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New florida bill SB932: non-consumer friendly Timeshare law changes

SueDonJ

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Brian, I'm thinking that it may be a good idea to put a link to this thread, specifically mentioning the letter in your post #50 above, in each of the Timeshare Resort Systems forums. It's good exposure if all of the owners of Florida timeshares aren't reading this thread?

[Deleted.]
 
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TUGBrian

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its going to be in this weeks newsletter actually.
 

palmtree7339

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New FL. Bill Changing Timeshare Laws. Letter To The Governor.

I have sent the following letter to Florida Governor Rick Scott:
As a Florida resident, timeshare owner, and Chairman of the Florida Timeshare Owners Group, I am writing in behalf of our entire organization, which unanimously approved that I request that you veto SB 932, Florida Timeshare Act, in it's present form, in order to allow more input from timeshare owners, as well as prospective owners. This bill has been rushed through the legislature so quickly that most timeshare owners groups, such as ours, have just recently learned of its existence. It's clear that the bill is unpopular with timeshare owners, and its passage, as presently drafted, will likely bring unfavorable publicity nationally, when consumer groups outside Florida become aware of its full implications.
SB 932 is a one-sided effort by the developer community to ease their burden by stripping away significant consumer protections. There are issues involving public disclosure, contract litigation, timeshare trusts, legacy resorts, and maintenance fees. If these issues are addressed in a more open and objective forum, it shouldn't be that difficult to present an amended bill for your signature that we can all support. Further discussion, input, and more appropriate revisions could result in a far better bill, that would be acceptable, and protect the interests of both the developers and owners.
As one of many thousands of Florida residents who are currently owners of timeshares, I urge you to veto this bill if it reaches your desk. Please give this matter your utmost attention. Very truly yours, Frank Debar
 

KevinD40

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WHOs Behind...

Wynhdham Corporate. I over heard them talking about this at the Christmas party...

Adequately versed in "legalese" and owning several Florida timeshares, I will certainly go through this material with a fine tooth comb and with great interest when I have a chance, but today is a "moving day" with several days on the road thereafter before next settling in.

Without even reading a single word however, the first question to enter my mind is who is actually behind the legislative proposal --- and why? :ponder:
 

palmtree7339

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Changes in Florida Law Affecting All Fl. Timeshare Owners

The following statement was recently distributed to all members of the Florida Timeshare Owners Group, in connection with pending legislation awaiting the approval, or the rejection, (a veto), by Florida Governor Rick Scott. This decision is expected within the next two weeks, and all owners of timeshare units located within Florida, should be made aware of its dire implications, regardless of where they presently reside, if this legislation goes into effect on July 1st, 2015.

Bill SB932 is presently on Florida Governor Rick Scott's desk, and we certainly have the hopes that it will be vetoed, since it is fatally flawed.
Besides eroding so many other consumer protections for timeshare owners, it gives timeshare resort developers legal benefits that they don't deserve, and have not earned.

The timeshare industry has continually used high pressure sales tactics to persuade people to buy timeshares that, in many cases, they simply cannot afford. Timeshare resort developers should be required to stop these predatory practices.

Senate Bill 932 does not address this issue. This bill intentionally includes vague language that provides developers with a general exemption from liability, if and when they make so-called "non-material" errors in contracts and disclosures to buyers.

Sounds harmless, but the bill provides no definition of what "non-material" means, and worse, leaves it up to the developer to decide what's material vs. what isn't.

Isn't that like allowing the fox to guard the hen house? The liability exemption for developers is clearly objectionable to present timeshare owners, and will most negatively effect any and all future purchasers of timeshares. Therefore, this bill must be defeated.

Developers already make all of the rules in their current timeshare sales practices, so why do they need a liability waiver to protect themselves from their current highly questionable sales practices?

Further information on this matter may be obtained by contacting our FTOG website, tsownersgroup.com, or by contacting me at fdebar433@gmail.com.

Thank you,

Frank Debar, Chairman
Florida Timeshare Owners Group
 

buildsmart

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Passed Senate 38-0 seems Veto Proof

This is the Summary. Votes seem Veto Proof.


