# Overseas Car Rental Coverage



## Blues (Jul 18, 2012)

I'm doing my last-minute due-diligence before heading over to Paris/London/Scotland for 3 weeks -- wife's chorus is singing at the Olympics  

After the Olympics tour, DW and I are heading up to Scotland for 11 days, and renting a car for a week.  I've confirmed that my Visa card will cover the CDW, so I'm good there.  Next, I called my car insurance carrier, GEICO, to confirm coverage overseas.  And much to my amazement and chagrin, I'm not covered overseas!   

So, it appears I'll have damage to the car covered, but not primary liability.  I'm renting through National Car Rental, and their web site is remarkably unhelpful in determining what coverage I get with their base rental fee, and what I can add on site.

So I'm exploring my options.  I recall someone talking about Premium coverage that you can add onto an AmEx card.  Does that include liability?

I'm also thinking of changing my rental to go through one of the agencies talked about on the Europe board, that includes full coverage.  Recommendations there?

Basically, what do I do to make sure I'm covered for liability?  I have a personal liability umbrella policy.  I guess I could depend on that; but it makes me nervous.  Thanks.

-Bob


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## Jimster (Jul 18, 2012)

*amex*

yes.  Contact Amex.  You can find it on their website too.


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## Blues (Jul 18, 2012)

Good news.  I just called National Car Rental, and 3rd party liability is included in the basic rental package in the UK.  Unlimited Bodily Injury, and Property Damage was somewhere in the $millions.

I think I'm going to decline all coverages and go with their basic liability, and Visa's CDW coverage.

-Bob


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## PStreet1 (Jul 18, 2012)

Just a thought that might make you want to check on American Express again.  The American Express coverage ($17.00-$25.00 total cost for up to 65 days rental--actual amount depends on the state where you live) includes coverage for hospitalization in case of an accident and coverage for your personal items that might be stolen.  It does not include 3rd person liability, but National has you covered on that.  AND the American Express coverage that you add is primary; your own insurance company won't even get a call.  The insurance that is just included with American Express has smaller limits and is not primary.

It's called premium insurance and it will kick in every time you rent a car using your American Express card once you add it----but you can cancel it anytime and re-ad it if you want.  When we don't want it to apply, we just use a different credit card.


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## WinniWoman (Jul 18, 2012)

Really scrutinize the insurance. In many cases, the DRIVER of the rental car is not covered for liability, believe it or not! My umbrella policy at home in the US supposedly did cover some other things, but I took out the full coverage through Hertz- everything- for our trip to Scotland last month after finding a million little "holes" in the credit card coverages. And, make sure Visa will cover you if you take out insurance with the car rental place. Some credit card companies' insurance is automatically void if you take out insurance with the car rental company.


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## Blues (Jul 18, 2012)

mpumilia said:


> And, make sure Visa will cover you if you take out insurance with the car rental place. Some credit card companies' insurance is automatically void if you take out insurance with the car rental company.



Right.  Visa explicitly requires you to decline the car rental CDW as a condition that the Visa CDW is valid.  That's why I want to decline the extra coverages from National, as long as their base coverage includes 3rd party liability; which they claim it does.

-Bob


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## bobpark56 (Jul 18, 2012)

I had the same issue recently when arranging a car hire for Spain next March. What I learned (I think) is that, in Spain, personal liability insurance follows the car, not the driver, hence it is included in the rental. I think they said this is the general practice in Europe. (If his is incorrect, please advise.)

Perhaps the same holds where you will be driving.

  --bp


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## flexible (Jul 19, 2012)

When we rented a car from Hertz in Dublin in 2009 they required a 3000 Euro deposit because we insisted on declining their insurance options.

I've been keeping our AX card solely because of the Premium car rental insurance option that we used numerous times. (It excluded 6 countries - Ireland, Italy, Austalia, NZ, Israel and another). I haven't read their policy over again recently though.

Which VISA card covers your CDW? We have several VISA/MCs but somehow I thought some of them dropped or drastically changed their car rental coverage after the 2008 financial crisis.


