Is Hyatt resale a good opportunity now

[DazedandConfused]

I have been a long time DVC owner (love it), had a Marriott Manor Club (sold it before the points change), stayed a few Westgates (all but Park City are not desirable), and stayed at Hilton in Orlando (nice).

I am considering buying one timeshare for my wife and I (to travel without kids) and looked at Hilton, but was not impressed with the variety of locations (we do not want Orlando or LV). However the Hyatt locations looks very desirable and the resale prices seem very reasonable now.

Traditionally, I do not want a set week at a set resort with a set room size forever and mainly want to use 1 bedrooms at lots of locations and probably travel in the Non-school vacations as my kids are soon off to college.

My questions are:

Other than Kal's site (nice but some of the posts are pretty old), where is a good site for details about Hyatt.

Can someone compare the Hyatt system to me in terms of DVC (points) system as Disney is super user friendly and flexible for owners.

Is the window for booking other non-home resorts 6 months?

How is the competition once the trading window opens up?

What is the sweet spot for resales assuming location is not a priority - is it Pinion with low dues

The location is not too important to me as I would want to use it as a points system. If I had to choose one location, it would probably be Key West as that is the easiest location for me to book, if all else fails.

Is all annual dues the same regardless of points

Is it critical to have 2,200 points or can you do fine with less if your priority is 1 bedrooms and can be 3 or 4 night reservations.

Is BUYING worthwhile or just stick with renting via II or VRBO or pay cash

Thanks for your thoughts.

 

[Sandy VDH]

Have you looked at Hilton lately, they have added more locations in addition to the Orlando, Vegas, Hawaii trio. They now have Mrytle Beach, Hilton Head, Park City, Breckenridge, Carlsbad.

Hyatt does have some nice locations too. An now they have the a pure points play.

 

[Tucsonadventurer]

I have been a long time DVC owner (love it), had a Marriott Manor Club (sold it before the points change), stayed a few Westgates (all but Park City are not desirable), and stayed at Hilton in Orlando (nice).

I am considering buying one timeshare for my wife and I (to travel without kids) and looked at Hilton, but was not impressed with the variety of locations (we do not want Orlando or LV). However the Hyatt locations looks very desirable and the resale prices seem very reasonable now.

Traditionally, I do not want a set week at a set resort with a set room size forever and mainly want to use 1 bedrooms at lots of locations and probably travel in the Non-school vacations as my kids are soon off to college.

My questions are:

Other than Kal's site (nice but some of the posts are pretty old), where is a good site for details about Hyatt.

Can someone compare the Hyatt system to me in terms of DVC (points) system as Disney is super user friendly and flexible for owners.

Is the window for booking other non-home resorts 6 months?

How is the competition once the trading window opens up?

What is the sweet spot for resales assuming location is not a priority - is it Pinion with low dues

The location is not too important to me as I would want to use it as a points system. If I had to choose one location, it would probably be Key West as that is the easiest location for me to book, if all else fails.

Is all annual dues the same regardless of points

Is it critical to have 2,200 points or can you do fine with less if your priority is 1 bedrooms and can be 3 or 4 night reservations.

Is BUYING worthwhile or just stick with renting via II or VRBO or pay cash

Thanks for your thoughts.

The window is 6 weeks out usually but sometimes there are last minute cancellations that show up and sometimes things open up earlier than 6 months. We typically give up our week the first month we get our points . We have had some great trades within Hyatt. My husband was up at midnight one evening and Siesta Keys appeared , we grabbed it. We have not yet found a resort we couldn't get into if you have flexibility and the wait list is an extra bonus. We started out with 2000 pts at Sedona, a great place to purchase. MF fees are the same for lesser value weeks so it makes sense to get at least an 1880 point week. 22000 weeks seem to have a much higher up front price than 2000, pt for pt. We started out with a 2,000 pt week and it was plenty to get 4 to 5 weeks of vacation. Sedona is a great place to buy as the fees are low but again make sure you get a place you would like to stay if anything were to ever change in the sysyem. The Pure Points system changes are going to start in Florida so I would stay away from purchasing there for right now. It may be more difficult to get through ROFR. The other program I have been checking out and would love to get into is Starwood or new name Vistana. They charge less all around fees, don't have a lot of properties but the ones they have are great resorts, and they have many Hawaii resorts if that is of interest.

