# Hyatt Pinon Point Owners Update + II "Potential" Limitations on Resale Owners...



## NWTRVLRS (Apr 30, 2015)

Hi All 

We are currently staying at our deeded week at the Hyatt Pinon Pointe, and went in for a 15 minute 'Owners Update' (that lasted almost 2 hours)... the update is specifically for owners who purchased on the resale market...  As we are new to timesharing, and purchased on the resale market by the suggestions/information/wisdom on TUG, we wanted to get the opinion of seasoned Tuggers...

I know that we have read many times on TUG that buying from the developer for the 'hotel perk' is not worth it... but during todays 'presentation', we were informed that:

1) II is expecting to expand the Hyatt Residence Club portfolio by purchasing properties in popular vacation spots, refurbishing them and turning them into HRCs vs building new HRC from the ground up. They mentioned several locations, both US and International.

2) As II as acquired HRC, they are potentially going to change the way developer owners are rewarded to make it 'fair' as they have paid more for their timeshare...

II 'may' begin limiting owners who have purchased on the resale market, and those limitations include not being able to book/trade into any other Hyatt property other then our home resort week.  However, IF we were to expand our portfolio to include a developer purchase, then we would be able to take advantage of the FULL ownership benefits that II 'may' be imposing in the near future.  

They also pushed the 'perk' of being able to roll your points over to Hyatt hotels.  

We did not bite on any of this... but would this even be possible?  Could II change the rules for resale vs developer sale... and/or change the rules for those that already own a resale?

Thanks for the feedback on this one.


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## SmithOp (Apr 30, 2015)

FUD, Fear-Uncertainty-Doubt. The only way they have to influence a resale owner to buy from them.  When it happens THEN you can adjust your ownership, no need to rush into a developer purchase, until then enjoy your resale.




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## NWTRVLRS (Apr 30, 2015)

Thanks Dave


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## lizap (Apr 30, 2015)

Agree with this completely.  Our greatest benefit thus far has been exchanging into Marriotts using II.  Hyatt has excellent trading power. You would still be able to do this and use your deeded week at your home resort.   A more likely scenario is to require resale owners to pay a one-time fee to II to continue to be able to use the internal trading system (similar to Marriott's DC).




SmithOp said:


> FUD, Fear-Uncertainty-Doubt. The only way they have to influence a resale owner to buy from them.  When it happens THEN you can adjust your ownership, no need to rush into a developer purchase, until then enjoy your resale.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## bdh (Apr 30, 2015)

NWTRVLRS said:


> Hi All
> 
> We are currently staying at our deeded week at the Hyatt Pinon Pointe, and went in for a 15 minute 'Owners Update' (that lasted almost 2 hours)... the update is specifically for owners who purchased on the resale market...  As we are new to timesharing, and purchased on the resale market by the suggestions/information/wisdom on TUG, we wanted to get the opinion of seasoned Tuggers...
> 
> ...



The HRC Rules can be changed at any time by HVOI - so internal HRC exchange rules could change to favor owners of developer purchased weeks.  If/when that happens, the question would be if it was retro-active on previous purchases or applied only on new purchases moving forward from the date of the rule change.  

External exchange rules within II to differentiate between developer vs resale purchases is another topic - while a rule change here is possible, it does not seem probable as the change would do more to deter HRC deposits into II than it would to "protect" HRC developer purchases.


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## Kal (Apr 30, 2015)

As I read about the "owners update" I slap myself on the back of my head and say to me...

OMG is it even possible that a time share huckster would NOT tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth as a means to get a sale????

If you can't believe a time share huckster, who CAN you believe!!


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## NWTRVLRS (Apr 30, 2015)

Thanks everyone for the feedback 

SO a few quick thoughts from this end... 

IF they changed the rules to benefit developer purchases by only developer purchases being able to exchange their week within the Hyatt system to another HRC, wouldn't that put a wrench in the whole system for not only resale purchases, but developer purchases as well, as it would limit the availability for internal exchanges for everyone? 

And for those Game of Thrones Fans... my hubby's comment this morning is that while we may be part of the 'Stark' Family (HRC Family), changes like the ones discussed in our meeting would relegate us to a John Snow status... just saying 

Have a great day everyone!


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## suzannesimon (May 2, 2015)

I agree, it sounds like a salesperson con.  They need our weeks as badly as we need theirs for trading.  It would force resale owners to set up their own exchange site losing a lot of exchange fees for II.


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## NWTRVLRS (May 2, 2015)

Excellent point!

And the truth is that the developer has already received a full sale from the original purchaser when a 'resale' happens, so they are never losing anything... And they had the ROFR, but chose not to take it... So they are never losing out on anything... and those purchasing resale are helping to pay the necessary maintenance fees that keep things going for all purchasers, no matter how they came to it...

