# Diamond Resorts Newsletter - sent by Hilton



## T_R_Oglodyte (Jan 6, 2022)

Posting this here because it was actually sent by Hilton.  Note the discussion of Hilton creating a new brand for some of the Diamond properties - Hilton Vacation Club. Looks as if the "Grand" will need to disappear from the title for this forum! 



> Dear Club Members,
> 
> Happy New Year from your Hilton Grand Vacations family! Every new year provides the unique opportunity to reflect on the past and look forward to the possibilities that lie ahead.
> 
> ...


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## dayooper (Jan 6, 2022)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> Posting this here because it was actually sent by Hilton.  N*ote the discussion of Hilton creating a new brand for some of the Diamond properties - Hilton Vacation Club. Looks as if the "Grand" will need to disappear from the title for this forum!*



Or the Diamond Forum will need to be renamed Hilton Vacation Club and need to be moved here!


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## PigsDad (Jan 6, 2022)

There will still be a Hilton Grand Vacation Club, but there will now be a new "Hilton Vacation Club" that will be more focused on the existing Diamond properties -- at least that is how I am reading it.  Will be interesting to see how this all shakes out.

Kurt


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## PigsDad (Jan 6, 2022)

BTW, HGV members were sent a similar email today as well:



> Dear Club Members,
> 
> Happy New Year from your Hilton Grand Vacations family! Every new year provides the unique opportunity to reflect on the past and look forward to the possibilities that lie ahead.
> 
> ...



Kurt


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## pedro47 (Jan 6, 2022)

PigsDad said:


> There will still be a Hilton Grand Vacation Club, but there will now be a new "Hilton Vacation Club" that will be more focused on the existing Diamond properties -- at least that is how I am reading it.  Will be interesting to see how this all shakes out.
> 
> Kurt


What is the difference betweem Hilton Club members exchanging into Hilton Grand Vacation Club and the new "Hilton Vacation Club?"
Are the new "Hilton Vacation Club' members going to be second class Club members?


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## PigsDad (Jan 6, 2022)

pedro47 said:


> What is the difference betweem Hilton Club members exchanging into Hilton Grand Vacation Club and the new "Hilton Vacation Club?"
> Are the new "Hilton Vacation Club' members going to be second class Club members?


No one knows as that level of detail has not yet been released.

Kurt


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## GT75 (Jan 6, 2022)

pedro47 said:


> What is the difference betweem Hilton Club members exchanging into Hilton Grand Vacation Club and the new "Hilton Vacation Club?"
> Are the new "Hilton Vacation Club' members going to be second class Club members?


Currently only a branding name change.


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## dougp26364 (Jan 6, 2022)

pedro47 said:


> What is the difference betweem Hilton Club members exchanging into Hilton Grand Vacation Club and the new "Hilton Vacation Club?"
> Are the new "Hilton Vacation Club' members going to be second class Club members?



Not second class members, but varying degrees of resort quality.

Think of it in these terms. Sedona Summit has different classes of units. I know there’s standard units and Mesa suites plus one other suite I don’t recall it’s name. The Suites at Fall Creek in Branson has standard units as well as more expensive Deluxe units. Polo Towers is actually separated into two resorts, the suites and the villas, with the villas requiring more points.

You’ll probably see the same between the “grand” resorts and the “vacation” resorts. You can say whatever you want, but most (not all) DRI resorts are of lessor quality than the current Hilton Grand resorts. It’s the main reason we left DRI and kept Hilton and Marriott. DRI fees where in line with Marriott and higher than Hilton but the quality wasn’t equal. It made the decision to drop DRI and keep the others easy for us.

I don’t see Hilton as treating DRI owners as second class citizens, but I also don’t see them elevating DRI resorts to Hilton Grand standards. It would be hard for me to believe that DRI members have forgotten how jacked the MF’s became when DRI decided to upgrade all the old Sunterra resorts. I can hear the screams now if DRI owners got shocked with huge special assessments to upgrade the DRI resorts to HGVC standards.


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## dioxide45 (Jan 6, 2022)

dougp26364 said:


> Not second class members, but varying degrees of resort quality.


I would think these "HIlton Vacation Club" resorts will probably be afforded fewer points in the new system than similar size units at a "Hilton Grand Vacations" resort?


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## dougp26364 (Jan 6, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> I would think these "HIlton Vacation Club" resorts will probably be afforded fewer points in the new system than similar size units at a "Hilton Grand Vacations" resort?



I think that’s the assumption, but we’ll have to wait and see what the cross-over rules look like. I’d take a guess but I’ve been wrong so many times I find it’s best to just wait and see. Hilton does appear to be moving faster towards integration than MVC/Vistana, but DRI didn’t have the market presence and recognition that Westin, Sheraton and Hyatt had going for them. Maybe that will make it easier for Hilton.

What I’m most curious about is how MF’s will be affected by Hilton’s management style. We left DRI primarily because the fees were out of line with the quality. Hilton has done a fantastic job IMO of keeping MF’s in line. Will DRI fees go down? Maybe they’ll have several years of no increases? Will they take any surplus and plow it back into the resort to increase quality without increasing MF’s? This is what interests me more than anything else because the variance in quality vs fees was what drove us out of the DRI system.


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## Eric B (Jan 6, 2022)

As mentioned in other threads, there's also the "Hilton Club" tier.  Maybe the forum should just be renamed "Hilton".


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## dioxide45 (Jan 6, 2022)

dougp26364 said:


> I think that’s the assumption, but we’ll have to wait and see what the cross-over rules look like. I’d take a guess but I’ve been wrong so many times I find it’s best to just wait and see. Hilton does appear to be moving faster towards integration than MVC/Vistana, but DRI didn’t have the market presence and recognition that Westin, Sheraton and Hyatt had going for them. Maybe that will make it easier for Hilton.
> 
> What I’m most curious about is how MF’s will be affected by Hilton’s management style. We left DRI primarily because the fees were out of line with the quality. Hilton has done a fantastic job IMO of keeping MF’s in line. Will DRI fees go down? Maybe they’ll have several years of no increases? Will they take any surplus and plow it back into the resort to increase quality without increasing MF’s? This is what interests me more than anything else because the variance in quality vs fees was what drove us out of the DRI system.


Perhaps it is the reputation of Diamond that is hastening the name change. The faster they can get that name off the resorts, the better.


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## dougp26364 (Jan 7, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> Perhaps it is the reputation of Diamond that is hastening the name change. The faster they can get that name off the resorts, the better.



I think it’s more about branding than getting rid of the bad taste of DRI. A lot of those that own DRI like DRI. I’m not certain that outside of timeshare that DRI has any brand recognition, either good or bad.

Hilton does have brand recognition. Getting the Hilton name on these timeshares could increase recognition plus draw interest from HHonors members towards those resorts, possibly opening up a pool of untapped prospects Hilton hadn’t been able to reach before.

DRI has always rented inventory. Now that inventory will have the Hilton name and perhaps will draw greater attention from current HHonors members as well as booking engines like orbits. As a result this could drive additional presentations/sales. In Sedona,

If I were Hilton, I’d want my name on these resorts ASAP as long as the resorts met Hilton’s standards


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## pedro47 (Jan 7, 2022)

I feel with the MF‘s DRI, were charging their owners/members, Hilton will have no troubles upgrading  many of the old DRI resorts. I also, feel Hilton will use their resorts reserve monies wisely to upgrade many of these Hilton brand resorts.  Finally, I feel Hilton will reduce the inflated management fees DRI charged their resorts.

Look for this money to go back into the new Hilton brand resorts.

This money will be used to improve the Hilton acquisition of DRI resorts. Hilton is not going purchase tools, silverware  and materials from the dollar tree stores.

Hilton is not going to purchase new trucks for their maintenance staff every two years for not properly maintaining their resorts .

Hilton, IMO, is going to use the MF’s properly and wisely to enchant these new Hilton brand resorts and by using the Hilton brand buying power to purchase new quality furnishings, appliances, linens, and kitchens cookware and silverware.

I also hope Hilton will look at their  new sale team and will terminate many of these employees.

This acquisition by Hilton will be a “win - win“ for all the new Hilton brand resorts and it’s owners. IMHO.

Go Hilton Vacation Club or Hilton Club.


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## dayooper (Jan 7, 2022)

Eric B said:


> As mentioned in other threads, there's also the "Hilton Club" tier.  Maybe the forum should just be renamed "Hilton".



If you are going to change the name of the forum,  I think that Hilton Grand Vacations Forum (remove the club from the title) would appropriate as that's the name of the overall company. I think just Hilton would be confusing for newbies as they might think that Hilton Hotels is involved with the system.


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## dioxide45 (Jan 7, 2022)

dougp26364 said:


> I think it’s more about branding than getting rid of the bad taste of DRI. A lot of those that own DRI like DRI. I’m not certain that outside of timeshare that DRI has any brand recognition, either good or bad.
> 
> Hilton does have brand recognition. Getting the Hilton name on these timeshares could increase recognition plus draw interest from HHonors members towards those resorts, possibly opening up a pool of untapped prospects Hilton hadn’t been able to reach before.
> 
> ...


Rebranding does give Hilton Grand Vacations another outlet for renting as well. RIght now they couldn't put the Diamond resorts for rent on Hilton.com. After a rebrand it gives them more options to unload unsold or unbooked inventory.


