# Restructuring my HGVC holdings



## brp (Sep 3, 2019)

There have been several threads about buying "the right" HGVC and also about eBay. I have read those and seen good advice. I'm starting a new thread because I want to do more than just buy something new. I want to sell some as well.

Here's the deal:

We have W. 57th and we're not gonna touch that.

We have 2 Flamingo 5000 Gold 2BR. Certainly not ideal in terms of MF/point. We would want to sell these, and know we'll take a loss.

We like the 10,000 point range and I'm currently looking at an eBay listing for 9600 at Boulevard. 2d left, currently just over $8K. Seller indicates "free title and closing." Doesn't want a Credit Card, but I will likely contact and offer them like 3% for taking it.

Overall, this seems a good deal, if I can get it under about $1/point. I don't see MFs for the 3BR here, but they list $1112, which is quite reasonable.

Probably not likely to get them to pay HGVC closing fees, but can certainly ask 

We're thinking to buy this first, even though it may mean carrying the extra MF into next year, or maybe listing the sales simultaneously.

If we we work with one of the brokers here, it is on the order of $1K in their fees, and the sales price would not be high, so a lot of loss. Don't really know the ins and outs of selling, but maybe it is worth to research, or enlist the aid of someone here who has done it...for a fee, of course.

Any thoughts on what we're trying to do here are most welcome.

Edit to add: Currently all 10K 2020 points are intact.

Cheers.


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## terces (Sep 3, 2019)

What are you currently paying for annual MF's for the 5000 point units at the Flamingo?


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## brp (Sep 3, 2019)

$1049 per 5000 point contract, so about $0.21/point. This is a little less than twice what the Boulevard contract would cost.

So, let's say I could get like $1500/contract for the ones I have. That's $3000. Let's say I paid even $1/point, so $9600 for this one. Then it would take a bit under 7 years to break even. Hmmm...now seeing if this makes sense with this contract.

Cheers.


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## Remy (Sep 3, 2019)

I like your plan. I went with the same unit after tiring of the constant nickel and dime of multiple weeks and the "buy where you want to stay" theory unnecessarily costing me a small fortune. Best of luck winning the auction at a price that beats ROFR.


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## bizaro86 (Sep 3, 2019)

brp said:


> $1049 per 5000 point contract, so about $0.21/point. This is a little less than twice what the Boulevard contract would cost.
> 
> So, let's say I could get like $1500/contract for the ones I have. That's $3000. Let's say I paid even $1/point, so $9600 for this one. Then it would take a bit under 7 years to break even. Hmmm...now seeing if this makes sense with this contract.
> 
> Cheers.



At the end of that seven years it is likely the larger unit would still have more value than the 2 gold units.


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## brp (Sep 3, 2019)

May I ask how recently you purchased and what you got it for? (Probably in for ROFR database, but may make sense to have it consolidated here).

Cheers.


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## terces (Sep 3, 2019)

We have 7000 point 2 bdrm platinum at the Boulevard and fees are ~ $850 = $0.012.2 per point (HGVC Club fee is on top of this).


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## hurnik (Sep 3, 2019)

Don't forget to add in all the closing costs and activation fees.  Although still a pretty good deal, IF you can get it at $9600.  Something tells me it'll go for more than that since all the other listings I've seen elsewhere are like $18,000 or more.  But there are always some good deals that crop up (like I got that Flamingo 7,000 points for $2500 plus closing costs, so go figure).


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## brp (Sep 3, 2019)

hurnik said:


> Don't forget to add in all the closing costs and activation fees.  Although still a pretty good deal, IF you can get it at $9600.  Something tells me it'll go for more than that since all the other listings I've seen elsewhere are like $18,000 or more.  But there are always some good deals that crop up (like I got that Flamingo 7,000 points for $2500 plus closing costs, so go figure).



I assume that yours was eBay? For me, I'll just bid what I want to pay and be willing to let it go if it goes over 

Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 3, 2019)

I just got Elera 9600 points for $6,478. With closing cost and transfer fee about $7,500.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 3, 2019)

Bao Nguyen said:


> I just got Elera 9600 points for $6,478. With closing cost and transfer fee about $7,500.



Great price. What are the MF on that unit? Is that a 3 bdrm or 2 bdrm?


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## brp (Sep 3, 2019)

That really is good. Seems I may want to keep looking as no real hurry 
Was it one with few bids (the one I'm looking at is up top 80 bids)

Also curious about the eBay winners: did they want check as opposed to Credit Card? I'm somewhat leery of that and willing to add a few percent (maybe 3%) to have them take the Credit Card.

Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 3, 2019)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Great price. What are the MF on that unit? Is that a 3 bdrm or 2 bdrm?


MF $1136 two bed rooms plus .


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 3, 2019)

brp said:


> That really is good. Seems I may want to keep looking as no real hurry
> Was it one with few bids (the one I'm looking at is up top 80 bids)
> 
> Also curious about the eBay winners: did they want check as opposed to Credit Card? I'm somewhat leery of that and willing to add a few percent (maybe 3%) to have them take the Credit Card.
> ...


My deal has option to pay with credit card . I don’t bid on any cash deal . 3% about $225 just a piece of mind . 
MF is due soon , you will see a lot of people dumb their timeshare . Don’t rush ...


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## hurnik (Sep 3, 2019)

brp said:


> I assume that yours was eBay? For me, I'll just bid what I want to pay and be willing to let it go if it goes over
> 
> Cheers.



No, not eBay.  Random listing on Judi's website.  The seller was just wanting to dump/get rid of it.


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## hurnik (Sep 3, 2019)

brp said:


> That really is good. Seems I may want to keep looking as no real hurry
> Was it one with few bids (the one I'm looking at is up top 80 bids)
> 
> Also curious about the eBay winners: did they want check as opposed to Credit Card? I'm somewhat leery of that and willing to add a few percent (maybe 3%) to have them take the Credit Card.
> ...



Yeah, I'm a little leery of the money order/personal check only.  Granted, the seller has a 100% positive rating, but no way I'd pay that way.  Credit card to "hold" the transaction and certified check to pay at closing/escrow, IMO.

It would be one thing if it's like a $500 sales price, IMO.


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## brp (Sep 3, 2019)

Another option that has been mentioned in other threads is the Scotland properties. MFs are low as are the transfer fees.

Cheers.


