# Do You Love The New RCI Points "Enhancements"?



## Hoc (Jan 7, 2008)

I just got an email from RCI points that they have "enhanced" their points partners program, so that RCI points are now worth roughly half what they were before.

They have changed it so that, instead of being able to redeem your points directly for points partners, you now get only a fixed discount against the price of the points partners items.

As an example, last year I was able to redeem 70,000 of my points for a round trip flight to Hawaii in peak season, normally priced at $1,200.  Now, under the "enhancements," I get only a credit for $600 for the same number of points.  Thus, the flight that I got for my points, plus a $149 service fee, will now cost the same number of points, plus the same fee, plus $600.

Really irritating.


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## timeos2 (Jan 7, 2008)

All the various incarnations of "points for anything" (cruises, plane fare, fee payments, rental cars, etc) other than simple timeshare use has never seemed to be a value to me.  When I hear that touted as a benefit I just shake y head "yeah, right".


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## djyamyam (Jan 7, 2008)

Hoc said:


> I just got an email from RCI points that they have "enhanced" their points partners program, so that RCI points are now worth roughly half what they were before.
> 
> They have changed it so that, instead of being able to redeem your points directly for points partners, you now get only a fixed discount against the price of the points partners items.
> 
> ...



I would agree that this sucks!  The old program was more in line with what the airline loyalty programs were.  This new one is more similar to a number of credit card loyalty points programs.  This new one is definitely a takeaway.

Here's a copy of that email:


Dear xxxxxxxx,

Your RCI Subscribing Membership gives you the freedom to choose from thousands of resorts in more than 100 countries.* And as an RCI Points member, you have another kind of freedom. You’re automatically hooked up with Points Partner companies – household-name travel and leisure companies that can help you get virtually anywhere you want to go, and do it your way.

*New for 2008*

We’re going farther to help you get even more out of the Points Partner Program. Based on your feedback, we’ve made enhancements to the program to give you more control over how many RCI Points you use for each transaction, with fewer limitations and more options than ever before.

Under the new structure effective January 10th, your RCI Points are converted to discounts – which you can apply toward the cost of airfare, hotel stays, rental cars, theme park admission tickets and much more. Use this conversion grid for most RCI Points Program transaction types and save. 

Exchange this Many RCI Points... for this much in cash discounts.....
35,000 / $300
45,000 / $400
55,000 / $500
70,000 / $600
90,000 / $800
115,000 / $1000
145,000 / $1250
170,000 / $1500
200,000 / $1750


For example, say you want to purchase a round-trip airline ticket from NYC to Aruba, valued at $695. You can choose to exchange 12,500 RCI Points for $100 off the ticket price, 70,000 RCI Points for $600 off the ticket price, or any value in-between. 

How you use your RCI Points and what you choose to do with them is completely up to you! 

Check your mailbox for details included in the new 2008 RCI Points Value Summary, arriving in early February.
Or, call an RCI Guide for details at
1-877-968-7476


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## Hoc (Jan 7, 2008)

timeos2 said:


> All the various incarnations of "points for anything" (cruises, plane fare, fee payments, rental cars, etc) other than simple timeshare use has never seemed to be a value to me.  When I hear that touted as a benefit I just shake y head "yeah, right".



Under the system in effect until this Thursday, I could get good value from the points partners.  Generally, I got 72,000 annual points for $357, and I exchanged them annually for airline tickets to Hawaii from the west coast over Christmas or New Year, which normally sell for about $1,200 to $1,400 without any discounting ever available.  I also almost always flew on aa for those flights, so I also got about 10,000 miles when I flew.

So, for $357 plus $149 annually, I got 10,000 miles plus tickets that I could not find on the market for less than $1,200.  I found that to be good value.  It was more than 50 percent off the normal prices.  

However, under the new program, it will now cost me $357 plus $149 plus $600+ for the same thing.  Since I can normally fly to the islands for about $280 when a fare sale happens, I don't consider it worth $1106 to do it over the holidays, and the points system will be less than a hundred dollar discount now.


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## timeos2 (Jan 7, 2008)

Hoc said:


> Under the system in effect until this Thursday, I could get good value from the points partners.  Generally, I got 72,000 annual points for $357, and I exchanged them annually for airline tickets to Hawaii from the west coast over Christmas or New Year, which normally sell for about $1,200 to $1,400 without any discounting ever available.  I also almost always flew on aa for those flights, so I also got about 10,000 miles when I flew.
> 
> So, for $357 plus $149 annually, I got 10,000 miles plus tickets that I could not find on the market for less than $1,200.  I found that to be good value.  It was more than 50 percent off the normal prices.
> 
> However, under the new program, it will now cost me $357 plus $149 plus $600+ for the same thing.  Since I can normally fly to the islands for about $280 when a fare sale happens, I don't consider it worth $1106 to do it over the holidays, and the points system will be less than a hundred dollar discount now.



