# Orange Lake - 1 in 4 or 1 in 3?



## anne1125 (Apr 6, 2006)

We were at OLCC in Nov. 2004.  Can we try for Jan or Feb. 2007?

Thanks,

Anne


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## AwayWeGo (Apr 6, 2006)

*Does 1-In-4 or 1-In-3 Apply To Owners?*

Do the 1-in-4 & 1-in-3 limits apply to people who own time at the resort? 

The purpose of the limit (as I understand it) is to encourage people who really like a particular resort to buy time there, rather than just exchanging in over & over. 

So does the restriction apply to people who do own time there? 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.


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## timetraveler (Apr 6, 2006)

are you kidding?        We owner's can return to our resort as often as we wish!  

You don't have to be staying there. You can use the resort amenities anytime while visiting Orlando.

Hubby and I attend symposiums in Orlando, frequently.   And when there we always go over to OL to enjoy all the amenities.   

So between that, and exchanging, and bonus time, an OL owner has unlimited access to their resort.


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## timetraveler (Apr 6, 2006)

anne1125 said:
			
		

> We were at OLCC in Nov. 2004.  Can we try for Jan or Feb. 2007?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Anne



Hi Anne.   You would be trying to go back in 9-10 months early.  Please verify with the resort.


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## anne1125 (Apr 6, 2006)

Thanks Vickie.  I'll call them.

Anne


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## AwayWeGo (Apr 6, 2006)

*Other Resorts, Too?  Or Just Orange Lake?*



			
				timetraveler said:
			
		

> We owner's can return to our resort as often as we wish!


Outstanding! 

Does that 1-in3 (or 1-in-4) limit exemption apply to Orlando timeshare resorts generally?  Or just Orange Lake? 

That is, if I own at Vistana Orlando, can I exchange back into Vistana Orlando all I want? 

Ditto Vacation Village At Parkway -- can owners there exchange back in without limitation? 

Also, Cypress Pointe owners into Cypress Pointe?  Blue Tree into Blue Tree? 

Ditto Embassy Grand Beach, HGVC Sea World, Polynesian Isles, FairField Cypress Palms, Summer Bay, etc.? 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.


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## gjw007 (Apr 6, 2006)

AwayWeGo said:
			
		

> Outstanding!
> 
> Does that 1-in3 (or 1-in-4) limit exemption apply to Orlando timeshare resorts generally?  Or just Orange Lake?
> 
> ...


Other resorts have similiar policies.  Vistana owners can exchange back without the limitation.  I don't believe that Vacation Village at Parkway has a 1-in-4 rule that applies to it.  There is no limit to the number of times as an owner I can exchange there but I prefer OLCC over VVP.  An interesting item is that OLCC lets you use the amenities even if you are staying there.  DVC, for an example, you can only use the amenities if you are staying there (the pools for example).


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## AwayWeGo (Apr 6, 2006)

*Owner Privileges.*

I never checked the official policies, but as a fee-paying owner over at Cypress Pointe Grandevillas, I feel entitled to use the pool, mini-golf, etc., any time I'm in the neighborhood, even if I happen to be staying at Motel 6. 

(I'll have to follow up on that before somebody calls security on me some time when I'm taking advantage of the resort amenities without actually being checked in.) 

Meanwhile, I'm taking the position that I can exchange back in to my Orlando home resort(s) any time I want. 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.


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## Vodo (Apr 7, 2006)

I was under the impression, from previous TUG threads, that the 1 in 4 (or 1 in 3) rule was applied in terms of years only.  For example, if I stayed at "Really Rad Resort" in December 2000 and it had a 1 in 4 rule, I could return as early as January of 2004, even though it was truly just barely 3 years since my last exchange there.  Does anyone know for sure?

Cindy


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## JLB (Apr 7, 2006)

Actually everyone is correct.

RCI's position is that trading restrictions are restrictions placed on the free and unfettered use of timeshare ownsership (something that in the rare occasion of being explained in the initial offering cannot be appreciated by the prospect) by the affilaites, not RCI.

Because of that, there could be as many interpretations of it as there are affiliates employing it.  Within an affiliate there can be as many interpretations as there are cutomer service reps telling explaining it.

The bottom line is that whatever the affiliate decides, RCI will honor, 100%, with no equivocation.  As I have said before, their final words to those who object is, "We have a legal department for people like you!"  I know that seems unfair, that they only said it once and now I have repeated a gazillion times, but oh well.  Nastiness sticks with me.

In this case everyone is right because it could be enforced by the calendar year, which means a 2004 visit would allow a return visit in 2007, or it could be enforced by the time of year, which means the OP could not return until after November, 2007.  

