# Former RCI Employee Willing to CANDIDLY Help



## Cynic

Hello everyone,

I'm a veteran RCI employee, no longer with the company. I'm willing to answer any and all questions you may have about exchanging your timeshare.

Much of how the system works is simply not disclosed to consumers, and I'd like to be instrumental in changing that.

I'm going to start a YouTube channel on this topic, and your questions will help me focus on issues most relevant to you.

I never signed a non-disclosure agreement with RCI, and own no stock in any timeshare developer or exchange.

My one and only goal is giving you the most accurate, helpful, and honest information possible.

Ask away, and you will be answered.

EDIT TO ADD: I know most about weeks, and my explanations of value and trading power are likely to be based on RW value, reflected in weeksexchanges and aftermarket purchases. A 90k timeshare may sell for 1k or less aftermarket. It's the nature of the beast.


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## melissy123

what is the best time of day or night to run a manual search?
Are the ongoing searches really only prioritized by the date the search started?


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## Cynic

@melissy123: 1) Depends on what's being searched for, as different resorts have different banking practices. Manual searches are most effectively used when searching less than 14 days in advance, honestly...other than that ongoing is your best friend; put it in as far ahead as possible, and keep in mind you can edit it later.

2) Weeks, I assume? Absolutely not. Trading power, which is largely determined by location, time of year, and how far in advance it was spacebanked, is also a significant factor. Although unit size and strata are also factors, they are far less significant as long as your strata is not too HIGH for what you want.


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## Jayco29D

I have trouble finding high quality RCI resorts. Besides Hilton, which RCI resorts would you consider to be at least 4+ star quality equivalent to Disney, Marriott, Westin, and Four Seasons? These are the timeshares I own. I can use RCI and The Registry with my Disney membership but I have only found a couple places on The Registry I would consider. I think The Registry Collection does not have enough properties and they are not as nice as Elite Alliance, in general, which I can use with the Four Seasons. I can’t find anywhere I would want to stay at within RCI. I think Interval has an overall better mix of high quality properties.


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## Cynic

@Jayco29D  Have you looked at the Manhattan Club? Your question is basically about what's high in strata, and that honestly means far less than location and time of year as far as exchanging.

Non-Disney McFivestars are a dime a dozen on the resale market, but still high in cost of ownership and risky in that they can change how your points work if/when they feel like it; I'd personally take a total dive small unit with very high trading power, as there is no real limit in trading up in strata... more flexibility and bang for buck.


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## Jayco29D

Cynic said:


> @Jayco29D  Have you looked at the Manhattan Club? Your question is basically about what's high in strata, and that honestly means far less than location and time of year as far as exchanging.
> 
> Non-Disney points are basically worthless as far as real-world value, although many people love the McFivestars as far as their personal use. You're talking to the guy who goes for low MF dives as I'm all about trading power or rentability.



I guess what you are saying is RCI does not have equivalent level accommodations to the typical Disney, Westin, Hyatt or Marriott. Manhattan Club would not interest me in terms of location. We do not do big city vacations like NYC or Las Vegas. I used to live in Manhattan in my 20s so I love NYC but too hectic for me now. I have never traded my timeshares. I buy to use but I will probably eventually consider purchasing some Getaways at Marriott (II has many for purchase without exchanging) as well as doing internal exchanging with my Westin StarOptions and using Elite Alliance with my Four Seasons. I just can’t find anything on RCI to use my Disney Vacation Club points for if we decide some years not to go to WDW, Disneyland or Aulani. I wish DVC would move to Interval or elsewhere.


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## Cynic

@Jayco29D Let me clarify: RCI gets you a lot of high quality stuff, but it's mostly stuff you already have access to, as most McFivestars are compatible with both II and RCI. The primary advantage of RCI is far more total locations, many of which will be unavailable/ VEP down for you (but in locations that are more appealing to more users). II has less total, but almost as many in your range. I'm not convinced RCI will give you much more than what you already have, as strata is your thing (and your high srata is not as important as trading power in RCI, which you may or may not have) . Disney chooses RCI for reasons that appeal to a larger number of users than users such as yourself, which I realize does you no good. Why they don't do II too is anyone's guess.


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## Cynic

This brings up something many people don't understand: having the nicest five-star, gold crown will NOT necessarily open up the most stuff for you in RCI. I could likely get more with any unit, any size, at the place in Hershey, PA than a 2/2 Embassy Suites owner in Hawaii could. Why? Supply and demand.


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## alwysonvac

What’s the deal with Disney? Years ago it was easy to book a two or three bedroom unit. I would get multiple matches. Now you’re lucky if you’re able to book a one bedroom.

How common are these exclusive exchange agreements? We’ve noticed that Wyndham owners have access to more Disney inventory than the general RCI public. For example, they were the only ones getting matches at Disney’s Aulani resorts. How much of the Disney exchange inventory is going to these exclusive agreements?

On the flip side as a Disney timeshare owner, I see RCI exchange inventory that my other timeshare resorts (HGVC and WorldMark) don’t see. It’s more than just Wyndham inventory. Does the exclusive inventory that is held back for DVC owners ever become available to the RCI general public? For example if an ongoing search is setup by a non-Disney owner for inventory that is currently being held, will RCI pull the inventory for the non-Disney to satisfy the ongoing search request?

Thanks and Welcome to TUG.


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## heathpack

I own a Sheraton Broadway Plantation unit, summer season, although I don’t believe I can book a specific week to deposit.

I usually trade with this in II but wonder sometimes what could be done with it in RCI.  I have been reluctant to pay an RCI membership fee to find out, that just another expense that I don’t need, being an II member already with other weeks I own.

Say I prepaid my MF, joined RCI, and deposited the week, do you have a sense for what I might have better access to in RCI that I couldn’t get in II?  

Our priorities: We like resorts where we can get some serious mountain biking in.  We’d love to drive (from LA) and be able to bring two small dogs (I heard RCI has some pet-friendly timeshares.). We would also consider a big trip to Europe or the South Pacific.  How about good city based timeshares?  Can I easily upgrade in unit size?  We are sailors, I know one can trade into Tradewinds with RCI, are there other boat based trades of good quality?

Basically: is there good stuff in RCI that RCI employees know to be very different from IIs inventory?

Some specific questions:
1.  What could I expect trying to trade in to Hilton’s like those on Oahu, the Big Island or Scotland?
2.  What boat-based timeshares are available?
3.  What are the gem locations that RCI covers but II does not?
4.  Are there great pet-friendly units to be had?

We own Hyatt, Disney, Marriott and Starwood, so our tastes run towards the upscale.  But we don’t typically care about elaborate resorts (just want a pool and hot tub) and clean/not totally outdated are fine by us.


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## Cynic

@alwysonvac There's a learning curve with timeshare. If I owned Disney, I'd deposit studios into weeks, as far in advance as possible. I'd attempt to get the most valuable time available to deposit. When a property or chain opens, newbie owners will be learning things. They will be putting large units in, and you'll see a lot more availability than you will once they learn the ropes. Yes, the larger unit may pull a bit more... but rule of thumb is, better to have the ability to get two smaller units at a resort, even if they aren't right next to eachother, if it's where you really want to go, than trade your whole 2-3 bedroom for a hotel room or studio and have nothing left to be playing with for that year.

I once saw a couple, both school teachers with zero flexibility on dates, trade a whole free-standing 2-bedroom house in the FL keys for a hotel room right on the Vegas strip during Easter... had they locked that house off, they likely could have gotten two hotel rooms at the same property, or two separate weeks of vacation. I doubt half the house (as they owned a holiday or summer week themselves, fixed, and the keys is one of the more valuable locations per lack of deposits) would have failed to pull that hotel room.

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "exclusive exchange agreement". Wyndham properties vary widely in real value. The one in San Antonio, TX (not what you'd think of as a highly sought-after vacation destination, I know) is worth far more than the one in Hawaii or Orlando, for instance, all other factors being equal. Supply and demand. Look at the basic lack of RCI properties in San Antonio.

Worldmark and HGVC are older and more common than Disney. Beyond that, it's largely where and when. Once again, location and time of year trump strata. 

RCI shouldn't pull property off hold for any non-VIP or non-comp user under ordinary circumstances. Things are generally only pulled off hold by advisors fixing problems behind the scenes, under 14 days, or by the special VIP team (if that's still around, I've heard conflicting things from resort employees). Being VIP has/had nothing to do with buying a timeshare; it's who you are (read manager at a resort, Chrystal's friend, etc). The people that did the RCI employee vacations could also pull stuff off hold under 14 days; all bets are off at that point, and true insanity can happen. I once saw Lehigh Acres get Manhatten Club this way.

Thanks for the welcome


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## Cynic

@heathpack You have a very good trader @ SBP. It's nice, but not so nice as to greatly limit where you can trade into. You may discover a lot if you decide to test. With RCI, flexibility is huge. I don't recommend shopping specific properties; rather shop an experience. RCI guides are trained to find you the TYPE of vacation you want.

There are so many places with mountain biking I can't began to list them. 

My only experience with II is staying in their resorts as a guest. Overall, I noticed they have less stuff, better consumer disclosures, and search first... RCI search first is very limited. 

1) I recall easily sending many with lower TP than you to Hilton properties in Hawaii, especially on Big Island. I don't recall specifics. Oahu was the most sought-after island by RCI members, but you own something more valuable as far as trading than the majority of them. Largely how far in advance you do it, and what gets put in. I didn't have enough people looking for Scotland to really remember anything at all there, besides the fact that people generally had specific resorts, and I often had stuff bigger/ better than what they thought they could get at places very different from what they were thinking. With RCI it's often best to have an experience in mind vs a specific destination or resort. 
2) I generally liked sending people to Tradewinds. Which one was up to their dates. It's different, intimate, and reasonably nice. People generally raved about those.
3) I don't know enough about II inventory and actual swaps. Gem locations in RCI are your cities, your USA summer beaches, your big international stuff, etc. I've sent people to palaces in turkey, apartments and hotel rooms from Sanfran to New Orleans to Prague, French, Italian and Swiss Alps, beaches all over the world, odd parts of Latin America, etc, but the bread and butter was stuff I don't know if you'd want. We had a LOT of people wanting things like Orlando, Vegas, Hawaii, Branson, Cancun, etc. 
4) I don't recall offhand what RCI resorts accommodate pets, it was not a commonly requested thing.


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## paxsarah

Cynic said:


> There's a learning curve with timeshare. If I owned Disney, I'd deposit studios into weeks, as far in advance as possible. I'd attempt to get the most valuable time available to deposit. When a property or chain opens, newbie owners will be learning things. They will be putting large units in, and you'll see a lot more availability than you will once they learn the ropes. Yes, the larger unit may pull a bit more... but rule of thumb is, better to have the ability to get two smaller units at a resort, even if they aren't right next to eachother, if it's where you really want to go, than trade your whole 2-3 bedroom for a hotel room or studio and have nothing left to be playing with for that year.



This doesn't really make any sense to me in terms of what I've learned/experienced about RCI exchanges into Disney (using my Wyndham points). I thought Disney centrally decided what to deposit to RCI, not individual owners choosing particular units. And in recent years, it's clear DVC has decided to deposit almost exclusively 1 bedrooms, and the vast majority at SSR.


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## tschwa2

Cynic said:


> @alwysonvac There's a learning curve with timeshare. If I owned Disney, I'd deposit studios into weeks, as far in advance as possible. I'd attempt to get the most valuable time available to deposit. When a property or chain opens, newbie owners will be learning things. They will be putting large units in, and you'll see a lot more availability than you will once they learn the ropes. Yes, the larger unit may pull a bit more... but rule of thumb is, better to have the ability to get two smaller units at a resort, even if they aren't right next to eachother, if it's where you really want to go, than trade your whole 2-3 bedroom for a hotel room or studio and have nothing left to be playing with for that year.
> 
> I once saw a couple, both school teachers with zero flexibility on dates, trade a whole free-standing 2-bedroom house in the FL keys for a hotel room right on the Vegas strip during Easter... had they locked that house off, they likely could have gotten two hotel rooms at the same property, or two separate weeks of vacation. I doubt half the house (as they owned a holiday or summer week themselves, fixed, and the keys is one of the more valuable locations per lack of deposits) would have failed to pull that hotel room.
> 
> I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "exclusive exchange agreement". Wyndham properties vary widely in real value. The one in San Antonio, TX (not what you'd think of as a highly sought-after vacation destination, I know) is worth far more than the one in Hawaii or Orlando, for instance, all other factors being equal. Supply and demand. Look at the basic lack of RCI properties in San Antonio.
> 
> Worldmark and HGVC are older and more common than Disney. Beyond that, it's largely where and when. Once again, location and time of year trump strata.
> 
> RCI shouldn't pull property off hold for any non-VIP or non-comp user under ordinary circumstances. Things are generally only pulled off hold by advisors fixing problems behind the scenes, under 14 days, or by the special VIP team (if that's still around, I've heard conflicting things from resort employees). Being VIP has/had nothing to do with buying a timeshare; it's who you are (read manager at a resort, Chrystal's friend, etc). The people that did the RCI employee vacations could also pull stuff off hold under 14 days; all bets are off at that point, and true insanity can happen. I once saw Lehigh Acres get Manhatten Club this way.
> 
> Thanks for the welcome



I would think you realize this but you don't seem to from this post- Many owners in systems with points can not reserve and deposit a specific unit.  There are crossover grids and they can only deposit points and then the developer picks the specific unit.  They are not given a trading value.  The points required are based on size and season.  It shouldn't matter whether what Hilton or Wyndham or Bluegreen deposits because they do bulk deposits as required by their contract and the members are given the credit based on the grids.

