# Canada to require air, rail and cruise travelers to be vaccinated



## RNCollins (Aug 16, 2021)

*Canada Plans to Require Vaccine for Travelers No Later than Oct. 31*

By Michael B. Baker / Business Travel News / Aug 15, 2021









						Canada Plans to Require Vaccine for Travelers No Later than Oct. 31
					

The Canadian government within the next few months will require all commercial air travelers to be vaccinated against Covid-19, the government's Treasury Board, a committee of Cabinet members, announced on Friday.




					www.businesstravelnews.com


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## AJCts411 (Aug 16, 2021)

71% vaccinated, right from his article. But there is a dictate to force AKA "drive the uptake of vaccines".


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## Chrisky (Aug 16, 2021)

Great news. Of course we need to increase the uptake, but people can still make a choice. They can choose to get vaccinated and be able move forward with their lives. 
For those who do not travel, do not take buses, are anti-vaxxers, etc. they will not get vaccinated. So be it. There will be considerations made for certain people who cannot get the vaccine for health issues.  
There are many employers who welcome this initiative, they want to create a safe environment for their employees to come back to work in their offices as well as a safe environment for their clients.  

From CTV news, as of this morning:
Canada


Total
Percentage of population vaccinatedTotal
Percentage of population fully vaccinatedEligible (12+)
Percentage of population vaccinatedEligible (12+)
Percentage of population fully vaccinated71.99%
+0.08%63.42%
+0.38%81.91%
+0.10%72.16%
+0.43%

Total doses administeredFirst dosesSecond dosesReceived from manufacturerReceived doses administered51,557,385
+177,05727,410,079
+31,92024,147,306
+145,13763,388,598
+081.34%
+0.28%


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## AJCts411 (Aug 16, 2021)

Chrisky said:


> Great news. Of course we need to increase the uptake, but people can still make a choice. They can choose to get vaccinated and be able move forward with their lives.
> For those who do not travel, do not take buses, are anti-vaxxers, etc. they will not get vaccinated. So be it. There will be considerations made for certain people who cannot get the vaccine for health issues.
> There are many employers who welcome this initiative, they want to create a safe environment for their employees to come back to work in their offices as well as a safe environment for their clients.
> 
> ...



How is unvacinated Canadians being forbidden from traveling within your country a choice?  Many legal experts, are on the side of this is against our Charter of Rights. This is a more of a punishment for choosing.   Can't wait for the private sector to take control and start demanding your papers.  "for our own good".


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## bizaro86 (Aug 16, 2021)

AJCts411 said:


> How is unvacinated Canadians being forbidden from traveling within your country a choice?  Many legal experts, are on the side of this is against our Charter of Rights. This is a more of a punishment for choosing.   Can't wait for the private sector to take control and start demanding your papers.  "for our own good".



I've been fully vaccinated for a long time, but I agree with this. As just one example, Newfoundland is an island. There are exactly two ways out - a plane or a ferry. Under this policy both will require full vaccination. How is that not keeping people a prisoner on an island if they choose to not get vaccinated.


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## Chrisky (Aug 16, 2021)

bizaro86 said:


> I've been fully vaccinated for a long time, but I agree with this. As just one example, Newfoundland is an island. There are exactly two ways out - a plane or a ferry. Under this policy both will require full vaccination. How is that not keeping people a prisoner on an island if they choose to not get vaccinated.








						Travel Advice - COVID-19
					

All travellers are permitted to enter Newfoundland and Labrador. Effective February 28, 2022, the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador does not require you to self-isolate or get tested for COVID-19 upon arrival, or complete the Travel Form.



					travel-declaration.nlchi.nl.ca
				




Newfoundland have protocols for people to follow when arriving.  
They have a form to fill out, if they are not fully vaccinated or only partially they have to quarantine for a certain length of time.  
Information in the link above.  

That is the whole idea.  They have a choice, vaccinate or not.


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## Chrisky (Aug 16, 2021)

AJCts411 said:


> How is unvacinated Canadians being forbidden from traveling within your country a choice?  Many legal experts, are on the side of this is against our Charter of Rights. This is a more of a punishment for choosing.   Can't wait for the private sector to take control and start demanding your papers.  "for our own good".



