# Does SFX service border on fraud- your experiences?



## Cayuga (Feb 15, 2007)

Yes...I have reached this level of frustration with the service of SFX Resorts!! I was excited about being "accepted" into their "exclusive" community three years ago, but looking back, overall it has been a big disappointment.

The basic SFX model is that you give them something very valuable (premium weeks) and they provide premium exchanges in return. My experiences have been one long litany of little to no communication (which has been most frustrating part for me!!), no exchange opportunities offered, and eventual bonus and regular weeks that expire because of this lack of availability!! To avoid this, one must give them more deposits to get an extension which starts the whole frustrating cycle over again.

I don't know why SFX exhange weeks should ever expire if they can't come up with exchanges for their clients. Afterall, we all gave them something of great value which they have used!! I feel like, at least in my case, they have stretched the process out until my exchange weeks have expired and they no longer are obligated to try anymore!!

I know RCI and the others operate on similar principles. However, SFX marketing gives this illusion that they have special connections and opportunities unlike the other exchange institutions. Also, there is no transparency. One cannot search their system at all!!! Their inventory is all "kept close to their breasts" so to speak and doled out in some vague and selective way. On this board, it appears a few people are favored in some manner , while others are simply used as fodder or pawns in a system that resembles some kind of shell game!! 

I've asked for stuff for over a year. Eventually, to test their sincerity, I asked for an exchange in the very place which they claim to be their "strength". Again, no communication for months (except for those useless auto messages) and no possibilities!!

If I sound a bit annoyed, I am!! This so-called premium exchange service is at best, in my opinion, a form of big pimping!


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## falmouth3 (Feb 15, 2007)

*Generally I've been quite happy with SFX*

I've gotten exact matches for 2 of 3 requests.  Still waiting for the 3rd.

Sue


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## BocaBum99 (Feb 15, 2007)

Weeks exchange systems count on a good percentage of depositers to get "nothing" for their exchanges.  How else can they balance the books?  You just are one of those weeks donors.  How else can they offer bonus weeks to others?  The system has to balance.  One week in, one week out.  If someone takes out 2 or 3 weeks for each deposit, then inevitably others are getting nothing.  That's just the way it is set up to work.

Some of this is offset by developer weeks and maybe even the exchange rents some weeks to put back in.  But the reality is that many people who put in a week into an exchange company gets nothing in return.


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## regatta333 (Feb 15, 2007)

i joined in June of last year and put in a request for London for May '08.  The guide I spoke with at the time seemed optimistic that I'd be able to get a match since I was requesting nearly 2 years in advance.  She said that since no one else had a request in for that location and time period, I would get priority over anything that became available, even over Platinum members since it works according to who requested first.  I was also encouraged by the fact that some members here had been able to exchange through them to London and I've seen Sloane Garden Club units on their sell-off lists.

I know it is still early, but since my deposit expires in August '08, that doesn't leave me a lot of flexibility if I fail to get a match.  In October, I updated my request to include a range of dates in Oct '07 and asked if they could send me a list of anything they had available in Europe for these time frames.  No response to my email.

I called them in January to ask what they had available for October and the only areas they had were Mexico and Hawaii.  That (and the fact that you are unable to search their inventory) makes me question how much inventory they actually receive.

In the meantime, I keep getting bonus week and 3-for-1 offers to deposit additional weeks.  I have no interest in bonus weeks or in depositing any more of my weeks unless I know I can get an exchange I want for the week I've already deposited.


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## falmouth3 (Feb 15, 2007)

*update exchange request*

If you updated your request, you may have changed your place in line.  If you want to add dates, you should make additional requests.   That's what I did for my request for Hawaii.  SFX will only allow requests up to 18 months into the future, so I put in a request for a range of dates and then a couple of months later, I added another request for 2 more months.  Right after that, I got a call saying I had a choice of resorts and dates for the Big Island.

Depending on when you want to take your trip, you may be pleasantly surprised at what is offered to you.


