# Anyone using fractionals to do wintering in warmer climes?



## caribbeansun (Mar 23, 2008)

Just curious if others are looking at fractionals as a way to do extended periods away from the snow and cold?

There's been a fair bit of chatter about doing this with timeshare weeks but that just seems like more work than it's worth and of course it's unlikely that the value will be retained as well although the jury is still out on that.

Fractionals have the benefit of typically 4-5 week blocks of time in one unit - of course the downside is that you probably have additional time that will go to waste.

Anyway, thought this might be an alternative to buying another house.

Anyone else thinking along these lines?


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## vivalour (Mar 23, 2008)

caribbeansun said:


> Just curious if others are looking at fractionals as a way to do extended periods away from the snow and cold?
> 
> There's been a fair bit of chatter about doing this with timeshare weeks but that just seems like more work than it's worth and of course it's unlikely that the value will be retained as well although the jury is still out on that.
> 
> ...



We looked into this species at Tremblant, since it's fairly close to home and has multi-season possibilities. The  upside is that there are ample re-sales, and  we would not have to buy from developers. The downside is that many Europeans are buying here (North America in general) and they will pay top dollar (or I should say, euro) for what I would not consider prime locations. One new fractional that I visited is now having a hard time selling, and had to re-package their offerings as a kind of time-share/fractional/DC hybrid!

We later ran through the numbers with our accountant for both fractional and condo purchases and decided current offerings were generally overvalued and we could rent many nice properties on the open market with much less hassle, on-going expense (taxes, MF), and much more flexibility. So we will stick with rentals and hotels for some of our trips (esp. Tremblant, Europe and U.S.). 

We also decided to join High Country Club for our beach vacations and short summer trips. For now, these two seem like the best values and are more practical options for our family than buying a fractional.

So that's our experience, but you also have to consider:
1. the specific market & development, and value for money
2. the possibility that you may not be able to sell easily, if and when you wish to (many owners attached to a single unit can keep values down; create an illiquid market)


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## Steamboat Bill (Mar 23, 2008)

Also, most fractionals I have seen offer 4-6 weeks or more but not in a solid chunk. Thus, you are talking about 1-2 summer weeks, 1-2 winter weeks, and 1-2 off season weeks and that means 3x trips per year to the same location.


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## pwrshift (Mar 23, 2008)

That alone is a deal breaker for me ... 3 trips to the same location at different times of year.  

But isn't it just as restrictive with DC's, perhaps more so?  You can't book the same 'holiday' resort (or time) year after year, even if it's a different location?

TS rule the roost when it comes to getting the weeks you want -- week after week, year after year!  Consecutively or concurrently.

Many resort condo hotel owners can book up to any 9 weeks during a year, but they lose the revenue that their own occupancy loses.
 

http://www.redleavesmuskoka.com/engine.cfm?i=12http://www.redleavesmuskoka.com


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## vivalour (Mar 23, 2008)

pwrshift said:


> That alone is a deal breaker for me ... 3 trips to the same location at different times of year.
> 
> But isn't it just as restrictive with DC's, perhaps more so?  You can't book the same 'holiday' resort (or time) year after year, even if it's a different location?
> 
> ...



We like to explore a variety of locations/resorts at various times of the (non-school) year, so DC variety suits perfectly, despite its limitations. 
Different strokes for different folks!


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## caribbeansun (Mar 24, 2008)

Hmmm - the one fractional that I actually spent any time reviewing was for a quarter-share which was split into a block of 5 weeks, 4 weeks and 4 weeks which moved rotated with the other owners each year.

I guess I'm looking for alternatives to buying full-share condo hotels myself or possibly buying with 2-4 other people while still having resort amenities.

A DC won't work because of the restriction on the consecutive weeks - I also wouldn't want to be changing units week after week.

I guess I was thinking of a month in Grand Cayman, a month is say Scottsdale or Tuscon and a month in say south Florida = Jan, Feb, Mar each year.


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## Steamboat Bill (Mar 24, 2008)

caribbeansun said:


> Hmmm - the one fractional that I actually spent any time reviewing was for a quarter-share which was split into a block of 5 weeks, 4 weeks and 4 weeks which moved rotated with the other owners each year.



What property was that?

Most fractionals have a rotating week schedule that will cause havock for anyone with kids in a school system that have fixed week vacations.


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## caribbeansun (Mar 25, 2008)

Castaway Cove/Reef Resort in Grand Cayman - I ended up buying full ownership rather than a quarter share.


