# Acquisition News [Gold Key Resorts] [MERGED]



## RuralEngineer

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/di...rough-gold-key-resorts-acquisition-2015-08-17



> Diamond Resorts International, Inc. announced today that it has executed an agreement to purchase the vacation ownership business of Gold Key Resorts, which manages five vacation ownership resorts in Virginia Beach, VA and one in the Outer Banks, NC,



http://hamptonroads.com/2015/08/diamond-resorts-buys-6-resorts-gold-key-168-million

very interesting.

Stephen


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## tschwa2

So are they acquiring Gold Key or just acquiring some of Gold Key's unsold inventory (which is primarily off season and Beachwoods in NC)?

That could be very bad for Gold Key owners.  I don't think they will have to worry about the special assessments that go along with some of DRI's other acquisitions but no one who is taken over by DRI seems to really think the experience is good.


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## traderjoez

The news articles clearly indicate that DRI has bought the resorts/business of Gold Key, not just excess inventory.  Another one bites the Diamond dust.


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## tschwa2

Thanks.  I saw that when I had time to do more than a 20 second skim.  I generally dislike the idea of staying at DRI due to the nickle and dimeing and/or medium to large resort fee when doing an exchange and having to pay for things like parking, internet, and other recreational charges that other resorts include for exchanges.  

I really like Gold Key VB properties.  Enough that I am generally willing to pay the parking fee that 2 out of the 6 properties charge.  Don't know if I will continue to stay with them if additional charges are going to be levied on exchangers.


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## harveyhaddixfan

*Diamond Resorts International Buys Gold Key Resort [MERGED AT THIS POINT]s*

So Gold Key bought Barrier Island Station Kitty Hawk last November, starts a $22 million renovation & name change to Beachwoods and makes everyone happy. Now they sell all the resorts to DRI? I feel like as a Beachwoods owner, and all the other owners, we just got screwed. 

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/di...rough-gold-key-resorts-acquisition-2015-08-17


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## Egret1986

*Thanks for sharing, Chris.*

Like it or not; now we're going to be a part of this huge corporate entity.  

Gonna have to dig out the positive on this news. 

Today has been a very bad timeshare day for me.


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## harveyhaddixfan

In a nutshell: all of us Gold Key owners just got screwed in the worst way possible.


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## artringwald

It may not be bad news for Gold Key Resort owners. Most likely, your current ownership terms will remain intact. Your maintenance fees will likely go up, but DRI will keep the properties in good shape. You will get your arms twisted to convert your ownership to DRI points. This is usually a very bad deal. Don't believe anything they tell you unless it is in a contract. Search this forum for a history of what happened when DRI bought Monarch Grand Vacations.


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## tschwa2

Gold key resorts are fixed week and for the most part float units within a view category.  Nothing really that they can fool with.  While not Marriott quality, I think they are already nicer than the two DRI resorts less than an hour away in Williamsburg that have had Marriott type MF's for at least the last 5 years.  Unlike many of the DRI acquisitions Gold Key wasn't distressed.  It wasn't go bankrupt or have an org like DRI to save them.  The developers probably wanted an immediate payday unless there were problems that weren't evident.  Gold key not only had the timeshares but also were the developer/manager for at least 2 full time condos, about 4 hotels plus shops and restaurants associated with the hotels and the ground floor block of shops/restaurants around the condo development.  I wonder if those assets will go to DRI or if Gold key wanted out of timeshares but is keeping everything else. 

I know DRI doesn't care for exchangers other than potential bodies that may become owners but my experience with DRI from their sales group who instead of letting me go when I said my husband wasn't with me and I was travelling with 96 year old grandmother and kids, still called multiple times to try to get my 96 year old to agree to a presentation. The second part I didn't like is despite the higher MF than equivalent resorts in the area for owners, still charges exchangers for things like internet and other rec items that are included in other resorts in the area.  The third part is that to this day 3 years after an exchange, they still insist that since I did business with them, they can call and email trying to get me to come for a discounted weekend.  I pretty much tell them every time they call to take me off their list and unless they are the only resort in the area that I want to go to when I want to travel, I could not imagine choosing DRI.  It doesn't hurt that in Williamsburg there are at least 6 I like better.   The calls are thankfully way down to less than one every other month. VB is going to be harder because the combo of  location and amenities are much better at gold key then the other resorts and that includes Ocean City and the Delaware Beaches as well.

Sorry for my DRI rant, I know some people really like their product but they really turned me off in a big way with a fairly average resort to back it up.


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## pedro47

DRI now have six (6) timeshares resorts on the East coasts on two (2) major ocean front locations.. The Outer Banks (OBX), NC and Virginia Beach,VA... Both locations throw over a millions tourist from May to September every year...This is a win - win for DRI and that is my opinion only.


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## johnrsrq

*Great news for DRI club members*

another set of places closer to some of the extended family. great news. yea!


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## pedro47

Does this include the new Cavalier Hotel project in Virginia Beach,VA ?


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## harveyhaddixfan

I don't think so. That's not one of their timeshares. I know of Beachwoods, Ocean Beach Club, Oceanaire and there are 3 others.


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## pedro47

traderjoez said:


> The news articles clearly indicate that DRI has bought the resorts/business of Gold Key, not just excess inventory.  Another one bites the Diamond dust.



This is a strange purchase because the purchase does not include Barrier Island Station @ Duck and Barrier Island's Ocean Pines Beach. Question were they not own and managed by Gold Key Resorts?


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## harveyhaddixfan

They aren't. Gold Key only bought Kitty Hawk and changed it to Beachwoods. Duck & Ocean Pines are managed by SPM as is Sea Scape in Kitty Hawk.


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## Maple_Leaf

*DRI is on the march again*



tschwa2 said:


> That could be very bad for Gold Key owners.  I don't think they will have to worry about the special assessments that go along with some of DRI's other acquisitions but no one who is taken over by DRI seems to really think the experience is good.



Getting acquired by DRI is a bit like a colonoscopy.  It may be good for you in the long run, but nobody likes it.


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## pedro47

harveyhaddixfan said:


> They aren't. Gold Key only bought Kitty Hawk and changed it to Beachwoods. Duck & Ocean Pines are managed by SPM as is Sea Scape in Kitty Hawk.



Thanks for information.


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## dwojo

traderjoez said:


> The news articles clearly indicate that DRI has bought the resorts/business of Gold Key, not just excess inventory.  Another one bites the Diamond dust.



 At least Goldkey kept their resorts in good condition so there should not be a problem with special assessments just maintenance fee hikes.


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## harveyhaddixfan

It still all seems like a sick joke.

https://vimeo.com/136338630


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## dsexton

I'm a little upset as a Gold Key owner in Va Beach that I'm learning about this through TUG.  I have not received any emails/mail, nothing about this !  Does anyone have any idea how those of us that own fixed weeks will be impacted ?  
On a brighter note, I am excited to see all the DRI resorts that I'm assuming we will have some privaledges when it comes to trading ?


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## harveyhaddixfan

Supposedly no impact to fixed weeks or current exchange company.


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## johnrsrq

dsexton said:


> I'm a little upset as a Gold Key owner in Va Beach that I'm learning about this through TUG.  I have not received any emails/mail, nothing about this !  Does anyone have any idea how those of us that own fixed weeks will be impacted ?
> On a brighter note, I am excited to see all the DRI resorts that I'm assuming we will have some privaledges when it comes to trading ?


 

it'll cost many thousands to join  the "CLUB" and get credit for your fixed weeks in points to get access to DRI resorts and DRI affiliate resorts. The points are exchangeable through Interval. If you maintain your week as you have it now, you can continue to trade and reserve it as usual. Good luck.


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## tschwa2

The other downside for shoulder and off season gold key owners who used priority with II to upgrade into a higher season.  Before you were only competing with owners at the 5 Gold Key during the priority period in II.  Now you may be competing with every DRI owner for that inventory, if DRI even has priority period with II.


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## johnrsrq

*from DRI website. Thrilled about this, more and more.*

More to Explore on the U.S. East Coast

Dear Member of THE Club® at Diamond Resorts International®, 

Great news! We are pleased to announce that Diamond Resorts International® signed an agreement to purchase Gold Key Resorts’ vacation ownership related assets, which will add five vacation ownership resorts located in Virginia Beach, Virginia and one in Outer Banks, North Carolina to our global portfolio. 

We are excited about this acquisition as Gold Key Resorts has a broad offering in Virginia Beach and helps us expand our offering on the U.S. East Coast. 

Virginia Beach is a popular vacation destination boasting the Virginia Beach Boardwalk, a three mile, 28-foot-wide icon dating back to 1888, which has been named in the top “Best American Boardwalks” by USA Today Weekend, Discovery Channel, Southern Living and Coastal Living. With proximity to the boardwalk, Gold Key’s properties offer easy access to all the entertainment and recreation opportunities in Virginia Beach. 

Gold Key has resorts in the following U.S. locations: 

• Beach Quarters Resort in Virginia Beach, Virginia 
• Turtle Cay Resort in Virginia Beach, Virginia 
• Boardwalk Resort and Villas in Virginia Beach, Virginia 
• Ocean Beach Club Resort in Virginia Beach, Virginia 
• Oceanaire Resort Hotel in Virginia Beach, Virginia 
• Beachwoods in Kitty Hawk, North Carolina 

Gold Key Resorts has a very talented team, and a variety of beautiful resorts, which is why we were so eager to pursue this transaction. Diamond Resorts International® and Gold Key Resorts will be going through a transition period before the sale is complete, and then sometime after that is finalized, we will be able to make the resorts available for you to book with your points for arrivals in 2016. 

If you are also an owner at any of the Gold Key Resorts, then you will be receiving additional information pertinent to your ownership from Gold Key throughout the transition period. 

Meanwhile, we will keep you updated about the resorts on the DiamondResorts.com website, through our What’s New function in the members area on the website, and through e-mails and THE Club® newsletter, but if you have any questions about the acquisition in the interim, then please contact us via Acquisitionqueries@diamond*resorts.com 

Sincerely, 
THE Club® at Diamond Resorts International®


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## CJ711

tschwa2 said:


> Gold key not only had the timeshares but also were the developer/manager for at least 2 full time condos, about 4 hotels plus shops and restaurants associated with the hotels and the ground floor block of shops/restaurants around the condo development. I wonder if those assets will go to DRI or if Gold key wanted out of timeshares but is keeping everything else.



Upon closing, DRI will acquire management contracts, real property interests, unsold vacation ownership interests and other assets of Ocean Beach Club, LLC, Gold Key Resorts, LLC, Professional Hospitality Resources, Inc., Vacation Rentals, LLC and Resort Promotions, Inc. (collectively the Gold Key Companies).

What is NOT included in the sale are parent company Gold Key | PHR's Cavalier Hotel, the company's two Hilton hotels at the Oceanfront or its interests in The Main, a downtown Norfolk hotel under construction. Gold Key | PHR's CEO Bruce Thompson intends to use funds from the sale of the timeshare properties to continue developing new projects in Hampton Roads and the East Coast, but I would suspect that there's a non-compete clause in there somewhere regarding the development of timeshare.


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## tschwa2

I think the $100 million dollar renovation at Beachwoods will still take place or at least some of it but instead of Gold key pumping that money into the resort (in addition to the Money brought in by the special assessment) DRI will put the entire amount on current owners and use that SA and additional SA fear to try to get another $10,000-$20,000 or so out of owners to convert to the club where they will be cushioned from the SA.  Once the current owners get the property nice and shiny it will be easier to sell points to all the developer owned weeks and weeks that enter default due to the raised MF's and SA.  

The other fear I have is that DRI won't consider non DRI owners as owners entitled to free ementies.  I can see them charging for waterpark, paddle boats, and all the new amenities but offering them free to DRI owners.  

Hope it won't be as bad as all that for at least the next several years.  I just pushed buy it now on a summer week.


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## harveyhaddixfan

I'm hoping the same. I feel like this is the worst thing Gold Key could have ever done. 

The 100 million includes building out the rest of the units originally planned. There are approx 83 units based on the number of owner & developer weeks mentioned in documents (4284). The $1681 (or $620 per year for 3 years due Jun 1 each year) special assessment for each week is right around $7,200,000. 

Gold Key pledged $15 million as follows: 3.8 for welcome center & lobby, 4.95 for the indoor water park, 2.8 for the lounge & activities center, 1.1 for wellness/fitness center, 457k for outdoor pool, 851k for the north glen (outdoor area with tennis, basketball, playground, etc), 948k for the lake enhancements. 

I'm pretty sure most of the work is done except for the water park. Since they completely gutted the building that had the indoor pool for the water park I'm sure they will finish it. It was slated to be done by the end of the year.


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## glenmore

We purchased a unit at Beachwoods when it was still Barrier a Island Kittyhawk and have it as RCI Points. We have no interest in DRI points

Will we be able to keep it in RCI Points?


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## harveyhaddixfan

All they have said is your ownership and exchange company will not change.


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## avad88

*Unhappy*



glenmore said:


> We purchased a unit at Beachwoods when it was still Barrier a Island Kittyhawk and have it as RCI Points. We have no interest in DRI points
> 
> Will we be able to keep it in RCI Points?



We also own at Beachwoods (8 years) with RCI points and have been happy until this year. We have used our points to stay at the resort some years and have traded with RCI other years. I was NOT thrilled when God Key bought the resort last year and raised our maintenance almost $200 per year and hit us with a huge assessment, but I was happy to see the improvements and was trying to think positive.
Now I AM SICK about Diamond Resorts buying it. I have read on TUG about DRI and can find almost nothing positive. 
All the info we received from Gold Key says that our ownership will not change whether we are in weeks or points, but somehow I keep remembering that old saying about timeshare salesmen---"you can tell they are lying if their lips are moving".
Is there anything positive about DRI and can we avoid joining their DRI points program or membership?


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## dwojo

DRI has high maintenance fees but they take good care of the properties that they manage. My wife and I have not stayed at a DRI resort they have managed for more than a year that has been being upgraded or already upgraded. We have been treated very well at the resorts as well.


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## johnrsrq

avad88 said:


> We also own at Beachwoods (8 years) with RCI points and have been happy until this year. We have used our points to stay at the resort some years and have traded with RCI other years. I was NOT thrilled when God Key bought the resort last year and raised our maintenance almost $200 per year and hit us with a huge assessment, but I was happy to see the improvements and was trying to think positive.
> Now I AM SICK about Diamond Resorts buying it. I have read on TUG about DRI and can find almost nothing positive.
> All the info we received from Gold Key says that our ownership will not change whether we are in weeks or points, but somehow I keep remembering that old saying about timeshare salesmen---"you can tell they are lying if their lips are moving".
> Is there anything positive about DRI and can we avoid joining their DRI points program or membership?



I didn't join (actually was very surprised I did) DRI's club until after approx 5 years elapsed since they took over mgmt of my home resort of two weeks of my large three bedroom suites - one mile from Disney. The RCI exchanges still worked for those years, I could still kick DRI out and go back to RCI exchanges to this day. I am still deeded to those weeks. I paid an extra to the club and acquired some points- that's the expensive part. However, my 2 full weeks now allow me to get close to 4-6 weeks depending on premium time and location. The voracious stories for some are true but they lead back to the finances of the resort(s) that were taken over. Many of their resorts are very nice although reading in TUG you would never no it. Their fees are not inordinately higher for my experience and in fact, when I have compared to Marriott's Grande Vista in Orlando MF's vrs MF's and II trading in addition to other nuance differences, I happen to fair better by cash $265 per week per year. The club fees and their points are (3k developer points 0.16cents, my week points @0.10 cents) plus couple hundred bucks for other bs.

So, basically, you don't have to be sick if your resort and its finances were ok up to this point. You keep it as is. You study it over time. There are many folks that like me and potentially you, have entered by way of legacy weeks. I would never fork over the kinds of money that *all* the systems are asking for at retail.

Good luck.


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## harveyhaddixfan

I wasn't too sure about Gold Key at first either until I heard all the plans. And they didn't raise the maintenance fees almost $200. They went from $625 in 2014 to $710 in 2015. I'm more worried about DRI trying to raise them to over $900.


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## nuwermj

tschwa2 said:


> The other downside for shoulder and off season gold key owners who used priority with II to upgrade into a higher season.  Before you were only competing with owners at the 5 Gold Key during the priority period in II.  Now you may be competing with every DRI owner for that inventory, if DRI even has priority period with II.



Diamond will be required to maintain two inventories. The current unsold inventory will, as it is sold, be placed into one of DRI's trust funds. Also, the deeds from current weeks owners who convert to Diamond points will be transferred into the trust. DRI's Club members will have access only to the intervals in the trust fund. Current owners will continue to have access to the intervals not held in the trust fund or not owned directly by DRI as unsold units.

The primary risk to deeded owners is that too many other deeded owners will convert to trust ownership, with their deeds then being moved into the DRI controlled trust inventory. This will reduce the inventory of weekly intervals available to the remaining weeks owners.


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## tschwa2

Since all of the gold key properties were sold as fixed weeks that shouldn't be a problem.  Many were sold as floating units within a view category.  It would not be nice if DRI decided to give the better views (higher floors) within a view category to DRI members and the less desirable units to the deeded owners.  It will also mean the developer dumps into II will probably go through the club before making its way into II and the better shoulder weeks won't make it at all.


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## nuwermj

There is no doubt that DRI will try to squeeze current owners. Some of your worries expressed in this thread will come to pass. DRI makes money first by selling points (about 60% of their net revenue). The other 40% comes from managing resorts (fees charged to HOA) and services to their trust fund members (reservations, billing, etc.). Converting fixed week owners will earn big money and it will be high pressure sales. 

Be that as it may, my experience with DRI room assignments is that they are left to the local resort managements. And the Hospitality and Management services division is actually very reasonable to work with. It's the sales division that is so bad.

Edit:


tschwa2 said:


> The other fear I have is that DRI won't consider  non DRI owners as owners entitled to free ementies.  I can see them  charging for waterpark, paddle boats, and all the new amenities but  offering them free to DRI owners.



Do you think DRI can do this successfully? I thought rules governing amenities at a resort were up to the HOA. Even if DRI's votes control the HOA, shouldn't the policy apply to all owners? At the HOA level there are only owners and guests, or so that is my understanding of such things.


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## nuwermj

In my experience, the annual cost of ownership for fixed week units is significantly lower than the annual cost of point ownerships. I have seen in resale ads that annual maintenance fees at Ocean Beach Club are $864 for a 2-bedroom unit and a 2-bedroom at Turtle Cay is $907. For those wishing to exchange their week, the annual membership for an exchange company like II and the exchange fee must be added to estimate the full cost. Still, Diamond is considerably more expensive. The annual cost of points needed to reserve an average
[*] 2-bedroom unit for seven nights is about $1500. This does not include the annual fee for The Club dues, which add another $225. 


[*] I averaged “high” demand points (for a 2-bedroom) at Polo Towers, Las Vegas NV; Lake Tahoe Vacation Resort, South Shore CA; The Suites at Fall Creek, Branson MO; The Ridge on Sedona Golf, Sedona AZ; Grande Villas Resort, Orlando FL; and Daytona Beach Regency, Daytona FL.

I also compared these five DRI resorts with Wyndham resorts in the same locations. For Windham I used the Club Wyndham Access rate (i.e. Wyndham's points system that is most like the DRI system). The average MF for DRI is $1517, while the Wyndham average is $1086. (The Wyndham resorts are: Grand Desert, Las Vegas NV; South Shore, Lake Tahoe NV (side); Branson at The Falls, Branson MO; Wyndham Sedona, Sedona AZ; Cypress Palms, Orlando FL; and Ocean Walk, Daytona FL)


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## Sugarcubesea

I really hope starwood does not sell to DRI


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## Maple_Leaf

*I don't think so...*



nuwermj said:


> The primary risk to deeded owners is that too many other deeded owners will convert to trust ownership, with their deeds then being moved into the DRI controlled trust inventory. This will reduce the inventory of weekly intervals available to the remaining weeks owners.



I doubt it.  My understanding is that Beachwoods weeks are fixed so a fixed week owner will always have access to their deeded week.  DRI may use their swarms of management lackeys and sales weasels to successfully pressure other owners into converting their fixed weeks into Confederate money but that won't affect the availability of your week.  What DRI will do is take over the HOA to amend the by-laws, adjust the maintenance fees and levy special assessments to further their corporate interests.  That's *your *primary risk.


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## nuwermj

Maple_Leaf said:


> ... My understanding is that Beachwoods weeks are fixed so a fixed week owner will always have access to their deeded week.



Yes, of course. But my reply to *tschwa2* was in relation to fixed week owners loosing access to exchanges for weeks that are not the deeded week. That is, the "off season gold key owners who used priority with II to upgrade into a higher season."


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## nuwermj

Maple_Leaf said:


> What DRI will do is take over the HOA to amend the by-laws, adjust the maintenance fees and levy special assessments to further their corporate interests.  That's *your *primary risk.



This is not a risk, this is a certainty. There will be no getting around higher maintenance fees, short of liquidating the deed. Given that a Gold Key owners does not sell, then the key question is keep the deed or convert to DRI points. 

