# [ 2017 ] Investment advice



## 3kids4me (Apr 28, 2017)

I'm always managed my own IRA but am starting to reconsider now that:

1.  I'm in my 50s and
2. I just rolled over a fairly decent-sized 401k into my IRA account

How many of you manage your own IRAs vs. having someone else do it?  If you do it yourself, do you spend a lot of time examining ETFs and Mutual Funds and moving things around or do you just pick a couple of things and stick with them?  Do you use an age-based fund? (I've never done this actually because it seems a bit too automatic for my tastes.)

And finally - if you do manage your own IRA, any funds that you particularly favor? 

Thanks for any advice!


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## WinniWoman (Apr 28, 2017)

3kids4me said:


> I'm always managed my own IRA but am starting to reconsider now that:
> 
> 1.  I'm in my 50s and
> 2. I just rolled over a fairly decent-sized 401k into my IRA account
> ...




I am 60 and I have managed our IRAs and 401ks for our whole lives, but have considered getting a financial advisor, but he wants a lot of money and the mutual fund company we use actually provides one for free and also has one of those computerized things you can use as well, which I do. The advisor is not a full service advisor but he does give you advice for how you should be allocated after looking at everything you have with and without their company. We also have our brokerage account with them. Only mutual funds and ETF's in that brokerage account. I don't deal with individual stocks and bonds. Exception is I invest through the Treasury in IBONDS every month.

Yes - I do take some time to read about different funds and ETF's. I inherited some money in 2011 and was faced with having to invest it all, but I managed myself after much research. Of course, I made some mistakes, but nothing drastic.

Generally, I stick with what we have, but after the advice we received I did get rid of our sector funds and upped our stock fund investing, but I did not listen to the advisor as far as having less in cash. I am pretty conservative for the most part, but not overly so in my opinion.

I also do not care for age based funds.  For the inheritance, it is an IRA also and I have to take yearly minimum distributions on it. I decide where to take it from each year, as opposed to the mutual fund company deciding. I just make sure that I sell some shares and put the money in the money market account when the time comes close to when they cut me a check and the take the money out of there. When I do get that check I simply reinvest it in my taxable account essentially in funds I already have in there.

Generally we have the basic type funds- Dividend Paying, Blue Chip, International stock and bond, Small Stock, Mid size stock, Large Stock, Emerging Markets Bond, Corporate Bonds, Tax free Bonds, Municipal Bonds, Floating Rate, Short term Bond, you get the idea.

And I pretty much stick to the 100 minus your age allocation and keep it simple. So in my case, 40% stocks. 60% Bonds/cash.


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## 3kids4me (Apr 28, 2017)

Thanks Mary Ann.  Which company provides a free advisor?  I use Fidelity and the "advisor" they provide tells me he isn't allowed to make any recommendations unless I buy their managed package, which I haven't wanted to do....


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## geekette (Apr 28, 2017)

3kids4me said:


> I'm always managed my own IRA but am starting to reconsider now that:
> 
> 1.  I'm in my 50s and
> 2. I just rolled over a fairly decent-sized 401k into my IRA account
> ...


I manage my own.  If you're going to own funds, there is no reason to pay someone to pick them.  Seriously.  Presumably the brokerage you rolled into has research onboard for you to peruse with hopefully a good Compare tool.      

I own stocks vs funds so it's a different strategy requiring different tactics.  I spend more time with my stocks than a person would with funds.  A fund owner doesn't need to monitor quarterly earnings, annual reports, etc., but I do that.   I don't jump in and out of those, and would not suggest jumping in and out of any investment vehicle.  

I would suggest steering clear of the age-based funds, and just pick a couple index funds that fit your goals and comfort level and reassess annually.  Most likely there will be no need to change anything until you are very close to needing the money.   Watch the expense and turnover ratios.  Turnover refers to their buying and selling.   100% turnover is not a fund I want to own, frankly, and would be suspicious of high turnover in a fund with "index" in its name.  

Index funds will by their nature have lower expenses and are generally "owning the market" of whatever niche the fund is, so you will experience the aggregate highs and lows (S&P 500 index, for example, will have 500 companies in it).  For comfort, stick with big company offerings that have had same management team at helm of whatever performance period you are looking at.  These are pretty easy things for you to do on your own.   Narrow the field to the index funds available to you, that is an easy first step.  Toss out any that require a fee to buy or sell.  

Depending on your risk tolerance, how soon to retirement, other assets, etc., I would suggest a large cap, a small cap and an international fund.  I am not a fan of bond funds.  Note that any international fund will have a higher expense ratio; this is completely normal.  Small cap is likely to have higher expenses than large cap and potentially higher turnover.  Presumably the large cap will be packed with companies you recognize and most of them will be older than your parents.   I would do 60% large cap, 20% sm, 20% int'l and call it a day.

If at some point you think you might want to own stocks, look at top 10 holdings of your funds for ideas.  I would actually suggest that you put a token amount into O, "the monthly dividend company", a well-regarded REIT.  It will keep generating cash in case you want a buffer in the cash portion of your account for comfort or to buy something else, or let the monthly divs compound until you want to see the cash.  Since I am not a fan of bonds, but most people want real estate in some form, I find this to be a good compromise.  I do own it myself and I do enjoy the monthly pay.  

You are rolling over what you invested in 401k all these years, I doubt you need paid help with this, but I can understand feeling jittery.  Even after decades of investing it was a different ballgame to deploy my largest nest egg but I had my 20 companies within 2 weeks of rollover hitting my account.  The key is to have a plan and tweak until you are happy with the plan, then you can deploy without emotion or second-guessing yourself.   

Good luck!


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## WinniWoman (Apr 28, 2017)

3kids4me said:


> Thanks Mary Ann.  Which company provides a free advisor?  I use Fidelity and the "advisor" they provide tells me he isn't allowed to make any recommendations unless I buy their managed package, which I haven't wanted to do....



I use T Rowe Price. You have to have a certain amount of money invested with them.  They have different levels of personal services. The advisor does not tell you what specific funds to invest in, but they run a report on the allocations and then it, of course, prints up what funds of theirs are appropriate, which is fine as you can decide from there. I mostly invest in their funds, but in my brokerage account I have not only some of theirs, but also Vanguard and PIMCO and Dreyfus, some ETFs and so on.

The advisor spends time with you before and after you complete an extensive questionnaire. Then he calls you a second time. Also, I can call anytime with questions. Then he follows up every year as well.


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## WinniWoman (Apr 28, 2017)

Geekette is on the money with the index funds. I always wanted different managed funds- I found index funds boring. But really- the best and least expensive things to invest in are index funds- one for all stocks, one for all bonds and one for international. Simplicity at it's best!


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## 3kids4me (Apr 28, 2017)

Thanks Geekette - this is very helpful advice.  The only thing I'm unfamiliar with are REITs - I've never invested in them.  I do have some individual stocks, mostly that I have picked because of some personal interaction with them or I have gotten into an IPO that I thought would be interesting.  I do like picking a few interesting, individual stocks but realize this shouldn't be overweighted.  The biggest issue I have is being worried about putting too much money in one fund or ETF, and as a result I have too many in my accounts - I really need to get over this!


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## rapmarks (Apr 28, 2017)

When we retired, my husband moved his ira funds to vanguard.  We went through two huge stock market hits, and it still increased to more than six times what he put in and has stayed there despite five years of rmd.  I sure wish I had followed his lead.he left them in the same funds all these years.   


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## tompalm (Apr 28, 2017)

Anyone else that manages your funds will keep you in the stock market and you will have to ride out any corrections or recessions that come along. The difference is some will recommend or ask if you want to be conservative with bonds instead of buying stocks or mutual funds. The closer you get to retirement, the more conservative you should get. The easy way to do that is by using target funds that have a higher percentage of bonds the closer you get to retirement. 

Lots of people say you can't time the market, but there are computer programs that use technical analysis and will send you an email saying go to cash after the market trend lines turn down. That email usually happens after the market has sold off 10 percent, but at least you will not be watching 50 percent of your funds disappear. Once the trend turns up, you will get an email to buy back in and your long term returns will be a lot higher. There is a lot to this program and too much to explain. But the info can be found on this link below. 

http://www.sumgrowth.com/default.aspx

Everything about the program has been back tested and is computer driven data analysis. It has proven itself time and time again over the years.


