# Urgent Advice-Good Deal or Dump?



## Bluesboy (Jul 14, 2015)

Just purchased from HGVC a 1 bedroom at Elara, 12K. Odd year 3400 points + 15,000 bonus.  A good deal or bad?  Not too late to cancel.

Thanks,


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## Passepartout (Jul 14, 2015)

It appears you bought from the developer. If so, the quick and dirty answer is you should rescind. You can then take your time learning the system and if you still are interested, buy resale. The developer deal is almost never a great deal for the buyer, and should it turn out to be, after you study it, it will always be available.

Jim


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## 1Kflyerguy (Jul 14, 2015)

There are similar point offerings available resale at the $1500 to 3500 range from some of the popular brokers. 

The bonus points are worth something, but probably not worth difference... The other question on bonus points, would you be able to vacation that much in the two years they are valid?


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## allenh91801 (Jul 14, 2015)

I would definitely cancel and consider resale.


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## alexadeparis (Jul 14, 2015)

Rescind! look up the sample recission letters on the main website. Do it now. Then take the time to figure out how many points you really want.  I bought a resale unit at the Bay Club (well, 2 actually) for less than $1,000 (total) "all-in" that yields 4800 EOY  Hilton points (9600 for both units). No bonus points, but I saved a lot of money.


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## SmithOp (Jul 14, 2015)

Rescind, 3400 point packages are plentiful on eBay much cheaper.


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## presley (Jul 14, 2015)

It's too much. 3400 contracts go for thousands less on Ebay and EOY even less. Elara also has MFs that are too high. 

After you cancel, let us know how often you like to vacation and room size/season needed and we can suggest more appropriate timeshares. Even if Elara turns out to be the best choice for you, you can get a lot more points for a lot less money.


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## Jason245 (Jul 14, 2015)

Bluesboy said:


> Just purchased from HGVC a 1 bedroom at Elara, 12K. Odd year 3400 points + 15,000 bonus.  A good deal or bad?  Not too late to cancel.
> 
> Thanks,



If you are asking this question, you don't know enough to have purchased in the first place.


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## vacationhopeful (Jul 14, 2015)

Jason245 said:


> If you are asking this question, you don't know enough to have purchased in the first place.



This as absolutely correct!!!

Rescind and save yourself a lot of money ... you can buy resale and instead of paying a loan payment AND your MFs ... you could buy double the points and let what would have been your LOAN PAYMENT to pay for your annual MFs plus YOUR rental car fees while on vacation.

Get it ... ONE OPPORTUNITY TO SAVE YOURSELF A BUNCH OF $$$$$$.

PS And after learning all about any timeshare product and YOU still want to buy from the developer at FULL PRICE .... that deal will still be available .... might even be ON SALE!!!!!


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## RX8 (Jul 14, 2015)

Jason245 said:


> If you are asking this question, you don't know enough to have purchased in the first place.



I congratulate the OP for researching after the fact and being aware of the rescind option.  So many others find out it was a bad deal weeks or months too late!


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## Bluesboy (Jul 14, 2015)

1kflyerguy, thanks.  Time is absolutely available within the two year time frame in order to absorb the 15K bonus points.


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## Passepartout (Jul 14, 2015)

The question is, if you can buy the same thing you bought from Hilton for $3000, can you buy the equivalent vacations as the 15k of points will get you for $9,000? I think you can. In fact as I understand their points/MF ratio thing, you can get a much larger bundle of points at the same annual MF cost.

It's your money to spend as you wish, but in timeshares, resale beats retail every time. And remember, this is not a 'new vs used' thing. ALL timeshares are used. Regardless of where you buy, someone slept in the bed the night before, and ate their cereal out of the same bowl as you will when you check in.

Buy resale, save thou$and$.


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## Bluesboy (Jul 14, 2015)

RX8 said:


> I congratulate the OP for researching after the fact and being aware of the rescind option.  So many others find out it was a bad deal weeks or months too late!


Jason245, thanks for the feedback.

Indeed new to the timeshare world, but pretty savvy on state rescission clauses.   I have recently looked at comparable resale properties on Redweek, Remax, etc.  but so far haven't found any comparable property with the combined points we have at 18,400, but still looking. 

Understanding the high/low difference in resale and developer pricing will likely always be significant, there appears also to be considerable variation in deals struck within HGVC, so it remains whether my deal was a more favorable one.  Predicated on what we could hear from other prospective buyers within earshot during our presentation, it would seem so.  But then again others participating were also likely newcomers as well.  Bottom line question is, within the realm of developer deals did we get a good one or not? Clearly, time shares purchased direct from a developer have the value wheels, including the spare, come off the moment the ink dries on the contract, but yet someone (maybe not you or I) has to pay for the development, marketing, and related expenses otherwise the product diminishes or disappears completely.

