't believe it's true, why then don't you call them & set us all straight?



Not sure its even worth a call, since I don't think its ever been a possibility to waitlist 12-8mos out.  I think they're cleaning up the wording to make it perfectly clear, and someone is interpreting it as a change when it isn't...


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## Helios (Feb 12, 2016)

YYJMSP said:


> Not sure its even worth a call, since I don't think its ever been a possibility to waitlist 12-8mos out.  I think they're cleaning up the wording to make it perfectly clear, and someone is interpreting it as a change when it isn't...



maph - I don't need to call to clarify what I am certain.  I have asked this question at least five times between 2013 as 4*, 2014 as 5*, and 2015 as 5*.  I also tried to wait list a reservation at 11 months in 2015 (This is the last time I tried hoping it would work this time).  And of course, it didn't because it is not possible.

Having said that, I like a challenge and I will call today.  I will report back.  My answer will come from the Elite line.  

Would you like me to record the call for quality purposes and as proof?  If you are right, it's on me.  If you are wrong, I'll send you a bill for my time...:hysterical:  in case it is not obvious, this last paragraph is pure sarcasm...


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 12, 2016)

Mauiwmn said:


> Good luck with your vacation hole.  I may need to rent David's villa for 2/11/17!:whoopie:



Too late - already rented (RedWeek/PayPal). 
Record for me - almost 1 year in advance. Glad I do not have to hassle with it during the Holidays at end of year.

I called today to transfer the reservation into Renters' name - Owner Services stated that only HomeResort can transfer the reservation (that is a 1st), and aware of issue of people renting out SVN SOs.

back to online issues... maybe the waitlist issue could have it's own thread?

As to the comment that the online booking is unfair to multiple owner weeks trying to reserve at same time - did i get that correct? You couldn't do that with calling in either - not sure how they would modify program to allow for multiple reservations at same time.

As to the split week issue (using consecutive weeks for a 2Bd LO) - you could try calling and make request for 2nd week to be added to existing online reservation (for the 1st week) when available 7 days later. I did this successfully before online booking.


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## maph (Feb 12, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> As to the split week issue (using consecutive weeks for a 2Bd LO) - you could try calling and make request for 2nd week to be added to existing online reservation (for the 1st week) when available 7 days later. I did this successfully before online booking.



I asked about doing this & was told that it can be done.  But the problem is that the 2nd reservation doesn't get made until 9AM when Owner Services opens.  If it's a high demand week, all of the inventory will have already been scooped up by the online booking system.


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## Denise L (Feb 17, 2016)

I am online and the website tells me that I cannot book WKORV until June 2016 for a February 2017 reservation.  I own there, but it isn't allowing me to book at the 12 month window.  Has anyone else had this problem?  This is very frustrating.  If I can't book online on time, then my view will be completely messed up .  Advice?


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## okwiater (Feb 17, 2016)

Denise L said:


> I am online and the website tells me that I cannot book WKORV until June 2016 for a February 2017 reservation.  I own there, but it isn't allowing me to book at the 12 month window.  Has anyone else had this problem?  This is very frustrating.  If I can't book online on time, then my view will be completely messed up .  Advice?



What the system is indicating is that the only inventory available would require a StarOptions reservation. It's possible that there are no more units available for your unit type. For instance, if you own ocean view, perhaps only island view units are left. Or, if you own ocean front, perhaps those units are already all reserved.


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## LisaRex (Feb 17, 2016)

okwiater said:


> What the system is indicating is that the only inventory available would require a StarOptions reservation. It's possible that there are no more units available for your unit type. For instance, if you own ocean view, perhaps only island view units are left. Or, if you own ocean front, perhaps those units are already all reserved.



If everything in February was already reserved, why would it indicate that she could reserve a February '17 date in June '16?  Technically, she can reserve anytime a reservation opens up, as long as it's in the Home Owners Reservation periord.  8 months is precisely when the exchange window opens, so it appears that the system isn't recognizing her as an Owner.

What a mess!


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## okwiater (Feb 17, 2016)

LisaRex said:


> If everything in February was already reserved, why would it indicate that she could reserve a February '17 date in June '16?



During the home resort reservation period you can *only* reserve the unit type you own. If you own oceanfront, you can reserve oceanfront. If you own ocean view, you can reserve ocean view. If you own island view, you can reserve island view. *You cannot reserve another unit type until the SVN reservation period begins at 8 months.*



LisaRex said:


> Technically, she can reserve anytime a reservation opens up, as long as it's in the Home Owners Reservation periord.  8 months is precisely when the exchange window opens, so it appears that the system isn't recognizing her as an Owner.



Wrong. She can only reserve the unit type she owns. If other unit types are available, she can compete for that inventory with all other SVN members at 8 months prior to arrival, which in the case of a February 2017 reservation would begin in June 2016.


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## pathways25 (Feb 17, 2016)

LisaRex said:


> If everything in February was already reserved, why would it indicate that she could reserve a February '17 date in June '16?  Technically, she can reserve anytime a reservation opens up, as long as it's in the Home Owners Reservation periord.  8 months is precisely when the exchange window opens, so it appears that the system isn't recognizing her as an Owner.
> 
> What a mess!



KOR has multiple deeded views so it's certainly possible that her deeded view is sold full, but other deeded views are not.  In that case, the other deeded views will show up as StarOption availability for her since she can't book those other views in the Home Resort Preference Period.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 17, 2016)

This thread needs a new title - a thread should start for issues with the online villa finder.

I think that villas showing up as SO reservations in the future is being misinterpreted - just because it shows a reservation window for a SO exchange does not necessarily mean that when that window opens that these weeks will be available.

It does look like something is going on with the villa finder especially for OV and IV villa that should have reasonable availability due to their numbers.


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## DeniseM (Feb 17, 2016)

There is definitely something going on behind the scenes - there is no reason that large amounts of inventory should be dumped in the system all at once (as has happened with both Maui and Harborside lately) _well within the 8 mo. reservation period.  _

There is also no reason that the same inventory should suddenly disappear all at once (as happened with the Maui summer inventory recently.)

IMNSHO:  There are system problems, and someone is manipulating inventory behind the scenes - hard to say why.


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## Denise L (Feb 17, 2016)

After our whale watching tour today, I'm going to go over to Owner Services and ask them what is going on, if anything.  I own oceanview and only make one reservation a year at 12 months out and then I never have to think about it again.  I suppose it is entirely possible that all the Friday check-in oceanview villas were booked up by whatever time I was checking...just before 1:00am Eastern....

Sorry to have posted in this villa finder thread...feel free to move this conversation to a new thread, DeniseM.  I haven't had a chance to post much during the past few years due to my daughter's issues, but vacationing here on Maui makes me think of TUG .


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## DeniseM (Feb 17, 2016)

Denise - I don't think they will have a clue.  I think they will just tell you that there is nothing wrong, and everything gets booked up quickly.  A number of people have contacted Starwood and they are reluctant to admit that there is a problem.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 17, 2016)

Denise L said:


> After our whale watching tour today, I'm going to go over to Owner Services and ask them what is going on, if anything.  I own oceanview and only make one reservation a year at 12 months out and then I never have to think about it again.  I suppose it is entirely possible that all the Friday check-in oceanview villas were booked up by whatever time I was checking...just before 1:00am Eastern....
> 
> Sorry to have posted in this villa finder thread...feel free to move this conversation to a new thread, DeniseM.  I haven't had a chance to post much during the past few years due to my daughter's issues, but vacationing here on Maui makes me think of TUG .



You posted in correct thread - it is just that the thread title need to be more specific as it took on a new dimension - and I see that DeniseM updated it (thanks DeniseM!).  Looks like this thread will be informative to figure out what is up with the SVO/SVN Villa Finder (including rampant speculation...)

DeniseL - Tonight (9pm pst) would be the 12 month mark for Saturday Feb 18, 2017. I see that you tried for a Friday (2/17/17) check-in last night. Were you on at 6pm HST?

Or, are you looking at any available villa (using your HomeResort Ownership) at <12 months? One issue is that this is an extremely busy time at WKORV/N, but I agree that there is apparently something going on with popular weeks at WKORV/N. Earlier in this thread - someone could not reserved their WKORVN IV which was odd considering the sheer number of them.
When I went to reserve my OFD studio (Prez Week 2017) - the system totally crashed and I was lucky enough to get through (9:26pm timestamp). Others were not so lucky.

I would call Owner Services and asked them what the availability looks like in their system for these weeks ~12 months away and see if their availability agrees with the Villa Finder.

Enjoy your vacation. We are not heading to WKORV until November this year (to celebrate our 10 year wedding anniversary - recall we got married during our 1st stay in our resale OFD)


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## DeniseM (Feb 17, 2016)

> Earlier in this thread - someone could not reserved their WKORVN IV which was odd considering the sheer number of them.



Even weirder - that inventory showed up later….



> I would call Owner Services and asked them what the availability looks like in their system for these weeks ~12 months away and see if their availability agrees with the Villa Finder.



Unfortunately, you can't call them at midnight, and by the next day, everything will be completely different.


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## LisaRex (Feb 17, 2016)

pathways25 said:


> KOR has multiple deeded views so it's certainly possible that her deeded view is sold full, but other deeded views are not.  In that case, the other deeded views will show up as StarOption availability for her since she can't book those other views in the Home Resort Preference Period.



Here is what DeniseL wrote:

"I am online and the website tells me that I cannot book WKORV until June 2016 for a February 2017 reservation."

If the website told her that she cannot book WKORV until Jun '16 for a Feb '17 reservation, then that is incorrect. Even if her deeded view is 100% sold out right now, there is no reason why an OV reservation might not open this afternoon...or tomorrow...or any time before June.  Owners cancel reservations all the time, and DeniseL should be able to reserve it before June, as it's within the home resort priority period.  Saying that she has to wait until the exchange window opens up is misleading at its most generous interpretation.


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## DeniseM (Feb 17, 2016)

Actually - the Villa Finder is saying that all the home resort reservations were gone for her category, for the date, and then it is showing her _when the Staroption reservation window opens._

This is how it should display, except for the fact that there should be home resort inventory available at midnight.

It doesn't mean that it doesn't recognize her as an owner - it means (for whatever reason) that there are no home resort reservations available, AT THE MOMENT.

Of course, we still don't know what is wrong with Home Resort availability.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 17, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Unfortunately, you can't call them at midnight, and by the next day, everything will be completely different.



Except that they may magically appear (as with the WKORV IV situation - and HRA as well?) - I recommend calling OS and confirm as it could be a glitch in the Villa Finder.  It looks to me as they are not allocating certain villa types at the exact opening of availability (for some unknown reason that may be nefarious or just a bug...)


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## DeniseM (Feb 17, 2016)

Hi Dave - A number of people have called, and they are just getting the run around - Starwood denies that there is a problem.  

