# New US - Mexican travel warnings



## dneveu (Jan 11, 2018)

Any anyone else seen these articles or have any information on these travel warnings released Wednesday?   The article advises some places (like Jalisco / puerto Vallarta) now have a 3 travel warning (reconsider travel)  but US the state department still has Mexico listed as an overall 2 travel warning (exercise increased caution).  

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/mexican-states-us-travel-warning-52263785

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/0...ot-travel-warning-on-five-mexican-states.html

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...s-citizens-avoid-5-mexican-states/1023620001/

Thanks for any input.


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## Eric B (Jan 11, 2018)

The Department of State has recently changed their travel warning system to include the numbers.  There’s a decent explanation in this article.  https://www.cntraveler.com/story/mexico-travel-advisory-what-the-new-system-means-for-us-travelers

The warning status doesn’t seem much different than it was before; they’ve just changed how they communicate it.


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## geist1223 (Jan 11, 2018)

We are leaving Saturday for 3 weeks in Cabo. These State Department Warnings have never caused us to change our plans.


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## WatsonC2 (Jan 11, 2018)

I haven't traveled recently to the higher risk areas (as defined by US.Gov)  [political comment removed] Also might get easier to get reservations in Mexico and maybe prices will drop...


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## T-Dot-Traveller (Jan 11, 2018)

Corey Watson said:


> .... and maybe prices will drop...



Prices for Avocados will go up . -- millennials will have to go back to ketchup & mustard on their hamburgers .


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## PamMo (Jan 12, 2018)

We've spent several weeks a year in Los Cabos for decades, and feel quite safe in our normal haunts, but times are changing. Since El Chapo was captured, the Sinaloa and New Generation cartels have been battling for turf, dominance, and control of the west coast drug corridor to the U.S. The federal police/military have stepped in to keep a lid on things, but the narco gangs have a lot of money and influence. Most of the violence is in the slums and residential areas of San Jose as gangs battle each other, but sometimes violence has spilled over to tourists areas. Just last month, to make a point that they "own" Baja and are not to be messed with, gangs hung bodies and "narcomantas" (banners with messages/warnings) from overpasses on the highways along the corridor between San Jose and Cabo San Lucas, and on the way to the airport. Disgusting, and certainly disturbing to anyone who saw them.

We're still planning on spending a month in Cabo this year, but sadly have no illusions that it is the sleepy big game fishing town, or untouchable upscale resort area it used to be. If tourists stop coming, many thousands of good people in the tourist industry will lose their jobs. It makes me angry and sad that drug users in the US funnel billions of dollars a year to these thugs in the Mexican drug cartels.


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## WalnutBaron (Jan 13, 2018)

Just a note of thanks to TUGBrian for including this post in the weekly TUG newsletter, as well as to PamMo for her eloquent statement about the growing dangers of traveling to some Mexican resorts.

Past discussions of this nature on the Mexico forum have included a good deal of browbeating and shaming at the mere thought that State Department warnings should even be heard, much less considered. This needs to stop. For those who are experienced travelers to their favored resorts and feel as if they know where the safe and unsafe places are, that’s great. But please don’t shame others who either don’t have that experience, are more cautious, or are more willing to heed the warnings.

As PamMo so correctly stated, one thing all of us can agree on is that the safety of travelers to Mexico—as well as Mexican citizens—is sadly compromised by the massive flow of billions of drug dollars from the U.S. to these drug thugs who have such a low regard for human life or quality of life.


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## Hankmoon (Jan 13, 2018)

We were just in Cabo at the Pueblo Bonito Pacifica. We had a lovely time. We arrived the day after the hangings over the bridges. I must admit that scared us and we did not explore Cabo. The one day we left the resort to downtown Cabo, we went with the resort’s shuttle to their downtown resort. Downtown Cabo is not that nice compared to other Mexican towns. Overall, we prefer the Mexican Riviera, Cozumel and Puerto Vallarta over Cabo. However, within the gated compound of Pueblo Bonito Pacifica, Sunset Beach and Montecristo Estates, you never have to leave anyway. It is a self contained resort and their Spanish architecture is beautiful at Sunset Beach and Montecristo. We stayed in a 1 bedroom oceanview suite in the modern “hotel” Towers at Pueblo Bonito Pacifica Adults Only. It was one of the most relaxing vacations we have had in a long time. No one bugged us, even though we did attend the timeshare presentation for 3 hours to get $400 off our bill. It was no pressure and very informative. The staff at Pueblo Bonito are lovely. The restaurants were pretty good for an all inclusive. The pricing was great since we got a promo and pre-paid for everything in advance, then got $400 off the final bill. We have been to Mexico 4 times in 2017 and we are going again at the end of this month. We have not had problems. I hope it continues to be safe in the tourist areas. All these warnings are influencing where we go when we are in Mexico and making us very cautious about how we travel while in Mexico. We also arrange our transportation to/from the resort in advance to avoid the timeshare people as well as taxi drivers we don’t know.


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## rpoyourow (Jan 13, 2018)

We just returned from Mazatlan over New Year's where we have traveled over the past 28 years.  Several years ago, there was some police presence.  This year, there was no police presence.  We felt completely safe traveling to all the haunts we usually frequent. 

We asked several friends, some of the locals and some of the resort staff about local conditions.  They replied that the local police presence was unnecessary, since much of the reported troubles were limited to the rural areas and the areas around Culiacan, 120 miles to the north.  That there had been no incidents locally in a long time, and that tourists were never involved (except once well outside of the center of Mazatlan and then only by accident).  They were more ocncerned last year about gas prices and the rising prices of commodities.


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## T-Dot-Traveller (Jan 13, 2018)

Hankmoon said:


> We were just in Cabo at the Pueblo Bonito Pacifica. We had a lovely time. .....We have been to Mexico 4 times in 2017 and we are going again at the end of this month. ...We also arrange our transportation to/from the resort in advance to avoid the timeshare people   ....



