# VIP Platinum Offer to me from Wyndham



## jebloomquist (Apr 3, 2012)

I am looking for the opinions of others. Here is the situation. 

Wyndham is offering me an opportunity to purchase 370k VIP qualifying points for a total price of about $14,500. The maintenance fee for these points would be about $125 per month or $1500 per year. This would move me from VIP Gold to VIP Platinum. 

Is there anyone who would consider this, or should I just not even think about the idea?


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## robcrusoe (Apr 3, 2012)

jebloomquist said:


> I am looking for the opinions of others. Here is the situation.
> 
> Wyndham is offering me an opportunity to purchase 370k VIP qualifying points for a total price of about $14,500. The maintenance fee for these points would be about $125 per month or $1500 per year. This would move me from VIP Gold to VIP Platinum.
> 
> Is there anyone who would consider this, or should I just not even think about the idea?


I've done something similar, the question is, can you use all those points and can you afford the ongoing costs.


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## rrlongwell (Apr 3, 2012)

robcrusoe said:


> I've done something similar, the question is, can you use all those points and can you afford the ongoing costs.



Agree with the above, I restructured an inherited account voluntarily giving up all the PIC based contracts because I did not the underlying properties then brought in a new PIC contract and purchased some additional timeshares from Wyndham bring the account back to Platium.  A little pricy, but a whole lot more than what they just offered you.  Best of luck and do not let Chicken Little convince you the sky is falling.


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## Ridewithme38 (Apr 3, 2012)

The Difference between Gold and Platinum:

25% more discount off points within 60 days (from 25% to 50%)
15 more days added to the upgrade time (up from 45 to 60 days)
5 more Guest Certificates
Unlimited ARP at ASSOCIATE locations (Don't know the value of this, as per posts, it has NONE) 
3 extra months of Pool time(From 6 to 9 months)

Those are the only ones i see with any value...

Now, Do YOU think these things are worth $14,500?

(Edited with correct information)


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## learnalot (Apr 3, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> The Difference between Gold and Platinum:
> 
> 25% more discount off points within 60 days
> 15 more days added to the upgrade time
> ...



Ride, just in the interest of accurary, the "unlimited ARP" is incorrect.  Unlimited housekeeping and reservation transactions, though.


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## timeos2 (Apr 3, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> The Difference between Gold and Platinum:
> 
> 25% more discount off points within 60 days
> 15 more days added to the upgrade time
> ...



add any or all can be ended tomorrow if they decided to. And the answer, even when those perks still exist, is "NO".  No developer purchase from Wyndham is worth the price (regardless of VIP level).


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## rrlongwell (Apr 3, 2012)

learnalot said:


> Ride, just in the interest of accurary, the "unlimited ARP" is incorrect.  Unlimited housekeeping and reservation transactions, though.



The unlimited ARP that was made reference to are actually:

1.  "Unlimited Advance Reservation Priority Bookings at Associate locations" and, 

2.  "Two (2) Reciporical Advance Reservation Priority Bookings per year."

Source:  "The Good Life.  VIP Owner Benefits"  published by Wyndham.

To Ride's list I would add:

"Receive an instant upgrade at the time of booking to the next largest unit available."  

Note:  This would need to be done at the time of booking the reservation.  For Platium, to get the discount and upgrade, this would need to be within the 60 window of the start date of the reservation.  To use this feature from the begining of an eligable ARP period, the initial booking would need to be at "full frieght".  A second booking would need to be made at the 60 day window or less.  The first booking could then be cancelled.


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## jebloomquist (Apr 3, 2012)

*Using Excess Points*

If I can't use all of the points, since the maintenance fee is about $4.05 per 1000 points, have any of you been able to rent points to others just to cover the mf? 

What are the issues, hassles, or downside with putting points in the TUG for sale ad area offering to rent available Wyndham properties for others as guests?


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## rrlongwell (Apr 3, 2012)

jebloomquist said:


> If I can't use all of the points, since the maintenance fee is about $4.05 per 1000 points, have any of you been able to rent points to others just to cover the mf?
> 
> What are the issues, hassles, or downside with putting points in the TUG for sale ad area offering to rent available Wyndham properties for others as guests?