For what it worth, one advantage of points is that special assessments at one resort are spread over all the trust fund members. This might not be important to some owners, it might be to others.


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## avad88

harveyhaddixfan said:


> I wasn't too sure about Gold Key at first either until I heard all the plans. And they didn't raise the maintenance fees almost $200. They went from $625 in 2014 to $710 in 2015. I'm more worried about DRI trying to raise them to over $900.



Sorry, you are right--I meant to say "they raised maintenance fees almost $100", in fact it was $85, but still the jump was more than we have ever experienced in our 8 years of ownership. In addition to the big special assessment at the same time, it hit our retirement budget hard. 
Thanks for the insights, everyone. For now, I am assuming our RCI points account doesn't change with the takeover. 
I will take johnrsrq's advice and not do anything rash, but try to stay informed and hope our maintenance doesn't go out of sight!


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## johnrsrq

nuwermj said:


> In my experience, the annual cost of ownership for fixed week units is significantly lower than the annual cost of point ownerships. I have seen in resale ads that annual maintenance fees at Ocean Beach Club are $864 for a 2-bedroom unit and a 2-bedroom at Turtle Cay is $907. For those wishing to exchange their week, the annual membership for an exchange company like II and the exchange fee must be added to estimate the full cost. Still, Diamond is considerably more expensive. The annual cost of points needed to reserve an average
> [*] 2-bedroom unit for seven nights is about $1500. This does not include the annual fee for The Club dues, which add another $225.
> 
> 
> [*] I averaged “high” demand points (for a 2-bedroom) at Polo Towers, Las Vegas NV; Lake Tahoe Vacation Resort, South Shore CA; The Suites at Fall Creek, Branson MO; The Ridge on Sedona Golf, Sedona AZ; Grande Villas Resort, Orlando FL; and Daytona Beach Regency, Daytona FL.
> 
> I also compared these five DRI resorts with Wyndham resorts in the same locations. For Windham I used the Club Wyndham Access rate (i.e. Wyndham's points system that is most like the DRI system). The average MF for DRI is $1517, while the Wyndham average is $1086. (The Wyndham resorts are: *Grand Desert, Las Vegas NV; South Shore, Lake Tahoe NV (side); Branson at The Falls, Branson MO; Wyndham Sedona, Sedona AZ; Cypress Palms, Orlando FL; and Ocean Walk, Daytona F*L)



Well, the MF's for the DRI Grand Beach Orlando 3 bedroom units are $955. They command more exchanges as they can be split. Maybe those DRI resorts referenced above were not managed as well by their respective HOA. All I can share is my experience. The resale points I have cost me $0  and the MF's are $.16.  The non resale account cost .12 all in.

Maybe Gold Key is financially in great shape. It would be nice if the current Beachwoods/Gold Key owners could share a pdf of last years/prior years budgets.


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## harveyhaddixfan

I'd be happy to do that when I get home to my PC!


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## nuwermj

johnrsrq said:


> Well, the MF's for the DRI Grand Beach Orlando 3 bedroom units are $955. They command more exchanges as they can be split. Maybe those DRI resorts referenced above were not managed as well by their respective HOA. All I can share is my experience. The resale points I have cost me $0  and the MF's are $.16.  The non resale account cost .12 all in.



A 3-bedroom unit at Grand Beach in the "high" season, the summer months, requires 10,500 points. At $0.16 a point, that is $1680. I think this reinforces my point: the cost of ownership for fixed weeks units is significantly lower than the cost of point ownership. Am I missing something?


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## harveyhaddixfan

actually, here is a screenshot of what I had.


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## harveyhaddixfan

Wrong one. This is 1 of 2 I was looking for.


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## harveyhaddixfan

2 of 2


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## johnrsrq

nuwermj said:


> A 3-bedroom unit at Grand Beach in the "high" season, the summer months, requires 10,500 points. At $0.16 a point, that is $1680. I think this reinforces my point: the cost of ownership for fixed weeks units is significantly lower than the cost of point ownership. Am I missing something?



no doubt about that. My week costs me $955 annual (up from 600 in 1995). If I withdrew my week from the club, I could use my week there for that total. I could also open an rci/II/DAE account and deposit my for exchange purposes if I did not want to stay there. Being in the club however, I still pay on my HOA fee of $955 and mf's that are attributable to the initial "developer" point I purchased to get into the club, as well as another $255 for the club fee. So I get a second bill for 3,000 points @ .16=480 +250= $730.

Why did I decide to do that. I can take as little 2  to at least 7  day reservations, borrow future points for current needs, mid week check in's, For me, it was being able to get more weeks and more places. I also use 13 month window reservation for prime locations.  I do take advantage of the *discounts* 14 day/ 60 windows for very cheap stays.  That's it , not a DRI sales person here... just why it works for me. flexibility. more time and more places.


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## johnrsrq

harveyhaddixfan said:


> I'd be happy to do that when I get home to my PC!




thank you. I will study.  At first glance the 2015 current fees look subsidized by 50% (says 45%) and the real jewels are from July 1  through the end of August. (my family just sold our NJ oceanfront house in  of 47 yrs. and last 10 we rented out- $6,500 week).  I would not expect Diamond to poorly treat the owners of *those* expensive weeks and if anyone of them were to join the "club", there'd better be a very large allocation and accommodation.

just my current opinion.  will continue to follow.  wish you all the best.


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## nuwermj

johnrsrq said:


> Why did I decide to do that.



I fully understand why you decided to do that. I might have done the same thing had I been in a similar situation.

It will be interesting to see whether DRI offers Gold Key owners the same kind of arrangement as you have. My impression from other recent DRI acquisitions is that deeded ownership with Club membership is not on the table.

Michael


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## harveyhaddixfan

Since DRI is in the process of buying Gold Key Resorts, I inquired about a deed back for my week 39 at Beachwoods. At first I got a response that they weren't doing it. Today I get a voicemail from Cacey Brown at Gold Key about it. I tried to call back and it went to voicemail so I'm guessing that DRI is instructing them to get back as many weeks as they can so they have inventory to add to the club and sell more points. Hopefully?


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## Egret1986

*Smart move*



harveyhaddixfan said:


> Since DRI is in the process of buying Gold Key Resorts, I inquired about a deed back for my week 39 at Beachwoods. At first I got a response that they weren't doing it. Today I get a voicemail from Cacey Brown at Gold Key about it. I tried to call back and it went to voicemail so I'm guessing that DRI is instructing them to get back as many weeks as they can so they have inventory to add to the club and sell more points. Hopefully?



I hope you're successful, Chris.


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## winger

I saw a couple of references in this thread about the resorts being in good shape and MF's should not have to increase significantly to bring the resorts up to Diamond's quality. Out of curiosity, I did a quick Google search and saw a reference to the Beachwoods property in Kitty Hawk, NC being run down and needing a "special assessment" to maintain the property. So, what's the real story?
https://www.google.com/search?q=gol...oid-sprint-us&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8


----------



## tschwa2

The real story on Beachwoods is it was run down.  Then Gold Key bought the developer rights (Sept 2014) and immediately planned and started a renovation and refurbishment.  So each interval had to pay about an $1800 assessment.  This comes to about $90,000 per unit (50*$1800).  With $50,000+ going into each unit with the additional going to the property in general plus the $10,000,000 pledged by Gold key in general common area upgrades there shouldn't need to be a whole lot more done to get the place up to the so called "DRI standards".  The assessment was on top of a $100 MF increase to fund future reserves.  

The refurb started in late 2014 but units didn't start to get completed until late spring and summer of this year.  So the conditions in the reviews are primarily pre-gold key.


----------



## smtundra

I went through a buyout with another Timeshare with Holiday Inn Vacation Club.  They offered a free conversion to points, and I still did NOT convert.  I didn't want to pay a membership fee and pay to exchange within their system.  I use this resort to exchange with Interval and have no problems.

I own 2 summer weeks with Gold Key, 1 week at Beach Quarters and one at Turtle Cay.  I will not convert to a point system and risk not being able to use my summer week, since we always stay and I will not give them up to get them back to Diamond Resorts.  It only helps the developer.  If I wanted to, I can do this in Interval.


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

DRI really must be pushing for deed backs. About 1-2 months ago Gold Key wasn't taking back deeds.


----------



## Egret1986

*A big congratulations to you, Chris!*



harveyhaddixfan said:


> View attachment 2247 DRI really must be pushing for deed backs. About 1-2 months ago Gold Key wasn't taking back deeds.



You've found the bright side to the DRI acquisition!  Way to go!


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

Woot woot! This was a week 39 that was in weeks. It pulled 17 & 16 TPU for $710 a year. They are also waiving the remaining $1240 on the special assessment!


----------



## johnrsrq

harveyhaddixfan said:


> Woot woot! This was a week 39 that was in weeks. It pulled 17 & 16 TPU for $710 a year. They are also waiving the remaining $1240 on the special assessment!



congrats! 

Remember if you ever wanted to stay there in the future or others, maybe Diamond owners will be able to have you as our guests. That way you have no more strings but if you still wanted to go there particularly that timeframe, it probably would be possible. We shall see.  Glad you had this option. Best  to you.


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

johnrsrq said:


> congrats!
> 
> Remember if you ever wanted to stay there in the future or others, maybe Diamond owners will be able to have you as our guests. That way you have no more strings but if you still wanted to go there particularly that timeframe, it probably would be possible. We shall see.  Glad you had this option. Best  to you.




Thanks, but don't worry. I'm not going anywhere. I bought a week 22 that is in points so I had been looking to dump the week 39. We went that week this year and it was a lot better than the end of September. It was really nice weather and daylight till 9 instead of 7!


----------



## pedro47

The new trend in the timeshare industry is to do completely away with all deed ownership.  This is my opinion only.


----------



## tschwa2

pedro47 said:


> The new trend in the timeshare industry is to do completely away with all deed ownership.  This is my opinion only.



No more pesky "owners" that developers have to pretend to allow to run the HOA and set the budgets and assessments.   No more costly foreclosures to have to deal with.  They wouldn't have to have licenses to sell since they are selling memberships and not deeded property.  They could re-write the governing rules whenever they wanted to without having to get a 2/3's vote or a super majority.  They can strip whatever they want upon resale because there would be no "deeded" rights.  All that sounds like a win-win for the developer.


----------



## sjuhawk_jd

tschwa2 said:


> Gold key resorts are fixed week and for the most part float units within a view category.  Nothing really that they can fool with.  While not Marriott quality, I think they are already nicer than the two DRI resorts less than an hour away in Williamsburg that have had Marriott type MF's for at least the last 5 years.  Unlike many of the DRI acquisitions Gold Key wasn't distressed.  It wasn't go bankrupt or have an org like DRI to save them.  The developers probably wanted an immediate payday unless there were problems that weren't evident.  Gold key not only had the timeshares but also were the developer/manager for at least 2 full time condos, about 4 hotels plus shops and restaurants associated with the hotels and the ground floor block of shops/restaurants around the condo development.  I wonder if those assets will go to DRI or if Gold key wanted out of timeshares but is keeping everything else.
> 
> I know DRI doesn't care for exchangers other than potential bodies that may become owners but my experience with DRI from their sales group who instead of letting me go when I said my husband wasn't with me and I was travelling with 96 year old grandmother and kids, still called multiple times to try to get my 96 year old to agree to a presentation. The second part I didn't like is despite the higher MF than equivalent resorts in the area for owners, still charges exchangers for things like internet and other rec items that are included in other resorts in the area.  The third part is that to this day 3 years after an exchange, they still insist that since I did business with them, they can call and email trying to get me to come for a discounted weekend.  I pretty much tell them every time they call to take me off their list and unless they are the only resort in the area that I want to go to when I want to travel, I could not imagine choosing DRI.  It doesn't hurt that in Williamsburg there are at least 6 I like better.   The calls are thankfully way down to less than one every other month. VB is going to be harder because the combo of  location and amenities are much better at gold key then the other resorts and that includes Ocean City and the Delaware Beaches as well.
> 
> Sorry for my DRI rant, I know some people really like their product but they really turned me off in a big way with a fairly average resort to back it up.



They can fool easily with the Maintenance fees. 15% maintenance fee increases for each of the next 5 years will screw everyone. I own two weeks at Ocean Beach Club.


----------



## Maple_Leaf

*I'm seeing this everywhere now*



tschwa2 said:


> No more pesky "owners" that developers have to pretend to allow to run the HOA and set the budgets and assessments.   No more costly foreclosures to have to deal with.  They wouldn't have to have licenses to sell since they are selling memberships and not deeded property.  They could re-write the governing rules whenever they wanted to without having to get a 2/3's vote or a super majority.  They can strip whatever they want upon resale because there would be no "deeded" rights.  All that sounds like a win-win for the developer.



And don't forget unilaterally increasing the points requirements for resort stays over time to inflate away the "owner investment."


----------



## somerville

*No Response from GoldKey*

I own a fixed week, fixed unit summer interval at Beach Quarters Resort. When I received notice of the sale to DRI, the letter included an email address to submit questions.  I sent an email asking them to confirm that there would not be any changes to my right to use my deeded week and unit and that I would continue to receive the same amenities, including parking. I received a quick response, which had attached a number of FAQs that they had dreamed up, none of which addressed my issues.  I immediately emailed them back, requesting that they address my issues.  Five days have passed without a response. This is not encouraging!


----------



## tschwa2

In general DRI includes parking for owners (whether deeded owners or points owners).  What they do do is charge exchangers for parking even if that is an amenity paid for and owned by the HOA.  I would probably still expect it for free if exchanging back into BQ but you may be charged if you exchange into other former gold key properties or other DRI properties.  Those kind of "perks" extend to all properties if you are a points owner but only at your home resort for deeded owners.


----------



## RLS50

*Great timing as always*

New to this site, but enjoying the education I am receiving from reading all the comments from the timeshare veterans.

After years of never buying a timeshare and having a generally negative attitude towards them, we bought from Gold Key at Ocean Beach Club in May (long story).   I now realize that I overpaid significantly and could have gotten the same thing here for less than 1/2 of what we paid.  Unfortunately I found TUG after we bought.

I can say in Gold Key's defense, that their sales tactics were nothing like what I am reading about DRI.   Most of what Gold Key told us has proven to be accurate and they have been very helpful and responsive since we have purchased.   We just paid a lot for what we got.

Of course 60 days after our purchase Gold Key sold out to DRI.   I am quite concerned about possible changes in the level of service we have received so far.  I hope DRI keeps most of the Gold Key people.   And while I am concerned about increases in the MF like everyone else, I can handle that (within reason) as long as DRI keeps the properties in top shape and if they kept the great service that Gold Key has given us so far.

One thing I know for sure is that I have no desire to convert my deeded week into points.

We'll see.


----------



## pedro47

Rumor has it that DRI has acquired a time share resort somewhere  in the state of New York.


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## dwojo

pedro47 said:


> Rumor has it that DRI has acquired a time share resort somewhere  in the state of New York.



I hope so that would be convenient for us.


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## kalima

*New York*



pedro47 said:


> Rumor has it that DRI has acquired a time share resort somewhere  in the state of New York.



I see that there are 4 DRI Affiliates you can book in New York. You mean an actual new purchase? I can't find anything on the internet about this.


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## pedro47

kalima said:


> I see that there are 4 DRI Affiliates you can book in New York. You mean an actual new purchase? I can't find anything on the internet about this.


This will be a new addition.


----------



## RuralEngineer

*NYC*

they should put MC out of it's misery.


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## smtundra

Keep your deeded week with Gold Key Resorts.  It is recorded in Virginia Beach's courthouse.  You will have every right to use your deeded week.   Sounds like DRI system is a bad deal.  If there is a year, you can't use it, use Interval or rent it out for the week through redweek.com or here on the marketplace or ebay.  There is a real estate agent in Virginia Beach call Timesharing2000.com that will take 20%, but seems to be a decent deal.

During the summer, I see a lot of the same people returning year after year, so I don't think they will be giving up there week.  There are few exchanges made into these resorts in the summer.


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## pedro47

When will DRI list these new resorts to their web site?


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## harveyhaddixfan

The acquisition isn't supposed to be final until October.


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## pedro47

harveyhaddixfan said:


> The acquisition isn't supposed to be final until October.



Thanks for the update.


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## dwojo

My wife and I did an owners update with DRI a few days ago and got no new information about the Goldkey acquisition.


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## nuwermj

Here is DRI's presentation to their stock holders. Among other things, you will see an emphasis on a new pool of owners to market Diamond’s points. 

http://phx.corporate-ir.net/Externa...9NTkyOTQwfENoaWxkSUQ9MzAxMjU1fFR5cGU9MQ==&t=1


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

The problem lies in your first sentence: "stock holders."  And that "low cost inventory" consists of the 40% of the weeks at Beachwoods still owned by Gold Key & all the weeks they are taking back at no cost to the owner (the only cost they incur are legal fees and the balances owed on the SA, mine was $1240)


----------



## Ty1on

nuwermj said:


> Here is DRI's presentation to their stock holders. Among other thinks, you will see an emphasis on a new pool of owners to market Diamond’s points.
> 
> http://phx.corporate-ir.net/Externa...9NTkyOTQwfENoaWxkSUQ9MzAxMjU1fFR5cGU9MQ==&t=1



What irritates me beyond measure is that that they refer to their sales front as concierge.


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## dwojo

I cannot believe that I am writing this ,but I miss Mr. Cloobeck being in charge.  The recent update we have done have been terrible. I get told how I do not have enough points and yet I cannot use them all.


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## nuwermj

Hmm, Pacific Monarch was acquired in May, 2012; Palmer became CEO in January, 2013. Was it Cloobeck or Palmer who is responsible for the very poor treatment of Pacific Grand members? dwojo, are you saying it was all Plamer's doing?


----------



## dwojo

nuwermj said:


> Hmm, Pacific Monarch was acquired in May, 2012; Palmer became CEO in January, 2013. Was it Cloobeck or Palmer who is responsible for the very poor treatment of Pacific Grand members? dwojo, are you saying it was all Plamer's doing?



  I cannot comment about Pacific Monarch as I did not own with them. I owned with sunterra. When Diamond took over we were not treated well either. After complaints and owners leaving Mr. Cloobeck made changes to the way Diamond treated owners. Since Mr. Palmer has taken over they have started to revert to their old ways of mistreatment.
  Diamond under both of those men was and is primarily all about making money any way they can. Now poor treatment has become the norm again instead of the exception.


----------



## nuwermj

Poor treatment is the norm. I'm in full agreement with you there.


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## harveyhaddixfan

#1 problem: DRI is a public company with stock holders. It's not a small company or independent resort that cares about the owners. The stock holders only want to know what their ROI is and when they are getting their next dividend check.


----------



## dsexton

I am a Gold Key owner (Beach Quarters) and attended an owner update this past weekend.  Based on everything I've read, I fully expected them to try and get us to convert our fixed week 14 over to points.  They did not, however did try to have us pay an additional $8k to convert to fixed week 35.  I guess because I'm a blonde the salesman assumed I was stupid.  He tried to convince me (with a 5 year old Interval cataloge) that my TDI was much lower than it actually is.  I know my TDI by heart and fully understand my trading value.  Of course week 35 is the same.  Go figure.  Every time I asked a pointed question about DRI, he claimed not to know anything, this was of course after name dropping every big wigs name in the Gold Key and Interval companies.  Again, not impressed.   The only thing I confirmed is the deal between DRI and Gold Key closes on Oct 15th.  He said fixed deeded weeks would not longer be sold after this time.  I'm quite sure after this last owner update, I will be removed from the solicitation list.  Thanks again to all of you here for the great education !


----------



## RuralEngineer

*OBC*

http://www.sellmytimesharenow.com/media/pdf/2013-Timeshare-Demand-Index.pdf/

OBC is #18.  Not bad.


----------



## Michael1991

dsexton said:


> I'm quite sure after this last owner update, I will be removed from the solicitation list.



That is not the DRI way. They want to pound you into submission and they are arrogant enough to think no-one can resist.


----------



## RLS50

*For what it's worth...*

We were in OBX last week and decided to stop in and see the Beachwoods property that Gold Key took over in Kitty Hawk.   We met with some Gold Key reps there who walked us thru the remodeling efforts.   It is expected that all the amenities under construction will be completed in early 2016 (fitness center, indoor water park, clubhouse, lounge, and outdoor bar and grill near the pool area, etc).   The upgrades to the insides of the existing units themselves are also well done and are also planned to be complete by early 2016.   There is some construction on new units and buildings that may continue thru 2016 as they add occupancy to the back of the property.   

Beachwoods looks like it is going to be a very nice property in OBX when it is finally completed.

We did ask about the impact of the DRI purchase.   They couldn't say much since they don't even know yet how the purchase will affect their own jobs, but they did mention that DRI is fully committed to the upgrades and actually it feels like they want to speed up the process to get everything done as soon as possible.  It sounds like Gold Key originally was maybe going to be taking a more phased approach whereas DRI may be looking to do it all sooner (including building additional units on the property).

