# Fed up with the airlines



## dougp26364 (Sep 25, 2011)

If it were possible to vacation without flying, we would. As it is we're down from 6 flights per year to 3. The only reason for us to fly is if it takes over 12 hours to drive to our destination. Unfrotunately, for our winter vacations, that means flying.

It's not so much the TSA that's done us in as it is the airlines. First it was all the add on fee's. Next it's everyone trying to avoid the fee's by packing carry-on luggage. Now, the airlines retaliate by checking carry on bags through to your final destination. What if I pack a carry on because I have things I DON'T want checked? The airlines answer? TOUGH!

Sure I can take my tripod out, our computer, our camera bodies and lenses and all my wife's medications but, that sort of defeats the purpose of putting them all in one bag for convenience.

So this trip I asked, why are they now checking carry on bags through to the final destination: 

1. People missing connections (if it's that tight of a connection, my bags are likely to miss the flight AND, now my carry on doesn't have a bar code for tracking)

2. People forget their bags. (do this more than once and I bet they don't forget again)

and of course
3. SECURITY: (I call BS on this one. The airlines need to stop hitting everyone over the head with security every time they want to do something less convenient for passengers).

The airlines created the carry on issue by charging for checked bags. Their solution is to check those carry on pieces at the gate (without charge for now) and cause anxiety about whether or not those items will make the connections. Without a tracking bar code, if my carry on is lost, it looks like any other small piece of luggage and I'm doubtful I'd ever see it again. 

It's gotten to the point where I try to purchased the ugliest piece of checked luggage I can in order to spot it in a crowd. Looks like I'll need to be doing the same with our carry on luggage to make it easier to track when it misses that tight connection the airlines said where making passengers miss their flights waiting on bags at the plane side.


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## klpca (Sep 25, 2011)

Which airlines are checking carryons? (So that I can avoid). I heard that United/Continental are allowing free checked bag if you pay for your ticket with one of their credit cards, btw.

So far the only airline that has gate checked my carryon was Hawaiian. Their overhead bins will not allow you to put a carryon in wheels first - they are so shallow that you have to put things in sideways. Lots of gate checking there, but its all going to the same place so I don't worry about losing it as much.


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## 6scoops (Sep 25, 2011)

dougp26364 said:


> If it were possible to vacation without flying, we would.
> 
> I would never be home if I could vacation without having to deal with the airlines, airports, and airfare especially since I've found Tug!!
> 
> ...



I recently found great airfare on Spirit Airlines, I was all set to book it, and I thought let me just check if Southwest has anything good,  and sure enough Southwest had $47.00 Nonstop flight from Chicago to Boston, and No bag check fees!!  Spirit would of charged at least $25.00 and the fare was $20.00 more (still cheap I know).  

I think Southwest has to be laughing all the way to the bank with the other airlines foolishly treating customers so bad!  I live very close to both airports but it is so worth driving the extra 15 - 20 minutes to fly Southwest.


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## Carolyn (Sep 25, 2011)

6scoops said:


> I think Southwest has to be laughing all the way to the bank with the other airlines foolishly treating customers so bad!  I live very close to both airports but it is so worth driving the extra 15 - 20 minutes to fly Southwest.



Unfortunately Southwest does not fly to the Caribbean


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## LisaRex (Sep 25, 2011)

klpca, a lot of airlines run out of overhead space during the boarding process because so many travelers opt out of checking in their bags because of the fees.  So when space runs out, the FAs will confiscate the carryons for the people who've yet to board to put in the cargo hold, instead of allowing them to keep it in the cabin.  Just about every Delta flight I've been on has had this happen to the last people boarding.  They call it being "pink tagged." 

OPer, if you put your stuff in a backpack or bag small enough to place under your seat, you won't get pink-tagged. It's only the bags that are too large to fit under your seat that are confiscated.  

FYI, I don't bring my Nikon D50 on trips anymore.  The pocket digital cameras have improved significantly and take excellent pictures.  I've learned to live without the big camera.  I have to do more post-production editing because the smaller cameras don't have the great zooms, but cropping can give me a similar effect without all the hassle. 

Also, I pay the AMEX SkyMiles gold card's annual fee because it offers great benefits.  First, it gives me and 9 of my companions 1 free checked bag, which has saved over $1000 this year on luggage fees. Plus, it now offers  priority boarding.  That means that we can board behind the elites and get in a better position for overhead space, if that's important to you.  Me? I pack way less than I used to, and have learned to manage with a small backpack that fits under the seat. 

