2012 MF's

jimf41 · Oct 20, 2011

This is from Dave M's 2011 post

I have modified the title of this thread to ask those who post to include:

Operating fee
Replacement fee
Property taxes
Total fee

Please also include any other items included in (or subtracted in arriving at) the total, such as the developer subsidy for Frenchman's Cove, Willow Ridge, Village d’Ile-de-France, Crystal Shores and Lakeshore Reserve.

I have updated the database of fees through 2010. I will post it in the FAQs for this forum by the end of this year and will include those 2011 fees that are available by that time.

Frenchmans Cove 2012 Platinum 2bdrm.

Operating fee...........$1308.24-------$51.00 increase
Developer Subsidy......-164.38---------24.38 decrease
Reserve......................229.62---------21.47 increase
Total........................1373.48--------96.96 increase

Est Prop tax.................232.50
Total W/ tax.............$1605.98

About a 7.5% increase

Numismatist · Oct 20, 2011

You sure, I just got that same number for my Gold week. :shrug:

m61376 · Oct 20, 2011

Numismatist said:
You sure, I just got that same number for my Gold week.

MF's are the same regardless of the season. The only small difference is where property taxes are billed separately, since those may differ.

Numismatist · Oct 20, 2011

m61376 said:
MF's are the same regardless of the season. The only small difference is where property taxes are billed separately, since those may differ.

My bad, i was thinking 2 bedroom versus 3 bedroom but i was 'seeing' Platinum versus Gold :doh:

MOXJO7282 · Oct 21, 2011

Marriott Monarch 2bedroom/2bath

Another acceptable increase

Marriott Monarch 2bedroom/2bath

2011 Operating Fee 2011-01-11 702.58
2011 Reserve Fee 2011-01-11 263.14
2011 Property Tax Fee 2011-01-11 82.28
Total Charges $1048.00

Marriott Monarch 2bedroom/2bath

2012 Operating Fee 2012-01-11 723.67
2012 Reserve Fee 2012-01-11 276.28
2012 Property Tax Fee 2012-01-11 82.31
Total Charges $1082.26

3.17% increase

PotentialMarriottBuyer · Oct 23, 2011

MF - Tax not included in Operating Fee?

Hi All,

Sorry for the novice question, but I was hoping you could clarify the following calculation:

Frenchmans Cove 2012 Platinum 2bdrm.

Operating fee...........$1308.24-------$51.00 increase
Developer Subsidy......-164.38---------24.38 decrease
Reserve......................229.62---------21.47 increase
Total........................1373.48--------96.96 increase

Est Prop tax.................232.50
Total W/ tax.............$1605.98

I thought operating fee included property tax? Is that wrong? The current fees for 2011 that I see posted for Frenchman's Cove are about $1200. Are they really $1200+$200 for taxes? Thanks for the help!

jimf41 · Oct 23, 2011

PotentialMarriottBuyer said:
Hi All,

Sorry for the novice question, but I was hoping you could clarify the following calculation:

Frenchmans Cove 2012 Platinum 2bdrm.

Operating fee...........$1308.24-------$51.00 increase
Developer Subsidy......-164.38---------24.38 decrease
Reserve......................229.62---------21.47 increase
Total........................1373.48--------96.96 increase

Est Prop tax.................232.50
Total W/ tax.............$1605.98

I thought operating fee included property tax? Is that wrong? The current fees for 2011 that I see posted for Frenchman's Cove are about $1200. Are they really $1200+$200 for taxes? Thanks for the help!

The above operating fee is for 2012. It does not include property tax which varies by season. The USVI has had some issues with property tax and hasn't collected at Frenchmans Cove since the start. They worked out a deal where they would bill the tax for past years about every six months. When they catch up to the current year, 2014 if I remember correctly, MVCI intends to include the property tax with your MF bill.

Currently we are all being billed separately for property tax by the USVI.

dougp26364 · Oct 23, 2011

PotentialMarriottBuyer said:
Hi All,

Sorry for the novice question, but I was hoping you could clarify the following calculation:

Frenchmans Cove 2012 Platinum 2bdrm.

Operating fee...........$1308.24-------$51.00 increase
Developer Subsidy......-164.38---------24.38 decrease
Reserve......................229.62---------21.47 increase
Total........................1373.48--------96.96 increase

Est Prop tax.................232.50
Total W/ tax.............$1605.98

I thought operating fee included property tax? Is that wrong? The current fees for 2011 that I see posted for Frenchman's Cove are about $1200. Are they really $1200+$200 for taxes? Thanks for the help!