IMO - Timeshare Sales People are your " big risk " when travelling to resort areas in Mexico .

Personally - I think a flying truck tire through my windshield in Canada ;is more likely to get me ;than accidentally being a cartel statistic while on vacation


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## Passepartout (Jan 13, 2018)

We are in Mazatlan now, not at a resort, but in a historic hotel in the center. The city has never looked better. It is undergoing a 4 year refurbishment of streets, lighting, New walkways, the new salt water swimming pool, and on and on. There is less police presence, but it is still visible if one looks. As to the State Dept advisories, like travel anywhere. Be aware of your surroundings and be prepared to leave an area of you feel uncomfortable with your security.

C'mon down. The water's fine!

Jim


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## PamMo (Jan 13, 2018)

Jim, that's great news about Maz. I love the old center of town - have dreamt about living in one of those gorgeous old homes with the interior courtyards! We hope to get back down there next winter.


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## PamMo (Jan 13, 2018)

Update on travel advisories to Mexico:

https://mexiconewsdaily.com/news/tr...il&utm_term=0_f1536a3787-80d57651bb-347993853


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## pittle (Jan 13, 2018)

We were in PV for 3 weeks in November and will be at the Grand Bliss Riviera Maya for 2 weeks in April.  We will drive to a condo in the Rosarito-Ensenada area for a month this summer and will go to PV again in November. 

We have driven to Mazatlán 8 times in the last 9 years with no issues.  We stop in San Carlos on the way. We have not had any problems. We do drive on the toll road because it is faster and safer.

We do not go out at night unless with others or using taxis and have always felt safe.  We live in the greater PHX area and do not go out at night here either. We always try to be aware of our surroundings no matter where we are. The tourist areas in any Mexico town are generally safe.


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## davidvel (Jan 13, 2018)

pittle said:


> We were in PV for 3 weeks in November and will be at the Grand Bliss Riviera Maya for 2 weeks in April.  We will drive to a condo in the Rosarito-Ensenada area for a month this summer and will go to PV again in November.
> 
> We have driven to Mazatlán 8 times in the last 9 years with no issues.  We stop in San Carlos on the way. We have not had any problems. We do drive on the toll road because it is faster and safer.
> 
> We do not go out at night unless with others or using taxis and have always felt safe.  We live in the greater PHX area and do not go out at night here either. We always try to be aware of our surroundings no matter where we are. The tourist areas in any Mexico town are generally safe.


It's not safe to go out at night in Goodyear?


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## youppi (Jan 13, 2018)

PamMo said:


> Update on travel advisories to Mexico:
> 
> https://mexiconewsdaily.com/news/tr...il&utm_term=0_f1536a3787-80d57651bb-347993853


From your link (Mexico News Daily | Wednesday, *January 10, 2018*), *The U.S. Department of State *said :
A *Level 4: Do not travel warning* was issued for five states: Colima, Guerrero, Michoacán, Sinaloa and Tamaulipas, *including *the tourist destinations of Acapulco and Ixtapa-Zihuatanejo in Guerrero and Mazatlán in Sinaloa.

and the *Government of Canada *said (https://travel.gc.ca/destinations/mexico):
*Last updated: January 10, 2018 08:49 ET
Still valid: January 13, 2018 16:42 ET
Northern states - Avoid non-essential travel*
Avoid non-essential travel to the following northern states due to high levels of violence, linked mainly to organized crime:

Chihuahua
Coahuila (except the city of Saltillo)
Durango
Nuevo León (except the city of Monterrey)
Sinaloa (*except *the city of Mazatlán)
Sonora (except the cities of Hermosillo and Guaymas/San Carlos)
Tamaulipas.
Exercise a high degree of caution in the cities that are excluded from the above advisory.

*Western states - Avoid non-essential travel*
Avoid non-essential travel to the western states of Guerrero (including Acapulco but *excluding *the cities of Ixtapa/Zihuatanejo and Taxco) and Michoacán (excluding the city of Morelia) due to the high levels of violence and organized crime.


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## pittle (Jan 13, 2018)

davidvel said:


> It's not safe to go out at night in Goodyear?



Goodyear is fine - actually very safe, but when we moved to the Phoenix area 11 years ago, we decided not to venture out at night as it was new to us and we had been retired 5 years.  Besides, as retirees, we like to skip lunch and eat around 3:00.  Three meals a day is overated.  I personally seldom drive once it is dark.  But, as my Dad used to tell me - be extra careful when it is dark and not much good happens after midnight (probably why I had a 11:00 curfew as a teen).


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## klpca (Jan 13, 2018)

I agree - always good to have a good discussion. I find it difficult to have folks like my dad (who has never been to Mexico and is proud of it!!), telling me that I don't know what I am talking about. We have visited different resort cities in Mexico, know where we feel comfortable and where we don't, and adjust our travels accordingly. My husband used to travel to Reynoso for work. Now that's a crazy place to go! We live less than an hour from Tijuana and hate to say between traffic at the border and safety concerns, we stay out. But we have friends who go into Tijuana regularly, so my personal choice is different than theirs.

We were in Cabo in July (no issues) and are headed to Cozumel in May. I feel safe within the hotel complexes. We never hike in Mexico - just don't feel good about that. We have eaten in town, but I've never found an amazing restaurant so if we have to stay onsite, we're ok with that too. I read the Gringo Gazette and Tripadvisor for threads posted by expats. I also take the State Department warnings into consideration.


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## Passepartout (Jan 13, 2018)

PamMo said:


> Jim, that's great news about Maz. I love the old center of town - have dreamt about living in one of those gorgeous old homes with the interior courtyards! We hope to get back down there next winter.


