# Dog friendly TS in California raises the bar for other resorts



## windyriver (Sep 19, 2014)

We are currently enjoying an exchange through DAE at the Stardust in South Lake Tahoe. Our first day here we were shocked to see DOGS on the property.
It turns out that a group of owners here proposed that the resort do a trial of allowing guests to bring their dogs. The policy or "trial" has been in place at least a year and appears to be very sucessfull-like the thousands of other non TS hotels and resorts that have been dog or pet friendly for years now. The policy is just like the standard hotel policy; certain rooms have been designated as dog friendly, you must sign an agreement-and there is a $20.00 a day "cleaning fee", or $140.00 a week. Since a deep cleaning would only take once after the dog has left, we can all assume that the resort is receiving extra revenue from the program. I don't know of any hotel that has "revoked" it's dog friendly policy; most people who travel with their pets, especially TS owners at a resort are going to make sure their dog behaves well and that they follow the rules. I sent an email with this same info to the manager of our home resort (Riverpointe in Napa) and to James Tennery, the general manager of operations at Grand Pacific Resorts which manages RP. I plan to bring up a "trial" proposal at our next annual members meeting which unfortunately is not until next July. The TS industry is way behind the times on this issue. There was a recent thread on TUG about how many TS owners don't travel as much as they'd like because they can't bring their dogs with them. Given the sucess of dog friendly hotels across the US-and certainly in Europe where you can even take your dog on the train-there is no good reason for the TS industry to not change their policies on this. I hope other TUGGERS who agree will contact their home resorts with similar proposals.


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## theo (Sep 19, 2014)

windyriver said:


> The TS industry is way behind the times on this issue. <snip> Given the sucess of dog friendly hotels across the US-and certainly in Europe where you can even take your dog on the train-*there is no good reason for the TS industry to not change their policies on this*. I hope other TUGGERS who agree will contact their home resorts with similar proposals.



I respectfully disagree and submit that there are indeed *numerous* very good reasons to unilaterally prohibit pets at timeshare facilities. I'd also point out that it's not an "industry" decision to make at all in the first place but is instead an issue for the majority of *owners* to decide for themselves at any given timeshare facility. I'm quite certain that at the small, independent, non-chain facilities at which we own our fixed weeks, there is not a snowball's chance in Hades that pets would *ever* be allowed --- and that's just fine with me. 

Let me be clear that I love dogs --- even those unfortunate breeds which, through no fault of their own, are not actually able to be German Shepherds . I've had dogs most of my life since childhood and I fully understand and appreciate exactly what they mean to a family and what they add to our quality of life. That being said, I don't support the above quoted viewpoint and certainly won't be contacting any of my resorts to encourage abandonment of a firm *NO PETS* policy.

Unlike the "hotel" and "train" examples presented above, in which *everyone* is basically just a transient "user" passing through, timeshare owners very literally *own* their little piece of the place, in time and space. Accordingly, those *owners* have the indisputable right to *not* have to be be involuntarily subjected to the dogs, cats, iguanas, parrots (...or cigarette smoke), or their malodorous "aftermath", as a result of inconsiderate others (whether owner or not) who may have preceded them. I acknowledge and respect the indisputable fact that no one should ever have to check into their *owned* unit / week only to be promptly greeted by (and begin sneezing at) airborne animal dander and / or the (maybe only partially masked) aroma of a recent animal "contribution" to the unit carpeting, flooring, or furniture. 

Speaking only for myself, I also don't want to have to listen to some insecure little [insert favorite yappy, hyper, dog breed here] creature yapping incessantly in an adjoining unit while its' inconsiderate occupants, completely oblivious to the disturbance they have left behind for others to involuntarily "enjoy", are down at the pool, or out to dinner, gone shopping, off on a (no pets allowed) boat tour, etc. I also don't need or want any poorly trained little dogs nipping at my ankles (and / or or having an unfortunate little "accident") in the elevator either. Call me a curmudgeon, but can you honestly state with a straight face that *any* timeshare *owner* should have to tolerate or endure *any* of that stuff at a facility at which they have paid serious money for ownership(s) and also pay annual maintenance fees in order to enjoy that ownership? 