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## wackymother (Apr 28, 2017)

rapmarks said:


> When we retired, my husband moved his ira funds to vanguard.  We went through two huge stock market hits, and it still increased to more than six times what he put in and has stayed there despite five years of rmd.  I sure wish I had followed his lead.he left them in the same funds all these years.



We also use Vanguard. They have the lowest costs. We do have an advisor, but we've never asked his advice on investing--I think he could give us direction if we wanted it. Mostly we ask for his help when we're moving things around, to make sure the paperwork gets where it's supposed to go. But basically yes, we have everything spread out across different index funds and sector funds. We also have a little bit in individual stocks, mostly for me to fuss around with. We thought about REITs but they seem high now, and we were taking a wait-and-see approach. 

I also have an account at Fidelity from an old job. That's again a mix of funds. It's been sitting in there for years, and it's done okay too, with minimal fussing.


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## breezez (Apr 28, 2017)

I manage my and my wife's IRA's and Roth IRA's

My theory is if talking heads know so much why are they on TV or doing seminars trying to tell me how to make money.   

The reality is with the advances in technology you have basically the same access to data the brokers do.   Only exception are hi frequency trading where they beat people by milliseconds in trade speed.

If you buy a stock or mutual fund you have to be 100% correct it's going to go up to make money.

If you short a stock you have to be 100% correct it's going to go down to make money.

Mutual Funds can be okay, but if you study prospectuses close you will see many undisclosed fees.  Example if a fund had a lot of equity turnover transaction it can charge ridiculous fees to its self for brokerage services for single trades.  These fees are not required to be reported and diminish your returns.

I watched a video from some guys a few years ago were they took an index S&P fund from a major fund provider and they tracked the difference over 20 years on a 1M investment just on the internal transaction fee the fund was absorbing as it traded equities.  They compared this to keeping the same stock mix in a stock account.  At the end of 20 years the private stock account had 32% more value than fund account just because of the fees the brokerage charged the fund to trade to itself.

Other problem with standard mutual funds they lack immediate liquidity should something really bad happen.   Say North Korea hits California with an ICBM Monday shortly after market opens.  Market tanks it's down a few thousand points.  But you can't get out till market close.  Standard funds only transact at market close prices so if you put order to sell at 10:00A EST. and market is crashing it won't process till 4:00pm closing price.

ETF's and ETN's trade during market day and offer greater liquidity and generally have lower internal fees than regular mutual funds.

But if your willing to give up unlimited upside potential of stock for a greater opportunity of success then trade derivatives.  You can be 100% wrong and still make money as a seller if option premium.  The person buying what you are selling has to be directionally right, they have to be correct in the amount of the change, and the speed of the price change to win.   Plus you can define your risk so you know exactly what you can make and lose before you place your trade.

Example yesterday I sold a vertical call spread on AMZN before market close knowing they were announcing earnings at 4:00pm. I sold 950 call bought 952.5 call and collected 80 cents per spread per share I sold 5 of these collect .8x5x100 or $400.   Most I can make $400 most I can loose difference in strike prices less the credit collected.   952.5-950=$2.5 -.8 credit = maximum possible loss of $1.7x100x5 or $850

So I risked $1.7 to make .8. But I have a statistically probability of 76% of winning when I placed the trade which AMZN was trading $918 when I placed trade.

My bet was AMZN was going to stay below $950.8 after earnings once market opened next day today AMZN closed at $924.99 so I win,  I can let spread expire or buy back much lower than I sold it.   I also played the put side and picked up over $1600 on there earnings announcement between puts and call spreads sold.

If you are interested in options and learning about them I would be happy to send you a link to where you can learn as well as get a brokerage account if you don't already have one.   Just PM if interested


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## Talent312 (Apr 28, 2017)

I'm in my 60's and self-manage 4 IRA's (DW & I have a rollover + Roth).  I simplify things by keeping the same set of ETF's & MF's in each of them.  I use a "110 - age" approach for a rough allocation between equities & fixed income.

For the fixed income portion, I use a combination of individual bonds & a floating rate MF. For the equity part, I have 4 ETF's (hi-dividend, large-, mid- and small-cap), and a MF for internationals.

I use Morningstar for performance & expense data and rank candidates on a spreadsheet.  Any ETF or MF that significantly underperforms peer in its category over a suitable period of time is replaced.

It's not rocket-science and it keeps me off the streets at night.

.


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## Maverick1963 (Apr 29, 2017)

I recommend Marc Faber's report. www.gloomboomdoom.com
He manages his own portfolio.  So it's not like analyst report. It's not about day trading, either.
I learn investment ideas for at least one year or longer term, something you would not think of
by yourself.  While there is a lot of information, it is not easy to discern opportunities.
It's $300 for 12 monthly issues.  I started subscription last year and renewed it last month.
It is worthwhile and I would say it's far better than money magazines.


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## VacationForever (Apr 29, 2017)

We use a large wealth management company to manage our investments. They give us options (pros and cons) and they are invested based on our wishes.  The advisor also provides holistic solutions, for example Long Term Care Insurance options - including non-conventional offerings, and other investment solutions which are not included in their annual percentage based commission.  The backend team monitors the fund managers performance and turnover, as well as funds performance and make necessary adjustments. We have a great front end team supporting us, including with banking needs / free wire / short term cash flow solutions etc.  It only costs us 0.8 percent on the managed portfolio.  They do normally charge 1 to 1.25 percent depending on the size of the portfolio.


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## bizaro86 (Apr 29, 2017)

mpumilia said:


> I am 60 and I have managed our IRAs and 401ks for our whole lives, but have considered getting a financial advisor, but he wants a lot of money and the mutual fund company we use actually provides one for free and also has one of those computerized things you can use as well, which I do. The advisor is not a full service advisor but he does give you advice for how you should be allocated after looking at everything you have with and without their company. We also have our brokerage account with them. Only mutual funds and ETF's in that brokerage account. I don't deal with individual stocks and bonds. Exception is I invest through the Treasury in IBONDS every month.
> 
> Yes - I do take some time to read about different funds and ETF's. I inherited some money in 2011 and was faced with having to invest it all, but I managed myself after much research. Of course, I made some mistakes, but nothing drastic.
> 
> ...



If you have a small cap fund, a mid cap fund, and a large cap fund, it might make sense to combine that money into one fund that does everything. You'd likely get the same exposure with lower fees. I like the vanguard total stock market etf.


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## "Roger" (Apr 29, 2017)

3kids4me said:


> Thanks Mary Ann.  Which company provides a free advisor?  I use Fidelity and the "advisor" they provide tells me he isn't allowed to make any recommendations unless I buy their managed package, which I haven't wanted to do....


Strange. I use Fidelity and the adviser provides us with lots of advice. Many of the recommended investments are not associated with Fidelity.


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## cp73 (Apr 29, 2017)

I have always managed our funds. I am a CPA and enjoy this type of stuff. Several years ago I found the bogleheads site and read about their investing theory and started using it. Its basically says all you need are a few low costs  index funds (vanguard or fidelity are good examples) and you will beat about 80% of all other funds. No need to pay advisors. If you pay 1% per year over your lifetime your looking at hundreds of thousands of dollars you will pay them and not do any better. Then all you need to do is rebalance once a year in your appropriate percentages. There is lots of information on this site. Also there you can find a spreadsheet which allows you to backtest almost any type of portfolio using Vanguard funds going back to the early 20's. You can do this for any number of years. They do not believe in market timing and dont let anyone fool you that they can. There are several slight variations of this approach. For example you might just start out with three funds, total stock market, total international stock market, and total bond fund. Based on your age and comfort level then determine what the appropriate percentages are. Another good source I would recommend is Paul Merriman. He has a free weekly podcast on this topic. His approach is similar to the bogleheads. Feel free to pm me with any specific questions.


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## x3 skier (Apr 29, 2017)

I "manage" my IRA and other accounts. I use Vanguard index funds and basically leave them alone. It's split between mostly Stock funds (S&P 500, Dividend payers and small piece of foreign markets) and a Bond fund. 

I figure if the whole stock market goes to hell in a hand basket, everybody will be in the same boat anyway so why fight it. 

Cheers


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## Big Matt (Apr 29, 2017)

Go find yourself a financial planner who can advise you on investment strategies, insurance needs (or not), ways to limit your tax liabilities, etc.  Then consider an investment portfolio that has a mix of stocks/mutual funds, and also investments that yield monthly cash flow such as a rental property.  Just make sure you can get 10-15% yield on the rental property and expect some one time items like replacing appliances, air conditioners, and so on.  The great part about real estate is if worse comes to worse you can either liquidate or just live in it.  Pick areas near colleges, military bases, or in blue collar towns where everyone wants a house, but may not have the funds/credit to own yet.  Use a property manager.


