Sandcastle P'town owners -Festiva

I was told the resort had "been sold" to a new owner... huh? I thought we interval owners were the owners...

What I've gleaned so far: there's a new "trustee" who now owns all the unsold units(??) - Festiva Resorts is in there somehow, new management??, there is now a sales office onsite, they will be undertaking major renovations "to bring it up to II standards" - they are initiating a points system, and plan to meet with all current owners - in person!

MF's are going up by $65/studio and almost $100/1-BR. Possible special assessments which they hope to know soon. A newsletter will be mailed to us shortly

If anyone has further info, please post - did anyone here know about this, how it happened, and who decided on Festiva?

IVS Realty

I spoke with someone at www.ivsrealty.com about a month ago...they list a lot of the Cape Cod resorts. I was interested in the Sandcastle and was inquiring about resales. I was told that IVS realty bought all the unsold weeks and they were listing them on their website. He was supposed to call me back when he had all the weeks and their prices figured out. But now I'm not so sure I want another week there, if MFs are going up.

The owners did have a $100 assessment last year for upgrades to the roof, swimming pools, and tennis courts. I have not heard of any other assessments at this time.

Here's the 411....

First of all let me say that this news distresses me immensely. As an owner, I had heard rumors and at the past annual meetings which I've attended, when one of the trustees was present they always say that they've been looking into ways to sell off their interest and retire. And, at the last annual owner meetings there was no one from the trustees' office present. If what you've heard is accurate, this is HOW it could've taken place: the "unsold weeks"are the accumulation of never before sold blue and white weeks, plus the repossession of delinquent red-white-and blue weeks. On top of this, the resort is closed about three months every year and those weeks are owned by the trustees (although they do not pay any MFs on them). The trustees can sell their inventory to anyone who will pay the negotiated price and that entitles them to alone have the single largest vote of all owners in a HOA, IF the management had been officially turned over to a HOA WHICH IT HAS LEGALLY NOT. Per the Declaration of condominium, the resort has never been sold out to a point where the resort's management could be turned over to a HOA. Therefore, until the point where the resort was something like 80 or 90% sold out (and I'm just throwing those two percents out as examples as I don't know the requisite) the trustees have the legal right to sell and manage what they own in any way they like. Therefore, they CAN do this. But it makes me sick. The ultimate and commonly frequent problem with companies/developers who come in and buy up what is mostly worthless inventory is that to justify the purchase they turn around and do a purported "upgrade" on all units. This leads to many many owners defaulting on their subsequent payments of assessments and MFs and then deeding back all the valuable weeks to a new developer/trustee. (This sounds like that, doesn't it?) Now, having explained the above to you, I've gotten on the horn and made some calls....here's what I learned.... Cliff Hagberg, the president and owner of IVS Realty in Hyannis (the largest timeshare resale company in New England) is the buyer. Cliff is a Sandcastle owner and I met him several years ago. According to an inside contact, he does plan to do upgrades to Sandcastle, which eventually has to mean special assessments. An upgrade (such as specifially A/C is necessary in order to get I.I. onboard as an exchange company.)
I'm only guessing, but Festiva's involvement may be as a third alternative exchanging company. I do not know Cliff's involvement if any with Festiva, although one could speculate that perhaps he has an interest in it? In any event, a letter will be forthcoming this fall to all owners and we will supposedly be able to convert our weeks to RCI Points. (I dread to think, but I dare predict the reason why Cliff is buying out and upgrading Sandcastle: His company IVS Realty did Points Conversions at other Cape Cod timeshare resorts and I think they charged over 2 grand per week. He stands to make a killing if he can get people on board with RCI Points. I converted the one week I own at Briarwood- but only after the price was lowered over the course of a few years to $495. (It turns out that RCI only realizes about $200 for a "conversion"- the rest of the money is divvied up between a resort/salesbroker commission.
There are two good things about this change: as of right now nothing has changed at the resort- it's the same managers and staff running everything the same. Things probably won't start happening at all until after the Royal Coacghman building is closed for the season (end of week 43) and until the Dunes building closes at the end of week 48. And the other good thing is that it is a local who is taking over- Cliff is a yearround Cape resident and I remember meeting him several years ago and him telling me that his wife's #1 favorite timeshare is Sandcastle. (And to be honest, as president of the largest timeshare resale company in New England he has the ability to trade or own anywhere he wants.)
Brian

Laurie & Brian, thanks for the info and bringing this to our attention. I hate the thought of another assessment and the m/f's going up. Sandcastle is a nice gem with low m/f's.

Pat H said:

Sandcastle is a nice gem with low m/f's.