However, I agree that it's a good idea to call or email a complaint so that Starwood knows that _owners feel that there is a problem._

*With Starwood leaving management in a couple weeks, they may not have much skin in the game at this point.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 17, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Hi Dave - A number of people have called, and they are just getting the run around - Starwood denies that there is a problem.
> 
> However, I agree that it's a good idea to call or email a complaint so that Starwood knows that _owners feel that there is a problem._



I guess it could be escalated to Suzanne Clarke? She is generally good at responding - or having having a delegate respond.  I did get a survey from my last reservation (that had a system crash) - perhaps I will respond although - except for my OFD studio (for renting), we do not vacation during peak times and do not use SO exchanges via SVN. But, I am curious.  Maybe I will attempt tonight by using my 1Bd OFD to see what happens.


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## DeniseM (Feb 17, 2016)

Maybe - but in 2 weeks, will Suzanne even be with Starwood?  I'm guessing her position will be eliminated.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 17, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Maybe - but in 2 weeks, will Suzanne even be with Starwood?



Good question - is the transition 2 weeks away?


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## DeniseM (Feb 17, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> Good question - is the transition 2 weeks away?



I "think" it's March 1 -  but might be April 1.


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## Sicnarf (Feb 17, 2016)

One way to check is to call the resort directly to see what kind of inventory they are seeing in their internal systems.  I was talking to a front desk staff at one of the resorts and he told that he is aware of situations where they see lots of inventory internally but owners are reporting no availability in SVN or SPG.


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## vacationtime1 (Feb 17, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> ...
> DeniseL - Tonight (9pm pst) would be the 12 month mark for Saturday Feb 18, 2017. I see that you tried for a Friday (2/17/17) check-in last night. Were you on at 6pm HST?
> ...



DeniseL -- If you're going to try to reserve WKORV/N online for next year, do it at 7:00pm HST; the time difference is only five hours (it is six hours when Florida is on daylight savings time because Hawaii does not do daylight savings time).

We also had an issue reserving our WKORV-OFC two weeks ago; Starwood's reservation computer is glitchy, to put it mildly.  If/when it doesn't work, log out, log in, and try again.  At least that worked for us.

I find it ironic that they are having the same issue over in Marriott-land; see http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=238324.


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## Negma (Feb 17, 2016)

This sounds like our pain and agony from two weeks ago. Keep trying as the week will probably appear within the next two days. One of the desk folks admitted they knew there was a problem. No one else will confirm the issue.

We are still here and have brought the issue up with some other staff and the answers are very election year compliant.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

For our 1Bd OFD WKORV (Feb 18, 2017) - there are only 24 total for Sat and Sun checkin. I got to the confirmation page in 7 minutes after logging on at 9:05pm pst. I didn't submit, but good to know I could since it would allow to match with our studio reserved last week.


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## jrab444 (Feb 18, 2016)

*Villa Finder malfunction*

I just finished trying to book my ownership week next year (Feb. 18-25, 2017) at KORN.  I am in Oregon. I hit the find reservation key at 9:00:05 PM PST. The type of villa I wanted came up.  I selected it and on the 3rd try got all the way through to the final confirmation stage (number of adults, number of children), hit the confirm button and it came up: "Uh Oh, we're having technical difficulties. Try again.." So I tried again and it said (paraphrasing): "You already have a reservation on hold, you can't make another one," but wouldn't allow me to get back to the one on "hold" Then it said my time was expired, and to retry from  start.  Now it shows no availability


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## maph (Feb 18, 2016)

jrab444 said:


> I just finished trying to book my ownership week next year (Feb. 18-25, 2017) at KORN.  I am in Oregon. I hit the find reservation key at 9:00:05 PM PST. The type of villa I wanted came up.  I selected it and on the 3rd try got all the way through to the final confirmation stage (number of adults, number of children), hit the confirm button and it came up: "Uh Oh, we're having technical difficulties. Try again.." So I tried again and it said (paraphrasing): "You already have a reservation on hold, you can't make another one," but wouldn't allow me to get back to the one on "hold" Then it said my time was expired, and to retry from  start.  Now it shows no availability



Same boat as you.  The first time I hit the 'OK' button & it threw me back to the previous screen (before 'confirm' screen) & I had to wait for the 5 minutes to run out.  Luckily a unit was still available & I again got to press the 'confirm' button, again got the 'Uh Oh ...'.  This time I pressed the 'x' in the top right corner instead of 'ok' & it stayed in the same screen, letting me press 'confirm' again.  The 2nd push actually worked for me & the reservation completed.


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## Denise L (Feb 18, 2016)

I'm walking around with my family looking for cats and trying to relax after a depressing 45+ minutes online getting technical difficulty messages, too.  More later when I get back, but the website shows that I have zero SOs left but every time we hit confirm on the timer page, we got an error message.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Denise - Your reservation probably went through - log in and check online in the morning.


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## pathways25 (Feb 18, 2016)

jrab444 said:


> I just finished trying to book my ownership week next year (Feb. 18-25, 2017) at KORN.  I am in Oregon. I hit the find reservation key at 9:00:05 PM PST. The type of villa I wanted came up.  I selected it and on the 3rd try got all the way through to the final confirmation stage (number of adults, number of children), hit the confirm button and it came up: "Uh Oh, we're having technical difficulties. Try again.." So I tried again and it said (paraphrasing): "You already have a reservation on hold, you can't make another one," but wouldn't allow me to get back to the one on "hold" Then it said my time was expired, and to retry from  start.  Now it shows no availability



Same thing here.  I hit the search availability button at 9:00:01 PM PST and followed that with 40 minutes of struggling with errors, failures and problems.  I also got the "You already have a reservation on hold" error.  After 40 minutes, all availability was gone and I have no reservation.

This is an absolutely RIDICULOUS way of trying to make use of a very expensive vacation ownership.  SVO needs to come up with a better way of handling high demand weeks.  Making owners endure this very stressful, time wasting exercise just completely unacceptable.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

I didn't submit this time (not looking in Feb), but last week I saw my SO amount drop after the technical issue error - and then confirmation showed.

So those with note that you have reservation on hold - log off/on, and look at your SO amount.
Also, check email for confirmation - mine showed up when I was still trying to reserve.

I didn't want to submit as not to take it from someone that actually wanted it.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

pathways25 said:


> Same thing here.  I hit the search availability button at 9:00:01 PM PST and followed that with 40 minutes of struggling with errors, failures and problems.  I also got the "You already have a reservation on hold" error.  After 40 minutes, all availability was gone and I have no reservation.
> 
> This is an absolutely RIDICULOUS way of trying to make use of a very expensive vacation ownership.  SVO needs to come up with a better way of handling high demand weeks.  Making owners endure this very stressful, time wasting exercise just completely unacceptable.



Before this - we had to call at 6am PST...

In reality, it has worked great for me. I have now made and used multiple online HomeResort reservations with excellent locations (timestamps), but do not go during high demand weeks.
I would not disagree with the speculation that due to the pending merger online reservation system is not being adequately resourced.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Something had definitely changed - we didn't get all these errors, freezes, and glitches in the past.


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## Denise L (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Something had definitely changed - we didn't get all these errors, freezes, and glitches in the past.



No email, no SOs.  I'm going to try to think about a late dinner and call SVO in the morning.  I guess February is a tough time to book!  We used to come at Easter and that time of year started to get boring for us, so we thought we would try something new .


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## okwiater (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Something had definitely changed - we didn't get all these errors, freezes, and glitches in the past.



TUG owners are "in the know" and likely began using the online reservations system immediately, when most owners were still doing it by phone. Now that some time has passed, behaviors have likely changed as well. The system is being burdened by a greater number of simultaneous connections than it has had in the past.


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## LisaRex (Feb 18, 2016)

okwiater said:


> TUG owners are "in the know" and likely began using the online reservations system immediately, when most owners were still doing it by phone. Now that some time has passed, behaviors have likely changed as well. The system is being burdened by a greater number of simultaneous connections than it has had in the past.



I agree with this.  It's too bad that they didn't create a reservation system that could handle the high volume one would anticipate when true high season weeks opened up, such as President's Day. 

SVN: One step up and two steps back.


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## okwiater (Feb 18, 2016)

LisaRex said:


> I agree with this.  It's too bad that they didn't create a reservation system that could handle the high volume one would anticipate when true high season weeks opened up, such as President's Day.
> 
> SVN: One step up and two steps back.



Well that's not quite fair. I think the online reservations system, though not without flaws, is a huge improvement over the phone system.

Many of the problems people are complaining about likely have nothing to do with the online reservations system and everything to do with how inventory is managed on the back-end. The suspicious lack of availability for certain unit owners, the bulk inventory dumps which occurred within the 8-month window, etc. -- do you really think these weren't happening before? I think the online system has just given us owners greater visibility because now we can check many different dates, anytime we want, even for no reason other than sheer curiosity. Were any of us doing this with the phone reservations reps? I think not.

The technical glitches being encountered when many owners are competing for high-demand weeks are certainly frustrating, and should be remedied. But is it really worse than the frustrating phone-dialing right at 9:00am, hoping that you're one of the first to be connected and that you'll be assigned to an agent who feels like talking and clicking faster than the others? To me, there was nothing more frustrating than enduring the chit-chat from the phone reps when you know that precious seconds are ticking away. I'd much, much rather encounter an occasional technical glitch -- which I know can be fixed in the future with additional fine-tuning of the system -- than endure phone reservations.

Sorry for the long-winded post, but we TUGgers sometimes have a tendency to emphasize the bad and ignore the good. Complaints about the glitches in the system are legitimate, but any assertion or implication that the system has made things worse rather than better isn't really accurate.


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## pathways25 (Feb 18, 2016)

okwiater said:


> The technical glitches being encountered when many owners are competing for high-demand weeks are certainly frustrating, and should be remedied. But is it really worse than the frustrating phone-dialing right at 9:00am, hoping that you're one of the first to be connected and that you'll be assigned to an agent who feels like talking and clicking faster than the others? To me, there was nothing more frustrating than enduring the chit-chat from the phone reps when you know that precious seconds are ticking away. I'd much, much rather encounter an occasional technical glitch -- which I know can be fixed in the future with additional fine-tuning of the system -- than endure phone reservations.
> 
> Sorry for the long-winded post, but we TUGgers sometimes have a tendency to emphasize the bad and ignore the good. Complaints about the glitches in the system are legitimate, but any assertion or implication that the system has made things worse rather than better isn't really accurate.



I agree that calling at 9:00AM was a pain, but whether you got what you wanted or not when calling, it was over in 5 minutes.  Now, you have an hour long ordeal fighting online to get space and it's just as luck based as it was when you had to call.

Don't get me wrong, I love being able to reserve online, when it's working anyway.  My primary complaint is the way that SVO allocates scarce resources, namely high demand weeks.  Calling in at 9:00AM was a poor way of doing it and now with online booking, it's actually gotten worse.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Now the Villa Finder is showing that *ALL* views and *ALL* unit sizes at WKORV N&S are booked solid  for 2/18/17.  What a mess!

okwiater - I disagree:  The Villa Finder is functioning *far worse* than it did the first year it was introduced.  So either the system hasn't been upgraded to keep up with use, or it is deteriorating and Starwood isn't maintaining it because they are short timers, or who knows what…



> I'd much, much rather encounter an occasional technical glitch -- which I know can be fixed in the future with additional fine-tuning of the system -- than endure phone reservations.



It's not occasional - this occurs every time the reservation window opens for a new date.

