# Huge auction, massive points (2,302,000), low mf/1000



## jebloomquist (Aug 3, 2012)

If anyone is interested in getting a massive amount of points with low mf/1000 all at one time, look at ebay auction:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/140816107853?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

It is for 2,302,000 points at Bali Hai Villas, with a current year mf of $9152. That is just under $4/1000.

I would love to bid on this one, but it is too big for me. Any platinum owner looking to get more points to leverage might consider this auction. The mf commitment, probably going to $9,700 next year is to much for me.


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## slip (Aug 3, 2012)

I saw that one too. It does have a bid.

Ron, is that you?


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## am1 (Aug 3, 2012)

The drawback is mf's start in February but usage does not start till July.


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## ronparise (Aug 3, 2012)

slip said:


> I saw that one too. It does have a bid.
> 
> Ron, is that you?



No, not me...When I bid, if I bid, my bid wont go in until the last seconds.


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## ronparise (Aug 3, 2012)

am1 said:


> The drawback is mf's start in February but usage does not start till July.



Thats not exactly true...You can make reservations (for check in after July 2013) as soon as the contract is yours, and if you need a reservation before the use year begins, use the credit pool. I think I could get  2 million points rented and a years maintenance fees paid and a free vacation for me, before the first mf is due...at least that would be my goal here

Also I like to consider mf compensation to the seller or advanced mf to be paid, as part of my sunk cost. As long as the total number fits my formula, I dont worry about who gets that sunk money, be it the seller, the broker, the closing company or Wyndham.

And remember because this seems to be one deed, the closing costs and transfer fees are not too much to worry about. If your goal was to buy another 2 million points and you did it with 300000 point contracts you would probably be paying close to $5000 closing and transfer fees. The early mf due here is less than that


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## am1 (Aug 3, 2012)

ronparise said:


> Thats not exactly true...You can make reservations (for check in after July 2013) as soon as the contract is yours, and if you need a reservation before the use year begins, use the credit pool. I think I could get  2 million points rented and a years maintenance fees paid and a free vacation for me, before the first mf is due...at least that would be my goal here
> 
> Also I like to consider mf compensation to the seller or advanced mf to be paid, as part of my sunk cost. As long as the total number fits my formula, I dont worry about who gets that sunk money, be it the seller, the broker, the closing company or Wyndham.
> 
> And remember because this seems to be one deed, the closing costs and transfer fees are not too much to worry about. If your goal was to buy another 2 million points and you did it with 300000 point contracts you would probably be paying close to $5000 closing and transfer fees. The early mf due here is less than that



Yes I agree.  The extra months of mfs, I consider part of the purchase price.  The ones that do not consider it drive up the purchase price.   If usage started july 2012 as well as fees the contract would sell for much more.  Maybe as much as $5000 more.


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## BocaBum99 (Aug 3, 2012)

Are these maintenance fees real?  Seem a bit low.  Is this resort being subsidized by Wyndham for now?


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## am1 (Aug 3, 2012)

BocaBum99 said:


> Are these maintenance fees real?  Seem a bit low.  Is this resort being subsidized by Wyndham for now?



It is less complicated than that.  Kind of a secret why they are so low.


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## ronparise (Aug 3, 2012)

BocaBum99 said:


> Are these maintenance fees real?  Seem a bit low.  Is this resort being subsidized by Wyndham for now?



no secret.  Its the result of point inflation. 

If you think of mf in terms of dollars per 1000 points, (which we all do) The mf seems low, but if you think of mf in terms of how much does it cost to stay here for a week, the mf is actually fairly high compared to other Wyndham properties. , Do the math and you see the mf/1000 points is about $4, Since it take 325000 points to stay a week here; the cost per weeks vacation is actually about $1300...Isnt that pretty much in line with other Hawaii resorts?

Where an someone can make out, is buying here, but not vacationing here. Use the points to stay for example at Bonnet Creek the week before Christmas for 112000 points or just $450 Or visit Fairfield Glade where a week in a studio in the off season is just 28000 points ($112)... Of course the flip side is just the opposite, If I use my Farifield Glade points that cost me $6/1000 points mf, a week in Hawaii will cost me about $2000


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## am1 (Aug 3, 2012)

ronparise said:


> no secret.  Its the result of point inflation.



It used to be.....


Thankfully I am not looking to add more points anymore.  But I put a bid in on this one for fun.


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## jjmanthei05 (Aug 3, 2012)

am1 said:


> It used to be.....
> 
> 
> Thankfully I am not looking to add more points anymore.  But I put a bid in on this one for fun.



Way to run it up for the rest of us! lol

Jason


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## am1 (Aug 3, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> Way to run it up for the rest of us! lol
> 
> Jason



I'll buy it at the right price.  But may as well find out the demand sooner.  

Probably a good example of not posting current auctions on a timeshare message board.


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## DeniseM (Aug 3, 2012)

BocaBum99 said:


> Are these maintenance fees real?  Seem a bit low.  Is this resort being subsidized by Wyndham for now?



Yes - they are in active sales...


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## rrlongwell (Aug 3, 2012)

am1 said:


> I'll buy it at the right price.  But may as well find out the demand sooner.
> 
> Probably a good example of not posting current auctions on a timeshare message board.



Someone is going to get one heck of a great price.  Hope it is you.  I know you are an experienced bidder, but a reminder anyone.  I have heard that some bidders use a service of some sort to put in last second bids.  In light of this and if you want it, maybe put your max price into the system prior to the last minute or so to counter act this.


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## jjmanthei05 (Aug 3, 2012)

am1 said:


> I'll buy it at the right price.  But may as well find out the demand sooner.
> 
> Probably a good example of not posting current auctions on a timeshare message board.



I wonder if this one will hit the $11,000 or so the New Orleans one did a few weeks back. 

Jason


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## ronparise (Aug 3, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> I wonder if this one will hit the $11,000 or so the New Orleans one did a few weeks back.
> 
> Jason



Oh yea.

The New Orleans one would have been valuable for someone that wanted ARP for Mardi Gras, or Jazz Fest or the Sugar Bowl or for the next time the SuperBowl comes to town, so perhaps it carried a premium because of that. But this one has mf 20% less so it should command a premium for that. Id say the lower mf is more important to more people so I'd expect an even higher price for this one, Id say a half a penny per point


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## csxjohn (Aug 3, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> Someone is going to get one heck of a great price.  Hope it is you.  I know you are an experienced bidder, but a reminder anyone.  I have heard that some bidders use a service of some sort to put in last second bids.  In light of this and if you want it, maybe put your max price into the system prior to the last minute or so to counter act this.



Putting your max bid in sooner than the last few seconds wont' counter a sniper.

The only thing you will accomplish by doing that is to show other bidders that they need to bid higher.

Ron uses a sniping service, I do it my self with 5 secs. to go.  I bid as high as I'm willing to go and if someone else puts in a bid higher than mine in those last few seconds, I don't worry about it because I didn't want the item at a higher price.

What I see happen on boats a lot is about an hour or so before the bid ends, people start bidding and it ends up like a live auction with a bidding frenzy.  Good for the seller, not so for potential buyers.


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## Rent_Share (Aug 3, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> Someone is going to get one heck of a great price. Hope it is you. I know you are an experienced bidder, but a reminder anyone. I have heard that some bidders use a service of some sort to put in last second bids. In light of this and if you want it, maybe put your max price into the system prior to the last minute or so to counter act this.


 
You obviously have no business being on eBay, if you are not familiar with snipe ing programs


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## rrlongwell (Aug 3, 2012)

Rent_Share said:


> Really, they also use this new thing called the internet, in context this comment explains alot



I have a day or so before I reach 90.  I know, I have heard of that criter called the internet.  According to Vice President Gore when he was in office, he named a system, that I had worked on, that was the predecessor to the internet.  I guess, maybe I became obsolete somewhere along the line.


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## rrsafety (Aug 3, 2012)

csxjohn said:


> Putting your max bid in sooner than the last few seconds wont' counter a sniper.
> 
> The only thing you will accomplish by doing that is to show other bidders that they need to bid higher.
> 
> ...




I sold an old Halloween postcard on eBay a few years back. It went from $5 to $328 in the last 30 seconds


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## ronparise (Aug 3, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> I have a day or so before I reach 90.  I know, I have heard of that criter called the internet.  According to Vice President Gore when he was in office, he named a system, that I had worked on, that was the predecessor to the internet.  I guess, maybe I became obsolete somewhere along the line.



not obsolete, perhaps irrelevent  (did I say that out loud?)


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## ronparise (Aug 3, 2012)

csxjohn said:


> Putting your max bid in sooner than the last few seconds wont' counter a sniper.
> 
> The only thing you will accomplish by doing that is to show other bidders that they need to bid higher.
> 
> ...



I posted yesterday as we were watching an auction, that we still had 15 minutes to go..."we havent seen the serious money yet"

What I see with timeshares on ebay is that all the action is in the last 10 seconds. That New Orleans auction went from 8000 to 11500 in the last ten seconds,


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## Sandy VDH (Aug 3, 2012)

I want some points, but NOT that many points.  That is 3 times the level of points I have now.


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## flexible (Aug 3, 2012)

deleted by flexible


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## markel (Aug 3, 2012)

So this auction is obviously for someone in the rental business. With the low MF's you don't think there is anyway that this will go for less than $10K, maybe $5K??  The MF's (albeit low for this amount of pts) on this is like having a house mortgage !!! I'll stick with my 154K package. Out of my league.


