# AVIS bate & switch



## Kauai Kid (Mar 18, 2009)

Before we left for Maui I made reservations with AVIS with an estimate of $400.07.

When I arrived the car wasn't ready and it took the Agent several minutes to print the contract which required more signatures than when you buy a home.
I just did as requested and left only to wait another 10 minutes for the car to arrive, soaking wet from the car wash.

I walked around noting numerous dings and scratches and left.

A couple days later I noticed several scratches on the right fender behind the wheel.  I looked the contract over and the price estimate was some $438

Fortunately I had a copy of the original reservations, took them back to Avis and they acted like they were doing me a favor by giving me the rate they initially quoted. 

Of course, when I checked in the agent noted the scratches on the right fender  and fortunately for me didn't include them in the charge since I told her the car was soaking wet when delivered and you'd never see those scratches anyway.

S0 this time with AVIS was not very good.  I'd take a picture of the car except you'd never see the scratches since it was wet.

Anyone got a solution to these problems?

Sterling


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## falmouth3 (Mar 18, 2009)

As I read your narrative, it appears that you've taken care of both of these issues already.  The only suggestion that I'd have it to look over the contract before you leave the desk.

Sue


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## Kauai Kid (Mar 19, 2009)

How about the scratches not noticed because the car was wet??  You'd never see those scratches with a camera either.

Wait till it dries???

I found out with their speedy check in/out number the price was higher!


Sterling


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## HatTrick (Mar 19, 2009)

Sterling,

I've rented from a few different companies on Maui, and have often gotten a car right out of the wash after a long wait. Maybe they're understaffed, or they just don't care, but there's no sense of urgency at any of the rental places in the islands.

Even if I can't see scratches, I usually write in a few in the most obvious places (like fenders and bumpers) on the evaluation form.

Using an AmEx card (or lacking that, buying the damage waiver) means not having to worry about scratches, dings, or dents.

Roger


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## SuzanneSLO (Mar 19, 2009)

HatTrick said:


> Sterling,
> 
> I've rented from a few different companies on Maui, and have often gotten a car right out of the wash after a long wait. Maybe they're understaffed, or they just don't care, but there's no sense of urgency at any of the rental places in the islands.
> 
> ...



With the Amex card, you also need to be careful not to use any coupons or discoutn codes. I have been told by a representative of the comapny that provides the rental car coverage that any discount off the rate will mean that you have not paid for your rental in full using your Amex card and will thus mean there is no coverage under the rental car program.  YMMV -- Suzanne


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## sjuhawk_jd (Mar 19, 2009)

SuzanneSLO said:


> With the Amex card, you also need to be careful not to use any coupons or discoutn codes. I have been told by a representative of the comapny that provides the rental car coverage that any discount off the rate will mean that you have not paid for your rental in full using your Amex card and will thus mean there is no coverage under the rental car program.  YMMV -- Suzanne



Which company representative are we talking about here "car rental" or "AMEX"? The car rental is paid in full when you sign the contract (whatever the discounted rate is) and they ring up your credit card and put a hold on it...


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## HatTrick (Mar 19, 2009)

SuzanneSLO said:


> With the Amex card, you also need to be careful not to use any coupons or discoutn codes. I have been told by a representative of the comapny that provides the rental car coverage that any discount off the rate will mean that you have not paid for your rental in full using your Amex card and will thus mean there is no coverage under the rental car program.  YMMV -- Suzanne



Suzanne,

I see no such language in the AmEx description of coverage.

_*How to Activate Coverage*

Coverage is activated when the Cardmember uses an Enrolled Card to pay the rental fee for the Rental Car and the Cardmember signs the rental agreement for that Rental Car.

Coverage will not be activated if an American Express Card that has been used to pay a rental fee for the Rental Car is enrolled in the Plan after the Cardmember or Authorized Driver Boards the Rental Car for the first time. Coverage also will not be activated if an Enrolled Card has not been used to pay the rental fee, but is subsequently used to pay for Damage to the Rental  Car._

There are exclusions for certain types of vehicles (off-road, limousines, golf carts, etc.) and certain locations (Australia, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Jamaica, New Zealand) but nothing about getting your rental at a discount.


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## easyrider (Mar 19, 2009)

Avis has switched cars on us usally to our benifit by upgrading. Our last car was supose to be a full size that would easily accomidate our lugage but we were upgraded to a nicer car that was smaller.

