# [ 2013 ] How do you feel about retailers promoting and being open on Thanksgiving?



## dmharris (Nov 17, 2013)

I'm totally against this.  I think we've gone too far afield and need to get back to true values, rather than shop for the value a day sooner.  

What do you think?  Sorry if this has already been discussed.


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## MommaBear (Nov 17, 2013)

I feel awful abut t. Not only will I boycott those chains, I will be sending a letter of complaint to the CEO.


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## DaveNV (Nov 17, 2013)

I won't shop on Thanksgiving. And I've only been out once for Black Friday.  What a PITA. Never again! 

My spouse works for Costco, which is ALWAYS closed on Thanksgiving. For a reason. Stay home and enjoy the holiday with your family.

Dave


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## PigsDad (Nov 17, 2013)

MommaBear said:


> I feel awful abut t. Not only will I boycott those chains, I will be sending a letter of complaint to the CEO.



Ok, no shopping at:

Best Buy
JC Penney
Kmart
Kohl's
Macy's
Sears
Staples
Target
The Gap
Toys R Us
Walmart

And probably a bunch more, but these are the big ones.

Kurt


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## Fisch (Nov 17, 2013)

dmharris said:


> I'm totally against this.  I think we've gone too far afield and need to get back to true values, rather than shop for the value a day sooner.
> 
> What do you think?  Sorry if this has already been discussed.



I don't like it.


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## Passepartout (Nov 17, 2013)

I hate it! Imagine someone feeling that it's OK to pre-empt food, football, more food, beer, more food, more football, more food with something as self-centered as 12 hour early Black Friday shopping. There oughtta be a law! I refuse to participate with the sacrilege of this most holy-day of worshiping at the turkey corpse and green-bean and mushroom soup casserole!

DW and I feel so strongly that we are going somewhere it isn't even celebrated! New Zealand. Oh, not that they don't celebrate a Thanksgiving, they just do it with a different kind of football. Or cricket. Or something. I think. 

Jim


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## Patri (Nov 17, 2013)

Though I am anxious to get shopping done early this year, I won't go out that day. I am purposely holding out until Small Business Saturday in our small town. Get what I can here, then try to finish up in the big stores early in December.


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## Kel (Nov 17, 2013)

We go camping and do the motorcycle desert riding thing with family and friends every Thanksgiving.  I've never shopped during the Thanksgiving weekend.  I'm curious, what retailers are advertising they will be open on Thanksgiving?  I fast forward through commercials so I have no idea what's happening in the holiday retail world.   And, I don't think retail businesses should to be open on holidays.


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## Timeshare Von (Nov 17, 2013)

Add me to the list of those who will not shop at those places interfering with the a family's ability to enjoy the Thanksgiving holiday.  Of all of the holidays, it along with Christmas should be left for people to enjoy time with their families.


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## Timeshare Von (Nov 17, 2013)

Kel said:


> I'm curious, what retailers are advertising they will be open on Thanksgiving?



Kmart advertised being open from 6a on Thanksgiving morning through Friday night (like 11pm?) . . . open 24 hours ON Thanksgiving is inexcusable.


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## laurac260 (Nov 17, 2013)

Kinda like blaming prostitutes for prostitution...?

I don't shop on thanksgiving, on fact I try to avoid retail outlets completely during the holidays.  But apparently there's a market for it huh?


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## presley (Nov 17, 2013)

I don't like it.  It's unfair to those working there who don't have a choice about whether they get the national holiday off to be with family.


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## am1 (Nov 17, 2013)

Many on here do not like it but its what the people want.  I do not agree with it.  With online shopping being so big I think Thursday and Friday should be the online shopping days not monday.

I once heard thanksgiving is the second biggest day of the year for pizza.  CEO of Papa Johns on cnbc I recall.  Should they be open?


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## DaveNV (Nov 17, 2013)

am1 said:


> I once heard thanksgiving is the second biggest day of the year for pizza.  CEO of Papa Johns on cnbc I recall.  Should they be open?



That's another company to be avoided, but for a different reason. He's a multi-millionaire, owner of a tremendously successful company.  But he refuses to provide healthcare for his employees because he says it would mean they'd have to raise pizza prices by something like 10 cents. Yet he gives away hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of pizza during the Superbowl. Definitely needs to get his priorities sorted out.  (Not trying to go political here, so please don't turn this into that kind of thread.)  

Dave


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## mpizza (Nov 17, 2013)

I am against retailers being open on Thanksgiving, as well as major holidays.  In fact, I wish that "blue laws" would prevail and stores remained closed on Sunday (except for essentials).   

One thing to keep in mind before you boycott, I work for a retailer and although we may wish to remain closed, if the Shopping Center is open, retailers are forced to operate Mall hours or face hefty fines and being placed in default under their lease.

Maria


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## Weimaraner (Nov 17, 2013)

So are we boycotting US timeshares too because we don't want to make their employees have to come to work on Thanksgiving? There are obviously folks who work for Marriott, Disney, Starwood etc who work holidays to make our vacations more comfortable. How about the movie theaters that open so people can watch the latest movie? Where do we draw the line?


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## Fern Modena (Nov 17, 2013)

I guess the person who mentioned K-Mart didn't realize that they have always been open on Thanksgiving, as has Walgreens. Most supermarkets are open for those of you who have forgotten something for the dinner table. 

Many restaurants are open on holidays, as are movie theaters, amusement parks, and zoos.  All of those places have employees who work on that day. 

If you don't like the fact that the stores will be open on Thanksgiving, then don't shop on that day. It is as simple as that.  If you work in retail, of course, that is different (although I daresay most of the above posters don't).

As for it being unfair by making people work on the holiday, how about Policemen, Firemen, Bus and Subway Operators, Taxi Drivers, Air Traffic Controllers, Pilots, Flight Attendants, Utility Workers, News Reporters and others who have 24/7 jobs?

It is what it is, folks. Its not a religious holiday, and most people don't think it means more than getting together with friends and family and having a big meal and nothing more.

JMHO, of course, and from a perspective of one who held a 24/7 job.

Fern


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## falmouth3 (Nov 17, 2013)

I heard that Macy's had already filled their work slots with volunteers.  Maybe not only the shoppers, but some of the employees want the stores to be open on the holiday.  Time and a half could be useful if you're struggling to make ends meet.


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## Ken555 (Nov 17, 2013)

Nonsense. If you don't like it, just don't shop on that day. If the stores want to be open, and have the staff to do so, then it's up to them. I don't understand the fanatical response this type of topic generates. 

I've shipped on Black Friday in the past, and have no intention of ever doing so again. Like others, it's just a PITA. But, if the stores want to do it, who am I to say otherwise? And if they want to open on Thanksgiving...well, so what? Remember, for every person who complains about working on Thanksgiving there are those who like it since they get paid extra. Keep things in perspective...


Sent from my iPad


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## Ken555 (Nov 17, 2013)

falmouth3 said:


> I heard that Macy's had already filled their work slots with volunteers.  Maybe not only the shoppers, but some of the employees want the stores to be open on the holiday.  Time and a half could be useful if you're struggling to make ends meet.



Exactly! And I bet many stores will be full of people shopping that day...especially during the day before Turkey Day celebrations. 


Sent from my iPad


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## Free2Roam (Nov 17, 2013)

Agree with Fern...I usually host the family dinner so I don't shop on Thanksgiving Day. And I don't like Black Friday crowds (tried once 20+ years ago, saw the line to get in and didn't bother getting out the car.) But I have no problem with businesses being open. I recognize and accept that not everyone is like me.


