[ 2008 ] RCI is a SCAM!!

thecypher · Sep 2, 2008

After several hopeful years and convincing myself I am probably wrong, I am now convinced more than ever before that RCI is a big SCAM!! What a freakin waste of money buying all those points which are utterly worthless. Please tell me I am wrong because clearly what seems to be going on is as soon as anybody deposits their timeshare week with RCI, they do not make it available to members for exchange or purchasing using points. They only put out absolute junk inventory for exchange and purchase using points. They make money selling the good weeks as Extra vacations. This must be illegal. How can they screw members like this?

Just check it out. Go do a search for vacations for 2009 summer for example. Just pick any place lets say SC Outerbanks. You will not get a single availability. Meanwhile tons of units are available at the same location for the same time for $900 a pop under Extra Vacations. So essentially all those points you have in your account are worth less than toilet paper. I am sorry. I am really angry and frustrated. I think a class action law suit is in order. As a paying member I expect to get access to every damn unit they have in their inventory on a first come first served basis. But that is not what is happening. I have tons of points which are utterly useless at this point. All I can buy is garbage that RCI can't sell. Freakin crooks!!!

If they let you buy the good weeks using your points all they make is the exchange fees. But if they sell it they make at least 5 times more. They have you by your balls anyway and you are not going anywhere. You pay your annual membership and you have useless points in your account that cost them nothing instead they make more money when you want to carry them over because you didn't want to buy garbage. And if you did buy garbage they made money off of selling garbage to you in terms of exchange fees. I think I am done with this timeshare business. Total scam!! You are better of putting money away and buying the weeks as you need

"Roger" · Sep 2, 2008

thecypher said:
....Just check it out. Go do a search for vacations for 2009 summer for example. Just pick any place lets say SC Outerbanks. You will not get a single availability.... I have tons of points which are utterly useless at this point....

I won't speak for the Weeks side of the picture (I find it totally frustrating myself), but I did "check it out" on the Points side.

Currently, the furthest that you can reserve into the future with Points is July 2. So, I gave June 27 a shot (the closest Saturday to July 2.) I wasn't sure whether you meant SC or the Outerbanks (usually referring to NC), but it didn't matter. Two pages of resorts came up for Myrtle Beach and Hilton Head when I tried for South Carolina - many of which were Gold Crown.

As far as I know, there are three Points resorts for the Outbanks in North Carolina. All three were available.

Kozman · Sep 2, 2008

RCI Class Action Law Suit

We feel your pain on the weeks side too! However, there is already a class action lawsuit in process against RCI for renting out inventory instead of making them available to members. Members joined RCI for the specific purpose of having an exchange pool to trade from and not to give away their week for RCI so they can make windfall profit on. You'd think they would be laying low during litigation, but they seem to be flaunting it instead.

http://www.rciclassaction.com/

thecypher · Sep 2, 2008

Yeah meant to say NC. Try going into "Weeks Reservation" (using your points) and do a search for Outer banks with start date of June 27th 2009 for a span of 10 weeks. I get ONE hit "Sea Scape Beach & Golf Villas" for just 1 week in a hotel unit starting 7/19/09. Now go into Extra Vacations and try a search for a week in the Outer banks for summer 2009. And you will see what I am talking about. Between June thru Aug 2009 there are about 30+ available units all going for $900 and above.

thecypher · Sep 2, 2008

Now I am having this really evil thought me being a paranoid person. Do you think everybody on the RCI site sees the same stuff when they do a search? Or is there a secret class based treatment that we are not aware of? Based on where you own your home resort etc.? I know we keep hearing points are points but I still wonder. Well we all know now our points are useless anyway. RCI is ripping us all off by taking our own stuff and selling it back to us sheep for 6 times the prices we should be paying for it.

timeos2 · Sep 2, 2008

Weeks doesn't require deposits - points does.

