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Need help getting from London to Wales

timesharer

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We are planning our first trip to Wales, UK.

We plan to fly into London Heathrow Airport. Considering that we have to drive on the left side of the road and we will be suffering from jet lag and some degree of sleep deprivation, which of the following three options would you recommend:

(1) Pick up the rental car at the LHR airport and drive to Little Haven in Wales (If it is an easy drive from the LHR airport at London to Little Haven, Pembrokeshire in Wales which is about 233 miles from London.)

(2) Take the Metro/bus from LHR airport to a suburb city where we pick up the rental car and drive to Little Haven in Wales (That is, if it is difficult to get out of LHR airport in a rental car and London )?

(3) Take the train from LHR airport to Little Haven in Wales

If you recommend option 3, how far in advance should we buy the train tickets online or should we just buy the train tickets after we get to London? Do you know the website where we can make the train reservation online in advance?

Would you please also recommend a website to make UK rental car reservation?

Thanks in advance!
 

"Roger"

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I would choose (and did choose) option 1. Option 2 provides little advantage outside of leaving you more tired when you start off. It could end up even more confusing on how to get to the M road to Wales.

Make sure you have a GPS. Without that, take a train.

Getting out of the airport is not too bad. Make sure you fully familiarize yourself with the car before setting off. Lots of icons on the car that you might not have seen before. Driving on the left will be a breeze on the M road going to Wales. When you get close to Little Haven you will encounter some very narrow roads (with hedgerows on each side). That will be the bigger challenge if you haven't driven in Britain before.

Little Haven is a great town with some wonderful gastro pubs (or at least that was true about five or six years ago). Once there, however, you will want to have a car. Limited availability of groceries short of driving at least as far as Broad Haven, just over a very steep hill but on a very narrow road. (For a full fledged supermarket, you would have to drive even further.)

While there is a bus that goes up and down the coast (the Puffin express) if you want to explore elsewhere, you again will need a car. While Little Haven itself is absolutely delightful, it is ... little.

As is often the case with airports, getting back to the car rental facility can be more confusing than leaving. Again a GPS is essential.
 

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I have flown to London from the States over 100 times in the past 20 years and have lived in London for a few of those years. I am well accustomed to the traffic and public transport. Personally, I would never rent a car immediately after I landed at Heathrow to drive all the way to Wales. I would be tired and it would not be any fun, especially in the summer during peak hours when the traffic can be brutal. I doubt there are any trains from Heathrow to Wales so the fastest way would be to go into London on the Heathrow Express to take the train to Wales. I would suggest taking a nice bus from Heathrow to your destination. You would need to transfer to rail or a connecting bus to end at your destination but it is a much more civilized way to travel, in my opinion.
 

Ken555

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I had a great time in Wales a couple years ago. I arrived on a Sunday so my options for car rental locations open was severely limited. I took the train from London to Bristol, a quick bus from train station to airport and picked up a car, then drove into Wales. Since you're going to the south you could take a train further, to Cardiff, Swansea or even Little Haven and then pickup a car.

I think travel by train is far superior to driving wherever possible, but driving is definitely necessary within Wales to explore properly.

I'd suggest buying train tickets a couple of months in advance if possible, since they often have lower price tickets in advance, especially if you want first class (which is often not much more), etc.

I've rented from Europcar and Sixt in the U.K. There are many options, but just research exactly where you want to drop off the car to be sure your chosen vendor has a location there.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

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We support option 1. We spent a week in Little Haven a few years ago at Haven Court. We had a wonderful time. There are about 3 Bars and 2 Restaurants in Little Haven. We had spent the prior week up in North Wales. So our experience of Little Haven to LHR was the early morning drive from Little Haven to LHR to fly home. Unless things have changed drastically Little Haven does not have a grocery store. If I remember correctly it is about a 10 mile drive to the nearest large grocery store in Haverfordwest. The roads are so small around Little Haven we have a picture of me standing in the middle of the road and with my arms outstretched I can just about cover the road side to side. I am only 6 foot. Remember behind those colorful Hedges on the side of the roads are stone walls. If you have the opportunity you will want to visit Skomer, St. David's, etc. One of Patti's favorite Warning Signs before a sharp curve was a simple Exclamation Point. Have a great time.
 

