# Can someone direct me in the right direction? [related threads merged]



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 9, 2013)

I am about to try and buy a contract of Wyndham points some time in the near future. Am I to understand that you get a FREE RCI account with the ownership of Wyndham points? Is it just a one year free membership or is it ongoing free?

And also is there a resource some place here on these boards or elsewhere that might help me better understand the RCI exchange system trading Wyndham points for RCI resorts? Like understanding TPU's and ongoing searches, etc. These are terms I have seen in reading some threads about trading into RCI.

Also there are some fees involved in sending your points over to RCI then again when you book an RCI?

I take it from the little bit I have read about RCi is that it is a good thing to do with your Wyndham points at the end of the year if you haven't used them, rather then just letting them expire?

If there is a thread on here that might help me I would appreciate if someone could head me in that direction. I appreciate any help in advance.

I asked this on the WYndham board instead of the RCI board because I don't think everybody over there is all Wyndham ppl.


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## markb53 (Jul 9, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I am about to try and buy a contract of Wyndham points some time in the near future. Am I to understand that you get a FREE RCI account with the ownership of Wyndham points? Is it just a one year free membership or is it ongoing free?
> 
> And also is there a resource some place here on these boards or elsewhere that might help me better understand the RCI exchange system trading Wyndham points for RCI resorts? Like understanding TPU's and ongoing searches, etc. These are terms I have seen in reading some threads about trading into RCI.
> 
> ...



Yes the cost of the RCI account is included in the program fee that is is part the the Maintenance Fee so you get is every year.

Personally I think the best use of Wyndham is with Wyndham resorts. 
I use RCI for booking Last Call and RCI specials. Where you can often book a week somewhere for under $300.00 cash no points.

Here is the quick list of RCI fees.

To deposit costs one RT Fee. Each year Wyndham gives you 1 for each 77k points you own. After that they are $30.00 each.
When you book through RCI. RCI charges about $189.00
Plus many resorts charge an additional (Housekeeping) fee sometime $50 to $75.

What I do is before my use year starts, I put all my points into the credit pool. That extends there live for 3 years. That costs $39.00 per use year. That way you never have to worry about left over points expiring. The only problem with doing that is that you can't use credit pooled points for APR (Advanced Priority Reservations) at your home resort. But I don't see needing that myself.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 9, 2013)

That sounds like a good idea actually. I didn't know about that credit pool thing. I read the words credit pool somewhere but wasn't sure what it is.

So you have to do it BEFORE you get the points right? You can't do it after you already have the points.

Are there always credit pool points available to use? Are everybody's pooled and you have to wait until there is enough in the pool before you can book?

And it costs $39 to pool ALL your points one time...and you can book one free vacation for every 77,000 points you own, then after that you pay for each one... There is no additional fee for using credit pool points?

By the way thank you for your help understanding this. You helped me on my other question earlier.

What I am concerned about is if I buy a contract in the next month or so and it still has all the 2013 points on it, once it closes and gets transferred (a few months from now) I will not have time to use up the points on the contract before they expire. I was wondering if RCI is the best thing to do with those leftover points.

I read something about if you deposit all your points in one lump sum to RCI then you can only have that ONE ongoing search going. I am not even sure what an ongoing search is. Maybe looking for availability for certain dates? But it may be more cost effective to deposit them all in one lump sum if they charge you for each deposit. I also read something about combining deposits to lengthen their expiration.

Is there a location you can go look to see what different resorts you can book through RCI and how many Wyndham points it takes to stay there?


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## markb53 (Jul 10, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> That sounds like a good idea actually. I didn't know about that credit pool thing. I read the words credit pool somewhere but wasn't sure what it is.
> 
> So you have to do it BEFORE you get the points right? You can't do it after you already have the points.
> 
> ...




Yes you have to do it before your use year starts. There is another cool thing about the credit pool. Right now I can see my 2015 points in my account. So I could call today and credit pool my 2015 points and use them today. 
If you read the directory about credit pooling, it says something about the use depends on others with the same use year putting their points in the pool. Apparently, years ago there were times that you had to wait a couple of days for pool credits to become available. But from what I have read. No one has had that problem in years. Probably because people like Ron and other that puts millions of points in the credit pool every year. 
Yes it is not by contract, it is buy use year. So I can pool all or part of my 2014 points now. I am not going to credit pool my 2014 points but I am going to credit pool my 2015 point  because in about 2 months I am going to book a reservation that uses all of my 2014 point and some of my 2015 points.
Reservation Transactions RT are put into your account on Jan 1st of each year regardless of your use year. You get 1 for each 77,000 points you have. I have 287,000 annual points so I get 3. If I had 21,000 points I would get 1 more. 
I bought a resale time share in early September last year. It got into my account on December 19th. Just in time to credit pool the 2013 points. There were no 2012 points. If there had be 2012 points. I could have made a reservation for christmas somewhere close. Or put them in RCI. The only time I think it is good to use RCI. When there is no other choice.
I have never tried doing an ongoing search so I don't know how they work.
There is no way to see the point cost until after you have a Wyndham account and access the the Wyndham RCI portal. 

Good luck on your decision making process and Happy Shopping.

Mark


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## JimMIA (Jul 10, 2013)

The only drawback I see with credit pooling (which I also use) is that pooled points cannot be deposited into RCI.  

That's not a big deal to me; I can plan around it if I want to use RCI, and there may be some work-around I'm not aware of.


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## markb53 (Jul 10, 2013)

JimMIA said:


> The only drawback I see with credit pooling (which I also use) is that pooled points cannot be deposited into RCI.
> 
> That's not a big deal to me; I can plan around it if I want to use RCI, and there may be some work-around I'm not aware of.



There is a cool work around. I recently needed 28,000 additional points for an RCI reservation. I looked around on the Wyndham site. It took me a little while to find it, but I finally found a 2 night booking that cost exactly 28,000 points. I made the reservation. It used my credit pooled points, since that is all that was available. Then I canceled the reservation. The points became canceled points, and I then deposited them into RCI. All on the same day to it only cost 1 RT

Mark 



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## JimMIA (Jul 10, 2013)

markb53 said:


> There is a cool work around. I recently needed 28,000 additional points for an RCI reservation. I looked around on the Wyndham site. It took me a little while to find it, but I finally found a 2 night booking that cost exactly 28,000 points. I made the reservation. It used my credit pooled points, since that is all that was available. Then I canceled the reservation. The points became canceled points, and I then deposited them into RCI. All on the same day to it only cost 1 RT
> 
> Mark
> 
> ...


Yeah, that's the one I was thinking of, but wasn't sure it actually worked.


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## scootr5 (Jul 10, 2013)

markb53 said:


> There is a cool work around. I recently needed 28,000 additional points for an RCI reservation. I looked around on the Wyndham site. It took me a little while to find it, but I finally found a 2 night booking that cost exactly 28,000 points. I made the reservation. It used my credit pooled points, since that is all that was available. Then I canceled the reservation. The points became canceled points, and I then deposited them into RCI. All on the same day to it only cost 1 RT



I just did the exact same thing yesterday (well, not for 28,000 points though).


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## AsAx (Jul 10, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I read something about if you deposit all your points in one lump sum to RCI then you can only have that ONE ongoing search going. I am not even sure what an ongoing search is. Maybe looking for availability for certain dates?



I had the same question in my mind, so I've searched and found this:

http://pgs.rci.com/landing/InsideRCI/ongoingsearch/index.html?promo=VANNAENUSWInsideRCIOngoing

Could other members confirm that this is how ongoing search works ?


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 10, 2013)

Thank you for all the information and help. I appreciate it.

I am having a hard time finding answers to specific type questions on here.

I have found several contracts for sale but am reluctant to try and buy something just yet because I don't think I have done enough research and learned enough to know that timeshare is right for us.

I think Wyndham points ARE right for us. We almost bought into DVC several times and didn't but this is more versatile and gives you so many more vacation options besides just Disney.

It is much more affordable, the maintenance fees are cheaper and from what I see through Ebay sales, it is easy to get rid of if you decide you no longer want it as long as you are willing to basically give it away.

If any of you come back and see this question, let me ask you this...how difficult is it to get reservations through Wyndham at the 10 month window or less? We rarely travel during summer or major school holidays. We usually travel in the off season like January/Feb, October/November. Have you always been able to get something or are there times you are left without availability for your dates of travel?


ETA: That IS where I read something about credit pooled points having to be available is in the directory. I have been trying to really read through that and study the points charts so I can kind of come up with an idea of how many points would be good for us.

Once you have your points and WYndham recognizes you as an owner do they issue you an online account where you can go online and see all your points and check for availability, etc? I know you just said you can see your 2015 points online so I am assuming there is some kind of owners site?

Now I just have to decide how many points are right for us and decide what we are willing to pay for a contract that meets our needs. I have been looking through Ebay completed sales and the price range is ALL OVER the place. Contracts have sold for $10 and some sell for $2,000 with almost the same amount of points at similar resorts.

I think we would like to keep our maintenance fees below $150 a month so that seems to limit us to contracts of 300,000 points or less. So that also may put us having to put out more initially to get lower MF's. 

I would like to make sure we get something and get everything closed and transferred in time for us to put our 2014 points in the credit pool also. That seems like the smartest way to manage your points to get more time out of them without having to use RCI.

Another quick question...if you use up your FREE bookings for the year and you make another one and have to pay the fee for it, how do you pay for that? Do you pay for it over the phone with a CC at the time of booking?

Also, when booking a vacation can you add a room request such as you would like a ground floor room if available? I see some of these resorts have 3 or 4 floors and some have no elevators.


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## vacationhopeful (Jul 10, 2013)

Feb in Florida is not low season.

Getting DVC using Wyndham points can change overnight along with the number of points required.

Not all Wyndham resorts are clones to Bonnet Creek..some are just converted motel rooms where 2 rooms morifed into a 1 bdr.

Keep reading. If you are spending $2K in MK fees yearly, for 10 years...you want your family to be happy.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 10, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> Feb in Florida is not low season.
> 
> Getting DVC using Wyndham points can change overnight along with the number of points required.
> 
> ...



Staying on Disney property in February is low season as far as how much you have to pay to stay there and what the crowd numbers are. I am not sure if it is low season for all of Florida.

We wouldn't be trying to stay at DVC resorts with Wyndham points. We would stay at a Wyndham resort.

Probably Star Island in Kissimmee or maybe Bonnet Creek in Orlando depending on which one had availability. But we have never had any problem booking rooms for Disney in January/February or October/November. We have even been twice during mid-April and didn't have any problem booking. But we have never tried booking with timeshare points either.

I don't really plan on paying $2k a year in MF's if I can help it. One of the contracts I am looking at right now has $80 a month MF's and one has $120 a month MF's. They may eventually get up to $2k a year after we buy into it and the MF's go up every year but initially we aren't going to start out paying that much. We won't buy a contract that has MF's that high.


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## markb53 (Jul 10, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Thank you for all the information and help. I appreciate it.
> 
> I am having a hard time finding answers to specific type questions on here.
> 
> ...



I will try to answer all of those. 
From my experience most resorts have good availability at 10 months. I hear myrtle beach might be the exception and maybe Bonnet creek in the summer if you need a 4 BR. If you are traveling not during school holidays, with rare exceptions, you will see a lot of availability. 

Once you get your membership number from Wyndham. You can register yourself online and your account will hopefully be set up. I had to call several times to get it all working properly. Especially the RCI portal. 

The online system knows how many RT's you have. So if you run out, it will add a $30 charge and pop up a form to put in your CC number. 

To do any special requests you will need to call the resort directly about 2 week before checkin. There is no guarantee and in the smaller resorts it may be difficult. But in the large resorts I have found that the front desk people try very hard to get you into a unit that works for you.


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## vacationhopeful (Jul 10, 2013)

I own at Star Island and many times there are the smaller size 1bdr units available - except they have NO BALCONY and have a kitchenette with 2 double beds in the bedroom. They do have a jetted tub in the bathroom. Those are called the "A" unit while the "B" unit on Wyndham's web site is a 1bdr deluxe. And yes, they do get booked out in February - by Canadians and people who live in very cold climates.

Plus, MANY of those units get rented via websites for hard cash by Wyndham's Extra Vacations.

If looking for a 300,000 pt  contract, many of those are actually 308,000 points as that is the magic "step up" purchase number the sales group has used for years. Many sellers will rightful say the MFs are $5.26 per 1000 points EXCEPT they forgot the $.54 cents per 1000 points CLUB WYNDHAM PLUS fee ==> costing close to $1800 in 2013 MFs.

If you buy a small points contract, Wyndham charges $110+ dollars as a "BASE" for the Club Wyndham Plus fee.

308K in points gives you exactly 4 Reservation Transactions per year, also.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 10, 2013)

Thanks guys y'all have been a big help.

I have told my husband everything y'all have told me and he said we could go ahead and try to get something whenever I find one that seems right for us.

I explained all the points usage and different fees etc and he said compared to what DVC costs that this seems almost like a steal and he is glad I decided against DVC and looked into this instead.

The big selling factor for him is, for the amount of points we can get 2 or 3 weeks of vacation per year when the DVC points would have only gotten us one week. The cost is almost nothing compared to the thousands you have to pay for DVC and the maintenance fees are about the same or cheaper than DVC MF's.

Just from investigating completed sales on Ebay I have noticed the contract's with high MF's sell for less up front and the ones with lower MF's sell for more up front. So I did tell him we will need to keep that in mind when trying to get a contract with low MF's. There won't be any $10 contracts in our future.

