# HGVC Deal for Hawaii



## cellphonejunkie (Sep 3, 2015)

Hi Guys,

Over the years, I've checked this site after every developer presentation and convinced myself to not buy. Now that I'm financially stronger and have two young kids, I'm starting to feel a timeshare is right for my family.

Today, we spent the morning on a HGVC VIP (return trip from last year's decline to buy, but paid $1700 for a week in Lagoon Tower) presentation. We started at $52K for 8400 pts at Hokolani which was out of the question at over $6/pt. After referring my cousin's info on which she was able to buy for less than $5/pt, they're now offering 7000pts for a 2br in Waikoloa for $35K. Of course, they'll throw in some bonus HHonors pts. I actually got a separate offer from them a couple months ago for a week in Waikoloa for 2016 for $500 which I've accepted.

I'm sure it's been discussed a million times over, but since everyone loves to chat about timeshares, can you tell me why anyone would buy from a developer if I can buy the same thing on resale? What are the major cons with buying resale (ie. No Silver status with HH, pay higher fees for booking, etc.)?

If I'm understanding things right, for $35K I could buy resale pts from owners at various locations and have those be my homebase for priority booking. But strategically, it makes more sense to put my eggs in the Vegas basket for the cheapest maintenance fees. Is Vegas still the cheapest in MF? In short, if you had $10K to spend, what strategy would you take? My preference is a 2br minimum since we need the space.

Lastly, which Ebay buyers have you guys bought from that are legit or which reseller brokers should I get in touch with? I'm in no hurry, so I'm prepared to be patient to maximize the deal.

Thanks!

CJ


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## Talent312 (Sep 3, 2015)

*Can you tell me why anyone would buy from a developer if I can buy the same thing on resale?*
-- Becuz they're frightened by the prospect of saving ~2/3 of the sale price?
Doesn't make sense to me. Unless you're hell bent on elite status (see below).

*What are the major cons with buying resale (ie. No Silver status with HH, pay higher fees for booking, etc.)?*
-- There are no cons. You still get HH-Silver (which you can easily bump to Gold with a HH credit card from Am-Ex or CitiBank). There's no difference in fees. You are treated eggsactly like a retail-owner, except in this respect: Resale points don't count for elite status that starts @14K points... but not even elite-members say the perks are worth the extra $$.

Two highly reputable HGVC resale brokers recommended here most often:
www.judikoz.com (Judi Kozlowski) and www.sellingtimeshares.net (Seth Nock).


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## Great3 (Sep 3, 2015)

Wow, it sounds like you are still willing to buy resale after checking out this site so many times.  You can get 7000 pts, for about $5-$8K.

You don't pay a higher reservation fee, but if you did, the difference between > $30K for developer and < $10K for resale can last a lifetime of reservations fees (but it is not more) and still have more than $10K leftover in your life.

And yes, Vegas is good for MFs, at least the Karen and Strip locations.  That's what I will do (Buy 2 bedroom 7000 pts. in Vegas) with that $10K if you really want a Hilton timeshare.  Buy in Vegas unless you need priority booking on Hawaii, than buy in Hawaii (Just not Big Island).

Use the the two brokers recommended above, not eBay, unless you are a risk taker and can stomach things not going smoothly.

Great3


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## presley (Sep 3, 2015)

cellphonejunkie said:


> In short, if you had $10K to spend, what strategy would you take? My preference is a 2br minimum since we need the space.



I'd likely buy one of the older Vegas properties since the annual costs tend to be the lowest. If you shop with one of the brokers listed above, they will help you throughout the process and educate you. You can buy off of Ebay if you don't mind not being walked through everything and taking a chance that closing could take a lot longer than expected.


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## CalGalTraveler (Sep 3, 2015)

Talent312 said:


> *Can you tell me why anyone would buy from a developer if I can buy the same thing on resale?*
> -- Becuz they're frightened by the prospect of saving ~2/3 of the sale price?
> Doesn't make sense to me. Unless you're hell bent on elite status (see below).
> 
> ...



