# Hawaii is likely just eight to 10 days away from dropping COVID-19 testing and quarantine requirements for vaccinated travelers



## DeniseM (Jun 17, 2021)

This is just a TRAVEL ADVISORY - let's keep it that way:








						Mainland vaccinated travelers can soon skip Hawaii testing rules
					

Hawaii is likely just eight to 10 days away from dropping COVID-19 testing and quarantine requirements for travelers from the mainland, Alaska and U.S. territories who have been fully vaccinated against the coronavirus, Lt. Gov. Josh Green said on Wednesday.




					www.staradvertiser.com


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## mjm1 (Jun 17, 2021)

DeniseM said:


> This is just a TRAVEL ADVISORY - let's keep it that way:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks Denise. You may want to edit the title to say “vaxxed travelers.”

Best regards.

Mike


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## 1Kflyerguy (Jun 17, 2021)

thats great news!


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## NTP66 (Jun 17, 2021)

I refuse to get my hopes up, just in case...


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## dsmrp (Jun 17, 2021)

Sounds good, I'm cautiously optimistic the domestic testing requirement will be lifted on July 1. Just hope it will last once it is lifted.


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## Fried_shrimp (Jun 17, 2021)

DeniseM said:


> This is just a TRAVEL ADVISORY - let's keep it that way:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



What a relief that would be.


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## easyrider (Jun 17, 2021)

Either way, testing or no testing, masks or no masks, we are heading to Hawaii and it will take something like an airplane shortage to stop us. We are vaxxed . I wonder what proof they will require since anyone can get a fake vaccination card. Has any group actually kept track of who is actually vaccinated ? I went to my doctor last week and all they did was ask me if I had received the vaccination. They didn't know is what I thought was odd. 

Bill


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## TheHolleys87 (Jun 17, 2021)

easyrider said:


> Has any group actually kept track of who is actually vaccinated ?


The state of Texas required all COVID-19 vaccinations be reported to its immunization registry, and I know mine was because I saw the clerk enter the data online. I think most if not all states have such registries. How easily  accessible that data might be to other states (or to private physicians, Medicare, insurance companies, etc.) I do not know.


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## dsmrp (Jun 17, 2021)

easyrider said:


> Either way, testing or no testing, masks or no masks, we are heading to Hawaii and it will take something like an airplane shortage to stop us. We are vaxxed . I wonder what proof they will require since anyone can get a fake vaccination card. Has any group actually kept track of who is actually vaccinated ? I went to my doctor last week and all they did was ask me if I had received the vaccination. They didn't know is what I thought was odd.
> 
> Bill


I don't think it's logistically and technically feasible for Hawaii officials to validate proof of vaccination, except for their own state. So that's why I presume they still required a negative viral antigen test, until they get their resident vaccination levels up to their own set 60% level , and case counts keep on a downward trend.

I didn't read the article closely, so could be misinterpreting not having to show vaccination status when arriving in Hawaii. But as Bill mentions, physical vaccination cards can be faked.


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## ConejoRed (Jun 17, 2021)

I understand you will have to still upload your vaxx card to the Safe Travels website.  We plan to upload the card and also a copy of the Los Angeles County electronic card that they issued.  The LA electronic card is also integrated with Apple Wallet so covered that way as well if they happen to question the card at the airport.   I think they are just hoping that most people will behave ethically and if a few slip through, their 60% threshold will mitigate that.  

We travel on July 16th so it looks like we may be able to skip testing which will be nice.


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## BJRSanDiego (Jun 17, 2021)

This is very good news.

But I suspect that it will take a bit longer. Not much but perhaps a week or two.  IMnsHO.


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## rickandcindy23 (Jun 17, 2021)

Leaving next Friday for Big Island.  We are vaccinated.  I would bet we will still need the Covid test results by Friday


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## NTP66 (Jun 18, 2021)

It just dawned on me that I'll still be making a Walgreens trip before we leave because my 8 year old daughter is required to take a test. Gonna have to ground her now...


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## csodjd (Jun 18, 2021)

We’re going over in… 11 days. Cutting it close.  

Looking at their numbers there are about 75,000 that are not yet “fully vaccinated” but are in the pipeline, and 65,000 of those need to move from the received one shot category to the fully vaccinated category to reach 60%. Since it takes 2 weeks after the last shot to be full vaccinated, whether we’ll need to get tested is already determined mathematically… we just don’t know the answer yet. 

Guess we’ll wait until the last minute to get tested to see if we can save a few hundred dollars! My hope is that they will announce the change several days ahead of actually reaching 60% based on knowing when they will rather than waiting until they get there, though I suspect it’ll be the latter.


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## rickandcindy23 (Jun 18, 2021)

CalGalTraveler said:


> Good news but we are traveling in 8 days. Will likely need to take the test because 72 hours prior.
> 
> We are not using Kaiser because they take 48 hours plus where we live in norcal. Will take from one of the providers that is partnering with Southwest to ensure all the paperwork is completed on time.


Which island?  We will be at Hilton Kohala Suites, then Hilton Kingsland, starting next week.  So looking forward to it.


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## CalGalTraveler (Jun 18, 2021)

I PMed details.


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## zentraveler (Jun 18, 2021)

Leaving July 3 for HHV and am hoping, but suspect the requirement will not be lifted by then , but hope springs eternal!


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## csodjd (Jun 18, 2021)

DeniseM said:


> This is just a TRAVEL ADVISORY - let's keep it that way:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I bit of new information in the news today from the Governor...

"He said the state is currently preparing for the 60% vaccination milestone.

When that happens, trans-Pacific travelers who have been vaccinated in other states will be able to skip pre-travel testing and quarantine requirements. Ige said in the next two weeks, the state will be ready to verify a person’s out-of-state vaccination status."