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## amirh (Sep 3, 2019)

brp said:


> Another option that has been mentioned in other threads is the Scotland properties. MFs are low as are the transfer fees.
> 
> Cheers.


I can attest to that. Bought a 7000 point 2br week 52 for $6k at  Craigendarroch. Start to finish was *3 weeks! *_No deed, perpetual right to use. You take a gamble on exchange rate, but it was a risk I was willing to take. On top of that, used my Amex aspire (or whatever they call it this week) to pay MF and transfer fees and got the kickback. That property is eligible for II from what I understand but I haven’t looked into it yet. _


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> We like the 10,000 point range and I'm currently looking at an eBay listing for 9600 at Boulevard. 2d left, currently just over $8K. Seller indicates "free title and closing." Doesn't want a Credit Card, but I will likely contact and offer them like 3% for taking it..



Well, they very quickly (within 1 day) sent the estoppel. All fees paid for this year. Some saved points (estoppel date of July 25). All future points available. And they will take a Credit Card if I add 3%. I believe that Boulevard is one of the properties where "$1/point" is still considered good, yes?

Secondary question: If I want to sell my timeshare myself (and not use a formal Realtor), and I'm willing to list and find the buyer...do I need to know much about the process or just pay a Transfer Company to handle all of that, i.e. is the difference between Realtor and Transfer Company just the listing, marketing and negotiating?

Cheers.


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## hurnik (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> Well, they very quickly (within 1 day) sent the estoppel. All fees paid for this year. Some saved points (estoppel date of July 25). All future points available. And they will take a Credit Card if I add 3%. I believe that Boulevard is one of the properties where "$1/point" is still considered good, yes?
> 
> Secondary question: If I want to sell my timeshare myself (and not use a formal Realtor), and I'm willing to list and find the buyer...do I need to know much about the process or just pay a Transfer Company to handle all of that, i.e. is the difference between Realtor and Transfer Company just the listing, marketing and negotiating?
> 
> Cheers.



Yes, I'd say $1/point for the 7k or higher points for Blvd is "good".  Just my opinion of course.

Yes, if you use LT Transfers, they'll pretty much walk you through everything in terms of handling the sale and such.  I'd then list them on TUG first (IMO), not sure about eBay.

If you go through the brokers that are generally recommended for buying resale, they will probably charge a commission or flat fee (probably $1,000 last time I checked), so you have to weigh that into your decision making.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 4, 2019)

You can also list on Redweek for a small fee. Use a closing company for the paperwork e.g. LT Transfers as recommended previously.


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

CalGalTraveler said:


> You can also list on Redweek for a small fee. Use a closing company for the paperwork e.g. LT Transfers as recommended previously.



Thanks. Got an offer from Judi's group for $750 each (because I've bought several from them). Maybe it's worth it to have them to all the work in this case?

Cheers.


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## GT75 (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> Got an offer from Judi's group for $750 each (because I've bought several from them).



That is good to know.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 4, 2019)

Easy to do with a broker. Can you list with a broker and also list yourself?


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## Sapper (Sep 4, 2019)

Bao Nguyen said:


> I just got Elera 9600 points for $6,478. With closing cost and transfer fee about $7,500.



I bid on that as well. Glad a TUGGER got it!


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 4, 2019)

Sapper said:


> I bid on that as well. Glad a TUGGER got it!




Hopefully HGVC pass the ROFR.


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## GTLINZ (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> Got an offer from Judi's group for $750 each (because I've bought several from them). Maybe it's worth it to have them to all the work in this case?
> 
> Cheers.



I have sold with Judi and the fees and professional closing was worth it to me.  But one cost I did not anticipate is that you are likely to get an offer from another broker and that added another $500 in fees in addition to Judi's fees.  But the offer was a bit higher so it really washed.  I was ready to sell so I went with it.


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## terces (Sep 4, 2019)

Sapper said:


> I bid on that as well. Glad a TUGGER got it!


Did you pass rofr yet, or was this the successful bid on ebay?


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## Sapper (Sep 4, 2019)

Bao Nguyen said:


> Hopefully HGVC pass the ROFR.



I think it will. They don’t seem to be ROFRing many Elara units... though, this is not an average Elara unit, so maybe.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 4, 2019)

Sapper said:


> I think it will. They don’t seem to be ROFRing many Elara units... though, this is not an average Elara unit, so maybe.


I don’t care much about Vegas , I wanted to add points to expand my HGVC points .  Seller tried to add 2020 mf to make it looks like $1 per point .


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

Bao Nguyen said:


> I don’t care much about Vegas , I wanted to add points to expand my HGVC points .  Seller tried to add 2020 mf to make it looks like $1 per point .



That's one thing I've heard is being/can be done: Add in things like the MFs for the ROFR reporting, and then rebate after-the-fact.

Cheers.


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## dayooper (Sep 4, 2019)

Sapper said:


> I think it will. They don’t seem to be ROFRing many Elara units... though, this is not an average Elara unit, so maybe.



Yeah, Elara is a huge resort and they need owners paying MF’s there. I think you will be fine.


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## Smclaugh99 (Sep 4, 2019)

There is an Ebay listing for 7k 2BR Platinum week at SeaWorld with less than 50min left.  Bid has been stationary at $4100. 

Sean


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

Smclaugh99 said:


> There is an Ebay listing for 7k 2BR Platinum week at SeaWorld with less than 50min left.  Bid has been stationary at $4100.
> 
> Sean



Thanks. MF ratio is certainly better than what I'm paying now, but still on the higher side, IMO.

What's also interesting is that the same seller has 3 other active listings, and all finish within less than 10 minutes of each other.

Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> That's one thing I've heard is being/can be done: Add in things like the MFs for the ROFR reporting, and then rebate after-the-fact.
> 
> Cheers.[/QUOTE
> Seller never mention about rebate me later.  HGVC send out MF around January , i don't want cause all the confusion later and get MF bill from HGVC again. I paid with credit card so 3% charged as well


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 4, 2019)

dayooper said:


> Yeah, Elara is a huge resort and they need owners paying MF’s there. I think you will be fine.


This resort is tricky.  40% own by Westgate ;  HGVC and Blackstone own 60%.  I think HGVC own only 20%.  If HGVC get bought  out, higher risk for me to loose HGVC.


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

So there is a 9600 pt. Boulevard that is constructed of two 4800 pt. Platinum 1BR. The claim is that the MF are $1261 for the package, but that seems low?

