# What kind of deal did you get buying Resale?    Advice please



## gilbbr (Jun 27, 2018)

Ok, fairly new Tugger hear, looking to purchase a Hyatt Wild Oak Ranch 3/3 Diamond Lockout with 2950 annual points.  

I am having a hard time determining if this is a good value or not.... Hoping some would chime in....

MF seem low at approx. $0.59 per point.  
Initial Purchase price is $4.23 per point. 

The Initial Purchase price would be paid in cash, not financed.  According to the ROFR data from the sticky above, the $/Point seem to bee somewhere in the middle to a tad high, but the MF are on the low end for sure. 

Actual details are as follows: 
Diamond 3/3 lock off at Wild Oaks Ranch.  
$12,900 plus $1750 MF (approx.) for 2950 points.  
2018 first use, starting week 31, with 2950 LUCP available but look like they will expire shortly after closing.  

We are so excited to become Hyatt RC owners, and I "think" we have found a fair deal.  But I over analyze EVERYTHING, and could use some affirmation, or redirection.  Candid replies are welcome and appreciated, criticism is not.  

We live about 5 hrs away from this resort, and I think we would use it every so often, but we would really like to trade over to Colorado and Florida, both in the off season, and smaller units.  We are trying to purchase enough points to make a few trips per year, while only paying 1 maintenance fee.... Are we on the right track?


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## Sapper (Jun 27, 2018)

The maintenance fee per point is good, however (and some may debate this) the purchase price seems a bit high to me. You have a few options. First is to haggle with Angie to get the price down. You can say the points it currently has are irrelivent as they will be expired before the closing process is over. If she tries to say Hyatt will ROFR for anything less, that's BS RIGHT NOW because of the current situation with HPP, and the ILG / Marriott purchase. Second is to buy off flEabay, but that might be months or a year of watching and waiting for something interesting to come up, and even when/if it does, you may be dealing with a scammer or it might take a ridiculously long time to transfer. Angie, the agent for option #1 is a known (you can search for her name here) individual who is not a scammer.  Third, you can wait for a different listing. They will come along, you may or may not be able to get a better deal down the road. That being said, once the Marriott / ILG purchase is done, and Marriott comes in and straightens out Hyatt / HPP (and they will), ROFR will become a thing again. What I'm saying is that right now, I believe we are in a sweet spot or a window where ROFR is temporarily not being exercised, so you have a time limit to "sit and wait" for options 2&3. Personally, if you like Wild Oaks, and you are OK with owning long term with all the uncertainties that brings (see the previous postings re HPP and the Marriott purchase), I'd take a hard look at option 1. 

All this being said, Hyatt has been a wonderful purchase for my little family.  Good luck.


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## sts1732 (Jun 27, 2018)

I'm with Sapper in that the price seems a little high, with the points due to run out soon, and the possibility of not being able to use them. Not knowing what the due date to runout on the points, and if the paper work was completed in time, thus being recognized in Interval as an owner you may be able to transfer and use the points in EEE if they aren't already there(EEE). That being said I wouldn't hold my breath.
It should also be noted that as a Hyatt owner you can't trade into a Hyatt in Interval, trading only with the availability within Hyatt.  Best of luck and WELCOME TO TUGG!


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## gilbbr (Jun 27, 2018)

Thank you both for your replies!  After doing the math for the last 2 years on similar properties, the points do seem to be on the higher end... I love the opportunity and flexibility that the 3000 points would offer us.  IF ROFR was enacted again, and we choose to sell in say 5 years. (not planning to, but you never know where life will take you!) Do you think we would get close to what we paid back from the sale?  Maybe 75%?  If they do start to act upon ROFR, that should HELP resale value, correct?

Our intention is to USE our points, not to sell anytime soon, but I also don't want to throw $13,000 away if "life" happens, and its really difficult to see how easily timeshares sell on the resale market.  Are there any ways to obtain "comps" for Hyatt, aside from the ROFR info that Kal collected?

Thank you so much for any additional insight!


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## scsu_hockey_fan (Jun 27, 2018)

gilbbr said:


> Ok, fairly new Tugger hear, looking to purchase a Hyatt Wild Oak Ranch 3/3 Diamond Lockout with 2950 annual points.
> 
> I am having a hard time determining if this is a good value or not.... Hoping some would chime in....
> 
> ...


I was looking at this one also. The purchase price seems good for a 3 bedroom in diamond season, from what I've seen in the past. Does the timing of the points work for you? What time of year do you like to travel? Do you have a lot of friends and family in the Texas area? Is august a time you would go to san Antonio if the trading system goes down the toilet, as we don't know what's going to happen with hpp and Marriott taking over. I passed on this one as the timing of the points are not ideal for us and August is to hot and humid in San Antonio for us. If June was diamond season then the story might be different.


