# Westin Kierland on ebay



## ral (May 15, 2007)

Has anyone noticed the sale of a Platinum Westin Kierland Annual Two-Bedroom on ebay? It sold May 7, 2007 for $24,090.00. Does that seem a bit high for a resale? I now see another one from the same seller a week later.


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## vacationtime1 (May 15, 2007)

The same seller sold another Kierland 2bd lockout for about $28,000 on eBay last month.  That price and the one you mention both seemed high to me, but the seller (tochoa25) would have no incentive to shill bid after the price went over $22,000 or so, so I have to assume both auctions were legitimate.


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## tomandrobin (May 15, 2007)

2 bedroom l/o platnimum weeks have been selling from 21 to 24 thousand.


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## gmarine (May 15, 2007)

tochoa25 is Thomas Ochoa. Exceptional to buy from. I doubt it is a shill bid. Keep in mind that sometimes when in a bidding war, emotions get the best of people and they sometimes dont want to lose the item and overlook the price thinking they are getting the best of it if they win.


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## angie (May 15, 2007)

Two Gold season Kierland 2 bedroom units sold yesterday on eBay for $10.8k and $11k respectively. These have 81k Star Options. Were these good prices?


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## DavidnRobin (May 15, 2007)

angie said:


> Two Gold season Kierland 2 bedroom units sold yesterday on eBay for $10.8k and $11k respectively. These have 81k Star Options. Were these good prices?




Seem to be normal prices - one went for ~$8750 a month or so ago (bargain).


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## vacationtime1 (May 22, 2007)

Another Westin Kierland Platinum 2 bedroom lockoff just closed at $24,000.  http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=260118146871&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=016    That makes three consecutive sales over $24,000.

Same seller (tochoa25).  Item #260118146871


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## puffpuff (May 22, 2007)

vacationtime1 said:


> Another Westin Kierland Platinum 2 bedroom lockoff just closed at $24,000.  http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=260118146871&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=016    That makes three consecutive sales over $24,000.
> 
> Same seller (tochoa25).  Item #260118146871


What is the developers price for this exact unit ?


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## DavidnRobin (May 22, 2007)

puffpuff said:


> What is the developers price for this exact unit ?



WKV is sold out - so no SVO price.  I heard they had WKV silver weeks that were being sold thru SDO.

I forgot who - but someone claims to have bought  same unit resale at ~$19K within the last year.  When sold by SVO - they went for ~$27K.

This eBay seller (tochoa25) seems to be turning around this unit type and a 2Bd Gold 81K repeatedly.

SmartChoice has shown asking prices of ~$25K.  The same broker we bought our 1Bd Prem-Plat - very professional outfit.

WKV (IMO) is a great SVO resale buy (for West Coasters) - I tell friends that WKV resale is an excellent entry into SVO - one has bought and loves it - the rest think I am crazy for buying TSs (they are all correct...)

WKV does not have a ROFR.


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## tomandrobin (May 22, 2007)

Seeing WKV maintain a decent resale value definately makes me feel better about our developer purchase at WKV. Of course, we made this purchase before we found TUG.


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## ral (May 22, 2007)

Let's see: three consecutive Platinum Westin Kierland 2-bedroom annual units with usage starting in 2008 selling for around $24,000 on ebay -- hmmmmm. It would seem that there are a lot of uneducated resale buyers out there (remember, these resale purchases are not from the developer). One might want to have a look at the closing documents after these resales have closed. Since no unit number is mentioned (every unit has an assigned number even if it is floating), is it possible that this is actually the same unit being resold after buyer's remorse?


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## DavidnRobin (May 22, 2007)

ral said:


> Let's see: three consecutive Platinum Westin Kierland 2-bedroom annual units with usage starting in 2008 selling for around $24,000 on ebay -- hmmmmm. It would seem that there are a lot of uneducated resale buyers out there (remember, these resale purchases are not from the developer). One might want to have a look at the closing documents after these resales have closed. Since no unit number is mentioned (every unit has an assigned number even if it is floating), is it possible that this is actually the same unit being resold after buyer's remorse?



Regardless of whether or not tochoa is not selling them - this is around the current selling price...

You can request the seller send you the deeded unit number (and week) prior to bidding or an offer - most often they will - I have done this...


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## ral (May 22, 2007)

David and Robin,

What factual evidence are you using to determine the average resale selling price for platinum 2-bedroom units at Westin Kierland? We all would like to see our individual timeshares appreciate in value, but it is the actual selling price at closing of a large number of units that determines the hard evidence of the average resale selling price. Results from a few sales on ebay would not warrant a valid average resale price, especially since one never knows whether there were actual closings associated with the auctions. I would very much appreciate knowing if you have a source, such as City of Scottsdale sale records, tax rolls or the like. It would provide me with the opportunity to determine a valid average resale selling price for these units. Thank you for your assistance regarding this matter.


