# Can someone explain what do they mean by Points are Points ?



## mz3bo (Mar 6, 2014)

Also, can someone explain what they mean by POINTS are POINTS with HGVC ? Let say I am trading inside hilton system (no RCI). If I own 7000 points in vegas and want to trade most of the time to Mexico on Hawaii, do I have less chance because I own Vegas and not somewhere else. In another word, what is the difference if you have 7000 points in vegas or 7000 points in hawaii when comes to exchaning on hilton network ?

Thanks


----------



## SmithOp (Mar 6, 2014)

If you own Hawaii you can book your owned unit type at 12 months, if you don't own there you have to wait for the 9 month club season to open up.  There may not be a vacancy if you wait for high demand weeks like summer and holidays.

If you are willing to get online right at 9 months you can usually book anywhere you want to go (with exception of event weeks), so therefore points are points.


----------



## tschwa2 (Mar 6, 2014)

So 7000 points in Hawaii (or anywhere else) will only help you with earlier booking at the exact resort you own at, during your season.  Hawaii points won't make any difference when booking Mexico, or even a different Hawaiian property or even the same property during a different season.  At 9 months points are points.

Another exception is if you buy points outside of the main resorts in an affiliate resort, they may have different rules about prepaying MF's, etc but at 9 months the actual points will be the same as the same number of points at any other resort in terms of ability to book within the system.


----------



## ronparise (Mar 6, 2014)

I use  "points are points"  to describe my points in the Wyndham  system, not Hilton(I dont own Hilton)   so I hope my comment is relavent.  If not I apologise for confusing you further


Points are the currency in my timeshare system They are symbolic of my ownership and what I use to make reservations

Its just like the money in my bank account where I might say a dollar is a dollar. The money is symbolic of the work I have done and of what I own. and its what I use to trade for things I want.   When it comes to writing a check, it doesnt matter how the individual dollars got there.  In my case, some came from my social security direct deposit, some came from a retirement check from a job I once had, some came from the rent I collected from real estate I own... But when I go to spend that money the grocery clerk doesnt care where that money comes from...all he cares about is that the little terminal says "approved" when I swipe my card.

Same thing with your points it doesnt matter which resort in your system thay came from. and long as you have enough of them you should be able to exchange them for a vacation somewhere else.


----------



## MelanieB (Mar 6, 2014)

I'm kind of repeating what others have already said here, but I'll say it a slightly different way.

There are two sorts of reservations you can make with points within the Hilton system.  Per Hilton's club rules: "Home Week reservations are consecutive night reservations at the resort at which a Member has an ownership interest in the season and unit type owned, for the number of days owned, checking in on the resort’s standard check-in day (“Home Week”)."  In other words, if you own a 2 bedroom platinum week at a resort with a Saturday check-in, then 7 nights in a 2 bedroom unit during platinum season starting on Saturday at that resort is what you can book as a home week.  Nothing else.  *Any* other booking is a "club reservation".  Sunday check-in?  Club reservation.  Gold season?  Club reservation.  8 night stay?  Club reservation.

There are exactly two advantages to making a home reservation.  First, you don't have to pay the reservation fee (~$50 online or $70 on the phone), and second, you can make a reservation as much as 12 months in advance.  Club reservations may only be made 9 months in advance.  So if availability is an issue, the home booking window can be important.  Whether availability in the club booking window is an issue depends on the resort and the season.

One caveat about home reservations that I think is frequently overlooked is that home reservations must be made using current year points.  IMO this completely kills the flexibility of the system.  So, for example, suppose in 2015 you decide to take an 8-day vacation instead of a 7-day vacation.  So you borrow a few points from 2016.  Well, now your 2015 reservation must be made as a club booking (because it's not the number of days you own), and any 2016 reservation you make must also be a club reservation (because you don't have the full year's points available to make a home reservation).  Now you're either taking a shorter vacation in 2016, or you're borrowing again from 2017.  (Borrowing is good, by the way.  It's free and automatic, and ensures you don't waste points.)  If you choose the shorter vacation and you don't happen to use exactly the number of points remaining in 2016, then you're either wasting points or rescuing them into 2017 (for a fee).  Now in 2017 you might make your home week booking, but you're still left with those rescued 2016 points you have to use - and odds are that the reservation you want to make are not going to add up to exactly the number of points you have left, which leaves you in a "waste or borrow" position again.

So, what all of this means is that many people tend to forget about home week entirely and make club reservations most (or all) of the time.  When booking a club reservation, it makes no difference where your points come from.  Whether you're booking at your home resort or not, you are given the same priority and treatment as anyone else making a club reservation.  It's an even playing field.  Thus, unless you are routinely making home week bookings… points are points.


----------



## UWSurfer (Mar 6, 2014)

Within the HGVC system, HGVC Points are the same whether they originate from a Las Vegas, Hawaii, Florida or other HGVC system property.  It's a form of currency used within the system for exchanges.   Hence the saying "Points are Points", "A buck is a buck", "What happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas"....

(Ok, maybe the Vegas saying doesn't apply to HGVC, I'm just saying.):rofl:


----------



## buzglyd (Mar 6, 2014)

tschwa2 said:


> So 7000 points in Hawaii (or anywhere else) will only help you with earlier booking at the exact resort you own at, during your season.  Hawaii points won't make any difference when booking Mexico, or even a different Hawaiian property or even the same property during a different season.  At 9 months points are points.
> 
> Another exception is if you buy points outside of the main resorts in an affiliate resort, they may have different rules about prepaying MF's, etc but at 9 months the actual points will be the same as the same number of points at any other resort in terms of ability to book within the system.



