# HRC presentation, takeaways and questions



## GMan82 (Nov 30, 2020)

Hi everyone,
I’m here visiting from the HGVC forums. I happen to be in Key West and opted to stay in the HRC Beach House via the Hyatt hotel site. It’s me and 3 other people, and the price for the 2 bed suite was too good to pass up. Anyway, they offered me a chance to sit through a presentation for $150 in gift vouchers to the cool restaurants / activities here, and access to the HRC membership discounts while I’m a guest.

I thought I’d post my experience here to see if it is what most would expect, as well as what they offered to sell me. I also had a question, as their Portfolio program is what they pushed on me.

Anyway, I’m not an owner, but in the interview at the beginning, I let them know I’m a HGVC owner. I had bought retail, but never again will I make that mistake. I discovered TUG too late, and not in time to rescind. That being said I’ve made use of the program, am in a unique position to afford it without major damage, and genuinely enjoy the resorts and the travel opportunities that opened up.

The salesman was this nice elderly man who didn’t seem to pressure me. He seemed very interested in his job and seemed to like the program. Truth being told, I loved a lot of what he mentioned when he described it to me.

He described the portfolio program where we buy 2200 points in this REIT that lets us use the points anywhere in the portfolio. I love that you can do single nights if you want, the lack of reservation fees, and the automatic rollover for up to 4 years. Hilton doesn’t have those aspects. Access to II is also a plus vs RCI. He mentioned that if I were to buy resale, I wouldn’t have access to the Portfolio and would instead be obligated to my fixed week. They mentioned this Beyond program to use points for cruises and other options. They really pressed II. They also really emphasized the “Saturday night savings” of 40% if you opt to not stay Saturday night at a resort. They also brought up small luxury hotels etc and how I could use my points and covert to WOH to stay at those places. Not the greatest deal, I know, but still a perk they advertise. They did bring up their version of elite status too, starting at 2201 points, existing in tiers. 

As far as pricing, they presented the original which was about $21/pt and the the covid discount to $14ish per point. About $32k for 2200 point week, with initially 150k WOH points, upgraded to 225k points. They’d take my hotel reservation and apply to the cost. Maintenance fees about $0.89 per point, implying that you pay fees based on how many points you own rather than the actual unit. They said that would be going up to about $1 in Jan and that they want to revert the sales from $15ish back to $22ish per point. They did also present a 1320 point option, with the covid discount being about $17ish per point.

All things said and done, I almost caved. The locations complement HGVC so well. I was particularly interested in the Sedona, Key West, and Carmel locations as I don’t have those in HGVC. They offered me at the end $1295 for 5 days and 4 nights in Key West, which would be $995 in off season. They would preserve the $21/pp price level. I passed. My gift was 3 x $50 gift vouchers for use at a list of places, including nice restaurants.

I think I’m sure of this answer, but did I do the right thing in passing on this “deal”? They were so very convincing with the program.

Is there truly no benefit to buying resale? They said I wouldn’t have access to the portfolio program and would need to do fixed week only. 

Is the program really as flexible as they made it seem? There is no difficulty in obtaining reservations? It’s easy to get exchanges through Interval? 

They told me the Legacy system’s units also don’t impact availability in the points portfolio.

Is Marriott really going to keep out of HRC even though they own HRC now?

I told myself I would never buy retail again, but they made this deal sound just too great. Hence my long post and question to the experienced folks here at HRC.

Thanks all.


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## PerryKing (Nov 30, 2020)

*Your lucky you escaped this offer.   YES,  you did the right thing by not buying into the new HPP terrible system.  ( The Hyatt Sunset Harbor club property was  the first club property in the Hyatt RC system.  It's the one on that is  in Old Town Key West and near the only Hyatt** hotel** on the Island and has the best location of the 3 in Key West. Its very difficult to grade into. The other two HRC proprieties are the Beach House at the entrance to the Key and Windward Point property near the airport?  Did you attend  your "Presentation"  in the "Sales Center" that Hyatt RC has set up in OLD TOWN KEY WEST to focus on selling the Hyatt PPP system ONLY !  

I've been through two sale presentations of the HPP  myself. one at at Key West (I received $200 for that one in prepaid Debit cards) and one  Pinion Point In Sedona AZ (10,000 Hyatt Hotel points) ,   And at the end of the presentations, and as a current  owner of 4 Deeded weeks in the club I  said: "NO WAY"  -  at those presentations.   I also remarked  to them that if its so good why don't you just grandfather all current member / owners of deeded week all the HPP privilege's .  I just got blank stares from the salesmen and the managers. 

I especially said "no way"  to them , when I was wavering a bit , and  then saw the  list of the extra high cost fees that were required every  time you wanted to use one of the features of the HPP that they sold you on.  Additional Fees which they probably did not show or discus with you. Also not all the HRC properties are in the portfolio program.  only just a few of them are and any new Construction might be.  

But I do own 4 Hyatt Residence club deed weeks at 4 different Hyatt Residence club resorts.  The club properties are all very nice top end resort, but unfortunately the annual maintenance fee's have started to increase each year more than they have in the past. AND with your deeded week you ARE NOT obligated to use only "your week" or use at your club .   *
So your salesman was not correct about that !


* You can convert your week to club points and use them to say at any club property where you have enough points for, and can find availability - in studios, 2 and or 3 bedroom units. Some clubs currently are very easy to find availability in ( Pinon Point , Wild Oak Ranch in San Antonio) and some are near impossible  (such as Carmel, Siesta Key, Ka 'anapali Beach Club, Park Hyatt Beaver Creek, Aspen and Sunset Harbor) also depending on the season for each club.  Hyatt RC does have a wait list system however.  But it does not work very well. 

(However it s quite possible to get into the 4 wonderful Colorado Clubs especially during the NON SKI SEASON times but even once in a while you can catch a ski week if you try or in the FALL at fantastically  low club points) And you can book 2, 3, 4 or 7 Nights,  If offered.  Some properties have a $35 cleaning fee for stays of less than 7 nights for club members, a few have no such fee at this time. 

