# Wyndham Timeshare



## ShouldITryWyndham (Jun 5, 2009)

We went to a Wyndham presentation last night and found it to seem much better than we thought it would.  While we didn't sign up for a full contract, we did sign up for an 18-month "trial" that comes with 308,000 points so we could try out the program.  It cost about $2500 and they said the cost of this could be rolled into a full contract if we sign up for one.  I wanted to start doing some research on this since we still have 6 days to rescind if it sounds like a bad deal.  We'd like the expert advice from the board members on whether or not this is a good deal and their overall opinion of Wyndham.

Thanks


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## lprstn (Jun 5, 2009)

ShouldITryWyndham said:


> We went to a Wyndham presentation last night and found it to seem much better than we thought it would.  While we didn't sign up for a full contract, we did sign up for an 18-month "trial" that comes with 308,000 points so we could try out the program.  It cost about $2500 and they said the cost of this could be rolled into a full contract if we sign up for one.  I wanted to start doing some research on this since we still have 6 days to rescind if it sounds like a bad deal.  We'd like the expert advice from the board members on whether or not this is a good deal and their overall opinion of Wyndham.
> 
> Thanks



RESCIND!!!! You could purchase at that price and get about 250K in points, why waste it to 'try it out'.

You want to try out timesharing check out www.wyndham-vacations.com and save tons of $$.


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## ShouldITryWyndham (Jun 5, 2009)

We're pretty new to this, where can you get a deal like that?  And then don't you have to buy into their Wyndham Conversion program thingy to be able to stay at resorts other than your home one?


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## ecwinch (Jun 5, 2009)

ShouldITryWyndham said:


> We're pretty new to this, where can you get a deal like that?  And then don't you have to buy into their Wyndham Conversion program thingy to be able to stay at resorts other than your home one?



You can get that deal by asking for it. It is not a "deal", it is a way to experience being a Wyndham owner.

You should rescind because you bought before you did any research. Would you buy a car that way?

Now $2500 is not a horrible deal for 300k of points. But you can do better. 

$2500 would enable you to rent two weeks of a timeshare rental.

It would allow you to buy a full 300k Wyndham membership. And probably have enough left over for maintenance fees for 2 years.

You need more time to research this. Rescind now to stop the clock from ticking, and then research it more. Once your recession period is over, you have no options but to enjoy your purchase.

Look at the Wyndham memberships for sale on e-bay. Look at other resort networks like Marriott, Hyatt, Hilton, Disney, and WorldMark. There are a lot of options out there.


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## vacationhopeful (Jun 5, 2009)

Ah, until earlier today you were free.  That Discovery Package is a very big marketing HOOK where you have prepaid for 2 1bdr vacations for $2500.  Those units could IMHO be rented for less than $1000 each which would include MF and the cost of a Guest Certificate.  
I am sure you got the VIP option included as 25% off the points at the 60 day prior to checkin - only available thru buying from Wyndham (and NOT the resale market).  Plus, the free upgrade to the next large size unit, if available.  VIP is the LINE used to reel you into the BUY only direct from Wyndham.  This is another marketing ploy, one which Wyndham keeps reducing (renting units thru Extra Holidays to the general population, limiting the number of free Guest Certificates, and restricting free Reservation Transactions).
Some of these changes might not seem to be aimed at you - after all you are going to quickly use up your 308,000pts.  But the experienced Wyndham owner might send each of their 3 adults kids on a vacation (1 free GC, the next two $99 or $129 each) where one vacation might have to be rebooked (another new GC $99/$129) along with another RT ($39).  Hopefully, none of these vacations need two reservations to make up the one 7 night stay as each reservation would require a GC.  Several short weekend stays will also eat up your allotted housekeeping credits (HK) which Wyndham will be happy to "sell" you more of.
Plus, there is the other issue called "point inflation".  Stay at older resorts and your 308,000 pts might get you 3 weeks of vacationing in a studio/1 bedroom size units.  But you love the idea of a beachfront unit with a sweeping view of the ocean (upper unit, oceanfront) might use all your 308,000 pts for 1 week.  Or you might not even have enough points.