P.S. I love that Southwest doesn't charge for bags, and I'd support them, but Southwest doesn't fly out of Cincinnati.


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## sfwilshire (Sep 25, 2011)

klpca said:


> Which airlines are checking carryons? (So that I can avoid).



I've had it happen on Delta a few times. Usually on the bigger planes. I guess they have a certain point where they know the overhead space is going to be overfilled and they offer to check the carryons through to your destination at no charge. Since I try to carryon only when travelling for business just for the week, I'm always thrilled, especially if I have a long layover on the way home. One less thing to keep up with.

Traveling from Knoxville, we very often have to gate check our roller bags because of the tiny planes. I've learned that my computer bag will only fit under the seat on the 3 across rows if I get the one on the aisle. I don't carry anything small enough to go in the tiny little overheads on those planes.

Sheila


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## dougp26364 (Sep 25, 2011)

Carolyn said:


> Unfortunately Southwest does not fly to the Caribbean



Heck they don't even fly from our hometown airport. It's not as if SWA's fly's to every airport or internationally.


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## dougp26364 (Sep 25, 2011)

klpca said:


> Which airlines are checking carryons? (So that I can avoid). I heard that United/Continental are allowing free checked bag if you pay for your ticket with one of their credit cards, btw.
> 
> So far the only airline that has gate checked my carryon was Hawaiian. Their overhead bins will not allow you to put a carryon in wheels first - they are so shallow that you have to put things in sideways. Lots of gate checking there, but its all going to the same place so I don't worry about losing it as much.



To date I've heard this line from USAir, Frontier and Delta. Until this weekend I had successfuly argued them out of checking through to the final destination. Frontier wouldn't budge. Fortunately I was able to cram our carry on bags into the overhead bin.

Even if I do book a regular size jet, there's no guarentee that the airlines won't change equipement on us or switch flights leaving us on the smaller jets. IMHO, their excuses are to save them time and the heck with the paying customer. 

My biggest issue is about the only flights out of our airport are the regional jet types. These have EXTREMELY limited overhead bin space. This will limit what I can bring onboard and, if they're insisting on gate checked bags being checked through to our final destination, greatly limits what I can take in my carry on bag. Forget about clothing. Camera bodies, lenses, tripods and a computer take up PLENTY of space.


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## timeos2 (Sep 25, 2011)

I fly US Air regularly and except on the small jets (which I happen  to like very much as they are convenient and comfortable - and I really like plane side bag pickup) I've never been told to check carry ons with them.  Same for Jet Blue, Air Tran (now slowly being changed over to Southwest) and American.  I wouldn't like it at all if that changes.


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## dwojo (Sep 25, 2011)

Since the airlines are to greedy to eliminate baggage fees they should at least enforce the size restrictions for carry on luggage. That might make thing better.


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## dougp26364 (Sep 25, 2011)

LisaRex said:


> OPer, if you put your stuff in a backpack or bag small enough to place under your seat, you won't get pink-tagged. It's only the bags that are too large to fit under your seat that are confiscated.
> 
> FYI, I don't bring my Nikon D50 on trips anymore.  The pocket digital cameras have improved significantly and take excellent pictures.  I've learned to live without the big camera.  I have to do more post-production editing because the smaller cameras don't have the great zooms, but cropping can give me a similar effect without all the hassle.



I have to many things I don't want lost by the airline. It would make very little sense for me to own a Nikon D90 with lenses, filters and assorted other items if I wasn't going to take it on vacation. Most things I can get on with our back pack camera bags but, there are a few items I can not. Lately I've been packing so I can "unpack" a portion of one bag to get the most expensive items onboard. 

Still, it's BS the excuses the airlines give flyers. If they'd just give me back my bag plane side rather than check it through to the final destination, it'd be no problem. I don't believe the excuses they toss out. It's for the airlines benefit and not the passengers. They're cutting costs at the passnegers expense.


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## dougp26364 (Sep 25, 2011)

dwojo said:


> Since the airlines are to greedy to eliminate baggage fees they should at least enforce the size restrictions for carry on luggage. That might make thing better.



