# Club Sunterra



## bluke (Dec 28, 2005)

Could anyone tell me how and if the point system works for Club Sunterra if you buy a resale week?  Thanks


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## Spence (Dec 28, 2005)

Please read here http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7606
then ask any question for clarification


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## bluke (Dec 28, 2005)

*Still confused*

Thanks for the thread Spence.   As I read through it I still am confused as to what it would take to buy a resale  and get the points transfered.  I attended a presentation at the Ridge at Sedona, and liked what I heard and saw, but not the price.   I will continue to read the other thread and see what happens.  

One point the sales rep. used as a selling point was the rental opportunity at the 100+ resorts.  Has anyone have more info on how that works?   If you can exchange within Sunterra and then rent the week?


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## fnewman (Dec 29, 2005)

Quite likely the source of your confusion lies in the fact that they were explaining the newer Sunterra Trust membership.  I'll admit to being less-than-expert in that offerring right now.  It sounds like what you want to do is to buy a resale week and become a Club Sunterra member.  As far as I know you can still do that; however, generally, you have to buy a deeded week then pay a fee to have the equivalent SunOptions value in the Club.  (Club membership does not transfer upon purchase of a resale).  Last time I heard that fee was $2995.  While some say that sounds like a lot, if you do a good job of shopping for your resale week, then add the Club transfer fee, it will still be a lot better than what you would have to pay at the resort.

Don't necessarily look for the cheapest resale week.  What will ultimately be the most important will be the number of SunOPtions the week is worth vs the annual maintenance fee cost.

As for renting - that is a really strong Sunterra feature.  Ask Spence - he is the king of Sunterra rentals!


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## goodzik (Dec 29, 2005)

*Sunterra points and membership confusion*

Can anyone set me straight about Sunterra timeshare, points and membership.  I am in the process of closing on a red float at HHI Island Links Resort.  It carries 8000 points in Sunterra.  Do I have to have a membership in Club Sunterra or does one come with the purchase of my red float at HHI?  If I need a membership, how much?  I have seen different costs and am confused.

bohdan


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## Spence (Dec 29, 2005)

*It is confusing!*

If you email me I can send you a .pdf copy of _SunGlances_ "At a Glance Membership Information Guide" tht will reinforce what you saw at your presentation.  Pg 16 includes "What can I do with my SunOptions?" and one of the items is "Rent your time (independently/non-commercial)."  Renting is not easy and the smaller the scale the greater percentage you have to invest in effectively advertising.  You can reserve high times at popular places and hope you get it rented or you can wait for the request and hope that there is spce still available for you to book, it's not as easy as the salesman would suggest.

Whether you want to use or rent your SunOptions... when you go to buy, as Frank said, you need to look at the long term cost which is the maintenance fees.  When you go to buy a traditional week, that week comes with maintenance fees that are the same whether it is a mid winter week in off season that nobody wants or a holiday week that everyone would want.  For example: MFs at Powhatan are $779 for a 4BR lockout, millions of 'em are available on eBay all the time.  A mid winter week is worth 6000 SunOptions if converted to Club Sunterra while a week 26/27/47/51/52 holiday week is worth 15,000.  Same MF.  The mid winter week comes up to .13/pt while the holiday week comes up to .05/pt of annual fees.  You can't rent your weeks out for too much more than .15/pt.  Therefore to clear any reasonable fee you need to have the lower MF/pt ratio.

Converting the fixed week is also confusing.  If you go to Sunterra sales center where you would most probably be directed they will try to sell you ~2000 moe SunOptions for $7000 to convert.  They will do it for a flat fee of $2995 but you've got to push the right person.  Sunterra Corporate will also do it for the flat fee of $2995 but again, you've got to talk to the right person or they'll try to refer you to your local sales center.  There has been some reported success in taking their $7000 deal and RESCINDING the next day, then you might get offered the bottom line price of $1295 to save the deal.  $1295 is the price that was generally available several years ago without having to do the dance.