SO, If you like the Hyatt club system and  the very nice resorts you should then be looking for deeded resale wee, that still operate under rules the original system.  If you can buy through a certified Hyatt resellers (They are actually independent Realtors)  like the ones in Puerto Rico or at Hyatt Main Street Station in Breckenridge Colorado or at Beaver Creek Colorado you  ALSO will become  part of the Hyatt Hotel exchange program.  (Those are three of the "Official" Hyatt resellers that I'm aware of, there my also be a few more around.  You can even use your legacy points (as they are called) to make Portfolio reservations (if available) and if you want to pay the reservation fees and the very high "Cleaning fees".  

Also as a deeded interest club member you have access to all the features of Interval International and  also exchanges using you deeded points through II. (  II owns the Hyatt system now, and Marriott now owns II - this has happened in just the last few years). We are not sure how this new ownership will effect the Hyatt RC in the future however,  for better or worse ??   And again not all of the 15 Club Hyatt RC resorts are even in the REIT and probably never will be, especially some of the best ones. Where as you can use your deeded points to exchange into any of them IF you can ever find availability ("IF " meaning: at the more popular ones especially). 

As for  the  Beyond Program as far I'm concerned is a Joke.  i.e. look at what you get for the cost of the points you would need to spend. Its my opinion that you could put together the same Beyond Vacation program offerings yourself or through  a travel agent for much less cost. 



I'm sure that every TUG Hyatt member of the forum  that sees your post above will mostly  say the same things OR MORE about the Hyatt Portfolio Points Program and the Deeded original club features that I have tried to outline for you here.   

Feel Lucky you escaped the HPP .. but look for a resale if you like the club ( P.S. You can not buy or resell  HPP system points per the rules of the program ).

Look for resales deals of deeded weeks at the beautiful  Hyatt Coconut Plantation Bonita Springs FL, Hacienda del Mar in Puerto Rico - before they raise the prices - if its not to late  and after the current special assessments ,  Pinon Point Sedona AZ , Wild Oak Ranch in San Antonio. and the two clubs in Key West (other than the Sunset Harbor).   If you find a place that you like and would be happy to go back there most of the time then buy there otherwise just look for the lowest cost per point and lowest cost maintenance fee per point.  i.e. just buy  HRC DEEDED points. - especial after you find and buy the  one property you really like most. 

Also there are several long threads on the Hyatt form where the Portfolio programed is disscused in length.  See if you can find and read those here.

i.e. see:  *
*"MVCI’s purchase of Hyatt Residence Club"   and 
"Foreclosure experience - summer 2020" on this forum.*

in fact read all of the threads  here that you might think would  help you find a interest in the Hyatt resedence club system with your eyes open.  You were pretty smart already resisting the HPPP program, because its not as good as they apparently made it sound to you.    





*PPK*


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## GMan82 (Nov 30, 2020)

PerryKing said:


> *Your lucky you escaped this offer.   YES,  you did the right thing by not buying into the new HPP terrible system.  ( The Hyatt Sunset Harbor club property was  the first club property in the Hyatt RC system.  It's the one on that is  in Old Town Key West and near the only Hyatt** hotel** on the Island and has the best location of the 3 in Key West. Its very difficult to grade into. The other two HRC proprieties are the Beach House at the entrance to the Key and Windward Point property near the airport?  Did you attend  your "Presentation"  in the "Sales Center" that Hyatt RC has set up in OLD TOWN KEY WEST to focus on selling the Hyatt PPP system ONLY !
> 
> I've been through two sale presentations of the HPP  myself. one at at Key West (I received $200 for that one in prepaid Debit cards) and one  Pinion Point In Sedona AZ (10,000 Hyatt Hotel points) ,   And at the end of the presentations, and as a current  owner of 4 Deeded weeks in the club I  said: "NO WAY"  -  at those presentations.   I also remarked  to them that if its so good why don't you just grandfather all current member / owners of deeded week all the HPP privilege's .  I just got blank stares from the salesmen and the managers.
> 
> ...


Thanks for your amazing response! Yes, the sales center was on Front St near the Hyatt Centric Hotel. Yes, I am glad I decided not to cave, mostly from my prior experience of having bought from the developer (HGVC). I’ll for sure take a look at those threads, and have actually been going through them. As nice as they are, the sales folks are still out trying to get a sale. I believe he did tell me that deeded weeks do have access to points. He told me that it happens on your assigned week, rather than on Jan 1 and that’s when your points become available to exchange into other HRC resorts.

He also mentioned priority access to resorts for those in the points portfolio program that those in the legacy deeded system did not have.

I had read some posts on Marriott here before heading into the presentation, though it was fleeting. He is under the impression that Marriott will absolutely leave HRC alone to do its thing. I find that hard to believe.

My question on inventory was skirted though. He made it seem that because the deeded weeks existed, that inventory in the PPP benefits. That made no sense to me. Also by reading here, it seems that only a select few weeks at certain existing resorts are enrolled. Implies slim pickings to me.


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## PerryKing (Nov 30, 2020)

There are some members here in this forum that have posted about the HPP lack of inventory ( at one time and or maybe in their experience or opinion) and I think that some of them have better insight to the inventory question  than I  do.  Some I remember claimed that the portfolio program had very little inventory and like I said in some resorts they have NONE. (like the ones I own in Colorado and Hacienda del Mar, and I hope they never do ) However the two new buildings one at Coconut Plantation (where I will be for 2 weeks beginning  5 DEC) and one at Wild Oak ranch have been designated for HPP inventory only.    Aspen is suing because they have ben included, claiming that it will or has hurt their resale values.

  Did they give you a list of clubs that are actually in the portfolio program ?  So maybe some will come forward with some more info for you.


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## GMan82 (Dec 1, 2020)

No, they made it seem like I could reserve at ANY property using this points program.


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## bdh (Dec 1, 2020)

GMan82 said:


> I think I’m sure of this answer, but did I do the right thing in passing on this “deal”? They were so very convincing with the program.
> 
> Is there truly no benefit to buying resale? They said I wouldn’t have access to the portfolio program and would need to do fixed week only.
> 
> ...



Perry's reply covered the bulk of the topics you inquired on, so just expanding on a few of your inquiries. 

