# Best states to retire to - financially??



## judyjht (Sep 3, 2013)

OK - what do you all think?   What are the worst ones too?  Thoughts??


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## vacationhopeful (Sep 3, 2013)

You need to MOVE --- that much I can tell you.


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## Janette (Sep 3, 2013)

SC is good if you have family on East coast. We love the low country.


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## x3 skier (Sep 3, 2013)

First thing I did is decide city or country, mountains or ocean and then if they tax pensions. In the end all that mattered to my wife was where are the Grandkids so we stayed where we were and travel from there. 

Cheers


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## DaveNV (Sep 3, 2013)

My opinion is that it's any state with no state income tax, reasonable property taxes, affordable utility costs, that has reasonable weather and real estate prices, and that has a good airport nearby so you can fly away to your vacation destinations.  

I'm a West Coast guy, so for me, that's starting more and more to look like Nevada.  Reasonable driving distance in all directions to all of the Southwestern US, and it seems Las Vegas airport is serving just about every major city, in one form or another.

Dave


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## ScoopKona (Sep 3, 2013)

BMWguynw said:


> My opinion is that it's any state with no state income tax, reasonable property taxes, affordable utility costs, that has reasonable weather and real estate prices, and that has a good airport nearby so you can fly away to your vacation destinations.
> 
> I'm a West Coast guy, so for me, that's starting more and more to look like Nevada.  Reasonable driving distance in all directions to all of the Southwestern US, and it seems Las Vegas airport is serving just about every major city, in one form or another.



And I can't stand Las Vegas. It will be one of the happiest days of my life when I get out of this culturally-void, low-expectations hell hole. What's a little extra money if you can't stand where you live?


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## Passepartout (Sep 3, 2013)

Here's the top 25 list from CNN Money. http://money.cnn.com/gallery/retirement/2012/10/16/best-places-retire.moneymag/index.html Hint: It isn't Massachusetts. IMO, it's hard to beat Nevada, financially.

Jim


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## gnorth16 (Sep 3, 2013)

ScoopLV said:


> And I can't stand Las Vegas. It will be one of the happiest days of my life when I get out of this culturally-void, low-expectations hell hole. What's a little extra money if you can't stand where you live?



Agreed on liking where you live, but there are worse places to live than Las Vegas.... Wanna trade ????


I didn't know South Dakota didn't have state income tax... In fact, I drool at all of the state income taxes that were listed...


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## Joe33426 (Sep 3, 2013)

I'm partial to Florida!  No personal income tax, low property taxes, and if you live in a major metropolitan area, you have access to city stuff.  And the weather can't be beat for about 7 months.  Yes, the summers are brutal.  And stuff is dirt cheap...

I have a small place in FL that costs me very little to carry.  The place is paid off and I get to use it for about 4 months a year and for long weekends.  I can get from NYC to FL in less time than some of my colleagues that have places in upstate NY can get to their weekend places.  

I'll probably get beat up over saying FL, but all of FL isn't Orlando, there are some really sweet places.  If I didn't have my place, I would look in Palm Coast.  Nice area, not too red neck, and it's still on sale.  The unemployment rate is high, like 26%, so it's all on sale.  

My family lives in MA, so I can definitely say that's a TERRIBLE place to retire.  Wish I could have convinced my folks to move somewhere else.


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## ScoopKona (Sep 3, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> = IMO, it's hard to beat Nevada, financially.



But it's easy to beat it just about every other way. June through September, for instance. 

There are a few positives: Southern Nevada is natural-disaster free, has plenty of great shows and restaurants, and the airport is very convenient so that the resident can get the [censored] out of Las Vegas. And yes, taxes are low.

But the negatives far outweigh the positives as far as I'm concerned. There's a reason great places to live are so expensive -- they're worth it. People look at Las Vegas and say, "At least it's cheap." I disagree. At MOST it's cheap.


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## Fern Modena (Sep 3, 2013)

Well, if you can't stand where you live, then you should move.  But I gotta tell you, you definitely live in a different place than my area. I sure wouldn't call the hill I live on a hell hole.  And as for culturally-void, have you ever been to The Smith Center? Or even a live performance at Ham Hall or Judy Bailey Theater at UNLV, or even a church, for that matter?  Or one of the many ethnic festivals Las Vegas is known for?  _::: sigh :::_ I guess not. Different strokes for different folks.

I came from California.  For me, taxes are lower, since there are no state taxes. Vehicle license taxes are high, and gasoline is higher per gallon than many places, but the Vegas Valley is pretty compact, and people tend to stay on their own side of town, so you don't use much gas.

Entertainment is all around you, and if you don't need constant Cirque shows, it needn't be expensive. Good restaurants abound.  And then there are those things called "locals discounts."

But don't expect warm/hot all year. It gets cold (in the 40's) in the winter, with a mean wind. But the rest of the year is wonderful.

I wouldn't move somewhere just because of the grandkids. Or stay somewhere for the same reason.  Even if your children don''t move away or not far away, as the grandkids grow older, they have more things to do with their friends and sports and dates, etc. And when they become adults they marry, and often times move, even if their parents didn't.

One of my granddaughters is 28, and has moved thus: California, Michigan, California, California (but 80 miles away from previous place), Las Vegas, back to California, California (another spot, 80 miles away) and now to Kentucky. And who knows what is next. Her Dh is in the Army now, maybe a lifer. But you know what? We computer CHAT and Skype more than ever.

Fern



ScoopLV said:


> And I can't stand Las Vegas. It will be one of the happiest days of my life when I get out of this culturally-void, low-expectations hell hole. What's a little extra money if you can't stand where you live?


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## snickers104 (Sep 3, 2013)

I agree...if you don't like where you live move!  I live in Southwest Kansas--talk about devoid of cultural things to do....BUT I live in a very small (1200 people) community and I am 6 hours from Denver OR Kansas City and 4 hours from Oklahoma City.  The pace of living is slower than almost anywhere else I have been and I love it..probably not the best place to retire but that is what I am going to do...stay here and just enjoy the simple things in life.


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## ScoopKona (Sep 3, 2013)

Wish I could move. But family issues force us to remain here for the near future. The minute we no longer have family issues anchoring us here, we're gone.


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## judyjht (Sep 3, 2013)

I am a Boston gal my whole life (65 years) so it is East Coast for me.  I do love to be near the water - don't have to be on it but near it.  Both kids and 6 grand-kids are in Connecticut (coast).  We do have a house in Maine but it is too far for the kids to come for a weekend so it some point we will sell the MA house (next Spring) - move to Maine and then figure out something.  It would have to be some sort of over 55 place with town houses and garages.  I could not live in a large building and hear people walking all night - guess I am getting old and crabby.


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## SMHarman (Sep 3, 2013)

Joe33426 said:


> I'm partial to Florida!  No personal income tax, low property taxes, and if you live in a major metropolitan area, you have access to city stuff.  And the weather can't be beat for about 7 months.  Yes, the summers are brutal.  And stuff is dirt cheap...
> 
> I have a small place in FL that costs me very little to carry.  The place is paid off and I get to use it for about 4 months a year and for long weekends.  I can get from NYC to FL in less time than some of my colleagues that have places in upstate NY can get to their weekend places.


That is likely true but when you bake in the costs of 3-4 air fairs for that weekend the price / time dial moves dramatically.


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## ScoopKona (Sep 3, 2013)

Joe33426 said:


> I'm partial to Florida!  No personal income tax, low property taxes, and if you live in a major metropolitan area, you have access to city stuff.  And the weather can't be beat for about 7 months.  Yes, the summers are brutal.  And stuff is dirt cheap...



Have you checked out the price of Windstorm Insurance lately? In all the coastal areas of Florida (which are the only places I would consider in that state), insurance premiums MORE than make up for low taxes. The insurance on our last place was $35K per year, and that was eight years ago. I can only imagine what it's like now.

I wouldn't zero-in exclusively on taxes. There are many, many financial factors. And then there's the "happiness and well-being" factor, which I don't think can be valued with mere money. When we leave Nevada, we'll probably end up somewhere in Hawaii. It'll be considerably more expensive. But I think it's worth the cost.


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## VacationForever (Sep 3, 2013)

Anyone considered New Zealand?  I don't like Florida - too hot and humid.  I don't like CA - high taxes plus other stuff that I won't get into.  I don't like Nevada, too hot and dry.  A number of friends moved to New Zealand and are very happy with their choice.  I love New Zealand when I did the touristy thing.  Free medical, the only thing is to figure out how to get permanent residency.


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## ScoopKona (Sep 3, 2013)

sptung said:


> Anyone considered New Zealand?  I don't like Florida - too hot and humid.  I don't like CA - high taxes plus other stuff that I won't get into.  I don't like Nevada, too hot and dry.  A number of friends moved to New Zealand and are very happy with their choice.  I love New Zealand when I did the touristy thing.  Free medical, the only thing is to figure out how to get permanent residency.



Show up with money. New Zealand, like most 1st-world countries, will let people with a clean background simply buy their way in -- by investing in a business, for instance. 

http://www.immigration.govt.nz/migrant/stream/invest/investment/default.htm


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## Carol C (Sep 3, 2013)

ScoopLV said:


> But it's easy to beat it just about every other way. June through September, for instance.
> 
> There are a few positives: Southern Nevada is natural-disaster free,



I thought it was Vegas I was seeing on the Weather Channel with flash floods that were destroying houses. Just saw some such video this AM. I'd certainly call that a natural disaster.


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## PStreet1 (Sep 3, 2013)

We looked at pretty much every state south of the Mason-Dixon line when looking for a retirement spot.  We had spent numerous weeks in Florida before that, and in "search mode" we spent more weeks there.  For us, it was a no-go:  bugs, humidity, and (compared to what we were used to) high property taxes.  We finally settled on Tennessee or Arizona or Nevada, and yes, Tennessee, had decidedly different advantages than we saw in Arizona/Nevada.  (We also knew we'd be spending at least 6 mts. of each year in Mexico.)

I think the search for the perfect retirement area is a highly individualistic one.  We have friends who have sold everything in the U.S., and this week left for their new lives in Panama.  It's just really difficult to generalize "best."


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## ScoopKona (Sep 3, 2013)

Carol C said:


> I thought it was Vegas I was seeing on the Weather Channel with flash floods that were destroying houses. Just saw some such video this AM. I'd certainly call that a natural disaster.



They've installed drainage channels, so it is nothing like it used to be. I'm sure Fern can chime in with the difference between then and now. I live up the side of a mountain, so if flood waters reach me, most of the strip is underwater.

But it is NOTHING like Southern California, which always seems to be rioting, on fire, breaking apart or sliding down a hill. And I'm sure anyone in the Gulf States would trade their natural disasters for ours.


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## ronparise (Sep 3, 2013)

Florida in the winter, make it your home and you get a 50k exemption on property taxes (ie the top 50k is not taxed) also no state income tax then timeshares  in the summer to beat the heat..


