# New Marriott point system good or bad



## boompole (Aug 19, 2010)

We just did a presentaion at Marriott on Kauai. Based on the new System each point is $9.20 and you have to buy min. of 1500. and then in blocks of 250.
We need 4100+ points to get a week a year on Hawaii.

We bought 2250 which would get us Hawaii EOY.
and MF will be around $900 year. Plus $165 EY for changes

Is anyone here buying into this? is it any good? Or is it too new

Thanks for you help!!


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## Pens_Fan (Aug 19, 2010)

You can rent a week through Redweek for less than what you will be paying for maintenance fees and charges for those points.

(900+165)*2=$2130 for the 2250 points that you bought over two years.

Most of the rentals on Redweek are ranging from $1500 to $2000 per week to rent.  Granted, this does not get you the high demand weeks, but neither will 4100 ponts.

Plus you don't have to buy the 2250 points for $20,700 either.

I would rescind if you still have time, but that is your choice.


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## pipet (Aug 19, 2010)

Your 4500 pts will cost 1065 annually, or 2130 every 2 years. 

What times of the year do you plan to travel?  How would renting compare?

I honestly think that's pretty expensive just in the maintenance fees alone, and that is not considering you had to pay 20700!

However, if you need the flexibility of the points system, there is no other way for you to buy in the system... (there is no point resale market yet)

If you just want to go to Hawaii every other year, have you considered buying a resale week? There are ads here on TUG and of course there is ebay, redweek, etc.  Search some completed listings on ebay, and you will see you can buy an every other year for less than half what you paid.  

If you buy a resale week now, you are NOT eligible to convert your week to points.  However, the maintenance fees, even for Hawaii weeks, will be less, so both your initial investment cost and your annual maintenance cost will be less (most are 1500-1700 for every year, half that for every other). You can also buy somewhere else (with cheaper cost & fees) to trade into Hawaii, but no one knows how the future of trades will be affected by the new points system, so if you truly want Hawaii, buy there.


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## dioxide45 (Aug 19, 2010)

boompole said:


> We just did a presentaion at Marriott on Kauai. Based on the new System each point is $9.20 and you have to buy min. of 1500. and then in blocks of 250.



What? I thought the price was supposed to go up to $10/point on July 1, no I think it was Aug 1, or August 18?


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## billymach4 (Aug 19, 2010)

*Rescind immediately!*



boompole said:


> We just did a presentaion at Marriott on Kauai. Based on the new System each point is $9.20 and you have to buy min. of 1500. and then in blocks of 250.
> We need 4100+ points to get a week a year on Hawaii.
> 
> We bought 2250 which would get us Hawaii EOY.
> ...



So you paid about $21,000 for an EOY. Not your fault but Marriott is ripping you off. 


My advice is to rescind immediately and purchase resale. You will get an eoy or an annual unit for at least %75 less than $21,000.


Thanks,

Bill


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## GregT (Aug 19, 2010)

boompole said:


> We just did a presentaion at Marriott on Kauai. Based on the new System each point is $9.20 and you have to buy min. of 1500. and then in blocks of 250.
> We need 4100+ points to get a week a year on Hawaii.
> 
> We bought 2250 which would get us Hawaii EOY.
> ...



Boom,

You've gotten some good feedback already.

I echo the comments about renting -- one of the intriguing (in not a good way) things about purchasing points is that you're basically paying the cost of renting the property in the MFs, there really isn't a discount.   Most properties I track, you could rent the week directly from the owner via redweek.com for the same amount you would pay to Marriott in MFs to reserve the week (and save yourself the up-front points cost).

I just did a very cursory search of redweek.com and found a 1BR Ocean-View in February for $1,450 -- and February is a prime travel time for Ko Olina.  There was a 1BR Mountain View in July for $1,600 (also at Ko Olina).  And these are the asking rental prices (to be negotiated), and there is often comparable availability.  2BR's tend to range from $1,800 - $3,000 and are widely available.

Now, renting is a pain -- but effectively, buying points simply means that you're buying the right to then rent the unit at its market rent (from an owner), versus at a discount.  It's hard to justify that reservations with new points = reduced cost of vacation accomodations, but there is a convenience factor from owning points (and ownership itself is kind of cool).

