# Changes in 2020 Points Charts



## Firepath (Dec 20, 2018)

Lots of changes to the points charts, with increases in most studios and 1 BR units, decreases in 2BR. Some 1 and 2BR units now as low as 6 points difference. This will likely move a lot of people (myself included) into 2BR instead of 1BR for just a few points more. I wonder if this will change the RCI availability which are almost always 1BRs.


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## Dean (Dec 21, 2018)

Firepath said:


> Lots of changes to the points charts, with increases in most studios and 1 BR units, decreases in 2BR. Some 1 and 2BR units now as low as 6 points difference. This will likely move a lot of people (myself included) into 2BR instead of 1BR for just a few points more. I wonder if this will change the RCI availability which are almost always 1BRs.


Probably not much if at all.  If anything it'll slightly increase studios.  It might decrease the total availability slightly.  On the DVC side it's based on the number of point traded out, which I don't think has changed.  It could change but likely not, it did decrease slightly a few years ago from 270 to 250 points for example.


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## Panina (Dec 21, 2018)

Firepath said:


> Lots of changes to the points charts, with increases in most studios and 1 BR units, decreases in 2BR. Some 1 and 2BR units now as low as 6 points difference. This will likely move a lot of people (myself included) into 2BR instead of 1BR for just a few points more. I wonder if this will change the RCI availability which are almost always 1BRs.


So if I understand correctly, if someone purchased from Disney enough points to go once a year to a specific resort using a studio they will no longer have enough points.  If so dvc just reduced the value of many of their members.


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## Dean (Dec 21, 2018)

Panina said:


> So if I understand correctly, if someone purchased from Disney enough points to go once a year to a specific resort using a studio they will no longer have enough points.  If so dvc just reduced the value of many of their members.


Or increased it depending on where one falls with the changes.  This is one of the reasons I've consistently recommended people buy a cushion of points of 10-20% for most situations.  This is the way the system is set up and the way the POS reads.


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## ljmiii (Dec 21, 2018)

It really varies by resort. To me the more interesting changes at BLT are between seasons - Premier Season in particular got hammered. Poly is another story. In a not so massive surprise, now that it is sold out they are making the bungalows cheaper and the studios more expensive.


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## Panina (Dec 21, 2018)

I always though dvc was the best system treating their members the best. Now I don’t if I am understanding this correctly.  A buyer has no guarantee with dvc if they buy for example at Saratoga enough points to have a week in a one bedroom in February. That can change if dvc changes the point value needed and then I need more points.

In hgvc I alway have my home resort week.  The points I got guarantees me a week in the status I purchased.  They have changed point value  of new developed resorts to  higher point requirements, diminishing my value of points to new resorts but the guaranteed of always having my home resort week remains, not having to buy more points.


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## Dean (Dec 21, 2018)

Panina said:


> I always though dvc was the best system treating their members the best. Now I don’t if I am understanding this correctly.  A buyer has no guarantee with dvc if they buy for example at Saratoga enough points to have a week in a one bedroom in February. That can change if dvc changes the point value needed and then I need more points.
> 
> In hgvc I alway have my home resort week.  The points I got guarantees me a week in the status I purchased.  They have changed point value  of new developed resorts to  higher point requirements, diminishing my value of points to new resorts but the guaranteed of always having my home resort week remains, not having to buy more points.


The POS says the "SHALL" rebalance if demand is too far off.  They've done so a few times.  Not a big deal, you just plan accordingly. While it may therefore not work for someone who wants to lock it down tight, the nature of the points in general with different seasons, LOS and resorts also creates the same uncertainty.  If you're looking at smaller units (esp studios), lower seasons and cheaper resorts you clearly need a large cushion.  If you're looking at Magic/Premier, large units and more expensive resorts likely not.  Every single member either knew or should have known going in this was a possibility.


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## bizaro86 (Dec 21, 2018)

Panina said:


> I always though dvc was the best system treating their members the best. Now I don’t if I am understanding this correctly.  A buyer has no guarantee with dvc if they buy for example at Saratoga enough points to have a week in a one bedroom in February. That can change if dvc changes the point value needed and then I need more points.
> 
> In hgvc I alway have my home resort week.  The points I got guarantees me a week in the status I purchased.  They have changed point value  of new developed resorts to  higher point requirements, diminishing my value of points to new resorts but the guaranteed of always having my home resort week remains, not having to buy more points.



With DVC you own a specific percentage of the resort's total. So the total amount of points is always the same, but they can adjust. 

