# [2008] destination paradise



## mishugana

I went to a presentation today you pay 8k +250 then pay 150 a year for mantenance and you get 3 weeks a year for about 500  a week . Any experience with this?


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## caribbeansun

Doesn't sound legitimate based on those metrics.


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## swami242

*Destination Paradise,*

My experience with them has been great. Just had 2weeks in Greece that went off without a hitch did pay 1400 but well worth it


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## Vacation Dude

This sounds like a scam to me.

Where are the links? Nevermind, I really don't want any details.


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## mj2vacation

swami242 said:


> My experience with them has been great. Just had 2weeks in Greece that went off without a hitch did pay 1400 but well worth it




wow.... one whole post......  PLANT!


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## sullco

*Destination Paradise*

If it walks like a vacation club, squawks or quacks like a vacation club....etc.

They are BOGUS. Run away fast.


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## Kukuinutmike

*Vacation Club?*

I don’t know if it's a vacation club but I got to stay in the same timeshare resort I own for $299 no tax. With my timeshare for the same 7 nights I pay $770 maintenance fee, 80 RCI fee, $14 per day room tax plus $124 or $199 exchange fee if I go anyplace else. Way cheaper than buying another timeshare week. So far so good here?


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## DeniseM

Here is an interesting review about this company:  http://ripoffreport.com/reports/0/395/RipOff0395453.htm


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## caribbeansun

Gee, two first time posters to the same thread about an obscure company - what are the odds of that happening???

Find somewhere else to shill your goods please.


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## niko

*thats funny......*

I just bought last week at the preview center and hope I didnt get scammed, I have done alot of timeshare presentations, but this one sounds great. 

I will have to say this..... swami is the poster who said he was happy with his experience..... the guy who pulled us off the street was nicknamed swami and his real name he told us was "bob".....damn, thats funny, but also fishy!


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## Surfer Dude

*My experience with Destination Paradise*

My family was in Waikiki over X-mas and my wife and I attended the DP presentation because we were given 50% off tickets to the Polynesian Cultural Center.

What I will write is my experience with DP and my impression about the company.  Remember, your mileage may vary.  You have to make your own decision with regards to the legitimacy of the program and whether it is right for you.

The presentation : DP tried hard to differentiate itself from a timeshare.  The presentation itself was in reverse order of a typical timeshare.  They presented the price first and then they get you excited about the program.  To wrap it up, they lowered the price if you sign NOW and they threw in 2 free airline tickets and a free week condo if you're the first 2 to sign up.

The decision : We liked the information presented.  Before we signed on the doted line, we insisted on looking at their reservation website first (a highly recommended move).  DP obliged but they drove the very short website test.

The awakening : The evening after we signed the deal, when the kids were quietly in bed, I read all the paperwork.  I did not like what I read as some of the information presented was inconsistent with the agreement.  As I replayed the events at the DP office, I became more unhappy with the program.

The straws that broke the camel's back : Why was I displeased with the program?
1. We asked the salesperson and the closer if reservations made through their system can be canceled.  This is very important when traveling with children.  The salesperson said "Yes" and the closer said "You can also buy travel insurance."  The agreement stated that all reservations are final and cannot be canceled for any reason.
2. We had to sign and initial many places in the office, including one on financing.  I was very very very unhappy when the closer said that he applied for a BOA credit card on my behalf and the entire amount of the purchase was charged to it.  Although, one of the forms we signed must have authorized them to do so, I felt that they should have been more explicit about their financing plan.  I happen to be a person who have enough credit cards and do not want any more no matter how attractive the reward may be (free miles, etc.)  I told the closer to void the charge there and then and used my own credit card instead.  I had to cancel the cc myself later on.
3. Unlike timeshares where you get a deed, for your money DP essentially entitles you a software license.  I admit I do not know what inventory system their software uses, but is their software license worth thousands of dollars plus yearly fees?  I wonder if their inventory is any better than those used by priceline, hotwire, skyauction, hotel.com, and the numerous timeshare rental websites.
4. Remember I asked for a website test drive.  The closer who demoed, chose my state.  There were a few pages of availability but I only saw the first page; I asked to see other pages but he changed the subject.  All the pages shown on the first page were of condos in a vacation destination over 100 miles from a big city.

The remedy - Since we were still in Waikiki, I decided to walk to their office the next morning and void the purchase.  The first reason alone is sufficient for me to back off of the deal, so that is what I told them.  I also mentioned reason 2 and that I really do not believe what else I can trust from the presentation.  They attributed the incorrect cancellation info to the new salesperson and they made several attempts to sweeten the offer DRASTICALLY.  Our minds were made up and the answer were instant "no" at each of the offer.

The end - They finally agreed to cancel the membership but said that the $250 is nonrefundable.  If I had changed my mind through no fault of DP, forgoing the doc fees was fine with me.  But since there was misinformation involved, I told DP that if the $250 was withheld, I would dispute my cc charge.  BTW, I had mentioned "presentation information inconsistent with the agreement" in my cancellation letter.  I am happy to report that when we returned from Oahu, there was a DP letter waiting for me stating that the full amount will be refunded to me.  I checked my cc account yesterday and the full amount was indeed refunded.  Happy conclusion.

The lessons -
1. Read your docs immediately and very soon.
2. Insist on a test drive of the system and insist on driving yourself and take as much time as you need.  Make sure it is a live system and do not skim on the details like location and dates.  Best of all, try a scenario like your next dream vacation and make sure the locations available is where you really want to be visiting.
3. If you want to cancel, cancel in person while you're on location.
4. If something is too good to be true, quaff 3 cups of triple latte and read the agreement word by word to make sure that that something is still indeed true.

Throughout the entire ordeal, I felt that DP was polite.


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## stefanie19

*Destination Paradise*

Hello, 

My Experince:  My husband and I went to Hawaii in November for our honeymoon.  We were walking around and someone stopped us at a booth to get discounts on snorkeling.  We ended up tricked into what looked like a timeshare presentation.   We owned in Mexico not too long ago and were not happy with it at all so needless to say we were not interested.  

After talking with the sales person and seeing the presentation it sounded really good.  My husband being in sales was not buying anything.  After getting on the website and seeing one location my husband was sold.  Marival Vacation Club in Nuevo Vallarta was what we had owned.  It cost $24,000 for a week every other year for 99 years plus $850 every other year.  We felt like it would be good because we could trade it and my son would get to use it too.  Being it Texas we could fly to Mexico cheap so it was worth it.  Anyways before we left Mexico we decided not to do it because of the up front cost.  We canceled without a hitch.  Now we were looking at being able to go there 4 times a year for $349.00 a week. I did not believe it could be that easy but after spend about an hour with the manager we were both sold. 

THE TRIP:  We used one of our 4 weeks already in Mexico.  Not at Marival but at  Casitas at El Dorado Royale.  We went to the Destinations Paradise website with the intension of booking at Marival.  After looking at almost every place in P V.  we found the best one and booked it.  I will say we were a little scared we were going to show up in mexico and find our we were scamed.  Well it worked great and we stayed in Mexico at a place that was normally $400 per night for the suite we got.  

REGRETS:  When I was there I was shown a 2 week program for about 5K and I wish I would have saved the $2,000 and done that.  I dont think I will be able to take 4 vacations a year with my husbands work.  

Bottom Line:  For us the bottom line is we get to go places cheaper.  The place was nice and we were happy.  Of course i have to say this is only one week out of hopefully a lot more.  We will come back and post any other places we go with the program.   

Has anyone else actually taken a trip using the program?  
I have seen places on the website that do not look as good as others.  So we will be very selective in the places we choose.  If anyone could tell me of experinces at different locations it would be nice..

If anyone has any questions for me I would be happy to talk.  

Stef-


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## DeniseM

5 out of the 12 posts in this thread are from 1st timers, all but one of them highly recommending this product....It's just one of those things that makes you go "Hmmmmmm....."  

Caveat emptor....


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## taffy19

I googled for destination paradise but came up with several different type of web sites.  Is it an MLM type of company which is a ponzi scheme too.  

There are so many schemses out there today so be very careful.  It's so easy to buy or join anything immediately but getting rid of it, once you own it, is very hard and annoying so be very careful and hold on to your wallet!

Can the people, who are so pleased with whatever they have, give us a web site where we can read what you bought or joined.


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## stefanie19

iconnections said:


> Can the people, who are so pleased with whatever they have, give us a web site where we can read what you bought or joined.



the website is www.destinationparadisehawaii.com

You have to join the program in order to access it though.  

Its not a ponzi scheme,

My husband said that basically what it is

1. They found condos that are not being used by the timeshare owner or that were "traded."

2.  You pay them money ($7,000) to access these condos.  

3. Then you pay a fee to the resort to stay in the resort.

4.  You choose from the website which they say is "real time"

5.  One good thing I think is the fact that my only annual fee is $150.00.

6.  If I no longer want the service I stop paying the $150.00.

   I personally think timeshare is a rip-off, give a company $20,000 or more and then pay $1000 when I want to go?  Isn't that what the $20k was for.

Stef-


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## DeniseM

stefanie19 said:


> the website is www.destinationparadisehawaii.com
> 
> You have to join the program in order to access it though.
> 
> Its not a ponzi scheme,
> 
> My husband said that basically what it is
> 
> 1. They found condos that are not being used by the timeshare owner or that were "traded."



This may have been explained to you this way, but there aren't lost condos laying around out there.  They are deeded property that belong to someone, so this needs more explanation.

If they are renting excess deposits from the timeshare companies, that means they are renting the leftovers that no timeshares owners wanted.



> 2.  You pay them money ($7,000) to access these condos.



You can join RCI or II and rent their excess inventory for a lot less than this.  It only costs $89 a year to be a II member, and there is no ($7,000) upfront membership fee.



> 3. Then you pay a fee to the resort to stay in the resort.



How much do you pay to the resort?



> 5.  One good thing I think is the fact that my only annual fee is $150.00.



Not really, since you already stated that you have to pay a fee to the resort every time, as well.



> 6.  If I no longer want the service I stop paying the $150.00.
> 
> I personally think timeshare is a rip-off, give a company $20,000 or more and then pay $1000 when I want to go?  Isn't that what the $20k was for.
> 
> Stef-



Yes, there are some $20K timeshares, and some that cost a lot more.  But I just bought an ocean FRONT timeshare in Hawaii for a grand total of $98.  Yes, I have to pay maintenance fees, but I get a deed for my money, and a guaranteed high quality vacation every year, that I can reserve whenever I want.  

I wish you well, but my guess is that once the company has collected $7,000 from enough people, they will be history.

Please let us know how it goes when you actually book a trip. 

Good luck!


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## stefanie19

*Got Some New Info!*

Hello,
 I called my sales person because of all the comments on here to get more info and really for a little more assance.  He was kind of short with me this time, and said this is what it comes down to. (according to him)

 They are a registered travel club with the state of hawaii and have a good rating with BBB.  They said that timeshare owners are the easiest customers to get to buy this because they see the value.  

The timershare owner that don't buy it hate it because they get offended that it is cheaper and works better. 

 I will say that this is not for everyone and I think a timeshare "for a grand total of $98 sounds more like a scam then this.  Just kidding  

Please tell me how to buy a timeshare that cheap and i will. 

 What are the maintanace fees? What is the resort you own?  And who did you buy it from?

  You guys have to understand that we used it and it worked.  So I have to be partial to it because of that.  

Let me ask you guys this.  If everything they say is true and we do get to stay in really nice resort all over the world for between $199-$799 is that a good deal?  

Please just answer that for me.  

Thanks Guys,
Stef-


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## DeniseM

Stef - I really did buy a timeshare on ebay a couple of weeks ago for $98.  Start reading post #48 in this thread to see the evidence.  Here are pictures from the resort from our vacation last summer.  We already own 2 weeks there, so we've already stayed there.  The MF is about $900 a year - Avg. for Hawaii, a little high for mainland timeshares.  It is ocean front, on Kauai, next to the Kauai Hilton.

As far as whether your deal is good or not, this is what I would be concerned about:

1.  How long has this company been in business? - What's their track record?

2.  What's the quality of the condos they are renting?

3.  How difficult is it to get the exact week and resort you want?

These vacation clubs are infamous for having problems in these areas.

I wish you well!


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## taffy19

stefanie19 said:


> Hello,
> I called my sales person because of all the comments on here to get more info and really for a little more assance. He was kind of short with me this time, and said this is what it comes down to. (according to him)
> 
> They are a registered travel club with the state of hawaii and have a good rating with BBB. They said that timeshare owners are the easiest customers to get to buy this because they see the value.
> 
> The timershare owner that don't buy it hate it because they get offended that it is cheaper and works better.
> 
> I will say that this is not for everyone and I think a timeshare "for a grand total of $98 sounds more like a scam then this. Just kidding
> 
> Please tell me how to buy a timeshare that cheap and i will.
> 
> What are the maintanace fees? What is the resort you own? And who did you buy it from?
> 
> You guys have to understand that we used it and it worked. So I have to be partial to it because of that.
> 
> Let me ask you guys this. If everything they say is true and we do get to stay in really nice resort all over the world for between $199-$799 is that a good deal?
> 
> Please just answer that for me.
> 
> Thanks Guys,
> Stef-


Stef is obviously not a shill.  What worries me though is that the salesman no longer has patience with her after she has bought so I hope it is not a scam and she will not lose her $7,000 eventually.   

The company belongs to the BBB but can she verify that?  We can't even access the web site which is strange.  Most web sites have an "about us" page but not here.   

There are so many scams out there and new ones popping up every day.  I hope for Stef and the others that it is OK and they can continue their vacations.


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## stefanie19

DeniseM said:


> 1.  How long has this company been in business? - What's their track record?They have been in business for 17 years.
> 
> 2.  What's the quality of the condos they are renting? Wyhndam, Marriot, Shell, and a lot of private small named condos.  All very nice I must say.
> 
> 3.  How difficult is it to get the exact week and resort you want? That may be the only catch.  Not every resort will have every week there.  But there is always something nice at all location on every week.
> 
> These vacation clubs are infamous for having problems in these areas.
> 
> I wish you well!




Thank you guys for making me asked the hard questions.  

P.S. my husband still thinks it is good.


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## Surfer Dude

*Checking out if DP is any good*

stefanie19, would you be willing to run some test to help us determine if DP is of any value?  Perhaps DP is the next big thing in the travel industry and we're just too paranoid (and for good reason for the $$$ involved and lack of historical data).

Test 1:

Check DP for condo availability in the Washington DC metro area from 1/17 to 1/20?  I would be impressed if you find any.  Ok, ok, this is not a fair test. :rofl: 

Test 2:

Check DP for condo availability in Washington state a week in the summer, say 7/11-7/18.  How may places are in Seattle?  How many places are in the San Juan Islands?  How many places are there in WA overall?  Although there many cool places in WA, if I were an out of state or country visitor visiting WA (not visiting relatives), I would probably be interested in Seattle and perhaps the San Juan Islands.

When we test drove the DP site during my presentation, about 5 pages of availabilities showed up, and all the places on the first page were in Lake Chelan.  Although Lake Chelan is a fine place for boating, swimming, etc., I suspect it would not be a first destination of choice for a visitor.

