# Just bought EOD 5800 pts retail.......Pacific Palisades



## Mpstan (Jun 14, 2012)

and at end of presentation we were thinking of going to 5800 pts  yearly (just short of $20K) to get 10,000 bonus points.    Basically 1 gold week 1 bedroom, for roughly $19,000.      We rented a week at Pallisades, hence the presentation.  

We were aware of the secondary market but were led to believe that there were serious disadvantages  to this route.   Other than missing out on Elite rewards are there ny other problems?      Also not sure we would use a kitchen enough to go the condo route.    We really like the San Diego area; may need to consider programs offering more luxury hotel like venues...

Based on recent ROFR, how much have we overpaid?         What's the recision period in CA?

Other thoughts?


Thanks everyone


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## ThierryJapan (Jun 14, 2012)

*Elite*

Elite starts at 14000 points, elite is good if you travel a lot and also use Hilton hotel 

Now I am sure you can find your week for less than 2000 usd on the resale market. But what is the most important is the maintenance fees that you will have to pay for many years,  I am not sure how much it wil be in your resort but you should look at the efficiency of maintenance fees cost per points you have

I have bought from the developers and buying from resale, but it comes down how much you are ready to pay in mf vs renting

And as many will say, maybe you should buy resale


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## amtuguser (Jun 14, 2012)

IMHO read your contract, follow the rescission rules exactly, buy resale, and use the saved money on anything else.

Live happily ever after.


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## Talent312 (Jun 14, 2012)

amtuguser said:


> IMHO read, your contract, follow the rescission rules exactly, buy resale, and use the saved money on anything else.



I concur.  HGVC is generally a consumer friendly system ('cept for its clunky reservation system), but its TS salesmen are sharks. As the saying goes: "How do you know a TS salesman is lying? ... His lips are moving."

OTOH, you may be one of those fortunate souls who has money to burn, so hey, whatever floats your boat. But I must ask, what is "EOD?" Is it anything like "EOY?"


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## channimal (Jun 14, 2012)

Other than the elite benefits there are zero issues buying/owning resale.  I wish I had known then what I know now  

Rescind and shop around.


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## Mpstan (Jun 14, 2012)

*But....*

Doesn't the location of where you bought your points have bearing on where you can reserve 12 months ahead, as opposed to 9 months for all other properties? * * *If you buy resale points and commingle them. How does that work? *

Also, if anyone can recommend brokers that are well versed in the San Diego/Carlsbad markets that would be helpful......   We do love the area and are willing to commit to a TS but obviously have more to learn.....

thank you again


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## Passepartout (Jun 14, 2012)

It is my understanding that the MF is based on the location of the owned resort. And that 'points are points' when it comes down to reservations.

Seth Nock and Judy K (here in TUG) are the most reputable HGVC resale brokers you could ask for. fairest prices and experience with shepherding them through ROFR.

It's your money, but for me, getting the same thing for $2k-$4k that the developer wants $20k for is not chump change. For the price difference, I can imagine a lot of 'status' while sitting on the patio with a glass of something cold and refreshing.

I advise rescission now. If, after studying the alternatives at leisure, you still want to buy retail, that deal will still be available. You just will be making an informed, rather than a rushed decision.

All the Best

Jim Ricks


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## Remy (Jun 14, 2012)

Talent312 said:


> I concur.  HGVC is generally a consumer friendly system ('cept for its clunky reservation system), but its TS salesmen are sharks. As the saying goes: "How do you know a TS salesman is lying? ... His lips are moving."
> 
> OTOH, you may be one of those fortunate souls who has money to burn, so hey, whatever floats your boat. But I must ask, what is "EOD?" Is it anything like "EOY?"



EOD = Every Other Decade?

I think we should all come up with a copy/paste for rescission advice. It all ends up the same anyway: Rescind. Read more on TUG and other sources. Buy resale if HGVC works for you. Paying retail makes no sense (unless it's a platinum and you plan on immediately selling it to me for pennies on the dollar).