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## critterchick (Jun 18, 2021)

ConejoRed said:


> I understand you will have to still upload your vaxx card to the Safe Travels website.  We plan to upload the card and also a copy of the Los Angeles County electronic card that they issued.  The LA electronic card is also integrated with Apple Wallet so covered that way as well if they happen to question the card at the airport.   I think they are just hoping that most people will behave ethically and if a few slip through, their 60% threshold will mitigate that.
> 
> We travel on July 16th so it looks like we may be able to skip testing which will be nice.



Where did you find the LA County electronic card? I heard that the state has a version (that can't go into Wallet) that came out today. Thanks.  Never mind - I found a reference and it's only for certain locations, not including hospitals, which is where we got ours. Oh, well.


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## ConejoRed (Jun 18, 2021)

critterchick said:


> Where did you find the LA County electronic card? I heard that the state has a version (that can't go into Wallet) that came out today. Thanks. Never mind - I found a reference and it's only for certain locations, not including hospitals, which is where we got ours. Oh, well.


We got ours at a “Mega Pod“ site so that is probably why we were able to get the digital card.  Will need to check the new state version info.  Hadn’t heard that yet.


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## csodjd (Jun 18, 2021)

critterchick said:


> Where did you find the LA County electronic card? I heard that the state has a version (that can't go into Wallet) that came out today. Thanks.  Never mind - I found a reference and it's only for certain locations, not including hospitals, which is where we got ours. Oh, well.


Here is the link to California's official state governmental vaccination verification app:






						Digital COVID-19 Vaccine Record
					

Get a digital copy of your COVID-19 vaccination record




					myvaccinerecord.cdph.ca.gov
				




I filled in the form: it asks Name, birthdate, and your cell phone or email address used when you got your vaccine. Then this message comes up:

*Digital COVID-19 Vaccine Record Submission Receipt*
*Thank you.*
Your submission has been received. If the information provided matches the vaccination registry, you will receive a link to access your COVID-19 vaccine record.
If you need further assistance, you may contact your vaccine provider directly or submit a request with the California Department of Public Health.

I used my email first. I received an email saying no match. So I used my cell phone. I got a text saying no match. I got my vaccination at a private medical clinic.


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## ConejoRed (Jun 18, 2021)

Thanks!  Went through the process using the cell number and got an almost immediate text with the link to the digital record and QR code.  It lists the vaccine dates and which vaccine.  Then did DH and got his as well. Given that we used a Mega Pod site is probably the difference and it may take longer for private clinics to submit their data (I am assuming they are required to report the information to the state or county at some point).


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## csodjd (Jun 18, 2021)

ConejoRed said:


> Thanks!  Went through the process using the cell number and got an almost immediate text with the link to the digital record and QR code.  It lists the vaccine dates and which vaccine.  Then did DH and got his as well. Given that we used a Mega Pod site is probably the difference and it may take longer for private clinics to submit their data (I am assuming they are required to report the information to the state or county at some point).


I'll try my wife. She got her shots at a UCLA clinic in Calabasas.


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## krj9999 (Jun 19, 2021)

And this discussion is getting way off topic now.


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## DeniseM (Jun 19, 2021)

I'm moving the insurance posts to a new thread, so we can focus on Hawaii in this thread: https://tugbbs.com/forums/threads/c-19-testing-and-insurance.320903/


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## csodjd (Jun 19, 2021)

krj9999 said:


> And this discussion is getting way off topic now.


Very much so. I’m just hoping, but not confident, that Hawaii will eliminate the mainland testing requirement before we fly over in 10 days. I’m guessing I’ll miss by a couple days (it was my comment that I’d save a few hundred dollars for the tests if they change the rule before I go that took us off topic).


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## NTP66 (Jun 21, 2021)

...so yeah, Hawaii appears to be within 10 days of dropping COVID testing requirements.


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## csodjd (Jun 21, 2021)

NTP66 said:


> ...so yeah, Hawaii appears to be within 10 days of dropping COVID testing requirements.


Ugh. And I‘m 8 days from flying, so 7 days from having to get tested. My wife and I both know we’re going to miss by “this much.”


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## controller1 (Jun 21, 2021)

NTP66 said:


> ...so yeah, Hawaii appears to be within 10 days of dropping COVID testing requirements.



YES, I would love to get back on topic and drop the insurance/ethics discussion. (please)


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## DeniseM (Jun 22, 2021)

There is another thread in this form for* Insurance posts*.  That is not the topic of this thread.


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## DeniseM (Jun 22, 2021)

*This is a travel advisory - don't make it political.*

Hawaii is 3% away from dropping the mandatory C-19 testing. Some are hoping for a July 1 policy change:








						Green wants COVID rules for U.S. visitors updated before July 4 to avoid ‘chaos’
					

Hawaii Lt. Gov. Josh Green is urging the state to commit to dropping its COVID-19 testing and quarantine requirements for fully vaccinated mainland visitors ahead of the Fourth of July weekend to avoid “chaos at the airports.”




					www.staradvertiser.com


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## Ty1on (Jun 22, 2021)

After dropping $420 for covid tests, I curse timing.


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## CalGalTraveler (Jun 22, 2021)

One week too late for us. At least the inter-island tests are gone.


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## MommaBear (Jun 22, 2021)

For all of you who paid big bucks for your testing to go to Hawaii, we got ours free through Walgreen's. I wonder what the difference is. Could it have been our Medicare age? Pre-existing conditions? Luck?


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## csodjd (Jun 22, 2021)

DeniseM said:


> *This is a travel advisory - don't make it political.*
> 
> Hawaii is 3% away from dropping the mandatory C-19 testing. Some are hoping for a July 1 policy change:
> 
> ...