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## learnalot (Aug 3, 2012)

flexible said:


> We MIGHT be interested IF we could find out about Wyndham's arrangement to use Wyndham points for CRUISES & LAND TOURS. PLEASE can someone explain how it works since it seems like the TYPEs of POINTS for ECVC/RCI/Wyndham and what levels of ownership provide are SO DIFFERENT even though 1 RCI Point -1 Wyndham point - 1 ECVC point.



Using Wyndham points for anything other than Wyndham reservations is almost never a good bang for your buck.  The conversion ratios are generally poor for things like cruises and airfare.  A moderately savvy shopper will usually do better booking themselves.  There are some instances where you get good value in RCI due to the fixed grid, but only for high end exchanges.  I would not buy Wyndham points for primary use outside of internal Wyndham reservations.


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## jjmanthei05 (Aug 3, 2012)

The other thing that would concern me about this auction is that "redweek4less" always does private listings so you can't ever see who is doing what bidding and the bidding on those auctions always seem odd. I think I will pass even thought the contract would work perfectly for me. 

Jason


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## ronparise (Aug 3, 2012)

flexible said:


> We MIGHT be *interested IF we could find out about Wyndham's arrangement to use Wyndham points for CRUISES & LAND TOURS*. PLEASE can someone explain how it works since it seems like the TYPEs of POINTS for ECVC/RCI/Wyndham and what levels of ownership provide are SO DIFFERENT even though 1 RCI Point -1 Wyndham point - 1 ECVC point.
> 
> *OurVacationCenter.com & ICE Enterprises feedback needed
> http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=175308*
> ...



I dont know about using points for cruises except to repeat what has already been said. The best use of Wyndham points is in the Wyndham ..

Also your assumption "that 1 RCI Point -1 Wyndham point - 1 ECVC point" is incorrect


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## vacationhopeful (Aug 3, 2012)

There has been much talk about a "Wait List" being developed for Wyndham Points owners. If it is just for VIPs, then smart owners could do ok for themselves. If there is a limited "perk" function, like 1 reservation success a year or 5 if VIP (like the guest certificate numbers), it would be the same effect as sniping is on a eBay auction and limit the number of yearly options. If it worked only for Regular Use Year points vs cancelled points, then it would not help renting mega owners who regularly cancel and rebook unsold reservations.

Now, if Wyndham charges a FEE - like a Guest Certificate level fee - to place a "Wait List" request - (a no money back fee) it would just keep tiering higher the cost to do rentals for everyone BUT Extra Holidays.

And us owners would have AGAIN paid for an enhancement that puts money into the pockets of Wyndham corporation and it sister companies.


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## am1 (Aug 3, 2012)

flexible said:


> We MIGHT be *interested IF we could find out about Wyndham's arrangement to use Wyndham points for CRUISES & LAND TOURS*. PLEASE can someone explain how it works since it seems like *the TYPEs of POINTS for ECVC/RCI/Wyndham and what levels of ownership provide are SO DIFFERENT*.
> 
> *Updated after Ron's reply below*: *Even though the USAGE charts for resort rentals look SIMILAR, apparently "1 RCI Point -1 Wyndham point - 1 ECVC point" is incorrect*. *I would nice to UNDERSTAND the grid systems.* *I suspect that WorldMark by Wyndham CREDITS need a currency converter to figure out how they relate in value to points.*
> *OurVacationCenter.com & ICE Enterprises feedback needed
> ...



Im yours for 25% of the rental prices.  But seriously if you have to hire someone to do rentals you are not interested.

Wyndham mfs are higher are higher but inflation at El CID resorts is non existent.


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## flexible (Aug 3, 2012)

deleted by flexible


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## am1 (Aug 4, 2012)

There is no business if you have to pay someone to do the rentals.  If you are buying to use and renting excess then it is different.  The VIP benefits will not transfer so you will be at a huge disadvantage.


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## pedro47 (Aug 4, 2012)

This is some great information.  Thanks to all for sharing your thoughts.


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## ronparise (Aug 4, 2012)

markel said:


> So this auction is obviously for someone in the rental business. With the low MF's you don't think there is anyway that this will go for less than $10K, maybe $5K??  The MF's (albeit low for this amount of pts) on this is like having a house mortgage !!! I'll stick with my 154K package. Out of my league.



I can see someone buying this instead of a winter home. with 2,300,000 points you  could get 3 months in a 2 bedroom at Palm Aire. not bad for just $10,000 a year mf, and certainly cheaper than buying a condo  for just 3 months out of the year


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## jebloomquist (Aug 4, 2012)

*..9.99 good bidding strategy or pushing bids up*

As I look at some of the bids made on this and other auctions, I wonder about the logic behind the bids. Any price that ends in ..9.99 should be used by a seller, not a buyer. When you are trying to sell something you use the  ..9.99 to make it look less expensive. I don't think that anyone using a bid ending in ..9.99 will ever win. Someone else, such as myself will use something such as ..02.52, just over a $100 mark. 

Is it possible that the bids of $499.99, $699.99, $999.00, $1,599.00, and $2,599.00 in this auction are bogus bids by the seller just to push the price higher with very little risk of winning. 

I really don't like these "private listing" auctions that do not display the other bidders ID. They suggest that it protects the bidder. Bull, I believe it is used by the seller to increase the auction price.


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## ronparise (Aug 4, 2012)

jebloomquist said:


> As I look at some of the bids made on this and other auctions, I wonder about the logic behind the bids. Any price that ends in ..9.99 should be used by a seller, not a buyer. When you are trying to sell something you use the  ..9.99 to make it look less expensive. I don't think that anyone using a bid ending in ..9.99 will ever win. Someone else, such as myself will use something such as ..02.52, just over a $100 mark.
> 
> Is it possible that the bids of $499.99, $699.99, $999.00, $1,599.00, and $2,599.00 in this auction are bogus bids by the seller just to push the price higher with very little risk of winning.
> 
> I really don't like these "private listing" auctions that do not display the other bidders ID. They suggest that it protects the bidder. Bull, I believe it is used by the seller to increase the auction price.



I think that anyone bidding at this point in the auction doesn't have a strategy, or more to the point they dont know what they are doing. And when it comes to Private Listing  Auctions...I dont know what Im doing


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## jjmanthei05 (Aug 4, 2012)

jebloomquist said:


> As I look at some of the bids made on this and other auctions, I wonder about the logic behind the bids. Any price that ends in ..9.99 should be used by a seller, not a buyer. When you are trying to sell something you use the  ..9.99 to make it look less expensive. I don't think that anyone using a bid ending in ..9.99 will ever win. Someone else, such as myself will use something such as ..02.52, just over a $100 mark.
> 
> Is it possible that the bids of $499.99, $699.99, $999.00, $1,599.00, and $2,599.00 in this auction are bogus bids by the seller just to push the price higher with very little risk of winning.
> 
> I really don't like these "private listing" auctions that do not display the other bidders ID. They suggest that it protects the bidder. Bull, I believe it is used by the seller to increase the auction price.



I have seen this over and over again from "redweek4less" and his/her auctions seem to end about 50% higher than other similar items. solid strategy for the seller (all though against terms and conditions of ebay) not good for a potential buyer. 

Jason


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## pacodemountainside (Aug 4, 2012)

*Wait List  and VOI Fees*



vacationhopeful said:


> There has been much talk about a "Wait List" being developed for Wyndham Points owners. If it is just for VIPs, then smart owners could do ok for themselves. If there is a limited "perk" function, like 1 reservation success a year or 5 if VIP (like the guest certificate numbers), it would be the same effect as sniping is on a eBay auction and limit the number of yearly options. If it worked only for Regular Use Year points vs cancelled points, then it would not help renting mega owners who regularly cancel and rebook unsold reservations.
> 
> Now, if Wyndham charges a FEE - like a Guest Certificate level fee - to place a "Wait List" request - (a no money back fee) it would just keep tiering higher the cost to do rentals for everyone BUT Extra Holidays.
> 
> And us owners would have AGAIN paid for an enhancement that puts money into the pockets of Wyndham corporation and it sister companies.







There is supposed to be a "Wait List" in place now. Clearly the Wyndham Triumvirate Dictatorship that is somehow running VOI Trust sans 4 owner members doesn't really care about governing documents. As with any Trust perk/benefit WVR can make a VIP benefit and pay for.  See Trust  2011 financials where  WVR  reimbursed Trust  some $12 million  for its perks.


1991 VOI TRUST AGREEMENT AS AMENDED

11.04 Wait List. A “wait list” system has been established by the Trustee for those Members who desire reservation dates that are unavailable and who want to be on a list in the event there are cancellations. The Trustee may charge a fee for the maintenance of the “wait list”, which fee may change, without any guarantee that the reservation date requested will become available. Use of the “wait list”, however, does not prevent a Member from making other reservations during the time such Member might be on the “wait list”. 


You and many others are  wrong Wyndham is getting rich from fees collected  by the Trust. The Trust has a legal obligation to levy fees to cover its operating costs. It has chosen to strike a balance between providing minimum benefits  such 1 RT  with 77K points  at no charge to everyone  and levy fees to cover others which in their opinion  are only used by a few people. 


 NO WAY, do guest certificates, RTs,  credit  pooling fees, etc.  go to Wynham Worldwide share holders. They  keep  Trust fee at $98/$117  or $.51/$.53  thousand so  BOD can claim they are such good managers their fees don't go up  every year like HOA fees! 