Let me ask you guys a question, if you know, if this applies to you...If you buy several smaller contracts like 100k ish points each does WYndham combine them all into one account for you and bill you ONE lump sum MF per month or do they bill you 3 different MF's every month?


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## pacodemountainside (Jul 10, 2013)

As long as all names are the same and Wyndham  advised will be in one account 

There are several theories of the case on  what is best.

Checking in, minimum POA fee, $299 transfer fee, etc.

Check posts here.

You need to sign up for monthly  auto billing to CC so can earn perks and avoid billing fee!

You need to look at costs over say a ten year period not get in a bidding frenzy .

Resort A for free  with  $600 MF and no closing costs is $6,000.

Resort B with $500 MF and $1,000 cash upfront   is also $6,000.

This simple  example  ignores time value of money  and  MF increase but  like when purchasing anything what is my cash outlay not monthly or down payment!


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 10, 2013)

I know that each resort has different maintenance fees but is there some place you can look up and see how much MF's have gone up over the last say, 10 years or so. At what rate they increase?

I see a 266,000 point contract with $132 MF's and a 308,000 point contract with $104 MF's and a 233,000 point contract with $87 MF's. They are all over the place and so different.

I see one ending on Ebay in 30 minutes that is 126,000 points with a $56 MF.


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## ronparise (Jul 10, 2013)

I think the op has it. Once she realized high mf points will cost less than average mf resorts and that thecheapest will be the most expensive I was confident that shes ready to venture into the wild wild west that is ebay 

To the op:  my last piece of advice is to take a balanced approach,, Dont take a high mf property because its cheap, and dont pay too much for a really low mf property. I find the best value in the middle...reasonable mf at a reasonable price

Club Wyndham Access is usually considered about average mf at $5.45 so a 308k contract will cost you in mf about $140 a month. I dont see any CWA contracts of this size on ebay now, but there are several  low mf ones; National Harbor, Las Vegas and Bali Hai. One of these would be a good purchase, at the right price, 

Figure out what you are willing to spend up front and bid accordingly. If someone else gets it dont worry, there will be more listings next week


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 10, 2013)

Does WYndham have ROFR like DVC does? Why are they not buying back these contracts themselves? Or do they?

I would hate to go through this and have them exercise ROFR on me.


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## ronparise (Jul 10, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Does WYndham have ROFR like DVC does? Why are they not buying back these contracts themselves? Or do they?
> 
> I would hate to go through this and have them exercise ROFR on me.



CWA and I think one of the Myrtle Beach resorts have rofr but they never exercise their right

Even if they did, who cares, its just someone that out bid you. If you do this like most of us, you will be out bid most of the time...but you only need to win one...so keep trying

Ive been bidding on big CWA contracts and was out bid, I bet, 10 times sometimes by a lot, before I finally got 1.3mm points at $1250 plus closing and transfer. or under $2000 total


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## pacodemountainside (Jul 10, 2013)

OP:

You really do need to do  a little  searching on your own.

Following  site has  12 year   MF history for Wyndham resorts.

http://forums.atozed.com/viewtopic.php?f=164&t=11197

Wyndham does not have any  ROFR. CWA does, but  as far as anyone knows never exercised.  Wyndham does  not give a rats ass  about its owners and maintaining   any value! Just roll out new scams  per other posts.  As Main Man   observed,  there are 50 million suckers, oops make that naive people  with good credit, waiting for us  to seduce. We are pushing the envelope.

You asked a very pregnant question,  why doesn't Wyndham  support resales. No one here has posted  a  logical, sensible or defensible answer.

My simple answer,  lawyers are cheaper than owner satisfaction.

Auctions simply  represent buyer interest. High,   seller wins , low  reserve  is invoked  or buyer wins.


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## staceyeileen (Jul 10, 2013)

I have had more luck contacting resellers directly with an offer rather than bidding on ebay auctions.  Perhaps I just don't have the patience for bidding.  Some of them have sites where they list their inventory in advance of it going on ebay.


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## SmithOp (Jul 10, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> I have had more luck contacting resellers directly with an offer rather than bidding on ebay auctions.  Perhaps I just don't have the patience for bidding.  Some of them have sites where they list their inventory in advance of it going on ebay.



You don't need patience to bid on eBay, just a good snipe program.  Set it up with the amount you want to pay and it will bid in the last 10 seconds.  The last bid is the one that gets it, why bid early and drive up the price?


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## staceyeileen (Jul 10, 2013)

SmithOp said:


> You don't need patience to bid on eBay, just a good snipe program.  Set it up with the amount you want to pay and it will bid in the last 10 seconds.  The last bid is the one that gets it, why bid early and drive up the price?



I don't bid early.  I am just cheap and almost always get outbid.  So yes, it requires patience and many many failed auctions as Ron said.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 11, 2013)

pacodemountainside said:


> OP:
> 
> You really do need to do  a little  searching on your own.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the link. I opened it up but can't figure out how to use that document. I don't see any MF's listed just names of resorts.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 11, 2013)

Anytime I bid on anything on Ebay no matter what it is I decide what my maximum highest amount I am willing to pay and I bid that. I don't go back and try to outbid anybody. So I am sure it may take me while before I get a winning bid on points.

I don't know anything about a sniping service. Do you have to pay for that service? I might just bid on it myself in the last few seconds of the auction.

I am trying to make sure I don't buy more points than we will actually use because I don't want to have to try and rent our extra points out to ppl or lose them.


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## staceyeileen (Jul 11, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Thanks for the link. I opened it up but can't figure out how to use that document. I don't see any MF's listed just names of resorts.



Scroll Sheet1 all the way to the left.


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## pacodemountainside (Jul 11, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Thanks for the link. I opened it up but can't figure out how to use that document. I don't see any MF's listed just names of resorts.




Unfortunately my computer has a "bug" and I cannot down load anything even bank statements.

However, as I recall there are left and right arrows at bottom that you  have to maneuver. The worksheet will not fit on one page.

If not, hopefully  someone else who is familiar with this  spread sheet will chime in.

Oops, Stacey types faster than me.


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## markb53 (Jul 11, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Anytime I bid on anything on Ebay no matter what it is I decide what my maximum highest amount I am willing to pay and I bid that. I don't go back and try to outbid anybody. So I am sure it may take me while before I get a winning bid on points.
> 
> I don't know anything about a sniping service. Do you have to pay for that service? I might just bid on it myself in the last few seconds of the auction.
> 
> I am trying to make sure I don't buy more points than we will actually use because I don't want to have to try and rent our extra points out to ppl or lose them.



I used ezsniper.com. They offer a free trial. And since I won on my first try, I didn't have to pay anything for the sniping service. I think it is a good idea to not buy more points than you need. You can always buy more if you find you need more every year. I think the sweet spot for a small purchase is 231k because you get 3 RT's and it is above the minimum program fee. I also like the idea of purchasing in multiples of 77. So I think 231k is a good size for a small purchase. It is actually quite easy to rent from other owners, if you don't have enough points for a particular vacation. I have done that several times now and It has worked our so well that I don't see me needing more than what I have for the foreseeable future. 



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## MaryBella7 (Jul 11, 2013)

I have used auctionsniper.com.  You get 3 free snipes.  One nice thing about sniping is that you put in your maximum, but they only bid what is needed to win, so you can get a better price than your maximum.  That is, of course, if someone else hasn't already bid higher, but if you put in your highest, that is out of your control anyway


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## Free2Roam (Jul 11, 2013)

[deleted] A little slow typing... Question already answered!


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 11, 2013)

Thanks. That worked. 

The MF's don't seem to jump very much each year. I didn't see anything startling. Just a few cents or a few dollars here and there.


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## SmithOp (Jul 11, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> I don't bid early.  I am just cheap and almost always get outbid.  So yes, it requires patience and many many failed auctions as Ron said.



Ah, sorry, I got confused thinking you were losing patience on auctions with snipe bids.  I have been lucky with eBay on two purchases, there have been several listings in succession and once the high bidders got theirs I was able to pick one up for the minimum bid price.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 11, 2013)

One of the auctions I was watching doesn't even end until 6 days from now and is already up to $1,126 on the bidding. That one has priced me out. But it was a perfect contract. It would have been worth it if we were in the market to spend a bit more.


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## ronparise (Jul 11, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> One of the auctions I was watching doesn't even end until 6 days from now and is already up to $1,126 on the bidding. That one has priced me out. But it was a perfect contract. It would have been worth it if we were in the market to spend a bit more.



Im guessing thats the National Harbor Contract.  It carries some of the lowest mf in the system. which makes it very popular and relatively expensive.

Thats the kind of contract I was warning you against in an earlier post...Ill repeat it here.  "dont pay too much for the low mf contracts and dont pay anything for the high mf contracts"   A 308000 point contract  with mf  between $5 and $5.50 per 1000 points will fall in your desired range for an annual mf contract ($130-$145/mo)  and I think there will be some of these that you can get for under $1000


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 12, 2013)

ronparise said:


> Im guessing thats the National Harbor Contract.  It carries some of the lowest mf in the system. which makes it very popular and relatively expensive.
> 
> Thats the kind of contract I was warning you against in an earlier post...Ill repeat it here.  "dont pay too much for the low mf contracts and dont pay anything for the high mf contracts"   A 308000 point contract  with mf  between $5 and $5.50 per 1000 points will fall in your desired range for an annual mf contract ($130-$145/mo)  and I think there will be some of these that you can get for under $1000



Yes it was the National Harbor Maryland 308,000 contract. The bid went higher than what we were willing to pay so we had to back away from that one.

I will just keep watching what comes out on Ebay until we find one the right size for the right price.

But some of these auctions have $750 closing costs and $298 transfer fee so you are over a grand before you even bid on the auction. That is why I was mainly watching auctions through SUMDAY because they don't charge closing costs.

They had a 266,000 point contract that disappeared today from the Ebay listings so I assume someone bought it through the agency outside of Ebay. That was another possibility that went by the wayside.

There is a listing on Ebay right now that is for 300,000 points and the company has it in the listing that if you win the auction for this contract that you can pick from their list of available timeshares and pick one for free. ALl you have to do is pay any transfer fee and any MF's still due for this year. It seems too good to be true. But they are also asking for ALL of the 2013 MF's for points that have already been used on this one auction. Well they are asking for 9 months of MF's for only 6 months worth of available points and when I emailed them and asked them to explain why someone would have to pay 9 months MF's on only 6 months available points they kind of talked around it and seemed to give an answer that justified charging more MF's then they should be charging. They also said all the MF's had to be paid in a lump sum at closing of the auction when almost all other auctions said you pick up paying monthly MF's once transfer is complete. This company said some resorts require all MF's be paid when transferring documents or something similar. They blamed it on the resort.

But that company also charges closing costs.

The main reason that National Harbor contract was so tempting was because of the $104 MF's.

I told Dh I wouldn't spend more than $1200 so I am going to have to watch for some bargains to come along. The no closing cost contracts are selling for more. The cheap contracts have closing costs. SO it seems you are going to end up paying it on one end or the other.

I just knew if I could get the lower MF's it would be more appealing to DH in the long term.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 13, 2013)

Looks like the days of getting contracts for pennies are over. Several of the contracts I have been watching on Ebay have been getting extraordinarily high bids.

The 308,000 contract I wanted is already up to $1,8000 in bids and there is still several days left to go before the auction ends.

2 others I was watching have already gone over $1,200.

Is there some other place to buy used timeshares besides Ebay? I looked on Redweek but they have expensive stuff too. Nothing cheap at all.


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## Rent_Share (Jul 13, 2013)

You are in the season where people are thinking of vacations, coming out of presentations, still with the sizzle but the common sense to check the internet for comparative pricing . . . . 

You need to be patient and unless ARP is an absolute necessity expand your search to other properties with low Maintenance Fees

In theory eBay's proxy bid and snipping have the same impact, but with snipping your maximum is not disclosed until seconds before the auction ends.

If you enter a proxy bid of 1200, someone can patiently bid the auction up to 1201.00, then the last minute bidding starts from there.  It is in the sellers best interest to have early high bids, which is why they sometimes take steps to make that happen


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 13, 2013)

Rent_Share said:


> You are in the season where people are thinking of vacations, coming out of presentations, still with the sizzle but the common sense to check the internet for comparative pricing . . . .
> 
> You need to be patient and unless ARP is an absolute necessity expand your search to other properties with low Maintenance Fees
> 
> ...



I see it says you own 15k Wolrdmark points. What is that? Is it similar to Wyndham points? I have seen a few auctions on Ebay selling Worldmark points but they are in the low thousands, like 6,000 points and not like the hundreds of thousands that you buy with Wyndham.

Also there have been new contracts added for sale on Ebay every day but most of them are smaller 100k ish point range. So I may look into buying several smaller ones. But that adds up quick too when you are paying $299 transfer fee for each contract, plus any closing, plus bid amount.

I do think if you are in the market to sell a timeshare now might be a good time to do it since they are selling so well.

I do think one of the auctions I have been looking at is shill bidding on their own auction because the bidder only has bid on 5 things and they were all timeshares. The bidding went from $50 up to $1200 in one day. And there is still several days left in the auction.

I have tried looking some on Craigslist but since you can't search system wide on Cl and have to go city to city it is tedious and there is not much out there for sale. I have found quite a bit of ppl trying to sell vacation weeks but not their contracts.


