# Sunterra SunOptions question



## skinsfan (May 15, 2007)

I am interested in the Sunterra SunOptions program; I understand that is the only type of Sunterra points that convert on the resale market. My question is, what home resorts offer the SunOptions program? I looked at the SunOptions directory and it seems that there is 98 different resorts that accept SunOption points. So can I buy resale at anyone of those resorts and get into the SunOption program? Can someone please clarify this for me? Thanks in Advance!


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## Bill4728 (May 15, 2007)

I believe there are 2 groups of resorts within the Sunterra system which instead of owning a deed at a single resort, own an UDI ( undivided interest -like stock) of a "TRUST". When you buy into this trust, you have the ability to use only those resorts in the trust and do not have a full "Club Sunterra" membership. 

The trusts (I believe) are several (~19 resorts) in "the CSV-1 trust". And the 2 hawaii locations " the Hawaii Trust".  

Here is a link to an explaintion of what is a UDI  link 

Here is a link to a thread which explains the CSV trust  LINK


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## PeelBoy (May 15, 2007)

After the Sunterra membership for almost 10 years, I still don't understand the system well enough.  Anyway, I will try.

In the old days, we bought from the developer a deeded unit converted to Sunterra SunOptions for use in any of the 98 resorts.  We can sell the deeded unit but the membership cannot be transferred to the new owner.  I don't think Sunterra is selling this type of membership anymore.

Now, there are 2 trusts: Florida and Hawaii.  Florida trust is always available at ebay and can be used in 19 resorts.  This trust is transferale to new owners.

I also have seen deeded unit with SunOptions to be used in one resort only. This is a rare find.

The Florida trust is what you always see.  They are not cheap though, more expensive than Fairfield and Royal Holiday Club, but cheaper than Shell and Worldmark.

I love Sunterra: quality resort, European affilitation (not available to Florida Trust), flexibility, 59 day discount and super trade power with II.


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## skinsfan (May 15, 2007)

I originally thought it was 19 or 20 resorts that are offered in the sunoptions, but if you look at the guide in this link it lists 98 different resorts with point values. Whats up with that?



Bill4728 said:


> I believe there are 2 groups of resorts within the Sunterra system which instead of owning a deed at a single resort, own an UDI ( undivided interest -like stock) of a "TRUST". When you buy into this trust, you have the ability to use only those resorts in the trust and do not have a full "Club Sunterra" membership.
> 
> The trusts (I believe) are several (~19 resorts) in "the CSV-1 trust". And the 2 hawaii locations " the Hawaii Trust".
> 
> ...


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## Bill4728 (May 15, 2007)

We are talking about 2 different things. 

Full members of Club Sunterra can use their Sun Options (points) at any of the approx 100 resorts.

Members of the CSV trust (sometimes call the florida trust) also have SunOptions (points) but these can be used only at the 19 trust resorts. *But*, can use their SunOptions at any of the ~100 resorts if they are a *full club members*. BUT, only people who buy from Sunterra are full club members. * note you can buy resale resorts/trusts, then buy more from Sunterra and get them all put into a full Club membership.

You need to make a choice. 

Do you want to buy resale TRUST SunOptions and stay only at the 19 trust resorts? 
OR 
Do you want to buy at least some SunOptions from Sunterra and be a full Club Sunterra member?


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## Spence (May 15, 2007)

skinsfan said:


> I am interested in the Sunterra SunOptions program; I understand that is the only type of Sunterra points that convert on the resale market. My question is, what home resorts offer the SunOptions program? I looked at the SunOptions directory and it seems that there is 98 different resorts that accept SunOption points. So can I buy resale at anyone of those resorts and get into the SunOption program? Can someone please clarify this for me? Thanks in Advance!


If you're not totally confused or even if you are, click on the Sunterra link below.


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## skinsfan (May 15, 2007)

Thanks so far for all the help! This question will help me LOTS in clarification. Say I buy resale at Bent Creek Golf Village, and the owner had Sunoption points. Can the SunOptions transfer into my name (from the previous owner)? Do I get UDI for points at that resort? And is the points ONLY good for the 19 listed resorts? On a side note WTF DO THEY HAVE TO MAKE THIS SO COMPLICATED! 



