# WorldMark booking guideline change - Club Pass?



## cotraveller (Apr 26, 2014)

There is an announcement on the WorldMark web site that the WorldMark booking guidelines are being changed to allow booking of short stays (less than a full week) at 10 months in advance of check in rather than the current 9 month window.  Although not specifically mentioned in the announcement, this was probably done in response to the concern that some WorldMark owners had about the new Club Pass exchange agreement.  

Under Club Pass exchange agreement, WorldMark owners will be able book Wyndham resorts at 9 months before check in and Wyndham owners will be able to book WorldMark resorts at 9 months before check in.  The change to the WorldMark guidelines gives WorldMark owners a 1 month head start to book the short stays in their resorts before they are available to Wyndham owners.  This makes the two systems similar in regards to Club Pass bookings in that the owners of each system will have a time advantage for booking within their respective systems before cross booking between the two systems is available..

The WorldMark guideline change goes into effect on June 2.


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## ronparise (Apr 26, 2014)

cotraveller said:


> There is an announcement on the WorldMark web site that the WorldMark booking guidelines are being changed to allow booking of short stays (less than a full week) at 10 months in advance of check in rather than the current 9 month window.  Although not specifically mentioned in the announcement, this was probably done in response to the concern that some WorldMark owners had about the new Club Pass exchange agreement.
> 
> Under Club Pass exchange agreement, WorldMark owners will be able book Wyndham resorts at 9 months before check in and Wyndham owners will be able to book WorldMark resorts at 9 months before check in.  The change to the WorldMark guidelines gives WorldMark owners a 1 month head start to book the short stays in their resorts before they are available to Wyndham owners.  This makes the two systems similar in regards to Club Pass bookings in that the owners of each system will have a time advantage for booking within their respective systems before cross booking between the two systems is available..
> 
> The WorldMark guideline change goes into effect on June 2.



Im sure you are right. this was done in response to complaints from Worldmark owners who were afraid Wyndham owners will get the jump on the short stay reservations. 

There is one other open complaint that the Board still has to resolve and that has to do with cancellations.  Currently Wyndham owners can cancel reservations up to 15 days before check in. and Worldmark is 30 days. Club Pass allows up  to 15 days before check in to cancel.  Im not sure what the fear is here,, but folks are complaining


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## uscav8r (Apr 26, 2014)

cotraveller said:


> There is an announcement on the WorldMark web site that the WorldMark booking guidelines are being changed to allow booking of short stays (less than a full week) at 10 months in advance of check in rather than the current 9 month window.  Although not specifically mentioned in the announcement, this was probably done in response to the concern that some WorldMark owners had about the new Club Pass exchange agreement.
> 
> Under Club Pass exchange agreement, WorldMark owners will be able book Wyndham resorts at 9 months before check in and Wyndham owners will be able to book WorldMark resorts at 9 months before check in.  The change to the WorldMark guidelines gives WorldMark owners a 1 month head start to book the short stays in their resorts before they are available to Wyndham owners.  This makes the two systems similar in regards to Club Pass bookings in that the owners of each system will have a time advantage for booking within their respective systems before cross booking between the two systems is available..
> 
> The WorldMark guideline change goes into effect on June 2.



Good to know! Thanks!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## cotraveller (Apr 26, 2014)

ronparise said:


> There is one other open complaint that the Board still has to resolve and that has to do with cancellations.  Currently Wyndham owners can cancel reservations up to 15 days before check in. and Worldmark is 30 days. Club Pass allows up  to 15 days before check in to cancel.  Im not sure what the fear is here,, but folks are complaining



The Club Pass documents that have been released for both WorldMark and Wyndham indicate that all credits, points, fees, etc. will be returned if the cancellation occurs 15 days or more before the check in date.  There does not appear to be any advantage for either system in regards to Club Pass reservation cancellations.

For bookings within each system, cancellations are subject to the rules and guidelines of each system.  For WorldMark owners the no penalty cancellation window is 30 days for reservations made more than 90 days in advance and 10 days for reservations made 15 to 90 days in advance.  Club Pass will have no effect on those cancellation dates.


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## Bigrob (Apr 26, 2014)

cotraveller said:


> The Club Pass documents that have been released for both WorldMark and Wyndham indicate that all credits, points, fees, etc. will be returned if the cancellation occurs 15 days or more before the check in date.  There does not appear to be any advantage for either system in regards to Club Pass reservation cancellations.
> 
> For bookings within each system, cancellations are subject to the rules and guidelines of each system.  For WorldMark owners the no penalty cancellation window is 30 days for reservations made more than 90 days in advance and 10 days for reservations made 15 to 90 days in advance.  Club Pass will have no effect on those cancellation dates.



