# Worldmark Renters and damage question



## Cathyb (Jan 19, 2009)

I just noticed an ad on TUG for Worldmark San Francisco for rent.  It brought up a question since I am a Worldmark owner.

If a renter does serious damage to the unit during the week, who pays for that damage?  I'm referring to broken lamps, TV or something expensive.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Jan 19, 2009)

Cathyb said:


> I just noticed an ad on TUG for Worldmark San Francisco for rent.  It brought up a question since I am a Worldmark owner.
> 
> If a renter does serious damage to the unit during the week, who pays for that damage?  I'm referring to broken lamps, TV or something expensive.



Turn the situation around.

Let's say that you owned a property that you were renting to someone.  Your renter, in turn, allowed someone stay in the property for awhile, and that person damaged your property but refused to pay.

Whom would you hold responsible for the damages?


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## Cathyb (Jan 19, 2009)

hmmm -- I would say the first one who rented from me -- but is that what Worldmark does????


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## FlyerBobcat (Jan 19, 2009)

Hmmmmm.  I think this is getting more confusing than the original question 

Help me out here....


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Jan 19, 2009)

Cathyb said:


> hmmm -- I would say the first one who rented from me -- but is that what Worldmark does????



Well, what do your WM documents say about who is responsible for damages when a member rents a unit?


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## BocaBum99 (Jan 19, 2009)

WorldMark by Wyndham charges the owner.  They take pictures of the damage, send you a bill in the mail and put a lock on your account until you pay it.


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## slabeaume (Jan 19, 2009)

BocaBum99 said:


> WorldMark by Wyndham charges the owner.  They take pictures of the damage, send you a bill in the mail and put a lock on your account until you pay it.




Yes, they send it to the owner!  I had to pay for a new bedspread and carpet cleaning once when my guest threw up.  Cost me about $350.


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## cotraveller (Jan 19, 2009)

From the WorldMark guidelines. Section D - Using Club Properties.

_3. *Care of Units.* The Owner is responsible for any damage or loss of furnishings that might occur during occupancy by an Owner or an Owner’s Guest._

If you rent out a unit, the person you rent to is your guest.  Per the guidelines, you are responsible for any damage.


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## Bill4728 (Jan 19, 2009)

cotraveller said:


> From the WorldMark guidelines. Section D - Using Club Properties.
> 
> _3. *Care of Units.* The Owner is responsible for any damage or loss of furnishings that might occur during occupancy by an Owner or an Owner’s Guest._
> 
> If you rent out a unit, the person you rent to is your guest.  Per the guidelines, you are responsible for any damage.


While this is true, you as the owner may not be on the hook. When you or a guest check-in, they will give the desk a credit card to cover this kind of damages. The resort will first bill the damages to that card. Therefore your guest will be the first billed. BUT you as the owner who made the reservation will be on the hook.


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## BocaBum99 (Jan 19, 2009)

Bill4728 said:


> While this is true, you as the owner may not be on the hook. When you or a guest check-in, they will give the desk a credit card to cover this kind of damages. The resort will first bill the damages to that card. Therefore your guest will be the first billed. BUT you as the owner who made the reservation will be on the hook.



I don't think this is true for WorldMark.  I think they just go right after the owner and skip trying to charge the credit card.


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## cotraveller (Jan 19, 2009)

Bill4728 said:


> While this is true, you as the owner may not be on the hook. When you or a guest check-in, they will give the desk a credit card to cover this kind of damages. The resort will first bill the damages to that card. Therefore your guest will be the first billed. BUT you as the owner who made the reservation will be on the hook.



I have checked into many WorldMark resorts over the years we have been owners.  They have never asked for a credit card.  Friends have never mentioned having to show one when I booked a unit for them either, although I never asked them about it.


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## slabeaume (Jan 19, 2009)

They sent me pictures and a bill, didn't send my guest anything.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Jan 19, 2009)

BocaBum99 said:


> I don't think this is true for WorldMark.  I think they just go right after the owner and skip trying to charge the credit card.





cotraveller said:


> I have checked into many WorldMark resorts over the years we have been owners.  They have never asked for a credit card.  Friends have never mentioned having to show one when I booked a unit for them either, although I never asked them about it.





slabeaume said:


> They sent me pictures and a bill, didn't send my guest anything.



Makes me wonder if this isn't another way to discourage rental "competition" from WM owners. I bet that if it's inventory rented by Wyndham, they take a credit card from the renter and pursue the renter for damages.


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## melschey (Jan 19, 2009)

Bill4728 said:


> While this is true, you as the owner may not be on the hook. When you or a guest check-in, they will give the desk a credit card to cover this kind of damages. The resort will first bill the damages to that card. Therefore your guest will be the first billed. BUT you as the owner who made the reservation will be on the hook.