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## ronparise (Jul 13, 2013)

I think you are making a mistake focusing too much on price, Dont get me wrong $1200 is a fine limit,but $1300 wouldnt be so bad. Id put in a $1500 bid with a sniping service  and be happy if Im had to pay a little more

regarding closing costs , transfer fees and maintenance fees without points...these are all part of your cost basis..If 1200 is your limit;  just factor them in. If you are willing to pay 1200 plus 299 for a sumday offering (1500 total) You might bid 700 for the same contract where you have to pay a $500 closing fee and only a dollar if you have to pay several months of maintenance fee without the use of the points.

Ive gotten some of my best deals from sellers with high fees because everyone else shys away from them


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 13, 2013)

ronparise said:


> I think you are making a mistake focusing too much on price, Dont get me wrong $1200 is a fine limit,but $1300 wouldnt be so bad. Id put in a $1500 bid with a sniping service  and be happy if Im had to pay a little more
> 
> regarding closing costs , transfer fees and maintenance fees without points...these are all part of your cost basis..If 1200 is your limit;  just factor them in. If you are willing to pay 1200 plus 299 for a sumday offering (1500 total) You might bid 700 for the same contract where you have to pay a $500 closing fee and only a dollar if you have to pay several months of maintenance fee without the use of the points.
> 
> Ive gotten some of my best deals from sellers with high fees because everyone else shys away from them



I have increased our budget from $1200 to $1500 and may increase it a bit more before it is over with. I am having to ease DH into this increase in bits and pieces.

At first I told him I think we can get some timeshare points for a couple hundred dollars. Then I told him, well, we can get some for a couple hundred plus a transfer fee. Then I graduated to telling him, well actually, it will be a couple hundred PLUS closing PLUS a transfer fee and possibly some 2013 MF's.

But the contracts I was looking at have gone above our budget. Dh doesn't want to do it if he has to sink several thousand dollars into it.

We have taken 6 vacations in the last 20 months and he had decided that we were going to take a break from vacations (and the huge expense) until November 2014. But once I started telling him about these points he said WELL if we get these points we can go somewhere before November 2014 if you want to. Even possibly this November if we were able to find anything available.

The only place I ever ask him to take me is to Disney World and we usually stay between 6 and 11 days and it costs a TON of money. Usually around $3,000 a week just for the accommodations when we take the whole family or $1,000 a week when it is just DH and I going. So this whole points thing appealed to him in that it would save him money.

I think in the end I may be able to get him up to $1600 or $1700 total but I know he will not go above that. I already tried to get him to go that high and he said no.

I have seen quite a few more contracts come onto Ebay for sale just in the last few days so I don't think there is going to be a shortage of contracts to buy. I think I am just going to have to be patient until I can find what we are looking for at the price Dh will agree to.

But some of these contracts are expecting you to pay for 2013 MF's that you may or may not even be able to use before the contract is closed and transferred. Some of them have even expected MF's be paid on points that are not even available any more. So I am only watching a handful. 

I have stopped focusing on low MF's as well. After that national harbor contract auction went above what I could spend I kind of knew a contract with that many points with that low of MF's are going to go for a high amount probably every time. SO I am refocusing my expectations for what we might end up with.


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## ronparise (Jul 13, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I see it says you own 15k Wolrdmark points. What is that? Is it similar to Wyndham points? I have seen a few auctions on Ebay selling Worldmark points but they are in the low thousands, like 6,000 points and not like the hundreds of thousands that you buy with Wyndham.
> 
> Also there have been new contracts added for sale on Ebay every day but most of them are smaller 100k ish point range. So I may look into buying several smaller ones. But that adds up quick too when you are paying $299 transfer fee for each contract, plus any closing, plus bid amount.
> 
> ...



So now you want to know about Worldmark..

This is another timeshare system managed by Wyndham but it is different. Different resorts and a different fee structure. Where with Club Wyndham Plus you need something like 154000 to 250000 points for a week in a two bedroom unit in prime time. With Worldmark you need between 10000 and 12000 credits. There is however some overlap in the systems, I can think of at least 14 resorts where both systems have units. Worldmark owners use their Credits and Wyndham owners use their points.

As you have figured out 250000 Wyndham points will cost you something like $1000  to buy (unless you want that National Harbor contract or something like it) and about $1500 a year maintenance. The 12000 Worldmark Credits will cost over $4000 to buy and about $800 a year maintenance

If you really want to learn how Worldmark works read this website, a couple of times http://www.wmtsinfo.com/  and come back here or to www.wmowners.com with questions..but based on your last post, chances are a Worldmark purchase will bust the budget


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## tug1873 (Jul 13, 2013)

The national harbor contract was posted the week before and no one bid. You could have gotten for $44 and closing. I had seen it and actually thought I should bid it but then forgot to bid.  It was more points then i wanted and i would have had dispose of another week. That is eBay sometimes there are no buyers. 

Be patient and look around anything below $5.40 is points your should consider.
San Antonio Crecenta is one those types of places that no one notices.  I have a Branson meadows contract that actually is not bad and I picked it up for free.


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## Rent_Share (Jul 13, 2013)

tug1873 said:


> *Be patient* and look around anything below $5.40 is points your should consider.


 
I rarely agree with Ron, but this time for a different reason, Worldmark is for people that live west of the Rocky Mountains, Wyndham is a better deal for someone who lies in the south / southeast


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 13, 2013)

ronparise said:


> So now you want to know about Worldmark..
> 
> This is another timeshare system managed by Wyndham but it is different. Different resorts and a different fee structure. Where with Club Wyndham Plus you need something like 154000 to 250000 points for a week in a two bedroom unit in prime time. With Worldmark you need between 10000 and 12000 credits. There is however some overlap in the systems, I can think of at least 14 resorts where both systems have units. Worldmark owners use their Credits and Wyndham owners use their points.
> 
> ...



I Googled Worldmark after I saw his points listed and saw the map showing where all the resorts are. They all seem to be on the West coast or the North West. 

I do think the Wyndham points will work better for me.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 13, 2013)

tug1873 said:


> The national harbor contract was posted the week before and no one bid. You could have gotten for $44 and closing. I had seen it and actually thought I should bid it but then forgot to bid.  It was more points then i wanted and i would have had dispose of another week. That is eBay sometimes there are no buyers.
> 
> Be patient and look around anything below $5.40 is points your should consider.
> San Antonio Crecenta is one those types of places that no one notices.  I have a Branson meadows contract that actually is not bad and I picked it up for free.



That's shame that I didn't see it last week. I would have snatched it up. It is selling like hot cakes this week. 

I will just be patient and try for something else.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 13, 2013)

There is something shady going on with that National Harbor listing through SUMDAY VACATIONS. They canceled all the bids on it and it is not for sale now. I think they were shill bidding on it and didn't get as much as they thought they wanted for it. I got a notice that my bid had been canceled even though I had already been outbid.

They haven't relisted it yet. But it shows ended with zero bids even though it had about 8 bids on it.

I had called them about it the other day and they said that this contract was one they were not going to negotiate on. They had it listed on their website for $2995. So obviously they are going to shill bid on it and jack it up until they get it up there close to $2995.

I hope they aren't that shady with all their contracts because there are a few they have for sale I was watching to possibly bid on. I may need to rethink what company I buy from.


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## scootr5 (Jul 13, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> There is something shady going on with that National Harbor listing through SUMDAY VACATIONS. They canceled all the bids on it and it is not for sale now. I think they were shill bidding on it and didn't get as much as they thought they wanted for it. I got a notice that my bid had been canceled even though I had already been outbid.
> 
> They haven't relisted it yet. But it shows ended with zero bids even though it had about 8 bids on it.
> 
> ...



It's quite likely someone bought it from them directly, outside of eBay.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 13, 2013)

scootr5 said:


> It's quite likely someone bought it from them directly, outside of eBay.



You may be right. I may be being paranoid about shill bidding because I have experienced it so much in my dealings with fabric sellers on ebay.

They may totally legit and I am just assuming the worst. I am going to try and buy a few contracts off their website and see if they will negotiate the prices down. If not I found a few that I am going to try and bid on next week.


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## ronparise (Jul 13, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> There is something shady going on with that National Harbor listing through SUMDAY VACATIONS. They canceled all the bids on it and it is not for sale now. I think they were shill bidding on it and didn't get as much as they thought they wanted for it. I got a notice that my bid had been canceled even though I had already been outbid.
> 
> They haven't relisted it yet. But it shows ended with zero bids even though it had about 8 bids on it.
> 
> ...



Based on my experience with Sumday and with timeshers and eBay and what I think I know about Wyndham pricing, what you are thinking about Sumday is way off base.

1) $3000 is a very fair price. National Harbor fees are right at $4/1000 points. Amortize the $ 3000 purchase price over 10 years and your total annual expense is only $5/1000. I don't think you can do better than that.

2) auctions are stopped all the time when a buyer makes the seller a good offer. I've done it with Sumday and other sellers too. Nothing wrong with it. 

3) Sundays reputation is the best. And they sell a lot. I doubt that they would risk it for a few dollars


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## staceyeileen (Jul 13, 2013)

Agree with Ron.  It wouldn't surprise me if someone just bought it at the price listed on their website.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 13, 2013)

I wish I had never found it actually and got myself excited about the possibility of such low MF's. 

I had read all these stories about ppl getting their contracts for just a few dollars on Ebay and that has not been what I have been running into.

I actually bid on and won a small 77,000 point contract on Ebay tonight for $218 plus $198 transfer fee. (I am not sure why they didn't charge the $298 transfer fee, I guess the owner is paying part of it)

There are 2 other small contracts on the Sumday website that I am going to contact them about on Monday to see if they will work me out a little bit of a deal for buying them both (all 3 actually)

Then possibly we can do the paperwork on all 3 at the same time.

If I get all 3 contracts it will give me a little over 300,000 points and all 3 MF's combined with be almost $170. (Way more than my Dh wanted to pay) But I told DH I would pay half the MF's and he can pay half the MF's so that it is not a big deal to either one of us.

So if nothing else I am now officially the owner of 77,000 points at Atlantic City New Jersey (Skyline tower) It has 2013 points on it user year January.

I know I have 3 days to change my mind and cancel but I don't foresee doing that.

I told Dh it may work out better this way getting 3 different smaller contracts so that if we ever want to downsize our points we could get rid of some and keep some. But I don't plan on getting rid of them anyway.

I had bid on another contract tonight. It was a Sumday 78,000 point Daytona I think contract but it went above my max bid of $300. I think it ended up going for $317. But I wasn't going to keep bumping my max bid up. I will get some other small contracts next week hopefully.

Let me ask somebody...once these closing go through and the transfer takes place and I have to start paying Wyndham the MF's does Wyndham contact me or do I have to contact them to get it started? And can you pick what day of the month you want your MF's to be paid on or do they choose that for you?


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## staceyeileen (Jul 13, 2013)

It seems like you're in a rush to get these 300k points.  I'd advise to just take your time until the right deal(s) come around and not settle for paying more in maintenance fees than you had originally wanted.  I think it can be a good strategy to have several smaller contracts rather than one large one, and I did it myself - but it took me a full 12 months to acquire my 3 contracts at a total price I was happy with.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 13, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> It seems like you're in a rush to get these 300k points.  I'd advise to just take your time until the right deal(s) come around and not settle for paying more in maintenance fees than you had originally wanted.  I think it can be a good strategy to have several smaller contracts rather than one large one, and I did it myself - but it took me a full 12 months to acquire my 3 contracts at a total price I was happy with.



Well my expectations about how much in MF's I would have to pay was unrealistic based on the big 308,000 point contract I found and bid on for National Harbor Maryland. Come to find out they basically have the lowest MF's around. SO I had no idea what it would really cost in MF's for 300,000 points in separate contracts.

I am not in a rush but I sure don't want to take a year getting my contracts. We decided to buy some so I am ready to buy some and be done with that part of it. We still have to wait for closing and transfers. So there is no rushing anything.

I just read a bunch of things before looking for a contract so my expectations were not prepared for the actual buying situation that I came across on Ebay.

It seems like right now those $10 contracts are nowhere to be found.


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## staceyeileen (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Well my expectations about how much in MF's I would have to pay was unrealistic based on the big 308,000 point contract I found and bid on for National Harbor Maryland. Come to find out they basically have the lowest MF's around. SO I had no idea what it would really cost in MF's for 300,000 points in separate contracts.



It's true, there are not many other National Harbors around as far as MFs go.  But for $170 a month it sounds like you'd be paying well above $6 per thousand points, which is above average.  If you want ARP at some specific resort and that's what it takes to get it, then go for it... but it didn't sound like that was your strategy.


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## markb53 (Jul 14, 2013)

There is a Panama City beach contract with 301k annual points on eBay right now.  It should probably go for $3000+ but you never know. It has all 2013 points available so you might be able to pick up a nice vacation at the end do the year or deposit into RCI and get 2 to 4 vacations for 189.00 each. I think this one is worth about $4000.00. If you take into account the 2013 points that you get for free and the low $4.10 MF. 




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> It's true, there are not many other National Harbors around as far as MFs go.  But for $170 a month it sounds like you'd be paying well above $6 per thousand points, which is above average.  If you want ARP at some specific resort and that's what it takes to get it, then go for it... but it didn't sound like that was your strategy.



No I am not going for ARP. The contract I bought has $47 MF's and the 2 contracts I am looking at buying next week have $62 MF's each. That would make it $171 total per month MF's. Compared to the NH contract that is way more than I wanted to pay but I am finding even if you get 308,000 points all in one contract the MF's are still around $160 a month depending on the resort.


