# Disney theme park attendance down 50% over the last 3 months



## rickandcindy23 (May 5, 2009)

I just heard this on Fox News.  No wonder there have been so many layoffs.


----------



## dougp26364 (May 5, 2009)

This really is no surprise to me. Even though my job is relatively secure, I'm not paying the prices Disney's asking for a day at one of their parks. I can't imagine that many people will feel they have that sort of discreationary income with the spector of a bad economy hanging over their heads. 

IMHO, Disney would be wise to reduce the admission fee's with the thought of making it up on purchases made within the park. Or at least with the thought that they won't lose those sales as well since people aren't even coming in the gates. Plus, it would be a nice PR move on Disney's part and a great advertising campaign.


----------



## kool_kat (May 5, 2009)

However, over Easter vacation they had to close the parks due to capacity on several days...go figuer


----------



## pcgirl54 (May 6, 2009)

sorry dup post


----------



## pcgirl54 (May 6, 2009)

Disney should reduce the ticket prices like Schooner Tuna in the movie Mr. Mom for customer loyalty in these tough economic times. I agree.

Something like :Kids are half price. 1 per each adult. 


I know there are hotel pkg incentives and the Magical Express from the airport is free but they need to do something else.


----------



## steved2psi (May 6, 2009)

*Bad info*

Per their 10-Q operating profits at the theme parks were down 50%, attendance down only 1%.  Not apples to apples with Easter in April this year vs. March in 2008.  Hotel occupancy at 89% vs 88% in 2008.


----------



## GadgetRick (May 6, 2009)

kool_kat said:


> However, over Easter vacation they had to close the parks due to capacity on several days...go figuer



I'll second that. I was there! It was the worst I've ever seen it (been there about 40 times various times of the year).

Here's a pic. I've got more but this will give you an idea of what it was like...





Oh, and this wasn't even the worst of it...


----------



## rkdahl (May 6, 2009)

Actually I think this was reported and stated incorrectly. I heard the same statement on the Fox Report with Sheppard Smith then I later read the news release from Disney and the quote was: 



> Disney said the recession led visitors to spend less money in its theme parks, though U.S. attendance was even with last year because of heavy discounting. Parks and resorts operating profits fell 50 percent to $171 million, while revenue dipped 12 percent to $2.41 billion.



So I think profits dropped 50%, not attendance. Hence everyones observations on crowd levels being in conflict with financial data.


----------



## dougp26364 (May 6, 2009)

rkdahl said:


> Actually I think this was reported and stated incorrectly. I heard the same statement on the Fox Report with Sheppard Smith then I later read the news release from Disney and the quote was:
> 
> 
> 
> So I think profits dropped 50%, not attendance. Hence everyones observations on crowd levels being in conflict with financial data.



To me this is amazing when you consider how much a day at Disney costs. The fact that park attendance could remain even would be a tribute to the sales job Disney does to get people into their parks, which aren't much more than a huge themed shopping mall. Still, is it any wonder consumer spending would be down? In 2000 it cost us over $50 for three hamburgers, three medium size drinks and three oders of cole slaw (they didn't have french fries) for lunch.   It's one of the reasons I'll never consider going back until we have grand kids old enough to enjoy the kiddie rides.


----------



## steved2psi (May 6, 2009)

*Other details from the 10Q*

The avg revenue per day at the hotels (room rate, food and beverages at the hotels) dropped from $239 per day to $199 per day.  Guest spending at the parks was down 4%.


----------



## rickandcindy23 (May 6, 2009)

rkdahl said:


> Actually I think this was reported and stated incorrectly. I heard the same statement on the Fox Report with Sheppard Smith then I later read the news release from Disney and the quote was:
> 
> 
> 
> So I think profits dropped 50%, not attendance. Hence everyones observations on crowd levels being in conflict with financial data.



Well that explains it.  News media is always trying to make things sound worse than they are.


----------



## Lisa P (May 6, 2009)

Disney's room revenues may be down with their own discount deals on rooms (pay for a few nights, get a few nights free).  And park spending is probably down as people everywhere are paying closer attention to their discretionary spending.  I'm sure a lot of people who opted not to cancel their spring break vacations are still watching their splurges more.

Greater Orlando has been hurting, along with the rest of the tourism industry.  On any given day, Disney's parks have more day guests than onsiters.  With the 2nd day free at Sea World and $99/week passes to the 2 Universal parks, Disney may be seeing a slight decrease in the number of days an offsiter visits their parks.  The tougher the economy, the better the competition's deals look.  And when I've spent twice the price to get in the gate, I'm not keen on spending theme park prices for food and souvies.  That may be some of what they're seeing too.