But this is when you get landed into the boat.  105,000pts brought from Wyndham might only cost you $12-17,000.  308,000 pts might cost you $30-40,000 (but you will have that $2500 credit) and you get to keep VIP status.

But look at resale:  That $2500 you just spent (but you can still rescind) could buy you 350,000-600,000 Wyndham points on the resale (eBay is one popular marketplace).  The only options you will NOT be getting is VIP and Plus Partners (can buy into that package for $3-4,000).  You will have ARP, your "free" RCI Weeks account and availability to all the Wyndham resorts that any other deeded UDI owner can reserve.

Just think of the resale points as you buying a house from the guy who got TRANSFER vs from the original builder except you don't get to pick the color of your rug.  And you get a super, discount price with resale!  And you get to keep your almost ALL of your cash.

Yes, resale sounds too good to be true!  Who would sell such an expensive timeshare for pennies on the dollar?  Owners who can't pay the ever increasing maintenance fees, who can't travel anymore, who don't like booking vacations 12 months or more in advance, never learned how to use this product, brought a second home, lack of vacation time with work, etc.  Here on TUG, many people sell to "balance" their portfolio ==> they just own too many weeks and are unloading TSs which "don't fit" into their current plan.  (ie research TS addicts who regular swear to never look at eBay again).

So, read some more and figure out how to wisely spend your hard earned dollars.

And Welcome to TUG.


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## vacationhopeful (Jun 5, 2009)

Wyndham has been around for 20+ years.  Timesharing has been around for more than 30 years.  All during this time, the TS vacationing product has grown up into a complex product - which basicly was done to separate more people from more of their hard earned $$$$$.

Fixed Week.  Brought a certained week in a certain unit at one resort.

Floating Week.  Brought a certain season of the year for a certain SIZE unit at on resort.

Minisystem.  Developer allowed you to pick to use your size unit among several different properties they manage. Wyndham is basicly a minisystem.

Points.  Buy a fixed number of points to use to get differently size units within the minisystem at different times of the year.

Converted Week (either a fixed or floating week) to the points system.  Always had the owner spending way too much money.  Many times today, it is cheaper to buy an already converted week than to do a new CONVERSION.

Exchange companies.  More vocabulary that you can read about elsewhere.

Wyndham sales personnel do the "sales speak" to partially confuse you and to instill FEAR in buying a poor product on the resale market (a poor product that they might be selling at the table next to you).  ARP is Advanced Reservation Priority is your home resort booking advantage - where your points are DEEDED at and where your MF (maintenance fees) are calculated and collected for that HOA (Home Owners Association).  Having ARP is your payback to book at the 13 month mark before the hoards of Wyndham owners at the 10 month mark.  So you want beach/ocean in South Florida in the FEBRUARY - you absolutely NEED APR for that reservation or a FIXED Week 6-9.

Most here on TUG suggest you take 6 months to read and learn about timesharing.  You need to be able to understand exactly what you are buying and what you might want to buy.  Renting and visiting several different TS and minisystems.  Ask questions.  Research.  Then research some more.  At least, going to timeshares while you do all this hard work can be very enjoyable.


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## ShouldITryWyndham (Jun 5, 2009)

Thanks so much for the info.  It sounds like we're going to rescind.  We had no idea how inexpensive resale points would be (we only have experience with DVC and resale points aren't all that discounted due to ROFR).   

Please let me know if this is correct:

So if we pay the $2500 for the plus partners and $2500 for CW (I think that was the abbreviation they used - Conversion thing so that we can stay at other Wyndham resorts) it's still cheaper than buying outright from them.  It looks like you can buy a bunch for $1 (plus closing costs, etc.) on ebay - is this real?!?   Are there hidden fees or problems that we'll find if we purchase this way?
Thanks - any further info or guidance would be appreciated.

