# Hilton resuming ROFR?



## onenotesamba (Nov 20, 2015)

So, I've heard from two separate (and reputable, as per this board) real estate agents, that Hilton has started exercising ROFR, again, as of last week.

Not sure if anyone can confirm that with first hand experience (I hope not), but I just got a cheap 4800 pt. unit, and I'm wondering if my first foray into HGVC will be bought out from under me.

Anyone else hearing/experiencing this, firsthand?


----------



## Jason245 (Nov 20, 2015)

Well.. report back to us with the results. ..then we will have a current data point.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


----------



## Helios (Nov 20, 2015)

If this true, I am very glad my unit recently passed ROFR.


----------



## SmithOp (Nov 20, 2015)

I have 2 that just went in for rofr, will let you know in a couple of weeks if they pass.  One I'm selling, one buying.

Agents may be motivated to get you to pay more for a higher commission.

Companies coming up on end of 4th quarter typically freeze spending so they can report better end of year financials.


Sent from my iPad Mini 4 using Tapatalk


----------



## alwysonvac (Nov 20, 2015)

If it gets bought back by HGVC, you can always try again. Time is on your side 

I don't think you'll lose any money if HGVC executes their Right of First Refusal. The real estate agents can confirm.


----------



## 1Kflyerguy (Nov 20, 2015)

Believe Hilton reported an increase in inventory of unsold units at there last quarterly results so would be a bit surprised, but would not rule it out.

Sent from my SM-T807V using Tapatalk


----------



## Helios (Nov 22, 2015)

Thinking about, wouldn't exercising ROFR go against their Asset Light Strategy? 

Unless they intend to generate some quick cash by selling highly desirable inventory at low prices.  But, I don't think that would be a route that HGVC take.


----------



## Jason245 (Nov 22, 2015)

moto x said:


> Thinking about, wouldn't exercising ROFR go against their Asset Light Strategy?
> 
> Unless they intend to generate some quick cash by selling highly desirable inventory at low prices.  But, I don't think that would be a route that HGVC take.


Which is why resale prices are dropping lower and lower. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


----------



## Helios (Nov 22, 2015)

Jason245 said:


> Which is why resale prices are dropping lower and lower.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


 
What's the fix to stop the prices going down?


----------



## Jason245 (Nov 22, 2015)

moto x said:


> What's the fix to stop the prices going down?



Fix the supply/demand equation for resale, or artificially fix it. 

Options include:

Creating a robust resale market that competes against the developer sale market (not going to happen0

Use ROFR in instances where the price is below some floor that is set (artificial)

Enact some provision (prepay 5 years of MF with transfer etc) on resales that makes them unappealing. (artificial). 

Have an exceptional brand that holds value just based on brand (DVC anyone).


----------



## Helios (Nov 22, 2015)

Jason245 said:


> Fix the supply/demand equation for resale, or artificially fix it.
> 
> Options include:
> 
> ...



I like the last item.  I think that would be the best way to do it.


----------



## Jason245 (Nov 22, 2015)

moto x said:


> I like the last item.  I think that would be the best way to do it.


Hilton doesn't have that and has no intention of making it like that. ..

Disney is an entertainment company first,  the timeshare business is a means of getting more customers to the parks and spending money on entertainment. .. 

Hilton is a lodging company first and formost... 

The difference. .. one is an experience  (disney ) that continues throughout the  duration of your stay, the other (every other timeshare ) is a commodity (a room to sleep in).

In commodity businesses,  you can only be as smart as your dumbest competition as those are the prices you must compete with,  and at the end of the day. .lowest price wins.


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


----------



## 1Kflyerguy (Nov 22, 2015)

moto x said:


> Thinking about, wouldn't exercising ROFR go against their Asset Light Strategy?



I don't think exercising ROFR or buy taking units back into inventory inherently goes against the asset light model.  They are taking them back to resell for a profit, not to hold for a long time.  I believe they stopped excising it, because they had enough inventory, particularity with the new resorts in Oahu, Maui and Hilton Head coming online.  

I expect they may start exercising again, but i think they only stopped sometime earlier this year, so i am doubtful they would restart this soon.  But time will tell.


----------



## arnief (Nov 23, 2015)

Can DVC hold value when the purchase expires after time?


----------



## Jason245 (Nov 23, 2015)

arnief said:


> Can DVC hold value when the purchase expires after time?


Value of okw units now(on resale market ) are higher then they were 20 years ago when originally purchased.  And that is without the 10 years of free tickets incentive they were providing. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


----------



## elleny76 (Nov 23, 2015)

Disney is Disney  and the resorts are only owned for 45 years only  I believe. 

