# long time HGVC owners - question



## knagel (Aug 19, 2013)

Have the points required to stay a week somewhere changed over the years?  I just bought 2 7000pt platinum weeks in Orlando, to be used anywhere, anytime.  I am just wondering if 10 years from now that 14000pts will still get 2 weeks in platinum season anywhere, anytime.

Anyone know if the RCI point amounts required to stay have changed over time too?

Lastly, what does elite status gain you from HGVC when buying direct from them?  If a person already has elite status from purchasing direct from them and decides to purchase some more "points" in the resale market, does that effect the elite status in HGVC eyes?

Thanks in advance!

Kevin


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## SmithOp (Aug 19, 2013)

Not likely to change existing resorts since they were all sold based on that point system.  They tried higher points with Kingsland and Grand Waikikian but seem to have backed off to lower point cost units at Kingsland phase 2, and cut back on plushness of the units.

Resale points don't count toward elite status, they have been grandfathered in with new purchase deals from the developer in the past, but not something in writing just if you catch a sales manager in a desperate mood.


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## RX8 (Aug 19, 2013)

And to answer your specific question - if you are currently elite buying more points resale won't effect your elite status either way (HGVC won't take away elite but points also do not count towards the next tier elite status).


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## Talent312 (Aug 19, 2013)

In the far distant past when HGVC was in its infancy, HGVC made some "adjustments" to the point structure at Flamingo and IIRC Seaworld... but they haven't tried anything like that at existing resorts since. 

If you think about, when they sell out a resort, the resort as a whole carries a total #of points.  If they changed that it would create a serious imbalance in demand for its use and affect the home-resort rights of existing owners... it would make a great class-action... but as I said... not gonna happen.
.


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## knagel (Aug 19, 2013)

RX8 said:


> And to answer your specific question - if you are currently elite buying more points resale won't effect your elite status either way (HGVC won't take away elite but points also do not count towards the next tier elite status).



what does the different tier elite status give you for benefits? and what are the tier breakdowns or what is the next tier?


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## SmithOp (Aug 19, 2013)

http://www.hgvcelite.com/Elite.aspx


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## Talent312 (Aug 20, 2013)

knagel said:


> Lastly, what does elite status gain you from HGVC when buying direct from them?  If a person already has elite status from purchasing direct from them and decides to purchase some more "points" in the resale market, does that effect the elite status in HGVC eyes?



1. A few perks, but nothing worth paying the extra freight over resale prices.
_... Even those here who enjoy their elite status will tell you that._

B. Nowadays, buying resale has no effect on elite status, either good or bad.

I bought resale from a guy who originally bought his unit in 2001.  In 2011,
HGVC thanked me for being a 10-year owner. They may be clueless that I'm
not the original owner, but then, I didn't ask for elite status either. 
.


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## knagel (Aug 20, 2013)

Has RCI increased the amount of points required over the years or have they stayed the same as HGVC has?  Meaning did 14000 points in the RCI network 10 years ago get you the same lengths of stay at the same resorts as what they do now?

Thanks again for all the GREAT info.  I am excited to start going on vacations!!!!


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## SmithOp (Aug 20, 2013)

Points have stayed consistent through the Hilton RCI portal, you can only see the Gold Crown rated resorts, lower rated are filtered out by the portal. It's been in the club rules since I've owned in 2001.

WORLDWIDE EXCHANGE RESERVATIONS

In addition to the direct reservation opportunities at Club affiliated resorts, your membership program is further enhanced by our partnership with leading exchange companies including RCI, and our affiliation with specialized exchange services offering preferred quality resorts and locations throughout the world.

POINT VALUES FOR RCI EXCHANGE RESERVATIONS

Unit Size        Points Required. Per Night.        per 7-Night
Studio        Starting at 120 to 480      Starting at 1,200 to 2,400
1 BedroomStarting at 170 to 680      Starting at 1,700 to 3,400
2 BedroomStarting at 240 to 960      Starting at 2,400 to 4,800
3 BedroomStarting at 290 to 1,170      Starting at 2,900 to 5,800

http://www.2013clubprogram.com/worldwide-exchange-reservations/

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## PigsDad (Aug 20, 2013)

SmithOp said:


> Points have stayed consistent through the Hilton RCI portal, *you can only see the Gold Crown rated resorts, lower rated are filtered out by the portal*. It's been in the club rules since I've owned in 2001.


I see Silver Crown and even Hospitality resorts in the HGVC RCI portal all the time.  I do believe they do filter out some resorts, but it is not just Gold Crown that we can see.

Kurt


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## dvc_john (Aug 20, 2013)

I can think of 2 instances where there has been change to a point schedule.

1) At HGVC I-drive (Tuscany), they originally had the same silver weeks that HGVC SeaWorld has. But they changed those silver weeks to gold weeks very early on.