Although DP claimed to be in biz for 17 years, the first 7 or so years were spent on software development prior to making their site live.

Thank you.


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## stefanie19

Hey SurferDude!  

I just checked and there were a total of 781 and these were all the places for that week.

Blaine, Chelen, Copalis, Beach, Glacier, Manson, Ocean Shores, Port Townsend, Seattle, Union.  

I looked into some of the places and every single one looks like a nice place.  You got me looking into to making to trip up there.  Thanks!

Stef


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## Surfer Dude

*Thanks*

Of all the places you listed, if I were to take a week off and fly in to visit WA, Seattle is probably the only logical destination for a typical visitor.  The other places would be fine for visitors driving in from neighboring states.

Seattle covers about 92 sq miles, and most visitors would probably want to stay in the downtown area.  It would be interesting to find out how many condos on the DP availability list actually is in Seattle downtown.


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## anav

*First Time Poster*

Hi Everyone, 

First time posting (ever!) My Husband and went to Waikiki for our honeymoon and bought into the whole Destination Paradise Scam. I have started doing a lot of research and have found *A LOT *of people that are in the same boat. I have file a complaint with the BBB of Hawaii and would like to get the names, contact info and stories of others that are in the same situation. Please contact me in any way that you would like to. We are having an extremely hard time trying to cancel, and it is (sigh) ruining our credit.

My email address would probably be the easiest, it is a.venegas@yahoo.com 

*Thank you*
Ana


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## PerryM

*Could be, probably isn't....*

Treat this company as a black box – you have no idea what it’s doing behind the scenes.

Maintenance fees are the base rate they can charge.  I’m going to guess that for a 2BR fractional use condo (timeshare, fractional) the MF is $750 a year. So that would be a break-even price to charge.

For a 1BR $600 and for a studio $450.

No company can offer rentals for less than this unless they are RCI or II or some exchange company where the MF has no bearing.  If this company gets into exchanging then the above rates are meaningless and exchange fees become the lowest rate charge.  Let’s just guess $125 per villa plus a membership fee.


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## zagadka

*DP were so funny*

we just came back from Waikiki. I was curious to find out more info about DP and stumbled upon this forum. 

Here are my thoughts:

the reason we attended the presentation was for the free 2 day Jeep rental, which we got and were very happy with it.

As far as the presentation goes, here is what I liked and did not like
Liked:
-the idea is great. I currently use priceline.com for my hotels and I would be willing to pay a yearly membership fee to be able to access better/more accomodations

Disliked
-having said that (above), I think the $8K downpayment+$200 ($150 pre-authorization plan)+HIGHER than priceline's charge per use = is not worth it for us.

For example: I paid $350USD to stay in Waikiki for a week in a hotel. Yes, the hotel was on the crappier side, but I could have gotten a 4* hilton for $100-120/night through priceline. We just didn't want to do that because vacation is about seeing places, not staying in your hotel room.

With DP i would have paid $700/week (more or less) for a better accomodation. Sure, I'd get better quality - but is it really worth it for more money per use+portion of the downpayment and $200/year fee? Let's say I take 2 vacations a yer - that equals an additional $100 every visit. 

Plus, I think the biggest turnoff for me was the fact that they did not want to test drive the site with me. They said they had no time. HAHHAHAHA. I was curious to see prices around NYC - wither for a weekly condo or for a hotel (yes, they mentioned they have hotel discounts as well). And I might have signed up IF hotel prices were significantly lower than priceline's levels.

I do take a few vacations throughout the year, but most are "see new city-move on", and a condo would not work there. So the hotel portion what might have sold me, IF they did a test drive.

BTW, after I loughed in their face about the $8K - they've lowered the cost to $2,500K for 10 years (vs. lifetime) and a second time they've added the lifetime to the $2,500. 

But still, $2500+$200/yearly+cost of actual condo > priceline+flexibility

I was also worried about prices during high seasons. I had a feeling thir presentation involved low season options. And better seasons would be either costlier, or would not have inventory. 

but teh Jeep was great. I'd visit their presentation again if I'm ever back to Hawaii for another gift. 

PS. I've never been to a timeshare presentation before, so I might have a different perspective at this thing than some timeshare owners. 

PS2:
BTW, DP did not leave us with any info - no brochures, no site address - nothing. Even though I've specifically asked for it.


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## zagadka

*?*

PS. what are RCI? I've googled it, but can't seem to find a definite answer


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## DeniseM

Welcome to TUG!  

RCI is an exchange company.  You can deposit your timeshare with them and exchange it for another TS of your choice - in theory. 

The offer you received is not representative of timeshare ownership - it's more of a vacation club.  If a week in a full condo doesn't appeal to you, you made the right decision, and probably timeshare ownership won't appeal to you either.  We like the fact that we can stay in a roomy condo with a bedroom. full kitchen, washer and dryer, and living room, for far less than the equivalent hotel, but that doesn't appeal to everyone.  If you want to find out more, we'd love for you to hang around and talk TS with us.


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## stefanie19

*Omg Still?*



PerryM said:


> Treat this company as a black box – you have no idea what it’s doing behind the scenes.
> 
> Maintenance fees are the base rate they can charge.  I’m going to guess that for a 2BR fractional use condo (timeshare, fractional) the MF is $750 a year. So that would be a break-even price to charge.
> 
> For a 1BR $600 and for a studio $450.
> 
> No company can offer rentals for less than this unless they are RCI or II or some exchange company where the MF has no bearing.  If this company gets into exchanging then the above rates are meaningless and exchange fees become the lowest rate charge.  Let’s just guess $125 per villa plus a membership fee.




Hello everyone, 
I have been really busy but I thought I would stop by and see what else is being said about this Scam!!!LOL    
HERE IS WHAT MY HUSBAND HAS TO SAY:

I just dont get why people think this is a scam!:hysterical: 
I have had this program now for a few months and I FREAKIN LOVE IT!

As an owner with Destination Paradise I am not paying MF or Exchange Fees I am simply renting condos that have not been sold or have been traded into RCI and II.  I can get a Condo almost anywhere in the world and do not have to call anyone but simply put in my user ID and Password.  Click on the location I want to go.  Put in my Dates and the size I want and CLICK BOOK.  Pay for the condo and GO!!!!

Please someone tell me why this is a scam!

I have looked at this "$98" timeshares on eBay.  EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM I CAN STAY AT FOR $299 OR $399 PEAK SEASON UP TO 8 TIMES A YEAR with only 1 week notice normally.  I HAVE LOOKED INTO THIS COMPANY THANKS TO THIS WEBSITE AND MY WIFE AND I CAN ASSURE YOU THERE IS NO SCAM!  EMAIL ME AT stefanie_smith19@yahoo.com if you would like more information.  

If a timeshare owner goes into this presentation with an open mind and not an ego they would realize it is 100% better and 1000% cheaper than timeshare and you are staying at the same places. 

_[Rental Ad deleted.  We have a strict no-advertising rule on TUG.  DeniseM Moderator]_


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## PerryM

*Phew - what's that smell (not me)*



stefanie19 said:


> Hello everyone,
> I have been really busy but I thought I would stop by and see what else is being said about this Scam!!!LOL
> HERE IS WHAT MY HUSBAND HAS TO SAY:
> 
> I just dont get why people think this is a scam!:hysterical:
> I have had this program now for a few months and I FREAKIN LOVE IT!
> 
> As an owner with Destination Paradise I am not paying MF or Exchange Fees I am simply renting condos that have not been sold or have been traded into RCI and II.  I can get a Condo almost anywhere in the world and do not have to call anyone but simply put in my user ID and Password.  Click on the location I want to go.  Put in my Dates and the size I want and CLICK BOOK.  Pay for the condo and GO!!!!
> 
> Please someone tell me why this is a scam!
> 
> I have looked at this "$98" timeshares on eBay.  EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM I CAN STAY AT FOR $299 OR $399 PEAK SEASON UP TO 8 TIMES A YEAR with only 1 week notice normally.  I HAVE LOOKED INTO THIS COMPANY THANKS TO THIS WEBSITE AND MY WIFE AND I CAN ASSURE YOU THERE IS NO SCAM!  EMAIL ME AT stefanie_smith19@yahoo.com if you would like more information.
> 
> If a timeshare owner goes into this presentation with an open mind and not an ego they would realize it is 100% better and 1000% cheaper than timeshare and you are staying at the same places.
> 
> 
> [Rental Ad deleted. We have a strict no-advertising rule on TUG. DeniseM Moderator]



I don't believe one single word you are saying.

Make 1,000 posts and prove you are not a scam and then plug a company and I'd have some respect.

Right now I smell a scam and it stinks.

I will gladly apologize if a reputable TUGGER can verify any of this.

I'm not going to waste my time - I'd rather read my spam folder there are a lot more creative scams in there....


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## playdeep

Just signed up today (6th of March). Had we not been late for a tour, I might have noticed that the binder we were sent home with had no information of substance in it nor web url for login. I also neglected to ask about cancelation if we were unhappy. Kinda surprised that I didnt ask about certain things after the fact. Not sure what to think now. I will be checking into it again tomorrow morning. Most of what I can find on the internet about this company is negative. Will report back. Unsure what to do as we paid using a check since we didnt have enough limits on the cards we had on us at the time. I did a stop payment on check but am unsure if they cashed it yet as the bank wont be certain till tomorrow morning.  I also plan to send cancelation letters by certified mail tomorrow if needed.


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## wilmetted

*Its a little fishy to me!*

I just got back from a destination paradise presentation about 2 hours ago. The only positive thing is the fact that we got a luau package valued at $200. Other than that, here are the negatives:

1)During the presentation, my husband and I noticed that the site was not live. They were showing us availability from the middle of January and February which is not a peak travel period.

2)I only recognized one of the resorts as somewhere that I might stay. I am a little picky.... ok, very picky

3)They did not have any tangible paper information
4)They told us that 19 out of 23 people they saw yesterday bought but n our group, only 2 bought so...... I think that may be a lie.

5)I felt that they tried to put more pressure on timeshare owners. They asked during their powerpoint presention if anyone owned a timeshare. 3 couples said yes and after 2 hours, I noticed that those of us who owned timeshares were the only ones still in the room.

6)In the beginning of the presentation, they said they were affiliated with hilton, marriot, hyatt and similar companies but they could not pull up inventory from any of these companies


I have a lot more to say but I would rather go enjoy my vacation now. I just wanted to see what Tuggers thought. This is purely my opinion. In theory, the program sounds good but ..... it is way toooooooo fishy!

Aloha!


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## stefanie19

wilmetted said:


> I just got back from a destination paradise presentation about 2 hours ago. The only positive thing is the fact that we got a luau package valued at $200. Other than that, here are the negatives:
> 
> 1)During the presentation, my husband and I noticed that the site was not live. They were showing us availability from the middle of January and February which is not a peak travel period.
> 
> 2)I only recognized one of the resorts as somewhere that I might stay. I am a little picky.... ok, very picky
> 
> 3)They did not have any tangible paper information
> 4)They told us that 19 out of 23 people they saw yesterday bought but n our group, only 2 bought so...... I think that may be a lie.
> 
> 5)I felt that they tried to put more pressure on timeshare owners. They asked during their powerpoint presention if anyone owned a timeshare. 3 couples said yes and after 2 hours, I noticed that those of us who owned timeshares were the only ones still in the room.
> 
> 6)In the beginning of the presentation, they said they were affiliated with hilton, marriot, hyatt and similar companies but they could not pull up inventory from any of these companies
> 
> 
> I have a lot more to say but I would rather go enjoy my vacation now. I just wanted to see what Tuggers thought. This is purely my opinion. In theory, the program sounds good but ..... it is way toooooooo fishy!
> 
> Aloha!



Hey, I am glad to see that someone from this forum went and liked it.  For what is it worth guys I think each and every one of you that own timeshare would like it.  Obviously if everyone that owned timeshare were the only ones left there must be something to it.  Just wondering what made it fishy?  Or are you just hopping on the band wagon?


----------



## stefanie19

wilmetted said:


> I just got back from a destination paradise presentation about 2 hours ago. The only positive thing is the fact that we got a luau package valued at $200. Other than that, here are the negatives:
> 
> 1)During the presentation, my husband and I noticed that the site was not live. They were showing us availability from the middle of January and February which is not a peak travel period.
> 
> 2)I only recognized one of the resorts as somewhere that I might stay. I am a little picky.... ok, very picky
> 
> 3)They did not have any tangible paper information
> 4)They told us that 19 out of 23 people they saw yesterday bought but n our group, only 2 bought so...... I think that may be a lie.
> 
> 5)I felt that they tried to put more pressure on timeshare owners. They asked during their powerpoint presention if anyone owned a timeshare. 3 couples said yes and after 2 hours, I noticed that those of us who owned timeshares were the only ones still in the room.
> 
> 6)In the beginning of the presentation, they said they were affiliated with hilton, marriot, hyatt and similar companies but they could not pull up inventory from any of these companies
> 
> 
> I have a lot more to say but I would rather go enjoy my vacation now. I just wanted to see what Tuggers thought. This is purely my opinion. In theory, the program sounds good but ..... it is way toooooooo fishy!
> 
> Aloha!




Also you said you were picky?  Where are you staying at now?  I am going with my Husband using the program and only paying $349.00 for 7 days at the Wyndym at Waikiki Beach Walk.


----------



## PerryM

*What?*



stefanie19 said:


> *Hey, I am glad to see that someone from this forum went and liked it.*  For what is it worth guys I think each and every one of you that own timeshare would like it.  Obviously if everyone that owned timeshare were the only ones left there must be something to it.  Just wondering what made it fishy?  Or are you just hopping on the band wagon?



Geez the only positive thing the poster boasted about was the $200 luau tickets and you come to the conclusion that this is a great thing to buy.  Where is the logic in this?  If you can read anything positive in the review then I am reassured of my previous conclusions of your posts.

This is all a scam – its way too good to be true – isn’t that obvious to everyone?

Click this chart and then click the “5y” zoom tab and you will notice how the financial world is voting on how things are going in the US.   The US has lost 50% of its wealth in the stock market and 15% in real estate in just 2 years.

So if you want to blow your money on crazy schemes like this then go right ahead – but don’t say that someone didn’t warn you that this is all a scam and you will need all your money you have left just to survive what's about to befall us.

This goes for ANY frivolous purchase; let alone a scam.


----------



## wilmetted

*I'm with PerryM on this one*



PerryM said:


> Geez the only positive thing the poster boasted about was the $200 luau tickets and you come to the conclusion that this is a great thing to buy.  Where is the logic in this?  If you can read anything positive in the review then I am reassured of my previous conclusions of your posts.
> 
> This is all a scam – its way too good to be true – isn’t that obvious to everyone?
> 
> Click this chart and then click the “5y” zoom tab and you will notice how the financial world is voting on how things are going in the US.   The US has lost 50% of its wealth in the stock market and 15% in real estate in just 2 years.
> 
> So if you want to blow your money on crazy schemes like this then go right ahead – but don’t say that someone didn’t warn you that this is all a scam and you will need all your money you have left just to survive what's about to befall us.
> 
> This goes for ANY frivolous purchase; let alone a scam.