That's where we are, in the Melville (as in Herman- he wrote here) Boutique Hotel. It's a block from Plazuela Machaco, and Olas Altas beach the other way. Turns out it's a community of short term ex- pats here escaping Winter. There are mature palms, bouganvillas, caged birds, and a big fountain in the courtyard. It's a little loud with music on the weekends, but at least it's very good music. We have classical concerts coming up tomorrow and next weekend. I'm off to tuck into some more shrimp.


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## pammex (Jan 14, 2018)

The US has changed its way of communicating advisories for travel.  You need to read very carefully as if not you mistake areas in a given state that are just fine as not being so also some of the advisories apply to DFederal or geovernement personnel, not the avergare tourist.  

I was in PV, and NV, in November, Guadalajara the other day, now in Lake Chapala area.  Ixtapa/Zihuatenejo in may and Mazatalan in October and as an aside Mazatlan has never looked so good!  

Use common sense when traveling anywhere.  I am more nervous and afraid of many places in the US than here in Mexico, there are no school shootings here, no mall shootings, so on and on..If you are nervous of outside country travel then vbest to stay in US.  Nothing that can be said my govermenment or folks here that wil change anyone's mind where they themselves feel safe.


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## klpca (Jan 14, 2018)

I decided to go to the source of the information instead of the media digested/regurgitated version and of course the link doesn't work https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories/mexico-advisory.html (hopefully this will work eventually)
because according to the link in post 13, the tourist areas in Los Cabos and Quintana Roo are fine for travel, as is Tijuana, which seems to contradict the headlines and articles linked in post 1.


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## Eric B (Jan 14, 2018)

Try https://travel.state.gov/content/tr.../traveladvisories/mexico-travel-advisory.html.  That one seems to work; difference is the inclusion of “travel” in the end of the URL.


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## dioxide45 (Jan 14, 2018)

klpca said:


> I decided to go to the source of the information instead of the media digested/regurgitated version and of course the link doesn't work https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories/mexico-advisory.html (hopefully this will work eventually)
> because according to the link in post 13, the tourist areas in Los Cabos and Quintana Roo are fine for travel, as is Tijuana, which seems to contradict the headlines and articles linked in post 1.


This link works;

https://travel.state.gov/content/tr.../traveladvisories/mexico-travel-advisory.html


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## gypsygirl1 (Jan 20, 2018)

We've travelled to Mexico 5 times in the past 2 years.  We've been to Cancun, Playa del Carmen, Cozumel, Puerto Vallarta and Isla Mujeres.  The travel warnings mentioned the state of Quintana Roo originally but Cozumel and Isla are incredibly safe.  There were some real problems in Playa del Carmen and Cancun in the last year or so.  Acapulco and Mazatlan have been "iffy" for years though I know divers who still go there. I wouldn't venture there, though expats that live there say that most of the areas to avoid are on the edges of town where there are gangs etc.  There are cities in the US that are very dangerous too.  No matter where you travel, don't get drunk, be watchful and follow the rules.  We never rent a car in Mexico - we always walk all over or take a cab or bus.  If you're in Cozumel, try Gordito's Burritos, Celito Lindo, the restaurant at the top of the Museum and the Las Palmeras near the ferry dock downtown.  All very yummy places to eat!


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## Jayco29D (Jan 20, 2018)

gypsygirl1 said:


> We've travelled to Mexico 5 times in the past 2 years.  We've been to Cancun, Playa del Carmen, Cozumel, Puerto Vallarta and Isla Mujeres.  The travel warnings mentioned the state of Quintana Roo originally but Cozumel and Isla are incredibly safe.  There were some real problems in Playa del Carmen and Cancun in the last year or so.  Acapulco and Mazatlan have been "iffy" for years though I know divers who still go there. I wouldn't venture there, though expats that live there say that most of the areas to avoid are on the edges of town where there are gangs etc.  There are cities in the US that are very dangerous too.  No matter where you travel, don't get drunk, be watchful and follow the rules.  We never rent a car in Mexico - we always walk all over or take a cab or bus.  If you're in Cozumel, try Gordito's Burritos, Celito Lindo, the restaurant at the top of the Museum and the Las Palmeras near the ferry dock downtown.  All very yummy places to eat!



Why don’t you ever rent a car in Mexico? Are there safety issues with driving in Mexico? Or some other reason? I am going to Cancun soon and we were wondering about renting a car or not.


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## geist1223 (Jan 20, 2018)

We always rent a car when in Mexico - Cancun and Cabos.


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## dioxide45 (Jan 20, 2018)

Jayco29D said:


> Why don’t you ever rent a car in Mexico? Are there safety issues with driving in Mexico? Or some other reason? I am going to Cancun soon and we were wondering about renting a car or not.


The only real issues with driving a car in Mexico is getting pulled over and shaken down by shady cops. They tend to target tourists to try to extort money. Do a lot of reading about it before you rent a car there for the first time. There are ways to avoid it or not get ripped off. There are also scams with regards to filling up with gas that you also have to watch out for. DO NOT go uninformed. That said, we rented a car to drive from Cancun to Tulum and back and we were fine. Though the drive is stressful and you need to always be watching out for constantly changing speed limits and topes (Speed Bumps). While the road is in good shape, the constant changes in speed limits and topes makes it more stressful than it really should be. You also need to watch out for people trying to run you over when you are going the speed limit.


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## DebBrown (Jan 20, 2018)

I'm glad to read good news about Mazatlan.  We were there a few years ago and it was a bit scary.  We heard gun shots from our hotel room and saw where dead bodies had been thrown through the window of the US consulate office.  You just couldn't ignore the gang presence.  It didn't ruin our vacation but it didn't make for a relaxing visit either.  

I really loved our visits to San Jose de Cabo but hesitate to go back right now.  We opted for Florida instead but maybe another year...


