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NY Atty General gets hilton and wyndham to make changes to sales in NY

TUGBrian

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Ron98GT

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http://www.ag.ny.gov/press-release/...jor-hospitality-companies-protect-new-yorkers

not sure if these are "earth shattering" benefits for consumers as they are being made out to be, but at least its something.

what WOULD have been nice, is a boost in NY's rescission period, which is only 7 days.
Isn't 7 days pretty standard across the 50 states, with one big difference being 7 "days" (Nevada unfortunately) vs 7 "business days" (this should be the min. if not greater)?
 

TUGBrian

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florida is 10...and even id prefer that to be longer.
 

1Kflyerguy

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What state is used for contract law? Is the TS location or where the buyers state of residence?
 

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The laws of the state where the timeshare is located determine the requirements for a valid transfer of the TS. If the sale is made is made in another state, the sales practices and contracts are subject to the regulations in that state, as well.

The buyer's state of residence have nothing to do with it.

I wish those agreements with NY's AG had also read:
1. Timeshare salesmen must state in writing how long the session will last, and if it lasts more than the time stated, the participants will be compensated at the rate of $10 per minute in excess of that time, as determined by their watch.

2. Timeshare salesmen may not make more than two offers to sell to any one person or couple. A 3rd offer shall entitle the person or couple to compensation at the rate of $10 per minute after the 2nd offer, as determined by their watch.
 
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LannyPC

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"Hilton agreed to stop using a clause in its timeshare purchase agreement that disclaimed responsibility for specific representations made by salespeople..."

" The law also makes it illegal to make representations in the sales process that are contradictory to the disclosures contained in the offering plan or prospectus."

So, IOW, it will be illegal for sales people to lie and our sales people will stop lying. I thought it was already illegal (somewhat) to lie. There just isn't really enforcement against lying. Salespeople's basic defence, should it come to that, is "How can it be proved that I/we did lie?"
 

theo

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Isn't 7 days pretty standard across the 50 states...

No, unfortunately it is not. There are a handful of states where the rescission period is actually only 3 days :eek: --- although in Florida and Tennessee it's 10 days.
In Alaska it's 15 days, but are there even any timeshares in Alaska? :shrug:

In the majority of states, the rescission period provided under applicable state law is 5 to 7 days.
 
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theo

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What state is used for contract law? Is the TS location or where the buyers state of residence?

State in which the contract is executed determines applicable rescission period. The state (...or country, for that matter) of the buyer's residency is irrelevant.

A developer selling timeshares which are located in a state other than the state in which the actual sale / contract is executed may offer the more liberal rescission period between the two states involved, if those two states involved differ in their respective rescission time periods. I have personally seen this rare phenomenon at least once (...although I can't recall the specific developer or "chain"), but that practice is surely the exception rather than the rule. Developers are not generally known (or inclined) to voluntarily or willingly put buyer interests before their own. :rolleyes:
 
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jimf41

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The laws of the state where the timeshare is located determines the minimum requirements for a valid transfer in that state. Thus, it's rescission period controls. However, if the sale is made is made in another state, the sales operation in that state must also comply with the licensing and standards of conduct established by that state.

The buyer's state of residence have nothing to do with it.

I don't think that applies in all cases. When we first bought in Ocean Pointe at the sales office in the resort we couldn't close on the unit and didn't have to pay for it for over a year. That's because NY wouldn't allow MVC to close on a unit under construction. Buyers from Florida and some other states had to close and pay up in the normal time period.

For some reason when we bought at Frenchman's Cove, again at the Ocean Pointe sales office, we closed within a couple of months but the resort wasn't open for use for almost 18 months.

In both cases we were NY residents.
 

Larry M

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A better interpretation

"Hilton agreed to stop using a clause in its timeshare purchase agreement that disclaimed responsibility for specific representations made by salespeople..."

" The law also makes it illegal to make representations in the sales process that are contradictory to the disclosures contained in the offering plan or prospectus."

