# We hired a professional organizer



## glypnirsgirl (Dec 9, 2013)

Ian and I have had too much stuff since we married ten years ago.

Now that we are empty-nesters, I am ready to get this house looking good. It is the first home that I have ever had that is not always company ready. And this one has almost never been company ready --- until now.

So far, we have worked on the kitchen and the office. The kitchen is finished. Ian says we aren't done with the office, but we are close. There is a small shelf unit that we would both like to get rid of but we don't have a spot cleared for the things that are on the unit. 

I am really happy with our organizer. She did not have us start buying stuff for storage. She did not have us pull everything out. Instead, we started just by purging - throwing out or giving away stuff. We started in one corner of the room and went through each room item by item. I had about 14 vases for instance. I now have 4. 

We work with her for about 2 hours and then have homework for the next week.

After the initial purging, we went through and grouped items "like with like." As we went through this step, it became obvious when we had too much of something and we continued to purge. 

Because we have had some items that we were working on spread throughout the house, we have also worked on those drawers/boxes/shelves that contained similar items. We had photographs in the office, in boxes in various closets, and in drawers in our guest room, for instance. The same thing with books and games - they were spread throughout the house. 

So far, the only things that we have bought are moving boxes and wrapping paper for getting things ready for Goodwill. We have not purchased any storage or organizing items. 

We will probably buy more Elfa shelves for the office. With all of the photo albums in one place, we need another shelf or two (or three or four). It would be nice to move some of the cookbooks and travel books to a more convenient place. 

Our organizer insisted that we start with the kitchen. I had not seen that the kitchen was even a problem. She was right. The effect was immediate and obvious. So we got almost instant gratification.

It has been a great experience so far.

elaine


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## ricoba (Dec 9, 2013)

May I ask the cost?


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## ace2000 (Dec 9, 2013)

That's good to hear!  Everytime I purge, I find out that I miss it later.  However, that's the best way to do it.  We recently went on an organizing spree this past summer.  We put two of these racks in the back of our garage (two of them fit perfectly in the back of our 2-car garage) and then filled them with the bins.  I can't recall how many fit, it was a lot... these really helped us!







http://www.lowes.com/pd_319477-1281...pl=1&currentURL=?Ntt=steel+shelves&facetInfo= 







http://www.lowes.com/pd_44066-61896...&currentURL=?Ntt=black+storage+lid&facetInfo=


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## ace2000 (Dec 9, 2013)

Just to add a little additional information to my previous post...  each shelf on the rack holds 6 storage bins.  We currently have 18 bins on each rack (for a total of 36 bins in the garage).  I guess we could go higher than that on the top.  Mostly just seasonal items and hobby stuff.  These racks are very sturdy and it gives us a ton of storage !!!


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 9, 2013)

ricoba said:


> May I ask the cost?



Sure! Our organizer charges $80 per hour. I have seen them as low as $25 per hour. We chose her because of her emphasis on purging rather then organizing. We have way too much stuff --- and Ian has always wanted to go through it all systematically. And the fact that we don't require much hand-holding. For us, she has been time effective because she does assign us homework instead of sitting here while we are working.

I have seen professional organizers charge from $20 to $100 per hour. The ones at $20 per hour sit through the whole thing --- as least that was my impression. Our organizer works in 2 hour increments --- and we spend about 20 hours working between appointments.

For us, it has been worth it. 

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 9, 2013)

ace2000 said:


> Just to add a little additional information to my previous post...  each shelf on the rack holds 6 storage bins.  We currently have 18 bins on each rack (for a total of 36 bins in the garage).  I guess we could go higher than that on the top.  Mostly just seasonal items and hobby stuff.  These racks are very sturdy and it gives us a ton of storage !!!



Thanks! That is a great, cost-effective solution. That is a lot of storage for the cost.

We have some racks and totes in the garage now. They are not perfectly proportioned to one another so there is a lot of wasted space. 

Your post came right on time, too. If the weather gets better (we had an ice storm and have not yet dug out) the garage will be the next project.

elaine


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## Elan (Dec 9, 2013)

This thread really hits home.  I am an organizer.  My wife is not.  I feel like our house is never "company ready", while at the same time she seems mostly fine with how it looks.  

  She has major reluctance to pitching things and, quite frankly, so do I.  But I will put all of my things into nicely labeled containers in the garage -- I may not need something ever again but, I can easily find it if I do .  My wife just leaves her stuff out.  Because she doesn't organize, her method of being able to find her things is to leave them all in plain sight, which drives me crazy.  She does not discern between common areas, such as the great room/kitchen and private areas, such as our bedroom or her craft room.  To her, it's all free domain to clutter.  

  I occasionally ask her if she is auditioning for "Hoarders", but she fails to see the humor......


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## geekette (Dec 9, 2013)

I also have deficiencies in this area.  I was simply coined a messy kid and there was never any instruction about how to put your stuff away - how do you know which should be the sock drawer or which shelf should hold board games and which should hold puzzles?  My mother is hoarderish so I guess she didn't know so couldn't teach me.  

I don't have a problem pitching things but have never figured out how to store things in ways that make sense, are convenient, use the space well, etc.  So I come up with new 'systems' that never work because they aren't convenient or easy or whatever.  

It has never been clear to me where anything "goes" and my attempts at inflicting order have failed repeatedly.  I have considered an organizer for that objective eye - they will see great storage ideas that would work for me that I can't see or don't know about or whatever.  It just doesn't make sense for me anymore to buy some Storage Thing without a good plan on how to utilize it.  Worse, the home I'm in is way low on built in storage so the problem has magnified over the years I've been there (longest I've lived anywhere since my parents house) and x figured it was My Problem.  Anything that wasn't Definitely His was my problem to deal with (entire kitchen/dining area, most of the garage except His Tools and Gloves), anything to do with the yard or dog or supplies for kitchen/home appliances....  one year he bought me banker boxes and made signs.  as if filing was the problem !!   

It's not a problem to have like items together, they just don't end up stored well for their size or use or volume or whatever.  

Great thread. Boyfriend and I have talked about getting an organizer when/if we live together but I'm tired of feeling like a messy kid with no clue of how to put my crap away.

can someone please define what 'company ready' means??  teasing ...   in my family, getting ready for company meant Hide Everything, usually in a closet or unused room.  No wonder I have no idea how to go about it, doesn't seem like my parents did, either.


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## SueDonJ (Dec 9, 2013)

It's definitely easier to keep an un-cluttered house if you have the space and a system, that's for sure.  I'm an admitted neatfreak but that's not always a good thing - it seems to stem from control issues and sometimes requires effort to just pull back and let go.  Our home is usually "company ready" but I've learned over the years that it's okay to have concentrated clutter as long as it's clean - there's a gigantic difference between cluttered and dirty.

On the other hand my sewing room couldn't be more organized or neat, even when I'm mid-projects.  Probably nothing would ever get done if my work space wasn't that way.

I would guess that you're correct, geekette, that somebody like you could hire a professional for just a few hours to figure out an organizational system, then go to town with his/her suggestions.


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## jlp879 (Dec 9, 2013)

I'm glad you had such a good experience with your organizer, she sounds like a real gem.

For those of you who want to go it alone, you might want to check out the Flylady system.  

Once I had three kids, I felt I could no longer keep up with the house.  It was like the "stuff" was winning and I was losing peace.  Luckily I found this website, www.flylady.net which helped me to go from CHAOS (Can't Have Anyone Over Syndrome) to company-ready which means throwing your door wide open to anyone at anytime (and not being embarrassed about it).  If you ever had a repair person at your house and they needed to use the washroom, and you had to hesitate before you said yes, then you know what I'm talking about. 

Now I still have three kids, so my definition of company-ready might be different from yours.  But at least I can shut the door to their rooms!

The best thing about the Flylady system is that she teaches you can't organize clutter, you can only get rid of it.  Once you purge, it is much easier to put systems in place for the possessions you have and maintain them. 

Flylady maintains that people or either BO (born organized) or SHEs (side-tracked home executives).  If you fall into the BO category, you will instinctively know where to put things for their maximum efficiency.  If you are not, then you will either get overwhelmed or feel frustrated at the thought of say setting up a kitchen or a workable office space.  I definitely fall into the side-tracked category!


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 9, 2013)

geekette said:


> I also have deficiencies in this area.  I was simply coined a messy kid.



Me, too. Exactly the reason that I hired someone --- it wasn't working for me or for us to do it on our own. 

My mother was a minimalist. Our house was always clean because we did not have anything. We weren't allowed to bring home school projects - my mother didn't want them messing up the house. I think that I didn't learn to organize because there was nothing _to_ organize.

Years ago when I was in therapy, I asked my psychologist for help in being a more organized person. He told me, "it is not part of your personality. You are an activist, not an analyst. You will have to hire someone to be organized for you." 

So, I have always had an office manager at work. 

I decided that I need help at home, too. 

My house was built in 1961. We have very little built in storage. I hung Elfa shelves and drawers in my pantry, closet, office, guest bath. I just had not utilized them well.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 9, 2013)

jlp879 said:


> For those of you who want to go it alone, you might want to check out the Flylady system.



Flylady was very helpful when my problem was not knowing where to get started. 

She has a great plan for getting started and for maintaining. I used to use her plans for assigning my kids chores. And having a schedule to make sure that everything gets done. 

I found it less helpful for actually organizing. 

I second flylady.

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 9, 2013)

Elan said:


> This thread really hits home.  I am an organizer.  My wife is not.  I feel like our house is never "company ready", while at the same time she seems mostly fine with how it looks.
> 
> She has major reluctance to pitching things and, quite frankly, so do I.  But I will put all of my things into nicely labeled containers in the garage -- I may not need something ever again but, I can easily find it if I do .  My wife just leaves her stuff out.  Because she doesn't organize, her method of being able to find her things is to leave them all in plain sight, which drives me crazy.  She does not discern between common areas, such as the great room/kitchen and private areas, such as our bedroom or her craft room.  To her, it's all free domain to clutter.
> 
> I occasionally ask her if she is auditioning for "Hoarders", but she fails to see the humor......



Your wife may be a horizontal organizer --- she needs to see things instead of seeing boxes. Shelves and hanging racks might be helpful - that way she can see her stuff and still it has a place rather than just a landing.


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## vacationhopeful (Dec 9, 2013)

My issue is I am a spatial oriented and organized person and my hired help is a "STUFFER". 

I have shelves and bins and organized areas for STUFF; my hired help just STUFFs the supplies where a 6" item goes into any old 6" spot. And HE moves stuff to create a "place" for a bigger item.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 9, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> My issue is I am a spatial oriented and organized person and my hired help is a "STUFFER".
> 
> I have shelves and bins and organized areas for STUFF; my hired help just STUFFs the supplies where a 6" item goes into any old 6" spot. And HE moves stuff to create a "place" for a bigger item.



Oh NO!!! My heart goes out to you.


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## Patri (Dec 9, 2013)

How fascinating. I like that your organizer is neutral and favors purging. And that the two of you do your homework! DH and I wouldn't be on the same page yet, but I am gradually going through stuff. 
He is now taking college classes (middle of a 4-year program) and so needs a table or desk for his school stuff. What a slob he is, just like at his real desk job. First he was in a bonus room, but no one wanted to watch TV or sleep in there because it was just trashed with his papers all over the floor. He can't throw any old ones away. I moved him to the dining room, thinking that with guests passing it periodically, he would be neat. Nope.
Now he is in a vacant basement bedroom. Table still full of junk that has no value. He sits surrounded by it. Either lazy or hoarding tendencies. Does not pick up his clothes, etc. either. Drives me nuts.
We also had an interesting situation at my job. A co-worker had filled a storage room with her personal stuff, plus old company items that could be thrown. I couldn't take it any longer. We couldn't move in there or find anything.
With permission of the boss, I cleaned out that room over 2 days while this gal was on vacation. Threw a lot of stuff, put her stuff in two rooms we use, and boss told her when she returned to take her stuff home. We read up on hoarding, and know that was a personal attack on her, but she was abusing the office facility. It took her a week, with us stepping over her boxes to function, before she finally took her things home. I hope she doesn't gradually fill the storage room again.
I'm sure the psychologists/psychiatrists can diagnose all of us by how tidy we are.
Sorry for the ramble.


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## SMHarman (Dec 9, 2013)

I know I changed my storing / throwing / donating habits with a transatlantic move.

When you have to put anything you want to move in a box and then label that box and detail the content (for customs) you soon start thinking about what you want to keep / ditch.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 9, 2013)

SMHarman said:


> I know I changed my storing / throwing / donating habits with a transatlantic move.
> 
> When you have to put anything you want to move in a box and then label that box and detail the content (for customs) you soon start thinking about what you want to keep / ditch.



My brother-in-law, who longs to live in Hawaii, has started using that concept for deciding whether or not to keep things. He picks it up and asks himself, "will I be willing to pay to move this to Hawaii" --- if it is worth it, he keeps it. Otherwise, away it goes. 

My bonus daughter does something similar by asking herself whether the value of the object is worth the space that it consumes --- she calls it "paying rent." She is a 29 year old professional woman and culled her wardrobe down to about 3 linear feet. I was astounded.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 9, 2013)

Patri said:


> How fascinating. I like that your organizer is neutral and favors purging. And that the two of you do your homework! DH and I wouldn't be on the same page yet, but I am gradually going through stuff.
> He is now taking college classes (middle of a 4-year program) and so needs a table or desk for his school stuff. What a slob he is, just like at his real desk job. First he was in a bonus room, but no one wanted to watch TV or sleep in there because it was just trashed with his papers all over the floor. He can't throw any old ones away. I moved him to the dining room, thinking that with guests passing it periodically, he would be neat. Nope.
> Now he is in a vacant basement bedroom. Table still full of junk that has no value. He sits surrounded by it. Either lazy or hoarding tendencies. Does not pick up his clothes, etc. either. Drives me nuts.
> We also had an interesting situation at my job. A co-worker had filled a storage room with her personal stuff, plus old company items that could be thrown. I couldn't take it any longer. We couldn't move in there or find anything.
> ...



Patri - it sounds like something that you are not going to be able to change. And he doesn't sound like he is motivated to change. It sounds like the basement may be the best place for him to work. 

Remember the thread about what animal you are based on the Myers-Briggs types? I have always wondered if it is the J/P or the T/F typing that indicates a person's natural organizational ability. I am not a psychologist, so it has just been a passing thought.

elaine


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## Rose Pink (Dec 9, 2013)

I'd blame my husband, but sitting here in my office surrounded by stacks of papers and this and that, I realize I have a problem, too. I hired a professional designer to make this beautiful office thinking then I'd be organized and keep it looking nice. It has never looked organized. I just can't seem to figure out where to put stuff that is convenient. I purposely bought a small desk so it couldn't get cluttered. Now stuff just falls on the floor.  I bought a small filing cabinet and put it in the closet so I could close the closet when not in use and hide the "officey" looking stuff such as the printer. However, I can't close the closet door because there is too much stuff piled in front of it. 

My bedroom, bathroom, kitchen (except for the table), the living room, etc all look presentable most of the time. But my office and DH's spaces look like the aftermath of explosions. 

DH and I can't agree on some areas of the house. There is now a huge Precor elliptical machine in the guest room because I wanted it out of the living room. The bedside cabinets are now crammed into the closet and the bed pushed against the wall. It was once a nice guest room but is now ugly all because of a piece of gym equipment. I wanted to clean out the garage and turn it into a home gym but DH says no. I can't even get into the garage without mountain climbing equipment and letting someone know to come find me if I don't make it back out. DH says he can only organize it with DS #1's help. DS#1 lives in Italy and won't be back for a few years. (And the last time he tried to help, he passed out with a seizure--never had one before or since--and had to be taken by ambulance to the ER.)

Speaking of gym equipment, I have a pilates reformer but can't use it because DH has piled boxes on top of it. 

So, I considered building an ell extension onto the garage so DH could have his garage stuff and we could still have a home gym. No, he thinks that is a stupid and expensive idea and would cram the swimming pool he plans to build after he retires. I suggested putting the pool inside the garage with the gym equipment so it could be used year round.  No, he plans to heat it year round.  Yeah, it's 9 degrees outside.  

Sooooo.....I think a professional organizer could be a wise investment if nothing for the marriage counseling benefit. :hysterical:


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## isisdave (Dec 9, 2013)

Golly, I'm feeling a lot better about OUR house. We'll have lived here 20 years in January, and neither DW nor I had ever lived anywhere longer than 7 years before in our combined 130 years on earth.

I try to have a rule that anything that comes in that is not to be eaten or flushed requires that a thing of similar volume goes out. Sometimes that works.


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## MuranoJo (Dec 9, 2013)

Elan said:


> This thread really hits home.  I am an organizer.  My wife is not.  I feel like our house is never "company ready", while at the same time she seems mostly fine with how it looks.
> 
> She has major reluctance to pitching things and, quite frankly, so do I.  But I will put all of my things into nicely labeled containers in the garage -- I may not need something ever again but, I can easily find it if I do .  My wife just leaves her stuff out.  Because she doesn't organize, her method of being able to find her things is to leave them all in plain sight, which drives me crazy.  She does not discern between common areas, such as the great room/kitchen and private areas, such as our bedroom or her craft room.  To her, it's all free domain to clutter.
> 
> I occasionally ask her if she is auditioning for "Hoarders", but she fails to see the humor......



Egads...DH sounds just like your wife, and I'm the one who's always trying to declutter or organize.  DH just does not get rid of anything, no matter how I've tried to coax him into a joint purging.  (I already purge at least once a year, but not this guy.)  And the 'free domain to clutter'...don't get me started.

P.S.  Now that Elaine mentioned it, I was an ENTP (Parrot) on the Animal Personality quiz.  If I had to guess, I'd say DH is an ISFP.


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## UWSurfer (Dec 10, 2013)

THANK YOU FOR THIS THREAD!!!!

We had the last kid leave here a year ago November with a couple of short visits by them all and our place is cluttered as ever.   I've seen the cause of this now and it is us!  No more kids to blame.  We simply have two to three times the amount of things here than we need to maintain, and no particular habit or method of addressing it.

The link to fly lady is a good one.  I had got on her bandwagon some years ago and got exhausted trying to keep up while the rest of the family just didn't care.   I spent some time tonight and got a nice shiny sink again in addition to spending 15 minutes on some clutter.   I will need to pace myself but so long as I stick to the plan and give it the 15 it should improve in time.  

And if all else fails, I know an organizer now is a good option to have in our arsenal for the future!


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## Passepartout (Dec 10, 2013)

Yup. Thanks for shining a light into this closet. Not that it gets too far at our house. When it comes time to get rid of my junk, a pickup load will about cover it. DW, on the other hand, can produce her kids' cub scout uniforms. They are nearly 40! We combined 3-4 households when we got together, and there was a LOT of 'too good to pitch' stuff.

I am convinced that a person doesn't see his/her own clutter. My wife can see, and not fail to comment on a piece of paper or unpaid bill on my desk, but don't comment on stacks of clothes in her sewing room that need hemmed, or a button, or other minor operation. Do not mention 5- year old craft catalogs. You just never know what you might NEED to order.

We are not to the 'Buried by Clutter' TV show catagory, but when we emptied out her 95 y.o. dad's place, I filled 6- 12 yard dumpsters. The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

Jim


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 10, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> I'd blame my husband, but sitting here in my office surrounded by stacks of papers and this and that, I realize I have a problem, too. I hired a professional designer to make this beautiful office thinking then I'd be organized and keep it looking nice. It has never looked organized. I just can't seem to figure out where to put stuff that is convenient. I purposely bought a small desk so it couldn't get cluttered. Now stuff just falls on the floor.  I bought a small filing cabinet and put it in the closet so I could close the closet when not in use and hide the "officey" looking stuff such as the printer. However, I can't close the closet door because there is too much stuff piled in front of it.
> 
> Sooooo.....I think a professional organizer could be a wise investment if nothing for the marriage counseling benefit. :hysterical:



I think that a professional organizer might be able to help a lot. Even if your husband doesn't want to organize his stuff, it would be helpful to you to organize your stuff.

It sounds like some of the problem with the office is that it was not designed to be functional, but to be pretty. If you use it much, you may want to reconsider if pretty is worth the cost in terms of inefficiency.

In one of Stephanie Winston's books, she suggested that paper only be handled once. When you pick up the mail, toss it, do it or file it. I am really good at the tossing part. The problem arises when I have something that comes in that is a reminder to make an appointment or a coupon that I want to use. I used to set those down because I don't get home until after office hours are closed. Now, I send my self an email to remind myself to make the appointment and toss the reminder.

The professional organizer had a great place for coupons --- under the floor mat in the car! That way I always have them with me and they are easy to find. I don't do much couponing for groceries, mainly big stuff like Kohl's and Bed Bath and Beyond. The suggestion wouldn't work for someone that uses lots of coupons.

At home, my office WAS junky. I had two roll around open file carts that I stored stuff in, but didn't use. I didn't use it because my eyesight is so bad I couldn't read the tabs. We ended up using our label maker to make large bold tabs that I can now read. 

