# Report: We attended our HGVC Presentation at Parc Soleil



## Pamona (Sep 19, 2019)

We thought it might be easier to post a new thread now that we finished our presentation. 

We are back home after 4 wonderful days at Hilton's Tuscany Village Resort in Orlando. We enjoyed the place and area. Thank you Hilton. 

We did attend the obligatory presentation in the Sales Center at Parc Soleil. Net end - we didn't purchase anything. Overall, the presentation experience was fairly low key and not high pressure. Maybe even more low key after they came to believe we are truly interested in joining HGVC as resale members.

The Sales Center is gorgeous and well appointed and their informational technology reminded us of Disney's technical prowess in film making. With 180 employees including 112 Sales Reps and stunning views and huge desk size computers one doesn't have to wonder why the cost of HGVC properties are so expensive. 

They put on a Hollywood group presentation complete with photos of the world and happy vacationers. Who wouldn't be taken in by such dreams. Very professional approach. Then back to earth and we separated with our sales rep.

Our rep began the usual rehearsed buddy-buddy approach letting us know in several ways that we are valuable people and he would never do anything to hurt us. I thought that was a good time to tell him that we are pursuing possible timeshare resales as our first step. I advised we had done our due diligence and that we want to be HGVC Members but not at developer expense. Very simple. 

That seemed to derail him a bit but he came back with the usual resales are chancy and sometimes you end up with huge past maintenance bills to pay off etc. Everyone lies. Imagine being told that in a sales presentation. lol. He told us of one unlucky soul that bought a time share then learned he now owed $18,000 in back maintenance. We would hear that story a few times again. Of course, buy a developed owned timeshare is clean and clear and no problems. 

I wont bore you with usual discussions as you have heard them many many times.
But there were a few things that I had not anticipated so I will mention them here.

First, he said that Hilton might change the point values for reservations for resale members and not "real' members. Make it more costly point wise to reserve rooms for a resale member. I told him then that proves the Hilton contract is worthless since what value is it to me if later in life I can't sell it to someone where they can't enjoy all of the benefits that I paid for? Since now they would be a resale member. That's the same BS logic as if I buy a new car but sell it 3 years later and the dealership will no longer service it? Why buy their car then?

After looking at me perplexed he got up and left and then began the procession and musical chairs of managers and other managers trying to put us all back on track. One began discussing the great benefits of Bonus Points and how they can be used up to 4 years. I reminded him its just 2 years but he said Yes but 2 more years for RCI. I asked why you can't be upfront and tell us it's not 4 years for Hilton? His response was asking what we would do with 30,000 bonus points. I told him I probably might pay off one year's $1,500. MF since Hilton only gives me .10 cents per point. He left us.

A manager offered 7,000 pts platinum for just $59,999 with 20,000 bonus points. I told him I can buy 7,000 points more realistically at about $1 a point in resale market. He said I can't so I advised that I had a printout of just one broker with 25 Parc Soleil resale opportunities. I offered to show the printout and he left us. 

I had mentioned the Apollo situation which seemed to throw them off base again. Except to say a take over wont happen. I reminded them that its up to senior management and the shareholders to decide that. Not HGVC employees. No response. 

One odd thing was that the sales rep showed us on paper that True HGVC Members have a special perk to pay a reduced cash price per night in Hilton brand hotels. Apparently you can use that perk if you don't want to use your points. BUT that perk is not available to resale members. I never encountered that before so I don't know if that is true or more BS. Can Hilton really discriminate and treat resale members as lepers? Maybe other TUG members have encountered this and know is that is correct. 

We were then told how chancy resales might be with the ROFR. True. Can't argue with that. But with 112 sales reps presenting to 150 families per session day that seems to suggest HGVC has plenty of inventory and may not want to get into buying back other inventory right now. That ended that discussion.

The next offer was at $48,000 for 7,000 points with 30,000 bonus points. Impressive. But I asked what is the true value of the property given the huge staff and expensive surroundings as well as the cost of the research, marketing, promotions, sales and other incidentals involved in finding and housing 150 families in Hilton properties in the hopes of getting them to buy? Now they downplayed the expenses when earlier they proudly stated how they spare no expense to bring us the best possible product. But at what cost to us?

I didn't get an answer of course. That was the end of our presentation. We were to wait there till someone checked us out and get us our vouchers so we can leave. 

After sitting alone for a bit then suddenly one last attempt was 3,400 point at $11,500 with 5,000 bonus points. Told us that's the lowest they can go and we asked when we would be checked out and given our stuff.