Sometimes the adjustments are small (ie, Easter moves every year, which affects which dates are certain seasons) and sometimes larger. I think on average it is a net benefit to members if they do it to equalize demand between rooms/seasons.


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## TravelTime (Dec 22, 2018)

I looked at the charts for the resorts I like after reading this thread. I tend to get 1 bedrooms. Most are the same or cheaper. The changes to studios are small. They basically shift 1-3 points per day maximum. In the end, when I looked at the 2020 charts, the differences are minimal to me and I think it is to the advantage of anyone who stays in 1 bedrooms or larger. But again, the change is so minimal that it does not really matter unless someone is very rigid and set on getting what they got last year.


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## bnoble (Dec 22, 2018)

I'm not surprised studios went up. There was significant demand for them system-wide. I *am* surprised 1BRs went up; they were typically the last to book. However, DVC might have some evidence that larger parties (4-5) are squeezing into 1BRs, and they are trying to nudge them up to 2BRs...


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## Dean (Dec 22, 2018)

TravelTime said:


> I looked at the charts for the resorts I like after reading this thread. I tend to get 1 bedrooms. Most are the same or cheaper. The changes to studios are small. They basically shift 1-3 points per day maximum. In the end, when I looked at the 2020 charts, the differences are minimal to me and I think it is to the advantage of anyone who stays in 1 bedrooms or larger. But again, the change is so minimal that it does not really matter unless someone is very rigid and set on getting what they got last year.


Look at SSR where most everything went up, I wonder if they moved an entire section between standard and preferred.  In many cases they increased studios AND 1 BR somewhat decreasing 2 BR for the most part.  Like bnoble, I too suspect part of the motivation is to push people to 2 BR though I'm not truly sure the motivation.  Certainly more 2 BR means cheaper admin costs which also raises the question whether we'll see a minimum LOS at some point at least for reservations done early at 11 months.  I also wonder if we'll see elimination of the 5 in a 1 BR not designed for 5 in the next year or 2, if the motivation were largely room stuffing, I suspect we will.  I agree with you that it is the nature of the system and i've long said one should buy a cushion of points in most cases, usually 10-20%, sometimes more.  Unfortunately there are many over the years that bought exactly what they "needed" at the time to get X for a specific season and that has always been a recipe for disaster unless it was the most expensive option to start with.  Poly increasing studios and decreasing bungalows was a non brainer, esp if they were doing a reallocation anyway, but we'll see hand wringing there as well.  The reaction to this change mirrors the reactions I saw with the back to back changes for the 2010/2011 points charts which also proved that the 20% per year POS restriction really gave no protection at all.


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## ljmiii (Dec 22, 2018)

Panina said:


> I always though dvc was the best system treating their members the best...


Whether you are being treated better or worse by the latest change depends on how and when you travel. DVC regularly shifts point requirements to try to equalize demand across season, day of the week, and room size.

When I bought BCV at DVC, weekend nights were much more expensive. For example, a Premier Season studio was 19 pts Sun-Thu and a whopping 43 pts Fri-Sat. In 2019 the split is 25/28 and in 2020 the split is 27/30 - just 10% cheaper for weeknights. And in recent years demand for Christmas and Easter has been outstripping supply so they increased the price - a BCV 2BR went from 467 to 495 pts.

But the real reason for the high level of complaints about the most recent increase is the change over the years in the sales pitch and customer base. Originally...and to a certain extent even in the mid-2000s when I bought...DVC offered villas for families for those who didn't want to stay in 'just' a Disney hotel room. The 1 and 2BRs were the showpieces and they also had studios for those who wanted them...and that's how you get 1BRs. The expectation was that guests would stay for 4ish nights and the minimum number of DVC points one could buy was much higher.

That all changed and the pitch became 'have a lifetime of memories for much cheaper than a Disney hotel room'. 'See how little it costs to spend a week at Disney'...and then highlight the cost of a studio during Adventure week - just a little over 100 pts. Alongside that shift were the skyrocketing prices per point. And so now thousands of people feel they have been deceived because the vacation they could barely afford will have to be shorter. Or they will somehow have to find the money to add-on.

In all fairness, those who bought at Poly were set up and 'everyone' knew it...except those who didn't understand what they were buying. You looked at the room and point distribution and knew that once it sold out the point price of the bungalows was going to fall...and that of the studios was going to rise.


