# Pahio Kauai Beach Villas board election



## jacknsara

Aloha,
DeniseM noticed that I am a candidate for the board of KBV and suggested that I post something about it.
For KBV owners who may not have noticed, the ballot can be voted online and the deadline is April 27.
My original candidate statement filled the form all owners received but had to be shortened by more than half.  I am pasting in the last paragraph of the original statement that was cut:

For a more detailed description of my past as well as a rough draft of my speculations of the long term challenges, please send me an email which includes either or both “KBV” or/and “Kauai Beach Villas” in the subject line.  jackgoodstein@hotmail.com  I will batch send my response using blind copy (bcc).

Since I was unable to include the above in my candidate statement, I have not yet written the referenced draft.  I will do so in the next week or so just in case someone requests it.
Jack


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## DeniseM

I will be voting all of my 7 votes for Jack.  Before we even bought at KBV, I asked Jack for advice and he was very knowledgeable and helpful in assisting with our decision to purchase there.  In the 7 or 8 years since then, Jack has been the best source on TUG for KBV info., and I think he would be an excellent Board Member.  Since we have a new management company starting Jan. 1, it would be fantastic to have a Tugger on the board, and I know that one of his goals is to form an owner's group and improve communication.


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## sjsharkie

I'd be interested in hearing more and have sent you an email.

I understand we have a pretty independent board already -- I had spoken to Patricia Harrington who is an officer on the board inquiring about whether it was a possibility that we would move to a different management group similar to Kauai -- see this thread here:
http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=210064
She was quite up front with me that they had considered a change of ownership but decided to go with Wyndham the last time.  I also received a call from GPR which was a nice surprise -- and they explained their position and hope that they could win over the board the next time the contract came up.  Sounds like they did just that.

I'm excited about this change, and am looking forward to more details around what benefits we will receive and what long-term benefits we will see from the new management company.  I did like the front office staff and am hoping most will stay on -- even though I understand Orin the GM will be departing which is a big loss IMO.

The one thing I ask from anyone I vote for on the board is more open communication as Denise mentioned.  I'd prefer not to have to call the board president every time I want information around property issues and major board decisions.  I also realize that our vote may not count, given that it is difficult to attain a quorum at any of these meetings -- so hopefully the board will choose wisely in their appointing of any new members.

-ryan


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## DaveNV

My ballot was accidentally shredded.     Do you have a link to the online voting site?

Dave


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## DeniseM

You need the hard copy - it has your voting pin number on it.  

[correcting]

For Help:  melissa.ragasa@wyn.com or 808-241-1020


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## linsj

Jack, I'm so glad you're running. I've appreciated all the info you've posted here about KBV, which helped me decide to buy there. You have my two votes.


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## jacknsara

DaveNW said:


> My ballot was accidentally shredded.     Do you have a link to the online voting site?
> 
> Dave




(I posted this before discovering that Denise had already answered it.  I'm leaving the post here since it took me at least two tries to enter the url for the voting site and now others can use it)

Dave,

Voting requires both a member number and voting pin which are provided on the individualized ballot.  The member number is the same as your Wyndham contract number (not the ICN on the deed).
The link to the online voting site is useless without the voting PIN but here it is   https://www.esc-vote.com/500

You might have some luck getting a new ballot mailed to you by contacting Kanani at melissa.ragasa@wyn.com or calling (808)241-1020 and requesting a new ballot be USPS mailed to you
Good luck
Jack


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## DaveNV

Thanks, Denise and Jack. I'll try contacting them directly.

Note to self: When sorting stacks of mail into piles of what to shred and what to keep, don't answer the phone with a ballot in your hand.  It's easy to put it on the wrong pile. :roll eyes:

Dave


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## sjsharkie

Quick question -- is there any hope of reaching a quorum here at this resort with our votes?  Why does this property differ than any of the others that I own with respect to voting of officers and reaching a quorum at the annual meeting?

Asking because the advice on other threads on voting for directors has been "why bother?", but here we seem to think that there is a chance of reaching a quorum?

-ryan


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## DeniseM

I think there might be a better chance to get a quorum because of the large number of people who are full time condo owners at the resort. [Sorry - this was incorrect - see Jack's info. below.]


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## jacknsara

DeniseM said:


> I think there might be a better chance to get a quorum because of the large number of people who are full time condo owners at the resort.


I just looked at the ballot again.  It is for the IOA (timeshares).  It does not include the 45 whole ownership apartments – they are included in the AOAO.



sjsharkie said:


> Quick question -- is there any hope of reaching a quorum here at this resort with our votes?  Why does this property differ than any of the others that I own with respect to voting of officers and reaching a quorum at the annual meeting?
> 
> Asking because the advice on other threads on voting for directors has been "why bother?", but here we seem to think that there is a chance of reaching a quorum?
> 
> -ryan



Aloha,
That is a fair question which cannot be definitively answered until after April 27.  If a quorum is achieved, it is unlikely that tugger votes will be a major determinate (though all votes do count) since tuggers are a very small minority of all owners.

I deliberately crafted my original candidate statement to appeal to owners for whom both of the following apply:  (1) they do not respond to being asked to vote based on negligible useful information (150 word self-promoting statement) other than who is an incumbent and (2) they are interested enough in changing that situation that they are willing to vote this time.  Whether the condensed version will be sufficiently effective remains to be seen.  I had no advance information about the change in management companies.  I wonder if that will motivate more owners - particularly those who converted to Wyndham - to vote.

I am encouraged by the one phone call I got from an owner I had never previously met.  He so liked my candidate statement that he was willing to assign me his proxy if I were planning to attend the annual meeting (I am not – but of course would in the future if elected).  

The one part of the original statement that I had to cut that I most regret I have already shared here – the one including one of my email addresses.

I believe it is possible to create an effective (high enrollment) KBV community forum without being on the board provided that there are enough owners who stay at KBV at different times who share that particular goal.  I’d prefer to see it happen as a board sponsored/embraced occurrence.  That is both faster and mo betta than (to quote a former manager of mine) feeding the horse from the wrong end.  I’ve been a leader in succeeding in the latter before; it takes several years:

http://www.powershow.com/view/23f59...uitos_Perspective_powerpoint_ppt_presentation
Jack


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## DaveNV

I sent email to Melissa Ragasa. Hopefully she'll help me out.

Dave


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## sjsharkie

jacknsara said:


> Aloha,
> That is a fair question which cannot be definitively answered until after April 27.  If a quorum is achieved, it is unlikely that tugger votes will be a major determinate (though all votes do count) since tuggers are a very small minority of all owners.
> 
> I deliberately crafted my original candidate statement to appeal to owners for whom both of the following apply:  (1) they do not respond to being asked to vote based on negligible useful information (150 word self-promoting statement) other than who is an incumbent and (2) they are interested enough in changing that situation that they are willing to vote this time.  Whether the condensed version will be sufficiently effective remains to be seen.  I had no advance information about the change in management companies.  I wonder if that will motivate more owners - particularly those who converted to Wyndham - to vote.
> 
> I am encouraged by the one phone call I got from an owner I had never previously met.  He so liked my candidate statement that he was willing to assign me his proxy if I were planning to attend the annual meeting (I am not – but of course would in the future if elected).
> 
> The one part of the original statement that I had to cut that I most regret I have already shared here – the one including one of my email addresses.
> 
> I believe it is possible to create an effective (high enrollment) KBV community forum without being on the board provided that there are enough owners who stay at KBV at different times who share that particular goal.  I’d prefer to see it happen as a board sponsored/embraced occurrence.  That is both faster and mo betta than (to quote a former manager of mine) feeding the horse from the wrong end.  I’ve been a leader in succeeding in the latter before; it takes several years:
> 
> http://www.powershow.com/view/23f59...uitos_Perspective_powerpoint_ppt_presentation
> Jack


Fair enough.  I think you have a better shot lobbying the existing board since most owners don't vote and the board are likely the ones to decide who gets in -- but I will gladly pledge my vote in the hopes of more transparency for all interested owners.

I'm actually pleased with the current board in that they decided to make a change from Wyndham.  This somewhat substantiates the assertion from Patricia last year that the board is wholly independent and there are no management flunkies making decisions for the owners.

-ryan


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## DaveNV

Wyndham sent me an email with the info to vote online.  Done and done.  Good luck, Jack!

Dave


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## jacknsara

*Results*

Aloha,
I was surprised to find out that none of the candidates for KBV board listed on the ballot were elected.  I’ve included some details later in this message. 
I am speculating, but unless something significant occurs to increase the individual owner voting rate, then the KBV board will always be selected by the one owner with 19% of the units.
As I previously mentioned, I believe it is possible to create a KBV community forum without support from the board provided that there are enough owners who stay at KBV at different times who share that particular goal.  Such an effort is likely to require patience and several years of coordinated effort (assuming the board does nothing to help).  At a minimum it likely requires attendance and promotion at the Wednesday morning resort manager meetings.  Other forms of on resort networking might be worthwhile.
There is no way to know the minimum size for a core group to realistically initiate such an effort, but I believe that if KBV owners within the TUG community are unable to coalesce to pursue such an effort then no other source will succeed either (again assuming the board does nothing to help).  
How many of us are interested enough in the creation of a KBV owner–to–owner communicating community to want to participate in creation and execution of a multi-year effort to see it happen?  I am guessing that there are at least a couple of dozen KBV owners who log onto TUG.  Are there a dozen of us who usually stay at KBV (rather than exchange) who are willing to band together for common action?  Ten?  
While I am willing to respond to PMs, I currently see no reason why this should not proceed in the open.
If the majority of KBV owners who are also Tuggers prefer inaction, that will be my path as well.  Since I expect such an effort to take 6 – 12 years, I have no current expectation of running for the KBV board again.
Mahalo
Jack
---------------------------
KBV May 5 board election results:
The following candidates were identified on the ballot that was mailed out to all owners:
Ross Tilton 322.75
Thomas Mischley 378.25
Larry D. Warner 97.50
Jack Goodstein 169.50
Lou Columbo 56.00
The following candidates were apparently nominated from the floor at the meeting and were elected to the board.
Linda Kolstad 1,039.50
Troy Spalding 1,039.50
The following candidate was presumably a write in
Charles Moebuss III 1.00
---------------------------
The following information is copied verbatim from the audit report sent on 6/23/16 to owners who requested the report be sent to them. 
Page 9  NOTE 1 - THE ASSOCIATION
. . .   The Association consists of 105 interval ownership units (5,355 weeks), located in Lihue, Kauai, Hawaii. The owners of all weeks in the Condominium are the only members.
Page 11   NOTE 4 - CONCENTRATION OF CREDIT RISK
. . . As of December 31, 2015, WVR owned 1,041 weeks or approximately 19% of the available weeks.
NOTE 12 - ECONOMIC DEPENDENCY
For the year ended December 31, 2015, the Association derived 18% of its revenue from WVR.
---------------------------
The Certification of Quorum and Election Tally states that the total membership is 5,991.00 and that attendance in person and proxies received was 14.84%, well over the 10% required for a quorum.  I have not sought clarification of the difference between the 5,355 identified in the audit report and the 5,991 identified in the Election Tally.
It seems clear that the 1,041 WVR owned weeks identified in note 4 are responsible for the 1,039.5 votes cast for the winning candidates.
Even though Wyndham will no longer manage the resort for the next few years, it seems likely that Wyndham will exert as much influence as it chooses in selection of board members until/unless far more owners vote.


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## sjsharkie

Jack, thanks for posting this info.  I just read it as I have been less involved reading TUG given some personal priorities right now.



jacknsara said:


> I was surprised to find out that none of the candidates for KBV board listed on the ballot were elected.  I’ve included some details later in this message.
> I am speculating, but unless something significant occurs to increase the individual owner voting rate, then the KBV board will always be selected by the one owner with 19% of the units.


I am not surprised.  With board elections every year, I assume it is Wyndham's intention to gain control of the board (and management contract rights) back through voting their ownership shares.  Note that Troy Spalding works for Shell per Linkedin -- coincidence?... I think not.

It will be interesting to see now the GPR manages the resorts if they will increase their ownership through defaults, deedbacks, etc.  Not sure if the management contract includes handling all defaulted intervals which I assume it does.



jacknsara said:


> As I previously mentioned, I believe it is possible to create a KBV community forum without support from the board provided that there are enough owners who stay at KBV at different times who share that particular goal.


I don't prefer inaction, but I would only participate if we had a link to a board member that would take feedback and drive it forward.  If you have that relationship with the board, then I might be interested in investing some time into this.  If not, then I don't see the point.  Let's be honest -- it is unlikely we will ever get to the point of being able to outvote the 19% share unless things go really really south (think Northwynd bad).

Thanks for the info.  Let me know if you get enough interested owners and have that link to a board member that can take our concerns upward.

-ryan


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## jacknsara

Aloha,
I recently acted on Ryan's input and initiated contact with the new board.  One consequence is that I will be submitting my name as a candidate again.  There are various contingencies where being a candidate, even if not elected, makes some sense.  I decided to post this now since the maintenance fee letter just arrived along with the usual note which included a solicitation for nominations for the board.
In 26 days we'll be at KBV through all of January followed by a week at the Shearwater.  
Jack


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## jacknsara

Aloha,

It turns out that our new KBV IOA president, Linda Kolstad, and I were both scheduled to be in Princeville on the same February day. Linda’s email signature block includes: Director, Association Governance—Hawaii, Wyndham Vacation Ownership.  We met for over an hour one late afternoon on our lanai at the Shearwater.  The meeting was pleasant.  I have no reason to expect Wyndham’s vote, but I guess it is a possibility.

Given Wyndham’s ownership percentage, Wyndham is effectively the sole decider for the foreseeable future.  Even so, I ask all tuggers to vote for me assuming my name appears on the ballot or consider writing me in if neither I nor any other tugger appears on the ballot.

Regardless of who or which interests dominate the IOA board, it is not clear to me why any set of incumbent board members would want to support increasingly competitive elections which might result from increasing owner ballot response.

Consequently, while it would be easier to grow a virtual KBV owner community with the sponsorship of a board member, I believe that sustainable success is more likely even if it takes longer if we develop and implement a plan that works better with but does not require direct involvement of board member(s).  

I recognize that there are many challenges in pursuing such an endeavor.  Rather than worry the details of how to make it happen, I believe a better starting point is to discuss specifically what desirable outcomes would come with success.  I offer the following list as a starting point for discussion in this thread.  The numeric tags in front of each statement is to facilitate reference; e.g., rather than repeat the whole sentence, a commenter can just refer to item (entity) number nn.  The numeric tags are not intended to convey logical or sequence relationship.

Once we converge on a list of desirable outcomes, the next step would be to identify obstacles to making them happen, essentially valid statements about why each desirable outcome does not already exist.  Please feel free to suggest additions, removals or edits to the following list.

102      More owners log into the community website upon receiving their annual ballot than the prior year.

104      Anyone who wants to be an IOA board candidate (regardless whether or not selected by nominating committee) is able to post his/her campaign statements without editing by the nominating committee or its delegate.

106      Owners are able to respond to individual candidate statements.

108      Candidates are able to respond to owner feedback.

112      It takes negligible resort staff time to fulfil their role(s) on the owners community web site.

114      The owner community website existence is secure regardless of changes in the IOA board’s attitude toward it.

116      The owner community website is independent of the company managing the resort.

I have some ideas for a low effort, low cost approach to achieve these outcomes. It is possible that the ‘solution’ would be generic with potentially applicability to any resort; all tuggers are invited to participate in this thread (no need to own at KBV).  In the months ahead, I will develop an initial draft of what such a plan might look like.  I expect that it would be in the form of a pdf or word document.  Consequently, I ask that tuggers interested in participating in reviewing and commenting on such a plan provide their email address.  Feel free to send a pm or email me at jackgoodstein @ hotmail . com with KBV in the subject line to avoid the spam folder.

Jack Goodstein


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## DeniseM

Hi Jack - If Wyndham is in control of the board, how did they get fired as the management company?


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## jacknsara

DeniseM said:


> Hi Jack - If Wyndham is in control of the board, how did they get fired as the management company?


Aloha Denise,
There were zero Wyndham employees on the KBV IOA board when that decision was made.  Once Wyndham lost the management contract, they decided to exercise their 19% ownership stake in KBV elections.  At the moment, Wyndham does not have a majority on the board.  There are two out of five board seats open in the upcoming election.  We'll have to wait and see how Wyndham decides to vote in the next couple of months.  There is some logic in them not fully populating the board with Wyndham employees due to appearance of potential fiduciary conflicts.
Jack


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## DeniseM

Is it their objective to get the management contract back?


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## ecwinch

It came from a sales weasel, so I almost don't want to repeat it. But that is what I was told. That it is a 3 year mgt contract, and Wyndham intends to take it back. But then 5 minutes later he told me that Wyndham did not want KBV, they only bought Pahio for development rights to Bali Hai.


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## LEW4kbv

Jack - the proxy envelope I just opened says to vote for 3 positions at KBV yet you say above there are only 2 of 5 board seats open. Just curious what I am missing?? Linda


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## jacknsara

LEW4kbv said:


> Jack - the proxy envelope I just opened says to vote for 3 positions at KBV yet you say above there are only 2 of 5 board seats open. Just curious what I am missing?? Linda


Aloha,
The older I get, the easier it is to admit that I am wrong about a detail or two.  What I anticipated is not what occurred.
I also did not realize that there was (at least) one Wyndham employee on the KBV board when the decision was made to change management company to Grand Pacific. 
Jack


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## Jeff From Salem

Guys and gals, from my perspective, Karen Blackford and Trish Harrington NEED your votes. It's imPERative that we get them voted back in. Wyndham is trying get them both off the Board, particularly Trish Harrington. Doing so would essentially give Wyndham all the power. And that would be ironic, as well as bad news, as they are no longer our manager of the timeshares. The developers chose to hire Wyndham Management company to run/manage/maintain the resort. It was never _their _property. It has ALWAYS been owned by the individual timeshare owners as well as the few condo owners. There has been 2 Boards that work together. The AOAO and the IOA. The former's responsibility was essentially taking care of the grounds and buildings, as they are common to both groups. The IOA is responsible for the inside of the timeshare rooms, as well as rental and sales. 

When we first found out that Wyndham Management was using the timeshare sales pitch to get individual owners to give them their deed for nothing, plus pay them money, in order to get into Club Wyndham. When I was there in 2005, I went through an "owner's update". Wyndham tried to get me to give up my deed to them (And I have a premium oceanfront building deed) and give them $7000 to get into their vacation club. For one, that's unethical. We hired them to manage the property, not use that as a way to gather deeds for taking over the resort. 

The IOA noticed that the quality of the maintenance under Wyndham was going downhill. At first, they tried to work with Wyndham to improve things. Eventually, though, they found them not being responsive. The IOA started looking into other management companies and chose Grand Pacific Vacation Services. They started later last year and they have been great so far. GPVS had also taken over from Wyndham at the Makai Beach Club after they had found the level of maintenance that Wyndham provided was unsatisfactory. Apparently, since 2013, GPVS has done wonderful things a the MBC and the resort sparkles. Keep in mind, they're supposed to be working for the owners. Clearly GPVS has been very responsive.

So now that the IOA brought in GPVS, Wyndham has been fighting to wrestle power away from actual individual owners. And through a lack of information to the ownership, few owners have actually been casting votes. Wyndham controls about 1100 deeds, compared to the roughly 5500 deeds overall. Only about 600 owners, to my understanding, have voted in recent past elections, allowing Wyndham to throw actual individual owners off the Board. They're gunning for Trish Harrington this time around.

We need to make sure that Trish Harrington and Karen Blackford remain on the IOA Board. Wyndham successfully got Trish thrown off the AOAO Board last year. I'm guessing that she'll try again the next time for voting for that board; and with our more aware ownership (I hope), we'll be able to get her and others back on. And congratulations to her, Trish Harrington was voted onto the board at Shearwater last week. She really is a great person to have represent us individual owners. 

There are others who are worthy to be on the boards, and we (including me) will work to get them on. But we don't want water down our vote either. If enough of the individual owners vote, we have way more votes than Wyndham does. But Wyndham is predicated on apathy, hoping that most owners will not vote, so that can use their voting power to further take over the board, allowing them to make decisions that will help Wyndham Corporate, not the actual individual owners at Kauai Beach Villas.

One final thing, if you're looking to get rid of your deed because you can no longer use the timeshare, please avoid merely giving it away for free to Wyndham. At the very least, first try putting in a classified at RedWeek.com (they deal in higher end sales, rentals, and purchases), or a classified in TimeSharing Today, a 6-times per year periodical (that also has an online edition). In case you're not familiar with TimeSharing Today, it's a non-profit run by and for timeshare owners with many interesting articles written by owners and industry experts. A classified ad starts at $40, I believe. You should be able to get _something _for your KBV deed, and it keeps it out of the hands of Wyndham. 

Thanks for reading.  Aloha!

Jeff Bellin
Salem MA (A city with several connections to Hawaii, including the Peabody Essex Museum, owning one of only 3 existing Ku statues, the Hawaiian war god)


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## jacknsara

Aloha Jeff,

Welcome to TUG.  Since my long term objective for KBV is to increase owners awareness and voting involvement in the governance of KBV, I welcome both your and Trish’s efforts to do so as well.

Given that TUG membership probably includes only a few dozen KBV owners, I see little point in debating your contention about who should get everyone’s vote.  Even so, the situation you describe is the result of several years of board oversight and Wyndham management.  Some might wonder how keeping the same non-Wyndham board members will result in a different outcome.

I did have a conversation with Trish many months ago.  My recollection is that she was unfamiliar with TUG at the time.  I am not aware that she has since logged in, but perhaps she is lurking.  If she has not joined, please encourage her to do so.

Since you have logged in and expressed such energy, I ask you specifically to review post 18 above and respond to it.  Its subject is not this specific election.

Mahalo,

Jack
Pahio Kauai Beach Villas board election


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## Jeff From Salem

DeniseM said:


> Hi Jack - If Wyndham is in control of the board, how did they get fired as the management company?



So, it's complicated. Wyndham was originally hired to manage the grounds, the buildings, the inside of the units, as well as handle the sales and rentals of the units by the original developer, David Walters. It was then PAHIO, one of three related resorts on Kauai. 

When David Walters started PAHIO, the Kauai Beach Villas was a series of year-'round owned condos. Walters negotiated to buy most of them and turn them into weekly timeshares. There were those who didn't want to sell and remained owning the individual units year-round. The Association Of Apartment Owners, or AOAO, is the Board that consists of condo owners as well as individual timeshare owners.

The IOA (I think it stands for Independent Owners Association) is comprised of individual timeshare owners. Or that's how it was supposed to be.

Over a decade ago, the boards started to see the resort go downhill. It was somewhat subtle, but it wasn't going in the right direction. They were also seeing costs go up much faster while the resort wasn't getting maintained as well as it used to be maintained. Wyndham was also using their timeshare pitch on the resort, as they were being paid to be KBV property managers, to get owners to give up their deeds to them for nothing, along with a lot of cash, to become members of Club Wyndham. I was subjected to a pitch. My waterfront unit deed, plus $7000 would get me membership into Club Wyndham. 

There was much discussion, after unsuccessfully trying to work with Wyndham to improve the quality of their work and get them to reduce costs, the Boards decided to look for a different management company. There was still 3 years remaining on the contract at that point. KBV decided to just let the contract expire, letting Wyndham continue for the next 3 years. In the interim, the IOA did some research and decided to hire Grand Pacific Resorts. GPX, as it's known, had taken over Makai Beach Club on the north shore a few years back after _they _had let Wyndham go. Makai Beach Club reports that the resort has shown tremendous improvement over the last 3 years since GPX took over.

GPX has only been involved managing the responsibilities of the IOA since later last year, which is to maintain the inside of the units, and be responsible for sales and rentals of the timeshare units. 

Meanwhile, through the lack of individual deeded owners voting (only 600 of 5500 voted the last election) and Wyndham accumulating deeds, Wyndham was able to use employees and shareholders to cast votes with their deeded power (Wyndham currently owns about 1100 deeds). If even 1/3rd of the individual owners had bothered to vote, we wouldn't be talking about this. But within the last year or so, Wyndham was able to successfully wrestle control of the AOAO Board of Directors, and THAT Wyndham dominated board voted to keep Wyndham Management in charge of managing the AOAO responsibilities (the grounds, the buildings). 

The IOA had already previously voted to terminate the relationship with Wyndham and legally contracted with GPX. But last year, Wyndham had enough votes to overcome weak voting on the part of individual owners and get the 60% majority on the IOA board. Again, if enough individual owners wake up, get interested and vote accordingly, they'll not only keep Wyndham at bay, but can reverse the tide. Again, while Wyndham owning 21% of the deeds currently sounds like a lot, it means that individual owners still own 79%. But it's easy for Wyndham to be able to arrange to have those voting with their deeds to vote in one big block.

We need to do some work to get the individual owners to vote. That's what I'm trying to do.

I hope this helps.


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## jacknsara

Jeff From Salem said:


> . . . We need to do some work to get the individual owners to vote. That's what I'm trying to do.
> 
> I hope this helps.



Aloha Jeff,

Your post #27 addressed a question posed by Denise.  Since it did not address my post #18 as I requested in post #26 I ask again that you do so.   Here's a direct link:
Pahio Kauai Beach Villas board election
No other tugger has responded specifically to post #18, but you are the first in this thread other than me to be actively campaigning for higher owner voting rates.

A non-trivial footnote regarding the 79% individual owners you cite.  An unknown but sometimes reported to be approximately 20% of all KBV owners have converted their ownership to the Wyndham club; that is separate from the 19% or 21% that Wyndham owns outright.  I have no information about how the KBV owners who converted to Wyndham feel about Wyndham losing the management contract.  Can you offer any insight about that segment of KBV owners?

Mahalo,

Jack


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## Jeff From Salem

jacknsara said:


> Aloha,
> 
> It turns out that our new KBV IOA president, Linda Kolstad, and I were both scheduled to be in Princeville on the same February day. Linda’s email signature block includes: Director, Association Governance—Hawaii, Wyndham Vacation Ownership.  We met for over an hour one late afternoon on our lanai at the Shearwater.  The meeting was pleasant.  I have no reason to expect Wyndham’s vote, but I guess it is a possibility.
> 
> Given Wyndham’s ownership percentage, Wyndham is effectively the sole decider for the foreseeable future.  Even so, I ask all tuggers to vote for me assuming my name appears on the ballot or consider writing me in if neither I nor any other tugger appears on the ballot.
> 
> Regardless of who or which interests dominate the IOA board, it is not clear to me why any set of incumbent board members would want to support increasingly competitive elections which might result from increasing owner ballot response.
> 
> Consequently, while it would be easier to grow a virtual KBV owner community with the sponsorship of a board member, I believe that sustainable success is more likely even if it takes longer if we develop and implement a plan that works better with but does not require direct involvement of board member(s).
> 
> I recognize that there are many challenges in pursuing such an endeavor.  Rather than worry the details of how to make it happen, I believe a better starting point is to discuss specifically what desirable outcomes would come with success.  I offer the following list as a starting point for discussion in this thread.  The numeric tags in front of each statement is to facilitate reference; e.g., rather than repeat the whole sentence, a commenter can just refer to item (entity) number nn.  The numeric tags are not intended to convey logical or sequence relationship.
> 
> Once we converge on a list of desirable outcomes, the next step would be to identify obstacles to making them happen, essentially valid statements about why each desirable outcome does not already exist.  Please feel free to suggest additions, removals or edits to the following list.
> 
> 102      More owners log into the community website upon receiving their annual ballot than the prior year.
> 
> 104      Anyone who wants to be an IOA board candidate (regardless whether or not selected by nominating committee) is able to post his/her campaign statements without editing by the nominating committee or its delegate.
> 
> 106      Owners are able to respond to individual candidate statements.
> 
> 108      Candidates are able to respond to owner feedback.
> 
> 112      It takes negligible resort staff time to fulfil their role(s) on the owners community web site.
> 
> 114      The owner community website existence is secure regardless of changes in the IOA board’s attitude toward it.
> 
> 116      The owner community website is independent of the company managing the resort.
> 
> I have some ideas for a low effort, low cost approach to achieve these outcomes. It is possible that the ‘solution’ would be generic with potentially applicability to any resort; all tuggers are invited to participate in this thread (no need to own at KBV).  In the months ahead, I will develop an initial draft of what such a plan might look like.  I expect that it would be in the form of a pdf or word document.  Consequently, I ask that tuggers interested in participating in reviewing and commenting on such a plan provide their email address.  Feel free to send a pm or email me at jackgoodstein @ hotmail . com with KBV in the subject line to avoid the spam folder.
> 
> Jack Goodstein




Sorry, Jack. I think I need new glasses. I was associating #18 with the one below it.

The only thing I can is that I have been encouraged to start a Yahoo User's Group, requiring permission and a password in order to see what's in it. I think there needs to be a forum where KBV owners, real individual owners, can talk about issues as well as possibly anything else related to KBV. I don't want trollers there, so a site where only invitees can see and contribute might be warranted.

Jeff


----------



## jacknsara

jacknsara said:


> . . . I believe it is possible to create an effective (high enrollment) KBV community forum without being on the board provided that there are enough owners who stay at KBV at different times who share that particular goal.  I’d prefer to see it happen as a board sponsored/embraced occurrence.  That is both faster and mo betta than (to quote a former manager of mine) feeding the horse from the wrong end.  I’ve been a leader in succeeding in the latter before; it takes several years:
> 
> http://www.powershow.com/view/23f59...uitos_Perspective_powerpoint_ppt_presentation
> Jack





Jeff From Salem said:


> Sorry, Jack. I think I need new glasses. I was associating #18 with the one below it.
> 
> The only thing I can is that I have been encouraged to start a Yahoo User's Group, requiring permission and a password in order to see what's in it. I think there needs to be a forum where KBV owners, real individual owners, can talk about issues as well as possibly anything else related to KBV. I don't want trollers there, so a site where only invitees can see and contribute might be warranted.
> 
> Jeff



Aloha Jeff,

One of the many things we (the amorphous Boeing community of practice that was the subject of the link) learned was that success required neither central planning nor leadership hierarchy nor budget nor sponsor/charter.  Different folks would take initiative and start things almost the moment company IT infrastructure incorporated new capabilities.  Some things worked better than others.  Some things did not work.

I have no reason to object to the principle of anyone starting a Yahoo group such as you mentioned.  There is at least one key issue to consider before starting it.  Out of many possibilities, let me suggest two opposites for comparison. 

Option 1: Rely primarily on email list(s) acquired from KBV in accordance with by-laws (5.04 et al) to promote it

Option 2: Limit promotion means in order to not be bound by the by-laws

If someone not explicitly authorized by the BoD establishes a Yahoo group using a list acquired in compliance with 5.04 to attract members, they may be committing themselves to regularly comparing the group membership with an updated/current email list in order to remove folks who have shed their ownership.  If the BoD authorizes such a group and assigns the list maintenance task to the KBV manager, then the group membership can be updated as transfer documents are processed.  Consequently, I suggest that Option 1 is best left for BoD authorized groups perhaps including committees authorized per by-laws 3.14.

Option 2 might appear more challenging to start but I have some ideas that I have not yet written down (refer back to post #18).  TUG already exists and can be used to address some aspects of Option 2.  If done with a systems / long term view, many desirable outcomes such as listed in post #18 might be achievable using web infrastructure that is free to the consumer.  An excel sensitivity model I created based on too many assumptions to defend in this thread suggest that success sufficient to be a major influence on board elections would take several years. 

So far, no one has provided feedback about the proposed desirable effects listed in post 18.  Feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Mahalo,

Jack


----------



## ronparise

jacknsara said:


> Aloha Jeff,
> 
> Your post #27 addressed a question posed by Denise.  Since it did not address my post #18 as I requested in post #26 I ask again that you do so.   Here's a direct link:
> Pahio Kauai Beach Villas board election
> No other tugger has responded specifically to post #18, but you are the first in this thread other than me to be actively campaigning for higher owner voting rates.
> 
> A non-trivial footnote regarding the 79% individual owners you cite.  An unknown but sometimes reported to be approximately 20% of all KBV owners have converted their ownership to the Wyndham club; that is separate from the 19% or 21% that Wyndham owns outright.  I have no information about how the KBV owners who converted to Wyndham feel about Wyndham losing the management contract.  Can you offer any insight about that segment of KBV owners?
> 
> Mahalo,
> 
> Jack



Im not sure that the way I feel about this will give you any insight but for what it's worth....

I own several weeks converted to Wyndham points

Painting Wyndham as the bad guy dosent work with me. At one time I was one of the biggest Wyndham points owners and Wyndham has been nothing but good to me.  My experience at Wyndham managed resorts has been pretty good.   I bought Wyndham points to make reservations at Wyndham resorts. I have no intention of ever visiting Hawaii so I dont much care whether one management company or another manages the resorts there. As long as they are managed to Wyndhams standards, I'm happy

As for my vote I choose to abstain

FYI
I ran for the board at another resort  where some of the condos are part of the club Wyndham points system. Wyndham has enough votes to put whom ever they wanted on the board and that's what they did


----------



## Jeff From Salem

ronparise said:


> Im not sure that the way I feel about this will give you any insight but for what it's worth....
> 
> I own several weeks converted to Wyndham points
> 
> Painting Wyndham as the bad guy dosent work with me. At one time I was one of the biggest Wyndham points owners and Wyndham has been nothing but good to me.  My experience at Wyndham managed resorts has been pretty good.   I bought Wyndham points to make reservations at Wyndham resorts. I have no intention of ever visiting Hawaii so I dont much care whether one management company or another manages the resorts there. As long as they are managed to Wyndhams standards, I'm happy
> 
> As for my vote I choose to abstain
> 
> FYI
> I ran for the board at another resort  where some of the condos are part of the club Wyndham points system. Wyndham has enough votes to put whom ever they wanted on the board and that's what they did



You're conflating different things. We're talking about the quality of the managing of the KBV. They have not done a good job. And that's what they were hired to do. That you have had a good experience with their Club Wyndham is not relevant, other than they used their time when the KBV owners were paying them to maintain the resort that they used that time to try to seize power over the resort.