As a finale we met a really nice professional who offered us a seemingly great idea. We purchase a small plan for $1,400 good for 18 months with 7,200 points that we can use up and no strings attached. We can walk away after using the points or after the time expires. Only Vegas, Hawaii, New York, Washington, Orlando, Myrtle Beach were available in this plan. Quite attractive locations but for us we have been there and done that so that was not for us. We have different plans for using HGVC in our future. But a nice plan maybe for a family wanting to get a taste of the HGVC. I believe she said that the money paid for that plan would be merged with a real plan in the future if anyone decided to go with HGVD Developer contracts. Don't quote me on that but I think that was the result. Best plan we hear all day. No thanks but then we left with our stuff. 

Sorry to take up so much space with this report. We do have to say that the reps and staff and managers we encountered were overall pleasant and never aggressive with us. We thank HGVC for that level of professionalism. 

Thank you TUG for preparing us. It can be overwhelming.

Pamona, 5 minutes ago Edit Report


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## brp (Sep 19, 2019)

I typically don't read the long posts, but I'm glad I read this one. Your approach and the responses sound like much fin 

Cheers.


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## jehb2 (Sep 19, 2019)

Ooooh, this was so fun to read.


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## PigsDad (Sep 19, 2019)

Great report -- thanks for sharing.  I just wanted to comment on a couple points:



Pamona said:


> One odd thing was that the sales rep showed us on paper that True HGVC Members have a special perk to pay a reduced cash price per night in Hilton brand hotels. Apparently you can use that perk if you don't want to use your points. BUT that perk is not available to resale members.


Ah, _that _BS.  There is no discount on Hilton hotels for HGVC owners.  I have seen a few reports from those that bought and then later were looking for the "Hilton hotel discounts" and finding there never was any.  The only "discount" owners might get for Hilton stays is the Honor discount.  Since an Honors membership comes with a HGVC purchase, I guess they could make that claim, but since an Honors membership is available to anyone, it is quite a stretch.



> We were then told how chancy resales might be with the ROFR. True. Can't argue with that.


I wouldn't call resale "chancy".  Yes, most deeds are subject to ROFR, but if HGVC does decide to exercise ROFR on your purchase, you get any deposit you made returned to you.  You can then find another resale to purchase and start the process over again.  The only thing you lose is a bit of time.  No monetary risk involved.



> As a finale we met a really nice professional who offered us a seemingly great idea. We purchase a small plan for $1,400 good for 18 months with 7,200 points that we can use up and no strings attached.


Yes, this is the VIP program, although I thought the going price was $1700, so if you were offered it for $1400, that is interesting.  It basically allows you to purchase one-time usage for 7200 points at certain properties, and is not a bad deal.  The downside is you must attend another sales presentation when you use those points.  And if you do end up purchasing, you can deduct the cost of the VIP points against a purchase you make.

Kurt


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 19, 2019)

@Pamona Thanks for sharing. I am impressed you did so much work to prepare. You "out-objectioned" the sales reps to the point they couldn't respond! 

It is interesting that they offered you the VIP for $1400 instead of the usual $1700. We've bought several to stretch our points, but will not buy more unless they offer some of the newer properties. It was a great way to get 9 month reservations in DC for the cost of a MF.

Now that you have lived through one. Would you do it again for a nice gift?


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## GT75 (Sep 19, 2019)

Wow, I was very impressed.     Thank you so much for sharing.    We normally (talking to myself anyway) suggest that you don't respond to their lies (or let's say misrepresentation) but your approach was wonderful.


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## brp (Sep 19, 2019)

GT75 said:


> Wow, I was very impressed.     Thank you so much for sharing.    We normally (talking to myself anyway) suggest that you don't respond to their lies (or let's say misrepresentation) but your approach was wonderful.



I generally prefer (and advocate) the approach outlined here. But my implementation hasn't been as thorough as this on the past couple as the folks we've talked to have been genuinely nice and (relatively) truthful.

Cheers.


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## Pamona (Sep 19, 2019)

CalGalTraveler said:


> @Pamona Thanks for sharing. I am impressed you did so much work to prepare. You "out-objectioned" the sales reps to the point they couldn't respond!
> 
> It is interesting that they offered you the VIP for $1400 instead of the usual $1700. We've bought several to stretch our points, but will not buy more unless they offer some of the newer properties. It was a great way to get 9 month reservations in DC for the cost of a MF.
> 
> Now that you have lived through one. Would you do it again for a nice gift?



Would love a nice gift but I doubt they will invite us back. But thanks to TUG we felt we were prepared and were on an even - or at least close to and even playing field. And that is quite an advantage given the level of professionally trained salesmanship.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 19, 2019)

@Pamona They will definitely invite you back.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 19, 2019)

FWIW...it seems the VIP has been devalued. I seem to recall it was $1499 a few years ago and even though they were more than 7000 points they would waive the requirement so you could stay in the biggest units at Kingsland. We had a top floor deluxe Kingsland via VIP. Now you are limited to less than a week during peak at several resorts or the smaller Kingsland 2 bedroom on the bottom floor for a week.