We mark every part of the car damaged and take pictures of the entire car inside and out. We also check the door locks to see if they work with the key ring door opener. The last car had a bad key ring opener so we had to push the lock button on the doors to lock up and use the key to open up. I also check to see the spare tire, jack and working lights. This seems like alot to do when renting a car but only takes 7 minutes.

On one car in Cabo we found the plastic under the front bumper of the car was tied on with a shoe string. Took a picture. The plastic did scrape a speed bump with our use and fell off. I tied it back on and told Avis what had happened when I returned the car.


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## gmarine (Mar 19, 2009)

Kauai Kid said:


> Before we left for Maui I made reservations with AVIS with an estimate of $400.07.
> 
> When I arrived the car wasn't ready and it took the Agent several minutes to print the contract which required more signatures than when you buy a home.
> I just did as requested and left only to wait another 10 minutes for the car to arrive, soaking wet from the car wash.
> ...



It may sound wrong but they actually did do you a favor by honoring the lower price. You signed a contract for the higher price even though it was different than your reservation. They really could have stuck to it and unfortunately they had your signature on the higher contract. But they did the right thing and honored the lower price. I dont know if you should necessarily be complaining about Avis, but rather complimenting them that they honored a lower price when you signed a contract for a higher price.

You really have to check your rental contract very carefully before leaving the rental office as well as check the vehicle very carefully.


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## Liz Wolf-Spada (Mar 20, 2009)

I an concerned now about using Priceline and AmEx. I always thought I was covered just by running the card through at the rental car company. (Also having paid for Priceline with the card, of course.) Maybe I should call Amex.
Liz


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## HatTrick (Mar 20, 2009)

Liz Wolf-Spada said:


> I an concerned now about using Priceline and AmEx. I always thought I was covered just by running the card through at the rental car company. (Also having paid for Priceline with the card, of course.) Maybe I should call Amex.
> Liz


You should, Liz, and report back what you hear.

I'm sure the claim is bogus. There's nothing in the AmEx documents relating to the price you pay for a rental vehicle. And it really makes no sense.


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## Kauai Kid (Mar 20, 2009)

gmarine said:


> It may sound wrong but they actually did do you a favor by honoring the lower price. You signed a contract for the higher price even though it was different than your reservation. They really could have stuck to it and unfortunately they had your signature on the higher contract. But they did the right thing and honored the lower price. I dont know if you should necessarily be complaining about Avis, but rather complimenting them that they honored a lower price when you signed a contract for a higher price.
> 
> You really have to check your rental contract very carefully before leaving the rental office as well as check the vehicle very carefully.



Remember--they were the ones that originally said I could rent the car for $400.07 on their letter head going through their web site.

Besides I was tired, the plane was 90 minutes late, it was getting dark, the car wasn't ready, my wife was waiting at the terminal for me to pick her up with the luggage.

I'm sure not going to kiss their feet for honoring their original quote even if it didn't have my signature on it.

Back when the economy was better I remember something similar happening with Avis.  Back then, $40 wasn't as important.

However, your points are well taken.  CYA with rental car companies.

Sterling


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## sailingman22 (Mar 20, 2009)

I usually arrive at the car rental after dark and I am required to fill out the damage report under a single night light so I make big circles everywhere and let them sort it out. Especially as the fleet of cars is getting older and worn out.


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## SuzanneSLO (Mar 20, 2009)

HatTrick said:


> Suzanne,
> 
> I see no such language in the AmEx description of coverage.
> 
> ...



I spoke to an Amex representative last Oct and had her e-mail me the Description of Coverage.  In the Section entitled "How to Activate Coverage"  paragraph 4 requires that the Cardmember "uses the Card to pay for the entire auto rental from the Rental Company at the time of vehicle return."

I specifically asked about using a coupon for $$ off posted on a rental agencies website and was told that since the coupon was being used to pay for part of the rental, the Amex coverage would not be activated.  I pointed out that this was nuts because the entire amount that the rental company thought was due was being paid on the card, but she told me that was Amex policy.

I then called the provider of car rental insurance from my Citi MC. Although they had similar language in the "MasterRental" insurance that the cardholder "pay for the entire rental agreement/contract (tax, gasoline and airport fees are not considered rental charges) with your MasterCard" it then continues that if "a rental company promotion/discount of any kind is initially applied toward payment of the rental vehicle, at least one (1) day of rental must be billed to you MasterCard card."  The representative I spoke with confirmed that you could use a discount code and coupon as long as at least one day of rental was charged to your card.

Based on this information, I now use my MasterCard for car rentals, not my Amex.

