# Marriott Mountainside Presidents Week on Ebay



## CalBoomer (May 19, 2011)

A Marriott Park City Mountainside 2BR Presidents Week timeshare is up for sale on Ebay right now. This is the primo family ski week at Marriott's primo ski resort property. This should be interesting. Because of the prevalence of "spiking" on high-value Ebay auctions, even an estimate of the final price will not be available until seconds before the auction closes.

So how about a pool to guess the final price? Closest estimate wins.............bragging rights!

My entry is $22,500.

Whatever the final close, I'm sure it will be a shock to those owners who advertise these at exorbitant prices on many websites.


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## gblotter (May 19, 2011)

Yep - I've been watching that one too.

Just wondering if the seller has set an unreasonably-high reserve price.  In that case, it may not sell at all.


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## puckmanfl (May 19, 2011)

good evening....

for the uneducated yearning for knowledge..
what is a reserve price??


what is the buy it now price on this one???

I could not find the auction

could you post a link???


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## dioxide45 (May 19, 2011)

My guess is that this will likely get taken back via ROFR, regardless of how high the price might be. With so little Mountainside inventory in DC, I would think Marriott would covet this week. It is also possible that they have a waiting list for people wanting to buy this unit via their weeks resale department. If they do, they will turn it over for a quick dollar.


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## davidn247 (May 19, 2011)

No "buy it now" on the auction. My guess is that it will go for more than $30000. I will probably participate (up to a certain point) as this is an extremely rare week (fantastic ski resort, very low MF, etc).

Still has 7 days to go...

http://cgi.ebay.com/MARRIOTT-MOUNTA...Timeshares&hash=item43a71c78f9#ht_3945wt_1147


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## dioxide45 (May 19, 2011)

And they are using a real closing company, JRA Services. Never seen them listed in an Ebay ad before. The ad does indicate they will tell you the reserve if you ask.


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## CalBoomer (May 19, 2011)

davidn247 said:


> No "buy it now" on the auction. My guess is that it will go for more than $30000. I will probably participate (up to a certain point) as this is an extremely rare week (fantastic ski resort, very low MF, etc).
> 
> Still has 7 days to go...
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/MARRIOTT-MOUNTA...Timeshares&hash=item43a71c78f9#ht_3945wt_1147



Any "participation" that is meaningful will all happen in the final 60 seconds of the auction.


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## CalBoomer (May 19, 2011)

puckmanfl said:


> good evening....
> 
> for the uneducated yearning for knowledge..
> what is a reserve price??
> ...



Go to the Ebay website and search for real estate, timeshare; then choose Marriott timeshares. It is in the middle of the pack.

A "reserve price" is the minimum price that the seller will accept. It does not have a ""buy it now" price because the seller is hoping to get as much as possible and not set an artificial limit on what it could sell for. Any Ebay bidder can set a maximum price they are willing to pay, and the computer keeps bidding for them up to that level. Experienced buyers usually stay out of the bidding until the final minutes so they do not tip their hand to competitors who are also bidding. Setting a higher maximum bid in the final seconds is called "spiking" and it is not illegal or unethical by Ebay's rules. "Shilling" is a seller bidding on their own item to push up the price, and that is against Ebay's rules if they can prove that it has happened. "Shilling" is one reason why experienced bidders use "spiking."

The whole exercise is a bit like poker in trying to fake out your opponents.


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## CalBoomer (May 19, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> My guess is that this will likely get taken back via ROFR, regardless of how high the price might be. With so little Mountainside inventory in DC, I would think Marriott would covet this week. It is also possible that they have a waiting list for people wanting to buy this unit via their weeks resale department. If they do, they will turn it over for a quick dollar.



I doubt that this would be taken by Marriott via ROFR at "any" price, because a seller in cahoots with someone else could just shill the price up to a level that a real open market would never go to. I would expect Marriott has a fixed price for such a week that they will simply not go beyond in exercising ROFR.

In any event, we are all entitled to our opinions and it will be fascinating to see what really happens. Fortunately, I have no interest in it because my kids are grown and have produced no grandchildren, so Presidents Week is absolutely the last week I want to go skiing.


