# VIP Early Check-in



## chapjim (Nov 8, 2011)

VIPs are supposed to be able to check in at 2 PM instead of the normal 4 PM check-in time.  We've done it on occasion but have also run into the situation where the receptionist said in effect, "We don't do that here."  Basically, that resort opted out of a Wyndham policy.

What is your experience?


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## rrlongwell (Nov 8, 2011)

chapjim said:


> VIPs are supposed to be able to check in at 2 PM instead of the normal 4 PM check-in time.  We've done it on occasion but have also run into the situation where the receptionist said in effect, "We don't do that here."  Basically, that resort opted out of a Wyndham policy.
> 
> What is your experience?



Have run into various VIP Benifits that were not provided at a number of resorts.  Wyndham Corporate advised me awhile ago that it is optional whether or not Wyndham Managed resorts honor VIP Benifits.  This pertained primarily to newspapers.  The competing interests, as it was explained to me by other Wynhdam Staff is that the papers that were supposed to be given to VIP Members at one resort were given to the sales staff as a benny and at one or two other ones they are just sold to guests.  I have also noticed at a couple of resorts that VIP Check-In and Out were eliminated.  Most recent was at Wyndham Skyline Tower.  The area it used to be at was being manned but the VIP signs were gone and they were taking who ever was next in line.  Also, although not limited to VIP Guests, a couple of times I have been advised that the paid valet service at Skyline Tower, does not include putting the luggage in the trunk (I do tip both for the unload and the loading of the trunk (if the service is provided).


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## ronparise (Nov 8, 2011)

sounds like another of the VIP benefits is slipping away

Not that its worth the money for a developer purchase, but more than once Ive been envious of my VIP friend. Shes all moved in and enjoying a drink by the pool and Im just checking in...I know she will be upset if she has to wait the extra time before checking in, like the rest of us


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## timeos2 (Nov 8, 2011)

ronparise said:


> sounds like another of the VIP benefits is slipping away
> 
> Not that its worth the money for a developer purchase, but more than once Ive been envious of my VIP friend. Shes all moved in and enjoying a drink by the pool and Im just checking in...I know she will be upset if she has to wait the extra time before checking in, like the rest of us



We were never VIP designated and never waited any longer than they did if a unit was available. In fact we got priority in at least one case when the "VIP" raised a real ruckus about "her rights" to a unit while we stood by. They asked us to come back in 30 minutes - we did  - and got assigned the penthouse!  Later (at 4PM) we saw her again at the desk complaining that she wasn't getting the unit she wanted. I can only hope we were the ones already in it....

VIP is not guaranteed, isn't worth 5 cents and is basically little more than a sales pitch.  We who refuse to get involved are the winners in the game IMO.  Those who had it from the early years when resales were qualified can & should use it to the maximum possible - but no one should ever pay an extra $10 for it as you'll likely never get it back. 

In fact we just checked in at Nashville this week (on a rental of course) and got in the VIP line early & were assigned a unit without a question.  It is truly a meaningless designation and another big waste of money. (And time here on TUG with all the unneeded questions about it. Unless you seriously overpay today you cannot get it so it is a non-factor and should be treated like any other sales pitch - ignore it)


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## am1 (Nov 9, 2011)

timeos2 said:


> We were never VIP designated and never waited any longer than they did if a unit was available. In fact we got priority in at least one case when the "VIP" raised a real ruckus about "her rights" to a unit while we stood by. They asked us to come back in 30 minutes - we did  - and got assigned the penthouse!  Later (at 4PM) we saw her again at the desk complaining that she wasn't getting the unit she wanted. I can only hope we were the ones already in it....
> 
> VIP is not guaranteed, isn't worth 5 cents and is basically little more than a sales pitch.  We who refuse to get involved are the winners in the game IMO.  Those who had it from the early years when resales were qualified can & should use it to the maximum possible - but no one should ever pay an extra $10 for it as you'll likely never get it back.
> 
> In fact we just checked in at Nashville this week (on a rental of course) and got in the VIP line early & were assigned a unit without a question.  It is truly a meaningless designation and another big waste of money. (And time here on TUG with all the unneeded questions about it. Unless you seriously overpay today you cannot get it so it is a non-factor and should be treated like any other sales pitch - ignore it)



You always make a few good points but have no idea.


