# Co-worker didn't listen to me - RCI Points



## Marcia3641 (Mar 4, 2013)

Now she owns RCI points and has NO idea what she purchased. I am trying to help her out but I not familiar with RCI points. She didn't even tell me she purchased this until last week and apparently she did it back in August and has been paying the down payment and now she totally regrets it. I looked over her contract and this is what it says. She is paying approx $4,000 which is really almost $7,000 with the interest rate she has...smh!


RCI Platinum Member
Paid through 1/14
Membership term expires 1/16
Use Year 2/1/13 - 1/31/14
Annual points - 22,000
Resort - Breakers of Ft. Lauderdale
Extra Vacations Program - 2 extra vacations (entitled to one week of accommodations in addition to the week deposited. the only cost will be the then current redemption fee). What exactly is this? I thought extra vacations could be purchased by anyone with an account?
Extra Vacation Getaway (3 year certificate). She is entitled to two full weeks each year for 3 consecutive years. No RCI points required. Confirmation can be made 2-45 days in advance of travel dates.

I showed her how to search and she had a breakdown as she couldn't find anything she wanted with the number of points she has. Isn't there somewhere on the RCI points site that she can search for vacations at a reduced points structure? and for $4,000 does that mean her membership is 'trial' as I couldn't tell from her contract, but saw that membership had a term date. Do RCI points roll over?

I have a weeks account and it's a little bit different so I wasn't sure where to tell her to go. Thanks in advance.

Marcia


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 4, 2013)

Breakers of Ft Lauderdale is the FT LAUDERDALE BEACH RESORT of 909 Breakers Ave, Ft Lauderdale. Many Tuggers own at this resort.

That is a very low RCI Point value ... the underlying deed must be a small 1bdr in the off-off season. Is there a MF amount mentioned anywheres on the paperwork? 22K in one year will not get her a STUDIO in PRIME season. 2 years worth of points would get her a small 1bdr (38500) or a STUDIO (25,500) if she uses parts of two years of points.


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## Marcia3641 (Mar 4, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> Breakers of Ft Lauderdale is the FT LAUDERDALE BEACH RESORT of 909 Breakers Ave, Ft Lauderdale. Many Tuggers own at this resort.
> 
> That is a very low RCI Point value ... the underlying deed must be a small 1bdr in the off-off season. Is there a MF amount mentioned anywheres on the paperwork? 22K in one year will not get her a STUDIO in PRIME season. @ years worth of points would get her a small 1bdr (38500) or a STUDIO (25,500) if she uses parts of two years of points.



Took some digging in the paper but I found it $643.


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## Egret1986 (Mar 4, 2013)

*Happens a lot; happened with my own mother...folks just won't listen*



Marcia3641 said:


> Now she owns RCI points and has NO idea what she purchased. I am trying to help her out but I not familiar with RCI points. She didn't even tell me she purchased this until last week and apparently she did it back in August and has been paying the down payment and now she totally regrets it. I looked over her contract and this is what it says. She is paying approx $4,000 which is really almost $7,000 with the interest rate she has...smh!
> 
> 
> RCI Platinum Member
> ...



They don't know what they're doing, but seem to think you know less, I guess.  Your co-worker now will have to live with the mistake.....an expensive one, with an ongoing annual fee until she can convince someone to take it off her hands (once she's paid it off).  Wish her luck.  She's gonna need it.


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## JudyS (Mar 4, 2013)

Marcia3641 said:


> ...
> I showed her how to search and she had a breakdown as she couldn't find anything she wanted with the number of points she has. Isn't there somewhere on the RCI points site that she can search for vacations at a reduced points structure? and for $4,000 does that mean her membership is 'trial' as I couldn't tell from her contract, but saw that membership had a term date. Do RCI points roll over?...


This isn't necessarily a trial membership. All RCI Points contracts are for three years; then they have to be renewed. Some resorts charge a fee for this renewal (mine charge $89), and apparently some don't. 

22,000 points is very little. A two-bedroom in red season is generally 50,000 points and up. You friend can get discounted weeks around 45 - 30 days before check-in. She can save points for one year for no fee. She can also borrow from the next year's points. 

The MF is horribly high for 22,000 points. (About a penny a point, or $220 a year, would be good.) She should do whatever she can to get rid of this week.

At least she only paid $4000 (plus interest), not $20,000 or so!


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 4, 2013)

That is a low ($643) MF rate, too. 2013 MF for a small 1/1 unit was $729. That is REALLY an outdated MF rate ... 2010 was $725.65, 2011 was $736.02, 2012 was $733.31, and then the 2013 MF was $729.

If the MF was wrong, the RCI Points value could be off, too. A couple of years ago, the resort reviews got better and the Point value for each week also went up. 

There is a REALLY rumor that once upon a time, STUDIO units were sold as a standalone item. 22K points is what a PRIME studio unit got; don't know about the MF for a studio standalone. (And I did meet a person who had brought a studio back in 1975).