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## TravelTime (Dec 22, 2018)

I looked at the charts again. I can see why many people are upset by the change. The places where I own and visit did not change much and some did not change at all but I see there were many changes especially in the studios but also the 1 bedrooms at many resorts. I think they raised the 1 bedrooms because they wanted the difference between studios and 1 bedrooms to be more significant. Otherwise, it would drive demand up to the 1 bedrooms. I am glad they reduced the points for the Poly bungalows because I would like to stay in one but the high points has kept me away.


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## ljmiii (Dec 22, 2018)

TravelTime said:


> I am glad they reduced the points for the Poly bungalows because I would like to stay in one but the high points has kept me away.


It good news for a lot of people and bad news for all those people who bought at Poly to stay in a studio. But as I said, it shouldn't be 'news' to anyone. *Maybe* before Poly opened...but there were already a gazillion comments on the boards wondering why anyone would pay that much more to stay in a 2BR Bungalow over one of the spectacular 3BR Grand Villas. But once Poly opened and there were another gazillion comments about the 'Ghost Town on the Lagoon' the jig was up.


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## bnoble (Dec 22, 2018)

TravelTime said:


> Otherwise, it would drive demand up to the 1 bedrooms.


But, this would have been fine, because in most cases the 1BRs are the last of any resort/view category to book.


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## Dean (Dec 23, 2018)

bnoble said:


> But, this would have been fine, because in most cases the 1BRs are the last of any resort/view category to book.


I agree, the core expectation for such a change would have been to raise studios and lower 1 BR slightly.  Also to reduce the bungalow points at the Poly.  Given the change, it does make me wonder the reasons behind it.  Either the 2 BR were lower demand than we thought or they specifically wanted to drive people to 2BR.  As I speculated, it could be to reduce costs with less phone calls and less total check ins or they felt the 2 BR were truly being underutilized.  

The entitlement mentality and lack of understanding of how one's timeshare actually works is always interesting to me but I do understand that it still hurts if this alters how one can use DVC or has to buy more points to do so.


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## TravelTime (Dec 23, 2018)

I just did a search for Memorial Day week for 7N.

Availability

VGF - 1 bedroom lake view available (this was the only resort that VGF 1 BR category that DVC did not charge points for)

SSR - all categories available

OKW - 1 and 2 bedrooms available

AK Kidani - 1 bedrooms standard view and savanah view available

AK Jambo - no rooms available for full week (ironically DVC reduced the points to stay in value category but this is always booked first. They also decreased points for standard view but increased points in the 1 BR Savannah view and club level)

BW - 1 bedroom garden/pool view available

BR - 1 bedroom available

BLT - 1 bedroom lake view available (there was no change in 1 BR lake view, theme park view went down, standard view went up)

Poly - 2 BR bungalow available

BC - no availability for full week

CCV - no availability for full week

So based on my biased random sample, it does seem the 1 bedrooms book up last. So this blows my theory that DVC increased the 1 BR points so studio demand does not move to relatively “cheap” 1 BRs if they had kept 1 BR points the same.

However, perhaps DVC is trying to equalize demand across view categories and room size, not just room size. For example, VGF 1 BR lake view and BW 1 BR lake view are usually the last to book. I thought the BLT 1 BR theme park view was overpriced before so glad they lowered this one.


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## Dean (Dec 23, 2018)

TravelTime said:


> I just did a search for Memorial Day week for 7N.
> 
> Availability
> 
> ...


I suspect this will shift a % of reservations to the 2 BR that were previously in a 1 BR or studio for 5 or 6 people.


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## SueDonJ (Dec 26, 2018)

I'm always surprised by the claims that "DVC is the best timeshare company because they're not a timeshare company like every other timeshare company." 

It was the first timeshare company I looked into because I'm as much a Disney freak as anybody but Don's not so we didn't buy there. In all my years of reading, though, since long before we bought anything, there have been periods where Disney did (legally) what they needed to do in order to protect the company regardless of how it impacted owners. These latest adjustments in the points charts are certainly not as egregious as what happened in the beginning days of BLT, when adjustments were made very soon after home resort points had started selling but occupancy hadn't begun. If I'm remembering correctly, that was the reason DVC lowered the minimum number of direct-purchase points, because without another purchase many new owners at BLT couldn't use their brand-new purchases to book what they had expected to be able to book when the resort subsequently opened!