Also are you saying a 50 tpu (trading power units) whether from a combined deposit is not the same as 50 tpu from Orlando or from Hershey.  Once they are points int the tpu system, matching should be based on the date of the OGS as long as you have enough trading power units for the desired exchange.


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## tschwa2

alwysonvac said:


> How common are these exclusive exchange agreements? We’ve noticed that Wyndham owners have access to more Disney inventory than the general RCI public. For example, they were the only ones getting matches at Disney’s Aulani resorts. How much of the Disney exchange inventory is going to these exclusive agreements?


I think the reason you saw more Aulani go to Wyndham (and Hilton too and RCI points) is they put in their OGS 2-4 years in advance.  Points owners that don't actually have to deposit points at the time the request is made can set up an OGS 2 years in advance and keep adding time onto the request. A weeks owner has to use a specific deposit and that specific deposit expires.   If they use a different deposit they need to set up a new OGS.  They get the match because they have the oldest searches going for the few units that are deposited.


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## alwysonvac

Hi Cynic,

Let me try asking my questions again. I don't think I was clear. 

I'm trying to understand what has changed on the RCI side with respect to exchanges into Disney. I'm not trying to trade my Disney timeshare. If you don't know the answer to any of my questions, just say so. It's fine.  

Thanks again for taking the time to share.

_Question #1_
_What’s the deal with exchanges into Disney Vacation Club (DVC)? Years ago it was easy to get a two or three bedroom DVC Orlando resort via an RCI exchange. I would get multiple DVC exchange matches using my WorldMark and HGVC timeshares. Now you’re lucky if you’re able to exchange into a one bedroom at a DVC Orlando resort. The TUG community has noticed the dramatic change in exchange availability but we don't know why. Do you?_

_Question #2_
_We’ve noticed that Wyndham owners have access to more DVC inventory than the general RCI public. For example, Wyndham owners were the only ones getting confirmed exchanges into Disney’s Aulani resorts. There were other TUG members such as mysellf that had very old ongoing search requests using our WorldMark and HGVC timeshares however our searches were not getting matches. I was specifically told that there is an existing private agreement between Wyndham and Disney that allows Disney to give inventory directly to Wyndham Vacation owners. This inventory is separate and not part of RCI’s Deposit Inventory. Wyndham’s RCI members are having their ongoing search requests fulfilled through this exclusive pool of Disney inventory. How common are these RCI Private Exchange agreements? How much of the Disney exchange inventory is going to these separate agreements? _

_Question #3_
_On the flip side as a Disney timeshare owner, I see online RCI exchange inventory that my other timeshare resorts (HGVC and WorldMark) don’t see. It’s more than just online Wyndham inventory. I've logged into RCI using via my DVC timeshare and compared it to what I see when I log into RCI using my HGVC timeshare. RCI is displaying more desireable online RCI resorts & weeks to Disney owners than to HGVC and WorldMark owners.  Does the online RCI inventory that is shown to DVC owners ever become available to the RCI general public? For example, if I see online inventory that is displayed to DVC owners only and I setup an ongoing search using my HGVC or WorldMark timeshare would RCI satisfy my ongoing search request. Or is the online inventory shown to DVC owners, only available to DVC members._​
Thanks Again


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## alwysonvac

tschwa2 said:


> I think the reason you saw more Aulani go to Wyndham (and Hilton too and RCI points) is they put in their OGS 2-4 years in advance.  Points owners that don't actually have to deposit points at the time the request is made can set up an OGS 2 years in advance and keep adding time onto the request. A weeks owner has to use a specific deposit and that specific deposit expires.   If they use a different deposit they need to set up a new OGS.  They get the match because they have the oldest searches going for the few units that are deposited.



This is not true for my case. With help from my fellow TUG members, we were able to compare the original date of request.

_NOTE: Both HGVC and WorldMark don’t require a deposit and can extend their RCI search requests beyond two years._


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## tschwa2

alwysonvac said:


> This is not true for my case. With help from my fellow TUG members, we were able to compare the original date of request.
> 
> _NOTE: Both HGVC and WorldMark don’t require a deposit and can extend their RCI search requests beyond two years._


Was your unfullfilled requests for the same dates?  I have seen Wyndham, RCI points and Hilton posts that have matched with Alunani.  I can't recall anyone from WorldMark posting a match.  I believe every post that had a match had a 2+ year search going. Unfortunately a single instance could have been a glitch and not a pattern.  Although it could be programmed that way.  I don't think this particular employee is going to have enough experience in multiple aspects (IT, customer service, management, and resort contracts with RCI ) to answer many or our questions.


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## alwysonvac

Please allow the OP to respond without speaking on their behalf.
Thanks


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## MIDisfan

tschwa2 said:


> Was your unfullfilled requests for the same dates?  I have seen Wyndham, RCI points and Hilton posts that have matched with Alunani.  I can't recall anyone from WorldMark posting a match.  I believe every post that had a match had a 2+ year search going. Unfortunately a single instance could have been a glitch and not a pattern.  Although it could be programmed that way.  I don't think this particular employee is going to have enough experience in multiple aspects (IT, customer service, management, and resort contracts with RCI ) to answer many or our questions.



I can confirm the same experience as Alwysonvac. I had a search in on the weeks and points side of RCI for Aulani and I kept moving the dates back which extended them out over 2+ years. A fellow tugger matched for my dates through the Wyndham portal with a search started after both of mine. Since the patterns with the Disney deposits have changed, I have not seen anyone match to Aulani except for Wyndham members. I have not seen a person match on the Points side or through HGVC. I could be wrong. Can you point me to the thread that you saw otherwise since i don't believe it's in the Disney stickies in the sightings board


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## tschwa2

MIDisfan said:


> I can confirm the same experience as Alwysonvac. I had a search in on the weeks and points side of RCI for Aulani and I kept moving the dates back which extended them out over 2+ years. A fellow tugger matched for my dates through the Wyndham portal with a search started after both of mine. Since the patterns with the Disney deposits have changed, I have not seen anyone match to Aulani except for Wyndham members. I have not seen a person match on the Points side or through HGVC. I could be wrong. Can you point me to the thread that you saw otherwise since i don't believe it's in the Disney stickies in the sightings board


I reviewed sightings.  There were a few Hilton but they were all 2015 or earlier.  I could have sworn I saw an RCI points member -I believe with Grandview points but it might have been Wed101something who has both but actually confirmed with Wyndham points.  There was one post that thought perhaps the HGVC long term search portal was broken.  There was also one match by a Wyndham owner that saw one in open inventory that did not match to his/her 22 month search.


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## alwysonvac

Aulani was originally available to all RCI members, you can find all of the old Aulani threads on the Sightings forum. But then it suddenly stopped (sometime in 2015?) and only Wyndham owners from that point on reported Aulani matches.


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## alwysonvac

MIDisfan said:


> I can confirm the same experience as Alwysonvac. I had a search in on the weeks and points side of RCI for Aulani and I kept moving the dates back which extended them out over 2+ years. A fellow tugger matched for my dates through the Wyndham portal with a search started after both of mine. Since the patterns with the Disney deposits have changed, I have not seen anyone match to Aulani except for Wyndham members. I have not seen a person match on the Points side or through HGVC. I could be wrong. Can you point me to the thread that you saw otherwise since i don't believe it's in the Disney stickies in the sightings board



I went a step further and provided documentation to HGVC for investigation
https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php...rmed-via-the-hgvc-portal.237613/#post-1850311

I posted the outcome on the Sighting forum in early 2016 and summarized the response in this thread under “QUESTION #2”
http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=237599

There was nothing wrong with the HGVC portal.


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## MIDisfan

tschwa2 said:


> I reviewed sightings.  There were a few Hilton but they were all 2015 or earlier.  I could have sworn I saw an RCI points member -I believe with Grandview points but it might have been Wed101something who has both but actually confirmed with Wyndham points.  There was one post that thought perhaps the HGVC long term search portal was broken.  *There was also one match by a Wyndham owner that saw one in open inventory that did not match to his/her 22 month search.*



I'll take your word on that because i'm not going to go back through all the Disney threads lol. I just never recall that circumstance and only recall 2 or 3 matches to Aulani after the deposit pattern change. Bnoble and Wed101(?) both matching to 2BD units I recall clearly but never anything sitting in open inventory. The owner of the Grandview points account matched prior to the change I believe.


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## T-Dot-Traveller

Cynic said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> I'm a veteran RCI employee, no longer with the company.
> I'm going to start a YouTube channel on this topic, and your questions will help me focus on issues most relevant to you.
> 
> I never signed a non-disclosure agreement with RCI
> 
> Ask away, and you will be answered.



RE : New website - you may wish to do a YouTube lesson on how to use the map section 
for both street view and full screen Google map view .
It is a little convoluted - BUT is one of the (few)TRUE UPGRADES and I find it much more useful than the map function on the prior ( 2016 & earlier ) website .

Do you have any insight into the reason for 10 resorts  per page  / when the prior website allowed 25 per page ?

Thank You -


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## Cynic

paxsarah said:


> This doesn't really make any sense to me in terms of what I've learned/experienced about RCI exchanges into Disney (using my Wyndham points). I thought Disney centrally decided what to deposit to RCI, not individual owners choosing particular units. And in recent years, it's clear DVC has decided to deposit almost exclusively 1 bedrooms, and the vast majority at SSR.



All apologies. You're right. Most points resorts do bulk-bank. The few owners who can get around that are likely insiders, or grandfathered from the good old days, which is not even applicable to Disney. Scratch much of what I said re: DIsney, except the higher value of Disney vs other points-based clubs, which is evidenced in both weeks and resale market.  If I can't exercise any control of what is spacebanked I'm basically playing Russian Roulette, which is why I'm no fan of either full floats or points. 

I can clearly see I'm going to need to refrain from speculation or general information when people have very specific questions. Thanks.


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## Cynic

tschwa2 said:


> Also are you saying a 50 tpu (trading power units) whether from a combined deposit is not the same as 50 tpu from Orlando or from Hershey.  Once they are points int the tpu system, matching should be based on the date of the OGS as long as you have enough trading power units for the desired exchange.



I'm saying something much simpler: there is one Hershey and a bajillion Orlandos. Therefore, a hotel room in Hershey is worth... a lot more space in a more common area like Orlando. All exchange systems are susceptible to all sorts of complex manipulation from confidential resort agreements that render the theory quite different from the reality. That's why I would only buy a deeded week. I can't generally rent "points" out for 1-2x MF. I can easily buy a "used" deed and do it all day, however, and such units can also be traded for stuff most points owners can't access. Your example of 50, 50, or 50 ignores resort contracts. 50 can be 100 per a clause, depending on where and where.