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## ScoopKona (Sep 3, 2013)

ronparise said:


> Florida in the winter, make it your home and you get a 50k exemption on property taxes (ie the top 50k is not taxed) also no state income tax then timeshares  in the summer to beat the heat..



You're in Ft. Myers. What are Citizen's windstorm premiums up to these days?


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## Joe33426 (Sep 3, 2013)

ScoopLV said:


> Have you checked out the price of Windstorm Insurance lately? In all the coastal areas of Florida (which are the only places I would consider in that state), insurance premiums MORE than make up for low taxes. *The insurance on our last place was $35K per year, and that was eight years ago.* I can only imagine what it's like now.



You must have lived in a really nice place if your windstorm was $35K.  Even if your premium was 10% of value of your home, you lived in a $3.5 million home? With a premium more like 3-5% of assessed value, you lived in a $7million home? You should have been self insuring if you can afford that type of place. 

Last year, what I paid in New York State income tax (not including NYC tax) was 5 times what I paid to Citizens insurance for windstorm.


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## vacationhopeful (Sep 3, 2013)

Threads like this have their own life -- but the informational value is priceless, educational and entertaining ....

Sure am glad I don't need a WIND STORM insurance coverage, glad I NEVER considered living in Vegas, know to NOT retire in MA or NY and have 3.5 acres of ground with fruit trees & vegetable garden and a 10KWH PV solar system (and today have a electric company CREDIT of $360.11).

 

TUGGERS are such a diverse bunch ... with some of the best educated (or uneducated) opinions.


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## Passepartout (Sep 3, 2013)

Here is Kiplinger's list of the best places to retire as to tax-friendliness: http://www.kiplinger.com/slideshow/retirement/T006-S001-10-most-tax-friendly-states-for-retirees/ It isn't the only reason to pick one of these, there is healthcare, climate, access to travel gateways, proximity to family, and general quality of life issues. But 'financially' was the criterion the OP asked for, and taxes is a big part of that.

Jim


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## mjm1 (Sep 3, 2013)

We are planning to retire to Las Vegas from Northern CA.  It will be hard to leave this area, but the cost of living is just too high. Like someone else posted, we like the idea that LV is within driving distance of San Diego and Scottsdale, not to mention other great spots in SoCal and Arizona.  And we can even come back to the Bay Area for visits.

We are still several years away, so we will see what happens.


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## persia (Sep 3, 2013)

My personal retirement options:

1) Southern NSW, possibly Kiama, we have relatives in Wollongong and Sydney.  Still a four season area, but winter isn't terrible.

2) Sunshine Coast, Queensland.  Sub tropics, closer to the relatives in Lennox Head, NSW (but a drive through Brisbane).

3) Whangarei, Northland on the other side of the Tasman.  Warm, nice scenery, close to Aukland, we have friends here and have worked on getting the relatives in Wollongong to move here, but wages are so much lower than Australia.  Also Kiwi land moves, and not in a good way.

That's our list.  Moving to Boston, where we have no attachment to anything, makes it easy to go back down under.  Just a retirement party, thanks for all the fish and Bob's your uncle, we're out of here.

I also consider friendliness a factor, especially being in cold New England....


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## camachinist (Sep 3, 2013)

I'm taking a hard look at Oregon, specifically the coast. I was there for a week, returning yesterday, scouting properties and local business opportunities, since I'll likely never 'retire' completely. Compared to California, essential fees are low, and there is no general sales/use tax. I'll likely never pay any state income tax, so that's moot, and real estate taxes are a lot lower than where I currently live, simply because similar properties assess lower. Where I plan on living, there are currently no smog inspections and that costs me a ton on my vehicles since they're vintage, but not exempt, here in Cali, both in inspection and repair parts costs to 'make them pass'.

The most obvious financial savings came about from the process of traveling. I stayed in nice local motels for far less than similar in California and with lower taxes, ate well for very little money at local joints, paid less for gas and enjoyed someone else putting it in and washing my windshield to boot. You can tell the tourists (me) in Oregon because they get out of their cars to 'pump gas'. Locals never leave the driver's seat


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## Fern Modena (Sep 3, 2013)

Let's start with a flood quiz--How much water (depth) does it take to float a car away (when you are driving it)?  Answer at the end...

Carol, Yes you did see flash flooding.  Remember the fire up on Mt. Charleston earlier this year?  Well, a good portion of the recent monsoons were focused on that area, and there was nothing to hold the rain back.  The flood control and water detention areas are not fully done there yet, so the water ran down the mountain and right through a neighborhood.  The street there (Grand Teton) is destroyed and will have to be rebuilt. A half dozen houses up on the mountain were flooded, and at various times the main roads up there were closed.

As Scoop said, I do remember when flooding was much worse.  Many people remember where the old Summer Bay/Leisure Suites/Ramada Suites used to be. That area now has huge storm drains, but it used to flood terribly. There were drains all the way from the west side to Caesars, and then it came above ground, through Imperial Palace's garage (now the Quad) and out to the timeshare. That has been fixed, as have many other areas.  

All rain and water runoff travels from the west side of town east and eventually to Lake Mead. For the past twelve years or so they have been really working on flood control channels and detention basins.  They also have a strong PR program to warn people about the dangers of driving through flooded areas or playing in the storm channels, but you can't fix stupid.  The fire department is always called during heavy rains to rescue people who "thought the water wasn't that deep" and that they could get thru.

The answer is: THREE INCHES.  How many of you knew that?  Remember, Turn around, don't drown.

Fern



Carol C said:


> I thought it was Vegas I was seeing on the Weather Channel with flash floods that were destroying houses. Just saw some such video this AM. I'd certainly call that a natural disaster.


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## Elan (Sep 3, 2013)

I'm still quite a few years away from retirement, but I'd consider southern Oregon.  I really don't care about taxes nearly as much as I care about climate.  Somewhere around Klamath Falls or Medford or Ashland might work.


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## easyrider (Sep 3, 2013)

There have been quite a few people moving to Idaho from my area. I visit some of these friends or their parents and they seem to really like Idaho. Im not sure why but the low crime rates, fewer regulations and scenic beauty are reasons enough for me.

I know this about what state would you move to but Im considering Panama and Coasta Rica. I have been reading about these areas for about two years now and know a few couples that are now living in Panama full time. English is spoken in both countries and you can use USD in Panama and most of Coasta Rica. Health care is great in both of these countries.  
http://internationalliving.com/


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## Passepartout (Sep 3, 2013)

I have been trying to interest DW in SW Oregon. Ashland, Grants Pass area. No sales tax, but they make it up with high property taxes. Makes sense to me with a grown kid and family in Seattleland and another in the CA Bay area, it would be about midway between and not close enough to be asked to babysit. She looks at me like I'm nutz! She likes it here in the high desert of S.Central ID. It's not bad here, fairly low crime, mountains fairly close. College town. Arts. Symphony. Conservative utopia (ALL Republicans from dog catcher to US Senators). Affordable taxes (see last sentence). Bring your own money- low wages (see 2 sentences back). Only 4 commercial flights a day out, but you only have to be at the airport 15 minutes before departure and you can park free as long as you want. Speaking of which, the town has no parking meters either. I think that in the end, we're staying in Idaho.

Jim


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## Luanne (Sep 3, 2013)

mjm1 said:


> We are planning to retire to Las Vegas from Northern CA.  It will be hard to leave this area, but the cost of living is just too high. Like someone else posted, we like the idea that LV is within driving distance of San Diego and Scottsdale, not to mention other great spots in SoCal and Arizona.  And we can even come back to the Bay Area for visits.
> 
> We are still several years away, so we will see what happens.



We moved last year from the SF Bay Area.  Both dds are pretty much out of the house and we couldn't afford to downsize where we were.  Also it's just gotten too crowded for us.  We chose Santa Fe, NM.  I'm sure there are places that may cost less to live in, and we certainly have issues with lack of water, but so far we love it.  We bought a smaller house than what we had in CA.  There are many things that cost less than they did in CA, and some that surprisingly (like car insurance) that are more.  We picked Santa Fe because of all it offers, especially to its older residents.  So much to do here.


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## VacationForever (Sep 3, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> She likes it here in the high desert of S.Central ID. It's not bad here, fairly low crime, mountains fairly close. College town. Arts. Symphony. Conservative utopia (ALL Republicans from dog catcher to US Senators). Affordable taxes (see last sentence). Bring your own money- low wages (see 2 sentences back). Only 4 commercial flights a day out, but you only have to be at the airport 15 minutes before departure and you can park free as long as you want. Speaking of which, the town has no parking meters either. I think that in the end, we're staying in Idaho.
> 
> Jim



Which city in S Central ID?  Sounds like my kind of place that I want to retire to.


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## Passepartout (Sep 3, 2013)

sptung said:


> Which city in S Central ID?  Sounds like my kind of place that I want to retire to.



We live in Twin Falls. 120 mi. east of Boise.


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## DonnaD (Sep 4, 2013)

*Retiring near our children and grandkids is key for us*

We have 3 married children and our grandkids all within 15 minutes of us. I get to help with children and be a strong influence of loving support. We sold our big house and moved into our ranch style duplex which we remodeled to meet our needs as senior citizens. We are 3 minutes to grocery, restaurants, bank, Lowes etc. We travel to Mexico beaches for winter, but home is where our family is, where cost of living is reasonable, right here in Ohio. It is also a good place to raise a family. We arevery happy with our decision.:whoopie:


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## MuranoJo (Sep 4, 2013)

S. Idaho (Boise area) is probably where we'll stay.  DH is one of the rare natives and just firmly rooted here.  And there really is a lot to like:  Close-by mountains, rivers, and lakes for outdoor enthusiasts. Diverse music venues with traveling artists and the local symphony, outdoor theatre, and wineries.
Four seasons with fairly mild winters, but mid-late summers can get hot.  As Jim mentioned, it's definitely a red state, which is somewhat interesting after all the influx of people from the West coast over the years.

Would prefer better flight connections, and ya never know when Yellowstone will blow.


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## PStreet1 (Sep 4, 2013)

When Yellowstone blows, we'll all go--it'll just be faster for you.


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## MuranoJo (Sep 4, 2013)

PStreet1 said:


> When Yellowstone blows, we'll all go--it'll just be faster for you.



Yeah, and that's why I wish the flight connections were better, for a quicker getaway.    But maybe it's better to just get it over with.

BTW, I've always thought SW OR would be nice (love the coast) or even MX.


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## easyrider (Sep 4, 2013)

We almost bought some property near twin falls heading the direction of shoshone falls. My brother in laws parents bought a bunch of lots and built some houses. Nice area. I like the Cour de lane area.