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## Steamboat Bill (Mar 25, 2008)

caribbeansun said:


> Castaway Cove/Reef Resort in Grand Cayman - I ended up buying full ownership rather than a quarter share.



http://www.thereef.com/files/Investment_Opps

There are a number of ways to invest at The Reef Resort, from individual weeks, through quarter shares, to whole ownership. Our innovative approach lets you choose your preferred method.

Membership options start at under US$11,500 for a week in a studio suite in off-season, to over US$50,000 for a two-bedroom condominium at New Years. Quarter share ownership in Phase III (the final phase) of our Castaways’ Cove condominiums start at US$185,000 with whole ownership starting at US$599,000.

ACT NOW and take advantage of our limited time offer “Fly and Buy” program. Pre-register for this programme and The Reef Resort will pay for two roundtrip airline tickets and a two night stay up to a value of US$2,000 if you decide to become a Member of this wonderful resort during your stay with us.

Terms and Conditions:

    * Pre registration is required to qualify for this program. Contact our sales team for registration and additional details: call 888.873.2361 or contact us at invest@thereef.com.
    * Roundtrip airline tickets and 2 night hotel stay will be refunded in full only after initial deposit has been received for the purchase of your Membership and all contracts are signed.
    * Airline tickets and hotel stay may not exceed US$2,000 and may not exceed 10% of Membership purchase price.
    * Airline and Hotel receipts required in order to process rebate.
    * Offer valid for a limited time, terms and conditions subject to change without prior notice.


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## charford (Mar 26, 2008)

I own a fractional at Smugglers Notch resort. It's a one-third share. I get a 4 week chunk of time in the summer (same weeks every year), a chunk of time in the winter (again, the same weeks every year) and several off-season weeks which have been converted to RCI points. We like the flexibility of our arrangement.

I also know of cases of people with full ownership condos in warm places, selling their own fractions on MLS. If you are interested in something warm, you might want to talk to a local realtor in the location(s) you're interested in.


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## sullco (Mar 27, 2008)

*Here's how to winter in consecutive weeks*

There are very few ways to do this in the shared ownership world because developers will not be able to sell the "off weeks" in seasonal destinations if they package the highly demanded weeks only.

However, if you have the money, the very best way, in my opinion, is to buy 4 consecutive winter weeks at the Hyatt Coconut Plantation in Bonita Springs, FL.  It's 10-15 minutes from the Ft. Myers airport, 14 miles north of Naples and is a first class operation.  The reason they can do it is that they sell the summer weeks to Florida residents (and others) at half the price of winter weeks.

However, it will cost you over $100K US (total), plus the usual fees to get four winter weeks.

If you want a guaranteed vacation in a fixed unit for fixed weeks, without buying and maintaining a whole ownership condo, this is one of the few ways to do it.  Hyatt has a very user friendly plan and is adding new locations in high end destinations.


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## Steamboat Bill (Mar 27, 2008)

sullco said:


> There are very few ways to do this in the shared ownership world because developers will not be able to sell the "off weeks" in seasonal destinations if they package the highly demanded weeks only.
> 
> However, if you have the money, the very best way, in my opinion, is to buy 4 consecutive winter weeks at the Hyatt Coconut Plantation in Bonita Springs, FL.  It's 10-15 minutes from the Ft. Myers airport, 14 miles north of Naples and is a first class operation.  The reason they can do it is that they sell the summer weeks to Florida residents (and others) at half the price of winter weeks.
> 
> ...



For this location and dates, this is a reasonable purchase.


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## hipslo (Mar 27, 2008)

sullco said:


> However, if you have the money, the very best way, in my opinion, is to buy 4 consecutive winter weeks at the Hyatt Coconut Plantation in Bonita Springs, FL.  It's 10-15 minutes from the Ft. Myers airport, 14 miles north of Naples and is a first class operation.  The reason they can do it is that they sell the summer weeks to Florida residents (and others) at half the price of winter weeks.



Is that property on the beach?


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## sullco (Mar 27, 2008)

Hyatt Coconut Plantation overlooks (from every condo) the Raptor Bay Golf Course.  It has a private island beach club accessible by boat from the Hyatt Regency Marina a few minutes away.  It has a water feature with lazy river, kiddie pool, adult only pool with hot tub, casual restaurant, etc.  Large clubhouse with fitness, day care, etc.

