# Summer Bay Las Vegas Desert Club Meeting Saturday Morning



## ry"c (Jun 17, 2011)

The Summer Bay Las Vegas Desert Club Annual Meeting for owners is tomorrow at 9 a.m. at the resort. Due to a last minute circumstance, I will not be in attendance. Would like to know what is said at the meeting if another TUGGER is going.
James Reach


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## roadtriper (Jun 18, 2011)

Just got back from the Mtg. evidently the "rumor" is true. Summer bay is in a deal with Orange Lake  for the Las Vegas and Marco Island properties. looking at a closing date in Aug.   IF the deal goes through Orange Lake will be the new Mgmt company. and we'll be Holiday Inn Vacation  Las Vegas Desert Club.  when the deal is complete they say all owners will be getting lots of info from Orange lake???  not much more info given at this time. 

 the Club house is "Almost" finished they are looking at moving into it in a few weeks???  the "Grand Opening" and Dedication will probably be in Oct.?
the 4 board members elected were Charles McKern, Gary Koehli, Dennis Stacey, and Marcel Ferrere.   James, looks like they voted the Proxys and the Summer Bay votes again. the 4 winners had 20,000 +/- votes and the 3 runner ups were all less than 3000.   we are going to get a tour of the clubhouse at 1pm.    ?????   all I know at this time  RT


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## M&JJ (Jun 19, 2011)

So what does this change to Orange Lake meant to me as an owner?  Bought my unit resale right before the move to the current location and curious what (if anything) this will mean to the owners.  The Holiday Inn name is not thrilling.

Would love to know more.

thanks


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## roadtriper (Jun 19, 2011)

Unknown at this time, I'm not that familiar with Orange Lake.  I guess they are a BIG outfit and have deeper pockets than Mr. Scott and Summer bay.
Summer Bay has been very good to us and the board all stated that they would be sad to see them go.  I'm sure this was a financial decision on Summer Bays part?  there doesent seem to be any hard feelings between anyone! and the Summer Bay Personel are working away trying to get the construction finished etc.  this is NOT a done deal yet, as in any transaction I guess it could fall through?  at this stage I guess as owners we need to do some research on Orange Lake,  Holiday Inn Vacation Club etc.  and wait and see when and if the deal goes through what sort of info we get. I suspect as owners we wont see much difference in our LV experience. probably a stronger sales push? which is actually good for us as owners.  Time will tell. RT


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## ry"c (Jun 19, 2011)

Regarding the Orange Lake potential purchase that was announced at our Annual Meeting: Any new developer may have a significant potential to develop a large number of new timeshare weeks at our resort and market and sell them. The Las Vegas Desert Club has 658 physical suites, but our HOA now only includes 520 physical suites as timeshares. The remaining 138 physical suites within our grounds may become 7,176 (52 X 138) developer-owned new timeshares weeks available to be offered to the public. The 138 physical suites are now owned by our HOA and are being rented out by our HOA to guests. The rental revenue goes to our HOA. These rental suites are less-appointed than the timeshare suites, but still good quality, fully-furnishied suites. These suites would have to be improved and renovated in many ways before they are of timeshare standard. Our HOA had a previous agreement with Summer Bay giving Summer Bay the option to acquire the 138 rental suites for converting to timeshares. This contract may be transferrable to a new developer. If not, a new developer would have to make a new agreement to acquire, renovate and resell these suites from our HOA.


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## roadtriper (Jun 20, 2011)

James, good to see you back!   as I understood the converation, it sounded like Orange Lake would assume the Obligation on the 138 developer owned units. and would be in a better financial position to get them renovated and sold. which would put the $10 Million +/- into the HOA's account sooner than the 2017 deadline?  Summer bay is still selling units as we speak, but they have stopped selling just crown point packages unless they are attatched to the sale of a new interval.  there is some question as to how the crown club memberships will be transfered into the HIVC  Points system.  Hopefully folks who paid the big bucks to join Crown Club will be granfathered in to the new program with out any expense?  we'll have to see?
the Board said all the RCI scores are well into the "Gold Crown" level and RCI will bestow the Gold Crown designation as soom as the construction is complete???
I'll be glad to get the "Rental units"  Gone forever! while they have generated $$$ which has helped pay for their upkeep etc.  they kill our reviews on the travel sights as while they are nice, they have all the tired furnishings from the old resort. and do not compare in any way with the rest of the property! RT


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## observe50 (Jun 20, 2011)

I hope I am not being rude by saying this.