If this is accurate, it's only about $120 more than the single 9600 pt. Plat 3BR, and maybe $3000 less, so that would take 30 years to recoup...

It also has 0 bids and closes in under and hour.

Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 4, 2019)

Smclaugh99 said:


> There is an Ebay listing for 7k 2BR Platinum week at SeaWorld with less than 50min left.  Bid has been stationary at $4100.
> 
> Sean


Stay away from this seller. after 3 months, they told  me they just submitted to HGVC got ROFR.. I called my credit card company and they refunded my money. 
Global Resort Transfer Inc.            Google this company, very bad rating.
www.globalresorttransfer.com
8900 SW 107th Ave


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> So there is a 9600 pt. Boulevard that is constructed of two 4800 pt. Platinum 1BR. The claim is that the MF are $1261 for the package, but that seems low?
> 
> If this is accurate, it's only about $120 more than the single 9600 pt. Plat 3BR, and maybe $3000 less, so that would take 30 years to recoup...
> 
> ...


I would not buy two contract , it  will not hold the value if anything under 7,000 points, very hard to sell.


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

Agreed. What if the plan is to use it for quite a while and sell way down the road? Seems a good price and quite reasonable MF for the point total, even if two contracts?

Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> Agreed. What if the plan is to use it for quite a while and sell way down the road? Seems a good price and quite reasonable MF for the point total, even if two contracts?
> 
> Cheers.[/QUOTE
> You have the estoppel from the seller? 5,000 point for Boulevard  $878 + $176 club= 1,054
> 9,600 points for $1261???


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

I'll get estoppel prior to payment. The $176 is not included in their calculation, and I already pay HGVC dues, so I'm not worried about this. This is a 4800 1BR platinum x2, not the Gold 5000 point 2BR.

(By the way - I very much appreciate the input of the many here who know quite a bit more than I do about this )

Cheers.


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## dayooper (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> Agreed. What if the plan is to use it for quite a while and sell way down the road? Seems a good price and quite reasonable MF for the point total, even if two contracts?
> 
> Cheers.



The fees for the 2 contracts will double. They will run you over $2000 (you would pay the $409 transfer for both, correct?) The MF’s look correct, though. Each 1 bedroom at The Boulevard is $610.


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

dayooper said:


> The fees for the 2 contracts will double. They will run you over $2000 (you would pay the $409 transfer for both, correct?) The MF’s look correct, though. Each 1 bedroom at The Boulevard is $610.



The seller (who got back to me very quickly) indicated that it's one transfer fee (one deed), but two activation fees. Given the price advantage over a single 9600 point 3BR, this still comes out ahead, and MFs only a bit higher. @Bao Nguyen's point about resale, though, are certainly valid down the road.

OTOH, with zero bids, it could well come back at a lower price 

Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> The seller (who got back to me very quickly) indicated that it's one transfer fee (one deed), but two activation fees. Given the price advantage over a single 9600 point 3BR, this still some out ahead, and MFs only a bit higher. @Bao Nguyen's point about resale, though, are certainly valid down the road.
> 
> Cheers.


two activation fee? $609 x 2 ouch.


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

Yup. But much less than the current price I see for a single 9600 point. Certainly not as good as yours, but still under $1/point, and maybe $2500 more than this one. Of course, this is just today 
Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> Yup. But much less than the current price I see for a single 9600 point. Certainly not as good as yours, but still under $1/point, and maybe $2500 more than this one. Of course, this is just today
> Cheers.


since this is not your first HGVC, why are you so rush?  I don't think it a good deal, correct me if I'm wrong.  You are trying to sell two contracts for two contracts lower MF? but you are paying a lot up front for the two new contracts ? are you buying for points? for me  I don't care about about how many bed rooms  .  I'm using my points in Hawaii.


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

These are just points for Hawai'i as well. I want to sell two contracts with higher $/MF ratio for lower ratio and about the same (10K) points. This has the points and a much lower ratio. This seems a low up-front price for 9600 points, but I agree about not rushing. Just seems better deals may be hard to find overall (initial price and MF ratio).

Sounds close to your very good deal, with just some more ($609) in activation fee...

But it is now over with no bid. I'm an impatient New Yorker, and it was hard to restrain, but I did 


Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 4, 2019)

brp said:


> These are just points for Hawai'i as well. I want to sell two contracts with higher $/MF ratio for lower ratio and about the same (10K) points. This has the points and a much lower ratio. This seems a low up-front price for 9600 points, but I agree about not rushing. Just seems better deals may be hard to find overall (initial price and MF ratio).
> 
> Sounds close to your very good deal, with just some more ($609) in activation fee...
> 
> ...


so you did not bid?  my deal came with 9600 points from 2019. Hopefully my deal close before  December 31th.


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## brp (Sep 4, 2019)

I did not. We don't need any 2019 points, so while that would be nice, it doesn't make as much difference to us, even though we could bank.

Cheers.


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## brp (Sep 5, 2019)

Hey all,

Sorry for spamming my own thread last evening, but the auction was ending and I was looking for advice. I still have a shot at this from the seller. Trying to see why this might be a bad deal:

Pros:

Very low buy-in price on a high-point, low MF package (@Bao Nguyen's unicorn find notwithstanding ) - of course, eventual selling price likely lowe as well.

Got the estoppel, and all current and paid up, with full 2020 points.

Cons:

Two activation fees - but more than offset by buy-in savings
Lowe resale - as mentioned, but offset by lower buy-in
In the worst case (think Apollo catastrophe) we're stuck with two studio weeks in Vegas - willing to gamble on this.

Is there something I'm missing that makes this a bad thing to consider?

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 5, 2019)

As I understand it (Warning I may be a bit behind):


You have two 2 bdrm Flamingos Gold that you are going to sell. 10,000 points total (5000 each)
You wish to buy two 1 bedroom Platinum units at BLVD. 10,300 points total (5150 each)

1) How much are you saving compared to the MF of your two Flamingos?
2) What is the net difference in cost of buying these new units with to net cost of selling Flamingo after broker and if you pay selling costs (worst case)
3) What is your MF/point in each deal?
4) What is your breakeven year to recoup the cost of this transaction?
5) If you waited for another deal to consolidate into one unit similar to the unit you originally wanted how would that compare to this deal?