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## dioxide45 (May 20, 2011)

CalBoomer said:


> I doubt that this would be taken by Marriott via ROFR at "any" price, because a seller in cahoots with someone else could just shill the price up to a level that a real open market would never go to. I would expect Marriott has a fixed price for such a week that they will simply not go beyond in exercising ROFR.
> 
> In any event, we are all entitled to our opinions and it will be fascinating to see what really happens. Fortunately, I have no interest in it because my kids are grown and have produced no grandchildren, so Presidents Week is absolutely the last week I want to go skiing.



Any price may have been an exaggeration. When I indicated any price, I was referring to any realistic price that an Ebay auction is likely to produce. I would agree that they have a set price they will cap at when determining whether to exercise or not.

If a shill runs the price up, it isn't realistic and the unit didn't sell anyway.


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## Darlene (May 20, 2011)

My guess is $32, 600. It would be a great week to own. I think the first letter 7 - is the builiding designation. I know they don't have 7 buildings there, but for some odd reason they count the buildings at Marriott Summitt Watch first - so Mountainside units all start with a 7 or 8. Then, the unit number is 356 - third floor - kind of below the ground level. Of course, as a owner, you would hope you could request and get a better room/view. 
Darlene


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## CalBoomer (May 20, 2011)

If you uncover the automatic bids, every bid since $7000 has been outbid by $100, indicating that someone has placed a higher maximum bid.


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## Garnet (May 21, 2011)

*I think less*

It is an excellent week, great location.  This market, I think much lower.  Can't join DC (even if Mar. ROFR'd).  My guess is $18k, and that Marriott will ROFR.


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## m61376 (May 21, 2011)

I think it will command a pretty penny. Even in this market there are die-hard skiers, and ski or beach locations are premier President's week destinations. I wouldn't be surprised at all if it went in the mid-twenties or even approached 30K..


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## Twinkstarr (May 21, 2011)

m61376 said:


> I think it will command a pretty penny. Even in this market there are die-hard skiers, and ski or beach locations are premier President's week destinations. I wouldn't be surprised at all if it went in the mid-twenties or even approached 30K..



That would be my guess also on the price. And after looking at "event" ski weeks that would be a pretty decent price.


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## davidn247 (May 21, 2011)

CalBoomer said:


> If you uncover the automatic bids, every bid since $7000 has been outbid by $100, indicating that someone has placed a higher maximum bid.



Just put a bid to test at $15000 and someone is already much higher! I know that the trick is to wait last moment.... but just wanted to know where people were at.

It will go higher than 30K and will not be surprised to be ROFR.


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## gblotter (May 21, 2011)

davidn247 said:


> Just put a bid to test at $15000 and someone is already much higher! I know that the trick is to wait last moment.... but just wanted to know where people were at.
> 
> It will go higher than 30K and will not be surprised to be ROFR.


$30K would still be a bargain for that week.


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## taffy19 (May 21, 2011)

m61376 said:


> I think it will command a pretty penny. Even in this market there are die-hard skiers, and ski or beach locations are premier President's week destinations. I wouldn't be surprised at all if it went in the mid-twenties or even approached 30K..


I still believe that ski resorts will out bid beach resorts closer to the original sales price anytime because there are so few available.  They may even become more valuable in the future as there will be less of them in the Marriott Legacy weeks' pool as the Marriott is a competitor and the week becomes trust points in a different bucket.  That Legacy week is gone and with that another guaranteed vacation week during the ski season _unless you enroll_.

It's going to be interesting to see if Marriott will exercise their ROFR here.  We will find out soon and will that be the bottom price from there on?  The economy has something to do with it too so we may never know the answer.


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## CalBoomer (May 21, 2011)

davidn247 said:


> Just put a bid to test at $15000 and someone is already much higher! I know that the trick is to wait last moment.... but just wanted to know where people were at.
> 
> It will go higher than 30K and will not be surprised to be ROFR.



Trust me. Most of the action will occur in the final minute, or seconds, when the price could rise $10,000 in a twinkling.


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## Cobra1950 (May 23, 2011)

Christmas week 51 Platinum Plus weeks are going at Mountainside or Summittwatch for 40K to $50K; New Years week 52 is going for $50K to $55K,
as President's week is a Platinum Plus as well, so it will be more than $30K.  Regular Platinum ski weeks are going for $15K to $17K
I have not seen any Presidents week on Red Week lately, will check


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## Robert D (May 24, 2011)

CalBoomer said:


> Trust me. Most of the action will occur in the final minute, or seconds, when the price could rise $10,000 in a twinkling.



I've seen some auctions that get bid up high early where there's wasn't that much action in the final seconds.  I don't know enough about this TS to know if the current bid is high or not.