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## staceyeileen (Jul 14, 2013)

What resorts are you looking at?


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

markb53 said:


> There is a Panama City beach contract with 301k annual points on eBay right now.  It should probably go for $3000+ but you never know. It has all 2013 points available so you might be able to pick up a nice vacation at the end do the year or deposit into RCI and get 2 to 4 vacations for 189.00 each. I think this one is worth about $4000.00. If you take into account the 2013 points that you get for free and the low $4.10 MF.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I have that one on my watch list but with MF's that low ($102 month) you are probably right about how much it will go for. I wish I had the budget to buy it myself but DH won't go that high.

It's at $260 right now but it has 4 1/2 days left to go so it will sky rocket by then.

Having no closing costs is probably going to add a lot to it's value too.


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## timeos2 (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> The main reason that National Harbor contract was so tempting was because of the $104 MF's.
> 
> I told Dh I wouldn't spend more than $1200 so I am going to have to watch for some bargains to come along. The no closing cost contracts are selling for more. The cheap contracts have closing costs. SO it seems you are going to end up paying it on one end or the other.
> 
> I just knew if I could get the lower MF's it would be more appealing to DH in the long term.



Paying higher upfront to purchase because of currently low maintenance fees is usually a big mistake. History says that nearly every resort starts out with low fees - thus looks attractive - and that can last up to a decade. But then reality hits and the money actually needed to maintain and improve the resort comes due and the owners get hit with significant special assessments or drastically higher fees or both. Meanwhile resale price falls as that low fee advantage disappears & it becomes like any other.  

It is best not to get suckered into that trap. Look for more established resorts that have already gone through at least one or two renovation cycles (helps to establish what the true long term fees will be) OR pay only what the average higher fee resorts bring per point on resale not a premium because a specific resort looks lower at this time. 

One of the beauties of the Wyndham system is that points are points and if you are careful you can pay a low cost per point and get a middle to low annual fee all in the same contract. Those are usually not the artificially pegged newer resorts that are still in sales & thus under pressure to hold fees lower than they really need to be. Think long term.


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## timeos2 (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Looks like the days of getting contracts for pennies are over. Several of the contracts I have been watching on Ebay have been getting extraordinarily high bids.
> 
> The 308,000 contract I wanted is already up to $1,8000 in bids and there is still several days left to go before the auction ends.
> 
> ...



There are still plenty of good to outstanding deals out there. Don't get focused onto one or two specific resorts and you'll find them. Points are points (except for ARP which isn't a factor most of the time and in any case can only apply to one resort so it isn't flexible).  

Get into the Wyndham owners group & you'll see nearly daily two or three new offers of free or nearly free points. It will increase toward the end of the year and is at a low this time of years as everyone is enjoying the best use times & may be looking to buy rather than sell. Come fall that reverses quickly.


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## littlestar (Jul 14, 2013)

A few months ago I won a CWA contract on ebay.  Granted it was only 64,000 points, but I paid a grand total of $202 dollars for it complete price with closing.  The auction closed during the middle of the week in the middle of the day.  I think that may have made a difference on how high it went and of course, it was a smaller contract. 

There was a Wyndham Grand Desert 77,000 contract offered by a Tugger on the Tug bargain board a few days ago.  I don't know if that sold yet or not?


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

littlestar said:


> A few months ago I won a CWA contract on ebay.  Granted it was only 64,000 points, but I paid a grand total of $202 dollars for it complete price with closing.  The auction closed during the middle of the week in the middle of the day.  I think that may have made a difference on how high it went and of course, it was a smaller contract.
> 
> There was a Wyndham Grand Desert 77,000 contract offered by a Tugger on the Tug bargain board a few days ago.  I don't know if that sold yet or not?



That's a really good deal for $202 total.

The 77k points I just bought was $218 but that does not include a $198 transfer fee. There were no closing costs on this one. But mine is also not CWA. Mine is Atlantic City, New Jersey resort points.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

timeos2 said:


> There are still plenty of good to outstanding deals out there. Don't get focused onto one or two specific resorts and you'll find them. Points are points (except for ARP which isn't a factor most of the time and in any case can only apply to one resort so it isn't flexible).
> 
> Get into the Wyndham owners group & you'll see nearly daily two or three new offers of free or nearly free points. It will increase toward the end of the year and is at a low this time of years as everyone is enjoying the best use times & may be looking to buy rather than sell. Come fall that reverses quickly.



I haven't been focused on any specific resorts. I was only obsessed over National Harbor because that was the big contract that got away.

I have actually only been trying to get a few contracts for a low amount, which right now, may not be totally possible.

Well, if you consider $416 total cost for a 77k point contract low, then I actually did get a low amount on my first contract purchase.

But the MF's on this one little contract are $47 a month. I actually thought it said $37 a month until after the auction was over then realized it was another contract that I got outbid on that had the $37 MF's. 

My problem is getting the amount of points I want for the amount of budget my DH has given me is turning out to be a little tricky.

I may have to lower my point expectation and decide that I may just end up with less points than I want right now due to DH limiting me on how much I can spend.


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## ronparise (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> No I am not going for ARP. The contract I bought has $47 MF's and the 2 contracts I am looking at buying next week have $62 MF's each. That would make it $171 total per month MF's. Compared to the NH contract that is way more than I wanted to pay but I am finding even if you get 308,000 points all in one contract the MF's are still around $160 a month depending on the resort.



It actually may be a little lower. 

Regarding the program fee, If the current owners of the small contracts are each paying the minimum, your combined account will be over the minimum threshold and you come in cheaper than you expect


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

littlestar said:


> A few months ago I won a CWA contract on ebay.  Granted it was only 64,000 points, but I paid a grand total of $202 dollars for it complete price with closing.  The auction closed during the middle of the week in the middle of the day.  I think that may have made a difference on how high it went and of course, it was a smaller contract.
> 
> There was a Wyndham Grand Desert 77,000 contract offered by a Tugger on the Tug bargain board a few days ago.  I don't know if that sold yet or not?



I contacted 2 different ppl who had ads for points for sale on the timeshare section of TUG and never heard back from either of them.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

*What does ODD year usage mean?*

Does that mean you get allocated the amount of points once every odd year and you can use them anytime you want to or does that mean you can only use your points during the odd years?


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## CruiseGuy (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Does that mean you get allocated the amount of points once every odd year and you can use them anytime you want to or does that mean you can only use your points during the odd years?



It means that those points are allocated to you every other year, in an odd year.  They expire in one year, so you must either use them in the odd year, or place them in the credit pool prior to the beginning of the use year so that they will be available for up to 3 years.

So if you have 154,000 biennial odd contract, you get to use those points in 2013, 2015, 2017, etc.  You actually only own half the 154,000 points.  You own 77,000 points, and you only pay maintenance fees on the 77,000 points. But since you only get to use them every other year you have 154,000 points available for use in the odd years.


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## chriskre (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Does that mean you get allocated the amount of points once every odd year and you can use them anytime you want to or does that mean you can only use your points during the odd years?



With Wyndham you can borrow ahead to turn this into an every year use within a certain timeframe without incurring additional fees.  
I am not certain of the exact timeframe but I have managed to turn my EOY into an every year use.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

Thanks for the info and quick replies.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

A listing I was looking at on Ebay said it was an odd year usage and the listing company stated that you will be allocated 52,500 points each year. Which confused me. It's a 105,000 point contract.

But from what it sounds like, that is wrong. You are actually allocated 105,000 every other year. Not 52,500 per year.

I am surprised the broker got that part wrong.


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## vacationhopeful (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> A listing I was looking at on Ebay said it was an odd year usage and the listing company stated that you will be allocated 52,500 points each year. Which confused me. It's a 105,000 point contract.
> 
> But from what it sounds like, that is wrong. You are actually allocated 105,000 every other year. Not 52,500 per year.
> 
> I am surprised the broker got that part wrong.



The yearly fees are based on 52.5K of points -- including the Club Wyndham Plus management fees --- except if this is your FIRST contract under you member number, you will be paying over $100 per year for your CWP part plus your MFs to the HOA.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> The yearly fees are based on 52.5K of points -- including the Club Wyndham Plus management fees --- except if this is your FIRST contract under you member number, you will be paying over $100 per year for your CWP part plus your MFs to the HOA.



What is the $100 a year for CWP? That is something you pay IN ADDITION to your monthly MF's? And isn't there also an $8 a month fee for paying monthly?


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## ronparise (Jul 14, 2013)

The $8 billing fee is absurdly high and you will pay an additional $3.50 if you pay it online.  You can however avoid these charges by doing an auto pay from your bank account. 

I told you about the program fee in a previous post. It is billed as part of your mf. Small accounts are subject to a minimum of, I think, $108. You plan a 300000 point account. Your program fee will be $0.54 per 1000 points. Relax! Or at least learn what's happening before you panic


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

ronparise said:


> The $8 billing fee is absurdly high and you will pay an additional $3.50 if you pay it online.  You can however avoid these charges by doing an auto pay from your bank account.
> 
> I told you about the program fee in a previous post. It is billed as part of your mf. Small accounts are subject to a minimum of, I think, $108. You plan a 300000 point account. Your program fee will be $0.54 per 1000 points. Relax! Or at least learn what's happening before you panic



Ok we will make sure we set it up to pay from our bank account to avoid the fee. Do you know if you can pick your payment date for your MF's once your account is set up or do they charge you beginning from the day the transfer is complete. (I appreciate all your help in the last week)


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Ok we will make sure we set it up to pay from our bank account to avoid the fee. Do you know if you can pick your payment date for your MF's once your account is set up or do they charge you beginning from the day the transfer is complete. (I appreciate all your help in the last week)



I told my husband I would try set it up (MF) to come out of my own bank account if I can set it up to come out at the first of the month. But if they just start charging you right away no matter what the date is we will have to set it up to come out of his bank account.

I am curious if anybody knows how that works. How you set your MF due date or if Wyndham sets the due date?


----------



## pacodemountainside (Jul 14, 2013)

This needs to be merged with prior 66+ post.  [DONE]


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## DeniseM (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggy911 - A gentle request:  please post all your questions and comments about this purchase in this thread, instead of starting a new thread.  Thank you!


----------



## JeffBrown (Jul 14, 2013)

*NO Shill Bidding*



mspeggysue911 said:


> There is something shady going on with that National Harbor listing through SUMDAY VACATIONS. They canceled all the bids on it and it is not for sale now. I think they were shill bidding on it and didn't get as much as they thought they wanted for it. I got a notice that my bid had been canceled even though I had already been outbid.
> 
> They haven't relisted it yet. But it shows ended with zero bids even though it had about 8 bids on it.
> 
> ...



Please review ANY Sumday Vacations ebay listing, they all contain the terminology which allows us to cancel the auction should it sell through another avenue.  I'm sorry if your first thought is that we are Shill Bidding our listings.  That is a very serious accusation that I don't take very lightly.  So, let me state on the record that Sumday Vacations does not practice shill bidding, never have and never will.  I have no way of proving that to you in this response but you will find your answer by simply looking at what has transpired.

1. The item is no longer for sale on ebay
2. The item is no longer for sale on our website
3. You will not see this item get relisted (ever)
4.  You can check public records and see that the item has transferred (in about 10 days)
5.  Also, the item had 3-4 days left, we certainly wouldn't end it this early if we wanted it to get bid up.

The reason that the auction was ended is simple, it sold off our website.  Please don't consider us a fraudulent company because we sell timeshares.  We are in the business to do just that and we consider ourselves "adequate" in acheiving that goal.

I think the biggest thing that's going on right now that is surprising everyone is that the market has turned (albeit slightly).  Not sure if that's temporary or long term but I fully expect the quality units that come up for sale to bring more than they were for the last several years, this was one of those cases and a new owner out there agreed that our website price was fair.

I hope this helps to calm your concerns and we look forward to assisting you with your purchases, we know you'll be happy with the end result.

Jeff Brown 
Sumday Vacations


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

JeffBrown said:


> Please review ANY Sumday Vacations ebay listing, they all contain the terminology which allows us to cancel the auction should it sell through another avenue.  I'm sorry if your first thought is that we are Shill Bidding our listings.  That is a very serious accusation that I don't take very lightly.  So, let me state on the record that Sumday Vacations does not practice shill bidding, never have and never will.  I have no way of proving that to you in this response but you will find your answer by simply looking at what has transpired.
> 
> 1. The item is no longer for sale on ebay
> 2. The item is no longer for sale on our website
> ...



I apologize for jumping to the wrong conclusions. Some folks here came along real quick to correct me and let me know my assumptions were wrong.

I obviously changed my opinion of your company, I bought a contract from you last night.

I have just had continuous and over abundant experience with shill bidders on Ebay in dealings with my business. Large fabric resellers.

But I know my initial judgement and accusation was not accurate.


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

DeniseM said:


> mspeggy911 - A gentle request:  please post all your questions and comments about this purchase in this thread, instead of starting a new thread.  Thank you!



Ok, will do. I just thought I may need to start a new one since it was about a new subject. I will stick to this one.


----------



## DeniseM (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Ok, will do. I just thought I may need to start a new one since it was about a new subject. I will stick to this one.



So that people can see what's already been asked and answered, it's best to keep related questions in the same thread - thanks.