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## ronparise (Nov 17, 2013)

If the folks here on tug are any indication the parking lots ought to be empty.

any bets on whether that will be the case

for the record I always volunteer to work on Christmas. You would be surprised how many people want to shop for their vacation home when they are on vacation


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## Timeshare Von (Nov 17, 2013)

Fern Modena said:


> I guess the person who mentioned K-Mart didn't realize that they have always been open on Thanksgiving, as has Walgreens. Most supermarkets are open for those of you who have forgotten something for the dinner table.



Well not "always" as I was a manager in the Kmart system for more than 6 years and we weren't open on Thanksgiving day when I worked for them.

I get that grocery stores could be viewed as essential, but not 24/7 on *the* day.  I remember we had to go out for something when we had a big family holiday down in the FLA Keys a couple of years ago.  It was nice to have Publix open but I think their signs said that they would be closing for the day at 4pm so their associates could enjoy the holiday with family.

I don't think there is anything anyone NEEDs to buy on Thanksgiving day at a Kmart.


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## Timeshare Von (Nov 17, 2013)

falmouth3 said:


> I heard that Macy's had already filled their work slots with volunteers.  Maybe not only the shoppers, but some of the employees want the stores to be open on the holiday.  Time and a half could be useful if you're struggling to make ends meet.



And that is a great way to handle it.  With Kmart however, I understand it was a mandatory minimum 8 hr shift for all employees that day because they are open 24 hours on Thanksgiving Day.


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## MommaBear (Nov 17, 2013)

PigsDad said:


> Ok, no shopping at:
> 
> Best Buy
> JC Penney
> ...


And my protest won't make much difference as I already do not shop at Wal-Mart, Kmart, Gap, JC Penney, Toys R Us, Sears, Best Buy or Kohls, and rarely at Staples or Target


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## DaveNV (Nov 17, 2013)

I think it's one thing to have service personnel working the holiday - firemen, police, medical, and so forth - because emergencies happen all the time. I spent long enough in the Navy to have been required to work on many a holiday. That was just the way it was.  And I also don't object to stores being open on the holiday IF the workers on duty have VOLUNTEERED to work on those days.  

But where I draw a line is retail stores that REQUIRE employees to work on the holiday, or else. And in the case of part time workers, as many are, there IS no time-and-a-half for working that day.

I choose not to shop those days, as is my prerogative. For those who wish to shop, go for it. I hope it's everything you want it to be.  

Dave


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## dougp26364 (Nov 17, 2013)

dmharris said:


> I'm totally against this.  I think we've gone too far afield and need to get back to true values, rather than shop for the value a day sooner.
> 
> What do you think?  Sorry if this has already been discussed.



If enough people stay home, they won't do it again. Unfortunately there's enough crazy people out there who live for the thrill of a bargain that this sort of thing will continue. My bet is not only will it continue but will grow. 

Personally, we won't be shopping on Thanksgiving and we don't shop on black friday or boxing day.


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## LannyPC (Nov 17, 2013)

I personally do not have a problem with stores being open on stat holidays.  If I don't like it, I won't shop there.

As for the employees' happiness and well-being, well, that's a risk managment runs by opening on stat holidays.  They should remember, happy employees make better employees.  If they alienate employees by requiring them to work on stat holidays for only straight time, employees won't be as happy or productive.  Also, their unhappiness might be taken out on the customers which, in turn, would run the risk of alienating the most important people --- the customers.

And as for part-time employees, if they're required to work on the stat holiday, well, they have other days off.  After all, they're part-time.  If they don't like being "forced" to work on a day they don't want, then maybe they should look for a new job and find an employer that will show a little more respect for its employees.

That brings things back to the employers.  If they make things miserable for employees, employees will quit.  This leads to a lot of employee turnover which is not very healthy for a company.  The company has to spend a lot of resources searching for,interviewing, and training new employees.

So I guess it's a 3-way street.  If customers don't like it, don't shop there.  If employees don't like it, don't work there.  Then employers must weigh these factors and figure out if it's worth it to open on such holidays.


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## Pens_Fan (Nov 18, 2013)

I won't shop Thursday or Friday.


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## Patri (Nov 18, 2013)

MommaBear said:


> And my protest won't make much difference as I already do not shop at Wal-Mart, Kmart, Gap, JC Penney, Toys R Us, Sears, Best Buy or Kohls, and rarely at Staples or Target



Wow. You probably pay much more than you have to for whatever you do buy.


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## lvhmbh (Nov 18, 2013)

I don't shop at those stores either except for Office Depot if I need something right away.  I've found that Amazon matches their prices and delivers.  However, I do go out to dinner EVERY Thanksgiving for the last 30 years and have never run into an unhappy server, etc.  If they are they don't show it.  I avoid the mall as much as possible too


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## klpca (Nov 18, 2013)

MommaBear said:


> And my protest won't make much difference as I already do not shop at Wal-Mart, Kmart, Gap, JC Penney, Toys R Us, Sears, Best Buy or Kohls, and rarely at Staples or Target



Target is the only store on that list where I shop as well. We're pretty much Amazon shoppers. I hate, hate, hate shopping, so I do as much as possible online. Between Amazon and Etsy, you can find most anything that you want. Obviously, we won't be out shopping on Thanksgiving. Ever. Not this year, not next year.

I think this says more about Thanksgiving dinner than shopping. Maybe there are people out there who don't really celebrate Thanksgiving. We do, but we have friends who aren't too excited about it. I imagine that for those folks, having the day off is very convenient for shopping.


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## geekette (Nov 18, 2013)

mpizza said:


> I am against retailers being open on Thanksgiving, as well as major holidays.  In fact, I wish that "blue laws" would prevail and stores remained closed on Sunday (except for essentials).
> 
> One thing to keep in mind before you boycott, I work for a retailer and although we may wish to remain closed, if the Shopping Center is open, retailers are forced to operate Mall hours or face hefty fines and being placed in default under their lease.
> 
> Maria



I do not want to go back to blue laws.  It's hampering for those of us that work more than full time during the week.


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## geekette (Nov 18, 2013)

Patri said:


> Wow. You probably pay much more than you have to for whatever you do buy.



how ya figure?


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## geekette (Nov 18, 2013)

mpizza said:


> I am against retailers being open on Thanksgiving, as well as major holidays.  In fact, I wish that "blue laws" would prevail and stores remained closed on Sunday (except for essentials).
> 
> One thing to keep in mind before you boycott, I work for a retailer and although we may wish to remain closed, if the Shopping Center is open, retailers are forced to operate Mall hours or face hefty fines and being placed in default under their lease.
> 
> Maria



That's a terrible contract.  I would not put my retail shop there not so much because of holidays but weather events.  If there is a snow emergency I would not want my employees to risk their lives to come to work and would want My Decision to override whatever mall mgmt wants.


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## AKE (Nov 18, 2013)

Not everyone looks at Thanksgiving the same way.  Why not close Disney, lock down the shopping or any commercial activity on the internet and so on? People have a choice, both when and where to shop and where to work.  My parents worked 6-day weeks - that was the norm in those days, and people like farmers, even today, work 7 days a week, 365 days year round.  When you take a job you know the parameters that come with it.  At the same time many DO want to work on holidays because it provides extra income (and especially if they can fill in for someone else who wants the day off). I have shopped and will continue to shop on Thanksgiving - why not if the prices are the best? I have also gone to Disney on Xmas Day as have millions of other people. 
(This argument reminds me of the days when there was NO SUNDAY SHOPPING in Canada because people needed a day of rest (and that's less than 15 years ago), NO THEATRES were allowed to be open (until the late 1960's), GAS STATIONS had to close  at 6 pm in Toronto 7 days a week (so try getting gas after 6 pm as there were hefty fines) and no SPORTING events were allowed on Sundays.  Bars also had to be closed on Sunday and liquor/beer could only be purchased around dinner hours and only if you bought a full meal.  Thank goodness we have come a long way since then!)


