# [2007] II just suspended my account for renting exchange



## jillandboy

A good exchange popped up this morning and I grabbed it and put it up on vacationtimesharerentals.com.   My girlfriend had rented out a week in Aruba (Marriott) for $1500 w/ 6 weeks advance notice and I thought it would be a fun thing to try.   Next thing I know, in a matter of hours, my account at II was suspended.  I had no idea this was illegal, I mean, they issue guest certificates, right?  

Also-- I'm wondering how they knew it was me; anyone know that?  

Help me out!


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## johnmfaeth

The policy is designed to keep good inventory in the hands of those who deposited equal or better so it is available to them.

RCI has the same restrictions.

It's fairly easy to match up your email address is my guess.

I personally think both trading companies are only out for themselves, but opinions are irrelevent, they go by the membership rules and agreements.

Be careful, you probably lost the use of that week too.


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## jillandboy

Thanks, I'm so spooked.  My friend had great success and that's what gave me the idea.  I really had no clue it was illegal.  Afterall, we can 'rent' it out to friends, etc.  

I agree about the exchange companies taking on blood-sucking attributes (hope that's not too rude for these forums)  we belong to II and RCI-- we're not even going to re-up w/ RCI- we own eoy at the Ron Jon resort and we'll just go there-- we can't get anything good for an exchange.  The exchange fees just go up willy-nilly too. 

They seem to forget that most of us have put out a fortune and we may not see the full return in our lifetimes.


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## philemer

unclewilly said:


> Thanks, I'm so spooked.  My friend had great success and that's what gave me the idea.  I really had no clue it was illegal.  Afterall, we can 'rent' it out to friends, etc.



No, you can't rent it out to friends. Well, I guess you could try.   You can only recover the cost of the Guest Cert. & exchange fee w/RCI. I think II only allows you to recover the Guest Cert. fee.


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## johnmfaeth

Even with friends and relatives, w/RCI it is against the rules to charge more than the guest certificate and exchange fee. Not sure about II.

I understand that some resorts (I think it was a Disney that someone posted here a while ago) actually question guests who show up with Guest Certificates as to whether they had rented it.

The person who answers yes to that one is suddenly homeless for the week.

John

PS. Like the old saying, just because you are paranoid doesn't mean that people are not out to get you


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## BevL

They do issue guest certificates, not renter certificates.  It is in the terms and conditions with II and RCI that you cannot rent out exchanges.  I'm not lecturing you when I say that, it's just how it is, whether we like it or not.

How would they find out it was you?  Possibly by comparing email addresses.  If you stated in the ad that it was an Interval exchange, someone may have reported it to Interval.

In any event, if it's a one-time thing, I'd suggest they will likely reinstate your account but whether you will get your original week that you used for the exchange back, I wouldn't count on that.


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## dougp26364

unclewilly said:


> Thanks, I'm so spooked.  My friend had great success and that's what gave me the idea.  I really had no clue it was illegal.  Afterall, we can 'rent' it out to friends, etc.
> 
> I agree about the exchange companies taking on blood-sucking attributes (hope that's not too rude for these forums)  we belong to II and RCI-- we're not even going to re-up w/ RCI- we own eoy at the Ron Jon resort and we'll just go there-- we can't get anything good for an exchange.  The exchange fees just go up willy-nilly too.
> 
> They seem to forget that most of us have put out a fortune and we may not see the full return in our lifetimes.



Actually, you can't "rent" it out to friends. You can give it to friends for the cost of the guest certificate. 

As far as the rental compaines being blood sucking entities, they'll only get away with what members allow them to get away with. That's why there is a class action law suit against RCI that's in the discovery stages right now (unless it's been dropped and the web site not updated). 

I really have not noticed this as being an issue with I.I. as I've found adaquate inventory to exchange into. With RCI, the only two times I exchanged with them (through HGVC) I found that inventory into Branson, MO was EXTREMELY limited despite the fact they had more member resorts than I.I. at that time. If it had been high season I might have understood but the two exchanges were shoulder season and should have drawn more than 1 resort on the first occasion and 2 resorts the second time I exchanged. 

For my part, RCI has not received any exchange weeks from me for the last 3 or 4 years and I will continue that trend. When the weeks membership I have now from another resort purchase runs out I don't plan on renewing with them. Not that the loss of my business will affect their practices at all but, if I can't get decent exchanges through them and prefer to use my weeks then why pay them a membership fee?

Note that these are not DOG weeks I own. One is HGVC which is supposed to be a relatively good trader. The other is French Quarter in Branson, MO which is a gold crown resort. The only one I've exhcanged has been HGVC as French Quarter is a new addition to our family of timeshares. If it was a mud hut in some remote third world country during rainy season I could buy the arguement that I'm getting what I paid for but his is Hilton, not some non-rated non-maintained unit during off season.


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## Dave M

I'm not sure how II could match your ad to your II account, because there is typically no identifying info in ads at the site where you listed it except for first name. No e-mail address is normally listed and an address doesn't pop up when sending a message to the person who placed the ad.

I'm guessing that the only way you could have been found out would have been if you disclosed in the ad or in an e-mail message to a respondent to your ad that it was an exchange and the respondent either works for II or complained to II.

Care to share with us how II likely found you? There are a lot of people here to whom it matters!


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## jillandboy

Hi, Dave- 
Have checked on this alittle, apparently you can access other members' email addresses once you log into vacationtimesharerentals.com.  My listing did not say it was an II exchange, it was just about the resort itself. 

