# Converting 50,000 SPG Points into 12 Roundtrip Tix on Southwest Airlines



## nodge (Nov 2, 2007)

Hi Gang,

I don’t know about you, but we’ve been accumulating SPG points faster than we can get rid of ‘em, and that long awaited European vacation, where using SPG points for hotel rooms actually makes financial sense,  seems to keep being pushed back further and further.

Fortunately, the good folks at flyertalk.com have figured out how to get 12 roundtrip tickets on Southwest Airlines for only 50,000 SPG (Starwood hotel) points.  Here’s how it’s done:

Step 1:  Before the end of 2007, convert 25,000 SPG points into 25,000 Amtrak Guest Rewards.

Step 2:  Then, convert those 25,000 Amtrak Guest Rewards into 125,000 Choice Hotel Points (Choice Privileges).  (Note:  Amtrak limits regular members to transferring 25,000 points a year (Amtrak “select” members can transfer up to 50,000 points a year)).

Step 3:  Then, convert those 125,000 Choice Hotel Points into 50 Southwest Airlines Rapid Reward Points.  A roundtrip flight costs 16 RR points, so this transaction will give you 3 roundtrips on Southwest.

Step 4:  Wait until January 2008 if you are not an Amtrak “Select” member.  (Don’t wait until then if you are an Amtrak “select” member).

Step 5:  Repeat Steps 1-3 in January 2008.  This will place another 50 Rapid Reward points into your Southwest airlines account and give you another 3 roundtrip flights on Southwest.

BONUS:  But as soon as your Southwest rapid reward account reaches 100 points within a 12 month period, you earn a Companion Pass.  This allows you to designate anyone to fly free with you for a year, even if you fly using one of your Rapid Reward flights.  Accordingly, those 6 free roundtrips essentially turn into 12 roundtrips.

For comparison purposes, you would have to spend $120,000 on your Southwest Airlines’ Rapid Rewards Visa to earn 100 Rapid Rewards points.  Even if you earned all of your SPG points using a Starwood AM EX, you would only need to spend $50,000 to reach the same result.  OF course, most of us are swimming in SPG points these days anyway.

The speculation at FlyerTalk is that one of these exchanging venues will soon change the conversion rates to make this deal much less desirable.  But, if you are willing to role the dice, and have SPG points to burn, you may be pleasantly surprised.

-nodge


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## DavidnRobin (Nov 2, 2007)

Sounds pretty convoluted - what are the risks?
We are up to about 300K SPs.


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## nodge (Nov 2, 2007)

DavidnRobin said:


> Sounds pretty convoluted - what are the risks?



The main risk is that you could be stuck with Amtrak points or Choice hotel points if either of those entities elects to arbitrarily cancel or change the conversion terms.

Before I posted this plan, I did steps 1-3.  It took 8 days total (5 days for SPG to Amtrak to post, 2 days for Amtrak to Choice to post, and 1 day for Choice to Southwest to post).  It works, but it is indeed a convoluted path to the end result.

-nodge


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## tomandrobin (Nov 6, 2007)

Nodge

How long are the rewards for? I know the normal rewards are for one year, so does that mean you need to book by one year or travel by one year?

Tom


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## pointsjunkie (Nov 6, 2007)

you have one year from the date the award is issued to fly.


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## tomandrobin (Nov 6, 2007)

pointsjunkie said:


> you have one year from the date the award is issued to fly.



Grrrrr...I'll have to wait until the end of the year to try it. We already have SW rewards to use in the spring for two trips, we are flying on Continental in June for Harborside, and US Air in the fall for Hawaii. That just leaves NYE trip next December.


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## nodge (Nov 6, 2007)

tomandrobin said:


> Nodge
> 
> How long are the rewards for? I know the normal rewards are for one year, so does that mean you need to book by one year or travel by one year?
> 
> Tom



Southwest reward tickets are good for a year from the date of issuance.  Travel must be COMPLETED by the one year deadline.

Shhhhhhh, Southwest doesn’t promote this, but you can extend that one year deadline indefinitely by paying Southwest $50 for a year extension.

You can also use 2 Southwest Rapid Rewards to book 1 flight to Hawaii on ATA.  The Companion Pass only works on Southwest though.

Here are few other benefits associated with this deal:

Southwest’s “Companion Pass” is the highest frequent flyer reward it offers.  So at airports that have special security lines for “elite” members of airline frequent flyer programs (like we do here in Portland), you and your family can avoid long security lines just by flashing your companion pass.

For each Rapid Reward that you earn, you also are given 4 free drink coupons.

Anyone can fly using your RR Awards, so long as you book it for them.  Accordingly, we will likely donate 4 awards to our kids' school auction along with an II Exchange.   Our out of pocket costs are minimal, and the school earns some serious cash.