Sorry, but I can't support (and would actively oppose) a "pet friendly" policy at *any* timeshare facility at which I *own* weeks. IMnsHO, it's completely inconsiderate of the many *owners* who don't happen to share your particular personal attachment to Fido the dog, Mittens the cat --- or Polly the Parrot. Pet owner convenience and preference does not trump the rights of owners. Period, amen.

Pet ownership and timeshare ownership are both personal choices. Unfortunately, those two personal choices cannot and should not be exercised in the same place at the same time to the detriment of others. Too bad, but that's life. 

Feel free to hammer away at me if you disagree, but that's my own firm (and mindful and considerate of other *owners*) personal viewpoint. YMMV.


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## Passepartout (Sep 19, 2014)

The key to any successful business enterprise is recognizing a need and filling it. If a resort finds a profit center by setting aside some rooms designated to be pet friendly, and received additional income from willing guests, I see no harm. As long as other accommodations are available to those with animal allergies or phobias, what's the beef?

Obviously, there have to be rules, perhaps size, no leaving alone, pre-paid damage deposit and/or credit card, just like with human guests. With airlines charging you to bring bags aboard, and for a soda in order to prop up the bottom line, charging timeshare owners/exchangers/renters for internet, pool towels, extra cleaning, phone calls, parking, etc, it seems a teenie step to allow pets in for a price.

Jim


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## presley (Sep 19, 2014)

Passepartout said:


> The key to any successful business enterprise is recognizing a need and filling it. If a resort finds a profit center by setting aside some rooms designated to be pet friendly, and received additional income from willing guests, I see no harm. As long as other accommodations are available to those with animal allergies or phobias, what's the beef?



I agree with this 100%.  The key is really to have responsible owners.  As long as owners don't leave their pets unattended, don't let them bark and clean up after them, I see no harm in having a few designated pet friendly rooms.  

My campground membership has a few cottages (looks like what Riverpointe in Napa uses) that are pet friendly.  When I want to stay there, I request one.  If none are available, I just don't stay there that weekend.  When they are available, I bring extra sheets/blankets and I cover all the furniture even though my dogs are poodles and don't shed.  I just figure it will be easier for them to clean when I leave.  There is a fenced dog park onsite.  The rest of the time, dogs have to be leashed.  It makes for a great getaway with the whole family.


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## Sandy VDH (Sep 19, 2014)

I am a dog owner.  I am a responsible dog owner, with an extremely well behaved dog.  He is not a barker, He is not a territory marker, he is well behaved and well mannered, and actually listens and obeys commands.  Lets just say that my dog is more well behaved than some children.  I go to Starbucks, out on the patio, put my dog in a down, go in and get coffee and he is still in his down when I get back out with my coffee.  So well behaved indeed.

But there are a lot of irresponsible pet owners, and basically blind owners.  Well at least blind to their pets issues and behaviors, they think it is cute.  But a few bad apples ruins it for everyone.  I take issues with unruly pets brought to dog parks too.  But hey that is just me. 

I would like to take my pet on more trips with me, especially if I was driving, as he really likes the car, and he travels really well and behaves when we get there.  But many places just do not allow pets of any kind. 

Again I can say that for some kids, and I say that about some parents who do not monitor and keep in check their kids behavior, they ruin it for many.  Only difference, is that I can not keep those people out of the timeshares.  But ce la vie.

I realize that does not address the entire dander issue that cause allergies for some people, and that is an issue that is not easy to overcome.

My dog stays at home or the kennel.  Oh well. Little I can do about it.


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## dougp26364 (Sep 20, 2014)

Over the past year I have begun to discover more timeshare allowing dogs with a non-refundable cleaning fees. For us this has been a pleasant change from years past as we like to take our two small, reasonably well behaved dogs (they're Scottie's and have a stubborn mind of their own). We've begun to plan more driving vacations around pet friendly resorts. 

