# [The Show, Hawaii Life]...beautiful and a little depressing



## jehb2

I find Hawaii Life to be a little depressing.  I absolutely love the shots of gorgeous scenery.  But when it comes down to the quality of the actual houses for sell not to mention the asking price--I want tell the couples, "hey, maybe you guys ought to rethink this."  Or maybe it just depresses me because it shows me what I could actually afford if I move to Hawaii.


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## rhonda

Google Downsizing ...  ??


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## DanaTom

Downsizing is a great response.    Depressing is not how I would look at it.   Sometimes when traveling to foreign lands...  Mexico, Central America... and even Europe.   They may have far less "things" and less of a home, but often, it's the lifestyle that makes me envious.    I'm not sure whom is right... those that work hard and have, or those that don't have and enjoy the simple things.  

While, I'm still a capitalist, it does make one think... so depressing?   I think its more about the lifestyle.


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## DaveNV

I think the program also only shows the people their own office listings.  With all the places for sale in Hawaii, I find it ridiculous to think the ONLY things available are some of the really poor places I've seen recently.

Case in point:  A schoolteacher from Oregon was looking for her first home on Maui.  She works in Lahaina, and had a reasonable budget.  They showed her two rough places in Kihei, and one clear up in the mountains on the other side of the island, with a two-hour commute each way to work!  Seriously??  That's the best they could do?

Or the couple last night who had a 1.5+ million budget.  They wanted a nice Master Bedroom and bath, with water views.  They ended up getting a terrible fixer near the beach, but it'll cost as much as the house sold for just to remodel it - and it still has no views.  

I wonder if it's a put up situation, and the people don't buy the place after all?  Wouldn't be the first time a TV show faked it to make ratings.

Dave


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## rhonda

Oh!  We are talking about a TV Show?  I had no idea.   Sure, one could probably do better on their own than the "set up" of a show.


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## DaveNV

rhonda said:


> Oh!  We are talking about a TV Show?  I had no idea.   Sure, one could probably do better on their own than the "set up" of a show.




It's a newer show on HGTV.  House hunting in Hawaii.  Pretty scenery, but not so realistic, in my view.  Seems way too narrow of a shopping list. 

Dave


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## SmithOp

*A nice place to visit but*

Can you afford to live there?

http://money.usnews.com/money/retirement/articles/2013/03/11/the-10-worst-places-to-retire

Honolulu
LA
NY
San Diego
Oxnard ???


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## danb

*Home prices in Hawaii*

When we were looking at homes in Oahu last year we saw some homes in Kailua that were in great neighborhoods but the home was old and dated. Needed to be gutted or torn down and built new. They were asking over 500 k. You really get a education looking, and it is a lot about the lifestyle. Homes in Oahu will be on very small lots and will cost a lot more than you expect. On the big island there is more land so for around 300k you will get what they were showing and it's reasonable. 
Moving from the east coast we found the price for most things is about the same but housing is more expensive. Food will be about the same and taxes much less. So when it all washes out its somewhat cheaper.


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## LisaH

Well the show is real for sure. Last week my agent was on the show (Hello David! I know you or your company reads or searches for Hawaii Life on the internet ). I don't think they only show their own listings as that do not benefit them much - they get paid whether they are the listing agent or not. We bought a house that was not its listing.


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## slip

Real or not it's a great show to watch if you love Hawaii. You see lots of places
You've visited and some places you'll want to see when you go back. There are
Properties in all ranges and while you usually always have to compromise when
You buy a house, I think that's a little more true on Hawaii. Unless you have a
Healthy budget.


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## fillde

It looks like the Big Island is where you get the biggest bang for your buck. 
A couple of observations about the show. I wish they would extend it for an hour. I would love to see more homes and neighborhoods. Secondly, I find myself looking at the homebuyers feet. It is a custom in Hawaii to remove your shoes when entering a home. I have seen quite a few homebuyers in violation.


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## HatTrick

BMWguynw said:


> I wonder if it's a put up situation, and the people don't buy the place after all?



I don't know if it was a put up situation, but on episode 3 a family from Colorado chose a home in Princeville for $649,000 but there was no follow-up to let us know if they actually got it.

A Zillow search shows that the property (4200 Wailea Pl., 96722) is still for sale and is now listed for $749,000.


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## artringwald

In one of the early episodes, a couple turned down a house in Kapaa that was close to the beach. It was a really nice house, but was too small for their family. We drove by it two weeks ago, and it's still for sale.

I also get upset when they go to a house and don't remove their shoes. It's a custom in Minnesota too, not for the red dirt, but for all the salt, sand, and slush that we put up with 9 months of the year.


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## Kauai Kid

*Bargain on the Big Island*

Realtor showed a 577 sq ft house listed for one million.

I wonder if it is still for sale?:hysterical:

Sterling


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## jehb2

danb said:


> ...but the home was old and dated. Needed to be gutted or torn down and built new. They were asking over 500 k.



I embrace downsizing.  We lived in an apartment in Japan for several years.  What amazes me is the idea of dropping 400K plus on something that has holes in the walls and is in need of serious repair.  

Plus a lot of the homes just seem really boring.  When House Hunters did Hawaii I would just drool.


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## optimist

If it is the same as house hunters/international, the whole thing is a set up. 
They find people who have already purchased a house (but not closed on it) and show them two other houses that are similar.


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## jehb2

optimist said:


> If it is the same as house hunters/international, the whole thing is a set up.
> They find people who have already purchased a house (but not closed on it) and show them two other houses that are similar.



