# Aloha Airlines/Aloha is Toast [Merged]



## Kauai Kid (Mar 22, 2008)

According to the morning paper, Aloha is bankrupt again.  They claim because of competition from Mesa and Go.

Sterling


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## Steamboat Bill (Mar 22, 2008)

If I need to fly from Kona to Maui in June, what is the best one way fare?


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## Mimi (Mar 22, 2008)

We just booked a one-way from LIH Kauai to OGG Maui for $73 on Hawaiian in January, after it went down from $85 a few days ago. Seems like a R/T fare.


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## DeniseM (Mar 22, 2008)

Steamboat Bill said:


> If I need to fly from Kona to Maui in June, what is the best one way fare?



If you haven't booked this yet, I would get serious about it.  Inter Island flights sell out during high season and prices are not likely to go down.


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## pcgirl54 (Mar 22, 2008)

I almost booked a flight with them a few weeks ago because the price was $119.00 from San Diego,. Glad I didn't.


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## Icarus (Mar 22, 2008)

pcgirl54 said:


> I almost booked a flight with them a few weeks ago because the price was $119.00 from San Diego,. Glad I didn't.



Why? Because they filed chapter 11 again? These days the airlines are in chapter 11 more than they are out of chapter 11.

They are still flying and not likely to stop flying.

-David


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## Elli (Mar 22, 2008)

Icarus said:


> Why? Because they filed chapter 11 again? These days the airlines are in chapter 11 more than they are out of chapter 11.
> 
> They are still flying and not likely to stop flying.
> 
> -David


David, I booked inter island flights with them for Sept.  If they really do go out of business, would another airline honour the tickets?


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## Icarus (Mar 22, 2008)

Elli said:


> David, I booked inter island flights with them for Sept.  If they really do go out of business, would another airline honour the tickets?



First, they aren't likely to go out of business. Chapter 11 is used to protect their assets from creditors and to allow them to re-organize and hopefully emerge from chapter 11 in the future.

Second, if they do, and in the unlikely event that nobody buys their assets and the even more unlikely event that they or other airlines won't honor your tickets, and you paid by credit card, you should be able to get your money back from your credit card company.

Again, all very unlikely at this point. There's no reason not to fly or make reservations for future flights on Aloha Airlines at this point. Just make sure to pay with a credit card.

-David


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## jbercu (Mar 22, 2008)

*Aloha Airline - avoid regardless of bankrutcy*

After my horrible experience with Aloha and just incredible experience with their customer service, I avoided Aloha at any cost for the past three years.

I also heard from other TUG members of bad experiences.

There are many excuses they can use for having to go into bankruptcy.  However, the main reason (IMHO) is bad service, and lack of customer service.  That is why it was so easy for any startup airline to eat their lunch.  Aloha has been flying from Oakland to Hawaii longer than any other airline, yet other airlines consistently chose Aloha's routes from Oakland to compete against,  and know that they can fill up the planes even if they charge higher rates, compared to Aloha that discounts all their seats and still do not fill their plane.
Bottom line is Aloha is a bad airline, and you should not take a chance on them destroying your vacation, especially if you may face cancelations.  Last time Aloha went into bankruptcy they canceled almost 50% of their routes.

Good Luck


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## philemer (Mar 22, 2008)

See this discussion @ flytalk.com http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=803680 Many are unhappy with Aloha but, then, many are unhappy with ALL airlines.


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## Icarus (Mar 22, 2008)

Aloha, Hawaiian and most US airlines scaled back most of their routes after 9/11 when the public, for the most part, stopped traveling. Is that what you are referring to? Other than that, Aloha has not scaled back their schedules.

That situation doesn't exist today, but several large airlines have announced that they intend to cut their domestic flights by around 5% because of the price of fuel.

About Go!, which I assume is the startup you mentioned. Go! is owned by Mesa.  I believe their recent loss was announced at $20,000,000.00

Of course, since you posted this on the internet, it must be completely true, right?

-David


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## philemer (Mar 22, 2008)

If Aloha goes bye bye UA fans will have only Island Air to use for their award flights.  http://www.united.com/page/article/0,6722,51922,00.html#jump4


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## DeniseM (Mar 22, 2008)

Hi David - who do you prefer between Aloha and Hawaiian?  We always fly Hawaiian and so far have had great service.  Does Aloha have the same nice  ambiance that HA does?  Our HA flights always make me feel like I'm already there!

Thanks!


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## jmatias (Mar 23, 2008)

We used to fly Aloha all the time between the islands but for business reasons about 1 year ago we switched to Hawaiian.  

For us, there is no difference between the service.

The main reason for the switch was that Hawaiian has more routes that we personally book such as the HNL-LAS flights and HNL-PHX.

But seeing the news about Aloha makes me glad we switched and now have bulk of our miles with Hawaiian.

Jen


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## Kona Lovers (Mar 23, 2008)

We've tried both Hawaiian and Aloha, and Hawaiian has had by far the better customer service.  Last year we used Island Air, and that was indeed an adventure in itself.

Marty


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## tompalm (Mar 23, 2008)

Wow, there is some entertainment on this thread.  

Let us start with the facts; fuel cost went from $50 a barrel to over $100 and that cost Aloha over $71 million more in operating cost last year.  It also cost the other airlines more money.  GO, or Mesa was worth $300 million two years ago and today they are worth around $90 million.  If Mesa has to pay Hawaiian the $80 million that the judge told them to, they will be in Chapter 11.  Also, the prior owners of Aloha still plan to take Mesa to court in October 2008.  Even if Aloha shuts down, there will still be a law suit; that is, if there is any possibility of getting money from it.  Bottom line is that Mesa selling tickets at $19, $29 and anything less than $50 caused them to lose money and when Aloha and Hawaiian matched those prices, they lost money too.  By the way, Hawaiian also lost big money this year, but their business plan of having 80% ETOPS long range fights and 20% inter-island saved them from major problems.  Aloha has 50% ETOPS and 50% inter-island.

The other airline that jbercu talked about out of Oakland is ATA.  They are shutting down operations at different airports and may not be around much longer.  The reason their flights are full is that they have always been the low cost leader.  But, the low cost did not generate profit and they can't continue.  Also, I fly the Oakland trips a lot and they are almost always full on Aloha, so his point is worthless.  

Ok, I am a pilot for Aloha and trying to be nice about what I am reading above.  However, if Aloha shuts down, the price of inter-island flights will go sky high.  Another airline (Hawaiian or Mesa or maybe United) will bring in extra service, but don't expect ticket prices to be cheap.  

If you already have your timeshare vacation plans for two islands this summer and need tickets for inter-island, Aloha should either have a new investor on April 1, 2008, or they might shut down.  There might be a big sale on April 2nd from the new owners of Aloha, or if Aloha shuts down, there might be a shortage of seats to fly inter-island this summer.  For all the people that already bought tickets on Aloha for this summer, there is a fund set up to pay Hawaiian or another airline to carry those passengers. However, I don’t know if the seats will be available for everyone that needs them.

Good luck to us all, even the bad airlines.


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## Icarus (Mar 23, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> Hi David - who do you prefer between Aloha and Hawaiian?



I've always flown Aloha Airlines, but Hawaiian has better/newer planes these days. It's been a while since I've taken an interisland flight. I don't know how true it is anymore, but Aloha was always viewed as the locally owned company.

Tom: I didn't know you were a pilot. I hope they survive and come out stronger this time. I think they really need new planes. It looks like they are trying to sell off the airline though.

One thing that's always perplexed me about the fare war with Go! They didn't have that many planes or seats, so I never really understood why HA and AQ matched those fares to the extent that they did. If they were smart, they should have simply not matched them at the ridiculously low price points or just offered a few seats at the ridiculously low fares. $49/$59 per leg, sure, and they should be able to make money on that fare, but not lower than that.

-David


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## pcgirl54 (Mar 23, 2008)

Icarus
We are from the East coast traveling to Hawaii for the first time as a celebration for the end of paying college tuition as our youngest just graduated. 

   I don't want to have to add to my regular stressload by wondering whether an airline will be in business or if we will have ticket issues for a trip of this magnitude. We chose United which owns 60% or more of the marketshare and Aloha and Hawaiian do not fly from the east coast thus we would have to involve other flight options.