It serves a few purposes. It saves us a little money vs boarding them, they remain on their same diet and feeding schedule (they receive veggie and fruits in addition to kibble), it saves us money vs flying and renting a car, but most of all it makes us relax more and run less. Dogs will limit you to how much you can be out or activities which cost money and forces you to relax, read a book and watch the sunrise and sunsets. 

If there's a market for it, then we'll see more of it. Since many timeshares are now part of systems and those systems are developer controlled, then there could be more pet friendly resorts. If there are sales to be made,  and most systems are still in sales, they'll begin to convert resorts to pet friendly. 

On the other hand, If it hurts sales or doesn't improve sales, then there won't be a reason to convert existing resorts pet friendly or make new resorts pet friendly. It's all dependent on sales and not so much current owners desires. HOA's are mostly controlled by developers.


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## ronparise (Sep 20, 2014)

My standard line when I so to a timeshare sales presentation is that Ill buy, if they allow dogs....backfired at Vacation Village at Parkway...but I already own there...

Im looking forward to staying  at  Stardust in South Lake Tahoe as soon as Millie recovers from her surgery


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## DebBrown (Sep 20, 2014)

Last year, the HOA of Swallowtail at Hilton Head took a poll regarding pets and it was overwhelmingly rejected.  I was disappointed but the resort is fixed week and unit so it wouldn't have been feasible to set aside a portion of the units for people with pets.

Deb


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## csxjohn (Sep 21, 2014)

windyriver said:


> .... I hope other TUGGERS who agree will contact their home resorts with similar proposals.



I do not agree with you and will be contacting my HOA to let them know how I feel about pets at our resort.  I want them to know this in case they are considering such a move.

I'm a pet lover and have owned all kinds.  I've had dogs since a toddler.  For the past 40 years or so we've had 2 dogs at a time replacing them as they passed on.

We were near retirement when one died and we decided not to replace him.  The last one died about 2 years before retirement and I thought about replacing him with a very small dog for a companion.

My wife convinced me to try it for a while with no dogs and after seven years of retirement I believe it was the right move.

A couple things came into play in the decision.  Losing the last two was very hard on us emotionally, it was getting harder losing them, not easier. We really don't want to go through that again.

It has really uncomplicated our lives.  We can come and go as we please and stay as long as we like without worrying about the dogs.

If people are traveling less because of their dogs they have made a choice to do so.  I chose not to be tied down like that.

The last thing I want is to be surrounded by other's pets while I'm on vaca.  As I said, I will be pro active and let my resort know.


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## vacationhopeful (Sep 21, 2014)

csxjohn said:


> I do not agree with you and will be contacting my HOA to let them know how I feel about pets at our resort.  I want them to know this in case they are considering such a move.
> 
> I'm a pet lover and have owned all kinds.  I've had dogs since a toddler.  For the past 40 years or so we've had 2 dogs at a time replacing them as they passed on.
> 
> ...



John,
You expressed my history with pets EXACTLY -- and I am at that DIFFERENT POINT in my life and am enjoying my pet free status for over 10 years. When I walk the halls of during my vacation stays, I have heard a dog (in a pet free resort) several times going yap-yap. I turned them in IMMEDIATELY - once the front desk informed me that was a legal service dog (I thought, REALLY ... yapping - is something wrong?). The other times, they went and investigated or told me, they had received other comments & were working on it.

Do I dislike pets? No ... I feel they just are better off at their own homes and NOT mine. And if people bring a pet to my house, it had better be leased and we will visit outside  - no if, ands or buts.

And I believe the managements at all stores and lodgings are getting very versed in clarifying between those $20 eBay pet vests vs the REAL certified assistance animals. 

I boarded my dog(s) when I went on vacation - yes, it cost me $$.


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## dougp26364 (Sep 21, 2014)

Which brings me back to this being a sales driven policy. While I like to bring our dogs on vacation, I believe the majority of owners would say no if put to a vote and for valid reasons. It will only become prevelant if resort management groups see this as an opportunity to increase sales by appealing to a growing, if still a minority, group of sales prospects. 