2) At a SW Florida affiliate, I week I own was brought into the HGVC system as a Silver week, but after a year or two was upgraded to gold.


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## knagel (Aug 20, 2013)

what are the stipulations on friends and family using some of your points on a trip you might not go on?

As long as we book the trip for them, they can go, no problems or questions asked?  OR, do we have to be present on every trip for check in under our name?


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## alwysonvac (Aug 20, 2013)

knagel said:


> Have the points required to stay a week somewhere changed over the years?  *I just bought *2 7000pt platinum weeks in Orlando, to be used anywhere, anytime.  I am just wondering if 10 years from now that 14000pts will still get 2 weeks in platinum season anywhere, anytime.



If you just bought a couple of days ago then you should really consider rescinding until you fully understand the PROs & CONs. The rescission period is the only chance you'll have in getting all of your money back. You'll never sell your weeks for the price you paid from the developer.

In regards to your question, will you still get 2 weeks in platinum season anywhere, anytime? In the beginning the point structure was consistent but the Club point requirements have increased along the way for the newer HGVC resorts/locations. There is no guarantee that the newer resorts/locations will have the standard two bedroom platinum season for 7,000 points and when/if it's available there might be a limited number due to various room types they've now created. Parc Soliel in Orlando is a perfect example of room types gone wild -  http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/parc-soleil-orlando-florida/ :annoyed:

You can find the point charts on the HGVC site - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resorts/

Examples of HGVC Resorts with Higher Point Requirements
Sunrise Lodge (Utah) - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/sunrise-lodge-park-city-utah/ (Managed by HGVC / Affiliated Resort)
Trump Tower (Las Vegas) - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/trump-international-hotel-las-vegas-nevada/ (Managed by HGVC / Affiliated Resort)
Grand Waikikian (Oahu) - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/grand-waikikian-island-of-oahu-honolulu-hawaii/
West 57th (NYC) [no 2 bdrms; one bdrm platinum 7200 points] - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/west-57th-street-by-hilton-club-new-york-city/
Hokulani (Oahu) [no 2 bdrms; one bdrm platinum 6200 points] - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/hokulani-waikiki-hawaii/ (Managed by HGVC / Affiliated Resort)

Examples of HGVC Resorts with the most standard rooms under the old Point Structure
SeaWorld (Orlando) - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/seaworld-orlando-florida/
Intl Dr (Orlando) - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/international-drive-orlando-florida/
South Beach (Miami) - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/south-beach-miami-beach-florida/
Flamingo (Vegas) - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/the-flamingo-las-vegas-nevada/
Karen Ave (Vegas) - http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/las-vegas-nevada/

NOTE: I think _*most*_ of the non-HGVC developed resorts that participate in the Club offer the old point structure so far (including the newer affiliates).


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## Talent312 (Aug 20, 2013)

You can order a Guest Certificate for friends+family for any booking, 'cept "open season" (cash-discount for members-only). You'll have to pay a fee for the GC, unless its a home-week booking.

If you will be "compensated" by your "friends," you should know that technically, you may only rent out a home-week booking.  If one of your friends lets it drop that they paid you for  a club-reservation, they could in theory, get the boot.

Underage peep or peep with a brood larger than the unit permits could find checking in on their own a wee-bit difficult.
----------------------------------
OP... You may notice that in the point-changes referred to by dvc, that the owner's unit-status changed, too. IOW, the change worked to the owners' advantage... more points all around.
.


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## knagel (Aug 21, 2013)

alwysonvac said:


> If you just bought a couple of days ago then you should really consider rescinding until you fully understand the PROs & CONs. The rescission period is the only chance you'll have in getting all of your money back. You'll never sell your weeks for the price you paid from the developer.
> 
> In regards to your question, will you still get 2 weeks in platinum season anywhere, anytime? In the beginning the point structure was consistent but the Club point requirements have increased along the way for the newer HGVC resorts/locations. There is no guarantee that the newer resorts/locations will have the standard two bedroom platinum season for 7,000 points and when/if it's available there might be a limited number due to various room types they've now created. Parc Soliel in Orlando is a perfect example of room types gone wild -  http://www.2013clubprogram.com/resort/parc-soleil-orlando-florida/ :annoyed:
> 
> ...



Past the 10 day period and not really interested in resending anyhow.  Just have questions I am unsure of.  I think this is great for the right people that can use it.  If you can't use it, then it is not right for you.

I did not know I had a home week.  I know I purchased phase 2 Parc Soleis, but was unaware that I had a home week.

Also was unaware that my points didn't exchange anywhere for the same amount.  The way the sales man explained it to us was our 14000 points was good for 2 weeks anywhere in HGVC.  So if we wanted to sell 1 week to friends to go to Hawaii (to pay for the annual maintenance costs for both units) then we would still have a week for us to use for basically free each year.  The was it appears to me based off the link in your page, that it costs over 14000 points to stay in Hawaii which our package wouldn't even get us 1 week there.  I might be calling the salesman soon if this is correct.


