[2008] destination paradise

yes, vacation clubs (usually timeshare rental brokers) have been more publicized in europe it seems. but theyre certainly been around here as well.

Paradise Blue Scam

Paradise Blue is a SCAM!

We went for the "free gift" and the "30" mintue program that lasted over 2 hours.

We had to hand over our cell phones so someone could personally turn them off. We were told that we would not be allow to use the restroom, so please go before the program started. THAT IN ITSELF SHOULD OF THREW UP RED FLAGS...But get the
gift and leave. Right? Wrong!!! The program LOOKS Great! To Good to be True! And your
on Vacation..You want to go back on Vacation.

So the Program starts at $9, 000 - Drops to $7, 000 by the time it was over we will give it to you for $4, 000 with a FREE Vacation (air fair not included) plus $183 or so a year. GIVE US YOU CREDIT CARD NUMBER!!!

But IF you change your mind you have 3 DAYS TO CANCEL NO QUESTIONS ASK!
YEAH RIGHT!!!

Paradise-Blue will not let you walk out of the building by yourself if you buy the program. They put your binder with all your information in a brown paper bag and escort you into elevator, into a waiting van that takes you back to your hotel??? (Whats that all about?)

As soon as I got back to the room I check the internet, find how many times Paradise-Blue had changed their name, all the bad reviews, BBB RATES THEM AN "F". I had to check the BBB in Flordia, because they are really listed in Flordia??? with an Hawaii address??

We go back to Paradise-Blue and TRY TO CANCEL WITHIN (1 HOUR!!) Just get our money OFF the Credit Card. Which at that point had not even been post to our account!!

NO WAY - They WON'T DO IT. Paradise-Blue dropped the price to $2000 then to $1, 000 plus the free vacation & the yearly fee. Paradise-Blue just would NOT take No for an answer! After we made a scene & we refuse to go in the back office people were starting to leave.

They then signed the cancellation papers. BUT they still did not take the charges off our Credit card! PLUS they CHARGED a $250.00 PROCESSING FEE!!! $4250.00

SO We went Back the next day when all the "New couples" were coming in (I told as many as I chould that it was a scam & I was there to get my money back - check the BBB & internet before they buy) most of the couples thanked me & walked out. Paradise-Blue did not like that, I reminded them of "Free Speech" and I would continue to do that until I got my money back.

I just wanted the $4, 225.00 off my credit card (4) days & talking numerous times to Credit Card Company POLICE THATS WHAT IT TOOK! ITS A SCAM!!

Hi, New user here. I think my wife and I might have been ripped off last week by Pacific Dreams Just Escape......

Any advice would help. I don't see anything that links them to Destination Paradise, or Paradise Blue?

Anybody see this? http://www.bbb.org/hawaii/business-...fic-dreams-just-escape-in-lahaina-hi-53036565

Good or Bad?

Thanks for your help!

Just went to the presentation today

We did it for a reduced price parasailing (4 of us for $80 total rather than the $260 or so it would've cost retail). I went in knowing good and well that we wouldn't go for it. I already own a HGVC that I bought for a song resale, but basically I'd prefer to waste an hour and a half and save nearly $200, so that's what I did.

The presentation was very slick. They had a "game room" for the kids (tv with an x-box - the kids were thrilled). The person leading the presentation had apparently been flown in to do the presentation. He was very good. His name is Kerry Elevier, I think. We had our personal sales person who applauded along and then afterwards tried to sell us. When I said "thanks but no thanks," she said we're not getting off that easily. It's almost like she knew she was going through the motions for us. When we made it clear we weren't going for it, she said ok, and proceeded to give me a bunch of hints on how to maximize our HGVC property with good trades. She was very helpful, this was not done with any sales in mind, as she knew it wasn't happening.

When she went to get us our final voucher, she had to have the "closer" sign off on it, he came by and tried to get us to do it, but we mentioned that we had more than enough vacation stuff going on, so we weren't going to do it. I mentioned my HGVC, and he quickly realized it wasn't going to happen.

I will say, having read the previous people trying to justify this, giving some of them (Stephanie in specific) the benefit of the doubt, I would say that you can get bargains this way, and if you didn't have the buy in, it would probably have some great value. Of course, spending $4, $6 or $8 thousand up front to get access to these great bargains is no longer a bargain. However, if you're really lazy, and want someone to do all the work for you, and don't mind spending that much up front, go for it. It's your money, after all.

All you have to do, though, is run through the numbers. Calculate how much you spend up front, how much it costs per year, and how much you spend per actual week you use (they have funny money numbers of credits they give you which is meaningless - how much does one actually spend each week they use is all I want to know). When you get that number, divide it by something like 10 years or more, and you'll get an idea of how much value this has.