PerryM said:


> Geez the only positive thing the poster boasted about was the $200 luau tickets and you come to the conclusion that this is a great thing to buy.  Where is the logic in this?  If you can read anything positive in the review then I am reassured of my previous conclusions of your posts.
> 
> This is all a scam – its way too good to be true – isn’t that obvious to everyone?
> 
> Click this chart and then click the “5y” zoom tab and you will notice how the financial world is voting on how things are going in the US.   The US has lost 50% of its wealth in the stock market and 15% in real estate in just 2 years.
> 
> So if you want to blow your money on crazy schemes like this then go right ahead – but don’t say that someone didn’t warn you that this is all a scam and you will need all your money you have left just to survive what's about to befall us.
> 
> This goes for ANY frivolous purchase; let alone a scam.




I was not implying that the program was good. I was being a little sarcastic. My opinion is that the program sounds good in theory but it does not work the way the company said and hence I think it is a scam. 

I just did a search on yahoo and the first thing that came up was "rip off report". See the link for yourself. 
http://ripoffreport.com/reports/0/395/RipOff0395453.htm
Personally, I would not do this because I feel that they try to make it sound good but they could not address my concerns effectively.

No offense to the poster that is all for Destination Paradise but my personal opinion is that they work for the company. This is the only post they have ever been a part of and they signed up a day before their first post. Sorry but this is just my opinion.


----------



## stefanie19

wilmetted said:


> I was not implying that the program was good. I was being a little sarcastic. My opinion is that the program sounds good in theory but it does not work the way the company said and hence I think it is a scam.
> 
> I just did a search on yahoo and the first thing that came up was "rip off report". See the link for yourself.
> http://ripoffreport.com/reports/0/395/RipOff0395453.htm
> Personally, I would not do this because I feel that they try to make it sound good but they could not address my concerns effectively.
> 
> No offense to the poster that is all for Destination Paradise but my personal opinion is that they work for the company. This is the only post they have ever been a part of and they signed up a day before their first post. Sorry but this is just my opinion.



Work for the company? I live in TEXAS!  Honestly guys, I think you are ALL just bitter that I can stay in timeshare without being suckered into paying for it.  Good luck, but this forum is obviously not going to accept the program I have like they do everyother timeshare.  Thanks for nothing. -Stef


----------



## caribbeansun

Yup, that's it - you've busted us all - we are all just bitter.

I'm sure that you wouldn't misrepresent where you live just like the salespeople for this group wouldn't misrepresent their product.  I'm sure that there's no possibility that you are the one person that finds this product to be wonderful amongst all those others that found it to be less than above board and I'm sure it's a complete coincidence that so many first time posters found this one obscure thread.

It could happen, I personally don't believe it, but it could happen...


----------



## DeniseM

stefanie19 said:


> Work for the company? Good luck, but this forum is obviously not going to accept the program I have like they do every other timeshare.



I think you've hit the nail on the head.  This is a website for timeshare owners, and there is little or no interest here, in vacation clubs.


----------



## HawaiiChuck

*Enquiring Minds want to Know . . .*

I normally wouldn't take the time to address the Cynics within our Society as it's beyond a Full time job . . . 

In this case I'll make an exception because I work for the Product in question here. I'll apologize in advance for what I expect to be a fairly lengthy (1st time  ) Post. Bear with me and I'll make every effort to explain . . .

When I hear the word scam, I'm Deeply offended. It's difficult to run a scam for 11 years unless your last name is Madoff or you have the power and might of say, Enron. We are as a people (some), when unsure, certain to be critical, cynical, pessimistic, if not downright cruel. Instead of simply saying "gee, I don't know", we need to be recognized as some authority on the subject at hand. Wal-Mart had over 50,000 BBB complaints last year. How does that happen ?? The squeaky wheel gets the Grease ?? As for the previous 27 posts, I'll claim to be the authority on this particular subject as I have witnessed first hand how it has changed the way many Vacation. We have asked a few local owners to post which explains a couple of the 1st time posts regarding this subject.

For the record, I reside near Seattle and own Timeshare points within Trendwest (Worldmark). It is a Great regional product which is how our Family uses it. I believe Timeshare is a good thing as our company would not exist without it. Additionally, our entire Family (Mom, Dad, and my 2 sisters) use this product and we Vacation together whenever possible (mini family reunions utilizing 2 or 3 units in the same resort).

Our Product Company started in the Travel business in 1986 booking Caribbean resorts, Dive trips, etc. for Americans via 1-800 numbers. This helped facilitate bookings back then as calling International (011) destinations was cumbersome for the consumer. The Company and this product evolved over the years and has been in an online format since 1998. We have numerous Customer service call centers and locations. Our product is distributed around the U.S., Canada, Central America, and parts of the E.U. within numerous Sales centers and Timeshare resorts. In nearly every case, the Product is Private Labled for those specific locations. We are directly linked into RCI as the 5th largest mover of their monotized Inventory. We utilize Resorts represented within II as well as non-affiliated Resorts. We currently have well over 100,000 Families that use our product and move almost 500,000 weeks of Inventory through our System.

Contrary to what I read within the posts, the Inventory does exist, however it must be acquired by us and distributed (by contract) in what is known as a "Closed Promotion basis". By definition, we can not make pricing available to the Public as in most cases it is well below a typical Resort maint. fee. and/or Hotel pricing. Therefore it is packaged in quantity and open to our 100,000+ Vacationing families within our system. An entire week in a Resort would range from $300 to as much as $900 for a very Prime offering.

To be Clear, we are not Everything to Everybody. We say "if it's your anniversary Nov. 12th and you need to be at the Embassy on Kaanapali Beach that Specific week every year, you need to plunk down the $25,000 and go buy Timeshare at that resort. Our product has a vast number of Resorts to choose from around the World. It's flexible in that you pay IF you go this year but are not committed to a MF if you choose to Cruise or do something else. It offers multiple weeks and options on an annual basis. The Savings are and will be evident each and everytime a Family member uses the program. 

In a nutshell, we are simply a Value option as compared to Timeshare. While it is admirable that our moderator picked up a Timeshare on E-Bay for $98 (a known commodity to her), it is still not cheap. The annual MF is in the area of $900 for 1 week and if exchanged, incurs additional costs through an Exchange company which varies depending on affiliation. It works for her because she knows that Resort and frequents Kauai.

As for Credit and/or Financing, we finance anyone through a number of Finance options including Bank of America, Universal Guardian, etc. In some cases, much like a Mortgage, the Contract is purchased and is then owned by that Finance company. We don't "Ruin people's credit". People Ruin their own Credit . . . The bottom line is Personal Responsibility and the contractual obligation they entered into. When times are tough we as a people look to cut back wherever possible. IF Vacations are important to you, we WILL save folks money each and everytime they use the Program. As I stated, it is not for everyone, but it would be rare to see a Negative Post here from someone who owns and has ACTUALLY used the program for a Family Vacation.

Once again, I apologize for the lengthy post. I hope this helps folks understand what it is we do, how it works, and rest assured proper Due diligence was done on our company by the Fortune 500 companies noted. We continue to enjoy numerous business relationships within the Travel industry and will look forward to servicing our Clients for many years to come . . .

Respectfully Submitted,  Chuck


----------



## DeniseM

> *We have asked* a few local owners to post which explains a couple of the 1st time posts regarding this subject.



This was probably a mistake because your owners came across as unknowledgable about travel in general, unable to answer questions coherently, and so overly enthusiastic about something they really didn't understand, as to be unbelievable.

Please don't "send" people to post on TUG - that's advertising and it's not allowed here.


----------



## Makai Guy

I'm writing, not as a bbs system Administrator, but as a long time TUGger who has seen these things come and go many times.

There is a solid reason why so many here are skeptical.  The track record for similarly promoted groups in the past has been dismal, with many just closing shop giving no advanced notice, and leaving their subscribers with nothing to show for the thousands of dollars they plunked down up front. The lucky ones may have at least managed to squeeze a vacation or two out of the systems before they disappeared without a trace. Since the buyers have no deeds or ownership stake, they have nothing but worthless paper and promises to show for their outlay.

First-time posters extolling the virtues of an organization we've never heard of tends to make seasoned users suspicious - shill posts are prime tactics of shady outfits.

Perhaps this organization is all it claims to be.  I hope it is for the sake of those who have bought in.


----------



## PerryM

HawaiiChuck said:


> I normally wouldn't take the time to address the Cynics within our Society as it's beyond a Full time job . . .
> 
> In this case I'll make an exception because I work for the Product in question here. I'll apologize in advance for what I expect to be a fairly lengthy (1st time  ) Post. Bear with me and I'll make every effort to explain . . .
> 
> When I hear the word scam, I'm Deeply offended. It's difficult to run a scam for 11 years unless your last name is Madoff or you have the power and might of say, Enron. We are as a people (some), when unsure, certain to be critical, cynical, pessimistic, if not downright cruel. Instead of simply saying "gee, I don't know", we need to be recognized as some authority on the subject at hand. Wal-Mart had over 50,000 BBB complaints last year. How does that happen ?? The squeaky wheel gets the Grease ?? As for the previous 27 posts, I'll claim to be the authority on this particular subject as I have witnessed first hand how it has changed the way many Vacation. We have asked a few local owners to post which explains a couple of the 1st time posts regarding this subject.
> 
> For the record, I reside near Seattle and *own Timeshare points within Trendwest (Worldmark). *It is a Great regional product which is how our Family uses it. I believe Timeshare is a good thing as our company would not exist without it. Additionally, our entire Family (Mom, Dad, and my 2 sisters) use this product and we Vacation together whenever possible (mini family reunions utilizing 2 or 3 units in the same resort).
> 
> Our Product Company started in the Travel business in 1986 booking Caribbean resorts, Dive trips, etc. for Americans via 1-800 numbers. This helped facilitate bookings back then as calling International (011) destinations was cumbersome for the consumer. The Company and this product evolved over the years and has been in an online format since 1998. We have numerous Customer service call centers and locations. Our product is distributed around the U.S., Canada, Central America, and parts of the E.U. within numerous Sales centers and Timeshare resorts. In nearly every case, the Product is Private Labled for those specific locations. We are directly linked into RCI as the 5th largest mover of their monotized Inventory. We utilize Resorts represented within II as well as non-affiliated Resorts. We currently have well over 100,000 Families that use our product and move almost 500,000 weeks of Inventory through our System.
> 
> Contrary to what I read within the posts, the Inventory does exist, however it must be acquired by us and distributed (by contract) in what is known as a "Closed Promotion basis". By definition, we can not make pricing available to the Public as in most cases it is well below a typical Resort maint. fee. and/or Hotel pricing. Therefore it is packaged in quantity and open to our 100,000+ Vacationing families within our system. An entire week in a Resort would range from $300 to as much as $900 for a very Prime offering.
> 
> To be Clear, we are not Everything to Everybody. We say "if it's your anniversary Nov. 12th and you need to be at the Embassy on Kaanapali Beach that Specific week every year, you need to plunk down the $25,000 and go buy Timeshare at that resort. Our product has a vast number of Resorts to choose from around the World. It's flexible in that you pay IF you go this year but are not committed to a MF if you choose to Cruise or do something else. It offers multiple weeks and options on an annual basis. The Savings are and will be evident each and everytime a Family member uses the program.
> 
> In a nutshell, we are simply a Value option as compared to Timeshare. While it is admirable that our moderator picked up a Timeshare on E-Bay for $98 (a known commodity to her), it is still not cheap. The annual MF is in the area of $900 for 1 week and if exchanged, incurs additional costs through an Exchange company which varies depending on affiliation. It works for her because she knows that Resort and frequents Kauai.
> 
> As for Credit and/or Financing, we finance anyone through a number of Finance options including Bank of America, Universal Guardian, etc. In some cases, much like a Mortgage, the Contract is purchased and is then owned by that Finance company. We don't "Ruin people's credit". People Ruin their own Credit . . . The bottom line is Personal Responsibility and the contractual obligation they entered into. When times are tough we as a people look to cut back wherever possible. IF Vacations are important to you, we WILL save folks money each and everytime they use the Program. As I stated, it is not for everyone, but it would be rare to see a Negative Post here from someone who owns and has ACTUALLY used the program for a Family Vacation.
> 
> Once again, I apologize for the lengthy post. I hope this helps folks understand what it is we do, how it works, and rest assured proper Due diligence was done on our company by the Fortune 500 companies noted. We continue to enjoy numerous business relationships within the Travel industry and will look forward to servicing our Clients for many years to come . . .
> 
> Respectfully Submitted,  Chuck



If you are a WM owner you know that the "points" are actually called WM Credits and that there are things called "Trade Points" which are similar but different than Credits.  Also Trendwest bit the dust a long time ago.

I would have no problems in learning about this club - how about a 1 page synopsis and a BBB reference to top it off.

Thanks,


----------



## DeniseM

PerryM said:


> I would have no problems in learning about this club - how about a 1 page synopsis and a BBB reference to top it off.



Chuck, if you want to respond to Perry, please send it privately, since posting promotional info. on TUG is not allowed.


----------



## vision2120

*You should get your facts straight*

Hey Denise- some of what you're saying is not correct.
I have worked in the vacation club & timeshare industry for many years. I do not work for Destination Paradise, but I know out of all the programs I've seen, theirs is a pretty good one.

1) Yes there are condos just "laying around out there" as you put it. Even though a timeshare is a deeded property it's still fractional ownership. Which means, 1 unit that is available has 52 owners, because there are 52 weeks in a year right? That's one unit! Each resort has hundreds of units and there are thousands of resorts world wide. Multiply the number of weeks in a year times the number of units. So lets say Resort "A" has 400 units available X 52 = 20,800 available weeks. Do the math if you think I'm wrong. Take your 20,800 weeks at ONE resort and multiply that by however many thousands and thousands of resorts are out there. You'll come up with about 7-10 MILLION weeks of timeshare that are available. OK now that we have that figure. Take into consideration there are at MINIMUM 3 million weeks every year that are not used. Because people bank their weeks when they're not using them so those units are EMPTY! So you mean to tell me that everyone who owns timeshare is always using their weeks every year and they never miss one single date. That's pretty amazing considering some people own 8 weeks a year some 10 or even more. See my point? So the timeshare companies and vacation clubs have contracts with all the resorts to fill the empty units when they're not being used. The timeshare company benefits because now they have someone in their otherwise empty unit (even though its a discounted rate) and hopefully that person will play a round of golf or what have you, and the resort will generate a profit. Furthermore these weeks are not just leftover junk as you put it. They are banked weeks that no one is using. I personally have used a vacation club to go to Maui. I stayed in a resort in Wailai Maui called Grand Champions. On a golf course 1/2 a block to the beach. I can email you photos if you want. These units normally rent out for $400 a night or more. If you don't believe me look it up online. The Four Seasons across the street is $1,200 a night. I paid $800 for the whole week to stay there through my club. And that was a "leftover week" as you put it.