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## kwindham (Sep 4, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> I have been trying to interest DW in SW Oregon. Ashland, Grants Pass area. No sales tax, but they make it up with high property taxes. Makes sense to me with a grown kid and family in Seattleland and another in the CA Bay area, *it would be about midway between and not close enough to be asked to babysit.* She looks at me like I'm nutz! She likes it here in the high desert of S.Central ID. It's not bad here, fairly low crime, mountains fairly close. College town. Arts. Symphony. Conservative utopia (ALL Republicans from dog catcher to US Senators). Affordable taxes (see last sentence). Bring your own money- low wages (see 2 sentences back). Only 4 commercial flights a day out, but you only have to be at the airport 15 minutes before departure and you can park free as long as you want. Speaking of which, the town has no parking meters either. I think that in the end, we're staying in Idaho.
> 
> Jim



lmbo!!  :hysterical::hysterical::rofl::rofl:

Sorry, that just struck me as extremely amusing!  I need to find somewhere where my oldest brother wont ask me to babysit!  LOVE my nieces and nephews, but I am NOT a babysitter!


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## kwindham (Sep 4, 2013)

Dh and I are a loooong way from retirement but its gonna have to be somewhere warm for me.  I Hate the cold!


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## Icc5 (Sep 4, 2013)

*California for me*

Lived here all my life and haven't ever found anywhere I'd rather live.  Yes, everything is high cost.  We have traveled to aprox. 40 other states and always come back to the best weather.  Yes, it is rough here.  Right now we have my son, daughter, son n law and grandaughter living here until they can afford places on there own.  Daughter and son n law and grandaughter moved in recently from Georgia.  Their jobs paid so low that they couldn't even afford to live there.  They all plan on staying in California.
We are probably lucky by living here all our lives that we could afford our house by moving up every 20 years or so till now that we plan to stay in this house forever (4 bedroom, 3 bath) and are just now finishing an enclosed patio of 750 sq. ft.  
Son is 23 and was able to start his own business plus work at Starbux for the past 7 years (health benefits).  He plans on moving out shortly with friends.
Grandaughter gets to go to school across the street where Mom, Uncle, and Grandmother went to school in one of best schools in the country.  We have people begging to get into our school district (Cupertino).
Bart


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## presley (Sep 4, 2013)

I feel the same as the PP.  I have never been anywhere out of California (besides Hawaii) that I have wanted to stay.  The costs are crazy high and we are small business owners.  I don't ever want to leave, but if we have to, we will retire on the Nevada border up north.  

I've been hoarding timeshares so that in the event that we do have to relocate, I can come back regularly.  

I was looking at the mean housing prices in the link on the first page of this thread and wondering if they are real.  Can you really buy a normal house in a nice neighborhood for $150K anywhere?  I can't imagine....


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## DaveNV (Sep 4, 2013)

kwindham said:


> lmbo!!  :hysterical::hysterical::rofl::rofl:
> 
> Sorry, that just struck me as extremely amusing!  I need to find somewhere where my oldest brother wont ask me to babysit!  LOVE my nieces and nephews, but I am NOT a babysitter!




I totally agree.  But you need to be careful what you wish for:

My family is mainly in Washington State and the Central California (Sacramento) area.  When my Dad retired from the military, he and my stepmother moved to Bend, Oregon. They figured it was roughly halfway between the two major groups of family members.  Dad said he was tired of being the one doing all the visiting to other people's homes, and it was high time they all made the trip to visit him instead.  They lived there the rest of their lives, (more than 30 years), and both are now buried in a cemetery just outside of Bend.

The entire time they lived there, all they did was complain that nobody visited them enough.  Every time we'd talk on the phone, I'd get harangued about when was I coming to visit them, and why was I going on vacation somewhere else, and NOT coming to Bend to see them?  

My repeated attempts to explain that Bend, Oregon is well off the beaten track, nowhere near an Interstate highway or major airport, and that it takes hours to drive there, all fell on deaf ears.  He wasn't going to listen to it, and then he'd launch into how it was everyone else's fault if they "didn't care enough to make the trip" to see them.  I gave up trying to make him understand that just because he was retired, the rest of us weren't.  Finally, we stopped arguing about it.  Trips to visit them became an ordeal, because it meant we HAD to go, or feelings would be hurt.  There was never, ever a chance to "just drop by" because they were in such an isolated area.  Getting there took a concerted effort.

It's a moot point now, because they're both deceased.  But I wonder how much better their relationship with my kids and grandkids would have been if they'd lived in an area where they could have been more a part of their lives.  

Dave


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## Passepartout (Sep 4, 2013)

presley said:


> Can you really buy a normal house in a nice neighborhood for $150K anywhere?  I can't imagine....



Here are the local listings for houses in our area with max price of $150K. http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-search/Twin-Falls_ID/price-na-150000 There are 369 of them. 

Back in 2008 before the economy where you live went south (ours really just dipped, and didn't tank), people flew here, were met by realtors. They toured available homes, saw that with the difference in house values, they could retire years earlier than they thought possible. They made offers and were on the next plane out of town. That isn't happening now to a large extent, but there are still great housing values here, and as long as one is not a 'wage slave', dependent on the comparatively low wage jobs here, this is a good place to consider.

Jim


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## ricoba (Sep 4, 2013)

*Vegas, Baby!*

Years ago, when we lived in Vancouver, BC, my wife wanted to move to California, and I said heck no, who'd want to live in that mess!!!  Well fast forward 20 years or so and you'd see it's us who have lived in this mess for over 15 years!

It really is hard to beat Southern California's weather, and places to go, places to eat and things to do.  

But, the traffic is terrible, the cost of living is sky high and the state is perpetually on the brink financially.  

Now, if I was independently wealthy or hit a big lotto, I'd probably find some wonderfully semi-isolated but not too isolated area in SoCal and live out my days.  But that's unlikely, so that is one of the reasons we sold our timeshare and bought a home in Las Vegas.  

Is Las Vegas perfect?  No, it's not.  But is it reasonably priced, with great amenities such as entertainment and great places for dining with easy access to the rest of the world?  Yup, it sure is.  

Compared to Los Angeles, the weather in Vegas, sucks.  But, the traffic is far more manageable, the cost of living is far more reasonable and the size of the city and metro area isn't so overwhelming big. 

So, more than likely we will retire to our Vegas home within the next decade. We really do like our home there and feel blessed that we were able to purchase it at a great price.  The neighborhood (East Flamingo @ Pecos), is very convenient to all the amenities and the attractions of Vegas, yet far enough removed from the hustle and bustle of the Strip or Downtown, that you'd hardly imagined you were in "Sin City".

Weather wise, yeah, it's HOT in the summer!  But that's what air conditioning is for and it makes swimming in the summer a great leisure time activity.  Then the winter is cold, not bone chilling cold with a foot of snow, but colder than Los Angeles.  But again, there isn't any snow or rain to deal with so again, it's very manageable.  Fall & Spring though, are PERFECT!  Dry, sunny, warm in the daytime and cooler at night.

Two things that Las Vegas is not known for though sadly is education and health care.  Since we'd be retiree's we aren't as concerned about education as health care, but the Clark County School District has a lot of room for improvement.  This is always considered an attributing factor when people ask why other businesses besides gaming don't locate in Vegas.  Professionals for the most part don't want to move to a city where their children aren't given a great educational opportunities.  

As well the University of Nevada Las Vegas, isn't the most prestigious school in the nation, except for its hospitality program. But there isn't a medical school, which would be a great advantage for Las Vegas and Southern Nevada.  So, the medical scene in Vegas is just OK, but people with means go to Los Angeles for world class medical treatment. 

But, no place is perfect, so I guess it's up to the person as to what is perfect for you.  For us currently, it looks like Vegas may be as near to perfect as we will find for the future.


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## camachinist (Sep 4, 2013)

While I do think the Cali coast would be a wonderful place to retire to, and I do have friends with beach houses there, it's simply far beyond my means. A modest home there is nearly .75MM and getting anywhere close to the beach or with a commanding view is over 1MM. Just not financially feasible. 

However, for substantially less money than my current residence is worth, I can get a view like this and a house like this along the central Oregon coast. It was one of numerous houses I surveyed last week. Also relevant to financial opportunities, I noted during this trip a huge influx of avid fisherman for the salmon season and servicing that industry, part of what my business does, presents some new and challenging financial opportunities, not to mention fishing can be plain old fun and it's been ages since we've had good fishing on the Cali coast.


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## ScoopKona (Sep 4, 2013)

ricoba said:


> Two things that Las Vegas is not known for though sadly is education and health care.



I agree with you about education. And I take a lot of flak for it elsewhere online. But I cannot agree about health care.

The reason why so many people in Las Vegas hate the health care system is that they have no insurance or substandard insurance. And those with simply "Medicare" will find the waiting times very long, and the offices very crowded.

With better insurance plans, Las Vegas health care is actually quite good. My mother-in-law couldn't walk when we moved here to take care of her. After a battery of surgeries, all performed here in town, she can. 

Now I realize that medical care is "good" when your loved ones have a successful outcome and "bad" when they don't. But I've seen enough of Las Vegas medicine to know that it's certainly better than my home state of Florida.

If medical care is what's holding you back, then I wouldn't worry so much about it. But you'll still be moving into an area with some of the worst schools in the country. The drain on society from that is immeasurable. And it's one of the many reasons I'm so keen to leave this city.


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## ricoba (Sep 4, 2013)

ScoopLV said:


> I agree with you about education. And I take a lot of flak for it elsewhere online. But I cannot agree about health care.
> 
> The reason why so many people in Las Vegas hate the health care system is that they have no insurance or substandard insurance. And those with simply "Medicare" will find the waiting times very long, and the offices very crowded.



My assumptions regarding health care are only subjective, since I have never had to use a health care provider (other than my dentist) in Las Vegas.  All I know is what I read in the papers and online and from talking to locals who have used health cares services in Vegas. 

While I am sure there are great doctors here, I still do know people who have gone from Vegas to LA for health care, especially specialty or cutting edge care.

I also know that while there are great nurses in Vegas, NV, doesn't provide the same level of laws regarding staff/patient ratio's that CA does.  Again, I know there are great nurses in Vegas, but if they are over worked due to higher patient ratio's, then there may be (*again I say may be*) potential problems in direct patient care.

Also, from what I understand, without a medical school @ UNLV, we don't have access to some of the newest and latest research and services available.  Again, that's not to disparage UNLV or doctors here, it's just obvious to me that UNLV needs a fully functioning medical school to be a world class institution.  Southern Nevada, where the majority of residents live are short changed by only having the medical school @ UNR.

These are just my observations at this point.  I may be incorrect.  Also, I wouldn't let this issue deter us from settling in Vegas.  It is still our plan in spite of any discrepancies in the issues of education and health care to retire in Vegas.  For us these would not be the most determinant factor.


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## ScoopKona (Sep 4, 2013)

UNR gets the medical school and UNLV does not for political reasons. Nevada as a political entity simply wouldn't exist without Las Vegas. The rest of the state siphons tax dollars away from Clark County and gives back.... nothing. 