Correct. The problem Ron is pointing out that has been noted on WM boards is that the regulation is inconsistent with Club pass, in that a reservations booked beyond 90 days by a Wyndham owner could be cancelled without penalty between days 15-30, but could only be cancelled by a Worldmark owner at day 30 without penalty.


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## cotraveller (Apr 27, 2014)

Bigrob said:


> Correct. The problem Ron is pointing out that has been noted on WM boards is that the regulation is inconsistent with Club pass, in that a reservations booked beyond 90 days by a Wyndham owner could be cancelled without penalty between days 15-30, but could only be cancelled by a Worldmark owner at day 30 without penalty.



If you are talking about in-system reservations, ie a Wyndham owner booking a Wyndham unit and/or a WorldMark owner booking a WorldMark unit, then I agree with what you say.  Those are the rules that have been in place for each system for some time.  

If there is concern that a WorldMark cancellation at the 30 day point could be picked up by a Wyndham owner as a Club Pass exchange, I would see that possibility happening only for resorts that do not normally fully book.  If the cancellation was a desirable reservation for a WorldMark owner that owner would have a wait list request in place and would get the reservation before any Wyndham owner had access to it. Only if there was no wait list request would the unit go into general inventory where it would be available to Wyndham owners as a Club Pass exchange.

Wyndham has no wait list.  So if a Wyndham owner cancels a reservation of a Wyndham unit in the 15 to 30 day window that unit would be available to both Wyndham owners as a direct booking and to WorldMark owners as a Club Pass exchange. If anything I'd say that gives WorldMark owners a very slight advantage over Wyndham owners for booking Club Pass reservations.

For a Club Pass reservation, ie a Wyndham owner booking a WorldMark unit as a Club Pass exchange and/or a WorldMark owner booking a Wyndham unit as a Club Pass exchange, either owner can cancel their Club Pass reservation at 15 days with no penalty.  That is what it says in the Club Pass documentation for each respective system.  There is no cancellation advantage for owners of either system for a Club Pass reservation.


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## ronparise (Apr 27, 2014)

cotraveller said:


> If you are talking about in-system reservations, ie a Wyndham owner booking a Wyndham unit and/or a WorldMark owner booking a WorldMark unit, then I agree with what you say.  Those are the rules that have been in place for each system for some time.
> 
> If there is concern that a WorldMark cancellation at the 30 day point could be picked up by a Wyndham owner as a Club Pass exchange, I would see that possibility happening only for resorts that do not normally fully book.  If the cancellation was a desirable reservation for a WorldMark owner that owner would have a wait list request in place and would get the reservation before any Wyndham owner had access to it. Only if there was no wait list request would the unit go into general inventory where it would be available to Wyndham owners as a Club Pass exchange.
> 
> ...



Fred 

you are absolutely right , as usual, about the cancellation policies in the two clubs....Nothing changes in the clubs, and there is nothing to complain about just because one club's rules are different than the others..

All I trying to point out is that that doesnt matter.  There are Worldmark Owners that are convinced that anything that Wyndham touches is designed to make Wyndham more money and when they make more money it must be bad for the owners

Worldmark owners (many of them) have always said that the liberal cancellation policy they enjoy is one of the best features of the Club. That another Club has a more liberal policy bothers them.  I think its just petty jealousy


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## lcml11 (Apr 27, 2014)

cotraveller said:


> If you are talking about in-system reservations, ie a Wyndham owner booking a Wyndham unit and/or a WorldMark owner booking a WorldMark unit, then I agree with what you say.  Those are the rules that have been in place for each system for some time.
> 
> If there is concern that a WorldMark cancellation at the 30 day point could be picked up by a Wyndham owner as a Club Pass exchange, I would see that possibility happening only for resorts that do not normally fully book.  If the cancellation was a desirable reservation for a WorldMark owner that owner would have a wait list request in place and would get the reservation before any Wyndham owner had access to it. Only if there was no wait list request would the unit go into general inventory where it would be available to Wyndham owners as a Club Pass exchange.
> 
> ...



A interesting concept showing up in a number of Club Wyndham Pass threads is that Pass is drawing from some sort of shared inventory between the systems involved.  

Just got off the phone with Owner's Care.  Club Wyndham Pass will apparently be having a dedicated inventory in the Clubs involved for use by the Pass program.  An analogy to the RCI inventory pool was made.

Can anyone out there provide any cites that the Pass inventory will not be a dedicated inventory?

https://www.worldmarktheclub.com/news/wynclubpassfaqs.pdf

"10.  What will be the booking window for WYNDHAM Club Pass?

There is a nine-month booking window for resort inventory in WYNDHAM Club Pass."

Please note that question 10 in the provided link talks of a booking window for "resort inventory in Wyndham Club Pass".

