# Hyatt Residence Portfolio



## WalnutBaron

I contacted a very helpful, experienced (13 years with HRC) owner services rep today through 1.800.GOHYATT to get as much information as is available on HRP. She emphasized that "this program is brand new but we do have an extensive booklet made available to owner services representatives" to help answer questions.

Here is the lowdown on what I was able to learn:

The HRP includes all HRC resorts *except* Hyatt Mountain Lodge, Hyatt Residences at Beaver Creek, Hyatt Main Street Station, and Hyatt Ka'anapali. (It does include Hyatt Aspen, which is the only Colorado property included in HRP.)
HRP owners can buy points in quantities less than necessary for a 7-day stay.
Reservations windows are similar to HRC, but not identical. (The rep told me I should contact sales for more details and offered to forward me to them, but I wasn't up to dealing with the sales weasels at this point.)
Points stays can be combined with fixed week stays, meaning HRP owners can combine stays with weeks owned in HRC.
"Inventory is limited, but is being expanded weekly to meet demand". (My interpretation of this item is that ILG is having some difficulty convincing HRC owners to convert to points and is therefore populating the HRP trust with weeks purchased by way of Hyatt's ROFR rights. As has been discussed elsewhere, this will be a slow and tedious process for Hyatt.)
"While the program is open and available now, the intent is to sell this program quietly now but to expand to a much more robust program early next year." I asked for clarification on this point, but she was unable to give me more details, as she admitted she was reading from the booklet.


----------



## lizap

What she left out is that HRC owners will be able to convert to PPP permanently or on an annual basis for a fee. Also Puerto Rico is not included in PPP.


----------



## lizap

I strongly believe that when they officially rollout PPP next year, HRC members will have the option to convert to PPP at a very reasonable fee, should they decide to do so (similar to Marriott).  They might even waive this fee for a short period of time if they're desparate to get PPP inventory.  I agree this is going to be a slow and arduous process.  In the meantime, Hyatt salespeople are trying to get current HRC members to convert at a very high cost.  If, in fact, this does transpire, which I think it will (and salespeople are aware of the plan, which many probably are), I have to question the ethics of this. Why not just send an 'official' announcement to current HRC members about what our options will be? There just is no leadership in this...


----------



## Kal

So what they are saying for HRC, the PPP owners have an opportunity to stay at HRC units.  As of now, there is one Carmel, two beach House, three at Pinion, and one at Sunset Harbor. [these are estimates, there could be a few more or less! ]


----------



## Tucsonadventurer

lizap said:


> I strongly believe that when they officially rollout PPP next year, HRC members will have the option to convert to PPP at a very reasonable fee, should they decide to do so (similar to Marriott).  They might even waive this fee for a short period of time if they're desparate to get PPP inventory.  I agree this is going to be a slow and arduous process.  In the meantime, Hyatt salespeople are trying to get current HRC members to convert at a very high cost.  If, in fact, this does transpire, which I think it will (and salespeople are aware of the plan, which many probably are), I have to question the ethics of this. Why not just send an 'official' announcement to current HRC members about what our options will be? There just is no leadership in this...


I was told by sales that as resale owners we did not even have an option of converting to the portfolio program.


----------



## lizap

Tucsonadventurer said:


> I was told by sales that as resale owners we did not even have an option of converting to the portfolio program.




The original plan (it may have changed) was to allow HRC members the option to convert to PPP permanently or to do it on an annual basis for a fee. Naturally salespeople won't tell you this as they are trying to make a huge amt. of $ before we are given our options. Would be very difficult for HPC to have enough inventory without this.  It will be quite similar to what Marriott owners paid to enroll their weeks in the points program.


----------



## bdh

Tucsonadventurer said:


> I was told by sales that as resale owners we did not even have an option of converting to the portfolio program.



Hard to imagine that the sales staff response is correct.  The PPP needs as many HRC owners to buy in/convert as possible, so ILG/HRC wouldn't want to exclude any HRC owner regardless of how they became an owner.


----------



## Cropman

Tucsonadventurer said:


> I was told by sales that as resale owners we did not even have an option of converting to the portfolio program.



I have no doubt that sales told you this and are probably going to tell people they need to 'Hyattize' the week they own to get around this problem.  But, I can't imagine this would even be close to being true. It would take too many potential prime weeks out of play.


----------



## Pathways

Kal said:


> So what they are saying for HRC, the PPP owners have an opportunity to stay at HRC units.  As of now, there is one Carmel, two beach House, three at Pinion, and one at Sunset Harbor. [these are estimates, there could be a few more or less! ]




Someone directly involved in the transaction said a week ago Hyatt took 5 out of 5 in KW by ROFR.  (All three properties involved)


----------



## WalnutBaron

Pathways said:


> Someone directly involved in the transaction said a week ago Hyatt took 5 out of 5 in KW by ROFR.  (All three properties involved)


If that's true, it's not necessarily a bad thing. Resale values are going to go up, especially on fixed weeks during prime season.


----------



## Cropman

Pathways said:


> Someone directly involved in the transaction said a week ago Hyatt took 5 out of 5 in KW by ROFR. (All three properties involved)



Were they all Diamond and Platinum weeks?


----------



## Kal

Pathways said:


> Someone directly involved in the transaction said...


If that "someone" is a sales person, I would consider the source.


----------



## dagger1

We bought the weeks and unit sizes we want at HWOR and HMSS so that everyone in our large family knows exactly when the Hyatt resort family get togethers are, everyone can plan accordingly.  We didn't want "floating" "maybe" weeks with Hyatt, the preplanning gets too difficult with a family as large as ours.  With fixed weeks (most of which are summer for school reasons, one fixed ski week that will require vacation days), this is perfect for us.  We have Wyndham CWA points for our "floating" trips, mainly my wife and I and friends.  We don't need more points, definitely not with Hyatt resorts.


----------



## Pathways

Cropman said:


> Were they all Diamond and Platinum weeks?



One Gold (ok, this was a Fantasy Fest week), two Plat, and two Diamond.

I will sent the complete info to Kal presently.



WalnutBaron said:


> If that's true, it's not necessarily a bad thing. Resale values are going to go up, especially on fixed weeks during prime season.



Resale up is bad if you are buying, good only if you are actively selling.  If this points thing tanks, due do either failure to attract buyers, or through stockholder pressure, then what direction will the prices go?

My concern is there are a lot of original owners in KW who may see the price bump as a great time to exit. How long will it take for Hyatt to get the votes to take direct control of the BOD's?


----------



## Kal

Pathways said:


> ...My concern is there are a lot of original owners in KW who may see the price bump as a great time to exit. How long will it take for Hyatt to get the votes to take direct control of the BOD's?


In a typical BOD, the elected members are owners except for one position that is a developer rep.  The developer BOD position is only present if the developer holds a certain percentage of the units.  Otherwise, there is no developer on the BOD.  An example is Sunset Harbor where the developer BOD member was voted out a number of years ago.  Therefore, Hyatt would have to lobby each BOD member to get votes in their favor.  Hyatt does not take direct control of the BOD, but they spoon feed every bit of information the BOD receives.  The BOD generally accepts anything Hyatt has to say so it's a "closet takeover".


----------



## JustynaC

I'm interested in knowing at what price did Hyatt buy back the Platinum weeks for.


----------



## lizap

JustynaC said:


> I'm interested in knowing at what price did Hyatt buy back the Platinum weeks for.



Going to depend on the resort, but I would not consider buying Hyatt until the PPP particulars are officially announced to existing HRC owners, unless you ONLY plan to use the week you buy.


----------



## JustynaC

Thank you!  I was inquiring about Hyatt Sunset Harbor in Key West in Diamond season.


----------



## Pathways

JustynaC said:


> Thank you!  I was inquiring about Hyatt Sunset Harbor in Key West in Diamond season.


The SH was a 2000 for $8500


----------



## Judymwg

Hi. Currently staying at Coconut Point. Met with sales yesterday.  I really like the program but the price tag is very high. We also own with Marriott so we understand the changes. We plan to hold out for a reasonable offer. In the meantime, here's a pic of the document I received. The columns are as follows: Feature, HRC, HPC​


----------



## lizap

Judymwg said:


> View attachment 4661
> 
> Hi. Currently staying at Coconut Point. Met with sales yesterday.  I really like the program but the price tag is very high. We also own with Marriott so we understand the changes. We plan to hold out for a reasonable offer. In the meantime, here's a pic of the document I received. The columns are as follows: Feature, HRC, HPC​




Promoting HPC in 1st post.  Hmm... how can you like something when the price tag is ridiculously high?? This is a scheme for ILG to make more money. When you have a mature product, such as TSs, you either come up with new products or re-invent old ones.. There is no incentive for someone to purchase this product (as opposed to a deeded week) at current prices.. I feel sorry for those poor souls that get suckered into this..


----------



## Judymwg

Good question. I bought into HRC via Piñon Pointe. The least expensive retail property. I never planned to use my deeded property and the current HRC program has been nothing but a disappointment; particularly all the CUP and LCUP timeline and rules. I most often just use Interval and trade to Marriott resorts. The new program would create the flexibility which I thought I was buying the first time around. I would like to finally be able to use Hyatt resorts but I'm not willing to pay the current ridiculous price tag to do so.


----------



## lizap

Judymwg said:


> Good question. I bought into HRC via Piñon Pointe. The least expensive retail property. I never planned to use my deeded property and the current HRC program has been nothing but a disappointment; particularly all the CUP and LCUP timeline and rules. I most often just use Interval and trade to Marriott resorts. The new program would create the flexibility which I thought I was buying the first time around. I would like to finally be able to use Hyatt resorts but I'm not willing to pay the current ridiculous price tag to do so.




