# Another Newbie Question....for Maximum Trade value (or just buy points)...what to do.



## AFARR (Feb 17, 2010)

As I mentioned in my other post, I'm in the process of buying my first TS.   This is a week (Outer Banks Wk. 37) that I'm likely to use.   Probably not (and not the reason I bought it in the first place) the best trade...however...

If I get another week....what should I look for for maximum trade power...(don't you call it "tiger trades")?   Any suggestions for the best values to look for?

What trading system RCI, II, etc.?

Or, if I got it with the intention of using it for trades anyway....just find a points week?   Which system?  How many points are good?

Basically looking for 2 BR trades so if I want to go somewhere in the summer, I can swing it (on-season)...

Thanks for any ideas or suggestions!

AFARR


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## bnoble (Feb 18, 2010)

Ah, you seek the Holy Grail!

This is a tricky business, because today's tiger trader can be tomorrow's kitty cat---just ask the many folks who bought South African when it was a tiger before Black Sunday, or the folks who had their claws pulled by RCI's 5/30/09 revaluation.  Buying explicitly to trade is nothing more than a form of gambling.

That said, the idea is that you want to buy something that everyone wants, but no one can get---for example, coastal summer SoCal---but you want to buy something with fees (and costs) that are low enough to make things work out *and* you might still end up better off renting it out and using the proceeds to rent whatever you want.

In summary: buying to trade is usually a bad idea, fraught with danger, and never certain.  In my opinion, you're better off buying something that you know *you* can use that also *happens* to be something everyone else wants, and no one else can get.  That way, if it ends up not trading the way you want it to, you can at least still use it, and maybe even rent it out.

Note: that's for RCI Weeks.  A mini-system is another story.  I own Wyndham, and don't think of booking other Wyndham resorts as "trades", I think of those as "use".  Most other mini-systems would be similar.


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## AFARR (Feb 18, 2010)

*Thanks!*

I definitely see your point on the trades...

However, if I'm torn on a purchase....(i.e....I will likely use it, but it's not a hugely appealing place from my viewpoint....I don't Ski, but if I had an opportunity to get a cheap week in a Ski area during prime season)...the possibility of trading it may make it worth buying the TS vs. looking for something else.

So, just general ideas...

What Weeks to look for (at the Beach areas)?   

Aren't some summer weeks worth more than other 'summer' weeks?   

What areas are considered more prized (I'm guessing nicer areas within a drive of bigger metro centers are probably worth more than nice places in the middle of nowhere).   

As I mentioned above...I don't ski (I prefer Xcountry vs. downhill), so I don't even know what prime Ski season is in various areas (a bunch of relatives ski, so even if I don't ski, someone would use it).

Thanks again!


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## Stricky (Feb 18, 2010)

My opinion is that you should stick with points. The weeks trading system is a thing of the past and is only going to die a slow death over the next 10 years. I would look to buy a points week from a resort that you would like to go to or look for a lot of points for a very low maintanance fee (another holy grail).

There is an option to lease RCI points for 3 years that a lot of people have liked. That way you can walk away after 3 years instead of paying MFs for the rest of your life.

My 2 cents...


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## bnoble (Feb 18, 2010)

> the possibility of trading it may make it worth buying the TS vs. looking for something else.


I'll say it again.  Buying to trade (vs. to use) is nothing more than a form of gambling.


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## BevL (Feb 18, 2010)

If I had to do it over again, I'd get into a points based system, especially at the resale prices now.  For me, Worldmark would be my choice as I live on the west coast.


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## rickandcindy23 (Feb 18, 2010)

bnoble said:


> This is a tricky business, because today's tiger trader can be tomorrow's kitty cat---just ask the many folks who bought South African when it was a tiger before Black Sunday, *or the folks who had their claws pulled by RCI's 5/30/09 revaluation.*  Buying explicitly to trade is nothing more than a form of gambling.



You have a great way with words, Brian. I love that claws pulled statement.   

I recommend that you buy RCI Points, if you want something that will get prime summer, but you better plan your trips 9-10 months out.  

I see a week 29 in Duck on eBay with RCI Points attached.  I do wonder what the trading power would be of that 3 bedroom unit, and the fees are low, but would it really be wise to get the week without the points?  No, I think the points are better, since RCI devalued so many week on 5/30/2009.  We will never know.  

I wonder if the Outer Banks summer weeks in general stayed as good traders after everything settled.  I somehow doubt it.


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## AFARR (Feb 18, 2010)

bnoble said:


> I'll say it again.  Buying to trade (vs. to use) is nothing more than a form of gambling.



I understand...I might have not been clear in my response....If I buy, it WILL be something that I am willing to use for the week and MFs (or at least allow family to use instead)...however, if I find 2 or 3 different places (all places I'd be willing to go and vacation and with reasonable MFs), and it comes down to it...the option (tradeablity?) to trade may make the final decision easier.

Thanks!


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## bnoble (Feb 18, 2010)

You said it yourself: you don't ski.  If you don't ski, and you buy a ski week, you are not buying to use.  You "could" use it, sure.  But you don't really want to.

Still an invitation to disappointment, from where I sit.


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## DeniseM (Feb 18, 2010)

Before you buy a trader, I would do a LOT more homework.  Although this was a very good question - you are not going to get a definitive answer, because savvy owners know that as soon as they start bragging about a cheap/tiger trader, it's the kiss of death to the trader.

Since you just bought your first TS, I would wait several months before you make another purchase.  If you want more options, join an exchange company, and rent some cheap last call or get away weeks.  Also check out our Last Minute Rental Board - all rentals there are $700 or less.