_My listing only contained a first name and state, but apparently (per said friend who had the successful rental) there's a place to view everyone's email. _
~~~~~~~
This is terrific info, all, thanks so much!  I really did do it innocently, I will explain that to them.  I doubt they'll take my week (I'll freak!).  I've taken the listing down and I spoke to a cust svc rep who said that it happens all the time and I just need to speak to a supervisor (msg pending) to get my II account back on line.   I'll update you on what happens!


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## chellej

Also, there are those folks out there that are always looking for violators and turn them into II, especially if it was a DVC resort.

Most DVC owners will not reserve friday & sat nights because they take so many more points so if a 7 day rental shows up, it is very suspect.


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## djs

A somewhat related question:

I have some friends who I've gotten a guest certificate for (through II Getaways). I've given their CC info and other contact info, so they paid for the whole thing.  Is this an OK thing to do?  Hasn't bitten me yet, but that's not to say it couldn't.


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## mshatty

I recently saw an ad on My Resorts Network where the guy actually put in his rental ad that his resort week was a RCI exchange and he only needed to get a guest certificate. 

I'm sure someone has reported him.


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## gmarine

unclewilly said:


> A good exchange popped up this morning and I grabbed it and put it up on vacationtimesharerentals.com.   My girlfriend had rented out a week in Aruba (Marriott) for $1500 w/ 6 weeks advance notice and I thought it would be a fun thing to try.   Next thing I know, in a matter of hours, my account at II was suspended.  I had no idea this was illegal, I mean, they issue guest certificates, right?
> 
> Also-- I'm wondering how they knew it was me; anyone know that?
> 
> Help me out!



Renting exchanges is prohibited. It is all explained in II's Terms and Conditions. You dont own the exchanged week, therefore you cant rent it. Guest certificates are to give the week to friends or family. At least you found out before you rented the week. Imagine your problems had you rented the week, accepted payment, renter purchases airline tickets and then you have to notify them that the reservation is cancelled. Not worth the potential problems.

An example would be when you rent a car, you are not permitted to rent it to someone else.

Fair or not, these are Terms that you agree to by being a member.


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## jillandboy

djs said:


> A somewhat related question:
> 
> I have some friends who I've gotten a guest certificate for (through II Getaways). I've given their CC info and other contact info, so they paid for the whole thing.  Is this an OK thing to do?  Hasn't bitten me yet, but that's not to say it couldn't.



THAT _has _to be legit, II/RCI will take the guest's credit card info directly.  Once I had the spelling of a guy's name off by one letter and my RCI account got charged in entirety for his vacation (his credit card declined due to spelling error and all of a sudden my RCI account was several hundreds in deficit).  I was on the phone w/ RCI a couple times and explained the whole thing and eventually it was straightened out satisfactorily. 

And kudos to all of you who actually _read _all the fine print.  What would the rest of us do without you?

ps. just realized I posted a classified with tug for this unit.  Will have to delete it! Yeesh!


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## ouaifer

I know 3 individuals that were found out by RCI last year...and had their accounts suspended, their exchanges cancelled, and their fees _*not*_ returned.  One person was actually turned in by another member.  It took several months for RCI to track it, but apparently, they did so successfully.

If you found a good exchange, took it, and then posted it right away...it would appear, that the powers that be, put one plus one together...and matched the listing with the exchange that they just authorized.  It's not brain surgery under this circumstance.


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## tarob42

*II Suspending Privileges*

This has been a very interesting thread and I also was not aware of II's restrictions.  I have a related question.  I have had family and friends who have purchased the extra weeks that Marriott has available from time to time.  For anyone who couldn't travel on the original week available I deposited it with II and exchanged it for them.  I made absolutely no money on any of it, but with what I have been reading I was wondering if this was illegal also?


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## johnmfaeth

I have Morritt's Tortuga Club oceanfront weeks that were a mandatory deposit into RCI for 2006 as the buildings were destroyed by hurricane, pending new construction opening in 2008 (but I still had to pay my fees of over $2,500 total).

Even I cannot rent them as per RCI even though I had to take the banked units or lose my entire MF's.

I had no choice but to accept their rules under duress....


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## eal

tarob42:
You could try calling II, plead ignorance, promise never to do it again, etc. and see what happens.  Often they will re-instate you after a stern talking to.  But if you do it again, your II membership will be gonzo.


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## islander222

Same rule for Royal Resorts owners who exchange internally.

*ISCO Exchange Program Rules & Procedures*

     #9.  Exchanges may not be rented or externally exchanged.


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## JT62

Is there some kind of "limit" that the exchange companies track, if you are requesting guest certificates? Like a number that would trigger a concern?

I gave friends a week a couple of years ago, and then gave some other friends a week that was going to expire on me last year. (I currently own 2 timeshares, and over the past 6 years, have used the weeks three times and exchanged them the rest)

Just curious

JT


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## riverdees05

tarob42,

Any luck on getting your week back and your  accout reinstated?


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## Jollyhols

After reading this interesting thread I have a thought:

If you have exchanged and owing to unforeseen circs cannot use the week, would II give permission to try and rent it out in that instance?
I am thinking in particular of the circumstance where you put in a request far in advance and they automatically confirm you as soon as one of choices are available.  If you cannnot then get flights, or a family member is ill etc, it is difficult to claim on travel insurance.  Therefore in that circumstance II should allow you to rent it out.


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## rickandcindy23

No. You cannot rent out an exchange, but you can give the week back and use your week later on.  I have done that so many times.   I lose trade power and I do not like that a bit.

I have entered my sister's cc number for a Getaway,  before TUG, before I knew the rule, but I am doubting that rule applies to Getaways, since I have done that for two other people in the last ten years or so.   After all, they had others' credit card numbers, so I was now left out of the loop.   I would never rent anything out and be the middleman.


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## Spence

Jollyhols said:


> After reading this interesting thread I have a thought:
> If you have exchanged and owing to unforeseen circs cannot use the week, would II give permission to try and rent it out in that instance?
> I am thinking in particular of the circumstance where you put in a request far in advance and they automatically confirm you as soon as one of choices are available.  If you cannnot then get flights, or a family member is ill etc, it is difficult to claim on travel insurance.  Therefore in that circumstance II should allow you to rent it out.


....No....


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## Jollyhols

I didn't realise you could give the week back.


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## johnmfaeth

Jollyhols said:


> After reading this interesting thread I have a thought:
> 
> If you have exchanged and owing to unforeseen circs cannot use the week, would II give permission to try and rent it out in that instance?
> I am thinking in particular of the circumstance where you put in a request far in advance and they automatically confirm you as soon as one of choices are available.  If you cannnot then get flights, or a family member is ill etc, it is difficult to claim on travel insurance.  Therefore in that circumstance II should allow you to rent it out.



Hi Jolly,

Look at my posting of March 28 in this thread. I can't rent out trades that were from "rental" unit involuntary deposits for weeks which were  unavailable to use due to resort hurricane damage. 

This is what happens when a market is 95% dominated by two "800 pound gorillas" - RCI/II.

John


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## Spence

Jollyhols said:


> I didn't realise you could give the week back.


"Give the week back" is _another_ way of saying Cancel an Exchange.  You lose the exchange fee and may lose exchange power of your original week.


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## AmyL4408

Jollyhols said:


> I didn't realise you could give the week back.



I have had to cancel a couple of our trips now....    for Health Reasons


They give you a week in return,  that expires in one year.   Mine have all been cancelled on short notice, so I can only search for an exchange within the 59 days flexchange.    Better than nothing though!


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## KHolleger