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## presley (Aug 21, 2013)

knagel said:


> Also was unaware that my points didn't exchange anywhere for the same amount.  The way the sales man explained it to us was our 14000 points was good for 2 weeks anywhere in HGVC.  So if we wanted to sell 1 week to friends to go to Hawaii (to pay for the annual maintenance costs for both units) then we would still have a week for us to use for basically free each year.  The was it appears to me based off the link in your page, that it costs over 14000 points to stay in Hawaii which our package wouldn't even get us 1 week there.  I might be calling the salesman soon if this is correct.



There are weeks that you can get 2, 2bedrooms in Hawaii.  You just cannot get all of them.  Anything that was said but wasn't written into the contract isn't what you signed for.  

Look at your paperwork and it will show you what week(s) you bought.  Most are sold as floating units within a season.  That means your home week is one of several options.  It's a very good system.


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## dvc_john (Aug 21, 2013)

Apparently you purchased 2  2-br Platinum weeks at Parc Soliel, each worth 7000 points for a total of 14000 points.

I think the links you are looking at are for the resorts with higher point requirements.  You need to look at all the resort point charts.

For example:
Grand Waikikian at Hilton Hawaiian Village points for a 2-br range from 7500 for a standard 2-br in Gold season, to 24000 points for a 2-br penthouse in Platinum season.

Lagoon Tower at Hilton Hawaiian Village points for a 2-br range from 5000 for a standard 2-br in Gold season, 7000 for a standard 2-br in Platinum season, and 9600 for a 2-br premier in Platinum season.

You can stretch your points by going in Gold season instead of Platinum, or skipping a weekend day, or downsizing to a 1-br if that's all you need.

On the other hand, your points won't go as far if you choose Penthouse or Premier units (in resorts that have them).


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## knagel (Aug 21, 2013)

sorry for all the questions....  

can someone explain the home week to me?  

I am really trying to learn as much as I can about HGVC because I think it is actually a great deal.


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## presley (Aug 21, 2013)

knagel said:


> sorry for all the questions....
> 
> can someone explain the home week to me?
> 
> I am really trying to learn as much as I can about HGVC because I think it is actually a great deal.


Your home week is a full week in whatever unit you bought with a Saturday check in /check out.  It is only useful if you want to book that full week at your resort because you can book it 12 months in advance.

Also, if you decided to rent out your week, you can only rent out the week that you own.  You would want to make the reservation for a holiday week or some other high demand week.

All other reservations can only booked 9 months or less in advance.


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## knagel (Aug 21, 2013)

where does it say when your home week is?  Is it the same week when you bought the contract?  Or is it stated somewhere in the contract?

thanks


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## dvc_john (Aug 21, 2013)

Your home week is any week at the resort you bought at, in the unit size you bought, in the season you bought. (It may be a specific unit week in your documents, I can't really recall, but it doesn't matter.) For Parc Soleil, Platinum weeks are weeks 6-15, 24-32, and 51-52. All other weeks at that resort are Gold. Platinum weeks are worth more points than Gold weeks. But there are variations in point values for a 2-br based on 2-br, 2-br plus, and 2-br premiere.

So, it seems in your case, your home week(s) are any 2-br Platinum week at Parc Soleil. You can book that week at 12 months out if you wish.

But, you can use the points instead to book any resort, any season, any unit size, beginning any day of the week, for any number of days (minimum 3 days) at the 9 month mark, limited only by the number of points you have, and availability for what you want at a given resort.


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## PigsDad (Aug 21, 2013)

In your case, I will bet you will rarely, if ever, utilize your Home Week booking advantage.  That is simply because there is always plenty of availability at all of the Orlando resorts, so you won't need to book 9 to 12 months out for a week at Parc Soliel.

IMO, what you need to focus on is that you have 14K annual points (and probably some bonus points if you purchased from the developer) and how to best use those points.  I would really suggest reading the club rules in the online owner's guide completely, expecially the Club Features section.  This is where you will get your questions answered on how you can use your points.  Talking to the salesman will not yield an authoritative answer, as they are focused on selling, not using; and often they are flat-out wrong.

Welcome to HGVC!  It is a great system and with 14K points, you will have a ton of choices on how to use them.

Kurt

ETA: Since you purchased 14K points, you will have Elite privileges.  You can go to the Elite website to see what benefits you have.


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## presley (Aug 21, 2013)

PigsDad said:


> (and probably some bonus points if you purchased from the developer) and how to best use those points.



Awesome point, PigsDad.