----------



## ronparise (Jul 14, 2013)

ronparise said:


> Based on my experience with Sumday and with timeshers and eBay and what I think I know about Wyndham pricing, what you are thinking about Sumday is way off base.
> 
> 1) $3000 is a very fair price. National Harbor fees are right at $4/1000 points. Amortize the $ 3000 purchase price over 10 years and your total annual expense is only $5/1000. I don't think you can do better than that.
> 
> ...





mspeggysue911 said:


> I told my husband I would try set it up (MF) to come out of my own bank account if I can set it up to come out at the first of the month. But if they just start charging you right away no matter what the date is we will have to set it up to come out of his bank account.
> 
> I am curious if anybody knows how that works. How you set your MF due date or if Wyndham sets the due date?


You can choose the date


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

ronparise said:


> You can choose the date



Ok Thank you for answering that. That will work out better for me so that I can actually have the MF's coming out of my bank and he won't even notice the money paying the fees every month. 

Then it truly will feel more like a free vacation when we use our points. (for him anyway)

This whole timeshare thing was my idea and I don't want him getting a constant reminder every month of what I cost him. lol


----------



## JeffBrown (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I apologize for jumping to the wrong conclusions. Some folks here came along real quick to correct me and let me know my assumptions were wrong.
> 
> I obviously changed my opinion of your company, I bought a contract from you last night.
> 
> ...



Thank you for your purchase.  You don't need to apologize but I do appreciate it, I only responded because I do not want others to think that way and many know that I am a TUG member and watch the boards.


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

Do any of you read up or post on the Wyndham Owners message board? I just found it but it seems like most of the posts over there are old. This TUG must be the main big timeshare message boards.

I was just Googling and trying to look up all the different websites and that message board came up. But nothing is recent.


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## ronparise (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Do any of you read up or post on the Wyndham Owners message board? I just found it but it seems like most of the posts over there are old. This TUG must be the main big timeshare message boards.
> 
> I was just Googling and trying to look up all the different websites and that message board came up. But nothing is recent.



You would do well to get familiar with the info there. For example, the mf spread sheet and the spreadsheet that tracks mf increases and special assessments


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## ronparise (Jul 14, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Ok Thank you for answering that. That will work out better for me so that I can actually have the MF's coming out of my bank and he won't even notice the money paying the fees every month.
> 
> Then it truly will feel more like a free vacation when we use our points. (for him anyway)
> 
> This whole timeshare thing was my idea and I don't want him getting a constant reminder every month of what I cost him. lol



My wife has no idea of what's behind her vacations either, except she knows she enjoys them. And if she saw what I pay each month, she would have a stroke


----------



## staceyeileen (Jul 14, 2013)

Yeah, it has a lot of reference material posted but I don't see much in the way of actual discussion.  TUG seems much more active.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 14, 2013)

ronparise said:


> You would do well to get familiar with the info there. For example, the mf spread sheet and the spreadsheet that tracks mf increases and special assessments



I did see a spreadsheet that showed the MF increases and it doesn't seem like they go up very drastically. Or at least not much in the last 10 years. Not to say that couldn't change.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

a 399,000 point contract that was on Ebay I had bid max bid of $1200 on sold last night for $2800!! OH MY GAWD!

It may take me longer than I had expected to be able to find several bargain contracts!

Oh well. I got the one 77k point contract on the cheap and that is enough for one week vacation a year in Orlando. So I can wait on some other contracts to come along for the extra vacations.

I just was ready to get them and be done with it.

I will have to do as a PP suggested and watch for auctions ending in the weekday during the middle of the day while others are at work. Unless they use a sniping service. That may be one way to get a better bargain.

Those 300kish point contracts are the hot ticket right now.


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

*Let me ask a new question for anybody who comes back in here*

For those of you who stay/have stayed numerous times in the Orlando area on Wyndham points, have you stayed at both Bonnet Creek AND Star Island?

Which one did you like better and why?

Week 45 at Bonnet Creek is value season and 13,000 points a night in a 1 bdrm. Star Island week 45 is HIGH season and is 12,000 points a night.

So I can stay at either for about the same amount of points and they both look nice and they both seem HUGE.

One is closer to Disney and the other is closer to Universal. We go to both parks so location doesn't matter at this point.

Any opinions on those 2 resorts?


----------



## littlestar (Jul 15, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> For those of you who stay/have stayed numerous times in the Orlando area on Wyndham points, have you stayed at both Bonnet Creek AND Star Island?
> 
> Which one did you like better and why?
> 
> ...



I have relatives that just came back from Orlando a few weeks ago and they wouldn't stay at Star Island.  When they checked in, the unit was terrible.  Holes in carpets, furniture was torn up (gum on furniture, too), and rust stains/water marks running down the walls.  Star Island is not all Wyndham managed.  There's different buildings so maybe that makes a difference, as our family's unit was booked through Interval International and not RCI.  We complained to Interval and they were looking into what happened and the condition of the unit.  I'd stick with Bonnet Creek after the pictures I saw of Star Island.  This was the back building close to the trailer park.


----------



## ronparise (Jul 15, 2013)

littlestar said:


> I have relatives that just came back from Orlando a few weeks ago and they wouldn't stay at Star Island.  When they checked in, the unit was terrible.  Holes in carpets, furniture was torn up (gum on furniture, too), and rust stains/water marks running down the walls.  Star Island is not all Wyndham managed.  There's different buildings so maybe that makes a difference, as our family's unit was booked through Interval International and not RCI.  We complained to Interval and they were looking into what happened and the condition of the unit.  I'd stick with Bonnet Creek after the pictures I saw of Star Island.  This was the back building close to the trailer park.



Bonnet creek is within the Disney gates and it is closer to Universal than star island.

I like star island but my first choice would be bonnet creek. I prefer the high rise to the garden apartment feel of star island


----------



## ronparise (Jul 15, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> a 399,000 point contract that was on Ebay I had bid max bid of $1200 on sold last night for $2800!! OH MY GAWD!
> 
> It may take me longer than I had expected to be able to find several bargain contracts!
> 
> ...



Don't give up. I was looking for a million point Club Wyndham Access contract recently. I kept getting out bid by a lot. One went for over $6000. I got mine finally for $1250 plus closing and transfer. (Under $2000) and it a July contract with all points available to me and I don't pick up mf until closing ((can you say free points))


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

I just actually won an auction on Ebay for 77k points Royal Vacations Suites Las Vegas Wyndham Points and I got it for $138. The thing that concerns me is they are new Ebay sellers and all their feedback is less than 6 weeks old. The Ebay name is timesahretravel. I don't even see Royal Vacation Suites in the Wyndham directory as a resort you can stay in. Could this be something shady or am I just being paranoid? Everybody has left them feedback within days of winning the auction NOT after getting everything closed and transferred.


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## scootr5 (Jul 15, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I just actually won an auction on Ebay for 77k points Royal Vacations Suites Las Vegas Wyndham Points and I got it for $138. The thing that concerns me is they are new Ebay sellers and all their feedback is less than 6 weeks old. The Ebay name is timesahretravel. I don't even see Royal Vacation Suites in the Wyndham directory as a resort you can stay in. Could this be something shady or am I just being paranoid? Everybody has left them feedback within days of winning the auction NOT after getting everything closed and transferred.



OK, first thing I would suggest is to slow down. Know what you are bidding on. Don't send any money to them until you have the estoppel.  

I've never heard of Royal Vacation Suites, and don't see them in the list of Wyndham resorts. The II code they listed is for the Royal Resort, which is *not* a Wyndham resort.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

scootr5 said:


> OK, first thing I would suggest is to slow down. Know what you are bidding on. Don't send any money to them until you have the estoppel.
> 
> I've never heard of Royal Vacation Suites, and don't see them in the list of Wyndham resorts.



I thought I was bidding on 77k Wyndham points which is what the auction says it is for, but once I looked in the directory and I didn't see the name of that resort it has me concerned. This is the listing I just won http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=141009067969

I sent them an email and asked for the estopple letter on this contract. Is the estopple letter proof that this contract is legit?

If you Google Royal vacation suites it brings up a website that says Wyndham extra vacations.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

I got a response from the seller. This is what they said 

"I do have the estoppel for this property. Royal Vacation Suites is a Wyndham Extra Holiday resort. These are true Wyndham points and I can email you the estoppel if you could provide me with your email address.

- timesharetravel"

He said he will email me the estopple letter but I don't know what I am suppose to see on the letter. What is it about the letter that proves this contract is legit?

Thanks for your help by the way.

The email I got from them requesting my name and address info had a lady's email address on it from GroupWiseInc. I Googled Group Wise Inc and it seems to be a company that claims to help relive ppl of their timeshares. Financial relief from your timeshare. There are no timeshare listings on there that you can look at to buy.

The website says they have been in business for 15 years but the website doesn't appear to be that old.

They only have Ebay feedback left for them since June and they have left feedback for others since May. I understand if you are new you have to start somewhere. But something about this is telling me to be very cautious/paranoid.

It's not much money. It's only $138 but I still don't want to just give money away.


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## littlestar (Jul 15, 2013)

ronparise said:


> Bonnet creek is within the Disney gates and it is closer to Universal than star island.
> 
> I like star island but my first choice would be bonnet creek. I prefer the high rise to the garden apartment feel of star island



Family must have been given a poor unit at star island, then, because I was totally amazed by the pictures I saw.  It was really nasty looking, especially the rusty looking water marks running down the walls and around windows. I wondered if this was the Wyndham section or a building that Wyndham didn't manage.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

They sent me a photo copy of a second page of a fax sent back in Jan 2013. It says the contract number, the amount of points, the resort and what the MF's are.

It doesn't say estopple on the page but I am not sure if it is suppose to.

It does say there is 77k Wyndham points but it doesn't specify that they can be used at any resort. I am not sure if it is suppose to say that either.

I don't know how to post a link to the page they sent me on here.


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## BellaWyn (Jul 15, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I got a response from the seller. This is what they said
> 
> "I do have the estoppel for this property. Royal Vacation Suites is a Wyndham Extra Holiday resort. These are true Wyndham points and I can email you the estoppel if you could provide me with your email address.
> - timesharetravel"


Royal Vacation Suites is part of the Trading Places International Inventory - still part of the Wyndham Worldwide umbrella but don't think [please chime in here TPI/Wyn people] the points can be used to get inventory in the Wyndham Vacation Resorts products.  It's a separate system similar to the Worldmark and Shell products.



mspeggysue911 said:


> He said he will email me the estopple letter but I don't know what I am suppose to see on the letter. What is it about the letter that proves this contract is legit?


The estopple letter tells you the status of the existing contract [all MF's current, in forclosure, etc] and is usually issued by the resort.  If Wyndham managed, it could come from corporate also.  My FW estopples came from the Property HOA's that manage the R.E.

If you're not sure what you're looking at -- this is why you found TUG right?  So far, plenty of people have been answering accurately all your questions.  *scootr5 **already told you NOT to pay the seller until you have an actual estopple*.  

To post a link, use the toolbar at the top of your "Reply" window.  It looks like a blue WORLD with glasses.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

Let me try and post the estopple they sent me. 

I think I attached something. It appears to have attached. Not sure if I did it right.

Is there a way for me to find out if these points can be used in the regular Wyndham system? Is there someone I can call?


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## ronparise (Jul 15, 2013)

I dont get it

The title of this thread, is:  * Can someone direct me in the right direction? *

You have been pointed in the right direction ...(5 pages worth) and yet you insist on going in your own direction.

The questions you are asking about your purchase should have been asked and answered before you bid

$600 maintenance fees for 77000 points is high, you were advised to look for less. 

You were advised to look for an experienced seller..You went for a new guy

You were advised that the very low mf contracts may be priced too high, and the the very high mf contracts may not even be worth a dollar. Any yet you paid $137 for a very high mf contract



Ive attached a Wyndham estopple for a purchase Im making. If yours looks like this you should be ok


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## ronparise (Jul 15, 2013)

I see you posted your estopple before I got mine up..Yes it looks good and Im sure that these are wyndham points good for use in the Club Wyndham Plus system

enjoy


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

ronparise said:


> I dont get it
> 
> The title of this thread, is:  * Can someone direct me in the right direction? *
> 
> ...



That is what the letter looks like that they sent me.

50 something dollars a month didn't seem high to me in MF's. 

The first 77k point contract I bought has $47 MF's

I don't recall anybody in this thread warning me to make sure the person I buy from has a lot of feedback or has been in business for a long time.

But I do appreciate everybody's help who has answered my questions in this thread.

The original title of this thread was asking someone to point me in the right direction of learning about the exchange rate between Wyndham points and RCI points/stays.


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## BellaWyn (Jul 15, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I don't recall anybody in this thread warning me to make sure the person I buy from has a lot of feedback or has been in business for a long time.


Probably because that's understood when dealing with *ANY* eBay purchase.  Part of due diligence and *"caveat emptor." * Posters here are all volunteers.  We help where we can but eventually people have to walk their path.

The difference between Ron's estopple vs yours [that I would get clarified before sending $$] is *related to the LOAN section.*  Ron's indicates there is no outstanding mortgage.  Yours is unclear - "contact the home resort"  WTH?


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

BellaWyn said:


> Probably because that's understood when dealing with *ANY* eBay purchase.  Part of due diligence and *"caveat emptor." * Posters here are all volunteers.  We help where we can but eventually people have to walk their path.
> 
> The difference between Ron's estopple vs yours [that I would get clarified before sending $$] is *related to the LOAN section.*  Ron's indicates there is no outstanding mortgage.  Yours is unclear - "contact the home resort"  WTH?