Affiliates don't always work like a regular HGVC resort in some cases (mine at least)

I can already use my 2015 points at my 7000 point Waikoloa Beach Resort.

However, my Seapointe reservation can't be made until 12 months. I own a fixed week 35 (which is odd that I have to make a "reservation" anyway for a fixed week) and I won't be able to get my 2015 points (6200 points) for this week until week 35 of 2014 when I'm 12 months out.

It makes borrowing a little more difficult since my week is so late in the year.


----------



## Kajeda (Mar 6, 2014)

I have a question concerning this topic as well. I've seen HGV resale points listed as Platinum, Gold, Silver and Bronze. I know that this restricts the ability of the owner to book during certain periods of the year. Does this restriction apply only during the "Home Week" period? 

So if I bought resale points (I assume cheaper) on a bronze package, would I have the same shot at making reservations during the Club reservation period vs. someone who had the same amount of platinum points during the Club reservation period?


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 6, 2014)

Kajeda said:


> I have a question concerning this topic as well. I've seen HGV resale points listed as Platinum, Gold, Silver and Bronze. I know that this restricts the ability of the owner to book during certain periods of the year. Does this restriction apply only during the "Home Week" period?
> 
> So if I bought resale points (I assume cheaper) on a bronze package, would I have the same shot at making reservations during the Club reservation period vs. someone who had the same amount of platinum points during the Club reservation period?



Yes true.  But with a bronze package you likely pay a higher MF per point fee than a platinum owners.  

Most of the timeshares have the same MF based on unit size,  well Platinum pays the same for a 2 BR that a Bronze owners does.  But gets significantly more points.  So their MF $ per point is much less.  

So you could both book the same clue season reservation, but it would cost the Bronze package holder a higher MF $, since the MF per Point is higher.


----------



## Tamaradarann (Mar 7, 2014)

*Platinum costs less than Bronze and then some*



Sandy VDH said:


> Yes true.  But with a bronze package you likely pay a higher MF per point fee than a platinum owners.
> 
> Most of the timeshares have the same MF based on unit size,  well Platinum pays the same for a 2 BR that a Bronze owners does.  But gets significantly more points.  So their MF $ per point is much less.
> 
> So you could both book the same clue season reservation, but it would cost the Bronze package holder a higher MF $, since the MF per Point is higher.



I agree with the way you look at it costing more in maintenance fees to make the same reservation owning Bronze than its does owning Platinum.  Another way of looking at it is that if you own a standard 7000 point 2 BR Platinum week you can go on a standard 2 BR Platinum vacation every year.  If you own a standard 2 BR Bronze week you may only be able to go on a 2 BR Platinum vacation about every 3 years, although you could go on a standard 2 Br Bronze week vacation every year if that location and time of the year is desirable.


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 7, 2014)

This is GReat Info ! Many thanks..

Ie... Let say I am getting HGVC 7000 Platinum week in Vegas, can someone tell me by experience if I have a chance of getting something in Mexico (fiesta) with platinum week when Open season starts (like at the 9th month) ? My concern is about the inventory availability from real life owners who has tried. Now that I understand the point = point system


----------



## buzglyd (Mar 7, 2014)

mz3bo said:


> This is GReat Info ! Many thanks..
> 
> Ie... Let say I am getting HGVC 7000 Platinum week in Vegas, can someone tell me by experience if I have a chance of getting something in Mexico (fiesta) with platinum week when Open season starts (like at the 9th month) ? My concern is about the inventory availability from real life owners who has tried. Now that I understand the point = point system



I think you mean Club season?

Open Season is a 30 day window for cash reservations.

Club Season is really good for nearly all resorts. Oahu in prime season is the most difficult at the 9 month window but you can do it if you know exactly what you want and act quickly.


----------



## Kajeda (Mar 7, 2014)

Sandy VDH said:


> Yes true.  But with a bronze package you likely pay a higher MF per point fee than a platinum owners.
> 
> Most of the timeshares have the same MF based on unit size,  well Platinum pays the same for a 2 BR that a Bronze owners does.  But gets significantly more points.  So their MF $ per point is much less.
> 
> So you could both book the same clue season reservation, but it would cost the Bronze package holder a higher MF $, since the MF per Point is higher.



Do the different packages (i.e. Platinum, Gold, Silver, Bronze) have certain maximum points that you can buy in each? For instance, is the Platinum package the only one that allows you to purchase 7000 points or more or can I only purchase 4800 points in a Platinum or Gold package and Silver and Bronze have lower maximum points?

Do you figure the cost of purchasing points into the MF per point cost?


----------



## Tamaradarann (Mar 7, 2014)

*Each Week Points vary by Season*



Kajeda said:


> Do the different packages (i.e. Platinum, Gold, Silver, Bronze) have certain maximum points that you can buy in each? For instance, is the Platinum package the only one that allows you to purchase 7000 points or more or can I only purchase 4800 points in a Platinum or Gold package and Silver and Bronze have lower maximum points?
> 
> Do you figure the cost of purchasing points into the MF per point cost?



Each week's points values vary by Season and Size  from about 1000 points for a Studio Bronze to 28,000 points for a Platinum 3 BR Penthouse.  From memory I don't know the exact point values of each but you can project that Platinum goes from 2200 points for a Studio to 28,000 points for the 3 BR Penthouse and that the point values of Gold, Silver and Bronze is about 70%, 50%, and 35% respective of Platinum for the size of accommodations if available.  I say if available since Silver and Platinum are only available in a few resorts.


