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[ 2012 ] Fairmont / Sunchaser / Northwynd official thread with lawsuit info!

Discussion in 'Canada Timesharing' started by htusa2002, Nov 22, 2012.

  1. Spark1

    Spark1 Guest

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  2. Spark1

    Spark1 Guest

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    I never asked Northwynd to take over the Resort nor did i sign any documents with these F*cking assholes. This was not like new owners from China that took over this resort. They were the bond holders that invested in this and lost a lot of money and this was a golden opportunity to nail the timeshare owners to the wall. This makes me wonder who else were the bond holders. I signed documents with Collin Knight and Marilyn not these crooks and i do not pay any one without my signature. Collin Knight went bankrupted therefore the paper work that we signed is toast plain and simple.
     
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  3. Just Looking Around

    Just Looking Around Guest

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    I am not part of the litigation group. I don't get any of the correspondence from their legal counsel. I would have gladly joined but by the time my wife and I were aware of it, it was too late. We have paid everything that was owed so, at the end of 2016, we were current with all of our obligations to Northmont.

    I will not pay them another dime.

    I will not pay them another dime regardless of the recent decision by the BC Court of Appeal.

    I know well the difficulties of winning a case, any case, in court. This case is complex and nuanced. Despite all of the corporate entities involved before Northmont, we are still dealing with the same people. They never formed an 'Owners' Association as was both promised and as I read it, required by law. (Right, they took a survey no one remembers and everyone was fine with the fox in the hen house, the hand in the cookie jar, the smile of the crocodile. "FAKE NEWS" people!) Look at the Property. Just look at the Property. Posters on here, like Real World, xplor, and owner1, can offer "Alternative Facts" in defense of Northmont all they want. They can even write grandiose reviews of the Resort, here and elsewhere. What they cannot do is convince me that my own eyes are deceiving me. Look at the Property; it is a disgrace, an unmaintained complex of uninhabitable monuments to incompetence, corruption, and greed. It has no future.

    It is all on them. They failed to engage leaseholders in any real way to contribute to the Property, as would have been done if an 'Owners Association' had been formed and involved.

    The Management has not prudently managed the facility, nor has the Management maintained the facility in anything resembling a workman-like condition for a vacation property.

    No, I am not paying them a dime. I will take up the fight in any way I can. I'll send a cheque to Geldert and gladly make-up any payments I have missed. The greatest strength the leaseholders have, the only strength they have, in fighting Northmont is staying in the fight and sticking together. We cannot afford to quit now. They are stealing our money and the future of timesharing in Canada.
     
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  4. Anxiety123

    Anxiety123 Guest

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    Well...in the end, we lose and will be paying big bucks now to get out. Northwynd wins and even Jim Belfry wins as he will never have to pay his share of all this mess. This is much sour grapes but maybe we all should have taken the way of the owners that lined up and paid to get out in the beginning and not be now paying 4 to 5 times the initial amount. I had others tell us in the beginning
    that the contract was binding and legal and we didn't listen but we did follow like sheep a man that will never have to pay Northwynd ever, nice to be him. Boo Hoo for us.
     
  5. Spark1

    Spark1 Guest

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    Judges make mistakes, look what Justice loo did which created 43% of the timeshare owners to cancel giving Northwynd over 10 million dollars. Was it right for Northwynd to carry on charging over 26% interest for this time from Justice Loo's case up to the Appeal which we won. This 26% is criminal. Do you believe if this is legal what Northmont is doing why did Collin Knight not do the same thing, He did not because he knows that the old agreements did not include capital expenses like leaking plumbing pipes in walls that should of been covered by warranty and main building beams. These agreements are not designed to replace the hole resort. This needs to be challenged in the Supreme Court of Canada. Are the politicians and the Judges in BC pushing hard to rebuild this resort at our expense because it was the largest business in Fairmont? Every one keep your money these guys are crooks and wait to see what our lawyer suggests.
     
