# New Properties



## texdoc (Dec 27, 2007)

I'm starting to wonder a little what's going on with HCC and the new properties.  I thought we heard in late summer that NC Outer Banks and Costa Rica were finished and just being furnished.  Then I remember reading that they should be available in November.  It's now almost January and we still haven't heard any official release dates for those two properties.  And...now we have over 300 members.  Shouldn't we be hearing about new properties that they are acquiring (or at least reviewing)?  

The one thing I fear is TOO MUCH competition for the properties that we have.  Signed on today at midnight EST and tried to book a property for the New Years week next year.  Fortunately I was able to get a reservation but I noticed that ALL of the ski weeks, the New York week, and many of the Mexican beach locations were snatched up within a couple of minutes.  Thank goodness I was on the computer at the right time!  We need to keep that ratio of members to properties so that we have ample opportunities to get a reservation.


----------



## vivalour (Dec 27, 2007)

*competition at peak vacation times*



texdoc said:


> The one thing I fear is TOO MUCH competition for the properties that we have.  Signed on today at midnight EST and tried to book a property for the New Years week next year.  Fortunately I was able to get a reservation but I noticed that ALL of the ski weeks, the New York week, and many of the Mexican beach locations were snatched up within a couple of minutes.  Thank goodness I was on the computer at the right time!  We need to keep that ratio of members to properties so that we have ample opportunities to get a reservation.



Maybe this could be the subject of new thread -- competition for the most "highly valued" properties at peak vacation times. I suspect this will be an ongoing an issue for HCC, as well as other DCs, and some timeshares (although I'm not personally familiar with the TS world). It could be the thing that turns people off of buying in.


----------



## Bourne (Dec 27, 2007)

So who booked the PVR week for New Years. 

What's next. A internal trading system between TUG/DC4MS HCC members.


----------



## jasfan (Dec 27, 2007)

I am in the process of finalizing my membership, yet this is has been my greatest concern.  I can't get the numbers to work for availability, and with the reservation system set as it is, NY is being booked many weekends, leaving the weeks open.  Weekend destinations will further stress the system with the reservation system.  I like HCC and the people, yet I hope they are properly managing growth...


----------



## DosMasCervesos (Dec 27, 2007)

texdoc said:


> And...now we have over 300 members.  Shouldn't we be hearing about new properties that they are acquiring (or at least reviewing)?


Over on on this thread I did a rough calculation of the ratio based on 32 available properties. Note that the property ratio is based on "full equivalent" members, of which I approximate to be 242.

I do share your concern about property availability though, especially now with the new less-than-7-day reservation rules.

Has anyone talked to HCC about what the holdup is on the new properties (Outer Banks, Costa Rica, Lake Tahoe)? Based on an October Helium article, Costa Rica was supposed to be ready in November, and even the Lake Tahoe property was supposed to be ready before the year's end. I'm sure they'll be available soon, but it would be nice to have a status update.

Matt


----------



## Tedpilot (Dec 27, 2007)

As of two weeks ago OBX is scheduled to be avail end of 1st qtr 08'.  Apparently many delays w/ construction but they are pre-positioning the furniture and such to get it up and running ASAP.  I don't know much about the other two.

Many people probably realize this, and we confirmed w/ HCC staff, but New Years is the MOST popular holiday.  Slow business, kids out of school, and not tied up with family over Xmas.  Colorado properties booked in 2-3 minutes...nature of the beast.  If we all think we get any location on any holiday at our whim we ought to think twice.  

Xmas...still lots of availability.  If you can get away any other week in Dec/Jan there are many great places still opened...I just booked BC Vil Hall in Dec.  

Ted


----------



## mjs (Dec 27, 2007)

At one point-- did the Affiliate membership come with a 12 month holiday reservation?   I know now it is sold with a 6 month holiday.

I also think the more tuggers that join, being more knowledgable, and willing to book EXACTLY 12 months out, the harder that it will be to get prime time reservations.

mark


----------



## vivalour (Dec 28, 2007)

DosMasCervesos said:


> Over on on this thread
> Has anyone talked to HCC about what the holdup is on the new properties (Outer Banks, Costa Rica, Lake Tahoe)? Based on an October Helium article, Costa Rica was supposed to be ready in November, and even the Lake Tahoe property was supposed to be ready before the year's end. I'm sure they'll be available soon, but it would be nice to have a status update.
> 
> Matt



Although it is moving ahead, Costa Rica has been delayed because of issues connected with property transfer from the previous owner, according to HCC. 

It would help to have regular member newsletters or emails to clear up these mysteries -- and make good p.r. in general.   

As a member, I would also like to know the strategy behind adding specific properties, other than "this is what members want". If that were the case, for instance, would HCC consider adding multiple units at the most popular locations as the membership grows? Do they have a plan to sell certain unpopular properties after a set period? Is the strategy not to buy or lease more than one property per location -- even if wildly popular?  