Plus, due to strange circumstances involving the arrival of bald eagles in the palm trees, the construction of the residential units has been stalled.  This means that you are competing with fewer residents for the beautiful amenities--all of which were built first and currently operational.  Hyatt's misfortune (although temporary) is your benefit.


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## vivalour (Mar 27, 2008)

sullco said:


> Plus, due to strange circumstances involving the arrival of bald eagles in the palm trees, the construction of the residential units has been stalled.  This means that you are competing with fewer residents for the beautiful amenities--all of which were built first and currently operational.  Hyatt's misfortune (although temporary) is your benefit.



By "residentail units" are you referring to a major new community development of private homes? Or would these be connected with the fractionals in some way? Not familiar with the area, but sounds interesting, even though we can't "vacation" for 4 solid weeks yet, since we're tied in with the school year. Thanks for your input....


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## hipslo (Mar 27, 2008)

sullco said:


> Hyatt Coconut Plantation overlooks (from every condo) the Raptor Bay Golf Course.  It has a private island beach club accessible by boat from the Hyatt Regency Marina a few minutes away.  It has a water feature with lazy river, kiddie pool, adult only pool with hot tub, casual restaurant, etc.  Large clubhouse with fitness, day care, etc.
> 
> Plus, due to strange circumstances involving the arrival of bald eagles in the palm trees, the construction of the residential units has been stalled.  This means that you are competing with fewer residents for the beautiful amenities--all of which were built first and currently operational.  Hyatt's misfortune (although temporary) is your benefit.




Thanks.  I am toying with the idea of purchasing a block of 4-6 winter weeks somewhere, though I am still likely a number of years away from doing so.  My requirements are somewhere warm, direct beachfront, nice resort, nice area, available for 25-30k per week, resale.  So far I havent quite found the perfect spot, though Ocean Pointe comes close.  Marco or Crystal Shores would likely be even closer but no resales available for quite some time.  Looks like this place wouldnt work for me if its not right on the beach (though it otherwise looks great, its just that direct beachfront is a must-have for me).

In general, I am a fan of the concept of a block of high end timeshare weeks in lieu of a whole ownership condo.


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## sullco (Mar 27, 2008)

I just meant that the timeshare condos, which were to be built in 14 separate, but identical, buildings did not get built. Only 3 (at last visit) of the multi-unit buildings have been completed.  All the amenities have been done since day one--that's what I mean by "good for you, less good for HVC."

Plus, you can buy one week at a time--just like regular timeshare.  The big difference is that they are fixed weeks--so you are guaranteed usage, time, and the exact condo that you buy.  There is plenty of flexibility in the Hyatt system--I do believe it's the best in the industry.

Some early buyers did indeed buy several consecutive weeks in the same condo--thus getting the effect of a perfectly designed fractional.  No waste--peak season--no surprises, etc.


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## vivalour (Mar 27, 2008)

sullco said:


> I just meant that the timeshare condos, which were to be built in 14 separate, but identical, buildings did not get built. Only 3 (at last visit) of the multi-unit buildings have been completed.  All the amenities have been done since day one--that's what I mean by "good for you, less good for HVC."
> 
> Plus, you can buy one week at a time--just like regular timeshare.  The big difference is that they are fixed weeks--so you are guaranteed usage, time, and the exact condo that you buy.  There is plenty of flexibility in the Hyatt system--I do believe it's the best in the industry.
> 
> Some early buyers did indeed buy several consecutive weeks in the same condo--thus getting the effect of a perfectly designed fractional.  No waste--peak season--no surprises, etc.



Sounds like a major development -- with 14 buildings! I did a quick check on TripAdvisor, and found many rave reviews, a few not so good -- complaints about bad service and mould.... Good idea, though. Thanks.


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## Steamboat Bill (Mar 27, 2008)

I like (but don't love) the Hyatt location.


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## caribbeansun (Mar 30, 2008)

Ultimately it seems that I cycle back to the same answer - either owning a second home outright OR owning say 3-4 second homes as part of a larger group with the ability to stay a month at a time in each - thus reducing the overall cost of 4 properties to that of one, providing some diversification in terms of real estate markets and a change of scenery.


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## smbrannan (Mar 30, 2008)

*Whatever happened to....?*



caribbeansun said:


> Ultimately it seems that I cycle back to the same answer - either owning a second home outright OR owning say 3-4 second homes as part of a larger group with the ability to stay a month at a time in each - thus reducing the overall cost of 4 properties to that of one, providing some diversification in terms of real estate markets and a change of scenery.