sue1947

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The Pembrokeshire Coast trip is still one of my favorite trips. We flew into London and took a train. I remember being totally jet lagged and tired and generally in a fog that first day and was very glad I didn't have to drive. We based in St Davids and I remember the train got us close, but not quite there so we ended with a taxi ride the rest of the way. We were there to hike the coast trail and used the local bus to drop us off at one end and pick us up at another spot with a stop in a village for lunch along the way. That worked well for the week we were there except one day when I misread the bus schedule. There was a taxi number at the local pub and we called that and got a ride home with a local farmer/Welsh choir member who serenaded us; one of those could have been a disaster but turned into a highpoint moments.
We did fine without a car, but it would have been nice on several occasions and the train on the way out had some issues. We ended up having to go back into England and then out to N Wales so a car would have been much better. We should have rented a car in St David midway through the week. That would have given me time to get over the jet lag and familiar with the roads before dealing with driving on the left.

Sue
 

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It depends ... how many are you, what time of day are you arriving, will it be raining, has the driver driven on the left (and probably a stick shift) before, will you need the car in Wales, where would you return it, and how long are you staying there?

I'd research car rental prices at Heathrow and in Wales; I'll bet they're cheaper off-airport in Wales. If there are two of you, the train will be cheaper and easier. If there are more, the car might be cheaper. But for two, I'd take the train to Paddington and then the train to Wales. If you'll need a car, and depending on where you will return it, you might take the train only to Cardiff or Swansea, for example, and rent a car there.

If you're planning more than one train trip, consider a rail card -- it really helps keep the cost down. Note that for a Two Together card you can buy it at a station but you need a passport-size picture.

You can buy tickets online at any of the railway companies' websites; they all sell the same tickets at the same price. You pick the tickets up from a machine at the station, so you can buy your tickets from the US before you leave. Generally, like airlines, the earlier you but, the cheaper. There are lower prices after 9:30am. Standard class is comfortable; first class has three seats across instead of four.
 
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"Roger"

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I can see the attraction of a train/car rental option, just make sure to check as to what can be done in one day and what would involve an overnight stay (on one or both legs). For example, there might not be a train that gets you to Heathrow in time to catch your plane. Also, on the way to Little Haven, when you are not familiar with the local roads, you don't want to be driving after dark.

Remembering back now, it would have been hard for us to make the trip back to Heathrow from Little Haven and be in time for our plane (unless we wanted to start off at something like three in the morning). It worked out well for us in that one thing we wanted to do in Wales is hear a concert by an all male choir. (Wales has a long history of the coal miners forming all male choirs.) The best of these choirs is the Morriston Orpheus choir and they were giving a concert in Swansea the Saturday we were deserting our timeshare. So we drove to Swansea, went to the concert and finished our trip to Heathrow the next morning..

As far as why you would want a car in Little Haven, the photo below is of downtown Little Haven. (I mean it. That is the center of town.) It is an absolutely delightful place to stay, but limited in what you can do. Eating out is fine. Even though Broad Haven is considerably bigger, our experience was that the pubs and restaurants in Little Haven were far superior. On the other hand, you have to go to Broad Haven to buy groceries. (It has a fairly small store, but that store does have everything that you need unless you are thinking of doing some exotic cooking.)

a - Little Haven 1.JPG


Two final notes. Even if you have a car, consider just taking the bus that goes along the coast to St. David. Takes some of the stress out of your visit. Also, if you are at all a hiker, take the same bus south and walk back along the coastal path (about six miles). Just gorgeous. There are directions in the timeshare lobby on exactly where to get off the bus for the hike back.

Day 5 - Coastal Path 6.JPG
 

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Thank you all very much for your helpful advice! We really appreciate your input. Another idea we had was to fly directly into the Cardiff airport in Wales.
The 1-stop flight arrives at 4:45PM on Sat. After we pick up the car, it may be past 6PM

Is it an easy 2 hours drive from the Cardiff airport to the resort in Little Haven (about 100 miles)? We will most likely get to the resort after dark.

Alternatively, we can fly into the Bristol airport. This 1-stop flight arrives at 1:10PM on Sat. Is it an easy 2.5 hours drive from the Bristol airport to the resort in Little Haven (about 140 miles)?

How would you compare the above 2 options with flying into the London Heathrow Airport and take the train + bus/taxi to the resort?
The rental car offices in the city center location or near the rail station are closed from 12PM on Sat and we will not be able to pick up a car until Monday.