One point I found interesting (maybe only to me) is that all timeshare reps in North Carolina have to be licensed real estate agents, who have taken and passed the real estate exam.   They can't just be hired off the street from any sales job and start selling timeshares the next day.   It sounds like the reps in North Carolina have more professional qualifications than the typical timeshare rep one would find in other states without that requirement (real estate license).

We still aren't sure what to expect from DRI, but I have to mention that the Gold Key people that walked us thru Beachwoods and patiently answered all of our questions were very friendly and very helpful.   So far as new owners with Gold Key in 2015, the Gold Key people we have talked to and worked with have provided to us what I consider to be excellent customer service.   

My #1 concern right now is that I hope DRI doesn't come in and diminish what seems like a very positive and customer focused Gold Key culture that we have experienced so far.


----------



## Egret1986

*Thank you so much for this update.*



RLS50 said:


> We were in OBX last week and decided to stop in and see the Beachwoods property that Gold Key took over in Kitty Hawk.   We met with some Gold Key reps there who walked us thru the remodeling efforts.   It is expected that all the amenities under construction will be completed in early 2016 (fitness center, indoor water park, clubhouse, lounge, and outdoor bar and grill near the pool area, etc).   The upgrades to the insides of the existing units themselves are also well done and are also planned to be complete by early 2016.   There is some construction on new units and buildings that may continue thru 2016 as they add occupancy to the back of the property.
> 
> Beachwoods looks like it is going to be a very nice property in OBX when it is finally completed.
> 
> We did ask about the impact of the DRI purchase.   They couldn't say much since they don't even know yet how the purchase will affect their own jobs, but they did mention that DRI is fully committed to the upgrades and actually it feels like they want to speed up the process to get everything done as soon as possible.  It sounds like Gold Key originally was maybe going to be taking a more phased approach whereas DRI may be looking to do it all sooner (including building additional units on the property).
> 
> One point I found interesting (maybe only to me) is that all timeshare reps in North Carolina have to be licensed real estate agents, who have taken and passed the real estate exam.   They can't just be hired off the street from any sales job and start selling timeshares the next day.   It sounds like the reps in North Carolina have more professional qualifications than the typical timeshare rep one would find in other states without that requirement (real estate license).
> 
> We still aren't sure what to expect from DRI, but I have to mention that the Gold Key people that walked us thru Beachwoods and patiently answered all of our questions were very friendly and very helpful.   So far as new owners with Gold Key in 2015, the Gold Key people we have talked to and worked with have provided to us what I consider to be excellent customer service.
> 
> My #1 concern right now is that I hope DRI doesn't come in and diminish what seems like a very positive and customer focused Gold Key culture that we have experienced so far.



I plan to be on the Outer Banks for HOA meetings for two resorts on the 24th of this month.  I keep hoping the Owners Meeting at Beachwoods will be announced very soon because that is also a meeting I want to attend.

I planned to stop by Beachwoods to get updates.  I do hope DRI does get the amenities and units completed soon.  Everything except for the indoor pool/water park area (announced by GKR/PHR last November) was supposed to have been completed in May.  Then this got pushed to September and now it's Spring 2016.  

I assume you walked away from purchasing a timeshare at Beachwoods while on this tour.     How was the tour?  I might sign up for their promotion since I need some accommodations for this upcoming HOA meeting and it will give me the opportunity to see how much progress has been made since I was there July 1.  It was very disappointing to see how far behind they were with the units and amenities.

Thank you again for your report!  It is appreciated.


----------



## friedshrimp

RuralEngineer said:


> http://www.marketwatch.com/story/di...rough-gold-key-resorts-acquisition-2015-08-17
> 
> 
> 
> http://hamptonroads.com/2015/08/diamond-resorts-buys-6-resorts-gold-key-168-million
> 
> very interesting.
> 
> Stephen



glad to hear it. DRI needs some more beach resorts on the East Coast.


----------



## friedshrimp

avad88 said:


> We also own at Beachwoods (8 years) with RCI points and have been happy until this year. We have used our points to stay at the resort some years and have traded with RCI other years. I was NOT thrilled when God Key bought the resort last year and raised our maintenance almost $200 per year and hit us with a huge assessment, but I was happy to see the improvements and was trying to think positive.
> *Now I AM SICK about Diamond Resorts buying it. I have read on TUG about DRI and can find almost nothing positive.*
> All the info we received from Gold Key says that our ownership will not change whether we are in weeks or points, but somehow I keep remembering that old saying about timeshare salesmen---"you can tell they are lying if their lips are moving".
> Is there anything positive about DRI and can we avoid joining their DRI points program or membership?



Maybe you've been talking to the wrong people?


----------



## friedshrimp

smtundra said:


> I went through a buyout with another Timeshare with Holiday Inn Vacation Club.  They offered a free conversion to points, and I still did NOT convert.  I didn't want to pay a membership fee *and pay to exchange within their system.*  I use this resort to exchange with Interval and have no problems.
> 
> I own 2 summer weeks with Gold Key, 1 week at Beach Quarters and one at Turtle Cay.  I will not convert to a point system and risk not being able to use my summer week, since we always stay and I will not give them up to get them back to Diamond Resorts.  It only helps the developer.  If I wanted to, I can do this in Interval.



That's one of the beautiful things with DRI, you do not pay to exchange within DRI which is now at about 300 resorts.


----------



## friedshrimp

Maple_Leaf said:


> And don't forget unilaterally increasing the points requirements for resort stays over time to inflate away the "owner investment."



Sorry but they can't do that. Point structures are set upon acquisition and cannot change.


----------



## youppi

Exactly. I hope they will not put an exorbitant number of point on those new resorts in VA Beach like they did with many of new additions where the number of point cost equal or more than renting. We must save at least 50% of the rental price by using points (save a minimum of $1000) otherwise it is useless to buy points because it will take to much time to recover the money.


----------



## dwojo

friedshrimp said:


> That's one of the beautiful things with DRI, you do not pay to exchange within DRI which is now at about 300 resorts.



Your exchange fees are just built in to the club dues


----------



## friedshrimp

dwojo said:


> Your exchange fees are just built in to the club dues



Sorry, but not even close. The main thing covered by the Club dues is the annual cost of the Gold II membership along with the Club travel services. My exchange fees back when I owned 5 weeks of fixed and floating week timeshare was about $750 a year (it was $149 per exchange through II then, now it is $164 so it would be over $800 a year for exchanges). The Club dues to DRI is $250 a year ($280 for Platinum members). Not to mention I can cancel and rebook as many times as I want (much harder to do with RCI or II).


----------



## RLS50

Egret1986 said:


> I plan to be on the Outer Banks for HOA meetings for two resorts on the 24th of this month.  I keep hoping the Owners Meeting at Beachwoods will be announced very soon because that is also a meeting I want to attend.
> 
> I planned to stop by Beachwoods to get updates.  I do hope DRI does get the amenities and units completed soon.  Everything except for the indoor pool/water park area (announced by GKR/PHR last November) was supposed to have been completed in May.  Then this got pushed to September and now it's Spring 2016.
> 
> I assume you walked away from purchasing a timeshare at Beachwoods while on this tour.     How was the tour?  I might sign up for their promotion since I need some accommodations for this upcoming HOA meeting and it will give me the opportunity to see how much progress has been made since I was there July 1.  It was very disappointing to see how far behind they were with the units and amenities.
> 
> Thank you again for your report!  It is appreciated.


Egret,

I know you own multiple units at Beachwoods, and have been following the process from the beginning as a (Barrier Island Station) legacy owner, even before the Gold Key purchase.   So I can't speak to how far behind they are from the original projections they gave owners like yourself 12-18 months ago.

What I can tell you as a total outsider visiting Beachwoods for the first time was that I was very impressed with the property and the plans for it.  I had read your comments a few times over the past couple of months about being excited about Gold Key's plans for it, and now I understand why you felt that way. 

We stayed in a 6,000+ sq foot house last week in Corolla, beautiful house.  But after touring Beachwoods my wife and I both agreed we would be just as happy staying at the Beachwoods property next time we visit OBX.   We both really like the natural setting in the woods and the spread out feel of the resort.  The resort feels more private than being in a huge house with other people, the amenities are nicer, and the upgrades appear to be really well done so far.  

We didn't take an official "sales promotion" tour , we just showed up and told them that we were Gold Key owners at OBC and wanted to see what they were doing.   The representative that showed us around was great.  She was super friendly.    We also met another Gold Key representative who had been around many years in the OBX area and was very helpful and informative in answering our questions.  Both were licensed real estate agents and both of them were cautiously optimistic about the DRI purchase.    It was just a really nice and productive experience overall.   

From what we saw touring the property and improvements made so far, it sure seems like Gold Key / DRI is fully committed to getting all the enhancements completed over the next 6-9 months.   Or at least all the amenities.  Not sure exactly how many new units they will be building on the back end of the property and when they will be fully completed.    

I would be very interested to hear your updates after you visit since you would know best how far they have come.   And I know I keep repeating myself, but I sure hope DRI keeps all the Gold Key people and doesn't mess up the Gold Key culture we have experienced to this point.


----------



## tschwa2

I would have been super surprised if the timeline they originally gave for the renovations were accurate.  It was way too much work being done.  I know when Massanutten added their indoor waterpark they said it would be open by August 2006 and it opened in May or June of 2007.  Beachwoods was doing refurbs on the units in additional to major upgrades on the grounds and common areas.


How are they working beach access.  Is there a private parking lot and if so how big is it?


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

There is a parking lot that is gated, but the gate usually doesn't work. It holds about 55 cars and is less than half a block to the beach from there. We never park there except to go out in the morning to see the sunrise, but when we drive by it's usually not very full.


----------



## RLS50

To add to Harvey's comments, you can access the beach from the road that runs right thru the resort.   If you follow it thru it either is (or turns into) Eckner St.  That crosses right over N. Croatan Hwy and goes down to a private parking lot.   The parking lot still has a sign from the old legacy resort (Barrier Island Station).  

You can see this on Google Maps how the road into the resort from Route 158 starts as Cypress Knee Trail and turns into Eckner St.

Something I didn't know, but the representatives told me during our tour, Beachwoods is actually considered an Oceanfront or Beachfront resort in trading power because of proximity to the ocean and / or private beach access.   I forget exactly how they phrased it, but maybe someone else who knows can clarify.

Also, the GK reps mentioned that there was some discussion about building lockers at the parking lot for families that want to store their beach gear for the week versus dragging it to the beach every day.   Also it sounds like the resort plans on running shuttles to the beach during the day for those that don't want to drive.   I am not sure if that is year round, or just during peak season.


----------



## Egret1986

*I think I'll pass on the tour and just drop by also. Hoping for a Last Call thru RCI.*



RLS50 said:


> What I can tell you as a total outsider visiting Beachwoods for the first time was that I was very impressed with the property and the plans for it.  I had read your comments a few times over the past couple of months about being excited about Gold Key's plans for it, and now I understand why you felt that way.
> 
> We stayed in a 6,000+ sq foot house last week in Corolla, beautiful house.  But after touring Beachwoods my wife and I both agreed we would be just as happy staying at the Beachwoods property next time we visit OBX.   We both really like the natural setting in the woods and the spread out feel of the resort.  The resort feels more private than being in a huge house with other people, the amenities are nicer, and the upgrades appear to be really well done so far.
> 
> We didn't take an official "sales promotion" tour , we just showed up and told them that we were Gold Key owners at OBC and wanted to see what they were doing.   The representative that showed us around was great.  She was super friendly.    We also met another Gold Key representative who had been around many years in the OBX area and was very helpful and informative in answering our questions.  Both were licensed real estate agents and both of them were cautiously optimistic about the DRI purchase.    It was just a really nice and productive experience overall.
> 
> From what we saw touring the property and improvements made so far, it sure seems like Gold Key / DRI is fully committed to getting all the enhancements completed over the next 6-9 months.   Or at least all the amenities.  Not sure exactly how many new units they will be building on the back end of the property and when they will be fully completed.
> 
> I would be very interested to hear your updates after you visit since you would know best how far they have come.   And I know I keep repeating myself, but I sure hope DRI keeps all the Gold Key people and doesn't mess up the Gold Key culture we have experienced to this point.



I really can't stomach sales tours, so I think that I will show up also as I had originally planned.  

I hope that I'm pleasantly surprised at the progress at the resort.  It was abysmal when I was there on July 1.  I left before the pool opening on July 4th, but walked around inside the gated area and liked what I saw.  The units were far from being completed.  The new furniture had just started arriving that week.  The units that I stayed in last March and July had the appliances, countertops, flooring, and painting completed.  But no new furnishings, no window treatments other than blinds, nothing on the walls, no decorator items or accessories, the mattresses were on bed frames only with no new linens or towels.  The screens were still torn on the screened porches and the exteriors looked old and worn.  Many of the parking lots were full of the discarded appliances.  There was no type of landscaping done around the units.  It wasn't a pleasant experience.  I knew they were behind but did not expect them to be that way off.  

Has the Welcome Center opened yet?  Are they out of the trailers yet (check-in and owner services)?  Are any of the other amenities available for use other than the outdoor pool?

If they stay on track and stick with Gold Key Resorts' plans for the resort, and get things completed; I will still be a cheerleader for this project even with the DRI horror stories.   I love the beach as much as anyone, but there's so much more to the Outer Banks that I enjoy when I'm there.   I don't need to be right on the beach every time I stay there.  Sometimes, it's nice to be somewhere that has a resort feel when you arrive, resort amenities and a higher quality of unit aesthetics.  I've only stayed in a Marriott timeshare once; never any Westins, Hyatts, Hiltons, etc.  So that's not the type of resorts that I usually stay in and don't require that level of stay.  But I do sometimes prefer the step-above the more basic resorts.  Sometimes, I do want that oceanfront stay.  I like the idea that now there will be both options available.

The gated parking, which Chris mentioned above, is available.  I'm hopeful that they are looking into a regular beach shuttle.  They had a Beachwoods shuttle onsite when I was there and said that it was something that they were considering.

After October, my next stay at Beachwoods will be in March 2016 for the OBX Taste of the Beach.  It will be my third year going to this great four-day event.  

Will Beachwoods' current units and all the planned amenities and such be completed by then?????


----------



## RLS50

Egret1986 said:


> I hope that I'm pleasantly surprised at the progress at the resort.  It was abysmal when I was there on July 1.  I left before the pool opening on July 4th, but walked around inside the gated area and liked what I saw.  The units were far from being completed.  The new furniture had just started arriving that week.  The units that I stayed in last March and July had the appliances, countertops, flooring, and painting completed.  But no new furnishings, no window treatments other than blinds, nothing on the walls, no decorator items or accessories, the mattresses were on bed frames only with no new linens or towels.  The screens were still torn on the screened porches and the exteriors looked old and worn.  Many of the parking lots were full of the discarded appliances.  There was no type of landscaping done around the units.  It wasn't a pleasant experience.  I knew they were behind but did not expect them to be that way off.
> 
> Has the Welcome Center opened yet?  Are they out of the trailers yet (check-in and owner services)?  Are any of the other amenities available for use other than the outdoor pool?
> 
> After October, my next stay at Beachwoods will be in March 2016 for the OBX Taste of the Beach.  It will be my third year going to this great four-day event.
> 
> Will Beachwoods' current units and all the planned amenities and such be completed by then?????


They are in the new Welcome Center.  We were impressed with it.  Large lobby area and large great room overlooking the pond area.  All the decking out by the pond is completed with seating areas.  

You already know the main pool was completed and open.  It is well landscaped and plenty of seating.   While they don't appear to have much more than the main Olympic pool officially completed at this time, a bunch of stuff appears to be very close to completion.  

For example it shouldn't take too much to complete the outdoor bar and grille near the main pool area.  It appears that the Fitness Center should be completed soon now that the Welcome Center is open.   There was construction personnel working on the indoor water park area when we were there.  The GK rep said that they consulted with the same people who design the Great Wolf Lodge indoor water parks.

If I had to guess I think the Fitness Center and areas by the main pool will be finished by March 2016.  They say the indoor water park should be completed by then too, and maybe it will be, but I can imagine if anything experiences delays, it might be that.  I only say that because it just seems like there could be more complex plumbing and water pressure requirements involved, so logically it could run into more issues.   

I did not see the overall disarray and major construction you report seeing in the summer.   We drove thru most of the complex and all the parking lots appeared to be mostly clear.

From what we saw last week, I think you have a good chance of being very satisfied with the final product.


----------



## Egret1986

*Yay.  I'm excited just to know the Welcome Center is done!*



RLS50 said:


> They are in the new Welcome Center.  We were impressed with it.  Large lobby area and large great room overlooking the pond area.  All the decking out by the pond is completed with seating areas.
> 
> You already know the main pool was completed and open.  It is well landscaped and plenty of seating.   While they don't appear to have much more than the main Olympic pool officially completed at this time, a bunch of stuff appears to be very close to completion.
> 
> For example it shouldn't take too much to complete the outdoor bar and grille near the main pool area.  It appears that the Fitness Center should be completed soon now that the Welcome Center is open.   There was construction personnel working on the indoor water park area when we were there.  The GK rep said that they consulted with the same people who design the Great Wolf Lodge indoor water parks.
> 
> If I had to guess I think the Fitness Center and areas by the main pool will be finished by March 2016.  They say the indoor water park should be completed by then too, and maybe it will be, but I can imagine if anything experiences delays, it might be that.  I only say that because it just seems like there could be more complex plumbing and water pressure requirements involved, so logically it could run into more issues.
> 
> I did not see the overall disarray and major construction you report seeing in the summer.   We drove thru most of the complex and all the parking lots appeared to be mostly clear.
> 
> From what we saw last week, I think you have a good chance of being very satisfied with the final product.



I'm sure the staff is also.  

It does sound like things are progressing and that maybe this coming Summer won't be a bust like last year.

Thanks again for sharing.  This is beneficial info for owners, as well as those that are potentially planning a vacation on the Outer Banks next year.


----------



## Egret1986

*I just confirmed a "Last Call" in RCI today to stay onsite at Beachwoods.*



RLS50 said:


> They are in the new Welcome Center.  We were impressed with it.  Large lobby area and large great room overlooking the pond area.  All the decking out by the pond is completed with seating areas.
> 
> You already know the main pool was completed and open.  It is well landscaped and plenty of seating.   While they don't appear to have much more than the main Olympic pool officially completed at this time, a bunch of stuff appears to be very close to completion.
> 
> For example it shouldn't take too much to complete the outdoor bar and grille near the main pool area.  It appears that the Fitness Center should be completed soon now that the Welcome Center is open.   There was construction personnel working on the indoor water park area when we were there.  The GK rep said that they consulted with the same people who design the Great Wolf Lodge indoor water parks.
> 
> If I had to guess I think the Fitness Center and areas by the main pool will be finished by March 2016.  They say the indoor water park should be completed by then too, and maybe it will be, but I can imagine if anything experiences delays, it might be that.  I only say that because it just seems like there could be more complex plumbing and water pressure requirements involved, so logically it could run into more issues.
> 
> I did not see the overall disarray and major construction you report seeing in the summer.   We drove thru most of the complex and all the parking lots appeared to be mostly clear.
> 
> From what we saw last week, I think you have a good chance of being very satisfied with the final product.



I have a couple of non-Beachwoods HOA meetings to attend on October 24.  I got a week for 10/18-10/25.  I live close enough that I was willing to do a day trip, but being able to spend a couple of days at Beachwoods will allow me the opportunity to check things out and talk to Jennifer Walker in Owner Services and Mr. Rauch, the resort manager.  I think I will pre-contact Mr. Rauch prior to my stay to see if he can arrange to put me in a "completed" unit.  Mr. Rauch goes way back to the days of Barrier Island Station Duck, then Barrier Island Station Kitty Hawk, then Gold Key Resorts, and now (I would assume) DRI.

I'm looking forward to a few days on the Outer Banks (as always) and the opportunity to view what has taken place since my brief stay in July.  It will also give me a chance to visit the resorts that are having the HOA meetings, and view the renovations that are currently taking place.


----------



## RLS50

Egret1986 said:


> I have a couple of non-Beachwoods HOA meetings to attend on October 24.  I got a week for 10/18-10/25.  I live close enough that I was willing to do a day trip, but being able to spend a couple of days at Beachwoods will allow me the opportunity to check things out and talk to Jennifer Walker in Owner Services and Mr. Rauch, the resort manager.  I think I will pre-contact Mr. Rauch prior to my stay to see if he can arrange to put me in a "completed" unit.  Mr. Rauch goes way back to the days of Barrier Island Station Duck, then Barrier Island Station Kitty Hawk, then Gold Key Resorts, and now (I would assume) DRI.
> 
> I'm looking forward to a few days on the Outer Banks (as always) and the opportunity to view what has taken place since my brief stay in July.  It will also give me a chance to visit the resorts that are having the HOA meetings, and view the renovations that are currently taking place.


I think you made a good choice.  Since you know the area and the resort so well, I think this will give you some useful intel, especially if you need to decide whether to use or rent some of your weeks there in 2016.