Ian's dad died 5 years ago. Ian had his dad's power of attorney so he was paying his bills. And he was the executor of his dad's estate. I had all of the estate paperwork including the bills that we paid --- nicely matched up with the cancelled check. That stuff took up inches of space. The statute of limitations on debts in Texas is 4 years and I haven't received a bill since two months after George's death. Those are now gone.

I now have nothing but our insurance documents, tax returns and cds with scans of the supporting records, and some vital records like birth certificates, passports, etc.  It all fits into one cart. And it is usable. It took less than an hour to get the files organized --- I was really surprised at how little time that it took. I had been dreading the file carts most of all.

Once we got the file cart usable. It was easy to clean off the desk. 

At the office, my office manager comes into my office periodically to evaluate how things are working. I have everything that I need within my reach. Even a coaster for my glass of water. 

We had to move things around until we got them "just right." It isn't a pretty office but it really works for me. In fact, it works so well that Ian built me a timer that goes off every 20 minutes to remind me to stand up.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 10, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> I am convinced that a person doesn't see his/her own clutter.
> 
> Jim



I am positive that you are correct about not seeing one's own clutter.

My first husband was a neat freak. But he never saw the newspapers and magazines that he left lying around. But he never failed to comment on the pair of heels that I left near the front door because I would kick them off as soon as I got home. 

Ian and I have a workroom where he works on projects and I do needlepoint. I have a small table (end table from the living room) to keep my stuff on. And, it is messy. I don't have a place for anything except for the table. (And one rolling craft cart where I store future projects).

Ian regularly comments on my mess --- and it is a mess. I have no systems in place. 

On the other hand, in the same room. Ian has 4 shelves that run the length of the room and a workbench that sets perpendicular to the shelves so that everything is in easy reach. He doesn't consider that his shelves are messy. But my table is. 

He says that he knows where all of his tools are. I know where all of my needles, fibers, laying tools, reading glasses are, too. They are all on my table! 

elaine


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## Beaglemom3 (Dec 10, 2013)

Thanks to all for the tips and to the OP who shared the experience of working with an organizer. I have been kicking this around for a long time.

I am, by nature, a sentimental person who finds it hard to let go of things. I have my old Liberty House muumuus from the '70s, my 7th grade report on Pompeii,  my blue ribbon for the 100 yard dash, etc.

Not helping, either, is being the child of parents who went through the Great Depression, I probably copy their saving  ("just in case")behaviors. There have been studies on this that affirm my suspicions.

Anytime that I buy 2 pieces of clothing, I donate at least 3. This is my own version of the law of diminishing returns. It helps.

I like the Flylady philosophy and have tried to use it, but do not follow through. I do, however, keep up with the shiny kitchen sink wisdom.

Will make an appointment with a certified organizer. This thread has been inspiring.

I have come to realize that I don't need a larger house. I need less "stuff". 


-


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## SMHarman (Dec 10, 2013)

ace2000 said:


> That's good to hear!  Everytime I purge, I find out that I miss it later.  However, that's the best way to do it.  We recently went on an organizing spree this past summer.  We put two of these racks in the back of our garage (two of them fit perfectly in the back of our 2-car garage) and then filled them with the bins.  I can't recall how many fit, it was a lot... these really helped us!
> 
> 
> 
> ...





ace2000 said:


> Just to add a little additional information to my previous post...  each shelf on the rack holds 6 storage bins.  We currently have 18 bins on each rack (for a total of 36 bins in the garage).  I guess we could go higher than that on the top.  Mostly just seasonal items and hobby stuff.  These racks are very sturdy and it gives us a ton of storage !!!





glypnirsgirl said:


> My brother-in-law, who longs to live in Hawaii, has started using that concept for deciding whether or not to keep things. He picks it up and asks himself, "will I be willing to pay to move this to Hawaii" --- if it is worth it, he keeps it. Otherwise, away it goes.
> 
> My bonus daughter does something similar by asking herself whether the value of the object is worth the space that it consumes --- she calls it "paying rent." She is a 29 year old professional woman and culled her wardrobe down to about 3 linear feet. I was astounded.



Thats what my UK garage looked like before I tipped most of it in a dumpster (aka Skip) rather than ship it to the US.


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## csxjohn (Dec 10, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> I'd blame my husband, but sitting here in my office surrounded by stacks of papers and this and that, I realize I have a problem, too. I hired a professional designer to make this beautiful office thinking then I'd be organized and keep it looking nice. It has never looked organized. I just can't seem to figure out where to put stuff that is convenient. I purposely bought a small desk so it couldn't get cluttered. Now stuff just falls on the floor.  I bought a small filing cabinet and put it in the closet so I could close the closet when not in use and hide the "officey" looking stuff such as the printer. However, I can't close the closet door because there is too much stuff piled in front of it.
> 
> My bedroom, bathroom, kitchen (except for the table), the living room, etc all look presentable most of the time. But my office and DH's spaces look like the aftermath of explosions.
> 
> ...



Funny post, I know not funny to you but reading it reminds me of reading some of Patrick McManus's stuff.  He's an outdoor comedy writer who talks of the mountains of stuff in the garage.

I think your husband is correct, building the ell won't work, it will just get filled in a short time.

On another note we had a hot tub for quite a few years and for the first couple we kept it going all winter.  I then decided that it's not a good idea in case we have a power outage or equipment failure and started shutting it down after Christmas.

I did have a couple breakdowns of the pump and related safety over rides and was glad it didn't get to happen during the freezing months.  Just something to think about when trying to keep a pool heated up north.


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## Elan (Dec 10, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> Yup. Thanks for shining a light into this closet. Not that it gets too far at our house. When it comes time to get rid of my junk, a pickup load will about cover it. DW, on the other hand, can produce her kids' cub scout uniforms. They are nearly 40! We combined 3-4 households when we got together, and there was a LOT of 'too good to pitch' stuff.
> 
> I am convinced that a person doesn't see his/her own clutter. My wife can see, and not fail to comment on a piece of paper or unpaid bill on my desk, but don't comment on stacks of clothes in her sewing room that need hemmed, or a button, or other minor operation. Do not mention 5- year old craft catalogs. You just never know what you might NEED to order.
> 
> ...



  Some good thoughts here, Jim.  I completely agree with one not seeing their own clutter and the apple not falling far from the tree.  When I visit my in-laws, I can see why my wife doesn't see our house as cluttered.  Relative to how she presumably grew up, it's not.  What really gets me is when her mom comes to our house and tells my wife how nice _*she*_ keeps it!  I'm like, "WTF?".  :hysterical:  

Oh well, it is what it is.  Things could be way worse.


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## Elan (Dec 10, 2013)

csxjohn said:


> I think your husband is correct, building the ell won't work, it will just get filled in a short time.



  Yeah, making room for more stuff typically doesn't work.  We have a 4 car garage.  I had actually started building the foundation of an 8x12 shed to put the odd-sized stuff in (lawn mower, pressure washer, air compressor, table saw, etc).  Then I realized that I just needed to get more organized.  So I spent a weekend putting up shelf brackets and plywood shelving up near the ceiling around the perimeter of the garage.  Bought a bunch of rubbermaid tubs (18 to 30 gallon size) and sorted thru my stuff.  Put a strip of duct tape on each end and on the lid and wrote on the tape with a Sharpie what was in each tub.  Turns out, I didn't need the shed.  Previously, I had a rack and tub system as described above, but it just took up too much floor space.  Having the shelving up high is sometimes a drag, but at least there's room to get around.
I also planked the attic area above the 3rd bay of the garage and put in a pull down ladder.   So we have an attic full of stuff like holiday decor and outdoor toys (sleds, float tube, raft, etc).  Oh, and my 2 spare sets of golf clubs.  :hysterical:


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 10, 2013)

Beaglemom3 said:


> Thanks to all for the tips and to the OP who shared the experience of working with an organizer. I have been kicking this around for a long time.
> 
> I am, by nature, a sentimental person who finds it hard to let go of things. I have my old Liberty House muumuus from the '70s, my 7th grade report on Pompeii,  my blue ribbon for the 100 yard dash, etc.
> 
> ...



George Carlin has a funny (and profane) routine about too much stuff. You can find it here. 

Our organizer told us that we are relatively easy because neither of us has much sentimental attachment to our stuff. Her biggest jobs are those people with sentimental attachments. The decision making process is more difficult because of the emotional attachments. 

One of the things that I have read, and this organizer has reiterated, is that memories are not stuff. She suggests that if something is meaningful to you and you want to remember it that you take a picture of it or log it. That way you honor the memory, but it is taking up much less room. 

Ian had one thing that he is very attached to: a banner from the 1963 March for Jobs and Freedom, His father took him to Washington DC when he was 8 years old to participate in the March. The March is where Martin Luther King gave his "I have a dream" speech. We took the banner and the pin that he saved and had them framed. It is now hanging in the hall with our pictures and our wall sized map and our mask collection. 

For the most part, neither of us has much stuff that is memorable. Almost all of our stuff was useful, but we didn't use it. Some of our stuff we would have liked to use, but we couldn't find it. Most of it was useful, but we just don't do the things that the stuff would have been useful for. 

Almost all of our stuff were just duplicates; things that were related to things that we don't do, but aspire to do; or things that we used to do, but don't do any more.

For instance, I loved the IDEA of scrapbooking, but it was never a high enough priority for me to do it. Realistically, I am never going to scrapbook. So all that stuff is gone. 

I had tons of vegetable seed starting stuff because I used to have a vegetable garden. Two years ago, I dug up the borders and trellises and flattened the area where the garden had been. I just had never gotten rid of the stuff inside. The other lawyer that I work with does garden. He was thrilled to get the heirloom seeds and accouterments that I have carefully stored for years. 

I think that you will be really happy working with an organizer. I interviewed a couple before hiring one. I rejected ones that were too authoritarian because that would not work for our personalities. I rejected ones that seemed to be more focused on appearance than function. And, I rejected those who believed in buying stuff for our stuff. Ian and I both agreed that storage solutions would be the last part of this process. 

I do have one area that is causing me emotional difficulty. It is the area that I wanted to work on first, but the organizer strongly recommended the kitchen. Ian wanted to do the office after the kitchen. I guess I will get to do the project that I wanted to start with next --- it is the project that is causing me emotional difficulty: going through someone else's stuff. 

This summer, one of my friends died. He was single.He had been married one time, briefly. He had no children. I dated him for a few years and we remained friends. I am the executor of his estate. 

He was a single man and had a 5 bedroom house that was full of stuff. I had an estate sale for all of the stuff that was not personal. Before the estate sale, I went through his house and brought home the photos and personal items that I thought that someone might want. I have had his most recent girlfriend over to choose the stuff that she wanted as mementos. Now, I am going to go through and cull a second time to get ready to send stuff to his sisters. They have been very specific about the things that they want. I have a few photographs that I want. Ted's stuff has been my emotional burden. I do not want the stuff and don't want to get rid of it either. I really want someone else to want it. 

Those emotional decisions are by far the hardest. Good luck with yours --- and wish me luck with mine, too.

elaine


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## JudyH (Dec 10, 2013)

You said two things that really struck me.

"Being a horizontal organizer."

"I want someone else to want the stuff."

My current house is a mess because if I put something away I forget about it and if its laying out its on my mind, even if I don't deal with it for years.  I never heard the term horizontal organizer.  I just thought I was sort of ADHD.

Then I kept procrastinating dealing with the clutter until I retired (last June), only rainy days (got to ride my horse!), etc.  

Now we are moving to FL next month.  I am delighted to throw out or give away all this stuff.  My next house will be visitor friendly.

That leads to the other issue.  I don't want to throw out good stuff.  I want someone to want it.  We all know that doesn't happen.  The kids don't want my good china or sterling silver.  Replacements Ltd. offered me next to nothing.  The market fell out for silver.  No one wants the family crystal.  Or old family pictures.  Memories and guilt are bad reasons for hanging on to all this stuff.

Its been hard to find charities to take some nice furniture....they are quite picky.

My big motivator is moving.  Our parents died two years ago.  I was furious at having to clean out and deal with all their stuff.  I never want my kids to have to do this.  So I am really happy about just getting rid of it all.  If I have to repurchase something, so what.

And I do take pictures of things I like, even pictures of big wall paintings or photographs.  Even some of my mom's jewelry before I sold it and got what I really wanted.

Thanks again.


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## Beaglemom3 (Dec 10, 2013)

Elaine,

  This is wonderful insight and guidance. You hit on some key issues with me. 
  Someday my cleaning lady (twice monthly) will be allowed into my office here in "Doubtin' Abbey", but I'll have to get the organizer in there first with me to pare it down. I have an entire filing drawer full of old monthly Schwab, Infinex and Fidelity statements from years past. Ay, yi, yi.

   Thank you.


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## heathpack (Dec 10, 2013)

glypnirsgirl said:


> Ted's stuff has been my emotional burden. I do not want the stuff and don't want to get rid of it either. I really want someone else to want it.
> 
> Those emotional decisions are by far the hardest. Good luck with yours --- and wish me luck with mine, too.
> 
> elaine



This is so true- when my grandfather died, we all went over to help clean out his house and lay claim to stuff that had belonged to him and my grandmother.  They did not have anything valuable, but my whole life they had this very unique (truthfully, awful) lamp.  It was big- three shades on a pole that wedged between the ceiling and floor.  The shades were all yellowed and bleak from years and years of use and they were covered with a this veneer of wood with intricate scrollwork cut out from it.  Really a horrible lamp.  But no one wanted it and that made me sad.  I was a college student in a dorm room and I drove that lamp all the way from New York to North Carolina.  And then what?  My roommates put their feet down and said "no."  I wound up busting it into pieces and putting it out on the curb, which made me even sadder.  Unwanted stuff is a tough thing for some reason.

H


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 10, 2013)

JudyH said:


> You said two things that really struck me.
> 
> "Being a horizontal organizer."
> 
> ...



It will be wonderful to get a fresh start.

Have you started from the other end of the process --- marking the stuff that you want to take with you? 

I think that things might fall into place more easily for you. 

For your nice stuff, you might want to consider a consignment shop if there are any in your area. 

For your nice but used furniture, you might want to contact the YWCA or battered women's shelter to see if they have a program for moving women and children out of a shelter and into a home or apartment. If they do not have to sell or store it, but have an immediate use for it, I am sure that they would be grateful. 

Good luck with your move --- I think that it sounds exciting.

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 10, 2013)

Beaglemom3 said:


> Elaine,
> 
> This is wonderful insight and guidance. You hit on some key issues with me.
> Someday my cleaning lady (twice monthly) will be allowed into my office here in "Doubtin' Abbey", but I'll have to get the organizer in there first with me to pare it down. I have an entire filing drawer full of old monthly Schwab, Infinex and Fidelity statements from years past. Ay, yi, yi.
> ...



Once you start on that financial stuff, it is really fast to go through. I had stacks and stacks of paper on my desk as well as the stuff in the file carts. If I no longer needed it for tax purposes or records, I threw it away or shredded it. I had tons of just crap --- expired coupons, bank and credit card statements that i have not needed for years. 

For investment accounts, you only need those statements where there was a transaction. I can go years without doing a stock transaction --- all you need are the statements with the purchase and the sale. The dividends are sent out in 1099 forms that should be kept with the returns.

It is much easier to toss if you know what you need to keep. 

I wish that I had taken before and after pictures. There is a stunning difference between the two.

Good luck!
elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 10, 2013)

heathpack said:


> This is so true- when my grandfather died, we all went over to help clean out his house and lay claim to stuff that had belonged to him and my grandmother.  They did not have anything valuable, but my whole life they had this very unique (truthfully, awful) lamp.  It was big- three shades on a pole that wedged between the ceiling and floor.  The shades were all yellowed and bleak from years and years of use and they were covered with a this veneer of wood with intricate scrollwork cut out from it.  Really a horrible lamp.  But no one wanted it and that made me sad.  I was a college student in a dorm room and I drove that lamp all the way from New York to North Carolina.  And then what?  My roommates put their feet down and said "no."  I wound up busting it into pieces and putting it out on the curb, which made me even sadder.  Unwanted stuff is a tough thing for some reason.
> 
> H



Unwanted stuff is tough. 

I know that part of the emotional issue is that I wish that he had developed relationships with people that would value his stuff. But he didn't have those relationships. And I can't make him have them retro-actively. 

With the help of this thread, I have decided what to do with this stuff. I am going to scan the pictures and save them --- it doesn't matter that I am not saving them for something. I can save them just because it makes me feel better to have them instead of actually tossing them. Of all things, the thing that has been the hardest for me is his wedding album. His marriage was terribly unhappy. His sisters don't want it because they know that his wife was awful and that neither of them were happy. It isn't a good memory for them. So, why did he still have it??? Because he never got rid of anything. Even something painful. Maybe I can get rid of it after all.

elaine


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## SMHarman (Dec 10, 2013)

Just moved and filed the financial stuff. It went in manilla folders by account by year then 2 years in each bankers box. 
The old ones are stored for 7 years and then shredded. 

I had been dreading this but as you said it went quick and I am enjoying setting up 2014 now!

Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk


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## SMHarman (Dec 10, 2013)

glypnirsgirl said:


> Unwanted stuff is tough.
> 
> I know that part of the emotional issue is that I wish that he had developed relationships with people that would value his stuff. But he didn't have those relationships. And I can't make him have them retro-actively.
> 
> ...



Keep the photos you can put them in a box and send them to scan cafe who do a great job scanning. 

My first marriage was not good but I would like some wedding photos to show my son when he gets older. I don't think my ex is organized enough to be able to still know where they are by then.  Why. It's part of my life story if my kids or grandkids want to hear and see it. 

Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk


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## stmartinfan (Dec 11, 2013)

Some great ideas here.  For me, it's the items with emotional attachments that are the hardest.  My mother grew up without her mother and with very few possessions, so she had emotional attachments to a few keepsakes and items she had gotten from other relatives.  At her death I got some of those, plus some of her things that I remember fondly, like special serving dishes from her delicious holiday meals.  I use them rarely, some aren't in a wonderful condition, and they have no monitory value.  But I still keep them because of the memories.  My kids don't have the same emotional attachment to any of them, so they won't want them, and it's unlikely they'll be of much value to a charity.  but throwing them in the trash seems like such a sad ending for them.  guess I need to figure out if it's easier to move them out all at once or slowly over time.

An idea for people looking to have decent furniture or other items go to someone who will appreciate them is to try Freecycle.  It's a listserve with groups in most major cities.  You can list things you are willing to give away, and people can respond electronically to arrange to pick them up.  Your item just might be what someone'a looking for, if they don't have to pay for it.  We've moved items to new homes that way.


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## talkamotta (Dec 11, 2013)

Im glad others are going through the same thing I am.  

Jeff and I are planning on getting married and bought a house together, we are 60 years old.  We both still have our separate homes that we each  lived in for over 30 years. We raised our families in these houses and both of us are borderline hoarders. Lots of memories, a lot of our adult children prized possessions that they left    Our task can be overwhelming at times.  

Thanks for all the suggestions.


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## SMHarman (Dec 11, 2013)

talkamotta said:


> Im glad others are going through the same thing I am.
> 
> Jeff and I are planning on getting married and bought a house together, we are 60 years old.  We both still have our separate homes that we each  lived in for over 30 years. We raised our families in these houses and both of us are borderline hoarders. Lots of memories, a lot of our adult children prized possessions that they left    Our task can be overwhelming at times.
> 
> Thanks for all the suggestions.



At 60 you should talk with a lawyer or estate planner about marriage to consider how to protect assets from elder care expenses. 

I know 60 year olds getting ' divorces ' for such reasons. 

Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk


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## Ironwood (Dec 11, 2013)

The problem is...we all have too much stuff!  Here's George Carlin from almost 20 years ago, but nothing has changed!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvgN5gCuLac


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## Beaglemom3 (Dec 11, 2013)

Ironwood said:


> The problem is...we all have too much stuff!  Here's George Carlin from almost 20 years ago, but nothing has changed!
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvgN5gCuLac




Enjoyed this.

When you think of how we love our "stuff", one can link the growth in storage unit facilities and container stores  e.g., "The Container Store",  to the maintenance and keeping of our "stuff".

It's a part-time job for some.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 11, 2013)

ace2000 said:


> Just to add a little additional information to my previous post...  each shelf on the rack holds 6 storage bins.  We currently have 18 bins on each rack (for a total of 36 bins in the garage).  I guess we could go higher than that on the top.  Mostly just seasonal items and hobby stuff.  These racks are very sturdy and it gives us a ton of storage !!!



Scott - are the bins stored in 1 or 2 rows on each shelf? 

Does the unit seem sturdy enough to hold heavy stuff?

We have some -20 rated sleeping bags that we don't want to compress too much. And we don't want to leave them in stuff bags because they then become more accessible to rodents and insects. 

I saw that the same company had even larger storage bins. I am just going to have to go to Lowe's and look at these. 

Thanks for the suggestions -

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 11, 2013)

Ironwood said:


> The problem is...we all have too much stuff!  Here's George Carlin from almost 20 years ago, but nothing has changed!
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvgN5gCuLac



Listening to this routine many years ago (when I was still in one of the company ready houses) and reflecting on my mother's mantra from the Immanuel Kant quote, "We are not rich by the things that we possess, but by the things that we can do without." Helped me to live a minimalist life for a really long time. 