Which is part of the issue - the programs can change but what you paid to get in is already gone. I base my purchases on the underlying (timeshare) use and don't plan on getting anything from the hyped extras. If one turns out to be a great value we'll certainly use it but don't put it in the value mix when evaluating any purchase or upgrade.


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## Hoc (Jan 7, 2008)

timeos2 said:


> Which is part of the issue - the programs can change but what you paid to get in is already gone.



Which is why I would never convert any of my existing weeks into points.  When I bought my Aussie timeshare, it was for the sole purpose of taking advantage of the RCI points system.  $2,100 about 8 years ago and $357 (less in prior years) per year in annual fees.  So, that's roughly $600 a year, including my initial investment, plus the annual service fees (which I believe started at $49).  I feel that I have gotten my value out of what I put in, including the original purchase price, because each year I traded for airfare that was substantially higher than the price I paid for the points plus fees plus amortized sunk cost.  But it is no longer the great deal it was when I bought, and it's really irritating to see RCI make a 50 percent devaluation of my points in one fell swoop while calling it an enhancement.

In any event, I think that the Sandy Point Beach Resort, which I bought for this system, is a pretty high demand during holiday weeks (I own a holiday week, peak season unit), and I believe that the resort is going to be sold with all profits distributed among the owners in 2020 or something like that.  So, there's probably still some underlying value.  I'm OK with the purchase, just not OK with RCI's continual devaluation of the owners' interests.


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## WilliamEng (Jan 7, 2008)

*Got the Same Email*

Yes, I got the same email that everybody will/have get/gotten. RCI is effectively shutting down the RCI Points Partner Program. 

It's ludicrous for them to say the following:

"We’re going farther to help you get even more out of the Points Partner Program. Based on your feedback, we’ve made enhancements to the program to give you more control over how many RCI Points you use for each transaction, with fewer limitations and more options than ever before."

What feedback are they talking about? I was never asked and I doubt if there is any record of anybody being asked. 

What control are these idiots talking about? They're making it more expensive, effectively, and increasing my limitations. The options are limited now.


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## pranas (Jan 8, 2008)

The new program is a joke. To be used only when desperate and want to get some value for unused soon to expire points.


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## JMAESD84 (Jan 8, 2008)

*My reply to RCI*

I have to believe that like most "improvements" RCI makes to it's programs, this one only improves RCI's bottom line and all but strips away any value that a member might have found in using the Points Partner program.

You're of course offering very flexible amounts of RCI discounts (on a basis of much less than 1 cent per point), while at the same time renting points to members for 2 cents each and of course there's always your fee for this service.

Most RCI point members are paying more than 1 cent per RCI point in the MF's charged by their home resorts.  

If you were looking to help members - you would let members sell or exchange points between each other, while charging a miminum fee for the bookeeping.  Better yet, offer Point Partners programs that allow members to get 2 cents worth of product or service for every point spent, you know...the same dollar value you get for the points you rent. 

Thanks for nothing


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## janapur (Jan 8, 2008)

Thanks for the info. I had been on the fence about using some soon to expire points for disney passes. I got them today. 

Jana


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## elaine (Jan 8, 2008)

*what can I get for 6,500 points tomorrow??*

what can I get for 6,500 points by tomorrow before the change comes into effect?  Also, do you have to pay a transaction fee? can i get even a 1 day base disney ticket?


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## SharonD (Jan 8, 2008)

They did the same thing a few years ago with the cruise for points.  Before they changed the program to 50,000 points + cash, I got a fantastic deal on two cabins for an Alaska cruise (took my parents for their 50th anniversary).  I still can't get over how little we paid for the cruise (of course, that was back when the Aussie exchange rate was much more favorable, too..)

Nowadays it seems if I check into a cruise with RCI, they want the price I see on the cruise discount sites in cash, PLUS 50,000 points, PLUS a transaction fee.

I have also gotten good deals on air fare from time to time.  I might still use points for air fare under this new system if I'm in the situation of having to use points up before they expire.  If the cost is equal to buying the flight, at least I won't lose the points.