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  6. GypsyOne

    GypsyOne Guest

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    When 14,500 timeshare purchasers did not think for a moment they were responsible for reconstructing faultily constructed buildings; when the original developer, Fairmont Resort Properties thought the same thing but chose to declare bankruptcy rather than hit up the timeshare users for capital costs; but the new owners who were not party to the original contracts can modify and re-interpret the leases, and the B.C. judges side with the new owners that keeps a major B.C. tourist attraction from failing, then a legal degree or background is not needed to suspect something is not right. Moving forward we need to come to grips with what we’re up against. Justice in B.C. seems not possible. The Supreme Court of Canada or civil disobedience (just not pay) are starting to look like reasonable choices.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2017
  7. Punter

    Punter TUG Member

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    Paying money to Northmont at this point makes absolutely no sense. The fate of the resort is sealed and I have no intention of lining their pockets any further.

    Stay the course and stick together.
     
  8. pdoff

    pdoff Guest

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    I will wait and see what the latest offer is - but I agree no more money for these people.
    I wonder again if an Investigation programme would be interested in this mess. (ie: Go Public, Fifth Estate etc.).
    There are so many unanswered questions from the start. Where did our maintenance fees go as the resort was running down? Were they used to invest in the many Resorts in other countries that all went broke? When Fairmont went bankrupt - did the same owners come back under another name?
    We had no idea that Fairmont went bankrupt until Northwynd came up with their crappy pay to stay or go proposal.
    We know that they left a wake of Time Share people who lost their investments as Fairmont walked away from their resorts in Mexico, Arizona, Hawaii and Costa Rica. Rafter Six Ranch was also a casualty thanks to these people.
     
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  9. servemeout

    servemeout Guest

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    Article 13 of our lease states the our VIA would be repurchased for 50% of 1/40 of the purchase price x the number of years remaining on the lease. So I did some calculation on what Northmont owes us.
    $5457.12 for the 24 years remaining in our lease that we will not be able to use, as we will not pay the reno fee. Now lets add another $250.00 per year for the time remaining, which is $6,000. This amount is probably grossly under estimated. We owe then fees of $2,971.97 for 2014 - 2016. Northmont please pay us $8485.15 that you owe us. This amount is taking what you say we owe vs what I say you owe us according to our contract. It is time that the gougees become the gougers. We will forgive the 26% interest rate on this amount. Please remit within 30 days. Northmont have stated that they do not have to honor article 13 of our contract. Wait, when did the law state that only SOME of the articles in a contract have to be honored. We looked at the MF for 2017. At that rate, nightly cost to stay, based on 7 night is $158.43 per night. Just Looking Around is correct, this is no longer a Resort. The 32% that paid to remain with the SVV will probably lose more that the delinquent group, as we refused to pay the ransom. Being a person that bets on the horses on occasion, odds of the resort do not look good. I would not give even odds of 1:1 of SVV still being around for much longer. Of the millions of dollars that they have fleeced from the time share lessees, what has been renovated? The answer here is "not much", but the reno fee was for all of the resort to be done. We have friends that owned in Belize. When Northmont moved in, they were offered a VIA at Lake Okanagan. They stated that LOR was a dump and left after one night at that resort. Northmont sold the property at LOR, but they retained the timeshare interests. So, to draw an analogy here, if the pipes break in the walls at LOR, who is responsible? The timeshare owners or the property owners. I would bet that Northmont would tell the new owners of the property from China, that 'that is your problem, not mine.' So who owns SVV? Has anyone seen their name on an ownership deed? The justice system let us down. Is Northmont is hurting for cash? Wouldn't be a shame if Wankel had to take a pay cut? The irony of the situation is that the three years of litigation that Northmont started may be their death knell, and the only tears we will shed will be crocodile tears. Waiting to hear the bells toll. Yes, the fate of the resort is sealed.
     