I asked them where they have been selling the timeshares since they were so new on Ebay and she said Redweek and something like MRN. They have another Ebay account that also has timeshares for sale that has feedback from a year ago. I don't know why they are selling under 2 different Ebay accounts.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

Well this is what I ended up with. What is over there on the left under my name.

I now have 3 contracts

77k points Las Vegas- paid $138 no closing no transfer fee
77k points Atlantic City Paid $218 plus $198 transfer fee no closing $416 total
154,000 Branson, MO Paid $255 no closing no transfer fee $255 total

So I did get the 300kish points I was looking for and stayed under our $1200 budget.

Total cost a little over $700.

All the MF's added up are $170 a month. Dh and I are going to split the MF's.

I am happy with how many points we have. Now I just have to sign a bunch of papers and WAIT. It will be 3 different companies doing the closings and transfers. No telling how long it will take.


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## MaryBella7 (Jul 15, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> 50 something dollars a month didn't seem high to me in MF's.
> 
> The first 77k point contract I bought has $47 MF's.



I know that Ron, in an earlier post let you know that a good average range for maintenance fees is $5-$5.50 per 1000 points.  If you take the higher of the 2, $5.50 and times that by 77 (for the 77 thousand), you get $423.50 for the year for maintenance fees. This equals just over $35 a month.

For your first contract, you are paying $564 ($7.36 per thousand points) for the year, for the second one $600 ($7.79 per thousand).  That is quite a bit higher than $5.50 per thousand points, and those are the contracts that you should not really be paying for at all - people give them away.  You will be paying over $300 more in maintenance fees yearly than the average, decently priced maintenance fee owner. I pay $757 yearly (which includes program fee, etc) for the same number of points that you will be paying $1164.  

Be patient!  You are trying to rush your purchasing.  If you need to, ask here if the maintenance fees on a property you are interested in are high or low.  Better yet, ask for a formula to help you calculate it yourself :whoopie: (Monthly fee x 12 = yearly fee.  Yearly fee / number of points (without the 3 last zeros) = dollars per thousand points.)    

Everyone here is typically pretty happy to help.  Good luck!  I'd back out of that second one, FOR SURE!


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## ronparise (Jul 15, 2013)

In absolute terms $50 a month is not high but it's $600 a year or nearly $8/1000 points. Sorry but that's high and reason enough to turn tie down in my opinion. Of course the price is right. So there's a decision to be made


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## ronparise (Jul 15, 2013)

OK you are all in. I can think of only one person on tug that moved as quick with as little forethought. And that's me

Welcome to our little club

By the way I think your fees may end up to be less than you think based on reasons I outlined in another post


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## staceyeileen (Jul 15, 2013)

For real, you picked up 3 contracts in two days?


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## scootr5 (Jul 15, 2013)

lhumes7 said:


> I know that Ron, in an earlier post let you know that a good average range for maintenance fees is $5-$5.50 per 1000 points.  If you take the higher of the 2, $5.50 and times that by 77 (for the 77 thousand), you get $423.50 for the year for maintenance fees. This equals just over $35 a month.
> 
> For your first contract, you are paying $564 ($7.36 per thousand points) for the year, for the second one $600 ($7.79 per thousand).  That is quite a bit higher than $5.50 per thousand points, and those are the contracts that you should not really be paying for at all - people give them away.  You will be paying over $300 more in maintenance fees yearly than the average, decently priced maintenance fee owner. I pay $757 yearly (which includes program fee, etc) for the same number of points that you will be paying $1164.
> 
> ...



Agreed. I got a little impatient at first and jumped on a Cypress Palms contract.

After that, I spent a lot of time stalking Smoky Mountains and Grand Desert, and ended up with a total of 309,000 points for a total purchase price of $1150, at an average of $5.18 per thousand, with points included in the first year.


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## staceyeileen (Jul 15, 2013)

Nice deal on Vegas though


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> For real, you picked up 3 contracts in two days?



Yes, one yesterday and two today.

Once we decided to buy I jumped right in. Maybe hastily but not knowing that much about the whole situation and maybe not understand the whole MF issue I bought 3 I am happy with the price of. And since Dh and I are splitting the MF's.

I appreciate the welcome to the club! I am excited to get these contracts in my name and ready to use!

One company has already sent me the electronic documents to sign. One said they will send it tomorrow.

I paid 2 of the 3 invoices. The other one said I will pay it after I sign the papers.

Now all I have to do is sit and try to be patient and wait for the process to happen, closing and transfer.

I am already wondering where all we will be going with our new points. I know our first trip will probably be to Orlando but not sure of when. It depends on how soon these points get put in an account for me and what availability there will be for Orlando for our dates.

2 of the contracts have 2013 points on them. One of the 77k and the 154k. The other 77k won't have points on it until January. So I will have 231,000 points to use in the last few months of the year or bank them with RCI.

I do know I will be pooling all my 2014 points in November/December, whenever you are suppose to do it before the new year. I did learn that from this message board.


LET ME ASK for anybody who has ever bought several contracts together like this...once these are all closed and they get transferred into my name, how will Wyndham know to put all 3 contracts into the same account for me? Or will they be in 3 different accounts?

And I just realized I have 308,000 points. For some reason I was thinking it all added up to 298,000. LOL. My bad. I may need to keep a calculator handy. And the cost was a little over 800 not 700. lol


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## staceyeileen (Jul 15, 2013)

You'll probably be set up with multiple accounts, but it's not a big deal to have them combine them.  Oddly enough, that is one thing at Wyndham that didn't take forever and day to get done.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> You'll probably be set up with multiple accounts, but it's not a big deal to have them combine them.  Oddly enough, that is one thing at Wyndham that didn't take forever and day to get done.



Ok good. I told my husband I thought someone said they can put all your contracts onto the same account where you can see all your points at one time.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

I told Dh that even with us paying almost $2,000 a year in MF's that we will still save thousands. Just one ONE family trip in 2011 to Disney JUST OUR ROOM was $2800 for ONE TRIP. And we have been 5 times in the last 18 months.

So it will always be a money saver for us as long as we go on several trips a year. Which I do plan on doing.

He is happy that I came in $400 under the budget he gave me to spend and I am happy that I was able to get the exact amount of points I wanted.

We are both happy to be splitting the MF's so that it doesn't seem like very much to either one of us. As long as there is no big painful bill every month we will always get pleasure from having these points. =) I hope anyway.

And I do know if we ever want to get rid of them one day just basically give them away and offer to pay the closing fees and transfer fees and someone will take them off your hands. Hopefully again. =)


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## ronparise (Jul 15, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> For real, you picked up 3 contracts in two days?



For real without reading a word on TUG

I attenended a Wyndham presentation at Bonnet Creek, signed, rescinded,and  found ebay. The first night on ebay I bid a dollar on 385000 points in three converted fixed week deeds (I didnt know what that meant) and won...Of course I won. The mf was $6/1000 points (didnt know what that meant either)

That was in Nov of 2011


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## ronparise (Jul 15, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> Nice deal on Vegas though



understand that thats not Grand Desert


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## ronparise (Jul 15, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I told Dh that even with us paying almost $2,000 a year in MF's that we will still save thousands. Just one ONE family trip in 2011 to Disney JUST OUR ROOM was $2800 for ONE TRIP. And we have been 5 times in the last 18 months.
> 
> So it will always be a money saver for us as long as we go on several trips a year. Which I do plan on doing.
> 
> ...



So we see the op has exactly the same exit strategy I do.  

Its called the "greater fool theory"


----------



## ronparise (Jul 15, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I told Dh that even with us paying almost $2,000 a year in MF's that we will still save thousands. Just one ONE family trip in 2011 to Disney JUST OUR ROOM was $2800 for ONE TRIP. And we have been 5 times in the last 18 months.
> 
> So it will always be a money saver for us as long as we go on several trips a year. Which I do plan on doing.
> 
> ...



If you are happy Im happy


----------



## MaryBella7 (Jul 15, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> He is happy that I came in $400 under the budget he gave me to spend and I am happy that I was able to get the exact amount of points I wanted.




That's pretty much all that matters!


----------



## paxsarah (Jul 15, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I told Dh that even with us paying almost $2,000 a year in MF's that we will still save thousands. Just one ONE family trip in 2011 to Disney JUST OUR ROOM was $2800 for ONE TRIP. And we have been 5 times in the last 18 months.



This is very true, and it's all in the perspective. Are you paying the absolute rock-bottom amount of Wyndham MFs? No. But as a Disney vacationer (as am I), you will be able to stay in more spacious and livable accommodations for much cheaper than any of Disney's on-site offerings. We've stayed at Bonnet Creek, as well as exchanging in RCI to stay in a DVC property (don't even get me started on the math of how many thousands of dollars that saved over rack rates, not that we would have paid them), and using RCI Last Call to pay cash for great deals on other nearby resorts. You are still saving money over your previous vacation expenditures, so well done. Now, pay attention to all of these really knowledgeable people as you start using your points - they really know what they're talking about and you can learn and save a lot more using their advice.


----------



## staceyeileen (Jul 15, 2013)

ronparise said:


> understand that thats not Grand Desert




I must have missed that in my haste trying to keep up with the purchases. What other resort is in Vegas?


----------



## scootr5 (Jul 15, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> I must have missed that in my haste trying to keep up with the purchases. What other resort is in Vegas?



Well, apparently Wyndham Royal Vacation Suites.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> I must have missed that in my haste trying to keep up with the purchases. What other resort is in Vegas?



Yeah it is some rinky dink little resort called Royal vacation suites which is a Wyndham "Extra" vacation resort. You can book rooms there for $68 a night according to the website. But the points are points. I will never stay at that actual resort. I will just use the points to stay at other places.


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

paxsarah said:


> This is very true, and it's all in the perspective. Are you paying the absolute rock-bottom amount of Wyndham MFs? No. But as a Disney vacationer (as am I), you will be able to stay in more spacious and livable accommodations for much cheaper than any of Disney's on-site offerings. We've stayed at Bonnet Creek, as well as exchanging in RCI to stay in a DVC property (don't even get me started on the math of how many thousands of dollars that saved over rack rates, not that we would have paid them), and using RCI Last Call to pay cash for great deals on other nearby resorts. You are still saving money over your previous vacation expenditures, so well done. Now, pay attention to all of these really knowledgeable people as you start using your points - they really know what they're talking about and you can learn and save a lot more using their advice.



Yes rack rates on a one bedroom suite at OKW is about $500 a night.

I don't know how many Wyndham points it takes to trade into RCI to stay at DVC though. I have no way of checking into any of that yet.

I really look forward to being able to log in and check availability and exchanges etc. i don't work so it will give me something else to do when I get bored during the day while the kids are at school.


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

One of the closing companies (for the 154,000 contract) already emailed me the contract and papers to electronically sign. It was simple to click and sign. No scanning and emailing. I hope all 3 companies uses that same type of set up. I do have a scanner so if I need to print stuff off and sign it then email it back I will but that Esign click and sign thing was a breeze.


----------



## staceyeileen (Jul 15, 2013)

Did you question the seller on the loan balance mentioned in the estoppel?  That seems fishy to me.  Each estoppel letter I have received has always said "There is no loan balance associated with this account" like Ron's.


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 15, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> Did you question the seller on the loan balance mentioned in the estoppel?  That seems fishy to me.  Each estoppel letter I have received has always said "There is no loan balance associated with this account" like Ron's.



Yes I emailed her and she said there was no outstanding loan balance on the contract. That company hasn't emailed me any paperwork yet. but I saved her email to me that said the contract had no loan against it.


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 16, 2013)

*I have a new question for anybody who checks back in*

Hypothetical question. If I take some of my new points when these contracts get put into my name and make a reservation then have to cancel it, those points become canceled points right? Once they are canceled points can you ever deposit them with RCI at the end of the year or once they are canceled points you have to use them or lose them?

Same type of question about canceled points if they have been pooled. If you have all your points pooled and make a reservation and have to cancel it, do those pooled points just become canceled points and never go back into the pool once they have been canceled right?


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 16, 2013)

*Another new question*

I have been up since 1:30 am so my head is full of questions.

When looking into a resort, for instance if I want to go to the beach at Destin, Florida...how do I go about finding out what the resort check in and check out requirements are. Like I have read some require you either CHECK IN OR OUT on Fri/Sat/Sun. And they do a certain number of days for stays like 3, 4 or 7. How do I find out what each resort requires? Or is it the same for all of them?


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## ronparise (Jul 16, 2013)

Cancelled points are cancelled points whether the reservation was made with pooled points or regular use year points and they go into the Use year of the reservation cancelled

Cancelled points can be deposited to RCI, pooled points cannot


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 16, 2013)

ronparise said:


> Cancelled points are cancelled points whether the reservation was made with pooled points or regular use year points and they go into the Use year of the reservation cancelled
> 
> Cancelled points can be deposited to RCI, pooled points cannot



OK. Thank you for the quick response.


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 16, 2013)

What are/how much is some of the special assessments you all have been hit with over the years with your timeshare contracts?

Do they just come out of the blue and you have to pay them right away? Do they warn you and give you a certain amount of time to pay it?


----------



## BellaWyn (Jul 16, 2013)

*Close this thread?*



mspeggysue911 said:


> I have been up since 1:30 am so my head is full of questions.


There is a learning curve with Wyndham. Suggest you do more searching here in TUG and read ALL of the stickies [that's why Dave/Goofyhobbie spent countless hours writing them]. Also visit the Wyndham Owners Forum AGAIN and spend time reading. Posts may be less current than TUG but information is STILL accurate.