I know airlines enter Chap 11 all the time but peace of mind is more important to me so that is why I am glad we are flying with another carrier as Hawaii newbies.

Good luck to you Tom and all the Aloha employees. This is not an easy time for them.


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## tdkk4sev (Mar 23, 2008)

I Have tickets for July 2008, should I attempt to cancel. Does Travel Insurance cover Airlines going out of Business. From what I have read so far it does not look very good. Thank you


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## tompalm (Mar 23, 2008)

Thanks guys and gals for the kind words and wishing Aloha well.   

Years ago, Aloha and Hawaiian tried to ignore another airline when they started service and cut fares.  Both companies lost market share and lost money.  Mesa was hoping to take away the market share, increase service and bring in more planes.  However, their fights ran about 75% full and some months were better than others, but they never increased their service. GO probably would not have continued much longer in Hawaii.  Especially if they don't win their appeal with Hawaiian and have to face Aloha in court later in 2008, they would not have been able to stick around.  Now, it is hard to say which company will be here at the end of the year.  Even the Super Ferry is having a very difficult time doing business here.

If you have tickets on Aloha for this summer, I don't think you can cancel unless you bought the higher fare that allows you to do that.  I think that Hawaiian will take those tickets and get you to the other island.  However, it might not be the time you wanted to go, but you should be ok.


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## tdkk4sev (Mar 23, 2008)

From what I have read in the news it sounds like the Government is going to really try and keep Aloha in Business. They have been around for 60 years and do 85% of the inter island cargo.


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## mepiccolo (Mar 23, 2008)

According to their web site press release (3-21), the bankruptcy court has granted them permission to carry on all buisness operation as usual


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## Elli (Mar 23, 2008)

Icarus said:


> First, they aren't likely to go out of business. Chapter 11 is used to protect their assets from creditors and to allow them to re-organize and hopefully emerge from chapter 11 in the future.
> 
> Second, if they do, and in the unlikely event that nobody buys their assets and the even more unlikely event that they or other airlines won't honor your tickets, and you paid by credit card, you should be able to get your money back from your credit card company.
> 
> Again, all very unlikely at this point. There's no reason not to fly or make reservations for future flights on Aloha Airlines at this point. Just make sure to pay with a credit card. -David


Thanks, David, yes, I did pay by credit card.  They had a seat sale on, and I got a really good fare.  We'll hope for the best.


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## mepiccolo (Mar 23, 2008)

We always fly Aloha from OC to Hawaii and have had nothing but the best customer service from Aloha Airlines.  The one time we flew Hawaiian Airlines we actually commented to ourselves how it wasn't as friendly as the Aloha staff was.  Once my (then) 2 yr old threw up all over my husband mid-flight and an agent gave him a really nice t-shirt to wear and keep and he wouldn't take $ for it.  The absolute worst service I have had on flight has been on US Air from LA to Philadelphia.  Talk about cranky, non-friendly, not helpful and downright mean flight attendants!  Ok obviously I don't mean all of them are that way but 2 years later I can still picture the 2 flight attendants from hell and I can't think of any employees anywhere that deserved to be fired more than these 2 "ladies" (and I use the term loosely here...there's a better name for them and it starts with a "B").  But back to my complements to Aloha - we love flying Aloha and we hope everything works out for that airline.  It is our favorite airline, and not just cuz it takes us to Hawaii!


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## Phill12 (Mar 24, 2008)

*May 23,trip to Maui*

After reading this topic of which I have not heard about on the news I did some calls.

 I called II travel and they looked into it and told me not worry about our plans because we would get switched to another airlines if needed.

 I called and talk to a very nice lady with Aloha airlines and she felt I did not need to worry because they were staying open and even if something did happen they would have to get us on another flight.

 She said that the State of Hawaii was working with them because they do not want them to go under because Aloha does much of the local flights there also.

 The only question I worried about was it is nice that they will book us on another airline but what happens if all those flights are full.

 I know we booked couple months ago and our flight went up in price since then and is full or close to it. I would think most airlines are also booked out or close!

 Some people have knocked Aloha but we have flown twice with them over the years and the employee's are the nicest people and do try and take care of the passagers!


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## rickandcindy23 (Mar 24, 2008)

We are flying Aloha April 4th from Kauai to Maui and hope they don't go under.  Aloha lives up to their name!  We have had excellent service from Aloha in the past.  Plus, I would rather never go on a small plane again, if I can help it.  We need Aloha to stay.  

Island Air doesn't allow us more than 50 pounds per person in luggage, which is very difficult to accomplish.  They won't even let you roll your carryon aboard, as there is no room in the overheads, they force you to check it.  With the electronics and snorkel gear, we cannot meet their guidelines for checking our luggage, so I won't fly Island Air ever again.  

Go was better about luggage, but why choose Go when Hawaiian and Aloha have bigger planes, less restrictions and cheerful service?


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## nygiants11991 (Mar 24, 2008)

We are going to Hawaii in Jan 09.  I have been researching flights and found Aloha is the only airline that flies direct from Sacramento to Maui.  If we fly on Hawaiian we would have a layover.  We don't like layovers.....

So now I am wondering if I should hold off on making my reservations, hmmm...


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## Phill12 (Mar 24, 2008)

nygiants11991 said:


> We are going to Hawaii in Jan 09.  I have been researching flights and found Aloha is the only airline that flies direct from Sacramento to Maui.  If we fly on Hawaiian we would have a layover.  We don't like layovers.....
> 
> So now I am wondering if I should hold off on making my reservations, hmmm...




 We also fly out of Sacramento to Maui non-stop May 23,2008 on Aloha Air hopefully! 

 After years of SFO and Oakland we tried Sac to Colorado Springs and have never gone back to SFO or Oakland Ca.

 Everything at Sacramento is so much easier and faster from parking to security!


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## nygiants11991 (Mar 24, 2008)

I hate to sound dumb, but after reading the thread again, I have a question.  Are we talking about inter island only or mainland to hawaii flights possibly being shut down on Aloha?


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## DeniseM (Mar 25, 2008)

Aloha is in Chapter 11, which is reorganization - they aren't going out of business.


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## Jim Bryan (Mar 25, 2008)

After one night in Maui we are flying on Pacific Wings to B.I. this Thurs. Never flown Pacific Wings before. Our Travel Agent booked it.


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## tompalm (Mar 26, 2008)

Things are looking up at Aloha and it is business as usual.  We got an email today saying:

We would like to clear up a few misunderstandings concerning the bankruptcy process.  One of the most important motions was for the continued use of our cash collateral.  This motion was budgeted and approved for 10 days.  This does not mean that we have to have a new investor within 10 days, it means we can continue to operate status quo without court approval for those 10 days.  The next court date is set for March 31st at 2:00 PM and at that hearing another motion will be placed to continue using cash for an additional period as part of the plan of reorganization.

Also, it was reported that four investors are looking at Aloha.


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## daventrina (Mar 26, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> Hi David - who do you prefer between Aloha and Hawaiian? Thanks!


Aloha used to be, well, Alohaish and then seemed to loose the feeling the last time they went bankrupt . We flew HA the last two trips out of SMF and were very happy. Really like the 767 2x4x2 seating (as long as we manage to get the 2).
Went to look at tickets for July and they were $2700 for 2 RT 
So, were using our SW credits on ATA for $10 for 2 RT + interisland Hilo to Maui.


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## reddiablosv (Mar 26, 2008)

*3/22 return flight home.*

I just wanted to relay a story that happened to me.  And, to all the women reading these posts. Please do not take offense! This is for your information and education only!     My wife, daughter and I were scheduled to fly from Kona to Orange Co. CA via Lihue on Aloha Airlines.  Amazingly we arrived early for checkin.  But, alas, we were told that the flight was overbooked and that no seat could be assigned to my 17 yearold daughter..... But not to worry because we had checked in on time and the airline would arrange that my daughter could fly home with us.....    Well, the airline offered free tickets on a future flight if someone would give up their seat!.... No takers!.. They then upped the ante!   First class! A free flight and the same departure time.  Just a layover in Honolulul.  NO TAKERS!   They then allowed all of us to board.  My daughter stood in the isle without a seat.    Suddenly they called the name of a passenger.  A female name.  They told her to get off the plane,... she had checked in late... even though she had made the plane in plenty of time.   My daughter was given her seat...... The passenger's husband deboarded the plane, following his wife.   He looked very upset.... I wonder about their conversation.       Ben


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## eekrat (Mar 30, 2008)

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080330/ap_on_bi_ge/aloha_bankruptcy

http://www.alohaairlines.com/landing_pages/aloha_oe_news_release.php

Bad news for Hawaii travelers!