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## eal (Feb 15, 2007)

I have had good luck with SFX but I don't get confirmations very early, maybe 4 to 6 months out.  Their deposits seem to arrive within a year of use, so requesting London for May 2008 would likely not get a response until after May 2007, when people are able to pay their 2008 dues, book a week, and/or deposit that week with SFX.  

I agree that their communication can be, er, "sparse', but do you call the same person each time?  The staff member who looks after Europe (I think) is Jennifer, extension 106.


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## Parkplace (Feb 15, 2007)

I have a week banked with SFX, and plan to put in a request today.  

Can you Falmouth, or anybody suggest some good Hawaiian Resorts to request?  I'm concerned if I am too vague and just ask for Hawaii I might get something of lesser interest.  Like everyone else I would really like beachfront.

Thanks


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## ronandjoan (Feb 15, 2007)

*Working with SFX - use their comment boxes*



Cayuga said:


> Yes...I have reached this level of frustration with the service of SFX Resorts!!
> I know RCI and the others operate on similar principles. However, SFX marketing gives this illusion that they have special connections and opportunities unlike the other exchange institutions. Also, there is no transparency. One cannot search their system at all!!! :



Cayuga,
So sorry that you have gotten such poor service with SFX.  We have been happy with them but have had occasion when emails were not answered - therefore, we just call!  and call again, in case they don't call back.  At least you get people who are KNOWLEDGEABLE - unlike many at RCI.

Also, as has been noted several times here,  over at Timeshare Forums, Mark will help out with any problems, and he answers posts almost immediately.  I have read all his posts to learn a lot.

The bonus week program is outstanding - why are you so angry about it?

SFX does seem to have a special connection with Mayan Palaces with their extra inventory - more than say, RCI does!

They are constantly making improvements to their website - hopefully, we will be able to search online in the future.  But for now, we are in the same situation as we were for years in RCI - just calling.  

Why did you say you finally got to join the "exclusive" club?  Anyone can join for free - you just need to have a Gold Crown type resort to exchange with.  It seems fair to me that if I deposit a  Gold Crown, I would like to get a GC in return - unless I choose not to.  When I really don't want to play the game with RCI - is it a good resort or not? - then I use SFX.

SFX gives us another alternative besides the big 2 - or 3 - and I for one, am happy with another opportunity.  It is a choice, however, we do  not have to use them.


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## regatta333 (Feb 15, 2007)

eal said:


> I agree that their communication can be, er, "sparse', but do you call the same person each time?  The staff member who looks after Europe (I think) is Jennifer, extension 106.



The person I worked with when I deposited last year was Ramona.  I was told she was the person who handled requests for London.  However, she is no longer with SFX.


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## "Roger" (Feb 15, 2007)

regatta333 said:


> ...She said that since no one else had a request in for that location and time period, I would get priority over anything that became available, even over Platinum members since it works according to who requested first...


That's interesting.  I was given just the opposite story several years ago when I used them.  I was offered an exchange and accepted.  Their agent did not act fast enough (out of the office for several days) and they lost it.  Later, when I was not getting an exchange, I was told that others with more trade power were now ahead of me.

If it is first come, first serve and you are eligible for any exchange in their inventory, why do they assign trade power?  It would automatically go to the first requestor regardless of trade power.

I would call and ask about this.


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## falmouth3 (Feb 16, 2007)

*No trading power factor*

I was told last week by SFX that it didn't matter which week I used for my exchange - all weeks trade equally.


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## DeniseM (Feb 16, 2007)

falmouth3 said:


> I was told last week by SFX that it didn't matter which week I used for my exchange - all weeks trade equally.



I don't think this is correct - If you read Mark's posts you will find that SFX definitely assigns trade power.


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## Jimster (Feb 16, 2007)

*Don't take offense, please*

First of all, I must say that I read this board everyday and this question about SFX's procedure must have come up at least 25 times in the last 2 years.  Second, what I am about to say should in no way be construed as an attack on the OP Instead it is more about how people think.  Nevertheless, I will be quite candid.  

I have been a SFX member for about 5 years.  I have had excellent success with them.  I have traded into London, Cabo, Hawaii and other places.  All have been great.

