# 1,245,000 points deeded @ Bonnet Creek



## lennyb216 (Apr 10, 2012)

1,245,000 points deeded at Bonnet Creek sold for$15,200 on Ebay tonight. I haven't seen Wyndham points sell that high in a long time.


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## Sandi Bo (Apr 10, 2012)

Wow. I suppose having 953,700 points available, and having maintenance fees paid through 2012 would make it somewhat attractive. I can't imagine spending $15,000 on ebay (or paying commission on a $15,000 sale).


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## rrlongwell (Apr 10, 2012)

lennyb216 said:


> 1,245,000 points deeded at Bonnet Creek sold for$15,200 on Ebay tonight. I haven't seen Wyndham points sell that high in a long time.



I have been wondering for awhile now when figures like these might start emerging.  The buyer and seller both win.  May the rest of E-Bay re-sales follow suit.  If one wants to buy that many points, it saves a bunch of Wyndham transfer fees doing it that way (with one deed, which I assume is what this was).  If there were about 2 million points that came with this and a rentor of reservations got it, it may not be as expense on a net basis as it appears.

UPDATE:  Taking into account the following post or two, if an existing VIP member bought this and it was one of what the sales force calls a "Power Deed", then the VIP discount on the account may apply.  If this is the case, the book cancel rebook trick could work very very well.


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## massvacationer (Apr 10, 2012)

That probably would sell for nearly $200,000 at retail, so maybe not a bad deal for someone who wants a lot of points deeded at BC to use to ARP large and presidential units


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## ronparise (Apr 10, 2012)

There are always outliers in any set of data. If this sale sticks, thats what it is and its meaningless. If you are trying to figure out the future for Wyndham resales, you would do better to look at the mean /1000 points 

I would bet, however, that this was the seller and a few of his buddies bidding up the price...or the buyer and seller entered into a side deal to preserve VIP


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## rrlongwell (Apr 10, 2012)

ronparise said:


> There are always outliers in any set of data. If this sale sticks, thats what it is and its meaningless. If you are trying to figure out the future for Wyndham resales, you would do better to look at the mean /1000 points
> 
> I would bet, however, that this was the seller and a few of his buddies bidding up the price...or the buyer and seller entered into a side deal to preserve VIP



If it was the former, than it was meaningless, if it was the later, than it does not indicate anything one way or the other (the VIP makes it a non-comparable to a re-sale price on E-Bay).  If it the wave of the furture, more of the better bids will start showing up on E-Bay.  When looking at the mean, it would need to be at least a three tier analysis.  Top Resports in prime season, all mid-grade resorts, and the weak not in demand resorts.  The latter should not be considered at all and eliminated from the calculation (makes the math easyier).


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## jjmanthei05 (Apr 10, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> If it was the former, than it was meaningless, if it was the later, than it does not indicate anything one way or the other (the VIP makes it a non-comparable to a re-sale price on E-Bay).  If it the wave of the furture, more of the better bids will start showing up on E-Bay.  When looking at the mean, it would need to be at least a three tier analysis.  Top Resports in prime season, all mid-grade resorts, and the weak not in demand resorts.  The latter should not be considered at all and eliminated from the calculation (makes the math easyier).



My math is a little easier....

I get an email daily of any Wyndham that goes up on ebay and I see 10 to 25 a day. That seems like way to much supply to increase bidding prices in any significant way. As for the "Save on transfer fees" say you get 8 - 154,000 contracts (you can get up to 14 on a single account) for which you spend $800 each to cover closing, transfer and about $100 per contract your still at only $6,500. Seems a way expensive less way to go than $15,000.

Jason


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## rrlongwell (Apr 10, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> My math is a little easier....
> 
> I get an email daily of any Wyndham that goes up on ebay and I see 10 to 25 a day. That seems like way to much supply to increase bidding prices in any significant way. As for the "Save on transfer fees" say you get 8 - 154,000 contracts (you can get up to 14 on a single account) for which you spend $800 each to cover closing, transfer and about $100 per contract your still at only $6,500. Seems a way expensive less way to go than $15,000.
> 
> Jason



If you went your way, then the account could be structured to have four different use years.  That would be a great benifit.  It would be done at the expense of combining points by use year and resort to maximize ARP rights in a specific booking.  Depends what the person wants.


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## ronparise (Apr 10, 2012)

rrlongwell said:


> If it was the former, than it was meaningless, if it was the later, than it does not indicate anything one way or the other (the VIP makes it a non-comparable to a re-sale price on E-Bay).  If it the wave of the furture, more of the better bids will start showing up on E-Bay.  When looking at the mean, it would need to be at least a three tier analysis.  Top Resports in prime season, all mid-grade resorts, and the weak not in demand resorts.  The latter should not be considered at all and eliminated from the calculation (makes the math easyier).