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## youppi (Jan 7, 2022)

dayooper said:


> If you are going to change the name of the forum,  I think that Hilton Grand Vacations Forum (remove the club from the title) would appropriate as that's the name of the overall company. I think just Hilton would be confusing for newbies as they might think that Hilton Hotels is involved with the system.


I agree with you. Hilton is the hotel side parent and Hilton Grand Vacations is the timeshare side parent as per the following picture from  https://s27.q4cdn.com/757306400/files/doc_presentations/FINAL-HGV-DRI-Slides-(1).pdf.


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## dioxide45 (Jan 7, 2022)

youppi said:


> I agree with you. Hilton is the hotel side parent and Hilton Grand Vacations is the timeshare side parent as per the following picture from  https://s27.q4cdn.com/757306400/files/doc_presentations/FINAL-HGV-DRI-Slides-(1).pdf.
> View attachment 44884


Interesting that they are pegging Wyndham resorts a little below Diamond.


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## Eric B (Jan 7, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> Interesting that they are pegging Wyndham resorts a little below Diamond.



They also have Hilton Club resorts above Marriott.  Gotta say I think the Westins I've been to have been higher quality/luxury than The District, for example.  But they made the slide, so they can position them where they want.


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## dayooper (Jan 7, 2022)

Eric B said:


> They also have Hilton Club resorts above Marriott.  Gotta say I think the Westins I've been to have been higher quality/luxury than The District, for example.  But they made the slide, so they can position them where they want.



This is just from what I hear, but The Quin and Central on 5th are supposed to be very luxurious. I don’t know much about Westin resorts either.


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## dougp26364 (Jan 8, 2022)

I think maybe just some, since travel and Lea sure straddles the line. I have stayed at any Wyndham resort, but the two Wyndham’s in Branson appear to be nicer than the DRI resort in that location. In Vegas it might be a toss up, but again, I haven’t stayed at a Wyndham resort……. ever.

As mentioned, it’s Hiltons chart, so they can rate their competition how they see them.


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## Eric B (Jan 8, 2022)

dayooper said:


> This is just from what I hear, but The Quin and Central on 5th are supposed to be very luxurious. I don’t know much about Westin resorts either.



I'll be staying at The Quin in March, so will have another data point.  The spectrum they put the resorts on is pretty subjective in any case and I might have taken into account being located in Cancun or St John as opposed to DC in the winter, but the Marriott bar would include Ritz Carlton, too.  I've got to believe there's a fair amount of investor relations puffery in the world similar to how not everything you hear from a timeshare salesman is 100% true.

But back to the subject - TUG didn't change the name of the Wyndham forum when the corporation became Travel+Leisure, so I'm okay with leaving this one as HGVC.  It's up to the management here on what they want to do about the DRI forum, of course, but I think it would be a bit confusing naming that one HVC when the rebranding has happened.  I also think that the integration will not be tight enough to eliminate the separate forum but instead a looser one like the Wyndham-WorldMark situation.  If it were me, though, I would change the order of the fora to move DRI next to HGVC and to group Hyatt near Marriott and Vistana.  It probably doesn't make a difference, though.


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## dayooper (Jan 8, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> Rebranding does give Hilton Grand Vacations another outlet for renting as well. RIght now they couldn't put the Diamond resorts for rent on Hilton.com. After a rebrand it gives them more options to unload unsold or unbooked inventory.



The Hilton Honors app already has some of the DRI resorts loaded but not able to book. They say coming soon and are listed as Hilton Vacation Club. Mystic Dunes in Orlando is one.


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## CalGalTraveler (Jan 8, 2022)

I don't believe mingling the DRI forum with HGVC makes sense. Different programs and there would be too much confusion and co-mingling of content.

Vistana is still separate from MVC. Of course MVC has not rebranded nor integrated.

Perhaps rename the Diamond Forum; "Hilton Vacations Club (Formerly Diamond)" since that rebranding is happening.


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## pedro47 (Jan 8, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> I don't believe mingling the DRI forum with HGVC makes sense. Different programs and there would be too much confusion and co-mingling of content.
> 
> Vistana is still separate from MVC. Of course MVC has not rebranded nor integrated.
> 
> Perhaps rename the Diamond Forum; "Hilton Vacations Club (Formerly Diamond)" since that rebranding is happening.


I feel the same way. Both programs are totally difference.


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## dioxide45 (Jan 8, 2022)

It might be jumping the gun a little bit to be renaming or merging forums just yet. Right now we are just talking about rebranding a few resorts. Diamond isn't gone yet.


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## pedro47 (Jan 8, 2022)

Dioxide45 is correct right just looking at Hilton. There is The Hiltion Club and The Hiltion Grand Vacation Club.


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## dayooper (Jan 8, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> It might be jumping the gun a little bit to be renaming or merging forums just yet. Right now we are just talking about rebranding a few resorts. Diamond isn't gone yet.



I think it just started as a little fun with @T_R_Oglodyte and myself. I know that I had no intention of wanting to rename anything quite yet. A little discussion like what happened after never hurt anybody and might be productive down the road.


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## youppi (Jan 9, 2022)

Multiple time Diamond Resorts tried to buy Bluegreen Vacations in the past.
So, if HGV would buy Bluegreen in the future, HGV would have all scale of resorts (Midscale, Upper Midscale, Upscale, Upper Upscale and Luxury resorts).

https://s27.q4cdn.com/757306400/files/doc_presentations/FINAL-HGV-DRI-Slides-(1).pdf.


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## Eric B (Jan 9, 2022)

Does it seem a bit odd to anyone else that the lowest bin on the scale is Midscale?  Hadn't really thought about it until @youppi listed the full scale by name.


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## Eric B (Jan 9, 2022)

All the resorts are above average!


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## dioxide45 (Jan 9, 2022)

Eric B said:


> Does it seem a bit odd to anyone else that the lowest bin on the scale is Midscale?  Hadn't really thought about it until @youppi listed the full scale by name.


When including the hotel brands on here, it probably makes sense. I wouldn't put any of those Hilton brands in the same league as Econo Lodge, Motel 6 or Super 8.


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## dayooper (Jan 9, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> When including the hotel brands on here, it probably makes sense. I wouldn't put any of those Hilton brands in the same league as Econo Lodge, Motel 6 or Super 8.



Think of some of the non brand affiliated no tell motels. Those dive places would rank below the ones you listed!



youppi said:


> Multiple time Diamond Resorts tried to buy Bluegreen Vacations in the past.
> So, if HGV would buy Bluegreen in the future, HGV would have all scale of resorts (Midscale, Upper Midscale, Upscale, Upper Upscale and Luxury resorts).
> 
> https://s27.q4cdn.com/757306400/files/doc_presentations/FINAL-HGV-DRI-Slides-(1).pdf.
> View attachment 44884



While I don’t think that HGV will buy BlueGreen, I don’t think that the consolidation of timeshare systems is finished. We have the Big 3 of Wyndham, MVC and HGV and the marketing power of their brands. The other systems that aren’t affiliated with hotel brands will struggle to keep up. I wonder if some of the smaller systems will be ripe for a buyout by the Big 3. Seems like it could be a better way to expand than building new resorts. Could international systems like DiVi and Anatara might be targets as well?

I also wonder what MVC will do with Hyatt (along with the newly acquired Welk). Will they keep them and let them sit? Will they sell them to an outside company and become the Big 4? I couldn’t tell you what is going on with Hyatt but it seems they are just out there in their own.


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## Eric B (Jan 9, 2022)

dayooper said:


> Think of some of the non brand affiliated no tell motels. Those dive places would rank below the ones you listed!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Holiday Inn is another hotel brand one; I've never been to one of those and have no idea whether they've been growing or not.  Don't think they'd be bought up by the Big 3 due to the branding issue.


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## GT75 (Jan 9, 2022)

dayooper said:


> also wonder what MVC will do with Hyatt (along with the newly acquired Welk). Will they keep them and let them sit? Will they sell them to an outside company and become the Big 4?


I thought that MVC was spinning off Hyatt.    I could also be dreaming again.    It is hard for me to stay current on HGVC and HC.


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## dioxide45 (Jan 9, 2022)

GT75 said:


> I thought that MVC was spinning off Hyatt.    I could also be dreaming again.    It is hard for me to stay current on HGVC and HC.


People here mentioned that as possibility, but no mention of that from Marriott Vacations Worldwide.


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## dayooper (Jan 9, 2022)

Eric B said:


> Holiday Inn is another hotel brand one; I've never been to one of those and have no idea whether they've been growing or not.  Don't think they'd be bought up by the Big 3 due to the branding issue.



I agree and that’s why I left them out. I know nothing of their system other than they bought out Silverleaf (I think that’s what it’s called). Are they on par with BlueGreen?

I also wonder about Wastegate and when that family will want to sell off. If I understand the situation, the system is very very consumer unfriendly but they have some very nice resorts. Isn’t there a ski property that is very nice?


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## youppi (Jan 9, 2022)

Eric B said:


> Does it seem a bit odd to anyone else that the lowest bin on the scale is Midscale?  Hadn't really thought about it until @youppi listed the full scale by name.


