# no good deed goes unpunished



## Sandy VDH (Jan 12, 2017)

I think I will stick to TUG.  I was out on Wyndham FB group and offered my opinion on valuation of points and use for airlines tickets etc.  Best use of points, blah, blah blah.  You know the drill.

I got a post "Scold much".   

OK, guess you don't need my opinion and advice over there.  

I will stick to TUG.  Love you crazy bunch.  We can agree to disagree, but I don't think I have ever been told I was scolding someone.


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## am1 (Jan 12, 2017)

What Facebook group that?  The one I was blocked from for offering the truth a few years back? 




Sandy VDH said:


> I think I will stick to TUG.  I was out on Wyndham FB group and offered my opinion on valuation of points and use for airlines tickets etc.  Best use of points, blah, blah blah.  You know the drill.
> 
> I got a post "Scold much".
> 
> ...


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## nicemann (Jan 12, 2017)

Sandy VDH said:


> I think I will stick to TUG.  I was out on Wyndham FB group and offered my opinion on valuation of points and use for airlines tickets etc.  Best use of points, blah, blah blah.  You know the drill.
> 
> I got a post "Scold much".
> 
> ...



Some people will always think they are right no matter what.  Help who you can and don't let the others get you down.


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## Passepartout (Jan 12, 2017)

nicemann said:


> Some people will always think they are right no matter what.


Boy if that doesn't tick off those of us who are.


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## Sandy VDH (Jan 12, 2017)

am1 said:


> What Facebook group that?  The one I was blocked from for offering the truth a few years back?



Could be, the group does have the rose colored glasses trend. 



nicemann said:


> Some people will always think they are right no matter what.  Help who you can and don't let the others get you down.



Yeah, will I will help those on TUG that want helping.  They do not want help over there.


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## wjappraise (Jan 12, 2017)

Sandy VDH said:


> I will stick to TUG.  Love you crazy bunch.  We can agree to disagree, but I don't think I have ever been told I was scolding someone.



Awesome.  We may be a collection of nerds, geeks, and trolls, but we are your nerds, geeks, and trolls.  

BTW - Interesting typo for the Posting header, "dead" instead of "deed".  I hope you don't think I am "scolding" you by pointing that out.  If so, I will stay away from the FB group.


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## Ty1on (Jan 12, 2017)

Sandy VDH said:


> I think I will stick to TUG.  I was out on Wyndham FB group and offered my opinion on valuation of points and use for airlines tickets etc.  Best use of points, blah, blah blah.  You know the drill.
> 
> I got a post "Scold much".
> 
> ...



They like to delete posts over there from anyone who really knows what they're talking about, too.


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## Sandy VDH (Jan 12, 2017)

wjappraise said:


> Awesome.  We may be a collection of nerds, geeks, and trolls, but we are your nerds, geeks, and trolls.
> 
> BTW - Interesting typo for the Posting header, "dead" instead of "deed".  I hope you don't think I am "scolding" you by pointing that out.  If so, I will stay away from the FB group.



Didn't even notice.  I am dead over there.  So now I am just good deed over here.


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## raygo123 (Jan 12, 2017)

Sandy VDH said:


> I think I will stick to TUG.  I was out on Wyndham FB group and offered my opinion on valuation of points and use for airlines tickets etc.  Best use of points, blah, blah blah.  You know the drill.
> 
> I got a post "Scold much".
> 
> ...


You attacked an old man, ha ha.  I read that.

In the land of the blind the one eyed man is king.  Unless you go on that page where lignorance is bliss 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk


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## Sandy VDH (Jan 12, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> You attacked an old man, ha ha.  I read that.
> 
> In the land of the blind the one eyed man is king.  Unless you go on that page where lignorance is bliss
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



If that was an attack, that was weak.

Who thought that using 500K points for a sea sju roundtrip airline ticket was a good use of his points.  NOT ME.  I suggested better ways to get some return on his MF $.  More power to him, let him and other do what they want.


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## raygo123 (Jan 12, 2017)

His trusted salesman saved the day by telling them that they could do that.  Why would the salesman tell him that if it wasn't a good idea?

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## 55plus (Jan 12, 2017)

Sandy VDH said:


> I think I will stick to TUG.  I was out on Wyndham FB group and offered my opinion on valuation of points and use for airlines tickets etc.  Best use of points, blah, blah blah.  You know the drill.
> 
> I got a post "Scold much".
> 
> OK, guess you don't need my opinion and advice over there.



Maybe Wyndham runs that Facebook page and don't want the truth to get out. . .


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## raygo123 (Jan 12, 2017)

morrisjim said:


> Maybe Wyndham runs that Facebook page and don't want the truth to get out. . .


Wes McLaughlin runs it.  You could be right except it wasn't him, it was a bunch of plain old wyndham owners.

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## ronparise (Jan 12, 2017)

It's been a while but I was tossed out of a Facebook group. I think because I refused to work with the founder of the group on rentals.  He wanted me to raise my prices to match his. I refused and next thing I knew I was tossed out


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## raygo123 (Jan 12, 2017)

ronparise said:


> It's been a while but I was tossed out of a Facebook group. I think because I refused to work with the founder of the group on rentals.  He wanted me to raise my prices to match his. I refused and next thing I knew I was tossed out


Sounds like you got the right place.  I questioned the for sale by owner prices and he refused to post it.there was one for $50,000 because that's what he paid for it.

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## am1 (Jan 12, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> Wes McLaughlin runs it.  You could be right except it wasn't him, it was a bunch of plain old wyndham owners.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



Yes that is the ****** who blocked me from the group for being too hard on Wyndham.


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## TUGBrian (Jan 12, 2017)

im sure many of those sites are a great place for owners who dont actually want help or advice, but instead want to be reminded that their ownership is all sunshine and roses!


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## Sandy VDH (Jan 12, 2017)

TUGBrian said:


> im sure many of those sites are a great place for owners who dont actually want help or advice, but instead want to be reminded that their ownership is all sunshine and roses!



exactly


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## raygo123 (Jan 12, 2017)

Absolutely, that site is very social.  Who stayed where, when and what to do.  It's about the vacation more than the transaction.

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## 55plus (Jan 12, 2017)

TUGBrian said:


> im sure many of those sites are a great place for owners who dont actually want help or advice, but instead want to be reminded that their ownership is all sunshine and roses!



I consider TUG to be like Fox News - meaning Fair and Balanced. I watch Fox News; I read TUG. . .


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## ronparise (Jan 12, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> Sounds like you got the right place.  I questioned the for sale by owner prices and he refused to post it.there was one for $50,000 because that's what he paid for it.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



Yep. Re reading the posts in this thread I see the name.   That's the guy and the group


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## rapmarks (Jan 12, 2017)

Omg there is a bluegreen resort addicts page and no negativity allowed at all


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## TUGBrian (Jan 12, 2017)

there are a few like that, its extremely frustrating to watch people post that they "just bought BG for XXXXX dollars"...and the not only no mention of rescission and resale...but actual deleting of posts and banning of folks who do mention it to them.