That is one thing they seem to be doing better. If it's oversized, it's tagged to the final destination. My issue is the extremely limited overhead bin space on regional jets and the number of passengers taking carry on bags to avoid baggage fee's. 

One thing I can agree with is Frontier allow passengers without carry on's that would need to be put in an overhead bin on first. Letting these passengers get into their seats first might expadite the boarding process since all they have to do is get onboard and sit down.


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## Ken555 (Sep 25, 2011)

Yet another reason to pay for United's Economy Plus, since the overhead bins by those seats are reserved for those sitting in that section.


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## LisaRex (Sep 25, 2011)

dougp26364 said:


> These have EXTREMELY limited overhead bin space. This will limit what I can bring onboard and, if they're insisting on gate checked bags being checked through to our final destination, greatly limits what I can take in my carry on bag. Forget about clothing. Camera bodies, lenses, tripods and a computer take up PLENTY of space.



I don't know what airline you fly, but here's Delta's policy:

*Approved Personal Carry-on Items*

You may carry on one bag and one personal item at no charge. Please note that all items must easily fit into the overhead bin or under the seat in front of you. 

    1 purse, briefcase, camera bag, or diaper bag;
*or *1 laptop computer (computers cannot be checked and must be carried on);
* or *1 item of a similar or smaller size to those listed above.

This policy is the main reason we don't take our D50 anymore -- we don't want to check it in.  

I was royally annoyed at first, too, because I bought the camera to take pictures.  But rather than continuing to bang my head against the wall, I've learned to conform.  And to my surprise, I actually have found it to be freeing to travel with less stuff.


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## AwayWeGo (Sep 26, 2011)

*Merger Is A Way Of Life In The Airline Biz.*




timeos2 said:


> Air Tran (now slowly being changed over to Southwest)


_Whoa !_

SouthWest is taking over AirTran ?

Who knew ? 

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## timeos2 (Sep 26, 2011)

AwayWeGo said:


> _Whoa !_
> 
> SouthWest is taking over AirTran ?
> 
> ...



Yup. SW bought them out & sale was completed recently. Changes in store for Air Tran I'm sure.


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## Passepartout (Sep 26, 2011)

AwayWeGo said:


> _Whoa !_
> 
> SouthWest is taking over AirTran ?
> 
> ...



I understand it is for counter/gate space and so SW can acquire AirTran's Caribbean  routes. I can see a bunch of MDs & B717s for sale in the future.

Will have very little effect on us out here in 'flyover' land.

Jim


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## dougp26364 (Sep 26, 2011)

LisaRex said:


> I don't know what airline you fly, but here's Delta's policy:
> 
> *Approved Personal Carry-on Items*
> 
> ...



The policy is not the problem I have *1* carry on case and *1* personal item. The problem is that everyone wants to take a carry on due to the charges for checked bags and the airlines don't want to give the carry on bags that have to be stored in carge back at the plane side. If I know I'll get my bag at plane side, I don't mind the gate checked bag policy. I *know* when it's placed on the plane and I *know* I'll pick it up at the plane side when we land. No chance it will get lost or not make my connection.

One of our camera bags has a space for our computer, the other is smaller and has space for my wife's nook. We were jackets with lots of pockets and, if need be, fishing vests for even more pockets. At issue is packing the $600 tri-pod in the checked bag and the inconvenience of unpacking that checked bag to take the tri-pod out *and* the idea that we can't pick up our gate checked bag plane side *but* must rely on the airlines to get the gate checked bag to our final destination. 

So, we're following their rules. They're just not giving us the opportunity anymore to keep our regulation carry on with us when they run out of overhead bin space. Of course, I can pay an additional fee and upgrade our boarding pass to #1, which is usually slightly less than checking a bag.

I did not buy a D90 and D3000 camera body plus various lens, tripod and accesories to leave at home. I bought them to take pictures. They'll remain on the plane with us or we won't fly. For the most part, the camera and accesories can fit under the seat in front of us. It's the gate checked bag with my clothes et......in it that must now be checked through to our final destination that's ticking me off. Just let me pick it up at the plane side and there's no problem. It's the airlines thin excuses to cover the fact they no longer want to take the time to get those bags off the plane and over to their guests that ticks me off.