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... or was ... I bought mine back in 2001 from IVS (whose website seemed to never get updated), and I didn't mind last year's assessment because fees had been so reasonable.

Yes, thanks Brian for so much more info.

The name of the company actually doing this is New England Vacation Services, and I'm not sure what its relationship is to Festiva. I've tried to read up on Festiva here, for the first time, haven't made my way through it all yet - what I've read doesn't sound thrilling, but is there an upside? I wonder whether there will be internal preference for other Festiva resorts, and/or internal trading there for weeks members, or only points ... are there Festiva Points? I thought that's what was meant, but RCI points would make more sense.

Guess we'll find out!

I hope you fair better than most resorts do when Festiva takes over. Read the long thread titled "Festiva just bought my resort, how bad is it going to get?" on the buying/selling forum to get an idea of what you have in store for you. You can only internally trade with Festiva(at least this is what Festiva told me) if you swap to their points for $3000 to $6000, plus you give up your deeded week. My advice is to never swap to their points. I watched an e-bay sale for Festiva points recently that didn't even get an offer and the starting bid price was$49.

They allegedly come in and raid the reserves for "needed upgrades". They raise MF's, and they give out as little financial information as possible.They will assess and do major upgrades because the better the resort looks, the easier it is for them to sell their points. They will try to get majority vote at the resort by repo's and deed backs, which come fairly easily from owners mad about assessments and MF increases.They stood at our annual meeting the first time since they purchased (2008 meeting) and announced that they would take owners weeks back for free from any owner who wanted out. They also gain control by selling Festiva Points in exchange for ownership of owner's weeks. Every time someone pays Festiva to become a points member, they give up their deed and become Right to Use instead of deeded owners. The week is now owned by Festiva, and festiva owns the vote. With their newly acquired vote, they will vote their employees and their mgt staff onto the board.

I hope your resort fares well, but Festiva Resorts is an expert at buying sold out resorts and ending up with total control of the resort, the mgt, and the board. Like the Boy Scout's motto, "Be Prepared".

This is a recent post from someone else on the Festiva thread on the buying/selling/renting forum:

"Festiva/ Peppertree@Tamarack

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I am an owner @ Pepertree@ Tamarack. I recently received 2 mailings:

a) a nomination form for officers-received after the due date to submit.

b) on the same day I received a letter with 2 things:
1) a list of nominees( guess who picked some of them? how did they get them in on time??)
2) "The approved 2009 Consolidated budget"

Hilites : 6.4% increase in op costs
11.3 % increase in MF
this is approximately $193k more increase in Revenue than expenses, yet they have decreased the money going to reserves by $143k

There is no explanation of where the $193k+ $143K= $326k is going!!!!

Nor is there any statement as to how much we have (or don't have) in reserve.

There's probably a couple of things here in blatant violation of Wis law,
but with loaded boards, little that can be done.

Be vigilant at your resort--make these guys provide decent management for their fees."

[Message deleted. Posting duplicate or very similar messages is not permitted on these forums. Dave M, BBS Moderator]

For more information on this same subject, go to this thread:

http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=85788

Sandcastle Owners Meeting Coming Up

The next owners meeting is coming up on April 25th. Is there value in attending? We've been getting annoying calls from Outfield Marketing who told us we "won't get the whole story" by attending the meeting and they want to come to our home to "explain" things to us. I've asked them to mail us information which I have never received.

I haven't seen information on from other Sandcastle owners on TUG mentioning the meeting. We live in "downstate" NY but we are willing to make the 5+ hour drive to attend if there will be a decent turnout. In years past, I've heard that less than 2dozen people show up and votes weren't even taken as the "owner" merely decided what he wanted. Meetings were moved for his convenience/inconvenience. It was clear that maintenance fee paying members were superfluous but now our voices may be of value if enough of us care to participate.

I don't plan to sign my weeks over to points. I'd probably sell before I'd do that. My husband and I plan to show up to at least hear what's going on before we make any decisions.

Is it too late to do anything about this or can attendees on April 25th make a difference?

By All Means Attend It

I've attended every annual Sandcastle meeting for the past decade. The lightest year had maybe two-three dozen people and there was inclement weather with no issues. The busiest year had every seat in the room filled....and there were no issues that year either- the weather was just very pleasant that April weekend.

In the end, there may be nothing concrete we as owners can do strictly in terms of being in attendance as there is no vote when the new trustee still owns majority interest. However, it's more a case of "speak now...or forever hold your peace" and it may be the only chance owners will have to get their voices heard by Cliff Hagberg.