They don't own the resort. But they can try to gain enough power to make more decisions to help themselves rather than help actual deeded owners. They'd be happy to get your deeds. It's in their corporate interests.

And hey, I have stayed at a Wyndham corporate owned resort and it was fine.

But their management company seems to create mediocre results at best. Makai Beach Club is a perfect example. The others there are FAR happier in the 3 years that GPX took over from Wyndham as the management company. They're thrilled now.

I'd prefer to not have the KBV further slip down into mediocrity. I have been hearing it right and left since I started reaching out to owners.


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## ecwinch

In the history of TUG, has there every been a grass-roots group that has ever been able to overcome the developer voting block at a resort with an active sales presence?

Like Ron mentions, each group I have seen follows the same playbook - paint the developer in the worst possible light, imply they ruining the resort, and ask for votes. But I have yet to see that playbook work. I jokingly call this the Scooby-Doo playbook, as most of those episodes end up with the villain being unmasked as the evil developer.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> In the history of TUG, has there every been a grass-roots group that has ever been able to overcome the developer voting block at a resort with an active sales presence?
> 
> Like Ron mentions, each group I have seen follows the same playbook - paint the developer in the worst possible light, imply they ruining the resort, and ask for votes. But I have yet to see that playbook work. I jokingly call this the Scooby-Doo playbook, as most of those episodes end up with the villain being unmasked as the evil developer.



You're talking like a climate warming denier. I have actually come up with evidence and support for my statements. You just want to belittle and troll.

I don't care who manages the resort. I really don't. As long as they do a great job. I have been seeing many things that Wyndham has done at KBV which are counter to what would be in the better interests of me as well as most owners. The resort has gone from a Gold Crown Resort to barely a Silver Crown. I have experienced other resorts that were better run. I have seen maintenance fees going to with the quality going down. I have talked with Board members who have told me that these were some of the reasons they elected not to renew Wyndham's contract. You can belittle and condescend all you want. It just makes me question your motives.


----------



## ecwinch

In the interest of polite discourse - because there is no need to engage in name calling just because I may disagree - what exactly do you point to support your position?

Jack mentions that defaulting owners are primary challenge facing the resort. You seemingly find a decrease in quality. What changes are forthcoming under GPR's management that will reverse the decrease in quality that you find concerning? At what cost?  As a fellow owner, I would be interested to hear about them.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> In the interest of polite discourse - because there is no need to engage in name calling just because I may disagree - what exactly do you point to support your position?
> 
> Jack mentions that defaulting owners are primary challenge facing the resort. You seemingly find a decrease in quality. What changes are forthcoming under GPR's management that will reverse the decrease in quality that you find concerning? At what cost?  As a fellow owner, I would be interested to hear about them.



I'm actually encouraged from what I'm hearing from those who have been to the resort recently since Grand Pacific Resorts took over. And I'm chagrined to read about how much the Makai Beach Resort has come up since GPX took over from Wyndham. So that's the good part. But Wyndham, rather than relinquishing the power they obtained since they accumulated some deeds when they were managing the resort, has instead dug their heels in. It's clear that they're more interested in their own corporate interests than the interests of the owners of the resort, as I see it.

Jeff


----------



## ecwinch

Well, as someone who stayed at the resort in Feb, I was very disappointed by how disorganized GPR was. And I saw no GPR initiated improvements at the resort since my last visit.

But it really is the lack of recognition of how dependent the resort is on Wyndham that gives me cause for concern. Jack has cited defaulting owners as the current challenge. Taking that at face value, what BoD choses a course of action that risks alienating the organization that is paying dues on 1/5 of the weeks? That seems counter-intuitive if the long-term viability of the resort is in question.

The second issue that gives me cause for concern is the sudden wealth of communication from the BoD members whose positions are at risk. For the years I have owned there, there has been very little communication from the BoD geared to generate owner engagement. If there were concerns about the resort, where was the owner communication on those challenges? Or why wasn't the owner communication site that Jack has suggested implemented during that timeframe? Or using TUG as a communication channel? Actions that were clearly within the authority of the BoD to execute - regardless of the manager.

But now that their positions are threatened, they now feel the need to reach out and ask for my vote. The timing causes me to question both their judgement and their agenda.


----------



## ronparise

Jeff From Salem said:


> You're conflating different things. We're talking about the quality of the managing of the KBV. They have not done a good job. And that's what they were hired to do. That you have had a good experience with their Club Wyndham is not relevant, other than they used their time when the KBV owners were paying them to maintain the resort that they used that time to try to seize power over the resort.
> 
> They don't own the resort. But they can try to gain enough power to make more decisions to help themselves rather than help actual deeded owners. They'd be happy to get your deeds. It's in their corporate interests.
> 
> And hey, I have stayed at a Wyndham corporate owned resort and it was fine.
> 
> But their management company seems to create mediocre results at best. Makai Beach Club is a perfect example. The others there are FAR happier in the 3 years that GPX took over from Wyndham as the management company. They're thrilled now.
> 
> I'd prefer to not have the KBV further slip down into mediocrity. I have been hearing it right and left since I started reaching out to owners.



Somebody asked for insight regarding the owners of weeks converted to points
I am one and I offered my perspective

You say my experience at  Wyndham managed resorts is not relevant. When it comes to my 3 votes, i gotta wonder what's more relevant? Your experience? I don't think so

You go ahead and do what you want. I was only suggesting that if you want to convince me, painting Wyndham  as the bad guy won't work

And asking for my input, but then rejecting it because it's "not relevant" won't work either

And asking for my vote, but then not responding to my email; that certainly won't work


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## linsj

This is the most difficult election I've ever voted in anywhere. I didn't get a ballot in the mail. It took two emails, three phone calls, and a lot of time on hold to get a working password to vote online.


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## DeniseM

I am looking at my ballot, and it seems to say that you must designate a specific person who will be there in person to vote as your proxy - is that correct?  How many average owners (not on TUG) will know someone to designate???


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## ronparise

I got another email about this election   This guy made one too many factual errors in the letter.. There are a lot of good reasons to get rid of Wyndham,  so you dont have to make stuff up
*Concerned Owners at Kauai Beach Villas*

*NEWSLETTER*
*May 15, 2017*



Aloha Again To My Fellow Owners at Kauai Beach Villas:



I apologize if this email may seem long to some, particularly if you're reading this on a smartphone. I do recommend that you find a laptop or desktop computer on which you can read it. This is too important for a short blast.



I promised you in another email that I would expand on what brings me to getting involved in this way, why I think this particular vote is SO critical, and what damage I foresee Wyndham could do to our interests as owners. This will follow a bit later on in this newsletter.



But first, I want to implore you, once again, to make sure to vote. I have attached a sample ballot, which might make it easier for you to fill out your own. On the sample ballot, I have written in my name, but you could write in ANYONE to be your Proxyholder who will be there, in person, to vote on June 1st. If you are planning to be there yourself, you can still vote via the Proxy ballot and attend. If you are planning on attending yourself, there is a checkbox where you can indicate that you'll be there. Personally, I _will_ be there in person to vote and to act as your Proxyholder.



And keep in mind, I strongly ask that you keep your votes to Trish Harrington and Karen Blackford. Why? We NEED to keep them on the board. If we water down the voting (by voting for a many candidates), we risk having Wyndham use their voting to get Trish and Karen off the board, and they're the ONLY traditional owners on the board, and therefore the only ones representing our interests.



In case you didn't know, each board, the AOAO and IOA, stagger the voting for their board members. They do this to make sure there is continuity from year to year. Imagine a year having 5 new members and no one really knowing what they're doing. So this year, we're voting for 3 board members. We want to absolutely make sure that Trish and Karen stay on. Next year, there will be a vote for the other 2 board positions. We'll work on (collectively) getting 1 or more additional traditional owners on the board so that we'll have a majority.



Again, if you wish to cast your votes yourself, there are *the ways* to do so.  Regardless of what method you choose to cast your vote, the board needs to receive your vote by*May 25th at 4pm, PDT*!!




Vote by *Mail* – by now, you should have received a ballot in the mail (If you haven't, please call GPVS at 888-477-6967 to request another one. *At this point, unless you can vote by the end of the week, I don't recommend this method.*The ballot is on a pre-paid, pre-addressed postcard:
   Pahio at Kauai Beach Villas Interval Ownership Association

   c/o Grand Pacific Resorts Management

   P.O.Box 4403

   Carlsbad, CA 92018 - 9986






Vote by *Email* – Scan your ballot and email it to:  *gprproxies@gpresorts.com*









Vote *On-Line* – Visit  *http://tinyurl.com/KBVVote2017*
Make sure you type the above on the address line, not the search line. Enter your personalized password which you were provided. Follow the prompts and cast your vote.  It’s that simple.

If you have any trouble with your password, call GPVS @ *(888) 477-6967*



You may choose _me_, *Jeff Bellin*, as your *Proxyholder* to vote for you (_You need to choose a Proxyholder_ if you will not be attending.).  I will be traveling to the resort that week from Salem, Massachusetts to ensure our voting block is represented for theJune 1st vote. I will cast the votes for whom you choose if you fill in the candidate selection at the lower right of the ballot. If you do NOT fill out that section, I will use your voting power to vote for the candidates I think best represent the traditional deeded owners.



To make me your Proxyholder, go to the upper left of your ballot, check the *4th box*down and write my name, *Jeff Bellin,* into the blank. *You must submit your ballot by May 25th at 4pm, PDT*.  It's imperative that you either vote for the above candidates directly, or have me vote on your behalf via Proxy. (Please, do not check any of the first 3 Proxy boxes). *Remember, 3 total votes per unit week owned on a yearly basis, 1.5 votes per unit week owned on an every *_*other *_*year.* Again, see the sample ballot that follows:









Again, the future of our resort rests in the hands of its traditional deeded owners.  We need your vote, if we owners are going to control the board, and make the decisions that affect us. We need to keep *Trish Harrington* and *Karen Blackford* on the board, to start with.



We need YOUR VOTE to help keep Wyndham from replacing the only 2 traditional owners we still have on the board, *Trish Harrington* and *Karen Blackford*. *Please vote today!*





How Did the Kauai Beach Villas Get To Be In This Situation And Why ME??



So, how did I get caught up in this, and why is this so important now to traditional owners, owners who want to see the value of owning timeshares at the Kauai Beach Villas be as great as possible? This all started for me back in 2004 when returning for the first time since we had bought in 2001. Of course, it's Kauai and we loved the oceanfront view from our unit, the oceanfront unit guaranteed as we had paid the premium to get us a deed to waterfront buildings.

We went through the owners update presentation. During our presentation, we were offered the opportunity to give Wyndham our oceanfront unit deed, plus $7000, to become a member of Club Wyndham. I immediately thought this odd for a number of reasons:




The company PAHIO had hired to maintain the resort, Wyndham Management, was using their paid time to market their own vacation product. I thought and still think it's unethical. If you hire my restaurant consulting company to help with your restaurant, my company people shouldn't use that time to sway employees or customers away from your business.


If I gave them my deed, I would then no longer have the guarantee that I would be able come back to the Kauai Beach Villas, much less guarantee to be able to use the oceanfront buildings. At the time, I imagined that they probably only had a handful of inventory using the method of getting people into Club Wyndham, so at the time, I was thinking I'd be competing with Club Wyndham members all over the U.S. trying to stay at KBV in just a few actual units of inventory.


I'm supposed to give _them _my deed _and _$7000 to get into their club?!? I mean, what gall, I thought. I just paid 10s of thousands of dollars a few years ago to own a deed, a piece of KBV. Now they wanted me to give them the deed and several more thousands of dollars? And I would have no guarantee of getting back into KBV? With a vacation club, I own nothing, and the money I would be putting into it (the many thousands of dollars I paid for my part ownership, as well as the $7000) guaranteed me _nothing_!



I thought to myself during the presentation that something was very wrong. I looked up the IOA Board contact information and was able to get in contact with then Vice-President Trish Harrington. I told her what I had encountered. If I recall correctly, she had not been aware at that time that Wyndham was trying to secure deeds from owners. She did say that upkeep of the place was not what the board had hoped, but she liked the then current manager that was in place.

But as years went on, both the AOAO and IOA were getting less happy with the upkeep of the place and the rising maintenance fees .

Meanwhile, I did an exchange one year into the Coronado Beach Resort in Coronado, San Diego. It was the most upscale resort I had ever stayed in at the time within the U.S., and I was astounded as to the level of upkeep, as well as customer service I encountered. The staff was not only solicitous, but bent over backwards to make sure I was happy. For example, one of the benefits of the resort is free bicycle rentals which included helmets. When I informed them that none of the helmets fit my head properly (I'm a bike advocate in my hometown, so I know about the importance of proper bicycle fit), the manager on duty took me across the street to a bike shop, with cash in her hand, and rented me a helmet from the shop ($20!). A small thing, but a big statement. Any time there might be an issue, they were right on it, and with enthusiasm. It was a different experience, for sure, than what I had experienced at KBV in terms of customer service.

I talked with the general manager of the resort, who, it turned out, was a VP with Grand Pacific Resorts corporate. He he had taken over the management of the resort, himself, when it was having some issues. I told him how impressed I was with the experience and it was quite different than what I was used to at KBV. For example, you know that sterile experience of checking in at KBV at the stand-alone building? Wyndham never seemed to be inspired to alter that experience. I took a road trip up to see a couple of Grand Pacific developed resorts in Carlsbad and was bowled over by the quality.

Keeping in touch with Trish Harrington, I learned that the IOA and AOAO were becoming less and less enamored with Wyndham in the overall upkeep of the resort, including the insides of the timeshares, the grounds, and the outsides of the buildings. The resort had gone down from a Gold Crown Resort designation in the RCI system to a Silver Crown Resort, and just barely making that. Wyndham wasn't replacing tableware and glasses with equivalent quality, and they were not maintaining the numbers of stemware and settings in each unit. Owners would show up with incomplete kitchens. Furniture was being replaced with lower quality items.

And yet maintenance fees were going up – a lot! My maintenance fee started at $679 in 2002, and now it's about $1400. Why have maintenance fees gone so high when the resort's maintenance has been so meh, so mediocre? Here's why:



As complete and total hired manager of the PAHIO Kauai Beach Villas in the past, Wyndham was responsible for the upkeep of the grounds, the buildings, and the upkeep of the insides of the timeshares. They were also responsible for sales and rentals, generating income for us. What pays for the upkeep of the resort? The maintenance fees, right? Yes, but not only the maintenance fees, but rentals of unused units are also additional income which go toward the upkeep of the resort. Any deeds whose owners have essentially abandoned (and therefore not paying their maintenance fees), and unit weeks that aren't being used, Wyndham was supposed to work hard to find renters for those unused units. That rental money is supposed to help offset the costs for those owners who _are_ paying their maintenance fees. That was an important part of their job.



But Wyndham _wasn't_ working hard to fill the empty rooms with renters and generate rental income, even though that was part of the job description as resort manager. Why is this? Because their modus operandi, their working model, is to get owners to be apathetic. Notice how you didn't receive much in the way of communications from them over the years? That's intentional. They hope that you lose interest. Then, eventually, they might call you up and offer to take your deed from you for nothing. The same deed you paid 10s of thousands of dollars for, Wyndham takes that deed and turns around and sells it for retail. They get the money, and they do nothing for you. That's the opposite of what they were being paid to do.

Think about this – do they make more money getting 10% of the maintenance fees, or getting you to give them your deed for nothing and turning around and selling it as a_Wyndham_ Kauai Beach Villas deed for $15,000 (and then continue to get the maintenance fees as manager of the property)? And those pitches to have you give up your deed to them plus thousands of dollars to get you into Club Wyndham? They get your deed for nothing, they turn around and sell it for a profit _and_ they get thousands of dollars from you for Club Wyndham membership. It's quite a racket.



So Wyndham has not been very diligent about making rental income for you, as owners. To give you some idea of how little they put into making rental income (and these are numbers you can get for yourself as part of the financial numbers available to you as owners), prior to 2015, there was about 2.4 million dollars in bad debt (owners not paying or units not being used), most of that uncollectable (owners just gone deadbeat). In 2015, about $615,000 was designated as bad debt. Other than raising maintenance fees on those who do pay, the only way to put a dent into that is rental income.



In *all of* *2015*, Wyndham raised about *$165,000* in rental income, quite clearly not enough to erase the *$615,000* in debt for that year. In contrast, from *January 2017 – April 2017* *(4 months)*, Grand Pacific Resorts has made over *$300,000 (!)* in rental income for KBV. That doesn't go into GPRM's coffers. That goes to us owners to offset maintenance fees. That's _double_ what Wyndham did in _all_ of 2015, and we're only a quarter way through the year! By the end of the year, we could easily be looking at $700,000 or more in rental income. And that's money that goes to upkeep the resort so that YOU don't have to pay more. Not only that, but with the rental income now _above_the budget forecast, the IOA and GPRM can start to think about making improvements to the resort. We need to get the AOAO to hire GPRM to manage their part of the resort (grounds and exteriors of the buildings) to help improve that end of things.

Ultimately, the more money GPRM makes for us, the more maintenance fees can be kept in line, and much greater improvements can be made to the resort. The Kauai Beach Villas is a unique and intimate resort on Kauai. As you probably know, there is NO resort on Kauai which is so close to the water. The oceanfront buildings are 10s of yards from the beach and water line. There's no other resort on the island that can boast this. If this resort returned to being top-notch, luxurious, family-friendly, with entertainment (like a real resort experience should be), this would be easily worth the current maintenance fee, in my opinion.

Those coming here, whether for the first time or returning, would have a wonderful experience, and want to return again. They may be inspired to buy their first week, or buy another one. And guess what inventory they'll have to buy from? Those units that you put up for sale. All of the other resorts at which I own have a resale program. At one resort, the resort keeps 25% of the sale price and the owner gets 75%. The money the resort gets goes back to the resort to defray expenses, keeping the resort sparkling and the maintenance fees down.



We'd all love to have a way to sell our units when we no longer need them at the resort, right? That's supposed to be the job of the resort management company. They're supposed to work for us. Well, that can't really be done if there is no physical sales space on the premises. Wyndham, however, is using the clubhouse to sell timeshares at their property in Princeville. And every guest (that includes you) has to go through Wyndham's salesperson in the clubhouse in order to get their parking pass and free WiFi code. Can we change this procedure? I don't know.

Meanwhile, with those deeds that Wyndham got for free from owners who didn't care anymore, Wyndham was supposed to be assuming the payment of those associated maintenance fees. But they were slow in transferring ownership to themselves. It was no skin off their back. The owners who had given up were not paying, and IOA board was only seeing bad debt as a larger number.

By Wyndham delaying the actual transfer of the deeds to their own name by as many as 2 years, Wyndham could save 2 years of paying maintenance fees on each unit. They didn't care. They didn't care that it hurt traditional owners. They didn't care that the lack of money coming in meant raising maintenance fees on those owners who_were _paying. They made more money on eventually selling the units.

The IOA, acting in good faith, and with several years remaining on Wyndham's contract with the resort, tried to work with Wyndham to improve their quality. As years went by, the board wasn't seeing results.

IOA succeeded in voting to hire GPRM and have them come aboard when Wyndham's contract expired. Wyndham's response to this has been to try to wrest control of the IOA and eventually get back management of the entire resort. If we don't stem the tide of Wyndham throwing owners off the board, Wyndham will be able to get rid of Grand Pacific in a few years, and you can forget about us having any say in what goes on.

As I have mentioned, a similar situation occurred at the Makai Club Resort in Princeville (a resort Wyndham _still_ arrogantly calls the “_Wyndham_ Makai Club”), when, after running it down and seeing Wyndham turn around and sell deeds, making a profit for themselves, the Makai Club Resort board fired Wyndham and elected to bring in Grand Pacific Resorts to manage it. In the 3 years since GPRM has managed it, the resort's quality has gone way up, to the point that owners call it “sparkling”. Wyndham, however, is still trying to fight it. As they successfully were able to get a share of the deeds, just as they have done at KBV, they're fighting to wrestle control of the board so they can get back management of the resort. Wyndham has been calling KBV the Wyndham Kauai Beach Villas when it had been the PAHIO Kauai Beach Villas. It'd be like if you hired me to clean and maintain your house and I put “The Bellins” on your mailbox.

So, is it getting any clearer that Wyndham needs to be shown the door, or at the very least, be kept at bay?

Theoretically, I don't care which company runs the resort as long as it's a great experience and maintenance fees are kept down. The better the KBV resort experience and the more reasonable and affordable the maintenance fees, the more valuable it is not only to us as owners, but to anyone who might want to purchase a deed in the future (and that means YOUR'S, if you need or want to sell!). Wyndham has failed on all counts. This is why it is SO critical that you vote, and the voting deadline to get your vote in GPVS's hands is May 25th by 4pm, PDT. Please, do yourself and every other owner a favor – *VOTE and do it today!!* And give your votes ONLY to *Trish Harrington and Karen Blackford*. *Do not dilute your votes.*



Again, if you need to get another copy of the ballot package, or need to get your personal info so you can vote, contact Grand Pacific Vacation Services at 888-477-6967. I'll be around for a few days if you want to ask me anything related to this, but I'm not a voting administrator. I'm not a IOA board member. I don't work for GPRM.I'm like you, an owner. And I'm an owner interested in making KBV a great, worthwhile, and affordable resort jewel on Kaua'i. If Wyndham is allowed to impose their own will, you'll be powerless, they're not going to take your needs into account, maintenance fees will continue to go up rapidly, and your deed will have less worth.



We need to reverse that trend. If we don't and Wyndham takes over the board completely, that will be the end of our ability to influence decisions regarding the resort. We want a resort that sparkles, that is in demand (so that your deed becomes more valuable in case you want to sell it), with maintenance fees that are reasonable and make sense.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

Hi -

I wrote that letter. To which facts are you referring? 

Is it that Wyndham was asking for deeds plus money to be handed over to get into a Club Wyndham membership? That was the case with me, and I can tell you a number of others. 

But here's the real crux of the issue. Assuming you're not a troll and a real, individual owner (regardless of whether you now hold a deed through Club Wyndham or you are an individual owner from the PAHIO days), do you want the boards to be controlled by individual owners, with individual owners making decisions on how the Kauai Beach Villas should be run, or do you want Wyndham taking over and running the place, making decisions for you, taking decisions out of your hands completely?

The Interval Owners Association, the timeshare board, currently has 3 Wyndham members on the board to 2 individual owners. Voting is split over 2 years, so 3 are being voted on this year, and 2 next year. For those who would prefer to have individual owners be the Directors to shape decisions on how the resort should be run, you should be voting for Karen Blackford and Trish Harrington. Voting for more than those 2 will water down your votes. NEXT year, the other 2 positions on the board will be voted for. At that point, we'll want to take 1 or both of those spots so that we, the individual owners, can retain control and make decisions regarding the resort's well-being. If Wyndham wins this year and next, they'll be in position to end the contract with Grand Pacific Resort Management and vote themselves back in as the management of the resort. If that happens, you can forget about the idea of you or me being able to get on the board and help shape the future of the resort. It will become just a Wyndham corporate resort. That is troubling for me. 

So do you want the board of directors comprised of Wyndham corporate making the decisions, or do you want individual owners who will make decisions that benefit the interests of the individual owners? I can tell you that if you look at the books, and you're entitled to as owners, you can see how Wyndham made a mess of things and caused the maintenance fees to rise up rapidly. You'll want to look at rental income and see what Wyndham has generated over the years, then look at the rental income that GPRM has generated since they took over. You'll see a HUGE difference. And it's rental income as well as getting owners to pay their maintenance fees, or selling deadbeat deeds to those that will, that keeps the maintenance fees down. You'll see how little of that, in comparison, has happened over the last many years prior to GPRM being hired. 

I'm just an individual Kauai Beach Villa unit owner, owning since 2001, and want to see to it that individual owners are best served.

Jeff Bellin


----------



## DeniseM

Please clarify - I can vote for the candidates of my choice, but I have to designate a proxy who will be AT the meeting. 

If I designate the board as my proxy, (2nd and 3rd options) then they will have control of my votes and can ignore my selections, and vote however they want - correct?

And even if I choose Jeff (who is probably a perfectly dependable and honest person) I have no way of knowing if he will execute my choices - correct?


----------



## Jeff From Salem

DeniseM said:


> Please clarify - I can vote for the candidates of my choice, but I have to designate a proxy who will be AT the meeting.
> 
> If I designate the board as my proxy, (2nd and 3rd options) then they will have control of my votes and can ignore my selections, and vote however they want - correct?
> 
> And even if I choose Jeff (who is probably a perfectly dependable and honest person) I have no way of knowing if he will execute my choices - correct?



You should designate a Proxyholder whom 1) you know is going to be there in person, and 2)  you trust, as best as you can, to carry out your votes in your interests, either to vote for the specific candidates you designate, or to choose candidates for you. If you choose the 2nd or 3rd options, you'll need to trust the Wyndham dominated board to vote honorably. If you have chosen candidates, they're supposed to vote as you selected, but....

I'd like to see them re-write that Proxy part of the ballot. I think it's sort of confusing.

Honestly, I have never been there for a vote before (You can partly tell how seriously I am taking this and concerned I am that I am flying from Boston to Lihue just for this vote.). I have always voted, but it was always from afar with a Proxy ballot. 

If you want to take my advice, check the 4th box and either write _my _name, Jeff Bellin, or write-in Trish Harrington's or Karen Blackford's name. You can figure they won't screw around with your vote, right? I know Trish personally, as since 2005, when I encountered the questionable Wyndham sales presentation at the resort, I called her up (from the readily available contact info at the time) to tell her about my experience. Since then, I have been researching what has been going on there, writing about it occasionally in the periodical TimeSharing Today. While there may be a few details that I may not have exactly right, I have been seeing patterns around the industry, not only with Wyndham but with Diamond. There are probably others. I have seen where initiatives such as what I have taken on have worked. Others have been more of a struggle. I just think that this particular vote is coming at a critical time, and I think we, as owners, if we band together, we can keep control of the resort, and have it be what WE want it to be. I like knowing that I can call up a Director and that person is in the same or similar boat as I am, interested in the same things because they are just another individual owner. 

Jeff


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## DeniseM

I don't remember the ballot being this way before, with a designated proxy - weird.


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## Jeff From Salem

DeniseM said:


> I don't remember the ballot being this way before, with a designated proxy - weird.



Y'know, I agree with you. I'm not sure why it was written that way. Even my wife, who is a lawyer, looked at it and thought that it wasn't all that well written. I'll mention it when I get there, perhaps it can be changed it for next time.


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## DeniseM

Is it even legal to require a proxy? - With my other resorts, we just votes for a candidate.


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## Jeff From Salem

DeniseM said:


> Is it even legal to require a proxy? - With my other resorts, we just votes for a candidate.



You got me. I don't know. I have personally received a few who are similarly confused. I'd like it to be fixed for next time. Meanwhile, I'm off to bed. The only thing that has kept me up (I was up until 1:30am crafting that letter that someone posted above) is an extra inning Red Sox game (They're playing the St. Louis Cardinals).


----------



## ronparise

DeniseM said:


> Please clarify - I can vote for the candidates of my choice, but I have to designate a proxy who will be AT the meeting.
> 
> If I designate the board as my proxy, (2nd and 3rd options) then they will have control of my votes and can ignore my selections, and vote however they want - correct?
> 
> And even if I choose Jeff (who is probably a perfectly dependable and honest person) I have no way of knowing if he will execute my choices - correct?




You can either give your proxy the freedom to vote as they choose, or require them  to vote as you direct


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## ecwinch

DeniseM said:


> Is it even legal to require a proxy? - With my other resorts, we just votes for a candidate.


It would vary depending on how the resort association is organized (i.e. typically a non-profit corporation of some sort) and the applicable state law dictating elections for that type of organization.

For instance in California if a HOA is organized as a non-profit mutual benefit corporation then the applicable provisions of the California Corporate Code would apply. And under applicable law in CA, there is generally only two ways that votes can be cast in a BoD election - either in person or by designating someone who will be present at the meeting to vote for you as your proxy.

Where you think you are voting directly by ballot, what you typically are doing is making the BoD secretary your proxy and directing them to vote as you have marked your ballot. As Ron points out this is called a directed proxy, since the proxy holder is only authorized to vote as you have marked your ballot. Or you can designate someone else and grant them authority to vote as they decide.


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## TUGBrian

drat, i wish id seen this last week to include in the newsletter...looks like itll be 2 days too late...but still a great read for KBV owners!


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## TheTimeTraveler

So can someone update all our curious readers as to the actual outcome of the vote ?




.


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## DeniseM

They haven't voted yet - the meeting is June 1.


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## TUGBrian

oh nice, I saw earlier that the deadline was may 25?  glad i got it in before then!


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## DeniseM

May 25th is the deadline for owners to submit their proxy votes, and the actual meeting at which the voting will take place  is June 1.


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## DeniseM

Anyone know what happened at the June 1st election?


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## Jeff From Salem

DeniseM said:


> Anyone know what happened at the June 1st election?



Yup. I was there. I don't have the exact numbers, but Trish Harrington got the most number of votes at about 1300.

Here are your top 3 vote getters, the ones who will be on the board for the next 2 year term:

1) Trish Harrington
2) Danielle Ramos
3) Larry Walker


----------



## Pathways

Jeff From Salem said:


> Yup. I was there. I don't have the exact numbers, but Trish Harrington got the most number of votes at about 1300.
> 
> Here are your top 3 vote getters, the ones who will be on the board for the next 2 year term:
> 
> 1) Trish Harrington
> 2) Danielle Ramos
> 3) Larry Walker



So don't keep us interlopers of this thread in suspense. Were these the independent candidates or Wyndham supported?


----------



## Jeff From Salem

Only Danielle, a.k.a. Dani, is a Wyndham person. She is a Wyndham employee. She has been involved with KBV for a long time. Trish Harrington is absolutely NOT a Wyndham person. From what I understand, Larry Warner (I mispelled his name in the last post. My apologies) is someone I don't know personally. He has tried to run a few times before. I understand that he is a traditional owner with interests in that direction.

I can tell you that Wyndham had about 3300 votes, having 1100 deeds in their possession (about 1/5th of the deeds), and used them entirely to vote for 3 Wyndham people, split 3 ways (about 1100 each). Of those, only Danielle got elected.


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## DeniseM

Hi Jeff - Thank you for the update.  While I completely understand your desire to have a private forum for secure owner conversations, please don't leave TUG out of the loop, because we are certainly interested in issues, and we can also help get out the vote.


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## Jeff From Salem

Sure. I'm glad I discovered this group, too. But there are going to be things that need to be discussed, I think, in a more closed environment. We'll see how it works, anyway. I don't have much time today or tomorrow to much aside from some of my own work (I'm a working actor, and these next couple of days, including today, are busy for me.).


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## TUGBrian

if you were in need of a private owner forum, we can provide such an item if you think thats something the HOA would go for!


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## Jeff From Salem

TUGBrian said:


> if you were in need of a private owner forum, we can provide such an item if you think thats something the HOA would go for!



How would you keep non-members of the group from reading the content?


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## TUGBrian

forum software has the ability to limit access to "subforums" to individual users or "groups" of users.

for example the SIGHTINGS forum is only visible to TUG members.


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## DeniseM

I believe the OP's goal is to prevent Wyndham management and Wyndham board members from accessing a private group, and since TUG doesn't filter access to private groups, there would be nothing to prevent Wyndham "infiltrators" from becoming TUG members and gaining access.


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## Jeff From Salem

DeniseM said:


> I believe the OP's goal is to prevent Wyndham management and Wyndham board members from accessing a private group, and since TUG doesn't filter access to private groups, there would be nothing to prevent Wyndham "infiltrators" from becoming TUG members and gaining access.



Correct. Thanks Denise!

JB


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## jacknsara

Aloha,

For various reasons with a critical one being the ready access to the membership register per Jan 17, 2018 email from kbvinfo@gpresorts.com , I have decided to submit my name as a candidate for the Kauai Beach Villas (KBV) Board of Directors (BoD) once again.  I have decided to re-use this thread from my prior two candidacies.  At a minimum, anyone who wants to can assess my statements over that time frame.

Sara and I have already made arrangements to attend the May 2018 annual meeting in person.

I recently submitted my KBV candidate questionnaire.  The following is extracted from the contents of that form:

KBV faces significant challenges.  The proximate cause of high levels of bad debt for many timeshare resorts including KBV is the negligible or negative aftermarket value of timeshare units. If this were an easy problem to fix, many timeshare BODs would apply the fix. Consequently, it is a reasonable inference that it is not an easy problem to fix.  Future success may require the active engagement of the majority of all the owners.  Developing communities of common interest / action is the kind of challenge that I have thrived on in the past.  Now that I am retired, I have the time and interest to help guide KBV to long term success.

Many of our owners are in or approaching a circumstance where it no longer makes sense for them to continue as owners (i.e. continue paying maintenance fees).  It is not easy for these owners to find a buyer for their ownership.  The impact of the KBV IOA competing to sell the non performing units it repossesses with current owners trying to get out needs to be carefully assessed.   Solutions to this conundrum may require engagement of the majority of owners.  
A key decision is whether the current ownership wants to realistically accept the challenge of remaining independent.  Assuming they do, then the IOA (led by its BoD) needs to develop and implement strategies to increase the market demand to own KBV timeshares.  To my knowledge, the IOA has never had a budget line for marketing.
However, if the majority of the owners do not want to financially commit to addressing the aftermarket challenge, then the consequences of that need to be fully communicated.
Regardless of one’s preferences, these challenges and ideas to meet them need to be communicated bi-directionally between the IOA board and the ownership base.  Ultimately, the majority of the owners need to be sufficiently engaged that they actually vote their KBV ballots.