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## gilbbr (Jun 28, 2018)

scsu_hockey_fan said:


> I was looking at this one also. The purchase price seems good for a 3 bedroom in diamond season, from what I've seen in the past. Does the timing of the points work for you? What time of year do you like to travel? Do you have a lot of friends and family in the Texas area? Is august a time you would go to san Antonio if the trading system goes down the toilet, as we don't know what's going to happen with hpp and Marriott taking over. I passed on this one as the timing of the points are not ideal for us and August is to hot and humid in San Antonio for us. If June was diamond season then the story might be different.


Thank you for your reply!  
_
Does the timing of the points work for you?_
Yes, we actually live in Texas, worst case scenario, we would use the deeded week, as it is the week before school starts.  
We plan to go to Orlando In the Fall, Florida panhandle (or keys ) in April-May, and Colorado at least 1x in the summer each year.  

_Is august a time you would go to san Antonio if the trading system goes down the toilet, as we don't know what's going to happen with hpp and Marriott taking over._

This was one of the reasons this unit was appealing to us... because if trading diminished, we could still enjoy a nice family vacation in a location we could drive too.  The unit is a bit larger than we would likely ever use, but the ability to pay the least amount of MF per point seems of greatest value in the long term.


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## scsu_hockey_fan (Jun 28, 2018)

gilbbr said:


> Thank you for your reply!
> _
> Does the timing of the points work for you?_
> Yes, we actually live in Texas, worst case scenario, we would use the deeded week, as it is the week before school starts.
> ...


Gilbrr, sent you a p.m.


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## Renzo (Aug 10, 2018)

New to Hyatt. I own mvc and Starwood. A friend wants to sell me a 1 bed Hyatt highlands wk 4, 1880 points for $500 Maintenance $1600 aprox. Does Hyatt have something similar like Marriott where you can’t use the point system if u buy resale. Is this a good deal? I would imagine 1880 points won’t take me anywhere really? Please advise. Ty


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## lizap (Aug 11, 2018)

Renzo said:


> New to Hyatt. I own mvc and Starwood. A friend wants to sell me a 1 bed Hyatt highlands wk 4, 1880 points for $500 Maintenance $1600 aprox. Does Hyatt have something similar like Marriott where you can’t use the point system if u buy resale. Is this a good deal? I would imagine 1880 points won’t take me anywhere really? Please advise. Ty



Well, it depends on where and when you want to go. I call our little gold week our energizer bunny.  We recouped our initial cost long ago. You need to take a look at the Hyatt points chart and see how 1880 points will work for you. I've considered buying a diamond week, but really can't justify it when our little gold week gives us at least 2 nice trips a year.


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## alexadeparis (Aug 11, 2018)

That is a good deal, and you CAN use the points resale, but I would expect those to be lost to ROFR.


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## northjerseyjim (Aug 11, 2018)

We are on the other end of the spectrum.  We bought at HRC Coconut Plantation week # 44.   We have no desire to trade this.

We travel to Florida every year in the first week of November.   We paid $500 for the 2br unit.  The original owner paid $13000.

This has but 1300 annual points, but if we do not plan to trade, who cares?


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## bdh (Aug 11, 2018)

northjerseyjim said:


> We are on the other end of the spectrum.  We bought at HRC Coconut Plantation week # 44.   We have no desire to trade this.
> 
> We travel to Florida every year in the first week of November.   We paid $500 for the 2br unit.  The original owner paid $13000.
> 
> This has but 1300 annual points, but if we do not plan to trade, who cares?



An excellent example of there is no one singular "best" TS for everyone.  Bought correctly and used correctly, the TS product is hard to beat.  The key to determining the "best" is a function of how much money an individual deems appropriate for the purchase/annual maintenance fees and what their travel objectives/patterns are.


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## Sapper (Aug 11, 2018)

Renzo said:


> New to Hyatt. I own mvc and Starwood. A friend wants to sell me a 1 bed Hyatt highlands wk 4, 1880 points for $500 Maintenance $1600 aprox. Does Hyatt have something similar like Marriott where you can’t use the point system if u buy resale. Is this a good deal? I would imagine 1880 points won’t take me anywhere really? Please advise. Ty



Re-sale can use the points with in Hyatt.  They may also be moved over to II.  IF you are using it as a points only, there are other properties with lower maintenance fees.  That being said, Highlands Inn is a wonderful property.  If you are going to use the property, you might want to find out what the unit number is, and see what the view will be (garden vs horizon vs ocean).  1880 points is what I would consider a minimum quantity of points, but everyone is different.  Right now, I would not worry about ROFR... this time next year may be a different story.


