# New Wyhdham Timeshare User Group on Facebook



## chirowes (Mar 20, 2015)

[link to commercial website deleted - per TUG rules]

[Please note that when this thread was first started, TUG was unaware that this was a link to a rental website, and the thread became quite long, before that came to our attention.]


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## alexadeparis (Mar 21, 2015)

Thanks just joined


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## WinniWoman (Mar 21, 2015)

Can you join this group if you own at a Wyndhan resort but are not a Wyndham points owner? (We bought at the resort before it became Wyndham)


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## chirowes (Mar 21, 2015)

*All are invited to join*

Feel free to join!


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## WinniWoman (Mar 21, 2015)

Thanks! Will do!


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## chirowes (Mar 22, 2015)

*Thanks*

Group is really growing. Thanks to everyone!


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## chirowes (Mar 24, 2015)

.............


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## andex (Mar 24, 2015)

thanks I joined as well!


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## joestein (Mar 25, 2015)

I just put in a join request.


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## chirowes (Mar 27, 2015)

thanks.....


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## chirowes (Mar 28, 2015)

..............


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## chirowes (Mar 29, 2015)

.............


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## luvNMB52 (Mar 29, 2015)

*facebook*

Just joined....  thanks!


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## DeniseM (Mar 29, 2015)

So…. What can I find on the new Facebook page, that isn't on TUG?


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## uscav8r (Mar 29, 2015)

DeniseM said:


> So…. What can I find on the new Facebook page, that isn't on TUG?



Wyndham owners not yet aware of TUG!  


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## chirowes (Mar 30, 2015)

...............


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 30, 2015)

One poster on that site thought TUG was rude to them.


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## chirowes (Apr 1, 2015)

....................


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## NHTraveler (Apr 1, 2015)

DeniseM said:


> So…. What can I find on the new Facebook page, that isn't on TUG?



Like...


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## vacationhopeful (Apr 1, 2015)

DeniseM said:


> So…. What can I find on the new Facebook page, that isn't on TUG?



A lot of newbies ..... booting off timeshare a sales person (was a polite one, too) ..... internet slang by a regular poster .... typing skills a little slack ....

Just my observations.


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## DeniseM (Apr 1, 2015)

vacationhopeful said:


> A lot of newbies ..... booting off timeshare a sales person (was a polite one, too) ..... internet slang by a regular poster .... typing skills a little slack ....
> 
> Just my observations.



So, they are "texting"


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## vacationhopeful (Apr 1, 2015)

DeniseM said:


> So, they are "texting"



Yes ... texting "lingo" on the internet/Facebook ... annoying to read.... and you would think ARP, LMR, STD, 1bdr, FB would be enough? ....  u r ~ rite!


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## Craigvince (Apr 1, 2015)

DeniseM said:


> So…. What can I find on the new Facebook page, that isn't on TUG?



Nothing, but there are sure a lot of people in the FB group that aren't/weren't on TUG. We've already recruited a few.


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## vacationhopeful (Apr 1, 2015)

I found some people who had tried to read TUG confused "by TUG" ..... FB was simpler or more familiar to them. But give them a week or three on FB ... TUG might seem much more full of info and details.


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## chirowes (Apr 2, 2015)

thanks.........


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## TUGBrian (Apr 2, 2015)

as long as owners are getting the  information they need, I dont particularly care where they get it =)

lots of folks are super comfortable with facebook, after all its the largest social media site on earth.

I am thrilled so many folks are willing to publicly chat about timeshares on facebook, so many feel the taboo/ashamedness of owning one!


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## wed100105 (Apr 11, 2015)

I just sent a request to join.


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## GregT (Apr 11, 2015)

vacationhopeful said:


> But give them a week or three on FB ... TUG might seem much more full of info and details.



I agree with this -- TUG is much better suited for the sharing of information and responding to questions.  Facebook may be well suited for a running dialogue, but it's hard to think that it can be as structured as TUG.

And one of the greatest assets of TUG are the TUGgers and their collective knowledge.  I definitely don't see that being replicated on Facebook.   I think the people most committed to their timeshares will end up here and Facebook may become a way of directing those people in this direction.

Best,

Greg


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## fibroreport (Apr 20, 2015)

I want to join.


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## fibroreport (Apr 24, 2015)

For some reason I have not been able to join. I sent in my request.


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## DeniseM (Apr 24, 2015)

Click on chirowes's blue user name and send them an email.


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## chirowes (Apr 28, 2015)

I think I was able to get u added to the group. Let me know if not.


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## Kidpolska (Apr 28, 2015)

thanks for the info...I am in!


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## chirowes (May 1, 2015)

Thanks for joining kidpolska. Learning quit a bit so far.


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## fibroreport (May 8, 2015)

`I don't seem to be a member for some reason


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## WinniWoman (May 8, 2015)

fibroreport said:


> `I don't seem to be a member for some reason




You have to go on facebook and request to join


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## chirowes (May 13, 2015)

yes please go to facebook and join there fibroreport


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## chirowes (May 23, 2015)

So we have over 1000 members now. Thanks all for joining!


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## am1 (May 31, 2015)

I joined the group when it first started and looks like today the admins decided to kick me out as I am no longer apart of it.  I guess telling the admin they are wrong when it comes to realistic rentals prices for last minute reservations was what did it.  But what do I know I have only been doing this for 8 years.  The admin seems pushy and demanding from what I have seen.  Hopefully he treats  others better and respects their opinion.  