The bill relates to the Florida Vacation Plan and Timesharing Act (act), which establishes requirements for the creation, sale, exchange, promotion, and operation of timeshare plans, including requirements for full and fair disclosure to purchasers. The act is enforced by the Division of Florida Land Sales, Condominiums, and Mobile Homes (division) within the Department of Business and Professional Regulation (department). The bill:

Provides that an ownership interest in a condominium or cooperative unit or a beneficial interest in a timeshare trust is required for such interests to qualify as timeshare estates;
Revises the definitions for nonspecific and specific multisite timeshare plans to provide that the plans may include interests other than timeshare licenses or personal property timeshare interests;
Revises the required disclosures for public offering statements in multisite timeshare plans and provides that the developer has the burden of proof with regard to compliance with those provisions;
Revises the requirements for amendments to timeshare instruments in regards to component sites;
Expands the limitation on liability for developers who, in good faith attempt to and substantially comply with, all the provisions of the act;
Requires the disclosure of lease terms in timeshare trusts;
Repeals the requirement for judicial approval of transactions involving timeshare trust property;
Creates a procedure for the extension or termination of timeshare plans;
Creates a procedure for the transfer of the reservation system and owner data when a managing entity is discharged;
Requires all multisite timeshare plans to disclose the term of each component site plan and prominently disclose the term of component sites which are shorter than the term of the plan;
Excludes component site common expenses and ad valorem expenses from the cap on annual increases in common expense assessments;
Allows for substitute and replacement accommodations that are better than the existing accommodations; and
Revises the notice requirements on substitute accommodations.
If approved by the Governor, these provisions take effect July 1, 2015.

Vote: Senate 38-0; House 87-22
 

pedro47

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Wow! Post #50 is right on target with his letter to the Florida Governor.
 

hunkyleebo

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This may be a flawed bill, but we need to find ways to terminate timeshare situations that have become untenable without requiring a 100% vote.
 

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A copy of another letter sent by an FTOG owner to the Florida Governors office

Dear Governor Scott,

The injustice of the current Timeshare act that sits on your desk is quite apparent to all fair minded citizens. Please do not taint the many great accomplishments you have achieved by allowing this bill to become law.

Your record is filled with a balance seldom practiced by politicians. Yes changes are needed! The changes contained in this bill are disproportionately weighted to the side of the developers.

The damage caused by this bill will be both immediate and long term. It will cause harm to consumers in Florida and beyond. It will damage the Republican Party and you personally.

It seems such an innocuous bill yet it affects an industry ripe with corruption and disrepute. What other industry sells a product that loses 80% of its value the moment after you purchase it.

The only truly reputable company within this industry is Disney. They keep the resale price of their product at respectable levels immediately and they take those resale values above original purchase price long term by putting their money back into the resale market assuring consumers are protected! They are the only ones participating in this responsible practice!

They do not need the changes that will be brought about by this bill and the companies that would have you sign this bill into law are looking to further take advantage of consumers.

I would further offer to you that the notion of ARDA ROC being a consumer organization is, in my most humble opinion, a sham! In virtually all HOA dues, (which are primarily controlled by developers), there is a $5 "donation" line item to ARDA ROC. The "donation" should be an "opt in". It is not. It is an "opt out". When the 225,000 Hilton Grand Vacations members "donate" $1.1 million ARDA ROC sees that as coming from Hilton. They are listening to Hilton Executives, not individual Resort Owners.

When the 410,000 Marriott Vacations members "donate" $2 million ARDA ROC sees that as coming from Marriott. They are listening to Marriott Executives, not individual Resort Owners.

When the 900,000 Wyndham Vacations members "donate" $4.5million ARDA ROC sees that as coming from Wyndham. They are listening to Wyndham Executives, not individual Resort Owners.

Most developers in this industry sell their product utilizing very questionable methods, do not back up the product that they sell, and not only do not keep the promises they make to sell their product they readily change the rules to their advantage.

The changes they are attempting to make through this legislative act removes some of the few protections consumers had in this arena.

In closing I implore you to veto this unethical legislation and let the House and Senate bring a bill to your desk next year that balances the needs of the industry with the rights of the consumers.
 

TUGBrian

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another letter sent to the governor recently by the FTOG chairman....has some summaries of the main complaints in it for clarification.

On behalf of all timeshare owners who live in Florida --- as well as non-residents who bought Florida timeshares --- We respectfully urge you to consider the following and forward this letter of our concerns to Gov. Rick Scott.