You are right. There is a 6th scale in hotel called Economy as per the following links but Hilton didn't show it in their presentation








						A Primer to Hotel Brands and Chain Scales
					

Real estate investors love putting assets into quality buckets. Big Four CRE assets follow an ABC classification, where A is the highest…




					medium.com
				





			https://www.hotelnewsnow.com/Media/Default/Images/chainscales.pdf
		









						Data-Driven Solutions Empowering the Hospitality Industry | STR
					

STR sets the standard for data intelligence and global benchmarking, allowing you to compete strategically, plan for the future and understand your customers.




					str.com


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## GT75 (Jan 9, 2022)

Westgate has a very nice looking resort (but haven’t step foot inside) at Park City only 1/2 block from HGVC Sunrise Lodge on Canyon side.


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## dayooper (Jan 9, 2022)

GT75 said:


> Westgate has a very nice looking resort (but haven’t step foot inside) at Park City only 1/2 block from HGVC Sunrise Lodge on Canyon side.



Thats the resort I was thinking of.


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## ljmiii (Jan 9, 2022)

GT75 said:


> I thought that MVC was spinning off Hyatt.    I could also be dreaming again.    It is hard for me to stay current on HGVC and HC.


When Marriott Vacations Worldwide purchased ILG, I remember reading that obtaining a license for the Hyatt name was uncertain and that Hyatt might be renamed, spun off, or perhaps even sold back to Hyatt. But I haven't read anything about it since.


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## Talent312 (Jan 9, 2022)

As "low" as I will go is a Hampton Inn (Hilton) or Fairfield Inn (Marriott).
They're in the low-mid range, like camping, but I'm comfortable there.
.


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## PigsDad (Jan 9, 2022)

Talent312 said:


> As "low" as I will go is a Hampton Inn (Hilton) or Fairfield Inn (Marriott).
> They're in the low-mid range, like camping, but I'm comfortable there.


If you think staying in a Hampton Inn is "like camping", I think you and I have a dramatically different definition of "camping".    






*vs.*






Kurt


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## 90_Min_Sales_Pitch (Jan 9, 2022)

We won't stay any lower than Hilton Garden Inn, if we can avoid it.  Hampton Inns are adequate, just don't care for the beds.

Fairfield, we've done it once, which was the last straw in transitioning to Hilton.  

We had a 4 night stay booked at Fairfield in Peachtree City, GA, that was accidentally cancelled at checking.  They created 2 new bookings, Mon - Wed, and Tues - Sat.  The manager accused me of lying about leaving on Friday, and said that the now double booked Wednesday would take care of itself in the system.  IT created a 4th booking, mimicking my original, but the manager changed her mind about cancelling the other flawed bookings, hanging up on IT.  "She doesn't want to talk to me anymore, can you try and convince her?"  It took 6 weeks, over a dozen phone calls, to finally get it all straightened out.


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## sfwilshire (Jan 10, 2022)

Talent312 said:


> As "low" as I will go is a Hampton Inn (Hilton) or Fairfield Inn (Marriott).
> They're in the low-mid range, like camping, but I'm comfortable there.
> .



Some of the Hampton Inns are very nice, but I recall one in the Nashville area that was definitely not up to Hilton standards. Always a risk with Hilton or Marriott franchises. Some are definitely better than others. I also found a stand out Fairfield in Lewisville TX a few years ago after mostly avoiding that Marriott brand.

Sheila


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## dayooper (Jan 10, 2022)

PigsDad said:


> If you think staying in a Hampton Inn is "like camping", I think you and I have a dramatically different definition of "camping".
> 
> 
> 
> ...



For some (ok, the very few that can afford it), this is "Camping"





But for many, this is their version of camping (I have been in a travel trailer just like this one).


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## sfwilshire (Jan 10, 2022)

dayooper said:


> The Hilton Honors app already has some of the DRI resorts loaded but not able to book. They say coming soon and are listed as Hilton Vacation Club. Mystic Dunes in Orlando is one.



We have been Mystic Dunes owners for decades through multiple management and name changes. My only major complaint with Diamond has been the hefty increases in Maintenance fees. I also hoped they would move to RCI or dual affiliation. I don't have the best luck with II. I considered letting my interval go before the HGVC merger was announced, but my week 52 3br unit that sleeps 12 is used at least half the time by my extended family.

I'm looking forward to what I hope are positive changes with this acquisition.

Sheila


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## dayooper (Jan 10, 2022)

sfwilshire said:


> Some of the Hampton Inns are very nice, but I recall one in the Nashville area that was definitely not up to Hilton standards. Always a risk with Hilton or Marriott franchises. Some are definitely better than others. I also found a stand out Fairfield in Lewisville TX a few years ago after mostly avoiding that Marriott brand.
> 
> Sheila



We actually really like the Home2Suite in Lexington Kentucky. It's our stop on the way home from Hilton Head. It's a very well run hotel with nice, big rooms.


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## dayooper (Jan 10, 2022)

sfwilshire said:


> We have been Mystic Dunes owners for decades through multiple management and name changes. My only major complaint with Diamond has been the hefty increases in Maintenance fees. I also hoped they would move to RCI or dual affiliation. I don't have the best luck with II. I considered letting my interval go before the HGVC merger was announced, but my week 52 3br unit that sleeps 12 is used at least half the time by my extended family.
> 
> I'm looking forward to what I hope are positive changes with this acquisition.
> 
> Sheila



It sounds like this is quite the resort and I think that's the reason it was one of the first to be uploaded into the Hilton Hotel system (still can't book it through Hilton Hotels, says it's coming soon). I hope that HGV will keep the MF's at HVC resorts the same or down a bit. From what I understand, the management fees the resorts had to pay were pretty high. Hopefully HGV can upgrade the resort to the new standard and build up your reserves. 

I feel the opposite about the exchange companies. I wish I had access to II through HGVC. Outside of a resort or 2 along the Lake Michigan shore that never have availability when I can go, the only RCI resorts I was interested in were the DVC resorts. Now they are gone and I have no desire to use RCI. If I had access to Hyatt, MVC and Vistana, I might use it more often. I think it's possible that @escanoe may be right in that HGV might use DEX to start their own exchange mechanism. Who knows, but the offerings on RCI I'm interested in are very thin.

I hope you do get some positive changes. I have been very happy with my HGVC purchase. We have had very nice accommodations and the service has been first rate. They do a great job at keeping MF's reasonable (I pay $2240 all in for my 2 platinum weeks and club dues) so I'm hoping they do the same for you all.


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## ocdb8r (Jan 10, 2022)

dayooper said:


> We actually really like the Home2Suite in Lexington Kentucky. It's our stop on the way home from Hilton Head. It's a very well run hotel with nice, big rooms.



Yes - not necessarily the best use of certificates, but I am a big fan of Homewood and Home2 Suites (I prefer the Homewood for the slightly better breakfast and occasional afternoon drinks/snacks reception. However, the main reason is just being spoiled with the extra space and kitchen a timeshare offers (which Homewood and Home2 offer as well).


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## PigsDad (Jan 10, 2022)

dayooper said:


> For some (ok, the very few that can afford it), this is "Camping"
> 
> But for many, this is their version of camping (I have been in a travel trailer just like this one).


I'd label both of those "Glamping", but that's just me.   

Kurt


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## dayooper (Jan 10, 2022)

PigsDad said:


> I'd label both of those "Glamping", but that's just me.
> 
> Kurt



LOL, yes, that's glamping. Before we started down the HGVC path, we explored glamping. We rented a trailer and spent a week at a state park. It was fine for me, but most of the family struggled with the accommodations. It was too cramped and the wife is very much a city /suburban girl and had issues with the bed. Maybe if we stayed in a better trailer, things might have been different. It was a lower level Forest River brand (I can't remember the exact line) with no slide and a tiny sofa bed in the main area. If we had stayed in a Grand Design Imagine like my good friend has (the 2nd picture I posted), we may have bought one. 

I'm actually happy the way things turned out as we love traveling in our HGVC accommodations. It fits my families personality much better than a travel trailer. It has crossed my mind to buy a smaller trailer so I can take my youngest places. He really enjoyed the trip and wants to do go camping more often.


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## travelplus (Jan 16, 2022)

Our Family owns at the Sedona Summit and Scottsdale Villa Mirage.  One option may be is to keep the Diamond Moniker and name it Diamond By Hilton Grand Vacations just like Hampton inn, Embassy Suites, Homewood Suites etc.


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## dayooper (Jan 16, 2022)

travelplus said:


> Our Family owns at the Sedona Summit and Scottsdale Villa Mirage.  One option may be is to keep the Diamond Moniker and name it Diamond By Hilton Grand Vacations just like Hampton inn, Embassy Suites, Homewood Suites etc.



I think they want to be as far away from that name as possible. In a presentation to the HOA’s, they said they were “sunsetting” the Diamond brand.


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## pedro47 (Jan 16, 2022)

dayooper said:


> I think they want to be as far away from that name as possible. In a presentation to the HOA’s, they said they were “sunsetting” the Diamond brand.


What is the official word from Hilton CEO ?


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## dayooper (Jan 16, 2022)

pedro47 said:


> What is the official word from Hilton CEO ?



Not sure, but the presentation was shared here and on the Facebook groups.