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## geist1223 (Jan 21, 2018)

Hope I am not bringing us bad luck but we have never had an issue with Mexican Police in Cabo or Cancun. We have started our second week in Cabo. No worries about safety. We have been shopping and walking around town. The Mexican Navy has been given responsibility for Security of Baja California Sur. So you do see Armed Mexican Marines and more Federal Police.


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## dsmrp (Jan 21, 2018)

geist1223 said:


> We always rent a car when in Mexico - Cancun and Cabos.



Hi, when you rent cars in Mexico, do you decline the CDW coverage and get coverage thru your credit card?  Ever had problems with car rental agency saying you caused minor damage, such as scratches? We have tentative plans to go to Los Cabos in November, and would like to rent a car.  Thanks!


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## Passepartout (Jan 21, 2018)

dsmrp said:


> Hi, when you rent cars in Mexico, do you decline the CDW coverage and get coverage thru your credit card?  Ever had problems with car rental agency saying you caused minor damage, such as scratches? We have tentative plans to go to Los Cabos in November, and would like to rent a car.  Thanks!


Knowing what I know, I'd buy the offered Mexican 3rd party insurance.  ymmv.


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## dsmrp (Jan 21, 2018)

Passepartout said:


> Knowing what I know, I'd buy the offered Mexican 3rd party insurance.  ymmv.



Thanks! that's what I was suspecting.


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## Passepartout (Jan 21, 2018)

We are in Mazatlan and feel very comfortable here.We have been coming here 30 years. But today I was given pause. We were at a classical concert in the 1880s historic theatre, and the Canadian gentleman seated beside me, a condo owner, said that a fellow Albertan had just bought and moved into their condo complex. They had just been there a couple of weeks and decided to do some exploring. They, and another Mexican couple took off up the new toll, 4 lane expressway to Durango. After about an hour, they were surrounded by 4 vehicles of gun carrying thugs. They were robbed of all their money, jewelry, and the month-old pickup they were in. They were taken out into the woods, with guns aimed at them, and if course feared for their lives. A passing motorist alerted the Federales, who rescued them. The thieves took all their money, jewelry, electronics and pickup and fled.  The Canadians only had short term insurance, and the guy I talked to has never heard of a successful claim against insurance. Obviously, a vehicle is not worth your life, and on a patrolled toll road, one would expect to be safe, but this example makes one think. I'd be very confused/upset if I'd recently bought real estate somewhere I didn't feel safe using. Color me very conflicted

Jim


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## dioxide45 (Jan 21, 2018)

dsmrp said:


> Hi, when you rent cars in Mexico, do you decline the CDW coverage and get coverage thru your credit card?  Ever had problems with car rental agency saying you caused minor damage, such as scratches? We have tentative plans to go to Los Cabos in November, and would like to rent a car.  Thanks!


This is always a hotly debated topic on this and other forums. Technically your credit card CDW will cover your rental in Mexico. There is howerver mandatory third party liability, of which the minimum should be covered in the base rate. However, they will push to upgrade you to higher third party coverage which you really should take. Also, if you stick with your credit card CDW, the rental agency is very likely to hit you with a very large (couple thousand dollar) hold on your credit card when you decline their agency CDW.


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## dsmrp (Jan 21, 2018)

Passepartout said:


> We are in Mazatlan and feel very comfortable here.We have been coming here 30 years. But today I was given pause. We were at a classical concert in the 1880s historic theatre, and the Canadian gentleman seated beside me, a condo owner, said that a fellow Albertan had just bought and moved into their condo complex. They had just been there a couple of weeks and decided to do some exploring. They, and another Mexican couple took off up the new toll, 4 lane expressway to Durango. After about an hour, they were surrounded by 4 vehicles of gun carrying thugs. They were robbed of all their money, jewelry, and the month-old pickup they were in. They were taken out into the woods, with guns aimed at them, and if course feared for their lives. A passing motorist alerted the Federales, who rescued them. The thieves took all their money, jewelry, electronics and pickup and fled.  The Canadians only had short term insurance, and the guy I talked to has never heard of a successful claim against insurance. Obviously, a vehicle is not worth your life, and on a patrolled toll road, one would expect to be safe, but this example makes one think. I'd be very confused/upset if I'd recently bought real estate somewhere I didn't feel safe using. Color me very conflicted
> Jim



OMG!!  So fortunate those people were not injured.


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## dsmrp (Jan 21, 2018)

dioxide45 said:


> This is always a hotly debated topic on this and other forums. Technically your credit card CDW will cover your rental in Mexico. There is howerver mandatory third party liability, of which the minimum should be covered in the base rate. However, they will push to upgrade you to higher third party coverage which you really should take. Also, if you stick with your credit card CDW, the rental agency is very likely to hit you with a very large (couple thousand dollar) hold on your credit card when you decline their agency CDW.



Hmm, I will need to research more on third party liability. I think best we take the car rental coverage in Mexico if we do rent a car.  (On our Ireland trip, we will use our Chase Reserve credit card for CDW, and know they will put a hold/charge of a few thousand euros. My Irish friend has done this for several trips, and usually sticks to the US based rental agencies.)


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## Eric B (Jan 22, 2018)

Passepartout said:


> We are in Mazatlan and feel very comfortable here.We have been coming here 30 years. But today I was given pause. We were at a classical concert in the 1880s historic theatre, and the Canadian gentleman seated beside me, a condo owner, said that a fellow Albertan had just bought and moved into their condo complex. They had just been there a couple of weeks and decided to do some exploring. They, and another Mexican couple took off up the new toll, 4 lane expressway to Durango. After about an hour, they were surrounded by 4 vehicles of gun carrying thugs. They were robbed of all their money, jewelry, and the month-old pickup they were in. They were taken out into the woods, with guns aimed at them, and if course feared for their lives. A passing motorist alerted the Federales, who rescued them. The thieves took all their money, jewelry, electronics and pickup and fled.  The Canadians only had short term insurance, and the guy I talked to has never heard of a successful claim against insurance. Obviously, a vehicle is not worth your life, and on a patrolled toll road, one would expect to be safe, but this example makes one think. I'd be very confused/upset if I'd recently bought real estate somewhere I didn't feel safe using. Color me very conflicted
> 
> Jim



Maybe I’m too cynical, but it strikes me as very bad judgment to go exploring wearing jewelry in a brand new pick up. I’ve lived overseas for a number of years, including in southern Italy near where the Camorra runs things, and learned to blend in and avoid high risk attention drawing behaviors.  The story is an awful but avoidable one.