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## Passepartout (Mar 4, 2013)

Points roll over for one year, so she could have 44,000 every other year and borrow from the next use year and have 66K every 3 years. Still a fairly modest account, but gets her toe in the pool. The low point costs are sub 30 or 45 days before move- in. Kinda like Last Calls, but paid with points and an exchange fee instead of cash and no fees.

Jim


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## JudyS (Mar 4, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> That is a low ($643) MF rate, too. 2013 MF for a small 1/1 unit was $729. That is REALLY an outdated MF rate ... 2010 was $725.65, 2011 was $736.02, 2012 was $733.31, and then the 2013 MF was $729.
> 
> If the MF was wrong, the RCI Points value could be off, too. A couple of years ago, the resort reviews got better and the Point value for each week also went up.
> 
> There is a REALLY rumor that once upon a time, STUDIO units were sold as a standalone item. 22K points is what a PRIME studio unit got; don't know about the MF for a studio standalone. (And I did meet a person who had brought a studio back in 1975).


It sounds like the OP's friend needs to look at her deed to see what she really owns. If this is a peak season unit, then taking it out of RCI Points (canceling its ability to trade in RCI Points) would probably be the best approach.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 4, 2013)

You can't save people from themselves, and I've also realized it's not worth the effort to rescue people.  

One time I rented a week at Bali Hai Villas in Princeville to a family member.  Before she left I talked with her about the sales presentation, what to expect, and why they shouldn't do it.  Sure enough, one day while they are there I get a call from her asking for advice.  They had signed up for the sales pitch and bought a Wyndham contract.  I reiterated everything I said before, and showed her ten current resales for contracts larger than hers that were being listed at 1% to 3% of what she was paying. Beyond that I had significant questions about whether she should even be timesharing in the first place because of their lifestyle and interests. But she was all gaga about the developer bonuses. After about fifteen minutes it suddenly dawned on me that she had no interest in killing the deal; she had simply been hoping that I would tell her what a good deal this was.  But I wasn't going to give her that.

Fast forward 18 months.  I get a call from her asking for more "advice".  She's realized that this was a bad decision, it's a money pit, it doesn't fit their lifestyle, and they need to get rid of it. So I give her advice on how to list the unit, most of which she promptly ignores, and puts the unit up for sale for $10k.  No serious inquiries, of course, but now the resale sharks are circling.  

Next thing I know she calls me up for advice on someone who is telling her they have someone ready to buy her contract for $15,000, but she needs to send $3000 to get an account set up, all of which will be reimbursed after the sale closes.  I explain to her how the scam works, and she says OK. A few days later I get a call and she wants to patch me into a call she is having with the guy at the company.  I reluctantly agree to get involved, and I try to expose the scam. But after we finish the call and I recap with her she trots out all of the rebuts the scammer gave her. I realize that she has no intention of taking my advice; once again she is simply hoping that I will confirm her wisdom, which I ain't gonna do.  

About four months later I get a call from her again.  She's gotten a call from someone who is willing to dispose of her ownership but she has to pay them $3500 to take it off her hands.  I explain to her what is going on and how she can put an ad on TUG, offer the unit up for free, even offer $1000 in buyer incentive if she absolutely must, and come out money ahead.  As soon as she starts to counter I simply tell her to do what she wants.

So she pays $4000, they jacked up the price on her, and as far as I know she is now rid of it.  She hasn't mentioned anything more about it, and I am certainly not going to ask.

*****

Telling somebody they made a mistake is tricky. Because it's hard to say that without also sending a hidden message that says there were stupid.  And people don't want to hear that.  What they want to hear from you is affirmation that they made a good deal.  I've realized that the best thing to do is to ignore all discussion about what they paid and instead get them excited about what the new opportunities they have.  Reality is going to wash up anyway; it's presumptuous for me to think it has to come from me.


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## jc92869 (Mar 4, 2013)

*rci instant exchanges*

There are "instant exchanges". these happen  within 30 days of check in date. the points rage for these are 7,500  - 9,000. the selection is not the greatest, but one can find some gems in there every once in a while.  Although  it is not a good deal, what she got is not necessarily the worst deal she could have gotten. If she plays her cards right  she can  get two to  three weeks vacations per year  with her points.


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## Marcia3641 (Mar 5, 2013)

Egret1986 said:


> They don't know what they're doing, but seem to think you know less, I guess.  Your co-worker now will have to live with the mistake.....an expensive one, with an ongoing annual fee until she can convince someone to take it off her hands (once she's paid it off).  Wish her luck.  She's gonna need it.



Honestly, I think she thought I was shafting her on the rentals that she has done with me over the last couple of years. Every time she rents from me I've told her NOT to fall for the sales tactic and if she really wants to own she should buy resale. I think the only reason why she even told me is because she was at her wits end and needed help....


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## Marcia3641 (Mar 5, 2013)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> Telling somebody they made a mistake is tricky. Because it's hard to say that without also sending a hidden message that says there were stupid.  And people don't want to hear that.  What they want to hear from you is affirmation that they made a good deal.  I've realized that the best thing to do is to ignore all discussion about what they paid and instead get them excited about what the new opportunities they have.  Reality is going to wash up anyway; it's presumptuous for me to think it has to come from me.



