HHV - No rooms at all? [2008 thread revisited]

So now that we're getting a bunch of new points, DW and I are starting to think about how to use them. Hawaii, says the Chief of Staff (copyright Alan Cole, used without permission).

The last time we used HGVC points for Hawaii was about 5 years ago at the Bay Club. Been there, done that. I don't recall having any problems booking it, though.

So I decided to look at HHV, since we haven't been to Oahu for at least 20 years. Nothing. Nada. I admit that I didn't scroll through ALL 9 months on their web page, but looked at times I thought likely I might get something, including all the way out 9 months (next March). Nada.

Is that normal? I've mostly used my HGVC points at LV, Orlando, and for RCI trades. Never had a problem. What's the secret to getting HHV?

Also, did a quick check on airfares. SFO-HNL is $750 pp rt and up. Wow. Kinda puts a damper on the thought of a quick getaway. In the past, we've done Hawaii a week at a time. But at those air fares I think I'd only want to do it for 2 weeks or more. Hmmm, if we could get some time at HHV, perhaps we could also get an RCI trade to Kauai, our favorite island.

Blues, there was a big thread about this a couple months back. I tried to find it but didn't have any luck, maybe someone else can find the link.

The gist of the thread was similar to your question..."Why is there no availability at HHV? This has been an issue for awhile now...and it sucks!

HHV - No availability

I remember from that thread that the consensus seemed to be that with the new sales of the Hawaiian properties, without them being built yet, the points that those owners are getting are being used at the current properties. Hopefully when the new units are open, the availability issue will come back to normal whereby at the 9 month mark, you would be able to see complete availabilty of units for booking.

I also looked yesterday at March of 2009 and saw no availability. It was disappointing. Does anyone know when these new properties - Waikikian and Kings Land(big island) will be open?

WORLD TRAVELER said:

I also looked yesterday at March of 2009 and saw no availability. It was disappointing. Does anyone know when these new properties - Waikikian and Kings Land(big island) will be open?

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According to an older thread, Kingsland started taking reservations for a Jan 2009 opening.

We booked our January trip to Oahu right at the 9 month mark. I could not get a 2 bedroom ocean view and had to settle for a 1 bedroom ocean view unit. The year before when I was looking and thinking about our plans, getting whatever unit I wanted didn't seem to be an issue at the 9 month mark. This year it's been a big issue getting anything at all.

I've been following the availabilty off and on since booking. Mostly hoping that a 2 bedroom ocean view or ocean front might pop up but seeing nothing at all. For giggles I've occasionally looked at the 9 month mark and usually see limited availability. For whatever reason, Hawaii has become a tough exchange within the HGVC system.

Perhaps it's the new properties being sold with new owners given the ability to book HHV 12 months out until their own properties take reservations. I think it could be they've built so many Orlando and Vegas units and sold them by telling people you can easily trade into Hawaii using the less expensive properties. I know that when we've attended the "owners updates," I always hear one or two salesmen introducing new owners and saying, "They going to Hawaii!" after they've purchased. If you building units in Vegas and Orlando and keep telling people it's "easy" to get into Hawaii, eventually something will have to give. Perhaps they've finally reached critical mass and there isn't enough Hawaiian units to go around for all those Vegas and Orlando owners.

I feel now that we're fortunate. Hawaii is someplace we've wanted to go and we have a room with what should be a reasonably decent view. I didn't buy our Vegas unit with the idea of trading into Hawaii. We bought it to use. Those that have purchased Orlando or Vegas with the express purpose of trading into Hawaii on a regular basis are the ones who may have need for concern. I fear that the Hawaii exchange may finally have been oversold.

HHV and borrowing points

Hi everyone,
Okay so now I'm worried after reading about the "shortage" of rooms at the HHV. I agree that the online reservation system is bad. I called HGVC today to check availability for April 2009 and was told there is space. How much space, I have no idea. I can't reserve a week until July 9th for April 4 - 11th so I'm crossing my fingers.

But I do have a couple of questions for anyone that knows. In addition to the condo for a week in April, I am trying to reserve another condo for the same week using borrowed club points from 2010. I am told I can't borrow until Jan 1st, 2009. How realistic do you think my chances are of reserving another condo for the same week?