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## enutts (Jan 12, 2017)

Sounds like they are being ran by the companies


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## spackler (Jan 12, 2017)

Which FB page is this?  There seems to be a lot of Wyndham ones.


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## raygo123 (Jan 12, 2017)

spackler said:


> Which FB page is this?  There seems to be a lot of Wyndham ones.


Wyndham timeshare users group.  

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
Based on how many people come to this site and ask should I rescind, I have not seen one on that site.  So it must be run by Wyndham.


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## am1 (Jan 12, 2017)

Legal or not that name looks very similar to another timeshare groups name.


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## Dill (Jan 12, 2017)

I've seen people attacked here for having the nerve to suggest they were happy they paid the extra to get VIP benefits. Some sites attract positive attitudes.. some are geared more toward negative. To each his own.

And here is where I get attacked....


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## Icc5 (Jan 12, 2017)

I don't know about that group in particular but so many people want others to say what they want to hear.  When any money is involved many people want to be told they are smart or good as they lose all there money.  Sometimes of like gamblers that always say what they won and they never seem to lose.
Same thing with stocks.  You hear what went great but don't ever bring up a bad pick.
I also see this with people on the Nextdoor app. that block you or complain if you don't agree with them.  Same people try turning the group against you because they don't know how discuss a difference of opinion.  Now don't argue with me, just admit I'm right


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## dioxide45 (Jan 12, 2017)

Dill said:


> I've seen people attacked here for having the nerve to suggest they were happy they paid the extra to get VIP benefits. Some sites attract positive attitudes.. some are geared more toward negative. To each his own.
> 
> And here is where I get attacked....


I am wondering where and when you were attacked? You have 18 posts and I looked through some of the threads and don't see anyone attacking you. There are rules here against personal attacks.

I think it might perhaps be perception. If someone is hearing something they don't want to hear, they see it as an attack. I don't think that is necessarily the case. I would rather someone be honest with me than tell me some fluff because it agrees with my way of thinking. I am always looking to get the most value out of my timeshare use and TUG has helped me to do that. That isn't what everyone is looking to get from timeshare though, so that is fine too.


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## TUGBrian (Jan 12, 2017)

there are a number of them that have included "timeshare users group" in their names to attract the unsuspecting....

as far as im concerned, if owners are going SOMEWHERE to share info and get help from other owners, its fine by me.   just a shame when folks get misdirected to a place where they will get bad advice...or have good advice censored.


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## TUGBrian (Jan 12, 2017)

its rare that someone gets "attacked" on TUG, not that it doesnt happen...but its usually taken care of the moment its reported...however I will say that the definition of "attacked" varies GREATLY from person to person...and ive seen 1000x worse on other sites.

most discussions only ever follow down that path when someone continues to argue a point that "the masses" generally know to be false...a great example of this is the "value" of vip or travelshare in making ones decision to buy resale vs retail but for most folks (especially here on TUG)...those features are simply not worth the premium price....but to a select few they are...on top of that some folks simply dont want to be told (or admit) that they paid way too much for something despite all evidence to the contrary.

in a case where said person is already ashamed (or whatever you want to label it) and just came here looking for help....youll find replies are sympathetic and genuinely helpful in directing them how best to utilize their ownership.

in cases where the person continues to argue or try to defend their purchase (or whatever the dissenting opinion/stance may be), or tries to convince everyone they are wrong...youll find a bit of pushback from the community....but it still should be done within the confines of the "be courteous" rule...and if not...moderators always step in.


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## CO skier (Jan 12, 2017)

TUGBrian said:


> ....but it still should be done within the confines of the "be courteous" rule...and if not...moderators always step in.


Fortunately, moderators offer a very broad interpretation of "courteous" in the Wyndham forum.  A literal interpretation would make for some very bland postings, and might have led to the end of a perfectly good thread at the mere mention of "genitals" or "Communists", among other base references.


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## Dill (Jan 12, 2017)

dioxide45 said:


> I am wondering where and when you were attacked? You have 18 posts and I looked through some of the threads and don't see anyone attacking you. There are rules here against personal attacks.
> 
> I think it might perhaps be perception. If someone is hearing something they don't want to hear, they see it as an attack. I don't think that is necessarily the case. I would rather someone be honest with me than tell me some fluff because it agrees with my way of thinking. I am always looking to get the most value out of my timeshare use and TUG has helped me to do that. That isn't what everyone is looking to get from timeshare though, so that is fine too.




I never said I was attacked but that's because I watch and rarely post. This is a good site and gives good information I don't doubt that but it has a very negative tone. I can say that on the few occasions people have strayed to far from the "Anti-wyndham" side it's made very clear they don't belong here. Again message boards  and facebook groups are a direct reflection of their members. Eventually it attracts and pushes away members until it finds it's place. some are positive some are negative. This one is just negative. And really I shouldn't say negative that's not the right term. It's just a very "fiscally oriented" site.


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## dioxide45 (Jan 12, 2017)

Dill said:


> I never said I was attacked but that's because I watch and rarely post. This is a good site and gives good information I don't doubt that but it has a very negative tone. I can say that on the few occasions people have strayed to far from the "Anti-wyndham" side it's made very clear they don't belong here. Again message boards  and facebook groups are a direct reflection of their members. Eventually it attracts and pushes away members until it finds it's place. some are positive some are negative. This one is just negative. And really I shouldn't say negative that's not the right term. It's just a very "fiscally oriented" site.


You did say, 





Dill said:


> And here is where I get attacked....


Or were you purporting that you would be attacked after that comment?

Either case, I would agree. This does seem to be a more fiscally oriented site. Kind of like people who use coupons vs those that don't. Neither seems to ever understand the other person's way of thinking.

I am not one to use points for a cruise or airfare as it generally isn't the best use of a timeshare. There are others that see the MF as sunk money and would rather spend the currency from their timeshare than to save it for its best value and then just pay cash for the cruise or airfare.


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## CO skier (Jan 12, 2017)

Dill said:


> I've seen people attacked here for having the nerve to suggest they were happy they paid the extra to get VIP benefits.


Ignore them.

Use your ownership for what fits you.  Be happy, and take pleasure in your ownership.


FYI- Some of the "attackers" may be experienced owners who are trying to help other owners make the most of their ownership.  The problem may lie in the perception.