Knagle, your bonus points will expire two years from when you signed the contract.  You want to use those first.  Travel has to be completed within the 2 years.  You can't wait until the last day and book a trip for the next day.  Very important to use those first, worry about your normal HGVC points later.


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## Talent312 (Aug 21, 2013)

knagel said:


> Where does it say when your home week is?
> Is it the same week when you bought the contract?
> Or is it stated somewhere in the contract?



To summarize:  Your contract & deed states which unit + week you bought.
However, as you have learned that unit is not yours to use. It's kept by "the club."
Kind'a like how in the mafia, your life is not your own, but you are taken care of...
or so I'm told.

Your home-week is one week (using the resort's weekly check in date), in the same size (class) unit and in the same season as the unit you own. You can book a home-week from 12-9 months out from your intended stay. It does not overlap with club reservations. You must use the points from the year you are booking. You cannot use banked or borrowed points.

Many peep never make home-week bookings, even if they stay at the resort where they own, since club reservations are far more flexible (3N minimums, any size, any season).  In fact, you will likely never know which unit at your home-resort is "yours."
.
Clear as mud?
.


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## knagel (Aug 21, 2013)

Talent312 said:


> To summarize:  Your contract & deed states which unit + week you bought.
> However, as you have learned that unit is not yours to use. It's kept by "the club."
> Kind'a like how in the mafia, your life is not your own, but you are taken care of...
> or so I'm told.
> ...



Definitely!!!!!!      You guys are great help!!!!!
Thanks again!  I am so looking forward to getting the information pack so we can start planning vacations!!!!  We just bought 8/1/13 so we haven't even got the info pack or anything so we can start booking travel.

Has anyone on here bought points on the open market?  We are thinking about doing so as we would like to travel about 4 weeks per year with the kids while they are still tolerant of their parents!!!!  Are buying points on the open market worth doing so?  If so, what do you look for besides the cost ratio of price vs. points.  Do you need to worry about the home location?  I would assume that location effects your maintenance fee.  I know we would then be locked in to maintenance fees the rest of our lives, but we are from IA and are planning on being snow birds in Jan, Feb and March and would like to have enough points to stay that long somewhere when we retire.

I guess the question is:......  has anyone bought points resale and is it worth it ( is it easy to do)?

Kevin


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## buzglyd (Aug 21, 2013)

knagel said:


> Definitely!!!!!!      You guys are great help!!!!!
> Thanks again!  I am so looking forward to getting the information pack so we can start planning vacations!!!!  We just bought 8/1/13 so we haven't even got the info pack or anything so we can start booking travel.
> 
> Has anyone on here bought points on the open market?  We are thinking about doing so as we would like to travel about 4 weeks per year with the kids while they are still tolerant of their parents!!!!  Are buying points on the open market worth doing so?  If so, what do you look for besides the cost ratio of price vs. points.  Do you need to worry about the home location?  I would assume that location effects your maintenance fee.  I know we would then be locked in to maintenance fees the rest of our lives, but we are from IA and are planning on being snow birds in Jan, Feb and March and would like to have enough points to stay that long somewhere when we retire.
> ...



Just go on the website and you can download all the info in PDF and put it on your Pad or Kindle. I've never gotten any welcome packet but I bought resale.


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## RX8 (Aug 21, 2013)

If you would like to share I am curious as to what price 14,000 points purchased direct are going for these days.  Thanks!


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## GregT (Aug 22, 2013)

knagel said:


> I guess the question is:......  has anyone bought points resale and is it worth it ( is it easy to do)?
> 
> Kevin



Kevin,

Yes, I purchased to two weeks resale -- both 4,800 Platinum packages in Orlando.  I do not expect to ever use my home week, as I use the points to travel to Hawaii, right now HHV (4X) and Waikoloa (1X) with another HHV booked for 2014.

HGVC rocks -- and they treat resale purchasers (like me) very well.  Spend some time with the system and when the time is right, buy another package.  There isn't really a hurry here as the prices are pretty stable.

Good luck and welcome to HGVC!

Best,

Greg


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## knagel (Aug 22, 2013)

I too am wondering if I over paid and what points have sold for in the past.

I paid 8/1/13 for 14000 pts in Parc Soliel platinum season with 42,000 bonus points added with 4 years to use the bonus points ( 2 years to book and can book 2 years out), $77,981 with maintenance fees of 900.96 9x2), taxes of $139.70(x2), and dues of $125 per person (x2).

So....  $77981 for 70000 pts to be used in the 1st year or two.  Then 14000 pts every year after.  With a 2331.32 yearly fee

So basically guaranteed 2 wks a year for the rest of our lives for 2331.32 per year.  I didn't think $1150.00 per week at just about any resort in the world for 2 weeks sounded too bad.  I'm 44 so over 25 years (hopefully ) that's $5450.56 per year for 2 weeks anywhere basically.  Then we can will the property to the kids and they would have 2 weeks anywhere for 2331.32 per year.