Spence said:


> If you're not totally confused or even if you are, click on the Sunterra link below.


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## Spence (May 15, 2007)

*If you're not totally confused or even if you are, click on the Sunterra link below.*



skinsfan said:


> Thanks so far for all the help! This question will help me LOTS in clarification. Say I buy resale at Bent Creek Golf Village, and the owner had Sunoption points. Can the SunOptions transfer into my name (from the previous owner)? Do I get UDI for points at that resort? And is the points ONLY good for the 19 listed resorts? On a side note WTF DO THEY HAVE TO MAKE THIS SO COMPLICATED!


Whatever you buy in resale at Bent Creek Golf Village will be good only at BCGV whether it's a fixed or floating week or a UDI.  I thought BCGV sold floating weeks but I've never bought there.  IF, the previous owner had bought in and/or converted to Club Sunterra, it makes no nevermind to the resale buyer, the resale buyer will only get the underlying deed and not Club Sunterra.  To get Club Sunterra you would have to pay Sunterra most probably in the form of at least 2000 additional SunOptions for about $5000 to convert the BCGV back to Club.  Why does Sunterra do this?  To discourage resale and to make money on every transaction, why not?


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## skinsfan (May 15, 2007)

So it really doesnt matter what resort you buy at then, you will have to upgrade regardless. So the only thing you can buy resale is a UDI in the SunOptions program specifically which only has 19 resorts affiliated with it... correct?



Spence said:


> Whatever you buy in resale at Bent Creek Golf Village will be good only at BCGV whether it's a fixed or floating week or a UDI.  I thought BCGV sold floating weeks but I've never bought there.  IF, the previous owner had bought in and/or converted to Club Sunterra, it makes no nevermind to the resale buyer, the resale buyer will only get the underlying deed and not Club Sunterra.  To get Club Sunterra you would have to pay Sunterra most probably in the form of at least 2000 additional SunOptions for about $5000 to convert the BCGV back to Club.  Why does Sunterra do this?  To discourage resale and to make money on every transaction, why not?


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## Bill4728 (May 15, 2007)

skinsfan said:


> So it really doesnt matter what resort you buy at then, you will have to upgrade regardless. So the only thing you can buy resale is a UDI in the SunOptions program specifically which only has 19 resorts affiliated with it... correct?



Skinfan,

You keep using the term SunOptions like it is something you buy. It isn't. It is simply the name Sunterra calls it points. 

You can buy a deeded TS at a Sunterra resort or buy into the CSV trust.  When you buy CSV, you'll get points (called SunOptions) which are good only at the Trust's 19 resorts. If you buy a deeded resort resale, you just get_ a week _(or points) for use at that one resort. 

If you want the best bang for your buck, then you'd buy a unit and week at a resort which, if converted to the Club, will give you the most points. THEN, you'll have to buy from Sunterra something more ( a deeded week a UDI somewhere or some other sunterra product) and have Sunterra convert your resale week to a Club week.


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## Spence (May 15, 2007)

skinsfan said:


> So it really doesnt matter what resort you buy at then, you will have to upgrade regardless. So the only thing you can buy resale is a UDI in the SunOptions program specifically which only has 19 resorts affiliated with it... correct?


You don't have to upgrade unless you want those extra benefits.  As with other systems, it does matter where you buy if you're interested in priority reservations ahead of the rest of the crowd for a certain resort or for one of the two Trusts.  You can buy most any of the Sunterra resorts resale you just don't get Club Sunterra unless you pay up.  Your statement above is false, in buying into one of the Trusts you are not buying an UnDivided Interest, you are buying a membership in the Trust that has title to the deeded real estate.


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## Spence (May 15, 2007)

Bill4728 said:


> If you buy a deeded resort resale, you just get points for use at that one resort...


