# Westin kaanapali ocean resort villas/ unit assignment



## sayer7 (Mar 28, 2008)

The resort is good, but there is an annoying problem.  No matter what you do or the ask you to do , you never get your room request because the managers take it on their hand to manipulate the unit assignment. As of writing this post I am now in my week I own in the resort.  I would like to post transcript of my  arguments with the managers ( peaple come here for vacation not to argue with resort employees). with computers and high tech, nowdays this should be easy and transparent so no one will feel jibbed)  here is the trancript: (I hope it will fit) if not see continuation:
Kristy Sandlin

To my dismay: your management sent security and threatened to escort me out of the resort because I wore a hat which says MANAGEMENT SUCKS, instead of coming and talk to me. Again another Moron manager employed employed by you guys is very irresponsible . 

THIS IS MY UNIT (TEADED IN MY NAME) THIS MEAN THE MANAGEMENT IS HARASSING ME IN MY OWN HOME. MAINTAINANCE FEES ARE PAID TO HIRE MANAGERS AND EMPLOYEES (WHO CAN DO THEIR JOB PROPERLY AND HONESTLY )TO MAKE OUR VACATION EXPERIENCE AT ITS BEST. NOT AGGRAVATE AND MAKE OUR VACATION MISERABLE.
----------------------------------------
From: msksjk@msn.com
 To: sonia.steverson@westin.com; msksjk@msn.com; jennifer.bauchner@starwoodvo.com; shown.obrien@starwoodvo.com; sarah.savidge@westin.com
 Subject: RE: 3408/10 Kanakriyeh
 Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 02:49:53 -0700


 I do not appreciate calling security to suppress my protest of the way we were treated, This is my week it is deeded in my name, I have paid my maintainance and management fees so that you can provide an environment for my vacation , another irresponsible moron manager who is clueless. ( did not get her name ). If she did not back off, I would have called the police on her harasement. 



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Subject: RE: 3408/10 Kanakriyeh
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2008 19:00:09 -1000
From: Sonia.Steverson@Westin.com
To: msksjk@msn.com; jennifer.bauchner@starwoodvo.com; shown.obrien@starwoodvo.com; sarah.savidge@Westin.com
CC: tulei.tapii@starwoodvo.com

Aloha Mr. Kanakriyeh, 

I tried calling you in your room. No answer, however I did leave you a
message w/ my cell number to give me a call at your earliest convenience.

Mahalo


sonia steverson front office manager the westin ka'anapali ocean
resort villas
170 kai ala drive lahaina, hawaii 96761 
tel 808.667.3200 fax 808.662.2561 
elevate your senses  westin.com 

-----Original Message-----
From: Mohammad Kanakriyeh [mailto:msksjk@msn.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, March 26, 2008 3:54 PM
To: jennifer.bauchner@starwoodvo.com; shown.obrien@starwoodvo.com;
Steverson, Sonia; Savidge, Sarah
Cc: Tapii, Tulei
Subject: FW: 3408/10 Kanakriyeh

----------------------------------------
From: msksjk@msn.com
To: jennifer.bauchner@starwoodvo.com; shown.obrien@starwoodvo.com
CC: msksjk@msn.com
Subject: FW: 3408/10 Kanakriyeh
Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 15:56:43 -0700


hi , I am sending you this because I think you need to know what is going on here at the resort. hope i have some response from the responsible person(s)
----------------------------------------
From: msksjk@msn.com
To: boardofdirectors@starwoodvo.com
CC: sonia.steverson@westin.com
Subject: FW: 3408/10 Kanakriyeh
Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 12:34:46 -0700

dear boardof directors I am sending you this info because it is
important to know about this particular situation.
----------------------------------------
From: msksjk@msn.com
To: sonia.steverson@westin.com
CC: msksjk@msn.com
Subject: FW: 3408/10 Kanakriyeh
Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 12:17:54 -0700

HI SONIA I AM SENDING YOU THIS BECAUSE I THINK YOU NEED TO KNOW WHAT
IS GOING ON HERE. HOPE I CAN TALK TO YOU.
----------------------------------------
From: msksjk@msn.com
To: sonia.steverson@westin.com
CC: msksjk@msn.com
Subject: RE: 3408/10 Kanakriyeh
Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 12:12:00 -0700


Enrique Fernandez 
E-Communications Specialist 
Owner Services

Your response to my concern is not acceptable. I have spoken to owners services in Florida and spoke to situation. I have a time stamp priority in this reservation, and I have time stamped requests ( I mean I went by the book !!). I am going to make much out of this because this is the fourth time it happened.. every time I was given certain explanation by the resort employees. This time. This time I was assigned a time stamp priority number 8/43 for a request sixth floor unit. ( this was blocked for me as the superviser Bobi in florida found out)

Some MORON manager (Sara Savidge) in the day I was supposed
to check in took it on her hand and unblocked it and gave it to some one else.