It's true with any "good" timesharing deal:  it never stays that way!

(Hoc, that's interesting about Sandy Point.  I own there also.  I had never heard this before).


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## BocaBum99 (Jan 8, 2008)

Hoc said:


> Under the system in effect until this Thursday, I could get good value from the points partners.  Generally, I got 72,000 annual points for $357, and I exchanged them annually for airline tickets to Hawaii from the west coast over Christmas or New Year, which normally sell for about $1,200 to $1,400 without any discounting ever available.  I also almost always flew on aa for those flights, so I also got about 10,000 miles when I flew.
> 
> So, for $357 plus $149 annually, I got 10,000 miles plus tickets that I could not find on the market for less than $1,200.  I found that to be good value.  It was more than 50 percent off the normal prices.
> 
> However, under the new program, it will now cost me $357 plus $149 plus $600+ for the same thing.  Since I can normally fly to the islands for about $280 when a fare sale happens, I don't consider it worth $1106 to do it over the holidays, and the points system will be less than a hundred dollar discount now.



I think your economics need some adjustment.

I've flown to and from Florida more than a half dozen times in the past year.  My airfare has usually been around $600.

My wife is flying to Florida and back to Oahu in 3 weeks on a ticket she booked on Sunday.  The charge on my AMEX card is $546.90.

I routinely fly between Ontario and Honolulu for around $300.  So, your $1200 price tag is way too high.  You have inflated your perceived return using that program.

I have done detailed apples to apples comparisons of points partners in the past.  I concluded that points were were the cash equivalent of about $.0075/point.  It appears that the new values RCI came up with are in line with this ratio.  I think the changes are about equal.

If you take a 90,000 points and trade it in for $800 and subtract out $149.  You get (800-149)/90,000 = $.0072.  Virtually identical to the $.0075 I mentioned.

This program does allow RCI the opporutnity to offer a lot more goods and services.  If your cost is $357 for 72,000 points.  Then, your cost is only $.005.

Your return on your investment is $134.  Divide that by the capital your invested in your timeshare and that is your return on invested capital.  If you bought those points for $1000, then your return on invested capital is 13.4%.

That is very low for a timeshare.  That is actually why I don't use RCI points much any more.  So many other timeshare alternatives are better.  

that points partners aren't a good value is a valid criticism.  That it is dramatically different than it was isn't.


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## sjschuster (Jan 8, 2008)

*New Points Grid for 2008 includes Points Partner Details*

Attached link for the .pdf file from RCI website for quick reference.  File was to big to attach...

http://www.rci.com/CDA/Common/Documents/PointsPartners-en_US.pdf


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## JudyS (Jan 9, 2008)

What's particularly annoying is how little notice they gave us of this change.

Has anyone run the numbers to see which is better, the old deal for Disney tickets, or the new one?  I'm considering using up a pile of points for Disney tickets later today when RCI opens (that is, Wednesday Jan 9th.)


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## BillR (Jan 9, 2008)

*Exchange this Many RCI Points... for this much in cash discounts.....
35,000 / $300      = .0086/point
45,000 / $400      = .0089/point
55,000 / $500      = .0091/point
70,000 / $600      = .0086/point
90,000 / $800      = .0089/point
115,000 / $1000   = .0087/point
145,000 / $1250   = .0086/point
170,000 / $1500   = .0088/point
200,000 / $1750   = .0088/point*

*INTERESTING MATH!  RCI's computer wizards are on the job again!*​*
If you pay .0086/point, you break even.

If you pay LESS than .0086/point - on the average, you have a good deal.
If you pay MORE than .0091/point - you lose.
If you pay RCI $.02/point, you get your face ripped off.*

*Since my average cost/point is less than $ .005/point, I am (very) pleased with the new program! *​


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## JudyS (Jan 9, 2008)

BillR said:


> If you pay .0086/point, you break even.
> 
> If you pay LESS than .0086/point - on the average, you have a good deal.
> If you pay MORE than .0091/point - you lose.
> If you pay RCI $.02/point, you get your face ripped off...


BillR, don't forget that there are also transaction fees that you need to factor in.


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## Hoc (Jan 9, 2008)

BocaBum99 said:


> My wife is flying to Florida and back to Oahu in 3 weeks on a ticket she booked on Sunday.  The charge on my AMEX card is $546.90.



That does not take into account that flying *to* Oahu between December 17 and 25, and flying *from* Oahu between December 26 and January 2 is dramatically more expensive than at any other time of the year.  That is the only time period during which I have used my points.  Last year, the price was about $1,200 from the West Coast and this year, it was about $1,400 from the West Coast.