Kozman said:
We feel your pain on the weeks side too! However, there is already a class action lawsuit in process against RCI for renting out inventory instead of making them available to members. Members joined RCI for the specific purpose of having an exchange pool to trade from and not to give away their week for RCI so they can make windfall profit on. You'd think they would be laying low during litigation, but they seem to be flaunting it instead.

http://www.rciclassaction.com/

As you can see by the dates on that website the class action has basically died. No updates and no action - it never had a chance.

As for Points being worthless as someone already posted it's too soon for summer 2009 in points. In weeks there are very few available but week for week trades is a dying model and has had little for years - no surprise there. The best weeks don't get deposited as they are too valuable as rentals or for owner use. Once the points resorts are available (they have to be deposited by the points agreement) the selection should be much better. Look in a few weeks.

sfwilshire · Sep 2, 2008

It may be pretty early on the Weeks side also. Many owners deposit their weeks at the end of the year when they pay their maintenance fees.

Early deposits may already be gone.

I would be the first to say that RCI is far from perfect, but I find many great weeks there. Keep reading here and you'll learn more about maximizing your membership.

Sheila

rickandcindy23 · Sep 2, 2008

Did you look at Standard Reservations? About 9-10 months (maximum you can search is 10), you should see availability there for various areas. If you cannot see much, it's probably a lack of inventory in points for that area.

I don't agree that RCI is a scam. I have found wonderful exchanges through weeks, and I think the points system is just a matter of learning the tricks.

skimble · Sep 3, 2008

I've had great luck with RCI Points over the past few years.
I have encountered one recent problem though. They are not confirming weeks through email quickly, and confirmed weeks aren't showing up in your account right away. I reserved three 2010 weeks for summer in CA last month. They took about 3 weeks to show up in my account.
I was searching another week, and ran across the week I had already booked in the system. Knowing how rare this week is, I called RCI immediately. The VC claimed that I DID in fact have a reservation in my account for this week. I asked why there was another showing. He said he didn't know--- that maybe it's another deposit. I told him it's too rare of a deposit for this to happen. He assured me that my summer week was booked an in my account.
A week later, I called RCI again to ask why I'm not seeing it. They know nothing about it... there's no summer CA coastal week in my account, and according to this VC, there never has been. It disappeared. Now, I'm waiting for my credit card statement to dispute this (and then, they'll likely only give me my $ back and claim they don't know why I was overcharged.)

So, the essence of the problem is the lack of timely confirmation notices via email, snail mail, or registering on your account. I never thought it would be a problem until I got one removed. I have the confirmation # written somewhere, but all they have to say is, "we don't see that in our system" and what recourse will I have?

caribbean · Sep 3, 2008

I have to say I have had good success using my points account. Below find a list of my trades made. Most have been using points to book into weeks resorts. A couple weeks to weeks trades and a several points reservations. Except for the fees that continue to rise, I don't have any problems because I am getting to go where I want and staying in pretty nice places. I am in Sarasota Fl right now, staying in Little Gull which is super.