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## Mpstan (Jun 14, 2012)

*EOD  Stands for every other day; meant EOY*

Sorry for the typo.    Will try contacting the two recommended people via their usernames (if that's what they are)


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## Passepartout (Jun 14, 2012)

I can't vouch for JudyK's username, but Seth Nock is his. Here's a link to his website from his profile: http://www.sellingtimeshares.net/ I think they work together from what I gather.

Jim


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## DeniseM (Jun 14, 2012)

Mpstan said:


> Sorry for the typo.    Will try contacting the two recommended people via their usernames (if that's what they are)



Honestly, you don't want to do anything to delay rescinding - these folks are reputable brokers, but you don't need a broker today - you need to RESCIND today! 

Right now, comb through your paperwork and follow the instructions to rescind without delay.  If you miss the deadline by just one day, you will be stuck.

Here is an article about rescinding - I wrote it for another resort, but all the basics apply to you - http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74493


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## Remy (Jun 14, 2012)

Passepartout said:


> I can't vouch for JudyK's username, but Seth Nock is his. Here's a link to his website from his profile: http://www.sellingtimeshares.net/ I think they work together from what I gather.
> 
> Jim



I don't think they work together in the sense it's the same firm. In the sense they're both real estate agents who will take commissions from a buyer and a seller, yes.


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## Passepartout (Jun 14, 2012)

Remy said:


> I don't think they work together in the sense it's the same firm. In the sense they're both real estate agents who will take commissions from a buyer and a seller, yes.



I was not exactly sure whether or not there was a relationship, only that both have good reports here in TUG for fair dealings.

Jim


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## gnorth16 (Jun 14, 2012)

Remy said:


> I don't think they work together in the sense it's the same firm. In the sense they're both real estate agents who will take commissions from a buyer and a seller, yes.



If either agent doesn't have what you are looking for, they can either go to MLS or HGVC resale and check out their inventory.  When I bought (through a non Seth/Judy agent) I believe they went to HGVC resale for inventory.


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## csxjohn (Jun 14, 2012)

Mpstan said:


> and at end of presentation we were thinking of going to 5800 pts  yearly (just short of $20K) to get 10,000 bonus points.    Basically 1 gold week 1 bedroom, for roughly $19,000.      We rented a week at Pallisades, hence the presentation.
> 
> We were aware of the secondary market but were led to believe that there were serious disadvantages  to this route.   Other than missing out on Elite rewards are there ny other problems?      Also not sure we would use a kitchen enough to go the condo route.    We really like the San Diego area; may need to consider programs offering more luxury hotel like venues...
> 
> ...



The thing to remember about rescinding is that no one on this forum will tell you that you got a good deal and don't rescind.

Take the advise you've been given and act immediately if not sooner.  Then, as has been suggested, you can go back and get the exact deal later if that's what you decide.


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## SmithOp (Jun 14, 2012)

Mpstan said:


> and at end of presentation we were thinking of going to 5800 pts  yearly (just short of $20K) to get 10,000 bonus points.    Basically 1 gold week 1 bedroom, for roughly $19,000.      We rented a week at Pallisades, hence the presentation.
> 
> We were aware of the secondary market but were led to believe that there were serious disadvantages  to this route.   Other than missing out on Elite rewards are there ny other problems?      Also not sure we would use a kitchen enough to go the condo route.    We really like the San Diego area; may need to consider programs offering more luxury hotel like venues...
> 
> ...



GPP has a resale department, were these resale prices or were they selling you a new unit at MarBrisa?  TheWizz on here has purchased resale units direct from GPP and got them into HGVC with elite credit if that is important to you.  Owning here gives you 12 month booking and day use (parking and common areas), useful if you live in CA..


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## rgong (Jun 14, 2012)

*In case you didn't get the message ... RESCIND!*



Remy said:


> I think we should all come up with a copy/paste for rescission advice. It all ends up the same anyway: Rescind. Read more on TUG and other sources. Buy resale if HGVC works for you.



