MFs - Bella vs. Key West

[GregT]

All,

I queried the database, but the Key West data isn't that recent. I was curious what the 1BR MFs compared for Key West versus Bella -- I own several of the smaller 1BR Bella and trying to figure out if Key West is basically the same.

Any intangible issues between the different phases?

Thank you!

Greg

 

[dioxide45]

All,

I queried the database, but the Key West data isn't that recent. I was curious what the 1BR MFs compared for Key West versus Bella -- I own several of the smaller 1BR Bella and trying to figure out if Key West is basically the same.

Any intangible issues between the different phases?

Thank you!

Greg

Greg, Our 1BR Prime EOY week at Key West has a 2017 MF of $298.59 (without the VSN fee). This is probably a little higher than High season given that the tax amounts will be different for different seasons at Florida properties.

BTW, I entered data for the 1BR EOY week back through 2015. The only issue is that this won't be the same for those that own High season and the database doesn't have the ability to capture season.

 

[pathways25]

All,

I queried the database, but the Key West data isn't that recent. I was curious what the 1BR MFs compared for Key West versus Bella -- I own several of the smaller 1BR Bella and trying to figure out if Key West is basically the same.

Any intangible issues between the different phases?

Thank you!

Greg

Bella 1BR is $476.57 + $109.21 tax = $585.78.

Key West 1BR is $481.52 + $115.65 tax = $597.17.

Pretty much the same...

 

[dioxide45]

Bella 1BR is $476.57 + $109.21 tax = $585.78.

Key West 1BR is $481.52 + $115.65 tax = $597.17.

Pretty much the same...

Are both of these Prime season?

 

[pathways25]

Are both of these Prime season?

My weeks are all Prime season weeks, but the fees are the same regardless of what season your week is in.

 

[dioxide45]

My weeks are all Prime season weeks, but the fees are the same regardless of what season your week is in.

I don't think that is correct. It certainly isn't for Marriott weeks and I think it is based on Florida law. Florida properties bill taxes differently depending on the season with higher seasons paying a slightly higher tax.

 

[pathways25]

I don't think that is correct. It certainly isn't for Marriott weeks and I think it is based on Florida law. Florida properties bill taxes differently depending on the season with higher seasons paying a slightly higher tax.

Hmm. In that case, I don't know what the taxes are for a High Season 1BR. I always wondered why the taxes don't show up on the budget documents that they attach to the maintenance fee bills.

 

[dioxide45]

Hmm. In that case, I don't know what the taxes are for a High Season 1BR. I always wondered why the taxes don't show up on the budget documents that they attach to the maintenance fee bills.

I was wondering the same thing. I even sent an email to the HOA documents mailbox asking about these details for our Bella week. They haven't replied and it has been well over a month since I emailed them. I guess they don't monitor that mailbox. For all of our Florida weeks, the tax amounts are clearly listed on the annual budget showing the different tax amounts for the High and Prime season weeks.

 

[LisaRex]

I don't think that is correct. It certainly isn't for Marriott weeks and I think it is based on Florida law. Florida properties bill taxes differently depending on the season with higher seasons paying a slightly higher tax.

SVN/VSE calculates MFs based on square footage for deeded owners, so all 2 bdrm owners (of equal size) pay the same MFs regardless of season. That is why corner (deluxe) 2 bdrm owners at WKORV pay more than regular 2 bdrm owners and why WSJ 2 bdrm loft owners pay more than non-loft 2 bdrm owners. It's all based on square footage. (I think that the consumer protection law that you are referring to actually dictates that HOAs cannot charge high season owners more in MFs than low season owners. After all, MFs are supposed to go towards maintaining the place and a high season owner isn't using the bed more or dinging the walls more. So billing them more just because the weather is nicer is unjust.)

That being said, developers have learned to get around the law by creating "points" systems instead of deeded ownership. They charge x dollars in MFs per point owned, which seems fair at first blush. However, since it costs more points to book in high season than in low season, high season owners end up subsidizing low season owners.

 

[LisaRex]

BTW, if you want to know MFs, resale ads are a good place to look because they'll usually list the MFs on the first page of the ad. Tug, Redweek, SellMyTimeshareNow and MyResortNetwork are good places to look because they usually have a decent selection. You can't just rely on one or two ads because some owners are clearly guessing.

 

[dioxide45]

SVN/VSE calculates MFs based on square footage for deeded owners, so all 2 bdrm owners (of equal size) pay the same MFs regardless of season. That is why corner (deluxe) 2 bdrm owners at WKORV pay more than regular 2 bdrm owners and why WSJ 2 bdrm loft owners pay more than non-loft 2 bdrm owners. It's all based on square footage. (I think that the consumer protection law that you are referring to actually dictates that HOAs cannot charge high season owners more in MFs than low season owners. After all, MFs are supposed to go towards maintaining the place and a high season owner isn't using the bed more or dinging the walls more. So billing them more just because the weather is nicer is unjust.).

This is true for the operating and reserve fee portion of the MFs for Florida properties. It isn't however so for property tax. It seems odd, but there an elusive statute where taxes are billed somehow on the value of the underlying unit. I don't know for certain, because I can't find any specific statute, but there is something in this.

(3) The property appraiser shall annually notify the managing entity of the proportions to be used in allocating the valuation, taxes, and special assessments on timeshare property among the various timeshare periods. Such notice shall be provided on or before the mailing of notices pursuant to s. 194.011. Ad valorem taxes and special assessments shall be allocated by the managing entity based upon the proportions provided by the property appraiser pursuant to this subsection.

Bold formatting is mine.

I take that those proportions are the percentage allocation based on the timeshare periods (season). I could be wrong. However, both of our Orlando Marriott Properties; Harbour Lake and Grande Vista have different tax amounts billed depending on if you own Gold or Platinum season.

Here is the difference between the two bills;

2BR Grande Vista Gold
2017 Florida Club Fee: $45.11
2017 Property Tax Fee: $159.17
2017 Replacement Reserve: $317.09
2017 Operating Fee: $755.91
2017 Total: $1,277.28

2BR Grande Vista Platinum
2017 Florida Club Fee: $45.11
2017 Property Tax Fee: $186.22
2017 Replacement Reserve: $317.09
2017 Operating Fee: $755.91
2017 Total: $1304.33

I don't see Marriott doing this if there wasn't some type of requirements to do so. For whatever reason, the Vistana bill and annual budget do not show the tax amounts, I have asked the Bella HOA about this, but they have yet to reply.

I can see where the difference makes sense. It is true that a high season owner is using the same number of beds and square footage as a prime season owner, however, if taxes are based on valuation of some sort, then a high season won't have as much value as prime

Does anyone own a 1BR SVV Bella or Key West Gold/High season week that could provide their 2017 annual MF?