HB 453 was filed with no input from timeshare owners and, in our opinion, strips away some consumer protections already in law. Some aspects of this bill codify practices that developers already use, such as vacation clubs that sell points into trusts instead of deeded weeks. We have no quarrel with clear cut provisions that simply modernize Florida's timeshare laws. We do object, however, to the following provisions of HB 453:

• This bill expands the limitation on liability for developers who, in "good faith", attempt to substantially comply with all provisions of the Timeshare Act. There are many, many industries who wish they could skirt the laws simply by acting “in good faith”. Under this provision, so-called non-material errors by developers are not actionable. We contest the idea that some contractual errors can be considered material while others are meaningless. Further, from our vantage point, developers do not need additional legal protections from their own mistakes in contracts and disclosure to potential buyers. This provision is a direct attack on existing law that protects consumers. If this becomes law, timeshare owners will have a much more difficult time getting out of flawed contracts. The backers of this provision say, without apology, that this is designed to deter frivolous lawsuits against the industry. Yet they have not cited a single instance where any attorneys have filed frivolous lawsuits against developers or homeowner associations.


• Another provision of HB 453 allows developers or HOAs to exceed Florida's 125 percent cap on increases in annual maintenance fees. In technical terms, the bill excludes component site common expenses and ad valorem expenses from the cap on annual increases in common expense assessments. We view this provision as a blank check for developer controlled associations and a pocketbook issue for owners. Since owner-advocacy groups, such as the Florida Timeshare Owners Group and the National Timeshare Owners Association, were not consulted about this provision prior to its inclusion in HB 453, we can only conclude the following: it was designed specifically to benefit developers by giving them carte blanche to impose any fees they want. Again, we view this as a direct attack on owners who, under current law, cannot be socked with exorbitant annual increases in their maintenance fees.


• A third and seemingly innocuous clause in HB 453 allows developers to substitute inventory with replacement accommodations that are "better than or equal to" existing accommodations. However, we see a huge potential for abuse within the vague language of this provision. According to realtors who are very familiar with timeshare transactions, this clause opens the door for developers to take back prime inventory, then "substitute" it with potentially inferior accommodations --- all to the detriment of an unsuspecting owner or potential buyer. This provision would also enable developers to substitute inventory in the middle of a timeshare resale, or right afterwards, effectively disrupting sales for a section of the industry they view as fierce competition. In practical terms, this substitution clause could kill the timeshare resale market, because who would buy a piece of property that could be "substituted" with a lessor product at any point in time? The whole idea of substituting inventory without owner consent is in our opinion, anti-consumer


These are our primary concerns with HB 453. Beyond the specifics, however, we are concerned that the timeshare developer industry would sponsor special interest legislation that is so transparently one-sided, favoring developer interests over those of timeshare owners. For this over-riding reason, we urge you to veto HB 453. Protect the consumers of Florida by sending this measure back to the Legislature with your directive that it be revised to ensure that NO consumer protections are rolled back, either directly or through the back door.
 

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sadly it appears the gov signed this bill (along with many others) yesterday.
 

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Talent312

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But at least they didn't mess with the recession period, yet.

Look alikes? Governor Scott & Lord Voldemort (Harry Potter)..

images


images
 
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theo

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One step forward, two steps back...

But at least they didn't mess with the rescission period, yet.

It's a curious and noteworthy contradiction that Florida's rescission period is among the longest rescission periods in the U.S. (at 10 days) and the pertinent FL law was tightened up even more just a very few years ago, by also applying that 10 day rescission period to timeshare resales as well as to developer-direct transactions.

But then this regressive, pro-developer / anti-consumer timeshare legislation gets introduced --- and has now formally been enacted into FL law. :annoyed:

The article content in post #63 above says it all. The (only) two "sponsors" of this foul-smelling legislation both received campaign money from the timeshare industry.
A well greased wheel rolls more smoothly, obviously including in Florida state politics --- although that's certainly not a situation unique or limited to Florida. :rolleyes:
 
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TUGBrian

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I doubt any of the politicians involved had the least bit of useful information about the timeshare industry in general, much less the resale market.
 

sparty

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I doubt any of the politicians involved had the least bit of useful information about the timeshare industry in general, much less the resale market.

So are some of the higher profile timeshare law companies who help folks get out of contracts bad as many have commented here on TUG? Some of the comments about the bill talk about this industry of law firms and how they hope this bill helps curb that.
 

TUGBrian

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We have heard of zero legitimate "law firms" who can carte-blanche get someone out of their timeshare, and certainly not the ones that advertise the guarantees to do so.

most arent even law firms, and in almost all cases the actions taken are ones any owner can do themselves (ie repeatedly send letters demanding cancellation over and over and over).