Agreed, we need a sticky.



> Paying retail makes no sense (unless it's a platinum and you plan on immediately selling it to me for pennies on the dollar).



'Cept you'd never see it since Hilton would jump in and buy it back  

I believe Judi K's user name on tug is Judi Kozlowski and her website is judikoz.com. Do a search on her site, she probably has some GPP listings. At least she did about a year ago when I was in the resale market.


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## Remy (Jun 14, 2012)

ThierryJapan said:


> Elite starts at 14000 points, elite is good if you travel a lot and also use Hilton hotel



I can agree Diamond (or Gold) in the Hilton HHonors system is good and very useful to me as a frequent traveler, but to pay the enormous markup for an HGVC unit (or two to get 14,000 points) just to get Gold HHonors status isn't a good value. HHonors Gold starts at 16 stays per year so a frequent traveler would already have this status without paying the enormous markup. A non-frequent traveler would be better off paying for breakfast and internet for two lifetimes of traveling 15 stays or less per year rather than paying the HGVC retail markup. I'd even suggest mattress runs would be less expensive to achieve and hold this status over paying the extra money to HGVC for 14,000 points. To give you an idea of the markup, the "best" HGVC could do on a Karen Ave. Vegas unit was $38,500 just a few months ago. That's for 7,000 points. The same unit would sell resale for $12,500 and beat ROFR without a problem. That's $26,000 difference for 7,000 points. Multiply by two to get 14,000 points at a $52,000 markup over resale. For $52,000 one can buy a lot of really nice perks at a Hilton, Conrad or Waldorf Hotel. And the paid-for perks are guaranteed. Room upgrades with status are not guaranteed.

Here's what Elite gets you:

Elite
14,000 ClubPoints

- Gold HHonors status
 * 25% bonus on HHonors base points
 * complimentary internet
 * bonus points or
 * space-available room upgrades
 * free breakfast
- $39 online HGVClub reservation fee (instead of $49)
- 10% Open Season cash discount
- Priority and exclusive resort access
- No reservation fee for 7-night stays during Club and Open Season reservation periods at any Hilton Grand Vacations resort
- Special resort access with 12 month reservation window
- Direct 800 number
- Special Elite Member check-in desk at select Hilton Grand Vacations resorts
- Elite designated door key


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## DeniseM (Jun 14, 2012)

Remy said:


> EOD = Every Other Decade?
> 
> I think we should all come up with a copy/paste for rescission advice.



Like the one in post #11?


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## MikeinSoCal (Jun 14, 2012)

rgong said:


> Do a search on her site, she probably has some GPP listings.


Most of those listings on her site are quite old and no longer valid.


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## Remy (Jun 14, 2012)

MikeinSoCal said:


> Most of those listings on her site are quite old and no longer valid.



Seth keeps his internal listings updated at sellingtimeshares.net. You'll find many realtors use the same system as Judi K so they aren't all her listings (sort of an MLS). I'm sure she keeps her stuff updated but others may not be as diligent, or place something as for sale to generate interest from a prospective buyer who the agent might sell on something else. If you look at the bottom of the listing on her site you'll see who the listing broker is for the unit.


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## DavidVanNorman (Jun 15, 2012)

Passepartout said:


> I can't vouch for JudyK's username, but Seth Nock is his. Here's a link to his website from his profile: http://www.sellingtimeshares.net/ I think they work together from what I gather.
> 
> Jim



Hi,

My name is David Van Norman, and I work for Seth Nock at Selling Timeshares, Inc. just wanted to state that Judy is actually from another firm and thank you so much for recommending Seth!