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## Blues (Jul 19, 2012)

flexible said:


> Which VISA card covers your CDW? We have several VISA/MCs but somehow I thought some of them dropped or drastically changed their car rental coverage after the 2008 financial crisis.



I'll be using my CapitalOne Visa.  But the coverage isn't through them.  I called them, and they referred me to the general Visa number at 1-800-VISA911.  So apparently it's coverage for ALL Visa cards, offered by Visa corporate.

-Bob


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Jul 19, 2012)

flexible said:


> When we rented a car from Hertz in Dublin in 2009 they required a 3000 Euro deposit because we insisted on declining their insurance options.
> 
> I've been keeping our AX card solely because of the Premium car rental insurance option that we used numerous times. (It excluded 6 countries - Ireland, Italy, Austalia, NZ, Israel and another). I haven't read their policy over again recently though.
> 
> Which VISA card covers your CDW? We have several VISA/MCs but somehow I thought some of them dropped or drastically changed their car rental coverage after the 2008 financial crisis.





Blues said:


> I'll be using my CapitalOne Visa.  But the coverage isn't through them.  I called them, and they referred me to the general Visa number at 1-800-VISA911.  So apparently it's coverage for ALL Visa cards, offered by Visa corporate.
> 
> -Bob


I used to think it was included in all VISA card summaries until a couple of weeks ago when I was looking at benefits provided by the various Alaska Airlines VISA options.  The summary indicated that the basic, "plain vanilla" Alaska Airlines VISA cards did not include car rental insurance coverage.  Coverage was included with the Alaska Platinum and Signature VISA cards however.


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## Passepartout (Jul 19, 2012)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> Coverage was included with the Alaska Platinum and Signature VISA cards however.



Methinks it is similar with MasterCard. Coverage is included with Platinum and above iirc.

Jim


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## Jimster (Jul 19, 2012)

*insurance*

Amex coverage is primary and lower limits of liability.  thats a big difference.  Most CDW coverage is secondary.  That means they go after your insurance first and if there is anything left they go to the cdw company.  That means a claim on your insurance for sure.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Jul 19, 2012)

Jimster said:


> Amex coverage is primary and lower limits of liability.  thats a big difference.  Most CDW coverage is secondary.  That means they go after your insurance first and if there is anything left they go to the cdw company.  That means a claim on your insurance for sure.


The terms on my VISA say that for rentals outside my country of residence the card coverage is primary.  There are also several countries where coverage is not provided.


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## Blues (Jul 19, 2012)

Jimster said:


> Amex coverage is primary and lower limits of liability.  thats a big difference.  Most CDW coverage is secondary.  That means they go after your insurance first and if there is anything left they go to the cdw company.  That means a claim on your insurance for sure.



Well, since GEICO has no coverage in Scotland, I won't have to worry about a claim on my insurance originating there  



T_R_Oglodyte said:


> The terms on my VISA say that for rentals outside my country of residence the card coverage is primary.  There are also several countries where coverage is not provided.



Yep, I printed out the CDW page from visa.com, and it says essentially the same thing.  It's primary outside the US.

-Bob


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## PStreet1 (Jul 19, 2012)

bobpark56 said:


> I had the same issue recently when arranging a car hire for Spain next March. What I learned (I think) is that, in Spain, personal liability insurance follows the car, not the driver, hence it is included in the rental. I think they said this is the general practice in Europe. (If his is incorrect, please advise.)
> 
> Perhaps the same holds where you will be driving.
> 
> --bp


Just a note on renting in Spain.  We were really, really pleased with our rental fro SIXT--almost new, a very roomy "scenic" Renault--and it was about $150.00 (dollars, not euros) for 8 days, and it definitely included the 3rd party liability.  (We used the American Express premium insurance for the other coverage.)


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## Blues (Jul 20, 2012)

Yes, I've heard a lot of good things about SIXT.  Unfortunately, they won't do one-way rentals between Edinburgh and Aberdeen.  Not sure if they don't do one-ways in general, or if it's something about these two cities.