That is fine with me, ask all you want. We have all sort of government documents we have to produce for a lot of things, namely passport, driver’s license, vaccination certificates for children to attend school.  Now, covid vaccine.  It is still your choice to vaccinate or not.  
You can choose to live your life as you are doing now, do not get vaccinate.  Or, you can get vaccinated and choose to travel etc.  Still your choice.  
Charter of Rights does not give people absolute right to do anything they want.  They still have to obey our laws.


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## dioxide45 (Aug 16, 2021)

Chrisky said:


> Charter of Rights does not give people absolute right to do anything they want. They still have to obey our laws.


Isn't the Charter of Rights & Freedoms supposed to supersede laws that violate the Charter? The Charter is the supreme law, no?


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## clipper (Aug 16, 2021)

I am fully vaccinated, still wear masks, etc.  We would like to visit my in-laws in another province.  I have comorbidities and my in-laws are in their late 80's.  Getting on a plane to visit them exposes me, my husband and my in-laws to the risk of COVID.  We have not seen them for over 2 years.   We usually visit at least once a year to help them and set up services so they can stay in their home comfortably.   My rights are just as important as other people's rights.  We all have to give up 'some' freedom to live in this world in harmony and peace.


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## bizaro86 (Aug 16, 2021)

Chrisky said:


> Charter of Rights does not give people absolute right to do anything they want.  They still have to obey our laws.



Actually the charter supercedes other laws.

And section 6 provides a guarantee of mobility between provinces. How do you propose someone from Newfoundland move to another province if they aren't permitted on an airplane or a ferry?

Like I said I got my vaccine at the earliest possible time, but I don't agree with this policy.


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## Chrisky (Aug 16, 2021)

And section 6 provides a guarantee of mobility between provinces. How do you propose someone from Newfoundland move to another province if they aren't permitted on an airplane or a ferry?
[/QUOTE]

Oh for heavens sake, this has nothing to do with moving to another province!


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## CanuckTravlr (Aug 16, 2021)

dioxide45 said:


> Isn't the Charter of Rights & Freedoms supposed to supersede laws that violate the Charter? The Charter is the supreme law, no?



Nope.  All rights and freedoms are subject to "reasonable and necessary" restrictions.  There is a "notwithstanding clause" in the Charter.  It's not much different than most other places in the world.  Here's a copy for you to read, if you're interested.

Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms (canada.ca)



bizaro86 said:


> Actually the charter supercedes other laws.
> 
> And section 6 provides a guarantee of mobility between provinces. How do you propose someone from Newfoundland move to another province if they aren't permitted on an airplane or a ferry?



Yes, the Charter generally supersedes other laws, but it still has the "notwithstanding" clause, although that doesn't generally apply to section 6.  However, I haven't seen any suggestion the restrictions would apply to Marine Atlantic or BC Ferries.  Accommodations would have to be made.

From what I have read, the proposed laws only affect interprovincial commercial air and rail passenger travel and cruise ship passengers.  It does not affect private aircraft, nor travel by automobile, nor boats without accommodation.  The regulations are not yet set, but I suspect the ferries to and from Newfoundland and Labrador, Vancouver Island, et cetera, will not be affected, anymore than they were when cruise ships were banned.  While some such ferries may have limited cabins available, they are not really cruise ships.  Unvaccinated passengers might be subject to some form of pre-boarding Covid-19 test, or limited isolation on board, or remaining in their vehicles if not a walk-on passenger.

Overall, I personally think it is a step in the right direction.


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## MrockStar (Aug 16, 2021)

Swim.


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## bizaro86 (Aug 16, 2021)

CanuckTravlr said:


> Yes, the Charter generally supersedes other laws, but it still has the "notwithstanding" clause, although that doesn't generally apply to section 6.



Do you think the government would be willing to use notwithstanding over this?

I would have no issue making it inconvenient for non-vaccinated to travel (for instance 2 self paid tests at 1 and 3 days before travel) but I think a complete ban is unfair.


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## CanuckTravlr (Aug 16, 2021)

bizaro86 said:


> Do you think the government would be willing to use notwithstanding over this?
> 
> I would have no issue making it inconvenient for non-vaccinated to travel (for instance 2 self paid tests at 1 and 3 days before travel) but I think a complete ban is unfair.



My comments about the "notwithstanding" clause were with respect to the comments by yourself and @dioxide45 that the Charter is supreme.  It's not.