WVR makes it  obscene profits that sent its stock soaring from $2.92 in first quarter of 2009 to  around $52 today by selling $200K condos   for over a million dollars as Time Share Intervals,  $299 to transfer ownership, 10% of resort HOA budget for managing under sweet heart contracts etc.. And,  EH legally stealing  90% of VOI(our) inventory to rent out and  pocket  as profit as BOD has failed to levy   some kind of charge for it. Really  depreciates  value of VIP benefits


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## am1 (Aug 4, 2012)

ronparise said:


> I think that anyone bidding at this point in the auction doesn't have a strategy, or more to the point they dont know what they are doing. And when it comes to Private Listing  Auctions...I dont know what Im doing



Just having some fun.  Its a few dollars overs $5000 now.  Ill wait for someone to go over that before I decide if I want it.


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## flexible (Aug 6, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> The other thing that would concern me about this auction is that "redweek4less" always does private listings so you can't ever see who is doing what bidding and the bidding on those auctions always seem odd. I think I will pass even thought the contract would work perfectly for me.
> 
> Jason



1) "private listings"
2) EMAIL sent to RedWeek4Less received NO REPLY
3) Question posted to seller on BOTTOM of page DOES NOT appear on the page. Is that because the QUESTIONS are not shown because seller uses "private listings"

Received this reply a few moments ago:
Hi,
Sorry no we do not send or mail any docs prior to auctions end. If you are the winner we will be happy to mail you the contract.
Thanks
Robbie

- redweek4less

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: FLEXIBLE (not my real EBAY name)
To: redweek4less
Subject: Details about item: FLEXIBLE sent a message about WYNDHAM FAIRFIELD POINTS BEACH KAUAI HAWAII TIMESHARE #140816107853
Sent Date: Aug-04-12 18:40:09 PDT

Dear redweek4less,

If this is a DEEDED Real Estate Timeshare contract ARE BOTH spouses living a community property state might need to notarize the papers to CLOSE the transaction? Could you please email a copy of the timeshare contract and any other real estate documents the buyer would need to sign prior to this auction closing? Thanks in advance for your answer.


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## jjmanthei05 (Aug 6, 2012)

flexible said:


> 1) "private listings"
> 2) EMAIL sent to RedWeek4Less received NO REPLY
> 3) Question posted to seller on BOTTOM of page DOES NOT appear on the page. Is that because the bids are not shown because seller uses "private listings"
> 
> ...



The other thing is with the posting of the "second chance offer" already built in at the bottom of the posting. Looks like a "i run up my listings" sign...

Jason


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## flexible (Aug 7, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> The other thing is with the posting of the "second chance offer" already built in at the bottom of the posting. Looks like a *"i run up my listings"* sign...
> 
> Jason




What does "i run up my listings" sign mean?


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## Ridewithme38 (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> Hi Jason,
> What does "i run up my listings" sign mean?
> 
> 
> While I've purchased a ton of historical documents etc & other stuff on EBay, I have never BID on a EBay REAL ESTATE transaction so I am CONFUSED.



It's when the seller or 'friends' of the seller bid on the auction, not to win the item, but specifically to raise the price


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## Rent_Share (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> Hi Jason,
> What does "i run up my listings" sign mean?.


 
He believes the seller uses shill biddings and is telling you that the winning bid will be a phony and we will send a second chance offer will be sent to the actual high "real" bidder IMHO it is obsolete boilerplate auction text when it was easier to send other bidders emails and bogus 2nd chance offers were moire common. 

Private listings are more or less obsolete too with the restrictions eBay has put on communication.  There is one loophole where a fellow bidder/scammer might be able to communicate with a bidder in a non private auction, but the desired target would need to have something else for sale, the search for their email would have to start under the other item, where they open themselves up to communication, initially wholly within the eBay system . . . . .



flexible said:


> While I've purchased a ton of historical documents etc & other stuff on EBay, I have never BID on a EBay REAL ESTATE transaction so I am CONFUSED.


 
Keep one thing in mind, since you are bidding on real estate, all of the eBay rules on merchandise do not apply, eBay Real Estate and Vehicle auctions are NOB BINDING


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## flexible (Aug 7, 2012)

THANK YOU for your information regarding EBay.

Since http://www.ebay.com/itm/140816107853?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649 
ends about 9:30 pm PST it MIGHT be interesting to 
watch the AUCTION SNIPER bids and see WHAT the winner bid is?

Do I understand correctly the PRIVATE LISTING sellers can then PICK & CHOOSE who to make SECOND CHANCE offers to IN CASE the WINNING BIDDER is the seller's wife/friend/shill?


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## antjmar (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> THANK YOU for your information regarding EBay.
> 
> Since http://www.ebay.com/itm/140816107853?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
> ends about 9:30 pm PST it MIGHT be interesting to
> ...



Yes! Its been a while since I sold on ebay but I believe you can do this even without a private listing.


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## jebloomquist (Aug 7, 2012)

*Contacted as 2nd high bidder*

On occasions I have been contacted as the 2nd high bidder, becuase the highest bidder dropped out "for some reason." The seller has requested that if I am willing to pay my highest bid offer, I can have the item. 

Here is my response and advice for you, given in an example.

Assume that an auction is sitting at $90 with a $10 minimum increase. I put in a bid of $150, and that pushes the current price up to $100. If no one else bids, I get the item for $100. But, near the end someone bids $200, and therefore, they win it at $160. But, I then get contacted by the seller or the highest bidder and offered the item at $150, "for some reason."

My response is, no. If that other party had not bid, real or shill, I would have gotten the item at $100. That is my offer back to them, $100.

This type of a response has never been refused by a seller or a highest bidder.


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## am1 (Aug 7, 2012)

jebloomquist said:


> My response is, no. If that other party had not bid, real or shill, I would have gotten the item at $100. That is my offer back to them, $100.
> 
> This type of a response has never been refused by a seller or a highest bidder.



It keeps others from bidding $130 or $140 after the shill bid $200.


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## Beefnot (Aug 7, 2012)

am1 said:


> It keeps others from bidding $130 or $140 after the shill bid $200.



Touche. Good point indeed.


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## flexible (Aug 7, 2012)

deleted by flexible


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## jebloomquist (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> If a few dozen TUGgers joined us for a Guiness perhaps at Buena Vista in San Francisco & we had the TV/WiFi set up for a few more Irish Pubs full of TUGgers using WiFi & Auction Sniper around the globe:
> 
> 
> Would THIS 2.3M Wyndham Points EBay auction IF won by a group of TUGgers who KNOW so much about Wyndham be WORTH winning?
> ...



I have wondered about going together with a half dozen people to buy this auction, or at least put in a reasonable bid.

There are obstacles as I look at doing this. It would be so much better if it could somehow be linked to a Platinum owner and get these benefits to leverage the points even further. 

I currently work with another owner swapping reservations and exchanging value to the benefit of both of us. But, something such as this requires a great deal of trust, which we have in each other. If I were the Platinum owner to acquire the points, and other TUGgers helped pay for the purchase and ongoing mf, they would have to trust me a great deal.

This is the only way that I see that something such as this could work optimally.

Someone else could speak to the legality of how to do this, i.e. to set up a non-profit with this as an asset.

I think that a bid of $6,800 is a reasonable price to pay. I would not even consider doing this alone.


----------



## am1 (Aug 7, 2012)

jebloomquist said:


> I have wondered about going together with a half dozen people to buy this auction, or at least put in a reasonable bid.



Good luck in setting it up.  It will go for well over 6800.


----------



## jjmanthei05 (Aug 7, 2012)

jebloomquist said:


> I have wondered about going together with a half dozen people to buy this auction, or at least put in a reasonable bid.
> 
> There are obstacles as I look at doing this. It would be so much better if it could somehow be linked to a Platinum owner and get these benefits to leverage the points even further.
> 
> ...



Best way to do what you are looking at is through an LLC so then the agreement can be layed out in the operating agreement. Then the owners have something to stand on besides "he said/she said".

And yes with the seller pushing up the auction price, this will go much higher than $7,000 especially since it is presidential reserve. Didn't want to make that public if people didn't know but now that it is out of what I want to spend I have no issue posting it. I could easily see this go over $10,000.

Jason


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## flexible (Aug 7, 2012)

RE: http://www.ebay.com/itm/140816107853?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649


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## Ridewithme38 (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> Jason,
> We agree re LLC (Limited Liability Corporation)
> I have experience re: Non Profits - however it is VERY complicated.
> We OBVIOUSLY do NOT understand Wyndham and YOU do. So does that mean while we are drinking our pints of Guiness IF we end up the winning bidder you MIGHT consider being part of a new LLC as the "Wyndham Consultant" who knows how to make use of it?
> ...



I wanna join the LLC!  I'll start at the bottom as the guy who sweeps up the points that are thrown away!


----------



## Sandy VDH (Aug 7, 2012)

I have a VIP Platinum account with room to spare.  

I only use 727K in Wyndham every year because I have PICs I don't put into Wynd, but I have credit for 1.35M so get 30 GC per year. 

Lets talk if LLC happens.

Can a trust be part of an LLC?  I am about to embark on changing all my deeds over because of divorce and am planning on putting them into a trust.


----------



## flexible (Aug 7, 2012)

deleted by flexible


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## ronparise (Aug 7, 2012)

Im not going to bid.on this big boy, but I dont think its too much for one guy to take on all at once.  