Sales staff will try their best to get your guests to a sales pitch and buy a timeshare from them.  If you do not want to get into the Rental Business, than credit pool the points.  That pushes the problem of unused points down the road.  Also, the conversion to maintance dollars, I do not think makes much sense,  however, that would be an option when you get to many points.  Be careful with this option.  I think they only give $2.50 per thousand.  You could also use the various programs that let you use your points for non-timeshare things.  I am not sure how much of a benifit this is to you, if any.


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## learnalot (Apr 3, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> The unlimited ARP that was made reference to are actually:
> 
> 1.  "Unlimited Advance Reservation Priority Bookings at Associate locations" and,
> 
> ...



I am aware of the 2 RARP allowances, although holiday weeks are blacked out per the member directory.  As far as the unlimited ARP at 
Associate locations, that exists only on paper.  In the real world, if you call in at 13 months for an ARP reservation at an Associate location, they will tell you that they haven't been given any inventory yet.  I would classify that "benefit" as a useless pipedream and sales pitch.


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## jebloomquist (Apr 3, 2012)

*Platinum vs Kitchen*

My wife will certainly appreciate all of the replies suggesting that I should forget the VIP Platinum idea. She is far more interested in upgrading the kitchen instead.


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## rrlongwell (Apr 3, 2012)

learnalot said:


> I am aware of the 2 RARP allowances, although holiday weeks are blacked out per the member directory.  As far as the unlimited ARP at
> Associate locations, that exists only on paper.  In the real world, if you call in at 13 months for an ARP reservation at an Associate location, they will tell you that they haven't been given any inventory yet.  I would classify that "benefit" as a useless pipedream and sales pitch.



I will defer to you, I never tried it.  There is a footnote that this feature is subject to availability.  If what you said is true, there is no inventory, then it is of no use.

In response to the original poster's latest response,  the 2 bedroom or more units tend to have great kitchens.


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## jebloomquist (Apr 3, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> In response to the original poster's latest response,  the 2 bedroom or more units tend to have great kitchens.



I was refering to the kitchen in my home which my wife has wanted upgraded for some time now.


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## SOS8260456 (Apr 3, 2012)

I vote with your wife, upgrade the kitchen.  

I always felt that the biggest difference in benefits was between regular VIP and VIP gold with not that much difference between gold and platinum.

Of course, when we purchased, we never thought any of the benefits would be taken away either.

If this is something you decide to do (and I seriously hope you dont), do you already have 2 non wyndham weeks in their PIC program?  If not, I would make sure I picked up the largest size qualifiying units before going through with this in order to get more bang for my buck.


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## Sandi Bo (Apr 4, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> "Receive an instant upgrade at the time of booking to the next largest unit available."



For accuracy -- you do not recieve the upgrade until you are within 60 days of checkin.  Once within 60 days you are eligible for 1 upgrade, if available.


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## rrlongwell (Apr 4, 2012)

Sandi Bo said:


> For accuracy -- you do not recieve the upgrade until you are within 60 days of checkin.  Once within 60 days you are eligible for 1 upgrade, if available.



I use this feature on a very regular basis.  If the upgrade is used at the time of booking, then there can be one unit size upgrade per reservation at the 60 day or less point.  Of my 9 pending reservations, I received upgrades on 6 of them so far.

Update:  Just went into my pending reservations.  Clicked on the upgrade button and no updates were available, but when I went to book a reservation, the new booking gave me the upgrade.  I took it and cancelled the one that the system would not let me upgrade.  I guess than makes it 7 for nine pending reservations.


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## Sandi Bo (Apr 4, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> I use this feature on a very regular basis.  If the upgrade is used at the time of booking, then there can be one unit size upgrade per reservation at the 60 day or less point.



As do I. What I was clarifying is that it is not available until you are within 60 days of the checkin date.  The text originally posted read "Receive an instant upgrade at the time of booking to the next largest unit available."  I would amend that to be "Receive an instant upgrade at the time of booking to the next largest unit available if you are within 60 days of your checkin date".


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## rrlongwell (Apr 4, 2012)

Sandi Bo said:


> As do I. What I was clarifying is that it is not available until you are within 60 days of the checkin date.  The text originally posted read "Receive an instant upgrade at the time of booking to the next largest unit available."  I would amend that to be "Receive an instant upgrade at the time of booking to the next largest unit available if you are within 60 days of your checkin date".



Would be glad to amend it, but I forgot which thread the quote came from.  It is not showing on this thread.


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## ronparise (Apr 4, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> Would be glad to amend it, but I forgot which thread the quote came from.  It is not showing on this thread.



