# [2010] Renting Disneyland tickets



## denverbob

There seems to a new trend (ads on ebay and craigslist) where a person buys multiday Disneyland tickets and then 'rents' the unused days to other people. The ad states that you must pick-up your ticket from their office 30 minutes before the park opens and must drop off your ticket in their drop-box by 2am (after you leave the park).

The tickets seem to be going for less than $50 for a one-day park hopper pass which includes fast pass. A large discount from Disney one-day prices.

Has anyone used this? Does it work as stated? Does Disneyland care?

Secondly, if this is an acceptable way to handle these tickets, then it would seem that more of the resorts might be doing the same as a benefit to their guests.


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## rhonda

Wouldn't Disney's biometrics (finger readers) at the gate prevent this?

Edited to add:  Oh! you said Disney_land_.  WDW uses the biometric readers to prevent this practice - but I' don't recall seeing the readers at the Disneyland park gates.


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## DeniseM

Disneyland tickets are not transferrable, so yes, this violates Disneyland's rules.


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## a1000monkeys

I have heard many stories of people selling fake or expired passes on Craigslist and eBay but this is the first I have heard of people renting them.  Still, I wouldn't risk it.

You won't know if the pass is valid until you get to the park.  If it's not you'll get little sympathy from Disneyland as the tickets are non-transferable.


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## BevL

Maybe I'm a little slow today but it sounds kinda hinky to me.  If I'm renting a valid ticket with more than one day on it, how can I control that it is returned?  And if it's only got one day left, why do I care if it's returned?  So I would be very leery of buying these.


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## cruisin

Many sellers will hold your drivers license, pretty good reason to give it back  I was at a ticket counter and they took someones passes that was trying to upgrade  these tickets to an annual pass, asked them where they purchased the ticket, "disney knows exactly where it was purchased AAA, at the booth, online, asked them when they used the other days, the people could not answer, and disney just took the tickets.


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## cruisin

BevL said:


> Maybe I'm a little slow today but it sounds kinda hinky to me.  If I'm renting a valid ticket with more than one day on it, how can I control that it is returned?  And if it's only got one day left, why do I care if it's returned?  So I would be very leery of buying these.



Because at the end of the day, you can go to the counter and turn that ticket in for an annual pass for another $70, as long as you do it before close on the last day it is valid. 

They will rent all the days on the ticket, upgrade it for another $70 on the last night  and sell the annual pass!


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## pedro47

Suggestion to this question, I would telephone Disney customer service at he theme and ask this question for the correct answer.


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## cruisin

DeniseM said:


> Disneyland tickets are not transferrable, so yes, this violates Disneyland's rules.



No need to call Disney, this post is correct.


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## Jimster

*Disney*

This is a good practice- assuming you don't care if you actually get in or not but just want to pay the "rent".


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## denverbob

I think most of the replys are missing the point. The fact is that this is happening and appears to be quite popular. Type "Disneyland Tickets" into Craigslist (LA) or ebay and you will see. The sellers on ebay have near 100% positive ratings - so it must work.

What I was hoping for was a response from someone who has actually done this.


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## Jimster

*craig's list*

If I can be so bold, I think you are missing the point.  No one doubts this can be done, but none of us want to be the one who does it and gets the shaft and no one wants to recommend something that can cause you great difficulty.  You can buy upgrades for airline flights on ebay too, but if you get caught.  You are screwed.  As an aside, since it is illegal to "rent" Disney tickets, do you really expect someone to provide information on a public forum?  According to the media, Craig's list also has been a forum to connect with call girls, do you think people will really admit to using them and rating them on line?  I know Disneyland tickets are expensive, but I can't imagine the savings would be worth the risk.


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## UWSurfer

Back when my kids were very young and we were very broke, we had a friend who worked at Disneyland who gets x many comp tickets to use for themselves or to invite family and friends.   They had enough for our kids & knew another couple who had an annual pass which they let us borrow.

The annual passes have a photo of the person they belong to and of course the picture didn't look anything like me.  I was told just act cool, they almost never look at the picture and all will be fine.   So we get the kids through with their passes and we hand the ticket taker the annual passes.   My wife gets through just fine but the ticket taker looks a me, then the pass, then me again.   The photo had beard...I didn't.   I'm thinking to myself this is going to get confiscated and I'm going to end up purchasing a new annual pass for this guy.

I look at her and said something like: "Yeah, I look pretty different without the beard".   The girl goes : "That's amazing!"...and I'm thinking I'm soooo busted, then hands me back the pass and to enjoy our day.   

My wife and one of my kids later ended up working at Disneyland for awhile and both mentioned how often people will just rush the turnstyles pushing through, kids and all to get past without paying.   It keeps security on their toes for certain.