We recently made a developer purchase I never thought I'd make, just because a resort we really liked in Breckenridge allows pets for owners (I looked for and continue to look for resales at this resort). I am considering churning our portfolio to include more pet friendly resorts if I can find what I want on the resale market and get rid of some of our current ownerships at non pet friendly resorts. So the option, IMHO, can drive sales. 

Because of the trend to go with resorts grouped in internal systems for internal reservations and because these large management companies need something new to drive sales, we could begin to see a change in pet policies at resorts. They don't really care what current owners think. They only care about what could increase sales, and if they believe or see that a pet friendly policy increases sales by 2 or 3%, those developer stacked HOA's will begin to change pet polices without owner input.


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## dougp26364 (Sep 21, 2014)

vacationhopeful said:


> John,
> You expressed my history with pets EXACTLY -- and I am at that DIFFERENT POINT in my life and am enjoying my pet free status for over 10 years. When I walk the halls of during my vacation stays, I have heard a dog (in a pet free resort) several times going yap-yap. I turned them in IMMEDIATELY - once the front desk informed me that was a legal service dog (I thought, REALLY ... yapping - is something wrong?). The other times, they went and investigated or told me, they had received other comments & were working on it.
> 
> Do I dislike pets? No ... I feel they just are better off at their own homes and NOT mine. And if people bring a pet to my house, it had better be leased and we will visit outside  - no if, ands or buts.
> ...



It seems to me fake service dogs are becoming an issue. We went to obedience class with our two dogs all the way through canine good citizen status, which is the beginning point for service dog training. A service dog is very well behaved and obedient. A yapping dog is very likely not a service dog. A dog pulling at a leash is very likely not a service dog.  A dog easily distracted by another dog walking by is very likely not a service dog. 

Unfortunately there are people who will abuse the service dog rules to bring fido on vacation. It hurts a large group of people who rely on service dogs by creating suspicion and resentment. 

My personal feelings are that they should be able to require more solid proof an animal is a service animal instead of a pet. Special interest groups seem to stand in the way of this happening, and I think it's really to their disadvantage rather than protecting their rights. It really doesn't seem to be all that difficult to buy a service animal vest or say it's a service animal and be untouchable.


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## Sandy VDH (Sep 21, 2014)

My dog has had lots of obedience training, he used to be a pet therapy dog, I used to take him to the hospital and to the seniors homes.  But he is now retired. 

In my opinion, even though he was a service dog, he is NOT MY service dog, as I do not require him to be with me.  I do not use his vest and bring him along.  

It really does scream fake service dog, if the dog is yapping away in the room.


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## VegasBella (Sep 21, 2014)

Some estimate that 3/5 Americans have pets.
Families today often have more than one pet.
More than half of all pets sleep in the bed with their owners.
Pets are being treated as family members more and more.
More and more airlines allow pets. More and more restaurants allow pets on patios. More hotels are letting pets stay. 

And here's the kicker: the higher the family income, the MORE likely the family has a pet (or two or three).

The trend is towards pet-friendly. 

Obviously HOAs are made up of owners who have their own ideas and biases, but *there is CLEAR profit available in this niche and those who don't see it or grasp it are missing out on essentially free money.*

Sources to support my claims:
http://www.forbes.com/2004/07/15/cx_cv_0715feat.html
http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2034634,00.html
http://www.humanesociety.org/issues/pet_overpopulation/facts/pet_ownership_statistics.html
http://www.marketingcharts.com/traditional/3-in-5-americans-own-pets-17938/
http://www.americanpetproducts.org/press_industrytrends.asp
http://adage.com/article/news/pet-friendly-hotels-raise-sign/233983/

----

Now, personally, I don't travel with my pets very often. There are a variety of reasons for this but I'd very much prefer to have the option to bring them more often if I wanted. Our last vacation my son whined about how much he missed the dogs and how he wanted to go home to see them.