----------



## BocaBum99 (May 6, 2009)

GadgetRick said:


> I'll second that. I was there! It was the worst I've ever seen it (been there about 40 times various times of the year).
> 
> Here's a pic. I've got more but this will give you an idea of what it was like...
> 
> ...



That looks like about 50% occupancy to me.  Disney... Easter.... Yes.  That's 50% full.


----------



## GadgetRick (May 6, 2009)

Here's another. This one was about 10:00ish.






It was very crowded for sure.

I know we didn't spend the money we would normally spend when in the parks. I'm sure people aren't spending the money they usually do. What amazes me about any company is, profits go down (but they still make a profit) and they freak. Now, I'm no economic major but, the last time I checked, _profit_ is what's left over once all the bills are paid. So, if you're earning a profit--no matter how small--should be a _good_ thing during these tough times. Of course, we all have to listen to what Wall Street says because they know what they're doing... :annoyed:


----------



## kool_kat (May 7, 2009)

I can attest to the deep discounting drawing folks in.  We had absolutely no plans to go to Disney this year, until we got an e-mail about the military discount.  My dad gets a free five day park hopper ticket and five of us get one for 125 (little less than 1/2 price).  So now there will be 7 more people in the park that had no intention of going to disney.  plus I exchanged into DVC, so Disney isn't getting any money for rooms from me.  My parents are staying at Disney, but there is a 40% military room discount.  So while they got us into the park, they did it at about 1/2 the normal price.


----------



## pgnewarkboy (May 7, 2009)

We were there over Easter with the grandkids.  We had one extremely crowded park day at the Magic Kingdom.  The second day at the Magic Kingdom was not bad at all.  The other parks were busy but not overly crowded.   Our longest wait was about an hour at the newest ride at Hollywood studios and about an hour for the buzz lightyear ride.

Tourguide Mike's itinerary may actually have been a help with the crowds.

We have been to Disney World 5 times.  Except for the magic kingdom, I thought the quality was down during this Easter break.  In all the other parks it was evident that there was less help.  

This is it for us for a looong time!  We enjoyed the grandkids having a good time.  Next time, we will take them elsewhere.


----------



## rickandcindy23 (May 7, 2009)

I use www.touringplans.com to determine when is the best time to go and which days to visit which parks.  This is the very best way to have a Magical experience.  Any early entry day or extended hours for Disney guests is a bad day to go to that particular park.  We do enjoy some of the extended hours at MK, because we stay until close and get to ride everything more than we even want or need!


----------



## TerriJ (May 7, 2009)

We were in Orlando in early April, but did not go to the parks.  I would swear we were the only ones though, everyone else was going!  I would hate to see full crowds, too crowded for me.


----------



## GadgetRick (May 8, 2009)

kool_kat said:


> I can attest to the deep discounting drawing folks in.  We had absolutely no plans to go to Disney this year, until we got an e-mail about the military discount.  My dad gets a free five day park hopper ticket and five of us get one for 125 (little less than 1/2 price).  So now there will be 7 more people in the park that had no intention of going to disney.  plus I exchanged into DVC, so Disney isn't getting any money for rooms from me.  My parents are staying at Disney, but there is a 40% military room discount.  So while they got us into the park, they did it at about 1/2 the normal price.


It's good to see more companies offering discounts to the military. When I was in (late 80s) discounts were few and far between...

To give you an idea about crowds (other than my pics), at EPCOT one evening, Mission Space had a 230 minute wait, this was at 7:00pm. Park closed at 9:00. Now, I'm pretty good with numbers and, the last time I checked, this means almost _four hours_ wait time! Park was closing in 2 hours. I've NEVER seen a wait that long...


----------



## stugy (Jun 10, 2009)

When we refer to "over Easter" or "during Easter Vacation"  do we also mean the week following Easter Sunday.  We have a confirmed vacation for April 3 to the 10th next year.........hoping the crowds won't be so bad.  Any input?
Pat


----------



## rsackett (Jun 10, 2009)

Both the week before and after Easter are very crowded.

Ray


----------



## rickandcindy23 (Jun 10, 2009)

According to Bob Sehlinger, The Unofficial Guide to Disneyworld, current crowd levels for summer are 8's on a scale of 1-10 for crowd levels, with 10 being highest.  

The week you are going, April 3rd-10th, crowd levels will be 9 the entire week.    Saw this on www.touringplans.com, Sehlinger's website.