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## sfwilshire (Jan 16, 2022)

dayooper said:


> It sounds like this is quite the resort and I think that's the reason it was one of the first to be uploaded into the Hilton Hotel system (still can't book it through Hilton Hotels, says it's coming soon). I hope that HGV will keep the MF's at HVC resorts the same or down a bit. From what I understand, the management fees the resorts had to pay were pretty high. Hopefully HGV can upgrade the resort to the new standard and build up your reserves.
> 
> I feel the opposite about the exchange companies. I wish I had access to II through HGVC. Outside of a resort or 2 along the Lake Michigan shore that never have availability when I can go, the only RCI resorts I was interested in were the DVC resorts. Now they are gone and I have no desire to use RCI. If I had access to Hyatt, MVC and Vistana, I might use it more often. I think it's possible that @escanoe may be right in that HGV might use DEX to start their own exchange mechanism. Who knows, but the offerings on RCI I'm interested in are very thin.
> 
> I hope you do get some positive changes. I have been very happy with my HGVC purchase. We have had very nice accommodations and the service has been first rate. They do a great job at keeping MF's reasonable (I pay $2240 all in for my 2 platinum weeks and club dues) so I'm hoping they do the same for you all.



It's good that we all have different tastes. For the last few years, II seldom made units available to me in the locations we want to vacation. I got some decent exchanges from them for my Gatlinburg weeks in the early years, but not so much for the Mystic Dunes intervals. 

RCI, has pretty consistently through the years had options to a lot of places I want to visit. I have deposits in RCI Weeks and RCI Points, so that expands my options. RCI has also made it easier to extend deposits. I've used the II e-plus a few times, but now the price has increased dramatically for that. 

I've enjoyed the HGVC properties I've stayed in and look forward to exploring more of them in the future.

Happy vacations!

Sheila


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## mitzi (Jan 21, 2022)

Shamelessly stolen from Hilton forum on FlyerTalk:

Hilton Vacation Club Mystic Dunes Orlando, it may open as soon as February 25, 2022.
Hilton Vacation Club Scottsdale Villa Mirage, aiming towards March 4, 2022.
Hilton Vacation Club Sedona Summit, on the way to opening March 18, 2022.

Mentioned earlier:
Hilton Vacation Club The Historic Powhatan Williamsburg, slated for March 11, 2022.


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## pedro47 (Jan 21, 2022)

mitzi said:


> Shamelessly stolen from Hilton forum on FlyerTalk:
> 
> Hilton Vacation Club Mystic Dunes Orlando, it may open as soon as February 25, 2022.
> Hilton Vacation Club Scottsdale Villa Mirage, aiming towards March 4, 2022.
> ...


I can not believe The Historic Powhatan @ Williamsburg over Greensprings Vacation Resort in Williamsburg, VA.


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## escanoe (Jan 21, 2022)

pedro47 said:


> I can not believe The Historic Powhatan @ Williamsburg over Greensprings Vacation Resort in Williamsburg, VA.



I thought it was pretty nice if not quite HGVC standards when staying there last fall. It is sure easy to get with discounted points last minute on RCI since the resort fee is so out of whack with the rest of Williamsburg. I only used it for 3 days, so only paid 3 days of the resort fee. Good deal on a 3BR.


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## trippka (Jan 23, 2022)

GT75 said:


> Westgate has a very nice looking resort (but haven’t step foot inside) at Park City only 1/2 block from HGVC Sunrise Lodge on Canyon side.


We have stayed there and won't stay there again. Lots of maintenance issues, and the upholstery was bad enough in our unit that they actually swapped it out with another unit. That was 2021.


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## GT75 (Jan 23, 2022)

trippka said:


> We have stayed there and won't stay there again. Lots of maintenance issues, and the upholstery was bad enough in our unit that they actually swapped it out with another unit.


Wow, that is too bad, because the outside looks great.    Honestly, I wouldn't purchase Westgate with all of the terrible reviews.     But we will be at Sunrise Lodge in less than two weeks.   Just waiting for that snow now.


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## DebbersNJ (Feb 7, 2022)

My husband and I stayed at Pacifica in Cabo last week - A+ rating all around! 

We did do an update meeting because we haven't been on one in years. I'm not 100% sure this is correct, but I'll do my best to share what we were told.

A new form of membership will be available to purchase soon in HGV MAX that will allow HGVC owners to access two other classes of Hilton timeshare brands: (1) BY HILTON CLUB (BYC) which will house the higher end properties which may become difficult for HGVC owners to access otherwise (these sites are already considered by staff to be 'by Hilton', such as in NY, Cabo, HI, etc) and (2) 'Hilton Vacation Club' which will be the Diamond properties. 

HGV MAX ownership includes (some?) access to HGVC, BH and HVC.

The new program is to launch on 4/1/22.

I also understood that any ownership at a BH resort will provide entre to HGV MAX when it is launched, as long as BH owners accept the option to enroll in the benefits of HGV MAX which will be offered for a limited amount of time, with no additional ownership purchase required. 

We were not told what kind of access HGVC owners would have at the launch or whether owners in that class would need to make a purchase or not to access HGV MAX. But according to the letter I quote below, it looks as though all _new_ HGVC owners will be provided with this offer (at least those who buy between 1/15/22, according to our rep, and the time of launch which is planned for April 1st).

We were asked to sign a paper that says:

"Thank you for purchasing with Hilton Grand Vacations. We are excited you have decided to become a part of our growing family."

"As you may be aware, HGV recently acquired Diamond Resorts International, Inc and is considering ways to integrate the two companies' product offerings."

"We are presently working on a new program that we plan to call HGV MAX. Although we can't commit to any details or otherwise offer the program today, the general concept would be that through HGV MAX, members would ultimately have access to approximately 150 resorts in the future as we transition Diamond properties to Hilton branded properties along with Hilton Honors membership and select travel benefits available through the Hilton network. At this time, however, the companies' products remain separate and there is no assurance that such future benefits may be available, Accordingly, no reliance should be made on any oral representation regarding the possibility of future benefits."

"If we launch the proposed new program, we will offer you the option to enroll in the offered benefits for a limited period of time with no additional ownership interest purchase required."

"By signing below, you acknowledge that the decision to purchase today was based solely on the current club benefits described in the exchange program disclosure statement for Hilton Grand Vacations Club provided with your purchase and the public offering statement for the project in which you have purchased."


Furthermore, I am in receipt of the following email from HGVC on February 3, 2022:

Dear Club Member,

*Hilton Grand Vacations will adjust all Points within the Club Member Program on February 24, 2022*. Starting on this day, the Club website, mobile app and Club Partner sites will reflect the newly adjusted totals. If you toured between February 1 and February 24, this was likely discussed during your presentation. However, if you toured prior to February 1, you were likely presented a pre-adjusted Points value.

*What is Hilton Grand Vacations changing?*
With this adjustment, we are changing the number of Points allocated to your vacation ownership interest and the number of Points required to make a reservation. The adjustment will be an increase of 60%. In other words, every 1 Point (including ClubPoints, Bonus Points and Saved Points) will be increased to 1.6 Points.

For example, if your ownership was allocated 5,000 ClubPoints annually before the Points adjustment, the allotment would increase to 8,000 ClubPoints annually, starting February 24, 2022.

Likewise, the number of Points needed to make a reservation will be adjusted by the same 60%. If a reservation required 5,000 ClubPoints on February 23, 2022, that same reservation would require 8,000 ClubPoints starting on February 24, 2022. *Hence, your ability to make reservations using your Points anywhere within the Hilton Grand Vacations Club system stays the same*.

*Why is Hilton Grand Vacations making the Points adjustment?*
Soon after our acquisition of Diamond Resorts, we conducted an analysis of all Club programs. The analysis determined that adjusting ClubPoints, Saved Points and Bonus Points up by 60% creates one consistent, simplified Points scale. This is necessary to operate a centralized reservation system that will give Members a seamless booking experience, as well as set the groundwork for a future membership offering that will provide access to more properties in new markets (once details are finalized, including program costs and fees, we’ll share these with you).

*What does this mean to you?*
Your timeshare ownership interest and access rights remain the same — you’ll be able to make a reservation at a Hilton Grand Vacations property as you do now. Additionally, all ClubPoints allocations and requirements are being adjusted equally. Hence, your ability to make reservations using your Points stays the same.

*Will this impact Hilton Honors Points conversions and ClubPartner Perks?*
Hilton Honors Points conversions will be proportionally adjusted so you receive a commensurate number of Points. The dollar amount per Points converted for ClubPartner Perks also will be adjusted proportionally for each partner.

*How can I learn more?*
We’ve created an online learning path to help you learn more. Visit my.hgv.com/points-adjustment to:


Watch our video tutorials
Review our Frequently Asked Questions
Use our Points Adjustment Calculator to see your new Points total
We appreciate your understanding as we work toward our goal of integrating these two great companies. And we look forward to helping you make more fantastic vacation memories in 2022 and beyond!

–Hilton Grand Vacations


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## pedro47 (Feb 8, 2022)

So all Diamond owners will receive this newsletter.?


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## Talent312 (Feb 8, 2022)

It looks like HGVC plans to upsell each set of owners the right of access to the other.
They stand to rake in millions by convincing us that we need to fork over $$ to get it.

DRi owners should be asking, "How much am I willing to pay for access to the club?"

Any mixing of the memberships will result in greater competition each other's resorts.
We'll soon find ourselves rubbing elbows with DRI folk... I may need to dress better.


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## geist1223 (Feb 8, 2022)

We are DRI Owners. At this time no inerest in the up sale to use HGVC.


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## dayooper (Feb 8, 2022)

Talent312 said:


> HGV stands to rake in millions by upselling each set owners access to the other.
> 
> DRi owners should be asking, "How much will I need to pay for access to the club?"
> Also, "Will I get H-Honors convertibility and silver status, like HGV owners?
> ...