Still hoping they'll look out ahead and change the rules effective when they hit 60% and not just announce the date when the rules will change when they hit 60%. It seems the Lt. Gov. wants that. The Gov, not so clearly. He seems to be saying, once they reach 60% they'll let everyone know how much longer before the testing requirement goes away.

The story says that Ige cautioned that number of people getting vaccinated each day is declining which will delay getting to the key 60% level. “We do anticipate crossing that 60% threshold,” said Ige. “It is hard to predict exactly when that would happen because of the fact that the pace of vaccinations is actually slowing...."

But that's incorrect. Someone becoming fully vaccinated tomorrow had their second shot (or their single J&J shot) two weeks ago. If they have enough people in that two-week pipeline to reach 60% there's no stopping reaching 60%, so they should know now when they'll hit that 60% number. The slowing rate of vaccinations impacts things 5-6 weeks later (3-4 weeks for 2nd shot, 2 weeks more after that). 

And, yes, the Lt. Gov. is correct... the airports will be a LOT easier to deal with over the holiday weekend if they don't have to do the Safe Travel checks.


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## bnoble (Jun 22, 2021)

csodjd said:


> if they don't have to do the Safe Travel checks.


The way I am reading things is that there will still be some form of Safe Travels checking, but without the uncertainty of getting a test back in time.


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## csodjd (Jun 22, 2021)

bnoble said:


> The way I am reading things is that there will still be some form of Safe Travels checking, but without the uncertainty of getting a test back in time.


Yes, I guess you'll still have to show your proof of vaccination. I was entering our upcoming trip this morning and saw that they have updated the Safe Travels website to allow for those vaccinated in Hawaii to upload a JPG of their CDC vaccine card, but it says they still have to show it at the airport.


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## cowboy (Jun 23, 2021)

Were your trips from the mainland or inter-island?


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## csodjd (Jun 23, 2021)

cowboy said:


> Were your trips from the mainland or inter-island?


Mainland.


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## HGVC Lover (Jun 23, 2021)

Not so fast......Hawaii time.....I doubt it will happen before July 4th or even in the month of July if I were a betting man......
https://www.civilbeat.org/2021/06/i...ictions-ahead-of-july-4-as-vaccinations-slow/


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## csodjd (Jun 23, 2021)

HGVC Lover said:


> Not so fast......Hawaii time.....I doubt it will happen before July 4th or even in the month of July if I were a betting man......
> https://www.civilbeat.org/2021/06/i...ictions-ahead-of-july-4-as-vaccinations-slow/


I watched an interview of the Lt. Gov. this morning from yesterday. He said that they will exceed 60% before July 1 based on the number of people that received their second shots more than 1 week ago. They know the exact number of people that are more than 1 wk and less than 2 wk post second shot, and the number that are less than 1 wk post second shot. That first group puts them over 60% and that will occur BEFORE June 29 (one week from yesterday when he quoted the numbers). 

He is advocating for a July 1 date. He made clear that the ball is in the Governor's court and it is just now up to the Governor to decide what day they will start accepting proof of mainland vaccination in lieu of testing to be exempt from quarantine.


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## rickandcindy23 (Jun 23, 2021)

We fly on Saturday and are getting our Covid tests on Thursday.  That is cutting it close, but last time Kaiser had ours done in 12 hours.  We are vaccinated, so I think the requirement is a bit ridiculous.


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## bnoble (Jun 23, 2021)

HGVC Lover said:


> or even in the month of July if I were a betting man..


I think I'd take that bet, based on the rate they got from 55%->57% (about one week). Even if they only maintained half that rate, that's still ~3 weeks from now.


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## Tamaradarann (Jun 24, 2021)

csodjd said:


> Yes, I guess you'll still have to show your proof of vaccination. I was entering our upcoming trip this morning and saw that they have updated the Safe Travels website to allow for those vaccinated in Hawaii to upload a JPG of their CDC vaccine card, but it says they still have to show it at the airport.



I just looked at my CDC vaccination card trying to find what the JPG was on the card and couldn't find anything that matched that.  We were vaccinated in New York State at a Catholic Health Services major vaccination site in  February and March.  What is the JPG?


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## NTP66 (Jun 24, 2021)

Tamaradarann said:


> I just looked at my CDC vaccination card trying to find what the JPG was on the card and couldn't find anything that matched that.  We were vaccinated in New York State at a Catholic Health Services major vaccination site in  February and March.  What is the JPG?


JPG is an image format -so if you scan your CDC card and save it, most apps will save it as a .jpg file.


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## Tamaradarann (Jun 24, 2021)

Tamaradarann said:


> I just looked at my CDC vaccination card trying to find what the JPG was on the card and couldn't find anything that matched that.  We were vaccinated in New York State at a Catholic Health Services major vaccination site in  February and March.  What is the JPG?



I just realized what you meant by the JPG!  A picture of the card!  I was looking for some type of official number or registration that would be recognized by the officials in Hawaii.  Billlions being spent on vaccinations in the US and no type of record system that can be checked and recognized by different agencies!


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## Henry M. (Jun 24, 2021)

At this stage of the game, a statement by the person saying they've been vaccinated is about as trustworthy as the card itself.

in my case, for the first shot they wrote down the lot number and the brand name on the card and handed it to me to fill out the rest. I forgot the card for the second shot, so the nurse wrote down the lot number on a business card and told me to just fill it in myself. She claimed the doctor's office would have a record of the vaccination, but that there was no other registry where the information would go to.

It's down to believing individuals and taking their word at face value to determine if they've been vaccinated.


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## rickandcindy23 (Jun 24, 2021)

I keep watching this thread, hopefully to find out that the requirement is dropped by this Saturday, which is when we arrive, but alas, we are leaving in an hour to get our Covid tests.