The last ten years of my Boeing career (2004-2014) were in the Office of Internal Governance / Global Trade Controls.  I am quite familiar with reading regulations and assuring that plans and actions are compliant.   Prior to that, I supported Boeing senior leadership in various tasks including strategic planning.   Nearer the beginning of my 30 year Boeing career I was the manager of a group that was responsible for development of the long range capital plan and submittal of the annual capital budget (~$300M) for a major parts making division.   I am well versed in the theory of constraints thinking processes which are integrated problem-solving tools based on rigorous cause-and-effect logic.

Mahalo,

Jack


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## DaveNV

Good luck, Jack.  I sold my KBV unit last year, or I'd certainly vote for you again.  Your dedication to properly running the resort has a long history.  I hope you make the Board this year.

Dave


----------



## Jeff From Salem

jacknsara said:


> Aloha,
> 
> For various reasons with a critical one being the ready access to the membership register per Jan 17, 2018 email from kbvinfo@gpresorts.com , I have decided to submit my name as a candidate for the Kauai Beach Villas (KBV) Board of Directors (BoD) once again.  I have decided to re-use this thread from my prior two candidacies.  At a minimum, anyone who wants to can assess my statements over that time frame.
> 
> Sara and I have already made arrangements to attend the May 2018 annual meeting in person.
> 
> I recently submitted my KBV candidate questionnaire.  The following is extracted from the contents of that form:
> 
> KBV faces significant challenges.  The proximate cause of high levels of bad debt for many timeshare resorts including KBV is the negligible or negative aftermarket value of timeshare units. If this were an easy problem to fix, many timeshare BODs would apply the fix. Consequently, it is a reasonable inference that it is not an easy problem to fix.  Future success may require the active engagement of the majority of all the owners.  Developing communities of common interest / action is the kind of challenge that I have thrived on in the past.  Now that I am retired, I have the time and interest to help guide KBV to long term success.
> 
> Many of our owners are in or approaching a circumstance where it no longer makes sense for them to continue as owners (i.e. continue paying maintenance fees).  It is not easy for these owners to find a buyer for their ownership.  The impact of the KBV IOA competing to sell the non performing units it repossesses with current owners trying to get out needs to be carefully assessed.   Solutions to this conundrum may require engagement of the majority of owners.
> A key decision is whether the current ownership wants to realistically accept the challenge of remaining independent.  Assuming they do, then the IOA (led by its BoD) needs to develop and implement strategies to increase the market demand to own KBV timeshares.  To my knowledge, the IOA has never had a budget line for marketing.
> However, if the majority of the owners do not want to financially commit to addressing the aftermarket challenge, then the consequences of that need to be fully communicated.
> Regardless of one’s preferences, these challenges and ideas to meet them need to be communicated bi-directionally between the IOA board and the ownership base.  Ultimately, the majority of the owners need to be sufficiently engaged that they actually vote their KBV ballots.
> 
> The last ten years of my Boeing career (2004-2014) were in the Office of Internal Governance / Global Trade Controls.  I am quite familiar with reading regulations and assuring that plans and actions are compliant.   Prior to that, I supported Boeing senior leadership in various tasks including strategic planning.   Nearer the beginning of my 30 year Boeing career I was the manager of a group that was responsible for development of the long range capital plan and submittal of the annual capital budget (~$300M) for a major parts making division.   I am well versed in the theory of constraints thinking processes which are integrated problem-solving tools based on rigorous cause-and-effect logic.
> 
> Mahalo,
> 
> Jack



Aloha folks!

Just to let you know that I have also thrown my hat into the ring to run for the IOA board. 

I wanted to respond to Jack's remarks about KBV needing a plan for marketing. 

As some of you may know, I have been researching, keeping a fairly close eye, on Wyndham's practices as manager since 2005. I have published articles and editorials about it in the publication, TimeSharing Today. I was instrumental in introducing Grand Pacific as a management company to the KBV board, after experiencing several of their timeshares (I don't own any, but stayed at a few and was really impressed compared to what I experienced at KBV via Wyndham.). Part of that research has been the gradual decrease in the sense of value of spending a week at KBV relative to the maintenance fees. That, and it can seem a bit shabby around the edges. Still, the location is awesome. Lack of use of the facilities next door, leaving only the smallish pool and jacuzzi at the rear of the resort, doesn't help. Last year, I started the Yahoo KBV Owners group (You're welcome to be part of that too, if you're an owner. If you're interested in being on that list, send an email to kbvowners-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

1) Regarding marketing, a _major _problem is that the hotel next door, with their relationship with Wyndham, has not allowed Grand Pacific to use any of their space to conduct on resort sales. That is HUGE. The most avid, motivated buyer will be the one that visits the resort and wants to buy in. With no physical space from which to conduct sales nor a model to show, that makes it hard to land the sale. I know I would have never bought a week without being on the property first. 

Grand Pacific, furthermore, has done a GREAT job in increasing revenue from rentals. They raised over $800,000 last year. In comparison, in 2016, the last full year Wyndham was in charge of managing the timeshare resort, they did just over $100,000. So Grand Pacific has done really well to raise money to do upgrades (they are about to unveil internal unit upgrade plans as a result). But their hands are somewhat tied with regard to sales. Grand Pacific has been working big time on updating the owners list so that they contact deadbeat owners about paying their maintenance fees as well as making the list available for owners (for non-commercial uses). 

And as a side note, Grand Pacific has also increased onsite activities to help make the experience of staying there more fun. They're also trying to organize off-site group trips, such as to museums and restaurants. 

If I were to be elected, I would absolutely sure to make an upfront priority to figure out how to create a sales space for Grand Pacific (or whatever company manages our resort). As the units are upgraded (including more air conditioning in the units), and the overall resort experience goes up, there will be more demand to own. And the more paying owners there are, the more valuable your deed will be, and it will be easier to resell them. Furthermore, with more sales activity, it will allow Grand Pacific to help resell your deed. All the dominos, in effect, will follow. 

2) On the front burner currently are negotiations, led by our General Manager, Clinton Owen (a Grand Pacific employee), to put in place an agreement between the hotel and KBV to allow KBV owners and guests to use the hotel facilities, including the pools and the workout club. The hotel board is supposed to be voting on the agreement (an agreement between their GM and our's has apparently been in place). Unfortunately, the board is not acting fast on voting on it. 

Before any big time marketing is done, in any event, I think we would want it to be done when KBV's outside value is high. And again, with no physical facilities currently in which to close to deal, it's not optimal either. 

Let me know if you have any questions.

Aloha,

Jeff Bellin


----------



## jacknsara

Aloha,

In a few days, I will commence sending out a board of directors campaign email to the approximately 3/4 of Kauai Beach Villas (KBV) owners who have provided an email address to KBV.

I have posted pdf files of the email message and attachment at https://sites.google.com/site/jackgoodstein/kauai-beach-villas 

My printed candidate statement included the url for this TUG thread, so some KBV owners who did not provide their email may find this thread and use the link above to get the files.  Of course, all tuggers are welcome to access it if they are interested.

I may choose to update the pdfs at my website in the next few days based on feedback received, but the file names are expected to remain the same.  I plan to update the date in the header to reflect the date the pdf is posted.

Mahalo

Jack Goodstein


----------



## cdn_traveler

Hi Jack,

Glad to give you our vote and our proxy.  Unfortunately, aside from the email that we received recently from you and a couple of other candidates, we have not received anything in the mail about BOD elections.   I'm now wondering if this been sent out to owners already and we just didn't get it.

Thanks,
Susan


----------



## DNRNFV

Jeff From Salem said:


> Aloha folks!
> 
> Just to let you know that I have also thrown my hat into the ring to run for the IOA board.
> 
> Jeff Bellin



Jeff, I appreciate your candidacy and would like to support it.  Are you sending out a letter to owners directly?  I will need to assign proxies for my two units.


----------



## jacknsara

cdn_traveler said:


> Hi Jack,
> 
> Glad to give you our vote and our proxy.  Unfortunately, aside from the email that we received recently from you and a couple of other candidates, we have not received anything in the mail about BOD elections.   I'm now wondering if this been sent out to owners already and we just didn't get it.
> 
> Thanks,
> Susan


Aloha Susan,
The USPS ballots are supposed to be mailed on Monday, April 2.  It is my understanding that only three candidates will be on the ballot for two positions.  One of the candidates is Linda Kolstad, the current president.  I believe she controls all the Wyndham votes, so that leaves the other candidate & incumbent Lou Colombo and I vying for the remaining seat.  
Jack


----------



## bryanphunter

Look forward to vote for you Jack and Jeff.  Been thinking of unloading my oceanfront unit, but I want to see how things improve.  I think progress can be made.  It is too bad that MF's are the same regardless of view. I realize the upkeep is no different if the unit is in Building A or Building H, but it sure makes a difference on the vacation experience.  Best of luck on the upcoming election!


----------



## Jeff From Salem

bryanphunter said:


> Look forward to vote for you Jack and Jeff.  Been thinking of unloading my oceanfront unit, but I want to see how things improve.  I think progress can be made.  It is too bad that MF's are the same regardless of view. I realize the upkeep is no different if the unit is in Building A or Building H, but it sure makes a difference on the vacation experience.  Best of luck on the upcoming election!



I might be wrong, but I thought that oceanfront unit maintenance fees _are _a little higher. I do know this, Bryan - your oceanfront deed is worth something on the open market. Do not ever just give it away, unless that your choice to do so. 

Things ARE getting better at the resort, and have been since Grand Pacific took over. 

I am considering going to the annual meeting to show support for the anti-Wyndham individual owners and candidates. I'm going to urge voting for Jack Goodstein (I did not make it onto the ballot this time, itself a issue with many), and, if you're not planning to attend yourself, to give your Proxy votes to Karen Blackford. 

Aloha,

Jeff


----------



## DaveNV

Jeff From Salem said:


> I might be wrong, but I thought that oceanfront unit maintenance fees _are _a little higher.
> 
> Aloha,
> 
> Jeff




Jeff, they are the same.  There are three unit types at KBV:  1br1ba, 1br2ba, and 2br2ba.  There are three view types: Garden View, Lagoon View, and Ocean View.  The 1br1ba units are all considered Garden View (e.g parking lot) because they are located on the back side of the buildings.  But technically, the 1br1ba units in Buildings F and G have a partial ocean view from the lanai, even though the straight-ahead view from the living room is interior to the resort.  

The 1br2ba units in Buildings A through E are all Lagoon View.  The 1br2ba units in Buildings F and G are Ocean View, as they are on the ocean side of those buildings, and the 1br2ba units in Building G are fully ocean front.  There are no 1br1ba or 1br2ba units in Building H.  

2br2ba units in Buildings A through E are all Lagoon View.  2br2ba units in Buildings F, G, and H are all ocean view, and technically, the 2br2ba units in Buildings G and H are fully ocean front.  

An owner reserving their week can't book "above" the view type that they own, although I suppose an owner in a Ocean View unit could book Lagoon View, if they wanted to.  The actual unit an owner can request floats, based on the check in day.  There is a schedule of which units check in on which day.

Despite all that, there are still only three maintenance fees at KBV, based strictly on owned unit type.  That is why the unit number on the deed is critical.  It controls everything.

Dave


----------



## linsj

Jeff From Salem said:


> I might be wrong, but I thought that oceanfront unit maintenance fees _are _a little higher.



Not true. MF is based on size of unit only.

ETA: Dave beat me it to the answer.


----------



## DaveNV

linsj said:


> Not true. MF is based on size of unit only.
> 
> ETA: Dave beat me it to the answer.



Sorry.  Fast fingers. 

Dave


----------



## Jeff From Salem

linsj said:


> Not true. MF is based on size of unit only.
> 
> ETA: Dave beat me it to the answer.




Noted. Thanks!

Interesting that at some resorts, there are slightly different sized units of each type, and each unit is assessed a slightly different maintenance fee. But that works only with fixed week resorts, I would think.


----------



## DaveNV

Jeff From Salem said:


> Noted. Thanks!
> 
> Interesting that at some resorts, there are slightly different sized units of each type, and each unit is assessed a slightly different maintenance fee. But that works only with fixed week resorts, I would think.



I agree.  I think in the case of KBV, everything was built at the same time, and each building (except H, which is only 2br units) is identical to each of the other buildings. The only thing different is building orientation, and the view out the windows.  The units of a given type are identical to each other, in terms of layout and size.

Dave


----------



## Jeff From Salem

By the way, folks, I have a copy of the updated KBV Owners List (obtainable by request from Clinton Owen at KBV). I noticed my wife and I are not on the list.

I am contacting Clinton Owen, the General Manager, about this. I suggest that you make sure that your contact info (including name, email address, mailing address, and phone number) are included.

Clinton can be reached at cowen@gpresorts.com

He can be contacted for any matters related to the resort, including suggestions, compliments, complaints, etc.

Aloha,

Jeff


----------



## Jeff From Salem

DaveNW said:


> I agree.  I think in the case of KBV, everything was built at the same time, and each building (except H, which is only 2br units) is identical to each of the other buildings. The only thing different is building orientation, and the view out the windows.  The units of a given type are identical to each other, in terms of layout and size.
> 
> Dave



Does that make the H building smaller or larger? I'm staying in H for the very first time later this year.


----------



## DaveNV

Jeff From Salem said:


> Does that make the H building smaller or larger? I'm staying in H for the very first time later this year.



H building has fewer units in it, so is a slightly smaller building, but the unit sizes it has are the same.  If you take the floor plan layout of the other buildings and slice off the one bedroom units on the two ends, the rest is the same, and that's what H is.  I think when they built it, they knew it would encroach on the hotel next door, so shortened the building by that much.

When KBV was originally built, it was combined with the (Sheraton?) hotel next door.  Then the big breakup happened, the hotel went independent, and the timeshare buildings were sold off as their own thing.  That's why KBV has so many tennis courts, and the hotel has such a huge swimming pool.  There was a time when it was all one big resort. 

If you notice the sidewalks, they intertwine with the hotel's sidewalks, because originally it was one big happy (if dysfunctional) family. 

Dave


----------



## Jeff From Salem

DaveNW said:


> H building has few units in it, so is a slightly smaller building, but the unit sizes it has are the same.  If you take the floor plan layout of the other buildings and slice off the one bedroom units on the two ends, the rest is the same, and that's what H is.  I think when they built it, they knew it would encroach on the hotel next door, so shortened the building by that much.
> 
> When KBV was originally built, it was combined with the (Sheraton?) hotel next door.  Then the big breakup happened, the hotel went independent, and the timeshare buildings were sold off as their own thing.  That's why KBV has so many tennis courts, and the hotel has such a huge swimming pool.  There was a time when it was all one big resort.
> 
> If you notice the sidewalks, they intertwine with the hotel's sidewalks, because originally it was one big happy (if dysfunctional) family.
> 
> Dave



Yes, that's how I recall it was when I purchased in 2001. In fact, many of us who purchased _assumed _that the co-use of facilities was part of the contract. And in a way, it was. But the co-use of facilities was not guaranteed, unfortunately. That aspect, written in the by-laws, was allowed to be re-visited, so we're currently in limbo regarding being able to use the facilities next door, and they, the use of the tennis courts and gas grills.

Jeff


----------



## DaveNV

Jeff From Salem said:


> Yes, that's how I recall it was when I purchased in 2001. In fact, many of us who purchased _assumed _that the co-use of facilities was part of the contract. And in a way, it was. But the co-use of facilities was not guaranteed, unfortunately. That aspect, written in the by-laws, was allowed to be re-visited, so we're currently in limbo regarding being able to use the facilities next door, and they, the use of the tennis courts and gas grills.
> 
> Jeff


Then you’ll also recall the extra MFs they collected for the swimming pool remodel. Remember the lazy river plans? I think it was around 2005 or 06. MFs jumped by a lot that year. Then Wyndham stole the money to use at Bali Hai, and left KBV with a tiny budget for the pool remodel. I’m still annoyed about that, and it’s one of the reasons I don’t own there anymore.

Dave


----------



## Jeff From Salem

Jeff From Salem said:


> By the way, folks, I have a copy of the updated KBV Owners List (obtainable by request from Clinton Owen at KBV). I noticed my wife and I are not on the list.
> 
> I am contacting Clinton Owen, the General Manager, about this. I suggest that you make sure that your contact info (including name, email address, mailing address, and phone number) are included.
> 
> Clinton can be reached at cowen@gpresorts.com
> 
> He can be contacted for any matters related to the resort, including suggestions, compliments, complaints, etc.
> 
> Aloha,
> 
> Jeff



An update. I think I need a new pair of eyes or a new brain. Honest to god, I looked at the owners list at least 3 times and didn't see my name. I looked at it a 4th time and I saw it. 

So I did jump the gun. 

I know that this caused a number of owners to contact Clinton Owen. I contacted him and he told me that, indeed, the best way to update your owner information is to do so through the KBV GPR website. I'll have specific instructions coming, but essentially, go to the kauaibeachvillasresort.com page, go to the Owners Community page. You can either chat with an online Grand Pacific Resorts representative to check on your owner info, or get the password to go into the Owners section of the site. Once there, there is a section to update your owner's info, as well as other things to do.

Sorry if this caused any confusion. Better safe than sorry, I'd say, though. And ballots will be going out in the next few days.

Mahalo,

Jeff


----------



## Jeff From Salem

DaveNW said:


> Then you’ll also recall the extra MFs they collected for the swimming pool remodel. Remember the lazy river plans? I think it was around 2005 or 06. MFs jumped by a lot that year. Then Wyndham stole the money to use at Bali Hai, and left KBV with a tiny budget for the pool remodel. I’m still annoyed about that, and it’s one of the reasons I don’t own there anymore.
> 
> Dave



Y'know, I wasn't aware of that, Dave. I didn't know that more money had been allotted toward the pool. Hmmm.......If that's true, that's another BIG mark against Wyndham. Is there documentation that shows that that was the case?


----------



## DaveNV

Jeff From Salem said:


> Y'know, I wasn't aware of that, Dave. I didn't know that more money had been allotted toward the pool. Hmmm.......If that's true, that's another BIG mark against Wyndham. Is there documentation that shows that that was the case?



It’s far enough back that I don’t know where or how the documentation could be found. Jack might know.  The MF one year jumped with a huge increase so they could do all this work, that never happened. Then the money was spirited away, somehow, about the time Bali Hai became the big draw. What KBV got was a minor pool remodel, and nothing to the extent that had been promised.

Dave


----------



## Jeff From Salem

Trish Harrington was on the Board at the time. I can ask her.


----------



## bianchicycle

jacknsara said:


> Aloha Susan,
> The USPS ballots are supposed to be mailed on Monday, April 2.  It is my understanding that only three candidates will be on the ballot for two positions.  One of the candidates is Linda Kolstad, the current president.  I believe she controls all the Wyndham votes, so that leaves the other candidate & incumbent Lou Colombo and I vying for the remaining seat.
> Jack



How many seats are open for this elections?


----------



## Jeff From Salem

bianchicycle said:


> How many seats are open for this elections?



There are 2 seats up for voting. Next year there will be 3 seats. Each year, it alternates, with 2 year terms of service.

(By the way, bianchicycle, as an aside, my current road bike is a Bianchi Eros.)


----------



## jacknsara

DaveNW said:


> It’s far enough back that I don’t know where or how the documentation could be found. Jack might know.  The MF one year jumped with a huge increase so they could do all this work, that never happened. Then the money was spirited away, somehow, about the time Bali Hai became the big draw. What KBV got was a minor pool remodel, and nothing to the extent that had been promised.
> 
> Dave


Aloha,
We've had this conversation a number of years ago.  My memory is different than yours.  Since I do not have any written documentation to back up my memory, I cannot claim it is more accurate than yours.
My memory in a nutshell:  there was an approximately $100/yr/unit increase in MFs that was supposed to last for a handful of years to address the pool issue.  The issue began when the condotel developer abruptly divorced us and put up hostile signs.  Concurrently, MFs all over Hawaii started to rapidly increase.  Every year there was a different story about why construction had not begun.  Finally, the condotel owner went bankrupt and for awhile KBV was allowed access to the pools (some years free some years with a fee). Some cosmetic changes were implemented to the area surrounding the KBV small pool.  I never saw any specific evidence of KBV money being misallocated to other resorts. 
Some folks on TUG think KBV has had a special assessment in the past.  My memory is that we have never had a special assessment.  I have aged sufficiently that I no longer engage in arguments that are based on my memory
Jack


----------



## DaveNV

jacknsara said:


> Aloha,
> We've had this conversation a number of years ago.  My memory is different than yours.
> 
> Jack




Thanks, Jack.  You've hit on the high points, and I will absolutely agree that I may well be mis-remembering things.  My recollection is that I was told by a former female Manager in the Front Office during an Owner's Update one year that the extra funds had been collected specifically to do a big pool remodel. I recall hearing the term "lazy river" being kicked around, because at that point I had never seen one.  I agree they had repeated excuses about why things weren't ever started - the one that made me laugh out loud was because there were no construction crews to hire - everybody was too busy.  And then, (again, my recollection), being told the money had been shifted to Bali Hai, to help in the construction up there, and that was why the pool remodel was being scaled down so far.  The mini-remodel they later did on the pool area was pretty dissatisfying after that.  The second remodel was better.  But truth be told, I never put a toe in the pool while I owned at KBV.  So maybe it's a lot of anxiety over nothing, but it was always a bone of contention for me, as an owner.

Dave


----------



## Jeff From Salem

Aloha Fellow Individual Kauai Beach Villas independent owners -


Karen Blackford and I have developed the following page, which is a MUST read if you are interested in having your Interval Owners Association (IOA) Board work for you. Currently Wyndham Corporation controls the board, and that is through them having been given 1100 deeds, with the voting power to go along with it.


We, Karen and I, along with your help, which includes voting, are committed to getting control of the board back into the hands and control of independent, individual owners.


Please go to this website and read up on as much as you can before you vote!


https://savekbv.org/


Mahalo!!


Jeff Bellin


----------



## leehad50

I just signed up for this Forum today. My wife and I bought at PKBV in 2000. We return every year except for the two years we let our children go as wedding presents. I became aware of the Wyndham take-over attempt last year and we gave our proxy votes to Karen and Jeff. I have visited https://savekbv.org and have been reading the information. We were troubled when Wyndham became the management company and developed a rather negative with some of the salespeople at Princeville. I would like to end the Wyndham control of the Board of Directors. My concern is not knowing who all the people are. I've read much but reading it doesn't make it all true. It appears there are only three candidates this year: Louis Colombo (incumbent), Linda Kolstad (incumbent), and Jack Goodstein. I know nothing about Jack Goodstein. Do any of you have any experience with these people?


----------



## DeniseM

Jack is a long-time Tugger and this thread was started by him (go back to page 1, by clicking on the 1 right below this message on the left.)  I am going to give Jack my votes.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

leehad50 said:


> I just signed up for this Forum today. My wife and I bought at PKBV in 2000. We return every year except for the two years we let our children go as wedding presents. I became aware of the Wyndham take-over attempt last year and we gave our proxy votes to Karen and Jeff. I have visited https://savekbv.org and have been reading the information. We were troubled when Wyndham became the management company and developed a rather negative with some of the salespeople at Princeville. I would like to end the Wyndham control of the Board of Directors. My concern is not knowing who all the people are. I've read much but reading it doesn't make it all true. It appears there are only three candidates this year: Louis Colombo (incumbent), Linda Kolstad (incumbent), and Jack Goodstein. I know nothing about Jack Goodstein. Do any of you have any experience with these people?



Jack is pretty new to me, too, but I have talked with him at length. As Denise points out, Jack started this particular thread. You can go back and browse it from the beginning. 

I'm behind his candidacy. He has been an owner for a long time, and he feels that the strongest ownership is one where the maximum number of independent owners are voting. One of his missions is to greatly increase the number of independent voters who actually vote. We need the numbers to ensure that control of the IOA BOD (Independent Owners Assocition, the timeshare board) is held by individual, independent owners, not Wyndham. Wyndham wants nothing more than to essentially fire Grand Pacific Resorts Management from being our management company, in spite of the great job they're doing in every aspect, and put themselves back in. This could happen if we don't get back majority of the Board Of Directors.

Trish Harrington, a long-time owner, is the one reliable person on the Board who votes in our interests consistently. She needs assistance. She can't do it alone.

Karen Blackford is a long-time owner who was voted off the BOD by Wyndham's votes last year. She and I tried to get on the ballot. The nominating committee, controlled by Wyndham voices, refused to put Karen and/or me on the ballot.

Linda is a Wyndham employee. Larry votes and acts consistently with Linda. Danielle Ramos and Lou Columbo comprise the rest of the BOD along with Trish Harrington. Again, Trish is the only one who consistently acts in the interests of individual owners.

If you are anyone is interested, I set up a KBV Yahoo discussion group. It's open by request. If you're interested, send an email to
kbvowners-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

Mahalo,

Jeff


----------



## Jeff From Salem

One quick correction, all - 

I thought it had been Karen Blackford who was the other owner who the Wyndham people refused to put on the ballot this year. It was not. It was another long-time, former BOD who had also voted to end Wyndham's contract, Tom Mischeley (forgive me if that's not the right spelling, but some of you will correct me on the spelling). Karen had decided that she had served on the board long enough (after getting offed last year by the Wyndham people). But she is still very motivated to help wherever and whenever she can. Thanks to Karen.

Sorry for that.

The same issue and mission Karen and I have still stands. 

Aloha,
Jeff


----------



## Jeff From Salem

IMPORTANT: Please go to www.SaveKBV.org

It's a website dedicated to the movement to wrestle control back from Wyndham forces. There is a lot of great information there. Note that there are several different tabs on the main page. One of them, "Wyndham's Smoking Gun" is an important document to read, showing evidence of Wyndham's plans to take control of the resort and get their management company back into control. Click on the green button on that page. You'll likely be astonished and angered.

Mahalo,

Jeff


----------



## jacknsara

Aloha,
For the 2017 KBV election, we wound up having two concurrent threads here on TUG.  I am pasting in an entry point to that other thread that helps explain my continuing emphasis on getting enough owners to vote to enable consideration of amendment to governance documents.
https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index...letter-from-board-member.254729/#post-1996108
Jack


----------



## jacknsara

leehad50 said:


> I just signed up for this Forum today. My wife and I bought at PKBV in 2000. We return every year except for the two years we let our children go as wedding presents. I became aware of the Wyndham take-over attempt last year and we gave our proxy votes to Karen and Jeff. I have visited https://savekbv.org and have been reading the information. We were troubled when Wyndham became the management company and developed a rather negative with some of the salespeople at Princeville. I would like to end the Wyndham control of the Board of Directors. My concern is not knowing who all the people are. I've read much but reading it doesn't make it all true. It appears there are only three candidates this year: Louis Colombo (incumbent), Linda Kolstad (incumbent), and Jack Goodstein. I know nothing about Jack Goodstein. Do any of you have any experience with these people?



Leehad,

Welcome to TUG.  My wife and I have been KBV owners since 1998, and currently own 3.5 annual weeks at KBV which we use every winter.  All but the first were resale purchases on ebay.

I sent a campaign email to all KBV owners whose email is current in Grand Pacific’s (the resort manager) database.  Unfortunately, Grand Pacific does not have a valid email for about 1/3 of owners.  I am attaching pdfs of both that email and the detailed analysis that it refers to.  These are also available at https://sites.google.com/site/jackgoodstein/kauai-beach-villas.

While I understand the position of the saveKBV organizers and appreciate their endorsement, I continue to ask KBV owners to assign all their votes to me.

I welcome questions regarding my detailed analysis here on TUG.

Jack


----------



## ffwwife

Hi all KBV owners who are interested in this Wyndham board  issue:
I emailed  Lou Columbo, as he sent out an email to the owners,  and I wanted to hear his side of this issue.  
Asked him to address some of the comments on  the SAVE KVB  website
His email response to me addressed absolutely nothing!     All he  said was that he was  "not in Wyndham's pocket".   I thought that was interesting that's all he has to say. ?!....


----------



## jacknsara

ffwwife said:


> Hi all KBV owners who are interested in this Wyndham board  issue:
> I emailed  Lou Columbo, as he sent out an email to the owners,  and I wanted to hear his side of this issue.
> Asked him to address some of the comments on  the SAVE KVB  website
> His email response to me addressed absolutely nothing!     All he  said was that he was  "not in Wyndham's pocket".   I thought that was interesting that's all he has to say. ?!....



Aloha,

I posted the results of the 2016 KBV election in post 15 on page 1 of this same thread (direct link: 
https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index...ch-villas-board-election.240675/#post-1900651 )

Here are the 2016 vote numbers for Lou Colombo and I:
Jack Goodstein 169.50
Lou Columbo 56.00

I attribute my vote lead in 2016 over Lou to the TUG vote. (a belated thanks to my TUG supporters)

I started post 18 on page 1 of this same thread (direct link: https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index...ch-villas-board-election.240675/#post-1977358 ) with the following report of a February 2017 meeting:
It turns out that our new KBV IOA president, Linda Kolstad, and I were both scheduled to be in Princeville on the same February day. Linda’s email signature block includes: Director, Association Governance—Hawaii, Wyndham Vacation Ownership. We met for over an hour one late afternoon on our lanai at the Shearwater. . . .​
The vote results for 2017 used to be included in a file on http://kauaibeachvillasresort.com/ but I cannot find it today.  I had previously captured those numbers and include them here:
Trish Harrington      1224.5
Danielle Ramos       1150.5
Larry D. Warner      1081.5
Louis Colombo        1029.0
Karen Blackford       597.5
Jack Goodstein        79.5
Ross Tilton              61.0
Charles Twardzicki    45.0
Thomas Mischley      43.0
Jeanne O’Hara         18.5

There were three positions open which means there were three votes available to each owner of an annual week.  One of the footnotes from the audit report cited in post 15 states:  As of December 31, 2015, WVR owned 1,041 weeks

I do not fault other candidates for seeking votes from Wyndham since I also did so.  It is simply smart campaign practice to seek the support of an entity with so much voting power.  Had Wyndham voted for me, I would not be in their pocket. 

Jack


----------



## Jeff From Salem

jacknsara said:


> Aloha,
> 
> I posted the results of the 2016 KBV election in post 15 on page 1 of this same thread (direct link:
> https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index...ch-villas-board-election.240675/#post-1900651 )
> 
> Here are the 2016 vote numbers for Lou Colombo and I:
> Jack Goodstein 169.50
> Lou Columbo 56.00
> 
> I attribute my vote lead in 2016 over Lou to the TUG vote. (a belated thanks to my TUG supporters)
> 
> I started post 18 on page 1 of this same thread (direct link: https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index...ch-villas-board-election.240675/#post-1977358 ) with the following report of a February 2017 meeting:
> It turns out that our new KBV IOA president, Linda Kolstad, and I were both scheduled to be in Princeville on the same February day. Linda’s email signature block includes: Director, Association Governance—Hawaii, Wyndham Vacation Ownership. We met for over an hour one late afternoon on our lanai at the Shearwater. . . .​
> The vote results for 2017 used to be included in a file on http://kauaibeachvillasresort.com/ but I cannot find it today.  I had previously captured those numbers and include them here:
> Trish Harrington      1224.5
> Danielle Ramos       1150.5
> Larry D. Warner      1081.5
> Louis Colombo        1029.0
> Karen Blackford       597.5
> Jack Goodstein        79.5
> Ross Tilton              61.0
> Charles Twardzicki    45.0
> Thomas Mischley      43.0
> Jeanne O’Hara         18.5
> 
> There were three positions open which means there were three votes available to each owner of an annual week.  One of the footnotes from the audit report cited in post 15 states:  As of December 31, 2015, WVR owned 1,041 weeks
> 
> I do not fault other candidates for seeking votes from Wyndham since I also did so.  It is simply smart campaign practice to seek the support of an entity with so much voting power.  Had Wyndham voted for me, I would not be in their pocket.
> 
> Jack



But Jack, keep in mind, they haven't been in the practice of voting for anyone who has been vocal about limiting or eliminating their influence on the voting and direction of the resort. They have actually voted to get rid of Board members who voted against their interests.

My question is, what would someone have to do in order to attract Wyndham's vote?  (see the Wyndham's Smoking Gun on the saveKBV.org page)

Jeff


----------



## ecwinch

Was so glad to receive Lou Columbo's email today regarding the upcoming KBV election. Not sure why some feel the need to impugn the character and integrity of someone who volunteers to donate his time and energy to make KBV a great resort.

I think it says more about the people making the accusations than anything else. I know where my votes will go - and not to someone playing the whisper game against their fellow owners.


----------



## DeniseM

I support an independent board of resort owners, so I will be voting for Tugger, Jack Goldstein, who is a long-time owner, and a long-time Tugger.  He has been upfront and transparent about his goals for the resort.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Was so glad to receive Lou Columbo's email today regarding the upcoming KBV election. Not sure why some feel the need to impugn the character and integrity of someone who volunteers to donate his time and energy to make KBV a great resort.
> 
> I think it says more about the people making the accusations than anything else. I know where my votes will go - and not to someone playing the whisper game against their fellow owners.



Eric, that isn't fair. You are ignoring evidence. Circumstantial evidence can be very powerful. I urge you to read through saveKBV.org

If you're truly in favor of an independently run Board Of Directors, you should look deeper than just your hunches. We have amassed research and evidence. Simply saying "I don't trust anyone who impugns"...is like saying "I wouldn't want to club that would have me as a member." It's a circular argument without real substance. You can certainly vote for whom you want. It's your right. But do some research. This vote is too important to not be completely informed about the issues.