It still helps to keep me becoming to acquisitive if I just think, "I don't need a bigger house, I need less stuff."

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 11, 2013)

SMHarman said:


> Keep the photos you can put them in a box and send them to scan cafe who do a great job scanning.
> 
> My first marriage was not good but I would like some wedding photos to show my son when he gets older. I don't think my ex is organized enough to be able to still know where they are by then.  Why. It's part of my life story if my kids or grandkids want to hear and see it.
> 
> Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk



I think that scancafe is a terrific idea. We easily have 14 linear feet of photo albums. 

I find myself storing stuff for my ex-husband as well. 

My mother, after the divorce from my dad, went through our family photo albums and cut him out of all of the pictures. I wasn't about to do that to my child. 

Some of the things that I ran into while going through the office were letters from his dad to him from before we got married, his family pictures, his family home movies. Our son is very sentimental and he will want these things. So I have carried them through 3 separate moves. 

I still have our letters from the years that we were together but living in different cities. Those I am going to go through and cull. I am not going to keep them all --- some of them are too mundane, I am sure.

I put together photos in an old metal file box for my ex-husband so that he would have family photos also. I even indexed them by year. That box is going to be the easiest set of photos to send to scan cafe. All of my photos I have in albums. The index box holds about 3 albums worth of photos.

I love the idea of scancafe. The thought to scanning all of these photos ourselves is a daunting idea.

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 11, 2013)

SMHarman said:


> At 60 you should talk with a lawyer or estate planner about marriage to consider how to protect assets from elder care expenses.
> 
> I know 60 year olds getting ' divorces ' for such reasons.
> 
> Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk



Also important if you both have children from prior relationships. 

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 11, 2013)

talkamotta said:


> Im glad others are going through the same thing I am.
> 
> Jeff and I are planning on getting married and bought a house together, we are 60 years old.  We both still have our separate homes that we each  lived in for over 30 years. We raised our families in these houses and both of us are borderline hoarders. Lots of memories, a lot of our adult children prized possessions that they left    Our task can be overwhelming at times.
> 
> Thanks for all the suggestions.



My parents gave us a deadline for retrieving our personal items. I went and picked up the things that were important to me and pitched the rest. Sometimes our kids just think that even though they may have moved, their stuff still belongs where it is.

If you already have the house, it seems that it would be easier to move the things that you know that you want and then to have an estate sale. Here, there are two companies that specialize in estate sales --- they price things, advertise the sales and split the proceeds. 

I looked into doing this for my friend that died, but they were not interested because the house was in the midst of being remodeled and they believed that it would be too hazardous. 

Good luck on your new marriage! I hope that you are very happy!

elaine


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## SkyBlueWaters (Dec 11, 2013)

This is interesting. What do you do with toys and board games, all mismatched. Throw them out. Been married ten years also and accumulated too much junk. Also, does the $85 per hour include additional manpower? Or is it just one person's consultation and you helping out?


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## SMHarman (Dec 11, 2013)

Beaglemom3 said:


> Enjoyed this.
> 
> When you think of how we love our "stuff", one can link the growth in storage unit facilities and container stores  e.g., "The Container Store",  to the maintenance and keeping of our "stuff".
> 
> It's a part-time job for some.



A great 'grown up' Nik Kershaw track - Stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QiU9wqRgggo

This is a very different Nik Kershaw from the 80s teen hearthrob one, the lyrics on his current albums are awesome.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 11, 2013)

SkyBlueWaters said:


> This is interesting. What do you do with toys and board games, all mismatched. Throw them out. Been married ten years also and accumulated too much junk. Also, does the $85 per hour include additional manpower? Or is it just one person's consultation and you helping out?



Sure, throw those mismatched games and toys and puzzles away. You can't play them, so they have no value.

It is one person's consultation. Does not include additional manpower. And, she doesn't do any of the heavy lifting, we do.

Frankly, she is too expensive for what we need. I think that her fee is almost like that of a psychologist for the emotional support to get through the process. And, she told me that most of her work is the getting through the emotional aspects of getting rid of things. She said that we are much easier then her average client. She is usually dealing with a client who is going through the property of someone who has died --- that is her average client. Helping children whose parents have died and their personal effects are simply overwhelming.

I chose her because her organizing philosophy is very close to my husband's. He is a strong-willed personality and it would not have worked for us to have someone with a different philosophy. 

I found lots of organizers that were in the $20 - $30 hour range. And a few that were more than $100 per hour. 

I am happy with her because we are quickly getting this job done.

elaine


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## puppymommo (Dec 11, 2013)

Timely topic.  Just today I got an email inviting me to participate in a survey about "compulsive hoarding".  (Is there any other kind?)  How did they get my email? LOL.

My dad and stepmother grew up in the depression and were hoarders. My dad mostly with food.  They moved a huge cache of canned goods from California to Texas and then back a number of years later.  Same cans.  My dad would always by the same items whenever he went shopping, no matter what was in the house.   We'd come to visit and find five pounds of butter in the fridge. Now he lives in a one bedroom senior apartment that is not cluttered and he doesn't go food shopping without help.  But I haven't looked in his refrigerator lately. 

I've come to admit that I have that hoarding tendency, too. Part of my problem is that I have emotional attachments to "stuff".  

DH has been working on the basement for about 6 months.  Mostly he won't let me look at what he is pitching.  Don't ask about our garage.


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## Beaglemom3 (Dec 11, 2013)

puppymommo said:


> Timely topic.  Just today I got an email inviting me to participate in a survey about "compulsive hoarding".  (Is there any other kind?)  How did they get my email? LOL.
> 
> My dad and stepmother grew up in the depression and were hoarders. My dad mostly with food.  They moved a huge cache of canned goods from California to Texas and then back a number of years later.  Same cans.  My dad would always by the same items whenever he went shopping, no matter what was in the house.   We'd come to visit and find five pounds of butter in the fridge. Now he lives in a one bedroom senior apartment that is not cluttered and he doesn't go food shopping without help.  But I haven't looked in his refrigerator lately.
> 
> ...



   I think you're my soulmate. 

   This thread has been so motivating that I finally donated my late dog's blankets and toys to our local shelter this morning. We are taking the little settee that two of them were put to sleep on a few years ago to the Weston "take it or leave it" area of the transfer station.


  I don't think I'm a hoarder, but left unchecked, who knows ? I have potential, not for filth/trash/garbage as seen on "Hoarders", but for my "passions". I am a _collector_ of things; real Dedham Pottery, antique ice cream scoops, authentic Shaker furniture (from Skinner's auctioneers) and the like. I am listing these as this is a hobby of sorts, but still, the little house is filling up. We call our house "D & J"s Antique Furniture Emporium". 

 I wonder if accumulating timeshares borders on same ? Meaning, is there a correlation in the acquiring of timeshares on some level ? Just wonderng here.

Funny, though, I am not a mall shopper. Hate to go there and last time I purposely went was to select a nice outfit for my late Mum's funeral (for her).


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## SkyBlueWaters (Dec 11, 2013)

Beaglemom3 said:


> I think you're my soulmate.
> 
> This thread has been so motivating that I finally donated my late dog's blankets and toys to our local shelter this morning. We are taking the little settee that two of them were put to sleep on a few years ago to the Weston "take it or leave it" area of the transfer station.
> 
> ...



I was going to mention about letting go of timeshares...many of us here admit to our obsession with them. I just laugh about it but truly, last time, I tried to add to my stash, i was a feeling a sense of guilt too. I am hoarding timeshares!


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## jackio (Dec 11, 2013)

SkyBlueWaters said:


> I was going to mention about letting go of timeshares...many of us here admit to our obsession with them. I just laugh about it but truly, last time, I tried to add to my stash, i was a feeling a sense of guilt too. I am hoarding timeshares!



The rule in my house (imposed by DH) is: for every one you take in, one you give out.


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## Rose Pink (Dec 11, 2013)

The George Carlin skit about "stuff" reminded me of a conversation I had with my DH several years ago. He travels a lot on business. After the children were grown and gone, I suggested we sell the house and get rid of everything except the clothes, etc we could carry in a suitcase for traveling. Then, I would travel with him. Technically, we would be homeless without a car and much in the way of belongings but we would be staying in nice hotels and driving nice rental cars courtesy of business expenses. If ever there was down time such as a vacation, we could find a timeshare or live off the accumulated hotel points, etc. 

I thought this was a good idea because we could spend more time together and we could save more money if we were careful.

DH said, "you may be able to get rid of your stuff but I need my stuff and I have to have a place to keep my stuff." 

-------------------------------------------------------------------

As for scanning photos, that is a good idea but not if you then get rid of the hard copies. I once met a couple who were so proud of themselves for scanning all their photos, etc onto floppy discs and then tossing the originals.  They seemed clueless that they would be hard-pressed to even find a computer these days that could read a floppy.

Even digital copies degrade over time. You can scan the photo books and have them made into regular books. These will take up less room on a shelf since you aren't saving the paper the photos are mounted to. But no method is foolproof. I would suggest culling the photos and mementos down to the basics (your posterity doesn't want to see 70 photos of each of your birthdays and holidays) that show how you looked as a baby, a child, a young adult, an adult and mature adult. Keep a journal of important events and especially poignant moments. If this is on acid-free paper, it should keep for awhile. Copies can be made if you have lots of descendants. I wish I had journals from my ancestors. Who knows? Maybe they exist but were passed down a different family line. It would be so wonderful to have a few photos and a couple of pages from each of them.


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## Rose Pink (Dec 11, 2013)

Beaglemom3 said:


> ...Anytime that I buy 2 pieces of clothing, I donate at least 3. This is my own version of the law of diminishing returns. It helps.
> 
> -


 
 By my math, you could be naked soon. :hysterical:


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## Rose Pink (Dec 11, 2013)

Elaine, did you say how you began your search for organizers? I remember you said you interviewed several, but where did you start your search?


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## Beaglemom3 (Dec 11, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> By my math, you could be naked soon. :hysterical:





 Eventually, but I have a long way to go.


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## vacationhopeful (Dec 11, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> By my math, you could be naked soon. :hysterical:



Is "naked" not FUN???  So, Beaglemom3, go for it!


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## Beaglemom3 (Dec 11, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> Is "naked" not FUN???  So, Beaglemom3, go for it!



   Last time I came close to this, it was on the beach.

   GreenPeace tried to drag me back into the water.





-


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 12, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> Elaine, did you say how you began your search for organizers? I remember you said you interviewed several, but where did you start your search?



I didn't start out looking for a professional organizer. I started watching YOUTUBE videos on organizing --- there are tons of organizing videos. 

I watched lots of videos trying to figure this out on my own. I think that I first googled organizing a pantry. And watched tons of videos. 

While watching many videos, I ran across this video it is one of my favorites - this woman does not show you the process of organizing, but instead it is a tour of her organized home. I admire her thoroughness, but do not aspire to this level of organization. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0yF0Iz74yQ

At some point, I realized I was watching these videos and people could show me what they had done, but I was not learning the process of organizing. It is when I realized that I really needed professional help. So, I started looking for professional organizers. Again, I just used google. I found two websites that are search sites for professional organizers:

http://www.napodfw.com/ (this still has the dfw tag, but I believe that they are nationwide). NAPO is the most common professional membership that I see. However, they seem to allow their members to just join. 

Whereas CPO is actually a school that teaches organizers and then certifies them. 

http://certifiedprofessionalorganizers.org/cpo-directory.php

And this website is basically an advertising service for organizers - the organizers are not necessarily certified:

http://www.findmyorganizer.com/

And this seems to be a franchise for organizers:

http://www.clutterbusters.com/

This is the website for the organizer that I am using: http://www.melindamassie.com/.

Most of the organizers that I was interested in, I contacted by email first. Melinda, I contacted through her blog. Some of the organizers did not timely respond --- how good could they be. Some of them told me what we were going to do --- not a good sign for being able to work with my husband who strongly believes that he knows what is best for himself and does not want to be told what to do. 

Melinda was great because she wanted us to set our goals. Because I told her that I want the whole house fabulous, she strongly suggested that we start with the kitchen and explained why: easy and relatively fast to do (very little emotional attachments there), immediate results, and getting to benefit immediately and daily from our efforts. She was right. 

We organized the kitchen before Thanksgiving. I baked pies on the day before Thanksgiving. The kitchen was completely clean and everything was put away before I went to bed. So, Thanksgiving, I had a nice clean space to begin heating up our grocery store cooked dinner. Before I went to bed, everything was clean and put away again. And, it has been every night since then.

I can now do two things that I have always aspired to do --- (1) set up a _mise en place_; and (2) clean up while I am cooking. I can do them both because my counters are so clear. 

Good luck!

elaine


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## Beaglemom3 (Dec 12, 2013)

I once did a scholarly paper on change using the 5 stages of change (  http://www.builtlean.com/2010/06/01/5-stages-of-change-model-which-stage-are-you-in/ ) and that has crept back into my thoughts



  So, last night I went here:  http://www.napo-newengland.com/   and found a couple organizers that I will contact today.

  When the student is ready, the teacher will appear.



-


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## momeason (Dec 12, 2013)

jlp879 said:


> I'm glad you had such a good experience with your organizer, she sounds like a real gem.
> 
> For those of you who want to go it alone, you might want to check out the Flylady system.
> 
> ...



I an definitely a SHE living with constant CHAOS. I wish I had the money to hire 
a manager for my home and personal life, I do not have an office..lol.

My son and my daughter..grown..are even worse than me.


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## normab (Dec 12, 2013)

geekette said:


> My mother is hoarderish so I guess she didn't know so couldn't teach me.
> 
> I don't have a problem pitching things but have never figured out how to store things in ways that make sense, are convenient, use the space well, etc.  So I come up with new 'systems' that never work because they aren't convenient or easy or whatever.
> .



So Geekette, I can relate to you as always having been the messy kid.  My mind is super organized but I can't seem to translate it externally.  I have trouble deciding how and where to put things.  AND my mom was an OCD neatfreak, but couldn't teach me how to be neater, so I always feel bad about not being neater, or, at least I WANT to be more organized and feel a bit helpless.

I am currently working on cleaning out 30 years of stuff.  I have considered getting an organizer to help me, but right now I am just hauling lots to several different charities on a weekly basis.  I really think what I need is to learn to organize.  I don't have a problem getting rid of stuff I am not using...


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 14, 2013)

*Where do you store luggage?*

One of the things that both Ian and I have is lots of luggage - we like having lots of bags to choose from. Currently, our two favorite bags and our newest bags (rolling duffels) that we bought for our cruise (so that they would fit under the bed) and our favorite carry-ons (Delsey's) are all in our bedroom. 

Then, the bags we use less often are in the garage. Things get pretty dusty out there so it is less than ideal.

What do you do?


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 14, 2013)

*Something that surprised me ...*

Speaking about emotional attachments:

I thought that I would be able to read and toss almost all of my love letters from my ex-husband. But, I have found that there is very little that I actually want to toss. I am surprised. The parts of the letters that is most interesting to me are not the things about our relationship, but those mundane things:
​how much he spent for breakfast in Hawaii ($2.70 for 2 eggs, bacon, toast, and a slice of papaya);
planning the wedding;
the amount of rent for an apartment in Austin $175 to $200;
how he evaluated where we should live;

One of the reasons that his mother never cared for me much was the fact that she felt like I discouraged him from going to medical school. His mother was a nurse, dad a doctor and they thought that he would become a doctor and join his dad's medical practice in a small town in East Texas. My ex was creeped out by the feel of cotton balls, fainted at the sight of blood, he almost collapsed when a rat that he was anesthetizing for a biology class died. I didn't think that medical school was a good fit for him. The letters mention the emotional turmoil making the decision to not go to medical school was causing him. 

I ended up keeping the whole batch. 

Now I am going through letters from 2 friends, one a friend of mine that was in Saudi Arabia for several years and the other was a women admitted to a Seminary (when that was rare) --- she studied in New York City at the Union Theological Seminary. 

I will probably keep all of the letters --- now working on putting them into sleeves to go into binders.

Just surprised that is how I feel.


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## rickandcindy23 (Dec 14, 2013)

Elaine, I read this thread daily since you started it.  I am a disorganized person who doesn't want to be disorganized.  In my heart, I am organized.  But I cannot do a thing about it.   I try, I really do, but I just have too much stuff, and Rick and I are quite a matched set.  40 years of marriage, and we throw very little of our stuff away.  Between all of our junky places, we are living in only small parts of our house that aren't junky.  Seriously. And my laundry room used to be organized, and it's become a mess in the last six months.  I don't know why.  I have to stop buying things at Costco.  Their packages take up so much room!  

We did clean our son's room a while back so our grandkids could sleep there.  It's a nice quiet and dark room for the little munchkins to get a good night's rest.  That was where our luggage was before, so we moved our luggage to our daughter's old bedroom, which is overflowing with stuff.  When the grandkids get older, I think it would be nice for our granddaughter to sleep in her mommy's old bedroom.  Gotta get it cleaned up first.  That is where all of the photos are.  The dreaded photos and albums, and empty picture frames with expectations of photos.  

I have a serious problem with books, especially literature books from college.  Mark Twain, Shakespeare, and everything in between.  I never read 'em.  Already read them in college.  I was planning to read them again. 

My den has a great closet, and it's full.  The den is pretty nicely organized, as long as you don't look in the closet.  I cannot put stuff on shelves anymore because there is no room, so the middle of the walk-in closet has boxes of paperwork.  I am buried in paperwork.  I don't care about any of it.  The timeshare stuff is a disaster, seriously.  I keep way too much of it.  The deeds are in the safe and not an issue.  

I need to hire my sister-in-law to help me.  She is an organizer.  But she lives in Germantown, OH.  :rofl:


----------



## MuranoJo (Dec 14, 2013)

Elaine,

The video you attached with Alejandra and her super-duper organizational skills was impressive.  This fall I tackled organization of our pantry, the kitchen and our sewing/laundry room.  I must say, our pantry closely resembles Alejandra's and it has been SO nice to do a quick inventory to see what is needed at the store with just one glance.  We also use those lazy susan turntables in just the corners of our pantry, for groupings of things like various oils, condiments, and misc. items which would get lost on the shelves. And I use one on a shelf in the broom closet for cleaning supplies--they're great.

Any major organizational project can seem overwhelming, but I've learned that taking baby steps is a good way to tackle it.  Just organize one shelf, and it's pretty rewarding and a good reinforcement to do another the next day.  (Kind of like the practice of cleaning one area for just 15 minutes a day and tackling another the next day for 15 minutes.)


----------



## glypnirsgirl (Dec 14, 2013)

rickandcindy23 said:


> Elaine, I read this thread daily since you started it.  I am a disorganized person who doesn't want to be disorganized.  In my heart, I am organized.  But I cannot do a thing about it.   I try, I really do, but I just have too much stuff, and Rick and I are quite a matched set.  40 years of marriage, and we throw very little of our stuff away.  Between all of our junky places, we are living in only small parts of our house that aren't junky.  Seriously. And my laundry room used to be organized, and it's become a mess in the last six months.  I don't know why.  I have to stop buying things at Costco.  Their packages take up so much room!
> 
> We did clean our son's room a while back so our grandkids could sleep there.  It's a nice quiet and dark room for the little munchkins to get a good night's rest.  That was where our luggage was before, so we moved our luggage to our daughter's old bedroom, which is overflowing with stuff.  When the grandkids get older, I think it would be nice for our granddaughter to sleep in her mommy's old bedroom.  Gotta get it cleaned up first.  That is where all of the photos are.  The dreaded photos and albums, and empty picture frames with expectations of photos.
> 
> ...



I think that Costco (which I dearly love) is a bane to organization. We have huge bottles of Heinz Ketchup that we bought more than 5 years ago. Same for Jif Peanut Butter. And cases of tuna and chicken. And ... it goes on and on.

The organic fruit there is such a good deal. We realized that with just the two of us, we just cannot eat it before it goes bad -- and I like some variety. 

Making the first pass through paperwork really is fast --- it is a matter of starting. I dreaded the paperwork more than anything, but I went through the non-photo/non-letter papers really quickly. Honestly, it took less than 2 hours total. 

The letters and photos are taking more time, but it is really enjoyable looking at the pictures and reading the letters. 

The office looked good and I wanted to move onto the next room. Ian felt like we weren't done so he insisted that we start dealing with the letters and photos before starting another room. We are not seeing major progress now that we are dealing with those items --- the first pass through (purging) makes the biggest difference.

These are the steps that our organizer has us do:
1. Starting in one corner, working around the room, look at every single thing and ask yourself: (a) Do I use this? (the question is not, "will I use this some day?"); (b) Do I love this? (there are things that we love that we don't use - for me, the most important is my mother's pyrex dish that she made jello and banana pudding in); (c) Is it fabulous? If the object does not fall into one of those categories, out it goes. It can be tossed, donated or marked to be sold. It just cannot be kept. 

