# Westin Kaanapali room question (Deluxe vs Premium)



## thezinfan (Jan 5, 2007)

My wife and I are about to dive into our first timeshare at The Westin Kaananpali ORV. We are looking at the resale market and the one thing i cant figure out is what are the differences between a deluxe and premium room, other than the higher MF. Are they available in all room categories? We are looking at Ocean View.

Thanks

Larry


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## tomandrobin (Jan 5, 2007)

WKORV has a studio that is 400 square feet and an one bedroom prekium villa that is 900 square feet. 


http://www.starwoodvacationownership.com/resorts/westin_kanapali_ocean_resort_villas/villas.jsp


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## Henry M. (Jan 5, 2007)

There are two bedroom lock-offs and Deluxe two bedroom lock-offs. Most units are the standard 2 bedroom lock-offs. The Deluxe ones are all the ocean front corner units which are a little bigger. None of the Ocean View units are deluxe.

When they split the two bedroom lock-off the call the result a One-Bedroom and Studio Premium Villa. I haven't seen a term for the results of splitting the Deluxe units or if you can even buy a 1 BR Deluxe unit. If you can, it will be Ocean Front, not Ocean View.

Be very careful with online ads. I've noticed many are unclear, some owners don't truly know what they are talking about, and sometimes there is no mention of the view (Island/Mountain View, Ocean View and Ocean Front View. The Ocean Front units should have room numbers greater than 2x25 or 3x25, where x corresponds to the floor. I'm not sure what the layout is for building 4.


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## DeniseM (Jan 5, 2007)

At the WKORV, you can buy a 2 bdm. Deluxe lock-off (1 bdm. + studio, 1,550 Sq.Ft.) or a 2 bdm. lock-off (1,400 sq. ft.), or a 1 bdm. premium unit (900 Sq. ft.).  There is also a studio unit, but they do not sell the studios alone - only as part of a 2 bdm.

We have seen 2 bdm. ocean view lock-off's going for as low as $31,000.  The two bedrooms are a good deal if you can afford it, because they are actually 2 separate units joined by a small foyer and you can split them and use them for a 2 week stay, or use one side and exchange the other, or use one side and rent the other.

You are smart to buy resale!


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## DeniseM (Jan 5, 2007)

emuyshondt said:


> None of the Ocean View units are deluxe.



I thought some of the Ocean View corner units were deluxe?

In this post, Nell talks about Island View deluxe - http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showpost.php?p=263794&postcount=5

Are their Island View Deluxe, but not Ocean View deluxe?


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## nell (Jan 5, 2007)

There are OF Deluxe lock-offs, IV deluxe (these are the three corners in bldg. 4-two on the hwy side and the corner where bldgs 1, 3, and 5 meet.  The fourth corner overlooking the public beach is consider an OV deluxe.  Hope this helps.

Another difference in the deluxe and premium lock offs are the balconies on the studio side.  The deluxe actually has a small balcony that you can walk on to with two chairs and a table.


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## DavidnRobin (Jan 5, 2007)

thezinfan said:


> My wife and I are about to dive into our first timeshare at The Westin Kaananpali ORV. We are looking at the resale market and the one thing i cant figure out is what are the differences between a deluxe and premium room, other than the higher MF. Are they available in all room categories? We are looking at Ocean View.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Larry


We own a Deluxe unit (Ocean Front)

The Deluxe units are the corner units - they are larger and and the studio has a true balcony whereas the premium studios do not.  The MFs are much higher.  Because they are on the corners - they have great light since they have window in font and on the sides.  There is wasted space in the entry hallway to the 1Bd side due to the design - we liked this space because it gave us room to put wet/sandy stuff and other things.

Are there Ocean View (OV) Deluxe units at WKORV?  I know that there are Ocean Front (OF) and Island View (IV).  If there are OV Deluxe units - because of the layout of WKORV - there can't be many of them and they will be farther away from the ocean than the OV units. (the front corners - by the ocean - are OF) - so only the other (far) corners of B2 and B3 can be Deluxe OV, and maybe the one corner of B4 (furthest away building).

Other than the studio side of the premium unit not containing a real balcony - I would consider OV Premium over Deluxe.


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## Denise L (Jan 5, 2007)

According to the Building C unit type list, there are six OV Dlx villas: 4103/05 and up to the 6th floor. Not sure if they built any in Buildings A or B, but if they did, they would be closest to the highway on the back corners.