Companion Pass bookings are not subject to black-out dates or seat restrictions.  If Southwest has a seat, your companion gets it.  So even if you end up paying for one full fare ticket (like a last minute flight home for a family emergency) because the award seats are sold out, your companion still flies for free (subject to a max $10 security fee).

With this many free tickets to burn, you could also actually take advantage of one or two last minute deals promoted here on TUG.  Why not fly to Scottsdale for the weekend this winter? With free flights and cheap accommodations, you’d probably spend just as much staying home.

We really like Southwest airlines.  For example, upon us landing at Ontario, California recently the Southwest flight attendant got on the PA and announced “Welcome to Honolulu, Hawaii,” and then cautioned us when opening the overhead bins because “Shift Happens.”  I digress, but my all time favorite "Southwestism" is when the flight attendent asks over the PA for anyone that is too hot to raise their hand.  She then tells these folks to use their raised hand to reach up and open the air vent above them and they'll cool down.  Classic.

I flew Northwest last week, after having flown Southwest almost exclusively for the past year, and it’s like night and day--  humorless and grumpy flight attendants, bad service, the works.    

Having earned a companion pass the old fashioned way, this Flyertalk SPG to Southwest method is one of the best redemption deals going, especially if you’ve got SPG points to burn.

-nodge


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## tomandrobin (Nov 6, 2007)

> Southwest reward tickets are good for a year from the date of issuance.  Travel may be booked for dates more than a year from issuance, but those reservations must be booked within the one year deadline.



So I can get the rewards by next week. Book travel next October 2008, for travel in December 2008. That would be 13.5 months from time of reward. 



> Shhhhhhh, Southwest doesn’t promote this, but you can extend that one year deadline indefinitely by paying Southwest $50 for each year of extension.


 
Is this $50 fee per reward or for all of the rewards?


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## nodge (Nov 6, 2007)

Oops, I was wrong.  I just called SWA and all TRAVEL must be completed by the one year deadline.

I was right about the $50 extension though.  It is $50 per award, but you can wait up to 24 months after expiration to revive it.  Click here for more info on this extension/revival deal.  (By my calculations, you can delay using an award for up to 4 years (1 year orginal term, 2 years afterward, plus 1 year upon timely submitted revival) for $50/award.)

-nodge


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## wingkng (Nov 7, 2007)

Thanks for this great tip.  I called member services at Starwood, and they actually gave me an additional 5000 Starpoints for transferring over 20,000 Starpoints to Amtrak (just like for with airline miles).  I don't know if that is in error, but I'll take it.  So, today I just confirmed that I received 30,000 points (25,000 I redeemed, plus 5000 bonus) into my Amtrak account, and I just ordered my Choice Privileges points.  I wonder how long it will take to get it to me.  Amtrak is suppose to mail these redemption points to me.


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## nodge (Nov 7, 2007)

wingkng said:


> Thanks for this great tip.  I called member services at Starwood, and they actually gave me an additional 5000 Starpoints for transferring over 20,000 Starpoints to Amtrak (just like for with airline miles).  I don't know if that is in error, but I'll take it.  So, today I just confirmed that I received 30,000 points (25,000 I redeemed, plus 5000 bonus) into my Amtrak account, and I just ordered my Choice Privileges points.  I wonder how long it will take to get it to me.  Amtrak is suppose to mail these redemption points to me.



Congrats wingkng!

At the time I transferred points from SPG to Amtrak, I was told that I would get a 5000 point bonus, but when the points actually showed up, the bonus was missing.  I called SPG, and they told me there was no bonus when converting to Amtrak.  The Bonus appears to depend on who you get at SPG.

As for the Amtrak to Choice conversion, it will all happen online.  Nothing will be mailed to you (even though the Amtrak notice says it will).  It took about 2 business days for me.  Just keep checking your Choice account.

-nodge

PS.  Earlier today Southwest announced these changes.  The companion pass survives.  It just looks like SWA is going to start charging more for guaranteed "A" tickets.


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## tomandrobin (Nov 8, 2007)

I was going to hold of to try this conversion, but after seeing SWA new prices that were released today, it may be worth it even if I have to pay the extra $50 to extend the reward. Still debating the value of this deal.


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## nodge (Nov 8, 2007)

tomandrobin said:


> Still debating the value of this deal.



If you can’t use 12 tix on Southwest, I agree, there is no value.  If you can find a use for all 12 tickets, the math works out like this:

If each round trip ticket on SWA is worth $200:

12 tix X $200 = $2400.00
Value of each StarPoint:  $2400/50,000 Starpoints = 4.8 cents

If each round trip ticket on SWA is worth $300:

12 tix X $300 = $3600
Value of each StarPoint:  $3600/50,000 Starpoints = 7.2 cents

If each round trip ticket on SWA is worth $400

12 tix X $400 = $4800
Value of each StarPoint:  $4800/50,000 Starpoints =  9.6 cents

If each round trip ticket is worth $500:

12 tix X $500 = $6000.00
Value of Each StarPoint:  $6000.00/50,000 Starpoints = 12.00 cents


Considering the fact that Starwood sells SPG points for 3.5 cents/each (and it's considered a huge rip-off to pay that much for ‘em), under this deal SWA is essentially paying you at least 4.8 cents a piece for your StarPoints.  In other words, you could pay Starwood  3.5 cents/StarPoint and then turn right around and make at least a 1.3 cent profit on each StarPoint you purchased by “selling” them to SWA.