From the tone and drift of the conversation, I think it is still an open question on how much of the high demand resorts in peak season will be placed in the Pass inventory.  From a Wyndham Club Plus/Access point of view Bonnet Creek was one of the resorts that this problem will exist at (Owner's Care cited this resort as a example and not me).

Actually, in light of the fact that this was a named example, this resort's availability through Wyndham Club Pass for the high demand, peak seasons, will be a interesting case in point to follow.


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## Rent_Share (Apr 27, 2014)

ronparise said:


> There are Worldmark Owners that are convinced that anything that Wyndham touches is designed to make Wyndham more money and when they make more money it must be bad for the owners



Only the new products/programs that require a premium purchase AND reduce availability (take away available days/units) to those members/owners who purchased prior to the newly created program.

 The combination of the 9 to 10 month adjustment on < 7 day reservations and the continuation of the waitlist for WM owners should alleviate any priority given another class of owners at the expense of the legacy owners, allowing WM owners a first claim on their units, before making them available to an elite sub group who purchased from the same developer


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## ronparise (Apr 27, 2014)

Rent_Share said:


> Only the new products/programs that require a premium purchase AND reduce availability (take away available days/units) to those members/owners who purchased prior to the newly created program.
> 
> The combination of the 9 to 10 month adjustment on < 7 day reservations and the continuation of the waitlist for WM owners should alleviate any priority given another class of owners at the expense of the legacy owners, allowing WM owners a first claim on their units, before making them available to an elite sub group who purchased from the same developer



I have come to agree with you.  Although 9 months didnt give Wyndham owners an advantage the important thing is that Worldmark owners should have an advantage in their own club over exchangers.  Now they do.

What I dont yet get are the complaints around the 15 day cancellation policy


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## lcml11 (Apr 27, 2014)

Rent_Share said:


> Only the new products/programs that require a premium purchase AND reduce availability (take away available days/units) to those members/owners who purchased prior to the newly created program.
> 
> The combination of the 9 to 10 month adjustment on < 7 day reservations and the continuation of the waitlist for WM owners should alleviate any priority given another class of owners at the expense of the legacy owners, allowing WM owners a first claim on their units, before making them available to an elite sub group who purchased from the same developer



The reduction of formally available inventory for the legacy owners of WorldMark the Club and Club Wyndham Plus/Access is already in progress as evidenced by loss of access to some WorldMark locations and the related loss to WorldMark owners to some Club Wyndham Plus/Access resorts without an additional fee.  

The big wildcard, at this point, is how much of the high demand - peak season timeframes are going off into the Wyndham Club Pass program from both resort systems.

There has been some very limited chatter about balancing the demand between the clubs involved for resort locations under the influence or control of Club Wyndham Pass.  The answer very well may be how much demand there is from the Developer Point Owners from both clubs for these high demand period.  Presumably, the more demand from this new group the more high demand inventory will gravitate to the Pass program from various sources.


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## Rent_Share (Apr 27, 2014)

ronparise said:


> I have come to agree with you. Although 9 months didnt give Wyndham owners an advantage the important thing is that Worldmark owners should have an advantage in their own club over exchangers. Now they do.
> 
> What I dont yet get are the complaints around the 15 day cancellation policy



In theory having units cancelled at 15 days should create more bonus time for WM owners. unless the WVO points cancelled at 30-15 days go to the WVO credit rental pool as opposed to ?

 I am not sure what the perceived damage is to the WM owners


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## lcml11 (Apr 27, 2014)

Rent_Share said:


> In theory having units cancelled at 15 days should create more bonus time for WM owners. unless the WVO points cancelled at 30-15 days go to the WVO credit rental pool as opposed to ?
> 
> I am not sure what the perceived damage is to the WM owners



Remains to be seen if there is any actual damage to most legacy owners.  For the most part, any given legacy owner is not a contender in the high demand peak timeframe resorts.  I can foresee situations where the observation that more time might be available in the discount windows might come to pass that more bonus time for WM Owners, or VIP and Resort Specials for that matter for Wyndham Club Plus/Access, might increase for non peak periods.


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## cotraveller (Apr 27, 2014)

ronparise said:


> Fred
> 
> you are absolutely right , as usual, about the cancellation policies in the two clubs....Nothing changes in the clubs, and there is nothing to complain about just because one club's rules are different than the others..
> 
> ...



Different systems have different rules and that applies to the exchange companies too.  Nothing new for Club Pass in that respect.

Perhaps Wyndham owners should start complaining that a WorldMark reservation booked between 15 and 90 days in advance can be cancelled with no penalty up to 10 days in advance of check in.  Or that WorldMark reservations booked between 3 and 14 days in advance can be cancelled up to 2 days before check in with no penalty.