Thanks in advance.

Susan

sparkysparky said:

In addition to the condo for a week in April, I am trying to reserve another condo for the same week using borrowed club points from 2010. I am told I can't borrow until Jan 1st, 2009. How realistic do you think my chances are of reserving another condo for the same week?

Thanks in advance.

Susan

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Boy that doesn't sound right. What good does it do to borrow your 2010 pts so you can use them for a 2009 reservation if they will not let you borrow them till 2009?

sparkysparky said:

... I am told I can't borrow until Jan 1st, 2009...

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Poppycock. I know of no such calendar year restriction.

In late 2007, I borrowed 80 of my "2009" points for a Cancun reservation for this year (from which I recently returned).

More recently, I attempted to make an RCI reservation for 2009 with some of my 2010 points, which the CSR was ready "borrow" for me, 'cept my destination was not available.

Talent312 said:

Poppycock. I know of no such calendar year restriction.

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I agree -- I have already made a 2009 reservation at Mabrisba and used 2010 borrowed points for it.

Kurt

Boy, if what you wrote is really true, I'm getting on the horn with HGVC first thing tomorrow. Thanks! I'll let you know what happens.

Unfortunately, it's true....

...I can't borrow my 2010 points until Jan. 1, 2009 ONLY because I am origianally a Bay Club owner, not an HGVC property owner. Pfft. I think the same rules should apply to either, don't you agree?

Sorry to hear that, Sparky.

It appears that owners at affiliates are treated differently. I own in Scotland, and whenever I try to use next years points for next year's reservations (e.g., using 2009 points now for a 2009 reservation), I always have to escalate it to a supervisor. It always works (eventually), but I always get a comment like, "Well, if you guarantee me that you're going to pay the 2009 fees on time and convert to HGVC points, we can make an exception."

Consequently, I don't use the standard HGVC mantra of "borrow, borrow, borrow". Too much hassle. I pay $69 every year to push my points out. Right now, my 2008 points are pushed to 2009.

This is one of my motivations to buy a resale at Flamingo. I've never known if my experience was due to owning an affiliate, or due to the fact that the affiliate was out of the country, and actually part of HIGVC rather than HGVC. But it appears that owners at affiliates really aren't treated the same as Hilton owned properties.

sparkysparky said:

...I can't borrow my 2010 points until Jan. 1, 2009 ONLY because I am origianally a Bay Club owner, not an HGVC property owner. Pfft. I think the same rules should apply to either, don't you agree?

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Well, that's a total bummer! Sorry to hear about that, but thanks for sharing -- it is good to know.

Kurt

Thats really too bad- I feel this is unfair for affiliate owners- They are HGVC members-
Anyway, I think many tUG visitors get the idea that they have to buy the cheapest HGVC resale possible-and head for the affiliates- Scotland, bay Club etc- - only to find out about the restrictions later.
I myself almost bought at Bay Club as it was so much cheaper than HGVC at Waik resort- until a good friend inormed me that a Bay Club owner had to pay to use the pool at Hilton waikoloa Village- and also mentioned HGVC may drop them- (probably a rumor) I ended up buying in HGVC Waik- (big difference)
Anyway - I was at HWV yesterday and spoke with an employee. She said that every day she deals with frustrated, irate Bay club owners who go to HWV to use the pools and lagoon only to be told they have to pay. She felt they should be informed of this when they buy Bay Club especially since it is Hilton managed.
For someone with children who would love the slides and waterfalls- this can be a real issue.

I think it would really help if tUG could post some of these HGVC affiliate restrictions- like the borrowing of points (Is this because HGVC may not manage the resort the next year?) up in the red zone-for general information

Frankly, it was news to me that out HGVC affiliate-bretheren are treated like 2d-class citizens when it comes to using their points. I had assumed that y'all got the same play-book that we HGVC-owners got. Its a shame, but I guess Hilton don't trust you to stick around.

Not being allowed to borrow points? thats what makes HGVC flexible. If HGVC markets their affiliates to us- they should at least give them the same benefits.

