Do not buy from this seller: pennyrcipoints!

So back in July, I had made an inquiry on ebay regarding a listing for Summer Bay Vegas.. I used the "Buy it now" button as the listing was for $1 and we were interested in purchasing additional RCI points.. at auction end, we asked the seller for the estoppel letter and a copy of the deed to show exactly what we were purchasing.. the seller said he would send it over.. but nothing ever came... so I just let it go and we never paid and I forgot about it..

So this week.. we get a welcome letter from Orange Lake Desert Club!!!! I checked Clark County web-site and sure enough.. we have a deed recorded in our name!! We never authorized this transfer!! I called ebay and they said on their end it was an invalid transaction since no money was ever changed hands... how the heck do they just record the deed in our name??!!

I called Orange Lake and nobody there can even tell me what we own or what is going on?? They said they just purchased the property and nobody has any information in their system regarding the resort yet.. They said to call Summer Bay for the unit information but Summer Bay tells me to call Orange Lake... :annoyed: :annoyed: Orange Lake is contacting their attorneys right now to see what my options are but in the mean time suggested I look around their system to see if we would be at all interested in the ownership..

I am shocked as to how easy it is to get a random deed recorded in your name?? I have contacted the seller without response.. I have gotten ebay to send me his address and phone number... I am waiting for Orange Lake to get back to me.. is there anything else I should be doing? They just say that I own a week there but no one can tell me what I own!! :annoyed:

I mean no disrespect but to me it seems that you must have done a bit more than hit a buy it now button, not get any response to your inquiries and next thing you know, you have a deed registered in your name. Presumably if there's a deed in your name - presumably the name is correct - and you got a letter - presumably at an address you provided, those details were given to the seller somewhere along the way.

Did you specifically tell the seller you wanted to back out?

I'm not saying that you can't out of it, or that it should have progressed this far but with these basic giveaways and seller paying fees, certainly emphasizes the need for clear communication. I mean, personally, if I sold a timeshare on Ebay for a dollar, I honestly wouldn't expect the dollar. I realize there's legalities involved but to me, I'm giving the thing away and I can't list on Ebay for zero.

Hopefully you can work with the seller and the resort to get it sorted out.

Scubakat, it would appear that they just rammed it through and quite possably forged your name? were they offering free closing and transfer fees? usualy even if it's a $1 there is a few hundred dollars in closing and transfer fees. it was most likely a Post card Co. and already made their profit on the seller, and just wanted off it before the MF come due Jan1.
PM me and I can help you figure out what you bought. I own at the desert Club. ]Orange lake just took over Managementof the resort so there may be a bit of confusion on a situation like this.
if this turns out to not be something you want, I would think you would be able to get out of this if you didn't actually sign anything. do you have a copy of the new deed? it may have the closing company info on it? also there had to be a transfer of ownership sent to the resort with $75-100 fee? that trransfer form should have some info on it as well. RT

I asked eBay the same question as I never provided my information or signed anything. The whole email string is still in my eBay account where it ended with the seller saying that he would send me deed information prior to the transfer..

Orange Lake called me with the prior owner's name and the person who submitted the deed.. They are researching this with their deeding department and attornies and said they will get back to me.. Asked me not to worry about it yet.. I asked about any signatures needed in their transfer paperwork etc and they said non was needed!! When we purchased our Marriott we were asked to send a copy of our driver licenses!

Thanks RT! I'll send you a PM regarding unit info but at this point we are so not interested and just shocked that this would ever happen!

I also feel really stupid as we have researched for months on the timeshares we own before buying them... And now I have no clue how this happened.. I saw the deed was in my name in the Clark County web-site.. I think I should order the actual deed? Apparatenly it was recorded in August and I didn't get the welcome letter until this week. I didn't even know what it was until I called Orange Lake to find out.... Can't I just have the deed recorded back to the original owner on there? I am trying to be patient for Orange Lake to get back to me and not freak out yet.. But it is hard!!

Why did you hit Buy it Now instead of contacting the seller in another way to ask questions? Though real estate sales aren't binding on eBay, you certainly indicated you wanted the resort.

