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[2009] Do I Have to Convert - Just Because They Told Me So?

Discussion in 'Buying, Selling, Renting' started by iameless, Feb 24, 2009.

  1. iameless

    iameless Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    This might be a really stupid question - but do I have to convert to points?

    Anyone else own weeks at VV and have been asked to convert?

    We have a fixed week at VV @ Bonaventure (which after checking is now labeled a RCI Point Resort). We bought kinda resale (cheap - but not cheap enough for what they are going for now. We were still newbies and thought we were getting a good deal - but now feel pretty stupid that we bought it at all!) - And, we are still making payments to the developer. Vacation Village is calling us non-stop leaving messages stating that we have to convert ASAP, etc. They are flinging around conversion $$ numbers and telling us that they want to upgrade us to VV @ Parkway because it will give us more points, lower maintenance fees, the developer is picking up the tab, etc.

    We are obviously still learning the ropes after being owners for just a few years. What should I be looking for? I'm guessing the developer is NOT picking up the tab and we would be paying for the conversion somehow.

    Help TUGGERS!
     
  2. philsfan

    philsfan TUG Member

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    They can't make you convert. Most resorts charge $3K or more to convert. Just tell them you're happy just the way you are...and run away!
     
  3. AwayWeGo

    AwayWeGo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Question Is Absolutely Non-Stupid.

    It's easy for noobs & semi-noobs to wonder if a timeshare question is or is not stupid only because so many people start out with a twisted & incomplete version of Timeshare 101 that they get from timeshare sellers.

    Very few figure it all out in advance. The timeshare sellers know that & try at every turn to take advantage of the knowledge gap.

    Timeshare sellers operate on an extremely simple basis, to wit:

    1. You Have The Money.
    2. We Want The Money.
    3. You Give The Money To Us.


    Anything beyond that is beside the point, from the perspective of timeshare sellers.

    The fact of the matter is that your timeshare deed spells out what you own & how you get to use it, mox nix whether the timeshare switches over to the points system.

    If the resort goes points -- or already is points -- your regular, plain-vanilla non-points timeshare week stays non-points just the same as always unless you shell out big bux to convert. You can still show up & check in for your paid-for time each year (as long as you keep on paying the annual fees on time). You can rent out your timeshare to other people & spend the money any way you want. You can bank your timeshare week in the conventional straight-weeks timeshare exchange system for trades into other people's timeshares.

    All you can't do is get any points for the week, which is also mox nix if you just want to use your conventional timeshare week the conventional way.

    If a timeshare seller's lips are moving, chances are he or she is fibbing, or at least spinning & stretching.

    Many if not most TUG folks have found out for themselves that there is nothing -- zero, zip, zilch, zorch, nil, null, nada, not anything -- that timeshare companies sell for big bux that's worth the money. That goes for timeshare weeks, timeshare points, timeshare upgrades, Solid Platinum VIP Priority Presidental Priority Status & I don't know what-all.

    -- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​
     
  4. geekette

    geekette Guest

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    While I don't think they can FORCE you to convert, they can make it unpleasant to Not convert. Please note, I know nothing about this particular resort/situation, "I'm just saying ..."

    If conversion is allegedly free, ask them to send you a contract for you to sign and get onboard. costs should be spelled out there, including those mysteriously DECREASING maint fees! If Attachment A is referenced and not included, get on the horn and ask for it. Make sure all is spelled out, accounted for, etc., so that you have ALL the info.

    I doubt it will be as they say, but, what the hell, play along in order to get your mitts on the docs.
     
  5. AwayWeGo

    AwayWeGo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Not Free.

    They never say conversion is free.

    It always costs a little something.

    Say, upwards of $3,000 or so.

    -- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA. ​
     
  6. JamminJoe

    JamminJoe TUG Member

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    Resorts Owned:
    Vacation Village at Parkway, Week 52, RCI Points
    Grandview at Las Vegas, Week 11
    I own 2-Vacation Village timeshares, I did convert VV@Parkway for 92,500 annual RCI Points, it cost me $2995.00, I did receive 2-bonus weeks (never used) and 12-months no interest which was helpful. I did not convert my Grandview at Las Vegas unit as I use annually my fixed week. I believe the conversion cost has gone way up. It was a lot of money for the conversion at that time but it has worked out well for me. I believe if they "force" a conversion they could not factor in the huge profit they are making and it would seem fair to have to pay the price RCI requires for the conversion only. If you deed is prepared for weeks I am not so sure they can "make" you do anything to convert.
     
  7. Babs from UK

    Babs from UK TUG Member

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    Conversation

    Our resort converted our weeks units to points when we purchased a second one on points. They did not tell us they had done this. The unit then came up through RCI as we had no idea that it had been converted and therefore had not done the homeweek reservation 13 months out. We nearly lost our week's use that year! Fortunately the reservations manager contacted us when RCI contacted her as she was assuming (rightly) that we were coming out as usual.