Also, I have never had a claim against a credit card resulting from a car rental, so my information is based only on the language in these coverage descriptions and what I was told by their representatives last Oct.  I would hope that Amex doesn't actually deny coverage based on using a coupon, but as long as I have the option to use MC instead, I don't need to rely on this hope.  -- Suzanne


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## Kevin (Mar 20, 2009)

SuzanneSLO said:


> With the Amex card, you also need to be careful not to use any coupons or discoutn codes. I have been told by a representative of the comapny that provides the rental car coverage that any discount off the rate will mean that you have not paid for your rental in full using your Amex card and will thus mean there is no coverage under the rental car program.  YMMV -- Suzanne



I just called American Express.  According to the rep... as long as you pay for the rental with your AMEX card, you are covered.  Regardless of the rate, discount etc.

If you are using a dealership or insurance company loaner... in the event your car is being serviced etc., and use your card as a "hold" only... you won't be covered by the CC insurance.  That's because you are not actually paying for the rental with your AMEX card, the insurance company or car dealer is paying for the use of the rental.

Kevin


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## Kevin (Mar 20, 2009)

SuzanneSLO said:


> I spoke to an Amex representative last Oct and had her e-mail me the Description of Coverage.  In the Section entitled "How to Activate Coverage"  paragraph 4 requires that the Cardmember "uses the Card to pay for the entire auto rental from the Rental Company at the time of vehicle return."
> 
> I specifically asked about using a coupon for $$ off posted on a rental agencies website and was told that since the coupon was being used to pay for part of the rental, the Amex coverage would not be activated.  I pointed out that this was nuts because the entire amount that the rental company thought was due was being paid on the card, but she told me that was Amex policy.
> 
> ...



Suzanne,

Okay, I called back after your post.  Thanks for the info.  I spoke with the division that handles this.

If a coupon you use says "FREE"... whether it be a totally free rental or Free day... the insurnace company from AMEX does not cover the car rental even if you pay with the card.

Pricline and entertainment book coupons and the like are covered as long as the aren't "free" and you use the AMEX card for payment.  Whew!!

Between my primary insurance carrier and AMEX, I would appear to be covered.  Except for Full size SUV's and a few other types of cars (exotic sports, etc.)

*Sterling,*

Sorry to hijack...

Bottom line is... as you well know... check your paperwork.  I had a similar sitiuation in Maui but caught it at the counter.   Glad you caught it. 

Kevin


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## HatTrick (Mar 20, 2009)

SuzanneSLO said:


> I spoke to an Amex representative last Oct and had her e-mail me the Description of Coverage.  In the Section entitled "How to Activate Coverage"  paragraph 4 requires that the Cardmember "uses the Card to pay for the entire auto rental from the Rental Company at the time of vehicle return."
> 
> I specifically asked about using a coupon for $$ off posted on a rental agencies website and was told that since the coupon was being used to pay for part of the rental, the Amex coverage would not be activated.  I pointed out that this was nuts because the entire amount that the rental company thought was due was being paid on the card, but she told me that was Amex policy.
> 
> ...



Interesting. I just received a new copy of the description of coverage a few days ago, and all there is regarding activation of coverage are two paragraphs:

*How to Activate Coverage*

Coverage is activated when the Cardmember uses an Enrolled Card to pay the rental fee for the Rental Car and the Cardmember signs the rental agreement for that Rental Car.

Coverage will not be activated if an American Express Card that has been used to pay a rental fee for the Rental Car is enrolled in the Plan after the Cardmember or Authorized Driver Boards the Rental Car for the first time. Coverage also will not be activated if an Enrolled Card has not been used to pay the rental fee, but is subsequently used to pay for Damage to the Rental Car.


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## HatTrick (Mar 20, 2009)

Kevin said:


> Suzanne,
> 
> Okay, I called back after your post.  Thanks for the info.  I spoke with the division that handles this.
> 
> ...



I made my own call, and the key to this whole thing is how the bottom-line rental-agreement cost is paid. You can negotiate whatever up-front deal you want, but when the bottom-line price is calculated, it must be paid entirely with the AmEx card. Getting a $400 rental that you pay, upon returning the vehicle, with a one-day free coupon plus your card won't cut it. Whatever price you walk away from the rental counter with on the day your rental begins, that's what you have to pay with your card.

Makes sense, I guess. Still would be nice to see it in writing.


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## donnaval (Mar 21, 2009)

I had reserved a car through Priceline in December for a January trip, and since my Amex account was new, I thought I'd call up and ask about whether simply paying for the Priceline rental automatically activated the insurance.  She was emphatic - NO - that when I rent through Priceline or Hotwire, etc., I must call in to Amex with the details and they would manually process the insurance fee.