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## Phydeaux (Nov 18, 2013)

AKE said:


> Not everyone looks at Thanksgiving the same way.  Why not close Disney, lock down the shopping or any commercial activity on the internet and so on? People have a choice, both when and where to shop and where to work.  My parents worked 6-day weeks - that was the norm in those days, and people like farmers, even today, work 7 days a week, 365 days year round.  When you take a job you know the parameters that come with it.  At the same time many DO want to work on holidays because it provides extra income (and especially if they can fill in for someone else who wants the day off). I have shopped and will continue to shop on Thanksgiving - why not if the prices are the best? I have also gone to Disney on *Xmas* Day as have millions of other people.
> (This argument reminds me of the days when there was NO SUNDAY SHOPPING in Canada because people needed a day of rest (and that's less than 15 years ago), NO THEATRES were allowed to be open (until the late 1960's), GAS STATIONS had to close  at 6 pm in Toronto 7 days a week (so try getting gas after 6 pm as there were hefty fines) and no SPORTING events were allowed on Sundays.  Bars also had to be closed on Sunday and liquor/beer could only be purchased around dinner hours and only if you bought a full meal.  Thank goodness we have come a long way since then!)



...and this, everyone, is why businesses are open on holidays.


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## geekette (Nov 18, 2013)

I am not a shopper, do it as rarely as possible, and not about to ever go shop Black Friday or 'the early hours' now (also never on a rainy Sat morn as I really hate crowds).  I generally do my Christmas shopping on Christmas Eve because there are very few of us and great bargains, and I likely know what I'm getting everyone by that time anyway.  Super Blowout whatever holds no appeal for me.  Getting up early never holds appeal unless it is to head for airport to start vacation.

I do not plan to boycott any of these stores as I know that there are going to be some employees IN GREAT NEED of holiday pay and this is one of the few times that retailers may actually reward their employees.  I am in favor of retail workers getting some perks as there are darned few and usually none in that line of work.  

I am against retail employers REQUIRING holiday work, but like the volunteer aspect.  I would have been a volunteer in my younger days as a chance for extra money was far more important than being with family On That Day.  Plenty of times I was unable to afford to take time off to travel to be with family anyhow (airfare was always out of budget).  

Not everyone has family or friends that can understand "I am so under water I MUST do this or fall farther behind" but I would much rather take the shift than ask Dad for a short-term loan.  Make hay while the sun shines.

Further, not everyone has family or friends that understands marking the holiday when we can all be together vs when the calendar says to do it.


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## geekette (Nov 18, 2013)

klpca said:


> Target is the only store on that list where I shop as well. We're pretty much Amazon shoppers. I hate, hate, hate shopping, so I do as much as possible online. Between Amazon and Etsy, you can find most anything that you want. Obviously, we won't be out shopping on Thanksgiving. Ever. Not this year, not next year.
> 
> I think this says more about Thanksgiving dinner than shopping. Maybe there are people out there who don't really celebrate Thanksgiving. We do, but we have friends who aren't too excited about it. I imagine that for those folks, having the day off is very convenient for shopping.



correct, not everyone 'celebrates Thanksgiving.'

why not be thankful for what you have everyday?  We don't stock up gratitude to only express it one day of the year.  It has been several years since I have been to a traditional Thanksgiving and not sure when I will be at the next one.

I can tell you that I will likely never cook a turkey again.  

Freed of dawn to dusk kitchen duty, shopping does not immediately spring to mind as what to do with free time, but, to each their own ...


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## csxjohn (Nov 18, 2013)

I doesn't matter to me what they do.  They are in business to make money and they make decisions to try to make more.

I know I won't be doing any shopping that day, I'll be eating with my family and watching some football games.

Waste of time to boycott or send letters.  If people want to shop that day it's fine with me.


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## Luanne (Nov 18, 2013)

What about places like grocery stores, Starbucks, and the like?  Are you going to boycott all of those as well?

I don't shop on Thanksgiving day, or the day after, but I have been known to get a cup of coffee at Starbucks on Thanksgiving morning.


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## Fern Modena (Nov 18, 2013)

*Requiring vs Volunteering to Work*

As I mentioned previously, I worked a 24/7 job.  Most of the many years I worked, I worked holidays.  I was lucky to get overtime for holidays. In fact, I got very generous overtime, at double time and a half (8 hours holiday pay, which everybody got, plus time and a half for working the holiday). In fact, that is why many people worked on holidays. You know, something about "money talks and bs walks" and all that.

Here is how the holiday work roster worked where I worked, and how it works in most civil service and/or union jobs (don't know about others, but it seems fair):


If it is your regular work day, and your shift works on Sundays and Holidays, you work. 
If it is your regular work day, but your shift is off Sundays and holidays, then you are off (although you can request/volunteer to work)
If you are a floater or fill in employee, if there is an open shift, you must work.  If there isn't, you may request to be off, or to work if work is available (you would get to work before the people in the above scenario)

If where you work didn't have shift work, then the work was always assigned according to inverse seniority, with the least senior people being required to work, although if any senior people wanted to work then one less of the low seniority people had to work.

In all my years of working holidays, those who worked morning shifts (off by 3 PM) *always* worked their shifts. Any floaters who were due to work had to work afternoons.  Is that fair? Yes It is called seniority/paying your dues, and it comes with a lot of jobs.

Fern


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## Fern Modena (Nov 18, 2013)

Perhaps Kmart had different rules in different regions. I moved to Nevada ten years ago, and Kmart was open on Thanksgiving Day then and remains so today.

Was it open on Thanksgiving forty or fifty years ago? I don't know, so maybe saying "always" was a bit too loose a description.

Fern



Timeshare Von said:


> Well not "always" as I was a manager in the Kmart system for more than 6 years and we weren't open on Thanksgiving day when I worked for them.


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## csxjohn (Nov 18, 2013)

Fern Modena said:


> As I mentioned previously, I worked a 24/7 job.  Most of the many years I worked, I worked holidays.  I was lucky to get overtime for holidays. In fact, I got very generous overtime, at double time and a half (8 hours holiday pay, which everybody got, plus time and a half for working the holiday). In fact, that is why many people worked on holidays. You know, something about "money talks and bs walks" and all that.
> 
> Here is how the holiday work roster worked where I worked, and how it works in most civil service and/or union jobs (don't know about others, but it seems fair):
> 
> ...



Interesting to see how others did it.  On the railroads I worked on to get paid for a holiday that you didn't actually work you had to work your scheduled day before and the scheduled day after.  Miss one of those and you lost that bonus pay.  If you're on Vaca over the holiday they extended it to the scheduled day before and after your vaca.

Double time and a quarter for us if we worked it.  

Railroaders working the road pools get no holiday pay what so ever.  Doesn't matter if you work or not, no extra pay.  Just one of the many reasons I hated the freight pools.


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## Tia (Nov 18, 2013)

Not going shopping on Thanksgiving. I have never gone for early am shopping on Black Friday either.


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## ace2000 (Nov 18, 2013)

One thing that is pretty cool about the holidays is knowing that barely anything is open and the streets are barren.  Now, everything changes.  I suppose Christmas day will be the same.