2) You say you can join RCI or II for $89 bucks? Yes you can. But what you aren't telling people is the $89 fee gives you access to condo's IF and I say IF, you OWN a week of timeshare then the $89 fee allows you to trade YOUR unit through RCI or II and access the other properties. Do you really think RCI is going to let you join them for $89 bucks and be able to just rent any condo you like??? Of course not they'd go broke because then everyone would be doing it and no one would be spending $20-$60 thousand dollars on a time share. So stefanie19 really has a good deal, because, yes she dropped 7 grand on her club but the reality is; she pays no maintenance fee (that's about $300-$1,000 a year), she doesn't pay an exchange fee (another $200-$300 a year) she only pays when she goes. And to boot she is paying a hugely discounted rate over what the nightly rates are. So lets take my resort for example, Grand Champions $400 a night X 7 (because its a full 8 days 7 nights) Thats $2,800 for the week. She gets it for $800 that's 2 GRAND she saved on that one trip!! 4 trips and she's saved the cost of the membership plus! Makes sense to me!! I realize that all the condos are not going to be 5 star everywhere you go, but not all timeshares are 5 star to begin with. So stefanie19 just make sure you're reviewing the resort BEFORE you book to make sure it's something that you would be comfortable with.
I can tell you that I've personally saved the cost of my vacation club after about 4 or 5 trips, so don't sell yourself short on what you have.


----------



## chanthj

*Too good to be true*

Please beware that Destination Paradise does not have any access. They just rent an office in Waikiki, Hawaii. They can try to generate lots of memberships as quick as possible. Once they are slow down then they can file for bankruptcy and you would lose your $8000. If this is true, I am sure all the well known online travel company like priceline.com, Travelocity, hotwire, expedia.com etc would jump on it making deal with the resorts/hotel all over the world since they already have relationship with them.

So when you go to Wakiki, don't go there unless you have 3 hours to spare and can take the headache of pressure sale just like timeshare for 50% (with limitation) discount on your tour ticket.


----------



## Bill4728

I don't know anything about this company. 

That said, all they seem to be saying is they will get you access to unused TS at a great discount.  ( which they may or may not be able to do) 

Isn't that what renting from a TS owner is all about??

Why pay significant money to a company that may (or may not) give you access when you can look at one of the many TS rental sites and rent directly from a fellow owner??


----------



## Surfer Dude

*If you really want to sign up for DP ...*

I am the dude who signed up for DP and successfully cancelled it the next day.  If you really want to sign up, here're some tips that can save you some money.  Prior to my final "no", the best offer I had was:

$4745 for

- 2 additional free weeks for first year
- 2 free round trip plane tickets for the continental US
- 4 weeks each year
- includes registration fees

If you paid more, you probably paid too much.  You may be able to get it for less.

For ME (and just me), I still do not belong to any TS, DP or other clubs (except for AAA).  I find that not restricting myself to the inventories/restrictions of TS, etc., my travel experiences have been most enjoyable.  Over X-mas, my family of 6 paid about $3000 for a 10 day vacation to Waikiki (hotel, food, airfare, car rental, PCC, parking, everything).  I just can back from a 11 day trip to Italy (Rome, Pisa, Florence, Siena, Venice) with my 2 sons, and the 3 of us spent a total of $4000 and that include everything including guided tours, attraction tix, train tix, daily fine dining, etc.  Everywhere we stayed where no more than 3 blocks from the center of everything and I would consider each place to be at least a 3.5 *.  VBRO is my friend but I did have to spend considerable time researching.  However,  I made no compromises on location nor timing.


----------



## Mari1969

Surfer Dude...In my opinion, you did yourself a favor.  I find it interesting how there are a handful of people here and throughout the net defending Destination Paradise.  IN MY OPINION, the truth of the matter is that MOST people do feel scammed or they have concluded this company's purpose is to scam as many people before they go under.  This is represented by the number of complaints filed with the DCCA Hawaii and the BBB.org.  The BBB has NO Rating for Destination Paradise.
My personal experience was that we went to a presentation in July 2008 and got pressured into buying.  No one put a gun to our head but they used different sale techniques to get us into buying.  They went from offering us a $7995.00 package which included 4 weeks worth of discounted hotel rooms/cruises/condos to a $5995 package which included 3 weeks worth of discounted hotel rooms/cruises/condos.  You are offered a certain amount of rewards to be used towards your booking.  $5995 seemed like a better deal and being in total vacation bliss did it for us.   We were having such a great time in Waikiki, we just wanted to be able to go again and again without spending $300/night at a decent hotel which was the average price for the rooms during the time we went :whoopie: .  The presentation showed us the option of staying at a condo for $700/week at the same place we were staying, The Imperial.  We paid $1000 for the week but that's because a friend of ours let us use his timeshare.  What we failed to notice during the presentation was what time of year The Imperial would be available at $700/week.   
The idea behind Destination Paradise seemed ideal but when you actually get on their "exclusive" website to compare prices with those from other travel websites, you realize, there isn't much savings.  In fact, what I was quoted late July for a hotel room in Florida was over $20 more a night than booking directly on Priceline.com.  To add to my disappointment, the system was down for two days before I was even able to view what was available, even the reps couldn't get on it.
For those who are considering cancelling their membership or considering joining, please keep in mind this...they only give you three CALENDAR days to cancel in writing from they day you join which at that point you don't even have access to their exclusive website.  You get your log in/passcode approximately two weeks after joining, by regular mail, sent to your home address.  
Some people have posed the question, what's the scam part about.  First of all, if you haven't noticed already, there are different price ranges.  If we had stayed their longer than the two hours we sat for the presentation and persuasion part of it, we probably would have gotten a better deal.  From what I've read on the net, some people paid $4000 for four weeks while some people paid the same for one week.  There is no price schedule posted at the presentation and there's nothing in writing that states what you get for $2K, $4K, $6K or $8K.  There are people that have paid up to $8K for access to this "software license."  From communicating with other people, they've experienced web access issues like I did.  I can list a few more things but if you're interested in knowing about them, contact me directly.  I just have to stress that what I have written here is IN MY OPINION ONLY and is supported by other people's opinions through their experience with Destination Paradise.  :annoyed:


----------



## niko

*Im happy with my purchase*

I bought into this "club" last year.... One thing im not seeing on here is the one thing that makes it worth it for me..... every year, we get $3000 put into our paradise account, it can (and will) be used for cruises. We are able to get $3000 a year in cruises every year. We are able to get restaurant gift certificates for 100's of restaurants in every city, we buy a $50 gift certificate for $20, or $100 G.C. for $45...... theres alot of side perks that im interested in besides the really nice resorts for $299-$799 a week. 
Even if I never use any condo reservations, the free cruise every year is GREAT! Also, If you go to the presentation make a deal, say you cant afford that much, We got them down to $4000, and it was money WELL spent!

and Yes, I am the same NIKO who posted right after I purchased, and now i thought id give a little update.


----------



## studying1

*paradise destination - hawaii and internet search*

Hi 

We went to a presentation when we were in hawaii and we purchased.  We have two timeshares here in australia so we thought this was a good thing.

what i am wondering given finding them on the google search is impossible and i got the web site from here and there is nothing on the web site, can someone tell me if all the paradise destination web sites are part of the hawaii company - like wyndham has different offices in locations it is in and what luck people have had emailing the company - had to do that as we seem to have lost our documents from hawaii to here and did people get their log in details in the two weeks as promised.

Thanks


----------



## Vacation Dude

My advice .....STAY AWAY from Destination Paradise.


----------



## studying1

*reply email came 4/22/09*



studying1 said:


> Hi
> 
> We went to a presentation when we were in hawaii and we purchased.  We have two timeshares here in australia so we thought this was a good thing.
> 
> what i am wondering given finding them on the google search is impossible and i got the web site from here and there is nothing on the web site, can someone tell me if all the paradise destination web sites are part of the hawaii company - like wyndham has different offices in locations it is in and what luck people have had emailing the company - had to do that as we seem to have lost our documents from hawaii to here and did people get their log in details in the two weeks as promised.
> 
> Thanks



I had sent an email thanks to the link that I got from here and now got a reply today 4/22/09.  They are resending our documents and the log in information.  The log in information was provided but I couldn't access the web site so I have sent another email about how do I access the web page.  If anyone here can tell me how to access the web site so I can log into the site I would appreciate it - all I get is a small screen and there is nothing on the screen that will allow me to log in.  Hope to get another email asap and will check our po box for the information that was posted to us about logging in.  The other question I have is given we are in Australia, is there anyone else who is a member who is not in the usa and had problems with bookings/phoning about issues and the times the office is available?

Thanks

Studying1


----------



## studying1

*insulting reply*



Vacation Dude said:


> My advice .....STAY AWAY from Destination Paradise.



I find your reply in red and in such a large font, rude and offensive.  We have joined Paradise Destinations and you can't even get the name right - and will see what happens in regards to bookings.  We got a good deal and if they keep their word we will have fun going to different places.

Studying1


----------



## studying1

*luau tickets*



wilmetted said:


> I was not implying that the program was good. I was being a little sarcastic. My opinion is that the program sounds good in theory but it does not work the way the company said and hence I think it is a scam.
> 
> I just did a search on yahoo and the first thing that came up was "rip off report". See the link for yourself.
> http://ripoffreport.com/reports/0/395/RipOff0395453.htm
> Personally, I would not do this because I feel that they try to make it sound good but they could not address my concerns effectively.
> 
> No offense to the poster that is all for Destination Paradise but my personal opinion is that they work for the company. This is the only post they have ever been a part of and they signed up a day before their first post. Sorry but this is just my opinion.



We got luau tickets when we went to the presentation in waikiki and i must say that germaine's luau is not a great luau.  we had a better time at the luau at the Royal Lahina Resort in Maui.  The luau tickets were not worth the time to attend presentation/purchase the goods.  Don't know why anyone would attend to go to that luau.

Studying1


----------



## studying1

*reply*



studying1 said:


> I find your reply in red and in such a large font, rude and offensive.  We have joined Paradise Destinations and you can't even get the name right - and will see what happens in regards to bookings.  We got a good deal and if they keep their word we will have fun going to different places.
> 
> Studying1



We also have two timeshares - one with wyndham and another with another company - not sure of name as it is hubby's timeshare so we know what we have got into.

Studying1


----------



## Vacation Dude

studying1 said:


> I find your reply in red and in such a large font, rude and offensive.  We have joined Paradise Destinations and you can't even get the name right - and will see what happens in regards to bookings.  We got a good deal and if they keep their word we will have fun going to different places.
> 
> Studying1



Are you a shill for this company?


----------



## studying1

*last comment*



Vacation Dude said:


> Are you a shill for this company?





Obviously you don't read the postings - I posted about this company.  How about you read them properly and then come back to me and apologise for your insulting implication.

Studying1


----------



## Steve

Please remember the "be courteous" rules for the BBS.  Posting in huge red letters is the same as shouting at someone.  There is no need for that.  

Steve
TUG Moderator


----------



## Vacation Dude

[Discourteous post removed.  Vacation Dude - please note that you have already been warned by a moderator, in the post above. - DeniseM Moderator.]


----------



## CarolF

DeniseM said:


> I think you've hit the nail on the head.  This is a website for timeshare owners, and there is little or no interest here, in *vacation clubs*.



Just found this thread and I don't know anything about Paradise Destinations but thought I'd chip in and say I've got a timeshare with the words Vacation Club in its title - Accor *Vacation Club*.  

Unlike the Paradise Destinations Vacation Club, all AVC club properties are fully owned, are completely free of any mortgages and you buy the right to use the properties through to 2080.  It trades through II.  I consider myself a timeshare owner much like the owners of Worldmark South Pacific Club (developed by the Trendwest organisation).



niko said:


> every year, we get $3000 put into our paradise account, it can (and will) be used for cruises. We are able to get $3000 a year in cruises every year.



hmmm, so where does this money come from?


----------



## 2curious

*Think about it....*

This website actually saved me from making a costly decision. My husband and I recently went to Waikiki at the end of April.   Like earlier reports we were approached by someone on the street offering us money to go to a Destination Paradise.  I initially was reluctant because the whole thing sounded too good to be true.  My husband and I went to the DP presentation.  Luckily, I have several years of theatre so I know acting when I see it! The presenter was sooo cheesy.  I would describe the performance as the typical “corny” infomercial.  After the presentation the consultant tried to win us over. I have to say I was actually interested…until I asked to test the website and see a contract. That’s when the consultant quickly asked the “back up person” to come over and discuss the plan with us. After the consultant went over the plan my husband and I laughed. “Did they seriously think that during a recession we were going to fork over $10,000 for that?” That’s when the consultant flipped over the piece of paper and offered the plan for close to $5,000.   This caught my husband’s attention because it seemed like a great deal. Of course it does when they cut the price in half.  My husband and I agreed to discuss it and come back if we were interested. That’s when the consultants started to get pushy!  They told us that the offer was a one time thing and it was too good to pass up. The consultant indicated that if we came back the next day we would be limited to paying $10,000 in cash! Yes I said in cash! They told us that we could talk it over amongst ourselves while we there and they walked away. Luckily, I had access to the internet on my phone and quickly googled Destination Paradise. I was alarmed when multiple websites, not just this one accused DP of scamming people. When they returned I once again asked them to show me their website and they came up with an excuse about not having enough time.  So my husband and I said that we would come back later on that evening. That’s when they told us that this is a one time thing and once our names are in the system we can’t return. WHAT? That’s when we knew that DP was a total fraud. 

We later ran into the guy that invited us to DP and asked him what he was getting out of all of this. He told us for each person/couple that he gets to go to the presentation he gets $200. If he offers the person cash, say for instance $100, then he gets half. If he offers a free show, snorkeling, parasailing, ect., then he can purchase the tickets for $50 or less and he gets the rest of the money.  Based on my research, what he told us may be a bold face lie and he might get more than what he said!

I’m posting this message because there are too many things that people can spend there money on and this is definitely not a wise investment. Don’t just give your money this company with out doing some homework first. These people play on the fact that you are on a vacation and try to catch you off guard. If they are who they say they are, then they would have the factual information onsite. Anybody can make a website and put together a phony presentation. Please take the opportunity to research this company before it’s too late! I don’t know about you but this is a recession and we don’t have money to waste.


