# Trade in for a new purchase?



## DLAU81 (Dec 3, 2018)

New to TUG and has been helpful to all my concerns.

We currently have 3 timeshares with HGV
2 - 2bed at Marbrisa
1 - 2bed at Kingsland

Wondering has anyone ever traded their timeshares for a new one before?

We went to Marbrisa and wasn’t happy with the resort so i’m Looking get rid of those. I tried asking HGV resale department for buyback but apparently they do no list this timeshare. We have our update presentation this week and wondering what should i do.


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## brp (Dec 3, 2018)

It's likely that they would make you an offer to trade your Marbrisa value toward something else. However, they will ask for a bunch of "new money" (likely minimum of $30K) for this as you would be purchasing at Developer rates. You'd be better off to sell the Marbrisa on your own and buy what you do want on the resale market.

Cheers.


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## dayooper (Dec 3, 2018)

DLAU81 said:


> New to TUG and has been helpful to all my concerns.
> 
> We currently have 3 timeshares with HGV
> 2 - 2bed at Marbrisa
> ...



Your trade in would cost more money than even giving your MarBrisa away and buying resale. Unless you are worried about MF’s per point, why would it matter if you owned at MarBrisa? Just use the points and enjoy the system.


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## DLAU81 (Dec 3, 2018)

I do like the system and the fact i have the points but i don’t like having 3 different maintenance fee every year so i want to consolidate and just have one to worry about.


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## tombanjo (Dec 3, 2018)

There is a thread that shows some examples of what HGVC is offering as trade ins, bottom line is no matter how much they give you, they want far far far more in "new money" than what you could achieve resale.

https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/my-sales-presentation-aka-owner-update.274184/

Some people never stay at the resort they own, they use the points to stay where  ever else they want, their ownership at Marbrisa or Elara or any other place is just to buy into the system and get points. 

So yes, they will buy back your timeshare when you "upgrade" at a much higher price. 

If you don't like Marbrisa, use the points to stay other places in the HGVC galaxy, or the much bigger RCI trade universe.

Worst case, sell Maribrisa in resale marketplace, and use funds to buy where you want in resale marketplace.


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## brp (Dec 3, 2018)

Selling and buying a consolidated thing is the only way. Yes, you will lost money on this, but you will save on MFs in the long run.

I feel your pain - we own two 5000 point Gold weeks in Vegas and I would prefer that they be 7000 point Platinum as the MFs would be the same for more points. I would have to sell the two 5000s at a loss, and buy the 7000s for more. The main reason I haven't done it yet is that, at present, the extra points are more than we'd need...until retirement.

And, yes, I do realize that I throw away some money each year I wait 

Cheers.


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## DLAU81 (Dec 3, 2018)

Thanks everyone, will let you know what kind of lies they present to us at the owners upgrade. Lol


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## bcjenkins (Dec 4, 2018)

DLAU81 said:


> New to TUG and has been helpful to all my concerns.
> 
> > Wondering has anyone ever traded their timeshares for a new one before?



I upgraded during Thanksgiving week.  HGV bought back two properties I owned, one was purchased from the developer, the other via resale market.  They credited me what I paid for the dev-purchased property, and for the resale property they credited me what the original owner paid.  (I.e., in theory I "made money" on the resale property.)

The goal of upgrading was threefold:  (1) Consolidate and reduce maintenance fees, (2)(a) increase my points and (b) get to a good point-to-maintenance ratio ($0.099/point), and (3) obtain HGVC Elite status.

To the important issue that others already have made:  This transaction required a *bunch* of new money. 

Was it a wise financial decision?  Of course not.  (Spreadsheets don't lie.)

Even if you consider the "profit" from the resale (credit toward purchase) and the boatload of Bonus Points I received, it wasn't a logical decision; however, I entered the transaction willingly and with eyes wide open. 

On paper, elite status in the resort system isn't worth it, but I wanted to try it to know for certain.  (I already have perennial Hilton Honors status via credit card and business travel benefits, so that particular "value" was a non-issue for me in making my upgrade decision.)

As an aside, the sales rep kept telling me that "amnesty" (buying back a resale property) was a one-time offer only, never to be repeated.  It's a classic sales play that I find highly unlikely.

Good luck.