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## SueDonJ (Nov 18, 2013)

csxjohn said:


> I doesn't matter to me what they do.  They are in business to make money and they make decisions to try to make more.
> 
> I know I won't be doing any shopping that day, I'll be eating with my family and watching some football games.
> 
> Waste of time to boycott or send letters.  If people want to shop that day it's fine with me.



Same here.  I feel badly for folks who want the day off and have to work, but I don't understand all the angst over their job requirements.   <shrug>

My preference, on an every day basis, would be to have every single store in the US follow the archaic Blue Laws that didn't allow any commerce on Sundays.  And not because it's "Sunday" as in "holy day" but because it was nice to have one day a week when we were forced to slow down.  Today's ways are sad in that respect, IMO, but it doesn't appear that there's any turning back.


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## Passepartout (Nov 18, 2013)

One thing (among many)that basically sucks about being a long-haul trucker is that there are NO holidays. If you're under a load, you roll. If not, you don't. When a holiday comes along, the BEST you can hope for is a day off without pay. It goes downhill from there. There IS no overtime. Over 30some years I worked a LOT of holidays, and with the family, took them when we could- not when the calendar said we should.

Jim


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## Luanne (Nov 18, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> One thing (among many)that basically sucks about being a long-haul trucker is that there are NO holidays. If you're under a load, you roll. If not, you don't. When a holiday comes along, the BEST you can hope for is a day off without pay. It goes downhill from there. There IS no overtime. Over 30some years I worked a LOT of holidays, and with the family, took them when we could- not when the calendar said we should.
> 
> Jim



Last year, on Thanksgiving Day, our furniture was delivered to our new home.  Thank goodness those wonderful movers gave up their holiday to get us into our home.


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## CarolF (Nov 18, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> I hate it! Imagine someone feeling that it's OK to pre-empt food, football, more food, beer, more food, more football, more food with something as self-centered as 12 hour early Black Friday shopping. There oughtta be a law! I refuse to participate with the sacrilege of this most holy-day of worshiping at the turkey corpse and green-bean and mushroom soup casserole!
> 
> DW and I feel so strongly that we are going somewhere it isn't even celebrated! New Zealand. Oh, not that they don't celebrate a Thanksgiving, they just do it with a different kind of football. Or cricket. Or something. I think.
> 
> Jim



Jim, I know nothing about Thanksgiving (your description is hilarious), I'm guessing by the name it is some sort of religious event for some Americans and I've heard some Canadians too.  Thought I would give you warning that you may need to find some Americans or Canadians in New Zealand to work out how to do, whatever it is that you do.  I hope you enjoy your trip and find whatever it is that you need.


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## Passepartout (Nov 18, 2013)

Luanne said:


> Last year, on Thanksgiving Day, our furniture was delivered to our new home.  Thank goodness those wonderful movers gave up their holiday to get us into our home.



They were surely thankful that you accepted the delivery on Thanksgiving too. Very often, a driver will get to a destination to deliver a load only to find the receiver closed or unable for one reason or another to accept delivery. Nothing to do then but twiddle your thumbs until you can make the delivery. Oh, for no pay- it just puts you behind for the rest of your deliveries. As I said above- when it comes to holidays, the best you can hope for is a day without pay.


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## MommaBear (Nov 18, 2013)

Patri said:


> Wow. You probably pay much more than you have to for whatever you do buy.



I just don't buy much! We don't have kids at home, no grandchildren yet and really own everything we need. We do spend a bit at the hardware store, grocery store and pretty much everything else from other discount stores or on sale at our locally owned store or Amazon.com.


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## PigsDad (Nov 18, 2013)

MommaBear said:


> ... or Amazon.com.



Oh-oh!  There is most certainly a significant amount of Amazon employees that will be working on Thanksgiving.  Better add them to your boycott list.


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## Passepartout (Nov 18, 2013)

PigsDad said:


> Oh-oh!  There is most certainly a significant amount of Amazon employees that will be working on Thanksgiving.  Better add them to your boycott list.



A very good point. Here's a report on the almost inhumane working conditions at Amazon warehouses. No talking, confiscation of cell phones, times bathroom breaks. It makes "The High Cost of Low Prices" (Wal Mart) seem like a great place to work. Check this and think about it along with your Prime Account. http://www.channel4.com/news/anger-at-amazon-working-conditions

Jim


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## mav (Nov 19, 2013)

MANY years ago, I was truly broke, and worked a full time job and a part time in a drug store to make ends meet. The drug store had to remain open on holidays, but  used volunteers to work Thanksgiving  and Christmas. We were also open til midnight on Christmas Eve. I was VERY glad to work, and a few others apparently felt the same because we volunteered to work a 12 hour shift so the others didn't have to.  I am sure there are some today working on holidays that are in the same situtation and actually happy to volunteer.  Lord those days we long ago but I still remember the lean days and tip very well to hotel staff and restaurant staff, etc. I came a long way baby.


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## pedro47 (Nov 19, 2013)

Timeshare Von said:


> Add me to the list of those who will not shop at those places interfering with the a family's ability to enjoy the Thanksgiving holiday.  Of all of the holidays, it along with Christmas should be left for people to enjoy time with their families.



Add my name to the list.  I totally agree Christmas & Thanksgiving Day is a day that families should br able to relax and enjoy a day off..


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## Beaglemom3 (Nov 19, 2013)

mav said:


> MANY years ago, I was truly broke, and worked a full time job and a part time in a drug store to make ends meet. The drug store had to remain open on holidays, but  used volunteers to work Thanksgiving  and Christmas. We were also open til midnight on Christmas Eve. I was VERY glad to work, and a few others apparently felt the same because we volunteered to work a 12 hour shift so the others didn't have to.  I am sure there are some today working on holidays that are in the same situtation and actually happy to volunteer.  Lord those days we long ago but I still remember the lean days and tip very well to hotel staff and restaurant staff, etc. I came a long way baby.





  I recall similar days, too, many years ago when I would volunteer to work on my holiday off at the hospital (we nurses had to work every other holiday) so that we could pay for the new house and the new mortgage. Late edit: Holidays were double or time and a half depending on the holiday. 

 Again, this differs from retailers being open as hospitals_ must _be open,  but to Mav's point, it can be helpful to some employees if it's a choice

 I was wildly popular on my floor, needless to say.


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## dmharris (Nov 19, 2013)

Beaglemom3 said:


> I recall similar days, too, many years ago when I would volunteer to work on my holiday off at the hospital (we nurses had to work every other holiday) so that we could pay for the new house and the new mortgage.
> 
> Again, this differs from retailers being open as hospitals_ must _be open,  but to Mav's point, it can be helpful to some employees if it's a choice
> 
> I was wildly popular on my floor, needless to say.



Having started this thread, it's been interesting to see the wide diversity of opinions.  In the end, I'm of the "live and let live" mindset, however; I am opposed to employees being forced to work and the money spent on advertising and promoting that stores are open on Thanksgiving is a major distraction technique from the point of the day, when people who choose to, can stop and smell the roses.  What's so important that can't wait till Black Friday (which I do participate in btw).

