# safety of the ocean?



## Zac495 (May 31, 2009)

If you've read in the lounge, you know my cousin drowned a few days ago in a Florida riptide. Devastating.

My question is - how safe is the ocean in Hawaii? I'm now terrified of the ocean. Can my 14 year old swim with my husband there? Can I stand on the shore without risk?

 My mother reports:

A friend said this happened to friends of theirs out on long island.   They were STANDING (several young men) in the water, their wives could SEE them from the shore, "Suddenly the ground disappeared from under them..."  One of the men was swept away in the undertow, and drowned.   This is very close to what one of the people with Ben reported afterward.


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## travelbug (May 31, 2009)

I hope you can enjoy the wonderful ocean waters of Hawaii in spite of the tragedy of your cousin's accident.  

You can feel very safe in Hawaii if you stay on the beaches with lifeguards in attendance, observe the warning flags that are erected on all the beaches if their are strong currents and use common sense.  The lifeguards are very attentive!

Common sense - in January on Kauai there was a 30 foot surf for a couple of days.  The fire department had to rescue a 50 some year old man in that surf because he thought he was on a safe beach with a reef (Anninni Beach).  Dumb.

I have seen mothers with young children allow their kids to play in the water on a beach with the flags up.  The mother was 20 yards away.

I have watched people turn their back to the ocean and get overwhelmed with the big waves.  Stories abound of tourists climbing the rocks to get a better view and a rogue wave washes them out to sea.  On Kauai there is a popular tourist site called Queen's Bath.  Consistently people are killed there because of rogue waves.  The locals beg people not to go there but the guidebooks keep writing it up.

That is my rant on ocean safety.  I spend alot of time in the water in Hawaii and love every minute of it.  There is nothing to beat the ocean beaches in the islands.  And you can be very safe doing it.

Marilyn


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## Werner (May 31, 2009)

Ellen, the simple answer to your question is that Hawaiian beaches can be dangerous.  Hawaii is a bunch of 20,000 to 30,000 ft mountains rising from the ocean floor 2,500 miles from anywhere, allowing unimpeded wave action right to the shoreline.  There is no continental shelf and few reefs to absorb their power as they approach the shore.  

That said, "travelbug" is right.  You can swim safely at beaches with lifeguards on duty.  Swim right in front of them.  The fact that they are there and the beach is "open" means that it is safe within the swim area.  Swimmers can get in trouble even at lifeguarded beachs by getting too adventurous.  

The local weather does not necessarily determine whether a beach is going to be safe.  The same beach can change from a duck pond to a swirling cauldron with changes in sea conditions and all on beautiful sunny days.  We were at Ke'e Beach in early March.  Big breakers coming over the outer reef created a wild scene of sideways-flowing water (both directions), whirlpools, even rapids within the lagoon.  Lifeguards were on duty but the beach was clearly closed (but of course a few tourists had to poke around the rocks at the water's edge).   A few days later Ke'e was calm and serene.  

Get the "..... Revealed" books for the island(s) you are going to.  They have good descriptions of the beaches.


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## teepeeca (May 31, 2009)

Aside from the "pm" I sent to you, when you go to the beach (WITH lifeguards), ask the lifeguard about currents, waves, thing to watch-out for, etc.

They are "very happy" to answer all of your questions---they want everybody to be safe, and to enjoy what the beach/ocean has to offer.

Tony


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## ricoba (May 31, 2009)

Ellen, the beach at HHV is very calm and protected by a reef.  I don't know about the other place you will be.  As well right next door to HHV is Ala Moana Park and they also have a very safe swimming area surrounded by rocks, with a small outlet to let the tide in and out.  

But as the saying goes, "never turn your back on the ocean"

Having said this though, I can't imagine going to Hawaii and not swimming in the ocean.


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## DeniseM (May 31, 2009)

The Marriott, where you are staying on Kauai, is on a bay, not directly on the ocean, so it's very sheltered.






Another very sheltered location on Kauai, with 2 rock enclosed areas and life guards, is Lydgate Park.


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## ricoba (May 31, 2009)

The bottom photo is similar to the sheltered swimming area at Ala Moana Park.  While there is an open beach area, it's nice to have the keiki beach area for those who are uncomfortable in the ocean.

Another option on Oahu would be to drive out to Ko Olina and swim in the sheltered lagoons.  But you have to go really early to get parking.


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## ownsmany (May 31, 2009)

Ellen
so sad  I didn't hear about your cousin.

As others said, it can be dangerous.  Just do as they recommended.

Thoughts and prayers for your family.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (May 31, 2009)

Ellen - if you're going to be staying at the Marriot Kauai Beach Club in Lihu'e, you shouldn't have any worries.  Kalapaki Beach is very protected, as Denise's photo indicates.