Nevada plays out just like the federal system -- the rural areas leverage their representation to take tax dollars out of the system, and then lecture the urban areas which actually pay the bulk of the taxes about fiscal responsibility.

Yes, it would be better if UNLV had a medical school. But UNLV isn't a powerhouse of a university in the first place. Other than Hotel Management and Gaming, of course. I'm just thankful that so many good physicians and nurses have moved to Las Vegas. While we don't have "an embarrassment of riches" in the medical department, it's not nearly as bad as the news makes it out to be.


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## Passepartout (Sep 4, 2013)

One thing I noticed back when I lived in Las Vegas. Many of the doctors seemed to be DO's as opposed to MD's. I really am not sure about the difference, but somehow always thought of an MD as being better qualified. Who knows?


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## ScoopKona (Sep 4, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> One thing I noticed back when I lived in Las Vegas. Many of the doctors seemed to be DO's as opposed to MD's. I really am not sure about the difference, but somehow always thought of an MD as being better qualified. Who knows?



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_MD_and_DO_in_the_United_States

I prefer DOs. They tend to look at the big picture.


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## ricoba (Sep 4, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> One thing I noticed back when I lived in Las Vegas. Many of the doctors seemed to be DO's as opposed to MD's. I really am not sure about the difference, but somehow always thought of an MD as being better qualified. Who knows?



Your statement got me thinking and I was wrong.  There is medical school in Las Vegas (actually, Henderson) and it is Touro University.  Touro is a school of Osteopathic medicine, so they grant a DO degree to the grads.  

From what I read on Wikipedia, it is a branch of Touro College and New York Medical College in New York and is a private non-profit school that has roots in Judaism.  It was established in Vegas area in 2004, so not sure how many DO's are currently in practice in Vegas area who graduated from Touro.

So, there is a medical school, but it is still not a state sponsored research university.

Just to add, one of my doctors (the shrink) is a DO and my family practitioner is a MD.


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## ScoopKona (Sep 4, 2013)

ricoba said:


> Your statement got me thinking and I was wrong.  There is medical school in Las Vegas (actually, Henderson) and it is Touro University.  Touro is a school of Osteopathic medicine, so they grant a DO degree to the grads.
> 
> From what I read on Wikipedia, it is a branch of Touro College and New York Medical College in New York and is a private non-profit school that has roots in Judaism.  It was established in Vegas area in 2004, so not sure how many DO's are currently in practice in Vegas area who graduated from Touro.
> 
> So, there is a medical school, but it is still not a state sponsored research university.



My wife and I, and my in-laws see doctors who graduated from very-well regarded schools. (Although I do not put as much stock in the medical school as I do in where they did their residency and what they've done AFTER school.) Most of the physicians we see graduated from Stanford and similar.

I would certainly see a doctor who graduated from Touro. Why not? I don't really see how a medical school can have "roots in Judaism." Their founder certainly does. But it's a medical school. Not a center for Talmudic studies.


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## Fern Modena (Sep 4, 2013)

*University for Doctors*

Southern Nevada *does* have a University for doctors, Touro University. They graduate Doctors of Osteopathy (DO) as well as Physician's Assistants. They have a campus in Henderson, NV, and run well regarded clinics there as well as providing clinics in the local women's shelter.

Besides Doctors, starting next January, a law in Nevada will privide that Advanced Practice Nurses (ie, Nurse Practitioners) will be able to open practices without supervision of doctors. They will be able to provide many/most services that families need.

Fern


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## klpca (Sep 4, 2013)

BMWguynw said:


> But I wonder how much better their relationship with my kids and grandkids would have been if they'd lived in an area where they could have been more a part of their lives.
> 
> Dave



The number one reason why we will stay in California. Family.


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## ricoba (Sep 4, 2013)

ScoopLV said:


> I would certainly see a doctor who graduated from Touro. Why not? I don't really see how a medical school can have "roots in Judaism." Their founder certainly does. But it's a medical school. Not a center for Talmudic studies.



I only reported what Wikipedia pointed out.  Like you, I would see their grads and not feel any regret, as long as they are good doctors, religious or not.

But, I'd also assume that like any school with a religious heritage or affiliation they would have a certain emphasis on community service that non-religious schools may not have.  I actually am very supportive of religious oriented or affiliated schools, whether they be Jewish, Catholic, Protestant etc  I think that their unique perspective of doing the greater good, benefits all of us in society.

The comment about Judaism and Touro, was just that, a comment.  It was not meant to portray any moral bias one way or the other.


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## vacationhopeful (Sep 4, 2013)

I think people's character is established through their entire life - church schools before college, community orientated colleges, the service clubs (Lions is one club I can think of), special needs non-profits, scouting organizations, Walks for "whatever" nonprofit, etc. It shows you that a disability or difference is NOT a reason to SHUN or SLAM or BELITTLE those who are different.


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## geekette (Sep 4, 2013)

I'm not keen on moving to be near anyone; my family is spread out which gives us more places to visit.  And We Do.

My retirement location will be about my preferences, and SO, if I have one at that time.  Until then, I'm 'the near kid' for mom (~3 hr drive).

I am partial to the Carolinas and TN (Knoxville is growing on me).  I used to really like Asheville, but that's before it got popular and expensive.

My boyfriend likes SW, specifically NM or AZ.  Both are fine with me, but I like having seasons.  I dig the cold more than I dig the heat (Florida has no chance with me) and have no problem with staying north until The Time Comes.  I am one of those freaks that enjoys a snowstorm.  It's beautiful and coats everything in a lovely white blanket that quiets everything.  

Too many years between now and then to really determine, but for me, no state income taxes is A Consideration but not The Consideration - I want all my leisure and cultural activities nearby, reasonable cost of living, close enough to major airport.  If there happen to be mountains or ocean nearby, all the better.  

I'm not sure how far I (we?) will downsize, so property taxes are an issue.  On the We side, he has a pension, I will not, so having his base income tax free is handy.  We won't be giving up vehicles or other motorized toys, so taxes and registrations for those are a consideration, as is home insurance.  It's not possible for me to know yet what my income will be but I am attempting to set up various revenue streams that I can start and stop at will in order to have some amount of control over my income, and thus, taxation.  

There is so much subject to change that unless you're within 5 years of pulling the trigger, it's a tough call to make and commit to.  I'm just hoping I can start shopping within 20 years ...  and don't see the point of attempting to project my various income streams in various states just yet.  But I am a tad bit jealous of those of you about to embark on The Next Chapter.


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## ricoba (Sep 4, 2013)

geekette said:


> I'm not keen on moving to be near anyone; my family is spread out which gives us more places to visit.  And We Do.



I grew up in the Seattle area, but my Moms family came from Montana and my Dad's from New Jersey.  My parents met and married in Fairbanks, Alaska (where I was born).  

We occasionally saw my Moms family as a kid and very seldom if ever did we see my Dads family.

I got used to not being around extended family.  At holidays it was usually just the four of us, Mom, Dad, Sister and Me.

I married a Filipina who is like all Filipino's very family oriented and focused.  Family isn't just brothers and sisters, it's also Aunts, Uncles, Cousins and the like.  Needless to say, I had a lot of adjusting to do!

Then after being married for a few years, we left the Vancouver, BC area and moved back to the USA, first, WA, then ID and finally to CA.  Again, we don't see family as often as we once did.  Though, we do see family more than I did when I was a kid growing up.  

Currently our son, lives back with my wife's family in Vancouver, BC (it's great for my kids, they are dual US and Canadian citizens) and our daughter lives with us.  My parents are still in Seattle and my wifes family is in Vancouver are, with us here in Southern California.  

So, I am not one of those people that move to chase down family.  My belief is my son will stay in BC and continue to make a life there.  He likes the cool, cold, wet and wild weather.  My daughter will more than likely end up staying in Southern California and eventually, we will move to Vegas.

We will be separated, but a benefit of Las Vegas, as opposed to Florida or another destination is that within an hour you can be in LA and within three hours to Vancouver.

For us, this situation won't be too unlike our current circumstance.  Maybe when and if our kids have kids our perspective will change, but for now, we still look forward to staying in the Southwest....


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## Luanne (Sep 4, 2013)

klpca said:


> The number one reason why we will stay in California. Family.



I had family in California.  But they moved to MO.  No way was I going to retire there.


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## Rose Pink (Sep 5, 2013)

We will probably stay put here in Millcreek, Utah (Salt Lake City area). I love our neighborhood. I am looking out my window at Mt. Olympus as I type this. 

We are 20 minutes from the SLC airport which makes it very convenient. We are 5 hours from Moab where my DH loves to go jeeping. Park City is less than 30 minutes away.

We have music, theater, dance, museums, art, many ethnic festivals as well as world class skiing and other sports venues. We are minutes from the canyons. I could walk to Millcreek Canyon when my feet were better. DH used to run up it. DS and DIL where married there.

I don't get to see my grandchildren as often as I'd like because my sons are lifers in the Navy. Currently my grandchildren are in Italy and Okinawa. So glad there is Skype! With changes of location every three years, who knows where they will be next. It was nice when they were both in Washington and it was easy to fly or even drive to visit them. DS#1's wife is also from the SLC valley so they can visit here and see both families in the same visit. 

The downside of living here is the air quality which is horrid in the winter. The county mayor says cars being required to have lower emissions will help but they also project the population to double which will make it worse. The county and cities are working to develop walkable neighborhoods and better mass transit but the problem still lies in the fact that we live in a bowl surrounded by mountains. 

I wish we could afford a second home in Moab where I could live during the winter months and get away from the inversion.  Or even McCall, Idaho.  I've only been there once but it is breathtakingly beautiful.


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## Rose Pink (Sep 5, 2013)

For those who want a small town feel but with some big city amenities, take a look at Cedar City, Utah.  The altitude gives it four seasons but it is only 40 minutes from the St. George area which has a milder climate.  St. George/Ivins/Santa Clara and environs is getting too congested and has a large snowbird population but Cedar City is smaller. 

Cedar City is home to Southern Utah University (SUU), a state university with a private college feel due to its size.  My DD graduated from there.  SUU is highly ranked as a best value college by the Princeton Review.

Cedar City is also home to the Utah Shakespeare Festival which has won a Tony Award for best regional theater.  DH and I go every year and love it.  It's as good as anything I saw on Broadway.  Their production of Les Mis last year was superb.  

Cedar City is 20 minutes from the Kolob Canyon part of Zion NP.  It is about 30 minutes from Cedar Breaks and 40 minutes or so from Brian Head ski area.  It is close to Zion NP and Bryce Canyon.  It is 3.5 hours from Salt Lake City and 2.5 hours from Las Vegas.  It does have its own airport but I am not sure how many flights there are.  Being close to St. George will give you more flying options.


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## Rose Pink (Sep 5, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> We live in Twin Falls. 120 mi. east of Boise.


