# ROFR at 23% of Developer Price?



## Kokonut (Aug 17, 2009)

I've been reading in the forum that Marriott is not exercising ROFR and that no one has heard of an instance where it has been exercised this year.

I have an opportunity to purchase an EOY resale at one of Marriott's Hawaiian resorts at 23% of the current list price. This type of unit rarely comes up for sale. Should I be concerned with ROFR?

Thanks in advance for your advice.


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## Quimby4 (Aug 17, 2009)

Don't be concerned about ROFR.  Just move forward, highly unlikely Marriott will exercise it.  23% of current list price still may be much higher then other units, have you fully shopped around?


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## Latravel (Aug 17, 2009)

23% of developer price is not high!  It's a great deal.  I would go forward and not be concerned with ROFR.  Great find!


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## Quimby4 (Aug 18, 2009)

Latravel said:


> 23% of developer price is not high!  It's a great deal.  I would go forward and not be concerned with ROFR.  Great find!



Ah, you're right.  I was thinking 23% OFF developer price, but 23%* of *devloper price is great...Ie. a $50,000 unit for 23% $11,500.  Got it!!


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## thinze3 (Aug 18, 2009)

Latravel said:


> 23% of developer price is not high!  It's a great deal.  I would go forward and not be concerned with ROFR.  Great find!



Unless its a 1BR unit at KBC. Those have been selling at huge discounts for sometime now. If MF's and assessments keep escalating, these units could go to zero one day.


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## doodles1 (Aug 18, 2009)

*ROFR*



Kokonut said:


> I've been reading in the forum that Marriott is not exercising ROFR and that no one has heard of an instance where it has been exercised this year.
> 
> I have an opportunity to purchase an EOY resale at one of Marriott's Hawaiian resorts at 23% of the current list price. This type of unit rarely comes up for sale. Should I be concerned with ROFR?
> 
> Thanks in advance for your advice.



Don't be concerned. My wife and I paid $3,750 for EOY Ocean Front at the Kauai Beach Club. It passed ROFR and Marriott recognized us as owners in less than 2 weeks after closing.
I agree that due to the high MF these properties are less desireable but we wanted Kauai as our home resort as they have a history of trading well and we do want to vacation there.
Marriott does not want to be paying these fees so I doubt they will exercise ROFR any time soon.

Jay


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## dioxide45 (Aug 18, 2009)

23% of developer price could be way over priced depending on the resort/season. It may be a good price for Hawaii, but is likely a bad price for Orlando gold seasons.


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## bobcat (Aug 19, 2009)

dioxide45 said:


> 23% of developer price could be way over priced depending on the resort/season. It may be a good price for Hawaii, but is likely a bad price for Orlando gold seasons.



Tonight on ebay a G V gold season at the Barony went for 3300.00Wonder If it will pass?.


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## Kokonut (Aug 19, 2009)

Thanks to everyone for their insight. I'm moving forward with the purchase with the hope that Marriott will waive ROFR. 

Koko


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## Kokonut (Aug 19, 2009)

Going through some threads, I've read that when Marriott has exercised ROFR on a sale, some buyers have increased their offer and resubmitted the Waiver of ROFR request.  Is that really possible?

Koko


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## pcgirl54 (Aug 20, 2009)

I watched that one Bobcat and I thought it would bump up at the last minute but it did not. Incredible deal.


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## ldanna (Aug 20, 2009)

bobcat said:


> Tonight on ebay a G V gold season at the Barony went for 3300.00Wonder If it will pass?.



Do you have the link or eBay number of this auction?


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## pcgirl54 (Aug 20, 2009)

*Ebay Barony Beach*

tem number:	130324659430
Item location:	Hilton Head Island, United States
Ships to:	United States


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## m61376 (Aug 20, 2009)

Kokonut said:


> Going through some threads, I've read that when Marriott has exercised ROFR on a sale, some buyers have increased their offer and resubmitted the Waiver of ROFR request.  Is that really possible?
> 
> Koko



That was always a gray area- a few people reported being allowed to do that, others were not able to.