Our About Us page shows all names of our agents. http://www.sellingtimeshares.net/selling-timeshares/about-us/

David Van Norman
Selling Timeshares, Inc.
david@sellingtimeshares.net


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## hsintang (Jun 15, 2012)

DeniseM said:


> Honestly, you don't want to do anything to delay rescinding - you need to RESCIND today!
> 
> I "bought" a TS week from a developer ~15 years ago.  There was no smart phone then, but I found TUG after I 'researched' online after I got back to my room.  I RESCINDed the next day through a certified mail and was never regret.  Tug had been one of the best resources for my timesharing experiences since


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## Mpstan (Jun 15, 2012)

Yes we have finished the rescind paperwork.     CA must make them supply a cover sheet that is quite easy to complete.   I like the advice earlier for our next step.... Do nothing.    

We're back to the drawing board.     Our kids were a bit bored around the resort so I think we want to widen our scope to include being nearer beaches or a downtown.     Anybody here familiar with the Wyndam system?   A few more venues up by us in in Washington......


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## Passepartout (Jun 15, 2012)

Living in Washington State, I can't imagine any TS system than could work better for you than WorldMark. www.wmowners.com Another choice might be Club Intrawest http://www.clubintrawest.com/public/en/where/where.asp or to a slightly lesser degree Vacations Internationale And here are their resorts: http://www.viresorts.com/resorts/resortLocations.html

So there are a few choices worth considering.

All the best. Glad you got the rescission letter off. You will be too.

Jim


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## Mpstan (Jun 15, 2012)

Yes we are familiar with Worldmark but we want to find o home resort in the SanDiego area, since we now have direct flights there from Bellingham WA.   Maybe there are some nicer Worldmark resorts but I'm only familiar with our local property in birch bay WA which I don't care for.     That's how we came up with HIlton and Windahm.    

Thanks for all the input


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## whatsburning (Jun 15, 2012)

Remy said:


> I don't think they work together in the sense it's the same firm. In the sense they're both real estate agents who will take commissions from a buyer and a seller, yes.



I thought only sellers pay commissions???


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## Remy (Jun 15, 2012)

whatsburning said:


> I thought only sellers pay commissions???



Uh, they'll charge a commission, one as the agent for the seller and one as the agent of the buyer. If you read their sales contract it is upwards of 25% when two agents are involved.


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## chriskre (Jun 15, 2012)

whatsburning said:


> I thought only sellers pay commissions???



Anybody can pay a commission.  It depends on what you are selling and in what market you are selling in.  TS's are not a traditional real estate sale.


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## GTLINZ (Jun 15, 2012)

Mpstan said:


> Yes we have finished the rescind paperwork.     CA must make them supply a cover sheet that is quite easy to complete.   I like the advice earlier for our next step.... Do nothing.
> 
> We're back to the drawing board.     Our kids were a bit bored around the resort so I think we want to widen our scope to include being nearer beaches or a downtown.     Anybody here familiar with the Wyndam system?   A few more venues up by us in in Washington......



You have done the right thing. But please do not give up on the HGVC system - we are extremely pleased with ours - it is a great system and problem the most flexible.  

As others have said, you could buy the same thing reasonably cheap on the resale market. One of the main things that affect the resale value of your unit is the season - 5800 is a 3br in gold season (most owners know the points value and season). You pay Maint Fees based on the unit size. A 1br plat is 4800 points while a 3br silver is 4200 - but the 3br has much higher MFs. You get the idea. Gold season (any unit size) is far cheaper than platinum. Silver is almost "given away".

Our favorite feature is open season. You get great cash rates for anything left over 30 days out.

So if you are anywhere near an HGVC location you like (and variety is the HGVC weakness) then I would strongly urge you to consider buying a platinum season unit. You will find the quality to be a different level (Marriott, Hyatt and HGVC are another level of CONSISTENCY IMHO).


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## alwaysOnTheGo (Jun 16, 2012)

GTLINZ said:


> So if you are anywhere near an HGVC location you like (and variety is the HGVC weakness) then I would strongly urge you to consider buying a platinum season unit. You will find the quality to be a different level (Marriott, Hyatt and HGVC are another level of CONSISTENCY IMHO).