Besides I thank all those people who buys retail  remember NO retail NO resale.




arnief said:


> Can DVC hold value when the purchase expires after time?


----------



## frank808 (Nov 24, 2015)

elleny76 said:


> Disney is Disney  and the resorts are only owned for 45 years only  I believe.
> 
> Besides I thank all those people who buys retail  remember NO retail NO resale.


Actually 50 years right to use.  The oldest resorts expire in 2042.  Old Key West sells for almost double what the original asking price was.  And this is at resale prices.


----------



## Jason245 (Nov 24, 2015)

frank808 said:


> Actually 50 years right to use.  The oldest resorts expire in 2042.  Old Key West sells for almost double what the original asking price was.  And this is at resale prices.



Which is why I am amazed how an ENTERTAINMENT company has actually produced the ONLY timeshare like product that has fulfilled all (or almost all) the promises from the Sales People. 

I can not think of another ownership option out there where the value actually increases, they give you everything you are promised, and do what they say they  are going to say they are going to do and not nickle and dime you throughout the process. 

From my look at the fee chart for HGVC, back 10+ years ago, HGVC started with the DVC model, and somehow was led astray....


----------



## elleny76 (Nov 24, 2015)

Yes still pricey for a resale TS. I bought DVC resale and I own 200 points. Now in compare with 100 points today sales at the Poly...  I totally paid resale ( half of the amount for todays 100 points value_Poly) 







frank808 said:


> Actually 50 years right to use.  The oldest resorts expire in 2042.  Old Key West sells for almost double what the original asking price was.  And this is at resale prices.


----------



## pinetree1 (Jan 27, 2016)

*Hilton ROFR*

I heard from a broker that Hilton is very aggressively exercising ROFR now and any offer under $9000 for Vegas Strip 7000 point could not pass ROFR. Just wonder how true is the comment. Any one has recent purchase experience? Thanks for sharing.


----------



## presley (Jan 27, 2016)

pinetree1 said:


> I heard from a broker that Hilton is very aggressively exercising ROFR now and any offer under $9000 for Vegas Strip 7000 point could not pass ROFR. Just wonder how true is the comment. Any one has recent purchase experience? Thanks for sharing.



I can't speak to that particular property, but there have been a lot of posts in the last few weeks about people buying at all time low prices. It will be easy to buy a 7,000 point contract for less than that, but I don't know which properties.


----------



## Jason245 (Jan 27, 2016)

pinetree1 said:


> I heard from a broker that Hilton is very aggressively exercising ROFR now and any offer under $9000 for Vegas Strip 7000 point could not pass ROFR. Just wonder how true is the comment. Any one has recent purchase experience? Thanks for sharing.


Tell the broker to give your offer (whatever it is) to seller and if you lose to ROFR please tell us because we have no data points proving they have exercised rofr in over 6 months..

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


----------



## SmithOp (Jan 27, 2016)

pinetree1 said:


> I heard from a broker that Hilton is very aggressively exercising ROFR now and any offer under $9000 for Vegas Strip 7000 point could not pass ROFR. Just wonder how true is the comment. Any one has recent purchase experience? Thanks for sharing.




Hogwash!  Sales are easily passing at 90 cents a point or less.  The agent probably has a seller that wants way too much.


Sent from my iPad Mini 4 using Tapatalk


----------



## onenotesamba (Jan 27, 2016)

Since I started this thread, I'll report back. I had an offer for 4800 pts Plat 1BR at SeaWorld pass ROFR at $2500 in December.  I've got another purchase of 4800 pts pending at the Boulevard/Strip for$3000, and the seller told me that the same unit passed ROFR at around that price, recently.

For 7000 point packages, I haven't seen many on the resale market for less than $1 per point, but I certainly wouldn't pay/offer more than that.  There are plenty of resale units out there.  If Hilton buys a unit out from under you at a low price, you can always find a comparable unit there for a slightly higher price and see if that one passes.

I'd look for a 7K point package at less than $6K and give it a shot. If it doesn't pass, try again at a slightly higher price.  It might take some time, but no one has reported ROFR activity on this board in a long time, so you've got nothing to lose by taking your time.  Slow and steady wins the race.


----------



## pinetree1 (Jan 28, 2016)

The broker Judi Kozlowski who is mentioned quite lot on the broad refused to take anything less than $9000. I will just try other sellers in different markets and will report back. Thank you for all your ideas and support.


----------



## Jason245 (Jan 28, 2016)

pinetree1 said:


> The broker Judi Kozlowski who is mentioned quite lot on the broad refused to take anything less than $9000. I will just try other sellers in different markets and will report back. Thank you for all your ideas and support.