Quite frankly, I don't think this issue is about Charter rights.  I think those claiming it is an infringement on their basic "freedoms" is as much of an overreach as it would be to invoke the notwithstanding clause.  The federal government has the right to regulate interprovincial transport.  There are lots of regulations in place already, to ensure the safety of ALL passengers, such as having to wear masks, restrictions on alcohol, security screening, and so on.  Provinces also have the right to put restrictions on travel, such as driver's licences, speed limits, camping permits, etc.

This is a health and safety issue, not a "freedom" issue, IMO.  Governments have always mandated restrictions for health and safety purposes.  Only authorized personnel, wearing proper safety equipment, can normally enter construction sites, as an example.  I honestly do not understand why anyone at this stage of the pandemic would refuse to be vaccinated.  It's still their choice, but if that is their choice, then they shouldn't be surprised by not having the same freedom to do what they want.

If they don't care enough about themselves, their young children, family, friends and neighbours, then I am not going to lose any sleep over their bleating about being treated "unfairly".  God forbid they might have to make a sacrifice for the common good.  There have been over 4.5 billion doses of vaccine administered around the world.  There are very few instances of negative effects, and we mostly know who might be susceptible.  We do know what the consequences are of not being vaccinated and contracting Covid-19, especially during this fourth wave.  I just wish they would think about someone else other than themselves!


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## bizaro86 (Aug 16, 2021)

The constitution (including the charter) is the highest law in Canada. It contains exclusions and exceptions, but those are part of the constitution, not another level of law above it.

The likeliest challenge to this law (and it's really more of an election promise right now than a law) would be under section 6, mobility.

This pretty clearly restricts inter-provincial mobility, and the notwithstanding clause doesn't apply to section 6 anyway even if the government was willing to use it on this. I don't believe a Canadian Federal government has ever used it, so it would certainly be rare.

That said, it could certainly be allowable under section 1 as a reasonable infringement. But that would be a matter for the courts interpreting the constitution if it were challenged (and I think you can expect that it will be if enacted).

Anyway, broadly speaking I think those who have chosen not to get vaccinated are a bunch of idiots. But under the same principles of Niemoller's, "First they came..." I'm concerned about the infringement of what I think are pretty important rights, even when the people whose rights are being infringed are idiots.


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## MrockStar (Aug 16, 2021)

Free Idiots.


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## echino (Aug 17, 2021)

Any court challenge of the interprovincial travel restrictions will be dismissed, the same way it happened to the challenge of mandatory hotel quarantine. It's a mockery of the Charter. You only have rights and freedoms in Canada until the government decides that you do not, for the common good.


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## CanuckTravlr (Aug 17, 2021)

I agree that any court challenge will likely fail.  But it's hardly a mockery.  Laws for the common good and well-being of society, applied equally to all, without discrimination by race, origin, colour, religion, sexual orientation, et cetera, are at the heart of the Charter.

The right to "life, liberty, and security of the person, and the right not to be deprived thereof" is guaranteed by the Charter.  That some people who have the ability to be vaccinated, but choose not to be, put others at potential risk, particularly those under 12 who can't be vaccinated yet, violates that fundamental right.

All rights and freedoms have always been subject to restrictions when they interfere with the rights and freedoms of others, not just in Canada, but in most free democracies.  Some people seem to be confusing a misguided, self-entitled, "freedom" to do whatever they want with the responsibility not to act in a way that puts others at risk!!


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## AJCts411 (Aug 17, 2021)

Chrisky said:


> That is fine with me, ask all you want. We have all sort of government documents we have to produce for a lot of things, namely passport, driver’s license, vaccination certificates for children to attend school.  Now, covid vaccine.  It is still your choice to vaccinate or not.
> You can choose to live your life as you are doing now, do not get vaccinate.  Or, you can get vaccinated and choose to travel etc.  Still your choice.
> Charter of Rights does not give people absolute right to do anything they want.  They still have to obey our laws.



Being coerced into being able to exercise protected charter rights is not a choice. Ever.  Charter guarantees the unrestricted movement of Canadians within Canada.  This is no where close to doing what they want, they are not criminals they are people with thier belifs that are different than yours.  And please site the LAW they are breaking?


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## T-Dot-Traveller (Aug 19, 2021)

We will know how this works after Sept 20
For now - Everything is speculative


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