----------



## FrankieT

*Help Destination Paradise Questions*



zagadka said:


> we just came back from Waikiki. I was curious to find out more info about DP and stumbled upon this forum.
> 
> Here are my thoughts:
> 
> the reason we attended the presentation was for the free 2 day Jeep rental, which we got and were very happy with it.
> 
> As far as the presentation goes, here is what I liked and did not like
> Liked:
> -the idea is great. I currently use priceline.com for my hotels and I would be willing to pay a yearly membership fee to be able to access better/more accomodations
> 
> Disliked
> -having said that (above), I think the $8K downpayment+$200 ($150 pre-authorization plan)+HIGHER than priceline's charge per use = is not worth it for us.
> 
> For example: I paid $350USD to stay in Waikiki for a week in a hotel. Yes, the hotel was on the crappier side, but I could have gotten a 4* hilton for $100-120/night through priceline. We just didn't want to do that because vacation is about seeing places, not staying in your hotel room.
> 
> With DP i would have paid $700/week (more or less) for a better accomodation. Sure, I'd get better quality - but is it really worth it for more money per use+portion of the downpayment and $200/year fee? Let's say I take 2 vacations a yer - that equals an additional $100 every visit.
> 
> Plus, I think the biggest turnoff for me was the fact that they did not want to test drive the site with me. They said they had no time. HAHHAHAHA. I was curious to see prices around NYC - wither for a weekly condo or for a hotel (yes, they mentioned they have hotel discounts as well). And I might have signed up IF hotel prices were significantly lower than priceline's levels.
> 
> I do take a few vacations throughout the year, but most are "see new city-move on", and a condo would not work there. So the hotel portion what might have sold me, IF they did a test drive.
> 
> BTW, after I loughed in their face about the $8K - they've lowered the cost to $2,500K for 10 years (vs. lifetime) and a second time they've added the lifetime to the $2,500.
> 
> But still, $2500+$200/yearly+cost of actual condo > priceline+flexibility
> 
> I was also worried about prices during high seasons. I had a feeling thir presentation involved low season options. And better seasons would be either costlier, or would not have inventory.
> 
> but teh Jeep was great. I'd visit their presentation again if I'm ever back to Hawaii for another gift.
> 
> PS. I've never been to a timeshare presentation before, so I might have a different perspective at this thing than some timeshare owners.
> 
> PS2:
> BTW, DP did not leave us with any info - no brochures, no site address - nothing. Even though I've specifically asked for it.


Hi,

Do you mind me to ask?  What did they actually offer you? Is it similar to what i got below?

----4 weeks/year
----Full family usage
----$6995
----Fist free vacation for the first two that signed up

You seem to be getting a better deal.

Thanks


----------



## FrankieT

*What did you get? D.P*



Surfer Dude said:


> I am the dude who signed up for DP and successfully cancelled it the next day.  If you really want to sign up, here're some tips that can save you some money.  Prior to my final "no", the best offer I had was:
> 
> $4745 for
> 
> - 2 additional free weeks for first year
> - 2 free round trip plane tickets for the continental US
> - 4 weeks each year
> - includes registration fees
> 
> If you paid more, you probably paid too much.  You may be able to get it for less.
> 
> For ME (and just me), I still do not belong to any TS, DP or other clubs (except for AAA).  I find that not restricting myself to the inventories/restrictions of TS, etc., my travel experiences have been most enjoyable.  Over X-mas, my family of 6 paid about $3000 for a 10 day vacation to Waikiki (hotel, food, airfare, car rental, PCC, parking, everything).  I just can back from a 11 day trip to Italy (Rome, Pisa, Florence, Siena, Venice) with my 2 sons, and the 3 of us spent a total of $4000 and that include everything including guided tours, attraction tix, train tix, daily fine dining, etc.  Everywhere we stayed where no more than 3 blocks from the center of everything and I would consider each place to be at least a 3.5 *.  VBRO is my friend but I did have to spend considerable time researching.  However,  I made no compromises on location nor timing.



Hi,

Do you mind me to ask? What did they actually offer you? Is it similar to what i got below?

----4 weeks/year
----Full family usage
----$6995
----Fist free vacation for the first two that signed up

You seem to be getting a better deal.

Thanks


----------



## mauihorizon

*Cancellation of Contract Destination Paradise Hawaii*

For all of you nice folks who got duped by Destination Paradise Hawaii two words ATTORNEY GENERAL.File a complaint with the AG of Hawaii and they will roll over.They have been shut down in Minnesota and 3 locations in Texas under the name Global Escapes.I hope this info helps.


----------



## mauihorizon

*Destination Paradise Hawaii turned into Destination Nightmare*

Here is an interesting link:

http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/443/RipOff0443560.htm


----------



## matth9601

*Anyone have luck getting Destination Paradise to refund your money?*

Myself and three friends ended up purchasing the "software license agreement" a week ago while we were in Waikiki.  We finally recieved our login information yesterday (funny how they only give you three days to cancel and you dont see the product for a week)  and were extremely dissappointed with the results.  The big seller for us were the discounts you get if you reserve your room less than sixty days from your arrival.  After searching the site we only found 31 rooms in about 8 hotels that were available in California over the next sixty days and we searched the entire state.  Furthermore the places we did find were places most people would never want to visit.  For example most spots were in Palm Springs or San Bernadino County.  I dont know about any of you but those locations in June dont really appeal to me.

I plan on putting in a call tomorrow to tell them that in our opinion they misrepresented their product and we would like a full refund.  My question is "has anyone had luck getting their money back from Destination Paradise?"  Any help would be appreciated.


----------



## mauihorizon

*Cancellation of Contract Destination Paradise Hawaii*

Tell them you will file with the Attorney General,BBB,and Hawaii Tourism Board.They are being watched by all of the above.Also their claim as a software license is bogus(hence 3 days only cancellation policy).State that you will also blog on any sites available to warn other people.


----------



## EdoB

Hi Everybody,

We came back from Hawaii last Sat, May 23. We got into this too. Due to some unexpected circumstances we canceled DP (i don't have my money back yet)

Like always i told my wife just pass by street marketers, but she dragged me into this again  They were too pushy, and we signed up for $2745 and I did cancel it 1 day later. But it wasn't so simple.....

I was calling them every hour. Young lady was telling me all the time that her manager was having "very" important meeting with  owner. Of course it was lie. After I called 5 or 6 times they called me back. I asked this girl if they need us both present there. She said that her boss will call me back again.

  I decided to stop by myself and asked them just give my money back. My wife stayed home with my daughter. This guy told me that he need us both  present. I was forced to wake my daughter up get into the car and  drive up there. Manager was begging us to stay, explaining that they can not loose us like this, and they will do anything to have us there. So instead of relaxing morning on Waikiki beach I had horrible and stressful time. Lesson learned!!!

Anyways we've  visited this place again, and asked for our money back. One week is gone. After i read all these postings I am getting very nervous. Can someone please help me here. Should I file complain to Attorney General, BBB? Or may maybe dispute this transaction with my credit card?
Any advice will be appreciated

Thanks


----------



## EdoB

Surfer Dude said:


> My family was in Waikiki over X-mas and my wife and I attended the DP presentation because we were given 50% off tickets to the Polynesian Cultural Center.
> 
> What I will write is my experience with DP and my impression about the company.  Remember, your mileage may vary.  You have to make your own decision with regards to the legitimacy of the program and whether it is right for you.
> 
> The presentation : DP tried hard to differentiate itself from a timeshare.  The presentation itself was in reverse order of a typical timeshare.  They presented the price first and then they get you excited about the program.  To wrap it up, they lowered the price if you sign NOW and they threw in 2 free airline tickets and a free week condo if you're the first 2 to sign up.
> 
> The decision : We liked the information presented.  Before we signed on the doted line, we insisted on looking at their reservation website first (a highly recommended move).  DP obliged but they drove the very short website test.
> 
> The awakening : The evening after we signed the deal, when the kids were quietly in bed, I read all the paperwork.  I did not like what I read as some of the information presented was inconsistent with the agreement.  As I replayed the events at the DP office, I became more unhappy with the program.
> 
> The straws that broke the camel's back : Why was I displeased with the program?
> 1. We asked the salesperson and the closer if reservations made through their system can be canceled.  This is very important when traveling with children.  The salesperson said "Yes" and the closer said "You can also buy travel insurance."  The agreement stated that all reservations are final and cannot be canceled for any reason.
> 2. We had to sign and initial many places in the office, including one on financing.  I was very very very unhappy when the closer said that he applied for a BOA credit card on my behalf and the entire amount of the purchase was charged to it.  Although, one of the forms we signed must have authorized them to do so, I felt that they should have been more explicit about their financing plan.  I happen to be a person who have enough credit cards and do not want any more no matter how attractive the reward may be (free miles, etc.)  I told the closer to void the charge there and then and used my own credit card instead.  I had to cancel the cc myself later on.
> 3. Unlike timeshares where you get a deed, for your money DP essentially entitles you a software license.  I admit I do not know what inventory system their software uses, but is their software license worth thousands of dollars plus yearly fees?  I wonder if their inventory is any better than those used by priceline, hotwire, skyauction, hotel.com, and the numerous timeshare rental websites.
> 4. Remember I asked for a website test drive.  The closer who demoed, chose my state.  There were a few pages of availability but I only saw the first page; I asked to see other pages but he changed the subject.  All the pages shown on the first page were of condos in a vacation destination over 100 miles from a big city.
> 
> The remedy - Since we were still in Waikiki, I decided to walk to their office the next morning and void the purchase.  The first reason alone is sufficient for me to back off of the deal, so that is what I told them.  I also mentioned reason 2 and that I really do not believe what else I can trust from the presentation.  They attributed the incorrect cancellation info to the new salesperson and they made several attempts to sweeten the offer DRASTICALLY.  Our minds were made up and the answer were instant "no" at each of the offer.
> 
> The end - They finally agreed to cancel the membership but said that the $250 is nonrefundable.  If I had changed my mind through no fault of DP, forgoing the doc fees was fine with me.  But since there was misinformation involved, I told DP that if the $250 was withheld, I would dispute my cc charge.  BTW, I had mentioned "presentation information inconsistent with the agreement" in my cancellation letter.  I am happy to report that when we returned from Oahu, there was a DP letter waiting for me stating that the full amount will be refunded to me.  I checked my cc account yesterday and the full amount was indeed refunded.  Happy conclusion.
> 
> The lessons -
> 1. Read your docs immediately and very soon.
> 2. Insist on a test drive of the system and insist on driving yourself and take as much time as you need.  Make sure it is a live system and do not skim on the details like location and dates.  Best of all, try a scenario like your next dream vacation and make sure the locations available is where you really want to be visiting.
> 3. If you want to cancel, cancel in person while you're on location.
> 4. If something is too good to be true, quaff 3 cups of triple latte and read the agreement word by word to make sure that that something is still indeed true.
> 
> Throughout the entire ordeal, I felt that DP was polite.



Hello Surfer Dude

I am in similar situation as you. How long it took them to refund your money back? Should I call them again, and dispute CC transaction?

Thanks


----------



## mauihorizon

*Destination Paradise Hawaii Scam*

Another interesting link started people who were scammed by Destination Paradise Hawaii.

http://scammedinparadise.blogspot.com/2009/05/destination-paradise.html


----------



## mauihorizon

*Destination Paradise Hawaii Scam*

THIS IS THE SAME "SOFTWARE PROGRAM"

A family of Florida-based travel companies doing business in Austin and San Antonio are facing charges of deceptive trade practices and other business and commerce code violations from the Texas Attorney General’s office.

The defendants, Escapes Austin LLC and Escapes Midwest LLC, which do business under the names Global Escapes, Blue Water, Sun Tree and others, are accused of using false gift giveaways to entice customers to attend sales seminars that marketed worthless travel-related software programs, according to a news release from the attorney general’s office.

Attorney General Greg Abbott said his office is seeking restitution for some 5,000 Texas consumers who may have been deceived into purchasing the software. In response to the attorney general’s actions, the 73rd District Court of Bexar County issued an order freezing the defendants’ assets.

Phone numbers connected to the Global Escapes’ Austin and San Antonio offices were disconnected when dialed on Monday. A representative with the company’s reservation service said she was restricted from giving out any corporate phone numbers. A 1-800 number listed on the company’s Web site consistently rang busy on Monday morning.

Court documents filed by the state also name chief executive officer James Carey III and managing member Gwendolyn Carey. According to the state’s lawsuit, the defendants used direct mail and telemarketing calls to inform potential customers that they “won” free cruises, hotel stays, vehicles, flights or expensive watches. However, recipients were told that they must set up an appointment to attend a sales presentation in order to receive their prize.

Those chosen also were told they only needed to pay taxes due on the gifts. Recipients were not informed about restrictions, hidden costs, the prizes’ overall value or the prizes’ limited availability. According to state investigators, prizes were difficult to redeem, expensive to redeem, or unavailable during certain dates.

During the mandatory sales seminars, the defendants touted their “proprietary software search engine technology,” which they claimed would allow purchasers to locate and reserve bargain travel deals online. “The defendants then used high-pressure sales tactics to convince customers that their ‘software license’ opportunity surpassed all others in the industry,” the release states. “The defendants’ sales representatives often purported to ‘negotiate down’ from the software’s $12,000 retail price to $7,000, $4,000, or to a ‘one-time price reduction’ of $2,200.”

Customers who could not afford the purchase price were offered financing. Rather than retain the purchaser’s outstanding debt, the defendants frequently sold it to third-party debt collection or finance companies.

According to the documents, after purchasing the product, many customers were unable to log on to the Web site for at least two weeks. “When the defendants finally provided the necessary user IDs and passwords, many customers encountered technical problems. Customers who were able to fully access the system discovered that the bargain travel deals they were promised did not actually exist.”

During the sales negotiations, customers were told they could return the product for a refund if they were dissatisfied with their purchase. However, when customers attempted to cancel their contracts, the defendants claimed the sales contract was binding. Concerned that the debt collection agencies could ruin their credit ratings, many customers also paid annual support “software upgrade” fees, even when they could not or did not use the system.

Under the Texas Deceptive Trade Practices Act, the defendants face civil penalties of up to $20,000 per violation, as well as a $250,000 penalty if the conduct was designed to harm a person aged 65 or older. The enforcement action cites numerous violations of the Business and Commerce Code’s Texas Contest and Gift Giveaway Act. Additionally, the Attorney General charged the defendants with violating the Texas Disclosure and Privacy Act, commonly called the Texas No-Call law.


----------



## wilmetted

*Has Anyone noticed?*

Has Anyone noticed that all the people who were claiming that the company was legitimate have vanished from this discussion? This includes the person who said he or she worked for the company. They should be able to do something about all of the dissatisfaction expressed on this board. 

For all of you who feel you have been scammed, don't give up and keep pursuing your refunds. There was some pretty good advice here and that is why I love this board. Lots of honesty!


----------



## schoof

*Cut our losses*

So, my husband and I bought into this at the end of February and have decided just recently that it is unaffordable for us, and with the research that I have done on trying to find cheap getaways with them, it's just not worth it. I'm trying to cancel and cut my losses. My husband says that we could only cancel within that 3 day period, but my understanding for that is you would not get any money back after 3 days if you cancelled. I don't care about my lost money, I just simply want out, and don't want to give them any more money. (we went with the surepay thingy). Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks


----------



## stefanie19

*OMG,*

OMG, this is still going on?  I have not been on the website for almost three months and can't believe how out of hand this has gotten.  I feel for all of you that think it is a scam.  Guys anyone who is worried about this being a scam send me a message and I will prove to you it is not a scam.  I had 8000 points and have used close to 5500 already in about 9 months.  If it was a scam when I showed up to the resort they would not have let me stay there. 

 For the last post....

I think the last post "hit the nail on the head."  I think it is the problem with the United States these days too.  Someone buys something and is not responsible enough to pay for it. Thats why banks collapse and the government has to bail everyone out.  
If you owned timeshare, because you get a worthless deed with it, they would foreclose on you and it would be on your credit for a long time if you stop paying.  
Shoof,
I don't know you but I know that if I agreed to buy something and I agreed to finace it and agreed to make the monthly payments.  I WOULD DO IT.  Its called your word and if your word means nothing than you are nothing.  

