# What were Westin Kierland Gold prices like in the beginning?



## Denise L (Aug 30, 2006)

Just curious. I was browsing an ebay listing for a Gold 2/2, with 81K Options. Not buying. Just wondering what the original prices were like...this one is at $13.5K right now.


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## zinger1457 (Aug 30, 2006)

deniselew said:
			
		

> Just curious. I was browsing an ebay listing for a Gold 2/2, with 81K Options. Not buying. Just wondering what the original prices were like...this one is at $13.5K right now.



A year ago it was around $22k.  They were pushing hard to sell the gold seasons and were offering a lot of starpoints.


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## BradC (Aug 30, 2006)

According to my notes, in September 2004, the developer price for a 2-bedroom Gold season was $19,995 (with 90,000 StarPoints bonus offered for purchasing).

At that time, buildings 1, 2, and 3 were finished and occupied, and they were starting to clear room for building 4, so it wasn't "the beginning," but pretty close.


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## DavidnRobin (Aug 30, 2006)

Sold for $13.9K - interesting - looks like someone sniped it.  For 81K SOs ($1100 MF) - seems like a good price for the SOs (a question I asked recently...).  Any TUGGER out there win the auction?

I wonder what the ROFR is for WK?


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## Ken555 (Aug 30, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> Sold for $13.9K - interesting - looks like someone sniped it.  For 81K SOs ($1100 MF) - seems like a good price for the SOs (a question I asked recently...).



Why is this a good price? My platinum fees are less than that (they're probably very close), at $950 plus II fees or so, and I only paid $6.5k more for the deed. Speaking for (at least) myself, it seems better to pay a bit more to get platinum and a full 148k Options for the same annual maintenance fee.


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## grgs (Aug 30, 2006)

Ken555 said:
			
		

> Why is this a good price? My platinum fees are less than that (they're probably very close), at $950 plus II fees or so, and I only paid $6.5k more for the deed. Speaking for (at least) myself, it seems better to pay a bit more to get platinum and a full 148k Options for the same annual maintenance fee.



LOL!  It's all relative.  For someone who owns at Westin St. John and WKORV, the sales price and mf for that Kierland resale probably don't look too bad!  I believe your mf on the Plat Kierland are same as the Gold.  Also, if you paid around $20K for a 2 bedroom Plat Kierland, I think you did very well--I'm not sure how many of those are floating around.  I would think mid-20's is more likely.  But, yes, I agree with you--it is nice to maximize the number of Options you get relative to your mf.


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## BradC (Aug 31, 2006)

Ken555 said:
			
		

> ... it seems better to pay a bit more to get platinum and a full 148k Options for the same annual maintenance fee.


Or alternately, buy the 1-bedroom Premium in Platinum season, which is also 81,000 StarOptions, but only about 65% of the maintenance fees of the 2-bedroom Gold season unit.


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## DavidnRobin (Aug 31, 2006)

Sorry - jet-lagged... you are correct, but I was mainly asking because of my previous inquiry about SOs and costs, but didn't consider MFs.

I track Westin on eBay, and it seemed reasonable compared to other auctions.

The WSJ units have lousy SOs, but what a sweet place...

Peace.


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## Ken555 (Aug 31, 2006)

grgs said:
			
		

> LOL!  It's all relative.  For someone who owns at Westin St. John and WKORV, the sales price and mf for that Kierland resale probably don't look too bad!  I believe your mf on the Plat Kierland are same as the Gold.  Also, if you paid around $20K for a 2 bedroom Plat Kierland, I think you did very well--I'm not sure how many of those are floating around.  I would think mid-20's is more likely.  But, yes, I agree with you--it is nice to maximize the number of Options you get relative to your mf.



True. I haven't looked in a while, so I just checked current resale Plat's at Kierland. I found two for $26k (at the place I bought mine for $20.5k just one year ago and RedWeek), one for $20k (though the site looks suspicious), another for $25k, and a few more. My impression is that there are fewer 2-bed Plats available right now compared to a year ago when I purchased.


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## Denise L (Aug 31, 2006)

Thanks for the posts.  I don't see too many Kierlands for sale, so this one was interesting.


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## DavidnRobin (Aug 31, 2006)

What are the current MFs for Kierland?


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## grgs (Aug 31, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> What are the current MFs for Kierland?



For a 2 bedroom: $1,044.72 (includes SVN fee & property tax)


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## BradC (Sep 1, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> What are the current MFs for Kierland?


According to the 2006 Association Expenses Summary on mystarcentral:

1br Deluxe:  $343.81
1br Premium:  $551.49
2br Lockout:  $895.30

That does not include any property taxes or SVN fees.  The property taxes on my 1br Deluxe were $19.38.