I normally fly at other times of the year between LAX and HNL at $280, with the non-sale fares going around $400.


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## Cayuga (Jan 9, 2008)

BillR said:


> *Exchange this Many RCI Points... for this much in cash discounts.....
> 
> If you pay LESS than .0086/point - on the average, you have a good deal.
> If you pay MORE than .0091/point - you lose.
> ...



***************************
Let's be careful about how much we discuss (read:brag)!! I believe these sites are covertly monitored and influence our ability to manage the system appropriately. I'm sure folks remember the South Africa timeshare "golden era" and how their value got eventually watered down and diminished!


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## Hoc (Jan 9, 2008)

BillR said:


> *Exchange this Many RCI Points... for this much in cash discounts.....
> 35,000 / $300      = .0086/point
> 45,000 / $400      = .0089/point
> 55,000 / $500      = .0091/point
> ...


*

Actually, factoring in a $129 transaction fee, it's:
35,000/$300 = $.0049/point
45,000/$400 = $.006/point
55,000/$500 = $.0067/point
70,000/$600 = $.0067/point
90,000/$800 = $.0074/point
115,000/$1000 = $.0075/point
145,000/$1250 = $.0077/point
170,000/$1500 = $.0081/point
200,000/$1750 = $.0081/point

So, once my maintenance fees go up to $490 a year (which is clearly foreseeable, given the trend of the U.S. dollar), I lose money on my points transactions.  I'm just glad that I did not buy the multiple interests that many did for the purposes of getting more RCI points.*


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## Hoc (Jan 9, 2008)

Cayuga said:


> Let's be careful about how much we discuss (read:brag)!! I believe these sites are covertly monitored and influence our ability to manage the system appropriately. I'm sure folks remember the South Africa timeshare "golden era" and how their value got eventually watered down and diminished!



Nobody can buy points at those rates anymore, anyway.  So, the value has already been diminished.


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## Hoc (Jan 9, 2008)

BocaBum99 said:


> Your return on your investment is $134.



No, because I can only trade in 70,000 points for $600, not 72,000 points.  $600-$149 (is it $149 or $129?)-$357=$94.  So, I get $94 annually on my $2,100 investment.  Without considering the likelihood of renting, trading or recouping my investment after resale, my return is only 4.4 percent.  Not very good by any measure.


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## BillR (Jan 9, 2008)

Hoc said:


> Actually, factoring in a $129 transaction fee, it's: . . . . .



*I must be missing something - what is this $129.00 transaction fee?​ *


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## Carolinian (Jan 9, 2008)

Interesting that they use the same word that airline ff programs use when they hose the members of one of their programs - ''enhancements''.  When they use that corporate doublespeak, hold onto your wallet.  Another gambit is that any devaluation of an ff program is generally explained as implemented ''because the members asked for it''.

Well, this is a devaluation of Points, and as a Weeks member ( until my membership runs out), I say ''hip, hip, hooray'' for anything that discourages use of the points partner crap.  Points partners is one of the things that encourages RCI raiding of Weeks inventory to prop up Points since they need rentals to pay for these things.

I hope that the next ''enhancement'' is to halt the ability of Points members to trade into the Weeks system.  Such a bold and fair move might even make me reconsider getting out of RCI when my membership runs out.


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## Hoc (Jan 9, 2008)

BillR said:


> *I must be missing something - what is this $129.00 transaction fee?​ *



RCI always charges you a fee to use your points via points partners.  I thought it was $129, but according to BocaBum, it might actually be $149, which devalues the points further from the numbers I was posting.


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## Hoc (Jan 9, 2008)

Carolinian said:


> Well, this is a devaluation of Points, and as a Weeks member ( until my membership runs out), I say ''hip, hip, hooray'' for anything that discourages use of the points partner crap.  Points partners is one of the things that encourages RCI raiding of Weeks inventory to prop up Points since they need rentals to pay for these things.



Steve--

I'm surprised it took you so long to post.  I thought that would probably be your reaction, given your (admittedly justified) distaste for the points system.  But be aware: points partners is RCI's excuse for raiding the weeks inventory, not one of the things that encourages it.  I doubt that RCI will inhibit its weeks raiding as a result of this new system.  Rather, it will use the same excuse, and likely will keep or increase the level of its raiding, no matter how much points partners activity exists.  Remember that it's all about maximum profitability, and as long as RCI continues to get deposits, it has no incentive to curtail its rape of the depositing owners.