We bought into Hyatt (HRC) several years ago and have been extremely happy with our purchase.  Have traded into other Hyatt resorts as well as used the points in II.  Often refer to our Hyatt purchase as the 'energizer bunny', just keeps going and going. Recouped our initial investment long ago. Did you buy a week worth at least 1880 pts. (gold week)?  If not and you are trying to visit during a peak time, that could account for some of your difficulty in using Hyatt's internal exchange system. A huge difference between Marriott's system and Hyatt's new HPC - Marriott allowed existing owners an opportunity to convert deeded weeks to the points system for a nominal fee.  I heard from a source several months ago that this was Hyatt's plan as well.  However, so far, there as been no announcement to existing owners as to our options.  Without access to our weeks, I have a hard time seeing how they will have enough inventory to make the new HPC successful.. I believe they will eventually do this, but it appears they are going to try to sucker those few poor naive souls into converting for ridiculous amounts of money before they make this offer.


----------



## WalnutBaron

Judymwg said:


> Good question. I bought into HRC via Piñon Pointe. The least expensive retail property. I never planned to use my deeded property and the current HRC program has been nothing but a disappointment; particularly all the CUP and LCUP timeline and rules. I most often just use Interval and trade to Marriott resorts. The new program would create the flexibility which I thought I was buying the first time around. I would like to finally be able to use Hyatt resorts but I'm not willing to pay the current ridiculous price tag to do so.


Every program has its downsides and complexities, but your description of HRC demonstrates an unwillingness to fully dig in and understand what you own. Yes, there are complexities with HRC--but if you're using Hyatt Pinon Pointe as essentially an II trader, then you have a relatively expensive one without seeking the benefits of using your points attendant to your ownership to trade within HRC for Hyatt resorts. Those resorts are pretty much uniformly fantastic, and if you read these boards you will find a high level of satisfaction from current HRC owners. To say that "I'd like to finally be able to use Hyatt resorts" simply shows that you've not studied well how to use what you already have.

HRC--just like Marriott or Vistana or Hilton--does have many rules. I even think that some of these rules are written for the express purpose of making things difficult for owners to get the full benefit of their ownership because those who don't make more $$ for ILG than the owners who squeeze every last dollar of value out of their ownership. You might want to check out the stickies on this forum. I'll bet if you spend 2-3 hours reading the stickies, you'll eventually feel much different about HRC.


----------



## scsu_hockey_fan

The way they differentiate the access to future new properties, 6 months looks like the magic number and makes me think that at the 6 month mark that both inventories will be pooled together and then available for both clubs, HRc and hpc,  new AND old resorts. Just my thought and obervations


Judymwg said:


> View attachment 4661
> 
> Hi. Currently staying at Coconut Point. Met with sales yesterday.  I really like the program but the price tag is very high. We also own with Marriott so we understand the changes. We plan to hold out for a reasonable offer. In the meantime, here's a pic of the document I received. The columns are as follows: Feature, HRC, HPC​


----------



## Judymwg

WalnutBaron said:


> Every program has its downsides and complexities, but your description of HRC demonstrates an unwillingness to fully dig in and understand





Thank you for taking the time to respond. I will take your advice and study the program by reading through the stickies as suggested.  In the meantime, we are still  in Florida. We hope everyone remains safe during the upcoming Hurricane -


----------



## WalnutBaron

Judymwg said:


> Thank you for taking the time to respond. I will take your advice and study the program by reading through the stickies as suggested.  In the meantime, we are still  in Florida. We hope everyone remains safe during the upcoming Hurricane -


Please take care and be careful. Don't hesitate to evacuate early if you're so inclined.


----------



## taffy19

Judymwg said:


> View attachment 4661
> 
> Hi. Currently staying at Coconut Point. Met with sales yesterday.  I really like the program but the price tag is very high. We also own with Marriott so we understand the changes. We plan to hold out for a reasonable offer. In the meantime, here's a pic of the document I received. The columns are as follows: Feature, HRC, HPC​


I have tried to figure out this document and would like to know the explanation of the line that starts with Comingle Points.  What does it mean "After all weeks are active" under HRC?
and
"1st week of January (week 12)" under HPC?

Walnutbaron may be right in post #1 of this thread that ILG has started to sell this new program quietly now but will start selling this program seriously after they have the proper permits for all 50 States or are they waiting for the completion of the Combined Marriott/Starwood Loyalty Program sometime next year?  Listen to the interview here by the Points Guy.

Also interesting to read this link again by the Timeshare Guru.  It is very similar to the trust program that the Marriott has too with the different tiers and beyond.  He explains it well but had some questions still.


----------



## lizap

taffy19 said:


> I have tried to figure out this document and would like to know the explanation of the line that starts with Comingle Points.  What does it mean "After all weeks are active" under HRC?
> and
> "1st week of January (week 12)" under HPC?
> 
> Walnutbaron may be right in post #1 of this thread that ILG has started to sell this new program quietly now but will start selling this program seriously after they have the proper permits for all 50 States or are they waiting for the completion of the Combined Marriott/Starwood Loyalty Program sometime next year?  Listen to the interview here by the Points Guy.
> 
> Also interesting to read this link again by the Timeshare Guru.  It is very similar to the trust program that the Marriott has too with the different tiers and beyond.  He explains it well but had some questions still.




BUT Marriott allowed existing owners to convert for a nominal cost.


----------



## Cropman

lizap said:


> BUT Marriott allowed existing owners to convert for a nominal cost.


That is what is so shocking.  So much money to switch.  I can understand if a person only has 1400 points, there might be some appeal.  Spend $15k and now you can get any time, anywhere will be the pitch. The same $15k gets someone new the same pitch.  Once every three years you can go anywhere at any time you want.  2200 points is all you need!

The problem will be the legacy inventory.  Those Diamond (and platinum, and some gold high demand) week owners won't be giving them up for the price they want.  The only inventory that will be available will be ski lodges in summer and other 1400 point weeks.  I would love for nothing more than for this to be the best it's ever been.  I'm just not sure this being the case at this price point.


----------



## WalnutBaron

Cropman said:


> That is what is so shocking.  So much money to switch. I just don't this being the case at this price point.



That's been the issue ever since details of the HRP began to leak out a few months ago. The conversion cost is just prohibitive--and for what? HRC owners have it pretty good right now, and for a much greater value than HRP offers.


----------



## taffy19

lizap said:


> BUT Marriott allowed existing owners to convert for a nominal cost.


Is this no longer the case?  I hear nothing from this company.

PS.  Does nobody know the answer to my question in post #28?


----------



## Quinte

Makes sense to me....

Anyone know why some resorts are excluded form the points program?

How much are they asking us to pay to convert?



scsu_hockey_fan said:


> The way they differentiate the access to future new properties, 6 months looks like the magic number and makes me think that at the 6 month mark that both inventories will be pooled together and then available for both clubs, HRc and hpc,  new AND old resorts. Just my thought and obervations


----------



## Tucsonadventurer

Quinte said:


> Makes sense to me....
> 
> Anyone know why some resorts are excluded form the points program?
> 
> How much are they asking us to pay to convert?


The Colorado resorts with fractional ownership and Hawaii are excluded because the MFs are too high for the program to absorb. Puerto Rico , not sure the reason for that, probably some legality


----------



## Tucsonadventurer

I received a call from a sales rep from Bonita Springs. The portfolio program is now legal in AZ
so he was able to answer my questions about it. I had called there months ago but they could not talk to me then 
as I reside in AZ. Most of the information has been reported on here but he did confirm that Hawaii would be added as soon as 
they finished whatever  procedure AZ just did to be legal. At that point all Hyatt owned inventory will go into the portfolio program which will
raise the current MFs of the portfolio program. What was new for me was that each year for $133 I could register my 2 legacy weeks into the program and get my points for them
on Jan 1 or before if my status was high enough. Of course to be able to do that I would have to pay close to $ 15,000 to buy 740 portfolio points which is pretty
steep and increase my MFs by $689 per yr. I would still be able to exchange into any resort same way as always ( not just the 9  portfolio resorts) but have priority biding and no
reservation fees. If it didn't cost $15,000 to join I might consider it.
Does anyone know how much of Hawaii is unsold as I hate for all those units to get into the portfolio program and not have them available to legacy owners.
Oh and supposedly there are new resorts being added such as New York, the Bahama's. Orlando and San Francisco. Mostly hotel conversions. Time will tell.
They were willing to take resale units and they would then make them available to use hotel points even though they are resale. Not a huge deal to us but surprising none the less.


----------



## lizap

Tucsonadventurer said:


> I received a call from a sales rep from Bonita Springs. The portfolio program is now legal in AZ
> so he was able to answer my questions about it. I had called there months ago but they could not talk to me then
> as I reside in AZ. Most of the information has been reported on here but he did confirm that Hawaii would be added as soon as
> they finished whatever  procedure AZ just did to be legal. At that point all Hyatt owned inventory will go into the portfolio program which will
> raise the current MFs of the portfolio program. What was new for me was that each year for $133 I could register my 2 legacy weeks into the program and get my points for them
> on Jan 1 or before if my status was high enough. Of course to be able to do that I would have to pay close to $ 15,000 to buy 740 portfolio points which is pretty
> steep and increase my MFs by $689 per yr. I would still be able to exchange into any resort same way as always ( not just the 9  portfolio resorts) but have priority biding and no
> reservation fees. If it didn't cost $15,000 to join I might consider it.
> Does anyone know how much of Hawaii is unsold as I hate for all those units to get into the portfolio program and not have them available to legacy owners.
> Oh and supposedly there are new resorts being added such as New York, the Bahama's. Orlando and San Francisco. Mostly hotel conversions. Time will tell.
> They were willing to take resale units and they would then make them available to use hotel points even though they are resale. Not a huge deal to us but surprising none the less.



Keep in mind that a 'salesperson' called you. Again, until HRC owners receive something official, I would not believe any of this..


----------



## WalnutBaron

lizap said:


> Keep in mind that a 'salesperson' called you. Again, until HRC owners receive something official, I would not believe any of this..