It's not either/or - both the phone system and the Villa Finder still exist, but they should both WORK correctly.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Now the Villa Finder is showing that *ALL* views and *ALL* unit sizes at WKORV N&S are booked solid  for 2/18/17.  What a mess!



Confused... unless you had every villa type available to be reserved as a HomeResort reservation at both resorts (OFC, OFD, OV, IV at WKORV and OF, OV, and IV at WKORVN)  - how would you know this?


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Because when you search using the Villa Finder, it shows the availability in your view, and also the _Staroption availability_.  There is now zero view availability and zero Staroption availability showing.

*I also verified this with several different views.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Because when you search using the Villa Finder, it shows the availability in your view, and also the _Staroption availability_.  There is now zero view availability and zero Staroption availability showing.
> 
> *I also verified this with several different views.



Sorry, that still doesn't clear up my confusion.  I understand that you can see availability for you villa type as a HomeResort reservation (of course), but how can you reliability see SO availability at 12 months as they are not available yet.
As stated before - I think there is over-interpretation of info shown on the Villa Finder.

If you are looking at the Calendar - note that it shows availability for WKORV for days that are greater than 12 months away (looking at it right now) - that isn't even possible.  I would not over-interpret this info.  YMMV


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

The Villa Finder always shows both Home Resort Availability AND Staroption Availability.  That is how it has always worked.  

You are correct that the Staroptions window isn't open yet, but it still _displays it at 12 mos_.  In other words, you can search for Staroption availability 12 mos. before the check-in date, even though you can't reserve it yet.

Here is an example that I just cut and pasted from a search for Feb. 5th that has *both* Home Resort and Staroption availability:



> *[HOME RESERVATION AVAILABILITY]*
> 
> THE WESTIN KA'ANAPALI OCEAN RESORT VILLAS NORTH LAHAINA, HAWAI'I
> Check-in Sun, February 05, 2017
> ...



If you do the same search for Feb. 18th it shows zero and zero - for all views.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

I know how the Villa Finder works...
It will not show a SO reservation at 12 months - only at 8 month (this the window opening later).
Which is what it is showing.

BUT you cannot see true availability as a HomeResort unless you have that specific villa available to search.  Any other output is being falsely interpreted.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Look at my example above - it does "show" Staroption availability at 12 mos. 

It shows the Staroption availability for Feb. 5, 2017, _which can be reserved on June 6th._

But when you do the same search for Feb. 18th - for ANY view - there are zero home resort reservations _available_ and zero Staroption reservations _showing. _ 

In other words, according to Villa Finder, there is zero availability for Feb. 18th for both home resort and Staroption reservations.  So either Starwood is holding back inventory, or the Villa Finder is screwed up.

*As far as the Staroption reservations go, it doesn't matter what view you use when you search - Staroption reservations are generic, so you get the same results, no matter what your resort/view is.

*I searched multiple views and phases to cross-check - all the same.

*Last night it still showed Staroption reservations for 2/18/17 - but not this morning.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

okwiater said:


> Well that's not quite fair. I think the online reservations system, though not without flaws, is a huge improvement over the phone system.



I agree.
Also, when calling was only option - it is not true that within 5 minutes (6:05am PST) you would have a reservation during high demand period. Lots of previous threads on this issue (pre-online), and in my personal experience.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Look at my example above - it does "show" Staroption availability at 12 mos.
> 
> It shows the Staroption availability for Feb. 5, 2017, which can be reserved on June 6th.
> 
> ...



Again - I am 100% aware how the Villa Finder works, and how HomeResort and StarOptions work.

Just because it states that the reservation window for that particular villa opens later DOES NOT mean it is available, and therefore at June 6 it may not actually be available.
As to what is happening for Feb 18 - different beast altogether. I will bet that soon the same case as your Feb 5 example will be observed.  Reservation window opens June18.

I am not disagreeing that something is going on - only against overarching blanket statements.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Of course we don't know if it will be available when the reservation window opens on June 6th, but that's not my point.  

My point is that according to Villa Finder, Feb. 18, 2017, is completely booked solid *NOW.*

That is what it *says* - you can interpret however you wish.



> I will bet that soon the same case as your Feb 5 example will be observed. Reservation window opens June18.



Last night at midnight, and early this morning, there was Staroption availability "showing" for Feb. 18th - but it's gone now.

How could the 18th be 100% booked solid, 12 mos. before check-in?  Seems highly unlikely.  YMMV


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Of course we don't know if it will be available when the reservation window opens on June 6th, but that's not my point.
> 
> My point is that according to Villa Finder, Feb. 18, 2017, is completely booked solid *NOW.*
> 
> That is what it *says* - you can interpret however you wish.



I understand your point for Feb 18 - however, regardless of what is going on for Feb 18, you cannot see actual availability unless you have have that specific villa as a HomeResort to search upon.  Meaning... For example - Unless you have a WKORV OFD (or whatever VOI) you cannot see HomeResort availability for OFD (or whatever VOI is being searched). That was my point.  and I do not have to BOLD.

My guess for what is going on for Feb18 has to do with software issue, and at some point - it will show up later.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear:  I am able to search for multiple home resort views/phases at the Maui resorts, and that is what I did.

There was Feb. 18th Staroption availability "showing" until this morning.  So it was there, and now it's gone.


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## okwiater (Feb 18, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> I understand your point for Feb 18 - however, regardless of what is going on for Feb 18, you cannot see actual availability unless you have have that specific villa as a HomeResort to search upon.  Meaning... For example - Unless you have a WKORV OFD (or whatever VOI) you cannot see HomeResort availability for OFD (or whatever VOI is being searched). That was my point.  and I do not have to BOLD.



David -- I think what Denise is saying, and I agree, is that if the villa finders shows no StarOptions availability, then nobody with a Home Resort will see any availability either. That observation mirrors my own experience perfectly. You can definitely see SVN availability prior to 8 months... it just won't let you click the "Reserve" button.


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## okwiater (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> okwiater - I disagree:  The Villa Finder is functioning *far worse* than it did the first year it was introduced.  So either the system hasn't been upgraded to keep up with use, or it is deteriorating and Starwood isn't maintaining it because they are short timers, or who knows what…
> 
> It's not occasional - this occurs every time the reservation window opens for a new date.



What can I say... I don't own WKORV but I own other high-demand weeks and have never had a problem booking using a home resort or SVN. You may be right that it's getting worse, but I don't think it's because the system has changed; rather, I think it's because more people are using it.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

It may definitely be because more people are using it - but isn't Starwood obligated to cope with that by increasing capacity?


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> I'm sorry if I wasn't clear:  I am able to search for multiple home resort views/phases at the Maui resorts, and that is what I did.



I got the point that you have multiple VOIs in which to search - but you made a statement that made it sound that everything for Feb18 (both HomeResort and SVN) is completely booked.  I claim that is unlikely the case (at least for everything not OFC or OFC due to limited villas). and these will show up later as previously observed.

Does Villa Finder have issues? Of course - as I and others reported in real time.
But, still better hassling with delays and error messages - than having to phone at 6am PST and hope to get thru in time. 

The online booking (even with issues) has worked fine for me.  Spending 26 minutes dealing with the highest demand week in 2017 (Feb 11) or 7 minutes for Feb 18 reservation (last night) was a minor hassle comparatively. And recall, I did this with a VOI that only has 24 total villas - unlike the other views.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> It may definitely be because more people are using it - but isn't Starwood obligated to cope with that by increasing capacity?



Yes they should - I agree that they may not be motivated to do so (speculative).


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## okwiater (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> It may definitely be because more people are using it - but isn't Starwood obligated to cope with that by increasing capacity?



I definitely agree that Starwood should work to resolve the problems, but I also recognize that designing software to accommodate huge spikes in concurrent usage is actually a challenging problem to solve. Heck, Ticketmaster had similar problems with their website for many years when concert dates would go on sale -- and you'd think they of all people should've solved it since the entire purpose of their business is selling tickets!

All things considered, I actually think that Starwood's online reservations system is pretty good. My guess is that WKORV is simply an outlier in terms of demand. Since it's a large resort and the entire year is a single season, it probably sees the largest amount of midnight action. Hopefully they will get it working better for you in the near future.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> I got the point that you have multiple VOIs in which to search - but you made a statement that made it sound that everything for Feb18 (both HomeResort and SVN) is completely booked.



Yes - According to the Villa Finder, IT IS.  

And that is my point exactly - how could it be completely booked???


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

okwiater said:


> My guess is that WKORV is simply an outlier in terms of demand. Since it's a large resort and the entire year is a single season, it probably sees the largest amount of midnight action. Hopefully they will get it working better for you in the near future.



If you try to book any of the more popular resorts, during high season - same problem, but Maui and Harborside are the worst.


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## okwiater (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> If you try to book any of the more popular resorts, during high season - same problem, but Maui and Harborside are the worst.



No problems at WSJ.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Yes - According to the Villa Finder, IT IS.
> 
> And that is my point exactly - how could it be completely booked???



Yes - according to Villa Finder - nothing at WKORV/N for Feb 18 2017 is available, but that doesn't actually mean that Feb 18 it is completely booked - only in a world that only believes what the Villa Finder states and nothing else matters. 

So... If you are interested in completing this experiment - call owner services with one of your many HomeResort VOIs (not OFC or OFD) and see if their availability reflects the observation seen with the Villa Finder.  I would do it, but only have 1Bd OFD and know that they are likely not available.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Dave -  I could call and maybe get more info, but that won't make the Villa Finder work any better, and that is the topic of this thread.  I should not have to call.  YMMV


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## okwiater (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Dave -  I could call and maybe get more info, but that won't make the Villa Finder work any better, and that is the topic of this thread.



If Starwood is listening, I'd be happy to consult for them on how to improve the performance of the villa finder.


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## pathways25 (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Yes - According to the Villa Finder, IT IS.
> 
> And that is my point exactly - how could it be completely booked???



I believe only 2/17 and 2/18 are sold out.  For WKORVN, I can see availability for 2/19 onwards in OV and IV (no more OF).  For WKORV, I can see availability for OV for 2/19 onwards.  There may be other room types available at WKORV, but I can't see them because I only own OV there.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

okwiater said:


> If Starwood is listening, I'd be happy to consult for them on how to improve the performance of the villa finder.



They are absolutely listening - they visit TUG every day. 

There is a method to my madness - I don't just gripe for the fun of it!


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## pathways25 (Feb 18, 2016)

okwiater said:


> If Starwood is listening, I'd be happy to consult for them on how to improve the performance of the villa finder.



Yeah, me too!  I'd almost be willing to consult there for free if I could make things better for all of us.


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## Denise L (Feb 18, 2016)

To follow up, we do have a reservation/confirmation number !  Not sure what the timestamp will be, though, so I am trying to decide whether we want that week or not.