Rather than call, I would suggest emailing from their website, so that you have your answer in writing in case you need to prove what you were told. 

http://www.orangelake.com/contact_us/contact_guest_info.html


OL is one of the resorts that brags it up during their sales presentations.  They don't necessarily bring it up as part of the canned spiel, but if you ask, they do brag about it, using it as a marketing tool.

So, why not just take an Extra Vacation there in the off-years or rent from someone!  Anyone have an official, reliable take on that?


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## JLB (Apr 8, 2006)

I just spoke to RCI, actually an OL help desk at an RCI call center, from a number given in the email I just received from OL.

The lady I spoke to was one of the more knowledgable Guides I have dealt with.

She said that OL enforces that 1-in-3 by requiring a full three year wait before a return visit.

By that interpretation if you visited in November, 2004, you can visit again in November, 2007 or later.

She also said that OL chooses to assign unit numbers, rather than give exchangers the units deposited with RCI, just because that's the way they choose to do it.  They like to be able to place people where they want to, even if that means more work on their part.


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## timetraveler (Apr 8, 2006)

JLB said:
			
		

> She also said that OL chooses to assign unit numbers, rather than give exchangers the units deposited with RCI, just because that's the way they choose to do it. They like to be able to place people where they want to, even if that means more work on their part.



When the model's not broken,  why fix it?


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## wdaveo (Apr 8, 2006)

Along these lines...isn't there some sort of restriction across the different Orlando resorts?  It seems I remember something like if I own at HGVC Orlando (which I do) then I cannot exchange into the other Orlando resorts, or I cannot buy, or something.  Maybe my memory is failing me...which I am sure it is.

Does anyone know what I might be thinking of?

I do own at HGVC but I do not have enough points to visit during Spring Break.  I would like to use my South African TS to trade into OLCC during Spring Break.  Other than the 1 in 3 rule, do I have any limitations?

Thanks,

Dawn


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## JLB (Apr 8, 2006)

I've always referred to that as a Regional Block.  Both RCI and II have and it is referred to in the Terms and Conditions of both.

It does not apply to all resorts.  It is optional to the resorts.  When we owned Orlando weeks there were some Orlando area resorts they could not see, resorts our non-Orlando weeks could.

The purpose is the same as the 1-in-3/4, to get you to buy at a resort you want to visit.  Resorts do not want to allow you to buy a less expensive week at a lesser resort and then trade into their nicer resort.

Other than trading power issues, your SA will work for Orlando.

Several years ago, when we were also members of II, I noticed that they did not even allow Orlando owners to get Orlando Getaways.  Since Getaways are essentially a rental of excess inventory, I felt that it was a little extreme to not allow Orlando owners to rent excess inventory in their own area.

I got them to change the policy to allow it if you also owned in another area, which we did.  Then there was a glitch in their web-site and it went back to the policy of not allowing Orlando owners to get Orlando Getaways.

It was about then that we gave up on that issue, the II web-site, and II altogether.




			
				wdaveo said:
			
		

> Along these lines...isn't there some sort of restriction across the different Orlando resorts?  It seems I remember something like if I own at HGVC Orlando (which I do) then I cannot exchange into the other Orlando resorts, or I cannot buy, or something.  Maybe my memory is failing me...which I am sure it is.
> 
> Does anyone know what I might be thinking of?
> 
> ...


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## gjw007 (Apr 8, 2006)

I'd like to reaffirm what JLB said.  Madge, under the ask RCI, had answer the question about regional blocks.  It is up the resort whether or not they will accept exchanges from resorts within the regional block.  I gathered that most of the II resorts tended to enforce it while RCI resorts allowed it because it gave them an opportunity to do a sales presentation on the exchangers.  I have exchange Orlando resorts for Orlando resorts.  I do it all the time with my Vacation Village at Parkway.


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## JLB (Apr 9, 2006)

Regional Blocks are not something a person would notice unless they did the same search with a resort from within the area and a resort outside the area.  The resort within the area would just not see the resorts in that area that employ the regional block.

The latest II T & C I have is 2003-2004, and it says, _*"Some members may be restricted from exchanging into resorts located within the same geographical area as the Home Resort accomodations which are being deposited or relinguished."*_  Then it names a bunch of areas.