Bruce


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## magmue (Dec 4, 2018)

if i remember correctly, Mar-Brisa is an affiliate in the HGVC system? If yes, Hilton Reps were telling the truth when they said it was not eligible for buy back. We had the same experience with our resale Bay Club.


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## Talent312 (Dec 4, 2018)

bcjenkins said:


> ...Was it a wise financial decision?  Of course not.  (Spreadsheets don't lie.)



That's really all one needs to know.
There is some value in the burden of selling the old TS's...
How much you're willing to pay for that is up to you.
.


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## zerocylinders (Dec 4, 2018)

I have done three upgrades: one was a bad deal in retrospect, the other was a decent one (maybe even good).  It all depends on what HGVC is offering to you, and what you are able to get from them in return.

When you do an upgrade, you should get 100% credit for what was paid to the developer originally for the property you are trading in.  So in that way, it is a good way to get rid of a property you might no longer want.  Also worth noting is that HGVC has offered to upgrade a unit purchased at resale (Anderson Club), giving me full credit for the original developer price paid by the original purchaser (which was much more than I paid at resale).  Plus you can get a good number of bonus points.  As mentioned, you will need to buy a MORE expensive unit by about $30K delta in order for HGVC to agree to any upgrade, so the game is that you want to trade in a more expensive property that you don't want, for one you do, and try to keep the new money you have to pay as close to 30K as possible.  You can also get other benefits on the upgrade - see below examples.

A couple of examples from my own experience:

Deal #1 (bad): Upgraded a one bedroom at Sunrise Lodge ("equity" credit of around $30K), to a 3 bedroom + 1 bedroom premium platinum for around $95K.  40,000 bonus points.  Moved my Anderson Club resale unit (that was in its own HGVC account so was a hassle to deal with) into my consolidated HGVC elite account making point management and reservations easier.  Enabled me to achieve Elite status.  I also used the 40K bonus points over 2 years for 6 extra weeks of vacation.

Deal #2 (good, I think): Upgraded the 3 Bedroom premier platinum at Sunrise Lodge (equity credit of around 65K) to a 2 bedroom penthouse unit / pool platinum season unit (19K annual points) at the new Barbados property, with a net payment of 44K.  Received 20,000 bonus points, plus converted my non-HGVC Grand Pacific Palisades unit (bought resale, not eligible for HGVC) into an HGVC unit and moved into my elite HGVC account.  

I won't dissect the first deal, which in retrospect I think was not worth it (though the 3 bedroom units platinum units are not easy to find, so what they are worth really depends on timing of when you are trying to sell; Watching market over past few years, I have seen the Sunrise 3 bedroom premier platinum units go for 40-50K, and also seen sellers at 15K; but they rarely come up so market is hard to judge).  

Deal #2 I am pretty happy with.  If I had sold the 3 bedroom Sunrise property, I would have received somewhere between 15K and 44K resale depending on how long a was willing to wait it out for top dollar.  Renting the 3 bedroom has turned out to be difficult (the one bedroom rents every year I don't use it, on the other hand), and our prior upgrade had combined the 1+3 bedroom into a single contract, which would have made resale very difficult.  I figured I might get 35K if I gave it 6 months for both units.  I could have purchased a prime fixed week unit the Barbados units direct from The Crane instead of HGVC, so there are some good pricing metrics.  A similar 2 bedroom pool/penthouse Crane residence around Christmas or spring break weeks would have run $55K - 90K resale, but would have been fixed week and would not be included in the HGVC system.  

Comparing purchase financial aspects on Deal #2:
Direct purchase with 3 bedroom trade in from Sunrise (retaining 1 bedroom for later sale and/or continued rental): net payment $44K
vs.
Sell Sunrise at resale (both units together) for around $35K (hopefully) and purchase comparable resale at around $70K midpoint of current offerings: net payment $35K and at least several months to a year before I could get the price I want for Sunrise (if at all).