However, Marriott properties are among the finest in the timeshare world and we love them.  We are all still studying the new system and there are things that we really like about it (flexibility, ability to rent points from others, visibility on points requirements in different properties, ability to book view category you want) and there are things we don't like (high purchase price and high MFs for new points purchasers, uncertainty about availability of inventory, and points reductions (ie skim) for people who own weeks already and are joining -- which doesn't impact you).

So, I believe you can get to the Marriott properties on Hawaii much more cost effectively with other approaches (renting, buying a resale timeshare for use or trade) but with those approaches comes some effort and risk of not getting exactly what you want.   

Good luck to you in your analysis!!

All the best,

Greg


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## jlr10 (Aug 19, 2010)

If you goal is to go to Hawaii, rescind and purchase a week in Hawaii on the resale market. EOYs can be purchased for less and half what you paid for points.  

Will you be able to trade into other Marriotts in the future?  No one really knows for sure. But Hawaii weeks are strong traders should you want a nice week in a non-Marriott resort should Marriott availablity dry up outside of points.

If you goal is to have the flexability of points I cannot comment as I think it is too expensive for us, so couldn't recommend it for anyone else.


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## puckmanfl (Aug 19, 2010)

good morning

please keep in mind that as a new purchaser of points (BI), one is NOT guaranteed Hawaii or any other destination!!.  It depends on trust availability and inventory in the "Exchange " company.  

Owning a deeded week (only available resale) does guarantee occupancy in season purchased at resort purchased


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## pwrshift (Aug 19, 2010)

I suggest you rescind too. If HI is where you want to go, you can still buy a resale deed that guarantees you space in a particular resort.

Take a look at some recent HI prices on Ebay and consider just what you have to pay in point costs and maintenance fees. The only negative is that you can't (yet) become a member in the club but if you buy where you want to go the club isn't the way IMO:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140440659371&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

This one sold for $6300

http://cgi.ebay.com/Marriotts-Waiohai-Beach-Club-Kauai-Hawaii-Timeshare-/220644932949?pt=Timeshares

Here are some other recent sales on Ebay ... scroll down the listings to see the details...

http://cgi.ebay.com/FIVE-STAR-Marri...NA-Timeshare-DEED-/110570183924?pt=Timeshares

http://cgi.ebay.com/Marriott-Waiohai-Beach-Club-Timeshare-Kauai-Hawaii-/180543171237?pt=Timeshares

http://cgi.ebay.com/Marriott-Waioha...Bedroom-Timeshare-/140433162162?pt=Timeshares


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## thinze3 (Aug 19, 2010)

Also, as an owner in Hawaii and one who has read all the DC charts carefully, you will be greatly limited on what you can get in Hawaii for 4500 pts.

For instance, a Waiohai island view during the month of July costs 4850 points for 7 nights, while in September it only costs 4225. So unless you want to go in September, you will need more points.

In general KoOlina is a tad bit lower - July 4575 and Sept 4050.


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## DanCali (Aug 19, 2010)

As others pointed out, leaving the merits of the system aside, the new system is expensive. In most places, you can rent for approximately the cost of MFs of new points without having to pay a large upfront sum to buy points. An example outside Hawaii - NCV peak summer weeks are 4725 points to reserve - that's $1900 in MFs... you can rent any summer week you want on RedWeek for approximately $2000-$2200, without paying $47K upfront. In fact, you could leave those $47K in a 3 year CD and earn an extra ~$1000 a year (at today's rates), making renting less expensive than buying by a large margin... (consider this the "opportunity cost")

Another thing, which was probably not discussed in your sales presentation unless you brought it up, is that Marriott is placing restrictions on any subsequent buyer of your points when you go to sell them on the resale market. As such, your points will be worth even less both because (i) resale prices are more reflective of the "true" value and (ii) you cannot sell the same product you bought. So, unless you rescind, you will likely lose 50% of you investment in 4-5 days... and that paper loss is just as real as a realized loss -  that money is not coming back.


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## larryallen (Aug 19, 2010)

*Me too....*

I did a sales presentation today but am just not swayed by it. Renting is just too cheap right now. I wanted 6,500 points so I could get to Maui, or similar, every year. The deal ("only until September 8th") is $9.20 a point instead of $10/point.  Fees are 40 cents per point per year so another $2,600 a year. They try to sweeten the pot but the math still doesn't get close to working. Shoot, I just rented a 3 bedroom at Ko Olina for $2,400... cheaper than the fees would be if I bought!