Not all exchange companies have that restriction.  Dial an Exchange and Trading Places (both free membership) allow you to rent an exchange.  Try them next time, especially if you are not going to re-join RCI and it won't cost you anything to join DAE and TPI.


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## djyamyam

KHolleger said:


> Not all exchange companies have that restriction. Dial an Exchange and Trading Places (both free membership) allow you to rent an exchange. Try them next time, especially if you are not going to re-join RCI and it won't cost you anything to join DAE and TPI.


 
That's NOT entirely correct.  DAE does not allow exchanges to be rented out.  See the following thread and responses by DAE's representative on this issue.

http://www.timeshareforums.com/forums/ask-dial-exchange/13843-renting-exchanged-week.html


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## Mel

I know many here don't like this rule, and think it is unfair that RCI and II can rent our weeks, but we can't rent the weeks we take in exchange, but perhaps if you change the perspective a bit, you might understand - I certainly do.

Say you have a house on the beach, and you lease it to someone for the summer.  They have use of your house for a period of 3 months, June - August.  They have paid up front for thier use.  Now, say they cannot occupy the house during the last 2 weeks of July because their child must return home for band camp (or any other number of reasons).  Since they will not be using the house, they decide to rent it out for those 2 weeks.  They figure you will never know since you live on the other side of the country, and besides they will occupy the weeks before and the week after.  They figure noharm, no foul.

How would you feel about this?  You have no control over who is using your house those 2 weeks.  You don't have a rental agreement with them, they do.  What if something happens while they are on your property?  If someone is hurt, YOU will be the one footing the bill, when you never gave this person permission to be on your property - they are not even guests of someone who holds a contract with you!  What if they rent to someone with a history of laswuits against property owners?  

When you deposit your week to RCI/II/DAE, you are in essence asking them to arrange for occupancy of your unit.  In exchange, they find a unit for you to occupy.  When you do this, you agree to their membership terms which state that they may use your unit any way they wish - you give them the right to sublet your unit.  That right does not extend to the person they sublet to.  They act, in essense, like a rental agent, it's just that instead of cash they are paying you in the form of a different unit/week to use.  They even charge a commission - your exchange fee.  If your rental agent sees that you get paid, are you going to complain when you find out that he let his best friend use your house without charge, and paid you out of his own funds?


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## rickandcindy23

That's a good analogy, Mel.

I dislike RCI for renting out so many weeks and not making them available to exchangers, but we cannot say, "they do it, why can't we?"  The weeks are not ours to use for rentals.  If everyone could do that, those of us who owned units that we occasionally rent out could not even get our maintenance fees back.  So many can get exchanges cheaper than the maintenance fees on a Hawaii week, so competing with exchangers would devalue what we own.


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## PerryM

*No speaka da English*

UncleWilly,

Your first priority is to get your II privileges back – this can be accomplished many ways:

1)	Groveling
2)	Pleading
3)	Begging
4)	Crying
5)	Moaning
6)	Slobbering

Do whatever you must to get reinstated – plead ignorant.  You might put on a heavy accent and pretend that you have a difficult time speaking English – do whatever you must.  “No speaka da English” is a great way to start the phone call.

There is but one reason II and RCI don’t want you to rent your exchange – you would be competing with them.  It’s that simple but they do a horrible job of conveying that and act as defiant bullies and punish those who dare rent and take business away from them.

There is no reason why you should not be able to rent a reservation - after all your original reservation could be rented.  There is an extra layer of incompetence that could zap your renter - that's why there is Renter's Insurance - to protect them from acts of the devil.

Once you get your membership back you can curse them, but until then let’s all chant together “I love II – II, you’re the greatest”.


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## chemteach

*???*

This thread is killing me...

Am I the only tugger wondering if Uncle Willie's story is either not real, or a Tugger who changed their name because they didn't want others to know they had rented out a unit and gotten caught?  Nothing personal, Uncle Willie, but you registered for TUG on the same day that you happened to place a unit for rent (the first time ever doing this) and within hours of the same day II found your rental advertisement and shut down your account, and on that same day you happened to find TUG, place a rental ad on TUG's site and post this thread?  It all seems a bit too coincidental.

I do believe that RCI and II will try to find people who place ads for rentals for their units.  But I find it hard to believe that unless they have a reason to suspect someone of renting out a unit, that they would go to the effort of getting on redweek, tug, myresortsometing.com, vrbo, etc.etc., to search out email addresses and try to connect them to people who might have recently made an exchange.  It's much easier to find people renting on ebay and these ebayers almost never get shut down.  If  II and RCI cared so much, they would start there, not with random research trying to connect email addresses to II or RCI accounts.

Sorry if I've offended you, Uncle Willie, but your story and registration on the BBS seem too coincidental...

The only other thing that makes any sense to me if your story is real is that Uncle Willie discovered TUG, posted the rental on TUG, and a tugger turned him in to II because they noticed your rental and it had been listed recently as a sighting (assuming it had been listed as a sighting that day...) and they connected the dots.  Still - all this happening withing a few hours of posting a rental (as stated in the initial post) seems incredulous.


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## PerryM

*WANTED - dead or dead*

I believe there is a bounty program in effect - a cottage industry of folks sniffing around many sites and finding violations of company rules.

Several years ago I tried to rent a Marriott Reward Certificate for my brother in law - Marriott sent me a polite eMail notice stating that this was in violation of their rules and I had 24 hours to stop or my MRP account would be suspended.

Many here on TUG had done the very thing I was doing - I don't know if that was always the rule or a new one, but in either case Marriott had found me on eBay and somehow figured out it was little old me.  I removed the eBay listing and asked Marriott how they found me.  The VP of Marriott indicated that they do not have folks looking - a reward was paid for the information.

So someone's wallet may be a little fatter this past week - what's in your wallet?


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## johnmfaeth

How many pieces of silver do you think the snitch got?


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## BocaBum99

chemteach said:


> This thread is killing me...
> 
> Am I the only tugger wondering if Uncle Willie's story is either not real, or a Tugger who changed their name because they didn't want others to know they had rented out a unit and gotten caught?  Nothing personal, Uncle Willie, but you registered for TUG on the same day that you happened to place a unit for rent (the first time ever doing this) and within hours of the same day II found your rental advertisement and shut down your account, and on that same day you happened to find TUG, place a rental ad on TUG's site and post this thread?  It all seems a bit too coincidental.
> 
> I do believe that RCI and II will try to find people who place ads for rentals for their units.  But I find it hard to believe that unless they have a reason to suspect someone of renting out a unit, that they would go to the effort of getting on redweek, tug, myresortsometing.com, vrbo, etc.etc., to search out email addresses and try to connect them to people who might have recently made an exchange.  It's much easier to find people renting on ebay and these ebayers almost never get shut down.  If  II and RCI cared so much, they would start there, not with random research trying to connect email addresses to II or RCI accounts.
> 
> Sorry if I've offended you, Uncle Willie, but your story and registration on the BBS seem too coincidental...
> 
> The only other thing that makes any sense to me if your story is real is that Uncle Willie discovered TUG, posted the rental on TUG, and a tugger turned him in to II because they noticed your rental and it had been listed recently as a sighting (assuming it had been listed as a sighting that day...) and they connected the dots.  Still - all this happening withing a few hours of posting a rental (as stated in the initial post) seems incredulous.



The same thought crossed my mind.  It could be Interval International doing a brief crackdown.  If I were II, I would only care about people renting exchanged weeks if it were impacting availability materially for other exchangers.  Otherwise, the practice should actually net them more money.

I would have a policy to placate owners and I would respond to their requests to eliminate violators of the no renting of exchanges rule.


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## tarob42

chemteach said:


> This thread is killing me...
> 