I have never had to show a credit card when checking into a WorldMark resort.


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## BocaBum99 (Jan 19, 2009)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> Makes me wonder if this isn't another way to discourage rental "competition" from WM owners. I bet that if it's inventory rented by Wyndham, they take a credit card from the renter and pursue the renter for damages.



I don't think so.  I doubt there was any malicious intent by WorldMark by Wyndham. I just think they don't want to bother with collecting fees from the renters when all they need to do is bill the owner.

If an owner has a security deposit and a rental agreement, they are at least partially protected.

Wyndham, on the other hand, does take a credit cared imprint at check in.  Not sure what they do with damage done to a unit.


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## LLW (Jan 19, 2009)

Few Worldmark owners rent out their reservations, as they have no home resorts, the credits may be rented out as is, reservations may be cancelled from 30 to 2 days before check-in, and WM holds owners responsible for both damage and liability. If a guest falls down when coming down the narrow staircase from the top floor at San Francisco and sues Worldmark, the Worldmark contracts say the owner is responsible. Only mega renters have the economy of scale, know-how, time, and temperament to brace for law suits, or the hassles, disputes, and suspension of usage for damage billings from Wyndham.

Mostly, owners rent because they want part of a 7-day reservation, or if it's a last-minute cancellation of plans past cancellation deadlines.


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## PerryM (Jan 20, 2009)

Pre-screening of rental candidates, a rental lease, and a deposit are required for a successful rental.

Asking for a copy of their driver’s license, 100% of the rental up front and a gut feeling of the renter is mandatory.  Some timeshares have the person checking in (owners and guests) pre-authorize an amount $500 - $1,000 on their major credit card which is active until a week or so after check out and some timeshares don’t.  You need to know how your resort handles it – just call them.

As to lawsuits – the resort carries liability insurance and your rental lease states that the renter isn’t going to sue you, even indirectly, and if they do they will pay for your legal expenses and you are on the hook for just the rental price they paid.  That's why you have that rental lease signed by the renter.  Your personal umbrella liability insurance should cover any thing that might make it past your rental lease.


But renting out a timeshare does take some getting used to.  However, everyone here can do it and its no big deal.

P.S.
WM is a mooch at many of their resorts - they own just some of the condos there.  I would imagine that they follow the customary front desk procedures that the main resort follows.  That's why you need to call the front desk and ask what their credit card procedure is.  I know for a fact that we had to have a major credit card and show ID when we checked into Ocean Walk which is owned by Wyndham.

Here is the link to Ocean Walk and it clearly indicates that a credit card is required at check-in.  That's another question you need to ask your renter - do you have a valid driver's license and major credit card - don't assume these folks do.  If they don't then don't rent to them.  This falls under the pre-screening of the candidate.

I hardly ever ask for a deposit anymore - this is the 21st century and ALL the places I rent out have the front desk asking for that major credit card - the renter knows they will be socked for the charge.  Keeping track of the deposit is a pain.  However, if the front desk could care less for proof of who checks in and the ability to repay damages then I do ask for a deposit - unless the renter is a prior renter of mine.  This would be an insane policy to not verify who is checking in and wanting collateral- a sign of incompetence by management in my opinion.

Can you imagine the lawsuit if a band of terrorists/criminals learned that no proof of ID or credit card were needed at a chain of resorts - the resulting lawsuits would bankrupt the resort/the entire chain - no amount of liability insurance would cover terrorist acts.  Granted the timeshare would have one more owner/member but when disaster strikes kiss that timeshare chain goodbye.

So if you check into your timeshare resort and the front desk guy doesn't demand proof of who you are you need to simply ask him/her "Are you nuts? I could be Jack the Ripper; or worse."

I'm just wondering if Homeland Security doesn't have some say here - contact them too.  You know, after a disaster everyone running around trying the connect the dots....it's too late then.

So I guess at some WM resorts all those 300 pound guys carrying violin cases might not be playing at the symphony that night.


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## Cathyb (Jan 21, 2009)

Ouch!  Did you then go after your renters???


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## Tokapeba (Jan 21, 2009)

I just got back from Sundance and no one asked for ID when I checked in. I was walking through the lobby when someone else checked in and they asked them.

Andy.


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## roadsister (Jan 22, 2009)

A credit card at Ocean Walk is due to the fact that Wyndham, not Worldmark runs the Florida place and their policy is a credit card is needed.


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## PerryM (Jan 23, 2009)

*NY Times article on timeshare rentals*

Here is the NY Times article on timeshare rentals that I participated in.


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## Tokapeba (Jan 23, 2009)

PerryM said:


> Here is the NY Times article on timeshare rentals that I participated in.



Wow Perry. Great article. 

Andy


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