----------



## Tamaradarann (Mar 7, 2014)

*The 28,000 3 BR Penthouse at the Grand Waikikian*



Tamaradarann said:


> Each week's points values vary by Season and Size  from about 1000 points for a Studio Bronze to 28,000 points for a Platinum 3 BR Penthouse.  From memory I don't know the exact point values of each but you can project that Platinum goes from 2200 points for a Studio to 28,000 points for the 3 BR Penthouse and that the point values of Gold, Silver and Bronze is about 70%, 50%, and 35% respective of Platinum for the size of accommodations if available.  I say if available since Silver and Platinum are only available in a few resorts.



I just thought again about the statement of 28,000 points for the 3 BR Penthouse which is at the Grand Waikikian, there may be 3 BR Penthouses at other resorts that don't have such high point values since they are not in a premium resort like the Grand Waikikian.


----------



## Ron98GT (Mar 7, 2014)

Tamaradarann said:


> I just thought again about the statement of 28,000 points for the 3 BR Penthouse which is at the Grand Waikikian, there may be 3 BR Penthouses at other resorts that don't have such high point values since they are not in a premium resort like the Grand Waikikian.



Actually, a Platinum week is 28,750 points , but who's counting 

You can get a 3-BR Plus Platinum week in the Lagoon tower for 9,600 points, but it's not a penthouse


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 7, 2014)

Well.. since the type of metal only affect the points by percentage of xxx ... then points are points are just what counts the most...


----------



## Tamaradarann (Mar 7, 2014)

*Thanks for the correction but I hope the message was correct*



Ron98GT said:


> Actually, a Platinum week is 28,750 points , but who's counting
> 
> You can get a 3-BR Plus Platinum week in the Lagoon tower for 9,600 points, but it's not a penthouse


\\

Ron, Thanks for the correction, I hope the message was correct with respect to the points for each metal type.


----------



## alwysonvac (Mar 7, 2014)

Ron98GT said:


> Actually, a Platinum week is 28,750 points , but who's counting
> 
> You can get a 3-BR Plus Platinum week in the Lagoon tower for 9,600 points, but it's not a penthouse



It's a penthouse unit. All of the 3 BR Plus units are all two story penthouse units on the top floor (24th) in the Lagoon Tower.

A 3 bedroom plus can either be a 3 bdrm oceanfront penthouse or 3 bdrm oceanview penthouse (determined by the front desk)
NOTE: I'm assuming HHV owners are assigned the oceanfront units.

See post #4 in this old thread for more info on the penthouse units - http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=132850

From my 2012 photos:


----------



## Seth Nock (Mar 8, 2014)

The 3 bedroom Lagoon Tower can also be Diamond Head View.


----------



## alwysonvac (Mar 8, 2014)

Seth Nock said:


> The 3 bedroom Lagoon Tower can also be Diamond Head View.



Yes, the penthouse rooms facing the rainbow tower can see Diamond Head


----------



## Ron98GT (Mar 8, 2014)

Tamaradarann said:


> \\
> 
> Ron, Thanks for the correction, I hope the message was correct with respect to the points for each metal type.


Not really a correction, just kidding around


----------



## Ron98GT (Mar 8, 2014)

alwysonvac said:


> It's a penthouse unit. All of the 3 BR Plus units are all two story penthouse units on the top floor (24th) in the Lagoon Tower.
> 
> A 3 bedroom plus can either be a 3 bdrm oceanfront penthouse or 3 bdrm oceanview penthouse (determined by the front desk)
> NOTE: I'm assuming HHV owners are assigned the oceanfront units.
> ...


Nice for everyone to know.  In the HGVC Member Guide, they label the Lagoon Tower 3-BR only as a "3 Bedroom Plus".  Whereas they label the Grand Waikikian 3-BR as a "3 BR Penthouse". 

That's what I get for kidding around, get myself in trouble - again


----------



## brp (Mar 8, 2014)

tschwa2 said:


> So 7000 points in Hawaii (or anywhere else) will only help you with earlier booking at the exact resort you own at, during your season.  Hawaii points won't make any difference when booking Mexico, or even a different Hawaiian property or even the same property during a different season.  At 9 months points are points.



The exception to this are the New York properties - Hilton Club and W. 57th St. These are much more limited for people getting in. I think it might not even be possible for W. 57th St. As we own in New York (just bought W. 57th resale and selling HCNY back to Hilton), I don't know the full details of what is, and isn't, possible from the outside, but I do know it's different from other properties.

Cheers.


----------



## Kajeda (Mar 8, 2014)

Sandy VDH said:


> Yes true.  But with a bronze package you likely pay a higher MF per point fee than a platinum owners.
> 
> Most of the timeshares have the same MF based on unit size,  well Platinum pays the same for a 2 BR that a Bronze owners does.  But gets significantly more points.  So their MF $ per point is much less.
> 
> So you could both book the same clue season reservation, but it would cost the Bronze package holder a higher MF $, since the MF per Point is higher.



So then if I were to purchase lets say, 4800 resale points for the LV Flamingo, and I didn't plan on using the Flamingo as my "Home Resort", would there be an advantage to buying Platinum points vs Gold points if the MF costs were identical but the cost of the points were higher for the Platinum points?


----------



## SmithOp (Mar 8, 2014)

Kajeda said:


> So then if I were to purchase lets say, 4800 resale points for the LV Flamingo, and I didn't plan on using the Flamingo as my "Home Resort", would there be an advantage to buying Platinum points vs Gold points if the MF costs were identical but the cost of the points were higher for the Platinum points?



You wouldn't get 4800 points with a gold season, those are platinum 1 br points.  Gold is 3400.

Study the point values, the link is at the bottom of the list on the right.

http://www.hgvclubprogram.com/resort/the-flamingo-las-vegas-nevada/

If you buy a platinum week, you have enough points to stay two weeks in silver season.