I would add a fourth question, "do I have to keep this document for legal or financial reasons (tax documents, deeds, vital records)?" 

When you have a limited number of choices, making decisions is easier. Flylady has a great system for doing this also -- and the questions are very similar. 

Then she has rules about what NOT to do: (1) Do not pull everything out at once, go through the space item by item; (2) Do not jump around, progress systematically through each room; (3) Once you have made a decision to get those items out of the house, get them out: do not let the boxes or bags linger. Each box that we filled for Goodwill got taped shut and put in the car. Once the car was full, we drove it to Goodwill. If Goodwill was closed, we still loaded it into the car so that it could be donated on the way to work. Each trash bag got closed and set into the garage for trash day. This was the first step and made a HUGE difference. And, it is the fastest. 

The second step is to gather like with like. The reason to do that is so that you have a place for everything that you can tell by looking where something goes. For instance, we have all of our bake ware together. Rolling pins, loaf pans, cake pans, pie plates, cookie sheets, sifters - it takes up very little room because we can stack stuff in one another. And, it is obvious where stuff goes. Before, I really didn't know where something went so it was likely to end up anywhere. 

Starting was the hardest part. 

Flylady has you start in what she calls baby steps. It really is an excellent website. 

I believe that stuff weighs on our souls. I don't believe that we were made to be materialistic: we are spiritual beings. I feel freer with less stuff.

You have the power to do something about it. You CAN do it, you did it with your son's room. 

Good luck!

elaine


----------



## glypnirsgirl (Dec 15, 2013)

Beaglemom3 said:


> I once did a scholarly paper on change using the 5 stages of change (  http://www.builtlean.com/2010/06/01/5-stages-of-change-model-which-stage-are-you-in/ ) and that has crept back into my thoughts
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Really liked the 5 stages of change --- 

the NAPONE site is terrific --- did you click on any of the links? Are the conferences just for the professional organizers or for people looking to get organized?


----------



## glypnirsgirl (Dec 15, 2013)

muranojo said:


> Elaine,
> 
> The video you attached with Alejandra and her super-duper organizational skills was impressive.  This fall I tackled organization of our pantry, the kitchen and our sewing/laundry room.  I must say, our pantry closely resembles Alejandra's and it has been SO nice to do a quick inventory to see what is needed at the store with just one glance.  We also use those lazy susan turntables in just the corners of our pantry, for groupings of things like various oils, condiments, and misc. items which would get lost on the shelves. And I use one on a shelf in the broom closet for cleaning supplies--they're great.
> 
> Any major organizational project can seem overwhelming, but I've learned that taking baby steps is a good way to tackle it.  Just organize one shelf, and it's pretty rewarding and a good reinforcement to do another the next day.  (Kind of like the practice of cleaning one area for just 15 minutes a day and tackling another the next day for 15 minutes.)



WOW! That is terrific!


----------



## laurac260 (Dec 15, 2013)

This is definitely an interesting thread.  I cannot imagine paying someone to help me organize my stuff.  Now, paying someone to keep the stuff out of my house in the first place though….  

My "issue" is all the crap that MUST come in, that I have no interest in.  I DON'T want a letter from capital one, asking me what's in my wallet?  every day.  I DON'T want catalogues (I know you exist, and I know how to find you on the web, stop sending me paper catalogues).  Junk mail drives me batty.

I also don't need to have every scrap of paper that my adorable little one generates in school, to come home.  I don't need a flyer every time the baseball team, cub scouts, etc, etc, etc, decides to have a meeting, or whatever.  Between school, kids activities, charitable organizations, the list goes on, and on, and on, and on, everybody "wants something".  Wants money, wants me to fill out a permission slip, wants me to read this, do this, watch this, emails, phone calls, voice mails, ENOUGH ALREADY!   No, I don't need an organizer.  I need a personal assistant.


----------



## Patri (Dec 15, 2013)

Elaine, can you believe how popular and meaningful this thread is? Who would have guessed. I was already in the organizing mood, but this has inspired me to keep going. Yesterday, I went through a couple boxes that had not been opened since we moved into this house 8 years ago. I found places to put some things, threw some, will donate rest. 

Also went through binders of managerial material of DH's job from years ago. He has switched careers and will never need the info again. (Plus everything is on the Internet these days). At first he wanted me to keep it all. Finally realized all he really needed were the binders for current projects. The binders were on floor under pool table, or on boxes in store room. I told him we didn't build this large house so his stuff could be under the pool table. Some of it dated to 1991!

I will tackle more this afternoon. I am determined! And really, just working on it for a short time is enough. The progress is evident.


----------



## glypnirsgirl (Dec 15, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> The George Carlin skit about "stuff" reminded me of a conversation I had with my DH several years ago. He travels a lot on business. After the children were grown and gone, I suggested we sell the house and get rid of everything except the clothes, etc we could carry in a suitcase for traveling. Then, I would travel with him. Technically, we would be homeless without a car and much in the way of belongings but we would be staying in nice hotels and driving nice rental cars courtesy of business expenses. If ever there was down time such as a vacation, we could find a timeshare or live off the accumulated hotel points, etc.
> 
> I thought this was a good idea because we could spend more time together and we could save more money if we were careful.
> 
> DH said, "you may be able to get rid of your stuff but I need my stuff and I have to have a place to keep my stuff."



To me, your idea seems terrific! Even better that the basic expenses for car rental and hotels would be paid for by the business. It is the essence of full time time-sharing with someone else footing part of the bill --- and you aren't limited to timeshare destinations.

I wanted to try full time time-sharing when Ian and I retire. He, who used to dream of full time RVing in a Sportsmobile (a Ford F350 outfitted as a mobile home on 4 wheel drive platform - we are talking small! 

He wasn't interested in full-timing in timeshares -- the locations are too limited. 

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 15, 2013)

puppymommo said:


> Timely topic.  Just today I got an email inviting me to participate in a survey about "compulsive hoarding".  (Is there any other kind?)  How did they get my email? LOL.
> 
> My dad and stepmother grew up in the depression and were hoarders. My dad mostly with food.  They moved a huge cache of canned goods from California to Texas and then back a number of years later.  Same cans.  My dad would always by the same items whenever he went shopping, no matter what was in the house.   We'd come to visit and find five pounds of butter in the fridge. Now he lives in a one bedroom senior apartment that is not cluttered and he doesn't go food shopping without help.  But I haven't looked in his refrigerator lately.
> 
> ...



That is a strange survey topic!!!

It took my sister, working by herself, three days to go sort, donate, pack and ship my mother's belongings. This included going through photos and letters. Everything that we kept fit into the trunk of my sister's 1999 Grand Marquis. She really was a minimalist. (One of the biggest insults that she would bestow upon people was to call them a consumer).

On the other hand, my father and stepmother both grew up during the depression. They have too much stuff. Every time my brother goes to visit, my dad asks for his help building another storage building. They are up to 6!!!  And they have a fully loaded attic and basement. 

I was about 12 when they first got married, I was going through the refrigerator and cleaning it out. The refrigerator was so packed, that you couldn't find things. And there were many things that were WAY past their prime. My stepmother came home and looked in the trash. She left the moldy things there. But, the 8 months past its expiration mayonnaise and salad dressings were picked out and put back into the refrigerator. 

It is understandable to me that people might want to keep something that they "might need." It is unfathomable to me to keep something that no one in their right mind would ever use or consume.

My sister and brother and I agree that we are hiring dumpsters to start on their job. My brother says that those storage buildings mainly hold stuff that should have been thrown out. Only one has grills and seasonal items like patio chairs. The other 5 all have crap in them.

When I visit, there is not even enough room for new groceries. And the stuff in the fridge isn't edible. There is no counter space for preparing food for cooking. I am thankful that they live within 30 minutes of Seaside so I can rent a timeshare and have them over --- when I go to visit them!

On top of all that, my dad regularly has guests over. His answer is to cook outside. Then he doesn't have to mess with the kitchen. 

elaine


----------



## glypnirsgirl (Dec 15, 2013)

laurac260 said:


> This is definitely an interesting thread.  I cannot imagine paying someone to help me organize my stuff.  Now, paying someone to keep the stuff out of my house in the first place though….
> 
> My "issue" is all the crap that MUST come in, that I have no interest in.  I DON'T want a letter from capital one, asking me what's in my wallet?  every day.  I DON'T want catalogues (I know you exist, and I know how to find you on the web, stop sending me paper catalogues).  Junk mail drives me batty.
> 
> I also don't need to have every scrap of paper that my adorable little one generates in school, to come home.  I don't need a flyer every time the baseball team, cub scouts, etc, etc, etc, decides to have a meeting, or whatever.  Between school, kids activities, charitable organizations, the list goes on, and on, and on, and on, everybody "wants something".  Wants money, wants me to fill out a permission slip, wants me to read this, do this, watch this, emails, phone calls, voice mails, ENOUGH ALREADY!   No, I don't need an organizer.  I need a personal assistant.



Hi Laura - You are similar to the way my mom was. My sister and I knew better than to bring things home: no projects, no papers, just report cards. If something required a permission slip, we just didn't go: it simply wasn't worth the wrath of bringing something home --- it doesn't sound like you are that extreme. 

So. for the kids stuff, you can train the kids not to bring those things home. 

There are solutions for junk mail. This is a great piece:

http://voices.yahoo.com/how-stop-junk-mail-being-delivered-your-4074459.html

Hope it helps!

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 15, 2013)

Patri said:


> Elaine, can you believe how popular and meaningful this thread is? Who would have guessed. I was already in the organizing mood, but this has inspired me to keep going. Yesterday, I went through a couple boxes that had not been opened since we moved into this house 8 years ago. I found places to put some things, threw some, will donate rest.
> 
> Also went through binders of managerial material of DH's job from years ago. He has switched careers and will never need the info again. (Plus everything is on the Internet these days). At first he wanted me to keep it all. Finally realized all he really needed were the binders for current projects. The binders were on floor under pool table, or on boxes in store room. I told him we didn't build this large house so his stuff could be under the pool table. Some of it dated to 1991!
> 
> I will tackle more this afternoon. I am determined! And really, just working on it for a short time is enough. The progress is evident.



I am a little surprised.

I hope it has been helpful. It has been helpful to me to write about it. 

I have been a little side tracked by buying, wrapping and boxing Christmas presents. My goal is to have the Christmas presents finished this afternoon so we can put the paper, bows and boxes away. 

And get back to organizing the office.

elaine


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## laurac260 (Dec 15, 2013)

glypnirsgirl said:


> Hi Laura - You are similar to the way my mom was. My sister and I knew better than to bring things home: no projects, no papers, just report cards. If something required a permission slip, we just didn't go: it simply wasn't worth the wrath of bringing something home --- it doesn't sound like you are that extreme.
> 
> So. for the kids stuff, you can train the kids not to bring those things home.
> 
> ...



Yes, I will definitely check out that link.  No, I'm not "extreme".  I just need to be more (gasp!) organized about the way I manage the stuff that does come in.  If the kids bring something home that requires my signature, I _should_ just fill it out and be done with it, as soon as it comes, right?


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## SMHarman (Dec 15, 2013)

laurac260 said:


> Yes, I will definitely check out that link.  No, I'm not "extreme".  I just need to be more (gasp!) organized about the way I manage the stuff that does come in.  If the kids bring something home that requires my signature, I _should_ just fill it out and be done with it, as soon as it comes, right?



That's the trash or action or file process with any piece of paper. 

Pretty good at trash
Ok at action
File goes in a holding pile and actually gets filed properly every 6 m or so. 

Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk


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## rickandcindy23 (Dec 16, 2013)

I talked with my sister about this thread, and she has a much older friend who is removing a large trash bag of stuff from her home every Saturday.  She goes through various rooms and finds items she never uses, and she bags them up and takes them to Salvation Army.  One bag at a time doesn't sound fast enough to me.   I would have to set my goal to four or five bags a week.  

Speaking of Costco, the cleaning supplies are taking up a lot of room in the laundry cupboards.  Why do I have so much toilet bowl cleaner, Swiffer wet cloths, and cans of glass cleaner and pledge?  Everything comes in quantities of 3-5 bottles/ cans/ boxes.  I don't have room.  I don't use enough of any of those items to warrant this much supply.  And the boxes of trash bags are a problem too. I have huge boxes of both kitchen and lawn bags under the sink.  

Bath and Body Works needs to stop having sales.  I cannot resist.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 16, 2013)

rickandcindy23 said:


> I talked with my sister about this thread, and she has a much older friend who is removing a large trash bag of stuff from her home every Saturday.  She goes through various rooms and finds items she never uses, and she bags them up and takes them to Salvation Army.  One bag at a time doesn't sound fast enough to me.   I would have to set my goal to four or five bags a week.
> 
> Speaking of Costco, the cleaning supplies are taking up a lot of room in the laundry cupboards.  Why do I have so much toilet bowl cleaner, Swiffer wet cloths, and cans of glass cleaner and pledge?  Everything comes in quantities of 3-5 bottles/ cans/ boxes.  I don't have room.  I don't use enough of any of those items to warrant this much supply.  And the boxes of trash bags are a problem too. I have huge boxes of both kitchen and lawn bags under the sink.
> 
> Bath and Body Works needs to stop having sales.  I cannot resist.



Cindy, your sister's friend would SEE the difference if she was systematically going through her home room by room rather than randomly picking things up. Still, even doing it randomly is better than not doing it at all.

And, I love Costco, but I agree. There is a reason that I have 5 year old ketchup and grape jelly. We don't use either one very often. We still shop there, but only for the more "normal" sized things: rotisserie chicken, pre-made salads, and some of their lunch meat items (they carry a large selection of nitrite and nitrate free lunch meat). No more multiple bottles of anything!

elaine


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## Rose Pink (Dec 16, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> ....
> 
> DH and I can't agree on some areas of the house. There is now a huge Precor elliptical machine in the guest room because I wanted it out of the living room. The bedside cabinets are now crammed into the closet and the bed pushed against the wall. It was once a nice guest room but is now ugly all because of a piece of gym equipment. I wanted to clean out the garage and turn it into a home gym but DH says no. I can't even get into the garage without mountain climbing equipment and letting someone know to come find me if I don't make it back out. DH says he can only organize it with DS #1's help. DS#1 lives in Italy and won't be back for a few years. (And the last time he tried to help, he passed out with a seizure--never had one before or since--and had to be taken by ambulance to the ER.)
> 
> ...





csxjohn said:


> Funny post, I know not funny to you but reading it reminds me of reading some of Patrick McManus's stuff. He's an outdoor comedy writer who talks of the mountains of stuff in the garage.
> 
> I think your husband is correct, building the ell won't work, it will just get filled in a short time.





Elan said:


> Yeah, making room for more stuff typically doesn't work. We have a 4 car garage. I had actually started building the foundation of an 8x12 shed to put the odd-sized stuff in (lawn mower, pressure washer, air compressor, table saw, etc). Then I realized that I just needed to get more organized. So I spent a weekend putting up shelf brackets and plywood shelving up near the ceiling around the perimeter of the garage. Bought a bunch of rubbermaid tubs (18 to 30 gallon size) and sorted thru my stuff. Put a strip of duct tape on each end and on the lid and wrote on the tape with a Sharpie what was in each tub. Turns out, I didn't need the shed. Previously, I had a rack and tub system as described above, but it just took up too much floor space. Having the shelving up high is sometimes a drag, but at least there's room to get around.
> I also planked the attic area above the 3rd bay of the garage and put in a pull down ladder. So we have an attic full of stuff like holiday decor and outdoor toys (sleds, float tube, raft, etc). Oh, and my 2 spare sets of golf clubs. :hysterical:



I don't know, guys. I'm pretty sure I _need_ one of these. If you build it, I will exercise. Just look at the view! http://www.houzz.com/photos/1818322/Colorado-Contemporary-traditional-home-gym-omaha

As for the garage, I have decided to leave that space entirely to my DH. Next summer I am having a side yard wall built that will be just deep enough (about 24 inches total) to enclose my garden equipment like shovels and rakes. That way, I won't have to venture into the garage. If you can envision something like this except the niche would be a gate between the front yard and the side yard. From the front (street view) it will just look like a garden wall/fence. And the doors on the private side yard would open to reveal a single row of garden tools. Nothing deep that would just invite more clutter. http://www.houzz.com/photos/50424/shwa-mediterranean-patio-portland

------------------------------

DH's father and mother were hoarders. My FIL had a small room in his basement filled with hardware including hundreds of small bottles filled with various types of screws, nails, fasteners and odds and ends. He had these jars bolted to wooden straps on the ceiling. Basically, he bolted the lid to the strap and then could just screw the bottle to the lid. It kept everything off the small counter space (except for all the other equipment he had on the horizontal surfaces). He even had some jars attached to a round drum that he could spin to locate the jar he was looking for. It was a clever system IF a person has a need for all that stuff. Some of it was probably from DH's grandfather who reupholstered furniture (or something). Some of it was airplane hardware as my FIL was an airplane mechanic. So, there are decades and decades of accumulated nuts and bolts and whatnots that no one ever used and GUESS WHAT!!!! It's all in my garage now. DH works now and then when he has time (and when the mood strikes him) to attach the hundreds of jars to our garage ceiling. 
Of course, being below freezing this time of year, nothing is being done on that project. It's cold as a glacier here and that is how fast our projects move along. In fact, we get so bored with one project that we move onto something else before the previous ones get done. Still waiting to get backsplash tile on the kitchen we remodeled almost three years ago. 

I can't blame DH for all of the delay. I have my own inertia which brings us back around to hiring an organizer.

Elaine, thank you for the links and for starting this thread. We have had similar threads on TUG in years past (one even started by me, I think) but it seems to be a perennial and universal problem for folks. 

When I had a professional designer design my office, my DS posted on FB that it would be just like all my other office spaces and be cluttered and useless. I hadn't realized how true that was until he pointed it out.  IOW, I just moved my office to another room rather than clean up the mess.

And, yes, I did go for pretty rather than practical as, at this point in my life, pretty is very crucial to my mental state. I don't need project space in my office. Just a place to pay bills, have my books (which aren't many these days) and some pretty pictures of flowers and my family. I also have a tiny electric baby grand piano (when I say baby grand, that is the shape but it is much, much smaller than an actual baby grand). After we remodeled the living/dining space, there was no room for it and I thought it would look pretty in my office--much prettier than more shelves or filing cabinets. I play it maybe once every five years for about five minutes. But I can't seem to get rid of it. 

The problem in my office is the stacks of professional magazines, etc that clutter the floor _everywhere_! I don't know if a professional organizer can help me with that. I just need to start purging them. I am no longer working and I don't need them and I don't read them. I just haven't gotten rid of them because I _might_ read them. 

Maybe if I clean up my own space, I will be able to have a clear conscience when I tackle the basement and DH's need for storage there. I figure if he gets the entire garage to himself, I should be able to have a pretty house. 
Clap if you agree.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 16, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> I don't know, guys. I'm pretty sure I _need_ one of these. If you build it, I will exercise. Just look at the view! http://www.houzz.com/photos/1818322/Colorado-Contemporary-traditional-home-gym-omaha



I might exercise with that view. Stunning!



> I can't blame DH for all of the delay. I have my own inertia which brings us back around to hiring an organizer.


I understand inertia --- and it can be debilitating when beginning a task which is overwhelming.



> Elaine, thank you for the links and for starting this thread. We have had similar threads on TUG in years past (one even started by me, I think) but it seems to be a perennial and universal problem for folks.


 I would have liked to talk to ANYONE who had hired a professional organizer before going for it. I could not find anyone that had used one. It was my desire to know what working with one was like that motivated me to start the thread.



> When I had a professional designer design my office, my DS posted on FB that it would be just like all my other office spaces and be cluttered and useless. I hadn't realized how true that was until he pointed it out.  IOW, I just moved my office to another room rather than clean up the mess.
> 
> And, yes, I did go for pretty rather than practical as, at this point in my life, pretty is very crucial to my mental state. I don't need project space in my office. Just a place to pay bills, have my books (which aren't many these days) and some pretty pictures of flowers and my family. I also have a tiny electric baby grand piano (when I say baby grand, that is the shape but it is much, much smaller than an actual baby grand). After we remodeled the living/dining space, there was no room for it and I thought it would look pretty in my office--much prettier than more shelves or filing cabinets. I play it maybe once every five years for about five minutes. But I can't seem to get rid of it.



If your office is pretty and it is meeting your needs, you don't have a problem. If you want to read those magazines, it isn't a problem. It is only a problem if you aren't getting what you want from your space. 

I personally don't think that accumulate stuff have a problem unless it isn't meeting their needs. 

I think that my mother wasn't meeting her children's needs by keeping our house as stripped down as it was. And my brother is just like her. During our last sibling trip, my brother's partner wanted to buy a sweater that looked really good on him. My brother completely nixed the idea --- takes up too much space, don't need it, etc. It was like hearing my mother word for word.




> The problem in my office is the stacks of professional magazines, etc that clutter the floor _everywhere_! I don't know if a professional organizer can help me with that. I just need to start purging them. I am no longer working and I don't need them and I don't read them. I just haven't gotten rid of them because I _might_ read them.