In addition I found out that Priority number 7/43 and 9/43 have
been given units in the sixth floor. Many others with much lower
priority were given units in the sixth and fifth floor. (but us we were
a second floor unit). Not only that no one of the managers have the
decency to admit to there mistakes but kept giving us bogus explanation
to why this has happened. 

Not only that, me and my wife had called earlier to avert such
thing from happening, particularly I spoke three days befor arrival to
Manager Carol Ludevig who took action and e. mailed florita about the
situation

This is not a way to spend your vacation arguing with managers who
become defensive and try to cover for each other . This is UNACCEPTABLE
and UNACCEPTABLE and UNACCEPTABLE and UNACCEPTABLE and I would like this
to reach highest levels of amanagement and board of home owners
association who care about this after all we owners pay the management
fees to serve us not to aggrevate au and F*** up ower valuable vacation.

Posted by: Owner
----------------------------------------
From: msksjk@msn.com
To: sonia.steverson@westin.com
CC: msksjk@msn.com
Subject: FW: 3408/10 Kanakriyeh
Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 12:07:42 -0700

Dear Mohammad Sayer Kanakriyeh - 

Thank you for contacting Westin Vacation Ownership. We welcome the
opportunity to assist you. 

We want to thank you for taking the time to send us your feedback.
Feedback from our owners is crucial as it oftentimes pinpoints areas of
needed attention. We want to apologize for the inconvenience that you
encountered as a result of the villa assignment for your reservation.
Please know, when you book your reservation within your Home Preference
Home Period (12-8 months in advance) you are guaranteed the View Type
you purchased. As you do not own a Fixed villa you are able to submit a
special request for a particular unit, floor, etc. These would be
special requests documented on your reservation and unfortunately can
never be guaranteed. The agents that assigned the villas do their best
to accommodate as many requests as possible. It is important to mention
that requests are time stamped and granted in the order in which they
are received. Once again, please accept our apologies for any
inconvenience that this may cause. 

We hope that this information was beneficial to you. Should you
need further assistance, please contact Owner Services at 800.847.8262
in the U.S., Canada and Puerto Rico, 0.800.89.5065 in the United
Kingdom, 001.800.847.8262 from Mexico and 407.903.4640 for all other
areas. Owner Services is available Monday through Friday, 9 a.m. to 9
p.m. and Saturday through Sunday, 9 a.m. to 6 p.m. Eastern time. 
We appreciate your patronage and thank you for contacting Westin
Vacation Ownership. 
Have a wonderful day. 

Sincerely, 
Enrique Fernandez 
        E-Communications Specialist 
        Owner Services
        ----------------------------------------
         From: msksjk@msn.com
         To: sarah.savidge@westin.com
         CC: sonia.steverson@westin.com
         Subject: RE: 3408/10 Kanakriyeh
         Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 11:05:32 -0700


I just sent this to owners services, hope some one responds!!!!!!

WE ARE VERY UNHAPY ABOUT THE ROOM ASSIGNMENT FOR THE LAST FOUR
YEARS. THIS YEAR WE RESERVED -- EXACTLY A YEAR EARLIER
-- WE REQUESTED CERTAIN FLOOR
-- WE CALLED TO VERIFY OUR PRIORITY OF ROOM ASSIGNMENT.

our request was not honored, we have to argue with the managers
upon arrival -- was not a nice scene -- WE FOUND PEAPLE WITH LOWER
PRIORITY NUMBERS -- HAVE BETTER UNIT ASSIGNMENT THAN US-- 
they blamed that on a lady by the name of JENNIFER CLASS... she
is the one who assigned the units' .. WE ARE MAD LIKE HELL. we need to
know why this happens. WE ARE HERE TO HAVE A VACATION NOT TO ARGUE WITH THE EMPLOYEES.
WE ARE NOT GOING TO BE SILENT ABOUT THIS AND WILL REACH HIGHEST
AUTHOROTIES AT STARWOOD. we would appreciate a response and our phone no is cell [XXX-XXX-XXXX].
MR AND MRS KANAKRIYEH

________________________________
Subject: 3408/10 Kanakriyeh
Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 17:34:05 -1000
From: sarah.savidge@westin.com
To: tulei.tapii@starwoodvo.com
CC: msksjk@msn.com

Aloha Tulei,

Mr. and Mrs. Kanakriyeh checked in today and were blocked by
Orlando for 2217/19. They had requested top floor, but didn't receive.
I explained they weren't blocked for a higher floor because the unit
would be further away from the ocean, having an inferior view of the
ocean from other rooms on a lower floor that are closer to the ocean. I
explained that according to the hierarchy of how the rooms are      
assigned we didn't make a mistake. I was able to move them to 3408/10 because they would rather have a higher floor than superior ocean view.



