# Guest claims Wyndham Sea Garden Made it sign up for meeting



## ljc50 (Feb 3, 2020)

Recently I had a guest book at the Wyndham Sea Garden. He is asking for $40 back because the resort would not "allow him to check in if he didn't". He was charged $40 for not attending the meeting. Has anyone heard of this EVER happening?
Usually, a guest checks in to the resort prior to even going to guest services to get the parking pass and the meeting sign up pressure. It is always the guest choice if they agree to go to the meeting or not. Yet, I wouldn't put it past someone to pull something like this. If this truly happened I want to follow up with it and I feel like I should refund the money. But if my guest if just trying to pull on over on me because he didn't go to the meeting, I don't want to send the money back.

Thoughts?


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## Panina (Feb 3, 2020)

My guess is when they went to get the parking pass, they were pressured, tired, maybe told they only get free parking if they sign up and  just wanted to get to their room.


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## 55plus (Feb 3, 2020)

Do your guests have a receipt for $40 from the resort? What does it state? Are these friends or renters? Sounds like another scam to access other people's money.


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## ljc50 (Feb 3, 2020)

Renter. My guess is they were tired and just signed up to get the resort to back off, then didn't go to the meeting.


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## SNA27 (Feb 3, 2020)

It's between the guest and Wyndham. My son signed up to attend in December. Here's his tour confirmation. I have highlighted relevant sections. You may want to ask your renter for the Tour Confirmation Email.


Your upcoming tour is confirmed.
Hello,

Get ready to learn about future family vacations, exciting adventures, and the great benefits of timeshare. We can’t wait to share them with you! Here are the details of your upcoming tour.

See you soon!






*YOUR TOUR DETAILS*​

*Location*

*Wyndham Royal Vista *

*Date & Time*

*12/15/2019 9:00 AM *

*Instructions*

*Member Services is located on the 9th Floor. When you exit the elevators, look for directional signage to the reception area. *

*Item(s) to be Received*

*Qty: 1
 Mai-Kai Dinner Show For 1*
_(Verifiable Retail Value: N/A)_
*Qty: 2 
Mai-Kai Dinner Show For 1*
_(Verifiable Retail Value: $100)_

*Payment*


*Refundable Deposit: **$40.00 **Non-Refundable Deposit: **$0.00 **Remaining Balance Due: **$40.00 *


*Transportation*






*To redeem this special promotion, you must be an owner in good standing or meet the following requirements: *


*You must attend a 60-minute timeshare sales presentation. *
*If married, both spouses must attend together. If cohabitating and traveling together, both partners must attend.*
*You are 28 years of age or older, and not a full-time student.*
*You have matching government issued photo IDs and a major credit or debit card (Visa, MasterCard, AMEX, Discover). International guests must bring a valid passport for each adult.*
*You have a minimum household income of $60,000 USD (in New York $75,000) or be 55 years or older and fully retired.*
Please see full Eligibility Requirements and Terms and Conditions below.



*Terms and Conditions

You (and spouse, if married or partner if cohabiting) must attend a timeshare sales presentation with the offering Developer and meet the eligibility requirements identified below:

Non-Owner Eligibility: Must attend a timeshare sales presentation with the offering Developer for the amount of time specified in the above email. This promotional offer is designed for individuals who are 28 or older and have a minimum annual household income of $60,000 USD (in New York $75,000), unless 55 or older and fully retired.

Owner Eligibility: Must attend a 60-minute timeshare sales presentation with the offering Developer and be an owner in good standing.*

Valid government issued photo I.D. (with matching addresses for those cohabitating), or valid passport for international guests, and a major credit card or debit card is required upon check-in. Guests or owners who are showing signs of intoxication that may impair their decision making may not attend the presentation. For purposes of attending the sales presentation, appropriate auxiliary aids or services for individuals with hearing, speech, or vision impairments are available. Requests should be made upon arrival at tour reception.

*If a refundable deposit was collected, it will not be returned to you if you fail to attend your sales presentation (due to state law, this policy does not apply to California, Hawaii, Maryland, Utah, and Wisconsin). See below for additional terms for Hawaii.*

The offering Developer reserves the right to substitute any offered item for one of equal or greater value. Upon the completion of your sales presentation, you will be asked to answer a brief survey, which will help us determine if we met or exceeded your expectations. This presentation occurs in a smoke-free environment. No alcoholic beverages allowed. This offer is not valid with any other promotion.

