# Jungle Bliss vs Grand Luxxe Riviera Maya



## dioxide45

Looking at these two resorts in the II directory. Are these the same property? Some of the photos are the same and it seems that the address is the same.

It seems that this property is also a fair distance from Playa del Carmen and is actually perhaps closer to Puerto Morelos than it is Playa del Carmen. How do you get around if you stay here? We have never rented a car in Mexico, is it almost a necessity here? Or is there enough public transportation. Is there anything (restaurants, shopping) within walking distance like there is in Cancun or right in Playa del Carmen?


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## hurnik

dioxide45 said:


> Looking at these two resorts in the II directory. Are these the same property? Some of the photos are the same and it seems that the address is the same.
> 
> It seems that this property is also a fair distance from Playa del Carmen and is actually perhaps closer to Puerto Morelos than it is Playa del Carmen. How do you get around if you stay here? We have never rented a car in Mexico, is it almost a necessity here? Or is there enough public transportation. Is there anything (restaurants, shopping) within walking distance like there is in Cancun or right in Playa del Carmen?



The resort complex is about a 20 minute ride to Playa and about a 30 minute ride to Cancun airport.  I can't remember how long it took the bus to get to Puerto Morelos, maybe 10-15 minutes?

I would choose the Grand Luxxe over the Bliss any day.  If it's the GRAND Bliss, then I'd still prefer the GL over the GB, but the GB is nice as well.

The Bliss is basicall a Mayan Palace with updated furniture, IMO.

There are shuttles that run like every 30 minutes to Playa, I *think* when we were there in Jan 2013 it was $50 *pesos* per person each way.

You could rent a car if you're daring, but you also have to purchase special insurance in addition to the rental car and some people on TA have reported being stopped by the police and basically forced to pay bribes even if it's illegal.

I've stayed there 2 times (once in Grand Mayan, once in Grand Luxxe).  Didn't use a car either time and just did the shuttle.  Only went to Playa for an entire day once and took a cab back.  I *think* the cab back was cheaper as I vaguely recall it was $40 pesos for the trip (that was in 2011).

IF you choose Grand Luxxe, try to request a unit that faces TOWARDS the resort (if you look on a map the buildings are triangle shaped).  You want the side of the triangle that's facing toward the resort, not the other 2 sides.  There's a resort next door that blasts loud music until about 2:00 a.m. every morning and if you face that side, it'll come in through the windows.  Sound carries more on higher floors as well.  Granted, there's only 3 stories due to code restrictions on buildings there.

But you'll have access to the GL only pool area (very nice, staff were very well attentive), the pool USED to be heated (don't know if that's still the case), and the Burger Custom Made is right there (only GL guests may use it) which, back in 2013 had very good food and service (you could easily split a meal between two people or save half of it and reheat it in your kitchen the next day).

--Kevin


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## rpennisi

Jungle Bliss must be the Grand Bliss, since the Grand Bliss is behind the Grand Mayan Jungle building 8/9.  The Bliss is among the Mayan Palace buildings 10-11.

I second the choice of Grand Luxxe over Grand or Jungle Bliss for all the reasons stated above.


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## lily28

Shuttle price to playa del Carmen has gone up to 80 peso each way in December 2014. It was 50 peso when we were there in august 2014. I was told the price increase was due to the economy in Mexico


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## ilene13

dioxide45 said:


> Looking at these two resorts in the II directory. Are these the same property? Some of the photos are the same and it seems that the address is the same.
> 
> It seems that this property is also a fair distance from Playa del Carmen and is actually perhaps closer to Puerto Morelos than it is Playa del Carmen. How do you get around if you stay here? We have never rented a car in Mexico, is it almost a necessity here? Or is there enough public transportation. Is there anything (restaurants, shopping) within walking distance like there is in Cancun or right in Playa del Carmen?



We have exchanged to the Grand Luxxe three times and we have two more coming up.  It is a beautiful property.  It is much closer to Puerto Morales than Playa del Carmen.  There are excellent restaurants on property but we do go into Puerto Morales and Playa for dinner also. Actually when we were there in November, we also drove in to Cancun one night for dinner.

That being said, we do rent a car whenever we are in the Cancun area (3/4 weeks a year).  We have  platinum AMEX card which covers all insurance except the 3rd party liability, which we do add.  If you want to go into PM for dinner, try John Gray's kitchen for dinner, it's fabulous.  Also in Playa try El Fogon, wonderful hole in the wall tacos.  Also Yaxache fot Mayan food.