I have no doubt that they use very shady techniques to get people to buy - high pressure, slick marketing, vague claims and terms (costs "from" a certain amount of money, using searches which are not necessarily the ones most would use, blurring different types of usages and costs, etc.), and finally, pressure that you HAVE to buy today or it's just no good. Of course, like with any of these vacations travel deals, someone has to pay for the expensive marketing (freebies that I got, for instance) that they use, someone pays upfront, and then us Tuggies who do our homework swoop in and pick up the stuff that's left over when people realize they're in too deep.

So, I'm sure, like those who pay full price from the developer on timeshares, there are instances of people getting value from their purchases, even here, if you use it (and the company stays in business), then you'll get some satisfaction. For me, I get far more satisfaction getting the same product at a fraction of the cost. So, caveat emptor. It's not like us folk here at TUG are trying to pull the wool over anyone's eyes - far from it, the more we discourage people from buying full-fare coach, the more we hurt ourselves, because more savvy shoppers will in the end cost us more money. But, that's just the type of people we are, I guess.

Just Dreams Aka Paradise Blue

Just Dreams is a SCAM! AKA Paradise Blue(changed their name 4 times)

We went for the "free gift" and the "30" mintue program that lasted over 2 hours.

We had to hand over our cell phones so someone could personally turn them off. We were told that we would not be allow to use the restroom, so please go before the program started. THAT IN ITSELF SHOULD OF THREW UP RED FLAGS...But get the
gift and leave. Right? Wrong!!! The program LOOKS Great! To Good to be True! And your
on Vacation..You want to go back on Vacation.

So the Program starts at $9, 000 - Drops to $7, 000 by the time it was over we will give it to you for $4, 000 with a FREE Vacation (air fair not included) plus $183 or so a year. GIVE US YOU CREDIT CARD NUMBER!!!

But IF you change your mind you have 3 DAYS TO CANCEL NO QUESTIONS ASK!
YEAH RIGHT!!!

Just Dreams will not let you walk out of the building by yourself if you buy the program. They put your binder with all your information in a brown paper bag and escort you into elevator, into a waiting van that takes you back to your hotel??? (Whats that all about?)

As soon as I got back to the room I check the internet, find how many times Paradise-Blue had changed their name, all the bad reviews, BBB RATES THEM AN "F". I had to check the BBB in Flordia, because they are really listed in Flordia??? with an Hawaii address??

We go back to Just Dreams and TRY TO CANCEL WITHIN (1 HOUR!!) Just get our money OFF the Credit Card. Which at that point had not even been post to our account!!

NO WAY - They WON'T DO IT. Just Dreams dropped the price to $2000 then to $1, 000 plus the free vacation & the yearly fee. Paradise-Blue just would NOT take No for an answer! After we made a scene & we refuse to go in the back office people were starting to leave.

They then signed the cancellation papers. BUT they still did not take the charges off our Credit card! PLUS they CHARGED a $250.00 PROCESSING FEE!!! $4250.00

SO We went Back the next day when all the "New couples" were coming in (I told as many as I chould that it was a scam & I was there to get my money back - check the BBB & internet before they buy) most of the couples thanked me & walked out. Just Dreams did not like that, I reminded them of "Free Speech" and I would continue to do that until I got my money back.

I just wanted the $4, 225.00 off my credit card (4) days & talking numerous times to Credit Card Company POLICE THATS WHAT IT TOOK! ITS A SCAM!!

Just Dreams Aka Paradise Blue

Just Dreams ripped me and my wife off in 11/2010 on our honeymoon. There deals are no better than Travelocity, orbitz, kayak, or priceline. And all those companies services are FREE!!!! We paid approximatley $6,000 for the uber special "Software license" only to find run down properties and virtually no "short term deals" they mention in the presentation. Not to mention NO DISCOUNTS beyond what the free sites can get you. I filed a complaint with the Department of Consumer Affairs in Hawaii, and the company they used to finance me responded with a letter saying they would no longer charge me anymore. Although my app fee and such was not refunded, nor were my first 4 payments, but I dont care. I have an official letter from them saying the Hawaii Attorney General contacted them, and that I no longer owe money. They must have gotten scared. Anyhow, YES they are a total scam. And YES, contact the DCCA they can get it taken care of. They are the same company as paradise blue. They keep changing their name to avoid detection.

That would probably be the Camlis, the only Seattle listing in the current RCI Directory. Red weeks all year long.