So on purchase price alone, I might have done slightly better selling and buying resale.  But, by going through HGVC I got a number of concessions that made the extra $9K worth it (in this particular case): (i) I still have the 1 bedroom at Sunrise I can now sell unencumbered from the 3 Bedroom, or I can keep renting it out over the cost of MFs; (ii) related, there was no way I could separate the Sunrise units since they were deeded in a single contract (big mistake I made in that first upgrade), making it very questionable whether I could ever get any real resale value for the 1 bedroom that would be tacked on to the 3 bedroom in a resale - in the upgrade, HGVC agreed to separate the deeds for me; (iii) slight reduction in MF/point (and Sunrise has been increasing, whereas Barbados is brand new so hopefully will be fixed for a while); (iv) 20K bonus points (not that I value these at much, but at least a few grand); (v) moving my Grand Pacific Palisades unit into the HGVC system and my elite account, which was impossible without the upgrade as my particular resale unit was not grandfathered in to the HGVC management deal at GPP.

So the moral to my story is that you should at least evaluate the upgrade offer that HGVC is giving you, and ask for anything that you want "fixed" as part of the upgrade.  You **might** be able to get a good deal, but you could also get taken so be firm if what they offer isn't good enough then walk away.


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## DLAU81 (Dec 4, 2018)

Thanks for everyone’s input!

I’m so confused, some people say MarBrisa is one of the only resorts that can be “traded up”/buy back but can anyone confirm they have traded up a MarBrisa unit?


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## DLAU81 (Dec 4, 2018)

magmue said:


> if i remember correctly, Mar-Brisa is an affiliate in the HGVC system? If yes, Hilton Reps were telling the truth when they said it was not eligible for buy back. We had the same experience with our resale Bay Club.



I have no idea some say its one of the only resorts that can be eligible for buy back.


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## SmithOp (Dec 4, 2018)

DLAU81 said:


> I have no idea some say its one of the only resorts that can be eligible for buy back.



I think it depends on whether its one of the older Grand Pacific units vs one of the newer ones sold by HGVC.  That is the only issue I can think of that would be relevant to buy back.  Why would HGVC want to give credit for a contract they didn’t sell in the first place?


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## DLAU81 (Dec 4, 2018)

SmithOp said:


> I think it depends on whether its one of the older Grand Pacific units vs one of the newer ones sold by HGVC.  That is the only issue I can think of that would be relevant to buy back.  Why would HGVC want to give credit for a contract they didn’t sell in the first place?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


When we bought the 2, we bought from HGVC so we were in the HGVC point system already. I had no idea they were part of the Grand Pacific!


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## DLAU81 (Dec 4, 2018)

SmithOp said:


> I think it depends on whether its one of the older Grand Pacific units vs one of the newer ones sold by HGVC.  That is the only issue I can think of that would be relevant to buy back.  Why would HGVC want to give credit for a contract they didn’t sell in the first place?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


I guess I thought it was weird that when it came time to pay for MF, i couldn’t pay it with my Kingsland unit but had to go through Advanced Finco


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## zerocylinders (Dec 4, 2018)

DLAU81 said:


> I have no idea some say its one of the only resorts that can be eligible for buy back.


All units that were originally sold by HGVC, are eligible in theory, don't buy the salesman telling you otherwise.  However, some properties are really hybrids - some preexisting units were sold outside of HGVC before HGVC took over. In that case only HGVC units within the property are eligible (Grand Pacific for example).  Not sure about Marbrisa.

If HGVC sold it, they can buy it back and resell it - if they want to.  I have had HGVC give me upgrade offers on: Anderson club, South Beach, sunrise lodge, and eagles nest.  Fwiw.

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## SmithOp (Dec 5, 2018)

zerocylinders said:


> All units that were originally sold by HGVC, are eligible in theory, don't buy the salesman telling you otherwise.  However, some properties are really hybrids - some preexisting units were sold outside of HGVC before HGVC took over. In that case only HGVC units within the property are eligible (Grand Pacific for example).  Not sure about Marbrisa.
> 
> If HGVC sold it, they can buy it back and resell it - if they want to.  I have had HGVC give me upgrade offers on: Anderson club, South Beach, sunrise lodge, and eagles nest.  Fwiw.
> 
> Sent from my Moto Z3 Play using Tapatalk



Marbrisa has a clear divide between the older GP units and newer HGV units.







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## GT75 (Dec 5, 2018)

SmithOp said:


> Marbrisa has a clear divide between the older GP units and newer HGV units.



Is it just simply then location?