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## Richelle (Jan 12, 2017)

It's also difficult to determine someone's tone over text. Most of the time, you have to use your best judgment. For someone who generally has a negative disposition, or tends to get pushed around, it would be easy for them to think people were attacking them when they are just trying to help. I try to use the emojis sparingly so people know I'm joking and don't misunderstand me. Just to be clear, my comment is general in nature, and not directed to any one person.  I have not really seen anyone attack anyone. It's a good forum with good people. 


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## Ty1on (Jan 12, 2017)

I think we need to examine the difference between a debate and an attack.  I've debated Ron Parise on some issues, and I hope he hasn't taken it as an attack.


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## raygo123 (Jan 12, 2017)

Richelle said:


> It's also difficult to determine someone's tone over text. Most of the time, you have to use your best judgment. For someone who generally has a negative disposition, or tends to get pushed around, it would be easy for them to think people were attacking them when they are just trying to help. I try to use the emojis sparingly so people know I'm joking and don't misunderstand me. Just to be clear, my comment is general in nature, and not directed to any one person.  I have not really seen anyone attack anyone. It's a good forum with good people.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Nope!  It them and that site.  It's a bunch of little groups of people.  Facebook friends.  


Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk


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## CO skier (Jan 12, 2017)

Ty1on said:


> I think we need to examine the difference between a debate and an attack.  I've debated Ron Parise on some issues, and I hope he hasn't taken it as an attack.


I think that is reserved for a very few successful debaters.


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## Ty1on (Jan 12, 2017)

CO skier said:


> I think that is reserved for a very few successful debaters.



hahahaha I hope he doesn't feel attacked by you either, but simply strongly at opposition in views


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## ronparise (Jan 12, 2017)

Ty1on said:


> I think we need to examine the difference between a debate and an attack.  I've debated Ron Parise on some issues, and I hope he hasn't taken it as an attack.



I look at every exchange here as a learning experience. Sometimes I'm the student and sometimes the teacher

So no , I don't take offense at much

To the perception of negativity....
i don't get it. Of course I'm one of those that see value in negative thinking. I generally "hope for the best but plan for the worst". I don't see anything wrong with taking a look at the dark side


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## ronparise (Jan 13, 2017)

CO skier said:


> I think that is reserved for a very few successful debaters.



I don't see much here as debate, as I said above, Every interaction is a learning experience and i have definitely learned from you.


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## TUGBrian (Jan 13, 2017)

some people take being told they are wrong as offensive or otherwise an attack...some people take it and learn from it (assuming they are actually wrong that is)....its just human nature when you have literally thousands of different people all interacting anonymously.

what 50 people might take as a perfectly normal comment, might be offensive and or insulting to 50 others (or just one other for that matter).

fact is timeshares are an extremely polarizing topic, very few want to admit to ever making a mistake, paying too much, falling for a lie, etc etc....and few others want to be reminded of it regularly =)


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## CO skier (Jan 13, 2017)

ronparise said:


> I look at every exchange here as a learning experience. Sometimes I'm the student and sometimes the teacher
> 
> So no , I don't take offense at much


Likewise.

I do not take offense at anything, or anyone's point of view.

But if their point of view is skewed ...

I will not hesitate to offer alternative points of view.


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## uscav8r (Jan 13, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> Wes McLaughlin runs it.  You could be right except it wasn't him, it was a bunch of plain old wyndham owners.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk





raygo123 said:


> Wyndham timeshare users group.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
> Based on how many people come to this site and ask should I rescind, I have not seen one on that site.  So it must be run by Wyndham.



Let's just call that site what it is: a Wyndham "safe space."


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## am1 (Jan 13, 2017)

uscav8r said:


> Let's just call that site what it is: a Wyndham "safe space."
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Not very inclusive either.  So I guess you are right.


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## John_and_Val (Jan 13, 2017)

But does that site offer any "good" information? I mean, besides all the talk about resale and renting, this website is one (if not "the") most educating website available. Not only do we tell people to "read the book", we inform one another of our learning experiences with the "system". Well worth its weight in gold, compared to how many places I've stayed or who owns what. If you don't increase your knowledge with the Wyndham way, you will never maximize your ownership.....whether resale or company bought.


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## raygo123 (Jan 13, 2017)

There are a few on the site that have visited tug.  And it is brought up from time to time.  It's hilarious, the other folks are amazed at their knowledge of wyndham.  And a couple are the mother hens of the group.  Like a higherarcy.  Kinda funny.  It's like a play.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk


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## Ty1on (Jan 13, 2017)

John_and_Val said:


> But does that site offer any "good" information? I mean, besides all the talk about resale and renting, this website is one (if not "the") most educating website available. Not only do we tell people to "read the book", we inform one another of our learning experiences with the "system". Well worth its weight in gold, compared to how many places I've stayed or who owns what. If you don't increase your knowledge with the Wyndham way, you will never maximize your ownership.....whether resale or company bought.



The FB page is ALL about how many places I've stayed or who owns what.  Or where is the nearest grocery store to Bonnet Creek.  Because, as we all know, there are no mapping sites out there.

They don't need TUG to increase their knowledge.  That's what they have salesmen for!


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## ronparise (Jan 13, 2017)

Dill said:


> I've seen people attacked here for having the nerve to suggest they were happy they paid the extra to get VIP benefits. Some sites attract positive attitudes.. some are geared more toward negative. To each his own.
> 
> And here is where I get attacked....




If someone asks "did I get a good deal buying 105000 points from wyndham for $20000" and I say "no, given that the same thing could be had on ebay for $500, thats not a good deal" you ought to rescind

Or if someone asks "does it make sense to pay $150000+ to buy a Platinum membership, and I say "Platinum benefits are great, but not worth $150000, and more than that you can buy more points and get the same number of reservations for less than $10000  on the secondary market"... and then I go on to do the math showing that even paying the increased maintenance fees (on 2 million pts resale vs 1 million retail) you still do so much better

So if I say these things, am I attacking the guy that asked the question?  I might even say that they made a stupid financial decision.... Is that an attack?...   or is it negative?   I dont think so.. Im speaking to the decision (and it was stupid) not the decision maker and Im using that decision to help others... at least thats my intent


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## CruiseGuy (Jan 13, 2017)

Yes, but there are those on that page that maintain that it can be a good decision to buy retail given the perks from Wyndham, especially those who have various VIP status and maintain that the discounts they get are worth the additional price they paid.  They don't get that almost no one will ever be able to justify the increased cost with VIP discounts at retail price verus resale costs on personal use basis.  There's a couple who will never be convinced, or they cannot bear to think that they may have made a poor decision.  So they have a lot of negative things to say about those who speak up in favor of resale.  The sad thing is that this misleads others into thinking that a retail purchase may be a wise decision when it's probably not.