Whatever happened to you plan to put together a consortium to pull this off?


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## sullco (Mar 30, 2008)

Re: the last exchange, plenty of "intermediaries" exist who "put together a consortium" on your behalf to accomplish just what you are hoping for.  Hasn't this been covered on this blog?  I am a recent poster and am surprised that this seems to not have been suggested to you.  Not trying to be a wiseguy.


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## caribbeansun (Mar 31, 2008)

Life got in the way and the concept that I'd created became too complicated from the tax/legal perspective so I set it aside for the last 6 months but it keeps coming back in different forms so it seems it may be destined to happen eventually.

My original concept was to find a way to allow all members of the consortium to have direct ownership in the properties and that's where it started to fall apart.  I had also wanted the ability of owners to deduct loan interest on their capital.  I may have been shooting for too much on all of this but frankly there should be a structure that will allow all of this.

Legal entity is a tough one - incorporation creates issues if the number of owners exceeds 50 and/or if you are considered to be soliciting investors, partnership created issues with titling the properties and changes in partners.  On the tax side there are foreign investment provisions in the tax act in Canada and there are issues with personal use within an incorporated entity in Canada.  I've also considered a trust as well as a non-profit entity and run into additional issues.

Heck I've even investigated off-shore partnerships and corporate structures but I'm much less comfortable with those options and they are considerably more expensive to maintain.

As you can see from this thread I keep returning to the same answer - from my personal perspective I want ownership in a number of properties (minimum of 4) where at some point in the future I can spend the winter months and in the meantime I can put the units into the rental pool to off set operating costs and build equity.

Something tells me I'll be back at this full speed once May arrives (I'm jammed with work for the next month)...





smbrannan said:


> Whatever happened to you plan to put together a consortium to pull this off?


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## PerryM (Mar 31, 2008)

*Who want's a fractional when DCs should be far superior*

THE best model for Destination Club usage is WorldMark – I’ve said it many times and maybe someone will eventually do it over a weekend.

The goal of a DC should be for the members to own the units and the management team to make their money managing the DC and not participate in appreciation of equity – that’s not their job.

WM is very simple – the developer, Wyndham in this case, buys/builds condos and then turns them, debt free, to WorldMark the Club.  In exchange Wyndham gets a million or so credits to sell for whatever they can extort out of Ma and Pa at a sales presentation.

EVERY WM owner owns a fraction of those debt free deeds.  Theoretically WM could sell a condo and disburse the proceeds back to all the members.

A DC modeled after WM is THE ultimate in DC structure.  The developer would find a condo, fix it up, and then have it appraised by a licensed real estate appraiser.  Let’s say that it appraises out to $1M.  The FIRST condo in the new DC would cost the 8 members each a membership cost of $125k ($1M/8).

Now the kicker that makes all this work – the rental rate for a week at similar condos is $2k per week.  Each member gets 2,000 Points/week * 4 weeks or 8,000 Points to spend within the DC to reserve 4 weeks or so.  Members can “roll” points into next year if not used and “rent” points to and from other members at whatever price they can establish.

Holiday weeks cost 50% more Points.  Reservations start 6 months out and members can add any number of Points to the reservation which is awarded 30 days later (5 months out) to the member that has paid the most Points for the week - the number of Points offered is right there for everyone to see.

Now time passes and a new condo is to be added; simple.  The new condo appraises out to $1.25M and our one existing condo appraises out to $1.5M – how to handle this?  Simple – new members pay $171,875 for their membership.  ($1,500,000 + $1,250,000 = $2,750,000/16 members) (The excess profit goes to the DC to hold in a reserve which could be applied later to more expensive condos).

Rents are now $2,500 for condo #1 and $2,250 for condo #2 and we average them to $2,375 per week and in the new year each member get’s 2,375 Points * 4 = 9,500 Points.  Inflation affects everything and if you were an original owner and rolled 2,000 Points forward one year you lost purchasing power.

Luckily any member can just pay the difference in dollars which go to that reserve fund.  EACH week of the year has a rental rate but the average rental * 4 weeks of usage is what each member gets per new year.

MFs are 8% of the current membership fees or $13,750 for 4 weeks usage per year.  (This percentage can be adjusted to reflect reality)

Condos can be sold at anytime and everything is adjusted with any proceeds going to the reserve.  Members can exit anytime they want by selling their membership for whatever they can get (ROFR applies) or the DC will recycle it at the current price less a 6% fee (normal real estate commission) to do this and memberships are FIFO ahead of new sales.