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## Ben100014 (Mar 30, 2008)

*Farewell and Mahalo, Aloha Airlines*

As it said in the last post, Aloha is officially bankrupt and out of business. I am sorry for all of the passangers who reserved flights after tomorrow. You can still fly these flights through United Airlines though. My opinion is that Aloha was bound to have done this sometime. I flew on it in 2004 and on Hawaiian just last December, Hawaiian was by far better at customer service.


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## Icarus (Mar 30, 2008)

In case it isn't obvious from eekrat's post, Aloha is ending passenger service on Monday March 31.

They are hoping to re-accomodate people with mainland tickets on United and those with interisland tickets on Hawaiian Airlines.

-David


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## Steamboat Bill (Mar 30, 2008)

Aloha Airlines halting passenger service

By AUDREY McAVOY, Associated Press Writer1 hour, 41 minutes ago

Aloha Airlines said Sunday it will halt all passenger service after Monday, signaling the end of an airline that has served Hawaii for more than 60 years.

Aloha, which filed for bankruptcy for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection on March 21, was a casualty of fierce competition and rising fuel prices. The airline said it will stop taking reservations for flights after Monday.

"We simply ran out of time to find a qualified buyer or secure continued financing for our passenger business," said Aloha President David Banmiller in a statement. "We had no choice but to take this action."

Aloha has suffered since Phoenix-based Mesa Air Group Inc. launched a new interisland carrier called go! airlines in 2006, triggering a local airfare war.

Banmiller didn't mentioned go! by name in his statement, but did blame the company's demise on rival companies.

"Unfortunately, unfair competition has succeeded in driving us out of business," he said.

Rising fuel prices, which have forced other airlines to raise fares and look for ways to cut expenses, also made it difficult for Aloha to operate.

Aloha said tickets for flights after Monday will not be honored. It said it is working to have United Airlines accommodate passengers with tickets for Aloha's mainland to Hawaii flights. It hopes to seat those with interisland tickets on Hawaiian Airlines.

Aloha has canceled Monday flights from Hawaii to the West Coast and between several cities in California and Nevada. It's last day for interisland travel will be Monday.

Aloha advised passengers who don't want to fly another airline and who want a refund to contact their travel agents or credit card companies. Those who paid by cash or check may file a claim in bankruptcy court.

The shutdown will affect about 1,900 employees. The company said air cargo services are to continue.

A Seattle company on Thursday offered to buy Aloha's cargo operations for an undisclosed amount. But Saltchuk Resources Inc. said it wasn't interested in taking over Aloha's passenger business.

Aloha Airlines was founded in 1946.


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## perktd (Mar 30, 2008)

*Aloha is toast*

Aloha Airlines announced today it will fly its last passenger flights to the mainland today and interisland tomorrow.  Hawaiian has information on its website about allowing Aloha passengers to standby for free passage the next three or four days.  If you have any tickets booked on Aloha or code shared on Aloha metal I would immediately move to make alternate arrangements.  The herd will be joining the fray as they hear about this over the next few days.  For a detailed thread discussing this I recommend checking on Flyertalk.  Don


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## Steamboat Bill (Mar 30, 2008)

This is very sad news as we are going to Hawaii in June (via AA...thankfully) but need a Hawaii to Mauio connection.


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## Luanne (Mar 30, 2008)

Steamboat Bill said:


> This is very sad news as we are going to Hawaii in June (via AA...thankfully) but need a Hawaii to Mauio connection.



There are other airlines that fly inter-island. And, where is Mauio?????


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## Courts (Mar 30, 2008)

Luanne said:


> There are other airlines that fly inter-island. And, where is Mauio?????



Is that the Italian Island??  
.


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## Denise L (Mar 30, 2008)

This is very sad, indeed  .  I feel for all the people who will have to rebook, get refunds, go on stand-by, etc.  Plus it sounds as if cash/check folks will have to file in bankruptcy court for their money back?!  Plus all of our flights to Maui will be even more packed and more expensive with one less airline flying there from the Bay Area.


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## mepiccolo (Mar 30, 2008)

I have been on hold for United Airlines for over an hour...

We had Aloha flights in May (3 booked with Aloha miles and 1 purchased) from the mainland and also 4 interisland flights booked through Aloha.

From Aloha's web site it appears that since we have booked flights we can possibly fly United 

BUT

I don't see anything on United Airlines saying they're going to do anything at all for Aloha passengers after April.  Does anyone know?  I'm prepared to book other flights but I don't want to do that if we are going to be helped out by United


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## BevL (Mar 30, 2008)

A word of advice from someone who has gone through this when Canada 3000 folded overnight.  Call your credit card company sooner rather than later.  For us, it was still touch and go getting our money back, and friends of ours who assumed they would be "taken care of" with alternate arrangements never did get their money back.

Not to scare anyone, but just my personal experience.


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## perktd (Mar 30, 2008)

*Merged threads*

Hi Bev  I know the job of moderator is a thankless one, but I don't think these threads should be merged.  None of us get very excited about an airline declaring bankruptcy these days because most of the airlines have been doing this for the last few years and kept flying as usual.  However, Aloha just announced they will not be flying their mainland flights tomorrow and their inter-island flights will cease the next day.  Many people will not even notice this announcment at the bottom of the bankruptcy thread and for those planning to travel Aloha in the next few days they need to know immediately.  Please consider restoring the flight stoppage to its own thread.  Don


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## tompalm (Mar 30, 2008)

Q & A

For Aloha Passengers With Confirmed Reservations For Travel After March 31, 2008 

If I have a confirmed reservation with Aloha for travel after March 31, what do I do? 

Aloha is working with code-share partner United Airlines and other airlines who are prepared to assist you For more information about United’s accommodation options, contact United at 1-800-UNITED1 or go to their website at www.United.com. 

Can I get a refund? 

Contact your travel agent or credit card company to request a refund. 

What if I paid by check or cash can I still get a refund? 

You can file a claim with the Bankruptcy Court. 

Can I continue to use my Aloha AirAwards credit card? 

Yes. Your AirAwards card is still good for all purchases. 

If I have already redeemed AlohaPass Miles for United Airlines travel and it has already been ticketed, is it valid? 

Yes and we recommend you contact United Airlines at 1-800-UNITED1 to reconfirm your reservation. 

Can I continue to redeem AlohaPass miles after March 31, 2008? 

No, after March 31, 2008, the program will expire. 

If I have already redeemed AlohaPass miles for a hotel stay or car rental, etc. is my travel award still valid? 

If you received a confirmation it should be valid. We recommend you contact the hotel or car rental company to confirm your reservation. 

If I booked travel on United Airlines through the Aloha Airlines Web site, will my travel still be honored by United? 

Yes. If you have already been ticketed and we recommend you contact United Airlines at 1-800-UNITED1 to reconfirm your reservation. 

If I booked a ticket on Aloha’s website for a flight operated by United is my ticket still valid? 

Yes. If you have already been ticketed and we recommend you contact United Airlines at 1-800-UNITED1 to reconfirm your reservation. 

Who do I contact if owed a refund or baggage claim settlement with Aloha Airlines? 

You can file your claim with the Bankruptcy Court. 

What happens if I booked future travel on United Airlines using my AlohaPass miles is my reservation still valid? 

Yes. If you have already been ticketed and we recommend you contact United Airlines at 1-800-UNITED1 to reconfirm your reservation.


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## myip (Mar 30, 2008)

I am so SAD.  I just disputed on my credit card.  I hope I get my money back.