That had to be the most frustrating booking experience ever :annoyed:.  I have owned since the beginning of time and was perfectly happy calling at 6:00 PST and eventually getting a person to book my reservation for me. It was always a bit stressful and annoying, but then I could go back to sleep in less than 10 minutes.  When the online stuff took over, I followed the new rules and the system worked pretty flawlessly in year one and then last year, I believe it was a little slower but I had completed the transaction in less than a minute.  This year, I got in right away, picked my dates, and waited for the spinning to stop many times.  First it was checking availability and timing out.  Then it was checking eligibility and timing out.  Then I was on the 5 minute timer page and it timed out after I hit Confirm, telling me to try again or to call or that there were technical difficulties.  I had to try again numerous times and then it told me that I had no SOs and that I had something on hold.  Then I had SOs and went through the whole thing again.  I hit Confirm.  Then it told me that it was having technical difficulties at least 20 times and to call for assistance.  OMG!

My DH says that perhaps the first time we hit Confirm, that it was working on the reservation on the back end, but the front end timed out waiting for a response, so it told me to try again.  But in reality, the back end was still chugging away, completing our reservation.  In that case, maybe our timestamp won't be so bad because that was at 12:04 AM Eastern.  But if that 5 minute hold timed out before the back end finished chugging, then we had to wait 5 minutes because our SOs were tied up, and try again.  At some point, we were able to hit Confirm again, at around 12:23 AM Eastern.  In which case, the timestamp is not ideal.  

Sigh!  I felt like I was wasting my time on Maui trying to come back to Maui!  Insanity!  Left the building to look for the cute resort cats, and checked my phone, but no email confirmation and no SOs.  

I spoke with the resort earlier yesterday (Wednesday) and was told that the earliest I could talk to Owner Services onsite would be Saturday while we are driving to the airport.  I also called SVO yesterday and spoke with a supervisor who assured me that the system was working (though it had been having some problems last month). 

This morning at 12:27 PM Eastern, I received my email confirmation after I left a message for the supervisor late last night before I went to look for cats.

So hitting Confirm at some point worked, but we only got error messages, and it didn't generate a confirmation email like it used to in the past after it actually completed the booking.


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## okwiater (Feb 18, 2016)

pathways25 said:


> Yeah, me too!  I'd almost be willing to consult there for free if I could make things better for all of us.



Works for me. Let's get them to pay for our travel, and we'll give them a week of consulting time for free


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Denise L said:


> To follow up, we do have a reservation/confirmation number !  Not sure what the timestamp will be, though, so I am trying to decide whether we want that week or not.



If you try again - it will be exactly like this the next time.  It has been bad for months, and really bad since Jan. 1.

Unless you reserve a very off-season week, it won't be any better next time.


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## Denise L (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> If you try again - it will be exactly like this the next time.  It has been bad for months, and really bad since Jan. 1.
> 
> Unless you reserve a very off-season week, it won't be any better next time.



That's sad news .  I never have that much time to waste trying to make a reservation.  Being on vacation allowed me the extra time to wait and click and log out and log back in and click....

This happens nearly every night at midnight Eastern for trying to book any resort, or especially Maui?

Booking DVC has never been as problematic and I can book high demand weeks at less than 11 months out (home resort booking) with no problem.  Disney IT is known for its problems, but it is actually better than my recent SVN experience.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Hi Denise - It mostly happens with Maui and Harborside, during high season.

You will have more luck with Friday or Sunday, and off-season.

If it were me, I'd keep it.  I tried for 40 min. last night to get a Resv. last night, and got shut out.  If you cancel this one - you might not get anything next time.


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## Denise L (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Hi Denise - It mostly happens with Maui and Harborside, during high season.
> 
> You will have more luck with Friday or Sunday, and off-season.
> 
> If it were me, I'd keep it.  I tried for 40 min. last night to get a Resv. last night, and got shut out.  If you cancel this one - you might not get anything next time.



Were you also trying for WKORV OV?

I also looked at the calendar and yesterday was 8 months out for Thanksgiving week.  Do you suppose that made it even worse or was it a typical experience for you?


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

It probably made it worse, but it's typical for Sat. check-ins.


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## YYJMSP (Feb 18, 2016)

pathways25 said:


> I believe only 2/17 and 2/18 are sold out.  For WKORVN, I can see availability for 2/19 onwards in OV and IV (no more OF).  For WKORV, I can see availability for OV for 2/19 onwards.  There may be other room types available at WKORV, but I can't see them because I only own OV there.



Today's the 18th, so you can't book Feb 19, 2016 yet -- that would start tonight at midnight Eastern time -- so that's probably why you see inventory.


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## Denise L (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> It probably made it worse, but it's typical for Sat. check-ins.



After our walk last night, I checked availability and it was showing some studios and nothing else except for pretend StarOption availability for checking back on June 18.  If what you found is accurate, you wrote that every view category in every size is booked for that check-in date, and also for the day before.  Will you be trying again tonight for Sunday check-in?


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Denise L said:


> After our walk last night, I checked availability and it was showing some studios and nothing else except for pretend StarOption availability for checking back on June 18.  If what you found is accurate, you wrote that every view category in every size is booked for that check-in date, and also for the day before.  Will you be trying again tonight for Sunday check-in?



No - I am going to wait until the next Sat.


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## Denise L (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> No - I am going to wait until the next Sat.



Let us know how that goes.  I hope it is easier than 40 minutes and still no reservation!  My DH and I were sure we had nothing so were thinking about Thanksgiving week and hoping that the reservation system would be fixed by then!  I'll be relieved when we aren't bound by the school schedules


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

OF and OV is booked for Feb 18, 2017 - there are a few IVs...
Phone lines this morning had a wait of >50 people - last week even more...


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## Denise L (Feb 18, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> OF and OV is booked for Feb 18, 2017 - there are a few IVs...
> Phone lines this morning had a wait of >50 people - last week even more...



If the villas are mostly booked, what will the 50+ people be saying when they finally get an agent on the phone ?


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Dave -  I could call and maybe get more info, but that won't make the Villa Finder work any better, and that is the topic of this thread.  I should not have to call.  YMMV



Yes this is a Villa Finder thread - but the supposition was put forth that Feb 18 was completely (100%) sold out.  This goes to the Villa Finders accuracy which goes to not believing everything the Villa Finder states - which goes to calling OS... which goes to the thread topic.

I guess it is the Scientist in me, not to assume and except at face value...

In looking at the Villa Finder - it appears that the level of occupancy (reservations) will also to show no SO availability (no reservation window at all). Examples are 2/11/17 and 2/18/17 with no SO ability. but other checkin dates do show SO ability (reservation window opens at 8 months) - this is using my OFD. Now, if these do not have HR ability (since only 24 villas total) - why would there be SO ability?

My speculation is that it has to do with a programming algorithm, coupled with software/hardware that can't handle the load.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

Denise L said:


> If the villas are mostly booked, what will the 50+ people be saying when they finally get an agent on the phone ?



Unhappy I suppose (this is for all VOIs - not just WKORV/N - since they do not know until one goes thru the standard litany and small talk). Especially for those that like the personal customer experience (wonder how Salty is doing?).

I have never (or yet) been denied based on availability until I just called to test availability of my 1Bd OFD for Feb 18. But, an OV or IV would be a better test. Alas, I do not own one of these.  We travel low season mostly - so not that important to me except for reserving our OFD studio. It does go to owning a fixed villa (or be an Ultra Premium Owner) if you want these high demand times. I assume, once high season passes for WKORV/N - normalcy will return.  Hopefully...
Also - I assume this goes to lack of II availability for WKORV/N.

This also goes to (IMO) people renting SOs competing with people who actually want to use SOs to stay at a popular resort at the 8 month point... but guess that is a topic for another thread...


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

Dave - I think you are channeling jarta today!

I did not say that I thought the 18th was _in fact_ sold out, I said that is what the Villa Finder SHOWS.

My entire point in this thread is:  The Villa Finder is _inaccurate_ - thank you for providing more evidence to support that!


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## okwiater (Feb 18, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> In looking at the Villa Finder - it appears that the level of occupancy (reservations) will also to show no SO availability (no reservation window at all). Examples are 2/11/17 and 2/18/17 with no SO ability. but other checkin dates do show SO ability (reservation window opens at 8 months) - this is using my OFD. Now, if these do not have HR ability (since only 24 villas total) - why would there be SO ability?
> 
> My speculation is that it has to do with a programming algorithm, coupled with software/hardware that can't handle the load.



You seem to be assuming that the system will only show you units for which you own a corresponding deed. That is not how the system works. It does not "use" one of your units to perform the search; rather, it searches for and displays all available inventory.

Even when searching 12 months out, the system will show you StarOptions availability for units you're not entitled to book, accompanied by a message that the booking window "opens on xx/xx/2017." That booking window is calculated specifically for you, based on the deed you own. Other searchers will see that very same unit and will have the ability to book immediately.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

okwiater is correct - when you view Staroption availability, it is not linked to your ownership.  

Everyone who has Staroptions, no matter what view or resort they own, sees the same thing.

Someone who searches with SVV Staroptions sees the same thing as an OF Maui owner.


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## SMHarman (Feb 18, 2016)

Steamboat availability in the 18th still. That expansion is nicely opening up ski availability.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

okwiater said:


> You seem to be assuming that the system will only show you units for which you own a corresponding deed. That is not how the system works. It does not "use" one of your units to perform the search; rather, it searches for and displays all available inventory.
> 
> Even when searching 12 months out, the system will show you StarOptions availability for units you're not entitled to book, accompanied by a message that the booking window "opens on xx/xx/2017." That booking window is calculated specifically for you, based on the deed you own. Other searchers will see that very same unit and will have the ability to book immediately.



Hold on - No, I am not saying this, or assuming this... (and depends on search parameters) I realized they are all searched - and may have lost thread train of thought since a few topics came up. View type does not come up as it is not a search criteria.  meaning: with non-HR SOs - a user cannot see OFD studio at 12 months out. I tried this with WKORVN and do not see WKORVN OF - only villas with unknown view.

There are two main outputs. One for the VOI that has search result(s) based on available HomeResort VOIs based on deeded VOI.  The other for SOs (at <8mo) that is based SVN availability, and the SO in the account (and search parameters). 

For example - I used my OFD studio to reserve last week using appropriate search parameters, and that view comes up based on my deeded villa that can only be seen with that VOI type.  
Now... searching with my 1Bd OFD - 2 outputs will come up:
1) My HomeResort confirmation for the 1Bd OFD (if available) - otherwise it specifically states not available.
2) SVN availability for my specific search (*which doesn't include View*) based on those SOs, that will have a note that reservation opens on a certain date. Which is the same date that I can no longer be guaranteed my view (8 months).

{sorry if my descriptions are confusing - it is not straight-forward to cover nuances}

there are 2 things happening with same OFD on different dates as explained before -
one (Feb11/18) shows nothing/ziltch (and Calendar pops up) while other dates (Feb 4) shows SVN reservations (opening at 8 months) - loss of view of course, but no HR availability.  What I was inquiring is what OS had available and not based on Villa Finder. Meaning that the entire resort is sold out - but not basing this purely on the Villa Finder

sorry to repeat myself - these posts are getting intertwined


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> okwiater is correct - when you view Staroption availability, it is not linked to your ownership.
> 
> Everyone who has Staroptions, no matter what view or resort they own, sees the same thing.
> 
> Someone who searches with SVV Staroptions sees the same thing as an OF Maui owner.



