# Now is the BEST time to buy DVC



## Steamboat Bill (Dec 15, 2006)

I have been a DVC owner since 2001 and have a love-hate relationship with it.

I love DVC for my own family use and it is the BEST way to experience DisneyWorld. I beleive it is one of the BEST run point based TS available.

I hate DVC as it is expensive to buy, has high MF, and in not good for trading for any property other than DVC. What I mean by that is that - it is a good trader, but it is an expensive way to use II as compared to Marriott, WM, etc.

Two weeks ago, I added-on 150 more points to my already 500 point contract. This is something I would have not believed I would do a few months ago. In fact, I was considering selling some of my points after I got banned from DISboards for starting threads on trying to get members to raise their rental rates.

However, there is a LIMITED DVC opportunity that is the BEST I have seen in many years and that is why I decided to buy more DVC points.

The DVC Saratoga Springs Resort and Spa, price per point, a few months ago was $101 per point.

They have a friends and family special for current DVC owners and firends of owners (hint-hint) that offers a $15 pp discount. Thus the price is $86pp. That is a good deal, but is the same price as buying resale from The Timeshare Store. 

However, here is the kicker....DVC threw in all the 2006 point year useage for only paying one month MF (December). Thus, the normal 2006 MF cost of $3.98 per point would only cost me $0.33 per point.

They were able to close me within 3 days and at no extra cost and put the entire purchase on my AmEx card (12,950 Delta points thank you).

I was then able to rent my 150 points for $10pp thus netting me a $1450 profit off the points I just got added to my account.

So in summary: the cost per DVC point was $86 - $9.67 (profit from rental - MF) = $76.33pp

Buying DVC directly from Disney for $76 per point is a fantastic and unbelievable deal. This is the BEST price I have seen in years. I assume that this deal will expire on December 29th, so if you are interested, send me a PM and I will give you my cast member contact at DVC.

Also note that DVC just announced a new property at the Animal Kingdom Lodge that will be build very soon. I know many people want to add on here, but the price will be $101-110pp (non-confirmed...just MHO). You can always trade into AKL with your SSR points. The only difference is that you will be paying about $25pp LESS for your DVC contract.

Once DVC points cost MORE than $100pp and the MF is over $5.00pp, I think most people are better renting than buying. However, buying DVC at $76 pp directly from Disney is the only "Sure thing" in the world....you WILL make money on a resale and you can immediatly make money renting points. No other TS developer can make this claim.

Now If I can only get my DISboard "Steamboat Willie" account back...that would be magical!


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## Carl D (Dec 15, 2006)

I agree with your basic premise, but I disagree that it's the "best" time to buy. -- That is relative.
I am personally waiting for AKV to go on sale before purchasing another contract. 
While you may be able to use your SSR points at AKV, you may not be able to do so when the resort is new & small, or if you opt for the concierge room, or a grand villa.

Not a big deal for most people, but you should also keep in mind the AKV contracts will have a few additional years.


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## rickandcindy23 (Dec 15, 2006)

I have tossed around the idea of Disney points.  I am one of the biggest nuts for Disney out there, so you would think Disney points would be in my repertoire of timeshares that you see to the left of this post.  We own lots of weeks, but we exchange into Disney and Disney exchanges are always Sat-Sat.  I wanted to add a five-night stay onto the week to extend our trips to 12 days instead of one week.  That would mean using double points for that Saturday night stay, so I cannot see doing it.  If the exchange weeks were Sun-Sun or even Fri-Fri, I would jump on the chance you just offered.  Too bad, so sad.


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## rickandcindy23 (Dec 15, 2006)

Carl D said:
			
		

> I agree with your basic premise, but I disagree that it's the "best" time to buy. -- That is relative.
> I am personally waiting for AKV to go on sale before purchasing another contract.
> While you may be able to use your SSR points at AKV, you may not be able to do so when the resort is new & small, or if you opt for the concierge room, or a grand villa.
> 
> Not a big deal for most people, but you should also keep in mind the AKV contracts will have a few additional years.



I wonder what the expiration date will be for this new resort?

Also, another question on my mind, what were the benefits for tickets with Disney Vacation Club?


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## Carl D (Dec 15, 2006)

rickandcindy23 said:
			
		

> I wonder what the expiration date will be for this new resort?
> 
> Also, another question on my mind, what were the benefits for tickets with Disney Vacation Club?


The word on the street is a fresh 50 years, making the expiration 2057.

DVC Members recieve approximately a $100 discount on each annual pass for the household.
The exact amount varies depending on renewal staus, premium passes, and so forth.

A HUGE benefit for annual pass holders is the Disney Dinning Experience. This costs $60, but gets you 20% off most restaurants including alcohol.
If you go as often as us, and your dinning habits are like us, this alone pays for the annual passes.
The DDE is only available to AP holders and Florida residents.


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## mshatty (Dec 15, 2006)

Bill,

Your taking of advantage of and offering this advantage to others to buy DVC points seems to be a good deal.

It looks like you have set yourself up to make good use and some $ off of this to support your TS habit.


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## BocaBum99 (Dec 15, 2006)

I think we may be at a crossroads for DVC.  There are 3 macro economic developments that could have an impact on the resale price of DVC points.

1) The timeshare resale market has had a greater than normal decline this fall.  There are other threads on TUG discussing this in a bit more detail.  So far, timeshares with strong resale markets such as WorldMark and DVC have held fairly steady, but the drop off could be signaling a greater issue for timeshares if there isn't a significant rebound in the Spring of 2007.

I believe the relevant macro level trend is the cooling off of the general real estate market.  For the longest time, I believed that the timeshare markets and the real estate markets operated on unrelated cycles (i.e. the timeshare market on the general economy and the residential real estate market on interest rates and demographic shifts).  Now, I believe there may be some spillover effect between the two.

Timeshare resales are related to the market for Timeshare primary sales since the more the resort developer educates consumers via tours, the greater the knowledge there is about timesharing in general.  That helps to prop up the demand for resales.  If resort developers start having trouble selling timeshares in 2007, then this could be very negative on the resale market.  Time will tell.

2) Rental rates in Orlando are starting to fall.  That's in part due to over capacity of hotel space in Orlando AND an over supply of timeshares in that market.  If there is any general slow down in the economy, it may be very difficult for DVC to hold its high prices from both a rental and a resale point of view.

3) The tremendous timeshare building and condo hotel developments in Orlando.  Will DVC continue to be able to hold its value as other alternatives start dropping?  It's kind of like the Dow Industrials and how it was impacted when the NASDAQ crashed.  There was a general aversion to anything stock market related in 2001 even for good companies.  