 I once met a couple (can't remember where they were from) who did their research and chose to retire in Chubbuck.  Having grown up in Poky, I couldn't fathom their choice.


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## Elan (Sep 5, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> Or even McCall, Idaho.  I've only been there once but it is breathtakingly beautiful.



  Funny, as I was going to mention suburban SLC as a possible retirement destination.  Much like Boise (including crappy air in the winter), but easier to get into/out of and better medical.  

  McCall is definitely a nice area.  Much nicer than Sun Valley, IMO.  Of course, winters are long and hard in McCall.  Once got snowed out of a June 10th golf tournament there.  But it's very nice July thru mid-September.


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## bogey21 (Sep 5, 2013)

BMWguynw said:


> My opinion is that it's any state with no state income tax, reasonable property taxes, affordable utility costs, that has reasonable weather and real estate prices, and that has a good airport nearby so you can fly away to your vacation destinations.



Seems to describe right where I am, Fort Worth, TX.  

George


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## Deb from NC (Sep 5, 2013)

We're staying put as well. NC does have state income taxes, but property taxes are low and housing is inexpensive.  We're less than 2 hours to the mountains and 3.5 to the coast, and a little over an hour to the Charlotte airport when we want to escape!    Having said that, if I could talk DH into moving to Sedona, I would be tempted to go there..so beautiful!


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## Rose Pink (Sep 5, 2013)

Deb from NC said:


> ...  Having said that, if I could talk DH into moving to Sedona, I would be tempted to go there..so beautiful!


 Have you been to Moab, Utah?  Similar red rock but much less expensive.  Moab is home to Arches NP and Canyonlands NP as well as Dead Horse Point.  It has a more laid back feel to it than does Sedona.  I love Sedona, too, and it is closer to a major airport PHX by a couple of hours.


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## Icc5 (Sep 5, 2013)

*Adding covered patio*



presley said:


> I feel the same as the PP.  I have never been anywhere out of California (besides Hawaii) that I have wanted to stay.  The costs are crazy high and we are small business owners.  I don't ever want to leave, but if we have to, we will retire on the Nevada border up north.
> 
> I've been hoarding timeshares so that in the event that we do have to relocate, I can come back regularly.
> 
> I was looking at the mean housing prices in the link on the first page of this thread and wondering if they are real.  Can you really buy a normal house in a nice neighborhood for $150K anywhere?  I can't imagine....



That 150K is getting me my covered patio in Cupertino.  I guess I could move and buy 8-10 houses but wouldn't have the same weather.
Bart


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## klpca (Sep 5, 2013)

We had friends who moved to Sandy, UT and loved it but had to move back to CA because of allergies. Luckily they hadn't sold their house here so they just moved back.


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## Rose Pink (Sep 5, 2013)

klpca said:


> We had friends who moved to Sandy, UT and loved it but had to move back to CA because of allergies. Luckily they hadn't sold their house here so they just moved back.


 I lived in Sandy for about 9 years.  Do you know what they were allergic to?


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## klpca (Sep 5, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> I lived in Sandy for about 9 years.  Do you know what they were allergic to?



I got the impression it was a hay fever but I'm not entirely positive. Obviously it's a good idea to live someplace for awhile before you make a lot of financial commitments.

A slightly interesting aside, my daughter found out that she's allergic to junipers - from spending two weeks in Bend, OR this May/June. It turns it that it's a pretty common cause of allergies in that area. She's a passionate rock climber and was there to climb at Smith Rock, but had to move along after two weeks because she was miserable. She had thought of living in Bend at one point, but not anymore.


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## presley (Sep 5, 2013)

klpca said:


> I got the impression it was a hay fever but I'm not entirely positive. Obviously it's a good idea to live someplace for awhile before you make a lot of financial commitments.



Really good point.  I had zero allergies my whole life and didn't realize that was what kicked in when we moved away from the beach.  I live in the same area, but inland and I guess to where all the allergens are.  

I visited St. Louis for a few days earlier this year.  It gave me one of the worst sinus headaches I've ever had.  I don't want to go to the midwest ever again.

If we relocate, we are going to visit the area at least once per season before making any drastic choices.


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## taffy19 (Sep 5, 2013)

We have to be close to the ocean and a mild climate so may as well stay where we are.  Our plan was to retire in Florence, OR because the area is so beautiful and stay the winter months in Puerto Vallarta but we found out that the climate in either place isn't mild enough.  I am here now and am almost melting. 

We know people in Australia and New Zealand and they love it there and our neighbor moved to Costa Rica and keeps telling us to move over there but it will be too hot and humid for us like Puerto Vallarta.

We like Southern California but there are problems here so may have to move eventually or it is getting too expensive.


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## zinger1457 (Sep 5, 2013)

bogey21 said:


> Seems to describe right where I am, Fort Worth, TX.
> 
> George



Aren't the property taxes in Texas typically high?  Remember having this discussion with someone from the Dallas area and they were paying almost 3X the amount in property taxes that I pay for a home of the same value here in Arizona.


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## bogey21 (Sep 5, 2013)

Don't know anything about property taxes in Arizona.  My Son lives in nice suburb of Dallas.  His property tax is just a touch over  $3,000 on a house he can sell tomorrow for $165,000.  Maybe this is high, maybe not.  I have no clue.

George


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## PigsDad (Sep 5, 2013)

bogey21 said:


> Don't know anything about property taxes in Arizona.  My Son lives in nice suburb of Dallas.  His property tax is just a touch over  $3,000 on a house he can sell tomorrow for $165,000.  Maybe this is high, maybe not.  I have no clue.


Ouch -- that is really high compared to Colorado.  We pay about the same tax on a house valued at about 3X of your son's.  But we have income tax.

Kurt


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## Chrispee (Sep 5, 2013)

bogey21 said:


> Don't know anything about property taxes in Arizona.  My Son lives in nice suburb of Dallas.  His property tax is just a touch over  $3,000 on a house he can sell tomorrow for $165,000.  Maybe this is high, maybe not.  I have no clue.
> 
> George



Wow, that would be taxes on an $800k house here in Vancouver Canada.  Our income taxes are fairly high.


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## channimal (Sep 5, 2013)

Taxachusetts comes to mind as one of the "do not retire here" states. I'd be inclined to do the summers in NH or ME + winters in FL.


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## Deb from NC (Sep 5, 2013)

Rose Pink said:


> Have you been to Moab, Utah?  Similar red rock but much less expensive.  Moab is home to Arches NP and Canyonlands NP as well as Dead Horse Point.  It has a more laid back feel to it than does Sedona.  I love Sedona, too, and it is closer to a major airport PHX by a couple of hours.



Yes, one time and I loved it there too!  We didn't have much time there,we need to go back.  LOVED Arches NP .


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## ricoba (Sep 5, 2013)

iconnections said:


> We have to be close to the ocean and a mild climate so may as well stay where we are.  Our plan was to retire in Florence, OR because the area is so beautiful and stay the winter months in Puerto Vallarta but we found out that the climate in either place isn't mild enough.  I am here now and am almost melting.
> 
> We know people in Australia and New Zealand and they love it there and our neighbor moved to Costa Rica and keeps telling us to move over there but it will be too hot and humid for us like Puerto Vallarta.
> 
> We like Southern California but there are problems here so may have to move eventually or it is getting too expensive.



It sure has been TOO HOT here in SoCal this past couple of weeks!  I guess I have to get over to Vegas to cool off!!! 

No doubt we are really spoiled with normally very average temps.  Though Emmy it does seem to be every year around this time that we get our hot spell.

As I posted earlier, we too like Southern California, but many of the negatives, traffic, congestion, cost of living, crime etc, out weigh the positives of the great weather and plenty of amenities... At least for us.


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## ricoba (Sep 5, 2013)

*Places I Personally Would Consider...*

This thread got me thinking and yes, we will likely end up in Las Vegas, but I know there are other places that I'd personally consider.

Boise or Twin Falls

Wenatchee or Yakima

Medford or Ashland 

Kelowna or Penticton

Reno

All the above places have lovely four season climates and have drier weather than some of the other places in the State or Province.  They are also moderately sized cities and they have beautiful natural surroundings.  Can't comment on the cost of living though, I just think those areas are nice.


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## am1 (Sep 5, 2013)

easyrider said:


> http://internationalliving.com/



Do not believe anything that international living writes.  Although both countries can be good options.  Less crime and cost of living in Panama.


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## PStreet1 (Sep 5, 2013)

iconnections said:


> We have to be close to the ocean and a mild climate so may as well stay where we are.  Our plan was to retire in Florence, OR because the area is so beautiful and stay the winter months in Puerto Vallarta but we found out that the climate in either place isn't mild enough.  I am here now and am almost melting.
> 
> We know people in Australia and New Zealand and they love it there and our neighbor moved to Costa Rica and keeps telling us to move over there but it will be too hot and humid for us like Puerto Vallarta.
> 
> We like Southern California but there are problems here so may have to move eventually or it is getting too expensive.



That's why we're just south of Tijuana:  we have San Diego's climate (coastal, never hot, never cold)--but just a tad better--and we have anything we want in San Diego with a 30 minute drive.  For us, it's working out well.


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## am1 (Sep 5, 2013)

Chrispee said:


> Wow, that would be taxes on an $800k house here in Vancouver Canada.  Our income taxes are fairly high.



A $800k house in Vancouver may be the same size as a $150k house elsewhere.


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## ricoba (Sep 5, 2013)

PStreet1 said:


> That's why we're just south of Tijuana:  we have San Diego's climate (coastal, never hot, never cold)--but just a tad better--and we have anything we want in San Diego with a 30 minute drive.  For us, it's working out well.



I am assuming you feel safe living in Baja, but I think I personally would be concerned living there.  We stopped going south of the border years ago.  Any comments?  Not trying to cause an argument, just curious to hear the good things instead of all the negative we read in the LA Times etc.


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## easyrider (Sep 5, 2013)

am1 said:


> Do not believe anything that international living writes.  Although both countries can be good options.  Less crime and cost of living in Panama.



Is international living a scam ? I find the articles really interesting. I am a paid member so I hope its not. Other than the articles the classifieds and advice pages are also interesting.


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## Karen G (Sep 5, 2013)

I'm late to this conversation because we've been enjoying our week in Carlsbad, CA, and the nice weather (I've already had a conversation with ricoba on Facebook about this!).

We retired to Henderson, NV (Las Vegas) in 2007 and we love it! We recently moved to Sun City Anthem and we love it even more.  After 25 years in the Seattle area, we primarily wanted to be out of the rain and that was one of the main reasons for moving to the Las Vegas area.

As far as medical care, our doctor in Henderson is the best doctor we've ever had anywhere. (Thanks, Fern, for that recommendation!)  We have a fantastic church, great friends, two of our three children live here, as well as  our first and only grandchild.  What's not to love!