  10. Scammed22

    Scammed22 Guest

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    Northmont owe's us 17 years that we still had left in our now dilapidated resort...that we will never get back. How does one put a price tag on that? They have taken our dignity of the proud owners we were, and of a once beautiful resort that we (ALL) the time share owners made beautiful with our maintenance fees. They stole our money lining their pockets. They came in with one intention and only one intention to destroy the resort and rip all of us off. Their only interest is making themselves rich and slowly boarding up Fairmont so it will look like the other ghost town timeshare resorts they cleaned out and left behind. When they moved in it was in the best interest for them the delinquent management team... Northmont not our resort! I VOTE YOUR FIRED! I agree with pdoff The Fifth Estate is the next step, and then back to court. They will get NO MONEY FROM US. I don't care what they come back with... unless of course their reimbursing me for the money I paid to have a beautiful resort to enjoy for 17 more years! They owe each, and every timeshare owner for being delinquent thieves stealing the maintenance fees and ruining our resort, and our lives. You don't have to go to law school to become a judge and figure this out. It's common sense. I'll say it again KARMA'S A BIT$H!!! It's not over!
     
  11. Real World

    Real World Guest

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    Just Looking Around this is hilarious.......would you like to provide some quotes that have "alternative facts" in them to support
    Just Looking Around this is hilarious.......would you like to provide some posts/quotes that have "alternative facts" in them to support your claims?

    I bet a lot of people would like to see them.
     
  12. Punter

    Punter TUG Member

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    Nope. We're good.
     
  13. Scammed22

    Scammed22 Guest

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    I'd be more than happy to send you everything I had......but like my maintenance fees I paid...I have no idea where they went! :shrug:
     
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  14. Spark1

    Spark1 Guest

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    How many timeshare owners value their vacation villa lease? Our lease agreement was signed October 9/2001. I have not received from FRPL any changes to this agreement. I have not received any changes from Northmont. If they did do any changes they had to follow item number 39 on our agreement. There is nothing in item number 39 allowing the owners of the resort to be able to do this Freedom to Choose. Freedom to choose goes against item numbers 9,10,13 and item 39 of our VACATION VILLA LEASE. This is why we hired Geldert Law. Northwynd won big time when Justice Loo ruled on a special case when she should not of. Because of this 43% of the the time owners that were part of the litigation cancelled. This is what Northmont wanted all along, they wished we would of all cancelled. That hurt us loosing that many to fight this case because we would of had lower lawyer fees. Every one should read item numbers 9 and 10 over and over. You do not have to be a judge or lawyer to understand that these two items pertain to MAINTENANCE FEES. The manager uses these two items to figure out around Nov 15 of each year what they need to charge time owners per week to cover expenses for the new year. There is nothing in these two items giving Northmont the right to charge us a huge assessment and a huge cancellation fee. When the judges made this decision allowing Northmont to do this we no longer have vacation villa leases.This means they can do what ever they want and you will pay. What the Judges decided there is no difference between the Legacy For Life and our old LEASE AGREEMENTS. The Supreme Court in BC had no right to allow this and allow Northmont to change the meaning of item numbers 9 and 10. They got to hung up about CAPITAL EXPENSES.All Northmont had to do is carry on using items 9 and 10 for maintenance fees and if they had to charge a extra 100.00 dollars so what. The resort would still be running and 43% would still be there using the resort and paying fees. Who in their right mind would want to be owners in this resort and if you do have your credit card handy. The only thing that i will agree with now is we will pay nothing and we will be compensated for the years lost with our timeshare. Ask this Question when the Judge in Alberta allowed Northmont to take over the resort, part of the deal was Northmont was responsible for CAPITAL EXPENSES for the 7000 building. This also means any agreements that we sign and witnesses like banks real estate, businesses. can be changed buy the supreme courts. This is not a communist country and we can not allow this.
     