I do believe that DVC has commanded far too high a premium on a relative scale to its peers in Orlando.  If there is a correction in the timeshare market, DVC owners could be impacted.  I am not saying it will happen for sure.  But, the higher rise, the greater they fall.

And lastly, there will be a time in the next 20 years when DVC points start falling in value.  Don't know when that will happen, but it will and when it does happen, it will happen fast.  I surely don't want to be on that bandwagon when the wheels fall off.


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## ondeadlin (Dec 15, 2006)

Bill,

Thanks for an informative heads up. I'm not very DVC saavy, so I had two questions: 1) Does the 150 point minimum purchase still apply? 2) How did you rent this year's points? Through Disney or privately? Do you have to rent them before Jan. 1 or you lose them?

Thanks!

Jim


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## rickandcindy23 (Dec 15, 2006)

I don't think DVC is more expensive than any of the other big developers in the area and the value is always up with DVC, as opposed to down.  Go buy a week at River Island with the corresponding points and see what you pay for a two bedroom.  It is going to lose value quickly for sure (probably 80% in the first year) and those points would not transfer when you choose to sell.  That sounds crazy to me, selling a timeshare just purchased, but you can bet that a year from now, some poor slob will be selling their River Island week for peanuts somewhere.   

HGVC and Marriott are very overpriced for the area and especially compared to resales.  How easy it is to trade into both.  I just looked with my *blue week *at summer of 2007 and pulled a three bedroom at HGVC Seaworld.  My blue week is a two bedroom.  

Getting a DVC trade is so much harder.  I think the value is there and will remain.  I may be talking Rick into a purchase, though I wish we didn't have to pay higher point values for those Fri and Sat stays to combine the week with an exchange.  

I always say not to buy Orlando, no matter what, but the simple fact of the matter is that buying Disney does not feel like buying Orlando.

BILL:  Are taxes included in the MF's, or are they separate?


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## Carl D (Dec 15, 2006)

BocaBum99 said:
			
		

> I think we may be at a crossroads for DVC.  There are 3 macro economic developments that could have an impact on the resale price of DVC points.
> 
> 1) The timeshare resale market has had a greater than normal decline this fall.  There are other threads on TUG discussing this in a bit more detail.  So far, timeshares with strong resale markets such as WorldMark and DVC have held fairly steady, but the drop off could be signaling a greater issue for timeshares if there isn't a significant rebound in the Spring of 2007.
> 
> ...


Boca, you're forgetting one huge driving force for DVC---> the price of the WDW hotel resorts. 
As long as there is a market that will nearly fill the WDW on site resorts, there will be a market willing to pay a little less at DVC. That "little less" is still a big number. Plain and simple, the price of the WDW resorts will continue to drive the price of DVC. Perhaps even more so than right of first refusal.
When Disney is filling the Beach Club hotel at $400 per night, it doesn't make sense the associated villas will sell for $100 per night.


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## BocaBum99 (Dec 15, 2006)

Carl D said:
			
		

> Boca, you're forgetting one huge driving force for DVC---> the price of the WDW hotel resorts.
> As long as there is a market that will nearly fill the WDW on site resorts, there will be a market willing to pay a little less at DVC. That "little less" is still a big number. Plain and simple, the price of the WDW resorts will continue to drive the price of DVC. Perhaps even more so than right of first refusal.
> When Disney is filling the Beach Club hotel at $400 per night, it doesn't make sense the associated villas will sell for $100 per night.



I'm not forgetting that.  I agree with your logic.  My point is that if Disney can't hold those prices, then it will impact DVC rental and resales.
There will be some bleedover effect no matter how popular Disney stays.  The greater the over capacity problem gets in Orlando, the greater the potential divergence in rental rates, the greater the bleedover effect will become.  That's my point.

And, DVC points at most resorts will have ZERO value in 2043.  Sometime between now and 2043 the resale prices need to go down dramatically.  The question is not if, but when.


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## bnoble (Dec 15, 2006)

Disney has done a masterful job at convincing people that their on-site resorts have value, though.  Viewed entirely on a fee-for-service basis, those perks don't justify the premium.  For example, I can get access to extra magic hours by renting a campsite in addition to any offsite lodging I get.  I can also contract with a towncar company to shuttle me back and forth from my offsite location.  I can pay to ship my packages all the way home rather than to my hotel.  Add all this up, and I'd STILL spend less out of pocket than I would on a comparable onsite rental.  

But, those resorts are still full, and a good chunk of the rooms are sold at rack rate, rather than at a discount.

9/11 demonstrated that even the Mouse isn't immune to travel slumps---they were selling rooms almost at half price for a while there---but it is darn close.


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## Carl D (Dec 15, 2006)

bnoble said:
			
		

> Disney has done a masterful job at convincing people that their on-site resorts have value, though.  Viewed entirely on a fee-for-service basis, those perks don't justify the premium.  For example, I can get access to extra magic hours by renting a campsite in addition to any offsite lodging I get.  I can also contract with a towncar company to shuttle me back and forth from my offsite location.  I can pay to ship my packages all the way home rather than to my hotel.  Add all this up, and I'd STILL spend less out of pocket than I would on a comparable onsite rental.


True, if you look at "value" from only a financial viewpoint.
For our family, we just can't put a price on the great memories we have of staying in the middle of Magic. 
For us, THAT'S value!


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## Carl D (Dec 15, 2006)

BocaBum99 said:
			
		

> And, DVC points at most resorts will have ZERO value in 2043.  Sometime between now and 2043 the resale prices need to go down dramatically.  The question is not if, but when.


First half of your statement- Correct, but by that time we have gotten our money's worth (IMO).

Second half- Not as quick or dramtic as you might think. Just think what the rack rates at Boardwalk will be in 2035.
That will help boost DVC prices.


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## ondeadlin (Dec 15, 2006)

> Disney has done a masterful job at convincing people that their on-site resorts have value, though. Viewed entirely on a fee-for-service basis, those perks don't justify the premium.



I don't own DVC, but we've traded in 2x in the last 2 years and I've gotta disagree that the perks don't justify the premium.

Staying in the park, at a huge 2BR OKW unit, is an entirely different experience than staying outside the park at, say, Marriott Grand Vista. The ease of transit, the castmember's attitudes, the extra magic hours, the dining plan (which we found a tremendous value), it all adds up to one of the best vacation experiences around, especially if you have children.

The one thing that would make me hesitate about purchasing is my belief that if you're a diligent II exchanger and a little flexible with your plans, you can trade in for a fraction of the price.

If you want a 2BR in a good season, though, that ain't easy. Possible, but not easy.