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## Talent312 (Apr 29, 2017)

To me, the issue with an all-in-one fund is that it paints with too broad a stroke.
You can't self-allocate among categories or select better performers within them.

*"If you do manage your own IRA, any funds that you particularly favor?"
*
I track 12-15 ETF's in each category. I'm currently invested in these:
... USMV - Large-Blend, Low Volatility
... SPHD - Large-Value, Hi-Dividend
... IJH - Medium-Blend
... IJR - Small-Blend
For foreign exposure: FMIJX -- an actively-managed fund.
They are all rated 5* by Morningstar.

My IRA's also hold individual bonds laddered to mature at different dates.
... CBS, Citi-Group, E-Trade, Staples, Time-Warner, Viacom, Wyndham...
If their value drops due to interest rate increases, I will still get face-value.

.


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## Berea1 (Apr 29, 2017)

Go to page B6 of the current Investors' Business Daily [May 1, 2017] which shows the top ten Fidelity funds and put 10% of your funds in each;  if you have a fidelity account, the choices are fee free transactions and rebalance once a month, assuming these are IRA accounts so no taxable event when you rebalance.  Patrick


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## geekette (Apr 29, 2017)

Lots of great stuff here, too much to quote well.  

I like owning stocks for simplicity and liquidity, but I like old dividend stocks for reliable payment.  If the economy goes to crap, people will still eat and use toiletries, and will pay the utility bills (gas, elec, water, internet, phone...).   A utility + a telecom + consumer staples puts you in good shape to weather next many years.  Add an industrial or railroad, healthcare (JNJ best of the best), you're set.

REITs are the easy landlord business:  someone else deals with the properties, tenants, maintenance, insurance, leasing, collections...   and sends me a share of profits.  They are best kept in tax sheltered accounts.   Brad Thomas writes extensively about REITs, you can probably find many about O.  Getting paid monthly is very fast compounding, and REITs have higher yields than many other investments.    mREITs are a different beast I do not know much about so I steer clear.

Market prices bounce, divs of good companies keep on coming and you still have the shares if you want to sell later.  Get paid to own.  Simple.   Look at the top 10 holdings in your various funds and you will see similarities, cheaper to make your own fund.  If you buy and hold, reinvest divvies for a few years, you will increase your share count without new money needed.  Companies like PG and MCD have increased my share count by more than 20% in 6 short years (June marks actual 6 yrs so one more payment coming before that for many cos).   My 401k doesn't get more money unless I change jobs or retire, so I decided how much I could feel comfortable putting in any one company and figured on 10-20 companies.  I didn't have to be particularly brilliant to pick those 2, they would be obvious candidates.  

Today I am looking at my own 401k portfolio because I am likely to change jobs in the next few months so will be gaining new money to this account, last infusion until retirement (probably).  Since I very seriously wish to retire in 8 years, I am aiming towards defense, which for me is utilities and consumer staples.  Secondary is growth of dividend so I am not adding to those companies with cut or stagnant div growth or low raisers (reference "CCC List" div champs at dripinvesting dot org   under forms).   

In this portfolio, I wish to build on positions I already have, so it looks like SO, AVA, PG, CL are on my add-to list immediately.   After that, I look at durable industry, in this portfolio I am looking at adding to GPC and NSC, passing on adding to GE, DE, CVX.  O is in this portfolio and I most definitely want more of it.  SYK has been very good to me, but I have a lot of healthcare related in other portfolios, JNJ is on my forever list.  I have KMB in a different portfolio and always want more of it.  

I do think that too many funds is counter-productive.  There is a point at which overlapping diversified funds is cannibalization.  You don't need to own the market many times over.   Add some stocks, 10-20, and reinvest the dividends, then no more than 2 etfs/funds to cover what you don't have, intl and sm cap growth+value.  You've got this, having already owned stocks.   I know, aging bull run, but, companies are reporting higher and higher earnings.  I personally prefer time IN the market to waiting for a pullback that may never come.  When it does come, do you want to be susceptible to the masses panic selling that forces fund managers to liquidate at lows?  No, you don't need that.  

If it makes you feel better, dollar cost average in, or some form of it.  I'm not sure it will be worth your financial while to sit on the cash vs deploy it to be in line for next dividend and start getting your free shs via div reinvestment.    But, there is something to be said for comfort and gaining confidence.  

Whatever you do, seriously, do have a plan.  Goals, strategy, tactics, timeline, rules all that jazz.  Makes it easier to Just Do It when you are ready to deploy, having dealt with everything beforehand and knowing it's the right path.   Give yourself every chance at peaceful sleep.  The market will be there when you're ready.

good luck!


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## cgeidl (Apr 30, 2017)

We joined Personal Finance a couple months ago and the analysis it provides is amazing. It is free and over $300 billion dollars of assets are using the program although they only manage about $4 billion at present.It enables y ou to see all your accounts including insurance and credit cards at once. It gives an interesting cost analysis of your investments. The retirement analysis is really well done and you can plan as many income and expense future events as you desire. I was a CFP for years andam very impressed of the free services but not impressed with the 1% management fee to use their services to manage your investments.


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## Sugarcubesea (Apr 30, 2017)

mpumilia said:


> I am 60 and I have managed our IRAs and 401ks for our whole lives, but have considered getting a financial advisor, but he wants a lot of money and the mutual fund company we use actually provides one for free and also has one of those computerized things you can use as well, which I do. The advisor is not a full service advisor but he does give you advice for how you should be allocated after looking at everything you have with and without their company. We also have our brokerage account with them. Only mutual funds and ETF's in that brokerage account. I don't deal with individual stocks and bonds. Exception is I invest through the Treasury in IBONDS every month.
> 
> Yes - I do take some time to read about different funds and ETF's. I inherited some money in 2011 and was faced with having to invest it all, but I managed myself after much research. Of course, I made some mistakes, but nothing drastic.
> 
> ...



I have T.Rowe Price and they offer a free advisor to me thru my company sponsored 401K / Roth Accounts. I'm also thinking of finding a Financial Advisor but have not had good luck in finding one in my area...


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## WinniWoman (Apr 30, 2017)

Sugarcubesea said:


> I have T.Rowe Price and they offer a free advisor to me thru my company sponsored 401K / Roth Accounts. I'm also thinking of finding a Financial Advisor but have not had good luck in finding one in my area...



Yes- I had the same issue. Not any advisors around these parts. I did find one- and even though he lives on the county below mine, he rents space as needed 2 counties down and does most of the work online and via phone. Still, he wanted a lot of money for a total ongoing type plan and management (like $10,000 per year!) and also wanted to move our money into Ameritrade and I didn't like that. He does offer one time only consultations and also another service with a little bit more consultation. He is certified and he was the only true fee-only (no commissions) based financial planner I could find within a reasonable distance to where we live.

So I am doing more of the same. Just investing and saving in our accounts and hoping for the best without an advisor- at least for now.


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## Sugarcubesea (Apr 30, 2017)

mpumilia said:


> Yes- I had the same issue. Not any advisors around these parts. I did find one- and even though he lives on the county below mine, he rents space as needed 2 counties down and does most of the work online and via phone. Still, he wanted a lot of money for a total ongoing type plan and management (like $10,000 per year!) and also wanted to move our money into Ameritrade and I didn't like that. He does offer one time only consultations and also another service with a little bit more consultation. He is certified and he was the only true fee-only (no commissions) based financial planner I could find within a reasonable distance to where we live.
> 
> So I am doing more of the same. Just investing and saving in our accounts and hoping for the best without an advisor- at least for now.



Thats been my problem --- finding a "certified and true fee-only" advisor is next to impossible.


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## 3kids4me (May 1, 2017)

Thanks for all of this advice!

I'm trying to figure out why O is such a hot buy.  It's down 2% this year and all of the analysts are bearish on it.  Am I missing something?

Thanks!


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## geekette (May 1, 2017)

interest rate fears would be my guess.  They reported last week beating estimates.