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## chapjim (Nov 9, 2011)

Whether VIP status was worth the cost is moot, at least for us.  We bought just enough points to get VIP Platinum, then went to the resale market for the next 2 million points.  My point is, we have VIP status.  We're not talking about achieving VIP status.  

There are some "benefits" that accrue to VIP owners and individual resorts shouldn't be able to opt out with a mere, "We don't do that here."  (I know, call ahead.)

Most of the bennies at resorts are trivial.  The VIP check-in is a crock, as has been pointed out, and I'm not a big USA Today fan.  However, when you arrive at a resort expecting to check in at 2 PM, it is annoying to be told they don't do that.

This is not to say that there are no useful benefits to being VIP.  Being able to book at 60 days with a 50% discount is a tremendous benefit.  Plus, I basically don't worry about guest confirmations or housekeeping credits.  I only run out if I mismanage.


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## rrlongwell (Nov 9, 2011)

> A number of people appear to be VIP owners that participate in Tugs.  I do not see any particular problem with the VIP folks participating.



For the last poster:  Does the VIP discounts apply towards your resale units since the account is already VIP?


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## chapjim (Nov 9, 2011)

rrlongwell said:


> > For the last poster:  Does the VIP discounts apply towards your resale units since the account is already VIP?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## rrlongwell (Nov 9, 2011)

chapjim said:


> For the last poster:  Does the VIP discounts apply towards your resale units since the account is already VIP?





> Yes, absolutely.  I have seen no difference in the utility of my resale points and those purchased from Wyndham.
> 
> There are some who say they achieved VIP status by purchasing only resale contracts.  I don't doubt it has happened, maybe because it was a while ago or because someone made a mistake.  It is not supposed to happen now.



Thanks.  I have heard the same thing from a couple of places on some re-sale contracts getting VIP eligable points.  That may depend on various thing like if they are the really old contracts, loctions etc.  The two that I have heard of from Wyndham Staff are sometimes that will take re-sale contracts back from a Wynhdam Owner if they buy additional points and the equilvant of the re-sale points and a different program, I think they call it OTP.  This is a program where a owner has a morgage and it has defaulted.  Wyndham may faciliate a sale where the new owner pays all back due monies etc.  Wyndham does not actually take title to the timeshare then sells it to you, they just arrange the sale and these points are then VIP eligable.


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## timeos2 (Nov 9, 2011)

am1 said:


> You always make a few good points but have no idea.



No idea about what? That TODAY spending to get VIP borders on the insane? Or that those that have it, whenever they got it including those lucky enough to have it from the day when resale qualified, should use it? That it isn't transferrable therefore carries zero resale value? That paying thousands or tens of thousands for a "free" newspaper, possible early check in that anyone can get, for a potential points savings on leftover time or a cheap gust certificate will cover those thousands in up front expense? In what lifetime? 

Trust me, I get the "idea". It is pure sales BS now meant to appeal to the "I need to feel special" crowd and nothing more TODAY.  As often repeated if you have it use it. But realize that NOW trying to obtain it , due to cost, is a losers play.


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## thommer (Nov 10, 2011)

I'm VIP Gold Only bought 168,000 Bi Annual points from Wyndham. they only count 84,000 points toward Gold.

Have 254,000 PIC points from a resale purchase prior to Wyndham at purchase of above resort in Hawaii they included and count toward VIP.

Have purchased 2 resales.  1 is affiliated resorts they counted toward Gold. It put me over 500,000 points.

One is a High End Hawaii Royal Sea Cliff resort very expensive annuals but they would not count them towards VIP because they were resale. 

Apparently Wyndham can not tell if affiliated resorts  are purchased retail or resale.

In the grand scheme of things this makes no sense to me.  The resort I pay the most annual fees for does not count toward VIP but all of my other resorts do.