Cost to buy the points $60,000 versus $30,000 to buy a week on Redweek.
Through Marriott you get 6,800 "bonus points" so that's worth about $3,000
You also can buy with your Marriott credit card so that's $60k x 5 points=300,000 points which is worth another $3,000 or so.

Beyond that though I am still looking at $54,000 net "cost" versus $30k for a resale. I just don't think it's worth it.  They need to sweeten that deal a lot more!


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## DanCali (Aug 19, 2010)

larryallen said:


> I did a sales presentation today but am just not swayed by it. Renting is just too cheap right now. I wanted 6,500 points so I could get to Maui, or similar, every year. The deal ("only until September 8th") is $9.20 a point instead of $10/point.  Fees are 40 cents per point per year so another $2,600 a year. They try to sweeten the pot but the math still doesn't get close to working. Shoot, I just rented a 3 bedroom at Ko Olina for $2,400... cheaper than the fees would be if I bought!
> 
> Cost to buy the points $60,000 versus $30,000 to buy a week on Redweek.
> Through Marriott you get 6,800 "bonus points" so that's worth about $3,000
> ...



And don't forget that whatever you buy resale you can resell a month later for about the same price. Not so with a developer purchase, where you'd incur a loss of 50%+ almost immediately.

P.S. "Resale prices" on Redweek are just asking prices...


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## larryallen (Aug 19, 2010)

*re-sales...*

_P.S. "Resale prices" on Redweek are just asking prices..._

I have been making some offers in line with prices reported on the ROFR page but no luck yet.


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## DanCali (Aug 19, 2010)

larryallen said:


> _P.S. "Resale prices" on Redweek are just asking prices..._
> 
> I have been making some offers in line with prices reported on the ROFR page but no luck yet.



ROFR hasn't been exercised actively for a very long time by Marriott. You are pretty safe on that front even if you paid much less than what is in that database.

eBay generally has lower prices than RedWeek. Some sellers are shady and I never felt comfortable buying timeshares there, but it's a good place to gauge the bottom end of selling prices. You'll find Ko Olina weeks there for much less than $30K... (this one ends in 20 hours: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370419641353).


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## CatJ114683 (Aug 19, 2010)

This seems like a good string to post our recent "Discover the Marriott Point Systems meeting" that we attended just last week while on vaca. We were among maybe 15 other couples attending this meeting.   The presenter gave the spiel, and while a strong presenter, was no match for the questions and comments that came from the group.  One of the points (no pun intended) that she made for pro-points was that Marriott would not be handing over any vacant units to Interval, as they were all going into a land trust, so trading would be effectively short-stopped.  Someone brought up the fact that weeks purchased independently of the Marriott were not eligible to play the point game, and those units would either be rented on Red Week etc.  Her comeback was that most Marriott properties were not being purchased "black market" as she called it. That created quite a buzz in the room, because apparently almost everyone there had not purchased through Marriott, but through resellers.  She openly admitted that the program was a 'better' option for multiple week owners who wanted to take 2 lower-end properties and turn them into a fabulous week at a high end property.  Same stuff we have all heard before.  All in all, Marriott came off as being pompous and self serving, totally going back on the sales goop they dished out for the past 10-20 years..  (Oh a lock off is the best.. divide it up and get 2 weeks vacation for the price of 1!!!)  One fellow asked if this program was so great, why didn't they just give the point value to the legacy customers instead of making them purchase the points?  Well, someone has to pay for the fancy new reservation equipment, staff training etc. etc. not to mention the biggest elephant in the whole system, the new resort at Marco Island.  The meeting left everyone quite aggravated and I think I saw the presenter sweating.


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## thinze3 (Aug 19, 2010)

Will Marriott let you buy DC points on the resale market?


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## larryallen (Aug 19, 2010)

*Ebay, etc....*

_eBay generally has lower prices than RedWeek. Some sellers are shady and I never felt comfortable buying timeshares there, but it's a good place to gauge the bottom end of selling prices. You'll find Ko Olina weeks there for much less than $30K... (this one ends in 20 hours: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...=370419641353)._


Yes, but I am looking for the 3 bedroom. The last annual on the ROFR page went for $24k but that was a few years ago so I figure it should go for sub $20k now. I am patient.