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## goodjobwm

We had 'shared' our 5 days passes with friends before. It worked fine, and it was pure luck.  Understanding Disney tickets are not transferable. 




denverbob said:


> I think most of the replys are missing the point. The fact is that this is happening and appears to be quite popular. Type "Disneyland Tickets" into Craigslist (LA) or ebay and you will see. The sellers on ebay have near 100% positive ratings - so it must work.
> 
> What I was hoping for was a response from someone who has actually done this.


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## denverbob

Jimster said:


> As an aside, since it is illegal to "rent" Disney tickets, do you really expect someone to provide information on a public forum?



Is it really 'illegal' to 'rent' Disney tickets? or just against Disney rules? Can you be arrested or ticketed for doing this? 

Seems to me the only 'risk' would be if the tickets were not accepted, then you would have to purchase tickets. 

What I was asking here was whether anyone had actually used one of the ebay 'companies' that rents tickets. Do you really believe Disney would take action against someone admitting use of these tickets on this forum? They obviously know many are using them - they can see ebay, too.

Seems if Disney wanted to stop this process, they could. I also don't see where Disney loses any money on this. This is not gate-crashing. I'm guessing these are fully-paid tickets which have no individual indentification on them.

Our family will be visiting So Cal the end of this month. We are trying to decide if we want to visit Disneyland, Universal Studios, or do something else. The price of tickets will help determine what we do.


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## Blues

denverbob said:


> I also don't see where Disney loses any money on this. This is not gate-crashing. I'm guessing these are fully-paid tickets which have no individual indentification on them.



Hmm, let's see.  Using the current promotional pricing:

2 people each buying a valid 3-day pass = 2 x $149 = $298

1 6-day pass shared among those 2 people = $173

To say that you don't see where Disney loses money is disingenuous at best.

And yes, participating in this scheme is called fraud, which is a crime.  I agree, it's likely not worth Disney's time or bad publicity to pursue it; but the answer to your question is yes, it's actually illegal.



> Our family will be visiting So Cal the end of this month. We are trying to decide if we want to visit Disneyland, Universal Studios, or do something else. The price of tickets will help determine what we do.



Valid concerns, and you'll have to make the assessment of what's best for your family.  I'm also unhappy with the recent price increases at Disneyland.  But I'm not unhappy enough to participate in a fraudulent scheme.  YMMV.

-Bob


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## denverbob

My point is that Disney is making the same amount of money as they agreed. They agreed to sell 5 tickets at a pre-determined price. The only difference is whether one person comes for 5 days or 5 people come for one day.


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## Blues

No, you're still being disingenuous and intentionally obtuse.

They (and the customer) agreed to allow *one* person in for 5 days during a 14 day period.  They explicitly did *not* agree to 5 different people for one day each.  That's in the terms of service -- the tickets are not transferable, as clearly stated on the tickets themselves.


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## K2Quick

Blues said:


> And yes, participating in this scheme is called fraud, which is a crime.  I agree, it's likely not worth Disney's time or bad publicity to pursue it; but the answer to your question is yes, it's actually illegal.



To call this criminal or fraudulent is, in my opinion, overstating the case.  The exact language on transferability in the terms and conditions is:

"Tickets may not be sold or transferred for commercial use."

If a friend and I split the cost of a six day pass and each of us use three days, yes we've transferred the tickets, but I don't believe the transfer would be considered "commercial use."  The ticket brokers who are making money on the rental scheme, however, are in clear violation of the commercial use clause.


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## Jimster

*Disney*

I think this is alot like music file sharing.  The "everyone else is doing it" argument was used there too.  Many of the same arguments like "who is it  hurting?" were made too.  Also, the idea that"they'll never take action" was made.  Yet it still goes on!  The problem is the recording indusry did pick out several well publicized cases and prosecuted them.  These people were in shock at how expensive the judgments against them were.  The question is not what people have done in the past, the question is whether you want to be at risk for what might happen in the future because should it be enforced against you as the example, I am very sure you won't like it!  But let's face it, marginal practices like this go on all the time.  The point is if you decide to do it you will be at risk.  As an aside, to me another consequence is it doesn't set a very good example for your kids.  It's like holding the exit door open to the theater to sneak  your kids in.  I guess I feel: either you can afford to go or you can't.  I don't think you'll find much validation in this forum or the Disney forum.  So if  you feel you need to "rent" the tickets do so, but don't ask for us to validate this practice which is marginal at best.