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## atom

I thought GL and GM guests can use the MP pools, but not the other way around?  The last time I stayed at the GM, we were able to use the MP pools.  Our friends, staying at MP, were not allowed in the GM pools and garden area.


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## hurnik

atom said:


> I thought GL and GM guests can use the MP pools, but not the other way around?  The last time I stayed at the GM, we were able to use the MP pools.  Our friends, staying at MP, were not allowed in the GM pools and garden area.



Unless they recently changed it, that's how it works.  Exception being in NV where the MP can use the GM pool area/lazy river.


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## pittle

hurnik said:


> Unless they recently changed it, that's how it works.  Exception being in NV where the MP can use the GM pool area/lazy river.



And, that is fairly new for NV.  That has been one of the biggest complaints about MP/GM pools.  NV had an awesome GM pool and MP people could not use it.  In Acapulco and Riviera Maya, the MP had the best pool.   From what I understand, the new pool in Puerto Penasco is exclusive to GM for now.  It is going to have a lazy river and kids pool area, so, it may become available for MP too.


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## MuranoJo

Good to hear about them relaxing the pool restrictions.


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## dioxide45

Okay. I am trying to find out some more information on the myriad of properties that seem to be available in II.

*These have inventory available for the dates I am searching;*
Grand Luxxe Residence Club Riviera Maya - LXR
Mayan Palace Riviera Maya - MYI
The Bliss Jungle Riviera Maya IV - BJU
The Grand Bliss Riviera Maya - GBM
The Grand Mayan Riviera Maya - MYU

*These are in the resort directory, but don't have any inventory when searching. Though I think they are part of resort groups above.*
The Bliss Jungle - BJV
The Grand Bliss Riviera Maya - GBN

*This is what I find when searching in the resort directory;*
The Bliss Jungle - BJU, BJV
The Grand Bliss Riviera Maya - GBM, GBN
Grand Luxxe Residence Club Riviera Maya - LXR
The Grand Mayan Riviera Maya - MYU
Mayan Palace Riviera Maya - MYI

Why is there an inconsistency in the naming of The Bliss Jungle/The Bliss Jungle Riviera Maya IV between what you see in a search and what is showing in the II resort directory?

When I look on the Videnta Resorts website, I see the following properties;

The Grand Mayan Jungle
The Grand Bliss
Mayan Palace
The Bliss
The Grand Luxxe I
The Grand Luxxe II
The Grand Luxxe III Spa
The Grand Luxxe IV Residences (Under Construction)
Grand Mayan Lago

I am trying to figure out how the properties in the II resort directory/inventory match up to those on the Videnta Resort website map. Is it something like this?
BJU or BJV.....The Grand Mayan Jungle
GBM or GBN.....The Grand Bliss
MYI............Mayan Palace
GBM or GBN.....The Bliss
???............The Grand Luxxe I
???............The Grand Luxxe II
???............The Grand Luxxe III Spa
LXR............The Grand Luxxe IV Residences (Under Construction)
MYU............Grand Mayan Lago

Also, do all of these trade primarily in RCI, is that why none of them are rated in II?
I have also read some information about access within the bigger complex. Some properties may not have access to certain pools or restaurants? Can anyone clarify. We are always looking at getting back to Cancun or the Riviera Maya and since Westin Lagunamar is such a hard exchange without Starwood preference, I am exploring other options.


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## raygo123

Go to vidanta.com

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk


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## dioxide45

raygo123 said:


> Go to vidanta.com
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



Not trying to sound snotty, but did you read post #10? I indicated in there that I looked at the map on the Vidanta website. Thus I am trying to match-up the resort names from that map to the resorts in the II directory. I didn't find anywhere on the Vidanta website where they tell me what the II resort code is.


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## dioxide45

Here is what the website indicates about use of pools

Guests at *Grand Luxxe Riviera Maya* can luxuriate in beautiful, pristine pools, including a Grand Luxxe-exclusive pool, as well as The Beach Club and The Grand Mayan and Mayan Palace pools.

Guests at *The Grand Bliss Riviera Maya* can luxuriate in beautiful pools throughout this gorgeous, lush destination, including The Grand Mayan and Mayan Palace pools.