Each of these firms in question we have ever seen all violate the main red flag warnings for ripoffs in the timeshare industry:

1. they provide guarantees and claims that cant possibly be true for everyone
2. they charge large upfront fees.
 

dannybaker

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Wow

I love the fact this bill is 100 percent not for the people. And it past with 100 percent approval but no politicians who voted have an idea what the bill even covers. At what point do Americans take back America? Another said day for the innocent victims of the time share business. I am so thankful for TUG and all of the knowledge you wonderful people have provided my family. Most people find TUG to late to help them with the Mafia mentality in the time share business. The extremely high sales pressure, the out right lies. It really is a mind control they put people under. The entire presentation is geared to play with your sub conscience mind. In my opinion they are criminals and scum bags. I truly am sorry for the innocent victims and thankful to TUG.
 

fiat1bmw

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Timeshare owners don't vote

I would venture to guess that most time share purchases in Florida are made by out of state residents and so can't vote in Florida elections.
 

chapjim

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[Deleted.]

Thank you! Really! I mean it!
 
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palmtree7339

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Florida's Changes in Timeshare Law. An Overview. ARDA And ARDA-ROC.

As the Chairman of the Florida Timeshare Owners Group, I recently sent a message to our membership, that I would like to also share with interested Tuggers. The message deals with the recent passage of revisions to the Florida Timeshare Act, which will go into effect on July 1, 2015.

These changes in the laws governing all Florida timeshare resorts will negatively affect many current and future owners. These revisions were requested and supported actively by timeshare resort developers, as well as the American Resort Developers Assn., also known as ARDA, and its subsidiary, ARDA'S Resort Owners Coalition, also known as ARDA-ROC.

You should now be aware that both of these organizations named above shall, as of this date, be banned from attending any and all future meetings of the Florida Timeshare Owners Group, as a direct result of their efforts to support these many anti-timeshare owner legislative changes.

Moreover, I am requesting that all FTOG members refrain from making any further voluntary contributions to either ARDA or ARDA-ROC, in the future, by way of the listed check-off method, as usually contained within their resort's annual maintenance fee billings, regardless of your resort(s) location.

These 2 group's are not our friends!

They chose not to inform our organization of the prior filing of this onerous legislation when their representative attended our March 2015 meeting to expressly update our membership on all legislative activities affecting Florida's timeshare owners, which was the essential agreement that led to their being invited to attend as one of our Guest Speakers.

It is also requested that all members contact their home resort's HOA Board members, and indicate their views re: ARDA and ARDA-ROC, and request that any future provisions for voluntary donations to these two organizations not be included on their resort's future mainteance fee billings.

We should not continue to financially support any organization that chooses to weaken our timeshare consumer protection laws that have already been established.

P.S. Be prepared to witness similar proposed timeshare legislation being filed in other states, now that these changes are established law in the State of Florida.

Frank Debar, Chmn.
Florida Timeshare Owners Group.
Website: www.tsownersgroup.com
 
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LannyPC

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Anything Positive?

I know many TUGgers and owners of FL TSs are quite upset at this bill and there are a lot of negatives to it. But, when a bill is passed, usually there is some rationale to it. What was the rationale behind this one?

I understand that any positives will not compensate for the negatives, but is there at least a shred of positivity to this, even if the negatives far outweigh the positives? Is there any silver lining to this cloud regardless of how big the cloud is and how thin the lining might be? :shrug:
 

palmtree7339

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Florida Timeshare Law Changes. Response to LannyPC.

I know many TUGgers and owners of FL TSs are quite upset at this bill and there are a lot of negatives to it. But, when a bill is passed, usually there is some rationale to it. What was the rationale behind this one?

I understand that any positives will not compensate for the negatives, but is there at least a shred of positivity to this, even if the negatives far outweigh the positives? Is there any silver lining to this cloud regardless of how big the cloud is and how thin the lining might be? :shrug:

Lanny, Good question, and certainly it deserves an answer. Unfortunately, significant positives, in my opinion, do not exist. This was strictly a pro-developer, anti-consumer series of changes in our state's Timeshare Act, as drafted and submitted to the legislature by a prominent law firm located in Orlando, FL, who was hired by ARDA to represent only the timeshare resort developer interests, and not we, the consumers, (timeshare owners).
Be prepared for many more pro-developer timeshare-related legislative changes being filed here in Florida next year, as well as in many other states. The recent Florida revisions should be, in my opinion, considered just the "foot in the door" to further anti-timeshare-owner legislation, throughout the country, in the coming years.
Watch, and see!
 
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