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## Dean (Dec 26, 2018)

SueDonJ said:


> I'm always surprised by the claims that "DVC is the best timeshare company because they're not a timeshare company like every other timeshare company."
> 
> It was the first timeshare company I looked into because I'm as much a Disney freak as anybody but Don's not so we didn't buy there. In all my years of reading, though, since long before we bought anything, there have been periods where Disney did (legally) what they needed to do in order to protect the company regardless of how it impacted owners. These latest adjustments in the points charts are certainly not as egregious as what happened in the beginning days of BLT, when adjustments were made very soon after home resort points had started selling but occupancy hadn't begun. If I'm remembering correctly, that was the reason DVC lowered the minimum number of direct-purchase points, because without another purchase many new owners at BLT couldn't use their brand-new purchases to book what they had expected to be able to book when the resort subsequently opened!


Legally they didn't have to but IIRC they reallocated after sales started and before BLT opened.  They gave owners the choice of canceling or doing odd sized add ons.  While not required, it was the right thing to do in the situation.


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## nomoretslt (Dec 26, 2018)

Dean said:


> Legally they didn't have to but IIRC they reallocated after sales started and before BLT opened.  They gave owners the choice of canceling or doing odd sized add ons.  While not required, it was the right thing to do in the situation.



We bought direct BLT before it opened and I don't remember any of this!  We originally bought BLT with the intention of staying in a Theme park view studio every other year (we already had contracts at 3 other resorts).  After our first stay, we visited our guide and added on because we loved the resort but found the studio way too small for the two of us.  We usually stay in  one-bedrooms but didn't want to spend too much on BLT...

DVC was an excellent purchase for us .... over 20 years as members and have sold and added on.  We could make money if we decided to sell, even after having many years of great vacations.  We started out small and had barely enough points for a week in a one-bedroom....and then the reallocation of weekends and weekday points messed us up many years back.  However, we made it work by staying at a value for one night at the beginning and end...then our financial situation improved and we now have plenty of points.  This newest reallocation really does not impact us too much, but I'm not really happy about it.  Some of the anger i've seen elsewhere is over the top though.  Folks don't realize it's a timeshare....and that is all it is.  Everything else they give you as perks is gravy, though some view it as an entitlement.  Between this reallocation and the big dues increase, I forsee a big increase in resale listings.  Which in turn will bring down the cost of resale.  

I personally don't think DVC is the great value it once was; a Disney vacation is becoming more costly between park ticket increases, the large increase in dues and I predict a big increase in nonDVC resort stays too.  This new minimum wage that Disney is paying is going to have quite the ripple effect.  I used to recommend DVC....but I won't any more.  Makes me sad.


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## Dean (Dec 27, 2018)

nomoretslt said:


> We bought direct BLT before it opened and I don't remember any of this!  We originally bought BLT with the intention of staying in a Theme park view studio every other year (we already had contracts at 3 other resorts).  After our first stay, we visited our guide and added on because we loved the resort but found the studio way too small for the two of us.  We usually stay in  one-bedrooms but didn't want to spend too much on BLT...
> 
> DVC was an excellent purchase for us .... over 20 years as members and have sold and added on.  We could make money if we decided to sell, even after having many years of great vacations.  We started out small and had barely enough points for a week in a one-bedroom....and then the reallocation of weekends and weekday points messed us up many years back.  However, we made it work by staying at a value for one night at the beginning and end...then our financial situation improved and we now have plenty of points.  This newest reallocation really does not impact us too much, but I'm not really happy about it.  Some of the anger i've seen elsewhere is over the top though.  Folks don't realize it's a timeshare....and that is all it is.  Everything else they give you as perks is gravy, though some view it as an entitlement.  Between this reallocation and the big dues increase, I forsee a big increase in resale listings.  Which in turn will bring down the cost of resale.
> 
> I personally don't think DVC is the great value it once was; a Disney vacation is becoming more costly between park ticket increases, the large increase in dues and I predict a big increase in nonDVC resort stays too.  This new minimum wage that Disney is paying is going to have quite the ripple effect.  I used to recommend DVC....but I won't any more.  Makes me sad.


I wonder if you bought after they made the change but before it opened.  They didn't offer a windfall of extra points only the option to cancel or buy additional but if needed, under the 25 limit.  I doubt this will move the needle sufficiently where DVC made sense for someone before but doesn't now but it has gotten more expensive as has Disney in general.  Personally I don't get people being overly upset with DVCMC as it's clearly spelled out in the documents and everyone either knew or should have know it could happen eventually.  IMO the only weird part is the increase in 1BR points but even that I think I can understand if the goal is to increase the number of lockoff's booked as 2 BR's.