I sat through a sales presentation last week in Orlando, ( did not buy ), but have become interested in the resale market.  I'm still trying to wrap my head around the nuances of the point system.

I've read other posts that basically state "points are points" no matter what season.  At that point, when looking at resales I no longer pay attention to the season.

With that being said, what would be the advantage(s) of points from a platinum season unit vs a gold season?  I am in NC, but we travel to Orlando and Vegas often.

Thanks,

Kevin


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## Mpstan (Jun 16, 2012)

Having a Platinum TS would have the same MF's as Gold, correct?    

Would Platinum points convert into more HHonors points in an exchange?

I'm sure those points in an exchange would be worth more to RCI since they could use them for an RCI client in peak season, buti don't know if that converts to higher point value compared to Gold when you try to trade points for something in the RCI system.....

Other than that I'm not sure what the answer is to your question.......   Thanks for the question.     I'm sure someone here knows for sure....


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## chriskre (Jun 16, 2012)

alwaysOnTheGo said:


> With that being said, what would be the advantage(s) of points from a platinum season unit vs a gold season?  I am in NC, but we travel to Orlando and Vegas often.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Kevin



Kevin, the advantage would be that you'd have more points to trade with for the same MF's in platinum season than you would in a lesser season.  Depends on why you want to own HGVC in the first place.  I own gold points but use the heck out of the Open Season options so don't miss the points but then I live in FL where many of the HGVC resorts are located so I can max the usage that way without obligating myself to higher MF's.


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## alwaysOnTheGo (Jun 17, 2012)

chriskre said:


> Kevin, the advantage would be that you'd have more points to trade with for the same MF's in platinum season than you would in a lesser season.  Depends on why you want to own HGVC in the first place.  I own gold points but use the heck out of the Open Season options so don't miss the points but then I live in FL where many of the HGVC resorts are located so I can max the usage that way without obligating myself to higher MF's.



Thank You.  I do believe that I "get it" now.  Looking at the resale listings, I now notice the correlation between the season, MF, and amount of points on the listing.


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## bosco0633 (Jun 19, 2012)

I love Judi.  I have purchased several units from her.  1 800 541-5666 ex 622.  She is excellent and creates an easy resale.  

Don't forget to rescind properly or you will be stuck with an overpaid unit.  

You should look into the marbrisa it is a better place in my opinion.  


Good luck


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## Mpstan (Jun 19, 2012)

In our paperwork there was a rescind form we used.    UPS emailed me yesterday that they signed for my rescind, so I think we are OK.       I'll feel better when I see a refund on my visa.    Thanks everyone


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## TheWizz (Jun 19, 2012)

SmithOp said:


> GPP has a resale department, were these resale prices or were they selling you a new unit at MarBrisa?  TheWizz on here has purchased resale units direct from GPP and got them into HGVC with elite credit if that is important to you.  Owning here gives you 12 month booking and day use (parking and common areas), useful if you live in CA..




I am very happy with my GPP resales (significantly < retail) - about the same price as HGVC LV properties and you can get Elite benes (as noted) included when you buy from their resale department.  I bought a 1BR PLT and a 2BR PLT week (~14k pts).  Highly recommended...  Good luck in the hunt.


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## travelguy (Jun 20, 2012)

Mpstan said:


> Yes we have finished the rescind paperwork.     CA must make them supply a cover sheet that is quite easy to complete.   I like the advice earlier for our next step.... Do nothing.
> 
> We're back to the drawing board.     Our kids were a bit bored around the resort so I think we want to widen our scope to include being nearer beaches or a downtown.     Anybody here familiar with the Wyndam system?   A few more venues up by us in in Washington......



Congrats on actually rescinding!!  Great decision.  _(You'd be surprised how many people don't take the rescind advice and regret the decision thereafter.)

_My advice is to take your time and determine how to get exactly what will work for you at a good value price.  As has been stated above ... either Seth or Judy will give you good advice and can get you a competitively priced resale!


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