    When we complained the timeshare staff quickly put us back on weeks and apologised. We then got our 2nd unit put on weeks too so that this could never happen again!
     
  8. Bill4728

    Bill4728 Moderator

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    First: NO MATTER WHAT THEY SAY: YOU DO NOT HAVE TO CONVERT!!

    Many people find that belonging to RCI points is a good thing and owning a RCI point TS is something they value. BUT Many people find that belonging to RCI points is not a good thing and owning a RCI point TS is something they don't like at all ( see post above from Babs in UK)

    That said, most TS resorts have been told that to convert their members from weeks to points the best way is to hire a "high pressure" sale team to convert as many owners to points as possible and that the average rate to convert is $3000. This info your resort has isn't true!! RCI charges abaout $200 ( not $3000) to convert an owner from weeks to points. The rest of the $3000 the resorts charges to convert owners is to pay for the high pressure staff and profit to the resort.

    IMHO, never pay over $500 to convert to points. If the resort want more than that, tell them hell no, that you'll buy a resale week which is already converted to points. It likely will cost you much less than the $3000 or more it cost to convert a week you already own to points.
     
  9. elaine

    elaine TUG Member

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    also-if you have a high demand fixed week,

    IF you have a high demand fixed week, think long and hard before converting---the "converters" really want these weeks and then you have no assurance you can make reservations for your week. Plus, I still find that high demand fixed weeks trade very well thru RCI---there is no way I would convert my week 32 summer East Coast beach week for points---despite getting 5+ phone calls to "arrange my owners meeting."
     
  10. Stricky

    Stricky TUG Member

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    I am trying to get my resort down off their $3250 price. I pointed out that RCI charges less then $400 and this was their response:

     
  11. JPD

    JPD TUG Member

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    weeks/points system

    just received my rci resort book. i noticed half the resorts are listed as points. i am under the weeks system, i don't plan on switching. my question is: will there still be enough weeks resorts to exchange to. each year we trade to orlando.
     
  12. Bill4728

    Bill4728 Moderator

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    When a resort says it "RCI Points", it means that the resort has switched to points, but many if not most of the owners there may not have switched to points. Therefore when they deposit a week it will be in the week inventory not the points inventory.

    So, IMHO, for a long time you'll continue to see lots of resorts in the weeks inventory.
     
  13. Rad techs

    Rad techs TUG Member

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    I do not know this for a fact, because it came from a time share salesman selling points in Hawaii. He said that points system could get deposited weeks. but not vice versa......... he showed us a chart on the week deposit point values. good question? here is a link for using points for weeks http://www.rci.com/GPN/CDA/Common/pdf/RCI_ExGridsUpdate1.pdf
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2009
  14. DianneL

    DianneL TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Sales Pitch

    I have had the high-pressure sales pitch from one of our home resorts, insisting we should convert to points. We told him no way. We were happy with our week, we often use it at the resort, and we would not convert even if it were free. He lured us into the meeting with a free breakfast and with the info that we were getting an "update". He went on to say that there would come a time when we or our child in later years would not be able to get an exchange because we were in the weeks program. Then I remembered the info from Tug, i.e. "if his lips are moving, etc". The cost to convert was $3000.
     
  15. Carolinian

    Carolinian Guest

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    Tell that to the owners at Wychnor Park Country Club in the UK, where the thugs from DRI decreed that they were going to use their voting control of the HOA to make the resort all points and force the deeded owners to take either points or two deeded weeks at another resort (unclear if those are weeks of equal season or not).

    You had better check out your declaration of covenants on your resort, and what vote the developer controls in it. If they try heavy handed tactics like DRI, you may be in trouble.

    That it is why it is better that a resort never start down the slippery slope of points, especially if it is a developer controlled points scheme.
     
  16. ecwinch

    ecwinch TUG Member

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    Rad - this is true. RCI points owners can use their points to reserve inventory that is in RCI Weeks, but RCI Weeks owners do not have that similar ability. That does not mean the dark future he was scaring you with will come to pass.

    I have to guess the property rights in the UK must be significantly different than the US. Do you know of this happening in any US resort - ie. other than South Africa or the UK?
     
  17. MrsLonely

    MrsLonely Guest

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    points or weeks

    Hi, I presently own a week at vacation village at Mizner, and was offered to turn my week over to points. I do not ever use my home resort due to the week we purchased, but I deposit it as 2 one bedroom units , so I get 2 7 day holidays. this year I traded a 1 bedroom and got a week at the grand beach resort in Kissimmee in feb , in a 3 bedroom unit, it was lovely!Also, I traded the other 1 bedroom unit and stayed at the vacation village at Parkway in a 2 bedroom lock off in April. What a deal. Now I just spoke to the rci points office , they told me to stay in the 2 bedroom lockoff at Parkway in April, I would have used 92500 points, which is what my home resort is offering me to change my week to points and move my home resort to the parkway in Kissimmee. So I would only have gotten 1 week vacation, as we tend to travel in the more prime times and with larger groups, so is there really any bebefit for me to convert to points? Also, they are charging me 933.65 closing fees and rci 1 year membership, and then the resort deed change to parkway for week 16 for 4000.00 . What are these 9000 points vacations I hear people talking about? So to convert to points or not, now that is the question!
     