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## m61376 (May 26, 2011)

Wow- still at just over 20K with a minute left...reserve still not met. Waiting to see if there would be a flurry of last minute bidding, but shockingly none.


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## dioxide45 (May 26, 2011)

I wonder if it would have gotten more activity had there not been a reserve on the auction.


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## MOXJO7282 (May 26, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> I wonder if it would have gotten more activity had there not been a reserve on the auction.


I find this to be true that non-reserved items sell at higher prices.


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## davidn247 (May 26, 2011)

m61376 said:


> Wow- still at just over 20K with a minute left...reserve still not met. Waiting to see if there would be a flurry of last minute bidding, but shockingly none.



I put a bid up to my (self-imposed) limit... but below the reserve price (I was the highest bidder). Ebay does not seem to be the place to sell such premium week if you are not ready to dump it.

I frankly think that a lower reserve price would have attracted more people to possibly go for it. This MOU Week 7 President is supposely one of the best II exchanger that you can have in your portofolio.


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## rrazzorr (May 26, 2011)

Even the Reserve was lowered yesterday. What's the problem, I wonder.... Didn't even reach the lowest predicted price.


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## gblotter (May 26, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> I wonder if it would have gotten more activity had there not been a reserve on the auction.


A high reserve price sends a signal that the seller is not motivated.  That ends up discouraging potential bidders.

Still, this is a rare week to appear on eBay - very surprised with the results.


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## rrazzorr (May 26, 2011)

gblotter said:


> Still, this is a rare week to appear on eBay - very surprised with the results.



Well, something tells me it's coming back up next week, with lower reserve.

Does anyone know the associated eBay listing fees with the reserve of let's say 20k? Also, I haven't sold on eBay in a while, what's their commission cut?


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## CalBoomer (May 27, 2011)

No matter how one spins this, the fact remains that no buyer was willing to shell out more than $20,500 for a Presidents Ski Week. My guess of $22,500 was based on about a 50% premium over what the platinum weeks go for--and even that was slightly too high. All of the asking prices on innumerable ad sites represent more seller denial than market demand. Whatever one thinks of Ebay, it is indeed an open market and represents the most transparent benchmark of real value.


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## dioxide45 (May 27, 2011)

davidn247 said:


> This MOU Week 7 President is supposely one of the best II exchanger that you can have in your portofolio.



Exchange? There is no way one should buy it to exchange. It would be to use or rent for big $$$.


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## ondeadlin (May 27, 2011)

Count me among those not surprised.

You can buy a diamond Hyatt week for under $10,000, which will give you access to President's Day week at a number of equally nice ski resorts (or nicer, quite frankly, given the fact Mountainside's rooms are quite small). Now, that's not for a fixed week, but given the fact Hyatt diamond weeks are fairly rare, it's a much easier reservation in their system. Just saw one available in Tahoe the other day, in fact.

The timeshare paradigm has changed drastically. The new norm includes much lower prices. I'd say that where this auction ended is just about this week's value in an open market. Could you get more? Sure, but your buyer would likely be someone who doesn't quite realize that the market has changed as much as it has.


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## m61376 (May 27, 2011)

While I am very surprised that there wasn't more interest, I'm not sure about the rationale that a higher reserve lowers the price.Not to bring up previous rehashed discussions, it seems to me to be a questionable as the logic that ROFR lowers prices because it scares potential buyers away.

I would think that the interested buyer would bid up to what they think the week is worth (or for us Tuggers to the limit that they would think is would be too good to pass up for   ), whether there is no reserve, a realistic or an unreasonable reserve. I agree that the seller overestimated the market.

With summer around the corner, maybe people are thinking beach and not skiing (I'm not a skier, so I don't know) and maybe that explains the limited interest.


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## MOXJO7282 (May 27, 2011)

CalBoomer said:


> Whatever one thinks of Ebay, it is indeed an open market and represents the most transparent benchmark of real value.



This is simply not true. And I can confirm from several first hand experiences. 

Case in point, I bought (2) GO Gold OFs off of ebay for $7500. I then listed those same weeks as a test on Redweek a week later at $9250. Immediately got a taker within days. I explained my situation to them and they offered me $11,250 thinking a higher price would sway me. It didn't because I love the property and these GO OF are extremely valuable to me.