Can we get a Mod to close this thread. It's gotten WAY OT and somewhat unwieldy.


----------



## vckempson (Jul 16, 2013)

BellaWyn said:


> Can we get a Mod to close this thread. It's gotten WAY OT and somewhat unwieldy.



+1 for me too.


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 16, 2013)

BellaWyn said:


> There is a learning curve with Wyndham. Suggest you do more searching here in TUG and read ALL of the stickies [that's why Dave/Goofyhobbie spent countless hours writing them]. Also visit the Wyndham Owners Forum AGAIN and spend time reading. Posts may be less current than TUG but information is STILL accurate.
> 
> Can we get a Mod to close this thread. It's gotten WAY OT and somewhat unwieldy.



It's gotten off topic because I was asked to put ALL my questions into this same thread.

If you think the thread has run its' course why even bother coming into it?

ETA: I have read the stickies here and I have read what I could find on the Wyndham Owners forum.

There aren't answers to specific questions. They are general things.


----------



## DeniseM (Jul 16, 2013)

I actually merged some of her threads.  The OP is a newbie with lots of related questions, and it's better to keep them in one thread for the sake of continuity.

MPS911 - If you have a question on a totally unrelated topic - like a different timeshare system, it's perfectly OK to start a new thread in a new forum.

Another good resource is the stickies at the top of each forum, and the search function.

Good luck with your search!


----------



## Twinkstarr (Jul 17, 2013)

BellaWyn said:


> There is a learning curve with Wyndham. Suggest you do more searching here in TUG and read ALL of the stickies [that's why Dave/Goofyhobbie spent countless hours writing them]. Also visit the Wyndham Owners Forum AGAIN and spend time reading. Posts may be less current than TUG but information is STILL accurate.



Good advice, we spent at least a year researching(reading Wyndham owner forum, looking at point charts etc) before buying.

But we may have had a shorter learning curve as we already owned a point system(Disney) before we decided to broaden our ownership.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 17, 2013)

*I have 2 questions*

I have 2 more questions for anybody who happens to come back in here and wants to answer for me...

First question is ONCE you bank your points into RCI is it ever possible to use those banked RCI points to stay back in a WYndham resort? Or is it only RCI resorts and DVC you can book into?

Second question, I am trying to understand points usage. If I want to make a reservation for a 2014 trip do I have to wait until January when I get my 2014 points allocated to me? Or is there a way to make a reservation for next year BEFORE you get your next year's points? I know if you have your points pooled that is one way to make a reservation for next year. But on these contracts I bought nobody has any of the points pooled for 2013.

The scenario would be, we want to book a short trip for March 2014 and a trip for summer 2014. Do we have to wait until January to make those reservations? Or in November when I pool my 2014 points can you go ahead and make it then once your points are pooled?

I hope my questions make sense.

These are actually things my husband has asked me and I told him I don't know, I would have to ask because I have used the search feature and am not coming up with anything even close to what I am needing to know.


----------



## tug1873 (Jul 17, 2013)

Let me see if I can answer some of these questions.

If your points are banked with RCI you can book any RCI available so that does include wyndham resorts it will cost you though $199 to reserve the week. It's usually better to book wyndham directly though then though RCI and you will not have the exchange fee. The other benefit is you can cancel the reservations up to 15 days before hand.  with RCI you lose the $199 fee and probably some points.

When you have a wyndham account you get so many free reservations per 77,000 points if I am wrong someone will correct me on this. What you need to watch out is if you cancel and re-book  you can easily end up running out of those points and have to pay $39 per reservation. 

House Credits are another thing to watch out for so don't book too many short stays or split reservations.  This is easy to avoid by booking longer stays or borrowing from the next year if you really need them.


When booking you can book 10 months out at any resorts. It will come from the points available for the given year.  So make sure you watch your use year. If you have points from expiring at the end of the year but make a reservation for say march it will not use those points. Make sure you either deposit it into RCI or make a reservation.

I have also found it easier to start planning your reservations a year out. You can always cancel up to 15 days before hand so if you need to cancel you can. You then just have to use those points before the end of the year or deposit them into RCI.  



mspeggysue911 said:


> I have 2 more questions for anybody who happens to come back in here and wants to answer for me...
> 
> First question is ONCE you bank your points into RCI is it ever possible to use those banked RCI points to stay back in a WYndham resort? Or is it only RCI resorts and DVC you can book into?
> 
> ...


----------



## JimmieJames (Jul 17, 2013)

I avoid RCI with a passion - however, with the mandatory use year change I will find myself with unused points at the end of December of 2014 and I will be forced to place them into RCI as a last resort or loose them.  My understanding is that there are Wyndham resorts available that I will be able to get - although not at nearly as good a deal as through Wyndham with my discounts and upgrades.  Others who use RCI can probably confirm this.  For example - in browsing the 'last call' RCI I find several Wyndham resorts listed. 

Your next year's available points will show up in your Wyndham account on line in plenty of time to make your reservations - for example I have already made several reservations for 2014 without affecting my 2013 points total.  This is without affecting my credit pooled points either.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 17, 2013)

JimmieJames said:


> I avoid RCI with a passion - however, with the mandatory use year change I will find myself with unused points at the end of December of 2014 and I will be forced to place them into RCI as a last resort or loose them.  My understanding is that there are Wyndham resorts available that I will be able to get - although not at nearly as good a deal as through Wyndham with my discounts and upgrades.  Others who use RCI can probably confirm this.  For example - in browsing the 'last call' RCI I find several Wyndham resorts listed.
> 
> Your next year's available points will show up in your Wyndham account on line in plenty of time to make your reservations - for example I have already made several reservations for 2014 without affecting my 2013 points total.  This is without affecting my credit pooled points either.



So if you have already made some 2014 reservations BEFORE you get your 2014 points then it is possible. That is what I was curious about. I want to try and book a reservation for next march 2014 but if I have to wait until the actual points are in my account in January then you might not find anything available.

Thank you for answering.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 17, 2013)

tug1873 said:


> Let me see if I can answer some of these questions.
> 
> If your points are banked with RCI you can book any RCI available so that does include wyndham resorts it will cost you though $199 to reserve the week. It's usually better to book wyndham directly though then though RCI and you will not have the exchange fee. The other benefit is you can cancel the reservations up to 15 days before hand.  with RCI you lose the $199 fee and probably some points.
> 
> ...



Thank you for answering.


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## uscav8r (Jul 17, 2013)

*Wyndham Site*

Once you get your Wyndham account set up, you can find most of the answers to your previous (and future) questions on their website. Unfortunately you have to be an owner to access it, so that won't help you right now.

It's a great place to go if you ever forget what you've already learned here, too!


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 18, 2013)

*What now?*

What happens after all the paperwork has been signed with the closing companies? It takes a couple of months and then what? I will get some paperwork in the mail from the closings and then I will get something in the mail from Wyndham?

Once I get something from Wyndham I will call them and ask them to put all 3 of my contracts together into one?


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## markb53 (Jul 18, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> What happens after all the paperwork has been signed with the closing companies? It takes a couple of months and then what? I will get some paperwork in the mail from the closings and then I will get something in the mail from Wyndham?
> 
> Once I get something from Wyndham I will call them and ask them to put all 3 of my contracts together into one?



According to Wyndham, it take 6 to 8 weeks from the time they receive The deed. In my case it took every bit of  that. I wouldn't wait to hear from Wyndham, however. That will probably take an addition 2 weeks or so. Once the closing company let me know they sent the deed to Wyndham, I starting calling the title department once a week. Once they tell you the transfer is complete, you should ask for your member number. Then you can setup your online account without waiting for Wyndham to notify you. And you can start booking vacations. 

--
Mark


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 18, 2013)

markb53 said:


> According to Wyndham, it take 6 to 8 weeks from the time they receive The deed. In my case it took every bit of  that. I wouldn't wait to hear from Wyndham, however. That will probably take an addition 2 weeks or so. Once the closing company let me know they sent the deed to Wyndham, I starting calling the title department once a week. Once they tell you the transfer is complete, you should ask for your member number. Then you can setup your online account without waiting for Wyndham to notify you. And you can start booking vacations.
> 
> --
> Mark



Cool thank you.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 19, 2013)

*Wyndham Smoky Mountains*

Have you or anybody you know of ever stayed at the Wyndham Smoky Mountains resort in Sevierville?

I am reading reviews of it on trip advisor and it seems like people are getting this resort confused with some resort in the same town that has an indoor water park. But they are referring to the one with the indoor water park as a Wyndham property. There are only 2 resorts listed in the Wyndham directory in Sevierville and neither of them mention a water park or wave pool on the resort grounds.

Do you know anything about either property?

We want to go stay at the Smoky Mountain resort next summer but if there is a Wyndham timeshare resort with an indoor water park I would definitely like to check into that.
 as well.

My question about the Smoky Mountain resort if you have stayed there is this...there are 2 activity centers shown on the resort map. One right in the check in building and one across the road on the other side of the resort. I am curious, which activity center has the pool tables and ping pong table? Or do they both? Is there a pool on both sides of the resort?


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## Myxdvz (Jul 19, 2013)

There's Wyndham Smokey Mountains (no waterpark) and Wyndham Vacation Resorts Great Smokies Lodge (with water park)


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 19, 2013)

Myxdvz said:


> There's Wyndham Smokey Mountains (no waterpark) and Wyndham Vacation Resorts Great Smokies Lodge (with water park)



Ah Ok TY. I will go investigate that now. I saw that lodge on the directory but must not have read the description well enough to know THAT resort is the one they were talking about.

I appreciate the quick reply.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 19, 2013)

P.S- For anybody who rents out timeshare points as a means of income...there is a 2,700,000 Club Wyndham Access contract for sale on Ebay for 17k with $1200 monthly MF's. I want it!! lol (I won't get it but thought somebody here might be interested in it)


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 20, 2013)

*Another quick question*

If at the end of this year I have some leftover points that need to be banked in RCI, say 100,000 points.

And next year I want to use those points but am about 30 or 40k points short, how do you go about getting more points through RCI?

Can you buy or rent some RCI points from other ppl or would I have to just pool my own future points then bank however much I needed into RCI to combine those 2 deposits into one big enough for my reservation?


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## ronparise (Jul 20, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> P.S- For anybody who rents out timeshare points as a means of income...there is a 2,700,000 Club Wyndham Access contract for sale on Ebay for 17k with $1200 monthly MF's. I want it!! lol (I won't get it but thought somebody here might be interested in it)



Prices have been going up but I don't think that much, I just won an auction for 1300000 points at under $2000 incl closing and transfer


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 20, 2013)

ronparise said:


> Prices have been going up but I don't think that much, I just won an auction for 1300000 points at under $2000 incl closing and transfer



WOW! I was impressed with THAT price but more impressed with the MF's. I thought MF's on 2.7 mil points would be several thousand per month.


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## MaryBella7 (Jul 20, 2013)

$5.50 - average decent maintenance fee x 2700(000)= $14,850 per year. Divide by 12 = 1237.50 per month.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 20, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> If at the end of this year I have some leftover points that need to be banked in RCI, say 100,000 points.
> 
> And next year I want to use those points but am about 30 or 40k points short, how do you go about getting more points through RCI?
> 
> Can you buy or rent some RCI points from other ppl or would I have to just pool my own future points then bank however much I needed into RCI to combine those 2 deposits into one big enough for my reservation?



Anybody have any good advice for this scenario?


----------



## ronparise (Jul 20, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> If at the end of this year I have some leftover points that need to be banked in RCI, say 100,000 points.
> 
> And next year I want to use those points but am about 30 or 40k points short, how do you go about getting more points through RCI?
> 
> Can you buy or rent some RCI points from other ppl or would I have to just pool my own future points then bank however much I needed into RCI to combine those 2 deposits into one big enough for my reservation?




The RCI account you get with Wyndham is a
Weeks account, it is not an RCI points account

What you will have is an RCI weeks account that you can deposit Wyndham points into


If you don't have enough wyndham points in RCI to do the exchange you want, you will have to deposit more


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## paxsarah (Jul 20, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> If at the end of this year I have some leftover points that need to be banked in RCI, say 100,000 points.
> 
> And next year I want to use those points but am about 30 or 40k points short, how do you go about getting more points through RCI?
> 
> Can you buy or rent some RCI points from other ppl or would I have to just pool my own future points then bank however much I needed into RCI to combine those 2 deposits into one big enough for my reservation?



When you decide to use your deposited points in RCI, and if you find you need more points to make an exchange, you can just deposit more points from your Wyndham account to RCI at that time. They do not need to be "combined." It's like making a bank deposit.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 20, 2013)

Ok, thank you both.

I didn't know if there was a process for renting extra RCI points from somebody.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 20, 2013)

*2 questions*

For those of you who own multiple contracts maybe you can help me understand this. Why are the closing processes so different from company to company?

I bought 3 contracts in 2 days. The first one I bought from Sumday. The next day I bought 2 more from 2 different companies.

The 2 contracts I bought on the second day both emailed me the papers to sign the very next day. One I had to print, sign, scan and email back. The other one had me actually electronically sign it. Then Sumday is actually snail mailing me the papers to sign and snail mail back to them. That seems like it is going to add weeks to the process. Why can one company take electronic signatures but another company say they have to have original signatures?

Have you had both cases happen in your dealings?


And second question: What does PCC mean? I see it used to refer to companies that sell timeshares.