-Bob


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## Dollie (Jul 20, 2012)

*Another consideration for Seniors*

We are off to Scotland in Sept.  When I did the rental car for this trip I found a surcharge for seniors that I had never run into before.  We just lucked out, my husband turns 70 in Oct.  Will have to watch for this from now on.

_Budget Scotland:_  Rental drivers: Minimum Age 23, Maximum Age 75. Young driver surcharge for renter 23 to 25 12.93 GBP per day, maximum 129.30 GBP per rental. Senior driver surcharge for renter 70 to 75 12.93 GBP per day, maximum 129.30 GBP per rental.

_Budget USA:_  no maximum age restrictions

_Thrifty Scotland:_  Renters aged 70-75 are subject to a senior driver surcharge of GBP 10.00/day. Senior drivers must be liable for the deductible on the vehicle (unless credit card coverage used). 

_Thrifty USA: _no maximum age restrictions


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## flexible (Jul 20, 2012)

Jimster said:


> Amex coverage is primary and lower limits of liability.  thats a big difference.  Most CDW coverage is secondary.  That means they go after your insurance first and if there is anything left they go to the cdw company.  That means a claim on your insurance for sure.



Jim,
We nearly always cancel insurance for our cars when we leave the US by plane since most trips are over 3-6 months. We start the insurance the day before we arrive home in the US by plane so our personal automobile policy should cover liability for a Hertz rental car from SFO-home.

When you wrote Amex is primary and lowers the limits of liability but most CDW is secondary, will Amex be primary for CDW if we have no other insurance except perhaps a travel insurance policy? (We are researching which travel insurance policy to purchase.)


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## Jwerking (Aug 1, 2012)

*Cancelling car insurance temporarily?*



flexible said:


> Jim,
> We nearly always cancel insurance for our cars when we leave the US by plane since most trips are over 3-6 months. We start the insurance the day before we arrive home in the US by plane so our personal automobile policy should cover liability for a Hertz rental car from SFO-home.
> 
> When you wrote Amex is primary and lowers the limits of liability but most CDW is secondary, will Amex be primary for CDW if we have no other insurance except perhaps a travel insurance policy? (We are researching which travel insurance policy to purchase.)



Hello Flexible:

We are going to be out of the country for 5 months. Do you have any problems with reinstating your car insurance upon return?  Do they charge you a carrying fee of some type during your absence?

Thanks for your help.

Joyce


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## PStreet1 (Aug 1, 2012)

flexible said:


> Jim,
> We nearly always cancel insurance for our cars when we leave the US by plane since most trips are over 3-6 months. We start the insurance the day before we arrive home in the US by plane so our personal automobile policy should cover liability for a Hertz rental car from SFO-home.
> 
> When you wrote Amex is primary and lowers the limits of liability but most CDW is secondary, will Amex be primary for CDW if we have no other insurance except perhaps a travel insurance policy? (We are researching which travel insurance policy to purchase.)



When I talked to American Express, what I came away with (not necessarily what was said) was:
1.  The regular Am. Express coverage that doesn't cost you anything extra, that just comes with using the card to rent a car is NOT primary and has lower limits.
2.  The Premium American Express coverage that you can add to your American Express card (doesn't cost anything to add it; it only has a cost when you use the card to rent a car) costs about $20.00--the actual cost depends on the state you live in--for the ENTIRE rental period up to 65 days (or so).  It has much higher limits, and it is primary; your own insurance company will not be contacted.  It covers the vehicle itself, theft of personal items, hospitalization, etc.  

Since it has nothing to do with your insurance, presumably it wouldn't matter whether your insurance was in effect or not----I'm sure a phone call would get full details.


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## Jwerking (Aug 2, 2012)

PStreet1 said:


> When I talked to American Express, what I came away with (not necessarily what was said) was:
> 1.  The regular Am. Express coverage that doesn't cost you anything extra, that just comes with using the card to rent a car is NOT primary and has lower limits.
> 2.  The Premium American Express coverage that you can add to your American Express card (doesn't cost anything to add it; it only has a cost when you use the card to rent a car) costs about $20.00--the actual cost depends on the state you live in--for the ENTIRE rental period up to 65 days (or so).  It has much higher limits, and it is primary; your own insurance company will not be contacted.  It covers the vehicle itself, theft of personal items, hospitalization, etc.
> 
> Since it has nothing to do with your insurance, presumably it wouldn't matter whether your insurance was in effect or not----I'm sure a phone call would get full details.