I don't think that you need an organizer for that. Some day, you will either decide to read them or you will decide that you aren't ever going to read them. 

I had the same problem with my scrapbooking supplies. One time, I made one page of a scrapbook. That was more than 10 years ago. The supplies weren't in my way. They were in the closet in my guest room. And, they were completely organized. Ready at a moment's notice for me to scrapbook. I donated them when I realized that I wasn't ever going to do it. We weren't even working on the guest room. I just decided that it was something I wasn't ever going to do.



> Maybe if I clean up my own space, I will be able to have a clear conscience when I tackle the basement and DH's need for storage there. I figure if he gets the entire garage to himself, I should be able to have a pretty house.
> Clap if you agree.



Couldn't find a clapper - I hope this counts: :whoopie:

elaine


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## Jestjoan (Dec 17, 2013)

*DIY Organizing*

Get Organized and The Container Store are participating in the 2013 Free Shipping Day. There may be others...........


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## Rose Pink (Dec 17, 2013)

Yesterday I started on my office. It will take a long time but already I see progress. I find it is easy to throw stuff in the recycle bin or for charity but 1/3 of the stuff I need to address in some way by filing or taking other action. That is the hard part. That is why the stuff was on the floor in the first place--I didn't want to attend to it at the time (or was waiting for further info). 

However, now I am doing something about it!  Nothing like being accountable to a group of friendly strangers on the internet. :hysterical:

Thanks, y'all! 


 (*And*, I am doing this with a cold and food poisoning at the same time.)
 (PS, if you get a cold, try the Puffs brand tissues with the Vicks in them.  So much nicer than smearing the sticky goo under your nose.  I put a tissue on my pillow and it really helped last night.)


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## Sandi Bo (Dec 17, 2013)

Thanks SO much for this thread.  The information is great, and very timely for me.   I have just started purging and the information here is more than helpful and well as inspirational.  

As "one of those" who wants to see SOMEONE use something rather than throw it away, any suggestions on what to do with old text books or a set of encyclopedias?  What about about all these old computer disks and VHS tapes? Are they of value to anyone or do they do to go in a dumpster?


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 17, 2013)

Jestjoan said:


> Get Organized and The Container Store are participating in the 2013 Free Shipping Day. There may be others...........



Right on time! Tomorrow is free shipping day. I have been a Container Store fan since they opened the very first store on Royal Lane in Dallas. I have elfa storage units in BROWN --- they only made it in brown for the first two years that it was out. Love Container Store. 

I have never heard of Get Organized ... want to see what that looks like.

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 17, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> However, now I am doing something about it!  Nothing like being accountable to a group of friendly strangers on the internet. :hysterical:
> 
> Thanks, y'all!
> 
> ...



Woo Hoo! That deserves a cheer!

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 17, 2013)

Sandi Bo said:


> Thanks SO much for this thread.  The information is great, and very timely for me.   I have just started purging and the information here is more than helpful and well as inspirational.
> 
> As "one of those" who wants to see SOMEONE use something rather than throw it away, any suggestions on what to do with old text books or a set of encyclopedias?  What about about all these old computer disks and VHS tapes? Are they of value to anyone or do they do to go in a dumpster?



Here there are some organizations that will accept books and tapes for a gigantic book sale --- our local library does and so does our Jewish Community Center. 

I donated those things because it seems sinful to throw books away. Even without emotional attachments, books are difficult to me.

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 17, 2013)

*True confession time*

My husband who is an avid camper decided 6 months ago that we would probably not camp any more. Last year, we spent $2000 on camping equipment. We went camping 4 times --- and had some great trips. 

It turns out that he thinks that I am too high maintenance to camp with. I don't just want a tent and sleeping bags. But nice thick pads, cots to raise the sleeping bags off the ground. I love cooking over a camp fire. I made home made biscuits, beef stroganoff with noodles, etc. He just felt like it was too much work. 

Of all things, I am the one who has resisted getting rid of the camping equipment. I really prefer timeshares, but I was willing to camp.

It seems like a loss to give up the idea of camping. But, I know if Ian doesn't want to do it, we won't. We had two more trips scheduled that he cancelled. Those are the only trips he has ever cancelled. 

So, next thing to go will be camping equipment. 

Tomorrow the organizer meets with just me. We are going to work on my needlework. I am interested in her ideas.

elaine


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## Rose Pink (Dec 18, 2013)

glypnirsgirl said:


> It seems like a loss to give up the idea of camping. But, I know if Ian doesn't want to do it, we won't. We had two more trips scheduled that he cancelled. Those are the only trips he has ever cancelled.
> 
> So, next thing to go will be camping equipment.
> 
> elaine


Consider finding a way to store a minimal amount of it such as sleeping bags and a few cooking supplies.  You never know when you  might need them for emergencies.  We don't camp but have organized (still needs more work) an emergency closet if we need to go to a shelter or stay in the yard.  Natural disasters occur everywhere and you may not be able to stay in your home if an earthquake or tornado damages it.  You may be able to "camp" on your property if there are no downed power lines, etc.  

 Our first choice would be to go to a hotel, of course, but they may be filled with other evacuees or, if the bridges are out, we wouldn't be able to drive out of our neighborhood.  We'd have to walk with only what we could carry.

 I am not a doomsday prepper (referring to the other thread) but have been taught that in the event of an emergency it can take first responders three days or more to get to you.  Hospitals, schools, etc are their first priority.  You need to have at least a 72-hour kit and then more if you have room for it.  You can check the CERT and FEMA websites.  If the disaster is widespread, the hotels (if they are still standing) and the shelters will fill up fast.  

 So, you may not have to give up your camping gear if you can find another use for it.


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## Rose Pink (Dec 18, 2013)

glypnirsgirl said:


> I have been a Container Store fan since they opened the very first store on Royal Lane in Dallas.
> 
> elaine



I've been there! Loved that store but I was only visiting Dallas while DH was on a business trip and couldn't take it all home with me.

We don't have one in Utah. We have IKEA and my local Smith's Marketplace has some storage bins I like but I'd love to have the variety of The Container Store. Shopping on-line just isn't the same as being able to see, feel, and examine a product in a brick and mortar store.


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## Rose Pink (Dec 18, 2013)

Sandi Bo said:


> Thanks SO much for this thread. The information is great, and very timely for me. I have just started purging and the information here is more than helpful and well as inspirational.
> 
> As "one of those" who wants to see SOMEONE use something rather than throw it away, any suggestions on what to do with old text books or a set of encyclopedias? What about about all these old computer disks and VHS tapes? Are they of value to anyone or do they do to go in a dumpster?



If you don't mind having something repurposed, some crafters use books to make lovely keepsake boxes or use the printed paper in other craft projects. There isn't much use for old encyclopedias with more updated info on the internet. You can try donating them to your library or to a thrift store before throwing them in the trash. At the very least, throw them in the recycling bin.

http://www.pinterest.com/MaryannWohlwend/repurposing-books/

We had a Savers Store open a few miles from us. It is basically a second-hand store. We laughed when we saw shelves of old 8-track tapes. Some outlets will take just about anything, so you could try that.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 19, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> Consider finding a way to store a minimal amount of it such as sleeping bags and a few cooking supplies.  You never know when you  might need them for emergencies.  We don't camp but have organized (still needs more work) an emergency closet if we need to go to a shelter or stay in the yard.  Natural disasters occur everywhere and you may not be able to stay in your home if an earthquake or tornado damages it.  You may be able to "camp" on your property if there are no downed power lines, etc.
> 
> Our first choice would be to go to a hotel, of course, but they may be filled with other evacuees or, if the bridges are out, we wouldn't be able to drive out of our neighborhood.  We'd have to walk with only what we could carry.
> 
> ...



Excellent idea!  We have an emergency preparedness closet. Ian's goal is to have a one year supply of food. Ian figures that we will be responsible for sustaining about 12 people so we really only have a 30 day supply of food. We also have some basic gardening equipment and a seed supply of heirloom food. We bought ours on ebay 2 years ago. These seeds we keep in the emergency closet, not with the gardening supplies. http://www.ebay.com/itm/SUSTAINABLE...057?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ac3120181. 

After reading this, I asked Ian where he was planning on staying if the house got destroyed by a tornado and our roads became impassable. (My office was destroyed by a tornado in 2000 --- been there, done that, think I'll pass next time). The tent really is comfortable. The cots with pads and a sleeping bag are comfortable for several nights sleep. Using your idea, I asked him if it wouldn't be a good idea to keep the equipment for emergencies rather than for camping. He is considering it.

He has wanted a solar oven. And a generator. He was never planning on getting rid of the camping stove because it is an integral part of our emergency preparedness. 

He is considering the camping equipment as emergency equipment. Time will tell what he decides. 

Thanks for the great suggestion!

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 19, 2013)

*Third meeting with the PO*

Ian had an appointment this morning and was unable to meet with Melinda. He asked that we work on my needlework supplies while he was gone. 

I had been brainstorming with him about different ways to organize my supplies. He suggested that we consider this system from the Container Store: http://www.containerstore.com/shop/...s/whatsNEWfromelfa?productId=10034968&N=81177 - it is a relatively new container store product. 

He had told me that he thought this was a great solution. I showed it to Melinda, and Melinda agreed. I let Ian know that Melinda thought that it was a good solution. He said, "hold on, don't go too crazy, don't go buy anything. Now, Ian thinks that we need to find a different solution.  --- In the mean time, for the first time, I have pulled stuff out and gathered it together in anticipating getting the peg board. Now everything is sitting and waiting on the dining room table. 

Today was the first time, since working with Melinda, that we ended up in the "things will get worse before they get better" category. We had been warned that it can happen. 

I am not going to be able to get this stuff organized before we leave for the holidays. Which means we will come back to a mess. 

I always clean house before leaving. But, I have had two big emergencies develop today and I will spend the next few days dealing with those, not organizing needlework supplies.   I am aggravated because I really wanted the public areas of the house to be really tidy before the holidays.

Not a happy camper!

elaine


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## Patri (Dec 19, 2013)

glypnirsgirl said:


> He is considering the camping equipment as emergency equipment. Time will tell what he decides.
> elaine



If he keeps it, tell him you have to test the equipment at least once a year. Then you can schedule a camping trip!


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 19, 2013)

Patri said:


> If he keeps it, tell him you have to test the equipment at least once a year. Then you can schedule a camping trip!



The ironic thing about this is that Ian is the one that loves to camp. I am a willing camper, but I don't really love it. I like it. 

Both of us grew up camping. My mom was a great camper and we had lots of good camping trips. But, when we were camping, we lived in places where great camping is a short drive away - Denver, Colorado (Rocky National Park), Visalia, CA (Yosemite), Everett, WA (too many to list). 

From where we live, the nearest good camping is 5 hours away. And the weather for camping is not reliable. It is more often TOO hot or TOO cold. 

I just feel like we are 5 years away from retiring and I would like to take cross-country trips, using the camping as a way of "bridging" from one timeshare to the other. It took us awhile to get the right gear together to be really comfortable. 

This is still a work in progress. Back to work to deal with these emergencies.

elaine


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## pjrose (Dec 19, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> If you don't mind having something repurposed, some crafters use books to make lovely keepsake boxes or use the printed paper in other craft projects. There isn't much use for old encyclopedias with more updated info on the internet. You can try donating them to your library or to a thrift store before throwing them in the trash. . . .



In Scouts my son cut the middle out of an old book to make a hidden compartment.  The books were supplied by the scoutmaster, so that was fine.  

I had a very collectible Apple Mac game in a case designed to look like a book, with the disk in a cut-out cubby inside. 

http://folklore.org/StoryView.py?pr...characters=Steve Capps&sortOrder=Sort by Date

my son took it and cut the inside into a bigger opening, hence destroying same .  It cost him about $50 in saved allowance to get me a replacement on eBay; the ones that occasionally appear on eBay now go for $300 or more.  

Before getting rid of any books, especially dictionaries or encyclopedias, look for money flattened between the pages, under "D" for dollar, "c" for cash, "m" for money, and so forth


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 20, 2013)

*My surprise!*

Because Ian and I are going to visit Jordan and Rose for the holidays, we decided to exchange gifts tonight. 

It turns out that the reason he didn't want me to go crazy buying the container store peg boards is because he had bought them for me for Christmas --- that and a flipnfold. I am really happy with my gifts.

I was able to get the emergencies taken care of ... and all of my needlework neatly put away. We will be leaving the house nice and tidy after all.

I got him a new Ipad air. I bought this for him back the first part of November. I had it delivered to the office, wrapped it and the accessories, separately. Then I put them all into a big box and wrapped the big box. I knew he would be able to guess if I had left it in the original boxes. So, his present has been all wrapped and he has been looking at it for weeks. 

He left his on a plane last year and has missed it ever since. So, last week he says, "I want to replace my ipad before our trip."  I said, "Don't you dare, we are too broke." I think that he guessed at that point, but didn't say anything. 

He does this regularly to me.

Hope your holidays are festive and bright!

elaine


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## pjrose (Dec 21, 2013)

What thoughtful presents!  I rarely have such brainstorms.....

Have a great time visiting Rose and Jordan!


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## ronandjoan (Dec 25, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> By my math, you could be naked soon. :hysterical:



Love this!
This thread is GREAT!!

Merry Christmas everyone, but be careful how many presents you get=more stuff!!


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## ronandjoan (Dec 25, 2013)

glypnirsgirl said:


> He wasn't interested in full-timing in timeshares -- the locations are too limited.
> 
> elaine



It depends on where you want to go!!

But he's right if , for example, you want to go to the Midwest... Very frustrating when most of DH relatives are where there are NO timeshares.  However I have enjoyed the condo life more than I think I would have the RV life we used to talk about ... Seems easier, larger living areas, etc


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 28, 2013)

ronandjoan said:


> It depends on where you want to go!!
> 
> But he's right if , for example, you want to go to the Midwest... Very frustrating when most of DH relatives are where there are NO timeshares.  However I have enjoyed the condo life more than I think I would have the RV life we used to talk about ... Seems easier, larger living areas, etc



Thanks, Joan1

One of the great things about where my son and daughter in law live is that it is very convenient for timeshares --- they live In Newport News, VA right between Virginia Beach and Williamsburg. We have always been successful booking a Getaway. And, until this stay at Williamsburg Plantation, the beds are better than at their apartment.

We aren't so lucky with the other 2 --- Columbus OH and Wilmington DE. It is surprising to me for such a small state how long a drive it is from the Delaware shore resorts to Wilmington but it is too far to commute. And there is nothing in Columbus,

I have been encouraging Ian to read your blog, but he is somewhat stubborn. We are still at least 6 years from retirement. 

I am so glad that y'all are still enjoying your adventure.

elaine


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## UWSurfer (Dec 28, 2013)

I can't say our home is organized yet, nor is it drop-in company ready either, but I can say that the initial fly lady habits I began have been largely adhered to for the past three weeks and three large boxes of documents and other stuff which have been bouncing around the house are now gone through.

Of those boxes, probably 85% of the contents were thrown away once I went through them...largely documents and things from anywhere from 4 - 24 years old and most of it unnecessary.  The remaining 15% has been filed away or otherwise dealt with.  One item of interest to me was a tax return from 1990 which provided a glimpse of our life when our oldest was two and my wife was pregnant with twins while we lived as caretakers in another family members home.   So many things happened around that time which tee'd up many of life's adventures to come!   That said, the tax return and supporting documents were promptly shredded!!!


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 28, 2013)

UWSurfer said:


> I can't say our home is organized yet, nor is it drop-in company ready either, but I can say that the initial fly lady habits I began have been largely adhered to for the past three weeks and three large boxes of documents and other stuff which have been bouncing around the house are now gone through.
> 
> Of those boxes, probably 85% of the contents were thrown away once I went through them...largely documents and things from anywhere from 4 - 24 years old and most of it unnecessary.  The remaining 15% has been filed away or otherwise dealt with.  One item of interest to me was a tax return from 1990 which provided a glimpse of our life when our oldest was two and my wife was pregnant with twins while we lived as caretakers in another family members home.   So many things happened around that time which tee'd up many of life's adventures to come!   That said, the tax return and supporting documents were promptly shredded!!!



Sounds like you are making great headway.

I like those glimpses into my past life. I decided to ask my son if he is interested in the letters between his dad and I. I was a little surprised that he is interested. 

One of the realizations that I have had is that I will need to "translate" them. My son can't read cursive. 

Ian bought archival sheet protectors and albums for me to transfer them to. They arrived yesterday. 

All of our "office stuff" is now in the office. Last night, for the first time in a long time, I used my desk to write the checks for bills. Most of our bills I have on autopay. The few that I still hand write, I had been writing on the dining table because there wasn't room for writing on my desk. It was nice to be able to find all those things that I need: pen, checks, stamps, all in one place and easy to access. 

Also, we returned from visiting my son and daughter-in-law last night. I was completely unpacked and the luggage was put away --- in the first 30 minutes of arrival. I just wanted the house to stay clean and organized. It is highly motivating to me.

elaine


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## JudyH (Dec 28, 2013)

As we purge the house to move, I have given much of the furniture to Restore, and found a junk guy to take the piano (needs thousands of $$ of repairs), old w/d, projection tv which works but no one wants it and a few other things.

We have thrown out so much in those hugh green bags.

In the new house, I am going to organize just like the woman in those videos.

I am so happy my children didn't have to do this all for us.


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## glypnirsgirl (Dec 28, 2013)

JudyH said:


> As we purge the house to move, I have given much of the furniture to Restore, and found a junk guy to take the piano (needs thousands of $$ of repairs), old w/d, projection tv which works but no one wants it and a few other things.
> 
> We have thrown out so much in those hugh green bags.
> 
> ...



I am so happy for you ... and your children, too. 

I think that you have made great choices on freeing yourself from your possessions.

Just in case someone is interested in restore and can't find it, here is the website:
http://www.habitat.org/restores/

Another great organization for nice used clothing is dress for success --- a non-profit that helps women transition back into the workforce. This is their website: http://www.dressforsuccess.org/supportdfs_donate.aspx

I remember ages ago someone talking about how comfortable timeshares are and they have so few of our possessions in them. I am not trying for that minimalist, but close. 

Happy purging! What a great way to start the New Year. 

elaine


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## Rose Pink (Jan 1, 2014)

Here are some links on downsizing from Houzz.com that appeared in my e-mail today. 
http://www.houzz.com/ideabooks/6079745/list/7-Tips-to-Get-With-a-New-Minimalist-Mentality

http://www.houzz.com/ideabooks/7448442/list/4-Obstacles-to-Decluttering-----and-How-to-Beat-Them

http://www.houzz.com/ideabooks/2120...gn=u414&utm_medium=email&utm_content=gallery3

There are some good tips and questions to ask oneself--especially resonating with me is the concept of holding on to something out of obligation.
May we all be more organized in 2014.


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## JudyH (Jan 1, 2014)

Rose, the above link gave a good suggestion what to do with photo albums, which are piled up in a room cause I couldn't decide.  The first 40 years album.  I might end up taking them all with me, we move in 2 weeks, but definately will downsize to this idea.

I think I have given away 800 books, most hardbacked, most I paid full price for.  I don't miss them yet.  I kept the ones I read over and over, the cookbooks I love and use, and 4 copy paper cartons of books I haven't read yet.

We also drank a lot of wine, but still managed to move over 100 bottles


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 2, 2014)

Rose - Those are great links! I read several of the links from the links as well. All were helpful. 

For Christmas, Ian gave me the Elfa pegboard system that I wanted. I do lovely needlework and it is something I truly enjoy doing. 

Over this past weekend, Ian installed the system for me with a few of the bins, shelves and hooks that are available for using the system. He had me work using it for a couple of days and then we decided what worked and what didn't and we have refined it. At this point, it is perfect for my current project - Beth Russell's Lion . The lion is the biggest project that I have ever worked on - it is about 30" x 24" and it is based on a William Morris tapestry. William Morris is one of the founders of the arts and crafts movement --- and he is quoted in one of the links that Rose included (“Have nothing in your house you do not know to be useful or believe to be beautiful.”). The space is now so well organized that I can sit down for just a few minutes and work on my project and come back to it later. I don't have to sort through a bunch of stuff and gather my tools together --- they are right there ready to be put to use. It is liberating to be able to do just a little of something and then be able to put it down (without making a mess) and come right back to it without having to set up my workstation. So much more efficient than the messy table that I had been using and much prettier, too.

I, too, love the 40 years album idea. 

Very helpful!

elaine


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## Rose Pink (Jan 10, 2014)

*Sentimental items*

Here is another link about handling items we feel guilty getting rid of but don't know what to do with.  My favorite line is "weird voodoo guilt."  :hysterical:

http://www.houzz.com/ideabooks/2124...gn=u418&utm_medium=email&utm_content=gallery7


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## Rose Pink (Jan 20, 2014)

I had another organizing article come through my inbox.  Again, it is from Houzz.  Some of the info we've heard before but I need reminders and sometimes someone says something old in a new way that resonates with me.  One line I liked was in the comments section:

 "I read this concept recently: the rule of attribution makes us give more value to what we already own.. just because we own it. So a good question when purging: if I didn't already own it, would I buy it? That has helped me decide to let go of things I did not want or need but for some reason was still holding."