From a pure math perspective, this is a tremendous deal (and even more so if you get an SPG agent that gives you the 5000 SPG bonus too).  

This math also suggests that one of the transferring entities in this process will soon figure out that they are giving away the farm and change the conversion terms.  Accordingly, the speculation on flyertalk is that folks should get in on this deal while the gettin’ is good.

-nodge

Here's another math thing:

Suppose we all weren't sitting on a ton of SPG points anyway, but had to pay retail and buy all 50,000 SPG points from Starwood.  The total cost for 50,000 SPG points would be $1750.  If you did this deal and converted those 50,000 SPG points into 12 roundtrip tix on SWA, the total cost per roundtrip ticket would be $145.83.   If SWA ran a promotion where folks could buy a package of 12 roundtrips for $1750, do you think that package would sell?  If so, even paying retail for StarPoints is a good deal.  Of course, none of us paid retail for our Starpoints so this SWA deal is even better.


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## wingkng (Nov 9, 2007)

I just had the points deposited into the Choice Privileges account this morning, and so I went ahead and converted them to SWA points.  I can't believe how quick everything went through.

I then went on a hunt to see what else can be done.  As it turns out, I have 20,000Continental Onepass miles I can't use, and today I received an email saying that there is a major devaluation of these miles in Feb '08.  So, I figure I would just convert my Onepass miles to Amtrak points (5000 miles = 5000 points).  With this, I will have enough points to do another conversion to Choice Privileges in January, so I can get another 3 free tickets on SWA.

If this happens, my wife and I will be set for the next 4 years (given that I can still revive expired award tickets as nodge suggested)

Thanks, Nodge, for the great idea.


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## tomandrobin (Nov 9, 2007)

We are going to start the process tomorrow, if SPG is open. After seeing the new SWA prices, we think it'll be worth the exchange.


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## GeorgeJ. (Nov 10, 2007)

What would the math be on 10,000 SPG points into Southwest credits rather than 25000? Can you convert a smaller amount?

I have 10000 Continental miles that I will probably redeem (it appears that 10000 Continental miles = 10000 SPG points) rather than SPG...If that would convert into 20 Southwest credits, that would be excellent...


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## nodge (Nov 10, 2007)

GeorgeJ. said:


> What would the math be on 10,000 SPG points into Southwest credits rather than 25000? Can you convert a smaller amount?
> 
> I have 10000 Continental miles that I will probably redeem (it appears that 10000 Continental miles = 10000 SPG points) rather than SPG...If that would convert into 20 Southwest credits, that would be excellent...



Yes, 10,000 SPG points can be converted into 20 Southwest RR credits. 

Here's the math:

Step 1:  10,000 SPG converts to 10,000 Amtrak  (1 SPG  to 1 Amtrak conversion ratio:  5000 SPG minimum to convert)

Step 2:  10,000 Amtrak converts to 50,000 Choice Hotel points (5000 Amtrak to 25,000 Choice Hotel conversion ratio:  5,000 Amtrak minimum to convert)

Step 3:  50,000 Choice Hotel points converts to 20 Southwest credits (5000 to 2 conversion ratio:  5000 Choice Hotel minimum to convert)

Same math for your Continental points.  (10,000 Continental = 20 Southwest RR points).  You can convert your Continental points directly into Amtrak (Step 1), and then do Steps 2 & 3 from there.

Good luck,
-Nodge


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## Need to Travel (Nov 11, 2007)

*How best to earn SPG points?*



nodge said:


> Of course, most of us are swimming in SPG points these days anyway.
> -nodge



I'm new to the SPG program so my account balance is 0, but I am intrigued by this process to get free airline tickets.
What is the most effective way that you earn SPG points?
When I try to search 
SPG under the forums it doesnt like it so I cant seem to find much on this program. Do you travel a lot or do you use your Amex card?
Thanks in advance


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## Need to Travel (Nov 11, 2007)

*All aboard!*

I decided it was probably worth opening an Amtrak account and credit card. The card gives me 5,000 pts. Hopefully nothing disappears before I get the credit card and the points converted.