Sincerely,

Jeff


----------



## Jeff From Salem

DeniseM said:


> I support an independent board of resort owners, so I will be voting for Tugger, Jack Goldstein, who is a long-time owner, and a long-time Tugger.  He has been upfront and transparent about his goals for the resort.



Thanks Denise.

And you're welcome to vote for Jack. If you know Karen Blackford, she's doing work with me to try to get both me and Jack on the Board. We're trying to create an independent owner majority on the Board. Karen will be there and we're asking to give her your Proxy. You may vote Jack in and/or leave that part blank. _We're trying to get enough independent owners to vote so that we'll have the votes to vote BOTH Jack and myself in._ At the very least, all Proxy votes will go to Jack if we don't get enough owners voting. We need to make sure that we have at LEAST ONE more _strong_ voice for independent owners to go along with Trish Harrington. But if we don't get TWO strong independent voices on the BOD, then Wyndham will still have control. And you need to know that Lou Columbo voted to keep two independent owners off the ballot. 

Aloha,
Jeff


----------



## ecwinch

Jeff From Salem said:


> Eric, that isn't fair. You are ignoring evidence. Circumstantial evidence can be very powerful. I urge you to read through saveKBV.org
> 
> ....We have amassed research and evidence.



Jeff - I have read everything on saveKBV.org and am not new to this discussion. Where exactly is the "research and evidence" that Lou Columbo is "controlled by Wyndham".

[comment removed]


----------



## ecwinch

Jeff From Salem said:


> And you need to know that Lou Columbo voted to keep two independent owners off the ballot.



And Jeff - how sure are you that Lou Columbo voted to keep independent owners off the ballot? As I understand it, any incumbent up for re-election would have to abstain from a vote on election related matters.

Based on your "research and evidence" do you have those facts correct? It is a pretty damning allegation IMHO.


----------



## DeniseM

Folks - This is an important topic, and emotions can run high - that's understandable.  To facilitate a civil debate, please  focus on the *issues* and steer clear of personal comments - thank you.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> And Jeff - how sure are you that Lou Columbo voted to keep independent owners off the ballot? As I understand it, any incumbent up for re-election would have to abstain from a vote on election related matters.
> 
> Based on your "research and evidence" do you have those facts correct? It is a pretty damning allegation IMHO.



Yes. BTW, a certainly fair question on your part. I like that you asked it rather than making assumptions.

Lou voted against a long-time owner and previous BOD member, as well as myself from being on the ballot. The for BOD had been one who had voted to end Wyndham's contract with the resort. Karen Blackford had also similarly voted, as a BOD, to end Wyndham's contract. She was voted off when Wyndham used their deeds to vote on pro-Wyndham voices. See the Wyndham's Smoking Gun on saveKBV.org.

Trish Harrington was the only BOD to vote to put both this other owner and myself onto the ballot.

Sincerely,

Jeff


----------



## DeniseM

Hi Jeff - So you are saying that you know this happened, because there were reputable witnesses present when Lou voted against 3 owners who wanted to be on the ballot?  Do you know if they publish their meeting minutes, or if they are available for owners to request?


----------



## vice

I am glad to see multiple parties giving opinions of how to vote and the reasoning behind it. I feel this may be one of the most consequential votes I ever cast for a timeshare and am actually quite concerned about making a good decision. If a couple of dozen independent thinkers that are on TUG that actually have votes to cast for KBV elections can't come to a consensus about what 2 candidates to put our votes behind, what chance does anyone have of preventing a Wyndham controlled board. (We need 2 seat wins, 1 does us little good). I don't have anything to add that would help anyone make a decision other than suggest that someone (moderator?) create a poll to see what candidates everyone is planning on voting for, requesting that only KBV owners with an actual vote participate.


----------



## jacknsara

Aloha,

This is a general response not only to Lou Colombo’s note but to the full BoD of KBV whether they are up for re-election this year or next.

Until there is agreement on a clear statement of important problems to be solved for KBV, there can be no logical assurance that a list of actions that everyone agrees is necessary (i.e. the shared intersection of divergent views of the situation) is also sufficient to solve the core problems facing KBV.

My analysis in the pdf named Goodstein_KBV_BOD_2018 concludes:   The core problem which impacts bad debt and maintenance fees and is a major source of dissatisfaction to owners seeking to dispose of their ownership is that the aftermarket resale value for KBV timeshares is negligible or negative.

My proposal for the direction of solution in that same document is: . . . the KBV BoD should develop and deploy a marketing plan to identify characteristics of potential buyers likely to appreciate KBV (segmentation) and focus communications to reach them (targeting)

In all the recent communications received from KBV and the other candidates, I do not recall anyone other than myself identifying any specific core problem let alone offering a direction for the solution (as opposed to a detailed solution which I haven’t developed either).

Jack


----------



## ecwinch

Jeff From Salem said:


> Trish Harrington was the only BOD to vote to put both this other owner and myself onto the ballot.



Jeff - this rebuttal does not support your statement that "And you need to know that Lou Columbo voted to keep two independent owners off the ballot.".

As I pointed out, Lou abstaining is not him voting to keep you off the ballot as you assert. For it would be a conflict of interest for a BoD member running for re-election to actively work to keep his/her challengers off the ballot. 

I believe this is a key issue - if you have evidence that Lou voted to keep independent owners off the ballot that certainly is demonstrative of his lack of independence. 

So please share with us to the evidence you have of the voting record.


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## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Jeff - this rebuttal does not support your statement that "And you need to know that Lou Columbo voted to keep two independent owners off the ballot.".
> 
> As I pointed out, Lou abstaining is not him voting to keep you off the ballot as you assert. For it would be a conflict of interest for a BoD member running for re-election to actively work to keep his/her challengers off the ballot.
> 
> I believe this is a key issue - if you have evidence that Lou voted to keep independent owners off the ballot that certainly is demonstrative of his lack of independence.
> 
> So please share with us to the evidence you have of the voting record.



You know what, you're right, Eric. I owe a big apology on that note.

It was Larry and Dani who voted down the candidates.


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## Jeff From Salem

I owe Lou Columbo an apology for including him in with the nominating committee which voted to keep off two anti-Wyndham candidates. My brain mistook Lou for Larry Warner in terms of the vote. Lou had to abstain (as did Linda) because their seats are up for election. It was Larry Warner and Dani Ramos who voted them down to be included on the ballot. Again, only Trish Harrington voted for them to be included.

I'm terribly sorry about that.

Still, Lou's open letter to the owners states that Wyndham is playing fair and everything is copacetic. Detailed minutes aren't kept for the Board meetings. Only voting records are kept. We never know the discussions that go on during the BOD meetings unless we attend. That's not good. Trish has suggested that better records of the meetings are kept, Linda has said no. Trish feels like she is alone there on the BOD, as her concerns have largely not been considered. It is Linda Kolstad, as President, who dictates the agenda. Linda does not acknowledge the work Grand Pacific has done. She'll acknowledge those on the BOD, and she'll defend Wyndham. Meanwhile, Trish, from her independent owner perspective, has had her concerns batted down, while Larry and Dani have been vocally lock step with Linda. Lou has not been vocally supportive of Trish. He may be merely laying low and not wanting to rock the boat. But we need more pro-active people on the Board. KBV is potentially in serious trouble if Wyndham is allowed to end Grand Pacific's contract and then take back over the running of the timeshares.

Sincerely,

Jeff


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## ecwinch

Jeff - Thanks for setting the record straight.

And while I while I can empathize that Trish feels she needs better air cover from Lou, I still cannot reconcile why some of these suggested changes were not implemented before Wyndham took control of the BoD. Hasn’t she been on the BoD for a number of years?


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## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Jeff - Thanks for setting the record straight.
> 
> And while I while I can empathize that Trish feels she needs better air cover from Lou, I still cannot reconcile why some of these suggested changes were not implemented before Wyndham took control of the BoD. Hasn’t she been on the BoD for a number of years?



You're welcome, and I'll do the short version answer of your question since I have covered this before in the past. You can probably look back at KBV threads here.

In the meantime, the first part of the answer is that, indeed, the IOA and AOAO BODs for a long time sort of effectively abdicated their responsibilities in terms of oversight of the resort management. For a long time, the original developer, David Walters, along with his assistant, Lynn McGrory, made the decisions. They were President and Vice-President for a long time. When Lynn left the Board, Trish took over as VP, and then became President when David passed away.

But as long as David was in control, the BOD sort of just went along with what he and Lynn did, not bothering to question. They assumed that David and Lynn knew what they were doing and, again, didn't question it. Sometime short of 2005, David brought Wyndham in. 

I bought in 2001. In 2005, I was at the owners' update while I was there. I know Wyndham had at least a presence there at the time because I have evidence. The person talking to me at one point offered me an opportunity to join Club Wyndham if I turned over my oceanfront 2BR/2BA deed to them plus $7000 in order to join their Club Wyndham. I questioned whether I would have the same guarantee to use the oceanfront units that I had at the time (since I had a deed to them and had paid a premium for that deed). 

But the more I thought about it, the more I had the opinion that the offer was inappropriate - for a number of reasons. #1) There'd be no way, particularly as most of the units were individually owned, that Wyndham would have enough inventory, not to mention _oceanfront _inventory, to guarantee me that I'd be able to use the oceanfront units #2). Why was the management company we hired to manage our timeshare units (Wyndham) using our owners update to profit their Club Wyndham Vacation program company? I thought it was unethical (We're paying them to manage the property and they're using that time to profit another aspect of Wyndham.).

I started to inquire with a couple of members of the board and told them about my experience at the owners update. They were not aware that Wyndham was doing that. But the more I inquired (looking into the job they were doing), we started to come to the conclusion that Wyndham was underperforming. I wrote an article for TimeSharing Today about it, and I got many responses from those who had similar experiences. I continue to ask about buying, maintenance, and upgrading practices that Wyndham was doing. In contact with a couple members of the BOD, we kept seeing that Wyndham was things like buying mediocre furniture, but paying more for it. They replaced good plates in the kitchens with lesser quality ones, but charging more for them. With the payment model to get paid 10% of the maintenance fees, they'd make more money the more money they spent. But the resort was going downhill, with maintenance fees going up. In contrast, since Grand Pacific has come on board, we're in much better shape financially due to their rental program having raised $800,000 for the resort. This compares to the $100,000 that Wyndham had raised in rentals their last year as manager. It is now, with Grand Pacific as manager, that we're really starting to see major improvements.

At one point, David and Lynn had made an agreement to give Wyndham access to unpaid deeds if, after one full year, the maintenance fees weren't paid. Under the agreement, Wyndham would purchase the deeds for just the cost of foreclosure, $750/deed. Again, the rest of the BOD went along thinking that David knew what he was doing and that all was in the best interest of the long term health of the resort and the owners. David agreed to sell Wyndham the clubhouse for $1.

A good company would have done due diligence to really go after/try to contact the owners to get them to get their maintenance fees up to date. Wyndham wasn't doing that. They were waiting until the year would go by on the unpaid deeds and then quickly snap them up for the $750. Wyndham was slow in transferring them to their name, saving a lot in maintenance fees. But rather than try to sell them off, they held onto them to use the voting power. This was particularly important to Wyndham after the BOD started to catch "Wynd" (pun intended) that they just weren't getting good results for the money. David and the BOD had given Wyndham Management company a 10 year contract. The BOD wanted to get out of it, but it would have been too costly in terms of a legal fees. The BOD eventually voted to not renew Wyndham's contract when it ended, and started to look at alternative management companies. Wyndham wasn't having any of it. As you can see from the Wyndham's Smoking Gun memo, Wyndham plotted to remove BOD members who weren't pro-Wyndham, and replace them with those who were.  

So the majority of the BOD's reliance on David Walters and Lynn McGrory to do the right thing, and assuming that Wyndham would do well didn't work out so well. The BODs were, indeed, guilty of a lack of oversight. But they did eventually wake up, although it was partly too late to keep Wyndham from getting control of both the AOAO and IOA. Wyndham's goal, right now, is to have control of the IOA BOD when Grand Pacific's contract is set to run out (in about 18 months). They will then end Grand Pacific's contract and vote to bring Wyndham back. The actual Wyndham employees (why are there two Wyndham employees on our board??) will likely have to recuse themselves. But Wyndham will work to get some non-employees who are sympathetic to Wyndham to vote in their favor. It's what Karen Blackford, Trish Harrington, myself, and even Jack Goodstein are trying to do to keep that from happening. It's essentially taking a monumental effort to regain the majority of the BOD. The AOAO was about to end Wyndham's contract as well, but Wyndham was able to get hold of that board and keep it from happening. It's why Wyndham manages the grounds and buildings while Grand Pacific manages the interiors of the timeshare units, the rentals, the sales, and the activities.

Hmmm, that was longer than the short version, wasn't it.  

Jeff


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## ecwinch

By a bit I would say. 

While I understand your perspective, I come at this from a different standpoint. As Jack observes in his posts, the current challenge facing KBV and most legacy timeshares, is the issue of replacing owners who exit (or flee) the timeshare. So while you see Wyndham as only self-serving in their approach, I see Wyndham as providing some protection that the resort will remain viable. Because the deeds they take back move from not paying m/f to paying m/f. Perhaps what you say is true about the timeliness of that process, but at the end of the day dues start being paid.

Now some will argue that the BoD/HOA should take those deeds back and resell them - generating revenue for the resort. Many resorts have tried that approach, and I think most of them would rather have a deal like KBV had. Toward that end perhaps modifications to that deal would have helped - for instance requiring them to make the resort whole on the delinquent m/f, to properly incentivize them to foreclose in a timely manner.

Likewise, I fail to understand the benefit of having an combative relationship with an organization that owns 20% of the resort. Any resort improvement plan would be difficult to achieve without their buy-in. So unless GPR has some desire to buy them out, it seems the best long-term strategy is find a middle ground that allows the resort to move forward. So what we need now is more BoD members pro-actively focused on working with Wyndham to make the resort better, and not creating a combative relationship with the largest stakeholder.

ps. I dont believe the Wyndham reps can vote on the mgt contract. They are barred by state law.


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## DeniseM

Here's a small point, but it annoys me and it's symtomatic of the bigger issues:  On our last trip to KBV, we had to do a sales pitch to get arm bands for the hotel pool.  It ticks me off, that I have to drive to Princeville, waste half a day, and endure a high pressure sales pitch, to use the hotel pool!  If Wyndham wasn't there, exploiting the pool use situation to feed the sales machine, I feel that GPR would be able to negotiate a mutually beneficial agreement for timeshare owners and condo-hotel owners - as we have in the past.

IMNSHO, Wyndham's first priority is clearly SALES, which is why they should not be the resort management company.


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## Jeff From Salem

DeniseM said:


> Here's a small point, but it annoys me and it's symtomatic of the bigger issues:  On our last trip to KBV, we had to do a sales pitch to get arm bands for the hotel pool.  It ticks me off, that I have to drive to Princeville, waste half a day, and endure a high pressure sales pitch, to use the hotel pool!  If Wyndham wasn't there, exploiting the pool use situation to feed the sales machine, I feel that GPR would be able to negotiate a mutually beneficial agreement for timeshare owners and condo-hotel owners - as we have in the past.
> 
> IMNSHO, Wyndham's first priority is clearly SALES, which is why they should not be the resort management company.



Denise, you're spot on here. When David Walters agreed to sell the Clubhouse to Wyndham for a song, it forced ANY other management company to have to cave in to Wyndham's demands just to have a place to check owners (and guests) in, as well as have an office for the General Manager to operate in. There is NO other space. Furthermore, Wyndham has put pressure on the hotel not to let Grand Pacific use the space inside the hotel that we used to use for the owners updates and sales. Remember that large space just off the lobby of the hotel?

I know that a potential agreement is possibly in place with the hotel for owners to use their facilities, but the last I heard, the hotel board was supposed to vote on the agreement, and I don't believe they have followed through with their vote.

Wyndham's modus operandi has always seemed to be SALES rather than SERVICE. Many people's experience (as several have written in TimeSharing Today) is that they'll sell you on one thing, and then soon after, they're trying to sell you on the next thing. It's anecdotal, but many have that impression.

Whereas a company like Grand Pacific really seems to focus on doing a great job and securing loyalty that way.


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## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> By a bit I would say.
> 
> While I understand your perspective, I come at this from a different standpoint. As Jack observes in his posts, the current challenge facing KBV and most legacy timeshares, is the issue of replacing owners who exit (or flee) the timeshare. So while you see Wyndham as only self-serving in their approach, I see Wyndham as providing some protection that the resort will remain viable. Because the deeds they take back move from not paying m/f to paying m/f. Perhaps what you say is true about the timeliness of that process, but at the end of the day dues start being paid.
> 
> Now some will argue that the BoD/HOA should take those deeds back and resell them - generating revenue for the resort. Many resorts have tried that approach, and I think most of them would rather have a deal like KBV had. Toward that end perhaps modifications to that deal would have helped - for instance requiring them to make the resort whole on the delinquent m/f, to properly incentivize them to foreclose in a timely manner.
> 
> Likewise, I fail to understand the benefit of having an combative relationship with an organization that owns 20% of the resort. Any resort improvement plan would be difficult to achieve without their buy-in. So unless GPR has some desire to buy them out, it seems the best long-term strategy is find a middle ground that allows the resort to move forward. So what we need now is more BoD members pro-actively focused on working with Wyndham to make the resort better, and not creating a combative relationship with the largest stakeholder.
> 
> ps. I dont believe the Wyndham reps can vote on the mgt contract. They are barred by state law.



Eric, think of it this way. They now own *20%* of the KBV timeshare deeds. They are represented by at least *60%* of the IOA Board of Directors. Does _that _seem fair and/or a good idea?

Secondly, the BOD at the time thought that Wyndham would make an honest effort in reselling the deeds. Instead, they have used the deeds to force a BOD takeover. Is that an example of a management company doing good work for the owners?

Thirdly, if they had done a better job of maintaining and upgrading the resort (compare their 10 years with Grand Pacific's 1 1/3rd years), and if they done due diligence with reselling the the deeds, why do you think that we'd be in the same boat as we are now? Don't you think the value of the resort for resales would have been better? And don't you think that there would have been, then, a decent number of resales meaning that new excited KBV owners would have been generated in place of all of these deeds in Wyndham's hands? And if there were more actual independent, excited KBV owners using their deeds, there'd be more positive energy and buzz surrounding KBV?

Fourthly, Grand Pacific generated $800,000 in rentals last year (2017) compared to about $100,000 by Wyndham in 2016. If Grand Pacific had been here in charge of the rentals for even 5 of the years that Wyndham was here, that could have been 5.6 million dollars more generated for KBV owners to pay for improvements and offset the need for raised maintenance fees. That's a LOT of moolah. Wyndham's MO is SALES, not great caretaking. If they had really put in the same effort into renting as they do into their sales, we would have been in MUCH better shape. Now, Wyndham owns the Clubhouse and we have to go through their 2-3 hour sales presentation for their Bali Hai resort, including the mandatory trip up to the North Shore to do it, in order to get a wristband that will allow us to use the pools at the hotel next door.

Does all of this sound like a company that has our best interests at heart??

Jeff


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## jacknsara

Jeff From Salem said:


> <snip> . . . Don't you think the value of the resort for resales would have been better? . . .


Aloha,
While this statement is a minor detail within Jeff's post, I would like to use it as an opportunity to manage the expectations of those folks who have read my lengthy analysis.
The value of the majority of timeshares plummeted to negligible or negative several years ago.  Unconverted KBV weeks are not part of a major brand mini-system, some of which have retained some positive value.  It is likely that informed aftermarket buyers would compare KBV to near equivalent units in Kauai or other Hawaiian Islands.  Until total demand for Hawaiian resale units exceeds availability, there is little reason to expect resale prices for KBV to materially increase.  What I do believe is possible is to increase the relative desirability of KBV ownership among informed buyers of resales. A price premium of $1 to a couple of hundred over  comparables would not change an informed buyers calculations by much.  A price premium over comparables of a couple of thousand could easily impact a buyer's calculations.
If the marketing approach I advocate is adopted and succeeds, current KBV owners who want to sell should be able to successfully exit their ownership without suffering scams or negative impacts to their credit rating.
I have no expectation that such sellers will net any substantial cash; it is possible that they will have to continue to pay some or all of the transactions costs.
Jack
BTW - I have begun outlining what a marketing plan might look like.  If there are any KBV owners reading this that want to participate (i.e. trade emails outside of TUG) in its development please PM me.


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## ecwinch

DeniseM said:


> Here's a small point, but it annoys me and it's symtomatic of the bigger issues:  On our last trip to KBV, we had to do a sales pitch to get arm bands for the hotel pool.  It ticks me off, that I have to drive to Princeville, waste half a day, and endure a high pressure sales pitch, to use the hotel pool!  If Wyndham wasn't there, exploiting the pool use situation to feed the sales machine, I feel that GPR would be able to negotiate a mutually beneficial agreement for timeshare owners and condo-hotel owners - as we have in the past.
> 
> IMNSHO, Wyndham's first priority is clearly SALES, which is why they should not be the resort management company.



Denise - and I absolutely agree with you that SALES is their main priority. But that does not bother me. In the broader context, I think that is the deal we make with the developer to enjoy the benefits of their involvement.


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## ecwinch

Jeff From Salem said:


> Eric, think of it this way. They now own *20%* of the KBV timeshare deeds. They are represented by at least *60%* of the IOA Board of Directors. Does _that _seem fair and/or a good idea?
> 
> Secondly, the BOD at the time thought that Wyndham would make an honest effort in reselling the deeds. Instead, they have used the deeds to force a BOD takeover. Is that an example of a management company doing good work for the owners?
> 
> Thirdly, if they had done a better job of maintaining and upgrading the resort (compare their 10 years with Grand Pacific's 1 1/3rd years), and if they done due diligence with reselling the the deeds, why do you think that we'd be in the same boat as we are now? Don't you think the value of the resort for resales would have been better? And don't you think that there would have been, then, a decent number of resales meaning that new excited KBV owners would have been generated in place of all of these deeds in Wyndham's hands? And if there were more actual independent, excited KBV owners using their deeds, there'd be more positive energy and buzz surrounding KBV?
> 
> Fourthly, Grand Pacific generated $800,000 in rentals last year (2017) compared to about $100,000 by Wyndham in 2016. If Grand Pacific had been here in charge of the rentals for even 5 of the years that Wyndham was here, that could have been 5.6 million dollars more generated for KBV owners to pay for improvements and offset the need for raised maintenance fees. That's a LOT of moolah. Wyndham's MO is SALES, not great caretaking. If they had really put in the same effort into renting as they do into their sales, we would have been in MUCH better shape. Now, Wyndham owns the Clubhouse and we have to go through their 2-3 hour sales presentation for their Bali Hai resort, including the mandatory trip up to the North Shore to do it, in order to get a wristband that will allow us to use the pools at the hotel next door.
> 
> Does all of this sound like a company that has our best interests at heart??
> 
> Jeff



Jeff - I think it is revisionist to say what someone thought when making a deal 10+ years ago.

Today weeks at KBV have marginal value on the open market, and it is unlikely that will change. As I noted, believing that that is a better deal to try to sell them is not something other resorts have had success with. And it is not an issue of quality of the resort. Point me to a legacy resort that has a good resale value and low bad debt expense. For every one you find, I can probably find 10 that suffer. Even the high quality Marriott resorts can be purchased for a $1 on ebay.

We see this on TUG all the time - timeshares simply have little to no value. How is someone going to be excited to buy a unit with a view of the lagoon when similar resorts are a dime a dozen. It is just systemic to the business model.

I have no illusions about Wyndham's intent. It really is a binary issue - either you feel that the resort benefits from Wyndham's involvement - or you don't. I am firmly in the camp that feels we do benefit.


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## ecwinch

jacknsara said:


> Aloha,
> While this statement is a minor detail within Jeff's post, I would like to use it as an opportunity to manage the expectations of those folks who have read my lengthy analysis.
> The value of the majority of timeshares plummeted to negligible or negative several years ago.  Unconverted KBV weeks are not part of a major brand mini-system, some of which have retained some positive value.  It is likely that informed aftermarket buyers would compare KBV to near equivalent units in Kauai or other Hawaiian Islands.  Until total demand for Hawaiian resale units exceeds availability, there is little reason to expect resale prices for KBV to materially increase.  What I do believe is possible is to increase the relative desirability of KBV ownership among informed buyers of resales. A price premium of $1 to a couple of hundred over  comparables would not change an informed buyers calculations by much.  A price premium over comparables of a couple of thousand could easily impact a buyer's calculations.
> If the marketing approach I advocate is adopted and succeeds, current KBV owners who want to sell should be able to successfully exit their ownership without suffering scams or negative impacts to their credit rating.
> I have no expectation that such sellers will net any substantial cash; it is possible that they will have to continue to pay some or all of the transactions costs.
> Jack
> BTW - I have begun outlining what a marketing plan might look like.  If there are any KBV owners reading this that want to participate (i.e. trade emails outside of TUG) in its development please PM me.



As much as I agree with portions of your thoughtful analysis, the reality is the only the Oceanfront units have any value. I purchased my three Oceanfront weeks for less than $2000 dollars and it included a year of pre-paid maintenance fees.

And how viable is it to ask existing owners to fund a marketing program that at best offers them the hope that they will get out in the future. What does a budget for that project look like on an annual basis and is that a good ROI? 100k? 200k?

If GPR's rental program is going like gang-busters as Jeff opines, then it seems like the right solution is to offer a deedback program and just rent the weeks out.  Unless the rental program is offering rates below what we pay in dues.


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## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Denise - and I absolutely agree with you that SALES is their main priority. But that does not bother me. In the broader context, I think that is the deal we make with the developer to enjoy the benefits of their involvement.



But Wyndham wasn't the developer, Eric. David Walters and the company he formed, PAHIO, was the developer. He developed KBV along with a couple others in Kauai (the Makai Club, for one). David Walters brought in Wyndham as the resort and property manager. Wyndham essentially has three companies. 1) They have a company that develops their own company properties/hotels. 2) They have a company that manages a vacation subscription program (Club Wyndham). People pay a membership fee to Wyndham, Wyndham allots them points for which the people can exchange those points annually in order to go to one of Wyndham-affiliated properties. 3) Finally, they have a property management company which other resorts can hire. For those resorts, Wyndham can take care of the property buildings and grounds, as well as facilitate sales and rentals for them. The normal charge for such services is 10% off the top of the maintenance fees paid by the users of the resort. The latter is what David Walters did several years after he created PAHIO. Originally, owners who bought into a PAHIO property could exchange into another PAHIO property for little or no charge (if I recall correctly). This stopped when Wyndham was hired to come into the picture as property and timeshare manager. At one point, Wyndham bought RCI, as well as Shell Vacations, to really create a monopoly in the timeshare world.

_But let's try another analogy, Eric._ Say you are fortunate enough to be able to hire a company to take care of your spacious home and grounds. You find several years later that the company that has been taking care of your property found a loophole that gives them majority ownership of your property. You still live there and own partially, but the management company controls all decisions about what gets done. They even give themselves a raise as the property manager, and your maintenance fees go up, while the condition of the property goes gradually down. The situation you're in, in that your share of the ownership and the too high maintenance fee makes your ability to resell the property very difficult, and if you do, you will take a large loss. Would you feel okay about any of that?

What you're possibly not on top of is that Wyndham and another company called Diamond Resorts (unrelated) have been notorious for wheedling and weaseling their way into resorts by first being hired as property managers, then finding ways to get control of enough deeds to take over the board and permanently take over the resort. 

Jeff


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## jacknsara

ecwinch said:


> . . . And how viable is it to ask existing owners to fund a marketing program that at best offers them the hope that they will get out in the future. What does a budget for that project look like on an annual basis and is that a good ROI? 100k? 200k?
> 
> If GPR's rental program is going like gang-busters as Jeff opines, then it seems like the right solution is to offer a deedback program and just rent the weeks out.  Unless the rental program is offering rates below what we pay in dues.



Aloha Eric,

I revived this thread and included the following in post 67 (direct link: https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index...las-board-election.240675/page-3#post-2107216 )

. . .  A key decision is whether the current ownership wants to realistically accept the challenge of remaining independent. Assuming they do, then the IOA (led by its BoD) needs to develop and implement strategies to increase the market demand to own KBV timeshares. To my knowledge, the IOA has never had a budget line for marketing.

However, if the majority of the owners do not want to financially commit to addressing the aftermarket challenge, then the consequences of that need to be fully communicated. . . .​
I believe that a realistic plan needs to be developed and shared with the ownership and their buy-in solicited.  If the ownership does not want to support the initial “investment” (a $10 - $40 increase in MFs), then, as previously stated, the consequences of that need to be fully communicated.

I understand that much of what I write does not get remembered. One of the reasons I like using TUG and this particular thread as a campaign tool is to put information on the record for reference when appropriate.

To the extent my detail plan exists it is still quite preliminary.  I’ll accept your annual cost numbers as a reasonable range.  Technically, the costs would be expenses of the period, but we can certainly think of them as an investment with a need to forecast an ROI.  That requires establishing the baseline to compare with.  At this point all I will say about the appropriate baseline based on what little extra insight I have been provided as a candidate is that one should not assume that the approximately steady bad debt levels of the past will not deteriorate in the not too distant future.  I can think of ways a board member can improve information regarding this question.   

Taking the optimistic case, let us assume that the bad debt level will remain at current levels indefinitely until some board action is taken that reduces it (note: mere repossession of units in default does not change the impact of the bad debt level but may move the impact from one budget line to another).  Further assume that a successful marketing program would likely take more than one year to demonstrate material improvement and might take over two.  For ROI calculations, let us assume it takes two years to achieve.  Rather than predict what the reduction would be, let us calculate how long it takes to break even.  If the marketing program costs $150K per year every year (forever for this calculation) then a reduction of $200K in bad debt beginning in the third budget year (and holding there forever for this calculation) means that it would be the ninth year before the strategy is profitable.  For the same costs, if there is a reduction of $250K beginning in the third year, then the strategy becomes profitable in the sixth year.  If there is a reduction of $300K beginning in the third year, then the strategy becomes profitable in the fifth year.

There are metrics that might provide early indication of failure but discussion of that is beyond what I care to attempt in this forum.

I’ve written before why reliance on rentals during an economic downturn is very risky.  Let us hope that rentals remain strong enough for long enough for marketing strategies to kick in.  I prefer to not speculate about the potential severity of the impacts if we soon experience another downturn like we did a decade ago.

Regarding the value of ocean front units versus non ocean front units we've had that discussion before.  I consider your response as viable an alternative as my example
https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index...letter-from-board-member.254729/#post-1996108

Jack


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## ecwinch

Jeff - Wyndham holds the developer rights previously held by Pahio, it is part of what they acquired (see press release below). And while your history lesson is entertaining, it is inaccurate.  They are not just the manager at resort, nor did David Walters just bring them in with a management contract. Wyndham acquired PAHIO, and Pahio held the management contract at KBV. Wyndham's acquisition of Pahio's rights is what gave them the management contract.

As noted in the press release - consider the expansion at Bali Hai - that was done with the development rights acquired from Pahio. 

And your analogy is flawed. First, no single interest owns KBV. Secondly, Wyndham also acquired the developer held inventory from Pahio, so became an owner at KBV concurrent with assuming the mgt contract and developer rights. And while you want to cast dispersions on Wyndham, this trend of declining resorts and increasing maintenance fees is happening through out the timeshare industry - even independent resorts where the developer has exited the picture. BoD's feeling that keeping m/f dues low is what owners want lead to declining resorts, leading to more owners not seeing the value and defaulting, which just increases the burden on everyone else. Wyndham is not the causation of that trend, it is systemic to the business model. 

You also are conflating ownership with control. The developer - be it Pahio or Wyndham - has always called the shots at the resort. 

Take a step back for a moment and try to see the forest for the trees. You decry the fact they are taking over the resort by acquiring deeds from defaulting owners. If Wyndham was not paying dues on those 20% of units, where would the resort be? I think it is naive to believe that those 20% of the units would be in hands of paying owners.


