# Bay Club vs. Waikoloa Beach Resort



## ontilt (Apr 12, 2015)

Hi,

First time post from a newbie after reading through the wealth of all the information folks have posted here -- first and foremost, thank you!!

I'm considering a purchase at Waikoloa Beach Resort and potentially Bay Club.  The purchase and maintenance at BC seem significantly lower than WBR.  The only concern I have is around "true" ownership.  As WBR is an HGVC listed property whereas Bay Club is managed by Hilton.  Should I care about this?  

The info I've gotten is that the points are all the same and the resorts are largely interchangeable in the area.  Should I be concerned about the any of the above or other caveats, or should I be shopping purely for points and MF?

We're already sold on the resort area, it's more a matter of optimizing on price and a home resort.  Any feedback or advice would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Harold


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## presley (Apr 12, 2015)

You can search Bay Club in the search button on this page and find many threads discussing this.  The general consensus from what I've seen is that Bay Club is much less expensive to buy (you can even buy it for a couple hundred dollars and then convert it to HGVC), has larger rooms and lower MFs. 

Waikoloa Beach Resort will allow you to use the Hilton Hotel pools for free, but you can buy a day pass if you are staying at Bay Club.

I haven't stayed in either one. I did stay in King's Land (loved it), but actually saw no particular difference between Bay Club and Waikoloa when passing them many times in the parking lot. Bay Club seemed to have a very boring pool area, but if I wanted a pool day, I'd just buy a day pass for the hotel and spend the day there. I'd be happy with either of those resorts.


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## SmithOp (Apr 12, 2015)

The thing about owning Bay Club is you lose the ability to borrow points and pay later, in order to deposit BC points into HGVC account you have to pay maintenance fees.  The 8400 point 2br villa is huge and the best point/mf ratio at BC.  

If you can afford the buy in, Kingsland have some of the best point/mf ratios.


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## Jason245 (Apr 12, 2015)

SmithOp said:


> The thing about owning Bay Club is you lose the ability to borrow points and pay later, in order to deposit BC points into HGVC account you have to pay maintenance fees.  The 8400 point 2br villa is huge and the best point/mf ratio at BC.
> 
> If you can afford the buy in, Kingsland have some of the best point/mf ratios.
> 
> ...



Bay club is investigating eliminating the MF payment to borrow requirement. No idea what happened with that as I am waiting for the Meeting minutes.


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## ontilt (Apr 12, 2015)

presley said:


> You can search Bay Club in the search button on this page and find many threads discussing this.  The general consensus from what I've seen is that Bay Club is much less expensive to buy (you can even buy it for a couple hundred dollars and then convert it to HGVC), has larger rooms and lower MFs.
> 
> Waikoloa Beach Resort will allow you to use the Hilton Hotel pools for free, but you can buy a day pass if you are staying at Bay Club.



I haven't seen anything for a few hundred at Bay Club, but good to know.  The day pass runs $150 for 3 days and with 2 younger children, that's basically a MF bump annually for me.  I've read that at Waikoloa Beach Resort you can use the Kings' Land pool as well as Hilton, so those are nice bonuses IMO.


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## ontilt (Apr 12, 2015)

SmithOp said:


> If you can afford the buy in, Kingsland have some of the best point/mf ratios.



Would love to buy into Kings' Land, but it's a bit higher than I wanted to go, and I'm not convinced of the premium.


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## Jason245 (Apr 12, 2015)

ontilt said:


> I haven't seen anything for a few hundred at Bay Club, but good to know.  The day pass runs $150 for 3 days and with 2 younger children, that's basically a MF bump annually for me.  I've read that at Waikoloa Beach Resort you can use the Kings' Land pool as well as Hilton, so those are nice bonuses IMO.



On ebay I have bought 1BR units for next to nothing.


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## dsmrp (Apr 13, 2015)

I'm in the process of buying at Bay Club, but my circumstances are different than yours Ontilt.  Our kids are grown, no grandkids in sight for quite awhile ... so a big resort pool is not a priority for us.  Plus when we go to Hawaii or any good beach area, we go to the beach, not a swimming pool.  I grew up in Hawaii and we had to drive to the beach. 