Like most anyone else I am always receptive to getting a deal, but it seems to me that most of the reviews have read regarding the likes HGVC, Marriot and others, the general attitude toward these developers is not just lightly skewed to the negative side, but heavily so.  So are these folks problematic to the point that the only good deal in time sharing is to buy in cheap enough so as to create tolerance in a negative world?


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## Jason245 (Jul 14, 2015)

Bluesboy said:


> Jason245, thanks for the feedback.
> 
> Indeed new to the timeshare world, but pretty savvy on state rescission clauses.   I have recently looked at comparable resale properties on Redweek, Remax, etc.  but so far haven't found any comparable property with the combined points we have at 18,400, but still looking.
> 
> ...


I bought 4800 pts eoy resale for 0 all costs included on ebay.  At the amount you paid,  I could pay my mf on the eoy for 20 years.  

Asking if you got a good price in comparison to other developer sales is akin to asking if you got a good price on the used car lot when all you did before hand was show up and pick the red one for 500 less than the asking price and getting them to throw  in a free tank of gas while not even having a drivers license.  

Ultimately it is your money so you can spend it how you like. 

Do you understand hgvc?  Have you read all the information about timeshares on tug?  The hgvc program summary?  Read the last few months of posts on this forum?  Know what the points can get you?  Know what the obligations of being a timeshare owner are? 

If you spent less than 6 months researching this, you are probably moving to fast.  I spent almost a year before I pulled the trigger .





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## Talent312 (Jul 14, 2015)

If you are bound + determined to throw your $$ away on a developer-sale... hey, whatever floats your boat, dude. There are plenty of posters here who paid full-freight as you did for a developer package, so you can take comfort in knowing that you have good company.

But if you ask them if it's a good deal, you'll get a snort, 'cuz they learned the hard way this fact of life: That shiny new car you just drove off the lot is now worth no more than 25% of what you paid. BTW, those bonus-points? Two years from now, they'll be gone and you'll be left with a TS for which you overpaid.
.

.


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## SmithOp (Jul 14, 2015)

Bluesboy said:


> I have recently looked at comparable resale properties on Redweek, Remax, etc.  but so far haven't found any comparable property with the combined points we have at 18,400, but still looking.




The problem is that 15,000 of that 18,400 are one time use.  You will be stuck paying maint fees every year and only getting 3400 going forward.


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## Ty1on (Jul 14, 2015)

Bluesboy said:


> Jason245, thanks for the feedback.
> 
> Indeed new to the timeshare world, but pretty savvy on state rescission clauses.   I have recently looked at comparable resale properties on Redweek, Remax, etc.  but so far haven't found any comparable property with the combined points we have at 18,400, but still looking.
> 
> ...



I always feel better when the VP who hired me is still on board, because a hiring manager can be emotionally attached to her decision, refusing to admit that hiring me may have been a mistake.  A new leader, on the other hand, doesn't harbor such attachment.

Consider whether you are defending your purchase because you made the decision, or it really was a great purchase.

It's true that this board is overwhelmingly against developer purchases and in favor of resale purchases.  You have a couple days to really look at the numbers of your deal, and determine objectively if it makes sense or not, if you are cognizant of the fact that as the purchase decisionmaker you may be biased, and are willing to put that bias aside.  It may have been a good decision, but I'd advise that you arrive at that conclusion objectively, not emotionally.

1.  How many weeks will you get with your bonus points over the next two years?  look up rental values for those weeks in locations that attract you.  Would you really have paid to stay somewhere for those weeks, or would you be taking extra vacations to justify your purchase?

2.  How much would it cost to buy the same number of points resale, irrespective of the bonus points?  Are there any advantages to owning developer points vs resale points that you think are critical to you?

3.  Add 1 & 2 together.  If that amount exceeds $12K, then be happy.  If not, then rescind, buy a resale, and use the extra money to buy those extra weeks you lost out on.

4.  If you would require financing to make a resale purchase, then developer is your only option.  The financing, even at a high rate, could reasonably justify the price difference in buying developer if this timeshare is really important to you.

No one is trying to hammer you to rescind.  As a fan of resale, I am appreciative of everyone who buys developer and keeps the timeshare machine running.  But it would be prudent to step back from your attachment to the transaction and analyze it objectively.  No one can do that for you.


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## GregT (Jul 14, 2015)

Bluesboy said:


> Jason245, thanks for the feedback.
> 
> Indeed new to the timeshare world, but pretty savvy on state rescission clauses.   I have recently looked at comparable resale properties on Redweek, Remax, etc.  but so far haven't found any comparable property with the combined points we have at 18,400, but still looking.
> 
> ...