_KAUI, HI— Wyndham Vacation Ownership, Inc. has acquired Hawaii-based PAHIO Resorts, Inc. and PAHIO Vacation Ownership, Inc. Wyndham Vacation Ownership will assume property management, sales and marketing operations for Bali Hai Villas, Ka Eo Kai, Kaui Beach Villas, Shearwater and Makai Resorts, all located here. Additionally, Wyndham Vacation Ownership has entered into an exclusive relationship with developer David Walters to expand the Bali Hai Villas resort, adding more than 125 vacation ownership units. PAHIOs five resorts have approximately 20,000 owners and consist of more than 400 vacation ownership units. The acquisition will provide Wyhndam Vacation Ownership with an enhanced presence in the Hawaiian Islands._


----------



## ecwinch

jacknsara said:


> To the extent my detail plan exists it is still quite preliminary.  I’ll accept your annual cost numbers as a reasonable range.  Technically, the costs would be expenses of the period, but we can certainly think of them as an investment with a need to forecast an ROI.  That requires establishing the baseline to compare with.  At this point all I will say about the appropriate baseline based on what little extra insight I have been provided as a candidate is that one should not assume that the approximately steady bad debt levels of the past will not deteriorate in the not too distant future.  I can think of ways a board member can improve information regarding this question.
> 
> Jack



Jack - IMHO the plan is either genius or crazy. I say that because I cannot think of any resort that is doing this. Which I believe is either the hallmark of genius or crazy.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Jeff - Wyndham holds the developer rights previously held by Pahio, it is part of what they acquired (see press release below). And while your history lesson is entertaining, it is inaccurate.  They are not just the manager at resort, nor did David Walters just bring them in with a management contract. Wyndham acquired PAHIO, and Pahio held the management contract at KBV. Wyndham's acquisition of Pahio's rights is what gave them the management contract.
> 
> As noted in the press release - consider the expansion at Bali Hai - that was done with the development rights acquired from Pahio.
> 
> And your analogy is flawed. First, no single interest owns KBV. Secondly, Wyndham also acquired the developer held inventory from Pahio, so became an owner at KBV concurrent with assuming the mgt contract and developer rights. And while you want to cast dispersions on Wyndham, this trend of declining resorts and increasing maintenance fees is happening through out the timeshare industry - even independent resorts where the developer has exited the picture. BoD's feeling that keeping m/f dues low is what owners want lead to declining resorts, leading to more owners not seeing the value and defaulting, which just increases the burden on everyone else. Wyndham is not the causation of that trend, it is systemic to the business model.
> 
> You also are conflating ownership with control. The developer - be it Pahio or Wyndham - has always called the shots at the resort.
> 
> Take a step back for a moment and try to see the forest for the trees. You decry the fact they are taking over the resort by acquiring deeds from defaulting owners. If Wyndham was not paying dues on those 20% of units, where would the resort be? I think it is naive to believe that those 20% of the units would be in hands of paying owners.
> 
> 
> _KAUI, HI— Wyndham Vacation Ownership, Inc. has acquired Hawaii-based PAHIO Resorts, Inc. and PAHIO Vacation Ownership, Inc. Wyndham Vacation Ownership will assume property management, sales and marketing operations for Bali Hai Villas, Ka Eo Kai, Kaui Beach Villas, Shearwater and Makai Resorts, all located here. Additionally, Wyndham Vacation Ownership has entered into an exclusive relationship with developer David Walters to expand the Bali Hai Villas resort, adding more than 125 vacation ownership units. PAHIOs five resorts have approximately 20,000 owners and consist of more than 400 vacation ownership units. The acquisition will provide Wyhndam Vacation Ownership with an enhanced presence in the Hawaiian Islands._




Eric, they acquired the marketing of the resort. Makai has already succeeded in pushing Wyndham out, by the way. The individual still own the timeshare resort, itself. It's with most timeshare resorts. I don't think you have the relationship of the owners to the resort correctly. Olympic Village Inn in California successfully booted Wyndham from the BOD. And what you say about resorts going downhill and maintenance fees going up, that's not a rule. Sure, there are some resorts that have not been managed well in the longterm. I own at two other resorts and they both keep their maintenance fees down and,having bought them on the secondary market, their value has kept even in the case of one resort, and gone up in the other. It may not be the rule, but there ARE examples of resorts that are well run, kept in the hands of a BOD comprised of individual owners, and done well.

The history of Wyndham taking over resorts is not good in terms of their track record. Makai is much better off now that Wyndham is out of the picture. The owners are MUCH happier.

Regarding _our _resort, well, yes, David Walters did most of the decision-making. Even as Wyndham was brought in, the BOD individually admit that they assumed that they didn't need to provide close oversight. They discovered that they do. The question still is whether a resort designed to be owned by individual owners, with decisions about its running made by a BOD comprised by individual owners, should be run by individual owners. While Wyndham has raped other resorts in the manner they're trying to do it in their past, we have recent examples of owners fighting back and winning. I mentioned the Olympic Village Inn. There was also a Diamond Resort in Poipu which got great publicity.

You seem to have a blind spot for supporting Wyndham. Do you read the publication, TimeSharing Today? You ought to, if you haven't. It's a great window onto the industry.

Could a sizable percentage of the deeds be in the hands of more individual owners? Why not? And if it were to be the case, we'd be stronger. Again, Wyndham's history is to weaken the consolidarity of the owners at large. 

When PAHIO itself was managing the property, we got somewhat regular updates. When Wyndham was in charge, we got almost none. I had brought the idea up to the BOD to edit an online newsletter for the owners. At the last minute, someone on the Board said that she would do it herself (I forgot who it was). And then she abandoned the idea.

It's partly why I chose to create one on the Yahoo Groups. (KBV Owners). 

Jeff


----------



## jacknsara

ecwinch said:


> Jack - IMHO the plan is either genius or crazy. I say that because I cannot think of any resort that is doing this. Which I believe is either the hallmark of genius or crazy.


Or maybe both   KBV might have a first mover advantage (among independent Hawaiian timeshares) if we start soon.  If we wait until the economy turns south, it may be to late for any plan to work.


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## ecwinch

Jeff - I read Timesharing Today, it is interesting. 

I dont think the final chapter has been written about OVI..... give it some time.


----------



## Rsiggy

First of all I want to express my appreciation to Jeff and Jack for their willingness to run for the BOD.

I’ve read Jack’s analysis regarding his plan to save KBV and Jeff’s history of the genesis of the deterioration after Wyndham took over.
Here’s my simplistic view regarding objectives for the new BOD:  1.  Retention of present owners 
2.  Enhancement of the units, the grounds (landscaping-compare to Kauai Coast Resort at the Beachboy) and amenities.  Jeff and Jack recognize how pool access is desirable.
3.  On site personnel:  all play an important part in making ones stay pleasant.  We’ve found almost all encounters MOST pleasant but while the front office were friendly however they were somehow ‘handcuffed ‘ when it came to trying to meet accommodating requests-a brushoff.

Jack identifies our location and beach walkways as a couple of the positive features.  

I hope they can build on these ideas so that current owners still continue and renters wish to become owners.
Budgeting is the biggest problem:  How to accomplish this while keeping MF’s competitive?  Doing more with the same amount or even less revenue?  Cost Control?  

It’s good to see that these two men are willing to work in the best interests of us owners and of our investment in KBV as opposed to the best interest of a corporation.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Jeff - I read Timesharing Today, it is interesting.
> 
> I dont think the final chapter has been written about OVI..... give it some time.



Hey, they threw Wyndham off. No living story is ever complete, right? But their effort was HUGE and SUCCESSFUL.

I hope you're not rooting for them to lose.

Jeff


----------



## Jeff From Salem

Rsiggy said:


> First of all I want to express my appreciation to Jeff and Jack for their willingness to run for the BOD.
> 
> I’ve read Jack’s analysis regarding his plan to save KBV and Jeff’s history of the genesis of the deterioration after Wyndham took over.
> Here’s my simplistic view regarding objectives for the new BOD:  1.  Retention of present owners
> 2.  Enhancement of the units, the grounds (landscaping-compare to Kauai Coast Resort at the Beachboy) and amenities.  Jeff and Jack recognize how pool access is desirable.
> 3.  On site personnel:  all play an important part in making ones stay pleasant.  We’ve found almost all encounters MOST pleasant but while the front office were friendly however they were somehow ‘handcuffed ‘ when it came to trying to meet accommodating requests-a brushoff.
> 
> Jack identifies our location and beach walkways as a couple of the positive features.
> 
> I hope they can build on these ideas so that current owners still continue and renters wish to become owners.
> Budgeting is the biggest problem:  How to accomplish this while keeping MF’s competitive?  Doing more with the same amount or even less revenue?  Cost Control?
> 
> It’s good to see that these two men are willing to work in the best interests of us owners and of our investment in KBV as opposed to the best interest of a corporation.




Thank you for your acknowledgement. 

As I have mentioned, *Grand Pacific's* work at increasing rental income resulted in going from ~$115,000 Wyndham's previous year as timeshare manager to ~$800,000 in their first year as timeshare manager. That's a big deal, but more has to be done to keep MF's down. Still, that increase from their work has allowed the resort to implement upgrades to the units which, I believe, are slated to begin later this year. I know that owners updates will soon include a showcase of the upgrades. So your money is starting to make a real concrete difference. Grand Pacific is really trying to earn their keep. Unlike with Wyndham, when they were given a 10 year contract, the timeshare management company is being given 3 year contracts. We need to make sure that individual owners are in the majority on the board so that if GP continues to do a great job, they will be allowed to continue their work. Again, Wyndham is gunning to end GP's contract no matter what, and install themselves back as the management company. 

If any of you haven't visited it yet, please go to the website *saveKBV.org*. Make sure you go to the *Wyndham's Smoking Gun* page, which contains a real internal memorandum from Wyndham outlining their plan to oust anti-Wyndham people from the AOAO Board Of Directors and install pro-Wyndham people in order to retain the management contract. 

Mahalo,

Jeff


----------



## ecwinch

Jeff From Salem said:


> Hey, they threw Wyndham off. No living story is ever complete, right? But their effort was HUGE and SUCCESSFUL.
> 
> I hope you're not rooting for them to lose.
> 
> Jeff



No, I am not hoping for them to lose. I think it is great that the owners have been re-energized and that the BoD is investing more time/energy in focusing on the long-term financial stability of the resort.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> No, I am not hoping for them to lose. I think it is great that the owners have been re-energized and that the BoD is investing more time/energy in focusing on the long-term financial stability of the resort.



GTK!


----------



## KYHOME

DaveNW said:


> Thanks, Jack.  You've hit on the high points, and I will absolutely agree that I may well be mis-remembering things.  My recollection is that I was told by a former female Manager in the Front Office during an Owner's Update one year that the extra funds had been collected specifically to do a big pool remodel. I recall hearing the term "lazy river" being kicked around, because at that point I had never seen one.  I agree they had repeated excuses about why things weren't ever started - the one that made me laugh out loud was because there were no construction crews to hire - everybody was too busy.  And then, (again, my recollection), being told the money had been shifted to Bali Hai, to help in the construction up there, and that was why the pool remodel was being scaled down so far.  The mini-remodel they later did on the pool area was pretty dissatisfying after that.  The second remodel was better.  But truth be told, I never put a toe in the pool while I owned at KBV.  So maybe it's a lot of anxiety over nothing, but it was always a bone of contention for me, as an owner.
> 
> Dave


I can explain about the pool at KBV.  First of all, the pool is not controlled by the timeshare owners/KBV IOA, it's part of the AOAO (Association of Apartment Owners).  The AOAO represents owners who purchased a unit outright.  Some of these owners live in them, others rent them themselves.  The IOA is responsible for the interiors of the timeshare/IOA units.  The AOAO is responsible for the exterior, grounds, etc. So, the pool at KBV is the AOAO's responsibility.  They had to raise the money for the pool and surrounding area remodel.  There has never been any money from KBV IOA that has been shifted to Bali Hai during my tenure.


----------



## DeniseM

Welcome KYHOME - Thanks for weighing in - what is your source for this info?


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## Jeff From Salem

DeniseM said:


> Welcome KYHOME - Thaks for weighing in - what is your source for this info?



Copy that.


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## Rsiggy

Re: DeniseM’s vote.

Assigned my proxy votes to Karen Blackford earlier this evening. 
Hopefully Jack gets enough to get elected.


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## KYHOME

ecwinch said:


> Was so glad to receive Lou Columbo's email today regarding the upcoming KBV election. Not sure why some feel the need to impugn the character and integrity of someone who volunteers to donate his time and energy to make KBV a great resort.
> 
> I think it says more about the people making the accusations than anything else. I know where my votes will go - and not to someone playing the whisper game against their fellow owners.


Lou Columbo (he is on the ballot) is not a bad guy.  He came to the board by appointment when another Board member (Wyndham employee) resigned.  He is an independent owner.  He appears to want to do what is best for the resort.  However, Jack Goodstein and Jeff Bellin are *Passionate* independent owners. We feel they would be better representatives of independent owners.


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## DeniseM

Hi KYHOME - Thank you for posting.  Please introduce yourself, so that we know the source of the Info you are providing.


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## KYHOME

Jeff From Salem said:


> Copy that.


I did meet Lou at the Board Meeting in 2017.  Also, we exchanged an email a few months back and I have read his communications as well as his bio.  As I said before, Jack Goodstein and Jeff Bellin are *Passionate* independent owners.  I highlighted passionate on purpose.  I believe that is where the candidates are different.  I believe Jack and Jeff would be more vocal and stand up better for independent owners.


----------



## KYHOME

DeniseM said:


> Hi KYHOME - Thank you for posting.  Please introduce yourself, so that we know the source of the Info you are providing.


KYHOME is Karen Blackford.  I live in KY - - a hint to why I choose the name.  .  I served on the KBV Board of Directors for 6 years, 5 of them as treasurer.  If you are interested in my credentials, I have an Accounting Background and Director experience at a Fortune 100 company.  For those of you familiar with ISO - - I was also a certified ISO auditor.  In addition, I was the Administrator of an 80,000 square foot, 24/7 medical facility with 5 satellite offices.  I want to use my experience and knowledge as your former Board member to make a positive contribution to this group!


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## DeniseM

Hi Karen - Thank you so much for posting on TUG!  Welcome!


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## ecwinch

KYHOME said:


> Lou Columbo (he is on the ballot) is not a bad guy.  He came to the board by appointment when another Board member (Wyndham employee) resigned.  He is an independent owner.  He appears to want to do what is best for the resort.  However, Jack Goodstein and Jeff Bellin are *Passionate* independent owners. We feel they would be better representatives of independent owners.



Karen - thanks for that insight. While I would agree that passion is desired element in a perspective BoD member, I would also add - all things in moderation. When you are so blinded by passion that you think it is acceptable to engage in a whisper campaign against a fellow owner - I would say that your passion is clouding your judgement. Not something I want to see in a BoD member.


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## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Karen - thanks for that insight. While I would agree that passion is desired element in a perspective BoD member, I would also add - all things in moderation. When you are so blinded by passion that you think it is acceptable to engage in a whisper campaign against a fellow owner - I would say that your passion is clouding your judgement. Not something I want to see in a BoD member.



Eric, I'm not whispering. I'm perfectly out front about it.

There are a number of important factors here:

1) Desperate times calls for desperate measures. Wyndham has been staging secretive campaigns to take over control of both BODs (the AOAO and the IOA). We have evidence of this. Their goal is to reinstate Wyndham Management as manager of KBV. That assertion is not "fake news". It was their stated goal in the inter-Wyndham memo shown on the saveKBV.org website (the 2016 memo showed plan to knock Trish Harrington off the AOAO, which they successfully did last year, and to put a Wyndham friendly person in as President. They did (Linda Kolstad). And that was all in an effort to ensure that Wyndham wouldn't lose the contract to manage the AOAO responsibilities.). Look for the Wyndham's Smoking Gun tab if you haven't seen it. 

So we need STRONG voices and leadership in order to counter Wyndham's forces. Larry Warner has clearly been in Wyndham's camp. Lou has not been a very vocal counter to Wyndham's moves. So passivity doesn't help here. We don't have much time. WE, as owners, have to make STRONG, decisive choices.

2) When I staged a somewhat similar campaign last year in support of re-electing Trish Harrington, Lou Columbo was vehemently vocal against me, particularly over using an old owners list in order to both promote keeping Trish Harrington on the IOA board, but also warning about Wyndham. Lou was quite nasty toward me, saying that I had no right to use the list (I did - I was using a list owned by Trish Harrington to promote her re-election). He also publicly and angrily gave me a "How DARE I tell him and other owners who to vote for!!". I was certainly taken aback. Not ONCE did he tell me that my heart was in the right place, that my fight to help individual owners maintain control of the direction of KBV was a good one, or _anything_ positive. What was I supposed to think, particularly after Wyndham put some votes behind him (not a ONE behind Trish Harrington)?? And for the record, y'all know that I can only suggest. I can't make any one of you do anything. I can suggest strongly and passionately, of course. But I have a right to speak out. And as a concerned and passionate owner, it's my duty to do so as a citizen of KBV, so to speak. And I don't think I would have started this to begin with if I hadn't generated a lot of conversation since I started writing for TimeSharing Today. When I started writing articles shortly after my 2005 visit to KBV regarding my treatment from the Wyndham person at the owners update, I didn't think I'd get the feedback that I did. So I know that there were others out there with the same concern. And seeing Wyndham attempt to do this same scheme elsewhere, as well as seeing other companies, notably Diamond Resorts do the same thing, I felt it was worth the effort to try to see if I could counter it. 

So, sorry, I don't have any patience to wait it out. The Grand Pacific contract to renew will be up for voting on next year. If Linda and Dani were to survive the votes this and next year, yes, they'd need to abstain from the actual vote for either a renewal of Grand Pacific or bringing in another company. But it would still likely leave an overall Wyndham friendly majority. That would leave the decision to the 3 remaining Board Of Directors. Larry, Dani, and Trish will be up for re-election next year. We'll need to keep Trish on. And that means we'd need at least one of the remaining members. We can't afford to have Trish as the only IOA Board member we can count on. If Larry and Lou end up voting for ending Grand Pacific's contract and bring back Wyndham, that will be it for at least the following 3 years. Do you really want to have Wyndham come back in as KBV Manager, with all we know about them?

Sincerely,

Jeff


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## ecwinch

Jeff - clearly you have personal grudge against Lou. Even Karen - who would seem to be better situated to opine on his independence acknowledges that he is an independent owner. Yet you want to speculate and use innuendo to paint a picture that he is under Wyndham's control, as noted on the saveKBV.org. :

_In 2017, again, using their voting proxies, Wyndham elected another, presumably, “Wyndham Friendly” Owner to our Board. *This gave Wyndham control of 80% of our Board.... 
*_
I find these smear tactics distasteful and anyone who employs them is not worthy of being on the BoD. Lou is not under Wyndham's control, and you know that.

Based on the blast emails Lou has sent out, I believe Lou is a moderate that thinks like I do. That the single largest interest at KBV is Wyndham, and any plan to improve KBV is doomed without their support. This is not OVI where the BoD is attempting to keep Wyndham from getting a foothold - Wyndham has been there 10 years, and has supported the resort by paying m/f on weeks surrendered by defaulting owners. You seemingly ignore that fact.

And in today's world I think we need more moderates that can see both sides of an issue, not zealots that are blinded by passion. Because you can campaign for someone without incorrectly reporting on their voting record or speculating that they are under Wyndham's control. You can chose to run a positive campaign - like Karen's statement - explaining why Jack is a better choice without impugning the volunteer service of a fellow owner. You can avoid using incorrect speculation to tarnish someone's reputation. Try that if you want my support.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

Eric, you belittle and dismiss what I'm saying. Why would I hold a "personal" grudge against Lou? I don't know him personally. I didn't know him before last year. And none of what I'm doing is because of some personal slight. I have been studying this issue for about 13 years. I have people who I know and trust who attend the meetings regularly. I have my own research. And I'm doing the best thing for individual owners, of which I am one of them.

They're not smear tactics. You can say that, but it doesn't make it true. I, alone, didn't come to the conclusion that Lou wasn't working in our interests. He just has not been vocal or spoken in dissent. It's like the famous 
Martin Niemöller quote:

_"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist._

_Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—_ 
_Because I was not a Trade Unionist._

_Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—_ 
_Because I was not a Jew._

_Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me."
_
If Lou didn't treat my efforts with such hostility last year, rather than encourage or acknowledge the need for independent owners to coalesce and take action, I'd give him the benefit of the doubt and think he was merely naive or uninformed. He may just not be that interested or concerned. Okay. But then he's not the person I and many others would want representing us on the IOA board given the urgent circumstances. 

I am not alone and have consulted with many in the industry. This is a serious matter that requires a great deal of urgency. You don't acknowledge the astonishing arrogance of the Wyndham memo.

But by muddying the waters, you undermine what is a really urgent issue. You do what you want. I'm not forcing you to do anything. If you're really concerned about the long-term vision of having an independent board, run by individual owners without an affinity or loyalty to a large corporation, then I recommend you get behind what Karen and I and Jack, as well as a host of other independent KBV owners are trying to do. If you aren't, then good luck and I hope the best turns out for all of us. 

As the Michael Corleone character said to his brother in The Godfather (one of my all-time favorite movies!), "It's not personal, Sonny. It's strictly business." 

Jeff


----------



## DeniseM

A couple of points:  People who are vested in Wyndham points may have a different view point regarding who should manage the resort, than weeks owners.  These two positions may be unreconcilable.

I believe that this debate has brought attention to the election, and that's a good thing, but once again, let's debate the issues and not veer off into personal attacks.

I don't think there is anything wrong with evaluating a candidates worthiness for office, but again, let's focus on the candidates position on the issues, and not make it personal.


----------



## ecwinch

Denise - yes, by all means let focus on the candidates position on issues - not some whisper campaign that someone is under Wyndham's control. Let's hear a candidate talk about a realistic plan for improving the resort and working with the single largest owner. Focus on issues, instead of engaging in speculation about someone being under Wyndham's control. 

Because like or not, Wyndham has a large ownership stake. And as you correctly observe - there are also a lot of votes residing with owners who have converted to points - so recognize that your message may not have the impact you desire with those owners. Bottom line - there is no long-term future at KBV unless Wyndham buys into that plan. Any BoD candidate who cannot recognize that fact is just wasting everyone's time.


----------



## DeniseM

Eric - I am confused by your use of a the expression "whisper campaign."  You may not agree with Jeff's criticism, but since he's been very open about it and posted his claims in a public forum, it's hardly a whisper campaign.

The definition of a "whisper campaign," is when someone privately spreads negative info., but does not come forward in public with their claims.  It's a small thing, but I think your label is incorrect in this situation.

*Definition:*
A whispering campaign or *whisper campaign* is a method of persuasion in which damaging rumors or innuendo are spread about the target, _while the source of the rumors seeks to avoid being detected_ while spreading them (for example, a political campaign might distribute anonymous flyers attacking the other candidate).​
As far as being _required_ to work with Wyndham - I personally know of other resorts where the owners voted the management company off the board, and the owners  run their own resort.  I don't think that's easy to do, but with enough owner support, it is definitely possible.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

Let me add this, if I may- 

Even without the vitriol and lack of appreciation for what I was trying to do last year (again, not for me, but for traditional KBV owners), Lou has shown a seeming lack of interest and/or concern about Wyndham's role here and their history here and elsewhere. He hasn't been vocal as a board member. His broadcast letter to owners was very gentle and sweet. He states that he's a nice guy and wants to just be helpful. Of course, anyone can write a letter when they're trying to get elected. I mean, in general political elections, many candidates try to be everything to everybody, and they used to go to the point of needing to get photographed kissing babies. But he could turn out to be a really nice person, in spite of how he interacted with me last year. But his letter lacked any conversation about the Wyndham issue, or a concern about connecting the past with the present and future in terms of Wyndham's participation. 

Lou wasn't sympathetic for what I tried to wake everybody up about last year concerning Wyndham, and what Karen and I, with Jack's help, are trying to do _now. _What we're doing is very pointed and motivated. We need pointed and motivated people on the IOA board if we're going to accomplish what we need to accomplish. We have no time to waste. 

So again, it's not personal. It's strictly business. 

Mahalo,

Jeff


----------



## ecwinch

Jeff - I believe your observations about Lou are equally true of many of the independent owners that sat on the BoD for years - including Trish. For all the years I have owned at KBV, the BoD's efforts regarding communication with owners have been minimal and same is true for transparency. For years I have read the rumor about the pool funds being diverted to Bali Hai - something that we now know is false. But why was this not common knowledge among the many of the devoted KBV owners who frequent this forum?

For the 10 years that Wyndham had the mgt contract, the BoD approved the dues increases that mgt requested and was responsible for ensuring the funds were being effectively utilized. If Wyndham was not effectively managing the resort as you imply - where was the communication from the BoD members on these matters? How effectively were the incumbent BOD members exercising oversight of Wyndham as manager?

You have posted about how Trish is the only BoD member we can count. If that is true, why does she seemingly place such a low priority on owner communication. Why cant she take the time to communicate with the KBV owners on a more regular basis and why the lack of communication for the past 10 years?

ps. Here is one issue I would like to hear some communication from the BoD about - currently what is happening with weeks from defaulting owners? GPR seems to be renting weeks out basically for mf. Is that sustainable in the long-run? Seems to me that will always result in a drain on Club finances unless GPR is able to rent out 100% of the inventory and take no commission on the rentals.


----------



## ecwinch

DeniseM said:


> Eric - I am confused by your use of a the expression "whisper campaign."  You may not agree with Jeff's criticism, but since he's been very open about it and posted his claims in a public forum, it's hardly a whisper campaign.
> 
> The definition of a "whisper campaign," is when someone privately spreads negative info., but does not come forward in public with their claims.  It's a small thing, but I think your label is incorrect in this situation.
> 
> *Definition:*
> A whispering campaign or *whisper campaign* is a method of persuasion in which damaging rumors or innuendo are spread about the target, _while the source of the rumors seeks to avoid being detected_ while spreading them (for example, a political campaign might distribute anonymous flyers attacking the other candidate).​
> As far as being _required_ to work with Wyndham - I personally know of other resorts where the owners voted the management company off the board, and the owners  run their own resort.  I don't think that's easy to do, but with enough owner support, it is definitely possible.



Yes, the definition of smear campaign is probably more appropriate. Both are similar in regard to using rumors and innuendo.

Where have you heard of a mgt company being voted off the BoD when they own 20% of the resort? I dont believe that has ever happened or will. Keeping someone who owns 20% of the interest off the BoD would likely lead to a messy and expensive situation in the long run. I also do not believe that having Wyndham and GPR at the resort is workable in the long run. So either GPR is willing to buy out Wyndham's interests, or GPR loses the contract. I believe that just a matter of time. 

A *smear campaign*, also referred to as a *smear tactic* or simply a *smear*, is an effort to damage or call into question someone's reputation, by propounding negative propaganda.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Jeff - I believe your observations about Lou are equally true of many of the independent owners that sat on the BoD for years - including Trish. For all the years I have owned at KBV, the BoD's efforts regarding communication with owners have been minimal and same is true for transparency. For years I have read the rumor about the pool funds being diverted to Bali Hai - something that we now know is false. But why was this not common knowledge among the many of the devoted KBV owners who frequent this forum?
> 
> For the 10 years that Wyndham had the mgt contract, the BoD approved the dues increases that mgt requested and was responsible for ensuring the funds were being effectively utilized. If Wyndham was not effectively managing the resort as you imply - where was the communication from the BoD members on these matters? How effectively were the incumbent BOD members exercising oversight of Wyndham as manager?
> 
> You have posted about how Trish is the only BoD member we can count. If that is true, why does she seemingly place such a low priority on owner communication. Why cant she take the time to communicate with the KBV owners on a more regular basis and why the lack of communication for the past 10 years?



Wow, several fair questions -

You might have not read many of my posts carefully, because I have talked about the BOD oversight (or sometimes lack thereof). For a long time, many on the BOD assumed that David Walters and Lynn McGrory would attend to the details. They believed that David and Lynn would make the right decisions. 

Trish Harrington has always made herself available. She was the VP of the BOD for a long time. She was the one broadcasting emails to an admittedly limited audience (as many owners didn't have emails). She has made her personal email available. Anyone can write her. Here it is, in fact. I know she won't mind: trish@aleapaheadit.com

Soon after the 2005 incident at the owners update when a Wyndham representative offered to take my oceanfront deed plus $7000 in exchange for membership into Club Wyndham (which I found unethical given that we were paying them to manage OUR resort, not run their own membership business), I contacted Trish. She had not been aware (nor were others on the BOD seemingly aware) that Wyndham was doing this at the owners updates. I started asking about how they were running the resort. I started pushing. KBV and Wyndham were entwined in a long-term contract for both the AOAO and IOA caretaker responsibilities. 

I'd keep in touch every so often, and eventually she started to report that Wyndham was not running the place as well as they thought Wyndham was. She pointed out poor purchasing decisions regarding furnishings, dishware, and the like. We saw maintenance fees go up regularly but we weren't seeing upgrades in conditions. Wyndham was buying mediocre quality items, but paying premiums for them. She pointed to poor maintenance. The poor Wyndham performance led to fees needing to be raised to cover the poor choices that Wyndham had made over time. Wyndham has done this at other resorts, resulting in lower owner interest over time. Wyndham could wait it out, and then take over the resorts through lack of interest from owners.

They tried to work with Wyndham. The only other choice they had was to try to sue them to get out of the contract. Wyndham wasn't interested. So the choice was to simply let the contract run out - on both sides of the resort management. David Walters had died, and Lynn McGrory was out of the picture. Trish took over as President of both BODs. 

Jeff


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## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Yes, the definition of smear campaign is probably more appropriate. Both are similar in regard to using rumors and innuendo.
> 
> Where have you heard of a mgt company being voted off the BoD when they own 20% of the resort? I dont believe that has ever happened or will. Keeping someone who owns 20% of the interest off the BoD would likely lead to a messy and expensive situation in the long run. I also do not believe that having Wyndham and GPR at the resort is workable in the long run. So either GPR is willing to buy out Wyndham's interests, or GPR loses the contract. I believe that just a matter of time.
> 
> A *smear campaign*, also referred to as a *smear tactic* or simply a *smear*, is an effort to damage or call into question someone's reputation, by propounding negative propaganda.



Eric -

You keep saying "Someone" owning 20%. This isn't a _someone_. It's a *corporation*. Wyndham is a corporation. This isn't Todd Rundgren buying up 1100 weeks of units because he has 20 extended family members who would like to live at KBV year 'round. Neither the President of the Board, Linda Kolstad, nor the other Wyndham employee on the IOA board, Dani Ramos, own ANY timeshares at KBV!! Their interest is solely in Wyndham's corporate interest. Honestly, I don't think you have read the saveKBV.org website. 


And a "smear" campaign?? Nothing I have pointed out is untrue. WE (and I mean, many, including Karen Blackford, myself, Trish Harrington, Ross Tilton, etc.) have evidence backing up our assertions. And choices have to be made. To me, Eric, you're muddying the waters here. You're being blind to what is obvious to most everyone else.

You're trying to make this about me personally. I have no other stake in the game other than I'm an owner. I see a tidalwave potentially coming. Wyndham has done this elsewhere. If you're not aware of it, go do your proper research. You haven't even spoken about the saveKBV.org website. Have you actually been there and done some reading? Have you studied up on the Olympic Village Inn resort situation in California?

Eric, I really implore you to stick to the issues. I'm not interested in discussing Lou Columbo, and whether I'm whispering, or shouting, or smearing, or any other gerund regarding Lou Costello. I really need to stick to  working on taking back the majority of the IOA BOD for the individual owners. I have made my suggestions as to who to vote for and why. You are welcome to do whatever you want that you feel is in your own best self-interests.

Jeff


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## ecwinch

Jeff - while I commend your passion, I dont find you a reliable source of information. Sorry. It is far to easy to be revisionist when viewing the past, and even in this thread you have gotten things wrong. 

Clearly KBV has my email address, and I have all my emails - even spam - for the past 10 years. The only communication I have received from Trish was last year when she asked for my vote. Communicating to a small group of supporters does not pass muster in my book.

If Wyndham was not doing their job, owners should have been notified. Oversight of mgt is the BoD's fiduciary responsibility - and the burden falls on the BoD President to ensure it happens. If Trish was unable to do that, why should she be on the BoD?  What happens if GPR starts performing in a similar fashion - do we have to live with it until we can cancel the contract? That seems like poor and passive BoD mgt to me.

Heck - there was not even any communication prior to the decision to terminate the mgt contract? Why not? Seems like a pretty big item that the BoD might want to survey the members on. Not the shot in the dark I have to learn about on TUG.


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## ecwinch

Jeff From Salem said:


> Eric -
> 
> You keep saying "Someone" owning 20%. This isn't a _someone_. It's a *corporation*. Wyndham is a corporation. This isn't Todd Rundgren buying up 1100 weeks of units because he has 20 extended family members who would like to live at KBV year 'round. Neither the President of the Board, Linda Kolstad, nor the other Wyndham employee on the IOA board, Dani Ramos, own ANY timeshares at KBV!! Their interest is solely in Wyndham's corporate interest. Honestly, I don't think you have read the saveKBV.org website.
> 
> 
> And a "smear" campaign?? Nothing I have pointed out is untrue. WE (and I mean, many, including Karen Blackford, myself, Trish Harrington, Ross Tilton, etc.) have evidence backing up our assertions. And choices have to be made. To me, Eric, you're muddying the waters here. You're being blind to what is obvious to most everyone else.
> 
> You're trying to make this about me personally. I have no other stake in the game other than I'm an owner. I see a tidalwave potentially coming. Wyndham has done this elsewhere. If you're not aware of it, go do your proper research. You haven't even spoken about the saveKBV.org website. Have you actually been there and done some reading? Have you studied up on the Olympic Village Inn resort situation in California?
> 
> Eric, I really implore you to stick to the issues. I'm not interested in discussing Lou Columbo, and whether I'm whispering, or shouting, or smearing, or any other gerund regarding Lou Costello. I really need to stick to  working on taking back the majority of the IOA BOD for the individual owners. I have made my suggestions as to who to vote for and why. You are welcome to do whatever you want that you feel is in your own best self-interests.
> 
> Jeff



Jeff - if you had started with the issues and supported your positions with verifiable information, we might be having a different discussion. But that is not how you came at this. You have speculated on things that have proven to be untrue (i.e. Lou voting to keep you off the ballot). So how do I separate the "wheat from the chaff" when I read your statements? Sure you corrected your false statement, but not without some prodding. 

And Jeff - our discourse would be more polite if you stopped assuming I am not well-versed in owner advocacy issues. Yes, I am well aware of OVI - I am also a Worldmark owner. I also have helped numerous owner advocacy efforts understand the legal documents governing their resort. I actively follow court cases regarding timeshares, and read Timesharing Today. I have followed the battles at Worldmark, Marriott's Ocean Club, Festiva at Southscape, Innsbrook, Sunchaser, Diamond at Poipu Point and Tahoe Beach, to name a few. I am not new to these issues.


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## ecwinch

Jeff From Salem said:


> They tried to work with Wyndham. The only other choice they had was to try to sue them to get out of the contract. Wyndham wasn't interested. So the choice was to simply let the contract run out - on both sides of the resort management. David Walters had died, and Lynn M



Here is the timeline as I understand it:

July 2006 - Wyndham acquires Pahio Resorts, acquiring mgt contract for KBV.  
Oct 2009 - David Walters dies
??? 2016 - KBV BoD votes to terminate IOA mgt contract. I cant tell you exactly when this happened as BoD minutes are not published. Nor do I know what the process was to bring GPR on-board.
Jan 2017 - GPR takes over management contract.