----------



## Tamaradarann (Mar 8, 2014)

*1 BR Platinum is 4800 points 1 BR Gold is 3500 Points*



Kajeda said:


> So then if I were to purchase lets say, 4800 resale points for the LV Flamingo, and I didn't plan on using the Flamingo as my "Home Resort", would there be an advantage to buying Platinum points vs Gold points if the MF costs were identical but the cost of the points were higher for the Platinum points?



1 Br Platinum is 4800 points, 1 BR gold is 3500 points.  That is the advantage to paying more for the Platinum Season.  The maintenance fees are identical, buy you get more points each year forever.


----------



## tschwa2 (Mar 9, 2014)

Kajeda said:


> So then if I were to purchase lets say, 4800 resale points for the LV Flamingo, and I didn't plan on using the Flamingo as my "Home Resort", would there be an advantage to buying Platinum points vs Gold points if the MF costs were identical but the cost of the points were higher for the Platinum points?



Perhaps a more appropriate comparison would be a gold 2 br Vegas with 5000 annual points.  The upfront cost may be $2000-$3500 with an annual MF of $900-$1000 depending on the property.  

A platinum 1 br Vegas with 4800 annual points would probably have a higher upfront cost (no comps on ebay so I am not sure what the going price would be) but the MF would be $650-$700.  You would be getting 200 fewer points each year.


----------



## Kajeda (Mar 9, 2014)

Tamaradarann said:


> 1 Br Platinum is 4800 points, 1 BR gold is 3500 points.  That is the advantage to paying more for the Platinum Season.  The maintenance fees are identical, buy you get more points each year forever.



Ok so maybe I'm confused how points work then. Someone correct me if I have this wrong. During the "Home Week", you can only reserve at your Home resort 12-9 months out. Platinum, Gold, Silver, and Bronze seasons determines when you can reserve and how many points it will cost you for a specific room size. 

During the Club reservation period, you can reserve beginning 9 months out and you compete with anyone within the HGV point system. Platinum, Gold, Silver, and Bronze seasons don't matter except for how much it will cost you in points to reserve the size room you want and what it costs at the resort you choose. 

Do I have that correct?


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 9, 2014)

Kajeda said:


> Ok so maybe I'm confused how points work then. Someone correct me if I have this wrong. During the "Home Week", you can only reserve at your Home resort 12-9 months out. Platinum, Gold, Silver, and Bronze seasons determines when you can reserve and how many points it will cost you for a specific room size.
> 
> During the Club reservation period, you can reserve beginning 9 months out and you compete with anyone within the HGV point system. Platinum, Gold, Silver, and Bronze seasons don't matter except for how much it will cost you in points to reserve the size room you want and what it costs at the resort you choose.
> 
> Do I have that correct?



Just for clarity on your first question during Home season.  You can only book what you own.  If you own a platinum 2 BR week, then you can book a platinum week.  If you own platinum 2BR and want to book a Gold 2BR week, you have to wait until the Club season 9 month mark.  Also if you thinking you are wanting to save some points by booking less than a full week, or by booking a smaller unit than what you own you must also only book at the Club season mark. So you have first dibs during home season for the 7 night stay in the exact size of unit and season of unit that you own.

Club season you are ok in your understanding.  I just didn't think you got full clarity on home season.  Maybe it was just how you worded it.


----------



## tschwa2 (Mar 9, 2014)

Sandy VDH said:


> Just for clarity on your first question during Home season.  You can only book what you own.  If you own a platinum 2 BR week, then you can book a platinum week.  If you own platinum 2BR and want to book a Gold 2BR week, you have to wait until the Club season 9 month mark.  Also if you thinking you are wanting to save some points by booking less than a full week, or by booking a smaller unit than what you own you must also only book at the Club season mark. So you have first dibs during home season for the 7 night stay in the exact size of unit and season of unit that you own.
> 
> Club season you are ok in your understanding.  I just didn't think you got full clarity on home season.  Maybe it was just how you worded it.



Quick question- if you own a lock off can you reserve just one portion during home season or reserve the whole thing but then later lock off and only keep half and use the other half as points in the club season?


----------



## Tamaradarann (Mar 9, 2014)

*Value of Season*



Kajeda said:


> Ok so maybe I'm confused how points work then. Someone correct me if I have this wrong. During the "Home Week", you can only reserve at your Home resort 12-9 months out. Platinum, Gold, Silver, and Bronze seasons determines when you can reserve and how many points it will cost you for a specific room size.
> 
> During the Club reservation period, you can reserve beginning 9 months out and you compete with anyone within the HGV point system. Platinum, Gold, Silver, and Bronze seasons don't matter except for how much it will cost you in points to reserve the size room you want and what it costs at the resort you choose.
> 
> Do I have that correct?



Sandy gave you an excellent explanation of the first part of your note concerning the 12-9  month window.  However, I am not sure that the second part of your question indicates the Value of the Season you purchase.  It doesn't cost you more points to reserve at the resort you choose.  You get less points when you purchase Gold, Silver or Bronze.


----------



## Kajeda (Mar 9, 2014)

Sandy VDH said:


> Just for clarity on your first question during Home season.  You can only book what you own.  If you own a platinum 2 BR week, then you can book a platinum week.  If you own platinum 2BR and want to book a Gold 2BR week, you have to wait until the Club season 9 month mark.  Also if you thinking you are wanting to save some points by booking less than a full week, or by booking a smaller unit than what you own you must also only book at the Club season mark. So you have first dibs during home season for the 7 night stay in the exact size of unit and season of unit that you own.
> 
> Club season you are ok in your understanding.  I just didn't think you got full clarity on home season.  Maybe it was just how you worded it.



My understanding is correct, just didn't explain it well. 

So this was my original question.