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## ronparise (Jan 13, 2017)

CruiseGuy said:


> Yes, but there are those on that page that maintain that it can be a good decision to buy retail given the perks from Wyndham, especially those who have various VIP status and maintain that the discounts they get are worth the additional price they paid.  They don't get that almost no one will ever be able to justify the increased cost with VIP discounts at retail price verus resale costs on personal use basis.  There's a couple who will never be convinced, or they cannot bear to think that they may have made a poor decision.  So they have a lot of negative things to say about those who speak up in favor of resale.  The sad thing is that this misleads others into thinking that a retail purchase may be a wise decision when it's probably not.




Thats why I am so vocal on the subject... Its for the guy that might be convinced by a VIP owner that buying VIP for himself might be a good idea


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## raygo123 (Jan 13, 2017)

ronparise said:


> Thats why I am so vocal on the subject... Its for the guy that might be convinced by a VIP owner that buying VIP for himself might be a good idea


Maybe we should all go on the site and stir it up a bit

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk


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## wjappraise (Jan 13, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> Maybe we should all go on the site and stir it up a bit
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



Let's do it.  For our friend Sandy VDH.   


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## raygo123 (Jan 13, 2017)

wjappraise said:


> Let's do it.  For our friend Sandy VDH.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Be nice the first time, you have o be approved by Wes Laughton, 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk


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## DeniseM (Jan 13, 2017)

Wes is a TUG member, and has very likely read every post in this thread, so I doubt if you can blind-side him, and besides, what is the point?


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## wjappraise (Jan 13, 2017)

DeniseM said:


> Wes is a TUG member, and has very likely read every post in this thread, so I doubt if you can blind-side him, and besides, what is the point?



I was joking. 
And you are correct, sometimes "ignorance is bliss," but it is still ignorance, and the bliss is short lived. 

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## Ty1on (Jan 13, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> Maybe we should all go on the site and stir it up a bit
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



Says the guy who traded in his resale for a full freight purchase


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## raygo123 (Jan 13, 2017)

Ty1on said:


> Says the guy who traded in his resale for a full freight purchase


I drank the Cool aid

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## raygo123 (Jan 13, 2017)

That shows the intensitivity of this group

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## wjappraise (Jan 13, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> I drank the Cool aid



That is what makes this forum valuable.  I purchased retail VIP and it took me a couple of years of lurking, before I dared even post, feeling that my poor decision (actually a series of decisions as I bought up to top of the VIP ladder) made me a poor candidate for advice/answers/opinions.  I have learned that many others are in my exact position, and we can all offer something to the community.


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## Ty1on (Jan 13, 2017)

There is no better qualification for giving advice than having made a mistake and learned from it.


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## ronparise (Jan 13, 2017)

Ty1on said:


> There is no better qualification for giving advice than having made a mistake and learned from it.




Some call that experience.   
And thats the only reason I presume to give advice here.   Ive had more experience (read, made more mistakes) than almost anyone.


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## whitewater (Jan 14, 2017)

the group is less than helpful....  Its much more robust and easy to search.  Same questions every few days there because of how things drop off.


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## dioxide45 (Jan 14, 2017)

My wife is a member of a few Facebook groups, I am a member of none. Shoot, I don't even have a Facebook account. I wonder sometimes if I should just so I can follow some of the Marriott and timeshare groups. I don't know if I could take it. I have tried to read a few when using my wife's iPad and the flow isn't as easy to follow. I even have a hard time using the II Community forums.


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## markb53 (Jan 14, 2017)

ronparise said:


> It's been a while but I was tossed out of a Facebook group. I think because I refused to work with the founder of the group on rentals.  He wanted me to raise my prices to match his. I refused and next thing I knew I was tossed out



I dropped out of that FB group when it became appearent that Wes was deleting threads talked positively about resale.


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## Larry M (Jan 14, 2017)

Icc5 said:


> ...I also see this with people on the Nextdoor app. that block you or complain if you don't agree with them.  Same people try turning the group against you because they don't know how discuss a difference of opinion.  Now don't argue with me, just admit I'm right



Nextdoor indeed. Two conflicting threads on my local one right now. One is looking for arborists right now to take out some trees in his yard. Another is bemoaning the removal of a large oak tree to accommodate public school expansion, organizing protests, and fostering establishment of a neighborhood council to rule on whether you can remove trees from your lot.


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## Larry M (Jan 14, 2017)

ronparise said:


> Some call that experience.
> And thats the only reason I presume to give advice here.   Ive had more experience (read, made more mistakes) than almost anyone.



Good judgement comes from experience.
Experience comes from bad judgement.


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## tschwa2 (Jan 14, 2017)

There were 3-5 times as many people on that site saying not to use points for airlines.  The majority said that unless you have points that are definitely going to expire and you couldn't use them for Wyndham stays or even rci stays in a pinch that using them for air or things like MF is not a good idea.  So there is always one or two who don't get that and "attack" others who they feel are attacking their choices.  I don't think the site is nearly as imbalanced as this thread makes them out to be.  

To all the newbies there (and here) looking for advice and hearing how great the VIP benefits are, I just like to remind them that yeah they are great but many on that site who enjoy those perks bought years ago when it might not have been as expensive to reach those statuses.  If you are really prepared to spend $80,000-$100,000+ in addition to $5000+ annually (which rise every year) on MF to Wyndham, than you want to look carefully at the benefits to make your decision.  If you are looking to spend less than $50,000 buying resale and paying out of pocket for the pecks you want will get you much more than spending $30,000-$50,000 buying direct with Wyndham.


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## paxsarah (Jan 14, 2017)

tschwa2 said:


> There were 3-5 times as many people on that site saying not to use points for airlines.  The majority said that unless you have points that are definitely going to expire and you couldn't use them for Wyndham stays or even rci stays in a pinch that using them for air or things like MF is not a good idea.  So there is always one or two who don't get that and "attack" others who they feel are attacking their choices.  I don't think the site is nearly as imbalanced as this thread makes them out to be.
> 
> To all the newbies there (and here) looking for advice and hearing how great the VIP benefits are, I just like to remind them that yeah they are great but many on that site who enjoy those perks bought years ago when it might not have been as expensive to reach those statuses.  If you are really prepared to spend $80,000-$100,000+ in addition to $5000+ annually (which rise every year) on MF to Wyndham, than you want to look carefully at the benefits to make your decision.  If you are looking to spend less than $50,000 buying resale and paying out of pocket for the pecks you want will get you much more than spending $30,000-$50,000 buying direct with Wyndham.



I agree with this. I post there sporadically from my position as a small-potatoes resale-only owner, and haven't gotten much pushback. I think both there and here have a lot of folks who made developer purchases in the past that may or may have not gotten them up to VIP level, and both have folks who are just trying to get the best use out of the ownership they have. The main difference I see is that over there, even once they become aware of the opportunity to purchase resale, there are still some stories of having gone back in to spend tens of thousands of dollars to add to their ownerships, and congratulations ensue. There's little sense of an objective reality in which those dollars will never be recouped.