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## BevL (Mar 30, 2008)

perktd said:


> Hi Bev  I know the job of moderator is a thankless one, but I don't think these threads should be merged.  None of us get very excited about an airline declaring bankruptcy these days because most of the airlines have been doing this for the last few years and kept flying as usual.  However, Aloha just announced they will not be flying their mainland flights tomorrow and their inter-island flights will cease the next day.  Many people will not even notice this announcment at the bottom of the bankruptcy thread and for those planning to travel Aloha in the next few days they need to know immediately.  Please consider restoring the flight stoppage to its own thread.  Don




Twasn't me who merged the threads, but there is a separate thread in the travel forum.


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## Laurie (Mar 30, 2008)

Darn it, I'm sorry to hear this. We flew Aloha 6 months ago and had an excellent experience, and their stated customer service policies were much better than Hawaiian, if we were to miss our connections from our mainland flights which were on separate tickets. So I'd made a mental note to use them again, next trip - I appreciated their customer-friendly way of doing business, when dealing w/the above scenario.


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## Dave M (Mar 30, 2008)

Nor was it I, but there are now enough links to this thread that anyone who relies on TUG for travel info should be able to find it.


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## mepiccolo (Mar 30, 2008)

Finally hung up on United Airlines after 1 hr 20 minutes.  Then I called BankCard Center (First Hawaiian Bank) to dispute the charges for our May trip which we purchased in August 2007.  Since they only hold records for 6 months they told me I would have to seek the credit directly from Aloha    So for all of you with Aloha credit cards who booked your flights more than 6 months out, this is the wonderful customer service you will get.  That card is being cut up immediately and we are going to pay off the balance less the charges for the flight we obviously never took (services not provided).  So that's my response to them - YOU go talk to Aloha.   It's not my fault First Hawaiian Bank only keeps records for 6 months.  I have the records for the purchase and was more than willing to fax it to them.  So when that balance goes unpaid and they try to affect our credit I can dispute it then to show it was services never provided.  Come on First Hawaiian Bank...step it up.  First Hawaiian Bank obviously is more connected to Aloha Airlines than a general consumer like me-get the damn record from them yourself.


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## voyager1 (Mar 30, 2008)

What an awful situation for everyone.  In addition to the financial loss to everyone holding reservations and the destruction of your holiday plans there is other collateral damage.  Tompalm was very thoughtful in taking the time to post the information from Aloha, especially considering that as a pilot on Aloha he is now out of a job.  Good luck to all of you!


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## Phill12 (Mar 31, 2008)

After reading all these new post tonight I called airlines and no answering of phones!

 I called United Airlines number and they did have a reservation from Aloha for us which was great. It wasn't non-stop and it was almost $400 more per person but we were ready when she said we need to pay the whole $2700 and I asked about the money from Aloha.

 She checked and found Aloha sent our reservations but no money so we need to pay again and go after Aloha for our money.

 We have twenty four hours to except our United flight but not going to happen most likely! 

 When I called Wells Fargo Visa acct the lady said right away your calling about Aloha Air. Turns out I was one of about 30 to call in last couple hours.

 She was very nice and took all the information and said they will have to see what happens and will send me papers to sign in about three weeks.

 If we get our money it would take a month or more so I guess I need to cancel Car/Luau/dinner cruise for May 23.

 This was a graduation and 21 birthday present for our daughter so I will have to tell her its off too!

 I guess I call II or the resort to let them know we won't be coming too!

 What really ticks me off is I talk to Aloha this week and was promised there would be no problem and if something happened I would be told my new reservations and airline and none of this was true!:annoyed:


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## GaryDouglas (Mar 31, 2008)

I had to scurry to change my flights from Aloha to UAL for our May flights. Technically, I made reservations on UAL and have to get my MR Visa account credited for my Aloha flights. I am within the 90 day limit on the purchase, so the Visa representive made it sound like it won't be a problem. We'll see. I'll finalize that tomorrow with Aloha or Visa or both. Also have to finalize the UAL flight. It's on hold until tomorrow midnight. I got the flights for $30 less than my original change from Aloha (which was already economical), so I'm money ahead. Wasn't expecting that. The UAL person said that they may not know for a couple days exactly how UAL will handle this situation. In the meantime, since I had an easy way out, I took it. 

My greater concern is for the Aloha personnel. Beside losing their jobs, I assume this blows away their retirement plan, in one way or another. Hopefully it's not as bad as all that.


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## LisaH (Mar 31, 2008)

voyager1 said:


> Tompalm was very thoughtful in taking the time to post the information from Aloha, especially considering that as a pilot on Aloha he is now out of a job.  Good luck to all of you!



Ditto! I'm so sorry to see Aloha go out of business. I always had great flights with Aloha, as late as a month ago. Sorry to see so many people losing their job especially in today's economic climate. It also teaches me a lesson not to accumulate too many points with any airline or hotel chain.


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## glenn1000 (Mar 31, 2008)

Worst case scenario- we are on Maui now and got our tickets through Cheap Tickets (and they weren't even cheap) that departed on ATA and was supposed to return on Aloha this Saturday. After nearly two hours on the phone with different people I understand that with Aloha up in smoke, ATA holds our return ticket responsibility. The first flight they have availability is eight days later then our original return. They suggested calling back in the morning. That's reassuring... :annoyed: 

We could have originally booked an ATA return for less $ but we have had good Aloha experiences in the past so went with them. That was a big mistake!


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## Phill12 (Mar 31, 2008)

GaryDouglas said:


> I had to scurry to change my flights from Aloha to UAL for our May flights. Technically, I made reservations on UAL and have to get my MR Visa account credited for my Aloha flights. I am within the 90 day limit on the purchase, so the Visa representive made it sound like it won't be a problem. We'll see. I'll finalize that tomorrow with Aloha or Visa or both. Also have to finalize the UAL flight. It's on hold until tomorrow midnight. I got the flights for $30 less than my original change from Aloha (which was already economical), so I'm money ahead. Wasn't expecting that. The UAL person said that they may not know for a couple days exactly how UAL will handle this situation. In the meantime, since I had an easy way out, I took it.
> 
> My greater concern is for the Aloha personnel. Beside losing their jobs, I assume this blows away their retirement plan, in one way or another. Hopefully it's not as bad as all that.




 You are lucky,United is taking advantage of this problem now and trying to charge us more than $1200 more than Aloha tickets cost us for non-stop flight. They told us last night we have reservations for 24 hours but need to pay them and worry about Aloha money later and deal with Aloha on that.

 Meaning is you pay us hostage fee and then get stiffed by Aloha.

 There is no way we are paying out more than $4600 to fly to Hawaii.

 After telling my wife today about all this she said this was our last trip to Hawaii. Not worth the money any more.

 Going to call the II Travel now but expect to blown off by them.

 I guess I will start calling and canceling our plans on Maui too!:annoyed:


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## Kauai Kid (Mar 31, 2008)

Thanks to Mesa and GO's $1 interisland flights there is no Aloha passenger service after 3/31/08 and 1900 people will loose their jobs in addition to countless people having problems with tickets and refunds!

Fly Hawaiian interisland.

Sterling


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## Phill12 (Mar 31, 2008)

Has anyone been able to get through and talk to Aloha Air. I have tried for last seven hours and its just busy so either everyone is calling or phones off the hook!

 I called II travel and was told I have to call Aloha. I asked about all their promises in case of problems with this airline when they booked us on it and was told I'm on my own if I can not reach Aloha.

 Says alot for the (II) Travel dept!


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## bevans (Mar 31, 2008)

My wife and I were scheduled to fly Oakland to Kona on May11, and Kona to Maui May17, both flights on Aloha. As soon as I heard of the cessation of service on Sunday night I booked with Hawaiian out of San Jose to Kona and Hawaiiian to Maui. I will be paying twice as much for the mainland to Hawaii flight and having to stop in Honolulu and change planes. I do not think any body should wait to see if they will get special tretment from United or Hawaiian because of the bankruptcy, get your flight now! I charged my tickets with Amex and put the charges in dispute this morning and received a suspension of charges as they "investigate". Does this mean I will get a permanent credit or be charged back at a later time? Has anybody gone down this road with their credit card company dealing with services lost because of bankrutcy? 

I will surely miss the direct flights Aloha had to Hawaii and having owned a business for 25 years realize the pain caused to employees with a business failure. A job loss this size will surely be felt on the islands. I enjoyed flying Aloha and had nothing but good treatment from them and their employees. 