Mr. and Mrs. Kanakriyeh said all they wanted was the sixth floor
not caring if they are close to the ocean or not. I cannot see what
requests or comments were made in DG, if you could please take a look at
their account and check requests that were made.

Mr. and Mrs. Kanakriyeh want to know what they need to do for
next year to ensure that they are on the sixth floor. I explained that
they need to specifically state all they want is high floor even if that
means sacrificing their ocean view.

Tulei please reach out to Mr. Kanakriyeh to discuss these matters or book an appointment at [XXX-XXX-XXXX]

Mr. Kanakriyeh you can reach Tulei at [XXX-XXX-XXXX]

Please call me if I can be of any further assistance.
Mahalo,
sarah savidge assistant front office manager the westin
ka'anapali ocean resort villas
6 kai ala drive lahaina, hawaii 96761
tel 808.667.3245 fax 808.667.3201
elevate your senses  westin.com
         _______________________


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## DeniseM (Mar 28, 2008)

Welcome to TUG!     Since your post isn't related to the thread you posted in, I started a new thread for you.  I'm also going to clean it up a little for you to make it more readable.


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## ciscogizmo1 (Mar 28, 2008)

Wow...  I'm so sorry you didn't get the unit you wanted.  What day did you check-in Friday, Saturday or Sunday?  I truely believe that makes a HUGE difference in what kind of Ocean view you'll receive.   I can see now that you checked in on Sunday.  If you read my problem at check-in in November the worst days to check-in are Friday and Sunday as less inventory is available.  
You can read about my check-in problem back in November:

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58522

Anyways.. let us know how it turns out.  Don't let it ruin your vacation because it is not worth it...  In reading the conversation I believe what I was told back in November is true.  It is confusing to the room assigner if you put in a generic request like high floor facing the pool closest to the ocean.  So, obviously all three weren't available so, they didn't know what was the most important to you.  So, they gave you closest to the ocean.  I know, from my November experience that you really need to be clear in your room request.  Also, remember requesting high floor could mean that you'll get a view overlooking the parking lot?  Is that okay with you.  Good luck...


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## sayer7 (Mar 28, 2008)

*unit assignment*

Missed up all our vacations, it took five days for a top manager to realize there was a problem. They tried to give us a $100 credit in our account for the inconvenience, but I told them I don't need your $100. If you want to compansate me , the fair compensation is to refund my Maintainance fees, since management have failed us inspite of going by the book.

I feel the process should be transparent, same as airlines fill the seats in the computer and they show you what seats are available, and that is how time stamped reservation and prioritization should be done.

I agree with you that employees are human beings and make mistakes, but they should admit if there was a mistake done and should not cover for each other. In addition we are also human beings, but it appears we are just numbers to them.


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## Bill4728 (Mar 28, 2008)

Welcome to TUG!

Sorry, that Starwood screwed up your room assignment but I'm not sure what you're post is trying to do. 

Many people here have had some bad experiances with room assignments, it would be nice if there was a better way but currently this is what we live with.

Good luck to you.


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## sayer7 (Mar 28, 2008)

*room assignment*

I am not sure what it will do, but I think there should be a way to hold the management accountable, after all they are paid by our money.  with all the technology now available the room assignment should be transperant:  For example :  Your reservation confirmation should say:

your reservation was made on -- date --- on -- time
your priority number in room request is  8 out of 43
Unit no  ##### is assigned to you 
Your special request of -------- could or could not be honored because of your time stamped priority situation.

So if that was important for the owner, he will have other options, change the week he was planing to travel to get higher priority ...etc.

this way it will not be in the hands managers who should not give courticy over other owners specially when the resort is full.


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## sayer7 (Mar 28, 2008)

Also I think if every one speaks up,  Timeshare manegments in general may pay attention.


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## ciscogizmo1 (Mar 28, 2008)

sayer7 said:


> I am not sure what it will do, but I think there should be a way to hold the management accountable, after all they are paid by our money.  with all the technology now available the room assignment should be transperant:  For example :  Your reservation confirmation should say:
> 
> your reservation was made on -- date --- on -- time
> your priority number in room request is  8 out of 43
> ...



I'm not sure I agree.  For one my situation was different as I felt I got a view that should have been classified as an island.  My requests have been standard I want to be facing the interior pool.  I don't care if it is on the 6th floor or the 1st floor.  My request has only been honored once.   Now, that I've seen other views in the future I plan to request a view overlooking the park parking lot on the 6th or 5th floor.   

2nd,  we bought a floating week with a floating unit.  If you wanted a fixed unit you should have purchased that.  Starwood does sell them.

I'm not sure your request is practical as you can check-in to a Maui unit Friday, Saturday or Sunday.  WKORV does not have set check-in days for units.  The check-in dates are set by the owners when they make reservations.  At least that is how it was explained to me last November. 