I feel as if roadtriper is correct in what he wrote especially about the other sites and the reviews that have been posted. The remaining rentals need to be finished correctly for your status to improve. I know I read many reviews on many sites and some reviews about the rental units weren't very good

I know RCI has been pushing Summer Bay as a Gold Crown Property to us and it was their push that actually got me to exchange for two units at Summer Bay this Sept.

From what I am seeing when the construction is finished you are going to have a timeshare worthy of that Gold Crown status.


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## ry"c (Jun 20, 2011)

*Election Outcome*

This is the second year in a row that an unknown with no prior Board experience won. This year, Dennis Stacey, who owns a perennial plant maintenence service and is a landlord of some offices in Illinois won. Last year Robert Scharf, an accountant from California, won who had never had any prior participation in our resort leadership.

The three candidates who had been on the Board in prior years lost, Jo-Ann Whitaker, David Freemantle and me, James Reach.

Surprisingly Marcel Ferrere won. He had lost four out of four prior elections (2004, 2006, 2008 and 2009) although he was an incumbent because the Board appointed Ferrere to fill a seat for a Board member who resigned mid-term on two separate ocasions.

One owner, a subsidiary of Caesars Entertainment Corp., owns 278 weeks, the largest bloc of any owner other than the developer. My guess is that Caesars voted its shares this year and last year for the unkown "average guy" rather than experienced people one of whom is an attorney, me, and one of whom is a CPA, Freemantle.

The Board policy is to randomize the ballot positions by drawing the candidate's names out of a hat to establish the order. Jo-Ann Whitaker was in first position and still lost to the person in last position, Dennis Stacey. In all of our elections, ballot position has not had any effect.

The way the voting goes is as follows: Owners who are not the developer mail in their marked ballots. About 920 owners mail in ballots representing about 2300 weeks, a very rough estimate based on the average owner having 2 1/2 weeks. The ballots go to managment company (developer) staff who does the tallying. At some point during preliminary returns, the developer looks at the leading candidates in the ongoing tally and votes its shares. The developer has a controlling interest because it has approximately 2400 votes, which are the unsold inventory timeshare weeks available for sale. This 2400 bloc of unsold inventory votes is more than all the other owner shares combined who vote. 

In all years except 2008 the developer has voted its shares in accordance with the leading candidates of the other owners in equal shares. In 2008, the developer chose to vote for other people other than the democratic winners and changed the outcome so that the three other down-ticket candidates who were not the true first, second, and fourth place winners got the Board seats.

After the mail-in tally and the developer votes its bloc of shares, the HOA votes its enomorous bloc of Long-Term Proxy votes. As stated above most of the owners throw their ballots in the trash and do not participate. My estimate is that 22,340 of the 27,040 total shares are not voted by owners. These shares then are available to be voted by the HOA as the owners have signed proxies in favor of the HOA to vote their shares if they don't vote.

Our HOA has the right to vote its Long-Term proxies as it sees fit. In some cases--2004 two candidates and 2006 one candidate--the Board adjusted the vote through its long-term proxies to give the Board seat (s) to losing candidates. Most of the time the HOA votes its Long Term proxies in accordance with the vote outcome after the developer casts its votes and after all the other owners have voted via mail-in balloting (this is done prior to the in-person voting at the meeting).

My guess is that the Caesars bloc of votes sufficiently tilted the original preliminary balloting outcome and then Summer Bay voted its unsold inventory accordingly and then our HOA voted its Long Term Proxies accordingly. Only a guess.

Our Board conists of 11 members. Three of them are not voted for by our owners; they are appointed by the developer. The remaining eight Board members come up for election, four every-other-year. Thus the developer appoints three members and votes as an owner its shares for the other eight members.


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## timeos2 (Jun 20, 2011)

It would seem to me that the developer should either have the 3 appointed seat OR the right to vote without agreeing to vote with the majority of independent owners, but not both.  Does Nevada have a regulation like so many other States that once turned over the project cannot be reclaimed (through Board appointment/votes) by the Developer/Subsequent Developer? If so why hasn't that kicked in? 