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## DavidnRobin (Sep 1, 2006)

Thanks for the info.   These MFs are sure a lot less than for WKORV S+N.

Sure would be great to have in one location the MFs for SVNs, along with known Developer costs, and resale cost ranges per unit in each season.


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## mesamirage (Oct 2, 2006)

*Best way to buy??*

I was looking at resales for Westin Kierland, and when looking at the options it seems I would be better off to purchase a Platinum EOY (148,100 points) for like $11,000 than to purchase an EY Gold? (81,000 points) for $12,000.  I know I would only have use every other year, but I would have access to the most desirable weeks those years and would not have to pay maint fees EVERY year.

Any feedback on the what would be the better approach to buying??

Thx


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## vacationtime1 (Oct 2, 2006)

mesamirage said:
			
		

> I was looking at resales for Westin Kierland, and when looking at the options it seems I would be better off to purchase a Platinum EOY (148,100 points) for like $11,000 than to purchase an EY Gold? (81,000 points) for $12,000.  I know I would only have use every other year, but I would have access to the most desirable weeks those years and would not have to pay maint fees EVERY year.
> 
> Any feedback on the what would be the better approach to buying??



Choosing between "the most desireable weeks" and annual usage is something only you can do, but if one of your goals is to maximize your StarOptions per dollar spent for exchange purposes, the Platinum is the hands-down winner.


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## DavidnRobin (Oct 2, 2006)

The best approach to TS buying is multi-faceted, and is based on your planned usage, financial situation, and what you want to get out of buying a TS.

The SO per dollar is lowest for the Platinum season - all else being equal.  The Platinum season is also best when it comes to MFs and SO value since the MFs are the same per season and are based on unit size.

However, fitting one's TS needs is also important in this decision - for example: 'Home' resort privledges vs. exchange value; resale ROI (return on investment); rent vs. MFs, and of course planned usage - and even worth considering (for some) are the Developer incentives.

Point being - there are a lot of considerations that need to be made in buying a TS.

I like the idea of buying where you want to go - however, some buy from the internal and external exchange aspect alone - and there are even those few that manage to 'flip' a TS when they get it below market value (and above the ROFR).

Food for thought - good luck in your purchase.


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## ccy (Oct 3, 2006)

deniselew said:
			
		

> Just curious. I was browsing an ebay listing for a Gold 2/2, with 81K Options. Not buying. Just wondering what the original prices were like...this one is at $13.5K right now.


There's a Westin Kierland 2 br lock off in Ebay right now ... for 81k star options which would you buy - 2br lo at WK in the gold season or 2br at VV in the platinum season?


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## DavidnRobin (Oct 3, 2006)

It would depend on what you would want to use it for.
VV is generally a better value SO-wise ($/SO).


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## Denise L (Oct 3, 2006)

ccy said:
			
		

> There's a Westin Kierland 2 br lock off in Ebay right now ... for 81k star options which would you buy - 2br lo at WK in the gold season or 2br at VV in the platinum season?



This looks like a relisting that originally was bid up to $13,900 on August 30. Interesting. I guess the deal didn't go through. It's only at a little over $6K right now.  MFs & taxes are listed at $1045. Oh, and it had 50 bids last month.


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## BradC (Oct 3, 2006)

deniselew said:
			
		

> This looks like a relisting that originally was bid up to $13,900 on August 30. Interesting. I guess the deal didn't go through.


Final sale price:  $12,650.


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## Denise L (Oct 3, 2006)

BradC said:
			
		

> Final sale price:  $12,650.



Yes, interesting. I wonder if a TUGer got it?!


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## DavidnRobin (Oct 4, 2006)

deniselew said:
			
		

> Yes, interesting. I wonder if a TUGer got it?!



Perhaps worth mentioning - if you read the ad carefully prior to the auction end - it stated (no longer now that bidding is over) that this is a non-binding bid, and only opens negotiations for purchase.  I thought that was interesting - or perhaps I have never paid attention, but this is different than what other bid sections for TSs have stated.  Maybe why this may have been a relist?

$12,650 seems reasonable at 15.6c/SO - you'd likely have to go with 148.1K SOs to get them cheaper at WKV


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## saluki (Oct 4, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> Perhaps worth mentioning - if you read the ad carefully prior to the auction end - it stated (no longer now that bidding is over) that this is a non-binding bid, and only opens negotiations for purchase.  I thought that was interesting - or perhaps I have never paid attention, but this is different than what other bid sections for TSs have stated.  Maybe why this may have been a relist?
> 
> $12,650 seems reasonable at 15.6c/SO - you'd likely have to go with 148.1K SOs to get them cheaper at WKV



That seems pretty shady. The seller should be required to set a reserve price or sell to the highest bidder.