  18. AwayWeGo

    AwayWeGo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    R. C. I. "Instant Exchange" = 9,000 Points (Maximum) For A Full Week.

    We've taken several RCI Instant Exchange vacations now -- for only 7,500 points each time.

    Anything in RCI Weeks that's still left at the 45-day mark before check-in is spozed to be available via RCI Points on Instant Exchange.

    We use Last Call & Instant Exchange far oftener than we do straight-points or straight-weeks timeshare exchanges.

    Is this a great country or what ?

    -- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA. ​
     
  19. pieohpah75

    pieohpah75 Guest

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    I also own at VV @ Bonaventure, 2bed/2bad lock out that we paid retail for (a whopping 11500k back in '98). I kick myself everytime I think about it! And then to boot, we ended up converting to points back in 2004 at an additional 4500k, this included a purchase of a tri-annual week in VV @ Parkway. So don't feel that stupid!

    I have to stay that apart from all the financial nightmares of dealing with a timeshare when you are 19 years old, we have enjoyed all of our exchanges. We have yet to stay at either one of our home resorts. We have had some wonderful vacations over the years, but then we are not very fussy and plan ahead of time.

    We didn't really have any issues with exchanging using weeks or when using points. We get 52500 pts per year through RCI Points and an additional 24500 from VV@parkway. It's enough for us right now. The most I've ever used for a vacation week was 38k points and our recent week costs us 8k pts. So we still have plenty of points to use this year or next.

    Unless, you can convert for less than $500, I wouldn't bother converting at all. Just my 2 cents worth..:)

    Dorothy
     
  20. Mel

    Mel TUG Member

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    As with what happened at the UK resort Carolinian mentioned, the only way they can make conversion mandatory is to do so through the HOA, and convert the entire resort (or the portion controlled by the particular HOA).

    If they manage to do that, you will be converted, and the cost of doing so will either be part of your maintenance fee, or a special assessment. Either way, they won't ask, they will tell.

    As for dwindling availability for weeks owners - don't believe it. We had a salesman imply that the number of resorts available for us to trade into drops every time a resort switches to points. Nevermind that we were able to trade into that points resort through weeks. The same salesman tried to tout the 9000 point exchanges - nevermind that this is what diminishes every time another resort joins points. Once all the resorts become points resorts, there will be no 9000 point trades, but there still might be "cheap" trades 45 days out for weeks owners, if they happen to own one of those 9000 point weeks.
     
  21. GTHervey

    GTHervey Guest

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    Alan, you seem to know a lot about this stuff. Here is a related question: We bought points from Sunterra (now Diamond) in 2005 in Lake Tahoe, CA. We received deeds to real property (fractional ownership interests). We later bought points in another Sunterra resort in Arizona. This one is in a Trust. The Tahoe property has now been made part of the holdings that are in the Trust. Diamond has tried to get us to give up our deeds, for which they offered us more points in the Trust. We are reluctant to give up the deeds, although it seems make no difference with respect to how and when we can use our points. We belong to the Sunterra/Diamond "Club." Is there an advantage to our having a deed that would justify our holding on to them?
     
  22. TUGBrian

    TUGBrian Administrator

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    Think ill use this as the next question answered on the new faq. good stuff!
     
  23. GTHervey

    GTHervey Guest

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    Brian, if you are referring to my question, that would be great! I just discovered this site, and it seems to be really useful.
     
  24. AwayWeGo

    AwayWeGo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    I'll Keep My Timeshare Deeds & The Timeshare Company Can Keep Its Timeshare Trust.

    If you keep your deeds, then you've still got ownership of your timeshares even if something unfortunate should ever happen to T.H.E. Club.

    If you swap your deeds for club benefits, then you could be out of luck if something bad ever happens to the club.

    Maybe that's wildly unlikely & T.H.E. Club is solid as Gilbraltar, I don't know. Even so, I like keeping control of my own deeded ownerships rather than turning my deeds over to some timeshare company so I can participate in the company's club-based timeshare exchange system.

    -- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​
     
  25. GTHervey

    GTHervey Guest

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    I have to assume that we would also be in a better position if the company goes into bankruptcy, since we will have an ownership interest in real property. Moreover, I assume that we will have some say, however small, in decisions related to changes at the resort, since we are owners of real property there. I have not reviewed any timeshare statutes, but I have to assume that there are similarities to condominium laws.

    My wife and I just got concerned because Diamond seemed a little too anxious for us to give up our deeds, which made us suspicious, and we believed that we would be giving up rights that we would not enjoy under the Trust.
     

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