Your membership at *The Grand Mayan* allows you access to a variety of gorgeous pools, including expansive, sunny options and secluded, quiet places to lounge.

Guests at *The Bliss Riviera Maya* can luxuriate in the cool, pristine waters of the Mayan Palace pools.

Your membership at *Mayan Palace* allows you access to beautiful pools, where you can spend the day splashing away or lounging poolside with a cocktail.

These are the pools that are identified on the property map.

The Grand Luxxe Pool
The Beach Club
Mayan Palace Pool
The Grand Mayan Pool

Reading the descriptions above, I am interpenetrating it to think pool access is as follows;
Grand Luxxe Riviera Maya - 1, 2, 3, 4
The Grand Bliss Riviera Maya - 3, 4
The Grand Mayan - 4
The Bliss Riviera Maya - 3
Mayan Palace - 3

Property Map


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## GrayFal

Just to simplify...you want the best units/amenities and this is Grand Luxxe. If you are there, you have access to everything you would need or want.


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## dioxide45

GrayFal said:


> Just to simplify...you want the best units/amenities and this is Grand Luxxe. If you are there, you have access to everything you would need or want.



Thanks. Yeah, that was kinda the conclusion that I was coming to. It looks like the Grand Luxxe are the only ones with a full kitchen also. How do these differ from the limited kitchens at the other properties? In the event that perhaps Grand Luxxe is not available for certain dates when we want to travel, I am just trying to compare to the other options.


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## GrayFal

dioxide45 said:


> Thanks. Yeah, that was kinda the conclusion that I was coming to. It looks like the Grand Luxxe are the only ones with a full kitchen also. How do these differ from the limited kitchens at the other properties? In the event that perhaps Grand Luxxe is not available for certain dates when we want to travel, I am just trying to compare to the other options.



If you can't get Grand Luxxe, take Grand Mayan. But the Luxxe units are beyondddddddd fabulous. Even the studio portion is set up as a mini one bedroom.  Really awesome!
Hold out for the Luxxe. If you must take GM, take E-Plus


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## dioxide45

GrayFal said:


> If you can't get Grand Luxxe, take Grand Mayan. But the Luxxe units are beyondddddddd fabulous. Even the studio portion is set up as a mini one bedroom.  Really awesome!
> Hold out for the Luxxe. If you must take GM, take E-Plus



That is the problem, I can't take EPlus being an enrolled Marriott owner. So if I wanted to retrade, it would be another full exchange fee.


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## GrayFal

dioxide45 said:


> That is the problem, I can't take EPlus being an enrolled Marriott owner. So if I wanted to retrade, it would be another full exchange fee.



Hmmm, are you sure???
Once you trade outside the "family" it should be business as usual. 

Have you had this issue before.???


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## dioxide45

GrayFal said:


> Hmmm, are you sure???
> Once you trade outside the "family" it should be business as usual.
> 
> Have you had this issue before.???



You would think, but there is no EPlus option when going through a booking. This is per the EPlus FAQ on the II website.



> _Currently, there are some members who do not have the option to purchase E-Plus. At this time, E-Plus is not available for Marriott Club Destinations, Club Intrawest or Diamond memberships._


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## GrayFal

dioxide45 said:


> You would think, but there is no EPlus option when going through a booking. This is per the EPlus FAQ on the II website.



Maybe ask a non DC Marriott owner to do a "mock booking" to see if it is given as an option???? Or else "gasp " call????

As you know, it is not necessary for m to m as we get free retrades.  
But non DC people do not have the same privileges.


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## dioxide45

GrayFal said:


> Maybe ask a non DC Marriott owner to do a "mock booking" to see if it is given as an option???? Or else "gasp " call????
> 
> As you know, it is not necessary for m to m as we get free retrades.
> But non DC people do not have the same privileges.



Non DC members using an individual II account do have EPlus as an option. Just not us DC enrolled owners with the corporate II accounts. I suspect it is because they can't make it work technologically with the free M to M trades.


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## GrayFal

dioxide45 said:


> Non DC members using an individual II account do have EPlus as an option. Just not us DC enrolled owners with the corporate II accounts. I suspect it is because they can't make it work technologically with the free M to M trades.



Yes, I just tried and it was not offered.  