Having attended other timeshares' annual meetings in the past when there was an outstanding issue of less relevance and seen smaller issues bring a crowd of hundreds, I will safely predict that attendance at the annual meeting will be so packed that they will not be capable of holding the crowd in the usual space upstairs (in the former lounge). I'd bet the meeting gets moved at the last minute to an area facility capable of holding a larger conference.
So,do by all means plan to attend!

Are owners planning to stay overnight at Sandcastle to discuss strategy prior to the April 25th meeting?

Sandcastle Owners

We have something very much in common here at Southcape Resort. If you follow the link in my signature it will take you to the letter we received from Cliff Hagberg, and the following posts should open your eyes to what you MUST do to preserve your rights!

You can even email me for the attachments which will spell out for you what you will be signing if you fall for Outfield Marketing's scare tactics.

DO NOT LET OUTFIELD MARKETING COME TO YOUR HOME!

I have good reason to suspect that Outfield Marketing is owned by Festiva Resorts. Cliff Hagberg teamed up with Outfield Marketing and they illegally elected themselves Trustees of the Owners' Association.

Our meeting isn't until May 16 so you needed the info in our discussion before we did. But we all needed it years ago when this takeover was in the works.

Staying for the meeting

Corky said:

Are owners planning to stay overnight at Sandcastle to discuss strategy prior to the April 25th meeting?

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Corky,
I am planning to stay at another of my timeshares across town that weekend. E-mail me if you set up a strategy meeting for Friday night!
Brian

Anyone attending the Sandcastle meeting-if you want a voting proxy from us just let me know.
Anita

What good is a voting proxy?

Anita,
In the 10 years I've owned at Sandcastle (9 units and I've attended almost every annual owners' meeting)there has never been a vote on anything. I inquired from the resort manager just why that is, and was told because the trustees owned majority interest and the resort was so far from the stipulation of it being sold to a percentage where a homeowners' association would be required to form....that any voting would be insignificant to the trustees majority interest.
When the trustees sold their interest to Cliff Hagberg he became the new majority interest holder (him or the company he owns/operates) and thus any "vote" is decided by him or his assigns.
So please tell me what you're talking about-a voting proxy- for Sandcastle- and what good it would do in the current situation seeing that we as owners have nothing to vote upon ?

Sandcastle Owners Meeting Coming Up - April 25th

Timesharemogul said:

Anita,
In the 10 years I've owned at Sandcastle (9 units and I've attended almost every annual owners' meeting)there has never been a vote on anything. I inquired from the resort manager just why that is, and was told because the trustees owned majority interest and the resort was so far from the stipulation of it being sold to a percentage where a homeowners' association would be required to form....that any voting would be insignificant to the trustees majority interest.
When the trustees sold their interest to Cliff Hagberg he became the new majority interest holder (him or the company he owns/operates) and thus any "vote" is decided by him or his assigns.
So please tell me what you're talking about-a voting proxy- for Sandcastle- and what good it would do in the current situation seeing that we as owners have nothing to vote upon ?

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Brian: Pls forgive me for my naivete - but if there's no value in a proxy and no value in a vote, then why did you ask Corky to let you know if there would be a strategy meeting somewhere on Friday night? Getting together to complain and commiserate might be fun and make us feel like we're not alone, but it doesn't sound like there will be much to gain from strategy unless you want to try to get NEVS to buy back all of our weeks. And why would they want to do that when they can get us to pay the bills for the 49%of Sandcastle they don't already own.

I don't mean to sound critical of your suggestion and if I do, I apologize in advance. Obviously you have a large interest in what's going on which I respect -- but I'm trying to understand if I'm missing something important. What's to strategize if we've already lost the farm and thrown away the key??? I'm sure what you say about voting is true based on what I know of the ownership rules and the situation when I have asked as well. It seems to me we're already unwilling pawns in someone elses game -- all we have to do is keep paying the bills to continue to play or figure out how to get out of it if we want to.

dneuser said:

Brian: Pls forgive me for my naivete - but if there's no value in a proxy and no value in a vote, then why did you ask Corky to let you know if there would be a strategy meeting somewhere on Friday night? Getting together to complain and commiserate might be fun and make us feel like we're not alone, but it doesn't sound like there will be much to gain from strategy unless you want to try to get NEVS to buy back all of our weeks. And why would they want to do that when they can get us to pay the bills for the 49%of Sandcastle they don't already own.

I don't mean to sound critical of your suggestion and if I do, I apologize in advance. Obviously you have a large interest in what's going on which I respect -- but I'm trying to understand if I'm missing something important. What's to strategize if we've already lost the farm and thrown away the key??? I'm sure what you say about voting is true based on what I know of the ownership rules and the situation when I have asked as well. It seems to me we're already unwilling pawns in someone elses game -- all we have to do is keep paying the bills to continue to play or figure out how to get out of it if we want to.