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## nell (Jan 5, 2007)

Denise L said:


> According to the Building C unit type list, there are six OV Dlx villas: 4103/05 and up to the 6th floor. Not sure if they built any in Buildings A or B, but if they did, they would be closest to the highway on the back corners.



Yes that's the corner overlooking the public beach.  From pictures and the live web cam, it looks like the back corners of bldgs 2 and 3 are one bedrooms.  So I believe the only OV deluxe units are in bldg. 4.


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## glenn1000 (Jan 5, 2007)

Denise L said:


> According to the Building C unit type list, there are six OV Dlx villas: 4103/05 and up to the 6th floor. Not sure if they built any in Buildings A or B, but if they did, they would be closest to the highway on the back corners.



I own a 1-bedroom OV deluxe that is listed as 4311. I still don't even know what deluxe means in this category but the room we were assigned this year was a nice unit in the 3 building that was one back from the OF units. It was not part of a 2-bedroom (i.e. no common entry area) but was accessed on its own from the main hall. Does anyone know where the other dedicated 1-bedroom units are located and if "deluxe" really means anything for a 1-bedroom? I haven't been able to figure it out by calling Starwood.


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## DavidnRobin (Jan 5, 2007)

Isn't TUG great?

I just looked at the Owners manual. There are only 6 OV Deluxe units and they are in Building 4 (aka Building C) - this is the back buidling furthest away form the ocean - these units overlook the parking lot, then the public park.

If it were me (knowing what I know now...)  - I would buy 1 week of a 1bd premium OV (81K SOs) - the cost (~$18K) and the MFs (~$1250) would be a lot cheaper - and you wouldn't have to deal with the studio-side.


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## DavidnRobin (Jan 5, 2007)

glenn1000 said:


> I own a 1-bedroom OV deluxe that is listed as 4311. I still don't even know what deluxe means in this category but the room we were assigned this year was a nice unit in the 3 building that was one back from the OF units. It was not part of a 2-bedroom (i.e. no common entry area) but was accessed on its own from the main hall. Does anyone know where the other dedicated 1-bedroom units are located and if "deluxe" really means anything for a 1-bedroom? I haven't been able to figure it out by calling Starwood.



Hey Glenn - from the Owners Handbook- 4311 is in Building 4 and is listed as a 1bd OV (and is not listed as Deluxe. The 2bd OV Deluxe units in B4 are 4x03/05 - and Deluxe units are not sold separately (they are deeded together).  So this is very interesting...  Perhaps this is why you ended up in a 1Bd OV premium in Building 3?  It is the same 'View' type that an owner is guaranteed if they call before the 8-month point (IF AVAILABLE - added).

From the Owners handbook -
The 1Bd OV units in B2 (for floors 2-6) are 2x01, 2x03, 2x24, and 2x25 (with 2124 and 2125 on the 1st Floor)
The 1Bd OV units in B3 (for floors 2-6) are 3x00, 3x02, 3x24, and 3x25 (with 3102, 3124 and 3125 on the 1st Floor)
The 1Bd OV units in B4 (for floors 2-6) are 4x11 and 4x13 (with none on the 1st floor)

These are all Premium layouts.  There are no Deluxe layout 1Bd units - they are all 2Bd LOs and are located on the corners of the buildings.

QFT


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## Denise L (Jan 5, 2007)

glenn1000 said:


> I own a 1-bedroom OV deluxe that is listed as 4311. I still don't even know what deluxe means in this category but the room we were assigned this year was a nice unit in the 3 building that was one back from the OF units. It was not part of a 2-bedroom (i.e. no common entry area) but was accessed on its own from the main hall. Does anyone know where the other dedicated 1-bedroom units are located and if "deluxe" really means anything for a 1-bedroom? I haven't been able to figure it out by calling Starwood.



My guess is that the word "Deluxe" in the case of the 1 bedroom OVs was used to spice up the description of the 1 bedrooms  . I believe that Starwood only sold 1 bedrooms or 2 bedroom lock-offs. In looking at the villa floorplan for a 1 bedroom, it is approximately 950 square feet. I don't think Deluxe means much in this case, except that if you book early, you may get a dedicated 1 bedroom instead of the one with the shared lock-off entryway.