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## thinze3 (May 31, 2009)

I agree. The water was soo lame at KBC in summer 2007 that it almost seemed stagnant to me. (I wouldn't expect this to be the norm.) As Werner stated, the wide openess of the sea brings a few sporatic swells, which to me are part of the beauty of Hawaii. Use common sense on Oahu and you'll be fine.

P.S. - We'll be at Ko Olina with its protected lagoons while you guys are at the Hilton.
If you want to swim in safety come visit us.


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## kelela92 (Jun 1, 2009)

I'm sorry to hear about your cousin. I have to say, if your husband is a strong swimmer then your daughter should be okay, he just needs to pay attention to everything around him. 

I have two incidents I want to talk about. The first, was much more recent. I was on Maui at a beach, it didn't seem strong. I typically would swim with my cousin, who lives on Oahu, but since I was on Maui, I was on my own. There were a few times that I got slammed by waves that were much larger than the others and on top of one another. Here's an example. I was about 15 feet out. At one point, the water would be to my mid-thigh (I'm about 5'1"). But when those big waves hit, even me jumping up, I still couldn't clear them. And I would have to go under and then tread water. I was still only 15 feet out. Things like that (and undertow of course) is what you need to look out for. I also didn't realize there were rocks under the water at one point on-shore, and so when I tried to go in, the waves were breaking into one another from the sides. Made getting in much harder than it should've been. I'd chalk all this up to me not know the beach at all. But since there were kids in there, I figured I would be fine. I kinda realize I don't want to swim alone anymore. 

My other story is at a lifeguarded beach. I was there with my cousin and friend. I hit and undertow, tried to swim out of it, and was getting pummeled by a whole bunch of waves. My cousin looked at me, asked me if I was okay. I was going to be the "hero" and say no, but I knew I was in trouble. She helped me get in. At first, I was very embarrassed, but then seeing our friend drag someone out, and the two lifeguards taking people in too...obviously, it was just something that "hit" all of a sudden. 

So, if you're afraid, definitely go to a lifeguarded beach. I would suggest talking to the lifeguards, let them know how strong of a swimmer you, your DD, and DH are, and lastly, ask them where to swim, what to look out for, etc. Then sit yourself down in front of the tower. 

I believe any ocean can be dangerous. I love swimming, but know now, swimming alone, even if Dh is slightly watching me, doesn't mean crap if I start to get pulled under. I know he cant save me, so I've realized, I shouldn't swim alone anymore, unless there's a lifeguard present. 

Good luck. Just be smart, and you guys should all be fine.


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## Zac495 (Jun 1, 2009)

Thanks everyone! I am copying all of your posts and we will be very, very careful. I wonder if Florida is more dangerous than Hawaii...


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## KauaiMark (Jun 1, 2009)

*Play it safe...*

if noone else is in the water, then there is probably a reason. 

My brother drowned on a beach just south of Santa Cruz. He was 48.

My son ALMOST drowned at Polihale in Kauai two years ago. He and another man got caught in a riptide at the same time.

My son made it out, the other guy didn't. My son is nervous even around out swimming pool in the backyard


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## ricoba (Jun 1, 2009)

Zac495 said:


> Thanks everyone! I am copying all of your posts and we will be very, very careful. I wonder if Florida is more dangerous than Hawaii...




I don't know about Florida, but the beach at HHV is much calmer than the beaches here in SoCal.


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## california-bighorn (Jun 2, 2009)

I've been reading this since yesterday and although excellent advise has been given, I didn't read another piece of advice that may help someone.  If you get caught in a riptide, the normal reaction is to try to swim back to shore against the current that is sucking you out.  DON'T swim against the rip.  Either swim parallel to the current until you are out of it or just go with flow and signal for help.  In salt water you are much more buoyant and you can float.  Just don't panic and fight it and get exhausted. 
A few years ago I got caught in a very strong rip with my son who was 12 at the time.  We started to try to swim back toward shore, then I decided it was far to strong to fight so we just allowed the current to take us out.  My wife who was on shore, saw what was happening. I gave her the divers signal we were in trouble and she notified a nearby surfer who grabbed his board and paddled out to us.  By the time he got there we were pretty much out of the rip, but my son was tired so he got a ride back in on the board.  By that time I was able to swim back at a different angle since we were out of the rip.
I know it sounds a lot easier to say not to panic, but it does work.
Also, if you get sweep off of a rocky area and the waves are breaking against big rocks, it may be better to tread water and wait for help instead of trying to exit and getting beat against the rocks and maybe being knocked unconscious.
Anytime exiting the ocean with any kind of wave action, watch the sets of waves and the patterns so you can pick the best time and exit at the safest moment.
Play safe!!!!


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## Jim Bryan (Jun 2, 2009)

Zac495 said:


> Thanks everyone! I am copying all of your posts and we will be very, very careful. I wonder if Florida is more dangerous than Hawaii...



Growing up in Florida going to the beaches, I'd have to say it can be dangerous at times. My feeling is you should never go into the water by yourself. When I was a Lifeguard the swimmers used to think I was mean, but they never got into trouble. Be safe or be sorry.