Very, very true! I told her I would reach out to my Tuggers and see how to make what she has work.


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## JudyS (Mar 5, 2013)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> You can't save people from themselves, and I've also realized it's not worth the effort to rescue people.
> 
> One time I rented a week at Bali Hai Villas in Princeville to a family member....
> Telling somebody they made a mistake is tricky. Because it's hard to say that without also sending a hidden message that says there were stupid.  And people don't want to hear that.  What they want to hear from you is affirmation that they made a good deal.  I've realized that the best thing to do is to ignore all discussion about what they paid and instead get them excited about what the new opportunities they have.  Reality is going to wash up anyway; it's presumptuous for me to think it has to come from me.


Very good points here, Steve.

If I were in this situation, I might send a follow-up email after each conversation summarizing my advice. Something brief, like "Glad we talked today. I just wanted to say again that you should RESCIND your timeshare purchase TODAY. Follow the instructions in your sales packet, send it express mail with a receipt request, and give me a call if you have any questions." This wouldn't necessarily save the person from themselves" but it might prevent them from coming back and saying, "Why didn't you warn me?"


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## JudyS (Mar 5, 2013)

Marcia3641 said:


> ...I've told her NOT to fall for the sales tactic and if she really wants to own she should buy retail. ...



Did you mean to say, if she really wants to own she should buy *resale*?


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## Marcia3641 (Mar 5, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> Breakers of Ft Lauderdale is the FT LAUDERDALE BEACH RESORT of 909 Breakers Ave, Ft Lauderdale. Many Tuggers own at this resort.
> 
> That is a very low RCI Point value ... the underlying deed must be a small 1bdr in the off-off season. Is there a MF amount mentioned anywheres on the paperwork? 22K in one year will not get her a STUDIO in PRIME season. 2 years worth of points would get her a small 1bdr (38500) or a STUDIO (25,500) if she uses parts of two years of points.



OK... she just gave me her packet so I could look through. It says unit week 40, unit 1707 BUT I just noticed it says 'first available occupancy date 2014' What does that mean?

And I also noticed on a different page the MF say $734.55 (642.84 + 91.97, taxes)


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 5, 2013)

Okay -- that is an early October week. 17th floor, intercoastal view, 1bdr with 1.5 bathroom. In PRIME season that is worth 43,500 RCI points with *the 2013 MFs of $751.78*. Still those MFs for her unit are too low (not right).

2014 is the 1st year she has points or usage of her HOME WEEK. She can still borrow NOW her 2014 points.

While the FLBR is all red weeks, the RED weeks have both different RCI Points values and TPU values.

Will go look up her RCI Points values for week 40:
Studio 2/2 12,500
1bdr 6/2 19,500
1bdr 6/4 (large side of L/O) 21,500
1bdr 6/4 (1bdr with 1.5 baths) 22,000
2/2 L/O 33,000


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## JudyS (Mar 6, 2013)

Vacationhopeful, maybe taxes are higher in prime season than in offseason? That would explain why her MFs are $734.55  instead of $751.78.



Marcia3641 said:


> OK... she just gave me her packet so I could look through. It says unit week 40, unit 1707 BUT I just noticed it says 'first available occupancy date 2014' What does that mean?
> 
> And I also noticed on a different page the MF say $734.55 (642.84 + 91.97, taxes)


Hoo boy! Week 40 is a terrible week. School is in session, too early for "snowbirds" to come down for the winter, and a possibility of hurricanes to top it all off. 

She is stuck with a really bad week. At least she won't owe MFs until 2014, since her usage doesn't start until then. But she's going to have a hard time getting rid of this week.


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## JudyS (Mar 6, 2013)

Marcia3641 said:


> Honestly, I think she thought I was shafting her on the rentals that she has done with me over the last couple of years....


Why is it that people will pay $100 a night (plus tax) to stay in one room at a dumpy hotel, but when you charge $700 a week to stay in a one-bedroom suite at a nice resort, they think you are ripping them off? I can't count the number of times potential renters have tried to bargain me down when I was charging less than $100 a night in the first place. Don't they realize it costs money to clean the suite, replace the furniture, run the pool, etc? 

Well, it sounds like your friend is learning the hard way how much MFs cost.


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 6, 2013)

JudyS said:


> Vacationhopeful, maybe taxes are higher in prime season than in offseason? That would explain why her MFs are $734.55  instead of $751.78.
> 
> ....



Fixed Weeks have the exact SAME MFs as the other units of the same size at this resort.

FLBR has 2 different size 1bdrs units (1bath and 1.5 bath units) and the 2/2s MFs are based on either Ocean side of building or Intercoastal view. And NOT on floor number.


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 6, 2013)

Marcia3641 said:


> Very, very true! I told her I would reach out to my Tuggers and see how to make what she has work.



She has a great HOME RESORT for her RCI Points. And the end of October is the LARGE Ft Lauderdale (in water) Boat Show week. Her points will get her a great week for a $40 Home Resort trade.