As long as we still get our booking advantage, HGVC members should be fine. Same with DRI owners. This new membership should not interfere with what we bought. We will see how good of word Mark Wang has. He has continuously said that we will see no disruptions in our purchased rights.


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## BingoBangoBongo (Feb 8, 2022)

DebbersNJ said:


> My husband and I stayed at Pacifica in Cabo last week - A+ rating all around!
> 
> We did do an update meeting because we haven't been on one in years. I'm not 100% sure this is correct, but I'll do my best to share what we were told.
> 
> ...


*
(My bolding in orig message) *

That is the first I have heard of this.  What were they trying to get you to buy?  Would it happen to be a bHC deed?


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## dayooper (Feb 8, 2022)

DebbersNJ said:


> My husband and I stayed at Pacifica in Cabo last week - A+ rating all around!
> 
> We did do an update meeting because we haven't been on one in years. I'm not 100% sure this is correct, but I'll do my best to share what we were told.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the report!

What do you own now? Do you own HGVC or Hilton Club? If they were trying to get you to upgrade to or purchase a Hilton Club deed when you currently own an HGVC deed, they are just putting a spin on the grandfathering of any new purchase made after 1-14-2022 into the HGV Max. Any purchase from Hilton Club or HGVC will be able to be enrolled with no new cost. I think any DRI purchased during this time will be grandfathered in as well, but I'm not sure.

If they weren't trying to get you to purchase a Hilton Club deed, than that is different than what has been said in other presentations.

On a side note, there seems to be some consistencies in the sales presentation reports.


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## Bxian (Feb 10, 2022)

I wonder how this will impact high demand HGVC resorts (such as those on Marco Island)?  They are not "ByHilton" resorts, but are high demand locations.


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## Mongoose (Feb 17, 2022)

mitzi said:


> Shamelessly stolen from Hilton forum on FlyerTalk:
> 
> Hilton Vacation Club Mystic Dunes Orlando, it may open as soon as February 25, 2022.
> Hilton Vacation Club Scottsdale Villa Mirage, aiming towards March 4, 2022.
> ...


I noticed these say Hilton Vacation Club, Not Hilton Grand Vacation Club.  So is this an indicator of it being a different brand?


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## dayooper (Feb 17, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> I noticed these say Hilton Vacation Club, Not Hilton Grand Vacation Club.  So is this an indicator of it being a different brand?



The majority, if not all of the DRI resorts will be rebranded HVC.


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## Mongoose (Feb 18, 2022)

dayooper said:


> The majority, if not all of the DRI resorts will be rebranded HVC.


Well that's confusing!


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## Lodemia (Feb 18, 2022)

My understanding - three tiers, Hilton vacation club, Hilton grand vacation club and a Hilton club (Formerly by Hilton club). Those of use who own HCNY are still on an island of our own it seems.


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## dayooper (Feb 18, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> Well that's confusing!



Yup, the HGV system has always been clear as mud. There are different booking windows for certain different properties. Throw in the Hilton Club, where there are close to as many different booking windows as there are properties, it’s kind of a mess.

The DRI resorts, at least those that will stay with that system, will become Hilton Vacation Club (HVC). How that will look is all speculative, but it seems from what has been said by the executives at HGV that they will keep everything just about the same (trust program, different collections). HGVC will also stay the same with the same booking windows, too. Now throw in the new HGV Max (dumb name if you ask me) and everything will really be muddy.

The one thing that is clear is that the HGVC TUG Community will learn how to maximize any new systems or changes to the systems to our advantage.


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## brp (Feb 18, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> Well that's confusing!



Sort of. Once they roll these in, it will be no more (or less) confusing than it is now, i.e. it will be much the dame. If they *did not* do this, then there would be even more types and even more confusion. So, I'd argue that rolling these in to existing names actually makes it less confusing than it would be if they didn't do that.

Cheers.


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## GT75 (Feb 18, 2022)

What we have previously *heard* is that a few DRI and all former CI/Embarc will be rebranded HGVC.     To me, if they become part of HGVC, then current HGVC members shouldn't have to purchase this new HGV Max program to have access to these resorts.   Also, what will be the booking windows (6 months)?   It will be interesting to see what is rolled out in April.    This is another reason that I wouldn't purchase HGV Max program yet.


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## Eric B (Feb 18, 2022)

GT75 said:


> What we have previously *heard* is that a few DRI and all former CI/Embarc will be rebranded HGVC.     To me, if they become part of HGVC, then current HGVC members shouldn't have to purchase this new HGV Max program to have access to these resorts.   Also, what will be the booking windows (6 months)?   It will be interesting to see what is rolled out in April.    This is another reason that I wouldn't purchase HGV Max program yet.



This seems completely rational to me.  When I sat through a sales presentation in January I asked about that and the fellow just kind of blithered without a good explanation of why I would need to get HGV Max to book HGVC.  I'm definitely waiting, too.


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## GT75 (Feb 18, 2022)

Eric B said:


> When I sat through a sales presentation in January I asked about that and the fellow just kind of blithered without a good explanation of why I would need to get HGV Max to book HGVC.


I didn't think to ask during my owner's update.   I really don't think that the salesperson would have known either.   I think that I know more (*thanks to all of my TUG friends*) than the salesperson about the subject.   The salesperson was actually asking me what I knew about the program.


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## CPNY (Feb 18, 2022)

So have they only announced the 5 resorts being converted to HVC or have there been more in addition to Bent Creek, Scottsdale Villa, Ocean Beach Club, Mystic Dunes, and Flamingo Beach? I guess they deem those resorts Hilton quality?


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## Mongoose (Feb 18, 2022)

GT75 said:


> What we have previously *heard* is that a few DRI and all former CI/Embarc will be rebranded HGVC.     To me, if they become part of HGVC, then current HGVC members shouldn't have to purchase this new HGV Max program to have access to these resorts.   Also, what will be the booking windows (6 months)?   It will be interesting to see what is rolled out in April.    This is another reason that I wouldn't purchase HGV Max program yet.


What is CI, the owners group for Embarc?


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## GT75 (Feb 18, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> What is CI, the owners group for Embarc?


Previously known as Club Intrawest before being brought into DRI as Embarc. HGVC and CI had an exchange agreement during that time.


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## dayooper (Feb 18, 2022)

GT75 said:


> What we have previously *heard* is that a few DRI and all former CI/Embarc will be rebranded HGVC.     To me, if they become part of HGVC, then current HGVC members shouldn't have to purchase this new HGV Max program to have access to these resorts.   Also, what will be the booking windows (6 months)?   It will be interesting to see what is rolled out in April.    This is another reason that I wouldn't purchase HGV Max program yet.



Yeah, I’m not that excited on HGV Max. Maybe a couple of DRI resorts I would like to visit, but few I would want to visit on a regular basis. What‘s the point of purchase if there’s little I would use? CI/Embarc? There‘s more to be excited about with that group.

I agree with the statement on CI/Embarc and a few select properties becoming HGVC that we shouldn’t have to pay any more than we do now.


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## mitzi (Feb 22, 2022)

CPNY said:


> So have they only announced the 5 resorts being converted to HVC or have there been more in addition to Bent Creek, Scottsdale Villa, Ocean Beach Club, Mystic Dunes, and Flamingo Beach? I guess they deem those resorts Hilton quality?



I just did a search on Hilton site - all of U.S., filtered by Hilton Grand Vacation Club.  Those five (no others) are listed as "coming soon".  All Hilton Vacation Club.


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## holdaer (Feb 22, 2022)

Interesting, I tried to search the same as you with United States and HGVC as my filters.

These are the 5 resorts showing up as HVC for me.

*1.* *Hilton Vacation Club Sedona Summit
2.  Hilton Vacation Club Scottsdale Villa Mirage
3.  Hilton Vacation Club The Historic Powhatan Williamsburg
4.  Hilton Vacation Club Mystic Dunes Orlando
5.  Hilton Vacation Club Oceanaire Virginia Beach*


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## dayooper (Feb 22, 2022)

holdaer said:


> Interesting, I tried to search the same as you with United States and HGVC as my filters.
> 
> These are the 5 resorts showing up as HVC for me.
> 
> ...



I got these resorts as well.


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## geist1223 (Feb 22, 2022)

Hilton Vacation Club is what Hilton renamed DRI.


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## Mongoose (Feb 22, 2022)

geist1223 said:


> Hilton Vacation Club is what Hilton renamed DRI.


I’m not sure about that.  More likely it’s the locations that are up to Hilton standards.  They won’t reflag something like the Bell Rock Inn with the Hilton name unless it gets major updates.


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## Talent312 (Feb 23, 2022)

I interpret that as meaning "HVC" will be bookable by Hilton hotel customers...
That doesn't mean they will be bookable thru HGVC w/o the Max feature.
We shall see.
.


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## dayooper (Feb 23, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> I’m not sure about that.  More likely it’s the locations that are up to Hilton standards.  They won’t reflag something like the Bell Rock Inn with the Hilton name unless it gets major updates.



That’s the plan. If I remember correctly, they will upgrade the resorts over the next 5 years, with about 20 being done this year (not sure if this included the Embarc properties).


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## CalGalTraveler (Feb 23, 2022)

Hmm...perhaps renting DRI via the HIlton website (using Hilton points or cash) could be a more cost effective and flexible alternative if they charge more than a nominal fee to join HGV Max. Certainly avoids the annual MF requirement for properties we wish to visit only once.