I have 1.9 mm points either under contract or in wyndhams transfer dept now plus another 40k worldmark credits. So Im not afraid of taking a big bite, but I might choke on 2.3mm on top of that this month

But I am going to stay up until 1AM to see what happens, and I would be interested in a pool to guess the winning bid   

send $10 to my paypal account,  ronparise@gmail.com before midnight east coast time (make it a personal; other  transaction and you pay the 3% fee)  ..Closest to the actual winning bid (over or under) takes the pot..You will have to trust me to give a fair accounting of the money.

Whether or not you are betting, post your best guess here

My guess..$13800


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## flexible (Aug 7, 2012)

deleted by flexible


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## ace2000 (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> huh, perhaps 2.3M Wyndham does NOT come with VIP status?
> *Or perhaps RESALES do NOT get VIP status?*


 
B-i-n-g-o!


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## learnalot (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> If the winning BIDDER used the contract a little while
> then wanted to DUMP this contract a a year or so later on on EBay
> are the odds good that someone would buy on EBay in the future?
> 
> ...



Anymore, you generally can't get VIP with resale.  You can sometimes bring resale points into a developer purchase, thereby converting or cleansing your resale points, but you would almost certainly pay a high price to do so, especially bringing in that many points.  Almost certainly not cost effective because even with VERY savvy (and fortunate) usage, it would take a long time to recoup your "sunk" costs from the developer purchase.  Particularly risky considering that the VIP program terms are not contractual and are subject to change (which they have).

I would definitely not recommend anyone look at this as an initial Wyndham purchase - IMO, it is much too big a piece to bite off without knowing the system.


----------



## ronparise (Aug 7, 2012)

learnalot said:


> IMO, it is much too big a piece to bite off without knowing the system.




There a couple of ways to teach your kid how to swim. I signed my daughter up for lessons at the YMCA...My mother told me she learned when her father threw her off the end of dock into the pond and she had to either sink of swim

Buying a contract like this one before you know the Wyndham system will be learning to Wyndham, like my mother learned to swim...You're either going to learn the system real quick, or your going to drown


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## flexible (Aug 7, 2012)

deleted by flexible


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## Ridewithme38 (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> OK.
> The OP for http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80334
> who asked how to turn 154K Wyndham points into VIP
> SHOULD be allowed to WIN this one.
> ...



he still wouldnt be VIP


----------



## learnalot (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> OK.
> The OP for http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80334
> who asked how to turn 154K Wyndham points into VIP
> SHOULD be allowed to WIN this one.
> ...



Hi Flexible,

Just to be clear, even if the person with 154K won this auction, it wouldn't make them VIP.  Resale points won't change your VIP status, so in order to cleanse the resale points, a SUBSEQUENT developer purchase would be required.  In this case, it would probably require a significant developer purchase since so many points are involved.


----------



## Ridewithme38 (Aug 7, 2012)

learnalot said:


> Hi Flexible,
> 
> Just to be clear, even if the person with 154K won this auction, it wouldn't make them VIP.  Resale points won't change your VIP status, so in order to cleanse the resale points, a SUBSEQUENT developer purchase would be required.  In this case, it would probably require a significant developer purchase since so many points are involved.



With this many points and this low of a MF....do you even really need vip?


----------



## jebloomquist (Aug 7, 2012)

Sandy VDH said:


> I have a VIP Platinum account with room to spare.
> 
> I only use 727K in Wyndham every year because I have PICs I don't put into Wynd, but I have credit for 1.35M so get 30 GC per year.
> 
> ...



I looked into putting my points into a trust for my kids. But, each of my 11 deeds would have to be converted by Wyndham at $299 a piece. That totals to $3,289 just to do it. I decided not to do it. They can get it when I die.


----------



## JudyS (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> If a few dozen TUGgers joined us for a Guiness perhaps at Buena Vista in San Francisco & we had the TV/WiFi set up for a few more Irish Pubs full of TUGgers using WiFi & Auction Sniper around the globe:....





flexible said:


> ....
> If my cyberspace TUG friends are willing to form a LLC, I'm crazy enough to submit a potentially winning bid via Auction Sniper....



There have been several suggestions in the past that TUGgers should get together and form a company that owns a bunch of timeshares. I like this idea, but as far as I know, no such company has been set up yet. (If there is one, please let me know. I probably want in!) 

I personally would be most interested in a TUG company that allows me to deposit a Marriott or Starwood week into II once every few years or that gives me cheap access to SFX. But, heck, I'd probably go in on any TUG LLC that has timeshares with low MFs. I'm an addict!   (As in, my annual MF fees are already higher than $10k a year, plus any special assessments. I'm trying to whittle down my timeshare ownerships, but my addiction makes it tough! Luckily, I own a lot of stuff that rents for at least the MFs. )

As for this particular auction, I think it would be very risky to buy this large Wyndham package with the hopes of setting up a TUG LLC. It would be much safer to set up the LLC first and then buy a large Wyndham package when another one shows up on eBay (and another good Wyndham deal will almost certainly show up eventually.) I would also be concerned with Boca's and Denise's observation that this resort is still in sales and that MFs may go up when sales are done.


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## learnalot (Aug 7, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> With this many points and this low of a MF....do you even really need vip?



No.  But the MFs are not pocket change.  And with that many points, any increase in MFs and you might really feel the pinch.


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## jjmanthei05 (Aug 7, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> With this many points and this low of a MF....do you even really need vip?



If you want to rent them for any kind of decent profit, yes you do. 

Jason


----------



## jjmanthei05 (Aug 7, 2012)

JudyS said:


> There have been several suggestions in the past that TUGgers should get together and form a company that owns a bunch of timeshares. I like this idea, but as far as I know, no such company has been set up yet. (If there is one, please let me know. I probably want in!)



I have one but it's mine....all mine! lol 

Jason


----------



## rrlongwell (Aug 7, 2012)

flexible said:


> Ride, YOU'RE HIRED,
> 
> If my cyberspace TUG friends are willing to form a LLC, I'm crazy enough to submit a potentially winning bid via Auction Sniper.
> 
> ...



In my opinion, Wyndham Rentals to unknown parties is a very risky business to be in.  Since you do not appear to know Wyndham Vacation Resorts very well, you might want to start smaller with something like this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wyndham-Smo...51122023451?pt=Timeshares&hash=item3a7809fc1b

My impression if you mixed high qualilty Myrtle Beach (for ARP rights) with low maintances fees Smokey Mountain (great resort), and cost averaged the maintance fees, you would make out like a bandit.

My thought process would be use the Myrtle Beach ARP or reciprical ARP rights for a three night weekend stay (Friday, Saturday, and Sunday nights) during peek summer weeks.  Use Sunday night through Thursday night at the 10 month window usinig the Smokey Mountain points.  You should then make a disclosure on the rental contract that a change of room could be required.  If a existing VIP Platium member did this, do the math, if they were adept at the book and rebook routine for the Sunday to Thursday portion.  Risking the weekend during the peek season would not be a good idea.


----------



## Ridewithme38 (Aug 7, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> If you want to rent them for any kind of decent profit, yes you do.
> 
> Jason



I figure in order to pull a profit with this, you'd need to rent ATLEAST 1 week per month for more then $900 per week(about $130 a day)

That means those 2.3 million points would give you 191k a month to use for rentals...

I think a profitable rental business IS possible...It would just be a LOT of work...you'd have to find a desirable location for every month of the year and find someone to pay for it


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## rrlongwell (Aug 8, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> I figure in order to pull a profit with this, you'd need to rent ATLEAST 1 week per month for more then $900 per week(about $130 a day)
> 
> That means those 2.3 million points would give you 191k a month to use for rentals...
> 
> I think a profitable rental business IS possible...It would just be a LOT of work...you'd have to find a desirable location for every month of the year and find someone to pay for it



At $130 per night would you be a customer?


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## Ridewithme38 (Aug 8, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> At $130 per night would you be a customer?



Good point, that makes it more complicated, if you double it, you can bring it down to a reasonable price, if you can rent 2 weeks Every Single Month...you can bring it down to $65 a night...


----------



## jjmanthei05 (Aug 8, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> I figure in order to pull a profit with this, you'd need to rent ATLEAST 1 week per month for more then $900 per week(about $130 a day)
> 
> That means those 2.3 million points would give you 191k a month to use for rentals...
> 
> I think a profitable rental business IS possible...It would just be a LOT of work...you'd have to find a desirable location for every month of the year and find someone to pay for it



Right now I am getting somewhere between $350 and $500 a night for weekend rentals. Without VIP benefits I would be making somewhere around 10-20%. Margins are a little tight with that. 

Jason


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## ronparise (Aug 8, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> I figure in order to pull a profit with this, you'd need to rent ATLEAST 1 week per month for more then $900 per week(about $130 a day)
> 
> That means those 2.3 million points would give you 191k a month to use for rentals...
> 
> I think a profitable rental business IS possible...It would just be a LOT of work...you'd have to find a desirable location for every month of the year and find someone to pay for it



This is not enough points for a business, but if you rented 75% you could probably pay the mf on the whole mess, and have 500000 points for your own vacations.


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## ronparise (Aug 8, 2012)

I was way off

Winning bid:	
US $7,877.00 [ 44 bids ]

Less than a years mf, which is my limit


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## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

*$7,877.00*

We appreciate everyone letting us know this wasn't a good deal.


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## jebloomquist (Aug 8, 2012)

Well, if the winner at $7,877 is a TUGger, congratulation. I would like to know what you plan to do with the points.