The group has a lot of people asking questions and too many people responding the questions with incorrect answers.   I do not see a reason for members here needing to join.


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## vacationhopeful (Jun 1, 2015)

am1 said:


> ....The group has a lot of people asking questions and too many people responding the questions with incorrect answers.   I do not see a reason for members here needing to join.



am1 ... I just got reprimanded for mention TUGBBS on their site by  "Wes" .. then that post was edited to exclude the TUG web site!!!!

So, you get booted and I get "slapped and *WARNED" to not reference TUG on that Facebook thread!*

Is that a "friendly" and/or neutral place to learn about timesharing? 

Is there a way to make a profit with a Facebook page/site?


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## scootr5 (Jun 1, 2015)

vacationhopeful said:


> am1 ... I just got reprimanded for mention TUGBBS on their site by  "Wes" .. then that post was edited to exclude the TUG web site!!!!
> 
> So, you get booted and I get "slapped and *WARNED" to not reference TUG on that Facebook thread!*
> 
> ...



Hm, I've mentioned TUG over there a few times. It seems like it would be a little one-sided to come here and keep bumping and asking for members, but then not allow this site to be mentioned.....


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## NHTraveler (Jun 1, 2015)

Nice Wes.  Really?


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## TUGBrian (Jun 1, 2015)

wow, they deleted posts that tell people about TUG?  I certainly hope a valid explanation is provided for this.

I have no problem with folks posting links to other sites that contain valid information to help an owner get advice or answers to a question...I cannot believe any other site claiming to be for the help and education of owners deliberately preventing the helping of another owner merely because it points to another site?

That said, their site=their rules....but hopefully this is just a misunderstanding.


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## chirowes (Jun 1, 2015)

This really is why I stopped using tug. The non stop complaining about everything. There are many references to Tug on the facebook page. We were compiling a list of good ebay sellers for the group. Something people can see quickly and not sort thru all the posts on here. I have never tried to limit references to Tug and tag Brian in the posts all the time to comment on a post. As for the complainers, yeah they get the boot. I wish Tug would also boot the complainers, but not my call. Booting the complainers on the facebook page is my call, and I will make it. Sorry to offend. Best of wishes to you all. Btw this is the one and only reply I will make to all these posts. As I said, I am not here to argue, which is why the facebook page will be different than the Tug forum.


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## am1 (Jun 1, 2015)

chirowes said:


> This really is why I stopped using tug. The non stop complaining about everything. There are many references to Tug on the facebook page. We were compiling a list of good ebay sellers for the group. Something people can see quickly and not sort thru all the posts on here. I have never tried to limit references to Tug and tag Brian in the posts all the time to comment on a post. As for the complainers, yeah they get the boot. I wish Tug would also boot the complainers, but not my call. Booting the complainers on the facebook page is my call, and I will make it. Sorry to offend. Best of wishes to you all. Btw this is the one and only reply I will make to all these posts. As I said, I am not here to argue, which is why the facebook page will be different than the Tug forum.



I do not see how providing a different point of view on what is a good price to get for renting Wyndham points last minute is complaining.  You may want a high price but that is not always realistic.  For a lot of people something is better than nothing.  That is what happens to people who cannot rent out their points/reservations.  But I guess you do not want anyone second guessing you.  All the best.  

I would suggest though is to lose the attitude and no one owes you further explanation on their timeshare experiences.  You may ask them to further explain but do not get upset and harass them to answer.


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## DeniseM (Jun 1, 2015)

chirowes said:


> This really is why I stopped using tug. The non stop complaining about everything. There are many references to Tug on the facebook page. We were compiling a list of good ebay sellers for the group. Something people can see quickly and not sort thru all the posts on here. I have never tried to limit references to Tug and tag Brian in the posts all the time to comment on a post. *As for the complainers, yeah they get the boot. I wish Tug would also boot the complainers, but not my call. Booting the complainers on the facebook page is my call, and I will make it. *Sorry to offend. Best of wishes to you all. Btw this is the one and only reply I will make to all these posts. As I said, I am not here to argue, which is why the facebook page will be different than the Tug forum.



I was going to comment on this, but your own words are so condemning, that I don't think anything else needs to be said.


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## TUGBrian (Jun 1, 2015)

I have no problem with you running your site how you see fit, if folks were complaining and breaking the rules...enforce away.  You wont hear me tell you how to run your own site =)

My comment was merely in regards to the claim that someone was banned and or censored for doing nothing more than mentioning TUG.

If thats not the case, no worries here!


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## chirowes (Jun 1, 2015)

No Brian, check the post yourself. It is the one about ebay sellers. Should not be far down.


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## DeniseM (Jun 1, 2015)

chirowes said:


> No Brian, check the post yourself. It is the one about ebay sellers. Should not be far down.



As stated above, it does appear that you deleted a link to TUG? [From your FB page]


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## chirowes (Jun 1, 2015)

Also Brian I reread. I am sorry if anything I said offened you. You have been nothing but great and supportive. Run this site how you see fit. My words may have come off short with you, but they were never intended that way. Truly deepest apologies if they came off that way.