OK, well that was converting a fixed week deed that you may have bought.  Sunterra doesn't sell fixed week deeds anymore.  They sell into a Trust called Club Sunterra Vacation Trust (CSV).  We are starting to see more and more of these on the resale market both on eBay and from the Holiday Group.  You do not get a deed, you become a member of the Trust that holds the deeds in a group of what is now 19 properties.  My understanding is that when you buy these resale, you have access to those 19 properties but not the ~100 total properties of Club Sunterra without paying a $2995 to get the FULL Club Sunterra.  Anyone with personal experience here, please chime in as I have never bought a Trust property.

Trust properties come with various MF/pt, I'm not sure why, I've seen .08-.12.  One of the 'selling' points of the Trust is that they supposedly have lower MFs/pt and insulate you from major assessments since you get taxed on a homogenized mix of the 19 resorts.  When I recently went to an "owners update" and they realized that I owned all holiday deeded weeks, they knew they could not 'sell' me on converting to their Trust.

BLUKE, as a data point, what was the retail offer you received?


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## Spence (Dec 29, 2005)

goodzik said:
			
		

> Can anyone set me straight about Sunterra timeshare, points and membership.  I am in the process of closing on a red float at HHI Island Links Resort.  It carries 8000 points in Sunterra.  Do I have to have a membership in Club Sunterra or does one come with the purchase of my red float at HHI?  If I need a membership, how much?  I have seen different costs and am confused.
> bohdan


Chances are your 8000 points do not transfer and all you are buying is a Floating week at Island Links.  See my lengthy post.


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## Bill4728 (Dec 29, 2005)

Spence & Frank,

Thanks, those were some of the best explantions of Sunterra that I've seen.  I'm still not sold but at least I'm interested now.


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## goodzik (Dec 29, 2005)

I have seen many membership fees talked about.
$2995 and $7000 I would guess are lifetime fees.
I have also seen $149 annual for Club Sunterra.
It looks like if you buy your timeshare on say ebay, you can join Club Sunterra if the unit is qualified.  How do you know for sure it is qualified?  When I called HHI Island Links Resort, they said that Sunterra has some units reserved there.
Does Sunterra buy up single units at multiple resorts and or build whole complexes and then sell them off.  I guess these they build they sell for the $20000 to $30000 and throw in the lifetime membership.
Just still trying to soak in the Club Sunterra knowledge before the bucks fly out of the wallot.

bohdan


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## Spence (Dec 29, 2005)

goodzik said:
			
		

> I have seen many membership fees talked about.
> $2995 and $7000 I would guess are lifetime fees.


Yes, these are the fee to initially join Club Sunterra when you have a property that isn't in the Club (these fees are 'waived' when you pay retail).



			
				goodzik said:
			
		

> I have also seen $149 annual for Club Sunterra.


Yes, $149 is an annual fee, it used to be less.



			
				goodzik said:
			
		

> It looks like if you buy your timeshare on say ebay, you can join Club Sunterra if the unit is qualified.  How do you know for sure it is qualified?  When I called HHI Island Links Resort, they said that Sunterra has some units reserved there.


The heritage of HHI Island Links Resort is that it used to be EPIC Vacation Club that went bankrupt and the assets were bought out by Sunterra.  So any unsold inventory now belongs to Sunterra AND anyone/everyone they've switched from EPIC to Club Sunterra has their 'weeks' in the Club Sunterra inventory.  I'm not knowledgeable on what the conversion was for all those EPIC owners.



			
				goodzik said:
			
		

> Does Sunterra buy up single units at multiple resorts and or build whole complexes and then sell them off.  I guess these they build they sell for the $20000 to $30000 and throw in the lifetime membership.
> Just still trying to soak in the Club Sunterra knowledge before the bucks fly out of the wallot.  bohdan


Sunterra has very few resorts that are purpose built by Sunterra originally, Sunterra was once Signature Resorts and went on a buying spree 6-8 years ago that cost them dearly and put them into Ch11.  They do not buy up individual units per se, they affiliate resorts buying unsold inventory that is then sold into the Club and also try to convince current owners to convert.  They also build additional units at Resorts they have taken over management of, and that is sold into the Club.


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## bluke (Dec 29, 2005)

*Cost info*

The cost to join and receive 10,000 points was only $29,995 and receive some other benefits.  MF's were just under $1,000.  This was at the Summit at Sedona.  We just got back this evening.  Nice place but not worth what they want.  We went just to see about Sunterra (and receive the free gift).
After we said no a couple of times they gave us alot of different offers, but nothing as good as Spence quoted.