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## bnoble (Dec 15, 2006)

I hear you Carl, but I've stayed offsite and onsite, and the memories last about the same either way. 

Like I said; they are masterful marketers, if nothing else.  And I still succumb to it from time to time, even though I *know* better.


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## BocaBum99 (Dec 15, 2006)

Disney commands a huge premium today and it is worth it because people are willing to pay for it.  That's a fact and I am not arguing with the market.

My asssessment is not about the past, it's about the likely future.  I believe I am more right than wrong.  I have provided 3 macro economic events that I believe could effect the future prices of DVC points.

In 2035, DVC points will be far lower in value than they are today in inflation adjusted terms.  I am quite sure of that.  There is no way for us to prove it now.  But I am firm in my conviction about this assertion.

Claiming that you've already got your money back is a red herring argument.  There are a lot of assets in which you can get your money back.  In timesharing by itself, there are dozens of alternatives that have a far superior return than DVC points.  If DVC had a superior return, I would own thousands of points.  I don't own any.  What is important from a financial return point of view is the relative return given the risk.

DVC is a great purchase if you've got to have it and you want a luxury item.   As a financial investment, it is weak at best.

Getting back to the original claim about now being a great time to buy DVC.  I think a better time to buy will be when DVC tanks due to some shock to the economy.  I'll bet the value is far greater at that time than now.  To me, DVC is providing incentives to purchase because they are having trouble making their numbers without the incentives.  If they weren't having trouble, they wouldn't be providing them.


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## littlestar (Dec 15, 2006)

We recently sold some DVC points - one package sold for $93 a point and the other for $86 a point. I thought that was really good. In my opinion, the driving force on price on DVC points is the Disney hotel rates. Deluxe Disney hotel rates are up there (Yacht/Beach Club standard rooms are around $400 a night). 

We've downsized our DVC points to just a little over 200 points. But I plan on using those points to make sure we (kids or us) can stay in a studio at Disney when we're going to the parks and when we WANT to go (not IF something pops up for trade). I plan to ride it out until the end with those points. Keeping those points is still better than paying almost $150 a night for a moderate or the outrageous deluxe hotel rates. By using those points Sunday through Thursday, we can get a lot of mileage out of them.  Is it extravagant? Yep, it sure is. But, we love the Disney resort hotels. My husband and I both agreed that we've worked too long and too hard not to have the splurge of those DVC points. 

When we want to stay in bigger units and not do the Disney parks, our plan is to stay at Marriott's Cypress Harbour, Horizons, or Vistana Villages for the most part (I do want to try Cypress Pointe soon, too, as an option). We can either get those with a cash Getaway or trade in with our lock-off units or AC's through Interval.

The only reason why I own DVC points is to stay on Disney property when we visit the parks. Even if I manage to trade in to DVC through Interval, it's so great to be able to pick up the phone and call DVC and book, say a studio at the same resort, for five nights for one of our kids or nieces or nephews. You can't call up Interval and do that when you have more people that want to go on the trip. The best value for us with the DVC points are the studios Sunday through Thursday. I think we'll use 20 nights of studios with our points next year. If I booked those 20 nights in Disney deluxe hotels on cash, it would probably cost me around $6,000. I know I could rent somebody else's points, but I don't want to fool with it. I want to pick up the phone and get what I want when I want it.


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## Carl D (Dec 15, 2006)

BocaBum99 said:
			
		

> In 2035, DVC points will be far lower in value than they are today in inflation adjusted terms.  I am quite sure of that.  There is no way for us to prove it now.  But I am firm in my conviction about this assertion.
> 
> In timesharing by itself, there are dozens of alternatives that have a far superior return than DVC points.  If DVC had a superior return, I would own thousands of points.  I don't own any.  What is important from a financial return point of view is the relative return given the risk.
> 
> ...


Worth less in 2035 once adjusted for inflation- Agreed.

Bad FINANCIAL investment- Agreed again, but I didn't buy it for that reason.

DVC tanks?- It may get somewhat slower, but I doubt "tank" will be the applicable descriptor. 

Trouble making their numbers?- No, sales are very brisk. That is why more DVC resorts are slated to come on line. Most notably, Animal Kingdom Villas. AKV is also slated to be a large resort. There are rumors of two more, with one being at the Grand Californian in Disneyland. That one seems very likely to happen.


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## BocaBum99 (Dec 15, 2006)

Carl D said:
			
		

> Trouble making their numbers?- No, sales are very brisk. That is why more DVC resorts are slated to come on line. Most notably, Animal Kingdom Villas. AKV is also slated to be a large resort. There are rumors of two more, with one being at the Grand Californian in Disneyland. That one seems very likely to happen.



Explain the incentive then.  Disney is not well known as a generous company.  It NEVER leaves money on the table.  Disney is legendary on this front.

It's kind of like the point in "A Few Good Men" where Tom Cruise asks Jack Nicholsen why the "two orders".

If there is no need for an incentive, why the incentive?

If things are going so swimmingly, we not just increase the prices more?


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## littlestar (Dec 15, 2006)

BocaBum99 said:
			
		

> Explain the incentive then.  Disney is not well known as a generous company.  It NEVER leaves money on the table.  Disney is legendary on this front.
> 
> It's kind of like the point in "A Few Good Men" where Tom Cruise asks Jack Nicholsen why the "two orders".
> 
> ...




I think part of the reason for incentives at Saratoga is the location. It doesn't command as much of a premium as Boardwalk, Beach Club, or the Wilderness Lodge does. Those resorts have deluxe hotels attached to them, plus they are close to the theme parks. There's a long waiting list for Beach Club points through Disney. If you try to add on direct through Disney for those three, there are no incentives offered for them and they sell for $95.00 a point direct through Disney. You can actually buy Saratoga cheaper with the incentives. I guess it's the old location, location, location coming into play.


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## Denise L (Dec 15, 2006)

I'm just going to add that last year at this time, SSR price was $81.50 per point with the 15% off retail, and the purchase also came with the previous year's points for little or no cost. And, there were no closing fees for new members.

So I would say that last year's deal was even better than this year's. New members now pay minimal closing costs (max $200, I think).

But the current promotion is great for today's prices!


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## Carl D (Dec 15, 2006)

BocaBum99 said:
			
		

> Explain the incentive then.  Disney is not well known as a generous company.  It NEVER leaves money on the table.  Disney is legendary on this front.


As strange as it sounds, DVC usually has some type of incentive. The exact details vary from time to time, but it always translates to a money saver.
When I purchased years ago it was called "Magical Beginnings", and DVC paid the first $10/pt toward your down payment. 
At the beginning of DVC there was some sort of free park pass incentive. 
Again, same story different title.