If you find that you disagree with my generally positive comments from what we saw last week, or are disappointed, I hope you share that with me.   Since you are a veteran at OBX and at the Beachwoods property, you would be a better judge than I am of what is good progress and how it compares to other rental options in OBX.

As somebody who was there for the first time ever last week, something you said to me a couple of months ago kept ringing in my head "when completed there will be nothing else like it on the Outer Banks."   I think I now understand what you meant.  

We went to OBX a lot in the 90's and stayed on north and southern shores.    We were in a beautiful home in Corolla last week.  But Beachwoods felt like somebody had taken the Poconos and beach proximity and mixed them together into one resort with some nice added amenities.  We especially liked all the trees and shade.   And another nice feature is the convenience of a WalMart and the shopping center right next door but because of the layout and trees you don't see it or "feel" it.   

And as somebody driving down from the Northeast corridor, it is nice to reach your destination as soon as your cross the bridge on Rt158.  That cuts anywhere from 30min to another 60 minutes of drive time depending on the season and traffic.  That might not mean much to somebody coming from VA, but if you are coming from PA or NJ that last extra hour sometimes feels like three.  And obviously it saves up to an hour going back home as well.   So the location is great for people with longer drives.

Hope you have a great week down there.


----------



## pedro47

I have seen commercials advertising  this new five star resort in the following states Virginia,  North Carolina, . and Maryland during the Month of October 2015.


----------



## RLS50

pedro47 said:


> I have seen commercials advertising  this new five star resort in the following states Virginia,  North Carolina, . and Maryland during the Month of October 2015.


Are you talking about Beachwoods?   

I am a new owner at Ocean Beach Club in VB, recently purchased a unit at Boardwalk Resort and Villas in VB, and also bought a Beachwoods unit on the TUG Marketplace.

So what I say next, I do not mean to be negative.  I am a huge fan of the Gold Key properties in VB and also see the tremendous potential in Beachwoods in NC.

But I am not sure I would call any Gold Key resort a 5 star resort?  4 stars might be fair.  If I had to take a swag by resort I would probably rank them...

Oceanaire - 4.5 Star
Ocean Beach Club - 4.25 Star
Turtle Cay - 4 Star (love the units and pools but not beachfront) 
Boardwalk Resort and Villas - 4 Star
Beachwoods - 4 Star (when completed)
Beach Quarters - 3.5 Star

Again, that is not meant as a criticism, just that for me calling something 5 Star usually means more luxurious accommodations.   For example I have not found the bedding at the Gold Key resorts to be anywhere near as nice as a high end Marriott or other high end resorts.

Even judging on a relative timeshare scale, I think the Marriott resorts are probably more luxurious than any of the Gold Key resorts.   But on the flip side, the MF's at the Gold Key resorts are lower than Marriott's so that balances it out I guess.   

And again, not a criticism per se, like I said, I like most all the Gold Key properties.   I can say I am not a big fan of Beach Quarters.  We toured it and the rooms feel a bit small and cramped, but we never stayed there so can't go too far with any criticism.

All JMO obviously.


----------



## smtundra

As a summer owner of 1 week at Beach Quarters and 1 week at Turtle Cay, I thought I would try to create a "Gold Key Resorts Owner's Forum" on Facebook.  

Please feel free to join and share information on there if you'd like.  I thought maybe others will be searching for information about this transition and allow people to share their experience and information.


----------



## dsexton

RLS50 said:


> Are you talking about Beachwoods?
> 
> I am a new owner at Ocean Beach Club in VB, recently purchased a unit at Boardwalk Resort and Villas in VB, and also bought a Beachwoods unit on the TUG Marketplace.
> 
> So what I say next, I do not mean to be negative.  I am a huge fan of the Gold Key properties in VB and also see the tremendous potential in Beachwoods in NC.
> 
> But I am not sure I would call any Gold Key resort a 5 star resort?  4 stars might be fair.  If I had to take a swag by resort I would probably rank them...
> 
> Oceanaire - 4.5 Star
> Ocean Beach Club - 4.25 Star
> Turtle Cay - 4 Star (love the units and pools but not beachfront)
> Boardwalk Resort and Villas - 4 Star
> Beachwoods - 4 Star (when completed)
> Beach Quarters - 3.5 Star
> 
> Again, that is not meant as a criticism, just that for me calling something 5 Star usually means more luxurious accommodations.   For example I have not found the bedding at the Gold Key resorts to be anywhere near as nice as a high end Marriott or other high end resorts.
> 
> Even judging on a relative timeshare scale, I think the Marriott resorts are probably more luxurious than any of the Gold Key resorts.   But on the flip side, the MF's at the Gold Key resorts are lower than Marriott's so that balances it out I guess.
> 
> And again, not a criticism per se, like I said, I like most all the Gold Key properties.   I can say I am not a big fan of Beach Quarters.  We toured it and the rooms feel a bit small and cramped, but we never stayed there so can't go too far with any criticism.
> 
> All JMO obviously.


Agree With You....However...
I would definitely agree with you regarding the ratings of the Gold Key Resorts.  I own at Beach Quarters, and for me BQ's location trumps lesser quality than other Gold Key Resorts.  For those that don't know the area, this can easily be overlooked, but BQ is located right in the heart of all the 'hot-spots' in VA Beach (Mahi Mahs, Waterman's, Chix).  Being able to walk to all my favorite haunts means a lot !!


----------



## RLS50

dsexton said:


> Agree With You....However...
> I would definitely agree with you regarding the ratings of the Gold Key Resorts.  I own at Beach Quarters, and for me BQ's location trumps lesser quality than other Gold Key Resorts.  For those that don't know the area, this can easily be overlooked, but BQ is located right in the heart of all the 'hot-spots' in VA Beach (Mahi Mahs, Waterman's, Chix).  Being able to walk to all my favorite haunts means a lot !!


Yes, we do like the location / area of Beach Quarters best when we take our teenage children.   Way more action and events for them on that end.  We like OBC best when it is just my wife and I.    

Another big advantage with owning or staying at Beach Quarters is that guests are allowed to use the pools at Turtle Cay, or vice versa if you are at Turtle Cay.   Some kind of grandfather arrangement between the 2 locations.  As far as I know it is still in place.   So if somebody stays at Beach Quarters, they get the advantage of Oceanfront balconies and views, but can also walk right across the street and swim in the one of the best outdoor pool areas on the VB oceanfront at Turtle Cay.   We would not hesitate to trade into Beach Quarters for that reason alone, which for us trumps any cons there.

So I hope you didn't take my remarks too critically.  In reality I don't think anyone can go wrong owning any of the Gold Key properties at VB.   They all have their own Pros and Cons.

I grew up spending my summers at Ocean City, MD, the Delaware beaches, and various spots all along the Jersey shore, and VB area is superior in our opinion.   We are just disappointed it took us so many years to find it.


----------



## nuwermj

pedro47 said:


> Rumor has it that DRI has acquired a time share resort somewhere  in the state of New York.



pedro47,

Do you have any more news on this rumor? When will it be announced?


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## tschwa2

Last night I saw the first Beachwoods unit available for exchange in II- just one for May 2016.  It is listed in the Cape Hatteras section.


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## Egret1986

*From $0 for resort transfer fees and estoppels (Gold Key Resorts) to $300 (DRI)*

Gold Key Resorts had no charges for these items.

I was just notified by the closing company that DRI charges a $250 resort transfer fee and $50 for estoppels.

I will have the expectation of the seller picking up these fees since I was given an "all-in" price, which did not include these costs.  

Officially, Beachwoods will be a DRI resort day after tomorrow.  So it begins.


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## Egret1986

*Does DRI accept Credit Card payment for Maintenance Fees?*

Gold Key Resorts did.  Does DRI?


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## tschwa2

Egret1986 said:


> Gold Key Resorts had no charges for these items.
> 
> I was just notified by the closing company that DRI charges a $250 resort transfer fee and $50 for estoppels.
> 
> I will have the expectation of the seller picking up these fees since I was given an "all-in" price, which did not include these costs.
> 
> Officially, Beachwoods will be a DRI resort day after tomorrow.  So it begins.



I have an "all in" in the works at beachwoods as well.  Estoppel taken care of over a month ago but still waiting for the deed to be returned from the current owner.


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## pedro47

Egret1986 said:


> Gold Key Resorts did.  Does DRI?



Yes!! DRI accept all major credit cards.


----------



## Egret1986

*Good deal!  Thank you for that info!*



pedro47 said:


> Yes!! DRI accept all major credit cards.



I like to earn awards on American and this is one of the ways I do it each year!

I guess it's time to get onboard with the DRI machine. It happens for me on Saturday.


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## RLS50

Egret1986 said:


> I guess it's time to get onboard with the DRI machine. It happens for me on Saturday.


If it makes you feel any better, you could be us.   We actually bought into the Gold Key "family" pitch and paid developer price for our deeded week and then within months end up being with DRI...who of course is probably going to give preference to their points system members unless I fork over another $20K.


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## tschwa2

Hopefully you bought the week(s) you want to use most of the time. They won't be able to take your fixed week away from you. Don't convert.


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## RLS50

tschwa2 said:


> Hopefully you bought the week(s) you want to use most of the time. They won't be able to take your fixed week away from you. Don't convert.


Yes and No.   We like shoulder seasons, but the week we bought isn't our perfect week, it is best spring week they had available oceanfront.   We used it to trade into a good Red week for this year.   But we have been trying to buy the exact shoulder weeks we want on the resale market.

You know, trying to make chicken salad out of .... and all that at this point.   With the benefit of hindsight we could have bought (resale) Week 26 2 BR / 2BA and 2 prime shoulder weeks in VB for what we will end up spending.   Oh well.


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## Egret1986

*I have officially been welcomed to the Diamond Resorts Family*

Welcome to the Diamond Resorts Family 

Dear Valued Owner, 

We are pleased to inform you that on October 16, 2015, Diamond Resorts International® completed the purchase of the vacation ownership assets of Gold Key Resorts which include the following six resorts:
Beach Quarters Resort in Virginia Beach, VA
Turtle Cay Resort in Virginia Beach, VA
Boardwalk Resort and Villas in Virginia Beach, VA
Oceanaire Resort in Virginia Beach, VA
Ocean Beach Club in Virginia Beach, VA
Beachwoods in Kitty Hawk, NC

With this transaction now complete, we are excited to welcome you to the Diamond Resorts family. We recognize the value of your ownership, and we want you to rest assured that your ownership is secure and you will continue to enjoy the vacation lifestyle you deserve. Any future confirmed reservations that you have already made are booked and there is no need to call again. For all new reservations, please continue to book on the website or contact the Owner Relations Services Call Center (1.800.465.3539) as you have before. 

At Diamond Resorts International®, your on-going satisfaction is very important to us, and our goal is to build a positive and rewarding relationship with you so that you may enjoy the many benefits of living a vacationed life. 

Diamond Resorts International® has more than 330 vacation destinations located in 34 countries throughout the continental United States, Hawaii, Canada, Mexico, the Caribbean, South America, Central America, Europe, Asia, Australasia and Africa. We look forward to talking to you more about the Vacations for Life® we can provide through a membership with THE Club® at Diamond Resorts International® during your next visit. 

You can also find out more information about us by visiting our website at DiamondResorts.com. We will continue to provide you with updated information on your ownership throughout the next few months. 

Stay happy. Stay healthy. Stay Vacationed.™ 

Sincerely,
Diamond Resorts International® Team


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## RLS50

*This is what I got in my In-box from DRI*

Here is the email I got from DRI...


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

Not even God can help us now!


----------



## dsexton

The communication was not specific enough about what website we use now.  I see the Gold Key site is still active.  I guess we continue to log-in there and pay dues etc. ?  Does anyone know if we will receive log-in credentials for the Diamond site ?


----------



## RLS50

dsexton said:


> The communication was not specific enough about what website we use now.  I see the Gold Key site is still active.  I guess we continue to log-in there and pay dues etc. ?  Does anyone know if we will receive log-in credentials for the Diamond site ?


Good question.  I spoke to Gold Key member services a few times this week to confirm our 2016 reservations.    They did not mention anything about 
 a change to our online access.   I am guessing if that happens, it will be a phased approach that could take weeks or months?

Also, I am not clear about access to DRI system for Gold Key members if none of us have purchased in the points system yet?   For example, with my deeded weeks and no DRI points, what good would signing on the DRI site do for me?   I don't believe I would actually be able to do much of anything there except for pay my bill or schedule my deeded week?    

I don't know the answer to your question but like you I am curious to see what changes and how fast.  As somebody who is really happy with the service I have received from Gold Key so far, I will be quite happy if the transition takes a very long time.


----------



## donnaval

Just FYI - I am at the Ocean Beach Club right now.  Not an owner, just an exchange I made before the changeover was announced.  The only outward sign that anything is changing is a small table in the lobby holding a blow-up of a welcome letter from Diamond, but it was not staffed when I got here Friday and I haven't seen anyone there, just a few local activity brochures scattered on it.  I can't tell for sure but it seems like the "Discovery" office across the street is closed.  The tablets and pens in the rooms still say goldkey.  There is no info binder in the unit but in the place where it usually sits on the coffee table is a copy of the same letter that is downstairs.  The info channel on TV has gone dark.  No phone calls to the unit asking if we'd like to tour, which I find surprising.  

We enjoy exchanging into the OBC, especially when we get a unit with a view or a balcony - will be curious to see if availability decreases with the changeover.


----------



## pedro47

New resorts to The Club in New York,.. Club Quarter opp. Rockeller Center, The Jewel Facing Rockefeller Center, Hotel Boutique Center at Grand Center, NYC, and the World Center Hotel, NYC.


----------



## RLS50

donnaval said:


> Just FYI - I am at the Ocean Beach Club right now.  Not an owner, just an exchange I made before the changeover was announced.  The only outward sign that anything is changing is a small table in the lobby holding a blow-up of a welcome letter from Diamond, but it was not staffed when I got here Friday and I haven't seen anyone there, just a few local activity brochures scattered on it.  I can't tell for sure but it seems like the "Discovery" office across the street is closed.  The tablets and pens in the rooms still say goldkey.  There is no info binder in the unit but in the place where it usually sits on the coffee table is a copy of the same letter that is downstairs.  The info channel on TV has gone dark.  No phone calls to the unit asking if we'd like to tour, which I find surprising.
> 
> We enjoy exchanging into the OBC, especially when we get a unit with a view or a balcony - will be curious to see if availability decreases with the changeover.


Thanks for the report!


----------



## Egret1986

*Returned home today from Beachwoods in Kitty Hawk; I hope to post on my blog soon.*

Surprisingly, when I met with and spoke to the Manager of Owner Relations this past Thursday, she indicated that "they" should be deciding very soon where and when the Association Meeting would be held.

When I arrived home I had a mailing that was dated October 20, 2015, announcing the Annual Membership Meeting will be held on Friday, October 30, 2015 at 11:00 am at the Kitty Hawk Hilton Garden Inn. Apparently, she hadn't received the memo.

Next Friday morning, at this late date of notification, will be hard to swing for most folks, I would think.  Maybe that was in the planning.  I'd love to attend, but I can't take off from work. 

Also in the mailing, there was an invitation for the Second Annual Beachwoods Owners Update and Barbecue to be held on Saturday, November 7.  "Learn more about the Gold Key/Diamond sale"  "Learn more about Gold Key/Diamond's continued involvement in Beachwoods"  "Tour new units and amenities"

I'll definitely drive down for this Update and hear what they've got to say, and see how it compares to last year's presentation.

Things are beginning to take shape at the resort.  While there were folks staying at the resort, it was a very quiet and relaxing stay.  The weather was wonderful.  I enjoyed my stay at the resort, although there were still no available amenities to use.  The Woodland Oasis Pool had just closed the previous week for the season.  The Welcome Center overlooking Cypress Lake is stunning.

I will post when I have added added my blog posts for my recent stay, with pictures that I took around the resort and inside a "B" side unit.


----------



## Michael1991

pedro47 said:


> New resorts to The Club in New York,.. Club Quarter opp. Rockeller Center, The Jewel Facing Rockefeller Center, Hotel Boutique Center at Grand Center, NYC, and the World Center Hotel, NYC.



These are DRI affiliate resorts. Diamond rents a few rooms and exchanges them for points with The Club members. They were announced this past week at the US Collection Membership meeting.


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## ShellsSinkDreamsFloat

I Just received my annual membership meeting information and proxy for Beachwoods.  Is anyone actually planning on going to the meeting?  Unfortunately I cannot make it on such short notice (it is Friday October 30).  I am sending my proxy today (hope it gets there tomorrow, but not likely).  If anyone is going (Egret1986 ?) and would like to be my proxy, let me know in the next few hours.  Otherwise I'll send the proxy as is (Michael Poch - President of BCA).  My concern is letting Diamond "run the table" and control the HOA.  It's probably too late to do anything this year, but hopefully we (Beachwoods owners) can organize for next year...


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## Egret1986

*I'm not going to be able to attend on Friday.*



ShellsSinkDreamsFloat said:


> I Just received my annual membership meeting information and proxy for Beachwoods.  Is anyone actually planning on going to the meeting?  Unfortunately I cannot make it on such short notice (it is Friday October 30).  I am sending my proxy today (hope it gets there tomorrow, but not likely).  If anyone is going (Egret1986 ?) and would like to be my proxy, let me know in the next few hours.  Otherwise I'll send the proxy as is (Michael Poch - President of BCA).  My concern is letting Diamond "run the table" and control the HOA.  It's probably too late to do anything this year, but hopefully we (Beachwoods owners) can organize for next year...



Like you, I couldn't arrange the time to go since I was on the Outer Banks last week and the late receipt of the notice.  Holding it on a Friday, as opposed to Saturday, combined with the short notice; I believe that was all in the planning to cut down on the number of Owners that could make the meeting.   Giving them the benefit of the doubt; the acquisition was finalized on October 17 and the letter of notification was dated October 20.

I am going to attend the Owner update the following Saturday.  If you can make that, it may or may not be worth your while.  Gold Key Resorts provided an impressive presentation last year.  I am definitely interested in hearing what they have to say a year later.

I got your email and will respond back to you by the weekend.  I work for USPS.  Unfortunately, if mailed today, a miracle would have to happen for your proxy to arrive by Friday's meeting at 11:00.   

Welcome to TUG!


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## Egret1986

*Beachwoods, Kitty Hawk, Unit 1203B  (1BR/1BA with full kitchen, sleeps 4-half of LO)*

Blog post with pictures can be found by tapping on My Website below.  "Beachwoods Lodging, Unit 1203B".

Here is a link.

http://www.timesharevacationsblog.com/2015/10/beachwoods-lodging-unit-1203b/

I should have my post, along with pictures around the resort done over the weekend.


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## harveyhaddixfan

Very, very nice. I was hoping for the key card access. It doesn't look like they replaced the roof on all the units like they had originally planned. With as much work as they've done, we should have ponied up an extra $100 a week to redo the outside of the units to look more like the check in building!


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## RLS50

Egret1986 said:


> Blog post with pictures can be found by tapping on My Website below.  "Beachwoods Lodging, Unit 1203B".
> 
> Here is a link.
> 
> http://www.timesharevacationsblog.com/2015/10/beachwoods-lodging-unit-1203b/
> 
> I should have my post, along with pictures around the resort done over the weekend.


Thanks for the update and the pictures.   We always enjoy your blog posts.

I am really curious to see how the indoor waterpark looks after completed.   Not because we will really use it, but if well done it should really create some space in the big pool for the adults since all the younger kids will likely want to be in there.    I do wish the space they were using for the indoor water park was bigger.


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## Egret1986

*I couldn't agree more.  The exteriors on most building look pretty tired.*



harveyhaddixfan said:


> Very, very nice. I was hoping for the key card access. It doesn't look like they replaced the roof on all the units like they had originally planned. With as much work as they've done, we should have ponied up an extra $100 a week to redo the outside of the units to look more like the check in building!



Barrier Island Station in Duck has finally started exterior renovations on their buildings.  This exterior work has transformed the looks of the resort.  Two buildings are completed and they really look great.  However, once you open the unit doors; no upgrades (30-year-old interiors).  Maybe one day.


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## Egret1986

*We've all got our wishes.  I know I've got mine.*



RLS50 said:


> I do wish the space they were using for the indoor water park was bigger.



I'm really looking forward to the Diamond/Gold Key Owners Update.  I hope it's similar to last year.  It was really well orchestrated and impressively presented, with plenty of information provided and lots of staff around to answer questions.


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## RLS50

Egret1986 said:


> I'm really looking forward to the Diamond/Gold Key Owners Update.  I hope it's similar to last year.  It was really well orchestrated and impressively presented, with plenty of information provided and lots of staff around to answer questions.



Just remember to take all the deeds to your properties (to turn over to the "Club") and a check for $30K and maybe you'll be able to leave as a proud Platinum owner of 50+K in points!  :hysterical:


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## RLS50

All jokes aside, curious if you hear anything interesting.   

Personally I am really curious to see the eventual DRI impact on MF's.   Unless I am missing something they seem higher (almost anywhere in the U.S.) for an average week than most Marriott oceanfront locations in the U.S.?    