Yes for SVN  - they see same thing.  But at HR, you cannot see OFD or OFC unless you have that VOI and have it available... View is not a search criteria. HR searches account for the deeded VOI.

the discussion was around HR reservations being sold out for WKORV/N (Feb 18'17) entirely based on Villa Finder - that was being reflected in SVN reservations.

Yes - at SVN period we all see same thing (of course) IF SOs are available to see them.  Those with inadequate SVN SOs do not see same thing either.  But, that is not what I was discussing before.

What was under discussion is what i described before - obviously poorly

For Feb 11 and 18 - using a specific search criteria - nothing shows for HR OFD, or SVN for WKORV at all
for Feb 4 - SVN shows but not HR OFD

I called and OS alluded to few IVs available based on their reservation experience - BUT Villa Finder shows none.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> No - with your SOs you cannot see OFD or OFC... View is not a search criteria.



I am not sure what you are trying to say - Staroption reservations have no view, and we are (in the last few posts) talking about Staroption availability.



> okwiater is correct - when you view *Staroption availability*, it is not linked to your ownership.
> 
> Everyone who has *Staroptions*, no matter what view or resort they own, sees the same thing.
> 
> Someone who searches with SVV *Staroptions* sees the same thing as an OF Maui owner.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> I am not sure what you are trying to say - Staroption reservations have no view, and we are (in the last few posts) talking about Staroption availability.



sorry - posts getting tangled and typing too fast with autocorrect, and differentiating HR from SVN searches

what i meant in the long run - bottom line - was believing the Villa Finder without calling OS. I know one should not have to and it should work perfectly (actually I disagree that it needs to be perfect), but would surprise me if IV WKORV is entirely sold out as claimed by Villa Finder (for example). I would bet that more will become available for Feb 18 if not already.

the rest was confusing HR searches (that has view coded in) with SVN searches that loses HR view. when I run a search (HR) - view is a parameter that is outputted as not in search feature - so for HR it does account for deeded villa. I already know that deed is not taken into account with SVN search. But, at one point the topic was HR and SVN searches. For Feb 18 - that would only be a HR search at this point in time.


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## pathways25 (Feb 18, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> For HR: I can see a 1Bd OFD but cannot see OFD studio (since it has been used).



This is incorrect.  You will see availability for all unit types that you own, whether or not you have a unit of that type available (unused) to make the reservation.



DavidnRobin said:


> Yes - at SVN period we all see same thing (of course) IF SOs are available to see them.  Those with inadequate SVN SOs do not see same thing either.



This is also incorrect.  You will see StarOption availability regardless of whether or not you have sufficient remaining options to make the booking.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 18, 2016)

pathways25 said:


> This is incorrect.  You will see availability for all unit types that you own, whether or not you have a unit of that type available (unused) to make the reservation.
> 
> 
> 
> This is also incorrect.  You will see StarOption availability regardless of whether you have sufficient remaining options to make the booking or not.



I was incorrect (and tried to correct) - it will allow to searches and show dates (I was searching on sold-out days), just not ability to reserve.  Sorry for the confusion. I tried to update my posts as I can find. I was in part discussing HR searches in regards to views and that people that do not have that VOI cannot see these views but Villa Finder accounts for them based on deeded VOI. But, then got confusing - multi-tasking...


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## jrab444 (Feb 19, 2016)

*No availability at WKORVN for Feb 19*

I'm an OF owner at WKORVN. I got screwed out of a completed confirmation last night because of technical problems.  Calling owner services promptly at 6:00 AM my time resulted in a 23 min. wait.  Naturally nothing was available and the agent could do nothing for me but did seem to admit there were problems last night. Tonight at 9:00:05 the villa finder showed nothing available for arrival on Sunday Feb. 19.


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## DeniseM (Feb 19, 2016)

I feel your pain!


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## Denise L (Feb 19, 2016)

jrab444 said:


> I'm an OF owner at WKORVN. I got screwed out of a completed confirmation last night because of technical problems.  Calling owner services promptly at 6:00 AM my time resulted in a 23 min. wait.  Naturally nothing was available and the agent could do nothing for me but did seem to admit there were problems last night. Tonight at 9:00:05 the villa finder showed nothing available.



Did you try again at 9:01? I am assuming you did, as I spent 40+ minutes last night trying for WKORV OV.  

A friend of mine owns a WKORVN IV and booked hers with ease at 9:01 tonight.  I know there are a ton more IVs than OFs, but the system let her through in seconds and she was done.  So different from my experience last night.


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## KACTravels (Feb 19, 2016)

jrab444 said:


> I'm an OF owner at WKORVN. I got screwed out of a completed confirmation last night because of technical problems.  Calling owner services promptly at 6:00 AM my time resulted in a 23 min. wait.  Naturally nothing was available and the agent could do nothing for me but did seem to admit there were problems last night. Tonight at 9:00:05 the villa finder showed nothing available.



I've also been checking for every night for over a week to see availability for our WKORN Ocean Front for next February and every night at 9pm, it shows no availability.  I haven't called in because I get too busy during working hours.  I know I need to call in to ensure that there isn't a "glitch" in our ownership.


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## YYJMSP (Feb 19, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> Now, if these do not have HR ability (since only 24 villas total) - why would there be SO ability?



Doesn't that mean that there are units available, but nothing matching your unused ownerships?

You have to wait until 8mos out before you'd have an ownership (ie SO's) that could be used to make a booking with that current inventory.

Someone else logging in may see the same inventory with the chance to make a home resort booking if they have that ownership unused at that time.


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## okwiater (Feb 19, 2016)

YYJMSP said:


> Doesn't that mean that there are units available, but nothing matching your unused ownerships?
> 
> You have to wait until 8mos out before you'd have an ownership (ie SO's) that could be used to make a booking with that current inventory.
> 
> Someone else logging in may see the same inventory with the chance to make a home resort booking if they have that ownership unused at that time.



This is correct.


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 19, 2016)

I went online last night testing my 1Bd OFD - I had no technical issues.  Everything seemed as normal.


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## Denise L (Feb 19, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> I went online last night testing my 1Bd OFD - I had no technical issues.  Everything seemed as normal.



So does that mean that Saturday was just a super heavy traffic night and Sunday wasn't?


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## DavidnRobin (Feb 19, 2016)

Denise L said:


> So does that mean that Saturday was just a super heavy traffic night and Sunday wasn't?



Correct - Sunday (Feb 19) seemed to work smoothly (I got to the confirmation page quickly, but I did not submit).  The last 2 Saturdays (Feb 11 and 18) were fraught with issues (jammed) even though I was able to reserve our OFD studio for Feb 11 after being kicked out multiple times.

I am on a MacPro using Safari with good internet speed.


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## Denise L (Feb 19, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> Correct - Sunday (Feb 19) seemed to work smoothly (I got to the confirmation page quickly, but I did not submit).  The last 2 Saturdays (Feb 11 and 18) were fraught with issues (jammed) even though I was able to reserve our OFD studio for Feb 11 after being kicked out multiple times.
> 
> I am on a MacPro using Safari with good internet speed.



Our bad luck, then, being on either LTE tethered from our iPhone or Westin Ka'anapali WiFi.  Though I was using a brand new super fast Dell.  DH said it wouldn't matter what computer or Internet we were using if the reservation system was all jammed up anyway.


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## DeniseM (Feb 25, 2016)

Interesting:  Villa Finder working smoothly and quickly tonight.  Hopefully, this means that they have fixed the problem.


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## Denise L (Feb 25, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> Interesting:  Villa Finder working smoothly and quickly tonight.  Hopefully, this means that they have fixed the problem.



That's good news!  Would have been nice if it was working 7 nights ago , but better late than never!


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## kgwilson932 (Feb 25, 2016)

*SVN -Reservation  Issues*

Tonight at 12:00 Midnight ET the SVN system would should that my home resort was open, but it said something like you must have a week available to select this week.  I do have more than a week available but the system was not seeing it. 


BTW - when you try to select a week 365 days out, it also is having issues. Last week it gave me a reference number but couldn't accept my reservation. When I called the next day the rep told me the ref number is only so they can find my request -- it does nothing to preserve my spot in the que and of course the week I wanted is now gone. 

Is anyone else having these problems? 

Thanks much. 
k


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## SMHarman (Feb 25, 2016)

kgwilson932 said:


> Tonight at 12:00 Midnight ET the SVN system would should that my home resort was open, but it said something like you must have a week available to select this week.  I do have more than a week available but the system was not seeing it.
> 
> 
> BTW - when you try to select a week 365 days out, it also is having issues. Last week it gave me a reference number but couldn't accept my reservation. When I called the next day the rep told me the ref number is only so they can find my request -- it does nothing to preserve my spot in the que and of course the week I wanted is now gone.
> ...


Which destinations were you looking to book?


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## Sicnarf (Feb 25, 2016)

My confidence with this tool is very low at this time.  There are times when the availability calendar shows plenty available but the search for those available dates does not return anything.  And there were several instances where the availability calendar shows nothing but the search for the same dates, returns several available units!


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## kgwilson932 (Feb 25, 2016)

WKV - is my home Resort that I couldn't book last night.  I was able to book it on the phone just now after they opened.  The rep confirmed - yes she has had other calls like mine that couldn't book online last night.  When I explained it didn't work last week either for a different reason, she responded with --yes the system is in Beta and they are working out the bugs. She then said they are changing to a new system in the third quarter with the new company. Which of course begs the question --why have a Beta at all?


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## Sicnarf (Feb 25, 2016)

kgwilson932 said:


> WKV - is my home Resort that I couldn't book last night.  I was able to book it on the phone just now after they opened.  The rep confirmed - yes she has had other calls like mine that couldn't book online last night.  When I explained it didn't work last week either for a different reason, she responded with --yes the system is in Beta and they are working out the bugs. She then said they are changing to a new system in the third quarter with the new company. Which of course begs the question --why have a Beta at all?



The system is in Beta ever since   I did encounter the same problem of not being able to book my home resort last week.


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## canesfan (Feb 25, 2016)

I had a problem last fall as well trying to book home resort. It was showing a home resort that wasn't available for booking as available though. Very frustrating. This system has been in beta for years.


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## Fizzer (Mar 5, 2016)

I am a new member and came to this board to try and find answers and to see if the problems I experienced were unusual. It seems not, although I have to admit to being more confused than ever. 
For background we own a 2BR o/v  at WKORV  and have done so since 2003. We use our villa every 2nd or 3rd year only and use SO and the occasional external exchange otherwise. We have been pretty happy up until now but are currently frustrated and angry with SVO and the process. We always stay in February when we do go, as it is our wedding anniversary and until this year never had any issues in booking.
This year we were out of country for our anniversary and in a location where internet access was very spotty at the best of times. When we did get access it was 3 hours after midnight EST and there was no availability of any villas at all, unless I try again using SO in June. When I contacted SVO I was told that it was effectively my fault, that I should have been on the internet at midnight EST and that there is a "race by owners for availability" and it all went within  the first hour. I should just "keep checking back".

The last time we stayed was Feb 2015 and I don't recall any of this grief when  we booked in 2014.