What happens if a unit is out of commission when you show up and you get assigned a new unit.  I know of very few floating week, floating unit systems that assign your unit when you book.


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## dss (Mar 29, 2008)

Welcome to TUG. I can certainly understand how frustrating the room assignment situation can be, but my suggestions would be to do your best to keep your cool. I don't mean to be critical but your emails calling people "morons" and wearing of a "management sucks" hat, etc... is only going to inflame the situation. That may well be your intent, but don't be surprised if instead of offering you a positive remedy, they hold firm to the fact that you purchased an Ocean View unit, nothing more, nothing less, and they are not obliged to give you anything else. I understand they have a priority system in place to assign rooms and it is FAR FROM PERFECT. I have had to personally change rooms the last two times I arrived at the property (and this is with an OF datestamp at 12 months out), but I have firmly and politely asked the front desk person to get me the on-duty manager, asked her to explain where I am on the datestamp, and both times I did my best to remain as polite as possible while clearly expressing the room assigned was unacceptable and wound up getting it switched. 

Sometimes it isn't clear to them what your preference is, as an example last time we asked for "pool view, high floor." We got first floor pool view overlooking the building two side entrances and BBQs. I told them this was unacceptable and asked how we could possibly be on the bottom floor with a 12 month datestamp. The first front desk person gave me a generic answer and I asked to speak to the manager. The manager then informed me that they process pool view before floor as a priority and wound up moving me to a much higher floor on the north side of building two and we were very happy. From now on, I am literally going to call a few days before arrival to confirm the requests, timestamp,  etc.... I agree it shouldn't be this complicated but I have some sympathy for the on-site team as everyone wants a high floor, pool view, etc... 

Bottom line is you are burning through any goodwill and sympathy they might have had for you given your situation. I would strongly suggest you find a senior on-site manager, clear the air in a positive manner, and befriend them so next time you come, they can flag your reservation so this never happens again. Anything less and you're just wasting your time venting.


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## tomandrobin (Mar 29, 2008)

Yikes! What a mess. 

Not being a WKORV owner or having never been to the resort, I don't understand the designated Ocean Front units. Shouldn't there be a set number of units that are set aside for those who paid extra for the view? Regardless of date stamp, an Ocean Front owner should get Ocean Front in one of the desiganted rooms. At the sale of the unit, did they give Ocean Front owners a resort room map indicating the units you are entitled as an Ocean Front owner? Why can't an Ocean Front owner specifically reserve one of the Ocean Front rooms when calling at 12 months?


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## twz (Mar 29, 2008)

I think the problem is with the ocean view units, rather than ocean front.  

We bought ocean front for just this very reason, to avoid issues with where an "ocean view" room assignment might land us.  We've been very happy with our ocean front choice and have always gotten what we paid for.


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## LisaRex (Mar 29, 2008)

I absolutely agree that calling people "morons" does not help your cause.  

However, I think that Starwood's handling of unit assignments is deplorable.  Currently we are given some timestamp that obviously means very little.  Then we are put at the mercy of some nebulous "room assigner" whose idea of what constitutes the best view may or may not coincide with our own.  Why?

We are all owners who've paid very good money for a particular view.  Starwood's insistence of using an archaic and veiled method of assigning rooms is causing unnecessary angst and frustration.  

If we can book concert/football tickets at a 60,000 seat arena using seat assignment software, the technology exists for Starwood to do the same with its owners. They have x number of villas.  X number are available for Friday check-in, Saturday check-in, and Sunday check-in.  When we sign in, we are shown all the rooms that we're allowed to book.  We can select a 2 bdrm villa on the 3rd floor 3nd stack from the ocean, or, if we prefer, we can reserve a studio on the 6th floor 1st stack.  Or, if we want to take the chance, we can wait a week to see if a better room opens up or look at a prior week to determine what our best option is.  

Then we KNOW what we are getting and won't travel to Hawaii with unrealistic expectations. No arguing with the manager, no nasty e-mails to Starwood management. 

At 8 months minus 3 days, inventory could open up for the folks who've reserved rooms within their view to upgrade to a better view, if available. Elite owners would be given a limited time opportunity to upgrade to a better view for free, while other owners would be given an opportunity to upgrade for a fee (e.g. $60/night), with all proceeds going to the HOA capital improvement fund to reduce MFs for all owners.

At 8 months, inventory could open up for all SVN who are trading in.   

Per our owners manual, at 3 months, any remaining inventory could be used by Starwood for StarPoints, Cash + Points, or Cash.  (Currently all proceeds are pocketed by Starwood. I think this is patently unfair.  Proceeds should be split by Starwood and the HOA.) 