Marriott has not exercised ROFR now for about 9 months or so, since the credit market tightened. Of course, it is not a given that it won't but there have been some spectacular buys that have been passed on, so the vast likelihood is that yours will pass too. This is a great time to buy.

Let us know when it passes, and good luck!


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## Kokonut (Sep 3, 2009)

m61376 said:


> Marriott has not exercised ROFR now for about 9 months or so, since the credit market tightened. Of course, it is not a given that it won't but there have been some spectacular buys that have been passed on, so the vast likelihood is that yours will pass too. This is a great time to buy.
> 
> Let us know when it passes, and good luck!



Just received notification from the closing agent that Marriott waived ROFR. Thanks to all for their input. I really didn't think it would pass.

Kokonut


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## falmouth3 (Sep 3, 2009)

Congratulations!   

Sue


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## m61376 (Sep 3, 2009)

Congrats- so what did you buy?


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## AwayWeGo (Sep 3, 2009)

*Exercising R. O. F. R. Means Buying The Timeshare -- No Do-Overs.*




Kokonut said:


> I've read that when Marriott has exercised ROFR on a sale, some buyers have increased their offer and resubmitted the Waiver of ROFR request.  Is that really possible?


Seems doubtful -- highly unlikely.   

Exercising ROFR means the timeshare company steps in & _buys_ the timeshare -- right out from under the regular walking-around person who had agreed to purchase it at the seller's price.  

Otherwise, it wouldn't be _exercising_ ROFR.  It would just be _threatening_ to exercise ROFR -- & there's no procedure for that, only for exercising ROFR on the 1 hand or waiving ROFR on the other hand.  

Putting it another way, when the ROFR papers hit the agent's desk over at the timeshare company, the agent's only 2 options are to paint or get off the ladder (figuratively speaking). 

Once the timeshsare is bought via exercise of ROFR, it's bought -- period.  Off the market.  Gone.  No do-overs.  No resubmission at a higher price.   Case closed.

ROFR *=* ROFL. 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## Dewnay (Sep 3, 2009)

Please tell us what you bought.

Congratulations!


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## Kokonut (Sep 4, 2009)

m61376 said:


> Congrats- so what did you buy?





Dewnay said:


> Please tell us what you bought.
> 
> Congratulations!



Thank you! 

I was fortunate enough to land a biennial 3-bedroom oceanview at Ko Olina. I have been looking for some time and as someone mentioned in another thread, they rarely appear on the resale market.

Kokonut


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## cp73 (Sep 4, 2009)

So whats 23% of developer price on that...About $10K..great deal...


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## ginsun88 (Sep 4, 2009)

Yes, great deal.  Was this the EOY advertised on Redweek.com?  I inquired but didn't want to get in a bidding war.

Enjoy your great find!
Grace


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## Kokonut (Sep 4, 2009)

gvdelizo said:


> Yes, great deal.  Was this the EOY advertised on Redweek.com?  I inquired but didn't want to get in a bidding war.
> 
> Enjoy your great find!
> Grace



Hi Grace,

Yes, this was the EOY advertised in Redweek. I was the first to respond to the seller with an offer.  He accepted and although he was subsequently offered a lot more, he abided by his agreement. I was floored as it is rare these days to encounter such an honorable person.

Koko


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## Kokonut (Sep 4, 2009)

cp73 said:


> So whats 23% of developer price on that...About $10K..great deal...



Chris,

It was actually $9,000. I'll add it to the ROFR database. There will only be 39 3-bedroom units out of the 750 units when Ko Olina is fully built out. I'm still amazed that Marriott didn't exercise ROFR.

Koko


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## m61376 (Sep 4, 2009)

Are the annual 3BR's close to $80,000 there (calculating that 9K for an EOY was 23% of developer's price)? I didn't realize they were that expensive.

At any extent, congrats again- you not only got a great deal, but managed to find a hard to find unit, esp. it being EOY. The 2BR's are great, but the 3BR's are fabulous, and they open up a new dimension to vacation ownership.