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## Cynic

alwysonvac said:


> _Question #1_
> _What’s the deal with exchanges into Disney Vacation Club (DVC)? Years ago it was easy to get a two or three bedroom DVC Orlando resort via an RCI exchange. I would get multiple DVC exchange matches using my WorldMark and HGVC timeshares. Now you’re lucky if you’re able to exchange into a one bedroom at a DVC Orlando resort. The TUG community has noticed the dramatic change in exchange availability but we don't know why. Do you?_
> ​



I don't know specifically, but I know in the aftermarket Disney has actual value today, vs most other McFivestar points are worth almost nothing. Draw your own conclusions from that. What I previously said was general BSING the owner type stuff, which we were trained to do from day one. Sorry.




alwysonvac said:


> _Question #2_
> _We’ve noticed that Wyndham owners have access to more DVC inventory than the general RCI public. For example, Wyndham owners were the only ones getting confirmed exchanges into Disney’s Aulani resorts. There were other TUG members such as mysellf that had very old ongoing search requests using our WorldMark and HGVC timeshares however our searches were not getting matches. I was specifically told that there is an existing private agreement between Wyndham and Disney that allows Disney to give inventory directly to Wyndham Vacation owners. This inventory is separate and not part of RCI’s Deposit Inventory. Wyndham’s RCI members are having their ongoing search requests fulfilled through this exclusive pool of Disney inventory. How common are these RCI Private Exchange agreements? How much of the Disney exchange inventory is going to these separate agreements? _



Wyndham = RCI. I recall some crap of a similar nature with Fairfield long ago. Don't you love corporate America?



alwysonvac said:


> _Question #3_





alwysonvac said:


> _On the flip side as a Disney timeshare owner, I see online RCI exchange inventory that my other timeshare resorts (HGVC and WorldMark) don’t see. It’s more than just online Wyndham inventory. I've logged into RCI using via my DVC timeshare and compared it to what I see when I log into RCI using my HGVC timeshare. RCI is displaying more desireable online RCI resorts & weeks to Disney owners than to HGVC and WorldMark owners.  Does the online RCI inventory that is shown to DVC owners ever become available to the RCI general public? For example, if I see online inventory that is displayed to DVC owners only and I setup an ongoing search using my HGVC or WorldMark timeshare would RCI satisfy my ongoing search request. Or is the online inventory shown to DVC owners, only available to DVC members._





alwysonvac said:


> Thanks Again


See above about the secondary market, which represents RW value. And you're welcome.


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## Cynic

Also, if I offended anyone with "McFivestar" I apologize. I just realized it makes them sound cheap, which was not intentional. I was referring to the chains of high quality newer resorts purchased as vacation club points. Retail prices of ALL timeshares are unreasonable.


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## tschwa2

Cynic said:


> I'm saying something much simpler: there is one Hershey and a bajillion Orlandos. Therefore, a hotel room in Hershey is worth... a lot more space in a more common area like Orlando. All exchange systems are susceptible to all sorts of complex manipulation from confidential resort agreements that render the theory quite different from the reality. That's why I would only buy a deeded week. I can't generally rent "points" out for 1-2x MF. I can easily buy a "used" deed and do it all day, however, and such units can also be traded for stuff most points owners can't access. Your example of 50, 50, or 50 ignores resort contracts. 50 can be 100 per a clause, depending on where and where.


What specifically did you do for RCI?  I don't know what "50 can be 100 per a clause, depending on where and where" means. 

 RCI awards tpu's that range between 1-60.  RCI's evaluations don't always make sense.  I own a summer week at Hershey by the way and I don't deposit it because RCI's evaluation is low IMO.  If I were to deposit a week 26 2 BR 2019 Hershey deposit now I would get 38 tpu's.  If I deposit a 2 BR Summer Bay (in Orlando) week 52 for 2018, I am awarded 39 tpu's.  Are you saying that if I started an ongoing search for the same hard to get resort the 38 point Hershey summer week would match before the 39 tpu Orlando week, even if Orlando search was started first?  What if I had a 120 point combined credit from various resorts and was looking for something that normally goes for 50 points, would my 38 point Hershey week match at all as the points requirement for what I am looking at is higher than I have with that deposit?  

Yes I agree if an agent was helping their friend Tina or Jane they might be able to manipulate the system to match but if a regular ongoing search is in place would the system look at where the tpu's come from or are they just programmed to match by date and minimum trading power reached.


----------



## Cynic

T-Dot-Traveller said:


> RE : New website - you may wish to do a YouTube lesson on how to use the map section
> for both street view and full screen Google map view .
> It is a little convoluted - BUT is one of the (few)TRUE UPGRADES and I find it much more useful than the map function on the prior ( 2016 & earlier ) website .
> 
> Do you have any insight into the reason for 10 resorts  per page  / when the prior website allowed 25 per page ?
> 
> Thank You -


Thanks. I personally miss the old internal DOS system. PF17 to over-ride, etc. Internally, we always had something much more complicated with many more tricks. By the time we could even see what members saw online I was heading behind the frontlines. And now I'm showing my age)


----------



## SmithOp

I dont think you will offend TUG members, we know retail is way overpriced, but some of us like McFivestar resorts as you call them.

How high do you think RCI can take its fees?  I have given up exchanging with RCI due to fees, will only do cash rental of last calls.  I prefer to trade points within my McFivestar system.

I got rid of my last RCI enrolled contract, but membership is still active, do you think they will notice if I keep my account open but never deposit?  I’ve done the same thing with Interval and they keep giving me accomodation certificates for cheap last call type weeks.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Cynic

tschwa2 said:


> What specifically did you do for RCI?  I don't know what "50 can be 100 per a clause, depending on where and where" means.
> 
> RCI awards tpu's that range between 1-60.  RCI's evaluations don't always make sense.  I own a summer week at Hershey by the way and I don't deposit it because RCI's evaluation is low IMO.  If I were to deposit a week 26 2 BR 2019 Hershey deposit now I would get 38 tpu's.  If I deposit a 2 BR Summer Bay (in Orlando) week 52 for 2018, I am awarded 39 tpu's.  Are you saying that if I started an ongoing search for the same hard to get resort the 38 point Hershey summer week would match before the 39 tpu Orlando week, even if Orlando search was started first?  What if I had a 120 point combined credit from various resorts and was looking for something that normally goes for 50 points, would my 38 point Hershey week match at all as the points requirement for what I am looking at is higher than I have with that deposit?
> 
> Yes I agree if an agent was helping their friend Tina or Jane they might be able to manipulate the system to match but if a regular ongoing search is in place would the system look at where the tpu's come from or are they just programmed to match by date and minimum trading power reached.



Now we're getting  somewhere. There are 3 tiers of upgrades. 100 is not official, nor is pink an official color. But there is an override system, and certain data-mods can apply. T1 (+10), t2 (+20), or a TU(+ nth) upgrades can be automatic and hidden depending on what is seeking what. A clause in the RCI contract with a specific resort can basically make your 38 a 58, or even above 60, in other words, depending on where it's attempting to trade into. Naturally you don't see that.

I started as an inbound vacation guide in weeks. Over time you can be trained in additional skillsets. I learned outbound, advising, and a bit of Worldmark, for instance. I ended up on the bridge before they canned me.

I don't see anything shocking that the Summer Bay property is worth what it is for that specific week. The Hershey for week 26 if spacebanked now would be losing a lot more TP than the Summer Bay solely per almost 1 year vs 6 months advance spacebank. To max the 26 you'd have to have deposited it last July. Do they allow you to pay your MF early? It should be much closer to 60 if spacebanked 12 months in advance. I hope that helps.


----------



## tschwa2

I was comparing a 2019 hershey (full value) with a 2018 summer bay (full value). 
 If there was an agreement to give owners at certain resorts more trading power- why wouldn't they just give them those points on deposit rather than have a known value of x with a hidden value of x+10.  I would imagine that the deal is with the developer who is still in active sales and either for an agreement to deposit Y number of extra units per year (in the hundreds or even lower thousands) that RCI can use for extra vacations, last calls and extra exchnages.  In return RCI will give deposits at those resorts more power and more power that owners at those resorts can see.  That is why Vacation Villages and Massanutten often get higher tpu's than you would expect for a resort with 1000's of available units system wide.   Are you saying that at the smaller resorts that don't have deals but are highly valued the trading power is actually higher than indicated by the tpu's.  This also would make no sense because if I look and I see a low tpu, I won't deposit.  On the other hand if I knew it was higher I would.  

Why would RCI and the resort want to hide the trading value of a resort.  I know the resort sales want to say they have the highest trading value.  If they really do have a deal to make it higher wouldn't they want to be able to show owners that it is true- rather than the- "as an owner, you can't see the real trading power, but trust me there is a secret deal that makes us trade higher than what you see."  As it is all sales people at all resorts can say this because there isn't any proof that it is the case and no incentive for resorts to really have a deal with RCI, they can just say it and it not be true.

The deals you talk of are often at resorts in active sales -those are the only ones that can pay for the deals in either $ or extra deposits and many of those are in points systems these days, so that actually goes against the advice to own the high season, at resorts with much more demand than supply.

RCI isn't making deals with small no name resorts that can't pay or really can't influence or bulk deposit which weeks are deposited. Large developers that can make thousands of deposits a years - 1000-5000 X's $239 exchange fee or $199 sale on extra vacations.  An owner at a small ocean front resort in the mid atlantic with less than 20 units isn't going to get the some kind of secret trading boost just because there are 900 requests for the 25 summer units that are deposited.  If RCI wants those deposits they would have to offer tpu's that matched supply vs demand.  They don't.


----------



## Cynic

SmithOp said:


> I dont think you will offend TUG members, we know retail is way overpriced, but some of us like McFivestar resorts as you call them.
> 
> How high do you think RCI can take its fees?  I have given up exchanging with RCI due to fees, will only do cash rental of last calls.  I prefer to trade points within my McFivestar system.
> 
> I got rid of my last RCI enrolled contract, but membership is still active, do you think they will notice if I keep my account open but never deposit?  I’ve done the same thing with Interval and they keep giving me accomodation certificates for cheap last call type weeks.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro



The sky is the limit on fees. Although greed can shock me, theirs can't. Not after what I've seen. 

Doubtful they will care. You may get an occasional call, but you're not obligated to deposit. Or are you now? In the good old days anyone could buy a membership and get bonus time. I remember accounts starting with however many 0s (non-owner, no VEP. Certain people had multiple accounts just to get around VEP limits as well). I know the non-owner part has changed, but they probably have people GF'd in still. 

Fees are a big part of my personal beef with clubs, as well as their ability to change the value or usability of anything I might purchase at a whim. It's like there is a fee to create an account, one to xfer the points to it, one to belong to the club, and MF to boot. Then guest certificates, incidentals, RCI/II if I want more swapping options. Coming fees, going fees, and fees for paying fees... LOL. If I just get a simple old _good_ fixed week I know I can use or rent I'm way ahead.

Does anyone have any idea how many Wyndham points it might take to get something like Cantebury SF? I'm just curious.


----------



## silentg

Hello Cynic!
I have two questions about RCI
Why do they split Holiday Inn Club points in half?
Also, what is the purpose of making you wait until two weeks before your exchange date to see if you qualify for an upgraded or better resort ? RCI hold a $49 dollar fee until the last minute.
Thank you!
Silentg


----------



## Cynic

@tschwa2 Wow. Just wow. I'm way beyond shocked. Some things have obviously changed. I'm so glad I did this before starting to YouTube. 

I never had the impression RCI was after the savvy owners, but the example of a place people were virtually always begging for vs something that was seldom anyone's first choice, even for XMas.... I'm floored. I'm not sure I should speculate on why there are so many hidden things. I know no two resorts are told the same thing by RCI... there are so many contractual differences it's impossible to remember them all. Some places can search first, for instance. Most can't. Some contracts prevent searching for larger units than owned even though they will pull them all day long (resort wants to upsell). Other contracts specifically state the smaller units at XYZ oceanfront resorts can trade for much larger units elsewhere. 

I remember the internal jokes about Vacation Village during their points conversion (once again revealing my age). Basically it was along the lines of someone at RCI must have gotten a sexual favor. 

The Hershey example would likely have a TP+ unlimited datamod if searching for Bluegreen space in RCI, for instance. Bluegreen should tell you that, while RCI certainly would not be telling all members trying to trade for Bluegreen space that, but you'd know more than me what Bluegreen has to say.


----------



## silentg

Cynic said:


> @tschwa2 Wow. Just wow. I'm way beyond shocked. Some things have obviously changed. I'm so glad I did this before starting to YouTube.
> 
> I never had the impression RCI was after the savvy owners, but the example of a place people were virtually always begging for vs something that was seldom anyone's first choice, even for XMas.... I'm floored. I'm not sure I should speculate on why there are so many hidden things. I know no two resorts are told the same thing by RCI... there are so many contractual differences it's impossible to remember them all. Some places can search first, for instance. Most can't. Some contracts prevent searching for larger units than owned even though they will pull them all day long (resort wants to upsell). Other contracts specifically state the smaller units at XYZ oceanfront resorts can trade for much larger units elsewhere.
> 
> I remember the internal jokes about Vacation Village during their points conversion (once again revealing my age). Basically it was along the lines of someone at RCI must have gotten a sexual favor.
> 
> The Hershey example would likely have a TP+ unlimited datamod if searching for Bluegreen space in RCI, for instance. Bluegreen should tell you that, while RCI certainly would not be telling all members trying to trade for Bluegreen space that, but you'd know more than me what Bluegreen has to say.