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## nomoretslt (Dec 27, 2018)

Maybe so Dean.  I do know we had to buy the minimum of 160 points I think it was, even though we were already DVC members.  We've added on there both direct and then resale.  I can't say I'm too upset about the rebalance...although they did bring on the demand for studios themselves once many of them were refurbished with the addition of the little drop down bed.  5 people in a studio in places like BWV is just too crowded.  And it makes no sense that you have sleeping surfaces for 5 in a studio but only 4 in a one-bedroom (except BLT and AKV-Kidani).  I noticed a HUGE change in a 2 BR standard view at SSR during Magic season.....53 points LESS for the week, but the preferred view is 65 MORE.  I see where people are tearing their hair out trying to figure it out.  But you are right...people need to know what they are getting into and what can happen.  But unfortunately they get swept up in the "moment" and don't really read the paperwork.  I still love my DVC and have no intention of selling right now.  And if a "fire sale" occurs, I may just do a couple of add-ons.

Panina....DVC does treat their members differently than other timeshares.  We get discounts on annual passes (and sometimes super discounts when the mother ship is feeling generous), discounts at some places to eat, discounts on  merchandise, discounts on some special events, and we able to purchase the Tables in Wonderland card that gives you 20% off at nearly every sit-down restaurant in WDW, including alcohol.  Worth it when travelling with a large group of if you visit often.  They also do these events called Membership Magic, where they close one of the parks in the evening and members get a "private" party.....although tickets are hard to get.


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## TravelTime (Dec 27, 2018)

I think DVC is one of the best timeshare companies due to customer service. For example, I bought 2 discounted annual passes for children we were planning to adopt but it fell through. When I arrived at the park, they gave us a full refund on the annual passes even though they are non refundable. At Animal Kingdom Lodge, they gave us a $85 lunch credit at the restaurant of our choice simple because the front desk person told us at 9 am that our room would be ready by 12 noon, and it was not ready. They did not need to do that since check in is not until 4 pm. I have more positive stories than negative stories with DVC. I know there are many DVC haters on TUG because it is so expensive. I think unless you are a DVC member, it is hard to understand the benefits. Exchangers are probably not treated the same way as members.


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## nomoretslt (Dec 27, 2018)

Agree with that TravelTime.  DVC treated us well during a family crisis and also went above and beyond when I lodged a concern regarding one of our rooms.  I am quite sure they keep track of chronic complainers....
Anyway, getting back to the points allocation subject, we usually go in May and October and switch home resorts...but now the theme park 1BR we like at BLT will be less points in May.  This is going to take some preplanning and getting used to.  It's not the end of the world.  For those that will be short a few points, there is the one time use points to purchase for $19 or is it $20 now per point.


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## Dean (Dec 27, 2018)

TravelTime said:


> I think DVC is one of the best timeshare companies due to customer service. For example, I bought 2 discounted annual passes for children we were planning to adopt but it fell through. When I arrived at the park, they gave us a full refund on the annual passes even though they are non refundable. At Animal Kingdom Lodge, they gave us a $85 lunch credit at the restaurant of our choice simple because the front desk person told us at 9 am that our room would be ready by 12 noon, and it was not ready. They did not need to do that since check in is not until 4 pm. I have more positive stories than negative stories with DVC. I know there are many DVC haters on TUG because it is so expensive. I think unless you are a DVC member, it is hard to understand the benefits. Exchangers are probably not treated the same way as members.


While I don't have any specific complaints for DVC, side by side Marriott and Bluegreen have treated me better in general and for service and attention while during a stay, DVC falls FAR behind consistently.  If there's something not in the unit and you call DVC, they schedule it on round and you're lucky if you get it in a hour.  For any other timeshare I can recall, it's there in 10-15 minutes with a follow up phone call to make sure it made it and all is in order.  Here are a few examples.  At Grande Ocean a couple of years ago we had an entire stove top that went out in one of our units.  It wasn't a big deal but they had to secure another, took 2-3 hours total.  Even though we kept assuring them it wasn't an issue (had 6 other units, didn't need it at the moment) they kept apologizing and ent a bottle of wine as well as several follow up phone calls.  Same trip one of our group posted a review on facebook about how great the resort was, the resort staff saw it and send a gift basket.  At the Aruba Surf Club last trip 3 years ago the AC in the studio side went out.  They worked for hours but couldn't get it fixed, set up a portable unit without being asked (work great BTW) and came back the next morning and spent hours more including the supervisor coming in on his day off (either Saturday or Sunday).  The only complaint I can think of with Marriott wasn't service but rather the resort itself, KBC.  Marriott also does much better and is more consistent with villa assignments while DVC has changed checkin from 4 pm till "after 4 pm) and taken away any system structure for assignment when it used to be by when the reservation was made.