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## mesamirage (May 22, 2007)

I think if your looking for "Hard Evidence" your sorta in the wrong arena... we're talking timeshares here... the market on anything is somewhat subjective to perceived value even more so on TimeShares. There are so many factors to consider... previous closings (on county records), Ebay prices of auctions, banked time, current reservations of high demand weeks, if the current years maintence fees are included or have to be paid back, etc.. There are SOOO many different variables when it comes to timeshares that the exact science goes out the window....

Its more than fair, based on current eBay resales, to state that fair market value on Platinum 2-bedroom units at Kierland appears to be $24,000-$25,000 IMO.... I don't think county tax records regardless of what they state will have any effect on your resale purchase price... it just might make you feel better or worse about the deal you strike.

Just my humble opinion.... and I have been happy to quote prices on other resale units in many of my posts... and I based that on Broker prices, eBay auctions, and more to provide my opinion... as I assume David has done the same.

Steve

Curious do you think the suggest resale value stated is too high or too low??




ral said:


> David and Robin,
> 
> What factual evidence are you using to determine the average resale selling price for platinum 2-bedroom units at Westin Kierland? We all would like to see our individual timeshares appreciate in value, but it is the actual selling price at closing of a large number of units that determines the hard evidence of the average resale selling price. Results from a few sales on ebay would not warrant a valid average resale price, especially since one never knows whether there were actual closings associated with the auctions. I would very much appreciate knowing if you have a source, such as City of Scottsdale sale records, tax rolls or the like. It would provide me with the opportunity to determine a valid average resale selling price for these units. Thank you for your assistance regarding this matter.


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## tomandrobin (May 22, 2007)

ral said:


> David and Robin,
> 
> What factual evidence are you using to determine the average resale selling price for platinum 2-bedroom units at Westin Kierland? We all would like to see our individual timeshares appreciate in value, but it is the actual selling price at closing of a large number of units that determines the hard evidence of the average resale selling price. Results from a few sales on ebay would not warrant a valid average resale price, especially since one never knows whether there were actual closings associated with the auctions. I would very much appreciate knowing if you have a source, such as City of Scottsdale sale records, tax rolls or the like. It would provide me with the opportunity to determine a valid average resale selling price for these units. Thank you for your assistance regarding this matter.



No one has put together an actual data base on Kierland resale units. But if you want to volunteer and research the City of Scottsdale records, have at it. David and Robin is basing thier opinion on e-bay sales, postings by other tug members and actual inquires to timeshare resellers. 

I am an onwer at Kierland and do try to keep up on the current pricing of resale Kierland units. I agree with thier estimate of the current resale price range. In fact, prices seem to be slightly higher this year then the past year. Part of the reason is lack of new mandatory Starwood resorts, low maintenance fee compared to resort with equal staroptions, and is the lowest mandatory Starwood Resort for the cost. For internally trade of the Starwood system, you can't beat it.

PS - I don't get you. You start the thread asking for our opinion of a resale, then proceed to bash, belittle and discredit the responses of the other members with an "in your face" attitude response.


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## mesamirage (May 22, 2007)

tomandrobin said:


> I don't get you. You start the thread asking for our opinion of a resale, then proceed to bash, belittle and discredit the responses of the other members with an "in your face" attitude response.


 
Not to pile on.... but nicely said.  

TUG is a community... we all are just trying to make owning Timeshares a better experience.... ohhh and bring about World Peace one timeshare resale purchase at a time!!


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## angie (May 22, 2007)

The thing about eBay is that it has a wide circulation, interested and arms length buyers and sellers are using it, and in the multiple transactions mentioned, there were numerous bids lleading up to the final sale price.  I don't know if these actually closed at the final price, but it is probably fair to say that the open market values these platinum 2br units in the $24k range at this time.


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## DavidnRobin (May 22, 2007)

ral said:


> David and Robin,
> 
> What factual evidence are you using to determine the average resale selling price for platinum 2-bedroom units at Westin Kierland? We all would like to see our individual timeshares appreciate in value, but it is the actual selling price at closing of a large number of units that determines the hard evidence of the average resale selling price. Results from a few sales on ebay would not warrant a valid average resale price, especially since one never knows whether there were actual closings associated with the auctions. I would very much appreciate knowing if you have a source, such as City of Scottsdale sale records, tax rolls or the like. It would provide me with the opportunity to determine a valid average resale selling price for these units. Thank you for your assistance regarding this matter.