You didn’t answer my question about RCI and Holiday Inn points? What do you mean by savvy owners? Also I don’t belong to Bluegreen so don’t know what you mean? And the Vacation Village comment was in appropriate. Are you really here to offer advice or to lurk  and smirk? 
Silentg


----------



## Cynic

silentg said:


> Hello Cynic!
> I have two questions about RCI
> Why do they split Holiday Inn Club points in half?
> Also, what is the purpose of making you wait until two weeks before your exchange date to see if you qualify for an upgraded or better resort ? RCI hold a $49 dollar fee until the last minute.
> Thank you!
> Silentg


I have no clue about Holiday Inn points. Anything you can get under 14 days is basically first come first served as far as RCI is concerned. In other words, before that people with more TP may be entitled. Under 14 days was our realistic RCI employee vacation window as well, and also when OGS would stop grabbing things. Charging people an extra fee for an upgrade sounds like the typical corporate revenue-sucking that's always been their MO. I'd have gladly given it to you for free if I liked you and you were getting me production...in my day doing that may have entailed reconfirming things around. No clue how that's handled now. I'd confirm/reconfirm bonus dummy weeks against really nice stuff all the time last minute.


----------



## Cynic

@silentg see above. What you quoted was for tshwa2 .


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## WatsonC2

Cynic said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> I'm a veteran RCI employee, no longer with the company. I'm willing to answer any and all questions you may have about exchanging your timeshare.
> 
> Much of how the system works is simply not disclosed to consumers, and I'd like to be instrumental in changing that.
> 
> I'm going to start a YouTube channel on this topic, and your questions will help me focus on issues most relevant to you.
> 
> I never signed a non-disclosure agreement with RCI, and own no stock in any timeshare developer or exchange.
> 
> My one and only goal is giving you the most accurate, helpful, and honest information possible.
> 
> Ask away, and you will be answered.
> 
> EDIT TO ADD: I know most about weeks, and my explanations of value and trading power are likely to be based on RW value, reflected in weeksexchanges and aftermarket purchases. A 90k timeshare may sell for 1k or less aftermarket. It's the nature of the beast.



We use our Wyndham Deeded Week and trade through RCI pretty regularly.  We end up with Points in RCI that we use to select our vacation.   Our friends bought RCI points but I noticed the amount of RCI points they need differs for the same exact vacation than mine.  For instance, mine might require 77,000 points and theirs might be 37,000 points (i cant recall exactly but the difference was significant). Clearly they have a different point chart for RCI points than for Wyndham points exchanged into RCI.    Can you confirm my understanding?


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## Panina

silentg said:


> You didn’t answer my question about RCI and Holiday Inn points? What do you mean by savvy owners? Also I don’t belong to Bluegreen so don’t know what you mean? And the Vacation Village comment was in appropriate. Are you really here to offer advice or to lurk  and smirk?
> Silentg


I am with you.  Nothing makes sense...it’s lurk ands smirk.


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## paxsarah

Corey Watson said:


> Clearly they have a different point chart for RCI points than for Wyndham points exchanged into RCI.    Can you confirm my understanding?



Most Wyndham points owners who regularly exchange into RCI (or owners in most mini-systems, I suspect) can confirm that understanding - yes, Wyndham points deposited into RCI are a completely different currency than RCI Points.


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## Jan M.

Corey Watson said:


> We use our Wyndham Deeded Week and trade through RCI pretty regularly.  We end up with Points in RCI that we use to select our vacation.   Our friends bought RCI points but I noticed the amount of RCI points they need differs for the same exact vacation than mine.  For instance, mine might require 77,000 points and theirs might be 37,000 points (i cant recall exactly but the difference was significant). Clearly they have a different point chart for RCI points than for Wyndham points exchanged into RCI.    Can you confirm my understanding?



The chart on the Wyndham website shows how many points are needed to deposit for the size of the unit and the red, white or blue week equivalent. I don't believe there is a specific correlation to how many points RCI lists stays for and how many Wyndham points you have to deposit into RCI.

I can remember back before the new Wyndham deposit to RCI point chart came out a few years ago that we used to deposit 28,000 points to get the smallest, lowest season weeks and we got some great deals. Sometimes we even got the red weeks and as a Wyndham VIP owner we got a free upgrade on the unit size too.


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## Eric B

Panina said:


> I am with you.  Nothing makes sense...it’s lurk ands smirk.



I am intrigued by the idea of inside information on the system, but am starting to agree with you.  I did notice a post by OP on another thread regarding ongoing searches being an ancient glitch that someone had discovered and posted on TUG; that thread added value to the conversation, identifying it as an ancient glitch didn’t.  Actually pointing out those system quirks would be beneficial, but I’d stay away from disparaging other users observations as a rule....


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## Jan M.

I'm sure there were many internal jokes about the sweetheart deal Vacation Village got when they converted to points. There have been many comments/posts on the subject of why Vacation Village resorts get the large number of points they do, that it doesn't make sense but is an excellent reason for owning at one of their resorts.


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## Eric B

There was a posting I read a few months ago that said second hand that there had been a large cash payment from VV to RCI to support that.  I believe that might have been the case, but the bulk deposit benefit might contribute as well. Owning at Massanutten, I’m just happy getting the points; makes for a lot of extra potential travel weeks for me.


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## Panina

Eric B said:


> I am intrigued by the idea of inside information on the system, but am starting to agree with you.  I did notice a post by OP on another thread regarding ongoing searches being an ancient glitch that someone had discovered and posted on TUG; that thread added value to the conversation, identifying it as an ancient glitch didn’t.  Actually pointing out those system quirks would be beneficial, but I’d stay away from disparaging other users observations as a rule....


If op is trying to help....it hasn’t helped as information seems outdated and  confusing. Or is it just me that isn’t following?


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## Cynic

I'm not certain this is helping anyone. I'm not wishing to cause drama.

I also don't find it completely fair to accuse me of something based on reading comments obviously intended for someone else, whose name is at the beginning of the comments. 

The amount of points Vacation Villages owners get is indeed a reason to buy there, and the issue of resort contracts is relevant to the subject. 

I'm not amused by RCI's business practices. Never was. That doesn't make them a bad or worthless exchange service however. Many people utilize their service all the time. If you don't find my information helpful you certainly don't have to read it.


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## ecwinch

Panina said:


> I am with you.  Nothing makes sense...



I would say it more that he is using internal RCI jargon that only has meaning within RCI and to us on the outside makes no sense.


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## flybefree

Hi, Cynic. Thanks for being here. I have three questions:

1) I own in both weeks and points. Why is it that the same unit, same date, same resort can have a huge difference in price in one system or the other? One in Provence was $370 more to book it in points. One in Germany is $45 cheaper in points.

2) How and why does RCI keep reducing TPUs on well-rated resorts in popular areas? Mine is in the Myrtle Beach area and is a lock-off. Depositing separately, it used to get a whopping 95 points when a friend told me about it. When I began shopping for one, it dropped to 89. By the time I bought one (resale, of course), I got only 63 TPU. My next deposit should be worth 65 TPU based on the calculator. I asked the resort, and they said RCI claims it's because of all the new resorts going up in that area, because of the competition. There aren't any new resorts in that area in RCI, and summer weeks like mine are gone months in advance every year. There is WAY more demand than supply. I also own at that resort in points and its retained its incredibly high trading power in points, which RCI says is due to a contract the resort has with points owners. How is it that RCI determines the trading power in weeks but the resort decides it in points?

3) And who the hell is managing the redesigns of the Web site? It's worse EVERY time they mess with it. I used to design e-commerce sites and I give it a D at best. Now we can only scroll through 10 resorts at a time, and if we want to search on trading power needed, we can only choose the smallest amounts, like 1-10,000 points. I've got a lot of points I need to use and wanted to search or sort on points so I could find a single trip that would use 50k+ points. Live it up a bit. Can't do that.

Thanks!


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## Jayco29D

Cynic said:


> @Jayco29D Let me clarify: RCI gets you a lot of high quality stuff, but it's mostly stuff you already have access to, as most McFivestars are compatible with both II and RCI. The primary advantage of RCI is far more total locations, many of which will be unavailable/ VEP down for you (but in locations that are more appealing to more users). II has less total, but almost as many in your range. I'm not convinced RCI will give you much more than what you already have, as strata is your thing (and your high srata is not as important as trading power in RCI, which you may or may not have) . Disney chooses RCI for reasons that appeal to a larger number of users than users such as yourself, which I realize does you no good. Why they don't do II too is anyone's guess.



From what I hear, very few DVC owners use RCI at all. They say it is not equivalent in value. I suspect Disney chose RCI for this reason. I suspect Disney does not want its DVC members trading DVC resorts bc that devalues the resort. Exchanges are good for customers but bad for the resorts. People say “Why buy if I can get it cheaper by exchanging?”


----------



## taterhed

Thanks in advance for your comments....

Any advice on how to maximize Worldmark points and/or spacebank in RCI?

Specifically, any tips for searches ?

Thanks.


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## jl2010

So basically what I have gotten from this thread is the following:
1) TPUs are variable based on hidden contracts with various timeshare outfits have with RCI. Example would be vacation villages.
2) Wyndham has its own currency when exchanges with RCI (being the same company) giving Wyndham owners an advantage.
3) RCI can override TPU value as it sees fit when appying to an area with a glut of availability  that can essentially making 38 TPUs worth 68 TPUs. Invisible to the trader of course. I would assume this is so trade power isn't always expected.
4) Weeks are more beneficial to owners than points. They can't be cost manipulated and are something solid to trade or rent.
5) There are no absolutes with RCI since they can change the rules any time they want.
6) Quality of timeshare does not always equal trading power. A dump in an area where there is very limited competition could have much greater trading power.... or not depending on RCI manipulation.
7) Greed dictates their fee structure.
8) The phrase "sexual favors" offends some. ")


Anything else?

To be honest, this is why I don't use RCI. No clear rules, and has always seemed sketchy to me.  I bought resale a fixed week 26 on Cape Cod, about 1:30 minutes from my house so I could drive there and use it even in lean years, or just hang a sign at work to rent it out.


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## flybefree

I'd agree with all of that, except the weeks being more beneficial than points. My points value has been consistent due to the resort's contract. RCI has been screwing with the TPU on the weeks side for years. But...some properties are cheaper in one system than the other, points allows you to book less than or more than a week (we did 2 nights in Vegas, for example), and weeks lets you book farther out for *some* resorts than points. I wish my points one was an EOY instead of annual, because it gets too many points for us to use without paying to extend. Maybe that's why RCI agrees to such high trading power for it...sneaky! We are holding steady for now but are contemplating selling one or both. I still like that I discover new areas I wouldn't have otherwise, especially in Europe. But the costs are getting too high.


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## Jan M.

flybefree said:


> I'd agree with all of that, except the weeks being more beneficial than points. My points value has been consistent due to the resort's contract. RCI has been screwing with the TPU on the weeks side for years. But...some properties are cheaper in one system than the other, points allows you to book less than or more than a week (we did 2 nights in Vegas, for example), and weeks lets you book farther out for *some* resorts than points. I wish my points one was an EOY instead of annual, because it gets too many points for us to use without paying to extend. Maybe that's why RCI agrees to such high trading power for it...sneaky! We are holding steady for now but are contemplating selling one or both. I still like that I discover new areas I wouldn't have otherwise, especially in Europe. But the costs are getting too high.



We are points and my sister and BIL are weeks owners. I always see far more availability as a points owner than my sister does as a weeks owner. We discovered this a few years ago when we were on the website at the same time and she couldn't see the reservation I called to tell her about. However I'm always looking for and booking reservations 5 weeks or less out.

We are all going to the new Wyndham resort in Austin next month that I booked through RCI in the past two weeks. She again wasn't seeing the reservations to book her own unit so I booked a week for her. All that was available when I booked both the units and the flights were studios and one bedroom units. Of course a few days after I was no longer able cancel and get the exchange fee back some two bedrooms showed up. Oh well. As other people have posted about wanting their own space even with family I find that I'm liking the idea.


----------



## flybefree

Yeah, there seems to be better availability for near-term exchanges in points and better ones for more distant trips in weeks. I booked Vincennes two years out for the first week of the French Open. That would not have been available to me in points.