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## bnoble (Dec 28, 2018)

Dean said:


> Here are a few examples.


In contrast, I had a dishwasher die at DVC's Beach Club Villas several years ago. It took two days to get it replaced, with dirty water fermenting in the bottom of the unit.


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## SueDonJ (Dec 28, 2018)

nomoretslt said:


> ... Panina....DVC does treat their members differently than other timeshares.  We get discounts on annual passes (and sometimes super discounts when the mother ship is feeling generous), discounts at some places to eat, discounts on  merchandise, discounts on some special events, and we able to purchase the Tables in Wonderland card that gives you 20% off at nearly every sit-down restaurant in WDW, including alcohol.  Worth it when travelling with a large group of if you visit often.  They also do these events called Membership Magic, where they close one of the parks in the evening and members get a "private" party.....although tickets are hard to get.



There is no doubt at all that DVC offers a more inclusive experience than any other timeshare company but that's due to the nature of the Disney beast rather than anything they do above and beyond the other companies. It can't be ignored that no other timeshare company is tied into a sprawling theme park complex that means you never have to step foot off-property for anything, or that any other company has as much of an obligation to corporate to keep their guests spending their money inside the property line rather than outside!

But they are not alone in offering discounts or special events to their guests. Marriott does it, albeit on a smaller scale, but at every Marriott timeshare resort I've visited they've offered guest- or owner-only activities on the weekly schedule, and most give out a list of outside vendors which offer discounted dining/recreation options that you get just by showing your key card. For example, Hilton Head Island is smaller than Disney World by far but the list of discounts with vendors all over the island is always at least a page long and usually two.

Like I said, I'm a Disney freak while Don is not. I love Disney World and could happily go over and over and over while he will not. I am the captive audience that DVC is marketed to while Don will never be. All that to say that I'm not just criticizing DVC because I don't "get" the allure. I do get it, but I pay for it through cash stays or owner rentals. Honestly, in my opinion the DVC timeshare units themselves are not as well-appointed or well-kept as some other timeshares, and I agree with Dean that the famed excellent Disney customer service doesn't always extend from the theme parks to the lodging facilities.


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## blondietink (Dec 28, 2018)

WE own both DVC and Sheraton/Westin timeshares.  I have found that DVC is excellent at service as are the Westin resorts. Our stays at Sheraton timeshare have been ok, but nothing to write home about.  Usually for the Sheraton, we are there simply for a place to sleep and it fits the bill.  I'm not wasting my time or money exploring and using a timeshare in Florida when I am busy in the parks.  If we want a day off, then maybe I would enjoy them more.  Westin are usually places like Hawaii, Mexico, etc., so our stays there are for entirely different reasons than a Florida stay. They all have their plus and minuses, but I will say we have never had an issue with our stays at Lagunamar in Mexico and the service there is top notch.


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## Dean (Dec 28, 2018)

bnoble said:


> In contrast, I had a dishwasher die at DVC's Beach Club Villas several years ago. It took two days to get it replaced, with dirty water fermenting in the bottom of the unit.


Unfortunately I've seen a number of reports of similar issues for DVC including multiple calls and no one ever showing up.  I haven't had a specific problem but side by side DVC does the on site stuff poorly comparatively speaking.


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## blondietink (Dec 28, 2018)

We had a problem with our dishwasher at BLT in October, so I called guest services at 10 pm Sunday night.  I told them there was no rush to fix it, but Bob the maintenance guy stopped by 20 minutes later and got it fixed right away.


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## TravelTime (Dec 28, 2018)

Here is a back to back comparison. I stayed at Marriott Ko Olina and at Aulani, both 1 BR OV. I loved them both for different reasons. There was no difference in service that I noticed. We did not have problems at either location. We are MVC and DVC members and both are home resorts. Both got crowded by mid day and it was hard to find a shady area to sit by noon.

Marriott Ko Olina
Pros: Bigger rooms, bigger property with more common area space, beautiful ocean view from a high floor, great value
Cons: No theming, few onsite restaurants

Aulani
Pros: Nicer rooms with better finishes and real woods, great theming in the rooms and throughout the resort, beautiful ocean view from high floor, across the street from the mall so easy to eat offsite and buy groceries, a little bit of Disney magic in the islands with character appearances
Cons: More expensive
Potential future con?: Next to Atlantis, may become more crowded in the lagoon area?