With the average DRI weekly MF rate about 50% higher than the average Gold Key property week now, what would the impact be?   VB is sort of unique in that on one hand there isn't room for anymore properties on VB oceanfront.  So would rentals for VB oceanfront go up to correspond to (possible) increases in owners MF's?  Or would owners who rent find themselves getting squeezed more and more each year?   Or else would prospective owners in VB start looking harder at owning non-DRI properties because their MF's will still be almost half of the DRI properties? 

Not sure right now which way the pendulum swings.   But curious to see what happens.


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## Egret1986

*That thought is depressing.  Why the high MFs? More than Marriott oceanfront?*



RLS50 said:


> All jokes aside, curious if you hear anything interesting.
> 
> Personally I am really curious to see the eventual DRI impact on MF's.   Unless I am missing something they seem higher (almost anywhere in the U.S.) for an average week than most Marriott oceanfront locations in the U.S.?
> 
> With the average DRI weekly MF rate about 50% higher than the average Gold Key property week now, what would the impact be?   VB is sort of unique in that on one hand there isn't room for anymore properties on VB oceanfront.  So would rentals for VB oceanfront go up to correspond to (possible) increases in owners MF's?  Or would owners who rent find themselves getting squeezed more and more each year?   Or else would prospective owners in VB start looking harder at owning non-DRI properties because their MF's will still be almost half of the DRI properties?
> 
> Not sure right now which way the pendulum swings.   But curious to see what happens.



In Virginia Beach, there's no other timeshare resorts that remotely compare to the Gold Key Resorts timeshares.  I think owners will find "themselves getting squeezed more and more each year" when the MFs begin escalating.  The ones that will be hurt the most are the owners of off-season weeks that probably will not be able to rent their unused fixed weeks to cover the fees.

My Gold Key Resorts MF's are already higher than other resorts where I own.  However, the GKR properties are more modern and have nicer amenities.  There aren't any Marriott or other name brands in Virginia Beach or the Outer Banks.  If prospective owners want to own at the nicest possible resorts in either of these two locations, then they will have to bite the maintenance fee bullet or settle for less than what they want in timeshare accommodations and amenities.

I am sure the maintenance fees will definitely be a talking point at the Owners Update.  There was an entire segment at last year's presentation dedicated to maintenance fees and the need to increase them at Beachwoods.  Diamond may have been one of the mentioned timeshare organizations as having higher maintenance fees.  Bruce Thompson indicated that while the maintenance fee was being increased from $625 to $710, it was still lower than the "industry" standard.  I'm not sure that this Update will be in the same format as last year's.  If it is, then Owners will have the opportunity to question the "executives" during the update.  If no one raises the point about Diamond maintenance fees being higher than the "industry" standard, then I certainly won't hesitate to bring that up.  It will be interesting to hear "the spin."


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## harveyhaddixfan

Here's the comparison from last year.


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## harveyhaddixfan

Also worth mentioning is the MF at Beachwoods is the same no matter what size unit you have. 

Comparing the fees at an oceanfront resort to Beachwoods really isn't fair either for a number of reasons like INSURANCE costs, higher maintenance due to the ocean, etc. Back in the woods where the resort is there is very little threat of flooding and wind damage is minimized by the trees, although I guess you could have more trees falling on the units. 

Diamond is probably nearing 50% ownership already and will have it easily when they start building new units. So we are at their mercy regarding increases. Hopefully they don't alienate too many of us.


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## RLS50

harveyhaddixfan said:


> View attachment 2318
> 
> Here's the comparison from last year.


Thanks for that.

Based on what I have seen reviewing various DRI deeded weeks available for sale across the U.S., it seems the average MF for a 2BR/2BA unit is between $1300ish to $1400ish.   

I would be happy to stand corrected if one of the DRI owners disagrees.   It is possible since my research is based on deeded weeks owners selling DRI properties that points or Club members pay a slightly different annual MF average.   

And I am only talking about U.S. properties, not Hawaii or Caribbean which is a different conversation and rate scale in almost all timeshare systems.


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## donnaval

My deeded 2-br Orlando unit was under $600 MF prior to a takeover by DRI.  Then, over a period of about 4 years, the MF more than doubled.  I was thrilled to pay $250 to DRI to deedback the unit to them because I thought I'd never get out of that timeshare.  I could not imagine anyone wanting to pay that kind of a MF for an Orlando timeshare.  I hope you Gold Key owners don't have the same experience.  We've traded into the Ocean Beach Club a few times, and Oceanaire a couple of times, and while they are nice they are nowhere near Marriott quality, and unless you have a guaranteed view unit, I'd hate to pay that Marriott-sized MF.


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## RLS50

Egret1986 said:


> In Virginia Beach, there's no other timeshare resorts that remotely compare to the Gold Key Resorts timeshares.  I think owners will find "themselves getting squeezed more and more each year" when the MFs begin escalating.  The ones that will be hurt the most are the owners of off-season weeks that probably will not be able to rent their unused fixed weeks to cover the fees.
> 
> My Gold Key Resorts MF's are already higher than other resorts where I own.  However, the GKR properties are more modern and have nicer amenities.  There aren't any Marriott or other name brands in Virginia Beach or the Outer Banks.  If prospective owners want to own at the nicest possible resorts in either of these two locations, then they will have to bite the maintenance fee bullet or settle for less than what they want in timeshare accommodations and amenities.
> 
> I am sure the maintenance fees will definitely be a talking point at the Owners Update.  There was an entire segment at last year's presentation dedicated to maintenance fees and the need to increase them at Beachwoods.  Diamond may have been one of the mentioned timeshare organizations as having higher maintenance fees.  Bruce Thompson indicated that while the maintenance fee was being increased from $625 to $710, it was still lower than the "industry" standard.  I'm not sure that this Update will be in the same format as last year's.  If it is, then Owners will have the opportunity to question the "executives" during the update.  If no one raises the point about Diamond maintenance fees being higher than the "industry" standard, then I certainly won't hesitate to bring that up.  It will be interesting to hear "the spin."


Yes, I completely agree that there is no real comparison in VB (or OBX for that matter) to the Gold Key / DRI timeshare properties…when only comparing timeshare properties.    I also agree about possible impact to shoulder seasons for timeshare owners, not just in rentals, but also in resale value.

We intentionally spent some extended weekends at various hotels along VB oceanfront this summer (not only enjoy VB), but also to get a more educated feel for what the comparisons are between some of the hotels to the timeshare properties.   And we made sure to visit and tour multiple timeshare properties in VB as well.

Using just one example (a more expensive one)…for direct shoulder weeks (April-May, late Aug into early October) you can stay in one of the Marriott’s for about $600-1000 during the week and about $500 to $800 for the weekend.   Or about $1100 to $1800 for the week (based on exact dates staying, discounts / specials, or timing of booking).   

That is only a 1BR / 1BA.  But you get a King size bed (with better quality mattress) facing the ocean, larger room, large oceanfront balcony, and in some cases a larger and nicer outdoor pool area than even the OBC complex.   

In fact, it one uses the Courtyard at 37th street, you get the above and can walk down and sit outside at Tortuga’s or Lager Head’s lounge in the evening for drinks, snack/dinner, and live music.   You might pay more for the week, but do have the freedom of a “rental” vs. ownership, and in many ways can enjoy similar or the same amenities (with some exceptions of course) as those at OBC.

I don’t really have any conclusions from my comments above.   There are too many moving parts and unknowns right now.    But I do think that if DRI ends up taking MF’s up $300-$400 or more per year from where they are now to match their fees at other properties in the U.S., that is going to present some different calculations in the math of ownership vs rental, and even potentially resale values.   

Again, too many moving parts right now to come to any conclusions I think.    

Hope you enjoy your trip to the meeting.


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## RLS50

donnaval said:


> My deeded 2-br Orlando unit was under $600 MF prior to a takeover by DRI.  Then, over a period of about 4 years, the MF more than doubled.  I was thrilled to pay $250 to DRI to deedback the unit to them because I thought I'd never get out of that timeshare.  I could not imagine anyone wanting to pay that kind of a MF for an Orlando timeshare.  I hope you Gold Key owners don't have the same experience.  We've traded into the Ocean Beach Club a few times, and Oceanaire a couple of times, and while they are nice they are nowhere near Marriott quality, and unless you have a guaranteed view unit, I'd hate to pay that Marriott-sized MF.


I don't own any Marriott timeshares, but have stayed at Marriott properties all over the world due to traveling for work over the years.

There is no question that the quality of Marriott properties are noticeably superior to the Gold Key properties I have stayed at or toured.   That is not intended as a criticism of the Gold Key properties, which I happen to like very much and consider the best at VB, just an honest acknowledgment of facts.

I really don't have a problem with the differences when paying an average MF of $875 per year.   But if DRI eventually ends up charging a higher MF than the U.S. Marriott timeshare owners are paying, then they better plan on making a lot of upgrades and improvements.   Because at those rates, then the smaller details will start mattering a whole lot more.  JMO.


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## donnaval

I don't mean to criticize the Gold Key properties either - as I mentioned, we've exchanged into them a few times and enjoyed our stays.  It's just that we know what happened with us when DRI took over our timeshare, and I sincerely hope the Gold Key owners don't have the same experience.

I actually prefer another timeshare at VB (The Colony) - an older, definitely not luxurious timeshare, but very spacious 2-br units with killer oceanfront balconies for all units, with parking right under the building.  If we were in the market for another timeshare (we are actually trying to downsize our holdings), I'd buy there rather than OBC or any Diamond-controlled facility.


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## RLS50

donnaval said:


> I don't mean to criticize the Gold Key properties either - as I mentioned, we've exchanged into them a few times and enjoyed our stays.  It's just that we know what happened with us when DRI took over our timeshare, and I sincerely hope the Gold Key owners don't have the same experience.
> 
> I actually prefer another timeshare at VB (The Colony) - an older, definitely not luxurious timeshare, but very spacious 2-br units with killer oceanfront balconies for all units, with parking right under the building.  If we were in the market for another timeshare (we are actually trying to downsize our holdings), I'd buy there rather than OBC or any Diamond-controlled facility.


No worries, I understood your intent.   I appreciate your comments and all the insight I can get on the VB area (and DRI).

We toured the Colony as well.  Not a bad property at all.  I think they have the largest 2BR / 2BA oceanfront units in VB at approx. 1200 sq ft.   As you stated, older and in need of some updates, but very reasonable pricing across the board.


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## Michael1991

RLS50 said:


> With the average DRI weekly MF rate about 50% higher than the average Gold Key property week now, what would the impact be?



You need to be a bit careful when making this comparison. For Gold Key owners MF are based on fixed weeks at a resort. They are paying to their HOA. In the case of Diamond point owners, we are paying fees to a trust fund and the trust fund pays the HOA. The trust fund adds an additional layer of fees to the point owners, which the fixed week owner will not be required to pay. 

For example, HOA fees at the Diamond managed Grand Beach resort in Orlando were, last year, $965 for a three bedroom unit. That same unit costs 10,500 point for a summer week and 8,500 for an off-season week. Trust fund fees for 10,500 points are $1,748 and for 8,500 points are $1,456.   

So, you will pay more if you convert to points. But I don't think fixed week owners will necessarily see MF increases. Following some of the previous acquisitions made by Diamond, MF increased significantly, but those resorts were in desperate need of updated. From what I've read, Gold Key resorts are in good condition. I'm thinking that your fees shouldn't change much.


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## nuwermj

From Wednesday's DRI Q3 financials conference call:  

Q: Benjamin Chaiken - Credit Suisse

Looking your package acquisitions can you give us a rough percentage of owners that convert from fixed to points within the first 12 months or whatever timeframe the deals is…?

A: David Palmer - CEO & President

Yeah it depends Ben on the tactic that we take in conversion ... We have two different approaches. In the ILX acquisition we actually had an instant new membership that was granted to all the ILX members with an opt out provision over a period of time.

In the Tempest acquisition deal we actually did the opposite we actually did it where you came into the sales center and we sold you over time. 

We haven’t disclosed publicly what those percentages are and I am not going to do that today. They have been very successful -- both of those approaches have been very successful there is pros and cons of each one, how you administer them.

In this case we’re going to use the latter where we use the Tempest acquisition program so we’re not going to give any instantaneous membership with an opt out. We’re going to deploy the same tempo that we used in the Tempest deal. So you will see that kind of roll in over the next three or four years. [That] is really the spectrum that you're talking about here not really in the first 12 months is really is kind of a three year program. 

And that’s why you still see few years later -- and we do breakout in our 10-K that population of individuals of -- almost 20% of our sales last year was to that population is to whom we provide resort management services, but are not yet in the point systems and they’re very, very strong prospects. So we've in fact built a pipeline of future tours over the next three or four years in the structure that we're using.


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## RLS50

Michael1991 said:


> You need to be a bit careful when making this comparison. For Gold Key owners MF are based on fixed weeks at a resort. They are paying to their HOA. In the case of Diamond point owners, we are paying fees to a trust fund and the trust fund pays the HOA. The trust fund adds an additional layer of fees to the point owners, which the fixed week owner will not be required to pay.
> 
> For example, HOA fees at the Diamond managed Grand Beach resort in Orlando were, last year, $965 for a three bedroom unit. That same unit costs 10,500 point for a summer week and 8,500 for an off-season week. Trust fund fees for 10,500 points are $1,748 and for 8,500 points are $1,456.
> 
> So, you will pay more if you convert to points. But I don't think fixed week owners will necessarily see MF increases. Following some of the previous acquisitions made by Diamond, MF increased significantly, but those resorts were in desperate need of updated. From what I've read, Gold Key resorts are in good condition. I'm thinking that your fees shouldn't change much.


Thanks for that info and comparison.   But this information raises a question.   Based on your example above, what benefits are the Diamond owners getting for what appears to be the large price difference between deeded week MF's vs. trust fund MF's?   

Even if for argument's sake we just hypothetically assume any owner could convert to points for free (I don't believe that is true in reality?), why would an owner convert to points and pay the equivalent of almost double the MF for a summer week?   

I get the idea of trading costs.  So maybe a person with the deeded week needs to add their II or RCI annual fees and any annual trading fees ($200-$300 approx.)   So maybe now for a summer week the deeded owners (true) costs are $1265 ($965 + $300).   But still almost $500 cheaper per year than trust point MF's.

If one has a "home" or preferred resort they plan on using regularly, or occasionally renting out to family or friends if they can't use it, I am struggling to understand the benefits of being in the trust and paying the higher annual MF's?

Since it sounds like all former Gold Key owners are about to enter a period of years worth of sales pitches by DRI (based on information shares by NUWERMJ in the post after yours) it would be good to understand.

Thanks.


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## Michael1991

Side point: 
In the Diamond system, members pay their maintenance fees and they pay additional Club dues. These dues are $225 or more depending on how many points are owned. The Club provides reservation and exchange services similar to II.

Main point: 
I may not be the best person to answer questions about the value of converting to points. I did not convert a fixed week at a Diamond location. I have a fixed week at a non-Diamond location and I added 4000 Diamond points a few years ago. If I could do it over again, I would not have bought Diamond points. Knowing what I know now, I think Bluegreen or Wyndham are better values for someone who wants the advantages of points. But there is no resale for me to liquidate my ownership.

That said, from what I've read on TUG and elsewhere, Diamond point owners like the flexibility of a points system. In Diamond members can use points for short stays--any number between 2 and 6 nights. Some like weekend stays, others like Sunday through Thursday combinations because the daily point cost is lower. If a week costs 10,000, then each of the five nights between Sunday and Thursday cost 1000, while Friday and Saturday cost 3000 each. (Yes, this sums to 11000; it's by design. It's a small "penalty" for breaking up the week. Not all point systems assess this penalty.) Because of the ability to make short stays, points are sometimes seen to be more flexible than fixed weeks. Similarly, some people like 10-12 day stays using a mid-week check-in.

Some people also like the "last minute" discounts offered by Diamond and they see this as a way to get more vacation days out of their points. Diamond gives a 50% points discount for week long reservations within 60 days of check-in, and within 30 days they give 50% discounts for nightly stays (there is a two night minimum). I've never been able to use this as I don't live within driving distance of a Diamond resort and I am restricted to school calendars. Nevertheless others like it.

Finally, I personally prefer the Diamond reservation system over exchanges through II. When I deposit my fixed week with II there is quite a bit of uncertainty. I have to submit a request for an area and a date range, and then wait. When I get a call informing me something is available, I have 24 hours to accept. And I have no idea if something better might be available next week. With Diamond, I can see the full availability at all of their locations 10 or 13 months in advance.   

For the person who owns a preferred resort they plan on using regularly, I think the general opinion on the internet is don't convert to points. People who have made the conversion note that it becomes more difficult to get a reservation at their (former) home resort. They are now competing with 100s of thousands of other owners. Further, they pay a lot for the conversion and they pay higher annual fees, but they don't feel they really get much more for that money.


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## donnaval

> If I could do it over again, I would not have bought Diamond points. Knowing what I know now, I think Bluegreen or Wyndham are better values for someone who wants the advantages of points. But there is no resale for me to liquidate my ownership.



Michael1991 - if you don't owe anything on your points, Diamond may take them back for a $250 fee.  Please see the long sticky thread at the top.  Good luck!


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## nuwermj

Regarding why someone might convert a fixed week to DRI points, have a look at messages #32 and #49 in this thread. JOHNRSRQ is a fixed week owner who finds benefit in joining the DRI Vacation Club. 

DRI has at least two way they convert owners at acquired resorts to their Vacation Club point system. 

1. Selling a Club membership where the owner retains their deeded week
2. Selling a Club membership where the owner swaps their deed for a trust interest 

I believe ILX owners were given option 2 only. They could convert what they owned to Diamond points but they had to surrender their deeds.

Tempus Resorts had two locations: Dunes Village in Myrtle Beach and Mystic Dunes in the Orlando area. I haven't heard anything about the situation at Dunes Village, but it appears that Mystic Dunes owners are offered the first option above (they might have a choice between 1 and 2 I'm not sure). Regarding option 1, after the owner pays to join the DRI Club, one such owner explains: "You assign the rights (keep the deed) and pay the same maintenance fees plus you pay more maintenance fees for the additional points you get for the assignment. You can terminate assignment with a determined notice period but you are still stuck with the additional points (and annual maintenance fees)." This sounds to me like the same deal JOHNRSRQ has.


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## pedro47

All the Gold Key resorts are now on the DRI website.


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## tschwa2

how does availability look for next summer through DRI?


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## DanZale2000

pedro47 said:


> All the Gold Key resorts are now on the DRI website.



Where? They are not listed in the Location pages; they are not in the reservation drop downs; they are not on the DRI Rental site; they are not in the news feed.


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## harveyhaddixfan

https://www.diamondresorts.com/Beachwoods-Resort
https://www.diamondresorts.com/Ocean-Beach-Club
https://www.diamondresorts.com/Oceanaire-Resort


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## Egret1986

*Thanks for the links.*



harveyhaddixfan said:


> https://www.diamondresorts.com/Beachwoods-Resort
> https://www.diamondresorts.com/Ocean-Beach-Club
> https://www.diamondresorts.com/Oceanaire-Resort



From DRI

*Please Note: This resort is coming soon and is not yet available for booking with points. Please watch for more updates on 'What's New' in the Member Area.*


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## Egret1986

*A few days ago, I posted pictures on my blog, with some commentary, for Beachwoods*

http://www.timesharevacationsblog.com/2015/10/beachwoods-resort-stay/

Includes pictures inside and around the new Welcome Center.

Heading back there on Saturday.  Hopefully, I'll have additional info to post after my return.


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## Egret1986

*Gold Key Resorts did not charge for estoppels or ownership transfers.*

I recently purchased a week at Beachwoods (after the official DRI acquisition date).  The closing company informed me that DRI charges $50 for estoppels and $300 for the ownership transfer.  I was not willing to pay these extra fees.  I got the seller to accept these additional fees (since they weren't disclosed previous to signing the contract).

The closing company just contacted me with this information.

"I just spoke to the Diamond Resorts rep at the resort and they do not currently have a transfer or estoppel fee as they are not included in DRI's system yet."

So, at this moment, the additional fees aren't being charged for the GKR timeshares.


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## harveyhaddixfan

$300 for a transfer fee? Who do they think they are, Wyndham?


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## johnrsrq

nuwermj said:


> Regarding why someone might convert a fixed week to DRI points, have a look at messages #32 and #49 in this thread. JOHNRSRQ is a fixed week owner who finds benefit in joining the DRI Vacation Club.
> 
> DRI has at least two way they convert owners at acquired resorts to their Vacation Club point system.
> 
> 1. Selling a Club membership where the owner retains their deeded week
> 2. Selling a Club membership where the owner swaps their deed for a trust interest
> 
> I believe ILX owners were given option 2 only. They could convert what they owned to Diamond points but they had to surrender their deeds.
> 
> Tempus Resorts had two locations: Dunes Village in Myrtle Beach and Mystic Dunes in the Orlando area. I haven't heard anything about the situation at Dunes Village, but it appears that Mystic Dunes owners are offered the first option above (they might have a choice between 1 and 2 I'm not sure). Regarding option 1, after the owner pays to join the DRI Club, one such owner explains: "You assign the rights (keep the deed) and pay the same maintenance fees plus you pay more maintenance fees for the additional points you get for the assignment. You can terminate assignment with a determined notice period but you are still stuck with the additional points (and annual maintenance fees)." This sounds to me like the same deal JOHNRSRQ has.