2293 Eagles Trace at Massanutten - 1BR Massanutten VA 8/31/2002
2481 Fairfield Williamsburg at Kingsgate - 2BR Williamsburg VA 10/11/2002
2091 Port de Plaisance Resort & Casino - Studio ST Martin 01/12/03
4905 Mauna Loa Village by the Sea - 2BR Hawaii 4/26/2003
3681 PAHIO Kauai Beach Villas - 2 BR Hawaii 5/3/2003
6494 WorldMark at Kihei -2BR Hawaii 5/10/2003
0301 Sarasota Sands - 1 BR Sarasota FL 6/21/2003
0301 Sarasota Sands - Studio Sarasota FL 6/21/2003
6055 The Alexandra Resort & Spa - 1BR 2 weeks Turks & Caicos 11/22/2003
3686 Bougainvillea Beach Resort - 1 BR 2 weeks Barbados 6/5/2004
6390 Residences at The Crane - Hotel Barbados 6/12/2004
5930 Morritt's Grand Resort - 2 BR 2 weeks Grand Cayman 11/6/2004
1715 The Four Sails - 2BR New Years Eve Dance VA Beach 12/26/2004
4856 Palm Beach Shores - 1BR Palm Beach FL 4/23/2005
0650 Suntide Island Beach Club - 2BR Sarasota FL 4/30/2005
3865 Umbrella Beach - 2BR Sarasota FL 9/10/2005
3025 WindJammer Landing - 1BR/pool 18 days ST Lucia 10/8/2005
1715 4 Sails - 2BR New Years Eve Dance VA Beach 12/31/2005
7543 Fairfield Atlantic City - 1BR New Jersey 1/12/2006
5930 Morritt's Grand Resort - 2 BR 2 weeks Grand Cayman 4/22/2006
6390 Residences at The Crane - 1BR/pool Barbados 4/22/2006
5356 DIVI ST Croix - 1BR ST Croix 4/29/2006
0259 Las Olas Beach Club - 2BR Satellite Beach FL 9/19/2006
1858 Sunterra Flamingo Beach - 1 BR ST Martin 10/7/2006
3984 Sunterra Royal Palm Beach - 2BR ST Martin 10/13/2006
4856 Palm Beach Shores - 1BR Palm Beach FL 3/10/2007
6390 Residences at The Crane - 2BR penthouse/pool Barbados 6/2/2007
6390 Residences at The Crane - 1BR/pool Barbados 6/9/2007
5044 Jamaican on the Gulf - 1BR ST Pete FL 9/22/2007
2150 Southwind II - 3BR HH Island SC 10/13/2007
2886 Sandyport Beach - 2 weeks in 1BR Bahamas 5/3/2008
0865 Little Gull - 2BR Sarasota FL 8/30/2008
2666 Playa Naco Resort - 1BR 2 weeks Dominican Republic 11/1/2008
2083 Four Winds of Longboat Key - 1BR Sarasota FL 4/25/2009
5249 Carambola Beach Resort - 1BR 2 weeks ST Croix 6/13/2009
0865 Little Gull - 1BR Sarasota FL 11/14/2009
0914 Half Moon Club - 1BR Jamaica 11/21/2009

rickandcindy23 · Sep 3, 2008

Patty, that is a very impressive list.

caribbean · Sep 3, 2008

Cindy-

Thanks. Just thought that saying you made good trades is one thing, but showing the list speaks for itself as fact. And there are only 2 on that list that I would not go back to. It does take effort to search early and often to make it work, but it most certainly can be done.

Mel · Sep 3, 2008

In looking at the RCI Weeks deposits, you have to consider 2 factors:

First, when searching with points, you are not going to see deposits from the RCI Points resorts - it's my understanding you can reserve them, but you have to call to do so.

Second, you need to consider the habits of RCI Weeks members. Part of the whole idea of RCI Points was to make all the weeks available at the same tame, and to encourage certain habits. The problem many people have with RCI Weeks is the need to understand everybody else's habits, and to learn the "system." Under points, RCI controls when "deposits" are made, for the most part. Though you do also have to consider that owners of other weeks from those resorts you want get a crack at those deposits before you do, so the RCI Points resorts still might not become available to you.

For the RCI Weeks resorts, deposit habits vary. Some owners will deposit every year in January, once their fees are paid. Since those weeks are not in RCI's inventory yet, you can't see them.

A very small number of resorts allow owners to deposit before the fees are paid. At those resorts, you will see many deposited either 1 year at (to maximize trade power), or once the owners decide they won't be using the week themselves. That timing varies, but again it is a small percentage of owners.

Some owners will pay their fees early, and deposit before January. Most of these do so when they have plans for those weeks - they are ready to make a request against them. For the owners of the prime weeks (what you're looking for), they are often also placing a request for another prime week. Since they are ALL doing the same thing, those prime deposits are fulfilling exchange requests from those who have ongoing searches, and you won't see them in the spacebank.

