# is anyone in the market for 9 million wyndham points



## siesta (Oct 25, 2010)

9 million points, who wants it

http://cgi.ebay.com/Wyndham-9-MILLI...=Timeshares&hash=item35ad40e3b0#ht_3082wt_905


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## Keep Traveling (Oct 25, 2010)

I almost jumped on it but I need 10 million.  That gets you SUPER DUPER VIP

Heith


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## timeos2 (Oct 25, 2010)

Keep Traveling said:


> I almost jumped on it but I need 10 million.  That gets you SUPER DUPER VIP
> 
> Heith



And TWO FREE USA Today's (if you ask).


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## JimMIA (Oct 25, 2010)

This is not as attractive as they try to make it sound.  1.6 million of the points are EOY -- only a measly 7.4 million annual points, and they're at Smoky Mountain, where I already have points.

Had my hopes up for a second there...ah well...

Odd that they don't mention the MF's...


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## JimMIA (Oct 25, 2010)

And another thing...

If you're going to spend $75,000 for 9 million points -- um, shouldn't they offer *FREE* closing???

I hate being nickel'd and dime'd!


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## rickandcindy23 (Oct 25, 2010)

$75K is nuts, and no VIP with that purchase.  :rofl:


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## MichaelColey (Oct 25, 2010)

Or: Make Offer.


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## DrBopp (Oct 26, 2010)

*MF*



JimMIA said:


> Odd that they don't mention the MF's...



I was thinking the same the same thing...... I would really have to know that before I made a serious offer...... Anyone want to go Dutch????


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## Rent_Share (Oct 26, 2010)

> *Closing costs are only $499 (Included in purchase price)*, which include Escrow, Ownership certificate preparation,and resort notification of transfer of ownership. At the end of the auction you will be responsible for:*Total Monies Due= **Final Bid Price*​


 
Whoo Hooo

Wonder If this was owned by the same guy complaining in here that he could no longer commercially rent his RCI exchanges


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## AwayWeGo (Oct 26, 2010)

*Au Contraire, Mon Frère.*




Keep Traveling said:


> I almost jumped on it but I need 10 million.  That gets you SUPER DUPER VIP


Not resale -- only full freight.  (So it goes.) 

BTW, I am guessing that the full-freight price paid by a retired Nebraska farmer we met for the 1*,*000*,*000 Wyndham points he had just acquired via "equity consolidation" at Wyndham Bonnet Creek would pretty much cover an eBay "best offer" for those 9*,*000*,*000 resale points.  

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## Jya-Ning (Oct 26, 2010)

JimMIA said:


> And another thing...
> 
> If you're going to spend $75,000 for 9 million points -- um, shouldn't they offer *FREE* closing???
> 
> I hate being nickel'd and dime'd!



Closing cost is included in the purchase price (which also including resort transfer fee).  Maybe they hear you and change it.



timeos2 said:


> And TWO FREE USA Today's (if you ask).



No, I think it is local newspaper now.  Used to be USA today, I guess they cut the cornor to save money (it is a lot if the trust is the only entity that has to pay it).

Jya-Ning


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## Rent_Share (Oct 26, 2010)

Jya-Ning said:


> Closing cost is included in the purchase price (which also including resort transfer fee). Maybe they hear you and change it.


 
Technically there is no resort transfer(s) or new deed recordings since they are selling the "stock" of two C-Corps that hold tittle to all of the deeds and/or points. The actual ownership stays with the corporate entites



> All of the deeds included in this purchase have been transferred into two corp names which will allow the transfer to be completed within 4 weeks from the time of purchase. There are no additional assets attached and these corp names were set up for the sole purpose of holding ownership of these Wyndham points*.*


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## jjmanthei05 (Oct 26, 2010)

Rent_Share said:


> Technically there is no resort transfer(s) or new deed recordings since they are selling the "stock" of two C-Corps that hold tittle to all of the deeds and/or points. The actual ownership stays with the corporate entites



Would that actually mean that the VIP points would transfer since the "ownership" of the deeds wouldn't change? I mean that could add another $1500 or so in value a year!!!!! At least your payback will be under 50 years!   

Jason


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## am1 (Oct 26, 2010)

VIP would not transfer. If it did the payback period would be a lot less than 50 years.  Because of the need for multiple member numbers and high annual fees/point it is not worth anywhere close to $75 000.


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## timeos2 (Oct 26, 2010)

*Looks like VIP would carry over*



am1 said:


> VIP would not transfer. If it did the payback period would be a lot less than 50 years.  Because of the need for multiple member numbers and high annual fees/point it is not worth anywhere close to $75 000.



Actually if they did it as they say - placed the ownership with a trust and all that now gets transferred is control of that trust - then VIP will apply as the "owner" (the Trust) does NOT change. 

Still unlikely to sell or to represent a good value but they did what they could to protect the VIP status even for a "resale"buyer.


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## am1 (Oct 26, 2010)

timeos2 said:


> Actually if they did it as they say - placed the ownership with a trust and all that now gets transferred is control of that trust - then VIP will apply as the "owner" (the Trust) does NOT change.
> 
> Still unlikely to sell or to represent a good value but they did what they could to protect the VIP status even for a "resale"buyer.



As I said that would not be the case.  Is there any mention of VIP status in the ad?  That would be the first clue.  

Did the seller (PCC) have the owners who were getting rid of their 28k-154k point contracts transfer their deeds to the same LLC which they were part owners of at the time so the VIP status would remain in tact?

Or is this just a collection of deeds that would not sell for a $1 and a good way for the (PCC) to get the deeds out of the owners hand without finding a buyer yet.