My 'factual' evidence comes from watching sales over the last year, discussions with other WKV buyers, and being pragmatic.  btw, I have actually bought there...

or... I took the Geomertic Mean Ratio of all recorded sales and looked at the 90% Confidence Intervals around the GMR, and evaluated the corresponding power to calculate the p-value to disprove a Null Hypothesis = 1.  It comes out to exactly $23,388.31 (rounded to the nearest cent)


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## Ken555 (May 23, 2007)

DavidnRobin said:


> took the Geomertic Mean Ratio of all recorded sales and looked at the 90% Confidence Intervals around the GMR, and evaluated the corresponding power to calculate the p-value to disprove a Null Hypothesis = 1.  It comes out to exactly $23,388.31 (rounded to the nearest cent)



:hysterical:


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## Negma (May 23, 2007)

DavidnRobin said:


> My 'factual' evidence comes from watching sales over the last year, discussions with other WKV buyers, and being pragmatic.  btw, I have actually bought there...
> 
> or... I took the Geomertic Mean Ratio of all recorded sales and looked at the 90% Confidence Intervals around the GMR, and evaluated the corresponding power to calculate the p-value to disprove a Null Hypothesis = 1.  It comes out to exactly $23,388.31 (rounded to the nearest cent)



This is probably the post of the year


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## DavidnRobin (May 24, 2007)

Negma said:


> This is probably the post of the year



Obviously I was kidding around and I had written this response before the others.

Overall - they will always be prices paid that were low and prices paid that were high.  We all have our limits on what we would or wouldn't pay.  For us I would only consider a steal if I were to buy a 2Bd LO-Plat at WKV because it is not a VOI that we would want.  If it were another type (not going to say...) - I would consider buying if the price was right.

Everyone has to establish this for their needs - if you are looking to pay less than anyone else - then you would unlikely find this unit (meaning: are you going to see ~$19K again?)

I would put the median around $23.5K based on my observations - which is higher than before, but that does not mean it won't go down again (or up).

The 81K SOs 2Bd LO (Gold) unit seems to be dropping from $12K to about $10.5K based on the plethoria of these units sold lately on eBay (whether confirmed or not) - one went for below $9K and at the same time one went for $11.5K.

The lower than 81K SOs units at WKV have really dropped (as discussed)

Bottom-line - establish your own price - and if you buy try and look forward not back.  We paid $5K too much for our OF WKORV - if I knew now what I knew then - I could have saved this amount.  Same holds true for those that buy from SVO and then find TUG (hopefully before the rescind period) and find out they could have saved $1000s.  However, I believe we picked up our WSJ and WKV units for less than standard market price - maybe true, maybe not.

R, R, R and R
Rescind is the 1st R
Research is the 2nd R
Resale is the 3rd R 
{and - if it fits your needs}
Requal is the 4th R

I wasn't trying to be mean to the OP - just in my view that is a reasonable expectation of price (~$24k) - the actual price cannot be determined easily - this prices change based on supply/demand - and what the seller wants and what the buyer will pay.  I would never pay $24K - I wouldn't even pay $20K, but if I could steal one for $15K... maybe, but only to turn around and resale (WKV doesn't have a ROFR).


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## dss (May 27, 2007)

What is the current thinking on the resale value of an EOY 1br Premium Platinum Platinum week at WKV? Also, can someone please confirm the maintenance fees on this unit?

Thanks...


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## DavidnRobin (May 27, 2007)

dss said:


> What is the current thinking on the resale value of an EOY 1br Premium Platinum Platinum week at WKV? Also, can someone please confirm the maintenance fees on this unit?
> 
> Thanks...




Are EOY more or less valuable than EY?  I do not know...
On eBay - based on EY value - around $6.5K I would imagine.
From a broker - perhaps slightly more?

Not alot of 1Bd Plat-Prem around that I have seen (at least at a realistic price) - lots of 2Bd Gold season (81K SOs) it seems


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## bud_baker (May 29, 2007)

2 BR  (1 LO) at Kierland on Redweek 17k, 25k, 28k with the later being Platinum


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## mesamirage (May 29, 2007)

Ral,

Even though your post got a few spirited replies, you should really show up on the thread again, show you appreciate the info and feedback... especially since you started the thread.  

Steve


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## skim118 (Jun 5, 2007)

WKV Platinum 2-bed rm just closed at $20,800( a sudden drop from the prior >$24K prices).

I wonder it's due to the Tuggers on  "requal " missions have decided to hold back given the SVN Elite turmoil ?

http://cgi.ebay.com/WESTIN-KIERLAND...ryZ15897QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


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