Yes, that is fairly accurate. The joiner fee was combined with the cost for the few thousand points I bought entering "The Club".  I think they waived the first year or more of mf fees as an incentive. Now, if I wanted to cut and run, I would still be obligated for the mf on those few thousand trust points. My deeded units would come back to me and I could use them at the resort for the weekly intervals or I could set up an RCI account (still in operation there) or a seperate II account etc.. I could legally without violation of any club rules ,etc, advertise them commercially and profit from them. Otherwise ,  one can not ;     I guess if I really wanted out, I too may have to pay a $250 relinquish fee to DRI for those initially purchased *developer* points.

On the resale point accounts which I took over, which they combined into a reale account- called a regional account- US collection only in my case, I never recall signing any documents which would allow any negative credit consequence to my credit. In fact, if they did, I would sue them and win. But they won't because they do not have me on an application , credit appl. note payment or anything for that matter. I could foresee them harassing me by telling me all of my accounts would be in default if resale mf's were not paid.

I am not there at this point (exiting right stage) because I do use the programs to my benefit. Works for me currently but it does take a little time and effort.


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## Egret1986

*Just received the new Fall Diamond Resorts International Newsletter for Beachwoods*

Outdoor Pool, Temporary Sales Center & Shoreline Fishing
OPEN

North Glen Recreation Park
OPEN

Welcome Center
(Guest Registration and Sales)
OPEN

Lake and Dock for Paddle Boating and Dockside Fishing
OPEN

Lakeside Lodge with Fireplace Lounge
EARLY OCTOBER

Vacation Home Renovations Complete
LATE OCTOBER

Pavilion Fitness Center
MID-NOVEMBER

Lakeside Lodge & Waterpark
MID-DECEMBER

Oasis Pool Snack Bar
SPRING 2016

These are part of the FAQs

Q: Can I exchange my week for a week with Diamond Resorts International®?

You will have the opportunity to purchase points which will allow you to exchange with Diamond Resorts and visit all of their properties and affiliates.

Q: Will my maintenance fees go up now that Diamond Resorts has acquired the resorts?

Maintenance fees will continue to be determined annually by the Board of Directors for work, refurbishment and ongoing operation for each individual resort property. Your fees will continue to be based on the specific needs of your home resort. Remember, your fees are determined based on items like reserve for replacement – which is the constant refurbishment of items like furniture, to ensure the best vacation experience possible.  Maintenance fees also encompass insurance, taxes, utilities, and other resort-related expenses. You should continue to expect inflationary costs to affect the annual budget.

Healthy and financially sound Owners’ Associations are important to ensure we provide quality vacation experiences, and deliver unforgettable hospitality experiences that families can forever treasure. This is the core of our business philosophy at Diamond Resorts.

Q: Will I be able to convert my week into points now?

There are no changes to your ownership. Diamond Resorts intends to offer owners the opportunity toconvert their week into points if they wish, in connection with purchasing into the points program. 


And a personal note from Bruce Thompson in this letter included in the Newsletter.

"On a personal note, I am not riding into the sunset; I plan on vacationing with my family at Beachwoods regularly. I look forward to fishing in the lake and playing in the waterpark with my grandchildren."


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## harveyhaddixfan

With his fixed week. No way he's buying into the Diamond Points.


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## Egret1986

*Does DRI charge maintenance fees by the unit size?*



harveyhaddixfan said:


> Also worth mentioning is the MF at Beachwoods is the same no matter what size unit you have.



Yes, we've always paid the same MF at this resort, no matter what size unit.  Charging according to unit size seems like a more equitable way to assess MFs.


----------



## Egret1986

*No new information provided at Beachwoods 2nd Annual BBQ*

Basically, it was reiterated what has previously been in print in the newsletter and email communications. 
"The future is bright and holds the promise of enhanced vacation experiences for you all. Remember, nothing has changed with your ownership other than you will have more opportunity and flexibility in your vacation planning than ever before."​
The future's so bright, I gotta wear shades! 

There were representatives stationed throughout the buildings and models, as we toured through the resort.  We didn't ask questions.  We just explored the areas and I took lots of pictures.

It was a great day.  I am extremely excited about this resort.  I liked what I saw last Saturday and look forward to the completion of all the amenities.  

I have reported the day's events and added pictures on my most recent blog posting.

http://www.timesharevacationsblog.com/2015/11/beachwoods-2nd-annual-owners-bbq/


----------



## RLS50

Egret1986 said:


> Basically, it was reiterated what has previously been in print in the newsletter and email communications.
> "The future is bright and holds the promise of enhanced vacation experiences for you all. Remember, nothing has changed with your ownership other than you will have more opportunity and flexibility in your vacation planning than ever before."​
> The future's so bright, I gotta wear shades!
> 
> There were representatives stationed throughout the buildings and models, as we toured through the resort.  We didn't ask questions.  We just explored the areas and I took lots of pictures.
> 
> It was a great day.  I am extremely excited about this resort.  I liked what I saw last Saturday and look forward to the completion of all the amenities.
> 
> I have reported the day's events and added pictures on my most recent blog posting.
> 
> http://www.timesharevacationsblog.com/2015/11/beachwoods-2nd-annual-owners-bbq/


Thanks for keeping us all informed.   Especially appreciate all the pictures you provide.

We enjoy your blog posts.   Hope you find the time to keep them coming!


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

And there we have it. We all knew it was coming. Beachwoods MF are showing in my account on goldkeyowners.com. They were $625ish in 2014, then Gold Key understandably raised them to $710 for 2015. Now they show as $820. Not a happy camper right now. I'd like to see the justification compared to last years numbers.


----------



## Egret1986

*And so it begins.....*



harveyhaddixfan said:


> And there we have it. We all knew it was coming. Beachwoods MF are showing in my account on goldkeyowners.com. They were $625ish in 2014, then Gold Key understandably raised them to $710 for 2015. Now they show as $820. Not a happy camper right now. I'd like to see the justification compared to last years numbers.



Of all the former Gold Key Resorts timeshares, Beachwoods had the biggest jump.  Ocean Beach Club had an $85 increase.

Thanks for the heads-up, Chris.


----------



## RLS50

I am sure everybody expected the jump at Beachwoods.   There was no way it was staying under $800, especially with DRI now involved.

But I am a little surprised at the 10% jump at OCB.   I am a big fan of the Gold Key properties at VB, and had a chance to either stay in or tour them all.   But they certainly aren't the quality of the oceanfront Marriott resorts all along the eastern seaboard.   If they keep bumping up MF's at this kind of annual rate they are going to need to do a lot of work on the properties and addressing all the little details to make the MF's even close to worth it.

JMO.


----------



## Maple_Leaf

*Wow, up 15%*



harveyhaddixfan said:


> And there we have it. We all knew it was coming. Beachwoods MF are showing in my account on goldkeyowners.com. They were $625ish in 2014, then Gold Key understandably raised them to $710 for 2015. Now they show as $820. Not a happy camper right now. I'd like to see the justification compared to last years numbers.



So DRI raised MF 15% at a newly renovated resort.  It looks like owners get to help pay DRI shareholders for some of the cost of buying their own resort.  What a value proposition!


----------



## johnrsrq

Maple_Leaf said:


> So *DRI raised MF 15%* at a newly renovated resort.  It looks like owners get to help pay DRI shareholders for some of the cost of buying their own resort.  What a value proposition!



lol, I think that's next year. At the very least, even to ardent to anti-DRI budgeting department factions, not this year.


----------



## smtundra

Maintenance Fees:

Turtle Cay, 1 bedroom went from $704 to $773.
Beach Quarters 1 bedroom went from $652 to $716.


----------



## Maple_Leaf

smtundra said:


> Maintenance Fees:
> 
> Turtle Cay, 1 bedroom went from $704 to $773.
> Beach Quarters 1 bedroom went from $652 to $716.



It's called "unlocking shareholder value."


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

I'm sure there are added lines in the budget at each resort for the DRI "management" fees.


----------



## Egret1986

*I was surprised at the $85 jump at OBC.*



RLS50 said:


> But I am a little surprised at the 10% jump at OCB.   I am a big fan of the Gold Key properties at VB, and had a chance to either stay in or tour them all.   But they certainly aren't the quality of the oceanfront Marriott resorts all along the eastern seaboard.   If they keep bumping up MF's at this kind of annual rate they are going to need to do a lot of work on the properties and addressing all the little details to make the MF's even close to worth it.  JMO.



I agree.  I love OBC, but the $949 MF for 2016 was unexpected and is entering territory (maintenance fee wise) that is unsettling. DRI didn't waste no time. When MFs get so high that you can't rent your unused weeks to cover the fees, then it will be time to say bye-bye.  

I like the higher-end former-GKR properties, but I've still got Four Sails two doors down.  Basic, but I still love it.  Great staff, well-maintained, awesome location and low MFs!


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

Got the budget in the mail today for Beachwoods. And there it is! An increase of almost $300k for "management fees", $540k for "corporate allocation" & $45k more for "front office". Take out those 3 and the developer subsidy from the revenue and the MF would have actually gone down. Even if you include the $323k for the annual operation of the new water park. 

Not quite sure how a few more things changed as much as they did. Like +$112k on property maintenance, +$134k for utilities, but -$141k on insurance? 

Looks like we'd all be up a creek if we didn't get that "developer subsidy".


----------



## tschwa2

I would like to hear the explanation for this.  Wouldn't it be nice if the owners could kick DRI as the managing entity.  Almost $900,000 in additional fees going toward management type allocations.


----------



## johnrsrq

harveyhaddixfan said:


> View attachment 2360
> 
> Got the budget in the mail today for Beachwoods. And there it is! An increase of almost $300k for "management fees", $540k for "corporate allocation" & $45k more for "front office". Take out those 3 and the developer subsidy from the revenue and the MF would have actually gone down. Even if you include the $323k for the annual operation of the new water park.
> 
> Not quite sure how a few more things changed as much as they did. Like +$112k on property maintenance, +$134k for utilities, but -$141k on insurance?
> 
> Looks like we'd all be up a creek if we didn't get that "developer subsidy".




Actually, I wonder if the management costs are variable with units.


----------



## RLS50

Thanks for those budget details...

*Corporate Allocation: *  The major line item that I don't understand is the "corporate allocation."    I mean, between us we know DRI was going to jack up the fees, especially to help reimburse the wallet for the big buyout of Gold Key.   But how do they explain that rather large line item?   What does it include or cover?    Does anybody know?

*Management Fees: * Not a shocker at all.  See above.   Expected when it was announced DRI was buying out Gold Key. 

*Front Office:*  I don't really have a problem with this one.  The Owner Relations fee disappeared from previous year, so it is almost flat year over year, or a smaller increase.


----------



## Maple_Leaf

*How does Diamond Resorts make money?*



RLS50 said:


> Thanks for those budget details...
> 
> *Corporate Allocation: *  The major line item that I don't understand is the "corporate allocation."    I mean, between us we know DRI was going to jack up the fees, especially to help reimburse the wallet for the big buyout of Gold Key.   But how do they explain that rather large line item?   What does it include or cover?    Does anybody know?
> 
> *Management Fees: * Not a shocker at all.  See above.   Expected when it was announced DRI was buying out Gold Key.



From Diamond's Investor FAQ:



> Annual fees paid by our members cover the operating costs of our managed resorts (*including an allocation of a substantial portion of our overhead related to the provision of our management services*), our management fees and, in the case of THE Club members, dues for membership in THE Club.



It looks like Diamond is allocating owners the indirect cost of corporate overhead in addition to the direct cost of resort management fees.:annoyed:


----------



## nuwermj

From Diamond's 10-K

A substantial portion of the revenue from our hospitality and management services business converts directly to Adjusted EBITDA. [i.e. Earnings Before Interest, Taxes, Depreciation and Amortization]

Substantially all of our management contracts with our managed resorts and the Diamond Collections automatically renew, and under these contracts we receive management fees generally ranging from 10% to 15% of the other costs of operating the applicable resort or Diamond Collection (with a weighted average of 12.9% based upon the total management fee revenue for the year ended December 31, 2014). The covered costs paid by our managed resorts and the Diamond Collections include both the direct resort operating costs and the absorption of a substantial portion of our overhead related to this part of our business. Accordingly, our management fee revenue results in a comparable amount of Adjusted EBITDA. Generally, our revenue from management contracts increases to the extent that (i) operating costs at our managed resorts and the Diamond Collections rise and, consequently, our management fees increase proportionately under our cost-plus management contracts; (ii) we add services under our management contracts or (iii) we acquire or enter into contracts to manage resorts not previously managed by us.

(source: 2014 10-k report, p. 8)


----------



## BobInNH

*Five resorts in the same town?  What was DRI thinking?*

Five resorts in the same town?  What was DRI thinking?  Why do they think DRI members need FIVE options in the same town?  Very strange thinking.


----------



## tschwa2

BobInNH said:


> Five resorts in the same town?  What was DRI thinking?  Why do they think DRI members need FIVE options in the same town?  Very strange thinking.



Between all 5 resorts, it will still be almost impossible to get anything larger than a studio during the summer with points.


----------



## nuwermj

BobInNH said:


> Five resorts in the same town?  What was DRI thinking?  Why do they think DRI members need FIVE options in the same town?  Very strange thinking.




Diamond did not acquire Gold Key for the benefit of The Club's members. Diamond bought (i) management contracts (40% of its net income comes from management contracts) and (ii) a new pool of owners to market Diamond’s points based system. 

See this presentation to investors:
http://phx.corporate-ir.net/Externa...9NTkyOTQwfENoaWxkSUQ9MzAxMjU1fFR5cGU9MQ==&t=1


----------



## pedro47

BobInNH said:


> Five resorts in the same town?  What was DRI thinking?  Why do they think DRI members need FIVE options in the same town?  Very strange thinking.



Marriott's have over five timeshare resorts on Hilton Head Island and in Orlando,Fl. That is not totally foreign.


----------



## BobInNH

pedro47 said:


> Marriott's have over five timeshare resorts on Hilton Head Island and in Orlando,Fl. That is not totally foreign.



Virginia Beach is hardly Hilton Head or Orlando.


----------



## tschwa2

https://www.diamondresorts.com/Virginia-Resorts

Not all the resorts list the capacity on the facts pages but Powhatan in Williamsburg lists 845 units.  Combining the 3 smaller VB resorts (Beach Quarters. Turtle Cay, and Boardwalk) you only have 500 units.


----------



## nuwermj

I found this in a TripAdvisor forum:

487. Re: Diamond Resorts International
Oct 30, 2015, 10:53 PM

I totally agree. We had a time share with Gold Key and they sold out to Diamond in Virginia Beach, as of October 2015. At a meeting the staff recommended we attend, they tried to get my husband and I to join. The presentation lasted 2 hours. It wasn't until the end that the real explanation was given: We HAVE TO BUY 8500 points at $8.20 per point....that adds up to about $69,000.00. Now that's on top of the price we paid for our time share with Gold Key the year before. Now we use Interval World. This works for us. I've never needed to take the time to answer a blog but this is a bit over the top.

http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopi...nternational-Timeshares_Vacation_Rentals.html


----------



## Michael1991

RLS50 said:


> Thanks for those budget details...
> 
> *Corporate Allocation: *  The major line item that I don't understand is the "corporate allocation."    I mean, between us we know DRI was going to jack up the fees, especially to help reimburse the wallet for the big buyout of Gold Key.   But how do they explain that rather large line item?   What does it include or cover?    Does anybody know?
> 
> *Management Fees: * Not a shocker at all.  See above.   Expected when it was announced DRI was buying out Gold Key.




I was looking at a trascript of CEO David Palmer's conference call with investors for Q4 2014 and found this: 

"Going forward, our G&A [General and Administrative] structure will be simple and clear and the main tenants of our management agreements to the HOAs will not change. We will continue to recover a significant portion of our corporate overhead from the HOAs for the services provided to them, while also earning a management fee on the allocations."


----------



## Maple_Leaf

Michael1991 said:


> We will continue to recover a significant portion of our corporate overhead from the HOAs for the services provided to them, while also earning a management fee on the allocations."



It's good work if you can get it.


----------



## pedro47

nuwermj said:


> I found this in a TripAdvisor forum:
> 
> 487. Re: Diamond Resorts International
> Oct 30, 2015, 10:53 PM
> 
> I totally agree. We had a time share with Gold Key and they sold out to Diamond in Virginia Beach, as of October 2015. At a meeting the staff recommended we attend, they tried to get my husband and I to join. The presentation lasted 2 hours. It wasn't until the end that the real explanation was given: We HAVE TO BUY 8500 points at $8.20 per point....that adds up to about $69,000.00. Now that's on top of the price we paid for our time share with Gold Key the year before. Now we use Interval World. This works for us. I've never needed to take the time to answer a blog but this is a bit over the top.
> 
> http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopi...nternational-Timeshares_Vacation_Rentals.html



$69,000 for 8500 points. Wow!


----------



## Egret1986

*Before I saw your post, that's what went through my brain.*



Maple_Leaf said:


> It's good work if you can get it.



Diamond bought out my group of timeshare resorts recently.  I didn't buy into the Diamond machine.  

I guess it doesn't make much difference how I got here.....just that I'm a part of it now.

Agreed.  "It's good work if you can get it."  They seem to have it sown up.


----------



## Seaport104

pedro47 said:


> $69,000 for 8500 points. Wow!



Why would anyone do this when you can pick up Diamond points for free or nearly free on resale? Just to have your Gold Key week be eligible for Diamond points??


----------



## RuralEngineer

*Collection*

Has anyone mentioned which collection they will be put in?  if U.S. collection then that makes it lot more valuable for resale points.


----------



## pedro47

RuralEngineer said:


> Has anyone mentioned which collection they will be put in?  if U.S. collection then that makes it lot more valuable for resale points.



This is in the U.S. Collection.


----------



## johnrsrq

RuralEngineer said:


> Has anyone *mentioned *which collection they will be put in?  if *U.S. collection* then that makes it lot more valuable for resale points.



This has not been mentioned. Recently, only a couple of locations , Naples (small) and Indiana (sports or something), have been mentioned as part of the US collection. I would think they manage this inventory separately but I would be delighted if they added it. Here's to hope!


----------



## RLS50

Michael1991 said:


> I was looking at a trascript of CEO David Palmer's conference call with investors for Q4 2014 and found this:
> 
> "Going forward, our G&A [General and Administrative] structure will be simple and clear and the main tenants of our management agreements to the HOAs will not change. We will continue to recover a significant portion of our corporate overhead from the HOAs for the services provided to them, while also earning a management fee on the allocations."


Thanks for sharing that additional info.

Not trying to be negative, but this additional fee, on top of increased management fees, seems like just a way for Diamond to generate profits for shareholders at the expense of the actual owners.

This is one example of why I wasn't crazy about the sale of Gold Key to Diamond.  It wasn't just the idea that fees were going to increase.  Increased fees with incredible service and top quality properties can be tenable, to a point.

The issue for me was that when you are owned by a private company, they pretty much answer to owners first, second, and third.   So their self vested interest is primarily in keeping happy owners.   When you are owned by a corporation, they are now trying to serve 2 masters...shareholders and owners.   And when the agendas of shareholders come into conflict with the agenda of owners, almost always shareholders are going to get preference over owners. 

The only company in the industry that I have seen that seems to have come close to managing this delicate balancing act between shareholders and owners the best is Marriott.   And even in the Marriott system, some owners there seem to be feeling like they are getting squeezed a little too much in recent years.

I don't presume to speak for all existing Gold Key owners, but getting hit with 10% to 15% increases across the board in MF's, for properties that weren't in distress and well managed already, it hasn't been the most encouraging start or introduction to Diamond.

Anyway, it will be interesting to see how this plays out.


----------



## Michael1991

Seaport104 said:


> Why would anyone do this when you can pick up Diamond points for free or nearly free on resale? Just to have your Gold Key week be eligible for Diamond points??



As much as I dislike DRI sales I'm having a hard time making sense of the report from the Tripadvisor forum. 

At the DRI sales meeting I have attended, they started at ridiculous prices, like $8.20 per point, but when I said no, the price fell. Current owners are reporting prices this past summer in the neighborhood of $3.00 per point.

I have also seen reports from Monarch Grand owners who report that Diamond is offering full Club membership for $12,000 - $20,000. These prices were offers made this year.

Also, Diamond's CEO told investors during the Q4 earnings call that their average transaction is $22,000 and that adding Gold Key sales will lower that average a bit. 

So ... how to make sense of $69,000 with no reduction when the customer says no. 