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## silentg (Sep 21, 2014)

When we bought our first timeshare in 1980, pets were allowed. We had a neighbor at the timeshare who had a very quiet poodle. An unfortunate accident as it was described in a letter from the management, stated as of January 1, 1982 dogs were no longer allowed at the timeshare. We later found out that the on site manager's dog, a large retriever, had attacked the little poodle. Fortunately, the poodle survived the attack, but management felt it was best not to have dogs at the resort. That manager left, soon after not because of the incident, but the policy still stands. I found the letter recently, while going thru my correspondence with the resort.  
There are some pet friendly resorts, TUG has a list of them on here. 
TerryC


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## pamandgary (Sep 21, 2014)

I am not a dog lover. In fact most dogs frighten me. We recently spent a week at David Walley's Resort time share which is now dog friendly. I enjoyed everything about the stay but the dogs.  They barked, often for long periods of time.  We had to call the front desk to get our peace and quiet.  Not everyone is a responsible dog owner.  I would venture to say more aren't than are.  If I knew a timeshare encouraged dogs, I would avoid buying or going. It ranks right in there with smoking!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## dougp26364 (Sep 21, 2014)

first class said:


> I am not a dog lover. In fact most dogs frighten me. We recently spent a week at David Walley's Resort time share which is now dog friendly. I enjoyed everything about the stay but the dogs.  They barked, often for long periods of time.  We had to call the front desk to get our peace and quiet.  Not everyone is a responsible dog owner.  I would venture to say more aren't than are.  If I knew a timeshare encouraged dogs, I would avoid buying or going. It ranks right in there with smoking!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



Then it's probably a good idea to begin to look at the amenities prior to making an exchange. Last year I found it nearly impossible to find timeshares within driving distance that were listed as pet friendly. This year I'm finding it easier, although still limited.  I had no idea David Walley's had become pet friendly. While they might have lost you as a potential guest they've gained us, based on the same policy. 

Reno, for us, is not within driving distance. It would be at least a 2 day drive but, I'm not necessarily averse to driving that far. We have a reservation in Sedona next year that will require an overnight stay in order to make the drive. Perhaps I'll consider a summer week in the Lake Tahoe area in the future.


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## ronparise (Sep 21, 2014)

Back to the resort that is the subject of the ops post. Stardust  in South Tahoe
I just talked to a nice lady at the front desk and yes they do allow pets, There is a $20 a night pet charge, and a $50 resort fee.  This is an old converted motel, but about 75 of the 85 rooms have been renovated.  Most of the units are studios 

I dont have anything on deposit with RCI so I cant see how many tpu are required to exchange in here, but there does seem to be a lot of availability  for last calls and extra vacations. and except for Christmas and New Years there is something every week with my wyndham points 

So
exchange fee 200
resort fee        50
doggie fee     150

Total $400 a week plus the tpu.  or wyndham points

or the last call fee of $250  +resort fee + doggie fee = under $500 a week. 

Would someone check for me to see what the tpu charge is at this place (rci#0515)

I think I just found my home for next summer.. Thanks windyriver


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## silentg (Sep 21, 2014)

Hi Ron, the TPU goes from 4-38 depends on size and time of year you go!


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## ronparise (Sep 21, 2014)

silentg said:


> Hi Ron, the TPU goes from 4-38 depends on size and time of year you go!



Thanks...Its those 4's that I was hoping for. my tpu cost is about $20/tpu  so $80 + 210 + $140 + 50 = $500 a week for my wife and me and dog


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## DeniseM (Sep 21, 2014)

We just had breakfast on the patio of a popular local place.  There were 5 dogs on the small patio, which wasn't enjoyable for us.  

Two dogs were lying quietly on their blanket by their owner's table - fine.

One dog was tied to the side of the patio area on a leash - fine.

One dog was on a leash, but not tied up, and it ambled around exploring the eating area at will, while it's owner ate and read the paper - not good.

One dog was with a family with a young boy, and the boy ran all over with the dog on a long leash, and allowed it to approach strangers who were eating, and it barked when it got excited - unacceptable.

This is a pretty representative cross section of pet owners and their behavior in public, and why many people don't want dogs at their resort.