Curt


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## Lawlar (Mar 31, 2008)

*Flying*

Remember when flying was a wonderful experience???  

The airplanes we have been flying on to Hawaii the last few years have had no leg room (they even removed a bathroom and standing area to put in more seats).  The airlines have stopped offering food service (food use to be good on airlines).  And the service is awful.  

So how come the airlines can't make money when they are flying these planes with their passengers cramed into tiny spaces and they provide no conveniences????

If airfares go up, and the service remains awful, then owning a timeshare in Hawaii isn't going to be such a great thing.


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## Denise L (Mar 31, 2008)

glenn1000 said:


> Worst case scenario- we are on Maui now and got our tickets through Cheap Tickets (and they weren't even cheap) that departed on ATA and was supposed to return on Aloha this Saturday. After nearly two hours on the phone with different people I understand that with Aloha up in smoke, ATA holds our return ticket responsibility. The first flight they have availability is eight days later then our original return. They suggested calling back in the morning. That's reassuring... :annoyed:
> 
> We could have originally booked an ATA return for less $ but we have had good Aloha experiences in the past so went with them. That was a big mistake!



Glenn, any luck today?  I suppose worst case, you book an extra week on Maui and the kids have a good excuse to miss school?  Sorry to hear about all the trouble, what a mess for all of you traveling   .  At least it's warm there.  Maybe you could visit another island at the end of the week and get another flight out earlier?  Not sure what I would have done if something like that happened to me last week.  I hope it works out.


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## tmartin1 (Mar 31, 2008)

*What to do?*

Hmmm, I'm not quite sure what to do yet.

We are going to Hawaii June 14 - June 28. Fortunately, the only flight we're taking through Aloha is the return flight (from LIH to SAN). So, at least I know we're getting to Hawaii. I figure the worst case scenario is that we're stuck on Kauai a few extra days or have to leave a day or two early.

I bought our tickets at the end of February, so it doesn't look like I'll have a problem disputing the charges (I think).

So, do I jump in and dispute the charges immediately and book on Hawaiian (at an extra cost) to get home or do I wait a little while and see how this all flushes out? Since I only have to worry about getting home, my stress level about this whole situation isn't too bad, compared to if I was worrying how I was going to get to Hawaii. 

I'd hate to book another flight on Hawaiian at a fairly significant extra cost and then we get a news report in the next few days that Aloha had some funding or buyer for the airlines and flights will resume. Since our trip is 3 months away, anything can happen. 

I'll still sleep at night waiting to see what happens because staying in Hawaii for an extra few days or so is hardly the worst thing that can happen!

Theresa


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## ricoba (Mar 31, 2008)

So much for the idea that airlines will continue to fly while they are in Chapter 11.... 

As the news person said this morning "Aloha to Aloha"....

I hope this works out OK for all you folks that have Aloha tickets.  

Hopefully Hawaiian or another airline picks up the slack for you..


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## thinze3 (Mar 31, 2008)

*Marriott Gives Helping Hand to Aloha Ticket Holders*

http://kgmb9.com/main/content/view/5175/196/


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## glenn1000 (Mar 31, 2008)

Denise L said:


> Glenn, any luck today?  I suppose worst case, you book an extra week on Maui and the kids have a good excuse to miss school?  Sorry to hear about all the trouble, what a mess for all of you traveling   .  At least it's warm there.  Maybe you could visit another island at the end of the week and get another flight out earlier?  Not sure what I would have done if something like that happened to me last week.  I hope it works out.



Today ATA told me that I need to call back tomorrow. That's what they said yesterday. At least they sound like they accept responsibility but I don't understand how they are going to all these extra people off the island on time. I have to work on Sunday, my wife on Monday and the kids are in high school- definitely not a time when we can take another week of vacation.

I'm going to put my head in the sand for now. We're doing the drive to Hana today. Last time we did it was 19 years ago when we swore we'd never do it again. Could be an interesting day overall- long drive with three kids in the back who don't want to go, parents stressed about lack of transportation home..


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## Phill12 (Mar 31, 2008)

glenn1000 said:


> Today ATA told me that I need to call back tomorrow. That's what they said yesterday. At least they sound like they accept responsibility but I don't understand how they are going to all these extra people off the island on time. I have to work on Sunday, my wife on Monday and the kids are in high school- definitely not a time when we can take another week of vacation.
> 
> I'm going to put my head in the sand for now. We're doing the drive to Hana today. Last time we did it was 19 years ago when we swore we'd never do it again. Could be an interesting day overall- long drive with three kids in the back who don't want to go, parents stressed about lack of transportation home..





 After dealing with all this since 5 am today I was about to give up and cancel trip! I called United back again today and talk to a agent and he went over everything with me.

 Our price had jumped to $843 per ticket   During the time we were speaking  he said the prices just went up again so United is taking advantage of this because many people with Aloha tickets were transfered to United. 

 I understand prices go up and down by the hour but in this case it wasn't going up as much on all the travel listings but just more for Aloha transfers. When I called Expedia they priced the same flight and price was no where near what they wanted to charge me so it was just for us transfers.

 I went back to Expedia that we have used for years and the lady priced Oakland and Sacramento. She booked us out of Oakland May 23 on ATA with one stop in Honolulu and second flight to Maui.

 Return is on ATA again and a non-stop and total cost for our three tickets was about $1650.00 total and this was about $1100 less than United was trying to get out of us and flight times cut in half.

 Now I just hope I get my Aloha money back and these airlines don't fold!


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## tmartin1 (Mar 31, 2008)

Well, I started stressing out after all, so decided to look into other options.

Right now, I'm on hold with my Credit card company, so hopefully, I'm not out $1700 (4 one-way tickets from LIH to SAN).

I went ahead and booked tickets on US Airways (not my first choice, but I can't be picky) from Maui to San Diego on Tuesday (so we're staying 3 extra days). Saturday flights were insane, so by staying 3 extra days, we're saving major bucks. I think I'll try to get an interisland flight from LIH to OGG on Saturday, then rent a place in Maui for 3 nights. 

I guess I'm taking a few extra days off from work and my daughter will miss the first few days of summer cheer practice. Oh well - at least I still have a job. I feel bad for the employees who are suddenly out of work.

Theresa


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## Icarus (Mar 31, 2008)

SOFTBALLDAD3 said:


> After all this they said no and well speaking to me in said the prices just went up again so United is taking advantage of this because many people with Aloha tickets were transfered to United.



United isn't honoring Aloha tickets for standby or other travel?

ok, I just checked United's web site. I guess not.

http://www.united.com/page/article/0,6722,52609,00.html

Like most airlines, United has a complex pricing engine that prices tickets based on demand. If they sell the cheaper seats before you purchase yours, they can run out of available seats at the cheaper price.

Ticket prices can and do change by the minute with any airline.

-David


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## mepiccolo (Mar 31, 2008)

We ended up finding that the cheapest flight we could take was through Alaska Airlines from LAX to Maui non-stop, with a return flight from Lihue, Kauai ($448.94 per ticket including taxes).  We added one night at the front of our trip to fly out on Friday instead of Saturday which saved us $1,000 from what we had been looking at to pay for four tickets.  We booked one night stay at the Blue Tile House in Paia for $189 and I'm actually looking forward to that-it looks lovely.  We booked interisland flights on Island Air for $79 (including taxes) per person which was actually a dollar less than we had paid for Aloha tickets.  While it looks like it will probably be a cold day in hell before we get the one ticket we purchased from Aloha last August for our May 08 trip, at least our other 3 tickets were purchased using frequent flier miles, so it could be worse.  My boss flew home from Maui yesterday to Orange County and wasn't even aware about Aloha going out of business until his family landed and there were tv reporters talking to the passengers as they came off the flight, asking them how it felt to be the last flight to the mainland on Aloha.  Gosh, one more day and he and his family would have been stuck.  I'm so sorry for all of you who are in this predicament.  I'm also very sorry for all the Aloha employees who lost their jobs-we loved flying Aloha Airlines and really hate to see it go like this.  I hope Go/Mesa gets theirs for causing this hardship on the State of Hawaii and the thousands of vacationers it affects.  :annoyed:


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## tompalm (Apr 1, 2008)

In an earlier post, I said good luck to all of us.  Good luck didn’t happen.  My primary concern was for the passengers that needed to travel interisland or to the mainland in the next couple weeks.  I knew that they could be stuck.  The news tonight displayed lots of folks stranded and no seats available on other airlines.  It was an incredibility sad day for a lot of people in Hawaii.  Half of the employees at Aloha Airlines had worked there more than 20 years and their coworkers had become family.  It was a great place to work and everyone loved coming to work and seeing each other.  In the end, it was the fare war by GO, the rising fuel prices and the older interisland planes that use a lot of gas that did us in.  In 2006, there were plans to get new planes, but when the fare wars happened, too much money was being lost and the new planes never happened. 