This thread, post #7


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## bnoble (Apr 4, 2012)

This question is pretty simple.  Right now, the cost of those 370K points resale is maybe a few thousand dollars, tops.  So, you are paying *at least* $12K for the marginal increase in benefits from Gold to Platinum.  If you get *everything* out of those "new" benefits, how much do you "save" each year?  How long does it take you to break even on your purchase?  How confident are you that nothing will change in your life circumstances or Wyndham's rules during that time that limits the value?

It is up to you to figure this out, but personally I would not bite.


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## jjmanthei05 (Apr 4, 2012)

The only way this makes sense is if you are planning on starting some kind of timeshare rental business. If not then I would just stick with what you have/resale. 

Jason


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## timeos2 (Apr 4, 2012)

jebloomquist said:


> My wife will certainly appreciate all of the replies suggesting that I should forget the VIP Platinum idea. She is far more interested in upgrading the kitchen instead.



Any return you'd eventually get, as well as the years of enjoyment your & your family would have from the kitchen work being done at your home, would far exceed any potential gain by wasting thousands for points (& a VIP designation) that you could get for a few dollars resale (w/o the near worthless VIP nonsense).  Only you can decide but IMO there is no question where the true value would using that $14K.  Think it through and you'll have your answer. I doubt that wasting more money with Wyndham will be it but decide that for yourself.


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## ronparise (Apr 4, 2012)

I am a silver owner, and I use my points to make reservations and rent them out. Its not a profitable venture unless I can get certain high demand weekends. or play the cancel and rebook and upgrade game within 60 days, or both. The idea of going to Gold or Platinum, is something that would seem to make sense to me, for the additional guest certificates and the unlimited transactions with no fee and the 60 day discount. But I think You need a whole lot more points to make the expense of buying from Wyndham, (even at the price you were quoted), work financially

There have been several discussions here about changes coming to the Wyndham reservations system. If a waiting list is part of those changes than the cancel and rebook trick will be taken from us. If that happens, renting for a profit will be gone as well.

Im going to wait another year to see what happens before I talk to any more Wyndham sales people


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## ronparise (Apr 4, 2012)

jebloomquist said:


> If I can't use all of the points, since the maintenance fee is about $4.05 per 1000 points, have any of you been able to rent points to others just to cover the mf?
> 
> What are the issues, hassles, or downside with putting points in the TUG for sale ad area offering to rent available Wyndham properties for others as guests?



renting points (actually making reservations for others and renting them at your cost) is probably pretty easy...But whats the point if you just want to break even?

Renting for a profit is a hassle and there is no guarantee and it takes some time... I do it and I make a little money. I find it easy and even fun, but Im not sure its something anyone can do.


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## Ridewithme38 (Apr 4, 2012)

ronparise said:


> renting points (actually making reservations for others and renting them at your cost) is probably pretty easy...But whats the point if you just want to break even?
> 
> Renting for a profit is a hassle and there is no guarantee and it takes some time... I do it and I make a little money. I find it easy and even fun, but Im not sure its something anyone can do.



When you are renting at cost, you cover your Maintenance fees and allow another person to enjoy a vacation at no cost to you, its a good deed, Good Karma the kind of thing you can do to both enrich your life and the life of others, that takes no effort and very little time for you to do...

Renting for a profit is always a nice perk when you can make it happen, but for those that just own their points to use....Why go through the hassle involved in trying to find someone to over charge and the guilt involved with taking advantage of them?

Now that i'm a little more knowledgeable about the Wyndham system i'm able to offer to rent from people at exactly their cost, this is neither them nor I taking advantage of each other....a 'Square' deal so to speak...we both gain


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## SOS8260456 (Apr 4, 2012)

ronparise said:


> There have been several discussions here about changes coming to the Wyndham reservations system. If a waiting list is part of those changes than the cancel and rebook trick will be taken from us. If that happens, renting for a profit will be gone as well.
> 
> Im going to wait another year to see what happens before I talk to any more Wyndham sales people



Good advice.  Who knows what will be happening later in the year.


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## rrlongwell (Apr 4, 2012)

ronparise said:


> This thread, post #7



Thanks, I forgot, I put that towards the bottom of the tread.  Modfication made.