This is only true if you buy a deeded UDI at a certain resort.  Most things you see resale are deeded weeks (some fixed, some floating) but there are sometimes UDIs to be found at resorts like Greensprings, Cypress Point Ph2, Grand Beach, Villas de Santa Fe, Village at Steamboat, Scottsdale Villa Mirage, Ridge on Sedona, or  Sedona Summit, probably others but these are the main ones.  A UDI the way Sunterra structures it is a percentage interest in a group of units at a resort where the fractional interest coincides with the number of SunOptions it was designed to represent.


Bill4728 said:


> ...you'll have to buy from Sunterra something more ( a deeded week, a UDI somewhere, ect) and have Sunterra convert your resale week to a Club week.


Sunterra's 'products' that are currently on developer sales are the Florida/CSV Trust and the Hawaii Trust.  So you won't find a deeded week, a UDI somewhere from the developer as the add-on to bring resales into the Club, it will be some of the Trust product.


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## skinsfan (May 15, 2007)

Thanks for the clarification! I appreciate the help! 



Spence said:


> You don't have to upgrade unless you want those extra benefits.  As with other systems, it does matter where you buy if you're interested in priority reservations ahead of the rest of the crowd for a certain resort or for one of the two Trusts.  You can buy most any of the Sunterra resorts resale you just don't get Club Sunterra unless you pay up.  Your statement above is false, in buying into one of the Trusts you are not buying an UnDivided Interest, you are buying a membership in the Trust that has title to the deeded real estate.


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## Bill4728 (May 15, 2007)

Spence said:
			
		

> Sunterra's 'products' that are currently on developer sales are the Florida/CSV Trust



Why is it called the florida trust when only 3 of the 19 resorts are in Florida?


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## Spence (May 15, 2007)

Bill4728 said:


> Why is it called the florida trust when only 3 of the 19 resorts are in Florida?


I don't know, do you?


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## JudyS (May 15, 2007)

Lots of good information in this thread!  Thanks, Spence & Bill!



Bill4728 said:


> We are talking about 2 different things.
> 
> Full members of Club Sunterra can use their Sun Options (points) at any of the approx 100 resorts.
> 
> Members of the CSV trust (sometimes call the florida trust) also have SunOptions (points) but these can be used only at the 19 trust resorts.....


Sheesh, no wonder people are confused about Sunterra. It's bad enough when you have a system like Starwood that has two different points systems called Star*points *and Star*options*.   But Sunterra offers two entirely different types of points, and then calls them _the same name!_


Will Sunterra convert _any_ Sunterra UDIs/weeks into the Sunterra Club, if additional SunOptions are purchased from the developer?   Will Sunterra convert more than one week at a time for that $5000 fee?

Is the European Sunterra system the same system as the American Sunterra Club, or are they two separate systems that trade inventory back-and-forth?  Sunterra Pacific is a completely different system (and is no longer even called Sunterra), although they trade a little inventory with Sunterra  -- is that correct?


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## Spence (May 15, 2007)

JudyS said:


> Will Sunterra convert _any_ Sunterra UDIs/weeks into the Sunterra Club, if additional SunOptions are purchased from the developer?   Will Sunterra convert more than one week at a time for that $5000 fee?


It's whatever you can bargain for and maybe the end of the month is a better time to bargain?  Lately the reports have been that they try to get you to buy 2000 points per property that's being converted but then relent and bargain down to 3000 for $7K or the like, all depends...



JudyS said:


> Is the European Sunterra system the same system as the American Sunterra Club, or are they two separate systems that trade inventory back-and-forth?  Sunterra Pacific is a completely different system (and is no longer even called Sunterra), although they trade a little inventory with Sunterra  -- is that correct?


I'm not sure of the denominations within the Sunterra Europe system, never paid that much attention, supposedly at the 10month before mark all of Sunterra Europe is available to Club Sunterra members and vice versa.

Sunterra Pacific was and is now again Vacation Internationale. While they were Sunterra Pacific some of the owners opted for Club Sunterra so they pledged their VI inventory to the Club.  How that works out exactly to swap in inventory, I don't know.  I can just say that although Club Sunterra puts all those VI resorts in their book, there is very seldom any availability.  And Club inventory shows up in the 'Exchange Resort Availability' within the VI system for VI owners, not a whole lot there.