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## csodjd (Jun 24, 2021)

rickandcindy23 said:


> I keep watching this thread, hopefully to find out that the requirement is dropped by this Saturday, which is when we arrive, but alas, we are leaving in an hour to get our Covid tests.


Right there with you. We’re holding off until Monday to get tested for our Tuesday trip, but it’s wishful thinking at this point. I do think the Lt. Gov. Is spot on though with his concern if they don’t change the rule by July 1. As he explained, they are sure to get travelers over the July 4 weekend thinking all they need is proof of vaccination.


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## NTP66 (Jun 24, 2021)

We have to get our daughter tested regardless, but was hoping that my wife and I could skip it so that we could split up when we land (I want to get my rental car quickly). I don't have to schedule my test until next Thursday, so I'm holding out a little more hope.


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## csodjd (Jun 24, 2021)

Henry M. said:


> It's down to believing individuals and taking their word at face value to determine if they've been vaccinated.


Probably true. But at this point, with most of Hawaii that visitors are in contact with being vaccinated (it is the more rural communities where vaccination rates are lower and dragging down the overall numbers), it no longer presents much risk to Hawaii residents, it is more a risk to the lying traveler.


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## zentraveler (Jun 24, 2021)

csodjd said:


> Right there with you. We’re holding off until Monday to get tested for our Tuesday trip, but it’s wishful thinking at this point. I do think the Lt. Gov. Is spot on though with his concern if they don’t change the rule by July 1. As he explained, they are sure to get travelers over the July 4 weekend thinking all they need is proof of vaccination.



I leave next a week from Saturday - July 3 - an am praying full time! I don't care so much about getting the test; that is the easy part. I am just hoping to have a smoother time landing at HNL on a holiday weekend.


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## NTP66 (Jun 24, 2021)

The test is going to be the easy part when you're looking at spending 13-15 hours in airports and on a plane...


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## JIMinNC (Jun 24, 2021)

Tamaradarann said:


> I just realized what you meant by the JPG!  A picture of the card!  I was looking for some type of official number or registration that would be recognized by the officials in Hawaii.  Billlions being spent on vaccinations in the US and no type of record system that can be checked and recognized by different agencies!



The CDC maintains summary statistics for the entire country, but the person-level data lives in separate data systems in each state, usually in the state public health department. Given the speed that we deployed the vaccines and the need to deploy them as rapidly as possible, developing a massive, centralized national individual tracking database would have likely slowed the process considerably. It likely was seen as quicker to decentralize the individual record-keeping in each state's existing infrastructure to move faster, rather than bogging down the process by requiring a massive national system. The downside of that is we don't have the centralized data repository that smaller countries have, but I'm sure everyone felt getting shots in arms as fast as possible to protect as many people as quickly as possible was a higher priority than person-level data at the national level.


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## dsmrp (Jun 24, 2021)

Covid tests are plentiful compared to rental cars, ha ha!  A year ago it was the opposite.


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## csodjd (Jun 24, 2021)

JIMinNC said:


> The CDC maintains summary statistics for the entire country, but the person-level data lives in separate data systems in each state, usually in the state public health department. Given the speed that we deployed the vaccines and the need to deploy them as rapidly as possible, developing a massive, centralized national individual tracking database would have likely slowed the process considerably. It likely was seen as quicker to decentralize the individual record-keeping in each state's existing infrastructure to move faster, rather than bogging down the process by requiring a massive national system. The downside of that is we don't have the centralized data repository that smaller countries have, but I'm sure everyone felt getting shots in arms as fast as possible to protect as many people as quickly as possible was a higher priority than person-level data at the national level.


It is unknown to me what requirements were in place that the entity delivering the vaccination into your arm report into the state database. I know that I was vaccinated in a private “concierge style” corporate medical office (“Medical One”) and my wife got her shot at a UCLA medical office. California doesn’t show me in their database and they do show her. Did Medical One drop the ball? Were they required to report? Was an error made? I don’t know the answers to these questions, but I do know that it means the state database is incomplete. If you are in it you were probably vaccinated. If you are not in it it doesn’t mean you were not vaccinated.


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## NTP66 (Jun 24, 2021)

Welp, July 8th is the official date, per Ige. From his FB page just now:



> Hawaiʻi is expected to reach a 60% fully vaccinated rate by July 8. Because of that, we will be able to safely relax some of the travel and social restrictions currently in place. Beginning July 8, Hawaiʻi will accept vaccination records from other states and US territories to bypass quarantine/pre-travel testing. Social gatherings will increase to 25 indoors and 75 outdoors statewide. Restaurants can also increase to 75% capacity (max 25 indoors/75 outdoors). Mahalo to everyone for doing their part to keep our community safe as we continue to begin resuming life “normally.” If you’re interested in getting vaccinated, you can find a link to register here: https://hawaiicovid19.com/vaccine/ #HIGotVaccinated


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## CalGalTraveler (Jun 24, 2021)

We got our results back in 12 hours from CityHealth. Super easy. Now figuring out how to get registered on safe travels and upload.


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## csodjd (Jun 24, 2021)

zentraveler said:


> I leave next a week from Saturday - July 3 - an am praying full time! I don't care so much about getting the test; that is the easy part. I am just hoping to have a smoother time landing at HNL on a holiday weekend.


That was the Lt. Gov.'s concern. That many will come over thinking that all they need next weekend is a vaccination card. By then Hawaii will probably have hit 60% and people will easily be confused into thinking they don't need to be tested.


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## BJRSanDiego (Jun 25, 2021)

As of today's data from the official Hawaii site, they are at 57%.  The current rate of "closure" is about 1 % increase every 5 to 7 days.  So, I think that on July 8 that they'll be very close BUT not yet at 60 percent.  I wonder if they will still open things up if they are at, say, 59%.