One possibility is that DRI sales is expecting to see this Gold Key owner again at another meeting. Owners from previous acquisitions report multiple attempts by DRI to convert them. The Gold Key owner will then have had time to consider this price and the lies about the benefits that will be lost if an "upgrade" is not made. Marketing text books often teach about the use of reference point or focal point prices, which are prices that nobody pays but makes the lower price look like a good deal. Perhaps something like this is DRI's plan. 

Is there any other ways to make sense of this ridiculous $69,000 offer?


----------



## Michael1991

RLS50 said:


> I don't presume to speak for all existing Gold Key owners, but getting hit with 10% to 15% increases across the board in MF's, for properties that weren't in distress and well managed already, it hasn't been the most encouraging start or introduction to Diamond.



And the only way Diamond can maintain these mark-ups is with their monopoly control of the management contracts and the high cost to owners of switching service providers. If Diamond had to compete with other management companies and if owners could exit the Diamond system and join another system at a much lower cost, then these mark-ups could not be sustained.


----------



## friedshrimp

Michael1991 said:


> As much as I dislike DRI sales I'm having a hard time making sense of the report from the Tripadvisor forum.
> 
> At the DRI sales meeting I have attended, they started at ridiculous prices, like $8.20 per point, but when I said no, the price fell. Current owners are reporting prices this past summer in the neighborhood of $3.00 per point.
> 
> I have also seen reports from Monarch Grand owners who report that Diamond is offering full Club membership for $12,000 - $20,000. These prices were offers made this year.
> 
> Also, Diamond's CEO told investors during the Q4 earnings call that their average transaction is $22,000 and that adding Gold Key sales will lower that average a bit.
> 
> So ... how to make sense of $69,000 with no reduction when the customer says no.
> 
> One possibility is that DRI sales is expecting to see this Gold Key owner again at another meeting. Owners from previous acquisitions report multiple attempts by DRI to convert them. The Gold Key owner will then have had time to consider this price and the lies about the benefits that will be lost if an "upgrade" is not made. Marketing text books often teach about the use of reference point or focal point prices, which are prices that nobody pays but makes the lower price look like a good deal. Perhaps something like this is DRI's plan.
> 
> Is there any other ways to make sense of this ridiculous $69,000 offer?



This summer at the Cancun in Vegas i picked up 10,000 points for $2.25 a point.


----------



## winger

Delete me please


----------



## jfbookers

*old info*

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Just returned from an abbreviated Diamond presentation. My wife wouldn't go and I didn't ask for the $100.00 VISA card so the sales person knew I wasn't a buyer but she tried anyway.
Not a hostile presentation but here is what I was told.
I am staying at the Beach Club recently obtained from Gold Key in Virginia Beach so the sales lady may have an excuse for not knowing everything about Diamond.
1. Diamond owns 330 resorts worldwide and there is no exchange fee when trading within their resorts.
2 Diamond was recently loaned about 450 million dollars from some impressive lending institutions to buy additional resorts worldwide.
3 Diamond is a company that "Likes to say yes" repeated about 10 times.
4. Diamond prides itself on excellent customer service.
5. No matter where you want to go or how you want to get there Diamond responds positively 92% of the time within 48 hours.
6. You can use your points on just about anything and Diamond can save you a great deal on air, car, lodging ect.
7. Diamond recently went public and the shareholders are demanding the amount charged for points be raised.(currently $8.20 per point) So buy now before the price skyrockets.
8. Saleslady originally thought the minimum buy in was 5,000 points which worked out to $41,500.00 but when she came back with the paperwork the minimum buy in was 8,500 points or $69,700.00 
I didn't stay around to see if they would come off of that figure. The saleslady did attempt to show me my timeshare habit would cost more over the next ten years. I think I will pass.


----------



## dwojo

Diamond Resorts customer service is pretty good but has gone downhill since they went public and Mr. Palmer took over. When Mr Cloobeck was in charge everyone seemed to try harder. Unless you own quite a lot of points there is difficulty getting into many of the resorts in the system at a time you can travel if you have children.


----------



## Maple_Leaf

jfbookers said:


> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Just returned from an abbreviated Diamond presentation. My wife wouldn't go and I didn't ask for the $100.00 VISA card so the sales person knew I wasn't a buyer but she tried anyway.
> Not a hostile presentation but here is what I was told.
> I am staying at the Beach Club recently obtained from Gold Key in Virginia Beach so the sales lady may have an excuse for not knowing everything about Diamond.
> 1. Diamond owns 330 resorts worldwide and there is no exchange fee when trading within their resorts.
> 2 Diamond was recently loaned about 450 million dollars from some impressive lending institutions to buy additional resorts worldwide.
> 3 Diamond is a company that "Likes to say yes" repeated about 10 times.
> 4. Diamond prides itself on excellent customer service.
> 5. No matter where you want to go or how you want to get there Diamond responds positively 92% of the time within 48 hours.
> 6. You can use your points on just about anything and Diamond can save you a great deal on air, car, lodging ect.
> 7. Diamond recently went public and the shareholders are demanding the amount charged for points be raised.(currently $8.20 per point) So buy now before the price skyrockets.



As Charlie Chan said in _Charlie Chan in London_, "Front seldom tell truth. To know occupants of house, always look in back yard."


----------



## nuwermj

Thanks for posting this summary, jfbookers.



jfbookers said:


> 1. Diamond owns 330 resorts worldwide and there is no exchange fee when trading within their resorts.



Diamond does not own any resorts. It has contracts to manage 99 locations and it has other kinds of contractual relations with the other 231 locations, which permit (limited) access to its members. The 330 resorts number is sales hype that typically leads one to believe all members have good access to all 330 locations, which is not true. 



jfbookers said:


> 2 Diamond was recently loaned about 450 million dollars from some impressive lending institutions to buy additional resorts worldwide.



This is not what CEO David Palmer is telling his share holders. The Gold Key purchase and the Club Intrawest are being paid out annual cash flow. DRII's free cash is about $355 million; Gold Key cost $167.5 million and CI will cost $85 million. For comparison, Marriott's cash flow is $200 million and Vistana/Starwood is $116 million. 



jfbookers said:


> 3 Diamond is a company that "Likes to say yes" repeated about 10 times.



Hyperbole 

Also, it seems from Diamond's investor presentations that they are moving away from "The Meaning of Yes" to "Vacations for Life"



jfbookers said:


> 4. Diamond prides itself on excellent customer service.



I don't have complaints with their customer service, although I don't use it very much.  



jfbookers said:


> 5. No matter where you want to go or how you want to get there Diamond responds positively 92% of the time within 48 hours.



I don't think I know what this means.



jfbookers said:


> 6. You can use your points on just about anything and Diamond can save you a great deal on air, car, lodging ect.



This benefit is disputed by many. Personally I've never found prices for cars or flights that are better than those found elsewhere on the internet. Moreover the points-to-dollars exchange is from 7 to 10 cents a point, while the points cost 16 to 24 cents each in MF. 



jfbookers said:


> 7. Diamond recently went public and the shareholders are demanding the amount charged for points be raised.(currently $8.20 per point) So buy now before the price skyrockets.



I've been reading transcripts of Diamonds quarterly reports to investors. There is not a word about price per point. The investors are far more concerned about the number of tours (or presentations), the cost per tour, the average transaction price, and the conversion rate (transactions per tour). Palmer explains the increase in the transaction price by selling more points per transaction, not increasing the price per point.



jfbookers said:


> 8. Saleslady originally thought the minimum buy in was 5,000 points which worked out to $41,500.00 but when she came back with the paperwork the minimum buy in was 8,500 points or $69,700.00



The minimum purchase for a buyer off the street is 2,500 points, or so I've been told at my sales meetings.


----------



## friedshrimp

nuwermj said:


> Diamond does not own any resorts. It has contracts to manage 99 locations and it has other kinds of contractual relations with the other 231 locations, which permit (limited) access to its members. The 330 resorts number is sales hype that typically leads one to believe all members have good access to all 330 locations, which is not true.



While most of this is true, Diamond actually does own the Polo Towers in Las Vegas as that resort was built by Stephen Cloobeck.




nuwermj said:


> I don't have complaints with their customer service, although I don't use it very much.



I have found DRI's customer service to be very good.





nuwermj said:


> I don't think I know what this means.



Me either. 





nuwermj said:


> This benefit is disputed by many. Personally I've never found prices for cars or flights that are better than those found elsewhere on the internet. Moreover the points-to-dollars exchange is from 7 to 10 cents a point, while the points cost 16 to 24 cents each in MF.



There are a couple of programs where using your points can be to your advantage. the 30/30 Cruises and Hotels programs give you 30 cents per point value (available to Gold and Platinum members).





nuwermj said:


> I've been reading transcripts of Diamonds quarterly reports to investors. There is not a word about price per point. The investors are far more concerned about the number of tours (or presentations), the cost per tour, the average transaction price, and the conversion rate (transactions per tour). Palmer explains the increase in the transaction price by selling more points per transaction, not increasing the price per point.



Price per point is increased quarterly.





nuwermj said:


> The minimum purchase for a buyer off the street is 2,500 points, or so I've been told at my sales meetings.



My understanding is that currently it is now 8500 point buy in. Over the summer it was 7500 points.

FYI - According to my contact, DRI members can start booking the GK resorts starting 01 Jan 2016. Only 12 days to go.


----------



## pedro47

price per point is increase qtrly.

What is the new price per point for the 4th qtr of 2015?


----------



## DanZale2000

friedshrimp said:


> ..., Diamond actually does own the Polo Towers in Las Vegas as that resort was built by Stephen Cloobeck.




Yes, Cloobeck and Diamond are Polo Towers' developer, but it's still a timeshare resort. Most of the Villas are deeded to individuals; the US Collection own more than 6,300 weeks in the Suites; Hawaii collection also owns weeks. 

Diamond's annual report states: "Other than unsold intervals which we maintain in inventory, various common areas and amenities at certain resorts and a small number of units in European resorts, we do not hold any legal title to the resort properties in our resort network."


----------



## friedshrimp

pedro47 said:


> price per point is increase qtrly.
> 
> What is the new price per point for the 4th qtr of 2015?



I'm not sure. The last presentation I went to over the summer it was $8.11 and I believe someone posted it was $8.20 for the fall so I would assume somewhere around $8.30 but that is just a guess.

I'm going today to have a looksee at the new resorts in VB so I can pick one for a short trip for my daughter in March. I'll see if I can find out what the current price is while I'm there.


----------



## friedshrimp

DanZale2000 said:


> Yes, Cloobeck and Diamond are Polo Towers' developer, but it's still a timeshare resort. Most of the Villas are deeded to individuals; the US Collection own more than 6,300 weeks in the Suites; Hawaii collection also owns weeks.
> 
> Diamond's annual report states: "Other than unsold intervals which we maintain in inventory, various common areas and amenities at certain resorts and a small number of units in European resorts, we do not hold any legal title to the resort properties in our resort network."



Seems as though we are trying to define the word "own". IMO, Diamond "owns" the Polo Towers while timeshare owners "own" unit weeks(s) in the Polo Towers. That's how I see it.


----------



## Michael1991

friedshrimp said:


> Seems as though we are trying to define the word "own". IMO, Diamond "owns" the Polo Towers while timeshare owners "own" unit weeks(s) in the Polo Towers. That's how I see it.



If, by this definition, Diamond owns the Polo Towers, why is it they don't own Historic Powhatan or Grand Beach or Kaanapali Beach Club or Lake Tahoe Vacation?


----------



## pedro47

Michael1991 said:


> If, by this definition, Diamond owns the Polo Towers, why is it they don't own Historic Powhatan or Grand Beach or Kaanapali Beach Club or Lake Tahoe Vacation?



I was under the impression that Cloobeck only & his investors develop Polo Towers and that Polo Towers was never a part of Sunterra liked Powhatan Plantation, Grand Beach or Kaanapali.

It was Clooebeck that changed the name to Historic Powhatan from Powhatan Plantation when he took over Sunterra.


----------



## Michael1991

pedro47 said:


> I was under the impression that Cloobeck only & his investors develop Polo Towers and that Polo Towers was never a part of Sunterra liked Powhatan Plantation, Grand Beach or Kaanapali.
> 
> It was Clooebeck that changed the name to Historic Powhatan from Powhatan Plantation when he took over Sunterra.




Yes, Cloobeck owned the name "Polo Towers," which is intellectual property. He leased it to Diamond Resorts until the end of 2014, when DRII purchased that intellectual property. 

Does this mean when friedshrimp claims "Diamond actually does own the Polo Towers in Las Vegas" he is referring to the intellectual property, and not any real property? 

What does it matter who the developer is when defining who owns a timeshare resort? Seems to me the HOA would be a better candidate as "owner" of the resorts. But then, the HOA is an association of the deeded owners, so I am still not sure what friedshrimp is talking about.


----------



## friedshrimp

Michael1991 said:


> If, by this definition, Diamond owns the Polo Towers, why is it they don't own Historic Powhatan or Grand Beach or Kaanapali Beach Club or Lake Tahoe Vacation?



In my opinion (and belief), they do. I'm not the one that said they didn't own anything. Again, IMO, every resort that they have 100% control of, they own.


----------



## friedshrimp

pedro47 said:


> I was under the impression that Cloobeck only & his investors develop Polo Towers and that Polo Towers was never a part of Sunterra liked Powhatan Plantation, Grand Beach or Kaanapali.
> 
> It was Clooebeck that changed the name to Historic Powhatan from Powhatan Plantation when he took over Sunterra.



I was an original owner at Powhatan Plantation (the name I still use). The name was changed well after the Diamond takeover of Sunterra and from those I have spoken with at Powhatan Plantation, the name was changed due to pending (or better yet, to ward off pending) legal actions by a customer who tried to claim racism (plantations owning slaves and such). I heard the same story for 4 different workers at Powhatan.


----------



## friedshrimp

Michael1991 said:


> Yes, Cloobeck owned the name "Polo Towers," which is intellectual property. He leased it to Diamond Resorts until the end of 2014, when DRII purchased that intellectual property.
> 
> Does this mean when friedshrimp claims "Diamond actually does own the Polo Towers in Las Vegas" he is referring to the intellectual property, and not any real property?
> 
> What does it matter who the developer is when defining who owns a timeshare resort? Seems to me the HOA would be a better candidate as "owner" of the resorts. But then, the HOA is an association of the deeded owners, so I am still not sure what friedshrimp is talking about.



Your attempt to define the term "owner" is getting to legalistic for me. Simply put, I've never heard of Polo Towers referred to as a "HOA Timeshare" or a "User Owned timeshare" but instead as a "Diamond Timeshare" and that to me defines ownership.


----------



## RuralEngineer

*Platinum offer*

was presented with a decent offer to turn one of my deeded beachwoods resorts week in along with the purchase of additional points.  declined.  i have yet to use points for much beyond timeshare reservations.  i did not want to commit to platinum level maintenance fees.  the former gold key sales team treated me well.

goldkeyowners.com website scheduled to go offline 8 jan.


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

Beachwoods is amazing now! Water park is just a few weeks away from opening.


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

Slide, lazy river, water volleyball, massive hot tub, etc.


----------



## Egret1986

*Thanks, Chris, for the update.*



harveyhaddixfan said:


> View attachment 2415
> 
> Slide, lazy river, water volleyball, massive hot tub, etc.



I appreciate the pictures.


----------



## tschwa2

Just paid my Beachwoods MF's.  I was going to do it earlier but then decided to wait until the migration to the DRI website.  

I was a little confused.  The statement listed a line item for insurance of $23.00 but gave no indication that it was voluntary so I assumed it was a line item for the property insurance.  Also on the budget it lists the total MF's as $820.

On the breakdown on the DiamondResorts page if you click on details it lists:


> 01-Jan-2016	2016	Maintenance Fees		31-Jan-2016	$757.00
> 01-Jan-2016	2016	Real Estate Tax		31-Jan-2016	$17.00
> 01-Jan-2016	2016	Replacement Reserve	31-Jan-2016	$46.00
> 01-Jan-2016	2016	Vacation Guard Travel Insurance 31-Jan-2016	$23.00



So the $23 is Travel Insurance.  No where is it listed as voluntary but I don't see how they could make it mandatory.

I paid $797 and will have to call to verify when I get a chance.
I always click on details because I want to make sure I am not paying ARDA or insurance both of which most management companies who slip it in also note that it is voluntary.

Any one else take a look at the Gold key billing details and not pay the insurance.


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

I saw that on the bill too listed as "insurance" and didn't think twice for the same reasons as you. So I will be asking for a $23 credit.


----------



## pedro47

Is this a bill for all DRI owners ?


----------



## tschwa2

Someone mentioned earlier in the posts, that points or club dues did not include the vacation insurance this year (it did last year).  If you have a deeded weeks ownership, through DRI, I would certainly check to see if they included as part of your dues.


----------



## RuralEngineer

*Point Value Established*

My 1 BR week 20 @ OBC was valued at 6500 pts, and my 2 BR week 23 @ OBC was valued @ 12,000 points.


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

No idea why they haven't made them available. It's not the lack of units under DRI control. The transfer documents for Beachwoods lists close to 1,000 weeks that Gold Key had and transferred to DRI. Problem is, they are mostly off season. There might have been a handful of summer, but that's it.


----------



## pedro47

Have all of the two (2) bedrooms been updated at Beachwoods and what is best two (2) bedroms unit you would recommend?


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

All units are done. The 8/4 is really an AB lockout (2, 1 BR) and I'm not sure what the 6/4 is. I have heard those are upstairs units and the second bedroom is up another flight of stairs with no window.


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

Sorry, it's the 8/8 that are the 2, 1 BR lockouts. I think the 10/8 are lockouts upstairs with the extra bed up another flight. I've got an email out to the resort asking what all the different configurations are.


----------



## pedro47

harveyhaddixfan said:


> Sorry, it's the 8/8 that are the 2, 1 BR lockouts. I think the 10/8 are lockouts upstairs with the extra bed up another flight. I've got an email out to the resort asking what all the different configurations are. View attachment 2441



Thanks for sharing this information.


----------



## dwmantz

*Gold Key Resorts begin to appear in Virginia Searches!!*

FYI

As of today, I'm seeing a little off season availability for the new Gold Key Resorts in DRI.

Can't however find a point chart.  Would appreciate obtaining a copy as soon as anyone finds one.


----------



## RuralEngineer

where do you see the point values?  i see GK in locations but nowhere else.


----------



## DanZale2000

RuralEngineer said:


> where do you see the point values?  i see GK in locations but nowhere else.



The Gold Key resorts were available in the reservation system for about two weeks. Then they were gone. DRI's call center said the resorts became visible due to a glitch in their software. When the glitch was fixed the resorts were gone.


----------



## RuralEngineer

*Dri gk*

they are now showing up in the reservation system although did not see availability.

stephen


----------



## DanZale2000

Ah... But there is availability through Diamond Resorts and Hotels.

https://www.diamondresortsandhotels.com/


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

I'd guess the inventory on that site is a mix of 2 different things: unsold weeks not held by a deeded owner / weeks DRI has sold that are held by the club & possibly units available as part of the in house rental program (I knew they were going to do this, just not sure if they got it going yet).


----------



## pedro47

DanZale2000 said:


> Ah... But there is availability through Diamond Resorts and Hotels.
> 
> https://www.diamondresortsandhotels.com/



You are right on point DanZale2000.


----------



## nuwermj

The Gold Key resorts are now available in the DRI reservation system. I'm a US Collection points member. I looked for 7 nights availability from today to the end of December. All the availability shown to me was then copied to an excel file. Unit type and points for the week are included. This information may or may not be helpful. There is still no point chart, however, so I can't tell which season a week belongs to. If it's not helpful please ignore this. 

The file is here. There is a separate tab for each location:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzHfVJaaWOsmY0ZraXdtdlVBUDQ/


----------



## RuralEngineer

*2016 club select*

DRI will let u deposit your units for 2016.

stephen


----------



## Egret1986

*I'm a Gold Key Owner and my account is not showing the correct seasons*



nuwermj said:


> The Gold Key resorts are now available in the DRI reservation system. I'm a US Collection points member. I looked for 7 nights availability from today to the end of December. All the availability shown to me was then copied to an excel file. Unit type and points for the week are included. This information may or may not be helpful. There is still no point chart, however, so I can't tell which season a week belongs to. If it's not helpful please ignore this.
> 
> The file is here. There is a separate tab for each location:
> https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzHfVJaaWOsmY0ZraXdtdlVBUDQ/



Many of my Summer weeks show the season as blue and not all my weeks are showing in my account.  Someone mentioned to me that they were told by DRI staff that the Gold Key properties' inventory and accounts will be "fixed" by April.


----------



## tschwa2

DRI adds resort fee for RCI exchanges into Beachwoods.

This appears in the RCI confirmation.


> Resort Fees
> Resort amenities fee is $25 U.S. dollars.
> The Fee is 25 dollars (plus any tax) per day.



It did not appear when I first booked in October.

The resort is already not on the beach.  They have made improvements and it will have nice amenities when complete (but it's not complete yet) but from an exchange perspective I can't see this being worth an extra $175 over the exchange fee plus  a unit deposit.