We were in the top floor (16th floor) at Aulani with the most spectacular view. While the view was excellent at both, the room we stayed in at Aulani was much nicer due to the theming, finishes and more direct ocean view than the room at MKO (10th floor, slightly angled ocean view).

We loved this trip so much that we are repeating it with another split stay over Thanksgiving 2019. This time, we got a 2BR ocean view exchange into MKO. So from a cost perspective, MKO is hands down a better value. I am sure we will enjoy both resorts again.

There was no change in the 2020 points chart for Aulani.


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## ljmiii (Dec 28, 2018)

TravelTime said:


> I think DVC is one of the best timeshare companies due to customer service...





Dean said:


> While I don't have any specific complaints for DVC, side by side Marriott and Bluegreen have treated me better in general and for service and attention while during a stay, DVC falls FAR behind consistently...


I had never really focused on the customer service aspect of DVC before and after reading these and other posts realized I've never stayed anywhere that had such a huge disparity between the quality of their 'front end' and 'back end' service.

I've had the front desk and concierge shower us with 'pixie dust' many times. The most notable during a recent trip where my mom unfortunately became ill, had to go to the hospital, and a few days later returned to WDW in a wheelchair and was now accompanied by my dad (who in a massive case of bad timing decided to let her go 'alone' with us for the first time because he didn't want to do Disney yet again). And the concierge did magic with ADRs and Fastpasses and 'handicapped' accommodations to make it all work out so my mom (and the rest of us) could have as wonderful a time as possible under the circumstances. In short, DVC's 'front end' customer service can rival that of a fine European hotel.

On the other hand, good luck getting something you need out of the housekeeping or even engineering staff. We've had stuff stay broken for days, items on the 'list' remain missing, and supplies go unreplenished despite multiple calls. At this point we just vulture off the carts.


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## TravelTime (Dec 28, 2018)

ljmiii said:


> I had never really focused on the customer service aspect of DVC before and after reading these and other posts realized I've never stayed anywhere that had such a huge disparity between the quality of their 'front end' and 'back end' service.
> 
> I've had the front desk and concierge shower us with 'pixie dust' many times. The most notable during a recent trip where my mom unfortunately became ill, had to go to the hospital, and a few days later returned to WDW in a wheelchair and was now accompanied by my dad (who in a massive case of bad timing decided to let her go 'alone' with us for the first time because he didn't want to do Disney yet again). And the concierge did magic with ADRs and Fastpasses and 'handicapped' accommodations to make it all work out so my mom (and the rest of us) could have as wonderful a time as possible under the circumstances. In short, DVC's 'front end' customer service can rival that of a fine European hotel.
> 
> On the other hand, good luck getting something you need out of the housekeeping or even engineering staff. We've had stuff stay broken for days, items on the 'list' remain missing, and supplies go unreplenished despite multiple calls. At this point we just vulture off the carts.



That is a good point. I have not had problems at a DVC resort. When I commented that I think DVC has the best customer service, I am commenting on their front end service at the resorts as well as the telephone service when booking resorts. Next time I go to MKO and Aulani, I will do a back to back comparison by reporting some type of housekeeping issue and see what kind of response I get from each company.


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## Dean (Dec 28, 2018)

ljmiii said:


> I had never really focused on the customer service aspect of DVC before and after reading these and other posts realized I've never stayed anywhere that had such a huge disparity between the quality of their 'front end' and 'back end' service.
> 
> I've had the front desk and concierge shower us with 'pixie dust' many times. The most notable during a recent trip where my mom unfortunately became ill, had to go to the hospital, and a few days later returned to WDW in a wheelchair and was now accompanied by my dad (who in a massive case of bad timing decided to let her go 'alone' with us for the first time because he didn't want to do Disney yet again). And the concierge did magic with ADRs and Fastpasses and 'handicapped' accommodations to make it all work out so my mom (and the rest of us) could have as wonderful a time as possible under the circumstances. In short, DVC's 'front end' customer service can rival that of a fine European hotel.
> 
> On the other hand, good luck getting something you need out of the housekeeping or even engineering staff. We've had stuff stay broken for days, items on the 'list' remain missing, and supplies go unreplenished despite multiple calls. At this point we just vulture off the carts.


