# Jupiter - Leaving Ritz Carlton Club?



## nakyak (Apr 8, 2014)

Been a member in Jupiter for a few years now and also own MVCI although I am unable to use my MVCI Points at Jupiter because I am not Premier.

While playing golf over the last few weeks in Jupiter there was some talk among certain folks about  not renewing the contract with Ritz-Carlton to manage the property beyond this year.  

The property has been through a lot of changes the last few years and after seeing the loss of Bachelor Gulch and Kapalua I suspect Ritz is going to be out of  there sooner or later.

Is MVCI still promoting Jupiter as an opportunity for owners to upgrade their point values during their presentations?  Has anyone been successful in booking Jupiter with MVCI points in 2015?


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## FractionalTraveler (Apr 8, 2014)

nakyak said:


> Been a member in Jupiter for a few years now and also own MVCI although I am unable to use my MVCI Points at Jupiter because I am not Premier.
> 
> While playing golf over the last few weeks in Jupiter there was some talk among certain folks about  not renewing the contract with Ritz-Carlton to manage the property beyond this year.
> 
> ...



The golf course was sold to Trump last year so RC does not manage it anymore.

The RC residences are still property of RC and they are part of the explorer collection.

We have stayed there three times in the last 2 years using DC points.  Its very nice. We plan on booking again for thanksgiving in a 4-BR for the family.

FT


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## WBP (Apr 8, 2014)

There is an important distinct difference between the Jupiter club and the once Bachelor Gulch club. At Jupiter, some entity related to the Marriott Vacation Club Trust owns several of the fractional homes. With that ownership, comes voting rights and decision making rights, and I'm not sure how influential Marriott's stake in Jupiter may be in effecting the outcome of a succession vote.

Further, the management of the Jupiter Club and golf course is now in the hands of the Trump organization, so I'm not sure how much would be gained by the fractional owners in Jupiter if they voted Marriott Vacation Club out. If they did that, they may lower their annual fees, but, they would lose their reciprocal usage with the few remaining Ritz-Carlton Clubs, and any remaining benefits that they enjoy at Ritz-Carlton Hotels.


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## FractionalTraveler (Apr 8, 2014)

WJS said:


> The fractional owners and whole ownership homeowners are probably fed up with Marriott Vacation Club's amateur attempts to be a luxury provider, which they are not, and with Marriott Vacation Club Marriottizing The Ritz-Carlton Club.
> 
> I'd not be the least bit surprised if the Jupiter fractional and whole ownership owners send The Ritz-Carlton Club and Marriott Vaction Club packing, as did the former Ritz-Carlton Club, Bachelor Gulch owners. I'd speculate that if a credible market research orgazination like Gallup or J.D. Powers surveyed the Bachelor Gulch owners today, that the vast majority of them would say that they are much more pleased with the Timbers organization than they were with Marriott Vacation Club, and with Marriott Vacation Club's ill-fated attempts to represent themselves as The Ritz-Carlton Club.
> 
> In my opinion, Marriott Vacation Club should do what it's uniquely qualified and best doing, managing timeshare resorts.



Not sure why you believe the owners are not happy.  The property is beautiful and Trump managing the golf course is not a bad thing in my opinion.

My understanding of the Bachelor Gulch situation was that they didn't want to be a part of MVCI not that the management was bad. That property was sold out prior to MVCI so the owners could decide their own future without needing Marriott.

Wasn't the global recession more of an impact on the owners ability to continue to pay the MF than bad management?

FT


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## EducatedConsumer (Apr 8, 2014)

FractionalTraveler said:


> Not sure why you believe the owners are not happy.  The property is beautiful and Trump managing the golf course is not a bad thing in my opinion.
> 
> My understanding of the Bachelor Gulch situation was that they didn't want to be a part of MVCI not that the management was bad. That property was sold out prior to MVCI so the owners could decide their own future without needing Marriott.
> 
> ...



