# Prices getting soft?



## RX8 (May 19, 2012)

I've noticed that platinum 7000 point eBay auctions are not generating much interest lately.  Recent ended auctions got high bids as low as $6200.  Even an 8400 point Hawaii went for $7300.

Prices on a downward slide?


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## slum808 (May 19, 2012)

Could Hilton's active rofr of platinum units be deterring buyers from bidding? I would think some potential buyers get tired of lossing contracts to Hilton.


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## sjuhawk_jd (May 19, 2012)

I actually see an upward trend for affiliates. There is a valdoro mountain lodge, 8400 annal points, and it is over $8K already, despite a maintenance fee of over $1300. No rofr.

Bay Club in Hawaii is going for way more than they were going for 3 years ago.


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## gnorth16 (May 19, 2012)

I think most people who have done their research are going with Judy or Seth.  When their is active ROFR, why waste your time fooling around with ebay.  Unless the seller is willing to  "fudge" the final sale price to get it passed ROFR (their is nothing in it for them)....


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## SmithOp (May 20, 2012)

*eBay*

Judi has several of the listings on eBay, and prices are up from 2-3 yrs ago.  The new iPad app for eBay makes it very nice to watch the auctions. 

Buyers are more savvy, possibly due to TUG, no bids for the low point / high mf listings.


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## Remy (May 20, 2012)

I spoke with a non-Judi/Seth broker who said she was getting Vegas 2/2 platinums past ROFR at $10,500. I'm guessing prices dropped as tens of thousands of units became available for sale at Elara. Holding costs on those isn't low and Hilton doesn't need the inventory right now through ROFR.


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## whatsburning (May 27, 2012)

Remy said:


> I spoke with a non-Judi/Seth broker who said she was getting Vegas 2/2 platinums past ROFR at $10,500. I'm guessing prices dropped as tens of thousands of units became available for sale at Elara. Holding costs on those isn't low and Hilton doesn't need the inventory right now through ROFR.



Is ROFR because of inventory or because Hilton wants to keep a (relative) steady value on the points?


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## gnorth16 (May 27, 2012)

Remy, 

What have 7000 point Vegas Ts's been clearing ROFR in the past.  I though 11k was about normal and a couple of years back, 9k was the going rate.  

As for Elara softening up prices, maybe... But any resales are still Wastegate and are not guaranteed entry into HGVC.  Any new inventory  (if they are even for sale yet) will still be developer pricing.  It may lower the prices a bit, but any mass drop because of Elara won't happen.


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## sjuhawk_jd (May 27, 2012)

gnorth16 said:


> ...Unless the seller is willing to  "fudge" the final sale price to get it passed ROFR (their is nothing in it for them)....



There is a "sale" in it for them. And a chance to acquire a customer, who may buy more from them in future. There is also profit through in-house closing costs, etc.


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## Remy (May 28, 2012)

gnorth16 said:


> Remy,
> 
> What have 7000 point Vegas Ts's been clearing ROFR in the past.  I though 11k was about normal and a couple of years back, 9k was the going rate.
> 
> As for Elara softening up prices, maybe... But any resales are still Wastegate and are not guaranteed entry into HGVC.  Any new inventory  (if they are even for sale yet) will still be developer pricing.  It may lower the prices a bit, but any mass drop because of Elara won't happen.



It went as high as $13,500 just before Elara came on the scene. I had two attempts at a 2/2 Plat LV Strip bought back at $12,500.

A drop due to Elara is because it costs money for HGVC to hold onto inventory. Why buy back a one week 2/2 at the LV Strip for $13,500 when they have 20,000 2/2 weeks at Elara to sell? I bet they buy the bargains, but the $13,500 buyback of HGVC Vegas weeks is a thing of the past in my opinion (and borne out by the drop we've seen so far in the ROFR price since Elara started selling).


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## RichardL (May 28, 2012)

Do not Assume there is a ROFR with regard to Hilton and the Bay Club.  I have personally called over to the designated person at the Bay Club and I was told by her that all waivers of ROFR were being automatically granted.  She then offered to email me the one that had been submitted and was sitting on her desk since she had just returned from vacation.  I received it within 10 minutes.  In my experience prices are not going up for Hilton.


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## gnorth16 (May 28, 2012)

I passed ROFR 18 months ago @ $3500 plus closing and transfer costs for a 5000 point gold strip.  That was before HGVC took the 20 or so million for ROFR and announced it.  Long story short, my purchase went sideways and stalled out.  It passed ROFR, but the title didn't transfer.  4 months later HGVC had a property in their resales list that was bargained down to $3500.  I was told it would not pass ROFR to others, but I was grandfathered in because my deal was passed before they started aggressively buying back.  

When I contacted HGVC resales about purchasing my points, they would not and offered to list it with them for $5000-$6000 (suggested price minus 25% commission) depending on how much I was willing to move on the price. If they will not buy it back, they want all their resales to pass ROFR as well, so suggesting any price below the threshold would be silly (or genius!)

So comparing 18 months ago to now, in my experiences, prices have gone up.


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## GregT (May 29, 2012)

Wow, does anybody know if this auction was ended early?  If this is the real clearing price, this is a great price for a 1BR Platinum at Flamingo -- about $3,100.  