Because Bay Club is a Hilton affiliate, I'll be paying about $715 to join HGVC
($399 joining fee + $315 other fees), since club membership does not transfer to resale owners. I think there are some membership fees even if buying at a Hilton property, but don't know what they are.  Joining HGVC is optional for Bay Club owners.

HGVC is an internal trading program.  Hilton can always change their membership and exchange rules. Bay Club HOAs could opt out of Hilton managing the place (believe they have a yearly renewable contract). But I think-hope Bay Club will remain an affiliate for quite a while.

We have 2 timeshares for which we paid a higher purchase price.  So we preferred the lower buy-in price for Bay Club, as we expect the resale value of most timeshares to approach zero.

If we didn't have timeshares already, I would've bought a Bay Club 2bdrm/2.5 bath villa unit.  But buy a timeshare for your own values and use patterns.


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## SmithOp (Apr 13, 2015)

ontilt said:


> Would love to buy into Kings' Land, but it's a bit higher than I wanted to go, and I'm not convinced of the premium.




Nice to own higher points to use elsewhere, not so good booking as home units. Its an easy trade in RCI for the time being, I got a separate account and picked up 2 consecutive May 2016 weeks from one deposit. I can get 2-3 weeks in studio/1br by point stretching my KL points in HGVC. 

I owned a Bay Club 1br but got rid of it.


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## 1Kflyerguy (Apr 13, 2015)

ontilt said:


> I haven't seen anything for a few hundred at Bay Club, but good to know.  The day pass runs $150 for 3 days and with 2 younger children, that's basically a MF bump annually for me.  I've read that at Waikoloa Beach Resort you can use the Kings' Land pool as well as Hilton, so those are nice bonuses IMO.



Yes, while I don't own at Bay Club i have considered buying there several times.  I think it works best if your mostly interested in Golf or beaches versing spending lots of pool time... The pools at Bay Club and Kohala Suites are nice but nothing special and would get boring very quick for young kids..


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## brp (Apr 13, 2015)

1Kflyerguy said:


> Yes, while I don't own at Bay Club i have considered buying there several times.  I think it works best if your mostly interested in Golf or beaches versing spending lots of pool time... The pools at Bay Club and Kohala Suites are nice but nothing special and would get boring very quick for young kids..



I agree. We like the pool at Bay Club for this very reason - very few kids. We do stuff in the early morning through early afternoon on several days, and then spend the later afternoon at the Bay Club pool reading, chilling and enjoying the Happy Hour 

But it's definitely not a kid kinda place.

Cheers.


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## ontilt (Apr 14, 2015)

dsmrp said:


> I'm in the process of buying at Bay Club, but my circumstances are different than yours Ontilt.  Our kids are grown, no grandkids in sight for quite awhile ... so a big resort pool is not a priority for us.  Plus when we go to Hawaii or any good beach area, we go to the beach, not a swimming pool.  I grew up in Hawaii and we had to drive to the beach.



Thanks for the feedback.  We prefer the beach too and A-bay is right there, but do like the option -- I guess that's what the day passes are for anyway.  That said, I think they're pretty happy with water in general



dsmrp said:


> Bay Club HOAs could opt out of Hilton managing the place (believe they have a yearly renewable contract). But I think-hope Bay Club will remain an affiliate for quite a while.



That's another consideration as well, what are your thoughts if the opt out occurs?  I suppose worst case, the Bay Club is still there as a consistent option and could be used for other exchanges.  

Thanks,
Harold


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## Talent312 (Apr 14, 2015)

I've stayed at Bay Club and can say that it is a fine place - rooms are quite large. As nice as the units are, it's more of a base for exploring the island than a stay-on-campus kind'a place. The front-office folk quite helpful. HGVC runs it like an adopted child - as if it was one of their own.

It's been a HGVC affiliate for 18 years. In theory, BC could change managers, but even so, owners would be allowed to continue their HGVC membership -- as happened in at Shell Island, a SW Florida resort in 2009 (IIRC).
.


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## topdog (Apr 14, 2015)

*Nice resort*

We stayed at Bay Club last year and thought it was great.  It is thoroughly integrated with Waikoloa Beach Resort operations.  It is a separate resort only in a formal legal sense.  