As they are doing it doesn't sound like a healthy way to run the Board vote.


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## ry"c (Jun 21, 2011)

When PEC Corporation was our developer 10 years ago, while the resort was called "Ramada Vacation Suites," the developer voted its own senior employees who were seated for all of the HOA Board member positions. This lasted at least ten years prior to 2001. During this period the management contract terms and the budget establishing the annual maintenance fees were profit-for-the-developer-driven without owner concern.
Since 2001 our resort has had CC & Rs and Bylaws to allow an 8 owner, 3 developer board, but with the caveat that the developer can vote its unsold inventory shares for the owner spots, while the developer has sole appointment power for the 3 developer spots.
Our Long-Term proxies are signed in favor of our HOA. Don't several developers have the owners sign the Long-Term proxies in favor of the developer? Prior to 2004, our resort's Long Term proxies were signed in favor of the developer. Now this is no longer the case.
Our HOA could trump the unsold inventory votes by voting its Long Term proxies in accordance with only owner shares voting that are not developer shares. However, since our developer pays for each of its weeks an annual maintenance fee, there is some fairness in allowing it to vote its shares for the owner seats. In co-operation, Summer Bay, as developer voted its unsold inventory in accordance with the remaining owner votes in six out of the seven elections our Board has had while Summer Bay was the developer. Exception was the 2008 election.
Don't several timeshare resorts across the U.S. have the developer controlling all of the positions on the HOA Board and all of the Long Term proxies?


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## roadtriper (Jun 24, 2011)

Don't Our CC&r's also turn the board to full Owner Control when we reach a certian threshold of sold units? 

Here are some Pics I took of the resort. a couple from Nov 2010 and the rest were this past weekend 
http://photobucket.com/SBLVDC


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## observe50 (Jun 24, 2011)

roadtriper,

Thank you so much for the photo's..... they have gotten a lot done from the last set of pictures in May. From what I can see it will deserve that Gold Crown status, it looks fantastic!

The sooner they get the old rooms refurbished and everything totally completed the reviews on trip advisor, bookit and so on will change without a doubt.

I am so looking forward to visiting your location.


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## jackio (Jun 24, 2011)

Thank you for posting these, Roadtriper!


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## ry"c (Jun 24, 2011)

There is no scenario in the CC & Rs where the owners will have more control than eight out of eleven Board seats, but the owners may end up with less control in certain situations. If a threshold is reached where the Developer owns a certain high proportion of total weeks in the association, the Developer becomes a "Class B Shareholder" while the rest of the owners are "Class A." If there is a "Class B Shareholder" the Developer has total and complete control over any actions of the Board. The rationale is that while the resort is being developed, the Developer should call the shots as to the direction of the resort, because it is spending all the money to build and market the place, and paying a substantial amount of the operating costs by paying a large number of Annual Maintenance fees. Our resort has the potential to go into Class B status because the resort may add over 8268 new unsold weeks into its inventory (the 138 rental untis X 52 weeks plus the 1092 unsold weeks added when we moved) changing the proportion of developer-owned versus owner-owned intervals to substantially more developer-owned.
If Orange Lake decides to agressively develop the 138 rental units into timeshare suites this could happen. I read on another TUG forum that after Orange Lake acquired a resort in Myrtle Beach, SC it agressively developed the property.



roadtriper said:


> Don't Our CC&r's also turn the board to full Owner Control when we reach a certian threshold of sold units?
> 
> Here are some Pics I took of the resort. a couple from Nov 2010 and the rest were this past weekend
> http://photobucket.com/SBLVDC


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## roadtriper (Jun 25, 2011)

If I'm reading it correctly...  Page 13  Article IV  Paragraph A  " The Board shall consist of eleven (11) members. *So long as the Developer shall own at least , five hundred (500) time shares The Developer shall have the right to elect three (3) members of the Board of Directors as more specificaly set forth in the bylaws"   ???  *


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## Dori (Jun 26, 2011)

Roadtriper, thanks for sharing your pix. Things are looking great!

