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Unrealistic pricing & inaccurate information

Keitht

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Clearly it is up to the prospective purchaser to do their homework before purchasing, but I've just seen one ad in the Marketplace where a company, not an individual, is way wide of the mark in a number of areas.
The asking price of $6k or about £4.5k is more than 3 times the amount being asked for similar units by the on site resales team. The maintenance fee is actually much lower than that advertised, which although a welcome surprise won't help with the sales attempt either.
I'm sure of the facts on this as I've just returned from a week in the resort, and a very pleasant chat with the sales staff.
 

theo

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Clearly it is up to the prospective purchaser to do their homework before purchasing, but I've just seen one ad in the Marketplace where a company, not an individual, is way wide of the mark in a number of areas.
The asking price of $6k or about £4.5k is more than 3 times the amount being asked for similar units by the on site resales team. The maintenance fee is actually much lower than that advertised, which although a welcome surprise won't help with the sales attempt either.
I'm sure of the facts on this as I've just returned from a week in the resort, and a very pleasant chat with the sales staff.

I have no doubts on the accuracy or validity of your facts or numbers.
Your observation is actually not at all an uncommon phenomenon.

I see many Internet ads for places with which I am personally familiar by current or prior ownership reflecting prices up to ten times actual resale market prices found easily in many other ads on any given day of the week.

I always just assume that the advertiser in such instances is either typing challenged (accidentally adding a few extra zeroes), hallucinating on drugs, or somehow just in complete denial regarding actual resale market value after having paid an exorbitant developer-direct price. Sometimes there is even language in such ads as "just want to get back what I paid"; a goal which of couse will likely never be achieved anywhere here on Planet Earth after a developer-direct purchase.
 
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richardm

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Tug is trying to become a timeshare classified site...

As TUG tries to become a player in the online classified industry and attract timeshare owners outside of the forum community, you're going to have to accept the fact that the vast majority of individual sellers won't be educated about either what they actually own, or what the current market will allow for pricing. Errors and overpricing occur on EVERY by owner selling site!

You'll also have to accept the reality that your classified section (unless the price is significantly increased to make it economically unrealistic) will become another venue where the small marketing companies so often slapped in these threads- will place ads simply to add another piece of "we provide you with exposure on...." ammo that they use to secure clients.
 

m61376

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And since many of these company ads are placed to satisfy their contractual obligation for their upfront broker fee, they will list the units for whatever the uninformed seller wants. Telling a prospective seller that you'll never be able to sell a unit for the amount they want isn't good for business for companies that charge upfront fees, so they advertise for whatever the seller thinks the unit should go for, even if they've figured in real estate appreciation, etc., which we all know is unrealistic, rather than alienating sellers with realistic market figures.

It is the rare timeshare that sells at or above purchase price, although some good resale buys have and some early pre-construction purchases of at least some of the higher end units (Marriotts, for ex.) have sold for more than they were purchased initially from the developer- but those are the rarity and, with recent escalation of developer prices, may not be seen in the future.
 

JMAESD84

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Realistic advertising and price control for TUG

TUG is the first site dedicated to timeshare owners. Offering advise, forums & unlimited free classifieds.

Unlimited - as long as you don't exceed 25. No fine print..... just a completely inaccurate advertising claim. (As seen in the Mar/Apr, 2009 issue of TimeSharing Today).

This site exists to educate and help......

Perhaps then TUG should not facilitate by providing a venue for the fleecing of the uninformed buyer out there who may find within the TUG Marketplace a resale advertisement that is 3 to 100 times more than the realistic price for the timeshare unit selling on the resale auction market. Perhaps those advertisements that are so overpriced should be removed or otherwise prevented from appearing on TUG.

Shouldn't we be ashamed as TUG members if we advertised within the TUG Marketplace at $5000, a timeshare we purchased (or which could be purchased) off of eBay for $500, and found an uneducated buyer?

Should TUG members be called out on these forum threads by other TUG members when they are found to have place ads that would only result in sales to uninformed buyers?
 