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## Passepartout (Jan 22, 2018)

Eric B said:


> Maybe I’m too cynical, but it strikes me as very bad judgment to go exploring wearing jewelry in a brand new pick up. I’ve lived overseas for a number of years, including in southern Italy near where the Camorra runs things, and learned to blend in and avoid high risk attention drawing behaviors.  The story is an awful but avoidable one.


Maybe. I didn't ask for an appraisal on the jewelry. Maybe it was a $15 Timex like I wear. And if what you drive is a new pickup,  that's what you take on a road trip. I agree about blending in, but fer crissakes they were on Federal Toll Road! There is no good answer, and the subject elicits response on TUG whenever Mexico safety is brought up. I'm just the messenger.

Jim

Sent from my R1 HD using Tapatalk


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## geist1223 (Jan 22, 2018)

Never had a problem with a Rental Company trying to claim damage from a minor scratch. We decline the additional insurance. It costs a lot more than the car rental. We have a car right now for less than $55 per week. Some of the rental companies will not rent to you if you decline. From talking to locals and Expats the Car Rental Companies are required to have the Insurance they are trying to get you to buy. The Expats and locals pay about $500 per year. So the Car Rental Companies are making a huge profit by convincing the tourists to buy the insurance.


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## dsmrp (Jan 23, 2018)

geist1223 said:


> Never had a problem with a Rental Company trying to claim damage from a minor scratch. We decline the additional insurance. It costs a lot more than the car rental. We have a car right now for less than $55 per week. Some of the rental companies will not rent to you if you decline. From talking to locals and Expats the Car Rental Companies are required to have the Insurance they are trying to get you to buy. The Expats and locals pay about $500 per year. So the Car Rental Companies are making a huge profit by convincing the tourists to buy the insurance.



Good to know.  Could you tell us what car rental companies you would use in Los Cabos, particularly at the airport? PM me if you prefer. Thanks!!
 In another thread, I think on Marriott forum,  someone mentioned renting used SUVs from an ex-Pat in Cabo San Lucas area.


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## geist1223 (Jan 23, 2018)

This is not an advertisement. We always use Hertz. We Book the Car Online bfore we leave the USA. Let the Car Rental Company know your flight info.


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## T-Dot-Traveller (Jan 23, 2018)

Jayco29D said:


> Why don’t you ever rent a car in Mexico? Are there safety issues with driving in Mexico? Or some other reason? I am going to Cancun soon and we were wondering about renting a car or not.



Generally there is no need - inexpensive taxis & great local bus system (s)


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## Zinjanthropus (Jan 23, 2018)

In 2015 We rented a piece of crap Jeep with manual transmission in Cozumel and drove all around the island exploring and stopping at local restaurants. We did the same last Nov.
We usually rented a car at Vidanta RM to drive into Cancun for beach, party and restaurants.
We normally bus or cab into playa Del Carmen.


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## easyrider (Jan 29, 2018)

dsmrp said:


> Hi, when you rent cars in Mexico, do you decline the CDW coverage and get coverage thru your credit card?  Ever had problems with car rental agency saying you caused minor damage, such as scratches? We have tentative plans to go to Los Cabos in November, and would like to rent a car.  Thanks!




We drive about 4 weeks a year in Mexico and use the American Express rental car protection in place of buying the CDW. The rental agency will place a hold on the car for about $2500 until you bring it back. I always take pictures and a video of the car. I like Avis the most because their cars are newer and they do provide the 3rd party liability insurance in their rate. Avis in Cabo has a compact mini van that I really like. 

I have brought back an almost brand new car to Avis with a small golf ball sized and shaped dent on the front fender. The Avis manager looked at it and let it pass. It was a pretty obvious dent. 

I have rented through Budget and their car was high mileage with scratches and dents. I took pictures and when I returned they tried to charge me for a new wheel because of a crease in the side. I looked at the pictures and the crease was all ready there. It was very small. When I arrived Budget tried to force me to buy all of their insurance for 20 minutes. They finally let me rent the car using my AMEX. I haven't been back.

I have had good luck with Alamo at times. Alamo will require you to purchase their 3rd party insurance but their total rate and quality of cars is similar to Avis.

Cabo is pretty easy driving conditions. I remember back when driving in the Cabo area was dirt roads, right frontage to turn left and huge speed bumps. I think the only right frontage road to turn left is the one we use to get to Costco.

Cancun has the many roundabouts that can get confusing when driving in heavy traffic.

PV has many right side frontage roads to turn left which can be confusing. 

I have donated to the police in all of these places at least once. In Cabo it was years ago and I was speeding. I offered $10 but it cost about $20. PV was parking in a yellow curb area and costed $10. Cancun was 2 years ago and I was pulled over for nothing other than being a tourist as far as I can tell. They wanted $50 but eventually took $30. In Cancun they tried the not enough paid for gas and even though I know I paid the guy the right amount, he pocketed $100 pesos. The Cancun flea market did the same and got $5. 


Bill


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## easyrider (Jan 29, 2018)

There were over 25,000 murders in Mexico last year. That does seem like a very high number. I'm not certain how many tourists get caught up in the violence but its probably some. I haven't seen the violence personally, but I do know of a few people that were related to, or friends of, people I know very well, that were victims of violence. So it does happen.    