BUT...

They are not RCI.  They will never be RCI (thankfully) and I don't want them to be RCI.  They do not use the same procedures!  As a practical fact, most TS exchangers start with RCI so they are familiar with that model.  They like using their computer to try and find "THE PERFECT EXCHANGE".  In all liklihood it is not going to come- probably because they are RCI.  The fact that they can type in the data into their website and search those resorts that RCI has not yet rented out makes them feel like they are doing something positive toward getting their perfect exchange whether they are actually doing anything constructive is a matter of debate.   In my experience, that is just so much wheel spinning.  On the other hand, putting in a search request is a bit more like SFX.  Although my experience with RCI is that they will contact you with an offer.  Nevermind that it is an offer of Canada in the winter when you wanted Hawaii in the summer.  All of this is to say, that is not how SFX works.  If you like the RCI model, use them!  Personally, I prefer SFX and DAE but don't expect them to be the same as RCI.  Why should they be?   We are comparing apples and oranges here between RCI and SFX.  I think it is all a mindset that people get into because they used RCI first- that's how it's supposed to work.  Again we are dealing with apples and oranges here.  To me this is all very similar to the posts about Americans driving cars in Europe.  I see a huge number of posts on here by my fellow Americans who can't envision taking a trip and not driving their car.  They can't get out of the mindset that vacations are done by cars and that you don't take trains.  While sometimes it is better to travel by car in Europe, it is as least as good of an option to take the train most of the time.  Maybe that's why the slogan "Think outside the box" was developed.

As to how to deal with SFX, I have found that phone calls to them work quite well.  The more options you give them the better your chances as well.  Pull up SFX in a search to get more tips or talk to Mark from SFX.


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## Jimster (Feb 16, 2007)

*Don't take offense, please*

First of all, I must say that I read this board everyday and this question about SFX's procedure must have come up at least 25 times in the last 2 years.  Second, what I am about to say should in no way be construed as an attack on the OP Instead it is more about how people think.  Nevertheless, I will be quite candid.  

I have been a SFX member for about 5 years.  I have had excellent success with them.  I have traded into London, Cabo, Hawaii and other places.  All have been great.

BUT...

They are not RCI.  They will never be RCI (thankfully) and I don't want them to be RCI.  They do not use the same procedures!  As a practical fact, most TS exchangers start with RCI so they are familiar with that model.  They like using their computer to try and find "THE PERFECT EXCHANGE".  In all liklihood it is not going to come- probably because they are RCI.  The fact that they can type in the data into their website and search those resorts that RCI has not yet rented out makes them feel like they are doing something positive toward getting their perfect exchange whether they are actually doing anything constructive is a matter of debate.   In my experience, that is just so much wheel spinning.  On the other hand, putting in a search request is a bit more like SFX.  Although my experience with RCI is that they will contact you with an offer.  Nevermind that it is an offer of Canada in the winter when you wanted Hawaii in the summer.  All of this is to say, that is not how SFX works.  If you like the RCI model, use them!  Personally, I prefer SFX and DAE but don't expect them to be the same as RCI.  Why should they be?   We are comparing apples and oranges here between RCI and SFX.  I think it is all a mindset that people get into because they used RCI first- that's how it's supposed to work.  Again we are dealing with apples and oranges here.  To me this is all very similar to the posts about Americans driving cars in Europe.  I see a huge number of posts on here by my fellow Americans who can't envision taking a trip and not driving their car.  They can't get out of the mindset that vacations are done by cars and that you don't take trains.  While sometimes it is better to travel by car in Europe, it is as least as good of an option to take the train most of the time.  Maybe that's why the slogan "Think outside the box" was developed.

As to how to deal with SFX, I have found that phone calls to them work quite well.  The more options you give them the better your chances as well.  Pull up SFX in a search to get more tips or talk to Mark from SFX.


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## KristinB (Feb 16, 2007)

I've only used SFX once, a few years ago, and I was satisfied with the experience.  We ended up with two weeks on Maui in January.