Here, of course, the response is almost always to rescind, and that is almost always the correct course of action - or, encouragement to realistically do the math in those few scenarios where an additional developer purchase to gain VIP levels might break even sooner rather than later. Over there, I feel fairly comfortable stating the choices I've made with my ownership and why, and sharing information (that can usually be easily looked up in the directory or online) but I pretty much ignore conversations about recent developer purchases where people seem happy about their choice.


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## raygo123 (Jan 14, 2017)

As I stated earlier, an almost state of bliss.  In a way, it's kinda refreshing.  A lighter side.  Don't worry be happy!

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## wjappraise (Jan 14, 2017)

tschwa2 said:


> I don't think the site is nearly as imbalanced as this thread makes them out



Hmmm.  But that site has kicked off several who post here regularly enough to have earned a reputation as being fair minded.  If the keeper of the FB account views them as heretics, I see that as unbalanced.  Or egotistical and controlling.  


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## tschwa2 (Jan 14, 2017)

IMO The keeper of the FB page is worried about getting into the bad graces of Wyndham and doesn't want people who post nothing but rescind, rescind, rescind.    As long as you acknowledge that there are real perks to having VIP and that there are people who have the money to spend who may find it worthwhile and don't attack those that have drank the cool aid and are happy with the cook aid.  It also doesn't help to tell people to rescind when they are past the time to rescind.  The site would rather not make those people feel bad about what they have done.  There are plenty who post that they bought retail but then added on with resale and/or wish they knew about resale before buying.


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## TUGBrian (Jan 14, 2017)

I dont think this thread was meant to specifically "call out" one particular group, as the actions of deliberately discouraging solid financial advice to new owners is shared by a good number of these groups.

its just incredibly sad that there are owners who still have their one and only chance to rescind and do research find a site that specifically prevents anyone from telling them about that chance.

that is flat out inexcusable.

if everyone were getting a fair deal, then simply informing owners of their one and only chance to rescind would of be no risk whatsoever and very few owners would even utilize the option to do so.

they know full well that darn near anyone who takes the time to gain the knowledge they need to make an informed decision on their first timeshare purchase is FAR more likely to buy resale than from a resort...or at the very least knows well enough to spot the developer "misleading" statements and or negotiate for a better deal.

/rant off


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## tschwa2 (Jan 14, 2017)

People are told to rescind there all the time.  People who post nothing but rescind especially when the original poster specifically mentioned that they bought last month or so and or did not ask what others thought or mention any questions or doubts are not so welcome.  There is almost always at least one person who suggests that rescinding now while in the allowed time and doing more research before settling on a retail purchase is wise.  There are always a few congratulations for buying and tales about how they love wyndham whether they bought retail or resale.  There are also periodic suggestions to come to TUG for more specific advice about resale vs retail options.


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## TUGBrian (Jan 14, 2017)

also why more than one group is the focus of this post, as there are groups on there that SPECIFICALLY ban people from telling new owners to rescind, or mention resale and actively delete the posts containing that information.

vs the one in particular who appear to simply frown upon it, but dont outright prohibit it.

you know there is a problem when the TUG facebook account gets kicked from the group after trying to help an owner who just bought.


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## silentg (Jan 14, 2017)

morrisjim said:


> I consider TUG to be like Fox News - meaning Fair and Balanced. I watch Fox News; I read TUG. . .


Can I veer off the subject? Where are you staying for the inauguration? I would love to go, but afraid of trouble in the area. It is an Historic event, but I will watch on TV. Please take photos and tell us how it goes!
Silentg


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## wjappraise (Jan 14, 2017)

TUGBrian said:


> you know there is a problem when the TUG facebook account gets kicked from the group after trying to help an owner who just bought.



Bingo!  I understand wanting to keep a positive spin on things, but when the moderator/owner of the FB site is fearful of displeasing Wyndham, don't we call that being a "shill"?  

Wasn't there a movie called "Pleasantville," where only positive vibes were allowed, and at the same time horrible things were afoot, and no one was allowed to speak about the negative aspects?  Or if you are older, how about "Animal Farm?"  Differing viewpoints need to be allowed in a truly meaningful forum.  

And when dissenting voices are forced out, that is shameful conduct on the part of the site owner.  

I am not on FB, so I don't know the answer to this, but it bears asking, "Are there postings on the FB site about the suspended accounts of VIP owners?"  If not, that silence is an indictment of the site owner.


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## raygo123 (Jan 14, 2017)

wjappraise said:


> Bingo!  I understand wanting to keep a positive spin on things, but when the moderator/owner of the FB site is fearful of displeasing Wyndham, don't we call that being a "shill"?
> 
> Wasn't there a movie called "Pleasantville," where only positive vibes were allowed, and at the same time horrible things were afoot, and no one was allowed to speak about the negative aspects?  Or if you are older, how about "Animal Farm?"  Differing viewpoints need to be allowed in a truly meaningful forum.
> 
> ...


Actually yes, but never more than one post in passing.  I have never seen anyone actually post it as a topic.  Or more than one post that it is taking place.no one cared to followup.

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## clifffaith (Jan 14, 2017)

dioxide45 said:


> My wife is a member of a few Facebook groups, I am a member of none. Shoot, I don't even have a Facebook account. I wonder sometimes if I should just so I can follow some of the Marriott and timeshare groups. I don't know if I could take it. I have tried to read a few when using my wife's iPad and the flow isn't as easy to follow. I even have a hard time using the II Community forums.



I had no interest in FB until I found out there were timeshare groups on it last spring. Usually access my Worldmark and DRI groups from my iPad twice a day. iPad "stays" in my "group area", but if I'm bored at my desk and log on using the big computer it signs me on to the "real FB page" and I'm always surprised to see Cliff's posts (he is my only friend!). Always find it odd to hear something about a friend's life from Cliff having seen it on FB, I guess emails are going the way of snail mail.


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## tschwa2 (Jan 14, 2017)

wjappraise said:


> Bingo!  I understand wanting to keep a positive spin on things, but when the moderator/owner of the FB site is fearful of displeasing Wyndham, don't we call that being a "shill"?


No a Shill is someone who works for a company but pretends to be a satisfied customer.  



> I am not on FB, so I don't know the answer to this, but it bears asking, "Are there postings on the FB site about the suspended accounts of VIP owners?"  If not, that silence is an indictment of the site owner.


  There were some but mainly they were referred to TUG for much more detailed discussion than what you can do on a FB format.


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## clifffaith (Jan 14, 2017)

Larry M said:


> Nextdoor indeed. Two conflicting threads on my local one right now. One is looking for arborists right now to take out some trees in his yard. Another is bemoaning the removal of a large oak tree to accommodate public school expansion, organizing protests, and fostering establishment of a neighborhood council to rule on whether you can remove trees from your lot.