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 15, 2006)

Wow…23 replies within 7 hours…this is a HOT topic!

Let me clarify my position and reply to a few posters.

First, I think DVC offers families the BEST vacation experience if you want to visit Walt Disney World. I have visited WDW in Orlando dozens of times and with two young children and a Florida resident season pass, we all love it here. There is so much to do in WDW and everything is so clean, no wonder it is the #1 tourist destination in the world. I am a big fan of staying on-site at Disney World.

Second, I never encourage people to buy DVC to make money. DVC is not like some of the other TS properties where "smart people" can easily make a living. DVC frowns on commercial renters and is starting to crack down on them.

Third, DVC is pretty expensive as compared to all TS, and extremely expensive as compared to Orlando TS properties. Sure, you can buy a cheap no-name Orlando TS for $500…but it will not be on-site. To families like me….we are willing to pay a premium to stay within WDW property. I equate DVC to a "ski-in/ski-out" TS property. Why do people pay 2-4x the rates to stay at a TS/hotel/condo that is ski-in/ski-out rather than staying at a cheaper property and take a shuttle bus or walk to the slopes?

To: Carl D - Why would you pay 25% MORE for AKL than SSR. This does not make much sense to me, but it is your cash. Besides AKL will be a HUGE property…almost as big as SSR. We can both agree that DDE is a fantastic deal for pass holders. I saved a ton of money when I had dinner with friends at Victoria & Alberts. I also agree with you that the hotel prices at WDW seem to defy the laws of gravity. Buying a DVC is like hedging your future WDW hotel prices.

To: rickandcindy23 - If you are able to trade into DVC for cheap during flex or some other method, then keep it up. My family requires a confirmed reservation 4-6 months before we travel. Taxes are included in the price. If you are really serious about DVC, I would encourage you to buy before Dec 29th as this is the BEST deal I have seen in years.

DVC has had a very steady increase in price since 1991. You can go to DISboard to see the trend charts. DVC is also hard to trade into during school vacations. Most II trades into DVC are for the off season or slow periods. This does not work if you have kids in school.

To BocaBum99 - I always respect your input as one of the most knowledgeable TS owners I have ever met. Regarding DVC, the resale market is pretty strong and prices are high. Since 2000, most DVC resale properties sell for about 85-90% the current DVC price. This is an amazingly high resale price. I am not sure if overbuilding Orlando is a factor or not as staying within WDW property is not overdeveloped and prices for hotel stays are climbing thru the roof. Let's not forget how expensive simply paying the tax on a room at WDW…ouch. My mother reminds me that in 1971, they thought paying $25 per night to stay at the Contemporary hotel was a rip-off. I agree that prices will have to fall for older properties like OKW as their 40 year right to use approaches (year 2042). However the SSR is on a new clock that expires in 2054. All this is a moot issue as most owners keep their TS for 10 years or less. I will probably not be here in 2054 to worry about it. I think the reason for this sale is to sell-out SSR and concentrate on the new AKL and new prices. Remember that SSR is a HUGE resort and is not in as nice a location as VWL, BWV, BCV. I 100% agree with you that DVC is not the BEST investment, I am only posting that, IMHO from now until December 29, 2006, this is the BEST DVC purchase plan I have ever seen. I doubt DVC will ever tank, but if you buy now and sell in 5 years, I am sure you will be happy with the results. I am recommending this as a vacation club for families that LOVE Disney, not for any investor out there.

To: ondeadlin - DVC owners can add 115 pts, new owners need 150. I rented my points online. The points are usually good for one year. I sense you are thinking of buying…am I correct?

To: Bnobel - Perhaps it is something in the water up there, but average people save all year just to vacation in WDW and want to stay on site. I think 99.99% of vacationers to WDW will NOT use the saving methods you describe. Some people actually pack lunch and drinks to save on the food expenses. As I said before, DVC (or WDW for that matter) is not cheap and the $10 refillable daily soda mugs are beginning to piss me off….for that price, I could get ten 2 liter bottles.

To: littlestar - You really know how to work the DVC system to squeeze 20 nights per year on 200 points. You stated you SOLD some points for $93 and $86pp and that is great news. I am posting how you can effectively buy direct from DVC for $76pp….this is a GREAT opportunity. Your analogy regarding location and price is correct.


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## littlestar (Dec 15, 2006)

Steamboat Bill said:
			
		

> To: littlestar - You really know how to work the DVC system to squeeze 20 nights per year on 200 points. You stated you SOLD some points for $93 and $86pp and that is great news. I am posting how you can effectively buy direct from DVC for $76pp….this is a GREAT opportunity. Your analogy regarding location and price is correct.



Actually, I'll have about 40 points left over. Here's the breakdown/plan for Sunday through Thursday stays (we've got kids and nieces and nephews going in October for food and wine and Mickey's Not So Scary Halloween Party):

October (5) nights - BWV = 45 points
October (5) nights - OKW = 40 points
October (5) nights - OKW = 40 points
January (5) nights - OKW = 40 points

Total  165 points


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 15, 2006)

littlestar said:
			
		

> Actually, I'll have about 40 points left over. Here's the breakdown (we've got kids and nieces and nephews going in October for food and wine and Mickey's Not So Scary Halloween Party):
> 
> October (5) nights - BWV = 45 points
> October (5) nights - OKW = 40 points
> ...



Am I to assume your 5 night rentals do NOT include the Friday or Saturday nights??? Either way, this is awesome useage of DVC points.


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## littlestar (Dec 15, 2006)

Steamboat Bill said:
			
		

> Am I to assume your 5 night rentals do NOT include the Friday or Saturday nights??? Either way, this is awesome useage of DVC points.



Exactly. No Fridays or Saturdays. I'll probably pick up a week in a 2 or 3 bedroom at one of the Marriotts (with one of our extra AC's I need to use) and if the kids need an extra night on the weekend, we'll do it that way.


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## Carl D (Dec 15, 2006)

I can certainly appreciate an economical use of points. I think that is great if that is what you choose to do. It's a very smart way to manage points.

For us, we book whatever vacations we want. I just can't be bothered with the weekend thing. 
Fortunately we have plenty of points to do that, and will buy another chunk when AKV goes on sale.


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## BocaBum99 (Dec 15, 2006)

Carl D said:
			
		

> As strange as it sounds, DVC usually has some type of incentive. The exact details vary from time to time, but it always translates to a money saver.
> When I purchased years ago it was called "Magical Beginnings", and DVC paid the first $10/pt toward your down payment.
> At the beginning of DVC there was some sort of free park pass incentive.
> Again, same story different title.