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## Pat H (Nov 11, 2007)

Need to Travel said:


> I'm new to the SPG program so my account balance is 0, but I am intrigued by this process to get free airline tickets.
> What is the most effective way that you earn SPG points?
> When I try to search
> SPG under the forums it doesnt like it so I cant seem to find much on this program. Do you travel a lot or do you use your Amex card?
> Thanks in advance



The SPG AMEX is a great way to go. Right now they have an offer for 10,000 points for getting the card. If you stay at any Starwood property and use the card to pay, you get points for the stay + points for using the AMEX. If you ever go to Europe, exchanging points for a stay in hotel is a great deal. Also, with some airlines, you get a 5,000 mile bonus if you transfer 20,000 points. Probably 95% of my points come from the card.


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## pointsjunkie (Nov 11, 2007)

Need to Travel said:


> I'm new to the SPG program so my account balance is 0, but I am intrigued by this process to get free airline tickets.
> What is the most effective way that you earn SPG points?
> When I try to search
> SPG under the forums it doesnt like it so I cant seem to find much on this program. Do you travel a lot or do you use your Amex card?
> Thanks in advance



the best way to acquire*points is throught the *wood credit card? there is a card that will gat you 40000 starpoints within a six month period IF you can spend or do spend $15000 in a 6 month period.

but for those of you who want to skip all the conversion. go on :
www.southwest.com/freeticket. pay the $59 use the card once and the ticket is in your account. just did it for me and my spouse and we both have 2 free tickets that we are using for arizona in march. each ticket would have cost over $400. the $59 was money well spent.


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## Need to Travel (Nov 11, 2007)

*48 or 50 states?*

Is the ticket good for all 50 states or 48?


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## pointsjunkie (Nov 11, 2007)

48 states to travel on ATA  with southwest rapid rewards you would need double each way.


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## nodge (Nov 13, 2007)

Need to Travel said:


> Is the ticket good for all 50 states or 48?



Here is a map of all Southwest Airlines cities (orange dots) and ATA cities (black triangles).

Mainland US Southwest and ATA flights "cost" one SWA Rapid Reward ticket.

Hawaii via ATA "costs" two Rapid Reward tickets.

"Companion Pass" flights can only be booked on Southwest flights.

As for signing up for credit cards to earn free tickets on Southwest, the good folks at FlyerTalk have made this game an art form.  One downside of signing up for too many credit cards is that it can negatively impact your FICO (credit) score.  Be careful.

-nodge


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## arlene22 (Nov 15, 2007)

Okay, I got the SPG points put in the Amtrak account, but when I went to transfer the Amtrack points to  Choice, the confirmation said:

25,000 Choice Privileges Points
  Item # 4012
  5,000 Points
  To be mailed

(same thing five times)

The "to be mailed" part is making me nervous. Did it say something different when you did it?


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## nodge (Nov 15, 2007)

arlene22 said:


> The "to be mailed" part is making me nervous. Did it say something different when you did it?



Don't worry about it. My transaction said the same thing.  The points will appear in your Choice account in about two days.  Just keep checking.

-nodge


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## pointsjunkie (Nov 15, 2007)

is there another airline that converts to amtrak besides CO?


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## nodge (Nov 15, 2007)

pointsjunkie said:


> is there another airline that converts to amtrak besides CO?



Midwest Airlines also converts to Amtrak

According to this website originally posted in 2003, "you can only convert Continental and Midwest miles to Amtrak points." 

Check out this handy-dandy mileage converter.  You tell it what miles/points you have and it tells you the best ways (if possible) for converting those miles/points into another program.  I just tried it for the Starwood to Southwest path spelled out in the OP.  It works.

-nodge


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## arlene22 (Nov 15, 2007)

nodge said:


> Don't worry about it. My transaction said the same thing.  The points will appear in your Choice account is about two days.  Just keep checking.
> 
> -nodge



Whew! Thanks.


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## tomandrobin (Nov 15, 2007)

We are waiting for the point transfer from Amtrack to Choice. Oh, just a FYI, we got the extra 5000 points with out spg transfer.


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## tomandrobin (Nov 16, 2007)

We made our conversion to SouthWest Rapid Rewards account this morning. 

Sunday called SPG made transfer to Amtrack
Wednesday we transfered Amtrack to Choice
Friday we transfered Choice to Southwest

Now all we need to do is wait for Southwest to post!


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## atstpier (Nov 16, 2007)

*Choice*

Mine said the same thing, but my Choice points showed up about 2 days later.  I just transferred my Choice points to Southwest.  I hit a little glitch because my Southwest reward number was not registered with Choice.  I called the customer service center and they took care of it.  I believe you should register your Southwest reward number in your Choice profile before you redeem the points.


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## wingkng (Nov 16, 2007)

I received my 50 RR points in my account a couple of days ago.  Now I just have to wait for Jan 1 to come around, so I can convert some more points.  Thank you for the mileage converter info.  This will come in handy for the future.


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## tomandrobin (Nov 22, 2007)

We got out 50 rewards deposited last night into our account! 

Thank you very much!

Now just need to do it all again in January!