  15. Hotpink

    Hotpink Guest

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    It appears or at least smells as if Northmont is going to try an end run play or something even dodgier at least in my opinion. Remember the "NEW SUNCHASER way back when. Kirk is going to take us out of the traditional time share model( their words not mine). Considering everything that has transpired since then we definitely are no longer in the traditional time share model. In April of 2016 if I read it correctly all contracts ( regardless of vintage) were rewritten unilaterally to give Northmont complete control and unlimited monetary squeeze power over all classes of owner. The renovation fee was supposedly for the whole resort yet we see the have approached the East Kootenay Regional District to rezone the resort and take at least 5 of the 8 Hillside buildings out of the resort (I'm unsure of exactly they want to do with them) and thus our resort will be shrunk by at least one third. The Riverview building is apparently under a different Stata Act and that may prove even more interesting when northmont enacts another executive order extort money from those that paid to stay and the delinquents. Hope those that paid to leave have a PAID IN FULL document properly certified so that they are of the hook. Now that the Appeal has been lost they can go back to the EKRD to have the rezoning heard. If I was a home owner on the west side of the highway I would be quite concerned. Since the appeal results being released Northmont has been very strangely quiet ( very unlike their past practices) I think northmont may try and get more money out of the delinquents and whomever else they can browbeat.
    I have been unable to ascertain what actions if any will be taken in the Alberta Civil courts regarding collections since actions were delayed last Sept until after the BC appeal. Again strangely quiet
    Not sure what will happen in the very near future but suspect that we may hear of another action being taken in theAlberta to protect the Northmont creditors before long. I think they have misjudged the resolve of the lessees who refused and still refuse to acquiesce to Northmonts executive orders.
     
  16. Spark1

    Spark1 Guest

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    What i recommend is hold on to your agreements and you had better believe they are legal documents. The supreme court of BC can not change your agreements and neither can Kirk. What the Supreme court of BC did is a mistake. I can not speak for all the vacation villa leases but i sure can for my lease. They used item numbers 9 and 10 to proof their point but they proved nothing and i believe the judges themselves do not understand these agreements. This last appeal was about managing the resort not about whether Northmont has the right to charge us this huge assessment or the cancellation,not according to my agreement. When the courts agreed with Northwynd that they can use this freedom to choose and Justice Loo ruled in their favor immediately the resort was down sized 43%.Yes we won the appeal over Justice Loo and now it was to late for the court to back down from there decision because the damage was already done by 43% cancelling. This resort never will be renovated and we would be nuts putting more money into this dead horse.We already have lost thousands with the years lost because of this FREEDOM TO CHOOSE. All the courts had to say to Northwynd is they have to use the agreements that are legal documents that the last owner did. Was part of managing the resort creating LEGACY FOR LIFE BUY both FRPL and NORTHWYND and trying to force the rest of us time owners to drink the same koolaide? This needs to be tried in the Supreme Court of Canada.
     
  17. Spark1

    Spark1 Guest

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    How many of you feel that #19 Lessee's Association is very important and i would say one of the most important items. There is a Act called "RESORT ASSOCIATIONS ACT" were you are asked to take part in setting up a LESSEE'S ASSOCIATION i was not phoned or emailed to be part of this association. Northwynd prove to all timeshare owners of this resort that you tried to set up this association. It would of been very easy to set up in Calgary where your head office is. There is thousands of Alberta timeshare owners including myself would of loved to be part of this association.
    (1) The purposes of an association are to promote,facilitate and encourage the development,maintenance and operation of a a resort promotion area.
    (2) An association may acquire and dispose of real and personal property.
    I know why you did not want a association we would of been in the way of your mission. The other question why did the judges of this case so far feel that it was not important to have a LESSEE'S ASSOCIATION? If i was part of this association and was told how bad some of these building are i would tell Northwynd get rid of them why put millions in buildings of no value. The land would have more value. I know now because of the condition of the buildings that would be left in the timeshare after Northwynd removes the best buildings out of the timeshare because of the cancellations and leaves us with the garbage i will not give them one cent.
    Northwynd had a blue print in how to get rid of the time owners and make millions and the justice system in BC is backing this.
     