BluesBoy,

I'm not sure how to respond -- your one-time points are single-use only, and I'm sure you would get good use out of them, but then you have 3,400 points EOY.

For comparison:

I paid $2,900 for 4,800 Annual points in 2010 (Sea World)
I paid $4,900 for 4,800 Annual points in 2012 (I-Drive)
I paid $6,500 for 7,000 Annual points in 2014 (Flamingo)

So....for the vicinity ($14,300) of what you are paying from the developer ($12,000), I receive 16,600 points annually.  I have much higher MFs granted ($2,800) than your 3,400 EOY week ($500?), but I have alot of points to work with annually (too many points, actually).    This is why I am selling I-Drive.

Good luck with your own analysis, but I don't think it works out in favor of developer purchases (which I have done -- paying much more than the total listed above).

Best,

Greg


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## csxjohn (Jul 15, 2015)

Since you asked the question I feel you should rescind the purchase now.

You will then have plenty of time to research to see if that is a good deal or not.

If after studying the purchase you determine it was a good deal, you can always go back and get it again.


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## 1Kflyerguy (Jul 15, 2015)

Bluesboy said:


> 1kflyerguy, thanks.  Time is absolutely available within the two year time frame in order to absorb the 15K bonus points.




Its good that can use the bonus points.. I see many post here and on Facebook from people that suddenly realize their bonus points are about to expire..  They are of no value if you let them expire..

I am in  agreement with the others that you could easily find something resale for less money.  Resale never comes with bonus points, but it does offer a much lower purchase price.

If your real question is how does this deal compared with other developer sales?  That is hard to really say, as that data is not published.. But i can share that you are getting more bonus points than I received when we made our original 5000 point purchase direct from Hilton.  So that is a plus, but then your also paying more per point than i did when you amortize the  every other year.   

The other concern i would have is that you are buying into the club at a very low point level.  There are some resorts you won't be able to use with so few points.  Please make sure you have looked at that aspect as well.  I know sometimes the salespeople make out that all the resorts are equal, but they are not  and may struggle to find a resort in the season you want to travel.


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## Passepartout (Jul 15, 2015)

The sales weasels are very smart to determine just how much is the max the prospect can/will spend. Then they add bonuses to incentivise the mark to sign. This has nothing to do with how much vacation the buyer gets, or how many points it will take to pull a standard 7 night reservation at their chosen resort. It's all about the signature- and if the buyer needs more points later, hey, that's another sale/commission.

Jim

I really think the OP has been provided plenty of information to make an informed decision. Now it's up to him to act. Or not.


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## PigsDad (Jul 15, 2015)

SmithOp said:


> The problem is that 15,000 of that 18,400 are one time use.  You will be stuck paying maint fees every year and only getting 3400 going forward.



It's worse than that.  The contract that the OP signed was for an EOY contract (odd years).  So comparing apples to apples, the OPs contract only compares to 1700 annual points when looking at resale offerings.

I think the OP is missing this HUGE point.

Kurt


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## vacationhopeful (Jul 15, 2015)

Passepartout said:


> ....I really think the OP has been provided plenty of information to make an informed decision. Now it's up to him to act. Or not.



I totally agree on YOUR comment, Jim!

OP ... look beyond the Bonus Points!!! It is like the diner giving you a 2nd dessert "on the house".. 

I would rather buy CHEAP resale  - FOR more points than this deal and USE the money for this "loan payment for the next 10-15 years" to pay my MFs.

YOUR goal is family vacations that your family can afford in a nice unit. 

PS I think of the poor fish in the pond eyeing up a fat juicy worm .... and seizing the bait. He might get the worm in his mouth ... but he can't enjoy it as he is struggling to stay "in the lake" ... else the fish is being fried for dinner.


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## presley (Jul 15, 2015)

Bluesboy said:


> Indeed new to the timeshare world, but pretty savvy on state rescission clauses.   I have recently looked at comparable resale properties on Redweek, Remax, etc.  but so far haven't found any comparable property with the combined points we have at 18,400, but still looking.



Remember that your bonus points are one time use points. So, there is no way to compare a resale contract of 18,400 points to a contract of 3400 EOY that comes with bonus points. 

You can easily figure the cost of bonus points by looking at the MFs for the property you are interested in. If you have 12K bonus points, look at the MFs for one year for a contract that is 12K points. That is your value. Pulling this somewhat out of my head from memory of what others have recently posted: the MFs for a King's Land 12,600 contract is around $1600.  You could figure the cost of a resale contract and add $1600. to get the actual value of what you have.