Property tax is often a line item rather than being included in the operating fee's for income tax purposes. If it's singled out, it might be used as a deduction on your income tax return. Consult your tax preparer to be certain.

qlaval · Oct 24, 2011

Marriott Aruba Ocean Club
1 bedroom
**Utilities 184.29
Surplus Return −25.30
Replacement Reserve 273.78
Operating Fee 637.15
------------------------------------------
2012 Total $1069.92

**Electricity and Water/Sewer line items

jpc763 · Oct 25, 2011

Here is my EOY Ko Olina resort.
2010 2011
$72.85 $66.00 -9.40% Property Tax
$80.58 $75.34 -6.50% Replacement Reserve
$664.41 $717.03 7.92% Operating Fee
$817.84 $858.37 4.96%

So the taxes went down, the reserve replacement went down, but the operating fee went up close to 8% that affected the total to almost 5%.

Given the state of the economy and hosing in general, I am suprised that they would increase the operating fee as much as they did.

Of course, we are not in a position to do anything about it. :wall:

MOXJO7282 · Oct 27, 2011

13.44 % increase on Aruba Surf MFs

This is a big jump after 2 years of going down. I don't have 2011 breakdown so don'y know where it shot up.

At $1373 this is still a great value considering what this still rents for but the days of $900 MFs and rentals of $4k+ plus are long gone.

2012 Reserve Fee $265.10
2012 Operating Fee $1108.76
Total Charges $1373.86

m61376 · Oct 27, 2011

MOXJO7282 said:
This is a big jump after 2 years of going down. I don't have 2011 breakdown so don'y know where it shot up.

At $1373 this is still a great value considering what this still rents for but the days of $900 MFs and rentals of $4k+ plus are long gone.

2012 Reserve Fee $265.10
2012 Operating Fee $1108.76
Total Charges $1373.86

ouch
Last year it was 1189.46, with the operating fee being 1053.63 and the reserve fee being 153.24 (with a reduction in fees of 17.41 last year). So the big jump is in the reserves.

3 BR at the SC: 1863.33, up from 1602. 38, a similar 14.1% jump, again largely from reserve fees (1409.55/217.55 with a reduction of 24.72 for 2011 versus 1486.95 operating expense and 376.38 reserve for 2012)

GregT · Oct 27, 2011

I understand that the BOD meeting at Maui Ocean Club that was held in October approved a 3.5% increase in the MFs. I do not know if that is to the total, or if that is just the operating component, with reserves/property taxes changing at a different scale.

Just an FYI -- I'm looking for confirmation online.

Thanks!

MOXJO7282 · Oct 27, 2011

GregT said:
I understand that the BOD meeting at Maui Ocean Club that was held in October approved a 3.5% increase in the MFs. I do not know if that is to the total, or if that is just the operating component, with reserves/property taxes changing at a different scale.

Just an FYI -- I'm looking for confirmation online.

Thanks!

Let's hope that is the full increase. I can live with that if that turns out to be it. That represents a $64.14 increase. Not great but not horrible.

sdtugger · Oct 27, 2011

GregT said:
I understand that the BOD meeting at Maui Ocean Club that was held in October approved a 3.5% increase in the MFs. I do not know if that is to the total, or if that is just the operating component, with reserves/property taxes changing at a different scale.

Just an FYI -- I'm looking for confirmation online.

Thanks!

Didn't Marriott win the property tax appeal? If that area went down, the rest could have gone up significantly? I'm not sure about that, but it will be interesting to see what happened in the details of the budget.

mcm21078 · Oct 27, 2011

MOXJO7282 said:
This is a big jump after 2 years of going down. I don't have 2011 breakdown so don'y know where it shot up.

At $1373 this is still a great value considering what this still rents for but the days of $900 MFs and rentals of $4k+ plus are long gone.

2012 Reserve Fee $265.10
2012 Operating Fee $1108.76
Total Charges $1373.86

is the $10 ARDA fee optional or do you have to pay it?

klpca · Oct 27, 2011

DSVII maintanance fees

Operating fee...........$667.54
Reserve...................$348.94
Total.....................$1,016.48
*property taxes are billed separately - see below.

Based upon past information, I believe that this represents a 6.9% increase over 2011. I am basing that number on the amount shown in the prior year budget of $950.72. This is our first year of ownership, so I am not sure if that was the exact amount billed last year.