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## 3kids4me (May 1, 2017)

Is a "true fee" advisor someone who just charges a percentage of your account every year?  That's what I was considering...choosing one who lets me keep my money where I want (e.g., Fidelity) but manages the money there and does not make money on "selling" me a particular fund or insurance policy or whatever.  My friend uses someone she likes very much who uses this kind of fee model - he is independent and doesn't take actual possession of the money - and I kind of like that versus places where you would actually have to move your money to that place.  He does charge 1 percent though - which seems kind of standard - and I'm wondering if he would make at least 1 percent more than what I would make which is, of course, the only way it would be worth it.  BTW, This guy isn't in my state, but does it matter whether he is or not?


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## x3 skier (May 1, 2017)

I'm amazed that people think hiring and paying an financial advisor of any kind will result in some magic advantage over the vast number of investors who think they can "beat the market". After all the smoke and mirrors and eyes of newts, index funds, either a standard mutual fund or an ETF, reflect the results of all investors, good and bad decisions, economy forecasts, etc. etc. etc.

There are a seeming endless source of free advice from highly reputable firms like Vanguard, Fidelity, T Rowe Price and others regarding prudent allocations of funds for various reasons especially retirement, in particular. These funds have calculators, advisors, publications and other information readily available for free.

It's your money and every dime spent on an advisor is one less dime that could be working much more effectively in an investment. Sure an advisor may have a run of success but the inevitable "reversion to the mean" will eventually result in a run of failure.

My personal experience is that paid advisors may offer some basic advice that can be readily found for free and they offer no more than sophisticated guesses on what the future holds for any investment. Index funds or ETF's reflect the results of every advisor in the universe and because the fees are minuscule, you get everybody's advice for much less than a penny on the dollar.

If you or your advisor think you can pick future stars of the investment universe, put the bulk of your money in indexes and gamble (that's what your doing) the "fun" money on the picks.

Just an anecdote regarding my retirement funds. I've been getting my RMD's for a few years now and I now have more money in my account than when I started receiving them. Since RMD's are planned to exhaust the account when I expire, I suppose this means I'm immortal.  All this without a dime to an advisor and a minimum of study of how to allocate funds drawn from free sources.

Cheers


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## VacationForever (May 1, 2017)

3kids4me said:


> Is a "true fee" advisor someone who just charges a percentage of your account every year?  That's what I was considering...choosing one who lets me keep my money where I want (e.g., Fidelity) but manages the money there and does not make money on "selling" me a particular fund or insurance policy or whatever.  My friend uses someone she likes very much who uses this kind of fee model - he is independent and doesn't take actual possession of the money - and I kind of like that versus places where you would actually have to move your money to that place.  He does charge 1 percent though - which seems kind of standard - and I'm wondering if he would make at least 1 percent more than what I would make which is, of course, the only way it would be worth it.  BTW, This guy isn't in my state, but does it matter whether he is or not?



Fee based is usually charged by the hour.  When it is a percentage to manage, it becomes commission based.  There is not a way to truly manage unless the person has access to the account.  There is NO way I would give access to a 3rd party to my money, unless that money manager is the assigned authority from the weath management company.  Please be careful as to who you give access to your money and the firm you choose.  I had used Fidelity wealth management services in the past and it was not a good experience.  The front end advisor who was assigned was based out of Utah which made communication difficult, not to mention he was not very good.

Remember that you still have full authority on how and where your money should be invested even if you were to use a wealth management company.  I pulled out my managed IRA funds and used another company to buy deferred income annuities because the rep / financial advisor was inexperienced in the area of annuities and I knew exactly what I wanted and I wanted to buy NOW!

There are some products that when bought, someone is going to be paid an upfront commission, like annuities, REIT, insurances, corporate bonds/notes.  Even with wealth management, the account holder has to ultimately decide if it is the right product, and if so, the account holder can always choose to use the wealth manager to purchase the product or someone else.  My wealth manager presented a REIT offering to me which we declined after looking through the literature.  None of these instruments woild be counted in the annual commission since there is no management beyond the initial purchase.

You need to decide if it is worth the 1 percent fee.  If you are disciplined, in all sense of the word, enjoy researching stocks and mutual funds performance - past, present and future, track funds managers, etc.. you may be able to do as well as these professionals.  Weatlh management firms have hundreds of people working behind the scene working on all of these, rebalancing the holdings on a regular basis.  For us, it is another stress that we got rid of by going through a wealth management company.


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## 3kids4me (May 2, 2017)

One of the things I asked this manager that my friend uses (she is a doctor and has used him for many years - although she is completely not interesting in researching stocks/funds at all - I have some interest but sometimes feel overwhelmed by it and don't want to constantly research) how often he would be checking my account for this 1 percent fee.  I expected him to say "every week" but he said "once a quarter" so that was a bit concerning given the fee he would get.  Thoughts?  How often do you think most of these advisors do really check your account?


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## x3 skier (May 2, 2017)

3kids4me said:


> How often do you think most of these advisors do really check your account?



At a minimum, when they are about to send you a bill for their service.

As you can tell, I'm very skeptical of paying for advice. I would guess your Dr friend's advisor is investing in more esoteric vehicles like energy trusts, REIT's or other things that do have more complex effects. In her case, it might be worth having some advice. For the average person with normal investments in stocks and bonds you can do just fine with the available free advice

Cheers


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## geekette (May 2, 2017)

he'll look at your account as soon as he knows it is you on the phone.  overhandling an account is worse than leaving it alone, actually, so that's not a bad thing.  jumping in and out of positions costs you your money.  Rebalancing, imo, is a term to try to legitimize churn on a regular basis.  

skier is right, you don't need an outsider.  You referenced analyst ratings  -- even they do not agree!  You definitely don't need someone to pick funds for you.  The only way to have control of your money is to control your money.  That's why I do it myself.  Even before the internet, plenty of free resources.  

How often do you really need to keep tabs on ATT or PG or SO, and to what extent?   But more importantly, what are you trying to accomplish?  Are you looking to play the market in buy low/ sell high or long term hold or climb onto an IPO for stardust?   Preserve your dough, grow it, lock it up safe, make your life easy....  ?   Are you looking for a plan where you only look once a year or are you wanting to see results monthly, and if so, what kind of results?   

For me it is easier because I concentrate on the dividend flow and largely ignore price action.  Strong companies often get stronger, their earnings show it, regardless of what Mr Market thinks on that given day.  Even on down drafts, my divs keep on churning since they are not price reliant.  

I will keep encouraging you to do this yourself because I know you can, especially if you settle on funds/ETFs.


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## 3kids4me (May 2, 2017)

Thanks all - this has been a really helpful discussion and I appreciate all of the input!

If I don't go with a manager, my next goal should probably be to get out of all my funds and use ETFs instead since they are cheaper.  That's a bit hard to do because the work it would take to research which ETFs would parallel the funds I'm in seems like a lot!


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## WalnutBaron (May 3, 2017)

3kids4me said:


> Thanks all - this has been a really helpful discussion and I appreciate all of the input!
> 
> If I don't go with a manager, my next goal should probably be to get out of all my funds and use ETFs instead since they are cheaper.  That's a bit hard to do because the work it would take to research which ETFs would parallel the funds I'm in seems like a lot!



Hi there...great question you posed, and you've gotten a lot of advice. Can I offer you some thoughts on your planned conversion from mutual funds to ETF's? I have several thoughts, in no particular order of importance:

Be careful about which funds you exit and when. While it is true that the expense ratios on funds are higher--in some cases, _much _higher--than ETF's, you should take a look at which funds are "churning" more than the others you own. Churning (meaning buying and selling stocks or bonds frequently) generally results in a fund taking gains over a period shorter than one year, and therefore resulting in a much higher tax bill for you when you get your 1099. Why? Because the IRS requires that short-term gains be taxed the same as dividends at your standard tax rate. If, on the other hand, your mutual fund manager holds investments for longer than one year, capital gains are taxed at the much-lower long-term capital gains rate of 20%. Get rid of the "churners" first, and be willing to hold on to the long term managed funds, assuming you're achieving an acceptable return.
If you're looking for guidance on ETF's, I first recommend you articulate for yourself a strategy. What kinds of ETF are you looking for, since there are now nearly 2,000 of them to choose from? Geekette has done a great job of explaining her investment objectives and recommended you consider index ETF funds. You can also choose to specialize part of your portfolio in certain sectors of the market like technology stocks or defense stocks or precious metals or any number of options. Identify your objectives first, and then do some research on appropriate ETF's to match those goals.
I'll recommend a couple of great sources for research, both of which will cost you some money, but both of which have been excellent sources for me over the years: Morningstar, which made its name and reputation on evaluation and ratings of mutual funds and has over the past ten years or so expanded into ETF ratings and recommendations; and Zacks, which focuses primarily on a methodology of tracking analyst upgrades or downgrades in stocks (and related funds holding those stocks) to recommend stocks to own based primarily on fundamental analysis.
Depending on what brokerage you use, the included research functions on your broker's website might provide much of this information for free. I use TDAmeritrade, which offers analyst reports from a number of services--including Morningstar--for free.
Best of luck in your decision and future financial and investing success!