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## sjschuster (Jan 9, 2008)

*Points Partners Transaction Fees*

Per RCI Fee structure on 1/9/08.....

RCI Points Partners® Transaction Fees

Partners Res - Air & Car
 $49 USD
 $52 CAD

Partners Res - Cruise
 $69 USD
 $73 CAD

Partners Res - Hotel
 $29 USD
 $31 CAD

Partners Res - Activities
 $69 USD
 $73 CAD


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## JudyS (Jan 10, 2008)

Oh, man, does RCI tick me off!  I just called RCI to dump my excess RCI Points into Disney tickets before the Points Partners changeover.  Well, *RCI decided to end the old program two days early.*  Yes, that's right, the email that they sent out the evening of 1/7 said the change would go into effect 1/10, but instead the change occured on 1/8.  I also took me almost an hour to get them to process my request.  A lot of that was spent on hold, waiting for them to pick up the phone. 

I ordered my Disney tickets anyway, before RCI could do something else to devalue my points.  However, I'm not sure exactly what they'll be sending me! _[Skip the rest of this paragraph if you don't want to know the details of Disney ticket types.]  _I was told that I would be getting 7-day, adult, non-expiring "Park Hopper Plus" tickets.  This is possible, although "Park Hopper Plus" tickets are an older type of ticket that Disney no longer sells.  I was also told that these tickets would come with 4 water park days, which must be used consecutively -- that is, once you use the first water park day, you must use the rest within 4 days or they expire.  I find this very unlikely because this is not how "Park Hopper Plus" tickets work.  I was also told that I wouldn't get actual tickets, but rather a voucher that would need to be exchanged at Disneyworld for the actual ticket.  I'm hoping that RCI just didn't know what they are talking about, and that I will receive normal Disney tickets, which was the case last time I ordered Disney tickets with RCI Points.  I will probably be able to tell what type of ticket I've gotten once my tickets show up in a week or so. 

So, what sort of value did I get?  It's hard to say, since I don't know exactly what tickets RCI is sending me. So, I'm basing my figures on Disney's current type of tickets (Magic Your Way Park Hopper with Fun and More.)  I got 4 tickets from RCI, and RCI charged me $192 plus the $69 transaction fee, plus 170,000.  According to RCI, 170,000 should give me a $1500 discount, so RCI is saying that these tickets are worth $1692 for four, or $23 each. Disney charges $435 with tax for a 7 day non-expiring ticket.  So, if these tickets were actually worth the full gate price, RCI would have actually charged me a bit less than the ticket value -- it's a $435 ticket, and RCI says it's worth $423. 

However, most ticket resellers get discounted tickets that are sold at a lower wholesale rate. (This was definitely the case with the RCI Disney tickets in the past -- I brought one to Disneyworld and asked to trade it in towards an annual pass.  Disney wouldn't apply the full gate price of a ticket towards an annual pass, but only the wholesale price; I think that was maybe $50 or $60 less.) There are ticket resellers online who will sell me a 7-day ticket for $404, including tax, and remember, they are making a profit at that price, so the wholesale price is even lower.  I would guess that, by saying each ticket is worth $423, RCI is marking up the wholesale price of the tickets by at least $30 or $40.  *So, beware -- the prices RCI charges before your discount probably are marked up over wholesale. *

When I go to Disneyworld in two months, I will try to find out what the actual wholesale price of these tickets were.  I don't believe that this can be done anywhere except at Disneyworld itself. 

OK, *what's the bottom line value that I got for my 170,000 points?*  I could buy four tickets like this for $1616 total.  I paid $192 plus a $69 transaction fee, so I paid $261 plus 170,000 for something that I could buy for $1616. That makes the value .*797 cents per point*.


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## Fern Modena (Jan 10, 2008)

Please let us know what kind of tickets/vouchers you end up getting for your points.

Thanks,

Fern


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## rickandcindy23 (Jan 10, 2008)

They should be the 7-day, non-expiring, "hopper" tickets with the Plus options.  

So you felt like you got a good deal, Judy?  Those tickets were a good value before, and I don't think the value was reduced as much as others do.  We probably aren't going to use our weeks for PFD anymore because the value isn't there.  Now if RCI would stop charging the transaction fees to deposit and the transaction fees for purchases, we might continue depositing our weeks, but the total cost of those tickets is now just too much.