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## Kokonut (Sep 4, 2009)

m61376 said:


> Are the annual 3BR's close to $80,000 there (calculating that 9K for an EOY was 23% of developer's price)? I didn't realize they were that expensive.
> 
> At any extent, congrats again- you not only got a great deal, but managed to find a hard to find unit, esp. it being EOY. The 2BR's are great, but the 3BR's are fabulous, and they open up a new dimension to vacation ownership.



Thanks again - the family is very excited and looking forward to our next vacation at Ko Olina in 2011. That will also be the year when the Disney property is scheduled to open next door.

Current developer price for the EOY 3-BR is $37,740 (EY is $62,900 but on sale at 20% off or $50,320 until 9-9-09). The price I paid was actually closer to 24% of developer but I rounded down.


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## thinze3 (Sep 4, 2009)

cp73 said:


> So whats 23% of developer price on that...About $10K..great deal...



"Geat deal" may be a huge understatement. This may be the deal of the century for such a premium unit.   

I am envious.


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## m61376 (Sep 4, 2009)

The fact that Marriott is letting deals like this slip through is just indicative that they are truly tightening their belts and just not laying out any money. These units are probably the fastest to sell out and my guess is that there were very few EOY's sold in the first place, so finding one on the resale market at a great price was amazing.

Nice that the seller was honorable like that too. My Mom has told a similar story about a home sale that her Dad made, and over the years I wondered if anyone was that honorable anymore. It is nice to hear that people like that still exist!!

In a few years from now when we're typing here commiserating about the "old times" -assuming the market rebounds- you may find yourself at the top of the "great buys" heap.


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## Fredm (Sep 5, 2009)

AwayWeGo said:


> Seems doubtful -- highly unlikely.
> 
> Exercising ROFR means the timeshare company steps in & _buys_ the timeshare -- right out from under the regular walking-around person who had agreed to purchase it at the seller's price.
> 
> ...



Alan,

Not necessarily so. 

I am not an attorney.  I have read enough to conclude that this issue is not as cut and dry as you state it The law itself on the right of preemption as it relates to real estate is murky.

So, some items to ponder.

Without getting into all the whys and therefores it comes down to an owners right to not sell. Most often the owner wants to sell, so an ROFR simply changes the buyer. Seller, as a practical matter, does not care who the buyer is. However, if the buyer gets a better offer, AND an escrow has not opened on the ROFR with earnest money,  the deal is not finalized. The buyer is not compelled to sell in light of the better offer. 
Again, this can be argued as the law is not cut and dry on the matter.

Importantly, an ROFR is not an option to buy. It is a preemptive right to buy on the exact terms as the accepted offer. The cleanest way for the preemption right holder to proceed is to simply substitute their name for the original buyer., and allow the opened escrow to proceed to closing.
But, that is not how it is handled by the right holder in almost all cases. 

Marriott, for example, produces its own purchase contract for the sellers signatures. While the amount is same, net, it is a different contract requiring the sellers signature. Nothing requires the seller to sign it. While the amount is net equal, no earnest money accompanies the contract. Further, terms of sale are different. Not hair splitting terms. But actual terms of sale.If, in the intervening time the seller receives a higher offer,  the seller can accept and change the basis for the sale.

These are points that can also be argued. 

Marriott, in its wisdom, chooses to not chase these legalities. Too many implications and commitment of resources. To their credit, they have also recognized that standing in the way of a legitimate higher offer before their contract is signed and delivered places them in a very bad light. Forcing an owner to sell in direct opposition to its owners ability to get a higher amount does not wear well  on its reputation. For this self-serving reason Marriott chooses to review the higher offer on its own merits, and can exercise at the higher amount, or pass.

All in all, good business sense.

Those developers who reserve a preemption right, and then act in an obstructionist way to shut down an owner from accepting a higher offer may find that they are accumulating problems that have not yet come home to roost, imo.


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## wljet (Sep 5, 2009)

*great price*



doodles1 said:


> Don't be concerned. My wife and I paid $3,750 for EOY Ocean Front at the Kauai Beach Club. It passed ROFR and Marriott recognized us as owners in less than 2 weeks after closing.
> I agree that due to the high MF these properties are less desireable but we wanted Kauai as our home resort as they have a history of trading well and we do want to vacation there.
> Marriott does not want to be paying these fees so I doubt they will exercise ROFR any time soon.
> 
> Jay



Where did you find this unit?