Dori


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## roadtriper (Jun 27, 2011)

Anyone have any experience with Oranger Lake or Holiday Inn Club Vacation???   not finding much for positive info.  lots of unhappy timeshare purchasers, but I guess thats the "Catch 22" of timesharing. looks like Orange Lake has all Gold Crown Properties.  JUst wondering what their management operations will be like if this deal goes through?  I've been pretty impressed with Summer Bay's way of doing things!  RT


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## ry"c (Jun 27, 2011)

roadtriper said:


> Anyone have any experience with Oranger Lake or Holiday Inn Club Vacation???   not finding much for positive info.  lots of unhappy timeshare purchasers, but I guess thats the "Catch 22" of timesharing. looks like Orange Lake has all Gold Crown Properties.  JUst wondering what their management operations will be like if this deal goes through?  I've been pretty impressed with Summer Bay's way of doing things!  RT



Based on other threads posted here on TUG, the Holiday Inn Club Vacations points progam DOES NOT TRANSFER when an owner resells his timeshare week. With RCI Weeks and RCI Points, the interval is connected to the RCI Weeks or Points. When a seller transfers his deed, RCI will transfer the responsibilites and  benefits of its exchange programs associated with that interval to the new owner after receiving a transfer fee and a copy of the recorded deed. With HICV after an owner pays $10,000 or more to join the club, if the owner resells his deed, the new owner does not get the points or membership in the club. The former selling owner loses all his points and is no longer a member because he no longer has an interval.
Will someone verify this?
Our resort's reservations and room blocking will be complex to manage for use at our resort--different rules for different programs with different groups having access to the reseravation central computer: straight non-affiliated owners, RCI Points program reservations through RCI's agents, Summer Bay Crown Club reservations through the Crown Club agents and now Holiday Inn Club Vacations reservations through the Orange Lake agents. Four separate pools of ownership with different reservation rules and different reservation agents doing room blocking for our resort. As it stands now, an RCI Points owner can make a mid-week arrival split-week stay up to 310 days in advance of arrival, but a straight non-affiliated owner can only make the same type of reservation 45 days prior to arrival. Now there are more sets of reservation rules either present or coming (Crown Club and Holiday Inn Club Vacations).
P.S. What if Orange Lake wants to not develop the 138 rental units and instead convert them to a Holiday Inn rental all-suites hotel inside our timeshare grounds?


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## roadtriper (Jun 27, 2011)

Back when the Desert Club deal was first being discussed there was all sorts of ideas and speculation as to what would be/could be done with the excess inventory.  isn't it spelled out somewhere that the units have to be  developed as timeshare intervals?  I remember reading something to that effect?   RT


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## roadtriper (Jun 27, 2011)

I would assume that when/if Orange Lake takes over the Mgmt.  and Summer Bay moves out that the Crown Club will no longer be a part of the Desert Club.   it was unclear at the HOA mtg how they were going to handle the folks who bought into the SB Crown Club point system.  I see a lot of similarities between the summer bay and orange lake business plan. Coincidence?    Didn't Summer Bay have a Holiday Inn in their Fla. list of properties?


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## ry"c (Jun 28, 2011)

roadtriper said:


> I would assume that when/if Orange Lake takes over the Mgmt.  and Summer Bay moves out that the Crown Club will no longer be a part of the Desert Club.   it was unclear at the HOA mtg how they were going to handle the folks who bought into the SB Crown Club point system.  I see a lot of similarities between the summer bay and orange lake business plan. Coincidence?    Didn't Summer Bay have a Holiday Inn in their Fla. list of properties?



Yes, there is a Holiday Inn Express within the grounds of Summer Bay Orlando.
Orange Lake will do its due diligence. With the current developer sales market at its nadir, it is more economically viable to have a Holiday Inn-branded hotel for rentals than to develop new timeshare intervals and try to sell them at developer prices.

I am in wonder at how THE SAME CUSTOMERS are resold multiple times...Our Summer Bay Las Vegas owners went from one week of regular ownership to more ownership (most existing owners purchased a second or third week) to RCI Points conversion of their existing week (s) ownership ($6,000) to Crown Club coversion of their existing owership (upwards of $10,000 or more because most owners will buy another biennial week when converting to Crown Club) and now will be asked to convert to Holiday Inn Club Vacations points for even more money. Orange Lake is getting a known customer base of existing owners who have a pattern or being resold again and again with different upgrades.