There are pros and cons to everything. You should not view this as all resale or all developer. Although we paid retail for an upgrade which made the most financial and risk sense, our next deal will be a Vegas resale to add points.  After that who knows? We are building a portfolio.

I see five scenarios for going with a developer: 

* some people are not as real estate or financially savvy as this group and do not feel comfortable with the risk of a resale. Timeshares and resale are complicated; some people have been stung with resale or had deals that got hung.  Some people pay for a financial adviser and some prefer DIY.

* Some people value their time very highly and they are not willing to wait or hassle with a resale deal. They both work 60 hour plus weeks at well-paying companies, have kids, (possibly parents to support too) and are not interested nor have the energy in putting the time to research, look for deals, and manage the nuances - $50k is not a lot of money to these people  (about the price of a new car) so it is easier to go with the developer and take the bonus points so they can spend valuable time vacationing with their loved ones rather than spending time scouring for real estate deals and saving a bit of money. These people are not stupid, they simply value their time differently.  

* upgrades are sometimes better from the developer based on hassle, time/risk to sell versus getting full price for the existing unit. You are also not paying two closing fees and often get significant bonus points which sweeten the deal.  We recently upgraded and the net difference between resale of selling and buying versus getting full price for our old unit with bonus points was a small premium relative to the time and risk involved. e.g. if we could not sell our existing unit before 2016 we would be stuck with an additional maintenance fee thus reducing the value of the sale.  The developer took care of everything.

* During an economic downturn or project closeout you may be able to get deep discounts.

* You want a new resort e.g. Maui, Hilton Head where resale will not exist for a few years or you want a particular kind of unit e.g. penthouse that is not easy to find on resale.


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## alexadeparis (Sep 3, 2015)

Another reason that someone might not want to buy resale: 
They simply DO NOT believe that you could buy the same thing MUCH cheaper on resale without there being some kind of "Catch". 

They think since they were quoted $50k from the developer, it cannot possibly be less than $10k for the same unit from a reseller and somehow NOT be a scam. 

I don't know if they are just misinformed, naive, overly skeptical, been scammed before, some combination of all of those or ????????   
There are a lot of people that think this way. 

In fact, I know someone that has two retail timeshares in one of the same systems I own. When I told them I have like 11 or 12 timeshares that I paid a TOTAL of less than $25k for, that person looked at me like I had horns growing out of my head. It was not until that person went WITH ME on vacation, as my guest, on MY POINTS, in the same system, that they believed that I had legitimately purchased a resale timeshare that actually "worked".

:hysterical:


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## 1Kflyerguy (Sep 3, 2015)

There are some really good points on pro or con of developer purchases..   Like CalGalTraveler i got what i believe to be a good deal on an upgrade purchase from the developer.. But that only worked out because i paid so much for my original purchase... I am sure i would have money ahead overall if all of my purchases were resale.. 

As for buying in Hawaii, I love the Big Island, and we own in Waikaloa.  But i probably would not buy there unless you plan to visit that resort often.  

We go to Hawaii almost every year, so I prefer to own where i go, and am willing to pay the higher MF for the flexibility and connection to the location.


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## cellphonejunkie (Sep 3, 2015)

Thanks for all the great feedback and resources! I'll be calling them soon.

Aloha!


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## Andythefox (Sep 8, 2015)

Buy 5000 or 7000 pts platinum in Vegas or Orlando and then book HGVC Waikoloa 9 months out. We have 5000 points and go to Waikoloa every two years. We book the platinum suite for 9,600 points every time and have never not been able to hold the room number we requested.


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## JSparling (Sep 8, 2015)

alexadeparis said:


> They think since they were quoted $50k from the developer, it cannot possibly be less than $10k for the same unit from a reseller and somehow NOT be a scam.



Great, great point. Most of us have probably been burned by the generally correct "it's too good to be true" tag line. And if you're telling me that the $10K unit you're selling me on E-Bay is the same, IDENTICAL one HGVC wants $50K for there is no way that's not "too good to be true." However, as us experienced people know, in this case and with HGVC it is indeed true.