I'm starting to wonder if HRC owners will _*ever*_ receive something official. It makes no sense to me that we haven't yet, since unknowing owners are probably the biggest "prospects" for the sales weasels, but HRP has been the worst-kept secret for nearly a year now--and no official or formal pitch has been made. Maybe the sales strategy is to hit up the owners individually when they vacation at their home resorts during those much-loved and ever-useful *Owners Updates*!


----------



## lizap

WalnutBaron said:


> I'm starting to wonder if HRC owners will _*ever*_ receive something official. It makes no sense to me that we haven't yet, since unknowing owners are probably the biggest "prospects" for the sales weasels, but HRP has been the worst-kept secret for nearly a year now--and no official or formal pitch has been made. Maybe the sales strategy is to hit up the owners individually when they vacation at their home resorts during those much-loved and ever-useful *Owners Updates*!



But they need us to convert to have enough inventory.  I believe they are trying to get as many to convert at 15k before sending out an official announcement to us that we can convert at a figure very similar to what Marriott owners were offered to convert.


----------



## Tucsonadventurer

WalnutBaron said:


> I'm starting to wonder if HRC owners will _*ever*_ receive something official. It makes no sense to me that we haven't yet, since unknowing owners are probably the biggest "prospects" for the sales weasels, but HRP has been the worst-kept secret for nearly a year now--and no official or formal pitch has been made. Maybe the sales strategy is to hit up the owners individually when they vacation at their home resorts during those much-loved and ever-useful *Owners Updates*!


Excellent point Liz and Walnut . When I asked the salesman he claimed all this would be in the contract but that is after the fact. The part of the program that sounds good is that you can book any # of days. His example was
Hawaii . A Sat evening in Maui at a 2 bedroom would be 880 points so if you were in the Portfolio program, you could book 6 days and save 880 points . So if that is in fact true you could reserve 6 nights in a 2 bedroom in Maui for 1320 pts. If the price was less and this was in fact true and verified I would have interest. 
Another point he made which makes me skeptical is his stating that Hyatt and Vistanna would eventually be able to book each other's resorts. I was told by another rep. that this was looked at and discarded due to some legalities. 
The salesman was compelling though and if someone was not on TUG I can see them being influenced. He also said their sales base is current owners. People that rent and come in off the street are not buying.
He went through all the problems with the current system and then showed how their new program counteracted them.


----------



## WalnutBaron

Tucsonadventurer said:


> He also said their sales base is current owners. People that rent and come in off the street are not buying. He went through all the problems with the current system and then showed how their new program counteracted them.


And that is at the very crux of whether HRP will succeed or collapse under its own weight. Are there problems with the HRC system? Yes, but no system is perfect. Among my minor complaints about HRC is the antiquated website, the inability to see availability for a desired internal trade using points by dates (such that, for example, if my original date(s) are not available, I can see nearby dates that are available and reserve those--something easily done in the Hilton system), and the fact that I can only trade internally in increments of 2,3,4, or 7 days at a time.

But, compared to most other systems, the HRC system is pretty fantastic. And the uniform high quality of the product is a huge plus, especially in light of the relatively reasonable maintenance fees.

The price tag Hyatt is asking for HRC owners to convert to HRP is prohibitive. I can, for example, buy another HRC week or two through the resale market--and at lower annual MF's--than the cost of conversion to HRP.

In light of that fact, I would correct one thing Tucson said: The sales base is not "current owners", but current owners who are not aware of the resale market and how much less expensive it would be to acquire additional weeks at resale prices.


----------



## taffy19

Something seems to be in the works so that may be why the long silence?  Read this link and also the one that was posted in the Marriott forum.  Will Marriott pull it off?

We will know soon enough but I am sure that the Hyatt Ka'anapali is going to be part of the new program one way or the other as was posted in post #24.  Marriott owns a lot of hotels and is already converting rooms to 1 or 2 bedroom suites so hotel guests can use them too.

I wonder what it will do to the Legacy week owners who bought here (Maui) before ILG was the new owner?  Some may like it but others do not like us.  We feel defrauded right from the start.


----------



## lizap

Tucsonadventurer said:


> Excellent point Liz and Walnut . When I asked the salesman he claimed all this would be in the contract but that is after the fact. The part of the program that sounds good is that you can book any # of days. His example was
> Hawaii . A Sat evening in Maui at a 2 bedroom would be 880 points so if you were in the Portfolio program, you could book 6 days and save 880 points . So if that is in fact true you could reserve 6 nights in a 2 bedroom in Maui for 1320 pts. If the price was less and this was in fact true and verified I would have interest.
> Another point he made which makes me skeptical is his stating that Hyatt and Vistanna would eventually be able to book each other's resorts. I was told by another rep. that this was looked at and discarded due to some legalities.
> The salesman was compelling though and if someone was not on TUG I can see them being influenced. He also said their sales base is current owners. People that rent and come in off the street are not buying.
> He went through all the problems with the current system and then showed how their new program counteracted them.



The part where he says Hyatt and Vistana will be able to book each other's resorts is very telling.  This tells me this is sales talk; not a snowballs chance of Hyatt owners being able to book Westin mandatory resorts.


----------



## lizap

taffy19 said:


> Something seems to be in the works so that may be why the long silence?  Read this link and also the one that was posted in the Marriott forum.  Will Marriott pull it off?
> 
> We will know soon enough but I am sure that the Hyatt Ka'anapali is going to be part of the new program one way or the other as was posted in post #24.  Marriott owns a lot of hotels and is already converting rooms to 1 or 2 bedroom suites so hotel guests can use them too.
> 
> I wonder what it will do to the Legacy week owners who bought here (Maui) before ILG was the new owner?  Some may like it but others do not like us.  We feel defrauded right from the start.[/QUOTE





taffy19 said:


> Something seems to be in the works so that may be why the long silence?  Read this link and also the one that was posted in the Marriott forum.  Will Marriott pull it off?
> 
> We will know soon enough but I am sure that the Hyatt Ka'anapali is going to be part of the new program one way or the other as was posted in post #24.  Marriott owns a lot of hotels and is already converting rooms to 1 or 2 bedroom suites so hotel guests can use them too.
> 
> I wonder what it will do to the Legacy week owners who bought here (Maui) before ILG was the new owner?  Some may like it but others do not like us.  We feel defrauded right from the start.



I don't think Kaanapali is going to be great selling point if potential buyers know the truth. Kannapali has been extremely difficult for HRC owners to book, even with ongoing requests.  It will be even more difficult for HPC owners to book.


----------



## Cropman

lizap said:


> But they need us to convert to have enough inventory.  I believe they are trying to get as many to convert at 15k before sending out an official announcement to us that we can convert at a figure very similar to what Marriott owners were offered to convert.



Lizap,  I agree they need us to convert to have enough *desirable *inventory.  However, now that they have rolled it out and started selling it at $15k ish, how can they ever sell it to others in 6 months or a year at $2-3k? (Just making up numbers at this point).  There would be a revolt by people that did buy in at $15k.  I don't think even Hyatt could handle that much negativity unless they refunded people, and no way that will happen.  I just think they have put themselves in a corner and the prices will stay there.  I really hope I'm wrong, because I think there are some aspects of the program that would be worthwhile but not at the buy in and higher MFs.


----------



## lizap

Cropman said:


> Lizap,  I agree they need us to convert to have enough *desirable *inventory.  However, now that they have rolled it out and started selling it at $15k ish, how can they ever sell it to others in 6 months or a year at $2-3k? (Just making up numbers at this point).  There would be a revolt by people that did buy in at $15k.  I don't think even Hyatt could handle that much negativity unless they refunded people, and no way that will happen.  I just think they have put themselves in a corner and the prices will stay there.  I really hope I'm wrong, because I think there are some aspects of the program that would be worthwhile but not at the buy in and higher MFs.



If what your saying turns out to be true, the ONLY way they will ever have enough inventory is to add more resorts. Do you think they really care if there is a revolt OR if there isn't enough inventory for HPC owners to reserve at resorts such as HKB??  With that said, I think they, ultimately, will be forced to lower the price to convert, whether that was their original intention or not. They can justify lowering the price by saying they had to do this to insure sufficient inventory.  Complete lack of leadership at ILG.  As an owner, really sorry to see this fiasco..


----------



## Cropman

[QUOTE="lizap, Complete lack of leadership at ILG.  As an owner, really sorry to see this fiasco..[/QUOTE]

Totally agreed.  Would really like to meet and hear the reasoning from the person who decided that keeping owners in the dark and vastly overpricing this program, was the way to go.  Probably was a fan of "new Coke" for those that can remember that fiasco.  If you are not on TUG, or to a lesser degree your resort's FB page, you have no idea what is going on until they surprise you with it at the meeting you NEED to go to, "To hear about all the new wonderful changes to the program!".  I guess I really need to quit worrying about it.  It won't affect me too much.  I bought weeks where I wanted, and when I wanted.  It would be nice if I can trade once in a while to other places in the system.  But, all in all, they can't take away my deeded weeks and I'm good with that.  And to those that buy in to the new program, best of luck to you.  I really do hope it works out great for you.


----------



## Tucsonadventurer

lizap said:


> I don't think Kaanapali is going to be great selling point if potential buyers know the truth. Kannapali has been extremely difficult for HRC owners to book, even with ongoing requests.  It will be even more difficult for HPC owners to book.


Does anyone know how much of Hawaii is still owned by Hyatt? I would hate for that to go into the new program. According to the sales pitch ,prices are going up after Oct 1. I can't believe people are buying in at the current
price. Unlike many people We hardly ever use our home week so if the portfolio program were to take off we would need to change our strategy. We bought at places and weeks we like and there is lots in interval so we would
adapt. We also just purchased Westin Kierland, hoping to get some easier trades into Maui then we could with Hyatt. We love the Hyatt system as it is and even if the new program is successful, it is going to take a few years if not more to get off the ground. I am glad that I heard the pitch on the phone and will not be wasting precious vacation time learning about it at owner updates.