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## WalnutBaron (Aug 11, 2018)

Sapper said:


> Right now, I would not worry about ROFR... this time next year may be a different story.



I agree. If one is inclined to buy a resale unit in HRC, this is the time. Once Marriott begins to consolidate its portfolio, changes will be coming and they likely will be more aggressive in exercising ROFR.


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## Marathoner (Aug 11, 2018)

gilbbr said:


> Actual details are as follows:
> Diamond 3/3 lock off at Wild Oaks Ranch.
> $12,900 plus $1750 MF (approx.) for 2950 points.
> 2018 first use, starting week 31, with 2950 LUCP available but look like they will expire shortly after closing.
> ...



As an owner of 2BR diamond week, I would say this is a good deal.  Just buy it and don't overanalyze.  Just be aware that Hyatt's program is in the midst of changing due to the HRPP program and the purchase of ILG by MVC.  Personally, I believe HRC owners will come out of this with more options so will be a positive but you never know.  I also expect more ROFR activity once the ILG purchase closes so you should buy now if you like the property.


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## Renzo (Aug 11, 2018)

Sapper said:


> Re-sale can use the points with in Hyatt.  They may also be moved over to II.  IF you are using it as a points only, there are other properties with lower maintenance fees.  That being said, Highlands Inn is a wonderful property.  If you are going to use the property, you might want to find out what the unit number is, and see what the view will be (garden vs horizon vs ocean).  1880 points is what I would consider a minimum quantity of points, but everyone is different.  Right now, I would not worry about ROFR... this time next year may be a different story.


How difficult is it to exchange internally to siesta key? I know with ii is impossible....Also, would I be allow to rent an exchange if I can’t use it?

I know other hyatts have lower maintenance but they could also be more pricey for 1880 points. 

Thanks you all for your help.


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## Sapper (Aug 11, 2018)

Renzo said:


> How difficult is it to exchange internally to siesta key? I know with ii is impossible....Also, would I be allow to rent an exchange if I can’t use it?
> 
> I know other hyatts have lower maintenance but they could also be more pricey for 1880 points.
> 
> Thanks you all for your help.



Siesta Key is the hardest to trade into (both due to fewer quantity of units, and owners renting their units as opposed to trading them).  This is not to say it is impossible, I have seen it a few times... but I have seen more availability at every other property... including Park Hyatt in Beaver Creek and the new one in Hawaii. 

Think of it like this, depending on the unit view, if you don't like it, you can list it here on TUG... or even eBay and make more than the $500 your friend wants.


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## Venter (Aug 11, 2018)

I am wondering what the chances will be to get a weekend or a week during ski season in any of the CO properties if you own elsewhere. What would the chances of a week during a holiday be?


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## Marathoner (Aug 11, 2018)

Venter said:


> I am wondering what the chances will be to get a weekend or a week during ski season in any of the CO properties if you own elsewhere. What would the chances of a week during a holiday be?



For a full week during peak ski season, you need a diamond week elsewhere to exchange into the the CO resorts.  The chances of an exchange is very good especially if you are not particular which week - with Breck being the easiest trade and Park Hyatt in Beaver Creek being the hardest.  In general, a Jan week is the easiest month to trade into (from Jan-Mar).


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## Sapper (Aug 11, 2018)

Venter said:


> I am wondering what the chances will be to get a weekend or a week during ski season in any of the CO properties if you own elsewhere. What would the chances of a week during a holiday be?



I picked up a Park Hyatt for this December about nine months out.  

Marathoner is correct about Main Street Station in Breck being the easiest, then Mountain Lodge in Beaver Creek, then Aspen, then the hardest is Park Hyatt in Beaver Creek.  You have to be very flexible on the use week... not sure you would ever see a holiday week though.


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## Venter (Aug 11, 2018)

Thank you for your replies.

I may actually not do a whole week but maybe some weekends and would consider one bedrooms and studios as well. Diamond is a bit pricy so I am looking at a platinum or gold two bedroom. Hopefully I can get a platinum for a reasonable price with fair MFs.

Any recommendations for what to look out for? I may consider every other year to just dip my toes in the water.


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## ivywag (Aug 12, 2018)

Renzo said:


> How difficult is it to exchange internally to siesta key? I know with ii is impossible....Also, would I be allow to rent an exchange if I can’t use it?
> 
> I know other hyatts have lower maintenance but they could also be more pricey for 1880 points.
> 
> Thanks you all for your help.


You would not be able to rent an exchange.  Hyatt only allows you to rent the deeded week/unit that you own.