Thanks for all your responses and for being cordial in your disagreement as you always are with each other (well most of the time)


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## Beaglemom3 (Nov 19, 2013)

dmharris said:


> Having started this thread, it's been interesting to see the wide diversity of opinions.  In the end, I'm of the "live and let live" mindset, however; I am opposed to employees being forced to work and the money spent on advertising and promoting that stores are open on Thanksgiving is a major distraction technique from the point of the day, when people who choose to, can stop and smell the roses.  What's so important that can't wait till Black Friday (which I do participate in btw).
> 
> Thanks for all your responses and for being cordial in your disagreement as you always are with each other (well most of the time)




  Thank you for posing this question. It was interesting and I learned to look at things a bit differently. As for boycotting, I won't, but I will try to shop at Costco and Nordstrom a bit more just in principle.


-


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## LannyPC (Nov 19, 2013)

pedro47 said:


> I totally agree Christmas & Thanksgiving Day is a day that families should be able to relax and enjoy a day off..



The company where I work works roughly the same as Fern Modena described in post #42.  When there is a stat holiday, there is a sign-up sheet.  Believe it or not, on practically every holiday, some workers near the bottom of the seniority list want to work that day but are told "No, we have enough workers senior to you who have signed up."

Me personally, I almost always sign up to work on a stat holiday (time-and-a-half for the first 4 hours and double time thereafter).  There will be other days of the week and weekends that I can spend with my family.


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## geekette (Nov 19, 2013)

dmharris said:


> Having started this thread, it's been interesting to see the wide diversity of opinions.  In the end, I'm of the "live and let live" mindset, however; I am opposed to employees being forced to work and the money spent on advertising and promoting that stores are open on Thanksgiving is a major distraction technique from the point of the day, when people who choose to, can stop and smell the roses.  What's so important that can't wait till Black Friday (which I do participate in btw).
> 
> Thanks for all your responses and for being cordial in your disagreement as you always are with each other (well most of the time)



It's a continuing commercialization of anything they can get their hands on.  

I do think that one has to accept the realities of their job.  Retail is a special animal and one knows going in what the deal is, or should have asked before accepting the job.  I accept that sometimes I will have to unexpectedly work in the middle of the night.  However, I do not have to leave home nor greet customers.  I accept that I am to do whatever it takes, regardless of what the clock says, and expect no extra pay nor comp time.  

I hate retail, tho.  Did my time, will not do it again.  Even back then, my main hangup with it is that it never closed.  Things are crazy now but people demand 24/7.  Some have no family, or no near family, or are so in need of the money that it's more of a Thanksgiving when the boosted paychecks come.

everyone has their own deal going on, but, "force" is not true - people CHOOSE to take the shift, choose to leave home and go to work.  Sure, they could lose the job if they refuse, but that's a Choice.


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## DeniseM (Nov 19, 2013)

Once I had to run to the grocery store on a major holiday, and as I walked out to the car with the bag boy I said something about being sorry he had to work that day.  He said, "I wanted to work today - I'm getting double time and a half!"

However, I also remember having a surly waitress on Halloween, who very frankly told us, "I'd like to go home to my kids before Halloween is over," when we ordered another drink after dinner.


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## Luanne (Nov 19, 2013)

pedro47 said:


> Add my name to the list.  I totally agree Christmas & Thanksgiving Day is a day that families should br able to relax and enjoy a day off..



Remember, not everyone celebrates Christmas.


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## Icc5 (Nov 19, 2013)

*Now and then*



csxjohn said:


> I doesn't matter to me what they do.  They are in business to make money and they make decisions to try to make more.
> 
> I know I won't be doing any shopping that day, I'll be eating with my family and watching some football games.
> 
> Waste of time to boycott or send letters.  If people want to shop that day it's fine with me.



I agree with this because you can't really go backwards in time.  I worked at a grocery chain for 42 years that wasn't open on most Holidays and closed earlier than normal on Sundays.  It was great while it lasted and I honestly feel when that started changing family life also started changing.  I know many people don't celebrate some of the Holidays so they shop and many people that do celebrate have it taken away by having to work.  I just wish families could enjoy the time together if they want to.
Bart


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## csxjohn (Nov 20, 2013)

*This is nuts*

There are people camped out at the Cuyahoga Falls Best Buy. Its a week until Turkey day gets here and he's been there for a week.



http://www.newsnet5.com/dpp/news/lo...already-camped-out-at-cuyahoga-falls-best-buy


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## geekette (Nov 20, 2013)

csxjohn said:


> There are people camped out at the Cuyahoga Falls Best Buy. Its a week until Turkey day gets here and he's been there for a week.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.newsnet5.com/dpp/news/lo...already-camped-out-at-cuyahoga-falls-best-buy



I concur.  this is not rational behavior.

Or, what a treat to be able to sleep outside in a parking lot for a week!  My life sucks because I can't go do that ....


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## swditz (Nov 20, 2013)

DeniseM said:


> Once I had to run to the grocery store on a major holiday, and as I walked out to the car with the bag boy I said something about being sorry he had to work that day.  He said, "I wanted to work today - I'm getting double time and a half!"
> 
> However, I also remember having a surly waitress on Halloween, who very frankly told us, "I'd like to go home to my kids before Halloween is over," when we ordered another drink after dinner.



retail workers never like hearing others are sorry they have to work.
as a retail manager I know my employees love hearing a sincere "thanks for being open today" it makes their shift much more enjoyable


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## pranas (Nov 23, 2013)

Other than a trip to the convenience store if necessary, I refuse to shop on Thanksgiving Day. I don't need anything bad enough to have to line up for sales on Thanksgiving.


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## Talent312 (Nov 23, 2013)

It beats going out at Midnight or 4AM, as we have in the past.
Once, I went out at Midnight, found both headlights out, and so took my sleeping wife's car.
At 4AM, I called her to let her know she'd need to get transport from one of her sons.

But truth, those were our young + nutty days... now I choose to do it all online.
.


Sent from my KFJWI using Tapatalk 2


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## DebBrown (Nov 23, 2013)

I will never be a Thanksgiving Day shopper - or Black Friday - or most any other day.  I try to buy online because I hate shopping.  

I do think it is a shame that so many people would rather be out shopping than spending a nice day with their families but I guess it is their choice.  Many of us have a fantasy holiday image that just isn't universal.

Someone mentioned being at theme parks over the holidays.  I remember one year we were at Disneyworld for Thanksgiving.  Somehow, I thought it would be special but it ended up being depressing.  It was just another day.  The holiday was completely lost.  We've been to Orlando many more times Thanksgiving week but always spend Thursday at the resort having a turkey dinner.

One of my favorite radio stations switched to all Christmas music a week ago.  I am totally bummed. 

Deb


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## ricoba (Nov 24, 2013)

I was rather ambivalent about this post until today.  

My daughter was just hired on @ Urban Outfitters as a seasonal worker.  She just informed us this morning that she is working Thanksgiving Day @ 11:30pm to 7:30am Black Friday.  

Since her regular full-time job is at LAX (Los Angeles International) she is working Thanksgiving day.  She'll come home at 6pm get a little sleep and then pull the night shift at Urban Outfitters.

Cora (my wife) is a RN and she has worked Thanksgiving for many years.  This year since we have no real plans, she may try and get a 12 hour shift.  

So, for Thanksgiving, I guess it will pretty much be just me home by myself!


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## jlr10 (Nov 24, 2013)

I do not  like the shopping on Thanksgiving, and agree that people should be able to spend the day with their family being thankful for their family. But with Black Friday shopping, even before they began opening on Thursday, many had to go to work on Thanksgiving to get ready. I know last year I ran into many employees who were not happy to not be spending the holiday with their families.