Most the complaints I have read on the internet about the "DP Scam" are more about money than the program not working.  

Everyone hopped on the band-wagon.  My hubby said it reminded him of the Salem Witch Trails.  :rofl: :rofl: 

I went on their website to log in and noticed they were having a contest. 

[Commercial link deleted - do not post links to Paradise Destination on TUG.]

I thought, hmm I wonder why they would put over $5000.00 in prizes just to hear peoples stories.  Now I see, all these website make it sound like nobody uses the site.  I log in all the time and see new resorts, locations and packaged deals. The company has over 150,000 owners using the program and I have not seen any complaints that date back past november.   HMMM
how could the company have gone under the radar for so long?  How could they have sold 10's of thousands with no BBB complaints.  THEN i came across JANA's post.  I see that right around the time all these post started was when see was fired.  

I am smart enough to see from myself that she is the cause.  I also see on the other forums that she is about to be hit bad legally.  Serves her right I'd say.  

Anyway,  I won't waste my time on here for a while so bye bye.

P.S.  
go ahead all you timeshare owners call me a shill again.


----------



## PerryM

*Destination Paradise - BBB rates it a "D"*

I've really enjoyed this thread - state of the art internet marketing via shills.

Here is the BBB review of Destination Paradise - *it gets a "D"; there are a lot of problems with this company.*

So if you don't mind buying from a "D" company riddled with all kinds of consumer problems then go right ahead but don't come back here bellyaching when you get screwed.

Folks let me tell you that this is very good marketing on the company's part - it is state of the art; and they don't give up easily.  This new marketing has shills invade a website and pretend to be just common folk and they will even bash the company but always seem to come around and endorse it.

P.S.
Last time I checked on this company BBB had it at a "C" - it has fallen since then; tough economic times.

P.P.S.
I don't have the time to do this but you could start down the management personnel table and I'd bet each has quite a colorful background.  That would be a hoot.  Typically the CEO and the marketing/sales guys have the most colorful history.  If I had to guess both managers will have been involved with at least 2 prior bankruptcies each - that's how good these guys are.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*I think an "F" pool might be worthy for this company.  Just when will all the hard work of this company be rewarded with a BBB of "F"?

I'll start - my guess is December 31, 2009 they will be awarded a BBB "F".*

6 more months of hard work here and other websites ought to do it.

(That's my guess and please don't try to piggyback on my winnings; pick your own date please)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Note to Destination Paradise:

I noticed BBB only has 17 complaints with Sales Practices - you need to work harder if I'm going to win the above pool.

Let me know if you need some ideas - we timeshare folks get lied to all the time and I have a list of whoppers that you can use.

I'm rooting for you......


----------



## DeniseM

Please note that Stefanie19 uses an internet provider in *Hawaii* where this company is located - this seems very odd, since she claims to be in Texas.


----------



## mauihorizon

*stefanie19 SCAM*

If you trace the ip address, not only is it a Hawaii internet provider, its location is about 7 blocks from the sales office.


----------



## schoof

Stefanie,

Just so you know, all I wanted was out, I finally got a hold of them, and have worked something out rather than me quitting payments, because I am NOT like that. I am a very responsible young woman for my age, and know what stopping payments would do to A- my credit rating and B- My life, as they could come after me. So I will be RESPONSIBLE enough to pay my dues as my hubby and I did get ourselves into this mess anyways. I haven't done anything with the program yet, and that is why we decided it's not worth it, but since we are still owners and always will be unless we dont pay the yearly fee, we probably will use it, and then pass it along. I just wish I wouldn't have gotten myself into this mess in the first place.


----------



## mauihorizon

*Destination Paradise Hawaii Scam*

To everyone who feels they have been scammed by Destination Paradise Hawaii, please read the following:

You're not alone. A group of us have filed complaints with the BBB and the DCCA (Department of Commerce and Consumer Affairs) both in Hawaii. We managed to have their BBB rating removed for a little while but now it's back to a D. Our complaints ranged from not being able to log onto the website to questioning their business practices and advertising tactics. The DCCA met with Mr. Balicki of Destination Paradise a few weeks ago and had them draft a release of contractual terms. The release promised return of any and all monies invested, including that infamous $250 processing fee that they claimed was non-refundable. Some of us received refunds today. Please, I urge you to file your complaints ASAP with both agencies. They can be done online but you will need to provide paperwork in order to prove that you were in fact in contract with Destination Paradise. 

The DCCA is actively working with all those who complain. There is more information about this on ABOUT.COM under Destination Paradise. Again, you're not alone and you will get your money back.


----------



## Politico

*Unfortunate*

I feel very badly for the people who feel for this.  Scamming folks during  a recession is beyond the pale.  Stephanie is obviously a shill.  The timing of her posts alone made clear she was a fraud from the beginning. 

To me this shows the importance of doing your research on TUG and elsewhere before making a purchase.

I hope everyone defrauded by this company pursues all legal remedies to shut these guys down once and for all.


----------



## sigep100

*Destination Paradise Scam*

Another Sad Story.

I was on my Honeymoon at the beginning of June and decided to go to Oahu, Hawaii.  Like most of you I was walking down the street minding my own business when I was approached by a gentleman who advised of all these discounts he could provide us if me and my wife would go to a presentation about vacation packages.  Thinking we would attend and leave at the first chance, we decided to go.  Who could pass up such great offers?

Well, we got caught up in the moment.  The sales pitch was good and the closer did what he needed to do to sell us.  My wife was excited about the deals she heard and thought it would be great for our family.  She thought we deserved to go on more vacations and especially at the prices of the condos and hotels they had.  Wanting to please my wife, I decided to run with it.

We were on vacation for two weeks and this is the first chance I've gotten to look at there website.  I am very dissapointed in the locations, prices, and availability of these condos and hotels.  The savings were very minimal and the locations were not attractive.  I could not believe we were sold this in Hawaii yet they have very limited locations we can actually go to in Hawaii.  Please let me know what I can do to possibly recover some of my money. 

Any recommendations on recovering my money or cutting my losses?  Please Help.


----------



## mauihorizon

*Hope this helps:*

To the people who are writing asking if we got our monies and if our credit was affected, about 23-25 people filed with the DCCA and YES we got a refund of our downpayments at Destination Paradise (DP) ranging from the processing fee of $250 to thousands of dollars and MOST of us got a refund from Universal.  However, because DP offered us the option of using their product for free, some of us got billed the annual fee of $189, even though we didn't  accept the terms of the offer.  Personally, I don't want any dealings with DP and this is what I'm trying to square off because none of us have gotten a letter from Universal (for those who used Universal for the financing) that we are no longer responsible for the debt.  Also, as far as credit is concerned, Universal's account never showed up on my credit reports, only as an inquiry so for all of you concerned about that, I suggest investing a little money in credit monitoring to make sure no negative feedback shows up.

For those that haven't filed a complaint with the DCCA/BBB, you need to do it right away.  Don't wait for the DCCA to come to you because it's not.  Everything can be found online.  All you have to do is fill out the complaint and send in your paperwork to the DCCA.  They will follow up with your case.  

As a group that succeeded getting refunds, we have discused the fact that we need more exposure.  Problem is we were all tourists in Hawaii/Waikiki and the only way to get the word out is word of mouth, perhaps standing near the offices of DP and dissuade people from becoming the next victims.


----------



## PerryM

*BBB just dropped rating this turkey*

The BBB dropped the "D" rating and just stopped rating it at all - it's a con - you all knew that didn't you?

Hopefully folks doing a Google search will find this thread and save their hard earned money from these con men.


----------



## Mari1969

*Thanks Perry M*

LIKE PERRY M SAID, Destination Paradise has no rating with the BBB.  More and more complaints are pouring in to the DCCA.  I am the one that posted the information that MauiHorizon has so graciously copied and pasted and I thank you for it.  

New information has surfaced and Destination Paradise has an affiliation with Global Escapes which offices are located in Florida.  Look them up please...look at their website...Identical to the one that Destination Paradise used to have a few weeks ago but suddenly has closed down.  
www.destinationparadisehawaii.net no longer exists. The have a .COM website which is spanking new and different from the .NET one and I'm sure it is to convince us there is no connection with GLOBAL ESCAPES.  I'm glad I printed the .NET website before it closed down.

WAKE UP PEOPLE.  FOR REAL...DO WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO TO GET YOUR COMPLAINTS INTO THE DCCA ASAP AND THE BBB.  THESE PEOPLE ARE LIKE NOMADS AND THEY'RE READY TO SET UP SHOP ELSEWHERE TO MAKE MORE MONEY AND TO TAKE THE HEAT OFF THEIR BACKS.

AND MS. STEFANIE19...YOU SEE WE'RE ONTO YOU SO STOP YOUR NONSENSE (BS) ALREADY.  I HOPE YOU'RE GETTING PAID FOR YOUR SUPPORT BECAUSE WHAT YOU'RE DOING IS ABSOLUTELY WRONG.  YOU'RE JUST AS GUILTY AS EVERYONE ELSE AT DESTINATION PARADISE THAT'S IF YOU'RE NOT ON THEIR PAYROLL ALREADY.  AS A MATTER OF FACT, GLOBAL ESCAPES HAD SOME TEXAN CONNECTION...RIGHT STEFANIE19?


----------



## mauihorizon

*How To File A Complaint With The DCCA Hawaii*

How To File a Complaint

To file a complaint about a particular company or individual, you can obtain a complaint form from the web site at http://hawaii.gov/dcca/areas/rico/forms/, by calling 586-2653, by going to the Office of Consumer Protection (OCP) and Regulated Industries Complaints Office (RICO) of the Department of Commerce and Consumer Affairs (DCCA), or by writing to the Consumer Resource Center, 235 South Beretania Street, 9th Floor, Honolulu, Hawaii 96813.


----------



## mauihorizon

*Complaints To The Dcca Of Hawaii*

HERE IS FUTHER PROOF THE SHEER NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO BEEN SCAMMED BY DESTINATION PARADISE LLC.LISTED ARE COMPLAINTS,TO THE DCCA OF HAWAII, THAT HAVE GONE UNRESOLVED.

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1213N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1197N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1196N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1195N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1194N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1184N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1173N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1164N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1143N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1134N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1096N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1085N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1077N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1060N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1044N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1028N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1018N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1017N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1001N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 1000N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0974N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0947N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0919N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0918N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0878N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0845N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0815N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0809N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0732N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0730N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0568N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0565N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0489N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0470N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0468N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0458N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2009- 0345N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2008- 1243N

OUTCOME: THIS IS A PENDING COMPLAINT. NO FURTHER INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE.  

Complaint No:   OCP- 2008- 1212N


----------



## mauihorizon

*Paridise Blue*

Looks like Destination Pardise Hawaii changed their name to Paradise Blue to avoid all the negative press.They changed names in Texas and the Attorney General still shut them down.


----------



## sigep100

*Any new information?*

I was wondering if anyone has any new information in regards to Destination Paradise.  I have filed a complaint with DCCA and BBB and was told by the BBB that my complaint shows as unresolved.  I have not heard from DCCA and was told that do to Destination Paradise putting the 3 day cancelation policy in the contract I was going to have a hard time canceling or getting out of my contract.  

Universal has started contacting me about my outstanding balance and I'm not sure if I should start paying them before I ruin my credit with this horrible purchase.  Please help with any advice.


----------



## mauihorizon

*Another Scam From Destination Paradise hawaii who has now changed to Paradise Blue.*

my wife and I had the same exact problem. the company this time has morphed into Paradise-Blue(.net). we got the same deal as everyone above but at least we had access to a computer within 24 hours after we gave them our credit card and signed the papers (for "only" $6995...) - chilly surprise when we got to see who they are... we looked for a fax number to fax them our cancellation notice. guess what - no fax number anywhere. Of course not since a fax cannot be contested in the court of law! ok then we needed to do something else then:
1. The next day (a Saturday - they work on Saturdays) we went to the same site where we had that presentation by them and we asked for a fax number so we can "fax some documents to complete the deal" - at first the receptioniste was reluctant to give us one but then she called the "manager" which gave us the fax number (we will see soon if this number is fake or not...). We will fax the cancellation notice as well - just in case - but read further below...
2. Next step was to contact the local Hawaii Waikiki police and got a police officer as witness to our cancellation process/event, just in case the things are going out of hand and just to make sure we have an official witness to our cancellation. And guess what, they (Paradise-Blue)where very pissed and offended by the fact we came with such a witness but unfortunately for them, while we were signing the cacellation papers in front of the police officer, another cuple showed up yelling about the deal being a scam(!!!). imagine what a coincidence! They had no choice and accepted the cancellation notice in front of the police officer.
3. We asked the credit card company (AMEX) to cancel the transaction and we explained them everything we've gone trough with Paradise-Blue. AMEX got the entire picture so they won't be surprised next time somebody else will do the same.

I'm not sure we are out of this yet but as a personal thought: I don't think anyone can prosecute this kind of business... I think they have enough cover-up to get themselfs over law suites for the scams. The fact that their service sucks is not a legal matter... we have all signed for this - sorry but look again through the papers we all signed...
I believe the only way to kill this type of business is to make more popular their practices.


----------



## DANIELA2424

*Email Me!!!!!!!*

ATTENTION TO ANYONE AND EVERYONE WHO HAS BEEN SCAMMED BY DESTINATION PARADISE!!!!

pls email me asap upon reading this thread. I am looking to take legal action!!!