Unfortunately, two relevant websites were taken down:

http://www.hoabachelorgulch.com/1042.pdf

http://www.hoabachelorgulch.com/correspondence.htm

On those sites, there was a very credible snapshot of sentiment of The Ritz-Carlton Club, Bachelor Gulch Members' towards The Ritz-Carlton Club and Marriott Vacation Club, and a very credible report of the consultants retained by The Ritz-Carlton Club, Bachelor Gulch Homeowners Association, HVS Shared Ownership division in Miami, Florida.

http://www.hvs.com/services/sharedownershipservices/

If my memory is right, it was said that the Bachelor Gulch membership had ill feelings towards Marriott Vacation Club, hence, a driving force in their desire to find a replacement for their former management company (and to do something that was perceived to be unanticipated, to sacrifice their affiliation with The Ritz-Carlton Club and The Ritz-Carlton Hotel Company).

No, I do not believe that the global recession was the driving force in the HOA's decision making to change management company's.


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## FractionalTraveler (Apr 8, 2014)

EducatedConsumer said:


> Unfortunately, two relevant websites were taken down:
> 
> http://www.hoabachelorgulch.com/1042.pdf
> 
> ...



We discussed all that Bachelor Gulch stuff you are referring to here on Tug.  See this thread: http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=175113&page=2 specifically post #44-46.

After reading all that material, I was left with the impression that owners were opposed to joining MVCI because it would unfairly give access to their property to MVCI owners who did not pay anywhere near what the RC owners paid.  That was their main issue with MVCI.

Timbers just like Equity Estates, Exclusive Resorts, and Quintess cater to a certain type of luxury consumer that RC owners were interested in maintaining their affinity with.  I cant blame them for that. That's what they signed up for when they invested over $100K in some of these assets.  If I had made that investment, I wouldn't want $5,000 MVCI resale owners to get access to my club either.

Regretfully MVCI had to deal with lots of unsold inventory in the RC destination club because of the global recession.  They did what they could to save the brand they helped create based upon the MVCI timeshare business.

I would agree that continuing to evaluate the sale of RC properties would be in the best interest of us VAC shareholders.  It would be a good business decision to continue with our asset light strategy and get rid of excess land and assets that are underperforming.  The brand will be much stronger in the long run.

FT


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## nakyak (Apr 9, 2014)

Trump taking over the golf operations was a good thing even though not all Members are happy about it.  Trump has improved the course and has a vision for it which is more than I can say about Ritz-Carlton.

As someone who has been a member with Ritz since 2004 I have watched many changes take place.  After 2010 I watched more and more changes that adversely affected the member base.  The loss of Clubs is alarming and I believe the Board at Bachelor Gulch acted in the best interest of their owners and kept the integrity of their Club by electing to go with Timbers.  


I can debate this all day but I still interested if we have any answers for the following questions.

Is MVCI still promoting Jupiter as a reason to upgrade during their sales presentations and more importantly (and telling if something is up) is any MVCI owner able to book into 2015 with their points at Jupiter?


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## dash (Apr 9, 2014)

*Yes. They are*

Yes
I was at a preso on Sunday, and the Jupiter property was the highlight of the enticement.


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## FractionalTraveler (Apr 9, 2014)

nakyak said:


> Trump taking over the golf operations was a good thing even though not all Members are happy about it.  Trump has improved the course and has a vision for it which is more than I can say about Ritz-Carlton.
> 
> As someone who has been a member with Ritz since 2004 I have watched many changes take place.  After 2010 I watched more and more changes that adversely affected the member base.  The loss of Clubs is alarming and I believe the Board at Bachelor Gulch acted in the best interest of their owners and kept the integrity of their Club by electing to go with Timbers.
> 
> ...



Yes, a Premier DC member can book the property today by calling owner services.

FT


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## nakyak (Apr 9, 2014)

FractionalTraveler said:


> Yes, a Premier DC member can book the property today by calling owner services.
> 
> FT




2015 dates?


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## FractionalTraveler (Apr 9, 2014)

nakyak said:


> 2015 dates?



As a member of the RC since 2004, I would recommend you call RC at (866)770-2619 or MVCI owner services at (800) 845-4226 and ask for the specific dates you are interested in booking.

FT


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## nakyak (Apr 9, 2014)

FractionalTraveler said:


> As a member of the RC since 2004, I would recommend you call RC at (866)770-2619 or MVCI owner services at (800) 845-4226 and ask for the specific dates you are interested in booking.
> 
> FT




Thanks, however I do not have more than 6500 points with MVCI therefore the Owner Services will not provide me any information.  I'm just curious if the dates you were looking for with points in Jupiter are in 2015.