I have done Black Friday shopping for the last few years.  Not really to get bargains, although I have picked up a few, but because this is the day my sister chooses to do her shopping.  I enjoyed sitting in sleeping bags on Thursday night and getting the change to catch up with my sister and nieces.  We talk about the past year and make plans for Christmas, and somewhere in there is usually sending someone out for hot chocolate or more blankets. Then we pack up and go into the store to try to get the bargains she has picked out, as she uses her Black Friday shopping to buy for others who don't have the money to buy for themselves. Hard to fault her for that.

I won't be doing it this year as the crowds that show up where she lives are becoming too hostile, with police being called last year as we were in the middle of two warring parties who were yelling and taunting each other.  None of us felt safe.  Definitely not the experience that we used to have.  I just returned from doing a large part of my holiday shopping. I will miss the dedicated time with my sister but am happy I have a head start on the holiday and am looking forward to sleeping in on Friday.


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## Icc5 (Nov 25, 2013)

*Offer Specials Now*



dmharris said:


> Having started this thread, it's been interesting to see the wide diversity of opinions.  In the end, I'm of the "live and let live" mindset, however; I am opposed to employees being forced to work and the money spent on advertising and promoting that stores are open on Thanksgiving is a major distraction technique from the point of the day, when people who choose to, can stop and smell the roses.  What's so important that can't wait till Black Friday (which I do participate in btw).
> 
> Thanks for all your responses and for being cordial in your disagreement as you always are with each other (well most of the time)



I just don't understand the push on Thanksgiving?  It seems that stores could offer their deals now and at least give most people the day off on Thanksgiving (workers) to enjoy with family and friends.  Run the specials each day so you don't get the mob mentality.  Companies would be able to pay normal pay and not special rates.  More business usually means more hours of help needed so more people hopefully would then get more hours.
Bart


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## Phydeaux (Nov 25, 2013)

Icc5 said:


> I just don't understand the push on Thanksgiving?  *It seems that stores could offer their deals now and at least give most people the day off on Thanksgiving (workers) to enjoy with family and friends*.  Run the specials each day so you don't get the mob mentality.  Companies would be able to pay normal pay and not special rates.  More business usually means more hours of help needed so more people hopefully would then get more hours.
> Bart



A savvy company could and would captilize on this strategy. This is a win win win for someone, ready for the taking! 

First, they get you into their business before the holiday and get those dollars from you before they're spent elsewhere.

Second, they could promote this in a manner to build a LOT of positive PR. Such as, "_To enable our dedicated and outstanding employees the ability to enjoy this Thanksgiving, Christmas (fill in the blank holiday), we are offering our best prices of the year *BEFORE* the holiday. Stop in Wednesday_...." Pay employees time an a half pay, even though it's not the holiday.

Third, they could create a positive work environment that their employees would appreciate.

Fourth, they'd allow their stongest asset, their employees, the opportunity to spend the holiday as they see fit. Hopefully enjoying it with their families.

If I owned a business, I would be all over this. Pre-Thanksgiving, I'd create and market my own Black Wednesday. Watch the others copy and follow suit.


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## heathpack (Nov 25, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> One thing (among many)that basically sucks about being a long-haul trucker is that there are NO holidays. If you're under a load, you roll. If not, you don't. When a holiday comes along, the BEST you can hope for is a day off without pay. It goes downhill from there. There IS no overtime. Over 30some years I worked a LOT of holidays, and with the family, took them when we could- not when the calendar said we should.
> 
> Jim



Lol, Jim, we do this too.  Essentially every job I've ever worked has been in a place that is open 24/7 (there have been a few exceptions for temporary jobs).  Now it is normal to me to simply "reschedule" a holiday- last year I even rescheduled my own birthday!

Totally different I know if its a big family gathering like Thanksgiving.  But its funny to hear that other celebrate on days other than the holiday, too.

H


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## cgeidl (Nov 25, 2013)

*If all volunteer work force it is okay with me.*

If no one is forced to work and there are willing workers and shoppers it's fine with me. Requiring employees to work is not okay. My grandson used to volunteer at a grocery and got more than double pay and more workers wanted the higher pay than needed.


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## rleigh (Nov 25, 2013)

I can understand why so many have a problem with it.

If any society is going to function successfully there will be agreed-upon boundaries; unspoken rules; cultural norms.

Norms are always changing and when they change it's quite a shock. (If it's an unacceptable change then people will fight back. Sometimes they win and sometimes they lose.)

There's a feeling that we've crossed a line and there is no going back. The term "is nothing sacred" comes to mind but in reality, no, nothing is sacred.

FWIW I'm on the fence. I was more upset and shocked about the expansion of Daylight Savings Time but no one else seemed to care about that.  :annoyed:  That still rubs me the wrong way...it's just not natural...it's man trying to control time...and nature....but I digress.


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## Clemson Fan (Nov 26, 2013)

rleigh said:


> If any society is going to function successfully there will be agreed-upon boundaries; unspoken rules; cultural norms.



You must be a baseball fan!


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## Clemson Fan (Nov 26, 2013)

I personally don't understand the angst people have over this. 

If this was an actual religious holiday of some sort and stores and companies were legally mandated in some way by the government that they must be closed, my bet is that many people on this board would be having a 180 degree reaction.


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## Clemson Fan (Nov 26, 2013)

Passepartout said:


> A very good point. Here's a report on the almost inhumane working conditions at Amazon warehouses. No talking, confiscation of cell phones, times bathroom breaks. It makes "The High Cost of Low Prices" (Wal Mart) seem like a great place to work. Check this and think about it along with your Prime Account. http://www.channel4.com/news/anger-at-amazon-working-conditions
> 
> Jim



I find it humorous when boycottaholics have stuff like this pointed out to them.


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## geekette (Nov 26, 2013)

Clemson Fan said:


> I personally don't understand the angst people have over this.
> 
> If this was an actual religious holiday of some sort and stores and companies were legally mandated in some way by the government that they must be closed, my bet is that many people on this board would be having a 180 degree reaction.



Yeah, almost seems a bit hypocritical that many stores are open on other federal holidays and no one complains.  I have never understood why mattress firms have sales on every major holiday weekend, but, whatever ...

It doesn't bother me one way or another.  I'm not a big shopper, would never set an alarm clock/miss sleep to go shopping, and would never create a traditional shopping event for myself.  Clearly this Isn't For Me, so if others enjoy it, groovy for them, I'll stay outa your way.  

I don't consider Thanksgiving to be the kickoff of the holiday season, feel no obligation to buy anyone anything nor buy endless decorations or buy stuff just because it's on sale.  I do believe I am fortunate to not have That Shopping Gene.  I have the lack of new clothes, few pairs of shoes to prove it.

The only thing that bothers me is the violence.  In that regard, I would prefer opening on Thurs vs sleep deprived masses trash talking all night until the opening mad rush/stampede/punch out fest.  

I will , however, be one of the few at the mall on Christmas Eve, whether or not I'm done shopping.  On that day, I can generally find very few people and most are cheerful (some are frantic).  I enjoy it for the peaceful cheer but don't always buy stuff.  It's my own tradition that I will cancel in an instant if inclement weather or other plans with family.


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## Quadmaniac (Nov 26, 2013)

I find this thread pretty funny after reading the first page. Everyone can boycott as much as they want, but the fact still remains, these stores would not open if it was not economical for them. It is pretty obvious that there is enough demand to make it profitable for them to open on these days. Right or wrong, these are business decisions made by business people and no matter how distasteful it is, I don't think it will change much.

If everyone stayed home with their families on holidays like this, we wouldn't have this issue at all, but unfortunately, the traditions are definitely not what they used to be. I personally never see the need to go shopping on holidays but there definitely are some who do....


