# Need Help Just Signed Up for Wyndham Vacation Ownership/VP Status - Myrtle Beach, SC



## termite (Jul 6, 2008)

Can someone please explain the pros and cons of buying *"resale"* versus *"retail" *Wyndham Vacation Resorts property options? I'm probably a little dense, so simplicity is greatly appreciated...

My husband and I attended a presentation on July 4th in Myrtle Beach, SC. This was supposed to be a fact finding tour. However, we ended up purchasing ocean front deeded property (so they say) for $22,849.00, 308,000 points (154,000 and a bonus of 154,000 for 2 years) with a 1 year price freeze, no money down, and the option of 90 days same as cash. By the way the bonus of 154,000 points gave us VP status, which I see reading through the bbs is described as basically a perk with no actual value. We realize we have 7 days to cancel and so we are now trying to determine which way to go, keep it or cancel. 

We came home this evening and frantically started surfing the Internet to see if there are any negatives to the program and came across the TUG BBS.

Now, we are really confused because we came across the term "resale" and saw the advise not to by retail. Can someone explain the difference in terms of the advantages, prices and what you do or do not get with resale ownership. The Wyndham Vacation Resorts program sounds great, but almost too good to be true.

Honesty is greatly appreciated, because we really don't want to get into something we will be sorry for later.

Thanks for responding,
Gloria


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## Pit (Jul 6, 2008)

Well, you've come to the right place. Lots of FF/Wyn owners here that will give you detailed advice. 

I, on the other hand, will simply tell you to get out your sales contract, carefully follow the instructions for cancelling the contract, and do it NOW (before its too late - you only have a few days to do it). You will save yourself thousands of $$$.

After you've got answers to all your questions and digested the wealth of information you are about to receive, you can then make an informed decision on what purchase will best suit your needs.


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## Jya-Ning (Jul 6, 2008)

The biggest difference is the price.  Resale is about 5% of retail price.  Resale will not count toward VIP and will not give you Plus partnership (PP).  And since you only got 2 year VIP anyway, so to you, the only difference is the PP.  The retail cost for PP is $2,395 if you purchase resell and want to add on it.  But that may not have too much value for you if this is your first TS.  Plus your MF + membership fee is over $3 per 1K (I believe it is over $4.5), so you will probably only be using RCI nightly stay.  But you will not need that since You will have enough time to try to use their internal exchange system.

By the way, your contract will not be able to give you 2 BD 1 week stay at summer time there.

Jya-Ning

ps. read your contract it has detail instruction to tell you how to rescind.  If that is what you want.


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## lprstn (Jul 6, 2008)

Rescind it now and purchase resale.  Wyndam is a great TS program, but purchasing from the developer is really not the best route.  Before you purchase go check prices (of which you can talk them down) on www.holidaygroup.com , http://www.timeshareresalesusa.com/ , http://www.timesharewholesalers.com/inventory/default.asp , http://www.gotimeshares.com/tugads/0-3dname6.html (Tom Cornelies a Wyndam points broker who personally gave me great service)

Some people also purchase from ebay too!

Good luck and welcome to our board...


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## zazz (Jul 6, 2008)

The difference between retail and resale is pretty easy.  

Last year, Mr. and Mrs. X purchased a 154,000 point contract at La Cascada in San Antonio for $20,649.  They decided after a few months that this wasn't for them and needed to sell.  In April, I purchased their contract via Ebay for $1,199 free and clear. 

You would get a couple of things that I don't have.  But I am not sure its worth $19,000.  All of that extra money is paying for the Wyndham developer's profit, commissions for the salesman, the cost of those presentation gifts.  Why should you pay that?

Do yourself a favor and cancel the purchase.  Lots of folks here are experienced with that process and can tell you exactly what to do to get this done right. 

Once you get that done, lots of people can familiarize you with the resale process and how to make a successful buy.