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## Passepartout (Sep 26, 2011)

Doug, I think yours is a worthy rant. While I don't carry a large camera and accessories, I HAVE been forced to gate-check a carry-on and had it disappear into the luggage hold, only to reappear at the baggage carousel- not at plane-side. Could have been a disaster if there was a tight connection. Your comment that gate-checked items are not afforded the bar-coded addressing strap that a checked bag gets is all the more troubling.

Wish I could offer more than just empathy for the predicament. I can't. I have pared my traveling kit down so that I simply don't check anything, and only allow gate checking if it's my last flight leg of the day. 

I took a photography class a couple months ago, and the instructor basically echoed your comments re: flying. I think he came to terms with carrying his camera equipment aboard and hoping his clothes made the trip along with him.

Jim


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## WinniWoman (Sep 26, 2011)

I'm fed up, too, but for a different reason and that is because you plan out your entire trip well in advance and pay for the tickets to avoid increases and then they change the itinerary or cancel flights, etc. I had just booked a flight on Travelocity to Scotland via Lufthansa and paid my credit card. I have just received an e-mail from Travelocity (2 months later) saying that the airline "could not confirm the flight" and to call immediately. When I called Travelocity (at least 6 times and put on hold forever) I could not get a common sense explanation. When I asked to be put on another direct flight that I saw on their website was available, they said I would have to pay more for the fare! However, they said if I took a flight home a day earlier or a day later, it would be the same original price! They also said if I would accept a layover, the price would stay the same. I already paid more for a direct flight, so why would I accept a layover?! I asked about partner airline flights from United and Continental that I saw on their website, and they said I would have to pay a higher fare for those, too! Why would that be? They blamed everything on the airline. They offered me a full refund on the trip, which I ended up taking because I was so disgusted, and then I re-booked (for now $400.00 more, of course!) directly with United Airlines. Now, here's the kicker - They said the refund could take 2-3 billing cycles, so now I have to lay out the airfare again! This is for 3 tickets and several thousand dollars!

I am disputing the charge on my credit card, even though I already paid it, just to hassle them. I have sent e-mails to Travelocity's corporate website, but haven't gotten a response as of yet. I will never use a consolidator again for airfare. I will only go directly through an airline, better yet, after this trip, I will avoid flying as much as possible! I hate it! They should pay us for all the aggravation we have to go through!


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## Talent312 (Sep 26, 2011)

First, for *mpumilia*...
Travelocity is not a "consolidator." They are a retail travel agency. Travelocity began its life as American Airline's "Sabre" reservation system, and as such, never has been (nor will be) oriented to custormer service (IMHO). I suspect there was a glitch in communication between the Travelocity and airline's computers, for which the airline may not be at fault, having no knowledge of your dealings with Travelocity. Booking directly with your preferred airline is the better practice.
------------------------------------------------

Here is a quote from the May 2nd press release from Southwest concerning Air Tran:

*DALLAS, May 2, 2011 /PRNewswire/ --*
Southwest Airlines announced today that it has closed on its purchase of all of the outstanding common stock of AirTran Holdings, Inc.... the total transaction value is $3.2 billion. 

Southwest and AirTran will immediately begin the work to integrate AirTran into Southwest Airlines. However, AirTran will continue to operate under the AirTran brand with its same policies, procedures, and product features for a period of time.

Southwest currently expects it will obtain a Single Operating Certificate in the first quarter of 2012 and estimates it will take several years to fully transition AirTran into Southwest Airlines to become one airline. In the near term, customers can expect to interact with each carrier as they always have.


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## Mel (Sep 26, 2011)

dwojo said:


> Since the airlines are to greedy to eliminate baggage fees they should at least enforce the size restrictions for carry on luggage. That might make thing better.


It's not even an issue with checking the size of the carryons.  How about insisting they put smaller items under the seat in front of them?

Our last flight home from Hawaii, my daughter volunteered to be bumped in Dallas (on American, going to CT).  Younger daughter and I got on the plane, and my carry on had to be placed in the "crew only" bin.  Daughter ended up getting on, but her bag was gate checked, along with several other people.  Not a problem, I thought, we're not making any connections.

Wrong!  After half an hour, she asked me to keep her bag receipt for her.  I looked down at it, and it said her bag was going to LA! I spoke to the FA, and she said we would need to talk to the gate agent when we landed - nothing she could do.  By the time we were able to get off the plane, the gate agent was gone, so had to go the baggage claim - because gate check isn't brought back to the gate!