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## jlee2070 (Aug 19, 2010)

I think one little nasty not mentioned here (or maybe it has been) is that if you purchase as resale week (after the system was introduced), you are NOT able to convert them to the DC Points system.  This may or may not matter to you but if the goal is to have the "flexibility" of the DC Points System, resale won't get you there...  You will have to stay within the Weeks Systems and trade via II (or perhaps RCI) to go to a different resort...

Somebody with more knowledge can confirm or correct my statements...


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## larryallen (Aug 19, 2010)

_I think one little nasty not mentioned here (or maybe it has been) is that if you purchase as resale week (after the system was introduced), you are NOT able to convert them to the DC Points system. This may or may not matter to you but if the goal is to have the "flexibility" of the DC Points System, resale won't get you there... You will have to stay within the Weeks Systems and trade via II (or perhaps RCI) to go to a different resort...

Somebody with more knowledge can confirm or correct my statements..._

I think you are exactly right.  The question becomes how much is that point system really worth?  I do not know the "answer" and perhaps it's different for different people but at current prices it's a pretty huge price to pay to be part of the system.


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## pwrshift (Aug 19, 2010)

It is pure speculation to state what Marriott will do or not do about resale weeks purchased after the new plan announcement date.  If the new plan fails as many expect, you'll probably see Marriott anxious to get weeks into the system regardless of previous 'rules'.  Count on it, there will be exceptions made at some future date.

Only thing for sure right now is that there are some incredible Ebay deals out there now and if it's a resort you want to use, who cares about a more costly new plan that might not be used.

Brian


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## kk0 (Aug 19, 2010)

*rescind if possible*



boompole said:


> We just did a presentaion at Marriott on Kauai. Based on the new System each point is $9.20 and you have to buy min. of 1500. and then in blocks of 250.
> We need 4100+ points to get a week a year on Hawaii.
> 
> We bought 2250 which would get us Hawaii EOY.
> ...



Please do extensive research on the internet before you commit.
Excellent advice from TUGgers.
Good luck.


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## larryallen (Aug 20, 2010)

*Are others buying?*

I would be curious if other people are buying in the new system?  It seems Marriott needs to bring the price down a tad.


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## DanCali (Aug 20, 2010)

larryallen said:


> I would be curious if other people are buying in the new system?  It seems Marriott needs to bring the price down a tad.



Not enrolling or buying. 

The fact of the matter is that the points "system" is just an exchange company. It offers the "benefit" of short exchanges in exchange for various fees, but it hardly resembles a "true" points system like the ones offered by Starwood, Hilton or Hyatt for example. 

Moreover, the enrollment fee of $2000/$1500 and even $600 seems a bit outlandish to pay just to join an exchange company, no? If II, RCI or SFX charged you $2K to enroll and then annual and exchange fees on top of that how would you react then? The fact that it's Marriott charging these prices should make that reaction no different... Oh, and you don't get a "request first" option after paying all those fees too 

Enrolling is expensive... buying is expensive... and the benefits relative to week for week exchanges are just not that valuable to me. If I wanted to a true points system, I'd look at other options.


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## scrapngen (Aug 20, 2010)

boompole said:


> We just did a presentaion at Marriott on Kauai. Based on the new System each point is $9.20 and you have to buy min. of 1500. and then in blocks of 250.
> We need 4100+ points to get a week a year on Hawaii.
> 
> We bought 2250 which would get us Hawaii EOY.
> ...



Strongly suggest you rescind and do some research into the new point system vs. weeks for Marriott. Remember, in addition to all that has been stated above, if you buy points from Marriott, you have no home resort. There is no preference of a particular resort regardless of how many points you buy. Therefore, your desire to get to Hawaii is limited by the points you have and the available resorts for the time you wish to go. 

I would agree that if HI is your preferred destination, you'd be better off buying a resale week. Your maintenance fees will be less than the new point system (even in Maui with their taxes) and your TS will trade well to any other location you wish to visit.


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## billymach4 (Aug 20, 2010)

larryallen said:


> I would be curious if other people are buying in the new system?  It seems Marriott needs to bring the price down a tad.



Not a buyer!