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## chirowes (Jun 1, 2015)

Also Brian I reread. I am sorry if anything I said offened you. You have been nothing but great and supportive. Run this site how you see fit. My words may have come off short with you, but they were never intended that way. Truly deepest apologies if they came off that way.


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## chirowes (Jun 1, 2015)

I did not delete a link to tug. It is still there. That is why I said to look.


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## chirowes (Jun 1, 2015)

Brian I did not even see the post u wrote from ealier till just now. We must have posted at the same time. I have never delete a link to you all. U know full good and well I tag u in the post all the time.


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## TUGBrian (Jun 1, 2015)

no problem at all.  I have never seen anything anti-tug on your site...i was just responding to the claims above =)


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## chirowes (Jun 1, 2015)

I really never do this but I will this one time. Lynn there must be a misunderstanding. I asked for a list of ebay providers then u quoted a reference to tug. That reference is still up. I then asked u to post the individual sellers rather than a reference as the facebook users want a quick list of sellers, that is what I was trying to provide. I know u have bought and was asking u to share them. I then right after thanked u for the link right afterward. As far as Adam. Well he wanted a revolt about guest certs and did not think they should be charged. Well that is fine but we dont care. We want to learn the system as it is, not as he thinks it should be. His starting all this arguing on here over being deleted from the facebook group confirms to me why I deleted him. I never deleted any link to tug. I learned much of what I know from TUG. I tag Brian in posts all the time. I had one complainer named Adam that I deleted for complaining and yet he is still complaining and involving others. That is why I deleted him. He was doing the same thing on facebook and causing people to argue instead of lerning the system as it is.  Again, Brian, my apologies.


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## chirowes (Jun 1, 2015)

Just saw ur post Brian. Thank you!


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## DeniseM (Jun 1, 2015)

chirowes said:


> I asked for a list of ebay providers then u quoted a reference to tug. That reference is still up. I then asked u to post the individual sellers rather than a reference as the facebook users want a quick list of sellers, that is what I was trying to provide.



So you are saying that you deleted a direct *link to TUG*, because you didn't want your FB peeps to go to TUG for the info., you wanted them to post the info. on your FB page.


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## uscav8r (Jun 1, 2015)

FWIW, I've never had a problem with referencing TUG on the FB page.


chirowes said:


> ...As for the complainers, yeah they get the boot...


I wonder if that is what happend to the Pompano Beach-based thread from Teresa XXX who supposedly thought she should have priority access up to the last day before wanting to book. She got pretty belligerent in the face of objective advice.


chirowes said:


> ...I had one complainer ... that I deleted for complaining ....


I've never been an Admin, but I have been in the military. We usually praise in public and punish/chastise in private. Do you try to work behind the scenes with a person via wards of caution before dropping the hammer? It may be a good way to tone things down without coming off poorly.


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## SmithOp (Jun 1, 2015)

TUG has the ignore list for the argumentative types that you would rather not read, it works great and they don't have to be kicked out.

Welcome to the world of moderating internet discussions, I did it back in the day on Compuserve and vowed I would never take it on again, a thankless task.


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## chirowes (Jun 1, 2015)

Yep, Pompano got the boot too.


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## am1 (Jun 1, 2015)

chirowes said:


> As far as Adam. Well he wanted a revolt about guest certs and did not think they should be charged. Well that is fine but we dont care. We want to learn the system as it is, not as he thinks it should be. His starting all this arguing on here over being deleted from the facebook group confirms to me why I deleted him. I never deleted any link to tug. I learned much of what I know from TUG. I tag Brian in posts all the time. I had one complainer named Adam that I deleted for complaining and yet he is still complaining and involving others. That is why I deleted him. He was doing the same thing on facebook and causing people to argue instead of lerning the system as it is.  Again, Brian, my apologies.



Not sure why you need to repeat yourself twice here.  This will be my last post about your group and I will stick to that.

I never wanted to start a revolt about guest confirmations I just think that $99/$129 is too high and the guest name should be allowed to be changed if the original guest cannot travel also that if one wants to add on a reservation to a stay a new guest confirmation fee should not be required.  

Somethings are important to some Wyndham owners and other things are important to other owners.  Who do you think you are to decide what is important and discussed and what is not?

How do you expect Wyndham owners to learn about the system when you run off knowledgable owners?  Your welcome for all the answers that I provided to the people asking questions.


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## chirowes (Jun 1, 2015)

I double post because really hard to navigate on mobile so my mistake. Anyway, best of luck to you Adam.


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## theo (Jun 2, 2015)

*To each their own...*

I believe that this "manufactured conflict' will quickly work itself out... 

Short attention spanned and semi-coherent "thumb texters" will predictably migrate to a social media site they are inclined to prefer for its' "quick and easy dialog" --- whether or not said dialog ever manages to even remotely approach the level of collective knowledge and experience long established and readily found here on TUG. 
Here on TUG, it is surely unheard of for anyone to ever get "the boot" for reasonably expressing a differing, alternative (...even if unpopular) point of view. 
Free thinking and / or honest expression would appear to *not* be welcomed on the censure-inclined "thumb texters" site, however.  I predict it will simply self-destruct.
The Facebook page will indeed be "different", likely including in longevity. TUG has been around for 20 years; I give the censured thumb texters 20 months --- tops.  