_I think I’m sure of this answer, but did I do the right thing in passing on this “deal”? They were so very convincing with the program.  _

There are some people that really like the flexibility aspects of the Portfolio Program and wind up buying.  If your style of travel/vacation is extremely varied, the Portfolio Program may be for you - that said, the prevailing thought is that you did the correct thing in saying "No".   Note that the vast majority of existing HRC owners that attend a sales presentation do not buy into the Portfolio Program.  The existing HRC owners that bought into the Portfolio Program did so on the sales presentation intimation that access to hard to get properties/reservations would be easier thru the Portfolio Program - fast forward 2 years to now, those that bought have now been disillusioned as there has been no increased access. 
_
Is there truly no benefit to buying resale?  They said I wouldn’t have access to the portfolio program and would need to do fixed week only.  _

The benefit to buying resale is:  It costs a lot less and you actually own a specific deeded week/unit with guaranteed usage.  As a Portfolio owner, you have no guaranteed usage - reservations are completely dependent on availability.  As Perry noted; as an Legacy owner, if you don't want to use your deeded week, you convert it to points for other dates at your home property or any of the other 15 HRC properties.  The converted points of your HRC Legacy week have the same exact value of those of the Portfolio Program.  Regarding no access to Portfolio Program, this is total BS! Portfolio Program has priority for 6 months to Portfolio inventory and deeded week HRC legacy owners have priority for 6 months to their deeded week - after 6 months, both Portfolio owners and HRC owners have access to inventory in both systems.  
_
Is the program really as flexible as they made it seem? There is no difficulty in obtaining reservations? It’s easy to get exchanges through Interval?  _

The HRC legacy system does not have the flexibilty of the Beyond Program.  But when it comes exchanging to other Hyatt and II properties, HRC Legacy access is exactly the same as the Portfolio Program.  Regarding no difficulty in obtaining reservations, this is also total BS!  The hard to obtain reservations (Siesta Key, Ka'anapali Beach Club, Park Hyatt Beaver Creek, Aspen and Sunset Harbor) that Perry noted are even harder to get thru the Portfolio Program.  IE: 99% of the prime weeks at those properties are owned by legacy deeded week owners, so for a Portfolio Program owner to get a prime reservation it only happens when a deeded week owner elects to not use their deeded week.   
_
They told me the Legacy system’s units also don’t impact availability in the points portfolio.  _

More BS! The Hyatt REIT owns large numbers of units at select HRC properties (Windward Pointe, Wild Oak, Coconut Plantation), however as noted above, the bulk of the prime weeks in the HRC system are owned by deeded week owners.  And for a Portfolio Program owner to get a prime reservation, it only happens when a deeded week owner elects to not use their deeded week.  There are no Portfolio Program exclusive properties until Hyatt builds or buys a new TS property.  Until that happens, HRC owners have access to every property that a Portfolio owner can access.   
_
Is Marriott really going to keep out of HRC even though they own HRC now?_ 

Short answer: Yes.  Longer answer: There may be some cross pollination between the Hyatt and Marriott systems years down the road, but with so many deeded weeks in the HRC system, Marriott is expected to leave Hyatt as a stand alone system.

FWIW: The majority of HRC properties have deeded weeks that are foreclosed on for various reasons, so pretty much every HRC property HOA has deeded weeks that are for sale.  The price of the HOA owned units for sale varies by property.  The Main Street Station HOA just held a silent auction - prices ranged from $500 to $10,000.  Beach House has 30+/- weeks for sale - prices range from $1,000 to $4,000.  Sunset Harbor has 30+/- weeks for sale - prices range from $5,900 to $8,900.  Coconut and Windward have units for sale, but don't know the price ranges there.  If you're interested in a specific Hyatt property, call the property and simply ask for the HOA contact for foreclosure units.


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## bdh (Dec 1, 2020)

GMan82 said:


> No, they made it seem like I could reserve at ANY property using this points program.



This is "technically" correct.  Both Legacy owners and HPP owners can get on the request list, so when a deeded week owner elects not to use their deeded week, it is available to all owners.


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## GMan82 (Dec 1, 2020)

I’m at Beach House right now and saw a list of foreclosed units that had codes like “D2200,” which I assume means a Diamond week at 2200 points. That’s interesting. From what I gather, based on some reading in these 24h, if I buy one of those deeds, essentially I can become an HRC club member and participate in the points program, but not be a PPP member. Yet, that probably doesn’t matter because it seems the overwhelming opinion is that the PPP isn’t really worth it.

Buying in Key West wouldn’t be a bad idea for me, being from Atlanta. It’s a nice getaway to come here, if I can’t get one of the other resorts.

If I convert my week to points, does it still rollover to the next year or does it expire in 12 months? For PPP the agent said that points won’t expire for up to 4 years; they automatically roll over to the next year and then I’ll have 4400 points to use that gear. And can points be converted immediately or only once the week has arrived?

Thanks for the help! Buying one of these foreclosed weeks might be a distinct possibility!


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## PerryKing (Dec 1, 2020)

Thank You BDH.

Perry


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## PerryKing (Dec 1, 2020)

See the last "STICKY" above at the beginning of this Hyatt Forum section in TUG for a  description of how the Hyatt legacy / deeded ownership / and points in the deeded ownership works.  Including how your last chance to save your points if your not going to use them for exchange's in the Hyatt Club resorts is to deposit them in the Extended Exchange program for exchanges from the  Interval International  availability.

Sticky - Useful Links and Info about Hyatt Timeshare ownership

TUGBrian
Jun 21, 2017


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## bdh (Dec 1, 2020)

GMan82 said:


> I’m at Beach House right now and saw a list of foreclosed units that had codes like “D2200,” which I assume means a Diamond week at 2200 points. That’s interesting. From what I gather, based on some reading in these 24h, if I buy one of those deeds, essentially I can become an HRC club member and participate in the points program, but not be a PPP member. Yet, that probably doesn’t matter because it seems the overwhelming opinion is that the PPP isn’t really worth it.
> 
> Buying in Key West wouldn’t be a bad idea for me, being from Atlanta. It’s a nice getaway to come here, if I can’t get one of the other resorts.
> 
> ...



