Banking StarOptions [Important update 2/13/12!]

jarta said:

This year I converted the MF to Starpoints since the conversion ratio is higher for Ocean Side 2-br units, although the MF is the same as non-Ocean Side 2-brs.

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What's the SP conversion rate for WLR Ocean Side units? I didn't realize there was a difference. I updated seenett's SP conversion spreadsheet that's on the Starwood Owner Resources page last year. Looks like I need to update again. Does the SP conversion at WKORV/N also vary according to view category? If so, I should include that information as well.

Thanks,

Glorian

This is the banking thread...

DavidnRobin said:

Actually... had a hard time deciphering what you meant here - how do you save the $99 banking fee?

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Basically, if you intend to bank two years consecutively don't use the banked options the first year. My experience was:

2012: bank 2012 options (which expire 12/31/2014)
2013: use banked options
2013: bank 2013 options (which expire 12/31/2015)

Had I simply told the rep to use my current year options for this years reservations my 2012 banked options would be valid for next year and I wouldn't have had to pay the $99 fee today. Of course, if I can't travel as often as I hope next year then it wouldn't matter since I would then need to bank the 2014 options...but since I try not to see too far into the future, I can't predict this at this time.

Of course, the confirmation emails SVN sends out specifically states the expiration date. I even found the email I received last year to compare today's with, and they have the same info. So it's really my fault for not remembering they were valid for two years, but I will say I would have appreciated the advice I received today months ago from the reps who encouraged me to use my banked options first. I really just don't think they knew/know exactly how people are going to use these just yet so perhaps weren't sure what to advise during the first year. To avoid predictable (see, I can see into the future!) comments on this matter, let me be very clear to avoid any confusion that I unequivocally accept full responsibility for this issue and do not blame Starwood. And in the hopes another has to bank options two years consecutively, this warning will help save someone their $99.

grgs said:

What's the SP conversion rate for WLR Ocean Side units? I didn't realize there was a difference. I updated seenett's SP conversion spreadsheet that's on the Starwood Owner Resources page last year. Looks like I need to update again. Does the SP conversion at WKORV/N also vary according to view category? If so, I should include that information as well.

Thanks,

Glorian

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Glorian, I was wrong. Both convert to 72K SP. Post above changed. Salty

Minimum Points to Bank?

I know there is no minimum number of StarOptions required to bank, but what is the least number of StarOptions where it actually makes sense to bank your options? After making our 2017 reservation, we have 1,800 leftover options. Does it make sense to pay $99 to bank that few options? I guess over time they could add up to enough to book a single night, but that night may end up costing a few hundred dollars.

I have 1900 StarOptions left over this year and I elected not to bank them. Not worth the fee to bank that few points. Just MHO.

I personally would not pay a fee to bank that few. However, it is virtually guaranteed that once you decide to let them expire, the following year you will try to book a reservation and find yourself 25 StarOptions short.

We have 2800 unused StarOptions this year and reached the same conclusion: it's not worth the price to bank them.

okwiater said:

I personally would not pay a fee to bank that few. However, it is virtually guaranteed that once you decide to let them expire, the following year you will try to book a reservation and find yourself 25 StarOptions short.

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That is somewhat our concern. I know that perhaps every two to three years, those extra points could come in handy. While the 1,800 extra SOs may not be important in 2018, 3,600 might be useful in 2019. Just hard to predict that far ahead. But at $200, are the extra 3,600 SOs worth it? I am sure there isn't a right answer without knowing what we want to do that far out.

okwiater said:

I personally would not pay a fee to bank that few. However, it is virtually guaranteed that once you decide to let them expire, the following year you will try to book a reservation and find yourself 25 StarOptions short.

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I think we came 50 short the one year we went to WSJ, and this year we are doing two 6-day bookings at Christmas because we didn't have quite enough for both families getting 7-day bookings.

And I think we still have some weird number like 112K and change left for next year we haven't booked yet, so I'm sure we'll end up short or just a few left once we figure out next Christmas.

Luckily we don't get charged for banking as 5* Elites, so whatever's left, no matter how small, we bank.

I've never come short. My guess is that the fee is too much for the small amount of points. Do you have an idea of how to use them?

Having said that, I always bank everything no matter what and use the banked point for my first SO reservation the following year. Frequently I gift those...

Helios said:

Having said that, I always bank everything no matter what and use the banked point for my first SO reservation the following year. Frequently I gift those...

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It's actually a better idea to save your banked options since they are good for 2 full years. As an example:

Let's say you own 81K options but make a reservation someplace for 56,700. That leaves you with 24,300, and you pay $99 to bank those.

The following year, you decide to go someplace worth 95,700 options. If you use the banked options first, you will be left with 9,600 options that you need to pay another $99 to bank. However, if you had used your usage year options instead, then 9,600 banked options would've still been available to you without paying another banking fee.