Now from Trish's only email to me, it appears that after that vote Wyndham used their interest to place three members on the BoD. Now that implies that prior to decision to terminate the mgt contract, Wyndham had less than three members on the BoD. Implying that the majority of the members where independent owners. Right?

So your position seems to be that Wyndham was cutting corners and raising fees. Implying to some degree that malfeasance was taking place. And yet the BoD only saw two options - sue to get out of the contract or ride the contract out. Why not sue for specific performance? Or bring in an auditor to do a forensic audit of the books? 2009 to 2016 is seven years. That is a long time to keep owners thinking things are going well at the resort. I mean that is what would read on the HOA website - pretty much sunshine and rainbows - no mention of any of these problems.


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## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Here is the timeline as I understand it:
> 
> July 2006 - Wyndham acquires Pahio Resorts, acquiring mgt contract for KBV.
> Oct 2009 - David Walters dies
> ??? 2016 - KBV BoD votes to terminate IOA mgt contract. I cant tell you exactly when this happened as BoD minutes are not published. Nor do I know what the process was to bring GPR on-board.
> Jan 2017 - GPR takes over management contract.
> 
> Now from Trish's only email to me, it appears that after that vote Wyndham used their interest to place three members on the BoD. Now that implies that prior to decision to terminate the mgt contract, Wyndham had less than three members on the BoD. Implying that the majority of the members where independent owners. Right?
> 
> So your position seems to be that Wyndham was cutting corners and raising fees. Implying to some degree that malfeasance was taking place. And yet the BoD only saw two options - sue to get out of the contract or ride the contract out. Why not sue for specific performance? Or bring in an auditor to do a forensic audit of the books? 2009 to 2016 is seven years. That is a long time to keep owners thinking things are going well at the resort. I mean that is what would read on the HOA website - pretty much sunshine and rainbows - no mention of any of these problems.




First of all, Eric, _*you* _don't know, with all due respect, but I do. I have laid out the issues not only in TimeSharing Today for many, many years, but to as many owners as I could prior to last year's vote. If you weren't on the list, I apologize. It was not my personally compiled list. It was a list last used when Wyndham was managing. Since then, there has been a lot of work done to update the lists.

I have talked about the issues on other pages in TUG, from my recollection. Most people here seem to know them. You seem to be in the minority that doesn't. I recommend doing a search here. You can also ask for other owners who received my reports from last year to supply you. _You need to do your own homework here._ Furthermore, anything supplied to you seems to be met with cynicism, if not skepticism. I don't don't recall you even commenting or being shocked by the inter-company Wyndham memo posted on the saveKBV.org website. You need to read that website's material. You really ought not to comment until you have looked at it fully. There may be something in there that you might be skeptical about, but you aren't equally plussed by anything that seems to be damning of Wyndham. So I don't understand where you're coming from. The evidence of Wyndham's goal is clear. It has not only been shown here, but has been exemplied many times elsewhere outside of KBV. I feel like I'm spinning my wheels with you. I have been really trying to work with you and your skepticism. But eventually, it has made me consider that you might be their pockets as well, only here to muddy the water.

Initially, I gave you the benefit of the doubt, and I was thinking that your questions could help focus my communication. But beyond that point, your comments have just been repetitive, and haven't really forwarded the action for anyone.

I hate to say it, but at this point, you're either for us (for individual owner control) or you're against us. We have just a few weeks to go. I'm not going to respond to anymore of your posts unless they are supportive of ousting Wyndham in order to maintain individual owner control of the IOA (and AOAO) board.

I'm at least actually _doing _something about it. It's my analysis and what I have decided needs to be done. Fortunately, I'm at not at all alone in this. I have many partners, including Karen Blackford and Jack Goodstein, and many, many others.

Jeff


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## Jeff From Salem

Aloha Folks -



1) With the election 2 weeks away, it's SO important that you go to our website, saveKBV.org and read it. Particularly pay attention to the Wyndham's Smoking Gun part of the site. It's astonishing and disturbing to read an actual inter-Wyndham document showing proof of Wyndham's ulterior motive to take and keep control of the resort, even to the point of overthrowing an existing President.



2) You probably received a large postcard about the website. I have talked to a few who dismissed the postcard as just another piece of advertising. I assure you that it's not. You really need to go to that website and read up. 



3) You need to vote. And, as outlined on that website, we're asking that you give your Proxy to Karen Blackford by writing her name in on the appropriate line and checking off that option. And then you need to leave the actual candidates selection blank. 



We're trying to get enough votes so that both Jack Goodstein and I can be voted onto the board (I would be nominated from the floor). If there are enough votes, we would end up voting Linda Kolstad, a Wyndham employee and someone who doesn't own any weeks at KBV, off the board entirely. She is astonishingly the current President of the KBV IOA board. Right now, Wyndham possesses 20% of the KBV deeds, yet pro-Wyndham people comprise a majority of the IOA board. If we can vote both Jack and me onto the board, we'll have Jack, me, and Trish Harrington, giving individual owners the majority. As much as I don't think having a corporation like Wyndham owning 20% of the deeds is a good idea, at most, they should only have 1 representative on the 5-member board. 



In the end, if we don't get enough votes for this meeting's vote, then Karen will put all of your votes solely behind Jack Goodstein. Jack is a good man who has a goal of greatly increasing the number of individual owners voting so that we can firmly be in control of the direction of KBV. So please give your Proxy to Karen Blackford when you vote, and leave the individual candidate section blank.



4) Finally, this project that Karen and I are running does cost money (the cost of the postcards, the mailing, the hosting of the website, etc.). If you'd like to help us defray some of the costs, you can do so on the saveKBV.org website. Any help will be appreciated. 



Mahalo,



Jeff Bellin


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## vice

I am not telling anyone how to vote but this is what I decided to do as a KBV owner. I assigned my 4 votes to Karen Blackford as my Proxy.
There was some mudslinging, name calling, and egg on face between Jeff and Eric and I can tell that both of these KBV owners care a great deal about the future of KBV. I don't know Karen or Jeff from Salem, but after spending hours reading this thread and other information sources, it came down to money and service.

Money: "*Grand Pacific's* work at increasing rental income resulted in going from ~$115,000 Wyndham's previous year as timeshare manager to ~$800,000 in their first year as timeshare manager. That's a big deal"

Service: Every time I have had to deal directly with Grand Pacific as my management company for anything from a simple phone call all the way to checking-in at KBV when we visited this January has been a very good experience.

For those who want my TLDR version of the previous 166 posts-
Minority Wyndham overlords want to rule majority KBV independent owner peasants by controlling the board. Jeff, Karen, and other independent KBV owners are banding together to form a resistance and save the KBV timeshare universe from evil corporate overlord that just wants to sell crappy memberships and collect management fees.


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## schenriq

We're able to reserve (at 10 months out) @KBV using our Wyndham points but we also own a biennial week deeded at building H. So I have a vested interest on both camps. Having said that, I do believe on an independent board and have already assigned my proxy to Jack.


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## Jeff From Salem

vice said:


> I am not telling anyone how to vote but this is what I decided to do as a KBV owner. I assigned my 4 votes to Karen Blackford as my Proxy.
> There was some mudslinging, name calling, and egg on face between Jeff and Eric and I can tell that both of these KBV owners care a great deal about the future of KBV. I don't know Karen or Jeff from Salem, but after spending hours reading this thread and other information sources, it came down to money and service.
> 
> Money: "*Grand Pacific's* work at increasing rental income resulted in going from ~$115,000 Wyndham's previous year as timeshare manager to ~$800,000 in their first year as timeshare manager. That's a big deal"
> 
> Service: Every time I have had to deal directly with Grand Pacific as my management company for anything from a simple phone call all the way to checking-in at KBV when we visited this January has been a very good experience.
> 
> For those who want my TLDR version of the previous 166 posts-
> Minority Wyndham overlords want to rule majority KBV independent owner peasants by controlling the board. Jeff, Karen, and other independent KBV owners are banding together to form a resistance and save the KBV timeshare universe from evil corporate overlord that just wants to sell crappy memberships and collect management fees.



Thanks, Vice. Thank you for giving your Proxy to Karen. It will be helpful, and I can assure you that Karen will do the right thing in your interest as an individual owner. 

But don't pooh-pooh our efforts. I'd prefer you step out on a limb and give your honest assessment of the situation. That memo showing Wyndham's intent to undermine individual owners' will is bad. We are really putting in time and money into this effort. I hope you don't make light of it. 

Regarding mudslinging, I can only speak for me, and I really haven't done any. I have been very, very thoughtful about this whole process, and have been researching this for over a decade. I talk to people who regularly attend all of the meetings. They tell me things that we owners don't know because the detailed minutes of the meetings are not posted. Only the actual voting is posted, so what goes on between the votes, the conversations, we aren't privy to unless you know people who attend (or you attend yourself). 

I'm not perfect. I'm not a professional at this. I'm doing due diligence as a concerned homeowner, really, and I want to be as informed as possible. Everything I have said I have had evidence (sometimes 2nd hand, sometimes circumstantial) to back up my assessment. Eric has merely questioned and seemingly seemed to, at times, try to undermine my assertions. I just don't get that he has done any real research of his own, nor has he acknowledged any of our findings, including the direct evidence against Wyndham. Again, at least Karen and I are trying to do something about it in a major way. 

Jeff


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## Jeff From Salem

schenriq said:


> We're able to reserve (at 10 months out) @KBV using our Wyndham points but we also own a biennial week deeded at building H. So I have a vested interest on both camps. Having said that, I do believe on an independent board and have already assigned my proxy to Jack.



It will be better if you assign your Proxy to Karen. Our project is about trying to get BOTH Jack and me on the IOA board. If that is successful, we, as independent owners will have retaken control of the board. If that is successful, Linda Kolstad will be voted off the board. We'll be able to have an independent owner as the President of the board.

Karen with help from others, will determine whether we have enough Proxy votes to put BOTH Jack and me on the board. If so, she'll divide up the votes. If not, she'll put all of the votes behind Jack. If only Jack gets voted onto the board, then we, individual owners, will still have a minority of the board and Linda will likely remain as President of the IOA, in spite of her not owning any KBV deeds and being a Wyndham employee (working out of their Kapaa office). So what will be more helpful, if you're so inclined, schenriq, is to give your Proxy to Karen Blackford and leave the individual candidate selection section blank. 

Anyone can vote again. The only vote that counts is the last one you place. Each successive one overrides the previous one.

Jack will be working with us anyway, but it will be easier to have all of the Proxies in Karen's hands. 

Thanks,

Jeff Bellin


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## OnlyKauaiTimeshares

I bought my first timeshare week in KBV H in 2006, and currently own 3 weeks in G and H. I have experienced the problems that Wyndham has in being responsive to owners concerns, and adequate maintenance. I was very skeptical when Grand Pacific entered the picture, but as they have come up to speed I have been very pleased. Trading out of Wyndham Bali Hai using RCI we stayed at KBV for a total of 5 weeks this year. I have had ample opportunity to see the improvements in on site activities, building maintenance, recycling, appliance repair and replacement, and front desk responsiveness. GP actually does what they say they will do. I believe that GP Has been a change for the better for us owners. 

I was exposed to two of the infamous Wyndham "Owners Updates" and was given a high pressure "opportunity" to trade in my three KBV oceanfront fee simple deeds for for Wyndham Points for only $7000 - $8000 each. Such a deal! Especially with no guarantee that those points would ever get me back to Kauai or KBV! 

I have found the high pressure push for "owner updates" from the Wyndham concierges consistently offensive across multiple Wyndham properties. This suggests a Wyndham policy to collect weeks, and their votes for purposes that have been discussed above. 

I suggest that owners consider the positive changes that they have experienced since Wyndham's direct influence on KBV daily operations has been reduced. 

Believing that it is not in my best interests as an owner to have Wyndham with a 20% ownership stake have control of our KBV boards I have assigned my proxy for 6 votes to Karen.


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## KYHOME

Interesting comment, Eric - we are all entitled to our own opinions and I respect yours.  All I can say is that I want what is best for Kauai Beach Villas.  It is true that I do not believe that Wyndham controlling our Board of Directors is in the best interest of our owners.  There are 5 seats on the BOD.  Since WYN has 20% of ownership, one seat should be all they hold.  I am not sure what you mean by engaging in a whisper campaign.  I do not feel that I have been whispering about anything.  If I was - - why would I come out and speak openly on this forum?  That is certainly not a whisper. 

I understand that some owners may blame the past BOD for not moving faster to make some of the desired changes at KBV - I might feel the same had I not been on the Board and knew what was driving those delays.  Your BOD had an Action Item List - - that mostly was ignored by Wyndham.  Of course, you can challenge the word choice (ignored), but I am saying that  your BOD put things on that list - - but when we the Action Item List was reviewed at the next meeting, we often  found nothing had been done about most items on the list.  We would then obtain promises that these items would be handled - - only to return to the next meeting to find nothing (or very little) had been done again.  This happened over and over again - - as a result, I cannot in good conscious say that Wyndham was a good management company for Kauai Beach Villas.  I will say that towards the end of their time as KBV's management company, things did get done.  Interesting that it didn't happen until then...  you can draw your on conclusions/opinion about why that happened.  Have you noticed that things are being done since 1/1/17?  Yes, that Action item list is being tended to under Grand Pacific's management.


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## Jeff From Salem

DNRNFV said:


> Jeff, I appreciate your candidacy and would like to support it.  Are you sending out a letter to owners directly?  I will need to assign proxies for my two units.





bryanphunter said:


> Look forward to vote for you Jack and Jeff.  Been thinking of unloading my oceanfront unit, but I want to see how things improve.  I think progress can be made.  It is too bad that MF's are the same regardless of view. I realize the upkeep is no different if the unit is in Building A or Building H, but it sure makes a difference on the vacation experience.  Best of luck on the upcoming election!



Thank you.

But here's the thing - *EXTREMELY IMPORTANT: *Please vote in the following manner. It is the best way to help us individual owners:  *GIVE YOUR PROXY TO KAREN BLACKFOR*D. Put her name on that particular line and check that box. *LEAVE THE INDIVIDUAL CANDIDATE SECTION BLANK!!!!*

Karen Blackford will take your proxy votes and either split them between me and Jack IF we have enough owner votes to guarantee that both Jack and I will be able to get onto the board and oust Linda Kolstad (who is a Wyndham employee and owns no KBV deeds). IF we do NOT end up getting enough votes to get both Jack and me onto the board, then Karen will place ALL of your Proxy votes behind Jack. The Wyndham controlled committee would not place the 2 candidates who have been openly against Wyndham continuing their dominance of the board. I will be nominated from the floor onto the ballot (Wyndham did this for the AOAO and the IOA boards after they got hold of the 1100 deeds, using their then newly gained voting power to oust anti-Wyndham factions on both boards and get themselves into the majority.). 

So again, PLEASE give your Proxy to Karen and leave the candidate section blank.

Secondly, please go to our webpage, *saveKBV.org*. Read as much as you can there and educate yourself as to the stakes of this election. 

Mahalo,

Jeff Bellin


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## Jeff From Salem

Aloha Everyone!


I'll know more about this later today, but the Wyndham-dominated board is set to vote this Wednesday to keep those who aren't up-to-date with their maintenance fees from voting. 


There is, apparently, a rule in the by-laws which officially, if enacted, will keep those who aren't up-to-date with their maintenance fees from voting (or having their vote count). While this may seem to make sense at one level, we're not sure whether the IOA board has actually implemented this rule in the recent past. I'm trying to find out.


If this turns out to be a new development in implementation of the rules, then it will an obvious move by Wyndham to reduce the possibility of individual owners being able to win the majority back. 


In the meantime, you can cover your rear end and ensure your vote will count by making sure you are not delinquent with your maintenance fees. 


Ironically, part of me also assumes that part of the reason that some may be hesitant to pay maintenance fees (I don't know what the numbers actually are) is due to what they have seen regarding their experience at the resort when it was under Wyndham's management. But keep in mind that it serves all of us to have everyone pay their maintenance fees. If an owner does not, it only adds to the burden of other owners, meaning we have to pick up the slack, or there is less money for upgrades.


Of course, the money that is raised has to be used and spent well and efficiently. Fortunately, everyone who has been at the resort recently has noticed how much of an experiential improvement there has been in areas where Grand Pacific has been able to affect the resort. 


Aloha,


Jeff


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## Jeff From Salem

Aloha Folks - 

Following up on the previous post, Trish Harrington told me yesterday that in her work as a member of the IOA board for the last 12 years, owners' votes were never rejected because they were late with their maintenance fees. In order to implement a policy restricting votes counted to only those who are up-to-date with their maintenance fees has to be voted on by the IOA. The IOA has not voted on this in at _least_ the last 12 years.

So again, this policy has not been enforced and is potentially arbitrary. So why is this suddenly being brought up now??

Moreover, interestingly, in the 2 years that Linda Kolstad, a Wyndham employee, has been President of the IOA,, this has never been brought up until now. So why is this suddenly being brought up now??

The actual by-law is below:

"Members in good standing: A member shall be considered in good standing if he is current in the payment of all maintenance fees, charges, or other financial assessments with the Interval Association. The right of a member to vote _may_ be suspended by the board of directors if a member is delinquent in paying any maintenance fees, charges, or other financial assessments. The right of a member shall automatically be reinstated upon paying any delinquency."  By-laws Article 2.06

So notice that it states "may be suspended". Not "will be". Arbitrary. 

So again.......Why do you think the Wyndham people are bringing this up now??

Jeff


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## DNRNFV

vice said:


> I am not telling anyone how to vote ....



I have done the same--Karen has my proxies.  I just came back from KBV and I have to say this last trip was fantastic from an owner-experience POV.  I had to give away my KBV booking last year (to my sister) so this was my first visit under GPX management.  I see some very good improvements in the resort and operation, and the staff are great--really trying hard.  GPX really gets customer service on the phone and in person!


----------



## Jeff From Salem

Note: With advice from the IOA attorney, the board has decided NOT to implement a bylaw which requires any votes to only be counted from those who are up-to-date with their maintenance fees and/or other financial obligations. The attorney warned that it would be too soon to give owners a chance to catch up. 

But the chances are that the bylaw will likely be voted upon and approved for next year's election. I can't say for sure, but I'm guessing that they will vote to implement the law giving those who are in arrears a chance to catch up. Also know that if the bylaw is eventually voted to be implemented, those who are on agreed upon payment plans are good to go as long as they are up-to-date with their agreements. 

But no one has anything to worry about this year with regard to whether their votes will be counted. I think most here would agree, however, that it's most fair to only count votes from those who are up-to-date with their maintenance fees. 

I also see potentially see circumstances where some use withholding their maintenance fees as a protest. That would be a tough call. Recently, the Diamond Resort in Poipu tried assessing a $6000 assessment. They were sued and lost. If there was an assessment made and an owner refused to pay it, that could also result in that owner not being allowed to vote.

And the KBV bylaw, as written, does state that the "shareholder" (as it is called) _may _not be allowed to participate in owners meeting matters, so perhaps there could be exceptions made.

But in any event, expect that the bylaw will likely be implemented in time for next year's vote. So be pro-active in that regard.

Aloha,

Jeff


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## Jeff From Salem

As an added note to my previous post, my skepticism still stands with the question as to why now? (and it's a rhetorical one).  I don't personally like it when an entity like Wyndham abuses their power for their own gain. My father fought against injustices inflicted on the less powerful. I am not nearly as extraordinary as he was, but I have done my share over the years.

The bylaw hadn't even been brought up for who knows how long. Now that Wyndham is feeling some real heat, they bring it up to try to diminish the number of individual owners.

I'm not against eventually implementing it, as long as delinquent owners are given ample time and opportunity to get themselves caught up, and exceptions be considered due to extenuating circumstances. But again, keep in mind, even the bylaw states "may be" and not "will be" kept from taking part in shareholder (owners) meetings. I will not want to see a corporate dominated IOA board impose a large assessment without transparency, then insist that those who don't meet the corporation's self-imposed deadline be punished.

Jeff


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## Jeff From Salem

Folks, please do make sure you vote! We're just a week away from the vote!! Make sure you go to *saveKBV.org *and _give your Proxy vote to Karen Blackford, leaving the candidate selection blank_. And if you are able, there's a place on the website to help offset some of the costs of this campaign. 

Thanks so much for voting and getting involved!!

Aloha,

Jeff Bellin


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## ecwinch

KYHOME said:


> Interesting comment, Eric - we are all entitled to our own opinions and I respect yours.  All I can say is that I want what is best for Kauai Beach Villas.  It is true that I do not believe that Wyndham controlling our Board of Directors is in the best interest of our owners.  There are 5 seats on the BOD.  Since WYN has 20% of ownership, one seat should be all they hold.  I am not sure what you mean by engaging in a whisper campaign.  I do not feel that I have been whispering about anything.  If I was - - why would I come out and speak openly on this forum?  That is certainly not a whisper.
> 
> I understand that some owners may blame the past BOD for not moving faster to make some of the desired changes at KBV - I might feel the same had I not been on the Board and knew what was driving those delays.  Your BOD had an Action Item List - - that mostly was ignored by Wyndham.  Of course, you can challenge the word choice (ignored), but I am saying that  your BOD put things on that list - - but when we the Action Item List was reviewed at the next meeting, we often  found nothing had been done about most items on the list.  We would then obtain promises that these items would be handled - - only to return to the next meeting to find nothing (or very little) had been done again.  This happened over and over again - - as a result, I cannot in good conscious say that Wyndham was a good management company for Kauai Beach Villas.  I will say that towards the end of their time as KBV's management company, things did get done.  Interesting that it didn't happen until then...  you can draw your on conclusions/opinion about why that happened.  Have you noticed that things are being done since 1/1/17?  Yes, that Action item list is being tended to under Grand Pacific's management.



Karen - thanks for that insight. I always believe that reasonable people can disagree.

In terms of the past BoD actions, as I said in another post - it is lack of communication to the members on the issues with Wyndham that was most disappointing. I think most owners were shocked to hear about the separation. We can disagree on the point of there being a different course of action. 

I did go to the resort after the switchover and as I reported here it a less than positive experience. Perhaps that can just be chalked up to transition issues.

On the whisper campaign point - I clarified with Denise that it was a less than accurate term. It was more about mud-slinging directed toward Lou that drew me into this discussion. No, I dont believe you were the responsible party.

Thanks


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## DeniseM

> In terms of the past BoD actions, as I said in another post - it is l*ack of communication to the members* on the issues with Wyndham that was most disappointing.



Over the years, I have owned close to 20 deeds, and I have never received a direct communication from the BOD at any of the resorts, except for official, sanctioned news letters.  I would be shocked if half the members of a board went rogue and issued a communication to owners saying they were having difficulty with the management company and the other half of the board.  Honestly, I can't imagine that ever happening - I don't believe that is how BOD's work.

It's more common for negative info to come out at election time - like it is now.  This is to be expected - because at election time, owners can do something about problems at the resort by voting for board members who support their views.

I am pleased that a number of view points have been expressed here.  Clearly, we don't all agree, but I think it's important for these viewpoint to come out - whether or not everyone agrees with it.  The challenge, of course, is to keep the discussions on track, and not making them personal.


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## hwnakn

I have a question on how to participate in the on-line voting: I cannot attend the meeting but I do want my vote to count. It appears to me I have to give a proxy to someone or, to members of the board as a whole made on the preference of the majority of the directors present at the meeting or, a shared proxy to the directors present at the meeting. It appears I am not allowed to vote on line as an individual without giving a proxy vote. I want my vote to count without having to give a proxy vote. How can I vote as an individual without having to give an individual or the board as a whole or shared a proxy?


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## DeniseM

This is what you do - log in, and then vote for the person you want at the bottom of the page.

Then at the top of the page, designate someone to vote your proxy - they will vote the way you mark your ballot.

For instance, I voted for Tugger Jack Goodstein, and I also designated my proxy to him, because he is going to be at the meeting.

The deadline is tomorrow, so you want to vote tonight.


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## hwnakn

DeniseM said:


> This is what you do - log in, and then vote for the person you want at the bottom of the page.
> 
> Then at the top of the page, designate someone to vote your proxy - they will vote the way you mark your ballot.
> 
> For instance, I voted for Tugger Jack Goodstein, and I also designated my proxy to him, because he is going to be at the meeting.
> 
> The deadline is tomorrow, so you want to vote tonight.


Denise, Thanks for the reply. I even contacted someone at Grand Pacific and all they could tell me was to contact KBV directly. When I did contact KBV someone there (I will not mention names) gave me the wrong information. They said to cast your vote on the bottom of the ballot and not to choose a proxy.  Of course when I did as instructed the site would not let me complete the ballot without choosing one of the four choices on the top of the ballot.

So, my search continued and was led to this TUG group. Following the billboard and all the, shall I say lively, debates gave me a lot to think on.

I will give Mr. Goodstein my proxy as long as he will cast my votes as I have chosen and not as he sees fit.  Again, thank you for your reply.

HWNAKN (Hawaiian Alaskan)


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## DeniseM

You  don't have to give Jack your proxy - you can give it to the board if you wish.

Just follow the directions on the ballot:  it tells you if you want to vote for a specific candidate, to choose the candidate(s) at the bottom of the page, and then choose someone to vote your proxy to at the top of the page.  These directions are right above the candidates names at the bottom of the page.


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## jacknsara

Aloha,
The BoD election was held today to fill 2  positions.  Linda Kolstad was re-elected.  I came in second place in large part due to receiving all the votes that Karen (KYHOME) held as proxy.  My thanks to all the Tuggers who supported me via either path.
The BoD is now in the midst of a 3 day strategy meeting; I am participating.  I won't be posting much for awhile.
Mahalo,
Jack


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## bryanphunter

Congrats Jack!!  Look forward to your participation on the BOD.


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## DaveNV

Congratulations, Jack! You've worked hard for this.  Good luck!

Dave


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## sjsharkie

First, congratulations, Jack.  I commend you on the collective efforts between you, Jeff and Karen to swing the vote.

Second, I looked back at the posts from over two years ago (including mine), and it is amazing how far we've come through your efforts. I am more optimistic that we can continue to drive change with your leadership on the board and keep GPX on board as management team.  They aren't perfect -- the usurious transfer fee is annoying, and I don't like their reservation process -- but the bottom line is they have increased rental revenue significantly outweighs all of the other cons IMHO.

The fact that we could only secure one seat tells me that there is a continued fight ahead.  But at least owner interests should be more fairly represented with this result in the future.  Thanks for all the hard work in getting us owners to this point.

-ryan


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## TUGBrian

Wonderful news, congratulations on the success after all that hard work!  an incredible accomplishment given what you were up against!


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## DeniseM

That is fantastic!


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## cdn_traveler

Congratulations Jack!   I'm glad that all your hard work to get on the Board has resulted in a positive outcome.  As a KBV owner, I look forward to the positive changes that you will bring to the Board and the resort.


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## foscomoss

Jeff From Salem said:


> Let me add this, if I may-
> 
> Even without the vitriol and lack of appreciation for what I was trying to do last year (again, not for me, but for traditional KBV owners), Lou has shown a seeming lack of interest and/or concern about Wyndham's role here and their history here and elsewhere. He hasn't been vocal as a board member. His broadcast letter to owners was very gentle and sweet. He states that he's a nice guy and wants to just be helpful. Of course, anyone can write a letter when they're trying to get elected. I mean, in general political elections, many candidates try to be everything to everybody, and they used to go to the point of needing to get photographed kissing babies. But he could turn out to be a really nice person, in spite of how he interacted with me last year. But his letter lacked any conversation about the Wyndham issue, or a concern about connecting the past with the present and future in terms of Wyndham's participation.
> 
> Lou wasn't sympathetic for what I tried to wake everybody up about last year concerning Wyndham, and what Karen and I, with Jack's help, are trying to do _now. _What we're doing is very pointed and motivated. We need pointed and motivated people on the IOA board if we're going to accomplish what we need to accomplish. We have no time to waste.
> 
> So again, it's not personal. It's strictly business.
> 
> Mahalo,
> 
> Jeff


thanks for attacking me jeff and questioning my integrity, now that the elections are over and you have succeeded in removing me i will answer any and all questions. and yes i was not sympathetic with your efforts. i have a few questions that i will be bringing up in the near future


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## foscomoss

Jeff From Salem said:


> Aloha Folks -
> 
> Following up on the previous post, Trish Harrington told me yesterday that in her work as a member of the IOA board for the last 12 years, owners' votes were never rejected because they were late with their maintenance fees. In order to implement a policy restricting votes counted to only those who are up-to-date with their maintenance fees has to be voted on by the IOA. The IOA has not voted on this in at _least_ the last 12 years.
> 
> So again, this policy has not been enforced and is potentially arbitrary. So why is this suddenly being brought up now??
> 
> Moreover, interestingly, in the 2 years that Linda Kolstad, a Wyndham employee, has been President of the IOA,, this has never been brought up until now. So why is this suddenly being brought up now??
> 
> The actual by-law is below:
> 
> "Members in good standing: A member shall be considered in good standing if he is current in the payment of all maintenance fees, charges, or other financial assessments with the Interval Association. The right of a member to vote _may_ be suspended by the board of directors if a member is delinquent in paying any maintenance fees, charges, or other financial assessments. The right of a member shall automatically be reinstated upon paying any delinquency."  By-laws Article 2.06
> 
> So notice that it states "may be suspended". Not "will be". Arbitrary.
> 
> So again.......Why do you think the Wyndham people are bringing this up now??
> 
> Jeff


for you information, ms harrington agreed with everyone in the committee meeting that if a member is not in good standing they will lose their right to vote. this is not a wyndham thing. these owners will be given the opportunity to catch up on all fees prior to the election. if they choose not to do so, they forfeit their right. again, it was approved by all members so why is this even being brought up


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## foscomoss

foscomoss said:


> thanks for attacking me jeff and questioning my integrity, now that the elections are over and you have succeeded in removing me i will answer any and all questions. and yes i was not sympathetic with your efforts. i have a few questions that i will be bringing up in the near future



the problem is not wyndham, it is the bad debt the association has every year and the board was working on a solution besides turning KBV into a rental property. i am sure jack will be a very good board member as long as he shows respect to all board members, is open minded and truly wants to help KBV.  i am neither for against any company managing kbv as long as it benefits the owners. what i was against was a company handed the contract with no other bids. i hope that never happens again. even if a company is doing well the board should at least look to see what else is out there. and yes gpr was handed the contract with no other bids


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## foscomoss

ecwinch said:


> Jeff - while I commend your passion, I dont find you a reliable source of information. Sorry. It is far to easy to be revisionist when viewing the past, and even in this thread you have gotten things wrong.
> 
> Clearly KBV has my email address, and I have all my emails - even spam - for the past 10 years. The only communication I have received from Trish was last year when she asked for my vote. Communicating to a small group of supporters does not pass muster in my book.
> 
> If Wyndham was not doing their job, owners should have been notified. Oversight of mgt is the BoD's fiduciary responsibility - and the burden falls on the BoD President to ensure it happens. If Trish was unable to do that, why should she be on the BoD?  What happens if GPR starts performing in a similar fashion - do we have to live with it until we can cancel the contract? That seems like poor and passive BoD mgt to me.
> 
> Heck - there was not even any communication prior to the decision to terminate the mgt contract? Why not? Seems like a pretty big item that the BoD might want to survey the members on. Not the shot in the dark I have to learn about on TUG.


not only was the contract terminated, but was handed to gpr, there were no bids released to amy other company. ms harrington took it upon herself to seek out gpr, offer them a contract, sign the contract before the board even voted hmmmm


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## foscomoss

KYHOME said:


> Interesting comment, Eric - we are all entitled to our own opinions and I respect yours.  All I can say is that I want what is best for Kauai Beach Villas.  It is true that I do not believe that Wyndham controlling our Board of Directors is in the best interest of our owners.  There are 5 seats on the BOD.  Since WYN has 20% of ownership, one seat should be all they hold.  I am not sure what you mean by engaging in a whisper campaign.  I do not feel that I have been whispering about anything.  If I was - - why would I come out and speak openly on this forum?  That is certainly not a whisper.
> 
> I understand that some owners may blame the past BOD for not moving faster to make some of the desired changes at KBV - I might feel the same had I not been on the Board and knew what was driving those delays.  Your BOD had an Action Item List - - that mostly was ignored by Wyndham.  Of course, you can challenge the word choice (ignored), but I am saying that  your BOD put things on that list - - but when we the Action Item List was reviewed at the next meeting, we often  found nothing had been done about most items on the list.  We would then obtain promises that these items would be handled - - only to return to the next meeting to find nothing (or very little) had been done again.  This happened over and over again - - as a result, I cannot in good conscious say that Wyndham was a good management company for Kauai Beach Villas.  I will say that towards the end of their time as KBV's management company, things did get done.  Interesting that it didn't happen until then...  you can draw your on conclusions/opinion about why that happened.  Have you noticed that things are being done since 1/1/17?  Yes, that Action item list is being tended to under Grand Pacific's management.


isn't it strange that these items were not acted on when a certain manager was in place for four years, but nothing was done by the bod then. when he left to becpme the gm of the makai club, a gpr managed facility, the actions items were completed new and old in less then two years, but then wyndham was said to be derelict. this same individual actually took gpr representatives on a tour of kbv while he was the wyndham representative these are facts.