We get to baggage claim, and are told watch for it at the carrousel.  It shouldn't have been on any other plane.  Well, it was on our plane, and then turned around and sent back to Dallas on the way to LA.  They had to deliver the bag to us.  She was upset because her summer homework and school library book were in the bag, but thankfully Hurricane irene caused the start of school to be delayed.

Her bag did have a barcoded tag, but the agent at baggage claim said that wouldn't be used to track the bag - we filled out a claim form with description of the bag and its contents instead - so why bother with the bar code?  

I know the cost of tracking and delivering that bag (we live an hour from the airport) was far more than the cost of having someone deliver it to the gate, and ours can't be the only one that's gone astray this way.


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## dougp26364 (Sep 27, 2011)

In the end, if they just afford me the right to pick up my carry on bag planeside, there'd be no problem. They're reasons for no longer allowing it ring hollow. I carry on because I don't want that bag checked. Just give back my bag & I'll be fine.


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## Fern Modena (Sep 27, 2011)

Doug,
I tried to buy a ticket on Spirit Airlines about a year ago.  They nickel and dime you for everything, including assigned seats.  If you don't care where you sit, and who you sit next to, you can wait till the airport, otherwise you must pay.

I have to travel with a portable oxygen concentrator when I fly.  The FAA says that I must be seated in the seat furthest from the aisle (in a 727/737 that would be the window seat).  Well, since it is a FAA rule, and is due to a disability, I'm surely not paying extra for it.

So I called Spirit to book via phone so I could get assigned the seat I needed.  The reservationist told me that I couldn't have an assigned seat unless I paid for it, that if I didn't want to pay for it, I'd have to wait and get a seat assignment at the airport.  I reiterated to her that the FAA *required* that I sit in a window seat.  She said again that I'd either have to pay for the reservation or get an assignment at the airport.  So then I asked her if that meant that I could have a paid for ticket, yet be denied boarding at the airport if there were no aisle seats available, and she said that she guessed so.

I'm certain that she was wrong not to comp me for a seat reservation.  I don't know if ADA Laws come into play here or not, but certainly her reasoning doesn't work.  I decided that I'll never fly with Spirit.

Fern


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## SuzanneSLO (Sep 27, 2011)

dougp26364 said:


> [snip] Of course, I can pay an additional fee and upgrade our boarding pass to #1, which is usually slightly less than checking a bag.
> 
> [snip]



I think this is your answer.  Pay for priority boarding. We have priority boarding and have never had to gate check a bag.  for your situation, the extra cost woudl seem to be worth it.  -- Suzanne


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## AwayWeGo (Sep 27, 2011)

*Smells Like Spirit Airlines.*




Fern Modena said:


> I tried to buy a ticket on Spirit Airlines about a year ago.  They nickel and dime you for everything, including assigned seats.


According to the Spirit Airlines web site, they charge for all luggage -- even carry-on bags. 

Shux upon'm. 

_Full Disclosure*:*_  We're booked on Southwest for all legs of our upcoming trip to Albuquerque & Las Vegas & Oakland.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


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## sfwilshire (Sep 28, 2011)

Passepartout said:


> I understand it is for counter/gate space and so SW can acquire AirTran's Caribbean  routes. I can see a bunch of MDs & B717s for sale in the future.
> 
> Will have very little effect on us out here in 'flyover' land.
> 
> Jim



I was SO hoping that would mean Southwest would come to Knoxville since AirTran is there already. The airport authority has courted them for years, but they continue to snub us. Many of us have to drive 200 miles to Nashville to get the better fares that Southwest tends to drive.

Sheila


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## Timeshare Von (Sep 28, 2011)

I'm still at a loss over a $1,500 tripod.  WOW!


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## dougp26364 (Sep 28, 2011)

Timeshare Von said:


> I'm still at a loss over a $1,500 tripod.  WOW!



Sorry, typo. drop the one and make it $500. Although $1,500 is not our of the question for a proffesional light weight tripod and there is a very light weight travel tripod that I salivate over that's in the $1,500 range.

I'm still in the learning stages and still building my equipement. Since the wife has taken up photography, it's making it twice as expensive but, we get to do this together. Right now I'm looking at three additional lenses (two for her, one for me), upgrading her camera body, buying her a better external flash and buying a second tripod. Once that's accomplished, then it's on to the proffesional lenses and perhaps upgrading my camera body. 