RCI's T & C says, *"RCI will apply any reasonable restrictions on
Exchanges required by Affiliated Resorts and/or
accommodating parties. These restrictions may
include, but are not limited to, a prohibition on
Members and their guests from exchanging into
the same resort more than once in a specified
period, a prohibition on exchanges from or to
other resorts located in the same geographic
area and minimum age requirements."*


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## wdaveo (Apr 9, 2006)

I see.  Thank you for the explanation.  I didn't want to get into a situation where I arrived at my timeshare using an exchange, and then be told I couldn't stay there because of a regional block.  (I am thinking that my SA RCI account doesn't know that I own at HGVC since that is a separate account.)

Thanks.

Dawn


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## rickandcindy23 (Apr 9, 2006)

*Another reason not to buy in Orlando*

With the higher maintenance fees and the large numbers of units always available, except during the summer when we never go, there is no reason to buy Orlando.   

If I bought in Orlando, I would be very disappointed not to be able to trade into a different unit than the one I own.


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## JLB (Apr 9, 2006)

Timesharing, like life, is full of disappointments.   



			
				rickandcindy23 said:
			
		

> If I bought in Orlando, I would be very disappointed not to be able to trade into a different unit than the one I own.


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## timetraveler (Apr 9, 2006)

rickandcindy23 said:
			
		

> With the higher maintenance fees and the large numbers of units always available, except during the summer when we never go, there is no reason to buy Orlando.
> 
> If I bought in Orlando, I would be very disappointed not to be able to trade into a different unit than the one I own.




HUH?   I can.    Of course, I have no reason to exchange into another Orlando resort, and have absolutely no desire too.


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## gjw007 (Apr 9, 2006)

rickandcindy23 said:
			
		

> With the higher maintenance fees and the large numbers of units always available, except during the summer when we never go, there is no reason to buy Orlando.
> 
> If I bought in Orlando, I would be very disappointed not to be able to trade into a different unit than the one I own.


Let me see if I have this correctly.  My annual maintenance fee is about $600 -$625 for a week for a 2-bedroom.  I get a timeshare at another location knowing that I don't want to stay there with a maintenance fee of around say $350 - $400.  I also don't know if I have been underpaying the maintenance fees because the managment company wishes to keep cost low until something happens and then I find out there is not enough funds and get hit with a huge special assessment.  Something to keep in mind as I've read several comments about these 'cheap' resort owners getting a surprize .  Because I don't want to stay or use my week, I must join an exchange company for around $100 per year plus I must pay an exchange fee of around $150.  My cheap timeshare is costing me around $600 - $650 plus the uncertainty of which resort I can pull although most of the resorts that can be pulled in Orlando are nice.  I also must go through the hassle of the process of exchanging as I never have the intention of using my 'cheap' resort.  

It might be argued that the exchange company and assorted fees are true for an individual who owns in Orlando but this is an option for them, not a necessity.  I know the mantra on this board about owning outside of Orlando and then trading in, but people should evaluate the true cost when owning outside of an area where they intend to use and not rely solely on this urban legend.  There may or may not be the savings that they expect.

I'm not arguing against exchanging but it should be an option, not something that people are forced to use.  I have no problem dropping the exchange company and being very happy with the weeks that I own.  The only real reason for me to have an RCI account is for my RCI Points.  There may be cases where it is justifiable to own outside Orlando and trade in but in some cases it may not but as stated, it really should be analyzed, pros and cons, before jumping to that conclusion.  For existing timeshare owners, it may make sense, but for others, perhaps not.


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## AwayWeGo (Apr 9, 2006)

*Do Regional Blocks & 1-In-3/4 Restrictions Apply To Points?*

Points are points, right? 

So when somebody wants a points-based exchange into Orlando, surely the exchange company won't look up the deposited weeks underlying the member's points balance to make sure none of the points came from Orlando. 

Likewise, if points really are all just points, wouildn't those 1-year-in-3 & 1-year-in-4 restrictions be dropped for points-based exchanges? 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.


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## gjw007 (Apr 10, 2006)

AwayWeGo said:
			
		

> Points are points, right?
> 
> So when somebody wants a points-based exchange into Orlando, surely the exchange company won't look up the deposited weeks underlying the member's points balance to make sure none of the points came from Orlando.
> 
> ...


Points are points are points but resort restriction still apply.  All points does is put you on equal footing with resort owners after the 9th month period (owners are allowed to book their unit 13 months in advance, book their resort 11 - 12 months in advance, book their resort group 10 - 11 months in advance).  All this means is that it doesn't matter after the 9th month whether you got your points at the resort or another resort. It doesn't remove resort restrictions.   If a resort has a 1-in-3/4 restriction, that still applies.  For example, I stayed at Sheraton's Vistana Resort a couple years ago.  I cannot stay there again for a couple more years even though I do have points account.  The easiest way around the 1-in-3/4 restriction (a points account by itself won't do it), is to use Bonus Week, extra vacations, or whatever the latest name for the program as most of these restrictions don't apply to those weeks.  Does this help?