We still need to depart from the London Heathrow Airport to fly back home, because the only flight leaves from Cardiff too early (e.g. 6AM)
Surprisingly, the airfare is not much higher if we leave from a different airport.
 
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Ken555

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How would you compare the above 2 options with flying into the London Heathrow Airport and take the train + bus/taxi to the resort?

If the total travel time is similar, I like the train since it offers a different experience. Of course, I'm partial to trains whenever possible. As for driving, since this sounds like the day you arrive to the UK, just be sure you are rested sufficiently to drive without issue. This might be another reason to consider flying or taking the train as close as possible and limiting your drive time.

The rental car offices in the city center location or near the rail station are closed from 12PM on Sat and we will not be able to pick up a car until Monday.

This is why I elected to pick up a car at the Bristol airport location, which was open on Sunday.

We still need to depart from the London Heathrow Airport to fly back home, because the only flight leaving from Cardiff too early (e.g. 6AM)
Surprisingly, the airfare is not much higher if we leave from a different airport.

Depending on your flight time, you could have a nice leisurely drive back to London. It's a bit out of your way, but you could even stop in Oxford or another good walking town for lunch, etc.
 

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Another option is to fly in a day early, rent a car at Heathrow, and overnight somewhere relatively close that you've always wanted to see. We once did that on a trip to Cornwall. We picked up the car and drove about an hour to Winchester to a b&b (I believe we pulled off the road for a short nap on the way!), and got to see Stonehenge since it's very close, as well as Winchester Cathedral.

We even booked tickets in advance for after-hours at Stonehenge where we got to go inside the circle - there are limited tickets for this, after-hours or very early morning, so an overnight nearby is almost a pre-requisite. Tickets here: http://www.english-heritage.org.uk/...e/plan-your-visit/stone-circle-access-visits/

I almost always use AutoEurope for our rental car, since they're in the US, usually have excellent customer service, and often will price-match if you find something cheaper. They're an agent, so your car will be from EuropCar or some other rental car company, which you'll see on the reservation.

I wouldn't recommend driving after dark on your first approach to the resort, and especially if it's your first time driving on the left hand side of the road.
 

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If I remember correctly the Office at Haven Court Timeshare closes about 7pm or earlier. We barely made it when we drove from Dyserth Falls. We stopped and toured too many places during our drive. So you had better check into this issue. What time does your flight arrive at Heathrow?
 
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Cardiff or Bristol are both good choices. Driving wise there's little between them as both will use the M4 which would be beneficial if it's your first time driving in the UK so it's really down to convenience of other factors such as car hire, prices etc.

I agree with Laurie regarding fitting in an overnight stay somewhere prior to departing from Heathrow, particularly the recommendation for Winchester.
 

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If I remember correctly the Office at Haven Court Timeshare closes about 7pm or earlier. We barely made it when we drove from Dyserth Falls. We stopped and toured too many places during our drive. So you had better check into this issue. What time does your flight arrive at Heathrow?

Thank you for your help!

I just found out the WOW ( Iceland) 1-stop flight arrives at the Gatwick Airport (LGW) around 8PM on Fri. The fare is $200-$300 per person lower than the other airline flights arriving on Sat at the Heathrow Airport.

Is it safe to take train/bus at night in London?

According to Google map, taking the bus requires fewer transfers than riding the train.Do we need to buy the bus ticket in advance like the airline/train tickets? (That is, if we book ahead of time, is the fare significantly cheaper?)

Where would you recommend that we stay overnight? Any recommendations on how to book the hotel/b&b?
 
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Where are you planning on staying the first night? You mention that Google states fewer transfers for the bus than train but where is the destination? What about staying at a hotel at the airport for the night and then picking up the car/train from there in the morning?
 

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Where would you recommend that we stay overnight? Any recommendations on how to book the hotel/b&b?

Try googling "b&b gatwick shuttle" if you don't want to drive on arrival. I just came up with this at the top of a search, for instance, and there are many more google words and search results: http://cumberlandhousegatwick.com/
 

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What is a typical time to clear customs and immigration after a flight to London? Should we allow at least 2 hours?

We had a memorable experience taking a night train in Germany many years ago. The chairs reclined very far and we were able to sleep fairly well. We are considering taking the train from the Gatwick Airport (LGW) at night to Haverfordwest, and picking up a rental car there Sat. morning. Haverfordwest is only 8 miles from the resort. Is it safe to take the train/bus there at night? If not, we can spend the first night at a hotel/b&b near the airport, but then we will have to get up early in the morning to take the train/bus to Bristol/Cardiff to pick up a car and drive about 3 hours to the resort.
 