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## hockeybrain (Sep 8, 2015)

We go to Hawaii every year at HGVC (Honolulu), at least the past six years in a row at either a Northeast Winter vacation or August vacation time.   We go exactly when we want without stress because we own and book at the 10 month or so mark.  If you plan on only going to HHV in a prime time or plan to in the future I would recommend owning there.   Off times at Hawaii are available at the nine month mark and sometimes for other windows but prime time windows are hard to trade into.   Owning elsewhere expecting to trade into Hawaii prime season may very well prove disappointing and at the very least stressful.   So, my advice if you really want to always go to HHV is to own there, but buy there resale .


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## Armani987 (Sep 21, 2015)

hockeybrain said:


> We go to Hawaii every year at HGVC (Honolulu), at least the past six years in a row at either a Northeast Winter vacation or August vacation time.   We go exactly when we want without stress because we own and book at the 10 month or so mark.  If you plan on only going to HHV in a prime time or plan to in the future I would recommend owning there.   Off times at Hawaii are available at the nine month mark and sometimes for other windows but prime time windows are hard to trade into.   Owning elsewhere expecting to trade into Hawaii prime season may very well prove disappointing and at the very least stressful.   So, my advice if you really want to always go to HHV is to own there, but buy there resale .



I'm looking into buying a resale and contemplating whether I should go into HGVC or SVO, but leaning towards HGVC. 

My purpose too is to go to Hawaii and go there every year around very end of August ~ September. Would you consider that a prime season? With so many schools starting mid August, resorts have been pretty empty the past few years in Hawaii during the time we go. Also, I woukd like to visit few places in Socal during the off-season too. 

My plan was to buy one in Vegas worth 5K points, and use Gold season in King's Land or HHV. I'm not too stuck to one location and have a little bit of flexibility for the next 5 years, and after that, full flexibility as my daughter will go off to college. Also ,  I never book my trip 12 months ahead, but more like 3~6, so will it make a difference not owning one in Hawaii?

Thanks!


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## presley (Sep 21, 2015)

Armani987 said:


> My purpose too is to go to Hawaii and go there every year around very end of August ~ September. Would you consider that a prime season? With so many schools starting mid August, resorts have been pretty empty the past few years in Hawaii during the time we go. Also, I woukd like to visit few places in Socal during the off-season too.
> 
> My plan was to buy one in Vegas worth 5K points, and use Gold season in King's Land or HHV. I'm not too stuck to one location and have a little bit of flexibility for the next 5 years, and after that, full flexibility as my daughter will go off to college. Also ,  I never book my trip 12 months ahead, but more like 3~6, so will it make a difference not owning one in Hawaii?


That is prime season for Hawaii (as is most of the year). 
You can own Vegas and book Hawaii, but I don't know if you will have enough points to book a full week if you want larger than a one bedroom. Make sure you check the points charts before you buy a contract.
Home resort advantage only matters if you book over 9 months and up to a year in advance. Once you hit the 9 month mark, it doesn't matter where you own. All rooms are open to all members.


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## vacationtime1 (Sep 21, 2015)

Armani987 said:


> My purpose too is to go to Hawaii and go there every year around very end of August ~ September. Would you consider that a prime season? With so many schools starting mid August, resorts have been pretty empty the past few years in Hawaii during the time we go.





presley said:


> That is prime season for Hawaii (as is most of the year).



Hawaii becomes less crowded once school starts.  Although many developers (e.g. Starwood and Marriott) sell Hawaii as "platinum" season year-round, that does not reflect reality.  Although I have no experience with HGVC, Starwood and Marriott are easy enough to reserve during "off" season -- late April through May and late August through mid-December.


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## Armani987 (Sep 22, 2015)

Thanks for the input guys. I'm gonna try to work out a deal  for 5K EOY or a 3.4K EY. That would get me a 1bdrm in Platinum on one of the phases in KL.  If I do decide that I need a bigger unit, I might bank one year or go buy more. My plan is to get a SVO for years that I don't have HGVC and I will be a very happy man.


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