There is no obligation to purchase anything. Corporate address: 6277 Sea Harbor Drive, Orlando, FL 32821. Information provided for this offer is subject to Developers’ privacy notice located at _clubwyndham.com/privacy._ *Developers and products may vary by state. Void where prohibited by law and where state registration requirements have not been met.

Proposed Future Resort:* The offering Developer cannot guarantee the completion of construction or the future availability proposed future resorts. The purchase of products should not be made in reliance of proposed future resorts.

*Wyndham Vacation Resorts Legal Disclosures:* Developer: Wyndham Vacation Resorts, Inc. inventory offered will vary and may include Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort, Wyndham Grand Desert, or Club Wyndham Access. Harold H. Johnson, Real Estate Broker, N.P. Dodge Company. John E. Calhoun, Arizona Real Estate Broker, Fairfield Flagstaff Realty, Inc. d/b/a Wyndham Vacation Resorts, Inc. Club Wyndham is a registered mark licensed to Wyndham Vacation Resorts, Inc. For NY Residents: Price range of interests offered varies from $11,800 - $92,700, subject to change without notice.

*WorldMark by Wyndham Legal Disclosures:* Developer: WorldMark by Wyndham shall offer WorldMark, The Club. WorldMark Oregon Real Estate Broker WRD Real Estate, Inc. Catherine M. Hoben, Arizona Real Estate Broker, Wyndham Resort Development Corporation d/b/a WorldMark by Wyndham.

*Margaritaville Vacation Club by Wyndham Legal Disclosures:* Developer: Margaritaville Vacation Club by Wyndham, Inc. shall offer Margaritaville Vacation Club by Wyndham. John E. Calhoun, Arizona Real Estate Broker, Fairfield Flagstaff Realty, Inc. d/b/a Wyndham Vacation Resorts, Inc. Wyndham Vacation Resorts is the marketing agent for Margaritaville Vacation Club by Wyndham, Inc.

*Shell Vacation Club Legal Disclosures:* Developer: SVC-West, LLC shall offer Shell Owners Club-West. SVC-Americana, LLC shall offer Shell Owners Club-Americana. Karen Grossman, Arizona Real Estate Broker, Shell Holdings – Arizona, Inc.

THE COMPLETE OFFERING TERMS ARE IN AN OFFERING PLAN AVAILABLE FROM THE DEVELOPER.

*THIS ADVERTISING MATERIAL IS BEING USED FOR THE PURPOSE OF SOLICITING SALES OF TIMESHARE INTERESTS.

ADDITIONAL TERMS AND CONDITIONS FOR SALES PRESENTATION IN HAWAII

If you have received items as part of the marketing promotion prior to attending the sales presentation and you fail to attend the sales presentation as scheduled, or if you fail to meet the eligibility requirements, you will owe the offering Developer the full retail value of the item(s) received. If you fail to arrive for your presentation and have paid a refundable deposit, please visit the front desk to receive your refundable deposit. For questions regarding your tour 808-921-1049.

Wyndham Vacation Resorts Legal Disclosures: Developer: Wyndham Vacation Resorts, Inc. offers two different ownership types: (i) deeded fee simple interests in Wyndham Kona Hawaiian Resort, Wyndham Royal Sea Cliff, Wyndham Vacation Resorts Royal Garden at Waikiki, Wyndham Bali Hai Villas, Wyndham Ka Eo Kai, Wyndham Kauai Beach Villas, Makai Club, Makai Club Cottages, Wyndham Mauna Loa Village, Wyndham Shearwater and Wyndham at Waikiki Beach Walk® and (ii) non-deeded, points based multisite ownership in Club Wyndham Access. Timeshare plan offerings may vary depending on your sales location. Exchange privileges offered in Club Wyndham ® Plus, RCI and (in limited locations) Trading Places International. Prices range between $9,800 - $169,300 and are subject to change without notice. Broker of Record is Wyndham Vacation Resorts, Inc., 75-6016 Kuakini Hwy., Kailua-Kona, HI 96740, 808-921-1049.