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## Herb33 (Aug 20, 2010)

If I did not already own Marriott weeks (purchased directly from Marriott) ... or if cost was my overriding concern ... I would not buy into this new program as it is currently being presented.


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## brianc936 (Aug 20, 2010)

In July, my family purchased 4,000 points through the new Marriott points program. This was our first venture into time share ownership. We did not find this website until after the rescission period had passed however I am not sure I would have rescinded. Yes, we agreed $36,000 buy-in is very expensive… but we feel it has been worth it for the following reasons:

1.	We view it as a pre-paid vacation package which will force our family to take regular vacations. We have taken Marriott vacations using Red Week etc. in the past and have gotten some good deals but have missed some vacations when we decided to cut back or spend the money in other areas. We had the up front money this year and family vacation time is a top priority so we decided to splurge.  
2.	Flexibility- we used our first points to book two-  3 day trips to Branson and a  3 day trip to Williamsburg this fall/winter. Then a 6 day trip to Palm Beach for Spring Break 2011. We still have our 5300 one-time bonus points for a trip to Hawaii later in 2011. We wanted to own Marriott,  but if we bought a couple of resale weeks when were ready to purchase(after June 20th), we would not have had this type of flexibility. We do no want to return to the same place every year and do not need to stay for exactly 7 days.
3.	 Flexibility = Cost Savings- With 5-7 of us traveling we can save an average $1000/year on flights by being flexible traveling mid week or off peak.
4.	At 40 years old, we will be taking vacations for at least 25 more years (hopefully more), wanted to be a Marriott owner, and felt like as a totally new owner the point system was they way Marriott was heading and wanted to get into the new program on the ground floor at hopefully the cheapest prices.

Bottom line- probably not a great financial move but given the intangibles listed above we felt it was the right decision for our family.


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## winger (Aug 20, 2010)

brianc936 said:


> In July, my family purchased 4,000 points through the new Marriott points program. This was our first venture into time share ownership. We did not find this website until after the rescission period had passed however I am not sure I would have rescinded. Yes, we agreed $36,000 buy-in is very expensive… but we feel it has been worth it for the following reasons:
> 
> 1.	We view it as a pre-paid vacation package which will force our family to take regular vacations. We have taken Marriott vacations using Red Week etc. in the past and have gotten some good deals but have missed some vacations when we decided to cut back or spend the money in other areas. We had the up front money this year and family vacation time is a top priority so we decided to splurge.
> 2.	Flexibility- we used our first points to book two-  3 day trips to Branson and a  3 day trip to Williamsburg this fall/winter. Then a 6 day trip to Palm Beach for Spring Break 2011. We still have our 5300 one-time bonus points for a trip to Hawaii later in 2011. We wanted to own Marriott,  but if we bought a couple of resale weeks when were ready to purchase(after June 20th), we would not have had this type of flexibility. We do no want to return to the same place every year and do not need to stay for exactly 7 days.
> ...


Welcome to TUG and Marriott.

40 years old - you should have another 40 years of enjoyment !


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## jlee2070 (Aug 20, 2010)

pwrshift said:


> It is pure speculation to state what Marriott will do or not do about resale weeks purchased after the new plan announcement date.  If the new plan fails as many expect, you'll probably see Marriott anxious to get weeks into the system regardless of previous 'rules'.  Count on it, there will be exceptions made at some future date.
> 
> Only thing for sure right now is that there are some incredible Ebay deals out there now and if it's a resort you want to use, who cares about a more costly new plan that might not be used.
> 
> Brian



It is NOT speculation but is how it stands TODAY. You are NOT able to convert a Marriott resale purchased after the inception of the DC to the system...  Maybe later things will change but this IS how it is NOW.


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## classiclincoln (Aug 20, 2010)

A few things just popped into my head after reading this (and all the other Marriott DC points threads).

Marriott has changed it's sales approach.  For new people, it will take longer to recover their cost of purchased.  (see my other post about recouping my cost of my deeded weeks).  Not as good as deeded weeks, but it is what it is.

Does it make sense for Legacy owners to buy into the new program?  Probably not.

If eventually, Marriott pulls all their inventory from II, OK, so what?  Marriott does not have the only "gold seal" resorts listed in the book.  

Just my two pennies I'll toss out there for everyone.