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## Renzo (Aug 12, 2018)

ivywag said:


> You would not be able to rent an exchange.  Hyatt only allows you to rent the deeded week/unit that you own.


Good to know. Thanks. I didn’t know


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## Renzo (Aug 12, 2018)

ivywag said:


> You would not be able to rent an exchange.  Hyatt only allows you to rent the deeded week/unit that you own.


If it’s against the rule I wouldn’t do it but how would they know? Just being curious......at check in maybe?


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## Tucsonadventurer (Aug 12, 2018)

Renzo said:


> If it’s against the rule I wouldn’t do it but how would they know? Just being curious......at check in maybe?


I wouldn't do it but at our owners update the sales supervisor said it was fine. He did it all the time and no one cared. Of course it was part of his sales pitch.


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## sts1732 (Aug 12, 2018)

Renzo said:


> New to Hyatt. I own mvc and Starwood. A friend wants to sell me a 1 bed Hyatt highlands wk 4, 1880 points for $500 Maintenance $1600 aprox. Does Hyatt have something similar like Marriott where you can’t use the point system if u buy resale. Is this a good deal? I would imagine 1880 points won’t take me anywhere really? Please advise. Ty


With a little planning 1880 points can get you some nice places in II. Be flexible both in dates and time of yr., yrs. ago with our first Hyatt purchase and 1400 points we got 2 wks. back to back in the USVI through II and still had more than 700 points left.


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## Marathoner (Aug 12, 2018)

Renzo said:


> If it’s against the rule I wouldn’t do it but how would they know? Just being curious......at check in maybe?



Nobody cares until they start caring.  You can read all about the Wyndham owners stories about how they profited from tactics using 60 day upgrades and credit pooling for years.  It all worked fine until Wyndham cracked down on it.  Until then, everyone got away with it and everyone benefited from it - including Wyndham's sales force.


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## lizap (Aug 13, 2018)

sts1732 said:


> With a little planning 1880 points can get you some nice places in II. Be flexible both in dates and time of yr., yrs. ago with our first Hyatt purchase and 1400 points we got 2 wks. back to back in the USVI through II and still had more than 700 points left.



I've found flexibility is key to getting the most out of your TS.


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## youknowthenight (Aug 13, 2018)

For point of reference, I'm finishing up a purchase in Sedona for about $5000 for a 2bd with 2000 annual points. But if you feel you're purchase is giving you the ideal amount of points than go for it.


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## pacman777 (Aug 16, 2018)

youknowthenight said:


> For point of reference, I'm finishing up a purchase in Sedona for about $5000 for a 2bd with 2000 annual points. But if you feel you're purchase is giving you the ideal amount of points than go for it.



Just curious if that passed ROFR? I heard they might not be exercising any ROFR due to then impending MVC acquisition.


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## Tucsonadventurer (Aug 16, 2018)

youknowthenight said:


> For point of reference, I'm finishing up a purchase in Sedona for about $5000 for a 2bd with 2000 annual points. But if you feel you're purchase is giving you the ideal amount of points than go for it.


That is an incredible deal. Enjoy!


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## SHG (Aug 20, 2018)

youknowthenight said:


> For point of reference, I'm finishing up a purchase in Sedona for about $5000 for a 2bd with 2000 annual points. But if you feel you're purchase is giving you the ideal amount of points than go for it.


Wow, it will be interesting to know if this passed ROFR for me as well. I just found the same resort/points that I am going to pursue!


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## ivywag (Aug 21, 2018)

Marathoner said:


> Nobody cares until they start caring.  You can read all about the Wyndham owners stories about how they profited from tactics using 60 day upgrades and credit pooling for years.  It all worked fine until Wyndham cracked down on it.  Until then, everyone got away with it and everyone benefited from it - including Wyndham's sales force.


It really is a disadvantage to your fellow Residence Club members to reserve prime weeks of CUP inventory and then rent them for your personal profit. It not only violates the rules but takes inventory out of the trading pool that another member might wish to reserve.  If you own the specific week/unit that you are renting, that's great.  If you don't, you should respect the rights of the other Club members.  Periodically, Hyatt/Interval does crack down on some of the EBay listings.


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## Marathoner (Aug 22, 2018)

ivywag said:


> It really is a disadvantage to your fellow Residence Club members to reserve prime weeks of CUP inventory and then rent them for your personal profit.



I agree with you.  I'm not saying that I condone the practice, I am stating what happened on Wyndham's system


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## bdh (Aug 22, 2018)

Marathoner said:


> I agree with you.  I'm not saying that I condone the practice, I am stating what happened on Wyndham's system



This thread has veered off the road of the original topic - so to continue to drive past the ditch and deeper into the woods....

