# Should we accept this "Gift"?



## Firepath (Jun 4, 2016)

I currently have a Permission Addendum on my parents WM account to help them manage it. Due to health issues they aren't using it and have offered it to me. They have 20,000 points and don't have a loan. Dues are about $1300anually which includes Travelshare. I have used their points over the years at Worldmark resorts, once used Club Pass, an RCI exchange, and a few Bonus Time stays. We are trying to determine if this will work for us. If I'm understanding correctly there is a transfer fee of $299. Are there any other fees? Would all of their benefits transfer to us as well? I think they got Travelshare free the last time they added on. If this is gifted to us do we have to pay taxes on it and if so, on what amount? Until we retire, I'm not sure we would use all 20,000 points each year, but I think I could rent at least enough of them to cover the dues each year to co-workers. I did recently rent some out and it went well. I should mention we also have DVC points and like that they will expire by the time we are too old to use them. This is a concern I have about WM as I don't want to be stuck paying dues for the rest of my life. Does this seem like a gift worth accepting?


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## am1 (Jun 4, 2016)

Yes it is worth accepting.


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## vacationhopeful (Jun 4, 2016)

If the dues are $1300 annually for 20,000 Worldmark points ... and you can take/use/gift 3 week long vacations which cost about $450 per week ... does that seem worthwhile? 

Remember, many of the benefits transferring to you as a direct family member, would NOT transfer to another resale buyer or gift receiver. 

And YOU are already using the product ... so the question is, will YOU and your family get $1300 usage out of it yearly?


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## uscav8r (Jun 4, 2016)

*Should we accept this &quot;Gift&quot;?*

There is no tax liability as the fair market value is well below the threshold for annual gifts (it is $14k per recipient per year for 2016). 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## VacationForever (Jun 4, 2016)

There is good resale value for WM points/contracts.  So there is "worth" and can be sold quite easily, as of now.  Wyndham also has an Ovation program where they will take back Worldmark points at no cost.  There will be no hassle in just giving up the points to Ovation, but then there is value in the resale market, so you can sell it if you don't want it.  You can list it with WMowners.com, through TUG, redweek etc... or through a resale broker.

Then the next question is whether you want to or can use it or rent it.  If you can, keep it.


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## taterhed (Jun 4, 2016)

Firepath said:


> I currently have a Permission Addendum on my parents WM account to help them manage it. Due to health issues they aren't using it and have offered it to me. They have 20,000 points and don't have a loan. Dues are about $1300anually which includes Travelshare. I have used their points over the years at Worldmark resorts, once used Club Pass, an RCI exchange, and a few Bonus Time stays. We are trying to determine if this will work for us. If I'm understanding correctly there is a transfer fee of $299. Are there any other fees? Would all of their benefits transfer to us as well? I think they got Travelshare free the last time they added on. If this is gifted to us do we have to pay taxes on it and if so, on what amount? Until we retire, I'm not sure we would use all 20,000 points each year, but I think I could rent at least enough of them to cover the dues each year to co-workers. I did recently rent some out and it went well. I should mention we also have DVC points and like that they will expire by the time we are too old to use them. This is a concern I have about WM as I don't want to be stuck paying dues for the rest of my life. Does this seem like a gift worth accepting?



 Worldmark points have steady and constant value. They are an asset, not a liability.

 Private (vs trusted brokers) sellers usually retail 'fully loaded' (bank+current+borrow all available) accounts for .30-.40 cents per point.  So, a normal advertised cost would be $2800 for 7000 pts plus $299 transfer fee (7000 bank, 7000 current, 7000 to borrow--21000 pts and HKT's).  Some will advertise a bit cheaper, or include the transfer fee etc...  For accounts that are not fully loaded (some points used) decrease the cost by the number of points missing x .07 cents (and $75 per hkt).  Minimum cost for an account is usually about .30 per point for a stripped account.

 Worldmark points are usually rented at the rate of .07 cents per point (plus HKT cost) plus/minus .01--a little less if the points expire soon.  Everything is negotiable of course....but they do rent pretty easily--based on posts etc...

 You do not have to keep the entire 20k.  You can split the account and sell part.  10k accounts are very desirable as are 5k.   If you split, I would recommend 2x10k.  You can then sell 1.  The cost of splitting is ??? also $299 I think.  There are limits to the number of splits/transfers per year(?).

 There are changes coming that will limit the number of points that can be rented to 2x account value.  This may impact the rental/sales market in a good or bad way.  Who knows?  This change will also stop the transfer of HKT's with points.  This is aimed at 'mega-renters' and will probably not affect the market extensively, but it may increase the value of larger accounts (especially 10k and above). 

 Finally, travelshare can be transferred to children (pretty sure about that) but you really need to determine if the extra fees are worth it for you.

 PLEASE do not use Ovation to give away this valuable benefit.  It will sell or rent easily.  Also, by renting points and using bonus time and inventory specials, you will still have access to vacations and essentially cover your MF's.

 cheers!