> Am I the only tugger wondering if Uncle Willie's story is either not real, or a Tugger who changed their name because they didn't want others to know they had rented out a unit and gotten caught?  Nothing personal, Uncle Willie, but you registered for TUG on the same day that you happened to place a unit for rent (the first time ever doing this) and within hours of the same day II found your rental advertisement and shut down your account, and on that same day you happened to find TUG, place a rental ad on TUG's site and post this thread?  It all seems a bit too coincidental.
> 
> I do believe that RCI and II will try to find people who place ads for rentals for their units.  But I find it hard to believe that unless they have a reason to suspect someone of renting out a unit, that they would go to the effort of getting on redweek, tug, myresortsometing.com, vrbo, etc.etc., to search out email addresses and try to connect them to people who might have recently made an exchange.  It's much easier to find people renting on ebay and these ebayers almost never get shut down.  If  II and RCI cared so much, they would start there, not with random research trying to connect email addresses to II or RCI accounts.
> 
> Sorry if I've offended you, Uncle Willie, but your story and registration on the BBS seem too coincidental...
> 
> The only other thing that makes any sense to me if your story is real is that Uncle Willie discovered TUG, posted the rental on TUG, and a tugger turned him in to II because they noticed your rental and it had been listed recently as a sighting (assuming it had been listed as a sighting that day...) and they connected the dots.  Still - all this happening withing a few hours of posting a rental (as stated in the initial post) seems incredulous.



I know Unclewilly and it is a completely true story. In the morning she exchanged to the resort, put it up for rental on Vacationtimeshare rentals  and within 4-5 hrs her privileges were suspended.  

The reason she registered on TUG the same day was to find out if that had happened to anyone else.


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## taffy19

I am not an exchange expert but don't you need a guest certificate if you give, rent or do a direct exchange with an *exchanged* or bonus week?  Can't the companies not trace these ACs easily in their data base?  

My friend called II once with me on the line and I paid for the guest certificate myself and could use her week which was an extra week she received at a resort for touring but couldn't use.  II allowed it and the resort did too because we went.  This is a very long time ago.  

To me, it would be dumb to advertise renting a week which you are not supposed to rent.  Contact people privately if you want to do this but you always run a risk that your renter may stand for a closed door.  Now that would be bad for the renters and I wouldn't be surprised if they would sue you in a small claims court.  I wouldn't chance it for a little rent.

I many times wonder if the resort developers or even the exchange companies have people reading these boards so they see how we feel about them and what we know.


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## jillandboy

wow!! 

Leave a thread for a couple days and look what happens!! 

THIS IS ABSOLUTELY TRUE!   I've intended to come back and update you but it's still going on, and I'm a little worried about spies myself.  One rep at II said "we're looking at everything."  

I've been a member of Tug since 2004 or 2005--- I found the old email  from tug giving us a free classified for referring a friend. That was in May, 2005, so we were members before then.   I've written two resort reviews, my review of Mustang Island Beach Club about 11 months ago won for the month.     

The only thing that isn't absolutely true is that I'm mrs. unclewilly, not the man himself-- but as you see our signature is for both of us. 

I just never joined the forums until now.   I feared it would take up all my time and this has been a lost weekend, to tell you the truth.  Imagine trying to catch up on everything now.  

Here's where it stands:  I called II and was told I have to speak to a supervisor.  I was told to take the add down in vacationtimesharerentals.com.   I took it down.   I didn't get a return call, but by that evening my II usage was back on line.   I cld the next day and said I wanted to discuss this with a supervisor, no call back.   *And I still have a 1 BR at the lovey Key West Resort at Disney, checking in April 
29th if anyone is interested. *


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## BocaBum99

Oh, I see.  You exchanged for a Disney and tried to rent it.  That explains everything.  

Someone on this message board most likely turned you in.  They probably won't admit it.  But, I'm 85% sure that's what happened.

There are people here who watch eBay and other rental venues for people renting DVC and other high end units.  Then, they turn them in for violating exchange rules.  They do it because they believe that when someone rents an exchange, that's one less that they could have gotten.  They are right.

My problem is not with the rule or that Tuggers turn them in because after all, a rule is a rule.  What I don't like is that the system is so ineffective that such a rule is even required in the first place.  If a system actually delivered like for like exchanges, then it wouldn't be profitable to rent exchanges in the first place.


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## jillandboy

It wasn't a tug person---

I started the thread AFTER the suspension.  I was looking for help.   

My friend had told me about forums months ago but I never dove in.  That was the push I needed.   (And I actually referred _her _to tug!) 

I've thought about it quite a bit and I can see where II is coming from.   I don't blame them, but now I'm stuck with a week and no supervisor will call me.  I was going to try and turn it back in. 

*On the owner's side*--- ( this is the 3rd time I'm writing this today)  We have about 63k sunk into timeshares (that's strictly timeshare money--purchases, maintenance fees, exchanges, II and RCI memberships). Since 1999 (our first purchase year) or 2000 (our first vacation year) for the days we've vacationed, thats:  (drum roll) $549.00 per day *straight accomodations costs*> not counting _anything _else. 

Oh, and we've been LIED to during the sales pitches.  (haven't we all?!) My husband and I still repeat the lines to eachother and laugh.   

Yes, I see II's side, but when's the last time they saw OUR side of the issue?


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## brucecz

unclewilly said:


> wow!!
> 
> *And I still have a 1 BR at the lovey Key West Resort at Disney, checking in April
> 29th if anyone is interested. *



I see that you are seemingly   persisting in breaking the rules of II and now a  differant rule on what I quoted above.

After you have been a member of Tug for 2 years and with this subject on not renting out exchanges being posted very often, people may doubt you that you did not know that that was against the rules.

I posted on the other string that you posted on to warn you about the other information later provided by you on other later postings on that string on how those postings could come back and boomerang on you.

Bruce


----------



## BocaBum99

unclewilly said:


> It wasn't a tug person---
> 
> I started the thread AFTER the suspension.  I was looking for help.
> 
> My friend had told me about forums months ago but I never dove in.  That was the push I needed.   (And I actually referred _her _to tug!)
> 
> I've thought about it quite a bit and I can see where II is coming from.   I don't blame them, but now I'm stuck with a week and no supervisor will call me.  I was going to try and turn it back in.
> 
> *On the owner's side*--- ( this is the 3rd time I'm writing this today)  We have about 63k sunk into timeshares (that's strictly timeshare money--purchases, maintenance fees, exchanges, II and RCI memberships). Since 1999 (our first purchase year) or 2000 (our first vacation year) for the days we've vacationed, thats:  (drum roll) $549.00 per day *straight accomodations costs*> not counting _anything _else.
> 
> Oh, and we've been LIED to during the sales pitches.  (haven't we all?!) My husband and I still repeat the lines to eachother and laugh.
> 
> Yes, I see II's side, but when's the last time they saw OUR side of the issue?




How do you know it wasn't a TUG person?  They could have turned you in after you posted your ad on vacationtimesharerentals.  It is easy to set up a notification on that site anytime anyone places an ad for a Disney resort.  They immediately see that it is for a 7-night stay, ask you a couple of questions like are there any fees other than the rental.  They get your email and they call their buddies at II to say they got another one.  It's very easy to set up a sting operation.  They can get you within an hour after you place your ad.


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## jillandboy

good point.   It may have been.    What I can tell you is that is wasn't a result of this thread, and no one even asked me any questions.  

I did call II to discuss and asked them 'how did you know?'  And the rep said 'Oh, we're looking at _everything_.'


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## jillandboy

brucecz said:


> I see that you are seemingly   persisting in breaking the rules of II and now a  differant rule on what I quoted above.
> 
> After you have been a member of Tug for 2 years and with this subject on not renting out exchanges being posted very often, people may doubt you that you did not know that that was against the rules.
> 
> I posted on the other string that you posted on to warn you about the other information later provided by you on other later postings on that string on how those postings could come back and boomerang on you.
> 
> Bruce



Hi, Bruce.  You don't have much if a sense of humor, do you?

I never read the forums before (believe what you want, I really didn't, even though I've belonged to Tug, that doesn't mean I've been in the forums) and that line about the week I have was just for irony.  I wanted to try and turn the week back in, and I wouldn't trust anyone on tug at this point to get rid of the week to.  I'll be asking friends and family if they want it.  