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## gnorth16 (Aug 8, 2012)

*Sorry to drive up the price*

My max bid was $5500... Any second chance offers should be declined for a lower price.

http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176568


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## jebloomquist (Aug 8, 2012)

Now, here is something to bore you. I spent many years as a statistician and am now a math teacher. Many times the price ratios aren't linear but have some kind of exponential function. In this case I felt it might be a square root funtion.

Prior to the end, about an hour before the end I calculated a potential final price as follows using the price ($2,037) of the biennial 308k Bali Hai auction from a few days ago:

SQRT (2302/(308/2)) * $2037 = $7875.59. Not too far from the final winning bid.


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## am1 (Aug 8, 2012)

Like I said earlier it did not sell for as high a price as people thought because the points do not start till July 1, 2013.  So you lose a year of use upfront that you will never be able to recoup.  Mf's start in February.


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## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

deleted by flexible


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## am1 (Aug 8, 2012)

First you will need to find out how many names can be on an account.

Second if there is no VIP Platinum attached to the account they is really no need for a manager.  Or for it to even exist.  I can rent cheaper then your points will cost.  

Third if you get this off the ground I will manage it.


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## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

deleted by flexible


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## learnalot (Aug 8, 2012)

flexible said:


> 1) I'll forward the PM I sent the others that I exchanged PMs with yesterday.
> 
> 2) Does someone KNOW the MAXIMUM number of names that can be a WYNDHAM contract?
> 
> ...



Flexible,

EasyRider and RidewithMe are 2 different people.  RidewithMe is the one who said he wanted to join and be the sweeper, but that just means that he wants to use any extra points for free or practically free because that is just how he rolls


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## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

deleted by flexible


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## rrlongwell (Aug 8, 2012)

flexible said:


> 1) ... I am nearly CERTAIN the names on timeshare contracts can be the name of a LLC/Corporation/Trust ETC ...
> 
> My account is in a LLC name with three active members and many people authorized to become members.  The deeds in the account are in various names.  Some in the LLC name, some in my wife and my name, and one in my sons name and my wife and my name.
> 
> ...


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## gnorth16 (Aug 8, 2012)

Expect second chance offers.

Within minutes of waking up, the seller cancelled the sale and "will recover a portion of the fees" according to eBay.  If they have a second chance offer, I don't think they can actually try to get compensated for the sale falling through.

I don't have any desire to get into an LLC with others.  I have a tough time sharing an appetizer in the lounge!  I was looking at getting a Wyndham points TS for business purposes and doing the same thing with an LLC.  A joint venture seems a little too complicated for my liking.


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## ace2000 (Aug 8, 2012)

What happened to the other thread about forming the LLC?


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## Ridewithme38 (Aug 8, 2012)

ace2000 said:


> What happened to the other thread about forming the LLC?



The Admin's didn't like it...is my guess
http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176577


Can i make a suggestion? If you are really interested in starting this LLC(i think its a good idea) read this book a few times..

http://www.nxtbook.com/nxtbooks/wyndham/memberdirectory11-12/#/0

I know, before i bought Wyndham i was told almost a dozen times on here to read it over and over again...and after reading it and learning a bit about the in's and out's....I bought a fixed week instead of points


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## rrlongwell (Aug 8, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> The Admin's didn't like it...is my guess
> http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176577  ...
> 
> 
> ...


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## Beefnot (Aug 8, 2012)

Alas, the sad price we must pay and indignity we must suffer to participate on TUG.


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## rrlongwell (Aug 8, 2012)

Beefnot said:


> Alas, the sad price we must pay and indignity we must suffer to participate on TUG.



You better be careful, you may be the next member of the Outcast Club.  If that happens, I welcome you.  You would be a great addition.


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## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> Ridewithme38 said:
> 
> 
> > The Admin's didn't like it...is my guess
> ...


----------



## Ridewithme38 (Aug 8, 2012)

flexible said:


> Ridewithme38 said:
> 
> 
> > The Admin's didn't like it...is my guess
> ...



I still believe the LLC could be a fun idea, even if it isn't based off that specific contract


----------



## rrlongwell (Aug 8, 2012)

flexible said:


> ... and that I don't land in OUTCAST Island ... since the TUG moderators do a GREAT JOB ...



Sorry, once a member always a member, flattery will not work.  The only thing that I can think of that might work is buy the site from TUG Brian, then grant yourself an exception.


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## Rent_Share (Aug 8, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> You better be careful, you may be the next member of the Outcast Club. If that happens, I welcome you. You would be a great addition.


 

I consider him one of the charter memners


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## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> Right now I am getting somewhere between $350 and $500 a night for weekend rentals. Without VIP benefits I would be making somewhere around 10-20%. Margins are a little tight with that.
> 
> Jason



What size/location rents for $350 to $500 PER NIGHT?
4 bedroom Presidential Units?
Christmas/NYE/Holiday Weeks?


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## Ridewithme38 (Aug 8, 2012)

flexible said:


> What size/location rents for $350 to $500 PER NIGHT?
> 4 bedroom Presidential Units?
> Christmas/NYE/Holiday Weeks?



I'm willing to bet, though i don't know for sure, that Ron gets $350-$500 for his Mardi Gras and Bowl nights...And i bet things like the Large rooms in Bonnet Creek around Holidays and special occasions get that much, Plus some of the Murtle beach units overs over summer breaks...heck, i bet there are alot of holiday and Summer break units that can go for that much...i wouldn't pay that much, but alot of, non-timeshare owners would


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## ronparise (Aug 8, 2012)

flexible said:


> What size/location rents for $350 to $500 PER NIGHT?
> 4 bedroom Presidential Units?
> Christmas/NYE/Holiday Weeks?



Sorry Flexible

knowing those locations and weeks are what makes a rental business possible. Im keeping mine secret


----------



## Ridewithme38 (Aug 8, 2012)

ronparise said:


> Sorry Flexible
> 
> knowing those locations and weeks are what makes a rental business possible. Im keeping mine secret



This is why we need ron to join the LLC...Don't worry Ron, the contract signed in blood is mostly ceremonial...and the promise of the LLC now owning your everlasting soul is just a contractual thing, we don't really follow through with it


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## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> I'm willing to bet, though i don't know for sure, that Ron gets $350-$500 for his Mardi Gras and Bowl nights...And i bet things like the Large rooms in Bonnet Creek around Holidays and special occasions get that much, Plus some of the Murtle beach units overs over summer breaks...heck, i bet there are alot of holiday and Summer break units that can go for that much...i wouldn't pay that much, but alot of, non-timeshare owners would



Locations I would pay $500 for a weekend:
Edinburgh, Scotland during the Edinburgh Tatoo Festival

Places timeshare sale managers rented and paid Ken for:
Mexico - Holy week BUT that was BEFORE the Global Financial Crisis of 2008

Places I would assume would be a good deal for HOLIDAY weekends:
NYC
Boston

We RARELY bother to make reservations we MIGHT not use. 
But sometimes our travel plans change and someone else needs our Christmas/NYE reservations (which we made far in advance).


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## Beefnot (Aug 8, 2012)

Don't forget Mardi Gras, Superbowl, Christmas/NY Hawaii, San Francisco, etc.  Find out when things that bring a lot of tourists into town are taking place and there you go.


----------



## ronparise (Aug 8, 2012)

Beefnot said:


> Don't forget Mardi Gras, Superbowl, Christmas/NY Hawaii, San Francisco, etc.  Find out when things that bring a lot of tourists into town are taking place and there you go.



Exactly right I gave away my 2 superbowl reservations for $300 a night, and used the money to buy another  Mardi Gras week ($2000)

In another thread there's notice that Wyndham added 50 units in Orlando, Im about to pull the trigger on a couple of Christmas weeks


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## cotraveller (Aug 8, 2012)

ronparise said:


> In another thread there's notice that Wyndham added 50 units in Orlando, Im about to pull the trigger on a couple of Christmas weeks



Unless there is another thread that I didn't see, the new units in Orlando are WorldMark, not Wyndham.  Your Wyndham points won't help there, you'll have to spend most of your WorldMark credits. Then we can add the mega-renter discussion for WorldMark along with the Wyndham one that has been going in this thread.


----------



## rrlongwell (Aug 8, 2012)

Rent_Share said:


> I consider him one of the charter memners



One of?  I thought I was the orginal member.  Oh well.


----------



## Beefnot (Aug 8, 2012)

I thought there was a Wyndham Reunion Resort in Orlando


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## Ridewithme38 (Aug 8, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> One of?  I thought I was the orginal member.  Oh well.



I've always hoped i was one of the board members of that group!


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## jebloomquist (Aug 8, 2012)

flexible said:


> What size/location rents for $350 to $500 PER NIGHT?
> 4 bedroom Presidential Units?
> Christmas/NYE/Holiday Weeks?



I am looking to take a group to Wyndham at Waikiki Beach Walk. Week 52 requires 1,000,000 points for a 4 BR Presidential. Friday and Saturday alone are 200,000 points each. Put whatever value on those points that you want. At $5/1000 it is $1,000 for Friday and Saturday nights or $5,000 for the week.


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## jebloomquist (Aug 8, 2012)

deleted by jebloomquist


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## rrlongwell (Aug 8, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> I've always hoped i was one of the board members of that group!



I am not sure, but I think I am a miserable failure compared to you.  You showed up on the seen and they immediately put you in charge, I think.  But you better be carefull, I think Flexible is giving you a run at your position.  You may be about to be demoted.