The only real issue with this system is that it doesn't allow Starwood to manipulate it at their will.  I strongly suspect that they are manipulating the system in their favor (e.g. not opening up the rooms with the best views in their class to us owners at all).  But because the assignments are done manually, we can't prove it.  Which is why we haven't seen an online booking system.


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## LisaRex (Mar 29, 2008)

twz said:


> I think the problem is with the ocean view units, rather than ocean front.
> 
> We bought ocean front for just this very reason, to avoid issues with where an "ocean view" room assignment might land us.  We've been very happy with our ocean front choice and have always gotten what we paid for.



This works for the WKORV side, but not the north side.  I bought OF on the north side without having a map available (conveniently none were available when they were marketing the property).  If you look at the north map, a lot of "OF" units are what any hotel would consider to be OV.  So we OF owners have the same issue as the OPer. 

I think the real problem is that what I define as a better view is not necessarily what someone else defines as a better view.  If you think about a concert, some people think a 10th row floor seat is better than a 10th row wing seat. I, personally, would choose the wing seat.   However, I can't choose.  I'm at the mercy of the room assigner.  

What is great about TicketMaster is that the software suggest the best seat, but allows us to override it if we'd like. WE decide what's more important to us (height or proximity to the stage) and we leave happy because we were allowed to apply our own preferences. Can you imagine how ticked we'd be if we didn't know what seat the "assigner" had chosen for us until we arrived for the concert? Yet, that's what SVO does to us.  

It's a crappy system that needs to be fixed. 

How does the Hyatt/Marriott assign its rooms?


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## dss (Mar 29, 2008)

Lisa,

I think that is an apt analogy. We should absolutely have to the ability to confirm a specific room when making the reservation with the understanding that it is subject to change in an "emergency" situation, much like airlines reserve the right to change seats when absolutely needed. That should alleviate 95% of all confusion and eliminate the angst that surrounds the check-in process. I also like the ability to allow owners to upgrade right before the inventory opens up to SVN at the 8 month window.

Bottom line is none of this is going to until either we get more of a voice on the HOA or speak loudly and with one voice to SVN management. 

If there is interest, I wonder if we could draft a letter detailing the issues that seem to come up with some frequency with regards to SVN and specifically WKORV and ask anyone who is interested to participate in the content, with it open to all to add their name. There is absolutely power in numbers here, especially if we make sure to get this in front of the right people withing both SVN and the HOA. Off the top of my head the issues that seem to come up most often are:

1 - Updated Reservation System: Needs to ability for true online booking, better room assignment visibility, flexibility when making changes, etc... Better training of the phone bank staff would help as well.

2 - Devaluation of SPG Points: Enough said

3 - Dramatic rise in annual maintenance fees without much in the way of an explanation or roadmap as to what to expect next.

4 - Transparency in the room assignment process, especially during the booking process. I know they won't even give you the room NUMBER until you check in (even if you are on the property) as they don't want you to rush the housekeeping staff and/or put your stuff in there early, but they could easily let you know where you are on the timestamp, etc... just like airlines and standby/upgrade lists. 

5 - Villa Upkeep: It appears some of the units are starting to suffer from missing items, worn appearance, etc... What is the upkeep plan?

6 - Elite Benefit Update: It appears most of us have lost faith in the Elite program, and with the 2k SPG Plat limit approaching (or possibly already hit?), there is little incentive to reach 5*. This program has limited benefits without that and hasn't been touched in years, except to remove certain benefits.


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## thinze3 (Mar 29, 2008)

I believe I would be mad as hell as well if this had already happened to me three years in a row, and then I arrived and it happened again, after making a request a year out. I can only imagine that he figured that he had finally figured out the system and was really looking forward to his "great" room assignment.

My goodness, this is ridiculous. WKORV needs to come up with a better system. IMO


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## ciscogizmo1 (Mar 29, 2008)

Curious if they assign the units as they are booked like you guys seem to be suggesting what happens if you get assigned a unit you don't want?  I think either way there will be problems because once the person finds out what they have been assigned and they don't like it.   They will do the same thing they are doing now and go up the chain of command and demand a new unit assignment.  So, I bet someone else that was assigned a particular unit will be kicked out.

The other thing is that you can check into  WKORV 7 days a week.  So, I bet from time to time the inventory moves round for check-in days at the 8 month window.

I'd rather figure out what is the problem first?  and I'm not sure what the problem is?  You know I go to other boards like Marriott & Hyatt and you never get people complaining about their view as much as we do.  Why is that?    I've stayed at a few Marriotts and I just never seem to get assigned a bad view.  I know, they are out there because I've seen some bad views but I can't figure is why WKORV is different?