I actually don't understand your last paragraph at all, and I'm just expressing my frustration.   I took the ad down from the web, it's gone.  I have no intention of trying to do this again, either. 

BTW-- got all the answers I needed in the first few hours.  I appreciate everybody's help.  I didn't even know enough to call myself a 'newbie,' but that's what I am.  THANKS>    

And Bruce, lighten up.


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## winger

Are weeks exchanged through accomodation certificates eligible to return to II for use of another week at a later date?


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## jillandboy

not mine, it was a regular exchange.   

We actually purchased this unit in 1999 as an eoy-- it was only our 3rd exchange.   It never occurred to us to do anything but use it in the past, but now we have (many) more timeshares.


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## Carl D

In a way you're lucky you were caught now-- before your rentees tried to check in at Old Key West. I'm not sure what may have happened, but I have heard reports here on TUG of Disney asking exchangers how they got their week.


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## jillandboy

Yes, that's been mentioned in this thread.  Chilling.  I think if the rental transaction went through I might have been in more trouble w/ II, but the add was down in a matter of hours.


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## brucecz

unclewilly said:


> wow!!
> 
> *And I still have a 1 BR at the lovey Key West Resort at Disney, checking in April
> 29th if anyone is interested. *



In regards to my sense of:whoopie:  humor. 

The above portion of your post has me  ROTFLMAO because.  

It almost looks like you want to get suppended again if that is another of your rental ads and if you have not learned from your first suppension.  FYI  that type of posting if it is a rental ad is only allowed in the Last Minute Rental portion of the Tug  BBS, not in this portion.

If it is a offer to give the week away with in the II guidelines, then make the posting clearer so you do not get  suppeneded again.

Your claim that you have owned timeshares since 1999 and said you had  paid over $60,000 for that type of group timeshares shows that you must have a sense of humor to vastly over pay that amount for that group.  You apparently have not learned much about timeshare values, etc in the last 8 years while owning them since 1999.

Maybe consider reading the terms and conditions of both II and RCI so you do not end up posting about a similar   exchanging problems.

But good luck to you anyway

Bruce


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## brucecz

unclewilly said:


> Yes, that's been mentioned in this thread.  Chilling.  I think if the rental transaction went through I might have been in more trouble w/ II, but the add was down in a matter of hours.



I posted on the other string that you posted on to warn you about the other information later provided by you on other later postings on that string on how those postings could come back and boomerang on you.

Bruce 

_______________________________________________________
Hi, Bruce. You don't have much if a sense of humor, do you?
_______________________________________________________


Well if because of you and "Your Friends" rental  of a exchange (maybe your spouse) the renters are at risk of because of "your  friends" ignorant greed or worse yet someones knowing greed  of having their vacation wrecked.

Instead of expressing any remorse of  "Your friends" actions that might wreck someones vacation, you have tryed to rationlize in your postings and you claim "that I do not have a sese of humor."  and that II is unfair.

If you think your condesending jab at me hides the fact that your actions and "your friends; actions are the problems then IMHO you are conning no one else but yourself.

Bruce


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## jillandboy

There's actually 2 more SVO's (6 total)  in the mix since 2001, and I was including all the money we've sunk in: m/f, exchange fees, II/RCI memberships. That being said, I know now I could have done a lot better, I suppose we could have done even worse too.   Glad you got a chuckle.  Do you always take on that pedantic tone?


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## taffy19

unclewilly said:


> A good exchange popped up this morning and I grabbed it and put it up on vacationtimesharerentals.com.   My girlfriend had rented out a week in Aruba (Marriott) for $1500 w/ 6 weeks advance notice and I thought it would be a fun thing to try.   Next thing I know, in a matter of hours, my account at II was suspended.  I had no idea this was illegal, I mean, they issue guest certificates, right?
> 
> Also-- I'm wondering how they knew it was me; anyone know that?
> 
> Help me out!


unclewilly, why don't you use the blasted unit?  Is that so hard to do or did you buy at a place you don't like to go for your vacation?  If that is so, you made a mistake!  JMHO.

I notice that you own more timeshares than one.  Can't you exchange them either with some of the independents if II or RCI cannot find you an exchange?

I believe that you are looking for trouble.


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## jillandboy

*I'm way beyond that now.  For those of you scoring at home, I've abandoned all intentions of renting the unit.  The suspension was enough for that. * I'm not looking for any trouble& I do want to be a good citizen. 

I was really flustered, at first, about the whole situation-- but thru these discussions I've comed to understand where II is coming from and have navigated anger-to-acceptance in a matter of days.  Again, II offers decent exchanges, RCI does not-- so I appreciate II. 

We'd never sold one of our exchanges before on-line, never tried to.  But I've known others who had.  What we had done was sold tons of getaways and last call vacations (NOT on line, never for profit-- Profit never entered the equation until this failed attempt).  Anyone can buy them, so I hope you doubters out there can see how it could be confusing.  We're _used _to sending other people on vacation.  

Anyway, Looks like we can't go that week, so I'll try to give it away to family or friends.   I'd be a nice early Christmas present.  And I'll be duly punished. 

Those of you on these forums know so much more than the average t/s owner-- but most t/s owners aren't on these forums.  So, please stop the rancor.  

And thanks, all, for the education.  I learned a lot and I really do appreciate it.


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## johnmfaeth

Hi Bill and Joy,

If you want to try to turn the negative situation to one of happiness, give Make A Wish of Central Florida a call at 407-622-HOPE(4673)
.
Make a wish "grants wishes" to children who have severe medical issues. A chance for they and their immediate families to get a break from the hospitals and doctors for a bit.

Their #1 requested destination is Disney. Sounds like a match to me.

Good luck!

John Faeth


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## Laurie

... or just call II and cancel the exchange. You'll lose your exchange fee, but get your banked week back to use in the future. You shouldn't need to speak to a supervisor.


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## ann824

winger said:


> Are weeks exchanged through accomodation certificates eligible to return to II for use of another week at a later date?



You can't turn them back in, but you can exchange them for another unit.  Once I did it and was charged a regular exchange fee, the last time I tried, they told me I had to pay the amount for the ac (199, 249, 299).  Maybe it depends on who you talk to.


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## rickandcindy23

Carl D said:


> In a way you're lucky you were caught now-- before your rentees tried to check in at Old Key West. I'm not sure what may have happened, but I have heard reports here on TUG of Disney asking exchangers how they got their week.




Not only do they ask this question of exchangers with AC's, but they ask renters as well.  I wanted to experience DVC inexpensively, so I rented one of the five-night studios at Old Key West from ebay for $100 a night.  This person was definitely an owner, so I was surprised at the question from the older woman at check-in.  When I answered that we rented the week from an owner, she asked if it was on the internet.  I told her it was and she visibly frowned.  I had the idea that Disney was getting tired of their OWNERS renting.  You can imagine how they would feel about exchangers renting.


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## littlestar

rickandcindy23 said:


> Not only do they ask this question of exchangers with AC's, but they ask renters as well.  I wanted to experience DVC inexpensively, so I rented one of the five-night studios at Old Key West from ebay for $100 a night.  This person was definitely an owner, so I was surprised at the question from the older woman at check-in.  When I answered that we rented the week from an owner, she asked if it was on the internet.  I told her it was and she visibly frowned.  I had the idea that Disney was getting tired of their OWNERS renting.  You can imagine how they would feel about exchangers renting.



Disney wanted to stop the commercial renters (people running businesses). I think they've pretty much stopped it by enforcing the one points transfer per year in or out per DVC membership. I don't think they are concerned about someone occasionally renting their points if they can't use their DVC points that year. I've heard through the grapevine that 20 or more reservations per year with different names than you or your associate members on your account would send up a red flag. But like I said, I don't really think that's such an issue now since they stopped the unlimited transfers some people were using to run those point rental businesses. I would imagine if someone was running a DVC rental business, the local county tax authority would be very interested in collecting that 12 1/2 percent (or whatever it is now) resort tax from them