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## pwrshift (Aug 20, 2010)

You missed my point jlee2070. If you buy a Maui oceanfront 2bdrm resale today for $15 k that you plan to use in Paradise forever and pass the deed on to your kids what does it matter what Marriott does today or tomorrow?  You don't even need to join II in that case and certainly have no need for the expense of the new plan either.  Marriott know it can't get these people to join but dearly wants access to their deeded weeks.  Rules will change.

Brian


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## BigGene (Aug 20, 2010)

*Dest Point Increases*

More and more angry as I learn more about the Marriott Destination Point system. Spoke to Michael OSBORNE, Marriott Sr Mgr, Customer Advocacy today. Learned that although my MFV Fairway Villa has an owner value at 2075 ,the usage value is 2750. That is bad enough. But then he told me that the 2750 value WILL CONTINUALLY INCREASE as time goes on. My 2075 owner value is fixed. It will be worth less and less. Does anyone know a good Class Action Suit Lawyer?


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## pwrshift (Aug 20, 2010)

Similar to the MR points you can get for giving up your week...fixed amount but the number of points required to get a hotel is always changing, with most of them going up.  Marriott is always the winner...buy shares instead and earn dividends.   

Brian


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## sparty (Aug 20, 2010)

BigGene said:


> More and more angry as I learn more about the Marriott Destination Point system. Spoke to Michael OSBORNE, Marriott Sr Mgr, Customer Advocacy today. Learned that although my MFV Fairway Villa has an owner value at 2075 ,the usage value is 2750. That is bad enough. But then he told me that the 2750 value WILL CONTINUALLY INCREASE as time goes on. My 2075 owner value is fixed. It will be worth less and less. Does anyone know a good Class Action Suit Lawyer?



What was your original concern that you contacted Customer Advocacy for?


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## GregT (Aug 20, 2010)

BigGene said:


> More and more angry as I learn more about the Marriott Destination Point system. Spoke to Michael OSBORNE, Marriott Sr Mgr, Customer Advocacy today. Learned that although my MFV Fairway Villa has an owner value at 2075 ,the usage value is 2750. That is bad enough. But then he told me that the 2750 value WILL CONTINUALLY INCREASE as time goes on. My 2075 owner value is fixed. It will be worth less and less. Does anyone know a good Class Action Suit Lawyer?



BigGene,

Welcome to TUG!!

It is the ultimate irony that I am defending the skim (please run a search on this topic) but I don't believe what he told you is correct.  It is true that your 2,075 is permanent/fixed/won't change but I don't believe that the 2,750 will change significantly -- and if it goes up, something else (a different season) in the property will go down in points required.   The total points across all seasons will stay the same.  

Specific points were assigned, and there may be "reallocation" but there will not be inflation.  

Again, welcome to TUG!

Greg


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## dioxide45 (Aug 20, 2010)

GregT said:


> Specific points were assigned, and there may be "reallocation" but there will not be inflation.
> 
> Again, welcome to TUG!
> 
> Greg



This is unproven and there is absolutely nothing in the exchange company documents that prevent point inflation. I think there is some regulation surrounding point values at trust resorts, but an exchange company can change trade power at will. Just see the many RCI threads on this.


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## GregT (Aug 20, 2010)

dioxide45 said:


> This is unproven and there is absolutely nothing in the exchange company documents that prevent point inflation. *I think there is some regulation surrounding point values at trust resorts, but an exchange company can change trade power at will. *Just see the many RCI threads on this.



Aren't we both?????   

If Marriott starts increasing points to make reservations at existing resorts, then skimming will seem like child's play.   

I really really really hope we never get there.     But I also missed skimming   

All the best,

Greg


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## Big Matt (Aug 21, 2010)

Well, here's my experience with Hawaii lately.

I just traded by 1BR Grande Vista (after locking off) for a 1BR Ko Olina.  The trade came through after five days after placing an ongoing request.  My total maintenance fee for the 1BR was about $600 (prorated).  I paid the $99 exchange fee and would allocate $50 of the lock off fee.  Basically, I'm getting a 1BR in July next summer for $750.


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## cruisin (Aug 21, 2010)

RCI has raised point values in the past for exchanging, I do not think there is anything stopping Marriott from changing exchange values. Isn't it just a big exchange club?