Thanks again everyone for the feedback 

We check out tomorrow, and have THOROUGHLY enjoyed our time here at Piñon Pointe... We have an amazing unit! We are grateful to TUG and the wonderful members who helped us through this resale process...


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## Bill4728 (May 11, 2015)

The normal salesmen's lies is "there are never any Hyatt resale because we use our ROFR to buy them back"


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## NWTRVLRS (May 11, 2015)

This was our first time sitting through a Hyatt presentation... it is, without a doubt, a very interesting experience


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## piyooshj (May 13, 2015)

I was told the same lie at Carmel. I immediately reverted and said this will make resale value of my developer purchase 0. He immediately became defensive and stopped stressing on that lie. 


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## NWTRVLRS (May 13, 2015)

Exactly! This would be a disaster for anyone owning a Hyatt property, whether resale or developer purchase!


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## SunandFun83 (Aug 13, 2015)

*If you repeat the garbage you are an accomplice*



Kal said:


> As I read about the "owners update" I slap myself on the back of my head and say to me...
> 
> OMG is it even possible that a time share huckster would NOT tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth as a means to get a sale????
> 
> If you can't believe a time share huckster, who CAN you believe!!



I am disappointed that NWTRVLR would even print that garbage here.  Why would you ever listen to a developer sales pitch about how buying resale is wrong and then repeat it.  Shame on you!

Maybe you should go buy two developer weeks at $35,000 each ( vs resale at $7,000) just in case.  What I heard is that once II changes the Hyatt rules so you cannot buy resale they will double the price on developer weeks.  Look at Mauii, the prices there are already double because there is no resale availability.


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## NWTRVLRS (Aug 14, 2015)

SunandFun83 said:


> I am disappointed that NWTRVLR would even print that garbage here.  Why would you ever listen to a developer sales pitch about how buying resale is wrong and then repeat it.  Shame on you!
> 
> Maybe you should go buy two developer weeks at $35,000 each ( vs resale at $7,000) just in case.  What I heard is that once II changes the Hyatt rules so you cannot buy resale they will double the price on developer weeks.  Look at Mauii, the prices there are already double because there is no resale availability.



...sorry you are disappointed, and calling what we posted 'garbage' seems harsh...

...as we are brand new to timesharing, and this was our first timeshare purchase (resale), we joined TUG to learn more, in order to make an informed decision on the resale. The people here have been nothing but friendly and helpful and we have been very appreciative as we navigated these waters.

...when we stayed in our resale for the first time, and heard the information from the 'update', we were a bit shocked to hear what they had to say, so we turned to the TUG experts for information... and as always, they have been very helpful.

...as we stated above, this was suppose to be a "15 minute 'Owners Update' (that lasted almost 2 hours)" -- next time, we will know better then to attend in the first place... lesson learned and now we are wiser owners... thanks to TUG.


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## Ty1on (Aug 14, 2015)

SunandFun83 said:


> I am disappointed that NWTRVLR would even print that garbage here.  Why would you ever listen to a developer sales pitch about how buying resale is wrong and then repeat it.  Shame on you!
> 
> Maybe you should go buy two developer weeks at $35,000 each ( vs resale at $7,000) just in case.  What I heard is that once II changes the Hyatt rules so you cannot buy resale they will double the price on developer weeks.  Look at Mauii, the prices there are already double because there is no resale availability.



That was out of line.

My question is, does II own Hyatt or vice versa?


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## NWTRVLRS (Aug 14, 2015)

Ty1on said:


> That was out of line.
> 
> My question is, does II own Hyatt or vice versa?



Thanks for having our back 

II owns Hyatt Residence Club... here is some info:
http://newsroom.hyatt.com/10-01-14-...pletes-Acquisition-of-Hyatt-Residential-Group


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## SunandFun83 (Aug 14, 2015)

*Hyatt sold the residence club to II*

Hyatt sold the residence Club division to II.  

Each Redidence Club Property has an agreement between a local developer and HRC.  I think that Hyatt does not own the individual properties.  The local developer played a significant part of discussions at the seven properties I have been to.

Read the original post again and I think garbage and timeshare huckster rumors is accurate description.  The great thing about TUG is access to knowledge from TUGGERS like KAL who know what they are talking about.  I try to educate TUGGERS to my ability.  I dislike posts like "hyatt owns Four Seasons". And Hyatt now comes with II Platinum". From people without any knowledge.

The universal TUG position is never accept a timeshare presentation as the Gospel.  Your post indicated it could be true.

I own 12 weeks purchased resale and just reading your speculation about the end of internal trading and II for my weeks gave me chest palpitations.


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## Kal (Aug 14, 2015)

NWTRVLRS said:


> ...this was suppose to be a "15 minute 'Owners Update' (that lasted almost 2 hours)" -- next time, we will know better then to attend in the first place... lesson learned and now we are wiser owners... thanks to TUG.