WorldMark by Wyndham Legal Disclosures (For Owners Only): Developer: Wyndham Resort Development Corporation d/b/a WorldMark by Wyndham, Inc. (“WbW”) (i) offers a right-to-use points-based membership in WorldMark, The Club.; (ii) offers exchange privileges in RCI; (iii) existing owner purchase price begins at $11,700 and is subject to change without notice; and (iv) Broker of Record is Wyndham Vacation Resorts, Inc., 75-6016 Kuakini Hwy, Kailua-Kona, HI 96740, 808-921-1049.

Shell Vacations Club Legal Disclosures: Developer: SVC-Hawaii, LCC (SVC) (i) offers a right-to-use points-based membership in Shell Owners Club – Hawaii; (ii) offers exchange privileges in Shell Vacations Club and RCI; (iii) prices are subject to change without notice, and range between $9.16 per point with a minimum point purchase of 1,500 points, to $5.79 per point with a minimum point purchase of 10,000 points; (iv) a Club Enrollment Fee of $599, subject to change without notice; and (v) Broker of Record is SVC-Hawaii, LLC., P.O. Box 390429, Kailua-Kona, HI 96739, 808-921-1049.

SVC ACTIVITY REFUND POLICY: All cancellations of activities and refunds require at least 24 hour notice prior to the scheduled time unless the cancellation is due to the fault of the activity vendor. Refunds will be made from the location of the original purchase. The original voucher and credit card slip should be presented for all refunds. If, for any reason, you are unable to return for your refund to the location, please mail your original voucher and credit card slip to our office at: Kauai Coast Resort at the Beachboy, 520 Aleka Loop, Kapaa, HI 96746.*


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## SNA27 (Feb 3, 2020)

Renter's claim of duress is nonsense. It's clearly a refundable deposit. Renter simply failed to collect his refundable deposit in addition to any promised rewards.


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## Richelle (Feb 3, 2020)

I would have the guests call the owner care line and report them. If the guest agreed to go to a meeting, made the deposit, and then didn’t go, it’s on them for not knowing they would lose the money.  Especially if they were told it was a “deposit”. Let owner care tell them that. Tell the guests they would have to call Owner Care to request a refund. You have no way of getting the refund for them. I know they are probably asking you to pay it, but put it on Wyndham. Wyndham is responsible for refunds and it’s out of your hands. by no means should you pay that $40. You didn’t agree to reimburse them if THEY decided to go to a meeting. Nor did you encourage them to go to one. I know you want to play the good guy, but it’s not on you. It’s on the guest and Wyndham. Mostly in the guest probably. 

This is why I tell people they are never required to go and that I recommend they decline. I don’t rent very often, but I know what it’s like to check in.


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## SNA27 (Feb 3, 2020)

He should have called you when the resort 'would not allow him to check in'. I have been to Sea Garden. You go to the Concierge after check-in. It's not possible for Concierge to 'disallow' anything.
I suspect the renter signed up for the rewards but somehow missed the meeting or thought he could just blow it off. He must have gotten a 'tour confirmation' email. It's his problem if he decided to ignore it.

Just so we can learn from this, was this rental on TUG marketplace, eBay, Redweek or Airbnb or some other site?


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## ljc50 (Feb 3, 2020)

I have been to Sea Garden as well and all of the Wyndham resorts you go to the Concierge after check in. Thank you for your help. I can't remember where the rental was from, I'll have to go back and look, but I believe it was Craigslist.

Thank you everyone for your help.


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## Rolltydr (Feb 3, 2020)

ljc50 said:


> Renter. My guess is they were tired and just signed up to get the resort to back off, then didn't go to the meeting.



This is probably true. I’ve been given the same spiel but I can’t remember where. I think La Belle Maison. They only charged $20 at the time. I refused of course. I didn’t want to go in the first place so they gave me an easy out. 


Harry


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## ljc50 (Feb 3, 2020)

Just as a followup. I advised the renter to call Wyndham Owner Services and make a complaint as suggested. He wrote back to say they are sending him a refund. True or not, I no longer feel like I need to do the nice thing.  Thanks again. I really appreciate everyone's help.


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## Jan M. (Feb 3, 2020)

ljc50 said:


> Just as a followup. I advised the renter to call Wyndham Owner Services and make a complaint as suggested. He wrote back to say they are sending him a refund. True or not, I no longer feel like I need to do the nice thing.  Thanks again. I really appreciate everyone's help.