Also - RCI conversion - how much is the exchange fee when you bank the points?  I don't really understand how RCI works.  

Thanks.


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## ecwinch (Jun 5, 2009)

ShouldITryWyndham said:


> Thanks so much for the info.  It sounds like we're going to rescind.  We had no idea how inexpensive resale points would be (we only have experience with DVC and resale points aren't all that discounted due to ROFR).
> 
> Please let me know if this is correct:
> 
> ...



Plus Partners is a developer only added benefit. So with resale, you would not get those benefits. But there still are less expensive ways to attain similar benefits.

The e-bay deals are real. Closing costs are the only "gotchas" with them. Just locate a reputable seller (# transactions, good feedback), and find a reasonable price.

With Club Wyndham (their new name), you deposit points into RCI and receive an exchange week in return. The number of points you deposit determines the season and size of week you receive in return. You pay the standard RCI exchange fee when you exchange that week within RCI.

Just like DVC, points are points. The resort your points are tied to gives you an advanced reservation period at that resort, but other than that you can use your points at any of the Wyndham locations.


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## vacationhopeful (Jun 5, 2009)

"CW"???? Is this salesman speak for Club Wyndham?

If you buy UDI Wyndham points or a "converted fixed week to points" deed, Club Wyndham is the former called FairSharePlus (FSP) reservation system you use to book/use your points.  There has NEVER been a conversion cost to FSP.  Wyndham just rename FSP to become Club Wyndham.  FSP was too similiar to their OLD name of Fairfield Vacation Resorts.

As for Plus Partners, you might just want to lease an RCI Points timeshare for those nightly stays at RCI points resorts.  You get a "free" RCI Weeks membership with Wyndham points account (not with a fixed week unit, but then you aren't paying a $.53 per thousand point MF either).  

Banking points use a reservation transaction (RT); just plan a little as only one RT is use for all transaction done in one calendar day.  RCI Weeks is an exchange system ... more learning and reading.


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## timeos2 (Jun 5, 2009)

*It is real - only buy resale*

Buy resale - the low prices for the system are real. Plus Partners - like most "perks" are overpriced and not worth worrying about. With a little research - similar to finding out about resale vs retail prices on the CW (fomer FSP) points - you can find ways to get the same or better deals without the cost of Plus Partners. Concentrate on what each piece costs & how to best (most inexpensively) obtain it.  Step one is buy Wyndham Points RESALE - never retail or Discovery Program - and then look for options on the features of Plus Partners. Most of all enjoy yourself as you vacation on resale poits for pennies on the retail dollar.


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## ausman (Jun 5, 2009)

You did very well, didn't buckle under the timeshare salesman's onslaught of mis-information and lies. Then decided to test it out at minimal cost. Wish I had done that too.

The advice is very good, rescind, learn more, and purchase on Ebay.

That $2,500 in the current market would allow you to take over an existing contract, for possibly $0 - $500, paying $400 closing fee and $125 transfer fee, and depending on the desirability of the deal some past MF, say 5 mths $500.

So, for approx. 500 + 400 + 125 + 500 = $1,525 OR LESS, perhaps more you could obtain the same amount of points.


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## ShouldITryWyndham (Jun 6, 2009)

Thank you to everyone for all the helpful advice, I wrote up the letter to rescind this morning.  It has to include the member number, contract number, rep and number, signed, and sent certified mail.  Am I missing anything?


I have another newb question:  If we buy a wyndham points resale off Ebay will we be able to use it at the 60 some odd wyndham vacation resorts properties throughout the US or just at our home resort?


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## EAM (Jun 6, 2009)

ecwinch said:


> Plus Partners is a developer only added benefit. So with resale, you would not get those benefits. But there still are less expensive ways to attain similar benefits.
> 
> ...
> Just like DVC, points are points. The resort your points are tied to gives you an advanced reservation period at that resort, but other than that you can use your points at any of the Wyndham locations.