Very sorry to hear about your cousin. Sad time for you and your family.


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## Liz Wolf-Spada (Jun 2, 2009)

What is the "divers signal"? I had a problem at Popui in a beach by a hotel with a lifeguard. Very shallow, but the undertow made it hard to stand up. I got out. It scared me. We will be in Hawaii and unfortunately, my DH doesn't swim and so I will be swimming alone. I try to stay close to shore. Yes, California ocean is rougher, but I've never been as scared as that time in Hawaii. I think California has big waves, but less dangerous currents (usually).
Liz


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## Henry M. (Jun 2, 2009)

The diver's flag just means there are divers somewhere nearby. There's a law in Hawaii that if you are diving you have to have a diver's flag with you.

I have found the waters around Kauai to be very treacherous. You can go out a few yards and it can be difficult to swim back to shore even if there are no big waves around. I've been scared a time or two in the Poipu are, near the Sheraton and the Marriott Waiohai. I also have friends that have gotten in trouble near Polihale (?) beach. It is not so much large waves, but rather rough currents that you can't just see that scare me the most. 

At WKORV and the area near Black Rock I find the ocean much more docile although you still need to know what you are doing. This is especially true if you swim out to the end of Black Rock. Sometimes there's a current there that can be dealt with relatively easily but could cause someone without experience to panic.

On the other hand, with proper respect, the ocean is great. There can be more danger driving down a busy highway than swimming with the proper care.


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## dmbrand (Jun 2, 2009)

What a great thread.  We leave Saturday for Oahu/Big Island, and I am devouring all this advice.  Looks like caution will rule the day for us.


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## california-bighorn (Jun 2, 2009)

*Diver in trouble signal*

When experiencing difficulty at the surface the signal for help is simply waving an arm back and forth above your head.  The trouble is a non-diver may think you are waving "hello" to them.  The signal for "OK" at the surface is to touch the top of your head with one arm making a shape similar to an "O" for OK.  BTW, if you ever watch divers stride off or roll over the side of a boat, they will make the OK signal to notify the crew they're OK after entry into the water.


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## hibbeln (Jun 2, 2009)

Get the Revealed books for the islands you plan to go to and read the advice they have on any beach before you enter.  Many are very pretty, but you just simply can't swim there.  Period.  This is ESPECIALLY so during the winter months (that's why we only go during the summer).

You are already safer than most, Ellen, because you're scared and respectful of the ocean!  The water around Hawaii is very, very deep and those waves have been travelling for thousands of miles when they hit the shore.

We saw 3 small children nearly killed on Maui at Big Beach (they were playing at the waters edge) 2 summers ago.  If it hadn't been for some fast-acting, brave locals (and literally the hand of God because I was sure those kids were dead) they wouldn't be alive today.  They were literally at our feet but there was NOTHING we could do to help them.  The locals could have been killed as they tried to save them.

Be smart.  Be cautious.  My kids have been swimming and snorkelling on Hawaii since the youngest was 3.  We've never had a problem (and I don't think we've ever swam at a beach with a lifeguard....there aren't many in Hawaii!) but we decide whether to go in or not by using our brains.


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## jeg (Jun 2, 2009)

Stop at Snorkel Bob's and ask where it's safe for swimming for that particular time of year/day. They have great advice on water conditions and beaches, as they rent snorkel and dive gear.


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## Zac495 (Jun 2, 2009)

KauaiMark said:


> if noone else is in the water, then there is probably a reason.
> 
> My brother drowned on a beach just south of Santa Cruz. He was 48.
> 
> ...



I am so sorry about your brother. Thank goodness your son is okay. Good advice is continuing and is so appreciated.


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## NJDave (Jun 9, 2009)

thinze3 said:


> P.S. - We'll be at Ko Olina with its protected lagoons while you guys are at the Hilton.
> If you want to swim in safety come visit us.



We'll be at Ko Olina the same week.


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## daventrina (Jun 14, 2009)

The ocean in Hawaii can be like a lake one minute and raging like a monster a little while later. Best to visit on the early am when the winds are down. Check the tides and currents. Ask a local... Go where there are others (we don't follow that rule a lot - but have an hours air and a back up plan - or two depending on the site). The worst  current we have been was at Hanauma Bay coming back in the slot. Used 300 lb of our 500 lb reserve getting back to the beach.

 Always keep an eye on the current, know how to get out of a rip current (it is not intuitive to swim down the beach when the current is pulling you off shore) and how to deal with the longshore current. If you can't swim stay out. If it bothers you wear a wet suit of vest - provides both warmth and buoyancy. Never turn you back on the ocean, always pay attention to her, and NEVER ignore her, or she will bite you...

Watch out for Kauai's north shore. Currents can be bad when all seems well on the surface or near shore. 

Be careful and respectful of the sea and you will most likely have a good time.


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