# SDO Maintenance Fees



## grgs (Mar 30, 2007)

Can someone tell me the m.f. for the small one bedroom unit at Sheraton Desert Oasis?  Please state whether it includes taxes and the $99 SVN fee.

Thanks!

Glorian


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## intromaster (Jun 5, 2007)

yes, I would like to know as well!

Thanks


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## nodge (Jun 5, 2007)

Small one bedroom SDO MF should be (but apparently isn't):  $269.53 (includes property taxes, doesn’t include SVN or optional “ARDA ROC PAC” fee.)

Here’s how I calculated this fee.  2007 maintenance fees for my annual SDO 2 bedroom lock-off were $728.46, which automatically includes property taxes, but doesn’t include the SVN fee.

I’m pretty sure that Starwood splits this maintenance fee between the large unit (63%) and small unit (37%) to form the 2 bedroom lock-off.  Accordingly, the maintenance fee for the small one bedroom for 2007 should be $269.53 (including property taxes, but not including the SVN fee (if any)).

If you already own an SVN property and pay the $99 SVN fee through that property’s maintenance fees, the annual SVN fee for the second unit is $30.  In addition, Starwood automatically tacks on a “voluntary” $5 contribution to an organization identified only as “ARDA ROC PAC,” which you can opt out of, but it takes an affirmative act on your part to avoid paying it.

Someone who only owns the small one bedroom may have better data.

-nodge


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## pointsjunkie (Jun 6, 2007)

i recently purchased sdo small unit ey and they say the MF"S are $449.95 per year. it would be great if it is less. but it does sound about right.


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## grgs (Jun 6, 2007)

The m.f. that I tracked down are (does not include $99 SVN fee; not sure about $5 ARDA PAC):

2 bedroom lockoff: $728 ($384 for an EOY)

Lg. 1 bedroom: $501 ($270 for an EOY)

Sm. 1 bedroom: $425 ($232 for an EOY)

The odd thing to me is that the two one bedroom units together add up to significantly more than the 2 bedroom unit.  

Glorian


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## nodge (Jun 6, 2007)

Oh Good, I was worried that another day would go by without us learning that SVN has been messing with things . . ..

If it is true that the small and large one bedroom maintenance fees when combined total more than the two bedroom lock-off maintenance fee, this would be in direct conflict with the “Declaration of Covenants, Conditions, Restrictions and Easements for Scottsdale Pinnacle” (Official name of SDO) recorded with Maricopa County as Document No. 98-0094372.

In particular, Sec. 6.1 (Creation of Personal Obligations for Maintenance Fees) on page 20 of Doc. No. 98-0094372 expressly says that:

“Proportionate Share” for Owners of Annual Intervals shall be as follows:

Interval Type/Unit Type..........................................Proportionate Share

Annual Interval – Deluxe One Bedroom.................................63%

Annual Interval – Standard One Bedroom.............................37%

Annual Interval – Two Bedroom........................................100%


Such that the Maintenance Fee of an Annual Interval – Two Bedroom shall be equal to the combined total Maintenance Fees of an Annual Interval-Deluxe One Bedroom and an Annual Interval – Standard One Bedroom.

“Proportionate Share” for each Biennial Interval Owner shall be fifty percent (50%) of the Annual Interval Maintenance Fee of the same Unit Type plus a bookkeeping fee established by the Association to reasonably compensate it for handling the extra work involved in assessing and collecting Maintenance Fees from the Owners of Biennial Intervals.”

If anyone (including the good folks at SVN) wants to check my work, click on this link:  

http://recorder.maricopa.gov/recdocdata/

Then enter 98 in the first box next to “recording number” and 0094372 in the second box next to “recording number," then click on "seach.”

Go to page 20 (which you get to by entering page "25" in the page search box that appears) of the document that appears.

Is anyone aware of SVN recording any changes to this document that affect this calculation?

-nodge


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## grgs (Jun 6, 2007)

Nodge,

I impressed that you tracked that down!

If you total the numbers that I listed above and deduct $99 from each one, the total does come out to $728 which is the amount for the 2 bedroom lockout. 

