# Hyatt ROFR question



## benjaminb13 (Jun 14, 2008)

Hopefully Kal gets this- just checked out your website and saw 1880 units for Beach House and Sierra passing at 10500 in 2008. 
Just seems really low- or- they are not excercising rofr this year- 
Any insight on this ?


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## Kal (Jun 15, 2008)

My understanding is that Hyatt is being very selective in what resales it will take under ROFR.  It appears they are more interested in the 2200 point weeks at bargain prices.


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## benjaminb13 (Jun 15, 2008)

Hi Kal- Just trying to understand, Is hyatt not attempting to ROFR anythining below 2000 pts in 2008?
In 2007 they rofrd me at 11500 for 1880for Sierra-I know I couldnt get my 2000 point beach house for less than 15000  back then-But in 2008  1880s going for 10,500? Just seems really low--If this is the case, and Hyatt isnt rOFRing 1880s-  Everyone should just sell what they have and buy 1880 weeks for 8 or 9000 each?


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## timeos2 (Jun 15, 2008)

*Why can't the believers understand?*

The house of cards that is ROFR does nothing to prop up resale prices or protect owners. When the Developer wants they can play  - if not the owners, buyers, sellers are left hanging out to dry. If you haven't figured it out yet I'm surprised as far too many posts have appeared explaining that no one but developers benefit.  Any alleged value to sellers, as in higher resale prices, is a myth used by Developers to string owners along ("Hey, we protect your value with ROFR"). Of course it is FAR too late when you realize that, like retail price, you have been sold a bridge in Brooklyn and they have no desire to prop up the prices but may, given the right deal, steal low ball resales from legitimate  buyers. I hope by now you know that depending on ROFR as the "bottom" value of your timeshare is at best wishful thinking.


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## benjaminb13 (Jun 15, 2008)

timeos2 said:


> The house of cards that is ROFR does nothing to prop up resale prices or protect owners. When the Developer wants they can play  - if not the owners, buyers, sellers are left hanging out to dry. If you haven't figured it out yet I'm surprised as far too many posts have appeared explaining that no one but developers benefit.  Any alleged value to sellers, as in higher resale prices, is a myth used by Developers to string owners along ("Hey, we protect your value with ROFR"). Of course it is FAR too late when you realize that, like retail price, you have been sold a bridge in Brooklyn and they have no desire to prop up the prices but may, given the right deal, steal low ball resales from legitimate  buyers. I hope by now you know that depending on ROFR as the "bottom" value of your timeshare is at best wishful thinking.



WOW----It sure seems like,, from what you say, you are the only one who has figured this all out. Unlike all those others who who have posted on this board.
Anyway, Im not interested in ROFR lowering or increasing  the resale value. II am interested in improving my position and getting as much vacation time and enjoy my timeshares- 
Like most  other tuggers without infinite knowledge, If  I can land my 2 or 3 1880s for the price of one 2200 week Ill sell mine and buy the 1880s.
so its always good to check into the ROFR situation


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## AwayWeGo (Jun 15, 2008)

*Not The Only 1 -- But It Takes Some Of Us A While To Catch On.*




benjaminb13 said:


> WOW----It sure seems like,, from what you say, you are the only one who has figured this all out. Unlike all those others who who have posted on this board.
> Anyway, Im not interested in ROFR lowering or increasing  the resale value. II am interested in improving my position and getting as much vacation time and enjoy my timeshares-
> Like most  other tuggers without infinite knowledge, If  I can land my 2 or 3 1880s for the price of one 2200 week Ill sell mine and buy the 1880s.
> so its always good to check into the ROFR situation


He's not the only 1.  A few of us in addition to timeos2 have given it the best effort we can to spell out for the benefit of others that ROFR = ROFL, taking pains to explain why that's so & illustrating how timeshare ROFR works in the real world.  

I have no horse in the race, no dog in the fight, nothing whatever riding on whether people do or do not catch on to the reality of timeshare ROFR.  Because of that, it's hard to generate the energy to go through it 1 more time, & I applaud timeos2 for his willingness to keep at it regardless -- an apt example of the saying that _A Prophet Is Not Without Honor Save In His Own Country_. 

About all I can muster the energy to do now, after so many previous tries at showing why ROFR = ROFL, is to suggest that those seriously interested in timeshare ROFR do a TUG-BBS search for ROFR = ROFL & read up on it. 