I am however able to exchange my dates for 2015 through the normal route with member services.


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## FractionalTraveler (Apr 9, 2014)

nakyak said:


> Thanks, however I do not have more than 6500 points with MVCI therefore the Owner Services will not provide me any information.  I'm just curious if the dates you were looking for with points in Jupiter are in 2015.
> 
> I am however able to exchange my dates for 2015 through the normal route with member services.



My understanding is that if you are not premier level (6500 points) you can't make a reservation at the RC residences.  Also, I haven't seen any RC properties in Interval International for exchange.

Are you saying you can exchange into RC properties through Interval?

I must have misunderstood, I though you had mentioned being a RC destination Club member since 2004 or was that for the RC Hotels?

FT


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## dioxide45 (Apr 9, 2014)

FractionalTraveler said:


> My understanding is that if you are not premier level (6500 points) you can't make a reservation at the RC residences.  Also, I haven't seen any RC properties in Interval International for exchange.
> 
> Are you saying you can exchange into RC properties through Interval?
> 
> ...



Doesn't Ritz have an internal exchange program like DC where they can book in to other Ritz properties?


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## FractionalTraveler (Apr 9, 2014)

dioxide45 said:


> Doesn't Ritz have an internal exchange program like DC where they can book in to other Ritz properties?



Yes, but the OP had to purchase a portfolio membership and not a club membership.

The club membership was limited to your home residence only.  They later introduced the more flexible portfolio membership which allowed for the internal exchanges.

I'm not sure which one the OP actually owns.  He did say that they owned less than 6500 DC points.  I don't know what RC fractional interest would actually equate to less than 6500 points since most of the fractions were sold in 28 day increments.  I would have thought because of the high initial investment that it would transfer to much more than that.

I know of several Grand Residence owners who were given well over 30K DC points for their 28 day fractions.

FT


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## nakyak (Apr 10, 2014)

FractionalTraveler said:


> *Yes, but the OP had to purchase a portfolio membership and not a club membership.
> 
> The club membership was limited to your home residence only.  They later introduced the more flexible portfolio membership which allowed for the internal exchanges.
> *
> ...




The bolded is incorrect.


I am a home club Jupiter member (5 week member) and we are able to do a night for night exchange to other Ritz-Carlton Clubs.  Once Ritz forced the Portfolio Ritz members to become MVCI owners (this was a bad deal for those owners) that took away any points program available to us.  They have been talking for years about getting one up and running for members but Ritz members have no interest in using their memberships for MVCI.   The MVCI points program is one of the main reasons for Bachelor Gulch leaving and has also caused a lot of concern at clubs like St Thomas, Jupiter, and especially Aspen.

There is no current point conversion for Ritz members.  Also Grand Residence is a MVCI product and is not Ritz Carlton hence the reason why they have points and trades through Interval.  Grand Residence is nice but is no where near on par with the level of services from Ritz.


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## nakyak (Apr 10, 2014)

FractionalTraveler said:


> Yes, but the OP had to purchase a portfolio membership and not a club membership.
> 
> The club membership was limited to your home residence only.  They later introduced the more flexible portfolio membership which allowed for the internal exchanges.
> 
> ...




I also have one gold MVCI week in Aruba that gives me somewhere around 2500 points.  It is not enough to be able to reserve Ritz through MVCI.  Owner Services won't even check for me because I do not have enough points.

I'm just curious if they are allowing MVCI to reserve into 2015 with their points or if they have restricted future bookings for next year for MVCI owners due to potential turnover of the club.


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## EducatedConsumer (Apr 10, 2014)

nakyak said:


> I also have one gold MVCI week in Aruba that gives me somewhere around 2500 points.  It is not enough to be able to reserve Ritz through MVCI.  Owner Services won't even check for me because I do not have enough points.
> 
> I'm just curious if they are allowing MVCI to reserve into 2015 with their points or if they have restricted future bookings for next year for MVCI owners due to potential turnover of the club.