This time Chapter 11 was different.  The current owners had been trying to reorganize for the last two years.  During the first week of March 2008, management told a group of pilots in ground school that the company was getting new planes, expanding with another company and that there would be something in the paper within two weeks.   However, around March 15th, the other company backed out of the deal and the present owners gave up.  When Aloha filed Chapter 11, there were four companies looking to invest.  Everyone thought that one of the companies would show up on March 31st at the court hearing and we would continue ops until things were reorganized.  However, it came as a big surprise to everyone when Aloha announced on March 30th that they were shutting down. 

The news tonight reported that Aloha reservations received 8000 calls, or more than twice the average of 4000 per day.  A lot of employees came in on their off day to help out, but that didn’t solve all the problems.   I am disappointed that United Airlines (Aloha’s code share business partner) didn’t do more, or pick up the Aloha Air miles.  Those miles had always been transferable before.   I had over 100,000 miles and it looks like they are gone.  I feel the pain for everyone that had those miles.

I am selling my house that we bought three years ago, downsizing and moving on.  However, I am probably better off than 90% of the people that I work with.  It is a very painful day for a lot of people.   I hope that everyone is able to get their money back from their credit card companies and that they are able to complete their vacation plans this year.

My sister was supposed to visit this June, and she wanted to fly from Honolulu to the big island.  I told her to put her plans on hold another year and not to come out this year.  Everyone will need to reconsider their options.   I recommend avoid flying interisland until after summer 2008.  It will be very difficult for Hawaiian and GO to pick up the extra passengers in the near future.  The news reported that Aloha flies 8000 passengers on a daily basis and that Hawaiian and GO will increase service for an additional 6000 seats.  So, what are the other 2000 people suppose to do???  Maybe United will come in with a couple flights to help out.  In any event, all flights will be very full.  Don’t miss your connection, or you could have major problems.  If you are angry, please be angry at GO or Mesa, they caused this mess.  They still owe Hawaiian $80 million and have to face Aloha in court during October 2008.  They are in serious trouble. 

I think that I can speak for all the employees at Aloha when I say “Thank you to everyone for flying Aloha over the years”.  It was the best eight years of my life.  To all our friends, I hope that our paths will cross again. 

Aloha, Tom Palmer, Captain Aloha Airlines


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## tompalm (Apr 1, 2008)

I just remembered that the Super Ferry is starting service again on April 23rd.  However, I would only use them as a last resort.  They have been having a lot of problems.


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## GrammyR (Apr 1, 2008)

*Interisland flights*

I called my credit card company as soon as I learned about the fiasco.  They said that it would be no problem getting a refund.  I then went online and booked a flight from Honolulu to Kona and back through Hawaiian Airlines.  That took forever because the computer kept kicking it off.  I finally got a confirmation though.  The price was the same as it was a few weeks ago when I book through Aloha.  I unfortunately chose Aloha because the times were better for our schedule.  I did have to pay about $40 more for the same trip, but at this point, that doesn't seem too bad considering what others are finding out.


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## Cathyb (Apr 1, 2008)

softball -- sorry and thank you for alerting us about II Travel and promises made by them


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## Cathyb (Apr 1, 2008)

bevans:  We too did exactly what you did:  Scheduled our Aloha cancelled flights with Hawaiian Air and called American Express and was told exactly what you were told.  I hope someone responds to your question about Amex and their method of handling something like this.


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## Dave M (Apr 1, 2008)

At a minimum, you can get a refund/credit _if_ the charge for your tickets appears on a credit card statement mailed to you within the past 60 days. Otherwise, legally, you might well be out of luck, unless your credit card company has a specific provision designed to protect you. However, most credit card companies have a more generous (unpublished) refund policy than the law and federal regulations require, typically covering charges as old as six months or so.

See this Federal Trade Commission link for the rules as to what to do. Note that unless you send a _written_ dispute letter via _certified mail_, your claim might well be denied.


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## thinze3 (Apr 1, 2008)

Kauai Kid said:


> Thanks to Mesa and GO's $1 interisland flights there is no Aloha passenger service after 3/31/08 and 1900 people will loose their jobs in addition to countless people having problems with tickets and refunds!
> 
> Fly Hawaiian interisland.
> 
> Sterling




Hopefully, the state of Hawaii will help Aloha get back on its feet.

Then Mesa should be taken to court AGAIN, this time by Aloha and the AG of the state of Hawaii. It sure seems like a deliberate plan by Mesa. IMO


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## Phill12 (Apr 1, 2008)

Cathyb said:


> softball -- sorry and thank you for alerting us about II Travel and promises made by them




Cathy, what really gets me is I called last week and talk to II Travel about this and was told if something happens we will get you on another airlines so you don't need to worry about anything.

 I was told II really isn't II travel but a regular travel agancy that also works with II and most II members don't know this.

 Yesterday when I called and talk to a lady she seemed to be handling everything and really being nice. She then transfered me to Human Resources in the Travel dept to finish this up.

 After ten minutes dealing with this women who it was easy to see she couldn't careless I asked why she was asking me all these same questions when other lady told you when she transfered me to you. Answer was she told me nothing but just transfered me.

 I was just passed off to this dept and then found out the human resource was for II and the Travel dept doesn't have one and nothing we can do for you.

 On the local news last night News 10 Sacramento they gave information on getting a refund and first was go back to your travel agency and they can handle this and then call your credit card company.

 When I talk to expedia booking our new flight I asked and they told me they were handling all their cistomers that were booked on Aloha Air.

 Never again will I stray from using Expedia for travel plans.

 Also I will never use II travel for anything!:annoyed:


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## GaryDouglas (Apr 1, 2008)

Thanks, Dave.  I didn't know about the certified mail requirement.  MR Visa stated I have 90 days, which is still more than a week away.   I should have the dispute papers from Visa within the next day.  I've talked to two people at MR Visa and one made it sound like it was a done deal and the other said that the dispute had be be verified and approved before the credit to my account takes affect.  It sounds like I'm safe, kinda...


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## ciscogizmo1 (Apr 1, 2008)

glenn1000 said:


> Today ATA told me that I need to call back tomorrow. That's what they said yesterday. At least they sound like they accept responsibility but I don't understand how they are going to all these extra people off the island on time. I have to work on Sunday, my wife on Monday and the kids are in high school- definitely not a time when we can take another week of vacation.
> 
> I'm going to put my head in the sand for now. We're doing the drive to Hana today. Last time we did it was 19 years ago when we swore we'd never do it again. Could be an interesting day overall- long drive with three kids in the back who don't want to go, parents stressed about lack of transportation home..



I'm so sorry... I hope things work out for you and your family.  Doesn't sound like a fun vacation to have to worry about airlines.  Keep us updated and let us know if we can do anything for you.


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## MikeM132 (Apr 1, 2008)

GaryDouglas said:


> Thanks, Dave.  I didn't know about the certified mail requirement.  MR Visa stated I have 90 days, which is still more than a week away.   I should have the dispute papers from Visa within the next day.  I've talked to two people at MR Visa and one made it sound like it was a done deal and the other said that the dispute had be be verified and approved before the credit to my account takes affect.  It sounds like I'm safe, kinda...



You're in better shape than me, apparently. I charged tickets last July on MR Visa. I called them and they said they put the charges into dispute and are mailing me papers, which should come in about 10 days. Since my charge is 8 months old already, I'm not sure about a refund. They implied it would go through, but that was just the lady on the phone. Well, see you in Maui anyhow. I'll let you know how I made out!
At least I'm lucky enough to have new tickets on Hawaiian for not all that much more money. Some don't appear to be so lucky.