That's why I was curious how much the points and maintenance fees have changed in the last 10 years.  This is a good hedge on inflation for luxurious properties.

Heck some if the motels I've stayed in the parking alone is enough to make you want to put a gun to your head.  With the parking included in the resorts there is a $20-$50 per day savings right there.  Yes.... we drive most places we can.  Just got back from IA to FL, SC to IA.  3100 miles and spent $500 in fuel and was gone 13 days.  Cheaper than air fair to all the places, but yes.... it does take a heck of a lot longer 

So...... the question is...... how badly did I over pay??????

Lay it on me.... I'm sitting down


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## knagel (Aug 22, 2013)

GregT said:


> Kevin,
> 
> Yes, I purchased to two weeks resale -- both 4,800 Platinum packages in Orlando.  I do not expect to ever use my home week, as I use the points to travel to Hawaii, right now HHV (4X) and Waikoloa (1X) with another HHV booked for 2014.
> 
> ...



Thanks for all the welcomes!!!!  Is it true you can buy like 7000 pts resale for $3000 or less from what I have been seeing?  Then just take over the maintenance?  I have also read that you want to make sure the past maintenance is paid up too and that there are no borrowed points against it, correct?


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## GregT (Aug 22, 2013)

knagel said:


> I too am wondering if I over paid and what points have sold for in the past.
> 
> I paid 8/1/13 for 14000 pts in Parc Soliel platinum season with 42,000 bonus points added with 4 years to use the bonus points ( 2 years to book and can book 2 years out), $77,981 with maintenance fees of 900.96 9x2), taxes of $139.70(x2), and dues of $125 per person (x2).
> 
> ...



Kevin,

Yes you did overpay, but the good news (such as it is) is that most of us purchased from a Developer doh at one point or another, so you are in good company.

HGVC weeks can typically be acquired for approx. $1/point (based on the annual allotment) so you could resell your two weeks for approx. $14K, give or take a little bit.

Your 42,000 bonus points are valuable, but they won't close the gap.   Pretend for a moment that you use those points to book 6 weeks of vacation in a 2BR somewhere (assume you can book weeks at a high rent place like HHV) and then you rent those weeks for $2,000, that's another $12,000 of value that you received.

The rest is the premium, in my opinion.   I paid a similar premium when I bought my Marriott (and wrote a similar size check for a single week).  But I love my week(s), I'm committed, and they have changed my philosophy to vacationing.

The MFs typically increase at a 3-5% rate per year, and can be a little frustrating.  Again, the positives here are that you have a lot of points to work with annually (and the bonus points) and you are in a terrific system that is expanding.

With all those bonus points, you may wish to take the "excess" and look for rentable reservations -- either at Parc Soleil (if you book a July 4th reservation, or similar high demand holiday) or at one of the other properties (but you know the rules on renting something other than your home week).

Good luck and welcome to TUG and HGVC!

Best,

Greg


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## presley (Aug 22, 2013)

knagel said:


> Thanks for all the welcomes!!!!  Is it true you can buy like 7000 pts resale for $3000 or less from what I have been seeing?  Then just take over the maintenance?  I have also read that you want to make sure the past maintenance is paid up too and that there are no borrowed points against it, correct?



Yes, you can buy for much less on the resale market.  I'm pretty sure Hilton won't transfer an account with past due MFs, so I don't think that's something that you need to worry about while shopping.

I am not a wheeler dealer.  I happened to be in the right place at the right time (long story).  I have 15,000 annual HGVC points, elite status and I paid about $15K altogether.  My annual dues are around $3K, including taxes and such.


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## RX8 (Aug 22, 2013)

Do have some good news for you.   You indicated that you are to pay $125 member dues X2.  You only have to pay ONE membership fee regardless how many weeks you own.


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## PigsDad (Aug 22, 2013)

knagel said:


> ... and dues of $125 per person (x2).


One small note: unless you deeded your two weeks to two different people (yourself for one and you wife for the other, for example), you will only have one annual annual membership fee of $125.  The membership fees are per account, not per week, so you can own 20 weeks / contracts and still only pay one annual membership fee.

Like Presley, I feel that I was in the right place at the right time as well.  With two separate purchases, I ended up w/ 15,400 points, elite status, and total MF+taxes of about $2300.  My two weeks (8400 and 7000 pts.) were both resale, via a broker and an onsite sales department at an older resort.

If you have not received your welcome packet yet, you could give HGVC a call and they may have your account number ready so that you can log into hgvclub.com.  Might give you a jump start on using all those bonus points!

Kurt

ETA: I see that RX8 beat me to the punch.  Newman!