If I'm in the market for resale points, and I find a Gold season package of 5000 points cheaper than a Platinum package of 4800 points (both point totals would allow me to reserve a Platinum 1BR for 1 week at most resorts during Club season) and the MF is the same, is there any reason not to buy the Gold package points over the Platinum package points if I don't care to reserve time during the Home season at my home resort? 

I hope I finally phrased it clearly. :whoopie:


----------



## Tamaradarann (Mar 9, 2014)

*Yes buy the 5000 Point Gold Package*



Kajeda said:


> My understanding is correct, just didn't explain it well.
> 
> So this was my original question.
> 
> ...



The way you word it, I agree with you buying the 5000 point 2 BR Gold package for less money and the same maintenance as the 4800 point 1 BR Platinum package.  Of course this would have to be at different resorts, but the home resort per your statement is not an issue.  However, for the same maintenance per year you could buy a 7000 point 2 BR package at the resort with the 1BR 4800 point package.  That would be 2000 more points per year forever for the same maintenance.


----------



## Tamaradarann (Mar 9, 2014)

*What is 2000 Points Worth every year?*



Tamaradarann said:


> The way you word it, I agree with you buying the 5000 point 2 BR Gold package for less money and the same maintenance as the 4800 point 1 BR Platinum package.  Of course this would have to be at different resorts, but the home resort per your statement is not an issue.  However, for the same maintenance per year you could buy a 7000 point 2 BR package at the resort with the 1BR 4800 point package.  That would be 2000 more points per year forever for the same maintenance.



What is 2000 points worth?  It is almost enough for 6 nights during Platinum Season in a Studio.  It is 4 extra week days in a 1 BR during Platinum Season.  It is about 9 nights during Gold Season in a Studio.  Just some thoughts on the added value of Platinum.


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 9, 2014)

Hi,

Wow, many answers so far. Now that I understand the idea, can someone help me clarify something.

I understand points are points. Let say I own a vegas 7000pts platinum. Now, when I will want to trade on hilton network, for let say hawaii, would my 7000points vegas be the same as a 7000points Orlando ? What i mean is, do I have more chance of getting week in Hawaii if I own the vegas or the orlando resort ?

Thanks


----------



## SmithOp (Mar 9, 2014)

Kajeda said:


> My understanding is correct, just didn't explain it well.
> 
> So this was my original question.
> 
> ...



You won't find a gold 5000 point (2 br) with same maint fees as a plat 4800 (1br).


----------



## SmithOp (Mar 9, 2014)

mz3bo said:


> Hi,
> 
> Wow, many answers so far. Now that I understand the idea, can someone help me clarify something.
> 
> ...



You are back to the subject of this thread, 7000 points booking at 9 months gets you whatever is available, the underlying resort you own has no bearing.  It's not like RCI or Interval where your deposit has different trade power, with HGVC at 9 months Points are Points!


----------



## presley (Mar 9, 2014)

mz3bo said:


> Hi,
> 
> Wow, many answers so far. Now that I understand the idea, can someone help me clarify something.
> 
> ...





SmithOp said:


> You are back to the subject of this thread, 7000 points booking at 9 months gets you whatever is available, the underlying resort you own has no bearing.  It's not like RCI or Interval where your deposit has different trade power, with HGVC at 9 months Points are Points!



As previously posted, several times, once you reach your 9month window, CLUB SEASON, all points are CLUB POINTS.  At that point, there is no such thing as Hawaii points or Las Vegas points.  We all have CLUB POINTS and it doesn't matter which resort they come from.


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 9, 2014)

presley said:


> As previously posted, several times, once you reach your 9month window, CLUB SEASON, all points are CLUB POINTS.  At that point, there is no such thing as Hawaii points or Las Vegas points.  We all have CLUB POINTS and it doesn't matter which resort they come from.



I understand... but ... who decide if I get the Ts or not in the club season...


----------



## presley (Mar 9, 2014)

mz3bo said:


> I understand... but ... who decide if I get the Ts or not in the club season...



You do.  You can book the day that the 9 month window opens at any resort.  You are in full control of booking.  If you wait, other members may take your desired reservation before you do.


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 10, 2014)

presley said:


> You do.  You can book the day that the 9 month window opens at any resort.  You are in full control of booking.  If you wait, other members may take your desired reservation before you do.



Presley, so it is a Point is Points and first come first serve right ? If it is, does most of HGVC resorts usually has availability on the first day of the 9th month or are they pretty much booked by Home Reservation ? I am mostly 'spotting' resorts in Hawaii and Mexico around the weeks 7-11...

Thanks


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 10, 2014)

presley said:


> You do.  You can book the day that the 9 month window opens at any resort.  You are in full control of booking.  If you wait, other members may take your desired reservation before you do.



One more question, When in a year does the Club and Home reservation start date ? Is it a fexed period year after year ?

Thanks


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 10, 2014)

Oahu is the hardest of the locations to book reservations, specifically the Lagoon and Kalia towers as they are lower point options than GW tower.  But that being said, if you are booking at exactly the first day you are permitted in club season then yes you likely should find what you want. 

Big Island has a lot more availability and they can be booked often well into the club season and often open season. 

I can't comment on Mexico as these units are not available online.  You have to call to obtain this.  I do not know if FA has inventory available exactly at the 9 month mark. 

You might have better success with mexico by making a deposit into SFX and trying to obtain a Grupo Mayan Resort or other resort via SFX.  They have lots of inventory for Mexico.  If I want Mexico this is the route that I take.

Regarding the 9 month club season date.  You need to read the member guide for specific wording, but what happens is that your entire stay needs to be within the 9 month mark, not just the checkin date.  This causes for issues when trying to book a longer stay.  You do run the risk of someone picking off the earlier part of your stay.  I have heard of others paying for a changeable phone reservation, and then calling and changing the reservation to get the extra day added.  This has to be done if there is only the single unit you want available.  