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## a1000monkeys

Jimster said:


> I think this is alot like music file sharing.  The "everyone else is doing it" argument was used there too.  Many of the same arguments like "who is it  hurting?" were made too.  Also, the idea that"they'll never take action" was made.  Yet it still goes on!  The problem is the recording indusry did pick out several well publicized cases and prosecuted them.  These people were in shock at how expensive the judgments against them were.  The question is not what people have done in the past, the question is whether you want to be at risk for what might happen in the future because should it be enforced against you as the example, I am very sure you won't like it!  But let's face it, marginal practices like this go on all the time.  The point is if you decide to do it you will be at risk.  As an aside, to me another consequence is it doesn't set a very good example for your kids.  It's like holding the exit door open to the theater to sneak  your kids in.  I guess I feel: either you can afford to go or you can't.  I don't think you'll find much validation in this forum or the Disney forum.  So if  you feel you need to "rent" the tickets do so, but don't ask for us to validate this practice which is marginal at best.



I am a trademark/copyright attorney.  The file sharing analogy isn't quite right since the Copyright Act has proscribed statutory damages.

Disneyland tickets are contracts between the purchaser and Disney.  Renting the tickets violates this contract and Disney can then void the contract by not honoring the tickets.  The renter of the tickets will not be liable for any criminal misconduct but also has no rights to the tickets since he/she is not privy to the contract between the purchaser and Disney.

If the person renting the tickets is renting fake or knowingly expired tickets then that person is committing a fraud which is illegal and you can Google stories of people that have been arrested for this.

That being said, I personally wouldn't risk my vacation dollars on tickets that I may be unable to use.  Disney will not be at all sympathetic to my situation if I showed up with invalid rented tickets.


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## Luanne

If you decide to do this, let us know how it works out for you.


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## denverbob

I will weigh all the pros and cons and if I decide to try this I will post a response on this board.

I especially appreciated the attorney's comments. I belive you hit the heart of the issue.


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## Jimster

*violations*

Well, I am a criminal attorney and I'd say it depends on when the problem is discovered.  If the renter is admitted to the park and then discovered, I see no reason why he couldn't be prosecuted for a variety of things including theft of services, fraud, etc.  If he is turned away at the gate, then his only loss will be his lack of admission to the park.  The "rentee" would still have legal issues.

As for the difference between this and file sharing, I agree that the legal aspects are different but it sounds very much the same.  The point I wanted to get across was that the rationales used by file sharers to justify their actions made them feel immune from legal problems and they were comfortable because everyone else was doing it.  All of this faded when someone took action.  I guess what I am saying is you don't want to be the one out there when someone decides to make an example of you.  As a prosecutor, we successfully put on trial 8 people who had been hooking up to cable tv illegally I heard the same "everyone else is doing it" refrain.  They suffered the consequences and again they were much more severe than they ever thought possible.


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## a1000monkeys

Agreed.  The old "everyone else is doing it" defense didn't work on my mother either.


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## djs

I wonder how different this is from the "can I rent out my II/RCI exchange"?  Sure one can, it's quite simple....just create some ad describing the week/resort/cost and wait for the renters to come to you.  Now the more important question is "may I rent out my II/RCI exchange?"  As we all know the answer to that one is "No."

It's a risk/reward situation here.  Is one comfortable enough with the savings to risk the fact that the ticket may get taken away with no recourse?  Is there a guarantee from the person providing the pass that it will work, with a full refund if it doesn't?


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## logan115

There was a similar thread in another section of TUG (http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114640) asking about another "scam" as I would classify it.

I'm 100% against this, and I don't really care what the situation is.  You're knowingly cheating, and it's not OK just because you may be able to get away with it.

The "It must be OK if I can get away with it" attitude is ridiculous IMHO.  Doesn't you gut tell you that something doesn't smell right, and MAYBE this isn't right ?

OK - time to get off my soap box.

Chris


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## goodjobwm

worst case you would loose $$ on those 'shared' tickets and have to buy tickets at Disney front booth.
If it was fake ticket and you purchase on EBAY, you can always dispute. EBAY / PAYPAL has good buyer protection.  I had disputed with PAYPAL for a few purchases, it all worked out well.




denverbob said:


> I will weigh all the pros and cons and if I decide to try this I will post a response on this board.
> 
> I especially appreciated the attorney's comments. I belive you hit the heart of the issue.


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## laura1957

logan115 said:


> There was a similar thread in another section of TUG (http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114640) asking about another "scam" as I would classify it.
> 
> I'm 100% against this, and I don't really care what the situation is.  You're knowingly cheating, and it's not OK just because you may be able to get away with it.
> 
> The "It must be OK if I can get away with it" attitude is ridiculous IMHO.  Doesn't you gut tell you that something doesn't smell right, and MAYBE this isn't right ?
> 
> OK - time to get off my soap box.
> 
> Chris




     Soapbox or not - I agree!!