----------



## lizap

Tucsonadventurer said:


> Does anyone know how much of Hawaii is still owned by Hyatt? I would hate for that to go into the new program. According to the sales pitch ,prices are going up after Oct 1. I can't believe people are buying in at the current
> price. Unlike many people We hardly ever use our home week so if the portfolio program were to take off we would need to change our strategy. We bought at places and weeks we like and there is lots in interval so we would
> adapt. We also just purchased Westin Kierland, hoping to get some easier trades into Maui then we could with Hyatt. We love the Hyatt system as it is and even if the new program is successful, it is going to take a few years if not more to get off the ground. I am glad that I heard the pitch on the phone and will not be wasting precious vacation time learning about it at owner updates.



We also own WKV. We have never had any trouble getting Hawaii (both Kauai and Maui) using our SOs (unlike HKB). We also have used our Hyatt for internal trading, but we have gotten some excellent trades via II (Marriotts in FL and Palm Desert). The minute our Hyatt no longer works for us we'll sell it in a heartbeat.  Recouped our initial cost long ago..


----------



## trendywendy

NOOB here - I just purchased the HPP at San Antonio Wild Oaks and wondering if this is a good decision. We can get a refund within 45 days.  I can share details of the pitch and hope you all can let me know what you think!  What is described on this page is mostly correct - http://www.thetimeshareguru.com/hyatt-residence-portfolio-program.html (there's an updated redemption chart in their booklet)

For the portfolio program, you can purchase a set number of points.  Currently, they're $19.75 / point and they said it would go up in October 1 to $24+ / point. Hyatt guarantees a buyback rate of $19.75 if they decide to buyback from you. You can stay at ANY HRC property (not only the ones listed earlier in the thread) using the HRC booking system (grid with points for room sz / time of the year).  You can convert HPP to World of Hyatt points at 1:41 ratio.  You can also book through Interval International (ILG).

We purchased the 1,100 point package, which will buy us ONE OF THE FOLLOWING:
1 week / 2 BR - low season (HPP - San Antonio)
OR
1 week / 2 BR - mid season (ILG exchange)
OR
45,000 World of Hyatt hotel points

As a purchase bonus, we got 100,000 WOH points, 2 ILG bonus weeks and 1 HRC bonus week.

Is this a good deal?  Why or why not?

Thanks!!


----------



## lizap

trendywendy said:


> NOOB here - I just purchased the HPP at San Antonio Wild Oaks and wondering if this is a good decision. We can get a refund within 45 days.  I can share details of the pitch and hope you all can let me know what you think!  What is described on this page is mostly correct - http://www.thetimeshareguru.com/hyatt-residence-portfolio-program.html (there's an updated redemption chart in their booklet)
> 
> For the portfolio program, you can purchase a set number of points.  Currently, they're $19.75 / point and they said it would go up in October 1 to $24+ / point. Hyatt guarantees a buyback rate of $19.75 if they decide to buyback from you. You can stay at ANY HRC property (not only the ones listed earlier in the thread) using the HRC booking system (grid with points for room sz / time of the year).  You can convert HPP to World of Hyatt points at 1:41 ratio.  You can also book through Interval International (ILG).
> 
> We purchased the 1,100 point package, which will buy us ONE OF THE FOLLOWING:
> 1 week / 2 BR - low season (HPP - San Antonio)
> OR
> 1 week / 2 BR - mid season (ILG exchange)
> OR
> 45,000 World of Hyatt hotel points
> 
> As a purchase bonus, we got 100,000 WOH points, 2 ILG bonus weeks and 1 HRC bonus week.
> 
> Is this a good deal?  Why or why not?
> 
> Thanks!!



I would definitely rescind. There's way too much uncertainty as to how much inventory will be available for you to book. I would hold off to see how successful the program is going to be before buying. Many here have serious doubts about its viability. As to price going up, don't believe it. Typical sales technique to get you to buy now.


----------



## Cropman

Agreed with Lizap.  Also you said,


trendywendy said:


> if they decide to buyback from you


 any bets on them buying back the points?  Also, for almost $22,000, I'm betting you can find just about any Diamond, deeded week, you want on the resale market.  The exception being Hawaii.  At this point in time, rescind.


----------



## bdh

At $19.75 per point, the HPP product is a challenge for current HRC owners to justify the buy in to HPP - at $24.00 per point, HRC will never get the current legacy owners to buy in.  And without the legacy owner weeks, the availability of units for the HPP owner to book is drastically reduced as HRC does not have/own enough units to keep new HPP buyers satisfied.


----------



## WalnutBaron

If you're looking for vacations at the San Antonio Wild Oaks property, you can acquire a Diamond week (high season) for around $13-14,000 with annual maintenance fees much lower than what you'll be paying in HRP. Check out www.redweek.com as well as the TUG Marketplace for listings. I agree with what others have advised: rescind while you still can. The HRC system is a much better value.


----------



## Kal

trendywendy said:


> NOOB here - I just purchased the HPP at San Antonio Wild Oaks and wondering if this is a good decision. We can get a refund within 45 days.  I can share details of the pitch and hope you all can let me know what you think!  What is described on this page is mostly correct - http://www.thetimeshareguru.com/hyatt-residence-portfolio-program.html (there's an updated redemption chart in their booklet)
> 
> For the portfolio program, you can purchase a set number of points.  Currently, they're $19.75 / point and they said it would go up in October 1 to $24+ / point. Hyatt guarantees a buyback rate of $19.75 if they decide to buyback from you. You can stay at ANY HRC property (not only the ones listed earlier in the thread) using the HRC booking system (grid with points for room sz / time of the year).  You can convert HPP to World of Hyatt points at 1:41 ratio.  You can also book through Interval International (ILG).
> 
> We purchased the 1,100 point package, which will buy us ONE OF THE FOLLOWING:
> 1 week / 2 BR - low season (HPP - San Antonio)
> OR
> 1 week / 2 BR - mid season (ILG exchange)
> OR
> 45,000 World of Hyatt hotel points
> 
> As a purchase bonus, we got 100,000 WOH points, 2 ILG bonus weeks and 1 HRC bonus week.
> 
> Is this a good deal?  Why or why not?
> 
> Thanks!!


What is your objective in using this system?  Where and when do you want to stay?  Depending on those goals, I seriously doubt you will get the value in return.  If you look at the contract document you signed, it will most likely indicate the only provisions of the program are those in writing.  Anything stated verbally has no basis in fact.  Thus, forget anything the sales huckster stated as it is just a pitch to get you to purchase.


----------



## echino

trendywendy said:


> We can get a refund within 45 days.



That's a lie. You can only rescind within 5-10 days, depending on state, so depending on the date you bought, you may be already stuck. Do it today!



trendywendy said:


> Hyatt guarantees a buyback rate of $19.75 if they decide to buyback from you.



That's another lie.


----------



## Kal

echino said:


> That's a lie. You can only rescind within 5-10 days, depending on state, so depending on the date you bought, you may be already stuck. Do it today!
> 
> 
> 
> That's another lie.


Not necessarily.  The key words are "IF they decide..".  It's not going to happen.  Why would they buy anything back???  They have far more points to sell than there is a market.


----------



## Sapper

I'm curious, if the point program were to fail, would they have to buy the outstanding points back?  If so, they may be setting the price point in advance. If not, are the people who bought points just out of luck (as they don't own deeds or RTU like in the HVC side)?


----------



## trendywendy

Sapper said:


> I'm curious, if the point program were to fail, would they have to buy the outstanding points back?  If so, they may be setting the price point in advance. If not, are the people who bought points just out of luck (as they don't own deeds or RTU like in the HVC side)?



Why do you guys think it'll fail? HVC has been using a point system for over 15 years.  The HPP buyers do have a deed to the property they purchased at.


----------



## trendywendy

Kal said:


> Not necessarily.  The key words are "IF they decide..".  It's not going to happen.  Why would they buy anything back???  They have far more points to sell than there is a market.


You're right I have no idea why and IF they do buybacks.  I figured it's like stocks - if I bought at $19.75 and the value increased to $24+, then the company would make money buying it back from me and reselling at a higher price.  I have NO IDEA if this is actually a practice.  Do you have experience with this?


----------



## lizap

Sapper said:


> I'm curious, if the point program were to fail, would they have to buy the outstanding points back?  If so, they may be setting the price point in advance. If not, are the people who bought points just out of luck (as they don't own deeds or RTU like in the HVC side)?



Depends on what you mean by fail. There's a distinct possibility that those buying points in HPC will have major difficulty booking resorts where and when they want. I consider that a failure..


----------



## lizap

lizap said:


> Depends on what you mean by fail. There's a distinct possibility that those buying points in HPC will have major difficulty booking resorts where and when they want. I consider that a failure..


Does ILG care? Under current leadership, most likely not. I am fairly certain they are aware of the concerns/confusion on this forum and the negative publicity it is bringing. They are choosing to do nothing. That says it ALL..


----------



## trendywendy

Kal said:


> What is your objective in using this system?  Where and when do you want to stay?  Depending on those goals, I seriously doubt you will get the value in return.  If you look at the contract document you signed, it will most likely indicate the only provisions of the program are those in writing.  Anything stated verbally has no basis in fact.  Thus, forget anything the sales huckster stated as it is just a pitch to get you to purchase.


My objective is actually not to "own" a timeshare.  I see the $22K as sitting in a "hyatt bank account" and each year, the maintenance fee = discounted cost of rooms, money i would've spent anyway on hotels.

This assumption only works if I can get rid of it in the future for the price I paid.  From what it sounds like, most people do not believe I can. Is that correct?


----------



## echino

trendywendy said:


> My objective is actually not to "own" a timeshare.  I see the $22K as sitting in a "hyatt bank account" and each year, the maintenance fee = discounted cost of rooms, money i would've spent anyway on hotels.
> 
> This assumption only works if I can get rid of it in the future for the price I paid.  From what it sounds like, most people do not believe I can. Is that correct?



The resale value of your timeshare is close to zero. $22k is spend and you are not getting it back.