  18. Hotpink

    Hotpink Guest

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    This is beginning to look interesting. A link to a letter written by Norton Rose to Kirk Wankel is attached. It is all important but note that on the first page they equate all contracts to being "practically identical". On page 6 under section 26 they refer to section 45 and their interpretation that can only be taken from the schedule "D" which is from Matkin's ( remember this is our TRUSTEE) affidavit Exhibit B4 . It doesn't make any sense to refer it to Exhibit B3 of the same affidavit. Bottom line they have the right to sue you annually ( and your heirs, executors, successors and permitted assigns in PERPETUITY.

    http://sunchaservillas.ca/wp-conten...nfirmingOccupancyCostsandReplacementCosts.pdf

    AND WE THOUGHT WE WOULD JUST GET A WEEK A YEAR FOR OUR INITIAL COST PLUS REGUALAR MAINTENANCE FEES. WHAT FOOLS WE WERE. AND SECTIN 45 IS NOT IN OUR CONTACT

    Not happy with that conclusion Mr. Wankel requested our trustee to petition the courts to change the all the contracts . Remember that was the case presented to Justice Loo and has actually never really been addressed even after all the court hearings.

    So what do they do in April of 2016 we get this which they

    http://sunchaservillas.ca/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/VIA-UPDATE-041816.pdf

    once you have read that then you need to read this

    http://sunchaservillas.ca/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Schedule-H-2003-Prospectus.pdf

    Not having a truly definitive answer from the courts they try to change everything to us being enslaved to them or their successors in perpetuity

    Read the following if you want you blood to boil

    http://www.iol.co.za/personal-finance/regulator-goes-after-timeshare-contracts-1753838

    We felt that it was a good deal to start with and for about 15 or so it was and the as the Dixie Chicks say THEN AlONG CAME EARL and EARL HAS GOT TO GO
     
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  19. Spark1

    Spark1 Guest

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    Hotpink when the freedom to choose permission to do this case took place we all had our vacation villa leases that we signed and witnessed. That case was botched by her ruling on a SPECIAL CASE . At that time all the money time owners paid out for the cancellation and renovations should of been paid back and JUSTICE LOO SHOULD of insisted on this because there was no case as far as time owners went. At that point Northmont was getting permission to enforce this freedom to choose. There would be no way of informing the people that paid because they controlled the registry. You can be sure they are charging 26.6% interest even though Geldert law won a easy appeal so when do charges start and when do they end.. This case should of been thrown out and they should of been told they have to work with the agreement time owners signed. What right do they have to use free money. This can still go to court because this money was not paid back. Northwynd had no right to assume how the next case was going to be ruled on or did they. Time owners all this is a scam.
    As far as Item39 goes they are doing more than modifing. They are not modifying the agreements they are modifying the whole resort at our cost. They want another platinum club so they can carry on with where FRPL left off.These guys are making millions scamming time owners and the governments and the courts are allowing this to happen.
     
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  20. Just Looking Around

    Just Looking Around Guest

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    I have not taken any photos of the Property. I live in Vancouver, and I'm not paying my 2017 fees or, any other fees, ever. I've no reason to go Sunchaser. Its bad enough I have to live with what I've seen. I certainly wouldn't want an image in full detail.
    Real World and owner1 (strange grammar and punctuation persisting from those who side with Northmont) have both challenged those of us who have raised this issue. Why don't you post photographs? Objective photos that represent the state of the Property - still can't call it a Resort, it's not.
    My only advice is to be sure to walk a distance from your vehicle before you frame the shot. It wouldn't serve you well to have part of the Staff Parking sign in the photo.
     
  21. Just Looking Around

    Just Looking Around Guest

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    That's interesting, if an incorporated enterprise owns a VIA, or say all the VIAs, ... think of the consequences.
     
  22. GypsyOne

    GypsyOne Guest

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    If Jim Belfry wins when we lose, why is he spending an incredible amount of time and money on this case? I think you've fallen for the Northmont propaganda.
     
  23. Real World

    Real World Guest

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    What do photos have to do with your comment "Posters on here, like Real World, xplor, and owner1, can offer "Alternative Facts" in defense of Northmont all they want."?

    Are you trying to avoid providing examples of the "Alternative Facts"?
     
  24. Meow

    Meow Guest

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    Our situation will not be improved by venting our anger towards Northward or by entering into dialogue with Northward proxies on this thread!
     

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