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## frenchieinme

denverbob said:


> Is it really 'illegal' to 'rent' Disney tickets? or just against Disney rules? Can you be arrested or ticketed for doing this?
> .



It's officially called 'theft of services'.  Because the ticket is a non-transferable license, it's misuse makes not only against Disney rules but also illegal not to mention "just plain wrong".  

frenchieinme


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## JudyS

Here's another approach to getting into Disneyland (a legit one.) If anyone here goes to both WDW (Disney World) and Disneyland, Disneyland will honor unexpired days from WDW tickets (or at least they did the last time I was there, about two years ago.) If you get a 10-day non-expiring WDW ticket from a discount source like Ticketmania, the cost is about $50 per day for a park hopper (water parks cost extra.) 

WDW does not honor Disneyland tickets, however.

If you have RCI Points, you can get a Disney ticket via Points Partners. This may or may not be a decent deal, depending on whether you have points to use up and what you pay in MFs per point. RCI doesn't have the 10 day tickets, but once you've used your ticket from RCI at least once, you can get full credit towards the cost of  a 10-day ticket. (You must upgrade within 14 days of your first use of the ticket.)  

Disney is also reportedly offering a combined annual pass (includes Disneyland in CA, California Adventure, and WDW) for $700 a year. Unfortunately, there seems to be no discount for DVC members.


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## Jimster

*RCI*

RCI has changed its points policy-I'll let you guess who benefited from the change!  They limit the number of points and the deal is not good anyway.  Any time you get a price from RCI, you can get it cheaper somewhere else.


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## JudyS

Jimster said:


> RCI has changed its points policy-I'll let you guess who benefited from the change!  They limit the number of points and the deal is not good anyway.  Any time you get a price from RCI, you can get it cheaper somewhere else.


I'm planning to use some RCI Points for a Disney ticket, but that's partly because I was quite ill last year and couldn't travel much, so my Points (and weeks) have been piling up. If I didn't have Points to use up, I probably wouldn't go through RCI for tickets; I'd use a discount broker like Ticketmania. 

The fact that RCI now only lets you use 1/3rd (or whatever it is) of your Points for Points Partners really stinks, definitely.


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## Jimster

*Points for Partners*

Yes, the whole thing is now almost a joke.  I understand that it is better than letting your points go to waste, but it is such a rip off.  OTOH most of what RCI does is a rip off-unjustified fee increases, renting of TS deposits, etc


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## Whirl

laura1957 said:


> Soapbox or not - I agree!!




Tried to stay away from this one...but had to say...I agree...and what kind of moral code is this to program into our childrens' young minds. 

I understand that times can be hard, and desires often exceed means...but instead practice and teach them to make ethical choices and thrive despite challenges ( economic or otherwise)....

Ok...getting down and putting mine away now too. This thread saddens me...


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## Blues

Whirl said:


> Tried to stay away from this one...but had to say...I agree...and what kind of moral code is this to program into our childrens' young minds.
> 
> I understand that times can be hard, and desires often exceed means...but instead practice and teach them to make ethical choices and thrive despite challenges ( economic or otherwise)....
> 
> Ok...getting down and putting mine away now too. This thread saddens me...



Yep, saddens me too.  Your comment reminds me of an incident a couple of years ago.

DW & I were visiting our granddaughter, who was 5 at the time, and her parents (my step-son and daughter-in-law).  We took them all out to eat at a buffet.  DSS and DDIL had to use the restroom, so I told them that I'd pay for everyone, and they should just tell the hostess they were with us when they returned.  I paid for 5, and DW and I took DGD into the buffet.

When they returned, DGD said, "Hey dad!  Grandpa told them I was 5!  And he paid for me!"  With a big smile on her face.

The significance of the comment was lost on me, so I ignored it.  Later, I realized that age 4 and under was free.  DGD is small for her age, so they must have been sneaking her in.  If I had understood what was going on, I'd have used it as a teachable moment for the just kind of issues you bring up.

I still regret that I didn't understand, so didn't get that teachable moment.  But I'm glad that DGD learned that *some* people obey the rules.

-Bob


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## skittl7

i used this service b4  i see no problem w/ it disney isnt losing any money, ticket was bought so i see no problem w/ who uses it rental places tell u what too say at gate if aked if u avoid the older women type tickettakers there is no problem geting in its still a valid tick.


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## DeniseM

First time poster.

"Texting" on TUG

Digs up a post that's 18 mos. old to post an endorsement.

Uh huh...


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