Finally, you have to consider the floating-week resorts. They all have their own reservation periods, and deposits can't be made before those dates. I don't know the ownership types at most of the resorts on the Outer Banks, but if any are Floating weeks, you aren't likely to see them yet either.

As with any high-demand area, particularly since most of the resorts there are still on the Weeks side, your best chance of getting an exchange in an ongoing search. Mark your place in line, and wait your turn. It's kind of like going to Disney World - if you go at peak times, you have to stand in line. The line isn't likely to ever get much shorter, so you just have to wait your turn. If you go at off-peak times, there are sometimes lines, and sometimes not.

theo · Sep 3, 2008

Say what?

timeos2 said:
As you can see by the dates on that website the class action has basically died. No updates and no action - it never had a chance.

Not accurate. The web site failing to be updated means absolutely nothing.
Settlement negotiations have already been conducted in Federal Court in Newark, NJ on this matter.

I don't have a dog in that fight and I don't trade with RCI, so I don't much care how the case turns out, personally. Nonetheless, it's simply a misrepresentation of the facts to just say that the case "has basically died". It may well be nearing an end, but Murillo vs. RCI is certainly alive and well and taking up time and space in Federal Court in Newark, NJ.

Kozman · Sep 3, 2008

theo said:
Not accurate. The web site failing to be updated means absolutely nothing.
Settlement negotiations have already been conducted in Federal Court in Newark, NJ on this matter.

I don't have a dog in that fight and I don't trade with RCI, so I don't much care how the case turns out, personally. Nonetheless, it's simply a misrepresentation of the facts to just say that the case "has basically died". It may well be nearing an end, but Murillo vs. RCI is certainly alive and well and taking up time and space in Federal Court in Newark, NJ.

I have personally been a principal in a class action lawsuit against a major company in CA and I can vouch for the fact that litigation takes forever. It's not over until it's over.

thetimeshareguy · Sep 13, 2008

Kozman said:
I have personally been a principal in a class action lawsuit against a major company in CA and I can vouch for the fact that litigation takes forever. It's not over until it's over.

Agreed Kozman. I would add that however long it takes, this is a worthwhile case if, in fact, it is moving forward. Having this in front of a judge may resolve once and for all whether RCI has been treating its members fairly. There's been a lot of rumor and you'd expect RCI would like to see an outcome to put an end to it (unless, of course, it has something to hide).

Please, anyone in a position to track the case, report back to these boards from time to time.

Carolinian · Sep 14, 2008

Lawsuits take time. The discovery process on something like this will, by itself, take many months. Its not over until the fat lady sings.

timeos2 said:
As you can see by the dates on that website the class action has basically died. No updates and no action - it never had a chance.

As for Points being worthless as someone already posted it's too soon for summer 2009 in points. In weeks there are very few available but week for week trades is a dying model and has had little for years - no surprise there. The best weeks don't get deposited as they are too valuable as rentals or for owner use. Once the points resorts are available (they have to be deposited by the points agreement) the selection should be much better. Look in a few weeks.

Carolinian · Sep 14, 2008

While Hatteras High's off-season weeks float, none of the high season weeks at OBX resorts do.

What is happening here is supply and demand. Many summer owners on the OBX own to use and do not deposit for exchange. In going through the records of one resort, I found that while 30% of owners deposited for exchange from December through May, only 10% of summer owners did and 20% of Fall fishing season owners. Managers at two other resorts told me that their patterns were similar. It was several years since I did that analysis, and with all the rental controversy at RCI since, I suspect those numbers may have declined further.

Another factor on the supply side on the OBX is that the demise of Bodie Island Beach Club and at least temporary closure of Sea Ranch II means less timeshare availible. It is unlikely that any more oceanfront timeshare will be built there.