 

[WalnutBaron]

I own fixed weeks at Carmel and Sedona through the Hyatt system. I agree with everything Tucson Traveler said. All of the Hyatt resorts we have visited through internal trades have been outstanding--Lake Tahoe, Colorado, Siesta Key, Beach House, San Antonio, and Del Mar in Puerto Rico. Trading internally is pretty easy--as long as you plan far enough ahead (we typically try to book at 6-9 months in advance) and as long as you're not trying to get into the newest property on Maui.

Pinon Pointe is nearly sold out--so although it currently has the system's lowest MF's--I suspect that may change over the next few years as Hyatt's subsidization of MF's will no longer be in effect. (Like most systems, the developer tends to subsidize MF's during the active sales period to encourage retail purchases.)

One other thing to consider: now that II owns the Hyatt system, Hyatt gets very high priority for trading within II--not only because of the high quality of the Hyatt resorts, but also because of the incentive II now has to keep the resorts full with both owners and traders from other timeshares to maximize occupancy and revenue.

 

[lizap]

I own fixed weeks at Carmel and Sedona through the Hyatt system. I agree with everything Tucson Traveler said. All of the Hyatt resorts we have visited through internal trades have been outstanding--Lake Tahoe, Colorado, Siesta Key, Beach House, San Antonio, and Del Mar in Puerto Rico. Trading internally is pretty easy--as long as you plan far enough ahead (we typically try to book at 6-9 months in advance) and as long as you're not trying to get into the newest property on Maui.

Pinon Pointe is nearly sold out--so although it currently has the system's lowest MF's--I suspect that may change over the next few years as Hyatt's subsidization of MF's will no longer be in effect. (Like most systems, the developer tends to subsidize MF's during the active sales period to encourage retail purchases.)

One other thing to consider: now that II owns the Hyatt system, Hyatt gets very high priority for trading within II--not only because of the high quality of the Hyatt resorts, but also because of the incentive II now has to keep the resorts full with both owners and traders from other timeshares to maximize occupancy and revenue.

FYI: I was told by a salesperson that MFs at Pinion Pointe are likely to rise when it is completely sold out..

 

[Marathoner]

One other thing to consider: now that II owns the Hyatt system, Hyatt gets very high priority for trading within II--not only because of the high quality of the Hyatt resorts, but also because of the incentive II now has to keep the resorts full with both owners and traders from other timeshares to maximize occupancy and revenue.

Hi - what is the experience that you have seen with Hyatt II exchanges which validates this observation? I have only exchanged within the Hyatt internal system so am unaware of any increased trading power within II.

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

 

[WalnutBaron]

Hi - what is the experience that you have seen with Hyatt II exchanges which validates this observation? I have only exchanged within the Hyatt internal system so am unaware of any increased trading power within II.

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

Marathoner, since I am like you--pretty happy with the options we have within HRC--I 've only done a few trades over the years, and only two since the acquisition of HRC by ILG 2 1/2 years ago. On one trade, I was able to get a 2 BR into Westin Princeville during a shoulder season (mid-April). On the second trade, I landed Grand Luxxe in Nuevo Vallarta, Mexico. Both are beautiful resorts, and I was very happy with the trades.

 

[DazedandConfused]

How do you value Hyatt points in terms of $/point?

For example, if a 2,000 point contract has dues of $1,000, then the points are $0.50/point

I pretty much assume that if you buy a good contract resale, keep it for 5 years or so, then sell it, you are pretty much break even, so there is no major cost to acquire a timeshare other than some loss of opportunity costs (not that significant now).

Is there a chart of the cost for annual dues for various Hyatt resorts

What are the best Hyatt resale locations for price/dues?
For example, the Hilton Las Vegas resorts and DVC Saratoga Springs have some of the lowest annual resale prices and annual fees in those systems.

 

[lizap]

Hi - what is the experience that you have seen with Hyatt II exchanges which validates this observation? I have only exchanged within the Hyatt internal system so am unaware of any increased trading power within II.

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

Guess it is all relative.

How do you value Hyatt points in terms of $/point?