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## ronparise (Sep 21, 2014)

DeniseM said:


> We just had breakfast on the patio of a popular local place.  There were 5 dogs on the small patio, which wasn't enjoyable for us.
> 
> Two dogs were lying quietly on their blanket by their owner's table - fine.
> 
> ...



My take away is that's why I dont like to go to restaurants that serve kids.


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## DeniseM (Sep 21, 2014)

ronparise said:


> My take away is that's why I dont like to go to restaurants that serve kids.



What restaurants don't serve kids?


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## tiel (Sep 21, 2014)

I am a dog lover, BUT, I also am highly allergic to some dogs.  When exposed, I have difficulty breathing, and have ended up in the hospital before.  So I would never choose to stay in a TS where I knew dogs had been allowed...don't want that to happen again!  A thorough cleaning after a dog's stay MAY NOT sufficiently remove the dander, even though everything could look clean.  Dander hides everywhere:  in carpet, on sofas and pillows, on drapery, etc.

Even if X number of units were set aside for "dog" units, I would object.  That would mean fewer villas would be available to me at my resorts when I want to vacation.  It's hard enough to go where we want to go as it is, and I wouldn't want to make things worse.  

Beyond these issues, there are also the negatives others have already mentioned here.

Since having pets is a personal choice, this is simply a change I would never support, and would actively object to.


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## vacationhopeful (Sep 21, 2014)

There is no reason to compare KIDS with DOGS as to who is welcome in a timeshare environment ... 

But there is ONE adult only resort in Florida where KIDs are NOT allowed.

And I don't hear any objections to kids not going to that resort.


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## VegasBella (Sep 21, 2014)

ronparise said:


> My take away is that's why I dont like to go to restaurants that serve kids.



My take-away is that I dislike restaurants that don't enforce their policies. 

Likely, the unleashed dog was violated the rules and probably local laws, too. 

I'm more sympathetic about the kid, but again the management should have come out and asked the parents/guardians to keep the child and dog at their table.

---
I went out to eat the other day and there were 5 tables occupied in addition to mine.* 

Two college students sat at a table that seats 6. They spread out their books and laptops across the table and only ordered coffee. 

One man sat alone and was quiet but he smelled so strongly of alcohol and cigarette smoke that I nearly lost my appetite.

One couple talked VERY loudly and used profanity. This was within earshot of my young son. They chewed with their mouths open. 

Two older men sat together and made many off color comments about their waitress. I half expected one to slap her bottom like it was 1972. They also stunk of cigarette smoke. 

A group of women, who had obviously been out dancing earlier and may have been inebriated, were extremely giggly. They were a bit loud at times but overall pretty well-behaved, although again not smelling the greatest (sweat, alcohol, smoke). 

*Not really. Just making a point.


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## Southpaw (Sep 21, 2014)

dougp26364 said:


> It seems to me fake service dogs are becoming an issue. ...  Unfortunately there are people who will abuse the service dog rules to bring fido on vacation. It hurts a large group of people who rely on service dogs by creating suspicion and resentment.



I was on a flight recently where the owner of a "service" dog let him out and the dog sat at *my* feet the entire flight, taking up my leg room.  I'm dog-friendly and it was fine, though it got to be bit much after a couple of hours.

The owner confessed to me, after he saw I liked the dog, that the dog was NOT really a service dog and that he had fake credentials.  This really opened my eyes to the fake service dog thing.  

I'm all for pet-friendly facilities but I'm not happy at the thought that there are fake service dogs who enjoy (and their owners enjoy) all kinds of privileges, while my dogs and I follow the rules.


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## DeniseM (Sep 21, 2014)

VegasBella said:


> My take-away is that I dislike restaurants that don't enforce their policies.



Exactly - so how can we expect timeshares to add a whole new set of rules for pets, and expect them to do a good job of enforcing them?

Let's face it - based on the many complaints we get here, resorts don't do a very good job enforcing the rules they have now!  Resorts already struggle with smokers, unsupervised children, local gate crashers, too many in a unit, and a host of other issues.  I can't imagine adding pets to the burden.