Lg. 1 bedroom: $501 - $99 = $402 

Sm. 1 bedroom: $425 - $99 = $326 

I got my numbers both from owners here on TUG and Starwood.  I did ask for m.f. _without_ the SVN fee, but I suppose it's possible that the numbers I got included the fee.

Glorian


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## nodge (Jun 6, 2007)

Hi Glorian,

Having the two one bedroom's MF's add up to the two bedroom MF's is a big improvement, but the percentages are still off over what they are supposed to be according to the recorded document.

Large One Bedroom:   55.2% of 2 bedroom L/O MF's.
Small One Bedroom:   44.8% of 2 bedroom L/O MF's.

Since no one is whining, I guess everyone is happy with this.  It definitely makes the large one-bedroom an even better deal (albeit at the expense of the small one-bedroom owners), but I'm sure all of you large one-bedroom owners will give the small one bedroom owners a great big "thank you" hug when you see 'em around the pool. 

-nodge


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## Robert D (Jun 8, 2007)

I own a small 1BR at SDO that I bought as a resale, so I'm not in the SVN. I paid $424.95 for 2007 M&T back in January for it.


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## nodge (Jun 9, 2007)

Robert D said:


> I own a small 1BR at SDO that I bought as a resale, so I'm not in the SVN. I paid $424.95 for 2007 M&T back in January for it.



Hi Robert D,

Thanks for posting your info.  In light of the 2 bedroom L/O MF's, and the recorded CCR's of SDO expressly requiring that the small and one bedroom MF's when combined MUST equal the 2 bedroom MF's, something is definately not right here.

I suggest you call SVN and inquire, and please let us know what you find out.

Thanks again,
-nodge


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## Robert D (Jun 10, 2007)

Thanks, Nodge.  I'll contact Starwood and see if they overcharged me.  I just looked up the 2007 M&T for my SDO and it shows that it is the amount I paid, but it sure sounds like this amount includes the $99 SVN membership cost.  Wonder if anyone else who has a small 1BR there can weigh in on this as to how much they paid and whether they are in the SVN.


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## Robert D (Jun 10, 2007)

I asked Starwood what the annual maintenance was for each size unit and got this message:

"Thank you for contacting Association Management. 

The 2007 maintenance fees for the different units at Sheraton Desert Oasis are listed below. 

Standard One Bedroom: $424.95 
Deluxe One Bedroom: $500.88 
Lockoff Unit: $728.46 

These figures can be found in the Scottsdale Pinnacle Owner's Association Operating Expenses Budget"

I sent them the quote above from the CCR's and asked why the total of the two 1BR's is more than a 2BR lockoff.  Will let you know what they say.


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## pointsjunkie (Jun 10, 2007)

does that include the $99 svn fee?


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## djyamyam (Jul 24, 2007)

pointsjunkie said:


> does that include the $99 svn fee?


 
Did this question ever get answered?  If I look at the previous posts, it looks like the $425 does include the $99 SVN fee.  However, if I bought resale and am therefore not eligible for SVN, aren't I paying for something I can't get?  Additionally, everything else I've read says I have to pay for my II membership directly to II.  So in essence, I'm double paying for my II membership.  Is that correct?


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## pointsjunkie (Jul 24, 2007)

don't forget a resale SDO is not part of the SVN unless you requalify it.


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## Robert D (Jul 25, 2007)

I contacted SVO over a month ago about the question of whey the total of the two 1BR's M&T is more than the 2BR lockoff.  They replied that they were reseaching my question, but no one has ever gotten back with me.  I suspect that they don't have a good answer and are in conflict with the bylaws.

As best I can tell, the $424 for the small 1BR does not include the SVN $99 membership fee - at least that's what Starwood told me.


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## Ken555 (Jul 25, 2007)

djyamyam said:


> Did this question ever get answered?  If I look at the previous posts, it looks like the $425 does include the $99 SVN fee.  However, if I bought resale and am therefore not eligible for SVN, aren't I paying for something I can't get?  Additionally, everything else I've read says I have to pay for my II membership directly to II.  So in essence, I'm double paying for my II membership.  Is that correct?