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## Pamona (Sep 19, 2019)

We didn't know that was the VIP program and it is usually valued at $1,700. But they offered it to us at $1,400 ( also we forgot to mention that we could have bought it at $1,295 if we paid immediately). Maybe they offered it to us in exasperation to finally get us to put our signatures onto something. As we said, that seemed like a great deal but we have different needs and those great locations weren't for us. Sorry.


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## GT75 (Sep 19, 2019)

CalGalTraveler said:


> They will definitely invite you back.



I agree.     They can not sell if there is no one there.



Pamona said:


> But they offered it to us at $1,400 ( also we forgot to mention that we could have bought it at $1,295 if we paid immediately).



I haven't been around as long as some of the others but that is the lowest price which I have heard off.    That is a little under $0.20/point.    Now, the only problem is those are like bonus points so non-changeable reservation (if I remember correctly).   But, of course you must sit through another presentation.   I don't think @Pamona you would learn any more about the system.     This VIP package would have let you "experiance" our booking system.


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## Janann (Sep 19, 2019)

Well done!  You gave the sales crew a run for their money.



Pamona said:


> After sitting alone for a bit then suddenly one last attempt was 3,400 point at $11,500 with 5,000 bonus points.



Any chance that this was an every other year contract?  If it was every year, it was actually a somewhat decent offer.


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## Pamona (Sep 19, 2019)

It was not an every other year contract....at least that is how we understood it. Actually, after that there was another person sitting in the musical chair routine who mentioned the possibility of alternative years but we just looked at him and he just left us. Nothing more was said on that topic. We got left alone a lot that morning. One funny thing was another person came in with a chart and was about to sit across from us then looked at us then looked at his chart and then excused himself and he left us.


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## Pamona (Sep 19, 2019)

Pamona said:


> It was not an every other year contract....at least that is how we understood it. Actually, after that there was another person sitting in the musical chair routine who mentioned the possibility of alternative years but we just looked at him and he just left us. Nothing more was said on that topic. We got left alone a lot that morning. One funny thing was another person came in with a chart and was about to sit across from us then looked at us then looked at his chart and then excused himself and he left us.



Opps...I am sorry....but my better and wiser half just reminded me that the initial 3,400 contract WAS an every other year deal but after that another person began talking about alternative years and merging the 3,400 with other contracts. That totally confused us and we didn't say anything and he left us.  So, sorry for my earlier confusion. It is hard to remember a lot of what happens in these different discussions.


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## SmithOp (Sep 19, 2019)

Janann said:


> Well done!  You gave the sales crew a run for their money.
> 
> 
> 
> Any chance that this was an every other year contract?  If it was every year, it was actually a somewhat decent offer.



Not a decent offer because we don’t know the maint fee and 3400 is probably a 1 br gold season.  Those can be bought resale for less than $1500.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


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## Talent312 (Sep 19, 2019)

Janann said:


> Any chance that this was an every other year contract?  If it was every year, it was actually a somewhat decent offer.



Beg to differ. An annual 3400 point package has virtually no resale value.
I think about $ 0.50 per point, and they can sometimes be had for $-0-. 
Simply too few points to be worthwhile.


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## jehb2 (Sep 20, 2019)

Pamona said:


> Would love a nice gift but I doubt they will invite us back.



One can only hope.  I think they stopped allowing us to go to presentation for 3-4 years.  I was so happy.  But they build new one and tried to get us to up grade.  I guess it’s common business sense that you need warm bodies to walk through the door.


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## pianodinosaur (Sep 20, 2019)

@Pamona  Congratulations on your excellent and instructive post regarding your HGVC sales presentation.  You are now well prepared to exchange into The Grand Luxxe or The Grand Mayan and survive a Vidanta sales presentation in Mexico!  The rooms at The Grand Luxxe in Puerto Vallarta are excellent, but, my wife and I do not want to suffer though that timeshare sales experience again.


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## RX8 (Sep 20, 2019)

In my presentations, HGVC has had two VIP options. Maybe they discussed the 7000 point VIP and then switched gears slyly to the 5000 point VIP, hence the lower price.


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## Pamona (Sep 20, 2019)

RX8 said:


> In my presentations, HGVC has had two VIP options. Maybe they discussed the 7000 point VIP and then switched gears slyly to the 5000 point VIP, hence the lower price.