Still, even with the amature equipement we carry, when we travel, there's a couple of thousand dollars in equipement that we carry on and, as I understand it, the airlines refuse to insure camera equipement. Thus, it's either going on the plane with us or we're not traveling.


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## Timeshare Von (Sep 28, 2011)

I understand Doug - it's easy to build your equipment inventory to over a couple grand even as a very limited amateur.  For my recent trip to Africa and later to Denali NP, I carried three Olympus bodies (E500x2 plus an E520) and a lens of varying focal lengths for each to avoid having to change on the fly in the dirt.  Add spare batteries (x12), memory cards (8GBx4 + 4GBx2), chargers, adaptors, filters, blah blah blah and a cheap tripod . . . I was easily at $3,000.  Good news is that while I love my Lowepro 350AW sling, I have found a compact way to fit everything (except the tripod) into my smaller (fits under the plane seats) Lowepro 200AW.


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## dougp26364 (Sep 29, 2011)

Timeshare Von said:


> I understand Doug - it's easy to build your equipment inventory to over a couple grand even as a very limited amateur.  For my recent trip to Africa and later to Denali NP, I carried three Olympus bodies (E500x2 plus an E520) and a lens of varying focal lengths for each to avoid having to change on the fly in the dirt.  Add spare batteries (x12), memory cards (8GBx4 + 4GBx2), chargers, adaptors, filters, blah blah blah and a cheap tripod . . . I was easily at $3,000.  Good news is that while I love my Lowepro 350AW sling, I have found a compact way to fit everything (except the tripod) into my smaller (fits under the plane seats) Lowepro 200AW.



I have a friend at work that does a lot of photography. He said he got into a "debate" about his camera case and gate checking it. When she asked what was in the case, he told her......in a deep serious and firm voice.....gold. He said she never said another word.


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## happybaby (Sep 29, 2011)

I think it was on a US Air flight where the overhead bins were full and they were asking for people to gate check their carry on.

Everytime I have gate checked it does not go to baggage or transferred onto your next flight.  When we gate check they have given us our item as we are getting off the plane whether it be for connecting flight or final destination.

I have never had my gate checked item taken to baggage claim.

Now I would have been upset if I paid for checking in that bag where here I got it free!!!

I did keep my small bag with medicines and camera, but the small suitcase I had them gate check it.  Medicine wouldnt bother me, if it were gate checked and I picked it up upon landing, but i wouldnt throw my cameras in the cargo area


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## dougp26364 (Sep 29, 2011)

happybaby said:


> I think it was on a US Air flight where the overhead bins were full and they were asking for people to gate check their carry on.
> 
> Everytime I have gate checked it does not go to baggage or transferred onto your next flight.  When we gate check they have given us our item as we are getting off the plane whether it be for connecting flight or final destination.
> 
> ...



In the past, this is how it use to be. A couple of years ago I had USAir try to check our carry on through to our final destination. When I complained that the final destination was Barcelona Spain and I was uncomfortable with that, the tagged it and we picked it up planeside. Which was a good thing since none of the 3 pieces of checked baggage maid the flight. 

This past year they've started insisting that all carry on's that had to be gate checked would be checked through to the final destination. So far, we've been able to get our bags on the plane. Others have not been so lucky. Since most flights from our hometown airport are on smaller regional jets, I'm going to have to rethink how we pack out bags and hope they allow us to pick up plane side if they insist we gate check out bags. This past trip, Frontier Airlines wasn't budging on the issue. It was checked through to the final destination and pick up your luggage at the carousel.


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## happybaby (Sep 29, 2011)

didnt know they changed the way they do gate checking.  will check out this week when we fly SW.

Last time we gate checked was feb 2010 coming back from vegas and i think it was on the 2nd leg, we had to gate check.  I still picked up the luggage "plane side" exiting out of the plane.

i dont recall if they tagged the gate checked luggage with destination or just with a number for us to pick up when we landed.


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## Timeshare Von (Sep 29, 2011)

I think "gate checking/pick-up" is available on the smaller planes but not the larger ones.

Last week I was flying home from Alaska and Delta had to check through a number of roller-board bags on a 757 aircraft . . . "gate checking" was not given as an option to those who boarded late and there were no more overhead bins available.

There was one person with a larger bag who fussed because of the value of the contents and the flight attendants made space in the front cabinent (where the first class jackets, etc. are stored).