In a timeshare update ( I hate timeshare updates and rarely go, I send guests I bring along) we tried to trade in our resale unit, but the sales manager told our salesperson that under no circumstances do they trade in resale units. 

Not necessarily an answer to any of above questions just my experience.


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## rrlongwell (Nov 10, 2011)

thommer said:


> I'm VIP Gold Only bought 168,000 Bi Annual points from Wyndham. they only count 84,000 points toward Gold.
> 
> Have 254,000 PIC points from a resale purchase prior to Wyndham at purchase of above resort in Hawaii they included and count toward VIP.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the update.


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## rrlongwell (Nov 11, 2011)

Anyone know what is happening at the Shawnee Mountain Resorts in Pa.?  I have two upcoming reservations at the resort.  They indicated that there was some sort of parting of the ways with them and Wynhdam.  Called Wyndham.  They gave the names of the four Wynhdam resorts (all right by each other) that they would not get involved with their decisions.  The resort indicated they are no longer taking requests for specific rooms for Wynhdam VIP Members.


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## timeos2 (Nov 11, 2011)

rrlongwell said:


> Anyone know what is happening at the Shawnee Mountain Resorts in Pa.?  I have two upcoming reservations at the resort.  They indicated that there was some sort of parting of the ways with them and Wynhdam.  Called Wyndham.  They gave the names of the four Wynhdam resorts (all right by each other) that they would not get involved with their decisions.  The resort indicated they are no longer taking requests for specific rooms for Wynhdam VIP Members.



VIP is a meaningless sales perk. Do you need more proof than the fact that a resort can pick & chose if they even honor it?


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## chapjim (Nov 11, 2011)

timeos2 said:


> VIP is a meaningless sales perk. Do you need more proof than the fact that a resort can pick & chose if they even honor it?



VIP may not be worth much to you but that is a subjective valuation.  Forget the newspaper and early check-in -- those are trivial annoyances but nothing more.

I don't have to count housekeeping points or transactions or pay for guest confirmations, hardly meaningless perks but not the best part.

I rented or used thirty-one Wyndham reservations in 2011.  All but one got a 50% discount.  That means my 3 million points was worth almost 6 million.  That's not meaningless!


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## rrlongwell (Nov 11, 2011)

chapjim said:


> ...I rented or used thirty-one Wyndham reservations in 2011.  All but one got a 50% discount.  That means my 3 million points was worth almost 6 million.  That's not meaningless!



I went over 1 year all on the VIP discount.  Am still going strong.  This fall got a little tricky for what I wanted but I did get them.  Granted I am under one of the exections referenced in the subject post.  Is it worth new purchases?  I do not know.  I guess it depends on the market and inflation does over the years.  P.S. do not forget the newspaper, it is a classy touch.


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## ronparise (Nov 11, 2011)

chapjim said:


> VIP may not be worth much to you but that is a subjective valuation.  Forget the newspaper and early check-in -- those are trivial annoyances but nothing more.
> 
> I don't have to count housekeeping points or transactions or pay for guest confirmations, hardly meaningless perks but not the best part.
> 
> I rented or used thirty-one Wyndham reservations in 2011.  All but one got a 50% discount.  That means my 3 million points was worth almost 6 million.  That's not meaningless!



If we assume you bought all your 3 million points retail than you paid something in the neighborhood of $400000  and your mf is about $15000 a year  and you get the use of 6000000 points

If I buy 6000000 points on the resale market. Ill probably be able  to do it under $50000  or a $350000 savings

Of course my mf will be double yours or about $30000 a year  Ill take the $350000 I saved and invest it at 4.3% and earn enough each year to pay the difference

I know that you can get to platinum without buying all your points retail. for example, you could buy 500000 points retail and PIC 2 three bedroom red units (500000 points) and buy the next 2 million on the secondary market to match your 3000000 points, 

My point is that as valuable as a platinum VIP ownership is; its not worth paying retail prices to get it


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## vacationhopeful (Nov 12, 2011)

Several years ago, you could PIC 4 weeks. Several years before that, you could PIC even more weeks.