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## csodjd (Jun 25, 2021)

BJRSanDiego said:


> As of today's data from the official Hawaii site, they are at 57%.  The current rate of "closure" is about 1 % increase every 5 to 7 days.  So, I think that on July 8 that they'll be very close BUT not yet at 60 percent.  I wonder if they will still open things up if they are at, say, 59%.


According to the Lt. Gov.’s data, your analysis is incorrect. According to him, the number of people ALREADY vaccinated and just awaiting the two-weeks to be “fully vaccinated” already puts them over the 60% threshold, the majority of those (enough to go over 60%) are already past the first week of those two weeks, and every day more and more of those cross that two-week line. They know quite precisely how many are in the unstoppable pipeline to being fully vaccinated and when they will hit 60%.


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## BJRSanDiego (Jun 25, 2021)

csodjd said:


> According to the Lt. Gov.’s data, your analysis is incorrect. According to him, the number of people ALREADY vaccinated and just awaiting the two-weeks to be “fully vaccinated” already puts them over the 60% threshold, the majority of those (enough to go over 60%) are already past the first week of those two weeks, and every day more and more of those cross that two-week line. They know quite precisely how many are in the unstoppable pipeline to being fully vaccinated and when they will hit 60%.


I hope that you (and Josh Green) are correct.


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## csodjd (Jun 25, 2021)

BJRSanDiego said:


> I hope that you (and Josh Green) are correct.


All that really matters is that the state stands by what the Governor said, and I'm confident they will.


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## BJRSanDiego (Jul 9, 2021)

csodjd said:


> According to the Lt. Gov.’s data, *your analysis is incorrect*. According to him, the number of people ALREADY vaccinated and just awaiting the two-weeks to be “fully vaccinated” already puts them over the 60% threshold, the majority of those (enough to go over 60%) are already past the first week of those two weeks, and every day more and more of those cross that two-week line. They know quite precisely how many are in the unstoppable pipeline to being fully vaccinated and when they will hit 60%.



I am pleased that the Lt. Governor and Governor followed through and eliminated the pre-test for travelers from the mainland who have been vax'd even though Hawaii fell short of its 60% target.

As of today (July 9), the official Hawaii DOH data shows that we are at 58.3% fully vax'd.  That doesn't surprise me based on the data I was seeing when I made my previous post.  So, I guess that the Lt. Governors own analysis was lacking or more blunt:  the Lt. Governor's own analysis was, in the words of @csodjd, "incorrect."

BTW, I have a science and math background. I love doing numerical analysis.  What I saw that that lead me to my the conclusions I posted was that the data on the rate of vaccinations has been dropping significantly.  Very simply, I looked at the number of people that would need to get their second shot and divided it by the number of days until July 8 and I saw the daily numbers that were too low to bring closure.

So, based on the official Hawaii DOH data, the people who have have had only one vax, have NOT been following up 100% with their second shot.  For instance, on June 14, 60% had their first shot.  So, most people would assume that in 2 weeks following June 14, that 60% of the people would have taken their second shot.  So, using that logic, Hawaii would have been at 60% fully vaxed by June 28.  But instead, we were only at 57.6% fully vaxed.  So, a significant number of first-time vax'd people aren't showing up for their second shot.   I find that concerning.  I haven't tried to analyze how long it will take to reach 70% fully vaxed but I think that it could possibly one to two months or perhaps even more if the daily vax rate continues to drop  That is just a guess on my part at this point.

There is something else that I find strange - - that is that on July 2nd, we were at 58.2% fully vax'd and then July 5, 6, 7 and 8 Hawaii DOH reported LOWER numbers.  Perhaps they found some errors in their data.

Just my observations.


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## critterchick (Jul 10, 2021)

MommaBear said:


> For all of you who paid big bucks for your testing to go to Hawaii, we got ours free through Walgreen's. I wonder what the difference is. Could it have been our Medicare age? Pre-existing conditions? Luck?



Medicare covers the test, so Walgreens likely billed them. I suspect that many younger folks also were covered by their insurance. And the rest got it for free as well - Walgreens, unlike CVS, don't charge for the test. but we live in CA, where the approved rapid test isn't available, and didn't want to take a chance back in May so went to CityHealth and paid $20 for a rapid test. My assumption is that they also billed Medicare and Tricare but I haven't seen an EOB from either of them yet.


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## BJRSanDiego (Jul 31, 2021)

Yesterday, July 30, Hawaii finally reached 60% fully vaxed.  The original story (post #1) thought that they would achieve that by about June 27.  Well it took an additional month, but it finally occurred.  

In regards to when Hawaii will reach the 70% milestone, people have opined that it will occur in September.  But the rate of "closure" is extremely low.  IMHO, it could take anywhere from 3 to 6 months.


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## csodjd (Jul 31, 2021)

BJRSanDiego said:


> Yesterday, July 30, Hawaii finally reached 60% fully vaxed.  The original story (post #1) thought that they would achieve that by about June 27.  Well it took an additional month, but it finally occurred.
> 
> In regards to when Hawaii will reach the 70% milestone, people have opined that it will occur in September.  But the rate of "closure" is extremely low.  IMHO, it could take anywhere from 3 to 6 months.


Can't help but wonder if the surge occurring there now will help drive people to be vaccinated. It may be awfully hard to get to that 70% without kids under 12 and without some existential push like a surge of cases.


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## BJRSanDiego (Jul 31, 2021)

csodjd said:


> Can't help but wonder if the surge occurring there now will help drive people to be vaccinated. It may be awfully hard to get to that 70% without kids under 12 and without some existential push like a surge of cases.


Yes, I'm wondering the same thing about the surge being a catalyst.  Right now the published death rate is still very low.  But the deaths lag the reported new cases by about 3 weeks.  So, it may take a while for people to take this surge more seriously and get more motivated to get the jab.