They are often scary flexible but unfortunately dramatically inconsistent in such areas.  They will bend and break their rules at every turn and often return points when it's inappropriate.  Then the next person in the same situation, nothing.  For example, they had a couple of back to back refurbishment situation with AKV where they had to relocate upcoming guests.  One of these was for the concierge where guests had booked at 11 months out as a once in a lifetime option.  DVC left it up to AKL and by the time they got around to getting things done, there was nothing left but mostly SSR.  Some got free dining plan and a return of more than the difference between the 2 options, others just got the difference in points returned and nothing else and I'm sure a lot of in between.  As I said, I'm not complaining only comparing my experiences and information.  Side by side DVC does poorly while one is in the unit in my experience of owning 24 years and Marriott almost as long.


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## nomoretslt (Jan 8, 2019)

And on the offsite timeshare that I recently "gave back" to Diamond resorts, we had no airconditioning and no wifi for more than two days during a very hot Labor Day week.  Fortunately we were staying at a studio at BWV for one of those nights, as I was able to get into a Moonlight Magic event at AK.  The person I was with was blown away with BoardWalk Villas...mind you we were in a studio as compared to a two bedroom duplex.  Could not get over how beautiful it was and how nice it was to walk to Epcot and Hollywood Studios.  I can't believe how much we were able to cram into that one night visit.  Really made me realize how much time was wasted driving back and forth from the other place and really made me appreciate my DVC that much more.  I was so happy to give back that other place!!  I've never had experience with any other timeshares other than that one, though. And really don't have any big complaints about DVC.  I do have issues with people that pile up their pizza boxes and garbage outside their door instead of taking to the trash room.


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## littlestar (Jan 9, 2019)

I am seeing chatter on various forums from folks glad they never bought into DVC because they thought the points were pretty much set. If they raised it here, it went down there. Also questions on whether a reallocation between villa sizes for non lockoff’s is allowed.


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## TravelTime (Jan 9, 2019)

littlestar said:


> I am seeing chatter on various forums from folks glad they never bought into DVC because they thought the points were pretty much set. If they raised it here, it went down there. Also questions on whether a reallocation between villa sizes for non lockoff’s is allowed.



It is disclosed when you purchase that the points are not set. The totals are set but within categories, they can change. This is not different than any other timeshare. Marriott and others have the same rule. I am perplexed as to why people think the DVC point chart will never vary within category. Also the changes within categories changed by 0-3 points at most. I guess if someone bought a small contract simply to stay in studios, this may affect them. They should sell their contracts if they are so upset. They can get all their money back and move on.


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## TravelTime (Jan 9, 2019)

I have noticed that people are snapping up DVC contracts right now. A month ago, there was a record number of people selling contracts and they are almost all gone.

There is also a rumor that Disney is increasing the buy in costs for the original 14 resorts. If true, this will be another huge price increase. This will may cause resale prices for the 14 to increase.


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## ljmiii (Jan 9, 2019)

TravelTime said:


> There is also a rumor that Disney is increasing the buy in costs for the original 14 resorts. If true, this will be another huge price increase. This will may cause resale prices for the 14 to increase.


It certainly happened for VGC last year - the direct price went up $50 and resale prices skyrocketed.


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## TravelTime (Jan 9, 2019)

ljmiii said:


> It certainly happened for VGC last year - the direct price went up $50 and resale prices skyrocketed.



This is the rumor from mouseowners.com:

VGC to $260pp
VGF to $245pp
Poly to $235pp
BLT to $220pp
BWV to $190pp
AKV to $176pp
SSR to $160pp

Supposedly the guides are releasing information informally. It seems multiple people have heard this from their guides. I hope this means resale prices will increase or hold steady so I can easily sell my contracts some day.


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## Dean (Jan 9, 2019)

littlestar said:


> I am seeing chatter on various forums from folks glad they never bought into DVC because they thought the points were pretty much set. If they raised it here, it went down there. Also questions on whether a reallocation between villa sizes for non lockoff’s is allowed.


This isn't the first time it's happened but it's the first time like this.  They lowered THV and raised others at SSR back when.  Some think it's not allowed and there has been wording posted that points for a "unit" must balance, different wording that points for a "vacation home" must balance and a third wording that it's by resort.  All the legal paperwork I have puts it by resort which is the one feasible way they could make any changes.  Under FL law lockout's are counted as the full unit unless the developer designates otherwise and the POS for DVC puts it by full unit not locked off.  Legally it's just a rearrangement but for those looking at smaller units, it's an increase in many cases.  Technically allowed but not good for them.


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