I know.  But at least House Hunters lets me have my fantasy.


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## DaveNV

jehb2 said:


> I know.  But at least House Hunters lets me have my fantasy.



I agree.  And my issue with Hawaii Life, is that from among ALL the real estate that's for sale there, the best they can offer are these (generally) rundown places? It seems wrong, somehow.  That was why I figured they'd only show on TV listings that were exclusive to their office.  It increases their commission that way.  And it would explain the great disparity among houses they do show people on the show.

Dave


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## DavidnRobin

HGTV shows are not real - many aspects are fake.  Not saying these houses or the buyers do not exist, but much of it is totally set-up for TV viewing under the standard HGTV HH template (3 homes - 30 mins).

In HGTV House Hunters International for St John USVI - they showed monkeys (what!) and riding horses in the sea (what!) - and views from homes were not the actual views at all.

In looking at the home prices - versus renting - it appears that one can get more value by renting nice homes in Hawaii as it appears there is a glut of house rentals.


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## mjm1

DavidnRobin said:


> HGTV shows are not real - many aspects are fake.  Not saying these houses or the buyers do not exist, but much of it is totally set-up for TV viewing under the standard HGTV HH template (3 homes - 30 mins).
> 
> In HGTV House Hunters International for St John USVI - they showed monkeys (what!) and riding horses in the sea (what!) - and views from homes were not the actual views at all.
> 
> In looking at the home prices - versus renting - it appears that one can get more value by renting nice homes in Hawaii as it appears there is a glut of house rentals.



That is disappointing.  We have watched HH and HH International primarily to see the areas that they visit. We also started watching Hawaii Life.  We figured they only showed a few of the homes that the buyers actually visit, but didn't realize some of these other things.  We will have a more watchful eye going forward.  Still enjoyable shows.


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## DavidnRobin

mjm1 said:


> That is disappointing.  We have watched HH and HH International primarily to see the areas that they visit. We also started watching Hawaii Life.  We figured they only showed a few of the homes that the buyers actually visit, but didn't realize some of these other things.  We will have a more watchful eye going forward.  Still enjoyable shows.



We watch them as well - and really enjoy Hawaii Life - but make sure to keep in perspective for what they are intended (entertainment).


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## tompalm

Now is a bad time to be looking for houses on Oahu.  Inventory is at an all time low.  This past Sunday we looked at a 1700 sq foot house on a 10,000 ft lot that was 50 years old.  The house needed a lot of work, but still sold the first week it was listed at $1.2 million.  A couple years ago, they would have been lucky to get $900,000.  People that need a house to live in have little to select from. 

On top of that, my neighbor a few blocks away sold their house for $1.9 million to someone from China that bought it sight unseen.  They saw the pictures on the internet and just bought it.  

It is a bad time to be shopping for a house on Oahu.  The outer islands are a much better deal.


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## DaveNV

tompalm said:


> Now is a bad time to be looking for houses on Oahu.  Inventory is at an all time low.  This past Sunday we looked at a 1700 sq foot house on a 10,000 ft lot that was 50 years old.  The house needed a lot of work, but still sold the first week it was listed at $1.2 million.  A couple years ago, they would have been lucky to get $900,000.  People that need a house to live in have little to select from.
> 
> On top of that, my neighbor a few blocks away sold their house for $1.9 million to someone from China that bought it sight unseen.  They saw the pictures on the internet and just bought it.
> 
> It is a bad time to be shopping for a house on Oahu.  The outer islands are a much better deal.




Whereabouts on Oahu are those houses located? At those numbers, I'd expect them to be in great neighborhoods, or have awesome views, or something.  I agree about the outer islands.  I check Realtor.com fairly often (shopping for that unexpected gem, you understand ) and it seems there is better inventory at lower prices away from Oahu.

Dave


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## hypnotiq

I have 15yrs till mini me goes to college, doesn't stop me from looking at Maui listings every week. 

However, Microsoft is gonna have to start paying me better if I ever hope to move there. LOL


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## Phill12

jehb2 said:


> I find Hawaii Life to be a little depressing.  I absolutely love the shots of gorgeous scenery.  But when it comes down to the quality of the actual houses for sell not to mention the asking price--I want tell the couples, "hey, maybe you guys ought to rethink this."  Or maybe it just depresses me because it shows me what I could actually afford if I move to Hawaii.



I do  have to agree with you! Hawaii beautiful but the homes they have shown so far makes me like timeshare resort for a week then back home! When I found this series was coming on I wanted to watch but have been totally bored with the homes. 
Guess I need to hit lottery then buy one of the ten million dollar homes to be happy.

PHIL


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## Tamaradarann

Phill12 said:


> I do  have to agree with you! Hawaii beautiful but the homes they have shown so far makes me like timeshare resort for a week then back home! When I found this series was coming on I wanted to watch but have been totally bored with the homes.
> Guess I need to hit lottery then buy one of the ten million dollar homes to be happy.
> 
> PHIL



I don't know where you are looking, who you have been looking with, or what your requirements are, but we have found some of what we consider excellent 2 BR condo's for 500-700K 2 blocks from the beach and 1 block from the supermarket in Waikiki.  You don't need a car.  Walk to the mall.  The bus is on the corner and will take you to the places you can't walk to.  We can't afford this amount until we collect SS and sell our house, but this is very doable for us.