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## ronparise (Aug 8, 2012)

cotraveller said:


> Unless there is another thread that I didn't see, the new units in Orlando are WorldMark, not Wyndham.  Your Wyndham points won't help there, you'll have to spend most of your WorldMark credits. Then we can add the mega-renter discussion for WorldMark along with the Wyndham one that has been going in this thread.



Yes, Wyndham added them to Worldmark, and I just made a Christmas reservation with 9% of my available credits This one for myself...I still may make 2 or 3 more if I think I can get them rented


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## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

Beefnot said:


> Don't forget Mardi Gras, Superbowl, Christmas/NY Hawaii, San Francisco, etc.  Find out when things that bring a lot of tourists into town are taking place and there you go.



Beefnot, 
Great advice.
I'm meeting with a Seven Sisters College student tomorrow who I hope will turn out to be a great virtual assistant & help with timeshares etc. 

*Ken & I have Bucket List items to check off.*

A few items among many checked off:
2008 Princess World Cruise
2009 Europe 4 months & cruising Spitzbergen near North Pole, Norway, Russia
2009 Rio, Iguazu Falls, Argentina
2009 Quark Expeditions with BBC filming Frozen Planet in Antarctica
2010 French Polynesia/Hawaii - 4 months winter
2010 Summer Banff, Jasper Canada, OR/MT/ID/NV
2011 - Belize, Mexico
2012 China/Tibet/Japan/Korea/Thailand/Australia

*Still on the list:*
Edinburgh Tatoo 2013
European River Cruises
Washington, DC - perhaps staying at Wyndham Old Town Alexandria a month or so

NOT on the list
renting timeshares unless we don't know what else to do with the inventory
making reservations unless I can't keep a virtual assistant to do so for us


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## Ridewithme38 (Aug 8, 2012)

ronparise said:


> Yes, Wyndham added them to Worldmark, and I just made a Christmas reservation with 9% of my available credits This one for myself...I still may make 2 or 3 more if I think I can get them rented



Dumb, off topic question....How do people travel on Christmas? Do they bring all the presents and hide them from the kids and tell them..."Santa knows our travel schedule"?


----------



## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

ronparise said:


> Exactly right I gave away my 2 superbowl reservations for $300 a night, and used the money to buy another  Mardi Gras week ($2000)
> 
> In another thread there's notice that Wyndham added 50 units in Orlando, *Im about to pull the trigger on a couple of Christmas weeks*



What does "Im about to pull the trigger on a couple of Christmas weeks" mean?
Are you referring to a cost to BOOK RESERVATIONS
OR to PURCHASE fixed weeks?


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## rrlongwell (Aug 8, 2012)

flexible said:


> What does "Im about to pull the trigger on a couple of Christmas weeks" mean?
> Are you referring to a cost to BOOK RESERVATIONS
> OR to PURCHASE fixed weeks?



He is referring to buying some.  I think he has used that term in other posts.


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## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> Dumb, off topic question....How do people travel on Christmas? Do they bring all the presents and hide them from the kids and tell them..."Santa knows our travel schedule"?



Since we "Don't do rain" we are ALWAYS away for Thanksgiving, Christmas Etc. Most resorts have a SANTA CLAUS who will give your child a gift that you have prearranged for Santa to give them.

People sometimes pack presents in a suitcase and give the suitcase or select items to the concierge or butler to keep so their smaller children will not find them in the days leading to Christmas.

BUT then Christmas is not about gifts.....

During our 2012 Viking River Cruise - 15 days with 25 people in China & Tibet, a woman said to me "_I admire how you are able to resist purchasing at every stop_." I said "_I want for nothing_." 

It amazes the SHEER VOLUME and number of suitcases required for some people to take home items especially IF they could have been purchased at a U.S. Walmart.


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## ronparise (Aug 8, 2012)

Ridewithme38 said:


> Dumb, off topic question....How do people travel on Christmas? Do they bring all the presents and hide them from the kids and tell them..."Santa knows our travel schedule"?



not everyone has kids.., or does presents...but if you do,  UPS delivers to timeshares too


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## flexible (Aug 8, 2012)

jebloomquist said:


> I am looking to take a group to Wyndham at Waikiki Beach Walk. Week 52 requires 1,000,000 points for a 4 BR Presidential. Friday and Saturday alone are 200,000 points each. Put whatever value on those points that you want. At $5/1000 it is $1,000 for Friday and Saturday nights or $5,000 for the week.



We toured Waikiki Beach Walk but I had NO IDEA it would that expensive for a family to spend Christmas there. Perhaps because so few resorts have 4 bedroom penthouses and the renters would not want to use 2 x 2 bedroom penthouses. 

We were in Hawaii 5 Dec 2009-31 March 2010 mostly Marriotts & a few VI. Most of the 8 weeks of Marriotts in Hawaii it cost II exchange fee + depositing a $325 MF resort. HOWEVER, that MIGHT have been a unique time frame after the global exonomic problems of 2008/09/10 when owners at Marriott Hawaii resorts deposited more frequently? Or airfare to HNL was higher?


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## ronparise (Aug 8, 2012)

flexible said:


> What does "Im about to pull the trigger on a couple of Christmas weeks" mean?
> Are you referring to a cost to BOOK RESERVATIONS
> OR to PURCHASE fixed weeks?



I booked a week with some of my worldmark credits at Reunion..and if Ride is right about getting 300 a night for Christmas week in Orlando, Ill do another couple more...Ride, why dont you bring your parents and daughter, to Orlando for Christmas..this place sleeps 10


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## am1 (Aug 8, 2012)

ronparise said:


> I booked a week with some of my worldmark credits at Reunion..and if Ride is right about getting 300 a night for Christmas week in Orlando, Ill do another couple more...Ride, why dont you bring your parents and daughter, to Orlando for Christmas..this place sleeps 10



Get the money up front.  

Or he could upgrade to Bonnet Creek and pay less money. About $50 a night less.


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## cotraveller (Aug 9, 2012)

ronparise said:


> Yes, Wyndham added them to Worldmark, and I just made a Christmas reservation with *9% of my available credits* This one for myself...I still may make 2 or 3 more if I think I can get them rented



That is a lot of WorldMark credits you are sitting on!  I guess you do want to become a WorldMark mega-renter.  More fuel for the move to put limits on the WorldMark rental market.


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## e.bram (Aug 9, 2012)

flexible:
Do the Seven Sister Colleges still exist. What are the?


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## flexible (Aug 11, 2012)

Amazing thread about this EBay Seller RedWeek4Less & his affiliated companies which predates the OP's mention of this 2.3M Wyndham point auction which I have NO IDEA who the WINNER was since GNorth16 accidently added a zero bidding $55,000.00 when he meant to bid $5,000.00 (I accidently entered the wrong numbers on EBay once too BUT not that large a number.)

RedWeek4Less scam thread: 
http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176043&page=2

My husband called this EBay 2.3M Wyndham story "comic relief" for how many things could go wrong AND "_What they don't tell YOU is what you NEEDED to know."_


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## rrlongwell (Aug 11, 2012)

flexible said:


> ...  RE: post above this one that mentioned me. I'm confused. We've been crazy busy with only a few moments to visit TUG recently. I don't know where the "seven sisters" quote came from ...



See post 125


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## Cheryl20772 (Aug 11, 2012)

ronparise said:


> Sorry Flexible
> 
> knowing those locations and weeks are what makes a rental business possible. Im keeping mine secret


Owww!  Look who's playing close to the vest now 

Anyone who has been reading Ron's posts knows what he is doing....


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## rrlongwell (Aug 11, 2012)

Cheryl20772 said:


> Owww!  Look who's playing close to the vest now
> 
> Anyone who has been reading Ron's posts knows what he is doing....



Yes, the main change in flow of the advise tends to be that he is willing to pay more for good resorts, good timeframes than he was a while ago.  Wise man.  I am not sure if he has found somemore that he is not sharing.


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## Beefnot (Aug 11, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> Yes, the main change in flow of the advise tends to be that he is willing to pay more for good resorts, good timeframes than he was a while ago.  Wise man.  I am not sure if he has found somemore that he is not sharing.



I think Ron has shared much of his secret sauce if one follows his posts, but he is not laying it all out in one place. However, there may be a few nuggets or nuances that he may only hint at or not even mention at all. I am not far different, though on the exchanging side.


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## ronparise (Aug 11, 2012)

Cheryl20772 said:


> Owww!  Look who's playing close to the vest now
> 
> Anyone who has been reading Ron's posts knows what he is doing....



Your are absolutely right my "secret"  is that New Orleans has lots of popular weekend festivals, and there are lots of expensive hotels in the French Quarter, but not too many timeshares....And of those timeshares only one  works well for weekend rentals. I own there. Thats no secret.

If there is a  secret it is is that I have read the original timeshare documents (several times with a high-liter). and I know the rules and procedures there better than anyone. and I have developed a relationship with the guest services manager and front desk manager, and with the folks on the reservations desk.

Because of that,  I see opportunities there that no one else does..How else can you explain that there was a guaranteed Mardi Gras week offered on ebay that I was able to buy for $100. No other bidders.  In the first year before any fees were due I brought in $3000 with that week. And just last month there was another such week for sale in the TUG classifieds for everyone to see... but I got it (more than $100 but still a fair price)

There are really no secrets, we all have access to the same ingredients, but only a few are able to put them together to make our own "secret sauce"


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## rrlongwell (Aug 11, 2012)

ronparise said:


> ... and I know the rules and procedures there better than anyone. and I have developed a relationship with the guest services manager and front desk manager, and with the folks on the reservations desk.
> 
> Because of that,  I see opportunities there that no one else does.