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## klynn

*I wanted that week!*

If you do decide to cancel the exchange, please let me know.  That is the week I was looking for.  It is my daughter's 10th birthday and I wanted to take her to Disney.  TIA!


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## winger

ann824 said:


> You can't turn them back in, but you can exchange them for another unit.....


if the one place I want to re-exchange into is only open for ac withinn flextime, do I just have to wait until the flex period before I call II to turn in my original week that I got for my ac?


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## ann824

One time when I called, they told me it had to be within 60 days.  It may have been that the unit I was wanting to exchange was within the 60 day period. I don't know what they would say if your unit was outside of that 60 day window.  Let me know if you find out anything.


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## jillandboy

johnmfaeth said:


> Hi Bill and Joy,
> 
> If you want to try to turn the negative situation to one of happiness, give Make A Wish of Central Florida a call at 407-622-HOPE(4673)
> .
> Make a wish "grants wishes" to children who have severe medical issues. A chance for they and their immediate families to get a break from the hospitals and doctors for a bit.
> 
> Their #1 requested destination is Disney. Sounds like a match to me.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> John Faeth




Great suggestion, I have a message in to Ruthie the wish coordinator at that number.  Also sent an email  via the website.  That would make me feel wonderful about the whole thing.


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## jillandboy

klynn said:


> If you do decide to cancel the exchange, please let me know.  That is the week I was looking for.  It is my daughter's 10th birthday and I wanted to take her to Disney.  TIA!



No way!  I'm out of mylanta as it is. 

If you have an exchange banked check a few times a day.  If one surfaces it won't stay for long, be ready to pounce.  Good luck.   

Also--- A friend of mine rented points from dizboards.com, I have no idea if that's legal but I suppose it's owners renting their own property, so that should be ok.   I think owners  sell their inventory on ebay too, which should be kosher if they're disney owners...right?


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## winger

ann824 said:


> One time when I called, they told me it had to be within 60 days.  It may have been that the unit I was wanting to exchange was within the 60 day period. I don't know what they would say if your unit was outside of that 60 day window.  Let me know if you find out anything.



I called and talked to II-Marriott Desk.  I canNOT trade in AC-confirmed week and get an AC to use at a later date; however, if I see a resort within my AC's grid the rest of the year (AC exp's 2/2008) that is available or 59 days from travel (for resort not in the AC grid), I can pay an exchange fee and effectively use the already-used AC to book a new exchange.

Fine line to me...but I guess there is a difference in how this is done


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## johnmfaeth

Hi again,

Ruthie is a wonderful person. It's somewhat short notice for them, but you never know.  I always offer that if they have an employee or volunteer that could use it, that's fine with me.

Good luck!

John Faeth




unclewilly said:


> Great suggestion, I have a message in to Ruthie the wish coordinator at that number.  Also sent an email  via the website.  That would make me feel wonderful about the whole thing.


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## chemteach

I apologize for my original post.  It being a Disney rental does suggest that someone turned you in.  (Or maybe II checks Disney rentals (??))  There is a lot of conversation on TUG about people being upset about Disney rentals of II exchanges.  I'm glad to hear you received your online service back with II.

I still think that it's far easier for II to find people renting on ebay and those rentals just sit on ebay until they close...  (unless people are turned in by "spies")


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## jillandboy

Make a wish:  Ruthie was really interested but there's no pending requests that fit the bill.  It's coming up too fast, they need more notice. 

Just wanted to tell everyone that I first called the local chapter of make-a-wish and they said 'we don't take timeshares.'  That didn't sound right, I sent a note on the web and followed up at the number that johnmfaeth gave and did speak to Ruthie.   

She said different chapters do different things, but she's in the central Fla locus and *they love timeshare donations*.   Her toll free number is: 888 874 9474 x205.   She said they've been getting a lot of requests for the Nickelodeon hotel/resort.


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## sdtugger

*Can I be greedy and want to do something nice at the same time?*

I have an AC that it appears I will not be able to use.  I was planning on offering it (for free) to family who may or may not be able to use it.  However, this thread has me thinking.  I can see a Disney 1 bedroom on line available for the AC in September.  Here's the part that sounds bad, but other than warm feelings, what do you get for donating the week?  I assume it is a charitable contribution.  But, how would you value it for tax purposes.


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## Dave M

sdtugger said:


> ...what do you get for donating the week?  I assume it is a charitable contribution.  But, how would you value it for tax purposes.


Yes, it's a charitable contribution and I'm sure there are many qualified charities that would be thrilled to have it.

However, strange as it may seem, you will not be entitled to any tax deduction for the donation. The tax law doesn't allow a deduction for donating the use of property on a rent-free or reduced-rent basis. Further, even if you were allowed a deduction, you would have to reduce the deduction by the amount that would be ordinary income (versus capital gain) to you (all of it) if you sold it to someone else.


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## jillandboy

That's interesting, you sound like you know what you're talking about.  While it's not rent-free, it's certainly not *fee-free*.  And there is a clear market value.   How can you say it's all ordinary income- if you sold it. (IF!) 
Is this rule regarding just real-estate type property or other types also? I'd love to know more.


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## Mel

When Dave says "if you sold it" he means if you sold that use - in other words rented it.

Now consider, even if it were your own timeshare and you had the right to rent it, you stil wouldn't get a deduction.  Turn that around to consider if you were to rent the timeshare and then donate the proceeds back to whoever rented it.  You have reportable rental income to balance your donation, which results in a wash - no deduction.  Assuming it is a rental property instead of timeshare, you would be taking a deduction on all of your costs anyway, whether it sat empty or was used by someone, so it's still a wash.

Since it is an exchange, you should be able to donate the use of your exchange, but again, you could not rent it out and then donate the proceeds, even if it would result in a tax deduction.  But I would also be very careful of donating an exchange - even though it is not a rental, it still requires a guest certificate, and I could see some logistical issues there - II needs to know who to issue the guest certificate to, I doubt it can be issued in the name of the charity.  And with a Disney exchange, there's the matter of that pesky $100 guest services charge.


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## chemteach

Mel said:


> But I would also be very careful of donating an exchange - even though it is not a rental, it still requires a guest certificate, and I could see some logistical issues there - II needs to know who to issue the guest certificate to, I doubt it can be issued in the name of the charity.  And with a Disney exchange, there's the matter of that pesky $100 guest services charge.




I recall posts in the past that if you donate an exchanged week, RCI will give a free guest certificate.  You just have to phone them to let them know the week was donated to a charity.  Perhaps II does the same.


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## LGinPA

*Cornfuzzled!*

Wow!  *unclewilly*, sorry to hear about all your problems.   But thanks for starting this thread.  There's a lot I'm learning here.  I thought once an exchange was confirmed, there was nothing I could do if I couldn't go!  I had no idea it can get turned back into II!

FYI, I've been a TUG member since 2000, but just joined the BBS recently, and loving it here!  :whoopie: 

I have 2 scenarios below.  Can someone 'in the know', tell me if these were legal? 

I'm confused about the purpose of a guest certificate. Last year, we had a change in family events and couldn't use an II exchange week at Myrtle Beach early August.  My sister was able to go that week. So I bought a guest certificate in her name.  She paid me for it and for the II exchange fee.  Was this illegal? 

So when we couldn't use the early August week in MB, we found another week in late August we could use, right here in the TUG classifieds.  I paid a Tugger $1100, to use their TS.  I paid them to buy a guest certificate in my name, too. Was that illegal?  If so, are the Tug classifieds illegal? (Silly, me.  They can't be!  But... but... it all sounds the same to me.   )   

Thanks for all the expert exchangers here.  I'm learning a lot!


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## Pat H

LGinPA said:


> I have 2 scenarios below.  Can someone 'in the know', tell me if these were legal?
