# Poll: Guess when Abound will actually launch



## sponger76 (Oct 1, 2022)

I know the latest info is that Abound will launch "late October," but people have started to see their statuses change, so some movement is happening already. With that being said, when do you expect to actually see the official launch?


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## TravelTime (Oct 1, 2022)

What I wonder about is how much time they will give to use the points if people deposit their Vistana week. I wonder if they will give extra time to use the points. I think they should make an exception for the launch and give extra time to encourage deposits.


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## kozykritter (Oct 1, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> What I wonder about is how much time they will give to use the points if people deposit their Vistana week. I wonder if they will give extra time to use the points. I think they should make an exception for the launch and give extra time to encourage deposits.


The points will be good for the 2023 calendar use year and bankable for use in 2024 and possibly 2025 depending upon your status level. That's the same as any trust points owner at MVC. I don't see them changing this for this situation.


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## dioxide45 (Oct 1, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> What I wonder about is how much time they will give to use the points if people deposit their Vistana week. I wonder if they will give extra time to use the points. I think they should make an exception for the launch and give extra time to encourage deposits.


They have already stated that Vistana owners will be able to elect their 2023 Vistana VOIs for Club Points through December 31, 2022.


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## kozykritter (Oct 1, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> They have already stated that Vistana owners will be able to elect their 2023 Vistana VOIs for Club Points through December 31, 2022.


The OP was talking about using the elected points, not the time frame for electing them.


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## ocdb8r (Oct 7, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> What I wonder about is how much time they will give to use the points if people deposit their Vistana week. I wonder if they will give extra time to use the points. I think they should make an exception for the launch and give extra time to encourage deposits.


Isn't banking "free" under the new unified membership fee structure?  Would seem if you elect your 2023 points before the end of this year, you have quite a decent runway for using them (given you can bank - although the banking usage is more limited under Abound).


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## timsi (Oct 7, 2022)

Anybody who deposits into Abound this year will only be able to book the 2023 leftovers. If many deposits are made with the idea of using the points in 2024, there will be additional pressure on the Abound inventory for that year without offering in exchange good 2023 Vistana inventory. If Marriott wants a launch that is somewhat normal (at least regarding the inventory), they should probably push it back to the next year. I know it does not look good, but we are used to it by now.


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## timsi (Oct 7, 2022)

sponger76 said:


> I know the latest info is that Abound will launch "late October," but people have started to see their statuses change, so some movement is happening already. With that being said, when do you expect to actually see the official launch?


The status change is a sign that things are moving forward but not a big sign.  A status change is relatively easy once you have the list of people that should have a certain status. The reservation system on the other hand is an everchanging environment that requires a lot more consideration and they have to make sure all the Vistana rules are taken into account.


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## chris1278 (Oct 7, 2022)

Is there much info or any idea what will be sold after the program officially launches? Will the Flex products still be offered or will it be Destination Points? Will Abound remain just a trading platform? 

I'm sure it's all speculation right now. But I'm curious if anyone thinks the product is going to change.


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## TravelTime (Oct 7, 2022)

ocdb8r said:


> Isn't banking "free" under the new unified membership fee structure?  Would seem if you elect your 2023 points before the end of this year, you have quite a decent runway for using them (given you can bank - although the banking usage is more limited under Abound).



I mentioned this mainly for people who used to have 2 years of banking in Vistana and now only get 1 or 1.5 years. I am moving up to Chairman’s level so I will still get 2 years. However, for my already banked weeks, I wonder if the system will extend the banking to 2 years on those weeks. When I moved from executive to presidential, they did extend the banking to 1.5 years on all my banked weeks. I hope they do that again.


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## dioxide45 (Oct 7, 2022)

chris1278 said:


> Is there much info or any idea what will be sold after the program officially launches? Will the Flex products still be offered or will it be Destination Points? Will Abound remain just a trading platform?
> 
> I'm sure it's all speculation right now. But I'm curious if anyone thinks the product is going to change.


We know that many Vistana sales offices are now selling Marriott Trust Points. A few offices are still selling Flex programs and Westin Aventuras really won't go anywhere. We understand that moving forward any Vistana weeks that are reacquired through ROFR, foreclosure or deed back will go into the Marriott Abound Trust and sold as Trust Points. We don't know how they will handle reacquired Flex products or single site HomeOption products that they reacquire.

For Vistana VOIs, Abound is a trading platform just as it is for Marriott weeks and even Marriott Trust Points. The MVC Exchange Company is the exchange platform that facilitates most if not all Abound Club Point reservations.


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## CPNY (Oct 7, 2022)

According to vistana, they are still working on merging accounts before the rollout. Marriott IT is just awful. I wouldn’t be surprised if the rollout doesn’t happen until November/December. Hope I’m wrong, but more importantly, I hope they can fix their terrible processes and actually merge accounts for those of us who had Marriott muck things up.


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## DanV (Oct 8, 2022)

chris1278 said:


> Is there much info or any idea what will be sold after the program officially launches? Will the Flex products still be offered or will it be Destination Points? Will Abound remain just a trading platform?
> 
> I'm sure it's all speculation right now. But I'm curious if anyone thinks the product is going to change.



I went to an owners update at WKORV recently and the pitch was that this was the last opportunity to buy deeded property in Maui. Going forward, I was told, they would only be selling Marriott points.


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## ToesInTheSand (Oct 9, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> They have already stated that Vistana owners will be able to elect their 2023 Vistana VOIs for Club Points through December 31, 2022.


yes - I was in a presentation just last week and they stated same


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## rickandcindy23 (Oct 9, 2022)

We recently checked into Marriott's Cypress Harbour and were welcomed as Chairman's Club, and the only way we coud be that is if they are counting our two OF center Westin Ka'anapali two bedrooms.  I don't own anything in points.  I was surprised and noticeably so.  Our son was standing next to me and said, "Why are you acting so surprised?"  I told him that nothing on my Vistana account has that status showing, and of course my Marriott account is all resale so nothing there, either.


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## travelhacker (Oct 9, 2022)

rickandcindy23 said:


> We recently checked into Marriott's Cypress Harbour and were welcomed as Chairman's Club, and the only way we coud be that is if they are counting our two OF center Westin Ka'anapali two bedrooms.  I don't own anything in points.  I was surprised and noticeably so.  Our son was standing next to me and said, "Why are you acting so surprised?"  I told him that nothing on my Vistana account has that status showing, and of course my Marriott account is all resale so nothing there, either.


Log into your Marriott account, you should see that you are chairman's club. Congrats!

My lowly select status started showing up about a week ago.


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## travelhacker (Oct 9, 2022)

This is what I see:




I'm looking forward to actually being able to search, but I believe I would need to elect points first.


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## kozykritter (Oct 9, 2022)

travelhacker said:


> This is what I see:
> View attachment 66336
> 
> I'm looking forward to actually being able to search, but I believe I would need to elect points first.


Do you own MVC? Or if you only own Vistana, how did you log into the MVC system? I was confused by your electing points comment!


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## travelhacker (Oct 9, 2022)

kozykritter said:


> Do you own MVC? Or if you only own Vistana, how did you log into the MVC system? I was confused by your electing points comment!


I own MVC weeks (resale). I also own Vistana (Mandatory). 

I think Abound will officially be live when Vistana owners can elect Abound points.


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## GrayFal (Oct 9, 2022)

rickandcindy23 said:


> We recently checked into Marriott's Cypress Harbour and were welcomed as Chairman's Club, and the only way we coud be that is if they are counting our two OF center Westin Ka'anapali two bedrooms.  I don't own anything in points.  I was surprised and noticeably so.  Our son was standing next to me and said, "Why are you acting so surprised?"  I told him that nothing on my Vistana account has that status showing, and of course my Marriott account is all resale so nothing there, either.


I am with your son.
You know you own two mandatory resorts purchased before 8/9/22?
If you look at your Vistana account it will say you are 5 * elite and if you log into your Marriott vacation club account, you will see chairman.
and on the Marriott vacation club app it tells you your total of Club Points.
I know you own Marriott resale but since all Vistana retail and mandatory resale before 8/9/22 are now considered Abound members unless the opt out in writing,I think you should see your status on the app.


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## kozykritter (Oct 10, 2022)

CPNY said:


> According to vistana, they are still working on merging accounts before the rollout. Marriott IT is just awful. I wouldn’t be surprised if the rollout doesn’t happen until November/December. Hope I’m wrong, but more importantly, I hope they can fix their terrible processes and actually merge accounts for those of us who had Marriott muck things up.