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## foscomoss

Jeff From Salem said:


> Let me add this, if I may-
> 
> Even without the vitriol and lack of appreciation for what I was trying to do last year (again, not for me, but for traditional KBV owners), Lou has shown a seeming lack of interest and/or concern about Wyndham's role here and their history here and elsewhere. He hasn't been vocal as a board member. His broadcast letter to owners was very gentle and sweet. He states that he's a nice guy and wants to just be helpful. Of course, anyone can write a letter when they're trying to get elected. I mean, in general political elections, many candidates try to be everything to everybody, and they used to go to the point of needing to get photographed kissing babies. But he could turn out to be a really nice person, in spite of how he interacted with me last year. But his letter lacked any conversation about the Wyndham issue, or a concern about connecting the past with the present and future in terms of Wyndham's participation.
> 
> Lou wasn't sympathetic for what I tried to wake everybody up about last year concerning Wyndham, and what Karen and I, with Jack's help, are trying to do _now. _What we're doing is very pointed and motivated. We need pointed and motivated people on the IOA board if we're going to accomplish what we need to accomplish. We have no time to waste.
> 
> So again, it's not personal. It's strictly business.
> 
> Mahalo,
> 
> Jeff


in response, i was less than nice to jeff when i received his first e-mail supporting me harrington in 2016. i questioned the legality of the e-mail. he did not get the owners list from gpr or wyndham, he received it from ms harrington which is a violation of the associations by-laws. how do i know this you might ask.the info on the bottom of jeff's e-mail was the same as what was on ms harrington's e-mail. it was al  her return info. that is why i questioned him. next why all of a sudden does he take such an interest in a resort that he own a unit every other year and uses it for trading power. other than the last two board meetings i don't know if he ever stayed at kbv. i have not missed  going to kbv since i bought my first unit in 2000.  jeff, you only became an advocate of ms harrington after a lengthy conversation with gpr representatives who intorduced you to her. that is why i was less than nice. i was running for the board also, did not campaign and because i don't support you and karen and trish i don't count? i am an owner of now 3 weeks every year


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## foscomoss

now let me discuss ms harrington. she is a long time professional board member. she is a very intelligent woman who knows how to play the system and also play to owners. her and her husband have received two free trips to kbv every year for the last 12 years. she also serves on the shearwater board and until recently was on the bali hi board. you do the math six free trips every year toi kauai for her and her husband. isn't it time for a change. next she violated the by laws by giving out the list of owners to an individual owner. after she signed a code of ethics on the previous board, she accepted a trip to carlsbad to attend gpr best of the best award ceremony, transportation and lodging. larry and i were offered the same but excused ourselves. next she accepted two free vacation weeks from gpr. finally, a special meeting was called to address her conversations with staff concerning other members of the board. is this the person we want to represent us? she is up for election next may. it would be a shame to see her or karen or jeff get on the board. lets have a fair, open mionded board. i support bids going out to companies before every management company's end of contract. lety's see what is out there and not just blindly renew a contract. not saying we have to change but at least know what is out there


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## Jeff From Salem

This is a bit long, so pardon me for that. 

I just got back from my normally scheduled, fixed vacation week at The Harborside Inn in Edgartown, Martha's Vineyard. Boy, did I need to decompress. It seems funny to say that being in Kaua'i left me somewhat stressed.

But in any case, thanks SO much for your partnership, Karen. We did work a lot on this project and we all, meaning those of you reading this as well as those owners who have yet to be part of this blog, have a lot to do. We need to get the number of owners who vote way up, and that will be a job that could take years.

That being said, we clearly made them nervous. Some of us were quite angry regarding the rules for the Owner Forum part of the annual meeting that were laid down by the majority Wyndham faction. For one, Trish Harrington didn't even get then until the morning of, partly due to her email being down, but they were only sent out the previous day, if I understand correctly.

Secondly, the rules were just handed out with a packet of stuff for the owners to read just a short while before the meeting was to start. Who reads everything??!? But the rules were asked to be agreed upon and were adopted unless there was any objection.

One of the written Rules included a 2 minute time limit for a comment and no time for rebuttal. Think about that for a minute.

After the owners forum had started (and this was after the vote was taken and tallied, with winners announced), we were arbitrarily told that we would have to put our questions in writing. Requiring questions in advance in writing has never been required before to my knowledge and it was certainly not the case last year. Then the lawyer present, after discussion with the Linda Kolstad, the board President, decided that any questions pertaining to Wyndham would be dealt with after the meeting was over. Karen and I, along with several others (Charles Twardzicki and Jack Goodstein, to name a few) were outraged. One of the questions I was going to ask was "What is Wyndham planning to do with the 1100+ deeds they have in their possession?". A fair question that should be heard by all, right?  They ended the Owners Forum precisely at the time for the owners Mai Tai Social held at the KBV pool, where a raffle would be held for some free stuff like a free week at a Grand Pacific resort. Just about everyone left. Even Trish left. She didn't hear that Wyndham questions would be only answered when after the meeting was officially over.

The lawyer excused himself. There were just a few of us. And just about every answer that had anything to do with Wyndham was answered by Linda Kolstad with "I don't know. I don't know anything about that part of Wyndham." There was no "I don't know, but I'll find out." It was "If you want to know, you can call Wyndham yourself." She said that she shouldn't have to be responsible for answering those questions. I responded by saying that ANY member of the IOA board should be able to respond to pertinent questions, even if they don't have the answer at the tip of their tongue. They are the ones who should be answering to us and getting our questions answered. Fortunately, Sherri Weeks, VP of Development for Grand Pacific was listening and urged Linda to find out the answers to anything she doesn't know. For cripe's sake, what the hell is the President of our KBV board saying "I know nothing, I see nothing!" She's Sergeant Schultz of Hogan's Heroes. 

But wait, there's MORE! During the first part of the meeting where the agenda of the annual meeting was discussed, Linda discussed our sources of income and costs (in a very general, generic way). She had a board and marker. She wrote down that $4,500,000 comes in from individual owner maintenance fees. She then wrote down that $1,500,000 comes in from "BULK", a corporate ownership. "BULK"??? I spoke out, "Who happens to be the "bulk" corporate interest, Linda?" She replied, "I really don't want to say right now." Really. That's what she said. I shouted out, "That's Wyndham, in case anyone is wondering!"

Well, the vote happened and we know how it came out. But one comment at the Owners Forum from an owner was particularly astonishing and sort of summed up the cost of lack of transparency. "Linda, we voted for you because we have seen the resort get better in the last 2 years." (Linda smiled eagerly and said "Thank you."). "But", he said, "Why didn't you say in your Candidate Statement that you worked for Wyndham, that you had no personal ownership at Kauai Beach Villas?!? I own at some Wyndham properties. I don't like how they run things. I don't like how they ran KBV. If I had known that you worked for Wyndham, I wouldn't have voted for you!"

How about that?!

She responded that she didn't have to disclose she worked for Wyndham. (Really?!?). But she then went on to say that she happily works for Wyndham and represents their interests on the board. Nice, huh?

So you can imagine that a bunch of us were pretty furious. 

We finally got out of there and got to the Mai Tai Social (I needed a couple in order to calm down). And I won 2 free nights at a Grand Pacific Resort!

As a complete aside, I met Charles Twardzicki at an Owners Update. He's a straight shooter. And we bonded. We didn't always see eye to eye, but he's concerned about Wyndham's presence as well. On the other hand, he thinks Larry Warner is neutral, not pro-Wyndham. But Warner was a jerk at the afterward part of the meeting and I know he has privately suggested that Trish should be removed from the board. 

The kicker was meeting Lou Columbo. We ran into each other on the beach much later in the week. We must have talked for at least an hour. And we not only seem to get along really well, but we seem to see eye-to-eye on a lot of things. The thing is, he was totally unaware (and I believed him) about the Wyndham crap. He was not aware of Wyndham's Smoking Gun. He had not read anything in either the TUG or this forum (although I had admittedly kicked him out when he was being nasty toward me about using an owners list to promote particular candidates). 

So I fault him for not educating himself, particularly after being on the IOA board. But I will give him a LOT of credit. After seeing me in action this week and hearing where I am and was coming from (and my frustration with his sole concentration on whether I was making an honest use of the list), Lou sincerely apologized for interacting with me the way he had last year. And then he told me that he wished he had known me a few years ago instead of just getting to meet me now. I tell you, my heart fell. That was one of the most sincere, honest, and moving apologies I have ever heard.

I told Lou about the Wyndham's Smoking Gun document. He seemed to be astonished to hear about it. I told him to not only read it, but to print it out. In fact, I ask that ALL of you print out a copy. I sincerely wish that I had thought to print out a copy (or, in fact, to print out LOTS of copies and hand them out at the meeting prior to the vote). I would have LOVED to have confronted the board about it publicly. Of course, I would have been admonished for speaking out, and/or it would have been relegated to the time after the owners meeting. 

But I want everyone to have a physical copy and bring it with them to show Wyndham people at the resort. And bring it if you're coming to an IOA meeting. And show it to anyone you know who is an owner at KBV.

I'm very tired, so I'm going to bed right now, but there's some very good stuff to share. We saw plans for unit upgrades. I went up to the Makai Club and saw their's that had actually been implemented. VERY impressed. By midsummer there should be a model unit to see as part of the owners update. 

And we are VERY, VERY close to having an agreement between the hotel and our resort for the use of their pools (with no added cost to our maintenance fees). This would be only for KBV owners and RCI exchangers. Renters would have to pay a resort fee. 




foscomoss said:


> _thanks for attacking me jeff and questioning my integrity, now that the elections are over and you have succeeded in removing me i will answer any and all questions. and yes i was not sympathetic with your efforts. i have a few questions that i will be bringing up in the near future_



Now, Lou, I'm not sure if your true colors are showing through or not. What you say about "free trips" and whatnot -- Everyone who gets on the board gets that benefit. It would be unfair to ask members to pay their own way to Hawaii twice per year to serve on the board. And it's not like it's a week of playtime, I'm sure. For the week, board members were in meetings from Wednesday through Saturday, and long days. And as far as using Trish Harrington's owners list to help promote her candidacy as well as the general information about what Wyndham was doing, it was perfectly legal. This was checked with counsel. That you're being indignant now is making me question your motives all over again, and makes me think it was the right thing to get you off the board. Believe me, after meeting you on the beach, I had some second thoughts. If I were you, I wouldn't ruin that. And what do you think my ulterior motives are? Do you think this all was really about you? 

The Wyndham's Smoking Gun document, something I didn't even know about until the last couple of months, only affirmed my suspicions and all the work I started last year. There were conclusions I came to due to circumstantial evidence, along with discussion with a couple of board members over the years. And then there were the personal experiences of interactions with Wyndham personnel at the owners update. There was the lowering of standards at the resort along with the raising of maintenance fees. There was the lackadaisical interactions with services at KBV. Then I stayed at the Coronado Beach Resort in San Diego, and the service was fanTAStic. A night and day difference between what I was experiencing at KBV and there. I checked out a couple of other GP resorts and saw the same high standards and service. I discovered that there were better alternatives to timeshare resort management than Wyndham. That discovery was part of what led to Wyndham's contract ending at KBV in the IOA. And the AOAO was heading in the same direction before Wyndham enacted a hostile takeover, successfully implementing what you see in the Wyndham's Smoking Gun memo. 

Meanwhile, Jack and Trish were far more aware of the shenanigans that Wyndham has been pulling. If you're not aware, Lou, then you're not doing your job to represent us owners, and that's the reason that you're off the IOA board. We need people like Karen, myself, and Jack on the board, and we need more of them. We need to work on being able to get a majority of strong individual owners onto the board again. We have to be persistant. It may take a while - years even, but we need to keep working at it. I'm sorry you may feel hurt, Lou. I do. But, as Michael Corleone said in The Godfather when they plotted to kill Solozzo and the corrupt police captain, "It's not personal, Sonny. It's strictly business." 

Aloha,

Jeff


----------



## ecwinch

Jeff - help me understand why you feel that Wyndham under any obligation to answer any questions about the deeds they own at that resort?


----------



## KYHOME

ecwinch said:


> Jeff - I believe your observations about Lou are equally true of many of the independent owners that sat on the BoD for years - including Trish. For all the years I have owned at KBV, the BoD's efforts regarding communication with owners have been minimal and same is true for transparency. For years I have read the rumor about the pool funds being diverted to Bali Hai - something that we now know is false. But why was this not common knowledge among the many of the devoted KBV owners who frequent this forum?
> 
> For the 10 years that Wyndham had the mgt contract, the BoD approved the dues increases that mgt requested and was responsible for ensuring the funds were being effectively utilized. If Wyndham was not effectively managing the resort as you imply - where was the communication from the BoD members on these matters? How effectively were the incumbent BOD members exercising oversight of Wyndham as manager?
> 
> You have posted about how Trish is the only BoD member we can count. If that is true, why does she seemingly place such a low priority on owner communication. Why cant she take the time to communicate with the KBV owners on a more regular basis and why the lack of communication for the past 10 years?
> 
> ps. Here is one issue I would like to hear some communication from the BoD about - currently what is happening with weeks from defaulting owners? GPR seems to be renting weeks out basically for mf. Is that sustainable in the long-run? Seems to me that will always result in a drain on Club finances unless GPR is able to rent out 100% of the inventory and take no commission on the rentals.


I realize I am late in responding to this post, sorry about that.  I want to tell you some facts about communication with owners between 2011 and 2017 - - the time that I was a BOD member.  Communication was a frequent topic.  The problem was that there was no easy way to communicate with owners, and what we attempted failed.  
1)  Email addresses:  We didn't have a decent list of email addresses and we repeatedly worked with Wyndham (WYN) to try to improve what we had.  (Finally, in the past 1.5 years we have a decent email list and a process set up for using it).  
2)  Website:  Getting something posted on the website that existed was discussed many times, but it never happened.  I am sure that if any of you recall that website was not nearly as friendly as what we have now! (Building a good website for KBV was part of our discussions with Grand Pacific).
3)  Mailings:  Even our regular mailings of a KBV newsletter went by the wayside - - this was another Action Item on the Action Item list that was not completed....

During this time I did have a subscription to the Timeshare magazine - - and I did read it.  However, I was not aware of TUG until the later part of my term.  That could have been an avenue for communication to owners who are active here.  I really don't know if other BOD members were aware of TUG at that time.  

All I am saying is that being able to communicate with owners was a constant challenge.  It was not ignored.  Now, it's a different ballgame.  We have access to email and snail mail addresses of owners as well as a good website that even holds meeting minutes and other important documents for all owners to see.  From my perspective, we got all this with a better management company - - Grand Pacific.  Your Board can produce much more and be more transparent with the right tools - - and a good management partner.  I know we were not perfect, and there are things that could have been done differently.  We can debate that all day long.  However, I just want to state that communication was not ignored in the past.  

Regarding your P.S. question.  I do know that Grand Pacific and your current BOD is working on this very issue.  It is understood that rentals aren't a long term solution.  But let's also know that it is delivering the desired result right now - - KBV's rental revenue for 2017 (after deducting rental commissions/costs) was $651k.  Bad Debt expense for the same time period was $709.  As you can see, net rental income came close to covering bad debt.  I can assure you this NEVER happened when WYN was our management partner  - - and they held the Rental contract as well!  Net rental income for 2018 was projected to exceed 2017 based on the performance thus far this year.  However, I don't know what effect the volcano on the Big Island (Hawaii) has had or could have on 2018 rentals.


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## KYHOME

foscomoss said:


> not only was the contract terminated, but was handed to gpr, there were no bids released to amy other company. ms harrington took it upon herself to seek out gpr, offer them a contract, sign the contract before the board even voted hmmmm


For the record, Here are the facts about the timing on signing the contract with Grand Pacific:
1)  The final version of the contract was sent to BOD members via email on 2/18/16.  The date on the agreement was blank.
2)  BOD members received a separate email on 2/18/16 to notify them of the special meeting to vote on the contract.  The meeting was scheduled to be held on 2/23/17.
3)  The decision to execute the Grand Pacific contract was made during the special meeting on 2/23/17.
4)  On 2/25/17 Board members received the signed copy of the contract from Trish Harrington.  The date on the agreement was February 23, 2018.

There is nothing in the facts that indicates that the Grand Pacific contract was signed before the board even voted....I have the documents to back up everything I have said here.


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## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Jeff - help me understand why you feel that Wyndham under any obligation to answer any questions about the deeds they own at that resort?



Because when they agreed to take over the deeds, it was under the understanding that they would sell them, Eric. David Walters understood that Wyndham's powerful sales team would have better tools than he ultimately had for selling the leftover deeds. The deeds would get into individual owners' hands who would pay the maintenance fees, and Wyndham would make their commission off of the sales. Everybody wins. 

But Wyndham instead chose to use their mass ownership of the deeds to undermine the wishes and aggregate power of the individual owner. We've gone from a representative democracy to practically an autocracy. 

When Linda Kolstad chose to merely identify Wyndham as a generic "Bulk Owner", it was part of Wyndham's attempt to mislead the owners. As I mentioned in my previous post, an outspoken owner didn't even know that Linda worked for Wyndham. She didn't feel that it was important for people to know that. She didn't let people know that she personally owned no deeds, no property at KBV. She gets paid by Wyndham to represent their interests. Those interests may or may not coincide with those of individual owners. She is paid to do what Wyndham wants her to do. I suspect that most individual owners are not being paid by a corporate interest to represent them, nor are they representing 20% of that corporate interest. 

But the mission of a corporation with stockholders to make a profit, to make money. An individual owner's mission is to have as a good a vacation as possible in the least costly way. Profit doesn't enter into it. If a corporation is at the heart of the resort, then their interest potentially is to make as much money as possible off of individual owners. If their power is strong enough, the company can manipulate the running of the resort with little or no transparency. In contrast, a completely individual owner controlled board oversees the management company, meaning the owners continue to be the boss of the management company. 

If Wyndham continues to hold the ~20+% of the deeds and then takes back control as the management company, we lose transparency, any checks and balances. It's not a good situation. 

So to answer your question, my question was about transparency. If I'm on the board, and I have ulterior motives other than those typical of individual owners wanting the best run, least expensive vacation property, you ought to know about it, and you'd want to know about it.


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## Jeff From Salem

KYHOME said:


> For the record, Here are the facts about the timing on signing the contract with Grand Pacific:
> 1)  The final version of the contract was sent to BOD members via email on 2/18/16.  The date on the agreement was blank.
> 2)  BOD members received a separate email on 2/18/16 to notify them of the special meeting to vote on the contract.  The meeting was scheduled to be held on 2/23/17.
> 3)  The decision to execute the Grand Pacific contract was made during the special meeting on 2/23/17.
> 4)  On 2/25/17 Board members received the signed copy of the contract from Trish Harrington.  The date on the agreement was February 23, 2018.
> 
> There is nothing in the facts that indicates that the Grand Pacific contract was signed before the board even voted....I have the documents to back up everything I have said here.



So, again, Lou Columbo puts out a mean and erroneous post -  "not only was the contract terminated, but was handed to gpr, there were no bids released to amy other company. ms harrington took it upon herself to seek out gpr, offer them a contract, sign the contract before the board even voted hmmmm"

Why is Lou so interested in undermining those who are trying to keep power in the hands of individual owners?? The only reason that individual owners have ANY power is that there is essentially a union of owners, supposed to be led by the IOA board. If you undermine the power of the individuals in favor of a corporate entity, then the individual owner is completely at the mercy of the corporate interest. I'm sorry, but it's not personal. It's strictly business. Checks and balances are about keeping those who are more powerful, who have more power, in check. The 4th Estate, the press, was designed to be a check over those with power in government. The U.S. Congress was designed to be a check and balance over the President. I fear that we are losing our focus here. The more we muddy the water, the more we lose focus on our mission. We need to work to ensure that union of individual owners maintains its power, its ability to be the check and balance. 

I personally know that Grand Pacific wasn't the only management company explored when the BOD was looking at a new management company in early 2016.

And then Wyndham's first move later that year was to use their votes to overthrow Trish Harrington as President of the AOAO, gain company control of the board, and keep their contract intact, knowing that they were about to get voted out as the manager of the AOAO functions. That's not a subjective judgment. It's fact, as we can see in the Wyndham's Smoking Gun memo posted on the saveKBV.org website. Wyndham used their power for their own private gains, not to empower the wishes of the individual owners and entities. Do y'all not see either an ethical and/or moral issue with Wyndham's parent company manipulating the board to insure that their resort management company maintains control of the resort management contract over the wish of the individual owners of the board?

Jeff


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## ecwinch

Jeff From Salem said:


> I personally know that Grand Pacific wasn't the only management company explored when the BOD was looking at a new management company in early 2016.



Ok - what other companies were asked to submit bids on the management contract at KBV? That is what Lou reported - ie. that the contract was not put out for competitive bid. Do you have personal knowledge that bid packets were provided to other companies? If so, which ones?



Jeff From Salem said:


> Because when they agreed to take over the deeds, it was under the understanding that they would sell them, Eric. David Walters understood that Wyndham's powerful sales team would have better tools than he ultimately had for selling the leftover deeds. The deeds would get into individual owners' hands who would pay the maintenance fees, and Wyndham would make their commission off of the sales. Everybody wins.



Do you have copy of the agreement between Pahio and Wyndham that outlines this understanding?

And I thought the issue at hand was the intervals from defaulting owners. Your response seems to be about developer inventory that Wyndham acquired from Pahio. They are apples and oranges. One is a contract with Pahio, the other is a contract between the HOA and Wyndham.



Jeff From Salem said:


> Why is Lou so interested in undermining those who are trying to keep power in the hands of individual owners??


You might ask yourself that same question, since you undermined him to help get Jack elected.


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## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Ok - what other companies were asked to submit bids on the management contract at KBV? That is what Lou reported - ie. that the contract was not put out for competitive bid. Do you have personal knowledge that bid packets were provided to other companies? If so, which ones?
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have copy of the agreement between Pahio and Wyndham that outlines this understanding?
> 
> And I thought the issue at hand was the intervals from defaulting owners. Your response seems to be about developer inventory that Wyndham acquired from Pahio. They are apples and oranges. One is a contract with Pahio, the other is a contract between the HOA and Wyndham.
> 
> 
> You might ask yourself that same question, since you undermined him to help get Jack elected.




Regarding your first comments, you can get that information from long-time IOA board members such as Karen Blackford or Trish Harrington.

Regarding your last question, you need to read KYLOVE's last comment, in addition to the entire thread. KYLOVE is Karen Blackford, a long-time board member. You can also read Lou's previous rant. Eric, you seem to have a blind spot about this issue and why we created this movement, because you keep ask the same questions over and over again, and why we worked to get certain members on or off the board has been discussed over and over again, but you come back with the same questions. Karen Blackford has addressed many of the same issues.  Even with evidence, you don't acknowledge it. So I can't help you.


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## KYHOME

This is Karen Blackford (KYHOME).  I thought it would be good to start this post by clearly identifying myself - - to ensure no one can accuse me of not being transparent, doing a "whisper campaign" or some other accusation.  We sure waste a lot of time and effort here when we could be using it for discussing solutions.  It is interesting reading the back and forth comments posted between Eric, Jeff and Lou. I am sure there are others, but recently, that's what I have seen.  There is so much finger-pointing posted here it's hard for any reader to find the truth about important issues that affect the continued success of KBV.  This is a place to vent, share unpleasant and pleasant experiences, etc.  That's great - we need that.  But do we really need all the finger-pointing too? I see comments posted here about what happened in the past - some are right - but many only partially correct or totally wrong.  They are often stated in accusatory language and/or stated as if they are facts.  I believe that many of these posts are relaying the writer's opinion and/or something someone else told the writer.  I know I am "preaching to the choir" when I tell you that what someone else tells you is not always factual, it often contains facts, but it can also contain a lot of other stuff that isn't true.   If you don't know the facts on a subject, please use this forum or your other sources to ask questions before you blurt it out here - and if it is your opinion or you are relaying what someone told you, then say so, and tell us why you are thinking this way.  It would be nice not have to read thru all the unnecessary stuff to attempt to find that valuable piece of information you have buried within your post.  In my opinion, readers will respect you much more for it and likely be more eager to read your posts and take them seriously. 

For the record, I don't have a problem telling you when I made a mistake.  I know I do and I have said so here.  I have also (more than once) posted facts to clear up something someone else posted.  If I have the actual documents or other information to back up what I am saying, I tell you (If I somehow overlooked this - call me out on it!).  I know there is likely something that I have said in this post that will not be interpreted the way I intended - - and that some of you won't chose to believe me when I provide an explanation.  I accept that.  Believe me, I know I screw up daily and I know that someone else might say some of this differently.  I did a lot of editing before pushing that "post" button - but I am sure there are places I could of stated things better. 

Just in case you are wondering - yes, I am a preacher's kid.  So if you think this sounded like a sermon, it probably does. (you could say, "at least she came by it honestly" - - or is that a phrase we only use in Kentucky?)  We all have different motivations that make us behave the way we do.  It does not mean any of us are bad people.


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## ecwinch

KYHOME said:


> There is so much finger-pointing posted here it's hard for any reader to find the truth about important issues that affect the continued success of KBV.
> 
> I see comments posted here about what happened in the past - some are right - but many only partially correct or totally wrong.  They are often stated in accusatory language and/or stated as if they are facts.  I believe that many of these posts are relaying the writer's opinion and/or something someone else told the writer.



Karen - on the point of sifting thru the "facts" vs "opinion/speculation", I agree with you 100%. My inquiries have been focused on finding the truth. But unfortunately most of the answers have fallen short.

Any insight you can provide on the agreement between Pahio and Wyndham, the agreement on Wyndham's ability to purchase intervals from defaulting owners, and/or the process that was used to select GPR would certainly be helpful to determine if the statements here are factual or not.

Toward that end, your participation in this thread has been very helpful. Thanks.

ps. Having gone back to your post outlining the timeline with GPR, I find the dates confusing - but perhaps I am missing something. I know that GPR was managing the resort when I stayed there in Feb 2017, and my memory is that the BoD communicated the change in mgt at some point in 2016. Your post mentions events in 2017 and 2018 - is that a typo? shouldnt all the dates be 2016?


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## KYHOME

ecwinch said:


> Karen - on the point of sifting thru the "facts" vs "opinion/speculation", I agree with you 100%. My inquiries have been focused on finding the truth. But unfortunately most of the answers have fallen short.
> 
> Any insight you can provide on the agreement between Pahio and Wyndham, the agreement on Wyndham's ability to purchase intervals from defaulting owners, and/or the process that was used to select GPR would certainly be helpful to determine if the statements here are factual or not.
> 
> Toward that end, your participation in this thread has been very helpful. Thanks.
> 
> ps. Having gone back to your post outlining the timeline with GPR, I find the dates confusing - but perhaps I am missing something. I know that GPR was managing the resort when I stayed there in Feb 2017, and my memory is that the BoD communicated the change in mgt at some point in 2016. Your post mentions events in 2017 and 2018 - is that a typo? shouldnt all the dates be 2016?


I will check dates  - could be a typo.


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## KYHOME

KYHOME said:


> I will check dates  - could be a typo.


*Geez, I am going to blame that one on getting old!  I apologize for incorrectly typing the year on several of these dates in my previous post!  I am restating with the note with the corrected dates below (corrections to the year are in Blue bold text, added some additional text in bold/italics - see #4):
*
For the record, Here are the facts about the timing on signing the contract with Grand Pacific:
1) The final version of the contract was sent to BOD members via email on 2/18/16. The date on the agreement was blank.
2) BOD members received a separate email on 2/18/16 to notify them of the special meeting to vote on the contract. The meeting was scheduled to be held on 2/23/1*6*.
3) The decision to execute the Grand Pacific contract was made during the special meeting on 2/23/1*6*.
4) On 2/25/1*6* Board members received the signed copy of the contract from Trish Harrington. The date on the agreement was February 23, 201*6*, *with an effective date of January 1st, 2017.*

There is nothing in the facts that indicates that the Grand Pacific contract was signed before the board even voted....I have the documents to back up everything I have said here.​


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## KYHOME

ecwinch said:


> Ok - what other companies were asked to submit bids on the management contract at KBV? That is what Lou reported - ie. that the contract was not put out for competitive bid. Do you have personal knowledge that bid packets were provided to other companies? If so, which ones?
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have copy of the agreement between Pahio and Wyndham that outlines this understanding?
> 
> And I thought the issue at hand was the intervals from defaulting owners. Your response seems to be about developer inventory that Wyndham acquired from Pahio. They are apples and oranges. One is a contract with Pahio, the other is a contract between the HOA and Wyndham.
> 
> 
> You might ask yourself that same question, since you undermined him to help get Jack elected.



I am responding to the question I keep seeing here - what did the foreclosure contract between Pahio/KBV and WYN actually say about reselling inventory.  First, I want to explain that I became a board member in late May, 2011.  This happened later in 2011.  (I am not telling you this for an excuse).  Also, Lynn McCrory (original developer) who was extremely knowledgeable about timeshares was on our board AND the contract was reviewed by our legal counsel as well.  

Here is the exact language from the contract:

6. Right to Resell. Nothing herein contained shall limit WVR’s right to further assign any Delinquent Inventory which has been assigned to WVR by the Association, or to resell such Delinquent Inventory to any bonafide purchaser, or otherwise utilize the Delinquent Inventory in any manner permitted under the Project governing documents or applicable law.​
I can tell you that Wyndham did tell us that the inventory would be resold.  I don't have a document that states this - it was verbal.  I can tell you I clearly understood that was their intent.  The first few years, very few foreclosures were processed.  Then the volume picked up dramatically and the BOD realized the inventory was not being resold.  We asked Wyndham - their answer was that they could not resell anything until they obtained the proper registration with the state of Hawaii - - and the person in government who handled that was notoriously slow and they could not get the registration processed.  This excuse was used by Wyndham right up until we pulled the contract.  

It is true that we did not have a new foreclosure contract in place when we pulled the contract with WYN.  This happened because contractually, we only had a window for a specific period of time or the contract would stay in effect another year.  A delay meant that WYN would get ownership of another lot of several hundred  units.  We were in negotiations with another company, but it was not yet final.  In our opinion, we could not afford to wait any longer - - being without a foreclosure contract for a short period of time was a better alternative than allowing WYN to gain hundreds more KBV units in the upcoming year.    

In hindsight, I admit that we were naïve to believe WYN would do what they said and resell the foreclosed units - - the contract language does give them opportunities to do otherwise.  But their delay tactics in responding to our questions on the subject was abhorrent - - and to this day, I believe their explanation (about the registration process with the state) was a stalling tactic.  They are a huge company - - I can't accept that they could not work with the state to resolve this issue (if it was an issue).  To my knowledge, they still have not resold a single KBV unit.  

I am sure many of you will have lots to say about this - - but at least you can stop speculating on what happened.  Now you know.


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## ecwinch

Thanks for that insight. I am not really speculating on what happened. The facts as I know them are:

Wyndham acquired from Pahio any and all of the rights they held at KBV in 2006. Presumably including unsold inventory.
Over a number of years they acquired inventory from the HOA that resulting from defaulting owners. During the recession, I am sure this was sizable.
They control that inventory thru Club Wyndham Plus in some fashion.
They also acquire inventory from KBV owners who have assigned their usage rights to Club Wyndham Plus.


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## KYHOME

Eric, Here's the 2006 newspaper post on WYN's purchase from Pahio, which included KBV.  This happened before my time on the board, so I don't have any additional information:

_KAUI, HI— Wyndham Vacation Ownership, Inc. has acquired Hawaii-based PAHIO Resorts, Inc. and PAHIO Vacation Ownership, Inc. Wyndham Vacation Ownership will assume property management, sales and marketing operations for Bali Hai Villas, Ka Eo Kai, Kaui Beach Villas, Shearwater and Makai Resorts, all located here. Additionally, Wyndham Vacation Ownership has entered into an exclusive relationship with developer David Walters to expand the Bali Hai Villas resort, adding more than 125 vacation ownership units. PAHIOs five resorts have approximately 20,000 owners and consist of more than 400 vacation ownership units. The acquisition will provide Wyhndam Vacation Ownership with an enhanced presence in the Hawaiian Islands._​WYN acquired most of their units via the separate the Foreclosure agreement - and yes, during the recession it was sizeable.  I can't say exactly how they use the inventory they got through foreclosures (they owned 799 as of 12/31/14 _(per the annual audit report),_ that number is over a thousand now.  I have always speculated that they use it to stock the Club Wyndham Plus (CWP) program.  I do know that during my tenure on the board the inventory they had was never for sale.

Here is how CWP worked during the time that I was on the board - what you have is partially correct:  

CWP owners pay monthly dues to CWP.  WYN then pays the annual maintenance fees to KBV IOA for the CWP owner. Owners retain the title to the KBV IOA interval.  (CWP does not own these intervals but rather individual owners have given up their use rights to the CWP.  CWP owners still vote in the BOD elections).

If a CWP owner defaults in their monthly payments to WYN for 90 days, WYN returns the interval to the KBV IOA. Since WYN has already paid the maintenance fees for the year, the IOA will not experience a loss unless the owner does not pay their maintenance fees for the upcoming year (due on 12/15).  IF the owner does not pay the dues for the upcoming year - after 365 days the interval goes into foreclosure - - when we had the Foreclosure Agreement with WYN, Wyndham then foreclosed and became the owner of the interval.  _(This information is per a WVO Controller in a memo dated 5/18/15)._  In my opinion, this was another reason to discontinue the foreclosure agreement with WYN.  By the way, it took quite a bit of prodding to get the information on how this worked from WYN (yet another reason I don't trust them).​I hope this information is helpful.
​
​


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## ecwinch

Karen - thanks for the insight. I have always found your posts to be very helpful.

As I have stated before, given the size of the Wyndham ownership at the resort (in addition to owners who have assigned their units for points), I fail to understand how an adversarial position towards Wyndham bodes well for the long-term success of KBV.

For I do observe that the SaveOVI movement resulted in a significant increase in dues for owners in the current fiscal year. Hopefully the same is not in store for KBV.


----------



## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> Karen - thanks for the insight. I have always found your posts to be very helpful.
> 
> As I have stated before, given the size of the Wyndham ownership at the resort (in addition to owners who have assigned their units for points), I fail to understand how an adversarial position towards Wyndham bodes well for the long-term success of KBV.
> 
> For I do observe that the SaveOVI movement resulted in a significant increase in dues for owners in the current fiscal year. Hopefully the same is not in store for KBV.