It is surprising how many people have taken only one dose of vaccine and didn't follow up with the second one.  Around June 9, the single dose group reached the 60% point.  If everyone with the single dose would have followed up with the second dose, it would have only taken perhaps a week to 10 days.  That is probably what the reporter of the article (and Josh Green) thought.  That is, they assumed that everyone would get the 2nd dose.  But it actually took about 50 more days before the fully vax'd percent hit 60%.  So, it seems like a bunch of people are either skipping the 2nd dose or are delaying it.

I'm hoping that Hawaii doesn't back track and re-institute Covid pre-tests for the vax'd people traveling to Hawaii.


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## TravelTime (Jul 31, 2021)

They measure the percentage based on 12+.


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## BJRSanDiego (Jul 31, 2021)

TravelTime said:


> They measure the percentage based on 12+.


Huh?  I don't understand what 12+ means.


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## Luanne (Jul 31, 2021)

BJRSanDiego said:


> Huh?  I don't understand what 12+ means.


Ages 12 and up?


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## Tamaradarann (Aug 1, 2021)

BJRSanDiego said:


> Yes, I'm wondering the same thing about the surge being a catalyst.  Right now the published death rate is still very low.  But the deaths lag the reported new cases by about 3 weeks.  So, it may take a while for people to take this surge more seriously and get more motivated to get the jab.
> 
> It is surprising how many people have taken only one dose of vaccine and didn't follow up with the second one.  Around June 9, the single dose group reached the 60% point.  If everyone with the single dose would have followed up with the second dose, it would have only taken perhaps a week to 10 days.  That is probably what the reporter of the article (and Josh Green) thought.  That is, they assumed that everyone would get the 2nd dose.  But it actually took about 50 more days before the fully vax'd percent hit 60%.  So, it seems like a bunch of people are either skipping the 2nd dose or are delaying it.
> 
> I'm hoping that Hawaii doesn't back track and re-institute Covid pre-tests for the vax'd people traveling to Hawaii.



With the numbers going up so much I am less concerned about kids under 12 getting vaccinated or getting to 70% of the Hawaiian Residents vaccinated.  It is apparent that vaccinated tourists, who as we know can still be infected, are bringing the virus in great numbers to Hawaii and that is why the numbers are going up.  I haven't been able to get any data on severity of those that are infected or the hospitalizations so I don't know what impact this has on the health system but it certainly seems like the virus is circulating in Hawaii more than it ever has.  

I am concerned that they will implement testing of everyone, vaccinated or not, before they come to Hawaii.  We have been vaccinated but have never been tested since we have never needed to get tested.  

I do have some hope in the near future with the high infected numbers.  This is peak summer tourist season with the highest number of tourists bringing the highest number of children to Hawaii.  Those numbers will be coming down significantly come September.  I suspect that the infected numbers will be going down also.  Also, while in the temperated climates the chances of infection go up in the Fall and Winter since people spend more time in doors closed up.  However, in Hawaii the numbers go down since less infected tourists come and it is less crowded, but everyone is still outdoors and perhaps the windows are open more since it is not as hot.


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## NTP66 (Aug 1, 2021)

Every report that I have read recently states the opposite - that the increased numbers are largely from residents.


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## Tamaradarann (Aug 1, 2021)

NTP66 said:


> Every report that I have read recently states the opposite - that the increased numbers are largely from residents.



I haven't seen any report that said that but I would be interested in seeing it.  What I am looking at is the major increase in cases in July when the number of tourist arrivals along with with the lifting of the negative covid pre-test requirement for tourists was lifted.  I don't think that is just a coincidence.  However, there is a possibility that we are both right:

I was just thinking about something eating lunch a few minutes ago.  Tourists who have been vaccinated and become infected with covid shoud be coming down with a mild case.  I have been on vacation at times and come down with a mild illness such as a cold, sinus infection, headache but I don't seek medical assistance I just deal with it with Advil, Tylenol, anti-histamines, decongestants etc.  Maybe that is what is happening so those that are seeking medical assitance are locals.


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## capjak (Aug 1, 2021)

In Maui County, there is an average of 24 new cases with a 4.5% test positivity rate over 14 days. For every 100,000 residents in Maui County, there have been an average of 14.4 newly reported cases per day over the last seven days. 

There are 18 individuals hospitalized in Maui County with COVID-19, according to counts last updated on July 30, 2021, from the Hawaiʻi Emergency Management Agency. 

There are 18 ICU beds being used in Maui County at this time (out of 31 currently available). Four of the ICU beds are being used by COVID-19 patients. Eight ventilators (out of 38 available) are being used in Maui County, with three being used by COVID-19 patients.


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## capjak (Aug 1, 2021)

Tamaradarann said:


> I haven't seen any report that said that but I would be interested in seeing it.  What I am looking at is the major increase in cases in July when the number of tourist arrivals along with with the lifting of the negative covid pre-test requirement for tourists was lifted.  I don't think that is just a coincidence.  However, there is a possibility that we are both right:







__





						Hawaii COVID-19 Data | Disease Outbreak Control Division | COVID-19
					






					health.hawaii.gov
				




The results are on this page and if you select table form it shows:
382 new cases on Maui in July 2021.

4% from non resident travel, 85% local community spread, 11% resident travel,


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## controller1 (Aug 1, 2021)

TravelTime said:


> They measure the percentage based on 12+.



"But the governor’s 70% vaccination benchmark refers to the _total_ population."