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## mash84121 (Jun 4, 2016)

Here is one site with two 20,000 accounts.  This gives some idea of the resale value for Worldmark accounts.

https://worldtimeshareclub.com/inventory/


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## ChuckHH (Jun 6, 2016)

taterhed said:


> Worldmark points have steady and constant value. They are an asset, not a liability.
> 
> Private (vs trusted brokers) sellers usually retail 'fully loaded' (bank+current+borrow all available) accounts for .30-.40 cents per point.  So, a normal advertised cost would be $2800 for 7000 pts plus $299 transfer fee (7000 bank, 7000 current, 7000 to borrow--21000 pts and HKT's).  Some will advertise a bit cheaper, or include the transfer fee etc...  For accounts that are not fully loaded (some points used) decrease the cost by the number of points missing x .07 cents (and $75 per hkt).  Minimum cost for an account is usually about .30 per point for a stripped account.
> 
> ...



That was a hella good advice...


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## Firepath (Aug 1, 2016)

Thank you for all the good info. We have decided to go ahead and take over my Dad's contract. I had contacted someone in WM's title services department last month who told me the transfer fee is $299 to a family member. When my Dad called to begin the process they referred him to Ovation. I also spoke with them and was told there are no closing fees or other fees, the grandfathered in components of his contract would move with the contract, and existing reservations wouldn't be affected. I've read so much negative about Ovation that I'm kind of wary of them being involved. Are they okay for a transfer between family members? It sounds like the problem is more with them taking back valuable contracts to re-sell with nothing to the current owner. I hope I'm right about that!


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## sue1947 (Aug 1, 2016)

Firepath said:


> Thank you for all the good info. We have decided to go ahead and take over my Dad's contract. I had contacted someone in WM's title services department last month who told me the transfer fee is $299 to a family member. When my Dad called to begin the process they referred him to Ovation. I also spoke with them and was told there are no closing fees or other fees, the grandfathered in components of his contract would move with the contract, and existing reservations wouldn't be affected. I've read so much negative about Ovation that I'm kind of wary of them being involved. Are they okay for a transfer between family members? It sounds like the problem is more with them taking back valuable contracts to re-sell with nothing to the current owner. I hope I'm right about that!



Ovation isn't a 'them'.  It is Wyndham's program to take back accounts.  You DO NOT WANT Ovation.  If you want to keep the account, you simply want to transfer the account to you as a direct family member.  That will leave the Travelshare benefits in place.  Sounds like there was a misunderstanding when your father called in or they are trying to take advantage of him.  

Sue


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## cayman01 (Aug 2, 2016)

Firepath said:


> Thank you for all the good info. We have decided to go ahead and take over my Dad's contract. I had contacted someone in WM's title services department last month who told me the transfer fee is $299 to a family member. When my Dad called to begin the process they referred him to Ovation. I also spoke with them and was told there are no closing fees or other fees, the grandfathered in components of his contract would move with the contract, and existing reservations wouldn't be affected. I've read so much negative about Ovation that I'm kind of wary of them being involved. Are they okay for a transfer between family members? It sounds like the problem is more with them taking back valuable contracts to re-sell with nothing to the current owner. I hope I'm right about that!




 Ovation is only if you want to give the points back to Wyndham. You do NOT want them involved in process.


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## raygo123 (Aug 2, 2016)

If you decide to keep, find out if tribute applies to worldmark as well, you may find the $299 will be waived.

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## Ty1on (Aug 4, 2016)

sue1947 said:


> Ovation isn't a 'them'.  It is Wyndham's program to take back accounts.  You DO NOT WANT Ovation.  If you want to keep the account, you simply want to transfer the account to you as a direct family member.  That will leave the Travelshare benefits in place.  Sounds like there was a misunderstanding when your father called in or they are trying to take advantage of him.
> 
> Sue



It sounds like Ovation and Tribute are being run by the same department.


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## Firepath (Oct 16, 2016)

Just checking back to let you know how the transfer went with the Ovation program. We started by making a 3-way call to WM Title Services. My dad gave a verbal authorization for WM to send all the transfer paperwork to me, which they did via email and within just a week or so. We did have some delay in getting the paperwork all signed, notarized, and back to them as my dad had a couple of trips to the hospital shortly after we got it. Title Services told me the account would be frozen during the transfer, but they actually froze it as soon as they sent out the paperwork, which seemed a bit premature to me, as he could've changed his mind about the transfer. We did miss out on a booking we were hoping for during that time because of that. From the time we sent the signed paperwork overnight mail until the transfer was actually complete and the new owners names appeared in the on-line account was about 3 weeks. The only real problem we've run into is with the associated RCI account. Using the RCI link from my WM account, it still shows my dad's name, but my WM credits. When I originally called WM about the transfer, they said everything would transfer over identically from my dad's account to mine. I since found out that isn't true. When I called about the RCI account, they said it will stay in his name, and they will give me a new one. The credits he currently has in his RCI account, thankfully not many, will not transfer over to me. They told me they would get working on setting up an RCI account for me, but that was over two weeks ago and they said it should've happened over the next weekend (it didn't). And now they put a freeze on the RCI account :annoyed:We also had a WM stay last week on a reservation that had been booked before the transfer. They were able to look up the account and confirm we are the new owners. We went to an owner update and when asked about the RCI account, the sales rep left for a few minutes, then came back and said it was being worked on and should be complete any day. We had the strange feeling she didn't really check. Anyways, the process has been mostly good and didn't cost anything. Now we just have to follow through with the RCI account.


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## taterhed (Oct 17, 2016)

Congrats 

sent from my cell phone...


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