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ence-after-record-25000-murders-idUSKBN1FH0W2



> MEXICO CITY (Reuters) - Mexican officials said on Sunday the government was set to unleash a new wave of troops to crack down on criminal groups in regions where a surge in violence led to more than 25,000 murders last year.



Bill


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## dioxide45 (Jan 29, 2018)

easyrider said:


> There were over 25,000 murders in Mexico last year. That does seem like a very high number. I'm not certain how many tourists get caught up in the violence but its probably some. I haven't seen the violence personally, but I do know of a few people that were related to, or friends of, people I know very well, that were victims of violence. So it does happen.
> 
> 
> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ence-after-record-25000-murders-idUSKBN1FH0W2
> ...


It seems the rate is about four times that in the US. About twice as many murders with only half the population.


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## easyrider (Jan 30, 2018)

dioxide45 said:


> It seems the rate is about four times that in the US. About twice as many murders with only half the population.



Yes, the murder rate is very high in Mexico. Compared to war torn Syria, Mexico has over twice the amount of deaths due to violence at over 25,0000 victims in 2017 compared to Syria at over 11,000 in 2017.

Interestingly though, it is not the tourists that have been targeted. It looks like the gang activity that has made Acapulco a place to avoid has expanded to Cancun and Baja where there have been cartel murder victims found in the middle of tourist areas.

What we did notice at the flea markets in Puerto Vallarta this January was a public sentiment that was some what bad regarding the USA. There were many vendors selling politicized items that disparage the USA. Very hateful slogans on shirts and other items that are anti USA. I haven't ever seen this in the past. Also in Puerto Vallarta, our group was followed by sketchy looking men from the parking garage area, to the flea market and then to the Cathedral.  

https://nypost.com/2017/08/12/drug-cartel-violence-hits-tourist-hotspots-cancun-los-cabos/

[QUOTE
*Drug cartel violence hits tourist hotspots Cancun, Los Cabos*
][/QUOTE]


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## Jayco29D (Jan 30, 2018)

I am in Cancun/Riviera Maya now. My friend and I (we are both quintessential American-looking females) rented a car for 3 days to visit Xcaret, Xel Ha and Fifth Ave in Playa del Carmen. We had absolutely no problems driving back and forth up to 1.5 hours each day from the furthest end in Cancun. We passed through many police checks and they never stopped us. There are police everywhere and they do not seem to bother anyone without reason. It feels safe. I also noticed very few Americans in the places we visited. For the first time in my life, most Mexicans asked me if I speak Spanish. Since I do, they were speaking to me in Spanish. I felt honored by this and they seemed respected because I was willing to talk in Spanish, even though they also speak English. I feel Mexico is changing a lot and the Mexican middle class is growing. Also, commercial development appears to be expanding in Riviera Maya. We were surprised at the many commercial developments and professional small businesses. It is not just a tourist destination anymore.


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## Jayco29D (Jan 30, 2018)

easyrider said:


> Yes, the murder rate is very high in Mexico. Compared to war torn Syria, Mexico has over twice the amount of deaths due to violence at over 25,0000 victims in 2017 compared to Syria at over 11,000 in 2017.
> 
> Interestingly though, it is not the tourists that have been targeted. It looks like the gang activity that has made Acapulco a place to avoid has expanded to Cancun and Baja where there have been cartel murder victims found in the middle of tourist areas.
> 
> ...


[/QUOTE]

What is the murder rate per capita in Mexico vs Syria? You can’t compare total numbers.


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## Jayco29D (Jan 30, 2018)

Passepartout said:


> We are in Mazatlan and feel very comfortable here.We have been coming here 30 years. But today I was given pause. We were at a classical concert in the 1880s historic theatre, and the Canadian gentleman seated beside me, a condo owner, said that a fellow Albertan had just bought and moved into their condo complex. They had just been there a couple of weeks and decided to do some exploring. They, and another Mexican couple took off up the new toll, 4 lane expressway to Durango. After about an hour, they were surrounded by 4 vehicles of gun carrying thugs. They were robbed of all their money, jewelry, and the month-old pickup they were in. They were taken out into the woods, with guns aimed at them, and if course feared for their lives. A passing motorist alerted the Federales, who rescued them. The thieves took all their money, jewelry, electronics and pickup and fled.  The Canadians only had short term insurance, and the guy I talked to has never heard of a successful claim against insurance. Obviously, a vehicle is not worth your life, and on a patrolled toll road, one would expect to be safe, but this example makes one think. I'd be very confused/upset if I'd recently bought real estate somewhere I didn't feel safe using. Color me very conflicted
> 
> Jim



Wow, what a scary story! I just googled the trip from Mazatlan to Durango. It is a pretty long drive outside of a major tourist area - 3.5 hours. While I have always felt safe in Mexico (see my other post in this thread), we stay within the tourist zones. We have never traveled between major cities/towns for exactly this reason. Sinaloa State has the highest warning from the State Dept but they have exempted Mazatlan from the warning. So I assume if you stay in the Mazatlan area, most folks will be okay.


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## Jayco29D (Jan 30, 2018)

Interesting list of murder rates by world cities. St Louis #14 and Baltimore #26 are higher than most Mexican cities and among the highest in the world! Brazil has more deadly cities than Mexico. USA has 4 out of 50 of the deadliest cities in the world. Chicago is not in the top 50, though.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_murder_rate

Number of cities by country represented in the tableCountryNo. of cities
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


Brazil19
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


Mexico8
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


Venezuela7
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


United States4
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


Colombia4
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


South Africa3
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


Honduras2
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


El Salvador1
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


Guatemala1
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


Jamaica1


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## easyrider (Jan 30, 2018)

What is the murder rate per capita in Mexico vs Syria? You can’t compare total numbers.[/QUOTE]

In 2017 there were 25,000 humans killed in Mexico from violent activities. In 2017 there were 11,300 humans killed from violent activities in Syria. Those are the total numbers. Are you saying that because Mexico has a higher population that explains 25,000 murders ? Maybe, but 25,000 murders using mostly small weapons seems huge.

http://www.iamsyria.org/death-tolls.html

I have been a big Mexico supporter through out the years and still do not think there is a real danger of violence to tourists in general, but if the gang activity that took over Acapulco spreads, all the resort towns will end up like Acapulco, imo. It wasn't violence to tourist that took Acapulco off the resort destination. It was gangs extorting the businesses and killing business people and other gang members that made Acapulco a non-tourist destination.