I am optimist enough to believe that if people buckle down & apply their grey matter, eventually the light of understanding will dawn. 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## benjaminb13 (Jun 16, 2008)

AwayWeGo said:


> He's not the only 1.  A few of us in addition to timeos2 have given it the best effort we can to spell out for the benefit of others that ROFR = ROFL, taking pains to explain why that's so & illustrating how timeshare ROFR works in the real world.
> 
> I have no horse in the race, no dog in the fight, nothing whatever riding on whether people do or do not catch on to the reality of timeshare ROFR.  Because of that, it's hard to generate the energy to go through it 1 more time, & I applaud timeos2 for his willingness to keep at it regardless -- an apt example of the saying that _A Prophet Is Not Without Honor Save In His Own Country_.
> 
> ...



Right,....Timeos2 and his disciple away we go--
This board should be a safe haven for people to ask their questions without having to deal with  righteous People like yourself who try to bully others into not asking questions and "using their grey matter."  You 
have too much time on their hands and need to get back to work-
At any rate, your the last person Id take advise from so keep your ROFR=ROFL
my questions were directed at Kal who is very helpful and not condescending.


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## mesamirage (Jun 16, 2008)

I'm not sure why NON-Hyatt owners jump over to our board just because we talk about ROFR... they must do a daily search on ROFR.

ROFR has it merits and it has worked to my advantage NOT the developer... regardless of folks opinions... it has *MADE* me money on a purchase and sell. 

Do I think its needed with a quality resort like Hyatt... nope because Hyatt holds it value due to the quality of the resorts and system.


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## benjaminb13 (Jun 16, 2008)

mesamirage said:


> I'm not sure why NON-Hyatt owners jump over to our board just because we talk about ROFR... they must do a daily search on ROFR.
> 
> ROFR has it merits and it has work to my advantage NOT the developer... regardless of folks opinions... it has *MADE* me money on a purchase and sell.
> 
> Do I think its needed with a quality resort like Hyatt... nope because Hyatt holds it value due to the quality of the resorts and system.



That was my first thought as well, Mesa.And thats what got to me.
I was looking for feedback from Hyatt owners and instead get these two "self proclaimed gurus" who arent even Hyatt owners jump right in. They are shocked and surprised that no-one else has figured out the truth about ROFR--- except themselves... and let you know it- They assume everyone should know the secret formula ROFR=ROFL
Unbelievable, I just  I wanted feedback from a HYatt owner.


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## Kal (Jun 16, 2008)

The concept that Hyatt needs some sort of mechanism like ROFR to support pricing has little if any merit for this hotel system.  With the enormous quality of the Hyatt system and a high consumer demand, they have the luxury of raising their sales prices 2-3 times every year.  The truth to be known on ROFR is one of pure sales economics.

If a vendor can obtain a product at a very deep discount then turn around a sell it at full retail pricing, that's a smart business decision.  In the case with resale timeshares when there are two buyers, Hyatt holds the trump card as there is no bidding process to set the purchase price.  If the price meets the criteria in the purchase model (i.e. ROFR) Hyatt takes the unit and the potential resale buyer walks.

Then it's pure profit as Hyatt adds the unit into their inventory and sells it at a very nice profit.  There's no sharing of profit with an external developer and they don't discount their selling price.  To me that sounds like a smart business savy.

The thought that ROFR somehow acts as an artificial price support might be the case at lesser timeshare resorts.   The Hyatt system is one of the top two in the industry and they don't need to play games like elsewhere.  Resale pricing continues to be established by the traditional buyer and seller, but if the deal is too good Hyatt enjoys a nice profit.  Other owners sit on the sidelines and wish they could have gotten that deal.  It's simply not a situation where Hyatt is taking action to support the value of those owners' units.


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## timeos2 (Jun 16, 2008)

*La La Land is a wonderful place to live until it ends*



Kal said:


> It's simply not a situation where Hyatt is taking action to support the value of those owners' units.



So simple. So factual. Be careful Kal or you too may become too informed and a know it all.  

Stating facts that conflict with owners rose colored beliefs is heresy. We all know the true facts are only supplied in 90 minute presentations, supported by other semi-informed or hopeful BBS postings but never through actual experience in the timeshare marketplace.  Let the dream live!


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## Kal (Jun 16, 2008)

That's good advice and I'll promptly file it for safekeeping.  Hmmm, the appropriate file folder would be "Timeshare Conspiracy".