Because we did want to buy it.. When we asked about the listing prior to hitting the buy it now.. The seller indicated it was 73k RCI points for around $650 annual MF.. It was after that when I asked for the estoppel and deed info prior to transfer.. That is where the communication stopped after he promised to send prior to transfer...

Patri said:

Why did you hit Buy it Now instead of contacting the seller in another way to ask questions? Though real estate sales aren't binding on eBay, you certainly indicated you wanted the resort.

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Ahhh, makes sense. Would seller have personal info from that correspondence to put on deed? Sneaky.

Who was the seller? That is the most important piece of info. Which seller is deeding properties which are not as advertised? If this is one of the big companies, I will be shocked. It could be Affordable Luxury (AKA Jon Comas). I would like to know if it is him.

Good question...

rickandcindy23 said:

Who was the seller? That is the most important piece of info.

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Assuming that the OP version of events is factually accurate, knowing the seller's identity could potentially help a whole lot of other people in the future, since "forewarned is forearmed"...

If it's 73K points in RCI it's likely one of the larger two bedroom units.

Aside from the obvious, you may have just got a tremendous deal once it all gets sorted out.

The seller is "pennyrcipoints".. They have a high percentage feedback on eBay... But when I just looked though their actual feedback closer... The buyers all have accounts less than a month old with hundreds of positives for listings for penny sales? I feel like an idiot...

Come to think of it.. We may have provided our contact info at listing closing.. We had bought our weeks from CJ timeshare and eMidsouth.. We would supply our info at listing closing when they asked and I would ask for the estoppel and deed info..they would then send those over with the contract before we would pay for the week... We would have followed the same process and I have the emails of the seller stating that he would send the former deed prior to transfer... When it didn't come I didn't follow up as I thought it was no deal..

When I talked to orange lake after the great info RT provided me.. It seems to be a 1 bedroom in season 1.. They have no idea if it is even enrolled in RCI points... We have a 2 year old and do not gamble... No plans on vacationing in Vegas...

I just recieved this from the seller... Are you kidding me??!!

"Contrary to your assertion, ebay does not condone bidding without the intention of buying. especially when the "buy it now" is used.

You own the timeshare and also owe the $499.00 deed preparation, etc. fee."

ScubaKat said:

I just recieved this from the seller... Are you kidding me??!!

"Contrary to your assertion, ebay does not condone bidding without the intention of buying. especially when the "buy it now" is used.

You own the timeshare and also owe the $499.00 deed preparation, etc. fee."

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But timeshare purchase on ebay are also non-binding. If the estoppel does not check out, something doesn't match, etc..

BevL said:

I mean no disrespect but to me it seems that you must have done a bit more than hit a buy it now button, not get any response to your inquiries and next thing you know, you have a deed registered in your name. Presumably if there's a deed in your name - presumably the name is correct - and you got a letter - presumably at an address you provided, those details were given to the seller somewhere along the way....

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It's quite possible to hit "Buy It Now," do nothing else, and get a deed in your name. Once you've purchased something on eBay, eBay will provide your name and address to the seller. And, that may be all that is needed to get the unit recorded in your name.

I recently gave away a timeshare here on TUG's Bargain Board. The "buyer" gave me his name and address, and that's all I needed to put the deed in his name. I then called the resort and told them that he was the new owner, and they accepted that. At no point did anyone ask for anything signed by the new owner, which shocked me.

ScubaKat, I think it would be worth spending $200 or so on a letter drafted by a lawyer, sent to both the closing company and the resort, saying that you never agreed to take on this property, you will not be responsible for any of the fees associated with it, and you want it out of your name ASAP. It may also be possible to complain to the recorder of deed--it couldn't hurt to send them a certified letter saying your did not agree to ownership of this property. (I wouldn't use a lawyer for that--the government won't respond well to threats.)

Unlike some of the posters here, I feel you did nothing wrong. Yes, you agreed to buy something on eBay, but it sounds like you received something totally different. This is the seller's fault, not yours. Even if you had followed up, gotten the estoppel, etc., the seller STILL could have deeded a completely different resort to you. I don't think it's fair that you have to go through this hassle (and pay for a lawyer letter), but that's what I'd do in your shoes.

Turnabout is fair play. Get the deed registered in their name and send it, via Registered Mail, along with a letter outlining the situation. CC the Attorney General in their state.