I know you are generally a shoulder season traveler....I think I would hold out for a 1BR Luxxe


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## rpennisi

"Reading the descriptions above, I am interpenetrating it to think pool access is as follows;
Grand Luxxe Riviera Maya - 1, 2, 3, 4
The Grand Bliss Riviera Maya - 3, 4
The Grand Mayan - 4
The Bliss Riviera Maya - 3
Mayan Palace - 3"

I believe that Grand Bliss should be 2,3,4
                    Grand Mayan should be 3,4

Definitely go for the Grand Luxxe if you can, and Grand Bliss as second choice.  I have stayed at the Grand Luxxe at both RM and NV, and the GB at NV.  You can't go wrong with either one.  But even the Grand Mayan at RM has a great pool area, so not too shabby either.


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## dioxide45

rpennisi said:


> I believe that Grand Bliss should be 2,3,4
> Grand Mayan should be 3,4
> 
> Definitely go for the Grand Luxxe if you can, and Grand Bliss as second choice.  I have stayed at the Grand Luxxe at both RM and NV, and the GB at NV.  You can't go wrong with either one.  But even the Grand Mayan at RM has a great pool area, so not too shabby either.



#2 is The Beach Club. I don't see where that is indicated in the description for the Grand Bliss; however, it is definitely closer to the Bliss than it is the Grand Luxxe which does have access. The Grand Mayan didn't have much of a description as to what pools it had access to, so I just matched it to the pool of the same name.


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## T-Dot-Traveller

*Going off resort - try Collectivo option to Playa del Carmen*



dioxide45 said:


> Looking at these two resorts in the II directory. Are these the same property? Some of the photos are the same and it seems that the address is the same.
> 
> It seems that this property is also a fair distance from Playa del Carmen and is actually perhaps closer to Puerto Morelos than it is Playa del Carmen. How do you get around if you stay here? We have never rented a car in Mexico, is it almost a necessity here? Or is there enough public transportation. Is there anything (restaurants, shopping) within walking distance like there is in Cancun or right in Playa del Carmen?


---------------
Hi - regarding transportation options -there is a TUG thread from Nov. 1 2015 
" Best way to Wal-Mart from GM Riviera Maya - started by wheaties 

It includes info on using the Collectivo system most resort staff use to get to work . It also gives recent prices on cabs and resort van transportation .

Hope this helps Dioxide 45 - once you get there - 
as it does not sound like a rental is necessary


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## rpennisi

dioxide45 said:


> #2 is The Beach Club. I don't see where that is indicated in the description for the Grand Bliss; however, it is definitely closer to the Bliss than it is the Grand Luxxe which does have access. The Grand Mayan didn't have much of a description as to what pools it had access to, so I just matched it to the pool of the same name.



The Beach Club was being built last time we were at the resort for the Grand Bliss (not to be confused with the Bliss which is a slightly upgraded Mayan Palace located between Mayan Palace buildings 10/11).  It is the closest you can get to the beach from the Grand Bliss buildings, which is not close, but it looked to be very nicely done.  It is between the models building and Cafe del Lago.

The Grand Mayan has a very nice pool area next to the GM check in building.  It is a very diverse area with lots of nooks and seating.  The Grand Mayan also has a lakeside beach area just south of the large grocery, shopping, restaurant building which fronts the large Mayan Palace pool complex.


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## Lingber

dioxide45 said:


> #2 is The Beach Club. I don't see where that is indicated in the description for the Grand Bliss; however, it is definitely closer to the Bliss than it is the Grand Luxxe which does have access. The Grand Mayan didn't have much of a description as to what pools it had access to, so I just matched it to the pool of the same name.



We were at Grand Luxxe this past summer and the Beach Club was for the use of BOTH Grand Bliss and Grand Luxxe. I would email the concierge to see if anything changed.

My first preference is G.L. because they have their own pool and gym with spa. The units and service were exceptional. I have stayed in Hyatt, Starwood and Marriott and these were truly at the top.  If that wasn't available I would for sure take Grand Bliss. The units are similar to G.L. and the Beach Club pool area is a really nice amenity to have. We would really miss it if we returned and didn't have access.