So home is exactly 12 months from your checkout date, and Club is exactly 9 months.  I usually go online and look at what is available now at the 9 month mark.  That give me insight on how the online system treats those dates.  There are a could of anomalies during the year.  Like end of February which has 28 days and 9 months later, which would correspond to the end of November.  I think that on the 28th of feb, the rest of nov dates beyond 28th, also become available. 

Changeable online reservation use the newer revolution system. You have NO choice over this.  Revolution does not look at your current booking when displaying changes to reservations.  So if there is NO additional units to book, you will be forced to call reservation to get the extra day added.  If there are units available, you could just switch a 3 day ressie for a 4 day one.  For very high demand locations like Lagoon Tower this often proves to be an issues.


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 10, 2014)

Hi Sandy,

Ok, if I understand it right, the Home and club reservation start period are all different for everyone that owns a HGVC TS , correct ?

So you are saying that my home period start 12 months as soon as I check out and 9 months is about 90 days after I check out... correct ?

Considering I do not own a HGVC at this time and decide to buy from resale, what determines my Home and club date ?

What happen if one year I decide not booking anything, what are the consequence on the home and club start date ?

Many thanks for your help

Bo





Sandy VDH said:


> Oahu is the hardest of the locations to book reservations, specifically the Lagoon and Kalia towers as they are lower point options than GW tower.  But that being said, if you are booking at exactly the first day you are permitted in club season then yes you likely should find what you want.
> 
> Big Island has a lot more availability and they can be booked often well into the open season.
> 
> ...


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 10, 2014)

mz3bo said:


> Hi Sandy,
> 
> Ok, if I understand it right, the Home and club reservation start period are all different for everyone that owns a HGVC TS , correct ?
> 
> ...



Your not understanding this, or at least I am not thinking you are getting this based on how your phrasing of your statements. 

The 12 months and 9 months windows are not based on your last checkout date, but are 12 and 9 months forward from today.  The catch is that 12 and 9 month forward window have to include the entire duration of your stay, up to your checkout day.  

So let me try this again, with an example.  

Home and club booking window dates have nothing to do with what you OWN, and everything to do with WHEN you want to travel.  WHEN you want to travel  and book something, that DATE dictates the 12 month and 9 month window.  It is a rolling window, not a fixed window. 

The dates are different for every day of the year.  Your use year is based on ownership, what year you use the point from is based on ownership. You either use the points to book something in your use year, or you pay to rescue them (during the current use year into the next use year), or your borrow them for free (from a future use year), or you pay to deposit them (prior to the start of a use year, into the next use year).  Rescue and Deposit come with a cost.  Borrowing is always free.

You are confusing use year, with booking window.  Two different things.  Use year in HGVC is always a calendar year.  Booking windows, well with 365 days in a year, there are 365 different dates, depending on the dates you want to book.  

HOME resort booking window opens at the 12 month mark for 3 a month period, thus allowing owners at that resort first dibs on booking what exactly they own at their resort.  So lets say if I own in Hawaii, and I wanted to book March 3rd, 2015 for a week stay in what I owned.  I could that today.  I'd be using my 2015 points to do it.   You can only use regular points for HOME resort bookings, you can't use Rescued or Deposited points.  So I would have to use next years points during home season.  If I had point remaining for this year but did  NOT intend to use them this year, then I'd have to rescue them and pay for that option.

You only have 1 HOME opportunity to book a week for each week you own in HGVC.  Obviously you can't use the same home priority twice in the same year, because you will use those points up when you book the home week.

If I wanted to book Hawaii during CLUB season, and you have 2014 points remaining or you want to borrow from 2015 (and you don't need your home priority for next year), today I would be able to book a stay from now to a check out of Dec 10, 2014, obviously provided there is availability.  Right now there is availability during the first 10 days of December.

I think you need to read (or reread) through the new files that explain HGVC that just got posted.


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 10, 2014)

Sandy VDH said:


> Your not understanding this, or at least I am not thinking you are getting this based on how your phrasing of your statements.
> 
> The 12 months and 9 months windows are not based on your last checkout date, but are 12 and 9 months forward from today.  The catch is that 12 and 9 month forward window have to include the entire duration of your stay, up to your checkout day.
> 
> ...



Sandy,

With your answer, I now totally understand what you are trying to explain. :

How much does it cost rescue or or deposit ? And how long does the deposit points stay in bank ?

Thanks


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 10, 2014)

mz3bo said:


> Sandy,
> 
> With your answer, I now totally understand what you are trying to explain. :
> 
> ...



Wow, I just looked and it went way up.  It was $49 and now it is $76 transaction fee to deposit or rescue.  They are good for one additional use year. 

I do think I heard, but I have not tried myself that you could deposit points one year into the next year.  Then the next year you could rescue them for an additional use year.  There would be a transaction charge each year, but it sounds like it could be done.  

From a fee perspective it is far cheaper to allows be in a borrow position and not in a rescue or deposit position.


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 10, 2014)

Sandy VDH said:


> Wow, I just looked and it went way up.  It was $49 and now it is $76 transaction fee to deposit or rescue.



Ok, My understanding:

I have 7000 points in hand for 2014. I decide I go to a 4800 points resort in 2014, this leaves me 2200 points unused. In 2015, I go to somewhere that cost me 12 000 points. I take the 7000 and rescue 2200 and borrow 2800 from 2016. Is that right ? And for doind this, it will cost me 76$ ? Does it impact my MF as well since I did not used all the points ?