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## grgs (Mar 29, 2008)

ciscogizmo1 said:


> I'd rather figure out what is the problem first?  and I'm not sure what the problem is?  You know I go to other boards like Marriott & Hyatt and you never get people complaining about their view as much as we do.  Why is that?    I've stayed at a few Marriotts and I just never seem to get assigned a bad view.  I know, they are out there because I've seen some bad views but I can't figure is why WKORV is different?



One thought is that perhaps WKORV tagged units as OV that Marriott would have classed as IV?  Here's a Marriott Maui Ocean Club pamphlet showing which view categories are assigned to which units:

http://iconnections.smugmug.com/gallery/1508048#150915143-L-LB

Marriott has classed first floor units Garden View (green) that I'm betting Starwood would have sold as OV.  Of course, the building layouts are different, so we can't be positive.

Also, Starwood has created this expectation that the timestamp is everything.  And, yet, an early timestamp doesn't seem to necessarily get you a good view.  I wonder if Starwood will put owners in to lesser OV rooms, and give the better ones to those customers who booked through Starwood, thereby making the timestamp not quite so relevant?

One pro-Starwood comment: at least I've never heard a WKORV owner say they had trouble booking their unit at 12 mos.  Yet, routinely, MOC owners complain they were unable to make their reservation.  Why would this be?

Glorian


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## jerseygirl (Mar 29, 2008)

LisaRex said:


> How does the Hyatt/Marriott assign its rooms?



Hyatt allows you to select a room as part of the online booking system.  There is, however, a disclaimer that says rooms are not guaranteed.  The request feature has worked for me though.

I have no personal experience with Marriott (not an owner), but I've read on these boards that they do not upgrade owners -- you get the view you purchased.  If true, this may mean that exchangers/renters actually have a better chance of getting upgraded rooms.  I had an excellent 6th floor ocean front in Aruba once, as an exchanger, so that was really cool!  I'm pretty sure that Marriott confirmations from II contain a room code (e.g., HZAA or something like that).   You can figure out what you're getting by looking at the codes on the regular reservation website.  I think that means you get the view of the owner who deposited.  I'm sure many will disagree -- but, when you think about it, this may be the fairest way -- exchanging "unit for unit" was the basis for the whole timeshare exchange concept.  

WKORV's reputation for giving exchangers the parking lot view, and the sheer volume of posts by owners regarding bad views probably doesn't help the trading powe/resale value.  For example, I gave a WKORV exchange to an employee for a wedding gift a couple of years ago, and sure enough -- they had the worst view in the place.  Had another former employee/friend getting married and although I found an exchange for the timeframe needed, I was hesitant to do it again.  Who wants to give what could have been a great wedding gift with the disclaimer, "Oh, by the way, your view is likely to be a parking lot."

Just my opinion -- I can certainly understand and somewhat agree with those who bought island view/oceanview who believe they should be upgraded to oceanview/oceanfront.  But, this methodology is sure to leave many people upset/disappointed.  Just suggesting that perhaps Marriott's reported policy of "you get what you paid for and nothing more" results in fewer disappointed owners in the long run.  I think it's the unmet, unrealistic expectations, coupled with what sounds like misleading view cateogories,  that cause all the anger/frustration/disappointment.   I don't spend 2 minutes worrying about my view at Harborside.  Sure, I love it when I'm facing the Royal Towers, the marina or the pool.  But, since the "ocean" isn't the main feture at Harborside, it's really pretty meaningless to me.


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## jerseygirl (Mar 29, 2008)

grgs said:


> One pro-Starwood comment: at least I've never heard a WKORV owner say they had trouble booking their unit at 12 mos.  Yet, routinely, MOC owners complain they were unable to make their reservation.  Why would this be?



Marriott owners who own multiple weeks are allowed to book at 13 months, plus there appear to be strategies associated with booking even further out (e.g., if you own 3 lockoffs, you can start at 13-months and book 6 weeks in a row by splitting your units -- which means your 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th weeks are booked even further than 13 months in advance).  Supposedly, Marriott only allows 50% of the reservations to be booked by these multiple week owners.  But, if a larger percentage of the owners only own one week, they're at a severe disadvantage when attempting to book at the 12-month mark.  I believe that's the primary reason why so many people complain that they can't get reservations at the 12-month mark.  

Marriott also has extra long platinum seasons at some of their resorts -- e.g., Newport Coast.  Most people want the 8-10 prime weeks of summer.  But, they sold way more than 8-10 weeks as platinum (I don't remember exactly how many -- but say there are 26 platinum weeks -- you have the majority of owners competing for the same 8-10 weeks).  Starwood has this problem too as it relates to gold season at Harborside and the float feature -- so it's not a "Marriott only" problem.  It's caused by developer greed -- making a season extra long to sell more weeks at a premium price.  I have to admit, I was proud of Starwood for fixing this problem with the newest phase at Broadway Plantation.  The seasons for the new phase are much more fairly distributed.