 I think that "rule of attribution" is why we want other people to want our stuff and feel offended or disappointed as if, when they reject our stuff, we feel like they are rejecting us.
 ---------------------------------------------------------------------

 Another idea from the article that I had not though of before is the idea of giving old linens and towels to pet shelters.  They don't even have to be in pristine condition.  The dogs and cats don't care.  They just need something soft to sleep on or get shampooed and dried with.

 I also liked the "rule of three" for bedding which is one set for on the bed, one for the wash, and a spare in the drawer.

 The article talks about defining a space for a set of items and not allowing them to outgrow the space.  For example, once your china hutch is full, you don't allow more dishes into your home without getting rid of some of what you already have.  Works for clothes, dishes, toys, etc.  You define how much space certain items get and then keep them corralled to that space.

 I also got a laugh out of one couple's arrangement.  She is a person who wants her house to be clean, uncluttered and company-ready.  Her husband is a pack rat who can't bear to get rid of his stuff.  The house is always kept to her standards as is the driveway and patio that can be seen from the street and from the house.  But there is a divider behind the patio that blocks from the house the garage and a part of the driveway.  That is the husband's domain.  He can keep as many greasy, junky things as he wants in and around the garage because no one goes there and no one has to see it.  This was in the readers' comments section. 


http://www.houzz.com/ideabooks/2220...n=u423&utm_medium=email&utm_content=gallery14


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## Rose Pink (Jan 20, 2014)

I am still working on my office clean-up but have lost some steam. I am happy to report, though, that I have actually been able to find the floor and clean the dust off the piano. This is huge. (Well, the piano is not huge, but cleaning all the dust off it was.)

What I am stuck on now is the amount of accumulated reading. I got rid of most of it but I still have a sack full of things to read and it takes me forever to get through it. I'm thinking of getting rid of most of that, too. What goes around comes around and I will most likely run into these recipes and health and financial articles again.

I'm just so tired. It takes me an hour to read just a few pages so the going is so slow.

I am trying to clean up this office so that I can begin to tackle the much bigger job of organizing the family history and scrap booking boxes. I think there are 11 or 12 or more of banker boxes filed with photos, family trees, journals, slides (that is going to cost a pretty penny to get those converted to photos or digital media) and various other things. These boxes just get moved from one area to another. Currently, they are in the kitchen under and around the table (we don't eat there) and in sight of the front door. Not good but I am not moving them into another corner somewhere. They will stay there until they are properly organized into something that can be proudly put on a shelf in book form or scanned into the computer.


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## pjrose (Jan 20, 2014)

Great ideas! 



Rose Pink said:


> . . .
> 
> ". . .  if I didn't already own it, would I buy it? That has helped me decide to let go of things I did not want or need but for some reason was still holding."
> 
> ...


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## MuranoJo (Jan 20, 2014)

Rose Pink said:


> ....Another idea from the article that I had not though of before is the idea of giving old linens and towels to pet shelters.  They don't even have to be in pristine condition.  The dogs and cats don't care.  They just need something soft to sleep on or get shampooed and dried with.
> 
> I also liked the "rule of three" for bedding which is one set for on the bed, one for the wash, and a spare in the drawer.



Great additional ideas, Rose!
I also love the idea of giving linens to pet shelters.  I've been doing this with older blankets, and the shelter seems to love getting them.  Hadn't thought of giving them towels, but will do so in the future.

Rule of three for bedding is another great one.  In fact, you could probably get away with a rule of two...one clean and one on the bed.  I cleaned out our linen closet some time ago and contributed quite a few never-used sheets to goodwill.


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 21, 2014)

Last night, Ian looked over at our bookshelves and told me, "those old love letters are taking up a whole shelf." The idea that either of us could look over at our formerly packed shelves and tell what is on them at a glance is revolutionary.

We have been working on the office for weeks --- and it still isn't perfect. We are down to letters and photos to cull and organize. Books are done. Periodicals are done. 

The realization that I can find any information that I want on the internet has made that much easier ... we just got rid of things that we found were available, except for those things that we actually enjoy or prefer in book form. 

For me, the irreplaceable books were my art books (the main thing that I buy as a souvenir when we travel) and gardening books. The reference works that I still use are cook books and travel books. Even though those are available on the internet, we chose to keep them. 

Almost every novel is gone. We checked to see if it is available on Kindle and if it is, we tossed it. Ian had every book ever written by Mercedes Lackey and WEB Griffin. I had Patricia Cornwell, John Grisham, Harlan Coban and a few others. All now are gone. 

We still have 14 linear feet of photo albums. And those old love letters. Other than that, we are finished in the office.  

Ian set up my part of our workroom for my Christmas present. He is still working on his work area. I have moved onto our master bedroom. I found three different Christmas presents that I had lost in the clutter. I actually mailed them to their intended recipients --- I hate mailing packages. The gifts were out of here within a day or two of their discovery --- that was a victory in self discipline. 

We still have lots to go: master bedroom, both bathrooms, the garage, then outside to our patio. 

We have had some unexpected benefits of this process. In organizing the kitchen and pantry, I became much more aware of what I cook. I have lost 10 pounds since November. We don't eat out nearly as much. We used to eat out four to five times per week. We now eat out on Saturday mornings. And occasionally on a weekend night. Never during the week. It is easier to come home and cook than it is to go out. That is revolutionary for us.

Our food bill has gone from $1200 per month to about $500 --- that savings is almost enough to pay for the organizer!

elaine


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## ace2000 (Jan 21, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> ...that savings is almost enough to pay for the organizer!
> 
> elaine



I love keeping up with this thread!  Congrats Elaine!


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## Rose Pink (Jan 21, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> Last night, Ian looked over at our bookshelves and told me, "those old love letters are taking up a whole shelf." The idea that either of us could look over at our formerly packed shelves and tell what is on them at a glance is revolutionary.


It's wonderful to know what we have.  And I think that your love letters take up an entire shelf is wonderful!  We don't have any love letters to speak of.



glypnirsgirl said:


> We have been working on the office for weeks --- and it still isn't perfect.


Eh, what does perfect mean anyway?  Perfection is overrated. 



glypnirsgirl said:


> The realization that I can find any information that I want on the internet has made that much easier ...


You've just inspired me to get rid of some gardening books and magazines!



glypnirsgirl said:


> For me, the irreplaceable books were my art books (the main thing that I buy as a souvenir when we travel) and *gardening books*.


Oh.  Guess not. 




glypnirsgirl said:


> We still have 14 linear feet of photo albums. And those old love letters. Other than that, we are finished in the office.


I have two feet per child of their photo albums.  I will have more linear feet of my own life after I finish going through all of those banker boxes I previously referred to.  I don't feel any guilt or need to reduce this, though.  To me, reducing the bankers boxes down to linear feet will be a huge accomplishment.



glypnirsgirl said:


> I found three different Christmas presents that I had lost in the clutter. I actually mailed them to their intended recipients --- I hate mailing packages. The gifts were out of here within a day or two of their discovery --- that was a victory in self discipline.


What a nice surprise for the recipients!



glypnirsgirl said:


> We have had some unexpected benefits of this process. In organizing the kitchen and pantry, I became much more aware of what I cook. I have lost 10 pounds since November. We don't eat out nearly as much. We used to eat out four to five times per week. We now eat out on Saturday mornings. And occasionally on a weekend night. Never during the week. It is easier to come home and cook than it is to go out. That is revolutionary for us.
> 
> Our food bill has gone from $1200 per month to about $500 --- that savings is almost enough to pay for the organizer!
> 
> elaine


That is fantastic!  I've also started cooking from our cupboards and freezer.  Can't say I've lost any weight  but I'm working on it.  I am also trying to save money by not eating out so I can have more $$ for home and yard projects. 

Elaine, this thread has been an inspiration to me and a much needed kick in the pants.  Thank you from the bottom of my heart.


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 21, 2014)

Rose Pink said:


> Eh, what does perfect mean anyway?  Perfection is overrated.



LOL! --- I agree. Right now, I am striving for pretty. Functional was relatively easy. Pretty is much more difficult.



Rose Pink said:


> You've just inspired me to get rid of some gardening books and magazines!



I got rid of the magazines. It is the books that I have problems with. I like having "paper" because I can carry it out to the yard with me. At least, that was my justification.



Rose Pink said:


> Oh.  Guess not. .



Choose your battles! I love yard work. Until this house, I have always had flower beds that I changed seasonally. The landscaping here is bare bones at best. I need SOMETHING to inspire me. 




Rose Pink said:


> Elaine, this thread has been an inspiration to me and a much needed kick in the pants.  Thank you from the bottom of my heart.



I am so glad. It has been a fun thread for me. 

elaine


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## pjrose (Jan 21, 2014)

ace2000 said:


> I love keeping up with this thread!  Congrats Elaine!





Rose Pink said:


> . . .
> 
> Elaine, this thread has been an inspiration to me and a much needed kick in the pants.  Thank you from the bottom of my heart.



Same here!  You've REALLY caught my attention with the cooking/eating-out/weight loss part.

We have the problem of too much storage space - three large attics, three big store rooms, and a huge garage - and they're all full.  Not full to the point of hoarding, but let's just say that if you need it, we've got it and probably a spare as well.  We know what's where.  What we lack is the discipline to pick an area and work on it.


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## Patri (Jan 21, 2014)

Because of today's snowstorm, I am spending the afternoon going through linen closets. The art dept. of a local college put out the word it needs rags, towels etc. for its clean-up projects. I hate to throw things in the landfill, and have too many ratty linens. I am getting a box full of cloth to give them. We will all be happy.


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## VegasBella (Jan 21, 2014)

We recently hired a professional organizer too. Our issue was tons of clutter accumulated after 6 years. We hired her for multiple days and worked ALL DAY LONG for those days. It was utterly exhausting but so worth it! We took 5 car loads to Goodwill and there's still stuff in the garage to go out. We filled 6 trash cans full of trash too. And 2 bins of recycling.

Now, we have very few books (made from trees - plenty still on ereaders). All my clothes finally fit in my dresser or in the closet. The shoes are keep out of sight. And most of my son's toys are organized. Finally. 

We still have work to do. And there were things she did that don't make sense to me (she filed a lot of paperwork and I will have to redo that because I don't like it). But overall it was really good. It is liberating to get rid of stuff.

Now we have a new rule: the exchange. Whenever we bring in something new (other than food) we have to remove something from the house. They don't have to be similar items, just one for one.


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## MuranoJo (Jan 22, 2014)

VegasBella said:


> Now we have a new rule: the exchange. Whenever we bring in something new (other than food) we have to remove something from the house. They don't have to be similar items, just one for one.



This is the one thing I wish I could convince DH to adopt.  Unfortunately--and this runs in his family--everything is sentimental or may be needed in the future, and he has a hard time tossing or giving anything away.  The one exception is old clothing he no longer fits.  I am tempted to hire a pro organizer and move him/her on to other family members when they're done with us.  Sad thing is, I know what to do--but maybe he'd listen to someone from the outside.

Here's the 'real' issue for me:  What the heck would either of us do with the other's collections should something happen to one of us?  Who needs that on top of the grief?  I shudder to think what will happen when his mom passes.


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## Rose Pink (Jan 22, 2014)

VegasBella said:


> Now we have a new rule: the exchange. Whenever we bring in something new (other than food) we have to remove something from the house. *They don't have to be similar items, just one for one*.


I like that!  I think I was stuck in the similar items routine.  Sometimes you can have one category pared down with room to spare but can't bring in a similar item as there is nothing you need to part with---sooo---getting rid of something from a different category works and can start a cascade in that category, too.  Like this very much.  It freed me from thinking inside the box.



muranojo said:


> This is the one thing I wish I could convince DH to adopt. Unfortunately--and this runs in his family--everything is sentimental or may be needed in the future, and he has a hard time tossing or giving anything away. The one exception is old clothing he no longer fits. I am tempted to hire a pro organizer and move him/her on to other family members when they're done with us. Sad thing is, I know what to do--but maybe he'd listen to someone from the outside.
> 
> Here's the 'real' issue for me: What the heck would either of us do with the other's collections should something happen to one of us? Who needs that on top of the grief? I shudder to think what will happen when his mom passes.


 DH's excess and clutter irks me, too, so I often remind myself that my areas need work.  I am taking this year to work on my issues (meaning my office and that pile of boxes in the kitchen filled with pictures and who-knows-what).  Then I can have a clear conscious to nudge DH.  He holds onto a lot of stuff that he "might" need for his work such as old manuals for products that are no longer made but that some clients may still have and the new guys don't know how to fix/manage.  When he retires, that stuff will go.  

 Also, my DD lives with us now that she is out of grad school and trying to pay off the debts from said education.  She loves books and checks out stacks at a time from the library as well as buys dozens from the used book shelf.  She does not get rid of any so all these books are being added to her collection.  She just bought two new bookshelves.  She and DH share the large room in the basement as office space.  It also contains my pilates reformer but it is difficult to get to it because of all the other stuff.  The room has narrow aisles through all the office furniture, etc.  I don't even try to clean that room anymore.  It's hard to dust clutter and maneuver a vacuum cleaner in tight spaces.  So, I just don't worry about it.  

 This summer I am having a new "fence" built between my front and side yards.  From the street it will look like any other garden wall.  From the private side yard it will have doors that open to a narrow (about one foot deep) storage area where I can hang my garden tools.  Then I will not have to enter the garage, either.  The garage is filled with all sorts of stuff DH has gathered but hasn't had the time to organize.  He and DS#1 work together to clean the garage now and then but DS has been in Italy for almost two years and it may be another before he comes to visit us.  In the meantime, I just don't worry about DH's stuff in the basement or the garage.  I just decided to "give" him those large spaces and  stay away from them.

 I feel much more at peace now that I have decided to work on my mess/projects and his are confined to areas where I do not have to tread.  The only other area is our bedroom.  If you are ever in an airport or hotel and see a balding guy with a HUGE suitcase, that is him.  When he is home, said suitcase rests, open, on top of a card table that DH sets up in our bedroom.  When he is out of town, I put the card table away in a closet.  As long as I make the bed and keep the rest of the room clean, I can live with the large suitcase/table set-up when he is home.  If I start to get upset, I remind myself that his work pays the bills and gives us perks such as FF miles and hotel stays and rental cars.  I can live with one area of the bedroom looking less than pristine.

 As to the death of a spouse, that is so painful to even think about and yet we must.  It happens.  DH and I have a long way to go.  He brings in the income and I manage it.  He wouldn't know how to pay the bills if something happened to me and I would be hard-pressed to manage financially if something happened to him.  Yes, we have insurance but it will only go so far.  I just hope it doesn't happen for a good long, long, long time.  This year I am trying to do my share by getting the paperwork organized, including all those boxes.  And... by crafting advanced directives (they all know what I want but it needs to be on paper and notarized).  

 There are always so many projects to do and here I sit typing away on TUG.  :hysterical:


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 22, 2014)

Earlier in the thread, we talked about being blind to one's own clutter. And it is absolutely true. 

The office was a mutual clutter zone. Ian thought that the workroom - where he does projects and I do needlework - was all my clutter. It took us about 2 hours to sort through and organize all of my projects, supplies, tools and paraphernalia. It took another hour to put up the elfa utility boards to make everything accessible. Completely finished in three hours.

After I organized my work space --- and he hung the elfa for me as part of my Christmas present, I was finished with my stuff in the workroom.

Last week while the organizer was here, I went on to the master bedroom to work without her. Last week, the organizer and Ian still worked on his part of the workroom. And he spent all week working on it. It has taken him more than 20 hours to organize his side of the workroom -- and now it is done and it looks great. (So great that the organizer took pictures of how he had set up the space. It was the first time that she has taken pictures in our house. Ian asked if she had taken "before" pictures --- she said it had not been bad enough to take before pictures --- but the workroom was so good looking and well organized, that she wanted pictures of it. Ian was proud of the work that he had done and rightly so).

Now, Ian is in the mode of working on his stuff. Today, while the organizer was here, he wanted to work on the garage. And, instead of me working on the master bedroom --- which we both recognize is my stuff --- he wanted me to help make decisions about my stuff in the garage. 

So, for the last two hours, while the organizer was here, I was in the garage waiting to make a decision. We have now made the first purge pass on one half of the garage. When they started on the garage, I went to work on the master bedroom. Ian said, "Sweetie, I need you to stay here to make decisions." So, I did. 

During that time, we came to 3 things that belong to me that we kept exactly where they were: a dive bag (for packing my scuba gear), 2 suitcases. One thing of mine that we gave to Goodwill: a hammock chair. And one thing that we moved: a container of Maxicrop (a liquid fertilizer that got moved to the other gardening stuff --- which is on the other side of the garage). 

Ian honestly believed that I had as much stuff in the garage as he did. Not even close to true! On the other side, I have a bike, a rack of gardening equipment and two shelves of gardening "stuff." And I know he thinks that more than half of the other side is my stuff, too.

The master bedroom was and is almost all my stuff ... and it isn't done. Because I am working on the garage. 

The organizer is great for keeping us on task. Because she gives us homework, we are making terrific progress. We spend more time working on our own than we do with her. And she is a good arbitrator or mediator. ... which just made me realize that there was some more stuff in the garage that belongs to me: a stack of empty buckets that the pool chlorine comes in. I save these for future gardening projects. When I elected to keep them instead of recycling them, Melinda had me make a deadline for myself as to when I would use them by (I chose April 30th) ... so now I am committed to getting rid of them if I don't use them.

Even though Ian and I are both blind (or at least near-sighted) to our own clutter, by dealing with each and every thing, we are making terrific progress. Before, Ian wanted to work on the organizing himself which meant getting rid of my stuff. With the organizer, he has to work on his stuff, too. 

After the garage (mostly Ian's) and the patio (a toss-up), the rest of the spaces that we will be working on will almost all be my stuff: guest bath, master bath, and master bedroom. 

I think that we have about 6 more weeks of work.

What has been amazing has been the fact that we have been able to keep everything together --- no backsliding.

elaine


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## Beaglemom3 (Jan 22, 2014)

This is such a wonderful thread.

  I have to say that one thing that one of the "take aways" for me is that sometimes our "internal clutter" or feelings of "inward disarray -being at continuous loose ends" mirrors our external clutter, at least for me.

  The more centered I am, the more effective I am in tossing sentimental items.

This thread has helped me to see this more clearly.




-


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## Rose Pink (Jan 22, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> ...stuff in the garage that belongs to me: a stack of empty buckets that the pool chlorine comes in. I save these for future gardening projects. When I elected to keep them instead of recycling them, Melinda had me make* a deadline for myself as to when I would use them by (I chose April 30th) ... so now I am committed to getting rid of them if I don't use them.
> 
> *



Oh, I like the deadline idea, too.  Thanks!


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## Rose Pink (Jan 22, 2014)

Beaglemom3 said:


> This is such a wonderful thread.
> 
> I have to say that one thing that one of the "take aways" for me is that sometimes our "internal clutter" or feelings of "inward disarray -being at continuous loose ends" mirrors our external clutter, at least for me.
> 
> ...



Yes, and the more externally organized I am helps with the internal organization as well.  For me, they seem to go hand in hand and I'm not always sure which one came first.  Generally, it is easier for me to work on external clutter such as cleaning my desk off and then I can "see" more clearly how to address the internal chaos.  It may work more the other way for some.  For me, doing the physical helps organize the mental probably because I have to focus the mental in order to get the external accomplished.  And now off to work on cleaning the living/dining room.


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## Elan (Jan 22, 2014)

Anyone else experience this?  I find myself being less organized than I typically would be, because when I walk into an area that my wife and I share (say master bath or WIC), I look at my area and think "Even if my stuff was perfectly organized, this area would still look like sh*t because of her stuff."  In other words, we've collectively gotten ourselves into somewhat of a downward spiral.


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## ace2000 (Jan 22, 2014)

Elan said:


> Anyone else experience this?  I find myself being less organized than I typically would be, because when I walk into an area that my wife and I share (say master bath or WIC), I look at my area and think "Even if my stuff was perfectly organized, this area would still look like sh*t because of her stuff."  In other words, we've collectively gotten ourselves into somewhat of a downward spiral.



TUG post of the day!


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 22, 2014)

Beaglemom3 said:


> I have to say that one thing that one of the "take aways" for me is that _sometimes our "internal clutter" or feelings of "inward disarray -being at continuous loose ends" mirrors our external clutter, _at least for me.
> 
> The more centered I am, the more effective I am in tossing sentimental items.
> 
> ...



I think that this is so true! I think that it getting the external stuff under control helped me to get the internal stuff under control. And vice versa. It is a virtuous circle.


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 22, 2014)

Rose Pink said:


> Oh, I like the deadline idea, too.  Thanks!



I liked it, too. 

I am giving myself my own internal deadline on some of my clothes that I really like, but never wear. I still held onto several suits leftover from my trial attorney days that I really like. I am afraid that I will need one of them (for some reason --- we don't do jury trials in federal court much). One of those suits I haven't worn since Ann Richards was governor --- but it is my favorite! 