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## easyrider (Sep 5, 2013)

PStreet1 said:


> That's why we're just south of Tijuana:  we have San Diego's climate (coastal, never hot, never cold)--but just a tad better--and we have anything we want in San Diego with a 30 minute drive.  For us, it's working out well.



Are you close to Rosarito ? I was thinking of visiting the WM there on my way to Cabo one of these trips.


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## PStreet1 (Sep 5, 2013)

We bought there 15 years ago, when we still lived in Colorado.  Then, when we moved to Arizona, it was with the plan that we'd spend the hot months on the coast and not have to deal with Arizona.  It's worked beautifully--and we're there more than just the hot months.

Safety?  We are so safe that you probably won't believe me.  We go where we want to go when we want to go.  We never think twice about safety issues here--and there are lots of places in the U.S. I think twice or more about.  We have lots and lots of friends who live in Mexico either full time or about the same amount of time we do; they feel as safe as we do.  I think this site tells the story very well:  http://howsafeismexico.com/ 
It is certainly true that there is drug violence in Mexico, but that's not part of my life, and it simply isn't a factor for us.  Mexico is a huge country; it's the size of Portugal, Spain, France, Germany, and Italy combined.  You'd never avoid Paris because there was a Mafia killing in Sicily, yet American media promote the idea that you are literally in danger anywhere in Mexico.

Several of our friends have lived fulltime in the area for over 20 years, and of all the people we know--and there are many--NOT ONE has ever experienced being afraid/feeling threatened/considering whether to go someplace or not/even feeling unwelcome.  It's been great for all of us.  NOT ONE has ever paid a police bribe, and we all drive new or "newish" American cars with American plates, and we all "look American," whatever that is.  Not one of us has decent Spanish (I say that, certainly not with pride, but to say that we gain nothing from "speaking the language and being local").  If among all of us, no one has experienced problems, believe me, they just aren't out there--unless you are courting them by dealing with the gangs in some way.  One of the standing jokes/topics of conversation of Americans in the area is the reaction of Americans who "venture to come to visit;"  they all--without exception--leave saying, "What was all the press about?  It's small-town safe and small-town friendly."

The picture by my name is our view from our bed/from the living room/ from the balcony on that side (the other balcony has a different ocean view)/from the kitchen/from the dining room.  Taxes on our 2000 sq. foot condo are $200.00 a year; we have a movie theater, with movies in English, a Home Depot, lots of American businesses you would recognize, and all the great local spots.

Why not "venture down" and see for yourself?  Prices are low, really low, right on the water.


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## PStreet1 (Sep 5, 2013)

easyrider said:


> Are you close to Rosarito ? I was thinking of visiting the WM there on my way to Cabo one of these trips.



Yes, we are at kilometer 38.5 (surf point known all over Baja).  If you decide to visit, I have a series of emails on restaurants/things to do/etc. that I send Worldmarkers, and anyone else who asks, about the area.  The feedback I get is that the emails are helpful.

Come on Down!


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## bogey21 (Sep 5, 2013)

easyrider said:


> Is international living a scam ?



I'm not sure but I know a couple who retired relatively early in their 50s who live in San Miguel, Mexico.  They love it and rave about the economics.  So much so that they have moved most of their money out of the US into San Miguel rental real estate property.

George


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## am1 (Sep 5, 2013)

easyrider said:


> Is international living a scam ? I find the articles really interesting. I am a paid member so I hope its not. Other than the articles the classifieds and advice pages are also interesting.



Yes they are in the business of selling the dream, and tours, real estate.  Only take prospective buyers to real estate where they get a good commission.  

You have to do your own research on any place you are interested in.  

The countries they advertise offer a lot more than advertised both good and bad.


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## Chrispee (Sep 6, 2013)

am1 said:


> A $800k house in Vancouver may be the same size as a $150k house elsewhere.



yeah, an $800k house is a liability that gets demolished around here.  Likely on only a 30ft lot too.  But where else can you experience rain 275 days per year?


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## LisaH (Sep 6, 2013)

PStreet1 said:


> That's why we're just south of Tijuana:  we have San Diego's climate (coastal, never hot, never cold)--but just a tad better--and we have anything we want in San Diego with a 30 minute drive.  For us, it's working out well.



Pat, how long does it usually take to cross the boarder? I ask because DS#2 seriously considers staying in San Diego area after school. I might do what you did and buy a place in Rosarito area (stay part time I think). BTW, would you consider any other places south of the boarder that is even closer to SD and just as nice (or nicer)?


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## vacationhopeful (Sep 6, 2013)

I just finished property tax appeals of property assessments and WON a reduction of over $9,500 annual property taxes for 2013. I did NOT have to go to the State Tax Court appeals.

Of course, the ORIGINAL TAX assessments for 2013 was $76,821.10. 

And these properties are over 100 miles SOUTH of NYC and not near the ocean (another 70 miles east). Need I say, there is a reason the current governor is so popular as he talks about reducing state spending and consolidating local government services. My personal house local government has not passed a budget YET and that bill is still at 2012 rates.:ignore:

Many formal hearing appeals DID not merit a reduction in assessments - I passed the State certification for Tax Assessor years ago - I read the manuals and passed the test the first time I took the 16 hours testing over one weekend. I might have had some idea of what I was doing.

Oh, yes, my state has a Income Tax and a sales tax of 7%.

But we don't have to pump our gasoline and have some of the cheapest gas around.

*PLEASE - DO NOT HI-JACK this thread on Property Taxes --- THIS POST IS ABOUT WHY PEOPLE MOVE FOR RETIREMENT!*


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## csxjohn (Sep 6, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> ...
> *PLEASE - DO NOT HI-JACK this thread on Property Taxes --- THIS POST IS ABOUT WHY PEOPLE MOVE FOR RETIREMENT!*



I don't agree with you on this.  The thread was started to find out, financially, which states are the best to retire in.

Property taxes address that issue, people stating non economic reason for a particular area are the ones who hijacked this thread.


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## kwindham (Sep 6, 2013)

PStreet1 said:


> We bought there 15 years ago, when we still lived in Colorado.  Then, when we moved to Arizona, it was with the plan that we'd spend the hot months on the coast and not have to deal with Arizona.  It's worked beautifully--and we're there more than just the hot months.
> 
> Safety?  We are so safe that you probably won't believe me.  We go where we want to go when we want to go.  We never think twice about safety issues here--and there are lots of places in the U.S. I think twice or more about.  We have lots and lots of friends who live in Mexico either full time or about the same amount of time we do; they feel as safe as we do.  I think this site tells the story very well:  http://howsafeismexico.com/
> It is certainly true that there is drug violence in Mexico, but that's not part of my life, and it simply isn't a factor for us.  Mexico is a huge country; it's the size of Portugal, Spain, France, Germany, and Italy combined.  You'd never avoid Paris because there was a Mafia killing in Sicily, yet American media promote the idea that you are literally in danger anywhere in Mexico.
> ...



Im really glad to find a tugger in Rosarita!!!  I was there for 10 nights this past January and loved loved loved it!!!   My parents about had a conniption fit that I was going to MX without my DH with all the alledged violence gangs drugs etc.  I assured them I was a big girl and would be fine.  They worried anyway.  BUT, Never once during my 10 night 11 day stay did I EVER feel unsafe, threatened, etc.  My aunt and younger brother (22) went with me and we had a blast!!!  It was breathtaking beautiful.  We drove to coast to Ensenada (sp?), stopped and ate local places, etc.  I would love to live there but dh but would probably never agree.  Im coming back January 2014.  Would love to meet you

I need to figure out is there a way to "friend" you or add you to a some kind of "follow" list on tug.  Can anyone help me out here?


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## csxjohn (Sep 6, 2013)

kwindham said:


> ...
> I need to figure out is there a way to "friend" you or add you to a some kind of "follow" list on tug.  Can anyone help me out here?



You can add a registered user to your contact list my clicking on their blue user name and following the link.  

You can see a list of your contacts by clicking on the "user CP" link in the blue bar above.

You can also keep in contact by sending an email by also clicking on the blue user name.  I've done this with a few members here and can carry on private conversations with them that way.


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## kwindham (Sep 6, 2013)

BMWguynw said:


> I totally agree.  But you need to be careful what you wish for:
> 
> My family is mainly in Washington State and the Central California (Sacramento) area.  When my Dad retired from the military, he and my stepmother moved to Bend, Oregon. They figured it was roughly halfway between the two major groups of family members.  Dad said he was tired of being the one doing all the visiting to other people's homes, and it was high time they all made the trip to visit him instead.  They lived there the rest of their lives, (more than 30 years), and both are now buried in a cemetery just outside of Bend.
> 
> ...



That really is sad.    Both DH and my family all live with a 15 mile radius of us, and have our whole lives (with the exception of mil lived in TN a couple years).  I love my family wholeheartedly, and would do anything for them.  But I feel the time has come, or is coming in the near future to live where it make ME happy.  I hate this place, there is nothing to do or see without driving at least 2 hours.  There is a small zoo and a movie theatre an hour from here.  I hate the weather, its either HOT or COLD, and its a wet nasty muddy cold, and a humid sticky hot.  I am NOT an indoor person at all, and it makes me crazy being cooped up in a house.  

Property here is really affordable.  We have a large beautiful home (3,800 sq) and 10 acres of land.  But what does that matter when there is nothing to do but look at it?


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## kwindham (Sep 6, 2013)

LisaH said:


> Pat, how long does it usually take to cross the boarder? I ask because DS#2 seriously considers staying in San Diego area after school. I might do what you did and buy a place in Rosarito area (stay part time I think). BTW, would you consider any other places south of the boarder that is even closer to SD and just as nice (or nicer)?



I had no problems going in or coming out.  Maybe 5 min going in, coming out one time was long, probably about 45 min?  it was a Saturday.


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## klpca (Sep 6, 2013)

kwindham said:


> I had no problems going in or coming out.  Maybe 5 min going in, coming out one time was long, probably about 45 min?  it was a Saturday.



It can be up to two+ hours during certain times, i.e. rush hour and holidays are a mess. Here's the website http://traffic.calit2.net/border/border-wait-times.php?type=passenger&sub=standard&port=250401 (Yikes, current wait time is three hours).

But you can speed up the process with one of these: http://www.mexadventure.com/MexicoTravel/SENTRI_pass.cfm


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## ace2000 (Sep 6, 2013)

The retiring in Mexico concept is intriguing, does anybody from the US ever think about retiring in Canada, or are the taxes too high there?


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## easyrider (Sep 6, 2013)

ace2000 said:


> The retiring in Mexico concept is intriguing, does anybody from the US ever think about retiring in Canada, or are the taxes too high there?



We were just up in Vancouver and Whistler BC and I would say while its a very nice place it is a bit more expensive to live because of the costs of food, gas and some other items. Gas was just under $5 a gallon, milk was about $5 a gallon, beer was about $45+ a case, wine was twice what you pay in WA and the list could go on.