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## rickandcindy23 (Oct 26, 2010)

am1 said:


> As I said that would not be the case.  Is there any mention of VIP status in the ad?  That would be the first clue.
> 
> Did the seller (PCC) have the owners who were getting rid of their 28k-154k point contracts transfer their deeds to the same LLC which they were part owners of at the time so the VIP status would remain in tact?
> 
> Or is this just a collection of deeds that would not sell for a $1 and a good way for the (PCC) to get the deeds out of the owners hand without finding a buyer yet.



I believe you are correct.  Besides, even if "some owner" in that 9 million points had a VIP Gold membership, Wyndham gives, and Wyndham taketh away, so I doubt it would carry over.  

Wyndham hates resale buyers, no matter how you go about it, so to assume that VIP transfers in this sale could be disastrous for the buyer.  Overpaying for something VIN cannot even give away, simply because it is packaged into one listing (probably with dozens of contracts within), is not something a TUG buyer would appreciate.  I can just imagine how many accounts it would take, since Wyndham only allows 13 or 14 contracts in each account.


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## scrapngen (Oct 26, 2010)

I'm trying to wrap my head around HOW you'd manage this?? Can you imagine trying to reserve your weeks each year/ let alone trade? I can't imagine one person managing it - especially if they were trying to maximise the value?? 

(Of course, not being a Wyndham owner - the learning curve even for a smaller number of points would be a bit of a challenge for me to maximise. :rofl: )


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## jjmanthei05 (Oct 26, 2010)

I think if you have 9 million points you aren't looking how to stretch your points to their max. For example I believe the most expensive room is a prime week at Sugar Bay which is 700,000 points. If you wanted to stay there you would get almost 13 weeks with that many points. A 4 bed presidential at Bonnet Creek would get you almost 5 months (21+ weeks) or be about 200,000 points short of staying the entire year in a 2 bed deluxe at BC (9,254,000 pts). Any way you look at it, it is a ridiculous amount of points. 

Jason


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## Rent_Share (Oct 26, 2010)

*Rough Estimate*



JimMIA said:


> This is not as attractive as they try to make it sound. 1.6 million of the points are EOY -- only a measly 7.4 million annual points, and they're at Smoky Mountain, where I already have points.
> 
> Had my hopes up for a second there...ah well...
> 
> Odd that they don't mention the MF's...


 

Most 2 Bedrooms are around 150-180K Points with Maintenance fees between 600 and 900 roughly Let's use 165 K and $750

1.6 Million / 165 Thousand = 10 weeks @ 750/2 [EOY] +/- $ 3,750/year

7.4 Million / 165 Thousand = 45 weeks @ 750 +/- $33,750/year


YMMV


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## rickandcindy23 (Oct 26, 2010)

If the maintenance fees to this ownership are an average of $5.50 per 1,000, for a person to get a week, 2 bed, at Bonnet Creek in summer would be 224K points X $5.50.  That isn't cheap at $1,232.


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## timeos2 (Oct 26, 2010)

rickandcindy23 said:


> I believe you are correct.  Besides, even if "some owner" in that 9 million points had a VIP Gold membership, Wyndham gives, and Wyndham taketh away, so I doubt it would carry over.
> 
> Wyndham hates resale buyers, no matter how you go about it, so to assume that VIP transfers in this sale could be disastrous for the buyer.  Overpaying for something VIN cannot even give away, simply because it is packaged into one listing (probably with dozens of contracts within), is not something a TUG buyer would appreciate.  I can just imagine how many accounts it would take, since Wyndham only allows 13 or 14 contracts in each account.



Again I am saying "IF" (and that is a big question mark - especially based on the eBay ad alone) they did the proper creation of a trust solely for the purpose of being the legal owner of these points, and that Trust/Owner was given VIP (which would mean they did this as a plan from the start - again it seems unlikely but is possible) then the simple fact that the Trustee changes in no way alters the ownership of the points and everything should remain as is.  In fact that is one method recommended to have "transferable" VIP privileges by those who try to maximize these things. 

I'm not saying the current offer is set that way but since it does mention a quick transfer due to a trust so if they set up a trust it was silly not to do it all (unless they never had VIP).

Too many points for me to worry too much about anyway.


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## rickandcindy23 (Oct 26, 2010)

> Too many points for me to worry too much about anyway.
> __________________



Me too!  

And there are too many "ifs" involved.  I get your point, and I agree 100% that _perhaps _this ownership will come with those golden or platinum VIP benefits, but if they don't come with those benefits, someone might overpay for it, making that assumption.  I wonder if the seller would actually know....


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## Trish839 (Oct 26, 2010)

What's the MF and how long can you stay in a TS on 9 million pts. 
I've met retirees who actually stayed in TS for months.


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## am1 (Oct 26, 2010)

It would be a very big IF as there would be a lot of paper work to get a few dozen owners or more to transfer their deeds into a LLC that they partially "own" and then transfer it to the new purchaser.  That would be about the only way VIP status of any kind would be retained.

Even if there were no VIP accounts as long as they were retail purchases then collectively they would be VIP memberships.  

The maintenance fees are probably over $6/k as there are a lot of converted off season fixed weeks. 

If the VIP status was retained then this ownership would be worth more than the $75 000 asking price.  Or I should say it would sell for more than $75 000.  Everyone can determine for themselves what they think it is worth.  



The highest week is 1 million points for the 4 bedroom Presidential in Hawaii.


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## siesta (Oct 26, 2010)

I guarantee not one of those deeds have VIP attached in the first place, let alone having it transfer.  This is a company that got stuck with a bunch of contracts that are extremely hard to get rid of for even a $1 in this economy, and they do not want to get stuck paying all the MF that will be due in a few months.


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