Okay, if that's true, then it's just the normal thing they do.  I am truly amazed at what WDW has done with the Disney Vacation Club.  Unfortunately for them, it doesn't work outside of the theme parks setting.  So, it is very difficult to have much of an impact on the bottom line like it does for Marriott or Hilton.


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 15, 2006)

Well...when I first bought DVC in 2001, they had the Magical Beginnings program and I took advantage of that offer, but I was NOT able to get immediate use of the points. The net cost per point was something like $64 per point when I bought, but I had to wait at least 6 months to get my point allotment.

The reason for this post was NOT simply to inform everyone about the reduced $15 pp savings to promote the 15th Anniversary of the DVC program, it was the added benefit of getting a full year of points for only paying one month of Maintenance Fees (1/12 the normal Price). I have not read anything about this on TUG.

Thus, when you add the $15 Friends and Family rebate and the potential to immediatly rent the 2006 points ($10pp), you in effect are receiving a $25 discount off the standard $101 pp price. This is a 25% discount when you combine the two programs.

I have NEVER seen a 25% discount off of Disney developer DVC prices. In fact, this is lower than all the resale prices I see on The Timeshare Store. That is why I am classifying this the BEST sale ever.

Good things will come to an end and that date is Dec 29th. I am sure there will be more discount programs in 2007, but I doubt it will be this good.

I am NOT trying to convince anyone of joining DVC as we already have 100,000 members. I am only informing TUG users, that I believe this is a good deal.

I even surprised myself when I bought 150 additional poitns to add to my already 500 points, but it was too good of a deal to pass up.

I may sell 250-500 points in a year or two, who knows. I will guarantee one thing....it will be for more than $76pp....yipee!


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 16, 2006)

I got a few e-mail asking for my contact at DVC so they can buy at $76pp.

Please re-read this thread as the cost is $86pp and you can rent your 2006 points for about $10-11pp on several bbs. Thus, the "NET COST" is $76pp, but requires a little work on your part.

Additionally, I do NOT encourage anyone to buy DVC thinking they are going to make a killing by renting points and then reselling later for a big profit. DVC frowns on commercial renters and is starting to crack down on "patters of abuse"

I am ONLY reccomending buying DVC if you really want to own a fantastic place for your family to vacation within the Disney family. I still feel that this is the best deal to come from Disney in years. If you have been on the sidelines, now is the time to act. If you are a "mouse-hater" then simply click past this thread.

I am willing to share some of my DVC knowledge with the TUG community as I have learned tons of info on my recent Marriott purchase from the TUG members. However, I hope people don't try to abuse this offer.

Again, DVC is expensive to buy and the MF are high, but this is a great opportunity to buy if you intend to use it to vacation in WDW. It also provides some flexibility to make a small profit by renting your extra points and I can almost guarantee you will make a profit if you decide to resell in 2-3 years. But if your intention is to run a DVC business....don't PM me.


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## rickandcindy23 (Dec 16, 2006)

What are the MF's for Saratoga per point right now?  

I was thinking of buying Villas at Wilderness from Seth Nock, probably about 200 points.  Then I dropped the idea, having been able to trade in for the last two trips, thanks to my awesome Foxrun and Gardens at West Maui weeks.  Now I also have come to realize the problem with the Sat-Sat exchanges and tacking on those five one-bedroom days on the front or the back of the exchange.  I will always have to pay double points for the Saturday or Friday stay.  I am not sure I want to pay that many points and the consequent fees for a five-day stay.  I am still better off using my AC for that extra week and leaving a little early.  I sure like the perks that Disney offers, though.  Hmmmmmmm........... 

The maintenance fees are probably the only thing I am not sure about between the two.


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## timeos2 (Dec 16, 2006)

*Resale value is not guaranteed*



			
				BocaBum99 said:
			
		

> And, DVC points at most resorts will have ZERO value in 2043.  Sometime between now and 2043 the resale prices need to go down dramatically.  The question is not if, but when.



Everything else stated in this thread I can go along with. If the DVC experience is worth the extra dollars I certainty don't want to rain on anyones parade.  Enjoy. But this line of fact is all too often overlooked by those that otherwise make a great case for DVC. The price will drop as Boca says. People aren't sharp enough to figure all the way through to what would it cost to rent a hotel room at Disney vs what seems to be a very high annual fee at DVC in the later years of the RTU.  Even if they did that calculation doesn't allow for any upfront purcahse expense but merely assuming an equal relationship between those annual fees and a rental. The value disappears if you have to pay very much to purchase the RTU in addition to the hefty annual fees.  Bottom line once the ROFR goes away the price will plummet. It will be too late to get out with any return on the purchase cost once it occurs. And when that will be is anyones guess but I know for sure it's closer today than it was last week. 

Except for that ever present fallacy ("sell for todays price or more") the rest of the DVC argument is reasonable. I just keep thinking far too many buyers are assuming a strong selling price and they stand to be burned on that. If they plan on the actual resale value of $0 in 2043 or earlier then they will be fine.  If they sell before 2043 and get $1 or more they are ahead of the game. Be informed and enjoy the magic.


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## ondeadlin (Dec 16, 2006)

timeos2 said:
			
		

> If they sell before 2043 and get $1 or more they are ahead of the game. Be informed and enjoy the magic.



If I were to buy DVC, I'd go into it planning to sell before developer construction ends. They pretty much have to keep the ROFR in place until that happens. With a new property planned at Animal Kingdom, and other new properties on the drawing board, I think that window is at least 10 years right now.


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## timeos2 (Dec 16, 2006)

*New construction doesn't apply*



			
				ondeadlin said:
			
		

> If I were to buy DVC, I'd go into it planning to sell before developer construction ends. They pretty much have to keep the ROFR in place until that happens. With a new property planned at Animal Kingdom, and other new properties on the drawing board, I think that window is at least 10 years right now.



The problem with that idea is that now there are at least two end dates for the RTU's - maybe more.  They can merrily sell the new 205X RTU's at full price and support them with ROFR while simultaneously walking away from the older, limited time left on the 2043 RTU's. In fact they almost have to. How can they possibly make a case that points that expire 10 years or more sooner have the same value as those that don't? Soon they will have to create tiers of ownership - old RTU, older RTU and new RTU.  The fun may be just starting.  Like most systems that seem simple and clear at the start they can and do get very complicated as the years pass. Construction and sales at new resorts means nothing to the value of the older ones except as it relates to use rights.  Ask the owners of the former Fairfield properties that stuck with weeks or what the value of FF points purchased at retail are today without ROFR to prop them up.  Or the former Marriott resort owners that got left when Marriott tired of their resort.  It happens all the time and DVC isn't going to be the only exception. The price of resale will fall and those that hoped to get out with high resale value will lose - but only in that one, limited area of ownership. Overall if all you lose on any timeshare is the upfront purchase price and everything else meets or exceeds your expectations you did pretty well. Not many are able to do even that as well as DVC does.