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## rrlongwell (Nov 12, 2011)

ronparise said:


> If we assume you bought all your 3 million points retail than you paid something in the neighborhood of $400000  and your mf is about $15000 a year  and you get the use of 6000000 points
> 
> If I buy 6000000 points on the resale market. Ill probably be able  to do it under $50000  or a $350000 savings
> 
> ...



At the 3 million point level, you could have a wife and child each have a Platium account.  That would then be three Platinium Accounts and 6 PIC Weeks.


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## ronparise (Nov 12, 2011)

So Linda  Do I get your point;  

A wyndham owner at the 3 million point level is probably renting his points as a business. And as a business the return on the investment of time and money sucks


The only way to make it work as a business is at all is with a Platinum ownership and even then its probably not worth the capital investment

And if we were to answer the question: Does it make sense to become a Platinum VIP today (even if you do it by PICing weeks)..the answer is probably not


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## chapjim (Nov 12, 2011)

ronparise said:


> If we assume you bought all your 3 million points retail than you paid something in the neighborhood of $400000  and your mf is about $15000 a year  and you get the use of 6000000 points
> 
> If I buy 6000000 points on the resale market. Ill probably be able  to do it under $50000  or a $350000 savings
> 
> ...



I bought 1,011,000 from Wyndham, bare minimum to get to VIP Platinum.


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## chapjim (Nov 12, 2011)

rrlongwell said:


> At the 3 million point level, you could have a wife and child each have a Platium account.  That would then be three Platinium Accounts and 6 PIC Weeks.



If I had bought 3 million points from Wyndham, I guess you'd be right.


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## vacationhopeful (Nov 12, 2011)

ronparise said:


> So Linda  Do I get your point;
> 
> A wyndham owner at the 3 million point level is probably renting his points as a business. And as a business the return on the investment of time and money sucks
> 
> ...



You got it. Wyndham won the war on Megarenters being an internet business by changing the rules. They cut off the value of 4 (started as unlimited) cheap MF weeks being PIC'ed by limiting them to 2 and each must have a developer purchase, limiting free guest certificates, no more 8AM listing for yesterday's cancelled weeks, and inside the 14 day cancelled reservations become NO POINTs saved. 

There were several years ago, several MegaRenters on TUG were pulling in $60-100,000+ yearly rental Wyndham vacations. 

But to be fair, was it all the Wyndham changes made or the economy?


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## chapjim (Nov 12, 2011)

ronparise said:


> So Linda  Do I get your point;
> 
> A wyndham owner at the 3 million point level is probably renting his points as a business. And as a business the return on the investment of time and money sucks.



But think how much more it would suck if I couldn't make reservations at 50%!


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## chapjim (Nov 12, 2011)

vacationhopeful said:


> no more 8AM listing for yesterday's cancelled weeks
> 
> But to be fair, was it all the Wyndham changes made or the economy?



I don't see your point about cancellations going back into inventory at 8AM the next day. This change was the biggest boon imaginable to renters like me.

I think it is as much the economy as anything.  Lots of people aren't going as far or as often as they used to.  Lots of other people aren't going at all.

SORRY!!  I kicked this one -- should have been a multi-quote.


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## am1 (Nov 12, 2011)

chapjim said:


> I don't see your point about cancellations going back into inventory at 8AM the next day. This change was the biggest boon imaginable to renters like me.



It just takes checking for inventory from 7am - 11:45pm 7 days a week.


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## vacationhopeful (Nov 12, 2011)

am1 said:


> It just takes checking for inventory from 7am - 11:45pm 7 days a week.



Makes a very LONG day. That was exactly my point.


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## ronparise (Nov 12, 2011)

chapjim said:


> I bought 1,011,000 from Wyndham, bare minimum to get to VIP Platinum.