I'm not sure what the "D2200" is.  Here's the link to the TUG thread on the BH foreclosures: https://tugbbs.com/forums/threads/foreclosure-units-available-hyatt-beach-house.310677/  that lists the unit, week and price.  There should be a property layout in your check-in package - if not, here's a link to KAL's layout of the BH unit numbers  http://www.bywindkal.com/Hyatt/HBHphotos/HBH_RoomNumbers.pdf

Correct that you would be an HRC club member and participate in the points program, but not be a PPP member.  HRC points do not rollover from year to the next. In general, HRC points get "stale" at 12 months from date of issuance.  So HRC points don't expire at 12 months, but they move to the LCUP period for another 6 months.  During LCUP, you can only reserve a Hyatt unit that has a check in date within 2 months.

If you're in KW now, visit the Windward Pointe and Sunset Harbor properties to check them out - they are two totally different properties.  WP is a much larger property and has a variety of on site amenities and all units all have the same floor plan.  Like BH, WP only has 2 bedroom units (no lock offs) and is located in New Town.  SH is the smallest property in the HRC system - only has 40 units and the only on site amenity is the pool.  There are a variety of unit floor plans and types (townhouse and single floor lock off) and is located in Old Town.  Depending on what you prefer to do on vacation will be a good indicator on which location of New Town or Old Town works best for you.


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## GTLINZ (Dec 1, 2020)

GMan82 said:


> If I convert my week to points, does it still rollover to the next year or does it expire in 12 months? For PPP the agent said that points won’t expire for up to 4 years; they automatically roll over to the next year and then I’ll have 4400 points to use that gear. And can points be converted immediately or only once the week has arrived?
> 
> Thanks for the help! Buying one of these foreclosed weeks might be a distinct possibility!



Hello GMan82.  I have owned both HGVC and HRC units and can tell you that using your points is a very different thing between the 2 systems.  I recently sold my HGVC because we are mostly only traveling now to FL and have friends and relatives to visit. So HRC works better for us at this time and I wanted to own less as I get closer to retirement. I also wanted access to Interval and did not really think RCI had nearly as many quality resorts as Interval.  But I totally agree with you that owning both is a nice complement of options - and I had both for a while.  We owned 15 years with HGVC and it was amazing how much I could squeeze out of my membership.

HGVC is a far more flexible system. You have the concept of a home reservation with both - and if you do not make that reservation (or spend any of your points) you lose the home reservation with both. HRC has an advantage in that if you do want to use your home week you own a specific unit and view - the same unit every year in a specific week number - which is no big deal in some places and a big deal in others (imagine a nice view at Sunset Harbor). You can also reserve part of your home week (less days or one side of a lockoff) and have points left over - which HGVC would not allow.  So what you own can make a big difference in HRC - or like me you can just own HRC for points to use between HRC locations and Interval.

With HRC, your points life cycle is aligned to your owned week - not by calendar year like HGVC - because you own a specific unit instead of a  generic season like HGVC.  With HRC, you do not have changeable reservations - and even worse you have to pay a fee to cancel a reservation to get your points back. You can borrow points but it is not simple and there are significant restrictions. You cannot "rescue" points either (your only real option is you can extend their life in Interval but have to save them there 4 months before your home week). With HRC, your points basically exist from a year before your home week until that week - and for a 6 month "limited" period (as reference above by BDH) after your week where your points can be used for HRC reservations only and only with a period of 2 months out - and they cannot be used for Interval.

HGVC inventory becomes available 9 months out if the owner does not reserve their unit 12-9 months out (not sure what happens if the owner uses points before 9 months out).   HRC inventory becomes available 6 months out if the owner does not reserve their unit 12-6 months out - or if the owner uses any points his unit become available up to 12 months out.  HRC has waitlists  - HGVC does not.

So if you really like Key West (or another specific location) - you can try and find a week you like and use part of it or all of it. Only Sunset Harbor has lockoffs in Key West and because of it's location tends to be used by it owners - especially in peak seasons - and it generally will cost a good bit more to buy into.  Otherwise you can just buy where MFs are less and use the points.

Hopefully this helps.


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## alexadeparis (Dec 1, 2020)

bdh said:


> I'm not sure what the "D2200" is.  Here's the link to the TUG thread on the BH foreclosures: https://tugbbs.com/forums/threads/foreclosure-units-available-hyatt-beach-house.310677/  that lists the unit, week and price.  There should be a property layout in your check-in package - if not, here's a link to KAL's layout of the BH unit numbers  http://www.bywindkal.com/Hyatt/HBHphotos/HBH_RoomNumbers.pdf


I assume D2200 means Diamond Unit, 2200 points value


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## hcarman (Dec 1, 2020)

Some differences between owning a deeded week with Hyatt and being in the Portfolio Program - or for owners that are in both programs.  You can convert your deeded week into points each year and you can opt to split it into several reservations - however, you are held to certain day combinations.  You can't choose to stay just one day at a property and often not just Friday and Saturday combined.  You can choose to book a Tuesday through Thursday or a Saturday through Tuesday, etc.  Also, there is an initial fee for converting your week into points and then a fee each time you make a reservation with your points.  Then many resorts even have split week fees.  So Hyatt is a bit fee crazy in my opinion when you opt to do something other than use your full week.  With the Portfolio program there is now the option to book just one night with the points from your deeded week or any combination you want; however, the cleaning fees are very steep and seems like the points required can be high.  We own Hyatt and Marriott and with the Destination Club program there are no fees to convert you week into points and no fees to book a property or split a week at a property.  The Hyatt Portfolio program also does not have these fees.  However, depending on your level, you may have to pay hefty housekeeping fees if you use your points to book multiple stays.  So either way you can't quite escape the fees.  Another big thing about owning a deeded week and being in the Portfolio program is that it isn't as easy as they make it seem to convert your week into Portfolio Points - it has to be decided between 1 and 2 years out depending on the week of your deeded property (week 52 must be decided close to two years out) and you have to pay maintenance fees on the property a year in advance - so effectively you are paying double maintenance one year.  Also something Marriott does not make you do and something the Hyatt sales staff seem to conveniently forget to mention.  As for the Marriott purchase of Hyatt - we were told just last week that Marriott bought up Hyatt's extra inventory in 2018 and plans to allow their members to book Marriott, Hyatt, and Starwood through one booking engine.  However, Hyatt owners will not have the same ability to book Marriott and Starwood.  At least that is the word in the sales office, so take it like a grain of salt.