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## sb1070 (Dec 29, 2005)

Bluke

The information I received from Sunterra Management and Legal in Vegas as well as a rude but informative rep in Vegas.

The Trust is resalable.  19 resorts all count as your home resort plus the ability to join II.  If you buy a trust resale you automatically receive a club "TRUST" membership which has dues of 149 yearly plus maintenance fees.

If you want access to the all Sunterra resorts you could buy a fixed week and pay the upgrade fee if you can get Sunterra to offer it to you.  Buy a fixed week and then buy 3500 points for like $7000 Sunterra then waives the fee to join club and bring your fixed week into that membership for what ever it's worth in points.

Since Sunterra are the experts at sleezy sales tatics and half truths it would be difficult to get a straight answer from anyone.  I happen to know a regional director for the Mid Atlantic who put me in touch with their legal dept in Vegas and I got lucky once with a rep in Vegas who gave me some truthful answers.

I hope this helps to clarify things for you.  If it was me I would buy a TRUST membership, join II and trade that way.  It's certainly the cheapest way to go and with 19 resorts plus II you would have decent options on destinations.

Scott


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## bluke (Dec 29, 2005)

Thanks for your advice and info, Scott.  I am going to do some looking and reading before I do anything.


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## Spence (Jan 17, 2006)

goodzik said:
			
		

> I am in the process of closing on a red float at HHI Island Links Resort.  It carries 8000 points in Sunterra.  Do I have to have a membership in Club Sunterra or does one come with the purchase of my red float at HHI?  If I need a membership, how much?  I have seen different costs and am confused.  bohdan



have you made any progress, what is the status of your purchase and Sunterra relationship?  Are you a member of the Trust of 19 resorts??


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## Spence (Jan 17, 2006)

bluke said:
			
		

> I am going to do some looking and reading before I do anything.



Blaine, how goes it??


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## bluke (Jan 17, 2006)

*still looking*

I'm comparing different point systems, and resale values of these systems.  I am looking at Fairfield, Sunterra, and Worldmark.  They each have advantages.  I am also looking at resale markets and simplicity to get into each system.  Also costs, etc.


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## leejaime97 (Jan 23, 2006)

Hey guys...we are at Greensprints Plantation this week...we are are owners of a week #7 4GB @ Greensprings...

We had the Sunterra Trust (CSV) sales pitch yesterday...here was the offer

-trust of 20 home resorts
-$6715 for 2000 points (seems to be the minimum that can be offered)
-free conversion of current Greensprings timeshare
-8,000 points for current Greensprings timeshare
-Club Sunterra fees are paid
-II fees are paid
-II bonus week (1BR) 2 year window (just have to pay exchange fee)
-for one time fee of $130 we can have an extra 2,000 points for the first year
-MF of $400 ($250 discount for first year)
-possible to book and then rent weeks

So the overall picture is:
10,000 points (2,000 bought/8,000 converted) = $6,715
Maintenance Fees = $400


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## Spence (Jan 23, 2006)

leejaime97 said:
			
		

> Hey guys...we are at Greensprints Plantation this week...we are are owners of a week #7 4GB @ Greensprings...by the way we bought this timehsare on ebay a few months ago for $499...
> 
> We had the Sunterra Trust (CSV) sales pitch yesterday...here was the offer
> 
> ...




*or you could demand conversion for the flat fee of $2995, the will do it according to Jules Ricklass, the VP for Sales...

or you could buy today for $6715 and rescind tomorrow, getting them to just do a straight conversion of your Wk7 to the Club for $1295 to 'save the deal'*


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## Spence (Jan 23, 2006)

leejaime97 said:
			
		

> -possible to book and then rent weeks


*
possible, but not probable, you try doing it on such a small scale without incurring significant advertising cost.  If you try to do it for $10 on TUG, be prepared to rent for not much more than MFs*

I've spoken to the rental people at Powhatan/Greensprings and the success rates for owners renting their weeks or weeks reserved with points is not stellar.  I know this from personal experience.