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## dougp26364 (Sep 21, 2014)

It always comes down to rules and how they're enforced. There's a FB page called Passenger Shaming in which photo's are posted of rude travelers on airlines and in airports. The thing that strikes me is all the pictures of feet. Passengers rest/stick there feet between the seats, put them up on the tray tables and backs of the seat in front of them, clip their toenails in flight, remove their shirts et..... I keep thinking to myself, why doesn't a flight attendent say/do something? Probably because they're worried the passenger will become even more unruley or tweet something about the "evil" airline.


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## windyriver (Sep 24, 2014)

*some suggestions*

I think some people misunderstood my post; any decision to implement a dog friendly policy should ALWAYS be decided by the owners, just like anything else with a big impact. 
All very interesting comments, though I do love dogs I also have had the experience of obnoxious dogs-and obnoxious owners who permit them to behave that way. It's true that a sucessfull pet friendly policy relies on two things; dog owners behaving responsibly AND proper enforcement by staff.

Pet allergies are a big deal, so clearly allowing dogs, even a limited way, is not going to be appropriate at all resorts. By only having a few units which allow dogs, that also limits the total number of dogs which can be on the property on any given week.

Is there someone who updates the list of pet friendly resorts on TUG? I didn't know that David Walley's was dog friendly, that resort has been on my list for a while. After the experience at the Stardust I decided the best policy would be to call a resort and ask them if they allow dogs since it appears that many are not advertising it upfront.

We really enjoyed our stay at the Stardust-personally I like North Tahoe better than South Tahoe, it's a little too busy BUT the Stardust is in a great location with walking distance to lots of places to eat, a shopping center etc. We stayed in a one bedroom (renovated) Galaxy unit and it was gorgeous, we loved it.
This resort has done an outstanding job with their upgrades, they have an enthusiastic and helpful staff and nice activities. Loved their pools which are kept heated to 86 degrees year round, the jacuzzi is kept at 104. If you like to hike-or just stroll, with or without a dog, be sure to check out Van Sickle Bi-State Park which is just minutes from the Stardust, up the hill right behind the Heavenly Gondola.


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## dougp26364 (Sep 24, 2014)

windyriver said:


> I think some people misunderstood my post; any decision to implement a dog friendly policy should ALWAYS be decided by the owners, just like anything else with a big impact.
> All very interesting comments, though I do love dogs I also have had the experience of obnoxious dogs-and obnoxious owners who permit them to behave that way. It's true that a sucessfull pet friendly policy relies on two things; dog owners behaving responsibly AND proper enforcement by staff.
> 
> Pet allergies are a big deal, so clearly allowing dogs, even a limited way, is not going to be appropriate at all resorts. By only having a few units which allow dogs, that also limits the total number of dogs which can be on the property on any given week.
> ...



Threads always take on a life of their own. Like conversations, they sometimes evolve to the point where you're not sure what the original topic might have been. 

I agree that owners should decide. It's unfortunate that most resorts remain managed and controlled by developers but, that's the way it's been for some time. They make some money on sales but the real profit center is in the continuous management fee's. I believe it's why we're seeing some convert to trust based ownership where the trust, which is controlled by the developer, have become popular. Developers can sell, manage and keep control of the resorts in perpetuity. 

As to dog friendly I've suggested to resort management companies and HOA's that they consider making first floor units only pet friendly. I think they should use the new vinyl floor tiles available for easier cleaning. First floors are often the least desirable. First floor units usually make it easier for owners to get their dogs outside, you don't have to worry a bounding dog would generate noise complaints and there's little chance owners would take their dogs into an elevator where accidents could happen. 

I often wonder if resorts really do the "deep" cleaning they use as an excuse to charge the pet fee's? What I worry about is that they charge the fee but, rather than do the cleaning they're suppose to do they just sort of keep that money as extra profit and gloss over the "deep" cleaning part.


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## Lisa P (Sep 25, 2014)

Southpaw said:


> I'm not happy at the thought that there are fake service dogs who enjoy (and their owners enjoy) all kinds of privileges, while my dogs and I follow the rules.