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## GMan82 (Dec 1, 2020)

What do you mean by converting my week into portfolio points? I thought the portfolio points program was different from the deeded week owners who then convert their week into points for use elsewhere in the club.

I’m still doing some research by reading old posts. I plan on calling the realtor tomorrow who is selling the foreclosed BH weeks in key west. I prefer flexibility, so points are points to me and I plan on mostly using them to try and get into other locales. However, a week in Key West isn’t necessarily a bad thing should I not be able to get into the other resorts or find anything in II.

Question: say I own week 6 but I can’t get vacation during that week to utilize it. Do I then convert my week to points and try to get say week 8? Or week 3? Or does the HRPP mean I can book my home resort any time and any same season week in that first 6 month preference period before the week converts to CUP automatically?

Where can I find a list of fees? I don’t think I have access to the HRC website documents. I’ll do a Google search momentarily, but just in case someone carries the list.


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## Kal (Dec 2, 2020)

GMan82 said:


> What do you mean by converting my week into portfolio points? I thought the portfolio points program was different from the deeded week owners who then convert their week into points for use elsewhere in the club.
> 
> I’m still doing some research by reading old posts. I plan on calling the realtor tomorrow who is selling the foreclosed BH weeks in key west. I prefer flexibility, so points are points to me and I plan on mostly using them to try and get into other locales. However, a week in Key West isn’t necessarily a bad thing should I not be able to get into the other resorts or find anything in II.
> 
> ...


With regard to Key West Beach House, I know many Beach House owners who have NEVER stayed at the Beach House.  They always use their HRC points to stay at other HRC resorts.  In short, they bought into the HRC system at an economical price and stay at more "spendy" resorts.  You would just have to think thru your preferred travel times and purchase a specific week that works best in the system.

IMHO, one of the HPP deal killers is you can't sell the HPP points on the resale market.  The only buyer is Hyatt and with a huge excess inventory of HPP points, they're certainly not going to pay $$$ to increase that inventory.

I've sat thru a number of the HPP presentations and ONLY suffer thru the clown show to get the $150 coupon.  I do admit I enjoy having fun in twisting their tails and watching their reaction.  Their opening is always "...do you like to vacation?"  My answer is NO, and that's where the fun begins.  Eventually, they rush thru their pitch and try to get this guy out of here.


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## GMan82 (Dec 2, 2020)

Kal said:


> With regard to Key West Beach House, I know many Beach House owners who have NEVER stayed at the Beach House.  They always use their HRC points to stay at other HRC resorts.  In short, they bought into the HRC system at an economical price and stay at more "spendy" resorts.  You would just have to think thru your preferred travel times and purchase a specific week that works best in the system.
> 
> IMHO, one of the HPP deal killers is you can't sell the HPP points on the resale market.  The only buyer is Hyatt and with a huge excess inventory of HPP points, they're certainly not going to pay $$$ to increase that inventory.
> 
> I've sat thru a number of the HPP presentations and ONLY suffer thru the clown show to get the $150 coupon.  I do admit I enjoy having fun in twisting their tails and watching their reaction.  Their opening is always "...do you like to vacation?"  My answer is NO, and that's where the fun begins.  Eventually, they rush thru their pitch and try to get this guy out of here.



I’m still debating if I want to take advantage of the foreclosure unit sale. I’m here with my sister and she doesn’t think I should pay a second MF since I’m not always using all my points in HGVC, which when I take a step back, does sound reasonable.

My vacay needs are always flexible in advance but then fixed once the year occurs because it is based entirely on my work shift schedule where I work a 7-day week and then am off a whole week + weekends on either side. In those off weeks is when I tend to travel and I have about 8 of them each year. This is ICU MD work and typical.

HGVC seems more flexible, but the locations of these resorts is different from the usual system. Plus access to II seems like it would be a huge plus.

I believe I’m fortunate to be able to have this decision to make. I’m a single guy who loves to travel, so the flexibility means more to me than utilizing a fixed week.


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## Kal (Dec 2, 2020)

GMan82 said:


> I’m still debating if I want to take advantage of the foreclosure unit sale. I’m here with my sister and she doesn’t think I should pay a second MF since I’m not always using all my points in HGVC, which when I take a step back, does sound reasonable.
> 
> My vacay needs are always flexible in advance but then fixed once the year occurs because it is based entirely on my work shift schedule where I work a 7-day week and then am off a whole week + weekends on either side. In those off weeks is when I tend to travel and I have about 8 of them each year. This is ICU MD work and typical.
> 
> ...


It sounds like you will rely on using the HRC points in selecting the travel locations and the period of travel.  With HRC, once you fix those travel parameters, get on the "Request List" well in advance of your travel.  If you find something else you like just confirm that reservation and delete the requested listed item.  BTW, you can add numerous request items.  I know some owners who may have 10-12 requests.  They just react when a particular request is confirmed.


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## GMan82 (Dec 2, 2020)

This sounds great! I left a message with that realtor. I went through the list of resorts and most of the resorts seem like amazing places to visit. I’m under 40, so definitely like to get around town or kick back and do nothing on a resort. Being from the east coast and a non-skier, I don’t see myself much in Hawaii, but California, Key West, other Florida locations, Puerto Rico, and Arizona seem like places I’d go. Interval >>> RCI seems like another benefit

Looking through multiple threads, it seems that SH, the colorado locales during ski season, siesta beach, and Maui are the hard to book resorts but the others seem more reasonable to exchange into.

I really appreciate all the help, everyone. I do love TUG. My only regret is not finding it prior to purchasing from the developer my HGVC membership. At least I enjoy using it and it’s introduced me to the idea that timeshare weeks can be a good deal.


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## GTLINZ (Dec 2, 2020)

GMan82 said:


> What do you mean by converting my week into portfolio points? I thought the portfolio points program was different from the deeded week owners who then convert their week into points for use elsewhere in the club.



