# We're buying resale, but...



## mrodm (Jul 28, 2007)

My husband and I have batted about the idea of owning a timeshare for several years.  Now that we have a better idea of our vacation needs and wants (finally!), we're ready to buy resale in a location that we're sure to visit at least once every 4-5 years.

With 3 kids in school, we're considering a property in Orlando, 3 bed/2-3bath, red, floating.  Our goal is to buy something with the most exchange value as possible that we can afford.

Now, some questions:

1.  _Since we only intend to visit occasionally and exchange the rest of the time, are we better off buying into a points program? _   The resale prices of exchange-program properties are significantly lower that those of points-program properties, so I'd like to know the value is there.

2.  _Is it necessary to join an outside program (ie, RCI, II, etc.) to effectively use a TS?  Or can one still get good exchanges using the property's parent company (ie, Fairfield/Wyndham, Sunterra, Hilton, etc.)?_ 

3.  _If we decide to purchase a second week/timeshare in the future, is it better to stick to the same company?_

Any answers, advice is greatly appreciated!  Thanks goodness I found these boards.  :whoopie:    ~Melissa


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## Timeshare Von (Jul 28, 2007)

Your best strategy is to avoid buying in Orlando, as it is terribly overbuilt (and still more are going up there!) . . . and it is a relatively easy trade with the exception of some of the primo weeks like Christmas.

If you buy into a points system say with FF/Wyndham you will need a huge number of points via resale to get a 3BR unit.  At Bonnet Creek (their premier Orlando location) it would be between 175k and 308k for a 3BR unit.  At Star Island it would be a bit less, between 154k and 224k points for a 3BR unit.  Cypress Palms and Orlando Int'l Resort Club do not have anything larger than 2BR units.

I don't know that the MF's would prove to be desirable in terms of the "value" of the week you would use in Orlando.

If you buy into FF/Wyndham's points program you will get your exchange company membership as part of your MF's.  Most are with RCI, but there are a handful of their resorts in II.  I would never own a timeshare with any company without having an exchange company membership too.  While FF/Wyndham does add to the flexibility of ownership through their own exchange-like network using points, there are benefits to having RCI membership that can enhance the "value" of your points ownership, particularly when bulk spacebanks occur.  (Please read thread on that subject to gain an understanding of that concept and why how it benefits the exchangability of points based exchange weeks in RCI.  Here is the link:  http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51884 )

Depending on how many points you buy in for your first resale purchase, you may or may not need (or want) to buy another package of points.   As for buying in again with the same company or another, some folks prefer to spread there options around with owning in a couple of different companies.

While I currently own primarily FF/Wyndham (fixed weeks with a small points contract soon coming my way), I would encourage you to take a look at BlueGreen too.  They are points based and I've been pretty impressed with what I've seen of their resorts and the company in general.  I would steer clear of Vacation Villages!

I'm guessing you'll get a lot of responses to your questions especially since I really only addressed from my limited FF/Wydham experience and knowledge.  Good luck in your continued learning and decision making process.


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## BocaBum99 (Jul 28, 2007)

3 bedroom units are hard to exchange into.  Your best bet if you absolutely need a 3 bedroom unit is to purchase one to use with a lockoff option if you plan to exchange so that you can get multiple exchanges per year you dont use it.  HOwever, I wouldn't buy into Orlando as TimeshareVon suggests.

Alternatively, you can purchase a point system such as Bluegreen or Fairfield or WorldMark to get 3 bedroom units.

I own all three.  If you live in the East, I'd recommend looking closely at Bluegreen or Fairfield.  If you live in the West, I'd recommend WorldMark.

All have their pros and cons.  If you specify where you live, perhaps we can narrow down the options for you even more.

Take a timeshare tour or two and figure out which system may make more sense to you, then buy something resale.  You should be able to buy something that meets your needs.


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## Timeshare Von (Jul 28, 2007)

BocaBum99 said:


> All have their pros and cons.  If you specify where you live, perhaps we can narrow down the options for you even more.




Given that their profile says "Austin" I would say that it's a horse a piece east vs. west based on where they live . . . so the next logical question would be "Where to you want to vacation, other than Orlando?"  If it's east then yeah, BG and FF/W makes most sense . . . and if West, then WM.