Agree.  My mother has a true service dog and she's found people are are getting more and more suspicious of hers because of the number of fakes.  She carries her dog's credentials everywhere now.


tiel said:


> I am a dog lover, BUT, I also am highly allergic to some dogs.  When exposed, I have difficulty breathing, and have ended up in the hospital before.


You're not alone in this.  My sons are the same way, fortunately less severely as adults.  This is the single most significant reason, to me, for any resort to keep a preexisting policy to restrict pets.  No owners who purchased where pets were not allowed, should be presented with a new health risk when traveling to their home resort.

As an RN who used to work in pulmonary care, I've had many patients whose asthma or COPD is triggered by pet dander, sometimes where they did not expect to find it.  Making exceptions for service animals is not the same as opening up the option for large numbers of pet owners.

People who truly need their service animal will take responsibility for theirs.  Real service animals don't chew furniture, dig at doors or yap and wreck the soft goods if left alone for a short while.  When the owner is taking a shower or steps down to the lobby, most people would not realize there was an animal still in the room.

Whenever my mother has stayed in a timeshare with her service dog, she's asked for a 1st floor unit at the edge of the property or far end of a hallway and they've always accommodated.  The outdoor lawn areas where she's been asked to take her dog to relieve himself have all been neat.  Her dog is trained to "go" under shrubbery or in the scrub brush areas of the woods, if available.  And she cleans up after him.  But whenever she stays in pet-friendly hotels, she's found that the lawns are littered with nasty landmines left behind by owners who don't curb their pets, even with posts of baggies supplied by the hotel.  Many pet owners will say "it'll decompose in days" and they don't think about the people who may walk out on that lawn after them.

We loooooove dogs.    But creating a pet-friendly policy in a hotel, where most people only stay a night or two, and you can check-out and go down the street, is one thing.  A "simple majority rules" policy change that affects other owners' ability to safely enjoy their weeklong ownership?  Whole 'nuther thing, IMHO.

I do think that if a floating-unit or points-based resort wants to designate a separate, low-rise building with a fenced dogwalk area as pet-friendly, it should be considered.  If enough owners want this, they should be willing to sign a document stating that they are willing to be assigned to stay in the pet-friendly accommodations, even if they are not traveling with pets on a particular vacation, at the front desk's discretion.  And the rest of the resort should remain _*strictly*_ off-limits to pets.  Again, JMHO.


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## ronparise (Sep 25, 2014)

windyriver said:


> I think some people misunderstood my post; any decision to implement a dog friendly policy should ALWAYS be decided by the owners, just like anything else with a big impact.
> All very interesting comments, though I do love dogs I also have had the experience of obnoxious dogs-and obnoxious owners who permit them to behave that way. It's true that a sucessfull pet friendly policy relies on two things; dog owners behaving responsibly AND proper enforcement by staff.
> 
> Pet allergies are a big deal, so clearly allowing dogs, even a limited way, is not going to be appropriate at all resorts. By only having a few units which allow dogs, that also limits the total number of dogs which can be on the property on any given week.
> ...



Thanks for posting this.. I will be exchanging into the Stardust  for my next trip to California


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## ronparise (Sep 25, 2014)

dougp26364 said:


> Threads always take on a life of their own. Like conversations, they sometimes evolve to the point where you're not sure what the original topic might have been.
> 
> I agree that owners should decide. It's unfortunate that most resorts remain managed and controlled by developers but, that's the way it's been for some time. They make some money on sales but the real profit center is in the continuous management fee's. I believe it's why we're seeing some convert to trust based ownership where the trust, which is controlled by the developer, have become popular. Developers can sell, manage and keep control of the resorts in perpetuity.
> 
> ...




Doug...I think the "deep cleaning" is a myth or done only when needed  I dont think  $140 is enough to do the the job. Its for those cases when a dog (or person)  ruins a piece of furniture, or some other big expense. I believe this is just another source of income for the resort, like rentals and the resort fee they charge. All done to keep the base maintenance fees affordable.


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