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What is a typical time to clear customs and immigration after a flight to London? Should we allow at least 2 hours?

We had a memorable experience taking a night train in Germany many years ago. The chairs reclined very far and we were able to sleep fairly well. We are considering taking the train from the Gatwick Airport (LGW) at night to Haverfordwest, and picking up a rental car there Sat. morning. Haverfordwest is only 8 miles from the resort. Is it safe to take the train/bus there at night? If not, we can spend the first night at a hotel/b&b near the airport, but then we will have to get up early in the morning to take the train/bus to Bristol/Cardiff to pick up a car and drive about 3 hours to the resort.

There isn't really a night service per se to Haverfordwest. All options include several changes of trains and at least one wait of several hours in the early morning before service resumes to Haverfordwest. I wouldn't enjoy the journey at the best of times let alone after a transatlantic flight. The trains you'll be taking do not have reclining chairs, to try and sleep on one would be very uncomfortable.

You haven't stated what time you'll be arriving, I could probably provide more advice knowing this.

The time to clear customs depends on a number of things, predominantly number of flights landing around the same time as yours and the nationalities of the majority of those passengers. Gatwick is mainly served by holiday charter flights and many passengers will be British or EU citizens. Theoretically the line for non EU passengers is likely to be shorter than the EU one. On average, I've never waited longer than 20 minutes at Gatwick but equally I'm not subjected to the longer questioning. I would suggest that it would be unlikely to take more than an hour.
 
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It's only a 5-hr drive from Gatwick to Little Haven, vs. a 2-hr to 3-hr drive from Cardiff or Bristol to Little Haven. Easily done in a day, and you can sight-see on the way if you choose. (As mentioned: Oxford, Stonehenge, Winchester - then there's Avebury (very cool!), Bath, and/or at least some pretty scenery.)

I would avoid the extra hassle of the cost and schedule-timing of an additional public transportation connection - especially given the possibility of flight delays, not to mention the stress and the exhaustion after an evening arrival - whew! I would just plan to pick up our own wheels at our leisure, and after a good night's sleep.

But we each have our own personal senses of ease and adventure.
 

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Thank you for all the helpful advice you've provided already. I did not state what time we will be arriving at London because we have not purchased our airline tickets yet.

I am still trying to check everything (flight & train/bus arrival/departure time, rental car office hours, etc.) to get it properly coordinated.
The train/bus schedule in June/July is not available yet. Does anyone know how far in advance these are made available?
Can we assume the June/July schedule is the same as the April schedule?

Is it difficult to drive out of the Gatwick Airport (LGW) or the Heathrow Airport (LHR) to get on the freeway? How would you compare navigating from LGW/LHR to the freeway relative to Charles De Gaulle in Paris getting to the freeway? We have never driven on the left side of the road though.
 

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It is not difficult to get to the Freeways (M roads) from Heathrow. Driving on the Left is not as diffcult as people think. I just think before I enter the Roadway from a Parking Lot to make sure I get in the correct lane at the start. Then everything seems to follow. You do have to get use to Roundabouts (Traffic Circles). The nice thing about Roundabouts is that if you miss the correct Exit just go around again. Patti is the Navigator. As we approach a Roundabout she tells me the correct Exit by using the Clock method ie 9 O'clock means I take the first Exit, 12 O'clock means go straight through, and 3 O'clock means I take the 3rd Exit. Sometimes there are more exits or they slant off so Patti adjusts the time ie 11 O'clock or 1 O'clock. Also remember the vehicle enterring the Roundabout yields to vehicles in the Roundabout.
 
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Heathrow would probably be the better option if you intend on driving to Wales as you can get on the M4 direct and pootle along to your hearts content for the 180 miles before it ends in Wales. The M4 is a relatively easy drive and it will give you the opportunity to familiarise yourself with the car. The vast majority of people adhere to the lane rules, overtaking only on the right, which means if you want to take it easy you can stick to the left hand lane and not feel under pressure.

Gatwick involves the more arduous task of driving up the horrendous M25 towards Heathrow to get onto the M4. The M25 would not be my choice of first road to drive on when landing in the UK.