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## arlene22 (Nov 23, 2007)

*Should I be worried?*

Made an amtrak transfer on the 15th, but the points haven't shown up in the Choice account yet. Amtrak says to give it 4-6 weeks...


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## tomandrobin (Nov 23, 2007)

arlene22 said:


> Made an amtrak transfer on the 15th, but the points haven't shown up in the Choice account yet. Amtrak says to give it 4-6 weeks...



Amtrak completes thier transfers on Fridays. That is what I read on the other board and that is the day we got our transfer.


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## arlene22 (Nov 23, 2007)

okay, thanks for the info. I won't panic just yet


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## sharktzu (Nov 27, 2007)

How long did you guys have to wait for the SP to show up in your amtrak account? I converted last week, but haven't seen the points deposited yet.


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## tomandrobin (Nov 27, 2007)

sharktzu said:


> How long did you guys have to wait for the SP to show up in your amtrak account? I converted last week, but haven't seen the points deposited yet.



It took about 3-4 days for the Starpoint to Amteack transfer. If you did it Wednesday, you had a 4 day holiday to take into account.


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## pointsjunkie (Nov 27, 2007)

did starwood give all of you the extra 5000 starpoints when transferring to amtrak?


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## tomandrobin (Nov 27, 2007)

pointsjunkie said:


> did starwood give all of you the extra 5000 starpoints when transferring to amtrak?



We got 5,000 extra points with our transfer.


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## Need to Travel (Nov 27, 2007)

*Is this card a special Edition*



Need to Travel said:


> pointsjunkie said:
> 
> 
> > the best way to acquire*points is throught the *wood credit card? there is a card that will gat you 40000 starpoints within a six month period IF you can spend or do spend $15000 in a 6 month period.
> ...


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## philemer (Nov 27, 2007)

Need to Travel said:


> Need to Travel said:
> 
> 
> > Is that any Amex *wood card or is it a certain one?
> ...


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## JudyS (Nov 27, 2007)

*Can you transfer points to someone else's account?*

This sounds like a great deal! I would like to do this, but I have only 11,000 Starwood points.  It sounds like a lot of folks here have surplus Starpoints, though.  Do any of these three programs (SPG, Amtrak, Choice Hotel) allow people to transfer points to someone else's account?  If they do, maybe I could work out some sort of trade with someone here. 

If not, I may try to cobble together enough points through various "shopping for Points" programs. The link Pointsjunkie posted provides up to 24 Rapid Reward Credits by opening a Southwest Credit Card and doing a balance transfer, so you would need "only" 76 more Rapid Reward Credits to get the 100 needed for a companion pass. You can get 10,000 Starpoints by opening a Starpoint Credit card.  You can get 5,000 Amtrak points by opening an Amtrak credit card, but I'm not sure that's enough to make it worthwhile; as others have said here, your credit rating takes a hit if you open too many new accounts at once. (What I've heard is you can open up to 2 new credit lines of any sort in 6 months; more than that and your credit rating goes down.) 

Amtrak also seems to award points for signing up for various things: 1500 for Netflix (I already havea Netflix account, unfortunately); 1500 for Stamps.com; and 1500 for Verizon (not sure that would be worth it.)   They also have a program where you get points for shopping. 

Also, I checked Southwest's site, and they say you don't have to have the same companion for the whole year.  Their Companion Pass lets you switch up to three times.  So, say, you could travel with your spouse a few times, then if they were busy, switch to traveling with a friend, then switch to traveling with your sibling, then back to traveling with your spouse.  However, you have to mail in the companion pass in order to switch, and getting the new pass can take up to 21 days.




pointsjunkie said:


> the best way to acquire*points is throught the *wood credit card? there is a card that will gat you 40000 starpoints within a six month period IF you can spend or do spend $15000 in a 6 month period.
> 
> but for those of you who want to skip all the conversion. go on :
> www.southwest.com/freeticket. pay the $59 use the card once and the ticket is in your account. just did it for me and my spouse and we both have 2 free tickets that we are using for arizona in march. each ticket would have cost over $400. the $59 was money well spent.


Thanks for the Southwest link!  That's a better deal that the offer on the Southwest home page.

Do you have a link for the Starwood Credit Card promo that provides 40,000 points for spending $15,000?  All I can find is one for 10,000 points, plus 1 point per dollar, which would total 25,000 points for spending $15,000.


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## DTLE949 (Nov 28, 2007)

*how to apply for choice hotels membership*

Hi all,
Can someone kindly tell me how to apply for a "choice hotels" membership/
Is it for comfort inns, econolodge, etc? I'm interested in the conversion from Amtrak to choice hotels to American Airline or Southwest Airline.
If you want to use Southwest credits for ATA flight, how does it work?  Is it an easy process? Do you have to call ATA or do you call Southwest?  I'm thinking about flying ATA from LAX to Hawaii next summer.

Thanks for your help.