As Jason has already said...a complicated analysis isnt needed...a quick look will tell you that Wyndham contracts, except for a very few , are going for at most, an amount (including closing costs and transfer fees)  equal to or less than  a years mf...This one went for twice a years mf...way out of line

To suggest that the points from one resort are more valuable than the points from another, based on your definition of whats prime and whats not is just silly to someone like me that sees points as points...The difference in value flows from  the  mf/point ratio...There really is a difference in value between the $3.50/1000 point and $6/1000 point contracts

The guy that bought this Bonnet Creek contract either really wanted a guarantee that he would get Easter and Christmas in 4 bedroom Presidential, with the Mouse..or  he didnt know what he was doing...either way it has no bearing on the future of Wyndham sales

By the way...I hope Im wrong...Id gladly trade my million and a half points for $15000...bit I dont see it happening in my lifetime


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## antjmar (Apr 11, 2012)

I think the ebay sales prices  are creeping up a bit. My last purchase I was bidding against 3 others   for a very small Myrtle beach contract (high MF). I didnt expect any competion.

Look at this one below. The ad isnt accurate since the MF cant be that low but most people dont know that.... 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/110854196273?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649


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## ronparise (Apr 11, 2012)

antjmar said:


> I think the ebay sales prices  are creeping up a bit. My last purchase I was bidding against 3 others   for a very small Myrtle beach contract (high MF). I didnt expect any competion.
> 
> Look at this one below. The ad isnt accurate since the MF cant be that low but most people dont know that....
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/110854196273?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649



I agree prices are creeping up..but the operative word is creeping.

It surprises me that those little contracts sell at all, let alone at the prices they do. Perhaps someone is taking my advice and looking for a cheap way to get to RCIs last call inventory


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## rrlongwell (Apr 11, 2012)

ronparise said:


> I agree prices are creeping up..but the operative word is creeping.
> 
> It surprises me that those little contracts sell at all, let alone at the prices they do. Perhaps someone is taking my advice and looking for a cheap way to get to RCIs last call inventory



$2,723 is what appears to be the current bid.  That is costs plus current bid price.  Impressive move up.  I do not look at all the auctions, however, from the ones I spot check, it looks like the days of free closings and fees paid by seller are heading down.  As for the maintance fees, if the bidders trust the E-Bay add, they may be in for one heck of a surprise.  However, I do not this resort, maybe they are that low.  That would be worth calling the resort to verify what their maintance fees are if one were bidding.

Someone may just be trying to take advantage of the advise that sometimes shows up on this forum to buy resorts with low maintance fees by making them real low in the ad to get a higher purchase price. $137.50 would be a closer "estimate" of maintance fees.  I used $5.50 per thousand to run a quick estimate of fees.

The ad is showing the Maintance Fee estimate as $37.45 per month.  That would be about a $1,200 dollar differential off of my estimate for a year.  The actual would vary depending on the acutal maintance fee/program fee/taxes at that resort.  Given that savings, if it were true, would possably explain why bidders might give the bid amount.


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## jjmanthei05 (Apr 11, 2012)

The last thing I have put a UDI on that resort (can't be a fixed week because the point totals don't line up) for 2010 $4.74/K plus the program fee so there is no way that is close. What is more reasonable is that is what has been paid so far this year for MF. Also when I look at ebay sale prices I don't count the MF repay, closing or transfer costs because none of those are actual profit for you. So if you go to see you don't actually get that money (or are being repaid money you already spent).

Jason


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## jjmanthei05 (Apr 11, 2012)

Something also seems weird about the bidding on that one. since they are going up in large increments.

Here are a couple of examples of more realistic ones from the same resort..

Posted 3/14 300K annual pts 1 bid $1

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wyndham-300-000-POINTS...

Posted 3/14 126K annual pts 0 bids $1

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wyndham-126-000-POINTS...

Posted 4/7 154K EOY pts 2 bids $1

http://www.ebay.com/itm/154-000-Points-Wyndham-Palm-Aire...


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## fluxmn (Apr 11, 2012)

*Low MF*

I'm guessing those MF's are wrong.  If you look at the other auctions by greattimesharebargains, many of their auctions have very low and wrong MF's.  I would definitely check anything I would buy from that seller.


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## antjmar (Apr 11, 2012)

fluxmn said:


> I'm guessing those MF's are wrong.  If you look at the other auctions by greattimesharebargains, many of their auctions have very low and wrong MF's.  I would definitely check anything I would buy from that seller.



Yes they are wrong. I should have stated I have points at Palm Aire.