A broker or ebay?

Thx

wljet


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## PerryM (Sep 5, 2009)

*Chicken or the egg or Turkey Buzzards?*

ROFR – haven’t seen that topic for, what, 2 days now.

To EVERY Marriott owner your attitude should be “ho-hum” except for the $90 or $99 fee (forgot what Marriott charges) that the seller pays out of the proceeds.  So Marriott stepped in and took the good deal from the buyer – whoopee!

To the buyer – sure you got ousted by a fortune 500 company who decided that you got too good of a deal and they want it.  Too bad; try again.  (Maybe raise your offer this time)

Did I miss something here?

Now the question of whether the ROFR supports, hurts ,or has no impact on resale prices.  I used to think that it supported prices but then Marriott stopped exercising the ROFR and prices now are imploding.  See; I was wrong.

Wait a minute – prices fall when the ROFR is NOT exercised and want to bet Marriott starts exercising them again when prices start to rise?  So the only question is which causes which; developer exercising the ROFR causes prices to rise or rising prices drive the developer to exercise the ROFR.

*My guess is that the ROFR has no impact one way or the other* and the developer is simply doing what developers do – make a profit for their stockholders.  Turkey buzzards have a role in nature.

Oh well, until this topic starts up again in a day or two…


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## AwayWeGo (Sep 6, 2009)

*Portrait Of R. O. F. R. Eagle.*



PerryM said:


> Turkey buzzards have a role in nature.






-- hotlinked --​
-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA. ​


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## davidvel (Sep 7, 2009)

Fredm said:


> I am not an attorney.  I have read enough to conclude that this issue is not as cut and dry as you state it. *The law* itself on the right of preemption as it relates to real estate is murky.


Not being an attorney, be careful commenting on what the law is...

The TS declaration states as follows:



> 9.4: If an owner desires to sell.. and receives an offer to purchase such Timeshare Interest which he or she desires to accept ... the Owner...shall notify [Marriott]...
> 
> [Marriott] shall the have the right and option to purchase ...
> 
> If [Marriott] elects to purchase...such notice from [Marriott] shall create a binding contract between the owner and [Marriott]...



For more details, see this thread: http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=104815


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## Fredm (Sep 7, 2009)

davidvel said:


> Not being an attorney, be careful commenting on what the law is...
> 
> The TS declaration states as follows:
> Quote:
> ...



daividvel.

I have not stated what the law is. I said it was murky, and could be argued.
Further, my statement was entirely in the context of responding to the unequivocal comment made here by AwayWeGo:
*"Once the timeshsare is bought via exercise of ROFR, it's bought -- period. Off the market. Gone. No do-overs. No resubmission at a higher price. Case closed."*

I also made a complete statement of what the TS Declaration says. Not the abbreviated and selected phrases you refer to. 
The complete sentences of the Shadow Ridge document you selectively quote are: (emphasis is mine)

" Declarant shall then have the right and option to purchase the Lot *at the same price and on the same terms as set forth in the Purchase Offer*".

"Such notice from Declarant shall be deemed to create a binding contract between the Owner and Declarant  for Declarant to purchase the Lot* in accordance with the terms and provisions of the written offer to purchase *the Owner's Lot"

I also stated Marriott's practice as it relates to its preemption right.
I have not interpreted Marriott's practice. I am reporting my personal experience. That experience spans a number of years and a number of transactions that have occurred as I have represented.
I only make inference to Marriott's motive in choosing to act as it does. 
I prefer to think that Marriott acts as it does with an eye toward preservation of good-will with its owners.

Again, my post was a well-intentioned direct reply to a statement made on this subject, born of personal experience which contradicts it. Sharing information here on TUG is what we do.
I clearly stated I am not an attorney. Why are you so sensitive?