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## roadtriper (Jun 28, 2011)

James I just checked my copy of the cc&r's and Article III  Paragraph "G"  states that "the developer, it's succesors, transferee's. or asigns,...   states that any of the lodging units shall contain timeshares. and additional property can only be developed for timeshare use.    Who controls the cc&r's ?  are they changable?


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## observe50 (Jun 28, 2011)

Please excuse my ignorance on this its just an observation.

If Summer Bay had intentions of changing hands I would think that they would want you out roadtriper since you are an attorney. Big business works in strange ways and a landscaper would fit their needs...know what I mean.

I know I am probably way off but I believe this is why they voted in the people they did.

I hope this isn't taken badly I am just speaking out loud so to say.


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## roadtriper (Jun 28, 2011)

observe50 said:


> Please excuse my ignorance on this its just an observation.
> 
> If Summer Bay had intentions of changing hands I would think that they would want you out roadtriper since you are an attorney. Big business works in strange ways and a landscaper would fit their needs...know what I mean.
> 
> ...



I hold no position they could want me out of!  I'm just an owner of timeshare intervals at the Desert Club
AND  I'm no Lawyer!  Heck, I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn last night!
Auto/Truck Mechanic, Automotive Machinist, Business Owner, all Badges I wear with Pride!    I think you're getting me and M.r Reach confused with each other???   RT


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## observe50 (Jun 29, 2011)

roadtriper you are correct my mind thinks one thing my fingers type another must be my age is catching up with me.

I know everyone that I have had contact with on this site has been so nice and so helpful. 

I know when we bought our timeshares decades ago it was so much different then now-a-days. It seems you are promised one thing and when they decide to change the rules that's ok it just the way it is and your stuck more or less.

We tried selling but nothing..... no offers at all. From what I am seeing people are practically giving them away to get rid of them.

For example I am coming out to Summer Bay the end of Sept. I exchanged 2-2 bedroom units thru RCI the cost

Maintenance fee each unit $678.00 total $1,356.00
Extension fees    each unit $109.00 total $   218.00
Exchange fees    each unit $199.99 total $   398.00

                                            TOTAL: $1,972.00

You can see it's not cheap I could have rented 2 owners units for cheaper

This is why when I go to a place I try to research to get something I feel worthwhile. RCI has been pushing Summer Bay for a year so I had them check about all the construction and they were told it was to be done March when it wasn't I was concerned because I would have gone elsewhere and come to Summer Bay when it was completed. 

As it turns out even with it not being done in March it looks like it will all be finished by the end of Sept. and what I see is very nice. I am so thankful for the pictures they speak many words. I am so looking forward to getting there and having a what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas time.

Okay so I'm old it might not stay there I might spread the word myself :ignore: lol


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## roadtriper (Jun 29, 2011)

"What stays in Vegas"  are $100 bills!  :annoyed:


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## observe50 (Jun 30, 2011)

Thanks for the heads up on the $100.00 bills   I'm going to make sure I change them to twenties now  

I check reviews everyday for Summer Bay and I must say the reviews are getting better and better each day.


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## Vacationguru64 (Jul 29, 2011)

*Orange Lake/ Holiday Inn Club*



roadtriper said:


> Just got back from the Mtg. evidently the "rumor" is true. Summer bay is in a deal with Orange Lake  for the Las Vegas and Marco Island properties. looking at a closing date in Aug.   IF the deal goes through Orange Lake will be the new Mgmt company. and we'll be Holiday Inn Vacation  Las Vegas Desert Club.  when the deal is complete they say all owners will be getting lots of info from Orange lake???  not much more info given at this time.
> 
> the Club house is "Almost" finished they are looking at moving into it in a few weeks???  the "Grand Opening" and Dedication will probably be in Oct.?
> the 4 board members elected were Charles McKern, Gary Koehli, Dennis Stacey, and Marcel Ferrere.   James, looks like they voted the Proxys and the Summer Bay votes again. the 4 winners had 20,000 +/- votes and the 3 runner ups were all less than 3000.   we are going to get a tour of the clubhouse at 1pm.    ?????   all I know at this time
> ...


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## observe50 (Jul 30, 2011)

I have stayed at Orange Lake in Florida and never had a problem what-so-ever it was very nice.


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## MollyBuzz (Aug 3, 2011)

I just hope the maintenance fees don't go up. I bought here (resale) because they were low, would hate to see that change and have redevelopment of the rental units be the reason.