Pacific Dreams is the latest version of Destination Paradise. They had to change names (again) do to all of the complaints and the 'F' rating by the BBB (worst rating possible). They will claim to not be associated with Destination Paradise, but just look at the 2 websites and you'll see that the text is largely copy-and-pasted and the pictures of the satisfied clients have some identical photos.

They do not deliver on what is promised in the presentation. I know, because sadly I fell for this scam.

Take everything wrong with Timeshares and their selling practices, multiple by 50, add in a whole lot of nothing for an expensive price and you get Pacific Dreams.

My fiance and I travel quite a bit and have been known to go to time share presentations to get discounted stays or activities now and then. We are used to the high pressure sales and the rapidly decreasing price over time. When we sat in on a presentation by Pacific Dreams in Maui, we didn't realize that a company would outright lie just to get business.

We were warned by the sales person about somebody who had been posting fake scams and ignorantly we bought into it. Like many things it was a while before we had another opportunity to travel and when we went to do so we realized just how big of a SCAM this really is. By this time it was definitely to late to cancel so we're just hoping to help others to not make the same mistakes we did. Remember, for every person who complains there are tens if not hundreds of people who just chalk a mistake up to a bad decision or they don't want to admit to getting scammed. I'll admit it though, we bought it hook, line, and sinker.

We had a three major problems with the service which is why we had to warn others. The least of all is the software. It looks like it is written 15 years ago and it is as hard to navigate as anything i've seen here on the web. Worse is that you can't book trips to any place you would actually want to go. Thinking of a romantic trip to Paris? Not even an option. We weren't able to find any major city anywhere in the world that it allowed. The worst clincher though is even when you find a far off remote place and you are supposed to be getting some great deal, the prices where over twice what we found in a quick 5 second search of accommodations on the web. The one thing they say they are good at, getting great deals around the world and their prices don't even come close to what's competitive.

It is a waste of several thousand dollars for us from this scam. I hope others don't make same mistake!

I had to register just to share some of my thoughts and the red flags that came up for me when going through the Just Dreams presentation, so this is my first post but I'm not a Planted poster.

This is a total scam.. We got suckered into a free car rental and some restaurant gift certs for our 90 minute presentation and we reluctantly agreed.

Here's some thoughts/flags:

1. The original person who offered us the presentation and tickets at the "free activities booth" specifically told us to lie and mark a higher pay range on the application at the sales pitch. Also, no mention of the company names "paradise blue" or "just dreams" were included by the activities booth.

2. Once arriving, they claim that they have a lease on the entire 6th floor of the Bank of Hawaii building (this isn't true though as there are vacant offices on that floor). Additionally, if you look at the buildings directory, as well as the plaques on the wall next to the office doors, you will see NO MENTION of the names "Paradise Blue" or "Just Dreams." Thus, there is no proof that they are there to "stay" so to speak, and they can up and leave any moment.

3. After arriving and filling out paperwork, we sat in the waiting room with a few other couples that were already there. It's very possible these couples could have been "dummies" and were planted there.

4. Upon arrival of our sales representative and being ushered into the presentation room, we were REQUIRED to turn off our cell phones IN THE PRESENCE OF the representative! HUGE red flag! We also could not use the restroom while in the presentation.

5. Our presentation was given by a gentlemen named "Seyi" who was very persuasive (I've seen his name mentioned in other complaints as well). He mentioned the price of $10,000 at the beginning of the presentation, claiming that was the final price and that there was no other hidden costs aside from the yearly renewal fee.

6. During the presentation, they mention that they help "subsidize" costs by paying part of the hotel/condo/cruise booking costs. They also showed slides that indicate the amount of savings one would receive. Each buyer is entitled to "X" amount of fictional vacation dollars to spend towards hotel/cruise/condo reservations ($3,000, for example). When you book a stay, they take money out of this fund, which is replenished yearly.

They DID NOT, however, specifically say HOW MUCH you can take out of this fund AT ANY GIVEN TIME. Seemed very evasive and vague, and I have seen complaints stating that you CANNOT USE THE FULL AMOUNT TOWARDS A SINGLE VACATION STAY. This makes the cost of the condo/hotel/cruise EXACTLY the same as it would be on orbitz, hotels.com, hotwire, etc.

7. During the presentation, they used screenshot slides that were still shots of their website. They DID NOT use the Live Software to show ANYBODY any price on any given destination.

In my experience, any presentation that DOES NOT show live software is HIDING SOMETHING.. I know because I've seen it done in other companies that I've worked with in an entirely unrelated industry. They use the excuse that the presentation would drag on too long past the 60 minutes they had if they used the live software, since everybody would want to see their destination of choice.