----------



## Kal

trendywendy said:


> My objective is actually not to "own" a timeshare.  I see the $22K as sitting in a "hyatt bank account" and each year, the maintenance fee = discounted cost of rooms, money i would've spent anyway on hotels.
> 
> This assumption only works if I can get rid of it in the future for the price I paid.  From what it sounds like, most people do not believe I can. Is that correct?


That $22K is long gone.  First off, Hyatt pays commissions for the sales transaction and profit to Hyatt.  Then, the balance covers the purchase of units to place into the trust.  If units are owned by "Hyatt" i.e. the developer, the developer gets paid for those units as they are placed into the trust.  All you will have is points and Hyatt restricts private resale of those points.

The common theme for timeshare ownership is "pre-paid vacations".  Most owners feel they can get some level of return when they sell the unit.  Thus, every year you probably save vacation costs by staying in a unit that exceeds the quality of a hotel room.  But over time, life styles change and if/when you get to a point where the program doesn't match your travel needs, the maintenance fees are a continuing cost.  In the HRC there is resale value so an owner can END the process.  In the HPP you basically have a hand full of points that you can't sell and the maintenance fees continue AND increase every year.


----------



## trendywendy

echino said:


> That's a lie. You can only rescind within 5-10 days, depending on state, so depending on the date you bought, you may be already stuck. Do it today!
> 
> 
> 
> That's another lie.



THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS WARNING!  We would've read over the paperwork anyway, but we thought we could take our time. Looks like they were totally lying about "45 day - same as cash". The FL contract states a 10 day cancellation period but the TX addendum shortens it to 6 days.  I will do this right away.


----------



## trendywendy

Kal said:


> That $22K is long gone.  First off, Hyatt pays commissions for the sales transaction and profit to Hyatt.  Then, the balance covers the purchase of units to place into the trust.  If units are owned by "Hyatt" i.e. the developer, the developer gets paid for those units as they are placed into the trust.  All you will have is points and Hyatt restricts private resale of those points.
> 
> The common theme for timeshare ownership is "pre-paid vacations".  Most owners feel they can get some level of return when they sell the unit.  Thus, every year you probably save vacation costs by staying in a unit that exceeds the quality of a hotel room.  But over time, life styles change and if/when you get to a point where the program doesn't match your travel needs, the maintenance fees are a continuing cost.  In the HRC there is resale value so an owner can END the process.  In the HPP you basically have a hand full of points that you can't sell and the maintenance fees continue AND increase every year.



Thank you also for your feedback.  We will be cancelling!


----------



## WalnutBaron

Congratulations. You just made a wise decision, saved yourself a ton of dough, and can now relax, read this and other bulletin boards on TUG and get yourself educated, and eventually find just what you're looking for at a fraction of your original purchase price. Feel free to ask your fellow TUGgers anything. It's a great community, and always happy to help.


----------



## NWTRVLRS

Yes, congratulations! We purchased a resale on Hyatt with the iformation we learned on TUGG, and have been very happy!


----------



## WalnutBaron

Trendy, you should also consider ponying up the $15 membership fee for TUG. It will give you full visibility on the site, including Distressed Sightings, for example, which are usually short notice (within 90 days) listings on the exchanges for very nice properties that are trying to fill last minute openings with reserved guests at very reasonable costs or exchanges. You will also have access to the TUG reviews section to get an idea of what experienced timeshare users think of properties you might be considering buying.


----------



## Ty1on

Bullet dodged!


----------



## bdh

Variety of HPP information from a recent owner update/sales presentation.

According to the salesman, Hyatt is going to increase the number of properties as they're adding 5 new resorts - only location that was mentioned was Key West. (Not sure why they would need a fourth property in Key West - unless they haven't obtained enough KW inventory thru ROFR.)   Construction has started at Coconut Plantation and Wild Oak on new buildings - these would obviously be in the HPP program in lieu of the HRC program. Would be interesting to know if they consider those as 2 of the 5 "new resorts".

When asked the specific question on HPP availablity, the salesman would answer "Oh, there's lots of availability" - there was never any specific information as to current availability.  

When asked the specific question regarding the disposition of HRC weeks that roll from HRPP to CUP and if the HPP member would have access to the CUP unit, there was never a definitive answer.  So the obvious inference is that until an HRC member buys into the HPP program and moves their HRC week to the HPP bucket, the HRC week remains in the HRC bucket and the HPP member does not have access to the HRC week.

Started selling points in May at $19.50 per point. A price increase to $19.75 in July and now $20 a point in October.  They anticipate another price increase by the end of the year.

Annual maintenance fee is $0.93 per point.

They have four different tiers of point levels/benefits.  The top tier is Elite at 8000 points and above. The benefit for Elite owners is that they can get on the wait list at 18 months as opposed to 12 months for all other HPP members.

The minimum number of HPP points that can be purchased is 660.  With that purchase, they would allow a person to Hyattize one of their HRC weeks.  Hyattizing a week would allow the person to move their HRC points into the HPP program on January 1 each year.  The moving of HRC points to HPP is an owner's elective each year.

If an HRC owner has multiple weeks, the minimum HPP purchase is $18,000 to Hyattize two HRC weeks. If an HRC owner has more than two weeks, it seemed to be like Monty Hall's Let's Make a Deal as there was not a set price per week after two HRC weeks - however a $30,000 HPP purchase was bantered about to Hyattize all HRC weeks.  

HPP points are good for 4 years. Points can be used for Residence Club (if moved by an HRC owner to the HPP program), Potrfolio Program reservations, Hotel reservations, Cruise reservations and Excursion reservations (jet ski, spa, site seeing, etc).

HPP allows the booking of single night stays - also allows the start of a reservation on any day of the week. They emphasized the fact that a Saturday night stay consumes 40% of a week's total points - so a person can maximize their point usage with six nights days of Sunday through Friday.

Contrary to what had been previously heard regarding the Hyatt Maui vote, the sales staff said the vote was not successful and that for now Maui would not be in the HPP program. Would be good to hear from anyone that has definitive information on that.


ROFR info not from the salesman.

The frequency of Hyatt exercising ROFR on Key West weeks over the past 12 to 18 months has varied. In 2016 they would take the occasional random week - 10 out of 100 presented.  That picked up a little bit in early 2017, however they really kicked it up a notch in May. In the May to August time frame they were taking back over half of what was presented - 30 out of 50.  However in late August the money spigot was turned off and pretty much everything has been getting through now.


----------



## Kal

bdh said:


> ....The frequency of Hyatt exercising ROFR on Key West weeks over the past 12 to 18 months has varied. In 2016 they would take the occasional random week - 10 out of 100 presented.  That picked up a little bit in early 2017, however they really kicked it up a notch in May. In the May to August time frame they were taking back over half of what was presented - 30 out of 50.  However in late August the money spigot was turned off and pretty much everything has been getting through now.


My guess is the lack of success in selling the HPP has directly impacted the cash flow in taking private sales on ROFR.  Don't add more property into a program that is failing.  And that decision was made before the hurricane hit Florida.


----------



## Kal

bdh said:


> ...
> When asked the specific question on HPP availablity, the salesman would answer "Oh, there's lots of availability" - there was never any specific information as to current availability.
> 
> When asked the specific question regarding the disposition of HRC weeks that roll from HRPP to CUP and if the HPP member would have access to the CUP unit, there was never a definitive answer.  So the obvious inference is that until an HRC member buys into the HPP program and moves their HRC week to the HPP bucket, the HRC week remains in the HRC bucket and the HPP member does not have access to the HRC week....


I can't wait to attend a presentation!  What a wonderful time to enjoy the sport of "HPP catch me if you can".


----------



## WalnutBaron

bdh said:


> Started selling points in May at $19.50 per point. A price increase to $19.75 in July and now $20 a point in October.  They anticipate another price increase by the end of the year.
> 
> Annual maintenance fee is $0.93 per point.
> 
> They have four different tiers of point levels/benefits.  The top tier is Elite at 8000 points and above. The benefit for Elite owners is that they can get on the wait list at 18 months as opposed to 12 months for all other HPP members.



Excellent report, bdh. Thank you! 

A couple of comments regarding the buy-in costs:

I suspect that the price increases mentioned were part of a pre-conceived sales plan, meant to give the sales weasels the ability to say, "You've absolutely *got to buy NOW*, because a price increase is coming on (fill in the date). Typically, price increases are made in response to supply and demand, but methinks this is not the case for HPP. Instead, I'm guessing another reason for the shut-off of ROFR is quite the opposite--a sudden oversupply of bought-up inventory coupled with anemic sales. The original sales plan was likely to utilize sales revenue to roll right into additional ROFR purchases. When that didn't happen, the spigot shut off.
Elite level is 8,000 points at $20 per point=$160,000. $160,000. *$160,000???!!!!???  *No wonder this crazy program is not selling. Who was the genius at ILG that dreamed this one up and thought it was a good idea?


----------



## JohnPaul

trendywendy said:


> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS WARNING!  We would've read over the paperwork anyway, but we thought we could take our time. *Looks like they were totally lying about "45 day - same as cash"*. The FL contract states a 10 day cancellation period but the TX addendum shortens it to 6 days.  I will do this right away.




45 days same as cash is totally different from the timeframe for recession.  What it means is that if you come up with other financing/funds within 45 days you will pay the same as if you had that money when you bought.  No interest or prepayment penalties.