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## Spence (Jan 23, 2006)

leejaime97 said:
			
		

> -Club Sunterra fees are paid
> -II fees are paid


for how long?
II fees are always included in the Club Fees and it's only a 'corporate' membership, you can't deposit other timeshares.


			
				leejaime97 said:
			
		

> -MF of $400 ($250 discount for first year)
> Maintenance Fees = $400


I'm guessing you're saying that the ongoing MF is $650 for 10,000 points in the out years??


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## leejaime97 (Jan 23, 2006)

Spence said:
			
		

> *or you could demand conversion for the flat fee of $2995, the will do it according to Jules Ricklass, the VP for Sales...
> 
> or you could buy today for $6715 and rescind tomorrow, getting them to just do a straight conversion of your Wk7 to the Club for $1295 to 'save the deal'*



Awesome...that is exactly what we were looking for...by the way, we have never rescinded before...do we talk to the sales person we were with or do we contact a corporate office?




			
				Spence said:
			
		

> *possible, but not probable*



You are exactly right...we found 3 ebayers who appear to be doing the "renting thing"...with not much success...1) wholesaleresorts 2) justgottago 3) poandho...a far cry from the $2,000-3,000 sales the sales people would like you to believe...

Fees seem to be paid indefinitely...

MF are $400 a year...the first year is $150...


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## Spence (Jan 23, 2006)

leejaime97 said:
			
		

> Awesome...that is exactly what we were looking for...by the way, we have never rescinded before...do we talk to the sales person we were with or do we contact a corporate office?


You need to go back to the sales office with a written letter and a copy that you can get their signature on.  I would talk to a supervisor or 'Mario' if he is available.  I call this 'doing the dance,'  good luck.




			
				leejaime97 said:
			
		

> Fees seem to be paid indefinitely...
> MF are $400 a year...the first year is $150...


I think you are mistaken on what the annual fees are.  I think in the outyears it's more like $650 MF + $149 Club dues.  There is no way it's $400 because if you trade in your SunOptions for money (called FeeOptions) they give you $585/10,000 SunOptions.  Realistically, I've never seen a quote for MF on 10,000 SunOptions less than ~$800.  

I was in for an 'Owner's Update' recently and they knew they couldn't convince me to get into their Trust and they said as much because I pay $779/15,000 SunOptions for my Powhatan HOLIDAY weeks or 5.195cents/SunOption and that was much lower than they were quoting for the Trust.  As I said I think there's something fishy in your numbers.


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## EileenSRN (Jan 23, 2006)

"MF $400 a year"
Hummmmmm....
When I was contracting for 11,000 points in the trust, the MF they quoted me was $750 something. That was in July '05. When I look on ebay at Greensprings 4 bedroom units they're showing over $1000 for '06.
And, when we recinded we lost the extra points on the straight conversion. Bottom line: we pay MF to Resort and have the alloted point value deposited in our Club Sunterra account. Also pay $149 per year for as long as we want to remain in the Club. If we don't pay Club dues, we revert back to a fixed week eligible for deposit in the Resorts affiliated Exchange Company.
Eileen


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## leejaime97 (Jan 23, 2006)

$400 maintenance fee is what is on the "Agreement"...no mistaking what it says...maybe it increases later?

My maintenance fees for 2006 (Greensprings 4BR) are $712...


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## EileenSRN (Jan 24, 2006)

They used the Trust MF as another selling point for converting. Supposedly, once you're in the Trust, the MF of all the resorts are combined to get an amount per point and you pay according to how many points you have. It may be more or less than what the fixed week owners pay. And since thay always push for you to buy more points over what your resort unit is assigned, you've got to be paying "more", not "less". When the final numbers were shown, I was paying a little more for 11,000 points than I would as a fixed week owner with a unit worth 6000 points. Powhatan is said to have "high" MF- and going higher. I didn't see much change this year, nor was there another special assessment.
Eileen


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## Spence (Jan 24, 2006)

EileenSRN said:
			
		

> Powhatan is said to have "high" MF- and going higher. I didn't see much change this year, nor was there another special assessment.
> Eileen



I disagree that Powhatan has 'High' MFs, $779.25 for a 4BR lockoff which is two complete 1230sqft 2BRs is par in my opinion, of course it seems like a lot if you were used to the depressed fees of ~$450 they were charging a couple years back.  Also seems like a lot if you're in Club Sunterra and your unit is only allotted 6000 SunOptions instead of 15,000; that's probably what you're talking about.