Bill


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## Jayco29D (Jan 31, 2018)

Delete


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## easyrider (Jan 31, 2018)

Jayco29D said:


> 25,000 is a lot of murders. So is 18,000 murders. That is how many murders there were in the USA. So if we go by total numbers, the USA is almost up there with Mexico and far surpasses Syria!



Not really. Mexico with a smaller population is ranked 2nd in the world regarding murder rates. The USA is ranked 9th in the world regarding murder rates and the difference between these rates regarding Mexico and the USA is Mexico has 5 times higher the amount of murder with a smaller population.

The only good thing I can think of is that the Mexicans are not targeting tourists with the exception of petty crimes. This was the first year in Mexico that I could feel a difference in attitudes of the local businesses where there is an anti USA sentiment because of political rhetoric, imo. To those that read this, please keep your political views out of this thread.

http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/compare/Mexico/United-States/Crime/Violent-crime



> *STAT
> Mexico
> United States
> HISTORY*
> ...


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## Jayco29D (Jan 31, 2018)

Using per capita as the measurement was exactly my point!


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## Jayco29D (Jan 31, 2018)

If the USA ranks in the top 10 for murders per capita, that is not exactly an honor - unless we want to be in the top 10 murder capitals in the world. As a peace loving person, it is embarrassing to see the USA ranks in the top 10. I wish we were in the top 10 for education and healthcare and well being.


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## T-Dot-Traveller (Jan 31, 2018)

easyrider said:


> There were over 25,000 murders in Mexico last year. That does seem like a very high number. I'm not certain how many tourists get caught up in the violence but its probably some. I haven't seen the violence personally, but I do know of a few people that were related to, or friends of, people I know very well, that were victims of violence. So it does happen.
> 
> 
> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ence-after-record-25000-murders-idUSKBN1FH0W2
> ...



About 100 years ago - 1910 - 1920 ( the period called - The Mexican Revolution) the population of Mexico was 15 million and it is estimated over a million were killed and up to a million
moved (mostly north)  as refugees .
The Cristero battles/ war  in the late 1920's probably resulted in 90,000 deaths .

There is some suggestion that the current murder rate is closer to the historic  20th century "norm " .

Mexico statistically  also has a younger population than the USA . I have read studies suggesting murder rates decline as (male) population ages .
As best I can tell approx 21% is male 18-44 / while the USA is !8 % . This is about 15% greater .

Every murder around the world is a tragedy
(All) countries have murders ; and why rates vary from one place to another is complex ( to say the least )


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## geist1223 (Jan 31, 2018)

We are 2.5 weeks into our 3 week stay in San Jose del Cabo. We have also spent 2 days up in La Paz. Whale Shark season. Also spent a day in Cabo San Lucas. We have not encountered any negative attitude from any of the Locals. They have all been friendly and helpful.


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## Egret1986 (Jan 31, 2018)

geist1223 said:


> We have not encountered any negative attitude from any of the Locals. They have all been friendly and helpful.



We just returned from our first trip to Mexico.  We stayed in Cancun.  We also found everyone that we encountered to be friendly and helpful as well.


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## easyrider (Jan 31, 2018)

I only noticed the anti USA sentiment in Puerto Vallarta and it was only at a few places. There were t shirts with vulgar political messages to Americans and other items of this nature, worn and for sale at the flea markets in PV. I didn't see this type of merchandise in Bucerias or the other smaller cities we visited. I did get a bad vibe in PV. Bad enough to leave shortly after sunset.

Bill


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## T-Dot-Traveller (Feb 1, 2018)

easyrider said:


> I only noticed the anti USA sentiment in Puerto Vallarta and it was only at a few places. There were t shirts with vulgar political messages to Americans and other items of this nature, worn and for sale at the flea markets in PV.
> 
> Bill



Best T - shirt I have seen was in Puerto Penasco / Rocky Point  about 4 years ago 

"Hey Gringo - I'm legal here "


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## Passepartout (Feb 1, 2018)

T-Dot-Traveller said:


> Best T - shirt I have seen was in Puerto Penasco / Rocky Point  about 4 years ago
> 
> "Hey Gringo - I'm legal here "


Saw one recently in Mazatlan: "The FUN side of the WALL"


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## Zinjanthropus (Feb 1, 2018)

easyrider said:


> I only noticed the anti USA sentiment in Puerto Vallarta and it was only at a few places. There were t shirts with vulgar political messages to Americans and other items of this nature, worn and for sale at the flea markets in PV. I didn't see this type of merchandise in Bucerias or the other smaller cities we visited. I did get a bad vibe in PV. Bad enough to leave shortly after sunset.
> 
> Bill


It's a perverse hobby of mine to seek anti US slogans and political messages when I'm abroad. It's good to discover what people are really thinking.  I remember the protests in France against the gigantic US entertainment conglomerates, and also the fast food joints... (A poster of Colonel Sanders forcing greasy chicken parts down a French girl's throat) I remember the anti US posters and graffiti in Panama in the late 80s and in Grenada after Maurice Bishop's assassination and in Haiti during our backing of the Duvalier regime.

What vulgar political messages did you see in PV?


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## Karen G (Feb 1, 2018)

Zinjanthropus said:


> What vulgar political messages did you see in PV?


Since we don't post or discuss political messages on TUG, please don't post any--vulgar or otherwise!