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## pedro47 (Feb 24, 2022)

holdaer said:


> Interesting, I tried to search the same as you with United States and HGVC as my filters.
> 
> These are the 5 resorts showing up as HVC for me.
> 
> ...


The Historic Powhatan Williamsburg are either one bedroom or two (2) levels timeshare units; excellent grounds maintenance, a security guard post, serval outdoor swimming pools and a historic plantation building onsite.


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## brp (Feb 24, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Hmm...perhaps renting DRI via the HIlton website (using Hilton points or cash) could be a more cost effective and flexible alternative if they charge more than a nominal fee to join HGV Max. Certainly avoids the annual MF requirement for properties we wish to visit only once.



Also a thought. I'm thinking that we would likely visit Kauai and Maui enough to possibly buy a resale at DRI "Hawai'i Collection." We shall see.

Cheers.


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## dayooper (Feb 24, 2022)

brp said:


> Also a thought. I'm thinking that we would likely visit Kauai and Maui enough to possibly buy a resale at DRI "Hawai'i Collection." We shall see.
> 
> Cheers.



Or maybe purchase a resale week and avoid the higher MF's and program fees?


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## brp (Feb 24, 2022)

dayooper said:


> Or maybe purchase a resale week and avoid the higher MF's and program fees?



I was suggesting resale. Or is a "resale week" something different than a regular resale purchase for DRI in terms of MFs and fees?

I only know HGVC and DVC in detail and there one purchases a "week" resale but it's really points and there is no distinction in terms of MFs and fees.

Cheers.


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## dayooper (Feb 24, 2022)

brp said:


> I was suggesting resale. Or is a "resale week" something different than a regular resale purchase for DRI in terms of MFs and fees?
> 
> I only know HGVC and DVC in detail and there one purchases a "week" resale but it's really points and there is no distinction in terms of MFs and fees.
> 
> Cheers.



There are legacy weeks that are on the resale market for many of the resorts, especially the more popular place (like Kauai and Maui). They aren't in "The Club" and can't trade points, but if you like one of the two resorts, they might be a better fit. DRI has very high MF's and program fees. @dougp26364 has mentioned the fees as the reason he left the DRI system. While you still get the higher MF's, you don't pay the large program and system fees club members do. It's like an affiliate resort at HGVC where you use the week like a traditional timeshare (it might be a floating week, though) but don't pay the club dues. At least that's how I think it works.


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## brp (Feb 24, 2022)

dayooper said:


> There are legacy weeks that are on the resale market for many of the resorts, especially the more popular place (like Kauai and Maui). They aren't in "The Club" and can't trade points, but if you like one of the two resorts, they might be a better fit. DRI has very high MF's and program fees. @dougp26364 has mentioned the fees as the reason he left the DRI system. While you still get the higher MF's, you don't pay the large program and system fees club members do. It's like an affiliate resort at HGVC where you use the week like a traditional timeshare (it might be a floating week, though) but don't pay the club dues. At least that's how I think it works.



Got it. Thanks. Yeah, will definitely need to look into that. We'd be very happy to be locked into Maui/Kauai with this purchase. Both have appeal, though, so choosing one may be hard. Also, I expect fee structures to change once things are integrated. And I still think it could work out better than MAX. But not rushing to buy just yet, no matter what the salesweasels say.

Cheers.


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## magmue (Feb 24, 2022)

> is a "resale week" something different than a regular resale purchase for DR


If I understand correctly, DRI "Collections" are based on trust points. Before there were collections, there were deeded weeks. Some owners of weeks converted to the points based collections but not all, and the weeks can be bought and sold resale. We were in Kauai for 2 weeks recently, and had a serious look around at various resorts. After we got home, we ultimately bought a deeded week at Point at Poipu. We likeed it enough to see ourselves going there regularly, and I have a feeling that HVC ownership will be a good thing for the resort.

ETA: I believe there is an exchange system set up within the DRI structure that allows deeded week owners to exchange with each other. And of course there's always II or RCI.


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## NiteMaire (Feb 24, 2022)

We are DRI legacy week owners at the soon to be renamed HVC Sedona Summit.  Legacy week owners can currently exchange into DRI owned/managed/affiliated resorts through an internal exchange system (Destination eXchange).  We are able to see HGVC properties available for exchange; we also see plenty of availability at 2 of the resorts likely be renamed HGVC (Point at Poipu and Kaanapali Beach Club). 
According to the CSR I talked with last week, this access won't change when the systems are integrated.  I realize no one really knows, but we'd be very happy with that especially since we purchased SS to exchange into those 2 properties.  As long as there are deeded units at those properties, I would expect some availability.
My gut tells me we'll still see HGVC availability after the integration; if for no other reason than HGVC getting DRI owners to experience and/or buy into HGVC.  Clearly we'll wait until the new system is rolled out, but, even then, I don't see us purchasing into HGV Max (though you never know). 
I'm not a points owner so I can't comment on that outside of saying points owners also see HGVC availability in DeX.


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## Hubble (Feb 27, 2022)

I "transitioned" out of DRI (Beach Quarters, VA Beach) in 2020, after 5 years.  We had a poor (low TDi) week, and although I managed decent exchanges (Interval) including one "big fish" towards the end (Hyatt, Sedona), there always seemed to be a cloud of uncertainty, largely due to high pressured owners updates to switch to points at a high price.  Just out of curiosity now, can Diamond owners still use Interval?  I have a sense that things would have been difficult for us going forward, but maybe we could have made it work for another year or two.


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## CalGalTraveler (Feb 27, 2022)

@magmue @NiteMaire (or other deeded week owners). What are the MF at Poipu and Sedona for a 2 bdrm unit Platinum Season? Where are the best places to find weekly deed resales?


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## NiteMaire (Feb 27, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> What are the MF at Poipu and Sedona for a 2 bdrm unit Platinum Season?


Sedona Summit 2022 MF: $955.31 excluding ARDA voluntary.  Starting in 2021, the SS BoD voted to include DeX membership in MF.  I own a 2BR LO.  
P@P MF: $1858.92 according to a post by @artringwald.


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## magmue (Feb 27, 2022)

> Where are the best places to find weekly deed resales?


We bought via RedWeek.  The transfer process is slow (and expensive!), but per our request our seller booked a 2022 week for us the week after Thanksgiving. 

At the time we bought (early January), there were 3 units listed, two pending with list price $800 - $2,000. We made an offer on the active listing, which was listed significantly higher, and were accepted. 

There are currently 5 units listed there asking from $1,500 to $7,400. That high end one is by a realtor who says she is a licensed agent with Bay Realty in Hawaii. She also says this "_All rooms are eventually going to be updated and resort will be a Hilton branded property by this summer_." Take that with several grains of salt, but clearly there is optimism.


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## Mongoose (Feb 27, 2022)

NiteMaire said:


> We are DRI legacy week owners at the soon to be renamed HVC Sedona Summit.  Legacy week owners can currently exchange into DRI owned/managed/affiliated resorts through an internal exchange system (Destination eXchange).  We are able to see HGVC properties available for exchange; we also see plenty of availability at 2 of the resorts likely be renamed HGVC (Point at Poipu and Kaanapali Beach Club).
> According to the CSR I talked with last week, this access won't change when the systems are integrated.  I realize no one really knows, but we'd be very happy with that especially since we purchased SS to exchange into those 2 properties.  As long as there are deeded units at those properties, I would expect some availability.
> My gut tells me we'll still see HGVC availability after the integration; if for no other reason than HGVC getting DRI owners to experience and/or buy into HGVC.  Clearly we'll wait until the new system is rolled out, but, even then, I don't see us purchasing into HGV Max (though you never know).
> I'm not a points owner so I can't comment on that outside of saying points owners also see HGVC availability in DeX.


It might be a little like Worldmark and Wyndham.  I bought a WM on resale.  I can see all the Wyndham locations, but I can't view availability or book them without an "Upgrade".


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## Mongoose (Feb 27, 2022)

NiteMaire said:


> Sedona Summit 2022 MF: $955.31 excluding ARDA voluntary.  Starting in 2021, the SS BoD voted to include DeX membership in MF.  I own a 2BR LO.
> P@P MF: $1858.92 according to a post by @artringwald.


How do you like Sedona Summit?  I have looked at it off an on over the years, but was turned off by DRI.  I purchased Hyatt Pinion Pointe instead, but SS looks like a nice resort.


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## NiteMaire (Feb 27, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> It might be a little like Worldmark and Wyndham.  I bought a WM on resale.  I can see all the Wyndham locations, but I can't view availability or book them without an "Upgrade".


While we won't know until April, I doubt this will be the case.  We can currently see availability and *book* HGVC resorts. Call me foolish, but I think it'll continue to be the case in the future. I think inventory will (continue) be limited, but we can travel anytime so I'm not worried about it from that perspective.


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## NiteMaire (Feb 27, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> How do you like Sedona Summit? I have looked at it off an on over the years, but was turned off by DRI. I purchased Hyatt Pinion Pointe instead, but SS looks like a nice resort.