This is how ALL DCs should be run – I would join since I’m getting ALL the appreciation and the management company is getting a fee which compensates them for their time and risk.

I do NOT want to "Buy a rich guy a condo and then pay him rent to use it".  I'm not sure when the DC industry will realize that folks like me want an alternative to a 2nd home and that includes appreciation.

Well make this the 10th time I've presented this plan - each time I think I refine it better and maybe someone will actually listen one day - I can only hope.


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## TarheelTraveler (Mar 31, 2008)

Carribeansun - As you have seen, it is not easy to pull off.  Crescendo invested significant sums into getting something similar done from a legal/tax perspective, using very good counsel.  You've got to comply with both tax and securities regimes in the U.S. and Canada.  I think it would be virtually impossible to put together on a small scale.

PerryM - I agree with you on the attractiveness of your model, particularly to the consumer.  I think you would have to give management more juice for someone to do it; otherwise, it's not worth taking the risks and spending the money.  However, your model is pretty close to the Bellehavens model if you think about it.


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## Steamboat Bill (Mar 31, 2008)

I think there should be a points-based DC like PerryM describes, I posted about creating a system like DVC (I don't know anything about WM) on a DC only forum and it was not well received.

http://www.destinationclubforums.co...destination-club-reservation-process-503.html

Perhaps Perry should post a new thread there to see if he has any better luck.


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## TarheelTraveler (Mar 31, 2008)

Having seen a points-like system in the DC environment with Crescendo, I'm a big fan as it seemed to even out the demand.  The credits varied based on holiday/high season/low season.  It didn't take into account the property, but that would be a good way in my mind to drive the use of less popular/less expensive properties perhaps.  Otherwise, there is always the incentive, as an example, to use the 6,000 sq. ft. Cabo or Punta Mita house in high season, instead of the 3,000 sq. ft. Scottsdale home in the summer.

The idea of points, however, as Bill noted, was definitely not well received on Destination Club Forums.


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## PerryM (Mar 31, 2008)

TarheelTraveler said:


> Carribeansun - As you have seen, it is not easy to pull off.  Crescendo invested significant sums into getting something similar done from a legal/tax perspective, using very good counsel.  You've got to comply with both tax and securities regimes in the U.S. and Canada.  I think it would be virtually impossible to put together on a small scale.
> 
> PerryM - I agree with you on the attractiveness of your model, particularly to the consumer.  I think you would have to give management more juice for someone to do it; otherwise, it's not worth taking the risks and spending the money.  However, your model is pretty close to the Bellehavens model if you think about it.



About 5% of the DC industry uses something close to my ideal DC setup - the other 95% use the model "Buy the rich guy a condo and then pay him rent to use it".  This, to me, is an insane model to use and the reason DCs are just a pimple in the 2nd home alternative market and will remain a pimple until they give the customers what they want - a viable alternative to a second home, without the hassles of ownership but with all the benefits of real estate appreciation.

Right now DCs are just too piggish - that model works for a small fraction of the total universe of customers they want to attract.  

We own 4 fractionals and convert them into WM credits (actually trade points) and exchange them for Marriott timeshares in II.  I'd rather invest the same money in a DC where I'm not the last thought of the DC but the very first taught.  We have the equivalent of 16 weeks in usage at Marriott resorts or 16 weeks in South Lake Tahoe in a 2BR.

I can foresee the day when DCs grow up and give fractionals a run for their money - that includes timeshares.


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## PerryM (Mar 31, 2008)

Steamboat Bill said:


> I think there should be a points-based DC like PerryM describes, I posted about creating a system like DVC (I don't know anything about WM) on a DC only forum and it was not well received.
> 
> http://www.destinationclubforums.co...destination-club-reservation-process-503.html
> 
> Perhaps Perry should post a new thread there to see if he has any better luck.




I'll do that later this week, let's see if I can change some minds.


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## vivalour (Mar 31, 2008)

PerryM said:


> About 5% of the DC industry uses something close to my ideal DC setup - the other 95% use the model "Buy the rich guy a condo and then pay him rent to use it".
> Right now DCs are just too piggish - that model works for a small fraction of the total universe of customers they want to attract.



What do you mean by the "total universe of customers"?  As you say, there IS a choice out there, so I don't see the problem for consumers who want to have some "investment" value in their DC.  When you are asking people to put up $150,000+  for a PerryM DC, I still see double risk for the average consumer, even in a so-called equity model.  You are buying into real estate AND the hospitality industry.  Both are difficult businesses, long-term investments, subject to significant volatility, market trends & competition, general economic conditions, regional specific issues, etc., etc.