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## PGtime

dioxide45 said:


> #2 is The Beach Club. I don't see where that is indicated in the description for the Grand Bliss; however, it is definitely closer to the Bliss than it is the Grand Luxxe which does have access. QUOTE]
> 
> We stayed at the Grand Bliss from 12/18/2015 - 12/25/2015.  We had access to the Beach Club (very nice).  When my sister's kids (staying at GM) showed up at the Beach Club, they were politely told that the Beach Club was only for GB & GL.
> 
> We have also stayed at the GL and agree it is the best on the property but the GB is still very nice.


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## Asl18940

I had something similar happen, but there is a potential solution.  SInce the 2 bdrm GL unit sleeps 8 that gives 8 available wrist bands. We just had 4 in our GL master suite, so they let us add my sister and her two kids to our suite and they got GL wrist bands even though they slept at the GM.  Nothing dishonest here again since the GL master suites are described as sleeping up to 8.


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## dioxide45

*Updating based on information in this thread*

*These are the pools that are identified on the property map.*

The Grand Luxxe Pool
The Beach Club
Mayan Palace Pool
The Grand Mayan Pool

*Access is as follows;*
Grand Luxxe Riviera Maya - 1, 2, 3, 4
The Grand Bliss Riviera Maya - 2, 3, 4
The Grand Mayan - 3, 4
The Bliss Riviera Maya - 3
Mayan Palace - 3


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## dominidude

As usual, thanks to all contributors  in this thread for the wealth of information.

My understanding is that the resort charges $75 upon check in, and that this check in covers, among other things, the shuttle from the airport to the resort, but not vice versa.

So, that begs the question, how much is it to take the bus back from the resort to the airport? Is it per person? we have six people travelling.


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## dioxide45

dominidude said:


> As usual, thanks to all contributors  in this thread for the wealth of information.
> 
> My understanding is that the resort charges $75 upon check in, and that this check in covers, among other things, the shuttle from the airport to the resort, but not vice versa.
> 
> So, that begs the question, how much is it to take the bus back from the resort to the airport? Is it per person? we have six people travelling.



I would actually book a one way transfer through USA Transfers. Looks like it is $70 one way for 6 people from Playa del Carmen.


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## pittle

dominidude said:


> As usual, thanks to all contributors  in this thread for the wealth of information.
> 
> My understanding is that the resort charges $75 upon check in, and that this check in covers, among other things, the shuttle from the airport to the resort, but not vice versa.
> 
> So, that begs the question, how much is it to take the bus back from the resort to the airport? Is it per person? we have six people travelling.



We own at Mayan World and will be using an exchange this fall at Grand Mayan.  We will not be using the shuttle since we will have been in PV for 2 weeks, but we will not complain about the $75 fee because it does cover internet and we have had to pay more than $75 for that before.  I think it cover Gym and some other things, but do not have the list in front of me.  One of the Taxi Vans will cost you about $70-$75 for 6 people to get back to the airport.


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## Catira

dominidude said:


> As usual, thanks to all contributors  in this thread for the wealth of information.
> 
> My understanding is that the resort charges $75 upon check in, and that this check in covers, among other things, the shuttle from the airport to the resort, but not vice versa.
> 
> So, that begs the question, how much is it to take the bus back from the resort to the airport? Is it per person? we have six people travelling.



$15 per person for transport back to airport


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## Hankmoon

dioxide45 said:


> Looking at these two resorts in the II directory. Are these the same property? Some of the photos are the same and it seems that the address is the same.
> 
> It seems that this property is also a fair distance from Playa del Carmen and is actually perhaps closer to Puerto Morelos than it is Playa del Carmen. How do you get around if you stay here? We have never rented a car in Mexico, is it almost a necessity here? Or is there enough public transportation. Is there anything (restaurants, shopping) within walking distance like there is in Cancun or right in Playa del Carmen?



Grand Luxxe is the top of the line.


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## jd2601

I am sorry if this has been answered.  Is there a difference between this resort and the Grand Luxxe that I have traded into in the past?  I do not remember it referred to as Grand Luxxe Jungle?  Thanks jd2601


Resort Details & Photos
*Grand Luxxe Jungle Riviera Maya*
Playa del Carmen, QuintanaRoo , MEXICO


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## hurnik

As per the Vidanta website:

The Jungle Suite has one bedroom with a king-size bed and in-room TV, a gourmet kitchen with breakfast bar, an attached dining room with formal dining table and sideboard, a living room with two sleeper sofas and a TV, two bathrooms and one Jacuzzi tub, and a private terrace, complete with outdoor lounge furniture.