In the future make sure you put this in all caps and bold too in all your listings and PayPal invoices. No timeshare tour or presentation is required.


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## CPNY (Feb 3, 2020)

ljc50 said:


> Renter. My guess is they were tired and just signed up to get the resort to back off, then didn't go to the meeting.


Do you have the renter sign an agreement that any charges incurred during his stay are his responsibility as well as he is bound by all of Wyndhams rules and regulations etc ? Don’t give him anything. It’s his fault he didn’t go to the presentation. They prob lied and said he had to go but we all know that’s a lie


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## geerlijd (Feb 4, 2020)

As a Wyndham owner, Wyndham Sea Gardens is the only resort I've been to where the concierge provides the room keys, not the front desk.  The front desk took my information then pointed me across to the concierge who had my key after trying to sign me up for an update!

This was a surprise to me checking in last year and I was very surprised the resort manager let's the concierge hold the keys hostage until you talk to them.

I could see a determined concierge telling a renter it's mandatory while not providing the keys, there might be some truth to this story.


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## Sandy VDH (Feb 4, 2020)

In the past, this resort manager had been giving better rooms if you attend presentations, don't know if he is still there or if this crap is still going on there.  I had my best friends booked into ocean palms which are more points and he tried putting them into cabanas, stating that is what they booked.  I did warn them and I had them call me if that crap was pulled when they checked in.  Guess what it did happen.  This was a few years ago that Manager could be long gone.


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## ljc50 (Feb 4, 2020)

This is a bunch of unbelievable misuse of power which should be be flagged and called into question!! Sounds like flags should be flying!!


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## capital city (Feb 4, 2020)

Sandy VDH said:


> In the past, this resort manager had been giving better rooms if you attend presentations, don't know if he is still there or if this crap is still going on there.  I had my best friends booked into ocean palms which are more points and he tried putting them into cabanas, stating that is what they booked.  I did warn them and I had them call me if that crap was pulled when they checked in.  Guess what it did happen.  This was a few years ago that Manager could be long gone.


I am in Pompano right now. I have dealt with that asshole before and just seen him 3 days ago at Palm Aire. Wouldnt hand over our keys until we did the presentation and promised the best rooms 2 years ago at Sea Gardens. We declined and then all the sudden our rooms were ready but not the ones he would have upgraded us to. I just about flipped out and really feel like Wyndham is playing with fire by having these people control the front desk.


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## Sandy VDH (Feb 4, 2020)

capital city said:


> I am in Pompano right now. I have dealt with that asshole before and just seen him 3 days ago at Palm Aire. Wouldnt hand over our keys until we did the presentation and promised the best rooms 2 years ago at Sea Gardens. We declined and then all the sudden our rooms were ready but not the ones he would have upgraded us to. I just about flipped out and really feel like Wyndham is playing with fire by having these people control the front desk.




Great, I was kind of hoping he was long gone.  He was at Royal Vista too and wouldn't let owners into the oceanfront building.  He was keeping those units for people who attended and/or purchased.   Are things better at RV.  I don't know?  Any owners who can comment?


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## capital city (Feb 4, 2020)

I'm actually here now. I own here and no matter what cant get a ocean view room but it is snow bird season and I'm not gold or platinum so cant pick a room just make a request and of course they dont care about that. I'll be selling or giving away my contract soon as it hasnt helped owning here at all and the mf are higher then CWA and CWA will get me the same room at 13 months.


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## ljc50 (Feb 5, 2020)

I hope people have his name and are calling in a complaint every time it happens. This is so disgraceful! I had a terrible check in experience last year at Palm Aire, including being put into a unit smaller than booked but I don’t believe it had anything to do with not booking a meeting. Now I’m beginning to wonder,


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## cbyrne1174 (Feb 5, 2020)

I've only researched the 4 pompano beach locations extensively, but haven't been to all of them. Isn't Sea Gardens the worst of the 4? It seems like it's a group of old hotel/condo complexes that were built in the 60s and 70s that have been converted to a single resort with one newer building in the back constructed around 2000. There are no decent ocean views except in the building of studios that is at the water or a few of the higher floors of the newer building. That's at least what I gathered from google/youtube.