They definitely haven't finished the merging accounts/combined points thing. I currently sit at Vistana 3* and MVC Owner levels. Should be MVC Select on combined points and Executive on elite mapping. I can understand why they haven't done the mapping yet because they have to get all of the elite set on the Vistana side and then do a one-time grandfathering. No Select bump yet.


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## rickandcindy23 (Oct 10, 2022)

I don't see any of that.  I only own resale Marriott, no points, nothing combined into my Marriott account (we have two of them because of how older weeks are deeded), and our Marriott account doesn't reflect us as any status, nor does the Vistana account recognize us as anything.  And irony of ironies, I can only see one of my Westin weeks, and they closed at the same time.  I asked them how I am supposed to pay the MF's for 2023, if I cannot even see the second week.  They do see it on Vistana's end, and I can see my reservations for next year.  

Vistana assured me that my account will show correctly eventually, but I can always call to pay my MF's.  I would never do that.  I don't like making phone calls.


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## Negma (Oct 10, 2022)

I am feeling left out. I do not own any Marriot. So how do I log into Marriot Club, with an acct number I don't have. Or is that the obvious thing we are waiting for? I tried to find the answer but I am obviously slow this morning.


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## dioxide45 (Oct 10, 2022)

Negma said:


> I am feeling left out. I do not own any Marriot. So how do I log into Marriot Club, with an acct number I don't have. Or is that the obvious thing we are waiting for? I tried to find the answer but I am obviously slow this morning.


You don't. At least not yet. You can see your VSN Elite Status in the Vistana mobile app.


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## kozykritter (Oct 10, 2022)

Negma said:


> I am feeling left out. I do not own any Marriot. So how do I log into Marriot Club, with an acct number I don't have. Or is that the obvious thing we are waiting for? I tried to find the answer but I am obviously slow this morning.


I re-read the FAQs this morning. Once Abound launches, it will be available for Vistana owners via the regular vistana.com website. You won't be going over to Marriott's owners website to log in. A Marriott account number is irrelevant at this point for these owners.


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## Negma (Oct 10, 2022)

Thank you. That's what I thought, but I thought I missed something.


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## Joshadelic (Oct 12, 2022)

travelhacker said:


> This is what I see:
> View attachment 66336
> 
> I'm looking forward to actually being able to search, but I believe I would need to elect points first.



How are you able to see this? I don't understand where everyone is getting all of this information. All I see when I log in to my account on vistana.com is the same thing that's been there for years now. Is there a different URL I need to use to access this? I have received absolutely NO communication from Vistana regarding ANY of these changes to Abound. What am I missing here???


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## dioxide45 (Oct 12, 2022)

Joshadelic said:


> How are you able to see this? I don't understand where everyone is getting all of this information. All I see when I log in to my account on vistana.com is the same thing that's been there for years now. Is there a different URL I need to use to access this? I have received absolutely NO communication from Vistana regarding ANY of these changes to Abound. What am I missing here???


YOu need to be using the mobile app on an Apple device. Apparently the Android app doesn't work the same. The image in the post you quoted is from MarriottVacationClub.com, which is only available to Marriott owners.


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## Joshadelic (Oct 12, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> YOu need to be using the mobile app on an Apple device. Apparently the Android app doesn't work the same. The image in the post you quoted is from MarriottVacationClub.com, which is only available to Marriott owners.



I downloaded the Vistana app on my iPhone. It basically shows the same info. I'm not a Marriott owner, so does that mean I just have to wait until they decide to take over vistana.com or is there some way I can access any of this with my current ownership with Vistana? I just find it really odd that I haven't received any communication at all about such extreme, significant changes.


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## dioxide45 (Oct 12, 2022)

Joshadelic said:


> I downloaded the Vistana app on my iPhone. It basically shows the same info. I'm not a Marriott owner, so does that mean I just have to wait until they decide to take over vistana.com or is there some way I can access any of this with my current ownership with Vistana? I just find it really odd that I haven't received any communication at all about such extreme, significant changes.


If you are eligible for a higher Vistana Elite Star level than you actually were, the app may show the new higher status. We own two mandatory resale weeks and had no Vistana * status, but it now shows us as 3* Elite.


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## Joshadelic (Oct 12, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> If you are eligible for a higher Vistana Elite Star level than you actually were, the app may show the new higher status. We own two mandatory resale weeks and had no Vistana * status, but it now shows us as 3* Elite.



I checked. I was 3* and still am 3* on the app.


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## dioxide45 (Oct 12, 2022)

Joshadelic said:


> I checked. I was 3* and still am 3* on the app.


If you don't own Marriott and don't have any unqualified mandatory resale weeks, then that makes sense. Nothing changes.


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## grrrah (Oct 12, 2022)

timsi said:


> Anybody who deposits into Abound this year will only be able to book the 2023 leftovers. If many deposits are made with the idea of using the points in 2024, there will be additional pressure on the Abound inventory for that year without offering in exchange good 2023 Vistana inventory. If Marriott wants a launch that is somewhat normal (at least regarding the inventory), they should probably push it back to the next year. I know it does not look good, but we are used to it by now.


Yeah, I really wished they would give an extra year or 6 months at least for the 2023 VOIs since it is pretty much end of year and counting on availability that second year.  Meanwhile, 2023 last time to get 2 years of banking in VSN.  I only own EOY, and wanted to enroll one of my '23 weeks, but I may just have to wait until 2025. tbd.


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## kgwilson932 (Oct 12, 2022)

We had our owner's update this morning at KOR. Same pitch as before, add more time to what we already own at KOR now before it's to late. It will be a new world after Oct. 22nd when Marriot swallows Vistana. The end to deeded properties. Wish we had sold 2 years ago before the pandemic hit and prices really dumped.  Things have been rough for a while and the future doesn't look bright.  They said the Marriot will add an additional 400,000 folks into the system. But, they claim you will be able to book 13 months out into your home resort and it will be fine.

 I can't sit through anymore TS "owner updates".


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## kozykritter (Oct 13, 2022)

kgwilson932 said:


> We had our owner's update this morning at KOR. Same pitch as before, add more time to what we already own at KOR now before it's to late. It will be a new world after Oct. 22nd when Marriot swallows Vistana. The end to deeded properties. Wish we had sold 2 years ago before the pandemic hit and prices really dumped.  Things have been rough for a while and the future doesn't look bright.  They said the Marriot will add an additional 400,000 folks into the system. But, they claim you will be able to book 13 months out into your home resort and it will be fine.
> 
> I can't sit through anymore TS "owner updates".


I hear you on the done-with-updates thing...the good news is they aren't required so you can just relax and enjoy your future vacations.

They said October 22nd? Was that for the launch of Abound? The only guidance posted by Marriott has been late October so I wonder if that is a real date or just what sales is saying!


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## CPNY (Oct 13, 2022)

They have until December 20th to roll it out since they said the fall ha. As they said, it looks like once it goes live that grayed out button may come alive and that’s where we would go to convert what we own to club points via the vistana website. I’d expect it will bring us to the Abound UI once we convert.



kozykritter said:


> I hear you on the done with updates things...the good news is they aren't required so you can just relax and enjoy your future vacations.
> 
> They said October 22nd? Was that for the launch of Abound? The only guidance posted by Marriott has been late October so I wonder if that is a real date or just what sales is saying!


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## dioxide45 (Oct 13, 2022)

A question I have, once you do elect, will you make Abound points reservations on Vistana.com too? It would seem odd to stand up a second user interface for this when they could just give you access to MarriottVacationClub.com?


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## kozykritter (Oct 13, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> A question I have, once you do elect, will you make Abound points reservations on Vistana.com too? It would seem odd to stand up a second user interface for this when they could just give you access to MarriottVacationClub.com?


I suspect it will a custom interface through vistana.com that pulls data from the Abound database, same as MVC users will see. Since this is being added (and promoted) as a feature of Vistana ownership/VSN membership and not a merger of the timeshare systems, it wouldn't make sense to move Vistana users into being MVC.com account holders as well.


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## dioxide45 (Oct 13, 2022)

kozykritter said:


> I suspect it will a custom interface through vistana.com that pulls data from the Abound database, same as MVC users will see. Since this is being added (and promoted) as a feature of Vistana ownership/VSN membership and not a merger of the timeshare systems, it wouldn't make sense to move Vistana users into being MVC.com account holders as well.


It would but it wouldn't. Marriott Vacations Worldwide has talked about consolidating IT and legacy systems in a program they call "Vacation Next". I suspect out of the gate we will just have a reservation page in Vistana.com that is a ported website UI from MVC.com for ust to make Abound reservations through. Long term though, they may try to combined the websites into one.