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## ronparise (Jul 21, 2013)

Your question is like asking why does McDonalds grill thei burgers and Burger King flame broil theirs? They are different. That's all

PCC is a post card company. The name refers to the way they typically market their services. And that service is that they offer to "buy" timeshares. I put buy in quotes because acuially you have to pay them to take it. Usually thousands of dollars.

Most of the big eBay sellers are not PCCs, exactly, rather the are their sales agents

What you bought on eBay, someone probably paid a PCC thousands of dollars to get rid of


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 21, 2013)

ronparise said:


> Your question is like asking why does McDonalds grill thei burgers and Burger King flame broil theirs? They are different. That's all
> 
> PCC is a post card company. The name refers to the way they typically market their services. And that service is that they offer to "buy" timeshares. I put buy in quotes because acuially you have to pay them to take it. Usually thousands of dollars.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the info


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 21, 2013)

Did I read somewhere on here the if an auction on Ebay says Private listing that you should NOT bid on it?

And if so, why?

The auction says private listing to protect the bidder's identity. But Ebay doesn't reveal a bidder's identity to begin with. So what would be the reason to make an auction private?


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## JeffBrown (Jul 24, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Then Sumday is actually snail mailing me the papers to sign and snail mail back to them. That seems like it is going to add weeks to the process. Why can one company take electronic signatures but another company say they have to have original signatures?
> .



Just to clarify, Sumday is not snail mailing you what you need to sign, we are snail mailing you ORIGINAL documents such as your completed Deed.  Just wait a bit and see, in the end, our closing will be the fastest and you'll have spent less time with my closing agent than any other.

Sincerely,
Jeff Brown
Sumday Vacations


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## tug1873 (Jul 25, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> Did I read somewhere on here the if an auction on Ebay says Private listing that you should NOT bid on it?
> 
> And if so, why?
> 
> The auction says private listing to protect the bidder's identity. But Ebay doesn't reveal a bidder's identity to begin with. So what would be the reason to make an auction private?



I wouldn't say don't bid just be careful about what you want to pay.
I think the concern is shill bidding. I don't care about shills in auctions because I never pay more then I want to. To hard to figure out of someone is shilling or not. Some shillers are very good at not being caught and you will never suspect them. Also levitate bids sometimes look like the seller is shilling and there innocent.


At the end of the day only bid what you think is a good deal and stick to it. On eBay it helps to bid last minute.

The same thing can said about any auction.


----------



## mspeggysue911 (Jul 25, 2013)

*New question*

There are several auctions on Ebay I have been watching and thought about maybe bidding on but the seller will NOT accept Paypal or credit cards. The other timeshare sellers I have bought from accepted either Paypal or credit card. This company says they will not. 

Should that be a red flag to me? If you pay by check or money order instead of Paypal or credit card you really have no recourse to get your money back if things go wrong.

What is your opinion on a company that won't accept Paypal or credit cards?

They told me NO REAL ESTATE transaction is suppose to use Paypal for payments and they claim the 3% fee is the reason they do not accept credit cards but when I offered to pay the 3% fee they still said no to credit cards.


----------



## staceyeileen (Jul 25, 2013)

I would only purchase using a credit card.


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## ronparise (Jul 25, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> I would only purchase using a credit card.



Why  is that?

..Conventional advice is not to finance a timeshare purchase. Most title companies I know wont accept credit cards for real property. Certified funds only, or wire transfers

If you insist on using a credit card , you can always use your card to get a cash advance and pay with cash.


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## tug1873 (Jul 25, 2013)

I agree credit cards are the best way to pay if you can. 

Ron,

I use credit cards like Amex. They guarantee your satisfied with your purchase. Some prepaid debit cards offer the same protection as well.

I also tend to use credit cards only when buying online.

I can also understand why sellers would not accept credit cards when it comes to transferring deeds. You could easily end up with the timeshare and get a refund.  

So I am willing to pay cash and accept the risk. Many those sellers are the ones with the best deals out there. So far I am ahead. Just never pay more then your willing to lose upfront. I believe ebay has insurance as well if you purchase an auction through them. I never had to claim that and I am not sure you are covered when you don't use paypal.


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## csxjohn (Jul 25, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> There are several auctions on Ebay I have been watching and thought about maybe bidding on but the seller will NOT accept Paypal or credit cards. The other timeshare sellers I have bought from accepted either Paypal or credit card. This company says they will not.
> 
> Should that be a red flag to me? If you pay by check or money order instead of Paypal or credit card you really have no recourse to get your money back if things go wrong.What is your opinion on a company that won't accept Paypal or credit cards?
> 
> They told me NO REAL ESTATE transaction is suppose to use Paypal for payments and they claim the 3% fee is the reason they do not accept credit cards but when I offered to pay the 3% fee they still said no to credit cards.



You answered your own question.  Without the treat of canceling your payment, there is no incentive for a seller to correct things quickly.

I won't bid on an auction where the seller does not accept CCs.  You will see many posts where people are having trouble with a TS purchase and I seem to remember that most of them are with the companies that don't accept them.




tug1873 said:


> I agree credit cards are the best way to pay if you can.
> 
> Ron,
> 
> ...



It is my understanding that there is no eBay protection on real estate, you are on your own for recourse if things go south.


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## csxjohn (Jul 25, 2013)

ronparise said:


> ..
> 
> ..Conventional advice is not to finance a timeshare purchase. ...



I pay my CCs off every month so Im not realy financing my TS purchases.  I use the card for the buyer protection it affords.


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## tug1873 (Jul 25, 2013)

csxjohn said:


> It is my understanding that there is no eBay protection on real estate, you are on your own for recourse if things go south.




Thank You for clearing this up. I  knew ebay had buyers protection but it has been years since I looked at it and it says in plain English it excludes Real Estate purchases.

So I have to agree Buyer Beware when no credit card can be used.  Ebay Auction if it requires cash. It also the reason I question the logic behind spending large amounts of money on Ebay auctions. 

If you buy off a timeshare broker don't they usually need a Real Estate license to conduct business unless they own it themselves. I don't recall seeing a license in ads?


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## staceyeileen (Jul 25, 2013)

ronparise said:


> Why  is that?
> 
> ..Conventional advice is not to finance a timeshare purchase. Most title companies I know wont accept credit cards for real property. Certified funds only, or wire transfers
> 
> If you insist on using a credit card , you can always use your card to get a cash advance and pay with cash.



I put all purchases on credit cards and pay them off monthly.  Financing is not an issue.  Using a credit card for a timeshare purchase provides a level of protection if your transaction does not go smoothly or the contract you receive is not as advertised (as a last resort, of course, after trying to work it out with the seller).


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## ronparise (Jul 25, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> I put all purchases on credit cards and pay them off monthly.  Financing is not an issue.  Using a credit card for a timeshare purchase provides a level of protection if your transaction does not go smoothly or the contract you receive is not as advertised (as a last resort, of course, after trying to work it out with the seller).



I know Im in the minority here, but if financing is not the issue there is no need for a credit card. Using a credit card is no substitute for due diligence. 

I understand that you want some protection...What no one seems to understand is, so does the seller


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## DeniseM (Jul 25, 2013)

ronparise said:


> I know Im in the minority here, but if financing is not the issue there is no need for a credit card. Using a credit card is no substitute for due diligence.
> 
> I understand that you want some protection...What no one seems to understand is, so does the seller



1)  Many people always fly for free because of their credit card points - so they WANT to use their card.

2)  There is nothing wrong with having a 2nd layer of protection from a credit card, and it's certainly easier to get your money back, if you can dispute it with your credit card company.

3)  Ron - I'm guessing that you personally don't use credit cards.


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## staceyeileen (Jul 25, 2013)

ronparise said:


> I know Im in the minority here, but if financing is not the issue there is no need for a credit card.



Sure, there's no NEED for one but there are many advantages to using one for people that can pay them off in full every month.  

1) I receive hundreds of dollars in cash back every year. 
2) Simplifies my finances.  I pay two big bills every month.  Credit card and mortgage.
3) As already stated, the benefits of things like purchase protection, price guarantee, warranty extension, travel insurance, etc.


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## ronparise (Jul 25, 2013)

It's not that I  don't understand the uses of credit cards beyond credit I do. Its that real estate title companies, at least the ones I've worked with don't take credit cards or personal checks. Some don't even take certified checks. They only take bank wires.

Timeshares are Real Estate.

Any closing company doing a proper job won't accept plastic. Why? Because it can be reversed after the property is transferred and the new deed recorded


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 25, 2013)

I talked to the seller and explained to him that I didn't feel comfortable making a timeshare purchase unless I could use a credit card or Paypal and he said he would take Paypal if I paid the additional 3.8% fee that Paypal charges. That's fair to me. I kept the email from him so if I do buy something from him I can remind him he said he would take Paypal for it. And my husband's credit card is the source that pays for things in my Paypal account. So we have a double layer of protection. First through Paypal and second through the credit card.

Not that it will totally protect you from fraud but it makes me feel better to think it could help in a bad situation.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 27, 2013)

*Question about banking into RCI*

Of the 4 contracts I have bought, 3 of them have 2013 points on them. When all the transfers are complete I will have 357,000 2013 to use or bank with RCI. We are going to try and make a short notice reservation to Bonnet Creek at the beginning of November but that will only use about 120,000 points leaving us with 237,000 we will need to put into RCI.

My question is, should we divide that into 2 different deposits or should I keep it all together and deposit it as one?

If I divide it up into 2 deposits that would enable me to have 2 ongoing searches going at one time right? But with dividing it up that would only be about 118,000 points for each deposit, which may not be enough points to cover the reservation I am searching for. What's the best option for those points?

Do you have to have enough points in the deposit to actually cover the reservation you are looking for in your ongoing search or can you search for something with less points than what you would need to book it?


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## paxsarah (Jul 27, 2013)

In the current Wyndham/RCI system, you cannot split points into separate deposits, so there would be no purpose (or way, really) to make two deposits from your points. (I'm sure you were reading some materials about the prior system, but it's completely different now.) It's now like depositing into a bank - you want to put $100 in the bank, there's no benefit to putting in $50 + $50. If you then want to make a withdrawal, or in this case an exchange with RCI, you spend the points you need, and whatever remains is your new balance.

I've only ever had one ongoing search on at once, but I believe I've seen here that you can have more than one search going at a time. You can also start an ongoing search without enough points deposited to actually make the exchange; however, I don't think you'd ever actually catch a hit with it - though with 237K deposited you'd be able to make almost any possible exchange, regardless.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 27, 2013)

Thank you for the info. That makes sense.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 31, 2013)

*RCI booking window.*

I will have a big chunk of 2013 points I will need to deposit into RCI at the end of this year. Once they are in there, what is my booking window? How far in advance can you book resorts using RCI? Is it still 10 months like with Wyndham?


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## staceyeileen (Jul 31, 2013)

I believe it is 2 years from the deposit date


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 31, 2013)

staceyeileen said:


> I believe it is 2 years from the deposit date



I think 2 years is how long they are good for. I am curious how far in advance can you book something. With your Wyndham points it is 10 months. Is it the same with RCI?

For instance if I want to book something for October what month does my booking window open up? January?


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## learnalot (Jul 31, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I will have a big chunk of 2013 points I will need to deposit into RCI at the end of this year. Once they are in there, what is my booking window? How far in advance can you book resorts using RCI? Is it still 10 months like with Wyndham?



You can book whatever has already been deposited.  Most deposits occur about 12 months out, but we already have something booked for summer 2015.

Your points are good for 2 years from the date of deposit.  Meaning, you need to have booked something by then using those points, but the travel date could be later.


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## learnalot (Jul 31, 2013)

mspeggysue911 said:


> I think 2 years is how long they are good for. I am curious how far in advance can you book something. With your Wyndham points it is 10 months. Is it the same with RCI?
> 
> For instance if I want to book something for October what month does my booking window open up? January?



I was already posting an answer to this the first time you asked it. In the example you gave, you could already book October 2014, although you might be ahead of many of the deposits right now, so possibly fewer options than there might be a couple months from now.


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 31, 2013)

Thanks for the info guys. That's what I needed to know.


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## pacodemountainside (Jul 31, 2013)

Enough is  a-nough!  Mods,  allow this dead horse  to RIP! :deadhorse:

http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=196413


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## DeniseM (Jul 31, 2013)

pacodemountainside said:


> Enough is  a-nough!  Mods,  allow this dead horse  to RIP! :deadhorse:




Really? - you'd prefer that each of the questions asked above was a separate thread?  
I don't think so....

Here are two easy fixes:

-Quit reading this thread 

-Use the "ignore" function


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## mspeggysue911 (Jul 31, 2013)

If you are talking about the mods need to close THIS thread (although the link you posted is to a thread about the new directory) I think the reason they have left mine open is because I seem to have a new question every day or two and rather than have me ask questions in a new thread they have just let me keep asking in here.

I don't understand why if this thread bothers you, you would even come in here. there was a guy posted a whole thread on another section of the boards specifically asking how he could ignore my thread. Seems ridiculous.

If it bothers you (general you) that new ppl have so many questions why even frequent a board? Is it meant for all the seasoned pros just to come and chat with each other every day about random things, or is for answering questions and helping each other gain knowledge?

You (general you) may know all there is to know and it irritates you that ppl can't seem to find their own info. But thankfully there are helpful ppl on this board. It has helped me learn a lot.


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## pacodemountainside (Jul 31, 2013)

[I think you need to take a break from this thread.  OK?  OK - DeniseM Moderator]


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