This is what happened with my WMH. I bought resale, and they kept charging me SVN fees. In the end, as some of you know who've read my story before... Starwood just decided to let me stay in SVN. After all, they didn't want to refund my money. Go figure.


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## Robert D (Jul 25, 2007)

This is the detail of the 2007 maintenance fees for my small 1BR at SDO from the mystarcentral website:

Current Year Charges 
Maintenance Fee(s)    $ 424.95  
Tax - If Applicable    $ 0.00  
Membership Fee - If Applicable    $ 0.00  
Other*    $ 0.00  
Interest    $ 0.00  
Late Fees    $ 0.00  
ARDA ROC PAC Contrib.**    $ 0.00  
Sub-Total
Current Year Charges    $ 424.95  

I assume the the Membership Fee is the SVN membership which would be $99 if I was in the SVN, so I assume that the $425 per year does not include the SVN membership fee.


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## Ken555 (Jul 27, 2007)

pointsjunkie said:


> don't forget a resale SDO is not part of the SVN unless you requalify it.



But Kierland is mandatory, so you must pay the SVN fee.


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## Ken555 (Jul 27, 2007)

Robert D said:


> This is the detail of the 2007 maintenance fees for my small 1BR at SDO from the mystarcentral website:
> 
> Current Year Charges
> Maintenance Fee(s)    $ 424.95
> ...



Kierland is mandatory, so you must pay SVN fee (or do you have more than 1 SVN property? your 2nd would be $30, and 3+ are no charge).


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## djyamyam (Jul 27, 2007)

Robert D said:


> This is the detail of the 2007 maintenance fees for my small 1BR at SDO from the mystarcentral website:
> 
> Current Year Charges
> Maintenance Fee(s) $ 424.95
> ...


 
Perfect.  That's what I was looking for.


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## Robert D (Jul 28, 2007)

I don't own at Kierland, only at Desert Oasis and Vistana resort and both were resales so I'm not in the SVN.  Looks to me that they are not charging me the SVN membership fee.


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## steved2psi (Jul 28, 2007)

I bought resales at SDO and SMV.  No charge at SDO but charged me the $99at SMV.  I e mailed customer service 2 days ago.  No response yet.


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## Novagirl (Sep 9, 2007)

*SDO Maintenance fees - % allocation*

Hi All,  Just came across this older post, but adding to it in case anyone still wants the info.

As far as I can tell (2007):

2 BR LO - $728.46, no SVN
1 BR lg - $500.88, no SVN
1 BR sm - $424.95, no SVN

This lines up (within a few cents) with the amendment to the CCR dated March 31, 1998, registered as #19980250658.

2 BR LO - basis for calculation
1 BR lg - 68.67% of the 2BR LO (i.e., in 2007, math =  $500.23)
1 BR sm - 58.37% of the 2BR LO (i.e., in 2007, math =  $425.20)

Pam


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## Robert D (Sep 9, 2007)

That's interesting. I never got a reply from Starwood as to why the sum of the small and large 1BR's fees were more than a 2BR LO, but it appears there was an amendment to the bylaws in 1998 that changed that.


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## nodge (Sep 10, 2007)

Novagirl said:


> This lines up (within a few cents) with the amendment to the CCR dated March 31, 1998, registered as #19980250658.
> 
> 2 BR LO - basis for calculation
> 1 BR lg - 68.67% of the 2BR LO (i.e., in 2007, math =  $500.23)
> ...



Great catch Novagirl/Pam!  

It's strange that Vistana elected to change that calculation within a month of recording the primary CCR's for the property, and that my title search report from a very reputable search company was missing the document that you found . . . ..

Folks who are interested in owning a 2 Bedroom at SDO (which is really just a small one bedroom connected to a large one bedroom)  should be aware that if they separately buy a large one bedroom and a small one bedroom to reach a 2 bedroom villa, they will be paying more in maintenance fees ($925.83) than if they just bought a 2 bedroom unit ($728.46) outright.

Let's see how long it takes Starwood to answer RobertD?

Buyers beware!

-nodge


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