But I was prepared to 1) be very flexible and 2) call them regularly and expect that my calls would not be returned.  I left both the dates and the islands up in the air -- I just gave them a six month window and said that I wanted two consecutive weeks in Hawaii.

I agree that the uncertainty is very frustrating.  And I think that people who must have specific locations or specific dates might do better elsewhere.


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## Mimi (Feb 16, 2007)

*Experience with SFX*

We used SFX successfully many years ago, back when you could directly deal with Mel. As I recall, that was prior to free gold and platinum charged membership options. We got many good trades and bonus weeks to Hawaii. Our most frustrating, and last experience, ended in no availability for our premium Kona Coast deposit. We got some email responses from Mark, but could never actually speak to anyone. We ended up settling for Los Abrigidos (which we routinely obtained with our standard SA deposits) rather than letting our week expire. We expanded our search options serveral times to no avail. Maybe it just put us at the end of the line each time, I have no clue. Now we find success with Trading Places and enjoy their excellent customer relations. You call and always have real prople, with pleasant dispositions, to speak with! We pay keen attention to remarks made about SFX on TUG and TS4MS. If Tuggers start raving about SFX service, I may try them again. Too often I continue to read about similar experiences to ours and, therefore, will continue to pass on them. :annoyed:


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## funtime (Feb 17, 2007)

*How long have we heard that their website is being updated*

I think we have heard SFX fans state that their website is soon to be updated for at least two years now.   The problem with having an effective website is that more of your customers will expect more of you and that is just not the SFX way.   I am coming to believe that other than persistent emails seeking more deposits, SFX is not proactive enough in helping its customers.  More importantly, there is nothing to grasp -- no website, no effective way to check on anything, counselors that come and go.    I will have to fight against being another one of the pigeons that put in a week and have not yet gotten much out of SFX.  I will not be depositing more weeks.  For a spunky little timeshare exchanger, I like HTSE for midrange timeshares, and pretty good ones in the fall and spring and a good little website and friendly service.  Funtime


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## McFail (Feb 17, 2007)

I don't know how this is not apples to apples. RCI and SFX and II and others take a week with the expectation that an equivalent week will be returned. The mechanism may be different be the root is that an apple is given and expected in return. 

Your statement that the more options you give them the better your chances are sound like every other trade be it SFX or RCI.

I have been very reluctant to deal with SFX because they are even less transparent than II/RCI. Now I understand that they are difficult to contact as well. No thanks. 




Jimster said:


> First of all, I must say that I read this board everyday and this question about SFX's procedure must have come up at least 25 times in the last 2 years.  Second, what I am about to say should in no way be construed as an attack on the OP Instead it is more about how people think.  Nevertheless, I will be quite candid.
> 
> I have been a SFX member for about 5 years.  I have had excellent success with them.  I have traded into London, Cabo, Hawaii and other places.  All have been great.
> 
> ...


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## Laurie (Feb 17, 2007)

I tried them once several years ago and didn't have a great experience. I put in a request for a specific resort, for any dates. They never called, and then I saw a week at my requested resort on a sell-off list which I received in the mail - by which time it was too late to book my plans. They seemed to have no record of my request when I phoned to find out what happened. I was told I was assigned to a specific person and could only speak to them, but by the next time I called SFX to inquire (later on, after my first lost request), this person had left, and I don't think my requests were transferred to their successor. 

Like Mimi, I finally accepted an exchange at an easy-to-get-resort-with-South-Africa-deposit (at the time, anyway - Paniolo Greens) to avoid having my week expire. 

I had deposited late with them, on a new purchase (Maui Lea). I asked and was told by my initial phone contact that this wouldn't affect trade power and that there weren't trade power differences, but I have since heard differently - sounds like there are (or were) 2 conflicting party lines on this question.


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## Jimster (Feb 18, 2007)

*SFX v. RCI- apples and oranges*



> RCI and SFX and II and others take a week with the expectation that an equivalent week will be returned.



Yes, the term for this is an "exchange company" and I don't think anyone is arguing with this as a defiinition.