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## wdaveo (Apr 10, 2006)

I've never regretted my HGVC Orlando purchase (from the developer, no less) and have been able to get every exchange I have ever wanted.  My only regret is not purchasing more points now that the children are older and it is more difficult to pull them out of school for an Orlando vacation.    

In a few years, though, the point value will be just right for hubby and I to travel when the kids are out of the house - or at least old enough to take care of themselves  (I have one child who I think will live with me forever if given the opportunity).


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## Mel (Apr 10, 2006)

*Re: Another reason not to buy in Orlando*



			
				rickandcindy23 said:
			
		

> If I bought in Orlando, I would be very disappointed not to be able to trade into a different unit than the one I own.


On the other hand, if I were going to Orlando, but not visiting the parks, I would be disappointed if I couldn't stay at the resort I want.  For a family that's spending the vast majority of their time in the theme parks, it really doesn't matter which resort you stay at, but if you're planning to hand around the resort, there are several I wouldn't want to stay at; the ones I would prefer are limited.  By owning where I want, I get a preference to stay there if I'm exchanging back to Orlando, or a guarantee if using my own week.  I also have the ability to use the facilities at my resort no matter where I end up staying.


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## rickandcindy23 (Apr 10, 2006)

*Mel, there are at least twenty different resorts that are GC or Five Star.*

So I like visiting a variety of resorts.  I like seeing what is out there.  Though I do avoid some of the resorts that get bad reviews.


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## JLB (Apr 10, 2006)

*Re: Do Regional Blocks & 1-In-3/4 Restrictions Apply To Points?*

Good Points.  

Edit:  On second thought it would not take the computer team much to flag Orlando owners, keeping the Regional Block intact.  And I can't quite see RCI not honoring OL's (and other's) 1-in-3/4 rules.

But it seems like I recall the trading restrictions not applying to Points.



			
				AwayWeGo said:
			
		

> Points are points, right?
> 
> So when somebody wants a points-based exchange into Orlando, surely the exchange company won't look up the deposited weeks underlying the member's points balance to make sure none of the points came from Orlando.
> 
> ...


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## JLB (Apr 10, 2006)

Orlando and Branson are similar resort-wise in that there are many and most are very good quality.  If I was visiting Branson there are any number, probably close to 20, that would do just fine.

The same with Orlando.

But we tend to gravitate toward that with which we are most familiar.  In our case that is the resort that got us started in all of this craziness, OL.


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## wdaveo (Apr 10, 2006)

JLB said:
			
		

> But we tend to gravitate toward that with which we are most familiar.  In our case that is the resort that got us started in all of this craziness, OL.



Yes, and not to stray too far off topic...I am curious as to why OLCC receives such a wide range of reviews from the very good to the not so good.

There is probably a thread here somewhere that describes how to avoid the bad units.  I'll have to look for it.

I definately want to go to the OLCC that is "very good"...not the other one


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## JLB (Apr 10, 2006)

The general consensus is that in an operation of this size there will always be some who are not happy.  The complaints do tend to be size-related ones, stuff like inconsistent answers from Customer Service, lack of attentiveness, lack of cleanliness, too crowded, too far to walk, not enough of one thing or another.

The overwhelming majority are pleased, likely awestruck, but some who are not happy really are not.  It is not just those here.

http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUser...esort_and_Country_Club-Kissimmee_Florida.html

As you read through the negative ones it appears that location, or unit quality is what upsets the most.  So, although we have never experienced a bad unit, some obviously have.
- - - - - -
Edit:  Let me correct myself.  I had never read through all of these Trapadvisor reviews so I thought I'd better check out what I have been posting.  After reading a few of the unhappy ones, I have to say that nothing on TUG has ever been even remotely as bad as some of these reviews.

I mean, going to the ER for bedbugs!  Really!?  Use diapers and dog poop laying around.  Spiders and roaches.  That's pretty brutal.

There is no doubt that there is a general dislike for the original West Village one-story golf villas, and especially those along 192.  There is no love lost for the studio units either.

Most of the complaints are from exchangers feeling they are getting the short end of the stick, ending up in poorer accomodations that what they traded with.  

But I noticed negative reviews from owners also.  That's a real eye-opener.

But I do agree, when you read the glowing comments of those who rate it a five and compare them with the those who rate it a 1 (because they couldn't rate it any lower), it's hard to believe they were at the same place.