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## dstacy969 (Feb 5, 2020)

These kind of hassles are exactly the reason why I just use my ownership and never even consider trying to rent it out to others. I bought to use anyway, nothing else.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## steve_solo (Feb 5, 2020)

cbyrne1174 said:


> I've only researched the 4 pompano beach locations extensively, but haven't been to all of them. Isn't Sea Gardens the worst of the 4? It seems like it's a group of old hotel/condo complexes that were built in the 60s and 70s that have been converted to a single resort with one newer building in the back constructed around 2000. There are no decent ocean views except in the building of studios that is at the water or a few of the higher floors of the newer building. That's at least what I gathered from google/youtube.


Your perception of Sea Gardens is accurate. It looks like Wyndham just bought up some mom and pop motels and called the collection a resort.
The newest building is farthest from the ocean, costs more points, and is marginally nicer.
The place does have 4 pools. One is surrounded by cabanas which are 1970's type motel rooms. We stayed there and it was clean and OK. It was nice having a pool just outside our door. There is also a Tiki bar there where there are snowbird activities several times per day. Trivia , Bingo, etc.
We must have been lucky not to be pushed into a presentation.


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## cbyrne1174 (Feb 6, 2020)

steve_solo said:


> Your perception of Sea Gardens is accurate. It looks like Wyndham just bought up some mom and pop motels and called the collection a resort.
> The newest building is farthest from the ocean, costs more points, and is marginally nicer.
> The place does have 4 pools. One is surrounded by cabanas which are 1970's type motel rooms. We stayed there and it was clean and OK. It was nice having a pool just outside our door. There is also a Tiki bar there where there are snowbird activities several times per day. Trivia , Bingo, etc.
> We must have been lucky not to be pushed into a presentation.




Funny how they'll buy up some crappy motels, but won't buy up/build in the Keys or Fort Meyers area (Naples, Marco Island etc)......


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## ronandjoan (Feb 21, 2020)

Rolltydr said:


> This is probably true. I’ve been given the same spiel but I can’t remember where. I think La Belle Maison. They only charged $20 at the time. I refused of course. I didn’t want to go in the first place so they gave me an easy out.
> 
> 
> Harry


Royal Sea Cliff in HI signed me up anyway, despite my NO and gave me a paper which said I was to go Tuesday or pay $20.  I read this in the fine print when I got to the room.  I was very angry that they did this and went back downstairs and showed it to them ... they were two young guys.  They said, Oh, that’s not for real, it doesn’t mean a thing.  I said, It's in writing.  They repeated that it didn’t mean anything, smirking the whole time.  I made them cross my name off  the Tuesday  list and on the paper they had given me  and initial it. They were really pulling a fast one and thought it was real funny. 
     I have not been back there since.  We like Kona Hawaiian Village ( the old name) across the street better anyway


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## 55plus (Feb 21, 2020)

ronandjoan said:


> Royal Sea Cliff in HI signed me up anyway, despite my NO and gave me a paper which said I was to go Tuesday or pay $20.  I read this in the fine print when I got to the room.  I was very angry that they did this and went back downstairs and showed it to them ... they were two young guys.  They said, Oh, that’s not for real, it doesn’t mean a thing.  I said, It's in writing.  They repeated that it didn’t mean anything, smirking the whole time.  I made them cross my name off  the Tuesday  list and on the paper they had given me  and initial it. They were really pulling a fast one and thought it was real funny.
> I have not been back there since.  We like Kona Hawaiian Village ( the old name) across the street better anyway


You would have had them for fraud if they billed your credit card for $20.


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## winegarden (Feb 22, 2020)

Recently I had a guest book at the Wyndham Sea Garden. He is asking for $40 back because the resort would not "allow him to check in if he didn't". He was charged $40 for not attending the meeting. Has anyone heard of this EVER happening?
Usually, a guest checks in to the resort prior to even going to guest services to get the parking pass and the meeting sign up pressure. It is always the guest choice if they agree to go to the meeting or not. Yet, I wouldn't put it past someone to pull something like this. If this truly happened I want to follow up with it and I feel like I should refund the money. But if my guest if just trying to pull on over on me because he didn't go to the meeting, I don't want to send the money back.