I'm not sure the fractional piece of the club in Jupiter could turn over, if Marriott Vacation Club has control of the outcome of such a vote, as a result of their financial stake in fractional homes in Jupiter. It would be interesting to know how many votes Marriott holds in Jupiter, and how many votes the Jupiter members (other than Marriott) hold. If Marriott has the leverage, they could do in Jupiter exactly what they did at BeachPlace Towers; exercise their right to vote, and stack the deck as they say fit.

_[Deleted.]_


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## FractionalTraveler (Apr 10, 2014)

nakyak said:


> The bolded is incorrect.
> 
> 
> I am a home club Jupiter member (5 week member) and we are able to do a night for night exchange to other Ritz-Carlton Clubs.  Once Ritz forced the Portfolio Ritz members to become MVCI owners (this was a bad deal for those owners) that took away any points program available to us.  They have been talking for years about getting one up and running for members but Ritz members have no interest in using their memberships for MVCI.   The MVCI points program is one of the main reasons for Bachelor Gulch leaving and has also caused a lot of concern at clubs like St Thomas, Jupiter, and especially Aspen.
> ...




I would recommend you reach out to the following executives to answer any questions you may have:

1. Linda Sciberras, Regional Membership Executive (407) 467-0228
2. David Kalnas, Customer Advocacy Manager (407) 238-3886

Both Linda and David have been very responsive and helpful in answering my questions in the past.

FT


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## fluke (Apr 10, 2014)

nakyak said:


> The bolded is incorrect.
> 
> 
> I am a home club Jupiter member (5 week member) and we are able to do a night for night exchange to other Ritz-Carlton Clubs.  Once Ritz forced the Portfolio Ritz members to become MVCI owners (this was a bad deal for those owners) that took away any points program available to us.  They have been talking for years about getting one up and running for members but Ritz members have no interest in using their memberships for MVCI.   The MVCI points program is one of the main reasons for Bachelor Gulch leaving and has also caused a lot of concern at clubs like St Thomas, Jupiter, and especially Aspen.
> ...




I don't think the Bachelor Gulch move was in response to the MVCI points program.  We had a thread about this last year and had a copy of the consultants post(referenced earlier in this thread - apparently no longer available).  BC began their process of separation (hiring consultant and legal advice) prior to that point.  Even the Consultant report stated a major factor was at least one well publicized attempt for Marriott to sell of the entire RC Club as well as the shrinking portfolio and no intention to expand.  I am sure the DC program didn't improve their feelings.

I started a thread about St Thomas that I was informed (By the sales department so take it with a grain of salt) that St Thomas owners had voted to participate in the DC.  Also I thought there was a thread late 2013 (can't find it with a quick search) of an Aspen owner complaining Aspen was joining the DC club.  Only time will confirm what will really happen at the RC clubs.  I think if they (Marriott Vacations Worldwide) could find a buyer they would dump the whole RC club.


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## gblotter (Apr 10, 2014)

Marriott owns property and therefore has voting rights just like any other owner - except that Marriott owns a lot more of course.  Marriott will certainly exercise those votes in a way the benefits its business (and shareholders would demand no less).  You and I might not like the outcome of that voting …

_[Deleted quote and comment related to moderated content.]_


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## EducatedConsumer (Apr 10, 2014)

gblotter said:


> Marriott owns property and therefore has voting rights just like any other owner - except that Marriott owns a lot more of course.  Marriott will certainly exercise those votes in a way the benefits its business (and shareholders would demand no less).  You and I might not like the outcome of that voting …
> 
> _[Deleted quote and comment related to moderated content.]_



In fact, the only property that Marriott owns in Jupiter are a few of the fractional club homes and the commensurate common land. That's it, no golf course, no Club House, no sales gallery, etc. 

Jupiter Residential Ownership Mix:

Estate Homes and Residences (whole ownership) - owned by non-Marriott entities;
Villas (whole ownership) - owned by non-Marriott entities;
Fractional Club Homes - majority(??) owned by non-Marriott entities;
Fractional Club Homes - some number owned by Marriott Vacation Worldwide Trust 

The remainder of the property is owned by Donald Trump, et al.


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## gblotter (Apr 11, 2014)

EducatedConsumer said:


> In fact, the only property that Marriott owns in Jupiter are a few of the fractional club homes and the commensurate common land. That's it, no golf course, no Club House, no sales gallery, etc.