----------



## tschwa2

Jan M. said:


> We are all going to the new Wyndham resort in Austin next month that I booked through RCI in the past two weeks. She again wasn't seeing the reservations to book her own unit so I booked a week for her. All that was available when I booked both the units and the flights were studios and one bedroom units. Of course a few days after I was no longer able cancel and get the exchange fee back some two bedrooms showed up. Oh well. As other people have posted about wanting their own space even with family I find that I'm liking the idea.


I just checked and Austin both through the Worldmark portion and Wyndham portion are available through both points and weeks.  I find that in RCI points (weeks inventory $239 exchange fee) shows up in points 1-24 hrs before it shows up an weeks so it does give points members a bit of a leg up.


----------



## Jan M.

tschwa2 said:


> I just checked and Austin both through the Worldmark portion and Wyndham portion are available through both points and weeks.  I find that in RCI points (weeks inventory $239 exchange fee) shows up in points 1-24 hrs before it shows up an weeks so it does give points members a bit of a leg up.



When I booked our stays two weeks ago the only thing showing was Worldmark Austin. During the whole week I was looking and planning every time I clicked on the calendar for Wyndham Austin it wouldn't open up. A week later a lot of inventory got loaded under Wyndham Austin. The resort just opened this week and last week was a soft opening for selected guests.


----------



## tschwa2

Jan M. said:


> When I booked our stays two weeks ago the only thing showing was Worldmark Austin. During the whole week I was looking and planning every time I clicked on the calendar for Wyndham Austin it wouldn't open up. A week later a lot of inventory got loaded under Wyndham Austin. The resort just opened this week and last week was a soft opening for selected guests.


Thanks for the heads up.  I am just deciding whether I want a studio for 10 or a 1 br for 17.  The size seems the same.  It looks like the both have balconies.  The difference is the privacy wall, and a washer/dryer in the 1 BR.   The $30 a day for parking is a bit of a bummer.


----------



## SHG

I hope someone can help answer this one?:

We just conducted a test where we had a friend log into their RCI account at the same time we logged into our HGVC RCI account. We each conducted an exchange search for Cabo San Lucas in July/August 2018. We were shocked to find that our friend had 8 pages of listing when we only had 8 resorts period!!! They were able to book exchanges into resorts that were not even on our list! How could this be??

No, their resort was not anything exceptional or perceived better than Hilton
Yes, we were both step by step looking at the same things, not filtering differently
Their RCI account is separate from their timeshare account, so they log directly into RCI

We called HCVC RCI the next day to see if they had any explanation. We made 2 separate calls to discuss with 2 different HGVC RCI counselors. Both were under the impression that we should be able to see all RCI availability and had no idea how anything different could be possible.

Is it possible that HGVC has reduced/filtered RCI exchange availability???? Anyone have any experience or insights on this?


----------



## Jayco29D

This discussion is reinforcing my negative opinion of RCI. With our Disney RCI account, we have options to stay at Registry resorts but there are so few resorts in The Registry Collection. And even The Registry Collection does not seem worth the trade. RCI has many great all inclusives in Mexico and the Caribbean but the all inclusive fees make it as expensive or more expensive sometimes than just booking a special rate online. I had my eye on the El Dorado Maroma overwater bungalows in Riviera Maya through the Registry Collection but the “per day” all inclusive fee is $1000 per night. I spent less than that for a nicer overwater bungalow at Le Tahaa and Bora Bora. If you delete the all inclusives from RCI inventory, you lose about half the resorts, I am guessing.


----------



## Panina

SHG said:


> I hope someone can help answer this one?:
> 
> We just conducted a test where we had a friend log into their RCI account at the same time we logged into our HGVC RCI account. We each conducted an exchange search for Cabo San Lucas in July/August 2018. We were shocked to find that our friend had 8 pages of listing when we only had 8 resorts period!!! They were able to book exchanges into resorts that were not even on our list! How could this be??
> 
> No, their resort was not anything exceptional or perceived better than Hilton
> Yes, we were both step by step looking at the same things, not filtering differently
> Their RCI account is separate from their timeshare account, so they log directly into RCI
> 
> We called HCVC RCI the next day to see if they had any explanation. We made 2 separate calls to discuss with 2 different HGVC RCI counselors. Both were under the impression that we should be able to see all RCI availability and had no idea how anything different could be possible.
> 
> Is it possible that HGVC has reduced/filtered RCI exchange availability???? Anyone have any experience or insights on this?


When I log into RCI thru the hgvc portal I see fewer resorts overall then if I logged in thru my own RCI account.

The reason, I have read elsewhere, is because the hgvc portal thru RCI will only see resorts that meet higher hgvc standards.


----------



## Cropman

Cynic said:


> reflected in *weeksexchanges*


 That's it, I'm done for the day.  I saw week sex changes, and thought they are doing them really fast these days.


----------



## Jayco29D

Cropman said:


> That's it, I'm done for the day.  I saw week sex changes, and thought they are doing them really fast these days.



Too funny! I am glad Tuggers have a sense of humor.


----------



## SHG

Panina said:


> When I log into RCI thru the hgvc portal I see fewer resorts overall then if I logged in thru my own RCI account.
> 
> The reason, I have read elsewhere, is because the hgvc portal thru RCI will only see resorts that meet higher hgvc standards.


Yes, I have seen others with this theory as well. I seriously doubt this is true. The resorts that I know we could not see are Gold crown resorts that I know are very nice. There is no way they would be filtered out for 'higher standards'. Also, if this were true, I would like to see where that is written in any documentation......?


----------



## WinniWoman

jl2010 said:


> So basically what I have gotten from this thread is the following:
> 1) TPUs are variable based on hidden contracts with various timeshare outfits have with RCI. Example would be vacation villages.
> 2) Wyndham has its own currency when exchanges with RCI (being the same company) giving Wyndham owners an advantage.
> 3) RCI can override TPU value as it sees fit when appying to an area with a glut of availability  that can essentially making 38 TPUs worth 68 TPUs. Invisible to the trader of course. I would assume this is so trade power isn't always expected.
> 4) Weeks are more beneficial to owners than points. They can't be cost manipulated and are something solid to trade or rent.
> 5) There are no absolutes with RCI since they can change the rules any time they want.
> 6) Quality of timeshare does not always equal trading power. A dump in an area where there is very limited competition could have much greater trading power.... or not depending on RCI manipulation.
> 7) Greed dictates their fee structure.
> 8) The phrase "sexual favors" offends some. ")
> 
> 
> Anything else?
> 
> To be honest, this is why I don't use RCI. No clear rules, and has always seemed sketchy to me.  I bought resale a fixed week 26 on Cape Cod, about 1:30 minutes from my house so I could drive there and use it even in lean years, or just hang a sign at work to rent it out.



This is a great synopsis! I totally agree. I haven't belonged to RCI for years. I like just showing up for my fixed weeks, though I have a longer drive for my VT one (pleasant 6 hours) (week 30) than you do for your Cape Cod week, but only a two hour drive after that VT week to the NH one (week 31).

I did do an exchange through Trading Places International (free membership) this year using my other VT week, which is a fixed- floating pre-assigned week (late Oct. this year), to Cape Cod for this Sept. (week after Labor Day week). Have not been to Cape Cod (except when in our 20's for a Labor Day weekend whale watching out of Provincetown with Greenpeace. LOL!). Looking forward to it. (Cove at Yarmouth).

Anyway, who needs all the hassles of having to figure out all the ins and outs of using points every year. You can tell from this thread what a convoluted system it all is. I just rent when I want to go somewhere extra. Yeah- it costs a lot more - but I just make a phone call and book it and call it a day. I get what I want where I want. The end.


----------



## jl2010

Well maybe one of these years you,and I can do a straight trade if you like The Cape. We didn't do it this year cuz The Cove just got the first outdoor pool built on Cape Cod in  2 decades. Looking forward to visiting. That makes  3 pools and total for our Resort, not to mention the new outdoor pool changing rooms and outdoor pool snack bar/bar. Supposed to be some live music parties out there this season.


----------



## Jan M.

tschwa2 said:


> Thanks for the heads up.  I am just deciding whether I want a studio for 10 or a 1 br for 17.  The size seems the same.  It looks like the both have balconies.  The difference is the privacy wall, and a washer/dryer in the 1 BR.   The $30 a day for parking is a bit of a bummer.



There aren't any unit floor plans available yet on the Wyndham website so I couldn't check out the layout of the units. I booked one bedroom units for us. I must have started looking when they first started loading the inventory because when I first looked all that was available were studios at Worldmark Austin. Over the next few days they added one bedroom units. Then a week later they added Wyndham Austin in studios, one bedrooms and two bedrooms. 

It may not work for you but we won't be renting a car and are taking the bus from the airport. The front desk staff told me the bus stop is no more than 2 blocks from the resort. We will be there for 12 days and my sister and BIL for 9 days so we have plenty of time to figure out what we want to do that will require a car and only rent one for a couple of days to do those things. We will be arriving before them so they can wait to see how taking the bus worked out for us.

The front desk staff at the resort told me there is a Trader Joe's and a Whole Foods a mile from the resort. We will walk to the stores and take an Uber back with our groceries. They also told me it is only a two block walk to where the nightlife is in Austin.

We "walked on the wild side", lol, when we stayed at La Cascada in San Antonio two years ago and took the bus from the airport and back again. That trip my husband was a little hesitant when I told him I had checked out the bus schedule and decided we were trying the bus. I told him we are being spontaneous; it will be an adventure. And it was nice to be able to look around and not have to worry about the traffic and where we were going. We had no problem each pulling our suitcase on the two block walk to and from the bus stop. On the San Antonio trip I told my husband if after trying it we didn't like it that we could always take a cab or Uber back to the airport for our flight home but it worked out fine. There is an HEB grocery store a block and a half from the resort and LaCascada has shuttles to most of the big tourist places too.

My theory on the bus/public transportation systems in the cities where you have to pay to park is that the people who work at the hotels, restaurants, shops, businesses, etc. all have to get back and forth to work but most don't make the big bucks to pay that much for parking, therefore the public transportation has to be good. We'll be testing my theory again in Austin next month.


----------



## Cynic

flybefree said:


> Hi, Cynic. Thanks for being here. I have three questions:
> 
> 1) I own in both weeks and points. Why is it that the same unit, same date, same resort can have a huge difference in price in one system or the other? One in Provence was $370 more to book it in points. One in Germany is $45 cheaper in points.
> 
> 2) How and why does RCI keep reducing TPUs on well-rated resorts in popular areas? Mine is in the Myrtle Beach area and is a lock-off. Depositing separately, it used to get a whopping 95 points when a friend told me about it. When I began shopping for one, it dropped to 89. By the time I bought one (resale, of course), I got only 63 TPU. My next deposit should be worth 65 TPU based on the calculator. I asked the resort, and they said RCI claims it's because of all the new resorts going up in that area, because of the competition. There aren't any new resorts in that area in RCI, and summer weeks like mine are gone months in advance every year. There is WAY more demand than supply. I also own at that resort in points and its retained its incredibly high trading power in points, which RCI says is due to a contract the resort has with points owners. How is it that RCI determines the trading power in weeks but the resort decides it in points?
> 
> 3) And who the hell is managing the redesigns of the Web site? It's worse EVERY time they mess with it. I used to design e-commerce sites and I give it a D at best. Now we can only scroll through 10 resorts at a time, and if we want to search on trading power needed, we can only choose the smallest amounts, like 1-10,000 points. I've got a lot of points I need to use and wanted to search or sort on points so I could find a single trip that would use 50k+ points. Live it up a bit. Can't do that.
> 
> Thanks!



Hey!

1) Largely supply and demand, although resort contracts with RCI can also be a factor. 

2) Many many factors are involved in the decrease and increase of value over time. Actual deposit date means far more than most people realize. 1+ year in advance gets most. Something deposited six month in advance has basically already lost about half it's trading power, and it gets worse the closer you get. Another undisclosed thing is VEP. As a resort ages, VEP generally tends to go down. VEP is an internal measure of total value, based on desirability and member comments about the resort each year. I don't personally agree with this, but many timeshare users seem to be as interested in the hairdryers in the bathroom (or lack thereof), presence of electronic kitchen gadgets, etc, far moreso than ordinary travelers. I suspect it goes back to the sales pitch. Since people were told about big nice places, they tend to place undue importance on those things vs common sense things like... umm... MYRTLE BEACH IN THE SUMMER!!!  Basically, some users complain about "dated furniture" and such and value goes down. The best places often have lower VEP, and very high strata (niceness/fanciness) tends to be most common in less high-demand locations (Orlando or Branson, anyone?). Those with the absolute highest VEP may have payed 90k or more to some vacation club, to a very nice weeks place like Manhatten Club, etc. Understand those too may (read usually will) fade in value with time. I've stayed in resorts RCI considered "dumps" and loved them. They were where I wanted to be, when I wanted to be there, and I'm not vacationing to sit in my condo (or hotel room... I'll take any size as it's just me and another person usually). If I had a lockoff I'd basically always deposit it as two weeks, like you do. Unit size means a lot less than most people realize as far as actual value is concerned.