						Ige: COVID restrictions will likely remain in place until the fall
					

Gov. David Ige says dropping the rules before Hawaii hits a 70% vaccination rate would be a mistake.




					www.hawaiinewsnow.com


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## lynne (Aug 1, 2021)

capjak said:


> In Maui County, there is an average of 24 new cases with a 4.5% test positivity rate over 14 days. For every 100,000 residents in Maui County, there have been an average of 14.4 newly reported cases per day over the last seven days.
> 
> There are 18 individuals hospitalized in Maui County with COVID-19, according to counts last updated on July 30, 2021, from the Hawaiʻi Emergency Management Agency.
> 
> There are 18 ICU beds being used in Maui County at this time (out of 31 currently available). Four of the ICU beds are being used by COVID-19 patients. Eight ventilators (out of 38 available) are being used in Maui County, with three being used by COVID-19 patients.


Queen's Medical on Oahu and Hawai'i Island is beginning to feel the effects:








						Queen's in need of 130 extra nurses to take on influx in hospitalizations
					

Queen's has seen a rise in both COVID and regular patients, including those who seek medical care for heart attacks, strokes, and trauma.




					www.kitv.com
				




As a data point, the hospitals on Hawai'i Island are beginning to curtail any visitors from coming into the facilities.  Hawai'i Island's infection rate is the highest in the state at 7% mostly due to resident travel and then bringing the virus back resulting community spread.  For travel related, 85% is resident and 15% is visitor in Kamuela zip code (96743)

****If this is post not appropriate for the Hawaii forum, please move to Covid-19 specific****


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## csodjd (Aug 1, 2021)

Tamaradarann said:


> It is apparent that vaccinated tourists, who as we know can still be infected, are bringing the virus in great numbers to Hawaii and that is why the numbers are going up.


As stated above, that is not correct. At least that is not what the officials (political and healthcare) in Hawaii are reporting. 

I just returned from 10 days there, and every report on the local news is saying the same thing -- the increase is the result of non-vaccinated residents returning to Hawaii and spreading COVID among their friends, family, church groups, etc. The attribute it to residents becoming infected shortly before being tested and returning, resulting in false negatives. It is particuarly a problem with those taking short trips to the mainland such as to Las Vegas.

The only meaningful way to address this is to require any unvaccinated person to undergo a test after arrival that is 5-7 days after their pre-flight test, and to have fast effective contract tracing for those that test positive on the second test (or require quarantine until the 2nd test).


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## youppi (Aug 1, 2021)

csodjd said:


> The attribute it to residents becoming infected shortly before being tested and returning, resulting in false negatives.


Why not after the pre-flight test ? 
There is plenty of time to be infected during the 72 hrs between the test and the departure if somebody doesn't take care.


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## csodjd (Aug 1, 2021)

youppi said:


> Why not after the pre-flight test ?
> There is plenty of time to be infected during the 72 hrs between the test and the departure if somebody doesn't take care.


Certainly that too. But I believe what they are seeing is the ~5-day trip (Vegas and Texas were mentioned most) where people get exposed in their first couple days and so no matter when they get tested for the return flight, whether 3 days or 3 hrs before departure, it's probably too soon to pick up the infection.


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## Tamaradarann (Aug 1, 2021)

capjak said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thank you for the Hawaii Covid-19 Data.  The data does indicate like you said that the majority of cases that are revealed with testing are coming from those that are either returning residents or local community spread.  However, in your post you just copied the first part of my post in responding.   You left out the reason I said that perhaps we are both right.  I believe the important part of my post was this:

_"Tourists who have been vaccinated and become infected with covid shoud be coming down with a mild case. I have been on vacation at times and come down with a mild illness such as a cold, sinus infection, headache but I don't seek medical assistance I just deal with it with Advil, Tylenol, anti-histamines, decongestants etc. Maybe that is what is happening so those that are seeking medical assitance are locals."_

The returning residents are a small fraction of those that get off the planes but more of them are testing positive than the tourists which is one indication that my statement above has some relevance.  Why would more returning residents be testing positive?  Also the returning residents live in Hawaii and perhaps have family and friends they want to protect from getting the virus so they are going to want to get tested.  The tourist don't, they are on vacation so they are less apt to get tested.


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## csodjd (Aug 1, 2021)

Tamaradarann said:


> The returning residents are a small fraction of those that get off the planes but more of them are testing positive than the tourists which is one indication that my statement above has some relevance. Why would more returning residents be testing positive? Also the returning residents live in Hawaii and perhaps have family and friends they want to protect from getting the virus so they are going to want to get tested. The tourist don't, they are on vacation so they are less apt to get tested.


All very speculative. We can safely assume that tourists are not coming to Hawaii and choosing to quarantine; They are coming vaccinated and/or tested so they can vacation. A fair number of residents are returning with neither vaccination or testing and are being required to (choosing to) quarantine. This is known. It's in the data. Prior to this surge this was believed to be the primary source of COVID in the state, and it may well be a primary source of the surge along with the residents that tested falsely negative. 

Moreover, tourists do tourist things in tourist places. They have never been a significant source of community spread. That has consistently been traced to church locations/events funerals, families, parties, etc.

In any event, your explanation would not affect the reported number of cases that has increased 3x-5x the last week or so because if tourists are not being tested they are not part of those numbers. All you are suggesting, without any data to support the theory, is that there are actually more cases than being reported. 

My experience in Honolulu during the 18 days I was there in July was that people were largely wearing their masks when they should, indoors, etc., and going along pretty normal. I left a few days ago just as the case numbers were jumping, but overall the numbers are still pretty low and there has not been a lot of impact in the hospitals, though I did play golf with a nurse that works in the Woman's and Children's Hospital and he said they were definitely seeing some young women and children with COVID, and had just taken a 26-wk gestation baby by C-section so they could put the mother on a respirator.