So again to continue my test I bumped up the price to $13,250. Within a week another separate offer of $12,500, and then another broker who offered $10k. So 4 offers within 6 weeks of buying off ebay.

Another case in point. I also sold  2 GO OS gold units. At the same time I had a redweek ad up and a ebay auction. Within the same week I sold both, ebay unit went for $5800 and redweek unit sold for $6250.



So my point is ebay doesn't represent true market value, rather just market value for that moment in time. As much exposure as ebay has, many don't trust it and know about it so you're not going to get true market value from ebay.


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## Cobra1950 (May 29, 2011)

From what I have seen, most of the higher value Mountainside and Summittwatch units (weeks 51, 52, & 7) are handled by real estate brokers that are specializing in them as opposed to the internet only virtual guys that probably do not even know where Park City or Lake Tahoe is. 
    I have not seen any indication that prices have broken for these weeks, at least in the Park City area, anywhere near the 60% or so that regular Platinum ski season weeks have (Last Marriott pre reorganization price of $37K versus $15K now).  I have been looking for a New Years' week at Summittwatch or Mountainside for several years to go along with our Christmas week at a decent price but have yet to see one.


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## CalBoomer (May 29, 2011)

Cobra1950 said:


> From what I have seen, most of the higher value Mountainside and Summittwatch units (weeks 51, 52, & 7) are handled by real estate brokers that are specializing in them as opposed to the internet only virtual guys that probably do not even know where Park City or Lake Tahoe is.
> I have not seen any indication that prices have broken for these weeks, at least in the Park City area, anywhere near the 60% or so that regular Platinum ski season weeks have (Last Marriott pre reorganization price of $37K versus $15K now).  I have been looking for a New Years' week at Summittwatch or Mountainside for several years to go along with our Christmas week at a decent price but have yet to see one.



Making derogatory comments about the brokers who utilize Ebay is not going to increase the value of your own timeshare. The fact that no one was willing to pay $20,000 or more for a President's Week should tell you something, whether or not you want to hear it.


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## Cobra1950 (May 31, 2011)

CalBoomer
    So who is making derogatory remarks about professional brokers?  Generally they perform a necessary function like any real estate broker, but any buyer today needs to know plenty about their business just as dealing with any vendor, trust of anyone you have not directly dealt with in the past is naive.
    However with all the internet flim flam going on, anyone who would put major funds at stake on a "too good to be true" deal on Ebay or anywhere deserves to get fleeced and it is a good chance they will be.
    Suggest you sign up on this site rather than having guest status, you might have a real learning experience on timeshare life and times.


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## dioxide45 (May 31, 2011)

Cobra1950 said:


> Suggest you sign up on this site rather than having guest status, you might have a real learning experience on timeshare life and times.



Perhaps you should do the same. You also show as a Guest.


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## CalBoomer (May 31, 2011)

Cobra1950 said:


> CalBoomer
> So who is making derogatory remarks about professional brokers?  Generally they perform a necessary function like any real estate broker, but any buyer today needs to know plenty about their business just as dealing with any vendor, trust of anyone you have not directly dealt with in the past is naive.
> However with all the internet flim flam going on, anyone who would put major funds at stake on a "too good to be true" deal on Ebay or anywhere deserves to get fleeced and it is a good chance they will be.
> Suggest you sign up on this site rather than having guest status, you might have a real learning experience on timeshare life and times.



I'm not a guest. I'm a member of TUG. I bought my units resale, but not through Ebay. But the prices were very similar. Your attitude about Ebay is not very realistic.


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## dioxide45 (May 31, 2011)

CalBoomer said:


> I'm not a guest. I'm a member of TUG. I bought my units resale, but not through Ebay. But the prices were very similar. Your attitude about Ebay is not very realistic.



You should read these instructions.


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## davidn247 (May 31, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> Exchange? There is no way one should buy it to exchange. It would be to use or rent for big $$$.



You are right. This type of week is definitely renting around $3500 (2BR, week 7, president's), which is a nice return after $950 MF (approx. 10% if you can buy it below $25000).

The beauty of that particular fixed week is (1) the no-brainer regarding booking the week..., (2) the cheap MF fees (rare in today's world!) and (3) the huge trading power. You can simply sit back and relax! The TS world is yours...


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## CalBoomer (May 31, 2011)

dioxide45 said:


> You should read these instructions.



Thanks. Never would have figured that out on my own.


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## JeffJay (Jun 23, 2011)

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