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## geekette (Sep 6, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> *PLEASE - DO NOT HI-JACK this thread on Property Taxes --- THIS POST IS ABOUT WHY PEOPLE MOVE FOR RETIREMENT!*


Thanks, but, I'll let the moderators determine what strays too far.

Like my railroad buddy, I absolutely consider property taxes a major consideration for my retirement as I have no intention of living in a dwelling that someone else owns.  Shelter is a necessity that I'm going to have to budget for.  With no mortgage, only things left are taxes and utilities.


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## SMHarman (Sep 6, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> *PLEASE - DO NOT HI-JACK this thread on Property Taxes --- THIS POST IS ABOUT WHY PEOPLE MOVE FOR RETIREMENT!*


But income taxes are just one of many factors to consider in the move.  They original slideshow showed income tax but not property tax rates (as that would be harder as it is city by city not state by state).  A 0 income tax state still needs income so that will likely come from property tax.  There is no 0 income tax 0 property tax state.
A retiree benefits from living in a high income tax low property tax state if they want to stay in their existing home as the property tax is a fixed cost that cannot be adjusted without moving.
It is not a hijack to discuss property tax here.


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## Passepartout (Sep 6, 2013)

Agreed. States need to have SOME revenue source, but some are decidedly more efficient than others. 

Desirable things for retirement States: May not be the same as 'good places to live'.

*Low property taxes.

Tax free retirement income tax- none on SS, or on unearned income, like interest or dividends.

Low- to no sales tax.

Inexpensive vehicle registrations.

Low- to no personal property tax on vehicles, RVs, etc.

(relatively)Cheap gas, groceries, electric power/gas, medical care.

Access to a major hub airport for lower cost travel.

Inexpensive- and easy (no lawyers needed) Probate for survivors after you're gone.
*
I'm sure there are others, and I can't provide examples of each, but no one place is going to cover all the low cost bases. You just have to do some research on the ones that are of most benefit to you and make the decision. Some are outlined in my post #7


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## KauaiMark (Sep 6, 2013)

*Moving away from all 50?*



judyjht said:


> OK - what do you all think?



My sister just recently informed the rest of the family that they have sold EVERYTHING (house, boat, cars, furniture, etc.) on Lake Lanier, Gainesville GA and are moving to.... Ambergris Caye, Belize

The last thing I heard before this, they were looking at several houses in San Diego, CA

Must be some kind of tax advantage involved. 

Guess where next we're trying to finagle an invite to visit?

...Mark


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## PStreet1 (Sep 6, 2013)

LisaH said:


> Pat, how long does it usually take to cross the boarder? I ask because DS#2 seriously considers staying in San Diego area after school. I might do what you did and buy a place in Rosarito area (stay part time I think). BTW, would you consider any other places south of the boarder that is even closer to SD and just as nice (or nicer)?



It takes no time, literally, to cross the border into Mexico.  Crossing back to the U.S. can be challenging; 3 hours is not unusual.  However, you can apply for a Sentri pass from the U.S. government.  http://www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/travel/trusted_traveler/sentri/

The Sentri pass is a full security check and 10 point fingerprint check.  It costs about $125.00 per person--but it's good for 5 years, so not much per crossing, per year.  Most people I know who live in Mexico would give up their first born child sooner than give up their Sentri passes.  With a Sentri pass, it rarely takes over 10 minutes to enter the U.S.

Rosarito Beach is 30 minutes south of the border.  The only possibility even closer is The Playas at Tijuana, and we weren't interested.  There are places on the north end of Rosarito that are closer than where we are, but in my opinion, south of town is nicer.  We are at kilometer 38.5, so you see it isn't far.  Rosarito is your best bet for "nice" and "close."

PM me and I'll send you any information you want.


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## PStreet1 (Sep 6, 2013)

kwindham said:


> Im really glad to find a tugger in Rosarita!!!  I was there for 10 nights this past January and loved loved loved it!!!   My parents about had a conniption fit that I was going to MX without my DH with all the alledged violence gangs drugs etc.  I assured them I was a big girl and would be fine.  They worried anyway.  BUT, Never once during my 10 night 11 day stay did I EVER feel unsafe, threatened, etc.  My aunt and younger brother (22) went with me and we had a blast!!!  It was breathtaking beautiful.  We drove to coast to Ensenada (sp?), stopped and ate local places, etc.  I would love to live there but dh but would probably never agree.  Im coming back January 2014.  Would love to meet you
> 
> I need to figure out is there a way to "friend" you or add you to a some kind of "follow" list on tug.  Can anyone help me out here?



Private Message me and we can exchange emails.  I have a series of emails I send to people wanting to visit the area, and I'll send them to you.  I list my favorite restaurants in town and south of town/stuff to do/etc.

We'll probably be there sometime in January; we usually are because we love the New Year's Eve party we usually go to there.  Definitely, we should arrange to meet.  : )


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## channimal (Sep 6, 2013)

KauaiMark said:


> My sister just recently informed the rest of the family that they have sold EVERYTHING (house, boat, cars, furniture, etc.) on Lake Lanier, Gainesville GA and are moving to.... Ambergris Caye, Belize
> 
> The last thing I heard before this, they were looking at several houses in San Diego, CA
> 
> ...



one of my first trades was into Ambergris.  Only "vehicle" needed is a golf cart


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## ricoba (Sep 6, 2013)

ace2000 said:


> The retiring in Mexico concept is intriguing, does anybody from the US ever think about retiring in Canada, or are the taxes too high there?



My wife and children are dual US & Canadian citizens, and so yes, we'd consider a move to Canada, to be closer to her family.  But instead of the Lower Mainland, I'd be more interested in the Okanagan, or perhaps Vancouver Island.


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## SunSand (Sep 6, 2013)

My wife and I will be staying in the Red Rocks/Summerlin area for a few days this winter to test it out.  We've visited the area several times during the the vacation seasons, so I want to see if its "livable" in the winter.   Sun City Anthem is beautiful, just want to see if Sun City Summerlin is livable as well.  The wife is not as enthusiastic about 55+ and Vegas, but we both love the West.  Nevada & Arizona have always seemed more like home.  I just need to sell my other half (But I'm getting closer).


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## Karen G (Sep 7, 2013)

SunSand said:


> My wife and I will be staying in the Red Rocks/Summerlin area for a few days this winter to test it out.  We've visited the area several times during the the vacation seasons, so I want to see if its "livable" in the winter.   Sun City Anthem is beautiful, just want to see if Sun City Summerlin is livable as well.  The wife is not as enthusiastic about 55+ and Vegas, but we both love the West.  Nevada & Arizona have always seemed more like home.  I just need to sell my other half (But I'm getting closer).


I'm not positive, but I think Sun City Anthem is a newer community than SC Summerlin.  Be sure to take your wife to the recreation center, the indoor/outdoor pools, the fitness center & theater, the golf courses, and drive through the neighborhoods.We moved into our Sun City Anthem house in June after living in Anthem Country Club for six years. We couldn't be happier with SCA--there is so much to do and so many amenities--wish we had moved there sooner!


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## ricoba (Sep 7, 2013)

Karen G said:


> I'm not positive, but I think Sun City Anthem is a newer community than SC Summerlin.  Be sure to take your wife to the recreation center, the indoor/outdoor pools, the fitness center & theater, the golf courses, and drive through the neighborhoods.We moved into our Sun City Anthem house in June after living in Anthem Country Club for six years. We couldn't be happier with SCA--there is so much to do and so many amenities--wish we had moved there sooner!



Yes, I am sure SC Summerlin is older, with older residents.

I also agree with Karen, check out SC Anthem, you will be impressed.


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## Fern Modena (Sep 7, 2013)

Sun City Summerlin was the first Sun City to be built in the Las Vegas Valley. It has the smallest houses, and the oldest residents. Some of the houses have turned over, of course, but the properties were built between 1988 and 1998. There are 11,000 rooftops there, so probably 14,000 +/- residents.

Good points: Four recreation centers with many shows and activities. There are shopping centers within the boundaries, so you can use a golf cart to get around. There is also a public bus route as well as an FDR Bus (dial a ride fixed route) three days a week.

Neutral: Summerlin is very suburban, while still in Las Vegas. It is not yet completely built out, and is a very large community.

Bad Points (my opinion, may not be yours): Traffic is worse on that side of town, and you have to "go through the Spaghetti Bowl" to go to The Strip or the airport.  The Spaghetti Bowl is where I-15/US-93/US-95/I-515 all come together. It often is jammed up, and that can happen at any time. There is no such thing as "rush hour" since the area works 24/7. An example: My dentist is near Alta and Decatur, which is on the other side of the Spaghetti Bowl from me. I have had it take anywhere from 30 minutes to 1:20 to get there.

About traffic, etc. Unless you are Karen, you will find that you spend most of your time on the side of town you live on. I rarely go across I-15, and if you lived in Summerlin, except for going to The Strip or the airport, you'd probably not go past Las Vegas Blvd.

Do you use the VA for medical care?  If you do, you might want to consider Sun City Aliante, which is much nearer the VA.  Otherwise, that area is not as well developed, and I wouldn't live there.

There is a 4th Sun City, Sun City Macdonald Ranch, which is also in Henderson (as is Anthem). It is small, by Sun City standards, about 2600 rooftops, and the people there are older as well.

If you want more info about Sun City Anthem, PM me and I'll talk to you off the board.

Fern 



SunSand said:


> My wife and I will be staying in the Red Rocks/Summerlin area for a few days this winter to test it out.  We've visited the area several times during the the vacation seasons, so I want to see if its "livable" in the winter.   Sun City Anthem is beautiful, just want to see if Sun City Summerlin is livable as well.  The wife is not as enthusiastic about 55+ and Vegas, but we both love the West.  Nevada & Arizona have always seemed more like home.  I just need to sell my other half (But I'm getting closer).


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## Fern Modena (Sep 7, 2013)

See?  I knew you'd be happy here.  That is why we didn't want to move into Country Club.



Karen G said:


> We couldn't be happier with SCA--there is so much to do and so many amenities--wish we had moved there sooner!


----------



## MuranoJo (Sep 7, 2013)

BMWguynw said:


> I totally agree.  But you need to be careful what you wish for:
> 
> My family is mainly in Washington State and the Central California (Sacramento) area.  When my Dad retired from the military, he and my stepmother moved to Bend, Oregon. They figured it was roughly halfway between the two major groups of family members.  Dad said he was tired of being the one doing all the visiting to other people's homes, and it was high time they all made the trip to visit him instead.  They lived there the rest of their lives, (more than 30 years), and both are now buried in a cemetery just outside of Bend.
> 
> ...



This hit a chord with me.  My parents divorced when I was 17 and lived in a small town of ~3000.  After graduation, each of us siblings moved to better opportunities, education, getting married, etc., until we were all scattered across the country.  Mom retired first, and I tried to get her to move out near us, but she insisted on moving back down South near her family's homestead.  Dad retired, and without discussing with any of us first, moved back to our small hometown.  