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## Ken555 (Nov 27, 2013)

Speaking of Thanksgiving...



> With many stores staying open during Thanksgiving this year thereby forcing workers to miss out on spending the holiday with their families, one store manager decided to take a stand on behalf of his employees — and was promptly terminated.



http://gawker.com/pizza-hut-gm-fired-for-refusing-to-make-employees-work-1472531075


Sent from my iPad


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## Tia (Nov 27, 2013)

Ken555 said:


> Speaking of Thanksgiving...
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Hope he gets his job back , it's not like pizza is a vital service that needs to be there for emergencies.


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## Ridewithme38 (Nov 27, 2013)

Tia said:


> it's not like pizza is a vital service that needs to be there for emergencies.



Being from NY and a single guy, i have to strongly disagree with this statement.


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## jlr10 (Nov 27, 2013)

Originally Posted by Tia  :
it's not like pizza is a vital service that needs to be there for emergencies.



Ridewithme38 said:


> Being from NY and a single guy, i have to strongly disagree with this statement.



:rofl:  We always had pizza on Christmas eve when I was growing up.  If it weren't for pizza we would only have had the broken Christmas cookies for dinner.  Seemed like an emergency at the time!


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## talkamotta (Nov 28, 2013)

*I never have shopped on Thanksgiving.  I was too busy making dinner*.  Now that my kids are grown and have families of thier own, in laws, also I have an ex husband and I am now engaged to another person with his family to consider.   The family situation has changed greatly. 

My 2 soon to be stepdaughters  work for Walmart and Shopko so we will have dinner for that side of the family on Sunday.  With my family we are more spread out,   my children's in laws and my  daughter is a nurse so of course she works Thanksgiving Im having my family on Saturday.  

I think the Christmas Season has gone too far off the mark.  Even if you dont have strong religous beliefs the holidays should be family time.  Even if its not on that holiday.  *We arent going to change the commercialism but I choose not to shop on holidays.*  I dont shop black Friday either.


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## csxjohn (Nov 28, 2013)

He made a stand and knew the consequences.

He worked for his bosses.  He did not work for his employees.

I think it's admirable that he thought the decision to open was wrong but in he end he is not the one in a position to make that decision.

If he continues to  blatantly disobey his future superiors he will be doing a lot of job changes throughout his career.


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## falmouth3 (Nov 28, 2013)

csxjohn said:


> He made a stand and knew the consequences.
> 
> He worked for his bosses.  He did not work for his employees.
> 
> ...



I heard on the news this morning that the company reconsidered, decided they used bad judgement, and offered him his job back.


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## Clemson Fan (Nov 28, 2013)

I'm off to work seeing my patients.  I hope they don't boycott me! 

Wherever you may be and whatever you may be doing, Happy Thanksgiving Everyone!


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## dioxide45 (Nov 29, 2013)

The way I see it, there is only a certain amount of money to go around. Opening a day earlier probably really won't turn in to more profits, just that the money is spent on a different day. I have heard a lot of reports this year where the malls and shopping centers were not as busy on Friday as in years past. It is because people went out and shopped on Thursday instead. 

The stores say they are opening because the customers want them to. I don't think that is the case. If they all opened at 6:00am on Thanksgiving Day, the people would still line up thinking they will miss out on a deal. It doesn't matter when they open, the people will be there.

I think with the short holiday shopping season this year, it is going to really hurt retail. It isn't going to be a pretty year of holiday spending and growth. They are going to have to cut and offer sales in order to get people in to the stores, and that just means the people will not shop at some other store. This year IMO will be what either makes or breaks Sears/KMart. I think it is more likely that it will break them. The one huge institution will go by the wayside, just like Eaton's in Canada did a while back.


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## csxjohn (Nov 30, 2013)

I agree to a point that everyone only has so much money to spend while shopping for gifts but I see two things here.

If I can entice people to come to my store before they walk into your store I have a good chance of getting some of that money that may have made it's way into your pocket.

I no longer buy the "short shopping season."  We saw Christmas items and decorations in the stores back in Sept right after the school supplies were taken off the shelves.

When the stores waited until after Thanksgiving to put the stuff out the number of days between T day and Christmas made a difference.

I think black Friday is dead or just hanging on.  Many retailers are having their sales on line before Thanksgiving and I predict that some super deals will start showing up before T day in the future.

We went out Friday morning to the Ace hardware store because of a sale they had on jump starters, regular $40, on sale for $30 and with the rewards card $20 with a limited supply starting at 7AM.  I needed 3 of them so to get up an hour earlier than normal I saved  $30 to $60 depending on how you figure it.

There was one couple ahead of us, had there been a long line up I would not have bothered.

While driving to breakfast I did not see a lot of cars at Big Lots, K Mart or any other stores we passed.  There may have all been at WalMart but they started the super deals Thursday afternoon.


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## Phydeaux (Nov 30, 2013)

I wonder how many more years the big box stores have until they go the way of 8 track tapes and Blockbuster. 

Go Amazon!


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## dioxide45 (Nov 30, 2013)

I did go in to Walmart on Black Friday. Though not for any of the deals, just for some every day items. This was around noon and the store didn't seem any busier than most other days. Their isles were still full of skids with some of their doorbuster items. Either they over ordered, or the demand just wasn't there.


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## dougp26364 (Nov 30, 2013)

Personally, I'm against the stores being open on Thanksgiving or Christmas Day. In today's society we get little enough time with our family as it is. 

Judging by the parking lots, thanksgiving sales around here was a big hit. I believe they'll become a permanent part of the shopping holiday season. 

Stores seem to be better at crowd control. I'm not reading as many police reports this year. 

My ex-wife managed a Pizza Inn back in the 80's. I was amazed at the business they would do that night. It was one of the busiest nights of the year. 

We don't do holiday stampede sales. I have more friends that do them than friends that don't. I can exercise my right to stay home. I suppose others can exercise their right to shop. When everybody has to work on thanksgiving then there won't be anyone to shop. Where I work, Black Friday is now considered a holiday amongst employees and we keep track of who worked it this year and hey have preference to have it off next year. Go figure.


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## dioxide45 (Nov 30, 2013)

dougp26364 said:


> Personally, I'm against the stores being open on Thanksgiving or Christmas Day. In today's society we get little enough time with our family as it is.
> 
> Judging by the parking lots, thanksgiving sales around here was a big hit. I believe they'll become a permanent part of the shopping holiday season.



While Thanksgiving Day sales may be a hit, all the stores are really doing is shifting the crush of bargain hunters from early Friday morning to Thursday night instead. From what I see, Black Friday numbers may be down. Kind of like a hangover, have a big bang the night before but then not as many people bother to get up the next morning.

Perhaps opening on Thanksgiving helps with the crowd control. There are the population of people that won't go out and shop that day and wait until Friday morning. So the crowds on either day are not too out of control.


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## pedro47 (Nov 30, 2013)

We do not and will not shop on Thanksgiving Day or Black Friday.  My dollars stays in my wallet.


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## LannyPC (Nov 26, 2014)

pedro47 said:


> We do not and will not shop on Thanksgiving Day or Black Friday.  My dollars stays in my wallet.



So what's everybody's shopping plans this Thanksgiving and Black Friday?

JFTR, for me, it's business as usual seeing that Thanksgiving is observed here on the second Monday of October.  Yes, some Canadian retailers are having Black Friday sales but there is nothing we really need right now that are available in these sales.