Yes, it might take most of 2 years worth of points to get a PRIME winter week in a 1/1 for $40 exchange fee, but she will get herself a week. 

If she added a FLBR 66K RCI Pts week brought on the resale market, that would get her 2 weeks every year in a 1 bdr 1.5 bath unit for $850.39 each week (including her 2 MFs and 2 $40 RCI points exchange fees). UNits RENT for MORE than that.

As for SNOWBIRD weeks, the SUMMER season is as busy with families who want a ocean vacation week. I have been there MOST summers and many times with my nephews. My nephews LOVE the FLBR (and they have gone every summer to Ocean City, MD beachfront). Their mom was very surprised by her vacation with ALL 3 of her boys and myself one summer (the immediate week after the Ocean City week. Drove home late Friday night from OC,MD and caught the plane down to FLL on Saturday afternoon). Her words were "No way am I doing back-to-back beach weeks with the boys!!!!" before the trip. At the end of the FLBR week, she admitted it was great time - nothing like OC, MD. Day trip to the upper keys; all day Everglades trip; pool & beach times; historical house & museum next door; fishing trip; Water Taxi day. Just no miniature golf or video machines or boardwalks -- not my sister's favorite venues. Us adults had our late afternoon/early evenings wine on the balcony, too.

This resort is in a BEACHY neighborhood -2 pizza places, 2 Mexican, Thai, Subway, coffee shops, homemade ice cream & popcorn, plus 4+ bars. There are several tee shirt shoppes with nicknack trinkets.


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## PearlCity (Mar 6, 2013)

JudyS said:


> Vacationhopeful, maybe taxes are higher in prime season than in offseason? That would explain why her MFs are $734.55  instead of $751.78.
> 
> Hoo boy! Week 40 is a terrible week. School is in session, too early for "snowbirds" to come down for the winter, and a possibility of hurricanes to top it all off.
> 
> She is stuck with a really bad week. At least she won't owe MFs until 2014, since her usage doesn't start until then. But she's going to have a hard time getting rid of this week.



Actually week 40 isn't that bad. Many school system have fall breaks which land around that time. Not all schools but I know a bunch on the west coast and in Hawaii that is a break the kids get.


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## Ron98GT (Mar 6, 2013)

JudyS said:


> This isn't necessarily a trial membership. All RCI Points contracts are for three years; then they have to be renewed. Some resorts charge a fee for this renewal (mine charge $89), and apparently some don't.
> 
> 22,000 points is very little. A two-bedroom in red season is generally 50,000 points and up. You friend can get discounted weeks around 45 - 30 days before check-in. She can save points for one year for no fee. She can also borrow from the next year's points.
> 
> ...


This is the first time I've heard this one.   Could you elaborate? 

Three Year Contract? 

I own a RCI Points TS and have a RCI Points membership.  I never had to sign a 3-year contract. :whoopie:


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## Marcia3641 (Mar 8, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> Okay -- that is an early October week. 17th floor, intercoastal view, 1bdr with 1.5 bathroom. In PRIME season that is worth 43,500 RCI points with *the 2013 MFs of $751.78*. Still those MFs for her unit are too low (not right).
> 
> 2014 is the 1st year she has points or usage of her HOME WEEK. She can still borrow NOW her 2014 points.
> 
> ...



Question.... if her usage doesn't start until 2014 does that mean she can't go anywhere this year with her 22K points? Also, I'm confused.... does she have a week at her resort AND 22K RCI points? Her loan won't be paid off until 2020  I think (I left the paperwork at my office) so does that mean next year she will continue to pay her loan at $75 a month PLUS she would have to pay her MF for the year of $735 too?


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## Marcia3641 (Mar 8, 2013)

Ron98GT said:


> This is the first time I've heard this one.   Could you elaborate?
> 
> Three Year Contract?
> 
> I own a RCI Points TS and have a RCI Points membership.  I never had to sign a 3-year contract. :whoopie:



I did read in her contract (fine print) that she would need to renew her membership at the three-year mark, I think it was $90 or something like that. I'm wondering if this is something new?


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## Marcia3641 (Mar 8, 2013)

jc92869 said:


> There are "instant exchanges". these happen  within 30 days of check in date. the points rage for these are 7,500  - 9,000. the selection is not the greatest, but one can find some gems in there every once in a while.  Although  it is not a good deal, what she got is not necessarily the worst deal she could have gotten. If she plays her cards right  she can  get two to  three weeks vacations per year  with her points.



Where are these instant exchanges located on the website?


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 8, 2013)

Marcia3641 said:


> Question.... if her usage doesn't start until 2014 does that mean she can't go anywhere this year with her 22K points? Also, I'm confused.... does she have a week at her resort AND 22K RCI points? Her loan won't be paid off until 2020  I think (I left the paperwork at my office) so does that mean next year she will continue to pay her loan at $75 a month PLUS she would have to pay her MF for the year of $735 too?



Her MFs are $752 a year. 