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## singlemalt_18

Tamaradarann said:


> ... *We can't afford this amount until we collect SS *and sell our house, but this is very doable for us.



Collect Social Security? :hysterical:

(I wish you all the best in living your dream and achieving your goals, but personally I would use the utmost caution if the lynchpin of the plan is social security.)

*********************************************************

As for the depressing reality of Hawaiian paradise, our modern media-based, instantaneous-gratification culture has substituted objective reasoning skills with short-sighted subjective thinking.

“Reality Show” is an *oxymoron*.  

Money never buys happiness.

Reality almost never stacks up the dream.

The _*perception*_ that something is missing will always devalue that which is possessed.

(Thus, perception is reality, and _value is in the eye of the beholder_!)

Black cars look better in the shade… and even magazine covergirl models have pores in the corners of their noses.


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## VacationForever

It is called supply and demand.  I sold a 1100 sq ft condo overseas last year for USD 1 million and it was not even in a prime area.  If that condo was close to the shopping or business district it would have gone for 3million or more.  There are enough people who want to live in Hawaii to warrant higher prices.


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## Kagehitokiri2

ill take fancy travel over owning fancy other stuff

--

there are indeed places that make hawaii prices look super cheap

as well as places that dont even sell freehold (including hawaii) where you instead have leasehold 
for a condo/home where you might be paying millions
just recently noticed condo development in kahala next to hotel, where lease is up soon, very cheap condos 
its trust land, so i guess (at least when i looked) it was up in the air whether lease will be renewed or not, so like a gamble buy

apartments can also be crazy - for example 5 year lease, or 3 year lease with 7 months up front, etc

most exclusive are COOPs like in NYC that are invitation-only 
monthly fees are high because you own (and maintain) building not just unit
saw an article saying one required 10 times purchase price in liquid assets (prices in tens of millions)
why? another article mentioned building facade repair elsewhere running hundreds of thousands, with not that many owners


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## Ron98GT

Since nobody has posted it:

http://www.hawaiilife.com/

I've been using the site to look at single family houses for sale on Maui & the Big Island.  I like this site better than the generic MLS sites.


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## hypnotiq

If anyone has a spare $19mil they want to lend me, I wouldn't be upset. 


http://www.hawaiilife.com/mls/352441/


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## Ron98GT

If you want depressing, watch "The Property Brothers" or "Love it or List it", both of which are filmed in Canada, presumably Toronto.  It seems like the average price of a house on these programs is $700,000, about 80+ years old, 1-Bathroom, small, crappy kitchens, no master bath, no garage, no back yards, and all kinds of structural problems.  And every time they show the program, there's Snow on the ground, YUCK. Toronto housing =


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## Ron98GT

hypnotiq said:


> If anyone has a spare $19mil they want to lend me, I wouldn't be upset.
> 
> 
> http://www.hawaiilife.com/mls/352441/


On Maui, look at the Kahului area.

On the Big Island, look at the area South of Kona, Waikoloa, Waimea, and the North shore.  There are some good prices in Waimea, but it's way to remote: Wyoming with palm trees.  I need a view of the ocean.

From the prices that I've seen, Oahu and Kauai are out of the question.


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## rifleman69

Tamaradarann said:


> I don't know where you are looking, who you have been looking with, or what your requirements are, but we have found some of what we consider excellent 2 BR condo's for 500-700K 2 blocks from the beach and 1 block from the supermarket in Waikiki.  You don't need a car.  Walk to the mall.  The bus is on the corner and will take you to the places you can't walk to.  We can't afford this amount until we collect SS and sell our house, but this is very doable for us.




I'm thinking you might need to rethink your retirement plan, if you're depending on social security (and selling your current house) to live in Hawaii or anywhere else that is $500,000-700,000.


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## tompalm

BMWguynw said:


> Whereabouts on Oahu are those houses located? At those numbers, I'd expect them to be in great neighborhoods, or have awesome views, or something.  I agree about the outer islands.  I check Realtor.com fairly often (shopping for that unexpected gem, you understand ) and it seems there is better inventory at lower prices away from Oahu.
> 
> Dave



Here is the house that just sold.  Still in escrow, but sold the first week, and I think the first open house.  So the price was close to asking and maybe more if they got multiple offers. It is at 251 Kalalau St, 96825 in case the link doesn't work.  The house is across the street from the house on the highway and not a desirable street.  There is no view and nothing great about the house.  The carpet, bathroom and pool was old outdated, needed work and one of the bedrooms was a bright pick.  

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/251-Kalalau-St_Honolulu_HI_96825_M70088-28641

The lots in this neighborhood are R-10 or 10,000 sq foot, so it is more pricey than the average 5000 sq foot lots on island.  I have seen more than a few houses sell for over one million dollars, only to be knock down so a new home could be built.   These are houses without a view.  The house that sold for 1.9 million dollars had a great view that added about $500,000 to the price.

The area is Portlock Triangle, close to Hanauma Bay, or Hawaii Kai.  But, these are the cheaper houses in Portlock.