We haven't ever been there!  DD loves Sedona and some colleagues own SS and love it.  When we were looking to add another, we decided to try DRI.  Our main purpose was to get a trader we may visit occasionally.  SS fit the bill.  Every owner I've talked to really likes/loves it.  @cindyc can provide more info. 
I had the same reservations about DRI, but so far the experience has been good.  We stayed at KBC (rented from owner), and thoroughly enjoyed it.  We didn't want the MF associated with KBC (and Point at Poipu) so we purchased a unit that gave us the ability to trade into those resorts.  DeX has plenty of availability at both resorts...including whale watching season!  Based on how DRI sets trading value for units ("tiers"), SS offered the least expensive means of trading into those resorts so we purchased.
Depending on how the integration affects availability (or not) in DeX, SS will be on our list if we decide to purchase another TS.  We own a 2BR LO so we can deposit each portion of the LO for a week.  Prior to the recent increase in exchange fees, we could get 2 weeks at P@P for ~$100 more than 1 week MF there.  It'll cost more than that now.  Granted we don't have the flexibility of P@P owners in terms of booking, but there was plenty of availability that we could book.
SS will be in the first group rebranded HVC so HGVC/Hilton decided it met a certain level of Hilton quality.


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## escanoe (Feb 27, 2022)

NiteMaire said:


> While we won't know until April, I doubt this will be the case.  We can currently see availability and *book* HGVC resorts. Call me foolish, but I think it'll continue to be the case in the future. I think inventory will (continue) be limited, but we can travel anytime so I'm not worried about it from that perspective.



The HGVC inventory available now to Diamond owners trading through Destination EXchange (DEX) is there because of the DEX tie-in to RCI. The inventory in DEX should be the same as what is available in RCI Weeks.

If anything, the merger should improve access to HGVC properties through DEX. I would not be surprised/hope to eventually see HGVC owners also have the opportunity to use DEX. If that happens, it would improve DEX as a bridge between current Diamond resorts and HGVC.


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## cindyc (Feb 27, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> How do you like Sedona Summit?  I have looked at it off and on over the years but was turned off by DRI.  I purchased Hyatt Pinion Pointe instead, but SS looks like a nice resort.


Hello @Mongoose! I am the person NiteMaire mentioned and we own 3 deeded weeks at SS.   Feel free to ask anything specific you have questions about. 

I personally love the Sedona Summit.  It is close to great hiking and mountain biking and some units have great scenery.  The wifi is terrible.  But if you are here to unwind and enjoy the outdoors, that won't matter too much.  The Sedona Summit is in the section of town called West Sedona which has the grocery stores and less traffic than the other resorts. 

One thing to know about SS is that the resort is divided into three sections.  The first part developed is the Summit and is made up of buildings 1 - 21; exchanging here costs the fewest number of points and the units are a little dated (ie pink cultured marble shell-shaped sinks!), but they have updated the soft furnishings recently.  The next section is Mesa, buildings 22 - 31 and the final section is Sunset, buildings 32-37.   Sunset costs the most number of points and the units are more updated, but I personally find the furnishings too dark and don't care for the layout which is rather cave-like.  I don't think the extra points are worth it for the Mesa and Sunset sections.

However, you may want to use the file I have attached which is a list of rooms with a view provided to me by the front desk.  I have highlighted the ones I personally think will have the best view, although the only ones I have actually been in are the ones in building 21, which are in the Summit section but actually have a bit of a view.  When you make your reservation or sometime before you arrive, let the front desk know if you have a room or building preference.  They cannot always honor it, but I do find that they try.


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## californiarob (Apr 5, 2022)

So from what I can tell, HGVC and Diamond will still technically be separate until enough owners upgrade to HGVC MAX... And/or HGVC sells enough new "points packages in the HGVC MAX trust.... Very disappointed that HGVC was selling the Diamond acquisition as growth i properties that owners will have access to yet, even those that upgraded last year are being required to upgrade again if you want to participate in the MAX program opening up the soon to be rebranded Diamond properties.... I imagine that Diamond owners will have some expenses to bring many of the resorts up to Hilton standards.... I told them to suck wind during my presentation. They sold the Diamond acquisition as something we would have access to last year. But. NOOOO.... Only of you give us more money.... Even at HGVC Elite status.... Even after upgrading less than a year ago.... HGVC and Diamond owners alike should push back hard on this.... Tell them what you think!!!!!


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## pedro47 (Apr 5, 2022)

If Hilton force Diamond management to use the MF collected  correctly and purchased quality linens, soft goods and appliances their should be little needs to increase MF from Diamond Resorts Owners. In other words  stop Diamond upper management from collecting a small portions of all MF collected.

This was a inside statement from a former upper management person in Vegas.


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## GT75 (Apr 5, 2022)

californiarob said:


> So from what I can tell, HGVC and Diamond will still technically be separate until enough owners upgrade to HGVC MAX.


I think that legally, the two TS (really DRI even has more than one because CI/Embarc is separate from DRI) will always be separate.   HGVC Max just allows some ability to book the left-over inventory in the other system (IMO).   I believe that some exchange program could have been utilized (ie, DeX) but that wouldn't have generated sales.


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## Mongoose (Apr 5, 2022)

californiarob said:


> So from what I can tell, HGVC and Diamond will still technically be separate until enough owners upgrade to HGVC MAX... And/or HGVC sells enough new "points packages in the HGVC MAX trust.... Very disappointed that HGVC was selling the Diamond acquisition as growth i properties that owners will have access to yet, even those that upgraded last year are being required to upgrade again if you want to participate in the MAX program opening up the soon to be rebranded Diamond properties.... I imagine that Diamond owners will have some expenses to bring many of the resorts up to Hilton standards.... I told them to suck wind during my presentation. They sold the Diamond acquisition as something we would have access to last year. But. NOOOO.... Only of you give us more money.... Even at HGVC Elite status.... Even after upgrading less than a year ago.... HGVC and Diamond owners alike should push back hard on this.... Tell them what you think!!!!!


There is no free lunch, especially in timesharing.  The opportunity is to grow via joining HGVMax for another $7K+.  It may or may not be worth it.  The old adage of buy where you want to go still appies.  I own The Bay Club in HI and still have not decided if its worth it for me to join HGVC.


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## letsgobobby (Apr 6, 2022)

GT75 said:


> I think that legally, the two TS (really DRI even has more than one because CI/Embarc is separate from DRI) will always be separate.   HGVC Max just allows some ability to book the left-over inventory in the other system (IMO).   I believe that some exchange program could have been utilized (ie, DeX) but that wouldn't have generated sales.


Exactly and in those terms, why would I pay a substantial fee to book leftovers? Especially when there is no real contractual value, it could be changed unilaterally at any time?

If I really want Zihua or Whistler, I'll rent or I'll buy at those locations. In the meantime, my HGVC deeds haven't yet been materially hurt by the changes. If inventory gets eaten up between 10 and 9 months HGVC will cease to be useful to me and I will cease to be a member.


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## brp (Apr 6, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> The old adage of buy where you want to go still appies.  I own The Bay Club in HI and still have not decided if its worth it for me to join HGVC.



I definitely agree with our W. 57th purchase. Our Vegas points to use in Hawaii...maybe not so much  But we know it's a risk.

With our DVC, for example, we own the resorts we want to frequent and book at 11 months.

Cheers.


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## eleigh (May 7, 2022)

We own a deeded (floating) week with Diamond at Lake Tahoe Vacation Resort. Have not heard anything about anything changing for weeks owners. No HVC max info or attempt to concert/up sell to points. When I get emails from Diamond they say HGVC…. Do you think we will need to buy points/join HVG max to get access to any Hilton properties? Thoughts???


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## dioxide45 (May 7, 2022)

eleigh said:


> We own a deeded (floating) week with Diamond at Lake Tahoe Vacation Resort. Have not heard anything about anything changing for weeks owners. No HVC max info or attempt to concert/up sell to points. When I get emails from Diamond they say HGVC…. Do you think we will need to buy points/join HVG max to get access to any Hilton properties? Thoughts???


Exactly how it will work, is not fully known. I would fully expect you will have to buy something to get access to HGV resorts.


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## NiteMaire (May 7, 2022)

eleigh said:


> Have not heard anything about anything changing for weeks owners. No HVC max info or attempt to concert/up sell to points. When I get emails from Diamond they say HGVC…. Do you think we will need to buy points/join HVG max to get access to any Hilton properties?


Short answer:  Yes.  Deeded owners (and resale points owners) are not eligible for HGV Max.  I can't find it at the moment, but it was in one of the documents HGV released.  I'll continue to look for it and update this post if I find it.

There's HGVC inventory already in DeX; there's a chance it will increase, but I'm not holding my breath.


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## pedro47 (May 7, 2022)

NiteMaire said:


> Short answer:  Yes.  Deeded owners (and resale points owners) are not eligible for HGV Max.  I can't find it at the moment, but it was in one of the documents HGV released.  I'll continue to look for it and update this post if I find it.
> 
> There's HGVC inventory already in DeX; there's a chance it will increase, but I'm not holding my breath.


They are Diamond deeded owner, that are The DRI Club Members with over 50,000 points and have fully pay off their timeshare resort.

What are their status?


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## eleigh (May 7, 2022)

NiteMaire said:


> Short answer:  Yes.  Deeded owners (and resale points owners) are not eligible for HGV Max.  I can't find it at the moment, but it was in one of the documents HGV released.  I'll continue to look for it and update this post if I find it.
> 
> There's HGVC inventory already in DeX; there's a chance it will increase, but I'm not holding my breath.


Thank you for the information. We are thinking about trying to sell our ownership, but want to know what options there are to go to Hilton properties before we decide.