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## oneohana (Mar 29, 2008)

I don't mean to flame the OP but, after 4 years in a row?

Wasn't the north side of WKORV sold as OV? They are now looking at WKORV-N now. When we were at WKORV last month, our IV was pretty much the same as their view. Maybe better.

When we go to Hawaii, it is not for the view from our lanai. I'm not saying I wouldn't prefer a OF view, but it beats looking at my monitor at work. BTW thanks for all those pictures everyone posted. I miss Hawaii already.


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## ciscogizmo1 (Mar 29, 2008)

grgs said:


> One thought is that perhaps WKORV tagged units as OV that Marriott would have classed as IV?  Here's a Marriott Maui Ocean Club pamphlet showing which view categories are assigned to which units:
> 
> http://iconnections.smugmug.com/gallery/1508048#150915143-L-LB
> 
> ...



You are probably correct that would be the million dollar question why do MOC owners complain about booking at 12 months and why do WKORV owners complain about their view!  But you wanna bet as WKORV owners figure out that they need to book 12 months out exactly to get a better view that the competition will get harder to reserve during those popular times.

I like the link of the view categories for Marriott.  It is probably obvious that Marriott is more experience in view categories and have learned from past mistakes.  I like how the some of the 1st floor units are categorized at island view and I think that is fair.  Also, I think, the Maui Marriott has better surroundings as you are not close to a highway like WRORV is.  MOC is located amoung a green belt so, an island view isn't as bad.

And, I agree with you on the timestamp thing.  I think they set themselves up for problems by mentioning that there was a timestamp in the first place.  Why even tell the customer that there was a timestamp.  I've never heard of Marriott telling me that everything is timestamp.  It might be but it is unknown to me.  Starwood just created more problems by even telling the OP where they were in line.  It is poor customer service in my opinion.   Back in November when I checked in I was told that I was #1 on the timestamp for a 2 bedroom unit.  The problem was that there were very few full two bedroom units to choose from.


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## LisaRex (Mar 29, 2008)

It may be that the lock-out feature is working against us, as Starwood is then free to market the unused side.  And they do market it, aggressively.  Yet, unlike us owners, renters are allowed to check in anyday.  So if their rental falls from a Thursday to a Wednesday, they could conceivably be taking the best view from owners who book the full 2 bedrooms.  

I think Starwood needs to give us an explanation as to how renters are treated vs. owners.  It is we owners who paid for the resort, and who continue to pay for the upkeep of the resort, and we are being treated very poorly.  To add insult to injury, our HOA do not make one red cent on the rentals.  Per the owners manual, Starwood has the right to usurp any villa not claimed within 90 days of check-in.  Free, except a minor housekeeping fee. 

And so it's conceivable that we're getting doubly screwed.  Firstly because we owners get to pay a 110%+ MFs each year for maintenance on people who don't pay us anything to be there and secondly because by allowing renters to check in on any day, they may be prohibiting owners from getting the best view, esp those who want to use both sides.


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## ciscogizmo1 (Mar 29, 2008)

LisaRex said:


> It may be that the lock-out feature is working against us, as Starwood is then free to market the unused side.  And they do market it, aggressively.  Yet, unlike us owners, renters are allowed to check in anyday.  So if their rental falls from a Thursday to a Wednesday, they could conceivably be taking the best view from owners who book the full 2 bedrooms.
> 
> I think Starwood needs to give us an explanation as to how renters are treated vs. owners.  It is we owners who paid for the resort, and who continue to pay for the upkeep of the resort, and we are being treated very poorly.  To add insult to injury, our HOA do not make one red cent on the rentals.  Per the owners manual, Starwood has the right to usurp any villa not claimed within 90 days of check-in.  Free, except a minor housekeeping fee.
> 
> And so it's conceivable that we're getting doubly screwed.  Firstly because we owners get to pay a 110%+ MFs each year for maintenance on people who don't pay us anything to be there and secondly because by allowing renters to check in on any day, they may be prohibiting owners from getting the best view, esp those who want to use both sides.



This is even true as an owner.  For example, I met 2 people in November that were taking advantage of the 13 night usage.  Where you can convert your 2 bedroom 7 nights over to a 1 bedroom for 13 nights.  So, you can  I believe check in on Sunday and stay through the following Friday.  So, for that particular unit you changed the check-in date from a Sunday to a Friday.   So, WKORV can't have set units for check-in days because of the programs they offer.  So, I don't see how they can assign a unit at 12 months when people may cancel at 8 months to do the other options.  I think it is more complicated than we realize.  I know for a fact at the units I own with Marriott the check-in dates are split amoung the units.  Where at WKORV told me that the majority of owners check-in on Saturday (hence, where the better views will be) and the minority check-in on Friday and Sunday.  In fact when we checked in on a Friday in November we were the only family checking in requesting a 2 bedroom that day.