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## WinniWoman (May 3, 2017)

I don't know that I would be converting all my mutual funds to ETFs. You use Fidelity- they have a lot of low cost funds. I would really just check the expenses of the funds and maybe just tweak/reallocate a few if necessary. You can add some ETF's. No need to do more work than you have to. Keep it simple.


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## rapmarks (May 3, 2017)

We around tax time, I realize how the mutual funds are killing me.  Big capital gain distributions,  but over all value not equivalent.  Do etf funds generate big capital gains distributions, then dilute the share price like mutual funds?


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## geekette (May 3, 2017)

mpumilia said:


> I don't know that I would be converting all my mutual funds to ETFs. You use Fidelity- they have a lot of low cost
> 
> 
> 3kids4me said:
> ...


There are a couple things to note here.

Mutual funds may or may not have a fee to buy or a minimum.  ETFs do have fees to buy and sell since they are by definition "exchange-traded".  You may get free trades from your broker to offset this.  They will want your business, so if free trades are not part of the deal, ask for them.  You could roll this from broker to broker to capture goodies of cash or trades indefinitely.  I don't choose to do this but just saying one could.  

It may help the process of converting to simply use the names.  Large Cap Growth, SP 500 index, etc., as most likely one to another they will be similar by name matching.  That said, do read at least the parts of the prospectus that tells you what they are designed to do, and then are "allowed" to invest in since this is the heart of the matter.  I would be suspicious if a fund designed to track an index allows holding up to 50% in cash.  Funds that attempt to "equal weight" will have higher expenses due to frequent rebalancing to keep the weight equal.

It sounds like you have not yet rolled, so you can possibly "map" funds you have to new ones.  That has not been my experience, my rolls have always been cash, but if your 401k is in same family this might be possible for you, and could escape buy fees (not sure on that, but, I would ask!)


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## wackymother (May 3, 2017)

A couple of related things. 

When you do check on your investments, and make changes, make sure you check your listed beneficiaries and make sure those are all the way you want them to be. Until pretty recently, I still had an old IRA where my mother was the beneficiary. She died in 2009. If I had died before changing the beneficiary, my money would have gone to her estate (I think). 

Also be sure you have your will in order and compile a list of your investments with account numbers and approximate holdings to keep with your will.


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## WinniWoman (May 3, 2017)

geekette said:


> There are a couple things to note here.
> 
> Mutual funds may or may not have a fee to buy or a minimum.  ETFs do have fees to buy and sell since they are by definition "exchange-traded".  You may get free trades from your broker to offset this.  They will want your business, so if free trades are not part of the deal, ask for them.  You could roll this from broker to broker to capture goodies of cash or trades indefinitely.  I don't choose to do this but just saying one could.
> 
> ...




You can also roll what you have- "in kind" into a Fidelity (0r other) IRA brokerage account and then take your time converting and so on or reallocating or whatever you decide to do. That is what I did with an inherited IRA.


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## Talent312 (May 3, 2017)

My deferred-comp payout will sent to my Rollover IRA on Friday. This means that I'll need to decide how to handle ~$77,000 in cash fairly quickly. This could take up most of my weekend.

I plan to put roughly 50% into 3 individual bonds and a floating-rate MF (Guggenheim), and dollar-cost average (DCA) the rest over the next 4-6 months using no-load, low-fee index funds that mirror my current allocations.

This will mean a fat-addition to my Morningstar watch-list.  I'd prefer to stick with my current ETF's, but multiple broker commissions don't lend themselves to a DCA approach.


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## rapmarks (May 3, 2017)

I want my husband to put our four grandsons as his beneficiary for his ira, not me.  Is there some reason you should not do this


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## 3kids4me (May 3, 2017)

geekette said:


> There are a couple things to note here.
> 
> It sounds like you have not yet rolled, so you can possibly "map" funds you have to new ones.  That has not been my experience, my rolls have always been cash, but if your 401k is in same family this might be possible for you, and could escape buy fees (not sure on that, but, I would ask!)



Already rolled, and my money was only in Vanguard "ETF-replicated funds" in the 401k so I just got those same ETFs with a little bit of variation.  Of course, since the remainder of my current IRA was mostly *not* in those ETFs, this succeeded in adding lots more line items to screen!  The trick now is to reduce that amount of items so I don't have as much to track - and if anyone thinks I'm better off in an ETF that is similar instead some of the following funds I would love suggestions. (Fidelity Balanced, Contrafund, Fidelity Select Telecom, Fidelity Global Equity, Fidelity Small Cap Growth, Fidelity High Income - see...so many!)



Talent312 said:


> This will mean a fat-addition to my Morningstar watch-list.  I'd prefer to stick with my current ETF's, but multiple broker commissions don't lend themselves to a DCA approach.



I never once thought of dollar cost average my rollover - I just dumped it all in.  My commissions at Fidelity are $4.95 so it wouldn't have been the worst thing in the world to do, but I probably would have often forgotten to do it and I don't think you can do any kind of automatic setup.


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## PigsDad (May 3, 2017)

3kids4me said:


> I never once thought of dollar cost average my rollover - I just dumped it all in.  My commissions at Fidelity are $4.95 so it wouldn't have been the worst thing in the world to do, but I probably would have often forgotten to do it *and I don't think you can do any kind of automatic setup*.


Fidelity does support scheduled, automatic investments into mutual funds you currently own in your account.  If you are interested, you can just search for "automatic investments" next time you are in your Fidelity account.

Kurt


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## Talent312 (May 3, 2017)

3kids4me said:


> I never once thought of dollar cost average my rollover - I just dumped it all in.



If I was rolling into a similar funds, I prolly wouldn't bother. But with the Florida Retirement System, who knows where that $$ has been.

As you say, the commissions aren't much -- 5 vehicles x 4 buys each = 20 transactions -- more than I want to pay. At least for now.

.


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## WinniWoman (May 3, 2017)

rapmarks said:


> I want my husband to put our four grandsons as his beneficiary for his ira, not me.  Is there some reason you should not do this
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk




Nope. If you do not need the money, there is no reason why the grandkids cannot be beneficiaries. Just be sure to communicate in writing to them that they should keep the money in an Inherited IRA or they will get killed in taxes if they try to just take the money and spend it. (Again, they can have the money transferred "in kind" and always change the investments as they desire later on). They will have to have it transferred and titled correctly in their individual names as an Inherited IRA and take the minimum distribution required each year. They will pay Federal taxes on the distribution only and possibly state taxes depending on the state they live in. Again, they can invest the money within the IRA however they want. If they are smart, they can make this money last a very long time.

Inheriting money takes great responsibility and should not be squandered.


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## WinniWoman (May 3, 2017)

3kids4me said:


> Already rolled, and my money was only in Vanguard "ETF-replicated funds" in the 401k so I just got those same ETFs with a little bit of variation.  Of course, since the remainder of my current IRA was mostly *not* in those ETFs, this succeeded in adding lots more line items to screen!  The trick now is to reduce that amount of items so I don't have as much to track - and if anyone thinks I'm better off in an ETF that is similar instead some of the following funds I would love suggestions. (Fidelity Balanced, Contrafund, Fidelity Select Telecom, Fidelity Global Equity, Fidelity Small Cap Growth, Fidelity High Income - see...so many!)
> 
> 
> 
> I never once thought of dollar cost average my rollover - I just dumped it all in.  My commissions at Fidelity are $4.95 so it wouldn't have been the worst thing in the world to do, but I probably would have often forgotten to do it and I don't think you can do any kind of automatic setup.




Those Fidelity Funds seem good- the Contrafund is excellent. I am not sure of your age, but the advisor from T Rowe Price and my well off brother both told me to get out of sector funds. I am 60 and my husband is 63. So, I got rid of my Healthcare, Financial, Gold, Silver, Utilities, Commodoties, etc. So if you are older, maybe ditch the Telecom one.