I am a bit perplexed tho.  In the last 3 weeks a friend purchased a Hyatt Sunset Harbor unit (resale) for $15,500.  When I check with Hyatt's sales people the exact equivalent unit is being sold by Hyatt at $38,000 (5% discount available to current Hyatt owners).  This seems to counter the ROFR Conspiracy Theory advocated here as the resort is 99% sold out.


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## Floridaski (Jun 16, 2008)

*Not sure I want to get into this but....*

I am not sure I want to post on this thread.  But, I have to defend Kal and other people who take their time to answer Hyatt related questions.

Kal has never pretended to know everything about the Hyatt or any other HIGH END timeshare system.

I find it very amusing that the people who blast these HIGH END systems like Hyatt - do not even own any weeks at these types of timeshares.  I am sure what these folks own is very nice, but I find it very unfair to be critical of a system that you do not have a vested interest in ownership.  

All Hyatt owners know about ROFR and all Hyatt resale purchasers sweat out ROFR when they place their offers.  It is not a science and it is really based on the simple consumer demands of the market.  

I do not think anyone would try to say that our economy is not in "slow" cycle and many folks have less cash to spend on things like timeshares.  So, I am not at all surprised that some 1880 point weeks are passing ROFR at lower price points then in the past.  Hyatt is not going to purchase a unit on ROFR if it does not think they can sell the unit quickly.  

Anyway, I am actually surprised at the tone of some posts - but it does make amusing reading.....


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## timeos2 (Jun 16, 2008)

Kal said:


> That's good advice and I'll promptly file it for safekeeping.  Hmmm, the appropriate file folder would be "Timeshare Conspiracy".
> 
> I am a bit perplexed tho.  In the last 3 weeks a friend purchased a Hyatt Sunset Harbor unit (resale) for $15,500.  When I check with Hyatt's sales people the exact equivalent unit is being sold by Hyatt at $38,000 (5% discount available to current Hyatt owners).  This seems to counter the ROFR Conspiracy Theory advocated here as the resort is 99% sold out.



And certainly seems to disprove the "ROFR protects resale value" line of thinking. Thanks for taking my comment in the light hearted way it was intended. And for shedding light on the fallacy of ROFR being for owners. Always enjoy your posts and the obvious knowledge behind them.


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## AwayWeGo (Jun 16, 2008)

*High End Timeshares, Shmy End Timeshares --  R. O. F. R. Still = R. O. F. L. Mox Nix.*




Floridaski said:


> I have to defend Kal and other people who take their time to answer Hyatt related questions.
> 
> Kal has never pretended to know everything about the Hyatt or any other HIGH END timeshare system.
> 
> I find it very amusing that the people who blast these HIGH END systems like Hyatt - do not even own any weeks at these types of timeshares.


Shux, I don't pretend to _any_ knowledge of Hyatt, but I would be surprised beyond amazement if ROFR as applied to Hyatt timeshares is different in any way from ROFR as applied to any timeshare company's timeshares, _mox nix_. 

High end, low end, or somewhere in the middle, ROFR = ROFL. 

Just to be clear, pointing out that ROFR = ROFL in no way represents any kind of blast against Hyatt timeshare resorts or the Hyatt timeshare company.  Pointing out that ROFR = ROFL -- irrespective of the timeshare company involved -- is no more than telling it the way it is. 

Also, I'm pretty sure -- & by all means correct me if I'm wrong -- that it is all right (according to TUG-BBS rules) for TUG-BBS members & guests to participate in all TUG-BBS areas & topics of discussion.  That is to say, the dedicated Hyatt Forum (if there actually were 1) would not be off-limits to non-owners of Hyatt timeshares.  

I like to have fun with timeshares & timesharing, & I like to extend timeshare fun vicariously throughout the year via Internet, mainly at TUG-BBS.  I like to kid around & digress way beyond timeshare-related topics.  I like to interact with all manner of fellow TUG-BBS folks, including the high-enders, even though I'm a bargain-hunting bottom feeder myself (not that there's anything wrong with that).  I like to provoke discussion & to provoke thought, but not to provoke people or to offend anybody.  

Best advice I can offer regarding _The Wisdom Of Uncle Alan_ is, _Take What You Like & Leave The Rest_. 