If you have a deeded HRC week and as discussed before do you use it (or do not use your full unit for a week) you will get points. What is different is that online you will see HRC inventory (deeded weeks) and HPP inventory (Portfolio program) as different availability. Each search hit will be identified as to which program it comes from.  And it can be inventory that is not available for a full week because it is what is left after another reservation.

If you get a hit on HRC inventory, you are bound by the 2,3,4 and 7 day reservation lengths. Less than a week is called split weeks and you will usually incur a cleaning fee of currently $39 bucks per reservation - paid at the resort on checkout.  If you get a hit on HPP inventory you can reserve any part of it in one day increments (i.e. 1-7 days) and they usually incur a cleaning fee of $60 bucks per reservation (also paid at checkout).

Some poor folks have added multiple single day HHP reservations to an existing reservation and found out that they get nailed with the extra cleaning fee for each reservation. The cleaning fee is higher than the reservation fee (currently $41 for online). So one or 2 day reservations are often not worth it as you can spend over $100 a night in fees for a single night reservation.

I am an HRC owner and was able to get a reservation last October from HPP inventory for 6 nights - and just had to pay the single $60 cleaning fee on checkout and the $41 booking fee when the original reservation was made.

So as you can imagine Hyatt wants to invoke ROFR for buyback on prime HRC weeks and move that inventory into HPP.  This has slowed way down due to CV-19 and now is a good time to buy as they are not doing a lot of buybacks right now.

And BTW - we live in GA also and love the Coconut plantation resort. It is not on the beach but there is a shuttle to a private beach with beach chairs included. We often see dolphins on the ride out. That resort is beautiful and has a lazy river. But you do have to book the shuttle and can only hold one reservation at a time.


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## GMan82 (Dec 2, 2020)

GTLINZ said:


> If you have a deeded HRC week and as discussed before do you use it (or do not use your full unit for a week) you will get points. What is different is that online you will see HRC inventory (deeded weeks) and HPP inventory (Portfolio program) as different availability. Each search hit will be identified as to which program it comes from.  And it can be inventory that is not available for a full week because it is what is left after another reservation.
> 
> If you get a hit on HRC inventory, you are bound by the 2,3,4 and 7 day reservation lengths. Less than a week is called split weeks and you will usually incur a cleaning fee of currently $39 bucks per reservation - paid at the resort on checkout.  If you get a hit on HPP inventory you can reserve any part of it in one day increments (i.e. 1-7 days) and they usually incur a cleaning fee of $60 bucks per reservation (also paid at checkout).
> 
> ...


HPP sounds worse and worse every time I read about it and I’m glad I didn’t cave in. Yeah, the salesman did NOT mention any fees to me for the portfolio program. In fact he basically said there are no fees.

Thanks for your response. Any insight into the reservations system is appreciated. I’m just awaiting a call back from the realtor listed at Beach House. In the meanwhile, I’m trying to research interval International and see if it’s possible to exchange into less than full week reservations. I rarely use full weeks at a time, though have done so, hence the appeal that flexibility has.

If the $4k Diamond weeks are still available, it seems like a too good opportunity. My guess is that some years from now if I want to exit, it shouldn’t be too difficult to recoup that cost as HRC resales seem to hold value well judging by what I’m seeing in redweek and tug for similar diamond weeks.


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## GTLINZ (Dec 2, 2020)

GMan82 said:


> HPP sounds worse and worse every time I read about it and I’m glad I didn’t cave in. Yeah, the salesman did NOT mention any fees to me for the portfolio program. In fact he basically said there are no fees.



Not sure this has been mentioned but you basically cannot get anything for a HPP resale. It makes them very hard to get out of. As you mention, at least a deeded prime week tends to keep some value.

I paid resale for my HGVC unit in 2005 (plat) and even paying resale i got about 30% of it back when I sold it in 2019. These things are trending downward over time. 10 years ago Hyatt was very expensive to get into.  You may want to consider a plat or even gold unit if you plan to mostly use points. Gold is a far cheaper buy in. I would not go below gold. Unless of course you find a unit and week at Beach house that you love ...


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## GMan82 (Dec 2, 2020)

GTLINZ said:


> Not sure this has been mentioned but you basically cannot get anything for a HPP resale. It makes them very hard to get out of. As you mention, at least a deeded prime week tends to keep some value.
> 
> I paid resale for my HGVC unit in 2005 (plat) and even paying resale i got about 30% of it back when I sold it in 2019. These things are trending downward over time. 10 years ago Hyatt was very expensive to get into.  You may want to consider a plat or even gold unit if you plan to mostly use points. Gold is a far cheaper buy in. I would not go below gold. Unless of course you find a unit and week at Beach house that you love ...


I had asked the salesman about resale. Yep, I do that. He said HPP can’t be resold anyway, fwiw. 

Still at $4k if the units still exist, and hopefully I’ll find out when the realtor calls back, it’s still a good opportunity for 2200 points in diamond for a deeded week. Otherwise I’ll check out the other resale options in time.


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## GMan82 (Dec 3, 2020)

Well looks like the current foreclosed BH Diamond weeks are gone already. I’ve asked him about the other units to see if Diamond weeks exist there, particularly at SH, which with smaller 1BRs I’d be more likely to utilize.

Question to see if I understand this correctly. When I have a week, say 48, at the 12-month Mark, the HRPP opens. I can also deposit right away into CUP. At that point, I have to book anytime within that 12 month period right? I can’t use my points and make a reservation for week 49 at a different resort without it being a LCUP use of points, even if booked during CUP?

I’m also going through interval threads. Seems much nicer than RCI, especially if trading Hyatt. But it looks like all stays need to be 7 days.


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## alexadeparis (Dec 3, 2020)

GMan82 said:


> Well looks like the current foreclosed BH Diamond weeks are gone already. I’ve asked him about the other units to see if Diamond weeks exist there, particularly at SH, which with smaller 1BRs I’d be more likely to utilize.
> 
> Question to see if I understand this correctly. When I have a week, say 48, at the 12-month Mark, the HRPP opens. I can also deposit right away into CUP. At that point, I have to book anytime within that 12 month period right? I can’t use my points and make a reservation for week 49 at a different resort without it being a LCUP use of points, even if booked during CUP?
> 
> I’m also going through interval threads. Seems much nicer than RCI, especially if trading Hyatt. But it looks like all stays need to be 7 days.



you have to get used to using the points from a year ahead - for example the week 49 reservation should be made with the prior years points as soon as you can. For example the week 48 2021 use year points come available in week 48 2020 (in just a few weeks)


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## GMan82 (Dec 3, 2020)

alexadeparis said:


> you have to get used to using the points from a year ahead - for example the week 49 reservation should be made with the prior years points as soon as you can. For example the week 48 2021 use year points come available in week 48 2020 (in just a few weeks)


I see. I guess that does make sense, but I wanted to confirm.