I imagine there are many factors coming into play, including markets, avail. investment funds, and an eye on the potential increase in property values -- to keep HCC investors happy. Anyone have a handle on this??


----------



## pwrshift (Dec 28, 2007)

There is a run on the most popular weeks with Marriott TS too, except by those that have 'fixed' week systems.  Fortunately many owners don't know how to work the 'floating week' system properly, but enough of them do that the weeks you want are often gone a couple of minutes after 9 a.m. on booking day...9.03 will be too late if you want Williamsburg Manor Club for July 4th, even though there are about 288 suites!  I've never missed getting that week knowing how to play the system.  With HCC the week will be gone right at the opening bell as there's only one!

In addition to increasing sales, Marriott eased the situation for multiple week owners by allowing them to book 50% of the capacity 13 months ahead...and I've never missed booking four weeks in a row (splitting two 2-bdrm suites into four parts called locking off) from Pres Day week to mid March at Marriott BeachPlace Ft. Laud.  The 1 week owners have a more difficult time as those who missed out on the 13 month window can also try at the 12 month day for the remaining 50%.  Marriott owners can also book 2 weeks in a row 13 months ahead at different resorts if they own at both.

The TS situation is probably worse than for DC's due to the number of owners competing for the same week, but because there are more units available it might now be easier than for HCC members as there is only one availability for each location for the primary week.  

For instance, a 200 suite TS has about 10,000 owners (and some locations are prime all year - like Hawaii).  Owners get on the phone EXACTLY at 9 a.m. 12 months (or 13 months if they own and book at least 2 weeks in a row at that resort) BUT when the 200 suites are gone with Marriott's 100+ booking agents, they're gone in minutes.  This is a constant disadvantage for 'floating' weeks and probably the reason Marriott started offering 'fixed' weeks at higher prices of course.  The owners who do miss out might find them on the exchange company offerings at Interval International easier than booking direct and usually get a bonus week for what they do deposit.

*The HCC location expansion is something I definitely see as a potential problem.*  Even with only 400 members potentially competing for the same New Year's week, the first one gets it as there are no more ... so potentially 399 upset members - thus 'use' restrictions come into play...Bill might not be able to book NYC next year at all.  As I've mentioned in another thread, there's also very little to choose from on the east coast if someone wants to drive there and this must be addressed by HCC as there are twice as many potential members east of the Mississippi than west...thus more competition for a VERY limited selection.  

Although I've never used it with Marriott vacation resort locations and not business locales, some of their resorts have a 3 & 4 night option for your 7 night entitlement.  The HCC idea of 3 & 4 night stays appeals to me for business use in NYC (and Chicago, Boston, Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver, LA, if added one day) as I usually stay at the NYC Marriott Renaissance or the Marquis ... so I'd fill in the empty spaces for those who booked the weekends.  But that short a stay might be useless for vacationers unless you might be on the move with short stays touring a country like Italy - Rome, Amalfi, Florence, Venice, Milan, etc.   Being stuck in Tuscany HCC for 1-2 weeks isn't of interest to me.

For vacationers the limit on booking multiple weeks in a row is a negative for DC's too.  The DC market is pretty new, growing fast, and there will be lots of pains ahead if unit growth doesn't grow with member growth.

Brian



vivalour said:


> ...I suspect this will be an ongoing an issue for HCC, as well as other DCs, and some timeshares (although I'm not personally familiar with the TS world). It could be the thing that turns people off of buying in.


----------



## Steamboat Bill (Dec 28, 2007)

The most popular weeks are Christmas and New Year Week and HCC should probably charge a premium for those weeks, just like Exclusive resorts does. 

We can't expect to join HCC (or any other DC) for cheap and expect to stay at $1-3m properties every New Year week. Currently HCC has a rotating holiday policy (same holiday once every three years).


----------



## oldkey (Dec 28, 2007)

*I am a happy HCC customer....*

.....but agree that there are two few properties. The pace has not been what I would have expected with the growth. During conversations over the summer before I purchased, specific locations were discussed as being here before the end of the year - but nothing. There should be a big push early in 2008.....I hope. Certainly the membership has grown considerably.


----------



## texdoc (Dec 28, 2007)

Oldkey,

I agree with you completely and that was the reason i submitted this post.  I've been extremely happy with HCC so far but I agree that they have failed to keep up with the increasing membership.  I know that none of us want them to go out and randomly buy properties just to maintain the member to property ratio but, like you said, there has been almost no movement in the past 5-6 months despite the addition of many new members AND a rate increase!

I really think HCC should send out more frequent updates to it's members.  Explain the situation in Costa Rica to us.  Tell us why Outer Banks hasn't closed.  Update us on new properties in the works.  Bill...you seem to have an "in" with the management.  Maybe you could pass along our concerns and suggestions to them.