For example, if a 2,000 point contract has dues of $1,000, then the points are $0.50/point

I pretty much assume that if you buy a good contract resale, keep it for 5 years or so, then sell it, you are pretty much break even, so there is no major cost to acquire a timeshare other than some loss of opportunity costs (not that significant now).

Is there a chart of the cost for annual dues for various Hyatt resorts

What are the best Hyatt resale locations for price/dues?
For example, the Hilton Las Vegas resorts and DVC Saratoga Springs have some of the lowest annual resale prices and annual fees in those systems.

First, TSs are NOT an investment. They are a way to experience vacations at very nice resorts. The thing that distinguishes Hyatt is the resorts are very high quality and in interesting locations. Right now, I think Pinion Pointe has the lowest MFs. However, they will very likely go up, possibly significantly, when the resort is completely sold. We bought at High Sierra four years ago and long ago, recouped our original cost.

 

[DazedandConfused]

First, TSs are NOT an investment. They are a way to experience vacations at very nice resorts. The thing that distinguishes Hyatt is the resorts are very high quality and in interesting locations. Right now, I think Pinion Pointe has the lowest MFs. However, they will very likely go up, possibly significantly, when the resort is completely sold. We bought at High Sierra four years ago and long ago, recouped our original cost.

I did NOT ask about timeshares as an investment, I was trying to determine the "savings" vs renting the same property for cash from Hyatt or VRBO.

For example, if ignore the cost of the timeshare (assume you will break even on a buy/sell) and you value Hyatt points at $1,500 dues for 2,000 points = $0.75 per point. Then book a week in a 1 bedroom for 1,450 points - this is equivalent to $1,087.50 for the week or $155 per night. the question is how much is that room for a cash reservation. Are there other fees to book your reservation? What happens to the extra unused 450 points?

If Aspen is 750 points for a Diamond studio ski week then this can be $80 per night based on $0.75 and seems too cheap, unless it is impossible to book a studio ski week.

 

[Kal]

You can book a Hyatt unit without using HRC points. Those units are managed by Hyatt on behalf of the developer or a HRC owner who has contracted with Hyatt to rent their unit. If you are a HRC member, you get a discount off the rental price. If not, you pay the asking rate. I recently saw a studio rental at Sunset Harbor during high season. The nightly street rate was about $440 while the owner discounted rate was about $250. One bedroom units might be at $650/night. On a maintenance fee basis, the HRC Sunset Harbor owner pays $214 per night for a 2-BR unit.

I'm not sure how much value you can place on these numbers, but at least it's a snapshot.

As a reference point, I am paying $170/night for a 1-BR very nice apartment in Paris thru Air B&B.

 

[DazedandConfused]

You can book a Hyatt unit without using HRC points. Those units are managed by Hyatt on behalf of the developer or a HRC owner who has contracted with Hyatt to rent their unit. If you are a HRC member, you get a discount off the rental price. If not, you pay the asking rate. I recently saw a studio rental at Sunset Harbor during high season. The nightly street rate was about $440 while the owner discounted rate was about $250. One bedroom units might be at $650/night. On a maintenance fee basis, the HRC Sunset Harbor owner pays $214 per night for a 2-BR unit.

I'm not sure how much value you can place on these numbers, but at least it's a snapshot.

As a reference point, I am paying $170/night for a 1-BR very nice apartment in Paris thru Air B&B.

Thats a great frame of reference. Of course, it assumes that there is no wasted points or the cost goes up.

I do like Hyatt and Hilton and other timeshares, but with VRBO and AirBnB, I am just not sure it is worth being locked into a system unless there is one location you want to visit every year.

 

[lizap]

Thats a great frame of reference. Of course, it assumes that there is no wasted points or the cost goes up.

I do like Hyatt and Hilton and other timeshares, but with VRBO and AirBnB, I am just not sure it is worth being locked into a system unless there is one location you want to visit every year.

If you travel off-peak, you will be able to get more than a week with your points. Also, if you can use a 1 BR, you can use your points from your 2 BR to get more than a week. You have to learn the system and make it work for you; the savings for us has been significantly more than we could have rented for. I have yet to see the owner discounted rates available. We supplement our TSs with VRBO rentals; they are completely different animals. TSs are luxurious resorts whereas our VRBOs are more apartment-like. They compliment each other nicely..