----------



## Twinkstarr (Jun 10, 2009)

We were at Vero Beach 4/4-4/11, the people who camped out next to us at the pool had a college age daughter. She headed over to WDW one day. It was a nuthouse. Reports on DIS that they had park closures due to capacity levels.

I've never heard of that over the 2 weeks of Easter, that's usually a problem the week before NYE.


----------



## JimC (Jun 10, 2009)

According to Orlando Sentinel article, 2009 will see the worst fall-off in tourist tax revenues ever.  Same goes with passenger traffic at MCO.

I can tell you that this is very bad news for central Florida economy.


----------



## rickandcindy23 (Jun 10, 2009)

JimC said:


> According to Orlando Sentinel article, 2009 will see the worst fall-off in tourist tax revenues ever.  Same goes with passenger traffic at MCO.
> 
> I can tell you that this is very bad news for central Florida economy.



We have been there five weeks so far this year.  We can't do it alone!  :rofl:


----------



## gjw007 (Jun 10, 2009)

steved2psi said:


> Per their 10-Q operating profits at the theme parks were down 50%, attendance down only 1%.  Not apples to apples with Easter in April this year vs. March in 2008.  Hotel occupancy at 89% vs 88% in 2008.



I can see where profits were down tremendously even when attendance was near normal.  Last December, there were 50% sales across the park on items such as Xmas decorations, shirts, towels, etc.  Assuming that these are items that people normally pick up, these would make up a great deal of the profit and the sales, although it moves the merchandise, does hit the bottom line.

I was there the end of February and although I have no comparisons to the past since I don't normally go in February, I thought it was reasonably busy but not as busy as other times that I go.  It definitely was busy for my May 12 visit but not as busy as other times (August).  I can relate to Jim's pictures.  I will be there from June 15 to 19.  I don't normally go in the summer when it is so hot and busy but my nieces want to go and it was the time they could all get off.  So I'll have been there almost 3 weeks so far this year with at least another 2 in December.


----------



## JimC (Jun 10, 2009)

rickandcindy23 said:


> We have been there five weeks so far this year.  We can't do it alone!  :rofl:



We live here and still stay on property about 25 days each year, plus weekend day trips for concerts and the like.


----------



## JeffW (Jun 10, 2009)

On the other hand, I wouldn't assume that Disney is supermarket-like, charging only 3%-4% above their costs.  I'm guessing they have a decent markup to provide some buffer, and with 9/11, Katrina (to some degree), and high gas prices last year, they'd be fools to not project some type of cyclical dip.  Lastly, unlike some other places, Disney I think almost always bounces back in attendance.  It's not like after a reduction if visits, people find a new place to vacation to.  

Jeff


----------



## wmmmmm (Jun 11, 2009)

rickandcindy23 said:


> We have been there five weeks so far this year.  We can't do it alone!  :rofl:


We're trying!  We normally go once a year but we will be heading down again in two weeks.  That's five times (18 nights) in 15 months.


----------



## JimC (Jun 11, 2009)

The pictures are helpful, but they are isolated snapshots without context.  You need to be there regularly if casual observation is how you are going to reach a conclusion.  I've been in the parks most every weekend this year.  My impression is that attendance is lower.

But it is better to look at data from multiple sources to get the whole picture.  Look at hotel tourism taxes, hotel occupancy rates, hotel average nightly rates, passenger counts at MCO, sales tax revenue, attendance (but harder to get).  What it shows is that fewer people are coming to Orlando and those who are -- are spending less.


----------



## bnoble (Jun 11, 2009)

Traffic to Orlando is down.  The reported numbers from each theme park operator suggest that Disney has done better holding their attendance numbers than any of the others.  Spending is absolutely down.


----------



## GadgetRick (Jun 12, 2009)

bnoble said:


> Traffic to Orlando is down.  The reported numbers from each theme park operator suggest that Disney has done better holding their attendance numbers than any of the others.  Spending is absolutely down.


I'm guessing that has something to do with the offers they've had. Really great offers but eating into their profits pretty badly. I understand people aren't spending what they normally spend in the parks either--I know we didn't when we were last down in April.


----------



## FlyKaesan (Jun 17, 2009)

I was in Disney during May and I have never seen so many people at Disney.  I am sure Christmas and Thanksgiving there are more but it was most crowded this year than previous visits.
I stayed after the close for Magic hours but the line wait was around 30 minutes so I decided to go back to the resort.
I don't think people are spending as much as before but I bought 3 tickets and it costed over $1200.  Disney ticket sales person seemed surprised by us.  I am not sure why.


----------