1) Eric, do you fail to see _any_ negative effect Wyndham's presence has had on Kauai Beach Villas? 

2) And what do you make of the inter-Wyndham memo from October 2016 seeking to overthrow the current President of the AOAO and get a majority of that board in order to keep their management contract? Do you see anything underhanded, unethical, or immoral?

Jeff


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## KYHOME

I'd like to weigh in here too regarding your comment about Wyndham, having an adversarial position towards them and it's long term effect.   I have explained in several previous posts (I won't repeat  here) why WYN was not a good Manager for KBV.  I believe KBV owners deserve better than what they got with WYN.  Although they carry name recognition, their performance was not to the level I have seen with Grand Pacific.  That's just the facts and this can be proved with financial comparisons as well as the "Smoking Gun."   I just want them (WYN) to behave like most management and large block owners behave - - that is, they don't attempt to or use their size and power to gain control of a board - - and use that power to gain control of another board (_*See the Smoking Gun -  WYN states in this document that they successfully took control of the KBV IOA Board - - and that they would use it to gain control of the KBV AOAO board - which they did.  That is unethical behavior - and not what you would expect to see in your resort management company - A management company should be a partner in a resort's success - - not garner control of the resort, and use it to their benefit.*)._  An adversarial relationship with WYN right now just means that we have a conflicting view and oppose their current position.  I don't see any other type of relationship that would work to get control back to independent owners.   When we do gain owner control, what we do will benefit WYN, just like it benefits all other owners. Therefore, I don't see a long term issue here - it's temporarily needed.

Regarding SaveOVI - their situation was not the same as KBV.  Just because they have had a significant increase in dues does not imply that KBV will.  If a resort does not ensure that sufficient reserves are being put aside for unavoidable updates and repairs, maintenance fees will increase.  That's just how it works.  When I was Treasurer, we were always watching our reserve funds and comparing them to our future plans for updates/repairs.  We worked to avoid special assessments (I can't afford that - most people can't) and ensure that sufficient $ would be there for future resort updates/repairs.  I am saying there is a plan for the future at KBV - and it is was being watched carefully.  If KBV decided to go beyond the plan, and update more quickly, it could impact maintenance fees or cause the need for a special assessment.   I can't speak to where we stand with reserves at KBV now, but I would be surprised if it were any different.


----------



## DeniseM

> I fail to understand how an adversarial position towards Wyndham bodes well for the long-term success of KBV.



It seems to me that this adversarial situation was _created by Wyndham_.  Based on their "take over" memo and other actions, if owners and independent board members just play nice with Wyndham, we are going to get steam rolled by the corporate machine.

Eric - I understand that Wyndham points owners may have reasons for wanting Wyndham back, but the majority of owners are not points owners, and their best interest was not being served when Wyndham was the management company.


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## ecwinch

Denise - my posts are not from a Wyndham points owners that wants Wyndham to get the management contract back. 

It is simply that the $1.5 million in dues that Wyndham pays KBV is a sizable portion of the budget. And I have yet to hear anyone outline how this ends well.


----------



## ecwinch

KYHOME said:


> _*See the Smoking Gun -  WYN states in this document that they successfully took control of the KBV IOA Board - - and that they would use it to gain control of the KBV AOAO board - which they did.  That is unethical behavior - and not what you would expect to see in your resort management company - A management company should be a partner in a resort's success - - not garner control of the resort, and use it to their benefit.*)._  An adversarial relationship with WYN right now just means that we have a conflicting view and oppose their current position.



As always, I appreciate your insights.

While I would agree with your assessment as it applies to a management company, what your analysis omits is that Wyndham is also the single largest owner at KBV. So unlike a simple mgt company, they have considerable skin in the game.

And we can disagree on the ethics. There is nothing unethical in the single largest stakeholder asserting their control. KBV has significant problems, they need to be addressed. The resort is not up to Wyndham standards and that is frequently commented on by Wyndham members who stay there. And like most legacy resorts the drag of defaulting owners impedes the BoD's ability to address concerns. But I dont see how alienating the single largest stakeholder at the resort addresses any of the systemic issues.


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## sjsharkie

ecwinch said:


> As always, I appreciate your insights.
> 
> While I would agree with your assessment as it applies to a management company, what your analysis omits is that Wyndham is also the single largest owner at KBV. So unlike a simple mgt company, they have considerable skin in the game.
> 
> And we can disagree on the ethics. There is nothing unethical in the single largest stakeholder asserting their control. KBV has significant problems, they need to be addressed. The resort is not up to Wyndham standards and that is frequently commented on by Wyndham members who stay there. And like most legacy resorts the drag of defaulting owners impedes the BoD's ability to address concerns. But I dont see how alienating the single largest stakeholder at the resort addresses any of the systemic issues.



You are right that there is nothing unethical about Wyndham asserting control, but as an owner, I have an issue with it.  If this were a for profit corporation, any board member or executive would be expected to recuse themselves from voting on specific vendors (i.e. management company in this instance) where they have a material relationship (i.e. employee of said management company in this instance.  While they may be independent in fact, they can never be independent in appearance, and this is problematic IMHO for owners as a whole.

So as an owner at KBV, I will always vote against board members that have a material relationship with Wyndham, Grand Pacific or any other timeshare management company.  I'm not sure how the actions of Jeff, Karen, Jack or anyone else are alienating Wyndham and I am supportive of their efforts to get the owners to vote their proxies to have fair representation on the board.

-ryan


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## Jeff From Salem

ecwinch said:


> As always, I appreciate your insights.
> 
> While I would agree with your assessment as it applies to a management company, what your analysis omits is that Wyndham is also the single largest owner at KBV. So unlike a simple mgt company, they have considerable skin in the game.
> 
> And we can disagree on the ethics. There is nothing unethical in the single largest stakeholder asserting their control. KBV has significant problems, they need to be addressed. The resort is not up to Wyndham standards and that is frequently commented on by Wyndham members who stay there. And like most legacy resorts the drag of defaulting owners impedes the BoD's ability to address concerns. But I dont see how alienating the single largest stakeholder at the resort addresses any of the systemic issues.



Eric, you have _still _yet to make a single comment regarding the Wyndham's Smoking Gun memo. Not ONE. You only seem to be defending the status quo. What are we supposed to think??

As Denise has stated, it is Wyndham who has created this, from poor previous management, to their bullying attempts at taking over the boards. It's like someone hitting you in the face, then the moment you hit back, they accuse you of being violent with them. 

And it's not a matter of guessing - there is evidence regarding the latter. They have more of an interest of their own self-interests rather than what is best for all. Karen has outlined many examples of this. I haven't seen one post from you acknowledging these. You have defended Larry and Lou who have been very vocal in defending Wyndham. You completely ignore any evidence presented (and then often come back with accusations that we haven't presented any evidence.). I don't know you personally, but what conclusion are we supposed to arrive at with regard to your loyalty?

Wyndham's presence, to me, is insidious. If you had been at the annual meeting yourself, if you had any sense of fairness, you might have been very disturbed at how Linda and the person she hired to run it handled the meeting. There sure were a good number of owners there who felt that way.

Jeff


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## ecwinch

sjsharkie said:


> You are right that there is nothing unethical about Wyndham asserting control, but as an owner, I have an issue with it.  If this were a for profit corporation, any board member or executive would be expected to recuse themselves from voting on specific vendors (i.e. management company in this instance) where they have a material relationship (i.e. employee of said management company in this instance.
> -ryan



Ryan - As I understand it the Wyndham affiliated BoD members were not able to vote on the mgt contract in 2016 - they were forced to abstain under the provisions of Article XI - Section II of the Declaration. Perhaps Karen can offer some insight into the particulars. 

_Section 2. Conflicts of Interest. The Developer, as the Owner of all unsold Intervals, will have the ability to vote for the Board members who in turn vote for and appoint the officers of the Interval Association. Such Board members and officers may be officers, employees, or agents of the Developer (Developer's employee). In the event a matter comes before the Board or the officers of the Interval Association where a vote or decision needs to be made, the Developer's Employees shall have the right to vote on such matters even if a conflict of interest exist between the Developer, Developer Employees, and the matter being voted upon; provided that the conflict is first disclosed by the Developers Employee and provided further that if the votes are counted, the decision is fair and reasonable to the Interval Association. Any such conflict shall be noted in the minutes of the meeting or the corporate records of the Interval Association._

This provision of course is predicated on that fact that Wyndham assumed the rights of the Developer from Pahio.


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## sjsharkie

It would be good to obtain that info.

The Conflict of Interest clause you copied doesn't seem to preclude them from voting on management contracts or any matter.  It only says that the decision must be fair -- appears like you could drive a truck through that loophole.

Thanks for posting the reference.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


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## ecwinch

That is why I asked if Karen could share any insight on how the voting went regarding the mgt contract.


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## KYHOME

Happy 4th of July!  Hope it is cooler where you are!  It is currently 95 degrees here, with a heat index of 104!  

I am responding to questions about the KBV Board of Directors (BOD) meeting that was held on 2/23/16 to discuss the Management Contract at KBV.  I cannot reveal details about that meeting because it was held in Executive Session, which means it is not shared.  I can tell you that Dani Ramos, as a Wyndham employee, should have recused herself from the vote - - but I cannot tell you whether she did or did not during an Executive Session.

Regarding my use of the term "unethical," I choose that word because I see WYN's actions have been "Underhanded", "Under the Table," "Questionable," "Shady," and "don't conform to an acceptable standard of business operations."  These terms are all used to define the term "unethical."  I believe these words are appropriate descriptions of what WYN did - please see the "Smoking Gun document  if you are not aware of this document, dated 9/6/2016, you should be.  In this internal WYN document, it is explained that WYN had already successfully taken control of the IOA board, and they're intent is to use it to gain control of the AOAO board as well.  (By the way - they were successful in gaining control of the AOAO Board.)  Here is the text from this WYN internal document:  

_"...our only way to influence the KBV IOA bulk vote is to control the IOA board.  (Please refer to the KBV IOA 2016 Annual Meeting Strategic plan).  Thus successful execution of the IOA plan created an IOA board of:_

_Linda Kolstad - President
Troy Spalding - Vice President
Dani Ramos - Treasurer
Karen Blackford - Secretary
Trish Harrington - Officer_

*With majority control, Dani, Linda and Troy can now determine how to cast IOA votes in the AOAO election.  
*
_…In the May5 KBV Annual Meeting, WVO successful took control of the IOA board.  As the singular large bulk owner with KBV AOAO, the IOA vote will sway the outcome of the AOAO annual election, which will be held on Thursday, October 20 at 9am."_​
If you want to see the whole "Smoking Gun" document, go to www.savekbv.org. , click on Wyndham's Smoking Gun.  Then click on the green link at the bottom of the page.


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## KYHOME

Sorry, this post was in error.


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## Jeff From Salem

KYHOME said:


> Sorry, this post was in error.



But, yay! No harm in reminding the folks here, Karen!

I'll be commenting about something that's a-brewing. Good news as well as questionable news.

I have a question, though.* Is there anyone in this group who is a lawyer AND is familiar with the real estate laws of Hawaii?* If so, could you contact me through a private message? This has to do with KBV business that affects everyone. I have an important question, but I don't want to take it public if it doesn't have relevance. Thanks!

Jeff


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## foscomoss

it appears that i was given bad information and for printing it, i am sorry. but there are a few things on my mind. one, the board should consist of professional people, not professional board members. 12 years is a long time to be on a board. i am sure there are many qualifies people who could bring a new perspective into matters. hopefully, jack is one of those. next the owner's list. when this all started, mr belin, sent out his blast supporting ms harrington and blasting wyndham. on the bottom of the blast was ms harrington's contact info. mr belin stated he used an old wyndham list. where did he get it is my question. lastly, a campaign shouls be built on positives, not fear and hatred. ms kolstad was called many nasty, mean and vile things at the may meeting by those who opposed her and wyndham. totally childish and unprofessional. i hope we all want what is best for kbv so lets stop the fear mongering, hate mongering and work to make this the best resort possible


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## Jeff From Salem

foscomoss said:


> it appears that i was given bad information and for printing it, i am sorry. but there are a few things on my mind. one, the board should consist of professional people, not professional board members. 12 years is a long time to be on a board. i am sure there are many qualifies people who could bring a new perspective into matters. hopefully, jack is one of those. next the owner's list. when this all started, mr belin, sent out his blast supporting ms harrington and blasting wyndham. on the bottom of the blast was ms harrington's contact info. mr belin stated he used an old wyndham list. where did he get it is my question. lastly, a campaign shouls be built on positives, not fear and hatred. ms kolstad was called many nasty, mean and vile things at the may meeting by those who opposed her and wyndham. totally childish and unprofessional. i hope we all want what is best for kbv so lets stop the fear mongering, hate mongering and work to make this the best resort possible





Hi. I'm not sure of who you are. But you're bringing up old talking points. And they just obfuscate the issues that are at hand. All points that have been brought up by me and Karen and others have been substantiated. So please go back and read the Wyndham's Smoking Gun and the like so you can educate yourself as to what is going on at the resort and with the IOA.

Secondly, whether it be old blood or new blood, it's what they stand for that counts. Trish Harrington may or may not be a perfect board member, but she's the only one who has spoken out about Wyndham. I'd like to see her speaking out even more strongly than she does. But new blood for new blood's sake? [Political comments deleted.] Right now, we have Trish on the side of the individual owner. For me, the jury is out with Jack. I'll have to see his how he votes on issues.

And the board needs to be filled with professional people? I'm not sure what that means. All or most on the board are professionals outside of the board. They each have their own strengths. And you certainly want visionaries on the board, not just bean counters.

I know that Linda has decided NOT to post the complete minutes of meetings, meaning we only see the actual votes. We don't see what was discussed, what was dismissed, we don't get to read/see any of the nuance that goes on during the board meetings. Grand Pacific keeps detailed minutes of the meetings. Having worked on a board in my home city (and my wife works on another board), we get the entire meeting's minutes posted. You get to read public comment, comments by the individual board members, and anyone else who contributes. You get to see disagreements, and who proposes and supports different issues. Linda has chosen to have us only see the votes, with all the other things stripped away. That other stuff is important. I know. I have been there. I have talked to those who have been at the IOA meetings. We're only getting to see what Linda, essentially, wants us to see.

I will continue to speak out for issues that I think are important to most, if not all of KBV owners. And areas that I feel that are in crisis, I will shout about. There are certain aspects of our ownership that are in critical condition, and if we don't act big time and fast, we'll lose. Again, the Wyndham Smoking Gun, which showed concrete evidence of Wyndham trying to take control of the board in order maintain their management contracts, is an example of underhandedness that is solely in their own (Wyndham's) interest, NOT necessarily in the interest of KBV. Some here may have liked the job that Wyndham was doing. But that's different than their secret, non-democratic plan to wrest control of the board for their own corporate interests. Linda and Dani have stated publicly that their sole interest is preserving Wyndham's interests. Neither owns a deed or has any personal stake in Kauai Beach Villas. So to have someone whose purpose is to soley serve Wyndham's interest be the IOA board's President, and to be able to control the board agenda, seems counterproductive.

And the majority of the IOA board informs what gets done on the AOAO board. Members of the IOA board, along with other representatives, votes for who gets on the AOAO.

I'm strongly considering a run for the IOA board next year. In my opinion, we need to rigorously keep our power as individual owners to affect change at the resort, while looking ahead as to how to have it be the best experience for everyone who stays there.

Aloha,

Jeff Bellin


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## jacknsara

Jeff From Salem said:


> . . .
> I know that Linda has decided NOT to post the complete minutes of meetings, meaning we only see the actual votes. We don't see what was discussed, what was dismissed, we don't get to read/see any of the nuance that goes on during the board meetings.  . . .


Aloha,

Approved minutes of several KBV board meetings were posted today, 8/30/18.  These are accessible by owners at http://kauaibeachvillasresort.com/ under owners community / board of directors

The special meeting of August 3, 2018 addressed the KBV IOA’s commitment to assure funding for use of the hotel pool beginning Jan 1, 2019.  Per 3.12 of our bylaws, our meetings are conducted in accordance with Roberts Rules of Order.  As a result of Roberts Rules, the minutes do not contain any discussion or explanation of why this approach was appropriate.  As a new director considering the options and facts, I concluded that this deal was better than no deal.  The motion passed unanimously.

Jack Goodstein


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## jacknsara

Aloha,
KBV owners whose emails are on file with Grand Pacific should expect to receive an email Friday 9/7/18 inviting them to participate in a very short survey. 
The board of directors are hoping for a substantial response rate.  The purpose of this message is to alert owners to look for it, open it and respond to it even if it winds up in a spam folder.
The email and survey are self-explanatory.  Owners seeking to understand more about it might want to refer to the new business item b of the 7/9/18 minutes (accessible by owners at http://kauaibeachvillasresort.com/ under owners community / board of directors / meeting minutes 2018) and the second half of the first pdf in the list at https://sites.google.com/site/jackgoodstein/kauai-beach-villas  (or attached to TUG post https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index...las-board-election.240675/page-5#post-2124393 )
Other than pointing to the already released information, I cannot comment further at this time.
Jack Goodstein


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## ecwinch

jacknsara said:


> Aloha,
> KBV owners whose emails are on file with Grand Pacific should expect to receive an email Friday 9/7/18 inviting them to participate in a very short survey.
> The board of directors are hoping for a substantial response rate.  The purpose of this message is to alert owners to look for it, open it and respond to it even if it winds up in a spam folder.
> The email and survey are self-explanatory.  Owners seeking to understand more about it might want to refer to the new business item b of the 7/9/18 minutes (accessible by owners at http://kauaibeachvillasresort.com/ under owners community / board of directors / meeting minutes 2018) and the second half of the first pdf in the list at https://sites.google.com/site/jackgoodstein/kauai-beach-villas  (or attached to TUG post https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index...las-board-election.240675/page-5#post-2124393 )
> Other than pointing to the already released information, I cannot comment further at this time.
> Jack Goodstein



So the net is that we gain access to the pool at the Resort, but at a cost of approx $60ish per unit week/interval. 

Of which $125,000 (or $23 per week) is the timeshare owners subsidizing the fully owned condo owners - allowing them to use the resort pool for free.

I understand you might not be able to comment, but what I dont understand is the following comment from the BoD minutes: 

_The Board discussed the proposal for the IOA to subsidize the program in the amount of $125K, to prevent a significant increase to the 2019 AOAO maintenance fees, given that the *AOAO is unable to generate revenue.*_

Perhaps one of the long-time owners can comment on that aspect. 

Thanks


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## jacknsara

Aloha Eric,
I guess I do not understand how you calculated $60ish.  Perhaps you are including a number twice that is only included once.  But yes, there is a cost for access.
Once both AOAO and IOA budgets are released (perhaps November), I should be able to provide more detail than I feel comfortable doing now.
Jack


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## ecwinch

Jack,

"$60ish" is my SWAG on how much each timeshare unit/interval is paying for pool access. As I understand it, KBV is approx 2/3rd's timeshare and 1/3rd fully owned condos. So an approximation is that each interval is paying $40ish for access and $23.34 to subsidize the condo owners. Also, comparing the 2018 annual budget (5,787,195) to the expense (275,000) - means the expenses will increase by about 5%. Which aligns with the $60ish SWAG based on my 2018 dues.


From the minutes:

_ commencing January 1, 2019, in the amount of *$23.34 per interval* to subsidize the Pool Licensing Agreement between KBV AOAO and Kauai Beach Resort Association of Apartment Owners (KBR AOAO),_


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## jacknsara

ecwinch said:


> Jack,
> 
> "$60ish" is my SWAG on how much each timeshare unit/interval is paying for pool access. As I understand it, KBV is approx 2/3rd's timeshare and 1/3rd fully owned condos. So an approximation is that each interval is paying $40ish for access and $23.34 to subsidize the condo owners. Also, comparing the 2018 annual budget (5,787,195) to the expense (275,000) - means the expenses will increase by about 5%. Which aligns with the $60ish SWAG based on my 2018 dues.
> From the minutes:
> _commencing January 1, 2019, in the amount of *$23.34 per interval* to subsidize the Pool Licensing Agreement between KBV AOAO and Kauai Beach Resort Association of Apartment Owners (KBR AOAO),_


Aloha Eric,
Again - I feel the need to wait until both AOAO and IOA budgets are shared with owners before commenting in detail.
Just looking at what you wrote, I notice that in at least one case you appear to be using an AOAO number for an IOA number without proportioning and/or double counting.
You are correct in asserting there is a cost.  I am just suggesting that your estimate of that cost is too high.
Jack


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## ecwinch

jacknsara said:


> Aloha Eric,
> Again - I feel the need to wait until both AOAO and IOA budgets are shared with owners before commenting in detail.
> Just looking at what you wrote, *I notice that in at least one case you appear to be using an AOAO number for an IOA number without proportioning and/or double counting.*
> You are correct in asserting there is a cost.  I am just suggesting that your estimate of that cost is too high.
> Jack



What AOAO number are you referring to?


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## jacknsara

ecwinch said:


> What AOAO number are you referring to?


Eric,
There is not much I can say at this time other than pointing to released information such as what is in the KBV Owners Community.  This will be my last attempt for now.  Perhaps if you re-read the first sentence of section II of the August 3 minutes and my previous posts,  you will be able to answer your own question.
Just for clarity:
AOAO is the association of apartment owners - the entity that represents all 150 apartments in the complex.  IOA is Interval Owners Association.
Jack


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## ecwinch

OK - the published BoD minutes show that the BoD voted to subsidize the pool agreement "_in the amount of _*$23.34 per interval" *and that IOA will* "subsidize the program in the amount of $125K".*

There are 150 units in the AOAO, and 105 units in the IOA. The IOA has 51 intervals per unit, so 5350 interval weeks.

So the subsidy is $125k divided by 5350 or 23.36 per interval. Close to what the minutes reflect.

So at 150 units in the resort, the cost per unit is $1833.33 per year to use the pool. 

And if only the 105 units in the IOA are funding his fee, then the cost per unit is $2619.04, or $51.40 per interval.  Not exactly my $60ish SWAG, but certainly not a doubling of any amounts.

This would seem to be a fairly straight-forward issue. So while I am glad to hear that we will getting access to the resort pool, I was surprised to hear that the timeshare owners are subsidizing the condo owners. In particular on the basis that the AOAO "cannot increase revenue".

It seems more a decision based it being easier to pass this on to the IOA because we have more members.

I wonder if the BoD has a legal opinion that this is permitted under the governing documents for the AOAO? Which certainly has a formula for allocating common expenses to the IOA.



_*
*_


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## DeniseM

Eric - Jack has posted his reason twice - I think you should respect that:


> Again - I feel the need to wait until both AOAO and IOA budgets are shared with owners before commenting in detail.


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## ecwinch

DeniseM said:


> Eric - Jack has posted his reason twice - I think you should respect that:



I did respect that - note my comment "I understand you might not be able to comment."

And he chose to engage.


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## magmue

Barring an unforeseen cataclysm, I am a soon-to-be owner of a 1BR at KBV (thank you Denise!) so I can't look at the minutes linked to above, but I will have skin in this game soon. I'm having trouble backtracking your math, Eric.


> ...at 150 units in the resort, the cost per unit is $1833.33 per year to use the pool.


When I start with the $125,000 subsidy and divide it by 150 total units, I keep coming up with $833 per unit.

The other piece that is not clear to me from the information posted in this thread: Is $125,000 the total cost for next door pool access per year, meaning the AOAO units are paying zero? Or is there some contribution from their budget as well?


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## ecwinch

The minutes reflect that the total cost of the pool agreement is $275k per year. So if each unit at the resort was covering that cost, the cost per unit would be 275k / 150 = 1883.33 per unit. 

And while the minutes do not explicitly state that the condo owners are not making a contribution, the $125k subsidy is the approx amount the condo owners would have had to contribute. So it would appear they are not.

Jack apparently is unable to verify that.


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## magmue

Ah, the minutes. Thanks


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## ecwinch

magmue said:


> Ah, the minutes. Thanks



Here are the minutes:

_KBR POOL USE EXPENSE President Kolstad advised the Board that the total cost for KBV IOA and AOAO pool use is approximately $275,000. The Board discussed the proposal for the IOA to subsidize the program in the amount of $125K, to prevent a significant increase to the 2019 AOAO maintenance fees, given that the AOAO is unable to generate revenue. On motion of Vice President Warner, seconded by Director Goodstein, the Board moved that the Kauai Beach Villas Interval Owners Association (KBV IOA) provide an annual payment to Kauai Beach Villas Association of Apartment Owners (KBV AOAO), commencing January 1, 2019, in the amount of $23.34 per interval to subsidize the Pool Licensing Agreement between KBV AOAO and Kauai Beach Resort Association of Apartment Owners (KBR AOAO), for the duration of that agreement. Furthermore, this sum is to be revisited annually by the KBV IOA Board of Directors to ensure that the subsidy amount is sufficient to support the continuation of the pool usage program, should the IOA determine that continuation of the program is in the best interest of our owners. The motion passed 5-0. On motion of Vice President Warner, seconded by Director Goodstein, the Board moved to ask the KBV AOAO to start the agreement effective August 1, 2018 if the KBR AOAO will agree to accept not to exceed $18,000 per month, inclusive of General Excise Tax, for August through December 31, 2018 and the KBV IOA will pay the full fee. The motion passed 4-1, Director Harrington voted against._

The KBV AOAO is the master association for all the apartments at the entire KBV resort (150 units). The KBV IOA is the association for the timeshare owners who collectively own 105 of those 150 apartments. Under the Declaration, the developer sold 51 intervals were sold per unit, so the IOA is comprised of 5350 intervals.

To make just a little more confusing, the resort next door (Kauai Beach Resort) is also a mix of ownership interests governed by the Kauai Beach Resort Association of Apartment Owners (KBR AOAO). The executed agreement is between the Kauai Beach Villas AOAO and the Kauai Beach Resort AOAO.


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## bianchicycle

jacknsara said:


> I just looked at the ballot again.  It is for the IOA (timeshares).  It does not include the 45 whole ownership apartments – they are included in the AOAO.
> 
> 
> 
> Aloha,
> That is a fair question which cannot be definitively answered until after April 27.  If a quorum is achieved, it is unlikely that tugger votes will be a major determinate (though all votes do count) since tuggers are a very small minority of all owners.
> 
> I deliberately crafted my original candidate statement to appeal to owners for whom both of the following apply:  (1) they do not respond to being asked to vote based on negligible useful information (150 word self-promoting statement) other than who is an incumbent and (2) they are interested enough in changing that situation that they are willing to vote this time.  Whether the condensed version will be sufficiently effective remains to be seen.  I had no advance information about the change in management companies.  I wonder if that will motivate more owners - particularly those who converted to Wyndham - to vote.
> 
> I am encouraged by the one phone call I got from an owner I had never previously met.  He so liked my candidate statement that he was willing to assign me his proxy if I were planning to attend the annual meeting (I am not – but of course would in the future if elected).
> 
> The one part of the original statement that I had to cut that I most regret I have already shared here – the one including one of my email addresses.
> 
> I believe it is possible to create an effective (high enrollment) KBV community forum without being on the board provided that there are enough owners who stay at KBV at different times who share that particular goal.  I’d prefer to see it happen as a board sponsored/embraced occurrence.  That is both faster and mo betta than (to quote a former manager of mine) feeding the horse from the wrong end.  I’ve been a leader in succeeding in the latter before; it takes several years:
> 
> http://www.powershow.com/view/23f59...uitos_Perspective_powerpoint_ppt_presentation
> Jack


Jack, my email tom@mediapage.com and I have been here for over 20 years. Count me in on anything that helps this property ( I have been here for the past 3 weeks).


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## bianchicycle

Jeff From Salem said:


> Guys and gals, from my perspective, Karen Blackford and Trish Harrington NEED your votes. It's imPERative that we get them voted back in. Wyndham is trying get them both off the Board, particularly Trish Harrington. Doing so would essentially give Wyndham all the power. And that would be ironic, as well as bad news, as they are no longer our manager of the timeshares. The developers chose to hire Wyndham Management company to run/manage/maintain the resort. It was never _their _property. It has ALWAYS been owned by the individual timeshare owners as well as the few condo owners. There has been 2 Boards that work together. The AOAO and the IOA. The former's responsibility was essentially taking care of the grounds and buildings, as they are common to both groups. The IOA is responsible for the inside of the timeshare rooms, as well as rental and sales.
> 
> When we first found out that Wyndham Management was using the timeshare sales pitch to get individual owners to give them their deed for nothing, plus pay them money, in order to get into Club Wyndham. When I was there in 2005, I went through an "owner's update". Wyndham tried to get me to give up my deed to them (And I have a premium oceanfront building deed) and give them $7000 to get into their vacation club. For one, that's unethical. We hired them to manage the property, not use that as a way to gather deeds for taking over the resort.
> 
> The IOA noticed that the quality of the maintenance under Wyndham was going downhill. At first, they tried to work with Wyndham to improve things. Eventually, though, they found them not being responsive. The IOA started looking into other management companies and chose Grand Pacific Vacation Services. They started later last year and they have been great so far. GPVS had also taken over from Wyndham at the Makai Beach Club after they had found the level of maintenance that Wyndham provided was unsatisfactory. Apparently, since 2013, GPVS has done wonderful things a the MBC and the resort sparkles. Keep in mind, they're supposed to be working for the owners. Clearly GPVS has been very responsive.
> 
> So now that the IOA brought in GPVS, Wyndham has been fighting to wrestle power away from actual individual owners. And through a lack of information to the ownership, few owners have actually been casting votes. Wyndham controls about 1100 deeds, compared to the roughly 5500 deeds overall. Only about 600 owners, to my understanding, have voted in recent past elections, allowing Wyndham to throw actual individual owners off the Board. They're gunning for Trish Harrington this time around.
> 
> We need to make sure that Trish Harrington and Karen Blackford remain on the IOA Board. Wyndham successfully got Trish thrown off the AOAO Board last year. I'm guessing that she'll try again the next time for voting for that board; and with our more aware ownership (I hope), we'll be able to get her and others back on. And congratulations to her, Trish Harrington was voted onto the board at Shearwater last week. She really is a great person to have represent us individual owners.
> 
> There are others who are worthy to be on the boards, and we (including me) will work to get them on. But we don't want water down our vote either. If enough of the individual owners vote, we have way more votes than Wyndham does. But Wyndham is predicated on apathy, hoping that most owners will not vote, so that can use their voting power to further take over the board, allowing them to make decisions that will help Wyndham Corporate, not the actual individual owners at Kauai Beach Villas.
> 
> One final thing, if you're looking to get rid of your deed because you can no longer use the timeshare, please avoid merely giving it away for free to Wyndham. At the very least, first try putting in a classified at RedWeek.com (they deal in higher end sales, rentals, and purchases), or a classified in TimeSharing Today, a 6-times per year periodical (that also has an online edition). In case you're not familiar with TimeSharing Today, it's a non-profit run by and for timeshare owners with many interesting articles written by owners and industry experts. A classified ad starts at $40, I believe. You should be able to get _something _for your KBV deed, and it keeps it out of the hands of Wyndham.
> 
> Thanks for reading.  Aloha!
> 
> Jeff Bellin
> Salem MA (A city with several connections to Hawaii, including the Peabody Essex Museum, owning one of only 3 existing Ku statues, the Hawaiian war god)



While Linda and Trish are good people, I feel it is just as important to vote people on the BODs that are activally willing to contribute their time and efforts to “this” property. I am sure that there are many talented people here that would do well on the BODs.


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## jacknsara

Aloha,
I am hopeful that the next newsletter from the KBV BOD will be released soon.  It was ready shortly before the holidays, but non essential things do slow down at year end.  That next newsletter will announce to all KBV owners (both email and USPS for those without email) that we now have our own forum on TUG:  
https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?forums/kauai-beach-villas-ioa-public-square.61/ 
Many regular Tuggers have already discovered it and read its initial posts.  Once that announcement is officially released, all my responses to KBV matters will be in that forum.
Jack


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## DaveNV

jacknsara said:


> Aloha,
> I am hopeful that the next newsletter from the KBV BOD will be released soon.  It was ready shortly before the holidays, but non essential things do slow down at year end.  That next newsletter will announce to all KBV owners (both email and USPS for those without email) that we now have our own forum on TUG:
> https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?forums/kauai-beach-villas-ioa-public-square.61/
> Many regular Tuggers have already discovered it and read its initial posts.  Once that announcement is officially released, all my responses to KBV matters will be in that forum.
> Jack



That should be a good way for Tuggers who own at KBV to connect with each other, too.  Good idea, Jack!

Dave


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## bianchicycle

Hey Jack. Sorry you didn’t make it here this year. Much better health in the new year. I will be here the last week in Jan of 2020. Look forward to meeting then.

Tom Kravitz


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## bianchicycle

Maybe I can throw out a new subject here regarding the use of the hotel’s pools.

If it is costing us $275,000 per year, why don’t we use that money and rip out our mundane pool and do it all over in a fashion that the owners would love to use. Larger, maybe grass (like a logoon surrounding it) and some type of amenities center. We should be as nice or better than any of the hotels, etc. we could open discussion as to looks, composition, amenities, etc. 

This, like several of the properties projects, should be on a 3-5 year plan. Attached is of several, logoon style, pools at one of the hotels. They feel much more like Hawai’i and would impress renter who might come back or buy here.


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## ecwinch

I see a number of challenges with that approach, but at least the $275k annual spend would be directed to adding long-term value to the resort.

Because as an annual expense I only see short-term value - ie. making it more appealing for renting/exchangers.


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## DaveNV

The KBV pool has been remodeled - twice - within the last ten or so years.  What you see currently is the best they could come up with.

Dave


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