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## Pit (Jan 10, 2008)

JudyS said:


> So, what sort of value did I get?  It's hard to say, since I don't know exactly what tickets RCI is sending me. So, I'm basing my figures on Disney's current type of tickets (Magic Your Way Park Hopper with Fun and More.)  I got 4 tickets from RCI, and RCI charged me $192 plus the $69 transaction fee, plus 170,000.  According to RCI, 170,000 should give me a $1500 discount, so RCI is saying that these tickets are worth $1692 for four, or $23 each. Disney charges $435 with tax for a 7 day non-expiring ticket.  So, if these tickets were actually worth the full gate price, RCI would have actually charged me a bit less than the ticket value -- it's a $435 ticket, and RCI says it's worth $423.



This gives another data point to measure the devaluation. When I purchased Disney tickets with Points last year, it cost me 44,400 points per 7-day (hopper and all that other stuff) ticket. Using the published discount schedule, a $400 discount is 45,000 points, or 112.5 points = $1. With a price tag of $423/ticket, thats 112.5 * 423 = 47,587.5 points.

So... 47,587.5 points for a ticket that last year was 44,400 points, a 7.2% increase. That's quite a bit more than inflation, but I'm not sure how much the actual Disney ticket prices have gone up. Anyone recall what Disney was charging for a 7-day ticket a year ago?


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## Hoc (Jan 10, 2008)

Pit said:


> So... 47,587.5 points for a ticket that last year was 44,400 points, a 7.2% increase. That's quite a bit more than inflation. . . .



Also remember that, due to inflation, your annual maintenance fees probably went up, so you already paid more than the rate of inflation to get the points already.  The 7.2 percent is on top of that.


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## JudyS (Jan 10, 2008)

Fern Modena said:


> Please let us know what kind of tickets/vouchers you end up getting for your points.


Will do!



rickandcindy23 said:


> They should be the 7-day, non-expiring, "hopper" tickets with the Plus options.
> 
> So you felt like you got a good deal, Judy? ....


I *hope* I'm getting regular Park Hoppers with the regular type of Plus features -- that's not what RCI described to me, but they probably don't know what they're talking about.  If I got the current type of regular Disney ticket (non-expiring, Park Hopper Magic & More), then it's a reasonable deal. 



Pit said:


> This gives another data point to measure the devaluation. When I purchased Disney tickets with Points last year, it cost me 44,400 points per 7-day (hopper and all that other stuff) ticket. Using the published discount schedule, a $400 discount is 45,000 points, or 112.5 points = $1. With a price tag of $423/ticket, thats 112.5 * 423 = 47,587.5 points.
> 
> So... 47,587.5 points for a ticket that last year was 44,400 points, a 7.2% increase. That's quite a bit more than inflation, but I'm not sure how much the actual Disney ticket prices have gone up. Anyone recall what Disney was charging for a 7-day ticket a year ago?


I paid 44,000 per adult 7-day ticket a while back, but RCI raised the number of points per Disney ticket sometime in 2007; I don't think it was 44,000 anymore.  (It may have been over 50,000 points, actually.) 



Hoc said:


> Also remember that, due to inflation, your annual maintenance fees probably went up, so you already paid more than the rate of inflation to get the points already.  The 7.2 percent is on top of that.


Right.  The price of Disney tickets tends to rise each year, but so does the cost of lodgings, such as timeshares.  Since the price of both tends to go up with inflation, there's no real reason for the number of RCI points per Disney ticket to go up.  It's a rip-off.


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## rickandcindy23 (Jan 10, 2008)

Judy, I bought our passes about six months ago and the 7-day park hopper plus, non-expiring ones were 44,400 points.  The cost to me was not a bargain, but it was a good way to use some points.


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## BillR (Jan 11, 2008)

sjschuster said:


> Per RCI Fee structure on 1/9/08.....
> 
> RCI Points Partners® Transaction Fees
> 
> ...


*About the same fee a travel agent charges for their services.*​


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## SJRSONG (Jan 11, 2008)

rickandcindy23 said:


> Judy, I bought our passes about six months ago and the 7-day park hopper plus, non-expiring ones were 44,400 points.  The cost to me was not a bargain, but it was a good way to use some points.




Just want to confirm that "non-expiring" means - that it will never expire???  that I can use in few years??? I would like to use up some of my points also... but will not be able to use tickets for few years until my kids are out of diapers...


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## Jya-Ning (Jan 11, 2008)

TUG101 said:


> Just want to confirm that "non-expiring" means - that it will never expire???  that I can use in few years??? I would like to use up some of my points also... but will not be able to use tickets for few years until my kids are out of diapers...