The email you can contact me at is

danielacaruso_@hotmail.com


----------



## mauihorizon

*Paradise-Blue SCAM*

Another Victim:
Just came back from Hawaii and also got schemed out of my $250.00. I paid $4500 for this package. It has not been two weeks and I have not received any user or log in, but I am honestly thinking about just not paying them. I can't beleive Ron (the salesrep) acted like he was so honest and then Chester (the manager comes over and tries to work with you as if hes doing you a favor). They should all go to jail in my opinion. Even the woman from Minnesota who does the convincing presentation. Everyone from my group purchased this package. I tried to print a complaint online from the DCCA website but the file was damaged. What is the next step after contacting DCCA? I wish I would have done my research. I let my traveling bug get in the way of my intelligence to "google"


----------



## mauihorizon

*Paradise Blue Scam*

How To File a Complaint 
To file a complaint about a particular company or individual, you can obtain a complaint form from the web site at http://hawaii.gov/dcca/areas/rico/forms/, by calling 586-2653, by going to the Office of Consumer Protection (OCP) and Regulated Industries Complaints Office (RICO) of the Department of Commerce and Consumer Affairs (DCCA), or by writing to the Consumer Resource Center, 235 South Beretania Street, 9th Floor, Honolulu, Hawaii 96813


----------



## studying1

*use of timeshares*

it has been a while since i have posted to you.  i have been reading the current posts and can confirm that they use one of the timeshare resorts we own in australia - sandy point.  it is very nice.

i understand that they buy unused weeks of timeshare resorts and sell them to dp owners.  i guess for the usa people coming to australia is a long trip and probably wouldn't be done much.

we are looking to go to europe i 10 and are going to try and use all our timeshares to get us to where we want to go/stay as long as possible.

we initially had problems accessing the site but eventually they resent our passwords and i have been on the site looking around at timeshares, hotels and cruises.  i have spoken to the staff several times to get the help i needed to better understand how to access the site/resorts i wanted and they were very helpful over the phone - they called me in australia.

only problem now is the fact that the repayments have not been made and that was our card providers fault as they froze the card as it was a replacement one and i only found that out last week and i have now sent a further email to the contracts area to see what has happened/will happen with the repayments to be taken that have not been taken.

i need to tell you i am having more trouble with a resort in maui that was booked here in australia for our trip in march 09 - they didn't give us the room we paid for, the room overlooked a cement roof/was glarey and the think they have done enough to refund dry cleaning and waive parking fees.  this isn't enough as we paid heaps for the room and we were there 5 days and action only happened when we filled out comment cards - free bubbly finally came after the feedback form was sent - on checkin was told it would be in the room by the time we got to the room.  i can tell you royal lahina in maui are bigger ripoff merchants than dp.  have lodged a complaint with the alha ceo, your consumer affairs in hawaii and am awaiting to hear from both of them.  followed up on the person the alha ceo gave me as the person looking into this matter and still no word.  don't use royal lahina/hawaiihotel resorts - there are only two of them - one in maui and one on the big island.  they rip you off so much it isn't funny.

robyn


----------



## mauihorizon

Anybody who signed up for the Dstination Paradise Hawaii(aka Paradise Blue)scam there is a way out, if the contract was signed before June of 2009.The cancellaton policy (3 days) was buried on the last page of the "terms and acknowledgement".They had to add a seperate page to acknowledge the 3 day cancel policy.Any contracts signed before June 2009 are "null and void".Good Luck


----------



## HawaiiChuck

*good work maui horizon*

Good work Maui horizon guy. You seem to be right on top of these folks with a ton of info for the rest of us. I saw you even got the info on the June 09 thing nailed down. Are you a lawyer or something ? Or maybe just that guy from Bluh Chunks Investments that has been in violation of that Federal law they call "Deceptive trade Practices" and the state laws are probably piling up too since they passed that new "Internet harrassment" law. 8 months now ?  That's pretty dedicated in your own efforts to control your marketplace. We'll stay on the high road however and at some point be vindicated . . .


----------



## Snow

Hi everyone,
My parents just returned from a trip to Hawaii where they signed up with Paradise Blue! It seemed too good to be true, so we looked them up on line. After reading the various sites, blogs and this forum, we realized it was all a scam. Unfortunately it has been more than 3 business days so they cannot cancel it. What can they do now? Is there a legal way to terminate the contract? How about canceling the credit card? Will it affect the credit rating in Canada? Is there a way to recover the $250 processing fee? Thanks in advance for your advice.
S


----------



## Paradise Dreams Maui Rip Off

*Paradise Dreams Maui Rip Off*

Paradise Blue has opened another office in Maui. Paradise Blue has changed its name to Pacific Dreams on Maui. It has opened in Old Lahaina Center, a Harry and Jannette Weinberg Foundadtion property.
Any questions or problems concerning getting out of your contract with Destination paradise Hawaii (Paradise Blue and Pacific Dreams) please contact:
Mr. Jeff D'Amato- Sales Manager in Maui 210-542-6135
Mike Balicki- Sales Manager in Honolulu 808.222.4085
Seyi Faodu - Sales Manager in Honolulu 612.310.6484
Chuck Roubalard - Owner of the product and Leader of the entire scam. 763.772.6535
I've done a lot of research on both Destination Paradise Hawaii (DPH) and Global Escapes in Texas and these are the same people. Once they got shut down by the Attorney General in Texas, they came to Hawaii. These companies exist to scam unwitting tourists. The owners and employees left San Antonio and started working in Hawaii. I'd like to see them shut down as a service to past, current and future victims. Here are links to the steps the Texas Attorney General took to shut them down. Just like they keep changing their name in Hawaii (Destination Paradise, paradise blue and now Paradise Dreams all within 18 months!), they used many names in Texas also: Escapes Austin, Global Escapes, Blue water, Escapes Midwest, Sun Tree Escapes, Escapes Midwest. Etc...

IT IS THE EXACT SAME SCAM JUST A DIFFERENT DESTINATION - INSTEAD OF RIPPING OFF PEOPLE IN TEXAS THEY ARE RIPPING OFF PEOPLE IN HAWAII

Please, please, please read the injuctions websites below:

INJUNCTION: http://www.oag.state.tx.us/newspubs/releases/2009/040109globalescapes_pop.pdf 

BANK ACCOUNT SEIZURE: http://www.oag.state.tx.us/newspubs/releases/2009/040109globalescapes_tro.pdf

Here is what an article in a Texas newspaper said about them:

A family of Florida-based travel companies doing business in Austin and San Antonio are facing charges of deceptive trade practices and other business and commerce code violations from the Texas Attorney General’s office.

The defendants, Escapes Austin LLC and Escapes Midwest LLC, which do business under the names Global Escapes, Blue Water, Sun Tree and others, are accused of using false gift giveaways to entice customers to attend sales seminars that marketed worthless travel-related software programs, according to a news release from the attorney general’s office.

Attorney General Greg Abbott said his office is seeking restitution for some 5, 000 Texas consumers who may have been deceived into purchasing the software. In response to the attorney general’s actions, the 73rd District Court of Bexar County issued an order freezing the defendants’ assets.

Court documents filed by the state also name chief executive officer James Carey III and managing member Gwendolyn Carey. According to the state’s lawsuit, the defendants used direct mail and telemarketing calls to inform potential customers that they “won” free cruises, hotel stays, vehicles, flights or expensive watches. However, recipients were told that they must set up an appointment to attend a sales presentation in order to receive their prize.

Those chosen also were told they only needed to pay taxes due on the gifts. Recipients were not informed about restrictions, hidden costs, the prizes’ overall value or the prizes’ limited availability. According to state investigators, prizes were difficult to redeem, expensive to redeem, or unavailable during certain dates.

During the mandatory sales seminars, the defendants touted their “proprietary software search engine technology, ” which they claimed would allow purchasers to locate and reserve bargain travel deals online. “The defendants then used high-pressure sales tactics to convince customers that their ‘software license’ opportunity surpassed all others in the industry, ” the release states. “The defendants’ sales representatives often purported to ‘negotiate down’ from the software’s $12, 000 retail price to $7, 000, $4, 000, or to a ‘one-time price reduction’ of $2, 200.”

Customers who could not afford the purchase price were offered financing. Rather than retain the purchaser’s outstanding debt, the defendants frequently sold it to third-party debt collection or finance companies.

According to the documents, after purchasing the product, many customers were unable to log on to the Web site for at least two weeks. “When the defendants finally provided the necessary user IDs and passwords, many customers encountered technical problems. Customers who were able to fully access the system discovered that the bargain travel deals they were promised did not actually exist.”

During the sales negotiations, customers were told they could return the product for a refund if they were dissatisfied with their purchase. However, when customers attempted to cancel their contracts, the defendants claimed the sales contract was binding. Concerned that the debt collection agencies could ruin their credit ratings, many customers also paid annual support “software upgrade” fees, even when they could not or did not use the system.

Under the Texas Deceptive Trade Practices Act, the defendants face civil penalties of up to $20, 000 per violation, as well as a $250, 000 penalty if the conduct was designed to harm a person aged 65 or older.


_____________________________

Here is the Better Business Bureau Rating iof this company:
Based on BBB files, this business has a BBB Rating of F on a scale from A+ to F.
Reasons for this rating include: 
• 73 complaints filed against business
• Failure to respond to 14 complaints filed against business.
• 13 complaints filed against business that was not resolved.
• BBB Accreditation was revoked because business failed to comply with agreed BBB standards.
• Business has failed to resolve underlying cause(s) of a pattern of complaints.

Here is the company Business Contact and Profile:
Business Contact and Profile
Name: Destination Paradise LLC
Phone: (808) 685-7071
Fax: (808) 931-6024
Address: 2250 Kalakaua Ave Ste 301
Honolulu, HI 96815-2545
Website: http://www.destinationparadisehawaii.com

New Owner Date: March 2008
Principal: Mr. Michael A. Balicki, Manager
Customer Contact: Mr. Michael A. Balicki, Manager - (808) 685-7071
Entity: Limited Liability Company
Incorporated: March 2008, HI
Type of Business: Travel Clubs
BBB Accreditation: This company is not a BBB Accredited business. Paradise Blue is opening another office in Maui. Paradise Blue has changed to Pacific Dreams on Maui.
Any questions or problems concerning getting out of your contract with Destination paradise Hawaii(Paradise Blue and Pacific Dreams) please contact:
Mr. Jeff D'Amato- Sales Manager in Maui 210-542-6135
Mike Balicki- Sales Manager in Honolulu 808.222.4085
Seyi Faodu - Sales Manager in Honolulu 612.310.6484
Chuck Roubalard - Owner of the product and Leader of the entire scam. 763.772.6535

________________________________________


This Company is not a BBB Accredited business.
Business Management
Additional company management personnel include:
Mr. Harold (Sunny) Lewis - Marketing Manager 808-222-1229. This is the guy that heads up all of the people on the street in Honolulu to get you to go to the presentation
Mr. Moa Mahe
Ms. Pearl Helsham - Office Manager
Mr. William M Campbell, IV
Mr. Kenneth D Stafford
Mr. Oluseyi Famodu - Sales Manager in Honolulu 612.310.6484
Mr. Chuck Robillard - Mastermind and OWNER of this scam!!! 763.772.6535
Mr. Mike Balicki 808.222.4085
Mr. Jeff D'Amato- Sales Manager in Maui 210-542-6135

They have opened on Maui as of Dec. 1st 2009 and they are using a marketing company called Tickets on the Rock owned and operated by Mr. Pete Carroll. They have Activity booths all over Maui, Mainly on Front Street, Maui. This is the company that gives you discounts on your activities to attend the presentation on Maui.

If you see any of these locations on Maui or Honolulu:
Destination Paradise Showroom
Pacific Dreams Showroom
Paradise Blue Showroom
Preview Center Showroom
Activity Store Kiosks
Valued Guests Kiosks
Tickets on the Rock Kiosks

PLEASE DONT BUY A THING----YOU WILL JUST GET RIPPED OFF!!!


----------



## travelpro2

*Destination Paradise/Valued Guests/Activity Store*

Never mind the gossip - This is what the BBB has to say about them


http://www.bbb.org/hawaii/business-reviews/travel-clubs/destination-paradise-in-honolulu-hi-53004251


----------



## mauihorizon

*HelloHawaiiChuck*

The fourth-most complained-about industry, travel clubs, had not ranked very high in complaints until last year, but has been on the BBB's radar for some time.

"You pay a fee to be part of this travel club, and through their membership they're able to negotiate good deals to prime locations around the world," Ellenwood said. "That can sometimes be a sketchy type of business that we keep an eye on."

Ellenwood said travel club complaints spiked in 2009 because of beefs against one business; she declined to name the business. However, according to Hawaii BBB statistics, there were 66 complaints last year against Destination Paradise LLC.

According to the BBB's complaint history, customers alleged that the company's sales presentations misled the actual savings realized by using the company's program, and that they were unable to examine the program within the cancellation time frame. Customers also cited difficulties in reaching customer service.

Destination Paradise did not return calls for comment.

The company is under "active investigation," said Christine Hirasa, spokeswoman for the state Department of Commerce and Consumer Affairs. She could not comment further, except that the Office of Consumer Protection is handling the investigation.

The state DCCA has 44 pending complaints against the company. The agency lists the company's associated names as "Paradise Blue" and "Paradise Dreams."

The company had its BBB accreditation revoked last August, and has not responded at all to 17 complaints filed with the BBB. That would be 17 too many, according to Ellenwood.

"One unanswered complaint can and will result in an F BBB rating," she said. "We at least expect the businesses to respond in good faith, to work with us ideally to some mutual satisfaction to the business and customer."

Ellenwood said the level of trust in companies is lower today after the 2001 Enron scandal, so it's important that businesses put on a good face and stay accredited.

"Consumers always come back and say accreditation matters," Ellenwood said. "With the diminishing consumer trust that we've seen, it really does make a difference


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## Kagehitokiri2

yes, vacation clubs (usually timeshare rental brokers) have been more publicized in europe it seems. but theyre certainly been around here as well.


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## mauihorizon

*Paradise Blue Scam*

Paradise Blue is a SCAM! 

We went for the "free gift" and the "30" mintue program that lasted over 2 hours. 

We had to hand over our cell phones so someone could personally turn them off. We were told that we would not be allow to use the restroom, so please go before the program started. THAT IN ITSELF SHOULD OF THREW UP RED FLAGS...But get the
gift and leave. Right? Wrong!!! The program LOOKS Great! To Good to be True! And your
on Vacation..You want to go back on Vacation.

So the Program starts at $9, 000 - Drops to $7, 000 by the time it was over we will give it to you for $4, 000 with a FREE Vacation (air fair not included) plus $183 or so a year. GIVE US YOU CREDIT CARD NUMBER!!!

But IF you change your mind you have 3 DAYS TO CANCEL NO QUESTIONS ASK! 
YEAH RIGHT!!!

Paradise-Blue will not let you walk out of the building by yourself if you buy the program. They put your binder with all your information in a brown paper bag and escort you into elevator, into a waiting van that takes you back to your hotel??? (Whats that all about?)

As soon as I got back to the room I check the internet, find how many times Paradise-Blue had changed their name, all the bad reviews, BBB RATES THEM AN "F". I had to check the BBB in Flordia, because they are really listed in Flordia??? with an Hawaii address??

We go back to Paradise-Blue and TRY TO CANCEL WITHIN (1 HOUR!!) Just get our money OFF the Credit Card. Which at that point had not even been post to our account!! 

NO WAY - They WON'T DO IT. Paradise-Blue dropped the price to $2000 then to $1, 000 plus the free vacation & the yearly fee. Paradise-Blue just would NOT take No for an answer! After we made a scene & we refuse to go in the back office people were starting to leave. 

They then signed the cancellation papers. BUT they still did not take the charges off our Credit card! PLUS they CHARGED a $250.00 PROCESSING FEE!!! $4250.00

SO We went Back the next day when all the "New couples" were coming in (I told as many as I chould that it was a scam & I was there to get my money back - check the BBB & internet before they buy) most of the couples thanked me & walked out. Paradise-Blue did not like that, I reminded them of "Free Speech" and I would continue to do that until I got my money back.

I just wanted the $4, 225.00 off my credit card (4) days & talking numerous times to Credit Card Company POLICE THATS WHAT IT TOOK! ITS A SCAM!!


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## wildman

Hi, New user here.  I think my wife and I might have been ripped off last week by Pacific Dreams Just Escape......

Any advice would help.  I don't see anything that links them to Destination Paradise, or Paradise Blue?  

Anybody see this?  http://www.bbb.org/hawaii/business-...fic-dreams-just-escape-in-lahaina-hi-53036565

Good or Bad?

Thanks for your help!