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## lynne (Aug 1, 2021)

Tamaradarann said:


> Thank you for the Hawaii Covid-19 Data.  The data does indicate like you said that the majority of cases that are revealed with testing are coming from those that are either returning residents or local community spread.  However, in your post you just copied the first part of my post in responding.   You left out the reason I said that perhaps we are both right.  I believe the important part of my post was this:
> 
> _"Tourists who have been vaccinated and become infected with covid shoud be coming down with a mild case. I have been on vacation at times and come down with a mild illness such as a cold, sinus infection, headache but I don't seek medical assistance I just deal with it with Advil, Tylenol, anti-histamines, decongestants etc. Maybe that is what is happening so those that are seeking medical assitance are locals."_
> 
> The returning residents are a small fraction of those that get off the planes but more of them are testing positive than the tourists which is one indication that my statement above has some relevance.  Why would more returning residents be testing positive?  Also the returning residents live in Hawaii and perhaps have family and friends they want to protect from getting the virus so they are going to want to get tested.  The tourist don't, they are on vacation so they are less apt to get tested.


You are correct that non-residents are only picked up if they begin to feel ill and submit to a test.  They are not included in Hawaii's infection numbers making it almost impossible to determine the true ratio of infections from travel.  Non-residents can also contribute to the community spread numbers if they have an infection when out in public and infect a resident.  One of the large clusters in Kauai was from non-resident and resident travelers who went to church where the infection spread.  

There are many more cases that are not being reported in the state due to the lack of testing.  As of today, the numbers have been moving in the wrong direction for over a week and in person school is beginning on Tuesday leading to more outbreaks.


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## Tamaradarann (Aug 1, 2021)

lynne said:


> You are correct that non-residents are only picked up if they begin to feel ill and submit to a test.  They are not included in Hawaii's infection numbers making it almost impossible to determine the true ratio of infections from travel.  Non-residents can also contribute to the community spread numbers if they have an infection when out in public and infect a resident.  One of the large clusters in Kauai was from non-resident and resident travelers who went to church where the infection spread.
> 
> There are many more cases that are not being reported in the state due to the lack of testing.  As of today, the numbers have been moving in the wrong direction for over a week and in person school is beginning on Tuesday leading to more outbreaks.



Lynne, thank you for acknowledging and verifying that the points that I am making are actually occuring not just speculation.  I know when we are in Hawaii we mix with residents in restaurants, breweries, theaters, symphonies, movies, supermarkets, Sam's, Walmart, Target as well as many shops throughout Waikiki as well as other areas of Honolulu.  Since the Delta Varient is so infectious I am sure that you don't need to hug, kiss, or live with a resident to transmit the virus.  

One thing that csodjd did bring up that I didn't think of is that while the great number of increases may be caused by infected tourists they are not being reflected in the numbers of infections that are being reported.   Therefore, as you also mentioned, there are alot more actual infections than are being reported.


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## csodjd (Aug 2, 2021)

Tamaradarann said:


> One thing that csodjd did bring up that I didn't think of is that while the great number of increases may be caused by infected tourists they are not being reflected in the numbers of infections that are being reported. Therefore, as you also mentioned, there are alot more actual infections than are being reported.


However, also note that Hawaii‘s COVID case counts include Hawaii residents that are diagnosed out of state. That’s a bit curious because, for one thing, it is not a case of COVID in Hawaii, and for another, that person probably cannot return to Hawaii until they are no longer infectious so they are not a threat to community spread. So, to that extent, the number reported may be viewed as having an element of being over-stated. 

While I appreciate that you mingle a lot with locals when you are in Hawaii, you also are by no means a “tourist” in any ordinary sense. You spend multiple consecutive months living there, so much so that you purchased a condo. That is not a tourist, that is a part-time resident. So your experience, like mine, is not that of a tourist at the Disney hotel, or at the Kaanapali Marriott. I doubt many tourists are going to Sams, Walmart, Target, symphonies and movies during their 7-14 days on their vacation of a lifetime on the beaches of Hawaii.


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## csodjd (Aug 2, 2021)

Tamaradarann said:


> the great number of increases may be caused by infected tourists


Again, that’s just not a statement supported by any data, and it is being expressly rejected by officials in Hawaii. You may believe it to be true, and may even be able to offer a reason why you think it is so, but it simply is not a fact and there is no evidence that suggests it is true. Notably, tourists are not being hospitalized, which directly contradicts your statement. It may be true that a tourist with mild symptoms won’t seek medical care, you’d still expect to see a proportional number of hospitalizations in tourists if, indeed, most COVID is coming from tourists because those reflect very sick patients.


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## Tamaradarann (Aug 2, 2021)

csodjd said:


> However, also note that Hawaii‘s COVID case counts include Hawaii residents that are diagnosed out of state. That’s a bit curious because, for one thing, it is not a case of COVID in Hawaii, and for another, that person probably cannot return to Hawaii until they are no longer infectious so they are not a threat to community spread. So, to that extent, the number reported may be viewed as having an element of being over-stated.
> 
> While I appreciate that you mingle a lot with locals when you are in Hawaii, you also are by no means a “tourist” in any ordinary sense. You spend multiple consecutive months living there, so much so that you purchased a condo. That is not a tourist, that is a part-time resident. So your experience, like mine, is not that of a tourist at the Disney hotel, or at the Kaanapali Marriott. I doubt many tourists are going to Sams, Walmart, Target, symphonies and movies during their 7-14 days on their vacation of a lifetime on the beaches of Hawaii.



You do bring up a good point about our not being typical tourists.  However, while the Disney Hotel and the Kaanapali Marriott are representative tourist destinations, the majority of tourists are in Waikiki a much more congested area where tourists are much more likely to mix with many more locals at the great variety of restaurants and shops as well as at Ala Moana Mall and on Buses.


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## DeniseM (Aug 2, 2021)

THREAD CLOSED: The Hawaii forum is NOT the place for COVID debates - that's why we have a COVID forum.


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