To be fair, I should qualify that this latest reservation (for next year's New Years Eve) was the first time I experienced any difficulty in scheduling a desired week since I started my membership.  I've been able to schedule some of the most difficult locations (Breckenridge Lodge, Beaver Creek, Punta Mita, etc.) when I desired without running into significant competition.  I guess the competition for next New Years should be expected when trying for a major holiday in a popular place.


----------



## Steamboat Bill (Dec 28, 2007)

texdoc said:


> Bill...you seem to have an "in" with the management.  Maybe you could pass along our concerns and suggestions to them.



I don't get any special treatment as I am a member just like you. I speak to Heath and others at HCC frequently, and I will pass this message to them. I also know that they closely monitor TUG posts, but do not want to post themselves.

Thus, if you create a new thread "My HCC wishes for 2008" and list a few of your wishes for improvement...then I guarantee that they will read it.

That is one cool thing about the Internet, posts can get people's attention...like what happened when Exclusive Resorts Un-invited me to their party....ouch!


----------



## Tedpilot (Dec 28, 2007)

Mark - I think you are correct about the Affiliate membership once being offered w/ a 12 month holiday reservation.  If I remember correctly, in the beginning all reservation plans had the 12 month holiday as part of the deal.

Ted


----------



## texdoc (Dec 28, 2007)

Sorry, Bill.  Didn't mean to imply that you receive any special treatment from HCC.  Just know from following the blog that you speak to Heath occasionally.  Thought that you could pass along a little information for us fellow members.


----------



## vivalour (Dec 28, 2007)

texdoc said:


> Oldkey,
> 
> I really think HCC should send out more frequent updates to it's members.  Explain the situation in Costa Rica to us.  Tell us why Outer Banks hasn't closed.  Update us on new properties in the works.  Bill...you seem to have an "in" with the management.  Maybe you could pass along our concerns and suggestions to them.



Totally agree on the updates -- in fact, I think the last "newsletter" on the web site for members is dated September -- new year, new info  -- I would hope! As a new member, I have no "in," and they have been totally receptive to reasonable suggestions and open to answering questions when I or dh have called. As well, we have managed to get great bookings.


----------



## vivalour (Dec 28, 2007)

Steamboat Bill said:


> The most popular weeks are Christmas and New Year Week and HCC should probably charge a premium for those weeks, just like Exclusive resorts does.



They already do, don't they, by restricting long-term holiday bookings to higher level, or "custom" premium rate memberships?


----------



## vivalour (Dec 28, 2007)

pwrshift said:


> There is a run on the most popular weeks with Marriott TS too, except by those that have 'fixed' week systems.



I guess it's all in the game, eh?  

HCC says it is committed to building up the East Coast portfolio while also marketing for new memberships. However, as you say, it won't be done overnight. Of course, the "high roller" DCs  have many more locations all over the map, but you are paying significantly more for the wider choice. In the fall, we checked out PE carefully before joining HCC and found major availability issues there for us -- even at the much higher membership cost.


----------



## Steamboat Bill (Dec 28, 2007)

Here is a link to Exclusive Resorts price list for their three membership categories.

http://www.exclusiveresorts.com/#Membership_Plans

The least expensive plan = $239,000 + $13,900 for 15 nights (No Holidays)
The middle plan = $349,000 + $22,900 for 25 nights (excludes Christmas and New Year weeks)
The top plan = $459,000 + $34,900 for 45 nights and that only includes one holiday (and this can include Christmas or New Year)

Thus, HCC is really underpricing their plans and really needs to put a premium price on Christmas and New year.


----------



## pwrshift (Dec 29, 2007)

From what I can remember about HCC discussions I had when considering joining, I believe they are close to announcing a Paris location, and maybe London.  Outer Banks was supposed to be real soon back in Sept, but it's not the best location at this time of year anyways.  They seem to feel one location in Hilton Head is sufficient, but with Marriott's 2000 (est) suites always filled all summer I don't agree.  Also think there was mention of South Beach.  I'm having a senior's moment so don't want to mislead anyone.  

There are some nice beachfront (all year use) condo-hotels in Fort Lauderdale that are fairly reasonably priced I think ... Bill would know for sure ... and if the St. Regis accepts DC's I suspect the others would too (like the Starwood Atlantic where I could have had a 1 bdrm preconstruction a few years back for $320k).

http://www.condohotels.com/listing-530.html

http://miami.backpage.com/realestate/classifieds/ViewAd?oid=oid:1740065&name=homes for sale


----------



## vivalour (Feb 27, 2008)

*Costa Rica property opening delays*

Tedpilot wrote in another forum: <<It does seem like forever. I thought in one of the newsletters HCC said the builder was having difficulties with the trasfer of title or something to that extent. I could be thinking of Tahoe too...>>

As mentioned earlier in this thread, the HCC Costa Rica property delayed opening  initially had to do with slow transfer  --caused by the unavailability of the previous owner, according to HCC. Could use an update, IMO.


----------