More deliberative Wyndham folks, although maybe possessing less "nimble thumbs", will likely settle on the long established TUG site reflecting a much higher level of collective knowledge and experience, but which also requires a considerably longer attention span in the quest for factual accuracy and well informed, specific detail.
Sometimes it *takes* discusssion and debate to flesh out all those specific details; maybe such discussion and debate is simply not for the terminally impatient. 

It's about personal choice. Patient TUGGERS (limited "texting thumb skills" notwithstanding) might even visit  both places --- until banished from FB for "disagreeing".


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## joestein (Jun 3, 2015)

Well I have had my own experience with the facebook page.

Yesterday I posted a comment about all people I read on this page who are buying Wyndham timeshare with loans and that if you can afford to pay cash you have NO BUSINESS BUYING IT.
I mentioned it is a luxury and that additionally the interest rates in the teens border on usuary.

I got a posting by another member who agreed with me and expanded on some of the points I made.

A few hours later that night the post disappeared.


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## joestein (Jun 3, 2015)

Well this morning, I was reading a post where their was a discussion of resale vs developer purchase.

Wes (Chirowes) was making an argument that developer purchaser makes sense and Ron Parise was disagreeing with him.

Wes made some comments about rude posters and this is not the direction my page is going to go.


I commented:

I dont understand why this page needs a direction.  You don't let us forget it is your page.

I discussed my posting that was removed.  I pointed out that only Abusive or Vulgar posts should be removed.

I then said this reminds me of certain shills.  (maybe a bit over the line)


Shortly thereafter I kicked out of the group.


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## snickers104 (Jun 3, 2015)

Shame on you for having an opinion that is not in the going in the direction of that page!!!!  Don't you know it is HIS page?????


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## ace2000 (Jun 3, 2015)

joestein said:


> Wes (Chirowes) was making an argument that developer purchaser makes sense and Ron Parise was disagreeing with him.



You mean Ron has lasted this long???  :hysterical:

Anyway, I guess this is turning into a helpful thread (in a negative way) for those considering joining that group, but just as a few others have mentioned, I get everything I need right here on TUG.  If anything, it probably makes me a little more thankful for the diversity of opinions we all share over here.


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## vacationhopeful (Jun 3, 2015)

I haven't been throw off yet .... close, but not dis-membered. :ignore:


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## ace2000 (Jun 3, 2015)

vacationhopeful said:


> I haven't been throw off yet .... close, but not dis-membered. :ignore:



Keep working on it... you'll get there.


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## chirowes (Jun 3, 2015)

I value all the experience of the veteran owners. I want that experience on the facebook group. Tug has provided me much info over the past couple of years but I grew weary of sifting thru the bebate and arguing and philosophical discussion to get to learn the product. It took too long. I did not complin on TUG, instead I started a facebook page to be different. To provide quick info about the product without debate. All are welcome to to contine to debate where they wish. It wont be on the facebook page. I wish only the best to the experienced owners who taught me so much.


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## comicbookman (Jun 3, 2015)

chirowes said:


> I value all the experience of the veteran owners. I want that experience on the facebook group. Tug has provided me much info over the past couple of years but I grew weary of sifting thru the bebate and arguing and philosophical discussion to get to learn the product. It took too long. I did not complin on TUG, instead I started a facebook page to be different. To provide quick info about the product without debate. All are welcome to to contine to debate where they wish. It wont be on the facebook page. I wish only the best to the experienced owners who taught me so much.



So you don't want debate, then I guess you know everything already and just want to share.  How noble.  I hope you make it clear to the other posters that all advice must agree with your opinion or face deletion.


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## scootr5 (Jun 3, 2015)

chirowes said:


> I value all the experience of the veteran owners. I want that experience on the facebook group. Tug has provided me much info over the past couple of years but I grew weary of sifting thru the bebate and arguing and philosophical discussion to get to learn the product.



But you came here and kept asking and asking those same owners who debate to join the group?


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## chirowes (Jun 3, 2015)

There are many members on TUG who do not wish to spend time on debate. I am one of them, and there are others. For those who do wish to contine to debate, I am glad they have TUG to continue their debate. The Facebook group will be different.


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## joestein (Jun 3, 2015)

chirowes said:


> There are many members on TUG who do not wish to spend time on debate. I am one of them, and there are others. For those who do wish to contine to debate, I am glad they have TUG to continue their debate. The Facebook group will be different.



So, what you really mean is my way or the highway, even though the vast majority of us would agree that your way is the wrong way.


Also, do you have any sort of affiliation with any Wyndham entity, other than timeshare ownership?


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## chirowes (Jun 3, 2015)

Just another owner. No ties to anyone.


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## comicbookman (Jun 3, 2015)

I notice you do not have a disclaimer stating that dissenting opinions will be removed.  Also I see you have also started a page called [removed].  Very easy to confuse with TUG.  Coincidence?  I think not.


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## bnoble (Jun 3, 2015)

> To provide quick info about the product without debate.


That's fine, but then you also can't take advocacy positions (e.g. "developer purchases make sense"), else you are hoist with your own petard.


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## NHTraveler (Jun 4, 2015)

joestein said:


> Also, do you have any sort of affiliation with any Wyndham entity, other than timeshare ownership?



I'm thinking the same thing.