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## x3 skier (Sep 29, 2011)

Fern Modena said:


> I have to travel with a portable oxygen concentrator when I fly.  The FAA says that I must be seated in the seat furthest from the aisle (in a 727/737 that would be the window seat).  Well, since it is a FAA rule, and is due to a disability, I'm surely not paying extra for it.



Never heard of that requirement from the FAA. My wife uses a portable O2 Concentrator and she can sit where she likes AFAIK. As we usually get upgrades, she sits on the aisle of a 2-2 seating arrangement. Her last flight was in Jun of last year so is it a new rule?

Cheers


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## dougp26364 (Sep 29, 2011)

Timeshare Von said:


> *I think "gate checking/pick-up" is available on the smaller planes but not the larger ones.
> *
> Last week I was flying home from Alaska and Delta had to check through a number of roller-board bags on a 757 aircraft . . . "gate checking" was not given as an option to those who boarded late and there were no more overhead bins available.
> 
> There was one person with a larger bag who fussed because of the value of the contents and the flight attendants made space in the front cabinent (where the first class jackets, etc. are stored).



It use to be but, lately United and Frontier have attempted to check our rollaboards through to our final destination on regional jets. I fear this will become the norm with all airlines as it saves the airline manpower and time (no one has to seperate carry-on's for plane side pick up). Frontier wasn't giving passengers a choice on their regional jets. They were checked through to the final destination, you left your bag or you didn't fly. Those were your choices.  

The saving grace with Frontier is that they're using newer and larger Embrair (sp?) jets that have more space in their overhead bins. we had two 21" carry on bags and both fit, although not wheels in first but sideways. 

Currently I'm looking for smaller carry on bags that will be easier to fit in all regional jet overhead bins. The trick is going to be my tripod. It breaks down OK but, I have to break it apart and angle it from corner to corner on a 21" bag. The light weight Gitzo travel tripod breaks down to a smaller, more convenient travel size but, the last time I looked it was over $1,000. 

My other option is to find some sort of addition to my Kata Camera sling bag that will attach to the bag and make it one carry on and still fit under the seat in front of me. If I can do that, I can go with a much smaller carry on to provide one or two changes of clothing, then check the rest. I've become adept at packing and can actually get a weeks worth of clothing in one 21" carry on bag. If I can keep it under 50 lbs, getting my wife's stuff and my clothing into one checked bag won't be a major issue. 

If we were typical travelers, this wouldn't be a huge issue. The problem is our photography hobby and carrying close to $4,000 worth of equipement between the two of us. Not to mention the lap top, e-reader, iPhones and various other small electronic gadgets. 

Right now, I'm using the 21" rollaboard's, a Kata backpack camera bag, a Kata slingbag, jackets with 4 pockets and when necessary, we also wear fishing vests with multiple pockets. We can get a LOT of stuff onboard with us and not take up any more space than is alotted each passenger. It's checking that rollaboard through to the final destination that's putting a cramp in my style. Especially since most flights from our smallish hometown airport are the small regional jets with limited overhead bin space. I never minded picking up our bags planeside and always tried to give us enough time between flights to allow for that delay. I'm not opposed to a 90 minute to 2 hour layover. Airport restaurants keep getting better and relaxing between flights for a meal has become a normal travel pattern for us. Recently, we found a Chop House restaurant in DIA that was more like a formal restaurant than the typical TGI Fridays, Chili's Two or airport bar/lounge restaurant. 

For me, plannning the trip is the norm. I suppose for most it's a matter of getting from point A to Point B as quickly as possible. But, then again, airlines rely more on business travelers willing to pay more for last minute tickets than leasure travelers who can shop for the lowest fare. I just can't believe business travelers would be happy checking a carry-on to their final destination. Especially if it gets lost in luggage never-never land, never to be seen or heard from again.


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## Fern Modena (Sep 29, 2011)

Nope.  Did she provide the airline with a letter at the airpoort, or did she check in by machine and disregard the letter notification?  

What airline, btw?