My issue is that this change seems negative in a big way and also suggests a significant overselling of the resort, either literally or certainly in sales hyperbole. Forget the touted 4 month Home Resort exclusive booking window of 12 - 8 months. It seems that there is now a 12 months to 12 months minus 1 hour window only. I wonder how many new buyers they would get if this was more widely known?

Even more frustrating is that there is availability at the 8 months window (presumably for less than an hour as  all SVO members can effectively reserve then). In addition the calendar shows availibility and I can book for cash through SPG.

I did email a concern and received a polite 'Tough ,that's the way it is "  form letter.  It left me with a very sour taste in my mouth TBH, as I never recall it being like this before. If this is a sign of how things will be with the new management company it is not reassuring.

I realize I am not alone in this and I do not expect sympathy but it seems that SVO knows there is an issue because they tell us that there is a mad race ( their agent's words not mine). Surely that should tell them that this  is not a sign of the premium product that they are marketing.

Having vented I did come here and when I read the other comments I am confused. 
1. People seem to be suggesting that there is a difference between a Home Resort and SO reservation, certainly in terms of available inventory or that they are somehow different. When I called SVO the agent disabused me of that belief and told me that all bookings, even at your home resort are Star Options bookings. I am confused. The agent was quite rude BTW which is a first for me with SVO. 

2. I see people writing about seeing different view types when reserving. All I can find as a filter is 2BR/1BR/Studio. Am I missing something?

I also note that when I view the SVO Find a Villa feature it has changed in the last day or so  'To improve the owner experience *We have recently made an enhancement to improve your Online Reservations experience.

We want to ensure that automated computer programs are not being used to search for availability.

We have implemented a simple feature called reCAPTCHA, and will use this feature going forward to help ensure that your Online Reservations experience is not impacted by automated programs
*
That suggests to me that this has been a concern for them. I wonder whether this accounts for the difficulties many have been experiencing.

I guess my final concern is that if these issues are  not resolved what options are available for owners, other than selling at a loss and walking away from it. We certainly have seriously considered this. The cost of ownership is not cheap by any means and paying for something that you cannot access all of a sudden is certainly a disappointing kick in the teeth.


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## DeniseM (Mar 5, 2016)

Unfortunately, the entry level people that you talk to when you call Starwood actually do not understand how the reservation system works themselves, and they have been instructed not to admit there are any problems with the system.

Here is a simplified explanation:

Let's say you want to reserve your Ocean View timeshare at 12 mos. before check-in.  

This is what is available to reserve: 
-50 Ocean Front units 
-100 Ocean View Units
-100 Island View units  
(Those are made up numbers for my example - ONLY.)

Let's say that by 3:00 am, when you called, all the Ocean View units had been reserved, 40 of the Ocean Front Units had been reserved, and 90 of the Island View units have been reserved.

So when you tried to make an Ocean View reservation, it shows ZERO availability.

But it shows Staroption availability, because there are still 10 Island View units  and 10 Ocean Front units that have not been reserved.

However, you cannot reserve IV or OF at 12 mos., because you own Ocean View.  You can't  make a Staroption reservation until 8 mos. before check-in.

Even if you were online exactly at 12 midnight, you may not have been able to get your reservation, because some views sold out immediately.

Then you look and see that Starwood is offering the exact dates you want for rent for big bucks.  However, those units are not in the* owner *inventory pool:
-They are units that are owned out right by Starwood.
-They are units that owner's converted to Starpoints.
-They are units that Starwood foreclosed on.
-They are inventory that Starwood has acquired through various means.

All that being said, the system does not work well, and we have no idea how Starwood is manipulating the inventory behind the scenes.  We do know that they hold inventory back, but we don't know how or why, and they will never disclose that fact.

***I am assuming you know that the parent company for Interval International will become  the Starwood management company starting April 1, and we have no idea what changes they may make.


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## Denise L (Mar 5, 2016)

Fizzer said:


> The last time we stayed was Feb 2015 and I don't recall any of this grief when  we booked in 2014.



We felt the same way .  Were you trying for the Presidents' Week Saturday check-in like a lot of us were?  We've been owners since WKORV first opened, and this year was our only horrible booking experience in over 14 years.  Something is terribly wrong with their back end systems which aren't giving a timely response to the front end system, so it times out over and over again before it gets an answer.  It was quite a disaster that night. 



Fizzer said:


> I guess my final concern is that if these issues are  not resolved what options are available for owners, other than selling at a loss and walking away from it. We certainly have seriously considered this. The cost of ownership is not cheap by any means and paying for something that you cannot access all of a sudden is certainly a disappointing kick in the teeth.



This was my DH's first experience booking and, in frustration, he said that we should sell our week, too, because of the awful booking system.  But we do love the resort and have enjoyed all of our stays there.  And even though we were upset and stressed out about the problems with booking, we are aware that SVO never promised us the exact week we wanted each year, but simply a floating week each year in an OV villa if we booked it 12-8 months in advance.  We probably would have purchased a fixed week, fixed unit if we had known they were available at the time (we purchased over the phone from CA), but oh well.

The kids enjoy their time there, and consider it their home away from home.  The staff there has always been very kind and helpful, and we feel very relaxed while we are there.   We love the resort, and are hopeful that it won't be as awful to book our week next year.

I hope that you were able to book another week in February, perhaps, to celebrate your anniversary a little early or a little later ?  We were married on Maui in November many years ago, and celebrate our anniversary whenever we are there, no matter what month .


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## Fizzer (Mar 6, 2016)

Thanks for your feedback. TBH as I am not a US citizen I have no idea when Presidents Week is, but we were trying to book the 17, 18 or 19 of February.
I also have a slightly better idea when I tried to make a dummy booking for March and saw, for the first time, Home Resort options rather than just SO. The earlier comments make a little more sense now.

I was aware of the pending change in ownership but am hoping that the recent shenanigans are just a coincidence and not an omen for the future.

My main concerns were that usually 3 hours or even 3 days after the window opened  was plenty of time to book the same week in the past, or at least IME. The fact that staff inform me that I need to be like a sprinter in starting blocks at a specific time  tells me they know there is a problem. The change to the process to prevent computerized searching also suggests some form of either abuse, or at the very least a lot of complaints.

 If that particular week is so special why did they not protect it like Christmas and the Japanese holiday that  we were told up front  were never available unless we purchased those specific  weeks at an enhanced price?  IIRC  I don't even recall being offered the option of a fixed week unit because I suspect we would have done so had we known it was available.

Our dissatisfaction  was compounded by the huge increase in fees we have seen, largely because we are Canadians and the exchange rate has made the fees 25-30% higher this year over last. I know that's not SVO's fault but  it didn't help.

I also wonder how owners in other parts of the world, where midnight EST  falls in the middle of a work day for example, are going to cope.


Anyway, we will give it one more year. Like you we have enjoyed our time there and at some of the other SVO resorts ( although we have had some cruddy rooms at some.....Atlantis anyone?). Our experience in exchanging through  II has been less than stellar too,   with only 1 resort coming anywhere near the quality of what we had given up in exchange  ( and even that had no laundry  or full kitchen even in a 1 BR). I suspect that if they don't fix their system that eventually word will get out and adversely impact future sales.

Anyway thanks for your explanations.  We are planning to try again in June, although if the week is so popular I guess it will be another sprint. If not then we will be going elsewhere for our Anniversary and heaven knows when we'll get to use our Maui unit.


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## dsmrp (Mar 6, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> ...
> All that being said, the system does not work well, and we have no idea how Starwood is manipulating the inventory behind the scenes.  We do know that they hold inventory back, but we don't know how or why, and they will never disclose that fact.
> 
> ***I am assuming you know that the parent company for Interval International will become  the Starwood management company starting April 1, and we have no idea what changes they may make.



Is the April 1 date pretty certain? The news releases last fall were somewhat vague, and indicated a merger closing date in the second quarter of 2016.  So that could take them to up June 30 or so.

Unfortunately owner dissatisfaction with the online reservation system, all seems to work in Starwood/Vistana favor, irregardless of the causes of the problems.   Wouldn't most people be more inclined to adopt a new reservation system or process from Vistana if the current one no longer meets their needs?  Or if owners are dissatisfied enough to sell their desirable units, especially on Maui, then there's more ROFR for Starwood/Vistana to exercise ??  the latter is probably a drop in the bucket, tho'.  I think it's more significant for Vistana to get the owners to 'buy in' to future changes in how reservations are handled.


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## DeniseM (Mar 6, 2016)

dsmrp said:


> Is the April 1 date pretty certain? The news releases last fall were somewhat vague, and indicated a merger closing date in the second quarter of 2016.  So that could take them to up June 30 or so.



I heard that date lately, from an owner who heard it from Owner Services, so yes, it's set in stone.


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## mjm1 (Mar 6, 2016)

Sorry to hear about the issues some are having with the online reservation system. I haven't encountered them, but it could be the resorts I have reserved.

Just yesterday I made a reservation at WKV for the first Saturday next March, which was a day after the window opened for an owner. I was concerned that I had missed the opportunity, since it is a high demand time of year. To my pleasant surprise, I was able to reserve a large 1BR. Now I have to decide if I want to rent it or cancel and try to go somewhere else, like Hawaii. 

It will be interesting to see what changes the new ownership will make once the transaction is finalized.

Mike


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## YYJMSP (Mar 7, 2016)

*Offering Home Resort bookings when I've used up the VOI*

So, here's another glitch I just noticed.

I have two different VOIs at two different properties for which I've used up the larger side of the 2BR L/O, but still have the smaller side of the 2BR L/O available.  The online system is offering me the either the smaller side, the larger side, or a full 2BR L/O as Home Resort booking options.

I have a third VOI for which I've used up the larger side of the 2BR L/O and most of the SO's from the smaller side, but still have some SO's available.  The online system is offering me the smaller side as Home Resort booking options.

Everything is for 2016 usage for 2016 dates I was checking.

I think it is really confused if you didn't use up a whole VOI.


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## DeniseM (Mar 7, 2016)

> I have a third VOI for which I've used up the larger side of the 2BR L/O and most of the SO's from the smaller side, but still have some SO's available. The online system is offering me the smaller side as Home Resort booking options.


I don't think it's a glitch - that means that only the smaller side is available.

Remember - the Villa Finder will show you home resort _availability_, whether or not you have already used the home resort reservation.


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## YYJMSP (Mar 7, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> I don't think it's a glitch - that means that only the smaller side is available.
> 
> Remember - the Villa Finder will show you home resort _availability_, whether or not you have already used the home resort reservation.



Tried to walk through to the point of confirming the reservation, and it gives me a "Sorry, we are experiencing technical difficulties. Please try again later." message once I select any of the Home Resort bookings I shouldn't be able to make.


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## DeniseM (Mar 7, 2016)

YYJMSP said:


> Tried to walk through to the point of confirming the reservation, and it gives me a "Sorry, we are experiencing technical difficulties. Please try again later." message once I select any of the Home Resort bookings I shouldn't be able to make.



It will show you what is _available_, even if you have already used your home resort reservation(s) up.  But it won't let you book it, if you have already used it.


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## LisaRex (Mar 8, 2016)

Fizzer said:


> For background we own a 2BR o/v  at WKORV  and have done so since 2003. We use our villa every 2nd or 3rd year only and use SO and the occasional external exchange otherwise. We have been pretty happy up until now but are currently frustrated and angry with SVO and the process. We always stay in February when we do go, as it is our wedding anniversary and until this year never had any issues in booking.