She is an agent not a seller.. it might be that the owners she has listed refuse to sell that low...did you ask if she had other resorts that she is willing to sell at the price you want for points you want? 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


----------



## natarajanv (Jan 28, 2016)

*she just flooded ebay with HGVC*



Jason245 said:


> She is an agent not a seller.. it might be that the owners she has listed refuse to sell that low...did you ask if she had other resorts that she is willing to sell at the price you want for points you want?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk



After a while she has a lot of HGVC listings on ebay now. This makes me believe the sales are slowing down...


----------



## presley (Jan 28, 2016)

pinetree1 said:


> The broker Judi Kozlowski who is mentioned quite lot on the broad refused to take anything less than $9000. I will just try other sellers in different markets and will report back. Thank you for all your ideas and support.



If you know exactly what you want to buy and how much you want to pay, just make offers everywhere until someone accepts it. It may take a few months, but you'll get what you want.


----------



## ameerishaan (Jul 5, 2016)

I bought from Judi Kozlowski a 7000 point contract for Elara for $10,000 in June. She told be it will not pass ROFR if under $10,000 as Hilton is buying back lots of contracts if under $10,000. Hmmmm....


----------



## Cyberc (Jul 6, 2016)

ameerishaan said:


> I bought from Judi Kozlowski a 7000 point contract for Elara for $10,000 in June. She told be it will not pass ROFR if under $10,000 as Hilton is buying back lots of contracts if under $10,000. Hmmmm....



As I have mentioned in other threads if brokers commissions are based on the sales price, then they would claim anything to get a higher price. If they get a fixed fee then they should recommend a specific price to buyers so the sale will pass rofr. The sellers shouldn't care they get their money regardless. This is however not the case with the brokers, I think some won't be a part of driving down the prices or maybe have another agenda. 

We have a small saying here where I'm from, always remember that the brokers are the sellers man not the buyers. I don't know if that also goes here in the US but I seen why not. 

Regards


----------



## Judi Kozlowski (Jul 6, 2016)

ameerishaan said:


> I bought from Judi Kozlowski a 7000 point contract for Elara for $10,000 in June. She told be it will not pass ROFR if under $10,000 as Hilton is buying back lots of contracts if under $10,000. Hmmmm....



We were very pleased to get the $10,000 contract through on the Elara purchase.  We lost one at $10,000. Our goal is to get the contract through for our Buyers and Sellers.  If there is an ROFR we get paid.  If we wanted to increase our income we could write the low offers and get paid and then sell the Buyer another unit.  That is not our goal.  It is not good for the Buyer, Seller, Agent or Developer


----------



## Judi Kozlowski (Jul 6, 2016)

*Hilton-HGVC*



natarajanv said:


> After a while she has a lot of HGVC listings on ebay now. This makes me believe the sales are slowing down...



Sales are not slowing down.  We just have not had time to advertise.


----------



## Judi Kozlowski (Jul 6, 2016)

*Hilton-HGVC -Commission*



Cyberc said:


> As I have mentioned in other threads if brokers commissions are based on the sales price, then they would claim anything to get a higher price. If they get a fixed fee then they should recommend a specific price to buyers so the sale will pass rofr. The sellers shouldn't care they get their money regardless. This is however not the case with the brokers, I think some won't be a part of driving down the prices or maybe have another agenda.
> 
> We have a small saying here where I'm from, always remember that the brokers are the sellers man not the buyers. I don't know if that also goes here in the US but I seen why not.
> 
> Regards



The way this works is if we write a sale at a lower price the unit will be exercised on and we will get paid.  Then we sell the Buyer another unit and get paid again.  That doesn't make your plan work.  We try to get a higher price because we owe it to the Seller to keep the values up.  If we know the Developer is going to exercise on the unit and we still write it shame on us.
The right thing to do is to sell the unit above the ROFR and then you have a happy buyer and seller and agent.  Doing the right thing is important to us.


----------



## ameerishaan (Jul 6, 2016)

Judi, I'm very glad it went through as well thanks to your advice of the pricing!!!! We are looking at another one to buy from you resale but want to make sure price is right. Thanks!


----------



## mscheribel59 (Aug 8, 2016)

I bought a 7,000 Platinum point Tuscany Village on International Dr, Orlando and it just cleared ROFR. Paid total of $4077.00 + 535 activation fee with Hilton. Seller paid $750.00 closing fee and tax, and the 399.00 transfer fee. It doesn't have to be 1.00 a point. Just depends if Hilton is actively buying back.


----------