8. At first, we were spoken to by our sales representative. When she quickly discovered that we were skeptical, a manager was almost immediately brought in to pressure us more.

We were brought into a private office in the back and after being further skeptics they brought in the "big guns" a.k.a. the presenter/VP manager of the office who gave the presentation. He further pressured us into purchasing the program.

9. The price plummeted. It was $10k originally, then went to $8k, and drastically dropped as low as $2,500 for a budget friendly package. Any product whose price drops this much should have it's legitimacy questioned immediately.

This is not only a shady marketing/sales tactic, but the manager blatantly told us that "nobody else got this same offer that you did..." Yeah right.. that's a blatant lie, as I've seen many other complaints online stating that they too received the exact same drastic price drops and offers, including the "free vacation voucher" that they toss in to try and sweeten the pot.

10. Speaking of private offices, the office we entered was very "sterile" and BARE! If this is in fact a legitimate business, and the resting place of this company, wouldn't there be personal effects in there? No pictures on the wall or on the desk, just a bare desk with a keyboard and monitor. I'm guessing this is so they can get out of there quickly if another DBA name change is needed.

Also, when we went back to cancel 2 days later, the return private office we spoke in was also bare and had no personal effects.

11. We decided to buy just to get out of there. After paying (with our credit card) and leaving, the anxiety and panic sunk in. We started thinking logically and wondered what disastrous thing we had done.

Sure enough, not a lot of legitimate complaints exist out there for Just Dreams yet. It seems that's the case because this name is fairly new, so not a lot of places exhibit legit complaints yet.

12. 7 day cancellation policy, but it's obvious you wont get your key code to access the software for AT LEAST 7 days. This is another HUGE red flag, and they will manipulate it and "talk" around it all day long, claiming that the filing process takes several days to activate your account and gather your keycode.

This is ridiculous. I sign up for programs online frequently, and there is no such process to go through to get an activated account. You can register online for any number of discount hotel/flight/car rental programs (hotwire, orbitz, etc.) and your account is activated almost IMMEDIATELY, giving you the right to utilize their services right away. This is the 21st century after all.

13. After deciding to cancel, we went in on Monday morning to the office to cancel. We were taken into another private office (which, as mentioned above, was also bare), and we were given a huge retention push. It was obvious that he was trying to retain us as a customer and get us to keep the program, but we were determined to cancel.

14. After trying to cancel, the manager continued to follow us outside and asked us questions about why we cancelled, etc. It seemed like he wanted to hear legitimate feedback, so I was inclined to give it to him.

Every time I mentioned one of these red flags, the guy simply evaded the real question at hand and gave us vague and manipulative answers. The manager would simply NOT give me a decent straight forward answer.

If this company was legitimate, wouldn't they gladly be receptive to positive critical feedback? Many, MANY other individuals have posted complaints and have mentioned MANY of the same red flags that I've mentioned above, yet he talked his way out of every single one of them.

15. No free trial offer or longer cancellation period. Incredibly high sales pressure tactics.

Any legitimate company would have:

a.) A free or discounted trial - Allow me to try your software for free for 'X' days, or allow me to pay a one time fee (say $100 or so) to use your software ONCE to get a discounted vacation. If it works, I'll come back to you and pay the full price. This option doesn't exist and they will laugh you out the door if you try and mention it.

b.) Longer cancellation period - a "no risk" trial of 30 days, 60 days, etc. is very standard and should ALWAYS be an option. There was simply just TOO MUCH RISK to get involved at a 7 day return period for SUCH A LARGE AMOUNT OF MONEY.

c.) No high pressure sales - I'm a firm believer that a good product SELLS ITSELF. If it's such a great product, it doesn't need a high pressure sales pitch, and if we want to leave without buying they should gracefully let us go!

16. When asked, the manager said he DID NOT HAVE AN EMAIL ADDRESS. Who in this day and age of business does NOT have a direct email address?

After that, I asked him for a business card. He handed me a card which was simply a generic business card for Just Dreams, and did not have a direct number for him or his name anywhere on it. Yet another red flag.

I argued for a good hour or so, after which we finally discovered it wasn't worth it to keep arguing and we left. The guy sure did try hard to make us feel bad about cancelling though, but in the end I'm incredibly glad it didn't work.

Avoid this place like the plague. Our 4-5 hours of wasted time on our Hawaii vacation wasn't anywhere worth the $160 or so in free gifts that we received. If I see credit card charges come across for this company I will go to war with them and do anything in my power to get it back.