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## EileenSRN (Jan 24, 2006)

Spence,
I agree with you! That's why I put the "high" in quotes. That's what the salespeople were saying to convince me that actually paying a little more in the trust for 11K Points would be cheaper in the long run than paying the MF to Powhatan as a fixed week owner. Guess I didn't make myself clear. I think my Powhatan is the cheapest MF I pay on 2 bedroom units. And I've decided to keep my eyes open for one of those 15,000 point units to crop up on ebay. I could afford to practically give away the week 8 - or use it after we retire. It's often nice in Virginia the end of Feb.
Eileen


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## Spence (Jan 24, 2006)

EileenSRN said:
			
		

> I've decided to keep my eyes open for one of those 15,000 point units to crop up on ebay. I could afford to practically give away the week 8 - or use it after we retire. It's often nice in Virginia the end of Feb.  Eileen


A Powhatan Wk26 and Wk27 4BR recently went on eBay for ~$3800 and $5100.  the $3800 was an exceptional deal for 15,000 unit and the $5100 was a good deal.


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## EileenSRN (Jan 24, 2006)

I haven't gotten the new SunOptions book yet. I forgot about week 26 being 15,000.


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## Spence (Jan 24, 2006)

*26/27/47/51/52*



			
				EileenSRN said:
			
		

> I haven't gotten the new SunOptions book yet. I forgot about week 26 being 15,000.



47 may be the cheapest week to find and 52 gives you the bonus of Wk53 in that one year out of ~seven that makes that week average to almost 18,000!

New SunOptions Directory should be out sometime in February, not holding my breath.  Also asked Club if they could put it online like the _SunGlances _ book.


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## pedro47 (Jan 24, 2006)

Spence, the new Sun Options Directory and the SunGlances Directory should have the same numbers?  Correct.


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## Spence (Jan 24, 2006)

pedro47 said:
			
		

> Spence, the new Sun Options Directory and the SunGlances Directory should have the same numbers?  Correct.


_SunGlances_ is a general 'How To' guide and contains no SunOptions numbers.

It is available to download for anyone, not just members.  You gotta be a member to find the link on the Sunterra site but if you click on this
https://secure.sunterra.com/US/pdf/SunGlances_Guide.pdf
it'll get you a slowwwww download of the .pdf file.


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## T_R_Oglodyte (Jan 24, 2006)

Spence said:
			
		

> _SunGlances_ is a general 'How To' guide and contains no SunOptions numbers.
> 
> It is available to download for anyone, not just members.  You gotta be a member to find the link on the Sunterra site but if you click on this
> https://secure.sunterra.com/US/pdf/SunGlances_Guide.pdf
> it'll get you a slowwwww download of the .pdf file.


Is there an online link to a SunOptions directory?


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## Spence (Jan 24, 2006)

T_R_Oglodyte said:
			
		

> Is there an online link to a SunOptions directory?


No, .....Post #30


			
				Spence said:
			
		

> New SunOptions Directory should be out sometime in February, not holding my breath.  *Also asked Club if they could put it online like the SunGlances  book.*


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## Cyndy (Mar 18, 2006)

Spence said:
			
		

> Please read here http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7606
> then ask any question for clarification



I'm trying to learn as much as I can about Sunterra and tried the above link but it does not work.  Can someone help me find this thread?  Thanks!


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## ouaifer (Mar 18, 2006)

Cyndy said:
			
		

> I'm trying to learn as much as I can about Sunterra and tried the above link but it does not work.  Can someone help me find this thread?  Thanks!




Cyndy,
The Boards are periodically purged of _older_  Threads and Postings to allow more space for current and future posts.  Everything was pruned about 2 weeks ago, and the link in question was probably in the information.  I'm sure Spence would be happy to _chime_  in and respond to your request.


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## Spence (Mar 18, 2006)

Cyndy,
The Boards are periodically purged of older Threads and Postings to allow more space for current and future posts. Everything was pruned about 2 weeks ago, and the link in question was probably in the information.  My memory is not photographic, that was an extensive thread that had lots of answers and information.  What are your questions?  You might also check out this BBS Forum


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