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## kozykritter (Oct 13, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> It would but it wouldn't. Marriott Vacations Worldwide has talked about consolidating IT and legacy systems in a program they call "Vacation Next". I suspect out of the gate we will just have a reservation page in Vistana.com that is a ported website UI from MVC.com for ust to make Abound reservations through. Long term though, they may try to combined the websites into one.


Yes, I agree their long-range plan is consolidation. It only makes sense


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## wannagotoo (Oct 13, 2022)

At my owner's update a few days ago, beginning of the year is when they think things will actually be working according to plan.


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## Covid hater (Oct 13, 2022)

Just did an update at WKORV and was told Oct 22nd and we will be able to access the Marriott/Abound system through the Vistana website.  Same sales pitch about a lot of competition to get into certain resorts w/all the Marriott people.  No answer when I said Marriott only has access to weeks that owners give up.


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## wannagotoo (Oct 13, 2022)

I did mine at WKORV also and she said they believe it will actually be functional by the first of the year. Here's hoping your people were correct. The push was for buying points, last chance, great deal, bonus 2,000, value will not change. The points sold in 2010 were 9.20 each, now they are $16.40. Rates go down if you buy over 2500. The HOA is .63 per. They were able to answer a lot of my questions regarding the transition yet there was no pressure to buy other than the immediacy.


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## chemteach (Oct 15, 2022)

I am showing as Chairman's Club on Marriott Vacation Club site, and I only own a resale Marriott week, so the systems must have linked for my Vistana ownerships, which are at 5 star.  This won't change anything for me.  But it's nice to see it.


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## bobpark56 (Oct 15, 2022)

Joshadelic said:


> I checked. I was 3* and still am 3* on the app.


I checked too, and we have gone from 3* to 4*. But the better news is from Marriott, where we have gone from Owner to Presidential.


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## TravelTime (Oct 22, 2022)

It is taking forever for Marriott to launch Abound. I thought they said October. One problem is if you elect points for 2023, you basically lose 2023 since there is nowhere good you could book for 2023 at this point. So you basically need to bank your points. Not sure many people will want to do that unless they are a higher level where they can get 18 mo to 2 years to use the points. Or they have not made a reservation to use their Vistana week for 2023 so electing Abound points might make sense.


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## sponger76 (Oct 23, 2022)

Well, we're in the last full week of October, no Abound and the FAQs now just say 'fall' is when it will begin. Half the votes said it would launch between today and Halloween. 42% said later. Who will have guessed correctly?


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## dsmrp (Oct 24, 2022)

I thought I read a post in which Sales said Oct 22.  It's now the 24th, and I sorta thought there'd be some big announcement on the first weekday after the 22nd. The day is still young, 8:30 PDT, 
so maybe something at day's end ??? 
When there's an email announcement, I'm usually in one of the last groups to get it. 




sponger76 said:


> Well, we're in the last full week of October, no Abound and the FAQs now just say 'fall' is when it will begin. Half the votes said it would launch between today and Halloween. 42% said later. Who will have guessed correctly?


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## EnglishmanAbroad (Oct 24, 2022)

I just logged in to Vistana to see the breaking news....and there wasn't any! I did however notice that the banner across the top of the dashboard that always gave a countdown to your next stay seems to have disappeared. A bit annoying as it used to be a good reminder if I was getting close to the 60 days on a reservation I needed to cancel.


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## TravelTime (Oct 24, 2022)

Basically, by the time they launch, they are really launching for 2024 since there is/will be nothing left to book in 2023.


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## timsi (Oct 24, 2022)

There is still a good chance they will launch before November 1st.


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## sponger76 (Oct 24, 2022)

EnglishmanAbroad said:


> I just logged in to Vistana to see the breaking news....and there wasn't any! I did however notice that the banner across the top of the dashboard that always gave a countdown to your next stay seems to have disappeared. A bit annoying as it used to be a good reminder if I was getting close to the 60 days on a reservation I needed to cancel.


I still have my countdown banner.


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## EnglishmanAbroad (Oct 24, 2022)

sponger76 said:


> I still have my countdown banner.


Thanks, so do I as mine's back.  Either they were reading here or it was just something passing through as in it's place for a while I had a link that took me to some general Vistana information.


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## zjhasan1976 (Oct 24, 2022)

EnglishmanAbroad said:


> I just logged in to Vistana to see the breaking news....and there wasn't any! I did however notice that the banner across the top of the dashboard that always gave a countdown to your next stay seems to have disappeared. A bit annoying as it used to be a good reminder if I was getting close to the 60 days on a reservation I needed to cancel.


The reservation system has been up and down today.  Not sure if that's part of the changeover?


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## TravelTime (Oct 24, 2022)

I am tired of waiting. I was going to deposit my WKOVRN week because it is worth a lot of points. I have a back up plan if the deposit privileges end up being lucrative. But my trip is 6 months away now. I booked 2 weeks back to back for April/Easter weeks (highest prime season since it is considered spring break plus holiday) with my WKOVRN week and a MOC week. I have 2 days before and after my MOC week in case I want to deposit the WKOVRN week. It saves me about 4500 points to go for 11 days with MOC vs 14 days with my Vistana week and MOC week. And it saves me about $2000 in airfare for the 4 of us. So I am hoping Abound launches soon so I can make a decision on our April vacation. Based on what I just wrote, it seems like electing points for my WKOVRN week makes a lot of sense. But so does staying 2 straight weeks with only one room move vs two room moves.


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## sponger76 (Oct 24, 2022)

zjhasan1976 said:


> The reservation system has been up and down today.  Not sure if that's part of the changeover?


The website has been giving me issues all day, including at times not allowing me to log in. Of course when I finally get in after multiple attempts, there are no visible changes on the site, so who knows if it's background changes to facilitate the new program or if they just have crappy IT services, whether its internal servers or cloud-based hosting.


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## zjhasan1976 (Oct 24, 2022)

sponger76 said:


> The website has been giving me issues all day, including at times not allowing me to log in. Of course when I finally get in after multiple attempts, there are no visible changes on the site, so who knows if it's background changes to facilitate the new program or if they just have crappy IT services, whether its internal servers or cloud-based hosting.


You would think that a company with a $5.6B market cap would be able to implement a decent system.  LOL


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## triangulum33 (Oct 25, 2022)

vistana.com is totally down.  Maybe the update is going in?


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## iowaguy09 (Oct 25, 2022)

Someone on the Abound Facebook group reported Westin Riverfront saying tomorrow Wed 10/26 is last day for Flex sales, then only Abounds points will be sold.  I know, came from a sales rep, but I’ll toss this twig on the speculation bonfire and say “Abound goes live before this week is out!”


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## dioxide45 (Oct 25, 2022)

iowaguy09 said:


> Someone on the Abound Facebook group reported Westin Riverfront saying tomorrow Wed 10/26 is last day for Flex sales, then only Abounds points will be sold.  I know, came from a sales rep, but I’ll toss this twig on the speculation bonfire and say “Abound goes live before this week is out!”


Many of the Vistana sites are already, and have been for a while, selling only ABound Club Points. That said. I have faith they will stick to "October" and we will see something after this weekend.


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## sail27bill (Oct 25, 2022)

Is 2023 an option? LOL


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## zjhasan1976 (Oct 25, 2022)

sail27bill said:


> Is 2023 an option? LOL


If you are a Marriott owner, then yes!  Hahaha


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## CPNY (Oct 25, 2022)

They have until December 20th to launch. All they said was “coming this fall”.

my post 8/9 Vistana resale was transferred into my name yesterday. Of course they created a new account and didn’t add it to my existing account like the transfer form specified.

I emailed title services yesterday and unlike my last resale which took 2 months and multiple phone calls to merge, this ownership was merged within a day. I can now see all of my ownerships under one dashboard. They could be moving fast to roll this out. I’m hoping that there is some way that ownership is included in Abound.


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## DavidnRobin (Oct 25, 2022)

CPNY said:


> They have until December 20th to launch. All they said was “coming this fall”.
> 
> my post 8/9 Vistana resale was transferred into my name yesterday. Of course they created a new account and didn’t add it to my existing account like the transfer form specified.
> 
> I emailed title services yesterday and unlike my last resale which took 2 months and multiple phone calls to merge, this ownership was merged within a day. I can now see all of my ownerships under one dashboard. They could be moving fast to roll this out. I’m hoping that there is some way that ownership is included in Abound.