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## Kevin (Mar 21, 2009)

donnaval said:


> I had reserved a car through Priceline in December for a January trip, and since my Amex account was new, I thought I'd call up and ask about whether simply paying for the Priceline rental automatically activated the insurance.  She was emphatic - NO - that when I rent through Priceline or Hotwire, etc., I must call in to Amex with the details and they would manually process the insurance fee.




These reps sound like the exchange company reps.  You can get a different answer with each call!


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## AwayWeGo (Mar 21, 2009)

*Attempted Avis El Switcho In Las Vegas.*

On 1 of our Las Vegas vacations, we snagged a PriceLine rental car before we left.  The agency, which remained unknown till our _Name Your Own Price_ offer was accepted, turned out to be Avis.  No problem.  Avis tries harder. 

When we showed up at the counter & whipped out our PriceLine receipt, the Avis lady punched some computer buttons & said, "Ah, yes.  Here it is.  You are signed up for a 3-cylinder Metro manual transmission subcompact.  For an added $10 daily, you can upgrade to a 4-cylinder compact car with automatic." 

"No thanks," I said.  "We'll take the 3 cylinders." 

The Avis shuttle dropped us off right in front of our PriceLine rental car -- which turned out to be a nice little 4-cylinder Ford Focus with air conditioning & PRNDL & everything.  I didn't see any Metro subcompacts anywhere on the lot. 

Sheesh. 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## Talent312 (Mar 21, 2009)

AwayWeGo said:


> When we showed up at the counter & whipped out our PriceLine receipt, the Avis lady punched some computer buttons & said, "... You are signed up for a 3-cylinder Metro manual transmission subcompact.  For an added $10 daily, you can upgrade to a 4-cylinder compact car with automatic."
> 
> "No thanks," I said.  "We'll take the 3 cylinders."
> 
> The Avis shuttle dropped us off right in front of our PriceLine rental car -- which turned out to be a nice little 4-cylinder Ford Focus with air conditioning & PRNDL & everything.  I didn't see any Metro subcompacts anywhere on the lot.



Reminds me of a SFO rental from long-ago.  We reserved a compact for a camping trip.  They offered an upgrade, but when we said no, all they had left were full-size, aircraft carriers.  Ours felt so heavy that at one point, I declined to obey a stop sign, fearing that I'd slide backwards off one of those SF hills.

I've actually relied Am-Ex coverage a couple of times.  They came thru, notwithstanding my using a discount coupon.  My understanding was that, as long as no other card or cash was used to pay a part of the bill, we were covered.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (May 1, 2009)

AwayWeGo said:


> On 1 of our Las Vegas vacations, we snagged a PriceLine rental car before we left.  The agency, which remained unknown till our _Name Your Own Price_ offer was accepted, turned out to be Avis.  No problem.  Avis tries harder.
> 
> When we showed up at the counter & whipped out our PriceLine receipt, the Avis lady punched some computer buttons & said, "Ah, yes.  Here it is.  You are signed up for a 3-cylinder Metro manual transmission subcompact.  For an added $10 daily, you can upgrade to a 4-cylinder compact car with automatic."
> 
> ...



There's nothing at all unusual about that with any rental company.  In my experience, most of the time when the rental company tries to sell me an upgrade at the counter it's because they don't have the car I reserved and they want to get me to pay for an upgrade for the car they are going to give me anyway.  

It's certainly not unique to Avis, and it occurs so often that it's clear the rental agents are trained to do that.  I suspect there is indicator that shows on their terminal advising them to try to sell the upgrade.

The lesson is to always decline the upgrade when offered at the rental counter.  At least half the time you're going to get the upgrade anyway.


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## donnaval (May 1, 2009)

We had an unpleasant experience with Avis this past week.  We bid on a car through Priceline, and Avis accepted our bid.  Paid in full, right?  But we were unhappy to learn that all of the Avis cars at this location had a toll paying thingie on the window so you can go through Sun Pass or Easy Pass lines on toll roads and the tolls are automatically billed to your credit card on file...well, you are charged $2.50 PER RENTAL DAY for this "convenience"!  Not only were we not planning to use any toll roads, but we would also prefer to pay tolls as incurred, if we did happen onto one unexpectedly.   I spoke with the counter person and her manager and was politely informed that there was no way to opt out of the additional charge.

I'm going to make a complaint through Priceline.  The $2.50 additional per day was not part of my bid to them.

GRRRR!!!!!


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