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## myip (Nov 28, 2007)

http://www.choicehotels.com/ires/en-US/html/AirlineMiles?sid=zyUc.Zw6WdgPxz.8


http://www.choicehotels.com/ires/en-US/html/GPAirlineRewards?sid=zyUc.Zw6WdgPxz.8


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## tomandrobin (Nov 28, 2007)

What is the weak link of this "transfer to tickets" program?

Which of the companies could or may change the rules of transfer? 

I want to do another 50 rewards for SouthWest, but need to wait until January?


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## atstpier (Nov 28, 2007)

*Amtrak Starbucks Play*

Amtrak guest rewards is offering double points through their shopping online program.  Each $1 spent at Starbucks online when directed through the Amtrak guest rewards website equals 14 points.  I did the math.  If I purchase $571 in Starbucks gift cards I get a free Southwest flight.

$571 x14 = 8,000 amtrak points = 40,000 choice points = 16 reward credits = one flight.


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## pointsjunkie (Nov 28, 2007)

JudyS said:


> This sounds like a great deal! I would like to do this, but I have only 11,000 Starwood points.  It sounds like a lot of folks here have surplus Starpoints, though.  Do any of these three programs (SPG, Amtrak, Choice Hotel) allow people to transfer points to someone else's account?  If they do, maybe I could work out some sort of trade with someone here.
> 
> If not, I may try to cobble together enough points through various "shopping for Points" programs. The link Pointsjunkie posted provides up to 24 Rapid Reward Credits by opening a Southwest Credit Card and doing a balance transfer, so you would need "only" 76 more Rapid Reward Credits to get the 100 needed for a companion pass. You can get 10,000 Starpoints by opening a Starpoint Credit card.  You can get 5,000 Amtrak points by opening an Amtrak credit card, but I'm not sure that's enough to make it worthwhile; as others have said here, your credit rating takes a hit if you open too many new accounts at once. (What I've heard is you can open up to 2 new credit lines of any sort in 6 months; more than that and your credit rating goes down.)
> 
> ...



i put the link on starwood amex thread. it still works.


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## sharktzu (Nov 29, 2007)

Has anyone thought about trying this with a spouses account as well? I have a family of four, so the op's plan really nets me two trips with my entire family which is certainly worth doing, but if I also created accounts for my wife and transfered points in her name, we could both get the companion pass which would let my whole family travel 6 times. Anyone have any experience or advice with this?


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## nodge (Nov 29, 2007)

sharktzu said:


> Has anyone thought about trying this with a spouses account as well? I have a family of four, so the op's plan really nets me two trips with my entire family which is certainly worth doing, but if I also created accounts for my wife and transfered points in her name, we could both get the companion pass which would let my whole family travel 6 times. Anyone have any experience or advice with this?




Hi Sharktzu,

Yep, I'm currently in the process of getting the Southwest Companion Pass (and 6 rapid reward tix) in one of my two son's names.  You just need Starwood to transfer your StarPoints to another family member's SPG account, and then proceed from there (Amtrak to Choice to Southwest) through that family member's separate accounts.

I elected to get the second Companion Pass in my son's name so that my spouse could be designated on my Companion Pass.  That way we can take weekend trips together while leaving the kids at home with grandma without the need to burn two free tix.  My son's companion pass will designate his brother as his companion.

I note that the Amtrak to Choice conversion has taken a lot longer this time around.  I've been waiting over two weeks so far, but it could be that processing speeds are slowing due to higher volume as folks learn of this deal.  I'm not worried.  Yet.

Also, I didn't get the 5000 mile bonus on the SPG to Amtrak conversion this time either.

Good Luck,  and  . . . . . Oh Yeah . . . .  Go STATE!!!!!

-nodge (Spartan Alum)


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## iluvwdw (Nov 29, 2007)

I just transferred 20,000 SPG points, plus the 5,000 bonus points to Amtrak.   This is a great deal!  THANKS NODGE!!!


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## sharktzu (Nov 29, 2007)

That's a great idea Nodge! I had just thought about my wife because she already has an SPG number, but it makes even better sense to do it in my son's name. I'll have to get on that tomorrow. Thanks!  Go Blue!


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## nodge (Dec 2, 2007)

It looks like Amtrak is currently in the process of changing the Amtrak to Choice Hotels conversion.  It looks like they are lowering the Choice Hotel points from the originally posted 25,000 Hotel Points per 5000 Amtrak points down to 15,000 Choice Hotel points per 5000 Amtrak points.

The fine print on Amtrak's web page still shows the original conversion calculation though. 

FYI,

-nodge


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## TheUnitrep (Dec 2, 2007)

nodge said:


> It looks like Amtrak is currently in the process of changing the Amtrak to Choice Hotels conversion.  It looks like they are lowering the Choice Hotel points from the originally posted 25,000 Hotel Points per 5000 Amtrak points down to 15,000 Choice Hotel points per 5000 Amtrak points.
> 
> The fine print on Amtrak's web page still shows the original conversion calculation though.
> 
> ...