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## DavidnRobin (Oct 4, 2006)

saluki said:
			
		

> That seems pretty shady. The seller should be required to set a reserve price or sell to the highest bidder.


I thought it was strange also - the seller (tochoa25) had a WKORV that states that it is a binding offer, but the WKV was more vague - in the bottom of the ad it states "Your bid is an intention to purchase not a contract for discussion" however, in the bidding section it stated it was non-binding.

Given that it was listed as a private listing (to supposedly protect bidders IDs) - what is to stop the seller from just bidding on it (using another eBay account) to a price they want - and if they don't get it - just relist and try again.  OR contacting the next highest bidder and making a second-chance offer.


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## DavidnRobin (Oct 5, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> I thought it was strange also - the seller (tochoa25) had a WKORV that states that it is a binding offer, but the WKV was more vague - in the bottom of the ad it states "Your bid is an intention to purchase not a contract for discussion" however, in the bidding section it stated it was non-binding.
> 
> Given that it was listed as a private listing (to supposedly protect bidders IDs) - what is to stop the seller from just bidding on it (using another eBay account) to a price they want - and if they don't get it - just relist and try again.  OR contacting the next highest bidder and making a second-chance offer.



and so the story goes...

It appears that this WKV 2Bd LO Gold (81K SOs) has been relisted
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...60038427167&rd=1&sspagename=STRK:MEWA:IT&rd=1

Look at the bidding section - it states "*This is a non-binding auction. By bidding, you are not entering into a contract to purchase this property. You are, however, expressing serious interest in the property and in pursuing contract discussions if you win.*"  Yet in the ad it states "*You bid is an intention to purchase not a contract for discussion*"

So this seller has a private ID auction with no reserve - where someone (hidden eBay ID - perhaps a seller proxy?) bids using a maximum bid that is preset and wins (in this case for $12,650) and yet it gets immediately relisted???  (again?)  Why??? probably because they do not want to set a reserve or a high initial starting bid. 

{I call 'BS!'} :ignore: 

So it looks as if that is exactly what is happening here.  I would stay away from this eBay seller! (tochoa25 - The Timeshare Group)

Don't they have to automatically pay the eBay fee when an auction is completed successfully?


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## timeandenergy (Oct 5, 2006)

I can't believe it is relisted again!!!  I definitely think something is shady with this ad.  It actually now has a reserve.  Do you think the seller will reveal what the reserve is?  I would stay away from at least this listing and possibly even the seller.


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## DavidnRobin (Oct 5, 2006)

timeandenergy said:
			
		

> I can't believe it is relisted again!!!  I definitely think something is shady with this ad.  It actually now has a reserve.  Do you think the seller will reveal what the reserve is?  I would stay away from at least this listing and possibly even the seller.



It could be a different unit (benefit of doubt).  The Title Co fees are too high - and there is a so-called $25 resort transfer fee of which doesn't exist for SVN mandatory resorts.

I do not know if the seller will tell you the reserve price - but I believe he wants 13K.  {a bit of prior sleuthing}  

I still think the "This is a non-binding auction. By bidding, you are not entering into a contract to purchase this property. You are, however, expressing serious interest in the property and in pursuing contract discussions if you win." - is totally ridiculous, and not sure why a seller would pay the end of auction fees associated with doing this since a potential buyer could easily back out of this bid (or even the seller).


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## DavidnRobin (Oct 10, 2006)

Update: never met reserve - final bid $9600 - much less than the previous bid of $12,650 of the previous listing.  Goes to show that the reserve auction is a bad idea when selling on eBay.


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## Denise L (Oct 10, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> Update: never met reserve - final bid $9600 - much less than the previous bid of $12,650 of the previous listing.  Goes to show that the reserve auction is a bad idea when selling on eBay.



Interesting. Let's assume that they were all separate listings...$12,900, $12,650 and $9600. I think the first two had reserves though, didn't they?


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## DavidnRobin (Oct 10, 2006)

Not the $12,650 auction - and I don't think the higher one had a reserve, but don't have the info anymore (wasn't it $13,900?)


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## Denise L (Oct 10, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> Not the $12,650 auction - and I don't think the higher one had a reserve, but don't have the info anymore (wasn't it $13,900?)



Yes, sorry, $13,900, not $12,900.

$9600, for the amount of Staroptions, is getting close to VV resale pricing  .


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## DavidnRobin (Oct 10, 2006)

reserve wasn't met - and it was a 'non-binding' auction - whatever that means ?


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## Denise L (Oct 10, 2006)

blujahz said:
			
		

> reserve wasn't met - and it was a 'non-binding' auction - whatever that means ?



Even though the reserve wasn't met, it's still interesting. Makes me wonder what the next listing will go for!


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