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## DaveNV

tompalm said:


> Here is the house that just sold.  Still in escrow, but sold the first week, and I think the first open house.  So the price was close to asking and maybe more if they got multiple offers. It is at 251 Kalalau St, 96825 in case the link doesn't work.  The house is across the street from the house on the highway and not a desirable street.  There is no view and nothing great about the house.  The carpet, bathroom and pool was old outdated, needed work and one of the bedrooms was a bright pick.
> 
> http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/251-Kalalau-St_Honolulu_HI_96825_M70088-28641
> 
> The lots in this neighborhood are R-10 or 10,000 sq foot, so it is more pricey than the average 5000 sq foot lots on island.  I have seen more than a few houses sell for over one million dollars, only to be knock down so a new home could be built.   These are houses without a view.  The house that sold for 1.9 million dollars had a great view that added about $500,000 to the price.
> 
> The area is Portlock Triangle, close to Hanauma Bay, or Hawaii Kai.  But, these are the cheaper houses in Portlock.



Thanks.  The key being the neighborhood of "Hawaii Kai."  I'd expect anything there to command a higher price than, say, Waimanalo or Wahiawa. 

I was surfing around an MLS there a year or two ago, and found a house I used to live in, in the Enchanted Lakes area of Kailua, was listed for $1.2million. Blew me away, because it didn't seem that fancy back in the early 1970s when I lived there. But the pictures showed the place had been totally redone, had a pool added, a new dock on the lakes, and whatever else. It was pretty nice.

Dave


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## KauaiMark

*We made the list- 10 worst places*



SmithOp said:


> Can you afford to live there?
> 
> http://money.usnews.com/money/retirement/articles/2013/03/11/the-10-worst-places-to-retire
> 
> Honolulu
> LA
> NY
> San Diego
> Oxnard ???



Yep we made the list:...
"...San Jose, Sunnyvale, and Santa Clara pay an average of $2,266 per month, and renters are charged a median of $1,059 monthly."

Maybe that's why watching Hawaii Life, $700k doesn't sound expensive. The 3br/2ba dump across the street just sold for $630K and it's not even on a beach. 


Compare that to my sisters place in Gainesville, GA 

...Mark


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## LisaH

KauaiMark said:


> Yep we made the list:...
> "...*San Jose, Sunnyvale, and Santa Clara pay an average of $2,266 per month, and renters are charged a median of $1,059 monthly.*"
> 
> Maybe that's why watching Hawaii Life, $700k doesn't sound expensive. The 3br/2ba dump across the street just sold for $630K and it's not even on a beach.
> 
> 
> Compare that to my sisters place in Gainesville, GA
> 
> ...Mark



I don't know anything in a 30 miles radius from where I live that rents for $1059 monthly...
Even when we first moved here, our 2BR apartment in Sunnyvale was a shocking $1000 month (we moved from CO where our mortgage was less than that). That was almost 20 years ago.


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## jlr10

SmithOp said:


> Can you afford to live there?
> 
> http://money.usnews.com/money/retirement/articles/2013/03/11/the-10-worst-places-to-retire
> 
> Honolulu
> LA
> NY
> San Diego
> Oxnard ???



We made the list in San Diego.  We would love to retire here but probably not doable. But if we move 50-60 miles north we can sell our house, buy a new house, pay cash, get twice the house and have $ left over.  The drawback?  We wouldn't live in San  Diego anymore


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## chrisfromOC

*prices seem ok to me*

Maybe it's a matter of high housing prices where I live, but I'm pleasantly surprised by the affordability of many of the houses on the show and keep urging my family to pack up and move ...


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## KauaiMark

My son is renting a 3br/2ba house in SJ and it's costing him $1500/month. If you believe zillow.com estimates, my house could be rented out for $3K/month. 

The best move I ever made was buying this place 40+yrs ago when it was "cheap" (about the price of a mid-low level Mercedes today)


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## Phill12

KauaiMark said:


> My son is renting a 3br/2ba house in SJ and it's costing him $1500/month. If you believe zillow.com estimates, my house could be rented out for $3K/month.
> 
> The best move I ever made was buying this place 40+yrs ago when it was "cheap" (about the price of a mid-low level Mercedes today)



That is a switch with Zillow having higher price listed. They are always showing lower price renting or selling.

PHILL12


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## Ron98GT

It wasn't that many years ago that I paid $530,000 for an acre of land so that I could build a house on it, and I was getting a deal compared to what other acres were going for.

More recently, I've been looking at land in SW Cape Coral, Florida.  On a channel with Gulf access & no low bridges (gave up on sailboat access, will have to put up with a 28-30 ft power boat).  By the time I put a house on the land with a sea wall, dock, pool, etc, I'd be pushing $500K, which is doable.

So, when I see 4-Bdrm homes, ocean view, and some with 3-car garages, for under $500,000, my wife may get her way and we may be moving to Hawaii in a few years, in lieu of Florida.


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## csalter2

jlr10 said:


> We made the list in San Diego.  We would love to retire here but probably not doable. But if we move 50-60 miles north we can sell our house, buy a new house, pay cash, get twice the house and have $ left over.  The drawback?  We wouldn't live in San  Diego anymore



50 or 60 miles north of you would put you in near me in Orange County (Dana Point, Laguna Niguel, Laguna Beach, etc.). You would not be able to do what you say. Believe me. In fact, I consider going 50 to 60 miles south, as it would be a better deal for me.


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## BocaBum99

Material goods do not create happiness.  My house in Hawaii is less than half the size of my house in Florida and I am 10 times happier living in Hawaii.  Evidently, I am not alone.

The people of Hawaii are the happiest in the country


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## Phill12

Tamaradarann said:


> I don't know where you are looking, who you have been looking with, or what your requirements are, but we have found some of what we consider excellent 2 BR condo's for 500-700K 2 blocks from the beach and 1 block from the supermarket in Waikiki.  You don't need a car.  Walk to the mall.  The bus is on the corner and will take you to the places you can't walk to.  We can't afford this amount until we collect SS and sell our house, but this is very doable for us.