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## theo (Jun 4, 2015)

bnoble said:


> That's fine, but then you also can't take advocacy positions (e.g. "developer purchases make sense"), else you are hoist with your own petard.



I have to just scratch my head in wonder when *anyone* seeks to overtly assert that "developer purchases make sense", at Wyndham or elsewhere. 

Makes sense *to whom?* is what I would have to ask. The eligible candidates are precious few...


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## chirowes (Jun 4, 2015)

I really am not sure what is so difficult to understand. Resale is cheaper for sure. I bought resale thru ebay. I used donate for a cause as the provider. To say some how resale is better is not even close to true. It is just cheaper. Cheaper by alot! U all act like u have never bought something that is better and more expensive because u wanted it. People buy Mercedes and Rolex all the time and we dont scream at them... take it back and buy Chevy. It is perhaps that some have been duped during high pressure sales to buy, then, others just want something better with more perks. Do I think the perks are worth it? NO!!!! Do I want them? YES. I am on the receiving end of the complaints from the retail owners about being yelled at about how much they overpaid. I have asked a few of u to be considerate of the retail owners feelings. Some of u proceeded to tell me how it was not my perogative to tell u what to say. Well am not going to argue on the facebook site about rights and censorship. You all can argue it over here from now to eternity. All are welcome on the facebook page if they can refrain from arguing and be nice to one another and actually helpful. There will be no 4 pages of arguing about how the group is run like there is just on this post alone. No new owner seeking help is going to read thru 4 pages of arguing to get no new or useful info at all. That is why the facebook page is different. I have a feeling u all will continue this post for at least 4 more pages before it is over. Yet in all that time will not have helped one single person. Keep arguing and debating, but at the end of the day, that is why some of u where deleted from the group.


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## DeniseM (Jun 4, 2015)

[removed]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## comicbookman (Jun 4, 2015)

chirowes said:


> I really am not sure what is so difficult to understand. Resale is cheaper for sure. I bought resale thru ebay. I used donate for a cause as the provider. To say some how resale is better is not even close to true. It is just cheaper. Cheaper by alot! U all act like u have never bought something that is better and more expensive because u wanted it. People buy Mercedes and Rolex all the time and we dont scream at them... take it back and buy Chevy. It is perhaps that some have been duped during high pressure sales to buy, then, others just want something better with more perks. Do I think the perks are worth it? NO!!!! Do I want them? YES. I am on the receiving end of the complaints from the retail owners about being yelled at about how much they overpaid. I have asked a few of u to be considerate of the retail owners feelings. Some of u proceeded to tell me how it was not my perogative to tell u what to say. Well am not going to argue on the facebook site about rights and censorship. You all can argue it over here from now to eternity. All are welcome on the facebook page if they can refrain from arguing and be nice to one another and actually helpful. There will be no 4 pages of arguing about how the group is run like there is just on this post alone. No new owner seeking help is going to read thru 4 pages of arguing to get no new or useful info at all. That is why the facebook page is different. I have a feeling u all will continue this post for at least 4 more pages before it is over. Yet in all that time will not have helped one single person. Keep arguing and debating, but at the end of the day, that is why some of u where deleted from the group.



So if you could buy a used rolex in mint condition for half the price of a new one, you would still buy the new one?  that is a better analogy.  clearly you have issues and you do not like being disagreed with.  your prerogative.  I just think it is deceptive to not tell your facebook users your biases upfront.  Clearly you do not think people need to know anything other than what you decide they should know.  And I still think "TRUG" is a deliberate attempt at confusion.


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## theo (Jun 4, 2015)

chirowes said:


> ...<snip> ...the facebook page is different.  Keep arguing and debating, but at the end of the day, that is why some of u where deleted from the group.



Gud luk 2 u.


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## chirowes (Jun 4, 2015)

If I wanted to confuse people with the name, I would have called it Timeshare user group. What do u think tug stands for? Timeshare user group. That is not a name, it is a description. [removed] has 350 members. Hardly a threat and it mearly describes the group. Just like TUG.


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## joestein (Jun 4, 2015)

chirowes said:


> I really am not sure what is so difficult to understand. Resale is cheaper for sure. I bought resale thru ebay. I used donate for a cause as the provider. To say some how resale is better is not even close to true. It is just cheaper. Cheaper by alot! U all act like u have never bought something that is better and more expensive because u wanted it. People buy Mercedes and Rolex all the time and we dont scream at them... take it back and buy Chevy. It is perhaps that some have been duped during high pressure sales to buy, then, others just want something better with more perks. Do I think the perks are worth it? NO!!!! Do I want them? YES. I am on the receiving end of the complaints from the retail owners about being yelled at about how much they overpaid. I have asked a few of u to be considerate of the retail owners feelings. Some of u proceeded to tell me how it was not my perogative to tell u what to say. Well am not going to argue on the facebook site about rights and censorship. You all can argue it over here from now to eternity. All are welcome on the facebook page if they can refrain from arguing and be nice to one another and actually helpful. There will be no 4 pages of arguing about how the group is run like there is just on this post alone. No new owner seeking help is going to read thru 4 pages of arguing to get no new or useful info at all. That is why the facebook page is different. I have a feeling u all will continue this post for at least 4 more pages before it is over. Yet in all that time will not have helped one single person. Keep arguing and debating, but at the end of the day, that is why some of u where deleted from the group.