She can book a vacation *NOW* for 2014 -- *I just book a HOME RESORT week for March 8-15, 2014 at FLBR for $40 today*. She can get a STUDIO unit for 25.5PTs or a 1bdr for 38K or 40.5K (all the 43.5K units where gone) -- if she borrows from her 2015 points.

Yes, she pays the $75 monthly loan AND her $752 MFs for 2014 by Dec 1 2013 for 2014 usage.

Plus, she has to pay $89 RCI Points fee every 3 years. Plus her RCI points membership fee which has a "free" RCI Weeks account.


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## Marcia3641 (Mar 8, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> Her MFs are $752 a year.
> 
> She can book a vacation *NOW* for 2014 -- *I just book a HOME RESORT week for March 8-15, 2014 at FLBR for $40 today*. She can get a STUDIO unit for 25.5PTs or a 1bdr for 38K or 40.5K (all the 43.5K units where gone) -- if she borrows from her 2015 points.
> 
> ...



Oh boy, I am pretty sure she didn't understand the part about having to pay the MF before end of this year for 2014 usage. I've only ever bought resale so I wasn't sure about the monthly loan piece. I am assuming her paperwork has an error regarding the MF amount, I will instruct her to call and confirm. So it pretty much sounds like she won't be able to go anywhere this year because in order to be able to go somewhere decent in 2014 she will need both years worth of points, is that fair to say?


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## JudyS (Mar 8, 2013)

If Week 40 isn't a low-value week in Florida, then I'd be interested in knowing which weeks *are* low value there. Spring, summer, winter -- just about anything will be better than fall. (Granted, I'm not familiar with Boat Week. Unless it's something really big, though, like Sundance, I think fall would still be low season.) 



vacationhopeful said:


> She has a great HOME RESORT for her RCI Points. ...


Oh, good point! I'm always talking about the value of RCI Home Resort & Home Group booking windows, yet I forgot about it in this case. Marcia, if your friend bought because she wants to stay at this particular resort, then things aren't so bad. She can get cheap RCI Points in various ways, and then use them to book a stay at this resort, in a better season and/or larger unit, with just a $40 exchange fee. 

If she bought this week to trade to other places, though, then it was a really bad purchase.



Ron98GT said:


> This is the first time I've heard this one.   Could you elaborate?
> 
> Three Year Contract?
> 
> I own a RCI Points TS and have a RCI Points membership.  I never had to sign a 3-year contract. :whoopie:


When you sign an RCI Points Participation Agreement, you are giving RCI Points use of your week for the next three years. (You can still reserve the week for your own use, without an exchange fee, if you do it during the Home Week booking period.) It's in Section F of the Participation Agreement. At the end of the three years, you have to tell RCI if you want to give your week to them for another three years. You don't pay another conversion fee, but at least some resorts do charge a fee when you sign-up again. VRI, which manages the resort where Marcia's friend bought, charges $89.


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## Marcia3641 (Mar 8, 2013)

JudyS said:


> Oh, good point! I'm always talking about the value of RCI Home Resort & Home Group booking windows, yet I forgot about it in this case. Marcia, if your friend bought because she wants to stay at this particular resort, then things aren't so bad. She can get cheap RCI Points in various ways, and then use them to book a stay at this resort, in a better season and/or larger unit, with just a $40 exchange fee.
> 
> If she bought this week to trade to other places, though, then it was a really bad purchase.



She bought thinking she would get to vacation several weeks a year, anywhere she wanted because there is soooo much availability :hysterical: as this is what she keeps telling me they told her in the sales presentation. I've given up telling her they lied and will just show her what she really has and how often she can travel with what she has. I feel bad for her and I'm trying to help her use what she has now. What's even worse is that she works in the accounting department and they CANNOT just take time off as easy as others because of month end, quarter end, year end, etc, etc, etc. so the 45 day deals aren't even going to be an option for her.


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## Ron98GT (Mar 11, 2013)

Marcia3641 said:


> I did read in her contract (fine print) that she would need to renew her membership at the three-year mark, I think it was $90 or something like that. I'm wondering if this is something new?


More like unique. I never heard of such a thing and nobody else has responded say that they have, so it is unique that they have to renew every 3-years, rather than when the want.


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 11, 2013)

Ron98GT said:


> More like unique. I never heard of such a thing and nobody else has responded say that they have, so it is unique that they have to renew every 3-years, rather than when the want.



Normal at the FLBR --- I have several points weeks there.


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## carl2591 (Mar 11, 2013)

T_R_Oglodyte said:


> You can't save people from themselves, and I've also realized it's not worth the effort to rescue people.
> 
> One time I rented a week at Bali Hai Villas in Princeville to a family member.  Before she left I talked with her about the sales presentation, what to expect, and why they shouldn't do it.  Sure enough, one day while they are there I get a call from her asking for advice.  They had signed up for the sales pitch and bought a Wyndham contract.  I reiterated everything I said before, and showed her ten current resales for contracts larger than hers that were being listed at 1% to 3% of what she was paying. Beyond that I had significant questions about whether she should even be timesharing in the first place because of their lifestyle and interests. But she was all gaga about the developer bonuses. After about fifteen minutes it suddenly dawned on me that she had no interest in killing the deal; she had simply been hoping that I would tell her what a good deal this was.  But I wasn't going to give her that.
> 
> ...