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## vacationhopeful (Jul 6, 2008)

My sister has PROMISED me with total ex-communcation from the entire family forever if I tell her in-laws that I have 2.4 times the number of Wyndham Points at 15% of their cost.

15% of your purchase price (22,850 x .15 = $3427) would easily buy 300,000 to 350,000 Wyndham points on eBay, including the closing costs and transfer fee (assuming 1 deed).  If you buy smartly, you could easily get more points or save more money than I mentioned in the last sentence. Definitely, more than 154,000 permanent points Wyndham direct sales sold you.  You can RENT Wyndham points from Wyndham directly at $10 per 1000 pts if more than than 90 days on checkin OR $5 per 1000 pts at less than 90 days OR directly from other owners. 

As for that developer price freeze for one year, the eBay prices have DROPPED in the last year by a nice amount.  I would have save MORE, if I had brought this year.

Save your money $22,850 ==> RESCIND immediately.

Welcome to the world of Timeshare and Tugs.

By the way, Wyndham has some great resorts.


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## timeos2 (Jul 6, 2008)

*Rescind or you will regret it*

You have already received great advice above. Buying retail Wyndham Points gets you ONLY "VIP" benefits (and in your case, since you are only getting 154,000 points that doesn't qualify for VIP. They are "giving" you an additional 154,000 for 2 years to show you VIP and hope you'll be suckered into buying even MORE overpriced retail points to keep it!) so you are paying $.148/point for something you could buy as many as you could ever want for $.01 or slightly more. Do the math on the savings and in your case the extra $20K is buying you NOTHING except a "free" two years of twice the points and the bogus VIP designation. 

Run away from this "deal". Rescind now unless you want to soon own 154,000 points you paid $22,000 for that you couls sell for, maybe, $2000. Seem like a wise buy? 

You came to the right place to get the truth. Now act on great information have been given.


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## rickandcindy23 (Jul 6, 2008)

I think she is only getting 154K per year for that price.  Wow, that is expensive.  You need to rescind as soon as possible, then come back to learn all about resales from us.


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## termite (Jul 6, 2008)

Thanks to all of you that responded to my questions. My husband and I really appreciate it. You are all *AWESOME!!!!!! *

After reading your responses, I clicked a few suggested links and discovered what you were all saying about resale pricing is on the money. So about an hour ago, we just finished our cancellation letter and we will send it Fed-X tomorrow. 

By the way the processing fee they charged for the contract paperwork is $349. Does anyone know if we will have to eat this charge? The contract indicates *a refund* within 30 days of the cancellation notice, but does not specify what is actually refunded.

Again, thanks for saving a pair of newcomers to the world of timesharing from making a costly and very regretable mistake.
________________

*Gloria*


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## termite (Jul 6, 2008)

Pit...Thanks for the advice... you were right about the responses I would get.


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## Patri (Jul 6, 2008)

Does the fine print say to fedex? Usually people send USPS return receipt requested. Make sure you do it as specified or it may not count.


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## termite (Jul 6, 2008)

Patri said:


> Does the fine print say to fedex? Usually people send USPS return receipt requested. Make sure you do it as specified or it may not count.


Patri,

Thanks for pointing this fact out I will send the cancellation notification according to what is stated in the public offering statement.


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## timeos2 (Jul 6, 2008)

*No fees. No regrets. Rescind and the world is great!*



termite said:


> By the way the processing fee they charged for the contract paperwork is $349. Does anyone know if we will have to eat this charge? The contract indicates *a refund* within 30 days of the cancellation notice, but does not specify what is actually refunded.
> ________________
> 
> *Gloria*



No - no "processing fee". Follow the exact steps as outlined in the paperwork you received to cancel with the allotted days and you owe NOTHING.  Don't let them try to say you do.


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## termite (Jul 6, 2008)

timeos2 said:


> No - no "processing fee". Follow the exact steps as outlined in the paperwork you received to cancel with the allotted days and you owe NOTHING.  Don't let them try to say you do.


Thanks John,

I'm feeling a lot better after reading your response.