If that is a true statement (I don't really know either way), then the Jupiter situation may be very similar to Bachelor Gulch.  If Jupiter owners decide to vote on terminating their Ritz Carlton management contract, Marriott would hold little influence over the outcome of that vote.

I don't have a dog in this fight, but I can certainly understand why Ritz Club owners would not want their experience diluted after spending so much money.  The Ritz component contributed heavily to the MVCI financial problems leading to the spinoff, so some major changes had to be made.  I feel bad for the Ritz owners nonetheless.


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## EducatedConsumer (Apr 11, 2014)

gblotter said:


> If that is a true statement (I don't really know either way), then the Jupiter situation may be very similar to Bachelor Gulch.  If Jupiter owners decide to vote on terminating their Ritz Carlton management contract, Marriott would hold little influence over the outcome of that vote.
> 
> I don't have a dog in this fight, but I can certainly understand why Ritz Club owners would not want their experience diluted after spending so much money.  The Ritz component contributed heavily to the MVCI financial problems leading to the spinoff, so some major changes had to be made.  I feel bad for the Ritz owners nonetheless.



You are 100% correct, the liabilities of the unsold Ritz-Carlton Club fractional and whole ownership inventory was a huge liability for MVCI, before the spinoff (this was very clearly disclosed in the MVW SEC filings) . What was particularly disheartening, was that without those liabilities, MVCI would have performed very well during recent turbulent times (which would have been a nice boost for the MVCI employees who were making that happen). Marriott is well known and respected for battening down the hatch and riding out the storm during financially turbulent times, but unfortunately, all of that unsold Ritz-Carlton Club inventory, created monumental challenges for MVCI.

The Jupiter situation is different than Bachelor Gulch for a few reasons, (1) the only inventory that Marriott may have owned at BG (after BG was sold out) was defaulted inventory (the Trust had not purchased any inventory at BG), so Marriott had little influence on a succession vote, and (2) The BG CLUB campus is totally unlike Jupiter; the BG Club is contained in one building. In Jupiter, there is a very large expanse of land, now owned by the homeowners and Trump, the Club House is owned by Trump, the golf course is owned by Trump, and Trump's people are the backbone of the Club's operations. The only Ritz-Carlton employee presence that exists in Jupiter now is to support the members and guests of the fractional club homes, and the back of the house support of Ritz-Carlton Club Member Services (Lord knows how many Vice Presidents MVW has for this limited function).

So, I'm not sure how much the Jupiter fractional members would gain by defecting from The Ritz-Carlton Club, other than the possibility of lower maintenance fees, the loss of stature that comes with a Ritz-Carlton affiliation, and the loss of reciprocal usage between the few remaining Ritz-Carlton Clubs, and Ritz-Carlton hotel benefits. I'd think the biggest current concern for the Jupiter fractional club members is the approximately 70% devaluation of their investment, and the ever-rising number of JUP fractional members who can not pay their dues.

Sadly, in my opinion, the loss of the BG Club represented a huge adverse hit to The Ritz-Carlton Club. The BG Club was one of the nicest clubs in the system, it was small, intimate, isolated yet convenient, ski-in/ski-out, connected to a Ritz-Carlton Hotel, an in a renowned destination.


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## nakyak (Apr 30, 2014)

I will be casting my vote to terminate the relationship with Ritz.  Timbers is a great fit for the property.

http://jupiterclubcoa.com/


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## SueDonJ (Apr 30, 2014)

nakyak said:


> I will be casting my vote to terminate the relationship with Ritz.  Timbers is a great fit for the property.
> 
> http://jupiterclubcoa.com/



It looks like your COA board is doing a wonderful job providing the necessary information for all owners to make an informed decision.  What a fabulous website they've developed to that end!  I hope all of you realize the importance of participating in the voting process, and wish you all the best regardless of the outcome.  Good luck!


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## fluke (Apr 30, 2014)

It will be interesting to see the outcome.  Probably the toughest number to hit will be 50% of the members have to vote.  

Does anyone know the total # of fractional interests?  Since MVW seems to own 60 fractional interests, I am curious how much influence they will have on the vote.