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## MattnTricia (Dec 16, 2006)

*DVC Benefits*

First - I would like to say I wish I had bought my first DVC back in 1999 when we were looking at Boardwalk for like $60 or OKW resales in the 50's. Secondly, we currently own 4 weeks with HGVC and 2 weeks with WorldMark and finally made the plunge based on this promotion 2 weeks ago.

The deciding factor was the Discounted 2006 maintenace fees that Bill explained. It actually netted down to a very similar cost to resale without the hassle of ROFR. We felt that it gave us an opportunity to buy in and try the membership for a few years - 40+ if you ask my wife - without any real risk being involved. The current resale market is hovering around $85 for this resort on stripped contracts and we decided that after renting the 2006 and probably 2007 points which we will not be able to use this was really a no lose situation for us.

I will admit that our initial contract was a minimum 150 and we are already planning an add on - VIA RESALE of course - to get us to the 300 or so plateau that we were looking at originally.


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## myip (Dec 16, 2006)

BocaBum99 said:
			
		

> And, DVC points at most resorts will have ZERO value in 2043.  Sometime between now and 2043 the resale prices need to go down dramatically.  The question is not if, but when.



Wouldn't Disney smart enough some time between now and 2043, they will offer the owners to renew the lease so the price doesn't seem to be dropping.  It is all preception.


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 16, 2006)

I received a PM question about the 50 and 100 point contracts that are sometimes on eBay

Answer: You can only add on smaller amounts (50 points or more now) once you are already a DVC member and you pay FULL price. Thus, I could buy 50 points, but it would be $101pp....not worth it. New members MUST buy-in at 150 point minimum. Besides, you can't get much for 50 points.

To: timeos2 - I understand the math and the concept, but I don't share the doom and gloom. Of course, my SSR points will be worth $0 in 2054. However, I bought in 2006 for a net cost of $76pp and can rent each year and profit $6-7pp each year. Thus, if I rent my points every year, the DVC purchase will be 100% FREE in 11-12 years which would be around 2018. At that time, I am sure I could resell it for over $100pp or continue renting and pocketing a profit of $6-7pp each year for the next 36 years that would net a total of $216pp-$252pp PURE PROFIT.

Regarding the multiple RTU dates -- I used to own 500 points at VWL in 2000 and sold them for a nice profit (about $6000) and bought SSR pre-construction. My two main reasons to do this were: (1). The new SSR  RTU had an extra 12 years and (2). The MF was lower at SSR as compared to VWL. I may sell my SSR points in a year or two if I see AKL or another newer property (VCR or California or ski, etc) has better RTU and lower MF. If not, I will continue to enjoy my ownership.

I respect everyone's opinion….however, I have proven and demonstrated how to buy (direct from the developer), enjoy, rent, flip, and sell DVC properties. I understand a lot about their program (I have bought over $100,000 of DVC points) and I mainly use it for my own family enjoyment. I don't think I have ever read about any other TS property that was bought directly from a developer that can match my success. This is not a brag or challenge, it just seems all the Marriott, Hyatt, HGVC, WorldMark, Bluegreen, Fairfield drop 50% or more once you sign the contract with a developer…..at least this won't happen with DVC.

There are even better ways to PROFIT off DVC (such as snagging the Christmas, New Years, Easter studios and then rent on eBay) but I have never done this as I consider it an abuse of the system and DVC is trying to stop this activity. Don't even mention this on DISboard as you WILL get flamed and perhaps banned. The people on DIS get upset if you take a towel from the pool to use in your own room.

To: mattnday - WELCOME HOME….

To: myip - we all are wondering what DVC will do when the original contracts expire, that is why I jumped ship to the new RTU for SSR and will jump to a newer RTU in the future. You have to stay ahead of the curve.


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 16, 2006)

mattnday said:
			
		

> First - I would like to say I wish I had bought my first DVC back in 1999 when we were looking at Boardwalk for like $60 or OKW resales in the 50's.



I can't even begin to explain to non-DVC members how many times I have heard that before.

Let's look to 2016...people will say, "I wish I bought SSR way back when it was only $76pp because the price is now $150pp"


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## rickandcindy23 (Dec 16, 2006)

*Hey, Bill, you guys all forgot me*

What are the MF's right now for Saratoga Springs and Wilderness?


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## rickandcindy23 (Dec 16, 2006)

I wonder if Disney will let me take my 7-day RCI points, non-expiring, park-hopper plus passes to the counter and use my $100 annual pass discount to upgrade them?   That would be a question for the salesperson.  I wonder where I put that guy's phone number at DVC.


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## bnoble (Dec 16, 2006)

www.mouseowners.com has the current (and historical) MFs for each DVC resort.


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 16, 2006)

Copied from www.mouseowners.com

Annual Dues amounts (in dollars) for all DVC resorts:

Year OKW BWV VB VB(sub) HH VWL BCV SSR 
2006 4.24 4.69 5.27 4.12 4.34 4.61 4.48 3.98 
2005 3.86 4.41 4.87 3.84 4.04 4.35 4.27 3.83 
2004 3.68 4.25 4.67 3.67 3.86 4.22 4.18 3.80 
2003 3.49 4.11 4.36 3.45 3.70 4.05 3.97   
2002 3.22 3.92 4.17 3.33 3.48 3.80 3.77   
2001 3.13 3.82 3.97 2.70 3.32 3.63     
2000 3.16 3.94 4.08 2.87 3.25 3.62     
1999 3.16 4.02 3.99 2.82 3.18       
1998 3.17 3.94   2.76 3.20       
1997 3.14 3.84   2.90 3.16       
1996 2.99 3.70   2.82 3.16       
1995 2.84               
1994 2.70               
1993 2.63               
1992 2.56               
1991 2.51

Now you can see one reason I jumped from VWL to SSR. With 650 points, thats a savings of $410

However, I lose the 11 month booking window for VWL and can only book at the 7 month window. That was not a deal breaker for me.


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## rickandcindy23 (Dec 16, 2006)

Now I understand why you like Saratoga better.

The increases are not higher than inflation, I like that about Disney and they have not had assessments.