You do understand we are talking about the showcase series Hawaii Life don't you?

PHILL12


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## lprstn

After watching the show my husband and I decided that we would rather rent there! The rental apartments on the properties were doable and in some decent areas.

I also wonder how many people on the show actually stuck around and continued to live in Hawaii - or if they left and came back to the mainland after realizing they'd have to work 2 times as hard for a living in paradise.


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## PearlCity

That show is interesting but, I do believe they are only showing their listings. My husband is an agent on Oahu and he couldn't believe the crap they were showing for one of the Oahu shows. That being said real estate is expensive here, utilities are high and cost of living is high. Most folks live in smaller homes here with very little land. But we have year round sunshine. 

The big island has cheaper lots and homes, but jobs are not as easy to come by as they are in Oahu. If you're set up with A great job on the big island if say you have it made. 

It's a fun show to watch though!


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## Tamaradarann

*No what is the showcase series*



Phill12 said:


> You do understand we are talking about the showcase series Hawaii Life don't you?
> 
> PHILL12



No I don't know that you are talking about the showcase series.  What is that?  If it is a showcase of expensive homes in Hawaii, you can find expensive homes in locations right where we live but don't want to live such as the North Shore or Hamptons of Long Island and NYC


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## Tamaradarann

*Long Island is so Expensive that Hawaii is doable*



rifleman69 said:


> I'm thinking you might need to rethink your retirement plan, if you're depending on social security (and selling your current house) to live in Hawaii or anywhere else that is $500,000-700,000.



We are retired already and live on Long Island in NY with our son.  With 3 cars an in-ground heated pool, and $7K in property taxes we can save about 12K a year in annual operating expenses if we live in Honolulu without a car and where the taxes on the above condo that has a pool and are about 2K a year. 
My wife and I will be collecting 40K in SS in a few years which will add to our retirement income that is already adequate for our expenses.  I think it is doable.


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## DaveNV

Tamaradarann said:


> No I don't know that you are talking about the showcase series.  What is that?  If it is a showcase of expensive homes in Hawaii, you can find expensive homes in locations right where we live but don't want to live such as the North Shore or Hamptons of Long Island and NYC





See my post #6 above in this thread.  "Hawaii Life" is a TV show on HGTV network. It shows couples house hunting in Hawaii.  

Dave


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## rifleman69

Tamaradarann said:


> We are retired already and live on Long Island in NY with our son.  With 3 cars an in-ground heated pool, and $7K in property taxes we can save about 12K a year in annual operating expenses if we live in Honolulu without a car and where the taxes on the above condo that has a pool and are about 2K a year.
> My wife and I will be collecting 40K in SS in a few years which will add to our retirement income that is already adequate for our expenses.  I think it is doable.



If you retired well before collecting social security, you shouldn't need the social security to help in what you're planning to do.  A financial advisor would have told you this when you were originally planning to retire.


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## PearlCity

Tamaradarann said:


> We are retired already and live on Long Island in NY with our son.  With 3 cars an in-ground heated pool, and $7K in property taxes we can save about 12K a year in annual operating expenses if we live in Honolulu without a car and where the taxes on the above condo that has a pool and are about 2K a year.
> My wife and I will be collecting 40K in SS in a few years which will add to our retirement income that is already adequate for our expenses.  I think it is doable.



Are you calculating in the at least $300-$600 in maintenance fees for the condo on top of the property taxes? and the $.25-$.28kwH electricity bill we pay (Mainland rates run $.08-$.12 a kWH).  Not to mention the soaring sewer fees on Oahu.


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## singlemalt_18

From the original thread post #1



jehb2 said:


> I find Hawaii Life to be* a little depressing*...  maybe it just depresses me because it shows me what I could actually afford if I move to Hawaii.



Yes, Hawaii Life IS a TV show, and it was found to be a little depressing.  So... after all of the discussion on realtor listings and retirement planning, 50 posts later we come to this:



PearlCity said:


> Are you calculating in the at least $300-$600 *per month* in maintenance fees for the condo on top of the property taxes? and the $.25-$.28kwH electricity bill we pay (Mainland rates run $.08-$.12 a kWH).  Not to mention the soaring sewer fees on Oahu.



Nice to see the thread back on topic!


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## danb

*Hawaii life*

We purchased in KaMakana after looking at many homes throughout the island. It has everything we like and we are looking forward to the move. Moving from CT, the third most heavily taxes state in the US we are looking at about a 12k reduction in taxes moving to Oahu. We compared food prices from Ct to Oahu and they are about the same. Sure electricity is more but we won't be purchasing oil at $3.90 per gal. Also on the news tonight they are talking about adding another tax to pay for improvements in energy efficiency. We already have a fund which the state tapped into to reduce debt so now they need another tax. I believe we have the highest tax on gas in the country. 
So after looking at all the taxes and quality of life we are making the move. Closing in April and moving in. 
We purchased the home with our son DIL and will live together. This saves a lot and enables us to live in paradise with our grandchildren. We will be retired and enjoying the Hawaii life.


