# [2013] T-Mobile to drop International Data and Roaming Fees



## Passepartout (Oct 10, 2013)

In a move to differentiate itself from the 3 bigger cell phone carriers, T-Mobile, a division of Deutsche Telekom is making using data, texting, or making a call between the 70 countries Americans are most likely to travel to, virtually the same cost as using it at home.

The changes take place Oct. 31st. A few details here: http://www.nbcnews.com/technology/t-mobile-getting-rid-international-data-texting-fees-8C11366852

Jim

ETA: Depends on whether 'In control of' is the same as 'a division of'. Here, from the quoted article: "T-Mobile has its headquarters in Bellevue, Wash., and is under the control of Germany's Deutsche Telekom AG."


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Oct 10, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> In a move to differentiate itself from the 3 bigger cell phone carriers, T-Mobile, a division of Deutsche Telekom is making using data, texting, or making a call between the 70 countries Americans are most likely to travel to, virtually the same cost as using it at home.
> 
> The changes take place Oct. 31st. A few details here: http://www.nbcnews.com/technology/t-mobile-getting-rid-international-data-texting-fees-8C11366852
> 
> Jim



I don't believe that T*Mobile is a division of DT any longer.  DT sold down their stake in T*Mobile several years ago.  

In any case, this is just the latest in a series of increasingly desperate attempts by T*Mobile to try to remain relevant in the market.


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## am1 (Oct 10, 2013)

This got me interested but only up to 6 weeks at a time.  Still may work.


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## MichaelColey (Oct 10, 2013)

Wow, that could be big for frequent international travelers.

I have some friends who spent several months abroad earlier this year, and they bought an unlocked phone and got local SIM cards for data in each country (and used VOIP for calls) for about $20 each.  But most people wouldn't go through that effort.


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## s1b000 (Oct 10, 2013)

Sounds attractive but their US coverage can be poor. I had them briefly but could not get a signal in my house.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Oct 10, 2013)

s1b000 said:


> Sounds attractive but their US coverage can be poor. I had them briefly but could not get a signal in my house.



Yeah - that's their big problem.  They have a terrible network, and they don't have access to enough capital to fix that.  

That's why the AT&T merger was critical for them.  When that was scuttled their ability to be a major player in telecom ended at the same time.


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## Clemson Fan (Oct 10, 2013)

Hmm, interesting.  I wonder if I'll be able to buy a T-mobile SIM to plug into my Verizon iPhone with an unlocked SIM when I travel abroad which I do about once a year?  I wonder if I'll be able to buy a SIM from them to plug into my iPad?


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## SMHarman (Oct 10, 2013)

Clemson Fan said:


> Hmm, interesting.  I wonder if I'll be able to buy a T-mobile SIM to plug into my Verizon iPhone with an unlocked SIM when I travel abroad which I do about once a year?  I wonder if I'll be able to buy a SIM from them to plug into my iPad?



Sounds possible.  The VZ iPhone is not locked to a specific network SIM card.


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## pranas (Oct 10, 2013)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> I don't believe that T*Mobile is a division of DT any longer.  DT sold down their stake in T*Mobile several years ago.
> 
> In any case, this is just the latest in a series of increasingly desperate attempts by T*Mobile to try to remain relevant in the market.



Actually it is still is part of DT - my SIL works for T-Mobile in Bellevue.  However, TM is being sized down because DT does want to sell it.


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## SMHarman (Oct 10, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> In a move to differentiate itself from the 3 bigger cell phone carriers, T-Mobile, a division of Deutsche Telekom is making using data, texting, or making a call between the 70 countries Americans are most likely to travel to, virtually the same cost as using it at home.
> 
> The changes take place Oct. 31st. A few details here: http://www.nbcnews.com/technology/t-mobile-getting-rid-international-data-texting-fees-8C11366852
> 
> ...



Am I reading this correctly, the 20c a minute, no additional cost is for WIFI calling and the data is 2G only.



			
				http://www.t-mobile.com/coverage.html said:
			
		

> Calls over Wi-Fi are $.20/min; texts over Wi-Fi are $.20 each. Coverage not available in some areas; we are not responsible for the performance of our roaming partners’ networks. Data at up to 2G speeds. No tethering.



I can WIFI call on my ATT networked smartphone with GrooVe IP Lite or a similar app.  2G speeds will feel painfully slow and hey, you have already found yourself a WIFI hotspot to make the calls.

Is this more marketing fluff than value add?