What you have done is exactly what I want to do. but with a smaller retail buy...     I can get to gold with a 126000 point retail buy and two PIC weeks. But I cant figure out a path to platinum unless I buy 500000 retail points...and I cant justify that expense for the extra 10 gift certs and the increased discount


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## jjmanthei05 (Nov 12, 2011)

am1 said:


> It just takes checking for inventory from 7am - 11:45pm 7 days a week.



You don't need to watch the system if you already have the reservations and just cancel and rebook right away for the discount. Makes everyone else watch for that much time to catch your reservations before you get them back. 

Jason


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## chapjim (Nov 12, 2011)

jjmanthei05 said:


> You don't need to watch the system if you already have the reservations and just cancel and rebook right away for the discount. Makes everyone else watch for that much time to catch your reservations before you get them back.
> 
> Jason



That's it!  You got it!  On day 60 before check-in, cancel the reservation and about 15 seconds later book the same reservation.  I open two windows and run the search once before I cancel so it's ready to go.  Plus, if there is the same reservation available, I don't have to sweat out the re-booking.

I've lost exactly one reservation out of maybe sixty re-bookings.  That was a 3BR unit at Ocean Walk.  Ocean Walk overbooks so my cancellation was sucked up to cover an overbooking.

I rebook several reservations (I just rebooked five at La Belle Maison in New Orleans for the BCS Championship), take the points and book something else (in this case, a 3BR Pres unit next May at Bonnet Creek for a repeat buyer).  When that one gets to 60 days, I'll cancel and rebook it.  I have ten reservations at La Belle Maison or Avenue Plaza for the NCAA Final Four.  Rebooking those will let me get something in mid-summer.  I have thirty-seven active reservations in Wyndham's system.

I do check for upgrades whenever I'm in the system but don't even come close to 7 AM to 10 PM.  I do work!


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## jjmanthei05 (Nov 13, 2011)

chapjim said:


> That's it!  You got it!  On day 60 before check-in, cancel the reservation and about 15 seconds later book the same reservation.  I open two windows and run the search once before I cancel so it's ready to go.  Plus, if there is the same reservation available, I don't have to sweat out the re-booking.
> 
> I've lost exactly one reservation out of maybe sixty re-bookings.  That was a 3BR unit at Ocean Walk.  Ocean Walk overbooks so my cancellation was sucked up to cover an overbooking.
> 
> ...



To maximize your booking discounts especially when doing multiple reservations for busy times also book a 1 bedroom then you get the upgrade benefit as well as the 50% discount.

Jason


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## chapjim (Nov 13, 2011)

jjmanthei05 said:


> To maximize your booking discounts especially when doing multiple reservations for busy times also book a 1 bedroom then you get the upgrade benefit as well as the 50% discount.
> 
> Jason


So you're saying book five 2BR units and five 1BR units at 13 months?  Then at the 60 day point, cancel the 2BR and immediately cancel and rebook the 1BR and grab the upgrade?

Good idea.  I did that once but it was an accident!


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## jjmanthei05 (Nov 13, 2011)

chapjim said:


> So you're saying book five 2BR units and five 1BR units at 13 months?  Then at the 60 day point, cancel the 2BR and immediately cancel and rebook the 1BR and grab the upgrade?
> 
> Good idea.  I did that once but it was an accident!



No I'm saying book 5 - 2 bedrooms and 1 - 1 bedroom. Then first cancel the 1 bedroom and regrab it to get your 50% discount on that. Then cancel 1 of you 2 bedrooms and upgrade the 1 bedroom to the 2. Then repick up the 1 bedroom and repeat through the 5 reservations. At the end you can either let the 1 bedroom go or rent that one as well.  This is how I believe it should work. I don't have VIP benefits  , I am a resale owner. Doing it this way wont cost as many carry points from 13 months to 60 days. 

Jason


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## chapjim (Nov 14, 2011)

Okay, I got it.  I'll probably screw it up but I got it!


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## am1 (Nov 14, 2011)

Probably best not to talk about this on a public message board.