 

[DazedandConfused]

TSs are luxurious resorts whereas our VRBOs are more apartment-like. They compliment each other nicely..

I agree, and they (hyatt) are also consistently uniform, in great locations, and have hotel amenities.

Do you consider the points system a good thing like DVC (most members are happy)or a bad thing like Marriott (seems the members are not happy)

 

[WalnutBaron]

I agree, and they (hyatt) are also consistently uniform, in great locations, and have hotel amenities.

Do you consider the points system a good thing like DVC (most members are happy)or a bad thing like Marriott (seems the members are not happy)

I consider the HRC points system as most definitely a good thing. Most resort requests can be accommodated within the HRC system, the points for a 2000-point contract can easily be stretched to several weeks of vacations if you're willing to travel mid-week and in shoulder seasons, and the only privilege you don't have as a resale owner is that you can't convert your HRC points into hotel points as retail owners can--but that would be a terrible strategy anyway, as the value of hotel points is a pittance compared to the value of your HRC points.

 

[dagger1]

Thats a great frame of reference. Of course, it assumes that there is no wasted points or the cost goes up.

I do like Hyatt and Hilton and other timeshares, but with VRBO and AirBnB, I am just not sure it is worth being locked into a system unless there is one location you want to visit every year.

We like the atmosphere of high end resorts, amenities for kids, etc. But the main reason we can't use VRBO or Airbnb is peculiar to us: we need fully ADA accessible rooms/bathrooms. Wheelchair maneuverability is a must for us. We have checked on ADA units at Airbnb and VRBO, and it almost always turns out they are really not... No elevators, rollin showers, or wheelchair space.... But most folks aren't in our situation...

 

[lizap]

The Hyatt points system has worked very well for us. I'm not familiar with the way DVC works, but IMO, their TSs cost too much initially. Regarding Marriott, I think there are mixed feelings, depending on who you ask. BTW, we have gotten some excellent exchanges into Marriotts using our Hyatt, via II.

 

[DAman]

I consider the HRC points system as most definitely a good thing. Most resort requests can be accommodated within the HRC system, the points for a 2000-point contract can easily be stretched to several weeks of vacations if you're willing to travel mid-week and in shoulder seasons, and the only privilege you don't have as a resale owner is that you can't convert your HRC points into hotel points as retail owners can--but that would be a terrible strategy anyway, as the value of hotel points is a pittance compared to the value of your HRC points.

There is a $133 fee to convert points into hotel points making it a worse value.

 

[DazedandConfused]

Does Hyatt have a booking feel like Hilton

Hilton fees
$55/107 - Reservation fee online/phone
$82 - HHonors point conversion
$76 - Hotel reservation vs points
$52 - Guest certificate

 

[dahntahn]

I agree, and they (hyatt) are also consistently uniform, in great locations, and have hotel amenities.

Do you consider the points system a good thing like DVC (most members are happy)or a bad thing like Marriott (seems the members are not happy)

We bought DVC from Disney way back when our kids were younger and before we learned of the secondary market, paying $ 79 per point. We used them for years, but when kids grew older they wanted to try Key West so we traded thru II and went to Hyatt Beach House and were impressed, went to their sales pitch and declined. Week priced at $ 27000. When we tried to do the same the next year, Disney had switched to RCI and we couldn't access Hyatt. So I looked in EBay and found a Hyatt week at BH for $9000 for 1880 points and bought it. Then when the big recession hit we bought three more weeks at very low prices, all resale. Since then we have used our Hyatt points to go to many other locations, all of them outstanding resorts, and have rented out our Disney points for a nice return that helps pay our Hyatt MFs.
The Hyatt points system point system is actually quite similar to DVC, has different quirks, but is easy to use once you figure it out. We like II as opposed to RCI which Disney uses, and find HRC trades get better value than DVC trades. Hyatt does lack DVCs ability to amass three years of points into one year by banking ahead and borrowing back. DVC has really retained its value and we could sell today for about what we paid, HRC not so much, although I expect resale value to rise with the development of the pure points system. I would encourage you to try to buy a deeded Hyatt week soon if you decide to jump in. We have found the use of our Hyatt points to be amazingly flexible and have had essentially no trouble trading into other Hyatt properties - the key is to place a request as far in advance as possible - 9 to 12 months out. Doing so we have never failed to get a desired reservation, but you usually don't find out until 6 months before the requested date because that's when owners have to decide on using their owned week. Sometimes we have heard much earlier, but mostly around that time.