Did you see @encino post where they are refusing to merge his Lagunamar ownerships?

btw - they are under no obligation to get it done by Dec 22 - just because they stated Fall.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## CPNY (Oct 25, 2022)

DavidnRobin said:


> Did you see @encino post where they are refusing to merge his Lagunamar ownerships?
> 
> btw - they are under no obligation to get it done by Dec 22 - just because they stated Fall.
> 
> ...


I haven’t seen the post but they told me the same thing and I kept fighting.

I was being facetious about the December date. Everyone seems to be set on October.


----------



## byeloe (Oct 25, 2022)

CPNY said:


> my post 8/9 Vistana resale was transferred into my name yesterday. Of course they created a new account and didn’t add it to my existing account like the transfer form specified


Just wondering which resort since my resales from June/July still haven't transferred.


----------



## TravelTime (Oct 25, 2022)

CPNY said:


> I haven’t seen the post but they told me the same thing and I kept fighting.
> 
> I was being facetious about the December date. Everyone seems to be set on October.



I saw it recently in writing that it was October. It was one of the Abound announcements awhile back.


----------



## CPNY (Oct 25, 2022)

byeloe said:


> Just wondering which resort since my resales from June/July still haven't transferred.


It may have transferred but it was set up in a different account. Call them with the contract number and they can see who’s name it is in


----------



## CPNY (Oct 25, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I saw it recently in writing that it was October. It was one of the Abound announcements awhile back.


I don’t see October happening but who knows


----------



## sponger76 (Oct 26, 2022)

CPNY said:


> They have until December 20th to launch. All they said was “coming this fall”.
> 
> my post 8/9 Vistana resale was transferred into my name yesterday. Of course they created a new account and didn’t add it to my existing account like the transfer form specified.
> 
> I emailed title services yesterday and unlike my last resale which took 2 months and multiple phone calls to merge, this ownership was merged within a day. I can now see all of my ownerships under one dashboard. They could be moving fast to roll this out. I’m hoping that there is some way that ownership is included in Abound.


What's the email address you used for title services? I may need their assistance with the same type of issue.


----------



## sponger76 (Oct 26, 2022)

I was finally able to log in again a few moments ago. Still no visible changes.


----------



## byeloe (Oct 26, 2022)

CPNY said:


> Call them with the contract number and they can see who’s name it is in


Hi
Is there a special phone number for title services?


----------



## JimT (Oct 28, 2022)

Just spoke w/ Marriott owner services - they are telling me date pushed back another 3 weeks.
i.e. Abound will launch mid-November (14th???)


----------



## CalGalTraveler (Oct 28, 2022)

CPNY said:


> I don’t see October happening but who knows



It could still be October i.e. October 2023.  


FWIW...I find it odd that they are touting the new MVC Bali resort in the latest Vistana newsletter when no one can book it yet with Abound points.


----------



## timsi (Oct 28, 2022)

Every time they shut down the system, they seem very close, then few hours later (sometimes a day or two later) the system comes back up with just some minor changes that are not related to the actual reservation system. I am wondering what is going so wrong that they can’t get it to function properly and that they must keep on trying, without success so far. Remember, in August we were talking about the same issue, and we thought we were close. Did they find the problem or not? I do not think I have seen anything like this before.


----------



## daviator (Oct 28, 2022)

timsi said:


> Every time they shut down the system, they seem very close, then few hours later (sometimes a day or two later) the system comes back up with just some minor changes that are not related to the actual reservation system. I am wondering what is going so wrong that they can’t get it to function properly and that they must keep on trying, without success so far. Remember, in August we were talking about the same issue, and we thought we were close. Did they find the problem or not? I do not think I have seen anything like this before.


I think your conclusion is a bit of a stretch.  I don't know when they plan to activate the Abound features for Vistana owners, and I'm sure IT issues are a big part of the challenge there, but I think it's very likely that most of the functionality has been implemented and they just need to essentially flip a switch to turn it on when everything is complete.  I don't think it's realistic to expect to see big changes on the public website until they flip that switch. But I'm sure there are big changes already implemented under the hood.


----------



## TravelTime (Oct 28, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> It could still be October i.e. October 2023.
> 
> 
> FWIW...I find it odd that they are touting the new MVC Bali resort in the latest Vistana newsletter when no one can book it yet with Abound points.



If it is available for booking with club points now, then we can book it.


----------



## dioxide45 (Oct 28, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> If it is available for booking with club points now, then we can book it.


Only if you own Marriott. Can't book it yet using only Vistana ownership.


----------



## VacationForever (Oct 28, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> Only if you own Marriott. Can't book it yet using only Vistana ownership.


You cannot book Vistana timeshare with Marriott Club points either, i.e. no real integration even on the MVC end.


----------



## TravelTime (Oct 28, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> Only if you own Marriott. Can't book it yet using only Vistana ownership.



That is what I meant. So it makes sense they are promoting the Bali resort. In any case, even if no one could book, they still advertise new resorts.


----------



## dioxide45 (Oct 28, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> That is what I meant. So it makes sense they are promoting the Bali resort. In any case, even if no one could book, they still advertise new resorts.


But they sent the email out to owners who own only Vistana. They won't have Club Points, or at least not yet.


----------



## grrrah (Oct 28, 2022)

JimT said:


> Just spoke w/ Marriott owner services - they are telling me date pushed back another 3 weeks.
> i.e. Abound will launch mid-November (14th???)


Wow, so now getting close to the 2024 use year (13 month res).

I only have EOYO, so for 2024, I'm thinking it's going to be better to borrow from 2025 vs. using banked 2023 points, which can still be banked for 2 years in VSN one last time.  The way I read the new banking/borrowing rules, if I borrow 2025 Abound points for a 2024 reservation but cancel, I can still use those points in 2025 (regular use year), but then won't be able to bank them into 2026 (assuming everything is before the 61 day mark)?  Is that how current MVC points work?  I've never even borrowed for VSN, but does the full MF have to be paid in full to make a reservation with borrowed points?


----------



## dioxide45 (Oct 28, 2022)

grrrah said:


> Wow, so now getting close to the 2024 use year (13 month res).
> 
> I only have EOYO, so for 2024, I'm thinking it's going to be better to borrow from 2025 vs. using banked 2023 points, which can still be banked for 2 years in VSN one last time.  The way I read the new banking/borrowing rules, if I borrow 2025 Abound points for a 2024 reservation but cancel, I can still use those points in 2025 (regular use year), but then won't be able to bank them into 2026 (assuming everything is before the 61 day mark)?  Is that how current MVC points work?  I've never even borrowed for VSN, but does the full MF have to be paid in full to make a reservation with borrowed points?


It would seem if you go the Abound route, there will be no need to prepay maintenance fees to borrow points. I haven't seen that mentioned anywhere. You can't borrow 2025 VSN StarOptions into 2024, that won't work as you own EOYO, thus you can only borrow StarOptions into odd years. If you borrow 2025 Abound Club Points into 2024 and later cancel, they will go back to 2025 and as long as they are not in a Holding Account (60 day restricted), you can bank them like normal. The rules are kind of confusing when reading about banking points that have been borrowed, but people have done this in the past.


----------



## timsi (Oct 28, 2022)

daviator said:


> I think your conclusion is a bit of a stretch.  I don't know when they plan to activate the Abound features for Vistana owners, and I'm sure IT issues are a big part of the challenge there, but I think it's very likely that most of the functionality has been implemented and they just need to essentially flip a switch to turn it on when everything is complete.  I don't think it's realistic to expect to see big changes on the public website until they flip that switch. But I'm sure there are big changes already implemented under the hood.


I hope you are right but every interruption (and we have had too many this year) comes with some erratic behavior related to the search feature. The later they implement it this year, the worse for everyone (including for Marriott). Something is telling me that it has not worked as planned and that they are still trying to figure out the problems. That does not mean they cannot flip the switch soon but it remains to be seen if the frustration does not continue after the launch.


----------



## CPNY (Oct 29, 2022)

CalGalTraveler said:


> It could still be October i.e. October 2023.
> 
> 
> FWIW...I find it odd that they are touting the new MVC Bali resort in the latest Vistana newsletter when no one can book it yet with Abound points.


I thought that was odd as well. They went on to tout booking it via interval


----------



## TravelTime (Oct 31, 2022)

I was assuming it would be possible to deposit a Vistana week booked for 2023 and elect points. However, I assume this will not be possible since the date to elect points has already passed. Does that sound correct?