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## thezinfan (Jan 5, 2007)

We are actually looking at the 2bdrm units, and i did notice that the deluxe title was being used on IV units (i didnt look at OF as they are a bit spendy for us.) TUGS is great. Found it today as I was googling "westin kaanapali resale" and it was refered to on another site. I shoulda known there'd be a forum for time-shares too! Thanks for the replies.


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## DavidnRobin (Jan 5, 2007)

I can send the WKORV Owners Handbook (2004) - as a PDF file - to any TUG Member that would like to have it - send me your email as a PM - it is in 3 parts - the largest is ~500KB.


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## nell (Jan 5, 2007)

blujahz said:


> It is the same 'View' type that an owner is guarenteed if they call before the 8-month point.
> 
> QFT



You are guaranteed what you bought between 12-8 months if rooms available for your dates.  Otherwise you wouldn't necessarily get your OF deluxe unit only the OF view.  This would be very important to me as I like having the two balconies.


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## DavidnRobin (Jan 5, 2007)

nell said:


> You are guaranteed what you bought between 12-8 months if rooms available for your dates.  Otherwise you wouldn't necessarily get your OF deluxe unit only the OF view.  This would be very important to me as I like having the two balconies.



You are correct - IF AVAILABLE. I corrected above because this is very important.

The balconies - along with OF - were important to us and why we bought OF Deluxe - although we paid a hefty premium.  This is why I would consider buying two 1Bd OV units - it would have been way cheaper, with about the same MFs.  Of course - we wouldn't have our SWEET OF unit with the great light and the 25 foot balcony - plus the studio side is really nice - next closest to the ocean and pretty good size.


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## nell (Jan 5, 2007)

blujahz said:


> You are correct - IF AVAILABLE.



Isn't that pretty much the status quo unless you have a fixed unit/fixed week.  My point was that it isn't only the view guaranteed in that period.   This becomes very important in the IV units because you have to deal with road noise no matter what, but at least with corner units you also have an ocean view.


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## nell (Jan 5, 2007)

Denise L said:


> My guess is that the word "Deluxe" in the case of the 1 bedroom OVs was used to spice up the description of the 1 bedrooms  . I believe that Starwood only sold 1 bedrooms or 2 bedroom lock-offs. In looking at the villa floorplan for a 1 bedroom, it is approximately 950 square feet. I don't think Deluxe means much in this case, except that if you book early, you may get a dedicated 1 bedroom instead of the one with the shared lock-off entryway.



I think Denise might be on to something here!


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## glenn1000 (Jan 5, 2007)

Denise L said:


> My guess is that the word "Deluxe" in the case of the 1 bedroom OVs was used to spice up the description of the 1 bedrooms  . I believe that Starwood only sold 1 bedrooms or 2 bedroom lock-offs. In looking at the villa floorplan for a 1 bedroom, it is approximately 950 square feet. I don't think Deluxe means much in this case, except that if you book early, you may get a dedicated 1 bedroom instead of the one with the shared lock-off entryway.



Thanks Denise. That makes sense. 

Does anyone have any idea why, if the square footage of the 1-bedroom is the same for all units, the MF on my 1-bedroom are almost the same as on our 2-bedroom IV unit? It was about $1400 this year for the 1-BR and $1500 for the 2-BR. Starwood told me the MF are based on square footage. I was thinking (hoping) that maybe the "deluxe" carried more space but, having been in the unit we were assigned, it seems the same as all the other 1-BR units.


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## Denise L (Jan 5, 2007)

glenn1000 said:


> Thanks Denise. That makes sense.
> 
> Does anyone have any idea why, if the square footage of the 1-bedroom is the same for all units, the MF on my 1-bedroom are almost the same as on our 2-bedroom IV unit? It was about $1400 this year for the 1-BR and $1500 for the 2-BR. Starwood told me the MF are based on square footage. I was thinking (hoping) that maybe the "deluxe" carried more space but, having been in the unit we were assigned, it seems the same as all the other 1-BR units.



Hi Glenn,

Quoting from your previous post on MFs... these were your fees:



> 2-bedroom:
> Master Association Assessment: $86.42
> Apartment Ownership Assessment: $330.50
> Vacation Ownership Assessment: $1,104.63
> ...



Subtracting the higher SVN fee from your 1-bedroom would make it $1299.91. Subtracting the lower SVN fee from your 2-bedroom would make it $1521.55.  

I think that there there is an initial cost for maintenance that is generally standard for any size unit. Then it is only slightly more for cleaning, maintenance, etc. for the larger units, since the initial base cost is already sunk.  I think that the flier/handout that comes with the bills lists the cost for each size villa.