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## sayer7 (Mar 29, 2008)

dss, Lisa :

I agree with all what you have said:  but that is what I did the first year, second year, third year but with the fourth year I had it!!!  I even had it more since I called three days before my arrival and talked to a manager who e. mailed Orlando and told them about my situation, and I specifically told them I don't want to make a scene at check in.  Olando e mailed back and blocked a unit for me in the sixth floor BUT a manager have given it up to some one else the day of my arrival. ( I found out that the seconed day when I called florida to see why this happend) that exposed the managers that they were lieyng to me.  when I found this information and confronted them.  they all were speachless.


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## sayer7 (Mar 29, 2008)

dss;  

we should write a letter as you said, how can we get owners to join.  I the purpose of my thread is to start something like that.  at least something good will come out of it for all.  may be create a WKOV owners web site.  I you notice on my star central there is now way for owners to interact and share info.


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## DeniseM (Mar 29, 2008)

> may be create a WKOV owners web site.  I you notice on my star central there is now way for owners to interact and share info.




This IS a WKORV owner's website! 

I'm confused about one thing - how are you related to Mr. Kanakriyeh?


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## sayer7 (Mar 29, 2008)

I wonder if we can invite the board of HOA of WKOV to this and let them read our views. ?


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## mepiccolo (Mar 29, 2008)

I agree with LisaRex and would be more than willing to sign the joint letter you are discussing.  

I believe that a portion of any rental fees made by Starwood for the units should go towards the HOA fees.  I would think that as owners we tend to treat the unit better than renters do, and yet we are the ones paying for the furniture and for the upkeep of the unit while no rental money goes towards upkeep?  Any way you splice it we, as owners, are being taken by Starwood.  

I feel for the original poster who has had bad experiences 4 years in a row.  Even trying to assure 3 days prior that it wasn't going to happen again.  It doesn't sound like he wanted to be cursing the day of his arrival but, my gosh, put in his shoes with all the problems he's already had I think I would have been a total potty mouth too, it wouldn't have been pretty if it had been me either :annoyed:


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## oneohana (Mar 29, 2008)

sayer7 said:


> dss, Lisa :
> 
> I agree with all what you have said:  but that is what I did the first year, second year, third year but with the fourth year I had it!!!  I even had it more since I called three days before my arrival and talked to a manager who e. mailed Orlando and told them about my situation, and I specifically told them I don't want to make a scene at check in.  Olando e mailed back and blocked a unit for me in the sixth floor BUT a manager have given it up to some one else the day of my arrival. ( I found out that the seconed day when I called florida to see why this happend) that exposed the managers that they were lieyng to me.  when I found this information and confronted them.  they all were speachless.




Maybe the people checking in before you didn't like their view and complaigned to the manager. That is how they got your room. One of the advantages of checking in as soon as you can. The later people get the undesireable views. 
Sorry to hear about your experiences at WKORV. Maybe a call to Suzanne Clark might help.


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## DeniseM (Mar 29, 2008)

sayer7 said:


> I wonder if we can invite the board of HOA of WKOV to this and let them read our views. ?



Starwood does read this board.  And since most of the members of the BOD are Starwood employees, my guess is that much of it falls on deaf ears...


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## sayer7 (Mar 30, 2008)

Prior to arrival and as always the reassured me that check in time has no effect on unit assignment.  still the insist on that.  By the way who is susan clark ? do you know what is her title ?


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## LisaRex (Mar 30, 2008)

sayer7 said:


> Prior to arrival and as always the reassured me that check in time has no effect on unit assignment.  still the insist on that.  By the way who is susan clark ? do you know what is her title ?



Her name is Suzanne Clark. She is VP of Owner Services.


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## mindy35 (Mar 31, 2008)

sayer7 said:


> To my dismay: your management sent security and threatened to escort me out of the resort because I wore a hat which says MANAGEMENT SUCKS, instead of coming and talk to me. Again another Moron manager employed employed by you guys is very irresponsible        _______________________



Just a question:

Did you bring this hat _with_ you or did you spend your vacation hours having it custom made?


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## sayer7 (Mar 31, 2008)

I wrote it on a key card and stapled it in the front of the hat they give me eith the WKORV embolem on it So it was on top of their embolem. It is one of created from their materials ( my sun's Idea)


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## Westin5Star (Mar 31, 2008)

sayer7 said:


> I wrote it on a key card and stapled it in the front of the hat they give me eith the WKORV embolem on it So it was on top of their embolem. It is one of created from their materials ( my sun's Idea)



I'm sorry to hear about your problems with room assignment and I hope that you are able to get things fixed for the future.  I have request.  Is there anyway that you could take a picture of that hat and post it?  I would love to see it and I am sure that there might be some others out there that would enjoy it as well.


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