----------



## VacationForever (Oct 31, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I was assuming it would be possible to deposit a Vistana week booked for 2023 and elect points. However, I assume this will not be possible since the date to elect points has already passed. Does that sound correct?


The election date can always be pushed to Dec 31st 2022 just for this one time.


----------



## Eric B (Oct 31, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> The election date can always be pushed to Dec 31st 2022 just for this one time.


IIRC it was already set to 12/31/2022, shifting to the normal deadlines next year.


----------



## TravelTime (Oct 31, 2022)

Eric B said:


> IIRC it was already set to 12/31/2022, shifting to the normal deadlines next year.



That is good. Just curious where it was published?


----------



## Eric B (Oct 31, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> That is good. Just curious where it was published?



Think it was in the FAQs on the Vistana site.


----------



## kozykritter (Oct 31, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I was assuming it would be possible to deposit a Vistana week booked for 2023 and elect points. However, I assume this will not be possible since the date to elect points has already passed. Does that sound correct?


You would have to unbook any reservation you made for a 2023 deeded week in order to be able to convert it to Abound, same as when you deposit a week in II.


----------



## DanCali (Nov 2, 2022)

timsi said:


> Every time they shut down the system, they seem very close, then few hours later (sometimes a day or two later) the system comes back up with just some minor changes that are not related to the actual reservation system. I am wondering what is going so wrong that they can’t get it to function properly and that they must keep on trying, without success so far. Remember, in August we were talking about the same issue, and we thought we were close. Did they find the problem or not? I do not think I have seen anything like this before.




I'm starting to think the delayed launch was actually an intentional premature announcement and had nothing to do with Abound actually being imminent. We've seen some unusual spikes in resales in the Spring at all mandatory resorts which were due to either (i) speculative buys due to rumors, or (ii) MVC employees buying based on insider information. Anyone who knew for certain that mandatory resorts would be included in abound could effectively buy 6000+ points for $12K-$15K ($2-$2.5/point) with MFs of $0.50 (e.g WKORV/N IV or OV). That's far below Trust point resale values and with lower ongoing annual costs. It's possible that many employees were trading on that info, and MVC wanted to put a stop to it with that summer "launch". Pure speculation...


----------



## daviator (Nov 2, 2022)

It turns out that 58% of those voting in this poll turn out to have been wrong, lol...


----------



## CPNY (Nov 2, 2022)

DanCali said:


> I'm starting to think the delayed launch was actually an intentional premature announcement and had nothing to do with Abound actually being imminent. We've seen some unusual spikes in resales in the Spring at all mandatory resorts which were due to either (i) speculative buys due to rumors, or (ii) MVC employees buying based on insider information. Anyone who knew for certain that mandatory resorts would be included in abound could effectively buy 6000+ points for $12K-$15K ($2-$2.5/point) with MFs of $0.50 (e.g WKORV/N IV or OV). That's far below Trust point resale values and with lower ongoing annual costs. It's possible that many employees were trading on that info, and MVC wanted to put a stop to it with that summer "launch". Pure speculation...


One of my sales reps told me that many of her colleagues bought a few WKORV units on the resale market over the summer. You are on to something


----------



## timsi (Nov 2, 2022)

DanCali said:


> I'm starting to think the delayed launch was actually an intentional premature announcement and had nothing to do with Abound actually being imminent. We've seen some unusual spikes in resales in the Spring at all mandatory resorts which were due to either (i) speculative buys due to rumors, or (ii) MVC employees buying based on insider information. Anyone who knew for certain that mandatory resorts would be included in abound could effectively buy 6000+ points for $12K-$15K ($2-$2.5/point) with MFs of $0.50 (e.g WKORV/N IV or OV). That's far below Trust point resale values and with lower ongoing annual costs. It's possible that many employees were trading on that info, and MVC wanted to put a stop to it with that summer "launch". Pure speculation...


In the last 18 months or so, the event weeks at Lagunamar virtually disappeared from the resale market. Week 52 would give 8300 Abound points and could be requalified for 9-10k. If you add the initial resale cost, one could also get Abound points for under $2.5 pp with an incredible MF of $0.19 pp. Why did they disappear but not the other Lagunamar weeks that are cheaper but have the same value on the StarOption chart?


----------



## DanCali (Nov 2, 2022)

timsi said:


> In the last 18 months or so, the event weeks at Lagunamar virtually disappeared from the resale market. Week 52 would give 8300 Abound points and could be requalified for 9-10k. If you add the initial resale cost, one could also get Abound points for under $2.5 pp with an incredible MF of $0.19 pp. Why did they disappear but not the other Lagunamar weeks that are cheaper but have the same value on the StarOption chart?



If one were to play this game with inside info, I wouldn't do it with voluntary weeks and then requalify. That process is relatively much more complex and uncertain (you don't know how long you can requal for $9-$10K, and it also requires purchasing a lousy product with zero resale value). I would just do mandatory weeks. 

However, if one thought that any purchase would require a requal (like many of us here did) then you may gravitate towards voluntary weeks. Event weeks may have the save value on the Staroptions chart but not in the MVC world and that was common knowledge.


----------



## timsi (Nov 2, 2022)

DanCali said:


> If one were to play this game with inside info, I wouldn't do it with voluntary weeks and then requalify. That process is relatively much more complex and uncertain (you don't know how long you can requal for $9-$10K, and it also requires purchasing a lousy product with zero resale value). I would just do mandatory weeks.
> 
> However, if one thought that any purchase would require a requal (like many of us here did) then you may gravitate towards voluntary weeks. Event weeks may have the save value on the Staroptions chart but not in the MVC world and that was common knowledge.


The process is indeed more complex but there may also be discounts we do not take into consideration.


----------



## kozykritter (Nov 4, 2022)

I was just on the phone with Owner Services over at Marriott and at the end of the call the rep asked if there was anything else she could do for me, and I said, yes, could you please have them launch Abound right now?  She laughed and said it is funny that I said that because she and her coworkers are immersed in Abound training right now so it feels to her like it is launched already but she understands that isn't the owner's experience. From what she is learning, it's absolutely launching in the immediate near future but no firm date because they have to get the system right to avoid disaster. I suspect we'll see it this month, but then again, I'm an optimist by nature.


----------



## sponger76 (Nov 4, 2022)

I just wish these companies would do a better job of managing expectations. Just not even make an announcement until they know it's ready to go. If they want to give some time from the announcement to when it goes live in order to give customers time to prepare, fine, as long as they have high confidence through testing that it's going to work when they flip the switch. But stringing people along, and constantly walking back the announced implementation date is, to me, bad business.


----------



## timsi (Nov 4, 2022)

daviator said:


> It turns out that 58% of those voting in this poll turn out to have been wrong, lol...


Never make forecasts, especially about the future!


----------



## TravelTime (Nov 5, 2022)

Did Marriott actually change any dates? I thought they never announced a date except saying in late summer that it would launch this Fall.


----------



## timsi (Nov 5, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Did Marriott actually change any dates? I thought they never announced a date except saying in late summer that it would launch this Fall.


Initially they said they would launch "later this summer".

I think we need a new poll.


----------



## sponger76 (Nov 5, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Did Marriott actually change any dates? I thought they never announced a date except saying in late summer that it would launch this Fall.


They said late summer. Then they specifcally said October. Right now it says fall. We'll see if it changes again.


----------



## Eric B (Nov 5, 2022)

sponger76 said:


> They said late summer. Then they specifcally said October. Right now it says fall. We'll see if it changes again.



I'm reading much too fast; at first I thought you wrote "Right now it says fail."


----------



## sponger76 (Nov 5, 2022)

Eric B said:


> I'm reading much too fast; at first I thought you wrote "Right now it says fail."


That reading is also close to the reality at present.


----------



## TravelTime (Nov 5, 2022)

sponger76 said:


> They said late summer. Then they specifcally said October. Right now it says fall. We'll see if it changes again.



Did they say it in writing or did the sales staff say it?


----------



## SVOTransplant (Nov 5, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Did they say it in writing or did the sales staff say it?



It was via email, sent late August, to owners. This is the exact wording from the email:


COMING THIS FALL​ Viewing your new Owner benefit level, your election value, and the ability to elect to receive Club Points to make reservations at Marriott Vacation Club resorts using the Abound by Marriott Vacations exchange program are expected to be functional in late October, 2022, for reservations beginning in 2023. Owners will be notified when transactions in Abound are available.​


----------



## wannagotoo (Nov 5, 2022)

I'm still going with what I was told at the owner's update. They are looking for it to be functional at the beginning of the new year.