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## presley (Aug 22, 2013)

PigsDad said:


> If you have not received your welcome packet yet, you could give HGVC a call and they may have your account number ready so that you can log into hgvclub.com.  Might give you a jump start on using all those bonus points!



I have to echo this.  Call and get your log in information today.  You have a lot of bonus points that you need to figure out how to use.  I don't think I could use all of those without taking a really expensive cruise.


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## kanerf (Aug 22, 2013)

Don't forget to take a look at the RCI portal once you get your account.  This is a good way to use points if you don't think you can use them all at HGVC.  You can get into Disney Vacation Club properties through RCI and many other nice locations where HGVC does not have a presence.  I like National Harbor in Maryland, just outside D.C. on the Potomac.


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## jonevans (Aug 22, 2013)

*you got the right points 7000*

I looked at HGVC for years before i made my first purchase of 7000 points at seaworld. cost of mine was $1 per point or so but am looking for another  7000 point right now. You got what I would say is the best points package  and are the perfect size  and charge the best maintenance fees because maintenance fees are all based on room size and a 2 bed that gives you 7000 points yearly maintenance fees is the same as a 2 bed in gold season and only worth 5000 points so you are getting 2000 more points plus the ability to book any time of the year and if you want can stretch your point out by choosing season you like.  I think 14000 point will keep you happy for a long time and you can stay as long as you like in any resort with the ability to bank when times are tough on funds and splurge when you can borrow from next years bank.

Don't buy the HHonor point as a benefit but as  a back up plan when you mess up all your planning and get to years end  and the best plan is to book early (9month mark is when you plan your stay  using the the check out date) and often and keep the need for more point is better that having to many. 

and like every one will tell you welcome to one of the best   and hoping for long and happy stay to you and yours.

PS will not be long before you will start to look at a new time share just for II trades  as I am at this point now


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## jonevans (Aug 22, 2013)

And one more thing

You are very smart to have found TUG and you will always now know where to get answers and will not be long before you will be giving insight and wanting your picture on the monthly news letter holding the TUG banner in front of the resort of your choosing.

and yes I would call HGVC after 4 or 5 weeks of singing papers and get my log in info so you can start planing and enjoying a well paid for vacation and just FYI was just at Hyatt in Carmel CA and a 1 bed room there 2200 point was $30000


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## knagel (Aug 24, 2013)

Are any on the other Vaction clubs as good as Hilton?  Meaning, do they offer same Points, MF, RCVI reservations, locations, etc.?  What sets Hilton apart from the rest if they are not as good?

Kevin


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## Sandy VDH (Aug 24, 2013)

There are plenty of vacation clubs, Four Seasons, Hyatt, Marriott, Starwood, Wyndham, Disney, Holiday Inn, Bluegreen, etc. 

They are all slightly different.  Some are pure points and were only sold that way.  Some are deeds converted to a point value.  Some are mixed, with mixed participation, in that some owners have converted to points and other owners just own the old week style units.  Each MINI club each have +s and -s with them. 

I also own Wyndham and Holiday Inn Vacation Club (HIVC) point systems.  Both because I had an ownership at a resort that got taken over by the operator with a point system.  

I love Wyndham because it is very flexible, and gives great VIP perks (like Hilton's Elite levels), as I own a lot of Wyndham points I am their highest level at VIP Platinum.  HIVC is just there, I don't have many points, but it gives me another venue.

One thing to consider in your view of cost per vacation.  The MFs are NOT set.  They will increase a few percent every year.  There is also a chance of a special assessment, but HGVC is one of the better companies in funding reserves out of the MFs.  So it has not had a history of special assessments, but it has happened occasionally at some of the affiliate resorts.  Have not yet heard it happen at a HGVC specific built resort.


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## knagel (Aug 24, 2013)

I know GregT said I did over pay for the package I got from HGVC.  Just curious as to what 2013 Parc Solies packages are going for direct from the HGVC like I purchased.  It cost me around $5 per point or a little more.  Was that high and by how much?

Also are the other vacation clubs about the same cost per point?  Do they get you the same locations thru RCI like HGVC does?  Are their locations nicer than HGVC?  Or is everything about the same other than MF.  Like the Wyndham club, what are the cost per point there and is everything else about the same as HGVC?

thanks
Kevin


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## GregT (Aug 24, 2013)

knagel said:


> I know GregT said I did over pay for the package



Kevin,

I'm sorry to have been the bearer of bad news -- but honestly the real positive here is that HGVC is a tremendous system and you have enough points to really use the system effectively.

HGVC's own reservation system is very flexible and the properties are very high quality.  I know you will enjoy your ownership!  And most of us did buy direct from the developer at one point or another, so you are in very good company...