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## nakyak (Apr 30, 2014)

fluke said:


> It will be interesting to see the outcome.  Probably the toughest number to hit will be 50% of the members have to vote.
> 
> Does anyone know the total # of fractional interests?  Since MVW seems to own 60 fractional interests, I am curious how much influence they will have on the vote.



Their FAQ's list the number at 400


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## dioxide45 (Apr 30, 2014)

fluke said:


> It will be interesting to see the outcome.  Probably the toughest number to hit will be 50% of the members have to vote.
> 
> Does anyone know the total # of fractional interests?  Since MVW seems to own 60 fractional interests, I am curious how much influence they will have on the vote.



I think perhaps the harder number to hit will be the 66%. Since if MVCI votes their shares to keep it part of RCDC, then the owners have to get 264 of the remaining 340 votes. That means that all the owners have to get 77.7% of the vote in favor in order to out vote MVCI.


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## FractionalTraveler (May 1, 2014)

In the latest MVW quarterly results, the company discusses numerous lawsuits from RC owners.  I was surprised at the number of lawsuits now working its way through the court system.  Seems like they are being sued from just about every RC DC property at the moment.

There is also a new legal challenge from a Harbor Lake owner regarding the points system.

FT


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## nakyak (Jun 3, 2014)

Voting closes tonight.  It will be interesting to see if Jupiter follows the lead of Bachelor Gulch.


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## FractionalTraveler (Jun 4, 2014)

nakyak said:


> Voting closes tonight.  It will be interesting to see if Jupiter follows the lead of Bachelor Gulch.



I fully expect for this to happen. RC destination club has a lot less focus on its owners now that they are part of the much larger MVCI.

FT


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## bazzap (Jun 4, 2014)

I can certainly understand why RCDC owners would want to vote for change, although it would seem to be an unfortunate loss of a very attractive option for MVC owners.
The only thing I am not clear on from reading the attachment, is how significant the impact would be if "RCDC" / "MVW" were to decide to vote their 60 interests against change?


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## Fasttr (Jun 4, 2014)

Pretty lopsided results....  http://jupiterclubcoa.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/2014-Election-Results_6-4-14.pdf


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## bazzap (Jun 4, 2014)

Fasttr said:


> Pretty lopsided results....  http://jupiterclubcoa.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/2014-Election-Results_6-4-14.pdf


Well this certainly answers that question very clearly.


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## ondeadlin (Jun 4, 2014)

Can't be surprised by the vote.  If I paid those prices I would go ballistic about MVCI owners using the property.

With only five remaining locations, the Ritz-Carlton Club looks to be withering on the vine.


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## Fasttr (Jun 4, 2014)

ondeadlin said:


> With only five remaining locations, the Ritz-Carlton Club looks to be withering on the vine.



Sounds like MVC control of these clubs is leaving a taste in the mouths of the club members more along the lines of a Saltine than a Ritz.


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## nakyak (Jun 4, 2014)

For those mvci points owners considering using the remaining ritz properties they should do it now .  Aspen or st Thomas should be the next leave.  I am not for certain but I think both clubs management agreements are up for renewal in the next 12 months.

I'm excited for timbers to come in and take over.


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## dioxide45 (Jun 4, 2014)

I find it interesting that the Ritz properties can so easily break the management agreements. From information past reported related to Beach Place Towers, it sounded all but impossible for them to get out from under their management agreement with MVCI. It sounds like these contracts were written up providing more leeway for the BOD/HOA to change management companies?


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## nakyak (Jun 4, 2014)

dioxide45 said:


> I find it interesting that the Ritz properties can so easily break the management agreements. From information past reported related to Beach Place Towers, it sounded all but impossible for them to get out from under their management agreement with MVCI. It sounds like these contracts were written up providing more leeway for the BOD/HOA to change management companies?



The management agreement was not broken.  It simply was up for renewal.


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## dioxide45 (Jun 4, 2014)

Fasttr said:


> Pretty lopsided results....  http://jupiterclubcoa.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/2014-Election-Results_6-4-14.pdf



With those results, it doesn't look like MVC voted their proxies. Or if they did, they voted in favor.