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## PeelBoy (May 15, 2007)

Sunterra sounds confusing, but using SunOption is easy.  Log on to the site, find the resort and book without any exchange fee.  Use their 59 days window so you get 50% discount of points.

I like Sunterra because of the resorts in Europe; otherwise, don't bother.

The corporate account trades very well with II, so in the past 3 years, I have not returned to a Sunterra resort anymore.

If you buy resale cheap, you can't go wrong.


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## JudyS (May 16, 2007)

Thanks very much for the information, Spence and PeelBoy!


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## fnewman (May 18, 2007)

PeelBoy said:


> In the old days, we bought from the developer a deeded unit converted to Sunterra SunOptions for use in any of the 98 resorts.  We can sell the deeded unit but the membership cannot be transferred to the new owner.  I don't think Sunterra is selling this type of membership anymore.



Perhaps that is not the primary product being sold today but, as an existing Club Sunterra member, you can still buy deeded weeks from the sales staff at a resort with that SunOption value added to your existing membership for whatever prices and terms you can negotiate (it will be higher than a pure reasle purchase, for sure).  However, if the presentation is at one of the 'trust' resorts, you can be sure that is the proposal you will hear.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (May 18, 2007)

Spence said:


> Sunterra Pacific was and is now again Vacation Internationale. While they were Sunterra Pacific some of the owners opted for Club Sunterra so they pledged their VI inventory to the Club.  How that works out exactly to swap in inventory, I don't know.  I can just say that although Club Sunterra puts all those VI resorts in their book, there is very seldom any availability.  And Club inventory shows up in the 'Exchange Resort Availability' within the VI system for VI owners, not a whole lot there.



I've wondered a bit about how that VI tail works within Club Sunterra. My speculations:

I assume that VI members who joined Club Sunterra did so in the usual way; i.e either by affiliating their weeks with Club Sunterra or by surrendering their VI ownership and receiving a trust ownership.  That means that Sunterra operates with respect to VI the same way that it operates with respect to most of it's other resorts.
As far as VI is concerned, Club Sunterra is just like any other owner.  If they receive a valid reservation request pursuant to an ownership account that they have linked to Club Sunterra, VI makes the reservation just as they would for any other owner.

Sunterra's access to inventory in VI is based on the number of VI points attached to Sunterra's account.  I imagine that VI treats all of Club Sunterra as one big account, i.e., the points for all VI accounts that are part of Club Sunterra are merged.

A VI week is available to Club Sunterra members only after Club Sunterra makes a specific reservation at a VI resort and adds that week to the Club Sunterra pool. (I'm surmising that because I don't see an option on the web page to put in a request for a VI resort - if a VI unit is there a Club Sunterra member can grab the week, but there's no option I see to do a request, nor is there any guidance advising to call in to make a VI resort request).

The piece that seems most unclear to me is how home resort advantage works for a Club Sunterra member for whom VI is the home resort.  It makes the  most sense to me that the Club Sunterra member would need to declare by a certain date how many of their VI points they intended to use as a home resort.  Any points not used by the member then become available to Club Sunterra, and the member receives the number of SunOptions associated with  the VI points they don't use.


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## BillR (May 19, 2007)

*Corrected*



Spence said:


> Sunterra Pacific was and is now again Vacation Internationale. While they were Sunterra Pacific some of the owners opted for Club Sunterra so they pledged their VI inventory to the Club.  How that works out exactly to swap in inventory, I don't know.  I can just say that although Club Sunterra puts all those VI resorts in their book, there is very seldom any availability.  And Club inventory shows up in the 'Exchange Resort Availability' within the VI system for VI owners, not a whole lot there.



*Sunterra Pacific was a name invented by Sunterra for their management company contract for VI.  They did purchase some inventory for VI so they could claim "ownership".  Sunterra purchased (and sold) only 119 interval weeks at The Oasis in Palm Springs.  That is the reason it is difficult to find availability with VRI resorts.  VI TERMINATED Sunterra's management company about 4 years ago.