I believe all have Hawaii affiliated resorts but maybe Boca has a view on which of the three mentioned is best if you want to go to Hawaii with your points based ownership.  (I've been successful in getting there as often as we want to via a floating week on Waikiki plus RCI exchanges for a piggy-back second week, every other year or so.)


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## mrodm (Jul 28, 2007)

Yes, we're in Austin, so either direction is fine.  We're not tied to either coast as far as a preference, except that we want to buy in a location that's within a day or two drive.  (Living in Texas, it's takes a day just to get out of the state...) 

We were thinking Orlando because the kids are at the ages where we can vacation there with little complaint.  I do get the comments about it being overbuilt, though, so that's definitely a BIG consideration before we buy.

We come from the attitude that we'll see what's available each year, and then just go for it.  Eventually we'd like to exchange for all over the world, so we don't want to end up with an property exchange value that only gives us close-by.

So, from what I'm hearing, a point-based program may work better for us, as far a flexibility goes.  Please keep the comments coming; you are all a font of information!  (Although, the more I read the more cross-eyed I get:rofl: but it's all sinking in.)


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## BocaBum99 (Jul 28, 2007)

I'd say that Bluegreen is a better choice for Hawaii since it's cheaper than WorldMark to get a good exchange through the exchange companies that have the best Hawaii inventory.

WorldMark is best for trading in II and SFX.  

BG is better for RCI and RCI Points, DAE and TPI.  If you need the hardest to get RCI trades, then WM is better since it doesn't have trading power restrictions and you can request first, but it is quite expensive for trading into RCI.

It's a toss up for HTSE depending on where you want to go.

Fairfield is only good for trading into Fairfield or using Fairfield Resorts.


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## BocaBum99 (Jul 28, 2007)

mrodm said:


> Yes, we're in Austin, so either direction is fine.  We're not tied to either coast as far as a preference, except that we want to buy in a location that's within a day or two drive.  (Living in Texas, it's takes a day just to get out of the state...)
> 
> We were thinking Orlando because the kids are at the ages where we can vacation there with little complaint.  I do get the comments about it being overbuilt, though, so that's definitely a BIG consideration before we buy.
> 
> ...



Given what you've said so far, I would recommend the following course of action.  It will help you make an informed choice.

1) I would definitely pick a point system.  Orlando is easy to get.  All alternatives will meet your needs there.

2) You need to decide whether or not you prefer the high end hotel based timeshares such as Hyatt, Hilton, Starwood, etc or you prefer a value based timeshare resort group such as Bluegreen, WorldMark and even Fairfield.   Rent a unit in Orlando and attend a bunch of presentations.  Narrow your list down to your top three based on what you heard.

3) If you decide that Bluegreen, Fairfield or WorldMark best meets your needs, then rent one of those and attend presentations at each.

At that time, you will be prepared with the resort group you most like and you can ask us questions here to determine the best strategies for each resort group and whether or not what you want to do is even feasibly possible.

We can show you how to get the best deal, get the most of our your specific purchase and ensure that the pre-conditions exist for you to be happy long term with your timeshare purchase.


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## BocaBum99 (Jul 28, 2007)

I should note that there are lots of other good options as well.  Shell, Sunterra and others.  I am just not personally as well versed with those systems.


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## Timeshare Von (Jul 28, 2007)

BocaBum99 said:


> 3) If you decide that Bluegreen, Fairfield or WorldMark best meets your needs, then rent one of those and attend presentations at each.



You may also want to consider doing the three day/two night packages that are essentially "free" once you figure in the deal on accommodations plus any "gifts" they give you to take their presenation.

Living in Austin, I think you may be able to do a FF/Wyndham in San Antonio.  Branson is within a couple of days drive time and may be worthwhile in taking in a rental or two . . . or a special packaged trip.  Both FF/Wyndham and BlueGreen have active sales offices in Branson, as does Westgate and probably others I'm not not familiar with.  (There are a lot of them there . . . quickly rivaling Orlando for the most overbuilt timeshare area in the USA!)

If there is a Bass Pro Shop near you, you may be able to buy a "tour package" for BlueGreen there.  Wyndham has them offered via their sales website:  http://www.fairfieldgetaway.com/ .