I don't think they switched gears because the discussion continued as to what we could do with 7,200 points. Many examples of vacations which we appreciated but the locations were just not for us....maybe 20 years ago that might have been different for us. Aftercall, what's wrong with a try it out and get a flavor of HGVC....walk away after if not happy. Well, that was our experience and it was never as aggressive as we feared but we were well prepared, thanks to TUG, just incase. I do pity unknowing families entering their lair with no clue what to expect. Even with our detailed study and preparation it was still mind boggling but we knew the adult bar was waiting for us back at Tuscany Village and we took 2 perfect seat by the pool and had a few adult beverages to relax and watch the pool activities.


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## CaliGirl08 (Sep 20, 2019)

Thanks for your story.  I went to my first timeshare presentation at Elara and bought the VIP option for $1,700 in 2017.  It was worth it at the time since we booked a 6 night 2 bedroom stay at the new Hilton Hawaiian Village Grand Islander.  I have to agree, if they cut costs at the sales presentations would it increase profits which HGVC is failing to meet.


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## ski_sierra (Sep 21, 2019)

Looks like you gave them good material to get trained on how to overcome objections. How long were you in the presentation for?


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## Pamona (Sep 21, 2019)

We were there about 40 minutes before being shown the way to the elevator.


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## brp (Sep 23, 2019)

One thing we have done on a couple of presentations in NYC associated with great stay rates is to go when we first get into town (1-2 days before the presentation) and get our reward ($200 in Elevated Rewards Dollars in this case). First, we can start using them immediately. Second, it's easier to get out if we already have our gift and have satisfied the requirement of "showing up." May not always be possible, of course.

Cheers.


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## Pamona (Sep 26, 2019)

Wow...we have been invited back for another presentation!!!!. This time 5 days and 4 nights in Orlando. We thought for sure they would never want to see or hear from us again. We just have to wait one full year. Does anyone know what happens if we buy a resale in the meantime? Can we still take advantage of the latest vacation package they offered? How does that work?


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## GT75 (Sep 26, 2019)

Pamona said:


> Does anyone know what happens if we buy a resale in the meantime? Can we still take advantage of the latest vacation package they offered? How does that work?



I don't see a problem because there should be nothing in writing which you sign stating "....".   In fact, you can tell them that you purchased resale and will purchase from them if they can match the resale price of $xxx.


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## rjp123 (Sep 27, 2019)

I have my "owners sales presentation" in NYC next week.  Got the $250 for 2 nights in NYC offer via a telephone call so we are going to see what the experience of the up-sell is like.  Thanks for the detailed description.


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## Pamona (Sep 27, 2019)

rjp123 said:


> I have my "owners sales presentation" in NYC next week.  Got the $250 for 2 nights in NYC offer via a telephone call so we are going to see what the experience of the up-sell is like.  Thanks for the detailed description.



Good Luck and study the TUG advice....just enjoy NYC...its great


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## mjm1 (Sep 27, 2019)

rjp123 said:


> I have my "owners sales presentation" in NYC next week.  Got the $250 for 2 nights in NYC offer via a telephone call so we are going to see what the experience of the up-sell is like.  Thanks for the detailed description.



Are they providing a room for you in one of their timeshare units or in a Hilton branded hotel?

Best regards.

Mike


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 28, 2019)

Looking forward to hearing your presentation report on what's new.

Our NYC bounceback was at W57 and we had the option of HCNY. We opted for W57 because they allowed us to use the lounge because we are owners (although they said "not guaranteed.") We also stayed at Hyatt Res Club at Kaanapali on a promo stay which was very nice. I wouldn't mind that stay again.

I've noticed travel bloggers write about discounted stay offers and they are usually giddy about staying at a hotel. Not as good a deal because we find the timeshares nicer. But perhaps the developers know that the most likely person to buy another timeshare is someone who is already owns a TS.


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## brp (Sep 28, 2019)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Looking forward to hearing your presentation report on what's new.
> 
> Our NYC bounceback was at W57 and we had the option of HCNY. We opted for W57 because they allowed us to use the lounge because we are owners (although they said "not guaranteed." We also stayed at Hyatt Res Club at Kaanapali on a promo stay which was very nice. I wouldn't mind that stay again.



We've done 2 bouncebacks through our stays at W. 57th. The first time, I booked fairly close to our desired stay, so W. 57th had no availability. We opted for the Hilton Midtown (over Residences or HCNY) as we could use the Executive Lounge (not very good at all). Second stay (earlier this month) was at W. 57th, also with lounge access.

Cheers.


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## Pamona (Sep 28, 2019)

mjm1 said:


> Are they providing a room for you in one of their timeshare units or in a Hilton branded hotel?
> 
> Best regards.
> 
> Mike



They told me we are to be assigned a one bedroom in the Parc Soleil and that is where the presentation takes place. But that is a year from now. Hilton's rule is not to permit a return for at least one year at the same presentation site.


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