This is not a whole lot different than the sales pitch coming out of Shawnee Village and some other locations that they have access to the inside information from Extra Holidays on events, which dates to rent etc.

This is one of the primary reasons a indivual owner does not have any chance against the mega rentors on a percentage basis.

Ron's posting is one of the best reasons I have seen up for Wyndham and other points based or floating weeks based systems to impose some limits on the mega renters.  The use of company inside information is absolutly a real competive advantage and should be offset by thoughs firms that are letting their employees engage in that type of activity.


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## jjmanthei05 (Aug 11, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> This is not a whole lot different than the sales pitch coming out of Shawnee Village and some other locations that they have access to the inside information from Extra Holidays on events, which dates to rent etc.
> 
> This is one of the primary reasons a indivual owner does not have any chance against the mega rentors on a percentage basis.
> 
> Ron's posting is one of the best reasons I have seen up for Wyndham and other points based or floating weeks based systems to impose some limits on the mega renters.  The use of company inside information is absolutly a real competive advantage and should be offset by thoughs firms that are letting their employees engage in that type of activity.



I don't understand what your "competitive advantage" comment means. He doesn't have special access to inventory that no one else does. He said that there were 2 postings one on tug, the other on eBay. So his competitive advantage is that he looks at timeshare postings and can read? The only advantage I can see that any mega renters has is they don't have to worry about schedule. So they know 10 or 13 months in advance of what units they want to rent and don't need to know if they are going to be able to get off work ect. You make it sound like they get access to inventory days before everyone else because they are in bed with Wyndham. They play by the same rules as everyone else, they are just better prepared.


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## tschwa2 (Aug 11, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> This is not a whole lot different than the sales pitch coming out of Shawnee Village and some other locations that they have access to the inside information from Extra Holidays on events, which dates to rent etc.
> 
> This is one of the primary reasons a indivual owner does not have any chance against the mega rentors on a percentage basis.
> 
> Ron's posting is one of the best reasons I have seen up for Wyndham and other points based or floating weeks based systems to impose some limits on the mega renters.  The use of company inside information is absolutly a real competive advantage and should be offset by thoughs firms that are letting their employees engage in that type of activity.



The difference is your sales pitch was a lie (surprise  ), if you buy more retail points I will be your personal inside guy helping you out.  

Ron's trick is to know the product and do his own research on purchasing, pricing and which dates to reserve, and make his own contacts.


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## flexible (Aug 11, 2012)

ronparise said:


> Your are absolutely right my "secret"  is that New Orleans has lots of popular weekend festivals, and their are lots of expensive hotels in the French Quarter, but not too many timeshares....And of those timeshares only one  works well for weekend rentals. I own there. Thats no secret.
> 
> If there is a  secret it is is that I have read the original timeshare documents (several times with a high-liter). and I know the rules and procedures there better than anyone. and I have developed a relationship with the guest services manager and front desk manager, and with the folks on the reservations desk.
> 
> ...



Ron,
In trying to applying your SAGE advice to my INSANE situation:
1) *SPECIALIZE*

2)* Get to KNOW all the KEY PLAYERS at the resorts you specialize in renting
-Reservations staff
-Reservations Supervisor
-Hotel Manager for EACH property owned by resort
-OPERATIONS Manager for each property
-Front Desk
-Chief Concierge
-staff concierges
-Butlers
-CEO
-ETC

3) Know your CONTRACTS.
- We ENLARGE our contract documents
- Highlight
-We wrote a NEW Document "ECVC Points Clarified" with paragraphs defining:
current
borrowed
rented
banked
transferred
PDP points
about 8 categories
THEN asked Member Services & other management REVIEW to verify we understood correctly. In at least one case, we had it wrong but it was due to CONFLICTING language in the resort's documents. Since the resort is in Mexico it is NOT that easy for everything to be translated accurately, but we make every effort to UNDERSTAND the rules.


Granted, my purposes are not to be in the "rental business" but to use excess inventory. If I need to come out of retirement, perhaps I could do this as an income in my old age IF the global economic climate is such that people are still spending money on vacations and the resorts are in business. (We are optimists.)

I met my husband at VI Torres Mazatlan in Dec 2006. It was the ONLY timeshare I owned at the time. He wanted to marry me 9 days later. Since I a became a resident of a CALIFORNIA again (Community Property State) shortly after we married, apparently I am considered by the title companies ETC for deeds we have deeded back to own half.

We are trying to downsize our porfolio:
1) 3.8M points contract (Mexico or cruises)
2) 26 weeks consecutive no MF + double if we use VF weeks -Mexico only - about 6 locations 
3) PV - nice resort - our contract does NOT require AI - seems to be BIGGEST selling point to people renting from us
4) VI - 6 contracts that we would have dumped 30 Jun 2012 BUT realized we'd lose $10K in banked points. So we hope to use them up before the next MF cycle (30 Jun 2013) then dump them.*


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## rrlongwell (Aug 11, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> I don't understand what your "competitive advantage" comment means. He doesn't have special access to inventory that no one else does. He said that there were 2 postings one on tug, the other on eBay. So his competitive advantage is that he looks at timeshare postings and can read? The only advantage I can see that any mega renters has is they don't have to worry about schedule. So they know 10 or 13 months in advance of what units they want to rent and don't need to know if they are going to be able to get off work ect. You make it sound like they get access to inventory days before everyone else because they are in bed with Wyndham. They play by the same rules as everyone else, they are just better prepared.



Flexible understands and responded much better than I could.  See her point number 2.  The access to the inside information would be a huge competive advantage that a lowly owner does not get.


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## tschwa2 (Aug 11, 2012)

It is an advantage but you don't need to be a megarenter to do it.  If you make an effort you could probably get the "insider advantage' with owning one week. I own 4 weeks in Myrtle Beach(2 different resorts) and 4 weeks in Hilton Head (3 different resorts).  I haven't been to Myrtle Beach in 3 years.  Sometimes I deposit, sometimes I rent.  I plan on going down to SC next month.  I will stop by the resorts, introduce myself to the people I don't already know and take pictures of the resorts, rooms if I can and general area.  I will also scout out if there is any of Carolina's elusive "brick and mortar" rental agencies that would be available to rent at a higher price on the units i won't be using.  

This will give me a competitive advantage but it isn't being unfairly sold to a few.


The advantage that the mega renters have is they have the time (its their business) to put in the extra effort that a family with kids with crazy schedules may not have  the desire to put into getting their one or two vacations per year.


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## ronparise (Aug 11, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> This is not a whole lot different than the sales pitch coming out of Shawnee Village and some other locations that they have access to the inside information from Extra Holidays on events, which dates to rent etc.
> 
> This is one of the primary reasons a indivual owner does not have any chance against the mega rentors on a percentage basis.
> 
> Ron's posting is one of the best reasons I have seen up for Wyndham and other points based or floating weeks based systems to impose some limits on the mega renters.  The use of company inside information is absolutly a real competive advantage and should be offset by thoughs firms that are letting their employees engage in that type of activity.



There is no "inside information" here This stuff is available to anyone. Knowing the resort staff doesnt get me any special deals, and they dont hold stuff for me, but they do treat my guests well when they arrive.. for example there are two types of studio units here, one with one king sized bed, and one with two queens. If I rent to a party that needs two queens, its important to know that they will get the room with two queens. It doesnt always happen. but because I know to ask in advance, and who to ask, I can assure my client that the right room will be there when they arrive. I now have a happy repeat customer, rather than one who had to sleep on the floor. 

Another factor thats important to my success here is that they allow split reservations and that the two splits can overlap...Thats not clear on the deed. The reservations people know it, but its not something they volunteer. Lots of owners dont know this, and dont even know enough to ask the right questions,  I asked, and I had to go to Wyndhams legal dept to get it, but I have it in writing.. This split week thing is what enabled me to get two reservations for superbowl 2013 with the one weeks ownership. They also allow what they call right to use weeks. For each week I own, I can pay the mf for another week and use it. The combination of split weeks and right to use weeks allowed me to make 22 reservations for the same weekend with just 6 weeks owned. ( I now have 10) Anyone could have done this if they owned the weeks and if they knew the rules..I do and I did

Flexible hit on the most important thing when renting  tiimeshares.  Specialize

 Hell...I can tell you  how long it takes to walk from the resort to the Superdome, or the French Quarter, and if you dont want to walk, I can tell you where the streetcar stops, how much it costs and where to buy your discounted three day pass. If you insist on bringing your car, this resort has the cheapest valet parking in town. I can even send you a menu for the best steak house in town that happens to be located in the same building.  .None of this is insider information. It is out there and available to everyone.  But Im probably the only guy that took the time, and made the effort to learn it all. And was stupid enough to buy 10 weeks here.


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## flexible (Aug 11, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> Flexible understands and responded much better than I could.  See her point number 2.  The *access to the inside information would be a huge competive advantage that a lowly owner does not get*.



Does TUG have a list of DEFINITIONS for:

"Lowly owner"
"Mega Renter"

*LOWLY OWNERS:* Are they like my friends with 77K ECVC & another 90K ECVC points. IF we are in a resort restaurant or around the pool and they mention a request they feel was ignored by a waiter, resort staffer etc and I send email to the HOTEL MANAGER or assistant on my laptop (sometimes without their knowing it) since I tend to know MOST people employed by the resort and would rather not *HEAR UNNECESSARY COMPLAINTS* while I'm at the resort  is this an implication that if they didn't have a friend like me their requests MIGHT be ignored. Perhaps because the resorts are in Mexico and our friends, Ken & I are still struggling with Spanish.