3) Likely a third party that has never actually used RCI. I'm sure Chrystal and her people met with them, and gave them a list of desired features. It was only toward the end of my tenure as a vacation guide that I even got to see what end users see, and I was not impressed. The internal system is far more powerful, but also far less user-friendly. I'd suggest submitting feedback to RCI. We were always coached to offer no more than the three biggest and best options over the phone, and suggest the Internet to "shoppers". 

Happy vacationing!


----------



## Cynic

Jayco29D said:


> From what I hear, very few DVC owners use RCI at all. They say it is not equivalent in value. I suspect Disney chose RCI for this reason. I suspect Disney does not want its DVC members trading DVC resorts bc that devalues the resort. Exchanges are good for customers but bad for the resorts. People say “Why buy if I can get it cheaper by exchanging?”



Hmmm...

Disney is it's own tier.  Aftermarket values prove this easily. Some Disney owners may want other options, and RCI has the most. Sales tool.

Idiots always want something fancy. You live once, and vacationing is about living. People that know how to have a fun vacation always want... a location. And a place to crash after a long day of doing whatever. Many timeshare owners spend so much money they forget to have fun. Sad but true


----------



## Cynic

taterhed said:


> Thanks in advance for your comments....
> 
> Any advice on how to maximize Worldmark points and/or spacebank in RCI?
> 
> Specifically, any tips for searches ?
> 
> Thanks.



Spacebank as far in advance as possible. I don't know if future years can be prepaid, but if possible I would. Submit search online, and early. THEN call and tell them about what sort of vacation experience you're looking for, how many are traveling, etc. They may be able to add other options of similar vacation experiences you hadn't thought of to your search. 

Good example: "it's two of us, a couple, and we love golf, mountain biking, and chillaxing on the beach"
Bad example: "we want right on the beach in Myrtle Beach and we have a two bedroom, five star GC (in inland Texas in August) so we're entitled to a two bedroom right on the waterfront in July".

Be realistic. Many people expect the same size or bigger than what was put in, same or more number of stars, AND IN A MORE DESIRABLE PLACE. That would drive me crazy. Be as flexible as possible, and keep an open mind. And be ready for new experiences and FUN!


----------



## Cynic

Panina said:


> When I log into RCI thru the hgvc portal I see fewer resorts overall then if I logged in thru my own RCI account.
> 
> The reason, I have read elsewhere, is because the hgvc portal thru RCI will only see resorts that meet higher hgvc standards.



Correct. Everything VEP down will be blocked for you. Even via RCI account you will not see all availability (nor will a vacation guide see stuff not in range of what's being searched with). It's based on the first timeshare  on that particular account. Some people had multiple accounts for this reason. And how you put it was... presentation BS. I'd say it this way: "you see what's of similar STRATA". Now you've learned something. You're welcome. Have fun.


----------



## Cynic

SHG said:


> No, their resort was not anything exceptional or perceived better than Hilton



You don't actually know that. Their are numerous factors, such as resort contracts, actual deposit trends, VEP, etc. Plus things below you are also blocked. People in one area know that area, not the whole system. Chinese walls are the norm in corporate America these days.


----------



## Cynic

flybefree said:


> Yeah, there seems to be better availability for near-term exchanges in points and better ones for more distant trips in weeks. I booked Vincennes two years out for the first week of the French Open. That would not have been available to me in points.


QFT. But under 2 weeks you find the most random treasures in weeks. Too late to rent out.


----------



## bizaro86

Cynic said:


> Spacebank as far in advance as possible. I don't know if future years can be prepaid, but if possible I would. Submit search online, and early. THEN call and tell them about what sort of vacation experience you're looking for, how many are traveling, etc. They may be able to add other options of similar vacation experiences you hadn't thought of to your search.
> 
> Good example: "it's two of us, a couple, and we love golf, mountain biking, and chillaxing on the beach"
> Bad example: "we want right on the beach in Myrtle Beach and we have a two bedroom, five star GC (in inland Texas in August) so we're entitled to a two bedroom right on the waterfront in July".
> 
> Be realistic. Many people expect the same size or bigger than what was put in, same or more number of stars, AND IN A MORE DESIRABLE PLACE. That would drive me crazy. Be as flexible as possible, and keep an open mind. And be ready for new experiences and FUN!



The problem with taking an even trade is that RCI charges so much that makes an even trade a poor value.


----------



## Cynic

SHG said:


> Yes, I have seen others with this theory as well. I seriously doubt this is true. The resorts that I know we could not see are Gold crown resorts that I know are very nice. There is no way they would be filtered out for 'higher standards'. Also, if this were true, I would like to see where that is written in any documentation......?


Not all GC are created equal. Not at all. Some are VEP down and out of range for others. Others will be trading value issues. The measures you guys see are ... like maybe half the picture at best.


----------



## Cynic

Cynic said:


> Not all GC are created equal. Not at all. Some are VEP down and out of range for others. Others will be trading value issues. The measures you guys see are ... like maybe half the picture at best.


I personally recommend direct exchanges, owner to owner.


----------



## tschwa2

Cynic said:


> Not all GC are created equal. Not at all. Some are VEP down and out of range for others. Others will be trading value issues. The measures you guys see are ... like maybe half the picture at best.


You would be surprised what people see and know on TUG.  We have been doing members only trading tests for 10+ years.  Members here regularly have OGS's set up just to see what happens at dozens of resorts during different seasons.  +


----------



## Cynic

tschwa2 said:


> You would be surprised what people see and know on TUG.  We have been doing members only trading tests for 10+ years.  Members here regularly have OGS's set up just to see what happens at dozens of resorts during different seasons.  +



 I've noticed a bit of that. Only had the pleasure of dealing with a few TUGers on the phone (the gentleman who introduced me to these boards years ago actually owned his own resort). You're ahead of the curve. I think those who get the most from these boards have far more insight and knowledge than average timeshare owners. I'd recommend membership here above RCI membership, candidly.

My statement about "measures you guys see" should have been worded better, more like "what RCI discloses to members".


----------



## Cynic

ecwinch said:


> I would say it more that he is using internal RCI jargon that only has meaning within RCI and to us on the outside makes no sense.


If there's something I can clarify I'd be glad to. Some of you likely know more than me. Others are relatively new.


----------



## Cynic

jl2010 said:


> So basically what I have gotten from this thread is the following:
> 1) TPUs are variable based on hidden contracts with various timeshare outfits have with RCI. Example would be vacation villages.
> 2) Wyndham has its own currency when exchanges with RCI (being the same company) giving Wyndham owners an advantage.
> 3) RCI can override TPU value as it sees fit when appying to an area with a glut of availability  that can essentially making 38 TPUs worth 68 TPUs. Invisible to the trader of course. I would assume this is so trade power isn't always expected.
> 4) Weeks are more beneficial to owners than points. They can't be cost manipulated and are something solid to trade or rent.
> 5) There are no absolutes with RCI since they can change the rules any time they want.
> 6) Quality of timeshare does not always equal trading power. A dump in an area where there is very limited competition could have much greater trading power.... or not depending on RCI manipulation.
> 7) Greed dictates their fee structure.
> 8) The phrase "sexual favors" offends some. ")
> 
> 
> Anything else?
> 
> To be honest, this is why I don't use RCI. No clear rules, and has always seemed sketchy to me.  I bought resale a fixed week 26 on Cape Cod, about 1:30 minutes from my house so I could drive there and use it even in lean years, or just hang a sign at work to rent it out.



Re: #4: Not all weeks. Not even most. The week you own is an example of the sort of week I would personally buy, since I'd enjoy a change of pace from FL in the summer. I can also 1:1 trade it for something nice (to me) no probs. Think I actually saw that one on eBay for like 1kish or less for a 1 br... I'm thinking the mf would be less than what it rents for, but you'd know more than me on that. ANy insights?

Re: #5 That's also true for points and clubs. Fixed to something you'd actually like to vacation or could rent out seems like the easiest call. 

Re: #6 I don't like the word "quality". It's subjective. I don't vacation to sit in a condo or hotel room for a week. Strata freaks usually own something that's not as desirable to most people as they think...a palace in the VA mountains is still... in the VA mountains. Then they want to go to Europe, finally get their trade, and guess what: It's a spartan place in the Swiss Alps, right next to world-class ski lifts, and they waste time being upset that it's not half as big or luxurious as their silly VA mountains McMansion that's a dime a dozon. General rule of thumb is, the most desirable places will have been developed long ago, and the resorts may be older, small units, etc. Huge units tend to be in locations where land is cheap. When you're on the waterfront or by the skilift or on the strip, space is money. Developers are even greedier than RCI. 

Re: #8 They also didn't understand why they couldn't book an UPGRADE two years in advance, that they weren't actually ENTITLED to an upgrade ever, that a post beginning with SOMEONE ELSE'S NAME was not directed at them, or that their question would be answered in order and others had asked first. Notice something? So yeah. They can have fun getting help from someone who is being PAID to deal with them)


----------



## jl2010

Cynic said:


> Re: #4: Not all weeks. Not even most. The week you own is an example of the sort of week I would personally buy, since I'd enjoy a change of pace from FL in the summer. I can also 1:1 trade it for something nice (to me) no probs. Think I actually saw that one on eBay for like 1kish or less for a 1 br... I'm thinking the mf would be less than what it rents for, but you'd know more than me on that. ANy insights?



The week I own rents for $279 a night + tax.  Total is $311 a night  if you can get time there during summer. My maint is $559. So yeah.


----------



## Laurie

Cynic, how long ago did you leave RCI?


----------



## Jan M.

Cynic said:


> Think I actually saw that one on eBay for like 1kish or less for a 1 br... I'm thinking the mf would be less than what it rents for, but you'd know more than me on that. ANy insights?



The maintenance fees depend on where you own so that is hard to say without knowing what resort you were looking at and what season the week is in. We've stayed at a lot of resorts through RCI and always enjoy talking to the people who own at the resort we are at. We've found that maintenance fees for a week in some cases were as low as around $550-$575, in many cases were as high as $1200-$1400 for a week and varying amounts in between. 

About 2 or 3 years ago we were staying at a HGVC resort in a red week. It was in the higher range of maintenance fees and one of the couples we met owned 10 weeks! We calculated that they had spent no less than $10k, if not a lot more at times, for each week they owned and were paying in excess of $13k a year in maintenance fees. We felt immensely better about what we've spent and what are maintenance fees are! It also made us glad we have RCI points and have been able to use them to get multiple weeks instead of just one week. They way we book and travel, discounted point weeks in the last 2-5 weeks before check in, wouldn't work for most people but it sure works for us!


----------



## Jselden

I have seen a place online where you can get an Annual RCI Membership for $99. Does this give me full access to everything RCI offers? Does this give me access to 5 Diamond resorts?


----------



## HtownRose

I am a weeks member via my Wyndham ownership.  I have only bought Extra Vacations since the 28,000 point exchanges were discontinued - never attempted to figure out TPUs & don't plan to.  If I give away my Wyndham contract, would I still be able to keep my RCI membership - just pay the fee directly to RCI?  It seems I heard once that was possible, but it was before RCI was bought by Wyndham.  Thank you!