First of all comparing a Mercedes to a Chevy is a completely different comparison.  Yes they are both cars but completely different.

A better analogy would be paying $5K for a new Chevy or paying $50K for the same car but with a few options added in.

Plus you have a long way to go to have helped a fraction of the people that TUG has helped.


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## bnoble (Jun 4, 2015)

You know what's awesome about TUG?  The ignore list---and mine has grown by one.


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## vacationhopeful (Jun 16, 2015)

I think I got booted from the Facebook group .... been work busy but noticed no new FB emails for a couple of days. Went looking.

I just love Gomer Pyle quote "Well, I'll be...." 

FB page says "closed group" and the button, "ask to join" is available.....

ADDED: Looking back on my emails with Facebook conversations ... I must like Shawnee more than others. I guess I should have disclosed that I own 3 deeds there (all converted to Wyndham points) with very good MFs ratio (lower than most). And I use the FREE DAY RESORT priviledges for FIXED WEEEK owner every couple of months. And I like the place as a getaway 0 using my VIP discount to book within the 60 day window (hard to get the free unit upgrade, but as I know the resort, I know WHERE to look).


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## DeniseM (Jun 16, 2015)

vacationhopeful said:


> I think I got booted from the Facebook group ...



I bet you're crushed….


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## chirowes (Jun 16, 2015)

If I could delete this thread I would. Please feel free to delete it if possible. Thank you


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## comicbookman (Jun 16, 2015)

chirowes said:


> If I could delete this thread I would. Please feel free to delete it if possible. Thank you



But we are having sooo much fun


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## DeniseM (Jun 16, 2015)

chirowes said:


> If I could delete this thread I would. Please feel free to delete it if possible. Thank you



Why would we want to do that?  I think it's helpful for people to know what to expect on your website...


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## mistalong (Jun 16, 2015)

This is more than comical.  :hysterical:


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## vacationhopeful (Jun 16, 2015)

chirowes said:


> If I could delete this thread I would. Please feel free to delete it if possible. Thank you





comicbookman said:


> But we are having sooo much fun



Wes McLa .... see, here on TUG we do not wipe out our past or even ASK to clean the slate. You been around TUG for over 18 months and now you want your posts & thread in the past month to two, to go away? 

WHY? 

Censoring posters to your FB page might help you bury opinions different than YOURS .. but the kids will grow up and move on .... unless this thread here is going to hurt YOUR future cash flow in some way.

As for your post, Wes, following this one .... this thread is NOT an argument .... far from it. *Your statement below is call a "deflection defense" ... usually offered when logic or facts DO NOT SUPPORT your position....*


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## chirowes (Jun 16, 2015)

As I said, you all will fill up 8 pages of argument before this feed dies. I also find it funny as well. Have a good day everyone and all the best!


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## uscav8r (Jun 16, 2015)

*Bait and Switch?*

When things started getting dicey with Wes (am1 got booted), I considered standing up for him (oh, wait... I DID), but decided to let things play out for a bit. So apparently I got booted as well _*f**or reasons unbeknownst to me*_.

These are my impressions:


Wes is not actually educating people because he will let egregiously erroneous info remain without comment. This tells me:
Wes does not know enough about his ownership to make a proper judgment, or
He does not care because this is not his primary intent.
 
As an extension of this last bullet, he freely posts his own rental offers, but apparently suppresses anyone else's attempt to help or be helped by other owners in this regard (i.e., list a one-off rental). I can understand keeping commercial interests at bay, but this is ridiculous for the common owner.
Wes expects you to be a mind reader.
He never posted any of his guidelines or taboo topics.
There seems to be an unwritten ban on rental posts (other than his own).
 
Wes will boot people without so much as a "reach-around" or warning.
Without knowing #3, how can anyone who actually knows their ownership avoid #4?
After all those observations, I can conclude that:


Wes is looking for naive or partially knoweldgeable owners and he will lull them into a false sense of security with pretty pictures and trivial owner-to-owner help/advice (of which he provides very little himself with substance).
Once the new member sees that the group is okay, he springs rental offerings from "trusted" Wyndham and Bluegreen owners. Just not anyone else's legit offerings.
Anyone seen as a potential competitor or who may educate others to a certain level will get the boot.
If Wes would actually return my query as to why I got booted, and have a man-to-man dialogue, I might have been prevented from posting this. Instead, he has not been straightforward with me (nor others, apparently), and this is the unfortunate outcome.

This really makes me want to stand up a REAL Wyndham owners group based on education and exchange, and not on corralling a group to which one would make exclusive commercial offers.


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## DeniseM (Jun 16, 2015)

That's unfortunate, because now that Wes's site is used for his rentals, he can no longer promote it on TUG, because that's a commercial website...


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## uscav8r (Jun 16, 2015)

chirowes said:


> As I said, you all will fill up 8 pages of argument before this feed dies. I also find it funny as well. Have a good day everyone and all the best!


Instead of finding it funny, be a decent human being and give others some common courtesy and discuss what you may have at issue with him/her. I understand that being an Admin is difficult, but you've taken "going Communist" (your words from FB) to a whole new level.