Thank you, Pat, for the explanation and certainly something I will add to my AMEX card - something I checked out after reading this discussion yesterday.  Unfortunately, the AMEX premium coverage excludes car rentals in New Zealand and that is where we will be renting a car for abou6 60 days. 

Also, checked my own car insurance policy and found it does NOT cover car rentals in foreign countries - what a bummer.  

Did some research on the insurance coverage for the two cars reserved on the North and South Island of NZ.  It appears one company provides third party liability coverage of $1 million NZD ($800K USD)  and the second company only provides $300K USD.  Lesson learned - helps to read the fine print.  I will likely change the car rental for the south island even though the costs is significantly higher with the other company. 

But will surely check out canceling our car insurance at home for the 5 months we are gone since no one will be driving the cars and 2 of the 3 cars are parked in our garage.

Joyce


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## LisaH (Aug 2, 2012)

Could someone post a weblink to American Express Premium Insurance Coverage? Last time I contacted them, they claimed that it's not available to CA residences. Maybe the policy has been changed?


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## PStreet1 (Aug 2, 2012)

We have residence in Arizona and California; they were uncertain which to use and took both addresses.  They charged us for California (which costs less), so evidently it is available in California.  To reach them, I think a phone call is required--though there may be a web link.....just don't know.


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## Ken555 (Aug 2, 2012)

LisaH said:


> Could someone post a weblink to American Express Premium Insurance Coverage? Last time I contacted them, they claimed that it's not available to CA residences. Maybe the policy has been changed?



https://www295.americanexpress.com/premium/car-rental-insurance-mvt/home.do

$17.95 per rental for California residents.

Note that if you use Priceline for rental and you want this coverage you need to call prior to the rental pickup date so they know to charge you.


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## Gophesjo (Aug 2, 2012)

I haven't read this entire thread, but I do have experience with the issue of rental car coverage overseas.  I had a minor scrape in a rental car in France that was my fault (luckily no other vehicles or people were involved, so I did not get a ticket).  I had not purchased any kind of local coverage, depending entirely instead on the coverage included in the benefits associated with a Platinum Visa Card that I had used to reserve the vehicle, as well as pay the rental charges.  It took about three months for the matter to be entirely resolved, but Visa did everything I had hoped they would do in taking care of the charges.


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## Jwerking (Aug 3, 2012)

Jwerking said:


> Also, checked my own car insurance policy and found it does NOT cover car rentals in foreign countries - what a bummer.
> 
> Did some research on the insurance coverage for the two cars reserved on the North and South Island of NZ.  It appears one company provides third party liability coverage of $1 million NZD ($800K USD)  and the second company only provides $300K USD.  Lesson learned - helps to read the fine print.  I will likely change the car rental for the south island even though the costs is significantly higher with the other company.
> 
> ...



Update - not good news.  In my email correspondence with the NZ car rental company, the rep states that the insurance liability coverage is for property damage only to third parties and NOT bodily injury.  She states  " Your Car Insurance will not cover any injury to the 3rd party or to yourself but will be treated just like a New Zealander in accordance with our policy called Accident Compensation Corporation where the NZ government will cover all Medical cost that will be incurred due to the accident."  

I will check this out on the International board and see if I can any Kiwis to verify if this is true.  If it is, I guess that I am good to go.  A bit scary since their laws are different than ours here in the US.

Also, my car insurance company states that I have to cancel my Virginia state car tags if I want to cancel my car insurance for the 5 months we will be gone.  VA requires all licensed cars in the state to have insurance coverage - so legally I guess the insurance co is correct.  The rep suggested that I could drop the collision and keep the liability and comprehensive - which would save some money.  The comprehensive provides coverage for thief - think someone will steal one of our cars when we are gone?  Or maybe a tree will fall on one of them or a flash flood will wash it away?

Joyce


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