----------



## TravelTime (Nov 5, 2022)

SVOTransplant said:


> It was via email, sent late August, to owners. This is the exact wording from the email:
> 
> ​
> COMING THIS FALL​Viewing your new Owner benefit level, your election value, and the ability to elect to receive Club Points to make reservations at Marriott Vacation Club resorts using the Abound by Marriott Vacations exchange program are expected to be functional in late October, 2022, for reservations beginning in 2023. Owners will be notified when transactions in Abound are available.​



Yes I saw the October date in writing but I do not recall other dates in writing. I am probably wrong and it was written somewhere.


----------



## TravelTime (Nov 5, 2022)

wannagotoo said:


> I'm still going with what I was told at the owner's update. They are looking for it to be functional at the beginning of the new year.



If it is in the New Year, then it will be too late for anyone to make a deposit for 2023. They extended the deposit date to end of December but that will be useless if they launch in the New Year.


----------



## daviator (Nov 5, 2022)

This is still the date shown right this moment in the FAQ on the Vistana website.  October was not just a date given verbally.  Of course, schedules slip, and obviously they have in this case.





At the WDW owner's meeting this week, there was an owner services executive participating, and she said that owners would receive an email "very soon" when the program was ready to launch, but wouldn't be any more specific.  She was also (I thought) quite honest and advised attendees that if they preferred to use their ownership to stay at Westin and Sheraton-branded properties, that they should NOT elect Abound, as they will get better value by staying within the VSN system.  I appreciated hearing that; if MVW is honest with owners about the pros and cons of both systems, then I think both will continue to be healthy and there will be inventory in both Abound and in VSN for those who want to play in each system.


----------



## Eric B (Nov 5, 2022)

daviator said:


> This is still the date shown right this moment in the FAQ on the Vistana website.  October was not just a date given verbally.  Of course, schedules slip, and obviously they have in this case.
> 
> View attachment 68002



Maybe it’s like that Canadian Thanksgiving thing in a different month and there’s another October in the year depending on where you live….


----------



## timsi (Nov 5, 2022)

June 16, 2022 

John Geller (President):  "We're about to launch ‐ as we announced this morning ‐ the new combined Marriott product later this summer, which will greatly improve the value proposition, as we'll talk about."

[...]  "A good example of this is the launch of the Abound by Marriott Vacations later this summer."

Lori Gustafson (Exec VP/Chief Brand & Digital Strategy Officer): "So as part of our Vacation Next effort, we are bringing to life Abound by Marriott Vacations, set debut later this summer. It is an exclusive new owner benefit and exchange program which provides more options and access for owners."


----------



## VacationForever (Nov 5, 2022)

Another missed commit, but no head rolled.  Let's promote the incompetence to take on the CEO role.


----------



## TravelTime (Nov 5, 2022)

I was thinking of going to Lagunamar next June with my SOs. SOs bookings just opened for the dates I was interested in. I could get 2 weeks with my 176K SOs and I would lose 1000 SOs.

If I deposit my week and use Abound points for these dates, it will cost me 7900 Abound points and I would have over 400 points left over that I would be able to use in the future.

Just saying that using SOs is not always better than electing a week.


----------



## jeffm211 (Nov 5, 2022)

daviator said:


> This is still the date shown right this moment in the FAQ on the Vistana website.  October was not just a date given verbally.  Of course, schedules slip, and obviously they have in this case.
> 
> View attachment 68002
> 
> At the WDW owner's meeting this week, there was an owner services executive participating, and she said that owners would receive an email "very soon" when the program was ready to launch, but wouldn't be any more specific.  She was also (I thought) quite honest and advised attendees that if they preferred to use their ownership to stay at Westin and Sheraton-branded properties, that they should NOT elect Abound, as they will get better value by staying within the VSN system.  I appreciated hearing that; if MVW is honest with owners about the pros and cons of both systems, then I think both will continue to be healthy and there will be inventory in both Abound and in VSN for those who want to play in each system.


I was told the same thing about VSN booking this past October.  Makes huge sense if you look at conversion values and # of SO vs. Club Points to book; at least it looks that way in January.


----------



## timsi (Nov 5, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I was thinking of going to Lagunamar next June with my SOs. SOs bookings just opened for the dates I was interested in. I could get 2 weeks with my 176K SOs and I would lose 1000 SOs.
> 
> If I deposit my week and use Abound points for these dates, it will cost me 7900 Abound points and I would have over 400 points left over that I would be able to use in the future.
> 
> Just saying that using SOs is not always better than electing a week.


For Hawaii, maybe, but I think that is not true for most other Vistana resorts. June is also not very busy, and you can typically book getaways through Interval.


----------



## TravelTime (Nov 5, 2022)

timsi said:


> For Hawaii, maybe, but I think that is not true for most other Vistana resorts. June is also not very busy, and you can typically book getaways through Interval.



Whether June is busy or not is not the point. The point was given the exact same bookings, sometimes (maybe not most of the time), it is better to book with Abound points over SOs.


----------



## jabberwocky (Nov 5, 2022)

Eric B said:


> Maybe it’s like that Canadian Thanksgiving thing in a different month and there’s another October in the year depending on where you live….


You may be on to something here. Maybe they are using the Ethiopian calendar where it is currently 27-02-2015?


----------



## kozykritter (Nov 5, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I was thinking of going to Lagunamar next June with my SOs. SOs bookings just opened for the dates I was interested in. I could get 2 weeks with my 176K SOs and I would lose 1000 SOs.
> 
> If I deposit my week and use Abound points for these dates, it will cost me 7900 Abound points and I would have over 400 points left over that I would be able to use in the future.
> 
> Just saying that using SOs is not always better than electing a week.


Sounds like you have the numbers down. The real issue for the foreseeable future is the difference in inventory. Your odds of being able to book something through the VSN are gargantuan right now compared to being able to book something through Abound for the next couple of years until a critical mass of Vistana owners start converting points, if that ever happens. So do you pass up the sure thing for the chance to have 400 points left over or do you grab what you know you can get right now? It's a decision a lot of us are going to have to make over the next couple of years at least.


----------



## CPNY (Nov 5, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I was thinking of going to Lagunamar next June with my SOs. SOs bookings just opened for the dates I was interested in. I could get 2 weeks with my 176K SOs and I would lose 1000 SOs.
> 
> If I deposit my week and use Abound points for these dates, it will cost me 7900 Abound points and I would have over 400 points left over that I would be able to use in the future.
> 
> Just saying that using SOs is not always better than electing a week.


Interval getaways are also an option for some units. You may be able to get a June week. However, the real question is, will WLR be available in Abound for June? The chart is only as good as the availability


----------



## sponger76 (Nov 5, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Did they say it in writing or did the sales staff say it?


In writing, multiple times, starting with the initial announcement stating summer. Then the emails and FAQs saying October, and now the FAQs saying fall.


----------



## VacationForever (Nov 6, 2022)

sponger76 said:


> In writing, multiple times, starting with the initial announcement stating summer. Then the emails and FAQs saying October, and now the FAQs saying fall.


I guess that means it can be moved to Dec 20 or thereabout.


----------



## sponger76 (Nov 6, 2022)

VacationForever said:


> I guess that means it can be moved to Dec 20 or thereabout.


The point is, they keep moving the goalposts, which is piss poor planning and communication.


----------



## byeloe (Nov 6, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> was thinking of going to Lagunamar next June with my SOs. SOs bookings just opened for the dates I was interested in. I could get 2 weeks with my 176K SOs and I would lose 1000 SOs.


I guess you are overlapping seasons, since it would only be 162000 for 2weeks in a 2BD gold season.   Your reasoning is only applicable to owners of Oceanfront Hawaii since you get a ton of Abound points if you elect


----------



## CPNY (Nov 6, 2022)

I don’t know when but I do know it’s (A) bound to happen


----------



## DavidnRobin (Nov 6, 2022)

Unless the date is written in someone’s purchase contract it doesn’t matter - just like the signed contract states.

PR-wise is another issue, but that is short term in the corporate scheme of things.

Maybe it is just that they can’t get their antiquated IT system to work to with the combined systems.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## TravelTime (Nov 6, 2022)

byeloe said:


> I guess you are overlapping seasons, since it would only be 162000 for 2weeks in a 2BD gold season.   Your reasoning is only applicable to owners of Oceanfront Hawaii since you get a ton of Abound points if you elect



That is why I said sometimes. People on this thread make statements like it is bad for 100% of people.


----------



## TravelTime (Nov 6, 2022)

DavidnRobin said:


> Unless the date is written in someone’s purchase contract it doesn’t matter - just like the signed contract states.
> 
> PR-wise is another issue, but that is short term in the corporate scheme of things.
> 
> ...