Take care,
___________________________

Gloria


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## PAMPERS93035 (Jul 6, 2008)

*Vip Status/wyndham/fairfield Resorts*

I Too May Be Sucked Into Getting Vip,  I Attended An Update Presentation And Told Me I Needed Vip To Use My Points.  Now I Have 189,000 Annual And 154 Bi Annual Points. They Got Me To Purchase A Discovery Package For 2400.00 To Try The Benefits.  My Questions , Is There Any Way To Become Vip On The Resale Market?


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## timeos2 (Jul 6, 2008)

PAMPERS93035 said:


> I Too May Be Sucked Into Getting Vip,  I Attended An Update Presentation And Told Me I Needed Vip To Use My Points.  Now I Have 189,000 Annual And 154 Bi Annual Points. They Got Me To Purchase A Discovery Package For 2400.00 To Try The Benefits.  My Questions , Is There Any Way To Become Vip On The Resale Market?



No longer and it isn't worth it if it cost $100 - at tens of thousands it can NEVER be worth becoming "VIP".  Buy the points you need resale and enjoy. VIP isn't even a fixed set of perks - and none of them can actually over ride the base rights of use/reservatuon granted with Wyndham FSP Points ownership. So they have to do things like "free" papers, early check in and some points discounts at 60 days from check in (and not all of those at all levels of "VIP"). Simply not worth messing with and certainly not paying for.


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## Jya-Ning (Jul 6, 2008)

PAMPERS93035 said:


> I Too May Be Sucked Into Getting Vip,  I Attended An Update Presentation And Told Me I Needed Vip To Use My Points.  Now I Have 189,000 Annual And 154 Bi Annual Points. They Got Me To Purchase A Discovery Package For 2400.00 To Try The Benefits.  My Questions , Is There Any Way To Become Vip On The Resale Market?



If they made a mistake, yes, you will get VIP through resale.  If they did not catch it than you may get to keep it until your update.

Otherwise, to my knowledge, there should be no way to get VIP through resale if they are not a TS saling company.  However, there are all kind of methods that will need you to buy a min number of developer points to become VIP.  And when you visit a salesperson, they will try to throw all these to ask you part your money.  The problem is, since they are saleman, you should not trust their word, you should make sure your contract guarantees you a VIP.


But you don't need VIP to use your point.  If you miss this point, I will try again:

*No, You don't need VIP to use/enjoy your point*

In fact, I know a lot of VIP get so scared to use their point to visit a Wyndham resort, it maybe a torture instead of enjoy.  Because they get the worse treatment from a salesperson.  They actually are much nice to a non-VIP.

Do you know what you actually get?  If you don't know, why you want it?  For the name?  

You should not need the discover program.  Read the directory.  That including the word "all VIP benefits are subject to change" and read them until you really understand what they saying.  Than think how many benefits are really useful to you, not useful on paper.  Than you can know if VIP is useful to you or not.

If at that moment, *you figure it means that much, and you do have the money to spare*, go to find a salesman that you like and willing to work with, and purchase your VIP.

Jya-Ning


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## acesneights (Jul 6, 2008)

And even if you do have the money to spare, you might want to donate it for cancer research or some really worthwhile cause and get a tax deduction rather than filling Wyndham's 40 billion dollar coffers. There is no guarantee your VIP benefits will survive the next annual VOA meeting.

Stan


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## jercal10 (Jul 7, 2008)

acesneights said:


> And even if you do have the money to spare, you might want to donate it for cancer research or some really worthwhile cause and get a tax deduction rather than filling Wyndham's 40 billion dollar coffers. There is no guarantee your VIP benefits will survive the next annual VOA meeting.
> 
> Stan


I've been getting my VIP discount for quite a few years now. I had the good fortune to get in early.


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## acesneights (Jul 7, 2008)

You get your VIP discount on the 10% of inventory WYN doesn't  take at 61 days.

And you're competing with 250,000 other VIP owners to get the discount at 8am on day 60.