P.S. LOL. Love the play on words, _"two studio weeks in Vegas - willing to gamble on this."_


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## brp (Sep 5, 2019)

Flamingo: Yes
Boulevard: Two 1BR Plat @ 4800 each (9600 total)

1. Flamingo is about $2100, Buoulevard is about $1261, so savings = $839/year
2. Buy = roughly $6500 + 2x$609+$409 = $8127, Sell might net about $3500 total for both
3. Flamingo = $0.21/point, Boulevard = $0.13/point
4. Breakeven = 5.5 years

This seems reasonable to me.

If we got a straight 9600 for, saqy $9500, the MFs are lower by about $100, so savings = $939/year. But buy-in is up by about $2000 (transfer is covered in this one), so BE = 7 years. So maybe this one makes as much sense, in the end.

Thanks for the reality-check questions 

(Happy to have found a place to throw in gambling )

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 5, 2019)

$839/year is significant and 5 years is good. The biggest difference is that the 1 bdrms will sell for less or than the Blvd. How long do you intend to keep?


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## brp (Sep 5, 2019)

We'll keep 20-25 years, I'd say 

I did try on the straight 9600. Last bid for me was $9412. Was winning until 2 seconds, then outbid at $9512 

Yes, they will sell for less, but we'll get them for less.

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 5, 2019)

BTW...now I understand why you wanted to restructure because we have one Paradise unit at 7k pts at about $1050/year and $.15 MF/point which is much lower than your $2100 MF. Quite a premium for only 3000 more points. 

Lower buy-in was one of the reasons we opted for Paradise vs. Blvd. We also wouldn't mind being stuck in Vegas if the system rules changed. We could rent out the unit for Raider games or conventions if we didn't plan to use because it is near both venues.


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## brp (Sep 5, 2019)

OK, seems done. The two-package deal on eBay ended with no bids at an opening of $6500. I got it for $6250 (probably could have fought harder for $6000, but it seemed not worth the effort). So $0.65/point, plus fees, of course.

Just need thit to pass the monkeys...

Now to sell those Albatross...I mean Flamingos...

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 5, 2019)

Congrats! How did you get it for below the reserve? Did you contact the seller after the auction closed?


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## brp (Sep 5, 2019)

Yup. I'd actually contacted him before it closed to ask about getting estoppel prior to any payment. He got back to me quickly that it would be no problem. Then I decided to wait until the auction ended and contact him again because I figured that I could get it below the eBay asking price that way. And, since it ended with no bids and was now closed in eBay, no violations there.

Basically, I saved the Credit Card fee that they add (something I'm very much OK with to use a CC with these lower-priced transactions).

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 5, 2019)

Smart move! Will take note of other auctions that go unsold.

As a bonus of holding 1 bdrms platinums, if you had to rent you could probably rent them out for MF or a bit of a premium. Harder to do with a 2 bdrm.


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## brp (Sep 5, 2019)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Smart move! Will take note of other auctions that go unsold.
> 
> As a bonus of holding 1 bdrms platinums, if you had to rent you could probably rent them out for MF or a bit of a premium. Harder to do with a 2 bdrm.



Could probably get a premium for Raiders' games if I rented a long weekend to "friends," even though it is a bit far from the venue. Closer than Oaktown.

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 5, 2019)

You could also split the home week i.e. rent the first half for Raider Game and then use the other half.

Might have to tip the housekeepers well during mid-week to clean up after your renters.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 5, 2019)

Congrats whatever that make you happy....


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 5, 2019)

brp said:


> OK, seems done. The two-package deal on eBay ended with no bids at an opening of $6500. I got it for $6250 (probably could have fought harder for $6000, but it seemed not worth the effort). So $0.65/point, plus fees, of course.
> 
> Just need thit to pass the monkeys...
> 
> ...


so how many points did you get? 9,600?


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## brp (Sep 5, 2019)

Yup, 9,600. Structured as  2 x 4800 1BR.

Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Sep 5, 2019)

brp said:


> Yup, 9,600. Structured as  2 x 4800 1BR.
> 
> Cheers.


nice!...I'm thinking rent out for Raider game too... but not sure how advance we know  their  game schedule. I'm sure entire town will sold out .


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## hurnik (Sep 5, 2019)

I was in a similar boat, but ultimately the restructuring would never work out financially, I don't think.

I have a 3400 point (1 BR Gold) at BLVD - $610 MF
I have a 5000 point (2 BR Gold) at BLVD - $845 MF

So combined MF is like $1455 for 8400 points
The "cheapest" 8400 points (for MF) was BLVD at $1070, but $18,000 cost to buy.  I think BE was like 33 years (not counting closing costs and activation fees, and assuming I could sell my two for $2500 total).

The "next" best was like MF at $1,118 at a buy in of $14k (not counting closing/activation).
I think even the 9600 point one (not quite apples/apples) on eBay would still take me close to 21 years to BE.

So I'll just keep 'em


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 5, 2019)

Having the Raiders in town will change the rental dynamic.

@hurnik Although you prob don't enjoy having two units that are lower value, the silver lining is the lack of a good BE option means that what you have is pretty good!

Could you flip the 3400 pt unit only for a 5k pt or more and get a better BE return?


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## brp (Sep 5, 2019)

hurnik said:


> I was in a similar boat, but ultimately the restructuring would never work out financially, I don't think.
> 
> I have a 3400 point (1 BR Gold) at BLVD - $610 MF
> I have a 5000 point (2 BR Gold) at BLVD - $845 MF
> ...



Wow, much lower MFs at BLVD for the 5000 pt. Gold. Knew it was lower, but didn't know it was this much lower.

As to the second part, you can get these points for a muhc lower buy-in. As an example, I know that judikoz has Carigendarroch (likely spelled that wrong, but don't feel like looking it up): 8400 points for $10K, and likely can get it for less. And this has even lower MFs. But it would still definitely be longer than our Flamingo BE as your MF ratio is better than ours.

Cheers.


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## hurnik (Sep 5, 2019)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Having the Raiders in town will change the rental dynamic.
> 
> @hurnik Although you prob don't enjoy having two units that are lower value, the silver lining is the lack of a good BE option means that what you have is pretty good!
> 
> Could you flip the 3400 pt unit only for a 5k pt or more and get a better BE return?



Hmm, I've not checked/considered that.  I'll have to run the numbers and see.
Odds are the 3400 point would have to go for $500 or $1000 at most (but by the time I paid for closing costs, probably close to zero net gain).