Nodge --

I found the following on the Choice site:

_To redeem for Southwest Rapid Rewards® credits, please call the Choice Service Center at 888-770-6800. You qualify to redeem for Southwest Rapid Rewards credits if you previously had a hotel stay since 1/1/06 or if you have used your Choice Privileges Visa® card._ 

There is no longer a way to accomplish the transfer by computer.

Looks like the jig is up.

Jerry


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## arlene22 (Dec 2, 2007)

Holy cow, the flyer talk folks are having a fit over this! Apparently (and this is true in my case) there are lots of folks who requested an Amtrak>Choice transfer at the 5000>25000 rate, receved emails that confirm this, but whose Amtrak accounts now say they transferred 5000>15000. Until they actually post in the Choice account, we won't know how many we get


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## iluvwdw (Dec 4, 2007)

arlene22 said:


> Holy cow, the flyer talk folks are having a fit over this! Apparently (and this is true in my case) there are lots of folks who requested an Amtrak>Choice transfer at the 5000>25000 rate, receved emails that confirm this, but whose Amtrak accounts now say they transferred 5000>15000. Until they actually post in the Choice account, we won't know how many we get



Oh, this STINKS!!!!!!  My points haven't even been posted at Amtrak yet!  Should I transfer them back?  What can I do?


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## sharktzu (Dec 4, 2007)

I'm actually in the same boat. I transfered the funds from amtrak to choices only to find out about the decreased conversion ratio. I called amtrak to protest, but the best I ended up with is an appeal to reverse my transaction to choices. I haven't decided yet if I can use the amtrak points or try to transfer them back to starpoints. Nodge, what are you doing?


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## iluvwdw (Dec 4, 2007)

sharktzu said:


> I'm actually in the same boat. I transfered the funds from amtrak to choices only to find out about the decreased conversion ratio. I called amtrak to protest, but the best I ended up with is an appeal to reverse my transaction to choices. I haven't decided yet if I can use the amtrak points or try to transfer them back to starpoints. Nodge, what are you doing?



If I can convert back to StarPoints, I guess that is what I will do.


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## nodge (Dec 5, 2007)

sharktzu said:


> Nodge, what are you doing?




This was far too good of a deal to last, so I’m not surprised that the two intermediaries in this transaction (Amtrak and Choice) changed the terms.  I AM surprised HOW they did it though – no notice, 11th hour change, etc.   After all, the transaction in the OP, while convoluted, was fully authorized by the respective partners’ own terms and conditions.  It’s almost like Amtrak and Choice borrowed SVO Management’s playbook.

The Guru’s at flyertalk.com have collectively adopted a wait-and-see approach.  They recognize that at least for all the folks that did the transfer from Amtrak to Choice under the original conversion terms (before December 1, 2007), it will be hard for Amtrak to legally justify changing the terms after the fact on confirmed transactions with well documented paper trails.  Accordingly, the folks at flyertalk figure that Amtrak is just taking its authorized 60 days (as authorized in its original terms) to process the transaction to give it time to figure things out.  Flyertalk folks figure Amtrak will eventually honor the original terms on all transactions initiated before Amtrak changed them.  To date, Amtrak hasn’t denied honoring a single conversion transaction (but it appears to have stopped processing them since around Nov 15th or so).

Of more concern is what Choice will do with these 60 days Amtrak is giving it.  If I were a cynical person, I’d bet that Choice will use this time to lower the exchange rate from 2 Rapid Rewards per 5000 Choice points to 1 rapid reward per 5000 Choice point. Or worse yet, kill the Choice to RR conversion altogether.   If Choice did that before our Amtrak points showed up at Choice, there isn’t really much anyone could do about it.

On the plus side, there is a nice Comfort Suites in Okemos, Michigan (just down the road from East Lansing, home of Michigan State University – Go State!), and we visit relatives in East Lansing pretty regularly.  So at a minimum, we’ll probably make better use of Choice points vs. Amtrak points, if it comes to that.  

Also, even with the lower Amtrak to Choice conversion, it’s still a pretty darned good deal (as of today), especially for those who scored the 5000 SPG to Amtrak bonus.  If you have the ability to also earn Rapid Reward points through traditional methods like actually paying retail to fly  SWA or using a SWA credit card, this now watered-down SPG to SWA deal (as of today) still gives you a pretty big leg-up on earning a companion pass.

There are still plenty of other promotions to pick-up the RR point slack.  For example, SWA is currently running this promotion where you earn 1 Rapid Reward credit for each $100 SWA gift card you purchase using your SWA credit card (5 RR credits max).