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## pacodemountainside (Apr 11, 2012)

Incorrect MF in for sale ads/listings  has been discussed at length and is a problem!. The reasons are many, last years, omit POA fee, out right lie,  converted fixed week vs UDI,  typo, original owner had more than 300K points paying $.53/1,000 POA fee and selling say 105K if free standing will carry $98 POA  fee, etc.

The only sure fire way I know to verify is have seller send a copy of his annual assessment statement. If does not have he can go to his account,  click on and attach to an e-mail.

There is an excellent MF calculator on Wyndham Form and pretty accurate. However, at locations where there are multiple HOAs can be confusing.

But read ads carefully for inaccuracties(euphasim for lie) such as THIS listing includes free RCI membership.

Paco


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## rrlongwell (Apr 11, 2012)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wyndham-Clu...50776702603?pt=Timeshares&hash=item231afde68b

Now I am impressed.  Check out the above link for Club Wyndham Access points.  $5,100 current bid plus at least about $700 in fees.  Auction not done yet.  580,000 points.

In this case, they are indicating that both Wyndham Vacation Resorts or WorldMark by Wyndham owner can use these.  This is news to me.  Hope the bidders know what they are bidding on.  It appears the E-Bay re-sellers still come up with creative ways to try and boost the re-sale prices.

"Your Ownership ADVANTAGE…

Wyndham Vacation Resorts
Look at the vacation pleasures you'll enjoy as a Wyndham Vacation Resorts or WorldMark by Wyndham owner…"

"fully-stocked kitchens, (hello, midnight snack)"  This is an interesting ad feature for the Club Wyndham Access timeshare being bid on.  I wonder if this is adding to the value.  I would not think a bag of popcorn, some coffee, and salt and peper qualifies.

P.S.  The bag of popcorn is not bad.  The Wyndham Club Plus members get the popcorn to.

UPDATE:  The final bid price is US $5,655.55 plus costs.


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## tschwa2 (Apr 11, 2012)

Wow another private auction.  I wonder if all these high price auctions will be relisted in a few days or weeks.


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## jjmanthei05 (Apr 11, 2012)

Both are the same sellers and the most recent one has bids of 3333.33 and 4444.44. After reviewing this I don't think i would ever buy from this person because something just seems off...

Jason


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## antjmar (Apr 11, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> Both are the same sellers and the most recent one has bids of 3333.33 and 4444.44. After reviewing this I don't think i would ever buy from this person because something just seems off...
> 
> Jason



I wouldnt buy from them...But I'd sure love for them to sell some of my points!:hysterical:


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## rrlongwell (Apr 11, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> Both are the same sellers and the most recent one has bids of 3333.33 and 4444.44. After reviewing this I don't think i would ever buy from this person because something just seems off...
> 
> Jason



Just did a quick count of Wyndham Vacation Resorts listings on E-Bay for 300,000 points or better.  Do not know if I got them all.  I count 29, forteen of which have bids.  It will be interesting to see what the final bids are on these contracts.


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## vacationhopeful (Apr 11, 2012)

jjmanthei05 said:


> Both are the same sellers and the most recent one has bids of 3333.33 and 4444.44. After reviewing this I don't think i would ever buy from this person because something just seems off...
> 
> Jason



Jason,
You are soooo jaded.:ignore:


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## pacodemountainside (Apr 11, 2012)

Just remember,   since auctions  began  around the time of the great flood there have been shrills, ringers, scammers  and reserves.

While  e-bay and craigslist  are great places to buy  and sell one  does at own risk. Cavet emptor. E-bay  specifically excludes time shares from its protection plan!

The big  auction houses in NYC  and London   go to great lengths to insure integrity!


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## carl2591 (Apr 11, 2012)

tschwa2 said:


> Wow another private auction.  I wonder if all these high price auctions will be relisted in a few days or weeks.



private auctions also mean the winning price will not be shown in feedback forum so the prices they are selling this stuff at is a guess. 

kinda make you wonder why they use private auctions to hide something.. not to protect the buyers ID ... make you go HUMMMMMM


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## rrlongwell (Apr 12, 2012)

carl2591 said:


> private auctions also mean the winning price will not be shown in feedback forum so the prices they are selling this stuff at is a guess.
> 
> kinda make you wonder why they use private auctions to hide something.. not to protect the buyers ID ... make you go HUMMMMMM



This just went for $1.  Hope you got it Ron.  Wyndham Points La Belle Maison Resort 328,000 Annual Points

UPDATE:

Another one: WYNDHAM CLUB ACCESS, 819,000 POINTS, ANNUAL, TIMESHARE went for $2,999 dollars, is the train leading to significantly higher re-sale prices leaving the station?


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