I am going through a long thread right now titled “Hyatt Portfolio Points Program.” Lots of gold in there regarding what a mess the program is. At HGVC, the entire system is a points-based program, where we can reserve our deeded week and specific unit type at 12-9 months prior to the week. If we make a points reservation elsewhere that privilege is forfeit for home week reservation. Tbh, why doesn’t HRC just grandfather everyone into the HPP and give deeded owners the option of booking their week at some advance window before effectively switching to points? I like the way HGVC seems to work in that regard. In all honesty, that’s kind of what the legacy program sounds like, but then they went ahead and complicated things with 2 competing “clubs.”


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## Luvscoffee (Dec 5, 2020)

Hi!  My husband and I sat through this presentation in March in Key West and our experience was the same as yours in regard to the offer.  We did not own any timeshares at the time but have sat through a couple DVC presentations.  We went in with the mindset that we were not buying anything, however, our salesman did a great job of selling and we walked out an owner.

Thankfully, we quickly came to our senses and cancelled the purchase.  We’re chalking it up to a great learning experience! Fast forward a few months and after researching resales we were able to find a good resale price for a diamond week unit at BH ($4,500).  We chose BH because we love Key West, have stayed at BH a couple times and really like it there.  So, worst case scenario if we can’t book into another property, we get to stay at a place we love.

In regard to II, the jury is still out - when I’ve looked for exchanges, availability seems dicey.  I admittedly need to learn more about this system and since our youngest is graduating this year we’ll be able to travel when we want (January/February and in the Fall)and not according to a school calendar (yay!).  This should be a good advantage for exchanges if we go that route.  My husband is a nurse so we have to plan out most vacations a over a year in advance so he can request his time off.  He has some flexibility for off peak times given his seniority so we’re hopeful that we will be able to fit in at least one other last minute vacation a year.  Bottom line, buying resale into HRC was a good fit for our new lifestyle post school aged kids.


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## Kal (Dec 5, 2020)

GMan82 said:


> ...Question to see if I understand this correctly. When I have a week, say 48, at the 12-month Mark, the HRPP opens. I can also deposit right away into CUP. At that point, I have to book anytime within that 12 month period right? I can’t use my points and make a reservation for week 49 at a different resort without it being a LCUP use of points, even if booked during CUP?....


Just for clarification, when you receive next year's "new" points, just consider those points as CUP.  All options are available to use those points.  As an important feature you have the exclusive right to occupy your owned unit/week.  This is the HRPP period and lasts for 6 months.  If you use any of those points during that first 6 months, your exclusive HRPP option automatically ends.  You DO NOT need to take any action to "deposit HRPP points to CUP".  The only action during that 6-month timeframe, if you desire, is to confirm you will use your owned unit/week.


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## skimeup (Dec 5, 2020)

I bought into HRC Carmel, week 48 - 1880 points - three years ago and have learned quite a lot since then.  I live in Los Angeles and my brother and sil live in The Villages (FL). We try to do a trip together every year or two now that we are all retired.  

The first year I owned, they really loved the idea of heading to Key West - during prime time.  My Carmel time was worth 1880 points so I made reservations for some time using my points and for some time through the Hyatt Hotel for the two br at Beach House.  They wanted to spend 8 days, so I would not have had enough points anyhow for the whole thing.  Being retired, I have time to go online and monitor availability and about a month before we were due at BH, my new points were in and there began to be some 2 - 3 day stays.  I was able to reserve those and change the hotel reservations.  I finally ended up with all 8 days paid for with points.  It was composed of some four different reservations strung together, so I had to pay an additional $41 per reservation.  BUT, since they strung every res together and it was a full week + we did not pay a housekeeping fee.  We actually like being a ways out of town, as for whatever reason, in mid-January there was a pretty rowdy crowd in town.  And I think some small cruise ships land there. 


The following year, I wanted to visit my own unit but I would have had to reserve at least  four day midweek or three day weekend  in order to get into my own place  (1140 points)  (2nd floor br, ocen view), and I really wanted to have enough points left to stay in Aspen in the summer, for the music festival.  So decided to give that up because the three day weekend would have been about the same, since Saturday night points are higher in all HRC.  

First, Aspen.  Sunday - Saturday studio:  450 points.  Saturday night 260.  It is a gorgeous property, feet from the gondola but for summer, easy walking distance to much of town and across the street from the bus station for travel to festival sites etc.   I did enter waiting list desires.  Turned out I needed to request each day as a one day, additionally two day, three day, etc reservations starting on different days of the week.  What a pain!  HOWEVER,  every request came up and I managed to reserve 8 days,  This time, however, I paid about 5 reservation fees at $41 each.  Still ending up with eight days at the music festival for about $1000.  It did take a lot of putzing with the reservation system.  I bring this up also because the one and two day portfolio reservations started showing up pretty much right after I was six months out from my desired times.  (Of course, the bad news was the whole thing was canceled due to COVID.)

On a far less time consuming note, I do check the tug list for amazing listings that a couple of people religiously post.  I did land two weeks in Boston Marriott Pulse and one week in DC (Mayflower Autograph), both of which were amazing, through II for less than the cost of one year's MF.  In terms of points in II, it is a bit annoying that one must deposit no more than four months out from the deeded week and also annoying that the points are good for only two years.

I insert this lengthy post to note that with due diligence, the system can be maneuvered to your advantage - and for less money than HRPP.  And on another note, I had to speak with a gal from II about something and she told me she had never seen Marriott Boston or DC ever show up in any manual search she did for someone.  So there is a good advantage in trading power for the HRC association with MVC and II.  