Whichever airport you opt for it is easy to get onto the motorways, they're clearly signposted and you'll have to try really hard to get it wrong.

Bear in mind if taking the M4 into Wales you will cross the Severn Bridge which has a toll currently set at £6.70. The toll only applies when entering Wales, it's free to return to England.
 

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Long post about driving to and around Wales ...

We are back to your first post. It really is not that bad connecting to the M roads from Heathrow. (M roads are the British equivalent to our Interstates.) There is an oval road that circles around Heathrow and you connect to the M4 from there. How far you need to drive on the oval road depends upon which car rental you hire from. The M roads have wide lanes and are very easy to drive. (A little harder close to Heathrow only because of heavier traffic.)

Pay attention to what Pompey Family said about proper etiquette on the M roads. In America, when you have three lanes going in a single direction, cars travelling at a moderate speed will often take the center lane allowing cars to pass on the left or the right. In Britain, you take the far outside lane (the left in Britain) and only go to the center or the far inside lane in order to pass slower traffic.

The bottom line is that getting from Heathrow to Wales on an M road will be easy even when you are unfamiliar with a car with the steering wheel on the right side of the car.

Once you get off the M road (you are well into Wales now), things get a bit more complicated. Overall, driving of the left is not that complicated in that you the driver will be sitting on the side of the car that is toward the center of the road (and the center strip if you are lucky enough to have one). The main time that you have to worry about getting confused is when you first pull out of a parking lot onto the road. A little caution and that is not too much of a problem.

Personally, I love the roundabouts and am glad to see them being introduced into my home state. As geist notes, just remember that cars on the roundabout have the ride away. With a GPS, it will tell you whether to take the first, second, third, etc. exit as you approach the roundabout. At that point, my wife counts "one, two, now off ..." if for example I need to take the third exit. Also, some of the busier roundabouts have two lanes. The British consider it bad form to take the outside lane if you are going three quarters the way around the roundabout. But what goes with that, is that you are to yield to anyone moving from an inside lane to the outside in preparation for exiting.

The difficult part for your trip is that you are eventually going to encounter some very narrow roads as you near Little Haven (or drive around Wales at all). The danger is that as a car or lorry approaches you from the other direction, you are used to leaving a certain amount of space between you and the oncoming traffic. If you leave that amount of space on the country roads in Wales or England, you will be scraping the passenger side of thecar against a hedgerow, a rock, a wall, or parked cars in a village. You have to hug the center line to a much greater degree than what will be instinctive to you. (I am not exaggerating this. On one trip, my wife and I thought we would leave most of the driving to someone who loves to drive in America. After several screaming episodes as he would pull to the left away from the oncoming traffic, we essentially took his keys away for the sake of safety.)

The bottom line is that we are used to having very wide roads in America even in the country. That has made Americans sloppy drivers. The British and Welsh are used to driving at fairly high speeds with a great deal more precision. (Quick story - Talking to a bar maid in a pub, she said that when she took her drivers test in Wales, it was an hour and a half grueling experience. She then traveled to America for a year and was dreading the driver's test in that she was not used to driving on the right side of the road. As it turned out, her driver's test in America lasted less than five minutes and she never had to leave a parking lot.)

Be aware that outside of the M roads and some A roads, most roads are not lettered or numbered. Without numbering or street names, the only identification for roads are signs at intersections indicating the next town. A GPS is all but essential.

I don't remember too many encounters on two way roads that are only wide enough for a single car in Wales. (Wales is not the worst place to drive in the UK. Some of the roads in Devon and Cornwall can be a different experience.) What happens with regard to one lane, two way roads is that if you meet an oncoming car, one of you has to pull over into one of the niches that appear periodically in order to let the other car pass. It would not be that unusual for the car that passes to have perhaps only about nine to twelve inches on each side of the car as he or she passes by.

The road directly between Little Haven and Broad Haven which goes over a ridge is one that can get fairly narrow. The worst spot is as you drive into Little Haven itself as you are on a steep downhill with cars parked on the side so that there is only a single lane. Meeting an oncoming uphill car is not a pleasant affair. If it freaks you out too much, you can avoid the whole experience by taking two sides of a triangle and a longer route between the two towns.

Finally, I don't know how old you are, but when you make arrangements to rent a car, ask if they have any age restrictions for foreigners. Some car rental companies will not rent to anyone over seventy. (Used to be sixty-five.)
 
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