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## andex (Aug 5, 2011)

Thats seems like great news.  One possible draw back.... When I was looking into buying a time share property from orange lake with RCI points. I was told the RCI points doesnt follow to the new owner. wondering if they would grandfather this if they bought LVDC
cant seem to find anything about this possible transaction on the web?


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## UWSurfer (Aug 5, 2011)

I bought LVDC resale a few years back.  The account associated with the week had over 100,000 points in it and was transferred over to me as the new owner. 

Shouldn't be an issue but it does take someone closing who knows what they are doing with RCI.


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## roadtriper (Aug 5, 2011)

MollyBuzz said:


> I just hope the maintenance fees don't go up. I bought here (resale) because they were low, would hate to see that change and have redevelopment of the rental units be the reason.



MB, the Finances at the Desert Club are totaly controled by the HOA BOD.  Summer Bay or Orange Lake are the Hired Managment Co. and do not control the MF.     the Maint fees as I understand it are determined by the upcoming years budget and needed reserve funds.     the rental unit renovations are to be paid totaly by the developer/mgmt co.  as they sell them.  
I'm sure MF's will probably go up   what hasn't?   but it shouldn't be because of the rental units or the new Mgmt company if it happens.


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## andex (Aug 9, 2011)

UWSurfer said:


> I bought LVDC resale a few years back.  The account associated with the week had over 100,000 points in it and was transferred over to me as the new owner.
> 
> Shouldn't be an issue but it does take someone closing who knows what they are doing with RCI.



i also bought LVDC on the resale last month and the points also followed. however the same re-sellers (checked with a few of them) told me it didnt work the same with holidayinn vacation. those properties didnt keep the RCI points in the resale?


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## mikejt (Sep 14, 2011)

roadtriper said:


> I would assume that when/if Orange Lake takes over the Mgmt.  and Summer Bay moves out that the Crown Club will no longer be a part of the Desert Club.   it was unclear at the HOA mtg how they were going to handle the folks who bought into the SB Crown Club point system.  I see a lot of similarities between the summer bay and orange lake business plan. Coincidence?    Didn't Summer Bay have a Holiday Inn in their Fla. list of properties?



You are correct the crown club will go away for the Las Vegas owners.


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## Sandy (Sep 14, 2011)

MollyBuzz said:


> I just hope the maintenance fees don't go up. I bought here (resale) because they were low, would hate to see that change and have redevelopment of the rental units be the reason.



I am with you 100%!!! I just learned about this Orange Lake acquision when I opened my mail yesterday!  Surprise, surprise, SURPRISE!!!

This perhaps explains why, when I was on the phone with RCI a week ago, the rep kept telling me that I owned at Orange lake.  I argued with him, but he insisted that I owned at OL.  Of course I KNOW where I own, and did not own at OL.

Well, yes I do... 

I have two concerns: _will our very reasonable MFs go up as a result of this _(My guess is YES)

And how does OL justify owning SB, when the SB orlando is right down the street, perhaps a mile or so, from the OL resort?

sandy


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## observe50 (Sep 14, 2011)

I called RCI  and they gave me a choice to change my reservations, they gave me a number to Summer Bay 702-731-6100 which I just called they answer Desert Club Resort Las Vegas. They have different offerings to choose from that tell you what is going on.

I asked about the Clubhouse and was told that the Clubhouse is open for business.... the woman said the convenience store, coffee/deli and tiki bar are all open for business.

I kept my reservations because I do want to see what is going on and I do know Orange Lake Resorts I visited in Florida were very nice.

As with everything time will tell


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## mikejt (Sep 14, 2011)

OL only bought the Las Vegas and Marco Island resorts the Summerbay kept its Orlando resort. I think they may have financial issues and had to liquidate some of there properties. I am an owner at the Desert Club Las Vegas and that is a wonderful place to stay in Vegas.  I am unhappy with SummerBay as I was a crown club member and I paid for the membership and now it will be gone at the end of the year.


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## Sandy (Sep 14, 2011)

mikejt said:


> OL only bought the Las Vegas and Marco Island resorts the Summerbay kept its Orlando resort. I think they may have financial issues and had to liquidate some of there properties. I am an owner at the Desert Club Las Vegas and that is a wonderful place to stay in Vegas.  I am unhappy with SummerBay as I was a crown club member and I paid for the membership and now it will be gone at the end of the year.