Now you know the routine for the "owners update". Next time consider the amount of the "gift", then weigh that against a 2-hour hole in your day.

For me, I often go for the gift and let the huckster clearly know I'm not purchasing more points or anything else. In one case the guy said I have to take the tour after I told him NO. I suggested he could spend his valuable time with the next person rather than me where there is NO HOPE of peddling anything. We agreed that I would tell his superior we indeed took the tour and loved the property. The lovely visit was considerably shortened and we were out the door with rewards in hand.


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## alexadeparis (Aug 14, 2015)

SunandFun83 said:


> I am disappointed that NWTRVLR would even print that garbage here.  Why would you ever listen to a developer sales pitch about how buying resale is wrong and then repeat it.  Shame on you!
> 
> Maybe you should go buy two developer weeks at $35,000 each ( vs resale at $7,000) just in case.  What I heard is that once II changes the Hyatt rules so you cannot buy resale they will double the price on developer weeks.  Look at Mauii, the prices there are already double because there is no resale availability.



I think this was intended as tongue in cheek or sarcasm. I don't think SunandFun83 was really being harsh for real. Anyone who has been on this board for any length of time knows to come here to check what the salesperson "told" them. 99% of the time is it lies or at least a pretty huge distortion of the truth!

Side note: I don't think Hyatt would limit resales from using their points at other Hyatt resorts. That limits availability for their precious developer units too, on the other side of that coin. That would be shooting themselves in the foot, in addition to plunging the resale value down even further.


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## NWTRVLRS (Aug 14, 2015)

Kal said:


> Now you know the routine for the "owners update". Next time consider the amount of the "gift", then weigh that against a 2-hour hole in your day.
> 
> For me, I often go for the gift and let the huckster clearly know I'm not purchasing more points or anything else. In one case the guy said I have to take the tour after I told him NO. I suggested he could spend his valuable time with the next person rather than me where there is NO HOPE of peddling anything. We agreed that I would tell his superior we indeed took the tour and loved the property. The lovely visit was considerably shortened and we were out the door with rewards in hand.



And the crazy part is... there was no gift at all... we were told it was a 15 minute update, without a gift... we knew that going in... then after they kept us for 2 hours, they would not offer a gift... so like I said, lesson learned


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## Ty1on (Aug 14, 2015)

alexadeparis said:


> I think this was intended as tongue in cheek or sarcasm. I don't think SunandFun83 was really being harsh for real. Anyone who has been on this board for any length of time knows to come here to check what the salesperson "told" them. 99% of the time is it lies or at least a pretty huge distortion of the truth!
> 
> Side note: I don't think Hyatt would limit resales from using their points at other Hyatt resorts. That limits availability for their precious developer units too, on the other side of that coin. That would be shooting themselves in the foot, in addition to plunging the resale value down even further.



Now that you mention it, I do see sarcasm.  I like to think I'm a better detector than I was in this case.


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## SunandFun83 (Aug 14, 2015)

*Sarcasm and dry humor do not translate very well.*



alexadeparis said:


> I think this was intended as tongue in cheek or sarcasm. I don't think SunandFun83 was really being harsh for real. Anyone who has been on this board for any length of time knows to come here to check what the salesperson "told" them. 99% of the time is it lies or at least a pretty huge distortion of the truth!
> 
> .



I think the part about Go buy Two Developer Weeks in a hurry because the price is going to double soon might be easily recognized as sarcasm. The part about garbage was a little harsh and I am sorry.  

I think TUG is a fantastic resource to ask questions and hope people with knowledge will share it.  I do think that NewB TUGGERS should restrain from saying they think something is or might be true when they do not know.  Please limit yourself to phrasing a question as a question, Kind of like the Jeopardy TV Show rule.  In this case it would be: "I sat through an owner update and was shocked at the developer sales rep talking points.  Could any of the following be true, what do y'all think?" 

In this case the Jeopardy analogy is supposed to be very dry humor, and a poke at some of the posting of false information I referred to.

Enjoy your Hyatt week.  I think I will have to go to a different thread to find out about exchanging for Marriott weeks, because, that is something new to me.


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## Ty1on (Aug 14, 2015)

SunandFun83 said:


> I think the part about Go buy Two Developer Weeks in a hurry because the price is going to double soon might be easily recognized as sarcasm. The part about garbage was a little harsh and I am sorry.
> 
> I think TUG is a fantastic resource to ask questions and hope people with knowledge will share it.  I do think that NewB TUGGERS should restrain from saying they think something is or might be true when they do not know.  Please limit yourself to phrasing a question as a question, Kind of like the Jeopardy TV Show rule.  In this case it would be: "I sat through an owner update and was shocked at the developer sales rep talking points.  Could any of the following be true, what do y'all think?"
> 
> ...



So it was a combo sarcasm and personal insult to the OP.  I reiterate that you were out of line.  :rofl:


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