Thx!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/130701636618?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649


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## gnorth16 (May 30, 2012)

GregT said:


> Wow, does anybody know if this auction was ended early?  If this is the real clearing price, this is a great price for a 1BR Platinum at Flamingo -- about $3,100.
> 
> Thx!
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/130701636618?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649



A spelling error in the title may have not popped up in some saved searches for others.  It was a lucky tugger that got it! (not me)


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## RX8 (May 30, 2012)

gnorth16 said:


> A spelling error in the title may have not popped up in some saved searches for others.  It was a lucky tugger that got it!



Greg, the auction ended normally.  Gnorth is right, this was a "hot" deal due to the spelling error in the title (Hilton Flaming Points).


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## Remy (May 30, 2012)

RX8 said:


> Greg, the auction ended normally.  Gnorth is right, this was a "hot" deal due to the spelling error in the title (Hilton Flaming Points).



Two others have sold on eBay for $3,050 and $3,300. This is about the going price for this unit on eBay. It seemed it might go lower due to it ending at 1 am eastern on the night of Memorial Day, but that didn't seem to have an impact. They also artificially inflated the transfer fee and are at the high end of closing costs.

As far as the spelling, this broker has had two auctions with this same "O"mission. Time to invest in a smarter spellcheck.


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## GregT (May 30, 2012)

Remy said:


> Two others have sold on eBay for $3,050 and $3,300. This is about the going price for this unit on eBay.



That's really interesting -- I didn't realize Flaming(o)'s were going for that low.  This makes the higher prices for other ROFR-based properties really seem out of whack.   I would have thrown out one low eBay auction as a small sample but three auctions is very interesting.

Thanks very much!

Greg


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## sinistrafatboy (May 30, 2012)

I was watching this auction off and on all weekend. What is the downside to buying from a Ebay auction. Does the closing become a problem? And how can I determine a good deal from a potential nightmare?


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## GregT (May 30, 2012)

sinistrafatboy said:


> I was watching this auction off and on all weekend. What is the downside to buying from a Ebay auction. Does the closing become a problem? And how can I determine a good deal from a potential nightmare?



I've bought three timeshares off of eBay and the process was the same -- as long as you have a good closing company, the source of the week didn't impact me.

The only caution is that some of the listing brokers have less than stellar reputations, and I would encourage you to make sure that the favorability % is close to 100%.

Best,

Greg


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## Remy (May 30, 2012)

sinistrafatboy said:


> I was watching this auction off and on all weekend. What is the downside to buying from a Ebay auction. Does the closing become a problem? And how can I determine a good deal from a potential nightmare?



In my experience research is your friend. Stay away from people who don't know what they own, don't have facts straight in their ads, don't fully answer questions, etc. If you know the MF is $950 and they say it's $600 it's a good sign they don't know what they have for sale.

I've bought off eBay and from a broker in the city my timeshare is located. I've also sold through Seth Nock. It's anecdotal, but they're all about the same and I've not had problems with any of them. I did try a bankruptcy auction once. I wouldn't do that again.


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## presley (May 31, 2012)

sinistrafatboy said:


> I was watching this auction off and on all weekend. What is the downside to buying from a Ebay auction. Does the closing become a problem? And how can I determine a good deal from a potential nightmare?



I have had good and bad experiences buying on Ebay.  At this point, I will only bid from certain sellers.  For example, there are several HGVC listings now that I won't bid on because of the seller/closing company.


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## csxjohn (May 31, 2012)

sinistrafatboy said:


> I was watching this auction off and on all weekend. What is the downside to buying from a Ebay auction. Does the closing become a problem? And how can I determine a good deal from a potential nightmare?



I've bought 3 TSs off eBay.  Here is what I did.

Know exactly what the auction is for:

Fixed or floating, if float, which weeks can you get
Points or weeks
Deeded or Right To Use for a set number of years
Who's paying the transfer costs
Who's paying the MFs and When
How much are the MFs
What's the usage, annual or something else

I look at feed back, if it's not 99% I check to see what the bad marks are for

I always print the auction out and review it that way.  I've picked up things I missed on my computer screen.

I go to the resort web page and if I have some questions, I call the resort and tell them I'm considering buying a TS at their resort and could you tell me....

Hope this helps


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## Purseval (May 31, 2012)

RX8 said:


> Prices on a downward slide?



We tried to buy through a broker and were told that ROFR was about $3000 higher than what we offered.  Asked if we wanted to raise our offer and we declined.  We're in no hurry to buy and the unit still isn't sold.


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## RX8 (May 31, 2012)

Purseval said:


> We tried to buy through a broker and were told that ROFR was about $3000 higher than what we offered.  Asked if we wanted to raise our offer and we declined.  We're in no hurry to buy and the unit still isn't sold.



If you don't mind the asking, what was it that you tried to buy and how much?


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## GregT (May 31, 2012)

Purseval said:


> We tried to buy through a broker and were told that ROFR was about $3000 higher than what we offered.  Asked if we wanted to raise our offer and we declined.  We're in no hurry to buy and the unit still isn't sold.



The exact same thing happened to me.  I went to a different broker and got them to make the offer ($4,900) which was accepted by seller and did pass ROFR.  

I thought that was interesting -- and therefore it's worth continuing to ofer the price you want.  

Best,

Greg


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