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## fillde

danb said:


> We purchased in KaMakana after looking at many homes throughout the island. It has everything we like and we are looking forward to the move. Moving from CT, the third most heavily taxes state in the US we are looking at about a 12k reduction in taxes moving to Oahu. We compared food prices from Ct to Oahu and they are about the same. Sure electricity is more but we won't be purchasing oil at $3.90 per gal. Also on the news tonight they are talking about adding another tax to pay for improvements in energy efficiency. We already have a fund which the state tapped into to reduce debt so now they need another tax. I believe we have the highest tax on gas in the country.
> So after looking at all the taxes and quality of life we are making the move. Closing in April and moving in.
> We purchased the home with our son DIL and will live together. This saves a lot and enables us to live in paradise with our grandchildren. We will be retired and enjoying the Hawaii life.



KaMakana= the gift. Danb wish you luck in paradise.

Right now the talk is taxes. Next year the talk will be "what happened to my healthcare".


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## frank808

danb said:


> Sure electricity is more but we won't be purchasing oil at $3.90 per gal.



Your right on that oil is $4.33 a gallon for 87 octane!


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## Phill12

Tamaradarann said:


> No I don't know that you are talking about the showcase series.  What is that?  If it is a showcase of expensive homes in Hawaii, you can find expensive homes in locations right where we live but don't want to live such as the North Shore or Hamptons of Long Island and NYC



 Go back to first posting and read it!

 It is a tv series on HGTV every week showing families looking at moving to Hawaii and looking at homes for sale. Most of these homes are over priced dumps and one always seems to have nice view of ocean area but that is about it.

 This weeks show was one of the worse and I wouldn't have even walked into two of the three to look. I know they look at more homes then decide on three for the show but have trouble believing this would have been the best three choices.
This week they did have a nice looking realtor instead of that older lady that looks like  dry leather, guessing many hours in sun or tanning booth. 

PHILL12


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## rifleman69

PearlCity said:


> Are you calculating in the at least $300-$600 in maintenance fees for the condo on top of the property taxes? and the $.25-$.28kwH electricity bill we pay (Mainland rates run $.08-$.12 a kWH).  Not to mention the soaring sewer fees on Oahu.



Nope, they aren't calculating the maintenance fees and electricity.


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## danb

*Hawaii Life*

Again, I don't think the prices were out of line except the home in Oahu that was in really bad shape. Essentially it needed at least $200k of work. 
We looked at a home in Kailua that was in a very desirable neighborhood. The homes in the area were very nice, you could see some were completely rebuilt or remodeled. This home was very dated with a tiny kitchen from the 50's. it needed everything. The asking price was $648k. We were told it probably wouldn't last a week. It didn't have a water view and was about a 1/2 mile from the water. 
So the houses they showed fit what we looked at in Oahu.


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## danb

*Hawaii Life*

Again, I don't think the prices were out of line except the home in Oahu that was in really bad shape. Essentially it needed at least $200k of work. 
We looked at a home in Kailua that was in a very desirable neighborhood. The homes in the area were very nice, you could see some were completely rebuilt or remodeled. This home was very dated with a tiny kitchen from the 50's. it needed everything. The asking price was $648k. We were told it probably wouldn't last a week. It didn't have a water view and was about a 1/2 mile from the water. 
So the houses they showed fit what we looked at in Oahu.


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## presley

Hmm.  The cost of living doesn't sound more than what we go through here in San Diego.  It was big news on the local news last night that you could get a gallon of gas for only $4.19.  Our electric bill, even with solar, runs $95. - $200./month and that is after we've used all our own solar power.  .15 - .26 pkw h is what the charge is.  Between air conditioning and pool pump, we can't lower our cost.

I often fantasize about retiring on the Big Island.  I'll have to see what the property taxes are over there.  Right now, even if our home was totally paid off, we would need to pay $4K/year just for property tax.  I don't want to move, but I don't see us ever retiring in California.  I wouldn't mind moving if it was to Kona.


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## rifleman69

$4000 a year for property tax?   That's pretty much a $250,000 house in Portland Oregon.


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## Kona Lovers

We've watched those house hunting shows about Hawaii as well.  I love the scenery if nothing else.  One thing I wonder about the shows is are they maybe showing some to actually discourage people from considering moving to Hawaii?
 Just a thought.  

Aloha,

Marty


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## PearlCity

presley said:


> Hmm.  The cost of living doesn't sound more than what we go through here in San Diego.  It was big news on the local news last night that you could get a gallon of gas for only $4.19.  Our electric bill, even with solar, runs $95. - $200./month and that is after we've used all our own solar power.  .15 - .26 pkw h is what the charge is.  Between air conditioning and pool pump, we can't lower our cost.
> 
> I often fantasize about retiring on the Big Island.  I'll have to see what the property taxes are over there.  Right now, even if our home was totally paid off, we would need to pay $4K/year just for property tax.  I don't want to move, but I don't see us ever retiring in California.  I wouldn't mind moving if it was to Kona.



Except that our income taxes are high. When I lived in California I was so excited that I had to pay so little in taxes. And we get taxed on groceries., medical services etc.. And melectric bill? $200 a month is with use of solar hot water and no air conditioner use. If my family wasn't living here I'd move and just vacation here.

The big island is nice. I don't know what property taxes are but we are here visiting family right now and were told that a friend had to sell their house on the west side due to high property tax. On a rental property we own on Oahu, a 300 sf studio worth abou $160 k but with maintenance fees of $288 monthly, we pay $700 annually in property tax I think....


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## presley

rifleman69 said:


> $4000 a year for property tax?   That's pretty much a $250,000 house in Portland Oregon.