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DaveNV

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I'd think a strong "caveat emptor" (buyer beware) common-sense approach should be used. If a potential buyer is shopping for a timeshare, finds the TUG classifieds, and even briefly browses the ads, they will quickly show the exhorbitant price to be the exception, rather than the rule. If that buyer then opts to pay that outrageous price, who is to blame for that? Certainly not TUG admins, who merely host those FREE ads.

People who foolishly pay too much for things are a dime a dozen. Ask my brother, who, despite my numerous attempts to educate him about how to buy a timeshare cheaply, insists on buying from developers because he "gets a better deal." Say WHAT??? All he does is throw money down the drain.

When we stayed at Hacienda Del Mar in Cabo at the same time, he and his wfe in the studio they bought there from the developer, and me in the MUCH NICER 1br I exchanged into through RCI, he got angry that the resort wouldn't upgrade him to a better unit like I had. "I'm an OWNER HERE!" he kept insisting. They told him he had the unit he owns, and that was that, even though he'd spent some $12K for his week. I, on the other hand, had a substantially nicer time in the unit I exchanged into, for a deposited week I'd bought on eBay for a few hundred dollars.

You can't stop people from buying things badly. TUG ads give me an idea of availability at certain resorts, and I use them as a launching pad to shop for a better deal. So far, eBay has served me well. Unfortunately, none of the TUG ads so far have been what I wanted, at a price I was willing to spend. but I'm glad they're there, if only to serve as a benchmark of what some people think their t/s is worth.

Dave
 

calgarygary

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TUG is the first site dedicated to timeshare owners. Offering advise, forums & unlimited free classifieds.

Unlimited - as long as you don't exceed 25. No fine print..... just a completely inaccurate advertising claim. (As seen in the Mar/Apr, 2009 issue of TimeSharing Today).

This site exists to educate and help......

Perhaps then TUG should not facilitate by providing a venue for the fleecing of the uninformed buyer out there who may find within the TUG Marketplace a resale advertisement that is 3 to 100 times more than the realistic price for the timeshare unit selling on the resale auction market. Perhaps those advertisements that are so overpriced should be removed or otherwise prevented from appearing on TUG.

Shouldn't we be ashamed as TUG members if we advertised within the TUG Marketplace at $5000, a timeshare we purchased (or which could be purchased) off of eBay for $500, and found an uneducated buyer?

Should TUG members be called out on these forum threads by other TUG members when they are found to have place ads that would only result in sales to uninformed buyers?

I believe a sticky thread to call out ads could be justified but holding TUG responsible for a misleading ad is not warranted. We do not hold newspapers responsible for the content of their ads, why would we hold TUG accountable?
 

aliikai2

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Huh??

TUG is the first site dedicated to timeshare owners. Offering advise, forums & unlimited free classifieds.



Perhaps then TUG should not facilitate by providing a venue for the fleecing of the uninformed buyer out there who may find within the TUG Marketplace a resale advertisement that is 3 to 100 times more than the realistic price for the timeshare unit selling on the resale auction market. Perhaps those advertisements that are so overpriced should be removed or otherwise prevented from appearing on TUG.
How do you plan to determine the true market value?:shrug:
Shouldn't we be ashamed as TUG members if we advertised within the TUG Marketplace at $5000, a timeshare we purchased (or which could be purchased) off of eBay for $500, and found an uneducated buyer?
There are many times one of us scores a deal on a purchase, are you saying we should sell it for what we paid?:confused:
Should TUG members be called out on these forum threads by other TUG members when they are found to have place ads that would only result in sales to uninformed buyers?

I guess if we were all here simply to educate the uninformed, maybe this would be acceptable.
I don't judge, many of us list items for more that a Tugger ( educated, thrifty, timeshare expert) would pay.

jmho,

Greg
 

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on the last note, if you feel strongly enough about it, why not contact the poster and inform him or her that their timeshare is priced unrealistically and it will never sell.