Thoughts?
[/QUOTE]

Yes. i have been asked for a deposit to ensure I attended an "update." I refused, saying that if they didn't trust me, I certainly would not trust them. "Surprisingly enough", the deposit was waved. Not sure which company it was. I will also never turn over my driver's license again either or let them take my grandchildren to a place unknown. I had to threaten to call the police to get them back. That was Diamond for sure.


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## theo (Feb 22, 2020)

Some years ago , we owned a "converted" fixed week at Wyndham Sea Gardens (acquired for next to nothing and used only once before (gladly) giving it away to a fellow Tugger (right *before* Wyndham started charging $299 to acknowledge deed transfers). 

I recall very clearly that Sea Gardens personnel were the most aggressive and relentless I had ever encountered in their efforts to get people to attend a "owner's update". I ultimately confronted the sales weasel who was most persistent (and annoying) in trying to "schedule" me and I (politely, but firmly) communicated that if I heard from him again during my stay, my courteous request and disposition would likely take a decidedly different tone and direction. Not a actionable "threat", but a very clear message.

I never heard from any sales weasels again during our stay. However, during a specific 30 minute absence from my locked unit (which was in the Key West building at Sea Gardens) the following day, my nice Citizen's watch disappeared from the counter on which I had placed it (not in plain view and no housekeeping staff had been in). I never saw that particular sales weasel (...or my watch) again.

I obviously couldn't prove anything, but filed a Police report anyhow; I have never been much of a believer in "coincidence".
In short, I am not at all surprised to learn of a $40 "presentation extortion fee" at Wyndham Sea Gardens. Those years ago, I would have much preferred to pay them a $40 ransom over "sacrificing" my nice Citizens watch.


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## catvag (Feb 22, 2020)

cbyrne1174 said:


> I've only researched the 4 pompano beach locations extensively, but haven't been to all of them. Isn't Sea Gardens the worst of the 4? It seems like it's a group of old hotel/condo complexes that were built in the 60s and 70s that have been converted to a single resort with one newer building in the back constructed around 2000. There are no decent ocean views except in the building of studios that is at the water or a few of the higher floors of the newer building. That's at least what I gathered from google/youtube.


Best TS in the area is in Lauderdale-By-The-Sea (Town adjacent to Pompano) at the Windjammer Resort.  It's been owned by the same wonderful family (The Boutins) for decades.  I've known them for the 20 years I've been an owner.  They're always updating, renovating, innovating.  I highly recommend you check it out.


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## stumahlin (Feb 25, 2020)

This story presents yet another reason to try to take advantage of Wyndham's Ovation program.  Yes, you get exactly ZERO if they take back your points, but -- hey -- you don't have to deal with Wydham anymore.


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## Richelle (Feb 25, 2020)

stumahlin said:


> This story presents yet another reason to try to take advantage of Wyndham's Ovation program. Yes, you get exactly ZERO if they take back your points, but -- hey -- you don't have to deal with Wydham anymore.



It’s also free to the owner and faster then if you gave it away on the private market. Easier as well. They do give you three years worth of points maintenance fee free if you bought direct from Wyndham. The value of those points is more then what they would get on the resale market.


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## glider2 (Feb 26, 2020)

Here's another two cents, for what it's worth. My experience with lots of Wyndham visits is that they will ask for a $20 deposit only after I have agreed to attend an owner's update/sales pitch. The $20 is to ensure I attend; if I fail to show up the $20 is forfeit. The $20 has always been refunded along with whatever enticement they provide after I have completed my meeting. I suspect that your renters may have agreed to attend a sales pitch and then not shown up, thus forfeiting their deposit.


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## dgalati (Feb 26, 2020)

Richelle said:


> It’s also free to the owner and faster then if you gave it away on the private market. Easier as well. They do give you three years worth of points maintenance fee free if you bought direct from Wyndham. The value of those points is more then what they would get on the resale market.


Transfer time once Wyndham receives all paper work and a recorded deed is 15-16 weeks this does not include the 3-4 weeks of time preparing and recording new deed.


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## Richelle (Feb 26, 2020)

dgalati said:


> Transfer time once Wyndham receives all paper work and a recorded deed is 15-16 weeks this does not include the 3-4 weeks of time preparing and recording new deed.



To be clear, Private transfer to another owner takes that long. Ovation is less then 90 days. Mine only took four weeks. I’ve not heard anyone say it took more then 2 months for Ovation.


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