I have told myself if I don't wear it by April 1st, it is going. 

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 22, 2014)

Elan said:


> Anyone else experience this?  I find myself being less organized than I typically would be, because when I walk into an area that my wife and I share (say master bath or WIC), I look at my area and think "Even if my stuff was perfectly organized, this area would still look like sh*t because of her stuff."  In other words, we've collectively gotten ourselves into somewhat of a downward spiral.



Oh, yeah! Ian and I both had this problem. We are probably equally messy/equally neat. But, because we saw the other person's clutter but not our own, we each got messier. That was the downward spiral.


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 22, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> I liked it, too.
> 
> I am giving myself my own internal deadline on some of my clothes that I really like, but never wear. I still held onto several suits leftover from my trial attorney days that I really like. I am afraid that I will need one of them (for some reason --- we don't do jury trials in federal court much). One of those suits I haven't worn since Ann Richards was governor --- but it is my favorite!
> 
> ...



OMG! I just looked up when she was governor --- 1990 to 1995! That suit is going now!


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## pjrose (Jan 22, 2014)

*When clutter becomes hoarding...*



glypnirsgirl said:


> . . .  I still held onto several suits leftover from my trial attorney days that I really like. I am afraid that I will need one of them (for some reason --- we don't do jury trials in federal court much). One of those suits I haven't worn since Ann Richards was governor --- but it is my favorite!
> 
> . . .





glypnirsgirl said:


> OMG! I just looked up when she was governor --- 1990 to 1995! That suit is going now!



Someone I know well is a hoarder.  Maybe not as much as a TV-show hoarder, but still can't get rid of anything, and seems oblivious to it.  Just one example: said person has Pendleton and Harris tweed suits from the 40s through 60s that belonged to someone else, that will never fit, but that are supposedly worth something.  Add to that various silk cocktail dresses made by dressmakers, and so forth.  These are just the tip of the iceberg. 

Said person's (SP) only offspring has been offered pretty much the contents of the large old house to sell on eBay, preferably while SP is still alive, because only SP knows what's valuable and what isn't.  SP is not in physical condition to deal with it, and even so would be reminiscing too much to be able to deal with it efficiently, and doesn't want to deal with it efficiently.

Offspring started on the third floor and then discovered it was easier to buy stuff at auctions and sell that on eBay than to sort through the clutter.  

So....eventually Offspring is still going to have to deal with it all, we hope not via the commotion of an auction, not having time to separate the valuable from the not.


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## Patri (Jan 25, 2014)

A slow day, so I worked on a closet with lots of papers. Winnowed school supplies (no kids left at home, but I do use folders etc. sometimes). Created a big box to give away. Also organized mailing supplies (have lots more than I realized). Best thing - I can now shut the closet door.


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## VegasBella (Jan 25, 2014)

Elan said:


> Anyone else experience this?  I find myself being less organized than I typically would be, because when I walk into an area that my wife and I share (say master bath or WIC), I look at my area and think "Even if my stuff was perfectly organized, this area would still look like sh*t because of her stuff."  In other words, we've collectively gotten ourselves into somewhat of a downward spiral.



So true! 

I play the blame game with my husband. In my head I'm the organized one and he's disorganized. But really, I just use his lack of organizational skills (he has some but needs improvement) to justify my clutter. I can and should do better.


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 26, 2014)

Patri said:


> A slow day, so I worked on a closet with lots of papers. Winnowed school supplies (no kids left at home, but I do use folders etc. sometimes). Created a big box to give away. Also organized mailing supplies (have lots more than I realized). Best thing - I can now shut the closet door.



Victory! I think it is important to celebrate and enjoy those milestones. 

I organized my stationery while we were doing the office. I now paper, envelopes, pens and stamps all in one place. I have a box of lovely engraved cards that one of my friends gave me years ago. I am ready to write written invitations to dinner!


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 26, 2014)

*Future generations*

I think that people hold on to some things because they believe that their kids will value them. One of the things that I have done as I have gone through things is to ask my son if he would like some things in the future. He is sentimental, but not a pack rat. He has only been interested in a few things. 

For the most part, I am free to get rid of anything that I want to get rid of. Neither Ian nor I has been bad about wanting to keep something that the other wants to keep. We have been remarkably compatible in making decisions. Which has made the process so much more enjoyable. 

We are working in the garage now. The only problem there is all the dust. It gets to my nose. 

Back to work!

elaine


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## Beaglemom3 (Jan 26, 2014)

Today I am recycling/donating a lot of vintage Irish lace curtains that came down from my Grandmother and Mother (both from County Cork) as I cannot house 38 pairs of them, sad to say. I have some Rue de France ones from Newport and am on the fence with these.

So, I will keep the special ones and send the others to a crafting co-op in Haiti near where I volunteered (was on a medical team fixing cleft palates) and the rest to the Salvation Army.

The time has come to take them out of storage and into the light.

Feels good (with a twinge of sadness...    )

Couldn't have made it this far without reading all the great posts here.


ETA: I've had these curtains for 10 years now as I kept them when I sold Mum's house.


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## Rose Pink (Jan 27, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> Back to work!
> 
> elaine



I went back to bed.:hysterical:

This evening I am trying to work on one of those boxes.  How do you throw away Mother's Day cards?  I've decided I don't need my old passports, though.  Small (very small) victory.


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 27, 2014)

Rose Pink said:


> I went back to bed.:hysterical:
> 
> This evening I am trying to work on one of those boxes.  How do you throw away Mother's Day cards?  I've decided I don't need my old passports, though.  Small (very small) victory.



Throwing away cards was one of the most difficult things that I did while organizing the office. For many years, I kept a hanging file folder that had all my birthday cards, mother's day cards, etc. The folder was THICK. What I realized is that I had not LOOKED at the cards, I only kept them. As I was purging, I read each one to see if there was anything that was "historical," in the cards. There wasn't. I ended up pitching them all.

If the cards had been hand-drawn or crafted, I would have saved them. But all of them were commercial cards that said how much my husband/child/sibling/parent love(d) me. I feel loved all of the time. I really don't need a card to tell me that I am loved. I know it. I was able to purge all of them.

I did that before I did the letters between my first husband and I. Based on the cards, I thought that I would have little of interest, but it turned out not to be true. There was tons of information that was extremely personal and valuable to my son. His dad and I divorced when he was about 9. He remembers the worst part of our marriage. He is looking forward to reading about the many happy years that we had before that. 

If you need the cards to remember an event or an emotion or to feel loved, they have real value to you and you should keep them. If not, you may want to consider giving them up. Or, you could do a cost v. benefit analysis - the cost of the space v. the benefit of keeping them. It may be that the room that they take up is so small that it doesn't make a material change in the appearance of the room. 

Good luck!

elaine


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## pjrose (Jan 28, 2014)

Cards -  fronts anyway - could go on free cycle for a crafter.  Or to a teacher or day care center for collages.


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## Rose Pink (Jan 28, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> ...If the cards had been hand-drawn or crafted, I would have saved them. But all of them were commercial cards that said how much my husband/child/sibling/parent love(d) me. I feel loved all of the time. *I really don't need a card to tell me that I am loved. I know it.* I was able to purge all of them.
> 
> 
> elaine


Thank you!  That's all I needed to hear.



pjrose said:


> Cards - fronts anyway - could go on free cycle for a crafter. Or to a teacher or day care center for collages.


I give mine to my sister who teaches at an elementary school.  She uses them to teach various subjects.  The cards add an art element to whatever project they are doing.


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 28, 2014)

*Completely unrelated to organizing*

My friend that died last summer did not have family with him in the last two weeks of his life - all of which were spent in ICU. I had his health care power of attorney. He had been fairly explicit in telling me the reason that he gave the POA to me. He said that his two sisters would pull the plug as soon as they could and that I would be deliberative in assessing whether or not he had a chance of getting better. He didn't want to be non-functional and he didn't want to be left on life support for longer than was necessary to see if he had a realistic chance of a meaningful life. He had a very minor fender bender accident late at night. The police stopped and he collapsed when he got out of the car to go back to them. They performed CPR and he was placed on a ventilator as soon as he got to the hospital. I went to be with him every day for the full two weeks usually spending hours with him. 

I had to make the decision to take him off of the ventilator. It was a gut-wrenching and heart-breaking decision to have to make. I stayed with him while he died. 

I have left very specific instructions with my sister that I do not want her to be with me if she ever has to make that decision. I know that she loves me and I love her enough that I do not want her going through the experience. 

That talk is a hard talk to have with anyone. I believe that the more specific that you can be, the better. 

elaine


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## pjrose (Jan 28, 2014)

*Very Much Related to Organizing*

Elaine, you titled this *Completely unrelated to organizing*



glypnirsgirl said:


> . . . .
> 
> I have left very specific instructions with my sister that I do not want her to be with me if she ever has to make that decision. I know that she loves me and I love her enough that I do not want her going through the experience.
> 
> ...



Actually, this is very much related to organizing.  It's not organizing STUFF, it's organizing your plans.  Good for you, and thank you for sharing.


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## Blues (Jan 29, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> I had to make the decision to take him off of the ventilator. It was a gut-wrenching and heart-breaking decision to have to make. I stayed with him while he died.



Yes, that's a very gut wrenching decision; as it always should be.

I was at the hospital for a very long and emotional night when my sister died - until the next sunrise, actually.  Her daughter (my niece), the older of her two kids, had the medical POA and made the decision.  Unfortunately, my nephew didn't arrive from out of state until very late in the process.  Although the decision was clear to those of us who had been around, he hadn't had time to acclimate to the fact that his mother was dying.  It was a very, very difficult and emotional scene; one which has affected the relationship between the siblings to this day.  But I don't know what more either of them could have done.

Elaine, you have my deepest sympathy for having to make such a difficult decision.

-Bob


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## Rose Pink (Jan 29, 2014)

This is an interesting turn of discussion since I have had the advanced directives papers sitting on my desk for quite some time.  It is one of the things I am "going to get to."  I've told my husband and children (including DILs) what I want so they will all be on the same page but I want it in writing and notarized.

---------------------------------------
I found a 1 inch thick, 4x6 inch note binder with notations on the calendar pages and some quotes I liked.  I thought I'd add them to my journal on the PC and then toss the paper.  My intent was to just add some simple notes about what happened month to month.  Well, it isn't more than a page long and it's taken me hours.  Why does everything take me so long?


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## pjrose (Jan 29, 2014)

Rose Pink said:


> . . .  My intent was to just add some simple notes about what happened month to month.  Well, it isn't more than a page long and it's taken me hours.  Why does everything take me so long?



With me, it's because I get distracted (TUG for example) or forget what I was doing, or both


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## CSB (Jan 29, 2014)

This topic is very relevant to me right now. I am feeling that I cannot move forward in my life without getting though the clutter.

My problem is not so much hanging on to things for my own sake but not willing to let go of them unless they have a home to go to. I have dropped off many things to the local charities. 

Here is an example of what is bothering me right now. My mother had old bed linens that my sister and I have possession of since she passed away. They are at my house and since my sister works very hard and long hours, I am dealing with things like this. The linens are really nice looking and in pretty good shape. I don't know what time period they are from. My guess would be 1900 to 1920's. I remember seeing something like these duvet covers when I was very young. My parents had a feather duvet with a beautiful blue on one side and gold on the other. The duvets cover, such as the ones I am talking about, went over the duvet and since the cover was open in the middle and had a crochet/lace pattern, you could see the coloured duvet through the openings. I have been spending time on the computer trying to find someone who would be interested in buying them or at least loving and owning them. 

It kills me to see good stuff thrown away. If I drop the duvet covers off at the local charity, I think they will be treated like garbage. Not because I think that people who accept charity are bad, its just that this type of item would be for someone like a decorator or a collector. Someone like me can not use them - I don't have coloured duvets to show off the lacy openings and I don't love them enough care for them properly. I want someone else to love them and take care of them. I just sounded ridiculous, didn't I? 

I am improving. I had 3 sessions with a life coach and it helped me to feel hopeful about my progress. She gave me assignments and I really felt better about things. My kids have also been good. They were really excited that I was doing this and were very helpful at suggesting all the things that I should get rid of.


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## pjrose (Jan 29, 2014)

*Cindy...*

No, that doesn't sound ridiculous.  I have lots of things that are too nice to give to the thrift shops but I don't necessarily want to go to the trouble of eBay.  However, eBay is your best bet for selling them and for finding out actual value.  At least use eBay to look them up - vintage linens, or vintage sheets, vintage duvet, antique duvet, antique sheet  - and see whether they are listed, and if any have sold and for how much.  

Here's one:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-Whi...504395?pt=US_Duvet_Covers&hash=item4acee21acb

and here are some that sold:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_sac...tage+duvet+lace&LH_Complete=1&LH_Sold=1&rt=nc


If they are worth something and you don't want to go to the trouble, there are businesses that will eBay for you for a cut.  

Or, take them to an upscale consignment shop (google), perhaps one that deals with vintage clothing.  Or ask at consignment or antique shops if they know anyone in the area who is into vintage linens.  Give them away to those people if you feel like it and if the people are nice - at least then you know they'd be appreciated.  

Same for other things of that nature.  Interesting older clothes?  Drama department of college or high school, or consignment shops. 

I have given various things to collectors and people who own shops that specialize in whatever.  Not often, but occasionally, and it made me feel good.

PJ


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 29, 2014)

Rose Pink said:


> This is an interesting turn of discussion since I have had the advanced directives papers sitting on my desk for quite some time.  It is one of the things I am "going to get to."  I've told my husband and children (including DILs) what I want so they will all be on the same page but I want it in writing and notarized.



One of the realizations that I had in going through this process with my friend was that, despite a straight forward discussion, I still did not have sufficient direction from Ted. As a result, I was second-guessing myself all along the way. 

Because of that process, I am being very explicit. I want to be removed from a ventilator if any of these things happen: (1) I am 100% dependent on the ventilator and the doctors do not know why I am not breathing (i.e. I don't have pneumonia or some other verifiable treatable condition; (2) regardless of the percentage of breathing that the ventilator is doing for me, I am on a ventilator for more than 48 hours --- I am claustrophobic, I want OFF; (3) they are administering Versid for more than 48 hours - it is an amnesiac so you don't know what is happening. I don't care if I am conscious. I want off.

What happens is that they put you on the Versid so you don't know what is happening, when you come to, you don't know what has happened or how long you have been in treatment. You forget how to write. But you don't know that you don't know how.

I talked to the ICU nurses in length to reach these conclusions. Uniformly, every one of the nurses believed that NO ONE recovers from being on a ventilator more than 48 hours.

I believe that being very specific is helpful to your loved ones. 

---------------------------------------


Rose Pink said:


> I found a 1 inch thick, 4x6 inch note binder with notations on the calendar pages and some quotes I liked.  I thought I'd add them to my journal on the PC and then toss the paper.  My intent was to just add some simple notes about what happened month to month.  Well, it isn't more than a page long and it's taken me hours.  Why does everything take me so long?



Some things are just like that. Especially things that are meaningful to you. They just take longer. 

As my brother says, "It's progress, not perfection."

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 29, 2014)

Blues said:


> Yes, that's a very gut wrenching decision; as it always should be.
> 
> I was at the hospital for a very long and emotional night when my sister died - until the next sunrise, actually.  Her daughter (my niece), the older of her two kids, had the medical POA and made the decision.  Unfortunately, my nephew didn't arrive from out of state until very late in the process.  Although the decision was clear to those of us who had been around, he hadn't had time to acclimate to the fact that his mother was dying.  It was a very, very difficult and emotional scene; one which has affected the relationship between the siblings to this day.  But I don't know what more either of them could have done.
> 
> ...



Bob, thank you. I don't think that people who have not experienced it, can really understand the difficulty of it. 

My condolences for the loss of your sister.

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 30, 2014)

> Originally posted by CSB
> I want someone else to love them and take care of them. I just sounded ridiculous, didn't I?



I think that the feeling of wanting SOMEONE to love and care for something that you value, but cannot take care of is totally natural. Especially if the items belonged to someone that you have loved and lost.



pjrose said:


> No, that doesn't sound ridiculous.  I have lots of things that are too nice to give to the thrift shops but I don't necessarily want to go to the trouble of eBay.  However, eBay is your best bet for selling them and for finding out actual value.  At least use eBay to look them up - vintage linens, or vintage sheets, vintage duvet, antique duvet, antique sheet  - and see whether they are listed, and if any have sold and for how much.



I agree that it isn't ridiculous --- it is too universal to be ridiculous. And I could never force myself to take the time and effort to do Ebay.



pjrose said:


> Same for other things of that nature.  Interesting older clothes?  Drama department of college or high school, or consignment shops.
> 
> I have given various things to collectors and people who own shops that specialize in whatever.  Not often, but occasionally, and it made me feel good.
> 
> PJ



I love the idea of a drama department. 

elaine


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## pjrose (Jan 30, 2014)

*Re end of life, a different perspective*

Someone I know said that if we ever have to make the choice of keeping her going with machines or pulling the plug said, "If they say that I'm going to live the rest of my life like a vegetable, like a broccoli, then I will be a broccoli."  Sounds kind of flip, I know, but that's why we are encouraged to write out what we want in advance.  She'll say she wants the machines.


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 30, 2014)

pjrose said:


> Someone I know said that if we ever have to make the choice of keeping her going with machines or pulling the plug said, "If they say that I'm going to live the rest of my life like a vegetable, like a broccoli, then I will be a broccoli."  Sounds kind of flip, I know, but that's why we are encouraged to write out what we want in advance.  She'll say she wants the machines.



Funny! I think that it is very expressive of how she feels. And it expresses great guidance for her family. It is a very clear choice.

elaine


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## Rose Pink (Jan 30, 2014)

*Me, Myself and I*

Me:  get back to work and you can have a cookie later.

Myself:  Oooo, let's make cookies now!

I:  I am too tired.  Let's all just take a nap.

This is why "we" never get much done.


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## CSB (Jan 30, 2014)

Here's my challenge to all of you out there who are like me and have saved all the dishwasher soaps and laundry detergent packets from our vacations. Take them out of the closet, and use them until you have only one left. I'm working on it

Didn't save any of them, good for you. Now challenge me to get rid of something.


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 30, 2014)

CSB said:


> Here's my challenge to all of you out there who are like me and have saved all the dishwasher soaps and laundry detergent packets from our vacations. Take them out of the closet, and use them until you have only one left. I'm working on it
> 
> Didn't save any of them, good for you. Now challenge me to get rid of something.



That is a great idea! I love Westin toiletries - they are white tea and ginger scented. I have a full bathroom drawer of them. They are one of those things that I was dreading having to purge. I love the idea of using them up instead!

I challenge you to get rid of any magazine that is more than 6 months old that you have not used at least once as a reference in the last 6 months. (I have a couple really old Bon Appetit magazines that I still use for recipes --- and they are not on the internet site --- Tina's Triple Chocolate Cake recipe is in one of them). 

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 30, 2014)

Rose Pink said:


> Me:  get back to work and you can have a cookie later.
> 
> Myself:  Oooo, let's make cookies now!
> 
> ...



I have a new (to me) device called a "fitbit" --- you can buy them online at the fitbit website or at Target and Best Buy. It is a small thing that I clip to my clothing. It measures my steps and the number of floors that I climb. It is very motivating to me because I can get online (or on my phone) and see how often that I have moved and how many total steps that I have taken. Doing housework and organizing, I can do lots of steps. 

I am much more willing to walk because I get credit for it --- which is stupid but it works! I have found it oddly, but highly, motivating.

elaine


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## IngridN (Jan 30, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> That is a great idea! I love Westin toiletries - they are white tea and ginger scented. I have a full bathroom drawer of them. They are one of those things that I was dreading having to purge. I love the idea of using them up instead!
> 
> ...
> 
> elaine



How about bagging them and dropping them off at your local Vincent de Paul, other charity, homeless shelter, or the like. Our local VdP works w/homeless shelters to distribute these small sized toiletries. DH travels quite a bit and he collects them for me. They appreciate everything including the small kleenex, toothpaste, toothbrushes, even those eyeshades that the airlines distribute. It feels good, both to be able to do a little something as well as clear some cabinet space!

Ingrid


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## glypnirsgirl (Jan 31, 2014)

IngridN said:


> How about bagging them and dropping them off at your local Vincent de Paul, other charity, homeless shelter, or the like. Our local VdP works w/homeless shelters to distribute these small sized toiletries. DH travels quite a bit and he collects them for me. They appreciate everything including the small kleenex, toothpaste, toothbrushes, even those eyeshades that the airlines distribute. It feels good, both to be able to do a little something as well as clear some cabinet space!
> 
> Ingrid



I used to take them to the YWCA for the women that lived there. A few years ago, they stopped accepting them. No explanation.

I will contact our local homeless shelter to see if they would be useful.

Great idea!

elaine


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## pjrose (Jan 31, 2014)

I have recently lucked out with clearance clothes that fit and look good  My closet is so packed that simply trying to cram anything else in counts as exercise.  