Given the number of ads posted on a daily basis, its simply not reasonable for us to "price check" each one before it goes online.
 

TUGBrian

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I went ahead and moved the offtopic discussion to its appropriate thread (in the about the rest of TUG forum discussing the marketplace itself) so this thread can continue on its original track.
 

JMAESD84

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How do you plan to determine the true market value?:shrug:

This obviously is not easy as values fluctuate. There is likely a reasonable market range price (low to high) for like timeshare units. Below "low" is where the "scores a deal" from your next statement falls, a true exception to the current market value. Above "high" is where a seasoned timeshare vet would say that advertised price is way too much for that property. A buyer doing any reasonable research on prices would find like units offered for much less.

Completed sales for resale markets fall within the range of (low to high) 90% of the time.

There are many times one of us scores a deal on a purchase, are you saying we should sell it for what we paid?:confused:

I'm saying that if a TUG member advertises it for sale on the TUG Marketplace that it should be advertised within the market value range as stated above. You will still profit from the "deal you scored" because you obtained the timeshare at a below market price. If you want to try to score another deal by advertising above the market "high" then this shouldn't be allowed within the TUG marketplace.

Do we really want buyers feeling like they've been taken advantage of by a seller on TUG, since all TUG ads are by members. I'm not saying that TUG needs to be the lowest price option, just some confidence that it's not completely unfair. Folks may be willing to pay a little more for the peace of mind that TUG sales are fair sales with less problems.

I guess if we were all here simply to educate the uninformed, maybe this would be acceptable.
I don't judge, many of us list items for more that a Tugger ( educated, thrifty, timeshare expert) would pay.

jmho,

Greg

Many TUG members are such experts with regards to specific resorts, timeshare systems and marketplaces that they can simply shop for best price and mitigate any risks involved. Other TUG members have a more casual relationship with the timeshare markets and may welcome a TUG marketplace where TUG members offer to sell from their own inventory of timeshares at monitored fair market prices.

Just a thought.
 

JMAESD84

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Rules for Buying, Selling & Renting Forum

This question always bugged me.

How come every time someone new comes to this forum with questions about selling or renting timeshares asking pricing information...yada yada yada we make them strip out infomation about the resort, week, unit, ala the details because it might look like an ad...... on a site that will let them list an ad for free?

It doesn't make sense to me. It prevents or limits the useful flow of pertenant information to the seller seeking it and would be a poor substitute for a well constructed ad placed for free in the TUG Marketplace.

I mean come on there's a difference right?

If NewJoeBlow posts a question about selling I know that he's thinking of selling. We can PM him if we want to know the details about what he's thinking about selling. Let this detailed dialog remain on the forum. More people will get educated by it and better TUG Marketplace ads will result.
 
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TUGBrian

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because its against the posting guidelines of the TUGBBS forums as posts like that are considered advertising. The forum guidelines exist for a reason, and its a good one. They exist due to past circumstances that required them to be created, and they are not flexible for these items. Besides, the actual resort itself does not change the concept of the resale market and the tremendous depreciation that all timeshares experience when bought new from a developer.

The advice given here always applies and leads members and guests alike down the proper path to get their timeshare sold properly (if not for far less money than the seller would have originally thought).

also note that not all TUGBBS members are TUG members, and vice versa. Id venture a very large % of people posting ads in the marketplace dont read or participate on the forums at all.

As mentioned previously, there is simply no way to fact check each and every ad (unless you guys feel the desire to do so on your own). On top of that who decides what is fair?

sure some of the ads are cut and dry in terms of listing an outrageous price, but not all are. Who decides which one is too high "enough" to be considered unreasonable.

what if that person is more than willing to sell it for a reasonable price, but lists it 5k above assuming he will get offers in the reasonable range?

There are so many different situations that come into play its not even funny.

Ive had email conversations with numerous members regarding their ad prices, some price ads too high just because they dont know any better (and havent read any of the advice articles), some because they simply dont believe what the resale market prices actually reflect, and others because its what "someone else told them".