One issue is if they launch too late, esp if it ends up being after the new year, then they will definitely not get any elected weeks. I am double booked in case I want to elect points for 2023. For me, there are a lot of advantages to elect points for my week.


----------



## CalGalTraveler (Nov 6, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> One issue is if they launch too late, esp if it ends up being after the new year, then they will definitely not get any elected weeks. I am double booked in case I want to elect points for 2023. For me, there are a lot of advantages to elect points for my week.



+1 Good point. Given the delays, perhaps they now figure that deposits for next year for the average owner (not super users like you) are mostly lost for Vistana so no rush.  AFAIK they don't make incremental revenue by making deposits for 2023. They can begin promoting deposits next year and can continue to sell to un-requaled voluntary and Abound points buyers, knowing that they would not be able to close their deed purchases before the end of 2022 in time to deposit.


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## byeloe (Nov 6, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> That is why I said sometimes. People on this thread make statements like it is bad for 100% of people.


It's much less than sometimes.   Probably only works for Hawaii since there is such a disparity in the amount of Abound points that you receive compared to other resorts


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## TravelTime (Nov 6, 2022)

I am tripled book now for Maui in April. At this point, I do not want to use my Westin week and prefer to stay at MOC since I have 9 nights booked there and stay the first week in Wailea. So I may rent my Westin week. Hopefully I can find someone who want to go during spring break. Last time, I made the price a little lower than everyone else to get it rented quickly.


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## TravelTime (Nov 6, 2022)

Here is some bad news. My WKOVRN 2BR OF is renting out for an average of $5000 for the week I have booked during spring break. I will get the equivalent of $5800 in Abound points if I elect points. People who say renting is better are not always right either. People think a 2BR OF in Hawaii is worth so much on the rental market. There are many myths on TUG.

Even it were worth more than the equivalent in Abound points, the hassle of renting would not be worth it. For me, the only reason to rent out a week is if I can‘t or do not want to use it. There is also the risk no one will rent the week. So if the week is renting for $5000 on average, I charge a few hundred less to make sure it rents.


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## daviator (Nov 6, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Here is some bad news. My WKOVRN 2BR OF is renting out for an average of $5000 for the week I have booked during spring break. I will get the equivalent of $5800 in Abound points if I elect points. People who say renting is better are not always right either. People think a 2BR OF in Hawaii is worth so much on the rental market. There are many myths on TUG.
> 
> Even it were worth more than the equivalent in Abound points, the hassle of renting would not be worth it. For me, the only reason to rent out a week is if I can‘t or do not want to use it. There is also the risk no one will rent the week. So if the week is renting for $5000 on average, I charge a few hundred less to make sure it rents.


Also, specific to Hawaii, are the various taxes which you are supposed to be paying (GET, TAT, etc.) and which the state is becoming increasingly sophisticated in their ability to collect, pursue and penalize.  Many people aren’t paying those taxes and are setting themselves up for an unpleasant surprise.

If I wanted to monetize my Hawaii ownership in the age of Abound, I think it would be safer to convert to club points and then rent them, even if I got less money for doing so.  That would avoid all of the complicated Hawaii tax process.


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## byeloe (Nov 6, 2022)

@TravelTime 
I think it is pretty clear that your ownership is better off in Abound, unless you are going to use it


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## TravelTime (Nov 6, 2022)

byeloe said:


> @TravelTime
> I think it is pretty clear that your ownership is better off in Abound, unless you are going to use it



If I can’t deposit into Abound, I am not planning to use it and will stay at MOC instead for the dates that do not leave Sat-Sat. So then I will need to rent it or lose it. The airfare is at least $2400-$2600 more if I fly Sat-Sat so that is not worth it to me to pay that much more. Instead I will fly on weekdays.


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## TravelTime (Nov 7, 2022)

Is it too late to bank Star Options for 2024-2025? I am now 5* Elite. I was nothing before so I am not clear on the deadlines.


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## VacationForever (Nov 7, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Is it too late to bank Star Options for 2024-2025? I am now 5* Elite. I was nothing before so I am not clear on the deadlines.


I assume you are asking about 2022 SOs?  Banked 2022 SOs will be good until Dec 2024.  Deadline for 5 star elite to bank is end of the year.

You should go to Vistana website and click "Bank Star Options".  If you have anything remaining for this year and you can bank, it will provide you with the ability to do so for "free".


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## Eric B (Nov 7, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Is it too late to bank Star Options for 2024-2025? I am now 5* Elite. I was nothing before so I am not clear on the deadlines.



Banking deadline for 5* is December 31, I believe. My first year as one, too, but I already blew the banking fee when I did mine in June as a no status resale owner....


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## TravelTime (Nov 7, 2022)

Eric B said:


> Banking deadline for 5* is December 31, I believe. My first year as one, too, but I already blew the banking fee when I did mine in June as a no status resale owner....



Great, if Abound does not launch by Dec 31 or the terms are not good For depositing a week, then I will bank. We get 2 years in Vistana if we are 5* elite. Is that correct?


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## byeloe (Nov 7, 2022)

Dec 31 2022 is the deadline for banking your 2022 options.  You would be using your 2023 week to Elect Abound  if they launch this year, so there is no rush to bank your 2023 options this far in advance.   You would still have 2 years as a 5* elite owner


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## Eric B (Nov 7, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> Great, if Abound does not launch by Dec 31 or the terms are not good For depositing a week, then I will bank. We get 2 years in Vistana if we are 5* elite. Is that correct?



Under the current VSN rules everyone gets 2 years to use banked StarOptions. From what has been released regarding the transition to the new set of rules that will remain the same for 2023 and 2024. After that the duration they are good for depends on the ownership level in Abound with Presidential getting 18 months and Chairman's Club getting 2 years, while those at lower levels will only have 1 year to use the banked StarOptions. I believe the same durations would apply in VSN for folks that aren't Abound enrolled. The deadlines for banking change as well. See the attached, which was released in August.


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## TravelTime (Nov 7, 2022)

Eric B said:


> Under the current VSN rules everyone gets 2 years to use banked StarOptions. From what has been released regarding the transition to the new set of rules that will remain the same for 2023 and 2024. After that the duration they are good for depends on the ownership level in Abound with Presidential getting 18 months and Chairman's Club getting 2 years, while those at lower levels will only have 1 year to use the banked StarOptions. I believe the same durations would apply in VSN for folks that aren't Abound enrolled. The deadlines for banking change as well. See the attached, which was released in August.



Great thank you!


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## timsi (Nov 7, 2022)

They said Abound is just an option, if we like what we have we can keep it. Of course, that is not true, they had to lower the banking and other VSN benefits to make it less attractive.


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## TravelTime (Nov 7, 2022)

Eric B said:


> Banking deadline for 5* is December 31, I believe. My first year as one, too, but I already blew the banking fee when I did mine in June as a no status resale owner....



I blew the 2 year banking rule for some of my Abound points because I banked way in advance. I banked some of my points a few years in advance. Last time when I went to presidential, Marriott extended my baking to 1.5 years. I asked this time and they said if they were already banked, there is no extension to 2 years. I think this is very unfair. You get penalized for banking early. Going forward, I am not banking early. 

Sometimes I seem very pro-Marriott but really I am neutral toward all my timeshares. They all have pros and cons.


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## Eric B (Nov 7, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I blew the 2 year banking rule for some of my Abound points because I banked way in advance. I banked some of my points a few years in advance. Last time when I went to presidential, Marriott extended my baking to 1.5 years. I asked this time and they said if they were already banked, there is no extension to 2 years. I think this is very unfair. You get penalized for banking early. Going forward, I am not banking early.
> 
> Sometimes I seem very pro-Marriott but really I am neutral toward all my timeshares. They all have pros and cons.



On the other hand, I never expected to become 5* and able to bank through December 31st based on the implementation of Abound. All things being equal, I'm not offended that I'm not getting the banking fee back and will be in a better position on a going forward basis. I would have a hard time feeling upset about not getting the extra 6 months for previously banked points based on a windfall of Chairman's Club status for an all resale ownership, myself, though I might try calling back again to see if a different representative could or would help me out on that. YMMV.


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## TravelTime (Nov 7, 2022)

Eric B said:


> On the other hand, I never expected to become 5* and able to bank through December 31st based on the implementation of Abound. All things being equal, I'm not offended that I'm not getting the banking fee back and will be in a better position on a going forward basis. I would have a hard time feeling upset about not getting the extra 6 months for previously banked points based on a windfall of Chairman's Club status for an all resale ownership, myself, though I might try calling back again to see if a different representative could or would help me out on that. YMMV.