ScubaKat said:

I just recieved this from the seller... Are you kidding me??!!

"Contrary to your assertion, ebay does not condone bidding without the intention of buying. especially when the "buy it now" is used.

You own the timeshare and also owe the $499.00 deed preparation, etc. fee."

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How can they say that when the resort they deeded to you doesn't match the description???

I'd get that lawyer letter out to the seller and the resort, and complain to eBay and the recorder of deeds as well.

Do you have an email to the seller saying specifically, "I must see the deed and estoppel before I commit to this deal."

Or do you have an email saying, "Please send me the deed and estoppel," and when you didn't get it, you didn't follow up and assumed the deal was dead?

And who is the $499 payable to, the seller or the resort? If the seller, I'm totally in your corner. He should have clarified and presumably collected the money before he put the deed through. If the resort, well, again, it will be added to your account with the management company, I assume.

And is the resort saying, "No, it's not in RCI points," or, "We don't know at this time." Sounds like things are pretty confused.

Again, don't get me wrong. I hope you can sort this out. It may turn out that it's easier to work with the seller to get it out of your name.

JudyS said:

Unlike some of the posters here, I feel you did nothing wrong. Yes, you agreed to buy something on eBay, but it sounds like you received something totally different. This is the seller's fault, not yours. Even if you had followed up, gotten the estoppel, etc., the seller STILL could have deeded a completely different resort to you. I don't think it's fair that you have to go through this hassle (and pay for a lawyer letter), but that's what I'd do in your shoes.

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They did get deeded exactly what they clicked the Buy It Now button for, the resort was just sold to a new owner and got a name change.

I think you need to decide if you want it. If you don't, get an attorney to get yourself out of it.

I know of another Tugger that this happened to. They actually told the seller that they were not going to buy and didn't pay anything. The seller still transferred the deed, and then the Tugger asked me if I wanted it and deeded it to me.

My email to him was "Please send a copy of the estoppel report and deed information for unit verification prior to transfer".. His response.. "As this is a free and clear deeded timeshare the estoppel is not included in the transfer cost. I wil ask that a copy of the deed be sent over". That never came...

We do not want it.. I just talked to eBay and they also suggest getting legal counsel.. The seller is not listing them under the real estate category.. She told me to go on his listing and report all of them so the appropriate people will look into it but eBay buyer protection doesn't include real estate purchases.

We will be contacting a lawyer.. I need to get more information as well since all eBay provided me was the sellers name and phone.. The resort has the info on the transfer papers hopefully and I will request a copy of the deed.

Thanks for all your suggestions and advice!! I feel like an idiot but hopefully this would prevent others from going through the same ordeal.

SkubaKat, one bedrooms at the Desert Club are in the 30,000 +/- point range
do you have anything in print that states the deal was for 73,000 annual RCI points?
if so contact the seller and call their bluff! tell them to prove the 73K annual RCI points account exists and is attatched to the LVDC Unit you purchased and You'll pay the $499 imediatly! that would be a GREAT trade with low MF's. if they can't provide what they promised to sell you, then tell them to unwind the deal Imediatly or you will take further Legal action.
Dont feel bad, this could have happened to any one of us!
there is something shakey on the sellers end here. no seller would continue forward with the closing/ transfer of the deed, paying the fee to the Clark County Register of Deeds, and paying the $125 transfer fee to the resort. without first collecting the $499 from the Buyer! the fact that they now say you still owe them the $499 is proof that you are a "non performing buyer" being high bidder or hitting the Buy it now button isn't truely a Binding contract on any ebay auction. I've had people bid on items and never pay me. Ebay has no authority to make them pay it's an assumed agreement to pay. no money... no deal. RT

I had a deed recorded into my name without my knowledge once, and it happened to be in Osceola County. It was maddening.

This seller is scum. No one will buy from this guy, and I hope you change the title of the thread to "Do not buy from this seller: ____"

What horrible ads this guy has currently on eBay. Lack of information and bad information! How does he come about all of these RCI Points packages, anyway? It's suspect for sure.

http://www.deeds.com/recording/information.html?id=1317040408RA621888

http://www.leg.state.nv.us/nrs/NRS-247.html