Our property taxes were about $70 this year (based upon a $5.50 purchase price for future reference). The assessed value used by Riverside county was about $4,500 and the total bill included a separate timeshare fee of $25. (I'm fuzzy on those details because I received the Donatello property tax bill on the same day but I think those are the DSVII numbers).

MOXJO7282 · Oct 27, 2011

mcm21078 said:
is the $10 ARDA fee optional or do you have to pay it?

Optional for sure

pedro47 · Oct 27, 2011

mcm21078 said:
is the $10 ARDA fee optional or do you have to pay it?

The $10 ARDA is opitional and I beleive the average Marriott MF is about $1100 per year now.

DanCali · Oct 28, 2011

MOXJO7282 said:
This is a big jump after 2 years of going down. I don't have 2011 breakdown so don'y know where it shot up.

At $1373 this is still a great value considering what this still rents for but the days of $900 MFs and rentals of $4k+ plus are long gone.

2012 Reserve Fee $265.10
2012 Operating Fee $1108.76
Total Charges $1373.86

I wouldn't call it great value because there is an immediate impact on resale prices. Whatever value is left is reflected in the resale price.

Once the disparity between rental price and MFs goes away resale price is approximately zero... (or negative)

MOXJO7282 · Oct 28, 2011

DanCali said:
I wouldn't call it great value because there is an immediate impact on resale prices. Whatever value is left is reflected in the resale price.

Once the disparity between rental price and MFs goes away resale price is approximately zero... (or negative)

As I said its not what it used to be, but the "disparity" is still pretty large so that was my point. The Aruba Surf probably has one of the largest "disparities" in fact. What your suggesting won't happen for a long time if ever.

MOXJO7282 · Oct 28, 2011

Good news on MF increase from Maui Ocean Club

Maui Ocean Club - Original
Increase of 3.37% ($63.92)

2BDRM OV

2012 AOAO Operating Assessment 649.57
2012 Property Tax Fee 257.88
2012 Operating Fee 724.23
2012 AOAO Reserve Assessment 74.36
2012 Reserve Fee 190.40

Total Charges $1896.44

GregT · Oct 28, 2011

Maui Ocean Club -- 3BR Lahaina Villas

2012 AOAO Operating Assessment 2012-01-11....$873.33.....................(2011--- $897)
2012 AOAO Reserve Assessment 2012-01-11..........99.98.....................(New this year)
2012 Property Tax Fee 2012-01-11........................346.72....................(2011 -- $408)
2012 Operating Fee 2012-01-11............................973.72....................(2011 -- $944)
2012 Reserve Fee 2012-01-11...............................255.99....................(2011 -- $213)
Total Charges...................................................$2,549.74..................(2011 -- $2,463)

I'm happy with this, and curious to see what the detail OpEx changes were.

Thanks!

Greg

GaryDouglas · Oct 28, 2011

GregT said:
..., and curious to see what the detail OpEx changes were.

We won the two lawsuits with the State of Hawaii and the County of Maui, which affected our bottom line in the millions. If this hadn't happened, we would have seen increases like last year. I assume the board president will have details on this in his next annual newsletter.

mjm1 · Oct 29, 2011

Desert Spring Villas 1:

2012 2011 Change
------ ------- -------
Replacement Reserve 470.29 447.90 5%
Operating Fee 755.49 617.45 22%
-------- -------- -----
Totals 1,225.78 1,065.35 15%

We are new owners, so are surprised at the percentage increase in the operating fee. However, I am not sure what increases were like in prior years. Insights from other owners at DSV1 would be appreciated.

2012 MF's

jimf41

Numismatist

m61376

Tug Review Crew

Numismatist

MOXJO7282

Tug Review Crew

PotentialMarriottBuyer

jimf41

dougp26364

TUG Review Crew: Expert

qlaval

jpc763

MOXJO7282

Tug Review Crew

m61376

Tug Review Crew

GregT

TUG Member

MOXJO7282

Tug Review Crew

sdtugger

mcm21078

klpca

TUG Review Crew: Veteran

MOXJO7282

Tug Review Crew

pedro47

TUG Review Crew: Expert

DanCali

MOXJO7282

Tug Review Crew

MOXJO7282

Tug Review Crew

GregT

TUG Member

GaryDouglas

mjm1

TUG Review Crew: Expert