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## AwayWeGo (Sep 7, 2009)

*I'm Taking That As A Compliment.  Thanks.*




Fredm said:


> Further, my statement was entirely in the context of responding to the unequivocal comment made here by AwayWeGo:
> *"Once the timeshsare is bought via exercise of ROFR, it's bought -- period. Off the market. Gone. No do-overs. No resubmission at a higher price. Case closed."*


Shux, unequivocal is my middle name. 

Just telling it the way it is.  

No wishy-washy temporizing.  

No irresolute shilly-shallying. 

BTW, I appreciate that detailed explanation & discussion of how ROFR actually works.  I still don't see how the seller gets to take a do-over or how the timeshare company gets to threaten to exercise ROFR without actually, uh *. . .* um, er, ah, you know -- _exercising_ ROFR.  But I appreciate it all the same. 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## Fredm (Sep 7, 2009)

AwayWeGo said:


> Shux, unequivocal is my middle name.
> 
> Just telling it the way it is.
> 
> ...



Alan, I too appreciate your straightforward view of things.

So, let's talk about it. As non-lawyers, of course. Just make it up as we go.
For example (and there are lots of different for examples) suppose someone offered to buy your whatever timeshare. You agreed on price, and everything else except two items. The buyer did not want to put any money down. And did not want to stipulate a time to close the deal. 
Being a straight ahead, no wishy washy kind of guy , you insist on the buyer putting something tangible behind the words. You want a reasonable deposit, and a 'time is of the essence" clause of some kind.
The buyer agrees, and the deal is made. Just normal stuff.

Since we are making it up as we go, lets say that you had a list agreement with a broker to sell your timeshare. That agreement says you are to pay the broker a commission. The list terms state that the commission be disbursed directly to them from transaction proceeds at closing.
So, the purchase offer presented to you says the same thing about the commission. Buyer and you have signed it. 
No hanky panky. Nothing in fine print to throw the wheels off the milk wagon. More normal stuff.

Now, the deal is subject to an ROFR that clearly states, among other things, the following:
" Declarant shall then have the right and option to purchase the Lot at the same price and on the same terms as set forth in the Purchase Offer".

"Such notice from Declarant shall be deemed to create a binding contract between the Owner and Declarant for Declarant to purchase the Lot in accordance with the terms and provisions of the written offer to purchase the Owner's Lot"

The preemption rights holder then  informs you that they want to buy your timeshare, and sends you a new contract to sign.
It does not include a deposit, has no close date, and stipulates themselves as the closing agent. It also states that they will not recognize the brokers participation in the original agreement.

Those are not the same terms as the original agreement. 
Where I come from words mean things. Not just some of the words that a lawyer may want to trot out to smack you around with. But, ALL of the words. 

Now, you just want to sell the timeshare. So, mox nix who the buyer is. They may be very credible to you. 
Yeah, but credibility (for better or worse) has nothing to do with their RIGHTS, or yours. Words cut both ways.

To take it one inch further, before you sign and return the new and *different *agreement, (one you would not have originally agreed to)  the buyer says to you "Alan, you know, the deal will still be a good one to me if I paid another $2,000. Would you take the deal for an extra 2k?"

What do YOU think your rights are?

No, I am not a lawyer. I am just your average everyday walking around licensed real estate guy who does this 24/7.

 The difference between an option holder an a preemption rights holder is important to this discussion. 
The option holder is exercising the pre-agreed, legally binding option to buy on specific terms which have been defined in advance, for which some consideration was paid to the seller for the option.

A preemption rights holder sits in the weeds and decides what is attractive. No compensation is paid for the right to preempt. 
Nothing forces the seller to sell. The seller can change their mind about the original deal.  Never mind on terms not originally agreed to.

Some preemption right holders reserve all kinds of goofy rights in their Governing Documents. Take Westgate, for example. They reserve the right to be the defacto list agent for all sales made by their owners. But, only after a sale has been made that they had no involvement in whatsoever. This, to claim 50% of the commission on the sale.  
Westgate reserves the "right" . The State of Florida has said its illegal.
That does not prevent them from "reserving" the right.  Owners do dot relinquish their rights in law just because someone else says they can deny them.