I just discovered Nextdoor in December when I got a piece of snail mail inviting me to join the group. I'd recommend it to everyone as a good way to learn about what's going on in your neighborhood. Our recent posts have been about people going into the recycle bins to scavenge bottles and cans at 3AM on trash day, suspicious characters wandering around, lost dogs reunited with owners, etc.  Have a gorgeous pot sitting on my counter waiting for Mom's birthday tomorrow -  someone on Nextdoor posted that she hand painted pots.


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## wjappraise (Jan 14, 2017)

Dictionary definition of "shill". 
an accomplice of a hawker, gambler, or swindler who acts as an enthusiastic customer to entice or encourage others.


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## wjappraise (Jan 14, 2017)

A shill may also act to discredit opponents or critics of the person or organization in which they have a vested interest through character assassination or other means.


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## nuwermj (Jan 15, 2017)

paxsarah said:


> .... I think both there [the Wyndham FB group] and here have a lot of folks who made developer purchases in the past that may or may have not gotten them up to VIP level, and both have folks who are just trying to get the best use out of the ownership they have. The main difference I see is that over there, even once they become aware of the opportunity to purchase resale, there are still some stories of having gone back in to spend tens of thousands of dollars to add to their ownerships, and congratulations ensue.



There are three Facebook groups for Diamond Resorts members and I have not seen _anyone _there who owns only resale points. Everyone seems to be well aware that points from other members are available for free, but these opportunities don't seem to be very attractive to the membership. The people how do acquire resale points do so with the intention of buying more developer points and re-qualifying the resale points. Tier benefits seem to be very attractive to Diamond's members. This seems very different from what I have seen in Bluegreen and Wyndham groups. In these latter cases there are members who want the tier benefits, but there are others who do not.


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## ronparise (Jan 15, 2017)

nuwermj said:


> There are three Facebook groups for Diamond Resorts members and I have not seen _anyone _there who owns only resale points. Everyone seems to be well aware that points from other members are available for free, but these opportunities don't seem to be very attractive to the membership. The people how do acquire resale points do so with the intention of buying more developer points and re-qualifying the resale points. Tier benefits seem to be very attractive to Diamond's members. This seems very different from what I have seen in Bluegreen and Wyndham groups. In these latter cases there are members who want the tier benefits, but there are others who do not.




Im not a diamond owner but have looked at that club as a possible  purchase.  It is my understanding that you cannot be a member of the "Club" unless you buy directly from Diamond. ie Resale owners do not belong to the Club; so they are limited in the resorts that they can reserve. 

Wyndham is different.  Resale buyers do belong to Club Wyndham and their points can be used make reservations at all of the resorts in the club

Its not that some Wyndham owners want or dont want the benefits of a VIP membership  We all "want" the VIP discounts and the free newspaper. I am quite "positive" about that.  What some seem to take as negativity, and a bad thing, are the posts like mine that point out that those VIP benefits cost much more than they are worth and that a non VIP resale owner can enjoy the same vacations and the same number of vacations at the same resorts as VIP owners for much less money.  None of that speaks to the character or the intelligence of the person that has decided to buy  (or bought) a wyndham ownership from the developer... whats done is done, and who am I to question that guys motive, especially when he hasnt asked for my advice.. ... Im not speaking to that guy  at all.  I really dont care that he made a stupid financial decision.  

The person Im speaking to when I post something like this is the guy on a budget, that wants to get the most bang for his vacation buck... or the guy thinking about a timeshare purchase and wants to make the best deal possible or the guy that just bought from the developer and is wondering "did I make a good deal?" Even then I try not to give advice, but rather, as Sargent Friday used to say "just the facts ma'am, just the facts" 

heres a story that points out what Im trying to say.  

I bought a boat a few years ago. it cost $60,000 to buy, and about $10000 a year to dock and another $10000 a year to operate and maintain. In the last two years I have gone out one day for about 4 hours.   So you  might say that that was a stupid financial decision, and of course it was.   Those are the facts

What you dont know is I  really didnt want a boat, nor did I buy one. What I wanted was a  home in Southern California. The ones I was looking at cost over a million dollars (which I dont have) and about the same $20000 a year to operate and maintain. I looked at doing it with timeshares too.  Enough worldmark credits to live in all year would cost about $150000 to buy and $30000 a year maintenance fees. So the boat actually works out to be cheaper than the alternatives I looked at and I really like being called "Captain Ron"    

So I dont presume to pass judgement on the folks that choose to throw their money away on things that work for them, or make them feel good. If judgement is  what they take from my posts (and the posts of others here);  thats just wrong.


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## nuwermj (Jan 15, 2017)

ronparise said:


> It is my understanding that you cannot be a member of the "Club" unless you buy directly from Diamond. ie Resale owners do not belong to the Club; so they are limited in the resorts that they can reserve.
> 
> Wyndham is different.  Resale buyers do belong to Club Wyndham and their points can be used make reservations at all of the resorts in the club



I think Diamond's "THE Club" is more like the Wyndham Club Pass program (in regard to accessing resorts with one's points) while Club Wyndham is more like a Diamond "Collection" of resorts. If I buy resale points in Diamond's US Collection I would be able to make reservations at any resort in that trust fund, about 50 locations. I think the same applies to resale points in Club Wyndham (except Wyndham has more resorts). With Diamond resale points I would not be a member of "THE Club" so I could not make reservations at resorts in other "collections" (Hawaii, Europe, etc.). Which Wyndham's resale points one can not make reservations at Club Pass locations.


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## raygo123 (Jan 15, 2017)

Ahhh!  I have another post about DRI.  That's why wolf ledge lodge in Sandusky Ohio a poster said did not exist!  It's in a collection that might not been available to him.

Over on the Wyndham site they said there's a cancel rebook number

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## uscav8r (Jan 15, 2017)

nuwermj said:


> I think Diamond's "THE Club" is more like the Wyndham Club Pass program (in regard to accessing resorts with one's points) while Club Wyndham is more like a Diamond "Collection" of resorts. If I buy resale points in Diamond's US Collection I would be able to make reservations at any resort in that trust fund, about 50 locations. I think the same applies to resale points in Club Wyndham (except Wyndham has more resorts). With Diamond resale points I would not be a member of "THE Club" so I could not make reservations at resorts in other "collections" (Hawaii, Europe, etc.). Which Wyndham's resale points one can not make reservations at Club Pass locations.





raygo123 said:


> Ahhh!  I have another post about DRI.  That's why wolf ledge lodge in Sandusky Ohio a poster said did not exist!  It's in a collection that might not been available to him.
> 
> Over on the Wyndham site they said there's a cancel rebook number
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



As Gold Five said, "Stay on target."

This is going waaaaaay OT!