But those who have been there can understand.  It is the luck of the draw, as one said.

Perhaps if you always have a 3-bedroom unit that helps out, since none of them are really old.
- - - - - -
Hopefully final edit:  

It's been a really great day so I decided what the heck, I'll just top it off by reading all of them.

After doing so, I have concluded that I am a pretty nice guy.


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## Mel (Apr 11, 2006)

JLB - you are right, the disappointment in OLCC seems to be concentrated in a few specific area.  Some of it is deserved, some not.  As for why we see so many, it is human nature.  Most people who are happy with what they receive don't make a big deal about it.  Those who are unhappy tend to be the loudest.  I know I am most likely to relate my experience when it was exceptional - either exceptionally good or exceptionally bad.

As to the specific bad reviews - The owner who doesn't like the resort owns a studio - but I suspect he has not owned a studio from the beginning.  When we bought, I recall the studio units being little more than hotel rooms.  It that's what you onw, and there are very few of them, don't expect to be moved into something nicer.  Some of the issues with the studio units, such as air quality might be resolved with the resort going non-smoking, but that assumes it will be enforced.

Then there are those who are disappointed that their special requests were not honored re: wanting a "new" unit.  There are only so many new units, and not eveybody gets one.  If the owners of the new units are there, they get them.  

The issues with Mold and Mildew are understandable, as are any issues with truly dirty units (you know the reviews I mean) - and if I got such a unit I would be back at the clubhouse demanding reslution.  But some of the others sound like the exchangers expectations were awfully high.  That's why I prefer reviews to ratings - if I'm reading about any resort, with a review I can sense whether the information is credible to me, or if the reviewer is being unreasonable.  

Given that the number of positive reviews outnumber the negatives, ad the fact that unhappy people are more likely to speak out, I'm not worried about my home resort.  I've always enjoys my stays, and I don't anticipate a major drop in trade power anytime soon.  The negative reviews (even of the sales staff) have not reached epic proportions, as they have at some resorts.


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## JLB (Apr 11, 2006)

I agree that in this particular case expectations do tend to be very high, so  disappointments come easy.

I noticed that many of the exchangers own in what they consider to be much nicer resorts, members of resort chains that have a reputation for being very nice.  Those chains are much newer than OL, so older, refurbished units are a disappointment.  They feel let down that RCI did not give them a like-for-like exchange.  The echoes what some have said here.

Of course, that could just be pride of ownership at work, owners of other resorts wanting their place to be just as important and as nice to them as owners of OL feel about their place.

The complaints about stuff like the resort grounds around their units being trashy and inconsiderate staff are things that could easily be improved upon, and there seems to be a number of those complaints.

The lack of complaints about areas like the East Village, or reviews saying their problems were solved when they got moved to the East Village, seems to reinforce what some folks have said here.  The East Vilage complaints are picky ones, stuff like the towels not being fluffy enough or wanting more than the mid-week towel exchange.

Like I said, having never been in anything less than a 3-bedroom _villa_, we seem to have avoided problems.

To put it into perspective, take a look at Westgate Vacation Mill:

http://www.tripadvisor.com/Hotel_Re...stgate_Vacation_Villas-Kissimmee_Florida.html

I've saved the detailed reading for another great day, but judging from the number of circles not colored in on the reviews, I have a pretty good idea how they will read.


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## sparkyboy (Apr 16, 2006)

If I owned at Orange Lake and wanted to use a different timeshare to trade there would I still be affected by the 1/3 rule since I didn't use my OL timeshare for an internal exchange? Or If I only owned 1 week at Orange Lake and wanted to have 2 weeks there *EVERY* year would the 1/3 rule pertain to an owner using a non-OL unit for the second week?


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## gjw007 (Apr 16, 2006)

sparkyboy said:
			
		

> If I owned at Orange Lake and wanted to use a different timeshare to trade there would I still be affected by the 1/3 rule since I didn't use my OL timeshare for an internal exchange? Or If I only owned 1 week at Orange Lake and wanted to have 2 weeks there *EVERY* year would the 1/3 rule pertain to an owner using a non-OL unit for the second week?


The 1-in-3/4 rule applies if you don't own at OLCC and use another resort to exchange in.  It also doesn't apply if you use RCI's bonus weeks (or lastest name, it seems to change).  Many people bought an inexpensive studio for the second reason that you gave as this allowed them to exchange into the resort as often as they desired.  If you own at OLCC, the 1-in-3/4 rule doesn't apply.  In fact, even if you are staying at another resort, you can go to OLCC and use the facilities.


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