----------



## wilma

bdh said:


> Variety of HPP information from a recent owner update/sales presentation.
> 
> According to the salesman, Hyatt is going to increase the number of properties as they're adding 5 new resorts - only location that was mentioned was Key West. (Not sure why they would need a fourth property in Key West - unless they haven't obtained enough KW inventory thru ROFR.)   Construction has started at Coconut Plantation and Wild Oak on new buildings - these would obviously be in the HPP program in lieu of the HRC program. Would be interesting to know if they consider those as 2 of the 5 "new resorts".
> 
> When asked the specific question on HPP availablity, the salesman would answer "Oh, there's lots of availability" - there was never any specific information as to current availability.
> 
> When asked the specific question regarding the disposition of HRC weeks that roll from HRPP to CUP and if the HPP member would have access to the CUP unit, there was never a definitive answer.  So the obvious inference is that until an HRC member buys into the HPP program and moves their HRC week to the HPP bucket, the HRC week remains in the HRC bucket and the HPP member does not have access to the HRC week.
> 
> Started selling points in May at $19.50 per point. A price increase to $19.75 in July and now $20 a point in October.  They anticipate another price increase by the end of the year.
> 
> Annual maintenance fee is $0.93 per point.
> 
> They have four different tiers of point levels/benefits.  The top tier is Elite at 8000 points and above. The benefit for Elite owners is that they can get on the wait list at 18 months as opposed to 12 months for all other HPP members.
> 
> The minimum number of HPP points that can be purchased is 660.  With that purchase, they would allow a person to Hyattize one of their HRC weeks.  Hyattizing a week would allow the person to move their HRC points into the HPP program on January 1 each year.  The moving of HRC points to HPP is an owner's elective each year.
> 
> If an HRC owner has multiple weeks, the minimum HPP purchase is $18,000 to Hyattize two HRC weeks. If an HRC owner has more than two weeks, it seemed to be like Monty Hall's Let's Make a Deal as there was not a set price per week after two HRC weeks - however a $30,000 HPP purchase was bantered about to Hyattize all HRC weeks.
> 
> HPP points are good for 4 years. Points can be used for Residence Club (if moved by an HRC owner to the HPP program), Potrfolio Program reservations, Hotel reservations, Cruise reservations and Excursion reservations (jet ski, spa, site seeing, etc.




Hyatt has been peddling the bs about new un-named resorts since the beginning. Remember New York? One salesman claimed a new residence club in Cancun, i stopped listening to the “new resorts” line.


----------



## heathpack

Wow, spend $13000 to Hyattize my Hyatt High Sierra week?  That would make it a Hyatt Hyatt High Sierra week.  Total joke.  Zero chance I'd give this ridiculous company any money.

I thought we had "inside information" that current owners would have the opportunity to participate in HPP for a minimal fee?

We went to a sales presentation in Carmel last March and were treated pretty disrespectfully by the salesman we met with them.  Really amazed at how low Hyatt seems to have fallen...


----------



## WalnutBaron

heathpack said:


> We went to a sales presentation in Carmel last March and were treated pretty disrespectfully by the salesman we met with them.  Really amazed at how low Hyatt seems to have fallen...



I know you've lost faith in Hyatt from reading some of your other posts. I would simply say that--as Kal has often pointed out--there's a big difference between the lowly, witless, and lying sales weasels and those who otherwise manage the properties and work so hard to make all of us owners and guests comfortable when we visit an HRC property. Hyatt Residence Club has not fallen at all. If anything, I find that the quality of the properties, their maintenance, the hospitality, and the total vacation experience are better than ever. 

As for ILG, that's another story.

My game plan is to simply wait ILG out. The HRP is twisting in the wind, and there are reports that Marriott Vacation Club may be negotiating to buy or merge with ILG. My guess is that--once management realizes this hare-brained idea was a complete fiasco--they will re-focus on building owner loyalty and work to further improve HRC.


----------



## heathpack

WalnutBaron said:


> I know you've lost faith in Hyatt from reading some of your other posts. I would simply say that--as Kal has often pointed out--there's a big difference between the lowly, witless, and lying sales weasels and those who otherwise manage the properties and work so hard to make all of us owners and guests comfortable when we visit an HRC property. Hyatt Residence Club has not fallen at all. If anything, I find that the quality of the properties, their maintenance, the hospitality, and the total vacation experience are better than ever.
> 
> As for ILG, that's another story.
> 
> My game plan is to simply wait ILG out. The HRP is twisting in the wind, and there are reports that Marriott Vacation Club may be negotiating to buy or merge with ILG. My guess is that--once management realizes this hare-brained idea was a complete fiasco--they will re-focus on building owner loyalty and work to further improve HRC.



I think you mistake my position on Hyatt.

I never really had "faith" in them, I just own a timeshare with them and it wasn't the kind of thing that was particularly emotional for me- ie not something that had "faith" eventually betrayed.  I knew buying any TS was a bit of a gamble, that the TS company holds a lot of the cards.  In some ways I've won my gamble with Hyatt, in other ways I haven't.  But overall I'm not dissatisfied with my ownership and in the end, my guess is that I'll have found good value in it when I am done with it.

If you read my posts, Im not critical of the resorts themselves, I find them lovely and they are more my style than anything else I own.  I understand the difference between ILG/the HPP pushers and the resort employees.

When I post in this forum what are IMO realistic assessments of Hyatt ownership, I commonly get told to just sell if I'm dissatisfied.  Which is fine- if people want to post those kind of replies have at it but I'm not seeking advice.  I'm just trying to post about what are my rational observations.  Not to denigrate anyone else's observations that differ from mind.  Personally I think your perspective is great and I love to hear it. I think others' perspectives are great too, love to hear them.  It's just a little amusing to me when other people give me advice as to how to "fix" my perspective on Hyatt.  It doesn't need fixing.  There's good, there's bad.  And if I wanted out, I have a solid grasp as to what would move me to sell and how I'd go about doing that. 

My comment about my presentation and Hyatt sinking low was a comparison of my first contact with Hyatt (Hyatt Vacation Club at the time) ever, which was at Highlands Inn- very classy presentation, around 10 years ago.  They painted a rosy picture and glossed over important details but did not lie.  This year, it was just your typical lying and scare tactics insulting your customer.  I've had similar experiences with Marriott and Starwood (now Vistana).  Disney seems to be the only one who has stayed classy in their presentations but honestly I'm getting that info second hand, no reason to go to a DVC presentation because there's such comprehensive/borderline obsessive info avail on the Internet, I don't need a presentation to learn about any changes to the system.

No need to worry that I'm upset or that I don't understand who's who or that I'm confused about the system or how to get value from it or need help in deciding when to cut my losses.  It's ok (even desirable) IMO to post all kinds of opinions about Hyatts system here, not just the rosy ones.


----------



## Kal

WalnutBaron said:


> I know you've lost faith in Hyatt from reading some of your other posts. I would simply say that--as Kal has often pointed out--there's a big difference between the lowly, witless, and lying sales weasels and those who otherwise manage the properties and work so hard to make all of us owners and guests comfortable when we visit an HRC property. Hyatt Residence Club has not fallen at all. If anything, I find that the quality of the properties, their maintenance, the hospitality, and the total vacation experience are better than ever...
> .


My view of the Hyatt hucksters started about 10-15 years ago.  At that time there were about 5 resorts and the sales office was in Key West on the third floor almost adjacent to Sunset Harbor.  The sales people would come down and sit on the front steps to get some fresh air (HA, they really needed it!).  I would stop and chat with them just to see if I could learn any news and bait them about resale pricing.  Almost every time they would question me to learn about the Hyatt system and often asked how I knew so much about their own business.  Eventually as I walked by they would grab me to learn even more about Hyatt time shares.  It became very clear they only memorized their sales pitch and would makeup anything that came to mind.  So now we see that they have perfected the game of doublespeak, avoid providing real facts and worshiping Monty Hall.


----------



## bdh

Couple of short comments this morning:

1.  I love and thank the developer and the retail buyer - without them, resale purchases and TUG would not be possible.
2.  Spoke with someone that did buy into the HPP as it "works for them".  Did so due to the attraction of points lasting 4 years.  As a side note, since all their previous deeded week purchases were from the developer, a single HPP purchase allows them the ability to move all their HRC points to HPP.  Note: if a person's HRC deeded weeks were purchased resale, Hyatt requires a higher buy in dollar value of HPP to be able to Hyattize resale weeks.

FWIW: the HPP buyer I spoke with does intend to move all their HRC deeded week points to HPP every year.


----------



## lizap

Still think the plan was/is to eventually allow current HRC owners to convert for a nominal fee, similar to what Marriott did. If Marriott ends up buying, the odds of this happening are very good, IMO.  They're going to sell as much as they can at these ridiculously high levels first, though.  Problem is they're not going to have enough HPC inventory for a very long time

QUOTE="heathpack, post: 2067593, member: 31482"]Wow, spend $13000 to Hyattize my Hyatt High Sierra week?  That would make it a Hyatt Hyatt High Sierra week.  Total joke.  Zero chance I'd give this ridiculous company any money.

I thought we had "inside information" that current owners would have the opportunity to participate in HPP for a minimal fee?

We went to a sales presentation in Carmel last March and were treated pretty disrespectfully by the salesman we met with them.  Really amazed at how low Hyatt seems to have fallen...[/QUOTE]


----------



## dagger1

bdh said:


> Couple of short comments this morning:
> 
> 1.  I love and thank the developer and the retail buyer - without them, resale purchases and TUG would not be possible.
> 2.  Spoke with someone that did buy into the HPP as it "works for them".  Did so due to the attraction of points lasting 4 years.  As a side note, since all their previous deeded week purchases were from the developer, a single HPP purchase allows them the ability to move all their HRC points to HPP.  Note: if a person's HRC deeded weeks were purchased resale, Hyatt requires a higher buy in dollar value of HPP to be able to Hyattize resale weeks.
> 
> FWIW: the HPP buyer I spoke with does intend to move all their HRC deeded week points to HPP every year.


Extending usage from 18 months to 48 months is attractive, but not for us.  We bought our fixed weeks/units for one purpose:  to use every year.  This was the attraction for us.  And to pay such a huge fee to enroll weeks....  But it obviously makes sense to some, because they are buying into it...


----------



## WalnutBaron

dagger1 said:


> Extending usage from 18 months to 48 months is attractive, but not for us.  We bought our fixed weeks/units for one purpose:  to use every year.  This was the attraction for us.  And to pay such a huge fee to enroll weeks....  But it obviously makes sense to some, because they are buying into it...