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## WinniWoman (May 3, 2017)

I


Talent312 said:


> My deferred-comp payout will sent to my Rollover IRA on Friday. This means that I'll need to decide how to handle ~$77,000 in cash fairly quickly. This could take up most of my weekend.
> 
> I plan to put roughly 50% into 3 individual bonds and a floating-rate MF (Guggenheim), and dollar-cost average (DCA) the rest over the next 4-6 months using no-load, low-fee index funds that mirror my current allocations.
> 
> This will mean a fat-addition to my Morningstar watch-list.  I'd prefer to stick with my current ETF's, but multiple broker commissions don't lend themselves to a DCA approach.


 

I have been reading lately that you are better off for the most part just putting all your money to work immediately rather than dollar cost averaging. The experts have evidently done research that shows you do much better with returns this way, even if the market declines for awhile.


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## rapmarks (May 3, 2017)

mpumilia said:


> Nope. If you do not need the money, there is no reason why the grandkids cannot be beneficiaries. Just be sure to communicate in writing to them that they should keep the money in an Inherited IRA or they will get killed in taxes if they try to just take the money and spend it. (Again, they can have the money transferred "in kind" and always change the investments as they desire later on). They will have to have it transferred and titled correctly in their individual names as an Inherited IRA and take the minimum distribution required each year. They will pay Federal taxes on the distribution only and possibly state taxes depending on the state they live in. Again, they can invest the money within the IRA however they want. If they are smart, they can make this money last a very long time.
> 
> Inheriting money takes great responsibility and should not be squandered.



My grandsons are 2, 5, 5, and 7,   So they wouldn't understand, but they can spread those payments out and they might help for college.  My aunt left all six nieces and nephews one fund, some spent it and some saved it.  My daughter is one that had it spent fast, my son saved it.   Raised in same house, what happened 


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## wackymother (May 3, 2017)

rapmarks said:


> My grandsons are 2, 5, 5, and 7,   So they wouldn't understand, but they can spread those payments out and they might help for college.  My aunt left all six nieces and nephews one fund, some spent it and some saved it.  My daughter is one that had it spent fast, my son saved it.   Raised in same house, what happened



Many advisors agree that it is better not to put large sums of money in the name of minors, for this very reason. You don't know how that child will use the money when he reaches 18. You want them to use the money for college or buying a house, but the young person might have other ideas. Either way, it's their money to use as they like. 

I think you can also arrange to have the money go into a trust that distributes when the grandkids turn 25 or 30 or even older. You need an estate-planning lawyer to help with this. 

Also, when a married person changes their primary beneficiary to someone other than their spouse, the spouse has to sign paperwork showing that she understands that this is happening.


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## WinniWoman (May 4, 2017)

rapmarks said:


> My grandsons are 2, 5, 5, and 7,   So they wouldn't understand, but they can spread those payments out and they might help for college.  My aunt left all six nieces and nephews one fund, some spent it and some saved it.  My daughter is one that had it spent fast, my son saved it.   Raised in same house, what happened
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



I inherited an IRA in 2011. I take the minimum distributions each year and the mutual fund company takes the Federal tax out before I get it, so that is taken care of. In NYS, because my mom was over 59 1/2 when she died (she was 81), I do not have to pay tax on it. (I thought that I had to be 59 1/2 in order for it to be tax free to me- and I ended up overpaying NYS taxes since 2011. I am now in the process of amending some returns to get some of the money back from NYS. The law here says only the DECEASED had to have been over 59 1/2, not the recipient, in order for it to be free of NYS income taxes)

Meanwhile, there is more money in the account than when I inherited it thanks to good returns. Maybe you can appoint an adult to oversee it for your grandchildren, like in a trust or an executor or something like that.


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## MOXJO7282 (May 4, 2017)

I'm struggling with the question as to hire an advisor to help with our portfolio. We have 401k, IRAs and a brokage account that I've always managed and very well I might add but my concern now is as we get older I'd like to reduce our risk so trying to understand how to do that without reducing my upside potential.  I also can get a free advisor from either TRowe or Fidelity and think I will do that but assume they will only give you so much help until they try to charge you.

As for stock picks- I have a philosophy to buy and hold stocks of companies we spend significantly as a family, or I've worked for and are good companies, especially those that are known to be good to their employees and that are industry leaders. This has worked out well and I don't really buy a stock based on anything else so i'm not an analytics kind of guy. 

For instance I bought Amazon (this is my biggest score, at $51) and also bought Costco, Marrriott, the Vacation Club AA, Netflix, Cablevision, Disney, MetLife, Facebook, Prudential and Lowes early. These are companies I know intimately in some way because of the reasons mentioned and any free money I find to invest I just buy more of one of these stocks.  They've just produced so well for me and i don't have the time or inclination to do other research so obviously I miss a lot of other opportunities but I stick to what works. 

My only investment shortcoming is I've invested so much in my Marriott rental units I've never had a big amount to invest or otherwise I'd be sitting on several million instead of several 100K but my rental program has actually produced a similar return so I'm not complaining one bit.


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## geekette (May 4, 2017)

mpumilia said:


> I have been reading lately that you are better off for the most part just putting all your money to work immediately rather than dollar cost averaging. The experts have evidently done research that shows you do much better with returns this way, even if the market declines for awhile.



I think this is a mixed bag and no perfect answer, but do note I don't believe there are any experts.  

Since I am not going for "returns" it doesn't much matter for me what they say.  I am in favor of whatever the specific investor is comfortable with.  

I deployed my 401k in one fell swoop to numerous stocks, no funds.  DCA is, in my opinion, much more relevant to stocks than funds.  NAV is much more difficult to divine or "play".  

Invest to your risk tolerance and sleep well at night comfort level.


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## geekette (May 4, 2017)

rapmarks said:


> Raised in same house, what happened


My brother, sister and I are very different when it comes to money.  We are different people with different goals and life experiences.  Growing up in same house is no indicator of sameness on any issue.


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## Elan (May 4, 2017)

Our company's 401K is run through Fidelity.  Periodically, a bunch of us in my work group would compare our YTD percentage returns on our 401K accounts.  One year, our group manager decided to try the paid account management service that Fidelity offers.  That year, almost all of us beat his returns.  Yes, it's anecdotal, but I think for longer term accounts, just putting a good portion of one's portfolio in an index tracking fund is a very simple and effective way to go.  Mix in a bond fund and adjust asset allocation as you age.


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## geekette (May 4, 2017)

mpumilia said:


> Those Fidelity Funds seem good- the Contrafund is excellent. I am not sure of your age, but the advisor from T Rowe Price and my well off brother both told me to get out of sector funds. I am 60 and my husband is 63. So, I got rid of my Healthcare, Financial, Gold, Silver, Utilities, Commodoties, etc. So if you are older, maybe ditch the Telecom one.


I disagree with this.  If anything, Telecom is not going away.  Look around at how many people can't put their phones down for even a meal with friends.

Utilities, also, long haul durable.  Why avoid them?  Who is going to go without electricity, water, heat/cooling?  

I am not keen on commodities or precious metals, and would prefer to pick my own financial companies to invest in, so, yeah, ditching those is easy.  I guess I don't understand why have concentrated sector funds In Addition To the more diversified holdings?


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## Talent312 (May 4, 2017)

Tidbit:  I talked to a TD Ameritrade branch manager today who told me that, once their takeover of Scottrade is complete, many Scottrade branches (including one near me) will become TD Ameritrade branches.

.


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## rapmarks (May 4, 2017)

geekette said:


> I disagree with this.  If anything, Telecom is not going away.  Look around at how many people can't put their phones down for even a meal with friends.
> 
> Utilities, also, long haul durable.  Why avoid them?  Who is going to go without electricity, water, heat/cooling?
> 
> I am not keen on commodities or precious metals, and would prefer to pick my own financial companies to invest in, so, yeah, ditching those is easy.  I guess I don't understand why have concentrated sector funds In Addition To the more diversified holdings?



I agree, certain utilities provide a nice income stream and growth


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## WinniWoman (May 5, 2017)

geekette said:


> I disagree with this.  If anything, Telecom is not going away.  Look around at how many people can't put their phones down for even a meal with friends.
> 
> Utilities, also, long haul durable.  Why avoid them?  Who is going to go without electricity, water, heat/cooling?
> 
> I am not keen on commodities or precious metals, and would prefer to pick my own financial companies to invest in, so, yeah, ditching those is easy.  I guess I don't understand why have concentrated sector funds In Addition To the more diversified holdings?