Either way, it was a major trip to see either of them.  And in both cases, they were hurt that we couldn't come see them more often.  
I'm not sure why neither of them wanted to really talk this through before they made their decisions.


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## MuranoJo (Sep 7, 2013)

PStreet1 said:


> ...It is certainly true that there is drug violence in Mexico, but that's not part of my life, and it simply isn't a factor for us.  Mexico is a huge country; it's the size of Portugal, Spain, France, Germany, and Italy combined.  *You'd never avoid Paris because there was a Mafia killing in Sicily, yet American media promote the idea that you are literally in danger anywhere in Mexico...*.



This is so true.  Yet so many can't see through the media hype.  
At any rate, I'd still consider certain areas of MX as long as I was confident of medical care.


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## geekette (Sep 7, 2013)

muranojo said:


> This is so true.  Yet so many can't see through the media hype.
> At any rate, I'd still consider certain areas of MX as long as I was confident of medical care.



I've only been down to Cabo twice, third trip coming, there is Just Something about the area, the people, etc., that keeps pulling me back.  so many more sweet little towns to visit!  

The last trip was 14 people, most had never left the US, some were terrified of Mexico (there were at least 2 couples that turned down the invite due to fear of violence in Mexico).  All that joined us Loved It.

While I realize that Baja is not like the mainland, I like the leisurely feel and understand why many wealthy Americans build massive mansions there.  While I would not be in the market for a mansion, I do think my dollars could get me a major upgrade from my current lifestyle.  This thread is causing me to think harder on early retirement, a dangerous line of thought since many of my relatives have lived into their late 90s ...

If I were to choose an always-warm location, I would look hard at southern Baja.  I would even consider Cabo Pulmo for the access to that reef.  

I think that just like Americans generalize 'violence in Mexico', folks in other countries are thinking that about us.  That Aussie gunned down ...  school shootouts ...    we also have gangs and drug runners.   Every place has its charms and deterrents.


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## SunSand (Sep 7, 2013)

Excellent advice on the Vegas area Sun City's. Thank you!  We'll take your advice and look even closer.  The overall personality of the community will be a big factor as well.  It's a huge decision, so I appreciate the input. Thanks!


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## bogey21 (Sep 7, 2013)

muranojo said:


> At any rate, I'd still consider certain areas of MX as long as I was confident of medical care.



My friends in San Miguel are very positive about the medical care there.

George


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## kwindham (Sep 7, 2013)

muranojo said:


> This is so true.  Yet so many can't see through the media hype.
> At any rate, I'd still consider certain areas of MX as long as I was confident of medical care.



I don't live there and so don't receive routine medical care there.  However, my Jan 13 trip there was for cosmetic surgery.  After a year and a half of dieting and exercise, I lost almost 100 lbs, (91 to be exact)  I had 3 procedures, one was a tummy tuck.  All of this was discussed in great detail with my primary physician here before I made any decisions.  But to make the long story short, I did it, I received fantastic care, I couldn't be happier with my results, mine actually look better then 2 of my friends that used stateside well renowned surgeons, and I paid a ton less (more $$$ for vaca's, lol).  So I think if you do your research for drs in mx you will receive good treatment as a rule.  Im sure they also have a lot of "slice em and dice em" so called drs too, but this is where your own research comes in


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## kwindham (Sep 7, 2013)

csxjohn said:


> You can add a registered user to your contact list my clicking on their blue user name and following the link.
> 
> You can see a list of your contacts by clicking on the "user CP" link in the blue bar above.
> 
> You can also keep in contact by sending an email by also clicking on the blue user name.  I've done this with a few members here and can carry on private conversations with them that way.



Thank you!  Now I know!


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## kwindham (Sep 7, 2013)

PStreet1 said:


> Private Message me and we can exchange emails.  I have a series of emails I send to people wanting to visit the area, and I'll send them to you.  I list my favorite restaurants in town and south of town/stuff to do/etc.
> 
> We'll probably be there sometime in January; we usually are because we love the New Year's Eve party we usually go to there.  Definitely, we should arrange to meet.  : )



PMing right now!!!


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## geekette (Sep 7, 2013)

kwindham said:


> I don't live there and so don't receive routine medical care there.  However, my Jan 13 trip there was for cosmetic surgery.  After a year and a half of dieting and exercise, I lost almost 100 lbs, (91 to be exact)  I had 3 procedures, one was a tummy tuck.  All of this was discussed in great detail with my primary physician here before I made any decisions.  But to make the long story short, I did it, I received fantastic care, I couldn't be happier with my results, mine actually look better then 2 of my friends that used stateside well renowned surgeons, and I paid a ton less (more $$$ for vaca's, lol).  So I think if you do your research for drs in mx you will receive good treatment as a rule.  Im sure they also have a lot of "slice em and dice em" so called drs too, but this is where your own research comes in



congrats on the massive weight loss and good outcome on 'the touch ups' done in Mx.  Please do continue to round up to 100 pounds as it's "close enough" and soooooo impressive.


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## PStreet1 (Sep 7, 2013)

muranojo said:


> This is so true.  Yet so many can't see through the media hype.
> At any rate, I'd still consider certain areas of MX as long as I was confident of medical care.



Good medical care is available-----depending.  Around Guadalahara, the care is generally quite good because of the medical schools in Guadalahara.  Other areas, it very much depends on where you are and what you need.

The post about cosmetic surgery is an example.  There are excellent cosmetic surgeons in lots of places, and one of them is Rosarito, where we are.  There is an eye surgeon who is supposed to be wonderful in Tijuana, and the list goes on.  I have a Mexican doctor whom I like very much, and I feel he is quite knowledgeable.  I see him for all kinds of "little stuff" that comes up.  Once I asked him if I needed to go to the hospital which one I should go to.  He just looked at me as though I'd asked a really dumb question for a minute.  Then he said, "You would go to the U.S."
     I replied, "Well, if it were an emergency."
     He said, "If it were an emergency, you would HAVE to go to the U.S., and if it weren't an emergency, why wouldn't you?"

     I think that pretty much says all there is to say.  If you need "non-machine" medicine--just doctors who are skilled--Mexico is fine.  If you need machines, they just don't have them, certainly not in the numbers you find them in the U.S.  There are many, many tests that just can't be done in Mexico--depending on your location.

     That's why we chose to be close to the border.  San Diego is 30 minutes away.  We could be stabliized at a local hospital and evacuated by air, or if time weren't an issue, the drive to the border doesn't take long.

     Unfortunately, it's not possible to predict just what kind of medical emergency one might have.


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## MuranoJo (Sep 8, 2013)

Thanks for all the various experiences, either direct or indirect.  A lot to think about if you are seriously considering retiring So. of the Border.
(Kwindham, major congrats for the significant weight loss!  Fantastic!)


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## kwindham (Sep 8, 2013)

Thank you for the congrats, the goal is/was 103 lost, still working on it.  the last few are extremely stubborn!


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## jlr10 (Sep 8, 2013)

We love where we live.  But we don't have a good retirement plan through work so our retirement plan is our home. We bought when the housing market was crashing in 1990 and have stayed put for 23 years.  Prices rose and fell but never have come close to our purchase price.  Hopefully in 15 more when are ready to retire it will have rebounded again then we will sell and move to where there is a lower cost of living.  But once we got spoiled with San Diego Weather - which is usually only bad in August when it is humid - it is hard to thing about leaving.


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## Passepartout (Sep 26, 2013)

*The 8 cheapest States to retire in....*

8> Louisiana
7> Nevada
6> Delaware
5> Mississippi
4> Arizona
3> Georgia
2> Wyoming
1> Alaska

Here, read why: http://wallstcheatsheet.com/stocks/the-8-cheapest-states-for-retirees.html/?a=viewall


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## easyrider (Sep 26, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> 8> Louisiana
> 7> Nevada
> 6> Delaware
> 5> Mississippi
> ...



Are you saving Idaho for yourself ? 

Bill


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## Passepartout (Sep 26, 2013)

easyrider said:


> Are you saving Idaho for yourself ?



Sort of. Financially, Idaho is not a low-cost retirement haven. But it's home.


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## Elan (Sep 26, 2013)

easyrider said:


> Are you saving Idaho for yourself ?
> 
> Bill



  Idaho sucks!  No reason for anyone to even consider moving here, regardless of age.


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## PigsDad (Sep 26, 2013)

Elan said:


> Idaho sucks!  No reason for anyone to even consider moving here, regardless of age.


That goes double for Colorado.  We have floods.  We have fires.  We have people from Boulder.  Stay away! 

Kurt


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## easyrider (Sep 26, 2013)

You Know, WA has a new reason to be called the evergreen state. 

Bill


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## easyrider (Sep 26, 2013)

PigsDad said:


> That goes double for Colorado.  We have floods.  We have fires.  We have people from Boulder.  Stay away!
> 
> Kurt



Isn't CO the Rocky Mountain High state or mile high state ? new meanings ?


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## csxjohn (Sep 26, 2013)

So my question has to be, where can I move to and be able to grow and smoke pot legally?


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## Passepartout (Sep 26, 2013)

csxjohn said:


> So my question has to be, where can I move to and be able to grow and smoke pot legally?



See post  #137 & #138. I suspect when other states see how much revenue there is in it and how many jobs it creates, it won't take long to be in the majority of states. I give it between 5- and 10 years.


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## Elan (Sep 26, 2013)

csxjohn said:


> So my question has to be, where can I move to and be able to grow and smoke pot legally?



  Given that Colorado has pot and is prone to fires, perhaps it'd be cheapest to just move downwind to Kansas?


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## lizap (Sep 26, 2013)

Compared to Louisiana that has extremely low property taxes, it's high.  But we do have a state income tax, so I guess it all evens out..




bogey21 said:


> Don't know anything about property taxes in Arizona.  My Son lives in nice suburb of Dallas.  His property tax is just a touch over  $3,000 on a house he can sell tomorrow for $165,000.  Maybe this is high, maybe not.  I have no clue.
> 
> George


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## csxjohn (Sep 26, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> See post  #137 & #138. I suspect when other states see how much revenue there is in it and how many jobs it creates, it won't take long to be in the majority of states. I give it between 5- and 10 years.



I may not have that long so I'd better start my research now.  Just like timeshares, I need to visit these places and try out the "amenities" before I jump in.


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## ricoba (Sep 26, 2013)

I like that NV comes in @ #7, seems like finally we have chosen fairly well. 

Oh, PS, I wouldn't mind living in AK or WY, but those places are just too cold for me!


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## Passepartout (Sep 26, 2013)

Back in my working- and single days, I said that if I HAD to live on the East Coast (I was working for a Washington Industry group at the time), I'd live in Delaware. Specifically the DelMarVa Peninsula. Flat as a fritter, and wicked humid in the Summer, but it has a lot of 'rural' charm missing in much of the East. And VERY low taxes.

Jim


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