I think you've hit on one of the main weaknesses of the HRP, dagger: unlike some other systems that have obvious "traders" (for example, Sheraton Desert Oasis in the Vistana system), the Hyatt Residence Club just has a family of top-notch resorts that owners typically want to visit or trade internally. They don't think about banking weeks because--even though the system is limited in its number of offerings and locations--those weeks promise a really fantastic vacation in beautiful surroundings at a great resort.

Yes, some are buying into this, but at a fearful price to do so.


----------



## dagger1

WalnutBaron said:


> I think you've hit on one of the main weaknesses of the HRP, dagger: unlike some other systems that have obvious "traders" (for example, Sheraton Desert Oasis in the Vistana system), the Hyatt Residence Club just has a family of top-notch resorts that owners typically want to visit or trade internally. They don't think about banking weeks because--even though the system is limited in its number of offerings and locations--those weeks promise a really fantastic vacation in beautiful surroundings at a great resort.
> 
> Yes, some are buying into this, but at a fearful price to do so.


Exactly.  Perfectly said!


----------



## bdh

lizap said:


> Problem is they're not going to have enough HPC inventory for a very long time



Will be interesting to see how the deposit of all their HRC points to the HPP works out for the recent buyer I spoke with works out.  When they travel, they stay at least 4 weeks and sometimes 6 or 8 weeks at a HRC resort.  Thinking they will have a difficult time getting into HSH for a month via the HPP program.


----------



## Tucsonadventurer

Most of these HPP benefits are a given in other clubs so for us it just made us decide to buy another resale elsewhere.
We do like variety so love to exchange but I'd rather exchange through interval than pay buckets of money for the privilege to do so
within Hyatt.


----------



## lizap

WalnutBaron said:


> I think you've hit on one of the main weaknesses of the HRP, dagger: unlike some other systems that have obvious "traders" (for example, Sheraton Desert Oasis in the Vistana system), the Hyatt Residence Club just has a family of top-notch resorts that owners typically want to visit or trade internally. They don't think about banking weeks because--even though the system is limited in its number of offerings and locations--those weeks promise a really fantastic vacation in beautiful surroundings at a great resort.
> 
> Yes, some are buying into this, but at a fearful price to do so.



We have gotten some excellent trades at Marriotts using our points in II.  To me, Hyatt is the best of several worlds, great resorts, very good internal trading, and an excellent trader in II..


----------



## WalnutBaron

lizap said:


> We have gotten some excellent trades at Marriotts using our points in II.  To me, Hyatt is the best of several worlds, great resorts, very good internal trading, and an excellent trader in II..


I agree. And when you deposit into II through the External Exchange, a Hyatt deposit gets very high credit value. Yet another reason why the sales weasels are having such a hard time making a success out of HPP.


----------



## Tucsonadventurer

wilma said:


> Hyatt has been peddling the bs about new un-named resorts since the beginning. Remember New York? One salesman claimed a new residence club in Cancun, i stopped listening to the “new resorts” line.


New resorts are "supposedly" New York, the Bahama's. Orlando and San Francisco. Mostly hotel conversions. AND of course I'll believe it when I see it. Hyatt
does need to get new resorts. If you look at the inventory, many of the few Hyatt properties there are, have only a few units assigned to Hyatt i.e. Northstar, Siesta Keys and Hyatt Residence Inn. 
That being said, we have in the past been able to get in to all of these, just not easily or often.  It will be interesting to see how this all plays out over time.


----------



## heathpack

Tucsonadventurer said:


> New resorts are "supposedly" New York, the Bahama's. Orlando and San Francisco. Mostly hotel conversions. AND of course I'll believe it when I see it. Hyatt
> does need to get new resorts. If you look at the inventory, many of the few Hyatt properties there are, have only a few units assigned to Hyatt i.e. Northstar, Siesta Keys and Hyatt Residence Inn.
> That being said, we have in the past been able to get in to all of these, just not easily or often.  It will be interesting to see how this all plays out over time.



What do you mean "Hyatt Residence Inn"?


----------



## Tucsonadventurer

heathpack said:


> What do you mean "Hyatt Residence Inn"?


Should read, Residences at Park Hyatt . Sorry to be confusing


----------



## Wild Coyote

My wife and I went to a "Owners Update" at Pinion Pointe this past week.  Actually it was a sales pitch for the HPP program.  We currently have a Platnium week and we were presented with 3 buy in options for the HPP "Executive Level", which is level 2 of the 4 HPP levels.  We could buy 660 points for $13,200, 780 points for $15,600 or 960 points for $19,200. Annual maintenance went up with each point category. Like others have stated we would have the option of transferring all or a portion of our current 2000 Platinum week points into the HPP. 
One of the interesting aspects of the presentation was that we would maintain our deed for but that it would be place in a trust.  Unfortunately, that was briefly mentioned early on in the presentation and we never got back to what that meant exactly.  In thinking about it I would assume that placing your deed in this HPP Trust would place some restrictions on what you are able to do with your week.  Hopefully, someone else may be able to provide some insight into what the ramifications of doing that would be.  

We declined the offer at this time based on cost and unsure that all the benefits would be as flexible as they indicated.


----------



## bdh

Wild Coyote said:


> One of the interesting aspects of the presentation was that we would maintain our deed for but that it would be place in a trust.  Unfortunately, that was briefly mentioned early on in the presentation and we never got back to what that meant exactly.  In thinking about it I would assume that placing your deed in this HPP Trust would place some restrictions on what you are able to do with your week.  Hopefully, someone else may be able to provide some insight into what the ramifications of doing that would be.



This doesn't sound possible - how could the deed be in your name but also in the trust's name?  Either you own the HRC deeded week or you don't. 

I'm thinking what they meant was that you could move HRC deeded week points into the HPP??  (With a buy-in to HPP, you have the elective to move HRC deeded week points to HPP each year.)


----------



## WalnutBaron

Wild Coyote said:


> We declined the offer at this time based on cost and unsure that all the benefits would be as flexible as they indicated.



First, welcome to TUG! I hope you enjoy the community, and we look forward to your input and insights.

Second, turning HPP down was a very wise move. Consider this: you now own a deeded fractional ownership at a beautiful resort that you enjoy. With HPP, you own nothing but a contract that extends your ownership from 18 months to four years--at a frightful buy-in price and at higher maintenance fees. One could argue that if you're buying into HPP in order to extend your reservation window, it might have been better to rent at a Hyatt location than own if 18 months isn't long enough in the first place. 

There's another advantage to owning what you own: the exact fixed unit and fixed week, so you know exactly what you're getting each year. As you know, there are some locations that are much more advantageous at Pinon Pointe than others. With HPP, you could very easily end up in Building 6, with a lovely view of the parking lot. With HRC, you know what you own and where--every year you visit.

I think you did the right thing.


----------



## mwwich

I returned from Windward Point last Sunday and attended a sales presentation for the first time in quite a few years as I had heard of a new offering from Hyatt.  Interesting experience.  Sales guy was nice enough and they did keep it to less than hour.  Sales manager lady (closer) was quite rude and basically said my ownership as I know it is over.  My 2 weeks are resale and I know they hate that and admitted as much to her.....but I questioned why they would roll to something that owners have to re-invest in to keep current privileges? Isn't that bad way to treat loyal customers?  Her answer was I have a smart phone and used to use a flip phone. Times changing and I have to change with them even at additional cost. 

I too was offered to enroll one week if I bought 660 points and both weeks if I bought 990 points.  $20/point and 93 cents/point maintenance fees.  Was told the vast majority of owners were upgrading and inventory will dry up and I will be left to use the weeks I own and wouldn't be able to trade.  I'm also a Marriott owner and remember hearing same from them when they rolled to a points program but my ability to reserve weeks via points seems to work fine.  Also told points would increase in price soon and the window to convert would eventually close to previous weeks owners.

Closer lady argued that I paid $1495 to move in to Marriott points program but I think it was only $495.....hard to remember it's been awhile and too lazy to look it up.  But she really was argumentative and to debate such a useless point to risk ticking me off.  I've worked in sales for 30 years and amazed at the churn/burn tactics vs just explaining the product and let people decide.  Of course if I didn't take it "that day" I wouldn't get this offer again.  Going to Bonita Springs in June with the kids and curious what the pitch will be there....

I will say they had the room full of people on a perfect Wed afternoon....incentives were $100 gift cards and 20-30% off a couple excursions we wanted to do so I felt it was worth the hour.


----------



## lizap

mwwich said:


> I returned from Windward Point last Sunday and attended a sales presentation for the first time in quite a few years as I had heard of a new offering from Hyatt.  Interesting experience.  Sales guy was nice enough and they did keep it to less than hour.  Sales manager lady (closer) was quite rude and basically said my ownership as I know it is over.  My 2 weeks are resale and I know they hate that and admitted as much to her.....but I questioned why they would roll to something that owners have to re-invest in to keep current privileges? Isn't that bad way to treat loyal customers?  Her answer was I have a smart phone and used to use a flip phone. Times changing and I have to change with them even at additional cost.
> 
> I too was offered to enroll one week if I bought 660 points and both weeks if I bought 990 points.  $20/point and 93 cents/point maintenance fees.  Was told the vast majority of owners were upgrading and inventory will dry up and I will be left to use the weeks I own and wouldn't be able to trade.  I'm also a Marriott owner and remember hearing same from them when they rolled to a points program but my ability to reserve weeks via points seems to work fine.  Also told points would increase in price soon and the window to convert would eventually close to previous weeks owners.
> 
> Closer lady argued that I paid $1495 to move in to Marriott points program but I think it was only $495.....hard to remember it's been awhile and too lazy to look it up.  But she really was argumentative and to debate such a useless point to risk ticking me off.  I've worked in sales for 30 years and amazed at the churn/burn tactics vs just explaining the product and let people decide.  Of course if I didn't take it "that day" I wouldn't get this offer again.  Going to Bonita Springs in June with the kids and curious what the pitch will be there....
> 
> I will say they had the room full of people on a perfect Wed afternoon....incentives were $100 gift cards and 20-30% off a couple excursions we wanted to do so I felt it was worth the hour.