In fact, it appears that if I am reading correctly (it's late, so I could be wrong), they have double charged you for your SVN fees for both intervals? A 1-bedroom is supposed to be $1196.61 + SVN of 103.30 = $1299.91 WITH FEES, not without. A 2-bedroom is supposed to be $1418.25 + SVN of 31.30 = $1449.55 WITH FEES.

According to your numbers, you are being charged $103.30 more for each interval.

I hope I just saved you $206.60!  Otherwise, it's late and I should stop posting :zzz: . If I'm correct, a bottle of wine would be nice, ha ha .


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## glenn1000 (Jan 6, 2007)

Denise L said:


> If I'm correct, a bottle of wine would be nice, ha ha .



I tried to get you over for drinks last month! Next time we're at WKORV together I will insist on it! :whoopie:


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## califgal (Jan 6, 2007)

Here's my 2cents....last time we stayed in #4621.  We bought island view and this was our first stay.  I was expecting a view of the road.  I was shocked when I walked into our room! It was a corner unit.  We had a view over the pool area with the beautiful ocean beyond. ( I thought they goofed and gave us an oceanview unit!)  From the master bdroom window we had the view of the new property next door under construction.  When on the master patio there's a view of the ocean.  We stayed on the 1 bdroom side.  

When we got hime I looked in my resort manual and found the regular units and delux.

When making our reservation this year I requested the same unit # to see what would happen.  I was told that unit was listed as island view, but it was a delux unit, and chances of getting that again are slim to none! So this year I'm really expecting a view of the road!


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## Ken555 (Jan 6, 2007)

I stayed in a "deluxe" unit in building C last year and it was fantastic. HUGE balcony with two recliners and two chairs along with a table and plenty of more room... 

It was an ocean view, overlooking the pool. 

I was told at the time, by sales staff during my 30 min 'update', that I was in a "deluxe" unit which originally cost substantially more then the regular OVs (he showed me the price but I forget the exact amount). 

If you can get one of these units you won't be sorry...


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## DavidnRobin (Jan 6, 2007)

Re: WKORV MFs - SVO/SVN charged the SVN fee twice - so be careful with this.  Likely your WKORV 2007 MF is higher by the amount of the SVN fee because of this.  They said to me over the phone that they were sending out a mailing about this, but we never received it.  There is a TUG thead discussing SVO MFs that is a bit buried now.
http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36341


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## DavidnRobin (Jan 6, 2007)

Re: WKORV Unit types -

There are 7 unit types (deeded) at WKORV with 3 different valuations (sizes) used to determine MFs:
1) *2Bd OF Deluxe* (n=24 in B2/B3), *2Bd OV Deluxe* (n=6 in B4), *2Bd IV Deluxe* (n=18 in B4) :: ~1750sqft [Rel. Valuation per Unit = 71,653.10]

2) *2Bd OF* (n=12 in B2/B3), *2Bd OV* (n=129 in B2/B3, n=6 in B4), *2Bd IV* (n=30 in B4) :: ~1400sqft [Rel. Valuation per Unit = 52,000.00]

3) *1Bd OV* (n=45 in B2/B3, and n=10 in B4) :: ~900sqft [Rel. Valuation per Unit = 43,873.44]

Notes:
- This makes 280 total units by my count - almost 1/2 2Bd OV
- That is 14,560 deeded weeks. Amost $700 million (@ $45-$50K/week)!
- Deeded means that these are what can be sold and registered with Maui County.
- The MFs of one type of unit valuation can be used to calculate the MFs of the other types (w/o SVN fee and ARDA)
- OV can end up being PLV (parking lot view) - so reserve early...
- The 2Bd units are all LO (Lockoff/Lockout) and have a common foyer (~50sqft) with a common foyer door and seperate entrance doors to the 1Bd side and studio side.


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## DavidnRobin (Jan 6, 2007)

So... that is probably more than anyone needs/wants to know about WKORV... :hysterical: 

Does this mean there is more/less value to unit types based on how many there are?  
Plus, difficulty/ease in reserving based on unit type since the owner gets their deeded unit type 8-12 months out?  
If you own a 1Bd OV, of which there are 55 units, do they give you the 1Bd side of the 2Bd OV LO if none are availale when calling in for a particular week?  {that question was for a new tugger...}


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