So, I’ll probably ride this out to the end one way or another and not seek to cancel any transactions.  The folks at Flyertalk are pretty darned militant and they have a strong sense of entitlement, so I figure I’ll just ride their coat-tails.  Either way, it was good while it lasted, and I hope some folks here were able to take full advantage of it.

Now you folks that haven’t tried this deal yet, I strongly encourage you to let the dust settle before entering the game at this point.

-nodge


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## tomandrobin (Dec 5, 2007)

I hope something works out. I really wanted to get another 50 rewards to get to 100 for the companion fares. I am going to wait and see where all the pieces end up falling. I wanted to do the second 50 rewards in January, so hopefully it will work out. The very least, I do 15,000 SPG transfer and get 30 more rewards......That will net me 80 plus the ones we already have. 

Can you transfer SPG points to two different Amtrak accounts, then transfer to one Choice account? That would make it easier to get the rewards.


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## wingkng (Dec 5, 2007)

tomandrobin said:


> I hope something works out. I really wanted to get another 50 rewards to get to 100 for the companion fares. I am going to wait and see where all the pieces end up falling. I wanted to do the second 50 rewards in January, so hopefully it will work out. The very least, I do 15,000 SPG transfer and get 30 more rewards......That will net me 80 plus the ones we already have.
> 
> Can you transfer SPG points to two different Amtrak accounts, then transfer to one Choice account? That would make it easier to get the rewards.



I am in the same boat.  I already have 25,000 AGR points in my account, and am  waiting for the new year to do something with it.  I am glad my first conversion transaction was complete before the new rules.  Meanwhile, I am going to take advantage of the SWA Gift card offer to get me 5 additional RR points closer towards the Companion Pass.


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## tomandrobin (Dec 5, 2007)

wingkng said:


> I am in the same boat.  I already have 25,000 AGR points in my account, and am  waiting for the new year to do something with it.  I am glad my first conversion transaction was complete before the new rules.  Meanwhile, I am going to take advantage of the SWA Gift card offer to get me 5 additional RR points closer towards the Companion Pass.



We don't have a SW visa.....


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## iluvwdw (Dec 13, 2007)

I have the Amtrak points in my account and it won't even get me 2 nights in a Cat 3 hotel??  And now, I can't even transfer to CHOICE REWARDS AT ALL!!!!!!  It says TEMPORARILY UNAVAILABLE.  I just WASTED 20,000 points.     Oh well....good thing all of you got in early!


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## nodge (Dec 13, 2007)

iluvwdw said:


> I can't even transfer to CHOICE REWARDS AT ALL!!!!!!  It says TEMPORARILY UNAVAILABLE.  I just WASTED 20,000 points.     Oh well....good thing all of you got in early!



According to this link, you'll have two weeks starting tomorrow to transfer those Amtrak points to Choice points, but only at the new exchange rate.   After that, you'll need to be an Amtrak select member or hold the Amtrak Mastercard to make the transfer.

Amtrak big wigs confirmed that they will honor the original exchange rate for those of us in limbo prior to Dec 1st.

Ah well, it was fun while it lasted.

-nodge


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## arlene22 (Dec 14, 2007)

Well, my 125,000 Choice points posted this morning, so I thought I was all set. But not so fast. When I called Choice, they said that because my points were from Amtrack, they were frozen and couldn't be used. She read from an email saying that because there were some abuses (use of duplicate accounts), Amtrack would be reclaiming ALL recent Amtrack > Choice transfers. ARGH! She referred me to Amtrack. 

When I called Amtrack, the woman said that this only applies to the people who had duplicate accounts, and shouldn't affect me. She send through an "escalation request" to Choice to let them know that my account was fine. We'll see where that goes. I'm not holding my breath. 

Sounds to me like Choice is freezing all the points to allow enough time for Amtrack to track down all the rule violators and reclaim those points. Don't know how long the "freeze" will last, but it doesn't look good for getting the transfer in before Dec. 31st  Maybe I'll just transfer my points to CO and be done with it. It actually works out better than a straight SPG>CO transfer, anyway, especially since I got the bonus 5,000 from SPG...


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## TheUnitrep (Dec 14, 2007)

125K points arrived in my account this morning, so I called Choice earlier this morning to begin the redemption process.  The representative told me they couldn't do anything with my Choice points since they were transferred from Amtrak. 

She said all points that were transferred from Amtrak are being returned to each individual's Amtrak account.   She suggested that I contact Amtrak if I needed to inquire further.

Is anyone else getting this explanation?

Jerry


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## jillandboy (Dec 15, 2007)

I have been so keen to do this.  We were supposed to be awarded 75k points in connecton w/ our explorer package, but Starwood hasn't given them to us yet.  This is the 3rd major mess up by Starwood that has cost us big time.  I sent them a 4 page letter, I did get a call last week saying that our points are there--- they aren't.  Now the dealio is changing. 

Any update on this?  This is a year we could really use the flights, but it does appear they are putting the kabosh on it.


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