Well, I think this is the point. If you have diversified funds there is no need for sector funds, unless you are betting on a boost from them for your portfolio, which is why I has some. I think probably there are plenty of utility companies in a diversified dividend fund, for example. I really wanted to keep mine, but felt better when I saw that sector went down for a while at least after I sold it, but my diversified fund held steady.

In addition, I remember when I was invested in a Technology fund and the market crashed- I think it was at the time of he bombing of the WTC. After looking at our depleted balance in that fund, I took it as a sign and I decided to pull it all out and pay off our house as it was the exact amount of the mortgage pay off. Best thing we ever did.

The advice I was given was based on our ages, so that is a big part of it.


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## Big Matt (May 6, 2017)

I'm going to post again since I don't think I explained what I meant earlier and many of the posters here are mixing apples and oranges.

My advice is to get a financial advisor/planner.  Generally these folks give advice, but don't manage anything.  The biggest thing that they can do that almost nobody can do on their own is to understand all of the tax laws and include that in the investment strategy.  This is by far the biggest way to increase your yield and income.  Same with insurance.  They don't sell it, but can help you understand how much to hold, if any and what type (term).  They get paid by the visit and in my mind vastly exceed anything else you will ever get anywhere else because there is no conflict of interest.  

Compare that with any brokerage house or stock broker.  They get paid whether they do well or not and as many people have mentioned they probably aren't any better than another.  They are SELLING things to you, not giving advice.   Understand why Fidelity likes to push Fidelity funds rather than individual stocks?  Understand why Allstate still tries to peddle whole life and annuities?


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## WinniWoman (May 7, 2017)

Big Matt said:


> I'm going to post again since I don't think I explained what I meant earlier and many of the posters here are mixing apples and oranges.
> 
> My advice is to get a financial advisor/planner.  Generally these folks give advice, but don't manage anything.  The biggest thing that they can do that almost nobody can do on their own is to understand all of the tax laws and include that in the investment strategy.  This is by far the biggest way to increase your yield and income.  Same with insurance.  They don't sell it, but can help you understand how much to hold, if any and what type (term).  They get paid by the visit and in my mind vastly exceed anything else you will ever get anywhere else because there is no conflict of interest.
> 
> Compare that with any brokerage house or stock broker.  They get paid whether they do well or not and as many people have mentioned they probably aren't any better than another.  They are SELLING things to you, not giving advice.   Understand why Fidelity likes to push Fidelity funds rather than individual stocks?  Understand why Allstate still tries to peddle whole life and annuities?



The issue is- it is hard to find one. Even the so-called fee only certified ones want to manage your money for you. They will have plans that give you advice and they will charge a set fee or by the hour. But, they still really want to go for the management because that is where the money is for them. And, I can't help but wonder if they will almost "withhold" some information to get you to move your money over to their practice.


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## Brett (May 8, 2017)

mpumilia said:


> The issue is- it is hard to find one. Even the so-called fee only certified ones want to manage your money for you. They will have plans that give you advice and they will charge a set fee or by the hour. But, they still really want to go for the management because that is where the money is for them. And, I can't help but wonder if they will almost "withhold" some information to get you to move your money over to their practice.



true,  Charles Schwab is now pushing a % portfolio fee arrangement, they used to have a set dollar or hourly fee for financial advice.
http://www.schwab.com/public/schwab/investment_advice/intelligent_advisory

The Wall Street Journal today (5/8/17) has several good articles on fees charged by major financial firms for portfolio advice


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## Miss Marty (Jun 8, 2017)

*If you inherit a traditional IRA, you are called a beneficiary.*

A beneficiary can be any person or entity the owner chooses
to receive the benefits of the IRA after he or she dies.

Beneficiaries of a traditional IRA must include in their gross income
any taxable distributions they receive.

*IRA
Pub 590 B*

*https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p590b.pdf*


*Are IRA distributions taxable in New York State?*

The *state* of *New York* has a *state* income tax, but residents benefit from an exemption on some of their retirement income that offers more favorable tax treatment than federal law. As a result, *IRA distributions* up to a certain amount don't get *taxed* for *New York state* income tax purposes.

https://www.tax.ny.gov


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## MuranoJo (Jun 9, 2017)

This may be one good reason to hire a financial manager at some point:  What about aging, when we have trouble making decisions, when we're worried about leaving a spouse who isn't as financially savvy?  Sure, you can set the account(s) to autopay, but really someone needs to be making decisions.


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## WinniWoman (Jun 9, 2017)

Miss Marty said:


> *If you inherit a traditional IRA, you are called a beneficiary.*
> 
> A beneficiary can be any person or entity the owner chooses
> to receive the benefits of the IRA after he or she dies.
> ...



Further- in NYS- with an inherited IRA that is properly re-titled (and split) amongst the beneficiaries- if the deceased person was over 59 1/2 years old, the beneficiaries do not have to pay taxes on the required RMDs each year. If the deceased was under 59 1/2, the beneficiaries have to pay taxes on the required yearly RMD's- UNLESS they themselves are over 59 1/2.


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## rapmarks (Jun 9, 2017)

MuranoJo said:


> This may be one good reason to hire a financial manager at some point:  What about aging, when we have trouble making decisions, when we're worried about leaving a spouse who isn't as financially savvy?  Sure, you can set the account(s) to autopay, but really someone needs to be making decisions.



We were told that is why you have a trust with two trustees, and have a successor trustee set to step in.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## VacationForever (Jun 9, 2017)

mpumilia said:


> Further- in NYS- with an inherited IRA that is properly re-titled (and split) amongst the beneficiaries- if the deceased person was over 59 1/2 years old, the beneficiaries do not have to pay taxes on the required RMDs each year. If the deceased was under 59 1/2, the beneficiaries have to pay taxes on the required yearly RMD's- UNLESS they themselves are over 59 1/2.


I want to add that from what I read, the limit of exemption in NYS is up to 20K a year.


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## geekette (Jun 9, 2017)

rapmarks said:


> We were told that is why you have a trust with two trustees, and have a successor trustee set to step in.


Yes.  I plan to lock up my assets in a trust and have a brother and a sister to be trustee 1 and 2. 

My portfolios can go on autopilot until empty so long as bank accounts to distribute to are kept updated.  There won't really be decisions that need to be made in managing it.  But, no two people I trust more than my sibs to make the few necessary.


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## rapmarks (Jun 9, 2017)

geekette said:


> Yes.  I plan to lock up my assets in a trust and have a brother and a sister to be trustee 1 and 2.
> 
> My portfolios can go on autopilot until empty so long as bank accounts to distribute to are kept updated.  There won't really be decisions that need to be made in managing it.  But, no two people I trust more than my sibs to make the few necessary.



We have my son, and next my daughter.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## MuranoJo (Jun 10, 2017)

Thx for advice.  We're long overdue for a lawyer to set these things up I guess.


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## MULTIZ321 (Oct 29, 2021)

Minimizing Taxes When You Inherit Money : Kiplinger.










						Minimizing Taxes When You Inherit Money | Kiplinger
					

Some inherited assets are tax-friendly, but under new rules, others come with a hefty tax bill. We help you get the most out of a legacy.



					www.kiplinger.com
				



.


Richard


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## GaroldJH (Oct 30, 2021)

Honestly, I'm just getting familiar with the subject. It's all too new and unknown for me. I don't have as much capital as you do yet.


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## geekette (Oct 30, 2021)

GaroldJH said:


> Honestly, I'm just getting familiar with the subject. It's all too new and unknown for me. I don't have as much capital as you do yet.


I hope you are very young, as having decades to grow your nest egg is really helpful!

Learn what you can, and sock it away.  Mistakes are inevitable, make them with small money sooner vs big money later.   Try not to look at your accounts often.   Money growth is very slow and it's better to not obsess over every little market move, because that occurs every day, all day, and you have better things to do!   For some of us, this was super easy before internet, and quarterly statements were good enough.

Good luck!


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## wackymother (Oct 30, 2021)

Another thread revived from long ago! 

Recently Vanguard asked us to designate a "trusted person" to be contacted if we start doing anything crazy with our money there, or if it seems like we might be the victim of financial abuse. Discussed on this page, you might need to scroll down.





__





						Security Center | Vanguard
					

Vanguard online security center.




					investor.vanguard.com


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## bogey21 (Oct 30, 2021)

rapmarks said:


> My grandsons are 2, 5, 5, and 7,   So they wouldn't understand, but they can spread those payments out and they might help for college.  My aunt left all six nieces and nephews one fund, some spent it and some saved it.