----------



## rjrsmr

This has been an interesting discussion... We've been every year floating weeks owners at a Sedona property since 1995 and RCI  members since 1993.  I remember the days of "red, white and blue" weeks.  We used to get awesome exchanges back in the day i.e. trading the studio portion for a 2BR in Kauai.  Then things changed to TPU's.  After that, couldn't get anything in Hawaii unless I combined deposits over a couple years.  I don't know how the other posters here get TPU's in the 50s, 60s, and beyond.  The best we've ever gotten was 19 and 21 for studio and 1BR respectively.  Have asked at owners meetings about it and response was "Sedona is getting overbuilt."
HUH???  When I hear overbuilt I think of Vegas--overbuilt, Orlando--overbuilt, even Mexico--overbuilt.  These places have literally thousands and thousands of units.  Sedona doesn't have anywhere near that volume, so to me based on the OP's logic of supply and demand, with less availability, we should have huge trading power, you know like back in the day when I had to pick up the phone to talk to someone about an exchange, and when I asked "WOW, how can I get a 2BR, IN HAWAII, with a studio when they told me at purchase a studio trades for a studio, and you could trade down but not up, and they're response was "It's because you own in such a high demand area."  
Another thing I've noticed with RCI is when searching for a specific week to match my trading power, it's nowhere to be found on the exchange platform but for a mere $1200-$1500 they'll be happy to "rent" the SAME week to me!!!!
No, I don't spacebank years in advance, if I'm going to drop 2-3K on prepaid MFs in hopes of a better exchange that I "might" get, then I'd rather just go to direct owners website like VRBO.  As it is, with higher membership fees, exchange fees, combine deposit fees, platinum fees (to get the "better" exchanges, wink, wink, which I refuse to pay, BTW) on top of MFs, RCI can no longer compete with private rentals.  I agree with other posters, that it makes more sense to just buy a bargain basement week where you like to go, and go with that.  Our membership with RCI runs out in a few months, and I'm done with them.  Even just using them for rentals or last call doesn't make sense when you factor in the membership fee is the cost of a nights rent someplace.


----------



## Eric B

It's got to be all relative to both supply and demand.  I took a quick look at RCI availability in Sedona; right now there are 1,544 check in nights available.  In Hawaii there are only 411 check in nights available.  I'm not sure how the volume of tourists visiting compares between the two, but it might be that Sedona has more supply available to meet its demand as compared to Hawaii.  In Las Vegas, RCI is showing 6,792 availabilities now.  Those numbers are on the points side; on the weeks side there are 1,042 in Sedona, 138 in Hawaii, and 1,717 in Las Vegas.  So there is also some market segmentation with more supply in Hawaii available to RCI points owners rather than weeks owners; it looks like ~68% of the availability in Sedona is in weeks while it's ~34% in Hawaii and ~25% in Las Vegas.  This is just my single data point snapshot of the situation; it will probably vary when developers make bulk deposits of weeks based units and reflects the fact that you can see availability in weeks through a points account.  It might also be biased based on availabilities for the weeks I own per OP's discussions on the subject earlier.  I do tend to agree with OP that RCI is driven by self-interest, making it more beneficial for people to use points accounts because they have more control of the product than when people own simple weeks units that necessitate having them voluntarily deposit them with RCI.  They're also in the business of selling better access products for more fees, which I can understand.  I think you've got the right perspective on comparing the costs and benefits; I've found some places I like to go through RCI that work out cheaper for me now, so I keep using them while keeping an eye out for other more efficient ways to vacation.


----------



## magmue

_"I took a quick look at RCI availability in Sedona; right now there are 1,544 check in nights available. In Hawaii there are only 411 check in nights available. I'm not sure how the volume of tourists visiting compares between the two, but it might be that Sedona has more supply available to meet its demand as compared to Hawaii. In Las Vegas, RCI is showing 6,792 availabilities now. Those numbers are on the points side; on the weeks side there are 1,042 in Sedona"_

As a new Hilton owner, a huge frustration for me is seeing so many fewer options than apparently exist in RCI. My RCI portal via the HGVC website shows me a grand total of 7 resorts in Sedona with 23 check-in options between now and next November. After a lot of reading here on TUG, I guess that's because of the VEP thing? Feels like Big Brother to me


----------



## basl99

Cynic said:


> If there's something I can clarify I'd be glad to. Some of you likely know more than me. Others are relatively new.


i have a Sheraton week at the Bonaventure orlanda
it is 3rd week Jan 
if i pay my dues now for 2019 can i post the week with RCI? and if i do what can of tpu would i expect?


----------



## basl99

oops that sheraton ventura


----------



## DeniseM

I believe you mean Sheraton Vistana.  Since you have a fixed week, I'm going to guess it is Sheraton Vistana _Resort_.  (As opposed to Sheraton Vistana _Villages_.) 

You can deposit your 2019 week now, if you pay your maintenance fee.  You can dermine the TPU by using the deposit calculator on the RCI website. 

One thing to consider - this may be a better deposit for Interval, because with Interval you get the Vistana to Vistana priority.  In other words, you have priority to trade into other Vistana resorts.  The best practice is to put in an ongoing search on Interval, because ongoing searches are filled before anything goes online.  The inventory you see online is the left-overs.


----------



## basl99

tht's really good advice


----------



## basl99

which are best resorts to trade on rci?


----------



## DeniseM

RCI is a points based system, so the best traders has a lot of points, and a low maintenance fee.  Sheraton Vistana Resort is average as far as points.


----------



## basl99

can you give examples of hi points low maintenance?


----------



## DeniseM

BryanL - What resorts do you hope to exchange into with RCI?


----------



## basl99

worldmark - have about 10,000 pts


----------



## HudsHut

Bryan:
Did you already deposit the points into RCI, or are they sitting in your WM account?
WorldMark can exchange into anything in RCI. 10,000 WM credits will get you a 2 br unit. You should set up a search for the resorts that interest you.
Manhattan Club in New York City, 
Hiltons in Hilton Head, Orlando, Las Vegas, Oahu and Big Island, Southern California Coastal
Disney's Saratoga Springs in Walt Disney World
I'm sure others will chime in with the resorts they enjoy in other parts of the country

*Exchange fee $239, housekeeping fee, Maintenance Fee on 10,000 credits. Make sure that the resort into which you want to trade is worth the sum of all these fees.


----------



## Sunshine Seeker

Cynic said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> I'm a veteran RCI employee, no longer with the company. I'm willing to answer any and all questions you may have about exchanging your timeshare.
> 
> Much of how the system works is simply not disclosed to consumers, and I'd like to be instrumental in changing that.
> 
> I'm going to start a YouTube channel on this topic, and your questions will help me focus on issues most relevant to you.
> 
> I never signed a non-disclosure agreement with RCI, and own no stock in any timeshare developer or exchange.
> 
> My one and only goal is giving you the most accurate, helpful, and honest information possible.
> 
> Ask away, and you will be answered.
> 
> EDIT TO ADD: I know most about weeks, and my explanations of value and trading power are likely to be based on RW value, reflected in weeksexchanges and aftermarket purchases. A 90k timeshare may sell for 1k or less aftermarket. It's the nature of the beast.




RCI has become more difficult to navigate than it was since Wyndham acquired it and made so many changes to the website.  It has become very frustrating for me to just perform a simple search.  Is there a way I can still get a listing of all availability units regardless of the time frame or the size of unit, like I used to do?


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## jwalk03

Is there a way to add a child to my RCI account to avoid paying the $79 guest certificate fee?  Currently There is only 1 name on the account.


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## basl99

my vistana time share has a tpu of 21
is that good?


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## DeniseM

TPU is very average - the TPU scale is 0-60.


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## basl99

with interval, if i deposit a sheraton i can trade for a sheraton elsewhere?


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## DeniseM

jwalk03 said:


> Is there a way to add a child to my RCI account to avoid paying the $79 guest certificate fee? Currently There is only 1 name on the account.



You would have to add your child to your deed, (register a new deed) which would cost around $200, depending on the location, and would make your child responsible for the maintenance fee, etc. if you did not pay it, or you went to that big resort in the sky.


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## DeniseM

BryanL said:


> with interval, if i deposit a sheraton i can trade for a sheraton elsewhere?



You can trade for anything that is available, (not just Sheraton) that you have enough TPU for.


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## basl99

what is the difference between interval and rci membership?


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## K2Quick

What's the best way to get a discounted RCI membership fee?  When I joined I got a 5 years for the price of 3 membership deal (which isn't as good as the offers I get from Interval International).  Anything better than that and how would I get it?


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## DeniseM

BryanL said:


> what is the difference between interval and rci membership?



-They are completely different exchange companies with different inventory and different resorts.

-Some resorts are affiliated with both, but most are only affiliated with one or the other.

-Which exchange company works best for you depends on what you are depositing and what resort you want to exchange into.


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## basl99

ok i have a week at the vistana sheraton week 4 floating for 2019
i want to deposit then trade
tpu is 21 
may try hawaii or mexico for next year or another sheraton
does sheraton trade mainly with ii?


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## HudsHut

BryanL said:


> ok i have a week at the vistana sheraton week 4 floating for 2019
> i want to deposit then trade
> tpu is 21
> may try hawaii or mexico for next year or another sheraton
> does sheraton trade mainly with ii?



You will do better trading your Sheraton in II.

21 TPU is not strong enough to get you most nice resorts. Stay away from RCI with this week.


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## basl99

i need help with a deposit
i own 25,000 credits/ year with worldmark
i own 1 week sheraton vistana
i want to deposit vistana with interval 
how do i do this
i am getting a huge run around


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## tschwa2

If you don't have an interval account you will need to pay to set one up.  Let them know you have Worldmark and Sheraton Vistana and see if they have any 2 for 1 or 3 for 1 new membership deals.  Membership in II typically costs $89 per year but you may get multiple years for the price of one when first setting it up.    Once the account is set up you should be able to deposit with Interval.


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## T-Dot-Traveller

BryanL said:


> my vistana time share has a tpu of 21
> is that good?



"GOOD" is all relative to the MF .

If your MF were $ 200 then 21 TPU would be at a cost below $10 per TPU . 
If your MF is $1000 then your cost is close to $ 50 per ( not good at all  )  Combine fees and yearly cost of RCI membership add some $ BUT the big
question is always cost per TPU .  Lockoffs deposited separately , generally get more TPU's then if done as a single deposit .


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## Panina

T-Dot-Traveller said:


> "GOOD" is all relative to the MF .
> 
> If your MF were $ 200 then 21 TPU would be at a cost below $10 per TPU .
> If your MF is $1000 then your cost is close to $ 50 per ( not good at all  )  Combine fees and yearly cost of RCI membership add some $ BUT the big
> question is always cost per TPU .  Lockoffs deposited separately , generally get more TPU's then if done as a single deposit .





BryanL said:


> my vistana time share has a tpu of 21
> is that good?



I would say if you use you unit most of the time then 21 tpu’s would be good.  Better to have a place you like to go and a lower tpu value when you trade.  Of course, better to have both.


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## Caligirlfrtx

DeniseM said:


> I believe you mean Sheraton Vistana.  Since you have a fixed week, I'm going to guess it is Sheraton Vistana _Resort_.  (As opposed to Sheraton Vistana _Villages_.)
> 
> You can deposit your 2019 week now, if you pay your maintenance fee.  You can dermine the TPU by using the deposit calculator on the RCI website.
> 
> One thing to consider - this may be a better deposit for Interval, because with Interval you get the Vistana to Vistana priority.  In other words, you have priority to trade into other Vistana resorts.  The best practice is to put in an ongoing search on Interval, because ongoing searches are filled before anything goes online.  The inventory you see online is the left-overs.


Very good info. I just closed on a Vistana. So even though I cannot trade internally, I can trade Vistana/Vistana on II? Is this correct?


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## DeniseM

Yes, that is correct.


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## krj9999

Regardless of whether behind the scenes there are internal boosts to TPUs, no one will know that at this point if it (still?) exists.  If my summer east coast beach resort only gets 21 TPU, I'm not going to put in an ongoing search for HGVC in Hawaii when I see the few deposits that do show up listed in the 40s or 50s (and for which I can't instantly confirm using a 21 TPU deposit).  I will say prior to the TPU system, it was a much stronger trader in what it could pull - including HGVC Hawaii for example.



Cynic said:


> @tschwa2I'm not sure I should speculate on why there are so many hidden things. I know no two resorts are told the same thing by RCI... there are so many contractual differences it's impossible to remember them all. Some places can search first, for instance. Most can't. Some contracts prevent searching for larger units than owned even though they will pull them all day long (resort wants to upsell). Other contracts specifically state the smaller units at XYZ oceanfront resorts can trade for much larger units elsewhere.


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## Mosescan

I think I understand what cynic is getting at. Some resorts, because of an inter resort agreement will allow your 21 TPU to match their otherwise 30 TPU unit. I imagine that’s the only way some of the independent resorts can get traded.


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## ottawasquaw

Eric B said:


> It's got to be all relative to both supply and demand.  I took a quick look at RCI availability in Sedona; right now there are 1,544 check in nights available.  In Hawaii there are only 411 check in nights available.  I'm not sure how the volume of tourists visiting compares between the two, but it might be that Sedona has more supply available to meet its demand as compared to Hawaii.  In Las Vegas, RCI is showing 6,792 availabilities now.  Those numbers are on the points side; on the weeks side there are 1,042 in Sedona, 138 in Hawaii, and 1,717 in Las Vegas.  So there is also some market segmentation with more supply in Hawaii available to RCI points owners rather than weeks owners; it looks like ~68% of the availability in Sedona is in weeks while it's ~34% in Hawaii and ~25% in Las Vegas.  This is just my single data point snapshot of the situation; .