The Marquis Villas in Palm Springs is another of Sunterrra's "exaggerations". They portrayed their purchase as total ownership.  The truth is they only own 40% of the intervals.

However, that was all in the time of Sunterra President Nick Benson - a corporate low life who was fired during the Europe fiasco.  I now more pleased with Sunterra SunOptions than any other exchange options.  I have Sunterra's inventory, II inventory and Club Select deposits and heavily discounted member rentals.  *

*I had a brain fart!  Correction noted and changed.​*


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## Spence (May 20, 2007)

BillR said:


> *Sunterra Pacific was a name invented by Sunterra for their management company contract for VRI.  They did purchase some inventory for VRI so they could claim "ownership".  Sunterra purchased (and sold) only 119 interval weeks at The Oasis in Palm Springs.  That is the reason it is difficult to find availability with VRI resorts.  VRI TERMINATED Sunterra's management company about 4 years ago.
> 
> The Marquis Villas in Palm Springs is another of Sunterrra's "exaggerations". They portrayed their purchase as total ownership.  The truth is they only own 40% of the intervals.
> 
> However, that was all in the time of Sunterra President Nick Benson - a corporate low life who was fired during the Europe fiasco.  I now more pleased with Sunterra SunOptions than any other exchange options.  I have Sunterra's inventory, II inventory and Club Select deposits and heavily discounted member rentals.  *



VRI has nothing to do with VI.  While VI does indicate in their online catalog, how many unit-weeks are available to the membership; Sunterra posts all the VI resorts as resorts in their catalog giving no clue how little availability their actually is.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (May 20, 2007)

BillR said:


> *Sunterra Pacific was a name invented by Sunterra for their management company contract for VRI.  They did purchase some inventory for VRI so they could claim "ownership".  Sunterra purchased (and sold) only 119 interval weeks at The Oasis in Palm Springs.  That is the reason it is difficult to find availability with VRI resorts.  VRI TERMINATED Sunterra's management company about 4 years ago.
> 
> The Marquis Villas in Palm Springs is another of Sunterrra's "exaggerations". They portrayed their purchase as total ownership.  The truth is they only own 40% of the intervals.
> 
> However, that was all in the time of Sunterra President Nick Benson - a corporate low life who was fired during the Europe fiasco.  I now more pleased with Sunterra SunOptions than any other exchange options.  I have Sunterra's inventory, II inventory and Club Select deposits and heavily discounted member rentals.  *


I think all of the references to *VRI* in this post are incorrect. *VRI* is Vacation Resorts International, which is the management company that Vacation Internationale selected to replace Sunterra.  

The post is correct if you substitute Vacation Internationale (or *VI*, if you prefer) for all references to VRI.


*****

BTW - the last time we were at Po'ipu, Sunterra was selling deeded weeks at the resort as well as Hawai'i trust ownerships.


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## Spence (May 20, 2007)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> - the last time we were at Po'ipu, Sunterra was selling deeded weeks at the resort as well as Hawai'i trust ownerships.


How did they present the choice/differences and why do you think thay would offer both?


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## T_R_Oglodyte (May 20, 2007)

Spence said:


> How did they present the choice/differences and why do you think thay would offer both?


The Trust, of course, is what they primarily are interested in selling.  But if a deed is important to the buyer, they are willing to go that direction.

I wonder if they might be a bit quicker to  offer a deed at Ka'anapali.  Annual fees at Ka'anapali or less than at Po'ipu.  If you own the trust, the annual fees you pay are a blend of the fees for Ka'anapali and Po'ipu, pro-rated t the amount of inventory at each resort that is in the Trust.  That means that, for the same number of SunOptions, annual fees will be lowest for a Ka'anapali ownership and highest for a Po'ipu ownership, with the trust somewhere between those two.

So if annual fees are an issue for a buyer at Ka'anapali, the sales person can offer a straight Ka'anapali ownership as a way to reduce fees.  Conversely, at Po'ipu, they include the difference in fees as a reason to buy trust or to convert your existing deeded Po'ipu week to trust.


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