----------



## CalGalTraveler (Sep 5, 2019)

@hurnik Perhaps keep your eye open this fall for a 5000 pt unicorn that someone is selling for next to nothing or giving away. You could calculate the highest price you could go and get a decent BE after disposing of the 3400 pt unit. I never thought @brp difference was that high but with 2 units it is significant.


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## emoneybug (Sep 5, 2019)

I would like a few of the 5000pt unicorns    ...I'm wondering if a seller would take $500 plus split closing/transfer costs for a low MF Las Vegas 5000pt HGVC.


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## brp (Oct 3, 2019)

brp said:


> OK, seems done. The two-package deal on eBay ended with no bids at an opening of $6500. I got it for $6250 (probably could have fought harder for $6000, but it seemed not worth the effort). So $0.65/point, plus fees, of course.
> 
> Just need this to pass the monkeys...
> 
> ...



The monkeys have passed on this one (was sent to ROFR on 9/13, got the notification early).

Now I just have to decide if I really want to pay the remaining $6422 via Cashier's Check (and save the $225 in CC fees), or go for the points and added protection 

If I don't sell the Flamingo units, there's always the Raiders in 2020 

Cheers.


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## hurnik (Oct 4, 2019)

brp said:


> The monkeys have passed on this one (was sent to ROFR on 9/13, got the notification early).
> 
> Now I just have to decide if I really want to pay the remaining $6422 via Cashier's Check (and save the $225 in CC fees), or go for the points and added protection
> 
> ...



typically, figure out how many points you'd get (I don't know which credit card you're using) and then use the $225 to calculate the "price per point".

IMO, it *almost* never makes sense to go that route.
UNLESS you're needing it for the SUB (sign up bonus), in which case, it may work out.  (ie: 80,000 UR points from the CIP for $225?  Sure, I'll bite)  50k AA miles for $225? eh, not so much.

Although the $225 seems rather high.  That's like 3.3% or thereabouts?


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## brp (Oct 4, 2019)

hurnik said:


> typically, figure out how many points you'd get (I don't know which credit card you're using) and then use the $225 to calculate the "price per point".
> 
> IMO, it *almost* never makes sense to go that route.
> UNLESS you're needing it for the SUB (sign up bonus), in which case, it may work out.  (ie: 80,000 UR points from the CIP for $225?  Sure, I'll bite)  50k AA miles for $225? eh, not so much.
> ...



Yeah, they're at 3.5%. Definitely high, but they are very up-front about it. We pay most fee-requiring things (estimated taxes, any taxes owed, property tax) with a CC, but that's at 1.9%, and we can make that work. We use Hyatt card and this counts for stays and status.

I did pay the $500 deposit on a CC as I didn't really know these folks. Further research (and some very recent comments on the ROFR thread from a Tugger who has worked with them twice) has decided me on the Cashier's Check route.

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Oct 4, 2019)

@brp congrats on passing ROFR. What company are you using for 3.5%?

Plastiq.com charges 2.5% and they frequently have promotions. If you don't have an account, there is a referral code where you can get 500 Fee Free Dollars (Full Disclosure: I get a referral bonus too). I sent you a PM with the promo code if you are interested.


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## brp (Oct 4, 2019)

This is the timeshare company themselves. They can take cards, but charge the fairly high fee. They clearly state this on the eBay ads, though. In the end, I would have saved $5 with a 2.5% fee (although I guess I would have saved the whole $17.50 with the sign-up promotion ), so not a big deal. I've looked at Plastiq but, since our tax payments are lower than this, and we can't use it to pay our mortgage the way we want (that would be the big win), not all that much use for us.

Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Oct 4, 2019)

brp said:


> This is the timeshare company themselves. They can take cards, but charge the fairly high fee. They clearly state this on the eBay ads, though. In the end, I would have saved $5 with a 2.5% fee (although I guess I would have saved the whole $17.50 with the sign-up promotion ), so not a big deal. I've looked at Plastiq but, since our tax payments are lower than this, and we can't use it to pay our mortgage the way we want (that would be the big win), not all that much use for us.
> 
> Cheers.


I rather pay with credit card, my last ebay deal, fell apart. Much easy for me to call my Amex to revert the charge. I like protection.


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## brp (Oct 4, 2019)

Interestingly, I also asked the same folks about selling my Flamingos. It seems that they are not actually a listing agent, but buy the timeshares from the seller and then sell themselves. Not an upfront-fee sort of thing. Haven't heard of this model. The offer they made for the Flamingo units was not all that attractive, though 

Cheers.


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## Bao Nguyen (Oct 4, 2019)

are you dealing with GC Getaways & Transfer Outlet, LLC??  I'm working with them right now with Elara deal.  They are not listing agent , original owner has to transferred to them, then they can transfer to me.  I'm just wondering these companies like Timeshare exit, paid them upfront and they help you exit Timeshare.


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## brp (Oct 4, 2019)

Bao Nguyen said:


> are you dealing with GC Getaways & Transfer Outlet, LLC??  I'm working with them right now with Elara deal.  They are not listing agent , original owner has to transferred to them, then they can transfer to me.  I'm just wondering these companies like Timeshare exit, paid them upfront and they help you exit Timeshare.



This is The Timeshare Group, LLC. They're not an exit company in that I don't pay them (well, I have to pay them for the units I'm buying from them ). They simply buy the units from me and then sell onntheir own.

Cheers.


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## GT75 (Oct 4, 2019)

brp said:


> This is The Timeshare Group, LLC. They're not an exit company in that I don't pay them (well, I have to pay them for the units I'm buying from them ). They simply buy the units from me and then sell on their own.



That is interesting, are you also going to use them then to unload your Flamingos units?    If so, please report back.


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## brp (Oct 4, 2019)

GT75 said:


> That is interesting, are you also going to use them then to unload your Flamingos units?    If so, please report back.



Well, their offer is lower than I would have expected (probably shouldn't list numbers as I don't want this to look like an ad, although I don't want to sell that that price ), so I don't think I will go with this. OTOH, it does get things resolved pretty quickly.

Cheers.


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## GT75 (Oct 4, 2019)

brp said:


> Well, their offer is lower than I would have expected (probably shouldn't list numbers as I don't want this to look like an ad, although I don't want to sell that that price ), so I don't think I will go with this.



Thanks for the information (and also not listing the price).   I would think that is to be expected if this company is legit.