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## MikeM132 (Apr 1, 2008)

Dave M said:


> At a minimum, you can get a refund/credit _if_ the charge for your tickets appears on a credit card statement mailed to you within the past 60 days. Otherwise, legally, you might well be out of luck, unless your credit card company has a specific provision designed to protect you. However, most credit card companies have a more generous (unpublished) refund policy than the law and federal regulations require, typically covering charges as old as six months or so.
> 
> .



any inside info on Marriott Visa's double-secret refund policy?


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## Dave M (Apr 1, 2008)

Sorry. I don't know what Chase's policy is.


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## GaryDouglas (Apr 1, 2008)

*Da Plane, Da Plane*

I was lucky I was browsing TUG when all this hit. When I finalized my UAL tickets, they were actually $60 less than my original Aloha tickets. If I don't get my Aloha tickets credited, I'll feel like I'm going first class, only I'll be in the back of the plane...


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## Cathyb (Apr 1, 2008)

DaveM:  "Send certified letter.."  Even if on the phone with Amex agent that takes all the information and tells you they will review and let us know in about 4 weeks?


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## Phill12 (Apr 1, 2008)

MikeM132 said:


> You're in better shape than me, apparently. I charged tickets last July on MR Visa. I called them and they said they put the charges into dispute and are mailing me papers, which should come in about 10 days. Since my charge is 8 months old already, I'm not sure about a refund. They implied it would go through, but that was just the lady on the phone. Well, see you in Maui anyhow. I'll let you know how I made out!
> At least I'm lucky enough to have new tickets on Hawaiian for not all that much more money. Some don't appear to be so lucky.




 What I don't understand is the fact just because some people used their heads and booked air early and got great pricing are the credit card companies now able to put a time limit on this!

 It seems to me that travelers paid for tickets with their credit cards for safety for a service that has not been fulfilled yet so time should have nothing to do  with it.

 Next is the fact the credit card company isn't giving us the money but making the Aloha Air return the money to your credit card acct.

 This just seems like a way for some of these companies get out of fighting this for their customers.

 Our charge was on Nov 29,2007 for a May 23,2008 flight and I called the credit card company(WELLS FARGO) on March 30,2008 and nothing was said about a time limit.

 Travelers are being taken from the Airline and don't need to be also taken by their credit card company too! 


 PHIL


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## Steamboat Bill (Apr 1, 2008)

For anyone interested in flying between the Big Island (KOA) and Maui (OGG), the only direct JET service is Hawaiian Air, everyone else is a small prop plane.

We just booked a June trip (AA from the mainland and HA between islands). I almost pulled the trigger on Aloha, but I did not like the schedule.


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## mepiccolo (Apr 1, 2008)

Yikes - the plan tickets we bought on Sunday for $448 (with taxes) is now going for over $1,300 (with taxes) for the exact same flight!!  Thank God we rebooked our flights right away on Sunday.  I know our initial reaction was to wait and see if United helped us out (which Aloha's web site made it seem like).  But by looking at United's web site it was clear that they were not offering any provisions for Aloha customers after 30 days (we travel in May) so we just bought new tickets on our own, at not to bad of a price (about the price for Aloha tickets when they used to go on sale).  So sad.  I miss Aloha Airlines already.


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## GaryDouglas (Apr 1, 2008)

Next time I'll look into travel insurance and see what it covers and what it costs...


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## glenn1000 (Apr 1, 2008)

ciscogizmo1 said:


> I'm so sorry... I hope things work out for you and your family.  Doesn't sound like a fun vacation to have to worry about airlines.  Keep us updated and let us know if we can do anything for you.



This morning ATA said they were having a meeting to figure out what they are going to do about passengers ticketed on ATA with an Aloha return (like us) who are trapped since there are no open ATA flights and that we could call back later today. 3.5 hours on hold with ATA this afternoon- never got through to an agent...

So Sunday was call back on Monday, Monday was call back on Tuesday and today there is no way to get through.

Will try not to think about it too much as we head to the Old Lahaina Luau. Weather is great and the snorkeling is he best we've had.


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## Dave M (Apr 1, 2008)

Cathyb said:


> DaveM:  "Send certified letter.."  Even if on the phone with Amex agent that takes all the information and tells you they will review and let us know in about 4 weeks?


You should follow the instructions at the link - to protect your claim.


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## tmartin1 (Apr 2, 2008)

mepiccolo said:


> Yikes - the plan tickets we bought on Sunday for $448 (with taxes) is now going for over $1,300 (with taxes) for the exact same flight!!  Thank God we rebooked our flights right away on Sunday.  I know our initial reaction was to wait and see if United helped us out (which Aloha's web site made it seem like).  But by looking at United's web site it was clear that they were not offering any provisions for Aloha customers after 30 days (we travel in May) so we just bought new tickets on our own, at not to bad of a price (about the price for Aloha tickets when they used to go on sale).  So sad.  I miss Aloha Airlines already.



Yikes is right! That's crazy. We had to get creative and I think we made out in the end. If we were to leave the same day (Sat), I would have had to pay an additional $200 per ticket, which came out to $800. So, by waiting until Tuesday, I found tickets that were $100 cheaper (each) than our original tickets, so we're flying from Kauai to Maui on Saturday, staying 3 nights, then going home. I figured in the extra cost of a condo in Maui and rental car and figured it'll cost about $1200. Factor in my $400 airline savings and I'm right at $800 - the same amount I would have paid to come home on my original date. I'd much rather spend $800 enjoying Maui then sitting on an airplane.

Theresa

Theresa


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## ciscogizmo1 (Apr 2, 2008)

GaryDouglas said:


> Next time I'll look into travel insurance and see what it covers and what it costs...



I've bought trip insurance before for cruises and unfortunately, they don't cover airlines in Bankrupcty which is the majority of them.  The only thing I could find that trip insurance would cover in regards to air travel is cancelled flights due to other reasons besides shutting down like weather, loss luggage, etc...   Basically, you can get coverage every thing but if the airlines shut their doors.

A good website to compare trip insurance costs and coverage is here:

www.insuremytrip.com


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## glenn1000 (Apr 2, 2008)

*Could it be much worse- stuck on Maui and forced to pay a fortune for a lousy flight*

Follow up: our travel agent (Cheap Tickets) never called back despite multiple promises to help get us home. On Sunday ATA asked us to call back Monday, then Tuesday. ATA agreed that they had to accommodate us to get us home since we were ticketed on ATA on the outbound flight. Apparently they made a corporate decision on Tuesday that ATA would ticket all people in our situation but that we would have to pay the full fare minus a refund for part of our Aloha fare. So by Tuesday every decent itinerary was gone and we paid $3651 for five one way tickets to Oakland through Los Angeles (with a long layover starting at 2AM Maui time) on an overnight flight. We have to get home so no alternatives at this point.

I will follow up as I have documented this nightmare pretty well. I've logged 12 hours of phone time, mostly on hold. Anyway, now we can relax but I wish we were told earlier that they (ATA and Cheap Tickets) did not intend to cover our return trip rather than assuring us that we would be accommodated.


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## Denise L (Apr 3, 2008)

glenn1000 said:


> Follow up: our travel agent (Cheap Tickets) never called back despite multiple promises to help get us home. On Sunday ATA asked us to call back Monday, then Tuesday. ATA agreed that they had to accommodate us to get us home since we were ticketed on ATA on the outbound flight. Apparently they made a corporate decision on Tuesday that ATA would ticket all people in our situation but that we would have to pay the full fare minus a refund for part of our Aloha fare. So by Tuesday every decent itinerary was gone and we paid $3651 for five one way tickets to Oakland through Los Angeles (with a long layover starting at 2AM Maui time) on an overnight flight. We have to get home so no alternatives at this point.
> 
> I will follow up as I have documented this nightmare pretty well. I've logged 12 hours of phone time, mostly on hold. Anyway, now we can relax but I wish we were told earlier that they (ATA and Cheap Tickets) did not intend to cover our return trip rather than assuring us that we would be accommodated.