That's a simplistic example, but it holds true in just about every circumstance. Always use your usage year options prior to banked options that won't expire for 2 years.

okwiater said:

It's actually a better idea to save your banked options since they are good for 2 full years. As an example:

Let's say you own 81K options but make a reservation someplace for 56,700. That leaves you with 24,300, and you pay $99 to bank those.

The following year, you decide to go someplace worth 95,700 options. If you use the banked options first, you will be left with 9,600 options that you need to pay another $99 to bank. However, if you had used your usage year options instead, then 9,600 banked options would've still been available to you without paying another banking fee.

That's a simplistic example, but it holds true in just about every circumstance. Always use your usage year options prior to banked options that won't expire for 2 years.

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I see your logic and I agree that it may work in some cases. I don't think this is a one size fits all scenario. Everybody can have a best way to use banked SOs and this may vary from year to year.

Conversely, say I need a SO reservation next year and I can use my home options and break one of my weeks. Or use my banked SOs (say you have enough banked SOs for the resie). I would still use my banked options in year one vs breaking my resort priority. Depending on where and how many SOs you own, this may be irrelevant since you may be breaking your home week anyway. I would hate to pay to bank and then let them expire on year two. Luckily for me, I bank at no cost.

I haven't gotten any options yet (since Nanea isn't completed yet), but from the sound of it, I think it's better to add another night on to your trip (if you can) rather then banking the options and paying $99.

If you have, say, 81,000 options; divide by 7 and your daily option rate is about 1,200 options a day. That's sort of equivalent to a $300-500 room (a suite)...

I think the minimum number of options to be allowed to bank them is 2000 options. So if it's less than that, you can't bank them, so use them for an extra night if you can.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

That only works at Nanea - when you make a home resort reservation at WKORV-N/S, it must be for 7 nights.

If you have extra Staroptions to use up, you can make a separate reservation for additional nights, but it will be "floating view," and you are likely to have to change rooms.

Helios said:

I see your logic and I agree that it may work in some cases. I don't think this is a one size fits all scenario. Everybody can have a best way to use banked SOs and this may vary from year to year.

Conversely, say I need a SO reservation next year and I can use my home options and break one of my weeks. Or use my banked SOs (say you have enough banked SOs for the resie). I would still use my banked options in year one vs breaking my resort priority. Depending on where and how many SOs you own, this may be irrelevant since you may be breaking your home week anyway. I would hate to pay to bank and then let them expire on year two. Luckily for me, I bank at no cost.

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You're correct on this point. My recommendation to always use your usage year options first applies only in StarOptions-to-StarOptions scenarios. If you have (or might have) a need for your actual Home Resort usage rights then of course you shouldn't relinquish them.

The main point to keep in mind is this: IF you are going to utilize an ownership as StarOptions, it is ALWAYS beneficial to utilize the options from that ownership BEFORE using banked options that expire the following year.

okwiater said:

You're correct on this point. My recommendation to always use your usage year options first applies only in StarOptions-to-StarOptions scenarios. If you have (or might have) a need for your actual Home Resort usage rights then of course you shouldn't relinquish them.

The main point to keep in mind is this: IF you are going to utilize an ownership as StarOptions, it is ALWAYS beneficial to utilize the options from that ownership BEFORE using banked options that expire the following year.

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We have 1800 SOs leftover that will expire in 2019. If for some reason we were to bank those and make a reservation in 2018 that would leave us with less than 1800 SOs, we would be better to use our 2018 use year SOs first and leave the remaining banked SOs. That would save us the $99 fee in 2018. Good tip! Though in 2019, we would want to use those banked SOs first.

farsighted99 said:

I haven't gotten any options yet (since Nanea isn't completed yet), but from the sound of it, I think it's better to add another night on to your trip (if you can) rather then banking the options and paying $99.

If you have, say, 81,000 options; divide by 7 and your daily option rate is about 1,200 options a day. That's sort of equivalent to a $300-500 room (a suite)...

I think the minimum number of options to be allowed to bank them is 2000 options. So if it's less than that, you can't bank them, so use them for an extra night if you can.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

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The average nightly cost is approx. 12,000 points.

I would only bank 2,000 points if I thought there would be a need for them in the next year or two.

NJDave said:

The average nightly cost is approx. 12,000 points.

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The average nightly cost would actually vary based on each owners usage. My average is less than 12,000, since I typically have 19-21 nights per year from a 148,000 platinum week.


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okwiater said:

The main point to keep in mind is this: IF you are going to utilize an ownership as StarOptions, it is ALWAYS beneficial to utilize the options from that ownership BEFORE using banked options that expire the following year.

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soon to be newbie owner, So apologize if I’ve missed it or if this has already been answered, as I try to learn as much as possible. but although This is beneficial in terms of saving a 2nd banking fee, The alternative trade-off to 2nd banking fee is that you have an extra year to use those remaining SOs?

and, can banked SOs (So I bank 2021 SOs on 10/1/2020, can the banked SOs be used for a reservation 8 Months in advance for a 2021Check-in. Or can banked SOs only be used for The 2 years after the use year (2022 & 2023 in this example)?

luv_maui said:

soon to be newbie owner, So apologize if I’ve missed it or if this has already been answered, as I try to learn as much as possible. but although This is beneficial in terms of saving a 2nd banking fee, The alternative trade-off to 2nd banking fee is that you have an extra year to use those remaining SOs?

and, can banked SOs (So I bank 2021 SOs on 10/1/2020, can the banked SOs be used for a reservation 8 Months in advance for a 2021Check-in. Or can banked SOs only be used for The 2 years after the use year (2022 & 2023 in this example)?