So it goes. 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## DMSTWO (Jun 17, 2008)

> I like to provoke discussion & to provoke thought, but not to provoke people or to offend anybody.



Uncle Alan,

Accepting the fact that you did not intend to  offend anyone it is unfortunate that some took your post that way.

I do have a suggestion that might help you in future TUG forays.

In the world of emails and BBSs *bold* or all CAP entries are considered to be the equivalent of shouting at someone.  Using proper email etiquette, like normal fonts, will go a long way toward people accepting your posts as casual dialog instead of a lecture or sarcastic tirade


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## mesamirage (Jun 17, 2008)

*Shux*, No one is suggesting you don't have the right to post or join a discussion... *Golly gee* no way... I think its more of why are you wasting your time hopping into Hyatt forums out of nowhere?? By your own post you can barely *Muster *the energy for a reply. 



AwayWeGo said:


> About all I can muster the energy to do now,


 
I don't want to see you give your last ounce of energy just so that you can help people (in your own words)



AwayWeGo said:


> apply their grey matter, eventually the light of understanding will dawn.


 
*Shux*, I now hope my grey matter will kick in and I can fully understand how ROFR made me money on both my Hyatt purchase and when I sold a Hyatt. 

As far as the empty promise from the developer about ROFR... thats not part of the discussion from my perspective since, *Shux*, I never plan to ever purchase retail.

I'm glad we can provide a forum for your entertainment and that you can live thru the Hyatt owners. I will not be posting again to this post since I know it only goes to continue your quest of entertainment thru the boards.

*Shux*, I think you will have to start a new search for the keyword "ROFR" so you can *muster *up a bit more energy to hop into another discussion.

Cheers! I can send you some pictures of our Hyatt vacations if that makes you feel closer to the action.


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## AwayWeGo (Jun 17, 2008)

*Energy Level Is O. K., Thanks.*




mesamirage said:


> By your own post you can barely *Muster *the energy for a reply.


Plenty of stamina to reply, just not for spelling out yet again why it is that ROFR = ROFL. 

Folks seriously interested in looking into it can do a TUG-BBS search. 

Others who'd rather stick with what they already believe can stand pat.  

_Mox nix_ to me either way. 

Is this a great country or what ? 

Thanks for interacting. 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## AwayWeGo (Jun 17, 2008)

*I Never Use Boldface.  (Well, Hardly Ever.)*




DMSTWO said:


> Uncle Alan,
> 
> Accepting the fact that you did not intend to  offend anyone it is unfortunate that some took your post that way.
> 
> ...


Thanks. 

I am sure you are completely right about that, & I agree with most of your recommendations.  That is, I hardly ever use boldface on TUG-BBS or anywhere.  Ditto all-caps. 

However that may be, I nearly always write TUG-BBS entries in what the drop-down fonts menu calls _Comic Sans MS_*,* Size 3. 

What more appropriate lettering style -- comic, that is -- for the (mostly) light-hearted & semi-whimsical entries I sling here at TUG-BBS ?  No need for anyone to take 1 bit of this stuff seriously.  As you can tell from the ongoing dialog in this particular topic of discussion, there is little risk of that. 

Also, not trying to offend anybody is no guarantee that some folks won't get honked off anyway.  Nobody always likes everybody.  That's no reason not to participate in the give & take of TUG-BBS discussions with as much good humor as possible. 

It is unfortunate, however, if people's irritation at my or manner or my irreverence makes it even harder than it already is for folks to grasp why it is that timeshare ROFR = ROFL.  I've tried sugar-coating it & have used various ways explaining it & illustrating it at various times, as have others on TUG-BBS who caught on to it way before I did.  So it goes. 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## benjaminb13 (Jun 18, 2008)

AwayWeGo said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I am sure you are completely right about that, & I agree with most of your recommendations.  That is, I hardly ever use boldface on TUG-BBS or anywhere.  Ditto all-caps.
> 
> ...



Problem with you is you LIE too much- and throw out a lot of bones, and you expect people to buy it- 
Everyone here knows you are just trying to push buttons.  You keep saying you are not trying to offend anybody.  but you know very well that others see you as offensive and irritating- and you enjoy it after all its all in good humor.


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## middleoforchid (Jun 18, 2008)

benjaminb13 and mesamirage---where are your manners???


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## benjaminb13 (Jun 18, 2008)

You are right -  
my apologies to all
Lets move on


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