I don't know if Financial Planners agree with me or not as I have never talked to one.  But what I did as far as college for my Grandkids was to open large 529 Account for each of them with my Daughter as Owner of the Accounts.  The beauty of this is that the accounts earn tax free and are not taxable when withdrawn if used for College.  In addition if one of her kids doesn't go to college she can transfer the funds from that kids account without penalty to the ones who do go to college...

George


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## rapmarks (Oct 30, 2021)

bogey21 said:


> I don't know if Financial Planners agree with me or not as I have never talked to one.  But what I did as far as college for my Grandkids was to open large 529 Account for each of them with my Daughter as Owner of the Accounts.  The beauty of this is that the accounts earn tax free and are not taxable when withdrawn if used for College.  In addition if one of her kids doesn't go to college she can transfer the funds from that kids account without penalty to the ones who do go to college...
> 
> George


I have those set up too, the post quoted was fromm5 years ago


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## rapmarks (Oct 30, 2021)

A thread from five years ago resurrected and the rules for inherited iras have changed significantly


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## CalGalTraveler (Oct 30, 2021)

@WinniWoman Great choice on T Rowe Price. I needed to reverse rollover my personal IRAs into my company 401k so we could do backdoor roth contributions without taxable gain consequences. So I asset transfered the TRowePrice funds but had to close the IRA. I would work with TRowe Price again if I have the opportunity and am glad I kept my funds as they have done extremely well.

I have always managed our own portfolio. Any errors I may have made have been more than made up by the management fees we saved over the years.


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## CalGalTraveler (Oct 30, 2021)

For those trying to figure out if the upcoming legislation will increase tax and capital gains rates and back-door and mega Roths - it appears that all of those provisions have been removed except for super wealthy as of Thursday (sigh of relief!) Below is a financial planning newsletter which I follow: _[Note: I have supplied this for tax planning, please stick to the tax changes and avoid political discussion]_









						Weekend Reading for Financial Planners (Oct 30-31) 2021
					

Enjoy the current installment of “Weekend Reading For Financial Planners” – this week’s edition kicks off with a (Twitter-based) breakdown of the final text of President Biden’s latest “Build Back Better” Act, which is perhaps more notable from a financial planning perspective for what parts of...




					www.kitces.com
				




_"On Thursday, the U.S. House of Representatives released the final text ..__.__of the framework.... Over the course of six weeks of negotiations, the bill was significantly scaled back ... * Among the items in that version that did not make it into the final text were increases to the top ordinary income and capital gains tax brackets, restrictions on Roth contributions or conversions for high-income earners (meaning that – at least for now – the ‘Backdoor Roth’ strategy is preserved), *new RMDs on mega-sized IRAs, reductions to the estate and gift tax exemption, and rules curtailing the use of grantor trusts. The tax increases that are in the bill mainly apply to specific high-income individuals: for example, the bill would make S corporation profits for individuals earning over $400K (single filers) and $500K (married filing jointly) subject to Net Investment Income Tax (NIIT), and all Modified Adjusted Gross Income (MAGI) over $10MM would subject to a new 5% surtax (with an additional 3% surtax for MAGI over $25MM)."

[Emphasis mine]_


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## MULTIZ321 (Nov 1, 2021)

Backdoor Roth, a tax strategy favored by the rich, survives in Democrats' latest plan.










						Backdoor Roth, a tax strategy favored by the rich, survives in Democrats’ latest plan
					

A House tax plan would have killed tax strategies used by the wealthy to get more money into Roth IRAs. The new Build Back Better framework keeps them.




					www.cnbc.com
				



.


Richard


----------



## MULTIZ321 (Nov 9, 2021)

3 'Strong Buy' Stocks Goldman Sachs Predicts Will
 Soar at Least 60%










						3 ‘Strong Buy’ Stocks Goldman Sachs Predicts Will Soar at Least 60%
					

U.S. stocks have been on a roll. The SP 500 closed Monday at a new record high and was up for the eight consecutive positive day — its longest streak of ...




					www.tipranks.com
				





Richard


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## Brett (Nov 9, 2021)

MULTIZ321 said:


> 3 'Strong Buy' Stocks Goldman Sachs Predicts Will
> Soar at Least 60%
> 
> 
> ...



Note the prices of these amazing stocks that analysts say will soar 60% next year and see if the forecast is correct


----------



## MULTIZ321 (Nov 12, 2021)

2 "Strong Buy" Stocks Under $10 With Triple-Digit
 Upside.










						2 “Strong Buy” Stocks Under $10 With Triple-Digit Upside
					

Investors are constantly looking for stocks that will yield massive returns. That being said, finding these stocks can seem like an overwhelming task. Not to mentio...




					www.tipranks.com
				





Richard


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## MULTIZ321 (Nov 22, 2021)

Are These Finance Stocks Undervalued Right Now?










						Are These Finance Stocks Undervalued Right Now?
					

Here at Zacks, our focus is on the proven Zacks Rank system, which emphasizes earnings estimates and estimate revisions to find great stocks. Nevertheless, we are always paying attention to...




					www.entrepreneur.com
				





Richard


----------



## MULTIZ321 (Nov 22, 2021)

4 High Yield Closed-End Funds For Your Income
 Portfolio










						4 High Yield Closed-End Funds For Your Income Portfolio - Dividend Strategists
					

Regardless of the discount or premium to NAV, I believe the more important aspect is the subsequent total return.




					www.thestreet.com
				





Richard


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## easyrider (Nov 22, 2021)

wackymother said:


> Another thread revived from long ago!
> 
> Recently Vanguard asked us to designate a "trusted person" to be contacted if we start doing anything crazy with our money there, or if it seems like we might be the victim of financial abuse. Discussed on this page, you might need to scroll down.
> 
> ...



We had some Vanguard products as did my inlaws. They appointed me as their designated account manager should something happen to them but they didn't tell me. I found out I had access to all financial instruments after they created a trust which was probably a good 5 years after they put me on their accounts. Their attorney told me. I thought that was strange but I guess it makes sense. 

Bill


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## wackymother (Nov 22, 2021)

easyrider said:


> We had some Vanguard products as did my inlaws. They appointed me as their designated account manager should something happen to them but they didn't tell me. I found out I had access to all financial instruments after they created a trust which was probably a good 5 years after they put me on their accounts. Their attorney told me. I thought that was strange but I guess it makes sense.
> 
> Bill



This doesn't put the "trusted person" on the accounts. It's just in case you start moving money around in ways that don't mesh with your actions in previous years. Unfortunately we've had a case of elder abuse in our family, so we're sensitive to that kind of situation.


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## Brett (Nov 22, 2021)

wackymother said:


> This doesn't put the "trusted person" on the accounts. It's just in case you start moving money around in ways that don't mesh with your actions in previous years. Unfortunately we've had a case of elder abuse in our family, so we're sensitive to that kind of situation.



yes, for Schwab it's confirmation, not permitting access to a financial account


----------



## easyrider (Nov 22, 2021)

Brett said:


> yes, for Schwab it's confirmation, not permitting access to a financial account
> 
> 
> View attachment 42596



What do they consider possible financial exploitation ? 

Bill


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## wackymother (Nov 23, 2021)

easyrider said:


> What do they consider possible financial exploitation ?
> 
> Bill



Not sure. I suspect if it's you start taking money out in an uncharacteristic way. Like if you haven't touched your money in years and you suddenly start taking out large sums, or making a lot of transactions. If you're someone who does a lot of churning, it's probably not as easy to spot problems. Although--our credit cards have pretty amazing algorithms to detect fraud, so I suspect Vanguard does too.


----------



## MULTIZ321 (Nov 24, 2021)

Energy Storage is the Next 'Mega Theme;' These 2
 Stocks Are Poised to Benefit










						Energy Storage Is the Next ‘Mega Theme;’ These 2 Stocks Are Poised to Benefit
					

Electric vehicles. Renewable energy. Wind farms and solar arrays. These are the technologies that will ‘lead the way’ of the next century’s industrial trends. They ...




					www.tipranks.com
				





Richard


----------



## MULTIZ321 (Nov 26, 2021)

Dividend Increases: 14 Stocks That Have Doubled Their Payouts : Kiplinger










						Dividend Increases: 14 Stocks That Have Doubled Their Payouts | Kiplinger
					

Looking for companies executing substantial dividend increases? These 14 stocks have upped the payout ante by a minimum of 100% this year.



					www.kiplinger.com
				





Richard


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