Best,

Greg


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## PigsDad (Aug 24, 2013)

knagel said:


> Also are the other vacation clubs about the same cost per point?  Do they get you the same locations thru RCI like HGVC does?  Are their locations nicer than HGVC?  Or is everything about the same other than MF.  Like the Wyndham club, what are the cost per point there and is everything else about the same as HGVC?



Yes, you overpaid, but that is water under the bridge right now.  My advice is to not dwell on that and focus on what a great system you now own.  And trust me, you are not the first nor the last person to over pay here. 

You can't compare cost/point across different vacation clubs, since they all use different point scales.  But I think that among the nicer systems, HGVC gives you a very good bang for the buck with ongoing cost per week, especially if you can use some point stretching tactics.  When we first started HGVC, we owned a single week (3BR, 8400 points) and the current MF for that is about $1200.  We consistently stretched that into an average of 2 1/2 weeks of vacation a year in 1- and 2-BR accommodations.

As to the luxury level, I may be biased, but I think the average HGVC falls in the top 10%.  There was an interesting thread on TUG recently discussing the different "tiers" of timeshare systems.

As to flexibility, it is hard to beat HGVC.  You can stay in any size unit, for any amount of days (3-day min usually), start and end on any day of the week, in any season -- all of this while booking up to 9 months out (some other systems are very flexible, but only for 30- or 60- days out, which doesn't give you much time to plan).  Worldmark is also another system that stands out for its flexibility -- it is as good or better than HGVC.

Just some of my thoughts,
Kurt


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## PamMo (Aug 24, 2013)

knagel said:


> I know GregT said I did over pay for the package I got from HGVC.  Just curious as to what 2013 Parc Solies packages are going for direct from the HGVC like I purchased.  It cost me around $5 per point or a little more.  Was that high and by how much?



Kevin, at this point it truly is water under the bridge, and you'll find out there are plenty of people who paid more and plenty of people who paid less. The key now is for you to figure out how to use all those points - that's the fun part!!! You were smart to look up TUG, as you'll get great advice from experts who know how to work the system to the max!


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## presley (Aug 24, 2013)

I don't think GregT was saying you paid too much compared to other identical direct contracts.  I think he was just saying that you could have purchased the same amount of points for less on the resale market.

I like HGVC the best because the resorts are excellent quality, the service is excellent and it is easy to book to shorter stays places.  

I don't think it is a good system to buy into for trading because it costs so much more than other systems.  Most resorts that you would trade into would be lower quality than the Hilton resorts.  If you are looking to buy a good trader, Worldmark is really the way to go.  Very low cost system with very high trading power in all the exchange companies.


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## knagel (Aug 24, 2013)

presley said:


> I don't think GregT was saying you paid too much compared to other identical direct contracts.  I think he was just saying that you could have purchased the same amount of points for less on the resale market.
> 
> That is my question.  They say I over paid, which I understand I paid more than it would have cost on the resale market.  But, how much did I over pay compaired to others?  I know it is water over the bridge now and I am still happy I purchased as it is getting the ball rolling for many new adventures.  I am just curious as I told you what I paid for the # of point I bought direct.  Wondering what other people PAID, not just that I over paid.
> I like HGVC the best because the resorts are excellent quality, the service is excellent and it is easy to book to shorter stays places.
> ...



Are you saying the RCI resorts are not as good of resorts as the HGVC resorts.  One of the main reasons I bought was to mostly use the RCI network and only occasionally use HGVC resorts.  We are thinking of Mexico, Bahamas, Canada, Hawaii, Dubai, etc.  I know HGVC are some of the places, but not all.  So are you saying if I would like to use the RCI reservations more so than HGVC resorts then another product is better suited for trading points?

Thanks again


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## presley (Aug 24, 2013)

knagel said:


> Are you saying the RCI resorts are not as good of resorts as the HGVC resorts.  One of the main reasons I bought was to mostly use the RCI network and only occasionally use HGVC resorts.  We are thinking of Mexico, Bahamas, Canada, Hawaii, Dubai, etc.  I know HGVC are some of the places, but not all.  So are you saying if I would like to use the RCI reservations more so than HGVC resorts then another product is better suited for trading points?



Yes.  Of the areas you mentioned, the only one I travel to is Hawaii.  I don't know of any resorts in RCI besides HGVC that would compare to HGVC.  There are other exchange companies that have higher quality resorts, but Hilton is at the top of the chain for RCI.  

You could also look at the smaller exchange companies.  SFX is one that I use regularly.  They are much more picky about which resorts they carry than RCI is.  The only downside is that they have much less exchange inventory.  Of course, if quality of resorts matters to you, you'd at least have peace of mind knowing you are only exposed to higher rated resorts.


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## presley (Aug 24, 2013)

It might be hard to find people posting what they paid for exactly what you bought.  Most people never post on forums and those that do have all bought different contracts.  Some people will never want to say what they paid.