Glenn, what a nightmare for you and your family! I'm just shocked that you have to dish out full fare for one way tickets  !  I know that you have to get back to work and the kids have to get back to school, but what a huge price to pay.   I can't believe that they aren't honoring your tickets that you already paid for well in advance.  I hope that you can get something worked out when you get home.

Well, like you said, you can at least relax now and know that you will be home in time for all of your commitments.  Enjoy the rest of your week and the great snorkeling.  I'll be interested to hear how the Luau was, since i hope to get my kids to a luau one of these years  .  Trouble is, they wouldn't eat any of the food, and my DH probably wouldn't either!


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## GaryDouglas (Apr 3, 2008)

ciscogizmo1 said:


> I've bought trip insurance before for cruises and unfortunately, they don't cover airlines in Bankrupcty which is the majority of them.


 
I just looked at an email MVCI sent to me back in February which included information on AIG Travel Guard's Owner Travel Insurance through Marriott. From the looks of it, this one would have covered the Aloha bankruptcy...

4. The airline, cruise line or tour operator with which you're scheduled to travel suddenly ceases operation or goes on strike leaving you with no option but to cancel your trip…with no recourse for reimbursement.


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## GaryDouglas (Apr 3, 2008)

*ATA Announced Bankruptcy, Et Tu ATA?*

I'm sorry Glenn, in case you haven't heard, ATA has just declared Bankruptcy also. You're going to have to scramble again. At least this time you should be able to credit your ATA charges immediately. It's sad, so sad, It's a sad, sad situation, And its getting more and more absurd...


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## myip (Apr 4, 2008)

Dave M said:


> At a minimum, you can get a refund/credit _if_ the charge for your tickets appears on a credit card statement mailed to you within the past 60 days. Otherwise, legally, you might well be out of luck, unless your credit card company has a specific provision designed to protect you. However, most credit card companies have a more generous (unpublished) refund policy than the law and federal regulations require, typically covering charges as old as six months or so.
> 
> See this Federal Trade Commission link for the rules as to what to do. Note that unless you send a _written_ dispute letter via _certified mail_, your claim might well be denied.



I am going to send a certified letter to American Express.  I called them up but they don't have address except PO Box.  I don't think you can send a certified letter to a PO Box.  May be I should send it to Consumer Relation.


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## Icarus (Apr 4, 2008)

myip said:


> I am going to send a certified letter to American Express.  I called them up but they don't have address except PO Box.  I don't think you can send a certified letter to a PO Box.  May be I should send it to Consumer Relation.



Yes, you can send a certified letter (or anything via USPS) to a PO Box.

-David


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## taffy19 (Apr 4, 2008)

tompalm said:


> In an earlier post, I said good luck to all of us. Good luck didn’t happen. My primary concern was for the passengers that needed to travel interisland or to the mainland in the next couple weeks. I knew that they could be stuck. The news tonight displayed lots of folks stranded and no seats available on other airlines. It was an incredibility sad day for a lot of people in Hawaii. Half of the employees at Aloha Airlines had worked there more than 20 years and their coworkers had become family. It was a great place to work and everyone loved coming to work and seeing each other. In the end, it was the fare war by GO, the rising fuel prices and the older interisland planes that use a lot of gas that did us in. In 2006, there were plans to get new planes, but when the fare wars happened, too much money was being lost and the new planes never happened.
> 
> This time Chapter 11 was different. The current owners had been trying to reorganize for the last two years. During the first week of March 2008, management told a group of pilots in ground school that the company was getting new planes, expanding with another company and that there would be something in the paper within two weeks. However, around March 15th, the other company backed out of the deal and the present owners gave up. When Aloha filed Chapter 11, there were four companies looking to invest. Everyone thought that one of the companies would show up on March 31st at the court hearing and we would continue ops until things were reorganized. However, it came as a big surprise to everyone when Aloha announced on March 30th that they were shutting down.
> 
> ...


I really feel for you and all the other Aloha employees too.  It is really sad to see a company go under when it has been in business so long.   

I hope that all TUGgers will get the flight they need.  We have our return tickets with Hawaiian so will be OK.


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## daventrina (Apr 4, 2008)

*CA has protection*

http://ag.ca.gov/travel/faqs.php

How do I file a complaint against an airline?

There are several ways that affected passengers can obtain information about air carriers that have ceased operations or filed for bankruptcy and the various avenues which are available to obtain refunds, file claims in bankruptcy, or have other carriers honor their tickets (assuming that such arrangements have been made).

For airlines, which are regulated by the United States Department of Transportation ("DOT"), these are:

   1. Log onto the DOT Website: http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/. Click on "Service Cessation."
   2. Call a hotline [(202) 366-2220] run by DOT's Aviation Consumer Protection Division. Leave a name and address and DOT will mail out the applicable "fact sheet."
   3. Write a letter to Department of Transportation, Aviation Consumer Protection Division, 400 7th St. SW, Room 4107, Washington, D.C. 20590.
   4. Log onto the Website for that carrier if it is still operational. Often times, when airlines cease operations, they continue to provide updated information on the Internet.

http://ag.ca.gov/travel/forms.php#fund
http://ag.ca.gov/travel/consumer.php
http://ag.ca.gov/travel/pdf/statute...8bdb0d9-fd6e-45da-847c-564a64a8db41/1/hilite/

http://www.tcrcinfo.com/index.html
http://www.tcrcinfo.com/forms.html

http://www.tcrcinfo.com/documents/Cessation%20Doc%202005%20OK.pdf

We had tickets on ATA using SW rewards credits. SW says that they'll reschedule us on other flights. We'll see what they come up with.


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## GaryDouglas (Apr 4, 2008)

Dave M said:


> At a minimum, you can get a refund/credit _if_ the charge for your tickets appears on a credit card statement mailed to you within the past 60 days. Otherwise, legally, you might well be out of luck, unless your credit card company has a specific provision designed to protect you. However, most credit card companies have a more generous (unpublished) refund policy than the law and federal regulations require, typically covering charges as old as six months or so.
> 
> See this Federal Trade Commission link for the rules as to what to do. Note that unless you send a _written_ dispute letter via _certified mail_, your claim might well be denied.


 
*Dave*, if the credit card company can't get the money from the carrier (Aloha or ATA in this case, blood from a turnip), is the CCC responsible for crediting my account, assuming all rules have been met?


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## DeniseM (Apr 4, 2008)

See posts #11 & 15 in this thread written by someone in the cc business.


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## Phill12 (Apr 4, 2008)

Even though we canceled our Maui plans after almost a year of having them in place some good news and dumb news!

 I see that my Wells Fargo Visa acct did return my $1649.00 for ATA flight. 

 Now we are only out our Aloha ticket cost of around $1900 and from what other Tuggers have said about the time rule we are dead in the water because we booked on Nov 29,2007 for a May 23,2008 trip. Still don't see how or why there would be a time table because you have paid for services not used.

 Dumb news is after my run-in with II travel and going back to Expedia to re-book and bragging on here about them because we have used Expedia for years they also let me down.

 After talking to someone that told me we just book your vacation plans for a fee and your on your own for your loss. This was almost as bad as dealing with II which will never happen again for us.

 Today Expedia sends me a E-mail giving numbers to call for about four airlines that they worked a deal to handle the ATA ticket holders. Nothing said if its the same bull that Aloha and United pulled where you pay higher fee to be on United but your Aloha money doesn't count toward your ticket.

 If United had done this with the Reservation we had from Aloha and not said we need to pay almost $2800 then go back and try to get our money from Aloha we would still be going  to Maui in May. 

 On the  TV News its made to sound as if you do get Aloha payments added to your United tickets and this has been a out right lie.To bad CNN doesn't hear about all this!

 If this was true we would still have our vacation and be flying on United in May instead of staying back at our resort in Lake Tahoe.


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## GaryDouglas (Apr 4, 2008)

DeniseM said:


> See posts #11 & 15 in this thread written by someone in the cc business.


 
Thanks. I think we're all learning more than we really want to... too bad some of us have to.


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## Cathyb (May 31, 2008)

*Aloha Airline Bankruptcy Reimbursement--American Express*

Just received a letter from American Express that we will be credited with the cost of two Aloha Airline inter-island tickets for July 2008 that we purchased about nine months ago    This helps defray the $390 replacement tickets with Hawaiian that we had to purchase.


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