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## Aptman

*Just went to the presentation today*

We did it for a reduced price parasailing (4 of us for $80 total rather than the $260 or so it would've cost retail).  I went in knowing good and well that we wouldn't go for it.  I already own a HGVC that I bought for a song resale, but basically I'd prefer to waste an hour and a half and save nearly $200, so that's what I did.

The presentation was very slick.  They had a "game room" for the kids (tv with an x-box - the kids were thrilled).  The person leading the presentation had apparently been flown in to do the presentation.  He was very good.  His name is Kerry Elevier, I think.  We had our personal sales person who applauded along and then afterwards tried to sell us.  When I said "thanks but no thanks," she said we're not getting off that easily.  It's almost like she knew she was going through the motions for us. When we made it clear we weren't going for it, she said ok, and proceeded to give me a bunch of hints on how to maximize our HGVC property with good trades.  She was very helpful, this was not done with any sales in mind, as she knew it wasn't happening.

When she went to get us our final voucher, she had to have the "closer" sign off on it, he came by and tried to get us to do it, but we mentioned that we had more than enough vacation stuff going on, so we weren't going to do it.  I mentioned my HGVC, and he quickly realized it wasn't going to happen.

I will say, having read the previous people trying to justify this, giving some of them (Stephanie in specific) the benefit of the doubt, I would say that you can get bargains this way, and if you didn't have the buy in, it would probably have some great value.  Of course, spending $4, $6 or $8 thousand up front to get access to these great bargains is no longer a bargain.  However, if you're really lazy, and want someone to do all the work for you, and don't mind spending that much up front, go for it.  It's your money, after all.

All you have to do, though, is run through the numbers.  Calculate how much you spend up front, how much it costs per year, and how much you spend per actual week you use (they have funny money numbers of credits they give you which is meaningless - how much does one actually spend each week they use is all I want to know).  When you get that number, divide it by something like 10 years or more, and you'll get an idea of how much value this has.

I have no doubt that they use very shady techniques to get people to buy - high pressure, slick marketing, vague claims and terms (costs "from" a certain amount of money, using searches which are not necessarily the ones most would use, blurring different types of usages and costs, etc.), and finally, pressure that you HAVE to buy today or it's just no good.  Of course, like with any of these vacations travel deals, someone has to pay for the expensive marketing (freebies that I got, for instance) that they use, someone pays upfront, and then us Tuggies who do our homework swoop in and pick up the stuff that's left over when people realize they're in too deep.

So, I'm sure, like those who pay full price from the developer on timeshares, there are instances of people getting value from their purchases, even here, if you use it (and the company stays in business), then you'll get some satisfaction.  For me, I get far more satisfaction getting the same product at a fraction of the cost.  So, caveat emptor.  It's not like us folk here at TUG are trying to pull the wool over anyone's eyes - far from it, the more we discourage people from buying full-fare coach, the more we hurt ourselves, because more savvy shoppers will in the end cost us more money. But, that's just the type of people we are, I guess.


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## mauihorizon

*Just Dreams Aka Paradise Blue*

Just Dreams is a SCAM! AKA Paradise Blue(changed their name 4 times)

We went for the "free gift" and the "30" mintue program that lasted over 2 hours. 

We had to hand over our cell phones so someone could personally turn them off. We were told that we would not be allow to use the restroom, so please go before the program started. THAT IN ITSELF SHOULD OF THREW UP RED FLAGS...But get the
gift and leave. Right? Wrong!!! The program LOOKS Great! To Good to be True! And your
on Vacation..You want to go back on Vacation.

So the Program starts at $9, 000 - Drops to $7, 000 by the time it was over we will give it to you for $4, 000 with a FREE Vacation (air fair not included) plus $183 or so a year. GIVE US YOU CREDIT CARD NUMBER!!!

But IF you change your mind you have 3 DAYS TO CANCEL NO QUESTIONS ASK! 
YEAH RIGHT!!!

Just Dreams will not let you walk out of the building by yourself if you buy the program. They put your binder with all your information in a brown paper bag and escort you into elevator, into a waiting van that takes you back to your hotel??? (Whats that all about?)

As soon as I got back to the room I check the internet, find how many times Paradise-Blue had changed their name, all the bad reviews, BBB RATES THEM AN "F". I had to check the BBB in Flordia, because they are really listed in Flordia??? with an Hawaii address??

We go back to Just Dreams and TRY TO CANCEL WITHIN (1 HOUR!!) Just get our money OFF the Credit Card. Which at that point had not even been post to our account!! 

NO WAY - They WON'T DO IT. Just Dreams dropped the price to $2000 then to $1, 000 plus the free vacation & the yearly fee. Paradise-Blue just would NOT take No for an answer! After we made a scene & we refuse to go in the back office people were starting to leave. 

They then signed the cancellation papers. BUT they still did not take the charges off our Credit card! PLUS they CHARGED a $250.00 PROCESSING FEE!!! $4250.00

SO We went Back the next day when all the "New couples" were coming in (I told as many as I chould that it was a scam & I was there to get my money back - check the BBB & internet before they buy) most of the couples thanked me & walked out. Just Dreams did not like that, I reminded them of "Free Speech" and I would continue to do that until I got my money back.

I just wanted the $4, 225.00 off my credit card (4) days & talking numerous times to Credit Card Company POLICE THATS WHAT IT TOOK! ITS A SCAM!!


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## mauihorizon

*Just Dreams Aka Paradise Blue*

Just Dreams ripped me and my wife off in 11/2010 on our honeymoon. There deals are no better than Travelocity, orbitz, kayak, or priceline. And all those companies services are FREE!!!! We paid approximatley $6,000 for the uber special "Software license" only to find run down properties and virtually no "short term deals" they mention in the presentation. Not to mention NO DISCOUNTS beyond what the free sites can get you. I filed a complaint with the Department of Consumer Affairs in Hawaii, and the company they used to finance me responded with a letter saying they would no longer charge me anymore. Although my app fee and such was not refunded, nor were my first 4 payments, but I dont care. I have an official letter from them saying the Hawaii Attorney General contacted them, and that I no longer owe money. They must have gotten scared. Anyhow, YES they are a total scam. And YES, contact the DCCA they can get it taken care of. They are the same company as paradise blue. They keep changing their name to avoid detection.


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## brizone

That would probably be the Camlis, the only Seattle listing in the current RCI Directory.  Red weeks all year long.


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## broiler_x

Pacific Dreams is the latest version of Destination Paradise.  They had to change names (again) do to all of the complaints and the 'F' rating by the BBB (worst rating possible).  They will claim to not be associated with Destination Paradise, but just look at the 2 websites and you'll see that the text is largely copy-and-pasted and the pictures of the satisfied clients have some identical photos.

They do not deliver on what is promised in the presentation.  I know, because sadly I fell for this scam.


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## World-Traveler

Take everything wrong with Timeshares and their selling practices, multiple by 50, add in a whole lot of nothing for an expensive price and you get Pacific Dreams. 

My fiance and I travel quite a bit and have been known to go to time share presentations to get discounted stays or activities now and then. We are used to the high pressure sales and the rapidly decreasing price over time. When we sat in on a presentation by Pacific Dreams in Maui, we didn't realize that a company would outright lie just to get business.

We were warned by the sales person about somebody who had been posting fake scams and ignorantly we bought into it. Like many things it was a while before we had another opportunity to travel and when we went to do so we realized just how big of a SCAM this really is. By this time it was definitely to late to cancel so we're just hoping to help others to not make the same mistakes we did. Remember, for every person who complains there are tens if not hundreds of people who just chalk a mistake up to a bad decision or they don't want to admit to getting scammed. I'll admit it though, we bought it hook, line, and sinker.

We had a three major problems with the service which is why we had to warn others. The least of all is the software. It looks like it is written 15 years ago and it is as hard to navigate as anything i've seen here on the web. Worse is that you can't book trips to any place you would actually want to go. Thinking of a romantic trip to Paris? Not even an option. We weren't able to find any major city anywhere in the world that it allowed. The worst clincher though is even when you find a far off remote place and you are supposed to be getting some great deal, the prices where over twice what we found in a quick 5 second search of accommodations on the web. The one thing they say they are good at, getting great deals around the world and their prices don't even come close to what's competitive.

It is a waste of several thousand dollars for us from this scam. I hope others don't make same mistake!


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## syn0s

I had to register just to share some of my thoughts and the red flags that came up for me when going through the Just Dreams presentation, so this is my first post but I'm not a Planted poster.

This is a total scam.. We got suckered into a free car rental and some restaurant gift certs for our 90 minute presentation and we reluctantly agreed.

Here's some thoughts/flags:

1. The original person who offered us the presentation and tickets at the "free activities booth" specifically told us to lie and mark a higher pay range on the application at the sales pitch. Also, no mention of the company names "paradise blue" or "just dreams" were included by the activities booth.

2. Once arriving, they claim that they have a lease on the entire 6th floor of the Bank of Hawaii building (this isn't true though as there are vacant offices on that floor). Additionally, if you look at the buildings directory, as well as the plaques on the wall next to the office doors, you will see NO MENTION of the names "Paradise Blue" or "Just Dreams." Thus, there is no proof that they are there to "stay" so to speak, and they can up and leave any moment.

3. After arriving and filling out paperwork, we sat in the waiting room with a few other couples that were already there. It's very possible these couples could have been "dummies" and were planted there.

4. Upon arrival of our sales representative and being ushered into the presentation room, we were REQUIRED to turn off our cell phones IN THE PRESENCE OF the representative! HUGE red flag! We also could not use the restroom while in the presentation.

5. Our presentation was given by a gentlemen named "Seyi" who was very persuasive (I've seen his name mentioned in other complaints as well). He mentioned the price of $10,000 at the beginning of the presentation, claiming that was the final price and that there was no other hidden costs aside from the yearly renewal fee.

6. During the presentation, they mention that they help "subsidize" costs by paying part of the hotel/condo/cruise booking costs. They also showed slides that indicate the amount of savings one would receive. Each buyer is entitled to "X" amount of fictional vacation dollars to spend towards hotel/cruise/condo reservations ($3,000, for example). When you book a stay, they take money out of this fund, which is replenished yearly.

They DID NOT, however, specifically say HOW MUCH you can take out of this fund AT ANY GIVEN TIME. Seemed very evasive and vague, and I have seen complaints stating that you CANNOT USE THE FULL AMOUNT TOWARDS A SINGLE VACATION STAY. This makes the cost of the condo/hotel/cruise EXACTLY the same as it would be on orbitz, hotels.com, hotwire, etc.

7. During the presentation, they used screenshot slides that were still shots of their website. They DID NOT use the Live Software to show ANYBODY any price on any given destination.

In my experience, any presentation that DOES NOT show live software is HIDING SOMETHING.. I know because I've seen it done in other companies that I've worked with in an entirely unrelated industry. They use the excuse that the presentation would drag on too long past the 60 minutes they had if they used the live software, since everybody would want to see their destination of choice.

8. At first, we were spoken to by our sales representative. When she quickly discovered that we were skeptical, a manager was almost immediately brought in to pressure us more.

We were brought into a private office in the back and after being further skeptics they brought in the "big guns" a.k.a. the presenter/VP manager of the office who gave the presentation. He further pressured us into purchasing the program.

9. The price plummeted. It was $10k originally, then went to $8k, and drastically dropped as low as $2,500 for a budget friendly package. Any product whose price drops this much should have it's legitimacy questioned immediately.

This is not only a shady marketing/sales tactic, but the manager blatantly told us that "nobody else got this same offer that you did..." Yeah right.. that's a blatant lie, as I've seen many other complaints online stating that they too received the exact same drastic price drops and offers, including the "free vacation voucher" that they toss in to try and sweeten the pot.

10. Speaking of private offices, the office we entered was very "sterile" and BARE! If this is in fact a legitimate business, and the resting place of this company, wouldn't there be personal effects in there? No pictures on the wall or on the desk, just a bare desk with a keyboard and monitor. I'm guessing this is so they can get out of there quickly if another DBA name change is needed.

Also, when we went back to cancel 2 days later, the return private office we spoke in was also bare and had no personal effects.

11. We decided to buy just to get out of there. After paying (with our credit card) and leaving, the anxiety and panic sunk in. We started thinking logically and wondered what disastrous thing we had done.

Sure enough, not a lot of legitimate complaints exist out there for Just Dreams yet. It seems that's the case because this name is fairly new, so not a lot of places exhibit legit complaints yet.

12. 7 day cancellation policy, but it's obvious you wont get your key code to access the software for AT LEAST 7 days. This is another HUGE red flag, and they will manipulate it and "talk" around it all day long, claiming that the filing process takes several days to activate your account and gather your keycode.

This is ridiculous. I sign up for programs online frequently, and there is no such process to go through to get an activated account. You can register online for any number of discount hotel/flight/car rental programs (hotwire, orbitz, etc.) and your account is activated almost IMMEDIATELY, giving you the right to utilize their services right away. This is the 21st century after all.

13. After deciding to cancel, we went in on Monday morning to the office to cancel. We were taken into another private office (which, as mentioned above, was also bare), and we were given a huge retention push. It was obvious that he was trying to retain us as a customer and get us to keep the program, but we were determined to cancel.

14. After trying to cancel, the manager continued to follow us outside and asked us questions about why we cancelled, etc. It seemed like he wanted to hear legitimate feedback, so I was inclined to give it to him.

Every time I mentioned one of these red flags, the guy simply evaded the real question at hand and gave us vague and manipulative answers. The manager would simply NOT give me a decent straight forward answer.

If this company was legitimate, wouldn't they gladly be receptive to positive critical feedback? Many, MANY other individuals have posted complaints and have mentioned MANY of the same red flags that I've mentioned above, yet he talked his way out of every single one of them.

15. No free trial offer or longer cancellation period. Incredibly high sales pressure tactics.

Any legitimate company would have:

a.) A free or discounted trial - Allow me to try your software for free for 'X' days, or allow me to pay a one time fee (say $100 or so) to use your software ONCE to get a discounted vacation. If it works, I'll come back to you and pay the full price. This option doesn't exist and they will laugh you out the door if you try and mention it.

b.) Longer cancellation period - a "no risk" trial of 30 days, 60 days, etc. is very standard and should ALWAYS be an option. There was simply just TOO MUCH RISK to get involved at a 7 day return period for SUCH A LARGE AMOUNT OF MONEY.

c.) No high pressure sales - I'm a firm believer that a good product SELLS ITSELF. If it's such a great product, it doesn't need a high pressure sales pitch, and if we want to leave without buying they should gracefully let us go!

16. When asked, the manager said he DID NOT HAVE AN EMAIL ADDRESS. Who in this day and age of business does NOT have a direct email address?

After that, I asked him for a business card. He handed me a card which was simply a generic business card for Just Dreams, and did not have a direct number for him or his name anywhere on it. Yet another red flag.

I argued for a good hour or so, after which we finally discovered it wasn't worth it to keep arguing and we left. The guy sure did try hard to make us feel bad about cancelling though, but in the end I'm incredibly glad it didn't work.

Avoid this place like the plague. Our 4-5 hours of wasted time on our Hawaii vacation wasn't anywhere worth the $160 or so in free gifts that we received. If I see credit card charges come across for this company I will go to war with them and do anything in my power to get it back.


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