> 
> I'm confused about the purpose of a guest certificate. Last year, we had a change in family events and couldn't use an II exchange week at Myrtle Beach early August.  My sister was able to go that week. So I bought a guest certificate in her name.  She paid me for it and for the II exchange fee.  Was this illegal?
> 
> So when we couldn't use the early August week in MB, we found another week in late August we could use, right here in the TUG classifieds.  I paid a Tugger $1100, to use their TS.  I paid them to buy a guest certificate in my name, too. Was that illegal?  If so, are the Tug classifieds illegal? (Silly, me.  They can't be!  But... but... it all sounds the same to me.   )
> 
> Thanks for all the expert exchangers here.  I'm learning a lot!



None of the above are *ILLEGAL*. The second one is against the exchange companies rules. 

BTW, where do you live in NEPA?


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## LGinPA

OK, so they were not *illegal*, as I worded it.  But are they against the rules?  I'm still confused.  There are hundreds of weeks for sale here in the Classified. Are they all the owners home resort week?  If so, is that what makes it OK? (I think I know the answer to this.)  But if it was an exchanged week, it would be against the rules?  

Pat, I PM'ed you.


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## Dani

LGinPA said:


> OK, so they were not *illegal*, as I worded it.  But are they against the rules?  I'm still confused.  There are hundreds of weeks for sale here in the Classified. Are they all the owners home resort week?  If so, is that what makes it OK? (I think I know the answer to this.)  But if it was an exchanged week, it would be against the rules?
> 
> Pat, I PM'ed you.



Yes...the second scenario is against the Terms and Conditions of II.  You cannot rent out a week that you received as an exchange.  If you own a week, you can freely rent it out.  You can however purchase a Guest certificate for friends and family.


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## camachinist

Additionally, even renting intervals at one's own home resort obtained through an intra-resort exchange (like trading into the same/different season, etc) are against the T&C's of most exchange companies. Once you sign the use of the interval over to the exchange company, it's contractually out of your control. 

Of course, companies (and individuals) break contracts all the time. One must just balance the risks versus the rewards. Businesses do it every day. 

Pat


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## captainhook1974

I just got burned on this whole subject(through II)...I was about the get the payment over paypal...and I was informed on one of these message boards that you can't rent exchanges...they might have it in the fine print...but it is nowhere on the confirmation...no where on the website...etc...They don't have it out in the open, that is for sure...Just stinks, now we have to find someone to use it...


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## dougp26364

From the I.I. website http://www.intervalworld.com/pdf/iw/buyers-guide.pdf check page 6 item (k). It's even in *bold* print. I am assuming that renting exchanges would be considered comercial and not personal usage. 

One always has to read all the way though the T&C of the membership. Not that it's an easy or interesting read but, the fine print is something we should all read.


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## gmarine

captainhook1974 said:


> I just got burned on this whole subject(through II)...I was about the get the payment over paypal...and I was informed on one of these message boards that you can't rent exchanges...they might have it in the fine print...but it is nowhere on the confirmation...no where on the website...etc...They don't have it out in the open, that is for sure...Just stinks, now we have to find someone to use it...




Its printed right on the guest certificate.


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## Dave M

I think that reference ("k") is on p. 4.

Although your cited language  prohibits commercial use, there is also a direct reference in that document to the prohibition against renting (#14 on p.8):





> "Members are expressly prohibited from exchanging or renting the Host Accommodations."


The term "Host Accomodations" is broadly defined as including exchanges, Getaways and Flexchange conformations.


----------



## Phill12

captainhook1974 said:


> I just got burned on this whole subject(through II)...I was about the get the payment over paypal...and I was informed on one of these message boards that you can't rent exchanges...they might have it in the fine print...but it is nowhere on the confirmation...no where on the website...etc...They don't have it out in the open, that is for sure...Just stinks, now we have to find someone to use it...




 Sounds like because of this you canceled your rental and that is great,being honest! Sad part thousands of others would have taken the money and run!

 I think there are reasons that mess people up here and that there are different kinds of people in timesharing! There are the honest ones that just don't understand and there are the low-lifes that just want to make a buck and so what if some family gets stopped at the resort and sent packing!  


 To the honest people the Guest Certificate is confusing because you can charge  your cost here but can not rent for a profit. I think when this started it was so your family could use it or you could get cheap vacation for family members. But like everything else people started getting greedy and want to make money off this too! Because of this someday there may no longer be guest cert to use.

 What I want to know is what happens when someone uses the G.Cert and gets question at the front desk. What proof do they need that someone renting would not also have with them!

 I would think if they could put a stop to all this renting what you don't own most of these sites would be down to few pages and not the hundreds of pages on rental sites!

 Also we are only talking about renting, You can not sell a unit you do not own. This would be like renting a car for the week and selling it!  

 I feel all these sites should red flag anyone trying to rent a unit that they do not own! No refund and they are removed from the site but of coarse that will never happen! To much money made from these low-lifes and these sites are here to make money.


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## chellej

They could also stop folks who are trying to make a business out of it - and really aren't they the biggest problem - just by limiting the number of guest certificates you ccan purchase in a year.


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## montara

*Renting out exchanges*

What if iyou give your week away as a freebie but charge an exhorbitant amount for something else, or have them submit a poem and offer them a timeshare for a prize.  What would RCI or II do about that?  Any comments?


----------



## Phill12

montara said:


> What if iyou give your week away as a freebie but charge an exhorbitant amount for something else, or have them submit a poem and offer them a timeshare for a prize.  What would RCI or II do about that?  Any comments?





 Montara I guess that would remove the honest owners and now who do we have left but the low-lifes trying to make a buck! This is scamming because they are renting something they have no right to rent and most of them know it! Then we will hear the lame statement that they didn't know or no speek english!

 I had been with Rci for about five wasted years in 1983 and II twice now that covers about eight years and have yet to get a guest cert and I would think many owners have never had one either. Unless you own more than one timeshare most families would be using theirs and taking family, friends with them!

 The main down side I see is when a family loses their vacation because they get stopped at the front desk! Then have to now go after this low-life that is scamming them and knows it. 

 Another point is there are thousands of owners each year that don't find renters and how many are lost to these scammers.

 Think about these low-lifes getting top unit and resort and rent it and how many owners have requested these units and never got one for their vacation!


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## rickandcindy23

How do you tell a renter to not "spill the beans?"  You see, when you rent, the renter needs to know that their vacation is secure and they are not breaking any rules.  So what are you going to do, ask them to keep their mouths shut?   How do you say that without coming right out and telling them that you broke the rules?  For example, a renter goes to the unit and finds it unacceptable and wants something different, so they march down to the desk and say, "I paid good money and hoped for a unit with a view!"  So the desk clerk says, "I thought this was an exchanger, sir?"  Then the renter tells how this person rented this week on redweek or ebay or wherever and how much they paid.  Now you have some explaining to do.  Also, your renter could end up being asked to leave, not just because you rented them a week, but because he is being unreasonable.  It is a good way for a resort to get rid of an unhappy customer--blame you for renting to that person.


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## Phill12

rickandcindy23 said:


> How do you tell a renter to not "spill the beans?"  You see, when you rent, the renter needs to know that their vacation is secure and they are not breaking any rules.  So what are you going to do, ask them to keep their mouths shut?   How do you say that without coming right out and telling them that you broke the rules?  For example, a renter goes to the unit and finds it unacceptable and wants something different, so they march down to the desk and say, "I paid good money and hoped for a unit with a view!"  So the desk clerk says, "I thought this was an exchanger, sir?"  Then the renter tells how this person rented this week on redweek or ebay or wherever and how much they paid.  Now you have some explaining to do.  Also, your renter could end up being asked to leave, not just because you rented them a week, but because he is being unreasonable.  It is a good way for a resort to get rid of an unhappy customer--blame you for renting to that person.