I'm actually going to Oregon in a months to scope out the area.  No sales tax is attractive.   Is $250K considered high or low for a house there?  Ours was $280 and we've put another $100K in and it is still a run down piece of crap.    We have 1/2 acre, though, which is considered huge where we live.


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## presley

oops, sorry went off topic in last post...

I watch the show and love it.  I also watch the one about buying a home in Alaska.  The thing I don't understand is whey they show properties that don't fit the buyers criteria.  There are so many properties for sale.  I guess they are really just pushing the one that fits.  Of course, both shows are probably really about stimulating the economies in both states.


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## DaveNV

presley said:


> I'm actually going to Oregon in a months to scope out the area.  No sales tax is attractive.   Is $250K considered high or low for a house there?  Ours was $280 and we've put another $100K in and it is still a run down piece of crap.    We have 1/2 acre, though, which is considered huge where we live.




<off topic reply> No sales tax in Oregon, but fairly steep state income taxes, licensing, permits, and other fees.  Do your due diligence before you move.  And depending on the area, that $250K is low average prices.  Nicer areas will be higher.

Dave

</off topic reply>


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## DaveNV

presley said:


> oops, sorry went off topic in last post...
> 
> I watch the show and love it.  I also watch the one about buying a home in Alaska.  The thing I don't understand is whey they show properties that don't fit the buyers criteria.  There are so many properties for sale.  I guess they are really just pushing the one that fits.  Of course, both shows are probably really about stimulating the economies in both states.




This is what I was saying about the Hawaii Life show - it seems to me they must be showing only their own listings on the show.  The junk houses they show otherwise make no sense.  Why else would they show such a wide diversity of houses that don't fit the buyer's needs or budget, or that are so far away from the areas they want?  You can't tell me those few homes are the ONLY things for sale in the area?  Ridiculous.

Dave


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## presley

Here's a house I'd buy sight unseen if I could just write a check.  
http://www.realtor.com/realestatean...malahoa-Hwy_Kailua-Kona_HI_96740_M80217-17018

Hawaii is attractive to me because I "think" I'd be outside most of the time.  However, I am inside most of the time where I live now.  So, maybe it's just a pipe dream.


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## rifleman69

presley said:


> I'm actually going to Oregon in a months to scope out the area.  No sales tax is attractive.   Is $250K considered high or low for a house there?  Ours was $280 and we've put another $100K in and it is still a run down piece of crap.    We have 1/2 acre, though, which is considered huge where we live.



I'd say low.   You can find dumps around obviously but most everything is at least $200,000.   Our last house, which was $260,000 was about 2100 sq ft, about 4 feet from the house next to it, with a postage stamp back yard and front yard.   Really all depends on where you want to live...the houses that seem like stealing deals are most likely in crappier neighborhoods.   If you want that ranch style house with a pretty decent front/back yard, look in Raleigh Hills or just near Highway 217 and Highway 26.


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## rifleman69

presley said:


> Here's a house I'd buy sight unseen if I could just write a check.
> http://www.realtor.com/realestatean...malahoa-Hwy_Kailua-Kona_HI_96740_M80217-17018
> 
> Hawaii is attractive to me because I "think" I'd be outside most of the time.  However, I am inside most of the time where I live now.  So, maybe it's just a pipe dream.



Check the roof.


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## danb

*Hawaii life*

Another perk for a retiree is the state of Hawaii gives you a $120k exemption off the assessed value of your home at age 66. The mill rate is 3.54 mills. They don't tax state pensions and SS. Sales tax is 4.5%.
Compare that with CT. Everyone I know our age is either leaving or planning on leaving this state. 
Home sales in Oahu for the period 12/12 to 2/13 were 717 homes at a average price of $600k. Condos for the same period sold 950 units for a average price of $333k. Sales of homes were up 8.3% and condos 13.1%.


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## PearlCity

danb said:


> Another perk for a retiree is the state of Hawaii gives you a $120k exemption off the assessed value of your home at age 66. The mill rate is 3.54 mills. They don't tax state pensions and SS. Sales tax is 4.5%.
> Compare that with CT. Everyone I know our age is either leaving or planning on leaving this state.
> Home sales in Oahu for the period 12/12 to 2/13 were 717 homes at a average price of $600k. Condos for the same period sold 950 units for a average price of $333k. Sales of homes were up 8.3% and condos 13.1%.



Good luck with your retirement on Oahu!


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## lprstn

I told my husband I'd be willing to 'live' on the Island for 3 months out of the year (via using our timeshares) and doing some rentals. However, the opportunities for our kids are mainly on the mainland and they will likely stay on the mainland to continue school and such. Therefore, I'd prefer to be where they are most of the time but escaping to Hawaii for a few months out of the year will still be a dream.


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## HatTrick

SmithOp said:


> Can you afford to live there?
> 
> http://money.usnews.com/money/retirement/articles/2013/03/11/the-10-worst-places-to-retire



On the other hand...

http://taxes.about.com/od/statetaxes/a/Best-States-for-Retirees.htm


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## Phill12

Kona Lovers said:


> We've watched those house hunting shows about Hawaii as well.  I love the scenery if nothing else.  One thing I wonder about the shows is are they maybe showing some to actually discourage people from considering moving to Hawaii?
> Just a thought.
> Aloha,
> Marty





 if you are right this show doing a great job of turning off people. We live in N. California and love it and much rather enjoy a week in Hawaii and then return home. :whoopie:

 We had two friends move there about ten years ago one to Maui and other another island and both moved back here to N. California within four years and cost had nothing to do with there choice. Both said they became very bored in Hawaii and missed the N. California/Reno/Tahoe area. 