If you love your purchase and are very happy with it and what you paid, then don't worry about doing math or searching resales. Just enjoy your purchase. I am sure you were very excited about it when you bought it. It doesn't really seem like you are keen on buying cancelling it and buying resale and there is no reason why you should do all that if you really don't want to. We will never tell you that you got a good deal, but there is no reason why you should care what we think.


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## Jason245 (Jul 15, 2015)

It is much easier to buy a timeshare then get rid of one.


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## vacationhopeful (Jul 15, 2015)

presley said:


> ....... It doesn't really seem like you are keen on buying cancelling it and buying resale and there is no reason why you should do all that if you really don't want to. We will never tell you that you got a good deal, but there is no reason why you should care what we think.



OP is thinking ... There has to be a catch!!! How can these internet people believe that they own exactly what I am buying from the developer? Hilton is a big company and builds & manages these resorts ... this idea of resale MUST be "funny" or not legal or simply just NOT the same product as what Hilton has offered to sell me. Why wouldn't Hilton just buy all these cheap points back themselves instead of allowing this "Black Market" to exist out in the open on the internet. 

To the OP ... every timeshare is USED after the first guest ever to stay in that unit checks out. Hilton takes back trade ins points or foreclosed on points ... and they are building NEW resorts. 

Selling your points becomes YOUR problem and your costs ... you would be selling a niche product which YOU paid a lot of money for. It is an imperfect market and you have to find a willing buyer ... the LOW (very low price) is your only option in dumping the Hilton points. You are not going to finance it, you are not going to have an marketing operation on site, you have to pay the carrying costs ... Hilton has COSTS and they are bigger ... including those gifts for attending and the sales space they use.

If you truly are not going to use your ONE TIME ONLY WINDOW to RESCIND ... fine! Enjoy your points and many years of vacationing with the family! We all will be staying in the unit next door, going out to eat most nights and will mostly, staying a 2nd week also.


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## csxjohn (Jul 15, 2015)

Here are recent HGVC auctions on eBay.  The ones with green prices actually sold.  The others got no bids.

This may help you determine if you got a good deal or not.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fro...re&LH_Complete=1&rt=nc&_trksid=p2045573.m1684


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## mtm65 (Jul 15, 2015)

Bluesboy said:


> Just purchased from HGVC a 1 bedroom at Elara, 12K. Odd year 3400 points + 15,000 bonus.  A good deal or bad?  Not too late to cancel.
> 
> Thanks,



Last fall we purchased a 3,400 point Oceans 22 EVERY year contract for $ 17,000 plus they offered 10,000 bonus points.  HGVC offered even more bonus points when we rescinded to try to change our minds.  We rescinded before we even completed our vacation, thanks to the members here at TUG.

To answer your question, I don't think you are getting a good deal.

We bought from Seth Nock last winter and now have 7,000 points and we spent about half of what the Oceans 22 cost.  We are happy with our purchase and have already used it for two vacations.

If I had to do it all over again, I would do the very same thing.

My advice, rescind and call Seth!!  You can do much better


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## goprohero (Jul 24, 2015)

Is a $12,118 loan payable over 10 years at 11.75% equaling $176.11 per month for 4200 points HGVC Seapointe a good deal or not?



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## Sandy VDH (Jul 24, 2015)

goprohero said:


> Is a $12,118 loan payable over 10 years at 11.75% equaling $176.11 per month for 4200 points HGVC Seapointe a good deal or not?
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Bad deal, just for the interest Rate alone.  Pay cash and buy resale. If Platinum week pay about 5K if Gold week pay less. 

11.75 interest, now that is crazy.


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## Cyberc (Jul 24, 2015)

goprohero said:


> Is a $12,118 loan payable over 10 years at 11.75% equaling $176.11 per month for 4200 points HGVC Seapointe a good deal or not?
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



if you need to loan money to buy your TS, then it is not a good deal(for you). On the other hand 4200 points for 12k is definitely a bad deal you need to rescind asap, you can get much better deals buying resale.

regards.


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## goprohero (Jul 24, 2015)

I forgot to mention the 4200 points is every ODD year.


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## Cyberc (Jul 24, 2015)

goprohero said:


> I forgot to mention the 4200 points is every ODD year.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



It is still a bad deal. it would still be bad even if it was annual.

regards


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## Sandy VDH (Jul 24, 2015)

goprohero said:


> I forgot to mention the 4200 points is every ODD year.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Even worse deal,  don't do it.  By resale and pay cash or use a 0% interest offer.   If you have to finance the timeshare purchase, you can't afford it. JMHO


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## clotheshorse (Jul 24, 2015)

goprohero said:


> I forgot to mention the 4200 points is every ODD year.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Terrible deal, call Seth or check the marketplace on TUG.  I purchased 4200 odd from him for $1,000 last year.   It was a good add to my existing points.  Save your money and buy resale.


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