In the past, resale purchasers have been able to pay a fee (abt $2500 plus small additional ongoing fees) to have Plus Partners added to their accounts.  I do not know if this is still an option.  The initial fee is waived with a developer purchase.

Wyndham maintenance fees are the sum of the fees you pay to the Wyndham VOA (vacation owners association) and the specific resort's owners' association.  Some resort's have higher fees than others.  Resort currently in sales may have artificially low fees.  Resorts with unusually low fees may not have sufficient reserves and a special assessment may arise.  IMHO, if you buy resale, buy either at a resort you would want ARP privileges at or at a resort with low-moderate fees.


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## timeos2 (Jun 6, 2009)

*Same Points Same Resorts*



ShouldITryWyndham said:


> I have another newb question:  If we buy a wyndham points resale off Ebay will we be able to use it at the 60 some odd wyndham vacation resorts properties throughout the US or just at our home resort?



Points are points. You can use yours - no matter how you purchased them - at every Wyndham points resort. You are in no way tied to your home resort with the small exception of the extra 3 month reservation period (13 months instead of 10) that you have only at your home resort.


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## Bill4728 (Jun 6, 2009)

timeos2 said:


> Points are points. You can use yours - no matter how you purchased them - at every Wyndham points resort. You are in no way tied to your home resort with the small exception of the extra 3 month reservation period (13 months instead of 10) that you have only at your home resort.


This is basically true but there is a big IF.  you can use points at other resorts to reserve room at the 10 month mark *IF there are rooms available.* At some older resorts in very high demand locations. The current owners have fixed week or fixed super high demand seasons. So there are almost never rooms available for point reservations. This isn't true at the newer wyndham resorts where everyone is in Club Wyndham, but mostly at older resorts or ones taken over/bought out by Wyndham. 

BUT again, for <$2000 ( including closing cost) you can buy a week or two at a wyndham resort which comes with between 150K - 300K points. You will not get Plus Partners, but the huge price difference makes this not so bad.  Just be sure that you buy a week which is already in points. Paying to convert a week isn't smart.  

Good Luck


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## ecwinch (Jun 6, 2009)

Bill4728 said:


> This is basically true but there is a big IF.  you can use points at other resorts to reserve room at the 10 month mark *IF there are rooms available.* At some older resorts in very high demand locations. The current owners have fixed week or fixed super high demand seasons. So there are almost never rooms available for point reservations. This isn't true at the newer wyndham resorts where everyone is in Club Wyndham, but mostly at older resorts or ones taken over/bought out by Wyndham.
> 
> BUT again, for <$2000 ( including closing cost) you can buy a week or two at a wyndham resort which comes with between 150K - 300K points. You will not get Plus Partners, but the huge price difference makes this not so bad.  Just be sure that you buy a week which is already in points. Paying to convert a week isn't smart.
> 
> Good Luck



Bill, I absolutely agree with you and you make a good point when/if she decides to venture into the resale market. For those older resorts, if you really want to go there, then you need to buy at that resort or recognize that you will have really plan in advance to go there.

But in the resale pts vs developer pts analysis I think the issue is moot. Unless Wyndham were to reverse course, and start building smaller resorts in high-demand areas. Then a new purchase ARP would have some value. With the Mega-Resorts they want to build now, I think the supply/demand equation makes it the same.


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## ShouldITryWyndham (Jun 10, 2009)

*Thanks!*

Thanks!  This has all been very helpful.  You've all helped to clear up some of the "sales speak" that made resale sound less desirable.  We're still learning and looking into some resale.  We already rescinded - first by mail then I actually walked a letter, etc. in to the local branch and got a receipt so that I know it's finished.