Basically you are losing the outdoor balcony/deck and plunge pool (that's the biggest change, IMO).  I also believe they are smaller in sq footage vs. the regular Grand Luxxe.
http://www.vidanta.com/en/destinations/riviera-maya/accommodations


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## Hankmoon

Is the Grand Bliss one bedroom suite the same size as the Grand Luxxe one bedroom?


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## T-Dot-Traveller

I believe Grand Bliss may be the same sq footage as Grand Mayan 

The Jungle Grand Luxxe 1 bedroom is likely 1100 -1200 sq feet . 
This is based on the frame of the buildings - which were originally to be MP . 
The Jungle GL is likely the footprint of a 2 bedroom MP . 

The Vidanta Traveler or website showed a floor plan but did not list sq feet 

Perhaps someone who has stayed in these RM units can confirm


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## mikenk

Hankmoon said:


> Is the Grand Bliss one bedroom suite the same size as the Grand Luxxe one bedroom?



No, as TDT said, the GB 1 bedroom is close to the same size as GM. The GL-suite 1 bedroom is larger and the GL-Villa one bedroom is even larger.

Mike


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## pittle

I think the 1-bedroom Grand Luxxe Jungle unit is the same size as a 2-bedroom Mayan Palace or Bliss unit.  It has 2 bathrooms (that were already to go) and the 2nd bedroom is now part of the livingroom/dining room/kitchen area.  that is what it looks like in the pictures. http://www.vidanta.com/en/resort-hotels/grand-luxxe/riviera-maya/accommodations I do not think it has a deck at all.


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## pianoetudes

On my last month trip to RM, the MP building 1 to 4 are closed for renovation. I believe they are converting the units to GL Jungle. The building 1 to 4 are actually at the best location of the entire resort - less than 5 minutes walk to the beach, restaurants (Balche/Frida, Havana Moon, Gong and the Italian restaurant). They are perfect for GL units. Besides with 21 buildings of MP and The Bliss, they will never run out of MP units.

Vidanta website says "private terrace, complete with outdoor lounge furniture" but no photos. I am curious how big the terrace is. At the presentation, I remember the sales person told me that the living room has some kind of rolling door for privacy. The website does say living room with two sleeper sofas. Then with the rolling door, you can make the unit to 2BR.


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## Eric B

Vidanta website has a floorplan that shows a very small terrace with no pool.


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## Hankmoon

I just booked a GL Jungle Suite for January in Riviera Maya. I was talking to the Vidanta reservation agent about pros/cons between the Jungle Suite vs the one bedroom suite. First of all, I was booking it late since January is high season and it is now October. There were no 1 bedroom suites left and only 2 Jungle Suites available for the date I wanted. I needed one very specific arrival date and was lucky to get it. He said the tradeoff is with the Jungle Suite you get two full bathrooms, the dining room and kitchen are in the middle and the living room can be converted into a second bedroom with two sleeper sofas because you can close it off with the sliding door but you do lose the big terrace with pool. In the 1 bedroom suite, you get 1.5 bathrooms only and the living room area is an open floor plan. So for traveling with kids or another couple or two singles, the Jungle suite could be ideal. For traveling as a couple, the 1 bedroom suite might be better. It just depends on how you want to use it. Both suites are true Grand Luxxe units with all amenities. The agent said right now, they are promoting the Jungle Suites because they are new so the usage fee may be lower than it will be in the future. It is only $50 higher for members than the 1 bedroom suite but he said it may be higher in the future. None of the suites in Riviera Maya have views so that is not much of a factor in deciding where to stay. The agent said the Jungle Suites are in the building behind the GL towers 1-4 on the map. This may seem far now but remember Vidanta keeps expanding so in a few years, this will be close.


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## MuranoJo

pianoetudes said:


> ..On my last month trip to RM, the MP building 1 to 4 are closed for renovation. I believe they are converting the units to GL Jungle. The building 1 to 4 are actually at the best location of the entire resort - less than 5 minutes walk to the beach, restaurants (Balche/Frida, Havana Moon, Gong and the Italian restaurant). They are perfect for GL units. ...



I checked with Customer Service yesterday to see if buildings 1-4 were still available to MP members.  They told me, yes, they were just undergoing renovations and are still MP units, and the renos are complete now.  That's the story I got  and I'll know more after my guests return in January.


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