PHIL


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## PearlCity

HatTrick said:


> On the other hand...
> 
> http://taxes.about.com/od/statetaxes/a/Best-States-for-Retirees.htm



The article says least property taxes wrt home value but home value of a small 1500 sf non oceanfront home on Oahu is $650k. If you calculate it out taxes are probably the same out of pocket or more than someone with a $200 k house elsewhere.


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## Tamaradarann

*Maintenance Fees and Taxes*



PearlCity said:


> Are you calculating in the at least $300-$600 in maintenance fees for the condo on top of the property taxes? and the $.25-$.28kwH electricity bill we pay (Mainland rates run $.08-$.12 a kWH).  Not to mention the soaring sewer fees on Oahu.



The Electric rates on Long Island are almost as high as Hawaii so that increase wouldn't be a problem.  Also, a 2 BR Condo has got use less electric than than a 3 BR House with a full finished basement, garage, and televisions and refrigerators all over the house.  

The operating costs that I listed was with me doing all the maintenance and repair work myself.  As I get into my 70's I will probably have to pay where I live for gardening, pool maintenance, painting, plumbing, electric etc.  $600/month will be a bargain.


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## rifleman69

Tamaradarann said:


> The Electric rates on Long Island are almost as high as Hawaii so that increase wouldn't be a problem.  Also, a 2 BR Condo has got use less electric than than a 3 BR House with a full finished basement, garage, and televisions and refrigerators all over the house.



Only if you don't use the a/c.


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## Tamaradarann

*A/C in Hawaii?*



rifleman69 said:


> Only if you don't use the a/c.



We have been in Hawaii in Jan, Feb, Mar, and April and have not needed A/C as long as the window open.  If you are on the sunny side of a building I could see the need for A/C.  If we bought in Honolulu we couldn't afford anything but the Mauka side of the building which usually doesn't get much sun or it is early morning if any.


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## rifleman69

But that's just Jan/Feb/March...what about the other nine months?   


Buy somewhere else than Honolulu.


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## PearlCity

Tamaradarann said:


> We have been in Hawaii in Jan, Feb, Mar, and April and have not needed A/C as long as the window open.  If you are on the sunny side of a building I could see the need for A/C.  If we bought in Honolulu we couldn't afford anything but the Mauka side of the building which usually doesn't get much sun or it is early morning if any.



Yes your electric bills are up there too! As so ac we find our electric bills highest from July through November. You sound like you very much thought this through and I wish you the best of luck. If you buy on Oahu recommend you check the Honolulu board of realtors website at www.hicentral.com for all the listings and try visiting in august or Sep and meet with an agent to look at places. Running numbers are great but I think you should really look at places and see what you can get for your money while you are here.  Good luck!


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## Tamaradarann

*Not Needing a car is Essential*



rifleman69 said:


> But that's just Jan/Feb/March...what about the other nine months?
> 
> 
> Buy somewhere else than Honolulu.



I said we have been here is April as well as J/F/M.  While the weather may be somewhat hotter from May thru October it will not be any hotter than New York in the summer which we have lived in for 63 years without A/C.  In addition not needed a car to live and enjoy life is essential for us.  In Hawaii you can only do that in Honolulu.


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## danb

*Hawaii life*

I agree with you and our original goal was to live in Hawaii for 6 months a year but our Son, DIL and the kids fell in love with the island so we bought the house together. 
Today is my first day of retirement. Big change as well as moving in 3 weeks. Trying to wrap my head around not getting up and going to work.


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## WinniWoman

rifleman69 said:


> $4000 a year for property tax?   That's pretty much a $250,000 house in Portland Oregon.



Try $9000.00 in school and property taxes for a $250,000 house in a rural part of the Hudson Valley area in New York!


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## slip

I feel much better now about the $2,800 I pay for my $200,000 house in
Wisconsin.


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## rpw

*congrats*



danb said:


> I agree with you and our original goal was to live in Hawaii for 6 months a year but our Son, DIL and the kids fell in love with the island so we bought the house together.
> Today is my first day of retirement. Big change as well as moving in 3 weeks. Trying to wrap my head around not getting up and going to work.



I can only dream that I can retire someday.


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## rpw

*Your electric bill may not be so bad....*



rifleman69 said:


> Only if you don't use the a/c.



I have family that live on Oahu in Miliani and they are now paying $16 a month.

OK, I have to add the caveat, they had solar panels put on their roof last year and now only pay a connection fee.  After federal and Hawaii rebates, the panels only cost them $12k and they figure they will break even in 4 years!  (did you know that electricty is .25kwh out there!)

I saw solar electric on a TON of roofs out there, far more than I have in the last 7 years I'd been going to HI.  Solar water heating was common, but I'll bet 1 in 20 houses have solar electric now.


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## rifleman69

mpumilia said:


> Try $9000.00 in school and property taxes for a $250,000 house in a rural part of the Hudson Valley area in New York!



Thankfully, the state of Oregon passed measure 5 back in the early 90's which limited the amount of assessed value that could be taxed...so it's limited to a 3% increase of the assessed value, but your property taxes can be raised (or lowered) by more.

$9000 in property taxes out here in Oregon would be equivalent of a $700,000 house I'm guessing...4000 sq ft minimum and a pretty decent sized plot of land?


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