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## Mongoose (May 7, 2022)

NiteMaire said:


> Short answer:  Yes.  Deeded owners (and resale points owners) are not eligible for HGV Max.  I can't find it at the moment, but it was in one of the documents HGV released.  I'll continue to look for it and update this post if I find it.
> 
> There's HGVC inventory already in DeX; there's a chance it will increase, but I'm not holding my breath.


I can understand resale, but not including deeded owners is a new low for them.


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## Mongoose (May 7, 2022)

eleigh said:


> Thank you for the information. We are thinking about trying to sell our ownership, but want to know what options there are to go to Hilton properties before we decide.


What do you MFs look like, unit size and season?


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## NiteMaire (May 7, 2022)

pedro47 said:


> The DRI Club Members with over 50,000 points and have fully pay off their timeshare resort.


Just like on the HGVC side, if purchased between January 14th - April 3rd, they'll be able to opt-in.  If on/after April 4th, then they will be in HGV Max.  If prior to January 14th, there's no firm direction.  It appears they are working a way to pay a fee to join HGV Max.  $7K was previously mentioned (at least on the HGVC side), but I don't know if that is current/accurate.


eleigh said:


> Thank you for the information. We are thinking about trying to sell our ownership, but want to know what options there are to go to Hilton properties before we decide.


If you check in DeX, you'll see some HGVC inventory.  We used DeX to exchange into The Grand Islander by HGVC in April.  While HGVC inventory appears in DeX, it's very limited at the moment.

ETA: I'm still of the opinion that it's best to purchase a resale unit in the other Club if you already own in one.  Sure, you don't get certain benefits, but the buy-in cost outweighs them in my opinion.  I'm in the same boat as you.  If I decide I really want access to HGVC resorts, I'll buy a resale unit.  I doubt that I will so I will be at the mercy of DeX inventory to get to HGVC units.


Mongoose said:


> I can understand resale, but not including deeded owners is a new low for them.


I think it's because they are using THE Club (and HGVC) inventory for HGV Max.  Since deeded owners aren't in THE Club, it's not possible to participate.


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## eleigh (May 7, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> What do you MFs look like, unit size and season?


2 bed lock off. Any time of the year. MF 1360 for 2023. We have booked ski week for the last 10 years no problem.


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## pedro47 (May 7, 2022)

NiteMaire said:


> Just like on the HGVC side, if purchased between January 14th - April 3rd, they'll be able to opt-in.  If on/after April 4th, then they will be in HGV Max.  If prior to January 14th, there's no firm direction.  It appears they are working a way to pay a fee to join HGV Max.  $7K was previously mentioned (at least on the HGVC side), but I don't know if that is current/accurate.
> 
> If you check in DeX, you'll see some HGVC inventory.  We used DeX to exchange into The Grand Islander by HGVC in April.  While HGVC inventory appears in DeX, it's very limited at the moment.
> 
> ...


Correction . They are fully paid deeded owners, that are in the DRI The Club.


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## Mongoose (May 7, 2022)

eleigh said:


> 2 bed lock off. Any time of the year. MF 1360 for 2023. We have booked ski week for the last 10 years no problem.


For DRI that seems very reasonable.


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## rcing (May 13, 2022)

I'm new to this forum and had my Owner's Meeting yesterday. Unfortunately, they didn't give me any paper. They were vague and very much like a Diamond meeting. They were selling a conversion package that I was told was a minimum. They had most of my accout numbers wrong, greatly inflated. When I told they said these are the numbers in the system. In the end, it didn't matter. I had 2 choices: 1) Join HGV for $26,500 and I would have no maintenance fees and they would convert my points. I would be Hilton Gold and have access to everything I could imagine (my editorialzing). 
2) Stay where I am and watch my choices of properties reduce over time and watch maintenance fees grow faster than they ever have. 
Just to make it interesting, if I didn't take the HGV choice that day, it would go to something like $67,000. I guess I will wait for the class action suit.


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## Mongoose (May 13, 2022)

rcing said:


> I'm new to this forum and had my Owner's Meeting yesterday. Unfortunately, they didn't give me any paper. They were vague and very much like a Diamond meeting. They were selling a conversion package that I was told was a minimum. They had most of my accout numbers wrong, greatly inflated. When I told they said these are the numbers in the system. In the end, it didn't matter. I had 2 choices: 1) Join HGV for $26,500 and I would have no maintenance fees and they would convert my points. I would be Hilton Gold and have access to everything I could imagine (my editorialzing).
> 2) Stay where I am and watch my choices of properties reduce over time and watch maintenance fees grow faster than they ever have.
> Just to make it interesting, if I didn't take the HGV choice that day, it would go to something like $67,000. I guess I will wait for the class action suit.


Welcome to the forum.  There is a ton of information and links on this site for the merger and HGVMax.  I wouldn't believe much of what you were told.  First, there will always be maintenance fees, otherwise how would the buildings be maintained and renovated.  Second, they have announced that if you have a developer purchase you should be able to join HGVMax in Q3 or Q4 for $7K.  Next, I really doubt your choices will diminish over time.  If you are in the Club, it will remain even if they change the flag out front.  I am a Hilton owner.  Most owners on TUG are wait and see.  It would be unwise to buy now.  What were you supposed to get for your $26K beyond access to HGVC?


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## Nowaker (May 13, 2022)

rcing said:


> no maintenance fees


Not possible.


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## Nowaker (May 13, 2022)

Mongoose said:


> First, there will always be maintenance fees, otherwise how would the buildings be maintained and renovated


Ponzi scheme! Have more people join for a one-time fee of $26,500 till the end of time!


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## Talent312 (May 13, 2022)

rcing said:


> I had 2 choices:
> 1) Join HGV for $26,500 and I would have no maintenance fees and they would convert my points. I would be Hilton Gold and have access to everything I could imagine...
> 2) Stay where I am and watch my choices of properties reduce over time and watch maintenance fees grow faster than they ever have.



How do you know a TS sales-weasel is lying? .. His lips are moving.
Only if its in the contract, would you have standing to sue.
It's never in the contract...
1A. There are no TS's without MF's, nor even full-condo ownership.
1B. "Hilton Gold" refers to HHonors...So, free breakfast at hotels?
2A. Access won't diminish. You'll always have what you have now.
2B. MF's _always_ grow faster than we like... Its a simple fact of TS-life.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (May 13, 2022)

rcing said:


> 2) Stay where I am and watch my choices of properties reduce over time and watch maintenance fees grow faster than they ever have.


This the classic "Fear of Loss" sales strategy. You need to buy more to protect what you already own.

An effective response is to say that you were promised certain benefits when you made your purchase, and now you're telling me that I need to buy more to keep from losing the benefits I was already promised? Why would I want to give my money to a company that is debasing what they sold me before?

It was fun seeing a DRI sales person squirm when I gave him that response.  After telling me in no uncertain terms that I needed to buy more to protect my existing reservation privileges, he insisted that they weren't taking anything away, I would still retain my existing reservation rights.  Then I asked why would I need to buy more to retain my existing reservation rights if they weren't being debased?  It was amusing to hear him trying to talk his way around that for about ten minutes before he finally gave up. 

That was the last time that DRI paired with one of the general sales reps.  Ever since, they've put me with a different sales crew, that deals only with existing owners and is much more low pressure.


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## T-Dot-Traveller (May 14, 2022)

rcing said:


> I'm new to this forum
> and had my Owner's Meeting yesterday.
> Unfortunately, they didn't give me any paper. They were vague and very much like a Diamond meeting.
> They were selling a conversion package that I was told was a minimum. They had most of my accout numbers wrong, greatly inflated. When I told they said these are the numbers in the system. In the end, it didn't matter. I had 2 choices: 1) Join HGV for $26,500 and I would have no maintenance fees and they would convert my points. I would be Hilton Gold and have access to everything I could imagine (my editorialzing).
> ...



Welcome to TUG
A great place to learn how to better use what you already own.

Owners meetings always = sales pitches
TS Sales Pitches always = an offer of  a new alternate vision that will make things wonderful and help you out
[ while simultaneously removing lots of money $$$ -  from your wallet]


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## Hubble (May 19, 2022)

rcing said:


> I'm new to this forum and had my Owner's Meeting yesterday. Unfortunately, they didn't give me any paper. They were vague and very much like a Diamond meeting. They were selling a conversion package that I was told was a minimum. They had most of my accout numbers wrong, greatly inflated. When I told they said these are the numbers in the system. In the end, it didn't matter. I had 2 choices: 1) Join HGV for $26,500 and I would have no maintenance fees and they would convert my points. I would be Hilton Gold and have access to everything I could imagine (my editorialzing).
> 2) Stay where I am and watch my choices of properties reduce over time and watch maintenance fees grow faster than they ever have.
> Just to make it interesting, if I didn't take the HGV choice that day, it would go to something like $67,000. I guess I will wait for the class action suit.



Sounds like the meeting I had in Williamsburg back in 2017 about my VA Beach unit.  We had an offseason week that traded reasonably well on II.  The rep. offered to convert us to points for 17K, saying we'd be paying an MF of over 3K overnight if we passed.  After we refused, they
had us sign a document, and gave us a new offer of 76K that we had to refuse in writing.  Three years later, we did "Transitions".  I could have probably made it work for another year or two, but we got enough out it and are glad to be rid of them.


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