I hear you .. stupid is as stupid does..  sometime you have to call a stupid person STUPID..   like the old saying if the shoe fits..  

just today they were talking on the radio about a person in Winston Salem that lost 200K to Jamaica'n  scammer's.. they were able to get some 40K back but she is still loosing some 160K and was all distraught about this.. 

I have to sit an laugh at the stupidity that is rampant in our society..  People think they win money with out ever entering something.. 

some with timeshare... you tell people what not to do and dam if they don't got do just  that and then several months later want you to help get them out of the mess THEY created..  

I just have to start telling them it called a STUPID TAX.. pay up and maybe learn if not PAY again.. and again ..  

I try to teach my kid how not to be stupid or gullible or both.. The world is a crazy place with scams around every corner and you have to be on watch.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Mar 11, 2013)

carl2591 said:


> I hear you .. stupid is as stupid does..  sometime you have to call a stupid person STUPID..   like the old saying if the shoe fits..
> 
> just today they were talking on the radio about a person in Winston Salem that lost 200K to Jamaica'n  scammer's.. they were able to get some 40K back but she is still loosing some 160K and was all distraught about this..
> 
> ...



Prior to all of that I tried to dissuade her (not sure if I was successful) from following through on an offer they had accepted to sell a pretty fancy Gold Wing motorcycle they owned.  The buyer purported himself to be a GI who was stationed overseas but would be needing transportation after their tour ended in a couple of months.  

The buyer had a buddy who was going to pick up the motorcycle, and he had sent to the buddy a cashiers check made out in my sister's name for the amount of the motorcycle, plus a thousand dollars extra to compensate the buddy for his time and effort in managing the sale.  The buddy would drop off the cashiers check, pick up the executed title transfer documents and bike, and my sister would give the buddy a check for his $1000.  

I explained to her what was going on, and she said not to worry.  She already thought of that had found out the bank would release the funds from the cashiers check in five days, and that she would post-date the check she gave to the buddy by five days. I explained to her how it was all set up for her check to clear before the international cashiers was returned, but it was clear she didn't want to her.  She kept insisting that once the bank releases the funds she would have the money.  I finally did get her to "agree" to call the bank to talk about what happens with an international cashier's check, but I doubt that she ever did.

Last time I looked they didn't have the Gold Wing any longer.  I didn't ask about how they eventually got rid of it.


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## Chilcotin (Mar 11, 2013)

To find the low point vacations sign into RCI Points and search for an exchange vacation.
On the left side drop down menu click on cheap inventory and then click on 0 - 10000 points.


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## Marcia3641 (Mar 12, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> Her MFs are $752 a year.
> 
> She can book a vacation *NOW* for 2014 -- *I just book a HOME RESORT week for March 8-15, 2014 at FLBR for $40 today*. She can get a STUDIO unit for 25.5PTs or a 1bdr for 38K or 40.5K (all the 43.5K units where gone) -- if she borrows from her 2015 points.



OK, I want to confirm that I have this correct. Once her 2014 MF are paid she can book a week at her home resort, but since she only has 22K points she will need to borrow from 2014, correct? Also, let's say she doesn't want to book at her home resort, does that mean she can start using her 22K point in 2013? Or does she have to wait unti 2014? If yes, it looks like her best bet is finding a gem in the instant exchange section as 22K points won't get her much not to mention the 30-day window will be difficult for her.


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## JudyS (Mar 12, 2013)

Ron98GT said:


> More like unique. I never heard of such a thing and nobody else has responded say that they have, so it is unique that they have to renew every 3-years, rather than when the want.


*I* responded and said I had the same fee, and *vacationhopeful* responded about it, too.

The $89 charge for 3-year renewal of RCI Points is standard with VRI-managed resorts. I own at three different VRI-managed resorts, none of the the same resort as mentioned in this thread, and they all charge the $89 fee every three years. 

I don't know if other resorts charge a fee years, but the three year renewal period for RCI Points is standard. As I said, it's in Section F of the RCI Points Participation Agreement. Go read your RCI Points Participation Agreement if you don't believe me.


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 13, 2013)

Marcia3641 said:


> Oh boy, I am pretty sure she didn't understand the part about having to pay the MF before end of this year for 2014 usage. ...... So it pretty much sounds like she won't be able to go anywhere this year because in order to be able to go somewhere decent in 2014 she will need both years worth of points, is that fair to say?



No, I did NOT pay 2014 maintenance fees to use points this year.


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## Ron98GT (Mar 13, 2013)

JudyS said:


> *I* responded and said I had the same fee, and *vacationhopeful* responded about it, too.
> 
> The $89 charge for 3-year renewal of RCI Points is standard with VRI-managed resorts. I own at three different VRI-managed resorts, none of the the same resort as mentioned in this thread, and they all charge the $89 fee every three years.
> 
> I don't know if other resorts charge a fee years, but the three year renewal period for RCI Points is standard. As I said, it's in Section F of the RCI Points Participation Agreement. *Go read your RCI Points Participation Agreement* if you don't believe me.