Can I buy points ? If yes, how much are they ?

I also understand that as soon as I borrow points, I fall out of my HOME period...

Thanks


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 10, 2014)

mz3bo said:


> Ok, My understanding:
> 
> I have 7000 points in hand for 2014. I decide I go to a 4800 points resort in 2014, this leaves me 2200 points unused. In 2015, I go to somewhere that cost me 12 000 points. I take the 7000 and rescue 2200 and borrow 2800 from 2016. Is that right ? And for doind this, it will cost me 76$ ? Does it impact my MF as well since I did not used all the points ?
> 
> ...



Yes that is correct in your understanding of your scenario.  You could rescue and borrow points and use them in the same transactions.  Actually the HGVC site automatically uses rescue points first, then regular points, then borrows points.  It is smart enough to do that. Oh do note that you will have to pay to rescue $76 and you will also have to pay for a reservation $49.  

Just note you must rescue before the points expire at the end of the use year. 

You pay your MFs at the end of the year for the next year.  For all HGVC specific built resorts you can borrow from next year without having to prepay your MFs, provided you are in good standing (all your MFs are current and paid).  I own at an affiliate (Bay Club) that forces you to pay an estimate of your next year MFs first, then they make the points available for you and then you can borrow.  So for most resorts, you pay your MFs on a schedule, regardless on when you use the underlying points (with some resort exceptions).

No HGVC had no mechanism to rent any additional points in a single year.  (Wyndham for example does offer this option, but HGVC does not).  The only way to do this is to purchase more point contracts.  

Correct, as soon as you borrow you give up your home priority option.

I think you are getting there.  Did you read the new HGVC reference materials that just got upgraded?


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 10, 2014)

Sandy,

I think I understand HGVC a lot more than a few days ago from all members help and particularly yours. I think I understand the basic about exchanging inside HGVC system, all the points etc...

Now, since inside HGVC, points are points, RCI is something else I guess.

I understand that Hilton has set specific points for RCI requirements and because I own a HGVC, I have access to Everything on RCI. Now, within Hilton exchange, desirability of a resort is not very important as points are points and you get to book what's available ( it is not really exchanging) , on a first come first serve basis. 

My concern now about RCI, I guess someone has to deposit their week in order for me to ''exchange'' with them. So I if I am not wrong, desirability of my resort is now really important on RCI, not only points... am I right ? 

Bo





Sandy VDH said:


> Yes that is correct in your understanding of your scenario.  You could rescue and borrow points and use them in the same transactions.  Actually the HGVC site automatically uses rescue points first, then regular points, then borrows points.  It is smart enough to do that. Oh do note that you will have to pay to rescue $76 and you will also have to pay for a reservation $49.
> 
> Just note you must rescue before the points expire at the end of the use year.
> 
> ...


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 10, 2014)

mz3bo said:


> Sandy,
> 
> I think I understand HGVC a lot more than a few days ago from all members help and particularly yours. I think I understand the basic about exchanging inside HGVC system, all the points etc...
> 
> ...



Yes HGVC points requirements are a fixed grid in RCI, always.  Which is not a plus for last minute bookings, but is fine for a lot of other bookings.  It is especially a good deal on some studio units in high demand places.  

Your are incorrect in your statement that you have access to all in RCI.  Actually HGVC limits you to better quality resorts, so you have a subset of the better resorts, and a filter to remove the lower quality resorts. 

You are correct in that RCI is going to be a supply issue.  You can't get what is not available.  Harder locations I would always suggest to be flexible and start an ongoing search in RCI.  You have a better chance of getting what you want that way.  But you are incorrect in that you must have desirability in your home resort.  HGVC has an odd arrangement with RCI, and it is not really a demand aspect, obvious not since the points requirements never change, they are always the fixed grid.  So with HGVC you get a very high trade priority, but you still can't get an exchange if the resort is never deposited. It does not matter where you own, HGVC as a group gets the same demand, priority and points regardless of actual property ownership.


----------



## UWSurfer (Mar 10, 2014)

Sandy VDH said:


> Your are incorrect in your statement that you have access to all in RCI.  Actually HGVC limits you to better quality resorts, so you have a subset of the better resorts, and a filter to remove the lower quality resorts.
> 
> You are correct in that RCI is going to be a supply issue.  *You can't get what is not available.*  Harder locations I would always suggest to be flexible and start an ongoing search in RCI. .



But I WANT the system where I CAN get what's not available.


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 10, 2014)

UWSurfer said:


> But I WANT the system where I CAN get what's not available.



Don't we all.


----------



## mz3bo (Mar 10, 2014)

Sandy VDH said:


> Don't we all.



I am on the resale market and I was wondering something. Some timeshare, like the HGVC Flamingo, are sold as Platinum but also has a specific week. The ads says - Flamingo 7000pts bla bla bla Platinum, Red, Week 13 ...

My understanding is that Platinum is a timeframe from a certain week to another, then why do they mention the exact week ?

Bo


----------



## SmithOp (Mar 10, 2014)

It's just for deeding and inventory purposes, some may list a week or unit number. Some may be event weeks, deeded for 51 or 52.

http://www.hgvclubprogram.com/content/2014-HGVClub-Seasons-Chart.pdf


----------



## csxjohn (Mar 11, 2014)

UWSurfer said:


> But I WANT the system where I CAN get what's not available.



How crazy is it that a filter is put in place that assumes you won't want certain resorts and doesn't let you see them?


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 11, 2014)

csxjohn said:


> How crazy is it that a filter is put in place that assumes you won't want certain resorts and doesn't let you see them?



I think that early in their shared history, HGVC put people into RCI exchanges then got all kinds of calls and complaints about how some of these resorts were substandard to the HGVC quality of resort. 