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## Passepartout (Oct 10, 2013)

Clemson Fan said:


> Hmm, interesting.  I wonder if I'll be able to buy a T-mobile SIM to plug into my Verizon iPhone with an unlocked SIM when I travel abroad which I do about once a year?  I wonder if I'll be able to buy a SIM from them to plug into my iPad?



I think both of those scenarios would work. The question I'd have is if you could sign up for just the time period you'd need to use it internationally. You could probably get away with signing up once, then cancelling but the next time, there might be questions- or costs.


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## easyrider (Oct 10, 2013)

Clemson Fan said:


> Hmm, interesting.  I wonder if I'll be able to buy a T-mobile SIM to plug into my Verizon iPhone with an unlocked SIM when I travel abroad which I do about once a year?  I wonder if I'll be able to buy a SIM from them to plug into my iPad?



Im using an older I Phone with ATT go phone plan. I buy $100 worth of credit to keep the same number all year. We will blow through most of the minutes through out the year. We also use skype on the I Phone and the kids have the face time dealio.


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## hypnotiq (Oct 10, 2013)

MichaelColey said:


> I have some friends who spent several months abroad earlier this year, and they bought an unlocked phone and got local SIM cards for data in each country (and used VOIP for calls) for about $20 each.  But most people wouldn't go through that effort.



We do this when we go out of the country. Very easy/simple to do and way more cost effective than "intl calling" that Verizon charges for.

We have an S3 and Nokia 928, and it works great.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Oct 10, 2013)

pranas said:


> Actually it is still is part of DT - my SIL works for T-Mobile in Bellevue.  However, TM is being sized down because DT does want to sell it.



I have relatives who work for T*Mobile as well. They no longer report to DT as a division of DT.  That ended a couple of years ago.  DT still has a big stake, but they are no longer a DT operating division.


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## Clemson Fan (Oct 11, 2013)

SMHarman said:


> Am I reading this correctly, the 20c a minute, no additional cost is for WIFI calling and the data is 2G only.
> 
> I can WIFI call on my ATT networked smartphone with GrooVe IP Lite or a similar app.  2G speeds will feel painfully slow and hey, you have already found yourself a WIFI hotspot to make the calls.
> 
> Is this more marketing fluff than value add?



I didn't see this in the NBC news article.  Where did you see it?

Wifi only calling would make no sense because I can do that now for practically free using the skype app internationally.  I read it to mean 20 cents a minute using the cellular network which Verizon now charges 99 cents a minute IF you singn up for their $5.99 international plan.

I didn't see anything in the article about speeds being limited to 2G?

Anyway, if this is the real deal I might be popping in some T mobile SIMs to my iPad and iPhone when I travel abroad.  It would save me the hassle of shopping for them when I'm abroad.


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## Ken555 (Oct 11, 2013)

Clemson Fan said:


> I didn't see anything in the article about speeds being limited to 2G?



I think it's great that T-Mobile is trying to provide additional services. I don't think we're far off from unlimited international calling and data plans (within ~5 years). I hope AT&T and Verizon match or do better than T-Mobile, though I doubt it. Unfortunately, the 2G data is correct. Just look at the plan options at the T-Mobile site for all the info. In part:



> Simple Choice International Service: Additional charges apply in excluded destinations; included destinations subject to change at T-Mobile’s discretion. Qualifying postpaid Simple Choice plan and capable device required. Taxes additional; usage taxed in some countries. Voice and text features for direct communications between 2 people. Communications with premium-rate (e.g., 900, entertainment, high-rate helpline) numbers not included and may incur additional charges. Calls over Wi-Fi are $.20/min; texts over Wi-Fi are $.20 each. Coverage not available in some areas; we are not responsible for the performance of our roaming partners’ networks. Data at up to 2G speeds. No tethering. Not for extended international use; you must reside in the U.S. and primary usage must occur on our U.S. network. Device must register on our U.S. network before international use. Service may be terminated or restricted for excessive roaming or misuse.
> International Data Roaming: Some devices may transmit and receive data without any user action, which may result in unexpected charges when you travel internationally. Some services that are free of charge when used domestically may incur charges when roaming internationally.




Sent from my iPad


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## pgnewarkboy (Oct 11, 2013)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> I don't believe that T*Mobile is a division of DT any longer.  DT sold down their stake in T*Mobile several years ago.
> 
> In any case, this is just the latest in a series of increasingly desperate attempts by T*Mobile to try to remain relevant in the market.



If offering better pricing is desperate, I wish ATTand Verizon were desperate.