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## brp (Oct 4, 2019)

GT75 said:


> Thanks for the information (and also not listing the price).   I would think that is to be expected if this company is legit.



I think that they really are. They want to buy from people who just want to get out, and they buy low to cover their operating costs on the sale. Really kinda like the way that the direct timeshare purchase sells high as that is what covers their costs. Since there are certainly people who just want out, there's a reason that, as I was told, they sell 5-6 timeshares a day, and have the bulk of the HGVC listings that I generally see on eBay.

The flip side of this is that a traditional broker has a fee and, after taking this into account, these guys are low, but not ridiculously so.

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Oct 4, 2019)

brp said:


> I think that they really are. They want to buy from people who just want to get out, and they buy low to cover their operating costs on the sale. Really kinda like the way that the direct timeshare purchase sells high as that is what covers their costs. Since there are certainly people who just want out, there's a reason that, as I was told, they sell 5-6 timeshares a day, and have the bulk of the HGVC listings that I generally see on eBay.
> 
> The flip side of this is that a traditional broker has a fee and, after taking this into account, these guys are low, but not ridiculously so.
> 
> Cheers.



I always wondered how they got their inventory. That sounds like a good service that the market needs. Kind of like home flipper.  Sometimes people just want out quickly and legitimately and this provides an fast avenue without worrying about scam buyers and tire kickers. Besides listing oneself on Ebay would not have many reviews, so buyers may be wary and bid lower than normal.

I wonder if you could do the same by messaging other Ebay mega sellers such as Sumday and Discount Timeshares.


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## natarajanv (Oct 4, 2019)

brp said:


> This is The Timeshare Group, LLC. They're not an exit company in that I don't pay them (well, I have to pay them for the units I'm buying from them ). They simply buy the units from me and then sell onntheir own.
> 
> Cheers.


Do they actually transfer the unit to their LLC ( incurring transfer fee + enrollment fee) and then sell it? BTW, did your estoppel list them as the owner?

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk


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## brp (Oct 4, 2019)

natarajanv said:


> Do they actually transfer the unit to their LLC ( incurring transfer fee + enrollment fee) and then sell it? BTW, did your estoppel list them as the owner?



Interesting point. They clearly don't formally transfer as the estoppel listed the real owners, not the LLC. They (the LLC) were authorized to negotiate for and sign for the sellers. I had figured that this was just the arrangement for this deal, but it seems that this is the way they operate. However, without the formal transfer, not sure how they relieve us of the ownership/MF burden prior to their actual sale of the unit.

Cheers.


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## GT75 (Oct 4, 2019)

brp said:


> Interesting point. They clearly don't formally transfer as the estoppel listed the real owners, not the LLC. They (the LLC) were authorized to negotiate for and sign for the sellers. I had figured that this was just the arrangement for this deal, but it seems that this is the way they operate. However, without the formal transfer, not sure how they relieve us of the ownership/MF burden prior to their actual sale of the unit.
> 
> Cheers.



Interesting.    If that is case then I certainly wouldn’t deal with them to sell my TS.  They aren’t buying it then.


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## brp (Oct 4, 2019)

GT75 said:


> Interesting.    If that is case then I certainly wouldn’t deal with them to sell my TS.  They aren’t buying it then.



I'm not really sure what's going on. All review for them I've seen (including something recent on the ROFR thread) are very positive on the buying end. So they are getting inventory from somewhere. And he offered me money up front, so there is some way in which they are taking this from me and selling it on their own.

If I do actually consider their offer, I think I need to call and ask come questions. I do believe they're legit, and it's just that I don't fully understand their model.

From looking at the docs I have, it would appear that, for a cash consideration, we would turn over control of the unit to the LLC to do with as they please. That all sounds good except for the "what if they don't sell it and 2020 MFs become due" question.

Cheers.


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## natarajanv (Oct 5, 2019)

brp said:


> The monkeys have passed on this one (was sent to ROFR on 9/13, got the notification early).
> 
> Now I just have to decide if I really want to pay the remaining $6422 via Cashier's Check (and save the $225 in CC fees), or go for the points and added protection
> 
> ...


Did you get the copy of the waiver or was it just verbal. I heard that hgvc stopped sending it via email/fax and sends by snail mail which takes few extra days.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk


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## brp (Oct 5, 2019)

natarajanv said:


> Did you get the copy of the waiver or was it just verbal. I heard that hgvc stopped sending it via email/fax and sends by snail mail which takes few extra days.



I have a scan of a hand-signed waiver document as part of the doc package I got. It's in the same document as another copy of the estoppel. I had requested one before sending any earnest money and got it then as well.

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Oct 5, 2019)

Please share if you find out how they work. It sounds like they dont change name on the account to avoid fees. They also have some limited power of attorney rights.


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## brp (Oct 5, 2019)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Please share if you find out how they work. It sounds like they dont change name on the account to avoid fees. They also have some limited power of attorney rights.



Power of attorney definitely. He said so directly. But, since there is no name change, we'd likely still be liable for MFs if it turned the new year (or 2/15, really) before sale.

Side question: Is there anything wrong/unethical with listing in more than one place to get extra visibility for a sale, say a broker and Redweek?

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Oct 5, 2019)

With broker why not. You will pay for ads.

I wonder if you could do 2 brokers tho.


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## brp (Oct 8, 2019)

Well, there guys are fast, and the POA that they have really makes things quick. Got the ROFR waiver notice Friday. Dropped a Cashier's Check in the mail Saturday. Today got notice that the deed is signed and recorded, paperwork sent to HGVC. They are estimating 10-14 days.

Cheers.


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## natarajanv (Oct 9, 2019)

brp said:


> Well, there guys are fast, and the POA that they have really makes things quick. Got the ROFR waiver notice Friday. Dropped a Cashier's Check in the mail Saturday. Today got notice that the deed is signed and recorded, paperwork sent to HGVC. They are estimating 10-14 days.
> 
> Cheers.



Wow. That was fast. Did you do all the paperwork electronically? Since the agent acts as a seller with POA, and may be with in house Notary public, they were not waiting on anyone except to receive your cashiers check i guess.... I just read about erecording, its amazing that the whole thing takes only a few minutes to record.


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## brp (Oct 9, 2019)

natarajanv said:


> Wow. That was fast. Did you do all the paperwork electronically? Since the agent acts as a seller with POA, and may be with in house Notary public, they were not waiting on anyone except to receive your cashiers check i guess.... I just read about erecording, its amazing that the whole thing takes only a few minutes to record.