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## csxjohn (Nov 26, 2014)

LannyPC said:


> So what's everybody's shopping plans this Thanksgiving and Black Friday?
> 
> JFTR, for me, it's business as usual seeing that Thanksgiving is observed here on the second Monday of October.  Yes, some Canadian retailers are having Black Friday sales but there is nothing we really need right now that are available in these sales.



How do you expect to grow your economy if you don't buy things you don't need and put them on a credit card?:hysterical:


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## PigsDad (Nov 26, 2014)

My plans?  Stay at home and enjoy the day off from work.  Same as what I do every year.  I really don't understand all the hype -- most of the loss-leader / doorbuster stuff is off-brand crap that no one really needs.  I can find most anything else online at similar prices.

Kurt


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## LannyPC (Nov 26, 2014)

PigsDad said:


> My plans?  Stay at home and enjoy the day off from work.  Same as what I do every year.  I really don't understand all the hype -- most of the loss-leader / doorbuster stuff is off-brand crap that no one really needs.  I can find most anything else online at similar prices.



Kind of like the Boxing Day sales we have here.


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## Zac495 (Nov 26, 2014)

My poor husband lost his good HR job and is working Best Buy part time to supplement unemployment. They are making him work 40 hours including Thanksgiving- so he's working for free in order to keep his job. I will miss him.


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## Fern Modena (Nov 27, 2014)

I understand that you'll miss him. But I really don't think they are making him work Thanksgiving for free. I believe if he wants to keep his job that he has to work Thanksgiving, yes. But FOR FREE? Not a chance.

Fern



Zac495 said:


> My poor husband lost his good HR job and is working Best Buy part time to supplement unemployment. They are making him work 40 hours including Thanksgiving- so he's working for free in order to keep his job. I will miss him.


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## Fern Modena (Nov 27, 2014)

*Working Thanksgiving*

When I was a child, oh so many years ago, stores weren't open on Thanksgiving. Or Sunday's. Or nights. But times change, and people's lifestyles change.

I worked for a transit agency for 27 years. I worked every Easter, Thanksgiving and Christmas. If I wewe willing to sell my soul for the devil I could have had holidays off, but I would have had to work a less desirable shift year round, something I wasn't willing to do.

I knew that it was expected of me, and they did pay me extra for the holiday, which I expect most, if not all, companies do.

As far as family dinner, when Jerry also was working, my MIL cooked, and they held dinner for us.

Fern


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## Clemson Fan (Nov 27, 2014)

Clemson Fan said:


> I'm off to work seeing my patients.  I hope they don't boycott me!
> 
> Wherever you may be and whatever you may be doing, Happy Thanksgiving Everyone!



Same thing for me this year!  I'll be working a minimum of 4 hours tomorrow and I'm on call to boot, so it may be worse then that depending on what comes through the ER.


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## Clemson Fan (Nov 27, 2014)

Fern Modena said:


> When I was a child, oh so many years ago, stores weren't open on Thanksgiving. Or Sunday's. Or nights. But times change, and people's lifestyles change.
> 
> I worked for a transit agency for 27 years. I worked every Easter, Thanksgiving and Christmas. If I wewe willing to sell my soul for the devil I could have had holidays off, but I would have had to work a less desirable shift year round, something I wasn't willing to do.
> 
> ...



Fern, I really enjoy your well thought out and wise posts!  You're a real treasure here on TUG!


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## Clemson Fan (Nov 27, 2014)

When I'm working tomorrow I'll give thanks that I won the birth lottery and was born in the country with the best economy and wonderful freedoms that allow me to work and support my wonderful family!  I'll still get time to spend with them tomorrow.  It's all good!

Happy Thanksgiving!

Go Seahawks!


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## pgnewarkboy (Nov 27, 2014)

Happy thanksgiving to all Tuggers!  Enjoy the holiday and be thankful as you see fit.

The holiday of Thanksgiving is historically a time where people from different cultures and families (indigenous tribes of north America and European families) came together to give thanks to God for the bounty of this land and the friendships that helped them survive harsh times.  It was a religious holiday.  During the day of thanksgiving the only work that was done was the work to prepare the feast.  On thanksgiving we are historically and essentially thankful to God.  When one thanks God, one is not concerned with anything except spiritual matters. 

Our commercial society has changed that around.  Many today are forced to work on this holiday or lose their job. Celebrating and thanking God for what we have doesn't enter the equation.  We must work and do what we must do to keep our jobs.  This wasn't necessary even 5 years ago.  Only recently have the big chains required people to work so the executives and shareholders can make an extra few bucks.  This denial of peoples right to commune with God and their families in the fullest manner (not a few hours late)  is cynical, cheap, and disgusting in my opinion.  It is a denial of their workers humanity at the deepest level.  Work or be fired!  I will never shop at a store that is open on Thanksgiving.  There is no deal that is good enough to make me support their horrendous actions.


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## bogey21 (Nov 27, 2014)

If the stores were smart they would make working on Thanksgiving voluntary and pay those who work double time (I think some do).  They should then post a sign saying "Everyone working today is a volunteer and is being paid double time".  Would be great public relations.

George


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## Sugarcubesea (Nov 27, 2014)

csxjohn said:


> He made a stand and knew the consequences.
> 
> He worked for his bosses.  He did not work for his employees.
> 
> ...




So many individuals do not understand that simple statement "You work for your bosses.  You do not work for your employees.


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## LannyPC (Nov 27, 2014)

Sugarcubesea said:


> So many individuals do not understand that simple statement "You work for your bosses.  You do not work for your employees.



That is true but there is the flip side of the coin.

Employers, supervisors, etc., need to keep their employees happy.  It's not good for business when employees come to work in a foul mood.  I know it's not an excuse, but if they are in a foul mood because they were "forced" to come in to work at an undesirable time, they might be easily irritable and take their frustrations out on a customer who happens to be, shall we say "hard to please".

As well, happy employees tend to stay longer at their employment whereas unhappy ones quit.  This causes high employee turnover.  Many supervisors and bean counters will tell you that high employee turnover is not good and very costly.  There is the process of constantly recruiting and training new employees.

Of course, I'm not saying "Kiss your employees' a***s and let them dictate when they work", but I'm just saying that keeping employees happy can go a long way.


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## pgnewarkboy (Nov 27, 2014)

LannyPC said:


> That is true but there is the flip side of the coin.
> 
> Employers, supervisors, etc., need to keep their employees happy.  It's not good for business when employees come to work in a foul mood.  I know it's not an excuse, but if they are in a foul mood because they were "forced" to come in to work at an undesirable time, they might be easily irritable and take their frustrations out on a customer who happens to be, shall we say "hard to please".
> 
> ...



I think employees need to be treated with compassion.  We are all human beings.  Employees are not robots or tools.  It is in my view immoral to treat employees poorly.  That includes paying them poorly, poor working conditions, threatening , harassing etc. etc.   Large corporations, meaning the executives and shareholders that own them often treat employees as if they are not human beings.  Increased profits and bonuses is not an excuse for immoral behavior.


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## tschwa2 (Nov 27, 2014)

As a person who works retail during the holidays, for the most part I don't mind it and know it is expected.  That being said, I think it is getting ridiculous.  Stores opening at 8pm on Thanksgiving is nicer than ones opening up at 2am or 4am a few years back.  You can still enjoy a family day and then go to work or if you don't work -shop.  I think opening early not only makes it a little more difficult for employees -  again not SO bad that I have to be there at 5:30 for a 6pm opening.  It is really bad for those who are looking for the limited quantity bargains.   They need to be in line sometime between 2-4pm at the latest for a 6 pm opening.   They are the ones that are really losing out on the family time.


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