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## SMHarman (Oct 11, 2013)

Clemson Fan said:


> I didn't see this in the NBC news article.  Where did you see it?
> 
> Wifi only calling would make no sense because I can do that now for practically free using the skype app internationally.  I read it to mean 20 cents a minute using the cellular network which Verizon now charges 99 cents a minute IF you singn up for their $5.99 international plan.
> 
> ...





Ken555 said:


> I think it's great that T-Mobile is trying to provide additional services. I don't think we're far off from unlimited international calling and data plans (within ~5 years). I hope AT&T and Verizon match or do better than T-Mobile, though I doubt it. Unfortunately, the 2G data is correct. Just look at the plan options at the T-Mobile site for all the info. In part:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


See my bold in the quote above.


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## pgnewarkboy (Oct 11, 2013)

WiFi calling on tmobile has always been treated as a regular cell call and counts against your minutes or texts depending on your plan. WiFi calling is used where there is poor cell coverage. It does not mean that international usage is limited to WiFi calling.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Oct 11, 2013)

pgnewarkboy said:


> If offering better pricing is desperate, I wish ATTand Verizon were desperate.



Worked out pretty well for Nash Rambler didn't it?  Taught Ford and GM a real lesson.

*******

Of course, people should take advantage if it works for them.  As regards AT&T, Verizon, and Sprint, they're probably trembling at this move in about the same way that GM and Ford trembled when Nash was circling the drain.  Or, to use a more recent example, the way Microsoft trembled when Corel slashed the prices on it's office suite software.  

But by and large, what's happening at T*Mobile, is that whenever they roll out a new, lower cost plan, they don't attract very many new subscribers.  Mostly what happens is that their existing subscribers convert to the new plan to save money, and the increase in revenue from the new subscribers they do attract is less than the drop in revenue they experience from their current customers switching plans.  So all that happens is that they generate less revenue, while their costs remain fixed or increasing.  That is the death spiral they are in.


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## Clemson Fan (Oct 11, 2013)

Yup, it's a worthless plan.

Poor journalism!  The several articles I read never pointed out this stuff!


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## Ironwood (Oct 11, 2013)

Out-of-country roaming rates are outrageous for Canadian cell plan holders!  Even crossing the border for a day with your cell can result in unpleasant surprises when you next see your bill.  Heading to CA for 12 days, and we are only taking one smart phone between the two of us and I just bought a 30 day (that's the minimum) US roaming package for $35 which gives us only 40 min talk time and 100 texts ingoing/outgoing!  Not much for $35 and we'll try to make do.  Always have Bell calling cards if we need to have extensive conversation back home.  I think we have some of the highest cell phone rates worldwide up here!


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## Chrispee (Oct 11, 2013)

Ironwood, you should check out Roam Mobility if you travel to the US frequently enough and want to have unlimited North America calling.


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## x3 skier (Oct 11, 2013)

Between Skype, Pinger, Face Time free WiFi hot spots and a local data SIM for an unlocked AT&T  MiFi when no free site is around, I am covered. 

Cheers


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## bogey21 (Oct 11, 2013)

I'm not experienced with using cell phones overseas but a friend recently used his once in an emergency from Amman Jordan to his wife in Dallas.  It was a short call but the charge on his cell phone bill for the call was something like $276. He called AT&T and questioned it and they reduced it to $30 immediately.  I guess it just pays to ask.

George


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## LisaH (Jun 3, 2016)

Anyone has more recent updates on T-Mobile coverage? Area that I am interested are SF Bay, San Diego, Chicago, and USVI. Consider switching due to its free raining feature. T Mobile claims that coverage has improved significantly in the last couple of years. Just need verification. Thanks!


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## pittle (Jun 3, 2016)

We have had AT&T for 20+ years and were considering changing cell providers, but were able to add free calling and texting to and from Mexico at no charge.  That saved them a customer since we tend to go to Mexico 4-6 weeks each year.  Not only that, I called in to upgrade to the next higher level because I saw an offer with more data for the same price, and they doubled my current 10GB data to 20GB data for not charge!  We decided to keep AT&T.  

I have been to Europe a couple of times, but that is so seldom that I use hotel WIFI for calling and emailing.  I can also use WIFI as many other places and not be charged for the calls.


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## tompalm (Jun 3, 2016)

LisaH said:


> Anyone has more recent updates on T-Mobile coverage? Area that I am interested are SF Bay, San Diego, Chicago, and USVI. Consider switching due to its free raining feature. T Mobile claims that coverage has improved significantly in the last couple of years. Just need verification. Thanks!



I've had T-mobile for years and haves traveled all over the states as well as international travel from Europe to Korea. Voice calling works fine just about anywhere you go. The data plan for your phone or iPad is not good in a lot of places. The phone works even better in other countries than the US and their international plan is excellent with free text and data, plus calls are 20 cents per minute. It really depends on what your needs are.