I will be checking in on March 24 and will give an update.


----------



## dsexton

*Prior Gold Key Owner Question - Fixed Week*

I own week 14 and in prior years, this week would automatically appear in II two years ahead.  So for example in about a month I should see my 2018 week 14 in II.  Does anyone know if this process will continue or will DRI force me to pay MF prior to releasing to II ?


----------



## harveyhaddixfan

I just sent an email to the owner services contact at Beachwoods to find out some details about this. I'm an owner and want to know if they will be adding this to owners that exchange back into the resort. 

An extra $175 on top of an $820 MF is outrageous. That puts a week 50% higher than the MF just 2 years ago. And they can't use the excuse that the resort was just remodeled. There was a $1620 special assessment to cover that, with the exception of the money Gold Key put in.


----------



## tschwa2

This is the wording from the DRI factsheet for Beachwoods



> Owner Weeks and Member Points Booking: Photo identification and a form of payment will need to be provided at check-in. Resort fees* will be waived when staying on your owner week or member point reservations.
> A resort fee of $25.00 plus tax per night will be added to the reservation if the owner or member of THE Club® is checking in on a rental reservation.



My impression from that is that any reservation not using your owners week or DRI points will be charged the Resort fee.  I hope this is not the case as I am also an owner here and don't want to pay.  I would love to hear the answer you are given.  

DRI seems like such a money grabbing organization.  They have added estoppel fees, a $250 transfer fee and these resort fees on top of raising the MF -with much of it going toward additional management fees.  The reserves are still ridiculously underfunded.  I know that is the next step but they didn't want to do it on top of the management fees for the first year.  Their priority is making sure they realize a healthy profit, doing a good job actually managing the resorts for owners seems to be a distant second.


----------



## RLS50

tschwa2 said:


> This is the wording from the DRI factsheet for Beachwoods
> 
> 
> 
> My impression from that is that any reservation not using your owners week or DRI points will be charged the Resort fee.  I hope this is not the case as I am also an owner here and don't want to pay.  I would love to hear the answer you are given.
> 
> DRI seems like such a money grabbing organization.  They have added estoppel fees, a $250 transfer fee and these resort fees on top of raising the MF -with much of it going toward additional management fees.  The reserves are still ridiculously underfunded.  I know that is the next step but they didn't want to do it on top of the management fees for the first year.  Their priority is making sure they realize a healthy profit, doing a good job actually managing the resorts for owners seems to be a distant second.


This really captures my same feelings so far.

I hope my initial impressions are wrong.


----------



## Michael1991

tschwa2 said:


> "Owner Weeks and Member Points Booking: Photo identification and a form of payment will need to be provided at check-in. Resort fees* will be waived when staying on your owner week or member point reservations. A resort fee of $25.00 plus tax per night will be added to the reservation if the owner or member of THE Club® is checking in on a rental reservation."
> 
> 
> My impression from that is that any reservation not using your owners week or DRI points will be charged the Resort fee.




Identical wording is used in the fact sheets for Ka'anapali Beach Club and The Point at Poipu. Someone here should be able to say how members are charged when they exchange in via exchange companies.


----------



## geist1223

At DRI Resorts if you are using your Ownership Week in the Resort or your DRI Points there is no daily fees. If you have traded through RCI or II to stay, there is a daily fee because you are not there as a DRI Member.


----------



## T_R_Oglodyte

Michael1991 said:


> Identical wording is used in the fact sheets for Ka'anapali Beach Club and The Point at Poipu. Someone here should be able to say how members are charged when they exchange in via exchange companies.





geist1223 said:


> At DRI Resorts if you are using your Ownership Week in the Resort or your DRI Points there is no daily fees. If you have traded through RCI or II to stay, there is a daily fee because you are not there as a DRI Member.



Speaking from personal experience, exactly as Geist1223 said.  The only way you avoid the fees is to come in as an owner.  Otherwise you clipped for the fees. 

In 2014 I had expiring points that I was able to burn making a reservation at Poipu in 2015.  That reservation overlapped with our normal owner reservation for 2015. We had family members there so we shared two units.  The exchange unit got hit with non-owner fees.  Our owner reservation did not. 

We did request two rooms close together, since we were family, and they accommodated us in rooms two doors apart.  I brought along a spare wireless router, connected it to the broadband in our room, and set up own personal wireless network that covered the two rooms.  That saved paying the internet charge on the exchange room.


----------



## Egret1986

*I checked in on an RCI exchange today that was confirmed last month.*



tschwa2 said:


> DRI adds resort fee for RCI exchanges into Beachwoods.
> 
> This appears in the RCI confirmation.
> 
> 
> It did not appear when I first booked in October.
> 
> The resort is already not on the beach.  They have made improvements and it will have nice amenities when complete (but it's not complete yet) but from an exchange perspective I can't see this being worth an extra $175 over the exchange fee plus  a unit deposit.
> 
> I will be checking in on March 24 and will give an update.



Apparently this took effect March 6, 2016.  If your confirmation is prior, then you will not be charged this fee.  However, this will be a fee for future exchangers, owner or not.  You will not be charged this fee if staying during your week.

Everyone still has to pay for internet service in the units.  The listed "complimentary WIFI" refers to WIFI in the public areas around the Welcome Center Complex.  WIFI costs $16.95/day or $44.95/week.  This has always been the case.


----------



## tschwa2

Thanks.  My confirmation was from October 2015.  I would hope that if one were paying a daily $25 resort fee that it would include internet in the unit.


----------



## Michael1991

Point tables for Gold Key locations are finally in the reservation directory. Here is the link.

pp. 72 & 75-77 

https://cmsprod.diamondresorts.com/sites/default/files/ReservationsDirectory_67.pdf


----------



## tschwa2

Here now.  Enjoying our stay.  I would probably be ok with a $5 or $6 per person a day resort fee for any day you chose to use the amenities.  Something where you check in and get a bracelet for the day.  But at 9-5p with not even the outdoor pool or the big slide open any more would be ridiculous.  

So with the fees, which I did not have to pay because I booked prior to the fee implementation, this will probably be my first and last stay.  It may be an ok value for off season and mid season DRI points owners.  

We had a rainy morning and it was a little humid but the rest of the day has been perfect.


----------



## nuwermj

Michael1991 said:


> Identical wording is used in the fact sheets for Ka'anapali Beach Club and The Point at Poipu. Someone here should be able to say how members are charged when they exchange in via exchange companies.




It looks like Diamond modified the daily resort fees and changed the wording. Here's what the "fact sheet" page has, in part, for each GK location. 

---------------------------
Ocean Beach Club
Hotel Guests and Exchange Reservation: A photo identification, credit card for $100 security deposit and a daily $18.00 plus tax resort fee will be required (cash is not an acceptable form of deposit). Resort Fee includes WiFi, local calls, use of the fitness center and pools, business center, activity center, and complimentary self-parking.

Oceanaire Resort
Hotel Guests and Exchange Reservation: A photo identification, credit card for $100 security deposit and a daily $18.00 plus tax resort fee will be required (cash is not an acceptable form of deposit). Resort Fee includes WiFi, local calls, use of the fitness center and pools, business center, activity center, and complimentary self-parking.

Beach Quarters Resort
Hotel Guests and Exchange Reservation: A photo identification, credit card for $100 security deposit and a daily $10.00 plus tax resort fee will be required (cash is not an acceptable form of deposit). Resort Fee includes WiFi, local calls, fitness center, indoor and outdoor pool, tennis courts, activity center, and business center.

Boardwalk Resort and Villas
Hotel Guests and Exchange Reservation: A photo identification, credit card for $100 security deposit and a daily $7.00 plus tax resort fee will be required (cash is not an acceptable form of deposit). Resort Fee includes WiFi, local calls, and use of the fitness center and pools.

Turtle Cay Resort
Hotel Guests and Exchange Reservation: A photo identification, credit card for $100 security deposit and a daily $5.00 plus tax resort fee will be required (cash is not an acceptable form of deposit). Resort Fee includes WiFi, local calls, and use of the pool.


Beachwoods Resort
Hotel Guests and Exchange Reservation: A photo identification, credit card for $100 security deposit and a daily $25.00 plus tax resort fee will be required (cash is not an acceptable form of deposit). Resort Fee includes Outdoor pool, indoor pool and waterpark, activity center, fitness center, lakeside lodge, paddle boats, fishing, nature trails, beach parking, tennis court, basketball court, bocce ball, playground, croquet, beach volleyball, and picnic areas.

------------------------
Then for each location there is the following.

Owner Weeks and Member Points Booking: Photo identification and a form of payment will need to be provided at check-in. Resort fees* will be waived when staying on your owner week or member point reservations.
A resort fee of $X.xx plus tax per night will be added to the reservation if the owner or member of THE Club® is checking in on a rental reservation.

(where $X.xx is the fee at the respective resort.)


----------



## RLS50

So I thought I would weigh in with something positive (wait for it).

We were big fans of Gold Key and the Gold Key staff.  They were always helpful and friendly.  When we found out DRI was buying Gold Key we were sick.   We didn't know much about DRI except for what we had read and not much of it seemed positive.

The transition from Gold Key to DRI has been very difficult over the past 4+ months.  I have spoken to a number of former Gold Key owners who share those feelings.   The system conversion from Gold Key to DRI was full of glitches that left some Gold Key people with missing weeks and most of the self serve capability and information that Gold Key owners had access to online is now gone and still has not been enabled on the DRI software.

What made this worse was the fact that when you called for help, you would often wait on hold for 30-45 minutes or so just to speak to a person to report the problem.   The former Gold Key owner services team was always helpful, or tried to be, but they no longer had the same system access or ability to fix things and had to forward on requests to groups or departments within DRI.   

What also makes it hard is that while we might have been impacted in relation to trying to use our timeshare weeks, some of the Gold Key people we worked with in the past and were very helpful lost their jobs as Diamond consolidated departments or did away with some groups altogether.   So obviously as bad as the transition felt for us, it was always made worse knowing some good people were losing their jobs, which was far more meaningful in the grand scheme of things than anything we were experiencing.

But recently, I think due to the fact that the Gold Key owner services group has been overwhelmed dealing with issues, our calls for help were sent directly to the DRI customer service reps in Las Vegas.    I have to give them credit where credit is due.  

Seriously, the DRI reps we worked with in Las Vegas were outstanding in the assistance they offered us.   They followed up on every promise they made and were very helpful.  Despite issues that required multiple calls and emails, they stayed on top of the problems and got them resolved.

It was nice to see and deal firsthand with the "friendly" DRI reps you hear about from the DRI owners who claim to be happy with their ownership.   

I hope the last couple of weeks marks a turn in this transition and things start improving and getting better for the legacy Gold Key owners.

FWIW


----------



## rmelo99

We're GoldKey owners at Oceanaire and are just finishing up our week here.

Here are some of what we have experienced as a result of the change.

No room charges from any of the on-site restaurants/bars. Due to the change it is cash or charge only. This is a huge inconvenience, especially poolside where we don't usually bring wallets down with us. Hoping this will be resolved next year, but not happy!

They have removed brooms/vaccums from each unit which were very helpful with cleanup while staying here w/ kids.

No more inventory sheets for all kitchen supplies, this is a positive.

No real support for owners anymore. We went down to the Discovery center and setup an appointment to meet w/ a manager about making changes to our TS. We woke up both our sleeping kids to make the appt only to find out they blew us off and tried to reschedule for another day. Unacceptable!

Tortugas by the pool no longer sells french fries! While this may sound small if you have kids you need to be able to get your FF fix on! They tried to send us to the restaurant at the resort next door.

I'm sure there's more but so far that's what I've got


----------



## RLS50

rmelo99 said:


> We're GoldKey owners at Oceanaire and are just finishing up our week here.
> 
> Here are some of what we have experienced as a result of the change.
> 
> No room charges from any of the on-site restaurants/bars. Due to the change it is cash or charge only. This is a huge inconvenience, especially poolside where we don't usually bring wallets down with us. Hoping this will be resolved next year, but not happy!
> 
> They have removed brooms/vaccums from each unit which were very helpful with cleanup while staying here w/ kids.
> 
> No more inventory sheets for all kitchen supplies, this is a positive.
> 
> No real support for owners anymore. We went down to the Discovery center and setup an appointment to meet w/ a manager about making changes to our TS. We woke up both our sleeping kids to make the appt only to find out they blew us off and tried to reschedule for another day. Unacceptable!
> 
> Tortugas by the pool no longer sells french fries! While this may sound small if you have kids you need to be able to get your FF fix on! They tried to send us to the restaurant at the resort next door.
> 
> I'm sure there's more but so far that's what I've got


Interesting.   Thanks.

Just curious, did they provide any logic / explanation for no more room charges?  That is pretty standard in the hospitality industry and Gold Key merely was providing the same service offered by Hilton, Marriott, Fairfield, Carlson, etc on the VB Boardwalk.   We have stayed at all those places in the past.  Charging stuff to your room and going cashless is even more prevelant today than it was even 10 years ago.   Seems kind of bizarre for Oceanaire to stop offering it no?

Even when it was Gold Key the food at Tortuga's wasn't great.   The food at Lager Heads next door was always way better in our opinion.   We never understood why such a big divergence in the food quality, since Tortuga's has a great lounge area.  One of the best spots on the VB oceanfront.   Always seemed like a missed opportunity.   And I thought that Gold Key also had a financial interest in Lager Heads?   Maybe that didn't transition with the DRI buyout.    

Ironically, it was the kind of finger foods / appetizers that Tortugas was best at.  So I would agree that getting rid of a staple item like French Fries on the menu appears to be another odd decision.

2016 has been rough for former Gold Key owners so far.  I am hoping that DRI really steps up their game going forward, because so far I am not sure there is a single area of ownership that has improved or been made better for former Gold Key owners.   

I would be happy to stand corrected by another owner and to give credit for something that has improved for us, but I am just not seeing it so far.   Oh, and to be clear my last comment has nothing to do with FF.   I am talking about way more serious stuff.


----------



## rmelo99

I think the room charge issue is a product of their delays with transitioning /tying their systems together. They still have Gold Key POS systems and can't reconcile Rooms & Names for current guests. Doesn't make financial sense and my guess is they are losing money until this is corrected.

They actually sent us to Lager heads for Fries, so they may still be tied. I know that PHR kept all of the non-timeshare assets of GoldKey, hotels etc on in VA Beach.

The wifi still sucks BTW, can't blame DRI for this as it has always been this way.


----------



## RLS50

rmelo99 said:


> I think the room charge issue is a product of their delays with transitioning /tying their systems together. They still have Gold Key POS systems and can't reconcile Rooms & Names for current guests. Doesn't make financial sense and my guess is they are losing money until this is corrected.
> 
> They actually sent us to Lager heads for Fries, so they may still be tied. I know that PHR kept all of the non-timeshare assets of GoldKey, hotels etc on in VA Beach.
> 
> The wifi still sucks BTW, can't blame DRI for this as it has always been this way.


Good point.   It would make sense that the current in process migration from the Gold Key systems to the DRI systems would  create issues like you describe.

As far as the WiFi issue, I also agree that blame falls mainly on Gold Key, and DRI just inherited the problem.   I think it was maybe the biggest real blind spot that Gold Key had not to fix WiFi issues at their resorts.   It wasn't just VB, they put tens of Millions into Beachwoods, and it appears they mostly ignored WiFi there too as part of the upgrade.

It really is a head scratcher for me.  Because we have stayed at the Marriott's, Hilton, and even the Country Inn and Suites before in VB and the Wifi in those locations was great.   So it isn't that Gold Key couldn't have great Wifi at their resorts, it is just they refused to address it.

Really odd, because so many travelers (like myself) need Wifi for work (even on vacation) to at least check and respond to emails.   And of course families usually have multiple devices that require stable Wifi in order to use them.

Gold Key seemed to be stuck in some kind of 1990's mindset where having poor Wifi was normal.  Their current Wifi strategy feels like it was at least 10 years behind the curve.  

It would be nice if DRI corrected the Wifi issues at the former Gold Key resorts.


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## T_R_Oglodyte

RLS50 said:


> Good point.   It would make sense that the current in process migration from the Gold Key systems to the DRI systems would  create issues like you describe.
> …



Based on previous history with DRI acquisitions, it will likely take a couple of years before the Gold Key bugs gets worked out in the reservation system.  And IMO that doesn't mean that the IT group is lacking; it more reflects the incredible complexity of the DRI reservation system.

The DRI reservation system is complex because it blends together all of the different types of ownership that exist throughout the network, and what the usage rights are associated with those ownerships.  The system has been largely constructed by acquisitions, and each of those acquisitions has it's own nuances that need to be accommodated - there isn't a single reservation platform.  One system might be all points.  Another might be a blend of fixed and floating.  In some systems some owners have unrestricted reservation rights, while others are limited to only certain units or certain times of the year.  Sometimes owners have negotiated specific usage rights that override standard provisions of the timeshare agreement for a resorts. Some resorts have both deeded weeks and trust-owned weeks.  Some systems allow reservations to be made only on a whole week basis, others allow reservations of a different length, and some have a combination of both.  

Getting all of that built into a single platform is massively complex.  They will get it done correctly in the end, but it will take some time to get there.  

*****

Also, a word to the wise.  If you notice a glitch in the system that works to the benefit of owners, think twice before you post about your discovery.  DRI does monitor these boards, and by posting about it you are alerting them about the situation, and that nice little egg will disappear. That kind of thing has happened before, much to the detriment of owners.

Whereas if you didn't say anything, maybe DRI would never figure it out ......


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## Egret1986

*It always seems so much simpler from the outside looking in.*



T_R_Oglodyte said:


> Based on previous history with DRI acquisitions, it will likely take a couple of years before the Gold Key bugs gets worked out in the reservation system.  And IMO that doesn't mean that the IT group is lacking; it more reflects the incredible complexity of the DRI reservation system.
> 
> The DRI reservation system is complex because it blends together all of the different types of ownership that exist throughout the network, and what the usage rights are associated with those ownerships.  The system has been largely constructed by acquisitions, and each of those acquisitions has it's own nuances that need to be accommodated - there isn't a single reservation platform.  One system might be all points.  Another might be a blend of fixed and floating.  In some systems some owners have unrestricted reservation rights, while others are limited to only certain units or certain times of the year.  Sometimes owners have negotiated specific usage rights that override standard provisions of the timeshare agreement for a resorts. Some resorts have both deeded weeks and trust-owned weeks.  Some systems allow reservations to be made only on a whole week basis, others allow reservations of a different length, and some have a combination of both.
> 
> Getting all of that built into a single platform is massively complex.  They will get it done correctly in the end, but it will take some time to get there.



It has been very frustrating as a Gold Key Resorts owner for many reasons.  My online account, as well as other issues has made the acquisition by DRI seem mostly negative.

The acquisition took place in October and the migration took place mid-January.  Hmmm, a couple of years to work out the bugs. 

Thank you, Steve, for sharing how much truly is involved in combining these very different systems and the complexity of the DRI reservation system.  Fortunately, through the encouragement of another TUG Member, I have made the steps to try to work through my ownership and account issues by telephone and am starting to make some headway.  The representatives through DRI Owner Services have been responsive and helpful now that I have taken a different path.  Today, I worked with a Team Member from the Mid-Atlantic Owner Services Office and got information that I previously was not able to obtain.  She was extremely helpful, personable, and took the time that I needed to get some resolution, understanding and information.


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## T_R_Oglodyte

Egret1986 said:


> The representatives through DRI Owner Services have been responsive and helpful now that I have taken a different path.  Today, I worked with a Team Member from the Mid-Atlantic Owner Services Office and got information that I previously was not able to obtain.  She was extremely helpful, personable, and took the time that I needed to get some resolution, understanding and information.



That tracks my experience as well.  If you can get connected with a senior representative, they can make a lot of things happen.   They have the power to override many of the elements of the system, so once they see the system isn't working as it should they can make it do so.  

They also can create trouble tickets that get a higher level of attention in the IT department. 

For those who might be wondering, the best way to get connected with one of those reps is by posting about problems in the DRI member forums.  If you point out where the system isn't working, with appropriate documentation, it is likely that someone will take on your case directly.


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## RLS50

I have been reading reviews on Trip Advisor, which have generally been not great in recent months relative to Ocean Beach Club, and I noticed that is his responses the GM has mentioned several times that refurbishments are planned soon that he feels confident will address most of the complaints.  

This was news to me because we own weeks at Ocean Beach Club and Oceanaire.   So far we have received no correspondence or communications of any planned upgrades.   And unfortunately, the DRI online system still doesn't have any HOA information accessible for the previous Gold Key properties even after the conversion took place 4 months ago.  So all the HOA updates and information we were able to get from the previous Gold Key online systems is still missing for us.

Did any OBC / Oceanaire owners get information on this in the mail or whatever?   It is possible we were just missed because I know other correspondence that DRI has sent out to owners did not reach everybody and we have only found out after calling and been told that the information should have been mailed to us.

Anybody know anything about planned renovations that are supposedly coming "soon?"


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