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Once banked, the StarOptions can no longer be used in their actual use year.

I also don't think most people bank until the use year of their points. It wouldn't really make sense to bank 2021 SOs in October 2020. You can't make a 2022 or later reservation with them until May of 2021. The banking deadline for most owners is July 1st of the use year. Elite owners have extended banking deadlines.

So if you bank 2020 StarOptions now, they can be used for a 2021 or 2022 reservation. You can't use them for a 2020 reservation.

Skipping a banking fee is what we did this year. We banked some 2019 StarOptions. Those now expire in 2021. This year instead of using our banked options, we used all of our 2020 use year options. So we have no more 2020 StarOptions to bank, saving us the $109. We still have a bunch of 2019 options that we banked that we can still use this year and next. However, next year we will have to use those banked options and will likely bank the 2021 options forward and save again on the banking fee in 2022.

I am also a newbie to Westin/Starwood/Vistana - trying to follow the logic here. Need some time to gel the points made above on banking - and have a few questions about use of StarOptions:

Scenario: I own 1 week at a mandatory resort - "resort #1"; EOY, 81,000 SOs; platinum season.

Question 1: If I purchase another mandatory resort - let's call it resort # 2 - AY or EOY week (say 81,000 points) in platinum season, can I use points to reserve two weeks in the platinum season at the resort #1 in the EOY year?

Question 2: May I use the StarOptions from resort #2 to reserve a larger unit (a 2 bdrm unit) at resort #1 during my EOY year and during the platinum season?

Question 3: If either question 1 or 2 are possible, how would one accomplish the goal? Would it include banking points? Or???

Question 4: As a Marriott owner, when needed, I can find folks who will rent/sell points (DP) that can be used to reserve an additional week at my resort. Are there Westin/Vistana owners who own points and rent or sell them? If so, where would I find Westin/Vistana points for sale?

Thanks in advance for your thoughts/experiences/responses!

TravelAmore said:

Scenario: I own 1 week at a mandatory resort - "resort #1"; EOY, 81,000 SOs; platinum season.

Question 1: If I purchase another mandatory resort - let's call it resort # 2 - AY or EOY week (say 81,000 points) in platinum season, can I use points to reserve two weeks in the platinum season at the resort #1 in the EOY year?

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I think by AY you mean All Years or Annual? If so, you can bank those options and use them in either of the following two calendar years. Booking window opens at 8 months.

Question 2: May I use the StarOptions from resort #2 to reserve a larger unit (a 2 bdrm unit) at resort #1 during my EOY year and during the platinum season?

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Season doesn't matter so much with StarOptions other than point requirements. As long as you have enough StarOptions based on the points chart and there is availability at eight months then you can book it.

Question 3: If either question 1 or 2 are possible, how would one accomplish the goal? Would it include banking points? Or???

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Yes, you would have to bank (or borrow) the points to accomplish this. There is a fee for banking (unless you are higher tier owner, unlikely since buying resale)

Question 4: As a Marriott owner, when needed, I can find folks who will rent/sell points (DP) that can be used to reserve an additional week at my resort. Are there Westin/Vistana owners who own points and rent or sell them? If so, where would I find Westin/Vistana points for sale?

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StarOption reservations can't be rented (unless reserved at a home resort). There is no way to transfer StarOptions between owners like you can do with Marriott. So there is really no rental market there. A rental market mainly exists renting whole week home resort reservations.

Thank you so much, Dioxide45 for your responses!
Is it true I would NOT be able to use the SOs from both resorts to reserve during the home resort season (at resort #1)?
Are you saying in order to reserve a larger unit or second week at resort #1, I would have to skip reserving in my home resort period and wait until the 8 month window?

TravelAmore said:

Thank you so much, Dioxide45 for your responses!
Is it true I would NOT be able to use the SOs from both resorts to reserve during the home resort season (at resort #1)?
Are you saying in order to reserve a larger unit or second week at resort #1, I would have to skip reserving in my home resort period and wait until the 8 month window?

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You can't use StarOptions to book during the Home resort period. You can however use your home resort usage to make one reservation and then wait until 8 months and make a StarOption reservation for more nights.
In order to book a larger unit or second week at resort #1 you need to use StarOptions at 8 months.

dioxide45 said:

You can't use StarOptions to book during the Home resort period. You can however use your home resort usage to make one reservation and then wait until 8 months and make a StarOption reservation for more nights.
In order to book a larger unit or second week at resort #1 you need to use StarOptions at 8 months.

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Thanks much!!