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## JudyS (Jul 29, 2007)

As others have said here, exchanging for three bedrooms will be hard.  There just aren't many of them out there.  So, buying into one of the points systems might be a good choice, as BocaBum and several others said.  However, other than maybe Fairfield, the purchase price for this would be fairly substantial -- about $8000 to $9000 to buy enough points in Worldmark for a three bedroom, for example. 

If that's above your budget, another option might be to look into Cypress Pointe in Orlando.  It's a nice resort (I've stayed there and liked it), very very close to Disneyworld, that has three bedroom units and sells for reasonable prices.  There are several TUG members who own there and are happy with the resort -- AwayWeGo is one; Timeos2 owns there and is President of the HOA.  I used to have a couple of spacebanked weeks from there that I used for trading.  I had a July two-bedroom that was only an average trader, but a spring three-bedroom should be stronger.  It gets a priority into other resorts managed by VRI.  If you did buy there, I'd suggest a high season week.


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## Zac495 (Jul 29, 2007)

Email Seth Nock  sethnock@hotmail.com  Tell him Ellen sent you (I get NOTHING out of this, but I'm a trusted, repeat buyers, so he may cut YOU a 
break). He knows these systems very well and tuggers will agree he is to be trusted. He will really help you get the best price that will pass right of first 
refusal (ROFR). 

I personally own 2 Marriott weeks (Aruba and Williamsburg), and Hilton points (Orlando). I would NEVER buy Marriott Orlando because Orlando is a bad trader (relatively). That said, if you buy a point system, it doesn't matter. I chose the place with the lowest maintenance fees (with Seth's help).

I agree with everyone. Go on a few fun vacations for FREE. Go to Hyatt - I went to the presentation there - very low pressure - in Bonita Springs. However, my concern with "newbies" taking presentations is that the salespeople are ready with the answer to RESALE. They will make their answer sound good, and Tuggers sound like idiots. That's their JOB. So you MUST promise yourself - I WILL NOT BUY, even when they tell me the prices will go up tomorrow. Even when they offer me round trip tickets and 7 nights in Hawaii (they will). Because the cost of that "free trip," is not as much as the extra money you'll pay to buy in developer cost. They'll tell you you won't be elite status and that you could be dropped because you're an outside buyer. They will tell you these are new policies that Tuggers don't know about yet. I guarantee they'll tell you all these things and you will be SO tempted to buy from the very nice salesperson. So copy my email and take it with you if you go on one of those presentations.

Are there ever reasons to buy developer? A few reasons. But NOT for a first timer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I promise!

Good luck!


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## pcgirl54 (Jul 29, 2007)

I have another question for you. Do you like the beach or prefer to ski? We have 3 sons and bought when they were 9-14. We prefer coastal beach locations so we chose a TS based on our vacation choices.

We looked at Fairfield and all the choices. Didn't like most of the locations except for a few places.

We just looked at Hyatt who has 13 resorts. Many are ski locations.

We also just looked at Hilton-many are managed properties in warm locations we prefer.

Starwood- some very nice locations. 

Marriott-many resorts 30+ in warm and cold weather locations.

I do not know about points resorts.


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## jejones3329 (Aug 11, 2007)

*Silverleaf*

I am a newbie and trying to decide what to buy but from my limited outlook it sounds like silverleaf could be an option, they have Orlando, plus Canyon Lake, Galveston, Lake Conroe as well as others. They have a bonus program where you can use time M-T free and pay $39.99-$49.99 on weekends. If you got your week at orlando you would still be able to utilize the bonus time at Canyon Lake and the others which would be within easy driving. I had made a mistake and bought a white week as the seller said the bonus time was available all year but in reality it is only good for the color you have, if you have Red it is good all year so I am looking into a red week. Silverleaf fees are high but if you utilize bonus time it sounds like it is worth it. If this sounds interesting there is a silverleaf forum on yahoo. Best of Luck


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## EMG (Aug 25, 2007)

Timeshare Von said:


> Your best strategy is to avoid buying in Orlando, as it is terribly overbuilt (and still more are going up there!) . . . and it is a relatively easy trade with the exception of some of the primo weeks like Christmas.
> 
> If you buy into a points system say with FF/Wyndham you will need a huge number of points via resale to get a 3BR unit.  At Bonnet Creek (their premier Orlando location) it would be between 175k and 308k for a 3BR unit.  At Star Island it would be a bit less, between 154k and 224k points for a 3BR unit.  Cypress Palms and Orlando Int'l Resort Club do not have anything larger than 2BR units.
> 
> ...