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## rhonda (Jun 4, 2016)

LisaH said:


> Anyone has more recent updates on T-Mobile coverage? Area that I am interested are SF Bay, San Diego, Chicago, and USVI. Consider switching due to its free raining feature. T Mobile claims that coverage has improved significantly in the last couple of years. Just need verification. Thanks!


I can confirm improved coverage across San Diego -- but though the use of newer frequencies which required me to upgrade to a newer phone handset.

FWIW, it still doesn't reach my house ... but I do enjoy the free music streaming (etc) when I'm on the road!  I have a free T-Mo wifi router at home bridging my call and text messaging.


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## tompalm (Jun 4, 2016)

pittle said:


> We have had AT&T for 20+ years and were considering changing cell providers, but were able to add free calling and texting to and from Mexico at no charge.  That saved them a customer since we tend to go to Mexico 4-6 weeks each year.  Not only that, I called in to upgrade to the next higher level because I saw an offer with more data for the same price, and they doubled my current 10GB data to 20GB data for not charge!  We decided to keep AT&T.
> 
> I have been to Europe a couple of times, but that is so seldom that I use hotel WIFI for calling and emailing.  I can also use WIFI as many other places and not be charged for the calls.



Have you ever noticed calls to Verizon cell phone are sometime not very clear. I believe GSM lines do not communicate well with CDMA or maybe it is T-Mobile that has minor issues on occasion. Has anyone with AT&T noticed a difference between calling people that have Verizon vs. T-Mobile. I have noticed a difference for years and had four different phones from S-3 to Note 4 to iPhone 6 and minor problems occured on occasion.


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## Ken555 (Jun 4, 2016)

tompalm said:


> Have you ever noticed calls to Verizon cell phone are sometime not very clear. I believe GSM lines do not communicate well with CDMA or maybe it is T-Mobile that has minor issues on occasion. Has anyone with AT&T noticed a difference between calling people that have Verizon vs. T-Mobile. I have noticed a difference for years and had four different phones from S-3 to Note 4 to iPhone 6 and minor problems occured on occasion.




C'mon...you don't really know how GSM and CDMA work, do you?


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## x3 skier (Jun 5, 2016)

tompalm said:


> Have you ever noticed calls to Verizon cell phone are sometime not very clear. I believe GSM lines do not communicate well with CDMA or maybe it is T-Mobile that has minor issues on occasion. Has anyone with AT&T noticed a difference between calling people that have Verizon vs. T-Mobile. I have noticed a difference for years and had four different phones from S-3 to Note 4 to iPhone 6 and minor problems occured on occasion.



I have friends with ATT and friends with Verizon. The only difference I've noticed is when someone uses a Bluetooth earpiece instead of using the phone directly. 

Cheers


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## SMHarman (Jun 5, 2016)

tompalm said:


> Have you ever noticed calls to Verizon cell phone are sometime not very clear. I believe GSM lines do not communicate well with CDMA or maybe it is T-Mobile that has minor issues on occasion. Has anyone with AT&T noticed a difference between calling people that have Verizon vs. T-Mobile. I have noticed a difference for years and had four different phones from S-3 to Note 4 to iPhone 6 and minor problems occured on occasion.



I believe GSM lines do not communicate well with CDMA or maybe it is T-Mobile that has minor issues on occasion.

Unlikely, GSM etc are just they way the signal is carried to the wire / fiber that then transmits the call to the alternate carrier. 

If you stay within the same carrier yiu would get an end to end encrypted call with the GSM datastream passed between the base stations. 

So many variables in this theory. 
1. Quality and conditiob of the Microphone on the sending phone. Price quality and pocket lint. 
2. Radio on sending phone
3. Antenna on sending phone (remember those problem iphones)
4. Distance to base station. 
5. Contention on radio to base station
6. Contention at base station
7. Quality and capacity of back haul. 

And then the same in the opposite direction to the receiving phone.


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## LisaH (Jun 5, 2016)

rhonda said:


> I can confirm improved coverage across San Diego -- but though the use of newer frequencies which required me to upgrade to a newer phone handset.
> 
> FWIW, it still doesn't reach my house ... but I do enjoy the free music streaming (etc) when I'm on the road!  I have a free T-Mo wifi router at home bridging my call and text messaging.



Yes free streaming is a nice feature to have, plus no roaming cost in foreign countries. 
When you use a T-Mo wifi router, can you make and receive calls from home?


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