My point was the procedures vary between these exchange companies and it is silly to try and compare the two systems.  SFX works with certain select TS and RCI basically allows all TS.  SFX does not intend to ever let members search on line for resort vacancies.  People who keep asking "When will we get to search on line for SFX resorts?"  Just don't get it!  The answer is never.  That is just not their procedural model.  While RCI does allow on-line searches, I would caution that this does not mean they are "transparent" nor does it mean that this process brings you any closer to securing a resort or even that the RCI is the right model and SFX is wrong. You can sit at your computer all day long and search the RCI website and you are never going to get a Four Seasons resort with you blue time resort from Podunkville.  In fact, you may never get what you want even using a good trader.  And even though you can always get an RCI VC on the phone that doesn't mean you are getting any closer to making the trade you are looking for.  It is all smoke and mirrors so the member thinks he has some control over his own fate when in reality I'm not sure they do.  RCI is like the dogs chasing the rabbit at the Greyhound park.  It uses alot of energy and the dogs are really excited about it but they never catch the rabbit.  I'm sure most RCI members often "settle" for something short of their desired exchange.  In this light, the procedural model SFX employs is more than reasonable.  Admittedly, there are also other good exchange companies out there like DAE but they each have their quirks and foibles.

In short, my experience with SFX has been very positive-better than with RCI and I am on exchange 40.  Northern Willie since you don't seem to like SFX, I am curious what your experience with them has been?


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## tsl (Feb 18, 2007)

*disappointed as well*

 My last deposit w/ SFX was a spring break ski week.  Even after being very flexible, the only thing I was offered was a smaller unit in St. Martin in Sept. in hurricane season.  All of the holiday weeks I deposited ended up being exchanged for off season weeks.  Maybe it is because we do plan a year out b/c that is when you can reserve our float weeks; but even when I had to just give my deposits away, it was always off season trades that matched w/ SFX.  I never saw the high end deposits (except for those I was putting in the system).

I find I do better w/ II on Marriott trades b/c I have high demand resorts and seasons.  As for my ski week, I will just use it or roll it over to the next season rather than deposit it for an off season Carribean week that I could pull in RCI w/ my South African week.

Honestly, the best way not to be disappointed is to do a direct trade.  I think I will be trying that more in the future.  No fees and you know exactly what you are giving up and getting.

JMOH


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## icydog (Feb 18, 2007)

*I am adding my two cents worth!*

 My experience with SFX was not great either. I deposited a one bdrm in London in April 06 and got back a Longboat Key in JUNE and a bonus week at the Coronado Beach Resort in October. I had to pay exchange fees for both. How did I get these weeks? I said, "_give me something, anywhere, anytime" _and those are the weeks I got. Up until that point I was emailing but I got canned responses and no trades. 

I will keep up my membership for the sell off lists but I won't ever give them a week of mine again. The whole time I had my week deposited with SFX I felt intimidated by them. I was afraid to speak up for months because they held all the cards. I had no way to see what was available and I felt my week was being held hostage. *At the end, I was determined they wouldn't keep my week without giving me an exchange. That determination taught me that I can't ever do this again!*


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## funtime (Feb 18, 2007)

*SFX also has few if any Marriotts*

II seems to have almost a stranglehold on Marriott trades so if you are looking for a Marriott, SFX is not the place to look.  Funtime


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## camachinist (Feb 18, 2007)

funtime said:


> II seems to have almost a stranglehold on Marriott trades so if you are looking for a Marriott, SFX is not the place to look.  Funtime


Indeed, to the extent that one poster inferred I was stupid to have deposited a Marriott interval with SFX. I did it as an experiment, with a GOT, to see what actually goes on there. IME, little does. 

My theory? They take the high demand weeks, like the Xmas Vegas week I deposited, and trade with other exchange companies for multiple lesser "value" weeks which are provided as exchanges/sell off's, etc. Their clients never see the high value weeks. I inferred this in some threads on TS4M's and never got a direct answer from Mark. 

As a further datapoint, I'll put in a wide-open multi-region request for our deposit and see what returns.