Perhaps some people are willing to overlook these risks because they get psychological comfort from the notion of being owners, with a deed in the drawer. We could surely buy our own condo or TSs in Florida, California or Mexico, but would MUCH rather forgo present hassle, risks I outlined, and even future "riches" by allowing HCC to do it for us. There may be more room for owner-centred, equity-style DCs, but I see the current market already flooded with possibly too many TSs and fractionals. These have a big advantage in being marketed by brands with deep pockets. So you would also have to get credibility and marketing power behind your PerryM DC, or you are dead before you start.... imho


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## PerryM (Mar 31, 2008)

vivalour said:


> What do you mean by the "total universe of customers"?  As you say, there IS a choice out there, so I don't see the problem for consumers who want to have some "investment" value in their DC.  When you are asking people to put up $150,000+  for a PerryM DC, I still see double risk for the average consumer, even in a so-called equity model.  You are buying into real estate AND the hospitality industry.  Both are difficult businesses, long-term investments, subject to significant volatility, market trends & competition, general economic conditions, regional specific issues, etc., etc.
> 
> Perhaps some people are willing to overlook these risks because they get psychological comfort from the notion of being owners, with a deed in the drawer. We could surely buy our own condo or TSs in Florida, California or Mexico, but would MUCH rather forgo present hassle, risks I outlined, and even future "riches" by allowing HCC to do it for us. There may be more room for owner-centred, equity-style DCs, but I see the current market already flooded with possibly too many TSs and fractionals. These have a big advantage in being marketed by brands with deep pockets. So you would also have to get credibility and marketing power behind your PerryM DC, or you are dead before you start.... imho



4,000,000 Americans own a timeshare - if 10% of them are high end owners who would be a candidate for a $125k DC then that's 400,000 possible customers for DC's who want to go after the high end timeshare owner.

Right now there are 6,500 DC members - that's 1.63% of a huge market.  There are many timeshare owners that paid $125k for 4 weeks of timeshares.  

The Achilles heel of timeshares is the lack of real estate appreciation - that could easily be addressed with a DC since the deed to the condo/home has not been sliced and diced 52 ways.  That deed will reflect appreciating values in the resort area it is located.

A Wal-Mart of DCs will spring up at sometime - some company that sees millions of dollars with forming DCs and managing them with the members, the guys who put up ALL the money, getting paid with higher and higher values of the condos that they bought and use.

The shortsighted view of the current DCs is too oriented towards greed - the real money is in large number of members who see the valuation of their investment going up and up every year.


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## Steamboat Bill (Mar 31, 2008)

There are now 6,500 DC members


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## caribbeansun (Apr 1, 2008)

Canadian tax and securities issues are real for me, US is not *unless* I included US citizens in the plan and purchased US properties.  Even if US citizens are included I'm not convinced that the SEC has any jurisdiction if the entity is anything other than US based.  Frankly the US/Canada tax treaty is the least of my worries at this point.

It wasn't my intent to create some large organization - it was my intent to perhaps get as many as 48-64 people involved to purchase 6-8 properties.  It wasn't my intent to create a structure that would be a full-time job for me via management fees.

I was coming from the perspective of bringing like minded people together who wanted quality vacations, capital appreciation and a tax deduction at the same time.

I don't believe it's "impossible" - it is however taking me in directions I hadn't initially considered to make it workable.



TarheelTraveler said:


> Carribeansun - As you have seen, it is not easy to pull off.  Crescendo invested significant sums into getting something similar done from a legal/tax perspective, using very good counsel.  You've got to comply with both tax and securities regimes in the U.S. and Canada.  I think it would be virtually impossible to put together on a small scale.


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## smbrannan (Apr 1, 2008)

caribbeansun said:


> It wasn't my intent to create some large organization - it was my intent to perhaps get as many as 48-64 people involved to purchase 6-8 properties.  It wasn't my intent to create a structure that would be a full-time job for me via management fees.
> 
> I was coming from the perspective of bringing like minded people together who wanted quality vacations, capital appreciation and a tax deduction at the same time.
> 
> I don't believe it's "impossible" - it is however taking me in directions I hadn't initially considered to make it workable.



That's too bad.  I'd have settled for quality vacations and capital appreciation.   Tax deduction not a necessity (but wouldn't turn my nose up if it could be done).


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