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## uscav8r (Jun 16, 2015)

mistalong said:


> This is more than comical.  :hysterical:


Yes, it has blown up in Wes's face. Now he may just have to deal with a competitor FB page because he has riled up so many helpful Wyndham owners.


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## uscav8r (Jun 16, 2015)

No longer pertinent.


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## SueDonJ (Jun 16, 2015)

[_Deleted quote from post edited mid-response._]

I'd consider adding, "[Proceed with caution.]" to the thread title, but am more comfortable with it being done by this forum's moderator or a moderator who is participating here.  

I don't think I will EVER understand why folks post things to a "discussion" board and then ask for the discussion to be one-sided.


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## scootr5 (Jun 16, 2015)

SueDonJ said:


> [_Deleted quote from post edited mid-response._]
> 
> I'd consider adding, "[Proceed with caution.]" to the thread title, but am more comfortable with it being done by this forum's moderator or a moderator who is participating here.
> 
> I don't think I will EVER understand why folks post things to a "discussion" board and then ask for the discussion to be one-sided.




Because they don't want a discussion, they want a bully pulpit. He set one up for himself with the closed Facebook group.


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## DeniseM (Jun 16, 2015)

SueDonJ said:


> I don't think I will EVER understand why folks post things to a "discussion" board and then ask for the discussion to be one-sided.



My guess is that the real goal of this website is to rent his timeshares - not to facilitate discussion...


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## hjsweet2002 (Jun 16, 2015)

We joined but cant get access dont know why


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## DeniseM (Jun 16, 2015)

I think the OP would be well served to follow this advice from Will Rogers:


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## vacationhopeful (Jun 16, 2015)

Any active TUGGERS left on the FB site? 

Please PM me ... just wanting to know if he eliminated ALL of us.....


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## mistalong (Jun 16, 2015)

I eliminated myself.  Few days ago I was just trying to perform my normal courtesy of notifying folks that I was releasing rooms, and saw that my post had to be approved.  Just kind of rubbed me the wrong way, so I opted out.


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## uscav8r (Jun 16, 2015)

vacationhopeful said:


> Any active TUGGERS left on the FB site?
> 
> Please PM me ... just wanting to know if he eliminated ALL of us.....


I think Ron is still there, or at least he was before I got dumped.


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## comicbookman (Jun 16, 2015)

vacationhopeful said:


> Any active TUGGERS left on the FB site?
> 
> Please PM me ... just wanting to know if he eliminated ALL of us.....



I am still there for now.  Just read over a chunk of it.  90% of wes comments are adds for his rentals.  don't really see how that is "helping " other owners.


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## Ty1on (Jun 16, 2015)

comicbookman said:


> I am still there for now.  Just read over a chunk of it.  90% of wes comments are adds for his rentals.  don't really see how that is "helping " other owners.



I hate it when I miss a good meltdown.


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## uscav8r (Jun 17, 2015)

mistalong said:


> I eliminated myself.  Few days ago I was just trying to perform my normal courtesy of notifying folks that I was releasing rooms, and saw that my post had to be approved.  Just kind of rubbed me the wrong way, so I opted out.



I never started any new threads on that FB page before, and when I finally did, I got the admin pending notice. A day later I got booted. Was that admin screen a new thing that everybody (or select people) had to abide by or was it always like that?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## uscav8r (Jun 17, 2015)

Anyone taking bets on whether he'll have the brass ones to post to this thread again? And if he does, can he even put up a plausible defense?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## WinniWoman (Jun 17, 2015)

vacationhopeful said:


> Any active TUGGERS left on the FB site?
> 
> Please PM me ... just wanting to know if he eliminated ALL of us.....



I am still on. And, FYI, even some of the Yardsale FB sites I am on have to approve your post first. It's not uncommon on some pages. 

I am not sure what all the issues are- I haven't read through this thread. What is going on? What types of posts were deleted? Brian is on....Ron is on..........


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## mistalong (Jun 17, 2015)

mpumilia said:


> And, FYI, even some of the Yardsale FB sites I am on have to approve your post first. It's not uncommon on some pages.
> .



True on some pages it is common for some pages to approve before posting.  But the one courtesy I like that I participate in is the fact that if someone is releasing rooms at noon, I don't want to read about it 2 hours later when it's finally approved.  I like having that courtesy advantage of knowing a room is coming available over the non-tuggers.


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## chirowes (Jun 17, 2015)

As I said, 8 pages but now I am going with 10. None of the rentals are mine. They are other small owners that I am helping. Yes, communist to help small owners rent unused points. Yes I do make a small amount to compensate for my time. I do approve messages, I am just one person so cant do it timely all the time. I have only booted people for not getting along with others or just being rude to others. I do not allow endless debate on non timeshare related issues. It is not the same as this site, it is different. Please feel free to join or not. Keep in mind. The group continues to grow and you keep my post at the top of the page, so thanks. I only started the group to learn about timeshares, not to rent others points, it just turned into that. It is not perfect and I know a lot on here don't like it. That is why u have TUG. Thanks again for all the support and apologies to those who seem to have a problem with my style. I did not realize it would be such a big change for those regular posters on this site, I now realize it will be, which is why I offered to delete this thread. I have learned from all of you over the years and am thankful, it is just time for a new direction for a different outlet...at least for me. Thanks again.


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## DeniseM (Jun 17, 2015)

chirowes said:


> Yes I do make a small amount to compensate for my time.