Considering Disney is the most expensive for a hotel room, you have to wonder how Disney Vacation Club manages to keep the fees low. 

Off topic a bit: I would love our Hawaii weeks if they could keep the fees from going up over ten percent EVERY YEAR!  It is getting out of hand.  In 2004, when we bought our first week, the fee was $674 for our two bedroom, now for 2006 it was $822, for 2007 it is a whopping $898.


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## jesuis1837 (Dec 16, 2006)

Steamboat, you got mail!


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 17, 2006)

Some more thoughts:

1. I am NOT in favor of anyone using DVC financing as I feel it is a rip-off at 10.75% (last time I checked)

2. I am NOT in favor of anyone buying DVC with the ONLY intention of renting or reselling for profit.

3. I still think this is a FANTASTIC opportunity for people interested in joining the DVC family.

4. You can also borrow points from 2007 use year and immediatly rent them now for an approximate $6pp profit....thus the net cost would be about $70pp

5. $70pp net cost is the LOWEST I have seen for DVC points bought directly from Disney in a LONG time. In a year from now (only if you are considering joining DVC) you will be kicking yourself for not taking advantage of this opportunity...if you can afford to pay cash (no financing).


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## BocaBum99 (Dec 17, 2006)

myip said:
			
		

> Wouldn't Disney smart enough some time between now and 2043, they will offer the owners to renew the lease so the price doesn't seem to be dropping.  It is all preception.



I expect that they will offer an incentive to renew the lease.  And, they will probably discount it by something like 25%.  But, if you pay that 25%, that is for the NEW lease.  Not the current one.  The current lease will still be worth ZERO in 2043 at all DVC resorts except Saratoga Springs.

I also expect the same thing to happen to DVC prices that happened in Hawaii regarding leaseholds.  Owners and potential buyers will be made aware of the various expiration dates at purchase and there will be dramatic price differences between the contracts based on expiration date.


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## BocaBum99 (Dec 17, 2006)

I have modelled DVC points and I have determined that the REAL rate of return on capital investment is roughly 7% CAGR for a simple purchase along with average usage or rental of points.  That isn't a bad return if you use it every year because that is pretty much a risk free return for very little work.  You competely control whether or not you use it. 

But, you are far better of buying other timeshares, buy, selling and renting them and using the profits to rent DVC units from other owners.  It will be cheaper, but it will be much more work.

I do know how you can make a lot more off of DVC, but it would require a lot more work and expertise.  I'm guessing I could make 25-50% if I really worked at it.


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 17, 2006)

BocaBum99 said:
			
		

> I have modelled DVC points and I have determined that the REAL rate of return on capital investment is roughly 7% CAGR for a simple purchase along with average usage or rental of points.  That isn't a bad return if you use it every year because that is pretty much a risk free return for very little work.  You competely control whether or not you use it.
> 
> But, you are far better of buying other timeshares, buy, selling and renting them and using the profits to rent DVC units from other owners.  It will be cheaper, but it will be much more work.



First - I have no idea what DVC will do when the points are close to expiring...that is why I jumped from VWL to SSR and will jump from SSR to XXX if and when a better RTU becomes available. I feel I am hedging the future resale value more in my favor.

Second - I am glad you independently came up with the 7% CAGR as this is an acceptable investemtn for me as compared to CDs, money markets, etc. The benefit is the potential use for vacation and the potential for capital appreciation on resale...the rental (CASH) is a bonus.

Third - I 100% agree that there are many other TS investments that would offer better % CAGR or capital appreciation than DVC. However, I think this method is beyond the ability of the average TS user (and perhaps TUG user). Making money or making a living in the TS industry is not an easy thing to do.

Fourth - A few months ago, I would NOT have reccomended buying DVC because it was $101pp. I was reccomending people to rent points for $10pp....but now buying DVC at a potential $70pp, it is a no-brainer (especially if you love the mouse)!

Fifth - Nobody has challenged my statement the this is the only "DEVELOPER" sale that makes any sense as most TUG users buy on the resale market. Are there any other TS that can be bought from a developer (other than DVC) where you will not lose your shirt overnight?


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## ml855 (Dec 18, 2006)

Steamboat Bill,

So what kind of an incentive will you receive for referring all these tug friends 
to your DVC guide?  I'm sure you don't receive anything for just referring but if they buy what do you receive?


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 18, 2006)

ml855 said:
			
		

> So what kind of an incentive will you receive for referring all these tug friends to your DVC guide?  I'm sure you don't receive anything for just referring but if they buy what do you receive?



Ah...a skeptic....first...I never publically posted my Cast Member sales rep. I only have done that twice via a PM.

I made the original post to SHARE the info...not try to get a rebate. Of course, I figured DVC would rebate me something, but I really did not know what it was.

So I just called them today and here are the details

Sharing the Magic program - I would receive (5 friends max) 
$200 MF credit for 1 friend referred that bought DVC
$350 MF credit for 2 friends referred that bought DVC
$500 MF credit for 3 friends referred that bought DVC
$750 MF credit for 4 friends referred that bought DVC
$1000 MF credit for 5 friends referred that bought DVC

Trust me when I post this...I did not start this thread in an attempt to earn a kick-back...in fact, if that is your opinion, simply call DVC on your own and don't use my name. However, if you feel I helped you get a great discount on DVC and want me to get a referral, then send me a PM and I will give your my cast member.

I have been very happy with the sharring of info on TUG that helped me buy my Marriott and maximize II and get my ski week and this is my way to contribute to the community.


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## Steamboat Bill (Dec 24, 2006)

I am bumping this to the top for Barndweller....

As I said, you have until Dec 29 for this offer and NO I am not a DVC employee or even a Disney stock owner. I simply think this is the BEST deal for DVC in a long time.


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## Steamboat Bill (Jan 10, 2007)

Steamboat Bill said:


> Some more thoughts:
> 
> 1. I am NOT in favor of anyone using DVC financing as I feel it is a rip-off at 10.75% (last time I checked)
> 
> ...




I just wanted to update everyone on my recent DVC add-on purchase.

I rented all the 2006 points within 48 hours of buying from Disney. A few weeks later, the renter wanted to rent more points from me as they wanted to reserve another room for a relative.

Becasue all my 2006 points were used and my 2007 points are not available to me until August 1, 2007, I was able to "borrow" from 2007 at no extra cost to me and immediatly rent them to the same person.

Thus, my DVC contract I bought (directly from the developer Disney) 3 weeks ago cost me an "adjusted" $70 per point. If I keep this up for another 12 years, my "net adjusted" price will be $0 for the purchase.