Fern



x3 skier said:


> Never heard of that requirement from the FAA. My wife uses a portable O2 Concentrator and she can sit where she likes AFAIK. As we usually get upgrades, she sits on the aisle of a 2-2 seating arrangement. Her last flight was in Jun of last year so is it a new rule?
> 
> Cheers


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## Fern Modena (Sep 30, 2011)

I just had the time to look up what I was referring to earlier:


> Onboard the Aircraft
> In accordance with Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) Safety Regulations, the Customer using an approved POC must be seated in a seat closest to the window than any other Customer in that row. In many situations, the Customer using the approved POC must be seated in a window seat to comply with the Safety Regulations. (The Invacare SOLO2 must be positioned on its side in order to fit underneath out aircraft seats.)
> Approved POCs that will be used during any phase of flight must be stowed completely underneath the seat in front of the Customer using the POC. As a result, the Customer may not be seated in a bulkhead seat.
> Pursuant to FAA Safety Regulations, a Customer using a POC may not occupy an emergency exit seat.



Fern



x3 skier said:


> Never heard of that requirement from the FAA. My wife uses a portable O2 Concentrator and she can sit where she likes AFAIK. As we usually get upgrades, she sits on the aisle of a 2-2 seating arrangement. Her last flight was in Jun of last year so is it a new rule?
> 
> Cheers


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## x3 skier (Sep 30, 2011)

Fern Modena said:


> I just had the time to look up what I was referring to earlier:
> 
> Onboard the Aircraft
> In accordance with Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) Safety Regulations, the Customer using an approved POC must be seated in a seat closest to the window than any other Customer in that row. In many situations, the Customer using the approved POC must be seated in a window seat to comply with the Safety Regulations. (The Invacare SOLO2 must be positioned on its side in order to fit underneath out aircraft seats.)
> ...



I never got anything back from either AA or DL after I faxed them the forms about her POC. I just checked in and got the seats on line, printed out the Boarding passes and got on the airplane.

Have no idea why they would say the FAA "requires" someone to sit next to the window. Its not as if you could roll it down and get more air.:hysterical:

Maybe the airline is fearful of a suit if someone in the row trips over the O2 line and sues the airline.

The emergency row restriction is reasonable and we do not sit there if we are not upgraded since the web sites clearly ask if one is able to handle the emergency door. We also never pick the bulkhead row since as noted, no place for the POC.

Airlines sometimes quote non existent FAA or DOT regs to suit their own purposes. 

Cheers


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## Fern Modena (Sep 30, 2011)

It appears that AA is not following the rules on its own website, which you can see here.  Among other things it says that you should call reservations and notify them that you are traveling with a POC, and then they will have a specialist call you back and discuss rules with you, etc.  And although it doesn't quote the FAA, it does say that the person with the POC may *not* sit in any seat where they would block anybody else's egress to the aisle.  Obviously your wife's seat does.

Fern


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## x3 skier (Sep 30, 2011)

Fern Modena said:


> And although it doesn't quote the FAA, it does say that the person with the POC may *not* sit in any seat where they would block *anybody* else's egress to the aisle.  Obviously your wife's seat does.
> 
> Fern



It is only me.  

Cheers


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## SuzanneSLO (Sep 30, 2011)

dougp26364 said:


> It use to be but, lately United and Frontier have attempted to check our rollaboards through to our final destination on regional jets. I fear this will become the norm with all airlines as it saves the airline manpower and time (no one has to seperate carry-on's for plane side pick up). Frontier wasn't giving passengers a choice on their regional jets. They were checked through to the final destination, you left your bag or you didn't fly. Those were your choices.
> 
> The saving grace with Frontier is that they're using newer and larger Embrair (sp?) jets that have more space in their overhead bins. we had two 21" carry on bags and both fit, although not wheels in first but sideways.
> 
> ...



It sounds like you might want to try to plan your travel to avoid regional jets. We live in a podunk town and drive about 4 hours to get to a major airport, passing numerous regional airports on the way.  We find that this also give us the option for many non-stop flights as well, which cuts down the drama with our travel.  Best of luck -- Suzanne


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## Timeshare Von (Oct 1, 2011)

SuzanneSLO said:


> It sounds like you might want to try to plan your travel to avoid regional jets. We live in a podunk town and drive about 4 hours to get to a major airport, passing numerous regional airports on the way.  We find that this also give us the option for many non-stop flights as well, which cuts down the drama with our travel.  Best of luck -- Suzanne



Tough to do Suzanne especially since the airlines (DL especially) will initially schedule with a larger plane only to downsize to a regional jet if they don't have the passenger load.  That's happened to me twice this summer!


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