With that being said - please don't promote your commercial website on TUG in the future - this is prohibited by the TUG posting rules.



> Individual users please note that messages promoting anything for which you may receive some personal gain are considered to be advertising, and are thus prohibited. Promotion of any service where you would get referral compensation is considered to be advertising. Directing somebody to your classified ad on TUG or elsewhere is considered to be advertising. Promotion of a website where you have anything for sale or rent is considered to be advertising.


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## scootr5 (Jun 17, 2015)

chirowes said:


> I only started the group to learn about timeshares, not to rent others points, it just turned into that.



That seems to have happened pretty fast, going from learning about timeshares to a rental business in less than 90 days. Kudos to you for getting up to speed so quickly.


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## chirowes (Jun 17, 2015)

This is the only thread on TUG. As I said before, please feel free to remove it if you feel it violates your rules. Well I have owned rental property for years and my own business for years so really no huge stretch for me to rent vacation rental. Pretty simple really compared to the complexity of my other businesses over the years. I do have a bachelor in marketing and business and 20 years experience running a business, so this really was a piece of cake. This is just a hobby as I move toward retirement.


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## DeniseM (Jun 17, 2015)

I'm not going to delete it, because it's helpful for Tuggers to know what they are getting into, if they sign up for your FB Page.

However, any future posts promoting your FB Page will be deleted.


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## comicbookman (Jun 17, 2015)

chirowes said:


> This is the only thread on TUG. As I said before, please feel free to remove it if you feel it violates your rules. Well I have owned rental property for years and my own business for years so really no huge stretch for me to rent vacation rental. Pretty simple really compared to the complexity of my other businesses over the years. I do have a bachelor in marketing and business and 20 years experience running a business, so this really was a piece of cake. This is just a hobby as I move toward retirement.



Just no experience in customer service apparently.


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## Bigrob (Jun 17, 2015)

scootr5 said:


> That seems to have happened pretty fast, going from learning about timeshares to a rental business in less than 90 days. Kudos to you for getting up to speed so quickly.



Scott, I think Wes (deliberately?) missed what I think was the point of your post. It certainly sounds like the intent from the beginning was to utilize the facebook page for promotion of a business rather than merely education and idea exchange. Hard to prove, but to your point, for the mission to have changed so dramatically and obviously indicates to me that the direction and intent was there from the beginning, which means the original posting shouldn't have made it to begin with. Unlike the FB page, however, the mods here give the benefit of the doubt and don't delete things just because they don't agree with them.

Fortunately, it sounds like Wes has been weeding out the real TUGGERs anyway. Any "forum" that discourages contributions from the people I've seen posting about it in this thread isn't a forum that I, or most anyone else who truly wants to LEARN about timeshares, would want to be a part of anyway.


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## scootr5 (Jun 17, 2015)

Bigrob said:


> Scott, I think Wes (deliberately?) missed what I think was the point of your post.



Yes, inflection and tone doesn't necessarily translate in the written word.


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## LisaH (Jun 17, 2015)

I have to day, it's pretty amazing that the guy is able to get 2000+ folks to join in less than 3 months. How would people find him on facebook, other than his initial posts here on TUG?


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## chirowes (Jun 17, 2015)

There are now over 3000 on my two groups. It is not that hard for someone who has done nothing but run and market a business for 20+ years to do. And, btw the mighty TUG has now decided to edit and delete part of my posts as they do not agree with their interest. I am sure it was not Brian who decided to pull the link, but others. How now will you keep people from searching Facebook for the [deleted]. Will you turn to deleting all my posts and threads as you all so swear that will never happen on TUG?


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## DeniseM (Jun 17, 2015)

chirowes - Perhaps you did not read my previous post - #115 in this thread.  

Promoting your own commercial website is a *violation of TUG's published posting rules*, which you agreed to when you registered for TUG.  

Whenever someone promotes their for-profit website, their commercial link is deleted from TUG.

If we had known that you were promoting a *rental website*, we would have deleted your first post.  However, you very successfully hid that info. for a long time.


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## scootr5 (Jun 17, 2015)

chirowes said:


> Btw this is the one and only reply I will make to all these posts. As I said, I am not here to argue, which is why the facebook page will be different than the Tug forum.



I counted a lot more posts after this one...


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## chirowes (Jun 17, 2015)

It is no more a rental website than any of the other groups on facebook, for all the other timeshares. Others besides myself post rentals on there all the times. See for yourself. It is the same as every other facebook page for timeshares except I just try to help some of the owners with rentals. Some I don't help at all. I did not do that from the start, just in the past few weeks. Twist it how you see fit. Haters gonna Hate

[commercial website name deleted]


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## DeniseM (Jun 17, 2015)

chirowes - I don't care if there are a million FB pages that rent timeshares - that has nothing to do with the TUG posting rules.

However, it's enlightening to see you show your true colors.

You are :this close: to getting banned from TUG - I recommend that you walk away.


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## chirowes (Jun 17, 2015)

Please feel free to refund my membership and ban me.


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## DeniseM (Jun 17, 2015)

Buh bye!  

*You know, I'm chuckling here, that you insist that you can do anything you want on your own website, but then challenge TUG's right to enforce their own *published posting rules*.  That's absolutely priceless! :rofl:


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