Bay Club units are bigger.  Waikoloa units allow free access to Hotel pools.  We enjoyed walking around the hotel complex, but would not have bought a day pass to use the pools.  With kids it would be a different story.

Our Bay Club unit had a great view of the golf course, which was nice to play.  We went to beautiful beaches, visited a coffee plantation, saw other resorts, enjoyed great restaurants, had a happy trip!  We would like to go back in a couple of years.


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## brp (Apr 14, 2015)

I should add that we're really big fans of the Bay Club. We've been there maybe 3 times now, and we just bought some Flamingo points (for the lower MF) with the almost-sole purpose of staying at Bay Club (some Vegas trips as well).

We were there in February and have booked another trip for October. As mentioned, it is a great base for activities as well as a nice place to just hang and chill in the afternoon. Nearby restaurants (walking distance) are quite nice.

Cheers.


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## ontilt (Apr 14, 2015)

dsmrp said:


> I'm in the process of buying at Bay Club, but my circumstances are different than yours Ontilt.




We're putting a bid in.  The broker has come back with standard closing costs, transfer fee, HGVC affiliate conversion, and a one-time HGVC Club Activation Fee.  The latter is $500 and something that I have not seen mentioned in other transactions.  Is this something others have seen with a BC transaction?

Forget it -- found the info:  http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=222573


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## dsmrp (Apr 14, 2015)

Congrats. If you're getting a non-villa 2bdrm, make sure you  understand  the  difference  in floor  plans. Villas are type E or F, and non-villas are A or B.  B's are smaller than A's, and   2nd bdrm only has 1 bed.


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## 1Kflyerguy (Apr 15, 2015)

dsmrp said:


> Congrats. If you're getting a non-villa 2bdrm, make sure you  understand  the  difference  in floor  plans. Villas are type E or F, and non-villas are A or B.  B's are smaller than A's, and   2nd bdrm only has 1 bed.



Do the stand alone Villa's have two master bedrooms or do they have two beds in the second bedroom? 

we would like to travel with a second couple, so two master bedrooms would be preferable..


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## dsmrp (Apr 15, 2015)

1Kflyerguy said:


> Do the stand alone Villa's have two master bedrooms or do they have two beds in the second bedroom?
> 
> we would like to travel with a second couple, so two master bedrooms would be preferable..



I've actually never stayed at Bay Club ; just going by the floor plans I've seen at this site, and a youtube video or two:

http://www.bayclubresaleshawaii.com/Floor_Plans/page_1796691.html

The villas in platinum season take more points tho', 8400 I think.  The non-villa 2 bdrms, platinum, are 7000.


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## mjack47 (Apr 16, 2015)

I am in the middle of closing a 2 bdrm at the Bay Club. Yes the $500 activation fee is now standard for the Bay Club. This is a recent change.  I was also concerned that the bay Club is not Hilton developed. I went so far as to write the chairman of the board at the club. I answered in a lengthly and pleasant letter.  He assured me that while nothing is guaranteed he is confident in a long term management deal with HGVC.  He notes over 60% of Club owners are HGVC club members.  There also are several board members that are board members as well as a HGVC VP>


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## ontilt (Apr 18, 2015)

dsmrp said:


> Congrats. If you're getting a non-villa 2bdrm, make sure you  understand  the  difference  in floor  plans. Villas are type E or F, and non-villas are A or B.  B's are smaller than A's, and   2nd bdrm only has 1 bed.



Did your contract specify the floor plan or just that it was a 2/2 with associated points?


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## dsmrp (Apr 18, 2015)

ontilt said:


> Did your contract specify the floor plan or just that it was a 2/2 with associated points?



Yes my agent, Sam Rodruguez,  included the 'A' plan and the associated points in the purchase contract. But I was pretty specific on the  plan type I wanted. He said he could tell the type from unit number in the deed. There's a map image online if you googled bay club waikoloa map. It shows the configuration  of the unit floor  plans in each bldg. Actually pretty repetitive layouts between bldgs. I think the 'A' unit numbers end in 13, 14 or 15, -but that's just my theory . ..


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