Interesting how these companies keep trying to upsell us more and more "privileges."  RCI is pushing its platinum service, Desert Club did the same last time we were there. Seems like they need to keep new money flowing in constantly. You would think that the MF would cover most everything that is needed.

I really worry about increasing MF costs. The reasonable MF was one of the draws to Summer Bay in the first place. I fear bad news will be on the horizon concerning these fees.
sandy


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## dwojo (Sep 14, 2011)

It's all about keeping up the revenue stream


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## roadtriper (Sep 14, 2011)

Sandy said:


> Interesting how these companies keep trying to upsell us more and more "privileges."  RCI is pushing its platinum service, Desert Club did the same last time we were there. Seems like they need to keep new money flowing in constantly. You would think that the MF would cover most everything that is needed.
> 
> I really worry about increasing MF costs. The reasonable MF was one of the draws to Summer Bay in the first place. I fear bad news will be on the horizon concerning these fees.
> sandy



Hi Sandy, how are you?
As I understand it...
The Maint fees are set by the HOA, collected by the HOA, go into HOA accounts, and are dispersed by the HOA.   the developer/management company have no access to those funds.
the Management company is hired by and works for the HOA. all departments are required to budget for the upcoming year and the HOA aproves the budget and funds the management company.

The money collected By the Developer for the sale of inventory they own, or membership in any "club" or internal "Points System"  is purely their income and has no basis on MF's   
The Developer/ management Company are the same entity  Orange lake (previously SB)   but basicaly have 2 seperate functions at the resort   they are hired by us the owners (HOA) to manage, maintain and run the resort.
and then there is the sales staff who's sole pupose is just that  Sell inventory and upsell owners into the "Club" or whatever.
Orange Lake  or SB before them do not have a direct say on the amount of the maint fee, nor do they directly get any part of it. they have a Contract to manage the resort, and I'm sure the $ amont they get for that contract is negotiated as is any contract.  if the amount of the contract goes up, or any other costs involved with the resort  Util, insurance etc. goes up, OUR maint fees will go up.   Orange Lake has to pay the Maint fees to the HOA (us) on the unsold intervals they own, just as we have to pay our maint fees on the units we own.   there are 7038 weekly intervals represented in the 138 excess units. plus whatever other inventory they aquired from SB in the deal. 
assuming they are responsible only for the 7038 intervals.  every $10 increase in MF's  would be an additional $70,380 in Maint fees they pay the HOA. their MF bill on the unsold inventory is in the well into the 7 figure range!      Orange Lake does not own the Desert Club, We the owners do!  there are some of the comon areas and part of the sales/admin building I believe are handled differantly as they were paid for by SB?   RT


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## Sandy (Sep 14, 2011)

Hi Roadtripper!

I was going to send you a PM when I opened the letter yesterday from SB.  Boy was I surprised. 
Thanks for your explanation on the fees. You seem to have a much better handle on this than I do. In your opinion, does this merger have any likelihood to increase MFs for us?


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## roadtriper (Sep 14, 2011)

Sandy said:


> Hi Roadtripper!
> 
> I was going to send you a PM when I opened the letter yesterday from SB.  Boy was I surprised.
> Thanks for your explanation on the fees. You seem to have a much better handle on this than I do. In your opinion, does this merger have any likelihood to increase MFs for us?



I really dont think the sale of SB's assets to OL  will have an adverse effect on the MF's   at last junes mtg we were in pretty good shape financialy. don't have the figures in front of me but there was a serious amount in the reserve account. and if what I read is true, and Orange lake HAS purchased the 138 units already?  that's an influx of Big money to the HOA that wasn't planned on for possably 7 years or so worst case scenario.   having said all that I DO believe MF's will go up, but I think it will be the economy driving it, not the change in Mgt. companies.  almost everything in my Business and personal life has gone up 
i'm sure you've seen the same!  so yeah the fees will probably go up, but I'm guessing/hoping it will be on par with everything else.    there are some 2 bedroom TS's in vegas with MF's above 1K  and they aren't any nicer than our units IMHO. so were still sitting pretty good!   good to hear from you!   pop in once in a while, you don't have to wait till there is a crisis!     RT


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