WORLD TRAVELER said:

I remember from that thread that the consensus seemed to be that with the new sales of the Hawaiian properties, without them being built yet, the points that those owners are getting are being used at the current properties. Hopefully when the new units are open, the availability issue will come back to normal whereby at the 9 month mark, you would be able to see complete availabilty of units for booking.

I also looked yesterday at March of 2009 and saw no availability. It was disappointing. Does anyone know when these new properties - Waikikian and Kings Land(big island) will be open?

Click to expand...

I too am concerned about HHV availability and suspect it has to do with inventory in the new Grand Waikikian being sold but not yet available. Nothing has been available for months. The property is in theory going to be completed late this year. I would suspect if nothing else that this is going to provide a lot of HHV inventory when it becomes available. Looks like 2008 and 2009 reservations are going to be tough until that inventory actually appears.

Here is the previous thread on this topic:

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68581

Ill be spendinng the 4th here at HGVC waik- My good friend and his family, who travelled with us for this 15 day vacation(they owns at Flamingo) were unable to fuse their points to find anything more than 3 days in this resort and needed to settle for Bay Club-

What do you think Glintz-
Is the HGVC world changing? It used to be buy resale- as cheap as you can get it - anywhere- and you will have no prob getting any reservation in the 9 month window .
But now with the difficulty in making reservations in HHV and HWR
Would prospective buyers who want to vac in Hawaii be better advised to buy resale or preconstruction in Hawaii itself?

IMO, it's always best to own where you want to vacation the most. We own in Las Vegas because we enjoy the LV Strip resort. Being able to get into Hawaii has always been a side benefit to us. If a person really wants to vacation in Hawaii then I feel they would be best served by owning in Hawaii. Things can always change in the future makeing what was possible yesterday difficult to do today. I think HGVC owners are seeing this with the limited availability in Hawaii right now. It could be different in another 6 to 12 months.

dougp26364 said:

IMO, it's always best to own where you want to vacation the most. We own in Las Vegas because we enjoy the LV Strip resort. Being able to get into Hawaii has always been a side benefit to us. If a person really wants to vacation in Hawaii then I feel they would be best served by owning in Hawaii. Things can always change in the future makeing what was possible yesterday difficult to do today. I think HGVC owners are seeing this with the limited availability in Hawaii right now. It could be different in another 6 to 12 months.

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I think it may be coming to this Doug- I wondeer if it has to do with the blackstone group purchasing HGVC

benjaminb13 said:

I think it may be coming to this Doug- I wondeer if it has to do with the blackstone group purchasing HGVC

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That's been a thought in the back of my mind. I'm sure some things are going to change. Some I'll probably like, others maybe not.

benjaminb13 said:

What do you think Glintz-
Is the HGVC world changing? It used to be buy resale- as cheap as you can get it - anywhere- and you will have no prob getting any reservation in the 9 month window .
But now with the difficulty in making reservations in HHV and HWR
Would prospective buyers who want to vac in Hawaii be better advised to buy resale or preconstruction in Hawaii itself?

Click to expand...

I really don't know. I hope it is just a temporary shortage due to the new HHV location being under construction. I knew when I bought in that things could change and I would not be surprised if the new ownership changes things for the worse.

GTLINZ said:

I too am concerned about HHV availability and suspect it has to do with inventory in the new Grand Waikikian being sold but not yet available. Nothing has been available for months. The property is in theory going to be completed late this year. I would suspect if nothing else that this is going to provide a lot of HHV inventory when it becomes available. Looks like 2008 and 2009 reservations are going to be tough until that inventory actually appears.

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I am positive that time (points) can not be given where it does not exist. Ie... if the Waikikian does not open until 2009, new owners would not receive any 2008 points.

Are Waikikian owners borrowing their 2009 points? If this is the case, more Waikikian availability for the rest of us!

OnMedic said:

I am positive that time (points) can not be given where it does not exist. Ie... if the Waikikian does not open until 2009, new owners would not receive any 2008 points.

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This is not correct. Owners of Grand Waikikian and Kingsland could get points in 2008 with the payment of a use fee roughly equal to the projected MF. This would have no effect on the 2009 points. Therefore, a situation is created where there are a lot of owners with points, but no home property to trade into.

nonutrix