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## ronparise (Nov 14, 2011)

They teach this technique at owner updates in an effort to sell more VIP ownerships


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## rrlongwell (Nov 14, 2011)

ronparise said:


> They teach this technique at owner updates in an effort to sell more VIP ownerships



Ron is right, this is a major sales pitch at numerous locations, in varying verisons, for buying.  It is absolutly a authorized release of the benifit by the Sales Staff.  This pitch is usally done in conjunction with the buy more to rent either through extra holidays, or through the site sales staff, or on your own.  The ending pitch of this line is use half the points for free and the other half that are rented will pay for the ones you use.  I do not know if this works or not.


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## am1 (Nov 14, 2011)

rrlongwell said:


> Ron is right, this is a major sales pitch at numerous locations for buying.  It is absolutly a authorized release of the benifit by the Sales Staff.  This pitch is usally done in conjunction with the buy more to rent either through extra holidays, or through the site sales staff, or on yourr own.



That does not mean the sales people actually think people will do it.  Or that they care if Wyndham changes the rules.  They will just change their approach and continue selling.


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## learnalot (Nov 14, 2011)

am1 said:


> That does not mean the sales people actually think people will do it.  Or that they care if Wyndham changes the rules.  They will just change their approach and continue selling.



I agree.  Heck, they are still telling people they can get any week for 28K through RCI.  Besides, what sales will pitch in order to sell you more points may be quite different than what corporate is willing to tolerate, especially things that become widely touted on public forums.  Drawing too much attention to a loophole is often a good way to get it closed.


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## chapjim (Nov 16, 2011)

*Enhancing Value of Ownership*



learnalot said:


> Drawing too much attention to a loophole is often a good way to get it closed.



I'm not saying you're wrong.  You are right.  But, you should be wrong!  This shouldn't be a loophole.  It should be an policy intended to reward owners with substantial investments.

Wyndham needs sales, that is well understood.  The best way to increase sales is to increase the value of ownership.  If all the representations sales people make were actually the way things work, Wyndham would have no problem making sales.  They would sell more contracts and fewer people would have buyer's remorse.  Plugging this loophole would markedly decrease the value of my ownership.  I would have to increase my asking prices and would rent fewer weeks.

RCI's should allow people to rent exchanges.  I've done it but got threatening letters from RCI.  Why does RCI care what we do with an exchange?  If we know we can rent an exchange, we might by more points with the idea of banking points we can't use.  We should be able to bank cancelled points.

There's a lot more.


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## am1 (Nov 16, 2011)

If the renting of rci exchanges were allowed all the good weeks would be cherry picked.


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## timeos2 (Nov 16, 2011)

am1 said:


> If the renting of rci exchanges were allowed all the good weeks would be cherry picked.



It seems they already are - for RCI rentals!  Why shouldn't owners who supply the inventory get the same right or everyone - INCLUDING RCI - should be prohibited from renting.  As it is it's totally a one way street with owners the biggest losers.   Make it fair and equal.


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## rrlongwell (Nov 16, 2011)

timeos2 said:


> It seems they already are - for RCI rentals!  Why shouldn't owners who supply the inventory get the same right or everyone - INCLUDING RCI - should be prohibited from renting.  As it is it's totally a one way street with owners the biggest losers.   Make it fair and equal.



Especially when RCI gets an additional fee for guest passes.


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## ronparise (Nov 17, 2011)

am1 said:


> If the renting of rci exchanges were allowed all the good weeks would be cherry picked.



Aren't they all cherry picked anyway?...isnt that what you are doing when you pick a week for yourself, ie looking for the best ones for yourself and leaving the rest for me....Whats the difference  whether you get that week I wanted, or someone else gets it to rent...either way its not there for me, or anyone else...its been cherry picked


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## am1 (Nov 17, 2011)

timeos2 said:


> It seems they already are - for RCI rentals!  Why shouldn't owners who supply the inventory get the same right or everyone - INCLUDING RCI - should be prohibited from renting.  As it is it's totally a one way street with owners the biggest losers.   Make it fair and equal.



This is not something that owners would like.  Individual owners would suffer even more.  Owners always have the option of not depositing with RCI.


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