All Disney ticket, if you bought them but not use them is "non-expiring" (there is no gurantee there will not be have a expiration except Disney's own image).  For ticket that does not have "non-expiring" feature, they will expire within 14 days once you start to use them.  The way Disney structure ticket is that the first few days are extreme high (like $70 per day), for people purchase 7 or 10 days the extra cost is less than $5 per day after the 1st 3 or 4 days.  For people that plan to go to Disney more than few times in their lifetime, but don't plan to go to the park more than 3 days each trip, it makes sense to add "non-expiring" feature.  

Jya-Ning

p.s. With small kids, IMHO, the first few years, you will spend all week in Disney, so "non-expiring" feature may not add too much benefit to you.

pss. Don't own RCI point account, don't know if you can just purchase plain ticket, if you can, then you should do that instaed.  You don't need hopper or Magic & More since it will be very hard just to finish one park per day with small kids, and you can stay in your resort's water park instead of Disney's Water Park.  Ticket is above $210 7 days.


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## janapur (Jan 11, 2008)

Just got our tickets via UPS today . . . not bad since I ordered them on Tuesday. However, I have no idea if I got in before the devaluation.

My problem is twofold: 

I am relatively new to RCI points (finally took the plunge after 18 years as just a weeks owner.) 

I am not Disney savvy. We will be exchanging into OLCC wk 52 2008.

Here's what I've got:

2 adult 4 day park hopper no expiration

1 child 4 day park hopper no expiration

Our daughter is free  

The cost:

115,000  points plus $57.00 plus $69.00 transaction fee

good deal? I'm sure not. I know we would have gotten greater value from a longer pass. However, I do not see visiting the parks more than 4 days and the 4 day pass was the smallest they offered. I'm sure that these do not include the waterparks, but I don't think we'll need them for week 52.

I'm secretly hoping that there'll be enough at the resort to keep the kids entertained, since this is one of the busiest weeks of the year.

Any opinions? You don't have to worry about hurting my feelings- these were points I inherited from an ebay purchase unused by the previous owner.

Jana


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## JudyS (Jan 11, 2008)

rickandcindy23 said:


> Judy, I bought our passes about six months ago and the 7-day park hopper plus, non-expiring ones were 44,400 points.  The cost to me was not a bargain, but it was a good way to use some points.


I paid 44,000 for 7-days a while back, too. I called RCI (sometime in fall 2007, I think) to inquire about buying more Disney tickets and the price had gone up, I think, but I'm just going by memory here.


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## klynn (Jan 11, 2008)

JudyS said:


> I paid 44,000 for 7-days a while back, too. I called RCI (sometime in fall 2007, I think) to inquire about buying more Disney tickets and the price had gone up, I think, but I'm just going by memory here.


 
I just bought 7 -day hoppers last week.  It was 50,500 points.


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## JudyS (Jan 11, 2008)

TUG101 said:


> Just want to confirm that "non-expiring" means - that it will never expire???  that I can use in few years??? I would like to use up some of my points also... but will not be able to use tickets for few years until my kids are out of diapers...


Disney currently sells both expiring and non-expiring tickets. The non-expiring tickets are just that -- they never expire.  In fact, Disney will even give credit if you turn in one of the very old tickets from decades ago, when a separate ticket was required for each ride.  However, such very old tickets are worth far more as collectibles than as a credit towards a new ticket. 

An interesting feature of Disney's non-expiring tickets is that if a child uses a ticket and has days left over, once they are too old to get in for the child's price, Disney will upgrade the remaining days on the ticket to an adult ticket for free.  As Disney puts it, "We don't penalize children for growing up."  However, this only applies to tickets that have been used at least once, not to unused tickets. 



Jya-Ning said:


> ...Don't own RCI point account, don't know if you can just purchase plain ticket, if you can, then you should do that instaed.  You don't need hopper or Magic & More since it will be very hard just to finish one park per day with small kids, and you can stay in your resort's water park instead of Disney's Water Park.  Ticket is above $210 7 days.


I think RCI offers only non-expiring park hoppers with water parks, no other types of Disney tickets. 



janapur said:


> ...Here's what I've got:
> 2 adult 4 day park hopper no expiration
> 1 child 4 day park hopper no expiration
> 
> ...