Interestingly, no. Earnest money by CC (so that was electronic). Purchase doc and Cashier's Check by mail. From California to Florida, no less. The recording may well have been electronic given how fast it was. Now I see just how slow HGVC can be, although they were very quick on the ROFR waiver.

Cheers.


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## CalGalTraveler (Oct 9, 2019)

Recording in Las Vegas is electronic and fast. We worked with a closing agency based in Florida for an HGVC Vegas unit and it only took about 46 days end to end with a hurricane closing the Florida office for a week.


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## brp (Oct 22, 2019)

Coming back to wrap this up. The points showed up in our account today. So, from initial offer to points available was 47 total days. Not too bad. Now have 19,600 HGVC points and 5250 bHC points annually. Far more than we can use. Hope those Flamingos move 

Cheers.


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## natarajanv (Oct 22, 2019)

brp said:


> Coming back to wrap this up. The points showed up in our account today. So, from initial offer to points available was 47 total days. Not too bad. Now have 19,600 HGVC points and 5250 bHC points annually. Far more than we can use. Hope those Flamingos move
> 
> Cheers.



Do you have to do anything special (like give your member number ) for all the contracts to show up in a single login, or does it happen automatically based on same owner names on all the deeds?


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## PigsDad (Oct 22, 2019)

natarajanv said:


> Do you have to do anything special (like give your member number ) for all the contracts to show up in a single login, or does it happen automatically based on same owner names on all the deeds?


As I recall, the enrollment form asks for existing member number so the newly-enrolled deed can be associated with your account.

Kurt


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## brp (Oct 22, 2019)

natarajanv said:


> Do you have to do anything special (like give your member number ) for all the contracts to show up in a single login, or does it happen automatically based on same owner names on all the deeds?





PigsDad said:


> As I recall, the enrollment form asks for existing member number so the newly-enrolled deed can be associated with your account.
> 
> Kurt



Yes, I did give the member number up front.

So this is where it got "interesting" (meaning that likely some of the new website "enhancements" worked against me. Went to login using the email and password I've been using for a long time. Was told that there was "no active account associated with this email." Called. Was told that, in fact, this was the case and that the account was associated with mrs. brp's email. Not bloody likely. She lets me deal with this stuff as she actually works at work. I believe she's never logged in. But I conformed the email and it was hers.

So, she said something about "we're not supposed to change the email, but I will do it. You will have to create a new account." Gave her my email, then did a full refresh. Tried "login" again and it popped up a "link account" message." I said yes, it said "you're linked." Then I just did my standard login again, and it went to the same old page as before, just with the additional two allotments of points (under the same contract number) showing up. Added to the regular HGVC point pool starting in 2020.

Actually, pretty seamless despite the errant error message. Not sure she really did anything in the end.

Cheers.


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## natarajanv (Nov 6, 2019)

natarajanv said:


> Do they actually transfer the unit to their LLC ( incurring transfer fee + enrollment fee) and then sell it? BTW, did your estoppel list them as the owner?
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk



I was curious about whether the brokers who are mentioned here buy them cheap and flip, so I checked Clark county recorder website to see about 100+ units registered/transferred to/from one broker who we all know. Is it possible to just register a deed and transfer but not pay the $609 enrollment fee hoping to flip it before the end of the year? The reason I am asking is the estoppel of my BIL shows that the club activation fee is pending for 2019. Have any of you guys seen an estoppel with Activation fee populated? Here it clearly states that it is due. BTW , the unit in question was recorded on August 2019 to just to be resold in October 2019


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## alwysonvac (Nov 11, 2019)

natarajanv said:


> I was curious about whether the brokers who are mentioned here buy them cheap and flip, so I checked Clark county recorder website to see about 100+ units registered/transferred to/from one broker who we all know. *Is it possible to just register a deed and transfer but not pay the $609 enrollment fee hoping to flip it before the end of the year? *The reason I am asking is the estoppel of my BIL shows that the club activation fee is pending for 2019. Have any of you guys seen an estoppel with Activation fee populated? Here it clearly states that it is due. BTW , the unit in question was recorded on August 2019 to just to be resold in October 2019
> 
> View attachment 14912



Interesting... I’ve never seen one but I guess it’s possible with a flip within months. Please let us know how it works out. I’m assuming HGVC may still want their activation fee each time ownership changes hands. 

By the way, which last name are you finding with 100+ unit changing hands in Nevada?


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## natarajanv (Nov 12, 2019)

alwysonvac said:


> Interesting... I’ve never seen one but I guess it’s possible with a flip within months. Please let us know how it works out. I’m assuming HGVC may still want their activation fee each time ownership changes hands.
> 
> By the way, which last name are you finding with 100+ unit changing hands in Nevada?




https://recorder.co.clark.nv.us/recorderecommerce/

nock


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## valuemkt (Nov 24, 2019)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Great price. What are the MF on that unit? Is that a 3 bdrm or 2 bdrm?


Pretty interesting .. we just stayed at Elara .. went to the mandatory presentation .. the offer was 8400 points for 60 grand .. of course we didnt take it ..


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## brp (Aug 20, 2020)

brp said:


> Yup, 9,600. Structured as  2 x 4800 1BR.
> 
> Cheers.



So, I came back to this after all this time as I got some interesting info. As I mentioned, this is structured as 2 x 4800 Pt. 1BR Platinum in one contract. Because of the odd arrangement, I got a very good price since selling would be challenging.

I was talking with Judi Kozlowski about some other things and mentioned this contract. She called me back and said that it seems that contracts *can*, in fact, be split with a call as she had seen one. No need to do it now, but interesting if true.

Cheers.


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## brp (Oct 13, 2020)

Coming back again with more info. Wanted to wait until all the dust had settled.

The two Flamingos have finally flown the coop!

We decided to lower one to $1000 rather than pay MFs for another year. I had considered the 2020 MFs as sunk cost.

Almost immediately got a bit. It came to the broker through MLS. The net result was $400 for our broker, $400 for other broker, $200 for HGVC (not sure why). Net to us was $0. However, full reimbursement of the $1087 2020 MFs. I considered that a good deal and went for it. Started the process. Then decided to lower the second one to $1000. Got a hit like 2 days later. Same source, same deal. Grabbed it.