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## raygo123 (Jan 15, 2017)

uscav8r said:


> As Gold Five said, "Stay on target."
> 
> This is going waaaaaay OT!
> 
> ...


My last statement was my attempt to tie it back to the conversation.  As if this is true, there is a bit of usable information.

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## silentg (Jan 15, 2017)

I go on Nextdoor for my neighborhood just to keep up.


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## raygo123 (Jan 15, 2017)

silentg said:


> I go on Nextdoor for my neighborhood just to keep up.


There were 5 people out of 20,000 regitered on the site for my city

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## silentg (Jan 16, 2017)

Ours has expanded to other neighborhood in the area


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## raygo123 (Jan 18, 2017)

I just tried the "cancel and rebook" phone number that was given on the Wyndham timeshare users group, turns out it was the new owner number

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## uscav8r (Jan 18, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> I just tried the "cancel and rebook" phone number that was given on the Wyndham timeshare users group, turns out it was the new owner number
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



Gotta love the inaccuracies advanced by folks on that site. 

But that's what happens when you ostracize and/or eradicate actual experts. 


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## raygo123 (Jan 18, 2017)

uscav8r said:


> Gotta love the inaccuracies advanced by folks on that site.
> 
> But that's what happens when you ostracize and/or eradicate actual experts.
> 
> ...


What's nice, "gotter dun!  A total state of BLISS!

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## Jan M. (Jan 19, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> I just tried the "cancel and rebook" phone number that was given on the Wyndham timeshare users group, turns out it was the new owner number
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



I may have missed something but why do you need to call to cancel and rebook? A Wyndham owner can do it themselves online!


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## raygo123 (Jan 19, 2017)

Jan M. said:


> I may have missed something but why do you need to call to cancel and rebook? A Wyndham owner can do it themselves online!


It was suggested that that is the best way to cancel and rebook here on tug.

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## Jan M. (Jan 19, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> It was suggested that that is the best way to cancel and rebook here on tug.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



It has been a while, probably close to a year and a half, since I started doing my own cancel and rebookings. I had one VC get really snotty with me when I called to ask about something. Then the next time I called to cancel and rebook I got her again and the attitude and she screwed up the reservation. There is a smaller pool of VC's for Presidential Reserve and rather than risk getting her and having her irritate me I quit calling and just do it myself. 

For the past about five years my reservations are with very rare exceptions booked within 60 day window and I only cancel and rebook if I find a better upgrade. And that isn't happening very often anymore. If the reservation is one that is really important to me then I don't risk it unless there is still something I could use if what I cancelled is lost. That is another big change that I've noticed in the last two years as I had never lost an important reservation before that and never really worried that I might. 

If you are calling I would make sure you are doing it while you are online too. There were a couple of times that I actually caught the reservation before the VC did when it came back. 

It is my understanding from what I was told by a VC a few months ago that they are no longer supposed to be doing the cancel and rebook. OP may find some VC's who will still do it for them but I wouldn't expect that to continue. I wondered about the change in policy and was told that the policy was always that they weren't supposed to do it but everybody did. There are two reasons that I can see why they are starting to enforce it. One was to cut back on the number of VC's and not have them tied up with those phone calls. Remember the layoffs and VC's pulled to work on the audits? The other reason was that Wyndham was pulling inventory when reservations were cancelled more often than in the past. When you are doing it yourself online and you aren't seeing the reservation come back you just assume someone else was quicker than you especially if you got slowed down by having to select the pictures. When the VC's don't see it come back even for that flash of a second or two they know that Wyndham has pulled the reservation and it gets awkward when they know that you know exactly what happened. I remember thinking it was odd when they really started firmly warning us that reservations can get lost. Duh, we all know that. I found a VC that was willing to talk and was told it was happening a lot more often that reservations weren't coming back. 

OP may have better, more up to date information about this.


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## raygo123 (Jan 19, 2017)

Jan M. said:


> It has been a while, probably close to a year and a half, since I started doing my own cancel and rebookings. I had one VC get really snotty with me when I called to ask about something. Then the next time I called to cancel and rebook I got her again and the attitude and she screwed up the reservation. There is a smaller pool of VC's for Presidential Reserve and rather than risk getting her and having her irritate me I quit calling and just do it myself.
> 
> For the past about five years my reservations are with very rare exceptions booked within 60 day window and I only cancel and rebook if I find a better upgrade. And that isn't happening very often anymore. If the reservation is one that is really important to me then I don't risk it unless there is still something I could use if what I cancelled is lost. That is another big change that I've noticed in the last two years as I had never lost an important reservation before that and never really worried that I might.
> 
> ...


Very well put. 

Yes that was my concern.  I have never done one online, and last fall when I did one, I was warned by a VC that a VC would no longer help.  But when I saw that post suggesting a special cancel and rebook number, for the sake of all on TUG, I had to do it.  

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## Richelle (Jan 19, 2017)

Jan M. said:


> It has been a while, probably close to a year and a half, since I started doing my own cancel and rebookings. I had one VC get really snotty with me when I called to ask about something. Then the next time I called to cancel and rebook I got her again and the attitude and she screwed up the reservation. There is a smaller pool of VC's for Presidential Reserve and rather than risk getting her and having her irritate me I quit calling and just do it myself.
> 
> For the past about five years my reservations are with very rare exceptions booked within 60 day window and I only cancel and rebook if I find a better upgrade. And that isn't happening very often anymore. If the reservation is one that is really important to me then I don't risk it unless there is still something I could use if what I cancelled is lost. That is another big change that I've noticed in the last two years as I had never lost an important reservation before that and never really worried that I might.
> 
> ...



I wonder if they are going to start charging if you cancel. RCI charges a fee I believe when you cancel even it it's well ahead of time. That would cut down on the cancel rebook. The sales guy could still use that as a sales tool but leave out that they charge a fee for cancellations. 


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## ronparise (Jan 19, 2017)

Richelle said:


> I wonder if they are going to start charging if you cancel. RCI charges a fee I believe when you cancel even it it's well ahead of time. That would cut down on the cancel rebook. The sales guy could still use that as a sales tool but leave out that they charge a fee for cancellations.
> 
> Not long ago they started charging a guest confirmation fee in the hope that that would cut back on rentals. It didn't work
> 
> ...


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## wjappraise (Jan 19, 2017)

Jan M. said:


> It has been a while, probably close to a year and a half, since I started doing my own cancel and rebookings. I had one VC get really snotty with me when I called to ask about something. Then the next time I called to cancel and rebook I got her again and the attitude and she screwed up the reservation. There is a smaller pool of VC's for Presidential Reserve and rather than risk getting her and having her irritate me I quit calling



Was her name Michelle?  