Are you sure that they don't include the waterparks?  RCI said that waterparks were included.  Can you look at the back of the tickets and tell me what they say?  The adults tickets should say something like, "4 DAY PARK HPR W/4 FUN VISITS AGES(10+)" and then the next line should say, "NO EXPIRATION".  Also, I take it that you got a real Disney ticket (a small piece of heavy-duty paper, about the size of a business card, with a magnetic strip on the back and a picture of a Disney character or landmark on the front)?  RCI said I'd get some sort of voucher, but in the past, I got real Disney tickets from them. 

In terms of whether you got the right ticket length, no worries there.  Shorter tickets are only worth it if you never plan to come back to Disney World. If you want a _longer_ ticket, just bring your unused tickets to any Disney World Guest Services location and you can upgrade each one to another ticket type by paying the difference in the retail costs between the two ticket types.  For example, you could upgrade from 4 days to 5 days, and I think you could get a 7-day non-hopper instead of your 4-day hopper, that sort of thing. (If anyone is interested in upgrading to an annual *pass* instead of to a different *ticket*, it's a bit different. For annual passes, Disney only gives you the _wholesale_ value of your ticket as a credit towards the _retail_ cost of the annual pass, so you lose some value if you do this.) 

In general, I feel the best value for people who plan to return to Disney is to get the longest non-expiring ticket that you can, and save the leftover days for future trips.   7-days is the longest ticket time that RCI has available, but Disney also sells 10-day tickets.  When I got my 7-day tickets from RCI in the past, I took them to Disney World and paid to upgrade to 10-day non-expiring park hoppers with water parks. 

I believe you can upgrade for 14 days after you use the ticket for the first time, so you don't necessarily have to decide what to do before you use the ticket.  However, you have the most options before the ticket is used.  I don't think you could take a _used_ park hopper and apply it towards the cost on a non-hopper ticket, for example. 

Oh yeah, one more thing.  Disney World tickets (at least the non-expiring kind) are usable at the California Disneyland and at Disney's California Adventure.  (Not sure if you can use them in the European or Asian Disney parks.)  We used a few days of our Disney World tickets last summer, and it was a way better deal than buying separate tickets for Disneyland.  You can *not* use Disneyland tickets at Disney World, however.


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## JudyS (Jan 11, 2008)

klynn said:


> I just bought 7 -day hoppers last week.  It was 50,500 points.


Yeah, that sounds like the price RCI quoted me a few months back, Klynn.

Anyone run the numbers yet to see which is the better deal, assuming these are the same ticket types?  I posted the best price I could find for 7-day tix a few posts back.  (I'd do the calculations, but I need to sign off now.)


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## JudyS (Jan 15, 2008)

Ok, I got my Disney tickets from RCI!!!  Despite all the weird things RCI told me (I would get vouchers instead of tickets, etc.), these appear to be perfectly normal Disney tickets of the type currently sold.  They are non-expiring 7-day adult park hoppers with 7 "Fun visits" so they provide 7 admissions to the Disney World "minor parks" (waterparks, Disney Quest, Pleasure Island) and well as 7 days admission to the main Disney World theme parks. 

I received 4 tickets from RCI, and was charged 170,000 RCI Points plus $192.  I was also expecting to be charged a $69 transaction fee, but that hasn't shown up on my credit card yet. The lowest discounted cash price I've found for this ticket type is $402.  (That's a Mousesavers special price that was just released today.) Assuming I eventually get charged the $69 fee, here is the math for the RCI Points value:
4 tickets worth $402 each = $1608
Minus fees of $192 + $69 = $1347 net value received
$1347 / 170,000 RCI Points = *.792 cents per RCI Point under the new system*
(If for some reason the $192 includes the $69 transaction fee, then the value would be .833 cents per RCI Point.) 

And, here is the math for the old ticket price, prior to last week's changeover:
4 tickets at 50,500 each would be 202,000 points
Value received would have been $1608 (total value of tickets) - $69 transaction fee = $1539 
$1539 / 202,000 RCI Points = *.762 cents per RCI Point under the old system*

So, amazingly enough, the new system actually seems to have produced a slight increase in value for this particular transaction!

By the way, the source of these tickets was Entertainment/Travelers' Advantage.  So, I would guess the dicounted RCI price is based on the Travelers' Advantage price, but I don't know that for certain.


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## Fern Modena (Jan 15, 2008)

Thanks, Judy


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## ChristyK (Jan 22, 2008)

You forgot to add the fine print under the grid:

*Subject to changes without notice.  Transaction fees also apply.


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## ChristyK (Jan 22, 2008)

It's $49 for an airline ticket.


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