It's not something you brought up, but I doubt that the 15 day cancellation for Club Pass reservations will create any more WorldMark Bonus Time.  The WorldMark wait list is still in effect at 15 days so any cancellations of prime units would go to the wait list, not to Bonus Time at 14 days.  For cancellation of non-prime units those would have gone to Bonus Time anyway so no gain there.


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## foofoo528 (May 5, 2014)

*WorldMark only for "developer" purchased points*

I found this on the FAQs 

_Will there be guidelines when exchanging between an individual’s home Club and resorts in the WYNDHAM Club Pass program?

Yes. Owners who would like to make an exchange outside of their home Club may do so by using their developer purchased credits/points.



So - resale owners will not have access?_


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## presley (May 5, 2014)

foofoo528 said:


> So - resale owners will not have access?



That is my understanding.


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## comicbookman (May 5, 2014)

presley said:


> That is my understanding.



The more interesting question is for those of us who have both developer points and resale.  Will we be restricted to only using points from our dev contracts, or to a maximum of the amount of dev bought points, or is one dev contract enough to allow all the points to be used for club pass.  Currently VIP "perks" are not limited to only dev points, so I wonder?

Of course I am not likely to use club pass, so it just an interesting question to me.


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## lcml11 (May 5, 2014)

comicbookman said:


> The more interesting question is for those of us who have both developer points and resale.  Will we be restricted to only using points from our dev contracts, or to a maximum of the amount of dev bought points, or is one dev contract enough to allow all the points to be used for club pass.  Currently VIP "perks" are not limited to only dev points, so I wonder?
> 
> Of course I am not likely to use club pass, so it just an interesting question to me.



This is my understanding of how the system is supposed to work.  The extract was from a Wyndham Program Document for Wyndham Club Pass.  In light of Ron's input re:  Voyager still not operational yet and will be coming in multiple parts over time", I do not know how it will actually work since a reservation through the computer using points from specific contracts is not operational yet.  Maybe to reserve Wyndham Club Pass, the owner may have to call into reservations.  

"Points associated with a vacation ownership interest purchased directly from Wyndham or its affiliates, acquired from an Immediate Relative, or acquired
from an authorized selling agent or reseller are eligible for both WYNDHAM Club Pass Universal Benefits and WYNDHAM Club Pass Exchange Benefits.  Points acquired from a third party not considered an Immediate Relative or not authorized by Wyndham are only eligible to receive WYNDHAM Club Pass Universal Benefits."


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## Vacationfuntips (May 5, 2014)

*"Points acquired from a third party not considered an Immediate Relative or not authorized by Wyndham are only eligible to receive WYNDHAM Club Pass Universal Benefits."*

What are the Universal Benefits?  I looked on the Club Wyndham Vacation Resorts website and I could not find an answer?

Does anyone know?  

Cynthia T


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## ronparise (May 6, 2014)

Vacationfuntips said:


> *"Points acquired from a third party not considered an Immediate Relative or not authorized by Wyndham are only eligible to receive WYNDHAM Club Pass Universal Benefits."*
> 
> What are the Universal Benefits?  I looked on the Club Wyndham Vacation Resorts website and I could not find an answer?
> 
> ...



There are none...."Universal benefits" is just a name they attach to this thing (Club Pass) so they can say everyone is included


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## Vacationfuntips (May 6, 2014)

*Wyndham Club Pass Directory*

Thank you, Ron! 

Perhaps, they will give some "Universal Benefits" to everyone later on?

Wishful thinking on my part 

I just found this link on Wyndham's site regarding the Wyndham Club Pass Directory.

Wyndham Club Pass Directory Link: 

https://www.wyndhamvacationresorts.com/ffrweb/pdfs/cw_wyndham_club_pass_supplement.pdf

Cynthia T.


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## GregT (May 7, 2014)

Vacationfuntips said:


> *"Points acquired from a third party not considered an Immediate Relative or not authorized by Wyndham are only eligible to receive WYNDHAM Club Pass Universal Benefits."*




I've not been following this that closely -- I don't think this refers to credits transferred (rented) from a third party does it?

I've tended to look for WM+A credits when renting just because of the other advantages, and figured I would do the same -- am I overinterpreting this clause?

Thanks very much,

Greg


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## PassionForTravel (May 8, 2014)

I would think that if you have a WM+a account and you rent in WM+a credits then they can be used for the club pass since they retain their WM+a status. If I rent WM+a credits into my account since it's a post 2006 account everything become WM. When we rent credits into my GF account they retain status however travelshare credits become WM+A.

I think what this is referring to is resale accounts.

Although details have been a little slim given that the program starts in 3 weeks.

Ian


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