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## timeos2 (Feb 18, 2010)

*Buy to use. Doesn't have to mean a week*



AFARR said:


> I understand...I might have not been clear in my response....If I buy, it WILL be something that I am willing to use for the week and MFs (or at least allow family to use instead)...however, if I find 2 or 3 different places (all places I'd be willing to go and vacation and with reasonable MFs), and it comes down to it...the option (tradeablity?) to trade may make the final decision easier.
> 
> Thanks!



The rule of buying to use is one that is ignored only at extreme risk. For weeks type ownership using means that most of the time you plan to use the time you purchased. Easy and as low a cost as possible as your only fees are the annual ones.  No system fees, membership fees or trade fees required.  If on occasion for some reason you absolutely can't use it then if its a high demand time (why own if its not?) then renting or a trade should be easy & bring in the value of your annual costs. As mentioned week for week trading is a dying program as it simply is too hard to get equal value matches. 

But buy to use can also mean buying into a system that offers multiple locations/resorts. It may be a closed one with a large number of internal choices like Wyndham, Worldmark, DRI and a few others. Do not buy one with too few locations or total resorts as you are back to external (& costlier) trades. Small systems are possibly worse than just a week to trade as you are paying the system premium without the big benefits.  Also there is the more wide open RCI Points system which offers no internal use but has great (and expanding) choices designed to be used for trade. It is still considered buying to use even though you aren't tied to one resort/week.

Unless you have a resort/area/time that you really want every year (and that many others would too) a good points based system seems to be the best & most cost effective for your needs.


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## John Cummings (Feb 18, 2010)

I have been timesharing for 22 years. If I had it to do over, I would do exactly the same thing I did. I bought 2 timeshares that are both floating weeks Gold Crown resorts "red" all year. Both are Coastal California resorts which is a high demand area with limited supply. Coastal California will always be high demand and never be overbuilt because of regulations and cost. As a result, they have always been tiger traders and still are. I always reserve prime summer weeks, typically July 4th week. I have used San Francisco Exchange "SFX" exclusively for the past 13 years. Prior to them, I used RCI and II. I receive 2 bonus weeks a year from SFX for depositing and my weeks don't expire. II also gave me a bonus week every year. We have always received what we requested.

I prefer floating weeks to fixed as I am able to get July 4th weeks without paying any premium for it. I like getting bonus weeks. I do not like points.

My opinion and experience is obviously different from most people here and I am certainly not trying to infer that they are wrong. I am a strong believer in going with whatever works the best for you. Weeks are still a viable way to go if you can make it work for you. The secret is to buy in a location where demand exceeds supply. Learn how to use the system to maximize your opportunities. Definitely look at using the independent exchange companies like SFX, DAE, etc. It is actually quite easy.

The secret is to do your homework before you buy and learn the system regardless if it is points or weeks.


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## DVB42 (Feb 18, 2010)

John Cummings said:


> I have been timesharing for 22 years. If I had it to do over, I would do exactly the same thing I did. I bought 2 timeshares that are both floating weeks Gold Crown resorts "red" all year. Both are Coastal California resorts which is a high demand area with limited supply. Coastal California will always be high demand and never be overbuilt because of regulations and cost. As a result, they have always been tiger traders and still are. I always reserve prime summer weeks, typically July 4th week. I have used San Francisco Exchange "SFX" exclusively for the past 13 years. Prior to them, I used RCI and II. I receive 2 bonus weeks a year from SFX for depositing and my weeks don't expire. II also gave me a bonus week every year. We have always received what we requested.
> 
> I prefer floating weeks to fixed as I am able to get July 4th weeks without paying any premium for it. I like getting bonus weeks. I do not like points.
> 
> ...




I prefer the weeks system over points for the same reasons described by John. I have been trading weeks for 30 years and have mostly been very happy with the outcome. Many TUG members have had some issues with the major exchange companies such as RCI and II. My experience with II has been positive for the most part.  I have never used RCI so I can not comment about them. Although I own some floating weeks, I prefer fixed weeks. That said, I would only buy into desired weeks that I would want to use myself.. Although I have traded a lot, I agree with essentially everyone that you should primarily buy at the resort you want to use yourself. Trading after that becomes much easier.


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## AFARR (Feb 18, 2010)

*Ok, then an additional question comes up...*

If I go with a Points purchase (in the future...I like to have some idea of what is a good/excellent value to keep an eye out for one...assuming I have the $$$ at the time), how to tell what is a good value.

Someone mentioned the Outer Banks place (68k points..deeded week 29, I think, in the RCI system).    Should I use things like that as an indicator of what points would get me?   So, if I bought a 90k points week in RCI (for the sake of arguement...I don't know if such beasts exist)...then if I wanted to go to the Outer Banks on Week 29...would I count on spending the 68k points that the OBX place cost (more or less...I know it depends on the amenities, resort, etc...but if a place is titled with 68k points...does that mean it requires 68k points to get into it as a rental...or is there an 'additional skim' by the trading company....say 75k points to rent it)?

Thanks!


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## brankatz (Feb 18, 2010)

I on the other hand bought my first TS about 8 years ago on E-Bay was a fixed summer week Gulf Coast of Florida low Maintenance fees and was relatively inexpensive investment I did research the resorts in the area and visited several before I decided where to purchase. I have had nothing but good things to say about the resort and return there same week every year one of the benefits of being same resort same time every year is there are other familys that visit every year and you become friends. So 2 years ago I purchased another timeshare the week after my resort again on E bay higher MF at a close by resort and decided to use it to invite other family members it is a larger unit if I am unable to use the second resort as is the case for 2011 I am able to use it as a trader(Got DVC VWL week 51 2010 with it woohoo). I like having the same week at the same resort and the same unit it gives the feeling as if you are going home. The kids youngest who was not even born are first couple of years will treasure the memories forever. Just my 2 Cents.


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