Unfortunately the practice of reserving Sunset Harbor 4 day studio CUP reservations and renting them on Ebay has been going on in the Hyatt world for 6 to 7 years.  As discussed here on TUG several years ago, the same 4 to 6 Hyatt owners (previously dubbed "The Studio Gang) run a profitable business by renting CUP reservations as the cost of a hotel room in Key West can be $200 to $400 a night depending on the season.  With the 4 day studio being so few points to reserve in the Hyatt system, its easy money to rent a CUP reservation for $150 to $300 a night on Ebay. 

It's also unfortunate that while Hyatt knows who the offending owners are and they have done absolutely nothing to stop/shut down the improper activity.  3 to 5 years ago, Hyatt stated that while the rules do not permit the renting of CUP reservations, the rules didn't outline a penalty for the activity, so there wasn't anything they could do to stop it.  About 2 years ago Hyatt updated The Club rules to address the rental of CUP reservations by including the following language in rule 6.2.

_In the event a Club Member rents accommodations reserved through the Club when prohibited from doing so under these Rules and Regulations, the Club has the authority, in the Club’s sole discretion, to suspend or cancel the Guest Certificate issued in connection with the reserved accommodations rented in violation of these Rules and Regulations. 
_
Fast forward to today and Hyatt has still done nothing the stop/shut down the Ebay rental activity of The Studio Gang.  So the practice of 4 day studio rentals to the public and thereby eliminating the possibility of a week long stay in a 2 bedroom unit by an Hyatt owner that wants to visit Key West continues.


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## WalnutBaron (Aug 24, 2018)

bdh said:


> This thread has veered off the road of the original topic - so to continue to drive past the ditch and deeper into the woods....
> 
> Unfortunately the practice of reserving Sunset Harbor 4 day studio CUP reservations and renting them on Ebay has been going on in the Hyatt world for 6 to 7 years.  As discussed here on TUG several years ago, the same 4 to 6 Hyatt owners (previously dubbed "The Studio Gang) run a profitable business by renting CUP reservations as the cost of a hotel room in Key West can be $200 to $400 a night depending on the season.  With the 4 day studio being so few points to reserve in the Hyatt system, its easy money to rent a CUP reservation for $150 to $300 a night on Ebay.
> 
> ...


Because I'm on the West Coast and own and visit Hyatt properties in the West, I had no idea this kind of practice was occurring with regularity at Sunset Harbor. HRC could take a much tougher stance toward The Studio Gang--and that would be to simply suspend their online accounts and access to the Hyatt Residence Club website if they continue to abuse their privileges of ownership. It is patently unfair for these owners to tie up desirable mid-week reservations and thereby prevent other owners who play by the rules to not be able to reserve 2BR units for an entire week. The whole intention of 2BR units, of course, is to be able to allow families or friends to accompany owners to a beautiful place for a fun-filled vacation. The Studio Gang has breached the good faith of fellow owners for their own financial gain to the detriment of Sunset Harbor, HRC, and the other owners of the property.


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## Tucsonadventurer (Aug 24, 2018)

WalnutBaron said:


> Because I'm on the West Coast and own and visit Hyatt properties in the West, I had no idea this kind of practice was occurring with regularity at Sunset Harbor. HRC could take a much tougher stance toward The Studio Gang--and that would be to simply suspend their online accounts and access to the Hyatt Residence Club website if they continue to abuse their privileges of ownership. It is patently unfair for these owners to tie up desirable mid-week reservations and thereby prevent other owners who play by the rules to not be able to reserve 2BR units for an entire week. The whole intention of 2BR units, of course, is to be able to allow families or friends to accompany owners to a beautiful place for a fun-filled vacation. The Studio Gang has breached the good faith of fellow owners for their own financial gain to the detriment of Sunset Harbor, HRC, and the other owners of the property.


The salesmen at Pinon Pointe are pitching this and when I told him it was against the bylaws he said Hyatt didn't care and he did it himself. Hyatt needs to start there if they do care.


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## youknowthenight (Aug 30, 2018)

pacman777 said:


> Just curious if that passed ROFR? I heard they might not be exercising any ROFR due to then impending MVC acquisition.


Yes, passed ROFR sometime in the last month.


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## Rick E (Sep 3, 2018)

We just closed on our Wynward Point silver 1400 points and paid $2,100 all in. We already owned a 1 bedroom gold pinion pointe with 1240 points, so now we can pretty much pick our location/week going forward. I think you could get a better price, if you wanted to try, and maybe wait. Hyatt waived ROFR pretty quickly. Good luck


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