Finally, I got two lovely weeks through the Resort Accommodation Certificates - 2BR Marriott and Worldmark   I am guessing that is due to fewer people traveling due to COVID.  

I just was given (free) a two year membership in RCI through my Royal Holiday membership.  I don't know RCI at all and will be checking those resort dump pages to see if there are any exciting resorts showing up there!


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## liongate88 (Dec 5, 2020)

I am also considering HRC.  I am just wondering how difficult it is to get Hyatt Maui resort, what months are likely you will get it even with request or it is “really” impossible to get it? Thanks


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## Sapper (Dec 5, 2020)

liongate88 said:


> I am also considering HRC.  I am just wondering how difficult it is to get Hyatt Maui resort, what months are likely you will get it even with request or it is “really” impossible to get it? Thanks



when it was brand new, just a few years ago, it was tough to get because there was not much inventory in the system. The developers did not dump unsold units into the system.  Prior to Covid, things were loosening up, inventory was coming into the system, and you could get a week during the slower times (a little late spring and mid-fall, when kids are in school)... busy times (summer and holidays, when kids are out of school) I did not see much inventory to trade into.  Then COVID hit, and there is lots of availability. My guess is once COVID is no longer a factor the availability will swing back to that late spring / mid-fall and not so much during the busy times.


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## liongate88 (Dec 6, 2020)

Thanks! Looks like there is still hope, not entirely impossible.


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## ArizonaHPP (Jan 3, 2021)

Hi all -
New here, but have been a TUG fan (and lurker) for years.  Recently, (late December 2020) I decided to purchase the new Hyatt HPP / HPC points program with 1,000 points at a “COVID” rate of $16,010, not including closing costs of $540. Incentives include 100k WOH points and 1 Week in a 2BR (Interval).

I like the flexibility of the points program and our usage will mostly be in Carmel and Sedona.  Should I be concerned with HPP inventory in these two locations?

Also, sales rep told me the Interval Resort Accommodations Certificate can be extended beyond the September 2021 expiration date (up to 2 years from HPP purchase date).  I was also told I can use the certificate for Hawaii.

What concerns should I have given the above?  Appreciate all feedback!

Thanks in advance. 



GMan82 said:


> GMan82 said:
> 
> 
> > Hi everyone,
> ...


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## echino (Jan 3, 2021)

HPP has zero resale value. You would be much better off purchasing a resale week.


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## alameda94501 (Jan 3, 2021)

ArizonaHPP said:


> Hi all -
> New here, but have been a TUG fan (and lurker) for years.  Recently, (late December 2020) I decided to purchase the new Hyatt HPP / HPC points program with 1,000 points at a “COVID” rate of $16,010, not including closing costs of $540. Incentives include 100k WOH points and 1 Week in a 2BR (Interval).
> 
> I like the flexibility of the points program and our usage will mostly be in Carmel and Sedona.  Should I be concerned with HPP inventory in these two locations?
> ...



As you likely know from lurking here, there's very little that benefits a developer purchase over a resale purchase. Best to rescind.

1,000 pts just doesn't go far. With legacy you could purchase resale weeks for 4,000-6,000 pts based on the dollar amount you bought from the developer, and with nearly the same inventory at Carmel and identical inventory at Sedona.


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## Kal (Jan 3, 2021)

Please rescind!  The portfolio program benefits only HYATT.  Extremely limited quality stays throughout the system.


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## socaltimeshare (Jan 3, 2021)

ArizonaHPP said:


> Interval Resort Accommodations Certificate can be extended beyond the September 2021 expiration date (up to 2 years from HPP purchase date). I was also told I can use the certificate for Hawaii



As a deeded week owner, I’ve been given for free resort accommodation certificates.  They just keep showing up in my account. The one currently in my account is valid through May 30, and technically can be used in Hawaii because in the month of January there is availability in Kauai (but not other islands or other months).  Also, my certificate is for up to 3 bedrooms, but all that is available in Kauai is 1 bedroom and studio timeshares.

YMMV but I don’t see this as a strong incentive.


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## Sapper (Jan 3, 2021)

ArizonaHPP said:


> Hi all -
> New here, but have been a TUG fan (and lurker) for years.  Recently, (late December 2020) I decided to purchase the new Hyatt HPP / HPC points program with 1,000 points at a “COVID” rate of $16,010, not including closing costs of $540. Incentives include 100k WOH points and 1 Week in a 2BR (Interval).
> 
> I like the flexibility of the points program and our usage will mostly be in Carmel and Sedona.  Should I be concerned with HPP inventory in these two locations?
> ...



First, WELCOME TO TUG!  

Second, pull the docs you signed right now and find out if you are still in the recision period. Even if you are out of the recision period, you might be able to rescind because of the holidays, find out.  Seriously, we will be here after you rescind to discuss all the different ways you can buy and use a deeded unit week more efficiently than the HPP.  

Really, rescind ASAP.


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## socaltimeshare (Jan 3, 2021)

ArizonaHPP said:


> I like the flexibility of the points program and our usage will mostly be in Carmel and Sedona. Should I be concerned with HPP inventory in these two locations?



Not considering HPP, I feel both of these properties have good internal trading availability in HRC. So get any re-sale deeded week in HRC then trade for the Sedona or Carmel week you want. You will save in initial purchase cost, you will save in annual maintenance fees (HPP is generally a higher cost per point), and re-sale will be better.

If you want the Hyatt 100K WOH points, just open up two WOH credit card accounts ( you and a significant other) since each account would have a 50k welcome bonus.


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## Pathways (Jan 3, 2021)

ArizonaHPP said:


> 1,000 points at a “COVID” rate of $16,010, not including closing costs of $540. Incentives include 100k WOH points and 1 Week in a 2BR (Interval).
> 
> I like the flexibility of the points program and our usage will mostly be in Carmel and Sedona. Should I be concerned with HPP inventory in these two locations?



Yes, I would be very concerned.  1k points will only get you 3-4 nights in a HRC reservation.  To maximize the points and get 5 nights it would need to be a PPP reservation, and there are not a lot of those.  You will have VERY little choice so be VERY flexible.  

Point cost is season dependent so there may be some outlier weeks where you can do better. 

Realize there are people who are buying WEEKS for $6-7k who get 2200 points.


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