The main problem I see with SFX is the lack of perceived value for cost incurred. What are they really doing to earn the fees being paid? At least at RCI and II, one extracts some percieved "value" by getting access to part of their database to "search", even if it is perhaps an inaccurate representation of true inventory.

Pat


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## McFail (Feb 18, 2007)

I have no experience with SFX other than research. 

My conclusion is that it is not a wise decision to give up a $1000+ asset with NO ability to see what is on the shelves. From many of the response here the shelves are bare or poorly stocked.


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## chemteach (Feb 19, 2007)

*SFX good for Mayan Resorts*

I was enticed by the 3 for 1 bonus weeks, and found that I couldn't use them.  Well - I used one for a Xmas week at Lawrence Welk, but now have the deposited week sitting with SFX.  I was able to get a New Year's week at the Grand Mayan in Nuevo Vallarta with another of my deposits, but the bonus weeks for that week were already beyond their expiration dates.  I find I can get much better trades in II than I can in SFX.  But as I said on a different thread about SFX - if you want to go to the Grand Mayans and put your request in early, you will be happy with SFX.


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## John Cummings (Feb 19, 2007)

After dealing with RCI and II for several years, I have used SFX exclusively for the past 10 years. They have always delivered what I requested and some of them were pretty tough trades. I have been dealing with the same person at SFX for several years now and have had no problems in communicating with her by both phone and e-mail.


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## camachinist (Feb 19, 2007)

I remember a time when many echoed John's sentiments and such was part of the reason I decided to give SFX a try. I wish for his experiences to be bestowed upon more of SFX's customers, though I haven't experienced such as of yet. I'll keep trying....

As my wife so succinctly put it, as this experiment was to result in a wedding gift: "We should have just rented the Vegas week and given the bride and groom the money". Women have a way with words sometimes 

Pat


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## icydog (Feb 19, 2007)

camachinist said:


> I remember a time when many echoed John's sentiments and such was part of the reason I decided to give SFX a try. I wish for his experiences to be bestowed upon more of SFX's customers, though I haven't experienced such as of yet. I'll keep trying....
> 
> *As my wife so succinctly put it, as this experiment was to result in a wedding gift: "We should have just rented the Vegas week and given the bride and groom the money". Women have a way with words sometimes*
> 
> Pat


 
Trouble is if you rent it you'll use the money you get for something else. Too bad the SFX thing didn't work out. I have had similar experiences with them. I really like II and I will stick with it for my Marriotts. I don't like RCI but who does? However,the endless searching for nonexistant resorts keeps me off the streets.


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## camachinist (Feb 19, 2007)

Ironically, my wife found a nice cottage for the bride and groom for just about what we paid for the GOT (850.00) and I know we could have rented it for more than that. So, I'll have to figure out a way to make up the shortfall on one of our other rentals. The price of my education 

Edited to add that perhaps my above post should have read "rented out", as the Vegas interval could have easily been rented out for twice what we paid Marriott for it.....

Pat


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## icydog (Feb 19, 2007)

camachinist said:


> Ironically, my wife found a nice cottage for the bride and groom for just about what we paid for the GOT (850.00) and I know we could have rented it for more than that. So, I'll have to figure out a way to make up the shortfall on one of our other rentals. The price of my education
> 
> Pat


 
What's GOT?


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## wrxdoug (Feb 19, 2007)

I have had good results with rci trading into castles in France, nice resort in tuscany and some great beach vacations.  Often the hardest trades (Tuscany, and great resorts in France) we had to plan two years out.  We often like to plan ahead as we use frequent flyer miles for seats which again you have to book 330 days out.  Doug PS we have used and are using sfx but have not been able to be as exact as we need at times.


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## camachinist (Feb 20, 2007)

icydog said:


> What's GOT?


GOT=Gift of Time, which are intervals Marriott owns and periodically makes available to its owners for essentially MF's. Ours was a 2006 2BR Christmas week at the Grand Chateau in Las Vegas. Hope someone enjoyed it 

Pat


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