Mel said:
In looking at the RCI Weeks deposits, you have to consider 2 factors:

First, when searching with points, you are not going to see deposits from the RCI Points resorts - it's my understanding you can reserve them, but you have to call to do so.

Second, you need to consider the habits of RCI Weeks members. Part of the whole idea of RCI Points was to make all the weeks available at the same tame, and to encourage certain habits. The problem many people have with RCI Weeks is the need to understand everybody else's habits, and to learn the "system." Under points, RCI controls when "deposits" are made, for the most part. Though you do also have to consider that owners of other weeks from those resorts you want get a crack at those deposits before you do, so the RCI Points resorts still might not become available to you.

For the RCI Weeks resorts, deposit habits vary. Some owners will deposit every year in January, once their fees are paid. Since those weeks are not in RCI's inventory yet, you can't see them.

A very small number of resorts allow owners to deposit before the fees are paid. At those resorts, you will see many deposited either 1 year at (to maximize trade power), or once the owners decide they won't be using the week themselves. That timing varies, but again it is a small percentage of owners.

Some owners will pay their fees early, and deposit before January. Most of these do so when they have plans for those weeks - they are ready to make a request against them. For the owners of the prime weeks (what you're looking for), they are often also placing a request for another prime week. Since they are ALL doing the same thing, those prime deposits are fulfilling exchange requests from those who have ongoing searches, and you won't see them in the spacebank.

Finally, you have to consider the floating-week resorts. They all have their own reservation periods, and deposits can't be made before those dates. I don't know the ownership types at most of the resorts on the Outer Banks, but if any are Floating weeks, you aren't likely to see them yet either.

As with any high-demand area, particularly since most of the resorts there are still on the Weeks side, your best chance of getting an exchange in an ongoing search. Mark your place in line, and wait your turn. It's kind of like going to Disney World - if you go at peak times, you have to stand in line. The line isn't likely to ever get much shorter, so you just have to wait your turn. If you go at off-peak times, there are sometimes lines, and sometimes not.

crazyhorse · Sep 21, 2008

Yes there certainly are a lot of nice extra vacations available for rent up to next August (2009). We cannot know exactly where these weeks came from but it is a pity in some ways that both Rental and Timeshare Exchange systems are being marketed by the same company, using the same properties. It now seems inevitable, that if there is some dissatisfaction with the Exchange Systems that questions will be raised about the whole business (viz the Class Action and numerous bulletin comments).
While it is clear that there would be some benefit for Property developers (Timeshare Companies) already using RCI for their Owners week`s exchange, to use RCI for renting out their surplus weeks, I have not heard of any, so far who have confirmed this.

Any Timeshare Companies out there who would like to write in to this board to verify this??????

crazyhorse · Sep 22, 2008

update

:shrug:

I should perhaps have made it clear that I am a weeks owner, but my opinion on the RCI extra vacation system applies for both types of owner.

I have not had much of a grudge over the years with my exchanges with RCI, and in fact have had many enjoyable exchanges, but this year I have seen some unusual results. I am an owner in a red week 3 bedroomed property, silver crown with quite a respectable rating (could almost be a gold crown). I have had an ongoing search since early June for a week`s exchange in Europe. I have also checked regulary on the site to see if anything was available that was a little different but which I would accept. I have had very little luck so far, and in fact have finally accepted a 1 bed property which neither has an RCI rating. but does have good reviews.

The reason I did this was partly out of frustration. There were oddly, no weeks of any grade available in the UK nor in Portugal at all for September. I also did a search for an exchange right through from early May to early October-same thing. On looking at the RCI Extra Vacations, I was not too pleased to see that for August alone, there were 21 properies of all grades available for the UK, and a number for Portugal. Note that many are in the school holidays for the UK.

Now what is a bit of a mystery to me is why these (some gold crown) are available for rent in August next year. Can RCI justify that these weeks, so far in the future, are surplus ones that exchangees do not want? (Give me half the chance!).