Keep in mind current HRC owners have NOT received any type of official notification as to our options regarding HPP.


----------



## WalnutBaron

mwwich said:


> I returned from Windward Point last Sunday and attended a sales presentation for the first time in quite a few years as I had heard of a new offering from Hyatt.  Interesting experience.  Sales guy was nice enough and they did keep it to less than hour.  Sales manager lady (closer) was quite rude and basically said my ownership as I know it is over.  My 2 weeks are resale and I know they hate that and admitted as much to her.....but I questioned why they would roll to something that owners have to re-invest in to keep current privileges? Isn't that bad way to treat loyal customers?  Her answer was I have a smart phone and used to use a flip phone. Times changing and I have to change with them even at additional cost.
> 
> I too was offered to enroll one week if I bought 660 points and both weeks if I bought 990 points.  $20/point and 93 cents/point maintenance fees.  Was told the vast majority of owners were upgrading and inventory will dry up and I will be left to use the weeks I own and wouldn't be able to trade.  I'm also a Marriott owner and remember hearing same from them when they rolled to a points program but my ability to reserve weeks via points seems to work fine.  Also told points would increase in price soon and the window to convert would eventually close to previous weeks owners.
> 
> Closer lady argued that I paid $1495 to move in to Marriott points program but I think it was only $495.....hard to remember it's been awhile and too lazy to look it up.  But she really was argumentative and to debate such a useless point to risk ticking me off.  I've worked in sales for 30 years and amazed at the churn/burn tactics vs just explaining the product and let people decide.  Of course if I didn't take it "that day" I wouldn't get this offer again.  Going to Bonita Springs in June with the kids and curious what the pitch will be there....
> 
> I will say they had the room full of people on a perfect Wed afternoon....incentives were $100 gift cards and 20-30% off a couple excursions we wanted to do so I felt it was worth the hour.


Even though I know this is par for the course for the sales weasels, it still ticks me off for your sake that you had to endure this kind of lousy treatment. Shall we count the number of outright lies the "closer" told you?

Times are changing in regard to HRC. *Verdict: Lie.*  Your ownership is deeded, and even though it may frost ILG and Hyatt management, you'll still be able to enjoy the same ownership rights and privileges you've always had.
The vast majority of owners are upgrading. *Verdict: Lie.* Quite the opposite, I would say, which is reflected in the closer woman's desperate attempts to insult you into changing your mind. Lots has been said in this forum about the terrible value (if you can even call it that) of converting a really nice fixed week ownership into points at a huge conversion fee and higher maintenance fees. Why the heck would anyone do that?
Inventory will dry up. *Verdict: Lie. *The one place this might prove to be true is Hyatt Ka'anapali due to the recent swindled vote by Hyatt and HKB owners to de-link several fixed weeks units into floating weeks (probably for easier sale within HPP). Otherwise, all other properties currently have and will very likely continue to have plenty of trading inventory. The only way this would truly change is if ILG buys up choice units through ROFR or forfeiture. For a few months during the summer, they did seem to be more active in the ROFR market, but that has reported to have subsided--and the speculation is because the HPP program is not generating enough working capital through sales to adequately fund ROFR purchases.
Points will increase in price soon. *Verdict: Probably True.* This is a common sales tactic to force potential marks to part with their $$$ before a price increase goes into effect. Of course, the problem with the strategy is that if sales are underwhelming at the introductory price (and there has already been one price increase), what makes ILG think sales will increase as the already-exorbitant price goes higher??
If you don't take the deal that day, you wouldn't see it again. *Verdict: Lie.* I guarantee you that if you called the lying weasel and told her you've changed your mind and want to purchase, there's no way she would turn down a sale by not giving you the same price.
Thanks for sharing your experience with us, and congratulations for not caving in to the high pressure and misleading sales tactics.


----------



## Kal

So now we have the "official roll-out" of the Portfolio Program.  Rather than a major new program, it's just a "New Reservation Exchange Option".  Owners get a number of new options including staying up to 30 days.  Hyatt would love to hear from you to talk about your travel dreams.

Hmmmm, they forgot to mention the modest fee is as low as $12,000 and higher Maintenance Fees.

Operators are standing by.


----------



## scsu_hockey_fan

Kal said:


> So now we have the "official roll-out" of the Portfolio Program.  Rather than a major new program, it's just a "New Reservation Exchange Option".  Owners get a number of new options including staying up to 30 days.  Hyatt would love to hear from you to talk about your travel dreams.
> 
> Hmmmm, they forgot to mention the modest fee is as low as $12,000 and higher Maintenance Fees.
> 
> Operators are standing by.


I think more details and questions are still unanswered and i guess time will tell? I wonder if the $12,000 allows you access to the Portfolio BEFORE the 6 month mark? I would have to guess the new reservation option which is at/after the 6 month mark would be a smaller fee if not complimentary? I believe this may be just the foundation and everyone (both systems) may have access to the shared properties at the 6 month mark? And when they add new resorts to the Portfolio that is what you might be paying for? As well as access prior to 6 month mark? along with a longer life on your points? Who knows for sure.... time will tell.... I could see some potential legal issues if it didn't go both ways with regards to access to each other's inventories at the 6th month mark.


----------



## Tucsonadventurer

lizap said:


> Keep in mind current HRC owners have NOT received any type of official notification as to our options regarding HPP.


Unless, where you live, has the new program, legally they can't release anything so that may be why there is nothing in writing.At least that is what they told us. We initially bought into Hyatt because we had a great salesman in Sedona who shared how he made use of and stretched his points to trade. We bought resale, but were impressed with him. Lately since the new program has been introduced I have not
had good experiences with owner's updates and plan to avoid Hyatt presentations, unless it is a promotion for a reduced rate stay. We will still check out Marriott and Westin presentations. As far as the residence side of Hyatt we still love it and have nothing but good things to say.


----------



## ivywag

What is the "shared access" that is being mentioned?  I am under the impression that the two systems are totally separate and that the points owners will only have access to any units that have enrolled in points and that HRC owners ONLY would have access to the legacy deeded units available.  Am I correct?


----------



## Kal

My take is "shared access" means HRP members only have access to specific HRC units which are deposited by HRC owners who joined the HRP program.  HRC owners would not have access to HRP units and HRP owners would not have access to the vast majority of HRC legacy units.

Sharing is very limited.


----------



## melroseman

Just sat thru the program in Key West.  Can't imagine buying 660 points at $20.00 each just to have availability of "trust" access in 9 resorts.  The remaining benefits are surely not worth the price and it sounds like Maui will never be in the program based on the maintenance fee disparity.  The promise of a few uncertain future urban locations is not a sufficient incentive to spend over $13,000 to buy in.  As a Hyatt fan I hope they can get some modifications that increase the value....


----------



## WalnutBaron

melroseman said:


> Can't imagine buying 660 points at $20.00 each just to have availability of "trust" access in 9 resorts.  The remaining benefits are surely not worth the price and it sounds like Maui will never be in the program based on the maintenance fee disparity.  The promise of a few uncertain future urban locations is not a sufficient incentive to spend over $13,000 to buy in.


You've captured in three sentences the central reason why HRP is floundering. HRP does offer members a distinct series of benefits: 1) advantageous access to the 9 resorts included in the program, beginning at 6 months out; 2) more flexibility through a points platform to choose among those resorts than the fixed week ownership of HRC. But those benefits are clearly not worth paying $13,000 to access, not to mention the fact that ongoing maintenance fees are much higher than under the HRC program. As has been discussed here, there will be the so-called "lambs" who will buy out of ignorance of what the real market is, but for seasoned timeshare owners and particularly owners of HRC, there's just no chance.


----------



## lizap

WalnutBaron said:


> You've captured in three sentences the central reason why HRP is floundering. HRP does offer members a distinct series of benefits: 1) advantageous access to the 9 resorts included in the program, beginning at 6 months out; 2) more flexibility through a points platform to choose among those resorts than the fixed week ownership of HRC. But those benefits are clearly not worth paying $13,000 to access, not to mention the fact that ongoing maintenance fees are much higher than under the HRC program. As has been discussed here, there will be the so-called "lambs" who will buy out of ignorance of what the real market is, but for seasoned timeshare owners and particularly owners of HRC, there's just no chance.



HPP was ill conceived from the start. Without participation from HRC members, they will have a very difficult time getting the inventory they need. I still predict, when Hyatt figures this out, current HRC members will be given an opportunity to convert permanently or on a yearly basis for a nominal cost. As is, HRC members will most likely never see an impact or if they do, the impact will be minimal, on their internal trading.


----------



## noriega

I just went to an owners presentation at the Hyatt Wild Oak Ranch. The saleman had to nerve to call me dumb twice!?? He bashed the Airbnb the system...can't believe Hyatt has gone to this level. I didn't buy into the upgrade sale. It was 660 for $13k - What a rip off!!!


----------



## Sapper

noriega said:


> I just went to an owners presentation at the Hyatt Wild Oak Ranch. The saleman had to nerve to call me dumb twice!?? He bashed the Airbnb the system...can't believe Hyatt has gone to this level. I didn't buy into the upgrade sale. It was 660 for $13k - What a rip off!!!



Sorry to hear this.  I wonder if the HPP is failing to the point management is pressuring the sales staff to make a sale no matter what.  Then the sales staff are stressed out at the lack of sales because no one is buying the overpriced product and taking it out on the folks who are smart enough to walk away (and buy resale HRC).


----------



## WalnutBaron

noriega said:


> I just went to an owners presentation at the Hyatt Wild Oak Ranch. The saleman had to nerve to call me dumb twice!?? He bashed the Airbnb the system...can't believe Hyatt has gone to this level. I didn't buy into the upgrade sale. It was 660 for $13k - What a rip off!!!


I echo Sapper's sentiments. Very sorry to hear that a sales weasel had the temerity to call you "dumb"--and twice! That's totally uncalled for. And very un-Hyatt like.


----------