 I do not know what you would tell the renter because I would never rent something that wasn't mind to rent! I have trouble thinking like one of these low-lifes so I can't give you a answer!
 Your right and the only up side if the renter understands what they are renting they might save some money! They also may have their vacation cut short because of dealing with this person of low moral character! Of coarse if they know all this is against the rules going in they deserve what ever happens and have no right to complain later!

 There probably is a small percent of owners and renters that are honest and don't know these rules but with all these sites available it couldn't be many! This is one of the most posted subjects in timesharing with stopping scammers!

 What part of Colorado are you from! I lived in Manitou Springs for eleven years back in the fifties! 

 We are going to our timeshare( Ridge Tahoe) for Memorial week and because daughter has finals she couldn't go with us. 

 We are flying into Colorado Springs the next week June 3 for six days because daughter wanted to go back and see the sights she saw when she was three. Our luck to pick a area with no timeshare resorts!


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## freechoice

*unfair rental policies ?*

Hi UncleWilly... there are many timeshare owners renting out their timeshares from the resort which is ok but arent there many on redweek etc renting out rci's and II too?

and then there are friends renting out to friends that probably going on all the time or how about posters I see at work that renting out weeks ? 

I think the fact is your ad in vacationweeks is so blatantly advertised that II had to quickly stop it.

Also Its so unfair that you were singled out because on rci I see a lot of rentals that I could have used but rci is renting them out too???

figure that out






unclewilly said:


> Yes, that's been mentioned in this thread.  Chilling.  I think if the rental transaction went through I might have been in more trouble w/ II, but the add was down in a matter of hours.


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## bobby

I'm glad members can not rent out exchanges. Exchanges are for exchanging by members, not profit. We need the good weeks available. Members can rent out their own units if they want some money.


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## Mel

Think about the chain of people involved when renting an exchange:

You deposit your week to RCI or II, giving them the right to use that week any way they see fit.

They give it to another member as an exchange, or even as a rental (this is within their rights, given the terms of membership).

That person then rents it out to someone esle.

When something goes wrong, who does the renter complain to?  The person they rented from doesn't own the week they rented, nor does that person even have the right to sublet.  How would you feel if you leased your full-ownership condo to someone (at a discout since it's a full year lease instead of weekly rental), and they turn around and rent it out.  They DON'T have that right, it's not their property, and you did not extend them the right to sublet.

Now assume you gave someone the right to sublet, because they will be elsewhere during the summer.  They lease the summer months to a third party, who then turns around and sublets to yet another person.  Are you happy about this?  I doubt it!  You had a signed contract with the person who subleased the first time - you chose to trust their judgement in whom to rent to.  You don't even know the next person in the chain, let alone the person they decided to rent to.  This is how I see the situation with RCI & II - They are your lessee, and have leased your week to someone else with your permission.  It should go no further.  When you get a guest certificate from RCI or II, you are certifying that you are following their policies, but you are also vouching for the person using your exchange.  Is your honor really for sale?  Are you willing to vouch for someone just because they paid you $500?

Then there are the use an inexpensive week to exchange into a high-value week, and then rents it for less than the maintenance fee.  First, this is against the membership rules.  Second, it undercuts other owners at those resorts.  If you want to rent out that high-demand week, buy it first!


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## reddiablosv

Johnmfaeth, made a great suggestion a while back. If you don't have time to use, rent , or sell , donate your florida week to  a charity.  You will get a nice tax break and screw the exchange company.   Next year you can figure out what you want to do with all your timeshares.  Ben


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## teshiachris

*Its all in the articulation*

Cant you just instruct the renter to say no, I didnt rent it, the person is a friend of mine?


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## csxjohn

teshiachris said:


> Cant you just instruct the renter to say no, I didnt rent it, the person is a friend of mine?



Although this thread is 5 years old it is still relevant.

DAE also has this restriction.

Who would want to rent from you if you instruct them that they may have to lie at check in?  And, would you trust your account and weeks deposited to the exchange company to someone successfully lying for you?

It's against policy and it can have financial implications to you and the renter.  

I would not do it.


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## jackio

robcrusoe said:


> if one does more than one or two a year, it becomes blatantly obvious to the exchange company



Unfortunately, my vacationing ability has decreased in the past few years, and I often gift expiring weeks to my friends and family,2 to 3 times a year.  So far the exchange companies have not questioned it.


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## Saintsfanfl

jackio said:


> Unfortunately, my vacationing ability has decreased in the past few years, and I often gift expiring weeks to my friends and family,2 to 3 times a year.  So far the exchange companies have not questioned it.



Why would they? Gifting is not renting. With II you can put the reservation in whatever name you wish and I assume it is the same with RCI.


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## DeniseM

Please note that this is a *2007 thread* that was brought out of moth balls today.  All posts before #94 are from 2007.


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## rickandcindy23

The thread still holds true.  II still punishes people who rent exchanges, which is only right, and RCI doesn't seem to care and maybe even allows their employees to do it.  

Case in point: I emailed an eBay seller who claimed he works for RCI and is allowed to rent exchanges for his own $$ benefit.  He says he gets inventory before other RCI members as an RCI employee and then rents them on eBay.  No one will turn him in or care, because, "employees don't have to abide by the same rules as exchangers."  I think he is a liar, personally.  

Yes, it was a DVC ad, and he continues to rent the weeks.  Nothing seems to stop him from doing it, and no one at RCI seems to police eBay.  But maybe he is telling the truth, in which case:


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## geekette

Not buying that employee line.  I'd turn him in.  Doubt he's an employee, but am very certain that RCI employees 1)  do not get access to weeks ahead of anyone [my understanding is that they can have an used week for their own vacation]  and 2) are not permitted to rent them out.

To the poster that asked, "can't you just say it's a friend?"  sure, but after you have run an ad on the internet, your new friend doesn't seem to be someone you knew until they answered your ad.  Intent to rent is enough to go on.


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## thinze3

teshiachris said:


> Cant you just instruct the renter to say no, I didnt rent it, the person is a friend of mine?



Not if someone reports it to II and sends them the Redweek or Tug link.  

Last year I traded into Crystal Shores and come to find out my plans changed and I could not go.  (Just like they have now for my 2013 vacation plans).  I contacted II and asked if I could trade my week with another person into another resort and was told 'yes'.  Well, instead of running an exchange only ad, I ran a rental ad as well.

Slap slap, II sent me an email telling me that it was not legal rent exchanges, and promptly put a hold on my account until my Tug and Redweek ads were removed.  (Truthfully, it's not legal to barter for outside exchanges either.)   Since I had no history of  guest certificates, II was very diplomatic in the way they handled things and simply explained the rules to me while asking that I not do it again.

It was simple enough for II to see that I do not own at Crystal Shores and that I traded into Crystal Shores.  CS is so small, I may have even been the only person who had an exchange for those dates that I did.

I had no problem with anything that happened.  All in all, it's better for the entire system to work this way so that all the premium weeks do not get scooped up by scalpers.


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## Quadmaniac

http://alberta.kijiji.ca/c-real-est...MONT-HOT-SPRINGS-LAS-VEGAS-W0QQAdIdZ427603254

This guy is looking for trouble....


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## timbuktu

*Getaway rental ?*

Is it ok to rent a Getaway that I purchased and cannot use ?


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## DeniseM

timbuktu said:


> Is it ok to rent a Getaway that I purchased and cannot use ?



Not if you get caught.


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