So at some point they put a quality filter on and don't even show you less quality resorts.  How they determine that, other than Gold crown or other designations, or perhaps via review ratings provided by guests. 

It is not a bad idea, except when the one place you need to get to only offers a lesser quality resort.  In that case if you ask, they might arrange the trade, but they will warn you if you are unhappy, there is no recourse with RCI and HGVC.


----------



## Ron98GT (Mar 11, 2014)

csxjohn said:


> How crazy is it that a filter is put in place that assumes you won't want certain resorts and doesn't let you see them?


My 1st TS is/was the Grandview in Las Vegas, 80K annual RCI Points.  The HGVC TS's in RCI are by far the best TS's in RCI. For the most part, most of the TS's in RCI are dump's, which do not match the quality of HGVC. I have been primarily using my RCI Points to exchange for HGVC TS's and to get the Jockey Club on the Las Vegas Strip over New Years (got a 2-BR for 2014/2015 ).

I currently own a Marriott TS (II) and a HGVC TS (RCI).  I use the Marriott to exchange for other Marriott's and for Weston's. I use the HGVC exclusively for other HGVC properties.  The Marriott's, Weston's, and HGVC's, far surpass anything else in RCI.

So, my point is that I don't thing I'd be interested in any of the properties that HGVC doesn't allow me to see in RCI.  I can already see them using my RCI Points account and I'm not interested.


----------



## csxjohn (Mar 11, 2014)

Ron98GT said:


> My 1st TS is/was the Grandview in Las Vegas, 80K annual RCI Points.  The HGVC TS's in RCI are by far the best TS's in RCI. For the most part, most of the TS's in RCI are dump's, which do not match the quality of HGVC. I have been primarily using my RCI Points to exchange for HGVC TS's and to get the Jockey Club on the Las Vegas Strip over New Years (got a 2-BR for 2014/2015 ).
> 
> I currently own a Marriott TS (II) and a HGVC TS (RCI).  I use the Marriott to exchange for other Marriott's and for Weston's. I use the HGVC exclusively for other HGVC properties.  The Marriott's, Weston's, and HGVC's, far surpass anything else in RCI.
> 
> So, my point is that I don't thing I'd be interested in any of the properties that HGVC doesn't allow me to see in RCI.  I can already see them using my RCI Points account and I'm not interested.



You might not be interested but others like me might be.

If I want to go to an area for a vaca,  I would like to see all the resorts the exchange company has available so I can make a choice on exact location and things of that nature.  I can then check out the resorts to see it they'd be suitable to me.

I don't need some computer to decide those things for me and possibly eliminate a resort that might be perfect for me that particular week.


----------



## presley (Mar 11, 2014)

csxjohn said:


> If I want to go to an area for a vaca,  I would like to see all the resorts the exchange company has available so I can make a choice on exact location and things of that nature.  I can then check out the resorts to see it they'd be suitable to me.
> 
> I don't need some computer to decide those things for me and possibly eliminate a resort that might be perfect for me that particular week.



One resort that is filtered out that I wish wasn't is Dolphin's cove in Anaheim.  I prefer it over Peacock Suites, but they show Peacock Suites.  I'd use my shell points for Peacock if I were desperate, but I'd never use HGVC points for it.The only other TSs in that area are WM Anaheim and Disney's California Grand.  Both of those don't show up in RCI often.  Since Hilton blocks Dolphin's cove, I can't count on a trade to Anaheim.


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 11, 2014)

presley said:


> One resort that is filtered out that I wish wasn't is Dolphin's cove in Anaheim.  I prefer it over Peacock Suites, but they show Peacock Suites.  I'd use my shell points for Peacock if I were desperate, but I'd never use HGVC points for it.The only other TSs in that area are WM Anaheim and Disney's California Grand.  Both of those don't show up in RCI often.  Since Hilton blocks Dolphin's cove, I can't count on a trade to Anaheim.



You can request an override if a unit at Dolphins cove is available.  It would require a phone call.  But I have heard of others having the filter lifted if you specifically request it.


----------



## csxjohn (Mar 11, 2014)

presley said:


> One resort that is filtered out that I wish wasn't is Dolphin's cove in Anaheim.  I prefer it over Peacock Suites, but they show Peacock Suites.  I'd use my shell points for Peacock if I were desperate, but I'd never use HGVC points for it.The only other TSs in that area are WM Anaheim and Disney's California Grand.  Both of those don't show up in RCI often.  Since Hilton blocks Dolphin's cove, I can't count on a trade to Anaheim.



This is exactly what I'm talking about.  I don't see how this is helping members.


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 11, 2014)

csxjohn, do you even own a HGVC, I don't think you do?  If not why does it bother you so much, if it does not impact you, and there is a work around?


----------



## csxjohn (Mar 11, 2014)

Sandy VDH said:


> csxjohn, do you even own a HGVC, I don't think you do?  If not why does it bother you so much, if it does not impact you, and there is a work around?



I thought this was a public forum and I try to learn as much as I can about all the systems I can.

It will impact me on the decisions I make on future TS purchases.


----------



## Sandy VDH (Mar 11, 2014)

csxjohn said:


> I thought this was a public forum and I try to learn as much as I can about all the systems I can.
> 
> It will impact me on the decisions I make on future TS purchases.



It is a public forum.  But there is a work around, albeit, it requires a phone call.


----------



## csxjohn (Mar 11, 2014)

Sandy VDH said:


> It is a public forum.  But there is a work around, albeit, it requires a phone call.



I was typing my post #63 when you posted about the work around.  I never saw it until now, and now I understand your question to me.

It's good to see the filter can be lifted, this helps, thanks for the info.


----------