One last note, you have used a calculation assuming that maintenance fees are points based. They aren't. In a specific resort, all weeks have essentially the same MF for the same size unit. So for a 2 BR unit the MF is similar for a 2200 point week and a 1300 point week, a fact we did not realize before buying. Luckily, our 1300 point BH weeks were recently raised to 2000 points, MFs unchanged.

 

[DazedandConfused]

Luckily, our 1300 point BH weeks were recently raised to 2000 points, MFs unchanged.

Very impressive!

What do people consider to be the best Hyatt for a pure points play - in terms of resale price and annual dues. I understan Pinion may be, but their dues may go up.

Is there a chart of ALL Hyatt resorts annual dues?

If I was MORE interested in a 1 bedroom, what point should I consider.
What is the difference between a 1 and 2 bedroom dues?
Is is better to buy a 2,000-2,000 contract even if you don't need that much or is it better to borrow from a future year (if possible) to use more points EOY, etc.

 

[lizap]

Very impressive!

What do people consider to be the best Hyatt for a pure points play - in terms of resale price and annual dues. I understan Pinion may be, but their dues may go up.

Is there a chart of ALL Hyatt resorts annual dues?

If I was MORE interested in a 1 bedroom, what point should I consider.
What is the difference between a 1 and 2 bedroom dues?
Is is better to buy a 2,000-2,000 contract even if you don't need that much or is it better to borrow from a future year (if possible) to use more points EOY, etc.

In terms of MFs, I believe Pinion Pointe is currently the lowest. In terms of resale, really depends on the week. Highest point weeks typically are in more demand, so they retain price better and are easier to sell. I would not buy anything less than a 2200 point week, as this will allow you access into a 2BR in Maui (when availability gets better). Maui has only a few 1 BR units. I have seen some 2200 points (Diamond) weeks for as low as 10K -11K in Key West, but don't know if these would pass ROFR, given that Hyatt appears to be accumulating inventory in FL.

 

[DAman]

Does Hyatt have a booking feel like Hilton

Hilton fees
$55/107 - Reservation fee online/phone
$82 - HHonors point conversion
$76 - Hotel reservation vs points
$52 - Guest certificate

$41 reservation fee
$30 guest certificates fee
$51 cancellation fee

 

[Tucsonadventurer]

You can waive guest fees for 3 people if you chose to pay a one time fee . We did so for both my children and my sister and it was something like 40 or 50 dollars for as long as we are owners. That way they can make their own reservations

 

[heathpack]

I think its a foolish move to buy Hyatt for the best points value right now. Hyatt can change the terms of the current points overlay at any time. If you're interested in the Hyatt system, buy a unit you want to use, or a lock-off bigger than you want but a week you can use at a resort you'd want to visit annually (to get some extra points). If you employ this strategy, HRC cannot hurt you with their new Pure Points system.

The current Hyatt points system is just an overlay to a deeded week, you get a certain number of points if you don't use your deeded week, but HRC can change the terms of the points system at any time. Your points are not guaranteed to represent anything specific over time. This is in distinct contrast to DVC where X points always and forever will represent Y percent ownership at your home resort. With DVC, you actually own points and that means something legally. With HRC, you own a deeded week and that's it. You don't own points, the points are just a trading concept for trading internally within the HRC system.

As to the poster who commented that DVC was "too expensive," I will say that I agree its an expensive system to own in. However, my DVC has appreciated in value by 65% in a few years of ownership. I could sell in 12 seconds and make a profit that would largely offset what I've spent thus far between the purchase and the annual fees.

My Hyatt has held value decently, it would take me a little longer to sell but would move pretty quickly and I've gotten tremendous value out of it. Its a great trader, I've never even been to my home resort (although I'd be fine with using my week every year instead of trading). They are both good systems but the big difference is that the Hyatt can be expected to depreciate whereas the DVC weirdly just continues to appreciate year after year for me.