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## Zinjanthropus (Feb 1, 2018)

Oops, I didn't mean post the Vulgar statements...just the gist of the thing. And I do think the level of disdain is germane to the conversation of safety in Mex.  Speaking of the level of disdain only gets political when an opinion of them is expressed...right? 
..but no problem, will follow the rules.


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## Karen G (Feb 1, 2018)

Zinjanthropus said:


> ..but no problem, will follow the rules.


Thanks!


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## pittle (Feb 1, 2018)

Passepartout said:


> Saw one recently in Mazatlan: "The FUN side of the WALL"


We saw those in PV too!  But, everyone was friendly and helpful to us (maybe because they respect their elders!).  

We are spending about 12 weeks in Mexico this year - Riviera Maya for 2 weks in April - Rosarito Beach/Ensenada area mid-July-mid-August, and then PV again for 25 days in November/early December.  We would not go if we did not feel safe and welcome. We generally go out in the daylight hours and are respectful of the people we meet and tip generously to those who serve us in any way.


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## Passepartout (Feb 1, 2018)

pittle said:


> We saw those in PV too!  But, everyone was friendly and helpful to us (maybe because they respect their elders!).
> 
> We are spending about 12 weeks in Mexico this year - Riviera Maya for 2 weks in April - Rosarito Beach/Ensenada area mid-July-mid-August, and then PV again for 25 days in November/early December.  We would not go if we did not feel safe and welcome. We generally go out in the daylight hours and are respectful of the people we meet and tip generously to those who serve us in any way.


I wish we had more time to spend there but DW plays in symphony here, and that's a winter thing. So we only were free from after the holidays until rehearsals start again for Spring- Early Feb. She feels her seat is not 'secure', and neither of us really want to go alone. Read my sad and scary tale in post #33. It was related to me by the victim's neighbor. Like you, we feel absolutely comfortable, and wouldn't go if we didn't. We hope the Federales can get a handle on the cartels, but unless/until demand dries up, the producers will produce.


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## Jayco29D (Feb 6, 2018)

If you want to see anti-USA sentiment, you do not need to go to Mexico. Just speak to anyone in the world especially the Europeans. They absolutely hate USA right now! USA is a laughing stock around the world. I am surprised at how kind the Mexicans are, given how terrible people in the USA talk about them and treat them. 

I am a member of a professional group that was supposed to hold its annual conference in Washington DC. The European members protested and the organization moved it to Amsterdam. The rationale was due to the travel ban and immigration policies, the USA is not allowing people into our country without hassling. I defended the USA and said we aren’t all racists but I was a small voice in the group and lost.

Since May 2017, I have been to Mexico on separate 5 trips: Cancun/Riviera Maya (1 trip), Cozumel (1 trip), Puerto Vallarta (2 trips) and Cabo (1 trip). Plus we travel all over the world too. The worst thing that happened to me in Mexico during this time is I fell off a bicycle and the Mexicans helped me and took me to the paramedics.


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## Egret1986 (Feb 6, 2018)

Jayco29D said:


> I am surprised at how kind the Mexicans are, given how terrible people in the USA talk about them and treat them.
> 
> The worst thing that happened to me in Mexico during this time is I fell off a bicycle and the Mexicans helped me and took me to the paramedics.



We just returned from our first trip to Mexico (Cancun).  One of the best things about the trip was the Mexican people.  I know most folks that we encountered were in the service and hospitality industry; but we haven't experienced such a level of warmth and graciousness by all we met while on vacation.  It was truly surprising, as you say, given the way they are talked about and treated by many people in the USA.   Cancun was very nice, but our experiences with the people would be what would entice us to go back.


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## pittle (Feb 6, 2018)

Egret1986 said:


> our experiences with the people would be what would entice us to go back.



That is why we are going for a total of 11 weeks and 4 days to various Mexican destinations this year!


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## PigsDad (Feb 6, 2018)

Egret1986 said:


> We just returned from our first trip to Mexico (Cancun).  One of the best things about the trip was the Mexican people.  I know most folks that we encountered were in the service and hospitality industry; but we haven't experienced such a level of warmth and graciousness by all we met while on vacation.  It was truly surprising, as you say, given the way they are talked about and treated by many people in the USA.   Cancun was very nice, but our experiences with the people would be what would entice us to go back.


This has always been our experience traveling to Mexico as well.  The people are just so nice and truly appreciative for visitors.  What upsets me most with the (politically motivated??) travel advisories coming from some agency in Washington is how it negatively affects the hard-working people in Mexico.

Kurt


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## Jayco29D (Feb 6, 2018)

When I tell the local Mexicans I live in California, they rave about it. However, when I asked if they are interested in visiting the USA, they usually say they no longer have interest in coming to the USA. My last driver said that many Mexicans were unnecessarily hassled on flights from Cancun to Miami last year during the travel ban and held in the airport. He said word got around and Mexicans are avoiding the USA. He said many Europeans and South Americans are now traveling to Mexico instead of the USA now because they do not want to support our government. He said Mexican tourism is still 80% Americans but I did not run into many Americans in the Cancun/Riviera Maya area on this trip. Or the Americans blended in so well I did not notice them. I heard more Spanish spoken (I speak Spanish so this is comfortable for me) and saw more middle class and upper middle class Mexicans traveling locally than tourists.

I read that tourism to USA was down at least 4% in 2017. I noticed my flight to Cancun was full but my flight from Cancun to Miami and Miami to SFO were unfilled. I even changed my flight on AA from Cancun to Miami at the last minute for $112 total one way.


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## rpennisi (Feb 7, 2018)

From my experience traveling to Mexico in the winter (especially January) is that most tourists are either from the northern middle of the US or are from Canada.
I agree the people of Mexico are friendly, hardworking and never threatening.  No surprise that they don't feel welcome in the US of late.


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