Can RCI prove that these are unpurchased weeks from the developers? I ask if it is likely that the developers would release these unsold properties for next August, when there is always the chance that the developers could sell them before then?

As I said before, it would be nice if we could get some corroboration from the developers on these issues.

Tia · Sep 22, 2008

Will a developer be willing to prove the source of the rentals? NO Why?... They don't have to.

Our resort developer has even tried to claim they haven't sold a certain % to maintain a vote in a certain HOA, but they refused to provide any stats from what I recall reading on an owner yahoo group. The only solution was a legal one.

Carolinian · Sep 22, 2008

When you see weeks for rent at sold out resorts, you know they did not come from the developer, and there have been quite a few reports of those!

crazyhorse · Sep 23, 2008

I have noticed that there is a similar bulletin live at the moment on the site see
unfair rci vacations
I have been watching the boards for a few years off and on and I remember some of the input from the RCI employee, but I didn`t see the outcome regarding the rental/exchange matter. Thanks Carolinian for your update.
As I referred earlier, I have not had much of a problem with RCI exchanges until this year. Any search I have done for exchanges over the past 20 years (if my memory is correct!) has always produced some properties for the UK. Now zilch!!. Yet there are plenty in Extra Rentals. My own weeks have in fact improved in their status over the years, so I guess people`s suspicions are well founded.
Pity really because at one time RCI (in another guise!!) was the respectable name in Timeshare, and seemed a buttress against the dark side!
If the alleged mis-use of our deposited weeks has indeed increased this year despite the class action, it suggests that either

1. the class action has died-this is not confirmed!!
2. the class action is still alive but RCI don`t care.
3. the parent company is heading for trouble financially (in the current financial climate for leisure/travel/real estate) and they need as much money as they can get!

If RCI was a bank, is it safe to deposit with them? :wall:

ladycody · Sep 23, 2008

I dont use RCI alot...and am a fairly new RCI member...but I do browse alot and could be satisfied with what was available to me. Then again, I'm easy to please and dont often go to the hot spots.

Many of the posts that I've read from people who have belonged to RCI for years indicate that they have slowly seen availability get more limited and/or harder to get, while rentals get more prolific.

It is interesting to me that it was within a year or so after Cendant's purchase of RCI, that the company embarked on it's mission to develop the "industry's most effective global condominium-rental distribution channel." Seems like whenever Cendant gets involved with something new, their stock does well but the end user gets shafted? Lord knows I havent been thrilled with their impact on my timeshare.

theo · Sep 23, 2008

Alive and well --- neither dead nor dying...

crazyhorse;5984631. Re: >> the class action has died-this is not confirmed!![/QUOTE said:
===========================================

In (and presumably outside of) Federal court in Newark, NJ, settlement discussions have been taking place in Murillo vs. RCI since mid July, 2008. The next hearing date is reportedly scheduled for October 01, 2008.

I don't profess to know (or care to guess) the ultimate outcome, but it seems clear that this case is proceeding to resolution, one way or another.

With RCI having attained ownership interests in "outside" rental entities (specifically, SnapTravel and Leisure Link, both acquisitions having been conducted after the lawsuit was initially filed back in April, 2006), one has to wonder whether RCI maybe has a strategy already in place for virtually any outcome of the lawsuit against them. I certainly don't claim to know and, since I try to avoid RCI like a communicable disease anyhow, I have no stake in that outcome. Still, I follow with great interest the "devolution" of what was (once upon a time, anyhow) the premier exchange company. Things certainly change with the passage of time...

[ 2008 ] RCI is a SCAM!!

thecypher

"Roger"

TUG Review Crew

Kozman

thecypher

thecypher

timeos2

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sfwilshire

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rickandcindy23

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skimble

caribbean

rickandcindy23

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caribbean

Mel

theo

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Kozman

thetimeshareguy

Carolinian

Carolinian

crazyhorse

crazyhorse

Tia

Carolinian

crazyhorse

ladycody

theo

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