One more question - we often do long weekends of half weeks for vacations - are timeshares still a good way to go for this type of travel?  It's not always the case but since we have to travel to visit family or to go to weddings, etc. our time gets broken up into smaller chunks.  Would a timeshare still make sense and would Wyndham still be a good one to go with?

Thanks,
C&B


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## muskitties (Jun 10, 2009)

I bought this same Discovery Package for $2,500.  It's not a good deal.  However, it is a nice way to tryout and learn the Wyndham system, and decide if the product works for you and your family.  After we used these points and learned the system, we happily bought annual Wyndham points resale on ebay.  

So if you want to purchase this Discovery Package for $2,500 to see if you like the Wyndham experience, you should do so.  But don't think that Wyndham is giving you a great deal.  You can easily purchase well over 308,000 annual points on the resale market through ebay for well under $2,500.


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## Lisa P (Jun 11, 2009)

Points-based mini-systems require more points for Friday and Saturday nights than for weeknights.  So if you want to use timeshare for 3-night weekends that include the full weekend (Thu/Fri/Sat nights or Fri/Sat/Sun nights), you'll probably find that they're not that cost effective.  OTOH, if you want to use them for short stays that only include one weekend night (ex.,Sat/Sun/Mon nights), they work fine.  Same with full weeks.  Midweek stays, all midweek nights, are the points-stretcher bargains.

For singles or couples who are happy with hotel rooms, arrangements with Priceline and hotel wholesalers and discounters can be more of a deal for short stays too.  Priceline only guarantees a room that sleeps 2, non-smoking, no mini-fridge, etc and sometimes added "resort" fees.  With a family or for people who want the space and amenities of a condo, good resale timeshares can still be an excellent deal.

And once you determine the cost-effectiveness question, YES, points-based programs are the way to go when you'll want varying length-of-stay vacations in condos or suites.  Make sure the system has resorts where YOUR family wants to stay.  We do this with our Wyndham points for at least one or two reservations per year.  HTH.


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## jgirvine (Jun 11, 2009)

*Another thing to think about before you buy resale*

II or RCI

I recently became a Wyndham owner.  Found out that some Wyndham resorts are affiliated with RCI and other with II.  Membership in either RCI or II comes with your Wyndham ownership, (yes, even resale).  So, before you buy, decide which you want and then buy a contract that is afflicted with that trading company.  I actually bought 2 contracts, one affiliated with RCI and one with II.  I wanted II.  So, I bought the II contract first and then the RCI one, that then puts all the points in one account that I can then deposit all points or some with II.  Man, did that make sense?  Kinda of complicated, but bottom line....education.
Good luck.
Ginny


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## Bill4728 (Jun 11, 2009)

jgirvine said:


> II or RCI
> 
> I recently became a Wyndham owner.  Found out that some Wyndham resorts are affiliated with RCI and other with II.  Membership in either RCI or II comes with your Wyndham ownership, (yes, even resale).  So, before you buy, decide which you want and then buy a contract that is afflicted with that trading company.  I actually bought 2 contracts, one affiliated with RCI and one with II.  I wanted II.  So, I bought the II contract first and then the RCI one, that then puts all the points in one account that I can then deposit all points or some with II.  Man, did that make sense?  Kinda of complicated, but bottom line....education.
> Good luck.
> Ginny


If like Ginny, you want to trade your wyndham with II, because almost all the wyndham resorts are in RCI and only a handful in II, you'll need to carefully look at the resort to determine if it is one of those few wyndham resorts in II.


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## ShouldITryWyndham (Jun 12, 2009)

Thank you all very much, this has been incredibly helpful.  If you buy resale do you have to pay the annual fee to have access to RCI?  Along with the fee to exchange your points into RCI?


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## jgirvine (Jun 12, 2009)

Your annual fee to II or RCI is included with the Wyndham purchase.  You DO have to pay the trade fee.

I wanted II, as we can travel last minute, and I liked what I saw in II for last minute more so than RCI.

Ginny


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