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## tschwa2 (Jan 19, 2017)

Richelle said:


> I wonder if they are going to start charging if you cancel. RCI charges a fee I believe when you cancel even it it's well ahead of time. That would cut down on the cancel rebook. The sales guy could still use that as a sales tool but leave out that they charge a fee for cancellations.


RCI doesn't charge for cancellation.  They charge an exchange fee and if you cancel you lose it and some points depending on when you cancel.  If you want to use the remaining points you pay the exchange fee again.

I think Bluegreen charges a cancellation fee. I think it's around $39 unless you are rebooking for something with more points.  The higher your status the more free cancellations you get.


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## Jan M. (Jan 19, 2017)

wjappraise said:


> Was her name Michelle?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Sorry but I don't remember her name. I think she is either gone or promoted to supervisor. Wish I was kidding about the last part but I've seen it happen too often. 

I know when I called to ask a question a few months later one of the VC's I'd been taking to for years got my call and joked that I must be avoiding him because it had been quite a while since he'd talked to me. I told him it wasn't him that I was avoiding and never mentioned her by name. Since there hadn't been time for him to look at the notes on my account to see who I'd talked to around that time and he seemed to know right off the bat who I had a problem with, I'm guessing I wasn't the only one.


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## Richelle (Jan 19, 2017)

tschwa2 said:


> RCI doesn't charge for cancellation.  They charge an exchange fee and if you cancel you lose it and some points depending on when you cancel.  If you want to use the remaining points you pay the exchange fee again.
> 
> I think Bluegreen charges a cancellation fee. I think it's around $39 unless you are rebooking for something with more points.  The higher your status the more free cancellations you get.



Sorry, I misunderstood her. She said she buys cancelation insurance. Otherwise, if she cancels, she loses her points and exchange fee. If she decides to use her week instead of exchanging, and has to cancel, she either loses the week or has to pay the fee to deposit it into RCI. Either way you cut it, it cost money to cancel. It may not be a cancelation fee per se. With Wyndham points, you don't pay anything to cancel, provided you cancel before 15 days from check in. You do have to pay a fee to add points to the credit pool and I believe there is a fee to deposit points into RCI. It's been a couple years since I have done that, so I am not sure.  RCI does not have a bad program. They have a lot of resorts to choose from if you want to pay the exchange fee. I just think Wyndham is more flexible. 


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## dgalati (Jan 21, 2017)

I also posted about the waste by using points for air travel. I thought it was odd the replies that you received for trying to educate them.


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## dgalati (Jan 21, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> His trusted salesman saved the day by telling them that they could do that.  Why would the salesman tell him that if it wasn't a good idea?
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk


Salesman always tells you the truth or what ever you want to hear.


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## raygo123 (Jan 21, 2017)

dgalati said:


> Salesman always tells you the truth or what ever you want to hear.


By your TONE, you, You don't like your associate?  How do you think I got my airfare, huh?!

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## raygo123 (Jan 22, 2017)

Well I was just punished for telling someone that their PR glasses gift from wyndham only cost them $100,000.  And was told that presidential reserve MF is 3.98/1000. 

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## Ty1on (Jan 22, 2017)

raygo123 said:


> Well I was just punished for telling someone that their PR glasses gift from wyndham only cost them $100,000.  And was told that presidential reserve MF is 3.98/1000.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk



They must own King Cotton.  King Cotton is PR only, but if you look at resorts with both standard and PR, PR is higher MF/Point in every single case.

I think your $100K estimate would be per glass, btw.


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## OutSkiing (Jan 23, 2017)

morrisjim said:


> I consider TUG to be like Fox News - meaning Fair and Balanced. I watch Fox News; I read TUG. . .


I agree that TUG provides great info .. not so much Fox news.

I just saw this graphical image depicting the most widely read news sources and thought it was pretty useful: [Deleted/political]

Bob


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## OutSkiing (Jan 25, 2017)

OutSkiing said:


> I agree that TUG provides great info .. not so much Fox news.
> 
> I just saw this graphical image depicting the most widely read news sources and thought it was pretty useful: [Deleted/political]
> 
> Bob


Sorry, I did not know the graph was political .. it depicted 15 to 20 news sources and did not take any particular positions on any political issue. It placed the news sources on a graph showing liberal vs conservative on the x axis and depth of reporting analysis on the y axis. I found it valuable info.

Bob


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## uscav8r (Jan 26, 2017)

OutSkiing said:


> Sorry, I did not know the graph was political .. it depicted 15 to 20 news sources and did not take any particular positions on any political issue. It placed the news sources on a graph showing liberal vs conservative on the x axis and depth of reporting analysis on the y axis. I found it valuable info.
> 
> Bob


That graphic is just a graphic. The X-axis holds no objective value as far as I am concerned. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## BellaWyn (Jan 31, 2017)

*Back to the OP's OT.....*



Sandy VDH said:


> I think I will stick to TUG.  I was out on Wyndham FB group and offered my opinion on valuation of points and use for airlines tickets etc.  Best use of points, blah, blah blah.  You know the drill.
> 
> I got a post "Scold much".
> 
> ...


Sandy,
Don't give up on posting in that FB forum.  It was one pissy lady that called you out and not for a good reason. Have read your posts over there and they are good information.  There are more Tuggers that lurk and post over there than people realize.  Have gotten PM's from people asking me followup questions because the FB forum is significantly more "flowery" than TUG.  However, TUG is a little more "forthright" sometimes than people can tolerate.

Neither of those statements are intended to be critical, of either forum.  Both serve a useful purpose and in the end, it's still owners trying to help other owners.  Clearly, many are less experienced than the owners here in TUG. Hence, they kinda need us (more than we need them).  Have personally gotten verbal smacks from owners in both forums and have learned to get zen about the process.  These are online forums.  it's part of the risk we take to be honest and openly vocal about truths as we know them and learn new stuff when it comes our way.



TUGBrian said:


> there are a few like that, its extremely frustrating to watch people post that they "just bought BG for XXXXX dollars"...and the not only no mention of rescission and resale...but actual deleting of posts and banning of folks who do mention it to them.


Brian,
Circle of influence....  yours is much MUCH bigger.  Can only imagine the frustration you've experienced over the years of observing literally thousands of new TS owners that have passed through TUG, on their way from the developer purchase, trying to understand the mistake they made knowing rescind is too late.  And yet TUG, the family legacy, is there to catch them, help them figure out the next step and send them off to with a more accurate understanding of their ownerships and how to best utilize. 

When people finally get around to actually wanting to hear truly accurate and sound advice they eventually land here. The "responsible place" where honesty takes prescedence over tact. Personally prefer TUG over the FB forum but sometimes it's nice to observe Wyndham through less jaded eyes.  But can only take that action in much smaller snippets.  It wears my brain out navigating all that fluff. 

TUG is solid.  Something to be proud of.


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