Every single person that joins TUG is prompted to read the how to sell article at least twice prior to posting any ad. How to get an accurate resale price is one of the key subjects of that article.

Taking a proactive approach to "judging" particular classified ads falls into a grey area that i personally am not willing to dive into on an official basis.
 

T_R_Oglodyte

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This obviously is not easy as values fluctuate. There is likely a reasonable market range price (low to high) for like timeshare units. Below "low" is where the "scores a deal" from your next statement falls, a true exception to the current market value. Above "high" is where a seasoned timeshare vet would say that advertised price is way too much for that property. A buyer doing any reasonable research on prices would find like units offered for much less.

I'm saying that if a TUG member advertises it for sale on the TUG Marketplace that it should be advertised within the market value range as stated above. You will still profit from the "deal you scored" because you obtained the timeshare at a below market price. If you want to try to score another deal by advertising above the market "high" then this shouldn't be allowed within the TUG marketplace.

Do we really want buyers feeling like they've been taken advantage of by a seller on TUG, since all TUG ads are by members. I'm not saying that TUG needs to be the lowest price option, just some confidence that it's not completely unfair. Folks may be willing to pay a little more for the peace of mind that TUG sales are fair sales with less problems.

Many TUG members are such experts with regards to specific resorts, timeshare systems and marketplaces that they can simply shop for best price and mitigate any risks involved. Other TUG members have a more casual relationship with the timeshare markets and may welcome a TUG marketplace where TUG members offer to sell from their own inventory of timeshares at monitored fair market prices.

Just a thought.

I think your idea of providing some pricing guidelines to with the listings is wonderful!!! How long will it be before you have it set up and operating??
 

DeniseM

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It doesn't make sense to me. It prevents or limits the useful flow of pertenant information to the seller seeking it and would be a poor substitute for a well constructed ad placed for free in the TUG Marketplace.

If we allowed advertising in the forums, it would be a nightmare for the (all volunteer) moderators to ride herd on, and it would attract even more spammers to TUG... I also think it would be a major distraction from the discussions as people jockeyed to promote their own Ads and to respond to other people's Ads. I think things work the best when we keep discussions and advertising separate.
 
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JMAESD84

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If we allowed advertising in the forums, it would be a nightmare for the (all volunteer) moderators to ride herd on, and it would attract even more spammers to TUG... I also think it would be a major distraction from the discussions as people jockeyed to promote their own Ads and to respond to other people's Ads. I think things work the best when we keep discussions and advertising separate.

I can't disagree with what you have stated.

I wasn't recommending allowing advertising in the forums. If you see posts that are truely ads or "want to be ads" then delete the post. I can also see the need for strict rules regarding the inclusion of contact information.

If you see an OP bumping a thread like it's an ad then caution them that the thread will get deleted.

But, I've read many threads where knowing the what, where and when of the timeshare interest would greatly improve the usefulness of the forum thread. I can just envision a forum thread where over the course of the discussion involving many posts which contains the what, where and when details of what neads to be sold/rented/purchased along with responsive and detailed market comparisons, advertising locations and schemes, etc. that has a much greater value as a forum discussion than it does as an advertisement.

Perhaps I'm being naive about the implications regarding member type and beneifts (as Bill stated), and the difficulty it might create for the moderators.
 
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DeniseM

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When someone posts that they want to buy or sell and list all the details, people immediately starting posting offers to buy from, or sell to, them. You don't see that, because that's when the Mods step in and edit the details out of the original post and delete any offers.

In a perfect world, people would stay on topic and JUST discuss the poster's situation, but that's not what happens, because newbies, and one time visitors don't know the rules, so when they see a post about a timeshare they are interested in, they start posting offers. Those posts generate more sales offers, and pretty soon it's a mess, and the thread has gone off topic. Then the spammers see all the soliciting and they post their junk and it escalates. Honestly, it really doesn't work, because some people just can't resist the temptation to add solicitations to these kinds of posts...