So, IOW, it will be illegal for sales people to lie and our sales people will stop lying. I thought it was already illegal (somewhat) to lie. There just isn't really enforcement against lying. Salespeople's basic defence, should it come to that, is "How can it be proved that I/we did lie?"

No. The agreement says nothing about whether the sales people may lie or not. It merely states that if you complain about some sales promise being unmet, that Hilton may no longer point to the agreement and respond to you by saying "Your purchase agreement states that we're not bound by verbal sales promises." They can still say they're not bound by sales promises--they simply cannot reference the purchase agreement verbiage."

Remember, these agreements were negotiated between a couple of lawyers. NY state is happy because they look tough to the public. Hilton is happy because they don't really have to change the way they do business. Guess who's unhappy? Right, you, the betrayed purchaser.

Well, you asked me, didn't you?

Larry
 

Talent312

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No. The agreement says nothing about whether the sales people may lie or not. It merely states that if you complain about some sales promise being unmet, that Hilton may no longer point to the agreement and respond to you by saying "Your purchase agreement states that we're not bound by verbal sales promises."

That is becuz taking that clause out of the contract doesn't change basic contract law. Now they can simply say: "Sorry. A written contract supersedes any oral promises made prior to or contemporaneous with its execution. If it's not in writing, it don't count."
-- Parol evidence rule.
 
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LannyPC

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No. The agreement says nothing about whether the sales people may lie or not. It merely states that if you complain about some sales promise being unmet, that Hilton may no longer point to the agreement and respond to you by saying "Your purchase agreement states that we're not bound by verbal sales promises." They can still say they're not bound by sales promises--they simply cannot reference the purchase agreement verbiage.

I know the agreement says nothing directly about lying. That's why I put "In other words (IOW)". Many buyers who feel duped by the lies, half-truths, exaggerated "facts", and skewed numbers can complain about it but they have no proof that the sales person(s) did indeed verbally lie. Whether lying is legal or not, the sales people's defence usually is "Prove that we did lie." It's basically one person's (buyer) word against another's (salesperson).

One of my biggest peeves in TS developer sales (and I'm sure many would agree with me) is that there is no incentive for a salesperson not to lie. There's no accountability. Even if the buyer can prove that the salesperson lied, the best he has is his legal right of rescission which he has anyhow regardless of whether the salesperson lied or was honest. And what penalty or punishment will a salesperson face if it's proved that he did lie? Getting fired?! If so, I'm sure he will just find another resort to work at. Big slap on the wrist there. :rolleyes:
 

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A Win!

"MANHATTAN: Without much fanfare or advance notice that investigations and negotiations had been ongoing, New York’s Attorney General, Eric Schneiderman, sprang the news on us that Hilton Resorts Corporation and Wyndham Vacation Resorts, Inc. had been bad boys but had reached an agreement to clean up their separate acts.

In the first agreement, which in my opinion has the most far reaching implications, Hilton agreed to stop using a clause in its timeshare purchase agreement that disclaimed responsibility for specific representations made by salespeople, particularly regarding the availability of reservations, hotel use rights, and the rental, resale, and buybacks of timeshare interests. Put your thinking cap on and imagine the possible repercussions of that agreement throughout the timeshare industry. As Donald Trump would say, “It’s HUGE!”

In the second agreement, which has a more limited locus, Wyndham agreed to stop offering reservation certificates, which allow members of its internal timeshare exchange program to make advance reservations at a timeshare hotel known as Midtown 45, prior to the acceptance for filing of the Midtown 45 offering plan. These certificates were given to purchasers of timeshares in other Wyndham properties, and they led some of those consumers to believe they were purchasing an interest in the Midtown 45 timesha."


Source: http://insidethegate.com/
 
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dioxide45

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There is another thread on this topic in the Buying, Selling, Renting forum.

[Link to destination thread disabled.]
 
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