Another one... A preemption rights holder changes THEIR mind after exercising its right. Since no liquidated damages were provided for, the seller is stuck high and dry. The original buyer is gone.  The seller loses, and the preemption rights holder goes about their business. 

Words cut both ways. If the preemption rights holder can do it, so can the seller. 

 I am not a lawyer. Just my opinion. It has also been my experience.
Preemption works when the terms are the same, and the seller wants to sell on those very terms. Otherwise bets are off in my world.


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## AwayWeGo (Sep 7, 2009)

*Painting Or Getting Off The Ladder.*

If some timeshare company steps in to buy a ROFR timeshare out from under a willing buyer at the agreed upon price but under different terms (new contract language, etc.), that's not strictly ROFR.  

ROFR is the right to accept or refuse the deal as it is -- _Right Of First Refusal,_ they call it.  Rewriting the terms of the deal, even without altering the price, isn't exactly the same thing -- close, maybe, but a different deal all the same. 

BTW, when I sell a timeshare, I don't collect any money from the buyer & the buyer doesn't pay any money to me.  Neither of us pays any commissions to anybody, brokers or agents _mox nix._  We both sign a a sales agreement with a professional Timeshare Closing Services Agency, which does estoppel, title search, resort notification, deed preparation, deed recording, resort account transfer, collection of funds, & disbursement of funds.  The sales agreement specifies who pays for the closing services (e.g., buyer, seller, or a share from each).

If there is any ROFR hoop to be jumped through, the professional Timeshare Closing Services Agency takes care of that too, providing the timeshare company holding ROFR the required opportunity to (a) exercise ROFR on the 1 hand or (b) waive ROFR on the other hand. 

If a ROFR timeshare company did step in, I suppose it could write in its own name on the sales agreement after crossing off the original buyer's name.  But nothing I am aware of gives the ROFR timeshare company the right to short-circuit the timeshare closing services agency handling the transaction, or to add broker commissions, or to impose its own contract language in place of the signed sales agreement already in existence.  

As a practical matter, there won't be any ROFR hoops involved with purchases & sales of any of my timeshares.  None of the ones I own are encumbered with ROFR, & it's for sure I won't be buying any that have ROFR   (thanks to being forewarned about ROFR by TUG-BBS).

It's not that there's anything wrong with ROFR, for those who like it.  It's just that I don't happen to like ROFR, & ROFR is not all that hard to avoid.  Just be sure to shun Marriott & WestGate, etc., timeshares. 

The reason I unequivocally say ROFR *=* ROFL is simply that so often the timeshare sellers tell customers that the timeshare company retains ROFR as a way of making sure that resale values of the timeshare do not go "too low."  

With or without ROFR, timeshare values can -- & do -- go ever so low, depending on the vagaries of the market.  Not only that, when timeshare values do sink low (e.g., to the levels where they are now & have been for several months), individual private sellers find that the timeshare companies that retain ROFR on their units are no longer exercising ROFR, period.  

So much for the assurances from the timeshare sellers about the purpose of ROFR -- & _that's_ what's laughable, even though there's nothing funny about it to the owners stuck with low-value timeshares whose worth some timeshare seller assured them would never go "too low" because of ROFR. 

So it goes. 

_Full Disclosure*:*_  I've only ever sold 1 timeshare.  Non-ROFR.  Trouble-free transaction.  Handled by a Florida professional timeshare closing services agency. 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## Fredm (Sep 8, 2009)

AwayWeGo said:


> If some timeshare company steps in to buy a ROFR timeshare out from under a willing buyer at the agreed upon price but under different terms (new contract language, etc.), that's not strictly ROFR.
> 
> ROFR is the right to accept or refuse the deal as it is -- _Right Of First Refusal,_ they call it.  Rewriting the terms of the deal, even without altering the price, isn't exactly the same thing -- close, maybe, but a different deal all the same.
> 
> ...



Alan,

Exactly.

What I described is how Marriott exercises its ROFR.

As for professional timeshare closing companies handling the close, they have no say in the matter.
We never touch transaction funds. All is forwarded directly to an independent closing agent who submits the deal for ROFR review.
But, once Marriott exercises they take over the deal, the closing agency is out.