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## kev5982 (Apr 4, 2012)

I am a current VIP Platinum owner and pay $4000 per year for those points.
I rent most of the points through Redweek.com or VTR. You can get a lifetime subscription to VTR and place an ad on one of the resorts of your choice. Wyndham Bonnet Creek is a good choice because of the availability and the number of people choosing to go there all year round.

Wyndham Bonnet Creek is a good choice to place an ad in Redweek .com also for the same reasons. You just have to wait till the 60 day mark from check in and book your weeks to rent. 

You will make a profit going this route and also be able to travel with a couple weeks vacation. The Platinum also allows you to book three day vacations fairly cheaply.


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## SOS8260456 (Apr 4, 2012)

kev5982 said:


> I am a current VIP Platinum owner and pay $4000 per year for those points.
> I rent most of the points through Redweek.com or VTR. You can get a lifetime subscription to VTR and place an ad on one of the resorts of your choice. Wyndham Bonnet Creek is a good choice because of the availability and the number of people choosing to go there all year round.
> 
> Wyndham Bonnet Creek is a good choice to place an ad in Redweek .com also for the same reasons. You just have to wait till the 60 day mark from check in and book your weeks to rent.
> ...



I cannot argue that I don't love being Platinum, but for alot of us it is already a "sunk" cost.  I think given the history of Wyndham trying to do whatever they can to limit owners from renting, investing in Platinum is not worth that additional money.  The OP is already Gold, if they want to get into renting, then pick up another 500,000 points on the resale market.  All the Gold benefits will apply to the resale points, because VIP is an account benefit, not a contract benefit.  They are already getting discounts and unit upgrades.  The increase in percentage of discounts compared to the money outlay is not worth it in my humble opinion.


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## jjmanthei05 (Apr 4, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> Now that i'm a little more knowledgeable about the Wyndham system i'm able to offer to rent from people at exactly their cost, this is neither them nor I taking advantage of each other....a 'Square' deal so to speak...we both gain



Ride,

I would disagree that this would be a 'square' deal. You are overlooking upfront, opportunity and miscellaneous Wyndham costs. Because purchase price for points can be anywhere from a few hundred dollars to $100,000+ range if VIP Platinum there needs to be consideration taken for that along with time spent and the risk of owning the points that if they aren't used they are still out the MF dollars. Where as you have none of those risks but are looking to pay the same maintenance fee cost as an owner. I would think something in the $7-$8/k range would be a fair deal to both parties. You can find people willing to give away their points at or below their MF cost but that is more along the lines of being desperate to get something for their points even if they're losing money. 

Jason


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## pacodemountainside (Apr 4, 2012)

Hey Jeb:

I would not knowlingly do business with any company that has an "F" BBB rating!



Also, sales incentives are  changeable or can be exterminated at  sales descretion.   See   www.wyndsham.com   for details   When Wyndhan was selling  some 25K new  Intervals a year,  beer money but with  new owner sales  around 4,000 last couple  years  the $12 million cost hurts.

But your offer intrigues me. I do updates regularily to rattle sales people cages and have never seen/had an offer like this. The best I had was buy 105K points for $18K, they would convert fixed week to UDI points without charge and issue a new deed for 245K points at LBM and I would be VIP Gold. Similar deal in Orlando(not BC deed)  and Vegas.

Are they offering trade-in or foreclosed deed? How were you able to take this offer back to room and think about?

If MF is around $4.00/ 1,000 and POA around $.50 this means HOA fee is around $3.50. I have purused MF calcuator on Wyndham forum and this is possible, but very few.

Pregnant question is: has VP sales signed off?

I do recall the low ball tactics of car salesmen of yore!

Paco


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## jebloomquist (Apr 5, 2012)

pacodemountainside said:


> But your offer intrigues me. I do updates regularily to rattle sales people cages and have never seen/had an offer like this. The best I had was buy 105K points for $18K, they would convert fixed week to UDI points without charge and issue a new deed for 245K points at LBM and I would be VIP Gold. Similar deal in Orlando(not BC deed)  and Vegas.
> 
> If MF is around $4.00/ 1,000 and POA around $.50 this means HOA fee is around $3.50. I have purused MF calcuator on Wyndham forum and this is possible, but very few.
> 
> Paco



Paco

I actually went to Wyndham with this idea. It was not presented to me in a sales presentation. And yes, there are places where the mf/1000 is low. My "2012 Annual CLUB WYNDHAM Plus Assessment Amount" is $3.90/1000.

Jim


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