Available in what timeframe? If you mean February, I'm not so sure this is an equal comparison. I know plenty of people who would want to go to Hawaii in February, while it may be the only month I've not visited Sedona. There are definitely higher demand months.
I would think the other Sedona owner may be feeling the effects of VEP which the OP has described. There is at least one regular TUG poster who brags about the RCI trading power of his Sedona T/S.


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## ottawasquaw

Cynic said:


> Not all GC are created equal. Not at all. Some are VEP down and out of range for others. Others will be trading value issues. The measures you guys see are ... like maybe half the picture at best.


Clearly this is a fair statement based on the responses you have rec'd here. I'm curious too, when were your employment dates with RCI? I thought Crystal has been gone for years. You sound a lot like a very nice employee who helped me years ago.
Your statements about the furniture is spot on. I've read those sorts of comments for years about units. And space banking early has always been true. Hopefully this has been a help to members.


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## Eric B

ottawasquaw said:


> Available in what timeframe? If you mean February, I'm not so sure this is an equal comparison. I know plenty of people who would want to go to Hawaii in February, while it may be the only month I've not visited Sedona. There are definitely higher demand months.
> I would think the other Sedona owner may be feeling the effects of VEP which the OP has described. There is at least one regular TUG poster who brags about the RCI trading power of his Sedona T/S.



I counted up all available weeks that showed up in RCI at the time I searched.  You could do a more focused search on time of year, but no info on that was posted by the Sedona TS owner, so I didn’t.


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## theo

Laurie said:


> Cynic, how long ago did you leave RCI?



Did I miss something, or has there been "crickets" from Cynic on this question since it was posed about a month ago?

A time frame (even if only rough approximation) would go a long way toward putting Cynic's input into context, particularly in view of changing RCI practices in recent years (the post-lawsuit creation of "TPU's" being a noteworthy example).


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## Mosescan

theo said:


> Did I miss something, or has there been "crickets" from Cynic on this question since it was posed about a month ago?
> 
> A time frame (even if only rough approximation) would go a long way toward putting Cynic's input into context, particularly in view of changing RCI practices in recent years (the post-lawsuit creation of "TPU's" being a noteworthy example).


Cynics pattern seems to be to check the board every so often and then reply to the last batch of questions all at the same time in consecutive posts.


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## Laurie

theo said:


> Did I miss something, or has there been "crickets" from Cynic on this question since it was posed about a month ago?
> 
> A time frame (even if only rough approximation) would go a long way toward putting Cynic's input into context, particularly in view of changing RCI practices in recent years (the post-lawsuit creation of "TPU's" being a noteworthy example).



I'm guessing more than 5 years ... some of this verbage such as "VEP" reminds me of conversations we had about 10 years ago with RCI personnel, back when trade power was more hidden. So some of Cynic's advice seems outdated. However, I'm always willing to listen, and TUGgers are chiming in with good info.


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## ottawasquaw

Laurie said:


> I'm guessing more than 5 years ... some of this verbage such as "VEP" reminds me of conversations we had about 10 years ago with RCI personnel, back when trade power was more hidden. So some of Cynic's advice seems outdated. However, I'm always willing to listen, and TUGgers are chiming in with good info.


My take, too. Always open to conversation, though. Personally, I have not used RCI or been a member for years. Still, it seems to thrive. While some of us do just fine without it, I think my mom has pretty good success using it. She is a Ninja though, LOL!


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## tonyg

Many years ago there was an RCI employee that gave us a lot of inside data until RCI figured out who he was. I cancelled my RCI membership a long time ago and would not consider rejoining if I owned a resort that traded with them. After looking at this thread, I don't see anything unexpected or shocking being exposed.


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## Egret1986

tonyg said:


> After looking at this thread, I don't see anything unexpected or shocking being exposed.



Nope, no new news here.


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## baspinall

I have a timeshare at Vacation Village in Weston FL. We have owned it for over 15 years and been with RCI. We haven't had the best luck with RCI for the last few years. I just now learned that I can internally exchange with affiliated resorts. How does this work ? Also how does this work with relation to RCI?


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## tschwa2

All it means is that if your unit is in weeks, not RCI points, the exchange fee is lower when exchanging into another VV affiliate.   If you paid to upgrade to Vacation Village plus or platinum or whatever they are calling it, there are discounts for all RCI exchanges and bigger discount for internal exchanges to affiliates.


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## baspinall

So I can't exchange directly with an affiliate. I still have to go through RCI? I see a few affiliates in CA that are NEVER available when looking on RCI's site


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## tschwa2

baspinall said:


> So I can't exchange directly with an affiliate. I still have to go through RCI? I see a few affiliates in CA that are NEVER available when looking on RCI's site


Try an ongoing search.


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## baspinall

Been there done that for a long time.


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## beachgurl

baspinall said:


> So I can't exchange directly with an affiliate. I still have to go through RCI? I see a few affiliates in CA that are NEVER available when looking on RCI's site


This is off of the VV website:
Timeshare is exchangeable thru Resort Condominiums International (RCI), Platinum Interchange or Interval International. *You can also internally exchange to sixty Vacation Village Resorts and Affiliates.*

I would call the VV - Concierge Department:  888 629 9593 and inquire how to do the internal exchange.


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## Eric B

Interesting.  Since I'd be quite interested in that as well and they didn't answer the phone, I sent the following e-mail to the one listed with the phone number you provided,concierge@vacationvillageresorts.com.

To Whom It May Concern:


I own several Vacation Village and affiliate weeks at Massanutten Woodstone, Summit and Fort Lauderdale Beach Resort.  The Woodstone and Fort Lauderdale ones are in the RCI points program, but someone just pointed out to me that on your website at http://www.vacationvillageresorts.com/VVR/explore_timeshare.php it states:


*Explore Timeshare *

Timeshare vacations offer families upscale villa resorts and cherished memories at affordable prices. Today’s timeshares are about flexibility, choice and comfort. Whatever your stage of life, there has never been a better time to discover timeshare vacations through Vacation Village Resorts. 

The Timeshare industry over the last twenty five years has evolved from fixed weeks to floating weeks and now Points programs. Each transition along the way provided timeshare owners with greater flexibility planning their vacations. Only Vacation Village Resorts offers all three types of ownership to discerning owners. 

*Why Timeshare *

*Points* - With Points you have the flexibility to choose how many days you want to stay or where you want to stay. You can use Points to book airlines, hotel stays, rent a car or book a cruise, and more through our Points Partner's Programs. 

*Flexibility* - Exchangeable Worldwide - Timeshare is exchangeable to almost 4,000 destinations and over 100 countries world wide thru Resort Condominiums International (RCI), Platinum Interchange or Interval International. You can also internally exchange to sixty Vacation Village Resorts and Affiliates. 

*Memories* - Family vacations strengthen family bonds while creating a lifetime of memories. 

*Great Vacation Value* - Timeshare allows you to lock in future vacations with today’s dollars. For the cost of about seven family vacations you can leverage your leisure dollars into a lifetime of cherished memories. 

*Comforts of home* - Owners stay in superior accommodations at luxury resorts. Most accommodations are spacious condominiums with fully equipped kitchens and multiple bedrooms with award winning amenities.


I’m interested in the highlighted sentence and attempted to call, but apparently the concierges are a bit busy with other customers.  Can you tell me how the internal exchange system works?  Because it is described in the highlighted sentence as being an additional system of exchanging to RCI, Platinum Interchange and Interval International, I wanted to explore how this works; I assume it is different than the discounted RCI exchange programs described at http://www.internalexchange.net.  Truly appreciate whatever information you can provide on how the system works and what I need to do in order to participate; this had not been explained to me when I purchased these timeshares, but it may be a program that did not exist at the time.


Very Many Thanks in advance for your help on this!  I look forward to hearing back from you so that I can share the information with several of my friends that also own Vacation Village resorts.


Regards,​I'll update this once I hear back from them.  They've got a decent number of resorts in a good spread of places; it might be worth it depending on the cost and resort week exchange rates....


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## beachgurl

Eric B said:


> Interesting.  Since I'd be quite interested in that as well and they didn't answer the phone, I sent the following e-mail to the one listed with the phone number you provided,concierge@vacationvillageresorts.com.
> ​
> I look forward to seeing what response you get, and to learn how it works.


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## beachgurl

You may have already tried this, but I found this link in another forum post. 

http://www.internalexchange.net/


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## Eric B

baspinall said:


> So I can't exchange directly with an affiliate. I still have to go through RCI? I see a few affiliates in CA that are NEVER available when looking on RCI's site



Had some spare time on my hands, so I was checking this out a bit; the VV affiliated resorts in CA that don't show up a lot in RCI are Aquamarine Villas, Casa de la Playa, Laguna Shores, and Laguna Surf.  If you go to their web sites, they're all managed by Tricom Management, Inc., which seems to be tightly bound to the Platinum Interchange as the exchange company.  I hadn't really known about that one before I saw them discussed on the VV site page that says there is an internal exchange program, so I don't know much about it, but if you want to go to those resorts, you might have to go through them.


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## Eric B

beachgurl said:


> You may have already tried this, but I found this link in another forum post.
> 
> http://www.internalexchange.net/



I’ve seen it; that’s going through RCI.  The way it’s presented on the VV website is you can (1) exchange in RCI, (2) Platinum Interchange, or (3) Interval International and also by (4) internal exchange.  They didn’t say internal exchange using RCI; that’s what I was asking about.


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## tschwa2

My understanding is the internal exchange is only available to Vacation Plus/platinum members.  Definitely not resale and even older retail isn't included.  You need to have bought retail within the last -maybe 3 years, or paid a fee or bought an additional unit to convert you resale or older retail to the plus/platinum plan.  I don't think this can be done for less than $4000 and it may even be higher.

I also don't know if Massanutten offers the program.  It is an affiliate but a different developer (Great Eastern) than the direct Vacation Villages properties.   

I don't like attending sales because of all of the incorrect information given.  If anyone can get a written description and details of the club (more than just notes taken during a sales meeting) I would love to see them.


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## Eric B

Last time I went was very recently in Weston, FL.  They were pushing the VV Preferred RCI program and never mentioned internal exchanges other than through RCI.  I had noticed a VIP check in area for VV Plus, Preferred & Premier members, and they were a bit hesitant to say anything about that level. The VV Plus & Preferred level have 90 day bonus weeks; they said Premier wasn’t official yet but would have 120 day bonus weeks.  The listing of VV Preferred benefits didn’t include anything for exchanging outside of RCI; there were a few things like Sam’ Club membership , though.  We didn’t bite; the lowest they got was $10k for a week in FL with a cruddy $/MF and we’ve got plenty of weeks.  Besides, I’d hold out for the Premier level after being told that’s coming.


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## TheTimeTraveler

Cynic said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> I'm a veteran RCI employee, no longer with the company. I'm willing to answer any and all questions you may have about exchanging your timeshare.
> 
> Much of how the system works is simply not disclosed to consumers, and I'd like to be instrumental in changing that.
> 
> I'm going to start a YouTube channel on this topic, and your questions will help me focus on issues most relevant to you.
> 
> I never signed a non-disclosure agreement with RCI, and own no stock in any timeshare developer or exchange.
> 
> My one and only goal is giving you the most accurate, helpful, and honest information possible.
> 
> Ask away, and you will be answered.
> 
> EDIT TO ADD: I know most about weeks, and my explanations of value and trading power are likely to be based on RW value, reflected in weeksexchanges and aftermarket purchases. A 90k timeshare may sell for 1k or less aftermarket. It's the nature of the beast.





Cynic;  This is very nice of you to offer up your advice and experience of the ins and outs of the RCI exchange program. 

With that said (and if you know), does Interval International run their operations identical to RCI ?   i.e. do they almost duplicate their operation based upon the RCI model ?   I know RCI was in operation prior to Interval International.

Thank you for your input.




.


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## fer829

I notice that Cynic only posted for 1 week, January 19-25.
I expect that any questions are not going to be answered by him anymore.


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## rickandcindy23

Yep, I think Cynic is done with TUG.  I hope not.


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## pedro47

To the OP, can you explain to us why some timeshare resorts are now charging resort fees to exchange guests?


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