I totally agree. I think the upgrade to Chaiman’s status and future 2 years of banking is great and this offsets that I banked early and lost the extra 6 months on those points. I will use them first anyway.


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## Eric B (Nov 7, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> I totally agree. I think the upgrade to Chaiman’s status and future 2 years of banking is great and this offsets that I banked early and lost the extra 6 months on those points. I will use them first anyway.



Don't set yourself up for the fear of missing out - I'm sure the sales force could fix the issue with the "lost" 6 months if you'd only buy some retail points....


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## Venter (Nov 10, 2022)

Whe received an addendum with our Aventuras purchase that the expected date of Abound being functional would be October.


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## Eric B (Nov 10, 2022)

Venter said:


> Whe received an addendum with our Aventuras purchase that the expected date of Abound being functional would be October.



2022 or 2023?


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## Venter (Nov 10, 2022)

Eric B said:


> 2022 or 2023?


2022


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## Eric B (Nov 10, 2022)

Venter said:


> 2022



Ok - wouldn’t hold my breath at this point (November 10, 2022)


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## dioxide45 (Nov 11, 2022)

wannagotoo said:


> I'm still going with what I was told at the owner's update. They are looking for it to be functional at the beginning of the new year.


They don’t know anything more than anyone else. Sales is usually one of the last to be told official dates.


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## dsmrp (Nov 16, 2022)

It's mid November already. Does anyone really think Marriott will announce something at month's end, considering it's a short Thanksgiving week next week? 
Will IT burn the holiday weekend oil to get all converted by Tuesday or Wednesday Nov 29 or 30??  I would be very surprised if they rolled it out on the Monday the 28th...


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## sponger76 (Nov 16, 2022)

dsmrp said:


> It's mid November already. Does anyone really think Marriott will announce something at month's end, considering it's a short Thanksgiving week next week?
> Will IT burn the holiday weekend oil to get all converted by Tuesday or Wednesday Nov 29 or 30??  I would be very surprised if they rolled it out on the Monday the 28th...


They haven't been burning any oil so far, I don't see why the holiday weekend would improve things in that regard.


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## JimT (Nov 17, 2022)

Attended an owners update Tuesday.  Rep said it was delayed because they wanted to get it right - maybe 3 months?!  Talked about all the additional properties participating in Interval International.  Didn't feel like they had anything to share.  Very disappointing.


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## grrrah (Nov 17, 2022)

JimT said:


> Attended an owners update Tuesday.  Rep said it was delayed because they wanted to get it right - maybe 3 months?!  Talked about all the additional properties participating in Interval International.  Didn't feel like they had anything to share.  Very disappointing.


Pretty much because they don't have much to share. At least nothing more than we already know here.


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## dioxide45 (Nov 17, 2022)

JimT said:


> Attended an owners update Tuesday.  Rep said it was delayed because they wanted to get it right - maybe 3 months?!  Talked about all the additional properties participating in Interval International.  Didn't feel like they had anything to share.  Very disappointing.


It is delayed because THEY CAN'T GET IT RIGHT!


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## Eric B (Nov 17, 2022)

JimT said:


> Rep said it was delayed because they wanted to get it right - maybe 3 months?!



Three months would put it past the December 31, 2022 deadline for electing Abound Club Points for 2023. That seems quite odd - if they launch it in February without extending that deadline into 2023, there won't be anyone on the Vistana side able to use Abound for 2023. There would be some Abound availability for the Marriott side due to all the weeks dumped into the trust. Our rep at Lagunamar said that we could call in to elect Abound club points if we wanted to before they figure out the IT side of things but that also seems completely out of any rational process and not something I would want to do without any insight into whether I'd actually be able to use the points. My guess would be a launch by December 31st or no launch for use in 2023. Stranger things have happened, though.


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## dioxide45 (Nov 17, 2022)

Eric B said:


> Three months would put it past the December 31, 2022 deadline for electing Abound Club Points for 2023. That seems quite odd - if they launch it in February without extending that deadline into 2023, there won't be anyone on the Vistana side able to use Abound for 2023. There would be some Abound availability for the Marriott side due to all the weeks dumped into the trust. Our rep at Lagunamar said that we could call in to elect Abound club points if we wanted to before they figure out the IT side of things but that also seems completely out of any rational process and not something I would want to do without any insight into whether I'd actually be able to use the points. My guess would be a launch by December 31st or no launch for use in 2023. Stranger things have happened, though.


I suspect if they push in to 2023, they will just do a regular rollout and Vistana owners being able to elect 2024 use year for points. There may not be the ability to elect for 2023. All the standard election deadlines could then apply. They could borrow in to 2023 for a 2023 reservation. The only 2023 Vistana inventory that would really be available in Abound would be what was conveyed to the trust, but Vistana owners could make 2023 point reservations into what would be much more Marriott availability. This of course is all just speculation. I notice that the FAQ about 2023 use year election still indicated December 31, 2022. If that FAQ item goes away or is updated, then we can draw more certain conclusions.


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## Eric B (Nov 17, 2022)

dioxide45 said:


> I suspect if they push in to 2023, they will just do a regular rollout and Vistana owners being able to elect 2024 use year for points. There may not be the ability to elect for 2023. All the standard election deadlines could then apply. They could borrow in to 2023 for a 2023 reservation. The only 2023 Vistana inventory that would really be available in Abound would be what was conveyed to the trust, but Vistana owners could make 2023 point reservations into what would be much more Marriott availability. This of course is all just speculation. I notice that the FAQ about 2023 use year election still indicated December 31, 2022. If that FAQ item goes away or is updated, then we can draw more certain conclusions.



On the other hand, Marriott has already started charging the Abound Club dues for 2023 and labeled them as that on the budgets. They could always change the messaging on that, but it could really make people wonder why they're paying more without the system actually existing for at least part of the year.


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## dioxide45 (Nov 17, 2022)

Eric B said:


> On the other hand, Marriott has already started charging the Abound Club dues for 2023 and labeled them as that on the budgets. They could always change the messaging on that, but it could really make people wonder why they're paying more without the system actually existing for at least part of the year.


That is a good point. With many already committed to 2023 home resort or VSN reservations anyway, they may still wonder the same thing.


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## hcarman (Nov 18, 2022)

A sales guy the other day told us he thought the merger would never happen - too complicated.  Amazing to hear that from a sales.guy.


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## DavidnRobin (Nov 19, 2022)

hcarman said:


> A sales guy the other day told us he thought the merger would never happen - too complicated. Amazing to hear that from a sales.guy.



Probably had some weak Voluntary weeks/points to sell you where Abound has little to no value.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## TravelTime (Nov 20, 2022)

Given Abound has not launched yet, I already canceled my WKOVRN reservation for Maui for April and re-booked the week for Thanksgiving. We are still going to Maui in April using MVC points instead. The reason I canceled Westin is because I want to fly on a Thursday and return on a Monday (11 days later) because flights are much cheaper, like thousands cheaper. I had the week booked to fly Sat-Sat for 14 days. I could not re-schedule my WKOVRN week at this late date or fly on odd days using my WKOVRN OF week since the options when I booked at 12 months were Fri, Sat or Sun for 7 days. This is another reason I prefer Abound points. The flexibility is much better for me.

If Abound still does not launch this year, I am looking at the following options for my WKOVRN week: 1) Rent the week, 2) Go to Maui again for Thanksgiving break (my DH gets TG week off every year as a bonus vacation week), 3) Bank the SOs and use them in June 2024 to go to Mexico, probably Lagunamar (14-15 days using my WKOVRN OF week in June). I am leaning toward going to Lagunamar for 14-15 days using my SOs because it seems like a good deal to exchange 7N for 15N.

Question: How likely is it that inventory for Lagunamar will be available at 8 months in June 2024? I looked for this year and it was available at 8 months using SOs and it is still available and it is only at less than 7 months. So I assume it will not be hard to get for June 2024. I am just worried if I save my SOs for June 2024 that the inventory could all be taken at 13 months by Abound users given what Tuggers have been saying in this thread.


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## byeloe (Nov 20, 2022)

TravelTime said:


> How likely is it that inventory for Lagunamar will be available at 8 months in June 2024?


Historically Lagunamar has been easy to book in gold season at 8 months.   Booking January 2023 was much more difficult than past years.  I would think that all the other gold weeks will still be easy at 8 months.


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