Then I will still have about 34 years left on the RTU until it expires. In the meantime, I can still rent points, sell the contract, or use it for my family enjoyment.

I think I discovered an amazing buying, renting, using technique that anyone who is interested in DVC would be impressed with.

Have a magical day....thanks DVC!


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## Steamboat Bill (Jan 10, 2007)

In March 2007, the DVC rates go up to $104 per point at Saratoga Springs. 

They expect SSR to be sold out by the end of 2007.

AKL will probably be $107-$110 per point, when they do start selling, but the MF will probably be 15-20% higher (my guess).

It looks like my predications are coming true....stay tuned.


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## Dean (Jan 10, 2007)

rickandcindy23 said:


> I have tossed around the idea of Disney points.  I am one of the biggest nuts for Disney out there, so you would think Disney points would be in my repertoire of timeshares that you see to the left of this post.  We own lots of weeks, but we exchange into Disney and Disney exchanges are always Sat-Sat.  I wanted to add a five-night stay onto the week to extend our trips to 12 days instead of one week.  That would mean using double points for that Saturday night stay, so I cannot see doing it.  If the exchange weeks were Sun-Sun or even Fri-Fri, I would jump on the chance you just offered.  Too bad, so sad.


I missed this thread the first time around as we were doing my daughters wedding followed by a DVC trip with one unit as an exchange and one as a points reservation.  Actually while most exchanges are Sat-Sat, I have seen a number of Sun-Sun and a few Fri-Fri units lately. But even if you lose a night on a 1 BR or larger, it's still likely a good deal for most situations.  That's exactly what we did in Dec, had a 2 BR exchange at SSR and arrived a day late.  Since my direct costs were around $600 total for the unit including the exchange fee and $95 resort services fee, I still feel it was well worth it esp since the points I would have used for that unit had a street value of $2400 or more.

In reference to the contract size.  One can only buy less than 150 if you are a current member OR if you buy resale.  But you can buy less than 150 pts resale, even 25, though the price per point and closing costs might take away much of the incentive.  I think it's very doubtful that AKV will be above the $104 per point price that starts in March as sales should start by about then.  DVC has never raised prices for a new sell above existing prices for other comparable resorts though they have offered incentives for certain resorts around that same time to reduce the price per point at resort they see as harder to sell.  I think it's very likely the price for AKV will be $104 per point initially with an increase again in the fall around or just after it opens.  This would be c/w what happened with SSR, BCV and VWL when they started selling and then opened a few months later.  There may be other incentives early on, there were with SSR including a situation where you paid no fees for the rest of the year, got last years points even though the resort was not open and in some cases, got a free 100 pts though I don't think it was 100 points AND last years points both.


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## Steamboat Bill (Jan 10, 2007)

Dean said:


> But even if you lose a night on a 1 BR or larger, it's still likely a good deal for most situations.  That's exactly what we did in Dec, had a 2 BR exchange at SSR and arrived a day late.  Since my direct costs were around $600 total for the unit including the exchange fee and $95 resort services fee, I still feel it was well worth it esp since the points I would have used for that unit had a street value of $2400 or more.



That is a fantastic price for a 2 BDR SSR.

Dean...where is your bouncing alien avitar you use on DIS....I am still an underground lurker there as my IP address (for Steamboat Bill) is banned from posting there.

It cracks me up but there is a thread about point rental rates that is exactly like I started that got me banned from DIS.

http://disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1318018


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## Dean (Jan 10, 2007)

Steamboat Bill said:


> That is a fantastic price for a 2 BDR SSR.
> 
> Dean...where is your bouncing alien avitar you use on DIS....I am still an underground lurker there as my IP address (for Steamboat Bill) is banned from posting there.
> 
> ...


Actually it's not been that long that the signature would have been allowed here so I haven't added it to my signature yet.  I haven't decided if I will or not.


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## ahmo (Jan 16, 2007)

Is this offer still available?  Thanks.


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## Steamboat Bill (Jan 16, 2007)

ahmo said:


> Is this offer still available?  Thanks.



I believe that the $15 discount is still available until Jan 20th, but the 2006 point use is gone. Call DVC for more details.


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## tomandrobin (Jan 19, 2007)

One day left! 

Just wanted to let you know, we did a 120 point add-on!


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## Steamboat Bill (Jan 19, 2007)

tomandrobin said:


> One day left!
> 
> Just wanted to let you know, we did a 120 point add-on!



Congrats......I also did a 150 point add-on!

I think this will be better than any AKL deals out there....but you never know...I will buy AKL only if they offer a killer price....I am NOT holding my breath on that one.


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## Steamboat Bill (May 29, 2007)

I was NOT going to post this, but I changed my mind.

I just bought Two more "100 point" DVC SSR contracts this past month.

I did NOT get as good of a deal as I did in December, but here are the details.

I bought two separate 100 point contracts as I feel the resale price of 100 points are stronger than one 200 point contract.

SSR = $101 per point - $10 point credit = $91 per point x 100 points = $9100

DVC also threw in the 100 points from 2006 that I immediatly rented for $11 per point....I think it took me less than 24 hours to find a renter.

Thus, my final price was $101 per point - $10 point credit - $11 per point rental = $80 per point x 100 points = $8000.

This is still cheaper than RESALES!!!!!

In addition, I can rent my 2007 points for $11 per point, but need to subtract the $4.14 annual dues = $6.86 per point profit.

Thus, my true NET cost after I rent my 2007 points will be $73.14 per point.

I can continue renting at $11 per point and/or sell it for a profit or use it for personal use.

Will someone on TUG please post about any other timeshare company that you can buy directly from the developer and make a profit like this?


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## Carl D (May 29, 2007)

Is that price for members, or everyone? We just bought a fresh load of Animal Kingdom, and got it for $93. I think that's a members only price, but I could be wrong about that. There are no incentive points at AKV in addition to the price break. It's one or the other.
I wanted the 11 month window at AKV for concierge and grand villas.

Also, for others out there reading, DVC can cancel reservations if they feel you are renting commercially. The magic number is 20 rentals, but that has varied lower in the recent past.


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## Dean (May 29, 2007)

Steamboat Bill said:


> Will someone on TUG please post about any other timeshare company that you can buy directly from the developer and make a profit like this?


There are no guarantees with any timeshare purchase DVC or otherwise and I doubt one that buys SSR at $91 per point will make much on it over time when you account for commissions, unless you deduct from the price paid with useage, but we shall see.  AKV likely has a much better potential for profit than does SSR, CRV will as well if it actually happens.  However, for those that look at resale, there are other situations where one can make a profit over time.  If you're happy with it and will use it, do so and enjoy.


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