*First*, if you quote & reference a source, you should post a link to it.  I don't know what is in the RCI Points agreement that you signed for VRI?


*Second*, don't assume that the agreement that you signed for VRI? is the same agreement that everyone else signed, outside of VRI.


*Third*, I don't have a clue what a VRI-managed resort is? I never heard of VRI.  I don't know what country VRI is in.  I don't know if VRI has anything to do with Wyndham or RCI?


*Fourth*, if you are paying $89 for 3 years, as you have stated twice in your post, your getting a very-very good deal, since I and other RCI members are paying 3X what you are paying.

http://pgs.rci.com/landing/ptr/fees/indexUS.html

http://www.rci.com/docs/KnowledgeBase/Documents/en_US/points_fees.pdf



*Fifth*, Some "RCI Points Agreements: (pick-one & read Section F):

http://www.rci.com/CDA/Common/Documents/TermsandConditionsofRCIPoints.pdf

http://www.rci.com/docs/KnowledgeBase/FAQS/NorthAmerica/en_US/PointsAgreement_02062008.pdf

http://b2b.rci.com/CDA/Common/Documents/RCI_Points_Network_Membership_Web_en_AU.pdf

http://www.rci.com/CDA/Common/Documents/DisclosureGuidePoints.pdf

There are more out there.  But I haven't seen one with a Section F, or any Section, that states a 3-year RCI Points member ship fee must be paid.  RCI charges me every year and they have since I purchased the TS.  The only exception is when I'm trying to make an exchange in a future year that I have yet to pay a RCI Points/Membership fee (ie, I'm paid thru 2013, so if I want to make an exchange in 2014 I will have to pay my 2014 RCI Points membership fee). 


*Lastly*,  don't be so quick to be sarcastic when someone asks a question.


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## tschwa2 (Mar 13, 2013)

VRI is a large timeshare management company.  They don't build resorts so they aren't a developer.  This is a list from their website.  Most of the resorts are independent but there seems to be a few DRI and other developer resorts managed by VRI.  They are quite large and exert a fair amount of pressure on the HOA boards for whom they work for.




> *Alabama*
> Shoreline Towers
> 
> *Arizona*
> ...



The $89 RCI points fee that they charge every 3 years is in addition to the annual RCI points membership that each member must maintain in order to keep the unit in the points program


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## JudyS (Mar 13, 2013)

Ron98GT said:


> *First*, if you quote & reference a source, you should post a link to it.  I don't know what is in the RCI Points agreement that you signed for VRI?


I searched for the RCI Points Participation Agreement and couldn't find a link to it online -- the copy I have is from a recent RCI Points conversion I did, and it was emailed to me. 

However, the the RCI Points Participation Agreement turns out to be one of the links you posted below:
http://www.rci.com/docs/KnowledgeBase/FAQS/NorthAmerica/en_US/PointsAgreement_02062008.pdf

The form I just filled out had the 3 year statement in section F, but the online form has it in section D: 
I understand that the term of this Agreement is for three (3) years unless I have an existing RCI Points Membership, in which case this Agreement assumes the term of my existing RCI Points Membership.




Ron98GT said:


> *Second*, don't assume that the agreement that you signed for VRI? is the same agreement that everyone else signed, outside of VRI.


I didn't actually assume this. I looked carefully over the form and couldn't find anything indicating it was specific to VRI. 



Ron98GT said:


> *Third*, I don't have a clue what a VRI-managed resort is? I never heard of VRI.  I don't know what country VRI is in.  I don't know if VRI has anything to do with Wyndham or RCI?


Tschwa2 did a good job of answering this. I will just add that VRI is the management company for the resort being discussed in this thread.




Ron98GT said:


> *Fourth*, if you are paying $89 for 3 years, as you have stated twice in your post, your getting a very-very good deal, since I and other RCI members are paying 3X what you are paying.


Tschwa2 did a good job of answering this, too -- the $89 fee every three years is in addition to the $124 annual RCI Points dues, not instead of it. 




Ron98GT said:


> *Fifth*, Some "RCI Points Agreements: (pick-one & read Section F):
> 
> http://www.rci.com/CDA/Common/Documents/TermsandConditionsofRCIPoints.pdf
> 
> ...



The fee is mentioned in at least two of the forms you linked to. It's on page 18 on the first link (the Terms and Conditions) and on page 21 of the 4th link (the Disclosure Guide.) Both say the same thing: 
The Network Administrator will provide the Member with at least seven (7) days prior written or electronic notice of upcoming renewal , and unless directed otherwise, then renews membership for an additional term equal to three (3) years, so long as the Member is otherwise eligible for membership. Payment of the Network Dues constitutes acceptance of a new membership term equal to three (3) years. Failure to pay membership for a renewal term may result in termination of membership …

The mention of "Network Dues" implies that resorts in general charge a fee for renewing every three years, not just VRI resorts. But, it doesn't say whether the fee is the same at all resorts.