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## Big Matt (Aug 21, 2010)

I completely agree.

Also, I'm sure that nice, new destinations could cost a lot more in points.

Finally, nothing will stop them from a) raising the annual fee from $199, or b) getting out of II.



cruisin said:


> RCI has raised point values in the past for exchanging, I do not think there is anything stopping Marriott from changing exchange values. Isn't it just a big exchange club?


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## pipet (Aug 21, 2010)

BigGene said:


> More and more angry as I learn more about the Marriott Destination Point system. Spoke to Michael OSBORNE, Marriott Sr Mgr, Customer Advocacy today. Learned that although my MFV Fairway Villa has an owner value at 2075 ,the usage value is 2750. That is bad enough. But then he told me that the 2750 value WILL CONTINUALLY INCREASE as time goes on. My 2075 owner value is fixed. It will be worth less and less. Does anyone know a good Class Action Suit Lawyer?



The documentation says that Marriott has the right to change both what enrolled weeks members are alloted as well as what the usage value is.  There doesn't seem to be protection for enrolled weeks owners in that their home resort does not have a set amount of points.  Enrolled weeks owners are being given a choice to participate in the program at whatever is offered.  Sadly, BigGene, the answer to your problem is don't convert to points if you don't like what is being offered.

There have been discussion on what protection is in place for new point buyers, and while documentation is scarce, I think the majority opinion is that there has to be stability in the total number of points available in the system at Trust properties.  The idea is that points can be reallocated but overall must remain the same (like as Disney does, except Disney does it on a resort basis, not a system basis).  Although I've read over the documents, I can't find such wording; however, such protection possibly could be required by states' laws regarding timeshare purchases.   Is the belief that Marriott has to keep things stable is based on true legal protection?  This is where we need someone with some actual real estate expertise to chime in!  Right now, I've not seen any reference to specific state laws to know for sure.   

The interplay of points allotment at non-Trust properties and Trust properties is also not clear.  Since weeks owners bought weeks, not points, I don't see how the points alloted for weeks would have to meet any legal requirement to remain the same.  Trust owners technically do not lose value at the Trust if there is point inflation at non-Trust properties.  However, it is reasonable to expect non-Trust properties to be somewhat in line with Trust properties  whether there is protection or not, mostly because it will affect Marriott new point sales if people see that they can only afford to go to resorts in the Trust.

If any property is added to the trust, the points could be reallocated system-wide, and at that point, it does seem like point inflation could be a problem since it is not clear that at any one resort points must remain stable.  

DVC is much clearer in this regard to its customers.  I don't know why Marriott can't make it clear.


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## jackie (Aug 21, 2010)

*New Points Program*

I just spoke to Marriott:  If I join the new program, I can still keep weeks with Marriott, lock them off and still use II.They said if I had a one bedroom
I could call II and look for a two bedroom. Them plan I think would be good
for me.  Do you think this is right?


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## pharmgirl (Aug 21, 2010)

jackieweidle said:


> I just spoke to Marriott:  If I join the new program, I can still keep weeks with Marriott, lock them off and still use II.They said if I had a one bedroom
> I could call II and look for a two bedroom. Them plan I think would be good
> for me.  Do you think this is right?



If you DON't join the plan [and give them all that money], you can STILL keep the weeks with Marriott, lock them off and still use II.  If you had a one bedroom you can STILL call II and look for a two bedroom!!!  
NO NEED to give MARRIOTT ANY MORE MONEY FOR THIS NEW PLAN


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## DanCali (Aug 22, 2010)

jackieweidle said:


> I just spoke to Marriott:  If I join the new program, I can still keep weeks with Marriott, lock them off and still use II.They said if I had a one bedroom
> I could call II and look for a two bedroom. Them plan I think would be good
> for me.  Do you think this is right?



If SFX or RCI charged you $1500 to enroll (or even $600) and took $200 a year and various additional "hidden" fees would you join that exchange system?

The points "program"you refer to is just an exchange system. The fact that Marriott is managing it shouldn't change your attitude towards (what I view) as exorbitant costs. In fact,the fact that they are managing it only increases conflicts of interests with owners...


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## anonymous54321 (Dec 15, 2010)

*Marriott must keep the plan they sold us*

[Duplicate post deleted - DeniseM Moderator]


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