The good old days are gone for good.

Stan


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## jercal10 (Jul 8, 2008)

acesneights said:


> You get your VIP discount on the 10% of inventory WYN doesn't  take at 61 days.
> 
> And you're competing with 250,000 other VIP owners to get the discount at 8am on day 60.
> 
> ...


  somewhat overstated , Stan.


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## lprstn (Jul 8, 2008)

PAMPERS93035 said:


> I Too May Be Sucked Into Getting Vip,  I Attended An Update Presentation And Told Me I Needed Vip To Use My Points.  Now I Have 189,000 Annual And 154 Bi Annual Points. They Got Me To Purchase A Discovery Package For 2400.00 To Try The Benefits.  My Questions , Is There Any Way To Become Vip On The Resale Market?



If you purchase resale (FSP points resorts only - NOT a converted points week) you can upgrade to VIP with Wyndam by purchasing a small points package (at least 105,000pts I was told but it really depends on where you go to purchase and upgrade) which will set you back at least $15,000 in order to roll all of your deeds into 1 deed (for the "lower MF" advantage) and therefore give you "VIP" status.

As for the others here on this board, I agree with them.  Its really not worth the cost if you learn how to manage your points well.  I have VIP and really did just fine without it.  I guess some of us just want to feel important, hence why all of the TS companies come up with gimmacks to make us "upgrade" just to be called "Very Important Person".  I fell for it because I haven't heard of VIP before I came to this board...you at least have the chance to do better...because we are telling you its a waste of $$


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## jercal10 (Jul 8, 2008)

You know we cruise a lot , and not everyone buys the lowest price cabin. Not everyone buys  a  Prius. We on this board tend to be the "coupon clippers of America" charter members.

There are many people who are very happy with their retail purchase of FF?Wyndham points!


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## acesneights (Jul 8, 2008)

jercal10 said:


> somewhat overstated , Stan.



What's overstated?

WYN has the right to take 90% of unreserved inventory?

The 250K VIP's?

Are there new figures since the August massacre?

Stan


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## jercal10 (Jul 9, 2008)

acesneights said:


> What's overstated?
> 
> WYN has the right to take 90% of unreserved inventory?
> 
> ...



What August massacre ? Wynd has always had the 90% right,at least in my docs.

What are you talking about on the 250K thing?

I frankly have noticed no change in availability--have you??


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## lprstn (Jul 9, 2008)

jercal10 said:


> You know we cruise a lot , and not everyone buys the lowest price cabin. Not everyone buys  a  Prius. We on this board tend to be the "coupon clippers of America" charter members.
> 
> There are many people who are very happy with their retail purchase of FF?Wyndham points!



Oh, I am VERY happy with my purchase of Wyndam (as I am sure others are too), be it retail or otherwise...however it still would have been nice to get it on sale..., but in no way am I gonna beat myself up about it...I am just more encourage to use it even more....


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## e.bram (Jul 9, 2008)

Jercal10:
your right! IGNORANCE is Bliss.


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## jercal10 (Jul 9, 2008)

e.bram said:


> Jercal10:
> your right! IGNORANCE is Bliss.



Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## acesneights (Jul 9, 2008)

jercal10 said:


> What August massacre ? Wynd has always had the 90% right,at least in my docs.
> 
> What are you talking about on the 250K thing?
> 
> I frankly have noticed no change in availability--have you??



The 250,000 WYN FSP VIP's.

The August (2007) massacre was when WYN went through and revoked VIP from resale from owners who had purchased additional retail to get VIP in writing signed off on by managers. 

VIP can be modified at any time without notice, no matter what you have in writing from WYN.

That's why there's so much resale.

Why should there be a change in availability? WYN has to leave the last 10%.

Stan


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## jercal10 (Jul 9, 2008)

I still don't understand what you are talking about on the 250K VIP's  competing for avail @  the 60 day point --it'a always been that way?
What do you feel has changed about that??