Ron98GT said:


> *Lastly*,  don't be so quick to be sarcastic when someone asks a question.


I didn't see a question in your post, just a statement that no one other than Marcia had ever mentioned the three year renewal term. And I wasn't trying to be sarcastic -- I was just frustrated because vacationhopeful and I had in fact also mentioned the three year term in this thread. 

In fact, people on TUG ask about the three-year renewal term fairly regularly, usually when asking if they can cancel RCI Points before the three years is up.


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 13, 2013)

I really like the FLBR for several reasons. 

Location.
Staff.
Other owners.
Other guests (many who repeatedly come back if they can get in).
Size of the units - which are very clean.
Views.

The ability to get 11 month booking advantage at other VRI resorts can be handy - but I have been having too much fun at my Home Resort.

And NO. My avatar is from an oceanfront unit at Wyndham Royal Vista in Pompano Beach - there are only 12 of them and 4 are below dune level and 1 is always held back for the sales office to use as a model. I have gotten the unit twice.


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## timeos2 (Mar 13, 2013)

JudyS said:


> If Week 40 isn't a low-value week in Florida, then I'd be interested in knowing which weeks *are* low value there. Spring, summer, winter -- just about anything will be better than fall. (Granted, I'm not familiar with Boat Week. Unless it's something really big, though, like Sundance, I think fall would still be low season.) .



Week 40 (or virtually any week between early September & mid-October) is an extremely slow time for Florida. Renters / Traders do not / would not know about some obscure / limited interest "boat show" and as you say most schools are session along with a very real threat of hurricanes. 

It is one of three to four times of year when even the all "red" Florida has a well known demand lull. Perhaps no where near as dramatic as a more seasonal area suffers or as long but a down period of demand none the less. I wouldn't own a fixed week in those times.


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## Jennie (Mar 15, 2013)

Linda (vacation hopeful)

Is it possible that this lady might have bought her week during that short time period when FLBR had the arrangement with a local company to sell 3 years use of a week, with no obligation to continue ownership after the 3 years ended?  

As I recall, the "program" was discontinued because a disgruntled Board member (I won't mention his name here) alleged that another Board member was selling these weeks for personal gain and not placing the monies into the resort's coffers? 

If it was purchased under that program, Marcia's friend would be able to discontinue her ownership at the end of the 3 years. If she cannot get out of long-term ownership, she has the option to remove her week from the RCI Points program and let it revert to being a fined-deeded week. And then register it as a fixed week in the RCI *Weeks* program, the rules of which would be much easier for her learn and navigate. Or she can join I.I. or one of the other exchange companies, and seek desired exchanges through them.   

If Marcia wishes to contacts you or me via PM or email, and provide her friend's name, we can call Ramona (the wonderful Front Desk Manager) and clarify exactly what her friend has purchased. If she has a "get out of jail" card option, it would be best for her to get rid of the week and then take her time obtaining more info to determine if timeshare ownership makes sense for her, and if so, what resort or group would yield the best results.


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## vacationhopeful (Mar 15, 2013)

Jennie -
She brought AFTER that issue was resolved (resolved last Spring, 2012) as her purchase was in August, 2012. 

As a non-owner, she would not have been on the mailing list of "leasing" a week for 3 years by paying the MFs each year ($250 option payment required) and then buying it for $2500. Those were units which were abandoned and offered via a Dec 2011 newsletter.

And there is a lady who regularly SHOWS units to sell to persons - I have run into her regularly; (at my last stay in early Feb) where I opened the door to my unit and found her inside and showing it to a couple who had agreed to buy a unit from her. I was very nice to these new owners - but she was not working from the rooftop as I have seen her come and go (with clients) from the front door. I am sure I had seen her during the "freeze" of the HOA selling timeframe. 

Remember, there is someone with a modest sign in the laundrymat or cornor store "reselling" timeshare weeks - sign has been there for years and years.


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## Jennie (Mar 20, 2013)

Thanks Linda for the clarification. It appears that this poor gal purchased from a resale seller not affiliated with our resort. Too bad she didn't find her way to TUG in time to rescind. 

I'm thinking that all those extra weeks she expected to have access to as a result of the FLBR purchase are the "Last Call" weeks in the RCI inventory.


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## Jennie (Mar 20, 2013)

vacationhopeful said:


> I really like the FLBR for several reasons.
> 
> Location.
> Staff.
> ...



Me too! Plus it is one block from the world famous Ft. Lauderdale beach (in a less crowded section), and two blocks from the water taxi that takes you from Miami to Palm Beach (many stops) on a reasonably priced all day pass. And it's within walking distance of the Galleria Mall, Publix Supermarket, CVS drug store, and a ton of great restaurants. It is one of the few timeshare resorts where one could get by fine without renting a car. 

Over 15 years I exchanged into almost every timeshare in Ft. Lauderdale, Hollywood, Pompano Beach, Delray Beach, Weston, Bonaventure, and Palm Beach. I liked FLBR so much that I purchased 6 weeks there to use as our "winter home". No regrets.


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