HTH! :hi:
 

JMAESD84

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Perhaps those advertisements that are so overpriced should be removed or otherwise prevented from appearing on TUG.

Shouldn't we be ashamed as TUG members if we advertised within the TUG Marketplace at $5000, a timeshare we purchased (or which could be purchased) off of eBay for $500, and found an uneducated buyer?

Should TUG members be called out on these forum threads by other TUG members when they are found to have place ads that would only result in sales to uninformed buyers?

Out of curiousity, I sorted the For Sale ads by price. With most expensive at the top (very easy to do) and found that the 100 most expensive ads in the TUG marketplace range in price from ($23,500 - $110,000).

Now some no doubt would argue that there is a timeshare that is worth this type of price when sold at resale. Does ANYONE think that one of these "top 100" ads represents a good value for the buyer?

I'd love to know.

P.S. We even have a Westgate all the way up at #18. Tahiti Village made the list as well.
 
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bnoble

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I guess I'm wondering why we shouldn't just let "the market" tell a seller that they are pricing too high? After all, even though none of those may represent a value to me, they might to someone else, for a variety of reasons. Who's to say that they are wrong, and we are right?

If someone does find it to be a value, then the seller and buyer are both happy. If no one does, then either the seller needs to adjust their expectations, or the week will go unsold.
 

R&K

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I guess I'm wondering why we shouldn't just let "the market" tell a seller that they are pricing too high? After all, even though none of those may represent a value to me, they might to someone else, for a variety of reasons. Who's to say that they are wrong, and we are right?

If someone does find it to be a value, then the seller and buyer are both happy. If no one does, then either the seller needs to adjust their expectations, or the week will go unsold.

Well said. What gives us the right to dictate the value some one else might put on it?
 

JMAESD84

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I guess I'm wondering why we shouldn't just let "the market" tell a seller that they are pricing too high? After all, even though none of those may represent a value to me, they might to someone else, for a variety of reasons. Who's to say that they are wrong, and we are right?

If someone does find it to be a value, then the seller and buyer are both happy. If no one does, then either the seller needs to adjust their expectations, or the week will go unsold.

The question really is should TUG be a more trusted website for "fair" timeshare resales.

We members here on the message board may tell that happy buyer that he/she got taken. Suppose "happy buyer" posts that he bought that super timeshare at (Westgate or Tahiti example units I mentioned) and the folks here say gee that's a great place but you got screwed on the price. That same unit just sold for X dollars and two others are up for sale right now elsewhere at way better prices.

How helpful or hurtful was the selling TUG member to the buying timeshare owner?

What happens to TUG's reputation in this purchasers eyes or those of forum readers, when told they got screwed on price by a TUG member in the TUG marketplace?

Would it still be that familiar "thank god I found TUG when I did"?

:shrug: Is it just in OUR forums that we are here to help?

Would a warning work for any prospective buyer who wishes to respond to an advertiser.

WARNING: It is highly recommended buyers seek the opinions of TUG forum members on the fairness of any purchase for timeshares advertised within the TUG marketplace. We at TUG seek to promote a fair marketplace but unfortunately, do not have the resources to screen all the ads before they are posted. TUG forum members will offer helpful insights into the buying process and specific timeshare values, so that you will be able to make an informed and safer timeshare purchase.
 

R&K

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WARNING: It is highly recommended buyers seek the opinions of TUG forum members on the fairness of any purchase for timeshares advertised within the TUG marketplace. We at TUG seek to promote a fair marketplace but unfortunately, do not have the resources to screen all the ads before they are posted. TUG forum members will offer helpful insights into the buying process and specific timeshare values, so that you will be able to make an informed and safer timeshare purchase.

This might be a good idea to post at the top of the page but in the end it up to the seller and buyer what they want to pay. Not up to TUG.
 

bnoble

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The question really is should TUG be a more trusted website for "fair" timeshare resales.
That's a good question. But, as we've seen over and over, we can't even decide what's "fair" in various threads here quite often. Value is always in the eye of the beholder.
 
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