I think that a February (and March and June/July) bottleneck was to be expected from the inception of the program, because Starwood coded the entire year in Hawaii as platinum plus season, then sold most ownerships as floating.  While it gives owners a great deal of flexibility, it also means that you have 50 owners for each villa, all potentially vying for the same dozen or so true high-demand weeks.

That bottleneck is a completely separate matter from the online booking tool freezing up and dropping reservations.  That is an IT systems issue, probably related to volume, that can and should be corrected. 

And THAT is a separate matter from inventory not showing up when one would expect to see it, such as what happened at Harborside earlier this year.  We shouldn't ever see a huge "bulk deposit" of inventory being dropped in SVN AFTER the 12 month window has opened. All inventory that belongs to owners should be available, and ready to book, when the Home Resort window opens up.  Owners should not be clicking on 12 months + two weeks out and seeing zero inventory.*  That leads to mistrust and suspicion. 

What also leads to mistrust and frustration is lack of training to CSRs who are telling owners that reservations made at their home resort are made with SOs.

(*I can guess that the weirdness we're seeing has to do with them manually separating inventory into their distinct pools (e.g. Flex Owners have a different inventory pool than deeded owners), but there's no excuse for them not having this work completed before the 2017 window opened.   When you add complexity to your program, you should have a plan in place for executing it seamlessly BEFORE it goes live.)

Get your act together, Starwood.


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## DavidnRobin (Mar 8, 2016)

From the CSR perspective - it could be considered correct that SO are used for HomeResort reservations because... 1) they are deducted from the SO total when making a HR reservation, and 2) you cannot make a HR reservation if insufficient number of SO in the account to make the HR reservation.

Not sure why this really matters as they do come from the total SO in the account.
These SO could be considered HomeOptions (hO) that can be used to reserve during HR period, or as SO for SVN exchanges.

I am not so sure that all the IT issues (lack of inventory) are due to more people on-line. 
Time will tell. 
I still prefer (by far) the on-line system than calling at 6am PST - can it be improved? most certainly... but those who forget the past...

If the online booking had to be perfect (or close to perfect) before release...? I figure - knowing SVO - I would most likely still be waking up at 6am to call. Other than the Feb 11 fiasco - I have been successful with booking on-line.

Theoretically - with WKORV/N virtually sold-out, and if no Owner exchanges out of WKORV/N (even with SVO ownership) or converts to SP...  How is everyone going to get the week they want when many are vying for the same time? It would only be 1 unit per owner per week at some point in the year based on people trying to continuously trying to get reservations throughout the year - with some owners ending up with week 50... 
IMO YMMV


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## LisaRex (Mar 8, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> From the CSR perspective - it could be considered correct that SO are used for HomeResort reservations because... 1) they are deducted from the SO total when making a HR reservation, and 2) you cannot make a HR reservation if insufficient number of SO in the account to make the HR reservation.
> 
> Not sure why this really matters as they do come from the total SO in the account.



It's a hugely important distinction, because only Home Resort reservations can be made within the Home Resort Priority period of 8-12 months out.  And then you are limited to reserving weeks only, with pre-defined check-in days, at the resort you bought, in the season you bought, in the regime you bought, in the size villa you bought, and in the view class you bought. 

Once you convert to SOs, that up to 4-month booking priority and your view class are lost, but the other restrictions are lifted. 

If the CSRs cannot keep this straight, then they will make mistakes, including telling owners that their coveted OF designation cannot be guaranteed because it's being made with SOs.


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## Denise L (Mar 8, 2016)

When I spoke with a supervisor in the hours before the/my February 18 midnight mess, I was told that when owners go online to book their home resort during the home resort booking period, it sends the requests to the back end one way.  And an owner in the 8 month or less window will have his/her request go another way.  She told me that if I was randomly searching for a reservation (let's say I was practicing prior to midnight, which I was), and happened to be searching for something in a StarOption booking timeframe, that she would need to help me reset my page so that the system would default to me using my home resort booking timeframe.  Maybe that meant that the default page when I log in to book would show a 7 night stay already filled in and it would be quicker?  I do not know what the page would look like if I did go out of my 12 month booking period.  

It would be nice if the system defaulted to our home resort and villa size and number of people, and then we wouldn't have to select all of these items with the pulldown menus.  We could just hit Agree and Confirm and hopefully be done.  If we wanted to change anything, then we could use the pulldown menus.


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## DavidnRobin (Mar 8, 2016)

LisaRex said:


> It's a hugely important distinction, because only Home Resort reservations can be made within the Home Resort Priority period of 8-12 months out.  And then you are limited to reserving weeks only, with pre-defined check-in days, at the resort you bought, in the season you bought, in the regime you bought, in the size villa you bought, and in the view class you bought.
> 
> Once you convert to SOs, that up to 4-month booking priority and your view class are lost, but the other restrictions are lifted.
> 
> If the CSRs cannot keep this straight, then they will make mistakes, including telling owners that their coveted OF designation cannot be guaranteed because it's being made with SOs.



Sorry - really not following... not important. I haven't had an issue with reserving my OF at 12 months (10 years) - just glad I do not need to call anymore and why I am still okay with on-line (works for me) - knowing it is flawed.  I do believe (not fact based) that something is going on 'behind the scenes' in regards to both on-line booking and with future of SVN


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## DeniseM (Mar 8, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> I do believe (not fact based) that something is going on 'behind the scenes' in regards to both on-line booking and with future of SVN



We know this for a fact:  There were no summer Staroption reservations available on Maui, or at Harborside for summer 2016, at the 8 mo. mark.

Then months later, Starwood dumped a LOT of summer inventory into the system, all at one time.

Clearly, Starwood manipulates inventory that _belongs to owners_, behind the scenes.


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## alohakevin (Mar 9, 2016)

DeniseM said:


> This is what is available to reserve:
> -50 Ocean Front units
> -100 Ocean View Units
> -100 Island View units
> ...



So is there rationale in buying a IV even though fees are equal to OF. Sounds as though you would stand a better chance of getting a HR reservation with IV.


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## DeniseM (Mar 9, 2016)

alohakevin said:


> So is there rationale in buying a IV even though fees are equal to OF. Sounds as though you would stand a better chance of getting a HR reservation with IV.



First of all - I made up those numbers, just for the example, but yes, there are more OV and IV units than OF units - especially in the South Phase.

However, personally, I don't want to stay in an IV unit, even if it is easier to reserve.  If I'm going to do that, I might as well just trade in with Staroptions and save a lot of money upfront and ongoing.


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## LisaRex (Mar 9, 2016)

alohakevin said:


> So is there rationale in buying a IV even though fees are equal to OF. Sounds as though you would stand a better chance of getting a HR reservation with IV.



No, because for every villa you add to the inventory pool, you also add 50 owners. If you have 10 villas, you'll have 500 owners competing for 10 reservations; if you have 100 villas, you'll have 5000 owners competing for 100 reservations.  Your odds of 1:50 haven't changed.   

As an example, let's say you want to reserve July 4th week, which is the most popular vacation week of the year.  If you own at WKORV, because weeks 1-50 were all coded as platinum plus, you have 49 other owners potentially vying for that week. 

Compare this to a resort like HRA that breaks up the calendar year into 3 seasons (platinum (18 weeks), gold (20 weeks) and silver (12 weeks)*.   If you want to reserve July 4th week (gold season), you only have to compete against 19 other owners because 30 owners cannot even try to reserve because they own in a different season.  (Of course, the downside to this is that you might be limited to booking the season you bought because once the exchange window opens, you're competing against the SVN world.) 

So it's not the number of units that is as important as the number of owners in your (float) season.

*I removed weeks 51 and 52 so that I compared apples to apples.


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## DavidnRobin (Mar 11, 2016)

Last night I made 2 separate reservations at 9pm PST - took less than 2 minutes.


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## DeniseM (Mar 11, 2016)

It went smoothly for me last night, too.  I have been told that Starwood found a problem, and corrected it.  I'm keeping my fingers crossed.


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## DavidnRobin (Mar 11, 2016)

I got a popup that said a reCAPTCHA was being used now, but I didn't get one.  Did you?
Is this only for WKORV/N?


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## okwiater (Mar 11, 2016)

DavidnRobin said:


> I got a popup that said a reCAPTCHA was being used now, but I didn't get one.  Did you?



It will pop up when you search multiple times in succession. But not on your first few tries.


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## Helios (Mar 11, 2016)

okwiater said:


> It will pop up when you search multiple times in succession. But not on your first few tries.



I've gotten the pop up but no caption, only a radial select button asking if I am a robot (or something like that)


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## dsmrp (Mar 11, 2016)

moto x said:


> I've gotten the pop up but no caption, only a radial select button asking if I am a robot (or something like that)



Yes only a checkbox or similar to click.
No randomly generated text to enter.


Coincidentally there's a thread on the Marriott forum now, where owners are having online reservation difficulties.


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## Helios (Mar 11, 2016)

dsmrp said:


> Yes only a checkbox or similar to click.
> No randomly generated text to enter.
> 
> 
> Coincidentally there's a thread on the Marriott forum now, where owners are having online reservation difficulties.



I'll check out the thread.  My Marriott Ko Olina resie for Prez week went flawlessly.


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## The Haileys (Mar 13, 2016)

I'm seeing something rather odd ... 

We own a 1 bedroom, ocean view, odd year float at WKORV (81K SO)

If I look at availability for check-in March 4, 2017 with flexible dates, filtered to 1 bedroom only, I get availability in Home Resort Usage. But there are others there, at the same SO value, but it says the reservation window opens 7/1/16.

There's a small difference in the room description:
Home Resort Usage is "1 Bedroom Premium Villa | Oceanview Standard | Platinum+" while the 8 month out is just "1 Bedroom Premium Villa"

Now I know they changed some of the ownership to differentiate Ocean View vs Ocean Front, but the SO values likewise changed, with the OF having a much higher value. 

I'm confused ... be gentle, I am also a newbie.


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## DeniseM (Mar 13, 2016)

The Haileys said:


> I'm seeing something rather odd ...
> 
> We own a 1 bedroom, ocean view, odd year float at WKORV (81K SO)
> 
> ...



There are two types of one bedrooms at the resort.  With a Staroption reservation, you don't get to choose which type you want.

1)  Dedicated one bedroom (stand alone) - what you own - "ocean view"
2)  Lock-off one bedroom (part of 2-bdm lock-off) 

When you reserve a one bedroom with Staroptions, you get a "floating view."



> Now I know they changed some of the ownership to differentiate Ocean View vs Ocean Front, but the SO values likewise changed, with the OF having a much higher value.



Ocean View and Ocean Front have always been sold separately - they were never in the same category at WKORV-N/S.

A few months ago, they announced that they were going to raise the OF Staroptions at WKORV-N/S, to match the OF Staroptions at the new resort they are building next door.  They didn't change the Staroptions required for other views.