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Dneuser,
My question to Anita was written because I thought she might know something that I do not. As far as I know and can imagine I don't see what vote we have so I don't know where she got the idea that she could issue a proxy and have it mean anything? I'm guessing now that either she was making a well-intentioned but sub-factually-cognizant offer, or she hasn't yet read my post. (Hopefully, she does have some super-plan that she just didn't share).
As to getting together to comiserate, I'm going to be there anyway to attend the owners' meeting that weekend and hear firsthand what's up... MAYBE, just MAYBE it's not as bad as everyone has SPECULATED- we've had no substantive information posted except opinions based on fear and opinions based on hearsay from some unscrupulous marketers. Maybe a meeting with other owners COULD be valuable- who's to say someone there hasn't had a positive experience by filing a complaint with the MASS.AG, or perhaps there's a knowlegeable real estate lawyer amongst our ownership base who could provide a little guidance. And at worst, for those of us who will be there anyway it might be fun to socialize with other owners....although I suspect if it's a large group we might have to take our unofficial meeting to an area lounge!
Brian

Sandcastle Owners Meeting Coming Up

Thanks, Brian. Sounds like a reasonable idea. My husband and I plan to be there for the meeting as well and, since we are optimists, we hope to be pleasantly surprised. I think you offer good advice about keeping an open mind so we'll make the long ride up on Friday night and stay somewhere other than Sandcastle - most likely. If there's a Friday night gathering we'd like to know about it too.

Sorry Brian- I wish I knew something-I just thought that the owners had a majority interest and a proxy would be useful somewhere. I'm in Ohio so can't get to the meeting. I wonder why we've never been contacted about any of this-we just get mf bills. Please keep everyone posted, those of you who can get to the meeting.
I certainly won't go for the points thing, either.

anita

FYI

Chapter 183B: Section 27. Surplus funds


Chapter 183B: Section 28. Expenses; assessments; late charges; interest; reserve funds


Chapter 183B: Section 30. Financial records

Chapter 183B: Section 32. Definitions; list of addresses of owners; ballots; communication expenses; vote allocation; notice; recording amendments

Sou13 said:

I have good reason to suspect that Outfield Marketing is owned by Festiva Resorts. Cliff Hagberg teamed up with Outfield Marketing and they illegally elected themselves Trustees of the Owners' Association.

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Outfield Marketing is not owned by Festiva Resorts. We have contracted them to provide certain sales and marketing services for us.

Outfield Marketing

FestivaRep said:

Outfield Marketing is not owned by Festiva Resorts. We have contracted them to provide certain sales and marketing services for us.

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So I was right about one thing, that Festiva has contracted with Outfield Marketing to coerce us into converting to Festiva points!

Sandcastle Resort Provincetown MA

I noticed a previous post regarding the sale of a summer Sandcastle week on Ebay for only $2.25 and what must be wrong with the resort. I actually bought the week, Week 27, at $1.25. It's the third week there now that I own. I consider myself lucky. The MF is very reasonable for an oceanfront timeshare. The ad could have been much better...you didn't really notice that it was a summer week, and I think it may have been easily missed.

Yes, Festiva is involved with trying to convert owners to points, but the resort is getting reburbished and is in good standing. Sandcastle is in a great location and I don't want potential owners or renters to hesitate buying or renting here.

Craig said:

I noticed a previous post regarding the sale of a summer Sandcastle week on Ebay for only $2.25 and what must be wrong with the resort. I actually bought the week, Week 27, at $1.25. It's the third week there now that I own. I consider myself lucky. The MF is very reasonable for an oceanfront timeshare. The ad could have been much better...you didn't really notice that it was a summer week, and I think it may have been easily missed.

Yes, Festiva is involved with trying to convert owners to points, but the resort is getting reburbished and is in good standing. Sandcastle is in a great location and I don't want potential owners or renters to hesitate buying or renting here.

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I received an email on the same unit. I passed even though it was for the 4th of July week. Until I can understand how a company, Outfield Marketing, that is composed of some of the oldest timeshare players in the business and has nothing to do with a resort until very recently, can come in and send letters to owners whose names are on a list that should be protected from solicitation and then contact them, over and over and over to set up "in home" meetings for the primary purpose of converting them from deeded owners to points holders with no voting rights and furthermore have owners pay several thousand in the process for the privilege of losing their deed rights, I am have no interest in buying at Sandcastle or anywhere else where such practices are allowed. I wish all Sandcastle owners the best. You may want to read the Southcape board and find out how they are dealing with Outfield Marketing.