Of course, Marriott has not been exercising at all lately. Capital expenditure freeze has put the brakes on that one.

Your perception is how it should be, not as it is.


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## AwayWeGo (Sep 8, 2009)

*R. O. F. R. = R. O. F. L.*




Fredm said:


> Your perception is how it should be, not as it is.


If so, that's all the more reason to stay far*,* far away from timeshare ROFR. 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## timeos2 (Sep 8, 2009)

*The myth and the myth. ROFR is a bad joke either way*



AwayWeGo said:


> If so, that's all the more reason to stay far*,* far away from timeshare ROFR.
> 
> -- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​



AMEN! Through all of Freds scenario he acts like the "new offer" from Marriott is an option for the seller. It is NOT. IF they wish to sell they can either take the unfair offer from Marriott & complete the deal OR not sell! They CANNOT take the REAL offer from the real buyer under the agreed terms as Marriott has preempted that and the new offer, not as good in at least some ways, is the ONLY one they can get. Or not sell (wasn't selling why they are doing this?) and start over to find ANOTHER real buyer at whatever terms and then doing the whole dance AGAIN with the same options in the end unless Marriott decides to stop stringing everyone along. STAY AWAY FROM ANY RESORT with ROFR or regret it at some point. 

At least the idea that the whole nonsense somehow gave price support to resale has finally died. That alone makes the discussion worthwhile.  I feel sorry for those that bought into the ruse and now will lose big time when/if they sell.  They played the game and lost. Bet they love ROFR now. (not!)


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## SueDonJ (Sep 8, 2009)

timeos2 said:


> ... At least the idea that the whole nonsense somehow gave price support to resale has finally died. That alone makes the discussion worthwhile.  I feel sorry for those that bought into the ruse and now will lose big time when/if they sell.  They played the game and lost. Bet they love ROFR now. (not!)



I don't know, John, I think if ROFR is exercised it can prop up prices in certain instances, particularly at a newer resort where inventory is limited and the developer is still selling.  If a buyer is looking for a specific resort/unit/season and the developer scoops up any resales that fit those parameters for which the buyer has bid too low, then that buyer will increase the offer(s) on other similar resales until s/he gets what she wants.

I agree, if a buyer is simply playing The Game to get the best deal out there on any timeshare then ROFR is mostly meaningless.  And of course, it's meaningless all around unless it's exercised.

I've just always thought, anyway, that ROFR is more of a benefit to the developer than the owner/seller, because it allows the developer to scoop up limited inventory at reduced rates and turn around and sell it at a profit to someone on their waiting list.


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## Fredm (Sep 8, 2009)

timeos2 said:


> AMEN! Through all of Freds scenario he acts like the "new offer" from Marriott is an option for the seller. It is NOT. IF they wish to sell they can either take the unfair offer from Marriott & complete the deal OR not sell! They CANNOT take the REAL offer from the real buyer under the agreed terms as Marriott has preempted that and the new offer, not as good in at least some ways, is the ONLY one they can get. Or not sell (wasn't selling why they are doing this?) and start over to find ANOTHER real buyer at whatever terms and then doing the whole dance AGAIN with the same options in the end unless Marriott decides to stop stringing everyone along. STAY AWAY FROM ANY RESORT with ROFR or regret it at some point.
> 
> At least the idea that the whole nonsense somehow gave price support to resale has finally died. That alone makes the discussion worthwhile.  I feel sorry for those that bought into the ruse and now will lose big time when/if they sell.  They played the game and lost. Bet they love ROFR now. (not!)



John.

What are you talking about?

Do not distort what I said.
I said that Marriott's exercise of an ROFR is not the end of the subject in light of a higher offer from the original buyer, if the seller has not signed the Marriott purchase offer. I stand by that statement for all the reasons stated in my dialog.

I also said that in almost all cases the seller does not care who the buyer is, and Marriott's exercise proceeds to closing.

Nor did I EVER state or imply that ROFR was a prop for prices. 
I believe they are not. Indeed, it is detrimental, IMO.

Before jumping on my dialog, do me the courtesy of reading the string.


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