You might be better off looking at what resale contracts are listed for.  Listed price is usually higher than the selling price, except on Ebay.  Here are some regular HGVC resellers.

judikoz.com
sellingtimeshares.net
atimesharebroker.com


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## SmithOp (Aug 24, 2013)

I think direct pricing is consistent based on location and unit types, so you didn't pay too much compared to other direct purchases.  The only deals I've heard about are if you buy pre-construction like I did.  I paid $29k for every other year 7000 points my first purchase, HHV Lagoon Premier Gold. I drank the kool-aid again when they offered Kingsland pre-construction, I paid $17.5k for every other year 8700 gold points plus 6000 bonus points.

Now compared to resale, yes, we all paid too much when we bought direct before learning of resale market.  The brokers Presley mentioned will give you a fair idea of the resale price needed to pass ROFR.  There are some eBay deals that get past ROFR for less, but it's not consistent enough to predict what Hilton will take vs pass on.

In 2009 people were dumping Bay Club because of a special assessment, I picked up a 1br 4800 points every other year to match my Kingsland for $299. We stay in that unit and my brother in law pays the Kingsland fees and uses that unit.  It's not simple to rent your weeks, even dealing with family.

Your ongoing fees are lower than mine since I own Hawaii, but it's been worth it to me for the home resort booking advantage. In the years I have 13,500 points the fees are about $2600 all in with club fees and taxes.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## GeorgeJ. (Aug 30, 2013)

Talent312 said:


> In the far distant past when HGVC was in its infancy, HGVC made some "adjustments" to the point structure at Flamingo and IIRC Seaworld... but they haven't tried anything like that at existing resorts since.
> 
> If you think about, when they sell out a resort, the resort as a whole carries a total #of points.  If they changed that it would create a serious imbalance in demand for its use and affect the home-resort rights of existing owners... it would make a great class-action... but as I said... not gonna happen.
> .



I believe that the original seasons at Flamingo were Gold, Silver & Bronze. Then they bumped each up a season a few years later after Seaworld was built.


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## vacationbear (Sep 2, 2013)

*HGVC points "never" expire?*

Hi
Also new to TUG and being amazed about the wealth of info available!
I am about to buy the first timeshare and would like to ask feedback to what has become the last two and most important questions for me.

During two HGVC presentations (2010 & this last July 2013 at HHV) the sales guys stated that those HGVC points "never expire". The 2012 club member guide on page 155 states quite clearly that they do indeed expire unless they are "rescued". Even then the rescued points will expire by the end of the following year.

Question 1: Assuming simple math: if I buy 7000 points and don't take a vacation for several years, would my account ever see 21000, 28000 points? This assumes I don't convert into HH points (nice feature, I am a member there for over 20 years).


Home resort week/ resort concept is confusing. I am looking for 9600 points to buy. Considering my situation: have kids, could see myself going to HHV, Lagoon Tower five of the next ten years but will also travel to other HGVC resorts in other years.

Question 2: What is the probability to get a 2 or 3 bedroom Plus or Premier during school summer break, say from mid June to first week in August at the Lagoon Tower during open season? 0%, 25%, 50%, 75% or 100%

Your input will guide me to either buy into the Lagoon Tower or go go after the most points at the cheapest MF (Kings Land or Las Vegas comes to mind).


Thank you all in advance!


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## GregT (Sep 2, 2013)

vacationbear said:


> Hi
> Also new to TUG and being amazed about the wealth of info available!
> I am about to buy the first timeshare and would like to ask feedback to what has become the last two and most important questions for me.
> 
> ...



If you want primarily Spring Break and summer reservations at Lagoon Tower, then buying there does most sense.   9,600 point packages are rare, and so are 8,400 point packages.  An 8,400 sold recently on eBay for $20K.    That being said, if you're only to use it half of the time, it's an expensive property to have for that level of frequency.

If I was buying for this purpose, I would steer away from the (fantastic) 9,600 point package, because if you decide you want to extend your home week reservation by 3 days to make a 10 day reservation, it's a lot lower probability that you can get a 3 day reservation in a 9,600 than in an 8,400 point room (a lot more 8,400 point rooms).   

Under this strategy, you would be booking a 2BR Plus 12 months out to secure your home resort week, and then 9 months out, trying to append on 3 (or 4 or 5) days to make a longer trip.  It will be hard enough to do this with an 8,400 point reservation, but near impossible with a 9,600 point room.

I hope that helps?

Best,

Greg


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## PassionForTravel (Sep 4, 2013)

In answer to your second question of getting a reservation at HHV during open season (30 days ahead cash is that what you meant?) during school holidays close to 0%.

Ian


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## vacationbear (Sep 4, 2013)

Thanks for the feedback, in particular GregT!!!

Started to process of buying into he Lagoon Tower...

Cheers
Frank


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