I took armloads of clothes that I haven't worn for ages out of my closet and put them in my daughter's former closet. I could tell they were oldies because they were on metal hangers, and I switched to fuzzy hangers a few years ago.  I told DH, if they're still there in a year (i.e., if I haven't worn them) they go 

I challenge anyone on here to do the same - purge your closet of clothes you haven't worn for a long time that'll probably never fit again anyway; put them in a "holding area" like I did if you can't quite bear to part with them  Shoes count too, as do the clothes in drawers.


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## MuranoJo (Feb 1, 2014)

I purged my walk-in closet about 2 years ago and it felt so good to do this.  But it took many hours and since so many of the items were in top shape (some I'd never worn that still had the price tags) and nice, professional suits, etc., I decided to try a consignment shop.  I made the effort to steam them all and take them to the shop for the assessment.  They kept most of them.

A few months later, what did I get?  About $77.  (Went back to the shop and none of them were still on the rack.)  Hmmm.  I would rather they go to a donation center for women looking for jobs, etc., and that's what I'll do in the future.

Meanwhile, regarding the little complimentary bottles of lotions, shampoos, etc., I have a bunch from my business travels.  I only use them for the guest bathroom, but have given quite a few away to visiting nieces.  Great idea to donate them.


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## pedro47 (Feb 1, 2014)

I ask The Commander-In-Chief to read this thread..with an open mind.


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## glypnirsgirl (Feb 1, 2014)

*Organizing your wardrobe*

In looking for packing tips (we are going on a cruise to Alaska this summer!), I found a terrific website for helping make outfits out of components. I love their simple packing list. It will be simple to modify for what we will need. Here it is:

http://www.stylebookapp.com/stories/packing_list.html --- be sure to tap the "example list" link.

Because I have been losing so much weight - 60 pounds so far - I have started buying new clothes. I don't have to buy a lot of them because I have a tendency to yo-yo so I have some clothes in the size I am now. 

I think that the tips on this closet-makeover are terrific.

http://www.stylebookapp.com/stories/closet_makeover.html

Hope this helps!

elaine


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## Rose Pink (Feb 5, 2014)

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/why-millennial-quit-6-figure-205835000.html


1. Ask yourself how your life might be better if you owned fewer material possessions. "A lot of people might want to declutter their closets," says Millburn. "But without understanding the purpose behind it, they will just get cluttered again."

2. Get rid of one thing each day for a month."This will help you build momentum," he says. At the end of the 30 days, you'll likely end up tossing a lot more than 30 items, since you've devoted that time to really looking. 

3. Recruit a friend to help. "The act of decluttering is fairly boring," Millburn  says. "If you can have an accountability buddy that’s helping you, it can make it fun." Plus, if you motivate each other, ultimately you both win.


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## Passepartout (Feb 5, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> Because I have been losing so much weight -* 60 pounds so far* - I have started buying new clothes. I don't have to buy a lot of them because I have a tendency to yo-yo so I have some clothes in the size I am now.
> 
> elaine



Congratulations are in order here!

You go girl!

(confessions of a fellow yo-yo poster child)

Jim


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## Rose Pink (Feb 5, 2014)

My clothes closet is 64 inches wide and 43 inches deep.  I have hanging racks and a lingerie chest in there as well as some shelving and shoe storage.  I can still walk into it and close the door and dress in there.  Even though I don't wear most of those clothes, I don't feel the need to purge them at this time.  Hopefully, someday I will be able to wear some of those cute shirts I bought when I was skinny. 
I am not a fashionista and I am fine with jeans or a pair of black pants/skirt and lots of different shirt options. Of course, when I finally do take out those new/almost new shirts, I may find them out of fashion.  Who knows.  At this point they aren't in my way so I won't worry about it.

OTOH, I'd love to purge DH's closet.  His is the same size as mine and whenever I put his clean laundry away, I trip over the shoes or the step stool he has in there.  He has shirts that are so old they are out of fashion and he never wears them.  He has very little hanging space and lots of shelves and a chest of drawers that is so full it is hard to cram in the clothes.  The clothes on the shelves and the clothes on 2/3s of the hangers are dusty because they don't get worn and rotated through the laundry.  Maybe if I didn't have anything better to do, I'd take them all out and wash them and put them back again.  But I DO have better things to do.  (Like my office and those boxes I keep talking about.)


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## Rose Pink (Feb 5, 2014)

Passepartout said:


> Congratulations are in order here!
> 
> You go girl!
> 
> ...



Yes, I agree whole-heartedly.


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## pjrose (Feb 5, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> . . .
> Because I have been losing so much weight - 60 pounds so far - . . .



Is this weight loss due to organizing so that you are now cooking at home instead of eating out?  Have you discovered the holy grail of weight loss?


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## glypnirsgirl (Feb 6, 2014)

Passepartout said:


> Congratulations are in order here!
> 
> You go girl!
> 
> ...



Rose Pink


> Yes, I agree whole-heartedly.



PJRose


> Have you discovered the holy grail of weight loss? Is this weight loss due to organizing so that you are now cooking at home instead of eating out?



Thanks!

It is a culmination of several things.

While visiting at Christmas 2012, my dad was upset with my sister, (who was formerly a model and now weighs more than 300 pounds) for eating dessert. He said, "Don't you know that sugar turns straight into fat?" I thought that it was a ludicrous statement. Despite my incredulity, I didn't say anything to him. Instead, I decided to google the statement to prove to him that he was wrong. One of the first things that popped up when I googled it was a video by a childhood obesity specialist. The video was of a lecture to medical students about obesity. In the video, he makes that statement. The whole video is about how toxic sugar is to those people that are not extremely active. Here is a link to the video.

Any way, after watching that video, I cold-turkeyed sugar. For months, I ate NO sugar in any form except in its natural state, i.e. fruit. In order to do it, I stopped eating out. There is no control over what restaurants put into food. Luckily, I had already started cooking at home. But I went to 100% home cooking. Now, I will occasionally have something that has sugar in it, but it is rare. 

I lost the first 35 pounds just by stopping eating, and more problematic for me, drinking, anything with sugar in it. 

After that, I stopped losing weight. My friend got sick and died. I put back on a few pounds. Went more stringently back to zero sugar, and lost those again. 

I just plateaued for several months. I started wearing my fitbit. I don't have time to walk as much as I should so I decided that I would be more efficient and I would walk up stairs. 

Ian bought a scale that synchs to the fitbit app. (I didn't know back then that I could log my food on the fitbit app). 

I read a book called, "The First 20 Minutes." That book has lots of information about how to efficiently get more fit/healthier. The thing that I took from it was the fact that one of the worst things that people do for their health is to sit down. The simple act of standing up every twenty minutes stops a cascade of deteriorating effects on your health. I sit a lot at work and simply start concentrating on my work and I can sit still for hours. I told Ian that I really wanted to stand up every 20 minutes but I didn't know how I would be able to remember to do it. He built a resetting 20 minute timer for me. (It is wonderful being married to an engineer).

One of the best side effects of getting up every twenty minutes is that I am in much less pain. My fibromyalgia got much better --- it was noticeable the first DAY that I got up and down.

If I don't have clients and don't have a deadline, I will walk in place and stretch every time the timer goes off. If I have a client with me or I am working on a tight deadline, I just stand up. Once an hour, I get up, walk down the hall and up and down the stairs in my building two or three times (there are four flights). 

I took off about 10 more pounds with those changes and plateaued again. 

We started working on the house which has me on my feet more at home. So that helped. 

I went to see my doctor and he reviewed my medication. Some how, the pharmacy had started filling my 50 mcg liothyronine at 25 mcg and I had not remembered that I was supposed to be on 50 mcg --- that helped. 

But, what has helped the most is logging my food. My doctor recommended an app called "myfitnesspal" --- it works on smart phones, computers, tablets and you can set it up to synch with your fitbit. You choose how much you want to weigh, how fast you want to lose, and it calculates the number of calories you should eat to reach those goals. 

Both the fitbit app and myfitnesspal have really large databases with most foods listed. 

I keep a portable scale with me. I weigh my food if I am eating out --- still rare for me. (I compared the calories for grilled halibut at Macaroni Grill, 880 calories, to home grilled 240 calories and decided it isn't worth it to eat out). I weigh my food at home. 

And, I started trying to get at least 6.5 hours of sleep per night. 

I am losing weight at a steady 2 pounds per week which is my goal. 

I really do feel like I have found the holy grail of dieting. 

Hope this helps somebody.

elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Feb 16, 2014)

*Back to the master bedroom*

We have finally finished the garage --- I did almost nothing in there after the purge --- so I am using "we" very loosely. Ian installed 20" deep Elfa shelving all around the garage above 76 inches --- we have really big things up there: big ice chest, suitcases and dive bags, picnic basket, big totes each with 1 sleeping bag in it (the rest of the camping gear is gone). Under the deep shelves, he hung utility hooks for the gardening tools and 4" deep shelves for cans, bottles and jars and other not deep things. 

We can now pull one of our cars into the garage. I don't think that it is possible for us to pull both cars in. We have one half of the garage set up like 2 E's with shelving perpendicular to the walls and 2' of walking space between each set of shelves. Everything is easy to access. 

So, today I purged my closet. I bought the Stylebook app for my ipad. I took every item of clothing out of my closet, tried it on for fit, looked for stains and repairs, donated the things that are too large, tossed the things that were ripped or stained. 

I used the Ipad to take pictures of everything that I kept. I downloaded them  to the Stylebook app. I discovered some interesting things about the clothes that I had left: the ones that I don't wear don't have a critical piece to make it work as an outfit. For example, I have a gorgeous cardinal red jacket with a black paisley --- it really needs a red top in just the right shade of red. I have two jackets with appropriate tops, but they both need a pair of medium brown pants --- I don't have any brown dress-up pants. Some of the jackets fit okay, but the look isn't appealing. Several of those jackets were just boxy. Those went, too. 

It was easier to take the pictures to upload to stylebook by the type of piece: blazers, sleeveless shells, long sleeve blouses, etc. 

The idea of style book is to have pictures of what you own so that you can accomplish a couple of tasks. You have an inventory of what you own. Because of the inventory, it is easy to check to see if what you are buying goes with your existing pieces, you can pre-plan outfits and "looks" --- with the idea that you will use the items that you own more creatively. You can spot "holes" in your wardrobe that need to be filled. 

After purging the don't fit or stained category, I had 37 tops that I use as jackets. Of those jacket/tops, 11 are solid colors: 2 navy, 2 orange, teal, purple, and 4 black that are virtually indistinguishable from one another and one black fitted jacket that is different. I own more jackets than I do shirts and shells! 

So, then I set aside every jacket and every shirt and every shell that I did not already own something that will go with it. It was this process - actually making up outfits, that I had downloaded the stylebook app for. After experimenting with the app, I figured out that it was easier to physically move the items than it was to move them virtually. Except for the navy and black, I did not have more than one shirt that went with any jacket. Those that had just one coordinating piece, I put them on the same hangar. 

If I was happy at the weight that I am (I'm not) or I thought that I would be this size for a significant amount of time longer, I would keep those items that need something to go with them and fill in the holes. I had way too many clothes left to worry about filling in any holes. Those orphan pieces went to the donate stack, also. And, I kept the prettier orange jacket and donated the other - they were both the exact same shade of orange and I only had one orange shirt that went with them. I donated one of the indistinguishable black jackets and kept the rest. 

When I went through the same process with my pants, it was almost immediately obvious that there was no reason to take pictures --- I own 14 pairs of black pants they are almost identical to one another. I own two pairs of navy pants of the same cut and style as the black ones. Some of the pants had never been hemmed, so I donated those. I own one pair of bitter chocolate pants that must be in the laundry, because they weren't in my closet. 

While I had all of the clothes out of my closet, I picked up all the shoes that were in the bottom, went through other stuff on the floor, And swept it out. I then repeated the process with shoes. I now have 5 pairs of shoes (all 5 are black), one pair of sneakers, one pair of sandals. Of the remaining shoes, all but 2 pairs of black shoes - the ones that I wear every day - went into see through shoe boxes which I labeled. 

It is much easier to see what I own so I can now vary what I wear every day. Instead of wearing black pants, colored shirt and black jacket --- which is what I had been wearing 90% of the time.

I got this all done in about 5 hours. If I had just done it without messing with taking pictures for the stylebook app, it would have taken about 2 hours. 

No wonder I had so many clothes --- a lot of them were orphans.

It is much easier to see what I own now.

elaine


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## Rose Pink (Feb 17, 2014)

Sounds like you had a very productive day.


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## Patri (Feb 17, 2014)

Elaine, your posts are amazing. It is thrilling to read about your successes.


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## CSB (Feb 17, 2014)

Elaine, I loved to hear what you accomplished. 

I wish I could do what you did (co-ordinate my clothes) but I am fashion challenged. I have pieces that I have bought but don't know what to pair them with to make a nice outfit. I have several pair of pants that I bought and they look nice but they are a little tight on the waist so I end up wearing the two pair that are more comfortable. Even when skinny I could never tolerate my waist band pushing on my stomach.

I did give away quite a few things and I am proud of that but would really like to have less but know exactly what to buy so I have complete outfits and not just a bunch of pieces.


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## glypnirsgirl (Feb 18, 2014)

CSB said:


> I did give away quite a few things and I am proud of that but would really like to have less but know exactly what to buy so I have complete outfits and not just a bunch of pieces.



It is because I am fashion challenged and prefer to be low maintenance that my wardrobe consists of black pants and black jackets and colored shirts that get worn. And pretty colorful jackets that don't get worn --- most of my jackets were donated because I don't have anything to wear with them --- so most had never been worn. 

I googled the term [without the quotation marks] "pieces for outfits" and I got several hits. These were the most helpful:

http://www.puttingmetogether.com/2013/11/10-pieces-14-outfits-fall-packing-2013.html
http://www.stylebookapp.com/stories/packing_list.html
http://www.slideshare.net/SCKESC/11-easy-pieces-to-31-outfits


In playing around on different sites, I ended up finding this website: 
http://www.polyvore.com/top_fashion_sets_for_feb/collection?id=3336657

It is not a "how to" like the other sites. Instead, you can use their "shop" feature to plan a wardrobe. When you find a piece that you like, you can do a search to see how other people have incorporated the piece into their wardrobe. 

I did my own wardrobe planning -- trying to figure out what pieces that I could buy to get the most use out of. The pieces that I used are not exact, they are similar to things I own (the black pants and jacket, floral print shell, lace tee, and rose button down shirt) and I have matched it with things that would really extend the wardrobe. It took awhile of playing around. I ended up with some great pieces to shop for when I am the next size down. Here is the link to my page:
http://glypnirsgirl.polyvore.com/?filter=sets

You can search by color, by piece, by color and piece, it was really easy to navigate. I found it helpful to save "drafts" rather than publish each thing that I came up with. 

Hope this helps!
elaine


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## glypnirsgirl (Feb 18, 2014)

Patri said:


> Elaine, your posts are amazing. It is thrilling to read about your successes.



Rose Pink


> Sounds like you had a very productive day.



Thanks! It helps me stay motivated to post about it. And the positive reinforcement helps, too.


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## Rose Pink (Mar 8, 2014)

Dear Diary:
Yesterday DH saw one of those barn-roof type storage sheds and got the crazy idea of replacing the roof over the garage with the added height of a barn roof so he'd have more room for storage. "Barn" is not the look I am going for. 

Why can't he just get rid of the junk?  He is never going to use this stuff. Oh, well. We all have our crazy dreams. 

DH is a kind, intelligent, caring, and very humorous man. Love him with all my heart and soul. He is hard-working and patient. He has so many sterling qualities that I suppose I should just endure his hoarding tendencies. It wouldn't be so bad if DD hadn't inherited them as well. 

I just want a pretty, organized house and property.

I think I need a hug.


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## glypnirsgirl (Mar 8, 2014)

Rose Pink said:


> I think I need a hug.




Sounds like you need a hug indeed {{{HUG}}}


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## glypnirsgirl (Mar 9, 2014)

*we are on hiatus*

We have been working on organizing the house now for 4 months. Last week was the last week that we had pre-paid the organizer for. We are still not finished. 

Once we finished the garage, we went to the guest room instead of to the master bedroom and bath and guest bath. We got through the guest room and that was the end of our professional organizer time. 

We are taking off the next three weeks. No organizer. No pressure to organize the remaining rooms --- for now. We paid for another 6 weeks --- but it doesn't start until the first Wednesday in April. 

I have lost another 10 pounds (total of 70 - now down below what I weighed when Ian and I got married). I am now swimming in my clothes. I did have 2 jackets and 2 skirts and 2 blouses in the size I am now. I ordered 7 pairs of pants - 4 black, 2 navy, 1 brown in my new size. I took them to have them altered (all needed to be shortened). Took some of my larger, favorite jackets to get altered, too. I am going to need to do another purge on the closet to get rid of the stuff that is too big --- but I can't do that until I get my clothes back from the tailor. I will be down to fewer than 20 items of clothing (not counting pajamas, underwear, workout clothes and socks). I don't intend to buy anything else in this size. It, too, is temporary.

Last weekend, I had friends over for dinner. It was the first time in many years to actually have guests. I didn't have to clean house to get ready for them, all I had to do was cook and set the table. 

I think that I am going to enjoy the 3 weeks hiatus. (I suspect I will want to do the closet once I get my clothes back from the tailor).

elaine


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## Rose Pink (Mar 9, 2014)

glypnirsgirl said:


> We have been working on organizing the house now for 4 months. Last week was the last week that we had pre-paid the organizer for. We are still not finished.
> 
> Once we finished the garage, we went to the guest room instead of to the master bedroom and bath and guest bath. We got through the guest room and that was the end of our professional organizer time.
> 
> ...


Congratulations on your weight loss!  That is inspiring.  Holding on to change and onto good habits is not easy.  You are to be commended.


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## glypnirsgirl (Sep 17, 2014)

We have not had the professional organizer back since going on the hiatus. 

Ian and I were supposed to go on a 10 day land tour and 7 day cruise in Alaska in June. I had bought the sports clothes for kayaking and hiking, cocktail dresses, shoes, handbags, etc that I wanted for the cruise. 

Then, my daughter in law developed preclampsia and gave birth to our first grand baby almost 2 months prematurely. The baby was born the week before we were supposed to leave for the trip to Alaska.

The baby and DIL are both doing very well. I love being a grandmother. 

The cruise got cancelled so that I could go help with the baby. (My DIL's mother has early on-set dementia and Rose had always made clear that she wanted me to come up and help when the baby was born). I went to stay with the new family for a month. So, nothing was done during that month --- except for cancelling all of the excursions that we had planned and making and documenting the claims for the travel insurance. And returning the clothes and accessories that I had bought for the Alaska trip.

I came home and spent the next six weeks getting caught up at work and  getting ready for the baby and parents' visit. Jordan and Rose had planned on spending Jordan's paternity leave here in Texas so that they could see family and show off the baby. 

During the preparation for baby time, I got completely off-track for organizing. I bought way too much stuff in getting ready for their visit. I bought a pack and play for the baby. I bought bottles, nipples, sterilizers, cloth diapers, stuff for dealing with the cloth diapers, baby clothes, formula, etc. 

We moved things around in the guest room so that there would be room for the three of them. We cleared things out further so that they would be able to unpack. It really paid off that we had cleared so much stuff out as part of the organizing. It was relatively easy getting the guest room ready for them.

They were here for 3 weeks --- which was lovely. I worked very little --- at home or at work.

My daughter in law took the cloth diapers that she liked back with her. Most of the neutral (not girly) cloth diapers I have given to my legal assistant who is expecting a boy next month. I still have girly cloth diapers that I will be donating. (As an aside, a family can save about $2000 by using cloth diapers rather than disposable diapers. My daughter in law was pleasantly surprised by how easy it is to deal with cloth diapers. She had not been open to trying them while the baby was brand new. But, once she realized how much money they could save, she decided to try them. And she likes them. The diaper covers are so cute that she was willing to continue using them).

The baby had been very colicky and she switched her formula. So I have several canisters of the old formula which I will be donating to the food pantry. I have baby clothes that have been outgrown. The outgrown baby clothes are practically new. Some have never been worn. Those clothes are now out of season. I will be selling them on ebay next spring and we will use the money to help fund the baby's 529 college savings plan. The clothes I have put away and stored to be sold next Spring.

I will be selling the sterilizer and formula prep machine on ebay. Those funds will go into the 529. I don't have those put back in the boxes, yet. I will take pictures for ebay, put them back in the boxes and get ready for mailing once they are sold. I won't be doing that until next week --- 

We are getting ready to go visit my bonus daughter and her fiance. We are going to choose caterers for the fun run that she has asked that Ian and I host for the morning of the wedding.

The house is a wreck. 

I am once again behind at work. 

I think that this is the two steps back part.

elaine


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## Patri (Sep 17, 2014)

You have happy, healthy people in your life, much more important.
Congratulations to all.
Sure you won't need any of that baby stuff for another one later on?

(I also used cloth diapers most of the time back in the day. Enjoyed them vs. the expense of disposable, which is now horrendous. And today's cloth is much more user friendly - for the changer, not the pooper.)


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