Before you buy anything, be sure to ask 2 questions"

1.  What are the maintenance fees?
2.  How does where you own points affect getting a priority trade to your home resort?  "ie"  you can buy cheap points on ebay, but they may not work the same way "retail" points do.


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## Polly & Jere (Aug 28, 2007)

mrodm said:


> My husband and I have batted about the idea of owning a timeshare for several years.  Now that we have a better idea of our vacation needs and wants (finally!), we're ready to buy resale in a location that we're sure to visit at least once every 4-5 years.



These kinds of questions are so difficult to answer without knowing all of the buyer's priorities and circumstances.  I personally would never choose to buy anywhere that I might only want to visit once every 4 or 5 years.  You'd be better off renting.... MUCH better!



> With 3 kids in school, we're considering a property in Orlando, 3 bed/2-3bath, red, floating.  Our goal is to buy something with the most exchange value as possible that we can afford.



All the places with the highest exchange value are those places that are nearly impossible to find availability in their respective prime seasons.  I'd question whether the MouseHouse qualifies because of overbuilding.

The big buying difficulty that I've run across is finding places that satisfy both usability and trade-ability (value).



> Now, some questions:
> 
> 1.  _Since we only intend to visit occasionally and exchange the rest of the time, are we better off buying into a points program? _   The resale prices of exchange-program properties are significantly lower that those of points-program properties, so I'd like to know the value is there.



That is why I love points in a quality franchise that gives high bang for the buck.  My 1st choice is WorldMark, then FairField, for value.  (I own both)   If you just want the best and cost is no object, then I'd say Disney, Marriott, Westin, and a few other high-end clubs.  If you buy any of these at the right price the resale value will likely remain high, depressions and belly-ups aside.



> 2.  _Is it necessary to join an outside program (ie, RCI, II, etc.) to effectively use a TS?  Or can one still get good exchanges using the property's parent company (ie, Fairfield /Wyndham, Sunterra, Hilton, etc.)?_



Depends on how often, far and wide you want to cast your nets, or watch others doing so.   And also if the parent company has the locations you want.  RCI and II give you far more options (choices).  I've found that choices are good... the more the better.  But then some people just don't like messing with them, or taking the time to shop for the bargains.

I'd think twice before buying Sunterra, though.  Lots of unrest with the natives there, and since I bought there, I can understand some of the reasons.  

I love WM, as I said above.   I probably wasted money buying most of the other stuff I did, and will probably just sell them off or trade them and get more WM Credits eventually.  

(I should add that all my purchases are within a 3 hour drive from my house, so there is a high usability factor in them all, as well as trade value.)



> 3.  _If we decide to purchase a second week/timeshare in the future, is it better to stick to the same company?_



Depends (again) on how good your first choice was.    I bought five of them within a space of a few months.  All good deals, to be sure, and I will get my money's worth from them all... assuming I live another few years.    (And if I don't then my wife and family will.)  However, if I'd have known how good WM is I'd have probably skipped the first four, and just gone with them, even though they were the most expensive, costing more than all the others combined.  I might wind up liking FF too, if I can ever get my member number.



> Any answers, advice is greatly appreciated!  Thanks goodness I found these boards.  :whoopie:    ~Melissa



Yep.  Aren't they great?   

Jere


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## easyrider (Sep 7, 2007)

Worldmark trades real good but if I was to go to Orlando again, and I plan to, I will probally buy from skyauction.com or from another tug member in the distressed weeks link. You can rent units for very little in Orlando. If you need holiday weeks its a different story probally. Three bed condo units are harder to rent. Three bed rental houses are a dime a dozen in Orlando, or so it looks like that on ebay.


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## easyrider (Sep 7, 2007)

Just looked on ebay (orlando in travel) lots of 3 bedroom condos and houses near disney and attractions for about a maintanance fee. We used WM points and traded into Silver Lake for two 2 bed 2 bath units Thanksgiving week but I think we should have rented a house instead and used the points elsewhere. Thats the plan for next time.


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