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## dioxide45 (Jun 4, 2014)

nakyak said:


> The management agreement was not broken.  It simply was up for renewal.



That makes sense, but do the management agreements ever come up for renewal at regular MVCI properties? I was under the impression that they were always up for automatic renewal unless MVCI opted out. There wasn't any say by the owners, or perhaps it requires a super majority with a super majority of owners also voting.


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## fluke (Jun 4, 2014)

*MVW Ownership*

Even with a change in management the units owned by MVW will still likely be available to the DC club.  Unless MVW can sell off that inventory.  There are multiple timeshare systems that own properties that are used by those respective systems with a different management company.  If MVW owns units a new management company can't impede there right to use it like any other owner.

Bachelors Gulch was different because (as I understand it) MVW had no ownership in units there.

Although as it appears MVW didn't vote against it,  you could always speculate maybe they made a deal with Timbers to acquire the unsold units.

It will be interesting to see if MVW maintains ownership and therefore usage of the units.


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## dioxide45 (Jun 4, 2014)

fluke said:


> Even with a change in management the units owned by MVW will still likely be available to the DC club.  Unless MVW can sell off that inventory.  There are multiple timeshare systems that own properties that are used by those respective systems with a different management company.  If MVW owns units a new management company can't impede there right to use it like any other owner.
> 
> Bachelors Gulch was different because (as I understand it) MVW had no ownership in units there.
> 
> ...



I think it would be in the best interest of all involved for MVCI to divest itself of the units they own. Or perhaps Timbers can sell the units under contract for MVC. I don't think they will continue to allow DC owners to book at a resort not branded as a MVCI property.


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## ondeadlin (Jun 5, 2014)

dioxide45 said:


> I don't think they will continue to allow DC owners to book at a resort not branded as a MVCI property.



I agree with this. Can't see it happening.


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## bogey21 (Jun 5, 2014)

dioxide45 said:


> With those results, it doesn't look like MVC voted their proxies. Or if they did, they voted in favor.



As an outsider looking in my take is that Marriott wants to allow Ritz to slowly go away.  Thus not voting or voting for facilitates their goal.

George


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## FractionalTraveler (Jun 5, 2014)

bogey21 said:


> As an outsider looking in my take is that Marriott wants to allow Ritz to slowly go away.  Thus not voting or voting for facilitates their goal.
> 
> George



I agree! 

It has been 4 years now since DC and only a handful of units from the RC Vail property have ever been entered into the Trust.

Many of the other properties are locked into litigation or have either exited or are planning to exit the RCDC.

FT


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## RSLeesburg (Jun 28, 2014)

As an update to this - I saw that the agreement with Ritz is officially terminated in September 2014.  Does anyone know when Jupiter owners will be able to start exchanging with Timbers properties?   Sept also?


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## gowarty (Jul 4, 2014)

*Ritz DC reviews?*

It appears MVC is still taking reservations for Jupiter even after the vote.  I tried to find reviews online for the property but can't find much at all (nothing on TripAdvisor even). 

Can anyone provide feedback on the property?   Was thinking of taking the young kids and wanted to make sure there was enough to do.


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## FractionalTraveler (Jul 4, 2014)

gowarty said:


> It appears MVC is still taking reservations for Jupiter even after the vote.  I tried to find reviews online for the property but can't find much at all (nothing on TripAdvisor even).
> 
> Can anyone provide feedback on the property?   Was thinking of taking the young kids and wanted to make sure there was enough to do.



Been there many times. Depends on age of kids.

The club has tennis, basketball, and golf.

These are homes so you probably won't find many online reviews.

FT


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## Kagehitokiri2 (Jul 11, 2014)

RC club/residences kapalua also temporarily went timbers before montage purchased management contract, IIRC


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## nakyak (Jul 16, 2014)

RSLeesburg said:


> As an update to this - I saw that the agreement with Ritz is officially terminated in September 2014.  Does anyone know when Jupiter owners will be able to start exchanging with Timbers properties?   Sept also?



I have heard it will be sometime in September before we have access.

My son attended an MVC presentation over the weekend and the salesman is still pitching premier plus gets you access to Jupiter.  Offered him the opportunity to purchase 1,000 points to bring him to the level.


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