The new resort has 2 view categories:
-Ocean Front
-[Resort] View


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## The Haileys (Mar 13, 2016)

Oof ... so confuzzling! Thank you for this information. I just keep adding to my notes ... getting all this figured out.


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## DeniseM (Mar 13, 2016)

When you make a home resort reservation, you get your deeded unit type and view.

When you make a Staroption reservation, you get a floating view (assigned by the front desk)  and you may get either type of one bedroom unit.


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## undrpar64 (Mar 13, 2016)

Actually the two views are classified as oceanfront view and resort view.  Some of the resort views will be as good as the oceanfront views of the North property.  The initial building built and the first one to be completed is the building that I would request for the resort view.  On the South side of that building you will have a decent view of the ocean and the rest of the view will be of the grassy area between the two properties.


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## DeniseM (Mar 13, 2016)

undrpar64 said:


> Actually the two views are classified as oceanfront view and resort view.  Some of the resort views will be as good as the oceanfront views of the North property.  The initial building built and the first one to be completed is the building that I would request for the resort view.  On the South side of that building you will have a decent view of the ocean and the rest of the view will be of the grassy area between the two properties.



Thank you - I will edit the name of the view.

I don't know about this phase, but in the two original phases, reservations won't accept requests for buildings - they will usually only accept a request for a high or low floor.  I always try, but the party line these days seems to be that they don't accept building requests any more.

Of course, you can and should put in a request at the front desk.


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## iqmavin (Jan 20, 2018)

My latest interaction w Vistana was less than favorable. I tried to book a short stay at my home resort with a 4 week window, dates and unit size flexible.  Nothing was available HOWEVER when I went to SPG  site plenty of availability at premium prices.  When I called Vistana the agent checked with another Department and relayed the following:

There are unsold units at each property.

If those aren't booked by owners that inventory is turned over to SPG for sale on the hotel market.  

Just because you're an owner and there is availability doesn't mean you get any priority.  It is what it is.  There's no place to complain or anyone to talk with as far as I can tell.  

You've been helpful in the past and I haven't used site in awhile so I hope this is best way to voice my concerns.



DeniseM said:


> Unfortunately, the entry level people that you talk to when you call Starwood actually do not understand how the reservation system works themselves, and they have been instructed not to admit there are any problems with the system.
> 
> Here is a simplified explanation:
> 
> ...





DeniseM said:


> Unfortunately, the entry level people that you talk to when you call Starwood actually do not understand how the reservation system works themselves, and they have been instructed not to admit there are any problems with the system.
> 
> Here is a simplified explanation:
> 
> ...


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## DeniseM (Jan 20, 2018)

Unfortunately, this is true:  Per the official terms, at 60 days before check-in, Vistana can Hoover up any unreserved owner inventory and put it in their own inventory - FOR FREE.


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## CalGalTraveler (Jan 20, 2018)

DeniseM said:


> Unfortunately, the entry level people that you talk to when you call Starwood actually do not understand how the reservation system works themselves, and they have been instructed not to admit there are any problems with the system.
> 
> Here is a simplified explanation:
> 
> ...



As a new owner at Starwood this is very eye opening because we don't encounter such issues with the Hilton units we own. 

If you encounter this lack of availability issue at 12 months, what are the alternative steps one should take to get a reservation on or close to the dates desired in your unit?  We will make our first 12 month reservation this summer and we want to be prepared.  Thanks for your recommendations.


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## Helios (Jan 20, 2018)

CalGalTraveler said:


> As a new owner at Starwood this is very eye opening because we don't encounter such issues with the Hilton units we own.
> 
> If you encounter this lack of availability issue at 12 months, what are the alternative steps one should take to get a reservation on or close to the dates desired in your unit?  We will make our first 12 month reservation this summer and we want to be prepared.  Thanks for your recommendations.


I have seen issues that self resolve after a couple of weeks.  The last time this happened to me was with 2017 Harborside reservations.  I tried exactly at midnight 12 months out and nothing.  A couple of weeks after that, I saw a post here saying the inventory had been released and I got the two weeks I needed - Those were week 52...Unbelievable...

I did complained to Vistana 5* Elite and they said that they knew about the issue...


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## DeniseM (Jan 20, 2018)

CalGalTraveler said:


> As a new owner at Starwood this is very eye opening because we don't encounter such issues with the Hilton units we own.
> 
> If you encounter this lack of availability issue at 12 months, what are the alternative steps one should take to get a reservation on or close to the dates desired in your unit? We will make our first 12 month reservation this summer and we want to be prepared. Thanks for your recommendations.



I don't know of anything that you can do _after the fact_, but one thing you want to be sure to do is to make your reservation ONLINE at midnight eastern, the night before you would normally call.

For instance:  If you want to reserve Saturday, July 6, 2019 - you should make your reservation at midnight eastern on July 5, 2018.  I would practice with the Vistana Villa Finder well in advance so you can be fast and efficient.  No need to worry about accidentally making a reservation when you are practicing - even if you do, you can immediately cancel it (online) with no penalty.  Your week goes immediately back into  your account.


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## CalGalTraveler (Jan 20, 2018)

Thanks for your insights. This is very helpful. This raises a few more questions:

Is there a waitlist or do you just keep checking?

Is there a specific check-in day for WKORVN OF?  If not, if I couldn't get Saturday at midnight can I go for Sunday? or do I have to wait a week because of check-in days?

Can you "walk-in" your reservation similar to the Hilton system i.e. book/rebook your reservation from 6 days midnight before your intended check-in until you get the dates you want?


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## rickandcindy23 (Jan 20, 2018)

I don't own Staroptions, but I have had ridiculous problems trying to book weeks at SBP, including NO inventory for small one bedrooms, which is a recent change because I was always (in the past) able to book small one bedrooms and not the premium one bedrooms.  

This past summer I attempted to book two bed lockoff units at exactly midnight, and I cannot get them.  I can only get premium one bedrooms.  So I have several small one bedrooms I have not been able to book, except in the off-season.  Pretty annoying.  

I also tried to book a week 33 lockoff more than a year out (that is the week on my deed), and I was unable to book the entire lockoff, even though I had no competition.  I could book that up to TWO YEARS out and supposedly be guaranteed that inventory.  Not so much.  

I asked why I couldn't get my week 33, and the Vistana person told me, "I guess a lot of people have already booked their deeded week 33's and they took all of them before you had a chance"  How many more did Vistana sell than are physically there???


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## DeniseM (Jan 20, 2018)

Is there a waitlist or do you just keep checking?

_Only for 4 & 5 Star Elite owners, and it's not automated, so not reliable._

Is there a specific check-in day for WKORVN OF? If not, if I couldn't get Saturday at midnight can I go for Sunday? or do I have to wait a week because of check-in days?

_Friday, Saturday, Sunday - you can't check for any date until [12] months before check-in - so you would have to make the attempt on 3 consecutive nights - not all at the same time._

Can you "walk-in" your reservation similar to the Hilton system i.e. book/rebook your reservation from 6 days midnight before your intended check-in until you get the dates you want?

_Nope - with Vistana you cannot add days to a reservation - you have to reserve 7 nights all at once._


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## CalGalTraveler (Jan 20, 2018)

DeniseM said:


> Is there a waitlist or do you just keep checking?
> 
> _Only for 4 & 5 Star Elite owners, and it's not automated, so not reliable._
> 
> ...



_"you can't check for any date until 8 months before check-in"_
Thanks.  On the answer above, I am now confused. If I am reserving my home resort, don't I reserve 12 months in advance?

_So I could envision the following scenario: book Friday to be safe and to get priority for the best view units. If cannot get Friday, go for Saturday, and if not Saturday, then Sunday.  However Sunday may be slim pickings for views because the best views might be taken by Friday or Saturday since most people will go for Friday or Saturday to be safe and get their week.  Is this true?_


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## DeniseM (Jan 20, 2018)

My apologies - meant 12 and will correct.

No - Vistana designates a fixed number of units to be available for each of the 3 nights, so one night's reservations do not impact the next nights.


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## CalGalTraveler (Jan 20, 2018)

Ah got it.  Thanks @DeniseM.  How hard is it for owners to book WKORV OF at midnight during late June early July?  Do people end up not getting their summer booked?

What if you want to split your lock-off to get two consecutive weeks.  Do you get one week and risk not getting the following week because you have to do this all over again the following week?


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## DeniseM (Jan 20, 2018)

I don't think you will have any trouble with summer, as long as you book ASAP, because there are so many dates that fall within the school holiday, so everyone isn't trying for the same week.  However, July has a lot more demand than June.  

The only date that often books solid in one day is the Sat. starting President's week.

If you are splitting your lock-off, you have to reserve one side, for the first week, and then reserve the other side, a week later.  Shouldn't be a problem if you make your reservation ASAP.


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## Helios (Jan 21, 2018)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Can you "walk-in" your reservation similar to the Hilton system i.e. book/rebook your reservation from 6 days midnight before your intended check-in until you get the dates you want?


This is one of the worst limitations when comparing Vistana to HGVC.  I love waking reservations with HGVC.  With Vistana, any change to dates means canceling and rebooking...


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## CalGalTraveler (Jan 21, 2018)

+1 I agree with @Helios. I love the flexibility of the HGVC system. HGVC has also proven that it can manage properties with updated furnishings, cleanliness, and amenities with most maintenance fees in the $900 to $2000 range (most $1200 - $1700) even in expensive locales like Hawaii and NYC. I have to say that the WKORVN maintenance fee of $2700 has me very nervous as to what increases the future will bring, and whether the developer (or eventually Marriott) will use maintenance increases to price us out of our OF unit to get a hold of them for their own profitable purposes. I believe that the HGVC system, although not perfect, tries to be honest and fair with it's owners so would be less likely to use such a tactic.  My solace is that we purchased this Westin unit for a terrific resale price so we won't lose much if the value drops by 50% or more as long as we get 5 or more years usage of the unit - AND we will love staying at this resort!

One clarification question of @DeniseM:  When you say "ASAP" you mean midnight the year before the first day of check-in correct?


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## DeniseM (Jan 21, 2018)

Just to clarify a few points:

The Westin is no longer managed by the developer (Starwood) Starwood sold out their timeshare management company over a year ago to ILG who rebranded it as "Vistana Signature Experiences."

Even though $2,700 is a high maintenance fee, it may make you feel better to know that it would cost you $4,600 to rent an ocean front unit from an owner, and far more to rent it from Vistana.

_One clarification question of @DeniseM: When you say "ASAP" you mean midnight the year before the first day of check-in correct?  

Yes - _That is as soon as it is possible to make a reservation.


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## CalGalTraveler (Jan 21, 2018)

DeniseM said:


> Just to clarify a few points:
> 
> The Westin is no longer managed by the developer (Starwood) Starwood sold out their timeshare management company over a year ago to ILG who rebranded it as "Vistana Signature Experiences."
> 
> ...



Thanks for the clarification.

I agree that the rental potential is one area that also gived me solace knowing that we can have a breakeven on our initial purchase in as little as 5 stays and could lock off the unit and rent one side if desired to offset maintenance fees.  The flexibility of renting the lock-off at Westin is not a feature available in the HGVC system - you can only rent your entire home week whether it is a 2 bdrm etc.  I love the flexibility that a lock-off provides.


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