The first one was super-smooth. Offer August 3. Papers came signed by buyer, We turned around bu Aug. 4. ROFR waiver August 5. Final docs sent to HGVC by August 12. Transferred out August 19.

Second was less smooth. This all started about August 6 or so, Finally closed out October 11 (truly gone from the account). Buyers kept delaying (for no reason) getting final docs done. Broker called with a "we're going to void the deal" message. They gave her a credit card that day 

Check for the MFs is on the way.

So, now down to 5250 W. 57th,
9600 (2x4800) Platinum at Boulevard.

Awaiting ROFR on very cheap 5000 pt. Gold at Boulevard,

Cheers.


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## bogey21 (Oct 13, 2020)

brp said:


> The two Flamingos have finally flown the coop!
> 
> We decided to lower one to $1000 rather than pay MFs for another year. I had considered the 2020 MFs as sunk cost.
> 
> Almost immediately got a bit. It came to the broker through MLS. The net result was $400 for our broker, $400 for other broker, $200 for HGVC (not sure why). Net to us was $0. However, full reimbursement of the $1087 2020 MFs. I considered that a good deal and went for it. Started the process.



I continue to be amazed  how (realistically) we are willing to accept $0 as the value of what we own...

George


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## brp (Oct 13, 2020)

bogey21 said:


> I continue to be amazed  how (realistically) we are willing to accept $0 as the value of what we own...
> 
> George



Also realistically I could have gotten more if I had been willing to wait, or used a different venue. After all, it did sell for $1000, which is more than similar listings on eBay. But working with a solid broker was worth it to me. With MFs over $1000/year, selling now was better than a few months from now.. And it did include the unexpected $1000 in MF reimbursement. I was hesitant until I saw that, and then it was worth it. I really did get $1000 for it.

HGVC ain't Disney. It goes down in value 

Cheers.


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## DazedandConfused (Oct 13, 2020)

brp said:


> HGVC ain't Disney. It goes down in value



Ouch, so true. But combining the two is "Dollar cost averaging"


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## natarajanv (Oct 13, 2020)

deleted


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## brp (Oct 13, 2020)

natarajanv said:


> So did you list it through a Broker?



Yup. Broker and Redweek (and if Redweek sold, I was going to pay broker due commission). Nothing on Redweek, but yes with broker.

Cheers.


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## letsgobobby (Oct 13, 2020)

brp said:


> HGVC ain't Disney. It goes down in value
> 
> Cheers.


Prices today aren't typical. I've followed certain HGVC resales for a decade and prices had been stable for most of that time. This year they fell another third or more presumably because of COVID and the financial pressures and travel disruptions associated with it. A true buyer's market, kind of the opposite of what's happened in residential real estate, where prices are soaring in most locations leading to a true seller's market.


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## MPrince (Oct 13, 2020)

bogey21 said:


> I continue to be amazed  how (realistically) we are willing to accept $0 as the value of what we own...
> 
> George



To me, the value is in using the timeshare, not in selling it.


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## brp (Oct 13, 2020)

MPrince said:


> To me, the value is in using the timeshare, not in selling it.



Unless one has something non-ideal in terms of MFs paid for a given amount of usage. Then selling and buying something different is the better long-term strategy.

Cheers.


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## bogey21 (Oct 13, 2020)

MPrince said:


> To me, the value is in using the timeshare, not in selling it.


I don't dispute with what you say.   But if values continue their downward sprial, you should allocate a portion of your anticipated loss when selling into your annual vacation cost.

George


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## brp (Oct 13, 2020)

bogey21 said:


> I don't dispute with what you say.   But if values continue their downward sprial, you should allocate a portion of your anticipated loss when selling into your annual vacation cost.
> 
> George



Maybe not. I consider 100% of it lost as soon as I buy. I count on zero resale. Complete sunk cost in the calculations. MFs are the ongoing kicker.

Cheers.


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## MPrince (Oct 13, 2020)

bogey21 said:


> I don't dispute with what you say.   But if values continue their downward sprial, you should allocate a portion of your anticipated loss when selling into your annual vacation cost.
> 
> George



I treat timeshare purchases as a sunk cost. They sit on my balance sheet as an asset, but any loss upon future disposition is a non-cash write-off. The value I get from that sunk cost acquisition is in using the timeshare, not in selling it at some future point in time. MFs I pay are part of my annual vacation budget. I'm retired, with a hefty annual vacation budget.

One of my hobbies is photography. When I buy  a camera, I don't care what I might be able to sell it for when I decide to replace it. The value of the camera is in using it. Same with timeshares.

That's how I look at it, you might look at it differently, and that's fine.


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## bogey21 (Oct 13, 2020)

brp said:


> Maybe not. I consider 100% of it lost as soon as I buy. I count on zero resale. Complete sunk cost in the calculations. MFs are the ongoing kicker.



Although I understand where you are coming from, purchase directly from a Developer is one heck of a price to pay for the option of paying annual MFs...

George


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## brp (Oct 14, 2020)

bogey21 said:


> Although I understand where you are coming from, purchase directly from a Developer is one heck of a price to pay for the option of paying annual MFs...
> 
> George



Who said anything about buying direct from the Developer? This is TUG. Friends don't let friends do that 

Cheers.


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## bogey21 (Oct 14, 2020)

brp said:


> Who said anything about buying direct from the Developer? This is TUG. Friends don't let friends do that



My comment was purposely at the extreme.  My point is that Developer or Resale the price one pays is the cost of an Option to use the Systerm or Resort and should be amortized into their annual cost calculation.  You have taken an even more realistic approach; that is mentally writing off the total cost up front...

George


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## brp (Dec 15, 2020)

OK, finally coming back to this as things are wrapped (for now )

In the end, we still have our W. 57th 5250 point studio

Sold: Two Flamingo Gold 5000 for net $0 in actual payment (minus broker fees), but about $1050 each in  reimbursement for 2020 MFs cash in the bank.

Bought: Boulevard 9600 points as 2 1BD 4800 Platinum for $6250 ($0.65/point)
Bought: Boulevard 5000 point Gold 2BD for $1075 ($0,22/point). Figured that the very low price made up for the Gold vs. Platinum for a number of years to come.

Annually we have

5250 bHC
14,600 HGVC

For 2021 it seems that the 5000 point Gold had free saved points, so there's:

2300ish bHC (after making 2 reservations
35,000ish HGVC (just about a literal shit ton)

We're good for now 

Cheers.


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