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## acesneights (Jul 9, 2008)

jercal10 said:


> I still don't understand what you are talking about on the 250K VIP's  competing for avail @  the 60 day point --it'a always been that way?
> What do you feel has changed about that??



Fairfield (pre-Wyndham) didn't always loot the inventory. They didn't take the best for their rental site. There weren't as many Bonus VIP's competing for the larger pool.

Stan


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## vacationhopeful (Jul 9, 2008)

Bonus VIP's being the ones who are given an extra XXX,000 points as a sales hook for 2 years (Discovery Vacations).  They buy 154,000 and get 154,000 more "free points" each year and get VIP (or more points to get Gold VIP) as a taste for this great ownership for 2 years, fix price on the points, etc.  

Yep, someone gives me free points with no maintenance fees for 2 years and points discounts and free upgrades ==>how much do they charge for these Discovery Vacations?  Remember, these Discovery Vacations can not be  NOT deeded points, so how are the individual HOA & POA's compensated for the vacation time (and making all deeded UDI owners unhappy about lack of availability).  Is there any limit on the sales staff from making a million of these "Discovery" sales?  As Gold VIP's, there is no housekeeping credit charges or reservation transaction fees collected or Guest Certificate fees ... just more costs driving the engine to raise the fees and eliminate more VIP benefits.  These "free" 2 year points don't even have maintenance fees.  Plus, do the Discovery Vacation clients have different VCs  == do they get "special inventory" which maintenance fee paying Wyndham owners don't?

Or do I have wrong information?  As I gleaned some of this info from Wyndham newbees, I hope others will correct my view with more tangible information.


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## jercal10 (Jul 9, 2008)

My understanding is that you do have to pay the MF. That's why Wyn does it so they don't have to.

I recall a sales person @ Grand desert telling me that if I bought there I could get "an extra room for my friends" anytime I came . HA Ha.


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## Jya-Ning (Jul 9, 2008)

Stan:

I must miss something.  Just 2 years ago, their VIP and non-VIP is about 2 to 3.  Now they have 350,000 member, and they have 250,000 VIP.  They must make over 100% sales. 

Linda:

They do own points about 20%.  And I believe discover program is differnt than the bonus point.  the price for the discover point including the MF.  The bonus point does not include.  Could be wrong though.

Jya-Ning


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## acesneights (Jul 10, 2008)

1 to 1. 500K members. = 250K

Stan


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## Jya-Ning (Jul 10, 2008)

acesneights said:


> 1 to 1. 500K members. = 250K
> 
> Stan



Since when did FSP members break to 500k members?  This year's meeting, the number is 350k.  When it reach 500k, it could have 250k VIP, but on the other hand, there will be same amount of inventory increases plus 20% whatever Wyndham claim they have owned in the system.

By the way, if the inventory become too crowded because of the number of VIPs, you can only blame people don't cancel their reservation when they can not use at 60 days.

Jya-Ning


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## kimbo (Jul 28, 2008)

*thought we got a deal!*

Boy, we are getting ready to rescind after reading all of this.  We spent far more than 2 hours (with kids getting frustrated about not being at the beach) and almost wasted $$$$$$$$$ on developer package.  The worst part is that they told us the price $22,800 was a deal because (a) my husband is in the military and (b) we were referred by owners.

I'm so glad I found this forum tonight!


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## Jya-Ning (Jul 29, 2008)

kimbo said:


> Boy, we are getting ready to rescind after reading all of this.  We spent far more than 2 hours (with kids getting frustrated about not being at the beach) and almost wasted $$$$$$$$$ on developer package.  The worst part is that they told us the price $22,800 was a deal because (a) my husband is in the military and (b) we were referred by owners.
> 
> I'm so glad I found this forum tonight!



Welcome.  Glad for you.  It is great product.  Maybe not for everyone especially if your husband will get move around and not be able to commit until last min.  But if you like TS, the entry fee (resale) is one of the best in its kind.

Jya-Ning


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