*MEGA RENTER* defined as people like retired real estate brokers who buy points etc resale, read the contracts, and learn how to carve out some additional retirement income?

What classification does my soon to be 86 year old nearly blind (due to AMD) husband fit in?
What classification am I? - 4th wife who only agreed to upgrade one of the over 50+ contracts he signed with develpers since the 1970s.

Ken's 3rd wife was in Mexico with him. Entered ICU in Mexico. After 6 weeks ICU Mexico, airlifted, 6 weeks ICU in U.S. she died when Blue Cross reached $1,999,985.23. Ken managed to drive down to Mexico as a widower. We both checked into Torres Mazatlan on 12/9/06.

Ken ONLY had 2M ECVC points when we met on 12/12/06. He mentioned he wanted to marry me on 12/21/06 as he drove me to the airport. After I took care of some business in the U.S. and returned Ken had been UPGRADED FOUR TIMES (2 upgrades in LESS than 3 days.....gee....couldn't they have RESCINDED the prior to save on the duplicate closing costs" I returned on 1/27/07 to realize he had 3.4M ECVC points. 

The Mayan upgrade and RCI Points purchased between 12/21/06 & my return on 1/27/07 were more than I can manage.


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## bnoble (Aug 11, 2012)

> But Im probably the only guy that took the time, and made the effort to learn it all.


Some day, you should sit down and figure out what your hourly rate is, including all of this time and effort.


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## Beefnot (Aug 11, 2012)

bnoble said:


> Some day, you should sit down and figure out what your hourly rate is, including all of this time and effort.



What may be of more pertinence is what other endeavors would provide equivalent or greater overall satisfaction and income.  Would one prefer to spend 1,000 hours per year at something they do not enjoy to make $50,000, or 2,000 hours doing something they love to make $80,000?


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## ronparise (Aug 11, 2012)

bnoble said:


> Some day, you should sit down and figure out what your hourly rate is, including all of this time and effort.



so far the hourly rate is crap, but now that I know what I know, from here forward the hourly rate ought to be pretty good. Where it will really pay off is when I start offering my services as a consultant...thats all pay and no work..

But I dont think in terms of hourly rate. Ive been a commissioned salesman for a long time (I sold my home delivery service of the Washington Post in 1958) Ive had months that Ive worked 250 hours without a payday, and other times  when Ive made my year with one  phone call..So it all evens out..and as Beefnot says...with this timeshare thing Im having a good time doing it

My real secret is where Im going next...


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## Beefnot (Aug 11, 2012)

ronparise said:


> My real secret is where Im going next...



I think I might know...


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## bnoble (Aug 11, 2012)

No, I get that.  I treat exchanging as a hobby.  And, I sometimes like to think of all the money I'm "saving".  But, it's a pretty poor value for the time invested, all told.


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## Beefnot (Aug 11, 2012)

bnoble said:


> No, I get that.  I treat exchanging as a hobby.  And, I sometimes like to think of all the money I'm "saving".  But, it's a pretty poor value for the time invested, all told.



What else would you be doing with your time? If you cannot think of a better alternative, I would consider it a pretty decent investment.


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## flexible (Aug 11, 2012)

ronparise said:


> so far the hourly rate is crap, but now that I know what I know, from here forward the hourly rate ought to be pretty good. Where it will really pay off is when I start offering my services as a consultant...thats all pay and no work..
> 
> But I dont think in terms of hourly rate. Ive been a commissioned salesman for a long time (I sold my home delivery service of the Washington Post in 1958) Ive had months that Ive worked 250 hours without a payday, and other times  when Ive made my year with one  phone call..So it all evens out..and as Beefnot says...with this timeshare thing Im having a good time doing it
> 
> My real secret is where Im going next...



OK
This MIGHT be a great time to PM me your *HOURLY CONSULTING RATE*.

We are grateful to find TWO new VIRTUAL ASSISTANTS in GREEN ACRES but
Our "project manager" (Harvard grad just delivered her 2nd baby today)
and her "assistant" who needs to drive CA->Bryn Mayr late next week
(I doubt either knew what a timeshare was when I met them.)

Do you want to join the payday party?
If I don't DELEGATE:
- reservations
- websites (timeshare related & many for hobbies)
- responding to inquires
- payment processing
and a TON more action items
ETC

TOO many other actions items and incomplete check marks on our BUCKET LIST.


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## Cheryl20772 (Aug 11, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> This is not a whole lot different than the sales pitch coming out of Shawnee Village and some other locations that they have access to the inside information from Extra Holidays on events, which dates to rent etc.


I think it's way different.  The sales pitch is just that... an empty pitch... with nothing behind it.  Those sales people have no connection to Extra Holidays.  If a person tries to contact the sales person after the interview, they won't answer the phone. Ron has done his own real homework to make connections and find out the information he needs to get the most from the points he owns...whether to use for his own vacation or to rent for profit.





> This is one of the primary reasons a indivual owner does not have any chance against the mega rentors on a percentage basis.


What difference does it make to an individual owner if those points owned by a so-called "mega renter" are owned by one Platinum owner or by by multiple individuals?  The points will be used or lost forever.  Ron is not even VIP (unless he has completed an account sharing agreement as was mentioned before).  He's just another owner like you and me.  We have the same opportunities and informaiton available to us.





> Ron's posting is one of the best reasons I have seen up for Wyndham and other points based or floating weeks based systems to impose some limits on the mega renters.  The use of company inside information is absolutly a real competive advantage and should be offset by thoughs firms that are letting their employees engage in that type of activity.


The information Ron describes is not "company inside information".  All anyone needs is a local calendar of events to know when units will be in highest demand for a particular area.  The personal connections Ron describes probably helps his rentals work more smoothly, but they are not necessary to know where the rental profits are.  

If Wyndham imposed any limits on "mega renters", they will be imposing limits on all owners.  We already have seen how their attempts to limit have curtailed our ability to transfer points between accounts, have VIP unlimited guest certificates, have inexpensive guest certificates.  Do you really think we need them to take more benefits away from all of us?


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## ronparise (Aug 11, 2012)

Cheryl20772 said:


> I think it's way different.  The sales pitch is just that... an empty pitch... with nothing behind it.  Those sales people have no connection to Extra Holidays.  If a person tries to contact the sales person after the interview, they won't answer the phone. Ron has done his own real homework to make connections and find out the information he needs to get the most from the points he owns...whether to use for his own vacation or to rent for profit.What difference does it make to an individual owner if those points owned by a so-called "mega renter" are owned by one Platinum owner or by by multiple individuals?  The points will be used or lost forever.  Ron is not even VIP (unless he has completed an account sharing agreement as was mentioned before).  He's just another owner like you and me.  We have the same opportunities and informaiton available to us.The information Ron describes is not "company inside information".  All anyone needs is a local calendar of events to know when units will be in highest demand for a particular area.  The personal connections Ron describes probably helps his rentals work more smoothly, but they are not necessary to know where the rental profits are.
> 
> If Wyndham imposed any limits on "mega renters", they will be imposing limits on all owners.  We already have seen how their attempts to limit have curtailed our ability to transfer points between accounts, have VIP unlimited guest certificates, have inexpensive guest certificates.  Do you really think we need them to take more benefits away from all of us?



Actually I am a silver vip now, but those benefits dont help a lot. Most of my reservations are made well in advance of check in and I dont have the nerve to try a cancel and rebook for the discount. The extra 4 guest certs help, but not that much. Although the wyndham points do ok, my real money makers are the fixed and floating weeks I described in a post above


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## ronparise (Aug 11, 2012)

Beefnot said:


> I think I might know...



Everything will be revealed in due time...but not yet


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## Cheryl20772 (Aug 11, 2012)

ronparise said:


> Actually I am a silver vip now, but those benefits dont help a lot. Most of my reservations are made well in advance of check in and I dont have the nerve to try a cancel and rebook for the discount. The extra 4 guest certs help, but not that much. Although the wyndham points do ok, my real money makers are the fixed and floating weeks I described in a post above


Don't forget about the free unit size upgrade (when available at 30 days prior to check in).  We usually travel off season and almost always find a nice upgrade.  Sometimes, if I haven't requested an upgrade before check in, we've gotten an upgrade at the check in desk.  I wouldn't cancel and rebook either, but usually just wait till within 60 days to make the reservation.  Guess you can't do that with planning special rental times though...but for personal travel off season it's good.


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## ronparise (Aug 12, 2012)

Cheryl20772 said:


> Don't forget about the free unit size upgrade (when available at 30 days prior to check in).  We usually travel off season and almost always find a nice upgrade.  Sometimes, if I haven't requested an upgrade before check in, we've gotten an upgrade at the check in desk.  I wouldn't cancel and rebook either, but usually just wait till within 60 days to make the reservation.  Guess you can't do that with planning special rental times though...but for personal travel off season it's good.



On a personal level I did book both a one bedroom and a three bedroom. I cancelled and rebooked the one bedroom for the discount and then cancelled the three bedroom and upgraded the one.. The end result was a three bedroom unit at a discounted one bedroom price.. The only risk if it hadnt worked,  was my marriage. Like you said..personal.  I dont paly with a customers reservation for a few dollars

Where the discount does help is when Im trying to fill a customers request in the 60 days before check in. Im on the computer all day and night looking for a cancellation. If I get one, its at a discounted price.


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