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## DLAU81 (Dec 5, 2018)

SmithOp said:


> Marbrisa has a clear divide between the older GP units and newer HGV units.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hopefully its not by location but when we stayed at Marbrisa not one of our weeks we stayed on the “GP” side using our club points. I thought it was crazy how i had to walk from GP side to the lobby/checkin area.


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## PigsDad (Dec 5, 2018)

SmithOp said:


> Marbrisa has a clear divide between the older GP units and newer HGV units.


Marbrisa does have two sections, but HGVC took over the sales long before the first phase was sold out.  That, and combined with the fact that there are not fixed unit HGVC contracts, means that there is no "GP" section or "HGVC" section -- it is just dependent on what kind of contract one owns.  Internally the contracts may have unit numbers associated with them for inventory reasons, but that does not indicate where you may be placed when staying there.

Kurt


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## SmithOp (Dec 5, 2018)

DLAU81 said:


> Hopefully its not by location but when we stayed at Marbrisa not one of our weeks we stayed on the “GP” side using our club points. I thought it was crazy how i had to walk from GP side to the lobby/checkin area.



You have to pay attention to the unit description when you book.  If it says “Stair Access and The Pointe” you will get one of the older GPP units (phase 1).  There are no elevators.






If its says The Cove you will be at the new pool area (phase 2), they have elevators.







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## SmithOp (Dec 5, 2018)

PigsDad said:


> Marbrisa does have two sections, but HGVC took over the sales long before the first phase was sold out.  That, and combined with the fact that there are not fixed unit HGVC contracts, means that there is no "GP" section or "HGVC" section -- it is just dependent on what kind of contract one owns.  Internally the contracts may have unit numbers associated with them for inventory reasons, but that does not indicate where you may be placed when staying there.
> 
> Kurt



I’ve been to sales presentation with both teams, GPP at Palisades and HGV at Marbrisa.  Its interesting how they spin it based on who you talk to.  GPP sales called it a partnership when they brought in HGV.  HGV sales said they bailed out GPP by taking over development of the Cove.


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## alwysonvac (Dec 5, 2018)

SmithOp said:


> You have to pay attention to the unit description when you book.  If it says “Stair Access and The Pointe” you will get one of the older GPP units (phase 1).  There are no elevators.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It’s been reported that this location doesn’t always honor the booking category 
https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php...in-experience-at-marbrisa-need-advice.275496/


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## DLAU81 (Dec 6, 2018)

SmithOp said:


> You have to pay attention to the unit description when you book.  If it says “Stair Access and The Pointe” you will get one of the older GPP units (phase 1).  There are no elevators.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Whew! Thanks for the info! I checked our weeks and we own the 2bed plus in the Cove Neighborhood.


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## Chop999 (Dec 6, 2018)

If you’re looking for some current resale data, I recently won an eBay auction for a 2bd 7000 pt platinum at Marbrisa for $1,850 closing costs and transfer included. I never actually owned it though. They took forever to produce the estoppel due to miscommunications with Adv Fin so they offered me an opportunity to withdraw. I exercised that option today once I had secured another property. Personally I think this was on the low side of what they’re actually worth but I wasn’t willing to try and “flip” a TS....could have been a mistake. Not sure how profitable that would have been.


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## DLAU81 (Dec 7, 2018)

Thanks! That’s actually very helpful. We have our owners update tomorrow so i’m Going in prepared thanks to TUG, we’ll see what the HGVC sales will have to say. They may even say that MarBrisa is not eligible for trade ins — that’s when we’ll take the $100 dining credit and have a nice steak dinner on them.


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## DLAU81 (Dec 7, 2018)

Just got back from our owners update and was told
All MarBrisa units whether HGVC or GP is “untouchable” meaning if you wanted to do any trade ups they are not eligible since it was not developed by HGVC.
So the sales person was trying to convince us trading in our 2bed Kingsland 7500 annual Gold for a 1bed Grand Islander (NO VIEW) 7200 annual Plat Grand Islander plus 20k new money would be a better investment for our money. Sure......

I checked resale and someone was selling Grand Waikikian (similar to Grand Islander) 1 bed 7200 Plat annual for $8500.

They were in a hurry to get us out since they couldn’t make a sale. At least we have a nice dinner for 1.5 hours.


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